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The Depressed/Angry Thread.

Started by Marvellous G, January 30, 2010, 04:13:29 PM

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Train of Naught

Quote from: jingle.boy on February 25, 2024, 04:05:11 AM
It's kinda nice that "this topic has not been posted in for at least 90 days."

It's been a brutal February.  I think I've been as low in my life as I've ever been. Living with depression sucks.  For me, there are many many different layers and nuances to what's triggered it, but there was a period of about 10 days where nothing mattered.  Literally nothing - there were times I didn't even care about or have the energy to eat.  I would never take my own life, but the thoughts are there - I was driving on the highway one day, passing a big transport truck and though "if he sideswiped me into the ditch, that wouldn't be so bad".  I don't know where I got the energy to put on a brave face and make it thru my work days.  The past few days have been better, but it's a pretty big hole to have to climb out of.  I'm still mostly faking my way thru things.

I miss me.
The old me.
The happy me.
The bright me.
The smiling me.
The laughing me.
The gone me.
         --Unknown


... but I'm trying to get back there.


Remember if you can go through all of that I bet soon enough you will find it in you to find the help you need, no one can help you enough if you don't want to help yourself, Remember if you decide to get help, the help will arrive in the ways you want it to arrive.. Much love to you, poor soul

Stadler

Quote from: Harmony on February 25, 2024, 11:35:32 AM
I stumbled upon this last week.  I can't say I'm a huge BBT fan but this resonated with me on a level that is hard to put into words.  He describes exactly how I feel in my grief over the loss of my sister well on 2 years ago now.

I know many here are dealing with grief and loss.  Maybe it will help.  I hope it does....at least as much as anything could ever possibly help.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Pn3y7S5FAw

Yeah, I can vouch for all of that.   I don't know if the percentages are right, and "sad" isn't really the right word, but I carry that melancholy as well.  I'm just now coming to grips with what Billy Bob said, and that is it will be with me from here on out. 

OpenYourEyes311

Quote from: jingle.boy on February 25, 2024, 04:05:11 AM
I would never take my own life, but the thoughts are there.

I miss me.
The old me.
The happy me.
The bright me.
The smiling me.
The laughing me.
The gone me.
         --Unknown

Wow. I could have wrote that. Both the bolded and the poem. Hope you find some peace.

Quote from: jingle.boy on February 26, 2024, 03:14:14 AM
This is how I like to express my depression ... some say they suffer from it, I say I live with it.  For me, it's no difference than having any form of chronic physical illness - arthritis, or MS, or something like that.  Some days it's barely noticeable, some days it's tough, and others it's debilitating.  But it's always there.  I know the REALLY bad times won't last forever, but (for me) they don't just fall off. 

As I reflect on my life, I've always had it (at least as far back as my teens), I just didn't recognize it for what it was until my mid-30s, or suppressed it with various means (drugs in my teens; partying/alcohol in my early 20s; love/infatuation in my late 20s; parenthood in my early 30s).

Re: the bolded part here, that's how I feel as well. It's always there and it's been a very hard year getting out of it. It's crazy the things we do to suppress the bad feelings. I never used drugs or alcohol, but it's funny how this post triggered how I'm sort of using parenthood to do my very best at masking the depression. He makes every day worth living, even when it doesn't feel like it.

Glasser

When I think of the last few years, losing both parents, and how my entire family fell apart, I wonder if my entire life was a lie. I feel like a 54 year old orphan. It's tragic honestly.

Stadler

Quote from: Glasser on May 24, 2024, 09:15:02 AM
When I think of the last few years, losing both parents, and how my entire family fell apart, I wonder if my entire life was a lie. I feel like a 54 year old orphan. It's tragic honestly.

My family hasn't fallen apart - in some senses it's stronger - but I can absolutely vouch for that feeling of being unmoored since losing my parents.   It's almost impossible to describe, and I can tell you I never in a million years saw it coming.

TAC

Quote from: Glasser on May 24, 2024, 09:15:02 AM
When I think of the last few years, losing both parents, and how my entire family fell apart, I wonder if my entire life was a lie. I feel like a 54 year old orphan. It's tragic honestly.

Tom, I know there's no way I could find the words to make you feel better. I can tell you that I really enjoy your company here, and look forward to your posts each day.


Quote from: Stadler on May 24, 2024, 09:58:03 AM
My family hasn't fallen apart - in some senses it's stronger - but I can absolutely vouch for that feeling of being unmoored since losing my parents.   It's almost impossible to describe, and I can tell you I never in a million years saw it coming.

I may not be able to speak 100% on this as my mother is still alive, but the real mover for me was my father. There are days where I just want to talk to him again. Maybe there'll be another shoe to drop when my mother passes, but I don't know..Other than my own wife and kids, I've lived most of my adult life without any actual family involved.


I guess we're just getting to the age where the torch has been passed to US, whether we're ready or not. Me, I'm gonna try and hold onto it as long as I fucking can.
Quote from: wkiml on June 08, 2012, 09:06:35 AMwould have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Quote from: Buddyhunter1 on April 22, 2023, 05:54:45 PMTAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol

Stadler

Quote from: TAC on May 24, 2024, 11:32:44 AM

I may not be able to speak 100% on this as my mother is still alive, but the real mover for me was my father. There are days where I just want to talk to him again. Maybe there'll be another shoe to drop when my mother passes, but I don't know..Other than my own wife and kids, I've lived most of my adult life without any actual family involved.


I guess we're just getting to the age where the torch has been passed to US, whether we're ready or not. Me, I'm gonna try and hold onto it as long as I fucking can.

This times a 100.  I talked to my dad probably every other day or so.  Just to shoot the shit sometimes, other times because I loved calling him and asking him about "problems" I was having with my car, or "how to" do stuff around the house, that kind of thing.  He always had great input, and it made him feel involved.  I was working on my truck earlier this week (an electrical problem; my dad went to electronics school and was a radio/radar guy in the Army) and I actually got angry that I couldn't call him and walk him through the problem. 

We also had a cool party for my stepdaughter and her engagement.  At one point I was sitting at a table with my mother- and father-in law, and I had this strong feeling that my mom and dad needed to be there. Not "would have liked to have been" or "it would have been nice if they were", but NEEDED to be there.  And they weren't. Didn't ruin the day or anything, but it certainly gave me something to think about.

Glasser

Thank you guys! This forum is special, hence the reason I share so much. I'm still searching and no pun intended, Learning how to live again, it's a different world in every sense. Part of me died losing them and then my son having open heart surgery 2 months after my dad passed in the thick of the pandemic. Much love to you guys!  :heart

wolfking

Quote from: Glasser on May 24, 2024, 09:15:02 AM
When I think of the last few years, losing both parents, and how my entire family fell apart, I wonder if my entire life was a lie. I feel like a 54 year old orphan. It's tragic honestly.

That's tough to read mate, I'm so sorry.

wolfking

I will say, those that had or have good relationships with your parents, cherish that.

My Mother and I are pretty close but my father I've never been close to.  I've tried but he's a strange fella.  He's never told me he loves me, never helped me, never really given me advice and never been a role model at all.  Even with my work situation, he's offered nothing.  I also only found out the last year that he was abusive to my mother for a lot of years.  I had inklings but never to the extent I know now.  not sure why she ever stayed.  They've finally parted ways over the last 3 months or so and my Father has basically removed himself away from us.  He left Mum the house and enough to live.  He always provided for us, he worked 80 hour weeks and we always lived comfortably but that was as far as his support ever went.

While we were never close, I've stuck out the olive branch while all this was happening more than ever as I knew we'd become more distant and I basically told him I'm there for him for whatever, even just to catch up and go for a game of golf to keep in touch, but that hasn't happened.  He's made his intentions clear and that's quite sad so now unfortunately I have to accept that and grow from it.  Even after all my work disaster, I thought any father would try and bond with their son.  He always plays golf with work mates all the time and while golf isn't my thing, just once, just fucking once all I wanted was him to want to go for a game of golf with me.  Even when I've hinted, he just shys away, can't handle the connection.

While I've tried to keep them together and our family by being around half the time, it's all over now.  Our family is slowly drifting apart.  I don't speak to my siblings that much and I know we are all a by product of the relationship we grew up with.  We never saw physical abuse, just a loveless marriage that should have ended 25 years ago.  I'm to blame to, I see so much of my father in myself it's scary.

Anyway, didn't mean to go into all that, but my point is, to those that are grieving their parents and miss them, if you had that relationship with them as I know some of you have, even though they are gone, be thankful and cherish the fuck that you had that, you simply have no idea how blessed you were.

Jamesman42

I miss my parents. My mom died when I was 17 and my dad died right before the pandemic. I'm glad he got to know my daughter exists. Too late to know he also would have a grandson. Really makes me sad sometimes.


I am slipping into depression. I'm at the end of a school year that has me questioning if I am worth it in my career. And I don't feel like a good enough dad/husband. And person, really.

ProfessorPeart

Quote from: Stadler on May 24, 2024, 11:42:57 AM
other times because I loved calling him and asking him about "problems" I was having with my car, or "how to" do stuff around the house, that kind of thing.  He always had great input, and it made him feel involved.  I was working on my truck earlier this week (an electrical problem; my dad went to electronics school and was a radio/radar guy in the Army) and I actually got angry that I couldn't call him and walk him through the problem. 


Man, this hits me. I literally called Dad 2 weekends ago because I bought a motion detection light switch for my garage. I got thrown by it needing 4 wires and not just 2. I was lost. Called him and talked him through what was in the box and what the directions said and he walked me through it.

My wife has said out loud that she does not want to see me when my Dad dies. Scares the crap out of me.
Quote from: ProfessorPeart on November 14, 2023, 11:17:53 AMbeul ni teh efac = Lube In The Face / That has to be wrong.  :lol / EDIT: Oh, it's Blue! I'm an idiot.
Quote from: Indiscipline on November 14, 2023, 02:26:25 PMPardon the interruption, but I just had to run in and celebrate the majesty of Lube in the Face as highest moment in roulette history.

Grappler

Quote from: ProfessorPeart on May 24, 2024, 07:02:25 PM
Man, this hits me. I literally called Dad 2 weekends ago because I bought a motion detection light switch for my garage. I got thrown by it needing 4 wires and not just 2. I was lost. Called him and talked him through what was in the box and what the directions said and he walked me through it.

My wife has said out loud that she does not want to see me when my Dad dies. Scares the crap out of me.

That's exactly how I am.  I rely on him or his advice so much when it comes to helping with home repairs, especially electrical stuff.  He just turned 70, and he's still like "hey, lets go up on the roof and cut a hole to install an exhaust fan." and I have to say "eh we'll hire someone to do that, your just had your knee replaced" 

My mom has Alzheimer's (and cancer) and I spend a lot of time thinking about her, mostly in a kind of mourning, where I wonder how things would be different if she were healthy.  She'd see the bigger house we moved into and understand that it's ours, she'd see the kids grow up.  There are days where I think that things would be easier on the family if she were gone, as morbid as it is.  My dad is incredible when it comes to handling her care - it's not easy at all, even though she lives in a memory care facility.  There are so many bills and health insurance/transportation coordination.  He spends 2 hours per day dealing with it all. 

It's very strange to get older yourself and realize that your parents are now that much older. 

Cool Chris

Quote from: Grappler on May 24, 2024, 07:41:17 PM
That's exactly how I am.  I rely on him or his advice so much when it comes to helping with home repairs, especially electrical stuff.  He just turned 70, and he's still like "hey, lets go up on the roof and cut a hole to install an exhaust fan." and I have to say "eh we'll hire someone to do that, your just had your knee replaced" 

Not to add some levity, but a while back my dad decided to get on a ladder and trim some branches, in the rain! He ended up falling off and knocking himself out. I talked to him later and he said mom told him he wasn't allowed to climb the ladder any longer, and that he wasn't in a position to argue, being as how he was in a hospital bed due to him falling off a ladder.

These posts are very moving; I appreciate the willingness of those who are contributing these difficult thoughts and emotions. I've only ever been close to my parents and sister in my family. All my relatives who have died I did not know well. I am not prepared for the loss of someone close to me.

jingle.boy

Quote from: wolfking on May 24, 2024, 05:33:51 PM
I will say, those that had or have good relationships with your parents, cherish that.

My Mother and I are pretty close but my father I've never been close to.  I've tried but he's a strange fella.  He's never told me he loves me, never helped me, never really given me advice and never been a role model at all.  Even with my work situation, he's offered nothing.  I also only found out the last year that he was abusive to my mother for a lot of years.  I had inklings but never to the extent I know now.  not sure why she ever stayed.  They've finally parted ways over the last 3 months or so and my Father has basically removed himself away from us.  He left Mum the house and enough to live.  He always provided for us, he worked 80 hour weeks and we always lived comfortably but that was as far as his support ever went.

While we were never close, I've stuck out the olive branch while all this was happening more than ever as I knew we'd become more distant and I basically told him I'm there for him for whatever, even just to catch up and go for a game of golf to keep in touch, but that hasn't happened.  He's made his intentions clear and that's quite sad so now unfortunately I have to accept that and grow from it.  Even after all my work disaster, I thought any father would try and bond with their son.  He always plays golf with work mates all the time and while golf isn't my thing, just once, just fucking once all I wanted was him to want to go for a game of golf with me.  Even when I've hinted, he just shys away, can't handle the connection.

While I've tried to keep them together and our family by being around half the time, it's all over now.  Our family is slowly drifting apart.  I don't speak to my siblings that much and I know we are all a by product of the relationship we grew up with.  We never saw physical abuse, just a loveless marriage that should have ended 25 years ago.  I'm to blame to, I see so much of my father in myself it's scary.

Anyway, didn't mean to go into all that, but my point is, to those that are grieving their parents and miss them, if you had that relationship with them as I know some of you have, even though they are gone, be thankful and cherish the fuck that you had that, you simply have no idea how blessed you were.

Man Kade... a good number of similarities with my relationship with my father.

So, my relationship with my father (who passed in 2020) was somewhat similar, at least during the last 10ish years of his life.  He was my best friend for a long time - we were very close.  When he and my mother split up (1985; I was 14), I managed to stay somewhat close to him, but my brother did not.  My father (learning from his father), had very tumultuous relationships with all of his family members (me, my brother, as well as his own father and brother).  For whatever reason, there wasn't enough room in his life to have a 'good' relationship everyone at the same time - someone was always in his shit-house. From about '90-'10, I was in his good graces ... I'd accepted his 2nd wife (they were married in '87) faster and more fully than anyone else in the family, and after the jingle.kids were born, he was a very active an involved grandparent.  During my wedding in '99, there were some circumstances that resulted in a very hard falling out with my brother, and nearly my father as well.  But my father owned up and sincerely apologized for what happened, and we moved on (unlike my brother, who doubled down on what happened, and it created an irreparable rift between us - still to this day as the last time we spoke was around the events of my father's death).  Around 2008, things started going off the rails with my dad ... see, he was the kind of man that needed to be needed.  He was his mother's caretaker until her passing in 2007; he was very active in the jingle.kids lives when they were young.  But then, as they started to get older and we didn't need him to 'kid-sit' or watch them, and they were less interested in hanging out with their grand-parents, well... he started taking personal offense to that.  At that point, he was rebuilding his relationship with his brother (they'd had a strained relationship since my mom/dad divorced), and was getting closer with my brother, as one of his kids needed high-school tutoring in Math (my father was a retired math teacher).  So, my brother was in his good books ... because he was needed.

Things came to a head in 2012 (very long complicated story) when he no-showed the jingle.kids birthday saying "I didn't think your parents would want me there" - when he had been at their birthday every year of their life.  And then more shit when my step-mom passed in late 2016.  We'd had periodic conversations for a few months early in 2017, then I called him in August to wish him a happy 75th birthday, and he was in the car on a road-trip vacation with his "new" girlfriend - not even 8 months after his wife of 30 years had just passed away.  I don't know that we had another conversation until the week before he passed away when he called me from the hospital as he'd been in-and-out of the hospital, having some strange/ongoing issues with his leg.  I'm glad we had that final conversation as some form of closure - he was a very complicated man and my relationship with him my entire life was a roller coaster of closeness and abandonment.

I honestly haven't thought much about him in the last 4 years ... I'm not even sure I remember the date of his actual death - it was the Wednesday 10 days before Father's Day, that much I remember.  So yeah, for those of you that have/had a lifetime of closeness with one or both parents, cherish that.  I'm not sure which is more common - situations like me/Kade, or those of Tom/Tim/Bill.
Quote from: TAC on July 31, 2021, 06:55:07 PMIf I can do it, it's idiot proof.
Quote from: Stadler on January 03, 2024, 09:00:00 AMThat's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
Quote from: hefdaddy42 on November 04, 2021, 05:14:36 AMI fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".

Glasser

Quote from: wolfking on May 24, 2024, 05:33:51 PM
I will say, those that had or have good relationships with your parents, cherish that.

My Mother and I are pretty close but my father I've never been close to.  I've tried but he's a strange fella.  He's never told me he loves me, never helped me, never really given me advice and never been a role model at all.  Even with my work situation, he's offered nothing.  I also only found out the last year that he was abusive to my mother for a lot of years.  I had inklings but never to the extent I know now.  not sure why she ever stayed.  They've finally parted ways over the last 3 months or so and my Father has basically removed himself away from us.  He left Mum the house and enough to live.  He always provided for us, he worked 80 hour weeks and we always lived comfortably but that was as far as his support ever went.

While we were never close, I've stuck out the olive branch while all this was happening more than ever as I knew we'd become more distant and I basically told him I'm there for him for whatever, even just to catch up and go for a game of golf to keep in touch, but that hasn't happened.  He's made his intentions clear and that's quite sad so now unfortunately I have to accept that and grow from it.  Even after all my work disaster, I thought any father would try and bond with their son.  He always plays golf with work mates all the time and while golf isn't my thing, just once, just fucking once all I wanted was him to want to go for a game of golf with me.  Even when I've hinted, he just shys away, can't handle the connection.

While I've tried to keep them together and our family by being around half the time, it's all over now.  Our family is slowly drifting apart.  I don't speak to my siblings that much and I know we are all a by product of the relationship we grew up with.  We never saw physical abuse, just a loveless marriage that should have ended 25 years ago.  I'm to blame to, I see so much of my father in myself it's scary.

Anyway, didn't mean to go into all that, but my point is, to those that are grieving their parents and miss them, if you had that relationship with them as I know some of you have, even though they are gone, be thankful and cherish the fuck that you had that, you simply have no idea how blessed you were.

I have no words other than that breaks my heart Kade.

Glasser

Quote from: jingle.boy on May 25, 2024, 07:14:55 AM
Man Kade... a good number of similarities with my relationship with my father.

So, my relationship with my father (who passed in 2020) was somewhat similar, at least during the last 10ish years of his life.  He was my best friend for a long time - we were very close.  When he and my mother split up (1985; I was 14), I managed to stay somewhat close to him, but my brother did not.  My father (learning from his father), had very tumultuous relationships with all of his family members (me, my brother, as well as his own father and brother).  For whatever reason, there wasn't enough room in his life to have a 'good' relationship everyone at the same time - someone was always in his shit-house. From about '90-'10, I was in his good graces ... I'd accepted his 2nd wife (they were married in '87) faster and more fully than anyone else in the family, and after the jingle.kids were born, he was a very active an involved grandparent.  During my wedding in '99, there were some circumstances that resulted in a very hard falling out with my brother, and nearly my father as well.  But my father owned up and sincerely apologized for what happened, and we moved on (unlike my brother, who doubled down on what happened, and it created an irreparable rift between us - still to this day as the last time we spoke was around the events of my father's death).  Around 2008, things started going off the rails with my dad ... see, he was the kind of man that needed to be needed.  He was his mother's caretaker until her passing in 2007; he was very active in the jingle.kids lives when they were young.  But then, as they started to get older and we didn't need him to 'kid-sit' or watch them, and they were less interested in hanging out with their grand-parents, well... he started taking personal offense to that.  At that point, he was rebuilding his relationship with his brother (they'd had a strained relationship since my mom/dad divorced), and was getting closer with my brother, as one of his kids needed high-school tutoring in Math (my father was a retired math teacher).  So, my brother was in his good books ... because he was needed.

Things came to a head in 2012 (very long complicated story) when he no-showed the jingle.kids birthday saying "I didn't think your parents would want me there" - when he had been at their birthday every year of their life.  And then more shit when my step-mom passed in late 2016.  We'd had periodic conversations for a few months early in 2017, then I called him in August to wish him a happy 75th birthday, and he was in the car on a road-trip vacation with his "new" girlfriend - not even 8 months after his wife of 30 years had just passed away.  I don't know that we had another conversation until the week before he passed away when he called me from the hospital as he'd been in-and-out of the hospital, having some strange/ongoing issues with his leg.  I'm glad we had that final conversation as some form of closure - he was a very complicated man and my relationship with him my entire life was a roller coaster of closeness and abandonment.

I honestly haven't thought much about him in the last 4 years ... I'm not even sure I remember the date of his actual death - it was the Wednesday 10 days before Father's Day, that much I remember.  So yeah, for those of you that have/had a lifetime of closeness with one or both parents, cherish that.  I'm not sure which is more common - situations like me/Kade, or those of Tom/Tim/Bill.

I just want to cry reading this. :(

wolfking

Quote from: jingle.boy on May 25, 2024, 07:14:55 AM
Man Kade... a good number of similarities with my relationship with my father.

So, my relationship with my father (who passed in 2020) was somewhat similar, at least during the last 10ish years of his life.  He was my best friend for a long time - we were very close.  When he and my mother split up (1985; I was 14), I managed to stay somewhat close to him, but my brother did not.  My father (learning from his father), had very tumultuous relationships with all of his family members (me, my brother, as well as his own father and brother).  For whatever reason, there wasn't enough room in his life to have a 'good' relationship everyone at the same time - someone was always in his shit-house. From about '90-'10, I was in his good graces ... I'd accepted his 2nd wife (they were married in '87) faster and more fully than anyone else in the family, and after the jingle.kids were born, he was a very active an involved grandparent.  During my wedding in '99, there were some circumstances that resulted in a very hard falling out with my brother, and nearly my father as well.  But my father owned up and sincerely apologized for what happened, and we moved on (unlike my brother, who doubled down on what happened, and it created an irreparable rift between us - still to this day as the last time we spoke was around the events of my father's death).  Around 2008, things started going off the rails with my dad ... see, he was the kind of man that needed to be needed.  He was his mother's caretaker until her passing in 2007; he was very active in the jingle.kids lives when they were young.  But then, as they started to get older and we didn't need him to 'kid-sit' or watch them, and they were less interested in hanging out with their grand-parents, well... he started taking personal offense to that.  At that point, he was rebuilding his relationship with his brother (they'd had a strained relationship since my mom/dad divorced), and was getting closer with my brother, as one of his kids needed high-school tutoring in Math (my father was a retired math teacher).  So, my brother was in his good books ... because he was needed.

Things came to a head in 2012 (very long complicated story) when he no-showed the jingle.kids birthday saying "I didn't think your parents would want me there" - when he had been at their birthday every year of their life.  And then more shit when my step-mom passed in late 2016.  We'd had periodic conversations for a few months early in 2017, then I called him in August to wish him a happy 75th birthday, and he was in the car on a road-trip vacation with his "new" girlfriend - not even 8 months after his wife of 30 years had just passed away.  I don't know that we had another conversation until the week before he passed away when he called me from the hospital as he'd been in-and-out of the hospital, having some strange/ongoing issues with his leg.  I'm glad we had that final conversation as some form of closure - he was a very complicated man and my relationship with him my entire life was a roller coaster of closeness and abandonment.

I honestly haven't thought much about him in the last 4 years ... I'm not even sure I remember the date of his actual death - it was the Wednesday 10 days before Father's Day, that much I remember.  So yeah, for those of you that have/had a lifetime of closeness with one or both parents, cherish that.  I'm not sure which is more common - situations like me/Kade, or those of Tom/Tim/Bill.

Reading this now mate, yes, I remember you telling me this story before.  Sad way for something to end when as you said you were best friends at one point and as close as you were.  That kind of makes things even worse.

I wish I had that at some point though.  My father never wanted to really know or be involved in our lives at all.  I wanted to be his friend but he just never really wanted to make any effort.  I've worked out on my own now that I was working 80 hour weeks just to be like him, for his approval.  He was always disappointed in my older brother as he has never worked and didn't make anything of himself.  I know my father has always seen him as a disappointment, I saw that pretty clearly.  I always did the opposite, working weeks and months at a time on end just to be like him, wanting him to be proud.  I'm not sure if he ever was, he never told anything of the kind.  The way things have been left and the resentment I'm starting to feel, I'll probably never know.

wolfking

Quote from: Glasser on May 25, 2024, 09:41:50 PM
I have no words other than that breaks my heart Kade.

It's all good brother.  But thank you.

wolfking

Quote from: jingle.boy on May 25, 2024, 07:14:55 AM
So yeah, for those of you that have/had a lifetime of closeness with one or both parents, cherish that.  I'm not sure which is more common - situations like me/Kade, or those of Tom/Tim/Bill.

Interesting thought.  Who knows, I'm sure the more people you talk to the more it would even out, but who knows.  I would think from what I've seen and people I have come across in my time that a situation like mine would be more a rarity than the other.

You know, it might just be my way of thinking now or due to our actual relationship but unfortunately, when the time comes and my Father passes, I know I'll feel nothing.  He has gone downhill but not taking care of himself and not seeing doctors when he should have is your own fault.  I still had respect for him over the last year but over the last 3 months, that's down to almost nothing.  And if he doesn't want a relationship with his children and wants to rot by himself, so fucking be it.

So yeah, anyone that has or has had a close bond with your parents, you are so very blessed and think yourself very lucky.

jingle.boy

Quote from: wolfking on May 26, 2024, 06:38:49 PM
Interesting thought.  Who knows, I'm sure the more people you talk to the more it would even out, but who knows.  I would think from what I've seen and people I have come across in my time that a situation like mine would be more a rarity than the other.

You know, it might just be my way of thinking now or due to our actual relationship but unfortunately, when the time comes and my Father passes, I know I'll feel nothing.  He has gone downhill but not taking care of himself and not seeing doctors when he should have is your own fault.  I still had respect for him over the last year but over the last 3 months, that's down to almost nothing.  And if he doesn't want a relationship with his children and wants to rot by himself, so fucking be it.

So yeah, anyone that has or has had a close bond with your parents, you are so very blessed and think yourself very lucky.

I thought that too, but there was a brief grieving process that I went thru.  I'd reconciled in my mind that my relationship with my father 'died' back in 2012 - that it was never going to be what it once was - and honestly, if I'd reflected more on the ups and downs of my relationship with him throughout those first 40 years, I should've known that to be the case.  And it was.  We never repaired anything after that one conversation, but that is how he handled adversity with family - by ignoring and distancing himself from it.  Still, there was some sadness that morning I got the call from my brother.
Quote from: TAC on July 31, 2021, 06:55:07 PMIf I can do it, it's idiot proof.
Quote from: Stadler on January 03, 2024, 09:00:00 AMThat's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
Quote from: hefdaddy42 on November 04, 2021, 05:14:36 AMI fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".

wolfking

Quote from: jingle.boy on May 26, 2024, 06:59:36 PM
I thought that too, but there was a brief grieving process that I went thru.  I'd reconciled in my mind that my relationship with my father 'died' back in 2012 - that it was never going to be what it once was - and honestly, if I'd reflected more on the ups and downs of my relationship with him throughout those first 40 years, I should've known that to be the case.  And it was.  We never repaired anything after that one conversation, but that is how he handled adversity with family - by ignoring and distancing himself from it.  Still, there was some sadness that morning I got the call from my brother.

Of course.  I'm probably being naive.  But never really having that relationship and connection in the first place, I'm not so sure.  But, it's probably not really a healthy thing to think about.

King Postwhore

And as Chad knows, my brother and I are close.  I couldn't even think if I was in Chad's position. 
"I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down'." - Bon Newhart.

Grappler

I have a similar relationship with my brother.  We just grew apart.  I finished college in 2002, and he was still downstate at school.  I went on to work, go out with friends 2-3 nights a week and live my life, never really checking in on him.  He has held that against me for 22 years.

My brother has a big ego - he finished college and rather than move back home to the Chicago suburbs, he stayed downstate in rural Illinois, where he got a job and could be "the big guy from Chicago" in a smaller town.  He has always held it against me, that I never stayed in touch with him, but forgets that telephones and relationships work two ways.  I never heard from him, and still don't, even though we now live 20 minutes apart.  He never RSVP's for family parties and I have to badger him and say "hey, are you coming?  We have to figure out how much food to buy."  He still acts as if the world revolves around him at his leisure and he can just wake up and decide if he wants to do something vs. planning ahead.

He never really checks in with me, or even my parents.  When my daughter was born and he became an uncle, he waited for four or five days before reaching out to me and congratulating me.  He never cared to ask about her as a baby, and still now as a 9 year old.  My wife held it against him so much that she refused to let me ask him to be godfather to our second child. 

Even recently, my dad coordinated my mom's kidney surgery 2 weeks ago.  He got it all sent, sent off a text with the details.  My brother responds and says "well, it looks like you have it all set" and my response was "thanks, I'LL BE THERE."  My brother didn't show up at the hospital, even though it was possible that my mom had some adverse reaction to anesthesia or her vitals could have crashed during surgery. 

My dad knows he and I don't really get along, but we are cordial.  I think it bothers him, but there's not much we can do - I always tell my wife that talking to him about it is futile, since my brother will never change, so why bother dredging all of this up. 

gmillerdrake

Quote from: wolfking on May 24, 2024, 05:33:51 PM
I will say, those that had or have good relationships with your parents, cherish that.

My Mother and I are pretty close but my father I've never been close to.  I've tried but he's a strange fella.  He's never told me he loves me, never helped me, never really given me advice and never been a role model at all.  Even with my work situation, he's offered nothing.  I also only found out the last year that he was abusive to my mother for a lot of years.  I had inklings but never to the extent I know now.  not sure why she ever stayed.  They've finally parted ways over the last 3 months or so and my Father has basically removed himself away from us.  He left Mum the house and enough to live.  He always provided for us, he worked 80 hour weeks and we always lived comfortably but that was as far as his support ever went.

While we were never close, I've stuck out the olive branch while all this was happening more than ever as I knew we'd become more distant and I basically told him I'm there for him for whatever, even just to catch up and go for a game of golf to keep in touch, but that hasn't happened.  He's made his intentions clear and that's quite sad so now unfortunately I have to accept that and grow from it.  Even after all my work disaster, I thought any father would try and bond with their son.  He always plays golf with work mates all the time and while golf isn't my thing, just once, just fucking once all I wanted was him to want to go for a game of golf with me.  Even when I've hinted, he just shys away, can't handle the connection.

While I've tried to keep them together and our family by being around half the time, it's all over now.  Our family is slowly drifting apart.  I don't speak to my siblings that much and I know we are all a by product of the relationship we grew up with.  We never saw physical abuse, just a loveless marriage that should have ended 25 years ago.  I'm to blame to, I see so much of my father in myself it's scary.

Anyway, didn't mean to go into all that, but my point is, to those that are grieving their parents and miss them, if you had that relationship with them as I know some of you have, even though they are gone, be thankful and cherish the fuck that you had that, you simply have no idea how blessed you were.

It breaks my heart to hear/read something like this. I just can't imagine it. I'm blessed to have a father who was always around and present and interested in our lives....was a good role model.....and I'm trying to be that type of father to my sons. I don't know what I'd do if my dad were that distant.....I wish I had something prophetic to say to you to help.

gmillerdrake

Quote from: jingle.boy on May 25, 2024, 07:14:55 AM
Man Kade... a good number of similarities with my relationship with my father.

So, my relationship with my father (who passed in 2020) was somewhat similar, at least during the last 10ish years of his life.  He was my best friend for a long time - we were very close.  When he and my mother split up (1985; I was 14), I managed to stay somewhat close to him, but my brother did not.  My father (learning from his father), had very tumultuous relationships with all of his family members (me, my brother, as well as his own father and brother).  For whatever reason, there wasn't enough room in his life to have a 'good' relationship everyone at the same time - someone was always in his shit-house. From about '90-'10, I was in his good graces ... I'd accepted his 2nd wife (they were married in '87) faster and more fully than anyone else in the family, and after the jingle.kids were born, he was a very active an involved grandparent.  During my wedding in '99, there were some circumstances that resulted in a very hard falling out with my brother, and nearly my father as well.  But my father owned up and sincerely apologized for what happened, and we moved on (unlike my brother, who doubled down on what happened, and it created an irreparable rift between us - still to this day as the last time we spoke was around the events of my father's death).  Around 2008, things started going off the rails with my dad ... see, he was the kind of man that needed to be needed.  He was his mother's caretaker until her passing in 2007; he was very active in the jingle.kids lives when they were young.  But then, as they started to get older and we didn't need him to 'kid-sit' or watch them, and they were less interested in hanging out with their grand-parents, well... he started taking personal offense to that.  At that point, he was rebuilding his relationship with his brother (they'd had a strained relationship since my mom/dad divorced), and was getting closer with my brother, as one of his kids needed high-school tutoring in Math (my father was a retired math teacher).  So, my brother was in his good books ... because he was needed.

Things came to a head in 2012 (very long complicated story) when he no-showed the jingle.kids birthday saying "I didn't think your parents would want me there" - when he had been at their birthday every year of their life.  And then more shit when my step-mom passed in late 2016.  We'd had periodic conversations for a few months early in 2017, then I called him in August to wish him a happy 75th birthday, and he was in the car on a road-trip vacation with his "new" girlfriend - not even 8 months after his wife of 30 years had just passed away.  I don't know that we had another conversation until the week before he passed away when he called me from the hospital as he'd been in-and-out of the hospital, having some strange/ongoing issues with his leg.  I'm glad we had that final conversation as some form of closure - he was a very complicated man and my relationship with him my entire life was a roller coaster of closeness and abandonment.

I honestly haven't thought much about him in the last 4 years ... I'm not even sure I remember the date of his actual death - it was the Wednesday 10 days before Father's Day, that much I remember.  So yeah, for those of you that have/had a lifetime of closeness with one or both parents, cherish that.  I'm not sure which is more common - situations like me/Kade, or those of Tom/Tim/Bill.

Man....this is heartbreaking as well. Knowing what I know of you Chad I'm sure that you made every effort to keep the relationship.....being a father I just can't imagine giving up or turning my back on my sons.

:hug:

jingle.boy

Quote from: Grappler on May 27, 2024, 07:54:09 AM
I have a similar relationship with my brother.  We just grew apart.  I finished college in 2002, and he was still downstate at school.  I went on to work, go out with friends 2-3 nights a week and live my life, never really checking in on him.  He has held that against me for 22 years.

My brother has a big ego - he finished college and rather than move back home to the Chicago suburbs, he stayed downstate in rural Illinois, where he got a job and could be "the big guy from Chicago" in a smaller town.  He has always held it against me, that I never stayed in touch with him, but forgets that telephones and relationships work two ways.  I never heard from him, and still don't, even though we now live 20 minutes apart.  He never RSVP's for family parties and I have to badger him and say "hey, are you coming?  We have to figure out how much food to buy."  He still acts as if the world revolves around him at his leisure and he can just wake up and decide if he wants to do something vs. planning ahead.

He never really checks in with me, or even my parents.  When my daughter was born and he became an uncle, he waited for four or five days before reaching out to me and congratulating me.  He never cared to ask about her as a baby, and still now as a 9 year old.  My wife held it against him so much that she refused to let me ask him to be godfather to our second child. 

Even recently, my dad coordinated my mom's kidney surgery 2 weeks ago.  He got it all sent, sent off a text with the details.  My brother responds and says "well, it looks like you have it all set" and my response was "thanks, I'LL BE THERE."  My brother didn't show up at the hospital, even though it was possible that my mom had some adverse reaction to anesthesia or her vitals could have crashed during surgery. 

My dad knows he and I don't really get along, but we are cordial.  I think it bothers him, but there's not much we can do - I always tell my wife that talking to him about it is futile, since my brother will never change, so why bother dredging all of this up. 

Things with jingle.brother are somewhat similar.  He's 4 years my elder, and when my parents split up (I 14; he 18), he took it upon himself to be fatherly to me.  Fortunately, after about 10 months of that, he was off to University, so I got a respite from him parenting/controlling me, but it never really ever did cease.  He always fancied him self smarter/wiser/better/etc... than me.  The beginning of the end was during my wedding (long story), and as I said earlier, rather than admitting he did wrong, he and my sister-in-law doubled down that they were right, and we (mrs.jingle and I) were wrong to even be upset.  It was 15 years of me trying periodically to reach out - hell, mrs.jingle even tried to connect our kids with their kids on a few occasions.  We were cordial for a while at family gatherings, but after drifting further apart for years, it all blew up when he called me after I'd be let go from my job in early 2017 (which, for those that know, was one of the best things to ever happen to me).  He called to console me and give me a pep talk because he'd gone thru this and knew what it was like and wanted to impart some wisdom on/for me.  THIS was the reason he called me after barely talking for 10 years?  Not after we'd lost two of our household pets the year before?  Not when he knew mrs.jingle's dad was in a head on collision that instantly killed her uncle and left her dad in ICU for weeks.  No, he calls to deliver some of his professional wisdom on me.  The conversation started going sideways after that, and then he started attacking the behaviours and character of the jingle.kids out of the blue.  Well, that was the end of that.  After that conversation, the only time we've spoken in in the weeks around the events of my father's death, and I haven't talked to him in almost 4 years.

Unfortunately, you can't choose your blood/relatives.  I know a lot of people have the mentality the family is always there for each other, you don't turn your back on family etc ... but that's not the case for my family unfortunately.  And I don't feel bound to look past people's shitty behaviour and treatment of me/my wife/my kids just because we're related. 

I've had a pretty good relationship with my mother for all but about 2 years when our kids were babies, but my father and brother have been a different story during my adult life.

@ Gary... yeah, I'd tried and always kept up my end of the bargain of reaching out and trying to maintain/rebuild the relationship with my father each time he withdrew.  But he seemed to have other priorities, and routinely fell short of doing what he said he was going to do, or even reaching out to us.  When relationships got too hard/rocky for him, he'd make sure there was distance.  In the end, I finally set my boundary - realizing that it wasn't my job to make him want to be a good father.  And I made my peace with that.  I know he did the best he could given how he was parented, but it was still pretty short of expectations.
Quote from: TAC on July 31, 2021, 06:55:07 PMIf I can do it, it's idiot proof.
Quote from: Stadler on January 03, 2024, 09:00:00 AMThat's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
Quote from: hefdaddy42 on November 04, 2021, 05:14:36 AMI fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".

wolfking

Quote from: gmillerdrake on May 27, 2024, 03:20:51 PM
It breaks my heart to hear/read something like this. I just can't imagine it. I'm blessed to have a father who was always around and present and interested in our lives....was a good role model.....and I'm trying to be that type of father to my sons. I don't know what I'd do if my dad were that distant.....I wish I had something prophetic to say to you to help.

Thanks Gary.  There's nothing to say, so don't sweat it. 

That was the one thing I think I always really wanted, a mentor, an idol and a role model, like all my friends had when I was growing up and even during my working years.  I've stayed close to my parents, but being around doesn't mean being 'close' to them.  I think I just held out hope my entire life that something more would blossom with our relationship but the last 3 months showed what I've been trying to pretend wasn't reality.  Luckily, I'm at a point know where mentally I can handle it.

wolfking

Quote from: jingle.boy on May 27, 2024, 03:34:23 PM
Things with jingle.brother are somewhat similar.  He's 4 years my elder, and when my parents split up (I 14; he 18), he took it upon himself to be fatherly to me.  Fortunately, after about 10 months of that, he was off to University, so I got a respite from him parenting/controlling me, but it never really ever did cease.  He always fancied him self smarter/wiser/better/etc... than me.  The beginning of the end was during my wedding (long story), and as I said earlier, rather than admitting he did wrong, he and my sister-in-law doubled down that they were right, and we (mrs.jingle and I) were wrong to even be upset.  It was 15 years of me trying periodically to reach out - hell, mrs.jingle even tried to connect our kids with their kids on a few occasions.  We were cordial for a while at family gatherings, but after drifting further apart for years, it all blew up when he called me after I'd be let go from my job in early 2017 (which, for those that know, was one of the best things to ever happen to me).  He called to console me and give me a pep talk because he'd gone thru this and knew what it was like and wanted to impart some wisdom on/for me.  THIS was the reason he called me after barely talking for 10 years?  Not after we'd lost two of our household pets the year before?  Not when he knew mrs.jingle's dad was in a head on collision that instantly killed her uncle and left her dad in ICU for weeks.  No, he calls to deliver some of his professional wisdom on me.  The conversation started going sideways after that, and then he started attacking the behaviours and character of the jingle.kids out of the blue.  Well, that was the end of that.  After that conversation, the only time we've spoken in in the weeks around the events of my father's death, and I haven't talked to him in almost 4 years.

Unfortunately, you can't choose your blood/relatives.  I know a lot of people have the mentality the family is always there for each other, you don't turn your back on family etc ... but that's not the case for my family unfortunately.  And I don't feel bound to look past people's shitty behaviour and treatment of me/my wife/my kids just because we're related. 

I've had a pretty good relationship with my mother for all but about 2 years when our kids were babies, but my father and brother have been a different story during my adult life.

@ Gary... yeah, I'd tried and always kept up my end of the bargain of reaching out and trying to maintain/rebuild the relationship with my father each time he withdrew.  But he seemed to have other priorities, and routinely fell short of doing what he said he was going to do, or even reaching out to us.  When relationships got too hard/rocky for him, he'd make sure there was distance.  In the end, I finally set my boundary - realizing that it wasn't my job to make him want to be a good father.  And I made my peace with that.  I know he did the best he could given how he was parented, but it was still pretty short of expectations.

Exactly!

Funnily enough, me and my brother are similar too.  We had an okay relationship but he hooked up with a woman who ruined his life and ended up having 2 children that he is sole carer for now but no job.  Anyway, this woman caused so much shit back in the day and it was clear what we all thought of her.  He was so scared of her and weak we had a falling out as something massive went down that my Mother and I couldn't excuse her for and she wanted to come to work as one of the kids were getting swimming lessons.  I told him and so did my mother to please not bring her down, especially being my place of work.  I always wanted to keep everything separate and hated if any relatives turned up at work.  Anyway she turned up cause he was too gutless and we went at it.  Since then things have never really been the same.  We really don't communicate, we basically have contact through my Mother.  God help us when she goes.  He doesn't even come around at XMas anymore.

My sister and I are okay but we don't talk much.  We text now and then to check in, but she has her own family with two kids. She's a hairdresser so I see her mostly when I get a cut.
That contact is probably the main reason I haven't gone the full shave to be brutally honest, sad.  Again, there were issues with her husband and the rest of our family.  He's very controlling and hates her seeing us or even talking to Mum.  I've never really had a problem with him personally but he just has always had a chip on his shoulder with my brother and I.  When things weren't too bad back in the day around 16-17 years ago, my sister was in hospital having birth to their first child.  Me, my brother and Mum turned up to see her.  He gave us the filthiest look and walked out when we got there.  I'll never forget that.  She makes excuses for him all the time but I sense once the two kids are grown up, things might change.  She does her best to appease him and stay in contact with us.  I've always been pleasant to him so to this day I'm not sure why he seems to have resentment towards me and the rest of us for that matter.

Yeah, my family is pretty fucked up.  Saying that, I'm not fucking perfect either.  Like Chad said, I too can't move past inexcusable behaviour, so I'll hold a grudge like the next person.  The way things are though, I'm going to have to make a Facebook account really just to keep in contact with my siblings I think.  My sister and brother chat through there I think the most but I just hate it but might be something I need to do at some point.  It's a me issue too.  But when I look back on everything over the last 3 months, it explains a lot.  More than any therapy can possibly explain.

jingle.boy

I don't see myself as holding a grudge, but rather setting boundaries that I won't concede anymore. I gave every effort and every opportunity for my brother and father to be an active participant in a relationship with me/my family. They repeatedly showed me the ways they didn't want to be a part of it - unless it was under their terms and conditions. I respect myself and my family too much to be steamrolled by them - or anyone for that matter.

So, I don't hold a grudge, I just move on when I know behaviours aren't going to change.
Quote from: TAC on July 31, 2021, 06:55:07 PMIf I can do it, it's idiot proof.
Quote from: Stadler on January 03, 2024, 09:00:00 AMThat's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
Quote from: hefdaddy42 on November 04, 2021, 05:14:36 AMI fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".

wolfking

Quote from: jingle.boy on May 27, 2024, 06:35:35 PM
I don't see myself as holding a grudge, but rather setting boundaries that I won't concede anymore. I gave every effort and every opportunity for my brother and father to be an active participant in a relationship with me/my family. They repeatedly showed me the ways they didn't want to be a part of it - unless it was under their terms and conditions. I respect myself and my family too much to be steamrolled by them - or anyone for that matter.

So, I don't hold a grudge, I just move on when I know behaviours aren't going to change.

Just shows your character and type of man you are for your family.  Maybe grudge is the wrong word.  That's probably a negatively geared word I put on myself, but no, holding values and standing by them no matter who they are is more on the money, you're right.

That's the sad realisation though, when you can see behaviours simply aren't going to change.

King Postwhore

I love Chad like a brother. Chad, you are the best.
"I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down'." - Bon Newhart.

jingle.boy

Quote from: King Postwhore on May 27, 2024, 06:50:02 PM
I love Chad like a brother. Chad, you are the best.

Back at ya, Broseph.
Quote from: TAC on July 31, 2021, 06:55:07 PMIf I can do it, it's idiot proof.
Quote from: Stadler on January 03, 2024, 09:00:00 AMThat's a word salad - and take it from me, I know word salad
Quote from: hefdaddy42 on November 04, 2021, 05:14:36 AMI fear for the day when something happens on the right that is SO nuts that even Stadler says "That's crazy".

Glasser

Quote from: King Postwhore on May 27, 2024, 06:50:02 PM
I love Chad like a brother. Chad, you are the best.

Loving all the love!  :)

TAC

Quote from: wkiml on June 08, 2012, 09:06:35 AMwould have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
Quote from: Buddyhunter1 on April 22, 2023, 05:54:45 PMTAC got a higher score than me in the electronic round? Honestly, can I just drop out now? :lol