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General => Movies and TV => Topic started by: The Letter M on June 07, 2021, 02:52:00 PM
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I figured since we are less than two days away from the premiere of Loki that a dedicated thread should get posted up. Early reviews have come in from critics who have viewed the first two episodes and from what I've read online, they all seem to agree it's the best first episode of the three Disney+ MCU shows so far. Many of the reviews have been glowing with praise for Tom and Owen, so that excites me!
If you're like me and you don't mind clips or minor spoilers, there have been plenty of short clips posted on Marvel Entertainment's YouTube page, if any of you haven't seen them floating around Facebook or Twitter lately. I think two or three clips were posted up today alone, so they're definitely driving the marketing hard for this show, and I don't blame them! I think this will be a hit on the level of The Mandalorian, and probably way more popular than WandaVision and The Falcon And The Winter Soldier. There hasn't barely been a day in the last month that I didn't see Loki or Tom trending on Twitter, so it definitely feels like there's a lot of online chatter for it despite it not even airing yet.
I wonder how they'll craft the story for this first season, because if you weren't aware, they did already green light a second season! This first season will be six episodes, and it was reported that the first episode's runtime will be 51 minutes (longer than WV and TFATWS) and the second episode will run 54 minutes, so that's very exciting!
What are everyone's hope and expectations for Loki (the show)? I don't think we'll see any big MCU characters that we've seen in prior movies, perhaps mentions of them (as we hear in one trailer, Loki mentions Heimdall and Thor), but no actual cameos. If we do, it'll be video footage from prior movies (like The Avengers). I think this show will definitely set up some things for future films (Doctor Strange In The Multiverse Of Madness, Ant-Man & The Wasp: Quantumania), but I hope we get a fairly self-contained story in this single season, unless they have a plan in place for a two-season arc (like with The Mandalorian), but waiting for the second season for any continuation of the plot could be an excruciatingly long wait!
I definitely am feeling the hype on this one, and as much as I am tying to get my sleep schedule back on track this week, I may have to stay up til 3am to catch the premiere as soon as possible on this one. :lol
-Marc.
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Whole i enjoyed both Wandavision and Falcon - neither completely blew me away and both had slightly underwhelming climaxes.
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All I'll say is one of the videos shows Loki being sucked by the Bifrost, so Asgardians are not out of the question :corn
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All I'll say is one of the videos shows Loki being sucked by the Bifrost
Kinky
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Off to a good start!
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Off to a good start!
Definitely!! And a lot more emotionally moving than I expected!! Tom Hiddleston's acting is stellar!
The Miss Minutes video was great, even being in 3:4 ratio really helped sell its authenticity. And the drawer with the, erm, "paper weights" really cracked me up (but it raises some intriguing questions if you really think about it).
I am definitely hooked, and I like that we got a great set up for the season with Loki having to help Mobius with the rogue variant causing trouble for the TVA!
-Marc.
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This one is going to be something special, they've set it up so well.
Anyone know how many episodes we got coming?
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This one is going to be something special, they've set it up so well.
Anyone know how many episodes we got coming?
For this first season, just six episodes, but they should be at least 50-ish minutes each. Episode 1 clocked in at 51, and apparently episode 2 clocks in at 54 minutes.
-Marc.
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Cool, thanks.
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All of these Disney+ Marvel shows are set to be ~6 hours of total runtime. That's what Feige stated was the sweet spot that balances story with budget.
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All of these Disney+ Marvel shows are set to be ~6 hours of total runtime. That's what Feige stated was the sweet spot that balances story with budget.
I tend to agree. It's about the same as giving each set of characters a two-film deal, or a trilogy if you prefer films to be under two hours long (though I don't think any MCU film has been under 120 minutes). And these are all characters that have had less-than full stories and arcs in the films and have largely been secondary supporting characters in the films they've been. The closest one to get leading status is Loki, but his popularity probably helped skyrocket his character. I'm sure if he wasn't as popular as he was by the time Thor: The Dark World happened (where he's probably the best thing about that film), then I'm sure he would've been written out sooner, or at very least, never been given a chance to spin-off into his own series.
-Marc.
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That was excellent. Loved every second.
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That was excellent. Loved every second.
Same.
The opening scene where he arrived at the TVA had me in pretty much constant laughter.
But it was all great.
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Great 1st episode. A lot to take in.
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Good stuff! A lot of it was outright funnier than I was expecting. And while I do like Owen Wilson, I have some doubts about his ability to pull off the heavy stuff. We shall see. He was pretty good in this first episode.
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Excellent start indeed! I wasn't sure what to expect apart from something weird. I got something weird which was really amazing.
I think among the 3 shows so far this opener was by far my favorite.
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I think it's safe to say that of all the D+ main characters, Loki comes I tk his series the most fully fleshed out, so we have a lot more invested in him so to speak.
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Absolutely loved the first episode.
Laughed at loud at the sight of a pamphlet titled "So You're A Variant" in the closing credits.
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Absolutely loved the first episode.
Laughed at loud at the sight of a pamphlet titled "So You're A Variant" in the closing credits.
(https://i.imgflip.com/5crzxp.jpg)
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EXACTLY
OLOLOLOL
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For reals.. I lived the whole Hitchhiker's vibe to the TVA, just wonderful.
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Holy info-dump batman!
Honestly, I think this is my favorite debut episode of all three series. High-brow meta-fiction with all sorts of world-building is way up my alley. My 12-yo, on the other hand, was bored out of his mind.
Excited to see where it goes! Hiddelston is just such an amazing actor.
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Loved the episode.
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Holy info-dump batman!
Yeah! Ton of exposition and recapping.....yet they managed to do it in a fun way.
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Holy info-dump batman!
Yeah! Ton of exposition and recapping.....yet they managed to do it in a fun way.
Often with tons of exposition, I feel like it's because they don't trust the audience to be smart enough to figure it out and it comes off as cheap and a bit insulting. With Loki, however, it felt pretty necessary as they were introducing a ton of weird stuff and didn't want the weirdness or the info to be anything more than foundation for the story they're telling.
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The episode was fun, entertaining, and very well executed. I LOVED IT! :heart
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I think it's safe to say that of all the D+ main characters, Loki comes I tk his series the most fully fleshed out, so we have a lot more invested in him so to speak.
Great episode, but one thing doesn't sit too well with me (though I understand why it was done). Spoilers below. Not sure if we're gonna try to keep this thread spoiler free for a couple days.
Otherwise, I'm very jacked to see how this is going to unfold. I'm just bummed that jingle.son keeps digging in to internet rumours, and can't keep his mouth shut. He's very good about not spoiling absolutely confirmed things (like Evan Peters' arrival in WV), but other quasi-verified rumours I wish he would keep to himself.
This version of Loki is what ... an hour removed from the Battle of New York? He hasn't gone through his 'redemption' arc that we all love him for Thor 2 and 3 (and to a small part, Infinity War). So, it seemed TOO rushed to in how the story took him through that arc in about 10 minutes. It was done about as well as it possibly could have been done (ie, he doesn't believe any of the tape reel until he realizes that the Tesseract is useless, and there are multiple Infinity Stones in a desk drawer), and then accepts what Mobius is telling him about Time and the TVA as legit.
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I think it's safe to say that of all the D+ main characters, Loki comes I tk his series the most fully fleshed out, so we have a lot more invested in him so to speak.
Great episode, but one thing doesn't sit too well with me (though I understand why it was done). Spoilers below. Not sure if we're gonna try to keep this thread spoiler free for a couple days.
Otherwise, I'm very jacked to see how this is going to unfold. I'm just bummed that jingle.son keeps digging in to internet rumours, and can't keep his mouth shut. He's very good about not spoiling absolutely confirmed things (like Evan Peters' arrival in WV), but other quasi-verified rumours I wish he would keep to himself.
This version of Loki is what ... an hour removed from the Battle of New York? He hasn't gone through his 'redemption' arc that we all love him for Thor 2 and 3 (and to a small part, Infinity War). So, it seemed TOO rushed to in how the story took him through that arc in about 10 minutes. It was done about as well as it possibly could have been done (ie, he doesn't believe any of the tape reel until he realizes that the Tesseract is useless, and there are multiple Infinity Stones in a desk drawer), and then accepts what Mobius is telling him about Time and the TVA as legit.
I likened Loki's change to Gamora's in Endgame. Gamora had about 3-4 years to develop and become who she was by Infinity War, but her 2014 version in Endgame seemed to flip on a dime once Nebula told her about their shared past/Gamora's future. Granted, Gamora probably had those feelings already but they weren't given the chance to surface until she met the other Guardians, but I guess it also shows how much she really cared for Nebula, even in 2014, that listening to her future sister spurred her into helping her/betraying Thanos.
Loki seeing his future definitely set him along the path he did take in the prime timeline, especially actually seeing his mom die, which I don't believe he literally saw in The Dark World, so I think seeing it (rather than hearing about it from Thor) definitely hit him harder emotionally. And it can't be said enough that Tom's acting in those few minutes is just absolutely brilliant. His tears from Frigga and Odin, to smiling at Thor's expression of brotherly love, to the fear and anger at seeing Thanos snap his neck, Tom conveyed so much in his reactions, you could really feel the journey Loki went on. It's like those meme pics of Shia LaBeouf in the theater watching his movies and going through emotions, but Tom did it better.
Some of my favorite details that I can recall after rewatching the episode last night:
-Loki immediately finding higher ground once he gets up in Mongolia, so he can visually assert his dominance over the natives.
-Mobius telling Loki that he hasn't needed to hear about the TVA until now, I feel is a meta joke to the audience who inevitably ask "Where was the TVA when (insert Earth Crisis) happened?!". Of course, all those events were supposed to happen, so we didn't need to see the TVA then.
-Loki grabs a Time Stone from the drawer, which would obviously be his best chance to escape along with the Tesseract, but Infinity Stones don't work in the Null Time Zone/outside their home universe, so it didn't even matter in the end.
There's just so many Easter eggs and references too, especially in the credits, where you can see some Infinity Stones being used as paper weights! Great attention to detail!
-Marc.
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This version of Loki is what ... an hour removed from the Battle of New York? He hasn't gone through his 'redemption' arc that we all love him for Thor 2 and 3 (and to a small part, Infinity War). So, it seemed TOO rushed to in how the story took him through that arc in about 10 minutes. It was done about as well as it possibly could have been done (ie, he doesn't believe any of the tape reel until he realizes that the Tesseract is useless, and there are multiple Infinity Stones in a desk drawer), and then accepts what Mobius is telling him about Time and the TVA as legit.
I can see why some might feel that way, but as you said, they handled it as well as they possibly could. He was able to see some key moments that contributed to his character arc in a matter of minutes, including his own death (The end of file shot was strong).
That entire scene was just great, and now I want to watch it again.
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Time moves differently in the TVA. Who's to say those 10 minutes weren't 10 years? :biggrin:
Anyway, I see that they are setting up Dr. Strange 2 very evidently. All the multi-verse talk. Seems this might feed right into it maybe even more than WandaVision. Loki would be the perfect person to introduce the Multi-verse of Madness.
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Time moves differently in the TVA. Who's to say those 10 minutes weren't 10 years? :biggrin:
Anyway, I see that they are setting up Dr. Strange 2 very evidently. All the multi-verse talk. Seems this might feed right into it maybe even more than WandaVision. Loki would be the perfect person to introduce the Multi-verse of Madness.
I think the nail was directly hit on the head considering Miss Minutes' animated video said the words "madness" and "multiverse" within a matter of seconds of each other. Also, the writer of the episode (series?) also did the most recent draft of Doctor Strange ITMOM, so I think we'll find out at the end of next March just how much Loki connects to the Doctor Strange sequel.
-Marc.
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Time moves differently in the TVA. Who's to say those 10 minutes weren't 10 years? :biggrin:
Anyway, I see that they are setting up Dr. Strange 2 very evidently. All the multi-verse talk. Seems this might feed right into it maybe even more than WandaVision. Loki would be the perfect person to introduce the Multi-verse of Madness.
I think the nail was directly hit on the head considering Miss Minutes' animated video said the words "madness" and "multiverse" within a matter of seconds of each other. Also, the writer of the episode (series?) also did the most recent draft of Doctor Strange ITMOM, so I think we'll find out at the end of next March just how much Loki connects to the Doctor Strange sequel.
-Marc.
I like how in an interview the other day in which he was asked about a connection between Loki and the Doctor Strange sequel, he said something like "I'm not the right person to ask."
Of course, he wrote both, so not sure who would be better to ask.
He'll fit in well at Marvel lol
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Anyone else catch Loki's line "This place is a Nightmare" and Mobius' response "That's another department".
So goddamned clever.
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I thought that there were only six Infinity Stones. Exactly six. I didn't pause and count them, but it sure looked like more than six in Casey's desk drawer, plus Casey said that they had a lot of them and some guys use them for paperweights. So there's even more, somewhere.
So... there are only six in our universe, but this show (or at least the TVA) exists outside of (or beyond) our universe? Something like that?
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I thought that there were only six Infinity Stones. Exactly six. I didn't pause and count them, but it sure looked like more than six in Casey's desk drawer, plus Casey said that they had a lot of them and some guys use them for paperweights. So there's even more, somewhere.
So... there are only six in our universe, but this show (or at least the TVA) exists outside of (or beyond) our universe? Something like that?
Those are presumably from variant timelines that the TVA put a stop to, i.e. copies of the ones from the Sacred Timeline (i.e. our universe).
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I likened Loki's change to Gamora's in Endgame. Gamora had about 3-4 years to develop and become who she was by Infinity War, but her 2014 version in Endgame seemed to flip on a dime once Nebula told her about their shared past/Gamora's future. Granted, Gamora probably had those feelings already but they weren't given the chance to surface until she met the other Guardians, but I guess it also shows how much she really cared for Nebula, even in 2014, that listening to her future sister spurred her into helping her/betraying Thanos.
Loki seeing his future definitely set him along the path he did take in the prime timeline, especially actually seeing his mom die, which I don't believe he literally saw in The Dark World, so I think seeing it (rather than hearing about it from Thor) definitely hit him harder emotionally. And it can't be said enough that Tom's acting in those few minutes is just absolutely brilliant. His tears from Frigga and Odin, to smiling at Thor's expression of brotherly love, to the fear and anger at seeing Thanos snap his neck, Tom conveyed so much in his reactions, you could really feel the journey Loki went on. It's like those meme pics of Shia LaBeouf in the theater watching his movies and going through emotions, but Tom did it better.
I agree with this, but also I think your description of 2014 Gamora all applies to 2012 Loki (assuming of course that he's telling the truth). When he eventually gives in, he reveals that he doesn't actually like killing and hurting people, but does it to feel powerful because he knows he's weak. In the sacred timeline, his redemption arc takes time because he's still after power and status - it's a slower change as he gradually comes round. But here, it's a much quicker process - firstly when discovering how power is meaningless at the TVA when he sees all those infinity stones, and then when he watches what happens to him and what we does in the sacred timeline. It seems to me that those experiences cause him to give up on his drive for power and pave the way for a quicker change of heart.
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So far, this is great. I don't like it a much as WandaVision, but it's still early (and WandaVision set an INCREDIBLY high bar).
I likened Loki's change to Gamora's in Endgame. Gamora had about 3-4 years to develop and become who she was by Infinity War, but her 2014 version in Endgame seemed to flip on a dime once Nebula told her about their shared past/Gamora's future. Granted, Gamora probably had those feelings already but they weren't given the chance to surface until she met the other Guardians, but I guess it also shows how much she really cared for Nebula, even in 2014, that listening to her future sister spurred her into helping her/betraying Thanos.
I don't think Gamorra "flipped on a dime" at all. Yes, becoming part of the guardians changed her. But it became pretty clear that she had been hiding the secret of the soul stone and resented Thanos for a LONG time before meeting the guardians. She just had to conceal how she felt. She also clearly had feelings for her sister for a long time as well. So I never felt like 2014 Gamorra's "flip" was abrupt. It was pretty in-character, actually, for all they had set up about her.
Loki seeing his future definitely set him along the path he did take in the prime timeline, especially actually seeing his mom die, which I don't believe he literally saw in The Dark World, so I think seeing it (rather than hearing about it from Thor) definitely hit him harder emotionally...
Yeah, Loki did soften a bit too quickly to sell completely convincingly. But I don't think it's that big a deal. I think they planted seeds that the Loki we know has a part of him that kinda wants to do good and get approval from others, and I think they way he explained that in this first episode kind of rang true, and we can look at it as him seeing those clips awakened that in him, just in a different way perhaps than him actually living it out in the MCU timeline we are familiar with. But also, on the flip side, I also don't think he was being completely sincere in his softening, and will show himself to be true to his nature by attempting to double cross Mobius at several opportunities.
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I thought that there were only six Infinity Stones. Exactly six. I didn't pause and count them, but it sure looked like more than six in Casey's desk drawer, plus Casey said that they had a lot of them and some guys use them for paperweights. So there's even more, somewhere.
So... there are only six in our universe, but this show (or at least the TVA) exists outside of (or beyond) our universe? Something like that?
Here's how I interpret the multiples of Infinity Stones - They're all from pruned branch timelines, like the Tesseract that Loki stole in Endgame. The branched timelines were clipped and reset with their time grenade charges.
It kinda makes sense that there would be more Infinity Stones at the TVA considering the power they hold, tons of nefarious beings would try to take them and cause chaos, which could incite branch timelines which would need to be pruned and reset. So as we see in the drawer, there are about six (red) Reality Stones, and if the Dark Elves were willing to destroy Asgard to get them, you can imagine how far other beings would go to get them to try and use them to recreate the universe.
There are about four (purple) Power Stones, and being the most physically destructive stone, a lot of war mongering villains would be after them, which is probably why in the prime MCU timeline, the Nova Corps were best trusted to keep it safe (though that did not stop Thanos, but then again, that was *supposed* to happen). There are about six (green) Time Stones, and of course, that would need to be watched carefully because of how easily it could alter the timeline and create multiverses easily (as Mordo warned in the Doctor Strange film).
There's one (blue) Space Stone, which is interesting that it seems like there aren't more of them, but it's probably one of the weaker stones in terms of it's power to alter the timelines since it just displaces people in the three dimensional space within the universe, but there might be more as paperweights around the TVA offices. And there are two (yellow) Mind Stones, which I've seen a lot of folks confuse for the Soul Stone, but the color brightness is a bit dark in the drawer, and the stone itself is seen to be quite larger than the others, which is how the Mind Stone looked in Infinity War (and Endgame) when it was pulled out of Vision's head. Granted, the stones could morph their shape to fit into the gauntlets, but it was always bigger than the other five stones, so I'm 99% certain those two bigger Infinity Stones are Mind Stones.
It also makes sense that there are no Soul Stones considering how difficult they are to obtain, though there are some stones in the credits of the show, and I hadn't seen if there were any orange Soul Stones in there yet. But yeah, hopefully that makes sense. The extra stones are just from branch timelines, so they were taken out of the Sacred Timeline, but because they're in a place outside of their home universe, they're powerless (an idea I recall being mentioned during the 90s Marvel VS DC Comics, where Darkseid came upon the Infinity Gauntlet (with all the Infinity Gems) and he tried using it, but it didn't work in the DC Universe because they weren't in their home universe - very clever writing.
-Marc.
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So far, this is great. I don't like it a much as WandaVision, but it's still early (and WandaVision set an INCREDIBLY high bar).
I likened Loki's change to Gamora's in Endgame. Gamora had about 3-4 years to develop and become who she was by Infinity War, but her 2014 version in Endgame seemed to flip on a dime once Nebula told her about their shared past/Gamora's future. Granted, Gamora probably had those feelings already but they weren't given the chance to surface until she met the other Guardians, but I guess it also shows how much she really cared for Nebula, even in 2014, that listening to her future sister spurred her into helping her/betraying Thanos.
I don't think Gamorra "flipped on a dime" at all. Yes, becoming part of the guardians changed her. But it became pretty clear that she had been hiding the secret of the soul stone and resented Thanos for a LONG time before meeting the guardians. She just had to conceal how she felt. She also clearly had feelings for her sister for a long time as well. So I never felt like 2014 Gamorra's "flip" was abrupt. It was pretty in-character, actually, for all they had set up about her.
That's fair. You're right, but it's been a while since I've seen GOTG 1 and 2, or Endgame, but you're probably right about her character. Yeah, she definitely had those feelings all along, but I think her change of heart happening because of her sister being quicker than it was being with the Guardians definitely speaks to her feelings and relationship with Nebula, which I think is a wonderful notion, and a great piece of character writing. Then again, she did walk away at the end of the battle in Endgame and kind of disappeared, not even telling Nebula anything, though to be fair, she was 9 years into the future with really no one else to be around. I would've thought she and Nebula would have run off together so I was surprise to see Nebula with the Guardians again at the end. Hopefully Thor: Love And Thunder kind of bring up their search for Gamora and touch on that a bit before we see them again in GOTG 3.
Loki seeing his future definitely set him along the path he did take in the prime timeline, especially actually seeing his mom die, which I don't believe he literally saw in The Dark World, so I think seeing it (rather than hearing about it from Thor) definitely hit him harder emotionally...
Yeah, Loki did soften a bit too quickly to sell completely convincingly. But I don't think it's that big a deal. I think they planted seeds that the Loki we know has a part of him that kinda wants to do good and get approval from others, and I think they way he explained that in this first episode kind of rang true, and we can look at it as him seeing those clips awakened that in him, just in a different way perhaps than him actually living it out in the MCU timeline we are familiar with. But also, on the flip side, I also don't think he was being completely sincere in his softening, and will show himself to be true to his nature by attempting to double cross Mobius at several opportunities.
Well, time does move differently in the TVA, so maybe Loki saw more of his life than we got to see him watch! :lol But for THIS Loki, he just lost a battle against the Avengers after being given an Infinity Stone and stealing a second, and then seeing his boss' boss (Thanos) snap his neck in a huge betrayal, so coupling that with the realization that the Stones weren't the most powerful things in the universe, and seeing his parents die (especially Odin after acknowledging him as a son), he got the whole range of emotions that the Prime Loki had over the course of 6 years in just under 6 minutes.
But you're probably right, he's still going to cause mischief, it's in his nature after all. There's that shot in the trailers of him parading about in Pompeii just before the volcano erupts as he seems to be evading Mobius, so who knows what's gonna happen as the series goes on. But I do think he was being genuinely vulnerable to Mobius in that moment, especially after he says that he tried using the Tesseract many times to escape the TVA. I think he's also just curious about why there's a more dangerous version of him causing trouble for the TVA, since Mobius likened 2012 Loki to being a pussy cat in terms of being a "dangerous variant".
-Marc.
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Yeah, I couldn't help but wonder whether the relative numbers and types of stones had any significance like you are suggesting, Marc. I tend to think it is somewhat random (as in, "dump a handful into the drawer to make the point"), and that beyond that, there wasn't really any intended commentary on the specific stones. But who knows?
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Yeah, I couldn't help but wonder whether the relative numbers and types of stones had any significance like you are suggesting, Marc. I tend to think it is somewhat random (as in, "dump a handful into the drawer to make the point"), and that beyond that, there wasn't really any intended commentary on the specific stones. But who knows?
I could honestly see it going either way. Marvel Studios is either really careful with the placement of its sets and pieces, or they could be super careless and just see how it goes, but given that they were taking a jab at the MCU's major macguffins, I think someone was being deliberate in their numbers and placement. But like you said, who knows! Only the writers and producers, really. In the end, the whole reason for them being there was to make Loki realize that his quest for power was meaningless in a place like the TVA, where that power is rendered powerless to the point of being pieces of office supplies.
-Marc.
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I keep forgetting that the universe has more dimensions and more realities than I think. The whole idea that those stones could've come from alternate timelines hadn't even occurred to me. Even though we saw about a dozen examples of alternate timelines and stuff.
Note to self: Remember to consider all possible realities when making any decision or trying to analyze science fiction. Or even reality. Right.
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Caught episode 2 this morning before heading out. What a good episode, probably even better than episode one!
The twist/reveal at the end was certainly played out unexpectedly, but sadly I had known about the "big reveal" beforehand (months ago) because of behind the scenes leaks. Not that I care too much because it didn't reveal too much, and it was much cooler seeing it unravel on screen anyway.
The ending of this episode left me with more questions than I started with, and very few answers. It was nice to see most of the supporting cast appear again throughout the episode, as I was worried we might not see the likes of Casey ever again! I'm really glad these are hour length episodes, but I wouldn't mind if the last couple are a little bit longer!
I'll share more spoilery thoughts later today once more people have seen it, but so far, this series is slowly shaping up to be my favorite of the 3 Disney+ Marvel Studios shows so far!
-Marc.
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Outstanding stuff... I'm all in on this one.
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Outstanding stuff... I'm all in on this one.
Enjoying this quite a bit as well. Better than Wandavison or Falcon and Winter Soldier so far. Hopefully it holds up and doesn't turn into the typical generic Marvel CGI action at the end. I like that Loki so far feels like it deserves to be a tv show. Falcon and Winter Soldier felt like an overlong movie they broke into 6 parts.
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I love the internal conflict they're developing in Loki, I really hope they draw it out to fruition.
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Enjoyed the 2nd episode as well. I'm more intrigued by the Time Keepers and wonder if they'll make an appearance at all in the course of the season. I really really love the vibe of the show so far, that setting of the TVA is a joy to watch.
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I thought the episode was really good. Looking forward to seeing the ramifications of the ending.
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I thought the episode was really good. Looking forward to seeing the ramifications of the ending.
Origins of the multiverse of madness methinks.
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So can we start talking spoilers yet? That's the reason we keep this thread separate from the MCU thread, right?
So...my son figures that the woman was just a female Loki....after all, they had been chasing down multiple Loki's and we even had pictures of many of them (Monster Loki was my favorite) so why not a female one? But then I pointed out that she refused to be called Loki, seemed to really dislike the name, and then exited by saying "it's not about you". Could this be a completely different character who has *fooled* the TVA into *thinking* they were chasing Loki?
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That's what I think. Other than the headpiece she was wearing, there are no outward physical indications. She and the small handful of actors that each spend about 30 seconds as "the variant" did a reasonable job of imitating his speech patterns, which was entertaining, but something tells me that she's not Lady Loki.
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Didn't he refer to her by a name when she revealed herself? I'm Assuming he knows who she is, but maybe I'm just misunderstanding.
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Didn't he refer to her by a name when she revealed herself? I'm Assuming he knows who she is, but maybe I'm just misunderstanding.
I did not hear that. You’re gonna make me have to watch it again. LOL did anyone else hear him address her by a name?
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Foreign language credits listed her as "Sylvie", and in one of the Crime Reports that Loki looks through, one incident in 1908 in Central California listed "Sylvie Laufeydottir" as the culprit. However, comics fans have pointed out that a 2nd version of Enchantress (not the original Amora one) was created by Loki by making a human named Sylvie Lushton believe she was an Asgardian, and Loki gave her powers and abilities like his and the Enchantress.
Marvel could be combining Lady Loki and the Enchantress into a new version of one of those characters. This wouldn't be the first time they've mashed up characters (see Iron Man 2's Whiplash, a combination of Whiplash and Crimson Dynamo, or GOTG2's Ego, who was a Mashup of Ego the living planet and a Celestial).
I'm trying not to make too many definitive theories quite yet because I'm sure her backstory will be revealed in episode three. I also don't think she is the MAIN antagonistic force of this season, and she might be trying to save the timeline FROM the Time Keepers...but we shall see!
-Marc.
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I'm trying not to make too many definitive theories quite yet because I'm sure her backstory will be revealed in episode three. I also don't think she is the MAIN antagonistic force of this season, and she might be trying to save the timeline FROM the Time Keepers...but we shall see!
Good point - particularly as Loki is hardly a typical protagonist (especially 2012 Loki), they could go in various different directions. Adds another level of intrigue and entertainment to it!
So can we start talking spoilers yet? That's the reason we keep this thread separate from the MCU thread, right?
Yes absolutely, I don't know why people keep holding off - each show having its own thread is precisely so that people can have spoiler-filled discussions as soon as an episode airs.
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and she might be trying to save the timeline FROM the Time Keepers...but we shall see!
I'm down with this theory... and that "The Timekeepers" is just Kang.
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and she might be trying to save the timeline FROM the Time Keepers...but we shall see!
I'm down with this theory... and that "The Timekeepers" is just Kang.
I have more hope for Kang appearing in Loki than I did for Mephisto appearing in WandaVision, mostly because Kang has already been cast in the MCU (for Ant-Man & The Wasp: Quantumania, which just started filming this week). It would be wild if Loki was stealthily setting up BOTH Doctor Strange In The Multiverse Of Madness *AND* Quantumania, but given the nature of the TVA and the concepts behind those film sequels, it makes sense if Loki has some connection to them. Endgame was more than just a time travel story, it was the precedent for Phase 4 and the insanity that will come because of meddling with time, and I am HERE for it. I cannot wait for Kang, so if he shows up in Loki, I'll flip.
-Marc.
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3rd episode is a bit bland to be honest. Lots and lots of chatter doubling as filling in the audience in on the background of the characters, but not much else going on. Hopefully this information dump will payoff in the remaining episodes.
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I'm really feeling this one more than Wanda and waaay more that Falcon. I'm interested to see if this is a way to bring some infinity war losses back to life.
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3rd episode is a bit bland to be honest. Lots and lots of chatter doubling as filling in the audience in on the background of the characters, but not much else going on. Hopefully this information dump will payoff in the remaining episodes.
I was going to say basically this same thing. Not the best episode.
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Just caught the episode, and yeah, it is a bit of a slower one, but it's also a bit shorter too. By the end, I was surprised how much shorter it was when it felt like it went by quite quickly.
I loved the quibbling between them and revealing more of Sylvie's personality and intentions. Also enjoyed seeing Loki cut loose a bit more, especially his hedonistic Asgardian lifestyle, including asking for "another!"
Definitely the weakest of the first 3 episodes so far but still enjoyable for me! The sets and locations were quite intriguing as well, and that final unbroken camera shot through the city was really well done!
-Marc.
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They did paint themselves into a corner at the end... I'm thinking Mobius will appear to save them, not really sure how else they can escape with only a few hours till the moon crushes them.
And I agree, it was a mild episode.
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That was a hell of a cliffhanger.
I don't agree that the episode was any weaker than the previous ones, but then I tend of think of seasons as a single entity, with each episode a part of it. This was different in a lot of ways, and seems to have added quite a lot to the characters and overall story arc which is exactly what TV shows are good for.
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I'm with Rich. This 'act' served a few purposes, and was entertaining enough. There's a few possible outcomes that get them off the rock - be it Mobius and the TVA finding them in *this* apocalypse, or allies of Sylvie showing up to save the day.
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Don't get me wrong, it was entertaining for sure.. Maybe I felt Loki and Mobius just had better chemistry thelan he and Silvie.
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I don't think Mobius or the TVA will come to the rescue, after all this is the worst apocalyptic of all according to Silvie if that´s true then they are hidden as explained in ep02, no?
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Don't get me wrong, it was entertaining for sure.. Maybe I felt Loki and Mobius just had better chemistry thelan he and Silvie.
I think this is it for me. I missed the Loki/Mobius banter in this episode.
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Low key episode...
/Coat.
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I don't think Mobius or the TVA will come to the rescue, after all this is the worst apocalyptic of all according to Silvie if that´s true then they are hidden as explained in ep02, no?
Shit, you're totally right.
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I thought it was great. It was a little on the short side, true, but it still flew by and I was totally caught by surprise when it was over. Except for that brief opening scene explaining how Sylvie charmed agent Hunter C-20, the entire thing was them on the move. I had no problem getting to know Sylvie (and Loki) a bit better through their constant banter, and they were almost constantly moving. Probably could've done without Loki getting drunk on the train and fucking things up, but even that scene gave us some insight in his character. It didn't even occur to me until later that we hadn't checked in with Mobius or anyone else from the TVA the whole episode.
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This episode sort of reminds me of Episode 4 of WandaVision, where we broke from Wanda and Vision (for the most part), and took the plot to a different place. It's a nice break but it seems like, according to Tom Hiddleston, episodes 4 and 5 will be amazing, so I think we are in for a treat. I think episode 3 was a much needed breather between the heights of the action and big plot points.
-Marc.
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I don't think Mobius or the TVA will come to the rescue, after all this is the worst apocalyptic of all according to Silvie if that´s true then they are hidden as explained in ep02, no?
Shit, you're totally right.
Well, theoretically, TVA could spend all the "time" they need hunting through various apocalypses throughout space and history before finally getting to this one. But then again, they've got a few dozen branches that they are trying to trim.
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That was easily the worst episode of the 3 miniseries so far.
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Good stuff. Not the chaos I was expecting following the end of episode 2, but we got great banter between two excellent actors who have obvious chemistry.
Hopefully the chaos hits full force next episode.
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My final opinion may change once the whole series is done, but as of now (3 episodes) this is easily my least favorite of the 3 Marvel Shows.
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I liked the episode plenty. Tons of great chemistry, cool scenes, good dialogue etc. Even some nice revelations about the TVA.
However I did feel that this episode lacked much...substance? It just felt like those packages from amazon that are a huge box filled mostly with airbubbles and a small keychain or something. Glad I got the keychain, but you could've put a lot more in that box.
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Felt a bit like an episode of Doctor Who in places.
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I liked the episode plenty. Tons of great chemistry, cool scenes, good dialogue etc. Even some nice revelations about the TVA.
However I did feel that this episode lacked much...substance? It just felt like those packages from amazon that are a huge box filled mostly with airbubbles and a small keychain or something. Glad I got the keychain, but you could've put a lot more in that box.
Right. There just seems to be something missing. Maybe it will all make sense once it's all done. It's obvious that this is a huge setup for all of the MCU in Phase 4 and beyond so it may even be years before we "get" everything.
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However I did feel that this episode lacked much...substance?
I liked the episode, but I agree with this. It just felt a bit predictable with the "what else could go wrong" type of writing. "Oh, We're stuck on the worst apocalypse, let's just jump back, oh wait, the battery is dead. That's fine let's go charge it. Oh, I guess we need to get on this train, Great. Well we got kicked out, oh crap, our equipment broke..." you get the idea. Overall, I thought it was a good episode that kind of hinted at the TVA not being what we thought it was.
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I think the main issue with "what else can go wrong" type of movies/episodes is that we know all along they'll get out of it somehow, so there's really no sense of fear for the characters. I tend to eventually roll my eyes at the next thing that blows up in their face in the types of episodes. Hopefully this set up future episodes and it'll all pay off later.
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Felt a bit like an episode of Doctor Who in places.
I just said the same thing to my folks (I'm definitely not a Who guy) Some random running about and nonsensical reasoning. Hope the 4th episode brings it back to some logic.
The chemistry is good, tho. She-Loki is pretty funny.
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Felt a bit like an episode of Doctor Who in places.
I just said the same thing to my folks (I'm definitely not a Who guy) Some random running about and nonsensical reasoning. Hope the 4th episode brings it back to some logic.
The chemistry is good, tho. She-Loki is pretty funny.
I was about to ask what "Mohammad reasoning" meant before you fixed your post. :lol
I'm going to guess it was autocorrected on your phone and you just didn't check it before hitting "post"?
-Marc.
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Felt a bit like an episode of Doctor Who in places.
I just said the same thing to my folks (I'm definitely not a Who guy) Some random running about and nonsensical reasoning. Hope the 4th episode brings it back to some logic.
The chemistry is good, tho. She-Loki is pretty funny.
I was about to ask what "Mohammad reasoning" meant before you fixed your post. :lol
I'm going to guess it was autocorrected on your phone and you just didn't check it before hitting "post"?
-Marc.
Yes, exactly. When I came back to the thread I was like WTF happened in my post... :lol
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Wow. Anyone who wanted more after last episode should certainly feel full after episode 4. I've watched it TWICE now and I can't settle down enough to fall asleep, so I'm posting my initial thoughts after two viewings.
Everyone in the cast had a moment to shine this episode, from Hunter B-15 and Mobius, to Loki and Sylvie, and even Ravonna Renslayer. They definitely amped things up a bit, and the not-so-twisty twist about the Time Keepers was fun to see unravel! I hope Ravonna spills the beans in episode five!
Also, if you missed it the first time, be sure to catch the mid-credits scene (after the main credits/before the black and white text credits). Definitely do not want to miss this one!!
-Marc.
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:omg: :omg: :omg:
Just...
:omg: :omg: :omg:
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:omg: :omg: :omg:
Just...
:omg: :omg: :omg:
:omg:
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Yeah, there was a lot to unpack there. Think I'll need to watch again, as we had a couple of logistical hiccups with wi-fi and Disney+ that interrupted our viewing a couple times.
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:omg: :omg: :omg:
Just...
:omg: :omg: :omg:
:omg:
Pretty much! This, for me, is the best episode of the series so far, but I have a feeling the next one might top that, especially if we get a lot more on those Variants teased in the credits scene! Glad to finally see Richard E. Grant in the show, and his outfit is ridiculously fun. It's pretty much the equivalent of the Halloween episode of WandaVision, seeing their classic comic costumes in live action.
-Marc.
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:omg: :omg: :omg:
Just...
:omg: :omg: :omg:
:omg:
Yep, this.
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That was a VERY cool episode. Multiple jaw drops.
My only complain, and really is the only one I can think of, is that the fight scene was.....bad. It actually took me out of it just how poor the fight scene was. Hopefully this show won't rely a lot on fight scenes, because they're crushing literally everything else.
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(https://scontent-ort2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/202074223_4672921769427078_6202829304876183533_n.jpg?_nc_cat=101&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=825194&_nc_ohc=FtTb4Ml5_9kAX_-GfAL&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-1.xx&oh=ca299dc018524bac97d71ea680265248&oe=60E1D2CE)
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Fantastic!
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That episode was FANTASTIC.
I must admit that I had no idea there was a mid-credits scene, so at the end of the episode proper, my youngest and I literally sat in open-mouthed shock while the credits rolled, legitimately sad. And then when the extra scene started, we both yetlled "YES!"
BTW, let's hear it for Gator Loki.
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Yeah, I'm curious as to how Loki was born a reptile in some alternate universe/timeline/whatever.
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Yeah, I'm curious as to how Loki was born a reptile in some alternate universe/timeline/whatever.
(https://media3.giphy.com/media/TI46fnNHSTJUevmwwe/200.gif)
I assume it's just a nod to Throg (Frog Thor).
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Um, okay. I don't know that reference, but I'll take your word for it.
In the meantime:
(https://i.imgur.com/2gsg0p9.jpg)
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World of Wilson’s.
Or WoW.
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BTW, let's hear it for Gator Loki.
Are we sure it's not a Lokidile?
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That was terrific. Delighted with it.
My only complain, and really is the only one I can think of, is that the fight scene was.....bad. It actually took me out of it just how poor the fight scene was. Hopefully this show won't rely a lot on fight scenes, because they're crushing literally everything else.
Totally.
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Speaking of Owen Wilson, I have to say that he's really killing it in this show. I like Owen Wilson, but every character he's ever done (that I know of) is basically the same, and I really wasn't sure if it would work here.
Instead, his calm, chill manner has proven to be a great counterpart to Tom Hiddleston's Loki, and they have great chemistry together. We'd better get a scene of Mobius on a jet-ski, though. Make it an end-credits or mid-credits scene if you must, but they've dropped like a dozen hints; they must follow through.
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Speaking of Owen Wilson, I have to say that he's really killing it in this show. I like Owen Wilson, but every character he's ever done (that I know of) is basically the same, and I really wasn't sure if it would work here.
Instead, his calm, chill manner has proven to be a great counterpart to Tom Hiddleston's Loki, and they have great chemistry together. We'd better get a scene of Mobius on a jet-ski, though. Make it an end-credits or mid-credits scene if you must, but they've dropped like a dozen hints; they must follow through.
Agree 100%
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Croki
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Yes, it's a genius piece of casting. They're fantastic together. At that point in the show last night I was like "oh noooo!"
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Yeah... when he got pruned, jinglie.son and I did an instant :omg: :omg: at each other. Then when Loki did, I knew something had to be up.
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Husband and I both said "can't be, he didn't say "Wow" yet!"
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Croki
:lol
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That was a VERY cool episode. Multiple jaw drops.
My only complain, and really is the only one I can think of, is that the fight scene was.....bad. It actually took me out of it just how poor the fight scene was. Hopefully this show won't rely a lot on fight scenes, because they're crushing literally everything else.
I agree. They need a new fight choreographer.
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Anyone else think about how everyone though that the MCU's first multiversal team-up would probably be Spider-Man No Way Home, but now it looks like it's going to be "Into The Lokiverse" with "our" Loki joining four other Loki variants in some abandoned New York (and possibly also meeting President Loki, who we still haven't seen yet). And we definitely need to see Croki just bite the ankles of someone or it'll be a lost opportunity.
-Marc.
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The memes coming from this show are fucking amazing.
(https://scontent-ort2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/209593403_3907429016021267_3498798227359259505_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=825194&_nc_ohc=Mr9owGiM8ZsAX-wx3Wg&tn=OM6zJbGir-yk92E0&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-1.xx&oh=fbb0d15ce33342f74a0963ffcc2dfd2c&oe=60E5A7F1)
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Wow, what an incredible penultimate episode! The various Lokis (or is it Loki?) make this a fun episode, especially Alligator Loki, who I have to give a hand to for stealing the show! I loved seeing the Throg cameo, too, which makes me wonder if he's there because of Alloki? Hmmm...
Classic Loki's last stand, complete with "glorious purpose" shout was brilliant, and the magically conjured Asgard was spectacular! I hope Kid Loki returns to the MCU for a Young Avengers crossover that they seem to keep setting up with these Disney+ shows so far!
Looking up Alioth in the comics, he's got a history with Kang, so if Kang isn't the "man behind the curtain" of the TVA, I'm not sure who would be. I just hope we get that question answered next week!
I can't say episode 5 is my favorite of the series so far, but it was definitely enjoyable and very fun to watch! There were tons of Easter eggs in there, like the THANOS COPTER in the background, so I may have to watch it again to try and catch them all!
-Marc.
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Dude! Spoiler warning!!!!
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Dude! Spoiler warning!!!!
Dude! This is the spoiler thread! That is why it’s separate from the MCU thread!
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Crazy fucking episode, just wild.
One thing I'm tripping on, and will probably have to watch a bazillion YouTube vids to get an answer 9n,is what was the deal with the tiny trapped Thor in the ground when they first went to the Loki hideout?
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Crazy fucking episode, just wild.
One thing I'm tripping on, and will probably have to watch a bazillion YouTube vids to get an answer 9n,is what was the deal with the tiny trapped Thor in the ground when they first went to the Loki hideout?
It's a comics reference to Throg, based on when Loki turned Thor into a Frog. Looks like this MCU Throg got stuck in a jar and is trying to grab a full-sized Mjolnir. Definitely a wild cameo for sure!
Dude! Spoiler warning!!!!
Dude! This is the spoiler thread! That is why it’s separate from the MCU thread!
Precisely this. The general MCU thread is for non-recet-spoiler talk, but these show-specific threads have been for spoiler discussion once new episodes go up. I had been vague before in my initial post-show posts but other folks had wondered why I was being so vague when this was the dedicated thread for the show, and they all talked spoilers, so I decided to just go for it.
-Marc.
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Aw thanks man, you saved me some digging.
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Dude! Spoiler warning!!!!
Dude! This is the spoiler thread! That is why it’s separate from the MCU thread!
I thought we were still working under the gentlemen’s agreement of 2 days grace .... not spoilers at 5 am on release day!
Either way, amazing episode. This is one I think I’ll rematch.
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I have a sneaking suspicion that the man/woman behind the curtain who started it all and has been manipulating time/everyone this whole time is going to be a 'Loki'. Probably will be a Tom Huddelston 'Loki' and then the two 'heros' are going to have to choose if they really want to destroy it all after they've been given a crafty dissertation as to 'why' it was all set up that way.
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I have a sneaking suspicion that the man/woman behind the curtain who started it all and has been manipulating time/everyone this whole time is going to be a 'Loki'. Probably will be a Tom Huddelston 'Loki' and then the two 'heros' are going to have to choose if they really want to destroy it all after they've been given a crafty dissertation as to 'why' it was all set up that way.
Yea, I can see that. The whole show seems about him confronting himself in many ways, and that would definitely fit into that. I don't see Kang being the big bad since it wasn't set up at all, but I can see a post-credits scene either hinting at him or showing him.
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FANTASTIC episode. In addition to the wonderful storytelling and acting, they sprinkled in some pretty obscure Easter Eggs throughout. I NEVER thought I would see the Thanos Copter in the MCU!
The Brokis are awesome, and Richard Grant's demise was fantastic.
If the big bad ISN'T Kang, then they have certainly wasted a lot of potential Kang-themed breadcrumbs throughout this series.
I hope that it's Kang, but that idea about another Loki also has merit.
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FANTASTIC episode. In addition to the wonderful storytelling and acting, they sprinkled in some pretty obscure Easter Eggs throughout. I NEVER thought I would see the Thanos Copter in the MCU!
The Brokis are awesome, and Richard Grant's demise was fantastic.
If the big bad ISN'T Kang, then they have certainly wasted a lot of potential Kang-themed breadcrumbs throughout this series.
I hope that it's Kang, but that idea about another Loki also has merit.
I dunno. I feel like breadcrumbs aren't enough to make him the big bad here. You generally don't have the final villain be someone we haven't met or even had mentioned till the end. We know they're giving us Kang in Ant-Man and The Wasp, so maybe these breadcrumbs are leading to that. And like I said, maybe a post-credits scene here, but there just wouldn't be any emotional investment in fighting off a villain that the show hasn't even mentioned yet. We all thought they were going to do that in WandaVision with Mephisto and nope. They clearly have villains or antagonists that have been present to some degree before the finale.
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FANTASTIC episode. In addition to the wonderful storytelling and acting, they sprinkled in some pretty obscure Easter Eggs throughout. I NEVER thought I would see the Thanos Copter in the MCU!
The Brokis are awesome, and Richard Grant's demise was fantastic.
If the big bad ISN'T Kang, then they have certainly wasted a lot of potential Kang-themed breadcrumbs throughout this series.
I hope that it's Kang, but that idea about another Loki also has merit.
I dunno. I feel like breadcrumbs aren't enough to make him the big bad here. You generally don't have the final villain be someone we haven't met or even had mentioned till the end. We know they're giving us Kang in Ant-Man and The Wasp, so maybe these breadcrumbs are leading to that. And like I said, maybe a post-credits scene here, but there just wouldn't be any emotional investment in fighting off a villain that the show hasn't even mentioned yet. We all thought they were going to do that in WandaVision with Mephisto and nope. They clearly have villains or antagonists that have been present to some degree before the finale.
Well, no villain is mentioned until they are mentioned.
I would argue that WandaVision did that with Agnes. They just didn't wait until the very last episode to do so.
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What if it is a Loki variant that is Kang? (i.e., what if they present Kang as a Loki variant?)
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FANTASTIC episode. In addition to the wonderful storytelling and acting, they sprinkled in some pretty obscure Easter Eggs throughout. I NEVER thought I would see the Thanos Copter in the MCU!
The Brokis are awesome, and Richard Grant's demise was fantastic.
If the big bad ISN'T Kang, then they have certainly wasted a lot of potential Kang-themed breadcrumbs throughout this series.
I hope that it's Kang, but that idea about another Loki also has merit.
I dunno. I feel like breadcrumbs aren't enough to make him the big bad here. You generally don't have the final villain be someone we haven't met or even had mentioned till the end. We know they're giving us Kang in Ant-Man and The Wasp, so maybe these breadcrumbs are leading to that. And like I said, maybe a post-credits scene here, but there just wouldn't be any emotional investment in fighting off a villain that the show hasn't even mentioned yet. We all thought they were going to do that in WandaVision with Mephisto and nope. They clearly have villains or antagonists that have been present to some degree before the finale.
Well, no villain is mentioned until they are mentioned.
I would argue that WandaVision did that with Agnes. They just didn't wait until the very last episode to do so.
But they aren't mentioned in the final act only. That's just not good storytelling. And while Agnes wasn't mentioned as the villain, she as a character was there since episode 1. So she wasn't a completely new character, just a character turn.
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That's just not good storytelling.
??? Says who?
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That's just not good storytelling.
??? Says who?
Me!
But maybe I’m wrong. Are there examples of these types of stories when the antagonist doesn’t get introduced or even mentioned until the climax? Did it work?
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There are different ways to do storytelling, especially in this medium. For example, it could be that Kang is behind it, but that defeating Kang isn't the finale of Loki, which is more about taking down the TVA, and setting up Kang within the MCU later on.
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I think Sylvie is going to die.
I also think this show is still a complete mess. Least favorite D+ TV series so far. I would probably even put Inhumans ahead of it.
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I think Sylvie is going to die.
I also think this show is still a complete mess. Least favorite D+ TV series so far. I would probably even put Inhumans ahead of it.
(https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Freplygif.net%2Fi%2F980.gif&hash=927053710c50d0999989a9a466d1c7ac2e969c16)
This is very much as good (if not better) than WandaVision, imo. I really hope you meant to put this in green font.
As for Kang, I would be disappointed as there are too many hints / easter eggs leading to that path. I don't do much investigative work at all the easter eggs, but jingle.son does and there are just too many connections that it would be disingenuous of Marvel to cite them all as red herrings. I can see there being one more Loki as a 'front' for Kang, but Kang needs to be the ultimate mastermind and creator of the TVA / Timekeepers. Perhaps there's a Loki that already toppled Kang or something like that?
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I think Sylvie is going to die.
I also think this show is still a complete mess. Least favorite D+ TV series so far. I would probably even put Inhumans ahead of it.
Yeah, I think she might too.
It's a bit random in a Dr Who kinda way, but I've really enjoyed it. Better than FATWS but not quite as good as WandaVision, I would say.
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After hearing and thinking of several theories about who the "Man Behind The Curtain" is, I think the final boss will be the King Loki that has appeared in trailers, but he didn't rise to power alone. I think he'll reveal he had a benefactor, someone who helped him create the TVA as a way to control time, and convince him to control and get rid of dangerous variants of himself. And by giving King Loki a way to control the time line, his benefactor would be left alone as he watches from the shadows in Chronopolis, deep inside the Quantum Realm. Yes - I'm suggesting that Kang is King Loki's help. He'll probably appear in a mid- or post-credits scene, sort of how Thanos appeared at the end of the Avengers, and much in the same way Thanos gave 2012 Loki the Mind Stone/Scepter. Maybe Kang knows that Loki couldn't succeed on his own, but giving him the help to oversee the timeline would give a Loki a chance to finally rule something, but keep him busy enough to keep him out of Kang's hair.
But if Kang doesn't show up at ALL, I don't think I'll be TOO disappointed, but there have been similar let-downs based on fan-expectations before, so I'm trying to temper my expectations for this finale.
-Marc.
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Loki is quirky and bonkers, but it's not random or messy.
That's part of why I love it - my favourite D+ series so far - but I understand why some people won't enjoy that style of storytelling so much.
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There are MANY easter eggs in the latest ep.
(https://i.ibb.co/3YZympY/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-09-a-la-s-01-34-39.png) (https://ibb.co/G3SvQW3)
QENG the company that bought the Avengers towers, who is behind that company? Yup, company owned by a man named Mister Gryphon, who is actually a version of Nathaniel Richards aka Kang the Conqueror.
Alioth and his past witk KANG https://www.menshealth.com/entertainment/a36954982/loki-alioth-mcu-marvel-comics/
(https://i.ibb.co/qBfjMTL/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-09-a-la-s-01-43-24.png) (https://ibb.co/K6khjTc)
Yellow Jacket helmet?
(https://i.ibb.co/swTNqjX/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-09-a-la-s-01-45-14.png) (https://ibb.co/d2NVDBH)
Thanos copter
(https://i.ibb.co/hWJgDWY/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-09-a-la-s-01-46-32.png) (https://ibb.co/cFSyDFY)
Throg and the tag in the jar may be an allusion to the episode when it was introduced originally in the comics on 1965
(https://i.ibb.co/fYzZJ9C/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-09-a-la-s-01-51-03.png) (https://ibb.co/8DLGkbj)
The Philadelphia experiment
https://www.gamerevolution.com/news/686690-loki-uss-eldridge-ship-boat-philadelphia-experiment-173
(https://i.ibb.co/bbDrGG0/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-09-a-la-s-01-54-26.png) (https://ibb.co/5Kw5JJ0)
ronan the accuser´s ship?
(https://i.ibb.co/Kyn1VSj/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-09-a-la-s-01-55-44.png) (https://ibb.co/vz9tLRx)
Living Tribunal´s head?
(https://i.ibb.co/F0CSWxq/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-09-a-la-s-01-57-11.png) (https://ibb.co/fnLhS1G)
Helicarrier with Hydra symbol?
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Caught the episode last night. Really like it, they are setting up the plot for a very dramatic ending. I did not catch nearly as many easter eggs, so might need to rewatch it. Don't know who will be the main villain, but I like the idea of another Loki, though given how much power and control this individual has, I would not be surprised if it's not that.
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Can someone please explain to me the "Thanos Copter"? It's one of the few (thousand) references in the MCU that I don't recall.
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Can someone please explain to me the "Thanos Copter"? It's one of the few (thousand) references in the MCU that I don't recall.
There’s not a ton to it. It’s from an old comic that, I’m pretty sure, wasn’t an official cannon thing where Thanos went super campy and had a 60s style personalized thanos copter. Because it was just so silly it really caught on in nerd culture.
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Can someone please explain to me the "Thanos Copter"? It's one of the few (thousand) references in the MCU that I don't recall.
There’s not a ton to it. It’s from an old comic that, I’m pretty sure, wasn’t an official cannon thing where Thanos went super campy and had a 60s style personalized thanos copter. Because it was just so silly it really caught on in nerd culture.
It was originally from Spidey Super Stories, which was basically a comic for younger kids based on the Spider-Man skits on The Electric Company. If I remember correctly, Thanos gets arrested by the police at the end of the issue.
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Thanks. Some people were getting pretty excited about seeing it, and I had no idea what it was. Apparently there are a lot of things in the background in The Void that are references to other things.
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I think Sylvie is going to die.
I also think this show is still a complete mess. Least favorite D+ TV series so far. I would probably even put Inhumans ahead of it.
I wouldn't put Inhumans ahead of the flu.
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I think Sylvie is going to die.
I also think this show is still a complete mess. Least favorite D+ TV series so far. I would probably even put Inhumans ahead of it.
I wouldn't put Inhumans ahead of the flu.
I'd put it right above a swift kick in the nuts.
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When we first got D+, I put on the Inhumans with the full expectation that I was going to be watching a dumpster fire on the level of Plan 9 from Outer Space the way people were talking about it. I was prepared to make fun of it ala MST3K.
With my expectations THAT low, what I ended up getting wasn’t really that bad. The lady was hot and I really liked the dog. I hope that ends up being canonical somehow.
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When we first got D+, I put on the Inhumans with the full expectation that I was going to be watching a dumpster fire on the level of Plan 9 from Outer Space the way people were talking about it. I was prepared to make fun of it ala MST3K.
With my expectations THAT low, what I ended up getting wasn’t really that bad. The lady was hot and I really liked the dog. I hope that ends up being canonical somehow.
I really don’t. Only because I want them to make a better version for canon. The dog will still be awesome but hopefully the rest won’t be so bad.
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(https://i.imgur.com/X2TzYMf_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium)
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I've tried three times to get through the first episode, and I have yet to succeed. :lol
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Even though I don't care for the show as much as the other D+ shows, I will say that, like most, it becomes more engaging as it goes on past episode 1, so it may be worth trying a few episodes. That said, I think ep. 1 of Loki is more accessible than ep. 1 of Wandavision, for example, just because Wandavision is so "out there" for the first 2 or 3 episodes before you find out about the "hex." Don't know if any of that is helpful.
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Something interesting I just noticed after watching the first 5 episodes again.
(https://i.ibb.co/GWBjjLJ/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-11-a-la-s-19-39-33.png) (https://ibb.co/zXjwwY5)
Ep 1 Orange color through all the episode, soul stone, on this episode we could see the emotions of Loki flowing.
(https://i.ibb.co/2Skfrvd/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-11-a-la-s-19-42-20.png) (https://ibb.co/pQL9Tfd)
Ep 2 Red color through all the episode, reality stone, Loki questions what´s real and what´s not real.
(https://i.ibb.co/8mR1V5W/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-11-a-la-s-19-43-31.png) (https://ibb.co/Twn958V)
Ep 3 Purple color through all the episode, power stone, Loki and Sylvie show their powers and are looking for a energy source.
(https://i.ibb.co/34nW26L/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-11-a-la-s-19-44-55.png) (https://ibb.co/MZmprw3)
Ep 4 Yellow color through all the episode, mind stone, Loki tries to change Mobius´s mind regarding the TVA and we see how Sylvie gets inside the minds of C-20 and B-15
(https://i.ibb.co/dWwJfjF/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-11-a-la-s-19-46-54.png) (https://ibb.co/1vtJ071)
Ep 5 Green color through all the episode, time stone, The chapter is developed in the void, probably there´s no time in there, as they said they´ll be there forever.
(https://i.ibb.co/M29WSQs/Captura-de-Pantalla-2021-07-11-a-la-s-19-52-11.png) (https://ibb.co/DVLsWTt)
ANNNND CHapter 6 will be Blue colored, space stone, whatever happens in this episode will affect the multiverse
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That. Is. Freakin. Brilliant!
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Nice! :tup
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Wow :omg:. MCU never fails to impress.
Assuming this isn't someone 'shopping a nice theory.
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Wow :omg:. MCU never fails to impress.
Assuming this isn't someone 'shopping a nice theory.
It is a fan theory, but it has some good grounds to support it.
https://gamerant.com/infinity-stones-theory-loki/
I went back to see if this theory connects with the infinity war drawer we saw on Ep. 1, but I could not see anything.
(https://thedirect.s3.amazonaws.com/media/photos/lokiz2.jpg)
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Wow :omg:. MCU never fails to impress.
Assuming this isn't someone 'shopping a nice theory.
It is a fan theory, but it has some good grounds to support it.
https://gamerant.com/infinity-stones-theory-loki/
I went back to see if this theory connects with the infinity war drawer we saw on Ep. 1, but I could not see anything.
(https://thedirect.s3.amazonaws.com/media/photos/lokiz2.jpg)
Niice, I didn´t see that article until now, it makes a lot of sense that this series is connected to the stones. We´ll see in a couple of days where we are led to.
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The finale was...well... more than I expected!! I need time to digest everything. Also, if you don't normally do so, I suggest watching this with the subtitles on, especially for the beginning/MCU logo sequence.
-Marc.
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Strange episode - a lot happen, a lot which will impact Phase 4, but at the same time this episode was a lot of people talking. And as a standalone series is this a satisfying ending? Well just make sure you watch the post credits for a massive pleasing sting :corn
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I enjoyed that. It's kind of a bummer that there wasn't really and ending, just another beginning. But interested to see where this goes. I'm extremely glad that this didn't end it a standard Marvel CGI-fest battle ending.
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I'm not sure how I felt about it. I know it's not the first show to end on a cliffhanger, but this just felt a bit.....emotionally empty? There was no closure to anything. I loved the acting and the dude playing Immortus did a really fun job and I'm looking forward to seeing different versions of him in Ant-Man. That said, it was mostly an info-dump and tease for other things. We didn't get any closure for Loki, for Sylvie, or Mobius, or anyone really. We got a villain that had no emotional resonance and who wasn't even a villain and then it just kind of ends. I'm glad they didn't do a big fight scene, but I was I hoping for some character resolution, which I don't think we got. You could argue you got SOME for Sylvie, but I didn't feel it.
It had great moments, but overall I feel kind of let down by it.
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Just finished, and this was pretty much what I was expecting for the finale, a complete explosion of the timeline with endless opportunities for storytelling and zero closure. Jonathan Majors is such a badass actor, can't wait to see him going forward. Wonder where they'll squeeze in season 2? They got plenty of time to play with it since Antman 3 isn't till early 2023 when Kang is scheduled to be the big bad.
Fucking bummed Mobius didn't get to ride a jet ski though.
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I'd say that Marvel got everything it wanted - they got to keep Tom Hiddleston as Loki after killing the character off and they also had a way to officially introduce the Multiverse. That's really all the show is about.
I'm not sure I expected anything more from the show, especially given that it's only six episodes.
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I'm not sure how I felt about it. I know it's not the first show to end on a cliffhanger, but this just felt a bit.....emotionally empty? There was no closure to anything. I loved the acting and the dude playing Immortus did a really fun job and I'm looking forward to seeing different versions of him in Ant-Man. That said, it was mostly an info-dump and tease for other things. We didn't get any closure for Loki, for Sylvie, or Mobius, or anyone really. We got a villain that had no emotional resonance and who wasn't even a villain and then it just kind of ends. I'm glad they didn't do a big fight scene, but I was I hoping for some character resolution, which I don't think we got. You could argue you got SOME for Sylvie, but I didn't feel it.
It had great moments, but overall I feel kind of let down by it.
Get out of my head! The whole episode left me with the feeling that its entire purpose was to setup for 'what's next?' - in Dr. Strange 2, Loki S2, Spiderverse, and Ant-Man. In and of itself, it didn't really accomplish anything other than give a recap of 'how we got here' from (Kang) The Conqueror.
Also, where the hell did Renslayer go running off to? Did she do something to kick things past "The Threshold"?
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I'd say that Marvel got everything it wanted - they got to keep Tom Hiddleston as Loki after killing the character off and they also had a way to officially introduce the Multiverse. That's really all the show is about.
I'm not sure I expected anything more from the show, especially given that it's only six episodes.
I can’t say I agree with this. It feels pretty cynical to assume marvel only cared about pushing content and nothing more. They’ve always made it about character. Which is why I fee this ended on a disappointing note.
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I'd say that Marvel got everything it wanted - they got to keep Tom Hiddleston as Loki after killing the character off and they also had a way to officially introduce the Multiverse. That's really all the show is about.
I'm not sure I expected anything more from the show, especially given that it's only six episodes.
I can’t say I agree with this. It feels pretty cynical to assume marvel only cared about pushing content and nothing more. They’ve always made it about character. Which is why I fee this ended on a disappointing note.
And we did get some of that, with the one episode that had Loki & Sylvie sitting and talking. I think the show (and other Marvel films/shows) can also be boiled down into being avenues for specific content. "Ok, the films are headed to the multiverse, so what do we do to explain this?" That's not a bad thing, but just the reality of this huge universe that they are expanding.
So in Endgame, Loki steals the tesseract, opening the door, literally, for the multiverse to be fully explained in Loki, the series. It just lays groundwork the same way that the films do. Same goes for Guardians 1 - they knew they were doing the Thanos stuff, so they used that film to officially introduce the concept of infinity stones. It worked and the movie is huge (and one of my favorites of the MCU) and still gave us loveable characters.
It doesn't mean the show or film are devoid of character development, but I do think the end result is "we have to arrive at X, so how do we get there?" and the blanks are then filled in.
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I don’t think he was trying to say that they were only “pushing content”.
But they are telling a micro story that is designed to be part of a much larger story. The small story can (and should) be enjoyable on its own. But the bigger story sets the precedent.
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I mean, they got to a finish line, the supposed bad guy was killed. That's a finish. Twas good enough for me, and the following few minutes of blowing up the universe will leave me hungry for the next few months till Spiderman I'd imagine. I don't think Ten Rings has any ties to the multiverse, does the Eternals?
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I don’t think he was trying to say that they were only “pushing content”.
But they are telling a micro story that is designed to be part of a much larger story. The small story can (and should) be enjoyable on its own. But the bigger story sets the precedent.
Yes, that's more on point with what I was saying. Thanks!
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The problem is how much 'Marvel Universe' can or dare they tell in these series? They don't want to alienate to many people from turning up at the cinema because they are getting confused by plot points that are related to these shows (which a lot of people won't watch). It's hard enough keeping track of 24 films worth of building!!
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I don’t think he was trying to say that they were only “pushing content”.
But they are telling a micro story that is designed to be part of a much larger story. The small story can (and should) be enjoyable on its own. But the bigger story sets the precedent.
Yes, that's more on point with what I was saying. Thanks!
That's fair. I guess I interpreted it as saying all Marvel wants to do is build the next thing and the rest doesn't matter.
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Most reviews I've seen today seem to say the same thing - it was an anti-climactic finale that ended with a cliffhanger, but it absolutely changes the MCU in a huge way.
I think it's pretty cool that they used a Disney+ tv series to create a Big Bang and pave the way for the coming films that address the multiverse (Doctor Strange, Spider Man, Ant Man sequels).
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Most reviews I've seen today seem to say the same thing - it was an anti-climactic finale that ended with a cliffhanger, but it absolutely changes the MCU in a huge way.
I think it's pretty cool that they used a Disney+ tv series to create a Big Bang and pave the way for the coming films that address the multiverse (Doctor Strange, Spider Man, Ant Man sequels).
I think it’s cool they did that too. I just wish they also provided some character/story resolution. Beyond Sylvie killing a guy she had never heard of prior.
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Guys, this was only season 1. The story feels unfinished because it isn't finished yet!
I'm very excited to see where it goes next.
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Guys, this was only season 1. The story feels unfinished because it isn't finished yet!
I'm very excited to see where it goes next.
As am I, but I think your first point is a bit dismissive.
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Guys, this was only season 1. The story feels unfinished because it isn't finished yet!
I'm very excited to see where it goes next.
As am I, but I think your first point is a bit dismissive.
It wasn't intended as such, it was simply that a lot of the conversation was implying that this season was the whole story.
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Thoroughly enjoyed that. Loved the explanation of the multiverse and the TVA vs the multiverse as "stifling order or cataclysmic chaos".
Thought the journey for Loki was very interesting and left him very changed from where we previously knew him.
Totally excited for what what comes next. The MCU's take on the space/cosmic aspects has really worked for me thus far and this just blows it up crazily. Awesome. 😊
The problem is how much 'Marvel Universe' can or dare they tell in these series? They don't want to alienate to many people from turning up at the cinema because they are getting confused by plot points that are related to these shows (which a lot of people won't watch). It's hard enough keeping track of 24 films worth of building!!
Really interesting point. All I can think is that they've entertained so many people so far - that says to me that they have the skill to multi-layer it so there's something for everyone.
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Guys, this was only season 1. The story feels unfinished because it isn't finished yet!
I'm very excited to see where it goes next.
As am I, but I think your first point is a bit dismissive.
It wasn't intended as such, it was simply that a lot of the conversation was implying that this season was the whole story.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I wasn't implying that. I was saying that, even with a larger continuing overarching story, each season needs its own arc and I feel like this season didn't have one that provided any resolution.
In WandaVision, she confronts her trauma. Falcon completes his journey to become Captain America. But this? No idea. Just a bunch of stacked cliff hangers. I think they could have done a lot of the universe building while still providing a full emotional arc. But instead all we got was Sylvie killing someone she didn't know existed prior. I enjoyed watching the episode. Immortus was super fun to watch and I am 200% sold on the actor taking on that character in the future. It just felt empty and incomplete. Like someone taking away my food before I was done and serving the next course. I need to finish the first course before I start the second course.
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Guys, this was only season 1. The story feels unfinished because it isn't finished yet!
I'm very excited to see where it goes next.
As am I, but I think your first point is a bit dismissive.
It wasn't intended as such, it was simply that a lot of the conversation was implying that this season was the whole story.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I wasn't implying that. I was saying that, even with a larger continuing overarching story, each season needs its own arc and I feel like this season didn't have one that provided any resolution.
In WandaVision, she confronts her trauma. Falcon completes his journey to become Captain America. But this? No idea. Just a bunch of stacked cliff hangers. I think they could have done a lot of the universe building while still providing a full emotional arc. But instead all we got was Sylvie killing someone she didn't know existed prior. I enjoyed watching the episode. Immortus was super fun to watch and I am 200% sold on the actor taking on that character in the future. It just felt empty and incomplete. Like someone taking away my food before I was done and serving the next course. I need to finish the first course before I start the second course.
I kind of get what you're saying, yet I felt fulfilled. I was pretty much anticipating the cliffhanger in this one, and totally got it.
I think we all can agree that Major is going to crush it as Kang, his work in Lovecraft Country was top notch.
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Oh yea. I haven’t seen Lovecraft and wasn’t familiar with the dude but this episode totally sold me on him. It’ll be interesting seeing him play Kang instead of Immortus too.
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I was saying that, even with a larger continuing overarching story, each season needs its own arc and I feel like this season didn't have one that provided any resolution.
Do you mean a narrative arc, or that the character arcs need a resolution? I'm assuming you mean the latter, because the season had a very distinct plot arc (find out what the TVA really is and who is behind it, and stop them).
So assuming you mean the characters, there is an arc but no, they're not resolved. But I'm interested to know why you feel they need to be? Most of my very favourite TV shows very much do not resolve character arcs at the end of each season (e.g. Mr Robot, Battlestar Galactica). Both doing so and not doing so are equally valid ways to do TV story-telling, aren't they? Just curious as to whether this is an expectation you have for all shows, or whether it's because it's the MCU where we're mostly used to movies and limited series.
EDIT: Also just to be clear, I myself was feeling unsure about the ending initially, until the mid-credits confirmation of season 2 appeared at which point I felt very satisfied and excited.
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I do hear you. And I appreciate you coming at it from a place of curiosity and not just telling me I'm wrong.
For me, and apparently a number of the youtube people I generally watch, it lacked an emotional sense of resolution. Yes, the plot of "who built the TVA and can we kill them?" was largely resolved, but it wasn't resolved (for me) in a way that had emotional resonance. The characters are supposed to go through something over the course of a season, and while (assuming multiple seasons) they have much more to go through, there are mini arcs under their bigger arcs.
So, let's say look at their plot to resolve who is behind the TVA and how do we stop them. It has to matter to the character in a deeper way. For instance, if it ended up being a Loki that represented everything Loki really wanted (being the ultimate ruler and king living an empty existence) and Loki defeated him, that would have emotional resonance and demonstrated personal growth and change. But we ended up with Immortus. We, as fans, know who that is because we either read comics or we read the internet. So when we see Immortus, we're like "OH SNAP IT'S THAT GUY HOW COOL!" But Sylvie and Loki? They have no idea who he is. So they're just talking to some random dude as far as they're concerned. Sylvie killing some random dude has no emotional depth. Loki learning his lesson from some random dude has no meaning. So it feels empty and hallow from that perspective. So Sylvie's arc of finding freedom ends with her killing a stranger she'd never heard of and then we cut away and don't show anything about how that impacts her.
Then you have the side characters. Mobius's arc was that he was a blind TVA agent who never questioned things and just played his role and really fantasized about Jet Ski's for some reason. His arc was to gain independence and individualism and try to spread that to his fellow TVA slaves. The result? He has no idea about anything and he's just a brainwashed analyst or whatever again. No resolution, just a reset. Same with that hunter he was hanging with.
Renslayer? She was 100% devoted to the cause, even when it all came crashing down. Her resolution? Nothing. She steps through a portal and we have no idea what the hell happened. This alone is fine, since not every character needs resolution, but when it all adds up, it just feels meh.
I fully understand that other people might not and do not feel the same way. And I am cool with that. I loved the show in all, and I enjoyed many aspects of the finale, but I just couldn't connect with the ending at all and it left me feeling empty inside. In a way that WandaVision and FATWS (who also had flawed endings) did not make me feel.
Hopefully that made sense.
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it lacked an emotional sense of resolution.
Bingo. It was a fun ride, but overall I felt a bit empty at the end. We got some closure on some things, and a lot of not-closure on a lot of things.
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I don’t understand. Sylvie had been ripped from her existence as a child because of TVA “pruning”. That gave her character a much deeper emotional drive to destroy the TVA and WHOEVER was running it. It would not have mattered who it was. She didn’t know, but she didn’t care. Whoever it was, THEY were responsible for her being ripped away from her life as a child.
Loki had only just been immediately picked up after a brief detour from the Battle of NY. That’s why he was trying to reason out the bigger picture with much more logical clarity. All of his emotions were on her. But her lifelong quest was singularly bent on destroying whoever was responsible for the TVA and who cares about the consequences. That’s what finally put them at odds with each other in spite of the mutual attraction.
I’d say that’s a pretty full emotional arc.
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Yeah, Adami, you keep saying you hope others won't be dismissive of your opinion. But the problem is, your take on what happened is very dismissive of what actually happened. "All we got" was "Sylvie killed some stranger?" We got a TON more than that. We got TONS of character arc. And, yes, those arcs aren't resolved. But that's okay. In fact, with Sylvie, I think that's kinda the point. To me, it's a cool contrast to see how two supposed version of the same person turned out completely differently, with one version learning how to trust and how to care about something other than self, and the other, traveling along the same journey, failed to make that transformation. I think that's pretty rich storytelling.
Anyhow, I loved this. For me, it went from worst MCU show to possibly the best in one episode. Despite a MASSIVE cliffhanger, it also simultaneously put a bow on the entire season.
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Your opinion is totally valid.
As is mine.
I just didn't experience the finale the same way you did or get as much out of it as you did, much like you didn't experience the initial episodes the way I did, and so forth. It's all good.
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What I am having a hard time wrapping my mind around is how/why Loki ended up in a "different" TVA at the end. If the TVA is outside of time, how is that possible?
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What I am having a hard time wrapping my mind around is how/why Loki ended up in a "different" TVA at the end. If the TVA is outside of time, how is that possible?
I had the same question. My only guess would be that, at some point after the multiverse split, a bad Kang went to the TVA and reset it or something.
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I don't have the comic knowledge that most of you have to draw off of....with any of the MCU so I just take these shows as they're presented. For me, LOKI was the 'weakest' of the three Disney+ MCU shows they've released yet.
I get there are implications the show introduced that will most likely resonate through future movies/shows and that there is still more story to tell.....but for me to 'buy in' to all of that I needed to be sold by the characters and I wasn't. Huddleston's Loki was neutered in a fashion to where he wasn't all that interested or compelling and all the other characters didn't reel me in at all. No charisma or 'draw' to really give a crap about what 'journey' they were on or whatever. Had zero connection to Sylvie or her mission.....just a cardboard cutout in my eyes with nothing to draw me in.
Outside of learning a few things that will play out as the larger story unfolds this was just a 'ho hum' kind of series for me.
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The Critical Drinker says pretty much how I feel about Loki:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zNCNWZ_w0A
Whenever there's things like the TVA or Q that can do anything... ANYTHING, I always think "then why the eff does any of this even matter". I knew there'd be trouble when there were Infinity Stones in the desk drawer. So everything we went through with Thanos ultimately means nothing so why should we care? Why should we get invested into the story?
At least Q was more of a guide than anything while the TVA (or at least the guy at the end) already knows everything that's going to happen so what's the point? I guess since they "beat" him now maybe things *will* and *do* matter but I'm not hopeful.
It also triggers me way more than it should that Loki just wore the same shirt and tie the entire time.
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The Critical Drinker says pretty much how I feel about Loki:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zNCNWZ_w0A (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zNCNWZ_w0A)
Whenever there's things like the TVA or Q that can do anything... ANYTHING, I always think "then why the eff does any of this even matter". I knew there'd be trouble when there were Infinity Stones in the desk drawer. So everything we went through with Thanos ultimately means nothing so why should we care? Why should we get invested into the story?
I just can't wrap my head around this kind of thinking. Everyone dies at the end of Hamlet, so why should we care about them? Everyone we know eventually dies, most without making much of an impact on the world, so why should we get invested in their stories? To me it's about the characters; what happens to them and how do they respond? Their feelings and hopes, their growth as people. It's about the journey, not the destination.
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The Critical Drinker says pretty much how I feel about Loki:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zNCNWZ_w0A (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zNCNWZ_w0A)
Whenever there's things like the TVA or Q that can do anything... ANYTHING, I always think "then why the eff does any of this even matter". I knew there'd be trouble when there were Infinity Stones in the desk drawer. So everything we went through with Thanos ultimately means nothing so why should we care? Why should we get invested into the story?
I just can't wrap my head around this kind of thinking. Everyone dies at the end of Hamlet, so why should we care about them? Everyone we know eventually dies, most without making much of an impact on the world, so why should we get invested in their stories? To me it's about the characters; what happens to them and how do they respond? Their feelings and hopes, their growth as people. It's about the journey, not the destination.
What ZB said…
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Exactly... it's kinda like saying the events of Infinity War and Endgame don't matter cuz Thanos and army were dusted.
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To me it's about the characters; what happens to them and how do they respond? Their feelings and hopes, their growth as people. It's about the journey, not the destination.
I 100% agree with this statement.....where I think I'm differing from most of you is that....for me....this show/series failed to engage me enough to have me invest in the characters and missed on all the points of your statement. Everyone of them were hollow. I don't know if it was a casting deal or just general boredom with the storyline but at no point was there any connection to any of those characters for me. The 'growth' or their individual 'journeys' felt artificial to me. Sure, you can sit here and point to instances of what the character arcs looked like and entailed but there was zero emotion behind it (for me) and it just seemed like Marvel was checking off boxes and making points to set up the bigger picture. Which is fine I guess if that's what the point was....but outside of that the characters were a cut and paste snoozefest (to me)
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I think I share similar a sentiment but would rate them a little higher overall. I did enjoy watching all three shows and I loved that the MCU got expanded, there is just 'something' missing about it all. The individual pieces and acting and story beats and all of that are pretty good but somehow overall they feel a bit let down. I think I liked Loki the best among them all. I have to rewatch them all as a binged series and see how I feel. Maybe that will change my mind a bit.
While not a direct comparison, when I think of The Mandalorian, I really enjoyed both seasons of that show, each episode as well as collectively. I don't feel the same way about the MCU shows overall to that level.
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Interesting nugget I totally missed: Back when Sylvia cuts the head off the timekeeper bot, you can faintly hear Kang's voice say "see you soon."
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I start rolling my eyes anyone they have Loki acting like some Terran schmoe you might meet in a bar. They have seriously neutered him since his origin which doesn’t make for an enjoyable watch for me.
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Well, I loved it.
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Interesting nugget I totally missed: Back when Sylvia cuts the head off the timekeeper bot, you can faintly hear Kang's voice say "see you soon."
FYI: Jonathan Majors voiced the 3 Timekeepers in that ep.
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Finally watched the finale. I didn't love the show, but I liked it and am excited to see the impact to the rest of the MCU. I also had a problem with the complete 180 of Loki's character. I know he ended up "good" in the movies but that took multiple movies for him to get to that point. I think they rushed that development a bit to the point that it didn't feel "real". They could have gotten him there by the last episode in a better way.
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The third episode of Marvel Studios ASSEMBLED has been uploaded today, an hour-long documentary on the making of Loki! Some very cool insights from Tom Hiddleston, great bits of interviews from much of the cast and crew behind the production of the series, and just a cool look back at the show as a whole. If you liked the show, definitely give it a watch!
-Marc.
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:caffeine:
I know what jingle.son and I are doing after dinner.
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If anyone else hadn't quite got their heads around the fact that the Loki variants could be so different despite there supposedly only being one sacred timeline, Screen Crush have done quite a good explainer following a conversation with the show's head writer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBehFiXwVY8
Essentially, the sacred timeline isn't only a single timeline/universe, but more of a baseline of what should happen to ensure He Who Remains is the only version of Kang/Immortus/whatever. So there could already be a multiverse of many different timelines (including ones where Loki is an alligator!) and they were still fine and "sacred" as long as they still have that outcome (or I guess at least don't interfere with it).
Actually makes a lot of sense and fits with a number of cues within the show (both verbal and visual) so some people seem to have picked up on this already, but I'll admit I hadn't got my head around it and was just enjoying the ride.
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From the YT comments:
I got a theory from this. The nexus event on Lamentis wasn't about Loki and Sylvie touching or feeling for each other. It was about their death. Because if they die then they never are and never will be in the Castle and that's a nexus event. They are supposed to be there. And as they are about to die so fast that's why the branch is happening so fast.
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That's interesting
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I don't have the comic knowledge that most of you have to draw off of....with any of the MCU so I just take these shows as they're presented. For me, LOKI was the 'weakest' of the three Disney+ MCU shows they've released yet.
I get there are implications the show introduced that will most likely resonate through future movies/shows and that there is still more story to tell.....but for me to 'buy in' to all of that I needed to be sold by the characters and I wasn't. Huddleston's Loki was neutered in a fashion to where he wasn't all that interested or compelling and all the other characters didn't reel me in at all. No charisma or 'draw' to really give a crap about what 'journey' they were on or whatever. Had zero connection to Sylvie or her mission.....just a cardboard cutout in my eyes with nothing to draw me in.
Outside of learning a few things that will play out as the larger story unfolds this was just a 'ho hum' kind of series for me.
My take too. The 3 series started at a high level and went progressively downhill. Hearing good things about “What if?” Though.
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I'm hoping to start Loki with my girlfriend maybe even today. She's never seen it and only knows the MCU as far as the movies go. She doesn't read all the stuff online or know the comics. So if I tell her Kang is in it (which I won't) it will mean nothing to her. So I'm very curious how his eventual arrival hits her and how she'll see the show as a whole. She really dug WandaVision and most of Falcon/Winter Soldier. It's really fun watching this stuff with someone who doesn't know what's going to happen. I don't usually have that luxury, knowing the comics and reading more than I should. So it's cool to see her genuine reactions.
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Finally started watching it.
Cool first episode, guess I'm in mode "Eh, it's Tom Hiddleston playing Loki again, what could be wrong with it? I'm fine with whatever will happen".
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Saw all episodes but the last, tonight I'm gonna finish.
This was great! More Loki from Tom Hiddleston is always a good thing, and Owen Wilson was great as Mobious. Some nice twists and turns there, alligator included :lol
Side note, hoping to not tread on hot waters best meant for the P/R forum, but.... one of the very few things I heard about the series were complaints about Loki being a transgender or whatever, I expected him to actually change form into a woman or something, but.... is that just it? there are many variants from different timelines and one of them is a woman? this is what pissed people off? geez.
Anyway, looking forward to the end as I said, I'm more than confident it will end with a blast :metal
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Glad you are enjoying the series, I haven't seen What If? Yet but Loki is my favorite out of the first 3 series.
Also, I didn't hear anybody complaining about woman Loki, but people did talk about him being bisexual since it was mentioned, I think in the 3rd episode when they were on the train.
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Glad you are enjoying the series, I haven't seen What If? Yet but Loki is my favorite out of the first 3 series.
Also, I didn't hear anybody complaining about woman Loki, but people did talk about him being bisexual since it was mentioned, I think in the 3rd episode when they were on the train.
And Loki being bi isn't even that wild of an idea given he is not straight at all in the comics AND the Nprse mythology, especially given that he births an 8-legger horse (which we actually see Odin ride in the first Thornfilm!), so I'm not sure why folks were surprised or upset.
Also, I believe you might be referring to the fact that Loki's bio at the TVA lists him as "genderfluid", not transgender (and yes, there is a difference). That got a lot of fans talking on Twitter when it was first seen early on in the series.
-Marc.
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Ah ok, makes sense, so that's what tickled some people.
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Finished... knowing there was a season 2 and the action was still going on, I should have braced myself for a cliffhanger, but I kinda hoped the story would have come to a conclusion ;D
Anyway, great ending episode, looking forward for the story to continue!
Adding what is to me the best quote of the series:
Will someone please explain to me what the hell is going on?! Look, it’s been a very, very, very trying past few days. Months? I don’t even know how long it’s been since New York. All I know is, I got pruned and I woke up here, and now I’m surrounded by Variants of myself, plus an alligator, which I’m heartbroken to report I didn’t even find all that strange.
:lol
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Season 2 was brought up at D23 and they announced, on stage, that Ke Huy Quan (Goonies, Temple Of Doom, Everything Everywhere All At Once) will be joining the cast!
-Marc.
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Finished it last night. I really enjoyed it! My wife especially liked it as she's a big Doctor Who fan, and thought the series felt a lot like that.
I've been reading through the thread, and have a few thoughts...
I'm hoping to start Loki with my girlfriend maybe even today. She's never seen it and only knows the MCU as far as the movies go. She doesn't read all the stuff online or know the comics. So if I tell her Kang is in it (which I won't) it will mean nothing to her. So I'm very curious how his eventual arrival hits her and how she'll see the show as a whole. She really dug WandaVision and most of Falcon/Winter Soldier. It's really fun watching this stuff with someone who doesn't know what's going to happen. I don't usually have that luxury, knowing the comics and reading more than I should. So it's cool to see her genuine reactions.
I'd say the Kang reveal was a bit disappointing for me. Neither my wife and I are big comic book readers, so we didn't know who he was, he was "just some guy" at the end of it all, sitting atop the hierarchy. And now he's, apparently, gone? Except for the many, many timelines where he's not gone.
In other takes, Episode 5 was probably the best, with all those Loki's. Classic Loki especially rocked.
I'll definitely watch Season 2 when it comes out, but expect it to be more of a "side story" going forward, focusing more on whatever branch of the timeline our Loki gets sent too which, I'm guessing, would be pretty separate from the one that the Avengers are in, though, who knows.
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Now that Secret Invasion had come and gone, let's look forward to what will hopefully be the best Disney+ MCU show of the year, Loki Season 2.
I'm not exactly too sure what to expect with the MCU's first second season, but I loved the first one so much, I'm sure this second will do just as well. I'm also very excited to see what Ke Huy Quan will bring to the show!
-Marc.
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Now that Secret Invasion had come and gone, let's look forward to what will hopefully be the best Disney+ MCU show of the year, Loki Season 2.
I'm not exactly too sure what to expect with the MCU's first second season, but I loved the first one so much, I'm sure this second will do just as well. I'm also very excited to see what Ke Huy Quan will bring to the show!
-Marc.
Oh shit, I didn't know he was in it, fucking sweet!!
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(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/364175701_717254377078734_6356231964522211652_n.jpg?_nc_cat=109&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=HbwDzxyxwpIAX-F-6uD&_nc_ht=scontent-iad3-1.xx&oh=00_AfDRbGe7ax9YpzjR2gqFOzt79voKnsr_JybGGwr66h4tSw&oe=64C98E1A)
T-minus 100,000 minutes until Loki Season 2 ⏳
From the Loki Facebook page!
-Marc.
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https://youtu.be/dug56u8NN7g
New trailer has dropped! This looks VERY exciting!
-Marc.
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https://youtu.be/dug56u8NN7g
New trailer has dropped! This looks VERY exciting!
-Marc.
Bitchin!
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Looks pretty groovy. I really liked Season 1, right up until that last episode with Mr. Exposition Dump taking a huge dump all over everything. So after that, I'm keeping expectations in check. But it looks like Waymond adds a fun little role, and Mo and Lo are back together, so it could be cool.
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Looks pretty groovy. I really liked Season 1, right up until that last episode with Mr. Exposition Dump taking a huge dump all over everything. So after that, I'm keeping expectations in check. But it looks like Waymond adds a fun little role, and Mo and Lo are back together, so it could be cool.
I'm really intrigued by Ke Huy Quan's OB, and I can't wait to see how much he'll be in the show. Hopefully more than just a couple of scenes or just one episode. Maybe for you, Orbert, this season's variant of Kang, Victor Timely, will be a bit more exciting. Personally, I liked how lowkey the final episode of season one was. There was no bloated CGI battle, no sky beams, no hokey dialog - just world building, and something that legitimately impacts the whole MCU with lasting repercussions that we've seen (unlike some other MCU D+ show endings).
-Marc.
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It was
Loki lowkey and different, which in that way was good. And it was interesting enough, but it felt like instead of getting some kind of conclusion, we got a very long introduction to the next big thing, whatever that is, and then him literally telling them that it wasn't the conclusion of anything, but instead an introduction to the next big thing. So in that way it was disappointing.
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That looks amazing.. I dearly hope they don't fuck this up.
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Looks good, looking forward to it :corn
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New teaser:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rg8pCyrZYaA
:metal
I must say that I sooooo hyped about this show.
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Hard to imagine it topping Secret War, but should be good either way.
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Phew! For a second there, I was thinking Secret Invasion and was wondering.
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Hard to imagine it topping Secret War, but should be good either way.
You mean Secret Invasion? Avengers: Secret Wars isn't out yet, and that's a film, not a series.
Either way, with all the delays in MCU content, Loki Season 2 might be the best Disney+ MCU content this year. I'm definitely more hyped for this than I was for Secret Invasion.
-Marc.
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Dunno how I typed what I did. Must have had a case of the Schmeglands. Meant Secret Invasion.
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Hard to imagine it topping Secret War, but should be good either way.
Personally thought Secret Invasion was the worst MCU film or series so far (yup even worse than Eternals).
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:corn
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I've avoided watching any reviews online as some folks have been able to review episodes 1-4 already.
I've been waiting for this for over two years and now the time is here!
-Marc.
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Thought first episode was good :tup
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Thought first episode was good :tup
Agreed! Feels like they didn't miss a step from season one. I rewatched the last two episodes of season one before the premiere of season two and it really felt continuous and seamless.
I really love OB and I hope he gets more to do as the season goes on!
-Marc.
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I’ve got my stepson staying with us for a few days, and I was just about to start on season 2 when I found out he hadn’t seen season 1 yet. So we’re taking a couple of days to binge watch season one, and we’re hoping to get to season 2 over the weekend.
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Wow, episode 1 was really good!
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Not sure when we will be able to discuss freely, but the one thing I'll say is that A+ for Tom's acting. The dude is phenomenal.
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OH SHIT TOTALLY FORGOT ABOUT THIS!!!!
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Very solid start... Also, in case nobody saw it, there was a post credit scene
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Very solid start... Also, in case nobody saw it, there was a post credit scene
I though the post credit was kind of sad honestly, given what we know.
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Very solid start... Also, in case nobody saw it, there was a post credit scene
Shyte! jingle.daughter and I didn't stick around. I guess I'll have to fast-forward to it. There haven't been too many PC scenes in the TV shows, so we shut it down rather promptly.
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Nice start to the season
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//LOKI SPOILERS
Did anyone notice that the town Sylvie landed in (Broxton, Oklahoma) was the location where Thor built New Asgard in the comics?
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//LOKI SPOILERS
Did anyone notice that the town Sylvie landed in (Broxton, Oklahoma) was the location where Thor built New Asgard in the comics?
I thought new Asgard was near a body of water?
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//LOKI SPOILERS
Did anyone notice that the town Sylvie landed in (Broxton, Oklahoma) was the location where Thor built New Asgard in the comics?
I thought new Asgard was near a body of water?
In the movies, it is. But in the comics it was in Oklahoma.
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Not sure when we will be able to discuss freely, but the one thing I'll say is that A+ for Tom's acting. The dude is phenomenal.
It's out, so discuss away. No point in waiting until nobody is interested in discussing anymore.
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I gotta say, seeing how freaked out Loki was about what's coming with Kang, it really got me worried, and that's something Ant-Man didn't quite pull off. Kang felt more like a side character there, not a big scary threat.
I think it would've been awesome if they made Modok the villain in Ant-Man and just hinted at Kang towards the end, building him up as the big bad, kind of like what they did with Thanos, you know, slowly revealing how menacing he is.
But no, they gave us this goofy Modok, and Kang the Conqueror got taken down by giant ants. Seriously, come on.
For me this first episode is like this:
GOOD
The story just flowed really nicely, you know?
They had some cool sounds and visual effects that kept us hooked.
It was awesome to see those characters again, like a breath of fresh air.
Man, the story was so gripping, it had us all on the edge of our seats.
BAD
O.B was pretty funny, but he just talked a lot, which was kinda meh for me.
Some of the acting was a bit awkward at times, but nothing too crazy.
Rating: 9/10
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Not sure when we will be able to discuss freely, but the one thing I'll say is that A+ for Tom's acting. The dude is phenomenal.
It's out, so discuss away. No point in waiting until nobody is interested in discussing anymore.
Seems like not many want to anyways :lol
I liked the episode a lot, but I do worry about the MCU undoing, or messing up, everything they have set up regarding time travel.
BAD
O.B was pretty funny, but he just talked a lot, which was kinda meh for me.
No sure we should expect anything else from the character. I just hope they utilize him more in future episodes.
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Also, in case nobody saw it, there was a post credit scene
Thank you! I was wondering why people were talking about Sylvie working at McDonald's when we only saw her for like two seconds. It might have been in a McDonald's but I didn't clock that. And she wasn't working there; she was a customer. Anyway, we had to go back and watch the scene, which at least explained the McDonald's references.
I though the post credit was kind of sad honestly, given what we know.
What do we know? (No spoilers!) That she ends up working in a McDonald's in Oklahoma? That would be sad.
Anyway, I thought it was fun. I like OB. I think my favorite part was when Loki was with OB in the past, giving him "memories" of stuff that they'd need in the future (which is really our "present", I think). It reminded me of Bill and Ted playing "the time game" with De Nomolos.
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I though the post credit was kind of sad honestly, given what we know.
What do we know? (No spoilers!) That she ends up working in a McDonald's in Oklahoma? That would be sad.
Anyway, I thought it was fun. I like OB. I think my favorite part was when Loki was with OB in the past, giving him "memories" of stuff that they'd need in the future (which is really our "present", I think). It reminded me of Bill and Ted playing "the time game" with De Nomolos.
What we know about Sylvie. She was taken from Asgard as a kid, and has been hiding in apocalyptic worlds even since. She has never experienced "normal" so her looking around the McDonald's room and saying "I want to try everything" is not about the menu, but just life in general, because this is the first time she isn't running.
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Ah, I get it. Kinda sad, but also hopeful. She gets to do a bunch of stuff for the first time. I thought maybe something horrible happens to her in a McDonald's.
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There are stills all over Facebook promoting the show that show her behind the counter in an employee’s outfit.
I don’t really consider that a spoiler because if it’s part of the public promotional material of the show, it should be fair game.
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This show is probably the most enjoyable thing for me that Marvel has done (along with maybe Agents of Shield). I couldn’t remember a ton from the first season, but it doesn’t really matter. Just the banter between Loki and the dude from all the Wes Anderson movies makes it fun.
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There are stills all over Facebook promoting the show that show her behind the counter in an employee’s outfit.
I don’t really consider that a spoiler because if it’s part of the public promotional material of the show, it should be fair game.
I don't consider it spoiler either, I just don't watch promos and stuff if I can help it. Some ad comes on, and I mentally tune it out as a hundred images flash by lasting 0.5 seconds each, pausing once in a while for a 2-second sound bite of something clever or funny or blowing up. At the end, it says what the promo is for and sometimes when it will be available, and that's all I care about. So if someone tells me that there's a still or a clip of Sylvie behind the counter at a McDonald's, that's news to me unless that particular image happened to stick with me.
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I thought episode 1 was great. Hard to comment too much because we aren't really sure yet where things are going, what things are significant, and why, since MCU shows typically have a lot of twists and turns. But it answered a lot of questions left dangling at the end of S.1. (although not all of them). O.B. is a great character. I'm pretty sure he won't disappear. That would be weird after we got so much time and development with him in this initial episode. But I'm interested to see whether he will play a key role or just be a minor character. It sure looks like we're headed to a confrontation with Kang (whether it is some version of He Who Remains or a different variant, or more than one). But we'll see. It seems that there will be something related to the Victor Timely variant, but (1) that could end up being just a minor plot point in the grand scheme of things, (2) Victor Timely could be the same variant as He Who Remains, just younger, or (3) something else I haven't imagined.
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I thought episode 1 was great. Hard to comment too much because we aren't really sure yet where things are going, what things are significant, and why, since MCU shows typically have a lot of twists and turns. But it answered a lot of questions left dangling at the end of S.1. (although not all of them). O.B. is a great character. I'm pretty sure he won't disappear. That would be weird after we got so much time and development with him in this initial episode. But I'm interested to see whether he will play a key role or just be a minor character. It sure looks like we're headed to a confrontation with Kang (whether it is some version of He Who Remains or a different variant, or more than one). But we'll see. It seems that there will be something related to the Victor Timely variant, but (1) that could end up being just a minor plot point in the grand scheme of things, (2) Victor Timely could be the same variant as He Who Remains, just younger, or (3) something else I haven't imagined.
It's hard to say at this point because, while comics fans can look and point to various comic storylines and plots from the past, the MCU has changed how it views Kang and his alter egos. As far as I'm aware, in the comics, Kang's other identities as Rama-Tut, Scarlet Centurion, and Immortus, are just the main Kang but at different points in his lifetime. In the MCU, it seems like they're treating them as variants of Kang, in addition to He Who Remains. So it'll be interesting to see how they take all of that and adapt it in this season of Loki. Whatever they end up doing, I just hope it makes sense.
-Marc.
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Yeah, all of that. I didn't realize what you said about Rama-Tut, et al., being the same Kang, but just at different points in time, rather than being variants. Is that "main Kang" the one known as "Kang Prime?"
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I have a weird feeling that Victor Timely won't be the "villain" of the show.
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Yeah, all of that. I didn't realize what you said about Rama-Tut, et al., being the same Kang, but just at different points in time, rather than being variants. Is that "main Kang" the one known as "Kang Prime?"
In the comics? Yeah, but in the MCU, it seems like things have been different. They might still be Kang at different points in time, just from variant branch realities or separate timelines altogether. I doubt we'll ever know for sure, but if we do, we'll either find out here in Loki S2 or Avengers: Kang Dynasty (whenever that actually comes out).
I have a weird feeling that Victor Timely won't be the "villain" of the show.
That's a good call, and quite possible.
-Marc.
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Who is Kang? As in Kang and Kodos?
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Q4-1QRwq1Dw/maxresdefault.jpg)
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Some guy who lost a boxing match, and decided to conquer the universe out of anger.
(https://media.giphy.com/media/hqI3PvvbMH7rp1e6A3/giphy.gif)
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I had heard this second episode wasn't as thrilling or exciting as the first, and while that might be true over-all, I thought there was a lot to enjoy here, especially Loki's moments interrogating their captive.
We've got some more mysteries to solve and problems to fix and it's shaping up to be a chase through time next episode!
-Marc.
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I could go for some pie.
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I liked the second episode. Reminded me of a procedural show, like Law and Order or something.
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I could go for some pie.
Same. Though that key lime pie filling in the show looked more like jello than what I typically expect a key lime pie to be.
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And man do they eat pie slowly. That would've lasted about 44 seconds in front of me.
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I could go for some pie.
Same. Though that key lime pie filling in the show looked more like jello than what I typically expect a key lime pie to be.
Yeah, it was REALLY green.
Would still eat
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Yeah, it was REALLY green.
Would still eat
That's what she ... uh, on second thought, never mind.
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About 5 minutes in I asked my wife to make sure we hadn’t skipped an episode. Seems like there were some plot elements skipped over between this and the first episode. I’m 98% sure the Brad guy was not in any prior episodes, right? Does Loki want to prune the other branches or not? I thought that he did in order to prevent the world being destroyed, but then he stopped them from pruning them all.
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About 5 minutes in I asked my wife to make sure we hadn’t skipped an episode. Seems like there were some plot elements skipped over between this and the first episode. I’m 98% sure the Brad guy was not in any prior episodes, right? Does Loki want to prune the other branches or not? I thought that he did in order to prevent the world being destroyed, but then he stopped them from pruning them all.
Yeah…..it’s not the most ‘flow’ centric show. It’s a show to watch for now that’s good enough but it’s far from top tier content.
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Brad is X-5. Definitely in both episodes. Sidekick to the lady that blew up all the timelines.
(https://preview.redd.it/loki-season-2-hunter-x-5-variant-v0-4ia92fl9cosb1.png?width=1410&format=png&auto=webp&s=e232fddf1d20c4d620b550943c3c829c40717fc5)
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Brad is X-5. Definitely in both episodes. Sidekick to the lady that blew up all the timelines.
(https://preview.redd.it/loki-season-2-hunter-x-5-variant-v0-4ia92fl9cosb1.png?width=1410&format=png&auto=webp&s=e232fddf1d20c4d620b550943c3c829c40717fc5)
Huh. Would never have recognized that as the same guy. Seeing them side by side they don’t really look alike. The haircut is different, facial hair is different. Clothes are different. Total Clark Kent/Superman thing going.
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Brad is X-5. Definitely in both episodes. Sidekick to the lady that blew up all the timelines.
(https://preview.redd.it/loki-season-2-hunter-x-5-variant-v0-4ia92fl9cosb1.png?width=1410&format=png&auto=webp&s=e232fddf1d20c4d620b550943c3c829c40717fc5)
Huh. Would never have recognized that as the same guy. Seeing them side by side they don’t really look alike. The haircut is different, facial hair is different. Clothes are different. Total Clark Kent/Superman thing going.
Mobius refers to him as both X-5 and Brad during the episode as well. His hair length seems to imply that after abandoning his post, he spent quite some time in the Sacred Timeline as Brad and becoming (or assuming the life of) a movie star. It's very Cypher, a la The Matrix.
-Marc.
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It definitely took me a few minutes to figure out they were the same guy. But I figured it out about halfway through the episode.
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Brad is X-5. Definitely in both episodes. Sidekick to the lady that blew up all the timelines.
(https://preview.redd.it/loki-season-2-hunter-x-5-variant-v0-4ia92fl9cosb1.png?width=1410&format=png&auto=webp&s=e232fddf1d20c4d620b550943c3c829c40717fc5)
Huh. Would never have recognized that as the same guy. Seeing them side by side they don’t really look alike. The haircut is different, facial hair is different. Clothes are different. Total Clark Kent/Superman thing going.
Mobius refers to him as both X-5 and Brad during the episode as well. His hair length seems to imply that after abandoning his post, he spent quite some time in the Sacred Timeline as Brad and becoming (or assuming the life of) a movie star. It's very Cypher, a la The Matrix.
-Marc.
But… did they ever refer to him as X-5 in a previous episode? He was always just a generic background character. Certainly not a name I would have remembered.
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Yes, he was constantly referred to as X5 in the first episode. And he frequently stood in that stupid pose with his hands hanging on his collar displaying the "X" and "5" on his gloves so you couldn't forget, just like in that picture.
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Yes, he was constantly referred to as X5 in the first episode. And he frequently stood in that stupid pose with his hands hanging on his collar displaying the "X" and "5" on his gloves so you couldn't forget, just like in that picture.
They should have made his real life in the Sacred Timeline to be an NFL Quarterback.
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:lol
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Yes, he was constantly referred to as X5 in the first episode. And he frequently stood in that stupid pose with his hands hanging on his collar displaying the "X" and "5" on his gloves so you couldn't forget, just like in that picture.
Huh. Mostly X-5 isn’t really a name so I guess it never connected that he was anyone of significance. Heck I have a hard time remembering Mobius, who I keep wanting to call Morpheus.
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They did say it a bunch of times, but to be fair, you are right and I'm not sure I would have remembered it either if not for also hearing it repeated a bunch more times in some "things you might have missed in this episode!" videos on YouTube. And that subplot with him pursuing a life in the past, although it makes sense when you think about the things that are dropped in episode 1, did seem a bit out of nowhere while watching episode 2 in real time. It kind of felt like one of those situations where maybe there was something else in the original script that would have made it flow better that maybe got cut in final edits without them realizing it made the story a bit choppy and hard to follow.
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The shift from X-5 being a supporting guy to the main focus of the episode, hitting the ground running at that, threw myself and Mrs. Orbert off, too. So you're not alone there. They were suddenly chasing down this Brad Wolfe guy, and Mobius kept calling him X-5, which sounded familiar, but honestly they've been throwing around a lot of names and ideas very quickly and don't always give the viewer half a second to put things together before jumping on to the next thing. Renslayer got named-dropped again and I went "Okay, she was..." and then something else happened. Casey and OB and Dox and Sylvie and B-15 and X-5 and Brad Wolfe and Miss Minutes is working with Renslayer and the TVA has somehow gone from the folks officially and thoughtlessly pruning timelines (and people) to the folks who now go "Those are people!" Meanwhile Sylvie is at the McDonald's in the 80's and wants to stay there, even though that timeline is going to be pruned. Sylvie just says the TVA is a bunch of shit and goes back there anyway (to die?) And the Temporal Loom (?) is overloaded, or was, because of all the splits and variants, but it's okay now (?) because those other "bad" TVA agents pruned a bunch of them, before the "good" TVA agents blew them up (?)
By the end of the episode, I just turned to Mrs. Orbert and said "I officially have no idea what the fuck is going on anymore."
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The shift from X-5 being a supporting guy to the main focus of the episode, hitting the ground running at that, threw myself and Mrs. Orbert off, too. So you're not alone there. They were suddenly chasing down this Brad Wolfe guy, and Mobius kept calling him X-5, which sounded familiar, but honestly they've been throwing around a lot of names and ideas very quickly and don't always give the viewer half a second to put things together before jumping on to the next thing. Renslayer got named-dropped again and I went "Okay, she was..." and then something else happened. Casey and OB and Dox and Sylvie and B-15 and X-5 and Brad Wolfe and Miss Minutes is working with Renslayer and the TVA has somehow gone from the folks officially and thoughtlessly pruning timelines (and people) to the folks who now go "Those are people!" Meanwhile Sylvie is at the McDonald's in the 80's and wants to stay there, even though that timeline is going to be pruned. Sylvie just says the TVA is a bunch of shit and goes back there anyway (to die?) And the Temporal Loom (?) is overloaded, or was, because of all the splits and variants, but it's okay now (?) because those other "bad" TVA agents pruned a bunch of them, before the "good" TVA agents blew them up (?)
By the end of the episode, I just turned to Mrs. Orbert and said "I officially have no idea what the fuck is going on anymore."
Ha! This sums it up better than I could.
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Yes, the second episode was really confusing and definitely felt like I had missed a whole episode. The start was so jarring. It really wasn't made clear why X-5 was so important. They went back in time to find Sylvie, Loki said she wasn't there but him and Mobius then continued on in that timeline to find and chase Brad until they caught him like that was the purpose in the first place. Just really strange story telling. They could have just had a line of dialogue that said something like 'we are looking for Sylvie, we don't know where she is but X-5 was hunting her and he has gone rogue and is now hiding in his real timeline and may know where she is. So let's go and ask him etc..."
As for everything else going on, your guess is as good as mine. I have even watched recaps on youtube and still don't get it. I enjoy the show though and the first episode was really great.
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The show is still quite entertaining. The dialogue is often very clever, and overall it's a lot of fun. I just have to accept the fact that I'm not really sure WTF is going a lot of the time. Still a lot of fun to watch, though.
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The show is still quite entertaining. The dialogue is often very clever, and overall it's a lot of fun. I just have to accept the fact that I'm not really sure WTF is going a lot of the time. Still a lot of fun to watch, though.
Yep agree. I’m still in on the show. Lots of great stuff but I think ultimately the time travel alternate realities variants time lines etc story angles are just too complicated for the everyday fan (like me). I kind of feel if Marvel continues down this road it is just going to continue to lose viewers.
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The show is still quite entertaining. The dialogue is often very clever, and overall it's a lot of fun. I just have to accept the fact that I'm not really sure WTF is going a lot of the time. Still a lot of fun to watch, though.
Yep agree. I’m still in on the show. Lots of great stuff but I think ultimately the time travel alternate realities variants time lines etc story angles are just too complicated for the everyday fan (like me). I kind of feel if Marvel continues down this road it is just going to continue to lose viewers.
Well, at least until the end of phase 6, there is a lot more of this. Personally, I love the concept and I am enjoying it very much, even if the execution is not always great.
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My family found the episode a little hard to understand, but we just paused it and talked through it, and found the thread.
It's a time travel show (among other things), so we expected some of this.
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They are moving fast, but most, if not of this stuff is explained. This is definitely not a show to watch while surfing on your phone or whatever, because it moves really fast.
. . . and the TVA has somehow gone from the folks officially and thoughtlessly pruning timelines (and people) to the folks who now go "Those are people!"
"Somehow" is that they learned that they are were not created by the Time Keepers, but area actually all variants that had had their lives taken away. So, now they have empathy for all the other variants that they were previously pruning.
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I’m with Zircon. It’s like it’s making me actually pay attention…and I REALLY LIKE THAT. I’ve gotten into some horrible TV viewing habits lately, and I almost wish I could just throw away my phone for a week. Unfortunately I don’t think I can do it completely. My work, banking, checking with my wife to see if she needs anything from the store on my way home…etc etc. But I do need to start some sort of self discipline. I’m trying very hard to force myself to not use my phone while watching TV. And I do find the the show engages me more when I do that.
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I've watched enough Doctor Who under the Moffat era to follow this ;D enjoyed both episodes so far.
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I've watched enough Doctor Who under the Moffat era to follow this ;D
:biggrin:
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I've watched enough Doctor Who under the Moffat era to follow this ;D enjoyed both episodes so far.
;D
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I don't actually watch much TV, and when I do, I give it my full attention. My wife "watches TV" while playing on her phone or even on her laptop. Then she tells me later about all the stuff that doesn't make sense. That's not me. I'm actually trying to follow this show, but it is definitely a challenge. Okay, I'm usually high, which doesn't help, but I did say that I'm enjoying the show and have accepted that I'm just not going to grasp everything going on.
They are moving fast, but most, if not of this stuff is explained. This is definitely not a show to watch while surfing on your phone or whatever, because it moves really fast.
. . . and the TVA has somehow gone from the folks officially and thoughtlessly pruning timelines (and people) to the folks who now go "Those are people!"
"Somehow" is that they learned that they are were not created by the Time Keepers, but area actually all variants that had had their lives taken away. So, now they have empathy for all the other variants that they were previously pruning.
So it was okay to kill everyone before, because regular people were beneath them, but now that it turns out that they're not some kind of superior beings, they suddenly feel empathy for them? I did understand that that was supposed to be the explanation, but I still think it's a hell of a 180. The day before, they had no problem nuking entire civilizations and realities that didn't fit "the sacred timeline" but now they actually care about all those people they didn't give a shit about yesterday. Okay.
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A lot of stories are based on making that 180 when a groundbreaking discovery is made. The entire theme of One Hour by the Concrete Lake by Pain of Salvation leaps immediately to mind.
But this is just observation, not criticism. I think some of us are trying to help you pick up on what you may have missed and then (as is par for the internet) wording it extremely poorly. So if it comes out as a criticism, that is certainly not my intent and I apologize if it’s coming out that way.
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They also learned that their gods were nothing but animatronic robots. So the higher moral authority telling them the sacred timeline was the only one worthy of existence disappeared in a poof of smoke.
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I didn't take it as criticism, so if that was directed at me, no apology is necessary. I suppose the 180 turn is something that not all TVA agents have made (yet?) so that's why we now have "good" agents (for lack of a better term) trying to stop the "bad" agents from continuing to prune timelines and thus kill all those people. I do get it. I just didn't think that it's as well-executed as it could have been. They're still cramming a ton of story and concepts into each episode. But it's a good challenge.
So... is there an explanation I missed for why Sylvie wanted so badly to return to a timeline she knew was going to be pruned?
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I didn't take it as criticism, so if that was directed at me, no apology is necessary. I suppose the 180 turn is something that not all TVA agents have made (yet?) so that's why we now have "good" agents (for lack of a better term) trying to stop the "bad" agents from continuing to prune timelines and thus kill all those people. I do get it. I just didn't think that it's as well-executed as it could have been. They're still cramming a ton of story and concepts into each episode. But it's a good challenge.
So... is there an explanation I missed for why Sylvie wanted so badly to return to a timeline she knew was going to be pruned?
I thought that was odd too, but since it happened at the end, I’m guessing she’ll leave before it actually does. She obviously just really liked it and had become attached to it, and started off believing she’d never have to leave. She probably just went back for some kind of closure.
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Hold up…
So, Owen Wilson was a teenager in the early 80s...
X-5 said Mobius isn't his actual name...
I don't think Mobius saw Jack when they walked into the McDonalds…
What if…? 🤔
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Last night's episode was pretty good IMO! This one felt more like a season one episode, especially with certain characters finally returning to the screen! Of course they had to tease us in that final scene though. Hopefully they don't leave that thread hanging for too long.
-Marc.
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So are Renslayer and Miss Minutes working together, against each other, or what? I think basically everyone is in it for themselves.
Victor Timely was interesting, but annoying.
Sylvie continues to be annoying, though somewhat less so this time.
Not enough Loki and Mobius buddy cop show, although they did get some fun moments. Not much TVA, but that's okay.
Still no idea WTF is going on big picture, but still watching.
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Victor Timely was extremely annoying. I really did not like that portrayal at all, it was just so frustrating. Overall the third episode was a big step back for me but hoping it picks up again.
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Victor Timely was extremely annoying. I really did not like that portrayal at all, it was just so frustrating. Overall the third episode was a big step back for me but hoping it picks up again.
I felt the complete opposite. I loved it. I thought it was the best episode of the 3 we've gotten so far.
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Victor Timely was extremely annoying. I really did not like that portrayal at all, it was just so frustrating. Overall the third episode was a big step back for me but hoping it picks up again.
I felt the complete opposite. I loved it. I thought it was the best episode of the 3 we've gotten so far.
Ok cool. That is good to know. I love the show so I'm happy to be alone in my thoughts. I just could not connect at all with that character so that just left me feeling disconnected with what was happening. I just wanted more of the Loki/Mobius buddy cop type stuff which I love.
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I really liked the performance of Victor Timely as well. It makes sense that He Who Remains had his humble beginnings as a neurotic yet brilliant and ambitious nerd in the 1800s
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I really liked the performance of Victor Timely as well. It makes sense that He Who Remains had his humble beginnings as a neurotic yet brilliant and ambitious nerd in the 1800s
Possibly. I can definitely see how a millennia of experiences and a multi-versal war could change a guy.
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I really liked the performance of Victor Timely as well. It makes sense that He Who Remains had his humble beginnings as a neurotic yet brilliant and ambitious nerd in the 1800s
100% disagree. That was brutal to have to watch. That actor couldn't and didn't pull off what they were going for. Looked and acted like a first year drama student. I almost just turned the show off because of it.
I know there are a ton of folks on the forum who are huge Marvel fans and maybe are even enjoying this show so I won't crap in your cheerios too much. I'll just say that this show is average at best on all accounts. Writing, acting.....storyline....all of it is just meh. It 'looks' great but outside of the foundation that Marvel set in place back when the content they were pumping out was really good....this show has nothing really redeemable about it.
Of course I'll keep watching because I've held on and watched much worse but this is far from the glory days of Marvel and when it was compelling
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I really liked the performance of Victor Timely as well. It makes sense that He Who Remains had his humble beginnings as a neurotic yet brilliant and ambitious nerd in the 1800s
100% disagree. That was brutal to have to watch. That actor couldn't and didn't pull off what they were going for. Looked and acted like a first year drama student. I almost just turned the show off because of it.
I know there are a ton of folks on the forum who are huge Marvel fans and maybe are even enjoying this show so I won't crap in your cheerios too much. I'll just say that this show is average at best on all accounts. Writing, acting.....storyline....all of it is just meh. It 'looks' great but outside of the foundation that Marvel set in place back when the content they were pumping out was really good....this show has nothing really redeemable about it.
Of course I'll keep watching because I've held on and watched much worse but this is far from the glory days of Marvel and when it was compelling
Nice to read some support on the Victor Timely character. It was excruciating to watch. Since I wrote my first comment above I have read and heard many other similar comments of people not liking the portrayal. I know there are some supporters here but I really was stunned how bad that performance was. Maybe the offscreen issues with the actor have also contributed to my feelings on it, not sure, but it was just really bad and hard for me how to see how that performance made it to the screen.
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I don't agree that the *performance* by Majors was bad - he was probably doing exactly what was written and directed. I just found the character's stutter and cadence of speach to be annoying af.
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I don't agree that the *performance* by Majors was bad - he was probably doing exactly what was written and directed. I just found the character's stutter and cadence of speach to be annoying af.
And I just see all of that as who Victor Timely *is*.
It’s almost like a look back in time to when Michael Jordan wasn’t good enough to make his HS varsity team.
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I don't agree that the *performance* by Majors was bad - he was probably doing exactly what was written and directed. I just found the character's stutter and cadence of speach to be annoying af.
And I just see all of that as who Victor Timely *is*.
It’s almost like a look back in time to when Michael Jordan wasn’t good enough to make his HS varsity team.
It was simply a bad performance by an actor. Ed Norton WAS Aaron Stampler in Primal Fear with a speech impediment. You saw the character and never thought it was just Norton playing a character. This performance by Majors was brutal…..just bad…..it’s a wonder it was allowed to be shown to the audience. But that just speaks more to the decline of the Marvel content in general. It was over acted while at the same time suffering from asking an actor to provide something convincing he was and is just incapable of providing.
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I don't agree that the *performance* by Majors was bad - he was probably doing exactly what was written and directed. I just found the character's stutter and cadence of speach to be annoying af.
And I just see all of that as who Victor Timely *is*.
It’s almost like a look back in time to when Michael Jordan wasn’t good enough to make his HS varsity team.
It was simply a bad performance by an actor. Ed Norton WAS Aaron Stampler in Primal Fear with a speech impediment. You saw the character and never thought it was just Norton playing a character. This performance by Majors was brutal…..just bad…..it’s a wonder it was allowed to be shown to the audience. But that just speaks more to the decline of the Marvel content in general. It was over acted while at the same time suffering from asking an actor to provide something convincing he was and is just incapable of providing.
Totally agree with this. Couldn’t have said it better. This sums up my feelings exactly.
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Whether it was how Majors was instructed to perform or his choice, it was bad. Such a cliché... the brilliant scientist who is socially awkward, with a stutter and timid personality. Oh wait... he's also a con artist! How original!
Still enjoying the show, but that definitely knocked it down a level.
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Not even sure what you guys are talking about. I just agree with the reviewers that think Majors is just killing it in now a third major version of this character. Still not sure about the Ant Man post credits scene. But He Who Remains was fantastic, Kang the Conqueror was serviceable in that role and moved the story forward, and Victor Timely may just be the best yet (or at least a solid #2).
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Not even sure what you guys are talking about. I just agree with the reviewers that think Majors is just killing it in now a third major version of this character. Still not sure about the Ant Man post credits scene. But He Who Remains was fantastic, Kang the Conqueror was serviceable in that role and moved the story forward, and Victor Timely may just be the best yet (or at least a solid #2).
That's what I'm thinking. Bad performance?
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Not even sure what you guys are talking about. I just agree with the reviewers that think Majors is just killing it in now a third major version of this character. Still not sure about the Ant Man post credits scene. But He Who Remains was fantastic, Kang the Conqueror was serviceable in that role and moved the story forward, and Victor Timely may just be the best yet (or at least a solid #2).
That's what I'm thinking. Bad performance?
Certainly it's all opinion and subjective....I'm glad that those of you who liked it and saw nothing wrong with it enjoyed it.
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Well, no, it's not "saw nothing wrong with it." I thoroughly enjoyed it and thought it was both VERY well written and VERY well acted.
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it was both VERY well written and VERY well acted.
We could probably go round and round on our completely opposite opinions on these points....but no need.....as I said.....glad ya'll enjoyed it. :tup
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Oh, for sure. And I'm not saying you are wrong. I'm just saying I think you are crazy. There's a difference. :biggrin:
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Oh, for sure. And I'm not saying you are wrong. I'm just saying I think you are crazy. There's a difference. :biggrin:
:lol
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Oh, for sure. And I'm not saying you are wrong. I'm just saying I think you are crazy. There's a difference. :biggrin:
:lol
I think it also comes down to the fact that I'm a very average and un-informed MCU viewer. Whereas...say....I'll take a hard line and defend a ton of stuff in the SW's threads because I'm a bit more invested in those. With this MCU stuff I'm probably more prone to being less impressed by it all because I don't have the history with the content.
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That....was a thrilling episode, especially those last few minutes!
I was not expecting that ending and honestly, that made it so good IMO. Cannot wait for next week and it seems like at this point we've seen all the pre-release promotional material in the first four episodes, so the last two will be unseen, I believe!
-Marc.
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That....was a thrilling episode, especially those last few minutes!
I was not expecting that ending and honestly, that made it so good IMO. Cannot wait for next week and it seems like at this point we've seen all the pre-release promotional material in the first four episodes, so the last two will be unseen, I believe!
-Marc.
Agree. I think I will skip the next episode to watch the last two back-to-back
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That....was a thrilling episode, especially those last few minutes!
I was not expecting that ending and honestly, that made it so good IMO. Cannot wait for next week and it seems like at this point we've seen all the pre-release promotional material in the first four episodes, so the last two will be unseen, I believe!
-Marc.
Agree. I think I will skip the next episode to watch the last two back-to-back
Only two more to go?? Damn.
I liked the episode, but am totally confused with the storyline around Dox/Hunters. Why all of a sudden are they willing to martyr themselves rather than align with Renslayer? What Renslayer wanted was that much more horiffic than what they were doing - their principles and standards were worth dying over? Why not save yourself and at least play along with Renslayer?
Miss Minutes is a wylie cunt.
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Miss Minutes is a wylie cunt.
Her face when Dox was dying was just....jesus. She was enjoying that so much :lol
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Miss Minutes is a wylie cunt.
Her face when Dox was dying was just....jesus. She was enjoying that so much :lol
Yeah, the animators doing her have done a great job.
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but am totally confused with the storyline around Dox/Hunters.
I'm going small font with my post/thoughts because it's once again going to be critical and I can see folks are somehow actually enjoying the show so don't want to be a large font negative Nancy....so...
I think one of the reasons you may be confused is because the writing is horrible. There is nothing original or compelling about any of what is going on in this show right now....it's just not good. I only keep watching to see if there is ANY type of payoff or saving grace and there has yet to be anything that says this is a good show. It's a snoozefest with nary a redeeming quality to be found.
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Good choice to not show what it looks like when you get crushed inside one of those shrinking boxes. I'm still not clear on everyone's motives and/or allegiances, but I guess with Dox and her team out of the picture, that's one less faction to worry about. Victor Timely got spaghetti-fied (I kinda wondered what that looked like, so that was cool and also unexpected) so he's also out of the picture (I assume), but as before, things keep moving, I still follow maybe half of what the hell's going on, but it's still a fun ride.
Mobius continues to have some of the best lines. "That sounds like something it would be better to hear from much farther away" (or something like that) cracked me up.
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Good choice to not show what it looks like when you get crushed inside one of those shrinking boxes. I'm still not clear on everyone's motives and/or allegiances, but I guess with Dox and her team out of the picture, that's one less faction to worry about. Victor Timely got spaghetti-fied (I kinda wondered what that looked like, so that was cool and also unexpected) so he's also out of the picture (I assume), but as before, things keep moving, I still follow maybe half of what the hell's going on, but it's still a fun ride.
Mobius continues to have some of the best lines. "That sounds like something it would be better to hear from much farther away" (or something like that) cracked me up.
My first reaction to this is that it sends Victor to a countless number of timelines.
@Gary... how do you really feel? :lol
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@Gary... how do you really feel? :lol
I say this in all seriousness.....I may start counseling again. Did it for years and it was awesome....now it's been around four years since I stopped going and I'm just a cantankerous old man now. I find too much joy in complaining about meaningless crap :lol
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Miss Minutes- gone
Ravonna - gone
Victor - gone
Who is the BAD guy in this series?
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Who is the BAD guy in this series?
The head writer
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Who is the BAD guy in this series?
The head writer
Haha. That was funny.
Also, I don’t th8nk any of those characters at “gone”.
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Who is the BAD guy in this series?
The head writer
:rollin
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Miss Minutes is a wylie cunt.
Her face when Dox was dying was just....jesus. She was enjoying that so much :lol
Duuuuuuuuuuude for fucking real man.... Amazing how they managed to pull that off so well.
Solid episode, I'll definitely need to watch it again since I watched it on my phone on a plane and was distracted by the views. Really solid stuff though, just love all the characters in this show and how they are portrayed.
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Once this season is over, going to do a full rewatch and keep notes, while exciting I'm lost on some details.
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Btw...did anyone else catch the pads "ah ah ah....." in total mimic of the scene from Jurassic Park?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfiQYRn7fBg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfiQYRn7fBg)
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Btw...did anyone else catch the pads "ah ah ah....." in total mimic of the scene from Jurassic Park?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfiQYRn7fBg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfiQYRn7fBg)
Nope... totally missed that.
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Oh I picked up on that right away and was half expecting the "You didn't say the magic word" :lol :lol
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Oh I picked up on that right away and was half expecting the "You didn't say the magic word" :lol :lol
Same lol, it was pretty spot on though, even down to the finger wagging Miss Manners. She's such a brilliant character
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Victor Timely got spaghetti-fied (I kinda wondered what that looked like, so that was cool and also unexpected)
Not that anyone is asking, but I figure that someone would be spaghettified at some point since they mentioned it in Ep. 1. I was wondering what it would look and I think it looked better than I expected.
Though since they mentioned "black holes" in the first episode, just want to point out that spaghettification through black hole would not look like that at all. Just sharing :)
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We missed last week’s episode so we watched the last two back to back last night and tonight. I didn’t have any issue with Victor’s character. The acting didn’t bother me or stand out to me as good or bad. The character was endearing enough.
I agree it’s a fairly sloppily written show and people seem to suddenly come by strong convictions about things for no apparent reason and with little convincing. I guess now Silvy is on Loki’s side again, though at the end of episode 3 she still didn’t seem to be (even though she didn’t kill Victor). We finally got some insight into why Loki might want to save the TVA (the “we are gods” line when Silvy says influencing Victor for good is like playing god - I guess he thinks maybe the TVA can kind of guide the different timelines for good not evil as opposed to just pruning them?).
The sudden back out suggest everyone (and everything?) is dead now, but I guess we’ll find out how they come back from this one.
In general, I really enjoy the show even if the plot and character development are pretty messy.
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We missed last week’s episode so we watched the last two back to back last night and tonight. I didn’t have any issue with Victor’s character. The acting didn’t bother me or stand out to me as good or bad. The character was endearing enough.
I agree it’s a fairly sloppily written show and people seem to suddenly come by strong convictions about things for no apparent reason and with little convincing. I guess now Silvy is on Loki’s side again, though at the end of episode 3 she still didn’t seem to be (even though she didn’t kill Victor). We finally got some insight into why Loki might want to save the TVA (the “we are gods” line when Silvy says influencing Victor for good is like playing god - I guess he thinks maybe the TVA can kind of guide the different timelines for good not evil as opposed to just pruning them?).
The sudden back out suggest everyone (and everything?) is dead now, but I guess we’ll find out how they come back from this one.
In general, I really enjoy the show even if the plot and character development are pretty messy.
I'll say this - I feel like Sylvie has definitely been weaker this season as far as her writing and importance to the plot. I haven't seen any real reason for her to be so protective of her branch timeline. Maybe if we got more scenes of Sylvie living her life in that branch timeline, her motivations might be more apparent.
-Marc.
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I agree it’s a fairly sloppily written show and people seem to suddenly come by strong convictions about things for no apparent reason and with little convincing.
I don't think it's sloppily written--except for the point you mention about characters suddenly developing strong convictions about things with very little motivation. That aspect is a repeated, nagging flaw in what is otherwise coming together brilliantly.
The sudden back out suggest everyone (and everything?) is dead now, but I guess we’ll find out how they come back from this one.
I'm assuming something along the lines of right about this time last season when we found out that pruning doesn't actually kill characters off, but instead transports them to the void at the end of time (or whatever it was called). I don't think they are dead or ceased to exit, but are just...some[where/time/___] else now, rather than the TVA.
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Mid season trailer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwSKatRviQo
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Cool. A few new clips in there.
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Loki is not only some of the best Marvel content in awhile, but aside from Ant Man, it's the only thing in awhile that makes me feel like there is any connective tissue building a common story toward something.
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New episode was good IMO. Not as good as the last one, but good.
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There’s a post credit audio at the end
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There’s a post credit audio at the end
Huh? I waited until the end and didn't hear anything
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There’s a post credit audio at the end
Huh? I waited until the end and didn't hear anything
Weird, I just replayed it. It happens right at the screen where you see the Dolby Vision Atmos, ARRI and two other seals below.
The audio recording says:
ZANIAC: you died, insert a coin, loser
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:lol That's funny and appropriate.
This episode meandered more than I would have expected, and was slower paced and less action packed than I would have expected for the penultimate episode in the series to be. That said, it all seemed to serve the story well. I'm interested to see how it wraps up.
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That was brilliant.
And my step son had to point out that Zaniac (which was a video game they were playing) was also the name of the horror film franchise that X-05/Brad Wolfe had starred in…because I wasn’t thinking about the name of the film he was in.
NUGGETZ!!!
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That was cool seeing all of them in their former lives. Yeah, it was a slower-paced episode, but I liked having the breather and getting a moment to think about things before the next big thing happened on screen. Some really cool scenes, though. I liked Loki going to that room, seeing himself reading a book or something, saying "Hello", then slipping back and entering the room again, but this time he's not there, so he wanders over, sees the book, picks it up, and we realize it's the same scene from 20 seconds ago but from the "other" Loki's point of view, then he shows up and says "Hello" again and disappears again. Time paradox stuff is fun. Kinda like seeing him get pruned by himself last episode, the other side of that same scene from Episode 1.
So if Casey (or Frank, as he still thinks of himself) didn't steal the TemPad at the end, who did? That didn't get answered because they all started going spaghetti, then Loki realized he could control the time-slipping. One of those things that got tossed out there to probably be revisited later, but instead we quickly moved on to something else. There were thankfully only a few of those this time.
Frank was one of the three inmates who escaped from Alcatraz in 1962. I liked how Doug's lab in the "real" world looked basically the same as O.B.'s in the TVA. Don was the Jet Ski salesman who became Mobius; we figured it had to be something like that. I liked how B-15 was Dr. Willis. They all came from very different walks of life, which I guess makes me wonder how each of them was "chosen" to be in the TVA. A question for another time, I suppose. Why did Sylvie remember both her present and her past, when none of the others did? She kinda explained it quickly, but I didn't really grok it in fullness. Because she, like Loki, is sort of "outside" of all the timey-wimey stuff?
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Well, remember that all the others went back to the lives that they had before the TVA. Whereas Sylvie joined that timeline already having full knowledge of her background, and knowing that she was a Loki variant, and knowing who Loki was.
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So if Casey (or Frank, as he still thinks of himself) didn't steal the TemPad at the end, who did? That didn't get answered because they all started going spaghetti, then Loki realized he could control the time-slipping. One of those things that got tossed out there to probably be revisited later, but instead we quickly moved on to something else. There were thankfully only a few of those this time.
I thought it just was one of the first things in that setting to 'spaghetti away' like everything else in the episode was doing...Sylvie's fast food bag and drink....the coffee mug....all the random items just disappearing. I don't think it was anything more involved than that.
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Well, remember that all the others went back to the lives that they had before the TVA. Whereas Sylvie joined that timeline already having full knowledge of her background, and knowing that she was a Loki variant, and knowing who Loki was.
Ah yes, that's makes sense. By that point, I guess Loki was used to starting his little speech with "I know this will sound crazy, but..." and forgot that he and Sylvie had already chatted a few times in that timeline.
So if Casey (or Frank, as he still thinks of himself) didn't steal the TemPad at the end, who did? That didn't get answered because they all started going spaghetti, then Loki realized he could control the time-slipping. One of those things that got tossed out there to probably be revisited later, but instead we quickly moved on to something else. There were thankfully only a few of those this time.
I thought it just was one of the first things in that setting to 'spaghetti away' like everything else in the episode was doing...Sylvie's fast food bag and drink....the coffee mug....all the random items just disappearing. I don't think it was anything more involved than that.
Maybe. It seems odd that a TemPad would go missing right about the time someone needed it, and it just happened to be a random thing that disappeared and no one saw it. When other things went spaghetti, there was always that visual effect that presumably the characters can see as well.
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This episode kind of felt like it should have been the start of season 3 (and last week’s should have been the end of the season). Feels like there is going to be a sudden conclusion/fix to the mess they are in and it might feel unsatisfactory. But I guess we’ll see what happens.
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This season has had a very odd rhythm overall. The tone changes each episode, and we spend a lot of time with certain characters, then leave them for a while and focus on others, and between that and the rather frenetic nature of what they're doing in the first place, it's been hard to feel like there's any cohesiveness, any singular direction, to what's going on. "Disjointed" may be a bit too strong, but it's something like that. I haven't looked, but across the five episodes so far, I wouldn't be surprised if there have been at least two or three different directors.
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From another site:
(https://imgur.com/WZC6d6V.jpg)
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Everything Is Connected. 👀🍿
The book by OB, "The Son Of Yoren" is based on Loki and Sylvie from the first season, specifically from the episode "Lamentis."
That's why when OB meets the god of mischief, he tells him that one of his characters has visited him. OB's science fiction is the foundation of the TVA and the story of the sacred timeline.
(https://i.imgur.com/Ewvyz6Q.jpg)
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From another site:
(https://imgur.com/WZC6d6V.jpg)
That's awesome!!!
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Guys go to LOKI Facebook page.
Then go to Messages
And follow the screens to start a convo.
When it tells you: FOR ALL TIME
Reply: ALWAYS
Enjoy.
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Wow... what a finale. I'm not sure if it's my favorite MCU D+ show finale, but it's up tthere. No post-credits stuff but the version of the main theme at the end is pretty killer.
I like that they left some things open in case there's a season three, or they all come back in a future project. There's a sense of bittersweet victory here that feels oddly fitting for Loki, both the character and the show.
-Marc.
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I'm a little confused as to what Loki was supposed to have done there at the end.
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As someone who enjoyed and follow along the plot pretty well, I'm not sure I get the finally. First time I feel the writing was a bit weird.
I really liked the first half of the episode, but not so much the ending.
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Yeah not sure what Loki did there at the end by zapping the timelines with his green juice. He preserves the TVA by destroying the time loom? or injecting the timelines with his powers? and sits at some throne? Definitely going to need a rewatch with no distraction, didn't really follow a lot of threads.
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No post-credits stuff but the version of the main theme at the end is pretty killer.
Yeah the music at the end was fantastic. Loved that version.
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My take from it is that Loki is now essentially the king of time and he replaced the loom with himself. He is the conduit for all of the timelines. Sounds like the TVA's job now is to monitor all the variants of Kang and make sure they don't get out of line.
My issue was with these 'insiders' that said Marvel is screwed with Majors based on how the season ended. I really saw nothing there that screws Marvel having to rely on Majors.
And yes, fantastic finale. It felt both sad and happy. Bittersweet, I suppose.
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I was zoning out and missed a bit, but yeah, fantastic finish. Gonna have to watch it again, but loved the soft, dramatic closing.
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The last two episodes were fantastic. I feel as a whole the season could have used one or two more episodes early on to help with the storytelling, but generally this was one of the better MCU shows.
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Other than feeling a little confused about what Loki is doing at the end, season 2 was great and solidified Loki as my favorite MCU show.
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Something really minor that bothered me from the finale was that when Loki went back to the Citadel, before Sylvie killed HWR, the lighting was different that the finale from season 1. Just me nitpicking :mehlin
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So that was... something. Definitely more entertaining than the Season 1 finale, and a very entertaining episode overall. But as with most of this season, I feel like I've followed a lot of what's going on, possibly most, but certainly not all. Loki was saying he figured out what kind of god he wants to be, so he's now Loki, More-or-Less Benevolent God of Time. I guess. That was my take, anyway.
Confusing, but still a lot of fun.
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This episode felt like they were scrambling to come up with a solution to something. I guess this was Loki’s send off though? He has to spend the rest of eternity holding time in place or something.
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Apparently Loki becomes God of Stories in the comics. So is tat what he's supposed to be now?
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Maybe? The MCU version of God of Stories?
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This episode felt like they were scrambling to come up with a solution to something. I guess this was Loki’s send off though? He has to spend the rest of eternity holding time in place or something.
Not just this episode…..the whole season. It was all disjointed and Willy nilly. I have a hunch they had the end game/end frame in mind and where they wanted to get to….which, was neat and beautiful and a good send off for Loki.
But the story and writing behind getting there was substandard for a MCU product like Loki. Whole season was choppy and confusing and it all failed to build anything for the final payoff.
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You clearly were not watching the same show I was watching.
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I thought this show/season was amazing. I love a good groundhog day scenario and I think they handled that well. I really appreciate how much of a person Loki has become. They've really given the character so much depth. Wilson and Hiddleston have amazing chemistry.
Edit - Yes, Loki is now god of stories in the form of the Norse mythology tree Yggdrasil
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You clearly were not watching the same show I was watching.
No, I did. And out of respect to you and the others who enjoyed it I’m not gonna detail ‘why’ I thought the season was just ‘meh’.
I truly am glad you guys liked it.
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I had some issues with parts of this second season which are documented in the thread above somewhere but I really enjoyed this final episode and the series overall. With how poor Marvel is travelling lately this was a big win for them. The really interesting thing now is what happens with the Kang character going forward.
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I had some issues with parts of this second season which are documented in the thread above somewhere but I really enjoyed this final episode and the series overall. With how poor Marvel is travelling lately this was a big win for them. The really interesting thing now is what happens with the Kang character going forward.
With infinite possibilities, they can write their way around anything. I still hope that they'll go forward with Kang as planned and just re-cast him if Majors seems to be to much a drag on the Disney name.
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I had some issues with parts of this second season which are documented in the thread above somewhere but I really enjoyed this final episode and the series overall. With how poor Marvel is travelling lately this was a big win for them. The really interesting thing now is what happens with the Kang character going forward.
Unlike the Star Wars reboot :angel: I’m convinced that the Kang storyline has been well planned out. Fiege has said a long time ago that this path has been laid out ahead of time for a long time now, and he’s done enough good things with the MCU that he has my 100% trust that he’s going to make it pay off. It’s just that COVID and the writers strike threw a huge monkey wrench into the works. But I’m convinced that the new “endgame” has not changed. That other stuff just meant we’ve had to shuffle around the journey a bit.
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I had some issues with parts of this second season which are documented in the thread above somewhere but I really enjoyed this final episode and the series overall. With how poor Marvel is travelling lately this was a big win for them. The really interesting thing now is what happens with the Kang character going forward.
With infinite possibilities, they can write their way around anything. I still hope that they'll go forward with Kang as planned and just re-cast him if Majors seems to be to much a drag on the Disney name.
To reiterate what we hinted at in this forum a few weeks ago, I think the Majors thing is a complete non issue. I actually keep my eyes on entertainment news and try to keep up on what people are talking about, and this forum is the only place I see Majors domestic issues even mentioned. Almost everyone else has completely forgotten it even happened.
With infinite possibilities, they can write their way around anything. I still hope that they'll go forward with Kang as planned and just re-cast him if Majors seems to be to much a drag on the Disney name.
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I had some issues with parts of this second season which are documented in the thread above somewhere but I really enjoyed this final episode and the series overall. With how poor Marvel is travelling lately this was a big win for them. The really interesting thing now is what happens with the Kang character going forward.
With infinite possibilities, they can write their way around anything. I still hope that they'll go forward with Kang as planned and just re-cast him if Majors seems to be to much a drag on the Disney name.
To reiterate what we hinted at in this forum a few weeks ago, I think the Majors thing is a complete non issue. I actually keep my eyes on entertainment news and try to keep up on what people are talking about, and this forum is the only place I see Majors domestic issues even mentioned. Almost everyone else has completely forgotten it even happened.
With infinite possibilities, they can write their way around anything. I still hope that they'll go forward with Kang as planned and just re-cast him if Majors seems to be to much a drag on the Disney name.
I still see it mentioned elsewhere, but not much. I'm sure the Mouse and Majors had a very stern "Come to Jesus" chat no matter how they go forward.
Product is going to be very thin this coming year, it looks like all we're getting is Deadpool, Echo, Agatha, and maybe Ironheart, which tells me 2025 is going to be a bloodbath of content.
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That's probably not a bad thing. I've been suffering some MCU saturation and burnout lately. I bailed on the Ms. Marvel TV show, never did end up watching Quantumania because of all the mixed reviews, Secret Invasion was pretty disappointing, and at this point I have no plans to see The Marvels. MCU set the bar pretty high with that original run all the way to Infinity Wars and End Game, and we kinda knew that things would be different after that. The "wow factor" had to come about from different places. WandaVision was pretty cool. The Spider-Man movies have been fun. But it's been less consistent, less consistently entertaining, so something of a pause in the MCU onslaught is not necessarily a bad thing.
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Wow…it took me 4 tries to reformat that post and I STILL screwed it up. :facepalm:
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I had some issues with parts of this second season which are documented in the thread above somewhere but I really enjoyed this final episode and the series overall. With how poor Marvel is travelling lately this was a big win for them. The really interesting thing now is what happens with the Kang character going forward.
With infinite possibilities, they can write their way around anything. I still hope that they'll go forward with Kang as planned and just re-cast him if Majors seems to be to much a drag on the Disney name.
To reiterate what we hinted at in this forum a few weeks ago, I think the Majors thing is a complete non issue. I actually keep my eyes on entertainment news and try to keep up on what people are talking about, and this forum is the only place I see Majors domestic issues even mentioned. Almost everyone else has completely forgotten it even happened.
With infinite possibilities, they can write their way around anything. I still hope that they'll go forward with Kang as planned and just re-cast him if Majors seems to be to much a drag on the Disney name.
I'm pretty sure Majors has some serious charges against him and it is apparently getting worse all the time (evidence against him). He will be going to court and may possibly face jail time from what I have heard. I think just because we don't hear about it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. But I also agree that Kang could be recast or the character could be replaced, lots of rumours of Dr. Doom replacing Kang are floating around. I think the planned out story beats probably remain in place.
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I loved the season, the last episode, especially those few last minutes, were incredible. Some of the biggest scale stuff we've seen in the MCU so far, I think it can be easy to forget when it's "just" a TV-show. So that's exciting.
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I don't get this article:
Loki’s Finale Didn’t Feature Kang, After All: EP Clears Up Those ‘Marvel Is F—ked’ Rumors
Rebecca Iannucci
Mon, November 13, 2023 at 9:00 AM PST
In the end, reports of Jonathan Majors’ presence as Kang the Conqueror in Loki’s sophomore finale were greatly exaggerated.
Earlier this month, our sister site Variety reported on how Marvel Studios was navigating — among other recent woes — the ongoing legal trouble for Majors, who is set to stand trial on Nov. 29 for assault, attempted assault, harassment and aggravated harassment after an alleged domestic dispute. At the time, an insider who had seen Loki’s Season 2 finale said “Marvel is truly f—ked” moving forward, given how the episode apparently kept Majors’ Kang in the spotlight and set the stage for 2026’s film Avengers: The Kang Dynasty (currently slated to star Majors).
But aside from a fleeting reference to Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania (where Kang previously popped up), the buzzed-about Marvel villain made no appearance in Loki‘s season ender (read our full recap), and there was no mid-credits or post-credits scene that might indicate a larger Kang story to come.
“That report was crazy. I’ll just say that,” Loki executive producer Kevin Wright tells TVLine with a laugh. “That just shows you, I don’t know what people are talking about.”
Wright also insists, with a firm “no,” that there was no footage intentionally left on the cutting room floor as a result of Majors’ current brouhaha. Rather, “the story that is on screen is the one that we set out to make,” he says, adding that he and Loki’s other creatives had no plans to set up a bigger MCU arc.
“Our VFX is awesome, it’s so good in this episode. You can’t do that if you’re not locking that stuff in months in advance,” Wright explains. “That final sequence was eight months in the making — just in post-production, not talking about shooting. We never really had any consideration for the larger Marvel universe, and that is why these two seasons were good. We built our own corner of the sandbox, we told our own story. People got excited about that and went, ‘Oh, Kang!’ and started building on top of that. But to us, we were the keepers of nearly 12 hours of that storytelling, and we wanted that to come to a close.”
As for the lack of end credits scenes — which have become a staple of Marvel’s shows and films, often teasing at least one future MCU project — Wright says they “would have just taken away” from Loki’s finale.
“We didn’t write any [post-credits scenes], and we certainly didn’t shoot any,” he continues. “A lot of people want these things to feel like contained stories. I know some people like the bigger interconnectedness. I think that’s also sometimes becoming a hindrance to some of our stories. For us, it was story closed, that was it.”
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/loki-finale-didn-t-feature-170045732.html
I think this author is an idiot.
1. "Kang" was barely in this? Um, no, unless you are just being pedantic about "Kang" vs. "He Who Remains." In some contexts, that might make sense if it is important to distinguish between variants. In this context however, that point is completely moot. The point is about whether Majors will continue to star as any Kang variant. "Kang" was absolutely all over this episode. A significant chunk of the episode focused on Loki interacting with him in the throne room, him being the one pulling the strings for everything that happened in both seasons, and him being the ultimate motivation for Loki's tragic, heroic choice at the finale.
2. There's no interconnectedness and setting up for the future of the MCU? What? This directly feeds into The Kang Dynasty and Secret Wars. Although there is plenty to speculate about in terms of how they will ultimately be linked, I don't see how anyone can say with a straight face that there's no connection.
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I think I'm closer to Gary on this one.
I like where Loki ended up, but did not love how we got there. Honestly, a lot of the finale could have just been an extra episode to season 1 and it wouldn't have made a difference. We didn't learn much more about Sylvie this season. We didn't learn anything about B-52 or whatever. We didn't learn much about Renslayer that wasn't heavily implied last season. We learned nothing about Victor Timely. We learned little about Mobius other than what his prime timeline guy was like. We also learned nothing about OB. I loved all of the actors, Ke Huy Quan was fantastic but ultimately just a means of exposition. Loki's arc from Thor 1 to this (not counting his other arc) is great, but this season just felt like stuff happening and I really didn't connect with it. I didn't hate it, I just kind of felt nothing. Glad others enjoyed it though.
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We didn't learn much more about Sylvie this season.
Well considering her arc was mostly completed in season one, there wasn't much more TO learn. We knew she just wanted to retire to a branch timeline and experience life in a way that she couldn't when she was on the run from apocalypse to apocalypse nearly all of her life, and given how long Asgardians live, that could've been centuries. She just wanted to enjoy life and its simple pleasures, from fast food to vinyl, and her purpose this season was to get Loki to realize what it was that he really wanted.
We didn't learn anything about B-52 or whatever.
Hunter B-15 was a doctor, presumably for children, with a lot of empathy and compassion, which probably influenced her judge of character and conviction to save the branch timelines from being wiped out once they learned they didn't need to prune them all. Learning who she was on the sacred timeline really put a good spin on how she's been viewed since Season 1 and rewatching that with this knowledge could spotlight some of her character moments.
We didn't learn much about Renslayer that wasn't heavily implied last season.
I'll agree, her arc this season felt a bit underbaked, though the revelations of her involvement with He Who Remains put her in a peculiar spot, and considering we didn't see Alioth consume her, it's safe to say she's still alive and probably has plans in the future, either to get revenge against Sylvie, the TVA, or HWR. She was really just a pawn for HWR and Miss Minutes this season, though the revelation of her story with Mobius really explains a lot about her ruthlessness, especially concerning Sylvie.
We learned nothing about Victor Timely.
We learned he was a no-name candlestick maker in the late 1800s, who might have influenced OB to write the TVA handbook. He was a brilliant con artist, which isn't too dissimilar from how Kang might operate, but he definitely shows that Kang Variants have a lot more variety than just being a green-and-purple-clad villain. I guess if folks found him annoying, they weren't going to glean anything from his character, but for those of us who enjoyed him, there was a bit to learn.
We learned little about Mobius other than what his prime timeline guy was like.
I feel like Sylvie, Mobius' arc was mostly complete in s1, but seeing his friendship grow with Loki was a key aspect of this season. There's a reason he's with Sylvie when they see Loki approach the gangway. Those are his closest friends and they motivated Loki to make his final decisions at the end of the season. The repetition of the "For you. For all of us" line from the end of the first Thor film, but this time to Mobius and Sylvie, really hits differently now, and was a brilliant inclusion in those final moments, along with Mobius' line of "Most purpose is more 'burden' than 'glory'.", which is just so beautiful, and a great twist on Loki's typical "I am burdened with glorious purpose." line he's said many times.
We also learned nothing about OB.
He was a failing sci-fi author and physics professor, which explains his aloofness and genius intellect, and seeing how his lab on the sacred timeline clearly inspired his TVA lab, it feels like when he joined the TVA, they either didn't erase his memories or his memories remained in a hazy way that kept them from being completely erased. Beyond that, I don't think we needed to learn much about him, as his presence was to create tension in the plot ("We're all gonna die!"), provide some curious puzzle pieces (learning Timely inspired him to write the handbook, which inspired Timely, etc), and ultimately help guide Loki through his time-slipping journey. Like the others, he survived and so there's a chance we may see him again, but honestly, I don't see a reason to need to learn MORE about him - just let him be a quirky tinkerer. Not every character needs a super in-depth backstory full of intrigue and drama.
I loved all of the actors, Ke Huy Quan was fantastic but ultimately just a means of exposition. Loki's arc from Thor 1 to this (not counting his other arc) is great, but this season just felt like stuff happening and I really didn't connect with it. I didn't hate it, I just kind of felt nothing. Glad others enjoyed it though.
Looking at Loki's arc from 2011's Thor up to now, it's amazing seeing what he became, both on the sacred timeline ("You wlll never be a god"), and at the TVA ("I know what kind of god I need to be."). I'd say his story is probably one of my favorites in all of the MCU now, next to Stark and Rogers, who, of course, have had definitive endings in their own right. If we never see Hiddleston's Loki ever again, I'd be satisfied, but I wouldn't turn down another glorious chance to see him on screen as long as his purpose for being there wasn't a burden.
-Marc.
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Valiant effort Marc to defend the season and the writing and the way they chose to tell the story, but it’s just not there. The end result….being the sacrifice and where Loki ended up was beautiful. Just wish they had accompanied that with a season of concise direction and sensible writing. They didn’t.
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I think Marc's point -- which I agree with -- is that there was character development, backstory, and motivation for all of these characters. All of that, along with everything else this season, went by so quickly that maybe it didn't seem important and wasn't really emphasized, but it was there. There was a lot of stuff crammed into every episode and the basic strategy seemed to be to keep things moving so fast that the average viewer doesn't have time to think about it. But it's actually there if you want to look for it.
I also agree with the basic stance that a lot of "big moments" didn't feel well-earned, mostly because of the breakneck pace with which things were presented. Not a lot of time was given to absorb everything, and the result for me was that a lot of stuff seemed to happen but I couldn't tell you what half of it was, or why. But I'm not gonna bag on the folks who liked it and/or found it to be just fine. I was still pretty entertained throughout the whole series.
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I think Marc's point -- which I agree with -- is that there was character development, backstory, and motivation for all of these characters. All of that, along with everything else this season, went by so quickly that maybe it didn't seem important and wasn't really emphasized, but it was there. There was a lot of stuff crammed into every episode and the basic strategy seemed to be to keep things moving so fast that the average viewer doesn't have time to think about it. But it's actually there if you want to look for it.
I also agree with the basic stance that a lot of "big moments" didn't feel well-earned, mostly because of the breakneck pace with which things were presented. Not a lot of time was given to absorb everything, and the result for me was that a lot of stuff seemed to happen but I couldn't tell you what half of it was, or why. But I'm not gonna bag on the folks who liked it and/or found it to be just fine. I was still pretty entertained throughout the whole series.
Yeah, I agree with this pretty much. I enjoyed the show, though I agree with a lot of the criticisms. I was entertained at least.
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I think Marc's point -- which I agree with -- is that there was character development, backstory, and motivation for all of these characters.
I'm going small font because I'm glad some of you guys enjoyed it....but...I just can't get on board with this season being a success.....outside of the final sequence with Loki taking his spot on that throne.
I think that there was a rudimentary attempt at that for these characters....but when you really look at what those characters did/said etc etc this season....there wasn't ANY significant development in any of these characters. In fact, the characters of Sylvie and Mobius were damaged more than developed in this season as far as what we'd grown to like of them in S1. They were shells of the interesting characters from S1 and were used as props more than parts of the story. And that's my 'complaint' about the season. It was a disjointed mess with no real compelling substance for 99% of the characters involved.
Loki was the only one that made strides and ultimately ended up in a really cool closing sequence that again....was pretty beautiful. But even his arc this season was disjointed and slogged on.
Renslayer could have not made an appearance at all this season and it wouldn't have affected the outcome one bit. Zero. Seriously, why even have shown her at all this season? She did nothing but eat some screen time in an episode.
We've discussed Victor Timely.....I couldn't take that character serious at all given how poorly it was acted. There was potential there for something cool but it was a huge swing and miss.
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I'll give you that the plot was at times disjointed, and that for you, it didn't work.
But the character stuff, that's a HARD disagree. The stuff you were saying isn't present absolutely was. Marc nailed it. Not everything you want was needed to tell this story. You may have subjectively wanted things to turn out differently, but that isn't the point. I'll use the first Avengers film as a good analogy. By that time in the MCU, Tony and Cap had been pretty developed. To a lesser degree, so was Thor. And to a lesser degree than that, so was Hulk. Despite making appearances in several movies, Natasha and Clint were really underdeveloped as fully fleshed out characters. Hence a LOT of people saying that by the time of Age of Ultron, despite it's flaws, Natasha and Clint got a lot more focus and fleshing out (and Natasha had gotten a lot in Winter Soldier prior to that also, which helped). But they weren't developed well by the end of Avengers. And here's where I'm going--they didn't need to be. Even though they were not fully fleshed out by then, they were as fleshed out as they needed to be. Same with some other key non-Avengers characters (Fury, Coulson, Hill, for example). Their development to that point served the story to that point. Same with all the characters you mention, Gary. As Marc pointed out, there was FAR from "zero" development this season for any of the ones you mention. What they did well was give enough for those of us that were open to emotionally invest in those characters and care about what happened to them (something lacking in a lot of recent MCU content). You may not have invested and cared. But a lot of us did. And there was more than enough meat on the bone for us to do so. Could there have been more? Sure. But you can say that about just about any project. We got what we got, and it worked, and worked well for a lot of us. To say there is "zero" is just inaccurate and just smacks of biased viewing. And that's also fine. If you don't like it because it didn't meet your subjective criteria, that's cool too. I'm that way with a lot of things that plenty of other people love, so I get it.
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I'll give you that the plot was at times disjointed, and that for you, it didn't work.
But the character stuff, that's a HARD disagree. The stuff you were saying isn't present absolutely was. Marc nailed it. Not everything you want was needed to tell this story. You may have subjectively wanted things to turn out differently, but that isn't the point. I'll use the first Avengers film as a good analogy. By that time in the MCU, Tony and Cap had been pretty developed. To a lesser degree, so was Thor. And to a lesser degree than that, so was Hulk. Despite making appearances in several movies, Natasha and Clint were really underdeveloped as fully fleshed out characters. Hence a LOT of people saying that by the time of Age of Ultron, despite it's flaws, Natasha and Clint got a lot more focus and fleshing out (and Natasha had gotten a lot in Winter Soldier prior to that also, which helped). But they weren't developed well by the end of Avengers. And here's where I'm going--they didn't need to be. Even though they were not fully fleshed out by then, they were as fleshed out as they needed to be. Same with some other key non-Avengers characters (Fury, Coulson, Hill, for example). Their development to that point served the story to that point. Same with all the characters you mention, Gary. As Marc pointed out, there was FAR from "zero" development this season for any of the ones you mention. What they did well was give enough for those of us that were open to emotionally invest in those characters and care about what happened to them (something lacking in a lot of recent MCU content). You may not have invested and cared. But a lot of us did. And there was more than enough meat on the bone for us to do so. Could there have been more? Sure. But you can say that about just about any project. We got what we got, and it worked, and worked well for a lot of us. To say there is "zero" is just inaccurate and just smacks of biased viewing. And that's also fine. If you don't like it because it didn't meet your subjective criteria, that's cool too. I'm that way with a lot of things that plenty of other people love, so I get it.
And I hope that the bolded and the point you made is clear to folks like you and Marc and others who liked it.......this is just how 'I' feel. I'm certainly FAR from a Marvel aficionado, and have admitted I'm an average fan at best. I got into it because my kids loved the movies so I just kind of found my way into the mix of the whole First Phase stuff. So, a lot of what I'm saying is really from the perspective of a casual fan who is just detailing how they've 'lost' me in the follow up phases. I felt invested in the stories/movies of that whole series of Avengers movies but haven't felt as connected to these subsequent stories/characters as I did with the original batch.
I don't think the writing is as good, the overall arch of the story they're trying to tell is more bland and not as compelling.....the actors are hit and miss as far as performances.....it's simply just not as good in my eyes. I loved the final scene of Loki because I do think that was a beautiful way to 'end' his arc.....but I've expressed how I felt about how they got there. Just didn't do it for me.
....
I want to like all of these efforts and the continuing story......and my criticisms of this show and other shows may just be a microcosm of my overall growing cynicism for EVERYTHING these days....not just entertainment but the world in general....and as a side note on that point it's something I'm trying to improve and address in my character because it's affecting more than TV show reviews at this point.
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FINALLY got to watch the final 3 episodes.
Wow, what an ending. I thought that was a really interesting final arc for Loki himself. I can also see how it still leads into a Kang War (however that develops), but could also see how they could go an entirely different route if they want. I liked it a lot.
I will definitely come down on the side of those who enjoyed it. Good stuff.
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A well written but too long post to quote without making thread hard to read.
I think I didn't express myself properly. Because based on what I wrote, you're mostly right.
However, when I said we didn't learn much about the characters (other than Loki) I didn't mean factual things, I meant personality, motivation, wants/needs/drives, etc. Also the facts we learned were mostly about the prime timeline version of these people, who are, to me, different characters. It's like asking me to describe Robert Pattinson's Batman and me giving you a ton of info about Adam West. The people we learned a little about looked the same and were played by the same actors, but they're different people. So I don't know much new about B-15 from season 2, even if I learned that a variant of hers was a doctor. So on and so on.
So again, I don't really value learning facts about someone like their job or occupation, and on top of that, that was about other characters.
And to what Bosk said, yes it's all subjective. This show meets your subjective criteria and didn't meet mine. It's all good. A lot of Marvel hasn't met my subjective criteria for some time now because I care deeply, and most importantly, about character more than plot. I just am finding harder and harder to connect with "We gotta get the thing to stop the thing from happening but the bad guy also wants the thing for evil reasons." And it playing in to later things also doesn't matter much to me. All subjective. For sure.
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The Making of episode has dropped on Disney+. Another near tear-inducing moment from Ke on how he got the role and what it meant to him. I just love that guy.
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The Making of episode has dropped on Disney+. Another near tear-inducing moment from Ke on how he got the role and what it meant to him. I just love that guy.
Hands down the most humble and gracious human on Earth. :heart
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Need to watch that.
Also, if the stuff that came out of the first week of Jonathan Majors trial is true, he might be done.
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You talking about the text messages?
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That and the supposed video of him shoving his ex into the taxi.
Of course we have to hear his testimony now, but it's not looking very good.
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Also, if the stuff that came out of the first week of Jonathan Majors trial is true, he might be done.
He Who Remains... behind bars
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Watch this video FIRST:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pv7q5C9HGd8
Then watch this one:
https://x.com/LonoBristol/status/1735040889674662369?s=20
:lol
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lol
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Ummmmm….this really really changes things. I think this opens up the conversation that men can be victims too. And I can tell you from experience…when you try to tell people that you were defending yourself against someone who was behaving like a wild animal…no one believes you.
I believe Christopher Titus has a skit about this. He was the one that went to jail, but the cops wouldn’t let him stay there just because he was afraid of his 5’2” 100lb girlfriend.
This video makes it look like Jonathan is the one being attacked and trying to get away. I mean, if she caught him cheating like it says then ya she had a right to be angry. But if she started freaking out in the car and he had to slap her just to get away, that changes things.
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Ummmmm….this really really changes things. I think this opens up the conversation that men can be victims too. And I can tell you from experience…when you try to tell people that you were defending yourself against someone who was behaving like a wild animal…no one believes you.
I believe Christopher Titus has a skit about this. He was the one that went to jail, but the cops wouldn’t let him stay there just because he was afraid of his 5’2” 100lb girlfriend.
This video makes it look like Jonathan is the one being attacked and trying to get away. I mean, if she caught him cheating like it says then ya she had a right to be angry. But if she started freaking out in the car and he had to slap her just to get away, that changes things.
That's the testimony of the driver, that she was freaking out and Majors was just trying to put her away
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Ummmmm….this really really changes things. I think this opens up the conversation that men can be victims too. And I can tell you from experience…when you try to tell people that you were defending yourself against someone who was behaving like a wild animal…no one believes you.
I believe Christopher Titus has a skit about this. He was the one that went to jail, but the cops wouldn’t let him stay there just because he was afraid of his 5’2” 100lb girlfriend.
This video makes it look like Jonathan is the one being attacked and trying to get away. I mean, if she caught him cheating like it says then ya she had a right to be angry. But if she started freaking out in the car and he had to slap her just to get away, that changes things.
Honestly, I found the defense to be weak. Majors didn't even get on the stand. Parker and her attorneys had multiple witness, text messages and pictures. Though, I will admit that the little bit of evidence the Major's attorney had was pretty damn good, I'm not sure it will be enough to clear him of everything.
I think the verdict will be today. So we will see.
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And Majors was found guilty.
Now we wait and see what Marvel will do. My guess is they drop Majors and the Kang story (given the ending of Loki makes it easy to move away from Kang), but I would prefer they recast the character.
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And Majors was found guilty.
Now we wait and see what Marvel will do. My guess is they drop Majors and the Kang story (given the ending of Loki makes it easy to move away from Kang), but I would prefer they recast the character.
Dayum... from bad to worse for Disney!
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I have to be missing something. Because this really sounds like he got shafted. I figured he had more going in his favor than Johnny Depp, and he walked away smelling like a rose.
So what am I missing?
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His punishment should be doing DCU movies
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His punishment should be doing DCU movies
Oof
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I have to be missing something. Because this really sounds like he got shafted. I figured he had more going in his favor than Johnny Depp, and he walked away smelling like a rose.
So what am I missing?
I don't know all the evidence the jury got, but I think the fact that the video shows him picking up his ex and trying to force her back in the car is counting as assault/harassment. Off the 4 charges, he was only found guilty of 2 though :dunno:
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Now we wait and see what Marvel will do. My guess is they drop Majors and the Kang story (given the ending of Loki makes it easy to move away from Kang), but I would prefer they recast the character.
Yeah, they will probably drop Majors. But I don't know why you think they would drop the Kang story. That wouldn't make any sense after they have invested so much time into it. I haven't seen anything from Marvel indicating that they have any intention of doing so.
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I still put even odds on them just pretending it never happened. Scrub the press…no comment…lather, rinse, repeat until the next Hollywood scandal comes along and the ADD public forgets it ever happened.
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https://deadline.com/2023/12/jonathan-majors-marvel-fired-guilty-verdict-1235671790/amp/
Whelp...
-Marc.
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Now we wait and see what Marvel will do. My guess is they drop Majors and the Kang story (given the ending of Loki makes it easy to move away from Kang), but I would prefer they recast the character.
Yeah, they will probably drop Majors. But I don't know why you think they would drop the Kang story. That wouldn't make any sense after they have invested so much time into it. I haven't seen anything from Marvel indicating that they have any intention of doing so.
My only concerns that they might pivot from Kang for Avengers 5 is the change in both writer and director for the film. Granted, that might not mean anything with regards to Kang, but it wouldn't surprise me if they did change things up to pivot away from focusing on Kang.
-Marc.
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Ummmmm….this really really changes things. I think this opens up the conversation that men can be victims too. And I can tell you from experience…when you try to tell people that you were defending yourself against someone who was behaving like a wild animal…no one believes you.
I believe Christopher Titus has a skit about this. He was the one that went to jail, but the cops wouldn’t let him stay there just because he was afraid of his 5’2” 100lb girlfriend.
This video makes it look like Jonathan is the one being attacked and trying to get away. I mean, if she caught him cheating like it says then ya she had a right to be angry. But if she started freaking out in the car and he had to slap her just to get away, that changes things.
Honestly, I found the defense to be weak. Majors didn't even get on the stand. Parker and her attorneys had multiple witness, text messages and pictures. Though, I will admit that the little bit of evidence the Major's attorney had was pretty damn good, I'm not sure it will be enough to clear him of everything.
I think the verdict will be today. So we will see.
Isn't that like the usual case? like don't most defendants not take the stand during their trial? I think I read that it's not a big deal to not take the stand.
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https://deadline.com/2023/12/jonathan-majors-marvel-fired-guilty-verdict-1235671790/amp/
Whelp...
-Marc.
Shows how much I know.
This is why guys don’t come forward when they are being abused. They will always believe the woman.
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Now we wait and see what Marvel will do. My guess is they drop Majors and the Kang story (given the ending of Loki makes it easy to move away from Kang), but I would prefer they recast the character.
Yeah, they will probably drop Majors. But I don't know why you think they would drop the Kang story. That wouldn't make any sense after they have invested so much time into it. I haven't seen anything from Marvel indicating that they have any intention of doing so.
Just me making assumptions based on stuff I read and heard. I hope I'm wrong, since I want to see the full Kang story played out.
And yeah, the marvel news was expected
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Majors didn't even get on the stand.
His defense lawyers have probably seen his work and realize how horrible he'd come across.....because he'd undoubtedly try to portray some sort of emotion or convey something and it'd seem disingenuous.
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Just move away from Kang completely. He's not been a compelling villain and getting punched out by Ant-Man hardly screams end level boss threat.
Also they've not as of yet really done much showing any attempt to rebuilt a new avengers team, which they probably need to start focusing on.
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Just move away from Kang completely. He's not been a compelling villain and getting punched out by Ant-Man hardly screams end level boss threat.
Also they've not as of yet really done much showing any attempt to rebuilt a new avengers team, which they probably need to start focusing on.
Yeah, Thanos dispatches Hulk in a fist-fight with relative ease; Kang can't out-box an Ice-Cream Scooper.
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Ya know... I'm glad Marvel waited until after he was convicted to drop him. I think that's the way it should be unless there's iron clad video evidence of a crime. I couldn't care less about Kang as a character. Or Majors portrayal of him. So far I haven't been super impressed, but the there are many variants and they'll just get more powerful. I'm sure they'll just recast and move on with the plan.
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Although I didn't initially care about them bringing Kang into the MCU, I've really REALLY enjoyed what Marvel has done with the character thus far AND Majors' portrayal. But love it, hate it, or somewhere in between, the bottom line is that this is yet another hit to Marvel as they continue to struggle after phase 3.
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The Multiverse Saga for me has definitely been hit or miss but the Kang storyline, so far, has been a big hit. I understand that people felt let down by him being beat by Ant-Man but the whole purpose of the villain is that there are literally thousands of meaner versions of him lurking out there. Cut one head, and from it 10 more will spring. I feel that's the point they were trying to make (although it did feel like a letdown that there were no true consequences of such encounter with any of the characters). Scott should've died, and have a variant of him take over his roles as the "main universe" Ant-Man or something. They literally can do anything with their multiverse storytelling devices.
I really hope they don't ditch his storyline because they're invested so much into it (it's been years of teasing The Kang Dynasty and the big multiversal war). It's a shame about Majors, though, because I feel he's a pretty amazing actor and really brought the variants to life.
There are some pretty amazing actors that could take over, and I wouldn't mind! Any ideas?
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There are some pretty amazing actors that could take over, and I wouldn't mind! Any ideas?
Terrance Howard.
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There are some pretty amazing actors that could take over, and I wouldn't mind! Any ideas?
Terrance Howard.
I don't know why he was replaced for IM2, but I wouldn't mind him coming back.
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There's been a lot of multiversal stuff thus far. But to my immediate memory, only Spider-Man and Loki (though I guess technically Thor briefly) have had variants played by other actors.
A very strange thing to do, given all of the potential. But it also means that literally any actor or actress can play whatever Kang we see next. It makes no difference.
But yes, Terrance Howard.
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Regé-Jean Page.
John David Washington seems popular ATM, but I'm not sure he's got the charisma for the role based on what I've seen him in.
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There's been a lot of multiversal stuff thus far. But to my immediate memory, only Spider-Man and Loki (though I guess technically Thor briefly) have had variants played by other actors.
A very strange thing to do, given all of the potential. But it also means that literally any actor or actress can play whatever Kang we see next. It makes no difference.
This is a great point. The having all Kangs be played by the same actor was a pretty cool milestone for Majors because he could showcase a pretty wide spectrum of acting abilities and of course, made sense because before his legal problems he was possibly one of Hollywood's fastest rising stars. Talk about rising & falling.
Now, unlike the Infinity Saga where we were mostly bound to one world and one timeline they can literally pull off any actor and without any explanation tell the world he's a new Kang. I do hope for a recast because there's a lot of potential in there (and I need me some Rama-Tut facing Moon Knight).
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There are some pretty amazing actors that could take over, and I wouldn't mind! Any ideas?
Terrance Howard.
I don't know why he was replaced for IM2, but I wouldn't mind him coming back.
He and RDJ butted heads on IM1.
He’s a very talented actor, but I get the impression that he doesn’t really care for “the big machine” of it all.
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I read that he and RDJ didn't get along, and also that he was a pain in the ass in general, seeming to think himself "above" doing comic book movies due to his previous work. Maybe something about salary as well; it's been a while. But the MCU showrunners decided that it wasn't worth it to deal with him, and personally I like Don Cheadle better anyway.
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That makes sense, and yeah Don Cheadle has been great in everything he has been in.
I mentioned it when Guardians 3 came out, but Chukwudi Iwuji would be a great replacement. I think Yahya Abdul-Mateen would be good in the role as well.
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John Boyega would be the perfect fit.
But he already said no, so, I guess is only wait and see who they bring for the role.