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Dream Theater => Dream Theater => Topic started by: cygnusx1jg on August 28, 2009, 08:27:20 AM
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....based on the threads I have read on this board. Now, I can understand the people that think Awake is DT's best record. I don't agree with them, but I at least understand their opinion. I just don't get the people that think this is their worst record.
Anyway, do you think Awake is the most varied DT release based on these opinions, or is their another album that has more differing opinions?
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I'd say FII is a lot more mixed, and the newer ones like ToT and Octavarium. Awake usually ranks top 3 for a lot of people here, but I see a lot more variety in opinions for the other albums I've mentioned, ranking from favourite to least favourite, and everything inbetween.
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Yeah, it seems pretty mixed. I've read posts saying that they hate James Labries vocals on this album, even going on to say they were terrible. I don't get that at all, I think he sounded great... but that's just me. Definitley one of the more diverse DT Cd's, but that's why I love them- they are diverse, and their sound is dynamically changing
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Yeah, it seems pretty mixed. I've read posts saying that they hate James Labries vocals on this album, even going on to say they were terrible. I don't get that at all, I think he sounded great... but that's just me.
Similar thing with Marquee. Some people don't like the harsher growly tone, especially on the higher vocals. Because I don't think there's anything you can really fault with JLB's vocals on Awake for the most part. I think it's just personal preference there.
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I'd say FII is a lot more mixed, and the newer ones like ToT and Octavarium. Awake usually ranks top 3 for a lot of people here, but I see a lot more variety in opinions for the other albums I've mentioned, ranking from favourite to least favourite, and everything inbetween.
This. I'm definitely in the newer category so you could understand since Awake is my #5.
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I find Awake to be a great album, until you get to the last 3 songs.
LSoaD does nothing for me.
Scarred is the most overrared song in DT's history.
SDV gets more props than it should because it's the DT song that will never get played live.
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RIGHT, my two cents.
....based on the threads I have read on this board. Now, I can understand the people that think Awake is DT's best record. I don't agree with them, but I at least understand their opinion. I just don't get the people that think this is their worst record.
I'm not convinced it's their worst record, but it's their least bombastic, which is kind of where Dream Theater's strengths lie. I like a lot of songs on it, but I don't think it plays to their strengths as a band. Not to say it's bad, but it doesn't soar like a lot of the other albums, in my opinion. Especially the newer albums, which I really enjoy.
Six Degrees, Octavarium and Black Clouds are all in the top half of their catalogue for me, which I can't say about Awake. Probably controversial but hey.
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I find Awake to be a great album, until you get to the last 3 songs.
LSoaD does nothing for me.
Scarred is the most overrared song in DT's history.
SDV gets more props than it should because it's the DT song that will never get played live.
I completely agree with this, although I'm not fond of Lie either (although I can still enjoy it occasionally)
AMBI is fantastic, the album before that is pretty good, but the last half hour of the album just does nothing for me. LSOAD isn't bad, but I've never really liked it myself. I've never understood the love for Scarred at all. Other songs I don't like I can still appreciate the reasons why others do, but with Scarred it makes no sense. And SDV is just boring. There's nothing specifically bad about it, it's just not an interesting song on any level. Songs like Disappear succeed much better at being slow emotional songs. My opinion of Awake would be quite high if the last half hour didn't exist, but I just can't overlook that long stretch of music at the end.
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:tup
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I find Awake to be a great album, until you get to the last 3 songs.
LSoaD does nothing for me.
Scarred is the most overrared song in DT's history.
SDV gets more props than it should because it's the DT song that will never get played live.
Funny because these three allow with Voices are probably the most mature songs they've ever written.
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Awake = best DT album
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Awake = best DT album
:tup
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I find Awake to be a great album, until you get to the last 3 songs.
LSoaD does nothing for me.
Scarred is the most overrared song in DT's history.
SDV gets more props than it should because it's the DT song that will never get played live.
Funny because these three allow with Voices are probably the most mature songs they've ever written.
Maybe lyrically, but musically Scarred ranks as low as most of WDADU for maturity. And LSOAD is a pretty standard ballady type song. And there's nothing all that exceptional about SDV either. The lyrics really save what are otherwise pretty average pieces of music by DT standards and are certainly not the most mature pieces they've written.
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I find Awake to be a great album, until you get to the last 3 songs.
LSoaD does nothing for me.
Scarred is the most overrared song in DT's history.
SDV gets more props than it should because it's the DT song that will never get played live.
Funny because these three allow with Voices are probably the most mature songs they've ever written.
Maybe lyrically, but musically Scarred ranks as low as most of WDADU for maturity. And LSOAD is a pretty standard ballady type song. And there's nothing all that exceptional about SDV either. The lyrics really save what are otherwise pretty average pieces of music by DT standards and are certainly not the most mature pieces they've written.
This.
I have never liked the music in Scarred and the radical transitions it has makes me hate it!
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I find Awake to be a great album, until you get to the last 3 songs.
LSoaD does nothing for me.
Scarred is the most overrared song in DT's history.
SDV gets more props than it should because it's the DT song that will never get played live.
Funny because these three allow with Voices are probably the most mature songs they've ever written.
Maybe lyrically, but musically Scarred ranks as low as most of WDADU for maturity. And LSOAD is a pretty standard ballady type song. And there's nothing all that exceptional about SDV either. The lyrics really save what are otherwise pretty average pieces of music by DT standards and are certainly not the most mature pieces they've written.
I seriously think you undercut the songwriting on those songs. In fact I dunno how anyone can call those songs immature yet love any of the more recent prog-metal-by-numbers songs.
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Awake is definitely my top DT album. It's my second fav album overall behind Queensryche's Promised Land. I gotta disagree with you guys about the last three songs on Awake. Obviously, SDV is my top song but "Scarred" and "Lifting Shadows" are also really powerful songs too. I'll admit, it took me many years before i really started to appreciate "Scarred." Now it's actually become the song that gets the most play from me on Awake. I think it's really underrated.
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All the songs are great for me except SDV. I can't listen to that song.
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I find Awake to be a great album, until you get to the last 3 songs.
LSoaD does nothing for me.
Scarred is the most overrared song in DT's history.
SDV gets more props than it should because it's the DT song that will never get played live.
Funny because these three allow with Voices are probably the most mature songs they've ever written.
Maybe lyrically, but musically Scarred ranks as low as most of WDADU for maturity. And LSOAD is a pretty standard ballady type song. And there's nothing all that exceptional about SDV either. The lyrics really save what are otherwise pretty average pieces of music by DT standards and are certainly not the most mature pieces they've written.
I seriously think you undercut the songwriting on those songs. In fact I dunno how anyone can call those songs immature yet love any of the more recent prog-metal-by-numbers songs.
Do you have any reasonable explanation for their apparent greatness other than spitting out some generic and tired criticism of modern DT? What makes them so special? Songs like Voices and The Mirror are much better examples of good songwriting on Awake, but Scarred has many of the same faults that plague their weaker efforts of WDADU, like poor transitions and lazy vocal melodies.
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Can we have a conversation about Awake while not resorting to calling DT "prog-metal-by-numbers"? Seriously, whatever-the-fuck that is supposed to mean is outside of my understanding. Frankly, I can't think of one other prog metal band that sounds remotely like the DT we hear on SC or BC&SL (like those albums or not), and I'd love to hear someone try and draw a comparison between a typical prog metal band and anything on them. Say what you want about them, but they're certainly not typical prog metal outings and it's no surprise that most people who espouse that tired criticism are people who admittedly don't listen to much prog metal.
[/rant]
That being said, Awake is a great album with tons of highs. However, the lows (The Mirror, Lie) are just about as low as DT gets for me. It was my first album and an album I still listen to regularly but I think that it's experimentalness is pretty hit or miss. Kevin Moore's sounds in the beginning of Caught in a Web are a fail, but in Erotomania his playing makes John's chromatic scale actually sound good. Kevin's lyrics on Lie are some of the worst the band's written, but John's on Voices and Kevin's on 6:00 are among the best. James' voice sounds horrible on 6:00, The Mirror, and the first half of Scarred, but he sounds fantastic on Innocence Faded, Voices, and the second half of Scarred. And so on.
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Kevin Moore's sounds in the beginning of Caught in a Web are a fail
What? That is pretty much THE definitive DT keyboard tone. Kevin Moore used it all over the place, Derek Sherinian used it a little bit, and Jordan Rudess uses it pretty often, too. I think the only difference is Moore played more of a lead with that tone in the beginning of "Caught in a Web," unlike most of their other songs, where that tone is usually used to play textural chords.
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Yeah, I understand. Again, I chalk it up to the experimental usage of the tone. It's a miss, in my opinion, when it's used that way. Unlike Erotomania, where Kevin uses the same tone in a more traditional sense and causes one of the best DT moments ever as a result.
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Kevin Moore's sounds in the beginning of Caught in a Web are a fail
What? That is pretty much THE definitive DT keyboard tone. Kevin Moore used it all over the place, Derek Sherinian used it a little bit, and Jordan Rudess uses it pretty often, too. I think the only difference is Moore played more of a lead with that tone in the beginning of "Caught in a Web," unlike most of their other songs, where that tone is usually used to play textural chords.
Even I love the intro to Caught in a Web (great fun to play on keyboard too, although tricky on the pitch bender). The basic octave strings sound would have to be one of the most commonly used DT sounds, although I can't think of any other instance where it is played with pitch bender, so I think you're right.
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LSOAD is a pretty standard ballady type song.
Listen again. It's the least "standard" "ballad" I've ever heard.
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Wait, what, James's harsh vocals on 6:00 and Scarred are awesome.
"Melodyyyyyy walks through the door" is one of my favorite DT lines vocally ever.
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Wait, what, James's harsh vocals on 6:00 and Scarred are awesome.
"Melodyyyyyy walks through the door" is one of my favorite DT lines vocally ever.
It's a matter of opinion. I think the best thing James decided to do for his voice EVER was stopping that harsh gargly tone.
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With a little help from food poisoning.
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Wait, what, James's harsh vocals on 6:00 and Scarred are awesome.
"Melodyyyyyy walks through the door" is one of my favorite DT lines vocally ever.
It's a matter of opinion. I think the best thing James decided to do for his voice EVER was stopping that harsh gargly tone.
I think it suits some songs in the album. Caught in a Web and 6:00 being some of them.
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Wait, what, James's harsh vocals on 6:00 and Scarred are awesome.
"Melodyyyyyy walks through the door" is one of my favorite DT lines vocally ever.
It's a matter of opinion. I think the best thing James decided to do for his voice EVER was stopping that harsh gargly tone.
Oh wait a minute, man!
James harsh voice always gets me well and I find it enjoyable and also that's why I love Awake so much. Glad we have harsh vocals in BC&SL a bit.
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Well yeah, I'm sure it wasn't very good for his voice :lol, but it did sound awesome in my opinion.
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LSOAD is a pretty standard ballady type song.
Listen again. It's the least "standard" "ballad" I've ever heard.
Seriously this. Of course it doesn't appeal to everybody, but it's anything but generic. Creative, unorthodox songwriting with a lot of sounds you don't hear in DT's other work.
As for Scarred, again it's a song that I used to dislike and can see why others would. But "immature" songwriting? Most of the transitions aren't any better or worse than is usual for DT, excepting a few abrupt ones going into the chorus, and I'm not sure what makes a vocal melody "lazy".
Awake is my 2nd favorite album, but I think it's relevant to point out that it was by far my *least* favorite when I first began listening to DT's albums.
-J
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I find Awake to be a great album, until you get to the last 3 songs.
LSoaD does nothing for me.
Scarred is the most overrared song in DT's history.
SDV gets more props than it should because it's the DT song that will never get played live.
Funny because these three allow with Voices are probably the most mature songs they've ever written.
Maybe lyrically, but musically Scarred ranks as low as most of WDADU for maturity. And LSOAD is a pretty standard ballady type song. And there's nothing all that exceptional about SDV either. The lyrics really save what are otherwise pretty average pieces of music by DT standards and are certainly not the most mature pieces they've written.
I seriously think you undercut the songwriting on those songs. In fact I dunno how anyone can call those songs immature yet love any of the more recent prog-metal-by-numbers songs.
Scarred is one of the only songs by Dream Theater where the transitions make absolutely no sense to me - I don't understand how it's apparently more "mature" (or how writing a really good nineteen-minute long prog metal song is immature, for that matter - it's a really lazy criticism which is thrown around far too much). The intro is lovely but it really loses its way. I'm not even convinced it has a way by the end. I've been trying to like it for over five years now, listening to live versions to see if I can work out what everyone loves about it, but it just doesn't fit together in any way for me. Which is my loss, but it is a little odd to see people calling it "perfect," which isn't rare.
(Oh, and Dimitrius, I agree with you on LSOAD and Scarred - although if you catch me at the right time I can be in the mood for Lifting Shadows! I really dig Space-Dye though.)
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Personally, I love James' growling high vocals. On the Live in Tokyo and the New York '93 discs, it's SO SWEET when he launches into his high register. Love it.
I have never liked the music in Scarred and the radical transitions it has makes me hate it!
Also, I never understand these comments about Scarred. Do you all even LISTEN to Dream Theater? They're all about rough, radical transitions that VERY OFTEN never work well. They've done this throughout their entire career, BC&SL included (RoP). Why the hell does it bother everyone so much in Scarred? Do you dislike Metropolis for the same reasons?? I'm just so sick of hearing this excuse...
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LSOAD is a pretty standard ballady type song.
Listen again. It's the least "standard" "ballad" I've ever heard.
Seriously this. Of course it doesn't appeal to everybody, but it's anything but generic. Creative, unorthodox songwriting with a lot of sounds you don't hear in DT's other work.
As for Scarred, again it's a song that I used to dislike and can see why others would. But "immature" songwriting? Most of the transitions aren't any better or worse than is usual for DT, excepting a few abrupt ones going into the chorus, and I'm not sure what makes a vocal melody "lazy".
By lazy I meant it doesn't sound like much thought went into it. It sounds like someone is just playing up and down the scale. Playing along a scale isn't a bad thing, as it leads to a flowing melody, and most good melodies do this, but it just doesn't sound like there is any care taken to where the melodies start and end in this particular case, in my opinion. DT write a lot better choruses now, and they wrote a lot better choruses on the rest of Awake too, and I think it's quite possibly the worst chorus DT have ever written (excluding WDADU).
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Scarred is one of the only songs by Dream Theater where the transitions make absolutely no sense to me - I don't understand how it's apparently more "mature" (or how writing a really good nineteen-minute long prog metal song is immature, for that matter - it's a really lazy criticism which is thrown around far too much).
I guess I'm the only one who doesn't really have a problem with the transitions in Scarred. I can't ever recall listening to it and thinking "wow that was a weird transition". If you can find one in Scarred as terrible as the Beautiful Agony -> blues type solo section in Nightmare be my guest.
I consider Scarred mature in how tastefully composed the sections and solos are. The techniques used meld together very nicely and aren't overpowering at all. It's also a great showcase on how creative JP used to be. Aside from maybe Lines In The Sand I haven't heard much of any of that in the newer stuff. To answer about The Count, it's immature mainly in lyrics but aside from the fantastic intro and last 5 or so minutes the music is not that great of quality.
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LSOAD is a pretty standard ballady type song.
Listen again. It's the least "standard" "ballad" I've ever heard.
Seriously this. Of course it doesn't appeal to everybody, but it's anything but generic. Creative, unorthodox songwriting with a lot of sounds you don't hear in DT's other work.
As for Scarred, again it's a song that I used to dislike and can see why others would. But "immature" songwriting? Most of the transitions aren't any better or worse than is usual for DT, excepting a few abrupt ones going into the chorus, and I'm not sure what makes a vocal melody "lazy".
By lazy I meant it doesn't sound like much thought went into it. It sounds like someone is just playing up and down the scale. Playing along a scale isn't a bad thing, as it leads to a flowing melody, and most good melodies do this, but it just doesn't sound like there is any care taken to where the melodies start and end in this particular case, in my opinion. DT write a lot better choruses now, and they wrote a lot better choruses on the rest of Awake too, and I think it's quite possibly the worst chorus DT have ever written (excluding WDADU).
Well I disagree, but I can't really articulate why because I know nothing about music. :lol Thanks for the explanation though. :tup
But it is still hard for me to grasp how someone could prefer the choruses of songs like You Not Me and Burning My Soul to this one.
-J
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Personally, I love James' growling high vocals. On the Live in Tokyo and the New York '93 discs, it's SO SWEET when he launches into his high register. Love it.
I have never liked the music in Scarred and the radical transitions it has makes me hate it!
Also, I never understand these comments about Scarred. Do you all even LISTEN to Dream Theater? They're all about rough, radical transitions that VERY OFTEN never work well. They've done this throughout their entire career, BC&SL included (RoP). Why the hell does it bother everyone so much in Scarred? Do you dislike Metropolis for the same reasons?? I'm just so sick of hearing this excuse...
Part of it is that the feel of the music in Scarred doesn't lend itself to the type of radical changes. Other things are that there's so many of them, and it's between lyrical sections of the song as opposed to instrumental passages.
That's only a bit of it, though - a lot of it is just to do with personal response to the music, and so its far trickier to quantify. They just "don't work" to my ears, which is pretty rare for a Dream Theater song. It sounds like the verses that are jammed together should be from two separate songs to an extent, which again is a personal response but there's a lot of ways that it doesn't hang together for me, almost uniquely for DT actually now I think of it. There are very, very few that I don't like, and this is one of that handful. Transitions probably have as much to do with that as anything else.
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Jarring transitions have pretty much been a staple of the band from Day One, and it seems to me that how much you like the song determines whether or not you like the transitions in that particular song. If you like the song as a whole, you don't mind the rough transitions; if you do not like the song as a whole, you point to the rough transitions as being one of the things that makes the song not very good. I have seen it many times over the years and it is pretty much the way it almost always goes.
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Scarred is one of the only songs by Dream Theater where the transitions make absolutely no sense to me - I don't understand how it's apparently more "mature" (or how writing a really good nineteen-minute long prog metal song is immature, for that matter - it's a really lazy criticism which is thrown around far too much).
I guess I'm the only one who doesn't really have a problem with the transitions in Scarred. I can't ever recall listening to it and thinking "wow that was a weird transition". If you can find one in Scarred as terrible as the Beautiful Agony -> blues type solo section in Nightmare be my guest.
I consider Scarred mature in how tastefully composed the sections and solos are. The techniques used meld together very nicely and aren't overpowering at all. It's also a great showcase on how creative JP used to be. Aside from maybe Lines In The Sand I haven't heard much of any of that in the newer stuff. To answer about The Count, it's immature mainly in lyrics but aside from the fantastic intro and last 5 or so minutes the music is not that great of quality.
2:10, 3:16, 4:35, 7:02. 9:32. You're welcome. (I didn't repeat sections where it had the same transition, or lack thereof). Some of those are out of nowhere like a bullet from the night. The one is ANTR isn't that bad at all. In fact, it flows nicely, unlike the randomness of Scarred.
LSOAD is a pretty standard ballady type song.
Listen again. It's the least "standard" "ballad" I've ever heard.
Upon listening to the song again, you're right. Unlike Scarred and SDV I realized I haven't given this song a recent chance at all. It's actually not bad. I think it's just the initial U2 vibe that puts me off. But once you get past that, it's much better. I'll upgrade that song from unlistenable to ok. :p
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The one is ANTR isn't that bad at all. In fact, it flows nicely, unlike the randomness of Scarred.
You've got to be fucking kidding me.
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The one is ANTR isn't that bad at all. In fact, it flows nicely, unlike the randomness of Scarred.
You've got to be fucking kidding me.
No. I'm not. There are some abrupt transitions in TCOT, TSF and AROP, but I think ANTR flows very well.
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With a little help from food poisoning.
He was having bad nights before the incident, and plenty of bootlegs from the later legs of the I&W tours and before the incident show him as much less of a monster than we assume from the overdubbed Live at the Marquee. Sometimes, I genuinely wonder if the food poisoning had as much to do with James' inconsistent singing from 95-02 as simply not taking care of himself and screaming through songs like "Surrounded" did.
The one is ANTR isn't that bad at all. In fact, it flows nicely, unlike the randomness of Scarred.
You've got to be fucking kidding me.
No. I'm not. There are some abrupt transitions in TCOT, TSF and AROP, but I think ANTR flows very well.
Agreed. It's one of the least cut & paste sounding epics DT have done ever. It all flows very nicely, except for when it comes out of Beautiful Agony.
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Which is the part I'm talking about.
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The one is ANTR isn't that bad at all. In fact, it flows nicely, unlike the randomness of Scarred.
You've got to be fucking kidding me.
Not particlarly polite, but it's pretty smooth I'd say! No drastic change in tempo or time signature (I don't think! I'd need to listen again to be certain), and it mirrors the opening of that section pretty well. I quite like it.
I consider Scarred mature in how tastefully composed the sections and solos are. The techniques used meld together very nicely and aren't overpowering at all. It's also a great showcase on how creative JP used to be. Aside from maybe Lines In The Sand I haven't heard much of any of that in the newer stuff. To answer about The Count, it's immature mainly in lyrics but aside from the fantastic intro and last 5 or so minutes the music is not that great of quality.
I'd disagree on the melding together very nicely, which I guess is again purely personal response. I think it seems a bit mad to say that Scarred fits together well, you think it seems a bit mad to say ANTR is pretty seamless, so that's probably gotta rest at a stalemate!
I'd agree that it's not overpowering, but I don't think there's anything immature about making powerful, bombastic music. Small and subtle isn't necessarily more mature than big and soaring. I'm kinda curious to how you'd weigh in on that.
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Which is the part I'm talking about.
Which isn't a big deal or out of the ordinary considering the transitions in any of the other songs of similar length. Hell, as much as I love "Learning to Live," it has to be one of the most cut & paste style songs DT have ever written.
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Which is the part I'm talking about.
I think that part flows nicely. It is a short buildup of only a bar or two, but it's definitely not what I'd call abrupt. There are much better examples on BCASL of sudden transitions, and I think some of the transitions in Scarred are just as sudden as anything they have done recently. An abrupt transition usually involves a sudden change of tempo and/or key. The section of ANTR doesn't do either of those.
Now of course your point in general was about complaining about Scarred while DT do similar transitions now. I've always acknowledged when DT have done equally abrupt ones recently, such as TCOT, AROP, and there are one or two in TSF that interrupt the flow too. The difference is that people don't fellate those songs and pretend the transitions are perfectly faultless.
But from thinking of recent examples, abrupt isn't always bad, but whether it works or not is subjective. To argue that the ones in Scarred or good or bad isn't a very fruitful discussion, but all I'm trying to say is that it does have some very abrupt transitions.
Some work, some don't. I think the quick transition of TCOT works well, while the ones in AROP and some of the ones in TSF don't. And I personally don't think the ones in Scarred work well. That's just my opinion.
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I'd say FII is a lot more mixed, and the newer ones like ToT and Octavarium. Awake usually ranks top 3 for a lot of people here, but I see a lot more variety in opinions for the other albums I've mentioned, ranking from favourite to least favourite, and everything inbetween.
Yeah I think ToT and Octavarium have far more split fan opinions than Awake.
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Which is the part I'm talking about.
That bit is less abrupt than a number of moments in Scarred. But it's not all that relevant anyway, abrupt transitions =/= bad song by itself, plenty of great songs have sudden transitions or lots of sections.
For me, the problem with Scarred is the combination of that and too many of the sections just not being very interesting. I think Awake is a great album, but Scarred is definitely DT's most overrated song IMO.
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Yeah, it's a cool album.
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Awake.
Classic DT, amazing follow up to Images & Words. I don't know how they did it, but I guess with I&W and Awake DT made the blueprint for their musical style. I can hear the styles of both albums coming back, time and time again.
I don't think Awake is better than I&W, or vice versa. Let's attempt an album list for old times' sake:
1. Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence - Dream Theater, but with a new found drift to experiment with sounds and songs.
2. Images & Words / Awake - Dream Theater, majestic and sentimental (these albums make me feel sentimental). Songwriting-wise and atmospherically speaking, these are the albums that make this band unique.
3. Scenes From a Memory - A DT classic for sure, no words can do this album justice. The perfect concept album, and definately a new kind of musical high for the band.
4. Black Clouds and Silver Linings - A perfection of the 'modern' DT sound. This record is convincing, even though we've kind of heard it before.
5. Falling Into Infinity - A more commercial record, but the grooves they got going on Lines in the Sand, New Millennium and Trial of Tears are kind of ground breaking for the band. The record has IMO the best sound production of all DT records, but maybe not the most suitable sound.
6. Octavarium - A refined focus on songwriting here. Great record but Never Enough doesn't rock hard enough. Of course, the title track is among the band's best.
7. Train of Thought - Monolithic and heavy. Maybe this deserves to be higher, because it scores serious points with its consistency and focus throughout. I'm glad this album exists, it's great to have a DT record with a full-on metal approach.
8. Systematic Chaos - I appreciate the effort, but DT didn't really grab me with this one.
9. When Dream and Day Unite - Great start of a great band, but DT without JLB isn't DT for me.
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Awake is a great album. The only flaw I see is the inclusion of SDV. It feels like an afterthought when you compare it to the style of the other tracks, and the song is one of the weakest tracks in their catalog. Swapping out that song would have made it just about perfect.
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Here's why Awake is a great album:
1) Obviously, because the songs are good.
2) On a more detailed level, because the songs are good in diverse ways. "6:00" and "Caught in a Web" are really groovy. "The Silent Man" and "Lifting Shadows off a Dream" are subtle and understated. "The Mirror" and "Space-Dye Vest" are borderline disturbing in the extremity of their pain. I appreciate these contrasts.
3) Leaning heavily towards ideology, because even though the songs are good in diverse ways, they are linked by a singular dark, moody atmosphere. Some have called KM's keyboard sounds circusy and silly; but, I disagree. I think his keyboards make the record.
4) The lyrics are outstanding. They're so dense you could argue they're dense for the sake of being dense (an argument I've debated countless times), but when one analyses them, he discovers nearly every line is relevant.
I interpret the lyrics as telling the stories of two characters. Maybe the stories of JP and KM themselves. And they're fascinating to read because although both begin their journey in the same place - one of despair - the JP character ends up "content" while the KM character ends worse than he started. Listening to the respective lyricists' words takes the record to a whole new level.
Overall, it's a terrific experience. And it's supremely emotional. And it's extremely relating. And I think Dream Theater should be infinitely proud of it because of how personal it is, and because of how courageous it had to be to be so personal in the first place. And even if you're of the belief it's not one of their better efforts, I think you can give them some props for that.
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Very well put, I had never thought about the album like that (two characters), very interesting way to look at it. I feel like listening to it now with that in mind.
Oh, and obligatory, OMG IS AWAKE CONCEPT ALBUM??
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Kevin Moore's sounds in the beginning of Caught in a Web are a fail
What? That is pretty much THE definitive DT keyboard tone. Kevin Moore used it all over the place, Derek Sherinian used it a little bit, and Jordan Rudess uses it pretty often, too. I think the only difference is Moore played more of a lead with that tone in the beginning of "Caught in a Web," unlike most of their other songs, where that tone is usually used to play textural chords.
Even I love the intro to Caught in a Web (great fun to play on keyboard too, although tricky on the pitch bender). The basic octave strings sound would have to be one of the most commonly used DT sounds, although I can't think of any other instance where it is played with pitch bender, so I think you're right.
Chorus of Voices. (On the initial F chord)
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Here's why Awake is a great album:
1) Obviously, because the songs are good.
2) On a more detailed level, because the songs are good in diverse ways. "6:00" and "Caught in a Web" are really groovy. "The Silent Man" and "Lifting Shadows off a Dream" are subtle and understated. "The Mirror" and "Space-Dye Vest" are borderline disturbing in the extremity of their pain. I appreciate these contrasts.
3) Leaning heavily towards ideology, because even though the songs are good in diverse ways, they are linked by a singular dark, moody atmosphere. Some have called KM's keyboard sounds circusy and silly; but, I disagree. I think his keyboards make the record.
4) The lyrics are outstanding. They're so dense you could argue they're dense for the sake of being dense (an argument I've debated countless times), but when one analyses them, he discovers nearly every line is relevant.
I interpret the lyrics as telling the stories of two characters. Maybe the stories of JP and KM themselves. And they're fascinating to read because although both begin their journey in the same place - one of despair - the JP character ends up "content" while the KM character ends worse than he started. Listening to the respective lyricists' words takes the record to a whole new level.
Overall, it's a terrific experience. And it's supremely emotional. And it's extremely relating. And I think Dream Theater should be infinitely proud of it because of how personal it is, and because of how courageous it had to be to be so personal in the first place. And even if you're of the belief it's not one of their better efforts, I think you can give them some props for that.
Very well-said, and I agree. However, I have never heard anyone refer to Moore's keyboard sounds as "circusy and silly". :lol
-J
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https://www.fiveeightforums.com/favorite-dream-theater-album-t86348/index.html?p=2210132#post2210132
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You bumped an ancient thread for some useless BS from 5/8? :facepalm:
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Yes.
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Yes.
Congratulations, you contributed absolutely nothing to the thread, other than perhaps to stoke your massive ego. Go away.
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Yes, many opinions do vary on Awake, but that doesn't change the fact that it is one of their best albums.
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Yes, many opinions do vary on Awake, but that doesn't change the fact that it is one of their best albums.
Obviously you don't know what opinion means if you think that's a fact.
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Congratulations, you contributed absolutely nothing to the thread
I was demonstrating that in a site with more diverse music discussion, Awake is top rated. It's probably not really the thing for prog nerds (ratings on progarchives are pretty low) but it seems like it's being more recognized with time.
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Yes, many opinions do vary on Awake, but that doesn't change the fact that it is one of their best albums.
Obviously you don't know what opinion means if you think that's a fact.
Well, I would argue that if a majority (or at least a plurality, given the number of albums they have) of fans rate it in their top 3, then that would make it one of their best albums, as far as their fans are concerned
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Congratulations, you contributed absolutely nothing to the thread
I was demonstrating that in a site with more diverse music discussion, Awake is top rated. It's probably not really the thing for prog nerds (ratings on progarchives are pretty low) but it seems like it's being more recognized with time.
So, when searching for a site with more diverse music discussion, you decided that the best example would be the other message board that branched off from the Official Dream Theater Website, on which most of the posters are lapsed Dream Theater fans, many of whom lapsed specifically because they were disappointed with the current material.
I don't see how that could possibly be an unrepresentative sample. Crikey bollocks.
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I don't see how that could possibly be an unrepresentative sample.
It's easy when you're up your own ass (I know you were being sarcastic so this isn't directed at you).
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Congratulations, you contributed absolutely nothing to the thread
I was demonstrating that in a site with more diverse music discussion, Awake is top rated. It's probably not really the thing for prog nerds (ratings on progarchives are pretty low) but it seems like it's being more recognized with time.
5/8 is not only NOT a DT related forum, but it's a forum that exists because they didn't like DT any more, and reading any DT thread there, it's just a pissing contest to see who can blatantly bash DT the most, and you'll see there is no actual discussion there. If anything, their opinion means less than anyone's due to their ridiculous biases, and bringing it here has no relevance, let alone bumping an ancient thread to do so.
edit: beaten by robwebster, and in style
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So, when searching for a site with more diverse music discussion, you decided that the best example would be the other message board that branched off from the Official Dream Theater Website, on which most of the posters are lapsed Dream Theater fans, many of whom lapsed specifically because they were disappointed with the current material.
Lol good point. But when we're discussing 'best album' nothing beyond Six Degrees is in the equation anyways, and Six Degrees is long before before the fans got "lapsed" so the link is still relevant.
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But when we're discussing 'best album' nothing beyond Six Degrees is in the equation anyways.
I'm listening.
This had better be fucking impressive.
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Yes.
Congratulations, you contributed absolutely nothing to the thread, other than perhaps to stoke your massive ego. Go away.
Dream Team, that was absolutely uncalled for. Ack44 did nothing wrong. If you are that annoyed that he bumped an old thread, then don't waste your time reading it or our time replying in it.
Congratulations, you contributed absolutely nothing to the thread
I was demonstrating that in a site with more diverse music discussion, Awake is top rated. It's probably not really the thing for prog nerds (ratings on progarchives are pretty low) but it seems like it's being more recognized with time.
5/8 is not only NOT a DT related forum, but it's a forum that exists because they didn't like DT any more, and reading any DT thread there, it's just a pissing contest to see who can blatantly bash DT the most, and you'll see there is no actual discussion there. If anything, their opinion means less than anyone's due to their ridiculous biases, and bringing it here has no relevance, let alone bumping an ancient thread to do so.
edit: beaten by robwebster, and in style
Yeah, no offense, but Rob did a much better job of making the same point.
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Congratulations, you contributed absolutely nothing to the thread
I was demonstrating that in a site with more diverse music discussion, Awake is top rated. It's probably not really the thing for prog nerds (ratings on progarchives are pretty low) but it seems like it's being more recognized with time.
5/8 is not only NOT a DT related forum, but it's a forum that exists because they didn't like DT any more, and reading any DT thread there, it's just a pissing contest to see who can blatantly bash DT the most, and you'll see there is no actual discussion there. If anything, their opinion means less than anyone's due to their ridiculous biases, and bringing it here has no relevance, let alone bumping an ancient thread to do so.
edit: beaten by robwebster, and in style
Yeah, no offense, but Rob did a much better job of making the same point.
No offense taken. Robwebster is the master, and I already acknowledged he did it better. :hat
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But when we're discussing 'best album' nothing beyond Six Degrees is in the equation anyways.
I'm listening.
This had better be fucking impressive.
Do listen, and be enlightened.
I just psycho-analyzed myself and realized the only reason I posted in this thread was to :corn while people got riled up about an undesirable link in their forum.
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Cool. A bit like your posts in every Israel thread, right?
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No, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is a much more serious matter and there is no trolling whatsoever.
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I just psycho-analyzed myself and realized the only reason I posted in this thread was to :corn while people got riled up about an undesirable link in their forum.
Why?
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Yes, many opinions do vary on Awake, but that doesn't change the fact that it is one of their best albums.
Obviously you don't know what opinion means if you think that's a fact.
Obviously, you can't take a joke. :P
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But when we're discussing 'best album' nothing beyond Six Degrees is in the equation anyways.
I'm listening.
This had better be fucking impressive.
Do listen, and be enlightened.
I just psycho-analyzed myself and realized the only reason I posted in this thread was to :corn while people got riled up about an undesirable link in their forum.
No disrespect, but your attitude exactly the reason why 5/8 will never fully grow up from being a place for people pissed off at DT or the various affiliated fansites. Which is probably a good thing, because otherwise it'd just turn into a "lite" version of a certain "chan" site.
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But when we're discussing 'best album' nothing beyond Six Degrees is in the equation anyways.
I'm listening.
This had better be fucking impressive.
Do listen, and be enlightened.
I just psycho-analyzed myself and realized the only reason I posted in this thread was to :corn while people got riled up about an undesirable link in their forum.
No disrespect, but your attitude exactly the reason why 5/8 will never fully grow up from being a place for people pissed off at DT or the various affiliated fansites. Which is probably a good thing, because otherwise it'd just turn into a "lite" version of a certain "chan" site.
PC, we don't need bashing of ANY other forum here.
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Aye aye, captain.
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Congratulations, you contributed absolutely nothing to the thread
I was demonstrating that in a site with more diverse music discussion, Awake is top rated. It's probably not really the thing for prog nerds (ratings on progarchives are pretty low) but it seems like it's being more recognized with time.
5/8 is not only NOT a DT related forum, but it's a forum that exists because they didn't like DT any more, and reading any DT thread there, it's just a pissing contest to see who can blatantly bash DT the most, and you'll see there is no actual discussion there. If anything, their opinion means less than anyone's due to their ridiculous biases, and bringing it here has no relevance, let alone bumping an ancient thread to do so.
edit: beaten by robwebster, and in style
And of course, you have no rebuttal for this post of BVD's.
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Cause he responded to rob's, dude.
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With a little help from food poisoning.
He was having bad nights before the incident, and plenty of bootlegs from the later legs of the I&W tours and before the incident show him as much less of a monster than we assume from the overdubbed Live at the Marquee. Sometimes, I genuinely wonder if the food poisoning had as much to do with James' inconsistent singing from 95-02 as simply not taking care of himself and screaming through songs like "Surrounded" did.
You got to be kidding. At that moment his voice was tired. He wasn't as dedicated to the care of his voice like today because he had his "I'm young and I'm a rocker, fuck the future" attitude. Had he been as careful as he is today you would listen the majority of the nights the same type of voice you hear in Awake. That lot of drive in his voice was, still, badass.
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I can see why people would call it badass, but to me it just sounds harsh and isn't really what I want from DT vocals.
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No disrespect, but your attitude exactly the reason why 5/8 will never fully grow up from being a place for people pissed off at DT or the various affiliated fansites. Which is probably a good thing, because otherwise it'd just turn into a "lite" version of a certain "chan" site.
Me pissed off at DT and affiliated fansites? Silliness. The only piss in this thread is towards 5/8, exact opposite dude. Sure there are people who hate DTF, but I'm not one of them.
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No disrespect, but your attitude exactly the reason why 5/8 will never fully grow up from being a place for people pissed off at DT or the various affiliated fansites. Which is probably a good thing, because otherwise it'd just turn into a "lite" version of a certain "chan" site.
Me pissed off at DT and affiliated fansites? Silliness. The only piss in this thread is towards 5/8, exact opposite dude. Sure there are people who hate DTF, but I'm not one of them.
Oh. Sorry. I couldn't tell :biggrin:
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A music discussion site.
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OK, enough, guys.
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Yes Awake is my 2nd least favorite Dream Theater CD... but only because I like everything else more.
6:00 - Love that song one of the best on Awake.
Caught In A Web - Mid tier song. Not crazy about it. But I am listening to it as I type this. It's a fun one.
Innocence Faded - I would say another mid tier song for me.
Erotomania - Probably my least favorite Dream Theater instrumental. No real hooks that grab me. But very good technically.
Voices - Best song on Awake
The Silent Man - Love it... and I rarely say that about acoustic songs.
The Mirror - Lower mid tier. Not much that grabs me.
Lie - Love it. I like the contrast of the silly lyrics and the hard riffs.
Lifting Shadows Off A Dream - My least favorite Dream Theater song. Not a fan of "relationship" songs and "Lifting shadows off a Dream once broken. She can turn a drop of water Into an ocean" is tackier than any lyric in Burning My Soul.
Scarred - Took me time to like it. It's a solid song. That said they have done better.
Space Dye Vest - Love the song just shouldn't be an album closer.
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Lifting Shadows Off A Dream - My least favorite Dream Theater song.
:P
Not a fan of "relationship" songs and "Lifting shadows off a Dream once broken. She can turn a drop of water Into an ocean" is tackier than any lyric in Burning My Soul.
what
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Keep my thoughts and ideas locked inside of my head?
Don't ask me why my hair is gray.
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THE APE ON MY BACK :metal
Tbh, I do agree with you on Awake. Not on the specifics necessarily, but the bit where you say it's among your least favourites, but only cause you like everything else more - that's a fantastic quote.
It's superb! Fine figure of an album, brimming with very good songs. But then I look at all the other albums, and they're bursting at the seams with character! They're more turbulent and exciting, more ostentatious, more powerful. And so, on that behalf, I don't find myself wanting to listen to the subtle Dream Theater album very often when the band's clearly at their strongest when they're big and bombastic and jostle you about a bit.
But still. Awake's good.
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As I said, for me Awake is the best DT album as a whole album. There are songs in other albums that I prefer, but as an album, is the best for me. And I entered into DT's world last summer. (I had a 2004 moment when I listened to ToT - the first DT album I listened to).
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THE APE ON MY BACK :metal
Tbh, I do agree with you on Awake. Not on the specifics necessarily, but the bit where you say it's among your least favourites, but only cause you like everything else more - that's a fantastic quote.
It's superb! Fine figure of an album, brimming with very good songs. But then I look at all the other albums, and they're bursting at the seams with character! They're more turbulent and exciting, more ostentatious, more powerful. And so, on that behalf, I don't find myself wanting to listen to the subtle Dream Theater album very often when the band's clearly at their strongest when they're big and bombastic and jostle you about a bit.
But still. Awake's good.
Exactly. Yeah Voices and Scarred are great "epic" songs. But stood up to songs like Lines In The Sand, Learning To Live, The Glass Prison and In The Name Of God? You get my point.
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Awake is my top 1 DT album, because it contains almost all the sounds DT can produce.
Happy-Hippy songs like Innocence Faded and Lifting Shadows Off a Dream.
Sad song like Space-Dye-Vest.
Heavy songs like Caught in a Web, Mirror.
Complex songs like Lie, Scarred.
Clean song like Silent Man.
Unique songs like 6:00, Erotomania.
And probably the best song in the album, Voices.
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Awake is my top 1 DT album, because it contains almost all the sounds DT can produce.
That's where I disagree. To me it feels like it's missing certain aspects of DT's sound, most importantly the aspect of what I'd sum up as fun. It has a bit more upbeat songs, but nothing fun. It mostly feels too dark and serious. IaW was a fun album. And even though I wouldn't really call FII fun, it was a much lighter album. That's one of the reasons Awake is my least favourite DT album.
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I think Awake is their worst album, mainly because of the keyboards. Except for 6:00, the keyboard work is terrible. I guess the only DT album with worse keyboard work could be WDADU, but I only listen to the WDADRU version of it, so I don't remember.
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I think Awake is their worst album, mainly because of the keyboards. Except for 6:00, the keyboard work is terrible. I guess the only DT album with worse keyboard work could be WDADU, but I only listen to the WDADRU version of it, so I don't remember.
I think the Keyboards sound great about half of the time, but the other half they actively work against the songs. And yup, same goes for WDADU.
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The only keyboard work I'd call bad on Awake is perhaps Lie. Other than that, it's just their most subdued keyboard work and pretty inoffensive. At worst it just sits in the background and doesn't contribute at all, and at best it does a great job of adding atmosphere, like Voices, although the constant synth string sound throughout the album wears thin at times.
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Awake is my top 1 DT album, because it contains almost all the sounds DT can produce.
That's where I disagree. To me it feels like it's missing certain aspects of DT's sound, most importantly the aspect of what I'd sum up as fun. It has a bit more upbeat songs, but nothing fun. It mostly feels too dark and serious. IaW was a fun album. And even though I wouldn't really call FII fun, it was a much lighter album. That's one of the reasons Awake is my least favourite DT album.
You're right, actually. 100% couldn't-be-correcter. That's exactly what it is. It's not fun. Most of the other albums feel like a big ol' adventure. Awake's just solemn.
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Awake is my top 1 DT album, because it contains almost all the sounds DT can produce.
That's where I disagree. To me it feels like it's missing certain aspects of DT's sound, most importantly the aspect of what I'd sum up as fun. It has a bit more upbeat songs, but nothing fun. It mostly feels too dark and serious. IaW was a fun album. And even though I wouldn't really call FII fun, it was a much lighter album. That's one of the reasons Awake is my least favourite DT album.
You're right, actually. 100% couldn't-be-correcter. That's exactly what it is. It's not fun. Most of the other albums feel like a big ol' adventure. Awake's just solemn.
And on the flpside, it's probably a big reason why a lot of people who love Awake love it. I can appreciate that many prefer the more serious dark tone of it, but personally I feel it has less character and charm than their other albums.
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Blob, I can hear your frustration in what I've read in this thread. It's like being a non Opeth/Muse/PT fan on DTF....
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Blob, I can hear your frustration in what I've read in this thread. It's like being a non Opeth/Muse/PT fan on DTF....
Which I can also sympathize with :lol (although I like Opeth, I still easily understand this one)
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I didn't know you liked Opeth, but cool :tup
Easily the best of the other bands DTFers cheat on DT with around here :D
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Blob, I can hear your frustration in what I've read in this thread. It's like being a non Opeth/Muse/PT fan on DTF....
:lol Perfect analogy.
I think Awake is their worst album, mainly because of the keyboards. Except for 6:00, the keyboard work is terrible. I guess the only DT album with worse keyboard work could be WDADU, but I only listen to the WDADRU version of it, so I don't remember.
I think the Keyboards sound great about half of the time, but the other half they actively work against the songs. And yup, same goes for WDADU.
Definitely. For the longest time, I couldn't even listen to CIAW because of that horrible, whiny, off-key keyboard sound Kev is using.
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Yeah, sometimes it sounds like all he's doing is pitch-bending generic string-synths and it sounds bad. Caught in a Web and Lie were definitely the two examples I had in mind. But on the A Mind Beside Itself songs, he does a fantastic job.
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I think Awake is their worst album, mainly because of the keyboards. Except for 6:00, the keyboard work is terrible. I guess the only DT album with worse keyboard work could be WDADU, but I only listen to the WDADRU version of it, so I don't remember.
I think the Keyboards sound great about half of the time, but the other half they actively work against the songs. And yup, same goes for WDADU.
Definitely. For the longest time, I couldn't even listen to CIAW because of that horrible, whiny, off-key keyboard sound Kev is using.
Funnily enough, CIAW is my favourite use of the string sound on the album, and I quite like that intro. Funny how that goes :lol
But I know what you mean, because I don't like the similar pitch bendy thing on Lie.
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Now that you mention it, I seem to recall being put off by it a bit on Lie as well. I think I had more quickly forgotten about it because (1) it's either not as high in the mix on that song, or just not as "in your face" for some reason, and (2) I've heard so many good live versions of the song over the years, I don't even specifically recall the studio version all that well.
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I disagree about the keyboards on Awake. I love the sound tones, the tenderness of the playing, everything. That album is what made me a KM fan. The sounds used are much warmer than I&W. No, they're not in the forefront, but that's what I like. They are atmospheric. For me, that's how I like keyboards to be. It adds that additional element to songs and really fills out the sound. I seem to recall KM saying he didn't care for the Awake mix. Not sure why or when he said that. I can probably find it.
My fav keyboard moment on Awake is early on in "Voices" when it gets quiet and you just hear JLB and the piano. mmm mmm mmm, that's good stuff.
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I agree, I've never found the keyboards off-putting in any way on Awake (and I am most certainly not a KM fanboi).
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I disagree about the keyboards on Awake. I love the sound tones, the tenderness of the playing, everything. That album is what made me a KM fan. The sounds used are much warmer than I&W. No, they're not in the forefront, but that's what I like. They are atmospheric. For me, that's how I like keyboards to be. It adds that additional element to songs and really fills out the sound. I seem to recall KM saying he didn't care for the Awake mix. Not sure why or when he said that. I can probably find it.
My fav keyboard moment on Awake is early on in "Voices" when it gets quiet and you just hear JLB and the piano. mmm mmm mmm, that's good stuff.
I like a lot of it. But there are spots here and there, like the keyboard lead patch in CIAW that I mentioned above, that are like nails on a chalkboard.
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I agree, I've never found the keyboards off-putting in any way on Awake (and I am most certainly not a KM fanboi).
I agree with this.
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I agree, I've never found the keyboards off-putting in any way on Awake (and I am most certainly not a KM fanboi).
I agree with this.
Yes, the Keyboards on Awake are my favorite actually.
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Awake is my favorite DT album and by a wide margin.
I remember receiving an advance cassette copy of it from Atco when I was doing music reviews in my college newspaper. My few DT fan friends gathered around a stereo and listened. If I remember, the songs were not in the correct running order and "Scarred" was omitted (just like the official cassette release).
I found it to be almost perfection.
If I have to find one song I am not 100% pleased with, it's "Innocence Faded." I always joked that the intro to that song sounded like the theme song to a TV show like 90210 :-)
6:00 is the perfect opening. Those toms just get to you.
I remember being on a bus with other music majors going to an opera in Manhattan . . . . One of our professors was a very very old Harpsichord player, relatively famous back in his day - at least for harpsichord players (R.I.P Dr. Cross). I played him "Space Dye Vest" and he was very impressed.
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Holy thread resurrection, batman!
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Awake is #4 for me, behind Six Degrees, Train of Thought and Scenes From a Memory. It's a great album, much better than the overrated Images and Words, in my opinion. Awake is a dark album, and that's what I love about it. It has a couple of "meh" songs, but stuff like Voices, Scarred and The Mirror are top tier Dream Theater. The guitar tone and Labrie's voice are on point in this album. Even the slowersongs are pretty good here. Other than 6:00, there is not one song I don't like on this album.
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One of their darker albums I like what the other poster have said about two characters writing the lyrics.
It seems Awake ended in despair "Space Dye Vest" and it is really a dark album.
And because of that I love how they included that in breaking the 4th wall, the hopelessness and darkness of Space Dye Vest was resolved by the "Illumination Theory" suite.
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Based on the songs they've played from the Awake album on their last two DVDs, I should like this album. From what I heard in the proshots, I liked 6:00, The Silent Man, The Mirror/Lie, Lifting Shadows off a Dream, and Space-Dye Vest. Never gave the studio album a full listen. I'll probably do that today.
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Awake is my favorite DT album and by a wide margin.
I remember receiving an advance cassette copy of it from Atco when I was doing music reviews in my college newspaper. My few DT fan friends gathered around a stereo and listened. If I remember, the songs were not in the correct running order and "Scarred" was omitted (just like the official cassette release).
I found it to be almost perfection.
If I have to find one song I am not 100% pleased with, it's "Innocence Faded." I always joked that the intro to that song sounded like the theme song to a TV show like 90210 :-)
6:00 is the perfect opening. Those toms just get to you.
I remember being on a bus with other music majors going to an opera in Manhattan . . . . One of our professors was a very very old Harpsichord player, relatively famous back in his day - at least for harpsichord players (R.I.P Dr. Cross). I played him "Space Dye Vest" and he was very impressed.
(https://s2.glbimg.com/QFgMCKE4GFegH7re5fPeeZLN69c=/620x465/s.glbimg.com/jo/g1/f/original/2013/10/30/dscn3645.jpg)
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Have they ever given an explanation why Scarred was left off the casette? Casette tapes can carry 90 minutes of music.
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They were 'scared' to put it on :hat
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They were 'scared' to put it on :hat
Don't be scared homie!! >:( :censored >:(
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Old thread, but I will throw in my two cents..
I was in my late teens when WDADU came out. Stumbled on it with the help of a guy at a Sam Goody. Loved it! A fresh new band to compete with FW Awaken The Guardian.
Then came images and words... It took time to grow on me. DT with a hair band singer, ugh. It almost seemed as if James' voice was strained and not up to the songs. Then came Awake.... This was a 10+ to me. The band was hitting on all cylinders and the songs were written for James. Perfection! It was/is their best. It was the Kiss Destroyer of Dream Theater, to me (My opinion, of course).
Of course, then came FII.. For another day ;D
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Awake is my favorite DT album and by a wide margin.
I remember receiving an advance cassette copy of it from Atco when I was doing music reviews in my college newspaper. My few DT fan friends gathered around a stereo and listened. If I remember, the songs were not in the correct running order and "Scarred" was omitted (just like the official cassette release).
I found it to be almost perfection.
If I have to find one song I am not 100% pleased with, it's "Innocence Faded." I always joked that the intro to that song sounded like the theme song to a TV show like 90210 :-)
6:00 is the perfect opening. Those toms just get to you.
I remember being on a bus with other music majors going to an opera in Manhattan . . . . One of our professors was a very very old Harpsichord player, relatively famous back in his day - at least for harpsichord players (R.I.P Dr. Cross). I played him "Space Dye Vest" and he was very impressed.
Definitely agree about Innocence Faded although I never noticed the 90210 connection. Man, you're right.
Also not a fan of Lifting Shadows and am lukewarm about Scarred. Otherwise the album is flawless.
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It's heavy, the sound is great and it's JLB's best studio performance IMO and it has my favorite DT song Scarred. Flawless album except for the intro to Innocence Faded indeed.
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6:00 is the perfect opening. Those toms just get to you.
6:00 Is always my go-to song when I try out a new sound system.
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It's definitely my favorite DT album. :tup
Hearing it instrumentally recently confirms this for me too, it's got such a gritty 90s sound. Mix and everything is perfect too :angel:
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Holy thread resurrection, batman!
See, it's awesome for "new fans" like me who missed a lot of these threads before.
I love Awake. Innocent Faded and Lifting Shadows are my own 2 meh moments of the whole album.
I also LOL'd in this thread how someone said SDV "won't ever be played live" and then they did a few years ago :)
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Warm summer evening, cruising around with the windows down, Innocence Faded blasting.......not perfect?