DreamTheaterForums.org Dream Theater Fan Site
General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: KevShmev on May 15, 2018, 05:02:30 PM
-
You can vote for up to 6.
I went with:
Your Wildest Dreams
Gemini Dream
The Voice
Magic
Drive
So Far Away
-
Walk of Life is one of the worst songs ever, and I don't really care for any of the other Dire Straits songs listed.
Livin' on a Prayer is the only Bon Jovi song I actively go out of my way to listen to, so I voted for it. The others listed are ok, but I wouldn't call them favorites by any means.
I don't know any of the Moody Blues songs listed.
I voted for Since You're Gone and Magic. I didn't like any of the other Heartbeat City songs (and particularly not the other two listed.
I think this is a particularly weak RRHOF class. I don't have enough familiarity with the Moody Blues or with Dire Straits pre-Brothers in Arms material to have much of an opinion, but I would not have considered either the Cars or Bon Jovi to be worthy. Bon Jovi, in particular, is problematic because I think you could make an argument that, if Bon Jovi is worthy, then so are bands like Def Leppard, Motley Crue and Poison.
-
I picked these:
Telegraph Road
Brothers in Arms
(Dire Straits are a very good and underrated band)
The Voice
Your Wildest Dream
Shake It Up
Drive
None of Bon Jovi songs (They blow and the fact they were inducted in the RnRHoF before Judas Priest is fuckin' travesty)
-
Telegraph Road and Brothers in Arms.
I don't care for, or don't know, all other tracks in here.
-
All the Bon Jovi songs. It's the only band out of the four I listen.
-
Dire Straits - Brothers In Arms (Side two of BiA - songs 6 through 9 on the CD - is perhaps the most perfect album side ever)
Bon Jovi - Wanted Dead or Alive (one of the best guitar solos in the history of rock; yes, up there with Comfortably Numb)
All of the Cars songs (though, like HBO and the Hall broadcast, you left off "Moving In Stereo", the soundtrack to one of the best movie scenes of all time, at least if you're a teenage boy going through puberty).
-
Not a fan of Dire Straits but Money For Nothing is a defining song for 80's MTV music. In the intro with Sting singing "I want my MTV" along with the keys & drums coming to a crescendo, you'd think it would go into something more powerful than the opening riff.
Not a fan of The Moody Blues either.
I have a lot of respect for the Cars. The carved their own niche and influence many bands today.
Bon Jovi is just good, straight up, rock 'n roll. They get lumped in with the hair bands of the 80's but to me they're much better than the hair bands of the 80's because their song structures are solid and they know how to write a great hook/chorus.
-
All the Bon Jovi songs. It's the only band out of the four I listen.
-
Bon Jovi blow, as has been stated, and I know like 2 Moody Blues songs.
Dire Straits - So Far Away
Dire Straits - Money for Nothing
Dire Straits - Walk of Life
The Cars - Since You're Gone
The Cars - Magic
The Cars - Drive
-
I went with:
Telegraph Road
You Give Love A Bad Name
Livin' On A Prayer
Wanted Dead Or Alive
You Might Think
Since You're Gone
-
All the Bon Jovi and Brothers In Arms.
-
Dire Straits never resonated with me, though the Money For Nothing video was probably in my all time top 10 back in the day. But it was in the "Sledgehammer" category... a video I loved and a song I never liked enough to listen to on the radio or any other way without watching the video.
Good selection of Bon Jovi songs except for I'll Be There For You.
Really liked Your Wildest Dreams, great song, moving lyrics.
You Might Think is the only Cars song on the list I can vote for in good conscience.
Walk of Life is one of the worst songs ever....
But the video is cool, or at least is was 30 years ago when I saw it last.
...you left off "Moving In Stereo", the soundtrack to one of the best movie scenes of all time, at least if you're a teenage boy going through puberty).
I thought that too but that album was released prior to 1980 (note the subject of the thread).
-
Walk of Life is one of the worst songs ever....
But the video is cool, or at least is was 30 years ago when I saw it last.
When I first saw your post, I thought the video was just a performance video with a bunch of doofy looking guys with bad Miami Vice style suits and dumb looking headbands (the barefoot guy with the acoustic guitar looks particularly stupid). I took a quick look at the video and didn't at all remember that it had a bunch of 80s sports footage. I guess it's ok to watch on mute, but that's about it.
-
I never cared for Money for Nothing that much. Even as a 12-year old, the "I want my MTV" opening sounded a bit too pandering.
...you left off "Moving In Stereo", the soundtrack to one of the best movie scenes of all time, at least if you're a teenage boy going through puberty).
I thought that too but that album was released prior to 1980 (note the subject of the thread).
Yep, yep.
-
(the barefoot guy with the acoustic guitar looks particularly stupid).
Jack Sonni. Agreed. (Though he's a Uconn guy - well, a drop-out, but still - so can't be all that bad.)
-
brother in arms is by a massive margin the best song here, lol
-
brother in arms is by a massive margin the best song here, lol
This.
I chose
Brothers In Arms
Telegraph Road
So Far Away
Money For Nothing
Why only (/mostly) include songs from Brothers In Arms? At least Tunnel Of Love should have been here.
I liked some other songs on this list, but these 4 are top notch for me, the others are good. I would have picked Nights In White Satin though.
-
Since Bon Jovi is somehow winning... what is everyone's opinion on them?
They meant a lot to me, and I went with them though a rollercoaster of emotions.
When I was a young kid, Bon Jovi was absolutely my first exposure to foreign music, and somehow heavy music. Until then it was just whatever the radio at home or in the car with parents was passing, Bon Jovi was the first stepping stone, in 1994, to eventually become a metalhead by discovering Iron Maiden the year later.
So of course at the beginning I ADORED Bon Jovi. Then eventually I became a metalhead and as a teen I went through my "death to false metal" phase, and so screw Bon Jovi, they're posers, they're too much commercial!!!
Then eventually growing up and reaching let's call it musical maturity, I appreciated Bon Jovi for what it was, not because of trends or expectations, and I also managed to understand better their lyrics as a side note, having learnt better the language by then :lol
Then of course it started the downward spiral of Bon Jovi, with albums sounding all the same. This is my main frustration with Bon Jovi, the waste of talent. They had the charismatic singer of a lifetime. The voice was there. The talent was there. The showmanship was there. The killer vocalist / guitarist duo was there. After achieving success in the second half of their carrer they could have done everything, they could have become minor Springsteens, but no, they chose to do over and over and over the same album of short songs with mandatory love ballads and the generic "feel good, everything's gonna be fine" upbeat track that would please your father and grandmother.
They could have been so much more, but they were always too tied to the commercial rules (see also the tracklist of the albums... always, always the singles at the beginning. Dry County should have closed Keep the Faith, FFS). They are great.... but they could have been so much greater to me. And by now Bon Jovi's voice looks shot, he barely moves around on stage, search for a random clip of him performing recently and then watch Joey Tempest performing The Final Countdown in recent years to see the HUGE difference (just to make a comparison with another singer who broke big in 1986).
-
Jon Bon Jovi is in his mid 50's now, so I am not going to give him too much crap about not being as active on stage. Trust me, it is harder as you get older to move like you did when you were younger. :lol :lol
As for the band itself, I liked them in the 80's, but can't say they were a favorite. I thought Runaway and You Give Love a Bad Name, their first two songs I knew, were okay, but then loved Livin' on a Prayer and Wanted Dead or Alive. I then got the Slippery When Wet on cassette and liked most of it. Some nice deep cuts on there. The New Jersey hits were spotty for me. I loved Lay Your Hands on Me and Born to Be My Baby, hated Bad Medicine. The only post-80s songs I can think of are Blaze of Glory, which is good, and It's My Life, which I always thought was one of their best hits. But even the songs I liked back then, I literally never listen to now. Even the couple songs I throw on my 80's playlist tend to get the skip button when they randomly come on.
Livin' on a Prayer has the Pour Some Sugar on Me syndrome now in that I have heard it a million times, so I don't need to hear it ever again, although Livin' is a much better song.
-
I saw them as an opener, and they were very good, not earth shattering.
I know for me, some of it is catchy, and I agree on the talent - the guitar solo in "Wanted Dead Or Alive" is one of my top five of all time - but I think they got to a point that the incredible "drive" and "vision" of Jon morphed from being "Springsteen" into being "Jon Bon Jovi, Inc." He's made so much about how "Bon Jovi is a corporation, and I'm CEO!" that it can't help but creep into the music. Are you REALLY going to jeopardize your hundred million dollar business to put out your version of "The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway" or "Music From... The Elder" or "Some Kind Of Monster"? I don't think so.
So even if I give them the benefit of the doubt and say it's not formula, or by the numbers, I think it's not a stretch to say that they are "safe". I don't mind safe - some of my favorite bands are probably equally "safe" (Night Ranger, Cheap Trick, Ozzy at this point, AC/DC... we don't all need to be Neil Young) - we should at least be honest about their place in music history.
-
Are you REALLY going to jeopardize your hundred million dollar business to put out your version of "The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway" or "Music From... The Elder" or "Some Kind Of Monster"? I don't think so.
I'd love to hear Bon Jovi's "The Astonishing" penned by Jon and Ritchie at their peak. And I hate that Dry County is the oddest song in their catalog.
Of course you're right from a commercial point of view, but if DT found the courage to do The Astonishing and Judas Priest found the courage to do Nostradamus, Bon Jovi could have as well be more daring. Or maybe they never felt the need to do so, and Jon got everything "unusual" he wanted when he did his solo album (whose most famous song is Blaze of Glory, but the better track is by far Santa Fe... I really love that song, and it shows that Jon has a bit of an epic side to him, that I wish he'd have explored more).
I regret however never seeing them live. Probably now it's too late, without even Ritchie there, and with Jon's voice struggling, but 10 years ago or so I bet I would have enjoyed the hell in seeing a stadium concert from the first foreign and heavy-ish band I ever listened to.
-
Are you REALLY going to jeopardize your hundred million dollar business to put out your version of "The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway" or "Music From... The Elder" or "Some Kind Of Monster"? I don't think so.
I'd love to hear Bon Jovi's "The Astonishing" penned by Jon and Ritchie at their peak. And I hate that Dry County is the oddest song in their catalog.
Of course you're right from a commercial point of view, but if DT found the courage to do The Astonishing and Judas Priest found the courage to do Nostradamus, Bon Jovi could have as well be more daring. Or maybe they never felt the need to do so, and Jon got everything "unusual" he wanted when he did his solo album (whose most famous song is Blaze of Glory, but the better track is by far Santa Fe... I really love that song, and it shows that Jon has a bit of an epic side to him, that I wish he'd have explored more).
But you're sort of making my case for me. Neither Dream Theater or Judas Priest are at the level of Bon Jovi. Neither can or do tour stadiums as a headliner. Neither was jeopardizing their corporate presence with their prog-metal concept records. I too would love to hear that from Bon Jovi, but I don't think those bands are in the same place.
-
Well, that's true, but shouldn't be easier for Bon Jovi to bounce back from a single misstep rather than a smaller band like DT? I can't imagine Bon Jovi forever losing their stadium status because of ONE album that tanks (and that maybe gets followed by a more commercial and traditional album), while DT I guess will have to work hard on the new album to mantain the level (and venues) they had when they toured playing a divisive album in its entirety and nothing else.
-
Well, that's true, but shouldn't be easier for Bon Jovi to bounce back from a single misstep rather than a smaller band like DT? I can't imagine Bon Jovi forever losing their stadium status because of ONE album that tanks (and that maybe gets followed by a more commercial and traditional album), while DT I guess will have to work hard on the new album to mantain the level (and venues) they had when they toured playing a divisive album in its entirety and nothing else.
Ask Billy Squier.
-
Is it already an implicit answer if I had to google the dude since I didn't know at all who he was? :D
-
Since Bon Jovi is somehow winning... what is everyone's opinion on them?
My first exposure to Bon Jovi was when Runaway showed up on MTV sometime in 1984. I hated new wave at the time, and Bon Jovi wasn't new wave, so I liked it as far as it went, but there wasn't anything special about it. Never really gave BJ another thought until Slippery When Wet broke in the second half of 1986. I believe it was You Give Love a Bad Name first and then Livin' on a Prayer. This was right around the time that the first wave of "hair metal" bands was breaking, and Bon Jovi struck me as just another hair metal band. You couldn't spit during the second half of the 80s without hitting Bon Jovi. I even went and saw them live at the behest of a girlfriend in 1989 (with Skid Row opening). They put on a pretty good show, but again, nothing really impressed me. After grunge broke in the early 90s, Bon Jovi became a relic of the 80s until It's My Life broke in 2000 and, after that, I really haven't given them a second thought until they got the RRHOF nod.
With that tepid explanation, you can probably deduce that I absolutely do NOT think Bon Jovi belongs the RRHOF. As I wrote earlier in the thread, inducting Bon Jovi legitimizes bands like Motley Crue and Def Leppard as RRHOF candidates. To the extent I care about the RRHOF, it's also a travesty that BJ is in and bands like Maiden and Priest aren't.
-
After grunge broke in the early 90s, Bon Jovi became a relic of the 80s until It's My Life broke in 2000 and, after that, I really haven't given them a second thought until they got the RRHOF nod.
Still I think their best album came in 1992, Keep the Faith. It had a depth and substance that other hair metal bands didn't have. They should have pursued more that direction. And I challenge every hair metal from the '80s to write something as Dry County. That song is metal and epic all the way through.
-
I think you just never had interest in them that leads to your belief they are not worthy. But their sales and tours prove differently.
-
I think you just never had interest in them that leads to your belief they are not worthy. But their sales and tours prove differently.
Bon Jovi sold a lot of albums (or, more accurately, they sold a shitload of copies of one single album). Don't know what you mean by "their . . . tours." The band played catchy, generic pop-metal/hard rock that was, in no way, original or innovative.
I actively dislike Bruce Springsteen, but I think he is unquestionably worthy of the RRHOF. My belief that Bon Jovi isn't worthy has nothing to do with my general lack of interest in the band. Rather, the reasons why I don't think the band is particularly worthy are the same reasons why I never became a big fan.
-
They still sell out large venues to this day. Btw, I think their last 3 albums are weak and I checked out but I still believe they are HOF worthy.
-
Not that I am much of a Bon Jovi fan, but from 1986-1989, they were arguably as big as any rock band at any given point (with U2, Def Leppard, Van Halen and Guns N' Roses the main competition at various times). And if you have a 4-year stretch where you are that huge, it is hard to argue against them.
Were they original or innovative? No, but that doesn't matter. You don't have to be original and/or innovative to be good.
-
I don't have any issue with Bon Jovi going in. Perhaps premature in that there are other bands who should go in before them.
I still have no idea what GnR are doing in there. None.
-
Well, at this point, they are running out of bands, so the last x-number of years has basically been "let's put in bands we do not like that were popular because we need some bands to put in this year." Just about any band the idiot voters thinks is actually worthy makes it within the first few years of eligibility.
-
I still have no idea what GnR are doing in there. None.
Green Day
Red Hot Chili Peppers
Jackson Browne
The Sex Pistols
Laura Nyro
And yet, no Phil Collins, no Iron Maiden, no Judas Priest, no Soundgarden.
It's going to be worse next round. I'm already gearing myself up for no-talents like Radiohead, The Pixies and Rage Against The Machine to be shoo-ed in on the first ballot. (I kid; The Pixies and Rage are both talented, just not my thing).
-
I think you just never had interest in them that leads to your belief they are not worthy. But their sales and tours prove differently.
Bon Jovi sold a lot of albums (or, more accurately, they sold a shitload of copies of one single album).
I believe the stretch from Slippery When Wet through New Jersey, Keep the Faith, These Days and possibly Crush all sold good, Slippery is surely the best seller but at the very least New Jersey was also huge.
-
*thinks the RHOF is a joke*
*gets worked up each year about the nominees and their worthyness*
Find the contradiction. ;D
-
If you're talking to me, I don't know that I think the Hall is a joke I think Jann Wenner is a joke, and they're not the same thing. I personally see too many artists like Rush who "think it's all bollocks" until they get there, get up on the stage, and realize "wow, this is real." Why SHOULND'T a guy like Phil Collins, who's body is falling apart around him, get a little love, FINALLY, after being the whipping boy for a bunch of people that don't know dick all about music (critics) and even a few that do (Bob Plant).
-
I don't mean anyone in particular, it's just an observation you can make every year when the nominees are announced.
I just find it funny to get worked up about something you (not you personally) claim you can't take serious.
And I don't know why Phil Collins isn't in there, but then I'm of the people that doesn't care who's in there and why, or why not.
-
I still have no idea what GnR are doing in there. None.
Green Day
Red Hot Chili Peppers
Jackson Browne
The Sex Pistols
Laura Nyro
And yet, no Phil Collins, no Iron Maiden, no Judas Priest, no Soundgarden.
No Thin Lizzy, Blue Oyster Cult, Grand Funk Railroad, King Crimson and Jethro Tull either.
-
I still have no idea what GnR are doing in there. None.
Green Day
Red Hot Chili Peppers
Jackson Browne
The Sex Pistols
Laura Nyro
And yet, no Phil Collins, no Iron Maiden, no Judas Priest, no Soundgarden.
No Thin Lizzy, Blue Oyster Cult, Grand Funk Railroad, King Crimson and Jethro Tull either.
RHCP deserve to be in. Iron Maiden deserve it too eventually. I could live without the rest in (including the list of who is actually in) although all have good arguments.
My only issue with the RnR HOF is that they include music beyond "rock", otherwise it's just a popularity contest so it'll never be about who is really the best rock music
-
I think you just never had interest in them that leads to your belief they are not worthy. But their sales and tours prove differently.
Bon Jovi sold a lot of albums (or, more accurately, they sold a shitload of copies of one single album).
I believe the stretch from Slippery When Wet through New Jersey, Keep the Faith, These Days and possibly Crush all sold good, Slippery is surely the best seller but at the very least New Jersey was also huge.
You are correct (assuming the sources that Wikipedia cites are accurate):
Slippery.............28M (12x platinum in the U.S.)
New Jersey.........18M (7x platinum in the U.S.)
Keep the Faith.....12M (2x platinum in the U.S.)
These Days.........10M (1x platinum in the U.S.)
Crush.................11M (2x platinum in the U.S.)
Not surprising that New Jersey (as the follow up to Slippery) sold like a mother f-er, and it's not surprising that Crush did well because "It's My Life" was huge, but I honestly can't say I've ever heard anything off of Keep the Faith or These Days. From my perspective, Bon Jovi was completely off the map in the 90s, but maybe I just missed it.
Anyone know of any site that tries to normalize album sales figures for albums that were originally released before CDs existed and whose sales numbers are inflated because of folks re-buying an album on CD to replace a cassette or vinyl? As I type this it sounds like it would be too speculative to be reliable, but who knows?
-
From my perspective, Bon Jovi was completely off the map in the 90s, but maybe I just missed it.
These are single's numbers (not albums like you showed) but I think kind of make the point Bon Jovi was still relevant on some level in the 90s.
https://www.billboard.com/music/bon-jovi/chart-history (https://www.billboard.com/music/bon-jovi/chart-history)
Always
Bon Jovi
Peaked at #4 on 12.10.1994
Bed Of Roses
Bon Jovi
Peaked at #10 on 3.6.1993
and for reference
It's My Life
Bon Jovi
Peaked at #33 on 9.30.2000
-
I still have no idea what GnR are doing in there. None.
Green Day
Red Hot Chili Peppers
Jackson Browne
The Sex Pistols
Laura Nyro
And yet, no Phil Collins, no Iron Maiden, no Judas Priest, no Soundgarden.
No Thin Lizzy, Blue Oyster Cult, Grand Funk Railroad, King Crimson and Jethro Tull either.
I think Crimson should be in - Fripp is EASILY as influential in his own way as a Lou Reed or any of the other hipster darlings that have gotten in the Hall. Fuck, he almost single-handedly created an entire genre.
-
I loved Bon Jovi from hearing Runaway, their first single. They wer3 great until after New Jersey. Every album after had a few good songs but it started not to rock. The became boring ballad heavy.
I remember JBJ was having songwriting lessons and the better he got as a songwriter, the worse his songs got!
I haven’t even bothered to listen to the last few.
-
I loved Bon Jovi from hearing Runaway, their first single. They wer3 great until after New Jersey. Every album after had a few good songs but it started not to rock. The became boring ballad heavy.
I remember JBJ was having songwriting lessons and the better he got as a songwriter, the worse his songs got!
I haven’t even bothered to listen to the last few.
Last album I liked was Have A Nice Day.
-
These are single's numbers (not albums like you showed) but I think kind of make the point Bon Jovi was still relevant on some level in the 90s.
https://www.billboard.com/music/bon-jovi/chart-history (https://www.billboard.com/music/bon-jovi/chart-history)
Always
Bon Jovi
Peaked at #4 on 12.10.1994
Always was huge. Heck, it's how I got to know them. It was so big that even a young teen as me who, as mentioned before, never really bothered with foreign music before got notice of it.
And as sappy as in some moments the lyrics tend to be, I still think it's one of their best ballads.
-
Yea, Always was a huge hit when I was a kid and my first experience with Bon Jovi. I've been bummed because he hasn't played it very much, it's always an "audible" on his current setlists that gets scratched off.
I loved Bon Jovi from hearing Runaway, their first single. They wer3 great until after New Jersey. Every album after had a few good songs but it started not to rock. The became boring ballad heavy.
I remember JBJ was having songwriting lessons and the better he got as a songwriter, the worse his songs got!
Runaway is my favorite BJ song. But you are right, his albums got worse and worse. I wouldn't of gotten his latest, but it was free with tickets for his last show I went to. I turned it off after a couple songs :lol
-
I loved Bon Jovi from hearing Runaway, their first single. They wer3 great until after New Jersey. Every album after had a few good songs but it started not to rock. The became boring ballad heavy.
I remember JBJ was having songwriting lessons and the better he got as a songwriter, the worse his songs got!
I haven’t even bothered to listen to the last few.
Last album I liked was Have A Nice Day.
Worst album cover of all time, though. Or at least a contender.
-
I loved Bon Jovi from hearing Runaway, their first single. They wer3 great until after New Jersey. Every album after had a few good songs but it started not to rock. The became boring ballad heavy.
I remember JBJ was having songwriting lessons and the better he got as a songwriter, the worse his songs got!
I haven’t even bothered to listen to the last few.
Last album I liked was Have A Nice Day.
Me too. That had some good stuff on it. It’s a masterpiece compared to what I heard after it.
-
I'd say put all the best songs of Crush, Bounce and Have a Nice Day all on one disc, and forget about the rest.
-
Phil Collins is in the R&RHOF, as a member of Genesis.