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General => General Discussion => Topic started by: MrBoom_shack-a-lack on July 10, 2019, 02:28:35 AM
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I'm just interested to hear what people think. I'm pretty sure I would get one.
I'll add a follow up question: What factors play in hand for you too consider buying an electric car?
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I'm days away (hopefully) to receive an hybrid car. So I'm gonna go with "no" I guess and accept the hybrid car as a compromise.
I would consider an electric car, but there has to be a widespread, nationwide network of charging posts. No way I'm gonna get a car that gives me headaches to plan trips because I don't know if I can charge it where I'd go.
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I'm days away (hopefully) to receive an hybrid car. So I'm gonna go with "no" I guess and accept the hybrid car as a compromise.
I would consider an electric car, but there has to be a widespread, nationwide network of charging posts. No way I'm gonna get a car that gives me headaches to plan trips because I don't know if I can charge it where I'd go.
Yea that's a big thing for me too.
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For my daily commute (70 km) I can imagine buying an electric car, if I could afford one. Sadly the last time I needed a new car the prices for new electric cars were much too high for my budget and used cars were virtually non-existent.
For any longer trips like working trips, holidays, visiting relatives in other cities etc. there's this to consider:
... there has to be a widespread, nationwide network of charging posts. No way I'm gonna get a car that gives me headaches to plan trips because I don't know if I can charge it where I'd go.
And not only the availability of charging posts is important, maybe even more so the duration for charging your car. If I run low on gas it takes maybe five minutes to fill it up. If I run low on electricity it takes from 30 minutes to several hours, depending on the charging post.
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I'm days away (hopefully) to receive an hybrid car. So I'm gonna go with "no" I guess and accept the hybrid car as a compromise.
I would consider an electric car, but there has to be a widespread, nationwide network of charging posts. No way I'm gonna get a car that gives me headaches to plan trips because I don't know if I can charge it where I'd go.
Just carry a diesel generator in the trunk!
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Just carry a diesel generator in the trunk!
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Coal Powered Turbine... apparently, coal is clean. :laugh:
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Using the Tesla Model 3 as my frame of reference, I'll separate it into dealbreakers and makers
Dealmakers:
1. Performance (Incredible)
2. Range (310 miles) same as my car
3. Recharge time - 15 mins at a super charge station for 180 miles is impressive and workable.
Dealbreakers:
1. Price ($35,000)- My current car is a Toyota corolla. It was 10 years old when I bought it with 50,000 miles and it was $9,000. So an
electric car with (equivalent engine wear/age) would have to come in at around 10 grand for me to bite.
2. Recharging stations- Its getting better, but I would want to see them as ubiquitous as gas stations
3. I have no need for a new car. My work commute is 4 miles on back roads. I barley put 3000 miles on my car a year and rarely even need to
fill the tank. Ultimately, my car is paid off. I need nothing else. But that being said, if I did need a new car and there was a $10,000 dollar
electric car, then I would strongly consider it.
*** On a side note, I am looking to test ride some electric motorycles, such as the Harley Livewire and the Zero brand motorcycles.
Again, the price issue pop up. $30,000 grand for the electric Harley is bullshit and the 90 miles range is not what I need. The Zeros are better at 20 grand which is an easier pill to swallow, but not one I plan to anytime soon. I like them a lot. The power is mental, but its probably gonna be another 10 years for the technology to come down in price to where I'll buy.
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I'm voting yes. If I had the chance I would buy one in a heartbeat. Unfortunately my country doesn't have them and won't have them in the foreseeable future either.
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Probably not. But I never gave it much thought. Bought my current car in 2017 and didn't once consider an electric/hybrid, but that was largely due to cost. Take that out of the equation maybe I'd think differently.
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Using the Tesla Model 3 as my frame of reference, I'll separate it into dealbreakers and makers
Dealmakers:
1. Performance (Incredible)
2. Range (310 miles) same as my car
3. Recharge time - 15 mins at a super charge station for 180 miles is impressive and workable.
Dealbreakers:
1. Price ($35,000)- My current car is a Toyota corolla. It was 10 years old when I bought it with 50,000 miles and it was $9,000. So an
electric car with (equivalent engine wear/age) would have to come in at around 10 grand for me to bite.
2. Recharging stations- Its getting better, but I would want to see them as ubiquitous as gas stations
3. I have no need for a new car. My work commute is 4 miles on back roads. I barley put 3000 miles on my car a year and rarely even need to
fill the tank. Ultimately, my car is paid off. I need nothing else. But that being said, if I did need a new car and there was a $10,000 dollar
electric car, then I would strongly consider it.
*** On a side note, I am looking to test ride some electric motorycles, such as the Harley Livewire and the Zero brand motorcycles.
Again, the price issue pop up. $30,000 grand for the electric Harley is bullshit and the 90 miles range is not what I need. The Zeros are better at 20 grand which is an easier pill to swallow, but not one I plan to anytime soon. I like them a lot. The power is mental, but its probably gonna be another 10 years for the technology to come down in price to where I'll buy.
Yea if there's one car I would be interested in, it's a Tesla 3 but even though that's aimed at the general consumer it's still a hefty price and in Sweden the base model is at $56000. :-\
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Absolutely. Trying to save for one now.
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I'm just interested to hear what people think. I'm pretty sure I would get one.
I'll add a follow up question: What factors play in hand for you too consider buying an electric car?
Yeah, I absolutely would. The only real obstacles right now are price and the technology getting up to par. The technology isn't too much of an issue, because it is getting there in terms of range, ubiquitousness of charging stations, and battery longevity. It's just that it isn't economically feasible right now. They just cost too much. I guess a related secondary factor is the used car market. There aren't many used electrics out there right now, which is huge. I can't even remember the last time I bought a new car, and I don't foresee doing it anytime soon because it just doesn't make economic sense to do so given depreciation. So I guess the bottom line is, once there is enough of a secondary market of used electrics out there at reasonable prices, I don't see how I won't own one.
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I'm just interested to hear what people think. I'm pretty sure I would get one.
I'll add a follow up question: What factors play in hand for you too consider buying an electric car?
Yeah, I absolutely would. The only real obstacles right now are price and the technology getting up to par. The technology isn't too much of an issue, because it is getting there in terms of range, ubiquitousness of charging stations, and battery longevity. It's just that it isn't economically feasible right now. They just cost too much. I guess a related secondary factor is the used car market. There aren't many used electrics out there right now, which is huge. I can't even remember the last time I bought a new car, and I don't foresee doing it anytime soon because it just doesn't make economic sense to do so given depreciation. So I guess the bottom line is, once there is enough of a secondary market of used electrics out there at reasonable prices, I don't see how I won't own one.
Your second point is where I'm at. I won't buy a new car, and to be honest, I don't have much confidence in a used electric.
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a car is a tool to get from point A to point B so I don't care if it runs on the blood of small children if it gets me somewhere
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a car is a tool to get from point A to point B so I don't care if it runs on the blood of small children if it gets me somewhere
You can get the Bathory model, if you can find enough virgins to procure the needed blood to run it ;D
Anyway, as I said, I'm getting an hybrid car, that looks like the immediate future for now. Anyone wanting to be environment conscious with their next car should consider an hybrid model, I don't know how it's doing in the other parts of the world but Toyota seems to be the leading brand when it comes to hybrid cars. I had a drive test for mine and it was so smooth to drive (authomatic gear change).
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Since the question states "that suited your standards..." I took that to mean that things like
there has to be a widespread, nationwide network of charging posts
would be available to suite my standards. Fast charging, afforadability. I mean, I have no attachment to gas cars. I just got a preowned one last year so I'm not in the market, but under these standards I don't see any reason not to buy an electric car.
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I'm going to try to return to this thread tomorrow with some more comments and replies, but I will say for now I'm a solid yes as I'm a Model 3 owner.
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Since the question states "that suited your standards..." I took that to mean that things like
there has to be a widespread, nationwide network of charging posts
would be available to suite my standards. Fast charging, afforadability. I mean, I have no attachment to gas cars. I just got a preowned one last year so I'm not in the market, but under these standards I don't see any reason not to buy an electric car.
This. They don't seem to be anywhere near meeting those standards yet, but when they get there, and I needed a new car, I'd do it.
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Using the Tesla Model 3 as my frame of reference, I'll separate it into dealbreakers and makers
Dealmakers:
1. Performance (Incredible)
2. Range (310 miles) same as my car
3. Recharge time - 15 mins at a super charge station for 180 miles is impressive and workable.
Dealbreakers:
1. Price ($35,000)- My current car is a Toyota corolla. It was 10 years old when I bought it with 50,000 miles and it was $9,000. So an
electric car with (equivalent engine wear/age) would have to come in at around 10 grand for me to bite.
2. Recharging stations- Its getting better, but I would want to see them as ubiquitous as gas stations
3. I have no need for a new car. My work commute is 4 miles on back roads. I barley put 3000 miles on my car a year and rarely even need to
fill the tank. Ultimately, my car is paid off. I need nothing else. But that being said, if I did need a new car and there was a $10,000 dollar
electric car, then I would strongly consider it.
*** On a side note, I am looking to test ride some electric motorycles, such as the Harley Livewire and the Zero brand motorcycles.
Again, the price issue pop up. $30,000 grand for the electric Harley is bullshit and the 90 miles range is not what I need. The Zeros are better at 20 grand which is an easier pill to swallow, but not one I plan to anytime soon. I like them a lot. The power is mental, but its probably gonna be another 10 years for the technology to come down in price to where I'll buy.
Yea if there's one car I would be interested in, it's a Tesla 3 but even though that's aimed at the general consumer it's still a hefty price and in Sweden the base model is at $56000. :-\
I'll say a big yes as the Tesla will likely be my next purchase (4-5 years down the line). $35,000 honestly isn't the real price... go to Tesla's site and actually price one... that $35K is reflecting your projected savings over the first few years (5 or 6 I think). It's more like $40K for the base single motor and the tax credit has been cut in half now. But hey, I paid a little over $47K for my 4Runner so the price-to-performance (my goodness the performance) is well worth it in my opinion.
Evening in my neck of Southwest VA we have Charging stations (actual Tesla stations; including one super-charger); I'm in Abingdon VA and there's a destination station in town (Martha Washington Inn), a Super Charger in Bristol VA 15-miles away, and another Charger in Wytheville VA about 50-miles away. Makes sense for me with the chargers around and I'd likely try it without buying the Tesla brick for the home (maybe when we build).
My business partner has a long-range dual motor Model 3 and the thing is a BEAST... 0-60 in 4.4 seconds (until you've experienced that pickup in an electric, those are just words; threw my head back in the headrest) and curving like a true sports car. Not to mention all the tech that comes with it (yes the autonomous driving is legit and with the most recent update it will give you curb-side pickup). Gas savings are real for sure as Nick can attest to... all in all when compared to other new autos, it's worth it if your driving range is covered in my opinion.
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My first reaction was to say yes but then I rethought the question and I think it should be no for me.
I do not own a car since about 3 or 4 years.
Got rid of the old one because:
- we did not use a car very often
- commuting for work / school is with bicycle (or subway)
- very good communications around where I live (subway, bus, tram, commutertrain and train... even got an airport within biking distance)
- close to car rental when needed
That we got rid of the car was mostly for environmental reasons but I find it nice to not have to worry about what the car will cost in service and repair.
The money we save by not having a car can buy a lot of car rentals and / or taxi rides.
So no I think I would rent one instead....
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I'm days away (hopefully) to receive an hybrid car. So I'm gonna go with "no" I guess and accept the hybrid car as a compromise.
I would consider an electric car, but there has to be a widespread, nationwide network of charging posts. No way I'm gonna get a car that gives me headaches to plan trips because I don't know if I can charge it where I'd go.
Non-Tesla networks have a way to go, but there is NO reason for any reservations on this front with a Tesla, assuming you have some way to charge at home or work. One thing a lot of people seem to fail to grasp is that 95% of charging is going to take place at one of those two places, and Tesla has plenty of superchargers so that you can go anywhere in America on the occasional road trip.
For my daily commute (70 km) I can imagine buying an electric car, if I could afford one. Sadly the last time I needed a new car the prices for new electric cars were much too high for my budget and used cars were virtually non-existent.
Electric cars are getting cheaper than ever, but that said even for a maker that still has a full tax credit (just going off US experience), and even factoring in gas/maintenance savings they still can't compete directly with the cheapest cars and crossovers out there. That said if you're budget allows for mid-size or above 5 year cost to own is going to be very similar, and that's when financially it's hard to say no to them if you test drive them.
Using the Tesla Model 3 as my frame of reference, I'll separate it into dealbreakers and makers
Dealbreakers:
1. Price ($35,000)- My current car is a Toyota corolla. It was 10 years old when I bought it with 50,000 miles and it was $9,000. So an
electric car with (equivalent engine wear/age) would have to come in at around 10 grand for me to bite.
2. Recharging stations- Its getting better, but I would want to see them as ubiquitous as gas stations
3. I have no need for a new car. My work commute is 4 miles on back roads. I barley put 3000 miles on my car a year and rarely even need to
fill the tank. Ultimately, my car is paid off. I need nothing else. But that being said, if I did need a new car and there was a $10,000 dollar
electric car, then I would strongly consider it.
As for #2, I will say again that as long as you're buying a Tesla it's a non-factor.
As for #1 and #3, those are related. You absolutely have to factor in your driving habits in a decision on an electric car in their current form. Their cost to own comes down a huge amount compared to ICE cars the more you drive them. In my position the last three years I've put on over 20k miles a year, and that's going to go up with a recent promotion, so it makes the overall cost to own much better for me.
I'm just interested to hear what people think. I'm pretty sure I would get one.
I'll add a follow up question: What factors play in hand for you too consider buying an electric car?
Yeah, I absolutely would. The only real obstacles right now are price and the technology getting up to par. The technology isn't too much of an issue, because it is getting there in terms of range, ubiquitousness of charging stations, and battery longevity. It's just that it isn't economically feasible right now. They just cost too much. I guess a related secondary factor is the used car market. There aren't many used electrics out there right now, which is huge. I can't even remember the last time I bought a new car, and I don't foresee doing it anytime soon because it just doesn't make economic sense to do so given depreciation. So I guess the bottom line is, once there is enough of a secondary market of used electrics out there at reasonable prices, I don't see how I won't own one.
Your second point is where I'm at. I won't buy a new car, and to be honest, I don't have much confidence in a used electric.
I don't mean to be a total Tesla fanboy, as I'm a fan of the technology at large, but along with the supercharger network another huge Tesla advantage is their battery technology. The biggest strike against the biggest non-Tesla electric car, the Nissan Leaf, was how awful its battery degradation was. Tesla meanwhile has lots of old S and X vehicles with hundreds of thousands of miles and very little range loss. I'm not saying that many new cars coming out today won't be able to match that, but when it comes to the used market I'd only trust a Tesla, and they of course hold their value a lot better and are thus a lot more expensive.
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But you're kind of making my personal argument for me. I don't want electric cars to be the transportation equivalent of "hey are you on PC or Mac?" or "iPhone or Android?" It shouldn't matter. If I'm driving a Dodge, Volvo, BMW, VW, Toyota, Acura or Yugo, I take the EXACT SAME GAS NOZZLE and shove it in my fuel hole.
It might be fine for a single person with one car to do these things, but I literally have between four and six cars in my driveway at any one time. Do I REALLY need to have six different charging networks - and therefore six different charging stations - in my home/work? Tha fuck if I'm going to do the "rooting through computer bag for appropriate charging cord before I plug my car in" nonsense.
Do I have that wrong?
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But you're kind of making my personal argument for me. I don't want electric cars to be the transportation equivalent of "hey are you on PC or Mac?" or "iPhone or Android?" It shouldn't matter. If I'm driving a Dodge, Volvo, BMW, VW, Toyota, Acura or Yugo, I take the EXACT SAME GAS NOZZLE and shove it in my fuel hole.
It might be fine for a single person with one car to do these things, but I literally have between four and six cars in my driveway at any one time. Do I REALLY need to have six different charging networks - and therefore six different charging stations - in my home/work? Tha fuck if I'm going to do the "rooting through computer bag for appropriate charging cord before I plug my car in" nonsense.
Do I have that wrong?
Just get a giant tesla coil to charge all your 6 future e-cars, problem solved!
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As someone who spends upwards of $300 a month on fuel to get to and from work, I'd love an electric car.
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As someone who spends upwards of $300 a month on fuel to get to and from work, I'd love an electric car.
damn. I spentd about 30 bucks a week for work commute on gas, throw another tank for the month for other use (30 bucks is about a tank for me in NJ) I'd put myself around $150 a month for gas.
But you're kind of making my personal argument for me. I don't want electric cars to be the transportation equivalent of "hey are you on PC or Mac?" or "iPhone or Android?" It shouldn't matter. If I'm driving a Dodge, Volvo, BMW, VW, Toyota, Acura or Yugo, I take the EXACT SAME GAS NOZZLE and shove it in my fuel hole.
It might be fine for a single person with one car to do these things, but I literally have between four and six cars in my driveway at any one time. Do I REALLY need to have six different charging networks - and therefore six different charging stations - in my home/work? Tha fuck if I'm going to do the "rooting through computer bag for appropriate charging cord before I plug my car in" nonsense.
Do I have that wrong?
I don't know, do electric cars have a standard plug for the car? I would hope so for not just home use but for public charging stations. As for home, I'd imagine once this becomes normal, houses will be built with charge ports and you could probably get a unit for your house that has 6 dongles or whatever for all your vehicles.
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No. I can afford one, but don't need or want one. I live a half mile from work. My 2015 Camaro ZL1 gets me from A to B just fine. :lol
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As someone who spends upwards of $300 a month on fuel to get to and from work, I'd love an electric car.
damn. I spentd about 30 bucks a week for work commute on gas, throw another tank for the month for other use (30 bucks is about a tank for me in NJ) I'd put myself around $150 a month for gas.
Keep in mind that I work 7 days a week, so I'm commuting Saturdays and Sundays too.
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But you're kind of making my personal argument for me. I don't want electric cars to be the transportation equivalent of "hey are you on PC or Mac?" or "iPhone or Android?" It shouldn't matter. If I'm driving a Dodge, Volvo, BMW, VW, Toyota, Acura or Yugo, I take the EXACT SAME GAS NOZZLE and shove it in my fuel hole.
It might be fine for a single person with one car to do these things, but I literally have between four and six cars in my driveway at any one time. Do I REALLY need to have six different charging networks - and therefore six different charging stations - in my home/work? Tha fuck if I'm going to do the "rooting through computer bag for appropriate charging cord before I plug my car in" nonsense.
Do I have that wrong?
Well you certainly have some valid points. The issue is gas is easy to get into a car, it's literally a hole and a hose if you break it down to its simplest, and not exactly much harder at its toughest. When electricity is delivered, especially when jumping to level 2 and VERY much so when going to level 3 and above it requires some very specialized equipment. Jumping off Tesla for a moment I will say with any electric vehicle you can get an adapter or three and basically be set to charge a non-Tesla at almost any non-Tesla station, but it'll be awhile before it's as simple as gas in that particular regard. The EU has been good about getting a standard going and they will almost certainly beat the US to the punch in having electric cars and charging on a universal format.
And just because I have to say it, get a Model 3 and you won't worry much about what other cars are there. :D
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I drove a fully electric vehicle for the first time in my life today. The harley Livewire
Loved the experience and I am totally sold on electric vehicles now. If the prices were lower, then I wouldn't mind switching tomorrow.
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I drove a fully electric vehicle for the first time in my life today. The harley Livewire
Loved the experience and I am totally sold on electric vehicles now. If the prices were lower, then I wouldn't mind switching tomorrow.
Oh cool, never heard about that bike. Saw sometime ago someone reviewing a commuter bike, I think it was the Zero FXS. He said it was the best bike he ever used in city, it just floored anything.
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So was seriously considering a Tesla. Test drove yesterday. But then started asking people's opinions and a vast majority of people seem pretty adamant I don't but a Tesla. Now I'm kind of bummed out. The most popular reasons seem to be:
1. Elon is a dick. Don't support him.
2. Cars are unreliable and rushed to completion so probably won't last long.
3. Insurance expensive
4. There were a bunch of bugs in an update last fall that kept some people from using their cars until they were fixed
Any thoughts? Should I abandon the dream? No other electric car that I've seen is close to the Tesla, and wouldn't be worth it to get at all.
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So was seriously considering a Tesla. Test drove yesterday. But then started asking people's opinions and a vast majority of people seem pretty adamant I don't but a Tesla. Now I'm kind of bummed out. The most popular reasons seem to be:
1. Elon is a dick. Don't support him.
2. Cars are unreliable and rushed to completion so probably won't last long.
3. Insurance expensive
4. There were a bunch of bugs in an update last fall that kept some people from using their cars until they were fixed
Any thoughts? Should I abandon the dream? No other electric car that I've seen is close to the Tesla, and wouldn't be worth it to get at all.
1. wouldn't bother me in the least; who cares if he's a dick? And does that mean since T. Boone Pickens was a nice guy we should now use more gasoline?
3. is what it is; even some gasoline powered cars are a bear to insure. That can, in some cases, be shopped.
2. and 4. would be the big deal breakers for me, at least until we have a secondary network of experts and repair shops to supplement/replace the dealerships. I think some here - El Barto comes to mind - that have what are deemed "expensive" cars have found that finding an off-dealer technician that knows their vehicles can provide better-than-dealer quality service at sometimes a fraction of the price. And this doubly so after talking with my step-son and hearing his experiences as a technician at two major dealerships in the area (including BMW, who is pushing their electric/hybrid lines).
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Right. And I can totally understand 2 and 4 being real concerns. It's just fascinating to me. Everyone I know that owns one, adores it. But then a vast majority of people that don't own them, think they are incredibly flawed and not worth it. Of course as with any car, only people who like them will buy them, but this case in particular seems so polarizing.
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I'm not sure "incredibly flawed and not worth it" is really accurate though; I've come about my "strategy" for cars based on 35 years of experience. I don't limit this to "electric cars", either. It's rare, but there are developments with respect to combustion engines that fall into this category as well. I just know at this point that I don't want to have to rely on a dealership for my vehicle, whatever that vehicle is.
I also drive a 2006 vehicle by choice (though my wife's car is a 2016).
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That totally makes sense. And this has me wondering if it's just a difference in what we find value in, or if I'm legitimately doing something dumb by considering buying one. That's my biggest concern.
Also sorry for trying to take over this thread. lol Thought it had some good info in it already.
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I dunno. I just find that reviews or criticisms of a product by someone who has never owned or tried the product to be of VERY limited value. I'm just not sure you learn much about the product in question from someone who won't buy it based on some principle or the other.
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Right. And most of the criticism comes from new articles and reviews posted online. Not to say those are completely worthless, after all, that's all we have to go with without buying one for ourselves. But at the same time, it is something where people assume the worst, and the news loves to portray new technology in a bad light.
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That totally makes sense. And this has me wondering if it's just a difference in what we find value in, or if I'm legitimately doing something dumb by considering buying one. That's my biggest concern.
Also sorry for trying to take over this thread. lol Thought it had some good info in it already.
Personally? I think it's value. My step-son just bought a car - 1988 if memory serves - with about 400,000 miles on it for $150, and he bought it in part because he did much of the service on it (while working for the dealership) and knew that the owner did EVERY service through the dealer since she bought it from the dealer, and actually saved most of the documentation. So for her - and, indirectly with him - it was worth it to bring the car into the dealer on a regular basis for all her service needs.
But I grew up with a dad that (before he got sick) did all his own work on his cars. To me it was a badge of honor that you do your own oil changes and brakes. We're at the point now that I've taxed my knowledge on some things (on my 2006, I can do the front brakes, not the rear, go figure) and so I want someone who is up on new technology. Having said that, I also know that I personally get no value, either in comfort or risk management, from paying the premium to the dealer. In fact, I often feel the opposite, but I'm honoring my feelings, not any grand truth. Some of the techs at dealerships are literally walking experts on the vehicles they service.
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1. Elon is a dick. Don't support him.
2. Cars are unreliable and rushed to completion so probably won't last long.
3. Insurance expensive
4. There were a bunch of bugs in an update last fall that kept some people from using their cars until they were fixed
I will respond more to this on FB, but want to hit the big points here:
1. I mean, I get why Elon has a reputation, some deserved, some not. If you don't like certain things about him and are going to not buy the associated brand that's up to you. I personally don't like the Chick-Fil-A loose association with charities I don't like but I still happily eat their chicken. In basically any organization, especially one of size your money will indirectly go to people and things you don't like.
2. The early production Model 3s had some issues, but otherwise this is mostly untrue. The biggest problem Tesla has, by far, is service, especially near end of quarter, but all their available products are now very solid.
3. This is always going to vary by state and company, but I shopped around a bit, stayed with the company I already had (Traveler's), and went from a 2017 car worth ~35k when bought to a 50k Model 3 and pay an extra ~$100/year. So hardly expensive to insure in my case.
4. Unfortunately in a software laden car bugs can happen, and one did screw me over pretty hard once, but the problem with Tesla reporting is that every rare case tends to get reported and overblown. This is why you hear about Tesla fires all the time if you follow news closely even though they are FAR less likely to have fires than their gas counterparts. I do believe last fall a few people did have to have cars towed to service centers, but it wasn't widespread. By far the biggest issue for me that they STILL haven't fixed is that sometimes when you go into reverse the screen goes black for 5 or more seconds before displaying the backup camera.
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Stadler, you're right. Different people find value in different things. I don't like driving. Most of the time it feels boring and like a waste of time. I see owning a Tesla and having access to its tech as a way to make the driving experience a lot more fun. That's a huge value to me, and probably a lot more than the average person considering I see zero point in upgrading my car to some low end luxury vehicle otherwise.
And thanks, Nick! The only huge concern with out of that list is 4. If I decide to go Tesla, I just have to be aware that something like that might happen. That's how I usually live, putting a bit more trust into technology, knowing that it might just glitch out sometimes.
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I don't think I would ever buy an Electric Car unless the prices became much more equivalent to their gas powered counterparts, they had range upwards of 400 miles, and charging took little more time than filling up a gas powered car (if it took 10-15 minutes to fully charge I would be on board). Since I don't see all of this happening in my lifetime, I doubt I will ever buy one.
As an aside, I believe Electric Cars are more of a stopgap until someone finally perfects hydrogen powered cars (or rather the efficient production and storage of hydrogen fuel). Honda, Toyota, and Hyundai all have ones that work, but haven't really taken off and I'm not really sure why. I mean I know why, it has to do with the way hydrogen fuel is being made, which I believe requires natural gas (which isn't renewable) or some kind of thermochemical process (which is extremely expensive). Once they figure that out, hydrogen may be the only cars we drive.
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I don't think I would ever buy an Electric Car unless the prices became much more equivalent to their gas powered counterparts, they had range upwards of 400 miles, and charging took little more time than filling up a gas powered car (if it took 10-15 minutes to fully charge I would be on board). Since I don't see all of this happening in my lifetime, I doubt I will ever buy one.
So much of this has already happened, and it really shows the misconceptions people have about electric cars.
If you do 15,000 miles or more a year the 5-year cost to own on a SR+ Model 3 is likely going to beat a comparable Honda Accord, Ford Fusion, or Toyota Corolla. Yeah, we need a bigger market or available cars that do this, but one big example is already on the streets. Just comparing sticker prices is worthless when comparing gas and electric vehicles.
Charging speed you again have to go with Tesla, but people have to realize if you can charge at work or home then top charging speed won't matter for 95% of your driving. You don't stop somewhere special to charge in most cases, and again, Tesla has shown that when you have to the network can be put in place. The current network is mostly V2, and their newer faster V3 is rolling out, but even as it is now, the last time I stopped here was my experience: Plugged in car, walked to deli in shopping center, was immediately waited on, ordered food, ate food, returned to car in under a half hour. In that time the car had added 160 miles of range, which was over double what I actually needed to get home. Again, you just can't compare gas to electric using only gas rules.
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Honest question: Does the battery (do the batteries) have memory? Is there long term risk to continual partial charging?
Look, I'm not arguing against electric; I think there are absolutely applications that make sense now (not every driver is like me, who will hop in the car and drive 250 miles - or more - without blinking an eye) and I do not disagree even a little bit with the degree of misinformation out there, but I'm not sure what you mean by "you just can't compare gas to electric using only gas rules." Unless I'm misunderstanding you, isn't that the base problem, that most people ARE going to compare using only gas rules? That's a human condition, not anything more nefarious; look at the different (but certainly related) issue of alternate energy. The amount of misinformation with respect to solar, wind and nuclear vis-a-vis electricity generated from fossil fuels is mind-boggling. To me it's not much different. Why this country doesn't get at least 50% of it's energy now from nuclear makes me scratch my head till it bleeds.
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It's actually the opposite. There's a risk to continual full charging. That tends to degrade the batteries faster, so they recommend a vast majority of the time you don't charge to 100%. Apparently that's the reason cell phone batteries die quickly too. Since you're charging them to 100% daily.
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It's actually the opposite. There's a risk to continual full charging. That tends to degrade the batteries faster, so they recommend a vast majority of the time you don't charge to 100%. Apparently that's the reason cell phone batteries die quickly too. Since you're charging them to 100% daily.
Oh the days when a cellphone battery used to last 3 days instead of 8 hours.
Based on what I read online, the batteries have gotten much better and after a couple of years of use, the battery might lose less than 5% of its power at most. So instead of 320 miles per charge, you would do 304 miles.
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It's actually the opposite. There's a risk to continual full charging. That tends to degrade the batteries faster, so they recommend a vast majority of the time you don't charge to 100%. Apparently that's the reason cell phone batteries die quickly too. Since you're charging them to 100% daily.
Oh the days when a cellphone battery used to last 3 days instead of 8 hours.
Based on what I read online, the batteries have gotten much better and after a couple of years of use, the battery might lose less than 5% of its power at most. So instead of 320 miles per charge, you would do 304 miles.
McSorley's (my favorite bar) is 317 miles away from me. Electric car: OUT. :)
(I'm joking of course. McSorley's is 132 miles from my house. ;) )
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It's actually the opposite. There's a risk to continual full charging. That tends to degrade the batteries faster, so they recommend a vast majority of the time you don't charge to 100%. Apparently that's the reason cell phone batteries die quickly too. Since you're charging them to 100% daily.
There's a chance I'm incorrect here, but I've been charging batteries and putting them under tremendous loads for almost 20 years now. The golden rule, and this goes for nickel-cadmium, nickel metal hydride, and lithium-ion polymer batteries, has always been to never over-discharge your cells. You can peak charge them as often as you want (and should if being used often), but as soon as you start letting the juice get too low, you begin to run a serious risk of damage and failure. Doing so prevents a process from sulfation from occurring and greatly extends the life of the battery.
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It's actually the opposite. There's a risk to continual full charging. That tends to degrade the batteries faster, so they recommend a vast majority of the time you don't charge to 100%. Apparently that's the reason cell phone batteries die quickly too. Since you're charging them to 100% daily.
There's a chance I'm incorrect here, but I've been charging batteries and putting them under tremendous loads for almost 20 years now. The golden rule, and this goes for nickel-cadmium, nickel metal hydride, and lithium-ion polymer batteries, has always been to never over-discharge your cells. You can peak charge them as often as you want (and should if being used often), but as soon as you start letting the juice get too low, you begin to run a serious risk of damage and failure. Doing so prevents a process from sulfation from occurring and greatly extends the life of the battery.
I can only go by what Tesla/Elon Musk have said when it comes to car batteries, but you're only supposed to charge to 90% daily at most. On Tesla cars the charging screen even has a section for daily charging (50-90%), and trip charging (90-100%), to underscore the point that you shouldn't be charging to 100% every day.
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It's actually the opposite. There's a risk to continual full charging. That tends to degrade the batteries faster, so they recommend a vast majority of the time you don't charge to 100%. Apparently that's the reason cell phone batteries die quickly too. Since you're charging them to 100% daily.
Oh the days when a cellphone battery used to last 3 days instead of 8 hours.
To be fair, those were the days without powerful and bright displays, and apps who require more processing power than the computers that sent a man to the moon.
It's easier to last 3 days when the most energy consuming thing you do is playing an 8-bit version of Worms or the equivalent.
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Ordered the wall connector and going to buy the car today. Good luck to me!
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It's actually the opposite. There's a risk to continual full charging. That tends to degrade the batteries faster, so they recommend a vast majority of the time you don't charge to 100%. Apparently that's the reason cell phone batteries die quickly too. Since you're charging them to 100% daily.
Oh the days when a cellphone battery used to last 3 days instead of 8 hours.
To be fair, those were the days without powerful and bright displays, and apps who require more processing power than the computers that sent a man to the moon.
It's easier to last 3 days when the most energy consuming thing you do is playing an 8-bit version of Worms or the equivalent.
Yeah, those essential Snapgram filters burn some electrons. ;) :) :)
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This thread is in need of some pictures and thoughts from someone. :D
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I'm trying to be a low-key Tesla owner. Thanks, Nick. :lol
Yeah, so I decided to buy the car, and took delivery on Friday. So far it's been a wonderful experience to drive. Luckily my car arrived with no issues, and I haven't had any yet (knock on wood). It was raining on the day I got it, so sadly no immaculately clean car to start off. The only really interesting thing is that I asked multiple people multiple times if my car would have the Pedestrian Warning System installed. For those that don't know, electric vehicles are so quiet that the US made a law that EVs made after a certain date have to have a speaker to make noise when the car is moving forward and backward at low speed. While I do think that will improve safety, it is kind of lame. An almost silent car is one of the coolest things about owning an EV imo. But when I got my car, turns out it didn't have it installed. So that's a bonus!
I'm not trying to flaunt the car or anything. I know it's a bit dumb for me to be concerned with stuff like this, but like I said earlier, there's so much baggage with Tesla and most people my age think the car is cringey to have, it's a slight status symbol, etc. Not looking forward to facing the multiple people that told me not to get it.
But that aside, the car has been so much fun to drive. It's made my commute more bearable. Haven't done any long trips yet, but I did go to a super charger to try that out. Was really easy. Really looking forward to not buying gas again or getting an oil change any time soon.
Here are a couple pics as requested.
(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/373532705943584772/627645093935054898/IMG_20190928_181512.jpg)
(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/373532705943584772/627645095797063741/IMG_20190928_181553.jpg)
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Awesome! :) :tup
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Cool and the gang!
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That's pretty cool, the dash seems so empty though with everything on the screen. Not an complaint, just something that sticks out to me and different.
I'd be interested in following up on you new tesla owners in 6-8 years. Not that I have doubts, but just out of curiosity of how the new sales are still holding up. I use that time frame as that's my typical life cycle of going through a car and would probably align with me getting my next vehicle which maybe by then I'll go a Tesla or similar route.
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I'm trying to be a low-key Tesla owner. Thanks, Nick. :lol
Haven't done any long trips yet, but I did go to a super charger to try that out. Was really easy.
Glad I was here to save the day. :D
I have to say, the simplicity of the supercharging was so much I almost couldn't comprehend it when I first went. I kinda looked the charger up and down looking for someplace to enter my card info or some identifying information about my car. But of course all you do is plug in and you're done.
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James May reviews his own cars – Tesla Model S vs Toyota Mirai (http://youtube.com/watch?v=GaIW5CQQ3Zo)