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General => General Discussion => Topic started by: KevShmev on November 05, 2022, 06:40:55 AM
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The writing is on the wall. It has been a cesspool for as long as I can remember, and with Elon Musk's recent actions, it is just a matter of time before it goes the way of myspace, as Musk seems determined to blow a lot of his own money just to watch it burn.
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as Musk seems determined to blow a lot of his own money just to watch it burn.
Any chance that that was his intention?
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It feels like a lot of these big giants have been declining for a long time now. Twitter has gotten worse and worse and is the cesspool of humanity where it brings out the worst in everyone and its only function these days seem to be people pushing the mob mentality to its limits. Facebook is another one that has basically become 70% ads and whenever I scroll through the feed, every 2 or 3 posts there's either advertisement or "recommended for you".
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While the rest of Twitter is a cesspool, it's seriously the best place to follow the Japanese metal scene, so hopefully he doesn't fuck it utoo much. Not holding my breath though. p
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You make Twitter what you want. I have no issues with it since I don't engage in the BS 99% of the time.
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You make Twitter what you want. I have no issues with it since I don't engage in the BS 99% of the time.
Yep. Twitter is fine if you properly curate it with blocks, mutes, unfollows, etc. But I suppose it also depends what you use it for and who you engage with. My follow list is very specific to the topics I’m interested in.
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Any chance that that was his intention?
Given how much Tesla stock he had to leverage to get the loans to pay for it, doubtful. He's just a moron.
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Any chance that that was his intention?
Given how much Tesla stock he had to leverage to get the loans to pay for it, doubtful. He's just a moron.
Yeah... He definitely led with his ego, and it's gonna cost him for sure.
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Any chance that that was his intention?
Given how much Tesla stock he had to leverage to get the loans to pay for it, doubtful. He's just a moron.
Musk might be a lot of things, but a moron is not one of them. Morons do not have the intelligence to make the billions he has.
You make Twitter what you want. I have no issues with it since I don't engage in the BS 99% of the time.
Same here. I am generally only on there for music and, to a lesser degree now, sports, and if anyone I follow starts talking too much about politics or social issues, I unfollow them, but going down the rabbit hole on occasion with whatever nonsense is trending just shows you how awful people are on that platform. It was basically a free-for-all to say pretty much anything inflammatory.
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Even the smartest people make dumb decisions. Considering how this all went down and how much he tried to get out of it, and how much we're finding out he overpaid for it, I'd say it's pretty safe to call this a dumb move on his part. And I bet if you got him honest enough, he'd say he wished he never did it.
Either doesn't impact me. I technically have a Twitter account which I think I made just to be able to read people's posts. I even stopped that. Never posted anything and I only go there when a link leads there for something else.
I think it all depends on how you use Twitter. If you use it to follow celebs, it's probably pretty benign. If you follow it to reach a community and spread messages, it's a hell hole. If you use it to follow Japanese metal bands, then you won life. If you use it to see how people are talking about things, then you're seeing the worst of humanity.
Either way, it's nothing more than what the people using it make it. If twitter sucks, it's cause the people who use it suck.
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Musk might be a lot of things, but a moron is not one of them. Morons do not have the intelligence to make the billions he has.
Exploiting other people's labour doesn't take much intelligence. ;)
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Reading comments from either band pages or sport team pages are the worst.
Also, I'm reading that Musk is implementing a policy where if people want to keep their verified check mark, they got to pay like $10 a month? Yeah, no one is going to buy that and if it leads to more fake accounts bots on the site, well, what does that say about your policy?
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Reading comments from either band pages or sport team pages are the worst.
Also, I'm reading that Musk is implementing a policy where if people want to keep their verified check mark, they got to pay like $10 a month? Yeah, no one is going to buy that and if it leads to more fake accounts bots on the site, well, what does that say about your policy?
This is the weird thing to me. It appears that in lieu of whatever the current verification process is, anyone who wants to be verified can just sign up for Twitter Blue for $8 a month. So no one’s identity will actually be verified anymore, and some people who were verified will likely just not pay for it. Elon claims it will fight bots by making it more expensive to be impersonate people, but it will just make it easier to impersonate people (especially if people stop paying for verification).
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Is the 8 dollars in lieu of verification process in addition to it? I can't see it being in lieu being a good idea at all. Simply adding 8 dollars to the current process makes sense if you need income.
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Musk might be a lot of things, but a moron is not one of them. Morons do not have the intelligence to make the billions he has.
Exploiting other people's labour doesn't take much intelligence. ;)
He doesn't pay them? They didn't apply for the job?
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Is the 8 dollars in lieu of verification process in addition to it? I can't see it being in lieu being a good idea at all. Simply adding 8 dollars to the current process makes sense if you need income.
From what I’m seeing, you get verified just by signing up/paying. What info about yourself you have to provide is unclear (not sure what the current verification process is either), but the concern is that anyone can basically pay and be verified without any sort of process to prove who you are.
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Musk might be a lot of things, but a moron is not one of them. Morons do not have the intelligence to make the billions he has.
Exploiting other people's labour doesn't take much intelligence. ;)
He doesn't pay them? They didn't apply for the job?
You're missing the point. Apparently, it is not difficult for any moron to take advantage of the laborers and make billions. I wish I would have known this in my younger years.
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What point? XJ said he exploited workers. He didn't hold them against their will.
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What point? XJ said he exploited workers. He didn't hold them against their will.
Pretty sure you and I are on the same page here. :tup :tup
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Musk might be a lot of things, but a moron is not one of them. Morons do not have the intelligence to make the billions he has.
Exploiting other people's labour doesn't take much intelligence. ;)
He doesn't pay them? They didn't apply for the job?
You're missing the point. Apparently, it is not difficult for any moron to take advantage of the laborers and make billions. I wish I would have known this in my younger years.
Not ANY moron, just the rich ones.
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https://techcrunch.com/2022/11/05/twitter-begins-rolling-out-7-99-twitter-blue-plan-with-verification-fewer-ads
So apparently the $8 cost for verified user status is what has been settled on. Will be interesting to see how they verify people's identity when any random schmoe can now sign up for it. I imagine it must be some kind of automated process given Elon's been firing a lot of the staff...
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While it's true you can mute/block/ignore your way through Twitter to have a better experience, that doesn't change the fact the place itself has turned into something bad though. That's like if your kid is being bullied at school and you say "Just close your eyes and put your fingers in your ears and the bad things will go away" :P It's unfortunate that it brings out the worst in many people. I would be all for a Twitter where you're stuck with your real name so there's some consequences to what you write, but I know that doesn't stop people from being jackasses on Facebook so it probably wouldn't fix much unfortunately. Maybe better moderation would help?
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While it's true you can mute/block/ignore your way through Twitter to have a better experience, that doesn't change the fact the place itself has turned into something bad though. That's like if your kid is being bullied at school and you say "Just close your eyes and put your fingers in your ears and the bad things will go away" :P It's unfortunate that it brings out the worst in many people. I would be all for a Twitter where you're stuck with your real name so there's some consequences to what you write, but I know that doesn't stop people from being jackasses on Facebook so it probably wouldn't fix much unfortunately. Maybe better moderation would help?
I don't think it would because the ones in charge love see their agendas pushed, even if presented in a trolling manner.
I lost track at how many stupid things I have seen trending over the years where when you click on the subject, barely anyone is talking about, so it shouldn't be trending, but they obviously have measures in place (that are far above my head) to push certain issues, narratives, etc. As terrible as the news media is at stirring up trouble with social justice matters for example, social media is now just as bad thanks to stuff like this, and arguably far more dangerous now since the average person likely spends a lot more time now on social media than they do watching and/or reading the news media. And I suspect it will be just as bad with Musk in charge, just with a different agenda in place.
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So it looks like what I thought would happen would happen. Tons of people created fake celeb accounts, got their blue check and are now posting spam as those celebs. Including Elon Musk. I suspect a major change to their system soon enough.
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Well, gee. You would think if they implemented a system like this that requires paying money that they would get this cleaned up before it goes out or not be greedy and not implement it at all. Don't know why big shots don't think like that.
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Who would have thought forcing programmers to rush out a feature under threat of firing would cause that feature to be underbaked on launch.
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-11-06/twitter-now-asks-some-fired-workers-to-please-come-back
(https://i.imgur.com/WcphO6k.png)
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I hope they realize how much leverage they have now.
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I hope they realize how much leverage they have now.
Part of me hopes they tell Elon go sod off.
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Well...those celebs who refused to pony up $8 have lost their blue check. I'm looking at Stephen King's feed with his 22.3 million followers without a blue check and realizing that there is very likely a new Stephen King account with a blue check that the gullible among us (read 85% of Twitter users) will assume is him.
Some of you will get this reference. I had a good laugh
(https://i.imgur.com/BQj2u54.jpg)
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Shocker. Looks like Elon will be banning people who use a fake name with a blue check (unless they announce that it's a fake name).
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Well...those celebs who refused to pony up $8 have lost their blue check. I'm looking at Stephen King's feed with his 22.3 million followers without a blue check and realizing that there is very likely a new Stephen King account with a blue check that the gullible among us (read 85% of Twitter users) will assume is him.
Some of you will get this reference. I had a good laugh
(https://i.imgur.com/BQj2u54.jpg)
The hilarious thing is that people like Tim Pool are not going to pay his $8 either.
I have a Twitter, but I hardly post on it. So if Twitter does collapse, I won't be all emotional over it.
It's not like it was Myspace, now that was a great site that should've stayed. It was great in how it was your own personal page, basically your own space. I've seen some pages that were really well designed.
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In somewhat unrelated news, tumblr is about to get a lot more popular.
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In somewhat unrelated news, tumblr is about to get a lot more popular.
:rollin
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Shocker. Looks like Elon will be banning people who use a fake name with a blue check (unless they announce that it's a fake name).
looks like he's already had several people who were imitating him banned even when their bio stated that they were parody accounts
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Someone posed as Tobey Maguire (with the verified badge) and announced Spiderman 4.
I'm starting to think this might turn out to be a bad idea ::)
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In somewhat unrelated news, tumblr is about to get a lot more popular.
I mean, they just unbanned nudes, so I can see a certain segment returning.
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I just hope there will be less worshipping of Musk after this. The man obviously has done some great business moves and knows his stuff on certain subjects, not going to deny that, but he has also started so many dumb projects that went absolutely nowhere and never will. You don't need to be a genius to see why many of his decisions in regards to twitter were not the brightest.
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I just hope there will be less worshipping of Musk after this. The man obviously has done some great business moves and knows his stuff on certain subjects, not going to deny that, but he has also started so many dumb projects that went absolutely nowhere and never will. You don't need to be a genius to see why many of his decisions in regards to twitter were not the brightest.
Something that I was pointing out in a political topic as well.
Famous people, and people in power, are human too, and they're subjected too to making mistakes.
There's no need to explain with conspiracy theories, wonders about what the masterplan might be, long rationalizations etc etc something that can be explained with good old human stupidity. Selective stupidity of course, even a smart man or a cunning politician can, and will, royally screw up and do something stupid, without being him/herself stupid.
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Everytime I see Elon in the news I'm always reminded by this brilliant Onion article: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.theonion.com/please-like-me-1848674003/amp
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Everytime I see Elon in the news I'm always reminded by this brilliant Onion article: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.theonion.com/please-like-me-1848674003/amp
He sent a stonk to the moon?
'Honestly, I don’t get why anyone wouldn’t like me. I do cool stuff. I make cars. People like cars, don’t they? I make stonks go to the moon. Isn’t that cool? Isn’t making stonks go to the moon something people like? Seriously, c’mon.'
TAC will appreciate this reference https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwfFFM-d6wk :lol
And going back to the 'I WANT MY EIGHT DOLLARS!' Damn inflation :D
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I get the reference but I can’t say I appreciate it. :lol
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There's no need to explain with conspiracy theories, wonders about what the masterplan might be, long rationalizations etc etc something that can be explained with good old human stupidity. Selective stupidity of course, even a smart man or a cunning politician can, and will, royally screw up and do something stupid, without being him/herself stupid.
Hanlon's Razor.
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What a doofus
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While it's true you can mute/block/ignore your way through Twitter to have a better experience, that doesn't change the fact the place itself has turned into something bad though. That's like if your kid is being bullied at school and you say "Just close your eyes and put your fingers in your ears and the bad things will go away" :P It's unfortunate that it brings out the worst in many people. I would be all for a Twitter where you're stuck with your real name so there's some consequences to what you write, but I know that doesn't stop people from being jackasses on Facebook so it probably wouldn't fix much unfortunately. Maybe better moderation would help?
I don't think it would because the ones in charge love see their agendas pushed, even if presented in a trolling manner.
I lost track at how many stupid things I have seen trending over the years where when you click on the subject, barely anyone is talking about, so it shouldn't be trending, but they obviously have measures in place (that are far above my head) to push certain issues, narratives, etc. As terrible as the news media is at stirring up trouble with social justice matters for example, social media is now just as bad thanks to stuff like this, and arguably far more dangerous now since the average person likely spends a lot more time now on social media than they do watching and/or reading the news media. And I suspect it will be just as bad with Musk in charge, just with a different agenda in place.
60 Minutes did a story last night that touched on some of this; I didn't get to watch all of it, because my trivia game started, but it's what I've been saying all along. There ISN'T an upside to Twitter, et al, because the motivations don't match. Twitter isn't trying to spread information, it's not trying to improve democracy, it's not trying to do ANY of these so-called upsides. They are all just happy accidents if and when they happen at all. Twitter's motivation, and the behaviors it seeks to promote, are about reinforcing the reward system it has built in, with the sole benefit of revenue. They did a study: they picked a certain number of news events, and they tracked the number of times the ACTUAL NEWS was forwarded or retweeted, and they tracked the number of times selected opinions ABOUT the news (reactions) were forwarded or retweeted. The latter was forward or retweeted orders of magnitude more, and the rewards - the "likes" - were orders of magnitude higher as well.
https://www.cbsnews.com/60-minutes/full-episodes/
Spoiler alert: they use the terms "in-groups" and "out-groups". It was like watching porn for me!
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I never had to block before the idiot bought it. I literally had no idea how to. I have probably blocked hundreds of accounts already. One of the first thing I was greeted with in my feed after the purchase was a dude cliff diving nude and spewing what appeared to be diarrhea as he flew through the air. I took that as a sign.
I'm seriously thinking of bailing. I use it solely to get info from various music people. Have never tweeted ever. Facebook is a no-go. I wish there was something built solely for musicians to use solely to connect with their audience. You know, only musical artists could create content and then we just follow them. Kind of like how Patreon works but free and strictly for news to the fans.
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Bailed on Facebook a couple months ago. Never signed up for Twitter.
All of it is inherently bad for humanity as is our addiction to accessing all of it via our collective addiction to mobile phones.
Just found this.
https://www.cnn.com/2022/11/07/tech/kathy-griffin-twitter/index.html
Haha. Shitstorm incoming.
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Social Media is telling in that it reveals human behavior.
Humans are not, by nature, good. It's why we have doctrines and societies that instill order for our natural chaotic minds.
It's why nice things can be overtaken, manipulated, and utilized for detriment.
But also, humans hide behind a screen and will not behave this way in reality. And if we were to go into full on Virtual Reality, I'd like to see how that pans out. Especially now that humans can be whomever and hide behind an avatar in this virtual world. I actually see this being way, way, worse if it were to be implemented by the masses.
Unless, we humans understand this behavior, it'll continue to be the shit storm brewing into a bigger storm.
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I had a Twitter account once for about 2 weeks then deleted it. Never understood what the big deal is about Twitter.
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I joined Twitter 11 years ago when I was back working as a journalist. It was extremely valuable to get leads for stories and promote my work. Once I left journalism again (for the final time), it sat idle for a bit. But several years back now, when I picked up the NBA Season Pass to watch my Timberwolves, I found it great on game days to go back and forth with the TV broadcast team, something I do to this day.
As much as that is positive, however, the negativity on Twitter is undeniable. It IS a cesspool, despite the platform's uses. And the whole checkmark thing and now paying for it...that's a big mistake. Not sure what Elon Musk is trying to achieve, but paying for validation is not it.
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I enjoy twitter and still do. I think people make too big of noise about Elon instead of just ignoring him. Of course he could ruin the platform, but I find it unlikely. I just think people are wayyyyy too invested in this one guy and he seems to get off on that. Best to just ignore.
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I enjoy twitter and still do. I think people make too big of noise about Elon instead of just ignoring him. Of course he could ruin the platform, but I find it unlikely. I just think people are wayyyyy too invested in this one guy and he seems to get off on that. Best to just ignore.
"Don't make us poke your eyes out, Dad." (https://youtu.be/SlKao_Pox5A)
People won't do that, and Trump is the prime example how people can not seem to just ignore. Especially those celebrities that are just as bad at not ignoring, plus they also instigate and participate in this type of behavior. Just look at Kathy Griffin, and others joining in on the behavior of impersonating those blue checkmarks.
This is a prime example of why I do not idolize celebrities, basically people on TV. They're human, they have emotions, and are also prone to the same stupid mistakes, or happy little accidents, like everyone else.
If we want true equality, this means that every human must be held accountable and treated the same. Now we are seeing these celebrities being treated the same and actually being banned for violating the rule of impersonation. Which is a big issue because impersonation is identity fraud. You are claiming to be someone you are not, and if we are to fight this supposed "Online Bullying" that is affecting the young adolescent teens, the "adults" shouldn't be behaving like those young adolescent teens.
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I never had to block before the idiot bought it. I literally had no idea how to. I have probably blocked hundreds of accounts already. One of the first thing I was greeted with in my feed after the purchase was a dude cliff diving nude and spewing what appeared to be diarrhea as he flew through the air. I took that as a sign.
Link? :) :) :)
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Social Media is telling in that it reveals human behavior.
Humans are not, by nature, good. It's why we have doctrines and societies that instill order for our natural chaotic minds.
It's why nice things can be overtaken, manipulated, and utilized for detriment.
But also, humans hide behind a screen and will not behave this way in reality. And if we were to go into full on Virtual Reality, I'd like to see how that pans out. Especially now that humans can be whomever and hide behind an avatar in this virtual world. I actually see this being way, way, worse if it were to be implemented by the masses.
Unless, we humans understand this behavior, it'll continue to be the shit storm brewing into a bigger storm.
I don't think that's true any longer. I don't think social media DOES reveal human behavior generally. I think it games the system to a SPECIFIC human behavior. We aren't bad by nature, but we all have a sort of light and dark. I know I've not kicked Twitter, but I'm also not feeding my ego with likes and shares. My insecurities are, lucky enough for me, sated in other ways. But there are too many for whom that's not the case. I have someone in my family who ought not be within 500 yards of social media but I can't do anything about it. I can't - and won't - force her to get offline. Maybe if her hurtful addiction was heroin, it would be different, but social media is still touted as the next big thing and so how to point at the downside?
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Spoiler alert: they use the terms "in-groups" and "out-groups". It was like watching porn for me!
Lots of ins and outs in the porn I watch too. Sometimes groups also.
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Social Media is telling in that it reveals human behavior.
Humans are not, by nature, good. It's why we have doctrines and societies that instill order for our natural chaotic minds.
It's why nice things can be overtaken, manipulated, and utilized for detriment.
But also, humans hide behind a screen and will not behave this way in reality. And if we were to go into full on Virtual Reality, I'd like to see how that pans out. Especially now that humans can be whomever and hide behind an avatar in this virtual world. I actually see this being way, way, worse if it were to be implemented by the masses.
Unless, we humans understand this behavior, it'll continue to be the shit storm brewing into a bigger storm.
I don't think that's true any longer. I don't think social media DOES reveal human behavior generally. I think it games the system to a SPECIFIC human behavior. We aren't bad by nature, but we all have a sort of light and dark. I know I've not kicked Twitter, but I'm also not feeding my ego with likes and shares. My insecurities are, lucky enough for me, sated in other ways. But there are too many for whom that's not the case. I have someone in my family who ought not be within 500 yards of social media but I can't do anything about it. I can't - and won't - force her to get offline. Maybe if her hurtful addiction was heroin, it would be different, but social media is still touted as the next big thing and so how to point at the downside?
It highlights the dark side.
I don't utilize twitter because of the character limit. I think that's dumb and many things can not be said with only 200 characters. This is why I use mainly Facebook because there is no character limit.
I personally think Myspace was the best social media platform, in the sense of having an online profile that is the place where you could spew all the non-sense thoughts you are having.
I also do believe that the problems of social media lie in the aspects related to addictions. Such as how humans get a dopamine hit when their feelings, thoughts, and ideas are accepted by others. So to get that high, humans will do anything to garner that acceptance, this is highlighted by Tik-Tok.
A great experiment would be to see how people utilize social media if there are no such things as likes or comments, you can still be able to share stuff onto your page. To comment on these videos or posts, you would have to message the person directly, create a small private group chat, or join a public group on the social media site where you join a yahoo-chat like live discussion on the topics people want to chat about related to the group.
If anything my main social media addicitons are Facebook and DTF.
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I still think Facebook's original idea (well, not original-original, I've heard it was a bit creepy) would have worked just fine. Stay in touch with friends and long-lost acquaintances. I mean, even with the best of intentions, it's hard to keep in touch with everyone, and it's dispersive to write a mail to every ex coworker, ex school buddy, friend that moved away, couple that got kids and are busy etc.... on Facebook you have them all there, you add only people you know and like (hence the term "friends" and not "contacts" or "followers" - take the hint, it's for friends, that's why you're meant to use your own name) and see what they're up to and share whatever you feel like sharing.
I never got the appeal of Twitter. Never used it. I have an account, it's just a throwaway one that I use for following people that....... well, wouldn't be able to post the same stuff on Instagram, let's leave it at that ;D
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I never got the appeal of Twitter. Never used it. I have an account, it's just a throwaway one that I use for following people that....... well, wouldn't be able to post the same stuff on Instagram, let's leave it at that ;D
Funny enough, I started using twitter because everyone I know IRL wasn't using it. For me, it was a clean social media platform where I can share what I want and follow what I want without the drama of people I know filling up my timeline and/or judging me like Facebook. Since then I've made some IRL friends from twitter from being my genuine self (and a bunch more people I'd love to meet IRL).
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Spoiler alert: they use the terms "in-groups" and "out-groups". It was like watching porn for me!
Lots of ins and outs in the porn I watch too. Sometimes groups also.
:tup
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:lol
Nice.
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I still think Facebook's original idea (well, not original-original, I've heard it was a bit creepy) would have worked just fine. Stay in touch with friends and long-lost acquaintances. I mean, even with the best of intentions, it's hard to keep in touch with everyone, and it's dispersive to write a mail to every ex coworker, ex school buddy, friend that moved away, couple that got kids and are busy etc.... on Facebook you have them all there, you add only people you know and like (hence the term "friends" and not "contacts" or "followers" - take the hint, it's for friends, that's why you're meant to use your own name) and see what they're up to and share whatever you feel like sharing.
Yeah, agreed. Problem is that META care more about advertisers and using the platform to do social engineering experiments on their user base.
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Now I'm seeing people post that they cannot change their user names at all.
Oh the irony. Mr. "free the bird" and "free speech" can't take it when people openly mock him so he's clamping down on users (even those with the blue checks) ability to manage their own accounts without restriction.
And yesterday he posted that you could not identify your account with another user's name - he even had the well-known account 'God' frozen for a bit unless you claimed you were a parody account. So this comedian changed his name to Elon Musk (parody) and with every post put (parody) in it and today he still had his account eliminated.
Part of me is tempted to bail but the other part is like :corn
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Now I'm seeing people post that they cannot change their user names at all.
Oh the irony. Mr. "free the bird" and "free speech" can't take it when people openly mock him so he's clamping down on users (even those with the blue checks) ability to manage their own accounts without restriction.
And yesterday he posted that you could not identify your account with another user's name - he even had the well-known account 'God' frozen for a bit unless you claimed you were a parody account. So this comedian changed his name to Elon Musk (parody) and with every post put (parody) in it and today he still had his account eliminated.
Part of me is tempted to bail but the other part is like :corn
And this would be considered great marketing, because even though people could easily just leave and ignore it. People choose to continue to stay and watch the palace burn.
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I would say that none of my twitter experience has changed since Musk took over. Unless it just goes under altogether I don’t expect it to, but I guess we’ll see.
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I still think Facebook's original idea (well, not original-original, I've heard it was a bit creepy) would have worked just fine. Stay in touch with friends and long-lost acquaintances. I mean, even with the best of intentions, it's hard to keep in touch with everyone, and it's dispersive to write a mail to every ex coworker, ex school buddy, friend that moved away, couple that got kids and are busy etc.... on Facebook you have them all there, you add only people you know and like (hence the term "friends" and not "contacts" or "followers" - take the hint, it's for friends, that's why you're meant to use your own name) and see what they're up to and share whatever you feel like sharing.
I never got the appeal of Twitter. Never used it. I have an account, it's just a throwaway one that I use for following people that....... well, wouldn't be able to post the same stuff on Instagram, let's leave it at that ;D
I got into facebook in college in 2006 and it was fantastic then. It really was fun to connect with friends, make friends through other friends, organize parties and share pictures with friends. I feel like various forms of online communication go through an early golden era before going to shit.
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The joy of early social media is that it doesn't need to concern itself with being profitable.
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People choose to continue to stay and watch the palace burn.
Yup, I don't now if it is true, but Elon musked said twitter activity yesterday was at a high.
I would say that none of my twitter experience has changed since Musk took over. Unless it just goes under altogether I don’t expect it to, but I guess we’ll see.
The only difference I see are more tweets bitching about him which makes my experience slightly worse. I started clicking the "see fewer tweets like this" option last night on accounts that won't stop talking about it, but otherwise, yeah my overall experience is the same and I don't expect much difference in the near future. Who knows in the long run if he starts making more changes. The blue check mark thing doesn't really bother me.
I still think Facebook's original idea (well, not original-original, I've heard it was a bit creepy) would have worked just fine. Stay in touch with friends and long-lost acquaintances. I mean, even with the best of intentions, it's hard to keep in touch with everyone, and it's dispersive to write a mail to every ex coworker, ex school buddy, friend that moved away, couple that got kids and are busy etc.... on Facebook you have them all there, you add only people you know and like (hence the term "friends" and not "contacts" or "followers" - take the hint, it's for friends, that's why you're meant to use your own name) and see what they're up to and share whatever you feel like sharing.
I never got the appeal of Twitter. Never used it. I have an account, it's just a throwaway one that I use for following people that....... well, wouldn't be able to post the same stuff on Instagram, let's leave it at that ;D
I got into facebook in college in 2006 and it was fantastic then. It really was fun to connect with friends, make friends through other friends, organize parties and share pictures with friends. I feel like various forms of online communication go through an early golden era before going to shit.
I also started on facebook in 2005 during my sophomore year in college. It was cool to easily see what my high school friends were up to that I wasn't close with and then connect with my current friends in college and get to see a smart part of their life outside college. I definitely didn't think much about the impact of facebook back then. It seemed harmless and a fun way to connect. I think that's the only reason why I still have it, because I have so much history with it and lots of pictures and events still on there. I'm not a fan of facebook and almost never post or comment on it anymore. I also restrict myself so people can't easily find me, see my old stuff, or share things on my timeline anymore. Funny how it's changed so much and my attitude towards it also has. Also another reason why I probably am so much more active on twitter, because I'm not active on facebook.
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Just mute "Elon" and "Musk" and you'll clean up a lot of the complaining on Twitter. But this is also nothing new. There is a main character on twitter just about every day (and you don't want to be that character). People just like to complain about something/someone.
I've never quite understood people complaining about Facebook either. That environment is entirely what you make it too. Friend the people you want to interact with, and unfriend/unfollow anyone you don't. But I will say it's worse than Twitter for me in the sense that it is exclusively family and friends there, and when they post something incendiary it is somewhat harder to ignore. I have really curtailed my follows to cut off people who post about politics a bunch over the years. It's mostly just a boring place with few posts these days. I'm only really there for a few specific music forums now.
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I still think Facebook's original idea (well, not original-original, I've heard it was a bit creepy) would have worked just fine. Stay in touch with friends and long-lost acquaintances. I mean, even with the best of intentions, it's hard to keep in touch with everyone, and it's dispersive to write a mail to every ex coworker, ex school buddy, friend that moved away, couple that got kids and are busy etc.... on Facebook you have them all there, you add only people you know and like (hence the term "friends" and not "contacts" or "followers" - take the hint, it's for friends, that's why you're meant to use your own name) and see what they're up to and share whatever you feel like sharing.
Yeah, agreed. Problem is that META care more about advertisers and using the platform to do social engineering experiments on their user base.
You expected otherwise? I don't say that to be snarky or dismissive, but I sort of don't understand why we're not more objective - not the right word, I understand - with companies like this. Why would we expect otherwise?
I think too many people are treating things like Facebook and Instachat and Snapgram like they are our metaphysical bedrooms, expecting a level of comfort, cooperation, and privacy that we should never ever be expectant about.
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The joy of early social media is that it doesn't need to concern itself with being profitable.
Well, it DID or should have, concerned itself with profitability, and if it didn't, then we were really at the nascent "dot.com" period, where 95% of companies failed, and RIGHTFULLY SO. You can't operate a company without being profitable; who pays the rent? Who pays the salaries? Companies are not charities!
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I still think Facebook's original idea (well, not original-original, I've heard it was a bit creepy) would have worked just fine. Stay in touch with friends and long-lost acquaintances. I mean, even with the best of intentions, it's hard to keep in touch with everyone, and it's dispersive to write a mail to every ex coworker, ex school buddy, friend that moved away, couple that got kids and are busy etc.... on Facebook you have them all there, you add only people you know and like (hence the term "friends" and not "contacts" or "followers" - take the hint, it's for friends, that's why you're meant to use your own name) and see what they're up to and share whatever you feel like sharing.
Yeah, agreed. Problem is that META care more about advertisers and using the platform to do social engineering experiments on their user base.
You expected otherwise? I don't say that to be snarky or dismissive, but I sort of don't understand why we're not more objective - not the right word, I understand - with companies like this. Why would we expect otherwise?
I think too many people are treating things like Facebook and Instachat and Snapgram like they are our metaphysical bedrooms, expecting a level of comfort, cooperation, and privacy that we should never ever be expectant about.
Well, I signed up for FB before I was a consenting adult. So, yes, I did expect otherwise.
I'm more seasoned now; I know that my social media profile is, basically, like a public resume. Gotta have a really vanilla presence that you use to say things like "Go 6ers!" and "I Voted!", so prospective employers, etc., can google me and see what I safe choice I am.
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The joy of early social media is that it doesn't need to concern itself with being profitable.
Well, it DID or should have, concerned itself with profitability, and if it didn't, then we were really at the nascent "dot.com" period, where 95% of companies failed, and RIGHTFULLY SO. You can't operate a company without being profitable; who pays the rent? Who pays the salaries? Companies are not charities!
The common trajectory of most SV companies in the last couple of decades is:
1. New, kinda cool idea gets a decent chunk of VC money.
2. Idea catches on and userbase grows exponentially.
3. Because of the rapid growth, company can draw in more VC money which they can use to subsidise the service. No-one worries because the service is still growing exponentially.
4. User growth stalls. We still aren't profitable with the subsidised prices/business model. The VC capital providers expect a return on investment.
5. Uh oh.
6. We now need to figure out how we can draw more money from the existing userbase.
7. User experience declines and prices rise due to the increased focus on monetisation and it infecting every part of the user experience.
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I still think Facebook's original idea (well, not original-original, I've heard it was a bit creepy) would have worked just fine. Stay in touch with friends and long-lost acquaintances. I mean, even with the best of intentions, it's hard to keep in touch with everyone, and it's dispersive to write a mail to every ex coworker, ex school buddy, friend that moved away, couple that got kids and are busy etc.... on Facebook you have them all there, you add only people you know and like (hence the term "friends" and not "contacts" or "followers" - take the hint, it's for friends, that's why you're meant to use your own name) and see what they're up to and share whatever you feel like sharing.
Yeah, agreed. Problem is that META care more about advertisers and using the platform to do social engineering experiments on their user base.
You expected otherwise? I don't say that to be snarky or dismissive, but I sort of don't understand why we're not more objective - not the right word, I understand - with companies like this. Why would we expect otherwise?
I think too many people are treating things like Facebook and Instachat and Snapgram like they are our metaphysical bedrooms, expecting a level of comfort, cooperation, and privacy that we should never ever be expectant about.
Well, I signed up for FB before I was a consenting adult. So, yes, I did expect otherwise.
I'm more seasoned now; I know that my social media profile is, basically, like a public resume. Gotta have a really vanilla presence that you use to say things like "Go 6ers!" and "I Voted!", so prospective employers, etc., can google me and see what I safe choice I am.
I mostly agree with Stadler's point about a company needing to make money, but Facebook changed quite a bit from when it first came out to when it started becoming an advertising business. I get what XJ is saying too in this case because the user experience changed when the business model changed.
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What do you mean "in this case"? I'm always the paragon of clarity. :p
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What do you mean "in this case"? I'm always the paragon of clarity. :p
...
:):):)
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I still think Facebook's original idea (well, not original-original, I've heard it was a bit creepy) would have worked just fine. Stay in touch with friends and long-lost acquaintances. I mean, even with the best of intentions, it's hard to keep in touch with everyone, and it's dispersive to write a mail to every ex coworker, ex school buddy, friend that moved away, couple that got kids and are busy etc.... on Facebook you have them all there, you add only people you know and like (hence the term "friends" and not "contacts" or "followers" - take the hint, it's for friends, that's why you're meant to use your own name) and see what they're up to and share whatever you feel like sharing.
Yeah, agreed. Problem is that META care more about advertisers and using the platform to do social engineering experiments on their user base.
You expected otherwise? I don't say that to be snarky or dismissive, but I sort of don't understand why we're not more objective - not the right word, I understand - with companies like this. Why would we expect otherwise?
I think too many people are treating things like Facebook and Instachat and Snapgram like they are our metaphysical bedrooms, expecting a level of comfort, cooperation, and privacy that we should never ever be expectant about.
Well, I signed up for FB before I was a consenting adult. So, yes, I did expect otherwise.
I'm more seasoned now; I know that my social media profile is, basically, like a public resume. Gotta have a really vanilla presence that you use to say things like "Go 6ers!" and "I Voted!", so prospective employers, etc., can google me and see what I safe choice I am.
I mostly agree with Stadler's point about a company needing to make money, but Facebook changed quite a bit from when it first came out to when it started becoming an advertising business. I get what XJ is saying too in this case because the user experience changed when the business model changed.
But read XJ's post; that you did or didn't expect something different, that FB was or was not something different doesn't make it right. That sequence that XJ posted is unfortunately all too accurate, but that's part of the problem. It's not that FB changed to something bad midstream, it's that they started at a point that was unsustainable from day 0. I suppose that's not the users fault, I understand that, but someone wishing that FB was the same today as it was when it started is like saying "I wish my kid was like they were when they were three forever!"
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People are so triggered today. No on can scroll right on by. Everyone needs to let everybody there point. I see friends who post nothing but hate from each side of politics and I just scroll on by. Seems to be a lost art.
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I still think Facebook's original idea (well, not original-original, I've heard it was a bit creepy) would have worked just fine. Stay in touch with friends and long-lost acquaintances. I mean, even with the best of intentions, it's hard to keep in touch with everyone, and it's dispersive to write a mail to every ex coworker, ex school buddy, friend that moved away, couple that got kids and are busy etc.... on Facebook you have them all there, you add only people you know and like (hence the term "friends" and not "contacts" or "followers" - take the hint, it's for friends, that's why you're meant to use your own name) and see what they're up to and share whatever you feel like sharing.
Yeah, agreed. Problem is that META care more about advertisers and using the platform to do social engineering experiments on their user base.
You expected otherwise? I don't say that to be snarky or dismissive, but I sort of don't understand why we're not more objective - not the right word, I understand - with companies like this. Why would we expect otherwise?
I think too many people are treating things like Facebook and Instachat and Snapgram like they are our metaphysical bedrooms, expecting a level of comfort, cooperation, and privacy that we should never ever be expectant about.
Well, I signed up for FB before I was a consenting adult. So, yes, I did expect otherwise.
I'm more seasoned now; I know that my social media profile is, basically, like a public resume. Gotta have a really vanilla presence that you use to say things like "Go 6ers!" and "I Voted!", so prospective employers, etc., can google me and see what I safe choice I am.
I mostly agree with Stadler's point about a company needing to make money, but Facebook changed quite a bit from when it first came out to when it started becoming an advertising business. I get what XJ is saying too in this case because the user experience changed when the business model changed.
But read XJ's post; that you did or didn't expect something different, that FB was or was not something different doesn't make it right. That sequence that XJ posted is unfortunately all too accurate, but that's part of the problem. It's not that FB changed to something bad midstream, it's that they started at a point that was unsustainable from day 0. I suppose that's not the users fault, I understand that, but someone wishing that FB was the same today as it was when it started is like saying "I wish my kid was like they were when they were three forever!"
Of course it was unsustainable. And I'm not entirely sure I would want it to still be the same either way. It's more that in 2005 there was an innocence to all this. I recall not being a fan of letting anyone use facebook and not just people with .edu emails. It was necessary change for the company, but it felt like it was already tearing apart what was enjoyable about it. If it was the same today as it was back then, would I use it? Honestly, probably not. I feel like all apps need to evolve before going stale. I just don't like the way Facebook did evolve. To tie in to twitter, while I'm pretty strong in not letting the headlines interfere with my use of the it, I have to acknowledge there is likely change coming that may better or worsen the experience likely be driven by money.
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Well, it DID or should have, concerned itself with profitability, and if it didn't, then we were really at the nascent "dot.com" period, where 95% of companies failed, and RIGHTFULLY SO. You can't operate a company without being profitable; who pays the rent? Who pays the salaries? Companies are not charities!
Agreed, which is why I am chuckling at those bitching about the $8 for the blue checkmark thing. Aw, the politicians and celebs are upset they won't get a free site to spread their massive influence anymore...for shame. Gimme a break.
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Well, it DID or should have, concerned itself with profitability, and if it didn't, then we were really at the nascent "dot.com" period, where 95% of companies failed, and RIGHTFULLY SO. You can't operate a company without being profitable; who pays the rent? Who pays the salaries? Companies are not charities!
Agreed, which is why I am chuckling at those bitching about the $8 for the blue checkmark thing. Aw, the politicians and celebs are upset they won't get a free site to spread their massive influence anymore...for shame. Gimme a break.
I think the bigger issue with celebrity check marks were that it meant it's a verified account so people don't get scammed from fake accounts. I also do think that some celebrities add a lot of value to twitter. It's one of my favorite reasons to be active there. I've interacted with quite a few of my favorite musicians for example. Having said that, I do think celebrities are the least of the people who should complain about $8 though. The celebs will have their following and influence regardless of the check mark.
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I think the bigger issue with celebrity check marks were that it meant it's a verified account so people don't get scammed from fake accounts. I also do think that some celebrities add a lot of value to twitter. It's one of my favorite reasons to be active there. I've interacted with quite a few of my favorite musicians for example. Having said that, I do think celebrities are the least of the people who should complain about $8 though. The celebs will have their following and influence regardless of the check mark.
True, and I think the door swings both ways. It's an advantage for both Twitter and the celebs/politicians to have the latter there. I can't remember who the first sitting president was to be on Twitter (feels like it had to be Obama), but I remember thinking of how powerful Twitter had gotten when even the President is on there and active.
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Whoa. Did this get pinned on purpose?
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So I'm seeing now under the title of accounts I follow that has the blue checkmark, "Official." Is that something Twitter put in so that we know this is their actual account?
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And it's gone already. :lol
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Whoa. Did this get pinned on purpose?
:lol
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Whoa. Did this get pinned on purpose?
:lol
Apparently I did this at 9pm last night, which is odd seeing as I was 3 drinks in at the pub at that time.
In summary: no.
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Cheers :lol
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Seems Twitter added a gray checkmark for official govt and major brand accounts accounts, only to have Elon cancel it a few hours later. This company may have six cans, but it's definitely missing the little plastic turtle killer that holds them together. :lol
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Elon Musk is a true alpha male, in the sense any feature he suggests is launched before leaving it.
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Whoa. Did this get pinned on purpose?
:lol
Apparently I did this at 9pm last night, which is odd seeing as I was 3 drinks in at the pub at that time.
In summary: no.
3? You lightweight. :lol
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Beer is like $10 a glass in Sweden. :P My phone touchscreen has been randomly registering clicks recently, I think it due to that.
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That's what I pay for a decent bourbon when I'm out.
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ITT: Drunken modding :lol
Still bettering than whatever Elon is doing.
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The official check was yanked by Elon. The fact that he's running this through realtime trial and error is fascinating. It's the same approach he and the Rooskies use in rocket engineering. And he's learning quickly. The problem still remains that he's only taking Twitter to exactly the place it was before he upended it. It seems he'll get there much quicker than originally predicted, but he's still burning a great deal of goodwill in both his and Twitter's brand. Basically, he looks like a dufus.
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(https://www.flagship.io/wp-content/uploads/test-in-production-meme-2.jpg)
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I mainly use it to get sports updates. Instant information and highlights. It's great when used correctly.
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(https://www.flagship.io/wp-content/uploads/test-in-production-meme-2.jpg)
:lol
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:lol At work, we have this meme for when we test in prod:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C906f4NXgAIx1Uv.jpg)
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:lol At work, we have this meme for when we test in prod:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C906f4NXgAIx1Uv.jpg)
It's older meme sir, but it checks out.
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:lol At work, we have this meme for when we test in prod:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C906f4NXgAIx1Uv.jpg)
Still one of the funniest things I've seen.
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So, Musk unloaded $4B of Tesla stock today. No reason given. Off the 2022 high by 52%. Seems like a totally good time to sell .... if your investment strategy is buy high / sell low.
That' brings the total to $19B sold since he announced he was taking over the Twitterz. He now only owns 14% of Tesla.
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This is quite the thread of verified* people on Twitter. Elon is a dope.
https://twitter.com/JoshuaPHilll/status/1590696859869536256
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I’ve been on the Twitter for years, best source for quick sports news around. But ya, you can tell just over the last week it’s going straight down the shitter.
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(https://www.flagship.io/wp-content/uploads/test-in-production-meme-2.jpg)
This is the story of life at my job.
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This is quite the thread of verified* people on Twitter. Elon is a dope.
https://twitter.com/JoshuaPHilll/status/1590696859869536256
Glorious
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This is quite the thread of verified* people on Twitter. Elon is a dope.
https://twitter.com/JoshuaPHilll/status/1590696859869536256
Glorious
Amazing
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So yesterday was the first day I really got a sense of how in trouble Twitter might be. This article covers it pretty well.
https://www.theverge.com/2022/11/10/23451198/twitter-ftc-elon-musk-lawyer-changes-fine-warning
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So yesterday was the first day I really got a sense of how in trouble Twitter might be. This article covers it pretty well.
https://www.theverge.com/2022/11/10/23451198/twitter-ftc-elon-musk-lawyer-changes-fine-warning
Yeah, I was talking about this stuff with my wife last night. She is in the GRC field (governance, risk, and compliance), and in her professional opinion, "They're fucked."
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This may end up being one of the grandest crash and burn scenarios in business history.
I find it fascinating.
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:trainwreck:
:corn
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So I'm seeing posts about blue check scammers posing as legit airlines customer services reps. People are Tweeting for assistance and are being scammed into providing ticketing info and a few have been directed to DMs where they are asked for credit card info and then lo and behold, their info is being used in thefts.
Elon has been asked to provide information or comments about this and all he does is block those who are asking what he plans to do about it.
Yeah, sure....stupid people willing to give out their credit card numbers take some of the responsibility. But in the recent past, many people stuck with airline issues have gotten legit help from airline customer services reps. So it is easy to see why people would fall for phony blue checked airline customer service accounts.
And this is just the first scam I've seen posted about. You know there has to be more.
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So I'm seeing posts about blue check scammers posing as legit airlines customer services reps. People are Tweeting for assistance and are being scammed into providing ticketing info and a few have been directed to DMs where they are asked for credit card info and then lo and behold, their info is being used in thefts.
Elon has been asked to provide information or comments about this and all he does is block those who are asking what he plans to do about it.
Yeah, sure....stupid people willing to give out their credit card numbers take some of the responsibility. But in the recent past, many people stuck with airline issues have gotten legit help from airline customer services reps. So it is easy to see why people would fall for phony blue checked airline customer service accounts.
And this is just the first scam I've seen posted about. You know there has to be more.
Saw something about fake blue check marked accounts pretending to be pharmaceutical companies have tanked their stocks by tweeting insulin will be free.
Elon really fucked this up
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Think we can talk Elon into buying Fox news next?
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Think we can talk Elon into buying Fox news next?
LoL, there isn't enough popcorn in the world for THAT idea. :lol
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Worst comes to worst, people just won't take anything for face value on Twitter anymore because of this, and people will really need to be cognitive about where they read facts and stuff.
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I think the idea they had for a few hours and rolled back might have made a lot of sense if they wanted a pay model as well. Verification of who you are is a big part of trust between customer and product on social media. Making companies pay for verification makes little sense, making an average person pay for privilege's may make sense though (an ad free experience, getting more public visibility).
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I think what makes me the most sad about Twitter likely being doomed is that every once in a blue moon there is a thread that really makes me laugh and not just the OP but the comments. There are so many funny people on Twitter.
Today's gem was an emergency room physician Tweeting: i can’t believe this needs to be said but if ur bit by a snake PLEASE don’t bring the snake to the ER with u
You can imagine all the stories being posted by various doctors and nurses around the world of things that have been brought to the ER for further examination. I literally had tears running down my face from laughter.
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I think what makes me the most sad about Twitter likely being doomed is that every once in a blue moon there is a thread that really makes me laugh and not just the OP but the comments. There are so many funny people on Twitter.
Today's gem was an emergency room physician Tweeting: i can’t believe this needs to be said but if ur bit by a snake PLEASE don’t bring the snake to the ER with u
You can imagine all the stories being posted by various doctors and nurses around the world of things that have been brought to the ER for further examination. I literally had tears running down my face from laughter.
TBF, without knowing much about snake bites, I can see why it makes sense so you know what you are dealing with as I'd imagine snake bites might be different depending on snake although if the snake was alive, that would be pretty odd experience. Maybe I'm completely wrong about that though.
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I think what makes me the most sad about Twitter likely being doomed is that every once in a blue moon there is a thread that really makes me laugh and not just the OP but the comments. There are so many funny people on Twitter.
Today's gem was an emergency room physician Tweeting: i can’t believe this needs to be said but if ur bit by a snake PLEASE don’t bring the snake to the ER with u
You can imagine all the stories being posted by various doctors and nurses around the world of things that have been brought to the ER for further examination. I literally had tears running down my face from laughter.
TBF, without knowing much about snake bites, I can see why it makes sense so you know what you are dealing with as I'd imagine snake bites might be different depending on snake although if the snake was alive, that would be pretty odd experience. Maybe I'm completely wrong about that though.
Surprisingly, the consensus was that it depends on your geographic location. In the US, snake anti-venom is like one-size fits all because the common snakes are all from the same type of family. Some Australians were suggesting the snake would be helpful in the outback ER.
I'm wondering why a photo couldn't suffice? Call me crazy. LoL
But there were also discussions about bats, rats, spiders, and other things getting loose inside of ERs. :o
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I think what makes me the most sad about Twitter likely being doomed is that every once in a blue moon there is a thread that really makes me laugh and not just the OP but the comments. There are so many funny people on Twitter.
Today's gem was an emergency room physician Tweeting: i can’t believe this needs to be said but if ur bit by a snake PLEASE don’t bring the snake to the ER with u
You can imagine all the stories being posted by various doctors and nurses around the world of things that have been brought to the ER for further examination. I literally had tears running down my face from laughter.
TBF, without knowing much about snake bites, I can see why it makes sense so you know what you are dealing with as I'd imagine snake bites might be different depending on snake although if the snake was alive, that would be pretty odd experience. Maybe I'm completely wrong about that though.
Surprisingly, the consensus was that it depends on your geographic location. In the US, snake anti-venom is like one-size fits all because the common snakes are all from the same type of family. Some Australians were suggesting the snake would be helpful in the outback ER.
I'm wondering why a photo couldn't suffice? Call me crazy. LoL
But there were also discussions about bats, rats, spiders, and other things getting loose inside of ERs. :o
They want the ER to make fresh anti-venom from that snake :lol
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So I'm seeing posts about blue check scammers posing as legit airlines customer services reps. People are Tweeting for assistance and are being scammed into providing ticketing info and a few have been directed to DMs where they are asked for credit card info and then lo and behold, their info is being used in thefts.
Elon has been asked to provide information or comments about this and all he does is block those who are asking what he plans to do about it.
Yeah, sure....stupid people willing to give out their credit card numbers take some of the responsibility. But in the recent past, many people stuck with airline issues have gotten legit help from airline customer services reps. So it is easy to see why people would fall for phony blue checked airline customer service accounts.
And this is just the first scam I've seen posted about. You know there has to be more.
Saw something about fake blue check marked accounts pretending to be pharmaceutical companies have tanked their stocks by tweeting insulin will be free.
Elon really fucked this up
That was Eli Lilly. Fake, but verified, account tweeted that out and totally tanked the companies stock.
According to this story, about $15 Billion. Keep it up Elon. You're doing great.
https://www.thestar.com/business/technology/2022/11/11/eli-lilly-loses-billions-in-market-cap-after-verified-twitter-impostor-promises-free-insulin.html
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Eli Lilly, along with drugmakers Novo Nordisk and Sanofi, currently dominate the insulin market. Together, they account for the entire insulin supply in the U.S. and 90 per cent worldwide.
The three people who discovered insulin, a life-saving drug, originally sold their patents to the University of Toronto for $1 each. One of the team members, Sir Frederick G. Banting, remarked: “Insulin does not belong to me, it belongs to the world.”
Eli Lilly was the first company to mass-manufacture insulin, shipping its first commercial supply in 1923. In 2022, the company charges $82.41 for individual vials of their Insulin Lispro Injection, or $159.12 for a pack of five pens.
I don't feel sorry for Eli Lilly, or those other companies. Their greedy asses are charging too much for insulin anyways. Obviously, people want it cheaper and agreed with the tweet enough to make them lose that much in the stock market. Also, I find it hilarious just how fragile the stock market is.
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Worst comes to worst, people just won't take anything for face value on Twitter anymore because of this, and people will really need to be cognitive about where they read facts and stuff.
Replace "Twitter" with "Internet" and you'll have the world becoming suddenly a better place.
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Worst comes to worst, people just won't take anything for face value on Twitter anymore because of this, and people will really need to be cognitive about where they read facts and stuff.
Replace "Twitter" with "Internet" and you'll have the world becoming suddenly a better place.
Do you really think it was before the internet? I actually think it hasn't been great since Television was invented. This is where the people started blending fiction with reality.
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Worst comes to worst, people just won't take anything for face value on Twitter anymore because of this, and people will really need to be cognitive about where they read facts and stuff.
Replace "Twitter" with "Internet" and you'll have the world becoming suddenly a better place.
Do you really think it was before the internet? I actually think it hasn't been great since Television was invented. This is where the people started blending fiction with reality.
Doesn’t the war of the worlds radio panic fiasco pre-date television?
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Yup...1938
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Worst comes to worst, people just won't take anything for face value on Twitter anymore because of this, and people will really need to be cognitive about where they read facts and stuff.
Replace "Twitter" with "Internet" and you'll have the world becoming suddenly a better place.
Do you really think it was before the internet? I actually think it hasn't been great since Television was invented. This is where the people started blending fiction with reality.
Doesn’t the war of the worlds radio panic fiasco pre-date television?
Thanks Marconi.
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Worst comes to worst, people just won't take anything for face value on Twitter anymore because of this, and people will really need to be cognitive about where they read facts and stuff.
We should have been cognitive of that well before Elon Musk took over.
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(https://www.flagship.io/wp-content/uploads/test-in-production-meme-2.jpg)
This is the story of life at my job.
"Real world" test :lol
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Good for them.
https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/twitter-hit-with-mass-resignations-after-elon-musk-hardcore-ultimatum-004304057.html
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Yeah, good for them. At least, if Twitter is gone, we all still have each other here in these boards. That's the key part.
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(https://i.redd.it/mup34249yl0a1.jpg)
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^ Glorious!
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(https://i.redd.it/mup34249yl0a1.jpg)
I don't buy that one. I think the employees were intentionally locked out. They can't return to the offices until Monday. If it was just a badge issue, they'd have security manually checking them at unlocked points of entry.
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I don't know how badging works at twitter but where I work (Wells Fargo) security can only give access to our elevators. They have zero ability to badge you into the banking floors as the badging system is governed by Wells and not building security.
I had to work a holiday once because I was on call and forgot my badge, the security got me in the elevator room but I couldn't get into the office and since no one was in the office I had to go back home.
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I REALLY don't get all the schadenfreude, I really don't.
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The internet hivemind always needs a villain.
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I REALLY don't get all the schadenfreude, I really don't.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElN_4vUvTPs
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The internet hivemind always needs a villain.
People have always needed a villain. Whether it be a angry sky person that demands child sacrifices on mountain tops, someone to burn at the stake for being a witch, or people to hang because of different skin tones... Humans have always been this way, long before the internet. We're a bit fucked up as a species in that regard and we (not literally every human in existence) seem to get off on it. For better or for worse, it's in our DNA.
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Yeah, it's easy to see Elon has a love/hate relationship with the general public. People really hate the guy so it's easy to see why people are loving the downfall of twitter.
I do think it's a bit sad that some people obsess over him.
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The internet hivemind always needs a villain.
People have always needed a villain. Whether it be a angry sky person that demands child sacrifices on mountain tops, someone to burn at the stake for being a witch, or people to hang because of different skin tones... Humans have always been this way, long before the internet. We're a bit fucked up as a species in that regard and we (not literally every human in existence) seem to get off on it. For better or for worse, it's in our DNA.
Isn't one of the better parts of humanity to overcome our human nature? Isn't our human nature to, at least in part, fuck as much as possible? But #MeToo, because it's the right thing to do, no?
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The internet hivemind always needs a villain.
People have always needed a villain. Whether it be a angry sky person that demands child sacrifices on mountain tops, someone to burn at the stake for being a witch, or people to hang because of different skin tones... Humans have always been this way, long before the internet. We're a bit fucked up as a species in that regard and we (not literally every human in existence) seem to get off on it. For better or for worse, it's in our DNA.
Isn't one of the better parts of humanity to overcome our human nature? Isn't our human nature to, at least in part, fuck as much as possible? But #MeToo, because it's the right thing to do, no?
Sure. And we do in a lot of ways. It takes time, and like with "MeToo" and segregation we've improved greatly in just a few generations. Long gone are the days where we'd have rivers of blood coming from the guillotine, and the celebrating of literal heads on spikes. At least we're now at the stage where we're just slinging digital shit at each other online rather than at stocks with rotten fruit.
People are struggling a lot financially, and people really hate hubris. So for a lot of people, to see a billionaire just throwing around billions of dollars in some kind of dick waving contest to appear to have had that hubris bite him in the ass, feels like some kind of justice, at least on a class level.
I get it.
I'm rooting for the downfall of Twitter in its current form. It's got nothing to do with Elon personally. Though, I've been a fan of his and a defender of him for a long time. His behavior the last few months has really soured me on him.
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I am thinking that Kevin Bacon should play Elon Musk in the eventual film. He already has the line.
(https://media.tenor.com/kKj_j0Kt5wYAAAAC/animal-house-kevin-bacon.gif)
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People are struggling a lot financially, and people really hate hubris. So for a lot of people, to see a billionaire just throwing around billions of dollars in some kind of dick waving contest to appear to have had that hubris bite him in the ass, feels like some kind of justice, at least on a class level.
I get it.
This. Simple and precise explanation.
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People are struggling a lot financially, and people really hate hubris. So for a lot of people, to see a billionaire just throwing around billions of dollars in some kind of dick waving contest to appear to have had that hubris bite him in the ass, feels like some kind of justice, at least on a class level.
I get it.
This. Simple and precise explanation.
No doubt Brian did a great job. I'm still skeptical; it still seems like it's arbitrary at best.
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(https://i.imgur.com/QSqr4kj.jpg)
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:lol
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People are struggling a lot financially, and people really hate hubris. So for a lot of people, to see a billionaire just throwing around billions of dollars in some kind of dick waving contest to appear to have had that hubris bite him in the ass, feels like some kind of justice, at least on a class level.
I get it.
This. Simple and precise explanation.
No doubt Brian did a great job. I'm still skeptical; it still seems like it's arbitrary at best.
Seems like is something we closely share views on. I'm also not one for schadenfreude ever. It feels petty and unproductive to me. But I've learned that's a hugely unpopular opinion, so now I just keep my mouth shut. People can't vent and spread negativity all they want, and I'll just say to myself that my silence is helping.
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I REALLY don't get all the schadenfreude, I really don't.
Because most individual lives are boring as fuck, mundane shit same day after day, and watching the world's richest man eat a gargantuan financial dick is fun. Just imagine it's Adam Schiff's comedy of errors on full display...
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The crew over at MySpace needs to take this opportunity to roll out a redesign and an app. I'd sign up.
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Dumpy's back, which may finally drive a lot of the folks on the fence away for good.
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Dumpy's back, which may finally drive a lot of the folks on the fence away for good.
Goddammit.
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How would it feel to be king of the internet dumpster fire?
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I was really dreading this day. I have enjoyed the news not constantly being about "TRUMP TWEETED".
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Why folks? Who cares. Scroll right on by. Ignore the orange cheeto. Life is so much better Ignoring the negative
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Why folks? Who cares. Scroll right on by. Ignore the orange cheeto. Life is so much better Ignoring the negative
Hey hey hey, lets not insult cheetos here.....
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It's the only color that works though :lol
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Why folks? Who cares. Scroll right on by. Ignore the orange cheeto. Life is so much better Ignoring the negative
Very true, but internet outrage is more fashionable than being an adult. :P
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Donnie said he has no intention of posting there, which would make sense since that'd immediately kill Truth Social.
Let's see how long he can actually stay off it though. I'd put the over/under at a month.
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Why folks? Who cares. Scroll right on by. Ignore the orange cheeto. Life is so much better Ignoring the negative
If I wanted to know who tweeted what, then I would look at twitter. Its the fact that literally all news outlets constantly had headlines about his tweets. Hard to escape. This isn't about ignoring Trump, its the coverage of it by the media.
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I’m in total covfefe with that😀
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So for people not keeping track of some of the behind the scenes drama:
Twitter/Elon: "Everyone needs to reply to this email within 24 hours agreeing to new, horrifically long hours or you are fired"
European Twitter Employees: "That has no legal weight, I will be working what I'm contracted until otherwise stated. Also remember you need to give a certain period of notice of employment termination, so you will be breaking several laws if you fire us in this way."
Twitter/Elon: *fires these employees*
European governments and worker organisations:
(https://i.imgur.com/VCrKT52.jpg)
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They/he also managed to break the copyright and contentID system, so people are uploading entire movies in 2 min clips currently.
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Donnie said he has no intention of posting there, which would make sense since that'd immediately kill Truth Social.
Let's see how long he can actually stay off it though. I'd put the over/under at a month.
I'll put next week's pay on the under.
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Donnie said he has no intention of posting there, which would make sense since that'd immediately kill Truth Social.
Let's see how long he can actually stay off it though. I'd put the over/under at a month.
I'll put next week's pay on the under.
:lol
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Donnie said he has no intention of posting there, which would make sense since that'd immediately kill Truth Social.
What on earth is Truth Social?
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Donnie said he has no intention of posting there, which would make sense since that'd immediately kill Truth Social.
What on earth is Truth Social?
That's the social media outfit and bastion of authentic free speech that Donnie started when he got the boot from Twitter.
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Why folks? Who cares. Scroll right on by. Ignore the orange cheeto. Life is so much better Ignoring the negative
Very true, but internet outrage is more fashionable than being an adult. :P
Word.
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If Elon has played one Trump card (lol) through this whole thing it's that he's given Twitter what it craves the most: the sense that they are the most important thing going on in the world at any given time.
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-11-21/elon-musk-s-2022-wealth-loss-exceeds-100-billion-for-first-time
For reference, over 140 countries have GDP less than this.
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I recently remembered I have a Counter Social account. Recovered my password and have started looking around again. I might have created a Mastodon account around the same time. I honestly can't remember. Hive seems scary due to the fact that 2 people run the whole thing (which isn't much different than Twitter now, I guess) and Tribel has people freaking out over security.
All I seem to be doing on Twitter now is blocking dozens of accounts every day. Not really all that fun.
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Well, with Musk bringing back all (or most) of the suspended accounts, I officially created a Mastodon account and loaded Tusky on my phone to browse it with. Already seeing many people that I look at over there so I might start moving away slowly from Twitter.
Pretty simple, find a server, create an account and you can see things from every server like you are all on the same one (but you're not). The joinmastodon site had a list of servers and I found one I liked that was it.
https://joinmastodon.org/servers
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Well, with Musk bringing back all (or most) of the suspended accounts, I officially created a Mastodon account and loaded Tusky on my phone to browse it with. Already seeing many people that I look at over there so I might start moving away slowly from Twitter.
Pretty simple, find a server, create an account and you can see things from every server like you are all on the same one (but you're not). The joinmastodon site had a list of servers and I found one I liked that was it.
https://joinmastodon.org/servers
I just picked a server at random. Still haven't really dug into the scene yet.
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Mine was fairly random too. I went with ohai.social. Listed itself as a generic server and had a smaller user load. So far, so good.
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Mine was fairly random too. I went with ohai.social. Listed itself as a generic server and had a smaller user load. So far, so good.
I have one follower so far... :lol
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Mine was fairly random too. I went with ohai.social. Listed itself as a generic server and had a smaller user load. So far, so good.
I have one follower so far... :lol
Stadler? It is a bot after all. :lol :lol
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New scary looking thing.
I will probably join because I tend to always rebel against the old man in my head.
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Mine was fairly random too. I went with ohai.social. Listed itself as a generic server and had a smaller user load. So far, so good.
I have one follower so far... :lol
Stadler? It is a bot after all. :lol :lol
Nah lol, some random dude from south America, we connected through jmetal of course lol
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It ain't me; I have no idea what any of you are talking about.
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Why folks? Who cares. Scroll right on by. Ignore the orange cheeto. Life is so much better Ignoring the negative
If I wanted to know who tweeted what, then I would look at twitter. Its the fact that literally all news outlets constantly had headlines about his tweets. Hard to escape. This isn't about ignoring Trump, its the coverage of it by the media.
The news media can be ignored too. Everyone has that choice. ;)
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Soooo where's all the doom and gloom for twitter lately?
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https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-11-21/elon-musk-s-2022-wealth-loss-exceeds-100-billion-for-first-time
For reference, over 140 countries have GDP less than this.
Wow, instead of losing his ass, he could've fed a few small countries.
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https://www.ft.com/content/a07ca1ae-9f9a-46ee-9457-27bb30e18ed2
When "ideals" clash against law.
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https://www.ft.com/content/a07ca1ae-9f9a-46ee-9457-27bb30e18ed2
When "ideals" clash against law.
Paywall
Care to summarize?
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https://www.ft.com/content/a07ca1ae-9f9a-46ee-9457-27bb30e18ed2
When "ideals" clash against law.
Paywall
Care to summarize?
https://www.reuters.com/technology/eu-warns-musk-that-twitter-faces-ban-over-content-moderation-ft-2022-11-30/
This one should be paywallless.
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Elon "free speech" Musk has suspended Ye's account again for posting this as "inciting violence."
Mods - if you feel this is inappropriate to post, I will remove it.
(https://i.imgur.com/b04tnZG.jpg)
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HarmonYe ;D
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HarmonYe ;D
FUUUUUCK don't lump me in with that asshole please. :censored
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You praise Hitler multiple times on a podcast, to the point Alex Jones of all people comes across as the moderating influence, post a Swastika on social media unironically, and all of a sudden you are banned from twitter.
Cancel Culture gone mad, I say.
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So twitter is enforcing some sort of hate speech policy?
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So twitter is enforcing some sort of hate speech policy?
Quickly re-learning all the same shit they learned years ago
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Sure banning Ye had nothing to do with this:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/nicholasreimann/2022/11/30/eu-threatens-twitter-ban-unless-musk-ramps-up-moderation-tactics-report-says/?sh=1f05b7f13fb8
Once again something Musk would have learned if he had any respect at all for the $44B platform he was buying.
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HarmonYe ;D
FUUUUUCK don't lump me in with that asshole please. :censored
Sorry!!
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This might invigorate his base and propel him to the White House in '24. Stranger things have happened (like 6 years ago, maybe, even).
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Well, the "twitter files" are coming out now, in a live twitter thread. https://twitter.com/mtaibbi/status/1598822959866683394 (https://twitter.com/mtaibbi/status/1598822959866683394) Definitely looks like they are painting this as the democrats having abilities to contact people at twitter to censor content.
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Well, the "twitter files" are coming out now, in a live twitter thread. https://twitter.com/mtaibbi/status/1598822959866683394 (https://twitter.com/mtaibbi/status/1598822959866683394) Definitely looks like they are painting this as the democrats having abilities to contact people at twitter to censor content.
Care to summarize. I ain't reading 33 individual tweets
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Elon Musk basically just discovered what we already knew: content moderation is messy and involves whole teams of people with a range of viewpoints trying to appease different political factions.
He then gave “leaks” to a Substack Man to present it as a blockbuster.
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Well, the "twitter files" are coming out now, in a live twitter thread. https://twitter.com/mtaibbi/status/1598822959866683394 (https://twitter.com/mtaibbi/status/1598822959866683394) Definitely looks like they are painting this as the democrats having abilities to contact people at twitter to censor content.
Care to summarize. I ain't reading 33 individual tweets
Twitter played nice with the democrats to censor things related to Hunter's laptop including as far as censoring private messages.
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And today all I see when I open Parler, I mean Twitter, is nothing but posts about the deep state, Trump was right about everything, treason, etc.
Making it really easy to flip to Mastodon. And why do I see every freakin' post tweet from Elon when I don't follow him? I just got done blocking about 50 accounts just now. It's all I do when I open the app now. Read some tweets from people I actually follow and block dozens of others.
It's become exhausting.
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A whistle-blower called in city authorities to say that some conference rooms in Twitter headquarters have been converted into modest bedrooms.
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A whistle-blower called in city authorities to say that some conference rooms in Twitter headquarters have been converted into modest bedrooms.
Definitely a sign of healthy work/life balance!
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I've worked plenty of places that had beds set up, usually for emergencies though.
I don't know, I wouldn't want to work there, but as long as it's not illegal, I don't really see the point in ripping on stuff like this (if it is illegal, fuck him).
If I were younger, I might see working at twitter as an amazing career opportunity right now. When I first started my job, it was fairly normal to work 80 hours a week. I viewed it part of a learning and growing experience. Work/life balance sucked, but I figured it out because I was motivated and young at that time. I have no desire to do that now, but I could see myself finding that motivation if I believed in what I was doing was worth it and I can't fault the people who stayed that may feel this way.
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If I were younger, I might see working at twitter as an amazing career opportunity right now. When I first started my job, it was fairly normal to work 80 hours a week. I viewed it part of a learning and growing experience. Work/life balance sucked, but I figured it out because I was motivated and young at that time. I have no desire to do that now, but I could see myself finding that motivation if I believed in what I was doing was worth it and I can't fault the people who stayed that may feel this way.
Cram, I can appreciate that sentiment. I think how you approached it is spot on. I'm going to generalize with no backup, but I feel like people in their 20's today don't really approach it like that anymore. And I mean that really generally. Obviously that's not everyone.
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I mean I made it "work" in my twenties, but my health and social life definitely suffered for it.
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I mean I made it "work" in my twenties, but my health and social life definitely suffered for it.
But you're in your 20's! Maybe you suffered from something specific, but I don't consider working too hard detrimental to one's health. Social life? Like I said, someone in the 20's should have enough energy for that no matter what they work.
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1. Mental health is a thing.
2. Even if you do have additional energy in your twenties, that's still energy I could be using on stuff other than work. Maintaining a healthy work life balance on an 80 hour week is hard work. Much better to work 40 ish and have energy to spare.
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1. Mental health is a thing.
2. Even if you do have additional energy in your twenties, that's still energy I could be using on stuff other than work. Maintaining a healthy work life balance on an 80 hour week is hard work. Much better to work 40 ish and have energy to spare.
Mental health is DEFINITELY a thing, something I've been saying for several years now in a variety of contexts. "Working hard" =/= "poor mental health" though, and that's the myth.
I think "hard work" in that sense is something we should all do to experience it, even if later we choose not to live a life like that. I think there is an entire generation of people that have just sort of lost what it means to actually SACRIFICE in order to earn their salary. I think this notion that all companies have to accommodate 10,000 (or however many employees they have) different lifestyles and different attitudes is a recipe for disaster (or at the very least, poor corporate performance, and like it or not, that's all that matters if we want to continue to have a job). Companies typically end their fiscal year in December; it's not that insane to think that there may be increased activity around that time; for some, sure, go home and pound eggnog. But for all the grief that CEOs/C-Suite executives get for being paid the big bucks, they ARE taking calls and making decisions on Christmas Day.
I can remember working in the environmental industry and having to remediate a big name company's site (you've used their calculators, I'm sure). We had to remove a transformer bank, dig out the soil underneath, replace it, and the transformers, over Labor Day weekend when the plant was on shut down. We strategized it, I hired a company that had duplicate equipment just in case something broke, and we set out. It was going to be a 48 hour marathon (we had something like 56 hour window before it impacted production). A hurricane came in that morning. We persevered; the lead supervisor for my sub had a heart attack an hour into the work. We persevered; I asked the guy on the concrete truck if he knew anyone that could help frame out the footings (one of the supervisor's tasks). I ended up giving him $300 cash to do it himself. We worked for two and a half days straight, sleeping in two-hour shifts. Rather than that being a negative, to me that's a story I can tell. I'm PROUD that we had that plant back up and running on time like we said we were going to. I felt like Tom Fucking Brady (sidebar: the plant site is about five miles from where Aaron Hernandez lived).
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My first job out of college, they would do a yearly power down of the data center for building power maintenance. It was always done on MLK weekend so the company would have a three day weekend, but the IT department was on site the entire holiday weekend. It SUCKED because it was such a long weekend (I did it i think 3 times) but I definitely believe being apart of such projects lead to a growth in my career. Not so much directly in these instances as I didn't stay in that job too long, but in the experience and confidence gained from playing my role in those crazy weekends.
Also, we are talking an IT company. I've been working in IT for 15 years now, it's very common to have days when you work 24 hours. It's part of the job when you have major projects and things usually go wrong that need to be fixed live and you can't just walk out during that time.
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Mental health is DEFINITELY a thing, something I've been saying for several years now in a variety of contexts. "Working hard" =/= "poor mental health" though, and that's the myth.
And "Working hard" != "Overworking". You can work hard within a 40 hour week.
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1. Mental health is a thing.
2. Even if you do have additional energy in your twenties, that's still energy I could be using on stuff other than work. Maintaining a healthy work life balance on an 80 hour week is hard work. Much better to work 40 ish and have energy to spare.
Mental health is DEFINITELY a thing, something I've been saying for several years now in a variety of contexts. "Working hard" =/= "poor mental health" though, and that's the myth.
I think "hard work" in that sense is something we should all do to experience it, even if later we choose not to live a life like that. I think there is an entire generation of people that have just sort of lost what it means to actually SACRIFICE in order to earn their salary. I think this notion that all companies have to accommodate 10,000 (or however many employees they have) different lifestyles and different attitudes is a recipe for disaster (or at the very least, poor corporate performance, and like it or not, that's all that matters if we want to continue to have a job). Companies typically end their fiscal year in December; it's not that insane to think that there may be increased activity around that time; for some, sure, go home and pound eggnog. But for all the grief that CEOs/C-Suite executives get for being paid the big bucks, they ARE taking calls and making decisions on Christmas Day.
I can remember working in the environmental industry and having to remediate a big name company's site (you've used their calculators, I'm sure). We had to remove a transformer bank, dig out the soil underneath, replace it, and the transformers, over Labor Day weekend when the plant was on shut down. We strategized it, I hired a company that had duplicate equipment just in case something broke, and we set out. It was going to be a 48 hour marathon (we had something like 56 hour window before it impacted production). A hurricane came in that morning. We persevered; the lead supervisor for my sub had a heart attack an hour into the work. We persevered; I asked the guy on the concrete truck if he knew anyone that could help frame out the footings (one of the supervisor's tasks). I ended up giving him $300 cash to do it himself. We worked for two and a half days straight, sleeping in two-hour shifts. Rather than that being a negative, to me that's a story I can tell. I'm PROUD that we had that plant back up and running on time like we said we were going to. I felt like Tom Fucking Brady (sidebar: the plant site is about five miles from where Aaron Hernandez lived).
Now that's a type of job where you can't be a slacker, and have deadline to meet. It's a job that has real world consequences if not done properly. That type of stress, frustration, planning, pursuance, is why people in those positions earn that much money. It's not easy to execute and it's a big responsibility if something goes wrong because you didn't take into account certain things.
Mental health is DEFINITELY a thing, something I've been saying for several years now in a variety of contexts. "Working hard" =/= "poor mental health" though, and that's the myth.
And "Working hard" != "Overworking". You can work hard within a 40 hour week.
Working Hard would depend on the type of job.
Some types of jobs are necessary to keep the wheels turning, and these are the jobs you just can't slack on, and these may require you to work extra harder.
Take a factory job and how that has evolved to being done by machines because human workers just can't meet the demands of the supply. You know how many people they'd have to hire and how much harder they'd each have to work, while at the same time the company would want profits. So those products would be priced higher.
It is interesting to note though, that back in those factory days, Sports was used as leisure time for companies. They noticed an increase in work production when giving their workers a time to leisure and play sports.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/281960859_Sport_industry_and_industrial_sport_in_Britain_before_1914_review_and_revision
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1. Mental health is a thing.
2. Even if you do have additional energy in your twenties, that's still energy I could be using on stuff other than work. Maintaining a healthy work life balance on an 80 hour week is hard work. Much better to work 40 ish and have energy to spare.
Mental health is DEFINITELY a thing, something I've been saying for several years now in a variety of contexts. "Working hard" =/= "poor mental health" though, and that's the myth.
I think "hard work" in that sense is something we should all do to experience it, even if later we choose not to live a life like that. I think there is an entire generation of people that have just sort of lost what it means to actually SACRIFICE in order to earn their salary. I think this notion that all companies have to accommodate 10,000 (or however many employees they have) different lifestyles and different attitudes is a recipe for disaster (or at the very least, poor corporate performance, and like it or not, that's all that matters if we want to continue to have a job).
Bingo.
And to XJ..I'm not saying Mental Health isn't a thing. Just like physical health is real. If you have cancer or something else, sure you can be fucked. If you have some sort of extreme mental health issue..I believe that can be tough to overcome.
But to improve our physical health, we have to exercise. Isn't it the same thing with mental health? Don't we strengthen our mental health by actually working through challenges?
It's like when some fat guy cries about diabetes. Fucking lose the weight. I have diabetes and I'm not heavy at all. My pancreas doesn't work.
I don't think someone going to a therapist is cowardly at all, but I do think people claim mental health issues way too easily. Just like me and diabetes, it's an insult to people that actually have mental health issues.
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Always cracks me up to see others describe my old standard schedule when I was still a restaurant chef as a toxic work/life balance (which it was), my industry is notorious for pushing the envelope of what people will tolerate.
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Oh yeah, restaurant work is hard.
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I'm not entirely sure that work/life balance means poor mental health though, I don't think anyone's claimed that but it almost reads that way. It certainly could lead to that, but I'm not rushing to say thats the case by default. A 40 hour work week is plenty to cause mental health issues depending on the job. There are even days like today where 8 hours is plenty to cause it, but it's almost mentally hard for me to not try to push through, I don't want to just give in. Something similar to what TAC is saying, sometimes pushing through is better. But it's case by case. If anyone's wondering, I woke to this morning after a re-occuring nightmare I have (but haven't had in a very long time) and it set me up for a day of mental frustration and anger before I even got out of bed and work only made it worse today.
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If anyone's wondering, I woke to this morning after a re-occuring nightmare I have (but haven't had in a very long time) and it set me up for a day of mental frustration and anger before I even got out of bed and work only made it worse today.
But you pushed through it because you have good mental health conditioning, instead of curling up in bed all day claiming mental health.
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I'm not entirely sure that work/life balance means poor mental health though, I don't think anyone's claimed that but it almost reads that way. It certainly could lead to that, but I'm not rushing to say thats the case by default. A 40 hour work week is plenty to cause mental health issues depending on the job.
I'm not saying that its a guarantee but having extra time to work on yourself does make things more manageable on average.
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If anyone's wondering, I woke to this morning after a re-occuring nightmare I have (but haven't had in a very long time) and it set me up for a day of mental frustration and anger before I even got out of bed and work only made it worse today.
But you pushed through it because you have good mental health conditioning, instead of curling up in bed all day claiming mental health.
Maybe. I'd like to think that, but I don't know. I'm still thinking about it so maybe not as much as I wish.
I'm not entirely sure that work/life balance means poor mental health though, I don't think anyone's claimed that but it almost reads that way. It certainly could lead to that, but I'm not rushing to say thats the case by default. A 40 hour work week is plenty to cause mental health issues depending on the job.
I'm not saying that its a guarantee but having extra time to work on yourself does make things more manageable on average.
I guess it depends on how you spend that extra time. If you are working on yourself, then sure I think thats very helpful.
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Oh yeah, restaurant work is hard.
The thing is, it's not the hard work that makes it so fucking toxic, it's the bullying, the shaming, the bullshit machismo that's so integrated into the culture. I can't even begin to think of all the habits and behaviors I've had to unlearn in the past ten years just to make myself a bit less of a shit human, especially in the kitchen. In the long run, I think I'm a better manager as a lover than as an asshole. It's no wonder addiction, alcoholism, divorce, and all those other wonderful things are so high in the business.
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Oh yeah, restaurant work is hard.
The thing is, it's not the hard work that makes it so fucking toxic, it's the bullying, the shaming, the bullshit machismo that's so integrated into the culture. I can't even begin to think of all the habits and behaviors I've had to unlearn in the past ten years just to make myself a bit less of a shit human, especially in the kitchen. In the long run, I think I'm a better manager as a lover than as an asshole. It's no wonder addiction, alcoholism, divorce, and all those other wonderful things are so high in the business.
My experience is that chefs just think they're the shit. Some how they feel like the kitchen actually isn't a workplace with laws and standards, but for some reason, they think it's their kingdom to speak to people however they damn well choose.
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Oh yeah, restaurant work is hard.
The thing is, it's not the hard work that makes it so fucking toxic, it's the bullying, the shaming, the bullshit machismo that's so integrated into the culture. I can't even begin to think of all the habits and behaviors I've had to unlearn in the past ten years just to make myself a bit less of a shit human, especially in the kitchen. In the long run, I think I'm a better manager as a lover than as an asshole. It's no wonder addiction, alcoholism, divorce, and all those other wonderful things are so high in the business.
My experience is that chefs just think they're the shit. Some how they feel like the kitchen actually isn't a workplace with laws and standards, but for some reason, they think it's their kingdom to speak to people however they damn well choose.
Honestly, I'd blame media for a great deal of that. Things like Hell's Kitchen do my industry zero favors, it gives cooks a false ideal of what's expected, and any actual development as a person and employee gets tossed out the window for some machismo pissing contest instead. The best chefs, the ones I try to emulate, are teachers first and foremost. The business, in the end, is about creating memories. We are integral to some of life's most important moments, the weddings, the engagements, the graduations, the birthdays, the first dates. In the end, unless we're dealing with the top teir of the culinary world, we should create a palate for those life moments to be played upon. Nowhere does ego fit into that scenario.
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Honestly, I'd blame media for a great deal of that. Things like Hell's Kitchen do my industry zero favors, it gives cooks a false ideal of what's expected, and any actual development as a person and employee gets tossed out the window for some machismo pissing contest instead. The best chefs, the ones I try to emulate, are teachers first and foremost.
I'm not fooled by the media. I get it. And to the bolded, yes I would agree.
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It's not you the media fools, it's the young and inexperienced cooks coming into the business.
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And today all I see when I open Parler, I mean Twitter, is nothing but posts about the deep state, Trump was right about everything, treason, etc.
Making it really easy to flip to Mastodon. And why do I see every freakin' post tweet from Elon when I don't follow him? I just got done blocking about 50 accounts just now. It's all I do when I open the app now. Read some tweets from people I actually follow and block dozens of others.
It's become exhausting.
So, are your content preferences set to “home” or “latest tweets”? Because you definitely want latest tweets to avoid all the algorithm curated content and things from people you don’t follow.
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I have barely seen Elon's tweets and scroll on by when I do. No big whoop.
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My first job out of college, they would do a yearly power down of the data center for building power maintenance. It was always done on MLK weekend so the company would have a three day weekend, but the IT department was on site the entire holiday weekend. It SUCKED because it was such a long weekend (I did it i think 3 times) but I definitely believe being apart of such projects lead to a growth in my career. Not so much directly in these instances as I didn't stay in that job too long, but in the experience and confidence gained from playing my role in those crazy weekends.
Also, we are talking an IT company. I've been working in IT for 15 years now, it's very common to have days when you work 24 hours. It's part of the job when you have major projects and things usually go wrong that need to be fixed live and you can't just walk out during that time.
This, I can't tell you how many 24 hour shifts I've had to pull because a production deployment went south.
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Sounds like shitty management tbh.
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Sounds like shitty management tbh.
And a shitty job and is illegal I. Many states.
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Illegal in most European countries as well. Being awake for 24 hours is similar to having a BAC of 0.10%, so in that respect makes mistakes and errors much more likely.
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I'm not entirely sure that work/life balance means poor mental health though, I don't think anyone's claimed that but it almost reads that way. It certainly could lead to that, but I'm not rushing to say thats the case by default. A 40 hour work week is plenty to cause mental health issues depending on the job.
I'm not saying that its a guarantee but having extra time to work on yourself does make things more manageable on average.
But that's just priorities. I have someone in my life that needs mental wellness - needs to work on themselves - as bad as anyone I've ever met in my life. She even knows it. But her claim is, "I don't have time; I have two kids, work, blah blah blah". But she also goes on like five Tinder dates a week. Dude (Dudette?), grow the fuck up. Being an adult isn't doing whatever you want when you want, being an adult is doing what you HAVE TO DO WHEN YOU HAVE TO DO IT, without being told.
We are a society of excuses. I don't think I'm out of line in saying "if you can, then shut the fuck up and do it". The number of people who truly CANNOT - as opposed to "won't", or "don't want to" is exceedingly low. We talk so much about stepping up and having your back and "Boston Strong!" and all these memes about whatever, and yet when the rubber meets the road it's "oh, this is too HARD". I have little sympathy for that, frankly.
(Again, to be clear, I am NOT including those who truly cannot. I am sympathetic to that.)
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Oh yeah, restaurant work is hard.
The thing is, it's not the hard work that makes it so fucking toxic, it's the bullying, the shaming, the bullshit machismo that's so integrated into the culture. I can't even begin to think of all the habits and behaviors I've had to unlearn in the past ten years just to make myself a bit less of a shit human, especially in the kitchen. In the long run, I think I'm a better manager as a lover than as an asshole. It's no wonder addiction, alcoholism, divorce, and all those other wonderful things are so high in the business.
My experience is that chefs just think they're the shit. Some how they feel like the kitchen actually isn't a workplace with laws and standards, but for some reason, they think it's their kingdom to speak to people however they damn well choose.
Honestly, I'd blame media for a great deal of that. Things like Hell's Kitchen do my industry zero favors, it gives cooks a false ideal of what's expected, and any actual development as a person and employee gets tossed out the window for some machismo pissing contest instead. The best chefs, the ones I try to emulate, are teachers first and foremost. The business, in the end, is about creating memories. We are integral to some of life's most important moments, the weddings, the engagements, the graduations, the birthdays, the first dates. In the end, unless we're dealing with the top teir of the culinary world, we should create a palate for those life moments to be played upon. Nowhere does ego fit into that scenario.
I love that last half. Wonderfully put.
I generally don't watch the cooking shows where the chefs come out and are all "I'm here to decimate the competition". if you have to call yourself a "bad ass", you're probably not a "bad ass" at all. Call me a sap, but I still love the Guy's Grocery Games-type stuff where it's a family and it's a celebration. I've written before about the guy from New Hampshire, with something like $20,000 on the line, playing for his kid who died at like eight of cancer, and he ended his cook and went over to help his competitor who was much older and struggling to get done. "I'm here to help, chef, tell me what to do!". I'm even tearing up thinking about it.
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I still watch Hell's Kitchen but it does make me uncomfy with the attitude they're promoting.
That said, I greatly prefer TGBBS (before the switch) and even shows like MasterChef and MasterChef Jr have become less competitive and toxic and more about people supporting each other.
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MasterChef Jr. is downright wholesome.
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Sounds like shitty management tbh.
More likely poor planning by engineers. Most problems we solve are complex, sometimes you don't know how things truly play out, even with all the testing, until it goes into production. You think if a change in twitter's code lead to the site being down, that the employees should just go home and wait until their next shift to fix it? That's not on management. It's part of being an engineer in a production environment. Of course shitty management could be an issue, but in my experiences, management isn't the one doing the work that causes the issues.
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Sounds like shitty management tbh.
Some jobs are necessities and you just can't leave them when something goes wrong. You as a worker are paid to fix things when they've gone wrong.
Imagine if it was a hospital that was having technical issues and you were the only one available to fix the issue. Who knows how long it'll take, this is why diagnosis are done to find out what is wrong. Depending on the severity of the issue and priority of the situation, a worker could be there for hours.
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Sounds like shitty management tbh.
Some jobs are necessities and you just can't leave them when something goes wrong. You as a worker are paid to fix things when they've gone wrong.
Imagine if it was a hospital that was having technical issues and you were the only one available to fix the issue. Who knows how long it'll take, this is why diagnosis are done to find out what is wrong. Depending on the severity of the issue and priority of the situation, a worker could be there for hours.
You staff correctly and not have one person work so many hours. It's illegal to do so.
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Sounds like shitty management tbh.
Some jobs are necessities and you just can't leave them when something goes wrong. You as a worker are paid to fix things when they've gone wrong.
Imagine if it was a hospital that was having technical issues and you were the only one available to fix the issue. Who knows how long it'll take, this is why diagnosis are done to find out what is wrong. Depending on the severity of the issue and priority of the situation, a worker could be there for hours.
You staff correctly and not have one person work so many hours. It's illegal to do so.
Then what happens when you can't staff correctly because you're short staffed due to people not wanting to do these jobs?
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Sounds like shitty management tbh.
Some jobs are necessities and you just can't leave them when something goes wrong. You as a worker are paid to fix things when they've gone wrong.
Imagine if it was a hospital that was having technical issues and you were the only one available to fix the issue. Who knows how long it'll take, this is why diagnosis are done to find out what is wrong. Depending on the severity of the issue and priority of the situation, a worker could be there for hours.
You staff correctly and not have one person work so many hours. It's illegal to do so.
I don't know about that. My Dr. friends all routinely did 24+ hour shifts during their residency at their hospital. It was normal. Although, I always wondered how safe it is to have someone operating without sleep. I must have brought this up to my friends countless times and they seemed to never have an issue. I know they are allowed to nap if it's quiet, but still. I'm not entirely sure it's illegal because it's so common and you can't always just have staff available.
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Then what happens when you can't staff correctly because you're short staffed due to people not wanting to do these jobs?
You raise your wages.
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I don't know about that. My Dr. friends all routinely did 24+ hour shifts during their residency at their hospital. It was normal. Although, I always wondered how safe it is to have someone operating without sleep. I must have brought this up to my friends countless times and they seemed to never have an issue. I know they are allowed to nap if it's quiet, but still. I'm not entirely sure it's illegal because it's so common and you can't always just have staff available.
In the case of long shifts at hospitals you are legally required to get a certain amount of sleep but in practice this doesn't work out. Medical professionals are pretty easy to exploit for extra, unsafe hours simply because if hospitals or surgeries are short staffed, and you don't work, patients suffer, or worse.
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I don't know about other states, but in NY there is no limit on shift-hours. Technically your employer can schedule you for a 24 hour shift, as long as you get paid overtime once you work more than 40 hours/week.
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I don't know about that. My Dr. friends all routinely did 24+ hour shifts during their residency at their hospital. It was normal. Although, I always wondered how safe it is to have someone operating without sleep. I must have brought this up to my friends countless times and they seemed to never have an issue. I know they are allowed to nap if it's quiet, but still. I'm not entirely sure it's illegal because it's so common and you can't always just have staff available.
In the case of long shifts at hospitals you are legally required to get a certain amount of sleep but in practice this doesn't work out. Medical professionals are pretty easy to exploit for extra, unsafe hours simply because if hospitals or surgeries are short staffed, and you don't work, patients suffer, or worse.
I can see that being the case. But to go back to King's point, where do you get extra workers from? You can't just pull Drs out of your ass. And while in residency these people don't make much money at all, they will when they are done, I'm not sure it's something you can fix by raising wages.
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You think if a change in twitter's code lead to the site being down, that the employees should just go home and wait until their next shift to fix it? That's not on management.
No, I think there should be OTHER people to replace them and do the fixes. Understaffing, or having a single point of failure (i.e. only "that guy" can solve the problem) is, for organisations above a certain size, bad management.
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I think in the medical field, residencies are almost like a medical boot camp. Kind of breaks you down a bit to rebuild. It ideally sets you up for real emergencies and helps you sharpen your focus and increase your stamina.
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This is the case in the US certainly, but not universal. Swedish medicals residencies are only required by law to work 40-48 hour weeks, and are guaranteed a rest period of 11 hours out of every 24. Unions can arrange for longer hours/shorter rests through collective agreements though.
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Get ready for the shitshow today on Twitter and all social medias. Brittney Griner swapped with Russian arms dealer Viktor Bout.
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You think if a change in twitter's code lead to the site being down, that the employees should just go home and wait until their next shift to fix it? That's not on management.
No, I think there should be OTHER people to replace them and do the fixes. Understaffing, or having a single point of failure (i.e. only "that guy" can solve the problem) is, for organisations above a certain size, bad management.
We are talking scenarios where it's already all hands on deck. And it's not really possible to have extra employees on standby just for these situations. I've experienced it so often across different companies where there's major upgrades happening and it requires the entire IT department to be on hand. It's not a single point of failure or understaffing. It's simply working through the issues which takes time.
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Get ready for the shitshow today on Twitter and all social medias. Brittney Griner swapped with Russian arms dealer Viktor Bout.
Yeah it's fucked. Actually left the non criminal stuck there.
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Then what happens when you can't staff correctly because you're short staffed due to people not wanting to do these jobs?
You raise your wages.
Do you really think it's that simple?
You think if a change in twitter's code lead to the site being down, that the employees should just go home and wait until their next shift to fix it? That's not on management.
No, I think there should be OTHER people to replace them and do the fixes. Understaffing, or having a single point of failure (i.e. only "that guy" can solve the problem) is, for organisations above a certain size, bad management.
And where would we find these OTHER people if they're already short staffed to begin with? Especially if people are not wanting to work these jobs.
With regards to fast food. I say this as well, and tell my coworkers, if people are not wanting to work these jobs. Then they better not complain when it takes longer to get their food, or if their food doesn't come out correctly because we have people training and do not have a strong work ethic to get shit right.
You should see some of the jobs on the products we receive, I tell my coworkers, "Looks like Bob pushed the wrong button again". We have had bags of Tenders that look like Nuggets, and Boneless Wings that look like tenders. Not to mention the awesome tape job of the boxes we receive where some weren't even sealed completely.
That's why I say, if humans desire things and want things, humans have to work for it. But if no one wants to put in the work, what do you expect the end results to be?
No matter what we do, humans will always have to put in work.
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Get ready for the shitshow today on Twitter and all social medias. Brittney Griner swapped with Russian arms dealer Viktor Bout.
I'm glad she's out.
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We are talking scenarios where it's already all hands on deck. And it's not really possible to have extra employees on standby just for these situations.
Why not?
I've experienced it so often across different companies where there's major upgrades happening and it requires the entire IT department to be on hand.
And why does it take the entire department? Or are you telling me its impossible to plan a code update such that it can be handled by a smaller team over a longer time?
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Get ready for the shitshow today on Twitter and all social medias. Brittney Griner swapped with Russian arms dealer Viktor Bout.
Yeah it's fucked. Actually left the non criminal stuck there.
I do hope Americans are now aware of other nations sovereignty and to respect their culture, which includes the laws and customs of the people.
It's the same as if you were to visit my Tribe, One such rule is no pictures, and if you do, prepare to have your camera confiscated. This includes using your phone camera.
Also, Russia isn't stupid enough to release their prisoner who is held on Espionage. Compared to someone who is a prisoner for a plant. Who really got what they wanted?
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Then what happens when you can't staff correctly because you're short staffed due to people not wanting to do these jobs?
You raise your wages.
Do you really think it's that simple?
In the liberal fantasy world where money grows on trees, sure. In the real world, with budgets, and accountability, and what not, no. Not even close.
I'm kidding, sort of, but no, it's not at all that simple.
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If money doesn't grow on trees, why do banks have so many branches?
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If money doesn't grow on trees, why do banks have so many branches?
Well played, my friend. Well played. :)
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We are talking scenarios where it's already all hands on deck. And it's not really possible to have extra employees on standby just for these situations.
Why not?
I've experienced it so often across different companies where there's major upgrades happening and it requires the entire IT department to be on hand.
And why does it take the entire department? Or are you telling me its impossible to plan a code update such that it can be handled by a smaller team over a longer time?
I think the point is, there isn't always that "longer time". Managing irregular demand for a service industry - and in this case, Marc is a service industry to his organization - has been a problem for management since day one.
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If money doesn't grow on trees, why do banks have so many branches?
Well played, my friend. Well played. :)
Thank you, I'll be here all evening!
As to a more serious reply though, if you are a business who can not find employees at current wage offerings, what other knobs do you have to turn other than raising compensation? Or shuttering, obviously.
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If money doesn't grow on trees, why do banks have so many branches?
Well played, my friend. Well played. :)
Thank you, I'll be here all evening!
As to a more serious reply though, if you are a business who can not find employees at current wage offerings, what other knobs do you have to turn other than raising compensation? Or shuttering, obviously.
Improve your efficiency, automate (where you can), outsource, relocate. All those cost money too, but they are in different accounting buckets and so have different impacts to the reported numbers.
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We are talking scenarios where it's already all hands on deck. And it's not really possible to have extra employees on standby just for these situations.
Why not?
It just doesn't make business sense. Maybe if we are talking low skill work where I can pull someone off the street to be standby. But when you are talking about specialized work, you don't really have options that make any sense. You can find consultants, but to train them and pay them just to be an extra hand one time? Doesn't make any sense.
We actually had a major outage at work a few weeks ago, it didn't impact me and I don't know the exact details of what happened, but it caused a large amount of people to work the entire weekend to fix it. The Monday morning after, management put a full out stop to all work going on until that situation was figured out (root cause analysis) and people could get some rest from working the weekend. These are situations where management can help, but management can't predict all failure scenarios and certainly can't just find someone to fix them on the spot besides the current employees.
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Get ready for the shitshow today on Twitter and all social medias. Brittney Griner swapped with Russian arms dealer Viktor Bout.
I'm glad she's out.
Same. Was it a good deal? Of course not, it's Russia. Sounds like Whelan wasn't an option in any way, shape or form. I think when the alternative was to let her suffer and die in a Russian prison, they did the right thing.
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This country is so divided that this definitely will cause a bigger riff. Lucky for me, I'll just scroll on by.
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We are talking scenarios where it's already all hands on deck. And it's not really possible to have extra employees on standby just for these situations.
Why not?
It just doesn't make business sense. Maybe if we are talking low skill work where I can pull someone off the street to be standby. But when you are talking about specialized work, you don't really have options that make any sense. You can find consultants, but to train them and pay them just to be an extra hand one time? Doesn't make any sense.
We actually had a major outage at work a few weeks ago, it didn't impact me and I don't know the exact details of what happened, but it caused a large amount of people to work the entire weekend to fix it. The Monday morning after, management put a full out stop to all work going on until that situation was figured out (root cause analysis) and people could get some rest from working the weekend. These are situations where management can help, but management can't predict all failure scenarios and certainly can't just find someone to fix them on the spot besides the current employees.
Marc's right about this and this is (partly) what I meant when I said it's impossible and impractical to make a corporation accommodate 10,000 different attitudes as to "work/life balance". If a mission critical job takes 1, 5, or 10 more hours to complete, and one employee says "sorry, it's 4:59 and I'm done at 5:00", that shouldn't automatically require the company to assume all the expenses of bringing on a temp, training them, insuring them, etc. in order to accommodate that one employee.
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This country is so divided that this definitely will cause a bigger riff. Lucky for me, I'll just scroll on by.
It's certainly a struggle to decode. I mean, whether she thought that was "minor transgression" or not, it's not her call. As a human, I'm glad she's home, but I'm not a very sympathetic consumer here. Look at all the time, effort, money, and political good will that was consumed because - and this is just one side of the argument, I know - she felt entitled to her cannabis.
It's interesting that one thing Griner, Bout, and Whelan all have in common is that they are innocent and victims of "sham prosecutions".
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I think the biggest sham here is the hoops we jumped through, and the resources we spent to free this individual, when the substance she was arrested for is still a schedule 1 narcotic in this country. This is a huge slap in the face to anyone currently in jail for cannabis, or in debt because of legal fees associated with a cannabis case, or didn't get/apply for a job because they're a cannabis user.
We moved mountains to bring this woman home over a substance that's still being used to ruin people's lives here. It's a crock of shit if you ask me. She's going to come home and be free to do whatever she wants, and she'll probably make a shitload of money in the process. I don't have a problem with us getting her back, but where's the urgency here in righting our wrongs?
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I think the biggest sham here is the hoops we jumped through, and the resources we spent to free this individual, when the substance she was arrested for is still a schedule 1 narcotic in this country. This is a huge slap in the face to anyone currently in jail for cannabis, or in debt because of legal fees associated with a cannabis case, or didn't get/apply for a job because they're a cannabis user.
We moved mountains to bring this woman home over a substance that's still being used to ruin people's lives here. It's a crock of shit if you ask me. She's going to come home and be free to do whatever she wants, and she'll probably make a shitload of money in the process. I don't have a problem with us getting her back, but where's the urgency here in righting our wrongs?
Generally people are in jail because they broke a law, no?
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Yeah...I don't think this is a 'win' at all for this Administration. It's just another example of their ineptitude and weakness IMO but I'm not going to sit here and argue about it because it's not surprising and right in line with what you should expect from them. It's a joke that we freed a sinister criminal who was and probably still is heavily motivated to do all he can to kill Americans or make sure they can be killed for a 'celebrity' who thought she was above the law and got caught.
Not to mention Brian's point. She's going to be hailed as an F'n hero as she comes home....what a joke.
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I feel the same as some here, I'm happy she's back from a humane perspective. For one, I don't think anyone should be locked up for simple marijuana possession, let alone do hard labor for 10 years. But I also don't think it's fair to let her go free when we gave up someone far worse and we have our own problems back home. It's a political chess move that Russia won IMO.
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I think the biggest sham here is the hoops we jumped through, and the resources we spent to free this individual, when the substance she was arrested for is still a schedule 1 narcotic in this country. This is a huge slap in the face to anyone currently in jail for cannabis, or in debt because of legal fees associated with a cannabis case, or didn't get/apply for a job because they're a cannabis user.
We moved mountains to bring this woman home over a substance that's still being used to ruin people's lives here. It's a crock of shit if you ask me. She's going to come home and be free to do whatever she wants, and she'll probably make a shitload of money in the process. I don't have a problem with us getting her back, but where's the urgency here in righting our wrongs?
Generally people are in jail because they broke a law, no?
Yes. I think what Chino is saying is that there seems to be difference standards for different people. I think Brian and I might differ slightly on what that means* but the point is, there are people in jail here in the States for exactly what Britany Griner did, and she's going to be - like Gary said - hailed as a hero upon her arrival whereas those others are... right exactly where they started.
* Even though I'm for the legalization of weed, when these people acted it was illegal and they knew that and should bear the consequences. This isn't about whether weed should be legal or not, but whether these people believe they are above the law or not, and whether these people, when faced with a law, were going to comply or not based on their own precious opinions.
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I feel the same as some here, I'm happy she's back from a humane perspective. For one, I don't think anyone should be locked up for simple marijuana possession, let alone do hard labor for 10 years. But I also don't think it's fair to let her go free when we gave up someone far worse and we have our own problems back home. It's a political chess move that Russia won IMO.
100% agree with the bolded. I've watched enough episodes of 'Locked Up Abroad' to know that you don't want to break another countries drug law though....and....that's what she did.
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What's the alternative? Let her do 10 years of forced labour on general principle? We know she broke the law, and I know the American mantra is play stupid games. . . but this wasn't even a fair application of Russian law.
Also, I'm not sure we should dismiss the possibility that the guy we released dies in a mysterious boat explosion six months from now.
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What's the alternative? Let her do 10 years of forced labour on general principle? We know she broke the law, and I know the American mantra is play stupid games. . . but this wasn't even a fair application of Russian law.
Also, I'm not sure we should dismiss the possibility that the guy we released dies in a mysterious boat explosion six months from now.
It's certainly not fair, but sadly, I think yes, that or a better trade deal. I definitely have sympathy for her, but I don't like the way Russia worked us here. Also, if we are going to play the future possibilities, you can't rule out this guy is involved in something that results in innocent lives lost either and I see that more likely than him being offed. I say that because you know that if he ends up being involved in something, it's going to tear people apart here in the US on this issue and that's exactly what Russia wants.
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What's the alternative? Let her do 10 years of forced labour on general principle? We know she broke the law, and I know the American mantra is play stupid games. . . but this wasn't even a fair application of Russian law.
Also, I'm not sure we should dismiss the possibility that the guy we released dies in a mysterious boat explosion six months from now.
More likely, drafted into military service and freezes to death in January.
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What's the alternative? Let her do 10 years of forced labour on general principle? We know she broke the law, and I know the American mantra is play stupid games. . . but this wasn't even a fair application of Russian law.
Also, I'm not sure we should dismiss the possibility that the guy we released dies in a mysterious boat explosion six months from now.
That'd be fine and all but this was a completely lopsided 'trade'. Not even in the same realm. If you ask me it was a failure up front for the US to allow Russia to even get to the point of holding her trial...much less sentencing her to what they did. But the 'trade' is a joke plain and simple....if it took her spending another 6 months or year in jail in order to get an even swap of some sort then whatever. But I don't see how this can be considered a 'win' by any means for the US or this administration.
I'm sure we will hear how great they are though for the next couple weeks leading into the inevitable softball 48 Hour interview with her and her wife.
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What's the alternative? Let her do 10 years of forced labour on general principle? We know she broke the law, and I know the American mantra is play stupid games. . . but this wasn't even a fair application of Russian law.
Also, I'm not sure we should dismiss the possibility that the guy we released dies in a mysterious boat explosion six months from now.
It's certainly not fair, but sadly, I think yes, that or a better trade deal. I definitely have sympathy for her, but I don't like the way Russia worked us here. Also, if we are going to play the future possibilities, you can't rule out this guy is involved in something that results in innocent lives lost either and I see that more likely than him being offed. I say that because you know that if he ends up being involved in something, it's going to tear people apart here in the US on this issue and that's exactly what Russia wants.
You don't think we've 'worked' Russia a time or two ourselves with this sort of thing? These swaps happen regularly enough, and it's come to be seen as a game of sorts. You win some, you lose some.
And honest question here, do any of the people outraged by this even know if her counterpart was being held here fairly? Do we know if he was actually guilty of anything? It's not like we have a great track record when it comes to arresting foreign nationals, after all. Again, part of the game. I really don't know, myself, but I'm not sure as anybody's actually looked into the circumstances of his imprisonment before rushing out to rage about how humiliating this whole thing is.
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For one, I personally am not outraged. I think the deal isn't good is all. It doesn't impact my life. And I have no idea if either party was rightfully detained here. Can you name me an example where the US came out the winner of such a trade though? It may make me think differently here as I'm sure you are right that it's not always a win or loss, but a trade off over time. Just seems like we got worked on this one and it also seems like it wasn't even a negotiation if Whalen was always off the table.
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Russia is not stupid.
Because of an American making a stupid accidental mistake and disregarding exactly where she was going, disregarding the cultural laws of Russia, this was the perfect hostage they needed to assert a trade deal.
I like how the White House thought they would get the marine too. Russia is like, fuck no, we're not dumbasses like you.
Also, Nationalism is a big thing to consider when dealing with POWs, such as if their nationalism is almost religious, they will fight to the death for their nation. It's why I see America's
lack of Nationalism quite troubling.
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What's the alternative? Let her do 10 years of forced labour on general principle? We know she broke the law, and I know the American mantra is play stupid games. . . but this wasn't even a fair application of Russian law.
Also, I'm not sure we should dismiss the possibility that the guy we released dies in a mysterious boat explosion six months from now.
It's certainly not fair, but sadly, I think yes, that or a better trade deal. I definitely have sympathy for her, but I don't like the way Russia worked us here. Also, if we are going to play the future possibilities, you can't rule out this guy is involved in something that results in innocent lives lost either and I see that more likely than him being offed. I say that because you know that if he ends up being involved in something, it's going to tear people apart here in the US on this issue and that's exactly what Russia wants.
You don't think we've 'worked' Russia a time or two ourselves with this sort of thing? These swaps happen regularly enough, and it's come to be seen as a game of sorts. You win some, you lose some.
And honest question here, do any of the people outraged by this even know if her counterpart was being held here fairly? Do we know if he was actually guilty of anything? It's not like we have a great track record when it comes to arresting foreign nationals, after all. Again, part of the game. I really don't know, myself, but I'm not sure as anybody's actually looked into the circumstances of his imprisonment before rushing out to rage about how humiliating this whole thing is.
This was where I was going when I said "one thing they all have in common...".
I would also offer that it's a bad assumption to assume that we, the people, have all the information necessary to make an informed decision here. It's a game between countries to be sure, but I would venture to say it's also a game with respect to playing to the sympathies of the constituents.
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For one, I personally am not outraged.
Didn't mean to suggest you were.
I think the deal isn't good is all. It doesn't impact my life. And I have no idea if either party was rightfully detained here. Can you name me an example where the US came out the winner of such a trade though? It may make me think differently here as I'm sure you are right that it's not always a win or loss, but a trade off over time. Just seems like we got worked on this one and it also seems like it wasn't even a negotiation if Whalen was always off the table.
Nope. It goes without saying that these things being made public is the exception, not the rule. To be honest, I've kind of just assumed that all countries occasionally nab foreign nationals from time to time on trumped up charges just to keep around for leverage when needed.
I also don't know if Bout was busted fairly or not. I see that he was nabbed in a US led sting operation, and quite frankly I'm more than a little put off at how we handle those things. Like I said, not the best track record. In any case the dude did just about half of his 25 year sentence. I'm not really apt to call this a win or a loss, nor do I think they're really applicable.
Something else I think needs consideration is that Griner was never going to do 10 years of hard labor. She was going to hang herself, die from her own hunger strike, or get shanked. She was only useful so long as she was a bargaining chip, and after that she's not.
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Something else I think needs consideration is that Griner was never going to do 10 years of hard labor. She was going to hang herself, die from her own hunger strike, or get shanked. She was only useful so long as she was a bargaining chip, and after that she's not.
I was curious what the penal colonies were like, ended up reading some article last week, it actually stated that since she was a high value prisoner, she likely was not going to get the typical brutal treatment from other inmates/guards that you would expect from someone like her (african america, homosexual). I mean, who knows, but I'm not entirely sure she wouldn't of survived 10 years (but like you said, it also depends if her status were to change due to political situations). It's almost impossible to tell, and really, hard to find a lot of details of what even goes on there. I'll be interested in what she has to say about her experience, that's for sure.
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I would also offer that it's a bad assumption to assume that we, the people, have all the information necessary to make an informed decision here. It's a game between countries to be sure, but I would venture to say it's also a game with respect to playing to the sympathies of the constituents.
And that is the only aspect that we could reasonably call a win/loss. It has nothing to do with the value of the respective chips on the table. Those are a wash in the big picture. It has to do with making half of the country think that America and/or Biden lost the game, while it's still going on, and in actuality will never end. Somehow I seriously doubt that Putin cares about Bout. I doubt he cares what Bout might do in the future. I think he cares a great deal about making so many Americans embarrassed about how we lost, though. That's always been what "Russia!" was about.
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Something else I think needs consideration is that Griner was never going to do 10 years of hard labor. She was going to hang herself, die from her own hunger strike, or get shanked. She was only useful so long as she was a bargaining chip, and after that she's not.
I was curious what the penal colonies were like, ended up reading some article last week, it actually stated that since she was a high value prisoner, she likely was not going to get the typical brutal treatment from other inmates/guards that you would expect from someone like her (african america, homosexual). I mean, who knows, but I'm not entirely sure she wouldn't of survived 10 years (but like you said, it also depends if her status were to change due to political situations). It's almost impossible to tell, and really, hard to find a lot of details of what even goes on there. I'll be interested in what she has to say about her experience, that's for sure.
Interesting. I'd actually read an article claiming pretty much the opposite. She was constantly being abused by guards and prisoners alike. No idea which is right, but I'd certainly assumed [wrongly, I suppose] that the brutal version was correct based on what we know of Russian prisons (a very different sort of brutality than American prisons).
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Something else I think needs consideration is that Griner was never going to do 10 years of hard labor. She was going to hang herself, die from her own hunger strike, or get shanked. She was only useful so long as she was a bargaining chip, and after that she's not.
I was curious what the penal colonies were like, ended up reading some article last week, it actually stated that since she was a high value prisoner, she likely was not going to get the typical brutal treatment from other inmates/guards that you would expect from someone like her (african america, homosexual). I mean, who knows, but I'm not entirely sure she wouldn't of survived 10 years (but like you said, it also depends if her status were to change due to political situations). It's almost impossible to tell, and really, hard to find a lot of details of what even goes on there. I'll be interested in what she has to say about her experience, that's for sure.
Who knows; but it would be a mistake to take the self-righteous, victim American viewpoint. That would be further playing into Putin's hands, in terms of El Barto's post above. That's only going to continue the internal debate, not cool it down.
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I would also offer that it's a bad assumption to assume that we, the people, have all the information necessary to make an informed decision here.
Yeah - we don't. There are so many issues at play in this prisoner exchange especially since UAE and the Saudis are involved. I'm certain we don't even understand half of what transpired to make this work. Maybe more information will come out later. But I doubt we will ever know the whole story.
“I am so glad that Brittney Griner is on her way home,” David Whelan, Paul’s twin brother, said in a statement Thursday via ABC’s Jay O’Brien. “As the family member of a Russian hostage, I can literally only imagine the joy she will have, being reunited with her loved ones, and in time for the holidays. There is no greater success than for a wrongful detainee to be free and for them to go home. The Biden Administration made the right decision to bring Ms. Griner home, and to make the deal that was possible, rather than waiting for one that wasn’t going to happen.”
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Let's talk about wrongful imprisonment and mention the one we have here in the US...Leonard Peltier. He is wrongfully held captive, and if the government really cared about racial relations, and all that jazz, they should release Leonard Peltier.
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...but the point is, there are people in jail here in the States for exactly what Britany Griner did, and she's going to be - like Gary said - hailed as a hero upon her arrival whereas those others are... right exactly where they started.
Not only in America. To my knowledge there are somewhere between 15 and 20 other American citizens currently in Russian jails/penal colonies for the exact same offence Griner admitted to (most recent example - Marc Fogel, an American teacher who was arrested last year at a Russian airport with "medical marijuana" in his luggage and was subsequently sentenced to 14 years in a penal colony*), but they receive little to no coverage in your media because...well, we all know why, we're just afraid to say it out loud.
As for Griner's treatment over here, nothing I've read suggests she was subjected to any worse than anyone else in that colony. Yeah it's a very grim existence, Russian labour camps break most human beings to varying extents, but I don't think it was any worse for her than it was for the other inmates.
And not that I expect anyone to want to come here right now, but guys and girls of DTF, for fuck's sake, I cannot stress this strongly enough: if you travel to Russia, do NOT bring ANY amount of drugs with you. It's the law here. You can think it's an insane law but that won't change it, and fuck every single one of these idiots in the US government endlessly describing Griner as "wrongfully detained". She was arrested for the exact same thing that would get her arrested in some states of the USA. Would she be sentenced in the US to 9 years? No, but she wasn't in the US, she was in another country with other laws. Stop with the arrogant "wrongfully detained" spiel, Mr Biden/Sullivan/Kirby/Blinken.
* https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/2022/07/28/marc-fogel-teacher-russia-prison/
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
I kind meant in practice, rather than on paper. Maybe this is what you mean, as well, but I'm not sure. If your wife got busted with a joint would she actually wind up doing the 9 years, or is there some sort of probation avenue or something? I ask because over here what the law says and how it's applied are very different things.
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
I kind meant in practice, rather than on paper. Maybe this is what you mean, as well, but I'm not sure. If your wife got busted with a joint would she actually wind up doing the 9 years, or is there some sort of probation avenue or something? I ask because over here what the law says and how it's applied are very different things.
The example you gave, no, but it's important to be clear about the offence in question here and the particular penal code under which she was found guilty (admitted to, Mr Biden/Kirby/ok you get it) - if Brittney had been caught smoking a joint in an apartment in Moscow she would not have been sentenced to anywhere close to 9 years. The issue here is she was bringing it into the country. It's a very different and much more severely punished crime under Russian law.
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You would think her agent or herself would know better. I have to believe she knew it and threw caution in the wind.
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I feel the same as some here, I'm happy she's back from a humane perspective. For one, I don't think anyone should be locked up for simple marijuana possession, let alone do hard labor for 10 years. But I also don't think it's fair to let her go free when we gave up someone far worse and we have our own problems back home. It's a political chess move that Russia won IMO.
This is pretty much where I am. I am glad she is free and coming home, but definitely think Biden got worked by Putin, who is off somewhere having a good laugh about what a massive win this was for him.
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
I kind meant in practice, rather than on paper. Maybe this is what you mean, as well, but I'm not sure. If your wife got busted with a joint would she actually wind up doing the 9 years, or is there some sort of probation avenue or something? I ask because over here what the law says and how it's applied are very different things.
The example you gave, no, but it's important to be clear about the offence in question here and the particular penal code under which she was found guilty (admitted to, Mr Biden/Kirby/ok you get it) - if Brittney had been caught smoking a joint in an apartment in Moscow she would not have been sentenced to anywhere close to 9 years. The issue here is she was bringing it into the country. It's a very different and much more severely punished crime under Russian law.
Valid point. Fair enough. :tup
I still have to ask, though, if Mrs. Dave had brought a joint of that fine, dank-ass Manchester bud home with her, would she have gotten 9 years?
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I feel the same as some here, I'm happy she's back from a humane perspective. For one, I don't think anyone should be locked up for simple marijuana possession, let alone do hard labor for 10 years. But I also don't think it's fair to let her go free when we gave up someone far worse and we have our own problems back home. It's a political chess move that Russia won IMO.
This is pretty much where I am. I am glad she is free and coming home, but definitely think Biden got worked by Putin, who is off somewhere having a good laugh about what a massive win this was for him.
Quite possibly, but probably not for the reasons Americans think.
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Japan has really strict drug laws as well. If she was detained in Japan rather than Russia, is this still a story?
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
I kind meant in practice, rather than on paper. Maybe this is what you mean, as well, but I'm not sure. If your wife got busted with a joint would she actually wind up doing the 9 years, or is there some sort of probation avenue or something? I ask because over here what the law says and how it's applied are very different things.
The example you gave, no, but it's important to be clear about the offence in question here and the particular penal code under which she was found guilty (admitted to, Mr Biden/Kirby/ok you get it) - if Brittney had been caught smoking a joint in an apartment in Moscow she would not have been sentenced to anywhere close to 9 years. The issue here is she was bringing it into the country. It's a very different and much more severely punished crime under Russian law.
Valid point. Fair enough. :tup
I still have to ask, though, if Mrs. Dave had brought a joint of that fine, dank-ass Manchester bud home with her, would she have gotten 9 years?
Honestly - it's possible, yes. Unlikely in truth (she's the mother of a 1-year-old; that carries weight) but possible.
I'm not going to pretend that Brittney hasn't been used as an opportune political pawn, because she has been. The moment Russia got hold of a black lesbian who very publicly refused to stand for the US anthem, Putin saw an opportunity to have a little fun with a Democrat administration (like I alluded to earlier, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that most Americans are totally unaware of all the straight white American men currently doing time in Russian jails for the same offence as Brittney - your media couldn't give a single fuck about them). 9 years was the higher end of the sentence she could have received, and giving her that sentence was meant all along to force Biden to agree to a wildly uneven deal or else forever be known as the Democrat president who let a black LGBT person rot in Russia. I think that if Putin had insisted on Biden doing his press conference today naked as part of the deal he would have agreed to it. Griner was used as a pawn and her sentence was harsh. But my point is that it was also within our law. There WILL be Russians doing 9 years' porridge for the same crime, depending on the judge.
What's been irritating to me about this story is that it's the whole dumb Pussy Riot story all over again. For those who don't remember, 4 girls entered a Russian Orthodox church during a service, smashed it up, assaulted a woman, desecrated the place, flashed their tits and sang profane songs. That's about 5 different types of illegal in Russia. The US government's response? "Russia is jailing innocent protesters!" Uh huh. Let an American 'punk band' pull that exact same shit in a church in Alabama and see what happens. But when it comes to Russia everyone is "unlawfully detained", like Griner apparently has been, as well as Paul "4 nationalities" Whelan.
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I know she admitted in court to be guilty, but I feel like there was some grey area here as to whether she actually had the vape pen on her. I thought I read somewhere, at least initially, that she was claiming she was innocent. The courts there seem to be a bit less fair and I think it was possible she was pressured to admit the fault because that would be the only way the US could save her. I'm not sure if there's any legitimacy to what I just wrote, but being I've read it, it makes me wonder if she could legitimately not have done anything wrong in the first place. That "could" be why the US government is saying wrongfully detained. What do I know though, I guess we can find out more once she makes public statements and interviews.
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
I kind meant in practice, rather than on paper. Maybe this is what you mean, as well, but I'm not sure. If your wife got busted with a joint would she actually wind up doing the 9 years, or is there some sort of probation avenue or something? I ask because over here what the law says and how it's applied are very different things.
The example you gave, no, but it's important to be clear about the offence in question here and the particular penal code under which she was found guilty (admitted to, Mr Biden/Kirby/ok you get it) - if Brittney had been caught smoking a joint in an apartment in Moscow she would not have been sentenced to anywhere close to 9 years. The issue here is she was bringing it into the country. It's a very different and much more severely punished crime under Russian law.
Valid point. Fair enough. :tup
I still have to ask, though, if Mrs. Dave had brought a joint of that fine, dank-ass Manchester bud home with her, would she have gotten 9 years?
Honestly - it's possible, yes. Unlikely in truth (she's the mother of a 1-year-old; that carries weight) but possible.
I'm not going to pretend that Brittney hasn't been used as an opportune political pawn, because she has been. The moment Russia got hold of a black lesbian who very publicly refused to stand for the US anthem, Putin saw an opportunity to have a little fun with a Democrat administration (like I alluded to earlier, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that most Americans are totally unaware of all the straight white American men currently doing time in Russian jails for the same offence as Brittney - your media couldn't give a single fuck about them). 9 years was the higher end of the sentence she could have received, and giving her that sentence was meant all along to force Biden to agree to a wildly uneven deal or else forever be known as the Democrat president who let a black LGBT person rot in Russia. I think that if Putin had insisted on Biden doing his press conference today naked as part of the deal he would have agreed to it. Griner was used as a pawn and her sentence was harsh. But my point is that it was also within our law. There WILL be Russians doing 9 years' porridge for the same crime, depending on the judge.
What's been irritating to me about this story is that it's the whole dumb Pussy Riot story all over again. For those who don't remember, 4 girls entered a Russian Orthodox church during a service, smashed it up, assaulted a woman, desecrated the place, flashed their tits and sang profane songs. That's about 5 different types of illegal in Russia. The US government's response? "Russia is jailing innocent protesters!" Uh huh. Let an American 'punk band' pull that exact same shit in a church in Alabama and see what happens. But when it comes to Russia everyone is "unlawfully detained", like Griner apparently has been, as well as Paul "4 nationalities" Whelan.
Thanks. My point of curiosity was simply whether or not she'd been treated more harshly to be used as a future pawn than otherwise normal Russkies.
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Dave, you need to stop what you're doing.
Joe Biden displayed how American strength and resolve can bring an innocent American home in exchange for the lord of war. Her imprisonment was unjust, and not the kind of thing we'd ever do here. Griner is only famous because she plays a sport that is subsidized by a more famous one. And while I don't want to make fun of the WNBA chauvinistically, at some point her social stature has been pumped up way beyond her actual prestige and accomplishments represents the best of America.
I don't know why you'd suggest what is obviously true, that America is run by an administration that is enslaved by identity politics that the only reason we exchanged for her is because of her identity. Putin is not as smart as some of his apologists think, but unlike the people who run the US at least kind of able to think practically just a big bad stupid evil man like Trump is. America cares deeply about every citizen of ours unjustly imprisoned in Russia. When the Biden administration says they'll continue to work on other Russian prisoners I assume they're just saying words to mollify the people mad about the others who have not been let free. While I don't agree with the American conservative line that freeing the ex-Marine is necessarily better, since he's theoretically more able to "take it", the Biden admin's priorities seem off here. And for the US to waste its best bargaining chip on a celebrity to me seems like government malpractice, they really mean it!
Pussy Riot was performing activism against the oppressive patriarchal institution of religion, and your words suggesting otherwise are perfectly reasonable violence against marginalized female atheist communities.
You subtly mock Griner for speaking out against US society and culture in a way that clearly demonstrates she hates it, which makes it weird how politically popular it was among certain people to help her out. For all of Putin's flaws, the man at least seems to like the country he's in charge of speaking out against injustice in America, but maybe if you EDUCATED YOURSELF you could see that you're just saying what Putin wants you to say.
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Let's bring some levity here.
(https://i.postimg.cc/ZnhsPnhX/FB-IMG-1670542247200.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/1nJKs9XK)
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Dave, you need to stop what you're doing.
Joe Biden displayed how American strength and resolve can bring an innocent American home in exchange for the lord of war. Her imprisonment was unjust, and not the kind of thing we'd ever do here. Griner is only famous because she plays a sport that is subsidized by a more famous one. And while I don't want to make fun of the WNBA chauvinistically, at some point her social stature has been pumped up way beyond her actual prestige and accomplishments represents the best of America.
I don't know why you'd suggest what is obviously true, that America is run by an administration that is enslaved by identity politics that the only reason we exchanged for her is because of her identity. Putin is not as smart as some of his apologists think, but unlike the people who run the US at least kind of able to think practically just a big bad stupid evil man like Trump is. America cares deeply about every citizen of ours unjustly imprisoned in Russia. When the Biden administration says they'll continue to work on other Russian prisoners I assume they're just saying words to mollify the people mad about the others who have not been let free. While I don't agree with the American conservative line that freeing the ex-Marine is necessarily better, since he's theoretically more able to "take it", the Biden admin's priorities seem off here. And for the US to waste its best bargaining chip on a celebrity to me seems like government malpractice, they really mean it!
Pussy Riot was performing activism against the oppressive patriarchal institution of religion, and your words suggesting otherwise are perfectly reasonable violence against marginalized female atheist communities.
You subtly mock Griner for speaking out against US society and culture in a way that clearly demonstrates she hates it, which makes it weird how politically popular it was among certain people to help her out. For all of Putin's flaws, the man at least seems to like the country he's in charge of speaking out against injustice in America, but maybe if you EDUCATED YOURSELF you could see that you're just saying what Putin wants you to say.
As bad as that is, it seems to me that what you're doing is just as bad. But what do I know?
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Wait, how many layers of irony are we on here? Now even I'm confused.
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El Barto. It's the world we live in. Extremism. No compromise. No working things out for the betterment of all. Just your beliefs and damn all others.
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I totally got the humor that was being played at. If someone started taking it seriously either I missed something or they did.
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Kinda feel this is heading down P/R territory now, if its not already here.
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Kinda feel this is heading down P/R territory now, if its not already here.
For which I'll accept my portion of the blame. I said my piece, I'll leave it there.
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I did the thing as well. But I also couldn't pass that one up.
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What's the alternative? Let her do 10 years of forced labour on general principle? We know she broke the law, and I know the American mantra is play stupid games. . . but this wasn't even a fair application of Russian law.
Also, I'm not sure we should dismiss the possibility that the guy we released dies in a mysterious boat explosion six months from now.
I believe he's more likely to "fall" out of a window. :lol
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What's the alternative? Let her do 10 years of forced labour on general principle? We know she broke the law, and I know the American mantra is play stupid games. . . but this wasn't even a fair application of Russian law.
Also, I'm not sure we should dismiss the possibility that the guy we released dies in a mysterious boat explosion six months from now.
I believe he's more likely to "fall" out of a window. :lol
To be clear, I was figuring that we or our buddies would blow him up. Putin's got no reason to. Vlad's no doubt hoping he'll do something to embarrass us to further the divide.
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
I kind meant in practice, rather than on paper. Maybe this is what you mean, as well, but I'm not sure. If your wife got busted with a joint would she actually wind up doing the 9 years, or is there some sort of probation avenue or something? I ask because over here what the law says and how it's applied are very different things.
For the record, Griner did not have a "joint"; it was my understanding that it was more than just a small, personal amount. There were canisters of hashish oil, enough for the duration of her stay (she was playing in a Russian league in her off season, so her trip was not a couple of days in length).
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Less than a gram of hashish oil in a vape cartridge is what every source I’ve seen said.
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Yea, .702 grams between two containers. One with .252 grams and one with .45 grams.
Is that a lot? Not sure. No idea about hash oil. Maybe it’s a whole lot and just sounds like a little.
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You would think her agent or herself would know better. I have to believe she knew it and threw caution in the wind.
I don't know her, and I am loathe to speculate on what someone thinks, but this is part and parcel with a LOT of what I write here: we - Americans - are growing this conception - a MISconception, mind you - that we are above the law. I don't like a law? Fuck it, I'll fight (read: whine) about it later. We have an entire thread on this here; weed has taken on a mythology of sorts. People smoking openly on the streets in advance of the laws ACTUALLY being passed, daring law enforcement to act. The move to expunge the record of many, many people WHO KNEW THEY WERE BREAKING THE LAW WHEN THEY DID IT.
She's a unicorn of sorts; she's a 6'9" female African American married lesbian playing an international sport at a high level. She's been breaking convention for years, in many ways in a good way (this is not an indictment) but in some ways not (she famously was involved in a public domestic violence incident with her previous partner). It's not a stretch to think that this wasn't a major concern for her.
I'm with Dave in the sense that it's arrogant and presumptuous to assume that we can go anywhere in the world and just expect to get the same luxuries - luxuries that so many here bitch and complain about, mind you - everywhere. We DO live in an exceptional country in many ways, but that forest seems to be forgotten amongst the trees we address each day.
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Japan has really strict drug laws as well. If she was detained in Japan rather than Russia, is this still a story?
Ask Paul McCartney.
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You would think her agent or herself would know better. I have to believe she knew it and threw caution in the wind.
I don't know her, and I am loathe to speculate on what someone thinks, but this is part and parcel with a LOT of what I write here: we - Americans - are growing this conception - a MISconception, mind you - that we are above the law. I don't like a law? Fuck it, I'll fight (read: whine) about it later. We have an entire thread on this here; weed has taken on a mythology of sorts. People smoking openly on the streets in advance of the laws ACTUALLY being passed, daring law enforcement to act. The move to expunge the record of many, many people WHO KNEW THEY WERE BREAKING THE LAW WHEN THEY DID IT.
She's a unicorn of sorts; she's a 6'9" female African American married lesbian playing an international sport at a high level. She's been breaking convention for years, in many ways in a good way (this is not an indictment) but in some ways not (she famously was involved in a public domestic violence incident with her previous partner). It's not a stretch to think that this wasn't a major concern for her.
I'm with Dave in the sense that it's arrogant and presumptuous to assume that we can go anywhere in the world and just expect to get the same luxuries - luxuries that so many here bitch and complain about, mind you - everywhere. We DO live in an exceptional country in many ways, but that forest seems to be forgotten amongst the trees we address each day.
I also believe in her head, she can't go without it either. It's always a confluence of reasons.
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Had she stated whether or not she had brought the stuff with her before into Russia before?
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I want to smack the next person who plays the "she only had to go to Russia to play basketball because we don't pay her enough here" card. Does anyone watch the WNBA? I would love it if someone saying that crap had someone immediately ask them to name their 10 favorite WNBA players on the spot (meaning, they cannot go google it and find out names). I would bet my yearly salary that 95% of them wouldn't be able to do it.
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I want to smack the next person who plays the "she only had to go to Russia to play basketball because we don't pay her enough here" card. Does anyone watch the WNBA? I would love it if someone saying that crap had someone immediately ask them to name their 10 favorite WNBA players on the spot (meaning, they cannot go google it and find out names). I would bet my yearly salary that 95% of them wouldn't be able to do it.
It's cult behavior. Reason is not driving it.
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
I kind meant in practice, rather than on paper. Maybe this is what you mean, as well, but I'm not sure. If your wife got busted with a joint would she actually wind up doing the 9 years, or is there some sort of probation avenue or something? I ask because over here what the law says and how it's applied are very different things.
For the record, Griner did not have a "joint"; it was my understanding that it was more than just a small, personal amount. There were canisters of hashish oil, enough for the duration of her stay (she was playing in a Russian league in her off season, so her trip was not a couple of days in length).
In many states, including Tejas, any amount of concentrate is a felony. What I was getting at with Dave, though, is that just because it's statutorily a felony doesn't mean they're going to ding you for one. I've never been particularly worried about it here. I'd say that Russia's law is a little outdated, and a little overboard, but not terribly unreasonable compared to some states here.
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Nevada used to be hella strict like that. Any possession equaled jail time.
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I want to smack the next person who plays the "she only had to go to Russia to play basketball because we don't pay her enough here" card. Does anyone watch the WNBA? I would love it if someone saying that crap had someone immediately ask them to name their 10 favorite WNBA players on the spot (meaning, they cannot go google it and find out names). I would bet my yearly salary that 95% of them wouldn't be able to do it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I745Ajeq_B8
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I want to smack the next person who plays the "she only had to go to Russia to play basketball because we don't pay her enough here" card. Does anyone watch the WNBA? I would love it if someone saying that crap had someone immediately ask them to name their 10 favorite WNBA players on the spot (meaning, they cannot go google it and find out names). I would bet my yearly salary that 95% of them wouldn't be able to do it.
I'm not on twitter really or following this super closely, but is this a big argument being made?
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I want to smack the next person who plays the "she only had to go to Russia to play basketball because we don't pay her enough here" card. Does anyone watch the WNBA? I would love it if someone saying that crap had someone immediately ask them to name their 10 favorite WNBA players on the spot (meaning, they cannot go google it and find out names). I would bet my yearly salary that 95% of them wouldn't be able to do it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I745Ajeq_B8
I knew what that was before I even opened it. I thought about posting it myself, but I got busy.
It's all so true.
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I want to smack the next person who plays the "she only had to go to Russia to play basketball because we don't pay her enough here" card. Does anyone watch the WNBA? I would love it if someone saying that crap had someone immediately ask them to name their 10 favorite WNBA players on the spot (meaning, they cannot go google it and find out names). I would bet my yearly salary that 95% of them wouldn't be able to do it.
I'm not on twitter really or following this super closely, but is this a big argument being made?
I assumed manufactured outrage. Some borderline nobody tweeted about it and it became the face of liberal outrage.
Also, I don't understand Kev's objection. It sounds to me like he thinks the lack of pay is deserved, and that's fine. I honestly don't have a problem with that outside of my objection towards capitalism and America's work fetish. In our culture it's certainly correct. But why object to somebody pointing it out if it's true?
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I want to smack the next person who plays the "she only had to go to Russia to play basketball because we don't pay her enough here" card. Does anyone watch the WNBA? I would love it if someone saying that crap had someone immediately ask them to name their 10 favorite WNBA players on the spot (meaning, they cannot go google it and find out names). I would bet my yearly salary that 95% of them wouldn't be able to do it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I745Ajeq_B8
I knew what that was before I even opened it. I thought about posting it myself, but I got busy.
It's all so true.
As did I. Bill Burr is the best.
Also, I don't understand Kev's objection. It sounds to me like he thinks the lack of pay is deserved, and that's fine. I honestly don't have a problem with that outside of my objection towards capitalism and America's work fetish. In our culture it's certainly correct. But why object to somebody pointing it out if it's true?
I object because the comment is almost blaming those of us who do not watch the WNBA (see: most Americans) for her being arrested, meaning she had to go to Russia to play because we all suck and do not support their league.
As for if the lack of pay is deserved, I think it comes back to, you are worth what someone is willing to pay you. Almost no one watches the WNBA, so their pay is crap compared to NBA players for example. Hell, I think the Kartrashians are a shit stain on society, but many love watching their stupid show and buying up everything they sell, hence they make a crap ton of money.
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I want to smack the next person who plays the "she only had to go to Russia to play basketball because we don't pay her enough here" card. Does anyone watch the WNBA? I would love it if someone saying that crap had someone immediately ask them to name their 10 favorite WNBA players on the spot (meaning, they cannot go google it and find out names). I would bet my yearly salary that 95% of them wouldn't be able to do it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I745Ajeq_B8
I knew what that was before I even opened it. I thought about posting it myself, but I got busy.
It's all so true.
It is a hilarious way of telling the truth. Watching him rant on many issues makes my day.
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I object because the comment is almost blaming those of us who do not watch the WNBA (see: most Americans) for her being arrested, meaning she had to go to Russia to play because we all suck and do not support their league.
That is not at all how I interpreted it, but if it's how you did I can't fault you for that. I can merely point out that there are other interpretations. In my case I saw it as an indictment America's work culture and fetish. "Work or die, and if one job's not enough work as many as necessary to get by. Work builds character!" You might not, but that's an interpretation I agree with.
I don't disagree that they shouldn't be paid like NBA players. I'm only suggesting that "they have to go and play in Russia to put food on the table" isn't an invalid criticism because it's true. I suppose they could flip burgers in their off-time, but that's hardly a better scenario.
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Yea, .702 grams between two containers. One with .252 grams and one with .45 grams.
Is that a lot? Not sure. No idea about hash oil. Maybe it’s a whole lot and just sounds like a little.
if you add them both together, it's almost a gram which is the full size vape cartridge that sells for around 100 bucks at dispensaries. It's not a large amount in size but could last awhile depending on usage (potentially her entire stay). My question has always been, did she truly have this on her or was she set up?
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
I kind meant in practice, rather than on paper. Maybe this is what you mean, as well, but I'm not sure. If your wife got busted with a joint would she actually wind up doing the 9 years, or is there some sort of probation avenue or something? I ask because over here what the law says and how it's applied are very different things.
For the record, Griner did not have a "joint"; it was my understanding that it was more than just a small, personal amount. There were canisters of hashish oil, enough for the duration of her stay (she was playing in a Russian league in her off season, so her trip was not a couple of days in length).
In many states, including Tejas, any amount of concentrate is a felony. What I was getting at with Dave, though, is that just because it's statutorily a felony doesn't mean they're going to ding you for one. I've never been particularly worried about it here. I'd say that Russia's law is a little outdated, and a little overboard, but not terribly unreasonable compared to some states here.
Out of interest though, what do you think would happen to me if I flew in to Dallas Fort Worth on an Aeroflot flight from Moscow and the good folk at TSA found some cannabis in my bags? Slap on the wrist or "your cellmate's gonna find you awful purty son"?
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I object because the comment is almost blaming those of us who do not watch the WNBA (see: most Americans) for her being arrested, meaning she had to go to Russia to play because we all suck and do not support their league.
That is not at all how I interpreted it, but if it's how you did I can't fault you for that. I can merely point out that there are other interpretations. In my case I saw it as an indictment America's work culture and fetish. "Work or die, and if one job's not enough work as many as necessary to get by. Work builds character!" You might not, but that's an interpretation I agree with.
I don't disagree that they shouldn't be paid like NBA players. I'm only suggesting that "they have to go and play in Russia to put food on the table" isn't an invalid criticism because it's true. I suppose they could flip burgers in their off-time, but that's hardly a better scenario.
They do go over there for the money in the off season. Players get paid a million for a shortened season there.
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It is a hilarious way of telling the truth. Watching him rant on many issues makes my day.
You and me both.
I object because the comment is almost blaming those of us who do not watch the WNBA (see: most Americans) for her being arrested, meaning she had to go to Russia to play because we all suck and do not support their league.
That is not at all how I interpreted it, but if it's how you did I can't fault you for that. I can merely point out that there are other interpretations. In my case I saw it as an indictment America's work culture and fetish. "Work or die, and if one job's not enough work as many as necessary to get by. Work builds character!" You might not, but that's an interpretation I agree with.
I don't disagree that they shouldn't be paid like NBA players. I'm only suggesting that "they have to go and play in Russia to put food on the table" isn't an invalid criticism because it's true. I suppose they could flip burgers in their off-time, but that's hardly a better scenario.
The average WNBA salary, assuming my google search is accurate, is just a shade over 100K a year, so these ladies aren't starving. Now, if Russia is offering a million to play for a spell over there, as Joe said, I get that that is hard to resist, but it comes with risks.
I will reiterate that I am glad she is coming home, but I just think there are many layers to this.
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
I kind meant in practice, rather than on paper. Maybe this is what you mean, as well, but I'm not sure. If your wife got busted with a joint would she actually wind up doing the 9 years, or is there some sort of probation avenue or something? I ask because over here what the law says and how it's applied are very different things.
For the record, Griner did not have a "joint"; it was my understanding that it was more than just a small, personal amount. There were canisters of hashish oil, enough for the duration of her stay (she was playing in a Russian league in her off season, so her trip was not a couple of days in length).
In many states, including Tejas, any amount of concentrate is a felony. What I was getting at with Dave, though, is that just because it's statutorily a felony doesn't mean they're going to ding you for one. I've never been particularly worried about it here. I'd say that Russia's law is a little outdated, and a little overboard, but not terribly unreasonable compared to some states here.
Out of interest though, what do you think would happen to me if I flew in to Dallas Fort Worth on an Aeroflot flight from Moscow and the good folk at TSA found some cannabis in my bags? Slap on the wrist or "your cellmate's gonna find you awful purty son"?
It's kind of tough because we've got overlapping jurisdictions. As I understand it, TSA doesn't look for drugs and would prefer not to find them. If they cant avoid finding them they'll either throw them out or, in the case of larger amounts, refer to local agencies. Texas would almost certainly treat you like anybody else. There is a distinction between flower and concentrates, which works both for and against you. They're harder to find, and thus easier for TSA to "not find." However the penalties are more severe, and you probably would get busted and go to jail. If it were a joint or a quarter-bag it's unlikely they'd actually bust you. In either case, my hunch is that you'd pay a fine and do a couple of years of probation, at worst. Unless you're a smuggler it's just not that big a deal.
All of this is academic, though. It's not TSA that would get you coming into the country, but Customs and Border Control. They are enforcing federal law. Individual agents would likely take a similar stance to TSA, honestly. It's just not worth their time when simply flushing it is a viable option. At the same time it's certainly possible that they might want to find their own Brittany Griner, in which case you'd get something similar to her treatment. In truth, and if I'm wrong correct me on this, I suspect the Russian airport cops that nabbed her were looking for her and knew they were going to nail her while her flight was still in the air. I seriously doubt this was just a random airport bust. They set out to bust the girl and succeeded. If that happens here then you're off to a federal prison, obviously. Otherwise you're unlikely to do any actual time. Again, fines and probation.
Basically, you're either just some random stoner and highly unlikely to go to prison, most likely, or you're a potential poker chip in the big game, and gods have mercy on you.
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Christ, if they're paying her that much I'd say fuck this country and become Dave's next door neighbor. Seriously, she's a giant black lesbian. Most of the world will treat her better than we will. Move someplace civilized and make more money?
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I will reiterate that I am glad she is coming home, but I just think there are many layers to this.
I get that and I'm not trying to give you grief about it. It's just that as you said there are many layers to this, and when that's the case people being so opinionated tends to set off alarm bells in my head. I suppose the more complex the situation is the less it lends itself to reasonable outrage.
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The problem is Britney Griner herself. If I didn't know better I'd say she was designed in a lab to be what the right reflexively hates and the left reflexively loves.
The right doesn't want to admit that they think she deserved what happened to her.
The left doesn't want to admit that trading an arms dealer for a women's basketball player engaged in anti-American activism is a humiliation.
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The problem is Britney Griner herself. If I didn't know better I'd say she was designed in a lab to be what the right reflexively hates and the left reflexively loves.
No doubt. That's why I figure the Ruskies knew all along that they really wanted to bust her.
The right doesn't want to admit that they think she deserved what happened to her.
The left doesn't want to admit that trading an arms dealer for a women's basketball player engaged in anti-American activism is a humiliation.
For my part I don't really see it either way. It's a more complicated thing than most people want to realize. We like our arguments simple. I don't think she deserved it, but I don't think it was unreasonable, either. I also don't find it humiliating, but that's only because I don't think the game is played the way people assume. People act as if we traded a rook for a pawn, and in reality they're both pawns in the grand scheme of things. Like I said, we win some rounds, we lose some rounds, and the game goes right on happening.
The humiliation for me is that so many Americans see this as so one-dimensionally transactional with no real concept of how all of this works. If Putin's laughing at us I think this is why.
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The humiliation for me is that so many Americans see this as so one-dimensionally transactional with no real concept of how all of this works.
We elected a reality TV star and then a Senile joke of an old man as our president back to back. It makes sense that 'we' don't get in to the details on this stuff
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Yeah, I really don't get how this is a "humiliation".
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The problem is Britney Griner herself. If I didn't know better I'd say she was designed in a lab to be what the right reflexively hates and the left reflexively loves.
No doubt. That's why I figure the Ruskies knew all along that they really wanted to bust her.
The right doesn't want to admit that they think she deserved what happened to her.
The left doesn't want to admit that trading an arms dealer for a women's basketball player engaged in anti-American activism is a humiliation.
For my part I don't really see it either way. It's a more complicated thing than most people want to realize. We like our arguments simple. I don't think she deserved it, but I don't think it was unreasonable, either. I also don't find it humiliating, but that's only because I don't think the game is played the way people assume. People act as if we traded a rook for a pawn, and in reality they're both pawns in the grand scheme of things. Like I said, we win some rounds, we lose some rounds, and the game goes right on happening.
The humiliation for me is that so many Americans see this as so one-dimensionally transactional with no real concept of how all of this works. If Putin's laughing at us I think this is why.
The chess analogy is actually useful.
We definitely did not give up a Queen. Some people probably think we did. Ah well.
I'm willing to entertain the possibility we didn't give up a Rook. But we definitely didn't give up a pawn. At least a Bishop/Knight.
There's a possibility the Biden admin traded a Bishop/Knight for a pawn in order to gain some kind of broader positional advantage. But I've seen nothing from the Biden admin that makes me think they're that smart.
The far more likely possibility is that we gave up a Bishop/Knight or a Rook, and the Biden admin thinks they got a Rook or a Queen back.
Humiliation was too strong of a word. But unless you believe we're playing 4D Chess this is an unforced, self-inflicted L and the left is tapdancing something awful to avoid admitting it.
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The problem is Britney Griner herself. If I didn't know better I'd say she was designed in a lab to be what the right reflexively hates and the left reflexively loves.
The right doesn't want to admit that they think she deserved what happened to her.
The left doesn't want to admit that trading an arms dealer for a women's basketball player engaged in anti-American activism is a humiliation.
As a resident lefty, I don't 'reflexively love' her, I could care less about her, but support her right to exist as she is. I honestly had no idea who she was before all this. (I could care less about men's basketball, much less women's)
The deal was stupid, it shows a good deal of other countries that we'll sacrifice an even trade to score political points, and I can totally see other countries licking their chops over this. I'd actually gather Joe et al lost points, as a good deal of my 'lefty' friends also agree this was a shit deal to score points.
Her right to free speech has nothing to do with this, she's still an American and has the right to redress her government.
I'm still glad she's home, and hope Mr Whelan can come home soon as well.
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I could care less about her,
HOW MUCH LESS, LONESTAR?
*ahem*
In any case, these analogies all rely on the assumption that both sides are playing the same game, rather than just using the same board. Losing a queen means nothing if you are playing Racing Kings.
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The problem is Britney Griner herself. If I didn't know better I'd say she was designed in a lab to be what the right reflexively hates and the left reflexively loves.
No doubt. That's why I figure the Ruskies knew all along that they really wanted to bust her.
The right doesn't want to admit that they think she deserved what happened to her.
The left doesn't want to admit that trading an arms dealer for a women's basketball player engaged in anti-American activism is a humiliation.
For my part I don't really see it either way. It's a more complicated thing than most people want to realize. We like our arguments simple. I don't think she deserved it, but I don't think it was unreasonable, either. I also don't find it humiliating, but that's only because I don't think the game is played the way people assume. People act as if we traded a rook for a pawn, and in reality they're both pawns in the grand scheme of things. Like I said, we win some rounds, we lose some rounds, and the game goes right on happening.
The humiliation for me is that so many Americans see this as so one-dimensionally transactional with no real concept of how all of this works. If Putin's laughing at us I think this is why.
The chess analogy is actually useful.
We definitely did not give up a Queen. Some people probably think we did. Ah well.
I'm willing to entertain the possibility we didn't give up a Rook. But we definitely didn't give up a pawn. At least a Bishop/Knight.
There's a possibility the Biden admin traded a Bishop/Knight for a pawn in order to gain some kind of broader positional advantage. But I've seen nothing from the Biden admin that makes me think they're that smart.
The far more likely possibility is that we gave up a Bishop/Knight or a Rook, and the Biden admin thinks they got a Rook or a Queen back.
Humiliation was too strong of a word. But unless you believe we're playing 4D Chess this is an unforced, self-inflicted L and the left is tapdancing something awful to avoid admitting it.
In fact I think we're playing Fizbin.
I've maintained all along that we have no way of declaring this a win or a loss because we haven't the foggiest notion of what the details actually are, will be, or have been. Nor do we understand the nature of the game that's being played. For that I think to assume that either one of them is more important, useful, meaningful, dangerous, or Christlike than the other is a mistake. Hence they're both pawns.
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As a resident lefty, I don't 'reflexively love' her, I could care less about her, but support her right to exist as she is. I honestly had no idea who she was before all this. (I could care less about men's basketball, much less women's)
The deal was stupid, it shows a good deal of other countries that we'll sacrifice an even trade to score political points, and I can totally see other countries licking their chops over this. I'd actually gather Joe et al lost points, as a good deal of my 'lefty' friends also agree this was a shit deal to score points.
Her right to free speech has nothing to do with this, she's still an American and has the right to redress her government.
I'm still glad she's home, and hope Mr Whelan can come home soon as well.
You're thinking about this like a human.
When I say "the left" or "the right", I'm talking about the NPCs who put ideology over thinking. Still too vague of wording on my part.
In fact I think we're playing Fizbin.
I've maintained all along that we have no way of declaring this a win or a loss because we haven't the foggiest notion of what the details actually are, will be, or have been. Nor do we understand the nature of the game that's being played. For that I think to assume that either one of them is more important, useful, meaningful, dangerous, or Christlike than the other is a mistake. Hence they're both pawns.
I disagree, but acknowledge you might be right and am not sure what other angles there are to explore.
There was a phrase for that once.
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As a resident lefty, I don't 'reflexively love' her, I could care less about her, but support her right to exist as she is. I honestly had no idea who she was before all this. (I could care less about men's basketball, much less women's)
The deal was stupid, it shows a good deal of other countries that we'll sacrifice an even trade to score political points, and I can totally see other countries licking their chops over this. I'd actually gather Joe et al lost points, as a good deal of my 'lefty' friends also agree this was a shit deal to score points.
Her right to free speech has nothing to do with this, she's still an American and has the right to redress her government.
I'm still glad she's home, and hope Mr Whelan can come home soon as well.
You're thinking about this like a human.
Yeah, it's a bad habit of mine.
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Dammit Lonestar! ;D
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I disagree, but acknowledge you might be right and am not sure what other angles there are to explore.
There was a phrase for that once.
Remember when Kennedy "won" the Cuban missile crisis? Or when Reagan "won" the Iranian hostage crisis? Sometimes these things are a lot harder to qualify than the people realize.
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Maybe the most surprising aspect of this story for me is how down-the-middle the media has covered it. Equal sides have been represented. Even on PBS last night. Not sure what to deduce from this but it's a pleasant experience.
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Remember when this thread was about Twitter?
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I want to smack the next person who plays the "she only had to go to Russia to play basketball because we don't pay her enough here" card. Does anyone watch the WNBA? I would love it if someone saying that crap had someone immediately ask them to name their 10 favorite WNBA players on the spot (meaning, they cannot go google it and find out names). I would bet my yearly salary that 95% of them wouldn't be able to do it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I745Ajeq_B8
"No one in the WNBA got COVID!"
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I object because the comment is almost blaming those of us who do not watch the WNBA (see: most Americans) for her being arrested, meaning she had to go to Russia to play because we all suck and do not support their league.
That is not at all how I interpreted it, but if it's how you did I can't fault you for that. I can merely point out that there are other interpretations. In my case I saw it as an indictment America's work culture and fetish. "Work or die, and if one job's not enough work as many as necessary to get by. Work builds character!" You might not, but that's an interpretation I agree with.
I don't disagree that they shouldn't be paid like NBA players. I'm only suggesting that "they have to go and play in Russia to put food on the table" isn't an invalid criticism because it's true. I suppose they could flip burgers in their off-time, but that's hardly a better scenario.
C'mon; a WNBA player - that is, a woman who performed at a high level for a local professional team or a local collegiate team - does not have to "go to Russia" or "flip burgers" to achieve a decent, "living" wage. Sue Bird has a job in Connecticut for the rest of her life.
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Out of curiosity, do Russians get 10 year sentences for it? That's what's puzzled me.
Yes. Cannabis in Russia is included in the 'List I' of narcotic and psychoactive substances. Russian law says that for the crime Brittney admitted to (yes, Mr Biden/Blinken/Kirby/Sullivan - admitted to), 9 years is the sentence. If she'd had a little more (as Marc Fogel did) it could have been anywhere up to 20 years (for certain amounts it is actually a life sentence). These laws apply equally to Russians and foreigners.
Russia could not possibly be clearer on this issue: by all means drink alcohol until your ears bleed, but do NOT try to bring Class I narcotics across the border, regardless of the amount or whether you have a doctor's note from America saying it's for your glaucoma.
I kind meant in practice, rather than on paper. Maybe this is what you mean, as well, but I'm not sure. If your wife got busted with a joint would she actually wind up doing the 9 years, or is there some sort of probation avenue or something? I ask because over here what the law says and how it's applied are very different things.
For the record, Griner did not have a "joint"; it was my understanding that it was more than just a small, personal amount. There were canisters of hashish oil, enough for the duration of her stay (she was playing in a Russian league in her off season, so her trip was not a couple of days in length).
In many states, including Tejas, any amount of concentrate is a felony. What I was getting at with Dave, though, is that just because it's statutorily a felony doesn't mean they're going to ding you for one. I've never been particularly worried about it here. I'd say that Russia's law is a little outdated, and a little overboard, but not terribly unreasonable compared to some states here.
Out of interest though, what do you think would happen to me if I flew in to Dallas Fort Worth on an Aeroflot flight from Moscow and the good folk at TSA found some cannabis in my bags? Slap on the wrist or "your cellmate's gonna find you awful purty son"?
It's kind of tough because we've got overlapping jurisdictions. As I understand it, TSA doesn't look for drugs and would prefer not to find them. If they cant avoid finding them they'll either throw them out or, in the case of larger amounts, refer to local agencies. Texas would almost certainly treat you like anybody else. There is a distinction between flower and concentrates, which works both for and against you. They're harder to find, and thus easier for TSA to "not find." However the penalties are more severe, and you probably would get busted and go to jail. If it were a joint or a quarter-bag it's unlikely they'd actually bust you. In either case, my hunch is that you'd pay a fine and do a couple of years of probation, at worst. Unless you're a smuggler it's just not that big a deal.
All of this is academic, though. It's not TSA that would get you coming into the country, but Customs and Border Control. They are enforcing federal law. Individual agents would likely take a similar stance to TSA, honestly. It's just not worth their time when simply flushing it is a viable option. At the same time it's certainly possible that they might want to find their own Brittany Griner, in which case you'd get something similar to her treatment. In truth, and if I'm wrong correct me on this, I suspect the Russian airport cops that nabbed her were looking for her and knew they were going to nail her while her flight was still in the air. I seriously doubt this was just a random airport bust. They set out to bust the girl and succeeded. If that happens here then you're off to a federal prison, obviously. Otherwise you're unlikely to do any actual time. Again, fines and probation.
Basically, you're either just some random stoner and highly unlikely to go to prison, most likely, or you're a potential poker chip in the big game, and gods have mercy on you.
Tell Dave not to bring an undisclosed, unregistered gun to the airport though. They flush drugs, but someone showed up at Bradley the other day with a handgun and it made the nightly news. And I say this knowing that that's not what Griner did, but to highlight that each jurisdiction, each country has their issues that they focus on that may be different than you're used to in your own "home country". You should, as a global traveler, know that going in. When I was traveling internationally for work, I did.
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The problem is Britney Griner herself. If I didn't know better I'd say she was designed in a lab to be what the right reflexively hates and the left reflexively loves.
No doubt. That's why I figure the Ruskies knew all along that they really wanted to bust her.
The right doesn't want to admit that they think she deserved what happened to her.
The left doesn't want to admit that trading an arms dealer for a women's basketball player engaged in anti-American activism is a humiliation.
For my part I don't really see it either way. It's a more complicated thing than most people want to realize. We like our arguments simple. I don't think she deserved it, but I don't think it was unreasonable, either. I also don't find it humiliating, but that's only because I don't think the game is played the way people assume. People act as if we traded a rook for a pawn, and in reality they're both pawns in the grand scheme of things. Like I said, we win some rounds, we lose some rounds, and the game goes right on happening.
The humiliation for me is that so many Americans see this as so one-dimensionally transactional with no real concept of how all of this works. If Putin's laughing at us I think this is why.
Might be the best post of the entire conversation. :)
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I object because the comment is almost blaming those of us who do not watch the WNBA (see: most Americans) for her being arrested, meaning she had to go to Russia to play because we all suck and do not support their league.
That is not at all how I interpreted it, but if it's how you did I can't fault you for that. I can merely point out that there are other interpretations. In my case I saw it as an indictment America's work culture and fetish. "Work or die, and if one job's not enough work as many as necessary to get by. Work builds character!" You might not, but that's an interpretation I agree with.
I don't disagree that they shouldn't be paid like NBA players. I'm only suggesting that "they have to go and play in Russia to put food on the table" isn't an invalid criticism because it's true. I suppose they could flip burgers in their off-time, but that's hardly a better scenario.
C'mon; a WNBA player - that is, a woman who performed at a high level for a local professional team or a local collegiate team - does not have to "go to Russia" or "flip burgers" to achieve a decent, "living" wage. Sue Bird has a job in Connecticut for the rest of her life.
I posted that before it was pointed out what they actually make. I suppose I should have looked it up first, my bad, but it was also in reference to the way I see America's values insofar as work and survival go, which was my greater point (and one I stand by).
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I object because the comment is almost blaming those of us who do not watch the WNBA (see: most Americans) for her being arrested, meaning she had to go to Russia to play because we all suck and do not support their league.
That is not at all how I interpreted it, but if it's how you did I can't fault you for that. I can merely point out that there are other interpretations. In my case I saw it as an indictment America's work culture and fetish. "Work or die, and if one job's not enough work as many as necessary to get by. Work builds character!" You might not, but that's an interpretation I agree with.
I don't disagree that they shouldn't be paid like NBA players. I'm only suggesting that "they have to go and play in Russia to put food on the table" isn't an invalid criticism because it's true. I suppose they could flip burgers in their off-time, but that's hardly a better scenario.
C'mon; a WNBA player - that is, a woman who performed at a high level for a local professional team or a local collegiate team - does not have to "go to Russia" or "flip burgers" to achieve a decent, "living" wage. Sue Bird has a job in Connecticut for the rest of her life.
I posted that before it was pointed out what they actually make. I suppose I should have looked it up first, my bad, but it was also in reference to the way I see America's values insofar as work and survival go, which was my greater point (and one I stand by).
I didn't mean to pound you so hard there, sorry! But even if they weren't making $100k, even if they were making far less, at least here in CT, those players that excelled at Uconn get perks that make salary an inconsistent measure. I make more than an average WNBA player, but before I moved last year, I lived in a town with a former star Uconn women's player, and she's not hurting for opportunity (not to mention the perks I've personally seen her get in local establishments). Now where I am, I'm just over the border from the home town of another former Uconn women's program star and again, she's not hurting for opportunity. Even the players that didn't make a national splash, they have name recognition and opportunities that result from that.
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I will reiterate that I am glad she is coming home, but I just think there are many layers to this.
I get that and I'm not trying to give you grief about it. It's just that as you said there are many layers to this, and when that's the case people being so opinionated tends to set off alarm bells in my head. I suppose the more complex the situation is the less it lends itself to reasonable outrage.
Perhaps. I just face palm at the reactions. The people who wanted her to be stuck in Russia to suffer in prison for nine years are gross, and the people who assume anyone who isn't wanting to throw a parade for this deal is "insert your favorite -ism" are gross as well. I know, I know, it's a small minority on each side, but they make the most noise, and it's frustrating as hell.
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While I've disagreed with Barto on this particular topic, I agree with where his head is at.
I say this as someone who's had a lot of unreasonable opinions - There is some kind of (metaphorical) virus or (metaphorical) demonic possession in the air that is turning into NPCs. As someone who's seen multiple people in my personal life fall victim to it, I understand the paranoia about making sure other people aren't infected.
Worse, whatever the disease is, I've never seen anyone get better once infected. It can be only managed or progress further.
I say this without any irony - When a bunch of my friends started getting the NPC virus, I was bad about being a real life hot take machine (and still can't help myself sometimes) and my life was still screwed up. Nobody would have (or should have) taken life advice from me. I wish I was in a place in my life where I could have told them to stop going down that road and they would have listened. People make their own choices, but I still feel like I failed.
The worst part is, I still don't know what to tell people. I am but an eternal contrarian. When the culture shifts and people get more level-headed (this stuff goes in cycles), I'll be the one accusing everyone of a lack of conviction. We all have our own curses.
But my bigger point is that, whatever else, screening for and trying to slow the spread of the NPC virus is imperative, even if it's annoying sometimes.
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NPC virus, eh? That's a pretty good way to look at it. People really do seem to be turning into the automatons they're being programed to be.
Personally, I blame capitalism and democracy, but that's probably a subject for a different thread--I don't want to make XJD cry. I will say, though, that it's not a new disease. It's just spiraling out of control as the methods of spreading it become far more effective.
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Hey, if you know me you know I'm always happy to blame capitalism. But yes, this thread has veered quite far into P/R territory now. I think any further discussion of the Prisoner exchange situation would be served best having its own thread over there.
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https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1601894132573605888?s=46&t=aPmpwiNPoT4ZycUOCo-wBA
This is so pathetic and cringe, just the most basic maga shit post.
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https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1601894132573605888?s=46&t=aPmpwiNPoT4ZycUOCo-wBA
This is so pathetic and cringe, just the most basic maga shit post.
But yet, people just can't ignore it and scroll past it. People just have to also express their feelings.
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https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1601894132573605888?s=46&t=aPmpwiNPoT4ZycUOCo-wBA
This is so pathetic and cringe, just the most basic maga shit post.
But yet, people just can't ignore it and scroll past it. People just have to also express their feelings.
And as you noted, they don't. "I'm leaving Twitter" is turning into the 2022/2023 version of the '90s empty liberal threat to "move to Canada" if [insert end of democracy candidate is elected].
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Never been on Twitter; always lived in Canada. Suck it you spineless US Liberals. :P
But yeah... that veiled threat of moving to Canada is such BS. As soon as people see the tax rates, they usually stop thinking about it. If the Trump era and abolishment of Roe-v-Wade didn't case even a tiny spike in US relocation, I don't see anything will.
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Never been on Twitter; always lived in Canada. Suck it you spineless US Liberals. :P
But yeah... that veiled threat of moving to Canada is such BS. As soon as people see the tax rates, they usually stop thinking about it. If the Trump era and abolishment of Roe-v-Wade didn't case even a tiny spike in US relocation, I don't see anything will.
We've been hearing that for decades; I can remember it since at least the first Iraq War, which was 1990. I'm pretty sure Alec Baldwin threatens it once a year just to stay fresh! (I'm joking here; I actually really like Alec Baldwin, for all his troubles and turmoils).
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I can only speak for myself, but a fair few people I follow(ed) did actually follow through on deactivating or abandoning their accounts. I agree about the threats to emigrate to Canada though. In any case, having even the option to try emigrating is a privilege those most affected by shitty policies can seldom afford.
Musk's comments are unfortunately increasingly on-brand for him.
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Never been on Twitter; always lived in Canada. Suck it you spineless US Liberals. :P
But yeah... that veiled threat of moving to Canada is such BS. As soon as people see the tax rates, they usually stop thinking about it. If the Trump era and abolishment of Roe-v-Wade didn't case even a tiny spike in US relocation, I don't see anything will.
Balking at the tax rate doesn't make much sense. I suppose if your job pays for your insurance than it would, but for me it might well be a tax break. In any case, some people did follow through. My stebrother packed up and moved to Argentina when Dumbass got appointed president. Loved it down there. When things started to turn he moved to Spain.
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"I'm leaving Twitter" is turning into the 2022/2023 version of the '90s empty liberal threat to "move to Canada" if [insert end of democracy candidate is elected].
I get what you mean, but I don't have an issue with celebs announcing they are leaving Twitter. Elton John, who has over a million followers, did it, and if he just left and didn't say anything, many of his followers would wonder where he went. When you have that many followers, it feels like a courtesy to make the announcement, the reasons notwithstanding.
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Never been on Twitter; always lived in Canada. Suck it you spineless US Liberals. :P
But yeah... that veiled threat of moving to Canada is such BS. As soon as people see the tax rates, they usually stop thinking about it. If the Trump era and abolishment of Roe-v-Wade didn't case even a tiny spike in US relocation, I don't see anything will.
Balking at the tax rate doesn't make much sense. I suppose if your job pays for your insurance than it would, but for me it might well be a tax break. In any case, some people did follow through. My stebrother packed up and moved to Argentina when Dumbass got appointed president. Loved it down there. When things started to turn he moved to Spain.
I envy the folks with the guys and ability to make those big moves like that. Can't imagine doing it.
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"I'm leaving Twitter" is turning into the 2022/2023 version of the '90s empty liberal threat to "move to Canada" if [insert end of democracy candidate is elected].
I get what you mean, but I don't have an issue with celebs announcing they are leaving Twitter. Elton John, who has over a million followers, did it, and if he just left and didn't say anything, many of his followers would wonder where he went. When you have that many followers, it feels like a courtesy to make the announcement, the reasons notwithstanding.
Well, like XJ alluded to, I was talking about the actual doing it. Whether they announce it or not, as long as they follow through, it's fine with me. I agree, it would be odd if Elton didn't say ANYTHING, and he has enough class and balls (and clout) to actually do it. There are, I predict, a ton of B-, C-, and D-list celebrities that are going to make a big stink about leaving and then... up their post count.
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I guess some people are waiting to see which way the wind is blowing. Be interesting to see how apple responds to the deliberate price disparity of Twitter Blue.
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I guess some people are waiting to see which way the wind is blowing. Be interesting to see how apple responds to the deliberate price disparity of Twitter Blue.
This is where I am, although Musk seems to have gone full blown Q. I changed some preferences on my account which stopped the promoted tweets and stuff as I was getting a lot of garbage. I blocked Musk outright and keep blocking en masse when I check some of the trending topics. Honestly, I don't know why I'm still there. It's like the morbid thing of watching the house burn down but you can't look away.
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I stayed away from reading retweets and likes long ago and had my browser set up (can't recall how) where the tweets from people I follow is in one separate timeline and the retweets and likes are in a separate timeline in which I never have to visit. I think this has helped me a lot in not getting angry on Twitter as much.
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"I'm leaving Twitter" is turning into the 2022/2023 version of the '90s empty liberal threat to "move to Canada" if [insert end of democracy candidate is elected].
I get what you mean, but I don't have an issue with celebs announcing they are leaving Twitter. Elton John, who has over a million followers, did it, and if he just left and didn't say anything, many of his followers would wonder where he went. When you have that many followers, it feels like a courtesy to make the announcement, the reasons notwithstanding.
Well, like XJ alluded to, I was talking about the actual doing it. Whether they announce it or not, as long as they follow through, it's fine with me. I agree, it would be odd if Elton didn't say ANYTHING, and he has enough class and balls (and clout) to actually do it. There are, I predict, a ton of B-, C-, and D-list celebrities that are going to make a big stink about leaving and then... up their post count.
Probably true. I think the ones who are likely to actually leave are the ones who will do so quietly.
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Never been on Twitter; always lived in Canada. Suck it you spineless US Liberals. :P
But yeah... that veiled threat of moving to Canada is such BS. As soon as people see the tax rates, they usually stop thinking about it. If the Trump era and abolishment of Roe-v-Wade didn't case even a tiny spike in US relocation, I don't see anything will.
Balking at the tax rate doesn't make much sense. I suppose if your job pays for your insurance than it would, but for me it might well be a tax break. In any case, some people did follow through. My stebrother packed up and moved to Argentina when Dumbass got appointed president. Loved it down there. When things started to turn he moved to Spain.
As someone who is from Argentina that decision baffles me :lol. I can, however, understand the move to Spain since I went that route earlier this year.
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https://news.sky.com/story/elon-musks-twitter-dissolves-trust-and-safety-council-just-days-after-its-members-speak-out-12767148
This bodes well.
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Never been on Twitter; always lived in Canada. Suck it you spineless US Liberals. :P
But yeah... that veiled threat of moving to Canada is such BS. As soon as people see the tax rates, they usually stop thinking about it. If the Trump era and abolishment of Roe-v-Wade didn't case even a tiny spike in US relocation, I don't see anything will.
Balking at the tax rate doesn't make much sense. I suppose if your job pays for your insurance than it would, but for me it might well be a tax break. In any case, some people did follow through. My stebrother packed up and moved to Argentina when Dumbass got appointed president. Loved it down there. When things started to turn he moved to Spain.
As someone who is from Argentina that decision baffles me :lol. I can, however, understand the move to Spain since I went that route earlier this year.
Would it have baffled you in 2001? At the time it worked quite well for him. Seems to me his biggest attribute is being able to see which way the tide is turning. He bailed at both of the right times.
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https://news.sky.com/story/elon-musks-twitter-dissolves-trust-and-safety-council-just-days-after-its-members-speak-out-12767148
This bodes well.
Now the former head is forced into hiding after Musk continues his Q fall by using their favorite rallying cry, PEDO!
https://people.com/human-interest/twitter-former-head-of-trust-and-safety-forced-flee-home-following-elon-musk-attacks-reports/
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https://me.mashable.com/tech/23050/after-suspending-the-twitter-profile-that-tracks-his-private-jet-elon-musk-is-no
Funny how the people who cry loudest about free speech seem to change their tune when that speech affects them.
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https://me.mashable.com/tech/23050/after-suspending-the-twitter-profile-that-tracks-his-private-jet-elon-musk-is-no
Funny how the people who cry loudest about free speech seem to change their tune when that speech affects them.
My take is a bit different. This is more of a safety concern that potentially impacts more people than just Musk. Pilot(s), other passengers for instance. There's a lot of nut jobs in this world, some who are deranged enough to pull out a rifle and try to put a few 30.06 rounds into a fuselage of a jet. I have to give him a pass on this one.
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1. The flight information is publicly available. Flightrader24 and the like can track flight paths by the minute.
2. He said mere weeks ago he wasn't going to ban accounts like this, and has unbanned a lot of people who were previously banned for hate speech/doxxing.
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Flight tracker does you no good unless you know Musk is on the plane. Pretty sure that is high security guarded info.
You're free to your take. I'm sticking with mine 😀.
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Isn't it easily trackable because it is his private jet, for his own personal usage, which is registered? The 19 year old does not have secret access or anything.
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Curious to what degree that goes.
If I were to tweet "YO! As of 1:34PM PCT, Jennifer Lopez is eating at McDonalds on Wilshire and blah blah" would that be deleted?
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According to the tweet this guy responded to, if it were close to 1:34, then yes.
(https://preview.redd.it/f90xix4p516a1.jpg?width=452&auto=webp&v=enabled&s=32842f9555a7915764c69e5c6cd096c546f75e13)
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Fair enough. Glad he's consistent at least.
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I wonder how many people caught the details on that map? "Epstein Island".
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I wonder how many people caught the details on that map? "Epstein Island".
12 trips.
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I wonder how many people caught the details on that map? "Epstein Island".
12 trips.
I'm no fan of Musk - no hater either; indifferent - but it's really getting ridiculous how vindictive and black/white people are. You're either a saint, can do no wrong, or, once a line is crossed, there's no evil you won't perpetrate, no failure you're not capable of achieving. Don't any of these people have their own quirks, failures, blind spots?
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I wonder how many people caught the details on that map? "Epstein Island".
12 trips.
I'm no fan of Musk - no hater either; indifferent - but it's really getting ridiculous how vindictive and black/white people are. You're either a saint, can do no wrong, or, once a line is crossed, there's no evil you won't perpetrate, no failure you're not capable of achieving. Don't any of these people have their own quirks, failures, blind spots?
Exactly. We've ALL spent our time on Epstein island.
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I wonder how many people caught the details on that map? "Epstein Island".
12 trips.
I'm no fan of Musk - no hater either; indifferent - but it's really getting ridiculous how vindictive and black/white people are. You're either a saint, can do no wrong, or, once a line is crossed, there's no evil you won't perpetrate, no failure you're not capable of achieving. Don't any of these people have their own quirks, failures, blind spots?
Exactly. We've ALL spent our time on Epstein island.
Completely agree Adami and Stads. I don't even pay attention and I'm on Twitter. Didn't even know about it until I saw these posts. I feel my life is better not getting involved in it.
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I wonder how many people caught the details on that map? "Epstein Island".
12 trips.
I'm no fan of Musk - no hater either; indifferent - but it's really getting ridiculous how vindictive and black/white people are. You're either a saint, can do no wrong, or, once a line is crossed, there's no evil you won't perpetrate, no failure you're not capable of achieving. Don't any of these people have their own quirks, failures, blind spots?
Exactly. We've ALL spent our time on Epstein island.
WTF? I never got my invite. Now I'm really mad at the guy.
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I wonder how many people caught the details on that map? "Epstein Island".
12 trips.
I'm no fan of Musk - no hater either; indifferent - but it's really getting ridiculous how vindictive and black/white people are. You're either a saint, can do no wrong, or, once a line is crossed, there's no evil you won't perpetrate, no failure you're not capable of achieving. Don't any of these people have their own quirks, failures, blind spots?
Exactly. We've ALL spent our time on Epstein island.
Well, I mean it slightly differently; it's not that we all spent time on Epstein Island - my invite must've got lost with Bart's - but "being a bad businessman" doesn't make you "a pedophile" and yet that's where we are. I made a list of all the things that Trump has been accused of - I'm thinking really about how since he's a bad President, then clearly Melania can't POSSIBLY love him or whatever - and it's the same here.
I'm making this point because it dovetails to the other conversation we're having. The people that hate Trump - and now Musk - are often the first people to be pointing out the "hate" in others. It's funny how those same people seem to always miraculously find a way to distinguish THEIR personal hate from the hate they claim to despise so much. As if someone hating one person is any different than hating the group they belong to (but that's the rub; it's NOT different, because it's NOT really one person, it's one person as a symbol of a group).
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I don't think they're connected. Maybe people think Trump is a bad president and, for completely unrelated reasons, think Melania probably doesn't love him.
Maybe people think Elon is doing a piss poor job running twitter and, for completely unrelated reasons, think he is a douche bag, and for other unrelated reasons, think he banged some girls on Epstein island.
I have no card in the Musk game. Just an observation.
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I don't think they're connected. Maybe people think Trump is a bad president and, for completely unrelated reasons, think Melania probably doesn't love him.
Maybe people think Elon is doing a piss poor job running twitter and, for completely unrelated reasons, think he is a douche bag, and for other unrelated reasons, think he banged some girls on Epstein island.
I have no card in the Musk game. Just an observation.
I know I'm wrong, but I politely disagree on the "for completely unrelated reasons". I don't think they are unrelated at all. I think we live in a world of absolutes. There's little room for nuance when everything is elevated to 11.
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Well, as long as you know you're wrong. :biggrin:
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I don't think they're connected. Maybe people think Trump is a bad president and, for completely unrelated reasons, think Melania probably doesn't love him.
Maybe people think Elon is doing a piss poor job running twitter and, for completely unrelated reasons, think he is a douche bag, and for other unrelated reasons, think he banged some girls on Epstein island.
I have no card in the Musk game. Just an observation.
I know I'm wrong, but I politely disagree on the "for completely unrelated reasons". I don't think they are unrelated at all. I think we live in a world of absolutes. There's little room for nuance when everything is elevated to 11.
Doesn't Elon bring it on himself?
He's the one who accused the scuba diver in Thailand of being a pedo when the guy didn't use one of his submarines to save those kids awhile back.
And he's been nothing short on incendiary recently, constantly railing against "woke leftists". C'mon.
Musk must be surrounded by sycophants who congratulate his every action because he seems to be having a tough time coping with the reality that many, many people Do Not Like Him.
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I don't think they're connected. Maybe people think Trump is a bad president and, for completely unrelated reasons, think Melania probably doesn't love him.
Maybe people think Elon is doing a piss poor job running twitter and, for completely unrelated reasons, think he is a douche bag, and for other unrelated reasons, think he banged some girls on Epstein island.
I have no card in the Musk game. Just an observation.
I know I'm wrong, but I politely disagree on the "for completely unrelated reasons". I don't think they are unrelated at all. I think we live in a world of absolutes. There's little room for nuance when everything is elevated to 11.
Doesn't Elon bring it on himself?
He's the one who accused the scuba diver in Thailand of being a pedo when the guy didn't use one of his submarines to save those kids awhile back.
And he's been nothing short on incendiary recently, constantly railing against "woke leftists". C'mon.
Musk must be surrounded by sycophants who congratulate his every action because he seems to be having a tough time coping with the reality that many, many people Do Not Like Him.
I don't know; maybe I just don't have that "vindictive gene". I was taught to do unto others, and that two wrongs don't make a right. Because Elon Musk accuses people of being pedophiles as a weapon, doesn't mean I should too. Bear with, because I'm having this same sort of conversation in multiple places, but I wrote something along these lines to Adami. The law is the only standard we can FORCE others to adhere to, but if I'm going to demand that others hold themselves to a higher standard, a moral standard, then I ought to be at least accountable to that standard, even given that people make mistakes. No?
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I don't think they're connected. Maybe people think Trump is a bad president and, for completely unrelated reasons, think Melania probably doesn't love him.
Maybe people think Elon is doing a piss poor job running twitter and, for completely unrelated reasons, think he is a douche bag, and for other unrelated reasons, think he banged some girls on Epstein island.
I have no card in the Musk game. Just an observation.
I know I'm wrong, but I politely disagree on the "for completely unrelated reasons". I don't think they are unrelated at all. I think we live in a world of absolutes. There's little room for nuance when everything is elevated to 11.
Doesn't Elon bring it on himself?
He's the one who accused the scuba diver in Thailand of being a pedo when the guy didn't use one of his submarines to save those kids awhile back.
And he's been nothing short on incendiary recently, constantly railing against "woke leftists". C'mon.
Musk must be surrounded by sycophants who congratulate his every action because he seems to be having a tough time coping with the reality that many, many people Do Not Like Him.
I don't know; maybe I just don't have that "vindictive gene". I was taught to do unto others, and that two wrongs don't make a right. Because Elon Musk accuses people of being pedophiles as a weapon, doesn't mean I should too. Bear with, because I'm having this same sort of conversation in multiple places, but I wrote something along these lines to Adami. The law is the only standard we can FORCE others to adhere to, but if I'm going to demand that others hold themselves to a higher standard, a moral standard, then I ought to be at least accountable to that standard, even given that people make mistakes. No?
Isn't that called being "self-righteous"?
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I think it was on fox news when I was flipping through the channels in my hotel the other night, maybe it was tiktok, but someone questioned is Musk the new Trump on twitter, and it certainly does seem that way. He's really getting under the left's skin lately and he's being extremely divisive. He's also craving attention. I'm no fan of the guy and I mostly dislike the latest ban because he said he wasn't going to. This guy is going back and forth on a lot of things related to twitter lately. Why hasn't he learned to keep things in house. Goes back to wanting attention I think.
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I was also taught that "two wrongs don't make a right", but I was also taught that "if you don't want to be clowned, don't be a clown." And Elon is showing a strong tendency for the clown makeup.
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I think it was on fox news when I was flipping through the channels in my hotel the other night, maybe it was tiktok, but someone questioned is Musk the new Trump on twitter, and it certainly does seem that way. He's really getting under the left's skin lately and he's being extremely divisive. He's also craving attention. I'm no fan of the guy and I mostly dislike the latest ban because he said he wasn't going to. This guy is going back and forth on a lot of things related to twitter lately. Why hasn't he learned to keep things in house. Goes back to wanting attention I think.
Or...Could be he knows exactly how the media operates and he is doing these things as a way to generate interest into Twitter. Since people just can't seem to not look away, or better yet, not follow Elon and just scroll on by, ignoring any post that mentions his name.
Since it seems every "story" follows the hero journey, these stories also need a villain. And the villain of the month is now Musk.
And if he's crying for attention, then the media sure are coddling him and saying..."Awe...poor baby needs his bottle" while breastfeeding him.
I was also taught that "two wrongs don't make a right", but I was also taught that "if you don't want to be clowned, don't be a clown." And Elon is showing a strong tendency for the clown makeup.
How else do you get medias attention?
There's reasons for the term...Media Circus.
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Maybe he just doesn't know what he's doing, and he's learning the way he always had; through trial and error.
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I agree with the first part.
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Maybe he just doesn't know what he's doing, and he's learning the way he always had; through trial and error.
That's fine, but why do it so publicly?
Like the blue check mark thing. If he wants to change it, why isn't he just doing it the typical way, meetings inside the company and figure it out before making any sort of announcement. It seems he's just throwing shit at the wall at this point, which could be trial and error, but the optics are pretty bad.
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Maybe he just doesn't know what he's doing, and he's learning the way he always had; through trial and error.
That's fine, but why do it so publicly?
Like the blue check mark thing. If he wants to change it, why isn't he just doing it the typical way, meetings inside the company and figure it out before making any sort of announcement. It seems he's just throwing shit at the wall at this point, which could be trial and error, but the optics are pretty bad.
Because it's just what he does.
(https://media2.giphy.com/media/l378ln6GybWpUPOqA/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e47bxwih3zgkpuhy6k4sl6dxs0x87e12lr0mlr1vfkj&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
I've said this before, but it's an approach that you'll see in rocketry. Mistakes are as useful as successes.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fj-z8OdagAIxua4?format=jpg&name=large)
Have to say, the added context feature IS useful.
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(https://media2.giphy.com/media/l378ln6GybWpUPOqA/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e47bxwih3zgkpuhy6k4sl6dxs0x87e12lr0mlr1vfkj&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
I've said this before, but it's an approach that you'll see in rocketry. Mistakes are as useful as successes.
Yeah.
When the revamped Blue was announced, and Musk said no one would ever pay $8 just to spam, the risks seemed obvious, and then they happened. Could easily be foreseen. I point this out to highlight that being willing to make mistakes doesn't have to mean making obvious blunders.
I also know from personal experience what happens when a big corporation tries to run like a startup, exactly what Musk is doing. In my experience, it doesn't work. Maybe Musk will have more success. He seems smarter and harder working than the leadership where I was.
And yet, all that said...
For some reason, in our culture, we've come to hold risk aversion as a sacred value. "Safetyism" as it's been called. Related to this (though I don't know exactly how) is that people who have never risked anything in their lives can point to and mock the failures of people who at least tried.
I say this as someone who has a lot of problems with risk aversion - Being willing to fail is the only way you can succeed. A lack of failure might feel good in the short term, but in the long term the failures will seem small and the lack of successes will loom large.
I feel like a lot of people watching Musks's Twitter tenure are thinking "I of course would hold meetings and consult with experts to make the best decisions." That's what the old Twitter did. It was a low enough value company that a single billionare could buy it. The company was technologically stagnant.
The "move fast and break things" mentality of the 00s/10s tech boom has been somewhat rightfully criticized, but in the end, those people built some of the most prosperous and powerful companies in America. The "adults" who took over afterwards turned the big tech cos into behemoths being punished by recession.
Musk might have bitten off more than he can chew, but how many people were even willing to take the bite?
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I was also taught that "two wrongs don't make a right", but I was also taught that "if you don't want to be clowned, don't be a clown." And Elon is showing a strong tendency for the clown makeup.
The two are not the same. I control myself. I can or cannot commit the wrong. It is wholly up to me. "Clown" is subjective; we can have a whole thread of people that some people are clowns and others do not.
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(https://media2.giphy.com/media/l378ln6GybWpUPOqA/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e47bxwih3zgkpuhy6k4sl6dxs0x87e12lr0mlr1vfkj&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
I've said this before, but it's an approach that you'll see in rocketry. Mistakes are as useful as successes.
Yeah.
When the revamped Blue was announced, and Musk said no one would ever pay $8 just to spam, the risks seemed obvious, and then they happened. Could easily be foreseen. I point this out to highlight that being willing to make mistakes doesn't have to mean making obvious blunders.
I also know from personal experience what happens when a big corporation tries to run like a startup, exactly what Musk is doing. In my experience, it doesn't work. Maybe Musk will have more success. He seems smarter and harder working than the leadership where I was.
And yet, all that said...
For some reason, in our culture, we've come to hold risk aversion as a sacred value. "Safetyism" as it's been called. Related to this (though I don't know exactly how) is that people who have never risked anything in their lives can point to and mock the failures of people who at least tried.
I say this as someone who has a lot of problems with risk aversion - Being willing to fail is the only way you can succeed. A lack of failure might feel good in the short term, but in the long term the failures will seem small and the lack of successes will loom large.
I feel like a lot of people watching Musks's Twitter tenure are thinking "I of course would hold meetings and consult with experts to make the best decisions." That's what the old Twitter did. It was a low enough value company that a single billionare could buy it. The company was technologically stagnant.
The "move fast and break things" mentality of the 00s/10s tech boom has been somewhat rightfully criticized, but in the end, those people built some of the most prosperous and powerful companies in America. The "adults" who took over afterwards turned the big tech cos into behemoths being punished by recession.
Musk might have bitten off more than he can chew, but how many people were even willing to take the bite?
We live in a "failure is not an option" society, or at least one that "claims" it's not an option (it sounds more like bravado to me). We are, more often than not, only as good as our worst moment. Couple that with our massive insecurity, and our society is not a safe place to make mistakes.
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I don't think space x is entirely comparable to what is happening at twitter. One company is using cutting edge technology, the other is a known company using tech that's tried and true. Using the blue check example again, Twitter went through the pain of figuring this out already. I'd imagine they failed already at something before finding a solution. Now when Elon messes with it publicly, it doesn't come off as learning from a failure, it's a failure because he didn't take into account what was previously learned. Making twitter profitable is no doubt going to be a trial and error thing, but the way he is doing it, doesn't feel like a learning experience to me. Feels more like personal gratification.
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I don't think space x is entirely comparable to what is happening at twitter. One company is using cutting edge technology, the other is a known company using tech that's tried and true. Using the blue check example again, Twitter went through the pain of figuring this out already. I'd imagine they failed already at something before finding a solution. Now when Elon messes with it publicly, it doesn't come off as learning from a failure, it's a failure because he didn't take into account what was previously learned. Making twitter profitable is no doubt going to be a trial and error thing, but the way he is doing it, doesn't feel like a learning experience to me. Feels more like personal gratification.
Completely agree with your post
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I don't think space x is entirely comparable to what is happening at twitter. One company is using cutting edge technology, the other is a known company using tech that's tried and true. Using the blue check example again, Twitter went through the pain of figuring this out already. I'd imagine they failed already at something before finding a solution. Now when Elon messes with it publicly, it doesn't come off as learning from a failure, it's a failure because he didn't take into account what was previously learned. Making twitter profitable is no doubt going to be a trial and error thing, but the way he is doing it, doesn't feel like a learning experience to me. Feels more like personal gratification.
As I said earlier, I don't think he knows what he's doing. He's approaching this the same way because he thinks he needs to reinvent the wheel. He does not. Twitter was already a thing. As I said a month ago, he's going to reinvent it right back to the place it was before he purchased it. He's going to make all of the same mistakes, learn the same lessons, and guide it to the same place.
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Allegedly now he's banning reporters who have been covering him. lol.
That said, also seeing more bots than ever.
Look forward to revisiting the app in like... a year.
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Everything is hunky-dory in my J-metal echo chamber.
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https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/twitter-suspends-journalists-covering-elon-musk-company-rcna62032
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https://www.bbc.com/news/business-63981767
Liquidation of your own company's stock when the price is at a local minimum doesn't seem something you would normally do if your financials were healthy, or is that just me?
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https://www.bbc.com/news/business-63981767
Liquidation of your own company's stock when the price is at a local minimum doesn't seem something you would normally do if your financials were healthy, or is that just me?
It brings the total of Tesla stocks sold by Mr Musk over the past year to almost $40bn.
Investing 101... buy low, sell high - not the other way around.
And with him selling all these shares, that in-and-of-itself (ie, flooding the stock market with supply of Tesla stock) inherently lowers the price of the stock.
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I wonder how many people caught the details on that map? "Epstein Island".
12 trips.
I'm no fan of Musk - no hater either; indifferent - but it's really getting ridiculous how vindictive and black/white people are. You're either a saint, can do no wrong, or, once a line is crossed, there's no evil you won't perpetrate, no failure you're not capable of achieving. Don't any of these people have their own quirks, failures, blind spots?
No, some people are perfect, which enables them to live in glass houses AND throw stones, didn't you know that?
Musk is definitely all over the place, but the "OMG, I THOUGHT HE BELIEVED IN FREE SPEECH" people on Twitter are idiots. Every time someone gets banned, they shout that, but just because someone who believes in free speech doesn't mean they are in favor of anyone and everyone saying whatever they want. I am sure most of the mods here are in favor of free speech generally speaking, but, because there are forum rules, we the posters cannot just say anything we want and get away with it. Same goes with a platform like Twitter, even where the rules appear to be fairly arbitrary as of late.
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"I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1518623997054918657)
"My commitment to free speech extends even to not banning the account following my plane, even though that is a direct personal safety risk" (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456)
"By “free speech”, I simply mean that which matches the law. I am against censorship that goes far beyond the law. If people want less free speech, they will ask government to pass laws to that effect. Therefore, going beyond the law is contrary to the will of the people." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1519036983137509376)
Given he unbanned literal fascists and doxxers when he took over (which would imply a pretty low bar for what is classed as acceptable speech under his/twitters rules), and is now banning people who are operating within the law (flight records are public and distributing them is not a crime, nor is reporting on it) one might be justified in being a little critical of the hypocrisy.
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https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-63996061
Fun times.
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"I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1518623997054918657)
"My commitment to free speech extends even to not banning the account following my plane, even though that is a direct personal safety risk" (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456)
"By “free speech”, I simply mean that which matches the law. I am against censorship that goes far beyond the law. If people want less free speech, they will ask government to pass laws to that effect. Therefore, going beyond the law is contrary to the will of the people." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1519036983137509376)
Given he unbanned literal fascists and doxxers when he took over (which would imply a pretty low bar for what is classed as acceptable speech under his/twitters rules), and is now banning people who are operating within the law (flight records are public and distributing them is not a crime, nor is reporting on it) one might be justified in being a little critical of the hypocrisy.
Well, except as noted above where it's hypocrites being a little critical of the hypocrisy. It's a sort of slippery slope.
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I dunno. If a smoker tells people not to smoke, he's a hypocrite with a good and accurate message. It'd be pretty dumb to ignore that advice because the dude smokes.
A person doesn't have to be perfect to make a criticism.
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They aren't hypocrites if they are (correctly) pointing out he said one thing (all speech that is legal should be permitted) and then performs actions that are directly contradictory to that ethos.
If Elon had marketed himself/twitter in the last weeks as being in favour of a curated space with additional limits of speech in order to foster a specific environment, then you might have a point if people were were characterising him as a free speech absolutist. But they didn't. Elon marketed himself as a free speech absolutist. So when he goes back on that, he should expect kickback.
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"I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1518623997054918657)
"My commitment to free speech extends even to not banning the account following my plane, even though that is a direct personal safety risk" (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456)
"By “free speech”, I simply mean that which matches the law. I am against censorship that goes far beyond the law. If people want less free speech, they will ask government to pass laws to that effect. Therefore, going beyond the law is contrary to the will of the people." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1519036983137509376)
Given he unbanned literal fascists and doxxers when he took over (which would imply a pretty low bar for what is classed as acceptable speech under his/twitters rules), and is now banning people who are operating within the law (flight records are public and distributing them is not a crime, nor is reporting on it) one might be justified in being a little critical of the hypocrisy.
Well, except as noted above where it's hypocrites being a little critical of the hypocrisy. It's a sort of slippery slope.
Always to the defense of the direct issue, by pointing out fallacies of tangential and/or indirect aspects of the issue at hand.
Why is it so hard for you to just deal with the issue at hand, rather than the noise around the issue. Unless you're suggesting XJ is the hypocrite?
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I dunno. If a smoker tells people not to smoke, he's a hypocrite with a good and accurate message. It'd be pretty dumb to ignore that advice because the dude smokes.
A person doesn't have to be perfect to make a criticism.
AND
They aren't hypocrites if they are (correctly) pointing out he said one thing (all speech that is legal should be permitted) and then performs actions that are directly contradictory to that ethos.
If Elon had marketed himself/twitter in the last weeks as being in favour of a curated space with additional limits of speech in order to foster a specific environment, then you might have a point if people were were characterising him as a free speech absolutist. But they didn't. Elon marketed himself as a free speech absolutist. So when he goes back on that, he should expect kickback.
Eh... You guys are being more sympathetic to the message than I am. I don't exactly assume that snarky, divisive comments on Twitter are "a good and accurate message" or "(correctly) pointing out" anything. Twitter is by and large a cesspool, and by and large populated by people that have little to no apparent interest in improving ANYTHING except their on-line profile. Musk's "hypocrisy" is not a cautionary tale to be absorbed by others, it's a stick by which keyboard warriors can exact their revenge against a flawed billionaire. We KNOW how much Americans love billionaires (we even had a guy campaign TWICE, and rather successfully, on a platform that was largely about abolishing, either directly or indirectly, the notion of billionaires).
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"I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1518623997054918657)
"My commitment to free speech extends even to not banning the account following my plane, even though that is a direct personal safety risk" (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456)
"By “free speech”, I simply mean that which matches the law. I am against censorship that goes far beyond the law. If people want less free speech, they will ask government to pass laws to that effect. Therefore, going beyond the law is contrary to the will of the people." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1519036983137509376)
Given he unbanned literal fascists and doxxers when he took over (which would imply a pretty low bar for what is classed as acceptable speech under his/twitters rules), and is now banning people who are operating within the law (flight records are public and distributing them is not a crime, nor is reporting on it) one might be justified in being a little critical of the hypocrisy.
Well, except as noted above where it's hypocrites being a little critical of the hypocrisy. It's a sort of slippery slope.
Always to the defense of the direct issue, by pointing out fallacies of tangential and/or indirect aspects of the issue at hand.
Why is it so hard for you to just deal with the issue at hand, rather than the noise around the issue. Unless you're suggesting XJ is the hypocrite?
Always with the ad hominem criticism of my posting. Why is it so hard for you to just deal with the fundamental point I'm making (and have been making, in one form or another, for years now)?
I'm not suggesting anything about any ONE poster and don't try to poke the bear by making me single someone out. To me, most of us ARE hypocrites, at least on the matters that REALLY matter in American politics, and if you don't understand that, then you haven't understood the vast majority of my posts over the past five years.
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Eh... You guys are being more sympathetic to the message than I am. I don't exactly assume that snarky, divisive comments on Twitter are "a good and accurate message" or "(correctly) pointing out" anything. Twitter is by and large a cesspool, and by and large populated by people that have little to no apparent interest in improving ANYTHING except their on-line profile.
The twitter experience is by and large determined by who you are following, and whose posts you are reading. Maybe you could consider the possibility that the cesspool is self-inflicted.
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Eh... You guys are being more sympathetic to the message than I am. I don't exactly assume that snarky, divisive comments on Twitter are "a good and accurate message" or "(correctly) pointing out" anything. Twitter is by and large a cesspool, and by and large populated by people that have little to no apparent interest in improving ANYTHING except their on-line profile.
The twitter experience is by and large determined by who you are following, and whose posts you are reading. Maybe you could consider the possibility that the cesspool is self-inflicted.
Absolutely. This is dead on. We control our own narrative.
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Eh... You guys are being more sympathetic to the message than I am. I don't exactly assume that snarky, divisive comments on Twitter are "a good and accurate message" or "(correctly) pointing out" anything. Twitter is by and large a cesspool, and by and large populated by people that have little to no apparent interest in improving ANYTHING except their on-line profile.
The twitter experience is by and large determined by who you are following, and whose posts you are reading. Maybe you could consider the possibility that the cesspool is self-inflicted.
I follow:
- Bill Burr
- Guy Fieri
- Alex Guarnaschelli
- Scott Conant
- The members of Dream Theater (Portnoy, Petrucci, Rudess, Sherinian)
- The members of Kiss (Simmons, Stanley, Frehley)
- Gas Monkey Garage
- Fish
- Dr. Phil
- Presidents Biden and Trump
- A couple people here (King, Dave, Cram, Coz)
- Howard Stern
- The Patriots
- The Yankees
Other than the last two Presidents, there's no politics whatsoever. Yet every morning I, through no fault of my own, are assaulted by terrorists like Jeff Teidrich, Occupy Democrats, some dude named "BrooklynDad_Defiant", some chick named "JoJoFromJerz"... the number is probably 20 or 30 to 1 in favor of these radical liberals (as compared to what we'd call "MAGA Republicans") spewing their version of hate and divisiveness, oblivious to their own hypocrisy while they blather on about Elon Musk's latest "fascist felony" (my words, but encapsulating a good portion of the flavor of the responses).
I'll consider anything; if it's self-inflicted, and it very well might be, it's certainly involuntary.
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Terrorists? Steady on.
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"I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1518623997054918657)
"My commitment to free speech extends even to not banning the account following my plane, even though that is a direct personal safety risk" (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456)
"By “free speech”, I simply mean that which matches the law. I am against censorship that goes far beyond the law. If people want less free speech, they will ask government to pass laws to that effect. Therefore, going beyond the law is contrary to the will of the people." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1519036983137509376)
Given he unbanned literal fascists and doxxers when he took over (which would imply a pretty low bar for what is classed as acceptable speech under his/twitters rules), and is now banning people who are operating within the law (flight records are public and distributing them is not a crime, nor is reporting on it) one might be justified in being a little critical of the hypocrisy.
Well, except as noted above where it's hypocrites being a little critical of the hypocrisy. It's a sort of slippery slope.
Always to the defense of the direct issue, by pointing out fallacies of tangential and/or indirect aspects of the issue at hand.
Why is it so hard for you to just deal with the issue at hand, rather than the noise around the issue. Unless you're suggesting XJ is the hypocrite?
Always with the ad hominem criticism of my posting. Why is it so hard for you to just deal with the fundamental point I'm making (and have been making, in one form or another, for years now)?
You use that term so frequently I have no idea what you're even talking about most of the time now. "attacks the character, motive, or some other attribute of the person making an argument rather than addressing the substance of the argument itself"
The above wasn't an attack towards you or your argument, but rather an observation that *you* often don't address the direct issue at hand, seemingly deflecting to secondary/tangential issues. Second, I wasn't trying to poke any bear. I didn't think for a millisecond that you were suggesting XJ is a hypocrite - just trying to understand if you were addressing the point directly (which might suggest you were calling him a hypocrite), or not (in which case, my observation stands).
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If I see any of those from others, I just scroll on by. I'm ok with that. I don't need to push my views on others. I just do what I think is right. I'm good with that.
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"I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1518623997054918657)
"My commitment to free speech extends even to not banning the account following my plane, even though that is a direct personal safety risk" (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456)
"By “free speech”, I simply mean that which matches the law. I am against censorship that goes far beyond the law. If people want less free speech, they will ask government to pass laws to that effect. Therefore, going beyond the law is contrary to the will of the people." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1519036983137509376)
Given he unbanned literal fascists and doxxers when he took over (which would imply a pretty low bar for what is classed as acceptable speech under his/twitters rules), and is now banning people who are operating within the law (flight records are public and distributing them is not a crime, nor is reporting on it) one might be justified in being a little critical of the hypocrisy.
Well, except as noted above where it's hypocrites being a little critical of the hypocrisy. It's a sort of slippery slope.
Always to the defense of the direct issue, by pointing out fallacies of tangential and/or indirect aspects of the issue at hand.
Why is it so hard for you to just deal with the issue at hand, rather than the noise around the issue. Unless you're suggesting XJ is the hypocrite?
To me, most of us ARE hypocrites, at least on the matters that REALLY matter in American politics, and if you don't understand that, then you haven't understood the vast majority of my posts over the past five years.
To this last point, why not just respond to XJ with "yup, Musk sure sounds hypocritical in that sense", rather than deflecting away to address those that are reacting/responding to Musk's behaviours?
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Terrorists? Steady on.
Why not? You used it, in a very very similar situation. Why not? They are undermining the country with their hate and divisiveness. They are creating in-groups and out-groups every bit as much as the "DUMB STUPID PUMPKIN HEAD" (sic, from a tweet from Jeff Tiedrich last night) or his "fucked up members of some fucked up cult" (sic, from a tweet from Jeff Tiedrich this morning, referring to Trump followers). Why not? Free speech.
Why not?
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"I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1518623997054918657)
"My commitment to free speech extends even to not banning the account following my plane, even though that is a direct personal safety risk" (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456)
"By “free speech”, I simply mean that which matches the law. I am against censorship that goes far beyond the law. If people want less free speech, they will ask government to pass laws to that effect. Therefore, going beyond the law is contrary to the will of the people." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1519036983137509376)
Given he unbanned literal fascists and doxxers when he took over (which would imply a pretty low bar for what is classed as acceptable speech under his/twitters rules), and is now banning people who are operating within the law (flight records are public and distributing them is not a crime, nor is reporting on it) one might be justified in being a little critical of the hypocrisy.
Well, except as noted above where it's hypocrites being a little critical of the hypocrisy. It's a sort of slippery slope.
Always to the defense of the direct issue, by pointing out fallacies of tangential and/or indirect aspects of the issue at hand.
Why is it so hard for you to just deal with the issue at hand, rather than the noise around the issue. Unless you're suggesting XJ is the hypocrite?
Always with the ad hominem criticism of my posting. Why is it so hard for you to just deal with the fundamental point I'm making (and have been making, in one form or another, for years now)?
You use that term so frequently I have no idea what you're even talking about most of the time now. "attacks the character, motive, or some other attribute of the person making an argument rather than addressing the substance of the argument itself"
The above wasn't an attack towards you or your argument, but rather an observation that *you* often don't address the direct issue at hand, seemingly deflecting to secondary/tangential issues. Second, I wasn't trying to poke any bear. I didn't think for a millisecond that you were suggesting XJ is a hypocrite - just trying to understand if you were addressing the point directly (which might suggest you were calling him a hypocrite), or not (in which case, my observation stands).
You rarely ever respond to the though or idea in any of my posts, but rather focus on the manner of the post or style, or some other characteristic of ME. Ad hominem. I respond, in my own way, DIRECTLY to the issue at hand. That you don't agree what the main point is isn't really on me, and not a function of my style or posting method.
Me suggesting - or not - whether any one poster here is - or is not - a hypocrite has NOTHING to do with addressing the point directly.
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"I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1518623997054918657)
"My commitment to free speech extends even to not banning the account following my plane, even though that is a direct personal safety risk" (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456)
"By “free speech”, I simply mean that which matches the law. I am against censorship that goes far beyond the law. If people want less free speech, they will ask government to pass laws to that effect. Therefore, going beyond the law is contrary to the will of the people." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1519036983137509376)
Given he unbanned literal fascists and doxxers when he took over (which would imply a pretty low bar for what is classed as acceptable speech under his/twitters rules), and is now banning people who are operating within the law (flight records are public and distributing them is not a crime, nor is reporting on it) one might be justified in being a little critical of the hypocrisy.
Well, except as noted above where it's hypocrites being a little critical of the hypocrisy. It's a sort of slippery slope.
Always to the defense of the direct issue, by pointing out fallacies of tangential and/or indirect aspects of the issue at hand.
Why is it so hard for you to just deal with the issue at hand, rather than the noise around the issue. Unless you're suggesting XJ is the hypocrite?
To me, most of us ARE hypocrites, at least on the matters that REALLY matter in American politics, and if you don't understand that, then you haven't understood the vast majority of my posts over the past five years.
To this last point, why not just respond to XJ with "yup, Musk sure sounds hypocritical in that sense", rather than deflecting away to address those that are reacting/responding to Musk's behaviours?
I did get to cross it off my bingo card though...
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I dunno. If a smoker tells people not to smoke, he's a hypocrite with a good and accurate message. It'd be pretty dumb to ignore that advice because the dude smokes.
A person doesn't have to be perfect to make a criticism.
That's the phrase..."Do as I say, not as I do."
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Other than the last two Presidents, there's no politics whatsoever. Yet every morning I, through no fault of my own, are assaulted by terrorists like Jeff Teidrich, Occupy Democrats, some dude named "BrooklynDad_Defiant", some chick named "JoJoFromJerz"... the number is probably 20 or 30 to 1 in favor of these radical liberals (as compared to what we'd call "MAGA Republicans") spewing their version of hate and divisiveness, oblivious to their own hypocrisy while they blather on about Elon Musk's latest "fascist felony" (my words, but encapsulating a good portion of the flavor of the responses).
I'll consider anything; if it's self-inflicted, and it very well might be, it's certainly involuntary.
This is by design. It also takes into consideration if you post on a thread and if you read certain threads.
I have been muting accounts of users I don't care about and Twitter just shows me more of the same but different people. It didn't used to be this way. I suspect the algorithm is purposefully set up to show a user accounts they would likely disagree with or vehemently disagree with over accounts they follow.
This is why I spend less and less time there each day. You were right about the fact that it is a cesspool.
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"I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1518623997054918657)
"My commitment to free speech extends even to not banning the account following my plane, even though that is a direct personal safety risk" (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1589414958508691456)
"By “free speech”, I simply mean that which matches the law. I am against censorship that goes far beyond the law. If people want less free speech, they will ask government to pass laws to that effect. Therefore, going beyond the law is contrary to the will of the people." (https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1519036983137509376)
Given he unbanned literal fascists and doxxers when he took over (which would imply a pretty low bar for what is classed as acceptable speech under his/twitters rules), and is now banning people who are operating within the law (flight records are public and distributing them is not a crime, nor is reporting on it) one might be justified in being a little critical of the hypocrisy.
Well, except as noted above where it's hypocrites being a little critical of the hypocrisy. It's a sort of slippery slope.
Always to the defense of the direct issue, by pointing out fallacies of tangential and/or indirect aspects of the issue at hand.
Why is it so hard for you to just deal with the issue at hand, rather than the noise around the issue. Unless you're suggesting XJ is the hypocrite?
To me, most of us ARE hypocrites, at least on the matters that REALLY matter in American politics, and if you don't understand that, then you haven't understood the vast majority of my posts over the past five years.
To this last point, why not just respond to XJ with "yup, Musk sure sounds hypocritical in that sense", rather than deflecting away to address those that are reacting/responding to Musk's behaviours?
What's the point of that? He doesn't need my affirmation, does he? And it's not deflecting; all these people are pointing at Musk as if he's part of the problem; I can't change Musk, and neither can any of those people pointing the fingers. I can't change the people pointing the fingers either, but if any of them ever see this, and have a shred of integrity, and WANT to be part of the solution instead of the problem - which I believe they are - maybe I can plant a seed to give them something to think about. I believe in what I write; I don't know if I AM right or not, no one does affirmatively, but I also have data that backs up that what we're (collectively) doing now isn't working. At the very least, being less divisive and minimizing out-groups can't hurt, so just like we talk about in terms of guns, abortion, we don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. It might not be a complete solution but we take the little steps we can. So if even one person takes what I write here and says "wow, maybe my snarky, quippy little reply, and the 12 people that will like me as a result isn't worth the further divisiveness and turmoil that it will possibly cause". It's like throwing trash out the window; does my throwing one McDonald's wrapper out the window REALLY move the needle in terms of the environment? No, not really, but if I do it, and you do it and XJ does it, it starts to add up.
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Other than the last two Presidents, there's no politics whatsoever. Yet every morning I, through no fault of my own, are assaulted by terrorists like Jeff Teidrich, Occupy Democrats, some dude named "BrooklynDad_Defiant", some chick named "JoJoFromJerz"... the number is probably 20 or 30 to 1 in favor of these radical liberals (as compared to what we'd call "MAGA Republicans") spewing their version of hate and divisiveness, oblivious to their own hypocrisy while they blather on about Elon Musk's latest "fascist felony" (my words, but encapsulating a good portion of the flavor of the responses).
I'll consider anything; if it's self-inflicted, and it very well might be, it's certainly involuntary.
This is by design. It also takes into consideration if you post on a thread and if you read certain threads.
I have been muting accounts of users I don't care about and Twitter just shows me more of the same but different people. It didn't used to be this way. I suspect the algorithm is purposefully set up to show a user accounts they would likely disagree with or vehemently disagree with over accounts they follow.
This is why I spend less and less time there each day. You were right about the fact that it is a cesspool.
Thanks for chiming in (sincerely). According to the 60 Minutes story a couple weeks ago, I think you are correct about the algorithm factoring in negative or conflicting disagreement in the filtered posts.
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Eh... You guys are being more sympathetic to the message than I am. I don't exactly assume that snarky, divisive comments on Twitter are "a good and accurate message" or "(correctly) pointing out" anything. Twitter is by and large a cesspool, and by and large populated by people that have little to no apparent interest in improving ANYTHING except their on-line profile.
The twitter experience is by and large determined by who you are following, and whose posts you are reading. Maybe you could consider the possibility that the cesspool is self-inflicted.
I follow:
- Bill Burr
- Guy Fieri
- Alex Guarnaschelli
- Scott Conant
- The members of Dream Theater (Portnoy, Petrucci, Rudess, Sherinian)
- The members of Kiss (Simmons, Stanley, Frehley)
- Gas Monkey Garage
- Fish
- Dr. Phil
- Presidents Biden and Trump
- A couple people here (King, Dave, Cram, Coz)
- Howard Stern
- The Patriots
- The Yankees
Other than the last two Presidents, there's no politics whatsoever. Yet every morning I, through no fault of my own, are assaulted by terrorists like Jeff Teidrich, Occupy Democrats, some dude named "BrooklynDad_Defiant", some chick named "JoJoFromJerz"... the number is probably 20 or 30 to 1 in favor of these radical liberals (as compared to what we'd call "MAGA Republicans") spewing their version of hate and divisiveness, oblivious to their own hypocrisy while they blather on about Elon Musk's latest "fascist felony" (my words, but encapsulating a good portion of the flavor of the responses).
I'll consider anything; if it's self-inflicted, and it very well might be, it's certainly involuntary.
These types of grifter activist accounts get dragged by the real "left" all the time.
You should try a few episodes of the podcast "Chapo Trap House" to learn more about what the real left is like. I would love to know what you thought about it.
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You rarely ever respond to the though or idea in any of my posts, but rather focus on the manner of the post or style, or some other characteristic of ME. Ad hominem. I respond, in my own way, DIRECTLY to the issue at hand. That you don't agree what the main point is isn't really on me, and not a function of my style or posting method.
Me suggesting - or not - whether any one poster here is - or is not - a hypocrite has NOTHING to do with addressing the point directly.
I respond to the CONTENT of your posts.... not to the content of your CHARACTER. The two are separate things, so there's no need perform the mental gymnastics to interpret my criticism of *what* you post as me criticizing you.
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Twitter leans to the left, it always has. From the previous employees to the users. It's no surprise, even if you don't follow leftist, that you are going to see these things on your timeline. That JoJofromJerz girl comes up on my page and I have no idea why. I'll probably mute the account next time I see it. It may be replaced by something similar, but at the end of the day, these things don't bother me too much. I don't have to use twitter, but the positives outweigh these small annoyances. I try not to give the things I dont like attention.
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Me scrolling Twitter right now.
Judas Priest - Metal Gods or Turbo Lover
Rocktails guy. Gas prices in California lowering finally.
Buddy, Playing Modest Mouse Album
Sports radio guy saying listen to me.
Painkiller or Aces High vote.
Elf on a Christmas tree topper
Cram's 2022 top album threads.
My buddy tweeted, The new Leftfield album is worth the wait.
Sports radio guy, I'd buy that shirt.
Guy playing a buckethead song.
Matthew Judon from the N.E. Patriots asking fans out what's good or bad outside of work
Nick Carter posting a pic with Tony Danza.
So as you can see, I'm not seeing anything negative. If you don't have friends that dwell on the negative, you wont see it.
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Me scrolling Twitter right now.
Judas Priest - Metal Gods or Turbo Lover
Rocktails guy. Gas prices in California lowering finally.
Buddy, Playing Modest Mouse Album
Sports radio guy saying listen to me.
Painkiller or Aces High vote.
Elf on a Christmas tree topper
Cram's 2022 top album threads.
My buddy tweeted, The new Leftfield album is worth the wait.
Sports radio guy, I'd buy that shirt.
Guy playing a buckethead song.
Matthew Judon from the N.E. Patriots asking fans out what's good or bad outside of work
Nick Carter posting a pic with Tony Danza.
So as you can see, I'm not seeing anything negative. If you don't have friends that dwell on the negative, you wont see it.
Well, I don't have any friends. So that's a start. :)
(I'm kidding; though the friends I do have are largely not on Twitter, though).
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I see so many people saying they see the other side to their beliefs but I guess it's who you follow so it's on those who follow to argue.
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Eh... You guys are being more sympathetic to the message than I am. I don't exactly assume that snarky, divisive comments on Twitter are "a good and accurate message" or "(correctly) pointing out" anything. Twitter is by and large a cesspool, and by and large populated by people that have little to no apparent interest in improving ANYTHING except their on-line profile.
The twitter experience is by and large determined by who you are following, and whose posts you are reading. Maybe you could consider the possibility that the cesspool is self-inflicted.
I follow:
- Bill Burr
- Guy Fieri
- Alex Guarnaschelli
- Scott Conant
- The members of Dream Theater (Portnoy, Petrucci, Rudess, Sherinian)
- The members of Kiss (Simmons, Stanley, Frehley)
- Gas Monkey Garage
- Fish
- Dr. Phil
- Presidents Biden and Trump
- A couple people here (King, Dave, Cram, Coz)
- Howard Stern
- The Patriots
- The Yankees
Other than the last two Presidents, there's no politics whatsoever. Yet every morning I, through no fault of my own, are assaulted by terrorists like Jeff Teidrich, Occupy Democrats, some dude named "BrooklynDad_Defiant", some chick named "JoJoFromJerz"... the number is probably 20 or 30 to 1 in favor of these radical liberals (as compared to what we'd call "MAGA Republicans") spewing their version of hate and divisiveness, oblivious to their own hypocrisy while they blather on about Elon Musk's latest "fascist felony" (my words, but encapsulating a good portion of the flavor of the responses).
I'll consider anything; if it's self-inflicted, and it very well might be, it's certainly involuntary.
These types of grifter activist accounts get dragged by the real "left" all the time.
You should try a few episodes of the podcast "Chapo Trap House" to learn more about what the real left is like. I would love to know what you thought about it.
I will check that out; I'm always interested to hear more on the things I write about. But as a general proposition, as someone whose friends are probably 4 or 5 to 1 lean left, I feel like I do have an understanding of the "real" left. The underlying point of all this is that it's not unilateral; if "JoJoFromJerz" or "Jeff Tiedrich" isn't the real left, then neither is goat boy with the face paint on January 6th the real right. My dad was a conservative until the day he died, and he was NONE OF THAT. He was APPALLED at that kind of behavior. But he, like me, didn't see it as unique to his party or to Trump. The divisiveness isn't just on the right, and isn't just at the extremes.
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Me scrolling Twitter right now.
Judas Priest - Metal Gods or Turbo Lover
Rocktails guy. Gas prices in California lowering finally.
Buddy, Playing Modest Mouse Album
Sports radio guy saying listen to me.
Painkiller or Aces High vote.
Elf on a Christmas tree topper
Cram's 2022 top album threads.
My buddy tweeted, The new Leftfield album is worth the wait.
Sports radio guy, I'd buy that shirt.
Guy playing a buckethead song.
Matthew Judon from the N.E. Patriots asking fans out what's good or bad outside of work
Nick Carter posting a pic with Tony Danza.
So as you can see, I'm not seeing anything negative. If you don't have friends that dwell on the negative, you wont see it.
My Twitter...
Nemophila - Seize the Fate x100
Daughter making statement against AI apps
Nemophila - Seize the Fate x100
Now that's how you create an echo chamber my friend.
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Why not? You used it, in a very very similar situation.
Feel free to provide the post.
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Why not? You used it, in a very very similar situation.
Feel free to provide the post.
The whole line of reasoning that went into the stochastic terrorism discussion. That was a term YOU introduced.
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1. Stochastic terrorism is a term that has been used since 2018, and is essentially a reframing of the general concepts of the "lone wolf" and "incitement" which are the subject of a large quantity of research and analysis. So I didn't introduce anything.
2. I described stochastic terrorism as a process, and how media and propaganda can be used to predictably radicalise a certain proportion of individuals. To my knowledge, I did not call a single person, other than those who commit the acts of terror that are incited, terrorists. But again, feel free to provide the post where I did.
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In any case back on topic:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-12-16/musk-disables-twitter-spaces-after-clash-with-journalists
Twitter disabled the "spaces" feature a few hours after Musk participated in a "Spaces" meeting with journalists he banned, got the bare minimum of pushback, and immediately dropped out of it.
https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/audio-of-elon-musks-twitter-spaces-session-with-journalists-before-he-abruptly-quit-3612756
Kinda feels like that kind of decision making is driven by ego rather than any sound business making decisions.
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Stochastic;
Randomly determined; having a random probability distribution or pattern that may be analyzed statistically but not predicted precisely.
Randomly determined, check. Analyzed statistically, maybe. Predicted precisely, nope.
It's like a theoretical physicist specializing in quantum theory took some LSD in hopes that he solve the random chaos principle 😀.
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Thanks for chiming in (sincerely). According to the 60 Minutes story a couple weeks ago, I think you are correct about the algorithm factoring in negative or conflicting disagreement in the filtered posts.
It feels like all it takes is one person you follow liking or retweeting something political or social justice-related for example, and all of a sudden, you get a barrage of tweets of that ilk despite not following any of it directly.
It is very easy to argue that going to Twitter at all is a self-inflected wound, so I will plead guilty in that regard, but the idea that if you just stick to what you follow means you will never see anything you don't want is not reality. It hasn't been that way on Twitter for as long as I can remember.
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Funny. I'm not seeing much of that at all. I think you want to blame algorithms, instead of blaming yourself for following those you disagree with.
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This isn't a response to Kev. It's to those complaining about seeing what they don't like on their Twitter feed.
I have no issues likecyou do so maybe you like the drama.
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I think it's more the "safe space" people. Jordan Peterson has spoken about this, how the safe space people want to live in a world where no one ever says or does anything that makes them uncomfortable. And I think for many, Twitter was a safe space, and now that Musk is turning it into Hell in a Cell where anything goes, some are uncomfortable because...*gasp"...they actually have to read opinions with which they do not agree. The horror.
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I think it's more the "safe space" people. Jordan Peterson has spoken about this, how the safe space people want to live in a world where no one ever says or does anything that makes them uncomfortable. And I think for many, Twitter was a safe space, and now that Musk is turning it into Hell in a Cell where anything goes, some are uncomfortable because...*gasp"...they actually have to read opinions with which they do not agree. The horror.
It's more like their safety bubble has popped and they are now vulnerable to all the things that safety bubble protected them from.
This is why I say that Life, Reality, and The World is not exactly kind. To survive in this world, your body and mind need to be kept in what is termed a "healthy" state. The mind, especially, needs to be in that healthy state or else you'll end up "losing your mind". To me, having a healthy state of mind means to be able to control your thoughts and emotions, for your brain to immediately tell your body not to react on those thoughts or emotions. It's your mind telling itself to breathe, calm down, and evaluate the situation before acting.
And honestly, I feel a lot of people do not have a healthy state of mind. People are quick to react without thinking. In the case of twitter, the reaction is to write a degrading post, to the point of it verging to a threat, rather than considering to ignore the post and scroll past it.
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I think it's more the "safe space" people. Jordan Peterson has spoken about this, how the safe space people want to live in a world where no one ever says or does anything that makes them uncomfortable. And I think for many, Twitter was a safe space, and now that Musk is turning it into Hell in a Cell where anything goes, some are uncomfortable because...*gasp"...they actually have to read opinions with which they do not agree. The horror.
The idea of twitter of ever being a "safe space" (which incidentally just mean a place where oppressed minority groups could discuss things without being harassed by a hostile majority - a shocking concept) is rather antithetical to the experience shared by some in this thread that they would be exposed to people and ideas outside their immediate follow group. In any case, being exposed to "ideas" and being exposed to abuse and hate aren't the same thing, and in my experience its mostly the latter which people are complaining Musk opened the floodgates to, which would track with the fact he unbanned a significant number of people who were previously banned for targeted harassment and hate speech.
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Pay money, gain ability to censor.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603985491505795072
No way groups could abuse this.
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Pay money, gain ability to censor.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1603985491505795072
No way groups could abuse this.
None whatsoever!
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https://twitter.com/TwitterSupport/status/1604531261791522817
So Twitter is quickly becoming the most censored mainstream platform in the West.
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But of course it is lol
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https://twitter.com/TwitterSupport/status/1604531261791522817
So Twitter is quickly becoming the most censored mainstream platform in the West.
Dumb policy is dumb.
But calling Twitter the most censored platform requires forgetting that Facebook (and its subsidiaries) and Youtube exist. Also requires forgetting what Twitter was like pre-Musk.
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A lot know about the dumb suspensions I've had on Facebook. Never on Twitter. I agree with ReaP about Facebook being the worst.
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A lot know about the dumb suspensions I've had on Facebook. Never on Twitter. I agree with ReaP about Facebook being the worst.
Just being a bit of a devil's advocate, but your FB issues were mostly the result of idiotic algorithms, and the platform being way to huge to personally see to each case. It seems that Twitter is specifically targeting groups to cultivate an environment that, I dunno, doesn't hurt Elon's feelings...I'm really not sure what the fuck they're doing, but there's a specific purpose as opposed to FB's general algorithm that makes sure you don't connect certain words in certain combinations...and this is coming from someone who got a week for posting "men are fucking idiots" (which is very true)
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A lot know about the dumb suspensions I've had on Facebook. Never on Twitter. I agree with ReaP about Facebook being the worst.
Just being a bit of a devil's advocate, but your FB issues were mostly the result of idiotic algorithms, and the platform being way to huge to personally see to each case. It seems that Twitter is specifically targeting groups to cultivate an environment that, I dunno, doesn't hurt Elon's feelings...I'm really not sure what the fuck they're doing, but there's a specific purpose as opposed to FB's general algorithm that makes sure you don't connect certain words in certain combinations...and this is coming from someone who got a week for posting "men are fucking idiots" (which is very true)
Something tells me if you would have posted "women are fucking idiots" on Twitter eight months ago, the ban hammer would have been quick and swift.
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A lot know about the dumb suspensions I've had on Facebook. Never on Twitter. I agree with ReaP about Facebook being the worst.
Just being a bit of a devil's advocate, but your FB issues were mostly the result of idiotic algorithms, and the platform being way to huge to personally see to each case. It seems that Twitter is specifically targeting groups to cultivate an environment that, I dunno, doesn't hurt Elon's feelings...I'm really not sure what the fuck they're doing, but there's a specific purpose as opposed to FB's general algorithm that makes sure you don't connect certain words in certain combinations...and this is coming from someone who got a week for posting "men are fucking idiots" (which is very true)
I posted just as silly on Twitter and haven't received one suspension.
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Aaaaaand the no promotion rule has been (seemingly) rescinded and will be revised to only be spam of competitors.
Credit to Musk for changing course quickly.
But again, unforced error. I could have told you this was a bad idea.
I kind of wonder if this is intentional. If he came out with the reasonable rule first, there would be some small low-level of complaining for a while. Instead - roll out something obviously bad. Eat a bit of backlash. Move to something reasonable. People happy.
Bigger issue (regardless of if my conspiracy theory is true), I'm starting to see more middle-of-the-road tech people being unhappy with decisions like this. These people are Elon's core constituency of powerful/influential people.
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Musk put up a poll asking if he should step down. He claims he will abide by the results. Not going well for him at the moment. I voted to dump him.
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Musk put up a poll asking if he should step down. He claims he will abide by the results. Not going well for him at the moment. I voted to dump him.
very normal way to run a business.
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Guy's ego is probably suffering under the strain of all of the (justified) criticism.
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So far he has abided by the poll results he's posted, right?
I am not optimistic he's going to bring in a great CEO. Twitter has really suffered from a lot of mismanagement (even before Musk) for years and it's going to take a hell of an effort to turn things around. My fear is he appoints one of his lackeys or someone worse. Who knows though.
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So far he has abided by the poll results he's posted, right?
I am not optimistic he's going to bring in a great CEO. Twitter has really suffered from a lot of mismanagement (even before Musk) for years and it's going to take a hell of an effort to turn things around. My fear is he appoints one of his lackeys or someone worse. Who knows though.
I wonder who would want to work under him as a CEO though?
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So far he has abided by the poll results he's posted, right?
I am not optimistic he's going to bring in a great CEO. Twitter has really suffered from a lot of mismanagement (even before Musk) for years and it's going to take a hell of an effort to turn things around. My fear is he appoints one of his lackeys or someone worse. Who knows though.
This is precisely what will happen. He will still make all the decisions but someone else will do all the hard lifting.
So far he has abided by the poll results he's posted, right?
I am not optimistic he's going to bring in a great CEO. Twitter has really suffered from a lot of mismanagement (even before Musk) for years and it's going to take a hell of an effort to turn things around. My fear is he appoints one of his lackeys or someone worse. Who knows though.
I wonder who would want to work under him as a CEO though?
There are probably tons of people who would love the job. As much as there seems to be a change in the working culture and the importance of work/life balance, there are still many people who would throw their mother under a bus if it landed them a big promotion.
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The dude has managed to keep himself and his new purchase on page 1 of every news outlet for weeks now. I wish the media would stop covering him.
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Musk put up a poll asking if he should step down. He claims he will abide by the results. Not going well for him at the moment. I voted to dump him.
Also voted against him :lol
In seriousness, the guy basically tore down twitter so letting someone else do the dirty work of cleaning up his mess makes some kind of sense.
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The dude has managed to keep himself and his new purchase on page 1 of every news outlet for weeks now. I wish the media would stop covering him.
The media needs a Boogeymen. Elon is a godsend to the media just as Trump was.
It's also hilarious that people assumed he could run Twitter because he's a businessmen with a big company. It's like expecting an optometrist to perform gynecology procedures.
For me, I said..."well, I guess we'll see won't we." And grabbed my big bag of :corn
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This isn't a response to Kev. It's to those complaining about seeing what they don't like on their Twitter feed.
I have no issues likecyou do so maybe you like the drama.
Well, that's me, then. How is following Gene Simmons and Mike Portnoy part of my problem?
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I think it's more the "safe space" people. Jordan Peterson has spoken about this, how the safe space people want to live in a world where no one ever says or does anything that makes them uncomfortable. And I think for many, Twitter was a safe space, and now that Musk is turning it into Hell in a Cell where anything goes, some are uncomfortable because...*gasp"...they actually have to read opinions with which they do not agree. The horror.
The idea of twitter of ever being a "safe space" (which incidentally just mean a place where oppressed minority groups could discuss things without being harassed by a hostile majority - a shocking concept) is rather antithetical to the experience shared by some in this thread that they would be exposed to people and ideas outside their immediate follow group. In any case, being exposed to "ideas" and being exposed to abuse and hate aren't the same thing, and in my experience its mostly the latter which people are complaining Musk opened the floodgates to, which would track with the fact he unbanned a significant number of people who were previously banned for targeted harassment and hate speech.
Oh, the irony of that statement...
(Though the kerfuffle at Yale over the Halloween costumes put paid to THAT definition; it was very, very clearly to mean the definition that KevShmev gave. That's been well-documented.)
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A lot know about the dumb suspensions I've had on Facebook. Never on Twitter. I agree with ReaP about Facebook being the worst.
Just being a bit of a devil's advocate, but your FB issues were mostly the result of idiotic algorithms, and the platform being way to huge to personally see to each case. It seems that Twitter is specifically targeting groups to cultivate an environment that, I dunno, doesn't hurt Elon's feelings...I'm really not sure what the fuck they're doing, but there's a specific purpose as opposed to FB's general algorithm that makes sure you don't connect certain words in certain combinations...and this is coming from someone who got a week for posting "men are fucking idiots" (which is very true)
Something tells me if you would have posted "women are fucking idiots" on Twitter eight months ago, the ban hammer would have been quick and swift.
Truth; the only people you could call "fucking idiots" were Republicans. ;)
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Well I just searched the phrase on twitter (in exact quotes) and got a tonne of posts from thoroughly unsuspended accounts. So that was a quite easily disproved hypothesis.
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Oh, the irony of that statement...
What's ironic about it?
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Oh, the irony of that statement...
What's ironic about it?
Well, the pages and pages of discussion we've had about cancel culture and the notions of "free speech". "Safe spaces" should apply to ANYONE that has a legitimate (in terms of intentions) idea, not just "oppressed minorities".
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(Though the kerfuffle at Yale over the Halloween costumes put paid to THAT definition; it was very, very clearly to mean the definition that KevShmev gave. That's been well-documented.)
Exactly, and it is intellectually dishonest for anyone to say otherwise, but it's a lot easier for some to virtue signal and imply that I was saying it should be okay to call minorities names than to face reality.
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Well, the pages and pages of discussion we've had about cancel culture and the notions of "free speech". "Safe spaces" should apply to ANYONE that has a legitimate (in terms of intentions) idea, not just "oppressed minorities".
Ideas with mainstream acceptance generally didn't NEED space spaces because there's minimal risk to either your safety or social standing by expressing them.
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Exactly, and it is intellectually dishonest for anyone to say otherwise, but it's a lot easier for some to virtue signal and imply that I was saying it should be okay to call minorities names than to face reality.
I never did that Kev. In any case, I will say that leftist concepts and technical language being co-opted and used to describe a much broader range of things is a tactic used by right wing propaganda outfits in a deliberate attempt to muddy and discredit the concepts, so I think its important to distinguish what these terms originally meant, rather than what the Petersons, Jones' and the like wished it meant.
EDIT: Further discussion stemming from this reply has been moved over to its own thread in P/R. Please move discussion over there.
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=57987.0
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A lot know about the dumb suspensions I've had on Facebook. Never on Twitter. I agree with ReaP about Facebook being the worst.
Just being a bit of a devil's advocate, but your FB issues were mostly the result of idiotic algorithms, and the platform being way to huge to personally see to each case. It seems that Twitter is specifically targeting groups to cultivate an environment that, I dunno, doesn't hurt Elon's feelings...I'm really not sure what the fuck they're doing, but there's a specific purpose as opposed to FB's general algorithm that makes sure you don't connect certain words in certain combinations...and this is coming from someone who got a week for posting "men are fucking idiots" (which is very true)
Something tells me if you would have posted "women are fucking idiots" on Twitter eight months ago, the ban hammer would have been quick and swift.
Truth; the only people you could call "fucking idiots" were Republicans. ;)
I know peeps that have gotten FB jail time for just that.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FkYmuDuUYAEI11N?format=jpg&name=large)
Vox populi ingressum feudum habet.
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It's easy to point out the other sides bad behavior. Seeing that both sides are wrong and needs to come to an understanding is the part that should be done but I'm pessimistic that it will happen. The benefits would be bountiful.
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Lost in the hub bub of everyone piling on Musk for this or that are all of the revelations of how Twitter was without a doubt an extension of the Democratic party and entities of our government like the FBI that were paying and directing Twitter to suppress information and pimp their agenda. That cannot be argued to the contrary given what is being revealed.
You can make arguments against Musk and dislike his methods or ideology but the 'crickets' from the rest of the media outlets surrounding everything that's coming to light is telling. Just imagine if the shoe was on the other foot and all of these revelations were concerning 'conservative' or 'repub' entities. It'd be an onslaught and media frenzy. Musk bought Twitter and yanked down the curtain and it's been non stop criticism of how he yanked the curtain down and nothing about what was behind it.
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Lost in the hub bub of everyone piling on Musk for this or that are all of the revelations of how Twitter was without a doubt an extension of the Democratic party and entities of our government like the FBI that were paying and directing Twitter to suppress information and pimp their agenda. That cannot be argued to the contrary given what is being revealed.
You can make arguments against Musk and dislike his methods or ideology but the 'crickets' from the rest of the media outlets surrounding everything that's coming to light is telling. Just imagine if the shoe was on the other foot and all of these revelations were concerning 'conservative' or 'repub' entities. It'd be an onslaught and media frenzy. Musk bought Twitter and yanked down the curtain and it's been non stop criticism of how he yanked the curtain down and nothing about what was behind it.
I'm failing to see how Twitter was "without a doubt" and "extension of the Democratic party".
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And also very much not a topic for P/R. I moved the discussion with regards to recuperation to a new thread.
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=57987.0
Stads, I will reply over there at some point.
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And also very much not a topic for P/R. I moved the discussion with regards to recuperation to a new thread.
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=57987.0
Stads, I will reply over there at some point.
I can't wait till Musk buys DTF and exposes how you've suppressed our free speech here.
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And also very much not a topic for P/R. I moved the discussion with regards to recuperation to a new thread.
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=57987.0
Stads, I will reply over there at some point.
I can't wait till Musk buys DTF and exposes how you've suppressed our free speech here.
HAHA
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:lol
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Your speech would be freer if you could learn to keep your damned mouths shut once in a while. :P
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DTF should implement the 8$ a month blue check mark
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DTF should implement the 8$ a month blue check mark
You mean the green stars?
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DTF should implement the 8$ a month blue check mark
You mean the green stars?
That's a one time donation! I need my blue check mark so my posts are above others and my speech won't be censored by XJ :lol
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DTF.org Alumni - They may or may not be notable.
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DTF should implement the 8$ a month blue check mark
You mean the green stars?
That's a one time donation! I need my blue check mark so my posts are above others and my speech won't be censored by XJ :lol
Oh, you mean the purple stars the VIPs get. :lol
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So I've just signed up for Post.News. It's supposed to be the next thing after Twitter. We'll see how it turns out...
https://post.news/hakaneinarsson
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So I've just signed up for Post.News. It's supposed to be the next thing after Twitter. We'll see how it turns out...
https://post.news/hakaneinarsson
I'm on the waiting list but once I get an account I'll give you a follow.
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Tesla shareholders must be loving me of time and focus their CEO is giving Twitter right now!
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If you think its bad for them, imagine the hypothetical scenario whereby you leveraged that stock to buy a non-profitable company significantly above the asking price. Would be enough to send someone into a bit of a spiral.
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Ok - I recently discovered something on Twitter that has made my experience there somewhat more enjoyable. I'm still spending less and less time there generally, but still.
I'm a little bit embarrassed that I never noticed this before but I'm going to put it out here in case others likewise were not aware.
Go on your feed. Underneath the word "Home" you will see 2 choices. "For you" and "Following"
Twitter defaults to "For You" and what I have noticed since EM took over, Twitter tends to push things onto my feed that are things would be the antithesis of things I post about or accounts that I follow. Like the whole point is to get followers angry about something enough to post a rebuttal or snark or what have you.
Once I clicked over to "Following" I get none of that. I pretty much get content only from accounts I like and follow with none of the annoying bait.
Please tell me I am not the last person on Earth to figure this out! :blush
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I think it's a new feature
"for you" is a rip off of tiktok's feed called the same thing
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Instagram has the same thing, you can click on top left on "Instagram" and hit following.
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Twitter appears to be down at the moment.
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Twitter appears to be down at the moment.
It's up for me.
But, related to that, it seems the Turkish govt was getting all butthurt about people criticizing their disaster response, and shut down Twitter, even though it's also a main way disaster response communication was being handled. I got a few friends in Turkey who are absolutely livid right now about it.
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Ok - I recently discovered something on Twitter that has made my experience there somewhat more enjoyable. I'm still spending less and less time there generally, but still.
I'm a little bit embarrassed that I never noticed this before but I'm going to put it out here in case others likewise were not aware.
Go on your feed. Underneath the word "Home" you will see 2 choices. "For you" and "Following"
Twitter defaults to "For You" and what I have noticed since EM took over, Twitter tends to push things onto my feed that are things would be the antithesis of things I post about or accounts that I follow. Like the whole point is to get followers angry about something enough to post a rebuttal or snark or what have you.
Once I clicked over to "Following" I get none of that. I pretty much get content only from accounts I like and follow with none of the annoying bait.
Please tell me I am not the last person on Earth to figure this out! :blush
You are absolutely not. I might be, but you are not. :) :) :)
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https://www.platformer.news/p/elon-musk-fires-a-top-twitter-engineer?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email
Hmmm.
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https://www.platformer.news/p/elon-musk-fires-a-top-twitter-engineer?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email
Hmmm.
Oof, just gives more to my theory that this guy cares wayyyy too much about getting attention. And that engineers response seems likely too because I know for myself, I've just scrolled on past anything he has said lately. I'm not interested in him running twitter anymore. Twitter has been chugging along and for most people, now that his over taken has died down, have moved on to either not using the platform or using it as they did before the take over.
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https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2023/mar/07/elon-musk-twitter-employee-feud-haraldur-thorleifsson
Ugly conduct of Chairman Musk aside, firing a guy who agreed to take a salary instead of a 100 million dollar pay-out, at a time when you are supremely overleveraged already is a bold move.
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https://www.platformer.news/p/elon-musk-fires-a-top-twitter-engineer?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email
Hmmm.
Does that page use some sort of weird font, or are the symbols for letters their way of pay-walling it?
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https://www.platformer.news/p/elon-musk-fires-a-top-twitter-engineer?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email
Hmmm.
Does that page use some sort of weird font, or are the symbols for letters their way of pay-walling it?
I didn't see any weird font when I clicked. I do wish they'd stop using that picture of him, though. Like something from Metropolis.
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https://www.platformer.news/p/elon-musk-fires-a-top-twitter-engineer?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email
Hmmm.
Does that page use some sort of weird font, or are the symbols for letters their way of pay-walling it?
I didn't see any weird font when I clicked. I do wish they'd stop using that picture of him, though. Like something from Metropolis.
Firefox is substituting the font on my end with gibberish. C/Ping it elsewhere resolves the issue though. Maybe he should buy out Mozilla and kill off Firefox once and for all.
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I have to admit I did laugh more than I thought I would at Chris Rock skewering Musk in his Netflix special. "Elon has negative cum. That's why he looks so weird." :lol
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I do wish they'd stop using that picture of him, though. Like something from Metropolis.
That's what he actually looks like.
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https://www.platformer.news/p/elon-musk-fires-a-top-twitter-engineer?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email
Hmmm.
Twitter has become a parody of a parody.
Why are my numbers tanking?
er, em, uh, uh, SPLUNGE!
You're fired!
It really is a carbon copy.
https://vimeo.com/617393744
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https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2023/mar/07/elon-musk-twitter-employee-feud-haraldur-thorleifsson
Ugly conduct of Chairman Musk aside, firing a guy who agreed to take a salary instead of a 100 million dollar pay-out, at a time when you are supremely overleveraged already is a bold move.
This comes off as a "gotcha" moment from this guy. Like he threw the bait out to Elon and he bit. He just comes off really bad here by responding publicly and just made it worse and worse as he kept going. I can't help but keep feeling like Elon is an attention whore.
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https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2023/mar/07/elon-musk-twitter-employee-feud-haraldur-thorleifsson
Ugly conduct of Chairman Musk aside, firing a guy who agreed to take a salary instead of a 100 million dollar pay-out, at a time when you are supremely overleveraged already is a bold move.
This comes off as a "gotcha" moment from this guy. Like he threw the bait out to Elon and he bit. He just comes off really bad here by responding publicly and just made it worse and worse as he kept going. I can't help but keep feeling like Elon is an attention whore.
Of course he is. It's his defining characteristic.
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Not going to blow up the funny thread, since it is, well, funny, but since the three examples are all Twitter I'll post here:
It makes me sad how many people are seemingly so insecure they have to troll for compliments from strangers on the interwebs. Of course that's their prerogative, and it's a better outcome than some of them, but it's still a sign that something is desperately, tragically wrong.
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Not going to blow up the funny thread, since it is, well, funny, but since the three examples are all Twitter I'll post here:
It makes me sad how many people are seemingly so insecure they have to troll for compliments from strangers on the interwebs. Of course that's their prerogative, and it's a better outcome than some of them, but it's still a sign that something is desperately, tragically wrong.
Like.
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Not going to blow up the funny thread, since it is, well, funny, but since the three examples are all Twitter I'll post here:
It makes me sad how many people are seemingly so insecure they have to troll for compliments from strangers on the interwebs. Of course that's their prerogative, and it's a better outcome than some of them, but it's still a sign that something is desperately, tragically wrong.
Like.
I get what you did there!! Believe me, though, if that was your message, if I was looking for arbitrary self-assurance and affirmation that I was the bomb-diddly, I wouldn't be posting what I post on DTF. ::)
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Speaking of twitter, I read this article yesterday (https://inews.co.uk/news/pressure-cooker-elon-musk-twitter-2196309) and I get that it is within his rights to do this, but it is a D*** move IMO:
No one knows who’s next for the chop. Managers were recently told to provide a list of people who ought to be promoted...many of those managers were subsequently fired and replaced by those they’d recommended, as part of a cost-cutting drive.
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Not going to blow up the funny thread, since it is, well, funny, but since the three examples are all Twitter I'll post here:
It makes me sad how many people are seemingly so insecure they have to troll for compliments from strangers on the interwebs. Of course that's their prerogative, and it's a better outcome than some of them, but it's still a sign that something is desperately, tragically wrong.
Well, I'll go a bit further and just general trolling on the internet. It's sad. Like on my youtube channel people sometimes say really mean things. And I just have to ask, why? And the only thing I can think of is it's for the attention.
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Not going to blow up the funny thread, since it is, well, funny, but since the three examples are all Twitter I'll post here:
It makes me sad how many people are seemingly so insecure they have to troll for compliments from strangers on the interwebs. Of course that's their prerogative, and it's a better outcome than some of them, but it's still a sign that something is desperately, tragically wrong.
Well, I'll go a bit further and just general trolling on the internet. It's sad. Like on my youtube channel people sometimes say really mean things. And I just have to ask, why? And the only thing I can think of is it's for the attention.
I watched a documentary about Hunter Moore the other night. I mean, it was bad for what it was, and as disgusting and disturbing as it was, I couldn't help thinking throughout that it was such a colossal waste of time and resources.
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https://www.businessinsider.com/twitter-automatically-responds-to-press-emails-with-a-poop-emoji-2023-3?
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https://www.businessinsider.com/twitter-automatically-responds-to-press-emails-with-a-poop-emoji-2023-3?
On the one hand, that’s incredibly immature, stupid, unprofessional and bad for Twitter. On the other hand it’s pretty funny.
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On the one hand, that’s incredibly immature, stupid, unprofessional and bad for Twitter. On the other hand it’s pretty funny.
Indeed. Might be the first time musk was actually funny.
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Saw a headline in some news feed a few days ago about Musk saying that Twitter is worth less than half of what he paid? Not sure if that's true or not, but can't imagine the richest dude in the world getting screwed out of billions.
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Saw a headline in some news feed a few days ago about Musk saying that Twitter is worth less than half of what he paid? Not sure if that's true or not, but can't imagine the richest dude in the world getting screwed out of billions.
I don't think this is news though. I think he knew he over paid going in and actually tried to get out of the deal. Maybe he didn't realize how much he over paid though.
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Saw a headline in some news feed a few days ago about Musk saying that Twitter is worth less than half of what he paid? Not sure if that's true or not, but can't imagine the richest dude in the world getting screwed out of billions.
I saw that headline too and I'm not quite sure what to make of it either. It's hard to imagine someone as wealthy as Elon Musk getting screwed out of billions of dollars, but stranger things have happened.
I think it's important to remember that headlines can be misleading or not tell the whole story. It's possible that Musk's comment was taken out of context or there's more to the story than we know.
Either way, it'll be interesting to see how this develops and what happens with Twitter's value in the future.
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Saw a headline in some news feed a few days ago about Musk saying that Twitter is worth less than half of what he paid? Not sure if that's true or not, but can't imagine the richest dude in the world getting screwed out of billions.
I saw that headline too and I'm not quite sure what to make of it either. It's hard to imagine someone as wealthy as Elon Musk getting screwed out of billions of dollars, but stranger things have happened.
Why? Who else can get screwed out of billions of dollars?
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Yeah, not hard to believe that it is true.
If he really paid above market value, then surrounding all the drama he lost a bunch of sponsors and advertisement contracts, It's not hard to see that its value decreased. Maybe not by half, but certainly not worth the same it was 5-6 months ago.
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History is full of "emperor wears no clothes" moments.
And anyway, isn't a lot of Musk's net worth kind of theoretical? A lot of it could be, for example, value of TSLA stock, which has tanked since the ridiculous IPO.
Also, if I'm Musk, I'm not necessarily hurt over spinning some of my funds into a company that, while perhaps not worth what I paid for it, still happens to be a real company that now belongs to me, and not just value on a ledger that ebbs and flows with the value of a company I'm no longer directly in control over.
I guess where I stand is that, sure, he could have overpaid for it, but that doesn't mean he's not going to make money from it, or that it was necessarily a bad place to put his money. Time will tell. It does not seem like anyone's giving up twitter anytime soon.
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History is full of "emperor wears no clothes" moments.
And anyway, isn't a lot of Musk's net worth kind of theoretical? A lot of it could be, for example, value of TSLA stock, which has tanked since the ridiculous IPO.
Also, if I'm Musk, I'm not necessarily hurt over spinning some of my funds into a company that, while perhaps not worth what I paid for it, still happens to be a real company that now belongs to me, and not just value on a ledger that ebbs and flows with the value of a company I'm no longer directly in control over.
I guess where I stand is that, sure, he could have overpaid for it, but that doesn't mean he's not going to make money from it, or that it was necessarily a bad place to put his money. Time will tell. It does not seem like anyone's giving up twitter anytime soon.
Also he can power trip with it. Definitely some value there for him above the actual price.
And as for the bolded, yeah. I feel like there's been some algorithm changes that I'm not happy about (I feel like I only see a small % of my followers tweets with any regularity) but it's mostly been the same experience for me. When the old blue check marks go, I do wonder if that will have any impact. Probably not for me, but maybe for some.
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Parachuting into page 16 of this thread. For a while I've wanted a way to follow a handful of twitter accounts without needing an account of my own. A few years ago I found a way to create a feed without an account. There is a twitter "front end" called Nitter, where you replace twitter.com with nitter.net in the URL, like so:
https://twitter.com/mikeportnoy/ (https://twitter.com/mikeportnoy/) becomes https://nitter.net/mikeportnoy/ (https://nitter.net/mikeportnoy/)
This strips away the popups asking you to create an account, enable notifications, etc., and removes the scroll limits when viewing on mobile.
There are browser add-ons to automatically redirect you to nitter from twitter, i.e., if you click a link from another page. I use Privacy Redirect for Firefox (https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/privacy-redirect/?utm_source=addons.mozilla.org&utm_medium=referral&utm_content=search).
But the most useful thing for me is the RSS feed, for example:
https://nitter.net/mikeportnoy/rss (https://nitter.net/mikeportnoy/rss)
If you know what RSS is, and already use an RSS feed for blogs, etc, then you will already know what to do with that link. There are a bunch of RSS apps for desktop and mobile, and they will all be able to generate a feed from that /rss link. I have my feed mixed with blogs and news sites, so the twitter posts are just mixed with others.
Here is a bit more about it: https://www.wired.com/story/nitter-twitter-remove-ads-for-you-promoted-tweets/ (https://www.wired.com/story/nitter-twitter-remove-ads-for-you-promoted-tweets/)
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So I guess today is the end of the blue check marks as I see lots of the bands I follow no longer have them (and I don't blame them for not buying it). Seems also like twitter lost some business today from Microsoft because their advertising API is too expensive. Also I read Germany is suing twitter for hate speech that could cost up to 30 billion in fines. Must be a great day over in the twitter business.
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At least the SpaceX stuff is going well!
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:lol
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And with that example, MP is leaving Twitter.
https://nitter.net/MikePortnoy/status/1649913146692313088
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At least the SpaceX stuff is going well!
(https://scontent-ord5-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/342210154_1307260886866181_1744800828132630504_n.jpg?stp=cp6_dst-jpg&_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=Cg532rJNUx4AX8SuV7r&_nc_ht=scontent-ord5-2.xx&oh=00_AfDPvPNHeul8WHxHFsv_8b8itdy6UN-5FlTgOlzHOv-wqQ&oe=64488E1D)
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So apparently people who didnt pay for twitter blue are still getting the mark saying they did. Includes a number of high profile celebrities. Wonder if there's a law against implying someone has paid for/endorsed a product when they haven't...
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Not really talking about Portnoy, but self-important celebs crying about their blue check mark has been cracking me up for a while.
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Not really talking about Portnoy, but self-important celebs crying about their blue check mark has been cracking me up for a while.
self important or not verification serves an important purpose for public figures. Elon Musk’s twitter has completely messed it up.
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If you are dumb enough to not know who you are following, then maybe you are gullible. I get hot chick's following me on all media. They all can't be bots. Right? Lol
Social media isn't that essential to cause this much uproar.
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If you are dumb enough to not know who you are following, then maybe you are gullible. I get hot chick's following me on all media. They all can't be bots. Right? Lol
They can't all be chicks either. ;D
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That's my point. Their fake. I know that. I don't need a blue checkmark to figure out some dude is not Portnoy.
Or a hot Chick that's into a 55 year old, graying, fat man. :lol
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That's my point. Their fake. I know that. I don't need a blue checkmark to figure out some dude is not Portnoy.
Or a hot Chick that's into a 55 year old, graying, fat man. :lol
but if anyone can copy paste a public figure’s profile with a slightly different user name no one would notice at first then it’s a problem.
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If you all ready follow them you are good. If you want to follow a star, most fake people don't post like the stars.
Listen, I understand why it makes it easier but it just takes a little energy on our parts to know who is real or not.
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That's my point. Their fake. I know that. I don't need a blue checkmark to figure out some dude is not Portnoy.
Or a hot Chick that's into a 55 year old, graying, fat man. :lol
You mean they're not? :)
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Not really talking about Portnoy, but self-important celebs crying about their blue check mark has been cracking me up for a while.
self important or not verification serves an important purpose for public figures. Elon Musk’s twitter has completely messed it up.
Then let them pay their measly 8 dollars a month. Or are these self-important people really that upset that a platform that previously allowed them to promote themselves free of charge suddenly comes with a super small purse string?
Note: that question is for almost anyone, as I know Xe is almost never interested in actual dialogue or any pushback to his "pounding my first on the desk" drive-by statements.
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Not really talking about Portnoy, but self-important celebs crying about their blue check mark has been cracking me up for a while.
self important or not verification serves an important purpose for public figures. Elon Musk’s twitter has completely messed it up.
Then let them pay their measly 8 dollars a month. Or are these self-important people really that upset that a platform that previously allowed them to promote themselves free of charge suddenly comes with a super small purse string?
that’s not how it works, at least imo. They brought value (eyeballs) to the site.
edit: i messed up the quoting
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The problem with MP's reason to leave is that Facebook and Instagram still have the same issue with people with fake accounts. The blue check mark doesn't solve the issue, just helps, because in the end, there's a significant portion of the population that is not like King here and actually falls for the fake traps.
What I do agree with MPs decision, is if twitter as a platform, is no longer trustworthy then he has a right to not use it and not provide it any money.
I'm curious if Twitter can perform well at actually blocking the fake content as well as the sites that still have a blue check mark though.
Anyway, it's sad that our social media options have become Zuckerburg (Facebook/Instagram), Elon (Twitter), or China (TikTok). None of the three are trustworthy anyway.
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So apparently people who didnt pay for twitter blue are still getting the mark saying they did. Includes a number of high profile celebrities. Wonder if there's a law against implying someone has paid for/endorsed a product when they haven't...
From what I've seen, it's happening to accounts that have at least 1 million followers. I've seen multiple say they did nothing to receive the blue check marks, they just appeared.
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Not really talking about Portnoy, but self-important celebs crying about their blue check mark has been cracking me up for a while.
self important or not verification serves an important purpose for public figures. Elon Musk’s twitter has completely messed it up.
Then let them pay their measly 8 dollars a month. Or are these self-important people really that upset that a platform that previously allowed them to promote themselves free of charge suddenly comes with a super small purse string?
Note: that question is for almost anyone, as I know Xe is almost never interested in actual dialogue or any pushback to his "pounding my first on the desk" drive-by statements.
The payment isn't the issue. The check mark on the past indicated only one thing: this is the official account of the person or organisation in the profile, and we have independently verified that they are exactly who they claim to be. It wasn't about status, it was about trust. Now any bell end can pay $8, get a check mark that used to confer authenticity, do a bit of work replicating a reputable organisation or copy an individual's profile appearance and get out there and spread disinformation in their name. And while I'm sure that many on this forum probably have the critical thinking skillsto distinguish a fraud or an imposter, the fact remains that a significant segment of the population (particularly in population and user base ARE susceptible to such attacks.
Celebs aren't bemoaning their loss of status (Stephen king doesn't need a blue tick to have status), they are bemoaning that Elon took a feature with a well defined and important purpose in making the site a trustworthy source of information and ruined it to give a bunch of nobodies a way to feel like they have some kind of status on the site. So in that respect: why on earth would Celebs or news organisations pay for a product that is literally worthless to them.
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The problem with MP's reason to leave is that Facebook and Instagram still have the same issue with people with fake accounts. The blue check mark doesn't solve the issue, just helps, because in the end, there's a significant portion of the population that is not like King here and actually falls for the fake traps.
What I do agree with MPs decision, is if twitter as a platform, is no longer trustworthy then he has a right to not use it and not provide it any money.
I'm curious if Twitter can perform well at actually blocking the fake content as well as the sites that still have a blue check mark though.
Anyway, it's sad that our social media options have become Zuckerburg (Facebook/Instagram), Elon (Twitter), or China (TikTok). None of the three are trustworthy anyway.
Totally agree. If someone doesn't trust Twitter and wants to tell it and Musk to go f themselves, I say go for it.
I suspect, like many things, this will work itself out and people just have to be patient. I am sure Musk knows that having many big names on there is good for the site (I agree with Xe on that), so you just have to let the noise die down a little and it will work itself out, but overreacting on Twitter these days is second nature to many these days, so overreacting on Twitter ABOUT Twitter is pretty funny, if you think about it.
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Not really talking about Portnoy, but self-important celebs crying about their blue check mark has been cracking me up for a while.
self important or not verification serves an important purpose for public figures. Elon Musk’s twitter has completely messed it up.
Then let them pay their measly 8 dollars a month. Or are these self-important people really that upset that a platform that previously allowed them to promote themselves free of charge suddenly comes with a super small purse string?
Note: that question is for almost anyone, as I know Xe is almost never interested in actual dialogue or any pushback to his "pounding my first on the desk" drive-by statements.
The payment isn't the issue. The check mark on the past indicated only one thing: this is the official account of the person or organisation in the profile, and we have independently verified that they are exactly who they claim to be. It wasn't about status, it was about trust. Now any bell end can pay $8, get a check mark that used to confer authenticity, do a bit of work replicating a reputable organisation or copy an individual's profile appearance and get out there and spread disinformation in their name. And while I'm sure that many on this forum probably have the critical thinking skillsto distinguish a fraud or an imposter, the fact remains that a significant segment of the population (particularly in population and user base ARE susceptible to such attacks.
Celebs aren't bemoaning their loss of status (Stephen king doesn't need a blue tick to have status), they are bemoaning that Elon took a feature with a well defined and important purpose in making the site a trustworthy source of information and ruined it to give a bunch of nobodies a way to feel like they have some kind of status on the site. So in that respect: why on earth would Celebs or news organisations pay for a product that is literally worthless to them.
I'm reading this, and you are, of course, factually correct. But I'm also reading this and thinking - since I'm not a fan of social media AT ALL, and think at best it's only neutral on a value scale - this IS social media. Social media IS all about having "some kind of status". You're focusing on the positive aspects, but maybe not Stephen King, but people who are famous for being famous - who count their "likes" - the blue check IS status. Twitter, except for the most basic of information regarding concert dates and the like, ISN'T trustworthy. Don't try to tell me that the "Paid Democratic Operatives" and the "MAGA Russian Bots" are furthering any discourse in America at this time. They are not.
We can debate whether this is short-sighted or not, and I understand the argument as to why it is, but I reckon that, like El Barto has pointed out a couple times now, Musk is doing this in real time. He's got better data than you, me or Xe has, by a long shot. I would venture to say he knows the ratios of "Stephen King's/Mike Portnoy's" (though King has, to my knowledge, only threatened to leave, pulling the social media equivalent of "I'm moving to Canada!") to those that can't afford the blow to their psyche by abdicating their millions of followers.
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the blue check IS status.
While I agree with Xe on the positives and maybe the intended point of the blue check mark, if you've been on twitter, you'd know there were an insane amount of nobody accounts with the blue check mark. It definitely wasn't only for celebrities. The end result was people using it to show some sort of status of "being known" when many of these people certainly are not. I believe that $8 was meant for the people who would have no issue buying such status.
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So apparently people who didnt pay for twitter blue are still getting the mark saying they did. Includes a number of high profile celebrities. Wonder if there's a law against implying someone has paid for/endorsed a product when they haven't...
From what I've seen, it's happening to accounts that have at least 1 million followers. I've seen multiple say they did nothing to receive the blue check marks, they just appeared.
Seems like it's a contingency measure against the "block the blue" campaign, where a bunch of people were just blocking everyone who paid the $8 (overwhelmingly, they seem to be Elon phanatics, crypto-bros, and people with libertarian politics)
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I'm reading this, and you are, of course, factually correct. But I'm also reading this and thinking - since I'm not a fan of social media AT ALL, and think at best it's only neutral on a value scale - this IS social media. Social media IS all about having "some kind of status". You're focusing on the positive aspects, but maybe not Stephen King, but people who are famous for being famous - who count their "likes" - the blue check IS status. Twitter, except for the most basic of information regarding concert dates and the like, ISN'T trustworthy. Don't try to tell me that the "Paid Democratic Operatives" and the "MAGA Russian Bots" are furthering any discourse in America at this time. They are not.
Regardless of whether the information itself is "trustworthy" (and to dismiss all information on Twitter as unreliable is IMO just as fallacious as accepting all information as true uncritically), I could at least be ensured in the past that that an account calling itself BBC News with a blue check was in fact BBC News, or that a bloke with a blue tick with the title "Middle East correspondent for Deutsche Welle" does in fact hold that position, rather than them being some crypto bell-end in Russia putting out fake press releases to grift people.
By an large, the people who got blue ticks weren't people who were "famous for being famous". If they were, I would hold a greater degree of agreement with you.
We can debate whether this is short-sighted or not, and I understand the argument as to why it is, but I reckon that, like El Barto has pointed out a couple times now, Musk is doing this in real time. He's got better data than you, me or Xe has, by a long shot.
He's also demonstrated that he is capable of extremely bad judgement and can be driven by ego and "memes" rather than data when he prefers.
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By an large, the people who got blue ticks weren't people who were "famous for being famous".
Right. Most of those people make their home on Instagram.
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So, I have never created a twitter account, but every so often to check the page for some of the artists I'm interested in just to see if they have any updates. Well, turns out I cannot do that anymore, because unless I'm logged into an account, any twitter link redirects you to a log in/sign up page :tdwn
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So, I have never created a twitter account, but every so often to check the page for some of the artists I'm interested in just to see if they have any updates. Well, turns out I cannot do that anymore, because unless I'm logged into an account, any twitter link redirects you to a log in/sign up page :tdwn
I saw this post this morning, and you're right. WTF? I usually check out the twitters of some of the hockey writers, which would come in handy tomorrow as Free Agency begins.
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You would have to create burner accounts on Twitter using those 10 min. email thingamabob if you really want to look at Twitter posts, but not partake in it.
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You would have to create burner accounts on Twitter using those 10 min. email thingamabob if you really want to look at Twitter posts, but not partake in it.
Yeah, nah, I'm good.
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You would have to create burner accounts on Twitter using those 10 min. email thingamabob if you really want to look at Twitter posts, but not partake in it.
Yeah I have a throwaway email I use for all my socials and whatever sites just ask for them (including DTF lol)... occasionally I check the inbox because things like Fandango and Livenation are tied to it and I sometimes need tix or whatever, and that inbox looks like the opening scene of Wall-E :lol
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I saw this post this morning, and you're right. WTF? I usually check out the twitters of some of the hockey writers, which would come in handy tomorrow as Free Agency begins.
Apparently Elon implemented it to stop orgs scraping the data.
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I saw this post this morning, and you're right. WTF? I usually check out the twitters of some of the hockey writers, which would come in handy tomorrow as Free Agency begins.
Apparently Elon implemented it to stop orgs scraping the data.
and a post view limit? wtf this new change is getting ripped on twitter right now
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Yep, this is going to push most of us elsewhere. I’d give it a half a day until he reversed this policy.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/news/2023/07/01/elon-musk-twitter-tweet-reading-limits/70375995007/
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There's word that Muskrat's post about limits is a ruse. They apparently created a DDOS on themselves when they implemented that new policy. Someone posted the reciepts out there showing the kind of traffic he was creating towards Twitter when trying to access a post while not logged in. It's pretty hilarious.
https://www.dexerto.com/tech/twitter-users-claim-elon-musks-recent-changes-may-be-self-ddosing-the-platform-2196413/
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I've also seen reports that this might be tied to them not paying Google their cloud services bill. Given how much money the site seems to be haemorrhaging atm, could well be plausible.
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Maybe Elon is taking a note from the school of Trump and just not paying bills
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Elon is threatening to sue Zuck over Threads... This will be interesting.
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I think my life is better not knowing the nonsense between 2 rich assholes. :lol
I have other stupid stuff to argue about online. :lol
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Elon is threatening to sue Zuck over Threads... This will be interesting.
I thought these guys agreed that they were going to fight each other somewhere. Can they just rent a barn out in the middle of nowhere and they can just beat the crap out of each other and then make peace?
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Elon is threatening to sue Zuck over Threads... This will be interesting.
I thought these guys agreed that they were going to fight each other somewhere. Can they just rent a barn out in the middle of nowhere and they can just beat the crap out of each other and then make peace?
They were supposed to and then Elon's mom wouldn't sign his permission slip :lol :lol
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Elon is threatening to sue Zuck over Threads... This will be interesting.
(https://i.redd.it/y0oblpx0sfab1.jpg)
::)
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I think my life is better not knowing the nonsense between 2 rich assholes being being on twitter
Fix'd for me
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Lol
It's weird that people just can't scroll on by anymore. People have lost the ability to do that.
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Musk's eccentricity aside, the minute you start criticizing your boss and/or place of employment on social media (not to mention the social media for whom you work!!), you are asking to get fired. I never feel sorry for anyone in those scenarios. Play stupid games, you win stupid prizes.
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Musk's eccentricity aside, the minute you start criticizing your boss and/or place of employment on social media (not to mention the social media for whom you work!!), you are asking to get fired. I never feel sorry for anyone in those scenarios. Play stupid games, you win stupid prizes.
Related, but not, but sort of... I clicked on one of those "click bait" sites for "10 best interview fails" or something like that, and every single one was some one bragging about how they went into an interview and "handed it" to the interviewer, smart-mouthing back to questions they felt were stupid, criticizing them for not offering water or coffee...
I get wanting to see if a company is a good fit. I get that an interview is a two-way street of sorts. I get that most people don't have the first f------g clue on how to interview someone. But not everything is a battle, not everything needs to be reduced to a twitter validation or affirmation. My goodness; I've been arguing that people are insecure for some time now, but are they THAT insecure that that have to feel like they're getting one over on someone that is actively trying to HELP them (by potentially giving them a job)? We're bordering on pathetic now.
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Musk's eccentricity aside, the minute you start criticizing your boss and/or place of employment on social media (not to mention the social media for whom you work!!), you are asking to get fired. I never feel sorry for anyone in those scenarios. Play stupid games, you win stupid prizes.
Related, but not, but sort of... I clicked on one of those "click bait" sites for "10 best interview fails" or something like that, and every single one was some one bragging about how they went into an interview and "handed it" to the interviewer, smart-mouthing back to questions they felt were stupid, criticizing them for not offering water or coffee...
I get wanting to see if a company is a good fit. I get that an interview is a two-way street of sorts. I get that most people don't have the first f------g clue on how to interview someone. But not everything is a battle, not everything needs to be reduced to a twitter validation or affirmation. My goodness; I've been arguing that people are insecure for some time now, but are they THAT insecure that that have to feel like they're getting one over on someone that is actively trying to HELP them (by potentially giving them a job)? We're bordering on pathetic now.
I cannot remember where I read it (it might have been here :lol), but I recall the blurb about someone doing a facetime interview and then getting upset and offended when they were asked to come into the office to do an in-person interview. :facepalm: :facepalm: Probably one of those "I am awesome, and you should just take my word for it and hire me immediately" people who are becoming more and more common.
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Musk's eccentricity aside, the minute you start criticizing your boss and/or place of employment on social media (not to mention the social media for whom you work!!), you are asking to get fired. I never feel sorry for anyone in those scenarios. Play stupid games, you win stupid prizes.
Related, but not, but sort of... I clicked on one of those "click bait" sites for "10 best interview fails" or something like that, and every single one was some one bragging about how they went into an interview and "handed it" to the interviewer, smart-mouthing back to questions they felt were stupid, criticizing them for not offering water or coffee...
I get wanting to see if a company is a good fit. I get that an interview is a two-way street of sorts. I get that most people don't have the first f------g clue on how to interview someone. But not everything is a battle, not everything needs to be reduced to a twitter validation or affirmation. My goodness; I've been arguing that people are insecure for some time now, but are they THAT insecure that that have to feel like they're getting one over on someone that is actively trying to HELP them (by potentially giving them a job)? We're bordering on pathetic now.
I cannot remember where I read it (it might have been here :lol), but I recall the blurb about someone doing a facetime interview and then getting upset and offended when they were asked to come into the office to do an in-person interview. :facepalm: :facepalm: Probably one of those "I am awesome, and you should just take my word for it and hire me immediately" people who are becoming more and more common.
That's why I love kitchens and how we do 'Stages' (try outs), can find out in a 4 hour shift for sure if someone knows what the fuck they're doing
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That's why I love kitchens and how we do 'Stages' (try outs), can find out in a 4 hour shift for sure if someone knows what the fuck they're doing
In college, I interviewed for a management position with Taco Bell, and they had me come out and do a "Realistic". It was like 2 or 3 hours. After the first hour, I was literally the best worker they had on that shift. :lol
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That's why I love kitchens and how we do 'Stages' (try outs), can find out in a 4 hour shift for sure if someone knows what the fuck they're doing
In college, I interviewed for a management position with Taco Bell, and they had me come out and do a "Realistic". It was like 2 or 3 hours. After the first hour, I was literally the best worker they had on that shift. :lol
For general linecooks, we just have them work part of or a whole shift, you can easily tell if they're up to snuff or not in that amount of time. At my level, it usually involves a full tasting. My last gig I had to do a salad, an entree, a fish entree, a passed app and a plated app. Then basically the whole hotel management team came and critiqued it, it's hella nervewraking. My current gig the boss already knew my skills so I just did a day in the kitchen more to see if I was interested in their operation, that's the difference between applying and being pursued in my business.
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That's why I love kitchens and how we do 'Stages' (try outs), can find out in a 4 hour shift for sure if someone knows what the fuck they're doing
In college, I interviewed for a management position with Taco Bell, and they had me come out and do a "Realistic". It was like 2 or 3 hours. After the first hour, I was literally the best worker they had on that shift. :lol
For general linecooks, we just have them work part of or a whole shift, you can easily tell if they're up to snuff or not in that amount of time. At my level, it usually involves a full tasting. My last gig I had to do a salad, an entree, a fish entree, a passed app and a plated app. Then basically the whole hotel management team came and critiqued it, it's hella nervewraking. My current gig the boss already knew my skills so I just did a day in the kitchen more to see if I was interested in their operation, that's the difference between applying and being pursued in my business.
That's all very interesting. :tup
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That's why I love kitchens and how we do 'Stages' (try outs), can find out in a 4 hour shift for sure if someone knows what the fuck they're doing
In college, I interviewed for a management position with Taco Bell, and they had me come out and do a "Realistic". It was like 2 or 3 hours. After the first hour, I was literally the best worker they had on that shift. :lol
For general linecooks, we just have them work part of or a whole shift, you can easily tell if they're up to snuff or not in that amount of time. At my level, it usually involves a full tasting. My last gig I had to do a salad, an entree, a fish entree, a passed app and a plated app. Then basically the whole hotel management team came and critiqued it, it's hella nervewraking. My current gig the boss already knew my skills so I just did a day in the kitchen more to see if I was interested in their operation, that's the difference between applying and being pursued in my business.
That's all very interesting. :tup
Yea it really is! How many kitchen staff do you work alongside?
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That's why I love kitchens and how we do 'Stages' (try outs), can find out in a 4 hour shift for sure if someone knows what the fuck they're doing
In college, I interviewed for a management position with Taco Bell, and they had me come out and do a "Realistic". It was like 2 or 3 hours. After the first hour, I was literally the best worker they had on that shift. :lol
For general linecooks, we just have them work part of or a whole shift, you can easily tell if they're up to snuff or not in that amount of time. At my level, it usually involves a full tasting. My last gig I had to do a salad, an entree, a fish entree, a passed app and a plated app. Then basically the whole hotel management team came and critiqued it, it's hella nervewraking. My current gig the boss already knew my skills so I just did a day in the kitchen more to see if I was interested in their operation, that's the difference between applying and being pursued in my business.
That's all very interesting. :tup
Yea it really is! How many kitchen staff do you work alongside?
Just 3 of us... My current account is very small, a top tier law firm with their own private bistro, I serve around 40 people a day.
My company has much larger accounts though, including Facebook, Lyft, and Marvell, all of which have brigades of up to 100 people.
I'll take my tiny kitchen though, love the hands on feel of it.
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I just deactivated my Twitter account. Feels good, although I never really used it much honestly.
So a heads up for those few of you DTFers who follows me there. Whenever Threads become availabile in the EU/Sweden I'll check it out.
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I just deactivated my Twitter account. Feels good, although I never really used it much honestly.
So a heads up for those few of you DTFers who follows me there. Whenever Threads become availabile in the EU/Sweden I'll check it out.
Would if I could... it's amazing how invested the Japanese musicians still are on that platform. They're slowly migrating to IG, so hopefully one day I can ditch it as well.
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I won't be using threads. It seems you can't delete your account there unless you delete your instagram account.
It's weird because for awhile I was anti-facebook mostly because I don't like Mark Zuckerburg. So I got big into using twitter instead. Of course now it's owned by Elon and it's like well, I don't want to support him either, but I certainly don't want to support Zuckerburg still too.
I guess the option is to not use it at all, but I enjoy it still. I have a lot of fun tweeting and interacting with others over there. It is what it is I guess, but I'm not doubling down on Threads.
I'm also not buying into the hype of the millions of installs last week. Let's see how it plays out in the long run vs. initial installs because they already had a huge base of people to pull from making that stat a bit less impressive for me.
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Meta and anything Meta-related is a non-started for me. So no Threads.
I'll stay on the sinking Twitter ship, or maybe check out BlueSky if that sticks.
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I think the tweet limit has been quietly lifted (and was apparently something to do with Elon not paying his hosting bill or something like that). I haven't had any issues since the first weekend it was announced. Also, Threads from what I've heard is pointless and will likely disappear in a few weeks/months.
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so are they for real with this « X » business? Seems too stupid but here we are https://www.axios.com/2023/07/23/twitter-x-logo-elon-musk
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Twitter is dead.
Long live X.
It's a bold move to take a brand so ubiquitous that it literally invented a new verb, and I stead go for something that is almost impossible to trademark.
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Almost as bold as firing a lot of people and mock them online and then get pissed when they get hired from the competition to create another rival social media.
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Twitter is dead. Long live X.
It's a bold move to take a brand so ubiquitous that it literally invented a new verb, and I stead go for something that is almost impossible to trademark.
If I remember right he has been trying to do this X everything app since the paypal days, I guess this is where he sees his opportunity.
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Quite.
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Twitter is dead. Long live X.
It's a bold move to take a brand so ubiquitous that it literally invented a new verb, and I stead go for something that is almost impossible to trademark.
If I remember right he has been trying to do this X everything app since the paypal days, I guess this is where he sees his opportunity.
And the "X" means something to him, since it's ubiquitous in his other endeavors (SpaceX, X.com xAI) and other aspects of his life (one of his kids with Grimes is named "X").
Personally, I think it's one of those things that make sense to him, whether it's his being on the spectrum or not, and we either go along or we don't. From a business perspective, it's probably not the conventional choice, but it's his money.
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[snip] (that's a porn website, fyi) just had their account shutdown. I wonder if he's going to go after the name. Does Twitter currently host video content, or is it made elsewhere and just linked?
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Thread title updated to reflect the changing times. ;)
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Twitter is dead. Long live X.
It's a bold move to take a brand so ubiquitous that it literally invented a new verb, and I stead go for something that is almost impossible to trademark.
If I remember right he has been trying to do this X everything app since the paypal days, I guess this is where he sees his opportunity.
And the "X" means something to him, since it's ubiquitous in his other endeavors (SpaceX, X.com xAI) and other aspects of his life (one of his kids with Grimes is named "X").
Personally, I think it's one of those things that make sense to him, whether it's his being on the spectrum or not, and we either go along or we don't. From a business perspective, it's probably not the conventional choice, but it's his money.
Yeah, I can see what you mean about making sense to him. It's a bit mind boggling, because I feel like doing this is going to cost a lot of money, but for what gain? It's his money to throw away. Honestly, the rebranding is the first time I've thought to myself, maybe time to jump ship. But I don't think there's another platform to jump ship to. (other than just avoiding social media completely)
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So, it won't be called Twitter, it'll be called "X?" ugh. I think I'm done now. it was bad enough with him buying it. Now he's totally rebranding. I'm done.
I was just in the market for a couple of new vehicles, and considered Teslas until we decided to go a different route because of this guy's insanity. About time I dump his social platform too.
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So, it won't be called Twitter, it'll be called "X?" ugh. I think I'm done now. it was bad enough with him buying it. Now he's totally rebranding. I'm done.
I was just in the market for a couple of new vehicles, and considered Teslas until we decided to go a different route because of this guy's insanity. About time I dumb his social platform too.
So funny, on my way into work today I had to pass 2 slow Teslas on the right because they were blocking traffic in the left lane. I thought to myself "fuck elon" and I think it came to my mind because of all this X talk. I don't know why it's bothering me so much to make me question the platform (after all the changes too) but it is.
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Here's the thing with the concept of the EV and Tesla - I had a lot of respect for Musk when he launched Tesla, and then instead of keeping his patent on the motor, he opened it to everyone - launching the whole widespread movement to EV. I support that. There are a lot of issues (getting rid of batteries being a big one, as well as charging infrastructure, which is another), but ultimately, I think an alternative to gas, whatever that may ultimately be (and I think it'll be something else), is a good thing, in the long run, and will be necessary.
But then he became unhinged. Just the way he purchased Twitter, fired all the staff, and from all accounts, literally turned a fun place to work into a nightmare...no. I mean, if being this innovative, successful company means absolutely grinding and getting shit on in your place of employment - hard pass. I respect brilliant minds. But there is a sense of humanity, wisdom, and kindness that in my mind, is more important than brilliance.
So we said no to his cars, and I literally just deactivated my Twitter "X" account after posting my last post.
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Is it going to be called X? Or just have the X replace the bird?
Are posts still called tweets or Xs? I don’t use Twitter so this is more entertaining.
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But then he became unhinged. Just the way he purchased Twitter, fired all the staff, and from all accounts, literally turned a fun place to work into a nightmare...no. I mean, if being this innovative, successful company means absolutely grinding and getting shit on in your place of employment - hard pass. I respect brilliant minds. But there is a sense of humanity, wisdom, and kindness that in my mind, is more important than brilliance.
I don't work there so this doesn't bother me too much. I'm sure I support many companies that have terrible work cultures. As long as it's not illegal (and it seems some stuff he's done may be borderline, I don't know) then I'm not going to shit on him too hard for how he runs his company internally. I don't think Teslas are bad cars or anything either. Just this X thing sounds so stupid. I guess once I get over the change it'll be fine.
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So, it won't be called Twitter, it'll be called "X?" ugh. I think I'm done now. it was bad enough with him buying it. Now he's totally rebranding. I'm done.
Yeah I'm glad I jumped ship a few weeks ago.
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Here's the thing with the concept of the EV and Tesla - I had a lot of respect for Musk when he launched Tesla, and then instead of keeping his patent on the motor, he opened it to everyone - launching the whole widespread movement to EV. I support that. There are a lot of issues (getting rid of batteries being a big one, as well as charging infrastructure, which is another), but ultimately, I think an alternative to gas, whatever that may ultimately be (and I think it'll be something else), is a good thing, in the long run, and will be necessary.
But then he became unhinged. Just the way he purchased Twitter, fired all the staff, and from all accounts, literally turned a fun place to work into a nightmare...no. I mean, if being this innovative, successful company means absolutely grinding and getting shit on in your place of employment - hard pass. I respect brilliant minds. But there is a sense of humanity, wisdom, and kindness that in my mind, is more important than brilliance.
So we said no to his cars, and I literally just deactivated my Twitter "X" account after posting my last post.
Well, I'm coming at this from a different view; I don't use Twitter and couldn't really care about any social media to be honest. And electric cars are on the horizon for sure, but I'm not down with all the hyperbole around them. But... some of that is anecdotal. I worked for GE: to many on the outside it was hellish. "Neutron Jack Welch" and all that. Yet FOR ME, it was the greatest work experience of my life. I did more and learned more in the first five years I was there than in the rest of my career combined, more or less. So who am I to judge what someone else experiences in their work place?
I really don't see the problem here. My electric comes from Eversource (well, it comes from the sun, because I have solar) but it was and always will be "Northeast Utilities" because that's how I know it. I go see concerts - including Dream Theater - at the "Toyota presents the Oakdale Theatre, powered by Xfinity". It's always going to be "the Oakdale" to me, because that's how I know it. Companies change names.
If he loses business, I can't believe it's because of branding; it will be because there's something better, and that's the call of the wild in the business world. So be it.
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Well, Twitter has been a cesspool for a long time. Musk has done nothing to improve it. Add to that a brand change to his "X" symbol, and all the stories about how he treats people...he doesn't need my patronage/usage of his properties.
That's all I was saying.
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Elon was someone I respected for what he was doing and then the screws starting coming loose. I think it began with that whole kids troop stuck in the cave calling some guy a pedophile thing. That's when I started losing respect for him. Now, I don't want anything to do with anything he does. It's that same god-complex that Steve Jobs had. Jobs was a horrible person from what I can tell yet some worship him. Sound familiar?
I'm hoping Bluesky can eventually open up and fill the Twitter, sorry X, void. Many of the people I follow on Twitter, sorry X, seem to have abandoned it as they haven't posted in months, but they are in other places. Musk really shot himself in the foot.
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Are posts still called tweets or Xs? I don’t use Twitter so this is more entertaining.
I've never had a Twit-, sorry, X account, but apparently they are supposed to be called "xeets" now. :facepalm:
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I have not seen the change to my account yet. No X. Still have the bird. Lol
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I have not seen the change to my account yet. No X. Still have the bird. Lol
You haven't heard about the bird?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSlB4eznXoA
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I'm not opening that and having that earworm. Lol
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Darnit :lol
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I'm not opening that and having that earworm. Lol
:lol
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Here's a fun twist... So one of Twitter's biggest markets is Japan, and via the rebranding they're calling it X-Japan... Unfortunately for Elon that name is already trademarked by legendary metal band of the same name.
Frontman Yoshiki tweeted this...
https://twitter.com/YoshikiOfficial/status/1683365008019959808?s=19 (https://twitter.com/YoshikiOfficial/status/1683365008019959808?s=19)
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Not to mention that Microsoft has a trademark on X and Meta also has a trademark on X specifically in the social media domain. Another well thought out plan from the genius.
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Not to mention that Microsoft has a trademark on X and Meta also has a trademark on X specifically in the social media domain. Another well thought out plan from the genius.
I also saw the logo used somewhere else
This seems very poorly thought out
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So when does twitter become X?
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So when does twitter become X?
It's already rebranded on the website, but I dont know if that means anything because the app is still Twitter.
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It's also still located at "twitter.com" and I'm assuming that won't change any time soon (if ever).
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Not to mention that Microsoft has a trademark on X and Meta also has a trademark on X specifically in the social media domain. Another well thought out plan from the genius.
I also saw the logo used somewhere else
This seems very poorly thought out
It's so wild how poorly thought out this is considering he has been pushing this x app idea since the PayPal days.
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The "X" logo is just a generic uniform font. Elon probably just typed "x" into a word doc and scrolled through all the different font options until he found one he liked.
https://www.businessinsider.com/twitter-x-logo-unicode-math-textbooks-2023-7#:~:text=Twitter%20on%20Monday%20rolled%20out,font%20%22Special%20Alphabet%204.%22
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(https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/363376195_10233016979833538_8858408155640744349_n.jpg?_nc_cat=110&cb=99be929b-59f725be&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=dbeb18&_nc_ohc=Wt05EUGU91gAX_2yePm&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=00_AfDmeWUqnLzUD6eI2v0kGFiBhE77IwQkToloYJVbCX0rfw&oe=64C60680)
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:lol
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Had a recent notion that we should set aside the phrase "hold my beer" and replace it with "hold my New Coke." Seems appropriate in certain instances.
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The "X" logo is just a generic uniform font. Elon probably just typed "x" into a word doc and scrolled through all the different font options until he found one he liked.
https://www.businessinsider.com/twitter-x-logo-unicode-math-textbooks-2023-7#:~:text=Twitter%20on%20Monday%20rolled%20out,font%20%22Special%20Alphabet%204.%22
Just looked, it is a double-struck letter (as the article states). They are used primarily to denote sets of numbers or other mathematical groups, the most common (which I teach in Algebra 1) is the double R for "real numbers":
https://mathworld.wolfram.com/Doublestruck.html
X doesn't appear in that list, interestingly.
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making the rounds... :D
[Snip - Rule 1 still applies]
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I wonder what he'll do with [Snip - Rule 1]
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Twitter has too many addicts that need the site for this to really impact the site negatively, but I think the X sounds and looks terrible. For me, I haven't used it outside looking at some tweets. Can't read comments anymore, but all is well, as it basically helps me cutting a (to me) timewasting habit.
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A gentle reminder to everyone that rule 1 still applies.
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And now the app has been rebranded. Stupid. Doesn't look good.
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X rebranding is supposedly complete - but the app is still called Twitter on the Apple App Store. Apple has a rule that prohibits one-character apps. :tup Elon.
Also, the new massive physical signage of the X logo on the roof of Twitter HQ was constructed/built without a permit. City of San Fran is investigating. :tup :tup Elon.
Also, jingle.son told me last week that the font used for the new logo is open sourced, so he can't trademark it. Anyone can start merchandising that logo apparently. :tup :tup :tup Elon.
Like, is he a stupid guy who pretends to be smart, or a smart guy who pretends to be stupid. I'm truly baffled.
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X rebranding is supposedly complete - but the app is still called Twitter on the Apple App Store. Apple has a rule that prohibits one-character apps. :tup Elon.
Also, the new massive physical signage of the X logo on the roof of Twitter HQ was constructed/built without a permit. City of San Fran is investigating. :tup :tup Elon.
Also, jingle.son told me last week that the font used for the new logo is open sourced, so he can't trademark it. Anyone can start merchandising that logo apparently. :tup :tup :tup Elon.
Like, is he a stupid guy who pretends to be smart, or a smart guy who pretends to be stupid. I'm truly baffled.
Look, it's fun to bag on him because that's the way we are these days, but not ALL of that is on him, and in fact probably not most of it. MAYBE the first one, I don't know (but I didn't know the Apple store had that rule), DEFINITELY not the second one (just by coincidence, when I was Counsel for GE, I was actually dual report with the group that WOULD have been responsible for that work) and PROBABLY not the third one.
And not so much you, personally, but I'd think that all the anti-corporate folks - you know, the "BIG Whatever Industry" folks - would celebrate that he wasn't trying to lock out all comers with the logo and trademarks.
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While I can see Elon himself not knowing the rule, I'd be shocked if he wasn't consulted as I have to imagine someone at Twitter understands the rules of the Apple store. But who knows, that person may not be working there anymore who would have known that.
I personally think it's more of his ego being super inflated lately that is the root issue a lot of these gaffs.
And as much as I recently stated I was starting to think of leaving, here I still am actively using X. I just can't get those interactions anywhere else. Like Night Ranger retweeted (re-xed?) my video highlights recently, how cool is that. It can't be replicated on facebook/instagram/tiktok. (maybe threads? but I won't be signing up for that anytime soon)
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While I can see Elon himself not knowing the rule, I'd be shocked if he wasn't consulted as I have to imagine someone at Twitter understands the rules of the Apple store. But who knows, that person may not be working there anymore who would have known that.
I personally think it's more of his ego being super inflated lately that is the root issue a lot of these gaffs.
And as much as I recently stated I was starting to think of leaving, here I still am actively using X. I just can't get those interactions anywhere else. Like Night Ranger retweeted (re-xed?) my video highlights recently, how cool is that. It can't be replicated on facebook/instagram/tiktok. (maybe threads? but I won't be signing up for that anytime soon)
Did you just see Night Ranger? They are an extremely underrated band live.
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While I can see Elon himself not knowing the rule, I'd be shocked if he wasn't consulted as I have to imagine someone at Twitter understands the rules of the Apple store. But who knows, that person may not be working there anymore who would have known that.
I personally think it's more of his ego being super inflated lately that is the root issue a lot of these gaffs.
And as much as I recently stated I was starting to think of leaving, here I still am actively using X. I just can't get those interactions anywhere else. Like Night Ranger retweeted (re-xed?) my video highlights recently, how cool is that. It can't be replicated on facebook/instagram/tiktok. (maybe threads? but I won't be signing up for that anytime soon)
Did you just see Night Ranger? They are an extremely underrated band live.
Actually I'd say they were one of the worst shows I ever saw...completely bland especially following Eddie Money.
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The change just happened to me.
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While I can see Elon himself not knowing the rule, I'd be shocked if he wasn't consulted as I have to imagine someone at Twitter understands the rules of the Apple store. But who knows, that person may not be working there anymore who would have known that.
I personally think it's more of his ego being super inflated lately that is the root issue a lot of these gaffs.
And as much as I recently stated I was starting to think of leaving, here I still am actively using X. I just can't get those interactions anywhere else. Like Night Ranger retweeted (re-xed?) my video highlights recently, how cool is that. It can't be replicated on facebook/instagram/tiktok. (maybe threads? but I won't be signing up for that anytime soon)
Did you just see Night Ranger? They are an extremely underrated band live.
Actually I'd say they were one of the worst shows I ever saw...completely bland especially following Eddie Money.
Yeah, saw them for the first time a couple weeks ago. Thought they were good, and Eddie Trunk was there to introduce them as they are "real live music". Honestly, though, I thought Jefferson Starship who were before them were better, song wise at least. Night Ranger has all the guitar chops, but not all the songs connected with me the way I felt Jefferson Starship did. (and they both were before Bret Michaels who headlined).
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Cram, you must really like going to concerts to see that smorgasbord of shit.
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Nah, I enjoyed Night Ranger. Weird for a short set to play 2 Damn Yankees tunes, though.
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Nah, I enjoyed Night Ranger. Weird for a short set to play 2 Damn Yankees tunes, though.
Because as overrated as Damn Yankees was, it's still better than Night Ranger.
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Nah, I enjoyed Night Ranger. Weird for a short set to play 2 Damn Yankees tunes, though.
Because as overrated as Damn Yankees was, it's still better than Night Ranger.
Nah.
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X rebranding is supposedly complete - but the app is still called Twitter on the Apple App Store. Apple has a rule that prohibits one-character apps. :tup Elon.
Also, the new massive physical signage of the X logo on the roof of Twitter HQ was constructed/built without a permit. City of San Fran is investigating. :tup :tup Elon.
Also, jingle.son told me last week that the font used for the new logo is open sourced, so he can't trademark it. Anyone can start merchandising that logo apparently. :tup :tup :tup Elon.
Like, is he a stupid guy who pretends to be smart, or a smart guy who pretends to be stupid. I'm truly baffled.
Look, it's fun to bag on him because that's the way we are these days, but not ALL of that is on him, and in fact probably not most of it. MAYBE the first one, I don't know (but I didn't know the Apple store had that rule), DEFINITELY not the second one (just by coincidence, when I was Counsel for GE, I was actually dual report with the group that WOULD have been responsible for that work) and PROBABLY not the third one.
And not so much you, personally, but I'd think that all the anti-corporate folks - you know, the "BIG Whatever Industry" folks - would celebrate that he wasn't trying to lock out all comers with the logo and trademarks.
For as much as Musk has positioned himself over the last X number of months as "the guy" that is steering the ship, yes, the blunders also deserve to get tied around his neck - whether he was actively or directly involved in the issue or not. If he fancies himself as parade master, when it goes off the rails, he "owns" it.
And do you honestly think for 1 second he chose an open source font to not "lock out all comers with logos and trademarks"? Why must you be so contrarian that you seemingly seem obtuse? Musk is such an attention whore that if that was his intent, he'd have shouted it from the rooftops - right beside his illegally built logo. :lol
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If X goes down because of strategic blunders (like rebranding itself to X and throwing away years of goodwill in the Twitter name) then that is 100% Musk given his ownership. If it turns out that he overpaid/got the valuation way wrong and now can't pay the debt he took out to finance the purchase, that is 100% him.
Example of something that would not be the new owner's fault: a lightning strike or earthquake demolishes HQ and the company cannot operate any longer
If X gets turned around and becomes a 4x better business, he'll get all the credit. If it goes bankrupt there is next to no scenario in which it is not predominately his fault.
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Unapologetically LOVE Night Ranger. I do agree about the sets though; they only play about an hour and a half - even when headlining - and they do two Damn Yankees songs and then there are little snippets of covers (Brad will sometimes start off an Ozzy song; they will sometimes do a snippet of an Alice Cooper song for Kerry Kelli or whatever his name is).
I just think they're fun.
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Cram, you must really like going to concerts to see that smorgasbord of shit.
smorgasbord isn't a bad way to describe the concerts I attend (Snoop Dogg tomorrow :lol) but shit? well, for the most part, I'll disagree. Night Ranger were solid. Definitely worth the 0$ I paid to attend.
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X rebranding is supposedly complete - but the app is still called Twitter on the Apple App Store. Apple has a rule that prohibits one-character apps. :tup Elon.
Also, the new massive physical signage of the X logo on the roof of Twitter HQ was constructed/built without a permit. City of San Fran is investigating. :tup :tup Elon.
Also, jingle.son told me last week that the font used for the new logo is open sourced, so he can't trademark it. Anyone can start merchandising that logo apparently. :tup :tup :tup Elon.
Like, is he a stupid guy who pretends to be smart, or a smart guy who pretends to be stupid. I'm truly baffled.
Look, it's fun to bag on him because that's the way we are these days, but not ALL of that is on him, and in fact probably not most of it. MAYBE the first one, I don't know (but I didn't know the Apple store had that rule), DEFINITELY not the second one (just by coincidence, when I was Counsel for GE, I was actually dual report with the group that WOULD have been responsible for that work) and PROBABLY not the third one.
And not so much you, personally, but I'd think that all the anti-corporate folks - you know, the "BIG Whatever Industry" folks - would celebrate that he wasn't trying to lock out all comers with the logo and trademarks.
For as much as Musk has positioned himself over the last X number of months as "the guy" that is steering the ship, yes, the blunders also deserve to get tied around his neck - whether he was actively or directly involved in the issue or not. If he fancies himself as parade master, when it goes off the rails, he "owns" it.
That's fine; just as long as we own that this isn't a reflection of reality, it's a reflection of our view of some vague "moral" justice, vengeance for behavior we don't like. The problem with that is, you have to KNOW the rules before you can BREAK the rules, and most people don't understand how companies (or governments) actually work. In other words, I think there really ARE people that think he sat there and did all this himself (and fucked it up).
And do you honestly think for 1 second he chose an open source font to not "lock out all comers with logos and trademarks"? Why must you be so contrarian that you seemingly seem obtuse? Musk is such an attention whore that if that was his intent, he'd have shouted it from the rooftops - right beside his illegally built logo. :lol
It's not being obtuse or contrarian. It's being open-minded and tolerant that not everything is either sheer genius or profound buffoonery that fits nicely into our narrative of heroes and villains. You weren't in the room. You weren't there. That you hate this guy, or think he's a massive tool, whatever, my version isn't "contrarian", it's just as valid (and in fact, maybe MORE valid given how most companies work) than yours, it just doesn't fit nicely into the cartoon narrative that many have adopted for Musk.
Maybe instead of pounding on me, we ought to look in the mirror and ask why we're so hungry, so thirsty for these high profile people to be so absolutely evil and bad and stupid that we can't even consider that maybe there's a shade of grey in there.
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Nah, I enjoyed Night Ranger. Weird for a short set to play 2 Damn Yankees tunes, though.
It's weird...except for the fact that Jack Blades is immensely proud of those songs (as he should be), and with Ted Nugent and Styx not playing them, he wants them to continue to be out there, and I don't blame him. Everyone remembers them, and they are crowd pleasers. I've seen Night Ranger 2x. Once was a casino-club show, and they did two. The next was opening for Styx at a casino outdoor amphitheater and Tommy Shaw came out and they did "High Enough." (That was four years ago, and the only DY song that Night Ranger did that evening.) Here's the vid - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvAu802z6cg (vid was tough to take, so apologies if it makes you seasick. people were swaying all around me - lol)
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This was the setlist last time I saw them:
Touch of Madness
Four in the Morning
Sing Me Away
Coming of Age (Damn Yankees cover)
Somehow Someway
Sweet Child o' Mine (Guns N’ Roses cover)
Lovin', Touchin', Squeezin' (Journey cover)
Hey Jude (The Beatles cover)
The Secret of My Success
Sentimental Street
School's Out (Alice Cooper cover)
Crazy Train (Ozzy Osbourne cover)
High Enough (Damn Yankees cover)
Goodbye
When You Close Your Eyes
Don't Tell Me You Love Me
Sister Christian
(You Can Still) Rock in America
The only covers played complete were the Damn Yankees songs; the first three were snippets (and if memory serves, just vocal, though I won't die on that hill) and the second two (Alice and Ozzy) were part of the introduction/solo spot for Brad and Kelli.
It was a great show. The only annoying part - and it was minor - was Jack playing like it was all off the cuff improv when the setlist is exactly the same night after night. Don't say "you know, you're a special audience, fuck it, we're going to try to play Crazy Train for you as a treat!" when you've done it for the past 100 dates. :) :) :)
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The problem with that is, you have to KNOW the rules before you can BREAK the rules, and most people don't understand how companies (or governments) actually work. In other words, I think there really ARE people that think he sat there and did all this himself (and fucked it up).
I'm not sure I understand the first point - one can absolutely break the rules without knowing them. And secondly, I don't think that, but he is ultimately the one that deserves to be held accountable ... being the owner and all. I'd chastise the individual that gave the go-ahead to build the big X, but at some point, the decision to do that came from Musk.
And do you honestly think for 1 second he chose an open source font to not "lock out all comers with logos and trademarks"? Why must you be so contrarian that you seemingly seem obtuse? Musk is such an attention whore that if that was his intent, he'd have shouted it from the rooftops - right beside his illegally built logo. :lol
It's not being obtuse or contrarian. It's being open-minded and tolerant that not everything is either sheer genius or profound buffoonery that fits nicely into our narrative of heroes and villains. You weren't in the room. You weren't there. That you hate this guy, or think he's a massive tool, whatever, my version isn't "contrarian", it's just as valid (and in fact, maybe MORE valid given how most companies work) than yours, it just doesn't fit nicely into the cartoon narrative that many have adopted for Musk.
First, neither of us were in the room, so you don't know what his intent or purpose was in choosing an open-source logo. I made no more assumptions than you did. Second, you choose to use the baseline of "given how most big companies work" (though, I would disagree that most big companies operate with the level of benevolence as your comment suggests ie, allowing the market to monetize the use of their company logo); I use the baseline of Musk's history of very strange decision making and actions of how he has run Twitter/X.
Maybe instead of pounding on me, we ought to look in the mirror and ask why we're so hungry, so thirsty for these high profile people to be so absolutely evil and bad and stupid that we can't even consider that maybe there's a shade of grey in there.
Wasn't really pounding on you anymore than you were pounding on me. :biggrin:
There could very well be a shade of grey, but I don't know. I was only pointing out actions and consequences/outcomes.
A) App store - he wants to rebrand as X, but can't rebrand that way with a very integral business partner. Doesn't seem like a wise business move.
B) You'd think any company would have their facilities people know the bylaws of the city their HQ resides in. Now there's a potential consequence of penalties being issued against the company. Doesn't seem like a wise business move.
C) I'm curious how many other multi-billion dollar publicly held companies haven't trademarked their logo or company name. Doesn't seem like a wise business move.
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Not sure if anyone saw, but the giant X was dismantled yesterday. The company's statement is it was for a brief event or something.
Right.
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Not sure if anyone saw, but the giant X was dismantled yesterday. The company's statement is it was for a brief event or something.
Right.
The event was public criticism :lol
Some things like that I just laugh at and don't put too much stock into. I'm pretty sure most companies have had blunders with local building code.
The thing about X and the Apple store however is a significant core business decision that is baffling. Unless they have some deal with Apple in the works, it's actually a bit of a disaster to not be able to rebrand the app on Apple phones.
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Nah, I enjoyed Night Ranger. Weird for a short set to play 2 Damn Yankees tunes, though.
It's weird...except for the fact that Jack Blades is immensely proud of those songs (as he should be), and with Ted Nugent and Styx not playing them, he wants them to continue to be out there, and I don't blame him. Everyone remembers them, and they are crowd pleasers. I've seen Night Ranger 2x. Once was a casino-club show, and they did two. The next was opening for Styx at a casino outdoor amphitheater and Tommy Shaw came out and they did "High Enough." (That was four years ago, and the only DY song that Night Ranger did that evening.) Here's the vid - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvAu802z6cg (vid was tough to take, so apologies if it makes you seasick. people were swaying all around me - lol)
I get that. I like Damn Yankees. It's just that they have a big catalog to pull from and in a short 8 song setlist, you could cut those 2 songs and add some big hit's that they had. I enjoyed the 2 Damn Yankees songs they played, I just would of rather hear their songs.
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I went and saw Eddie Money and Loverboy at the state fair, over 15 years ago now. It only cost whatever it cost to get into the fair (probably less than $10), but it was not worth the potential hearing loss I’ll tell you that. And I like Eddie Money.
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First, neither of us were in the room, so you don't know what his intent or purpose was in choosing an open-source logo. I made no more assumptions than you did. Second, you choose to use the baseline of "given how most big companies work" (though, I would disagree that most big companies operate with the level of benevolence as your comment suggests ie, allowing the market to monetize the use of their company logo); I use the baseline of Musk's history of very strange decision making and actions of how he has run Twitter/X.
Well, I point this out not to argue with you, but because it happens to me more often than not, so it's with saying again: You're arguing it's HIS fault. That's an assumption. You're using his past record ASSUMING future decisions will be made the same way. I'm saying "you have no idea whose fault it is". I'm steadfastly refusing to make ANY assumption. It COULD be his, it could not be. You're right; not many companies do put their intellectual property out there for everyone to use, but this is San Francisco, and this is tech, so who knows what those hippies are doing. Again, I'm not going to assume. :) :)
Maybe instead of pounding on me, we ought to look in the mirror and ask why we're so hungry, so thirsty for these high profile people to be so absolutely evil and bad and stupid that we can't even consider that maybe there's a shade of grey in there.
Wasn't really pounding on you anymore than you were pounding on me. :biggrin:[/quote]
Well I'm glad you are grinning; it was meant far more tongue in cheek that it came across after second reading!!! :) :) :) :)
There could very well be a shade of grey, but I don't know. I was only pointing out actions and consequences/outcomes.
A) App store - he wants to rebrand as X, but can't rebrand that way with a very integral business partner. Doesn't seem like a wise business move.
B) You'd think any company would have their facilities people know the bylaws of the city their HQ resides in. Now there's a potential consequence of penalties being issued against the company. Doesn't seem like a wise business move.
C) I'm curious how many other multi-billion dollar publicly held companies haven't trademarked their logo or company name. Doesn't seem like a wise business move.
None of it is wise; don't get me wrong. If I was Musk, someone would be fired. Not because I'm a whacko making insane business decisions, but because you (the employee) have one job: I tell you "brand", you make it happen. If you can't, I'll get someone that will. Again, don't misunderstand me; that "X" on the building is a major mistake; I just don't think it's his personally. If I made that level mistake while at GE, I would expect to be let go, or at least be kept on a very short leash.
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I absolutely think all of this falls at the personal feet of Musk himself. He has gone to great lengths to make sure that the employees still employed there are devotees of his "my way or the highway" stance. He bought Twitter and signed off on all the decisions that people bitch about.
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There's so much to this rebrand that doesn't make any sense. Twitter is a strong enough brand name that the common term for using the service became a verb in everyday language. You don't just throw something like that away for an X?!
I wasn't aware of the Apple store restrictions, but you would assume a large company would have checked something like that, before changing their name? Apparently not.
The platform URL still is Twitter.com. The button for posting still says "Tweet". If you look at the pages for terms and conditions etc, it's all Twitter.
It's all so incredibly half-baked.
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Lead singer for BAND-MAID Saiki tweeted that she doesn't recognize her feed anymore... If Elon fucks up my primary lifeline to communication with my beloved J-metal musicians, I'll fucking kneecap him myself.
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I'm steadfastly refusing to make ANY assumption. It COULD be his, it could not be. You're right; not many companies do put their intellectual property out there for everyone to use, but this is San Francisco, and this is tech, so who knows what those hippies are doing. Again, I'm not going to assume. :) :)
Well, I have an BA. Economics ... My field relies on assumptions! :lol
I absolutely think all of this falls at the personal feet of Musk himself. He has gone to great lengths to make sure that the employees still employed there are devotees of his "my way or the highway" stance. He bought Twitter and signed off on all the decisions that people bitch about.
(https://media.tenor.com/aB3dD6Q8zE0AAAAC/this-guy-gets-it-nick-offerman.gif)
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There's so much to this rebrand that doesn't make any sense. Twitter is a strong enough brand name that the common term for using the service became a verb in everyday language. You don't just throw something like that away for an X?!
I honestly wonder if their accounting auditor will suggest (require?) a Goodwill write down at some point. Maybe that's part of his plan - I'm not versed well enough on their accounting situation to know if that's a net benefit or detriment to the company financially.
Lead singer for BAND-MAID Saiki tweeted that she doesn't recognize her feed anymore... If Elon fucks up my primary lifeline to communication with my beloved J-metal musicians, I'll fucking kneecap him myself.
:lol :lol
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Lead singer for BAND-MAID Saiki tweeted that she doesn't recognize her feed anymore... If Elon fucks up my primary lifeline to communication with my beloved J-metal musicians, I'll fucking kneecap him myself.
...fuck. Serve him up.
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Since basically the same thing has been OK on the 'post funny stuff ' thread for days, (and with advising from a mod), this is the pic I posted last weekend, along with a non-direct comment.
(https://i.imgur.com/RvptrQ4.jpg)
Perhaps, Mr. Musk will try to take over those type of web sites as well.
(Again, sorry for the totally innocent nonknowing original post. I followed through with this because I didn't want people to think I did something blatantly wrong.)
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Lead singer for BAND-MAID Saiki tweeted that she doesn't recognize her feed anymore... If Elon fucks up my primary lifeline to communication with my beloved J-metal musicians, I'll fucking kneecap him myself.
...fuck. Serve him up.
It seems Twitter is pretty big in Japan, and FB isn't, so that's where most of the musicians do their thing. They're migrating to IG pretty heavily, but Twitter is still the main base of operations for now. I've curated my feed so it's like 99% Japanese and Joe and Marc... :lol
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Lead singer for BAND-MAID Saiki tweeted that she doesn't recognize her feed anymore... If Elon fucks up my primary lifeline to communication with my beloved J-metal musicians, I'll fucking kneecap him myself.
...fuck. Serve him up.
It seems Twitter is pretty big in Japan, and FB isn't, so that's where most of the musicians do their thing. They're migrating to IG pretty heavily, but Twitter is still the main base of operations for now. I've curated my feed so it's like 99% Japanese and Joe and Marc... :lol
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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In related news, Threads has already lost 50% of its users. I don't think Zuckerburg is going to kill twitter, at least not in the near future.
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/08/15/twitter-x-links-delayed/
what a little bitch, seriously
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:lol it's honestly kind of funny, but in all seriousness, it's not cool to use the platform as your personal playground.
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No, it's not. But I would be remiss if I didn't point out that this is the next step for many of the things written about in P/R. When you throttle or limit information - whether it's an individual or the "collective" - for whatever reason YOU justify, you have to accept it when someone else does it for criteria THEY justify, even if you don't agree with it. Didn't we have a pretty lively conversation about limiting access to websites that were less than conservative about COVID protocols, for example, or that were perhaps not fully informed as to COVID, how it works, and how to stop it? For all we know, Elon may legitimately think that those sites he's throttling are peddling false information. What's the difference? In both cases, someone else is making decisions for us that we should be making for ourselves.
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No, it's not. But I would be remiss if I didn't point out that this is the next step for many of the things written about in P/R. When you throttle or limit information - whether it's an individual or the "collective" - for whatever reason YOU justify, you have to accept it when someone else does it for criteria THEY justify, even if you don't agree with it. Didn't we have a pretty lively conversation about limiting access to websites that were less than conservative about COVID protocols, for example, or that were perhaps not fully informed as to COVID, how it works, and how to stop it? For all we know, Elon may legitimately think that those sites he's throttling are peddling false information. What's the difference? In both cases, someone else is making decisions for us that we should be making for ourselves.
He'd be blocking them entirely in the name of public safety like the Covid sites telling people to consume bleach were, I would think. What he's doing here is just forcing sites he doesn't like to take forever to load, just to annoy the people trying to view those sources. He's trolling.
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No, it's not. But I would be remiss if I didn't point out that this is the next step for many of the things written about in P/R. When you throttle or limit information - whether it's an individual or the "collective" - for whatever reason YOU justify, you have to accept it when someone else does it for criteria THEY justify, even if you don't agree with it. Didn't we have a pretty lively conversation about limiting access to websites that were less than conservative about COVID protocols, for example, or that were perhaps not fully informed as to COVID, how it works, and how to stop it? For all we know, Elon may legitimately think that those sites he's throttling are peddling false information. What's the difference? In both cases, someone else is making decisions for us that we should be making for ourselves.
He'd be blocking them entirely in the name of public safety like the Covid sites telling people to consume bleach were, I would think. What he's doing here is just forcing sites he doesn't like to take forever to load, just to annoy the people trying to view those sources. He's trolling.
That's how I read it too, and if he is, he's a dick, I get that. I sort of think that if you put a platform out there, you take the good with the bad. But there's no law against being a dick. It's kind of funny to see people get all uppity over this stuff when if the circumstances were different, they might see it another way.
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He's trolling.
Yup. Which is why I do find it a bit funny. He's got a sense of humor, that's for sure.
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I'm convinced the man wants to destroy his investment.
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/09/18/musk-says-twitter-now-x-is-moving-to-monthly-subscriptions.html
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Yeah, that'll work....
No one is going to pay to use twitter :lol
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I mean, some do, just not enough, and the free users are what makes it worthwhile for them.
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I mean, some do, just not enough, and the free users are what makes it worthwhile for them.
I meant the general public, obviously people ahve paid for the blue check mark (which mostly boggles my mind, I do think there are some cases it may make sense though). But general twitter access behind a paywall? They would need to have exclusive content a la Netflix. Tweets, generally, aren't that different than facebook posts. They mostly aren't exclusive or worthy to pay for. Add in the fact that many famous people, (in my case, band members I follow), didn't buy the blue check mark, then those people are just going to drop off the platform which is (once again, at least for me) the entire point of it is to have that access to someone you otherwise wouldn't. Twitter behind a paywall becomes a small group of people in a circle jerk lead by Elon himself IMO.
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I'm convinced the man wants to destroy his investment.
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/09/18/musk-says-twitter-now-x-is-moving-to-monthly-subscriptions.html
he's the world's largest man baby, of course he wants it gone. he is probably still mad someone named @pantherinadogsworld69 called him a bitch once
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RIP Twitter
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I'm convinced the man wants to destroy his investment.
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/09/18/musk-says-twitter-now-x-is-moving-to-monthly-subscriptions.html
he's the world's largest man baby, of course he wants it gone. he is probably still mad someone named @pantherinadogsworld69 called him a bitch once
:lol
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I mean, some do, just not enough, and the free users are what makes it worthwhile for them.
I meant the general public, obviously people ahve paid for the blue check mark (which mostly boggles my mind, I do think there are some cases it may make sense though). But general twitter access behind a paywall? They would need to have exclusive content a la Netflix. Tweets, generally, aren't that different than facebook posts. They mostly aren't exclusive or worthy to pay for. Add in the fact that many famous people, (in my case, band members I follow), didn't buy the blue check mark, then those people are just going to drop off the platform which is (once again, at least for me) the entire point of it is to have that access to someone you otherwise wouldn't. Twitter behind a paywall becomes a small group of people in a circle jerk lead by Elon himself IMO.
No disagreement there.
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https://finance.yahoo.com/news/exclusive-x-formerly-known-twitter-232930999.html (https://finance.yahoo.com/news/exclusive-x-formerly-known-twitter-232930999.html)
X, the platform formerly known as Twitter, will begin charging new users $1 a year to access key features including the ability to tweet, reply, and quote, according to a source familiar with the matter and later confirmed by the company.
The company will begin charging the fee on Tuesday for new users in New Zealand and the Philippines, marking one of the most significant changes to the social media platform since Elon Musk acquired the company nearly a year ago.
This doesn't sound initially as bad as I thought, but honestly, it's still not good when every other social media is free. If this is all about stopping bots, why are the bots worse since Elon took over? How do other companies deal with bots? I certainly see them ALL the time on Instagram, but it's fairly easy to ignore. I can also ignore them easily on twitter. It really doesn't bother me much, but a lot of the twitter bots I see are porn related and that I'd imagine bothers people a lot more.
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I’m not sure what this will do to stop current bots anyway, but it’s also not the worst thing in the world.
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According to this article, 25% of Twitter users are responsible for 97% of all tweets: https://www.socialmediatoday.com/news/new-study-shows-that-25-of-twitter-users-produce-97-of-all-tweets/610146/
Based on that, you'd expect something like 75% of Twitter users to not be interested in the $1 subscription fee at all. The question then becomes: How many of that 25% want to keep tweeting and pay up?
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i had already stopped using twitter but paying to post on a nazi hellscape site is absolutely not something i am willing to do. fuck elon musk
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i had already stopped using twitter but paying to post on a nazi hellscape site is absolutely not something i am willing to do. fuck elon musk
What does that mean? I mean that sincerely, as in, what leads you to call it that? I've complained numerous times about being bombarded by ideological propaganda, mostly from the left, but I can honestly say, I don't think I've ever been presented with anything resembling "Nazi" propaganda.
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I can't recall seeing anything pro nazi on twitter. I'm sure there's been instances of it though and I'm sure Elons takeover has allowed more instances, but generally, calling twitter a nazi hellscape seems completely wrong.
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I don't see any political shit on my feed at all, it's all glorious female Japanese metal musicians and a few of you assholes.
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i had already stopped using twitter but paying to post on a nazi hellscape site is absolutely not something i am willing to do. fuck elon musk
What does that mean? I mean that sincerely, as in, what leads you to call it that? I've complained numerous times about being bombarded by ideological propaganda, mostly from the left, but I can honestly say, I don't think I've ever been presented with anything resembling "Nazi" propaganda.
I’m a heavy Twitter user and have never encountered a “nazi” tweet that wasn’t retweeted into my timeline by someone pointing it out. Have had some rude or inappropriate people tweet at me, but they are easily blocked/muted. The experience on Twitter is generally what you make it, though I imagine if you are following certain topics more closely maybe you run into more nazis or something.
Now porn bots have increased of late (they used to be way worse), but the content filter blocks most of them for me.
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According to this article, 25% of Twitter users are responsible for 97% of all tweets: https://www.socialmediatoday.com/news/new-study-shows-that-25-of-twitter-users-produce-97-of-all-tweets/610146/
Based on that, you'd expect something like 75% of Twitter users to not be interested in the $1 subscription fee at all. The question then becomes: How many of that 25% want to keep tweeting and pay up?
I guess if all you want to do is read other people’s tweets you can still do that without paying.
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i had already stopped using twitter but paying to post on a nazi hellscape site is absolutely not something i am willing to do. fuck elon musk
What does that mean? I mean that sincerely, as in, what leads you to call it that? I've complained numerous times about being bombarded by ideological propaganda, mostly from the left, but I can honestly say, I don't think I've ever been presented with anything resembling "Nazi" propaganda.
I’m a heavy Twitter user and have never encountered a “nazi” tweet that wasn’t retweeted into my timeline by someone pointing it out. Have had some rude or inappropriate people tweet at me, but they are easily blocked/muted. The experience on Twitter is generally what you make it, though I imagine if you are following certain topics more closely maybe you run into more nazis or something.
The terms "nazi" and "facist" have been bandied about so much over the last several years the terms have not only lost teeth but seemingly any meaning behind them whatsoever. They seem to just be catchall terms to "other" someone you don't agree with without actually really engaging with them.
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i had already stopped using twitter but paying to post on a nazi hellscape site is absolutely not something i am willing to do. fuck elon musk
What does that mean? I mean that sincerely, as in, what leads you to call it that? I've complained numerous times about being bombarded by ideological propaganda, mostly from the left, but I can honestly say, I don't think I've ever been presented with anything resembling "Nazi" propaganda.
I’m a heavy Twitter user and have never encountered a “nazi” tweet that wasn’t retweeted into my timeline by someone pointing it out. Have had some rude or inappropriate people tweet at me, but they are easily blocked/muted. The experience on Twitter is generally what you make it, though I imagine if you are following certain topics more closely maybe you run into more nazis or something.
The terms "nazi" and "facist" have been bandied about so much over the last several years the terms have not only lost teeth but seemingly any meaning behind them whatsoever. They seem to just be catchall terms to "other" someone you don't agree with without actually really engaging with them.
That's no doubt true - I agree 100% - but they still carry a stink that outweighs any real probative value. There are people that still love to use those labels in order to "get one over" on those they disagree with.
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The term “Nazi” in modern day has basically just come to mean any act of extremism whatsoever. You need only to look at one of Seinfeld’s most famous episodes about the “soup nazi”
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The term “Nazi” in modern day has basically just come to mean any act of extremism whatsoever. You need only to look at one of Seinfeld’s most famous episodes about the “soup nazi”
It's still primarily the go-to of the left though. Not that most of them know what real fascism is, but still, it's usually meant to point rightward. No one is really calling Ocasio-Cortez or the Squad Nazi's, despite their extremism.
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Maybe we can also stop calling views that are, by any objective measure, moderately left of center at worst, "Extremism", since we are on a "use less hyperbole" roll?
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The term “Nazi” in modern day has basically just come to mean any act of extremism whatsoever. You need only to look at one of Seinfeld’s most famous episodes about the “soup nazi”
It's still primarily the go-to of the left though. Not that most of them know what real fascism is, but still, it's usually meant to point rightward. No one is really calling Ocasio-Cortez or the Squad Nazi's, despite their extremism.
I’m really going to push back on this. I have a lot of in laws who are right wing (a couple of them are extremists) and while I might not hear the exact term “Nazi”, I do oftentimes hear “tyrannical”, “terrorists”, and sometimes even the observation that they are being called “nazi’s” while claiming their opponents are actually closer to Nazi-ism in their policies. So I see absolutely no difference between the two sides at all.
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Maybe we can also stop calling views that are, by any objective measure, moderately left of center at worst, "Extremism", since we are on a "use less hyperbole" roll?
I will if you (collective) will. Anything to the right of Biden is automatically "EXTREMISM" (and Naziism, and fascism, and....) here and in many places, so fair is fair. And let's not pretend that the Squad or Ocasio-Cortez are "moderately left of center". Maybe in relation to other schemes across the globe, but again, under that scenario Trump is "moderately right of center" compared to, say, other schemes across the globe.
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Also:
*taps the P/R sign*
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Since Elon introduced the pay check and loosened the moderation, Twitter has really become a haven for redpillers, antivaxers, conspiracy theorists, and crypto-bros.
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The term “Nazi” in modern day has basically just come to mean any act of extremism whatsoever. You need only to look at one of Seinfeld’s most famous episodes about the “soup nazi”
It's still primarily the go-to of the left though. Not that most of them know what real fascism is, but still, it's usually meant to point rightward. No one is really calling Ocasio-Cortez or the Squad Nazi's, despite their extremism.
I’m really going to push back on this. I have a lot of in laws who are right wing (a couple of them are extremists) and while I might not hear the exact term “Nazi”, I do oftentimes hear “tyrannical”, “terrorists”, and sometimes even the observation that they are being called “nazi’s” while claiming their opponents are actually closer to Nazi-ism in their policies. So I see absolutely no difference between the two sides at all.
There IS a difference though. You admit that they don't hear the exact term Nazi as they describe the behavior; whereas it's a branding iron for the left, and it DOES get used, and purposefully, to hammer the point home regardless of the actual behavior. THAT'S the difference. One person here loves to associate me with Nazism, and I'm about as far from a Nazi as you can get. Seriously. More broadly, the extremes of both sides fall dangerously close to ACTUAL fascism - it's often discredited because it doesn't document the hate and nationalist jingoism that many require for real facism, but the book Liberal Fascism paints a fair picture of this. What's that saying? The line from communism to liberalism goes right through fascism"? I'm not sure its exactly true, but it's a statement nonetheless.
EDIT: SORRY XJ; I didn't see your tap until after I hit Send or whatever it is.
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I’ve been off Twitter for 4 years now, but I remember that there was an account called something like “Kool-Aid Man Confessions” and it was the depressed ramblings of the Kool-Aid Man. The account was only around for maybe a week and I’m sure no one but me remembers it.
His last Tweet was “They’re going to kill me and make a new one”
The next day his account was gone.
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Since Elon introduced the pay check and loosened the moderation, Twitter has really become a haven for redpillers, antivaxers, conspiracy theorists, and crypto-bros.
This may or may not be true. I certainly see more ads for crypto and the fact that anyone can have a check makes it easier to confuse conspiracy theorists for legitimate news sources. But it's still quite easy to avoid those sorts of topics altogether.
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I tend to see a lot of right-wing nutjobs, but I follow a lot of people involved in left wing and "social justice" circles, and Warhammer 40k accounts, and they tend to be two groups who attract a lot of bozos in the replies unfortunately. If your twitter followings are primarily composed of accounts composed of less contentious topics then I can imagine your experience being more pleasant on average.
The quality of the ads has really gone downhill though. And coupled with the fact they are far less obvious now, alongside malicious decisions like hiding headlines from hyperlink posts, makes the overall user experience much shittier than it was a year ago. Alongside his decision to experiment with charging users, I'm not sure I'll have the stomach to stick around much longer, despite my desire to maintain my connections to certain people on the app.
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I tend to see a lot of right-wing nutjobs, but I follow a lot of people involved in left wing and "social justice" circles,
Are you saying that right wingers are nut job and left wingers are "social justice" warriors?
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I tend to see a lot of right-wing nutjobs, but I follow a lot of people involved in left wing and "social justice" circles, and Warhammer 40k accounts, and they tend to be two groups who attract a lot of bozos in the replies unfortunately. If your twitter followings are primarily composed of accounts composed of less contentious topics then I can imagine your experience being more pleasant on average.
The quality of the ads has really gone downhill though. And coupled wit the fact they are far less obvious now, alongside malicious decisions like hiding headlines from hyperlink posts, makes the overall user experience much shittier than it was a year ago. Alongside his decision to experiment with charging users, I'm not sure I'll have the stomach to stick around much longer, despite my desire to maintain my connections to certain people on the app.
The functionality of the site has definitely been degraded since he took over. Most changes have been for the worse for sure.
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I tend to see a lot of right-wing nutjobs, but I follow a lot of people involved in left wing and "social justice" circles, and Warhammer 40k accounts, and they tend to be two groups who attract a lot of bozos in the replies unfortunately. If your twitter followings are primarily composed of accounts composed of less contentious topics then I can imagine your experience being more pleasant on average.
The quality of the ads has really gone downhill though. And coupled wit the fact they are far less obvious now, alongside malicious decisions like hiding headlines from hyperlink posts, makes the overall user experience much shittier than it was a year ago. Alongside his decision to experiment with charging users, I'm not sure I'll have the stomach to stick around much longer, despite my desire to maintain my connections to certain people on the app.
The functionality of the site has definitely been degraded since he took over. Most changes have been for the worse for sure.
I even have issues with posting sometimes using the app on my phone. It's weird how the basic functionality has gotten worse.
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Are you saying that right wingers are nut job and left wingers are "social justice" warriors?
No, I'm saying that when (prominent) people on the left post things to twitter (particularly when the posts concern certain topics of "social justice" which tend to provoke strong responses), the nutjobs from the right tend to show up in their replies spewing crap. The reverse is also true to at least some extent; tankies and Stalinists tend to show up on certain topics, I've noticed.
I even have issues with posting sometimes using the app on my phone. It's weird how the basic functionality has gotten worse.
Not that weird. Elon's twitter is haemorrhaging money and consequently he fired a lot of staff to keep costs down, while simultaneously implementing a lot of half-baked ideas and features on the live site without proper QA testing. Honestly I'm astonished the servers haven't burnt down already.
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Are you saying that right wingers are nut job and left wingers are "social justice" warriors?
No, I'm saying that when people on the left post things to twitter (particularly when the posts concern certain topics of "social justice"), the nutjobs from the right tend to show up in their replies spewing crap. The reverse is also true to at least some extent; tankies and Stalinists tend to show up on certain topics, I've noticed.
Ok, because right wingers don't have a monopoly on nut jobs.
Just a comment. I won't take it further as it doesn't really belong in this thread.
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I even have issues with posting sometimes using the app on my phone. It's weird how the basic functionality has gotten worse.
Not that weird. Elon's twitter is haemorrhaging money and consequently he fired a lot of staff to keep costs down, while simultaneously implementing a lot of half-baked ideas and features on the live site without proper QA testing. Honestly I'm astonished the servers haven't burnt down already.
So, can we narrow it down to either
1) he's doing it on purpouse because he wants to destroy Twitter for whatever petty reason went through his head
2) he's just grossly incompetent to the point that one should wonder who's actually responsible for his other successful eandeavors
or the jury's still out on that one?
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If you are knee dep into politics, the algorithm will see nothing but both sides and the extremism from both.
Me, I don't dive in, and never see those posts. It's not that hard to figure out.
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So, can we narrow it down to either
1) he's doing it on purpouse because he wants to destroy Twitter for whatever petty reason went through his head
2) he's just grossly incompetent to the point that one should wonder who's actually responsible for his other successful eandeavors
or the jury's still out on that one?
Why not both at this point?
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I just don't think you spend that much money to destroy a media outlet. That seems insane.
I just see it as incompetence.
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I think the initial purchase was incompetence (given he made an offer as a joke which he was then held to against his will), but I could see him burning the place to the ground if he views its failure as an inevitability. He's proven he has the ability to be quite petty and emotion driven in the past.
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Ok, because right wingers don't have a monopoly on nut jobs.
Just a comment. I won't take it further as it doesn't really belong in this thread.
Never said they did, but feel free to shoot me a PM if you have concerns.
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I think the initial purchase was incompetence (given he made an offer as a joke which he was then held to against his will), but I could see him burning the place to the ground if he views its failure as an inevitability. He's proven he has the ability to be quite petty and emotion driven in the past.
I think he wanted it initially, but messed up and then forced to buy it. That'd the real joke.
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I don't think he's purposely destroying it. I think that's just the outcome of his decisions. I think he just wants it to be a play ground shaped by his own rules and standards with his tweets being the most seen and valued. I think he's full of himself basically and that's rubbed off onto the platform, which has turned a lot of people off.
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Are you saying that right wingers are nut job and left wingers are "social justice" warriors?
No, I'm saying that when (prominent) people on the left post things to twitter (particularly when the posts concern certain topics of "social justice" which tend to provoke strong responses), the nutjobs from the right tend to show up in their replies spewing crap. The reverse is also true to at least some extent; tankies and Stalinists tend to show up on certain topics, I've noticed.
It's not "to some extent", though I don't know what a "tankie" is. It's at least the same extent. I imagine it's all - or largely - attributable to the algorithm. And some of it is worse, frankly, because it's irresponsible, but it's not so easily dismissible as "lunacy". I keep getting these smarmy, smart-ass responses referring to Trump as "the orange blob" and calling for his immediate retention in jail; and these morons are CLUELESS that this is EXACTLY what they claim to hate the most about Trump (his name-calling and his supposed "facsism" by calling for Hillary to be put in jail).
I've said this repeatedly; I'm not a Democrat, I'm a libertarian, but I can abide by the moderate Democrat position quite nicely. I'd vote for Bill Clinton tomorrow, and more than once if I could, knowing what I know now. And yet... the advocates of the Democratic Party couldn't be more distasteful to me. I want nothing to do with them. NOTHING. They are - and of course I'm generalizing here - condescending, suprerior and duplicitous, and the thing is, if they are so damn fucking smart, how can they NOT see their role in this discord? It's one of the reasons (And I've said this before) why I fought that Speaker issue so hard; YOU (the Democrats) are the ones screaming that we have to work together, and yet, you were the CATALYST for discord. I get that they benefited politically, but so what? Everyone else has to put their political wants aside to be "better" except for them? Republicans are supposed to tell Trump to piss off and in effect give up their seats (and theoretically abdicate their majority in the House) because it's the "right thing to do" but Democrats aren't required to just TABLE the motion on McCarthy? The upshot is that they could have STILL claimed the political victory by keeping a Speaker that some didn't want. They could have stuck it to Gaetz after all. But no, they didn't and yet they're still so much (morally) better than we are. Please.
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*Taps the sign*
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*Taps the sign*
But I'm responding to YOUR post! No pass for that!?!? :) :) :) :) :)
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:rollin
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His big plan is revealing itself. After he agrees with and comments on an antisemitic tweet mixed with white replacement theory, the big advertisers are bailing and at least one asked why their adverts were adjacent to Nazi stuff.
Musk is a genius!
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His big plan is revealing itself. After he agrees with and comments on an antisemitic tweet mixed with white replacement theory, the big advertisers are bailing and at least one asked why their adverts were adjacent to Nazi stuff.
Musk is a genius!
I haven't paid too much attention to the details about the antisemetic stuff, but I did see Mark Cuban write something up directed at Musk regarding advertisers concerns. it was really like a punch to Elons gut as it perfectly pinpointed how Elon was blaming the advertisers for leaving but the reality is, the advertisers aren't getting their money's worth on the twitter platform. Elon's business basically sucks so maybe he needs to look inwards instead of blaming those outside of his control.
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His big plan is revealing itself. After he agrees with and comments on an antisemitic tweet mixed with white replacement theory, the big advertisers are bailing and at least one asked why their adverts were adjacent to Nazi stuff.
Musk is a genius!
I'm sure a lot of you have seen his recent video telling advertisers to F* themselves.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_M_uvDChJQ
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Yeah just going back to my response before yours, Elon blaming THEM :lol
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If advertisers are going to leave, because they don't want their brands on that platform, and that's on the platform to solve, not the advertisers. Advertisers could leave Youtube if they feel like the stupid s*** people do on high-end Youtube channels may hurt their brand, which in turn could result in Youtubers receiving less money due to the lack of high-end ads on their videos. You don't hear Google blaming the advertisers. They would just do some correction on their guidelines and hope that results in advertisers wanting their ads on Youtube videos. Sometimes, it would be an overcorrection though.....
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If advertisers are going to leave, because they don't want their brands on that platform, and that's on the platform to solve, not the advertisers. Advertisers could leave Youtube if they feel like the stupid s*** people do on high-end Youtube channels may hurt their brand, which in turn could result in Youtubers receiving less money due to the lack of high-end ads on their videos. You don't hear Google blaming the advertisers. They would just do some correction on their guidelines and hope that results in advertisers wanting their ads on Youtube videos. Sometimes, it would be an overcorrection though.....
Yeah. Theres a push and pull constantly between social media and advertisers. I think it's fair for a company to not want their ads run against something that they may feel is morally wrong. And because it happens, they pull back, and then the social media company changes their rules to prevent that from happening. It happens time and time again. Elon should understand this. Does he think a Tesla commercial appearing in the middle of a pro ISIS youtube video a good look for Tesla? Or does he think it's good to invest in advertising on a platform that isn't getting any return on that investment? He's smarter than this. Just continues to make me go back to his inflated ego.
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I used to admired Elon because of all he was doing for electric vehicles and space exploration. But the last 3-4 years I've grown to really dislike the guy, and I think part of it is just that, his inflated ego.
He knows how to run a business, and he knows that telling all these companies to F off, pretty much, will hurt not only twitter/X but Tesla and Space X as well, just because they are an extension of him. Honestly, I think he plateaued when it comes to electric vehicles (he might improve battery, but not sure there is much he can do to move the needle anymore). As for Space exploration, he still has a lot he wants to do, and I think he will continue to improve on that end mainly because of NASA.
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Yeah, seeing nothing but people posting they have canceled Disney+ and are signing up for full premium or whatever that gives them on Planet Elon. Much like Trump, he has these worshipers that blindly follow him and his word is gospel.
I don't get it.
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Yeah, seeing nothing but people posting they have canceled Disney+ and are signing up for full premium or whatever that gives them on Planet Elon. Much like Trump, he has these worshipers that blindly follow him and his word is gospel.
I don't get it.
There's a weird almost cult like following to him, but it's not that different than almost any other celebrity or popular person on the internet. There's so many people who follow and almost worship someone and then they'll defend them non stop. It's a very odd thing IMO that people feel the need to be so obsessive with someone else. Elon definitely has a big following of that type of person.
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I mean, I worship Haraguchi-san, bassist of Nemophila, but at least she's cute af and can drop a sick fucking bass line...
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I mean, I worship Haraguchi-san, bassist of Nemophila, but at least she's cute af and can drop a sick fucking bass line...
I guess the question is, if she did something really stupid, would you defend her? That's really where I was going with the level of worship some people have.
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I watch what I want, I Tweet what I want. I don't pay attention to any of this. My life is so much better just scrolling on by.
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I mean, I worship Haraguchi-san, bassist of Nemophila, but at least she's cute af and can drop a sick fucking bass line...
I guess the question is, if she did something really stupid, would you defend her? That's really where I was going with the level of worship some people have.
Defend her? No... forgiver her...probably...
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He reinstated Alex Jones today. Just, wow.
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Sickening.
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His return is being marked with an interview with Musk, Tate, Gaetz and Vivek. Fucking should've just taken that 44 billion and flushed it, would've served humanity better.
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His return is being marked with an interview with Musk, Tate, Gaetz and Vivek. Fucking should've just taken that 44 billion and flushed it, would've served humanity better.
I know he isn’t super beloved, but Geoff Tate seems out of place in that line up.
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:lol
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IDK, I have venom for him. Lol
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Sickening.
Why? If he says something you think is harmful, counter it. If he says something false, correct it. This is probably a better conversation for P/R, but while I'm vaguely aware of why he was banned in the first place, the reinstatement isn't that controversial. He was accused of wrongdoing, paid the price - literally (though that was, importantly, a CIVIL trial not a CRIMINAL trial) and we move on. Isn't that how it goes? When Joe Biden plagiarized that essay in Law School, he paid the price and we moved on. When he plagiarized that speech back in the... what was it, the 80's? He paid the price and we moved on. Why does that only apply to the people "we like"?
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Did everything on Twitter get purged? This is what I see on my timeline at the moment.
(https://i.imgur.com/sI72Vlv.png)
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Mine looks normal.
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Mine as well...
(https://i.postimg.cc/SxLd3Zp4/Screenshot-20231221-060843-X.jpg)
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It had major issues last night. All topics for me returned the 'Couldn't find anything' message. Loads of people got logged out or got that Welcome to X message.
https://www.reuters.com/technology/social-media-platform-x-down-users-globally-downdetector-2023-12-21/
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Mine as well...
(https://i.postimg.cc/SxLd3Zp4/Screenshot-20231221-060843-X.jpg)
HAHAHAHA
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:lol
I didnt notice issues but I saw some people said they had issues.
I actually had issues with instagram last night, no joke, I opened it and scrolled and all I saw were RJ's instagram pictures from months ago. I mean, it had some other really old pictures from people I know as well, but it seriously was mostly RJ. So weird. Looks to be better today.
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It was down for a couple of hours around 6-8 European time this morning. These outages are becoming more and more frequent. Guessing the maintenance staff has been gutted compared to a year ago.
On another topic, anyone else noticing the absolute horse shit that is being advertised nowadays? I got an ad for a bra designed for octogenarians today...
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:lol
I didnt notice issues but I saw some people said they had issues.
I actually had issues with instagram last night, no joke, I opened it and scrolled and all I saw were RJ's instagram pictures from months ago. I mean, it had some other really old pictures from people I know as well, but it seriously was mostly RJ. So weird. Looks to be better today.
If they were the pics of my parent's dog it was totally worth it. She's so damn cute.
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It was down for a couple of hours around 6-8 European time this morning. These outages are becoming more and more frequent. Guessing the maintenance staff has been gutted compared to a year ago.
On another topic, anyone else noticing the absolute horse shit that is being advertised nowadays? I got an ad for a bra designed for octogenarians today...
That's either one crappy algorithm, or I REALLY want to see your X feed....