JR Writing JM's Parts - Any Evidence?

[OperantChamber]

I've seen a few people say it here and there. Is there any evidence of this outside of the one wah part in Raw Dog?

[lateralus88]

inb4 John Myung needs to start writing material of DT again

[reneranucci]

I've seen a few people say it here and there. Is there any evidence of this outside of the one wah part in Raw Dog?

I don´t think so.

[ariich]

No, and I'm certain it doesn't happen. There was that one deep keyboard part in Raw Dog that MP referred to on Twitter, and some cynics went mental taking it to mean that JR writes JM's bass parts. One of the most ridiculous reactions I've ever seen.

[hefdaddy42]

I don't believe there is any verifiable evidence for anything like this before Raw Dog.  However, the bass lines on BC&SL were the least Myungish on any DT album to date, so I wouldn't be surprised if it happened there as well.

I cannot stress enough how much that last sentence was pure supposition unsupported by documentary evidence.

[Jamesman42]

I don't believe there is any verifiable evidence for anything like this before Raw Dog.  However, the bass lines on BC&SL were the least Myungish on any DT album to date, so I wouldn't be surprised if it happened there as well.

I cannot stress enough how much that last sentence was pure supposition unsupported by documentary evidence.

Source?

[OperantChamber]

I cannot stress enough how much that last sentence was pure supposition unsupported by documentary evidence.

[Adami]

Well it seems on BC&SL that 95% of the time at least he's just doubling the guitar. So it's somewhat safe to assume he didn't write that. And we now know that the main riff (including the bass intro) to AROP was written by portnoy.

[BRGM]

By Portnoy? :O cool, how do u know?

[OperantChamber]

Well it seems on BC&SL that 95% of the time at least he's just doubling the guitar. So it's somewhat safe to assume he didn't write that. And we now know that the main riff (including the bass intro) to AROP was written by portnoy.

But what about the JMX riff in Strange Deja Vu? He wrote the riff but the bass and guitar are doing the same thing. I don't think the doubling proves anything.

[Adami]

Well it seems on BC&SL that 95% of the time at least he's just doubling the guitar. So it's somewhat safe to assume he didn't write that. And we now know that the main riff (including the bass intro) to AROP was written by portnoy.

But what about the JMX riff in Strange Deja Vu? He wrote the riff but the bass and guitar are doing the same thing. I don't think the doubling proves anything.

Doubling alone doesn't prove anything, but it's safe to assume that if myung did write some stuff that is doubled, it's rare. He's hardly in the studio they said, and when he is he's usually just learning.

[rumborak]

He might still have some input here and there, but one has to have been somewhat ignorant of the cumulative allusions from DT's side to not get that his involvement in the writing process is pretty minimal these days.
I for one can't remember the last "writing session" video that featured anybody but JP, MP and JR.

rumborak

[bosk1]

I for one can't remember the last "writing session" video that featured anybody but JP, MP and JR.

rumborak

  The last writing session video is the one that came with Systematic Chaos, and he is definitely in that one.

[Adami]

I for one can't remember the last "writing session" video that featured anybody but JP, MP and JR.

rumborak

  The last writing session video is the one that came with Systematic Chaos, and he is definitely in that one.

I could have sworn I saw at least one from the BCSL studio time. Where Portnoy was talking about the solo trade offs or something.

[Perpetual Change]

Yeah. Any little snippets Portnoy released from BC&SL writing seem to have just had MP, JP, and JR there.

[Adami]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5RLln_Hk7w

There's one.

And I gotta say, if I were in the studio and someone was acting the way portnoy was, I'd go insane.

Also, there are 7 JR studio updates from BCSL, that was one of them. I just watched them, the only time you see Myung is for 3 seconds when JR says "anything you wanna say?" and he just stands there. But they aren't writing or doing anything official at that point. LaBrie is also no where to be seen.

[BRGM]

John Myung is actually sitting over there! :O with headphones, practicing or summthin' ^^

[PlaysLikeMyung]

Yeah, the videos that JR shot were almost all JP/MP/JR

JMX, when he's in the videos, is just sitting somewhere else playing/practicing/whatever with his bass


Come to think of it, I don't think any footage exists of JMX without a bass in his hands lol

[OperantChamber]

He might still have some input here and there, but one has to have been somewhat ignorant of the cumulative allusions from DT's side to not get that his involvement in the writing process is pretty minimal these days.
I for one can't remember the last "writing session" video that featured anybody but JP, MP and JR.

rumborak

I must be ignorant. Can you provide some of these allusions?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5RLln_Hk7w

There's one.

And I gotta say, if I were in the studio and someone was acting the way portnoy was, I'd go insane.

Also, there are 7 JR studio updates from BCSL, that was one of them. I just watched them, the only time you see Myung is for 3 seconds when JR says "anything you wanna say?" and he just stands there. But they aren't writing or doing anything official at that point. LaBrie is also no where to be seen.

I'm naturally somewhat shy myself and prefer not to take pictures or be on camera. If I knew a few hundred people were watching, I'd probably react the same way.

[Adami]

I would too, not the point though.

[ariich]

Yeah, the videos that JR shot were almost all JP/MP/JR

But in fairness, JR doesn't really film the writing process, he mostly films them goofing around as that's far more fun to watch. And JM doesn't really do goofing around, which is why he features very little.

[Adami]

Can someone just ask a member of DT? I'm sure scotty or wey could just ask how much JM does.

[ariich]

Don't get me wrong, I'm pretty certain that JP and JR write the majority of the music, and MP has a lot to say about general ideas and song structures etc, and that JM sits back and goes along with it for the most part. I just don't think it's fair to say that he has no input, or doesn't even write his own parts, or anything like that.

[Adami]

Don't get me wrong, I'm pretty certain that JP and JR write the majority of the music, and MP has a lot to say about general ideas and song structures etc, and that JM sits back and goes along with it for the most part. I just don't think it's fair to say that he has no input, or doesn't even write his own parts, or anything like that.

Well, if the majority of the music is not written by him, and the majority of his stuff is doubling, then it's safe to say that he doesn't write the majority of his parts.

[bosk1]

Can someone just ask a member of DT? I'm sure scotty or wey could just ask how much JM does.

I know for a fact that they could ask them, but I'd bet even if you asked either of them to ask the question, they wouldn't really care to.  I know if I were in that position, I wouldn't bother to ask because (1) it really doesn't matter to me in the slightest, (2) I'm sure whatever answer I was given still wouldn't put the issue to rest because I doubt they could quantify it in any meaningful way, and (3) because of (2), even more of (1).

[ariich]

Don't get me wrong, I'm pretty certain that JP and JR write the majority of the music, and MP has a lot to say about general ideas and song structures etc, and that JM sits back and goes along with it for the most part. I just don't think it's fair to say that he has no input, or doesn't even write his own parts, or anything like that.

Well, if the majority of the music is not written by him, and the majority of his stuff is doubling, then it's safe to say that he doesn't write the majority of his parts.

I disagree that the majority of his stuff is doubling. Some of it is, sure, but certainly not most.

[OperantChamber]

I would too, not the point though.

I'm sorry, I thought you were trying to say that the fact that he doesn't pop up much in the videos is because he's not there or doing anything.

Don't get me wrong, I'm pretty certain that JP and JR write the majority of the music, and MP has a lot to say about general ideas and song structures etc, and that JM sits back and goes along with it for the most part. I just don't think it's fair to say that he has no input, or doesn't even write his own parts, or anything like that.

Well, if the majority of the music is not written by him, and the majority of his stuff is doubling, then it's safe to say that he doesn't write the majority of his parts.

My understanding is that if one of the guys comes up with a riff, the other guys will do something with it for their respective instrument. If JP comes up with a cool part, and JR and JMX decide to double it, that doesn't mean JP is writing their parts.
When people say JR writes JMX's parts, it implies that they simply sit him down and tell him what to play. I don't think that's the case and there doesn't seem to be any reason to believe  it happens that way.

[Adami]

Well let's look at metallica for example. When Hetfield would go into the studio and write every riff, and then Newstead would come in and double it completely, you can't really say Newstead wrote his parts.

[changing_seasons]

Jordan said on one of his live chat sessions that he does write some of the bass lines.

[OperantChamber]

Well let's look at metallica for example. When Hetfield would go into the studio and write every riff, and then Newstead would come in and double it completely, you can't really say Newstead wrote his parts.

You're right, but all I'm saying is that I don't think JMX is being told what to do.
I think it's ultimately JMX's decision whether to double a line or go into a crazy tap solo. Maybe he didn't come up with a most of the main riffs, but his parts are up to him.

But of course, I could be totally wrong.

Jordan said on one of his live chat sessions that he does write some of the bass lines.

Well I think that settles it until we can have one of the band members talk about it.

[EstyMaJ]

Does this make him any less of a Bass player ? Or is all the what seems to be JM bashing just that people like what he has written in the past so much that they want more ? Cuz I for one think he is one hell of a Bass player.   

[reneranucci]

I was half asleep while on the computer and I read the thread tittle as "JR Wearing JM´s Pants - Any Evidence?"

[OperantChamber]

I was half asleep while on the computer and I read the thread tittle as "JR Wearing JM´s Pants - Any Evidence?"

That would've made a much better thread.

[hefdaddy42]

Does this make him any less of a Bass player ?   

Where did you get that from?

[ReaPsTA]

From the MP.com FAQ:

MP: John M and I are a very untraditional type of rhythm section. I actually do all of my locking in with the guitar...the bass *usually* (not always) follows afterwards. So I very rarely ever work around the bass lines. In fact, I don't even put bass in my monitors live!! (mainly guitar). I think John M mostly keys into the guitar as well or lately with Jordan, will work along with Jordan's left hand patterns.

You can't necessarily say JR writes JM's bass parts, but you can hear JM do this a lot in DT's music.

Also, just something to think about. MP and JR tend to squash stupid DT rumors pretty quickly. If Myung were doing more in the studio than assumed, wouldn't they say something to that effect? The closest we've heard to a comment on Myung's role in the studio was JR saying flat out he, JP, and MP did most of the songwriting.