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General => Movies and TV => Topic started by: Kotowboy on May 19, 2016, 02:06:12 PM
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Teaser Trailer : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRVD32rnzOw
Official trailer Released Friday 20th May : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzD8H6o1awQ
From director Justin Lin comes STAR TREK BEYOND starring Idris Elba, Chris Pine, Simon Pegg, Zach Quinto, Zoe Saldana, John Cho, Anton Yelchin and Karl Urban. In theaters July 22nd.
Thread for the upcoming movie. Spoilers Ahead.
OFFICIAL POSTER :
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ci89BcfVAAQl7-X.jpg:orig)
Pics :
(https://trekcore.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/spock-science-lab.jpg)
(https://trekcore.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/uhura-sulu-crew-quarry.jpg)
(https://trekcore.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/wreckage-french.jpg)
(https://trekcore.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/scotty-jaylah-kirk-franklin.jpg)
(https://trekcore.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/crew-franklin-bridge-1.jpg)
(https://trekcore.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/urban-quinto-1.jpg)
(https://trekcore.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/blog.jpg)
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Is this supposed to just be for this movie? Or the entire ST universe?
Also, you made me think there was a new trailer! Booooo.
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Just the new movie and the other thread for everything else.
The Trailer is out tomorrow. :)
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Just the new movie and the other thread for everything else.
The Trailer is out tomorrow. :)
Ohhh cool. I'll watch it as soon as I get home from work tomorrow then. :)
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Just the new movie and the other thread for everything else.
The Trailer is out tomorrow. :)
Ohhh cool. I'll watch it as soon as I get home from work tomorrow then. :)
AS Will I ! :D
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3am Saturday uk time. :(
Bother.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzWIGFiGrlA
New trailer.
I was actually liking the beginning. Some decent dialogue there. Then the plot....or whatever....kicked in and I lost interest. Sad, for about 20 seconds I was really into it.
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I agree. It certainly started off a lot better than the previous trailer, but once it got to the aliens, it still looked like generic spacey action movie again. I see nothing compelling or fresh about the aliens in the movie, no indication of plot given either. And either the Enterprise gets destroyed, or it gets so ridiculously close to it that it's going to look Beyond stupid to have it magically fixed yet again. Modern trailers give away too much.
The dialogue at the start was nice, but it seemed hollow without the rest of the trailer indicating a payoff.
On the plus side, it didn't make me think less of the movie, but I doubt that would have been possible anyway. :P
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I agree. It certainly started off a lot better than the previous trailer, but once it got to the aliens, it still looked like generic spacey action movie again. I see nothing compelling or fresh about the aliens in the movie, no indication of plot given either. And either the Enterprise gets destroyed, or it gets so ridiculously close to it that it's going to look Beyond stupid to have it magically fixed yet again. Modern trailers give away too much.
The dialogue at the start was nice, but it seemed hollow without the rest of the trailer indicating a payoff.
On the plus side, it didn't make me think less of the movie, but I doubt that would have been possible anyway. :P
The best I can gather is....bad guy has grudge against Kirk or Federation (likely the latter) and destroys the boat and takes everyone (and lots of others) prisoner on his....prison planet. They fight back and escape and stuff. Meh. I dunno, I'm guessing you could boil down the other good movies into similarly silly sounding plots, but at least those had characters I really cared about. While I actually like Pine and Urban in these movies, I don't much care for anyone else.
Anyway, I don't feel like getting into it with Kotow or bring too much negativity. Those are my reactions. I'll bow out now and stick to the general thread unless something gets released.
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Included new trailer link in OP.
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Watched it a couple of times now.
Much better than the first trailer of course. And I think it looks great.
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Doesn't look as bad as i first thought...
I'm not expecting this to be the next Wrath of Khan or Undiscovered Country, but it at least looks like a fun movie.
I'm gonna go see it with an open mind!
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I'm going to see it because it looks a lot of fun and I enjoy seeing entertaining action films on a big screen :)
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I'm not expecting this to be the next Wrath of Khan
They already tried that.
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I'm not expecting this to be the next Wrath of Khan
They already tried that.
Three times in a row. :neverusethis:
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Three ? How was 2009 like Wrath of Khan bar the one tiny scene where Nero puts a bug in Pike to make him spill the beans ?
Nemesis was like a blatant Wrath of Khan remake. It stole way more from TWOK than Into Darkness did.
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Back to the trailer and I *love* any shot with the USS Franklin flying around. I like the new trailer more each time I watch it.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ci89BcfVAAQl7-X.jpg:orig)
(https://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/3680/6606/original.jpg)
^ Last Night's Fan Event Only TMP Style Poster.
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I agree. It certainly started off a lot better than the previous trailer, but once it got to the aliens, it still looked like generic spacey action movie again. I see nothing compelling or fresh about the aliens in the movie, no indication of plot given either. And either the Enterprise gets destroyed, or it gets so ridiculously close to it that it's going to look Beyond stupid to have it magically fixed yet again. Modern trailers give away too much.
The dialogue at the start was nice, but it seemed hollow without the rest of the trailer indicating a payoff.
On the plus side, it didn't make me think less of the movie, but I doubt that would have been possible anyway. :P
I thought the first trailer gave that away pretty clearly. Moreover, aren't there scenes with it smashed up on the ground?
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Yes. You see a scene where Kirk and *someone* - maybe Chekov jump out of the viewscreen and are sliding down the saucer.
Justin Lin is a massive Trekkie - i'm expecting there to not only be a new Enterprise at the end BUT one closer in design to the Motion Picture Enterprise.
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I agree. It certainly started off a lot better than the previous trailer, but once it got to the aliens, it still looked like generic spacey action movie again. I see nothing compelling or fresh about the aliens in the movie, no indication of plot given either. And either the Enterprise gets destroyed, or it gets so ridiculously close to it that it's going to look Beyond stupid to have it magically fixed yet again. Modern trailers give away too much.
The dialogue at the start was nice, but it seemed hollow without the rest of the trailer indicating a payoff.
On the plus side, it didn't make me think less of the movie, but I doubt that would have been possible anyway. :P
I thought the first trailer gave that away pretty clearly. Moreover, aren't there scenes with it smashed up on the ground?
Yeah, there are. I really wasn't paying much attention at first, but watching it again, it's painfully clear. It's like they have to cram every explosion and stunt into the trailer to make people watch it, never mind giving away key points. People apparently don't watch movies for plot anyway these days anyway.
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You're right. Let's spend $150m on a movie and only show the shots of people talking. That'll make us our money back LICKETY SPLIT.
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You're right. Let's spend $150m on a movie and only show the shots of people talking. That'll make us our money back LICKETY SPLIT.
Given that the first trailer was universally panned for being nothing but explosions and bike stunts, it couldn't hurt. :biggrin:
But of course it must be entirely one or the other! It's not like they could show a balance of elements to appeal to every cross section of audience or anything, and show some depth as well as fun. And perish the thought of holding back a single explosion! Don't allow the audience any surprises such as destroying the flagship of Starfleet!
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I'm with you as far as giving everything away in the trailer but the people involved in the film aren't always calling the shots on the trailers.
But for me - I don't really care about spoilers. I don't find they dilute my enjoyment of the whole film on the big screen.
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I'm still excited to see it Kotowboy
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I'm still excited to see it Kotowboy
Me too. I think it looks like a lot of fun and i'm not naive enough to think they're making this for anything other than big bucks and to appeal to a mass audience.
The difference is that I don't care and I enjoy fun sci fi action films on the big screen.
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I feel the same. Most of the best films they've made have been action films.
I hope to get the writing and the storyline from the TV series.
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Sooo... The shot in the trailer where Bones, Kirk & Spock are staring into the distance and Bones says " You really wanna head back out there ? "
..seen someone say online that it could be them staring at their brand new Enterprise at the end of the film. :)
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNVTglChXf4
Clip from the movie.
Let the intense burning fuming hatred commence !!!!!!!111
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNVTglChXf4
Clip from the movie.
Let the intense burning fuming hatred commence !!!!!!!111
No burning fuming hatred. I mean, it looks pretty bad, but mostly it doesn't make me feel anything at all. In fact, my only negative feelings toward the whole (new) franchise is that it's called Star Trek. If you redesign the stuff, give em different names and call it "Space Fighters" or whatever, I would simply ignore it. There's lots of terrible sci fi/action movies out there, this just one just happened to attach a name of my favorite franchise to it. Change that and I wouldn't feel anything at all toward it.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNVTglChXf4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNVTglChXf4)
Clip from the movie.
Let the intense burning fuming hatred commence !!!!!!!111
That was the least offensive clip I've seen yet.
After watching some of the fan-made stuff, I realize that my problem isn't that they're making Transformers movies. People like popcorn flicks and so be it. It's that they're not making ST with that great cast they have. I'm just annoyed at the loss of opportunity given the potential they have to work with. It's a damn shame.
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That clip was good. Looking forward to the movie.
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Pretty inoffensive clip. I don't know why they'd choose that clip to advertise the movie. Is it the only consecutive minute of footage without an explosion? It definitively wasn't anything to get excited about regardless of how starved the fanbase is. Again, not really holding back on spoiling the destruction of the Enterprise.
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IT'S RELEASED FOR YOU BLOB! THEY HEARD YOUR PLEA FOR NO EXPLOSIONS FOR ONE SCENE!! :lol
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I said "I bet they can't go a full minute without explosions", and they thought "oh yeah? We'll show him!" Then after a couple of weeks of creative editing, they made it happen.
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I said "I bet they can't go a full minute without explosions", and they thought "oh yeah? We'll show him!" Then after a couple of weeks of creative editing, they made it happen.
I'd actually find it brilliant and hilarious if that scene, in the movie, had like 10 explosions but were edited out for this clip release.
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Well, a different clip showed her kicking a bunch of people's asses with that halberd looking thing right before her meeting with Scotty began. So while no explosions, it was still down to the wire insofar as high-action chick-foo goes.
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At the beginning of the movie - they are day 966 into their mission.
That relates to both 1966 and September '66 when the Show started. :biggrin:
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Empire magazine :
" Beyond is surprisingly low on explosions and shaky cam ".
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At the beginning of the movie - they are day 966 into their mission.
That relates to both 1966 and September '66 when the Show started. :biggrin:
I bet they thought this was a really clever bit of trivia that only super duper hardcore fans would get.
Even the explosions in the trailer for the spoilered destruction of the Enterprise is an assault on the senses. The rest is apparently bike stunts.
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The few reviews I've read have either been positive or at least not negative. The positive ones seem to be from people who generally love the last two films, while the non-negative ones say "Well, it's not terrible". Since I didn't like either of the last two movies, I'll assume this movie is being reviewed as largely an unoffensive mindless action movie that doesn't go too far into the explosions and has some basic simple elements of Star Trek to make the long starved fans grateful for whatever crumbs we get.
Honestly, I didn't see Into Darkness in theaters, I still haven't even seen past the first 45 min in general. However, assuming the reviews don't get considerably worse, I'll see this in theaters. Not high expectations, but who knows? I definitely would love to like it.
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More reviews from critics I trust. Confirming what I thought, people who loved the last two movies like this one, people who don't know much about Star Trek and want a fun popcorn flick love this movie. Star Trek fans either like (if they liked the last two) or think it's meh.
Thankfully, meh is better than bad. I haven't heard that it's bad yet, just meh. So that's a plus. I guess.
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Sounds like what I expected so far. I expect it to be less bad than ID, but not as good as ST'09. I can't say I see any appeal so far based on the trailers, but I'm not cursing it like I was at this point with ID for JJ pulling that shit with "Khan", so I guess that's something?
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J.J Abrams confirmed that "Star Trek 4" is 100% happening.
Chris Hemsworth is supposedly set to return as Kirk's dad.
I'm glad that Beyond has mostly positive reviews so far.
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I'm hoping to see it in the drive in Saturday night. I'll find out this Wednesday when the new schedule is released.
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A week tomorrow for me. VIP Seats. Big Screen. Gonna not drink anything for two hours beforehand and make myself pee 100 times before I go in :lol
And have a bottle of coke to sip on throughout.
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Going to see it this Thursday.
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NO H8
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Can't wait to read your completely unbiased report! :neverusethis:
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I'm no more biased than you or anyone else. I will form my opinion based on what I see. I just happen to be a bit more discriminating than the average idiot who's content to shut off their brain and watch mindless explosions and plot holes for 2 hours. Mocking me in advance won't negate my equally valid opinion.
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I'm no more biased than you or anyone else. I will form my opinion based on what I see. I just happen to be a bit more discriminating than the average idiot who's content to shut off their brain and watch mindless explosions and plot holes for 2 hours. Mocking me in advance won't negate my equally valid opinion.
It's good you're not going in angry.
So sorry I enjoy being entertained.
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Can't wait to read your completely unbiased report! :neverusethis:
You're also very susceptible to confirmation bias. Any criticism levied by any of us will be seen as loathing. Particularly my own, since you're convinced I despise just about everything Star Trek related.
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I'm no more biased than you or anyone else. I will form my opinion based on what I see. I just happen to be a bit more discriminating than the average idiot who's content to shut off their brain and watch mindless explosions and plot holes for 2 hours. Mocking me in advance won't negate my equally valid opinion.
It's good you're not going in angry.
So sorry I enjoy being entertained.
So sorry for being tired of generic Hollywood shlock, and not finding it entertaining to have my intelligence insulted.
Going to see this movie tomorrow, so within 24 hours you'll know how bad it is. ;)
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Of course i'm not going to be THAT guy that says reviews really mean anything but ....93% on Rotten Tomatoes.
i've seen mostly 4/5 scores and they all say it's far superior to Into Darkness and feels like Star Trek again.
The worst reviews i've read say it's just "meh".
Sorry i'm clearly so braindead and stupid that I enjoy enjoying a fun exciting movie with amazing visuals for a couple of hours to forget how awful real life is.
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Of course i'm not going to be THAT guy that says reviews really mean anything but ....93% on Rotten Tomatoes.
i've seen mostly 4/5 scores and they all say it's far superior to Into Darkness and feels like Star Trek again.
The worst reviews i've read say it's just "meh".
Because no movie ever gets over-inflated reviews before it's come out to the wider audience ever. Godzilla got amazing reviews when it came out, had over 9 on imdb at first, and now it's at 6.5 or something. Reviews mean exactly dick, especially at this point.
Into Darkness was anything but fun to me, and I've yet to see a strong indication of fun from the new one.
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So why are you even going ?
::)
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You are all silly willies.
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::) Blobbie is the silliest willie of all of them...
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Having read/seen reviews and seen most of the trailers/tv spots, I can say that, as of now, this is in-fact looking more like a huge budget, modernized version of a silly TOS episode. Which is brilliant for the people who worship the original series. If that's the case, I'm sure I'll enjoy it but may not love it. Especially since I am more of a fan of TNG and onward, rather than the fun romp in space of the TOS, and I doubt we're getting a City on the Edge of Forever level of depth or brilliance in the new movie. I'm hoping for a fun classic-Star Trek feel, which isn't what I'd prefer, but I'd be satisfied with it. Of course mostly I want tight writing. I know everyone loved ST09, but I really didn't like that movie, mostly because the writing and plot holes were just pretty awful. So you give me a fun ST classic feeling romp with tight righting and I'll be cool.
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I know Pegg is all about plot & characters. I don't know about Doug Jung but hearing them talk and all the themes of the film etc etc...
And how they had to axe stuff from the script because it was backstory for ancillary characters that would have made the film 4 hours long.
I think it's going to be a lot more plot based than the last two.
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I know Pegg is all about plot & characters. I don't know about Doug Jung but hearing them talk and all the themes of the film etc etc...
And how they had to axe stuff from the script because it was backstory for ancillary characters that would have made the film 4 hours long.
I think it's going to be a lot more plot based than the last two.
Yea, sadly the movie comes out when I am getting two teeth extracted, so it might be a week or so till I can see it and focus on it.
God dammit.
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Ugh that reminds me of when I saw Interstellar - my sinuses were inflamed and pushing on my roots.
It was not fun and hampered my enjoyment of that movie.
Beyond comes out on Friday but i'm not seeing it til Tuesday because I wanted to wait til I could see it in the big cinema 45 mins away rather than in my tiny local cinema and when I saw the
Force Awakens there - some drunk pricks were shouting and smashing bottles.
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Ugh that reminds me of when I saw Interstellar - my sinuses were inflamed and pushing on my roots.
It was not fun and hampered my enjoyment of that movie.
Beyond comes out on Friday but i'm not seeing it til Tuesday because I wanted to wait til I could see it in the big cinema 45 mins away rather than in my tiny local cinema and when I saw the
Force Awakens there - some drunk pricks were shouting and smashing bottles.
I hear that. Hopefully by the 30th or something I'll be healed enough to see it.
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I'm gonna get me some subs, a bag of chips, a few cool suds and some water and chill at the drive in.
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I want a big meal beforehand and barely drink any liquid.
I had to pee twice during ID4:R. Not that I missed much but still it's annoying.
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So why are you even going ?
::)
Because I'm a huge Star Trek fan, and I actually give movies a chance, and I hope it exceeds my expectations. This may come as a shock to you, but I don't pay $20 to intentionally watch bad movies just so I can bitch about them on the internet to strangers. :biggrin:
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So what time are you seeing the stupid action movie for unintelligent morons ?
:biggrin:
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So the new movie is playing with the new Ghostbusters. Should be a fun night.
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So the new movie is playing with the new Ghostbusters. Should be a fun night.
Yes !!!
And then you'll see Ghostbusters :neverusethis:
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:lol
I may fall asleep. It starts at 10:45pm. Old people problems.
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Just got back from the movie. Overall, quite enjoyable. Happy, Kotow? :biggrin: Some mild spoilers ahead or whatever.
First I'll get the bad out of the way-
The bad guy was generic garbage again. His motivation was "the Federation couldn't find me after my ship crashed, so everyone in the Federation must obviously die." And the concept of him staying alive was too close to a shitty episode of Sliders for me to take seriously.
They still have little concept of physics.
Still a lot of mindless action and stunts and things flying around. The bike was actually not quite as stupid as it appears in the trailer, but still a pretty weak excuse to get a bike stunt in there. I don't agree with them giving this Enterprise saucer separation either, but the crash scene was given a good amount of time.
The humour was very hit and miss. The opening scene in particular was a bad start for me.
Now for the pros-
The character moments were good, and there were a decent amount of them. A lot of moments between the main trio, and Spock/Uhura are broken up, and it's only dealt with as far as it helps the story. Every character got a more even amount of screen time, and was useful. Felt like more of an ensemble than either of the previous movies.
While some of the callbacks were a bit blunt and even perhaps insulting, there were several less obvious callbacks that I appreciated. The USS Franklin was well integrated into the story. Not sure it quite works out, with them claiming it was the first warp 4 vessel, from 2160, with a high registry number. I would assume it's meant to be post Enterprise, with an incorrect warp speed given, but generally it tied in well to Enterprise.
Nimoy's absence was handled nicely.
Any complaints about whether or not they should have made Sulu gay aside, it was a non event, and nothing to complain about. It actually also remains consistent with him having a daughter according to Generations too. If anything, they could have used it more given the danger at the end.
Quite a bit of technobabble, although some of it comes back to my hinky science criticism. But a lot of it fitted with what's been established in Trek.
Aside from my criticisms of the bad guy, the story was solid. Not particularly fresh or original, but no major plotholes that took me out of it.
As expected, we see a new Enterprise at the end. There wasn't a lot of time to analyze it, but it looks generally like the old one, but with some notable changes. They've widened the nacelles to match the width of the ship, which I noticed because that was my biggest gripe with the old design. The nacelles appeared to be the same. I think they may have also fixed the weird swept forward secondary hull. There's also more detail on the neck. Didn't have time to confirm much else, but it appears it might take a few cues from the refit, but at the very least it fixes up my major problems with the reboot design from what I can tell.
Miles better than Into Darkness (this shouldn't surprise anyone), perhaps better than ST'09, although with the same general flaws. For now I'll tentatively give it a solid 7/10 while I let it sink in. At the very least, it felt like they took some time to read memory alpha while writing this one, rather than watching Star Wars. :lol
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:tup. Pegg says they relied heavily on memory alpha.
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You could tell. As I said, the USS Franklin, and that era as a whole was a major component of the story of the movie. It was more than just a reference to Archer and his dog, or a model of the NX-01 sitting on a desk, or calling something section 31. It felt like they made an effort to respect and incorporate the history, rather than spit on it like it felt with JJ. I'm actually not opposed to another movie with these writers. There are still areas for major improvement, especially as far as antagonists and action sequences go, but I enjoyed it.
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Can't every Federation vessel seperate the saucer though ?
They even mention it in an episode of TOS. It can be used as a lifeboat but it's a last resort and can't be re-attached.
They wanted to film it for TOS but couldn't afford it so that's why Encounter at Farpoint did it.
Maybe it's a reference to the fact they always wanted to do it with the TOS ship.
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Can't every Federation vessel seperate the saucer though ?
They even mention it in an episode of TOS. It can be used as a lifeboat but it's a last resort and can't be re-attached.
They wanted to film it for TOS but couldn't afford it so that's why Encounter at Farpoint did it.
Maybe it's a reference to the fact they always wanted to do it with the TOS ship.
I just checked memory alpha, and it appears that only referred to separating the nacelles rather than separating the saucer section from the secondary hull. Seemed like more of a TNG reference to me, with the crash reminding me of how it went down in Generations. Given that the technology in general in the reboot is accelerated compared to the 1960's show, it wasn't a major point against it, I just felt it took something away from the Enterprise D.
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I love the Generations crash scene. Looking forward to seeing a new crash scene like that.
I haven't seen every episode of Star Trek ever so I probably won't get all the easter eggs.
I watched the Beyond press conference and they basically gave away Krall's secret and everything. But I don't mind.
I'll forget it as soon as the movie starts anyways...Sounds intriguing..
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So it's better than '09 ?
I've heard from actual hardcore Trekkies that it's *by far* the best of the reboots and some think it's the best movie since Undiscovered Country.
I loved 09 and enjoyed Into Darkness but understand the crits too.
If Blob enjoys Beyond then i'll probably LOVE it :) :)
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I'd need to give it time before deciding, but I think it's probably better than ST'09. Krall was so weak that I couldn't rank it above FC at the least. The reboot movies have all had awful bad guys with zero depth between them. With an entire universe of possibilities, they keep coming back to the exact same thing.
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I'd need to give it time before deciding, but I think it's probably better than ST'09. Krall was so weak that I couldn't rank it above FC at the least. The reboot movies have all had awful bad guys with zero depth between them. With an entire universe of possibilities, they keep coming back to the exact same thing.
Bad guy wants revenge / has ulterior motive / wants dat big weapon has been a ST movie staple since 1984 though.
Khan, Kruge, Chang, Soran, Insurrection guy whose name I never remember / Shinzon / Nero / Khan / Krall.
I really hope that FOR ONCE Star Trek 4 is an exploration story. I get tired of reading " such and such cast as new ST villain but don't worry he's got a backstory..."
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I get tired of reading " such and such cast as new ST villain but don't worry he's got a backstory..."
I was thinking about this the other day and it's definitely a big problem. Some of the better movies didn't really have bad "guys." In Insurrection it wasn't a particular bad guy but several. In TUC it was a conspiracy of different races. TMP was a satellite with unknown intelligence. TVH didn't really have a villain at all. That reliance seems to be a modern thing. FC couldn't use just the Borg as the antagonist, they had to invent the Borg queen. Then they started modeling things after TWoK with Nemesis with angry, revenge driven nobodies.
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My favourite after Khan is definitely Soran. When we left Dubai in 1988 - It really fucking upset me. Like a lot.
The story of being desperate to get back to a place really hit me.
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Wrong Thread :)
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The bad guys in the last 3 movies (and even Nemesis too) just had such poorly fleshed out motivations to the point that they're little more than a target for the good guys to shoot at. Star Trek has covered so much ground, and yet now they have to simply to "ME BAD GUY DESTROY ENTERPRISE AND FEDERATION BECAUSE REASONS".
TMP had a strange alien ship destroying things for unknown reasons and threatening Earth. There wasn't a bad guy in the typical sense, just some messed up technology searching for its creator to complete its garbled mission, and a human interface to communicate with. The ultimate solution wasn't to destroy it, but to combine with humanity to the next evolutionary step, or whatever it was. The solution wasn't explosions though. Maybe not the best example of creating an exciting movie with a different plot. :lol
TWOK had the most typical bad guy, but it had the benefit of a TOS episode behind it for a truly personal vendetta with meaning. Khan and his group were exiled to a doomed planet by Kirk and many of his men died, and he holds Kirk personally responsible. His men want to be free, but Khan is fixated on revenge against Kirk in a battle of wits.
TSFS was driven by the crew saving Spock, and they happen to run into some Klingons who want the genesis device as a weapon for Klingon stuff. Nothing personal against the crew or the Federation, and it tied into the previous movie nicely. Overall pretty average though.
TVH had a giant flying space penis trying to communicate with Earth whales for some reason, and the answer was to time travel and bring back some whales. Definitely one of the stranger plots. The destruction caused by the space penis was incidental to its apparent purpose. There was no bad guy, and pew pews weren't the answer. The answer was WHALES.
TFF is another one I can't say I've ever bothered to understand the plot of. Spock's half brother tricks the crew so he can steal their ship to find space God. Space God wants a space ship to escape maybe? Not a standard bad guy or plot whatever it was, and it wasn't a standard bad guy pew pews.
TUC is all space politics. They had to pew pew some bad guys, but the motivation on both sides was space politics. Thoroughly Trek-y.
ST'09 had a Romulan who was mad because his planet was destroyed by natural causes and the Federation couldn't help, so obviously the Federation must all die, and the guy who tried to help must suffer.
I'm not going to try to make sense of the convoluted mess of Into Darkness, but both Sherlock Holmes and Robocop were terribly written bad guys trying to explode the crew and the Federation for whatever reasons. The whole reason Khan was such a great bad guy in TOS/TWOK was the personal plot between Kirk and Khan, which was not only completely absent in this case, but the reveal was laughable due to the complete lack of importance of it.
STB had a bad guy who was mad because he crashed and the Federation couldn't find and save his crew, so obviously the Federation must all die via ancient super weapon Kirk happened to be in possession of.
These are all simplifications of course, and not comments on the movies themselves, and as I said, I enjoyed STB plenty for everything else that was going on. My only point is that I want more variety for plots and antagonists, some depth to the bad guy. TOS alone has plenty of crazy ideas they could use as inspiration that could make great movies (and even still fill their explosion quota) that would make for much fresher plots than boiling down to a bad guy coming after the crew and the Federation / Earth for some unsubstantial flimsy reason. I don't need to put a face to some clear cut bad guy to get invested in a film.
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TFF had one pseudo-bad guy who led you to the actual bad guy, who was mostly incidental to the movie, while a different pseudo-bad guy occasionally got in the way. Even though the movie was pretty awful I've got no problem with this. Better than some random bad guy of the week.
I will say the many of the more recent movies have bad guys that really aren't any different than Khan, including two that essentially were him. It's just that by that point they'd become formulaic. Khan, as you said, had the advantage of a known history. Also, and I don't think I've thought of this before, his return largely happened in realtime. We knew him and he was gone about the right length of time. That continuity goes a long way.
As I've said before, I really don't think they could make a ST movie that had a V'ger or Space Dick as a stand-in antagonist rather than Introducing Some Intense Dude! I'd really love to see them try, though.
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Star Trek Space Dick. Cuming 2019.
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TFF had one pseudo-bad guy who led you to the actual bad guy, who was mostly incidental to the movie, while a different pseudo-bad guy occasionally got in the way. Even though the movie was pretty awful I've got no problem with this. Better than some random bad guy of the week.
Yeah, I'd forgotten a lot of the details. I do enjoy the movie a lot, but the plot is one of the worst for sure.
I will say the many of the more recent movies have bad guys that really aren't any different than Khan, including two that essentially were him. It's just that by that point they'd become formulaic. Khan, as you said, had the advantage of a known history. Also, and I don't think I've thought of this before, his return largely happened in realtime. We knew him and he was gone about the right length of time. That continuity goes a long way.
As I've said before, I really don't think they could make a ST movie that had a V'ger or Space Dick as a stand-in antagonist rather than Introducing Some Intense Dude! I'd really love to see them try, though.
And that's the thing. Khan worked so well because of that backstory. It's a rare situation for a movie to have that, and it was an essential part of the formula that's missing from recent attempts. Into Darkness showed you can't recreate it by just dumping the character into a setting without that setup. Nemesis tried to force that personal connection with Shinzon, and it also failed miserably for the same reasons.
Regardless of their success, it just feels so uninspired to keep doing the same thing, when they went to the trouble of creating this blank canvas with the reboot. It doesn't need to be something as abstract as a giant space penis, but at least do a bad guy with a different purpose and motivation, perhaps something less morally black and white that makes you think, or some kind of different being rather than a super strong humanoid for Kirk to have fisticuffs with at the end. Surely there's plenty of middle ground between space penis whale probe and Khan. :lol
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One of the reasons I really liked Watchmen (even though apparently everyone else hated it) was because the bad guy (despite being miscast) truly thought he was doing the right thing, and to an extent, you could see where he was coming from.
That's what I want in an antagonist. It's so easy to make a binary/black and white good vs. evil situation, but I feel like the grey area needs to be explored a lot more. What if the bad guy is trying to do the right thing the wrong way? What if it's just a clash of morals/principals (like in Civil War)? What if the good guy and bad guy's parents have the same name? So many options.
I want to feel a sense of sadness when the bad guy loses. Like "Damn, if only he could have been reasoned with or something, dude was just misguided"
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It's funny y'all get into the black and white-ness of modern bad guys. I was pondering Falling Down earlier and how wonderful D-Fens was as an antagonist. The movie played it out so well that in the end, when he reacted with equal amounts of sadness and bewilderment upon learning that he was, in fact, the bad guy that it really struck you. Yeah, I'm not sure why they can't do that in a ST setting.
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P.S.
Michael Giacchino's STAR TREK BEYOND Score is now on Spotify / Deezer.
:)
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Just saw the movie. My first impression is that it was fine. That's it basically. It was big and entertaining, which is what I expected I guess, but few things really stood out here.
Also, while they did a fine job explaining it so that I understood the stakes, I never really felt the stakes. Don't know why though.
I enjoyed watching it though, which is a big plus.
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Agree. Another solid Trek movie. Nothing more or less.
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Just saw it. It was fun, but the writing was absolutely lazy. Out of the alternate timeline Star Trek movies, this is the weakest. Nothing grabbed like the last two movies did. Again, a fun movie to watch (it is a Justin Lin movie after all)
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I don't see how the writing could be WORSE than Into Darkness.
As much as I enjoy the *spectacle* of that movie - the script is basically a colander.
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Into Darkness is probably my favorite. The only thing I don't like about it is the lazy resurrection, the rest is pretty neat.
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Into Darkness is probably my favorite. The only thing I don't like about it is the lazy resurrection, the rest is pretty neat.
I enjoy the pacing and the visuals and the acting - especially from Benedict. But a lot of it doesn't make sense.
I don't even have a problem with the Wrath of Khan homage per se - just that the dialogue is VERBATIM and it's not even the same characters saying the lines.
The Vengeance crash scene is pretty awesome but it should have ended there with Khan dying. Or at least being in a coma at the end.
The barge fight with Khan and Spock was not necessary at all.
The film doesn't explain WHY Marcus wants a war with the Klingons. Khan just says he does. He made the Vengeance to protect Earth from threats like Nero.
So why does he now want a war with the Klingons. Unless Khan was lying.
I expect the writing on BEYOND to much tighter.
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I don't think you have to have an answer drawn out for you on why Marcus wanted to attack the Klingon.
Their Klingons! He was thinking strike first or they will.
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I don't think you have to have an answer drawn out for you on why Marcus wanted to attack the Klingon.
Their Klingons! He was thinking strike first or they will.
Well he mentioned they had attacked 3 Federation ships already and with Nero attacking too - he wanted to build the Vengeance to be prepared for anything that came along.
But then Khan said he WANTED a Klingon war.
That's the part that didn't make sense.
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Yes, he wanted to cause chaos but when he found out about the 72 advanced missiles he had to save his race and decided to manipulate both and get to his people as well as continuing this war.
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I assumed Khan was lying about that bit.
I'm seeing Beyond on Tuesday. :) :)
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Drive in tonight!!!!! :metal
Edit:
(https://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/kingshmegland/20160723_193444_zpsnletx1ac.jpg) (https://s583.photobucket.com/user/kingshmegland/media/20160723_193444_zpsnletx1ac.jpg.html)
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I really enjoyed the movie. The Spock moment at the end of the film was a nice touch.
It was really sad to see in the credits, "For Anton".
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The plot of ID was an incoherent mess on the level of a Transformers movie. Even on first viewing, it didn't hold up to logical scrutiny.
The writing on Beyond was easily the strongest out of the 3 movies imo. It used some sense and consistency, and is the only movie out of the three where the writing actually made me smile at times. It was still far from perfect, especially as far as Krall was concerned as I mentioned earlier, but it's no comparison to ID or even ST'09. Those were lazy.
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Saw the film last night. Really enjoyed it.
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Just came back from Star Trek: Beyond. It was a great movie IMO.
Few Things:
I felt like a really good two-part episode of a Trek tv show, with a big budget. Made me wonder what Best of Both Worlds, Scorpion or Dark Frontier would have looked like with a similar Budget...
I cringed a bit when they found a technobabble solution, and used a Beastie Boys song to destroy the swarm ships. :biggrin: It was pretty cool though..
Is Sofia Boutella going to replace the late Anton Yelchin in the main cast? She was awesome in the film, and her character has a lot of potential.
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I think JJ said they won't recast or replace Anton, which works since TOS managed plenty of episodes without Chekov. Jayla would make an interesting addition though, and I'd be all for her appearing again. I doubt it though.
Destroying the swarm was clearly just an excuse for explosions though. :lol You'd think they'd have some kind of shielding against basic radio wave interference, or at least a failsafe sensor method of avoiding catastrophic collisions with the other ships. But anyway....
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The USS Franklin's registry 326 is Leonard Nimoy's birthday.
:clap:
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I think JJ said they won't recast or replace Anton
Well they have to technically "replace" him, don't they? Doesn't a ship need a whatever his title was?
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I think JJ said they won't recast or replace Anton
Well they have to technically "replace" him, don't they? Doesn't a ship need a whatever his title was?
They won't recast him. There will be no Chekov in future movies. Will they bring in another character? I dunno. Maybe. Sulu seems pretty worthless, might be good to give him that stuff too.
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I think JJ said they won't recast or replace Anton
Well they have to technically "replace" him, don't they? Doesn't a ship need a whatever his title was?
I assume they mean they won't replace him with a new main cast member that would permanently fill Chekov's roles. In TOS they regularly had one-off nobodies in those front two seats, and the new movies have several other minor characters on the bridge they could stick there without them being featured characters.
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(https://www.thecoolector.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/STB-01606RLC-1-1050x700.jpg)
I love this jacket. I wish I could buy it minus the Deltas though. :biggrin: :biggrin:
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I saw a video showing the jacket at SDCC, and many comments were saying that they wanted the jacket. Can't say I disagree with them either. :blob:
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I looked online and they're all terrible knock offs.
I wouldn't mind paying out for an actual one.
( i'd remove the deltas though. I just really like the jacket )
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I'm actually not sure how I feel about the film. :(
The third act was *great*. Everything from Kirk , Chekov boarding the Franklin with Jaylah and Scotty onwards is great fun.
But my screening was so dark and it wasn't even in 3D. Plus I was really tired for some reason and was finding it hard to focus.
I need to see it again in better conditions. Brighter screen and more awake.
I did like it though.
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It was really good. I think I'm done with 3d. Don't see it that way the next time
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This was in 2D hence my annoyance at it being so dark.
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But yeah. 3D sucks and they should stop forcing it on us.
It's more expensive for a shitty viewing experience.
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Damn. I like the I MAX 2D shoes usually.
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I'm not a fan of 3D either. It's a gimmick, and I find it very tough on my eyes.
I watched the movie on Sunday night. I liked it a lot - it was a lot better than Into Darkness for sure. They did a really good job of sharing screen time among the major characters, especially Bones, who was a bit shortchanged on the last one. His interactions with Spock were definitely one of the highlights. "You bought your girlfriend a tracking device??" :lol
The one new cast member that has never really fit, for me, is Simon Pegg as Scotty. Maybe I've seen him in too many other things, but he just doesn't work for me. The original Scotty was a lot more stoic and less comic relief.
The first few minutes were a bit cringy, when Kirk was trying to present those big-looking-but-actually-really-small aliens with the artifact as a gesture of peace. The saucer section separation definitely felt a little too TNG, but on the whole the VFX were really good, especially the entry into Yorktown with the Enterprise flying under the water.
Also, I agree with what's already been said here about the villain - I think they could have spent a bit more time fleshing out why he turned from Starfleet Captain to Big Bad.
Can we not have another Enterprise being destroyed in the next one please? :lol
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I'm just happy that the Enterprise fought back in this movie.
In Into Darkness - for whatever reason - Enterprise did not fire ONE phaser or ONE Photon Torpedo.
I have no idea why.
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In Into Darkness - for whatever reason - Enterprise did not fire ONE phaser or ONE Photon Torpedo.
Wow - didn't realise that!
Just read this interesting article on Karl Urban - looks like he was reluctant to return for a 3rd film because his character was sidelined in ID.
https://uk.ign.com/articles/2016/07/24/star-trek-beyondas-karl-urban-on-why-he-almost-didnat-return-after-into-darkness
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he almost didnat return ? :biggrin:
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SPOILER :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4DVUEb3Tm8
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Loved the different voices.
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It's a good ship. I always liked the Kelvin Timeline Enterprise but wasn't a massive fan of the bulbous nacelles and arcing pylons.
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I was never that much into the style of the different Enterprises. I should have been but it never really bothered me.
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Ah yes, you can clearly see the 1701-A on there. I was distracted trying to look at the bridge module in the cinema to notice that. Much improved on the nacelles, much more balanced than the horrible placement on the first one. From what you can see in the movie, it looks more like what it should have been in the first place.
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As a huge Star Trek fan I wanted to love this movie (and i'm a huge Pegg fan too, so his imput on the writting excited me). I sat down in the cinema expected to be blown away. 2 Hours later and I was hugely letdown - this film is a huge, huge mess. The direction isn't on a par on the JJ films, the on planet action scenes in particular suffered massively from being to dark with to many quick cuts. The plot (for what there is of one) is full of holes and solutions that are solved by one crew member (normally Scotty) plugging something into something else. Worse though is the villain whose back story is so confusing it actually makes your head hurt thinking about it - also he's after a McGuffin of all McGuffins.
It's not a complete loss if you don't think to hard about whats happening on screen then it's quite fun and glossy. Bones and Spock have some nice dialog together (the Necklace conversation is pure comedy Gold). Karl Urban is definately Man of Match in this film, also the Female Alien ally was a nice addition.
Worst of the Kelvin films for me - what promised as a real Star Trek adventure is sadly just another OK silly action movie that completely falls apart as soon as you dare think about what you are watching.
But Hey Ho at least it's not as bad as Insurrections!!
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I don't know how you could complain about the plot given how much worse the plots of the previous two were, especially Into Darkness. I wouldn't say Krall's backstory was confusing so much as just weak and light, but I agree he was a crummy villian. The major weakness in an otherwise solid movie. But then again, it's been a long time since they've had a Trek villian that didn't completely suck. Neither Nero or Khan made any sense at all.
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I don't know how you could complain about the plot given how much worse the plots of the previous two were, especially Into Darkness. I wouldn't say Krall's backstory was confusing so much as just weak and light, but I agree he was a crummy villian. The major weakness in an otherwise solid movie. But then again, it's been a long time since they've had a Trek villian that didn't completely suck. Neither Nero or Khan made any sense at all.
Plots haven't really been the strong point of the Kelvin films I agree.
I just thought there is so much wrong with Beyond's script it's the worst of the lot. And when you also add in it's the least ambitious story and yet still manages to mangle the plot so much - it's just a letdown really.
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We'll have to agree to disagree. I've been a big detractor of the reboot movies overall, and I have my issues with this one too which I outlined earlier in the thread, but imo the plot of Beyond was the only one that even tried to be coherent or faithful to the franchise.
Krall was certainly a huge weak point, no disagreement there, and there were some major points that warranted more detail there, but nonetheless, I wouldn't even put it in the same league as the trainwreck plots of the previous ones. '09 was thinly tacked together by coincidence, giant leaps of logic, and slapstick comedy, and nothing about Into Darkness made sense on even a surface level. After those, Beyond was refreshing.
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Beyond had a very simple plot, and felt more like an expensive isolated episode of TV than a movie to me.
And I think the plots of the previous movies make *enough* sense. Yeah, there are some crazy coincidents in the first one, but overall I enjoy that movie. And like I said earlier in this thread, Into Darkness is my favorite.
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We'll have to agree to disagree. I've been a big detractor of the reboot movies overall, and I have my issues with this one too which I outlined earlier in the thread, but imo the plot of Beyond was the only one that even tried to be coherent or faithful to the franchise.
Krall was certainly a huge weak point, no disagreement there, and there were some major points that warranted more detail there, but nonetheless, I wouldn't even put it in the same league as the trainwreck plots of the previous ones. '09 was thinly tacked together by coincidence, giant leaps of logic, and slapstick comedy, and nothing about Into Darkness made sense on even a surface level. After those, Beyond was refreshing.
Let me list some of the complaints with the plot I have and maybe you can explain then. (I don't mean that in a sarcastic way, I'm being genuine).
1. There is way to many solutions that happen because of reasons...Jump starting a Spaceship by dropping if of a cliff. Motorbike distraction where holographs appariently can follow roads perfectly and turn on there own. The Beastie Boys - I know it's technobabbled explained, but my God it's cheap, cheap writing. Violent explosions being used an a method of transport (at least twice!)
2. The Nebula being on the edge of sensor range, but at the end of the film it's right next to the space station (which in addition is way, way to advanced for the period in Star Trek Lore)
3. The Enterprise being the only ship in the current fleet that can fly the Nebula..........apart from it seems an ancient hulk like the USS Franklin - which flies back though it with ease.
4. How does Kelvin Spock have a picture of the original TOS Crew? (Really supposed to believe Prime Spock carried this around in his robes in '09.....)
5. Why does no one else on Yorktown want to help take down Krall, and how come Krall seems to be unaware of the Franklin, when it's his own ship! Infact just Krall is general - nothing makes any sense about him (he's still appariently wearing his 100 year old star fleet uniform when he reverts back to human form for Godsake.....)
6. The little dog like creatures Kirk encounter at the start. At the end we see a couple of them on Spaceship wearing Starfleet uniforms - does that mean they attack Kirk naked, if so was it sexual assault! /Ok this is a joke one!
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I can't argue many of those points, as a lot of those bothered me too.
The starship dropping off the cliff seemed like a silly excuse for a daring stunt (they needed to hit terminal velocity, but they would have hit the cliff at that speed, and it's not like jump starting a car ffs). The hologram was unlikely, but I was able to run with it.
The position of the nebula was a thought that crossed my mind too. Unexplored space right next door? I would have checked that in a basic survey before building a giant space station next to it. Couldn't have taken them more than a few hours to get back.
The Enterprise wasn't the only ship that could fly into the nebula, but they said they chose it because it had the best sensors of any of their ships, and Kirk seemed ready for adventure. Krall specifically wanted the Enterprise, so that was either luck, or the alien who came back nudged in that direction.
I have no problem believing Prime Spock carried that photo with him. It wasn't a big picture to carry around even in the Jellyfish ship, and being a physical photo in that era, it's also possible he had the photo with him on some kind of digital storage and had it printed out after he came back.
When Krall attacked, everyone was unprepared, and that was a huge swarm attacking. Were there any ships around capable of fighting them? Also I recall the swarm was affecting communications? They were caught unaware by a huge invasion force, and many of the people on the base seemed to be non Starfleet.
I assumed Krall stole the uniform after becoming more human so he could blend in with the crew and escape undetected.
Don't get me started on those little creatures. Not a good way to start off the movie, and it had to fight hard to get me back onside after that. :lol
There are lots of good points there, many of which I thought myself, but come on, these are mostly ridiculously minor compared to the giant turds of logic the previous movies pulled. Do you want me to list them? Because I've got all night, and I'd need it. :lol
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Saw this movie the other night and enjoyed it. It wasn't quite as good as the last one but definitely a solid watch. The visuals were absolutely jaw-dropping.
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Hopefully will see this movie over the weekend.
Do I have to have seen Into Darkness? I admit I couldn't get past the first 30 minutes or so of it.
I've read enough to know that apparently there's no more death or need for star ships.
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You can skip Into Darkness. I don't think there are any references to it that you need to know going into Beyond.
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There are lots of good points there, many of which I thought myself, but come on, these are mostly ridiculously minor compared to the giant turds of logic the previous movies pulled. Do you want me to list them? Because I've got all night, and I'd need it. :lol
Haha! No i'm well aware of the plot holes in the two previous movies! For me though those movies had a little more ambition in the story, Beyond has such a basic storyline and it still manages to screw it up (for me) and perhaps me expectations for this one was higher with Pegg on script duty, I guess this one hurt more. Weirdly depict all it's faults with the story (I tend to think of the massive coincidence more as destiny (it helps)) I think Star Trek '09 is one of the four great Star Trek movies with Wrath, Undiscovered Country and First Contact. After those four there is a massive drop off before you start encountering the middling and out right poor movies in the franchise. Beyond I'd put somewhere above the absolute dross like Final Frontier, Insurrections and Nemesis.
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I wouldn't put any of the reboot movies up with the best of the originals (mostly agree with your choices there, although I'd personally throw in TVH too), but I still very much enjoyed '09 for the action movie it was, and would consider it one of the better ones of the remaining movies, a bit below Beyond.
Trek has always been much more successful on the small screen than the big one anyway imo, so I'm not too bothered. I have high hopes for the new series, as Bryan Fuller seems to get that deeper meaning that is largely lacking from the more action oriented nature of the films, but Beyond at least restored my faith in the movie franchise.
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I wouldn't put any of the reboot movies up with the best of the originals (mostly agree with your choices there, although I'd personally throw in TVH too), but I still very much enjoyed '09 for the action movie it was, and would consider it one of the better ones of the remaining movies, a bit below Beyond.
Trek has always been much more successful on the small screen than the big one anyway imo, so I'm not too bothered. I have high hopes for the new series, as Bryan Fuller seems to get that deeper meaning that is largely lacking from the more action oriented nature of the films, but Beyond at least restored my faith in the movie franchise.
Yeah I'm really looking forward to Discovery too. Has there been any casting announced yet? Last thing I heard was they are going for a more arc based shorter first season (12'ish episodes).
If you want a Star Trek laugh i'd recommend reading the contents of this link :
https://www.denofgeek.com/uk/movies/star-trek-insurrection/42356/star-trek-insurrection-revisiting-star-trek-9
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No cast announced yet, or a confirmed era (aside from being prime timeline), although it was mentioned somewhere by Fuller that there were some well known actors from other liked shows, and a good amount of diversity. Looking forward to when they announce that.
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No cast announced yet, or a confirmed era (aside from being prime timeline), although it was mentioned somewhere by Fuller that there were some well known actors from other liked shows, and a good amount of diversity. Looking forward to when they announce that.
Yeah Trek needs to return to the small screen. Can't wait.
What's your (and anyone else) preference of the shows so far?
1. DS9
2. TOS
3. TNG.
4. Enterprise.
5. Voyager.
1 & 2 are so close. Heart says TOS. Head says DS9.
Edit : Fucking hell just seen there is a massive Trek thread on this site. Feel free to reply to this in there as this is more for Beyond discussion.
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Okay, just got back from Beyond.
Not bad actually. I'll do the pros and cons as bullet points because I'm terribly lazy.
Pros.
- Really digging Kirk and Bones.
- That new alien chick was awesome
- Alien starfleet girl with the face hugger for hair was fun
- Lots of nice character interactions, specifically between Scotty and alien lady, and Spock and Bones
- Nice to see Chekov get some screen time
- That damn space station. Good god that thing was glorious. I'd watch a 5 hour documentary just about that thing.
- Chekov's line at the end about whiskey (or scotch) being a Russian invention was the only time Chekov hearkened back to the original Chekov.
- Very cool new Enterprise at the end.
- Finally a universal translator that makes some damn sense (this will also appear on the cons list)
Cons
- Despite being a fine character in his own right, there's no similarity in personality between the two Spocks. They are completely different entities.
- The bad guy was just dumb, such a waste of Idris Elba. Boring revenge dude with a lot of convoluted nonsense as a backstory.
- The entire 3rd act was horrible (sorry Kotow). A god damn space cloud?!?! Haven't we had enough space clouds? Destroyed by Beastie Boys? Eh. And the fight with Kirk and Kral has a few cool moments but the futility of Krawl's character just rendered it meaningless to me. There were no stakes at all. We knew Kirk would win, and we (at least I) didn't care at all about Krawl, so it was just a fight to have a fight.
- They have to fall off a cliff? Ugh, what a useless scene. We didn't need the scene. Just take off, you're about to have a crazy (dumb) action scene, no need for artificial tension.
- The original cast picture at the end. Just seemed like pandering for no reason so the audience will go "LOOK THE ORIGINAL CAST THIS MOVIE IS AMAZING FOR DOING THIS".
- So they have a new universal translator, but the dog people at the beginning were speaking English? Everyone from the last two movies that we heard as English were just speaking English? Not wrll thought out.
That's all I got off the top of my head, but i'm there's a lot more I'll think of as time goes on.
So, for my movie ranking, now with this....
1. First Contact
2. Wrath of Khan
3. Voyage Home
4. Undiscovered Country
5. Search for Spock
6. Generations
7. Motion Picture
8. Insurrection
9. What does god need with a star ship?
10. Beyond (this and 9 could switch)
11. Nemesis
12. ST '09
13. Into Darkness
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Mostly agree with you there. Even though the original cast photo was blatant pandering, I still enjoyed it, especially given the nature of it being a tribute to the real death of Leonard Nimoy, and not just the character of Spock.
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1. First Contact
2. Wrath of Khan
3. Voyage Home
4. Undiscovered Country
5. Search for Spock
6. Generations
7. Motion Picture
8. Insurrection
9. What does god need with a star ship?
10. Beyond (this and 9 could switch)
11. Nemesis
12. ST '09
13. Into Darkness
Interesting list.
1. Wrath.
2. Undiscovered Country
3. Star Trek 09 (Yup Really).
4. First Contact
(Big Gap)
5. Search for Spock.
6. In To Darkness.
7. Generations.
(Another Gap)
8. Motion Picture.
9. Beyond.
10. Final Frontier.
11. Voyage Home.
12. Nemesis.
(Another Gap)
13. Insurrection
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Don't make me choose
First Contact / The Wrath of Khan / The Voyage Home
Very good
Galaxy Quest
Undiscovered Country
Generations / Beyond / ST '09
Average but still quite enjoyable
The Search for Spock
Insurrection
The Final Frontier
Insomnia cure
The Motion Picture
Worthless Shit
Nemesis
Into Darkness
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I'll never get the love for The Voyage Home. It's like one of those bad 80's comedies where only the premise of the film is the comedy and there are no actual jokes (3 Men and a Baby!). Screw it's Double Dumb-ass, Nuclear Wessels & Hello Computer stick. A quite literal Fish out of water comedy.
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Star Trek 4 is great.
:angry:
I wonder what The Final Frontier would have been like if Nimoy or Meyer had directed.
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1. Wrath of Khan
2. First Contact
3. Undiscovered Country
4. Voyage Home
5. Search for Spock
6. ST '09
7. Beyond
8. Insurrection
9. Into Darkness
10. Generations
11. Nemesis
12. Motion Picture
13. The Final Frontier
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Star Trek 4 is great.
:angry:
I wonder what The Final Frontier would have been like if Nimoy or Meyer had directed.
Shatner's directing was part of the problem, but relatively minor compared to Shatner's writing. A: Do away with Sybok being Spock's brother. B: Come up with a more plausible explanation for his mind control abilities. If he'd just been some guy running amok and zapping people with some psycho-ray-bun it would have been a much better movie.
And I always enjoyed ST4. Good story, and a good respite from the previous two which were somewhat dark.
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A psycho Ray Bun sounds delicious :tup
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I don't know my exact ranking but The Wrath of Khan is obviously #1 and Insurrection is #13
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I'll rank them thusly :
TOS
The Wrath of Khan
The Voyage Home
The Undiscovered Country
The Motion Picture
The Search For Spock
The Final Frontier
TNG
Generations
First Contact
Nemesis
Insurrection
Reboots
Star Trek Beyond ( provisional - I need to see it a few more times to be sure )
Star Trek
Star Trek Into Darkness
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:tup Just got back from seeing Star Trek Beyond again.
Better picture this time. Enjoyed it a lot more.
The sabotage / swarm scene is still entertaining as hell. :biggrin: :corn :corn
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:tup Just got back from seeing Star Trek Beyond again.
Better picture this time. Enjoyed it a lot more.
The sabotage / swarm scene is still entertaining as hell. :biggrin: :corn :corn
That might be my least favorite scene lol.
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It just made me grin so much both times. :)
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I want, just once in these movies, to have an action scene like that with some super cheesy power metal playing.
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I want, just did once in these movies, to have an action scene like that with some super cheesy power metal playing.
Watch Bill and Ted for that need. :lol
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I want, just did once in these movies, to have an action scene like that with some super cheesy power metal playing.
Watch Bill and Ted for that need. :lol
I mean like full on Rhapsody Of Fire playing during a space fight.
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:tup Just got back from seeing Star Trek Beyond again.
Better picture this time. Enjoyed it a lot more.
The sabotage / swarm scene is still entertaining as hell. :biggrin: :corn :corn
That might be my least favorite scene lol.
Ditto. So stupid and trying way too hard to be cool. It's almost like you can pick the moments during writing the script where Justin Lin came into the room and scribbled something on the page, and Simon Pegg had to write around it best he could.
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It just feels like lots of visual noise. I mean, they suddenly had billions of little hive ships? Meh.
And how can I feel invested in what is essentially, ANOTHER fight between the unbeatable good guys and faceless bad guys that mean absolutely nothing at all where you can take them all out in one swift move. Honestly, it was the worst part about Avengers, so much so that Joss even publicly admitted it was dumb. No idea why it's the one element everyone is so keen to copy.
At least with the Kirk/Elba fight (which was also silly) there was a way of connecting to it.
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The scene was literally a line of techno babble to try to justify the concept of "loud licensed rock music causes things to explode" in-universe. It seems that many ships had a pretty good chance against the station even without the super weapon.
If they'd come up with a better villian and finale, I think the movie could have been really great.
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:tup Just got back from seeing Star Trek Beyond again.
Better picture this time. Enjoyed it a lot more.
The sabotage / swarm scene is still entertaining as hell. :biggrin: :corn :corn
That might be my least favorite scene lol.
I hated the motorbike distraction scene. Firstly we get a feeble 'transporters won't work because techobabble'. Then they come up with this facepalm plan which is complete arse - the fake hologram bikes seem to be able to steer themselves sensibly without any worries about clipping into the ground, or floating above it. Then they jump start an ancient Starship by dropping it down a cliff and then destroy the enemies by playing the Beastly Boys at them........For a plot that is so paper thin it's amazing how bad the script is in the film.
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You've seen the original series yeah ?
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The transporters not working was very much in line with what the shows did (not TOS, but the TNG era). The rest was unfortunately contrived action, which wasn't a sign of a bad script, but a sign of having to shoehorn action into a script that didn't focus on that element as much as previous movies.
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:lol On the shows - everything on the ship stopped working the exact moment they needed them most.
Someone is stealing a shuttle!
Tractor beam!
Not working
Beam them out!
Not working!
Full Impulse!
Not Working!
Hail Them!
Not Working!
Regular training exercise! Transporters, tractor beam, engines, comms working perfectly!
Ferengi ship is nearby!
Nothing works!
It's almost like the Enterprise had a panic attack and wanted to hide in the corner - put it's hands over it's ears and go "lalalalalalalal" until the problem went away :rollin
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:tup Just got back from seeing Star Trek Beyond again.
Better picture this time. Enjoyed it a lot more.
The sabotage / swarm scene is still entertaining as hell. :biggrin: :corn :corn
That might be my least favorite scene lol.
I'd put it way above Kirk getting promoted to First Officer in 09 and Kirk's death from Into Darkness / Garbage Barge Chase with Spock beating the shit out of Khan. . .
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I don't have a problem with either of those scenes. I do have a problem with Kirk coming back to life, but not the death itself. And there are some things I didn't like about the new one, but destroying the swarm with rock music isn't really one of them. I saw it more as funny rather than "cool", so I thought it was fine.
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I don't have a problem with either of those scenes. I do have a problem with Kirk coming back to life, but not the death itself. And there are some things I didn't like about the new one, but destroying the swarm with rock music isn't really one of them. I saw it more as funny rather than "cool", so I thought it was fine.
The resurrection blood never bothered me as much as it does some. I do understand it's completely stupid, but ultimately it doesn't effect the plot to much, it's just an added misjudged bit of drama, trying to replicate a scene from the previous Khan movie. But if you take out Kirk dying, the magic blood - it doesn't really change anything. The swarm being destroyed was arguable the most important plot point in Beyond, and they chose to do it with the Beasty Boys...
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I don't know who the Beasty Boys are, so I don't have any pre-existing automatic dislike towards them. To me it was just some random song. So that specific aspect didn't bother me at all.
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I don't know who the Beasty Boys are, so I don't have any pre-existing automatic dislike towards them. To me it was just some random song. So that specific aspect didn't bother me at all.
For clarification I have no problem with the Beasty Boys or the song (It's a cool song) it's the core mechanic of the use of radio waves to disrupt the hive that I dislike. The fact they chose to use Sabotage was probably the best thing about the whole solution.
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It's un Trek like to hear music used in the movies so it's a little off putting for most.
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I have no problem with the Beastie Boys either, it just seemed like too jarring an anachromism to me, and too contrived and blatant to do an action scene with loud 20th century music.
From memory, the closest I can think of Trek doing that pre-JJ is First Contact using Magic Carpet Ride for the first warp test of the Phoenix, but it was used more for comedic effect in a quick joke than trying to be cool and modern, and that era wasn't anywhere near as distant as TOS is (or even the ENT era the Franklin is from).
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Finally saw it last night with the misses, unfortunately not in IMAX. Enjoyed it a lot, so many great moments, bit confused about the villian motives and overall goals though, I'll watch out again when the bluray is released.
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It's a great fun film.
But the fully CG saucer crash just isn't as good as the practical saucer crash from Generations.
Practical crash looks so believable whilst the one in Beyond is so obviously fully CG that I can't turn off my brain and just accept it.
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The crash in From Beyond was epic though. That was so well done.
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The crash in From Beyond was epic though. That was so well done.
In a computer.
The crash from Generations was a 6 ft saucer literally dragged over a massive set which was hand built. Which is why it looks so much more realistic and believable.
There are CG elements of course but it's an actual physical saucer crashing on an actual physical set.
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Is your point that you like I better doing it the old way? I don't care how it's done as well as its done well.
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I like whichever way looks more realistic and believable.
If the Gen crash looked shitty because you can tell instantly that it's a model and a set and the CG one from Beyond was more believable then so be it.
But by and large - practical is way more believable than CG.
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It's up to $333m on a $185 budget.
It *might* scrape up a $350m total gross which would not be a total failure once you add in home release sales.
Paramount really need to put a metric ton of extras on the Blu Ray / DVD to entice people to buy it.
Into Darkness extras were pathetic.
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Into Darkness extras were pathetic.
Unfortunately that's become the standard ever since Bluray came out, plus the general lack of interest in physical formats in general.
On one hand, they've already got a sequel lined up, but it's sad that this will discourage them from making another similar film, and instead return to what they know sells.
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The next film should have heart, an emotional core and the action should be slower, thought out and tense with a plot that has room to be told with an actual sense of real threat and danger. The last three film have been fun (to various degree's) action movies - with lots of explosions, a breakneck pace and plots that seems to have been written on the fly.
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That's Hollywood, mate.
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Into Darkness extras were pathetic.
Unfortunately that's become the standard ever since Bluray came out, plus the general lack of interest in physical formats in general.
On one hand, they've already got a sequel lined up, but it's sad that this will discourage them from making another similar film, and instead return to what they know sells.
Luckily - one supermarket in the UK got exclusive rights to get a double DVD package with all the extras on so I snapped that up.
For the 4th film - I expect Paramount will dish out a lower budget and as such it won't have to recoup so much.
If they made it for $100m - they'd only have to get back $300m for it to be a hit. . .
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Finally watched Beyond last night. I honestly don't see any differently than the other two. The pros and cons are largely the same. Weak story created as a vehicle for clever dialogue and lots of pew-pew-pew. In this case the bad guy of the week was pretty weak, which certainly didn't help matters. (And I'm tired of every bad guy requiring some surprise twist--OMG! He'f former Star Fleet!) Also, the action sequences were still just as chaotic as JJA's but were also too dark.* In the first viewing of each of the reboot movies I've never been able to tell who's shooting at who. When you combine the shaky cam, the twirly cam, the double-axle, triple somersault with a half twist cam and every other way to move a camera about cam, with the quick edits, it just becomes a jumbled mess. I generally just tune them out. See who's standing at the end or which ship is crashing. They add absolutely nothing.
That said, Simon Pegg's influence was definitely there. Definitely some nice character development for a change. The dialogue was good and contained some clever references. It was also pretty damned funny at times. I definitely liked Spock and Kirk having to evaluate and then reevaluate their places in the universe. That was a welcome addition that the other films lacked. Spock Prime's picture of his crew being what moved Spock was pretty clever. Yet, we never really got to see Kirk and Spock as a team. They refer to it, but their only real interaction in Beyond is failing to discuss anything with each other. They didn't like each other in the first two movies. In the third movie they claim to make a great team, but we never see any of it. That was a shame. Seeing Spock and McCoy interact is certainly entertaining, though. Just not sure having them all split up into groups was a good idea for the third film when they're very different characters before.
All in all, I'd still like to see them making these movies, but I have no expectation of them ever being more than they have been. They're generally fun to listen to, but crafting stories to fit around the action sequences doesn't make for good film.
*And after seeing Abrams's Star Wars I'm far more annoyed because the man can actually make a damn good pew-pew-pew scene if he chooses to. The dog-fighting scene in that was how these things should be done. Fast enough that they're not boring, but slow enough that you can actually grasp what's happening.
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Even though I enjoyed most of Beyond, it's pretty hard to argue with any of that.
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That scene where Bones and Spock kick the pilot out of that swarm ship was damn near incomprehensible.
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That scene where Bones and Spock kick the pilot out of that swarm ship was damn near incomprehensible.
Yup. That was one that stuck out at me. During the fight onboard and sliding down the crashed, burning Enterprise I had to pause the movie to crank the brightness upto see WTF was happening. You can see punches landing, but know idea on who, by who, or where they were.
If they'd kept phasers phasers, it'd be much easier to discern because at least then you'd recognize one side's weapons fire. Once they turned them into glowing red bullets they added dramatically to the clusterfuck.
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I finally got around to watch Beyond yesterday and I liked it, it was fun. It was a visual spectacle, but I think it's my least favorite Abrams movie.
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It's easily my favourite of the three.
ST09 is 2nd.
Beyond is the most Trek like.
But Abrams haters will complain about anything. I saw some people online whinging that the Track Titles on the Beyond OST were too silly.
:lolpalm: as if that affects the movie in any way.
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Beyond is the most Trek like.
The least 'trek' movie is Voyage Home - but people love that. Personally I think it's dreadful and gets worse each passing year. It's one of those naff 80's comedies where the humour comes purely come the concept (think 3 men and a baby). People from the future go back to the 80's and try to fit in with hilarious results!!!
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Beyond is the most Trek like.
The least 'trek' movie is Voyage Home - but people love that. Personally I think it's dreadful and gets worse each passing year. It's one of those naff 80's comedies where the humour comes purely come the concept (think 3 men and a baby). People from the future go back to the 80's and try to fit in with hilarious results!!!
TVH is still plenty Trekky. It's an environmental message wrapped in social commentary wrapped in time travel wrapped in camp comedy. Still one of my favourites. There's more to Trek than an Enterprise and space battles. :P
I'd say all of the original cast movies are pretty Trekky. If I had to say the least Trekky, probably TSFS imo. Sure, it's got the superficial elements like space ships, an Enterprise exploding before it was the cool thing to do, and Klingons etc, and while I enjoy the movie, it's a fairly empty movie that was little more than a means to an end, ie. bringing back Spock, plus some leftover scraps of TWOK.
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Nimoy only came back for 2 so he could be killed off and only came back for 3 and 4 so he could direct.
I wonder why he came back for 5 and 6.
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Beyond is the most Trek like.
The least 'trek' movie is Voyage Home - but people love that. Personally I think it's dreadful and gets worse each passing year. It's one of those naff 80's comedies where the humour comes purely come the concept (think 3 men and a baby). People from the future go back to the 80's and try to fit in with hilarious results!!!
TVH is still plenty Trekky. It's an environmental message wrapped in social commentary wrapped in time travel wrapped in camp comedy. Still one of my favourites. There's more to Trek than an Enterprise and space battles. :P
I'd say all of the original cast movies are pretty Trekky. If I had to say the least Trekky, probably TSFS imo. Sure, it's got the superficial elements like space ships, an Enterprise exploding before it was the cool thing to do, and Klingons etc, and while I enjoy the movie, it's a fairly empty movie that was little more than a means to an end, ie. bringing back Spock, plus some leftover scraps of TWOK.
Yeah I know i'm pretty much alone in not liking it but honestly the only ST movie I rate lower is Insurrections. Yup I put Final Frontier and Nemesis higher!
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I agree.
It's not all on Frakes but Insurrection is just poor. They had a limited budget to begin with and ILM were noticeably absent.
I know Jammindude on here loves Insurrection the most.
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The funny thing about Insurrections is the supposed good guys the Bak'u (the archetypal idyllic society, untouched by progress, innocent of crime, all loving and all accepting) are a total bunch of dicks, seriously. They've decided they couldn’t share their planet with anyone who didn’t share their values. The whole fucking planet. There only appears 600 of them in one isolated valley and they couldn’t even spare one lousy hemisphere. So they kicked the Son’a out (who for some reason didn’t just immediately land on the other side of the planet). But when you live on a magic planet that makes you immortal, exile is a slow death sentence. So that’s the Bak'u so intolerant and bloodthirsty they will murder anyone who holds different ideals. A race that have rejected technology except for the technology they need to crush their enemies. And then they just swan about, watching the rest of the galaxy die while they sit around making mediocre tapestries out of hemp.
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Ya....gonna have to disagree on the Bak'u being dicks. If you had a nice pool that you took care of, and your "friends" came over and intentionally pissed and crapped in your pool, imma thinkin you're going to be throwing them out and saying something to the effect of "you can come back, if you want to stop pissing in our pool"
Nemesis is the only ST movie in the entire franchise that was so dreadfully bad that it actually made me angry. What a horrible way to send out a great cast....it's almost disrespectful. No....it was disrespectful.
Insurrection is my personal favorite ST movie, because my personal beliefs are that the world you see in that film is going to come about someday....so it just warms my heart to see it. And then to see the rebelious children come home to be loved and healed. I get quite misty eyed at that movie.
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What did Jammindude think of Beyond ?
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To tell you the truth....kinda bland. It wasn't *BAD*, it was entertaining, but there was absolutely nothing in it that made me say, "NOW THAT'S what I'm talking about!"
I liked Into Darkness when it came out, but it hasn't aged well. When I originally saw the Kirk death scene in the theater, I thought it had a nice poetry to it. A sortof, "even in alternate universes, you will see repeating patterns".... But repeated viewings have made it downright cringeworthy. I've also come on board to the idea that while BC did a fantastic acting job, making him Khan was a huge mistake. They should have just left him as John Harrison, and the movie would have been much improved.
But Beyond was an improvement over ID, I will at least give it that. At least it felt like someone (Simon Pegg) cared about the story and wanted to give us something fun and exciting. I only watched it once, so it will be interesting to see how it holds up on repeated viewings. I still think the first one was the best of the new trilogy. Yes, the story had some flaws, but there was a really great chemistry surrounding that first film. Everyone NAILED their roles, and I wasn't bothered by the mild changes. I viewed the Spock Uhura romance the same as I did the Worf Troi relationship in TNG....just an interesting idea taking place in an alternate universe.
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The Spock / Uhura thing was to let the audience know that Spock is straight and also to put 0.005 seconds of romance in the trailer to attract the female moviegoers.
[/cynic]
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Ya....gonna have to disagree on the Bak'u being dicks. If you had a nice pool that you took care of, and your "friends" came over and intentionally pissed and crapped in your pool, imma thinkin you're going to be throwing them out and saying something to the effect of "you can come back, if you want to stop pissing in our pool"
See that's the Bak'u problem right there. They presume this 'pool' is their own, but it's not it's a communal pool. And the Son'a weren't 'pissing in the pool' they wanted to make it better by adding a waterslide, jacuzzi and hot tubs. But no the Bak'u couldn't have that, because they are dicks, total fucking dicks. So these Bak'u exile the Son'a - I presume with an non-aggressive leaflet campaign, as we are constantly told how 'peaceful' they are. So exiled not just to another valley, or island, or even another continent - no they exile them of the planet....dicks.
I don't like the Bak'u.
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double postage.
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Count me in on the 'finally got around to seeing it' camp.
Have to agree with the concensus here. I liked it overall, loved the humour and I think Jayla could be a fun permanent crewmember. But that bad guy... argh. Such a waste on Elba.
Overall fun and enjoyable movie, not as good as Rogue One by a long run, though.
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But easily the best of the 3 Star Trek prequels.
If Into Darkness had a better script - it would have been a pretty decent trilogy.
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If Into Darkness had a better script - it would have been a pretty decent trilogy.
If you pretend Cumberbatch isn't Khan and just some new villain it's a much better film and ironically he also becomes the best villain in the trilogy (admittedly that isn't hard!)
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Yeah I don't believe that Into Darkness is a total disaster like some people. It just needed some tweaks.
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Into Darkness is my favorite of the three, despite its flaws.
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It's a fun ride.
It's probably more exciting than Beyond but Beyond wins on nearly everything else. Except lighting. Beyond needed a better DOP.
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The problem is the conviction that ST needs a villain. Look at the best episodes from TOS or TNG and figure out who the bad guy was. The Guardian of Forever? Raging hormones? The Kataanian sun? Paradoxical spacial anomaly? And how many more have multiple, ambiguous bad guys creating conflict? Is Gul Lemec a bigger bad guy than Captain Jelico? Commander Shelby was more important as a bad guy than the Borg were, even if not as terrifying.
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My wife was in the hospital recently, and Star Trek Beyond was one of the free movies on the in-room entertainment thing, so we watched it. That was last week, and it was overall so forgettable that when this thread got bumped, I remembered watching it, but honestly could not remember the plot. I just read through the whole thread so far, and oh yeah, stranded alien dude, badass alien chick, that one.
Unfortunately, I still have to shell out for Redbox or On Demand or something, because the movies on the in-room entertainment thing have been edited. When Bones first appeared, he said "My Gosh, man!" and I just went "What?!" and my wife reminded me that the movie have been "sanitized". Dammit. I've seen every Star Trek movie in one form or another, but always on DVD or Blu-ray or otherwise uncompromised. And I know that that's a stupid reason, given that there are multiple versions of most them (original theatrical cut, extended cut, director's cut, etc) but I at least have to hear Bones say "My God, man!" Also, I don't know what else was cut, but just knowing that I've seen some kind of edited version bugs me.
Problem is, I didn't otherwise think it was good enough to even seek out again. I'll probably wait til it makes its rounds on Starz.
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"My Gosh, man!"
That's a damn shame. Probably the best scene in the movie. What was it Spock said, "I can confirm your hypothesis to be horseshit, doctor." :lol
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"My Gosh, man!"
That's a damn shame. Probably the best scene in the movie. What was it Spock said, "I can confirm your hypothesis to be horseshit, doctor." :lol
Oh yeah! "Horsebits"
I've never heard anyone in my life say "horsebits" and I was sure that's not what they were saying in the movie, either. Fucking sanitized movies.
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" If I may use the vernacular with which you are accustomed - i find your hypothesis to be horse-shit "
" I'll cut the horse-shit "
" Doctor I fail to see how excrement of any kind bears relevance to our current situation "
:P
I thought the new movies had more swearing than usual but then I rewatched The Final Frontier and it's full of it ! :lol I didn't realise.
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"My Gosh, man!"
That's a damn shame. Probably the best scene in the movie. What was it Spock said, "I can confirm your hypothesis to be horseshit, doctor." :lol
Oh yeah! "Horsebits"
I've never heard anyone in my life say "horsebits" and I was sure that's not what they were saying in the movie, either. Fucking sanitized movies.
I hate monkey fighting censorship!
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Though the censorship of Smokey and The Bandit is glorious. The voices don't match and some-bitch to scum-bum is the best thing ever.
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Yippee-ki-yay, Mister Falcon!
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Say what again Mother Father.
Monty you terrible TWIT !!!
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Watched the abbreviated version of Beyond last night. No idea why. While the overall story is just as bad as the previous two, Justin Ling made a much better film with what he was given that JJA. The first fifteen minutes, everything before the explosions start, is excellent. Great comedic timing with the tiny aliens. Kirk's personal log with the scenes of daily life on the Enterprise is done perfectly. The extended beauty shot of the space station is nicely done and not boring, as they often are. Very nice interplay between Spock and McCoy throughout the movie. I don't recall ever thinking "hey, that was pretty good" when watching either of JJ's films. If you skip over the chase and fight scenes and everything regarding the badguy of the week it's a very good 50 minutes, and overall the best of the three movies.
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It's amazing how they can't manage a half decent bad guy in any of these movies. I caught ST09 on TV the other night, and remembered just how poorly Nero was integrated into the plot and developed. It makes so little sense.
The first 5-10 minutes of Beyond with the tiny aliens actually had me ready to write off the movie instantly with how dumb and comical it was, but it managed to win me back with a lot of those character moments.
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Remember it's based on Star Trek TOS . A very silly show at times.
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Thank you for reminding me that a modern big budget Hollywood movie is based on a cheap 1960s television show. I had forgotten this! This justifies everything!
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You're welcome ! Don't hesitate to ask if you need any more help ! :)
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It's amazing how they can't manage a half decent bad guy in any of these movies. I caught ST09 on TV the other night, and remembered just how poorly Nero was integrated into the plot and developed. It makes so little sense.
The first 5-10 minutes of Beyond with the tiny aliens actually had me ready to write off the movie instantly with how dumb and comical it was, but it managed to win me back with a lot of those character moments.
I was fine with the comedy and it was very well done. Moreover, it actually integrated with Kirk's job dissatisfaction. But yeah, they feel it's necessary to have a bad guy, and in this day and age perhaps they're right, but they keep coming up with awful, cookie-cutter villains you just don't care about. They tried to do something different with Admiral Marcus, but he was pretty weak, as well.
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The addition of Admiral Marcus felt like they were just trying to muddy up the waters to throw people off, along with the whole Khan thing.
With the relatively poor box office of Star Trek Beyond, I especially doubt we'll see them break away from the simplistic generic bad guy in the next movie. They'll probably double down on keeping a clear bad guy and more action to appeal to the larger audience.
It really amazes me that with over 700 episodes and 10 movies (pre-reboot I mean) to draw upon for inspiration, that they can't come up with a scifi movie about anything other than a generic bad guy, and such poorly written ones at that. Surely they can come up with something that is different, and can still appeal to a general audience. :dunno: