DreamTheaterForums.org Dream Theater Fan Site

Dream Theater => Dream Theater => Topic started by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 12:15:40 AM

Title: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 12:15:40 AM
 SIMPLE!!

When Dream And Day Unite, Images and Words, Awake, Falling Into Infinity

VS

A Dramatic Turn of Events, Dream Theater, The Astonishing, Distance Over Time.

I have a feelin' this will be one-sided but ya never know ! :hat

Out of the first four albums I only REALLY like Falling Into Infinity whilst I thoroughly enjoy Mangini's first four way more.


- Will be interesting to do this poll for each drummer's first five albums sometime next year if DT15 is really that good.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Zydar on April 16, 2021, 12:20:16 AM
Easiest choice ever, the first four.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 12:22:47 AM
But why though?

For me - WDADU is obviously not that great - I&W is too 'light' for me. I find Awake incredibly dull after the first 4 songs and FII is the only album out of the first 4 I enjoy.

Whereas for me Mangini's first 4 albums are at worst incredibly consistent and at best - arguably DT's best 4 album run - and hopefully best 5 album run.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Zydar on April 16, 2021, 12:28:13 AM
WDADU has grown on me over the years, and I no longer rank it last in their discography. (TA has taken its place there).

I&W is their best one ever, and a true classic. Awake is not far behind. And FII is a very good album too.

Their last 4? Good stuff, but definitely not in the league of their 90s albums for me.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 12:34:55 AM

(TA has taken its place there).


The Astonishing the WORST thing they've done ? Not with Systematic Chaos' plodding entire second half in existence.

- As I said i think this poll may be slightly harder next year if DT15 is as good as JR is letting on.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: TM172003 on April 16, 2021, 03:51:36 AM
I voted Portnoy just because of Images and Awake. Apart from Peruvian Skies, Lines in the Sand and Hell’s Kitchen I don’t care for FII and WDaDU I’ve only ever listened to once. It’s just weird hearing Dominici.

DoT and ADToE are great but Mangini’s first four is weighed down by TA and DT.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Max Kuehnau on April 16, 2021, 04:15:22 AM
MM era first four, easily. Cleaner execution, greater musicality. No FII. (their worst album to date IMHO) Constant greatness and cohesion. And: absolute lack of intra-band drama.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Mladen on April 16, 2021, 04:24:00 AM
Oh, man. This was harder than I thought.

On one hand, Images and words and Awake are in my top three, while When dream and day unite and Falling into infinity are my bottom two.

On the other hand, A Dramatic turn of events and The Astonishing are in my top five, while Dream Theater and Distance over time are in my bottom four.

I went with the first four albums with Portnoy. Even paired with my least favorite Dream Theater albums, you cannot select an option that doesn't contain Images and words and Awake.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Dream Team on April 16, 2021, 04:49:55 AM
But why though?

For me - WDADU is obviously not that great - I&W is too 'light' for me. I find Awake incredibly dull after the first 4 songs and FII is the only album out of the first 4 I enjoy.

Whereas for me Mangini's first 4 albums are at worst incredibly consistent and at best - arguably DT's best 4 album run - and hopefully best 5 album run.

Awake’s best songs are AFTER the first 4. WDADU is wonderful. FII is their worst album by far. Images is legendary. And you ask US “why though”?  :lol

Now having said that, MM era is very close because of consistency.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Revenge319 on April 16, 2021, 04:53:11 AM
I'm going with Mangini's first four, simply due to how I'd rank these eight albums:

1. A Dramatic Turn of Events
2. The Astonishing
3. Distance Over Time
4. Images and Words
5. Awake
6. Dream Theater
7. Falling Into Infinity
8. When Dream and Day Unite
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: the_silent_man on April 16, 2021, 04:57:38 AM
Absolutely the first 4.
-1 groundbreaking masterpiece, which is considered one of the top prog metal albums of all time by many (I&W);
-Another dark, atmospheric masterpiece (by my taste), though I know not everyone holds it in high regards (Awake);
-An underrated album that has a few very weak songs by DT standards, but also some of their best work (FII);
-An average debut by a band finding their feet (WDADU);

Whereas the new 4 have:
A brilliant return to form, that however does have its issues in mainly very weak production and offering nothing new (ADTOE);
A very strong consise album but that is a bit 'tame' by DT standards, again not offering anything new (DOT);
An fairly average and slightly uninspired effect that has production that actively hurts the album (DT12);
A 'left turn' album that, even though it has it's moments of utter brilliance and is better than DT12 in some ways, is too long/spread too thin and does not play to DTs strengths IMO (Astonishing)

The strength of I&W and Awake win this by far. And I would take FII over Astonishing and DT12. ADTOE and DOT are really great albums, but they don't offer anything really new or blow me away like those early albums still do.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Zydar on April 16, 2021, 05:02:38 AM
the_silent_man: I agree with pretty much everything you wrote there. You worded it much better than me  ;D
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Skeever on April 16, 2021, 05:54:26 AM
Yeah, 3 of the first 4 are timeless classics to me. Only WDADU is just OK. Even so, I'd still take it over the Astonishing.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: krands85 on April 16, 2021, 06:20:09 AM
It's a bit closer than I first thought, as I can kind of match them up fairly similarly: Both batches have one of my absolute favourites - I&W and ATDOE; a great 'second tier' album - Awake and D/T; and a couple of my lower ranked albums each.

My rankings would look something like this:

I&W
ADTOE

Awake
D/T

TA
DT12
FII

WDADU

So although MPs 4 have the lower lows, they also have the higher highs and I voted for them. I&W is just too good on it's own not to vote for! If I was only allowed to take 2 albums to a desert island and my choices were I&W and my least favourite DT album (WDADU) or my #2 and #3 DT albums, I'd probably take the former.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: kirksnosehair on April 16, 2021, 07:12:01 AM
Interesting proposition, but for me not a very difficult decision with one exception.  I put ADTOE up there pretty high in the Dream Theater catalog.  There are only 3 albums of theirs I like more (I&W, SFAM and SDOIT) so it's hard for me to vote against such a brilliant album, but the Mangini group also includes The Astonishing, easily my least favorite, and the self-titled album which I almost never listen to.  They should have titled it, "Dream Theater does Rush"  :lol   


So I have to vote with the majority on this one, Portnoy all the way.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: CDrice on April 16, 2021, 08:19:41 AM
WDADU and Falling into Infinity are nice albums, but still albums I don't really go back to often. Awake is better, but still not one of my favorite and Images and Words is my favorite of theirs along 6DOIT.

Distance Over Time is my favorite album since 6DOIT and ADTOE is not far below.The self-titled didn't age the best for me, but I still listen to it every once in a while. The Astonishing is a bit inconsistent, but it has many cool songs on it.

Ranking wise it'd be something like this I guess
I&W
D/T
ADTOE
The Astonishing
Awake
DT
WDADU
FII

So I went with the Mangini era.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: bosk1 on April 16, 2021, 08:30:10 AM
Images and Words changed everything for me, musically, and I am not alone.  I do not discount that.  But at the end of the day, despite having some of the best songs in their entire discography, it is also inconsistent and has some of their weakest.  Awake is similar, but just a hair below.  FII has some terrific songs as well, but is ultimately one of their weaker albums.  And while I can appreciate WDADU, it is my least favorite.

The Mangini era has three flawless albums, two of which are in my top 4, and a VERY good one that I love dearly in The Astonishing. 

Mangini era easily for me.  Again, the first 4 is a legendary period of music--especially when you look at where they were about to go next with albums 5 and 6.  But going solely off of quality of what I like to listen to, I have to go with the Mangini albums.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: HOF on April 16, 2021, 09:20:16 AM
I'd take those first 4 DT albums over any 4 they've done since.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: darkshade on April 16, 2021, 09:51:38 AM
If you're listening with metal ears, I could see how you'd prefer the Mangini era.

If you're listening with music ears, there is no denying IaW and Awake are some of the best albums ever made by anyone.

The best songs on the other two albums are also pretty great.

Most of the best moments on the Mangini albums were done better on DT's first 4 (8) albums. I'll take any string of 4 albums from their first 10 albums over the last 4 DT albums.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: pg1067 on April 16, 2021, 10:13:03 AM
Well...this is really the KM/DS albums against the four most recent JR albums.

I&W
Awake


DT12
ADTOE
DOT
WDADU



FII





TA


FII drags down the KM/DS group, but TA is a significantly bigger blotch on the JR group's record.  That, coupled with the runaway top 2 being from the MP group, makes this a pretty easy choice.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: emtee on April 16, 2021, 10:23:13 AM
I'd take those first 4 DT albums over any 4 they've done since.

Easily and by a landslide.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: pg1067 on April 16, 2021, 10:25:03 AM
I'd take those first 4 DT albums over any 4 they've done since.

For me, I think SFAM through 8VM probably beats the first four.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Dedalus on April 16, 2021, 10:27:39 AM
Well...this is really the KM/DS albums against the four most recent JR albums.

Exactly. This changes everything in terms of sound, composition, music.

The drummers, well ........... are drummers.   :rollin
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: tofee35 on April 16, 2021, 10:31:48 AM
First 4 Mangini

Man, this was actually tough for me because I like what they've done with Mangini alot, but I prefer Portnoy's style. Neither of these DT eras are my favorite (SFAM to Octavarium reign supreme for me). I've always felt bad for not loving I&W and Awake like most people. I thought it was a "me" problem, but I've recently come clean and accepted that I just don't love the I&W and Awake albums.

-Tof
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 11:38:58 AM
I'd take those first 4 DT albums over any 4 they've done since.

For me, I think SFAM through 8VM probably beats the first four.

This. Scenes From A Memory, Six Degrees, Train of Thought & Octavarium is an almighty four album run - tarnished by Systematic Chaos. That 2nd half is just a slog. Two 15 minute low tempo songs back to back. Yikes.


Quote
Man, this was actually tough for me because I like what they've done with Mangini alot, but I prefer Portnoy's style.

Yeah. if MP hadn't quit and the albums had otherwise stayed the same but with MP drumming on - they'd be slightly better I think. I don't like MP as a person

but I definitely prefer MP as a drummer. He has way more soul - even though he plays pretty much the same things all the time.

MM is a nice guy but gets really Passive Aggressive about his playing and prides himself WAY too much on being a human metronome and being able to have 4 limb independence. Blah blah.

Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: JiM-Xtreme on April 16, 2021, 11:41:26 AM
A pretty easy choice for me. I find the first four Portnoy albums consistently enjoyable (although admittedly, WDADU and FII took a bit longer to grow on me) whereas I largely dislike ADToE and DT12, save for a handful of moments here and there.

And I know this thread isn't necessarily JUST about comparing the drumming, but I have to say I do find MP's approach and style more engaging and enjoyable personally.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: TheCountOfNYC on April 16, 2021, 11:42:47 AM
Mangini’s first four for me. This is aided by ADToE and D/T being my number 4 and 5 DT albums respectively, while for Portnoy’s first four, only IaW ranks in my top 5, plus WDaDU and FII are my number 12 and last place DT albums respectively. I did simple math to figure this out as well. I added up the rankings of each album on my list and whichever number was lower was the winner. So for the MP albums, I did 12+3+7+14 which came out to 36. For the MM albums, I did 4+11+9+5 which came out to 29. That leaves MM’s first four as the winner.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 11:42:58 AM

And I know this thread isn't necessarily JUST about comparing the drumming, but I have to say I do find MP's approach and style more engaging and enjoyable personally.

This too. As I said above - I like MM as a person and I like his playing in DT and live - but he does really get upset when people tell him he plays way more

for the time signature of the song and not the music itself and his bizarre drumming choices.

Like - I was watching an interview with him and he said he designed and setup his ambidextrous kit BEFORE he taught himself how to play 100% ambi lefty.

AND he said his set up DOES make him hurt - in the same interview. It seems everything he does is partly to annoy people who said he shouldn't do it.

BUT - this thread is about the music and i'll take MM's 4 over MPs first four any day.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 11:47:30 AM
Next thread - Charlie Dominici's first album VS James LaBrie's First 14 :neverusethis:
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Setlist Scotty on April 16, 2021, 12:44:15 PM
Goes without saying, for me, the MP albums. Part of that is because of the quality of IaW and Awake, but also because I rank WDaDU far higher than most, and because I have a much deeper connection to that era of the band than the MM era.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 12:55:03 PM
I became a fan during Octavarium. SC was the first NEW album for me then MP left 2 years after that.

So i've been a fan for MM's entire tenure so far so all his albums have been fresh to me and i've experienced them as they came out so it's an easier choice.

It's hard for me to listen to I&W as it's so 90s and as I said Awake just bores me.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Elite on April 16, 2021, 12:56:21 PM
Dream Theater is easily the worst DT album for me, despite having the best Mangini era song (The Enemy Inside).

Images & Words is an all-time favourite, Awake my second favourite DT album and FII would rank top half as well.

MP albums, easily.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 01:00:12 PM
DT12 needed better sounding drums. I think I prefer it over ADTOE - although it's hard to decide.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: geeeemo on April 16, 2021, 01:07:49 PM
It was not that hard for me.  I don't care for WDaDU, even I&W is one I don't listen to as much as the others, even though I like the music.  When I first was discovering DT 5 years ago, Awake really got some play time, but there are a few songs I really don't care for on that one.  FII, I like it the most of those 4 - it sounds like no other record of theirs and I listen to it frequently.
That said.  ADToE is my 2nd fave after Scenes, DT is good, but has IT which is a top 10 song for me, I love TA and D/T is great from top to bottom. 
voted Mangini's First Four
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: HOF on April 16, 2021, 01:32:57 PM
This isn't an MP v MM thing for me. I genuinely don't believe the band have topped the run of I&W through FII (though SFAM is up there as well).
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 01:35:55 PM
This isn't an MP v MM thing for me. I genuinely don't believe the band have topped the run of I&W through FII (though SFAM is up there as well).

Scenes - 6 Degrees - Train of thought - Octavarium.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: HOF on April 16, 2021, 01:50:46 PM
This isn't an MP v MM thing for me. I genuinely don't believe the band have topped the run of I&W through FII (though SFAM is up there as well).

Scenes - 6 Degrees - Train of thought - Octavarium.

I get that people like those albums, but let's just say I thought that SFAM was good but a step down from what came before, and the albums decreased in quality with each successive release.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: IgnotusPerIgnotium on April 16, 2021, 01:50:51 PM
The thing is that most of the songs that you find in the four MP albums are classics and hold up really well in comparison with the first MM era albums. Between ADTOE and DoT I wonder if there are songs that you can count with one hand that are considered 'classics'.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 16, 2021, 01:54:11 PM
Well obviously not yet as the first four albums are over 25 years old. D/T is two years old it hasn't had time to become a classic.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Polarbear on April 16, 2021, 02:02:12 PM
Despite me liking ADTOE quite a bit, and REALLY liking D/T this is still an easy choice!

IaW and Awake are just on a different level.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Enigmachine on April 16, 2021, 03:36:06 PM
Honestly this is kind of difficult, not even necessarily because it's close but I often find it hard for my evaluations of DT albums to be consistent for more than like a month or two. For instance, when I listened to D/T again today, I felt like it's kind of lost its fresh newalbum lustre and really admired A Mind Beside Itself when it was played on the Live Scenes dvd. However, a few months ago, my opinion would've been very much different. I would definitely have to sit with the albums a bit more to give a more accurate opinion with regards to my preferences.

If you're listening with metal ears, I could see how you'd prefer the Mangini era.

If you're listening with music ears, there is no denying IaW and Awake are some of the best albums ever made by anyone.

I'm not sure what this is supposed to mean. WDaDU and Awake are heavier than probably like half of the Mangini era at least (D/T is really the only notably heavy album for the band of that bunch) for one. I also wouldn't say there's no denying, because I could see a perfectly reasonable case for someone thinking that the newer material shows a kind of compositional maturity that's not as present, or takes a different form within the band's earlier albums. Vice versa too, of course. I'm just not a fan of this kind of absolutist language.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: KevShmev on April 16, 2021, 03:46:19 PM
As much as I like the Mangini era, this is not close for me.

The first four have my number 1 DT album (Awake) and my number 3 (Images and Words), and Falling into Infinity is probably in the upper part of my mid tier.  The Astonishing would be the highest for me of the Mangini era and that would be my number 5-7 DT album (dependent on my mood).

Plus, if I had to rank, say, my top 25 DT songs, probably about half would be from those first four albums, while the Mangini era would be lucky to squeeze in more than one or two.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Sebastián Pratesi on April 16, 2021, 05:42:55 PM
The thing is that most of the songs that you find in the four MP albums are classics and hold up really well in comparison with the first MM era albums. Between ADTOE and DoT I wonder if there are songs that you can count with one hand that are considered 'classics'.
They've played "Breaking All Illusions" more times than most songs on Dream & Day, Awake, Falling Into Infinity and Train Of Thought. It's also been played more than any stuff on Six Degrees, Octavarium, Systematic Chaos and Black Clouds. I'd say that one could be considered a classic by now.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Peter Mc on April 16, 2021, 07:56:39 PM
The thing is that most of the songs that you find in the four MP albums are classics and hold up really well in comparison with the first MM era albums. Between ADTOE and DoT I wonder if there are songs that you can count with one hand that are considered 'classics'.
They've played "Breaking All Illusions" more times than most songs on Dream & Day, Awake, Falling Into Infinity and Train Of Thought. It's also been played more than any stuff on Six Degrees, Octavarium, Systematic Chaos and Black Clouds. I'd say that one could be considered a classic by now.

I’m not sure he’s saying there are no classics just that you’d struggle to count them on one hand.

I’d say you’re probably only looking at On The Backs Of Angels and Breaking All Illusions right now as modern classics.  There’s potentially a couple on D/T but a bit too soon to judge.  I really enjoy the Mangini albums by the way, just not sure there are too many big fan favourites on them yet.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Enigmachine on April 17, 2021, 02:13:31 AM
Bridges in the Sky, The Enemy Inside, Illumination Theory, Our New World, Barstool Warrior, S2N, At Wit's End and Pale Blue Dot I'd say are (or have the potential to become) MM era DT classics as well.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Elite on April 17, 2021, 03:05:17 AM
If you're listening with music ears, there is no denying IaW and Awake are some of the best albums ever made by anyone.

eh, what?

and don't get me wrong, Images & Words might very well be my #1 album of all time, a large part of that is due to nostalgia, but your statement doesn't make any sense
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: SleeperAwake on April 17, 2021, 03:10:51 AM
Essentially this is three Top 5 albums vs three Bottom 5 albums for me. With WDADU and D/T being in the middle of the pack.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Peter Mc on April 17, 2021, 03:26:14 AM
Bridges in the Sky, The Enemy Inside, Illumination Theory, Our New World, Barstool Warrior, S2N, At Wit's End and Pale Blue Dot I'd say are (or have the potential to become) MM era DT classics as well.

I did almost put Bridges In The Sky, Illumination Theory and Our New World down and even The Gift Of Music.  Bridges In The Sky was probably closest.  I’m not sure they are big fan favourites though.  Lots of people seem to dislike IT and plenty hate anything off The Astonishing.  Don’t think many people think of The Enemy Inside as a classic either.  Bridges In The Sky is arguable but not sure about the rest.

I agree there’s a few potential classics on DOT but too early to say yet.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kyo on April 17, 2021, 06:35:00 AM
This is a surprisingly hard choice for me. You'd think that "classic DT" would be the easy pick, but WDADU has its obvious flaws, I never cared much for a lot of the material on Awake and FII also has just a few highlights and a lot of forgettable stuff. I&W is untouchable, but ADToE isn't that far off quality-wise and while I do think all of the other three Mangini albums are flawed in some way, that doesn't mean I like them less than Awake or FII overall. Though it needs to be said that having the less compressed HD tracks masters for ADToE and DT12 plus the Blu-ray master of DoT are essential to raise the albums to the audio quality level necessary to compete with the classics.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: darkshade on April 17, 2021, 07:30:03 AM
At best, there's a couple of classics but I struggle to call any Mangini tracks 'classic DT' without it being derivative of MP-era DT.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: KevShmev on April 17, 2021, 07:58:46 AM
Breaking All Illusions seems like the most obvious classic from the Mangini era thus far (played on multiple tours, and always in a prime spot in the set list - last song of a set).  Not my favorite from this era, but it seems like if you had to point to one song, that would be it.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: hunnus2000 on April 17, 2021, 08:18:25 AM
I went with the MM era.

I feel that the first 4 were pretty raw except for FII but I am not as impressed with Awake as others. I like it a lot but I feel the MM era has showcased JLB and JR better.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Trav86 on April 17, 2021, 08:58:55 AM
Images and Words
Awake
A Dramatic Turn of Events
Falling Into Infinity
Distance Over Time
When Dream and Day Unite
Dream Theater
The Astonishing

Portnoy’s first four.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Stadler on April 17, 2021, 09:09:15 AM
Images and Words
Awake
A Dramatic Turn of Events
Falling Into Infinity
Dream Theater
Distance Over Time
When Dream and Day Unite
The Astonishing

But the first two are so far out ahead of the rest, that it's not close.  Other than "This Is The Life", there's nothing that I would say is "classic" in the Mangini era.  I&W is one of my favorite albums of any band ever, and Awake is a worthy successor to that.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Zydar on April 17, 2021, 09:27:28 AM
Images And Words
Awake
Falling Into Infinity
A Dramatic Turn of Events
Distance Over Time
Dream Theater
When Dream And Day Unite
The Astonishing
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: TAC on April 17, 2021, 09:46:16 AM
Images And Words
Awake
A Dramatic Turn Of Events
When Day And Dream Unite
The Astonishing
Dream Theater
Falling Into Infinity


Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: HOF on April 17, 2021, 11:17:22 AM
Awake
Falling Into Infinity
Images And Words
-gap-
When Dream And Day Unite
-gap-
The Astonishing
Dream Theater
-gap-
A Dramatic Turn of Events
Distance Over Time (I’ve only heard a very little bit of this)
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Polarbear on April 17, 2021, 01:03:09 PM
Images and Words
Awake
Falling Into Infinity
Distance Over Time
A Dramatic Turn of Events
When Dream and Day Unite
Dream Theater
The Astonishing
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: TheCountOfNYC on April 17, 2021, 02:53:00 PM
Images and Words
A Dramatic Turn of Events
Distance Over Time
Awake
The Astonishing
Dream Theater
When Dream and Day Unite
Falling Into Infinity
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Volante99 on April 18, 2021, 11:22:05 AM
The first four-  it even close

Images & Words is still their best songwriting, and Awake makes a strong case for having their most inventive, progressive playing.

With the exception of ADoTE, I haven’t really enjoyed the Mangini era except on a very surface level.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 18, 2021, 02:23:03 PM
When Dream & Day Unite V A Dramatic Turn of Events = ADTOE

Images & Words V DT12 = DT12 for me. I like I&W but it's too soft for my tastes. Neither has a good snare sound though.

Awake V The Astonishing = The Astonishing. I enjoy the whole thing whereas Awake bores me after the opening 3 songs.

Falling Into infinity V Distance Over Time = Distance Over Time. I like FII more than most but D/T felt like classic DT from SFAM - Octavarium was back.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: JayOctavarium on April 18, 2021, 02:49:52 PM
Option 1 only because of Images and Awake. I do enjoy them all though.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: hefdaddy42 on April 19, 2021, 06:39:16 AM
This has nothing to do with either drummer (especially since Mangini wasn't even involved with the songwriting on 2 of his 4), but the Portnoy 4 easily.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Architeuthis on April 19, 2021, 11:41:35 AM
I prefer the MM first four.  By that time DT has come a long way as musicians, and Labrie has more freedom to be himself and call the shots on his vocal delivery. 
The band seemed to have a new energy after the somewhat darker vibe of BC&SL and SC. (although I love Systematic Chaos).
 I love all four of the Mangini albums from start to finish.  As far as the MP albums, I love I&W and Awake, but WDADU and FII are my two least favorite DT albums.

On a side note.  I like TA better than SFAM by far! 
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: lovethedrake on April 19, 2021, 10:26:08 PM
First 4 Portnoy.

They could have released 3 albums banging on sticks and scratching chalkboards in addition to Images and Words and it would still be first 4 portnoy.

ADTOE is their worst album also.

I think the three latest are all very good with DOT finally capturing some of the magic of the 90’s but I&W, Awake, and half of FII are classics. 
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: lovethedrake on April 19, 2021, 10:38:28 PM
Bridges in the Sky, The Enemy Inside, Illumination Theory, Our New World, Barstool Warrior, S2N, At Wit's End and Pale Blue Dot I'd say are (or have the potential to become) MM era DT classics as well.

At Wits End and Breaking all Illusions would be the only classics of the mangini era.  I don’t even looooove Breaking all Illusions as I think the vocal melodies are underwhelming but I will concede it as a classic.

Enemy inside is one of my least favorite Dream Theater songs, illumination theory is controversial and far from a classic, pale blue dot the same, S2N is a poor mans version of a SDOIT song.

I think our new world and barstool warrior are widely considered enjoyable but would you really put them up against metropolis, change of seasons, learning to live, spirit carries on, octavarium, take the time, trial of tears, fatal tragedy, SDOIT, etc.....?


Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Architeuthis on April 20, 2021, 01:25:12 AM
Bridges in the Sky, The Enemy Inside, Illumination Theory, Our New World, Barstool Warrior, S2N, At Wit's End and Pale Blue Dot I'd say are (or have the potential to become) MM era DT classics as well.



I think our new world and barstool warrior are widely considered enjoyable but would you really put them up against metropolis, change of seasons, learning to live, spirit carries on, octavarium, take the time, trial of tears, fatal tragedy, SDOIT, etc.....?
Yes I would!  Also add The Bigger Picture,  Illumination Theory,  Behind the Veil, Bridges in the Sky, Moment of Betrayal, Chosen, Ravenskill,  S2N,  Fall Into the Light,  and Pale Blue Dot.  All of those hold up to the older songs you mentioned..
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: WildRanger on April 20, 2021, 01:55:43 AM
I don't get how this could be close at all.
Portnoy's First Four by a long shot and I'm not a big fan of their debut and FII.

Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Enigmachine on April 20, 2021, 02:33:45 AM


At Wits End and Breaking all Illusions would be the only classics of the mangini era.  I don’t even looooove Breaking all Illusions as I think the vocal melodies are underwhelming but I will concede it as a classic.

Enemy inside is one of my least favorite Dream Theater songs, illumination theory is controversial and far from a classic, pale blue dot the same, S2N is a poor mans version of a SDOIT song.

I think our new world and barstool warrior are widely considered enjoyable but would you really put them up against metropolis, change of seasons, learning to live, spirit carries on, octavarium, take the time, trial of tears, fatal tragedy, SDOIT, etc.....?

I mean it kinda depends how strictly we give the measurement for classics. It's fair to say that even some of the ones you listed would be considered just as controversial as Illumination Theory or Pale Blue Dot. I've seen plenty of dissenting opinions on the likes of A Change of Seasons (many consider it disjointed and overblown), Trial of Tears (as a slow 13 min track, you can bet that there are many who'd consider it dull and uneventful) and Six Degrees (same criticisms thrown at ACoS but magnified). Maybe you don't like The Enemy Inside, but it's one of the band's best performing tracks in terms of streaming and hits super hard live. I'm not even personally a massive fan of Our New World but I know it has a strong effect on a lot of people. Also, would certainly put Bridges in the Sky up against all of those, as it's one of my favourite DT tracks and seems to be another fan favourite live.

Also... S2N being a poor man's version of a SDoIT song? I don't know what about it would really be reminding one of that album. The songs that it most closely resembles are probably Take the Time and maybe Surrender to Reason, at a stretch. Possibly The Great Debate but I don't know, even that doesn't really have the same vibe at all.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: geeeemo on April 20, 2021, 07:51:14 AM
It's not a landslide because not everyone loves I&W or Awake. They are very enjoyable (although there are couple songs in Awake I skip which is very rare for a DT album), but I just prefer how they evolved as they went. Ya, I&W was what got them going, but it doesn't make it a favorite because of that. It's all subjective anyway, so a comment of "not understanding how it could even be close", makes no sense to me. Here is my ranking of those 8.

ADTOE
FII
D/T
TA
Awake
DT
I&W

WDaDU (don't really listen to it)

The beauty of DT is that it is so veritable and yet still so DT.


Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Stadler on April 20, 2021, 08:16:11 AM
I prefer the MM first four.  By that time DT has come a long way as musicians, and Labrie has more freedom to be himself and call the shots on his vocal delivery. 
The band seemed to have a new energy after the somewhat darker vibe of BC&SL and SC. (although I love Systematic Chaos).
 I love all four of the Mangini albums from start to finish.  As far as the MP albums, I love I&W and Awake, but WDADU and FII are my two least favorite DT albums.

On a side note.  I like TA better than SFAM by far!

My jury is out as to whether this is a good thing or not.   
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: lovethedrake on April 20, 2021, 09:57:06 AM
It's not a landslide because not everyone loves I&W or Awake. They are very enjoyable (although there are couple songs in Awake I skip which is very rare for a DT album), but I just prefer how they evolved as they went. Ya, I&W was what got them going, but it doesn't make it a favorite because of that. It's all subjective anyway, so a comment of "not understanding how it could even be close", makes no sense to me. Here is my ranking of those 8.

ADTOE
FII
D/T
TA
Awake
DT
I&W

WDaDU (don't really listen to it)

The beauty of DT is that it is so veritable and yet still so DT.

Everybody is welcome to their opinion and there is no right of wrong in music.  However, the current poll is 71-24 and I think that’s likely a good representation of the die hard dream theater fanbase.

It’s funny that your best on the list is my worst by far and your second worst is my best by far, dream theater has certainly always given an inspired effort which is something we can all appreciate no matter the album.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Kotowboy on April 22, 2021, 02:35:19 AM
I don't get how this could be close at all.
Portnoy's First Four by a long shot and I'm not a big fan of their debut and FII.


And therein lies the cognitive bias of the forum.

Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: darkshade on April 22, 2021, 05:15:09 AM
76 - 24 IS a landslide.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: WildRanger on April 22, 2021, 07:43:49 AM
76 - 24 IS a landslide.

As it should be!
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Stadler on April 22, 2021, 08:21:36 AM
I don't get how this could be close at all.
Portnoy's First Four by a long shot and I'm not a big fan of their debut and FII.


And therein lies the cognitive bias of the forum.

How is that cognitive bias?  If he said it WITHOUT data, sure, but the data is backing him up. There's a point where "cognitive bias" becomes "truth".
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: gzarruk on April 22, 2021, 10:15:13 AM
I think nostalgia is also a big factor.

I'd say IAW and Awake are probably ranked higher than most MM era albums, but those last 4 are much more consistent than the first 4, which have WDADU and FII.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: pg1067 on April 22, 2021, 11:04:19 AM
I think nostalgia is also a big factor.

I'd say IAW and Awake are probably ranked higher than most MM era albums, but those last 4 are much more consistent than the first 4, which have WDADU and FII.

Well...three of them are.

While I'm not among them, there are lots of folks who don't view FII as a drop off after Awake.  For those folks, you have a raw debut with a different singer and three straight excellent albums.  As my comment on page 1 indicates, I'd rather have the group that contains two epic albums, one good album and one below average album over a group that contains three good albums and massive stinker.  And yeah...nostalgia certainly plays into it to some degree.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: IgnotusPerIgnotium on April 22, 2021, 11:21:07 AM
I'd say IAW and Awake are probably ranked higher than most MM era albums, but those last 4 are much more consistent than the first 4, which have WDADU and FII.
It's easy to see why. It's about the circumstances and musical position of the band. If we see WDADU and FII as less 'good' albums it's because..well the first it's a debut album -I mean what expectations could anyone have and FII was a notorious album for the band, having a lot of personal issues to deal with as well as conflicts with the label.
The albums that JP produced may be consistent but they are widely considered by many to lack variety and having also some controversial mixing problems. So the MP 4 albums marked a growing period for the band as for the 4 MM albums mark a search for identity.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: hunnus2000 on April 22, 2021, 12:24:24 PM
I think it's as simple as those who prefer MP over MM.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: lovethedrake on April 22, 2021, 12:48:57 PM
I think it's as simple as those who prefer MP over MM.

I don’t think so.... 90’s DT + SDOIT is better than anything since imo but I would take the astonishing and DoT over the last 3 portnoy albums.   

Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: pg1067 on April 22, 2021, 01:28:08 PM
I think it's as simple as those who prefer MP over MM.

I disagree.  The difference has virtually nothing to do with who played drums.  It has much more to do with who played keyboards (KM and DS on the first four versus JR on the most recent four) and a different singer on the debut and the band being in a vastly different stage of its career (new band versus established band with absolute control over what it does).
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Dedalus on April 22, 2021, 02:05:40 PM
I think nostalgia is also a big factor.

I'd say IAW and Awake are probably ranked higher than most MM era albums, but those last 4 are much more consistent than the first 4, which have WDADU and FII.

Well......  considering that I&W is at the highest level of the band's discography, as I do, the other three records are well below. Awake certainly down and WDADU and FII even more.

I always say that and I will repeat it. The first time I heard Awake, after I&W, I was VERY disappointed. Basically I was avid for an I&W part 2.
Today I have changed my mind, but I still think that Awake is not up to the task as a successor to I&W.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: darkshade on April 23, 2021, 04:42:54 AM
but we did eventually get IaW pt 2, and it wasn't anywhere near as good as Awake, which is an underrated prog metal classic now.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: TheCountOfNYC on April 23, 2021, 05:28:15 AM
I think it's as simple as those who prefer MP over MM.

Definitely not. I prefer Portnoy but picked the Mangini albums.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Elite on April 23, 2021, 02:38:47 PM
I think nostalgia is also a big factor.

I'd say IAW and Awake are probably ranked higher than most MM era albums, but those last 4 are much more consistent than the first 4, which have WDADU and FII.

and the last for have the self-titled and TA, the latter of which being an especially divisive album in the fanbase, so what's the point there?

I think it's as simple as those who prefer MP over MM.

No, it's not. A better statement would be preferring having MP or not having him at all, but that statement also doesn't really hold up.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: cfmoran13 on April 25, 2021, 08:31:48 AM
Portnoy's first 4 (or any 4) beat Mangini's first 4.  The mere existence of The Astonishing will keep Mangini's albums from surpassing any other album run DT had.  That album is still unlistenable for me.  Almost 30 years later, I&W is still a beast.  And, although I'm not a huge fan of WDaDU, I'll still take that album over TA.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: pg1067 on April 25, 2021, 12:04:12 PM
Portnoy's first 4 (or any 4) beat Mangini's first 4.  The mere existence of The Astonishing will keep Mangini's albums from surpassing any other album run DT had.  That album is still unlistenable for me.  Almost 30 years later, I&W is still a beast.  And, although I'm not a huge fan of WDaDU, I'll still take that album over TA.

I think I'd take the four MM albums over TOT through BC&SL.  My bottom three are 12. BC&SL; 13. SC; 14. TA.  The presence of BC&SL and SC in that group probably outweighs the presence of TA in the other group.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: hunnus2000 on April 25, 2021, 01:14:23 PM
Portnoy's first 4 (or any 4) beat Mangini's first 4. The mere existence of The Astonishing will keep Mangini's albums from surpassing any other album run DT had.  That album is still unlistenable for me.  Almost 30 years later, I&W is still a beast.  And, although I'm not a huge fan of WDaDU, I'll still take that album over TA.

I get if people don't like things because of personal tastes. But, people truly miss out on moments that shine. MM had some wonderful moments on TA and because some find "unlistenable" they can never know.....
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Elite on April 25, 2021, 01:17:46 PM
Yeah, 'unlistenable' is rubbish in this context.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Enigmachine on April 25, 2021, 01:46:28 PM
Like, I understand why some would consider the album a bit boring or cheesy, cause yeah it's on that more broadway angle and that doesn't appeal to everyone. But... unlistenable? I find it odd that someone who likes Dream Theater generally would hear Dystopian Overture, The Gift of Music and A Better Life and go oh my god, please turn that noise off.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: gzarruk on April 25, 2021, 02:02:12 PM
Like, I understand why some would consider the album a bit boring or cheesy, cause yeah it's on that more broadway angle and that doesn't appeal to everyone. But... unlistenable? I find it odd that someone who likes Dream Theater generally would hear Dystopian Overture, The Gift of Music and A Better Life and go oh my god, please turn that noise off.

All of this and a lot more. Disc 2 alone has Moment of Betrayal and the two-punch The Walking Shadow and My Last Farewell, all classic DT magic.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: TAC on April 25, 2021, 02:12:44 PM
I get that the entirety of TA might be a bit much, but anyone should be able to pick 10-12 tracks that stand up.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: pg1067 on April 25, 2021, 04:26:44 PM
It's not unlistenable, but I've listened to it enough and not found much to latch onto, so I don't really care to go back.

10-12 tracks?  No way.  There's 34 tracks, and 5 are NOMAC tracks, so there's 29 "real" songs.  There's one song that reminded me of a Dregs song that I liked, but after that, there are about 25 songs that just blend together and maybe 2-3 others that I'd actually go out of my way to listen to again.

I respect them for doing it, and I'm happy there are folks who like it.  It just didn't hit with me, and that's ok.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: TAC on April 25, 2021, 05:02:42 PM
Yup, that's ok.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Volante99 on April 26, 2021, 10:30:24 AM
Images & Words
Awake

(gap)

A Dramatic Turn of Events

(big gap)

Falling into Infinity
Distance Over Time
When Dream and Day Unite
Dream Theater
The Astonishing
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: cfmoran13 on April 27, 2021, 11:47:10 AM
When I said "unlistenable", that's obviously just for me.  That's how I feel.  I don't like the album at all.  I tried.  I really did.  I know some people absolutely love it.  I'm happy for them.  I just find it to be very bloated and over-indulgent.  The only song I've listened to from it in the past 3-4 years is "Our New World".  And, it's the version with Lzzy Hale.  Truthfully, I don't really foresee myself ever going back to give it another try.  I simply just don't have the time to dedicate to listen to the entire thing.  It's not like I enjoy being able to say there's an album from DT that I absolutely hate.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: darkshade on April 27, 2021, 06:04:00 PM
When I said "unlistenable", that's obviously just for me.  That's how I feel.  I don't like the album at all.  I tried.  I really did.  I know some people absolutely love it.  I'm happy for them.  I just find it to be very bloated and over-indulgent.  The only song I've listened to from it in the past 3-4 years is "Our New World".  And, it's the version with Lzzy Hale.  Truthfully, I don't really foresee myself ever going back to give it another try.  I simply just don't have the time to dedicate to listen to the entire thing.  It's not like I enjoy being able to say there's an album from DT that I absolutely hate.

I always swap out the Lizzy Hale version of ONW the rare times I whip out The Admonishing. It's just a little bit better, and she kills it like JLB doesn't. She should have done co-lead vocals with JLB on TA, it might have made the album more listenable for me. I can imagine her vocals on the title track. Maybe throw in that guy from the Neal Morse Band (Eric?)
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: geeeemo on April 27, 2021, 06:47:30 PM
When I said "unlistenable", that's obviously just for me.  That's how I feel.  I don't like the album at all.  I tried.  I really did.  I know some people absolutely love it.  I'm happy for them.  I just find it to be very bloated and over-indulgent.  The only song I've listened to from it in the past 3-4 years is "Our New World".  And, it's the version with Lzzy Hale.  Truthfully, I don't really foresee myself ever going back to give it another try.  I simply just don't have the time to dedicate to listen to the entire thing.  It's not like I enjoy being able to say there's an album from DT that I absolutely hate.

I always swap out the Lizzy Hale version of ONW the rare times I whip out The Admonishing. It's just a little bit better, and she kills it like JLB doesn't. She should have done co-lead vocals with JLB on TA, it might have made the album more listenable for me. I can imagine her vocals on the title track. Maybe throw in that guy from the Neal Morse Band (Eric?)

Eh. I was at the show where she performed with DT. Not a fan. You have James beautiful voice and her heavier one. He has a better girl voice then she does!
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Enigmachine on April 28, 2021, 04:49:31 AM
If I remember correctly, Hale is one of those vocalists who, despite being a woman, has a fairly masculine voice, much like Doro or Ida Haukland from Triosphere. Meanwhile, much like Geddy Lee (who I genuinely thought was a woman on my first listen when I didn't know who he was), James is kind of the reverse, having a pretty feminine singing voice for a dude. It's why the combination feels a little off, given that Faythe's lines are generally very demure, which James has the capability of pulling off effectively, much like the Victoria lines in Scenes. There's value in subtlety and having Hale belt out Faythe lines all over the album as she does on the single would've been pretty silly. Honestly, I far prefer the original for that reason, the edit just feels very forced to me. Good singer, but wrong for the song.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: KevShmev on April 28, 2021, 06:06:03 AM
If I remember correctly, Hale is one of those vocalists who, despite being a woman, has a fairly masculine voice, much like Doro or Ida Haukland from Triosphere. Meanwhile, much like Geddy Lee (who I genuinely thought was a woman on my first listen when I didn't know who he was), James is kind of the reverse, having a pretty feminine singing voice for a dude. It's why the combination feels a little off, given that Faythe's lines are generally very demure, which James has the capability of pulling off effectively, much like the Victoria lines in Scenes. There's value in subtlety and having Hale belt out Faythe lines all over the album as she does on the single would've been pretty silly. Honestly, I far prefer the original for that reason, the edit just feels very forced to me. Good singer, but wrong for the song.

Totally agree.  I listened to that version twice and came away unimpressed both times.  It didn't help that the edits were awful (the original is only a little over 4 minutes and taking out little bits here and there was jarring...terrible decision), but every time Hale would sing, I would cringe and pray for the return of JLB.  Not a bad voice, but she did too many inflections that changed the melodies, and not in a good way. Gimme the original any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: Dream Team on April 29, 2021, 08:35:24 AM
Rethinking my position carefully . . . I listen to the MM albums more often because of burnout on the old ones. If I had to rank them:

Images
The Astonishing (VERY difficult to rank, could be 1 or 4)
A Dramatic Turn of Events
When Dream and Day Unite
Dream Theater
Awake
Distance Over Time
Falling Into Infinity

So I guess technically I could have voted for the MM era . . .

Just think, if DT15 is as good as advertised, will we have a vote for the MP5 vs the MM5?  :lol Beating SFAM is a tall task . . .
Title: Re: Portnoy's First Four VS Mangini's First Four
Post by: TheCountOfNYC on April 30, 2021, 12:15:52 PM
Rethinking my position carefully . . . I listen to the MM albums more often because of burnout on the old ones. If I had to rank them:

Images
The Astonishing (VERY difficult to rank, could be 1 or 4)
A Dramatic Turn of Events
When Dream and Day Unite
Dream Theater
Awake
Distance Over Time
Falling Into Infinity

So I guess technically I could have voted for the MM era . . .

Just think, if DT15 is as good as advertised, will we have a vote for the MP5 vs the MM5?  :lol Beating SFAM is a tall task . . .

I think the IaW/Awake/SFaM trio is too much to overcome.