DreamTheaterForums.org Dream Theater Fan Site
General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: RoeDent on April 12, 2018, 01:54:40 PM
-
This stems from a discussion on the Sea Within, but I feel it could use its own topic. How often do you listen to bonus tracks on an album? Whether it's new tracks that don't fit in with the "flow" of the main album, or alternative versions of album tracks.
Me? I very rarely listen to them. I don't really know how to categorize them. First of all, I absolutely cannot listen to them after hearing the main album. The album has its own distinct flow, and it is intended to end with its closing track, after which the journey is over and I must take off the headphones, do something else and put a full stop to that particular album listening experience. Often, the sequence of bonus tracks is too short to be a meaningful listen, or I'm not really bothered with hearing remixes/edits etc.
That's just me though.
-
Depends on the quality. For The Dear Hunter's Migrant, most of the best songs are bonus songs, so those get more plays than the actual album songs. But I find that generally the bonus songs sound rushed or just like worse versions of songs that are on the actual album, not always though.
-
Alter Bridge has released a fair amount of bonus tracks from their five albums, usually as either a Best Buy exclusive or a Japan-region exclusive, and for the most part, those songs stack up well to their best songs on the official album, especially New Way to Live and The Damage Done from the Blackbird album.
-
Depends on the quality.
That. Chloroform and Drown with me are 2 songs I love yet both are bonus tracks for In Absentia. I could see people not really listening to the bonus tracks in The Whirlwind perhaps since that one is a concept album. But I won't stop listening to a song just because it's bonus material.
-
Always. Between having only the original version of the album and having a remastered album with bonus tracks, I prefer the latter. The tracks can suck, they can be totally unnecessary, but... they are something different, special and the artist put them there for a reason. Never break the ritual of listening to the whole album + bonus tracks. :metal :metal
-
Fairly regularly. But I also make it a point if I have a special edition or something, to separate those tracks from the album's running order. I'm generally an album guy, so I want to listen to a full record, but if there are b-sides, I'll label the tracks as the album's B-sides, and listen to them after the full record.
-
Always.
This opens up a can of worms for the other side of the coin. I absolutely hate when an album has 5 different versions spread throughout the world. The US seems to be the worst at getting bonus tracks. Since I am a completest, I then have to start tracking down versions from around the world to figure things out to get the complete thing.
Just recently, there was an album that I wanted that had been out a few years. I discovered that there was an Australian edition, a US edition, a European edition, a US special edition, an iTunes edition, an Australian Special Edition, another foreign special edition, etc. All with different track listings ranging from something like 11-18 tracks.
In the end, I ended up buying the Australian Special Edition since it was the only one with almost all of the tracks. I got the 1 last track digitally via Amazon. It's a nightmare.
This is a huge pet peeve of mine.
-
If they're covers always. Live versions maybe. Remixes almost never. Instrumental versions never.
-
Actual original songs? Depends if they're good.
I rarely buy extra versions of stuff just for bonus tracks. However, sometimes the album just comes with bonus tracks and I listen to those. If they suck, I discard them like I would a proper album track. I tend to just treat them like any other track.
The only potential exceptions to how I view bonus tracks are 1) If the album is a concept album and the bonus tracks have nothing to do with it or 2) I didn't know about the bonus tracks till after years of listening to the album as was.
-
Always with the bands I'm really into and with my constant favorites. If I've just gotten into a band, I might try and stick to the main entries for a while just to get a good vibe for the "constant" of the band's feel, but if I end up really enjoying them and sticking with them, I'll no doubt try to soak in every ounce of music they make.
It also turns out that with almost every single band that I consider a favorite, their B-sides/Bonus/Demos end up being some of my favorite work from them. I guess examples cause fucking DTF:
- The already mentioned PT's Chloroform and Drown With Me, along with SW's solo stuff, The Map and Home In Negative.
- A bit more controversial as most fans just consider it an official "disc" by now, but the previous "bonus" of In Rainbows is all absolutely amazing. Down Is The New Up may be my favorite song from them, tied with Up On The Ladder.
- AFI's Crash Love bonus tracks are amazing; Fainting Spells, We've Got The Knife. Then There's stuff from December Underground like Jack The Ripper, and my favorite AFI song, Rabbits Are Roadkill on Rt. 37.
- There's too many Devin Townsend extras to name but there's a whole hell of a lot from the guy that's awesome and considered a "demo/bonus/extra". One I recently fell in love with is the super ambiant, electronic/"Tron-like" Accelerated Evolution extras Locate; Echo; Assignable. Ho Krll off Deconstruction is incredible (though I think that may have appeared earlier). Pretty much all of the Transcendence extras are amazing. There's just too many, and many are just considered "more stuff" by now considering the amount of awesomeness the man comes up with.
- Gorillaz is another band that basically have a whole other discography just with bonuses alone. Hong Kong; People; Rockit (which is incredible in its own right and should be an album entirely); Faust; The Sounder; then there's the tons of randomness that aren't even on albums or were released in secret through the early days of the mysterious of the net. Mr. Softy's Balloon Race is fantastic; Dub Dumb is super cool. Again, too many to name.
- There's a few miscellaneous ones from both OSI and Chroma Key that are either bonuses, B-sides or extras in some form that are pretty nifty. I don't think any stand out as favorites but I definitely spin them now and again (No Celebrations particularly from OSI).
I think I'll end it there. :lol Suffice it to say, if a band I love has tracks out there, I want them. It can give insight into a different kind of music the particular artist(s) want to create (and may well in the future, as is the case with a lot of the aforementioned; some even turn into full albums) or something they're interested in. It's also cool to hear something from a band that does something very particular that has now done something so far out of left field that it ends up weirdly working well despite being the polar opposite. Any way you slice it, tracks that are out of place or are considered unfinished or bonuses are cool because they're almost always different or may be a piece of the album before that's fallen off or considered not as good (but it may end up being your favorite).
-
Recently I've found the habit of making playlists with b-sides/bonus songs from bands and i make a playlist that's almost like an album but with songs not represented on any of the studio albums. A lot of bands have some really good b-sides (whether it's from singles, the odd EP or bonus tracks on a japanese version of an album) and I've gained a lot more appreciation for some bands by checking out their songs like that.
-
I absolutely hate when an album has a re-release with a bonus track or two tacked on at the end. Completely kills the album for me, to the point where I either won't buy it or turn it off before the bonus tracks start.
-
Bonus Tracks are exactly that to me. Bonuses that either don't fit or the band decided why not release a remix.
The only ones I don't get are Extended tracks (unless they were cut short due to album length). Why not just have had that on the album.
-
Just depends on whether or not I like the song, and if so, how much I like it. Like any other song.
I really hate the trend of making several versions of the same album but only one variant has a certain bonus track while other regions/editions get their own bonus tracks. FFS, stop that. I will not buy more than one edition per album, I will just download the rest of the bonus tracks if I like the band enough.
Some of my favorite songs on an album are bonus tracks.
-
Basically never. Usually they just interrupt the flow of the album, especially if they're at the end after the proper closer
-
I don't really care for remixes or demo versions when they are released as bonus tracks, but I totally love checking out new songs that are bonus tracks. Sometimes they suck, sometimes they are awesome, but you don't know if you don't listen. To me, it's just more music from the band I am already listening to, so the more the better, but just need to understand mentally that these songs often don't belong with the album (hence being left off, although not always) so it's best to go in with a clear mind when judging the bonus tracks.
Having said that, some bands do really great bonus tracks. Kamelot comes to mind immediately.
Epica's last two albums had a bonus disc of acoustic versions that were really good too.
-
I don't get it. Is it really that hard to move your index finger and apply a bit of pressure to click on "stop"? If the bonus tracks are in the middle of the album (which they rarely are), I don't see a problem with listening to the album and then stopping it before the bonus tracks. ???
-
Remember when bonus tracks were either tacked onto the end of the last track, by adding like a minute or more into it. Or adding 50 tracks of one second silence before the final track.
Also, What about pre-gap bonus track's? Hybrids Lights Go Down, Knives Come Out comes to mind.
-
If it's a brand new track, pretty much every time I listen to the album. If it's just a demo or alternate version, usually never, depends on the quality of it and which track it is.
-
If they are good, then I will listen to them all the time.
-
It depends.
If they are demos, I usually just listen to them once. Every once in a while a good demo shows up and I'll add it to the album playlist.
If they are fully recorded tracks, then I will add them to the album playlist after the main album.
-
Original songs, I slap them on to the album and listen to them along with the rest as if they were there to begin with.
Acoustic versions of songs, remixes and covers, I'll slap them on as well, but be less inclined to listen to them with the rest of the album.
Instrumental versions, demos, "single" versions & alternate takes... I usually don't even rip those into iTunes.
-
Recently I've found the habit of making playlists with b-sides/bonus songs from bands and i make a playlist that's almost like an album but with songs not represented on any of the studio albums. A lot of bands have some really good b-sides (whether it's from singles, the odd EP or bonus tracks on a japanese version of an album) and I've gained a lot more appreciation for some bands by checking out their songs like that.
Yea, I kind of do this. So if it's an artist that I love (and therefore have lots of bonus tracks by this artist) I will use iTunes to put all the bonus tracks onto one custom album and rearrange the tracks in a way that flows well for me. That way I can listen to all the bonus tracks without it ruining the flow of the album. Two albums that spring to mind, where doing this has allowed me to enjoy the album WAY more, are Shogun by Trivium and Unto the Locust by Machine Head. Those two albums are ones that, in my opinion, are totally ruined by the bonus tracks and I personally enjoy them so much more without them. Having all the bonus tracks on one custom album makes so much more sense to me and my listening habits.
-
Rarely, if ever.
Do not care about demos. I don't want to read the first draft of The Shining, or watch a rough cut of Casablanca.
Do not care about remixes. I don't need multiple versions of a song any more than I need 26 versions of the Star Wars original trilogy. With some rare exceptions. The Cult's remixes are the standout in my collection for the songs they remixed.
Generally don't care about live tracks. I'd rather listen to a whole live set than a random live song or two.
Unreleased/B-Sides: I am all over the map on this.
-
I guess it depends, but I usually do listen to them, especially if they were on the original version of the album when I bought it. For some bands I like the bonus tracks just as well as the regular tracks. Usually I just rip the album as is and listen to it in that order. Once in a while I might change the order, like with Katatonia - Night is the New Day.
-
With live tracks, if they're songs that the band never plays anymore, from a band that has never released a live album, or differs highly from the studio version I'll listen to them.
-
- The already mentioned PT's Chloroform and Drown With Me
Yes! Drown With Me is easily my favourite track from the In Absentia era. Chloroform is also up there for me.
-
Depends. If they're actual new songs, yes. If they're live tracks, old demos, instrumental versions, random covers I pass.
-
Depends. If they're actual new songs, yes. If they're live tracks, old demos, instrumental versions, random covers I pass.
Same for me. But if I'm listening a whole album I usually skip the bonus track at the end if it doesn't fit. For example Bury and Root by Leprous are good songs, but after the closers Contaminate Me and The Last Milestone there's no point to listen another song.
Some great bonus tracks that come to my mind:
New Way To Live and The Damage Done - Alter Bridge
Bury - Leprous
Thorn Clown, Break Darling Break - Pain Of Salvation
Voorhees - Oceansize
Porcupine Tree - In Absentia bonus tracks
-
I have to add that I'm annoyed at how bonus tracks are slapped at the end as an afterthought. When they're actual studio tracks I'd like for them to be incorporated in the tracklist, like an added scene of a movie that takes place where it's supposed to happen rather than being a random post credits sequence, because there are songs that are meant to be album closers and a chance to do something creative with the tracklist is lost when the bonus track is at the end.
-
Pretty much always. A lot of the artists I listen to have great bonus tracks and B-sides, often they're even better than the actual album tracks.
-
For The Dear Hunter's Migrant, most of the best songs are bonus songs, so those get more plays than the actual album songs.
For me, it helps that they were released essentially as a separate EP, so it's easy to listen to it like that.
Similarly, on the Road Salt albums, Pain of Salvation incorporated the bonus tracks into the album where they fit best in terms of flow. Other bands have done similar things. That works too as, as long as the songs are good, it creates a superior version of the album.
Where it's just one or two tracks that come at the end of the album, especially if the final track of the main album works as a good closer/finale, then yeah I don't really bother much with the bonus tracks.
-
I have to add that I'm annoyed at how bonus tracks are slapped at the end as an afterthought. When they're actual studio tracks I'd like for them to be incorporated in the tracklist, like an added scene of a movie that takes place where it's supposed to happen rather than being a random post credits sequence, because there are songs that are meant to be album closers and a chance to do something creative with the tracklist is lost when the bonus track is at the end.
If the bonus tracks are on album reissues, they probably don't want to disrupt the original sequence and flow of the album, which is a very good thing imo. That should be kept as it is. However, these days it's pretty easy to play around with the tracklist yourself and insert the bonus tracks where you like, or even to omit some of the tracks.
-
If they're covers always. Live versions maybe. Remixes almost never. Instrumental versions never.
Pretty much me. Maybe switch "remixes" and "instrumental", though it depends on both.
Generally don't care about live tracks. I'd rather listen to a whole live set than a random live song or two.
That's me; I hate when there are random songs from shows floating around. Release the whole show and be done with it.
This opens up a can of worms for the other side of the coin. I absolutely hate when an album has 5 different versions spread throughout the world. The US seems to be the worst at getting bonus tracks. Since I am a completest, I then have to start tracking down versions from around the world to figure things out to get the complete thing.
It's a nightmare.
This is a huge pet peeve of mine.
This is me, except for remixes. I have all the b-sides from Oasis, for example, and all the b-sides from Noel, except for one which is an Amazon-only exclusive and I have to buy the WHOLE High Flying Birds album to get it. Pfffft.
This is why when bands like Genesis release "Archive" sets and leave one song off because it's "not our favorite" it pisses me off. Ozzy does this too; I had to scour ebay for a promo disk of "Crazy Babies" to get a CD version of "You Said It All" when they could have just tacked it onto the 87th remaster of "Blizzard of Ozz". I'd blame Sharon, but it's not even a cash grab, it's just LAZY. Compare that to Dio, whose releases are stellar for that. Same with Bruce Dickinson.
-
Similarly, on the Road Salt albums, Pain of Salvation incorporated the bonus tracks into the album where they fit best in terms of flow. Other bands have done similar things. That works too as, as long as the songs are good, it creates a superior version of the album.
The only band I can think of that I listen to with any regularity is Symphony X with the special edition of Iconoclast. With that album, I never saw the need for them to mix the extra songs in and change up the order. It's actually kind of confusing because I can never recall which songs are "bonus" songs and which ones aren't.
Back to the main question, I fall into the camp of "it basically just depends on whether I like the song." If I like it, I'll listen to it. If I don't, it's easier to skip than a regular album track. Instrumentals and demos usually end up getting listened to once or a few times just to experience, and then get shelved. Covers and acoustic versions of album tracks usually get that treatment as well, but not always. The acoustic and alternate version disk that Epic released with The Holographic Principle, for example, is excellent, and I listen to it fairly frequently. But extra full songs are generally what stands a better chance of getting a frequent spin. The bonus tracks Within Temptation released for The Unforgiving were so good that I would often forget that they weren't actually album tracks.
-
An old school 'the album is over when the album is over' person......
yet.....at the time, I wish I would have been able to purchase Qryche's 'Promised Land' with 'Real World' on it, rather than digging for 'The Last Action Hero' CD. 'My' version of the LP had it placed it before 'Lady Jane'
I've never played a purchased CD in a car. Ever. I made cassette copies back in the day. All of my homemade CDrs have 15 seconds of silence at the end, so that the disc doesn't go from the ending track to first track instantly, giving me time to remove it. I'll add bonuses, but also place 15 seconds between the end of the album proper and 'my' bonuses. I also insert 6-8 seconds of silence between sides one and two. A: because I'm anal. And, B: because it used to take 30-60 seconds to lift, replace, clean, and gently place the needle back down.
The Beatles: all nonalbum 45s from the era of the album are added at the end. Gives me the option to listen to them first or last. For 'Revolver', 'Sgt. Pepper', and 'The Beatles'.....there's 30 seconds after the album proper....just in case (or nothing added).
Queen: nonalbum, era-related live, BBC, bonus tracks added after the silence. I've made so many as gifts, that I figure it would not be fair to not include some additional material. Who wants to lug around two discs, when one will suffice? And if traffic is bad heading home, I've got the extra stuff that I might not normally listen to. Some of their albums have so much related bonus material, that one or two extra discs are necessary anyway. Or you have something like 'The Miracle'......where I've inserted three nonalbum Bsides and a solo track into 'my' album, while removing four of the album tracks.
Oddly: their remasters from 2011: an absolute fantastic extended version of 'It's A Hard Life' is not included, yet the bonus disc only filled around 30 minutes (thank you, public library)
Led Zep III: 'Hey Hey What Can I Do' fits perfectly in the middle of side two, and 'Hats Off To (Roy) Harper' is hats off removed, because I don't want to screw up the beginning or end of that side.
Genesis, Journey, REM, Rush, Styx, Springsteen, Tull, Van Halen, The Who, Yes, etc etc.... I 'wish' all CDs had bonus material of demos/ live material added. Insert a 15-30 second gap as an additional track, and then fill the rest of the disc up. More bang for the buck.
As to Dream Theater: there's never any room for bonus material ;)
-
Depends. If they're actual new songs, yes. If they're live tracks, old demos, instrumental versions, random covers I pass.
Same for me. But if I'm listening a whole album I usually skip the bonus track at the end if it doesn't fit. For example Bury and Root by Leprous are good songs, but after the closers Contaminate Me and The Last Milestone there's no point to listen another song.
You know, this is a good point, and you're probably "right" about both of those. However, I listen to the bonus track in both cases right after the end of the album and don't have any issues with it at all. Especially Bury. Maybe it's just because I've always listened to it that way, but it seems to cap things off with an extra burst of energy.
-
I think the question is asking for a black/white answer, when I think it's been shown that it's definitely more grey (gray?). Generally speaking, I can enjoy them without issues such as "if they wanted it, it would have made it" or "they were left off for a reason".
Bonus Track / B-Side = Completely finished and polished that, for whatever reason(s), didn't make the final tracklist.
Demo = Rough take used as a guide to make the complete version, often used to weed-out ones that aren't working.
Ultimately, either one can be good/bad, it's all subjective. We are also in a time when the order doesn't mean much these days (albums like "The Astonishing" being the exception), what with the finite storage of tapes/CDs/etc no longer being a factor. For example, if I have a two-disc album, I put all tracks into one folder and re-number them from 01-X, and don't bother with "Disc 1 - Track 01 and Disc 2 - Track 01).
My bottom line is that "it depends". Some of my most-loved songs are Bonus Tracks and/or B-Sides:
James LaBrie - Elements of Persuasion - Understand
Bon Jovi - Starting All Over Again, Borderline, Love Is War, etc.
Dream Theater - Speak to Me, To Live Forever, Eve, Don't Look Past Me, Through Her Eyes (Long Titanic), etc.
Halestorm - Halestorm - Tell Me Where It Hurts
As for demos, these can be so amazing, like how different Livin' On A Prayer would have been (and probably a flop) had they not changed it, so these are cool also. The demo of Always has JBJ bustin' balls with a key change that has him singing higher than he ever did before and hasn't since, it's amazing.
As for live tracks being bonus: what's the problem? I can understand the whole "just release the entire show" thing but if I want to listen to the Live at Budokan "Hollow Years" on its own then I will and I don't have to actually go through the entire show. Sure, some of us are able to set aside the time for the whole thing but if I don't have time then I'm happy to have individual songs.
Or what if something amazing happens during that "one song" during that "one show", should they release the whole thing? I'm looking at something like when the cops cut the power during The Spirit Carries On and MP and the crowd were singing without a PA, that's a special moment and having the one song out there is cool.
I also find it funny that we here seem to love "Making Of" Official Bootlegs which, to me, are virtually un-listenable, but some of us are anti-live/bonus tracks.
TL;DR - Not an easy answer to the question, I'm generally 100% on-board with them.
-
^
:tup