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General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: 73109 on August 24, 2009, 11:45:23 AM
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Any Pantera fans here. If there are, let this be a general appreciation thread.
*appreciates*
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*Appreciates*
Pantera's a great band, and definitely a band responsible on making me love metal.
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*appreciates*
Dime was a legend. Vulgar Display of Power is damn good. That is all.
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WE'RE TAKING OVER THIS TOWN
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*appreciates*
Dime was a legend. Vulgar Display of Power is damn good. That is all.
I know Dime can't be replaced but it would be so fucking awesome if Zakk Wylde would fill in for Dime for a one-off reunion tour. Phil and Vinnie of fucking children.
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I do so love Pantera. Saw them from the 2nd row on FBD...left with a black eye and a knot on my head...
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:metal
One of the first metal bands I got into. Their only weaker album was Far Beyond Driven. Everything else was fantastic. Nothing more I can say really :hat :)
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*appreciates*
Dime was a legend. Vulgar Display of Power is damn good. That is all.
I know Dime can't be replaced but it would be so fucking awesome if Zakk Wylde would fill in for Dime for a one-off reunion tour. Phil and Vinnie of fucking children.
You say Dime can't be replaced, but then you attempt to replace him with one of the most overrated guitarists ever? Interesting.
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*Appreciates*
Pantera's a great band, and definitely a band responsible on making me love metal.
Same here...
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You say Dime can't be replaced, but then you attempt to replace him with one of the most overrated guitarists ever? Interesting.
A. Zakk is a pretty good metal guitarist and a really cool guy
B. No, Dime is irreplacable but I would want Pantera to move on. Just think of Dime as Cliff Burton. He was irreplacable but Metallica went on.
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A. NO U
B. Pantera accomplished everything they needed to with those five albums. Pantera had broken up 3 years before Dime was killed. Cliff was killed when Metallica were in their prime. There's no reason for Pantera to reunite.
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A. NO U
B. Pantera accomplished everything they needed to with those five albums. Pantera had broken up 3 years before Dime was killed. Cliff was killed when Metallica were in their prime. There's no reason for Pantera to reunite.
Hey, I was too young to see them in their prime and I want to see them, and if that means replacing a guitar god witha pretty bad ass metal guitarist, so be it. I don't want more music, I want to SEE them.
and what is up with A. NO U?
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*appreciates*
Dime was a legend. Vulgar Display of Power is damn good. That is all.
I know Dime can't be replaced but it would be so fucking awesome if Zakk Wylde would fill in for Dime for a one-off reunion tour. Phil and Vinnie of fucking children.
Zack's intensity isn't high enough for that band...and Ozzy just fired the dude..and AND he was hospitalized for a blood clot.
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A. NO U
B. Pantera accomplished everything they needed to with those five albums. Pantera had broken up 3 years before Dime was killed. Cliff was killed when Metallica were in their prime. There's no reason for Pantera to reunite.
Hey, I was too young to see them in their prime and I want to see them, and if that means replacing a guitar god witha pretty bad ass metal guitarist, so be it. I don't want more music, I want to SEE them.
and what is up with A. NO U?
Dude, so was I. 95% of seeing Pantera live is watching Dime be Jesus. If I can't see Pantera with Dime, then I don't want to see Pantera. It's as simple as that.
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A. NO U
B. Pantera accomplished everything they needed to with those five albums. Pantera had broken up 3 years before Dime was killed. Cliff was killed when Metallica were in their prime. There's no reason for Pantera to reunite.
Hey, I was too young to see them in their prime and I want to see them, and if that means replacing a guitar god witha pretty bad ass metal guitarist, so be it. I don't want more music, I want to SEE them.
and what is up with A. NO U?
Dude, so was I. 95% of seeing Pantera live is watching Dime be Jesus. If I can't see Pantera with Dime, then I don't want to see Pantera. It's as simple as that.
You made me chuckle. But I have to disagree. I think Phils' stage presence and vocal delivery and overall badassness (when he wasn't fucked up) was just as important as "Dime being Jesus"
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I saw them twice.
Phill was the man.
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Pantera was fucking amazing. Such a tragedy how it all ended. RIP Dimebag.
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I saw them at the Hammerstein in New York for the reinventing the steel tour, i saw them in other occasions but this time around i was first row in front of dimebag and had a nice bruise across my chest from the guard rail and a pick from dimebag to show for it. the flame throwers inside a venue really get toasty!
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WASH AWAY US ALL
TAKE US WITH THE FLOODS
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WASH AWAY US ALL
TAKE US WITH THE FLOODS
Thats my second favorite song of theirs. Just behind The Sleep.
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Their only weaker album was Far Beyond Driven.
That's probably my favourite album of theirs. :lol
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Vulgar Display Of Power is my favourite Pantera album.
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Pantera = :metal :metal :metal :metal
This dude (https://forums.simcentral.net/showthread.php?t=51797) = Asshat
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The Great Southern Trendkill is the best Pantera album.
FUCK THE WORLD
FOR ALL IT'S WORTH
EVERY INCH
OF PLANET EARTH
:metal :metal :metal :metal :metal
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One of my all- time favorite bands and probably my favorite metal band. I was lucky enough to see them live twice, but unfortunately both times were from a seat in an arena...so I never got to really "experience" a Pantera show.
But all of their albums are great...and if I had to pick a favorite right now it would probably be Far Beyond Driven.
Fuck I love that band so much.
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Hmmm it says this thread hasn't been active in more than 90 days. That has now changed.
Listening to Vulgar Display Of Power right now. I love it SO MUCH. :2metal:
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I was a big pantera fan, Although Anselmo I find a bit meh. For me, it was all about that Dime riffage + Vinnie Paul grooving. Those 2 could play off each other so well, it's like they grew up together :neverusethis:
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Oh yeah, I had the PSP on shuffle today and caught a couple tracks from Cowboys from Hell. Love that album. Vulgar is awesome too. FBD and TGST, I never got into those as much, but still pretty good.
:metal
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Any Pantera fans here.
Absolutely. She's my favorite stripper at Savannah's on Hanna in Harrisburg.
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lol
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Lol for sure but choosing that for a stripper name is pretty badass. Especially when she comes onstage to "Welcome to the Jungle"
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I went through Pantera a little while ago, most of the stuff is very hit or miss with me. Like I love Suicide Note Pt. 1, Cowboys From Hell, 10's, Floods but there are others that I really hate like Suicide Note Pt. 1
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I went through Pantera a little while ago, most of the stuff is very hit or miss with me. Like I love Suicide Note Pt. 1, Cowboys From Hell, 10's, Floods but there are others that I really hate like Suicide Note Pt. 1
Sense. This makes none.
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I went through Pantera a little while ago, most of the stuff is very hit or miss with me. Like I love Suicide Note Pt. 1, Cowboys From Hell, 10's, Floods but there are others that I really hate like Suicide Note Pt. 1
If you meant that you hate Suicide Note Pt 2 then I agree (I assume one of the two was a typo). I love pt 1, but pt 2 to me is just noise. TGSTK had a few of those, but luckily it still had a lot of great songs like the title track, Drag the Waters, and 13 Steps to Nowhere. For me Far Beyond Driven was their only big misstep as an album, but I love the rest. I don't mind Anselmo screaming, but sometimes it got to the point of being screaming over noise.
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I went through Pantera a little while ago, most of the stuff is very hit or miss with me. Like I love Suicide Note Pt. 1, Cowboys From Hell, 10's, Floods but there are others that I really hate like Suicide Note Pt. 1
If you meant that you hate Suicide Note Pt 2 then I agree (I assume one of the two was a typo). I love pt 1, but pt 2 to me is just noise. TGSTK had a few of those, but luckily it still had a lot of great songs like the title track, Drag the Waters, and 13 Steps to Nowhere. For me Far Beyond Driven was their only big misstep as an album, but I love the rest. I don't mind Anselmo screaming, but sometimes it got to the point of being screaming over noise.
yeah I meant I hate pt 2
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The outro to Floods is some of the most beautiful music I've heard.
I miss Pantera just as much as anyody here. Its hard to pick a favourite album, but I'm probably gonna have to go with The Great Southern Trendkill.
STRONGER THAN ALL!!!!!
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Not to try and start shit, but I never got the appeal. Vulgar was a pretty good album, but not great, and I never really cared for much of the rest. Pantera's appeal always seemed to come more from their image and attitude than their music. Specifically, mindless crank-fueled aggression. It just seemed to me like all of the people who got so fired up about them were people I'd like to see launched into the sun®. Obviously that doesn't apply to the people here, but most of the people who'd go to see them here in Dallas were just not my kind of people.
I did go back and watch some videos and the drummer seemed to be some kind of badass. I never saw anything in Darryl that impressed me, though. He strikes me as a perfect example of an untimely death elevating someone's status far beyond what's merited.
Also, part of my dislike comes from having grown up when they did. I saw this band more often than what they would eventually become.
(https://www.truemetal.org/metalwallpaper/images/powermetal.jpg)
They own a great nudie-bar, though. Probably their single best contribution.
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I did go back and watch some videos and the drummer seemed to be some kind of badass. I never saw anything in Darryl that impressed me, though. He strikes me as a perfect example of an untimely death elevating someone's status far beyond what's merited.
That would only make sense if he wasn't already considered a metal god before his death. He's no Kurt Cobain. Dimebag's status was just as big before he died, because of his unique distinctive style, and great playing. Simple as that.
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I did go back and watch some videos and the drummer seemed to be some kind of badass. I never saw anything in Darryl that impressed me, though. He strikes me as a perfect example of an untimely death elevating someone's status far beyond what's merited.
That would only make sense if he wasn't already considered a metal god before his death. He's no Kurt Cobain. Dimebag's status was just as big before he died, because of his unique distinctive style, and great playing. Simple as that.
All of this.
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I for one really like Power Metal.
Here are the albums in order of preference
1. Cowboys From Hell
2. Reinventing The Steel
3. Vulgar Display Of Power
4. Far Beyond Driven
5. The Great Southern Trendkill
6. Power Metal
I haven't heard any of the earlier ones before PM.
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I for one really like Power Metal.
Here are the albums in order of preference
1. Cowboys From Hell
2. Reinventing The Steel
3. Vulgar Display Of Power
4. Far Beyond Driven
5. The Great Southern Trendkill
6. Power Metal
I haven't heard any of the earlier ones before PM.
how is greatest southern trendkill so low!
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The outro to Floods is some of the most beautiful music I've heard.
This. It's very haunting.
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YES! Love Pantera. :metal
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The outro to Floods is some of the most beautiful music I've heard.
Agreed. The solo, as well.
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I quite like Pantera. Phil's voice is about as brutal as it gets, and Dime's playing was always incredible. Too bad his guitar tone sucked bullbags big time.
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I for one really like Power Metal.
Here are the albums in order of preference
1. Cowboys From Hell
2. Reinventing The Steel
3. Vulgar Display Of Power
4. Far Beyond Driven
5. The Great Southern Trendkill
6. Power Metal
I haven't heard any of the earlier ones before PM.
how is greatest southern trendkill so low!
I really like it, but I enjoy the others more.
FUCK THE WORLD
FOR ALL IT'S WORTH
EVERY INCH
OF PLANET EARTH
:2metal:
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FUCK THE WORLD
FOR ALL IT'S WORTH
EVERY INCH
OF PLANET EARTH
:2metal:
FUCK THE WORLD
FOR ALL IT'S WORTH
EVERY INCH
OF PLANET EARTH
:metal :metal :metal :metal :metal
DON'T YOU EVER DARE REPEAT SOMEONE ELSE'S POST, BIRCH
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:-[
:metal
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They say that you aren't a metal fan unless you know the lyrics to angel of death and fucking hostile by heart. So when I was 12 I had to learn both.
Oh and there is a yearly tour going around in Finland (for the fourth year now I think) of metal players doing a Dimebag tribute tour (playing Pantera). Last year it was where I live in New Year's Eve. Good times.
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Back before I got heavily into prog, Pantera was my absolute favorite band.
Also fun fact: a guy in my journalism class knows Phil personally. Phil called him the day after Dimebag died to tell him what had happened.
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They say that you aren't a metal fan unless you know the lyrics to angel of death and fucking hostile by heart. So when I was 12 I had to learn both.
Oh and there is a yearly tour going around in Finland (for the fourth year now I think) of metal players doing a Dimebag tribute tour (playing Pantera). Last year it was where I live in New Year's Eve. Good times.
I don't know either so... lol
Back before I got heavily into prog, Pantera was my absolute favorite band.
Also fun fact: a guy in my journalism class knows Phil personally. Phil called him the day after Dimebag died to tell him what had happened.
Wow, cool. My name is Phil. So I'm glad there is a cool Phil out there cos Phil is a pretty gay name.
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Ratings:
1) The Great Southern Trendkill
2) Cowboys From Hell
3) Far Beyond Driven
4) Vulgar Display Of Power
5) Power Metal
6) Reinventing The Steel
Haven't heard anything from Metal Magic to I Am the Night, TBH.
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I was lucky enough to see Pantera on one of their last tours (might have actually been the last), when they came through with Slayer. It was my first concert and a lot of fun. I'll always remember the flames shooting up in the giant Pantera sign behind the stage. The temperature in the Xcel Center went through the roof.
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The XL Center's a cool venue, but the side-upper-deck seats' views are almost obstructed by the ceiling, so it's kinda distracting.
Wait... are we talking about the Hartford venue, or a different venue of a similar name?
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They say that you aren't a metal fan unless you know the lyrics to angel of death and fucking hostile by heart. So when I was 12 I had to learn both.
Oh and there is a yearly tour going around in Finland (for the fourth year now I think) of metal players doing a Dimebag tribute tour (playing Pantera). Last year it was where I live in New Year's Eve. Good times.
you were well raised
Angel of Death is the anthem of all metal.
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ANGEL OF DEATH
MONARCH TO THE KINGDOM OF THE DEAD
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I was a huge Pantera fan in my teenage years, they did amazing things for metal in a music world full of shit. Trendkill is my favourite album. 10's is amazing, and Dime's solo on that is incredible.
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Can we stop disgracing this thread with Slayer references?
Pantera were my No.1 band when I was a teen (and I see I'm not alone looking through the thread). Maybe part of their appeal is to angry, testosterone fuelled males. I know I was one. They are also the reason I listen to metal, and the reason I play guitar.
Album rankings:
Trenkill
Vulgar
Cowboys
FBD
Massive gap
RTS (With the exception of the riff in RIMN)
Massive gap
Glam Era albums
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Slayer > Pantera
Just sayin'
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You got the arrow the wrong way round
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The XL Center's a cool venue, but the side-upper-deck seats' views are almost obstructed by the ceiling, so it's kinda distracting.
Wait... are we talking about the Hartford venue, or a different venue of a similar name?
I was actually referencing the Xcel Center in St Paul, MN.
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Slayer > Pantera
Just sayin'
You got the arrow the wrong way round
+1
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Nope. Slayer is altogether more brutal, interesting, and consistent than Pantera.
Dime > Kerry and Jeff combined, though.
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Can we stop disgracing this thread with Slayer references?
Pantera were my No.1 band when I was a teen (and I see I'm not alone looking through the thread). Maybe part of their appeal is to angry, testosterone fuelled males. I know I was one. They are also the reason I listen to metal, and the reason I play guitar.
Album rankings:
Trenkill
Vulgar
Cowboys
FBD
Massive gap
RTS (With the exception of the riff in RIMN)
Massive gap
Glam Era albums
Good to see Trendkill top your list too. I thought RTS was quite a good album really.
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Nope. Slayer is altogether more brutal, interesting, and consistent than Pantera.
Dime > Kerry and Jeff combined, though.
Good enough. ;)
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Nope. Slayer is altogether more brutal, interesting, and consistent than Pantera.
Dime > Kerry and Jeff combined, though.
My input, yes I am aware it is unwanted. I think that brutal wise, Pantera and Slayer both have their way of being brutal. I think Pantera is more brutal in the groovey, heavy, kitten punching riffery but Slayer is more brutal with the strait up insane metal insanity. I personally think both are just as interesting, and as for consistency, I have to give it to Pantera. Their only shitty album (of the known ones off a label) is RTS. Slayer went through a 15 or so year period where they sucked. Well...not sucked, but it definitely did not match up with their big 4 (3 for me) albums of the late 80's and early 90's.
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1. The Great Southern Trendkill
2. Cowboys From Hell
3. Vulgar Display Of Power
4. Far Beyond Driven
5. Reinventing the Steel
But none of those albums are bad, or even okay. They all kick ass, just some more than others. :metal
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Reinvent is a good album, you guys smoke too much crack. ;D
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Reinvent is a good album, you guys smoke too much crack. ;D
It's crap. I bought it on the day it came out and I can still remember the disappointment :( Especially since it followed Trendkill.
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Reinvent is a good album, you guys smoke too much crack. ;D
It's crap. I bought it on the day it came out and I can still remember the disappointment :( Especially since it followed Trendkill.
I think they had no chance following up Trendkill but it's still a good album IMO.
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Slayer's only "bad" album was Diabolous in Musica. Pantera had RTS and 4 GLAM albums ffs.
Also, if Slayer doesn't make you want to murder something, there's something wrong.
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Slayer's only "bad" album was Diabolous in Musica. Pantera had RTS and 4 GLAM albums ffs.
Also, if Slayer doesn't make you want to murder something, there's something wrong.
I really like Diabolus...
And Pantera don't consider their 4 Glam albums to be part of the modern Pantera, neither should you. Their first album is CFH.
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I've heard a song or two off of Power Metal, and I don't understand why they don't include that one as their first "true" album, especially since it's the first with Phil. It's not that bad.
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Slayer's only "bad" album was Diabolous in Musica. Pantera had RTS and 4 GLAM albums ffs.
Also, if Slayer doesn't make you want to murder something, there's something wrong.
I really like Diabolus...
And Pantera don't consider their 4 Glam albums to be part of the modern Pantera, neither should you. Their first album is CFH.
Too bad. They should have changed their name then. CFH is their 5th.
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Slayer's only "bad" album was Diabolous in Musica. Pantera had RTS and 4 GLAM albums ffs.
Uuuuummmm... Reinventing The Steel is fucking awesome.
And I like Power Metal.
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CFH is definitely their first true effort. Power Metal is alright, but I think Dime and Vinnie and their gang would've been at the same skill level if they hadn't made their four glam albums. They loved that sort of music actually, it's difficult to believe they really hated their past. Sure they don't/didn't count them in but you can't deny such a history. They just had a change of attitude and look, makes sense coz they were friends with Slayer, or at least just Kerry King. You never know what may have influenced their decision.
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Holy Shit, I'm just listening to the Cowboys From Hell remastered 3 cd version that I got. This remaster is absolutely horrible, I can't listen to it, they've totally butchered it. :tdwn
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I never have faith in the remasters. Usually, it ruins something that was originally fresh and awesome.
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I never have faith in the remasters. Usually, it ruins something that was originally fresh and awesome.
I am quite a big fan of remasters but this is just horrible. Luckily, the live tracks and demos make it worth the purchase price.
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lolpantera
at least their not slayer
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lolpantera
at least their not slayer
Congrats, your contribution to this thread was definitely worthwhile, thank you.... :\
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I really like Cowboys From Hell, but that's all I've heard besides the obvious "Walk"
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I really like Cowboys From Hell, but that's all I've heard besides the obvious "Walk"
all their albums are good. Unless you want to see thier roots get thier older albums, Power Metal is a pretty good album with some cool songs.
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I really like Cowboys From Hell, but that's all I've heard besides the obvious "Walk"
all their albums are good. Unless you want to see thier roots get thier older albums, Power Metal is a pretty good album with some cool songs.
I really need to somehow get a hold of Power Metal.
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I really like Cowboys From Hell, but that's all I've heard besides the obvious "Walk"
Letters, definitely check out Vulgar, Far Beyond and Trendkill, all classic albums.
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I'll definitely do that soon :tup
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I really like Cowboys From Hell, but that's all I've heard besides the obvious "Walk"
all their albums are good. Unless you want to see thier roots get thier older albums, Power Metal is a pretty good album with some cool songs.
I really need to somehow get a hold of Power Metal.
You'll love it considering you're an 80s metal lover too :hat
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Got the urge to listen to some Vulgar Display...so I am :P
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Pussy burnt :metal forgot the one for 2
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Pussy burnt :metal forgot the one for 2
The CFH + VDOP pack? Yeah that is indeed worth it.
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Pussy burnt :metal forgot the one for 2
The CFH + VDOP pack? Yeah that is indeed worth it.
haha. i meant the emote. Power Metal is one of the good Pantera albums. I have no Idea why they deny their roots. It shows how they were during their teenage years
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I really like Cowboys From Hell, but that's all I've heard besides the obvious "Walk"
all their albums are good. Unless you want to see thier roots get thier older albums, Power Metal is a pretty good album with some cool songs.
I really need to somehow get a hold of Power Metal.
You'll love it considering you're an 80s metal lover too :hat
How the hell can you get a hold of it?
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I really like Cowboys From Hell, but that's all I've heard besides the obvious "Walk"
all their albums are good. Unless you want to see thier roots get thier older albums, Power Metal is a pretty good album with some cool songs.
I really need to somehow get a hold of Power Metal.
You'll love it considering you're an 80s metal lover too :hat
Great album.
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I really like Cowboys From Hell, but that's all I've heard besides the obvious "Walk"
all their albums are good. Unless you want to see thier roots get thier older albums, Power Metal is a pretty good album with some cool songs.
I really need to somehow get a hold of Power Metal.
You'll love it considering you're an 80s metal lover too :hat
How the hell can you get a hold of it?
Because I obtain everything through a download ;)
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I normally avoid downloading music, but I had to do that for the early pantera stuff cos it is impossible to hear it otherwise...
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By Demons Be Driven has to be one of the heaviest riffs in the universe.
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[Insert random Pantera song here] is the heaviest riff ever.
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[Insert random Pantera song here] is the worst guitar tone ever.
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[Insert random Pantera song here] is the worst guitar tone ever.
Son, it's one thing to come into a thread and state your opinions, but to come into a thread and post outright lies?
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Why does The Great Southern Trendkill kick so much fucking ass? :2metal:
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FUCK THE WORLD
FOR ALL IT'S WORTH
EVERY INCH
OF PLANET EARTH
:2metal:
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[Insert random Pantera song here] is the worst guitar tone ever.
Son, it's one thing to come into a thread and state your opinions, but to come into a thread and post outright lies?
I know you know good guitar tone, young man. And you're lying through your teeth if you're saying Dimebag had it.
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His tone was unique, so if I heard him play I'd instantly recognise it. But it being THAT good as people would put it? Not really. I wouldn't even change the tone on any album.
I'm gonna start collecting the first era of albums before Power Metal.
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[Insert random Pantera song here] is the worst guitar tone ever.
Son, it's one thing to come into a thread and state your opinions, but to come into a thread and post outright lies?
I know you know good guitar tone, young man. And you're lying through your teeth if you're saying Dimebag had it.
Of course I know good guitar tone. Tone is incredibly subjective though. My definition of good tone is something that fits the style of the song. Dimebag undeniably has that.
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Dimebag's tone is terrible, but it suits Pantera. Sure.
Listening to 'Official Live - 101 Proof'. I love Phil's disgusting, slurred, drug-fucked, sleazy voice.
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Uuuuummmm... Reinventing The Steel is fucking awesome.
Bumping this post for TRUTH. I listened to it today for the first time in nearly a year and it STILL is a fucking cool record. Really groovy and heavy shit. Hellbound is ... well I can't describe it. This will do: :2metal:
Just listen to that snare! THAT SNAAAAAAARRE.
Mentally metalicious lines: HELLBOOOOUUND, IT'S GODDAMN ELECTRIC, and COZ YESTERDAY DON'T MEAN SHIT - BECAUSE TOMORROW'S A DAY - YOU HAVE TO FACE!!
Godly.
Ooh, 4th page now. :hat Keep 'em comin'.
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Yeah I don't understand the hate for it. Maybe it's produced a little differently than the others, but it's still great. Lots of great riffs.
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I love this band, a lot of very good songs. I don't really listen to much outside of Cowboys/Vulgar/Driven. Maybe I should start listening to some of their other stuff.
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Trendkill is pretty good, but if you ask me, each album had a dip in quality after Cowboys.
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Trendkill is pretty good, but if you ask me, each album had a dip in quality after Cowboys.
Trendkill is my favourite. Floods is their best song IMO.
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Dat solo.
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Trendkill is pretty good, but if you ask me, each album had a dip in quality after Cowboys.
Trendkill is my favourite. Floods is their best song IMO.
Dat solo.
Shit yes. Listened to that today for the first time in ages. Awesome.
Probably not the song you want to be playing in Brisbane, Australia around this time though. Yikes!
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Trendkill is pretty good, but if you ask me, each album had a dip in quality after Cowboys.
Trendkill is my favourite. Floods is their best song IMO.
Dat solo.
Shit yes. Listened to that today for the first time in ages. Awesome.
Probably not the song you want to be playing in Brisbane, Australia around this time though. Yikes!
Do you live in Brisbane? :(
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Trendkill is pretty good, but if you ask me, each album had a dip in quality after Cowboys.
Trendkill is my favourite. Floods is their best song IMO.
Dat solo.
Shit yes. Listened to that today for the first time in ages. Awesome.
Probably not the song you want to be playing in Brisbane, Australia around this time though. Yikes!
Do you live in Brisbane? :(
Nah, my aunty does. Her house is fine though.
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I live in Perth, its all over the news here.
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R.I.P. Dimebag... happy birthday in heaven!!!!
We'll never forget you! :heart
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^Good timing obscure! I'm gonna put on The Sleep right now as I go to sleep.
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^ :metal
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I listened to Reinvent tonight. kicked arse.
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1 week late but Happy B-Day Dimebag! :metal :metal (He deserves two, OK!)
Very Rare Dimebag Darell and Vinnie Paul Hard Rock Treasures interview 2004 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mKWWOP4PP1U&feature=related)
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I'm also late for the party but Happy Bday. You gave us some of the most badass riffs in metal history R.I.P. :2metal:
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Just saw this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOV7MGWd8Es) doc. about Pantera. I love the transition they made from being a pure glam rock band to a Death/Thrash metal band. Talk about two diffrent worlds. :lol
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Yeah, nobody give into the temptation of listening to the earlier albums. They are truly awful.
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(https://userserve-ak.last.fm/serve/_/81447183/Pantera+80s+Pantera+Power+Metal+album+art.jpg)
(https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-AjZFX3G0qf8/T_28MBjWGeI/AAAAAAAAASU/ysTrfODGib0/s1600/PanteraPhilAnselmoHelterSkelterTee.jpg)
:lol
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I wish they would re-release their first 4 albums. I still need to check those out.
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God damn Phil is one of the best vocalists of all time, have any of you heard the split he did with war beast? His solo album is to be material like that and I'm so fucking excited
Also god damn The Sleep, a pure bonafide masterpiece. I'm on a Phil anselmo/pantera binge atm
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I dunno man. Can he even sing anymore? I know he's still good for screams but it's been years since I've seen him not sound like a winded, shitfaced, redneck when trying to sing traditional style stuff.
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I dunno man. Can he even sing anymore? I know he's still good for screams but it's been years since I've seen him not sound like a winded, shitfaced, redneck when trying to sing traditional style stuff.
latest EP with Down was pretty good, but I think his solo is going to be heavy as fuck extreme material.
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Yeah, nobody give into the temptation of listening to the earlier albums. They are truly awful.
Wrong. Power Metal is great, much better than most of the stuff from their "tough guy" period.
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Freakin bad-ass MoFo ass kikin Vinnie " Fucking" Paul and of course Dimebag. :metal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyTXRUX6e-w
He and Dime has more metal in their beards than fukin any emo-metal kiddo bands these days PUT TOGETHER!!
AAAAAAAAARHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHGGGGGGGGGGGG!!!!
Sry for that, had to ventilate! :|
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God damn Phil is one of the best vocalists of all time, have any of you heard the split he did with war beast? His solo album is to be material like that and I'm so fucking excited
Also god damn The Sleep, a pure bonafide masterpiece. I'm on a Phil anselmo/pantera binge atm
:tup Cowboys is where it's at for Phil. He does the harsh stuff but can still do the Halford ball squeezing high note stuff too. Awesome.
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God damn Phil is one of the best vocalists of all time, have any of you heard the split he did with war beast? His solo album is to be material like that and I'm so fucking excited
Also god damn The Sleep, a pure bonafide masterpiece. I'm on a Phil anselmo/pantera binge atm
:tup Cowboys is where it's at for Phil. He does the harsh stuff but can still do the Halford ball squeezing high note stuff too. Awesome.
+1 to both of those points. The Sleep is freaking amazing and although I really enjoy most of their albums Cowboys is the perfect medium for me (my fav).
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I wanna say that Vinne Paul is my favorite drummer when it comes to double bass. The guy is able to never overuse it and the way he plays it just feels like a bullet to the chest every time he hits it. Awesome.
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Yeah, nobody give into the temptation of listening to the earlier albums. They are truly awful.
Wrong. Power Metal is great, much better than most of the stuff from their "tough guy" period.
Its a nice blend of the old and whats to come.
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I like the classic Pantera albums but I always had a sort of unusual perspective on them. Phil and I are the same age and he used to hang out in the record store where I worked when we were both teenagers in New Orleans. He was always a bit peculiar (the guy most likely to go berserk one day -- no surprise, right?) and used to just hang out to talk metal with the store employees and talk about how he was going to have a metal band -- which he did, named Razor White, and they were pretty decent. Then he disappeared for a few months and we heard he had gone to Dallas to join another band. Lo and behold the rise of Pantera began.
I've always supported him and his various projects since Pantera, but I always thought of Pantera a bit differently because they had that wacky teenager who used to hang out where I worked and he turned his dreams into something bigger.
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Interesting story Rick....................I'd call myself a casual Pantera fan - very much just a few songs off a few albums. What would you consider their "classic" albums to be - I'd say Cowboys and Vulgar Display. After that it seemed to me it got to be as much about being as heavy as possible as writing decent songs.
For me it's Cemetery Gates and ..
the best of the rest. (Cowboys, Shattered, Domination, This Love, Walk, Fucking Hostile)
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Adore Pantera, but as with most bands from my youth, I only revisit them once in a while now. But I do so with Pantera more than any other band I grew up with.
10's; Floods; Hollow; and The Sleep are my go-to songs. The Art of Shredding is nice when I wanna feel like a...a...horny chainsaw-man with a shotgun for a dick. Or something.
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Interesting story Rick....................I'd call myself a casual Pantera fan - very much just a few songs off a few albums. What would you consider their "classic" albums to be - I'd say Cowboys and Vulgar Display. After that it seemed to me it got to be as much about being as heavy as possible as writing decent songs.
I think of the classics as Cowboys, Far Beyond Driven and Vulgar Display. Others may disagree, but that's the classic 3 for me.
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I guess I should join Rick and George so we can have three NOLAmites up in this bitch simultaneously. I only consider CFH and VDoP classics. I still really like Becoming, HLSC, 10s, DtW, and adore Floods though.
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My favorite part of Trendkill is the intro:
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!
:metal :metal :metal :metal :metal
One of the best album intros ever.
Whenever I think of Pantera, I think of Beavis & Butthead jokes about Phil:
https://youtu.be/p0gTN_YQCKY
DAMN IT, PANTERA, THIS BEER IS WARM!!! :lol
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Here's a cool concert with Rex, Vinnie and Dime playing together for the last time on New Years Eve 2001.
https://youtu.be/luOswaDhwO8
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Awesome! Gonna have to watch this in full soon.
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Loved Pantera ever since I first heard Cowboys from Hell. For some reason, I never went to one of their concerts. Probably because of the stories of out of control mosh pits of which I am not a fan.
I did however get to see *Diamond* Darrell close up at The Palace, Hollywood, CA (a small club) on January 13, 1993 at the 2nd Annual Randy Rhoads Benefit concert. He stole the show, and that ain't easy when the night included Jens Johannsen, Jake E. Lee, Tony MacAlpine, Adrian Vandenberg, John Norum, Phantom Blue, Blues Saraceno, Alex Skolnick, Mark Wood, Randy Coven and Dee Snider's Widowmaker.
Been looking for these 1st, 2nd and 3rd Randy Rhoads Benefit concerts on video or audio for years. Good times.
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Forgot to share one of the few pictures I've found from that benefit night
(https://img003.lazyboys.info/people/dimebag_darrell/dimebag_darrell_jake_lee_lemmy_dimebag_darrell_guitar_for_the_practising_july_1993_v4rPbane.sized.jpg)
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Dime would have loved this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngMJTWUanCA
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1. Cowboys From Hell
2. Power Metal
3. The rest
CFH is an amazing, amazing album. So is Power Metal. After CFH the band got progressively worse, more and more heavy and less and less interesting. Which is a shame because even their bad albums have classic songs like Floods.
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1 - TGSTK
2 - Vulgar Display of Power
3 - Far Beyond Driven
4 - Cowboys From Hell
5 - Reiventing the Steel
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1. Cowboys From Hell
2. Power Metal
3. The rest
CFH is an amazing, amazing album. So is Power Metal. After CFH the band got progressively worse, more and more heavy and less and less interesting. Which is a shame because even their bad albums have classic songs like Floods.
Except that Floods wasn't on a bad album. ;)
Since we're playing the ranking game (yay!) now, I'd say-
1. Cowboys from Hell
2. Vulgar Display of Power
3. The Great Southern Trendkill
4. Reinventing the Steel
5. Far Beyond Driven
If I was including Power Metal, I'd probably rank it 5th.
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I absolutely worshipped FBD as a teenager, which means that is by default my favourite of theirs.
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Ah, Pantera :heart
Fun fact: I have FBD on vinyl with the original art. Such an awesome cover. I really dig that album but not my favorite. Not sure how I'd rank them.
A couple of months ago I did this event where you read embarrassing stuff out of your teenage diaries in front of a crowd, and my one diary with a Pantera sticker on it had an entry about how I was so upset because my brother and his friends got to see Pantera and Black Sabbath without me, and it JUST WASN'T FAIR :lol
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Too bad they fall apart after RTS, wonder where would they go after that one. But it probably saved Anselmos life, drug abuse would probably kill him if they continued, Dime˙s death gave him that cold shot he needed to get clean, atleast i think. Too bad that was the way it had to go down. My favourite album is FBD, but all are really close, with stuff like Floods, The Sleep, Revolution is my name, Regular people, you can`t go wrong. And Power metal, remaster would do wonders to that album
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*BUMP*
So I've started listening to the classic albums again and I'm still in awe of how amazing they are.
I bought CFH back in the day and loved it to death, but somehow found the cover of VDOP too offputting to really buy it! :facepalm:
So I bought FBD the day it came out (the VINYL version!!) and loved it, but also wondered what happened to Phil's range man. He uses his lower range mostly and the growling. Then they just got even heavier on STK and RTS.
All the drama when Daryl passed sort of passed me by because of the shock. Vinnie should just let bygones be bygones and forgive Phil man, life is too short.
No matter what anyone says I will always love Phil's voice, his work with Down is just outerworldly and his latest with the Illegals? BRUTAL!
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Phil has GOT to have the "most changed vocal style/range" in the history of recorded music.
From Power Metal to Reinventing the Steel, it does kind of follow where he was at with his health and drugging.
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For me:
Vulgar
Cowboys
Steel
Power Metal
>>>Not as big on the rest. Appreciate what they were going for on all other records, but really, if you made me do it, Vulgar and Cowboys are the only Pantera albums I listen to regularly.
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I'd probably rank:
Vulgar Display of Power (just the complete package, not a bad song on there!)
Cowboys From Hell (just amazing, there's a bit of filler on there but it's just astounding and where they really started to hit their stride)
Far Beyond Driven (just brutal, dark and kinda disturbing. They just did not give a fuck about playing it safe, this was a statement and has some of the best individual songs they ever wrote!)
The Great Southern Trendkill (further brutality and features probably the best solo/outro combo that they ever wrote.....Floods)
Reinventing the Steel (their crown started to slip here, in my opinion, Yesterday Don't Mean Shit is where it's at though :metal)
Power Metal (well yeah, it's not even really the same band. It's not unlistenable though)
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My ranking is the same:
Vulgar Display Of Power
Cowboys From Hell
Far Beyond Driven
those three are my go to records
The Great Southern Trendkill
Reinventing The Steel
not bad, but not as good as the first three
And I've never heard their 80s records.
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Watched some parts from "Watch it go" a documentary directed by Dimebag about the craziness that went on on- and offstage....good god! It goes on and on.... :mehlin
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I’m probably the only person ever who thinks The Great Southern Trendkill is far and away their best.
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It's definitely up there. The only thing that stops it from being that popular is the is the constant screaming Phil does. A little more melodic vocal lines wouldn't have hurt.
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It's definitely up there. The only thing that stops it from being that popular is the is the constant screaming Phil does. A little more melodic vocal lines wouldn't have hurt.
It would have been top 3 for me without Phil screaming.
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I've got a confession to make, I like Pantera, I like groove metal, but I know 10% of their songs !
Sounds so stupid even to me.
Around 1998 I discovered the great southern trendkill and listened to it 300 times since then, at least.
I heard older hits over time like walk, cemetary gates, cowboys...I like them but in the meantime it sounds "cute" to me compared to what I listened to meanwhile (and even to TGST).
When I try to browse the old albums the sound cuts my motivation :( (tho I like the guitar sound).
I don't know far beyond and reinventing the steel.
Maybe I fear to be disappointed ^^
So, even if my situation is a little strange, to me Pantera is legendary and shaped part of Metal and of guitar playing !
And there are not many qualified followers continuing what they did.
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Not that strange. I love Pantera, but don't profess to know all or most of their songs as well. Far Beyond Driven was hit or miss to me. Loved Strength Beyond Strength, Broken, Becoming, 5 minutes alone and shedding skin, but beyond that? Detested Good friends and a bottle of pills, hard lines and sunken cheeks and didn't know what to make of 25 years, although I thought that's a pretty good song. Great Southern Trendkill is the same. Know perhaps 30% of that album, like the title track, Floods, Suicide note #2, but the rest?
Don't even ask me about Reinventing the Steel.
The cool part of this band is that they knew how to surprise you. Deep cuts on Cowboys and Vulgar like The Sleep, Primal concrete sledge, Psycho holiday, Hollow, F#$$%%% hostile, surprised the shit out of me. Tracks like No good or Rise? What the hell? So don't feel bad about not knowing all their songs. There's even more to explore for ya!
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The cool part of this band is that they knew how to surprise you. Deep cuts on Cowboys and Vulgar like The Sleep, Primal concrete sledge, Psycho holiday, Hollow, F#$$%%% hostile, surprised the shit out of me. Tracks like No good or Rise? What the hell? So don't feel bad about not knowing all their songs. There's even more to explore for ya!
One thing that Fucking Hostile is not is a deep cut. :lol That song is a fan favorite and was always played on each subsequent tour. I'd argue that Primal Concrete Sledge isn't a deep cut either, though it rarely was played on later tours.
My ranking:
Vulgar Display of Power
Cowboys From Hell
Far Beyond Driven
The Great Southern Trendkill
Power Metal
Reinventing the Steel
The rest....
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I’m probably the only person ever who thinks The Great Southern Trendkill is far and away their best.
Nope! I love it too. I don't mind the screaming because there are mellower breaks in the album.
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I'm listening to a lot of Pantera recently it's so awesome :D I didn't hear their 80s albums or Far Beyond Driven yet (besides 3 songs maybe)
1. TGST really works great as a whole album and I seriously wasn't prepared for the transition between Suicide Note pt 1 and pt 2 lol
2. CFH this is the first Pantera album I heard and I really love every song there Domination is super awesome and so is Shattered
3. VDoP it sounded like such a different band after I heard Cowboys, even more than hearing Load after the prior albums Metallica recorded, probably because of Phil's voice he didn't really have those shrieks here. I still really like it, only track I'm not so into is No Good, other than that Hollow and Live In a Hole are awesome
4. Reinventing the Steel I only first listened to this one like last week, I really didn't feel it the first time and the only track that stood out to me as pretty good was I'll Cast a Shadow but I listened to it again and it really grew on me, Death Rattle is my favorite and Revolution is My Name and Yesterday don't mean shit are very awesome (alongside ICaS), the only song that I really dislike is Uplift it just sounds to me so boring :S
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Has anyone else checked out the new version of Reinventing the Steel? The new Terry Date remix is fantastic and so clear compared to the original. I like having all of that era's b-sides on the third disc as well. I already had one or two from the various albums that they appeared on.
These guys have done a great job compiling each re-release's bonus content, though I dislike the actual remastering job on CFH, Vulgar and FBD.
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Has anyone else checked out the new version of Reinventing the Steel? The new Terry Date remix is fantastic and so clear compared to the original. I like having all of that era's b-sides on the third disc as well. I already had one or two from the various albums that they appeared on.
These guys have done a great job compiling each re-release's bonus content, though I dislike the actual remastering job on CFH, Vulgar and FBD.
I'm waiting for this one. Isn't in stores yet here but I'm picking it up as soon as it is. I'll order online if I have to. I haven't been a fan of those earlier remasters either. I haven't checked Trendkills though yet actually, but the ohters weren't great. Cowboys was horrible. The new mixes I heard on youtube were fantastic. It's a great album this one.
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Has anyone else checked out the new version of Reinventing the Steel? The new Terry Date remix is fantastic and so clear compared to the original. I like having all of that era's b-sides on the third disc as well. I already had one or two from the various albums that they appeared on.
These guys have done a great job compiling each re-release's bonus content, though I dislike the actual remastering job on CFH, Vulgar and FBD.
You and I are in lockstep. I love the new Terry Date remix of Reinventing the Steel. SOOOOO much better. But the remastering job of those older records is horrible. I have the originals, and had bought the remasters too, but sold them.
Anyone on the fence about getting the Terry Date remix of Reinventing the Steel, go out and get it. It's really good. :metal
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Can't believe Dimebag has been gone 16 years now. I'll never forget the day it happened, shocking. RIP Dimebag.
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Yea it's crazy! I also remember that day so vividly. So sad that his brother is also gone, they were inseparable.
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How about a Pantera "reunion"?
https://blabbermouth.net/news/its-official-panteras-surviving-members-to-embark-on-reunion-tour-in-2023
Blabbermouth is also reporting Zakk Wylde and Charlie Benante will be joining. Thoughts?
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I have mixed feelings about it. I saw that the other day and while Phil was the voice of the band and really love Rex's playing, it really can't be Pantera without the brothers. It is going to be some tribute band. Either way I don't even know what shape Phil's voice is right now and if the shows will do the band name justice.
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No Abbotts = No Pamtera
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No Abbotts = No Pantera
Exactly!
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How about a Pantera "reunion"?
https://blabbermouth.net/news/its-official-panteras-surviving-members-to-embark-on-reunion-tour-in-2023
Blabbermouth is also reporting Zakk Wylde and Charlie Benante will be joining. Thoughts?
.
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I have mixed feelings about it. I saw that the other day and while Phil was the voice of the band and really love Rex's playing, it really can't be Pantera without the brothers. It is going to be some tribute band. Either way I don't even know what shape Phil's voice is right now and if the shows will do the band name justice.
Yeah, I have mixed feelings as well. That said, I'm pretty shocked this hasn't already happened, and I take comfort in knowing that it's (presumably) being done with the best of intentions. My final judgement will likely come down to how they bill it: as long as it's clearly a celebration, I'll be good with it.
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I have mixed feelings about it. I saw that the other day and while Phil was the voice of the band and really love Rex's playing, it really can't be Pantera without the brothers. It is going to be some tribute band. Either way I don't even know what shape Phil's voice is right now and if the shows will do the band name justice.
Yeah, I have mixed feelings as well. That said, I'm pretty shocked this hasn't already happened, and I take comfort in knowing that it's (presumably) being done with the best of intentions. My final judgement will likely come down to how they bill it: as long as it's clearly a celebration, I'll be good with it.
If they get Zakk Wylde on guitar and either Charlie Benante or Mike Portnoy on drums (preferably Charlie for this one), all of who were friends of the Abbott brothers, it would definitely make me feel much better about it as it would clearly be a tribute to the two of them.
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I'm intrigued by the reunion. I saw Pantera three times (1997-twice, 2001) and loved each show. I don't think a reunion tour will be able to match the ferocity of the classic lineup but I do think they can be respectful of the band's legacy and give younger fans a taste of what it used to be like to see them live. Nothing will compare to seeing them at the Aragon ballroom in 1997. The crowd was raging and the band was on fire...it just made your hair stand up on end to be in the room with all of that energy.
Zakk and Charlie are great choices, if that's who it turns out to be, both for their talents and their friendship with the band.
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I'd check it out. I've never seen them before and while it won't be the same, it's something for people like myself to get to experience. It seems they might be advertising this as a celebration of Pantera and not a formation of a new Pantera band so I think that's pretty cool.
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I REALLY don't like Anselmo (nothing to do with his offstage stuff, or the IMO ridiculous assertions that he had any apportionment of blame for Dime's death) so there's that, and Rex Brown has always been perplexing to me, but I'd go see a party with Zakk Wylde and Charlie Benante if it was the right venue (Irving Plaza?).
I find the dialogue around all this fascinating, though. I don't mean here, I mean in the Blabbermouth article, and in the comments.
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Rex Brown has always been perplexing to me.
Rex Brown is one of the most underrated bass players in metal. His playing is super tight and always locked in with the drums and guitar. He also has one of the best bass tones I’ve heard from someone who plays with a pick, second only to Justin Chancellor from Tool.
As far as my opinion of him as a person, well he seems to follow the bass player trend of keeping quiet, doing his job, and avoiding controversy. Maybe he could be called out for continuing to work with Phil, but that’s controversy adjacent and shouldn’t be a direct knock on Rex.
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Some of the dialogue around this being a cash-grab is interesting. Pantera is no doubt still a big name in metal/rock circles, but unless they are paired with another high-profile band this tour would do what, large clubs and maybe theaters here in the states? Obviously if a package is put together for sheds it would include multiple bands.
I've seen people mention arenas and stadiums and I doubt that would happen unless other large bands (Like the Megadeth/LoG/Trivium tour) were brought together. We'll see.
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if it was the right venue (Irving Plaza?).
Irving Plaza would be too small for this IMO. But yeah, similar type of venue. It would need to be a big GA pit spot.
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Some of the dialogue around this being a cash-grab is interesting. Pantera is no doubt still a big name in metal/rock circles, but unless they are paired with another high-profile band this tour would do what, large clubs and maybe theaters here in the states? Obviously if a package is put together for sheds it would include multiple bands.
I've seen people mention arenas and stadiums and I doubt that would happen unless other large bands (Like the Megadeth/LoG/Trivium tour) were brought together. We'll see.
AND
if it was the right venue (Irving Plaza?).
Irving Plaza would be too small for this IMO. But yeah, similar type of venue. It would need to be a big GA pit spot.
I'm admittedly out of touch with the Pantera fan base. I know they have, what, four platinum albums, but I never thought of them as an arena headline act (forget about stadiums).
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I could see them being pretty big for this tour, but it's also kind of hard to tell because it's been so long and even some of the fan base is pushing back on this. Irving Plaza ia 1k capacity. I think that's too small. But something like Hammerstein Ballroom at 2.2k may be possible. I could see them pushing this to bigger venues too, but I don't know what data the promoters are using to calculate potential draw. It won't be small, but I'm hesitant to think it will be arena big. It could be though. One article did say it was not LiveNation booking the tour which makes me think it won't be summer amphitheaters.
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The idea that this could be a cash grab is kind of insane. This is the lowest the level of interest in Pantera has ever been. Phil's behavior over the years and the shift in tastes has alienated a sizeable percentage of their potential fanbase, whereas in the 90s they were close to the biggest metal band on the planet. They really should have done it with Zakk Wylde when Vinnie was still alive (except that all I heard was that Vinnie wanted no part of it). Without the Abbotts this is just a tribute band. I'm sure they'll still sell a decent number of tickets, but nothing like it would have been if this happened 10-15 years ago.
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Any rumors as to who will play with them?
Mostly curious here, I wasn't much a fan when they were active, so a "reunion" tour is a pretty big yawn for me
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Any rumors as to who will play with them?
Mostly curious here, I wasn't much a fan when they were active, so a "reunion" tour is a pretty big yawn for me
The long-running (then disputed, and now favorite again) on guitar is Zakk Wylde. The same source from blabbermouth is stating Charlie Benante on drums.
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In terms of what venues this kind of show would do in Southern California, I say probably the Anaheim House of Blues (2,000 people, all GA). Hollywood Palladium (which has around 4,000 people standing GA, I think) would be quite a stretch.
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I'm not really into this idea at all hey. Just feels wrong. Although, I honestly think Zak would be the only guy I'd have on guitar to change my mind and make it somewhat okay.
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Looking at setlist.fm, it confirmed what I thought, they were pretty much nothing but an arena and amphitheater band. Nothing but big arena's and outdoor venues. Not sure this would pull that, but who knows. Yes, the brothers aren't there but the voice is and from what I have heard recently, Phil sounds pretty good.
I do wonder if Phil and Rex can tour under the name. I would venture a guess that the brothers wives or something like that might own the trademark. Not really sure how that all played out. I could see a lawsuit or cease and desist story coming out if this is verified.
Anyway, with all of these other bands out there touring with members you can't even name, the fact that they have 2 and one is the voice, I don't buy the "it's not Pantera" argument. I could name so many bands right now and use that same argument based on the criteria of the Abbott's not being there.
I never had the chance to see them. I would consider seeing this especially if Zakk and Charlie were involved.
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Any rumors as to who will play with them?
Mostly curious here, I wasn't much a fan when they were active, so a "reunion" tour is a pretty big yawn for me
The long-running (then disputed, and now favorite again) on guitar is Zakk Wylde. The same source from blabbermouth is stating Charlie Benante on drums.
Both, Zakk and Charlie confirmed
https://www.sonicperspectives.com/news/zakk-wylde-and-charlie-benante-to-tour-with-panteras-surviving-members/
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Also a neat little blurb buried in the article:
According to Billboard, the lineup has been given a green light by the estates of the band's founders, drummer Vincent "Vinnie Paul" Abbott and guitarist "Dimebag" Darrell Abbott, as well as Brown, who last year said Wylde wouldn't tour with PANTERA if a reunion were to happen. It's unclear what changed his mind.
It's nice to see that it was cleared with Dime and Vinnie's estates - hopefully that begs off some of the complainers. It's not the same without them, but it's good to have their blessing in a way.
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I do wonder if Phil and Rex can tour under the name. I would venture a guess that the brothers wives or something like that might own the trademark. Not really sure how that all played out. I could see a lawsuit or cease and desist story coming out if this is verified.
Anyway, with all of these other bands out there touring with members you can't even name, the fact that they have 2 and one is the voice, I don't buy the "it's not Pantera" argument. I could name so many bands right now and use that same argument based on the criteria of the Abbott's not being there.
I have to imagine that everyone associated with the band gave the blessings to do this. I could be wrong. Also, I agree on the second point. I saw Lynyrd Skynyrd last summer without a single original member. It's really not that odd. However, the timespan between now and their last show is likely the reason people are pushing back. That part is not quite normal in the general sense, but also, we've seen reunions happen after long periods of time that doesn't include all members.
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Looking at setlist.fm, it confirmed what I thought, they were pretty much nothing but an arena and amphitheater band. Nothing but big arena's and outdoor venues. Not sure this would pull that, but who knows. Yes, the brothers aren't there but the voice is and from what I have heard recently, Phil sounds pretty good.
They headlined a lot of smaller arenas - they played the Rosemont Horizon/Allstate Arena here in Chicago a lot in the 90's, and I saw them in 2001 at the UIC Pavillion (seeing Morbid Angel open for them and play in an arena was really weird). They can definitely do the same size venues - 10,000 seaters, especially if they get a really great opening band. Megadeth/Slayer/Testament played at the UIC Pavillion in 2010 and that show was pretty full. Pantera are certainly among that same caliber of band.
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Ehhh....put me in the 'this isn't Pantera' camp. There simply is no Pantera without Dime or Vinny. This will be a Pantera cover band....probably sound decent and all that....but I personally think touring as 'Pantera' is just a money grab. Tour as "pick a name" and call it a tribute band and be done with it.
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Ehhh....put me in the 'this isn't Pantera' camp. There simply is no Pantera without Dime or Vinny. This will be a Pantera cover band....probably sound decent and all that....but I personally think touring as 'Pantera' is just a money grab. Tour as "pick a name" and call it a tribute band and be done with it.
I respect your opinion Gary, but I've sort of come to the conclusion that that ship has sailed as a general concept. If Floyd can be without Roger Waters, if Dream Theater can be without Mike Portnoy, I think there really isn't an "indispensible member" with one exception. There is really only one band for whom there are truly indispensable members (and I'm not talking about simply "having ownership of the name"): The Beatles. I was going to put Rush in there, but a) they existed before Neil joined, and b) I don't think the window has passed for which we see something - even if it's a one-off - for Rush with another drummer. We will NEVER see the Beatles as an entity again.
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I agree. I just can't get on board with this. Put it this way, if Dime and Vinnie were still alive, and I could see a reunion tour featuring only half the classic line up, it wouldn't be Phil and Rex I'd want.
Dime and Vinnie were the heart of the band as far as I'm concerned.
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From what I understand, one of the estates of the brothers had to say yes to get majority love. The band is penning it as "A celebration of Pantera music."
So if it is a one off I get it.
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From what I understand, one of the estates of the brothers had to say yes to get majority love. The band is penning it as "A celebration of Pantera music."
So if it is a one off I get it.
I suspect it will just be one "tour" but as usual these things will span multiple years. The billboard article mentioned the band playing multiple US and European festivals with other dates added.
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1 and done should include multiple countries if it is true.
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Ehhh....put me in the 'this isn't Pantera' camp. There simply is no Pantera without Dime or Vinny. This will be a Pantera cover band....probably sound decent and all that....but I personally think touring as 'Pantera' is just a money grab. Tour as "pick a name" and call it a tribute band and be done with it.
Yeah, I shouldn't even comment 'cause I'm not that big of a Pantera fan, but I know them enough to know about the importance of the Abbott brothers. It feels weird to see the band name used again.
With due respect and given the obvious proportions, could Paul McCartney and Ringo Starr tour as The Beatles? the other two guys are dead....
Even Queen called themselves "Queen +" whoever was with them...
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Ehhh....put me in the 'this isn't Pantera' camp. There simply is no Pantera without Dime or Vinny. This will be a Pantera cover band....probably sound decent and all that....but I personally think touring as 'Pantera' is just a money grab. Tour as "pick a name" and call it a tribute band and be done with it.
I respect your opinion Gary, but I've sort of come to the conclusion that that ship has sailed as a general concept. If Floyd can be without Roger Waters, if Dream Theater can be without Mike Portnoy, I think there really isn't an "indispensible member" with one exception. There is really only one band for whom there are truly indispensable members (and I'm not talking about simply "having ownership of the name"): The Beatles. I was going to put Rush in there, but a) they existed before Neil joined, and b) I don't think the window has passed for which we see something - even if it's a one-off - for Rush with another drummer. We will NEVER see the Beatles as an entity again.
I get that sentiment....BUT....as others have mentioned....Dime and Vinnie made up the sound of Pantera....and while there are certainly guys who can play their parts it's just not the same at all. But I do understand this isn't the first or last instance of a broken up band or band with dead members that will tour as 'THE' band. But, like in all those instances....to me....it feels cheap. This one even more given the two most vital members aren't participating.
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Eddie Trunk just said on his Sirius Satellite show that Charlie Benante texted him and said this is a tribute tour, not a reunion tour.
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Eddie Trunk just said on his Sirius Satellite show that Charlie Benante texted him and said this is a tribute tour, not a reunion tour.
I feel like part of how well-received it'll be will depend upon the marketing veneer. If it's billed as "a tribute to Pantera" or such it'll be easier to go down, but promoters are going to want that big Pantera logo on top of their festival and show lineups, even if their stock has plummeted compared to the 90s.
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So Have a big banner saying Pantera for this one tour cycle.
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Ehhh....put me in the 'this isn't Pantera' camp. There simply is no Pantera without Dime or Vinny. This will be a Pantera cover band....probably sound decent and all that....but I personally think touring as 'Pantera' is just a money grab. Tour as "pick a name" and call it a tribute band and be done with it.
I respect your opinion Gary, but I've sort of come to the conclusion that that ship has sailed as a general concept. If Floyd can be without Roger Waters, if Dream Theater can be without Mike Portnoy, I think there really isn't an "indispensible member" with one exception. There is really only one band for whom there are truly indispensable members (and I'm not talking about simply "having ownership of the name"): The Beatles. I was going to put Rush in there, but a) they existed before Neil joined, and b) I don't think the window has passed for which we see something - even if it's a one-off - for Rush with another drummer. We will NEVER see the Beatles as an entity again.
I get that sentiment....BUT....as others have mentioned....Dime and Vinnie made up the sound of Pantera....and while there are certainly guys who can play their parts it's just not the same at all. But I do understand this isn't the first or last instance of a broken up band or band with dead members that will tour as 'THE' band. But, like in all those instances....to me....it feels cheap. This one even more given the two most vital members aren't participating.
Well, if it doesn't work for you that's entirely fine; I certainly share that. I'm out on Yes without Jon Anderson OR Chris Squire at this point and I have certain eras of some bands that I ignore completely because certain people aren't in there (cough, Rob Halford, cough; Asia without the four original guys).
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Pantera is one of two bands I love that I missed out on seeing live before they disbanded/retired, the other one being Rush. If this is closest I can get to seeing them, I’ll take it.
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I never saw them in their prime, so I'd go to a show, providing Phil is sober and 'singing' well :metal
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I saw Pantera live a few times in their prime and it was always a great show. In the 90s they were one of my favourite bands but I rarely or at all listen to them these days. I’m not against this tour and I would even consider going to see it.
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Speaking of Pantera live...
Here's a video of their performance at the Monsters of Rock '92, in Italy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-lMfmlPXSA
This is from the "Italian MTV" (it was called Videomusic). They recorded pretty much the whole thing and then broadcast it all. I remember taping it - I must still have the VHS at my dad's apartment, back in the homeland ;D The line-up included Pantera, Testament, Megadeth, Dio-fronted Sabbath and Maiden headlining. (I'm pretty sure the other performances are on YT too). Awesome stuff.
Pantera were fresh off releasing Vulgar, and they had such amazing energy on stage. The broadcast unfortunately cut off F'ing Hostile (you can hear the very end of it at the beginning of the video, with Anselmo's scream), but the rest is there and it's great.
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Speaking of Pantera live...
Here's a video of their performance at the Monsters of Rock '92, in Italy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-lMfmlPXSA
This is from the "Italian MTV" (it was called Videomusic). They recorded pretty much the whole thing and then broadcast it all. I remember taping it - I must still have the VHS at my dad's apartment, back in the homeland ;D The line-up included Pantera, Testament, Megadeth, Dio-fronted Sabbath and Maiden headlining. (I'm pretty sure the other performances are on YT too). Awesome stuff.
Pantera were fresh off releasing Vulgar, and they had such amazing energy on stage. The broadcast unfortunately cut off F'ing Hostile (you can hear the very end of it at the beginning of the video, with Anselmo's scream), but the rest is there and it's great.
God, if I had the chance to see Pantera in '92, I would pay ridiculous amounts! I watched Mouth for War but I'll have to watch the rest later.
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Check this set:
https://z2comics.com/products/pantera-a-vulgar-display-of-power?_pos=1&_sid=4e017e267&_ss=r
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HALFTERA!
I'll start out by saying I'll definitely see this when it hits the NJ/NY area. But, it's not Pantera and it's not a reunion. Phil and Rex have played live together with Down in the past and there are no Abbott brothers. This is Sammy and Mikey doing Van Halen with The Circle. I'll admit they got probably the 2 best choices they could for substitutes. But, it'll never touch the real thing.
I was fortunate enough to see them 5 times back in the day. I got to see them slay when they opened for Skid Row supporting Vulgar. And, I got to see a doped-up and ranting Phil touring on the last album. This will most likely be somewhere in the middle. Zakk will do a good enough job pulling off Dime's parts and Charlie is awesome. I haven't heard Phil live in a while. So, I'm curious to hear what he sounds like these days. Say what you want about this band, they're gonna headline every rock and metal festival in the US and probably Europe next year. They've already been announced as the headliner for Mexico's "Heaven and Hell Metal Fest". So, yeah, they're gonna make a ton of money. I'm just surprised we haven't heard anything from Rita yet.
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I never got to see Pantera. I just didn't go to enough concerts in the 90s other than Queensryche and Dream Theater. And when they got back for their last record, I was in law school and couldn't afford to go. By the time I was ready, they were done, and Dime was gone.
So I am absolutely going to see this. They can call it Pantera - we all know it isn't. BUT, IF (and it is a big IF) Phil can get his voice in good enough shape to at least give the Cowboys and Vulgar stuff the good performance it deserves, I'll be happy. I have ZERO doubt that musically it will be PERFECT with Zakk and Charlie involved and Rex holding it down as normal. The wildcard is Phil. If he does what he has been doing, the material that I want to see probably won't be sung well. But regardless, I'll be there. To me, it'll be a nice way to honor Dime and Vinnie.
But if they continue under the Pantera name and make this a formal band again and not just a tour, I'll be done. This, IMO, should just be a tour to send Pantera off the way the band should have been, and to honor Vin and Dime. If it is more than that, I'll see my show and call it a day.
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I never got to see Pantera. I just didn't go to enough concerts in the 90s other than Queensryche and Dream Theater. And when they got back for their last record, I was in law school and couldn't afford to go. By the time I was ready, they were done, and Dime was gone.
So I am absolutely going to see this. They can call it Pantera - we all know it isn't. BUT, IF (and it is a big IF) Phil can get his voice in good enough shape to at least give the Cowboys and Vulgar stuff the good performance it deserves, I'll be happy. I have ZERO doubt that musically it will be PERFECT with Zakk and Charlie involved and Rex holding it down as normal. The wildcard is Phil. If he does what he has been doing, the material that I want to see probably won't be sung well. But regardless, I'll be there. To me, it'll be a nice way to honor Dime and Vinnie.
But if they continue under the Pantera name and make this a formal band again and not just a tour, I'll be done. This, IMO, should just be a tour to send Pantera off the way the band should have been, and to honor Vin and Dime. If it is more than that, I'll see my show and call it a day.
Charlie and Zakk have both issued small "statements" clarifying that this is a tribute and celebration,. and not a reunion.
As for Phil - even back in the 90's, he was hit or miss. He was in the throes of his addictions and was never going to sing Cemetery Gates perfectly, like the studio record. The live album even confirms that, back in 1997. The sheer ferocity of the live shows is what that propelled them forward.
I think they'll be able to match that, and I wasn't sure about it last week when it was announced. I was listening to A New Level and the drumming in that song really reminded me of Charlie's drumming on Nobody Knows Anything from We've Come For You All. They both have the chops to honor Dime and Vinnie and Phil will just be Phil. Maybe he'll be amazing, maybe he won't, but that isn't anything new for him.
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Some folks on FB are calling this a disgraceful money grab. :\ I don't see anything wrong with doing a tribute celebration because that's all it is. I'm pretty sure Zakk wouldn't be doing this if he thought it would be disrespectful and selfish. Besides, I don't know who could play Dime's parts better than Zakk.
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Maybe it's because I'm not a Pantera fan (though I'm a fan of Kiss with Tommy and Eric, so...) but I always sort of chuckle at the responses to this stuff. So what if it was a money grab? There are worse things; it's a BAND for gosh sakes. "It's not Black Sabbath without Bill Ward!" or "It's not Van Halen without Michael Anthony!" Guess what; it was. If you don't like that music, fair enough, but that's not the same thing. I'm a Zakk fan, he's a great guitar player, so I have no doubt he can play the Dime parts; and he does seem to have a sense of history and "place", so there's that, but it's not for anyone to say whether this is the real deal or a 'tribute', those are just labels. The concerts are NOT going to be free, are they? So what's the difference?
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Maybe it's because I'm not a Pantera fan (though I'm a fan of Kiss with Tommy and Eric, so...) but I always sort of chuckle at the responses to this stuff. So what if it was a money grab? There are worse things; it's a BAND for gosh sakes. "It's not Black Sabbath without Bill Ward!" or "It's not Van Halen without Michael Anthony!" Guess what; it was. If you don't like that music, fair enough, but that's not the same thing. I'm a Zakk fan, he's a great guitar player, so I have no doubt he can play the Dime parts; and he does seem to have a sense of history and "place", so there's that, but it's not for anyone to say whether this is the real deal or a 'tribute', those are just labels. The concerts are NOT going to be free, are they? So what's the difference?
I agree. People take these things too personally sometimes.
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I agree. People take these things too personally sometimes.
I agree sometimes people can take things too personally. However, it all depends upon a person's context. Someone who grew up with that band and loved that band and poured their blood, sweat and tears for the band may certainly have a more personal connection than someone who is a casual fan or maybe just discovered the band. Half the band - arguably the two most important members - are dead. The two left - the bassist and the loudmouth singer - have decided to go out on the road with 2 other musicians and call it Pantera.
I think the main problem was the way this was presented to the public. It was a generic press release hyping the return of Pantera. They didn't announce right away who was joining Phil and Rex. There would've been way less backlash, maybe even none, if they had elaborated more on having this be a celebration of Vinnie and Dime and Pantera as opposed to straight-up calling it Pantera. There was no mention of Rita or if she was involved in this at all. Calling it Pantera 1,000 times in the release could certainly leave a bad taste in someone's mouth. Especially if Pantera was the gateway band for someone discovering music. Look at how many KISS fans can't get over Tommy and Eric being in Peter and Ace's makeup. And, it's been 15 frickin' years! But, I'm sure Zakk's interview over the weekend did a lot to talk some people off the ledge.
It should be pretty cool. It's gonna do really well. It's not Pantera. I can't wait.
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I agree. People take these things too personally sometimes.
I agree sometimes people can take things too personally. However, it all depends upon a person's context. Someone who grew up with that band and loved that band and poured their blood, sweat and tears for the band may certainly have a more personal connection than someone who is a casual fan or maybe just discovered the band. Half the band - arguably the two most important members - are dead. The two left - the bassist and the loudmouth singer - have decided to go out on the road with 2 other musicians and call it Pantera.
I think the main problem was the way this was presented to the public. It was a generic press release hyping the return of Pantera. They didn't announce right away who was joining Phil and Rex. There would've been way less backlash, maybe even none, if they had elaborated more on having this be a celebration of Vinnie and Dime and Pantera as opposed to straight-up calling it Pantera. There was no mention of Rita or if she was involved in this at all. Calling it Pantera 1,000 times in the release could certainly leave a bad taste in someone's mouth. Especially if Pantera was the gateway band for someone discovering music. Look at how many KISS fans can't get over Tommy and Eric being in Peter and Ace's makeup. And, it's been 15 frickin' years! But, I'm sure Zakk's interview over the weekend did a lot to talk some people off the ledge.
It should be pretty cool. It's gonna do really well. It's not Pantera. I can't wait.
Well, that's sort of why I referenced Kiss in my original post. I don't get that either. I'm a Kiss fan from 1977 or thereabouts (Kiss Alive II was one of the first records I ever bought with my own money; might be the first, I don't remember). I'm invested in them, still; I saw like four or five reunion shows with the original members, and I've been lucky enough to meet both Gene and Paul twice each (wonderful, wonderful men in my experience). But I'm realistic about things. I read the four autobiographies; they are not the same. I saw Kiss on Peter's last tour and there was nothing magical about it. He sucked hard.
I will agree with you on one point: context DOES matter. Gene and Paul haven't pulled any wool over anyone's eyes, nor have they backed away from the issue. It is what it is, and we get to vote with our dollars. All I know is Kiss filled the Meadows Music Theater in May of this year (capacity 6,500 in the shed, another 22,000 on the lawn; I don't know how many actually attended for the show) and Ace barely put 400 people into Toad's Place, a 750 capacity club about a month ago. So the votes are in, so to speak. I get the controversy around Anselmo, and I'm not a fan (has nothing to do with the racism shit, I just don't think he's all that talented) but if you ARE a Phil guy, this is a dream come true in some senses; I don't think that's for me to say whether this is legit or not.
And I don't know who "Rita" is or why she's important; I'm guessing one of the widows, and that's fair, but again, only to a point.
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The thing is, even though Phil was the vocalist on the most iconic material, most Pantera fans I've talked to are first and foremost Dimebag fans. He's probably the most important metal guitarist of the 90s, bleeding well into the 00s. And even the people who considered themselves Phil fans I would imagine have dwindled over the years. The botched initial marketing hasn't helped matters. And no matter how many interviews they do calling it a "tribute", it seems inevitable that future marketing is going to muck it up and make a lot of people assume it actually is a reunion, for better or for worse.
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Well, Dime was Pantera. Therefore, Pantera died with Dime.
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I've spent some time listening to Pantera since this news came out (I was pretty young when they were at their peak then broke up). I don't know if it's the production style but I really haven't been impressed. Of course some of the hits are good but overall I thought I would enjoy them more. I'll keep listening.
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I think Dime is an incredible riff writer and soloist, but I always hated his tone. His insistence on solid state amps and heavily scooped mids for me had a really deleterious affect on guitar tones for awhile. I think 90% of kids back then in Guitar Center cranking Boss MT-2 Metal Zones were being inspired by it. It's just this harsh sledgehammer of a tone that's abrasive and fatiguing. It's tolerable on songs like "Cemetery Gates" because the solos are just drenched in reverb and delay, which counteracts the piercing sound of it. But I'd have preferred if people were instead trying to ape Fear Factory's on Demanufacture. Just as heavy and hard-hitting, but far more pleasant to listen to.
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I've spent some time listening to Pantera since this news came out (I was pretty young when they were at their peak then broke up). I don't know if it's the production style but I really haven't been impressed. Of course some of the hits are good but overall I thought I would enjoy them more. I'll keep listening.
Part of the Pantera experience involves putting yourself in the 1990's. Hair bands and heavy metal were on the way out. Metallica and Megadeth both started writing more accessible music, Maiden was in the Blaze era and declining in popularity. Metal was changing. Very few metal bands were getting heavier during those years. Nu metal was becoming a thing, groove was in.
Then there was Pantera, who did get heavier and they renounced the newer trends in music. Vulgar was heavier than CFH. Far Beyond Driven was way heavier than Vulgar and debuted at #1 on the Billboard chart. Trendkill was much more aggressive than FBD. They flew the flag for heavy metal and became huge, filling some voids where bands like Metallica, Megadeth and Maiden were back in the 80's and early 90's. And they were on a mission to just bludgeon everyone.
When I listen to Pantera, those are the times I remember, and their music makes a bit more sense when you put it in the context of that era. Without Pantera in the 90's, you wouldn't have bands like Lamb of God or Five Finger Death punch today.
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I'm reading all this and I'm trying to be respectful, both to the players and to the fans, but as someone that was NOT immersed in that thrash, groove metal, heavy metal scene, I have to say... my first impression is it's an overstatement to say he was the most influential metal guitar player of the 90's. Lamb of God and Five Finger Death Punch are popular, well-known bands, but they aren't TRANSCENDENT bands. Korn has sold a lot of records - five platinum records I think - but again it doesn't strike me as transcendent in the way, say, Metallica is.
He might have been a great guy, he might have been an excellent player, he might have advanced the art significantly, and he should get props for all that.
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As a kid, Pantera were one of the first metal bands I got into, the sound was something else. Dime obviously had a big part of that. I think he deserves the accolades he gets and to me he was the sound of Pantera. Dude could play, no question. I was also into Korn and Tool so Dime seemed a cut above the rest.
Then I discovered Iron Maiden and went down a different path. I still listen to Pantera frequently enough. Dime's soloing in the title track of the Great Southern Trendkill gets me every time.
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I think Dime is an incredible riff writer and soloist, but I always hated his tone. His insistence on solid state amps and heavily scooped mids for me had a really deleterious affect on guitar tones for awhile. I think 90% of kids back then in Guitar Center cranking Boss MT-2 Metal Zones were being inspired by it. It's just this harsh sledgehammer of a tone that's abrasive and fatiguing. It's tolerable on songs like "Cemetery Gates" because the solos are just drenched in reverb and delay, which counteracts the piercing sound of it.
This is so relatable :lol
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And I don't know who "Rita" is or why she's important; I'm guessing one of the widows, and that's fair, but again, only to a point.
Yeah, Rita is Dime's wife.
Another problem people have with this is that, if Vinnie were still alive, this probably never happens. (Never say "never".). Vinnie, in large part, blamed Phil with Dime's death and hadn't spoken with him since Dime died. Some deep seated hatred there. Not "you screwed me out of millions" hatred but, "my brother's dead because of you" hatred. Now that Vinnie's gone, too, Phil and Rex are relatively free to do what they want.
I loved Pantera. I got to see them on the Vulgar tour, opening for Skid Row. And, to see dozens of metal folding chairs go flying into the air when they broke into "Fucking Hostile" was a sight to be seen. Their shows were amazing. Before Phil started performing all fucked up every night. Then, it was 3/4 fire, 1/4 mess.
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And I don't know who "Rita" is or why she's important; I'm guessing one of the widows, and that's fair, but again, only to a point.
Yeah, Rita is Dime's wife.
Another problem people have with this is that, if Vinnie were still alive, this probably never happens. (Never say "never".). Vinnie, in large part, blamed Phil with Dime's death and hadn't spoken with him since Dime died. Some deep seated hatred there. Not "you screwed me out of millions" hatred but, "my brother's dead because of you" hatred. Now that Vinnie's gone, too, Phil and Rex are relatively free to do what they want.
I loved Pantera. I got to see them on the Vulgar tour, opening for Skid Row. And, to see dozens of metal folding chairs go flying into the air when they broke into "Fucking Hostile" was a sight to be seen. Their shows were amazing. Before Phil started performing all fucked up every night. Then, it was 3/4 fire, 1/4 mess.
I read something along those lines, but I thought it was Dime's girlfriend/partner (I'm assuming that's the aforementioned Rita).
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I read something along those lines, but I thought it was Dime's girlfriend/partner (I'm assuming that's the aforementioned Rita).
They both did - Rita was Dime's common-law wife. During the war of words in the press after Pantera broke up, Phil made some crack about Dimebag needing to be severely beaten. Lo-and-behold, Dime is murdered on stage sometime later. Rita and Phil eventually patched things up, but Vinnie never forgave him.
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HALFTERA!
I'll start out by saying I'll definitely see this when it hits the NJ/NY area. But, it's not Pantera and it's not a reunion. Phil and Rex have played live together with Down in the past and there are no Abbott brothers. This is Sammy and Mikey doing Van Halen with The Circle. I'll admit they got probably the 2 best choices they could for substitutes. But, it'll never touch the real thing.
I couldn't have said it better myself. I expect it to be good, but it feels weird that they're calling it Pantera, especially since they were estranged for some time after their last album. Vinnie even partly blamed Phil for Dimebag's death (which I think was unfair). I hoped for a reunion until Dime's murder. After that it seemed pointless to me.
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I would still go see a show just to get to hear Pantera songs, even if it is just Rex and Phil. If Phil is able to hit that high note at the end of Cemetery Gates, that would be awesome, especially since that song will be the epicenter of the entire set and the main tribute song. Zakk is actually the only guitarist I could actually think of that could do Dimebag's Riffing justice.
I will say though, I know it won't be the same as it used to be with Dime and Vinnie. Dime not only played some good guitar, his entire persona and identity was brought through his guitar playing, which was revealed when they would play live. That's what I liked about Dime as a guitar player.
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If Phil is able to hit that high note at the end of Cemetery Gates, that would be awesome, especially since that song will be the epicenter of the entire set and the main tribute song.
I think that's highly unlikely. He wasn't even doing that live past the early 90s. It's hard to imagine he's somehow gotten his voice into better shape than what he couldn't even do 30 years ago now.
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Yeah, he's never hit it outside the studio so not sure why he would be able to now.
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There are a couple live videos where he does it, like this one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0Wt6rxBFlY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0Wt6rxBFlY)
But he didn't always do it, and not at all after the early 90s that I'm aware of.
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So apparently the first Pantera Tribute date I know of, all but confirmed (by a music journalist who pretty much NEVER gets things wrong as far as announcing concerts and lineups), will be at Knotfest in Săo Paulo, Brazil, on December 18 (possibly in Knotfest Chile the week prior as well, I'm not sure).
It's interesting. I have a bunch of friends who are pretty disappointed in this decision, and twitter users are enraged. Another band (Armored Dawn) got previously removed from the Knotfest lineup because some of the members own a health insurance company implicated in serious scandals in Brazil involving the government's efforts (or lack thereof) to fight the COVID-19 pandemic. Wonder if the outrage will be comparable this time around.
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I don't think it will get to that point. I do find it strange that they will start the tribute tour on a festival.
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I don't think it will get to that point. I do find it strange that they will start the tribute tour on a festival.
Charlie recently said that it's going to be select appearances (i.e. festivals) and that it's likely that they aren't going to do a whole tour. The Pantera schedule won't affect what Anthrax has planned.
I think that's more in line with the messaging that this is a celebration of Pantera, rather than a reunion. If it gets enough traction and support, maybe they'll be interested in expanding on it.
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^ They talked about doing festival appearances so that makes sense. I assume they'll hit South America, the U.S and then Europe for the string of large festivals there.
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That makes sense, thanks for clarifying :metal
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Listening to A vulgar display of power
Man, this album rips :metal
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Yes it most certainly does.
The riffing in Regular People is some of the most underrated shit ever!
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The riffing in Regular People is some of the most underrated shit ever!
Many time yes to this! I absolutely LOVE that song. That main riff is incredible.
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I got into them as a teen when Vulgar came out and they utterly blew me away. I thought that album was the heaviest I'd heard since Reign In Blood. Then I went back to Cowboys and it had all this classic metal influence all over it too and it was amazing.
Oddly of its time, though. Those albums are definitely achievement enough but they never got that good again. Awful what happened to Dime. Seemed like such a cool guy and was a real individual player. Vinnie too was doing really groovy double bass drumming that I don't remember hearing before then, and I've always felt he was a bit overlooked.
They're not a band I've listened to in years, tbh. Hasn't aged too well for me, and I suspect it's the sound. Their production was really impressive at the time but I feel like it was also the start of the ubiquitous, over-polished metal sound that I don't dig.
However, Charlie is one my favourite drummers and Zakk is clearly an amazing player. Those boys should crush it. Will be interesting to see what it's like.
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The riffing in Regular People is some of the most underrated shit ever!
Many time yes to this! I absolutely LOVE that song. That main riff is incredible.
The whole first minute is just off the charts.
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PANTERA Returns For First Appearance at Hell & Heaven Fest in Mexico (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCKpXFHFsYA&ab_channel=MetalInjection)
Sounds pretty huge actually, especially for being the first show. Charlie nails the sound and feel of Vinnie.
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PANTERA Returns For First Appearance at Hell & Heaven Fest in Mexico (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCKpXFHFsYA&ab_channel=MetalInjection)
Sounds pretty huge actually, especially for being the first show. Charlie nails the sound and feel of Vinnie.
Just watched Walk and thar was my main takeaway! I could imagine Vinnie behind the kit and they sound fucking HUGE.
Weird seeing Phil so stationary but his vocals weren't half bad and Zakk doing a pretty damn good job.
Maybe I need to do all i can to see this. I only got into Pantera after they'd split so never got to see them.
Edit: I've watched a few more of the videos from last night and I've gotta say, they do a great job but it's really the guitar solos where I realise how unique Dimebag was. It's the main point in each song where I feel it's lacking,maybe just me though.
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They sound pretty good. Is it me or are they tuned down a 1/2 step? Not a criticism, just an observation. The scheduling of this tour is really gonna help out Phil a lot. He won't be out there 3-4 nights a week, blowing out his voice, and will be able to rest it properly.
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they do a great job but it's really the guitar solos where I realise how unique Dimebag was. It's the main point in each song where I feel it's lacking,maybe just me though.
Yeah....I've watched a couple vids also and agree. You'll never capture Dime's presence and ability.....it's a serviceable enough job I suppose for a Pantera cover band but I've never been all that impressed with Zakk's playing anyway. Always thought he was more of a 'character playing a part' than an actual good musician. Which is fine....just, you can find 50 local guitarists in your city that are just as good if not 'better' than him.
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they do a great job but it's really the guitar solos where I realise how unique Dimebag was. It's the main point in each song where I feel it's lacking,maybe just me though.
Yeah....I've watched a couple vids also and agree. You'll never capture Dime's presence and ability.....it's a serviceable enough job I suppose for a Pantera cover band but I've never been all that impressed with Zakk's playing anyway. Always thought he was more of a 'character playing a part' than an actual good musician. Which is fine....just, you can find 50 local guitarists in your city that are just as good if not 'better' than him.
I was listening to them open with A New Level and i'm not sure what Zakk was playing when the faster riff starts, that wasn't the right rythm or maybe the audio is distorted i'm not sure. Maybe he got a brainfart or something.
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Supposedly he didn't even start learning the songs 'til a few weeks ago, and they didn't rehearse until a week before the first shows. That's not auspicious for a successful tribute tour. In the phone camera recording of "Cowboys From Hell", Zakk isn't even really bothering to play the solo, he just takes a few licks from it and then wanks the rest.
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Supposedly he didn't even start learning the songs 'til a few weeks ago, and they didn't rehearse until a week before the first shows. That's not auspicious for a successful tribute tour.
Well, he was on tour with BLS and missed some rehearsals for that reason. It seems like he did a serviceable job - not the tightest, but he didn't straigth up butcher the songs. Charlie was kicking ass and it sounded just like Vinnie playing drums. Phil sounded really good. From the videos I've seen, it wasn't the ferocious live show that they used to put on in the 90's, but they're all older. At least fans that never saw the original band get to see them play these songs live again.
I do love that they have Dime and Vinnie's portraits on the bass drums. That's a really kickass thing to do.
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not the tightest, but he didn't straigth up butcher the songs.
Yeah, this is hardly a ringing endorsement. I heard all the skeptical voices and wanted to hold on passing judgment, hoping they'd take this more seriously, but this is worrying so far.
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Man, I used to love Pantera. I lost interest after seeing that video of Anselmo doing the Nazi salute and yelling "white power."
They've definitely got some bangers, but I don't want to support them anymore.
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not the tightest, but he didn't straigth up butcher the songs.
Yeah, this is hardly a ringing endorsement. I heard all the skeptical voices and wanted to hold on passing judgment, hoping they'd take this more seriously, but this is worrying so far.
I'm just comparing him to Dime. Part of it may be that it's hard to hear on video and that the music is downtuned. Dime was just always on and very perfect in his playing. Zakk was a little looser - the riffs were there, but it doesn't always sound perfect. I think he did a good job and I'd have walked away happy if I saw that first show.
Charlie put up a nice little thing on social media - he wore one of Dime's wristbands and had a pair of Vinnie's gloves with him on stage. You can tell that it means a lot to him to be playing these songs and he put in a lot of time practicing to be spot-on.
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I can't say I am a Pantera fan, but isn't have Anselmo and Wylde in the same band like prick overload? If I had to think of the 5-10 biggest pricks in rock or metal, both would unquestionably be on the list.
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As people have said, it's their first show. I've seen worst "first night" tour performances from people. By the time the Metallica tour starts, I have no doubt they're gonna be a fine-tuned machine. Charlie and Zakk are touring together at the moment. So, they can practice songs together every day if they want. All 4 of them know what this means to people. They certainly don't want to disappoint anyone. Nor, do they want to not do Vinnie and Dime justice.
Of the people who were actually at that show, I'm sure you'd be hard-pressed to find someone who walked away disappointed. Youtube is a blessing and a curse. People who missed something actually get to see it. But, people who missed something get to pause and rewind and rewatch it over and over to critique it as well.
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I can't say I am a Pantera fan, but isn't have Anselmo and Wylde in the same band like prick overload? If I had to think of the 5-10 biggest pricks in rock or metal, both would unquestionably be on the list.
What gives you the impression that Zakk Wylde is a prick? He always seemed pretty chill to me. Doesn't shit talk in interviews, and always gives praise to other musicians. I mean, anyone that can manage to get along with Sharon for 30+ years can't just be a prick.
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Yeah Zakk always comes across quite gracious, respectful and humble from what I've seen.
I think they sound great. I'm happy with Zakk doing his own thing though here.
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Yea, Zakk always came across as a cool but weird dude. Not one I'd have anything in common with, but far from a prick.
Also checked out a few videos. Charlie sounds like Vinnie. Phil sounds like....a meh version of Phil. Rex sounds mostly inaudible. Zakk sounds like Zakk playing Pantera songs in his own style.
I guess it depends what you want. If this was just the new Pantera, then I'd be fine with Zakk putting his own style on things. If this is really meant as a tribute to Pantera, and they want to be true to the original sound, then he's far from that.
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Keep in mind that I've never been a Pantera fan aside from perhaps Cemetery Gates and maybe one or two other tracks, so this "reunion" or whatever you wanna call it doesn't mean much to me personally. But am I the only one calling BS on how this is what at least Vinnie would want? I check out Blabbermouth pretty often, and regularly I see "headlines" from all sort of musicians such as Paul Stanley, Corey Taylor and a bunch of others who have all proclaimed in interviews that Dime and Vinnie would be proud of this. Now I know that the estates of both Dime and Vinnie have given this thing the OK, but given that Vinnie remained on non-speaking terms with Phil until he died (and I don't think his relationship with Rex was great either) and based on comments I've read that he made in various interviews (courtesy of Blabbermouth), I find it hard to believe that Vinnie personally would've been OK with this thing. Am I the only one on this board to think this way?
Like I said, it doesn't matter to me personally either way, but I find it comical how all these famous musicians are speaking out in support of this as if it's necessary or if they're trying to convince the naysayers to see that this is a good thing that Vinnie would've wanted. From my perspective, it looks more like wishful thinking or simply trying to push something through as fact until it essentially becomes fact. Anyone more knowledgeable about Pantera, feel free to explain this to me (aside from telling me that Phil and Rex were also part of the band and so therefore have the right to perform - I get that). Is there any provable evidence that Vinnie had a change of heart shortly before he died? Because from my (very limited) perspective, if Vinnie was still alive today, I don't think "Pantera" would be out on tour again right now or perhaps ever.
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Yea, Zakk always came across as a cool but weird dude. Not one I'd have anything in common with, but far from a prick.
Also checked out a few videos. Charlie sounds like Vinnie. Phil sounds like....a meh version of Phil. Rex sounds mostly inaudible. Zakk sounds like Zakk playing Pantera songs in his own style.
I guess it depends what you want. If this was just the new Pantera, then I'd be fine with Zakk putting his own style on things. If this is really meant as a tribute to Pantera, and they want to be true to the original sound, then he's far from that.
For his age and the abuse he's put on his body, I think he's sounding really good.
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Yeah Zakk always comes across quite gracious, respectful and humble from what I've seen.
I think they sound great. I'm happy with Zakk doing his own thing though here.
Totally agree with this.
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Yea, Zakk always came across as a cool but weird dude. Not one I'd have anything in common with, but far from a prick.
Also checked out a few videos. Charlie sounds like Vinnie. Phil sounds like....a meh version of Phil. Rex sounds mostly inaudible. Zakk sounds like Zakk playing Pantera songs in his own style.
I guess it depends what you want. If this was just the new Pantera, then I'd be fine with Zakk putting his own style on things. If this is really meant as a tribute to Pantera, and they want to be true to the original sound, then he's far from that.
For his age and the abuse he's put on his body, I think he's sounding really good.
Totally. Still meh, but he sounds better than I expected.
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Keep in mind that I've never been a Pantera fan aside from perhaps Cemetery Gates and maybe one or two other tracks, so this "reunion" or whatever you wanna call it doesn't mean much to me personally. But am I the only one calling BS on how this is what at least Vinnie would want? I check out Blabbermouth pretty often, and regularly I see "headlines" from all sort of musicians such as Paul Stanley, Corey Taylor and a bunch of others who have all proclaimed in interviews that Dime and Vinnie would be proud of this. Now I know that the estates of both Dime and Vinnie have given this thing the OK, but given that Vinnie remained on non-speaking terms with Phil until he died (and I don't think his relationship with Rex was great either) and based on comments I've read that he made in various interviews (courtesy of Blabbermouth), I find it hard to believe that Vinnie personally would've been OK with this thing. Am I the only one on this board to think this way?
Like I said, it doesn't matter to me personally either way, but I find it comical how all these famous musicians are speaking out in support of this as if it's necessary or if they're trying to convince the naysayers to see that this is a good thing that Vinnie would've wanted. From my perspective, it looks more like wishful thinking or simply trying to push something through as fact until it essentially becomes fact. Anyone more knowledgeable about Pantera, feel free to explain this to me (aside from telling me that Phil and Rex were also part of the band and so therefore have the right to perform - I get that). Is there any provable evidence that Vinnie had a change of heart shortly before he died? Because from my (very limited) perspective, if Vinnie was still alive today, I don't think "Pantera" would be out on tour again right now or perhaps ever.
+1
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As far as I know the whole reason this hadn't happened earlier was because Vinnie wasn't ok with it due to his broken relationship with Phil. I hadn't heard of him changing his mind either before his passing. I'm sure this will sell plenty of tickets, but it would have been much bigger if they'd done it years earlier. Metal has kind of been moving on from them for awhile.
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Keep in mind that I've never been a Pantera fan aside from perhaps Cemetery Gates and maybe one or two other tracks, so this "reunion" or whatever you wanna call it doesn't mean much to me personally. But am I the only one calling BS on how this is what at least Vinnie would want? I check out Blabbermouth pretty often, and regularly I see "headlines" from all sort of musicians such as Paul Stanley, Corey Taylor and a bunch of others who have all proclaimed in interviews that Dime and Vinnie would be proud of this. Now I know that the estates of both Dime and Vinnie have given this thing the OK, but given that Vinnie remained on non-speaking terms with Phil until he died (and I don't think his relationship with Rex was great either) and based on comments I've read that he made in various interviews (courtesy of Blabbermouth), I find it hard to believe that Vinnie personally would've been OK with this thing. Am I the only one on this board to think this way?
Like I said, it doesn't matter to me personally either way, but I find it comical how all these famous musicians are speaking out in support of this as if it's necessary or if they're trying to convince the naysayers to see that this is a good thing that Vinnie would've wanted. From my perspective, it looks more like wishful thinking or simply trying to push something through as fact until it essentially becomes fact. Anyone more knowledgeable about Pantera, feel free to explain this to me (aside from telling me that Phil and Rex were also part of the band and so therefore have the right to perform - I get that). Is there any provable evidence that Vinnie had a change of heart shortly before he died? Because from my (very limited) perspective, if Vinnie was still alive today, I don't think "Pantera" would be out on tour again right now or perhaps ever.
Vinnie held a grudge against Phil, and never let it go. I believe Phil eventually made amends with Rita Haney, Dime's widow. I don't think Vinnie was ever going to be ok with Phil, and I don't think Vinnie would play in a version of Pantera without Dime. So the band would never have played again if Vinnie were alive.
With Vinnie being dead, I don't think it matters as to how he would have felt about a Pantera tribute or reunion. Phil was playing Pantera sets with his solo band over the last handful of years, keeping the songs alive. He, Rex and the Abbot estate seemed to take extra care in getting two guys that not only could musically do the job, but were also very good friends of Dime and Vinnie. It's not just two hired guns. I appreciate that more than seeing them go out with two guys from Phil's solo band.
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He, Rex and the Abbot estate seemed to take extra care in getting two guys that not only could musically do the job, but were also very good friends of Dime and Vinnie. It's not just two hired guns. I appreciate that more than seeing them go out with two guys from Phil's solo band.
This.
Zakk and Charlie bring a lot of cred to this.
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He, Rex and the Abbot estate seemed to take extra care in getting two guys that not only could musically do the job, but were also very good friends of Dime and Vinnie. It's not just two hired guns. I appreciate that more than seeing them go out with two guys from Phil's solo band.
This.
Zakk and Charlie bring a lot of cred to this.
Zakk and Dime being best friends is a huge reason that I feel Zakk doesn't need to replicate Dime and can just be himself for the most part. He was the obvious choice and I wouldn't think any Pantera fan would be unhappy with him being the one stepping in.
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I thought it sounded fairly good. Not something I needed to happen in my musical universe but they didn't fuck it up, afaic.
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diggin this.... feel ok to like with zakk and charlie...
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This popped up in my youtube feed tonight..
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/XhZKIn8wk4A
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It kind of depends on what you're into the band for. To some people Phil was the best part of the band, and those people are more likely amenable to Zakk filling in. To me Dime was the most important member, so it won't be really possible to have any semblance of authenticity.
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This popped up in my youtube feed tonight..
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/XhZKIn8wk4A
Everyone involved has been up front with their intentions, so I don't have a massive problem with how this is being billed.
That said, I cannot, for the life of me, understand why they didn't call it something else...anything, really. I mean, call it Trendkill, call it Cowboys From Hell, call it Death Rattle...whatever, but why call it Pantera? Oh, that's right, money.
I mean, Vinnie was consistent right up until his death. If it were me in any of those four's shoes, I would not feel comfortable playing under a Pantera banner...especially when something like 'Pantera: Revisited' would have felt so much more in line with Vinnie's wishes.
I dunno...it's fine, I suppose. I'm not going to blame any of them for making a choice that aligns with the promoters, but it certainly doesn't 'feel' as warm and fuzzy as it should...at least for me.
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I just threw it out there as it seemed relevant to the discussion of the last couple of days. I never listened to Pantera so I don't really care about this in the slightest. My biggest problem is that it puts Anthrax ever further on the back burner with Charlie tied up with this.
And there's no way they put this together without the Metallica tour. This has likely been being worked on for some time.
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I just threw it out there as it seemed relevant to the discussion of the last couple of days. I never listened to Pantera so I don't really care about this in the slightest. My biggest problem is that it puts Anthrax ever further on the back burner with Charlie tied up with this.
Anthrax is out touring in the beginning of '23 with BLS. After that, I'm sure Anthrax's focus is on completing their new album. The dates of this Metallica tour are so sparse, I don't imagine it's going to interfere terribly with their plans. Even when they inevitably add some US festival dates, there will probably be more than enough time to work on their new album. Anthrax could even end up on some of the same festival bills as Halftera.
As to why they're not calling it something else... It's all about branding and the guarantee. Going out as Cowboys From Hell or something similar, they'll have to work twice as hard to get the casual listeners/fans to realize they aren't your typical tribute band (even though some call this exactly that). And, they probably wouldn't get as much money being billed that way. Everyone knows what this is, even the haters. They just choose to shit on it. I've loved Pantera's music for the last 30 years. This isn't Pantera. But, it is 4 people who respect the legacy, 2 of whom are from the classic line-up, of the band. They're bringing Pantera's music to a lot of people who probably missed out the first time around, hopefully making some new fans along the way. I can't wait to see them take the stage at MetLife Stadium in August '23.
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I just threw it out there as it seemed relevant to the discussion of the last couple of days. I never listened to Pantera so I don't really care about this in the slightest. My biggest problem is that it puts Anthrax ever further on the back burner with Charlie tied up with this.
Anthrax is out touring in the beginning of '23 with BLS. After that, I'm sure Anthrax's focus is on completing their new album. The dates of this Metallica tour are so sparse, I don't imagine it's going to interfere terribly with their plans. Even when they inevitably add some US festival dates, there will probably be more than enough time to work on their new album. Anthrax could even end up on some of the same festival bills as Halftera.
Yeah, I guess you could look at it that way, but the fact of the matter is that Anthrax will now be working around Pantera's schedule. Not that Anthrax has fucking done anything recently anyway. For All Kings is only almost 6 years old.
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Yeah, I guess you could look at it that way, but the fact of the matter is that Anthrax will now be working around Pantera's schedule. Not that Anthrax has fucking done anything recently anyway. For All Kings is only almost 6 years old.
Great album, btw. Like it much better than Worship Music. Wouldn’t mind hearing some new material from them.
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All the fans waiting for Charlie to finish with Pantera and get back to Anthrax........nah, it's just Tim.
(https://media.tenor.com/rec5dlPBK2cAAAAd/mr-bean-waiting.gif)
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This popped up in my youtube feed tonight..
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/XhZKIn8wk4A
It was no secret Vinnies thoughts. I'm sure there must have been a lot of discussion and heavy thinking behind it. Maybe something changed with Vinnie before his passing. Money is obviously the driving force with this but we probably will never know the full specifics.
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All the fans waiting for Charlie to finish with Pantera and get back to Anthrax........nah, it's just Tim.
(https://media.tenor.com/rec5dlPBK2cAAAAd/mr-bean-waiting.gif)
No, I'm with Tim on this one. A new Anthrax is much more exciting than a Pantera tribute.
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This popped up in my youtube feed tonight..
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/XhZKIn8wk4A
It was no secret Vinnies thoughts. I'm sure there must have been a lot of discussion and heavy thinking behind it. Maybe something changed with Vinnie before his passing. Money is obviously the driving force with this but we probably will never know the full specifics.
I don't think anything changed - Vinnie stuck to his guns right up until his death. I'm sure once the Abbott estate saw some numbers, things loosened up quick - promoters are willing to pay X per show, the band will pay a percentage to the estate if you sign off on the tour dates for "authenticity." Phil and Rita are also on good terms, which helps.
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All the fans waiting for Charlie to finish with Pantera and get back to Anthrax........nah, it's just Tim.
(https://media.tenor.com/rec5dlPBK2cAAAAd/mr-bean-waiting.gif)
No, I'm with Tim on this one. A new Anthrax is much more exciting than a Pantera tribute.
Anthrax is going back on tour to start 2023, I don't think there's much reason to think Pantera is hurting Anthrax at this time.
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All the fans waiting for Charlie to finish with Pantera and get back to Anthrax........nah, it's just Tim.
(https://media.tenor.com/rec5dlPBK2cAAAAd/mr-bean-waiting.gif)
No, I'm with Tim on this one. A new Anthrax is much more exciting than a Pantera tribute.
Haha, yeah just having a laugh. For All Kings is the only real Anthrax album I really enjoy so I'm interested in hearing a follow up myself.
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All the fans waiting for Charlie to finish with Pantera and get back to Anthrax........nah, it's just Tim.
(https://media.tenor.com/rec5dlPBK2cAAAAd/mr-bean-waiting.gif)
:rollin :rollin :rollin
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All the fans waiting for Charlie to finish with Pantera and get back to Anthrax........nah, it's just Tim.
(https://media.tenor.com/rec5dlPBK2cAAAAd/mr-bean-waiting.gif)
No, I'm with Tim on this one. A new Anthrax is much more exciting than a Pantera tribute.
Haha, yeah just having a laugh. For All Kings is the only real Anthrax album I really enjoy so I'm interested in hearing a follow up myself.
I also like it but :o
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All the fans waiting for Charlie to finish with Pantera and get back to Anthrax........nah, it's just Tim.
(https://media.tenor.com/rec5dlPBK2cAAAAd/mr-bean-waiting.gif)
No, I'm with Tim on this one. A new Anthrax is much more exciting than a Pantera tribute.
Haha, yeah just having a laugh. For All Kings is the only real Anthrax album I really enjoy so I'm interested in hearing a follow up myself.
I also like it but :o
Yeah I know.......I dunno, just nothing really tickles me like it. I probably need to give the older albums more of a chance though.
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Yesterday, at Santiago Chile's Knotfest, we had the first performance of "Pantera" with just Phil and 3 non-Pantera guys. Supposedly, Rex was home quarantining from Covid. The bassist from Phil's Illegals band and Cattle Decapitation, Derek Engemann, filled in. Rex performed in Colombia on Friday and flew home afterwards. It sucks. But, it just costs too much for these guys to cancel a gig or two, especially these big festivals. I wonder how many people there even know it wasn't Rex.
https://blabbermouth.net/news/pantera-performs-at-knotfest-chile-without-rex-brown (https://blabbermouth.net/news/pantera-performs-at-knotfest-chile-without-rex-brown)
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Yesterday, at Santiago Chile's Knotfest, we had the first performance of "Pantera" with just Phil and 3 non-Pantera guys. Supposedly, Rex was home quarantining from Covid. The bassist from Phil's Illegals band and Cattle Decapitation, Derek Engemann, filled in. Rex performed in Colombia on Friday and flew home afterwards. It sucks. But, it just costs too much for these guys to cancel a gig or two, especially these big festivals. I wonder how many people there even know it wasn't Rex.
https://blabbermouth.net/news/pantera-performs-at-knotfest-chile-without-rex-brown (https://blabbermouth.net/news/pantera-performs-at-knotfest-chile-without-rex-brown)
I'm not sure they cared from seeing some of the videos of that show, it looked wild :lol but yeah, it's a bit odd for it to go to a one man original band like that, but it's for legit reasons.
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I mean honestly, it feels like Phil is running this whole spectacle anyway.
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I'm not sure they cared from seeing some of the videos of that show, it looked wild :lol but yeah, it's a bit odd for it to go to a one man original band like that, but it's for legit reasons.
I'm sure they didn't care. Had I been there, I don't think I would've cared. Truthfully, to me, Rex is the least important part of that band. Phil is the voice and the Abbotts were the backbone. I'm not saying he's NOT important, just the least important. As long as the band sounded good and the fans enjoyed it, nothing else matters.
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Yeah, poor Rex has always just kinda been there. Don't see anyone walking out that he wasn't there. :lol
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I can't say I am a Pantera fan, but isn't have Anselmo and Wylde in the same band like prick overload? If I had to think of the 5-10 biggest pricks in rock or metal, both would unquestionably be on the list.
I get Anselmo, but Wylde? He's not a shrinking violet, but he's usually pretty respectful and recognizes his place in the (rock'n'roll) cosmos.
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Keep in mind that I've never been a Pantera fan aside from perhaps Cemetery Gates and maybe one or two other tracks, so this "reunion" or whatever you wanna call it doesn't mean much to me personally. But am I the only one calling BS on how this is what at least Vinnie would want? I check out Blabbermouth pretty often, and regularly I see "headlines" from all sort of musicians such as Paul Stanley, Corey Taylor and a bunch of others who have all proclaimed in interviews that Dime and Vinnie would be proud of this. Now I know that the estates of both Dime and Vinnie have given this thing the OK, but given that Vinnie remained on non-speaking terms with Phil until he died (and I don't think his relationship with Rex was great either) and based on comments I've read that he made in various interviews (courtesy of Blabbermouth), I find it hard to believe that Vinnie personally would've been OK with this thing. Am I the only one on this board to think this way?
Like I said, it doesn't matter to me personally either way, but I find it comical how all these famous musicians are speaking out in support of this as if it's necessary or if they're trying to convince the naysayers to see that this is a good thing that Vinnie would've wanted. From my perspective, it looks more like wishful thinking or simply trying to push something through as fact until it essentially becomes fact. Anyone more knowledgeable about Pantera, feel free to explain this to me (aside from telling me that Phil and Rex were also part of the band and so therefore have the right to perform - I get that). Is there any provable evidence that Vinnie had a change of heart shortly before he died? Because from my (very limited) perspective, if Vinnie was still alive today, I don't think "Pantera" would be out on tour again right now or perhaps ever.
Scotty, I'm with you 10,000% on this. Having been through the loss of two people that I was perhaps as close to as any human beings can be, I'm under ZERO delusions that I know what my parents would or would not have wanted, except in those instances where they've clearly said what it is they want (or don't want).
I also know (and I've stated this here before) that the lines between "A Tribute to Pantera!" and "Pantera: The Band" are blurring here. Some of that is the media being sloppy, but I saw some ads for the tour that were "Metallica with Pantera". Boom, full stop. I just know from having followed bands for decades that patently do not get along, people surprise me every single time. Why Keith Richards and Mick Jagger still make music together (or Joe Perry and Steven Tyler, as other examples) is beyond me, but they find a way. It shocks me that Jon Anderson and Chris Squire remained on the outs until Chris's death (though I understand there was peace at the end). I watched John and Mike CELEBRATE each other twice on this last tour and I never thought I'd see that. For ANYONE - even his girlfriend, unless he SAID it to her, and I don't understand that he did - to assume that Dime would "want" or "like" anything is ridiculous.
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Keep in mind that I've never been a Pantera fan aside from perhaps Cemetery Gates and maybe one or two other tracks, so this "reunion" or whatever you wanna call it doesn't mean much to me personally. But am I the only one calling BS on how this is what at least Vinnie would want? I check out Blabbermouth pretty often, and regularly I see "headlines" from all sort of musicians such as Paul Stanley, Corey Taylor and a bunch of others who have all proclaimed in interviews that Dime and Vinnie would be proud of this. Now I know that the estates of both Dime and Vinnie have given this thing the OK, but given that Vinnie remained on non-speaking terms with Phil until he died (and I don't think his relationship with Rex was great either) and based on comments I've read that he made in various interviews (courtesy of Blabbermouth), I find it hard to believe that Vinnie personally would've been OK with this thing. Am I the only one on this board to think this way?
Like I said, it doesn't matter to me personally either way, but I find it comical how all these famous musicians are speaking out in support of this as if it's necessary or if they're trying to convince the naysayers to see that this is a good thing that Vinnie would've wanted. From my perspective, it looks more like wishful thinking or simply trying to push something through as fact until it essentially becomes fact. Anyone more knowledgeable about Pantera, feel free to explain this to me (aside from telling me that Phil and Rex were also part of the band and so therefore have the right to perform - I get that). Is there any provable evidence that Vinnie had a change of heart shortly before he died? Because from my (very limited) perspective, if Vinnie was still alive today, I don't think "Pantera" would be out on tour again right now or perhaps ever.
Scotty, I'm with you 10,000% on this. Having been through the loss of two people that I was perhaps as close to as any human beings can be, I'm under ZERO delusions that I know what my parents would or would not have wanted, expect in those instances where they've said they want (or don't want).
I also know (and I've stated this here before) that the lines between "A Tribute to Pantera!" and "Pantera: The Band" are blurring here. Some of that is the media being sloppy, but I saw some ads for the tour that were "Metallica with Pantera". Boom, full stop. I just know from having followed bands for decades that patently do not get along, people surprise me every single time. Why Keith Richards and Mick Jagger still make music together (or Joe Perry and Steven Tyler, as other examples) is beyond me, but they find a way. It shocks me that Jon Anderson and Chris Squire remained on the outs until Chris's death (though I understand there was peace at the end). I watched John and Mike CELEBRATE each other twice on this last tour and I never thought I'd see that. For ANYONE - even his girlfriend, unless he SAID it to her, and I don't understand that he did - to assume that Dime would "want" or "like" anything is ridiculous.
I also am not a big fan or closely follow Pantera, but lets say Vinnie was still alive.... a lot of time has passed, without knowing the details here, I have to think it's very possible he would have gotten over whatever issues they had by now. We've seen it time and time again with other bands and especially when a lucrative tour opportunity comes, that members can overcome their dislike of each other to perform as a band again. My point is merely, it's impossible to say what the relationships would be like today if Vinnie and/or Dimebag hadn't died.
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Keep in mind that I've never been a Pantera fan aside from perhaps Cemetery Gates and maybe one or two other tracks, so this "reunion" or whatever you wanna call it doesn't mean much to me personally. But am I the only one calling BS on how this is what at least Vinnie would want? I check out Blabbermouth pretty often, and regularly I see "headlines" from all sort of musicians such as Paul Stanley, Corey Taylor and a bunch of others who have all proclaimed in interviews that Dime and Vinnie would be proud of this. Now I know that the estates of both Dime and Vinnie have given this thing the OK, but given that Vinnie remained on non-speaking terms with Phil until he died (and I don't think his relationship with Rex was great either) and based on comments I've read that he made in various interviews (courtesy of Blabbermouth), I find it hard to believe that Vinnie personally would've been OK with this thing. Am I the only one on this board to think this way?
Like I said, it doesn't matter to me personally either way, but I find it comical how all these famous musicians are speaking out in support of this as if it's necessary or if they're trying to convince the naysayers to see that this is a good thing that Vinnie would've wanted. From my perspective, it looks more like wishful thinking or simply trying to push something through as fact until it essentially becomes fact. Anyone more knowledgeable about Pantera, feel free to explain this to me (aside from telling me that Phil and Rex were also part of the band and so therefore have the right to perform - I get that). Is there any provable evidence that Vinnie had a change of heart shortly before he died? Because from my (very limited) perspective, if Vinnie was still alive today, I don't think "Pantera" would be out on tour again right now or perhaps ever.
Scotty, I'm with you 10,000% on this. Having been through the loss of two people that I was perhaps as close to as any human beings can be, I'm under ZERO delusions that I know what my parents would or would not have wanted, expect in those instances where they've said they want (or don't want).
I also know (and I've stated this here before) that the lines between "A Tribute to Pantera!" and "Pantera: The Band" are blurring here. Some of that is the media being sloppy, but I saw some ads for the tour that were "Metallica with Pantera". Boom, full stop. I just know from having followed bands for decades that patently do not get along, people surprise me every single time. Why Keith Richards and Mick Jagger still make music together (or Joe Perry and Steven Tyler, as other examples) is beyond me, but they find a way. It shocks me that Jon Anderson and Chris Squire remained on the outs until Chris's death (though I understand there was peace at the end). I watched John and Mike CELEBRATE each other twice on this last tour and I never thought I'd see that. For ANYONE - even his girlfriend, unless he SAID it to her, and I don't understand that he did - to assume that Dime would "want" or "like" anything is ridiculous.
I also am not a big fan or closely follow Pantera, but lets say Vinnie was still alive.... a lot of time has passed, without knowing the details here, I have to think it's very possible he would have gotten over whatever issues they had by now. We've seen it time and time again with other bands and especially when a lucrative tour opportunity comes, that members can overcome their dislike of each other to perform as a band again. My point is merely, it's impossible to say what the relationships would be like today if Vinnie and/or Dimebag hadn't died.
I don't know......maybe had Dime not been killed......I can see a scenario where they make amends and perform together again. But there are countless interviews out there in print and on video where Vinnie is 100% committed to there never being a 'Pantera' tour again because Dime was dead and there is no Pantera without him. Plus, it's one thing to break up as a band then make up but it's another when your brother is murdered by someone who was directly/indirectly inspired by Phil to carry out that shooting. Vinnie was holding a pretty strong grudge against him and I don't think that would have ever subsided to be honest after watching some of those interviews.
This Pantera cover band is going to make a butt ton of $$$ for a lot of people so I think that's why we're seeing this passed off as some sort of 'reunion' or whatever. But, as the many videos of the shows illustrate.....this is just a cover band....that is it.....and IMO it's a cover band with a guitarist struggling to hold up his end of the deal.
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Yeah, I mean, it's totally possible this never happens if Vinnie is still alive. But we just don't know. Especially, like I said, with the potential money being offered to do this tour. Obviously things are very emotional, but I truly think time heals all wounds. Maybe not in this case, but it's just so hard to be strongly opinionated one way or the other here. (as someone who isn't too close to the band, I can see why those who are big fans have stronger opinions)
IMO it's a cover band with a guitarist struggling to hold up his end of the deal.
Why do you think this? Not arguing as I'm not really following their performances, I'm just wondering what he's doing wrong.
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IMO it's a cover band with a guitarist struggling to hold up his end of the deal.
Why do you think this? Not arguing as I'm not really following their performances, I'm just wondering what he's doing wrong.
This is probably where it's just what you're expectations are from this tour/performance. If you're going to use or bill the name 'Pantera' I expect Pantera level sound. None of the solo spots sound anything like Dime's solos.....maybe every now and then there's a hint of the original but they aren't even close. And, which....I get that he's Zakk Wylde and not Dimebag.....his little signature squeal/noodle thing is littered throughout all the songs. I remain baffled as to 'how' he's considered a good guitarist but whatever. It's all opinion but for me he's just too far off base from the original guitar riffs and sounds. He's playing them close enough to get through the songs and entertain the crowds but Pantera/Dimes signature sound was just a thick, powerful rhythm of his riffs and captivating solo's.....and that's missing.
Drummer is doing good but it's a much "simpler" ask IMO as it's pretty clear cut what he's expected to do.
I 'get' the argument for having Zakk serve as the guitarist with his friendship to Dime and he's a "big name" draw. But for me and what I hear....it's just Phil and the Illegals with a different guitarist.
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Oh, if he's not being faithful to the original, that's not cool. I've never been a big fan of his. But if he's making it more about him than Pantera, I'm not a fan of that.
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Oh, if he's not being faithful to the original, that's not cool. I've never been a big fan of his. But if he's making it more about him than Pantera, I'm not a fan of that.
I don't think he's capable of playing Dime's solos so I think that's why he doesn't even attempt it. The rhythm parts are there but there is 'flare' added as I mentioned here and there and he does struggle to even keep those sounding correct.
The cool thing is though is for his age and the abuse he's put his voice/body through.....Phil sounds pretty dang good!
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Oh, if he's not being faithful to the original, that's not cool. I've never been a big fan of his. But if he's making it more about him than Pantera, I'm not a fan of that.
I don't think he's capable of playing Dime's solos so I think that's why he doesn't even attempt it. The rhythm parts are there but there is 'flare' added as I mentioned here and there and he does struggle to even keep those sounding correct.
The cool thing is though is for his age and the abuse he's put his voice/body through.....Phil sounds pretty dang good!
Couple of things come to mind here:
1. As someone who cut his teeth on Zakk and Dime's lead playing (both huge influences on me as a player), I will be the first to tell you that they are very different players who come from very different schools of playing.
2. Respectfully, I believe that Zakk is more than capable of playing Dime's parts note for note. I suspect that his deviations from the Dime's solos (which are most notable in "This Love" and "I'm Broken") in the videos posted are more about Zakk wanting to put his own spin on Dime's work—Dime was a dear friend. This may irk some fans, but I promise you that Zakk is aware of every deviation.
3. I've covered a lot of guitarists over the years, and there are two schools of thought when it comes to this: play it note-for-note, or put your own spin on it. There are pros and cons to both approaches, but as I've gotten older, I tend to lean toward 'capturing the essence of a part' while putting my own spin on it—especially when it comes to a player I respect and admire. It's difficult to explain, but to me, this feels like the most respectful way to honor a musical hero.
4. I'm (obviously) a huge fan of Zakk. While I can only offer personal anecdotes, I have met him various times throughout the years, and the man has always been nothing but humble and gracious. 20 years ago, when BLS was playing to 10 people on the bar circuit, I saw Zakk numerous times at shows, and he treated every show (and fan) like he was at MSG.
5. I'm on record as not being a fan of the way this 'reunion' is being billed—the whole thing reeks of a cash-grab and, as a long-time fan of the Abbot brothers, does not sit well with me. That said, I suspect (and I have nothing other than my gut to go on with this) that Zakk's mindset was, 'if not me, then it will be somebody else.' I know that if I were in his shoes, I'd want to be the one standing in for my dead friend.
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Oh, if he's not being faithful to the original, that's not cool. I've never been a big fan of his. But if he's making it more about him than Pantera, I'm not a fan of that.
I don't think he's capable of playing Dime's solos so I think that's why he doesn't even attempt it. The rhythm parts are there but there is 'flare' added as I mentioned here and there and he does struggle to even keep those sounding correct.
The cool thing is though is for his age and the abuse he's put his voice/body through.....Phil sounds pretty dang good!
Couple of things come to mind here:
1. As someone who cut his teeth on Zakk and Dime's lead playing (both huge influences on me as a player), I will be the first to tell you that they are very different players who come from very different schools of playing.
2. Respectfully, I believe that Zakk is more than capable of playing Dime's parts note for note. I suspect that his deviations from the Dime's solos (which are most notable in "This Love" and "I'm Broken") in the videos posted are more about Zakk wanting to put his own spin on Dime's work—Dime was a dear friend. This may irk some fans, but I promise you that Zakk is aware of every deviation.
3. I've covered a lot of guitarists over the years, and there are two schools of thought when it comes to this: play it note-for-note, or put your own spin on it. There are pros and cons to both approaches, but as I've gotten older, I tend to lean toward 'capturing the essence of a part' while putting my own spin on it—especially when it comes to a player I respect and admire. It's difficult to explain, but to me, this feels like the most respectful way to honor a musical hero.
4. I'm (obviously) a huge fan of Zakk. While I can only offer personal anecdotes, I have met him various times throughout the years, and the man has always been nothing but humble and gracious. 20 years ago, when BLS was playing to 10 people on the bar circuit, I saw Zakk numerous times at shows, and he treated every show (and fan) like he was at MSG.
5. I'm on record as not being a fan of the way this 'reunion' is being billed—the whole thing reeks of a cash-grab and, as a long-time fan of the Abbot brothers, does not sit well with me. That said, I suspect (and I have nothing other than my gut to go on with this) that Zakk's mindset was, 'if not me, then it will be somebody else.' I know that if I were in his shoes, I'd want to be the one standing in for my dead friend.
Great post, totally agree on all points. It really shouldn't come as a shock to anyone re: how Zakk is approaching the solos, etc on this project. He spent years doing the exact same thing w Ozzy playing his interpretation of Randy Rhoads' parts, too. And Tony Iommi. And Jake E. Lee. And <insert original guitarist name here>.
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Oh, if he's not being faithful to the original, that's not cool. I've never been a big fan of his. But if he's making it more about him than Pantera, I'm not a fan of that.
I don't think he's capable of playing Dime's solos so I think that's why he doesn't even attempt it. The rhythm parts are there but there is 'flare' added as I mentioned here and there and he does struggle to even keep those sounding correct.
The cool thing is though is for his age and the abuse he's put his voice/body through.....Phil sounds pretty dang good!
Couple of things come to mind here:
1. As someone who cut his teeth on Zakk and Dime's lead playing (both huge influences on me as a player), I will be the first to tell you that they are very different players who come from very different schools of playing.
2. Respectfully, I believe that Zakk is more than capable of playing Dime's parts note for note. I suspect that his deviations from the Dime's solos (which are most notable in "This Love" and "I'm Broken") in the videos posted are more about Zakk wanting to put his own spin on Dime's work—Dime was a dear friend. This may irk some fans, but I promise you that Zakk is aware of every deviation.
3. I've covered a lot of guitarists over the years, and there are two schools of thought when it comes to this: play it note-for-note, or put your own spin on it. There are pros and cons to both approaches, but as I've gotten older, I tend to lean toward 'capturing the essence of a part' while putting my own spin on it—especially when it comes to a player I respect and admire. It's difficult to explain, but to me, this feels like the most respectful way to honor a musical hero.
4. I'm (obviously) a huge fan of Zakk. While I can only offer personal anecdotes, I have met him various times throughout the years, and the man has always been nothing but humble and gracious. 20 years ago, when BLS was playing to 10 people on the bar circuit, I saw Zakk numerous times at shows, and he treated every show (and fan) like he was at MSG.
5. I'm on record as not being a fan of the way this 'reunion' is being billed—the whole thing reeks of a cash-grab and, as a long-time fan of the Abbot brothers, does not sit well with me. That said, I suspect (and I have nothing other than my gut to go on with this) that Zakk's mindset was, 'if not me, then it will be somebody else.' I know that if I were in his shoes, I'd want to be the one standing in for my dead friend.
Good post Sir.....and I've admitted that I'm not intimately familiar with Zakk's playing....I've heard him play....but, I don't follow his career per say. I totally get your post and the point behind it and I never wanted to suggest that he is a dick or some kind of asshole as I wouldn't begin to even know that. I just haven't been impressed by his coverage of Dime's parts on the tour thus far and don't think he's come close in any of the solos. Whether that's intentional or not is the question I guess....but on a 'Pantera' tour I personally would want to hear the original solos for the songs.
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I think that's the issue. If he was playing like this doing a cover for a BLS gig, it'd be fine. But when the giant Pantera banner is above them on stage, I'm expecting faithful recreations, and these are not that.
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Oh, if he's not being faithful to the original, that's not cool. I've never been a big fan of his. But if he's making it more about him than Pantera, I'm not a fan of that.
I don't think he's capable of playing Dime's solos so I think that's why he doesn't even attempt it. The rhythm parts are there but there is 'flare' added as I mentioned here and there and he does struggle to even keep those sounding correct.
The cool thing is though is for his age and the abuse he's put his voice/body through.....Phil sounds pretty dang good!
Couple of things come to mind here:
1. As someone who cut his teeth on Zakk and Dime's lead playing (both huge influences on me as a player), I will be the first to tell you that they are very different players who come from very different schools of playing.
2. Respectfully, I believe that Zakk is more than capable of playing Dime's parts note for note. I suspect that his deviations from the Dime's solos (which are most notable in "This Love" and "I'm Broken") in the videos posted are more about Zakk wanting to put his own spin on Dime's work—Dime was a dear friend. This may irk some fans, but I promise you that Zakk is aware of every deviation.
3. I've covered a lot of guitarists over the years, and there are two schools of thought when it comes to this: play it note-for-note, or put your own spin on it. There are pros and cons to both approaches, but as I've gotten older, I tend to lean toward 'capturing the essence of a part' while putting my own spin on it—especially when it comes to a player I respect and admire. It's difficult to explain, but to me, this feels like the most respectful way to honor a musical hero.
4. I'm (obviously) a huge fan of Zakk. While I can only offer personal anecdotes, I have met him various times throughout the years, and the man has always been nothing but humble and gracious. 20 years ago, when BLS was playing to 10 people on the bar circuit, I saw Zakk numerous times at shows, and he treated every show (and fan) like he was at MSG.
5. I'm on record as not being a fan of the way this 'reunion' is being billed—the whole thing reeks of a cash-grab and, as a long-time fan of the Abbot brothers, does not sit well with me. That said, I suspect (and I have nothing other than my gut to go on with this) that Zakk's mindset was, 'if not me, then it will be somebody else.' I know that if I were in his shoes, I'd want to be the one standing in for my dead friend.
Good post Sir.....and I've admitted that I'm not intimately familiar with Zakk's playing....I've heard him play....but, I don't follow his career per say. I totally get your post and the point behind it and I never wanted to suggest that he is a dick or some kind of asshole as I wouldn't begin to even know that. I just haven't been impressed by his coverage of Dime's parts on the tour thus far and don't think he's come close in any of the solos. Whether that's intentional or not is the question I guess....but on a 'Pantera' tour I personally would want to hear the original solos for the songs.
It's all good, G-man.
I wasn't only referencing your post with my comments (and apologize for failing to throw in specific quotes)—there have been some swipes at Zakk on this thread, so I just wanted to offer my perspective. He may very well be a 'douche,' but that has not been my experience.
Your last line, however, underscores my main criticism: call it 'Cowboys From Hell: A Tribute to Pantera,' and most of our complaints about how 'authentic' the representation is suddenly fall away.
I understand the economics here (hence my 'cash-grab' point), but I feel like the 'Pantera' billing is a massive misstep here on the part of the powers that be.
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Oh, if he's not being faithful to the original, that's not cool. I've never been a big fan of his. But if he's making it more about him than Pantera, I'm not a fan of that.
I don't think he's capable of playing Dime's solos so I think that's why he doesn't even attempt it. The rhythm parts are there but there is 'flare' added as I mentioned here and there and he does struggle to even keep those sounding correct.
The cool thing is though is for his age and the abuse he's put his voice/body through.....Phil sounds pretty dang good!
I say this with respect, because we're talking about "opinions" and yours is as valid as anyone else's, but clearly you're not a Zakk fan - for better or worse - so there's that. I DIG Zakk; I think he's Ozzy's second best guitar player by a long shot (St. Rhoads is #1) and I dig his soloing. It may not be Pantera, I'll give you that, but it sounds like you think Zakk is a drop off from Dime and for someone like me - for whom Pantera never really rang the bell - it's the opposite.
EDIT: What William Munny said. :)
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Oh, if he's not being faithful to the original, that's not cool. I've never been a big fan of his. But if he's making it more about him than Pantera, I'm not a fan of that.
I don't think he's capable of playing Dime's solos so I think that's why he doesn't even attempt it. The rhythm parts are there but there is 'flare' added as I mentioned here and there and he does struggle to even keep those sounding correct.
The cool thing is though is for his age and the abuse he's put his voice/body through.....Phil sounds pretty dang good!
I say this with respect, because we're talking about "opinions" and yours is as valid as anyone else's, but clearly you're not a Zakk fan - for better or worse - so there's that. I DIG Zakk; I think he's Ozzy's second best guitar player by a long shot (St. Rhoads is #1) and I dig his soloing. It may not be Pantera, I'll give you that, but it sounds like you think Zakk is a drop off from Dime and for someone like me - for whom Pantera never really rang the bell - it's the opposite.
Yeah....maybe if I was more familiar with his stuff I'd be more 'ok' with how he's playing and what not.....but I'm not...so that's probably the hang up for me. I don't know that I dig his style all that much
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When it comes to soloing, Dime and Zakk are very different players with different strengths.
Typically, with shredders, you have two types of players- those with stronger fretting hand technique (Joe Satriani, George Lynch) and those with stronger picking hand technique (Al DiMeola, John Petrucci). Dime had an otherworldly fretting hand ability, almost like his left hand had seven fingers that could dance around the fretboard like nobody’s business. Zakk on the other hand has one of the most ferocious picking hands on the planet. That said, Zakk is perfectly capable of playing a close approximation of Dime’s stuff while still leaning into his own strengths and putting his own spin on the solos. Zakk is a student of shred, and has gone on record priding himself on doing his homework and playing Randy’s stuff, faithfully.
That’s why I’m absolutely SHOCKED with some of his soloing performances on this tour. “Cowboys from Hell” and “Walk” are serviceable enough, but on songs like “A New Level” he’s clearly half-assing it with his trademarked “pentatonics-up-and-down-at-top-speed”. Perhaps he’s still finding his footing but he’s capable of much much more than what he’s currently doing.
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So, I've been listening to all the live performances in recent months. I'm sorry, but this is awful. Phil simply cannot sing the songs, and as a result, the band has detuned and it's so low it's mud.
Look, I wish I could have seen Pantera too. I never made the effort before Dime was killed. I wish I would have. But it's hard to listen to all this drop-tuned stuff with Phil not even really able to clearly sing the words. I know the crowds are going nuts, which means this will likely never end. But as a Pantera fan, I just wish it never began.
It was fine when Phil was doing Pantera songs with his solo band. I expect those to be different - it's not Pantera. But if you go out AS Pantera, you need to deliver, and some of these Pantera performances are downright embarrassing.
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Pantera - A New Level LIVE @ Metlife Stadium East Rutherford NJ 8/4/2023 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nxn66wI39bY)
Thought they were a lot of fun last night.
Sadly, their sound mostly sucked making it hard to hear Phil, but the crowd was into it and there was a lot of energy in the stadium (which was still fairly empty when they started their set with the song I shared, but filled up by the time they ended). I'm not a huge Pantera fan generally so I'm not going to be able to critique them against their original line up, but I thought Charlie and Zakk were good overall. Charlie had two different drum sets on opposite ends of the stage that he switched halfway through. Phil mostly circled around the stadium throughout the set while the rest kind of migrated slowly. Definitely an odd set up to see, but there were like 5 or so scattered mosh pits to enjoy watching from the stands. Set was close to 50 minutes, about what you can expect as an opener. They delivered the goods I'd say and I think the people who were there enjoyed the set a lot.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F2ul8mVXUAEZlNN?format=jpg&name=large)
Blabbermouth also shared my video (at the bottom :'( ) https://blabbermouth.net/news/see-pantera-play-first-concert-as-support-act-for-metallica-on-m72-tour (https://blabbermouth.net/news/see-pantera-play-first-concert-as-support-act-for-metallica-on-m72-tour)
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So, I've been listening to all the live performances in recent months. I'm sorry, but this is awful. Phil simply cannot sing the songs, and as a result, the band has detuned and it's so low it's mud.
I can agree with this, though I give them credit for tightening up more. Zakk's rhythm playing is better than it was when they started playing these shows, but the downtuning is distracting.
The live clips just make me go and search for footage from 1997-2001, when the band was ferocious and the guitar tone was razor sharp. I think it's cool that they're doing this for people, but it will definitely never compare to the original lineup, who was a true force of nature on stage.
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So, I've been listening to all the live performances in recent months. I'm sorry, but this is awful. Phil simply cannot sing the songs, and as a result, the band has detuned and it's so low it's mud.
I can agree with this, though I give them credit for tightening up more. Zakk's rhythm playing is better than it was when they started playing these shows, but the downtuning is distracting.
The live clips just make me go and search for footage from 1997-2001, when the band was ferocious and the guitar tone was razor sharp. I think it's cool that they're doing this for people, but it will definitely never compare to the original lineup, who was a true force of nature on stage.
I've done the same thing!
I saw them in '97, and, at that time, Pantera was the 'tightest,' 'heaviest' band I'd ever seen. I LOVED Trendkill (it is still my fav Pantera album, by far), and Phil was just on another planet. Yes, he talked too much, and yes, he took shots at Metallica, but whatever...he owned the stage, and that LIVE 101 Proof is a good approximation of the show I saw.
Now, thanks to Youtube, I've been able to go back and watch some fan-filmed bootleg content from that tour, and the band is every bit as ferocious as I remember.
Fun fact: I worked an in-store back in the summer of 2000 when Pantera came to town–spent 4 hours essentially handing the boys sharpies and grabbing them stacks of cd's (they easily spent $1000 on music that afternoon).
My impressions at the time? Dime was a tad reserved, but super cool. Rex was, well, I honestly don't remember him saying anything. Vinnie was in a fowl mood and treated everyone like shit.
And Phil...Phil was in a strange mood. He smiled and nodded, dutifully signed everything that was handed to him, but on more than one occasion, he muttered under his breath (loud enough that me, and everyone else, including the band could hear), "I'm so over this f*cking Pantera bs."
Anyway, talk about the last gasp of a long gone era. I mean, my store held in-store signings with bands 12-15 times a year. Not sure that's a thing anymore, especially now with every band embracing the VIP pay-to-be-backstage model.
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That's a cool story. Phil was so drugged out in that era...
I am with you on Trendkill. It's my favorite Pantera album too, and really the only one I revisit much anymore. I love how dark and heavy that record is.
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That's a cool story. Phil was so drugged out in that era...
I am with you on Trendkill. It's my favorite Pantera album too, and really the only one I revisit much anymore. I love how dark and heavy that record is.
It also has some incredibly moody moments–"10s," "Floods," and "Suicide Note Pt 1." immediately come to mind.
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Easily my favourite album from them too.
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TGST is a difficult listen, and I mean that in a good way. The band, and Phil especially, were in a dark place at the time, and it really comes out in the music. It’s raw, uncomfortable, and off-putting at times. The band sounds desperate, unhinged, and constantly on the verge of breakdown, and it’s makes for what I consider to be their heaviest record by far.
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I won't do a long text about how I don't like that tribute show that looks more like money withdrawal than a band.
Especially since anselmo did all he could to leave pantera.
TGST is the only pantera album I listen to, because it was the only one I had in the 90's...And I ffff love it, it's powerful, rich, hateful, groovy, and I always listen to it without any skip :)
I heard the other albums and tried to put cowboys on repeat but it's not as magic as first time I heard the trendkill
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i need to vent for a moment lol - i was listening to pantera, enjoying a little moment of nostalgia and rocking out. you know, just trying to relive some of the good ol days. then my eldest son douglas comes in and things take a turn. he starts going on about pantera's politics and their usage of the confederate flag, belittling me for listening to their music. i get it, everyone's entitled to their opinions, but come on, can't a guy just enjoy some music without it turning into a political debate???
back in my day, we didn't overanalyze every lyric and riff for political correctness. we just rocked out and had a good time. pantera's music spoke to me in a different way, and i wasn't thinking about their politics when i was headbanging to their tunes. it's frustrating how everything has to be so political these days. can't we just appreciate things for what they are without dissecting every little detail? i'm all for open discussions, but sometimes a person just wants to enjoy some music without it becoming a battleground of ideologies.
my son is passionate about his beliefs and that's fine. i respect that. i just wish he'd understand that sometimes music is just about the music, and not a platform for political debates. i don't want my son embarrassed by me for my music tastes - if i really wanted to be embarrassing to him i would have shouted "RE! SPECT! WALK!" at him like i was tempted to! :rollin
anyway, hope this band goes strong until phil walks past the cemetery gates, rest in peace dimebag :metal
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i need to vent for a moment lol - i was listening to pantera, enjoying a little moment of nostalgia and rocking out. you know, just trying to relive some of the good ol days. then my eldest son douglas comes in and things take a turn. he starts going on about pantera's politics and their usage of the confederate flag, belittling me for listening to their music. i get it, everyone's entitled to their opinions, but come on, can't a guy just enjoy some music without it turning into a political debate???
back in my day, we didn't overanalyze every lyric and riff for political correctness. we just rocked out and had a good time. pantera's music spoke to me in a different way, and i wasn't thinking about their politics when i was headbanging to their tunes. it's frustrating how everything has to be so political these days. can't we just appreciate things for what they are without dissecting every little detail? i'm all for open discussions, but sometimes a person just wants to enjoy some music without it becoming a battleground of ideologies.
my son is passionate about his beliefs and that's fine. i respect that. i just wish he'd understand that sometimes music is just about the music, and not a platform for political debates. i don't want my son embarrassed by me for my music tastes - if i really wanted to be embarrassing to him i would have shouted "RE! SPECT! WALK!" at him like i was tempted to! :rollin
anyway, hope this band goes strong until phil walks past the cemetery gates, rest in peace dimebag :metal
I'd relate that type of attitude to how certain people used to view music as being violent, tell him about how others felt regarding Metal being Satanic, and including messages.
I mean, Pantera isn't singing about these issues.
It's like when people stopped listening to Sinead O Connor for her controversial SNL performance. Imagine if he was a devout Christian and told you to stop listening to Sinead O Connor due to what she did. :biggrin:
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i need to vent for a moment lol - i was listening to pantera, enjoying a little moment of nostalgia and rocking out. you know, just trying to relive some of the good ol days. then my eldest son douglas comes in and things take a turn. he starts going on about pantera's politics and their usage of the confederate flag, belittling me for listening to their music. i get it, everyone's entitled to their opinions, but come on, can't a guy just enjoy some music without it turning into a political debate???
back in my day, we didn't overanalyze every lyric and riff for political correctness. we just rocked out and had a good time. pantera's music spoke to me in a different way, and i wasn't thinking about their politics when i was headbanging to their tunes. it's frustrating how everything has to be so political these days. can't we just appreciate things for what they are without dissecting every little detail? i'm all for open discussions, but sometimes a person just wants to enjoy some music without it becoming a battleground of ideologies.
my son is passionate about his beliefs and that's fine. i respect that. i just wish he'd understand that sometimes music is just about the music, and not a platform for political debates. i don't want my son embarrassed by me for my music tastes - if i really wanted to be embarrassing to him i would have shouted "RE! SPECT! WALK!" at him like i was tempted to! :rollin
anyway, hope this band goes strong until phil walks past the cemetery gates, rest in peace dimebag :metal
I'd relate that type of attitude to how certain people used to view music as being violent, tell him about how others felt regarding Metal being Satanic, and including messages.
I mean, Pantera isn't singing about these issues.
It's like when people stopped listening to Sinead O Connor for her controversial SNL performance. Imagine if he was a devout Christian and told you to stop listening to Sinead O Connor due to what she did. :biggrin:
RIP Sinead O Conner, we shall miss her forever and always
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I spun TGST off the back of these comments and really enjoyed it. Been a looooong time since i heard it. Funny, really. When it came out I was disappointed by the change from the earlier albums (which I worshipped). Decades on, I barely listen to the Panties but this still sounds fresh and current. Nice!
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I spun TGST off the back of these comments and really enjoyed it. Been a looooong time since i heard it. Funny, really. When it came out I was disappointed by the change from the earlier albums (which I worshipped). Decades on, I barely listen to the Panties but this still sounds fresh and current. Nice!
panties :lol :lol :lol :rollin :rollin :rollin :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:
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PANTERA: Heavy Metal Icons Announce Second Leg Of North American Celebration Tour With Special Guest Lamb Of God
https://lotsofmuzik.com/pantera-heavy-metal-icons-announce-second-leg-of-north-american-celebration-tour-with-special-guest-lamb-of-god/
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MADISON SQUARE GARDEN!!! Time to figure out how to get in on tomorrow's presale! :metal
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MADISON SQUARE GARDEN!!! Time to figure out how to get in on tomorrow's presale! :metal
I plan on attending, but I'd be shocked if this show sold out so I may wait on getting tickets. Good for them though, booked the world's most famous arena! :metal
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(https://www.brooklynvegan.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/13/pantera-lambofgod-tour.jpg)
For the fans.
For the brothers.
For legacy.
They forgot
For the money!!!
:rollin
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:lol no doubt
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(https://www.brooklynvegan.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/13/pantera-lambofgod-tour.jpg)
For the fans.
For the brothers.
For legacy.
They forgot
For the money!!!
:rollin
hahaha
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i asked ChatGPT to write an epic story about eating Panera while listening to Pantera:
In the bustling city of Melodia, where the streets hummed with the rhythm of life, there stood a Panera Bread that seemed to echo the harmony of the surrounding urban symphony. It was a crisp autumn day, and the aroma of freshly baked bread wafted through the air, drawing in hungry souls like a magnetic force.
Jack, a passionate music enthusiast with a penchant for heavy metal, found himself wandering into Panera with a hunger that matched the intensity of his favorite guitar riffs. The warm, inviting atmosphere enveloped him as he stepped through the door, and the lively chatter of fellow patrons created a vibrant backdrop.
As Jack approached the counter, the menu unfolded before him like a musical score, each item promising a unique culinary note. After much contemplation, he decided on a classic Turkey Avocado BLT on freshly baked sourdough, a choice that resonated with his taste buds. To accompany his sandwich, he opted for a hearty bowl of Broccoli Cheddar soup, the rich aroma tantalizing his senses.
With his order in hand, Jack sought out the perfect spot to savor his meal. He found a cozy corner near the window, where the golden rays of sunlight filtered through the autumn leaves outside. Setting up his temporary headquarters, he plugged in his headphones and queued up a playlist that would complement the flavors of his Panera feast.
The first crunchy bite of the Turkey Avocado BLT unleashed a symphony of textures – the crisp bacon, the creamy avocado, and the succulent turkey danced on Jack's taste buds like skilled musicians playing in harmony. Meanwhile, the Broccoli Cheddar soup warmed his insides like a melodic bass line, comforting and familiar.
As he savored each mouthful, Jack closed his eyes, allowing the music of Pantera to transport him to another realm. The thunderous guitar riffs and pounding drums of "Cowboys From Hell" resonated in his ears, syncing perfectly with the rhythmic joy of devouring his Panera delights. It was a fusion of culinary and auditory ecstasy that elevated the simple act of eating into an epic experience.
The other patrons glanced at Jack, intrigued by the spectacle of a lone diner lost in the world of metal and mouth-watering sandwiches. Unbeknownst to them, he had become the protagonist of his own gastronomic saga, a tale woven with the threads of music and flavor.
As the final notes of Pantera's "Walk" reverberated in his ears, Jack leaned back in his chair, a satisfied smile playing on his lips. The Panera Bread experience had become an epic journey of indulgence, a tale told through the marriage of delicious bites and headbanging rhythms. And in that moment, amid the aroma of fresh bread and the echoes of Pantera, Jack found himself grateful for the symphony of life that unfolded in unexpected places.
:metal :metal :metal
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Indiscipline = ChatGPT confirmed.
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(https://www.brooklynvegan.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/13/pantera-lambofgod-tour.jpg)
For the fans.
For the brothers.
For legacy.
They forgot
For the money!!!
:rollin
hahaha
I'd be compelled to laugh as well if it weren't so true. Fantastic cover band though
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Looks like Phil's getting more delusional, believing that if he keeps telling the lie, that it will become truth... ::)
https://blabbermouth.net/news/philip-anselmo-on-panteras-return-i-know-for-a-damn-fact-vinnie-paul-and-dimebag-would-want-us-to-do-this
From what I've read, there's no way that Vinnie would have ever been cool with this without Dime, and even more so now that he's gone, too.
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The songs are great and deserve to be played, two of the members are there, the fans are loving it…I fail to see why they shouldn’t keep touring as long as there’s a demand.
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I think the main problem is that Pantera WERE Dime and Vinnie. In so many bands, members are replaceable and the band are still considered 'the band'. Look at Megadeth. Dave is Megadeth and for their fans the only irreplaceable member.
We can all list bands that would be over for us, if a certain member or members left. For the majority of the fanbase (although maybe I'm wildly off base) Dime and Vinnie are irreplaceable. Any version of the band without them is not Pantera. That is my personal view, and I suppose it is something people are vocal about because they are billing themselves as Pantera.
Call yourself a tribute to, or whatever, but to say this IS Pantera, feels disrespectful to Dime and Vinnie. As to whether Dime and Vinnie would be cool with it? Vinnie was very vocal over the years, stating there was no Pantera without Dime (and I agree). Dime was a lot more chill and was just always up for a good time, so I believe he'd actually probably be fine with it. It just seemed like the sort of person he was.
It unfortunately seems like a money making machine, and as much as I would like to see Pantera live, and this is the closest I'd ever get, I can't help thinking I'd be left feeling shortchanged.
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While I largely agree with twosuitsluke, I think there is some flaw in our arguing.
When they do it mainly (only?) for the money, that means they are successful at what they are doing, which in turn means that the fans want to see this incarnation of the band.
But when the majority of the fanbase think Dime and Vinnie are irreplaceable, who are the ones going to the concerts?
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Your right, my argument is flawed there, as the tickets are selling (which I find even more crazy, given the price), so fans clearly do want to see this.
I suppose the two things aren't mutually exclusive though. You can feel Dime and Vinnie are irreplaceable, yet still go see this Pantera tribute.
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I suppose the two things aren't mutually exclusive though. You can feel Dime and Vinnie are irreplaceable, yet still go see this Pantera tribute.
Yeah, I think this is the case with most attendants, but it's still a bit hypocritical.
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Oh, it totally is. I think the deciding factor being that Pantera WERE such a huge band, and there are generations of fans who never got to see them live.
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What turned me off is that I don't get the sense it's being taken seriously as a fitting tribute to them. Perhaps by Charlie, but like for Zakk, he didn't start learning the material until very shortly before they were going on tour, and from the live snippets I've watched it's clear he had no intention of honoring Dime's parts, he just plays the main riffs, some iconic parts, and then just wanks the solos and everything else the same as he does in every other project.
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I don't have a dog in the Pantera fight, but if you (anyone) always have the choice to buy a ticket or not.
I've often started an OP about bands carrying on without key/original members, bands playing 35 y/o material exclusively...that sort of thing. I've always scrapped it because it comes down to consumer choice. It always does.
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I don't have a dog in the Pantera fight, but if you (anyone) always have the choice to buy a ticket or not.
I've often started an OP about bands carrying on without key/original members, bands playing 35 y/o material exclusively...that sort of thing. I've always scrapped it because it comes down to consumer choice. It always does.
I likewise don't have a dog in the fight - aside from Cemetery Gates and perhaps one or two other songs, I have zero interest in the band's music. But being as big as they are, I've still followed their story. And I certainly don't have a problem with Phil and Rex going out with Charlie and Zakk, but twosuitsluke summed it up pretty well:
Call yourself a tribute to, or whatever, but to say this IS Pantera, feels disrespectful to Dime and Vinnie. As to whether Dime and Vinnie would be cool with it? Vinnie was very vocal over the years, stating there was no Pantera without Dime (and I agree). Dime was a lot more chill and was just always up for a good time, so I believe he'd actually probably be fine with it. It just seemed like the sort of person he was.
Given that Vinnie was hardcore against it and never stated otherwise (nor has his estate ever produced a written and signed document showing Vinnie would approve it in case he died), to go out as Pantera and especially to make the claims Phil has that this is what the brothers would want is a load of crap. If they truly cared about the legacy and it wasn't about the money, they could go out as something else, not unlike how the Dio-fronted version of Sabbath went out as Heaven and Hell for the last few years Dio was alive. Maybe wouldn't draw quite as big a crowd, but it would be a much more genuine and honest "tribute" to the band (lineup) that was so well loved. To do otherwise is completely disingenuous regardless of any claims to the contrary.
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I think the main problem is that Pantera WERE Dime and Vinnie. In so many bands, members are replaceable and the band are still considered 'the band'. Look at Megadeth. Dave is Megadeth and for their fans the only irreplaceable member.
We can all list bands that would be over for us, if a certain member or members left. For the majority of the fanbase (although maybe I'm wildly off base) Dime and Vinnie are irreplaceable. Any version of the band without them is not Pantera. That is my personal view, and I suppose it is something people are vocal about because they are billing themselves as Pantera.
Call yourself a tribute to, or whatever, but to say this IS Pantera, feels disrespectful to Dime and Vinnie. As to whether Dime and Vinnie would be cool with it? Vinnie was very vocal over the years, stating there was no Pantera without Dime (and I agree). Dime was a lot more chill and was just always up for a good time, so I believe he'd actually probably be fine with it. It just seemed like the sort of person he was.
It unfortunately seems like a money making machine, and as much as I would like to see Pantera live, and this is the closest I'd ever get, I can't help thinking I'd be left feeling shortchanged.
This is incredibly well said and sums up my thoughts exactly.
That said, I am obviously in the minority...people are paying to see 'Pantera,' so the masses have spoken and the demand is being met.
That said, I have no interest in seeing it.
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What turned me off is that I don't get the sense it's being taken seriously as a fitting tribute to them. Perhaps by Charlie, but like for Zakk, he didn't start learning the material until very shortly before they were going on tour, and from the live snippets I've watched it's clear he had no intention of honoring Dime's parts, he just plays the main riffs, some iconic parts, and then just wanks the solos and everything else the same as he does in every other project.
Yea, this is a good point, and possibly where some of my distaste stems from, and I'm a fan of Zakk Wylde.
Call yourself a tribute to, or whatever, but to say this IS Pantera, feels disrespectful to Dime and Vinnie. As to whether Dime and Vinnie would be cool with it? Vinnie was very vocal over the years, stating there was no Pantera without Dime (and I agree). Dime was a lot more chill and was just always up for a good time, so I believe he'd actually probably be fine with it. It just seemed like the sort of person he was.
Given that Vinnie was hardcore against it and never stated otherwise (nor has his estate ever produced a written and signed document showing Vinnie would approve it in case he died), to go out as Pantera and especially to make the claims Phil has that this is what the brothers would want is a load of crap. If they truly cared about the legacy and it wasn't about the money, they could go out as something else, not unlike how the Dio-fronted version of Sabbath went out as Heaven and Hell for the last few years Dio was alive. Maybe wouldn't draw quite as big a crowd, but it would be a much more genuine and honest "tribute" to the band (lineup) that was so well loved. To do otherwise is completely disingenuous regardless of any claims to the contrary.
I nearly mentioned Heaven in Hell in my post actually, as I agree that this would've been better. They could've billed themselves as Black Sabbath but I suppose it's slightly different as they were making new music. As unhappy as I am with "Pantera" bring back, I'd be even more pissed off if they tried to write a new album and claim it was Pantera.
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I nearly mentioned Heaven in Hell in my post actually, as I agree that this would've been better. They could've billed themselves as Black Sabbath but I suppose it's slightly different as they were making new music. As unhappy as I am with "Pantera" bring back, I'd be even more pissed off if they tried to write a new album and claim it was Pantera.
Intially it was just to support a new compilation of the Dio-era of the band, wasn't it? Yeah, they recorded 3 new songs, but that's nothing significant. I think the fact that Tony specifically decided (in other words, was not forced to) change the name to differentiate between the Dio and Ozzy bands was very classy. Shame that Phil and Rex couldn't learn from them.
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I nearly mentioned Heaven in Hell in my post actually, as I agree that this would've been better. They could've billed themselves as Black Sabbath but I suppose it's slightly different as they were making new music. As unhappy as I am with "Pantera" bring back, I'd be even more pissed off if they tried to write a new album and claim it was Pantera.
Intially it was just to support a new compilation of the Dio-era of the band, wasn't it? Yeah, they recorded 3 new songs, but that's nothing significant. I think the fact that Tony specifically decided (in other words, was not forced to) change the name to differentiate between the Dio and Ozzy bands was very classy. Shame that Phil and Rex couldn't learn from them.
Yea, I think you're right actually, but they went on to record an album of new material under the new name.
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I am just upset they didn't even bother to play Cemetery Gates .
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I am just upset they didn't even bother to play Cemetery Gates .
Don't think Phil would stand a chance singing this one anymore.
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I am just upset they didn't even bother to play Cemetery Gates .
Don't think Phil would stand a chance singing this one anymore.
Yea that's my guess too.
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There's one early live video where he hits those high notes at the end, but after that he didn't even bother trying to tackle the ending in his prime. No way could he even attempt it now.
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I nearly mentioned Heaven in Hell in my post actually, as I agree that this would've been better. They could've billed themselves as Black Sabbath but I suppose it's slightly different as they were making new music. As unhappy as I am with "Pantera" bring back, I'd be even more pissed off if they tried to write a new album and claim it was Pantera.
Intially it was just to support a new compilation of the Dio-era of the band, wasn't it? Yeah, they recorded 3 new songs, but that's nothing significant. I think the fact that Tony specifically decided (in other words, was not forced to) change the name to differentiate between the Dio and Ozzy bands was very classy. Shame that Phil and Rex couldn't learn from them.
I didn't think he could use the name Black Sabbath if Ozzy wasn't part of it.
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I nearly mentioned Heaven in Hell in my post actually, as I agree that this would've been better. They could've billed themselves as Black Sabbath but I suppose it's slightly different as they were making new music. As unhappy as I am with "Pantera" bring back, I'd be even more pissed off if they tried to write a new album and claim it was Pantera.
Intially it was just to support a new compilation of the Dio-era of the band, wasn't it? Yeah, they recorded 3 new songs, but that's nothing significant. I think the fact that Tony specifically decided (in other words, was not forced to) change the name to differentiate between the Dio and Ozzy bands was very classy. Shame that Phil and Rex couldn't learn from them.
I didn't think he could use the name Black Sabbath if Ozzy wasn't part of it.
No. AFAIK, that whole thing came much later. They started doing shows as HaH in 2007. I don't think the Ozzy stipulation came into play until 2011 or 2012.
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I nearly mentioned Heaven in Hell in my post actually, as I agree that this would've been better. They could've billed themselves as Black Sabbath but I suppose it's slightly different as they were making new music. As unhappy as I am with "Pantera" bring back, I'd be even more pissed off if they tried to write a new album and claim it was Pantera.
Intially it was just to support a new compilation of the Dio-era of the band, wasn't it? Yeah, they recorded 3 new songs, but that's nothing significant. I think the fact that Tony specifically decided (in other words, was not forced to) change the name to differentiate between the Dio and Ozzy bands was very classy. Shame that Phil and Rex couldn't learn from them.
I didn't think he could use the name Black Sabbath if Ozzy wasn't part of it.
No. AFAIK, that whole thing came much later. They started doing shows as HaH in 2007. I don't think the Ozzy stipulation came into play until 2011 or 2012.
Gotcha!
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MADISON SQUARE GARDEN!!! Time to figure out how to get in on tomorrow's presale! :metal
I plan on attending, but I'd be shocked if this show sold out so I may wait on getting tickets. Good for them though, booked the world's most famous arena! :metal
Show is tomorrow! I think they lowered the ticket prices, I can't recall seeing $100 lower level and $54 upper level tickets before, but it looks like it sold well enough. My friend is hooking a bunch of us up with his work suite seats tomorrow. Pretty excited, not just for the show, but these guys mostly never come out to concerts so it'll be fun just to go to one with them.
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Thought they were pretty good last night. Sound was great, the arena was packed, crowd energy good.
Pantera - I'm Broken LIVE @ Madison Square Garden New York City NY 2/22/2024 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQqnaNZg8Nk)
Pantera - Walk LIVE @ Madison Square Garden New York City NY 2/22/2024 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rc0IGzPQ_KY)
There was definitely a bit of the "wow were playing at MSG" type of moments which I always love.
Not the best picture, but you get the idea of how packed the Garden was:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GG_rVJ4WgAEfdVi?format=jpg&name=large)
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Great video, Marc - definitely looks like an awesome crowd for them/Lamb of God! Hoping to catch them on a future leg/tour. I saw Pantera so many times during the Vulgar Display of Power/Far Beyond Driven tours, been hesitant on this iteration but looks like they're delivering a great show.
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Thought they were pretty good last night. Sound was great, the arena was packed, crowd energy good.
Pantera - I'm Broken LIVE @ Madison Square Garden New York City NY 2/22/2024 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQqnaNZg8Nk)
Pantera - Walk LIVE @ Madison Square Garden New York City NY 2/22/2024 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rc0IGzPQ_KY)
There was definitely a bit of the "wow were playing at MSG" type of moments which I always love.
Not the best picture, but you get the idea of how packed the Garden was:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GG_rVJ4WgAEfdVi?format=jpg&name=large)
Thanks for the videos (as always)!
Phil sounds great, the band sounds tight–I'm still not on board with how it's being billed, but at least they are doing a good job delivering the goods.
As for the "I'm Broken" solo–I've yet to see Zakk nail it. It's such a good illustration of how sneaky good Dime was as a player.
Zakk's been playing that song for a year and that solo (in particular) still gets the best of him. I mean, 98% of those in attendance won't care, and he does nail about 90% of it, but the point stands–Dime is incredibly difficult to duplicate. (Reminds me of Satch's issues with "Mean Streets" on Stern a while back).