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General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: Calvin6s on April 09, 2016, 03:12:43 PM
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So I guess this happened? It has become so irrelevant to me that I just don't care. Guess there is yet another stupid controversy. But is it really a controversy if people don't care?
The inductees:
Deep Purple
Steve Miller
Chicago
N.W.A.
Cheap Trick
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NWA>Yes, King Crimson, ELP and so many more.
I respect AL for mocking the thing when Rush was inducted.
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Cheap Trick? Are they really at the C level bands at this point in time?
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N.W.A. in a rock and roll hall of fame... :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
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I'm not sure if this is correct, but I think these were the nominees
Chicago
Yes
The Cars
Deep Purple
Steve Miller
Janet Jackson
Cheap Trick
The Spinners
Chaka Khan
Chic
The J.B.'s
N.W.A
Nine Inch Nails
The Smiths
Los Lobos
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N.W.A. in a rock and roll hall of fame... :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
I don't even consider rap to be MUSIC, let alone ROCK!!
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I'm not sure if this is correct, but I think these were the nominees
Chicago
Yes
The Cars
Deep Purple
Steve Miller
Janet Jackson
Cheap Trick
The Spinners
Chaka Khan
Chic
The J.B.'s
N.W.A
Nine Inch Nails
The Smiths
Los Lobos
It's BULLSHIT that YES didn't get in!
Other than that the only bands on that list that I think deserve it are Chicago and Deep Purple.
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But how many here even knew this event happened already? I didn't. I only know because Gene Simmons said he is cheering on the death of rap and Ice Cube of NWA responded in his RnRHoF interview so it pops up on rock news sites.
My problem with the RnRHoF has less to do with hip-hop inclusion and more about the fact that I just never cared about it. Just like I never cared about the Grammys or Billboard or MTV awards.
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N.W.A. in a rock and roll hall of fame... :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
Yeah. Nothing wrong with NWA or hip hop but what they're doing in a Rock hall of fame?
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N.W.A. in a rock and roll hall of fame... :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
I don't even consider rap to be MUSIC, let alone ROCK!!
Rap is totally music, but it isn't rock. They should just call it the popular music hall of fame and be done with it, no more controversy.
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Lars actually gave a really good speech inducting Deep Purple. But yeah.........the whole thing is a bit of a joke.
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I mean, if I went to Cleveland would I go? Absolutely. But the whole induction process is tainted now.
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But how many here even knew this event happened already? I didn't. I only know because Gene Simmons said he is cheering on the death of rap and Ice Cube of NWA responded in his RnRHoF interview so it pops up on rock news sites.
I only know because I saw something pop up on the Metallica FB page about the induction speech. If not for that, I would have had no clue, even from major rock sources. I don't think Blackmore even showed up, so I don't care.
Cheap Trick? Are they really at the C level bands at this point in time?
Yeah. That happens when you skip a bunch of A and B, too.
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Don't call Cheap Trick a C list band around Chicago.
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It's not like Cheap Trick is a one hit wonder. They had at least a dozen really big hits spanning over 3 decades. I'd hardly call that C-list.
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Ultimately, making the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is like getting a Grammy nomination: just about any serious artist with a clue knows it means squat in the grand scheme of things, but you have to talk it up a bit like it matters since that kind of recognition is never a bad thing.
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N.W.A. in a rock and roll hall of fame... :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
I don't even consider rap to be MUSIC, let alone ROCK!!
Rap is totally music, but it isn't rock. They should just call it the popular music hall of fame and be done with it, no more controversy.
Maybe what I said was a little harsh, but I was expressing my frustration over the fact that so many pop and rap acts, as well as rock bands that just aren't that GOOD get honored by organizations like the RaRHoF, while artists who contributed something to the history of modern music since at least the '60s & '70s continually get passed over and ignored. If I had it MY way, DT would have been inducted last year, since I do believe the 25th anniversary of a band's first album is the main requirement for eligibility.
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Yeah, i'm not sure why Deep Purple wasn't inducted yet. It should have been a long time ago.
Chicago
Yes
The Cars
Deep Purple
Steve Miller
Janet Jackson
Cheap Trick
The Spinners
Chaka Khan
Chic
The J.B.'s
N.W.A
Nine Inch Nails
The Smiths
Los Lobos
From these, i would induct Yes, Deep Purple, The Smiths and Nine Inch Nails, they more than deserve it. Last spot could be Chicago, Cars or Steve Miller.
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Great that DP finally got in, but not cool that Blackmore wasn't allowed to be their.
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Now, if you could, what artists/bands would you guys induct?
I would pick one from each decade (based on the decade they formed), only exception being the 70s:
60s - King Crimson
70s - The Cure
70s - Iron Maiden
80s - The Smiths
90s - Pearl Jam
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They should change the name of the Rock n Roll Hall of Fame to Music Hall of Fame, to reflect the new genres coming in. Bearing in mind that hip-hop only became popular in the late 70s/early 80s, and the 25-year wait for eligibility, it stands to reason that hip-hop artists should be honoured in this way now that we're approaching 40 years since the genre's development. Regardless of whether you personally like it or not, you can't deny that many of these artists had a huge impact on music history.
A lot of this complaining is probably just sour grapes because their favourite band isn't inducted yet.
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Calvin, do you Internet at all? The nominations were all over the Internet and news.
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Calvin, do you Internet at all? The nominations were all over the Internet and news.
I will repeat this
So I guess this happened? It has become so irrelevant to me that I just don't care.
I have smartphone notifications for top headlines, so either this never showed up or I "just don't care" and quickly deleted the notification headline. Music awards are about on the level of National Enquirer headlines for me. And the RaRHoF did not disappoint as it produced a laughable Gene Simmons - NWA feud, a Steve Miller diatribe and I think there was music involved, but I wouldn't be able to tell on that last point.
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If you don't care why make a thread? :lol
Well all have a beef about who makes it and who doesn't. That hack owner from Rolling Stone who runs this can suck it for all I care.
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If you don't care why make a thread? :lol
Because when something I consider a joke has a joke within a joke, it's funny.
This is like reporting on the Jethro Tull win for Best Metal at the Grammys. I don't really care about the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit issue either, but if Betty White was on the cover ....
It's like watching the race for the USA President. It's great reality TV filled with laughs (until they told me what the winner's prize was). Thankfully, NWA's induction will not affect my music life in the slightest.
Or I could just say I found the "New Topic" button. Would you like me to tell you where it is? :laugh:
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This is a joke that is at least 15 years old though? Lol. Would doesn't know this? Every year it's the same thing. We say, "They made it yet this band didn't "?
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(https://www.beezid.com/img/pages/blog/directions1.jpg)
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:lol
It's just seemed like you just figured it out and it made me laugh a littl .
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Gotta admire them for putting the hall of fame in Ohio (Cleveland Rocks). Somebody said if they were near, they'd go.
Whereas I wouldn't be asking myself how I ended up in the RaRHoF, but rather how I ended up in Cleveland, Ohio. I asked my smartphone for places to visit in Cleveland, Ohio and it only came up with one site:
Cleveland Hopkins International Airport
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I think we all know where it is and question why. Btw, I'm going to Columbus, OH tomorrow for a conference. It's a little more than an hour away from Cleveland
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Chicago should have been in years ago. How many #1 albums in the 70s?
nwa.....geesh, why not induct Benny Goodman, Gene Krupa, etc...? They were more influential, and have more in common with rock n roll. Cheap Trick?!?!? Will they need a bucket for Nielsen at the podium?
Went to the fame about 15 years ago. A very nice Lennon display, Queen items (Freddie leotards, Brian May outfits, guitar etc)...with a cheap, slightly bent 'One Vision' picture sleeve. Is the place worth a special trip? No. Is it worth it if you happen to be there? Probably.
The stadiums are a good place to catch a game (especially if your team is playing the Browns). alicecooper'stown was a great restaurant/sports memorabilia place to go to, but that closed eons ago.
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Don't call Cheap Trick a C list band around Chicago.
FTFY. C-list, my ass.
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I did go to the Rock Hall in Cleveland last Summer.
Kevin Gilbert's name is in there along with a clip of The Monkees (see my YouTube Channel or blog).
Blackmore decided not to go. There's a good video of him giving his reasons
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xr_aADCoUvE
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Now, if you could, what artists/bands would you guys induct?
I would pick one from each decade (based on the decade they formed), only exception being the 70s:
60s - King Crimson
70s - The Cure
70s - Iron Maiden
80s - The Smiths
90s - Pearl Jam
Why did you pick Iron Maiden for the 1970s? There's some debate about weather or not their first album was released in 1979 or 1980, but other than that their first few several, best-known, and probably most popular albums are very much a product of the '80s.
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I love Cheap Trick. One of the most underrated rock bands of all time. Was happy to see them get in.
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Yes should've been in years ago. I remember when they were nominated first and there was a fan poll (like when Rush was nominated) and they were beating everyone by a shitton percent and they still didn't get in. Jan Wenner is so fucking anti-prog that I'm shocked that Rush and Genesis even got in.
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Why did you pick Iron Maiden for the 1970s? There's some debate about weather or not their first album was released in 1979 or 1980, but other than that their first few several, best-known, and probably most popular albums are very much a product of the '80s.
I picked based on the decade they formed, which was the 70s (1975).
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They were some good picks Outcrier.
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Yes should've been in years ago. I remember when they were nominated first and there was a fan poll (like when Rush was nominated) and they were beating everyone by a shitton percent and they still didn't get in. Jan Wenner is so fucking anti-prog that I'm shocked that Rush and Genesis even got in.
I think Genesis only got in because of their pop success in the 80s, and Rush only got in recently because the mainstream and critics finally came around to giving them their proper credit, so they probably felt like they had to let them in. Regardless, Jan Wenner can suck a fatty.
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If you don't care why make a thread? :lol
Well all have a beef about who makes it and who doesn't. That hack owner from Rolling Stone who runs this can suck it for all I care.
If by "this" you mean the "hall" itself, I heartily AGREE with you! I had forgotten about that. Rolling Stone has always been VERY anti-prog, at least until recently, and also pretty much late to the game or conveniently unaware when it comes to metal. It usually seems that if it it isn't hippie music, new wave, or rap, they don't want to deal with it.
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Now, if you could, what artists/bands would you guys induct?
I would pick one from each decade (based on the decade they formed), only exception being the 70s:
60s - King Crimson
70s - The Cure
70s - Iron Maiden
80s - The Smiths
90s - Pearl Jam
Agree with Crimson (that Fripp isn't in there is a travesty)'
Maiden is an '80's band; their debut came out in 1980 (they didn't even record those versions of those songs until January of 1980) and The Cure are more rightfully an 80's band, too, since their debut was in October of '79 but their first real splash of success was in the '80's.
Pearl Jam will be first ballot and one of the few that actually deserve that honor.
What, pray, did The Smiths do to merit that honor? Duran Duran is far more deserving, in my view, as are The Cars. Though perhaps The Smiths get in for the influence of Johnny Marr on the Manchester scene of the 90's. But this is a discussion much like that of the Talking Heads. If they don't get in on influence, there's not much more to advocate for them.
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I already said i picked bands based on the decade they formed.
Smiths is a similar case as Talking Heads: classic bands who released many classic albums, simple as that.
And Talking Heads already are inducted.
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I already said i picked bands based on the decade they formed.
Sorry; I don't read all the posts then post; I hit reply and respond. No big deal; no one is grading this (though with the criteria of "25 years from first release, that might be a better common starting point).
Smiths is a similar case as Talking Heads: classic bands who released many classic albums, simple as that.
And Talking Heads already are inducted.
So is Laura Nyro and it's well documented that most of those Sire Records bands (read: most of those late 70's/early 80's quasi-new wave, post-punk bands, like the Ramones, the Talking Heads, The Pretenders, Blondie) were given undue consideration because of the input (read: strong arm influence) of the President of Sire Records, Seymour Stein. He's tried to get credit for the name "New Wave", since many of those bands sought to have some distance from the pure punk scene. It should be noted that The Smiths were on Sire as well.
That's one of my beefs with the Hall; you have that whole scene with second and third tier bands being inducted (same with the "California Rock" scene of the Eagles, Jackson Browne, etc.) and you have whole other genres - prog and metal - where basically you get the handful of stadium acts that cannot be denied (AC/DC, Van Halen, Floyd, Genesis). Fuck, Laura Nyro is more famous for dating Jackson Browne than she is for any of her songs!
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I don't really care about this second or third tier bands that are categorized based on if they fill stadiums or just a pub, i care about the quality of their discography. Both Smiths and Talking Heads have a stellar discography, far better than many that already are in the Hall. That's enough for me.
Hm... Most of the bands you mentioned deserve to be in it, regardless if they were given "unique consideration". I know there are bands like Iron Maiden that deserve to be on it more than Pretenders or Blondie, but i doesn't make these two undeserving.
(god, that was a lot of "deserve")
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I don't really care about this second or third tier bands that are categorized based on if they fill stadiums or just a pub, i care about the quality of their discography. Both Smiths and Talking Heads have a stellar discography, far better than many that already are in the Hall. That's enough for me.
Hm... Most of the bands you mentioned deserve to be in it, regardless if they were given "unique consideration". I know there are bands like Iron Maiden that deserve to be on it more than Pretenders or Blondie, but i doesn't make these two undeserving.
(god, that was a lot of "deserve")
Hahaha; deservedly so. ;)
But let me ask you this, independent of any one band: what constitutes a "stellar discography"? Can one put out one album and have it be a "stellar discography"? What about the Stones or Hank Williams, Jr. (not rock, but I needed an example), who both have something like 50 studio albums, some which are classic (Stinky Fingers, The Pressure Is On) and some that are - politely put - not?
Isn't there a degree to which popular acceptance is a measure of that stellar discography? I think that is kind of the knock on the Hall, especially early on; you got the critical darlings The Yardbirds and The Velvet Underground but no AC/DC or Genesis? It's REALLY hard to argue "stellar discography" and put IN the Yardbirds and keep OUT Genesis.
This is why the Hall fails; they are too inconsistent for their own good. Forget about "likes" and "dislikes" for a minute; King Crimson literally covers all bases. They were the first real "prog" band. They haven't sold shit for records. They haven't had a hit single. They touch - in one form or fashion - every other major prog band except Floyd. They have crossed genres (Wetton: Asia; Fripp: Gabriel and Hall; Burrell: Bad Company; McDonald: Foreigner). I mean, they could have put Crim in 10 years ago and NEVER had to answer the "prog" question ever again. But they didn't. This leads me to believe that the "stellar discography" isn't enough.
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Do you think the movie might have had something to do with why NWA was inducted?
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I already said i picked bands based on the decade they formed.
Smiths is a similar case as Talking Heads: classic bands who released many classic albums, simple as that.
And Talking Heads already are inducted.
I just looked up "eligibility for Rock and Roll Hall of Fame," And it DOES say 25 years after the release of a band or artist's first album. So unless you count The Sound House Tapes (1979) Iron Maiden would probably be classified as a band that didn't release their first album until 1980, which is how THEY gauge it, making them eligible in 2005.
I also want to clarify something I said earlier, when I talked about "having it my way." I was referring to the fact that DREAM THEATER released their first album in 1989, which made them eligible in 2014.
Deep Purple put their debut album out in 1968, which made them eligible in 1993.
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I just looked up "eligibility for Rock and Roll Hall of Fame," And it DOES say 25 years after the release of a band or artist's first album. So unless you count The Sound House Tapes (1979) Iron Maiden would probably be classified as a band that didn't release their first album until 1980, which is how THEY gauge it, making them eligible in 2005.
I also want to clarify something I said earlier, when I talked about "having it my way." I was referring to the fact that DREAM THEATER released their first album in 1989, which made them eligible in 2014.
Deep Purple put their debut album out in 1968, which made them eligible in 1993.
I know that. What's the problem?
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Do you think the movie might have had something to do with why NWA was inducted?
Oh yeah, absolutely. Brings good press for the Straight Outta Compton movie, and to their Hall of Fame. Might as well strike now while the viability is out for the time being to benefit from.
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This leads me to believe that the "stellar discography" isn't enough.
Well, but then bands like Velvet Underground and Stooges wouldn't be inducted either.
Summing up: who knows how the damn Hall works :rollin
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This leads me to believe that the "stellar discography" isn't enough.
Well, but then bands like Velvet Underground and Stooges wouldn't be inducted either.
I think the former SHOULD have been without question, but the second... it could be debated. I can make the argument both ways.
Summing up: who knows how the damn Hall works :rollin
This is the one unassailable truth in this entire thread. Full stop.
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The fact that we make fun of the RaRHoF process but then argue about which artists are worthy between a small group of people is exactly why I have never cared about music (or movie) awards.
I can't even decide my top 10 artists. I can't even decide my top 10 songs, albums. And that's a judge of one.
Throw in all the politics, snubbing, race/gender hand wringing, style definitions and whatever else, that's just icing on the cake of a concept that has problems at its foundation.
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The fact that we make fun of the RaRHoF process but then argue about which artists are worthy between a small group of people is exactly why I have never cared about music (or movie) awards.
I can't even decide my top 10 artists. I can't even decide my top 10 songs, albums. And that's a judge of one.
Throw in all the politics, snubbing, race/gender hand wringing, style definitions and whatever else, that's just icing on the cake of a concept that has problems at its foundation.
I think, to put it all in layman's terms, to sum up your whole post that I agree on. All of this, The Grammys, this Hall of Fame, other awards. It is all one big giant pissing match and ego-stroking that does not contribute to anything. At all. Imo. These are the reasons why I do not care for Hall of Fames like WWE's version of it and it is just hair-pulling to read people's thoughts like, "But, but, this guy deserves to go in. Why does he do not get in, but this other guy does get in?"
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Steve Miller just let the RNRHOF where they can stick it.
https://www.rollingstone.com/music/features/steve-miller-this-whole-industry-is-f--kin-gangsters-and-crooks-20160411
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Steve Miller may be my new hero.
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All right, it is agreed. Gene Simmons will accept NWA in this hall of fame as long as Led Zeppelin gets into the rap hall of fame.
https://411mania.com/music/gene-simmons-will-agree-with-nwa-hall-of-fame-induction-when-led-zeppelin-gets-in-rap-hall-of-fame/
Cube - I stand by my words. Respect NWA, but when Led Zep gets into Rap Hall of Fame, I will agree with your point.
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Didn't have a huge problem with this year's inductees, other than Cheap Trick. I will never see them as a first-rate band deserving of Hall of Fame status, especially given some of the acts that aren't in the Hall yet.
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I think I understand why you say that, but I know for me, Cheap Trick embodies what music is all about. Hits, not hits, self-written, song-writing factory written, live, studio... they've been through it all. I've seen them in arenas and in a small club, and they are just pros. They are one of the few bands out there that can probably play anything from their catalogue at any time. Eddie Trunk famously gave them a 'dream setlist' and they went up on stage and played it.
They do it because they love it, they do it to a high level, and they do it with a passion. Hard to knock.