Author Topic: Mass Effect (merged thread)  (Read 68907 times)

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Offline AcidLameLTE

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #525 on: March 14, 2012, 07:48:38 AM »
Some people? There's a 30,000 strong group petitioning to get Bioware to change/expand upon it. They've raised something like $30,000 dollars too, that's going to charity.
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Offline ACID_FOX

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #526 on: March 14, 2012, 07:53:18 AM »
True, but in their defence it is a diabolical ending, and it goes against everything Bioware said pre-release.
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Offline Dimitrius

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #527 on: March 14, 2012, 08:20:56 AM »
It's still a humongous sense of entitlement! God-forbid the creators of the fiction end it like they wanted it to end!

I didn't love the ending, but I'm OK with it (went with synthesis by the way, it's what my Shepard would've done), and if they want to expand on it through single-player DLC (which is coming) I'm cool with it too.
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Offline ACID_FOX

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #528 on: March 14, 2012, 08:31:50 AM »
There's too many plot holes and a complete lack of variety for me to really be happy with it. All the choices I'd made throughout all three games were for nothing, more or less. I mean technically there's three endings, but as someone on the Bioware forums put it "It's just one ending with three different colours".
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Offline ariich

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #529 on: March 14, 2012, 08:51:02 AM »
There's too many plot holes and a complete lack of variety for me to really be happy with it. All the choices I'd made throughout all three games were for nothing, more or less. I mean technically there's three endings, but as someone on the Bioware forums put it "It's just one ending with three different colours".
So what? It's more than pretty much all other games have. Maybe I'm coming from more of a film and TV background and less of a gaming one, but I think the core underlying story should be pretty much set by the writers but some of the details dependent on what the gamer does, which is basically how the Mass Effect series works.

Either way, petitioning Bioware is deeply pathetic.

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Offline Dimitrius

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #530 on: March 14, 2012, 08:53:41 AM »
Indeed. It would like petitioning Ronald D. Moore to rewrite the ending to Battlestar Galactica (to use an example of a sci-fi series that got a lot of flack for its ending) because I didn't like it.
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Offline ACID_FOX

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #531 on: March 14, 2012, 09:05:27 AM »
I agree about the petition thing, but I guess it's just because I invested so much time into the games, I wanted to feel SOME kind of recognition or reward.
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Offline ariich

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #532 on: March 14, 2012, 10:24:20 AM »
Well that's the risk with anything in the creative industries. Some will pay off, others will not. Just because YOU do not like it, doesn't mean others feel the same way, and to complain or petition is to say "I am right, and the artist is wrong".

The BSG ending is a great example. Some people hated it and complained no end about it. I thought it was incredible and wouldn't have had it any other way. Neither side is right or wrong. Those who didn't like it can say so, but to actually complain about it is to display a sense of undeserved entitlement - ultimately the only one who is entitled to say what happens is the artist. The rest of us are there to enjoy it or not.

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Offline abydos

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #533 on: March 14, 2012, 11:18:04 AM »
Yeah but the ME3 ending is bad, wrong and filled with inconsistencies with the lore and plot.

Pretty good article summarizing what's wrong and why - SPOILERS, obviously.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2012, 12:34:56 PM by abydos »

Offline ZBomber

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #534 on: March 14, 2012, 11:52:44 AM »
I haven't played the game, and I actually don't know WHAT the ending is, but a lot of the complaints I read said that in a game where your choices are supposed to affect the gameplay, it doesn't really even matter in the end. Seems like a valid criticism from the little that I know. But I also agree that the developers should be able to frame the story the way they want to.

I'm really curious what the ending is, but I think I'll probably just play through the series first instead.

Offline ariich

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #535 on: March 14, 2012, 02:32:04 PM »
I still don't see why that would be a problem. Your choices do affect things as the games go on - small things here and there as well as big things. But I'd still expect there to be some overarching ending that is basically the same regardless of the decisions you make, because that's what'll bring the plot to a close as any good story should.

The supposed inconsistencies I don't know about as I haven't finished the game, but people made the same complaint about the BSG ending and I didn't agree then, so I'll have to see what I think when I reach the end of the game.

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Offline XJDenton

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #536 on: March 14, 2012, 02:39:47 PM »
Finished it. 99% phenomenal. The ending was a large pile of smegma though, and I can fully understand while a lot of fans are fucked off with it. It really doesnt do the rest of the series service.

I don't feel entitled to a new ending, and bioware are free to write thier stories as they see fit, but in my opinion they would likely have a much stronger product if they did go back and edit it. And games are unique in that gameplay and assets can be patched, and I dont see why story should be exempt from that. Indeed, its already happened a couple of times (fallout 3 anyone?).
« Last Edit: March 14, 2012, 02:49:37 PM by XJDenton »
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Offline AcidLameLTE

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #537 on: March 14, 2012, 03:41:17 PM »
Started playing today. About 6 hours in.

I'm loving trying to scan all the sectors while, at the same time, trying to run away from the reapers :lol

Also, this game has reminded me why I don't like most cover systems. Can be REALLY frustrating sometimes.

Offline XJDenton

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #538 on: March 14, 2012, 03:43:07 PM »
MEs main problem is that spint, dodge and take cover are all the same key/button. Thats where 90% of frustration lies for me at least.
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Offline Dimitrius

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #539 on: March 14, 2012, 04:20:47 PM »
MEs main problem is that spint, dodge and take cover are all the same key/button. Thats where 90% of frustration lies for me at least.
Same issue that Gears of War has, I don't know why they "borrowed" that same mechanic.
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Offline abydos

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #540 on: March 14, 2012, 04:25:31 PM »
It's even worse in multiplayer because the same button revives fallen teammates as well as all the other functions.

Offline Omega

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #541 on: March 14, 2012, 08:27:46 PM »
I just finished the game... I'm...not sure what to think. I'm deeply confused, nostalgic, frustrated, and awed at the same time.
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Offline Super Dude

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #542 on: March 14, 2012, 09:39:56 PM »
True, but in their defence it is a diabolical ending, and it goes against everything Bioware said pre-release.

What did they say pre-release?
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Offline Elsydeon

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #543 on: March 14, 2012, 11:01:50 PM »
True, but in their defence it is a diabolical ending, and it goes against everything Bioware said pre-release.

What did they say pre-release?
That your choices would matter what happened in this game.

Offline abydos

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #544 on: March 14, 2012, 11:42:32 PM »
True, but in their defence it is a diabolical ending, and it goes against everything Bioware said pre-release.

What did they say pre-release?
That your choices would matter what happened in this game.
Sometimes even reddit is useful. Related to the ending so don't click if you haven't finished the game - https://imgur.com/HjzGQ

Offline ACID_FOX

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #545 on: March 15, 2012, 01:59:28 AM »
 :lol  :lol  :lol  :lol
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Offline HarlequinForest

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #546 on: March 17, 2012, 02:52:29 PM »
I'm about 12 hours in.  Playing as an adept, as always.  Insanity makes me want to tear my hair out sometimes; fight for 5-10 minutes without a save, then step out of cover for 3 seconds and get shredded.  :(

My belief so far is that the other two games are better, if only for the following reasons:
1) I don't like the pacing of the story so far
2) They did nothing fun with exploring planets on the galaxy map (no reason to orbit non-mission planets); the Mako is still my favorite
3) Cut-scenes are too cinematic; not enough dialogue options
4) Abilities feel way too familiar to ME2 (which I am bored of at this point), although this is slightly counteracted by the new power tree, which provides some cool synergies and really difficult decisions

That said, it's still awesome.  I haven't read anything about the game yet, and I probably won't return here until I've finished it.

Offline XJDenton

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #547 on: March 17, 2012, 05:32:59 PM »
I'm probably going to write an in depth reviw in the next couple of days.
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Offline Dimitrius

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #548 on: March 17, 2012, 07:22:01 PM »
(fallout 3 anyone?).
 
Not the same situation though, Bethesda didn't change the ending because "it sucked" they changed it because you couldnt play the DLC after it ended (remember that FO3 doesn't let you continue exploring after you beat the main quest) and people who didn't had a save befofe starting the final missions got, understandably, upset. That's why Broken Steel changed the ending.
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Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #549 on: March 19, 2012, 06:42:12 AM »
I'm about to go to Earth. I have done at least 80% of the side quests and my EMS is still only like 2700 or something. Apparently you need 5000 to get the best ending. Even if I did the remaining 20% of side quests, I'm still not sure I would get my EMS that high.

'Bout to be fucked. :lol
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Offline ACID_FOX

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #550 on: March 19, 2012, 07:04:39 AM »
To be honest, the effect it has on the ending itself is pretty minimal.
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Offline Riceball

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #551 on: March 19, 2012, 07:40:30 AM »
Maybe spoilers, IDK







Disclaimer: I haven't played any of the trilogy at any stage, nor will I (unless I have no need of income). I'm interested in this from a commercial perspective.

In my mind, roasting your fanbase like this is pretty poor business. People have invested an immense, probably excessive, amount of time on the product; really invested themselves in it which us great - it shows that they've developed a pretty fine piece of kit. Surely, in this day and age with all of the feedback and intelligence a gaming company can obtain through the internet, someone working in a senior enough possie would think, hang on, we are really going to piss people off here, lets spend a bit more time and get this right. I think its going to cause a fair bit of damage to the developers reputation. I think this could be a really great case study at a business school :lol
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Offline ACID_FOX

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #552 on: March 19, 2012, 08:11:46 AM »
Not only that, they literally LIED about the ending. The lead developer said before the games release "It wouldn't be an A B C type ending" When that's exactly what we got.
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Offline AcidLameLTE

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #553 on: March 19, 2012, 02:04:27 PM »
So yeah, the ending wasn't that great but not exactly something I would sign a petition over.

Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #554 on: March 20, 2012, 10:52:19 AM »
OK. Full spoiler review from a hardcore fan...

The Amazing - Mass Effect 3 has by far and away the best interpersonal moments of the series. There were certain sequences that made me feel legitimately nostalgic and sad, like when you go shooting with Garrus on the Citadel. Speaking with your allies and squad mates on Earth before launching the final attack was also incredible. I could go on for days about all the moments like this.

Up until the ending, the game's plot is awesome. The Mordin story, in particular, is probably the best executed and written "arc" of the series. It's absolutely perfect. As a matter of fact, the entire genophage section is pretty much perfect. I also really like how Thane's "arc" played out.

The Good - ME3 finds the perfect balance between the ridiculously complicated item inventory system of ME1 and the nonexistent item inventory system of ME2. It also finds the perfect balance between the ridiculously detailed leveling up system of ME1 and the oversimplified leveling up system of ME2.

I really enjoyed the combat in the game, although sometimes the level design is a little clumsy.

The Nitpick-y - There were a lot of tiny changes made to ME3 from ME2 that I did not like as much. I preferred the menu screens in ME2, preferred having the codex separate from the journal, etc. Just lots of nitpick-y things like that that, at the end of the day, I really don't care at all about.

The Bad - This might also be a nitpick-y thing, but I didn't like how most of the dialog options were reduced to two. I also thought there was a little too much automatic dialog.

The Horrible - I hate to be a part of the whiny internet community that is dominating discussion of ME3, but I gotta admit, I really hated the ending. I try to make sure I approach all art and entertainment without expectations or hopes, but in the case of the ME series where I ended up investing 60+ hours in a single save file and developing real relationships with the characters, I couldn't help but develop some hope that I would see what happens to them. I also wanted to see what happens to Shepard. Basically, I wanted a happy ending with lots of closure that would make me feel warm and fuzzy inside.

The ending that we actually got was just so unsatisfying. It has left me with no desire to replay ME3 anytime soon, whereas the second I finished both ME1 and ME2 for the first time I was starting a new game. I also feel like the volume of what is required of the player to achieve the best ending is so large that it makes me not want to even try. I completed 80% of the side quests in the game and still my Effective Military Strength was only at 2800. I don't mind playing multiplayer to boost that but right now I'm trying to save money so I don't have Xbox Live Gold.

Am I sounding a little self-entitled right now? Probably, and I apologize for it. I just feel that the ending sucked. It was really really bad, and makes the entirety of ME3 seem somewhat pointless.

Conclusion - Up until the ending, the game is almost perfect and has many perfect moments. The ending, however, left such a bad taste in my mouth. It made me feel sad that I will never know on any level what will happen to these characters I have come to love, and it made me feel discouraged to play the game again because it made what I'd done seem pointless.

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Offline AcidLameLTE

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #555 on: March 20, 2012, 11:08:39 AM »
Did anyone play the game with the day one DLC?

Offline XJDenton

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #556 on: March 20, 2012, 11:36:04 AM »
I did.
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Offline ACID_FOX

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #557 on: March 20, 2012, 12:29:23 PM »
"Up until the ending, the game is almost perfect and has many perfect moments. The ending, however, left such a bad taste in my mouth. It made me feel sad that I will never know on any level what will happen to these characters I have come to love, and it made me feel discouraged to play the game again because it made what I'd done seem pointless."

This.
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Offline Dimitrius

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #558 on: March 20, 2012, 01:45:33 PM »
You don't need to play MP to get the best EMS number...
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Offline Omega

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Re: Mass Effect 3 (merged)
« Reply #559 on: March 20, 2012, 01:49:02 PM »
"Up until the ending, the game is almost perfect and has many perfect moments. The ending, however, left such a bad taste in my mouth. It made me feel sad that I will never know on any level what will happen to these characters I have come to love, and it made me feel discouraged to play the game again because it made what I'd done seem pointless."

This.

SPOILERS




I must agree with this as well. Yet I found the "ending" rather exhilarating and amazing up until the confrontation with the Catalyst. The conduit and the bloody Shepard, the bloody, grotesque inner sanctums of the Citadel, the confrontation with the Illusive Man and the conversation with Anderson all were executed quite well. But then...the events after that...eh...not so much.
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