Mangini's Billie Jean beat on
" A New Beginning "
:coolio.
LISTENING NOW :metal :corn :corn
:biggrin: I like the West Side Story section in Dystopian Overture
A Saviour In The Square.
DAT INTRO :'( :'( :'( :'(
For me, the track that completely stands out is Our New World. That is DT at its best. Like, easily beats anything they've done in the last 5 years. And more.
Act of Faythe now.
Ahhhh. When a 4th is played and it resolves to a 3rd. :lol
Act of Faythe now.
Ahhhh. When a 4th is played and it resolves to a 3rd. :lol
That's been one of my criticisms. This album is a bit "death by plagal cadence".
this album is fucking amazing, best since SFAM IMO
For me, the track that completely stands out is Our New World. That is DT at its best. Like, easily beats anything they've done in the last 5 years. And more.
If that track is not going to break into radio stations i'll lose any hope in human kind (the very little i still have)
Three Days :lol :metal :metal :corn :corn
Did they let Primus in the studio ? :lol
AWESOME
Act of Faythe now.
Ahhhh. When a 4th is played and it resolves to a 3rd. :lol
That's been one of my criticisms. This album is a bit "death by plagal cadence".
As a composer it pissed me of a little.
Brother, Can You Hear Me sounds like a song from church :biggrin:
For me I don't like when a 4th doesn't resolve to a 3rd :lol
For me I don't like when a 4th doesn't resolve to a 3rd :lol
That's the very point of it though. Just like a seventh chord tries to "pull" you towards the root note, the 4th tries to pull you towards the third of the tonic.
But, it is a rather hamfisted songwriting device. It should be used sparingly.
I like the chorus to "Chosen".
Digital Discord now.... DAT NOMAC.
Uh oh it's the tripods from the 2005 War Of The Worlds :biggrin:
The X Aspect.
Bagpipes ahoy ...and demonic choir :D
A New Beginning.
Dat surf intro :biggrin:
I'm going to bed at the end of ACT I and will continue my "review" tomorrow :rollin
Well this album is definitely for those that thought DT were stuck in a creative rut.
It's the "weirdest" they've sounded since Six Degrees. And is by far the most of the Mangini Era.
*maybe* the RoadRunner era.
Seriously. They've bought back that - whatever it is - they lost after Six Degrees.
Nutty sections. Some sections so bizarre and awesome I was like :lol fuck yes.
Brother, Can You Hear Me sounds like a song from church :biggrin:
Yeah, it sounds like a hymn :mehlin
Mangini's Billie Jean drum beat on " A New Beginning " - groovy as fuck. :metal
The Road To Revolution....
Final track of ACT I.
:clap: thoroughly enjoyed ACT I.
Some songs stand out more than others. But that always happens on first listen.
I'm getting the album tomorrow...but please someone tell me this:
Does the lyric book show which character is "speaking" in each song?
I'm getting the album tomorrow...but please someone tell me this:
Does the lyric book show which character is "speaking" in each song?
I'm getting the album tomorrow...but please someone tell me this:
Does the lyric book show which character is "speaking" in each song?
Yup!
I'm getting the album tomorrow...but please someone tell me this:
Does the lyric book show which character is "speaking" in each song?
Yes.
Gonna continue my play through this evening.
Thanks for all the quotes. :bosky:
:)
Waiting for the release tomorrow, but just out of curiosity, wouldn't it make more sense to have different threads, one for the music and one for the story? Some might want to discuss the music while just starting to listen and not want to read spoilers about the story.
Waiting for the release tomorrow, but just out of curiosity, wouldn't it make more sense to have different threads, one for the music and one for the story? Some might want to discuss the music while just starting to listen and not want to read spoilers about the story.
Yeah, but the flipside is, then there are multiple threads to follow, which just seems unwieldy and confusing.
Can I point out how beautiful Act of Faythe is? It reminds me of sections of Octavarium. Great buildup, satisfying payoff, beautiful harmonies and melodies, and JLB of course slays it as usual.
Can anyone tell me how Evangeline is related to any of the other characters?
From someone who doesn't have the album I can tell the Empress/Nafaryus/Daryus/(and maybe Faythe..?) are like the royal family while Arhys and Gabriel are more than likely brothers and Xander is a child in the rebel army..?
So far, there are several tracks I love, but the rest just blur together, and so far I don't really like Act II at all.
The high points on this album are way up there, and reminds of the type of writing they haven't done since SFAM/SDOIT, and are easily the best I've heard in the MM era, but there are too many misses for me at this point, and too many songs that felt like they started the same. Three Days is classic DT, and the kind of thing I've been itching to hear for a long time. Hits the spot goooood. I've already listened to it more than anything from ADTOE and DT12 combined.
Let's see how I feel after a few more listens though. :)
I've said it before and I'll say it again: Three Days is fucking awesome and might become a top 20-10 DT song for me. Yes, even separated from the story, I really love this song.
Right on mate, I now understand why people said James really shined on this one, he really makes the characters come to life!I've said it before and I'll say it again: Three Days is fucking awesome and might become a top 20-10 DT song for me. Yes, even separated from the story, I really love this song.
I love all of the Empire's sections. Daryus sounds like a spoiled brat in one moment, haha. "Don't make me ask again, DO AS MY FATHER SAYS!"
Indeed. It is what I like to call "the love theme". You hear it the first time at the end of A Savior in the Square when Gabriel first sees Faythe.
Indeed. It is what I like to call "the love theme". You hear it the first time at the end of A Savior in the Square when Gabriel first sees Faythe.
Works for me (although it makes me think of the Love Theme From Kiss :lol ). It's a really catchy and memorable theme, and Act of Faythe is my favourite variant of it, like it's the full version.
Not really what I was expecting. Like Blob said most of it seems to blur together. I don't dislike it, but I haven't heard anything that made me think "hey, that was a great song." I hear passages throughout that I really dig, but it's a bass line here or a guitar solo there as part of something I assume to be one the songs.
Still don't like the drums.
I think it'll be pretty damned fun to watch played live.
Indeed. It is what I like to call "the love theme". You hear it the first time at the end of A Savior in the Square when Gabriel first sees Faythe.
Works for me (although it makes me think of the Love Theme From Kiss :lol ). It's a really catchy and memorable theme, and Act of Faythe is my favourite variant of it, like it's the full version.
Yeah, there's even a more upbeat version of it that's also interesting during The Road to Revolution. :)
I will say, I was not expecting this at all. What an amazing effort. I'm not sure it paid off completely, but they really seem to have given it their all and props to the band for having an idea and then being 100% committed to it.
I really don't know how to put it otherwise, but MM managed to put 3 hours of lifeless drumming onto that album.
If you still find the drumming in this whole album lifeless, then you will never ever like Mike Mangini's drumming in whatever form. This has been his style from the very very start.
Listening all day.
Easily best since 6DOIT. At least on part with it.
Anyone who thinks differently is wrong.
The biggest mistake I made today:
While at work I listened to SDOIT disc 1. :facepalm:
TA... not even remotely close.
I must admit, I have now written off MM.Yeah, I think I have to concur. Up until now he's merely been a disappointing reminder of what's lost. Now I'm considering him a detriment, despite perhaps being the most gifted one in an amazingly talented band.
Yeah, I think I have to concur. Up until now he's merely been a disappointing reminder of what's lost. Now I'm considering him a detriment, despite perhaps being the most gifted one in an amazingly talented band.
Wow, wow. I love it. There is indeed some songs that I wouldn't listen without the context of the album, but the album as a whole is just beautiful. I actually liked the story!Can I point out how beautiful Act of Faythe is? It reminds me of sections of Octavarium. Great buildup, satisfying payoff, beautiful harmonies and melodies, and JLB of course slays it as usual.
Indeed. It is what I like to call "the love theme". You hear it the first time at the end of A Savior in the Square when Gabriel first sees Faythe.
Yeah, I think I have to concur. Up until now he's merely been a disappointing reminder of what's lost. Now I'm considering him a detriment, despite perhaps being the most gifted one in an amazingly talented band.
I really don't want to harp on this too long, but yeah, I had the same thought when I was listening to the album. Especially for the softer sections, subtle, organic drumming would have been wondrous and added so much to the songs. But it just stays at the same "bup ... chick", the whole time.
Yeah, I think I have to concur. Up until now he's merely been a disappointing reminder of what's lost. Now I'm considering him a detriment, despite perhaps being the most gifted one in an amazingly talented band.
I really don't want to harp on this too long, but yeah, I had the same thought when I was listening to the album. Especially for the softer sections, subtle, organic drumming would have been wondrous and added so much to the songs. But it just stays at the same "bup ... chick", the whole time.
The most brutal thing ever is "A New Beginning" fading out in the middle of that incredible Petrucci solo. :facepalm:
Yeah, I think I have to concur. Up until now he's merely been a disappointing reminder of what's lost. Now I'm considering him a detriment, despite perhaps being the most gifted one in an amazingly talented band.
I really don't want to harp on this too long, but yeah, I had the same thought when I was listening to the album. Especially for the softer sections, subtle, organic drumming would have been wondrous and added so much to the songs. But it just stays at the same "bup ... chick", the whole time.
Yeah, I think I have to concur. Up until now he's merely been a disappointing reminder of what's lost. Now I'm considering him a detriment, despite perhaps being the most gifted one in an amazingly talented band.
I really don't want to harp on this too long, but yeah, I had the same thought when I was listening to the album. Especially for the softer sections, subtle, organic drumming would have been wondrous and added so much to the songs. But it just stays at the same "bup ... chick", the whole time.
It's funny, because I think that if this were any other band no one would care at all about the drum sound, the mix or the drum performance itself (which I think is pretty killer). One of the criticisms he has received the most in these past 4 years has been of overplaying, of lacking 'feel' (whatever that means) and of playing very machine-like compared to Portnoy. This is probably one of the most laid-back-play-to-the-song drum performances I've heard from DT, so I find it very peculiar that you don't find his drumming organic, or to consider him a detriment.
My two cents.
I have to disagree on MM as well. The drumming is definitely lifeless. There's also plenty of subtlety -- sure there could have been more of that, but it's there especially on the first disc. The thing with MM is he keeps a basic up-front pulse, but there's lots of other things that he adds in underneath. Portnoy makes these extras super obvious, with MM you have to listen more for them (plus his cymbals are generally mixed lower). I imagine if this style bothers you, you'll never really enjoy MM's playing. I for one think it fits well.
He won't like it unless MM plays like his favorite drummer, Gavin Harrison. :lol
Wow. I hadn't made it that far yet, but after your post I listened to those. WYTHC is the most egregious yet. AoF isn't too bad, and I rather like the mini-solo at the conclusion. WYTHC is actually hard to listen to, though.Yeah, I think I have to concur. Up until now he's merely been a disappointing reminder of what's lost. Now I'm considering him a detriment, despite perhaps being the most gifted one in an amazingly talented band.
I really don't want to harp on this too long, but yeah, I had the same thought when I was listening to the album. Especially for the softer sections, subtle, organic drumming would have been wondrous and added so much to the songs. But it just stays at the same "bup ... chick", the whole time.
Yes, because When Your Time Has Come and Act of Faythe has "bup...chick" drumming all over. Maybe I am just imagining all those ghost notes.
He won't like it unless MM plays like his favorite drummer, Gavin Harrison. :lol
Or Marco Minnemann, or Neil Peart, or ...
The biggest mistake I made today:
While at work I listened to SDOIT disc 1. :facepalm:
TA... not even remotely close.
Why would you compare them? SDOIT is written as a typical music album. TA is written as a musical.
If you listen to TA as a musical and judge it as a musical production, the musical choices all make sense, especially the recurring themes, the not so lengthy development of "instrumental" ideas, etc.
TA is not even comparable to SFAM because SFAM, while a concept album with a narrative, is still written mostly as a typical music album, like Haken's Aquarius and Visions. TA, based on the flow and the composition, is really writeen as a musical theater production. Even the last song would give you the impression that it is where the "actors" would come back to the stage to take their bows and receive audience applause.
I am getting a sense here that DT has more plans for this project and they might actually explore making this an actual theatrical production because that is how it is written.
Seriously though, this is just my personal opinion and taste. I do not connect with his uber-precise, dry drum sound. I like to hear the stick scraping over the rim, the imprecise hit of the hihat, I like dynamics. MM is not about that, I totally get that (now). Doesn't mean I have to like it.Which is why, and I'll reiterate, I look forward to seeing this played live. I think it'll all come across much better to my ears in that format. The sound is the bigger problem for me, and the overplaying exasperates that. A more raw live sound with, dare I say, a little sloppiness will make the whole thing more palatable and it's already sure to be fun to watch.
Can we talk about how Hymn of a Thousand Voices and Our New World don't sound like standard DT? This is like, the first time they've done this in a looong time. I didn't think they still had it in them.
Can we talk about how Hymn of a Thousand Voices and Our New World don't sound like standard DT? This is like, the first time they've done this in a looong time. I didn't think they still had it in them.
When I think of DT playing something new in TA, first that comes to mind is A Life Left Behind. :)
Can we talk about how Hymn of a Thousand Voices and Our New World don't sound like standard DT? This is like, the first time they've done this in a looong time. I didn't think they still had it in them.
When I think of DT playing something new in TA, first that comes to mind is A Life Left Behind. :)
Hymn of a Thousand Voices seems to be the climax of the album to me. The songs after it are more of a...celebration/summary? do other people interpret it differently? Either way my God is the ending of that song glorious.
I still have no way to hear it til midnight when I'm ASSUMING Amazon will give me quality mp3s.I liked the poem
I wrote this bit (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=45717.0) now inspired by this wait for the album, it's about Fessoy The Deaf, a nice rich farmer who lives in The Upper Yorke Bay and was born with no ears, which made him famous for this unique disfigurement, a year before the events of The Astonishing; a surgeon from Widow's Peak comes up with a way to make Fessoy hear. That night after the surgery he goes out with his family to hear the NOMAC's for the first time..
Yes I'm very ready -and already- immersed in the world of The Astonishing heh
I liked the poem
I haven't listened to much of this yet, just the first few tracks, but Dystopian Overture is the tits!
Unfortunately, though I don't doubt there will be some great music on this album, the very fact that it's over 2 hours long is gonna be prohibitive, since I never really have a chunk of free time that long to commit. Hopefully enjoyment isn't contingent on an uninterrupted listening experience.
-J
I haven't listened to much of this yet, just the first few tracks, but Dystopian Overture is the tits!Yeah, I'm hep. This weekend I'm going to drive up to Texoma to visit some friends, which is the perfect length of time to listen to it twice and familiarize myself with it, yet the car I'm driving has no working CD player. :lol
Unfortunately, though I don't doubt there will be some great music on this album, the very fact that it's over 2 hours long is gonna be prohibitive, since I never really have a chunk of free time that long to commit. Hopefully enjoyment isn't contingent on an uninterrupted listening experience.
-J
I haven't listened to much of this yet, just the first few tracks, but Dystopian Overture is the tits!
Unfortunately, though I don't doubt there will be some great music on this album, the very fact that it's over 2 hours long is gonna be prohibitive, since I never really have a chunk of free time that long to commit. Hopefully enjoyment isn't contingent on an uninterrupted listening experience.
-J
For you Spotify guys, it's now up for me here, central time zone :metal
$34 for HDTracks?!?
Someone please tell me that the $15 CD was mastered with competence...
Thank god, I thought I was gonna have to sell my Dad on the idea. :lol$34 for HDTracks?!?
Someone please tell me that the $15 CD was mastered with competence...
The CD of The Astonishing has better mastering than the HDTracks version of DT12.
I have no idea how the HDTracks version of The Astonishing compares to the CD though. Hopefully when someone here buys it, they can do a comparison.
$34 for HDTracks?!?
Someone please tell me that the $15 CD was mastered with competence...
Am I the only one who thinks the title track slays Our New World? ONW is okay, but has a very ordinary feeling to it. Kind of like...Wither? (not a great comparison but couldn't think of a better analog). Astonishing, though...that ending...best two minutes of DT since Razor's Edge.I really do like Our New World, but the title track is a great ending. I'm not sure why some people have said they don't understand why it's there. That ending is so over the top, I love it.
More songs need James' maniacal laughing.
More songs need James' maniacal laughing.
I love that so much. It's cheesy but awesome.
And am I the only one who maniacally laughs along with it? :lol
Not only his laughing, but also his screams during The Walking Shadow. "YOU MURDERER!!!!!!" It set the mood so damn well!YESSS! I'm not normally a fan of screaming lyrics and stuff like that but this absolutely works.
After A few listening and a bit too much wine... I'm all into Nafaryus!!! all his songs I'm like.. yeah this dude rocks!
Not only his laughing, but also his screams during The Walking Shadow. "YOU MURDERER!!!!!!" It set the mood so damn well!YESSS! I'm not normally a fan of screaming lyrics and stuff like that but this absolutely works.
This is like DT meets Disney or Ayreon :P
I just got the HDTracks promo email. However, it doesn't seem to have come with the full lyric book, FYII was about to reply saying my order did come with a PDF, but you're right - the PDF is just the cover image and nothing more. Normally I wouldn't care too much, but the booklet is kinda important to understand what's going with this album! Guess I'll be writing them an email to see if anything can be done.
This is like DT meets Disney or Ayreon :PThe Answer reminds me very much of some sort of Disney theme.
Can we talk about how Hymn of a Thousand Voices and Our New World don't sound like standard DT? This is like, the first time they've done this in a looong time. I didn't think they still had it in them.
When I think of DT playing something new in TA, first that comes to mind is A Life Left Behind. :)
Life Left Behind also has some very uncommon DT writing in it. Really like that tune (despite the Tempus Fugit opening).
That's why Our New World is my favorite song on the album, yeah. Completely unexpected, different style.
I haven't listened to much of this yet, just the first few tracks, but Dystopian Overture is the tits!Yeah, I'm hep. This weekend I'm going to drive up to Texoma to visit some friends, which is the perfect length of time to listen to it twice and familiarize myself with it, yet the car I'm driving has no working CD player. :lol
Unfortunately, though I don't doubt there will be some great music on this album, the very fact that it's over 2 hours long is gonna be prohibitive, since I never really have a chunk of free time that long to commit. Hopefully enjoyment isn't contingent on an uninterrupted listening experience.
-J
"Moment of Betrayal" is 10X more badass within the context of the album. My initial opinion was "oh, this is cool, but remind of Behind the Veil". As a kick-off to Act II, it's freaking stellar.
VERY good album. Quite different. Major props to JP!
8/10
Its extremely ballad heavy. There are moments when you expect the songs to be up beat and rock out and then it just goes right back to a ballad. As good as JLB is on this album there is almost too much of him and Petrucci is surprisingly low in the mix at times. I am someone who loves the prog side of DT and prefers the less metal side but even I think they could have rocked out a bit more so far through 15 tracks.After Chosen is actually where a lot of the more upbeat / heavier tracks are.
So is Act II being overlooked by many simply because of fatigue?
So is Act II being overlooked by many simply because of fatigue? I gotta say - it's edging out Act I for me.
On another listen through, getting more into it and I can definitely say it beats DT13.Glad to hear! Every DT album needs to best itself :neverusethis:
"A New Beginning." Holy f**k are you serious? Dream Theater in a groove? Yes!This could be an early favorite for me. I could listen to them jam that last part for like 20 minutes. In fact, it would be awesome if they did that in the live show to give James a little break before the end of Act I.
I've listened it in full over Spotify. I have to say I don't like it at all, too much ballads.
Hopefully this is a grower, I'll try to listen to it again later.
Very weak.
Lord Nafaryus sounds so much like a Muse song but I can't pin down what (because I'm not a muse fan and don't really like them) but I though it was 'Butterflies and Hurricanes', any Muse fans recognize what it is?
Lord Nafaryus sounds so much like a Muse song but I can't pin down what (because I'm not a muse fan and don't really like them) but I though it was 'Butterflies and Hurricanes', any Muse fans recognize what it is?
At the same time, Muse sound alot like Queen at times. And for me, LN sounds more like Queen than Muse.
B.Lee
Lord Nafaryus sounds so much like a Muse song but I can't pin down what (because I'm not a muse fan and don't really like them) but I though it was 'Butterflies and Hurricanes', any Muse fans recognize what it is?
At the same time, Muse sound alot like Queen at times. And for me, LN sounds more like Queen than Muse.
B.Lee
It's the vibrato that does it. The vocals sound more Freddy Mercury inspired to me, similar to how JLB sang on their Queen cover.
Lord Nafaryus sounds so much like a Muse song but I can't pin down what (because I'm not a muse fan and don't really like them) but I though it was 'Butterflies and Hurricanes', any Muse fans recognize what it is?
At the same time, Muse sound alot like Queen at times. And for me, LN sounds more like Queen than Muse.
B.Lee
It's the vibrato that does it. The vocals sound more Freddy Mercury inspired to me, similar to how JLB sang on their Queen cover.
Well, I'm talking musically, Its the piano/strings part around 0:45
Can someone tell me who Evangeline is in relation to the other characters?
Am I the one only who finds it hard to distinguish when James changes vocal style between the characters? After all the talk about him being brilliant in portraying serveral different characters throughout the album, I am glad to have the lyrics to see where he switches from character to character. It's probably just my hearing though :P
Am I the one only who finds it hard to distinguish when James changes vocal style between the characters? After all the talk about him being brilliant in portraying serveral different characters throughout the album, I am glad to have the lyrics to see where he switches from character to character. It's probably just my hearing though :P
Am I the one only who finds it hard to distinguish when James changes vocal style between the characters? After all the talk about him being brilliant in portraying serveral different characters throughout the album, I am glad to have the lyrics to see where he switches from character to character. It's probably just my hearing though :P
I can for some characters, not for others. Gabriel and Arhys sound exactly the same to me (although they are brothers, so it would make sense). Nafaryus usually sounds gruff, but that's not consistent. Faythe is most distinctive with the lighter tone. Overall though, I haven't noticed a lot of the changes.
There is a lot to love here but there are about 10 songs that sound like they could be straight out of the movie Pocahontas. There are even some fantastic overall songs that still have parts that seem to drift back into Pocahontas territory.
I've been a huge DT fan for about 12 years. And this is the first album I totally dislike after the first listen. Utter disappointment.
The story's been used for I don't know how many times. I always liked to believe that DT have a kind of esoteric vibe about them, but with this album we got a metal DISNEY drama. And it's so overpolished and uninspired that the only human element bringing something sonically new and showing some sort of experimentation is stagnating DT-machine are the freaking tracks "written" by NOMACs.
Don't want to be a party ruiner, but we're all entitled to our opinion here, right? :)
I'm not sure how you can ever pair this album up with "not experimental". Compare it to the last 4 DT albums and say it's less experimental than those. Get out of here. :lol
I can totally get why someone would not be into this album and can see the Disney thing, but god I can't respect the opinion that this isn't inspired or experimental.
This is the first time since TOT that I felt like true inspiration went into the making of the album. Although 34 songs sounds like an amazingly exciting idea, I think the album would be getting a better reception had they edited it down to about 15 songs.
There is a brilliant focus and tightness of an album like SFAM and I fear this one suffers from a lack of editing. Sometimes less is more.
With that said, I don't really have an issue with some filler tracks with beautiful piano and nice vocals from Labrie but it may end up detracting from the overall ranking of the album.
Time will tell as I have only had one full listen and I may be off base proclaiming these songs as filler.
And it's the only DT album that sounds exactly as the previous one.
I'm not sure how you can ever pair this album up with "not experimental". Compare it to the last 4 DT albums and say it's less experimental than those. Get out of here. :lol
I can totally get why someone would not be into this album and can see the Disney thing, but god I can't respect the opinion that this isn't inspired or experimental.
It may be an experiment in terms of form (storyline etc.), but musically.. I honestly don't see signs of further development. "we've heard it all before." And it's the only DT album that sounds exactly as the previous one.
Really? I don't have the album yet, so I don't know if this is accurate, but I found this:$34 for HDTracks?!?
Someone please tell me that the $15 CD was mastered with competence...
The CD of The Astonishing has better mastering than the HDTracks version of DT12.
I have no idea how the HDTracks version of The Astonishing compares to the CD though. Hopefully when someone here buys it, they can do a comparison.
Really? I don't have the album yet, so I don't know if this is accurate, but I found this:$34 for HDTracks?!?
Someone please tell me that the $15 CD was mastered with competence...
The CD of The Astonishing has better mastering than the HDTracks version of DT12.
I have no idea how the HDTracks version of The Astonishing compares to the CD though. Hopefully when someone here buys it, they can do a comparison.
https://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/46804
https://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/102647
CD version for me then, although I'd pay more for a better master. 24 bit/96 kHz doesn't matter after the mixing is done.
There are obviously some similarities between DT12 and TA (and older albums), since it's a progression of sound, but how anyone could think they sound exactly the same, I'm at a loss.
Lyrically, every track has a purpose, but musically there is a decent amount of redundancy and sameyness they could have maybe cut down on. The problem with a concept album / rock opera is that it's sort of an all or nothing deal to me. It's hard to just enjoy a few tracks out of context, because it's just a segment of it. That wasn't a problem on SFAM, since that is as close to musical perfection as it gets, but it's harder when you only dig 1/3 of a rock opera.
There are obviously some similarities between DT12 and TA (and older albums), since it's a progression of sound, but how anyone could think they sound exactly the same, I'm at a loss.
Lyrically, every track has a purpose, but musically there is a decent amount of redundancy and sameyness they could have maybe cut down on. The problem with a concept album / rock opera is that it's sort of an all or nothing deal to me. It's hard to just enjoy a few tracks out of context, because it's just a segment of it. That wasn't a problem on SFAM, since that is as close to musical perfection as it gets, but it's harder when you only dig 1/3 of a rock opera.
I think it really is because of a difference in approach. SFAM is written as a music album. It is very enjoyable to listen to. But can you stage it as an actual musical without modifying the content? I think you can not, there are too many lengthy instrumental portions.
TA, on the other hand, really feels like it was written as a musical. I don't think any modification needs to be done and they can already stage this as an actual musical play.
I think it really is because of a difference in approach. SFAM is written as a music album. It is very enjoyable to listen to. But can you stage it as an actual musical without modifying the content? I think you can not, there are too many lengthy instrumental portions.
TA, on the other hand, really feels like it was written as a musical. I don't think any modification needs to be done and they can already stage this as an actual musical play.
Absolutely. The only comparison I was drawing was that they're both written as a greater whole, but TA truly is a rock opera as opposed to SFAM's concept album. That unfortunately means it's even more difficult for me to enjoy a track here and there on TA, because that's not how it was written and designed to be listened to. SFAM still overall works well as individual tracks despite the story because it was still written to work that way.
I am starting to think that JP may actually have bigger plans for this one because one does not just write a real rock opera if there is no intention for it to be staged as one.
I am starting to think that JP may actually have bigger plans for this one because one does not just write a real rock opera if there is no intention for it to be staged as one.
We're still yet to see how it's presented live. For all we know, JLB will have 56 costume changes during the show. :P
I am starting to think that JP may actually have bigger plans for this one because one does not just write a real rock opera if there is no intention for it to be staged as one.
We're still yet to see how it's presented live. For all we know, JLB will have 56 costume changes during the show. :P
Or those costumes where there's two halves (two characters) so he turns left and right depending on which character he is.
I am starting to think that JP may actually have bigger plans for this one because one does not just write a real rock opera if there is no intention for it to be staged as one.
We're still yet to see how it's presented live. For all we know, JLB will have 56 costume changes during the show. :P
Or those costumes where there's two halves (two characters) so he turns left and right depending on which character he is.
I am starting to think that JP may actually have bigger plans for this one because one does not just write a real rock opera if there is no intention for it to be staged as one.
We're still yet to see how it's presented live. For all we know, JLB will have 56 costume changes during the show. :P
Or those costumes where there's two halves (two characters) so he turns left and right depending on which character he is.
Our New World intro :metal :metal :clap:
THAT solo on A Saviour in The Square. If anyone knows of Marco Sfogli from JLB solo band, JP seems to have taken a page from his style... it just sounds so close. Quite funny, since Sfogli took from JP first :biggrin: :metal
Also the combo A Saviour In The Square - When Your Time Has Come is probably my favourite right now...
Best sounding album since Octavarium ?
The most brutal thing ever is "A New Beginning" fading out in the middle of that incredible Petrucci solo. :facepalm:
Best sounding album since Octavarium ?
I'd say so. I actually prefer the drum sound on this album to octavarium. My biggest problem with octavarium's drum sound is how limp he kick drum is. I like them to sound tight and defined.
The most brutal thing ever is "A New Beginning" fading out in the middle of that incredible Petrucci solo. :facepalm:
I agree with this completely, so far my only real grump about the album.
The opening four notes of Ravenskill reminds me of the Tetris theme. Can't stop thinking about it whenever it starts.
The most brutal thing ever is "A New Beginning" fading out in the middle of that incredible Petrucci solo. :facepalm:
I agree with this completely, so far my only real grump about the album.
Would be preferable to extend it if this is a standard music album, but the length is ok in the context of a musical.
The most brutal thing ever is "A New Beginning" fading out in the middle of that incredible Petrucci solo. :facepalm:
I agree with this completely, so far my only real grump about the album.
Would be preferable to extend it if this is a standard music album, but the length is ok in the context of a musical.
IDK, the lengh is alright, just needed a proper ending. I can see it merrits, but its just not fullfiling. JP did it in TBOT too, but alteast there it was indeed after 3 min ;D Hopefull live he will extend it a bit, and give it a proper finish.
The opening four notes of Ravenskill reminds me of the Tetris theme. Can't stop thinking about it whenever it starts.
What have you done...!
Is it just me, or does the melody, most prominently featured in "Brother Can You Hear Me?" remind anyone of the vocal melody from the middle of Rush's "Hemispheres, Part IV: Cygnus, Bringer Of Balance"? The lyrics in that song go -
."I have memory and awareness
But I have no shape or form
As a disembodied spirit
I am dead and yet unborn
I have passed into Olympus
As was told in tales of old
To the city of Immortals
Marble white and purest gold..."
The melody in BCYHM is VERY reminiscent of that verse for me, and I'm hoping I'm not the only one who felt that way
-Marc.
The most brutal thing ever is "A New Beginning" fading out in the middle of that incredible Petrucci solo. :facepalm:
I agree with this completely, so far my only real grump about the album.
Would be preferable to extend it if this is a standard music album, but the length is ok in the context of a musical.
IDK, the lengh is alright, just needed a proper ending. I can see it merrits, but its just not fullfiling. JP did it in TBOT too, but alteast there it was indeed after 3 min ;D Hopefull live he will extend it a bit, and give it a proper finish.
I don't think so. Remember it's a rock opera, where everything has a proper place. Seems difficult to change that without changing the dynamics.
B.Lee
I actually look at the story now as consisting of three acts. Act 1 is up to Three Days, all of this is set-up and intro the world being built (10 songs, 37+ minutes). Act 2 is Hovering Sojourn up to Road to Revolution, which contained the plot twists (Faythe and Gabriel, Daryus vs. Road to Revolution, Faythe and Nefaryus) (10 songs, 42+ minutes). Act 3 is the current Act 2 up to Our New World (12 songs, 43+ minutes)which is the climax and resolution of the plot developments in "Act 2" . Power Down and Astonishing is the curtain call. The album looks more balanced to me that way. :)Yes yes yes, absolutely! Narratively and musically, it really feels like 3 acts, and that's how I'm treating it basically. First part is Descent to Three Days, second part is Hovering Sojourn to Road to Revolution, and third part is basically Act II minus Astonishing which is more of a coda/epilogue, and frankly pretty unnecessary in my opinion.
I know many can often disregard shorter songs, hence why it's been barely mentioned, but wow - "The Answer' is a beautiful 1:53's worth of music. Then it's like the 'full version' of it comes in and gets ramped up in Act II with 'Begin Again'. Brilliant. This is just a superb album. :metal
Yes yes yes, absolutely! Narratively and musically, it really feels like 3 acts, and that's how I'm treating it basically. First part is Descent to Three Days, second part is Hovering Sojourn to Road to Revolution, and third part is basically Act II minus Astonishing which is more of a coda/epilogue, and frankly pretty unnecessary in my opinion.
I really want The Astonishing: The Musical
The opening four notes of Ravenskill reminds me of the Tetris theme. Can't stop thinking about it whenever it starts.
What have you done...!
:neverusethis:
More songs need James' maniacal laughing.
I love that so much. It's cheesy but awesome.
And am I the only one who maniacally laughs along with it? :lol
More songs need James' maniacal laughing.
More songs need James' maniacal laughing.
I just wish there was footage of him recording that.
And what's so special about the STILL unlocked places tab, why is it so important when we've heard the album, know the characters, know the story?Well, considering that RR hasn't sent people their digital downloads yet, I'm guessing all that stuff will probably be unlocked and sent out by some guy who's probably still sleeping, lol. JP also said they were planning to have the track list link to actual explanations of scenes for people who didn't quite get what's happening in the story, so there should be more to that as well.
And what's so special about the STILL unlocked places tab, why is it so important when we've heard the album, know the characters, know the story?
And what's so special about the STILL unlocked places tab, why is it so important when we've heard the album, know the characters, know the story?
Don't know, but I don't see any reason for it not to be revealed now. Maybe later today?
I was just walking back to work after my lunch break, listening to A Life Left Behind on Spotify - it's one of the standout tracks for me so far. I'm a sucker for catchy choruses. And that "video gamey" intro is nice too.
I love that piano intro to Ravenskill!
I love that piano intro to Ravenskill!
When it goes heavy it gets even better. Definitely my favourite track so far. :metal
I mean to honor the fact that they go by the name Dream Theater, I feel that would be their true destiny. :PI really want The Astonishing: The Musical
I have a feeling that their decision to stage a full "The Astonishing"-only tour is a testing of the waters. Now that I had listened to it a lot of times, I find myself thinking that one does not write a musical this elaborate without planning to bring this on stage as a full-scale production at some point.
I mean to honor the fact that they go by the name Dream Theater, I feel that would be their true destiny. :PI really want The Astonishing: The Musical
I have a feeling that their decision to stage a full "The Astonishing"-only tour is a testing of the waters. Now that I had listened to it a lot of times, I find myself thinking that one does not write a musical this elaborate without planning to bring this on stage as a full-scale production at some point.
So far the only thing im dissapointed in is the ending. Not that its not good, it fits, but I really wanted it to end with an epic guitar solo ala Razors edge or IT.
About the best I could do.
https://www.blobvandam.com/link/JLB_HAHA.mp3
Act of Faythe - Nice song, but "My music player"? LOL
I am starting to think that JP may actually have bigger plans for this one because one does not just write a real rock opera if there is no intention for it to be staged as one.
We're still yet to see how it's presented live. For all we know, JLB will have 56 costume changes during the show. :P
I don't have the slightest clue what's going on in the story, or who is who, but I'm enjoying it.
I don't have the slightest clue what's going on in the story, or who is who, but I'm enjoying it.
Me neither :lol Hopefully we can get a full breakdown of the story and characters for us who hasn't "gotten it" yet.
can anyone give a tl;dr breakdown of the story? I've listened to it 6~ times now and following the lyrics and I still don't have a clue what it's aboutReally? If you've followed along with the full lyrics (including who is speaking at each point) then I would say it's actually pretty easy to follow. If anything, I can understand why some people would find a lot of the lyrics too blatant/obvious, especially those who have felt that way about a lot of DT's lyrics (which doesn't include me by the way).
I would fire the guy who have overseen the artwork. The credits at the back of the CD-set are impossible to read!
Artwork 0/10
can anyone give a tl;dr breakdown of the story? I've listened to it 6~ times now and following the lyrics and I still don't have a clue what it's aboutReally? If you've followed along with the full lyrics (including who is speaking at each point) then I would say it's actually pretty easy to follow. If anything, I can understand why some people would find a lot of the lyrics too blatant/obvious, especially those who have felt that way about a lot of DT's lyrics (which doesn't include me by the way).
Act of Faythe - Nice song, but "My music player"? LOL
Indeed. It is what I like to call "the love theme". You hear it the first time at the end of A Savior in the Square when Gabriel first sees Faythe.
Is it just me, or does the melody, most prominently featured in "Brother Can You Hear Me?" remind anyone of the vocal melody from the middle of Rush's "Hemispheres, Part IV: Cygnus, Bringer Of Balance"? The lyrics in that song go -
."I have memory and awareness
But I have no shape or form
As a disembodied spirit
I am dead and yet unborn
I have passed into Olympus
As was told in tales of old
To the city of Immortals
Marble white and purest gold..."
The melody in BCYHM is VERY reminiscent of that verse for me, and I'm hoping I'm not the only one who felt that way...it also reminds me of parts of "The Wall", too. There's tons of Rush and Pink Floyd all over this album, at least to me.
-Marc.
Act of Faythe - Nice song, but "My music player"? LOL
What about the "How music makes me feel!" part of A New Beginning? :lol
(POSSIBLE) SPOILER ALERT:Never think of that !! It would be great if DT give us Hi Res Picture for any place taken in the story !!!
Re. the Places tab: Most of the CD booklet is given over to the lyrics (the addition of locations and "Day/Night" is a nice touch). The only pictures are one of the Emperor's Palace (different angle of the front cover scene), and fuller pictures of the characters. So as of now I have no idea, for example, what Heaven's Cove looks like. Maybe (hopefully) the Places tab will give us more pictures of the key scenery and locations of the story, to help bring it further to life.
Stupid question maybe, but what does 'Int.' and 'Ext. in the booklet mean?
For example:
Int. Emperor's Palace - Night
Ext. Ravenskill Town Square - Day
Interior and exterior (Inside and outside).
Disc two of SDOIT is shorter.
Steven Wilson most gentle songs sound hardcore compared to this album.
What really surprised me is how, with all the visual emphasis on the NOMACS, on the album they play virtually no role. I was hoping for an actual NOMACS tune.
Question, are the characters pictured inside like on the website?
All I know is I will be buying this today, and after ADTOE, I never ever thought I would "first day, unheard buy" a DT album again. But there you go.
And if the only good thing to come of it is this awesome new forum design, I call it a WIN. This is flipping awesome!!!
All I know is I will be buying this today, and after ADTOE, I never ever thought I would "first day, unheard buy" a DT album again. But there you go.
And if the only good thing to come of it is this awesome new forum design, I call it a WIN. This is flipping awesome!!!
I predict you will love it! It's so full of melody.
Just do yourself a favor (if you can) and dedicate alone time to the first spin. Quiet and alone.
Is it weird that I think it's weird that literally nobody but myself commented on the new forum theme...? Are you guys actually seeing it? :-\
Is it weird that I think it's weird that literally nobody but myself commented on the new forum theme...? Are you guys actually seeing it? :-\
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=45721.msg2087302
I think my Dream Theater days are over. I didn't care about the last two albums, but this one takes the cake.
...laughable...
...pompous rock for women in their 50's or kids.
...childish ...
...The album sounds like it was written by 15 years old.
...embarassing. ...
Obviously, not everyone will like this album. And as has been said over and over since the inception of this forum, ALL opinions are welcome. However, negative opinions still should be expressed constructively, as clearly stated in the forum rules. Petty insults like the following are clearly out of bounds and will not be tolerated:Insults to who ? The musical notes on the album ? Do you take personnaly remarks about a musical material in a "if you don't like what I like the way I like it, you insult me" way ? This has nothing to do with moderation, but with with your inability to distinguish your own tastes from the OBJECT of your liking.
Honestly, if you need to be told that that sort of thing is out of bounds, I'm not really sure what more can be said to you. We are better than that here.
As for your other criticisms, I don't see any basis for them, but your opinion is your opinion. But this warning is strictly for the off-base insults.
"A New Beginning." Holy f**k are you serious? Dream Theater in a groove? Yes!This could be an early favorite for me. I could listen to them jam that last part for like 20 minutes. In fact, it would be awesome if they did that in the live show to give James a little break before the end of Act I.
Obviously, not everyone will like this album. And as has been said over and over since the inception of this forum, ALL opinions are welcome. However, negative opinions still should be expressed constructively, as clearly stated in the forum rules. Petty insults like the following are clearly out of bounds and will not be tolerated:Insults to who ? The musical notes on the album ? Do you take personnaly remarks about a musical material in a "if you don't like what I like the way I like it, you insult me" way ? This has nothing to do with moderation, but with with your inability to distinguish your own tastes from the OBJECT of your liking.
Honestly, if you need to be told that that sort of thing is out of bounds, I'm not really sure what more can be said to you. We are better than that here.
As for your other criticisms, I don't see any basis for them, but your opinion is your opinion. But this warning is strictly for the off-base insults.
It's pretty obvious that NOT ALL opinions are welcome.
*snip*
Even if I accepted the insults targeted at the band, even if I took your opinions-stated-as-facts and even if I could get over the implications that DT should be less accessible and have failed to do so; even if I ran with all of that, I'd still have to question your knowledge of Steven Wilson.Actually, you can : I don't like Steven Wilson's music that much, and don't know all his albums for that very reason. I've heard pretty much everything he's done after 2000 with Porcupine Tree or as a solo artist, though.
*snip*
If you consider this a satirical troll post it's actually kinda funny. :lol
And insults at the band... They're filthy rich and they do whatever they like. Don't worry, they don't care about me not liking their album.
Even if I accepted the insults targeted at the band, even if I took your opinions-stated-as-facts and even if I could get over the implications that DT should be less accessible and have failed to do so; even if I ran with all of that, I'd still have to question your knowledge of Steven Wilson.Actually, you can : I don't like Steven Wilson's music that much, and don't know all his albums for that very reason. I've heard pretty much everything he's done after 2000 with Porcupine Tree or as a solo artist, though.
I have a question about the title of the album. I have only listened once, while reading the lyrics. Why is the album named The Astonishing? In the end the lyrics say: eternally, in harmony our lives will be astonishing again. What do they mean by this?As I understand it, they're gonna start making music once again. The NOMACs shut down and Lord Nafaryus saw the error of his ways.... All of this in true Disney fashion! *I personally love the ending so hard!*
Yeah i got that, but i don't understand how lives can be astonishing? It doesn't seem like the proper adjective for that :P
You can't dig your way out of this one. You simply can't.
This album is getting trashed on the Metallica forum of course.
" Not enough solos "
" Too many ballads "
" It's BORING ".
" Not enough F words and blastbeats " < - - i made that one up but I extrapolated.
Yeah i got that, but i don't understand how lives can be astonishing? It doesn't seem like the proper adjective for that :P
So you say about one of the most fan-friendly major bands out there (even after Portnoy's departure).I don't see the link. They won't read this thread. It's not like I'm waiting for them at the end of a show to say to them that their album sucks.
Regardless, it doesn't foster good discussion. Notice the little tangent we are on.But what discussion is even possible, except for some fans loving the album and saying "that part is great, that part is amazing, etc."- which is fine, but barely a discussion? It's an opinion thread. There isn't much more to say.
I won't say anything bad anymore about the album, because it obviously hurts some people's feelings.
their album sucks.
You can't dig your way out of this one. You simply can't.
Wait, what? This is not about diging out. My phrase was simply meant to say that an artist like Steven Wilson pretty much always sounds more gritty than DT here, nothing more (and I could have chosen someone else). If Steven Wilson wrote some embarasingly cheesy songs with PT or as a solo artist that I don't know about, it doesn't really change anything. And if what you have in mind is Blackfield, yes, it's cheesy, but if you're trying to dig out everything Wilson wrote, you're totally missing the point.
This, along with the fact that you pointed out MMs drumming says to me you just miss Portnoy. And that's fine. But it's got to start dawning on people that there's 99% chance he's not coming back.
And the metal parts are laughable? "Day after day, night after night..."
Back to the topic, does anyone else think the way James sings "Faythe I treasure more than all the diamonds in my crown" is the most beautiful thing he's ever done?
Kilgore Trout, you can say what you want to about the album, provided it is not couched in insults like what I quoted above. Not everyone likes the album, and that's cool. In the 200+ page thread that preceded this one, there was plenty of good discussion, including great comments from those who did not like the songs they had heard. That is all fine. Whether you want to voice your dislikes constructively or keep them to yourself is up to you, but either of those options are allowed and do not break the forum rules. But let's keep the discussion in the thread album-focused rather than turning into a debate about what you can and cannot post, or debates about who knows more about Wilson. That is not what this thread is about. (and that is a general comment to EVERYONE, not just Kilgore Trout) Thanks.
You're speaking in nonspecific terms without defining them.Yeah, like everyone is using specific terms in this topic.
First you said that nothing on this album is as "hardcore" as SW?That is not even what I wrote.
I don't have a clue as to what you're trying to say. So when I say "dig out", I mean dig yourself out of a poorly-explained position which most are likely to disagree with you on anyways.I thought I stated my genre impressions (and nothing more) in words and sentences that were simple enough to understand, like everyone else did.
Gosh. Don't read implications where there are none. I wrote "It's not like I'm waiting for them at the end of a show to say to them that their album sucks". I wasn't saying the album sucks.
I won't say anything bad anymore about the album, because it obviously hurts some people's feelings.their album sucks.
:clap: :bosky:
Whenever I get a new Dream Theater Album (or rush for that matter) I usually give them a few spins without trying to dig to much into details. More in a relax kinda let the album drive my mood way.I find this to be the only reasonable approach to listening to any music, really. Trying to get all in your head at first is a pointless imo.
This has work pretty well before because I'm not comparing parts to previous albums/songs/bands etc. and usually make my experience with the album unbiassed. Only After a few spins then i start digging deeper into details (lyrics, music, etc)
Again, can we please turn the discussion to the actual content of the album rather than arguing over each others' positions? Thanks.
Yeah i got that, but i don't understand how lives can be astonishing? It doesn't seem like the proper adjective for that :P
I googled "Astonishing" and I got, "extremely surprising or impressive; amazing"
The idea is that the people being allowed to make music again will introduce some more amazing and impressive things in their life. How did you feel the first time you ever listened to DT, or realized you loved it? That's what they'll finally be allowed to feel again.
As for why it's called 'The Astonishing,' as I understand it, The Astonishing is the process of Nafaryus realizing the true power of music and allowing it back into the world.
First off I would like to thank Amazon for delivering this YESTERDAY!!!
I have been begging for two things from a DT album:
1. Way more piano
2. Allowing James to go off
This album does both!
Brace yourself, bow down to Nafaryus :metal
I have to agree... these songs put the previous album to shame.Wow, that is saying alot! I love DT 12 probably more than most on this forum. I have to wait another week to hear TA, my local record store forgot to order it and I requested it a week ago..
I have to agree... these songs put the previous album to shame.Wow, that is saying alot! I love DT 12 probably more than most on this forum. I have to wait another week to hear TA, my local record store forgot to order it and I requested it a week ago..
YES!
First impression:
This is some of the most special, most melodic and beautiful music Dream Theater has even written.
Okay what is this "gift" Gabriel has? Am I dumb?
Thanks for the heads up.. I don't have a computer at the moment, just a Android phone. I have to wait for the cd next Friday. There are no best buys in my area and I seriously doubt Wal-Mart will have it. My local record store is only open Thursday through Saturday..lame!I have to agree... these songs put the previous album to shame.Wow, that is saying alot! I love DT 12 probably more than most on this forum. I have to wait another week to hear TA, my local record store forgot to order it and I requested it a week ago..
I reccommend getting it on HDtracks.com!
Okay what is this "gift" Gabriel has? Am I dumb?
If you are Jonesing for it... get a Spotify Premium subscription. its how I am listening to it right now.Thanks for the heads up.. I don't have a computer at the moment, just a Android phone. I have to wait for the cd next Friday. There are no best buys in my area and I seriously doubt Wal-Mart will have it. My local record store is only open Thursday through Saturday..lame!I have to agree... these songs put the previous album to shame.Wow, that is saying alot! I love DT 12 probably more than most on this forum. I have to wait another week to hear TA, my local record store forgot to order it and I requested it a week ago..
I reccommend getting it on HDtracks.com!
Lord Nafaryus. I am in love with this song. This is new DT, a sound I haven't ever heard from them. I absolutely adore it.
Thanks, but my phone plan has limited Data and would send my bill through the roof with an alb7m this long, lol! I'll just have to wait. I made it 43 years of my life without hearing it, I guess I can go for another week. I better stay away from the burgers and fries to increase my odds of survival during the wait..If you are Jonesing for it... get a Spotify Premium subscription. its how I am listening to it right now.Thanks for the heads up.. I don't have a computer at the moment, just a Android phone. I have to wait for the cd next Friday. There are no best buys in my area and I seriously doubt Wal-Mart will have it. My local record store is only open Thursday through Saturday..lame!I have to agree... these songs put the previous album to shame.Wow, that is saying alot! I love DT 12 probably more than most on this forum. I have to wait another week to hear TA, my local record store forgot to order it and I requested it a week ago..
I reccommend getting it on HDtracks.com!
I can hear something weird in the end of the vocals on A Tempting Offer. What is that sound James is making? Is it some weird editing? Sound like he's saying: take the evening to decide... ivdsh
Somebody is slacking the living shit out of putting the lyrics on the website..
I can hear something weird in the end of the vocals on A Tempting Offer. What is that sound James is making? Is it some weird editing? Sound like he's saying: take the evening to decide... ivdsh
Did anyone else hear this?
The band has the whole album up on youtube if anyone is interested.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLToa5JuFMsXR7S5f8Ti0IWHYFOU5WclqA
And yes, it IS a verified official DT youtube page, and the whole album was uploaded yesterday. So enjoy, especially for those of you who are still waiting for their physical order to come in!
-Marc.
Do you really put Descent of the NOMACs as a highlight? Bring that one to the controversial opinions thread :lol
I can hear something weird in the end of the vocals on A Tempting Offer. What is that sound James is making? Is it some weird editing? Sound like he's saying: take the evening to decide... ivdsh
Did anyone else hear this?
Yes. It was even asked about from Petrucci in his AMA. He didn't know what it was
Lord Bug.
In my lyric book, during The Walking Shadow, (spoilers ahead I suppose) it attributes the part threatening Arhys' son ("Confront your death, like father like son") to Arhys himself (who has just been killed) rather than Daryus. Does everyone else's have this mistake? :lol:
Apologies if it has been mentioned before.
Somebody is slacking the living shit out of putting the lyrics on the website..This
Story question/critisism:Yes, almost not making sense at all. One thing that disappoint me about the story in The Astonishing
Okey, correct me if Im wrong.
So, Daryus kidnapped Xander and threatened to kill him if Arhys didn`t bring him Gabriel. Daryus kills Arhys and almost kills his sister.
In "Astonishing", Arabelle sings:
" My prince, my son
You got lost along the way
In light of this new burden that you face
you are forgiven on this day"
He got off quite easily, dont ya think? :lol
First off I would like to thank Amazon for delivering this YESTERDAY!!!
I have been begging for two things from a DT album:
1. Way more piano
2. Allowing James to go off
This album does both!
I totally agree with number 2, but for number 1...
I'm more of a Petrucci person. I wish their were more guitar solos than piano. My opinion though.
That's true. Also whatever happened to Nafaryus anyway? Did he die? I didn't really understand what happened to him at the end.Story question/critisism:Yes, almost not making sense at all. One thing that disappoint me about the story in The Astonishing
Okey, correct me if Im wrong.
So, Daryus kidnapped Xander and threatened to kill him if Arhys didn`t bring him Gabriel. Daryus kills Arhys and almost kills his sister.
In "Astonishing", Arabelle sings:
" My prince, my son
You got lost along the way
In light of this new burden that you face
you are forgiven on this day"
He got off quite easily, dont ya think? :lol
There is no an actual fight and war between The Great Northern Empire and Ravenskill Rebel Militia. From the begining, they made us think there will be a big war between TGNEA and Ravenskill, you can see it in trailer, but then what we got?
I think it will be great if there is a war between Empire Guards and Ravenskill troop before finally story of Walking Shadow Start.
Disc 2 must have more song to tell story about war, The Astonishing must have 20 track each Disk, hahaha ;D
Sorry for my bad english
That's true. Also whatever happened to Nafaryus anyway? Did he die? I didn't really understand what happened to him at the end.Story question/critisism:Yes, almost not making sense at all. One thing that disappoint me about the story in The Astonishing
Okey, correct me if Im wrong.
So, Daryus kidnapped Xander and threatened to kill him if Arhys didn`t bring him Gabriel. Daryus kills Arhys and almost kills his sister.
In "Astonishing", Arabelle sings:
" My prince, my son
You got lost along the way
In light of this new burden that you face
you are forgiven on this day"
He got off quite easily, dont ya think? :lol
There is no an actual fight and war between The Great Northern Empire and Ravenskill Rebel Militia. From the begining, they made us think there will be a big war between TGNEA and Ravenskill, you can see it in trailer, but then what we got?
I think it will be great if there is a war between Empire Guards and Ravenskill troop before finally story of Walking Shadow Start.
Disc 2 must have more song to tell story about war, The Astonishing must have 20 track each Disk, hahaha ;D
Sorry for my bad english
Since that, all people who gonna die, come to gabriel for more life. And Gabriel become a magic doctor rather than a SaviorOkay what is this "gift" Gabriel has? Am I dumb?
He can ressurect people by singing ;D
I can hear something weird in the end of the vocals on A Tempting Offer. What is that sound James is making? Is it some weird editing? Sound like he's saying: take the evening to decide... ivdsh
Did anyone else hear this?
I can hear something weird in the end of the vocals on A Tempting Offer. What is that sound James is making? Is it some weird editing? Sound like he's saying: take the evening to decide... ivdsh
Did anyone else hear this?
Sounds like a serious mistake in the editing stage. How didn't anyone noticed this?
Thats why we need more song in disc 2, to explain everything. I agree with them who said Disc 2 end quickly :-\That's true. Also whatever happened to Nafaryus anyway? Did he die? I didn't really understand what happened to him at the end.Story question/critisism:Yes, almost not making sense at all. One thing that disappoint me about the story in The Astonishing
Okey, correct me if Im wrong.
So, Daryus kidnapped Xander and threatened to kill him if Arhys didn`t bring him Gabriel. Daryus kills Arhys and almost kills his sister.
In "Astonishing", Arabelle sings:
" My prince, my son
You got lost along the way
In light of this new burden that you face
you are forgiven on this day"
He got off quite easily, dont ya think? :lol
There is no an actual fight and war between The Great Northern Empire and Ravenskill Rebel Militia. From the begining, they made us think there will be a big war between TGNEA and Ravenskill, you can see it in trailer, but then what we got?
I think it will be great if there is a war between Empire Guards and Ravenskill troop before finally story of Walking Shadow Start.
Disc 2 must have more song to tell story about war, The Astonishing must have 20 track each Disk, hahaha ;D
Sorry for my bad english
I am starting to think that JP may actually have bigger plans for this one because one does not just write a real rock opera if there is no intention for it to be staged as one.
We're still yet to see how it's presented live. For all we know, JLB will have 56 costume changes during the show. :P
DAT OUTRO SOLO :metal
PS: A New Beginning just kicked in, DAT RIFF :metal
JLB is such a beast.
New update from Website !!
Place are unlocked !!
New update from Website !!
Place are unlocked !!
And there's also the other video... but it looks like the same as the first trailer? ???
https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks
(https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks)
The song explanations are up!
https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks
(https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks)
The song explanations are up!
The very soul of what was once real music is now lost in a digital quagmire of emotionless sonic madness.OOOOOOH SHOTS FIRED
Calvin?yes?
I've just begun my first listen. I prefer to wait until the early evening and settle down to the whole thing, for my first go at an album. This moment. I have been waiting months for this, and now it's happening. Loving reading everyone's first impressions here. :tup
The opening guitar in Heaven's Cove sounds a LOT like the opening guitar in On the Backs of Angels.
I noticed it but I figured I wouldn't spoil it for anyone else, guess it's too late for that, can't unhear it either.I can hear something weird in the end of the vocals on A Tempting Offer. What is that sound James is making? Is it some weird editing? Sound like he's saying: take the evening to decide... ivdsh
Did anyone else hear this?
Sounds like a serious mistake in the editing stage. How didn't anyone noticed this?
It's so sad to know that such a big mistake will be there forever...
Where? I'm not seeing it.https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks
(https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks)
The song explanations are up!
Wow !!! It also have clearer GNEA map !!
The band should read the reviews at Amazon.
The band should read the reviews at Amazon.
The band should read the reviews at Amazon.
My local record shop had the new album stocked last night. Went out and bought it, but haven't had a chance to listen yet. Going for a run soon, likely going to put it on headphones. Is it good running music?If you pretend you're Nefaryus and listen to Three Days, then maybe.
The band should read the reviews at Amazon.
The band should read the reviews at Amazon.
Yikes. As a guitar player I'm starting to wonder if the good people at Mesa Boogie are starting to regret slapping a JP name tag (first time they ever did an "artist model" endorsement) on what might well be one of the best amps they ever made (I won't get into the technical details).
And while I kept thinking - wow, even harmonicas, whistling or an accordion couldn't make this any worse - on comes bag pipes. Bag pipes! :rollin
Why would they possibly regret a JP signature model amp after hearing TA? It has some of JP's best guitar work on it ever. Great chord structure, riffs, solos...This album is signature JP stuff.
The band should read the reviews at Amazon.
Yikes. As a guitar player I'm starting to wonder if the good people at Mesa Boogie are starting to regret slapping a JP name tag (first time they ever did an "artist model" endorsement) on what might well be one of the best amps they ever made (I won't get into the technical details).
And while I kept thinking - wow, even harmonicas, whistling or an accordion couldn't make this any worse - on comes bag pipes. Bag pipes! :rollin
The band should read the reviews at Amazon.
Yikes. As a guitar player I'm starting to wonder if the good people at Mesa Boogie are starting to regret slapping a JP name tag (first time they ever did an "artist model" endorsement) on what might well be one of the best amps they ever made (I won't get into the technical details).
And while I kept thinking - wow, even harmonicas, whistling or an accordion couldn't make this any worse - on comes bag pipes. Bag pipes! :rollin
The band should read the reviews at Amazon.
Yikes. As a guitar player I'm starting to wonder if the good people at Mesa Boogie are starting to regret slapping a JP name tag (first time they ever did an "artist model" endorsement) on what might well be one of the best amps they ever made (I won't get into the technical details).
And while I kept thinking - wow, even harmonicas, whistling or an accordion couldn't make this any worse - on comes bag pipes. Bag pipes! :rollin
Why would they possibly regret a JP signature model amp after hearing TA? It has some of JP's best guitar work on it ever. Great chord structure, riffs, solos...This album is signature JP stuff.
Why would they possibly regret a JP signature model amp after hearing TA? It has some of JP's best guitar work on it ever. Great chord structure, riffs, solos...This album is signature JP stuff.
Imagine being a TAMA executive and hearing St. Anger.
(https://www.dreamtheater.net/sites/g/files/g2000005396/f/201601/MAP_1400.jpg)Where? I'm not seeing it.https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks
(https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks)
The song explanations are up!
Wow !!! It also have clearer GNEA map !!
The opening guitar in Heaven's Cove sounds a LOT like the opening guitar in On the Backs of Angels.
Why would they possibly regret a JP signature model amp after hearing TA? It has some of JP's best guitar work on it ever. Great chord structure, riffs, solos...This album is signature JP stuff.
Imagine being a TAMA executive and hearing St. Anger.
I was right. Or actually not: this is even worse than expected. The issue with this "concept" was already clear. and now there is the music to go with it. Yikes.
I never liked Scenes from a Memory because of the ridiculous concept/movie theme, but it had at least a few good songs. This thing however? Somebody please tell Petrucci to get off his high horse. And please send Jordan Rudass packing.
I'll happily be listening to Awake on my way home from work today instead of hitting the record store. This band is done it seems. At least artistically.
Having had several listens to this point, this album is very much a Rock Opera and not something I can compare to a 'concept album.' Calling it a concept invokes comparison to SFAM and Operation Mindcrime etc. Do that and this album fails miserably. I love the freshness of style in several places, and I applaud any band that does what it wants, but this is the hardest material to enjoy for me personally. This album sounds like the cast and crew of The Rocky Horror Picture Show and members of Symphony X had an ugly lovechild. There are painfully cheesy sections scattered across what sounds like a longwinded ballad. To care about the story I have to care about the songs, and sadly I can't connect to it. Perhaps it will grow in some sections, but for now "Moment of Betrayal" is the only 'song' I enjoy. Looking forward to the next album so I can put this one behind. I hope I like it more live since I already have tickets, but whatever this is just isn't my thing. It's cool that so many here are enjoying it though. A band like DT can't be summed up in a single album or style really so opinions will always be heavily divided. I joined these forums when Mangini joined the band (I am a longtime fan of his), but the last 2 albums really have me missing the Portnoy era of 2003-2009. There is less of a song focus and more of a technical focus that felt more balanced in the past.
Perfect! Thanks. Do we have higher res pictures of the characters and places too?(https://www.dreamtheater.net/sites/g/files/g2000005396/f/201601/MAP_1400.jpg)Where? I'm not seeing it.https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks
(https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks)
The song explanations are up!
Wow !!! It also have clearer GNEA map !!
The map published by F.E STANHOPE & CO
Who are they?
EDIT : Spoke too soon. Nomac eyes still do diddly squat :lolI KNEW IT!
(https://i.imgur.com/zrbawum.png?2)
No, but we have full body of them along with the explanation about who are they. Just click character in website astonishing ;DPerfect! Thanks. Do we have higher res pictures of the characters and places too?(https://www.dreamtheater.net/sites/g/files/g2000005396/f/201601/MAP_1400.jpg)Where? I'm not seeing it.https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks
(https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks)
The song explanations are up!
Wow !!! It also have clearer GNEA map !!
The map published by F.E STANHOPE & CO
Who are they?
I appreciate the band taking big risks and doing something different...I just would rather hear songs that stand on their own that aren't part of a concept. This is coming from a guy that loved Scenes, Six Degrees, and Savatage albums like Dead Winter Dead and The Wake of Magellan.
I doubt that I've ever heard anything as cheesy as the story behind The Astonishing.
It's pretty good musically though, only a little too ballad-heavy for me. A New Beginning, Three Days, Moment of Betrayal and Our New World are tentative favourites, but I'm sure that will change with subsequent listens.
The story though... not a big fan of it.
My Last Farewell - A SHREDDING RUDESS SPOTTED :rollin \m/
Yup. Those were helpful in understanding the characters and their relationships to others.No, but we have full body of them along with the explanation about who are they. Just click character in website astonishing ;DPerfect! Thanks. Do we have higher res pictures of the characters and places too?*snip*Where? I'm not seeing it.https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks
(https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks)
The song explanations are up!
Wow !!! It also have clearer GNEA map !!
The map published by F.E STANHOPE & CO
Who are they?
I don't want to sound like a teenager on twitter ...but Our New World is actually perfect :lol
Oh My Gosh. :'( :'( :'( :'(
Yes, they have it, but not upload it, or yetYup. Those were helpful in understanding the characters and their relationships to others.No, but we have full body of them along with the explanation about who are they. Just click character in website astonishing ;DPerfect! Thanks. Do we have higher res pictures of the characters and places too?*snip*Where? I'm not seeing it.https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks
(https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks)
The song explanations are up!
Wow !!! It also have clearer GNEA map !!
The map published by F.E STANHOPE & CO
Who are they?
I know there must be hi-res pictures of the characters because when they were revealed on their Instagram, they were just a small snippet of the larger one.
Hopefully, they'll show up soon, along with the places - (Although we do have one of Heaven's Cove - didn't know that is what it's called at the time)
I appreciate the band taking big risks and doing something different...I just would rather hear songs that stand on their own that aren't part of a concept. This is coming from a guy that loved Scenes, Six Degrees, and Savatage albums like Dead Winter Dead and The Wake of Magellan.
This is how I feel as well, and one of the reasons I had some trepidation about this album. SFAM for example, while it has a couple of tracks basically useless as stand alones (Regression, Through My Words) and a couple I'd probably only listen to as part of the full album (One Last Time, Through Her Eyes), it also has songs that are perfectly great to listen to on their own. Strange Deja Vu and Fatal Tragedy at worst have endings that lead into the next song but are still standouts on their own, and Beyond This Life and Home stand up among DT's best songs whether you listen to them alone or in the album. With so many tracks, including such short songs and songs very much there to provide information about the story, I wasn't sure whether there would be many songs that would hold up well on their own. A 2+ hour continuous listen with a story is good too, but I'd love it if the songs worked in both contexts.
Hearing the album, I think my concerns were definitely warranted, but there are definitely some good songs there so it will take a lot more listens to see where the album stands.
I've only listened once so far, but I'm lukewarm on the album. From a 'rock opera' point of view, it's very well arranged and the story explanations by track on the Astonishing website make it easy to follow the story. I just feel as though there aren't many great songs that stick out musically, in my opinion, except for maybe "Moment of Betrayal" and "Three Days".
I definitely don't love Our New World as much as a lot of people seem to.
Thanks for the heads up.. I don't have a computer at the moment, just a Android phone. I have to wait for the cd next Friday. There are no best buys in my area and I seriously doubt Wal-Mart will have it. My local record store is only open Thursday through Saturday..lame!I have to agree... these songs put the previous album to shame.Wow, that is saying alot! I love DT 12 probably more than most on this forum. I have to wait another week to hear TA, my local record store forgot to order it and I requested it a week ago..
I reccommend getting it on HDtracks.com!
Our new World reminds me a lot of Rush, more so than any other single DT song. I'm surprised that nobody made that remark yet.No way, not as much as The Best of Times or The Looking Glass.
Our new World reminds me a lot of Rush, more so than any other single DT song. I'm surprised that nobody made that remark yet.
lol I was just trying to get that last image myself and I came here to see it. How did you get it ?All you have to do is playing with page source :tup ;D
Thanks a bunch, pringkaarwanda! That is awesome. I know there are others here that appreciate this too.You're welcome my brother !! :tup ;D
Our new World reminds me a lot of Rush, more so than any other single DT song. I'm surprised that nobody made that remark yet.No way, not as much as The Best of Times or The Looking Glass.
OH AND ALSO, I remember the other thing that bugs me. **SPOILERS** The placement of Machine Chatter is really bizarre. I need to read those detailed explanations on the official website, but it seems really weird how Daryus kills Arhys, then there's a minute of NOMAC noise, and *then* Xander gets angry at Daryus.
Since the album is not quite gapless - you could almost re-sequence the album in a playlist to your liking :)Oh for sure - I also considered whether I should just scrap the title track and have it as a separate song. But I do prefer to listen to albums as the artist intends them, so I don't think I will.
I cannot pick a single favourite individual track. There are so many. I've lost track of how many times I've got goosebumps over the last 2 hours or so. Dream Theater have done it again.
I cannot pick a single favourite individual track. There are so many. I've lost track of how many times I've got goosebumps over the last 2 hours or so. Dream Theater have done it again.
One thing I'm really digging about the album is the effort they put into making the music fit the narrative. Fantastic example being the start of A Tempting Offer: it starts with a sweet, innocent piano melody to signify X walking along unknowingly, and then kicks into the same motif in a really dark riff to signify Daryus following behind. Really nicely done, and there are a bunch of moments like that.
One thing I'm really digging about the album is the effort they put into making the music fit the narrative. Fantastic example being the start of A Tempting Offer: it starts with a sweet, innocent piano melody to signify X walking along unknowingly, and then kicks into the same motif in a really dark riff to signify Daryus following behind. Really nicely done, and there are a bunch of moments like that.
That might be my favorite thing about it. I know I keep seeing it get thrown around as both a positive and negative criticism, but I love how it transpires just like a musical.
Trivial, but I encountered a 'hiccup' when transferring the download to disc: Act 1 would not fit ?!?!? I checked for errors on my part, compared the times, and then used Excel to total the time. Well, it is not 78:59, but 79:59. I had to go back through and remove little bits of silence at the end of various tracks. Then breathed a sigh of relief. Wish I was younger, I'd have lit one up for the listen.
One thing I'm really digging about the album is the effort they put into making the music fit the narrative. Fantastic example being the start of A Tempting Offer: it starts with a sweet, innocent piano melody to signify X walking along unknowingly, and then kicks into the same motif in a really dark riff to signify Daryus following behind. Really nicely done, and there are a bunch of moments like that.
That might be my favorite thing about it. I know I keep seeing it get thrown around as both a positive and negative criticism, but I love how it transpires just like a musical.
It doesn't bother me in the slightest that it's not a traditional "album" per se.
I don't know how well received it will be with Joe Public - but i hope it does well for the band. I'd hate for it to die on it's arse sales wise.
Our new World reminds me a lot of Rush, more so than any other single DT song. I'm surprised that nobody made that remark yet.No way, not as much as The Best of Times or The Looking Glass.
Perfect! Thanks. Do we have higher res pictures of the characters and places too?
:facepalm: My brain failed to dig up Looking Glass as I was recalling past Rush similarities. I guess this shows how little I have listened to DT12 over the past two years.Our new World reminds me a lot of Rush, more so than any other single DT song. I'm surprised that nobody made that remark yet.No way, not as much as The Best of Times or The Looking Glass.
One thing I'm really digging about the album is the effort they put into making the music fit the narrative. Fantastic example being the start of A Tempting Offer: it starts with a sweet, innocent piano melody to signify X walking along unknowingly, and then kicks into the same motif in a really dark riff to signify Daryus following behind. Really nicely done, and there are a bunch of moments like that.
That might be my favorite thing about it. I know I keep seeing it get thrown around as both a positive and negative criticism, but I love how it transpires just like a musical.
It doesn't bother me in the slightest that it's not a traditional "album" per se.
I don't know how well received it will be with Joe Public - but i hope it does well for the band. I'd hate for it to die on it's arse sales wise.
That's where I stand. I mean, a band like DT doesn't really rely on album sales anyways, so it isn't like I expect the world to come crashing down and them cancel the tour, but I won't lie when I say that I'm glad that the concerts have been on sale for quite awhile before people heard the album.
Thoughts, everyone ?
1. Best album of the Mangini era.
2. Best album of the Road Runner era.
3. Both ?
Thoughts, everyone ?
1. Best album of the Mangini era.
2. Best album of the Road Runner era.
3. Both ?
4. Best album of their career? :corn
I think it's their best album since Systematic Chaos, by a considerable margin. I'm not yet sure where it ranks, but it's top 4.
Thoughts, everyone ?
1. Best album of the Mangini era.
2. Best album of the Road Runner era.
3. Both ?
4. Best album of their career? :corn
Whoaa !!! Thanks a lot brother !!! :tupPerfect! Thanks. Do we have higher res pictures of the characters and places too?
You can find them on the artist's site here:https://www.artstation.com/artwork/BvaXz (https://www.artstation.com/artwork/BvaXz)
And the hi-res version of the cover check here: https://www.artstation.com/artwork/K13BR (https://www.artstation.com/artwork/K13BR)
This is one of DT's most consistently good releases. It's ridiculous how everything feels in place.
This is one of DT's most consistently good releases. It's ridiculous how everything feels in place.
Not digging this yet. Where's the metal? I wasn't expecting a whole album full of slow to mid tempo ballads
Btw, 'Begin Again', big Christmas vibe at the end lol
Btw, 'Begin Again', big Christmas vibe at the end lol
Neither. For me this doesn't stack up to my top tier of DT albums (Six Degrees, I&W and ADTOE). Bit hard to tell at this stage, but I can see if settling in my second tier, along with Awake, FII and Black Clouds.
Thoughts, everyone ?
1. Best album of the Mangini era.
2. Best album of the Road Runner era.
3. Both ?
Btw, 'Begin Again', big Christmas vibe at the end lol
That's the part a friend and me like to call 'the Disney theme'. It's amazing, and it puts a big big smile on my face.
Btw, 'Begin Again', big Christmas vibe at the end lol
I think we can agree that there's lot of Disney in here, and makes sense given JP just told in his reddit answers that he's a sucker for Disney movies. :DYeah but the most Disney song is definitely The Answer.
Thoughts, everyone ?
1. Best album of the Mangini era.
2. Best album of the Road Runner era.
3. Both ?
4. Best album of their career? :corn
NO WAY MAN SYSTEMATIC CHAOS HAD GROTESQUE CREATURES BATTLE
I'm probably more of a metalhead than...3/4 of the users here, and I don't really understand the "TA has no metal!" outcry (from the few with that viewpoint). JP has so many huge riffs, and MM's drums make much more of a metallic impact than they do on the previous two releases. Almost every song hits on metallic territory at some point, and it's always memorable when it goes there. I'll take that all day in comparison to the hit-or-miss riffing and oft-directionless soloing of the post-MP era.
I mean, there's metal sprinkled here and there but for the most part it's almost entirely absent. It's very orchestra based and light; you can have huge riffs and metal-oriented drums and still not be metal. I don't see the 'little-to-no-metal' thing as bad though. They've more than established themselves as being able to do both straight up metal along with prog-metal so I'm absolutely all for this kind of music. I don't think there is zero metal but I can't see how anyone would say it's not extremely light on metal.
I really don't agree that the metal is absent... at all. I'm completely with Frenemies on this one. To me there's at least as much "metal" as there is "ballad", yet a small number of people have been bemoaning there being too little of the former and too much of the latter. I don't get it.I'm probably more of a metalhead than...3/4 of the users here, and I don't really understand the "TA has no metal!" outcry (from the few with that viewpoint). JP has so many huge riffs, and MM's drums make much more of a metallic impact than they do on the previous two releases. Almost every song hits on metallic territory at some point, and it's always memorable when it goes there. I'll take that all day in comparison to the hit-or-miss riffing and oft-directionless soloing of the post-MP era.
I mean, there's metal sprinkled here and there but for the most part it's almost entirely absent. It's very orchestra based and light; you can have huge riffs and metal-oriented drums and still not be metal. I don't see the 'little-to-no-metal' thing as bad though. They've more than established themselves as being able to do both straight up metal along with prog-metal so I'm absolutely all for this kind of music. I don't think there is zero metal but I can't see how anyone would say it's not extremely light on metal.
4. Best album of their career? :corn
NO WAY MAN SYSTEMATIC CHAOS HAD GROTESQUE CREATURES BATTLE
The drums that go with JP's solo in the ending of "A New Beginning" could be a bit more varied, and when i say a bit i mean A LOT. They drums are so simple on that part, good drumming on that solo would elevate the song to the next level.
The drums that go with JP's solo in the ending of "A New Beginning" could be a bit more varied, and when i say a bit i mean A LOT. They drums are so simple on that part, good drumming on that solo would elevate the song to the next level.
:omg: Are you joking ? They work BECAUSE they're so simple. :lol
The drums that go with JP's solo in the ending of "A New Beginning" could be a bit more varied, and when i say a bit i mean A LOT. They drums are so simple on that part, good drumming on that solo would elevate the song to the next level.
:omg: Are you joking ? They work BECAUSE they're so simple. :lol
The moral of the story: if Faythe hadn't had her headphones in, then Nafaryus would still be a dickhole of a leader.
I agree that it works, but i do miss a bit more variety, not necessarily meaning more complexity. Just my opinion.The drums that go with JP's solo in the ending of "A New Beginning" could be a bit more varied, and when i say a bit i mean A LOT. They drums are so simple on that part, good drumming on that solo would elevate the song to the next level.
:omg: Are you joking ? They work BECAUSE they're so simple. :lol
Yeah definitely agree with you here. The simplicity really stuck out and I thought it was very well done.
I agree that it works, but i do miss a bit more variety, not necessarily meaning more complexity. Just one more beat (or something like that, i'm not a drummer) every time X part is repeated 3 times in a row exactly the same, for example. Just my opinion.The drums that go with JP's solo in the ending of "A New Beginning" could be a bit more varied, and when i say a bit i mean A LOT. They drums are so simple on that part, good drumming on that solo would elevate the song to the next level.
:omg: Are you joking ? They work BECAUSE they're so simple. :lol
Yeah definitely agree with you here. The simplicity really stuck out and I thought it was very well done.
If all you want is BALLS and SHREDDING and BLASTBEATS you will be left wanting.
If you're after actual songs and melody and music and emotions by the bucketload - welcome aboard ! :)
If all you want is BALLS and SHREDDING and BLASTBEATS you will be left wanting.Exactly why I LOVE this album so much.
If you're after actual songs and melody and music and emotions by the bucketload - welcome aboard ! :)
The drums that go with JP's solo in the ending of "A New Beginning" could be a bit more varied, and when i say a bit i mean A LOT. They drums are so simple on that part, good drumming on that solo would elevate the song to the next level.
:omg: Are you joking ? They work BECAUSE they're so simple. :lol
If all you want is BALLS and SHREDDING and BLASTBEATS you will be left wanting.
If you're after actual songs and melody and music and emotions by the bucketload - welcome aboard ! :)
Yep. I play drums/percussion, and I wouldn't change a single thing Mangini does in that section. He has lots of other places to do more detailed things.The drums that go with JP's solo in the ending of "A New Beginning" could be a bit more varied, and when i say a bit i mean A LOT. They drums are so simple on that part, good drumming on that solo would elevate the song to the next level.
:omg: Are you joking ? They work BECAUSE they're so simple. :lol
Couldn't agree more with this!! Also, being a bass player. Thank goodness JMX didn't go crazy here! The constant groove that they carve out makes the guitar solo and jazzy chords work perfectly...IMO! I wanted 10 more minutes of it though.
Story question/critisism:
Okey, correct me if Im wrong.
So, Daryus kidnapped Xander and threatened to kill him if Arhys didn`t bring him Gabriel. Daryus kills Arhys and almost kills his sister.
In "Astonishing", Arabelle sings:
" My prince, my son
You got lost along the way
In light of this new burden that you face
you are forgiven on this day"
He got off quite easily, dont ya think? :lol
Yep. I play drums/percussion, and I wouldn't change a single thing Mangini does in that section. He has lots of other places to do more detailed things.The drums that go with JP's solo in the ending of "A New Beginning" could be a bit more varied, and when i say a bit i mean A LOT. They drums are so simple on that part, good drumming on that solo would elevate the song to the next level.
:omg: Are you joking ? They work BECAUSE they're so simple. :lol
Couldn't agree more with this!! Also, being a bass player. Thank goodness JMX didn't go crazy here! The constant groove that they carve out makes the guitar solo and jazzy chords work perfectly...IMO! I wanted 10 more minutes of it though.
Ok, everyone is welcome to their opinion but to actually say that there are no songs on TA is pretty ridiculous.
Ok, everyone is welcome to their opinion but to actually say that there are no songs on TA is pretty ridiculous.
MY TA CDS ARE BLANK!
Agree with you 110%. Not suer why they wouldnt love having the JP Signature Mesa....The band should read the reviews at Amazon.
Yikes. As a guitar player I'm starting to wonder if the good people at Mesa Boogie are starting to regret slapping a JP name tag (first time they ever did an "artist model" endorsement) on what might well be one of the best amps they ever made (I won't get into the technical details).
And while I kept thinking - wow, even harmonicas, whistling or an accordion couldn't make this any worse - on comes bag pipes. Bag pipes! :rollin
Why would they possibly regret a JP signature model amp after hearing TA? It has some of JP's best guitar work on it ever. Great chord structure, riffs, solos...This album is signature JP stuff.
If all you want is BALLS and SHREDDING and BLASTBEATS you will be left wanting.
If you're after actual songs and melody and music and emotions by the bucketload - welcome aboard ! :)
what's the most 'most sing-a-longable' song in your opinion?
Act of faythe for me, can't stop :hefdaddy
mathewmatt summed it up about as well as I could.
Note....anyone notice 'Tempus Fugit' at the beginning of 'A Life Left Behind'?
(if it's been mentioned, my apologies)
mathewmatt summed it up about as well as I could.
Note....anyone notice 'Tempus Fugit' at the beginning of 'A Life Left Behind'?
(if it's been mentioned, my apologies)
Tempus Fugit? I hear it now, interesting, but I thought more of The Dregs.
Kink.
Giggity.
If all you want is BALLS and SHREDDING and BLASTBEATS you will be left wanting.
If you're after actual songs and melody and music and emotions by the bucketload - welcome aboard ! :)
If all you want is BALLS and SHREDDING and BLASTBEATS you will be left wanting.These songs aren't as catchy and don;t stand nearly as well on their own IMO. I will give it a 2nd and 3rd listen and I expect to like it better...I just hope that I like it a lot better than I did on the 1st listen.
If you're after actual songs and melody and music and emotions by the bucketload - welcome aboard ! :)
Yep. I play drums/percussion, and I wouldn't change a single thing Mangini does in that section. He has lots of other places to do more detailed things.The drums that go with JP's solo in the ending of "A New Beginning" could be a bit more varied, and when i say a bit i mean A LOT. They drums are so simple on that part, good drumming on that solo would elevate the song to the next level.
:omg: Are you joking ? They work BECAUSE they're so simple. :lol
Couldn't agree more with this!! Also, being a bass player. Thank goodness JMX didn't go crazy here! The constant groove that they carve out makes the guitar solo and jazzy chords work perfectly...IMO! I wanted 10 more minutes of it though.
Exactly...I'm glad they were disciplined here.There are many other places for 'flash', especially earlier in the same song! It's such a great piece!!
What the hell is happen with second video in Astonishing Website !!???
We wait for a long time for second video unlocked, and when they unlocked it, they just put the same video there !???
I've been try to refresh that page for almost 20 hour to see if the update the page and put a true second video, but it zero !! :facepalm: :'(
What the hell is happen with second video in Astonishing Website !!???
We wait for a long time for second video unlocked, and when they unlocked it, they just put the same video there !???
I've been try to refresh that page for almost 20 hour to see if the update the page and put a true second video, but it zero !! :facepalm: :'(
AND WHAT DO THE CLICKABLE EYES DO
Mangini's drumming is amazing on this record.
Also this is awesome:
The scream shatters the prince’s eardrums causing irreversible nerve damage and rendering him hearing-less. He is now doomed to live inside of his own soundless prison with the rest of his lifetime left to lament in a barren wasteland of silence over his despicable actions.
This is cheesy as hell, but when Faythe found the music player and had a life changing moment, I went "I can totally understand you!" I have my earphones on at least four hours a day and I get the metaphor of the music player being some sort of haven. Anybody else had this cheesy reaction? :lolYou're not the only one. Cheesy yes, but also very relatable in the current day world.
Mangini's drumming is amazing on this record.
Also this is awesome:
The scream shatters the prince’s eardrums causing irreversible nerve damage and rendering him hearing-less. He is now doomed to live inside of his own soundless prison with the rest of his lifetime left to lament in a barren wasteland of silence over his despicable actions.
Its all on the mini site! https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks
So that was the fate of Daryus. Freaking HD Tracks only has the front cover PDF in the download.
This is cheesy as hell, but when Faythe found the music player and had a life changing moment, I went "I can totally understand you!" I have my earphones on at least four hours a day and I get the metaphor of the music player being some sort of haven. Anybody else had this cheesy reaction? :lolYou're not the only one. Cheesy yes, but also very relatable in the current day world.
I just notice something annoying me when I check The Astonishing Artwork from Jie Ma
When I look at Daryus face, its feel like different, and I found my feeling is true !!!! Hahaha
So, did Daryus have plastic surgery so his face got more handsomeness now?? Hahahaha :rollin
From left is Old Daryus and from right is New Daryus :lol
(https://i.imgur.com/4oTmcLM.jpg)
Here is what I like about this album: never in a million years would I seek out this kind of music on my own. I don't watch musicals or listen to opera. DT has really exposed me to (dare I say it!) a new world of music.
I doubt DT will ever read this post, but if they do, I sincerely thank you.
I said it before it was released, and I'll say it again...having James sing all the characters was a mistake. I can't distinguish who is who. They should have called the album "Dream Theater presents The Astonishing" and brought in different singers for the different parts - that way it's not an "official" DT album, but still recognizes that the band was the source of the album.
I'm not knocking JLB's ability to sing, just the ability to sing so many distinct characters - something I wouldn't expect anyone to do effectively to be honest.
I said it before it was released, and I'll say it again...having James sing all the characters was a mistake. I can't distinguish who is who. They should have called the album "Dream Theater presents The Astonishing" and brought in different singers for the different parts - that way it's not an "official" DT album, but still recognizes that the band was the source of the album.
I'm not knocking JLB's ability to sing, just the ability to sing so many distinct characters - something I wouldn't expect anyone to do effectively to be honest.
But you can sort of distinguish the characters if you combine them with the musical themes of the characters:
Arhys - soaring rock oriented vocals; rock, prog, marching music
Gabriel - gentle airy vocals with some soaring vocals from time to time; mostly accompanied by acoustic guitar, and some melodic prog rock
Nafaryus - gruff vocals; heavy music with references to "older styles" of music (tango, jazz, swing)
Daryus - rough vocals; mostly metal
Faythe - very gentle and soft vocals; distinct piano melody
Ok, everyone is welcome to their opinion but to actually say that there are no songs on TA is pretty ridiculous.
The scream shatters the prince’s eardrums causing irreversible nerve damage and rendering him hearing-less. He is now doomed to live inside of his own soundless prison with the rest of his lifetime left to lament in a barren wasteland of silence over his despicable actions.
I said it before it was released, and I'll say it again...having James sing all the characters was a mistake. I can't distinguish who is who. They should have called the album "Dream Theater presents The Astonishing" and brought in different singers for the different parts - that way it's not an "official" DT album, but still recognizes that the band was the source of the album.
Just like 'lovethedrake' said 'On the first act I feel as though the album suffers a bit from the stretch of "Savior in the Square" to "Act of Faythe". Three songs of not much going on there. '
us
- Everyone is talking about the vibes the get from songs. I'm getting a MAJOR James Bond vibes from 3:12 to 3:30
I said it before it was released, and I'll say it again...having James sing all the characters was a mistake. I can't distinguish who is who. They should have called the album "Dream Theater presents The Astonishing" and brought in different singers for the different parts - that way it's not an "official" DT album, but still recognizes that the band was the source of the album.
No offence, but I personally would have hated that idea. Fine if it were like the minor work Theresa Thompson did on 'Through her Eyes' and 'TSCO' (actually, come to think of it i think there are some female vocals at the end of 'Act of Faythe'), but I think James does just
beautifully the way it is.
I am perfectly fine with JLB doing all of the vocals and characters. Given that he has appeared on an Ayreon album, having different vocalists for each character would have given it too much of a feel like that project. A guest vocalist, like on SFAM, would have been neat, but this is fine.
i haven't read the long story page but i'm about to and maybe that'll clear something up
Edit: This part of Dystopian Overture (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUayZvdXCaw&t=22s) is basically the theme from Luigi's Mansion (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHQ43ObPMHQ&t=10s)
I haven't had time to go through the whole thread, so, sorry if this has been mentioned.
I just noticed that the first minute=+ of "A Savior in the Square" is "Our new World". :eek
How the fuck is JLB going to pull The Path That Divides live?
I am perfectly fine with JLB doing all of the vocals and characters. Given that he has appeared on an Ayreon album, having different vocalists for each character would have given it too much of a feel like that project.
I am perfectly fine with JLB doing all of the vocals and characters. Given that he has appeared on an Ayreon album, having different vocalists for each character would have given it too much of a feel like that project.
Which is why I suggested DT not release it under the DT banner in my original post that was only partially quoted. If it was only two or three characters, ok. But eight is too many to distinguish. That's a big reason Ayreon and Avantasia are so digestable.
Just like 'lovethedrake' said 'On the first act I feel as though the album suffers a bit from the stretch of "Savior in the Square" to "Act of Faythe". Three songs of not much going on there. '
I said it before it was released, and I'll say it again...having James sing all the characters was a mistake. I can't distinguish who is who. They should have called the album "Dream Theater presents The Astonishing" and brought in different singers for the different parts - that way it's not an "official" DT album, but still recognizes that the band was the source of the album.
I'm not knocking JLB's ability to sing, just the ability to sing so many distinct characters - something I wouldn't expect anyone to do effectively to be honest.
Negative:
I wish i could like the album, but i can´t...all i hear is ballads alá The Spirit Carries On. I´m going to give it a couple of spins before a completly give up, but for now i´m very dissapointed.
Mangini´s playing doesn´t do it for me, always the same machine gun snare fills. His double kicks sometimes seems out of place and makes no sense. He´s a very skilled drummer though, but it feels too mechanical and stiff!
Positive:
It sounds great
Very smooth playing and solos from Petrucci, as always
Labrie haven´t sounded better, very diverse singing
Jordan is Jordan
I really hope this album grows into me, cause i´ve never experienced wanting to turn of an Dream Theater album halfway through before...been listening to them since they released Awake.
My spontanious feeling right now: I want Portnoy back...i really do
My one question is why did Gabriel save only Faythe and not Arhys too?
My one question is why did Gabriel save only Faythe and not Arhys too?
I said it before it was released, and I'll say it again...having James sing all the characters was a mistake. I can't distinguish who is who. They should have called the album "Dream Theater presents The Astonishing" and brought in different singers for the different parts - that way it's not an "official" DT album, but still recognizes that the band was the source of the album.
I'm not knocking JLB's ability to sing, just the ability to sing so many distinct characters - something I wouldn't expect anyone to do effectively to be honest.
I agree with Mason here. One of the things that detracts my enjoyment of the album is the fact the characters are indistinguishable for me without a lyric sheet. I mean, Nafaryus is perfectly distinguishable because he always has some crazy musical theme behind his parts, but that's about it.
Another thing is I felt the album was too bloated and I think this album didn't need to be over two hours long.
However, after two listens I think some parts are really fantastic, like Lord Nafaryus (I knew I would like this song when I heard the title :lol ) or Three Days, and some songs are also really good like Ravenskill and Moment of Betrayal, which works much much better in context of the album. On the other hand, the overture and the final song left me disappointed a bit.
Still, overall, might be the best album DT had since Systematic Chaos for me. Need to listen more to digest the whole thing.
I'm afraid I'm going to have to join the minority who don't like the album.
There's a real lack of actual songs here. They've let the story get in the way of the music. All I hear is a collection of unfinished song fragments, some of which are really good, but none of them are satisfying.
My one question is why did Gabriel save only Faythe and not Arhys too?
I don't think she was actually dead yet, but very close to it. Arhys was dead dead.
I think.
The band should read the reviews at Amazon.
Yikes. As a guitar player I'm starting to wonder if the good people at Mesa Boogie are starting to regret slapping a JP name tag (first time they ever did an "artist model" endorsement) on what might well be one of the best amps they ever made (I won't get into the technical details).
And while I kept thinking - wow, even harmonicas, whistling or an accordion couldn't make this any worse - on comes bag pipes. Bag pipes! :rollin
Why would they possibly regret a JP signature model amp after hearing TA? It has some of JP's best guitar work on it ever. Great chord structure, riffs, solos...This album is signature JP stuff.
Just a hunch. This album is going to go down as DT's "The Elder" or "Rock me tonight". And the fact that "Rolling Stone" likes it is more of an indicator since they're almost always wrong about everything.
A story point / question:
Does anyone else think it's strange Daryus has no presence after The Walking Shadow? Reading the lyrics while listening I was wondering if he died as well and I missed that somehow, as he has no lines and suddenly Gabriel and others are on the scene but there's no sense of danger that the guy that just killed and attacked people might do it again. But obviously he still seems to be about at the end based on the lyrics. Maybe he went into shock after stabbing his sister or something - would have been good to the get that across in the music if so.
Also, I seem to have a problem with the track descriptions (https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks/#cnt1) online (which I realise may contain the answer to my question), and I'm not sure if there's a issue with my browser or something, as the they appear to just cut off at the end. E.g. The Answer ends like:
"He embodies the very essence of promise and hope that the inhabitants of Ravenskill cling to and it is he whom they wholly place their belief in. They see"
And A Better Life ends like:
"Knowing that she would not survive the birth of their son and recounting the life of misery and misfortune she endured, he"
A story point / question:
Does anyone else think it's strange Daryus has no presence after The Walking Shadow? Reading the lyrics while listening I was wondering if he died as well and I missed that somehow, as he has no lines and suddenly Gabriel and others are on the scene but there's no sense of danger that the guy that just killed and attacked people might do it again. But obviously he still seems to be about at the end based on the lyrics. Maybe he went into shock after stabbing his sister or something - would have been good to the get that across in the music if so.
Also, I seem to have a problem with the track descriptions (https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks/#cnt1) online (which I realise may contain the answer to my question), and I'm not sure if there's a issue with my browser or something, as the they appear to just cut off at the end. E.g. The Answer ends like:
"He embodies the very essence of promise and hope that the inhabitants of Ravenskill cling to and it is he whom they wholly place their belief in. They see"
And A Better Life ends like:
"Knowing that she would not survive the birth of their son and recounting the life of misery and misfortune she endured, he"
i also wonder what song is very similar to Our New World
:tup. That is pretty cool, makes sense that something happened to him at that point. Thanks.A story point / question:
Does anyone else think it's strange Daryus has no presence after The Walking Shadow? Reading the lyrics while listening I was wondering if he died as well and I missed that somehow, as he has no lines and suddenly Gabriel and others are on the scene but there's no sense of danger that the guy that just killed and attacked people might do it again. But obviously he still seems to be about at the end based on the lyrics. Maybe he went into shock after stabbing his sister or something - would have been good to the get that across in the music if so.
Also, I seem to have a problem with the track descriptions (https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishingtracks/#cnt1) online (which I realise may contain the answer to my question), and I'm not sure if there's a issue with my browser or something, as the they appear to just cut off at the end. E.g. The Answer ends like:
"He embodies the very essence of promise and hope that the inhabitants of Ravenskill cling to and it is he whom they wholly place their belief in. They see"
And A Better Life ends like:
"Knowing that she would not survive the birth of their son and recounting the life of misery and misfortune she endured, he"
Daryus is in utter shock about what he has just done. Also the scream we hear at the end of My Last Farewell shatters his eardrums.
"Faythe is unaffected due to the protection of her earphones but Daryus is not so lucky. The scream shatters the prince’s eardrums causing irreversible nerve damage and rendering him hearing-less. He is now doomed to live inside of his own soundless prison with the rest of his lifetime left to lament in a barren wasteland of silence over his despicable actions."
Weird that your track explanations cut off...I can see them completely
I have the same problem with those song descriptions. I was just reading up on The Walking Shadow for the reason you described. It seems Gabriel let's out a huge scream that everyone can hear from afar (which brings Nafaryus and Arabelle to the scene), however Faythe doesn't hear it because of her headphones. Then it's says "But Daryus is not so lucky. The... (cuts off)" so I think he may get knocked out by the scream or something?Yeah, I didn't think there was much point in reading the track descriptions if I wasn't sure how much I was missing. Looks like it cuts off just as it gets to the part V_R11 described.
How the fuck is JLB going to pull The Path That Divides live?
I thought the same my first listen. He's gonna have to shorten the length of the last lines a lot?
The song currently stuck in my head is "A Better Life". I just love everything about it. Foot stomping rhythm in the verses, that solo!! I get chills every time the "Evangeline" bit kicks in. Just brilliant.
Also, I don't think anyone's mentioned any similarities with Les Mis, but that's what I'm reminded of when I hear Brother Can You Hear Me/Hymn Of A Thousand Voices. Specifically thinking of "Can you hear the people sing..." part if anyone knows it. I'm not saying it's musically similar of course, but it serves a similar purpose in the story. Like a call to arms, for the people to join together in revolution..
Anyway, total nonsense, but that's just what it conjured up in my mind.. :P
That must be some real good noise cancelling headphones she's got, to not hear Gabriel's scream.
There must just be a problem with my browser or something then if they work fine for some others. I am reading on a tablet at the moment so maybe that is causing problems. Will try to look at them again later on another device, and can hopefully catch the more of the additional context / explanation for events.Just to mention in case anyone else had the same experience with the track descriptions on the site, they are fine on my laptop.
clinks63 was here..
I am perfectly fine with JLB doing all of the vocals and characters. Given that he has appeared on an Ayreon album, having different vocalists for each character would have given it too much of a feel like that project.
Which is why I suggested DT not release it under the DT banner in my original post that was only partially quoted. If it was only two or three characters, ok. But eight is too many to distinguish. That's a big reason Ayreon and Avantasia are so digestable.
I like the link with all of the song descriptions, but in there somewhere online I can see all of the lyrics?
I would rather see DT try something different than do what everybody wants DT to do. People are so self important when it comes to their career. I hope their continue to strive for different.
I am perfectly fine with JLB doing all of the vocals and characters. Given that he has appeared on an Ayreon album, having different vocalists for each character would have given it too much of a feel like that project.
Which is why I suggested DT not release it under the DT banner in my original post that was only partially quoted. If it was only two or three characters, ok. But eight is too many to distinguish. That's a big reason Ayreon and Avantasia are so digestable.
I would rather see DT try something different than do what everybody wants DT to do. People are so self important when it comes to their career. I hope their continue to strive for different.
While it's looking more likely this isn't going to rank highly for me overall, I'm still happy they got so invested in an idea and did something very different for themselves.
The songs I like, I love, and can see myself listening to in future unlike anything from ADTOE and DT12, because they're different and unique. And sure, there are plenty of misses for me, but when you do something different, you're not going to please everyone. I'm fine with that. I hope that come next album, they continue to evolve and try new ideas, and maybe those ones will be more to my tastes.
But I won't criticize them for doing what they want and keeping it fresh.
In which moments can I hear Richard Chycki's speaking as Lord Nafaryus?
In which moments can I hear Richard Chycki's speaking as Lord Nafaryus?
Where was this mentioned?
In which moments can I hear Richard Chycki's speaking as Lord Nafaryus?
Where was this mentioned?
In which moments can I hear Richard Chycki's speaking as Lord Nafaryus?
Where was this mentioned?
The booklet, but I didn't notice it while listening.
I admittedly glossed over quite a few pages of this thread - too many to go through once I got home last night - but does anyone absolutely adore The Answer? That is one of the best songs under two minutes I've ever heard. Gorgeous little piece of music. :tup :tup
Yeah that's what someone was saying in the New Beginning thread, valid reason to trim except there were other places they could have trimmed IMO, they picked on the few "rockin'" moments to trim..
I admittedly glossed over quite a few pages of this thread - too many to go through once I got home last night - but does anyone absolutely adore The Answer? That is one of the best songs under two minutes I've ever heard. Gorgeous little piece of music. :tup :tup
Agreed. Less is more, in this case.
Also, I noticed a drop-off in quality in Act 2 on my first listen, almost like it reached the point of tedium since the songs all seemed to have a similar vibe, but we'll see if I still think after a few more listens (which only takes many more hours :lol :lol). I disagree with anyone who says this album doesn't have songs, though. Tons of really good ones in Act 1.
Going through the tracklist this could have been a spectacular 15 track album.
So that means we got about 15 great new DT songs so I am ecstatic but overall it sounds like a 34 song album that needed to be edited down a bit.
The frustrating thing are that there MOMENTS of absolute brilliance in every track, and James is literally the best I've ever heard him sing, but it just doesn't fit together very well.
The one elephant in the room here is that the ballads and slow songs are often just not very good...... if there were a bunch of "beneath the Surfaces, Waits for sleep, Anna Lees, or Dissappear's I don't think people would be complaining quite as much. They really do often come off as filler and just a means to tell the story. Although i do think a true metalhead would really struggle with this album regardless of how good the ballads were.
Its tough to stomach a 55 year old man singing disney songs despite how beautiful many of them are. I wish they would have gone for less sappy and more mystical on their ballads.
Going through the tracklist this could have been a spectacular 15 track album.
So that means we got about 15 great new DT songs so I am ecstatic but overall it sounds like a 34 song album that needed to be edited down a bit.
With all that said I have it ranked around 5th for DT which means it dethrones FII and I NEVER thought any of the classic era DT albums would get dethroned. So despite some of my complaints I am a truly satisfied customer and fan.
I have a musical question that bothers me
Does the tune from 3:25-3:41 in Dystopian Overture reappear somewhere in the album or am I just imagining it?
I have a musical question that bothers me
Does the tune from 3:25-3:41 in Dystopian Overture reappear somewhere in the album or am I just imagining it?
I gotta say the last two notes of The Decent of The NOMACs are EXACTLY what I thought the NOMAC would sound like before the album came out :lol
I can just imagine the floors of the venue trembling at that noise before the band comes in for the overture it will be a lot like Dream Collapsing/Bridges from the ADToE tour.
Could they have told the entire story on one single CD though? Or did the story warrant a double CD?
Thought I'd heard it. Thanks
Thought I'd heard it. Thanks
I call it the West Side Story section :D It's great.
PEOPLE OF DTF....
This is not a conventional record. This is unlike anything you have ever heard DT do before, ever. It is a ROCK OPERA.
A rock opera is a work of rock music that presents a storyline told over multiple parts, songs or sections; however, it is not an opera. A rock opera differs from a conventional rock album, which usually includes songs that are not unified by a common theme or narrative. It is even unlike a "concept album". So, when you think that "it's only fragments of songs", you would in fact be partially correct, because it is told in that vein as part of the narrative. Why? Because it is a ROCK OPERA.
Now, you don't have to like it. You may in fact hate it. But it is a ROCK OPERA done by the band, which again...is like NOTHING they have ever done in the past.
I know some of you still won't get this, but at least I hope this can put the record into perspective for some of you before you go trashing it or the band.
:metal
Wow I put this album on, with earphones and began cleaning the house. It's been transformed into the cleanest its ever been. Astonishing.
Where's the Heaven's Cove appreciation?
Wow I put this album on, with earphones and began cleaning the house. It's been transformed into the cleanest its ever been. Astonishing.
Where's the Heaven's Cove appreciation?
I just had an awesome workout listening at the gym. This cd will demand several listens. I like the idea of breaking it into sections when listening.
PEOPLE OF DTF....
This is not a conventional record. This is unlike anything you have ever heard DT do before, ever. It is a ROCK OPERA.
A rock opera is a work of rock music that presents a storyline told over multiple parts, songs or sections; however, it is not an opera. A rock opera differs from a conventional rock album, which usually includes songs that are not unified by a common theme or narrative. It is even unlike a "concept album". SFaM was a concept album. This is not. So, when you think that "it's only fragments of songs", you would in fact be partially correct, because it is told in that vein as part of the narrative. Why? Because it is a ROCK OPERA.
Now, you don't have to like it. You may in fact hate it. But it is a ROCK OPERA done by the band, which again...is like NOTHING they have ever done in the past.
I know some of you still won't get this, but at least I hope this can put the record into perspective for some of you before you go trashing it or the band.
:metal
There is not second video...yet.
In which moments can I hear Richard Chycki's speaking as Lord Nafaryus?I guess its in Losing Faythe. You can hear a man and women cry in the first line, it must be Nafaryus & Arabelle :huh:
Music calmed your soul just lika a drug
Remember bug?
Father is it true
Bug was always you?
What is Bug :D is it Lord Nafaryus's band or sumthing... i'm so lost...
Music calmed your soul just lika a drug
Remember bug?
Father is it true
Bug was always you?
What is Bug :D is it Lord Nafaryus's band or sumthing... i'm so lost...
Music calmed your soul just lika a drug
Remember bug?
Father is it true
Bug was always you?
What is Bug :D is it Lord Nafaryus's band or sumthing... i'm so lost...
I didn't read the entire thread and I don't yet have the record. I'm curious though; given that I'm more a fan of DT's heavier, metal aspects, will this record do anything for me?
But i don't understand this bit;
"Father is it true
Bug was always you?"
Where had Faythe heard about bug? :D I first understood that Faythe was listening to music made by BUG with the Ipod she had found.
And she was suprised that BUG was his father.
If you aren't a fan of the ballads or poppier songs at all, probably not much. Listen to it though, you may like it.I appreciate the info. I intend on buying the record regardless, but this sets me up nicely. I love the ballads, the pop stuff a bit less, but I should be OK with this one.
There's a scream at the end of "My Last Farewell" but I can't quite tell who's supposed to be screaming it. Is it Gabriel or Faythe?
-The scream: This is the only part of the album where I feel like they kind of "dropped the ball" on presenting the story. That scream is supposed to be something huge. And while James does it justice with his voice, this is the one area where I feel like some vocal effects were necessary to portray it as something truly otherworldly that deafened Daryus. Oh well.
-The scream: This is the only part of the album where I feel like they kind of "dropped the ball" on presenting the story. That scream is supposed to be something huge. And while James does it justice with his voice, this is the one area where I feel like some vocal effects were necessary to portray it as something truly otherworldly that deafened Daryus. Oh well.
I though about this too, but I think the irony would be that its a scream that's meant to damage his vocal cords, so JL may have opted to not damage his? Only explanation I could think of to spin it.
Btw, does this part from Dystopian Overture sound really familiar to anyone else:
https://vocaroo.com/i/s0WnqDoo2Pab (https://vocaroo.com/i/s0WnqDoo2Pab)
?
James wouldn't have to damage his, though. Like, they could use the same scream but just add effects to it to make it more powerful and dramatic.
-The scream: This is the only part of the album where I feel like they kind of "dropped the ball" on presenting the story. That scream is supposed to be something huge. And while James does it justice with his voice, this is the one area where I feel like some vocal effects were necessary to portray it as something truly otherworldly that deafened Daryus. Oh well.
I though about this too, but I think the irony would be that its a scream that's meant to damage his vocal cords, so JL may have opted to not damage his? Only explanation I could think of to spin it.
Man, I'm glad I didn't bank on getting this on Canadian Amazon. They still don't have a listing outside of a $190 vinyl "Import".Amazon is good for stuff that they already have lying around in their warehouse. I've had packages delivered to my door the day I ordered them, or on the weekends, but pre-ordering anything, you can flip a coin as to whether it will be delayed or not.
It's almost comical how little of a shit Amazon gives about the Canadian market.
Edit: It's not even a question of 'obscurity'. They have a prominent listing for Steven Wilson's new thing in New Releases.
I'm fine with DT staying away from satanic music like metal.
Yeah, I think I have to concur. Up until now he's merely been a disappointing reminder of what's lost. Now I'm considering him a detriment, despite perhaps being the most gifted one in an amazingly talented band.
I really don't want to harp on this too long, but yeah, I had the same thought when I was listening to the album. Especially for the softer sections, subtle, organic drumming would have been wondrous and added so much to the songs. But it just stays at the same "bup ... chick", the whole time.
Yes, because When Your Time Has Come and Act of Faythe has "bup...chick" drumming all over. Maybe I am just imagining all those ghost notes.
That's my experience with pre-ordering from them as well.Man, I'm glad I didn't bank on getting this on Canadian Amazon. They still don't have a listing outside of a $190 vinyl "Import".Amazon is good for stuff that they already have lying around in their warehouse. I've had packages delivered to my door the day I ordered them, or on the weekends, but pre-ordering anything, you can flip a coin as to whether it will be delayed or not.
It's almost comical how little of a shit Amazon gives about the Canadian market.
Edit: It's not even a question of 'obscurity'. They have a prominent listing for Steven Wilson's new thing in New Releases.
I'm loving Mangini's double hi-hat work is some of the mellow sections, e.g., Losing Faythe. This album just kills! Incredible work.The double hi-hat work is one of the things I love most about MM's playing in general.
I feel Myung isn't getting enough credit. He's in the groove, much like Mangini is in the beat. That's how a Bass and Drum duo should be.
I don't want to say that much right now apart an honorable mention to Ravenskill for having one of the most intense climax in a Dt song, ever.
All in all very strong melodies spread throughout the whole album.
Let's hope the Double Album curse won't strike Dt again, like what happened after SDOIT.
I feel Myung isn't getting enough credit. He's in the groove, much like Mangini is in the beat. That's how a Bass and Drum duo should be.
I agree. I can often clearly hear him on this album, which I wasn't expecting at all. Mangini's playing fits the music really well, I do not have a problem with the drum sound/"perfect" technical playing personally.
Could they have told the entire story on one single CD though? Or did the story warrant a double CD?
They could have done 3 CD's if they had jammed a bit more. Any less than 2 CD's and we just wouldn't have gotten the DT soul injected in there, not enough room for detail.
I don't want to say that much right now apart an honorable mention to Ravenskill for having one of the most intense climax in a Dt song, ever.
I feel Myung isn't getting enough credit. He's in the groove, much like Mangini is in the beat. That's how a Bass and Drum duo should be.
I agree. I can often clearly hear him on this album, which I wasn't expecting at all. Mangini's playing fits the music really well, I do not have a problem with the drum sound/"perfect" technical playing personally.
^^This. The bit that springs to mind is the outro of A New Beginning. JM/MM locking in a straight-ahead beat with JP's almost ad-libbed sounding solo bouncing around over the top. Very cool.
It will be interesting to see how they handle the fade-out live..
Just bought the album. I haven't listened yet, but it's already a 0/10 for being a digipak.
:P
Ihope for a JP extended solo section there with no fade out.
i would've actually preferred 3 CD's to two tbh becauseCould they have told the entire story on one single CD though? Or did the story warrant a double CD?
They could have done 3 CD's if they had jammed a bit more. Any less than 2 CD's and we just wouldn't have gotten the DT soul injected in there, not enough room for detail.
Actually I think 3 CDs would have been perfect, it would have allowed them to balance the narrative:music ratio more fairly and satisfactory for the fans who are taken aback by the lack of DT feel.
Even though this is not a 5.1 cd, I put the second disc in my player, found the setting I liked and cranked it. The dog was not too fond of the nomac tracks. They were freaking her out. Also, the bass was so loud a box fell off the amp and scared the shit out her.Ha! My Dog reacts to the Nomac tracks too. She raises and turns her head sideways with wide open eyes and perked up ears..
The sound was amazing and you could really hear that bass. I was in a rather large bonus room and I kind of got a feel of what this may sound like live.
For those that have only listened to once, give it another go.
Count me among those who view The Astonishing as DT’s best work of the RR era, maybe even since Six Degrees.
BUT there seems to be some baffling editing mistakes in Act 1.
Does anyone else notice that glitch in Petrucci’s legato run at 2:38 in A Better Life?
Is this just me?
Does anyone else notice that glitch in Petrucci’s legato run at 2:38 in A Better Life?
Is this just me?
It could actually go into 3 parts quite nicely too, as it only really has 3 proper "events" (or "scenes"? :P) with the rest being setting up or character reactions to those:i would've actually preferred 3 CD's to two tbh becauseCould they have told the entire story on one single CD though? Or did the story warrant a double CD?
They could have done 3 CD's if they had jammed a bit more. Any less than 2 CD's and we just wouldn't have gotten the DT soul injected in there, not enough room for detail.
Actually I think 3 CDs would have been perfect, it would have allowed them to balance the narrative:music ratio more fairly and satisfactory for the fans who are taken aback by the lack of DT feel.
1. the CD split is really lopsided as is
2. they probably had to cut down act 1 a bit to make it fit onto 1 CD
3. 80 minutes at once is still a loooong album even without the other 50 minutes of act 2
Wife is off with her friends for the afternoon! You mean I get over two hours home alone to listen to this on my big stereo? It's a freakin miracle!!! Let the one-man listening party begin! :metal :cornAwesome! The best way to listen to an album of this magnitude.. :hat
I don't want to say that much right now apart an honorable mention to Ravenskill for having one of the most intense climax in a Dt song, ever.
All in all very strong melodies spread throughout the whole album.
Let's hope the Double Album curse won't strike Dt again, like what happened after SDOIT.
What exactly is this curse? The two albums they released after SDOIT were some of their best.
Does anyone else notice that glitch in Petrucci’s legato run at 2:38 in A Better Life?
Is this just me?
Listened for it several times right now. All I hear is an amazing legato run :huh:
ninja'd by Logain :lol
Wife is off with her friends for the afternoon! You mean I get over two hours home alone to listen to this on my big stereo? It's a freakin miracle!!! Let the one-man listening party begin! :metal :cornAwesome! The best way to listen to an album of this magnitude.. :hat
That's my experience with pre-ordering from them as well.Man, I'm glad I didn't bank on getting this on Canadian Amazon. They still don't have a listing outside of a $190 vinyl "Import".Amazon is good for stuff that they already have lying around in their warehouse. I've had packages delivered to my door the day I ordered them, or on the weekends, but pre-ordering anything, you can flip a coin as to whether it will be delayed or not.
It's almost comical how little of a shit Amazon gives about the Canadian market.
Edit: It's not even a question of 'obscurity'. They have a prominent listing for Steven Wilson's new thing in New Releases.
In this case though, I mean they literally don't have a listing for this CD on their Canadian site. It's not just 'to be released' or 'out of stock'. It's not there at all. Fortunately, I decided to give my business to a local music shop instead.
Yep, me and a couple of others have said the same thing. Definitely should have been 3 acts.It could actually go into 3 parts quite nicely too, as it only really has 3 proper "events" (or "scenes"? :P) with the rest being setting up or character reactions to those:i would've actually preferred 3 CD's to two tbh becauseCould they have told the entire story on one single CD though? Or did the story warrant a double CD?
They could have done 3 CD's if they had jammed a bit more. Any less than 2 CD's and we just wouldn't have gotten the DT soul injected in there, not enough room for detail.
Actually I think 3 CDs would have been perfect, it would have allowed them to balance the narrative:music ratio more fairly and satisfactory for the fans who are taken aback by the lack of DT feel.
1. the CD split is really lopsided as is
2. they probably had to cut down act 1 a bit to make it fit onto 1 CD
3. 80 minutes at once is still a loooong album even without the other 50 minutes of act 2
Part 1 - Introduction and the meeting in the square (ends with Three Days)
Part 2 - Reaction to the meeting in the square, then the arrival of Faythe and Daryus in Ravenskill and the deals they attempt to strike there (ends with Road To Revolution, roughly)
Part 3 - The showdown at Heaven's Cove (essentially Act II as it is now)
Yep, me and a couple of others have said the same thing. Definitely should have been 3 acts.It could actually go into 3 parts quite nicely too, as it only really has 3 proper "events" (or "scenes"? :P) with the rest being setting up or character reactions to those:i would've actually preferred 3 CD's to two tbh becauseCould they have told the entire story on one single CD though? Or did the story warrant a double CD?
They could have done 3 CD's if they had jammed a bit more. Any less than 2 CD's and we just wouldn't have gotten the DT soul injected in there, not enough room for detail.
Actually I think 3 CDs would have been perfect, it would have allowed them to balance the narrative:music ratio more fairly and satisfactory for the fans who are taken aback by the lack of DT feel.
1. the CD split is really lopsided as is
2. they probably had to cut down act 1 a bit to make it fit onto 1 CD
3. 80 minutes at once is still a loooong album even without the other 50 minutes of act 2
Part 1 - Introduction and the meeting in the square (ends with Three Days)
Part 2 - Reaction to the meeting in the square, then the arrival of Faythe and Daryus in Ravenskill and the deals they attempt to strike there (ends with Road To Revolution, roughly)
Part 3 - The showdown at Heaven's Cove (essentially Act II as it is now)
The ending with "I am through with being pushed aside" gives me chills. It's such a powerful and evil piece. You can almost sympathize with Daryus' struggle (even though he's a dick), yet it lets you know things are gonna go real south real soon.Yeah, that ending is very chilling. Favoritism never seems to work out for everyone, so you can see after reading the information on the site why he feels the way he does. I can't justify his actions, though. :P
I overwhelmingly disagree with the "music player" part being cringeworthy.
Thinking about the context and what it means, makes full sense.
2 acts is because thats the broadway way...
I can't even imagine how dragged out a 3 Act version would be.
I admittedly glossed over quite a few pages of this thread - too many to go through once I got home last night - but does anyone absolutely adore The Answer? That is one of the best songs under two minutes I've ever heard. Gorgeous little piece of music. :tup :tup
Last night I listened to the music without reading along and my initial reaction was that Disc 1 was too Jordan-heavy and slow in spots with the piano intros and interludes, while Disc 2 really shined a lot more. Tonight I listened while reading the booklet dialogue as well as the track-by-track description on their website that sets the scene and plot, and I found myself enjoying it a whole lot more.
I admittedly glossed over quite a few pages of this thread - too many to go through once I got home last night - but does anyone absolutely adore The Answer? That is one of the best songs under two minutes I've ever heard. Gorgeous little piece of music. :tup :tup
I agree wholeheartedly Kev... I wrote a similar thing a couple of days (and many, many pages) back. The Answer was one that jumped out at me immediately and I think sometimes may get written off as it's so short. But to me, it's 1:53 of seriously beautiful melody. I adore it's 'big brother' Begin Again too, and love the 'Christmas' outro.
I overwhelmingly disagree with the "music player" part being cringeworthy.
Thinking about the context and what it means, makes full sense.
I still consider the whole "music player" part my favourite in the entire song, and it's one of my favourite songs on the first act.
Honestly, I like the "my music player" line. You all treat it as cringeworthy or out of place, but it really speaks to how terrible the world has become, that something like a little ipod is so valuable, and so emphasized musically. Upon the second listen I actually get goosebumps there.Thank you! And, I would bet that some of the people complaining about that line also use music to take their minds off of other things, or escape reality for a while too, just as Faythe is doing...it doesn't only have to apply to the society created in the story. This is very common now.
I'll be writing my review tomorrow but some thoughts:
- To take such a different direction from the last 6 albums is refreshing and much welcomed; especially when coming out of a streak of top 10 charts, and grammy nominations
- TGOM feels so much stronger coming right after the overture. The beginning is such a greater than life sound in the right context
- Saviour in the Square and When Your Time has Come are the mellow cousins of "The Mirror" & "Lie" as they go so well together one after the other
- Lord Nafaryous and Three days are just too much fun to listen to.
- MM is not the the attention grabbing drummer MP is (don't mean this as an insult by any mean). But then there are moments when a simple beat REALLY adds so much more: The heavy beat he plays in Ravenskill, the one he plays on a life left behind after the intro.
- A life left behind is among my favourite DT songs. The intro has a clear YES nod
- A new Beginning steals the show with the heavy riff at the beginning, and its 80s sounding solo.
- JP proved he not only shreds. His solos made me smile
- The album could have ended in Our New World (Are you kidding me with this song? holy sh*t!!!). But like many Neal Morse epics, I get why it closed with Astonishing.
- Gabriel The Astonishing is a fantastic nickname.
Does anybody else find the guitar solo in "When your Time has come" hilarious? Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love it but this is what i picture:Ok, what did you take?
Queen Elsa from Frozen singing "let it go" and then she hears some crazy noise and looks over the hills and sees Petrucci in a blizzard just rocking his ass off out of nowhere.
I actually think that would make for a funny movie... a rock band infiltrates a disney movie which is actually sort of what The Astonishing is anyways.
I promise I did not take any drugs before this post so if it comes off like gibberish than I apologize :)
I admittedly glossed over quite a few pages of this thread - too many to go through once I got home last night - but does anyone absolutely adore The Answer? That is one of the best songs under two minutes I've ever heard. Gorgeous little piece of music. :tup :tup
I agree wholeheartedly Kev... I wrote a similar thing a couple of days (and many, many pages) back. The Answer was one that jumped out at me immediately and I think sometimes may get written off as it's so short. But to me, it's 1:53 of seriously beautiful melody. I adore it's 'big brother' Begin Again too, and love the 'Christmas' outro.
Oh lawd, coming from another forum it's so refreshing to see people who don't like the album not being total bass soles about it. Props!
As cheesy and "Disney-like" as it is, I personally quite like it. It's great for what it is, don't see why people compare to other stuff the whole time. If people go about it like they would when it comes to The Wall or even a Steven Wilson record (these days), they 're just setting themselves up to not like it.
If they pull it off in a live setting, it will make for such a great show.
Over time a few tracks might be filler material for me but can't complain at all because there are just so many good moments in there. "Chosen" is my personal favorite, I'm surprised it hasn't gotten as many honorable mentions in here. It's like the "Let It Go" of this album. ;D
They took enough creative risks here (imo the biggest one being making this tour album-exclusive), at least you can't blame them for that.
I admittedly glossed over quite a few pages of this thread - too many to go through once I got home last night - but does anyone absolutely adore The Answer? That is one of the best songs under two minutes I've ever heard. Gorgeous little piece of music. :tup :tup
I agree wholeheartedly Kev... I wrote a similar thing a couple of days (and many, many pages) back. The Answer was one that jumped out at me immediately and I think sometimes may get written off as it's so short. But to me, it's 1:53 of seriously beautiful melody. I adore it's 'big brother' Begin Again too, and love the 'Christmas' outro.
The Christmas sound actually puts me off a bit there, and ever since I haven't really enjoyed that melody elsewhere on the album because it reminds me of that. There are a few Disney type things like that in Act II that make me prefer Act I (not that I have a problem with happy or Disney, I just didn't like that particular sound or melody). Our New World and Astonishing are probably the only things on Act II I like at this point.
Act I is another story though. Still digging much of that a lot.
I admittedly glossed over quite a few pages of this thread - too many to go through once I got home last night - but does anyone absolutely adore The Answer? That is one of the best songs under two minutes I've ever heard. Gorgeous little piece of music. :tup :tup
I agree wholeheartedly Kev... I wrote a similar thing a couple of days (and many, many pages) back. The Answer was one that jumped out at me immediately and I think sometimes may get written off as it's so short. But to me, it's 1:53 of seriously beautiful melody. I adore it's 'big brother' Begin Again too, and love the 'Christmas' outro.
The Christmas sound actually puts me off a bit there, and ever since I haven't really enjoyed that melody elsewhere on the album because it reminds me of that. There are a few Disney type things like that in Act II that make me prefer Act I (not that I have a problem with happy or Disney, I just didn't like that particular sound or melody). Our New World and Astonishing are probably the only things on Act II I like at this point.
Act I is another story though. Still digging much of that a lot.
Thats cool mate - different strokes for different folks. I really love Act II though - Begin Again, The Path that Divides, The Walking Shadow, My Last Farewell, Losing Faythe and Astonishing are big highlights for me. It's actually the power of this album - so many different tracks and diversity that suits everyone a little different. :tup
I don't want to say that much right now apart an honorable mention to Ravenskill for having one of the most intense climax in a Dt song, ever.
All in all very strong melodies spread throughout the whole album.
Let's hope the Double Album curse won't strike Dt again, like what happened after SDOIT.
I love many of Dream Theater's slow songs like Wait For Sleep, Space Dye Vest, Another Day, Lifting Shadows, Hollow Years, Through Her Eyes, The Spirit Carries On, Solitary Shell, Goodnight Kiss, Along for the Ride, The Bigger Picture, The Answer Lies Within etc. I just don't feel like the melody and quality of these songs match the aforementioned songs.
My biggest challenge with this album is to find time for it...working in a law firm and having three kids makes it very difficult :biggrin:
My biggest challenge with this album is to find time for it...working in a law firm and having three kids makes it very difficult :biggrin:
So what you're saying is people just don't have the time for music any more? :P
My biggest challenge with this album is to find time for it...working in a law firm and having three kids makes it very difficult :biggrin:
So what you're saying is people just don't have the time for music any more? :P
Hahaha absolutely...there is a huge nomac in my life following me wherever I go :lol
Anyone interested to hear Portnoy's thoughts on The Astonishing?? I think it'd be interesting....
Anyone interested to hear Portnoy's thoughts on The Astonishing?? I think it'd be interesting....
People who complain about the fadeout on new beginning can blame themselves if they buy CD's rather than digital copies.What does a fade out on a song that is not the final song on either disc have to do with buying CD's, time limitations, or how long you have to wait for an album?
If everyone switched to digital we would not have the time limitation problem. Also as soon as the mastering was done we could download it.
As it is the people who buy CD's are making everyone wait for them to have them manufactured.
I'm sure one can still be impressed by the talent these 5 guys have in their fingers. They can still play scales and fills faster and more smoothly than nobody else in the rock world....
... What they have forgotten is how to write a damn song.
2 acts is because thats the broadway way...I guess, but then there are many 3-act operas and operettas that still only have one interval when staged (usually between acts 2 and 3) with only a short break in the other one. Not like it really matters much at all, but I think the pacing works so much better (musically and narratively) when thinking of it in 3 parts.
I just read a frankly astonishing review on progarchives by a self confessed "former" DT fan. Here's the closure:QuoteI'm sure one can still be impressed by the talent these 5 guys have in their fingers. They can still play scales and fills faster and more smoothly than nobody else in the rock world....
... What they have forgotten is how to write a damn song.
The question is: have the two of us listened to the same album? :huh:
I just read a frankly astonishing review on progarchives by a self confessed "former" DT fan. Here's the closure:QuoteI'm sure one can still be impressed by the talent these 5 guys have in their fingers. They can still play scales and fills faster and more smoothly than nobody else in the rock world....
... What they have forgotten is how to write a damn song.
The question is: have the two of us listened to the same album? :huh:
It's not like everyone is forced to love the album. I myself think this album (and most of their latest stuff) got nothing on old DT so, that's why he said what he said.
However, the issue there is not that the reviewer dislikes the album, it's that the reason doesn't make any sense. The reviewer implies that the technical showmanship overshadows the songwriting, but anyone who has listened to it can gather that that is opposite to what DT have actually done.
However, the issue there is not that the reviewer dislikes the album, it's that the reason doesn't make any sense. The reviewer implies that the technical showmanship overshadows the songwriting, but anyone who has listened to it can gather that that is opposite to what DT have actually done.
He didn't mean that. He meant that, while they are great musicians, that doesn't mean it translate in good songs.
He actually wrote a long review, wasteland just quoted the very last part from it.
Anyone interested to hear Portnoy's thoughts on The Astonishing?? I think it'd be interesting....
I was wondering that today. I'm sure someone will ask him in an interview and he'll probably respond saying something like that hasn't even listened to it yet or that he has nothing to say regarding it.
My only real complaint is that the ending isn't as epic as expected, given the size of this story.
He actually wrote a long review, wasteland just quoted the very last part from it.
QuoteMy only real complaint is that the ending isn't as epic as expected, given the size of this story.
There is so much wrong with this sentence. It's the most epic ending to a DT album since Octavarium.
In terms of Portnoy liking or disliking this, I really don't think we'd get this album if he was still in the band and running the show.
In terms of Portnoy liking or disliking this, I really don't think we'd get this album if he was still in the band and running the show.
And even if it did happen, he'd probably want to do half the characters. "You only have three days...ROOOOAAAAAARRRRRRR"
Anyone else noticed a general change to a more positive vibe in DT's music since Portnoy left? Particularly, there is more major-key music now. Before hearing the ending to Illumination Theory, for example, the only DT music in the key of C major that I heard was in Only A Matter of Time.
Towards the end of my second full listen (currently on Whispers on the Wind), and I'm spotting more and more of the recurring themes.
So I finished my listen where I said I would focus on JM. I turned down the volume amd I used the large earbuds for my in-ears so that the bass woukd boost.
Wow. JM is the silent killer here. He did not go for flash and speedy playing but focused on being the rhythm section and it's amazing work. Especially loved his work on the slow songs.
So I finished my listen where I said I would focus on JM. I turned down the volume amd I used the large earbuds for my in-ears so that the bass woukd boost.
Wow. JM is the silent killer here. He did not go for flash and speedy playing but focused on being the rhythm section and it's amazing work. Especially loved his work on the slow songs.
The same would go for MM (probably JP too, actually). There are a lot of subtleties in the songs I can hear even from the first listen, the album is really well composed.
In terms of Portnoy liking or disliking this, I really don't think we'd get this album if he was still in the band and running the show. Don't think he'd be a massive fan".
This album is JLB telling the haters to suck it
So I finished my listen where I said I would focus on JM. I turned down the volume amd I used the large earbuds for my in-ears so that the bass woukd boost.
Wow. JM is the silent killer here. He did not go for flash and speedy playing but focused on being the rhythm section and it's amazing work. Especially loved his work on the slow songs.
The same would go for MM (probably JP too, actually). There are a lot of subtleties in the songs I can hear even from the first listen, the album is really well composed.
MM definitely. Which is why I laugh when I read comments saying that Mangini's playing here is simple. There's this part in Dystopian Overture, for example, where it took mh second listen that the ride is playing along to JR's playful piano playing. And then in another part of DO, where he is doing this beat with the toms (after that break where JP did a Rush-like lead), I realized on second listen that he is doing it with just one hand because I can hear cymbals in the left speaker. LOL
So I finished my listen where I said I would focus on JM. I turned down the volume amd I used the large earbuds for my in-ears so that the bass woukd boost.
Wow. JM is the silent killer here. He did not go for flash and speedy playing but focused on being the rhythm section and it's amazing work. Especially loved his work on the slow songs.
The same would go for MM (probably JP too, actually). There are a lot of subtleties in the songs I can hear even from the first listen, the album is really well composed.
MM definitely. Which is why I laugh when I read comments saying that Mangini's playing here is simple. There's this part in Dystopian Overture, for example, where it took mh second listen that the ride is playing along to JR's playful piano playing. And then in another part of DO, where he is doing this beat with the toms (after that break where JP did a Rush-like lead), I realized on second listen that he is doing it with just one hand because I can hear cymbals in the left speaker. LOL
What ride bit are you talking about? The only thing I can find that resembles that is just after the minute mark, but he's just playing straight 16ths there (as is the piano aside from JR's expressive tempo pushing) along with a very simple bass/snare. The ride is fast, but the beat itself is very simple. Unless you mean a different bit. :)
In terms of Portnoy liking or disliking this, I really don't think we'd get this album if he was still in the band and running the show.
And even if it did happen, he'd probably want to do half the characters. "You only have three days...ROOOOAAAAAARRRRRRR"
So I finished my listen where I said I would focus on JM. I turned down the volume amd I used the large earbuds for my in-ears so that the bass woukd boost.
Wow. JM is the silent killer here. He did not go for flash and speedy playing but focused on being the rhythm section and it's amazing work. Especially loved his work on the slow songs.
The same would go for MM (probably JP too, actually). There are a lot of subtleties in the songs I can hear even from the first listen, the album is really well composed.
MM definitely. Which is why I laugh when I read comments saying that Mangini's playing here is simple. There's this part in Dystopian Overture, for example, where it took mh second listen that the ride is playing along to JR's playful piano playing. And then in another part of DO, where he is doing this beat with the toms (after that break where JP did a Rush-like lead), I realized on second listen that he is doing it with just one hand because I can hear cymbals in the left speaker. LOL
What ride bit are you talking about? The only thing I can find that resembles that is just after the minute mark, but he's just playing straight 16ths there (as is the piano aside from JR's expressive tempo pushing) along with a very simple bass/snare. The ride is fast, but the beat itself is very simple. Unless you mean a different bit. :)
I think we're talking about the same section. :lol That part is indeed not hard, but it is not just straight 16ths, but has accents that complemented what JR is playing. So for me it is not simple compositionally. Very subtles highlighting, like how he used the rides to highlight the harmony in the guitar solo of The Bigger Picture.
Anyone else noticed a general change to a more positive vibe in DT's music since Portnoy left? Particularly, there is more major-key music now. Before hearing the ending to Illumination Theory, for example, the only DT music in the key of C major that I heard was in Only A Matter of Time.
I doubt JLB will be able to constantly pull off keeping the right "voice" for each character live, since his live singing is always a bit of a mixed bag, but I say, so what? The album is what we will be listening to for years, and he pulled it off on that, so mad props. :tup :tup
I can't imagine MM standing up to play and shouting " URRRRGHHHHH " into the mic.
Anyone else noticed a general change to a more positive vibe in DT's music since Portnoy left? Particularly, there is more major-key music now. Before hearing the ending to Illumination Theory, for example, the only DT music in the key of C major that I heard was in Only A Matter of Time.
The tone of some of this reminds me of Static Impulse.I have yet to explore 2nd CD but melodies on first one are IMO best they've ever done. I like catchy vocal melodies in rock/metal so I can see many songs off TA on heavy rotation on my music player.
I've read a few people say that LaBrie has catchier vocal melodies on his solo albums.
Not anymore :)
The tone of some of this reminds me of Static Impulse.I have yet to explore 2nd CD but melodies on first one are IMO best they've ever done. I like catchy vocal melodies in rock/metal so I can see many songs off TA on heavy rotation on my music player.
I've read a few people say that LaBrie has catchier vocal melodies on his solo albums.
Not anymore :)
Since no individual song on The Astonishing is over 8 minutes - I wonder if they purposefully made DT12 shorter songs to test the water for this album.JP said he had the idea for it while jetlagged while promoting the self-titled (interview for Eddie Trunk, 01/18/16). Of course it has mentioned (many times) they wanted to record a concept album even when MP was in the band, but the idea of a rock opera with short songs (by the DT stardard) probably wasn't in their mind.
I haven't read through the entire thread so this might be nothing new but the intro to "A Savior in the Square" really reminds me of "Goodbye Blue Sky" by Pink Floyd. I can't be alone in this right?
I love many of Dream Theater's slow songs like Wait For Sleep, Space Dye Vest, Another Day, Lifting Shadows, Hollow Years, Through Her Eyes, The Spirit Carries On, Solitary Shell, Goodnight Kiss, Along for the Ride, The Bigger Picture, The Answer Lies Within etc. I just don't feel like the melody and quality of these songs match the aforementioned songs.
See, it's interesting - I'm a big fan of DT's melodic side, and I feel these are easily some of the best ballads they've ever written. I do love Wait for Sleep and Far From Heaven, and the BTFW version of Space Dye Vest (the album version doesn't excite me as much as many others here, nor Disappear bar the ending, as I find it a bit of a grind). But I honestly think many of the ballads on the Astonishing blow away some of the others you mention.
But you've documented your stance really well, and how it may take more listens to click. I hope it does, as there is some real quality on this album. But if not, hey, that's the nature of us all liking different things. :tup
I don't know if this has been mentioned yet: the part at 4:42 in A New Beginning sounds like a variation of the intro melody in TGOM.
The part in ANB is one of my favourite parts in the entire album! :hefdaddy
I'm sure that the start of the guitar solo in A New Beginning (when the simple drum beat comes in) is a variation on the "Brother can you hear me?" theme.
I think it is amazing that The X Aspect rarely been mentioned yet. When I first heard Dystopia Overture I immediately got goosebumps by 0:45-1:00 thinking and hoping the theme would return many times during the album. As far as I have noticed it is only returning in The X Aspect and by doing so making it my favourite song on the album. It should have been used as the main theme throughout the album IMO, it amazing. That being said, this record is unbelievable the way it is! My only real complaint is that the ending isn´t as epic as expected, given the size of this story.
I haven't read through the entire thread so this might be nothing new but the intro to "A Savior in the Square" really reminds me of "Goodbye Blue Sky" by Pink Floyd. I can't be alone in this right?
Unless I missed something, the NOMACS themselves were completely useless to the story. And that would have been fine, but now they made such a massive deal of these things that when they ultimately never affected the story directly in any way it was a bit disappointing. The story would basically have been the same if they weren't there.
I think it is amazing that The X Aspect rarely been mentioned yet. When I first heard Dystopia Overture I immediately got goosebumps by 0:45-1:00 thinking and hoping the theme would return many times during the album. As far as I have noticed it is only returning in The X Aspect and by doing so making it my favourite song on the album. It should have been used as the main theme throughout the album IMO, it amazing. That being said, this record is unbelievable the way it is! My only real complaint is that the ending isn´t as epic as expected, given the size of this story.
Totally with you there. The first couple of listens of X Aspect I thought about skipping then BAM - that melody! It's not the same, but it relates so closely to the "Evangeline, you lived your life..." section of a "Better Life" - so maybe it's kind of like her theme...since she's you know...not actually alive in it.
Gone are interesting instrumental sections and in are uninteresting choruses and sections that are 3 parts sappy, 3 parts cheesy, 3 parts pretentious, and 6 parts forgettable.
The problem I have is that some people are missing the stereotypical long song epic rather than an actual epic ending.QuoteMy only real complaint is that the ending isn't as epic as expected, given the size of this story.
There is so much wrong with this sentence. It's the most epic ending to a DT album since Octavarium.
It amazes me that someone can love "Octavarium" and hate "The Astonishing" as I have the complete opposite reaction.Without the title track, it would be the worst album after WDADU, I agree. But what do you think about Octavarium the song?
To me Octavarium was an utterly uninspired effort and arguably their worst album whereas The Astonishing just oozes with inspiration and is their best album in 15 years... maybe even longer!
But hey, thats the beauty of music.
Systematic Chaos great and TA very very bad? come on bro.Agreed. An opinion that SC was great is a minority amongst the fans. Too early to say for TA, though, but I doubt it ends up in the same hemisphere as SC.
Malt Licky you're obviously a fan of prog metal and TA is more on the prog rock side, I'm sure they'll go back to the prog metal sooner or later, they're more comfortable there IMO.
The Astonishing is a DT statement that says "See we know prog rock, we just like doing prog metal" :lol
Systematic Chaos great and TA very very bad? come on bro.Agreed. An opinion that SC was great is a minority amongst the fans. Too early to say for TA, though, but I doubt it ends up in the same hemisphere as SC.
It amazes me that someone can love "Octavarium" and hate "The Astonishing".
And here I am, still refreshing The Astonishing website about every 1 or 2 hour, hope a different video show up in second video slot and something appear when I click NOMACS eyes :facepalm:
Deep in my heart, I really hope that second video is video clip of Dystopian Overture with a cool 3D animation :'(
Hahahaha, I found this so funny to read :lolAnd here I am, still refreshing The Astonishing website about every 1 or 2 hour, hope a different video show up in second video slot and something appear when I click NOMACS eyes :facepalm:
Deep in my heart, I really hope that second video is video clip of Dystopian Overture with a cool 3D animation :'(
For years to come, pringkaarwanda continued refreshing The Astonishing page, he lost his job for failure to show up, his friends got together and brought him in for an intervention after cutting off the internet lines in his house to get him off the refresh button, he moved to the sidewalk of a coffee shop to use their wifi and keep trying, his wife subsequently left him and his kids were taken away by child services.
On January 31th 2022 an RIP thread was made for pringkaarwanda on DTF as he was found on that sidewalk outside the coffee shop with all his fingers bruised and disfigured from clicking the refresh button on The Astonighing page.
RR issued an official apology, on the anniversary on February 1st 2023.
I could easily listen to the whole thing in one go but I want to do other stuff :lol
I have to respectfully disagree. Even after 5-6 listens of TA, I've found it much more cohesive and memorable than SC.Systematic Chaos great and TA very very bad? come on bro.Agreed. An opinion that SC was great is a minority amongst the fans. Too early to say for TA, though, but I doubt it ends up in the same hemisphere as SC.
It is great with caveats, I suppose. All things considered, perhaps "good" is a more appropriate judgment of SC. Even so, it is miles above TA, I submit.
It amazes me that someone can love "Octavarium" and hate "The Astonishing" as I have the complete opposite reaction.
whatever happened to riff-based instrumentals, thoughThe Gift of Music, Moment of Betrayal, My Last Farewell, and A New Beginning have some of that, but yeah, there's certainly much less. I love the solos though so I don't mind one bit.
the soloing on this album is generally pretty good but i miss having at least a little of the chaotic bits like Breaking All Illusions, Bridges in the Sky, Outcry, heck, Lost Not Forgotten even has them (and I don't really like that song much)
whereas aside from the overture tracks there's really not much of that on The Astonishing
whatever happened to riff-based instrumentals, though
the soloing on this album is generally pretty good but i miss having at least a little of the chaotic bits like Breaking All Illusions, Bridges in the Sky, Outcry, heck, Lost Not Forgotten even has them (and I don't really like that song much)
whereas aside from the overture tracks there's really not much of that on The Astonishing
It amazes me that someone can love "Octavarium" and hate "The Astonishing".
It still amazes me that people can't accept other people have different tastes.
It amazes me that someone can love "Octavarium" and hate "The Astonishing".
It still amazes me that people can't accept other people have different tastes.
Hear hear!....It's really annoying me that so many people in here just can't accept that other people having different opinions and tastes to their own is not something to be derided or put down.
whatever happened to riff-based instrumentals, though
the soloing on this album is generally pretty good but i miss having at least a little of the chaotic bits like Breaking All Illusions, Bridges in the Sky, Outcry, heck, Lost Not Forgotten even has them (and I don't really like that song much)
whereas aside from the overture tracks there's really not much of that on The Astonishing
Personally, I think some folks struggling with the album may have come to it thinking it's something it's not.
The band have been very upfront in saying that it was conceived as a rock opera. In the Eddie Trunk interview, JP said that the best way to listen to it was sitting chilled out, headphones, listening to it all in one sitting.
To me, this makes total sense, as they've written it to be something to be presented on stage - exactly what they're doing with the tour.
If Broadway/West End musical theatre isn't your thing, and your tastes lie elsewhere, that's totally cool, but in that format, the story and characters have to come first, with musical showoffery taking a back seat.
That's something I think they have pulled off amazingly well with TA, but if you're thinking of the album as just a collection of songs, I think you may be doing it a disservice. This one is a different animal altogether.. :tup
Just my opinion, of course..
It amazes me that someone can love "Octavarium" and hate "The Astonishing" as I have the complete opposite reaction.Without the title track, it would be the worst album after WDADU, I agree. But what do you think about Octavarium the song?
To me Octavarium was an utterly uninspired effort and arguably their worst album whereas The Astonishing just oozes with inspiration and is their best album in 15 years... maybe even longer!
But hey, thats the beauty of music.
It amazes me that someone can love "Octavarium" and hate "The Astonishing" as I have the complete opposite reaction.Without the title track, it would be the worst album after WDADU, I agree. But what do you think about Octavarium the song?
To me Octavarium was an utterly uninspired effort and arguably their worst album whereas The Astonishing just oozes with inspiration and is their best album in 15 years... maybe even longer!
But hey, thats the beauty of music.
I do like the title track but I think they mailed in the rest. I go back and forth on which their worst album is between Octavarium and Systematic Chaos because SC has some interesting parts but nothing great while Octavarium is mainly uninspired but does have a pretty decent epic.
It amazes me that someone can love "Octavarium" and hate "The Astonishing".
It still amazes me that people can't accept other people have different tastes.
Hear hear!....It's really annoying me that so many people in here just can't accept that other people having different opinions and tastes to their
own is not something to be derided or put down.
It amazes me how many people like to take quotes out of context and don't read the rest of my post. "But hey, thats the beauty of music". I think thats pretty clear that I am saying the beauty of music is that people have varying tastes. So not sure what you guys are trying to start here.
It amazes me that someone can love "Octavarium" and hate "The Astonishing" as I have the complete opposite reaction.Without the title track, it would be the worst album after WDADU, I agree. But what do you think about Octavarium the song?
To me Octavarium was an utterly uninspired effort and arguably their worst album whereas The Astonishing just oozes with inspiration and is their best album in 15 years... maybe even longer!
But hey, thats the beauty of music.
I do like the title track but I think they mailed in the rest. I go back and forth on which their worst album is between Octavarium and Systematic Chaos because SC has some interesting parts but nothing great while Octavarium is mainly uninspired but does have a pretty decent epic.
I really like Octavarium. The Answer Lies Within is a nice catchy slow song. The Root of All Evil is heavy and catchy at the same time. These Wall is catchy as hell. Octavarium is epic, Panic Attack was crazy at the time and sounded like someone was really having a Panic Attack (in a good way)
Reappearing themes I've found so far
Dystopian Overture 0:44 --> The X Aspect
Dystopian Overture 2:57 --> Brother, Can You Hear Me?
Dystopian Overture 3:25 --> A New Beginning
Dystopian Overture 4:00 --> Astonishing
Act of Faythe 3:57 --> A Savior in the Square
Brother, Can You Hear Me? 3:05 --> The Road to Revolution
Ravenskill 4:12 --> When Your Time Has Come
The X Aspect 3:29 --> Brother, Can You Hear Me?
2285 Entr’acte 0:43 --> Lord Nafaryus
2285 Entr’acte 0:58 -->Three Days
2285 Entr’acte 1:15 --> The Road to Revolution
Losing Faythe 0:19 --> Chosen
Astonishing 1:23 -->, 4:31 --> Brother, Can You Hear Me?
Astonishing 2:13 --> The Answer
Astonishing 3:32 --> The Road to Revolution
Main Theme:
Dystopian Overture 2:28 -->
Lord Nafaryus 2:23 -->
A Savior in the Square 3:43 -->
Act of Faythe 1:06 -->
The Road to Revolution 1:49 -->
Astonishing 2:44 -->
Reappearing themes I've found so far
Dystopian Overture 0:44 --> The X Aspect
Dystopian Overture 2:57 --> Brother, Can You Hear Me?
Dystopian Overture 3:25 --> A New Beginning
Dystopian Overture 4:00 --> Astonishing
Act of Faythe 3:57 --> A Savior in the Square
Brother, Can You Hear Me? 3:05 --> The Road to Revolution
Ravenskill 4:12 --> When Your Time Has Come
The X Aspect 3:29 --> Brother, Can You Hear Me?
2285 Entr’acte 0:43 --> Lord Nafaryus
2285 Entr’acte 0:58 -->Three Days
2285 Entr’acte 1:15 --> The Road to Revolution
Losing Faythe 0:19 --> Chosen
Astonishing 1:23 -->, 4:31 --> Brother, Can You Hear Me?
Astonishing 2:13 --> The Answer
Astonishing 3:32 --> The Road to Revolution
Main Theme:
Dystopian Overture 2:28 -->
Lord Nafaryus 2:23 -->
A Savior in the Square 3:43 -->
Act of Faythe 1:06 -->
The Road to Revolution 1:49 -->
Astonishing 2:44 -->
The Answer, When your time has come and begin again are also all completely connected by the same melody :tup
This if freaking crazy how good this album is! I keep posting here after each listen because it keeps getting better and better.
I absolutely love rock operas so I am having so much fun with the theatricality of this whole thing. Labrie is just amazing on this album!!!
I assumed the top 3 DT albums were completely untouchable (SFAM, I&W, SDOIT) and I feel like its blasphemy to place anything above them but I honestly think this album belongs up there with them and might just be the best of the bunch. SFAM is one of the all time great albums IMO and this one is honestly rivaling it. Crazy to say. One thing I will say for certain is that that this album has definitely left Awake and FII in their dust and those were my number 4 and 5.
If the DT guys are reading this. Well done gentleman! I am floored.
Evangeline's theme is quickly becoming my fav. 1st "solo" in Dystopian Overture.
I can accept people not liking this album. Musical tastes being subjective, and all.
But to say that the DT guys just phoned it in with this one? With the amount of care that went into making specific musical themes serve story purposes, marking characters with distinct musical styles, and having a narrative that flows well both musically and plot-wise, I find such a criticism LAZY. Just say you don't like it, instead of making unfounded (and most likely, wrong) accusations of "phoning in" on the band who seems to have given much effort and passion in producing this work.
I can accept people not liking this album. Musical tastes being subjective, and all.
But to say that the DT guys just phoned it in with this one? With the amount of care that went into making specific musical themes serve story purposes, marking characters with distinct musical styles, and having a narrative that flows well both musically and plot-wise, I find such a criticism LAZY. Just say you don't like it, instead of making unfounded (and most likely, wrong) accusations of "phoning in" on the band who seems to have given much effort and passion in producing this work.
I don't think anybody is saying JP, JR or JLB "phoned" anything in. From anything I have seen online, that criticism is levied against JM and MM's performance on the album.
you guys can't brush it off by saying "it's a different type of album" :lol
i know that. that doesn't mean they couldn't vary up their instrumental sections a little when they do have them.
Reappearing themes I've found so far
Dystopian Overture 0:44 --> The X Aspect
Dystopian Overture 2:57 --> Brother, Can You Hear Me?
Dystopian Overture 3:25 --> A New Beginning
Dystopian Overture 4:00 --> Astonishing
Act of Faythe 3:57 --> A Savior in the Square
Brother, Can You Hear Me? 3:05 --> The Road to Revolution
Ravenskill 4:12 --> When Your Time Has Come
The X Aspect 3:29 --> Brother, Can You Hear Me?
2285 Entr’acte 0:43 --> Lord Nafaryus
2285 Entr’acte 0:58 -->Three Days
2285 Entr’acte 1:15 --> The Road to Revolution
Losing Faythe 0:19 --> Chosen
Astonishing 1:23 -->, 4:31 --> Brother, Can You Hear Me?
Astonishing 2:13 --> The Answer
Astonishing 3:32 --> The Road to Revolution
Main Theme:
Dystopian Overture 2:28 -->
Lord Nafaryus 2:23 -->
A Savior in the Square 3:43 -->
Act of Faythe 1:06 -->
The Road to Revolution 1:49 -->
Astonishing 2:44 -->
The Answer, When your time has come and begin again are also all completely connected by the same melody :tup
I think from tracks 1-27 this might just be the greatest DT album ever made.
However, The stretch from "My last farewell" until the end of the album (excluding "Our New World") is very underwhelming.
I SO badly want to like "Hymn of a Thousand Words" but I just can't. It plods along and is super cheesy. I wish they would have made this a faster paced track and added some virtuosity to it.
Its because of this final stretch that I wouldn't call this a perfect album but even this stretch is still good. Its just not incredible like the rest of the album.
I said before that this rivals SFAM but SFAM ends with One Last Time, Spirit Carries On, and Finally Free so I think I retract that statement.
I now have a "Big 4" though rather than a "Big 3". Where those albums rank within the "Big 4" (SFAM, I&W, SDOIT, TA) I don't quite know yet
I think from tracks 1-27 this might just be the greatest DT album ever made.
However, The stretch from "My last farewell" until the end of the album (excluding "Our New World") is very underwhelming.
I SO badly want to like "Hymn of a Thousand Words" but I just can't. It plods along and is super cheesy. I wish they would have made this a faster paced track and added some virtuosity to it.
Its because of this final stretch that I wouldn't call this a perfect album but even this stretch is still good. Its just not incredible like the rest of the album.
I think from tracks 1-27 this might just be the greatest DT album ever made.
However, The stretch from "My last farewell" until the end of the album (excluding "Our New World") is very underwhelming.
I SO badly want to like "Hymn of a Thousand Words" but I just can't. It plods along and is super cheesy. I wish they would have made this a faster paced track and added some virtuosity to it.
Its because of this final stretch that I wouldn't call this a perfect album but even this stretch is still good. Its just not incredible like the rest of the album.
I said before that this rivals SFAM but SFAM ends with One Last Time, Spirit Carries On, and Finally Free so I think I retract that statement.
I now have a "Big 4" though rather than a "Big 3". Where those albums rank within the "Big 4" (SFAM, I&W, SDOIT, TA) I don't quite know yet
Do me a favour and stick with 'My Last Farewell' and 'Act of Faythe'. They both completely clicked with me last night, and are real highlights, particularly 'My Last Farewell'. Great recurring themes in 'Act of Faythe' from 'Chosen' too. :tup
I sort of figured out the story function of NOMACS tracks. I initially said that they mark Daryus, but more generally, I think they mark a major action brought about by an Empire character:Well, Nafaryus changes before Our New World, technically...ONW doesn't really mention him in any form. That's the only one that doesn't really line up.
Nafaryus demands for Gabriel's surrender in Three Days leads to The Hovering Sojourn of NOMACS looking for Gabriel.
Daryus makes A Tempting Offer to Arhys leads to the NOMACS noting the Digital Discord.
Daryus killing Arhys at The Path That Divides leads to ominous Machine Chatter among the NOMACS.
Nafaryus changing for the good in Our New World leads to the Power Down of the NOMACS.
I sort of figured out the story function of NOMACS tracks. I initially said that they mark Daryus, but more generally, I think they mark a major action brought about by an Empire character:Well, Nafaryus changes before Our New World, technically...ONW doesn't really mention him in any form. That's the only one that doesn't really line up.
Nafaryus demands for Gabriel's surrender in Three Days leads to The Hovering Sojourn of NOMACS looking for Gabriel.
Daryus makes A Tempting Offer to Arhys leads to the NOMACS noting the Digital Discord.
Daryus killing Arhys at The Path That Divides leads to ominous Machine Chatter among the NOMACS.
Nafaryus changing for the good in Our New World leads to the Power Down of the NOMACS.
get the HDTracks version you guys holy shit
My wife generally doesn't like DT. I have to force her or bribe her to let me play DT in the car. Not anymore! She really likes The Astonishing (as do I).
Try it out on your wife or girlfriend.
Why did Gabriel tell his brother that the NOMAC's were down in Moment of Betrayal?
Do we know that the NOMAC's occasionally powered down?! Do we know Gabriel only sang in their absence?! This is new to me if so.
My wife generally doesn't like DT. I have to force her or bribe her to let me play DT in the car. Not anymore! She really likes The Astonishing (as do I).
Try it out on your wife or girlfriend.
I CAN say that about ADTOE and DT12You could, and meanwhile I'd say those are 2 of their all-time best albums. Honestly, I can't think of any of their albums as a whole that fit that category (even the ones I don't really like such as SC and TOT).
Sorry if this was already brought up but it is a long thread.I love the Incredible Hulk theme. I definitely hear the similarity with the first few chords/melody. That being said, it's a pretty simple melody, so I totally see how someone else would have come up with a similar note choice.
The X Aspect (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zopCaFSsgc)
Incredible Hulk TV end theme (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzMSfaNXYZg)
I'm not saying they are the same, just that X Aspect made me think of the Hulk theme so much that it is the "Hulk" song for me now.
Anybody else in love with JP's solo in "When Your Time Has Come" ? Such a melodic moment. :)
Why did Gabriel tell his brother that the NOMAC's were down in Moment of Betrayal?
Why did Gabriel tell his brother that the NOMAC's were down in Moment of Betrayal?
I've got a feeling that it's another mistake in the lyrics boklet. It makes much more sense if Arhys is the one singing the first two verses, and gabriel the third. That makes it more like a conversation.
Arhys is nervous and hasty in his desicions, and desperatley tells Gabriel there's no time to loose. The parts sounds very much like the talk of a militia leader, and not that of a musical artist.
Then the third verse is Gabriels response to that, noting that his brother was acting very strange.
Did anyone get Faythe's theme in The Walking Shadow (When you hear Daryus' walking before accidentally stabbing Faythe)? You hear a choir faintly humming her theme. It's so eeriely done and subtle. And it made one of my favourite songs on it even better.
"Brother can you hear me
I am just a man
Known across the desert
Beyond the shadows in the sand" ::)
I don't think so. Nafaryus presumably powers down the NOMACs to give Gabriel and Faythe the chance to speak/sing, and Gabriel tells Arhys that. All makes sense as is.Why did Gabriel tell his brother that the NOMAC's were down in Moment of Betrayal?
I've got a feeling that it's another mistake in the lyrics boklet. It makes much more sense if Arhys is the one singing the first two verses, and gabriel the third. That makes it more like a conversation.
Arhys is nervous and hasty in his desicions, and desperatley tells Gabriel there's no time to loose. The parts sounds very much like the talk of a militia leader, and not that of a musical artist.
Then the third verse is Gabriels response to that, noting that his brother was acting very strange.
From DT website:
"Recognizing his son’s captor to be Prince Daryus and keeping X’s safety in mind, he immediately withdraws any efforts to apprehend the prince and instead asks him what he wants. Daryus makes him an offer that will put Arhys in an extremely complicated and life altering position…If Arhys delivers Gabriel to him, Prince Daryus will in return guarantee the safety, protection and prosperity of Xander for the rest of his life..."
Shouldn't the word "Arhys" appearing in bold above be replaced by "Xander"?
I just hope people don't dismiss TA as "too much to digest" this early into the digesting process. The very best albums and pieces of music don't reveal everything immediately. You still find little moments you never spotted before, sometimes years after your first listen.
I just hope people don't dismiss TA as "too much to digest" this early into the digesting process. The very best albums and pieces of music don't reveal everything immediately. You still find little moments you never spotted before, sometimes years after your first listen.
Yes. The album is best enjoyed digested in small doses.
It will produce easy to manage nuggets...
..which you can then flush away in the toilet of memory ???
I dunno where this is going tbh.
I just hope people don't dismiss TA as "too much to digest" this early into the digesting process. The very best albums and pieces of music don't reveal everything immediately. You still find little moments you never spotted before, sometimes years after your first listen.
I just hope people don't dismiss TA as "too much to digest" this early into the digesting process. The very best albums and pieces of music don't reveal everything immediately. You still find little moments you never spotted before, sometimes years after your first listen.
??? Did i ?
These shows could end up being JLB's most difficult ever. He will need lots of tea and honey.
After a first listen last Friday, with headphones and booklet, I'm now trying a casual listen. It's a very good album, but still way too much to digest. I don't even know a fifth of the album. Most of it feels like new material, though it's my second listen.After 5 full listens and another listen of a handful of songs, I feel I've got a pretty good grip on the album now. Obviously there will be all sorts of details to listen out for (I hadn't noticed Faythe's theme in The Walking Shadow until I read about it here, for example).
I'm gonna need another 10 listens before I can make my mind up.
While most of the "songs" are pretty good, I just don't like the way they're only 2 minutes long before giving way to random excerpts from other songs and then just stopping. Most of them are just stitching together the same half-dozen refrains in different orders anyway.Not everyone will dig that, for sure, but I don't think the way you've put it is very fair. JP wrote a narrative, and then they put the music to that narrative, so recurring themes represent characters and situations. So it's not a case of the same refrains popping up at random; it's about what's happening to the characters and the story.
The one thing bugging me is that a few of the tracks have that same slow-down crescendo ( rallentando ? ) as if they were ending an epic.
While most of the "songs" are pretty good, I just don't like the way they're only 2 minutes long before giving way to random excerpts from other songs and then just stopping. Most of them are just stitching together the same half-dozen refrains in different orders anyway.Not everyone will dig that, for sure, but I don't think the way you've put it is very fair. JP wrote a narrative, and then they put the music to that narrative, so recurring themes represent characters and situations. So it's not a case of the same refrains popping up at random; it's about what's happening to the characters and the story.
I think it actually works very well. Ok it makes it harder to dig into an individual song in some ways, but then there are some great themes that come back later on. A great example is Evangeline's theme - in A Better Life, it comes as a bridge section late on and isn't repeated. On its own I might have thought it was a waste of a great chorus, but then it reprises in The X Aspect. It makes sense narratively, and is great when it comes back.
These shows could end up being JLB's most difficult ever. He will need lots of tea and honey.
Yes, all that is gonna be tough to say the least.
B.Lee
I believe i read/saw/heard an interview where he said that some vocal lines would be playback. This was to make it more like a conversation, and not have him standing there talking to himself.
Yes, but if you look at something like Les Mis, each of the characters has a "signature theme" that pops up throughout the musical. But when each of those characters sings their spotlight song, those songs are self contained and "uncontaminated" by the other themes. It's just what is annoying me at the moment. I'm loving songs like A Life Left Behind, for example, but then there's the Arrabelle/Darius bit at the end, and it kind of spoils the flow of the song as a whole.For sure and I totally get why you and some others wouldn't like it so much, though personally I think your example is terrible as I absolutely adore the end of A Life Left Behind, which completely makes the song for me. That's actually, in my opinion, one of the most coherent and self-contained songs on the album. Kinda reminds me of The Bigger Picture, structurally.
Just my $0.02.
Perhaps it would help if I started thinking of this as one 130 minute piece of music.Yeah, it might. I'm certainly approaching it that way, but then I tend to approach almost all albums that way anyway regardless of whether they are concept albums or rock operas or not.
I found the Faythe Theme in The Walking Shadow quite obvious, but it can be because Faythe's theme stood out quite soon for me, it is just pure beauty.Could be partly that, as I don't find that theme so exciting. :lol
A Life Left Behind has the most unexpected intro and outro for any ballads ever. I'm in love with Daryus' parts.
I don't envy JLB, he will be missing these nice long water breaks during the next tour, seriously I think it will be the most he ever worked in a DT concert :lol
I don't envy JLB, he will be missing these nice long water breaks during the next tour, seriously I think it will be the most he ever worked in a DT concert :lol
Agreed - this has probably got the highest ratio of vocals to instrumentals of any DT album.
Quite a few of the songs have at least 1 minute of instrumental introduction before JLB's vocals come in. Heaven's Cove's introduction is a good 2:30 long out of 4:19. So there are a few decent breaks for him to run backstage and take on board fluids.
My one question is why did Gabriel save only Faythe and not Arhys too?
Sorry if this what already mentioned before, but why is Xander sometimes simply called X while all other characters are always mentioned in their full name?
I saw an earlier thread where someone pointed out that Daryus got off way too easy for being such a prick and killing (or attempting to kill) two characters. He kind of just disappears after that, until his mother Arabelle says "I forgive you, especially with your new impairment." I looked at the lyrics to see if I missed something, but I didn't. Finally, I read the track notes on the microsite and saw it - he's permanently deaf in a new world full of music, as a result of Gabriel's eardrum-shattering scream. That makes much more sense!
Anyone else notice that this key point was missing from the actual lyrics - or am I still missing it there somewhere?
My one question is why did Gabriel save only Faythe and not Arhys too?
Because they wrote that :rollin
I saw an earlier thread where someone pointed out that Daryus got off way too easy for being such a prick and killing (or attempting to kill) two characters. He kind of just disappears after that, until his mother Arabelle says "I forgive you, especially with your new impairment." I looked at the lyrics to see if I missed something, but I didn't. Finally, I read the track notes on the microsite and saw it - he's permanently deaf in a new world full of music, as a result of Gabriel's eardrum-shattering scream. That makes much more sense!
Anyone else notice that this key point was missing from the actual lyrics - or am I still missing it there somewhere?
It's very subtle, but in Astonishing:
[Arabelle]
My prince, my son
You got lost along the way
In light of this new burden that you face
You are forgiven on this day!
Yeah, I did catch that "new burden that you face" line, but just didn't know what that burden was until I read the online description. Maybe that was intentional so that we'd all go to the site to catch some extra nuggets of info, which after some thought is kinda cool. Get 90% of the story from the album, but look for clues elsewhere to get the other 10%. Keeps us engaged.
My one question is why did Gabriel save only Faythe and not Arhys too?
Because they wrote that :rollin
The twenty seconds following 1:22 in Lord Nafaryus might be the most annoying, unpleasant piece of audio DT has ever released.That is not possible, there is no Bebot played during that section.
The twenty seconds following 1:22 in Lord Nafaryus might be the most annoying, unpleasant piece of audio DT has ever released.
See, and I loved that part! To each their own...
Also, the fade out of A new beginning has go to be the absolute biggest let down I have ever heard in music. That groove and solo are so god damn amazing and then it just fades out?!
I don't like it. At all. I am a huge DT fan and have seen them numerous times. I was looking forward to this tour, but I won't be going to watch them perform this album. I just couldn't get into it. Of course the musicianship is incredible. I also feel the this is James' best album of vocals. He was brilliant. However after listening to the album 3 times, I can't remember ONE single track that stands out that made me hum or sing a chorus to or catchy riff. For me, the tracks are too short and they never got into songs. I guess it's just a rock opera that HAS to be listened to over the entire act. To me, they focused way too much on the story and characters than the music. I assume now that this tour will be more of a visual play and DT just happens to be standing there playing background tracks. That's just not my thing. So for me, The Astonishing was a big let down and I will pass on it. I also didn't like BCaSL. I would rank this one right down near the bottom with it. I will just listen to Score for a while to restore my FAYTHE....see what I did there?
I love the album but I think some of the critiques are fair.
I would hope most people were able to understand each other's opinions most of the time!I love the album but I think some of the critiques are fair.
This is another thing that I find unique about The Astonishing; I absolutely love it yet I completely understand where those who don't are coming from.
Anyone else notice that that the chorus chord progression in "Three Days" (and its reprise in "2285 Entr'acte), sounds like the part in "Raw Dog" from 1:36-2:05? Especially the string sweeps...
Also, the fade out of A new beginning has go to be the absolute biggest let down I have ever heard in music. That groove and solo are so god damn amazing and then it just fades out?! This, to me, feels like the most creatively bankrupt thing I have ever heard from DT. I mean, what happened to figuring out transitions and making the music have flow? God, this just let me down in ways I don't even understand.
Also, the fade out of A new beginning has go to be the absolute biggest let down I have ever heard in music. That groove and solo are so god damn amazing and then it just fades out?! This, to me, feels like the most creatively bankrupt thing I have ever heard from DT. I mean, what happened to figuring out transitions and making the music have flow? God, this just let me down in ways I don't even understand.
I've seen this complaint numerous times in this thread, and I'm not quite sure I understand it. This section is almost three minutes long, isn't it? The fade out really doesn't feel abrupt to me.
Also, the fade out of A new beginning has go to be the absolute biggest let down I have ever heard in music. That groove and solo are so god damn amazing and then it just fades out?! This, to me, feels like the most creatively bankrupt thing I have ever heard from DT. I mean, what happened to figuring out transitions and making the music have flow? God, this just let me down in ways I don't even understand.
I've seen this complaint numerous times in this thread, and I'm not quite sure I understand it. This section is almost three minutes long, isn't it? The fade out really doesn't feel abrupt to me.
There's only a couple of albums that I'm as excited about as this one, 2015 was an amazing year for music, but this album keeps growing on me on every listen, I know I'm kinda getting ahead of myself but I can very easily see this album being top half DT material, might even crack the top 3.
Like I predicted though, the 'standout' tracks of the first few listen won't be as shockingly good as they were on first listen compared to the other songs, songs like Three Days and Lord Nafaryus, I still love Three Days very much though.
Also, the fade out of A new beginning has go to be the absolute biggest let down I have ever heard in music. That groove and solo are so god damn amazing and then it just fades out?! This, to me, feels like the most creatively bankrupt thing I have ever heard from DT. I mean, what happened to figuring out transitions and making the music have flow? God, this just let me down in ways I don't even understand.
I've seen this complaint numerous times in this thread, and I'm not quite sure I understand it. This section is almost three minutes long, isn't it? The fade out really doesn't feel abrupt to me.
I actually had to go out and intentionally wait for it. I listened to the album five times without noticing it. I thought it flowed great.
That's obviously what happened.Also, the fade out of A new beginning has go to be the absolute biggest let down I have ever heard in music. That groove and solo are so god damn amazing and then it just fades out?! This, to me, feels like the most creatively bankrupt thing I have ever heard from DT. I mean, what happened to figuring out transitions and making the music have flow? God, this just let me down in ways I don't even understand.
I've seen this complaint numerous times in this thread, and I'm not quite sure I understand it. This section is almost three minutes long, isn't it? The fade out really doesn't feel abrupt to me.
It's not abrupt. It's lazy song writing and DT is a band that has some of the greatest transitions from song to song historically. I felt like they were just like, welp, we got nothing here, so fade out.
Anyone else let down by the "scream"? I read the passage before listening and was so excited to here that, and then laughed at it. Even my brother who was in the other room chimed in for that one part, "THAT?! that was the scream? lol"
:lol Not sure how a fadeout is "lazy songwriting." That doesn't even make sense. "The band didn't end a song the way I think it should have ended" is not "lazy."
criticisms of too many ballads, filler songs, not enough stand alone content; all miss the point.
There's only a couple of albums that I'm as excited about as this one, 2015 was an amazing year for music, but this album keeps growing on me on every listen, I know I'm kinda getting ahead of myself but I can very easily see this album being top half DT material, might even crack the top 3.
Like I predicted though, the 'standout' tracks of the first few listen won't be as shockingly good as they were on first listen compared to the other songs, songs like Three Days and Lord Nafaryus, I still love Three Days very much though.
Don;t want to derail but what came out in 2015? I feel like I missed out.
:lol Not sure how a fadeout is "lazy songwriting." That doesn't even make sense. "The band didn't end a song the way I think it should have ended" is not "lazy."
::) The CD is one second shy of being A FULL DISC. Fuck you Dream Theater. I want that god damned second you thieving gypsies !!!
I don't get the hate for "my music player". What other choice did they have ? "My CD player" ? "My MP3 player" ? Whatever they picked would probably seem out dated in 10 years. So while it may not be optimal, "Music Player" seems like the best choice.I think the complaint is about the line in general, whether it was "music player", "mp3 player" or any other variation. It sounds fine the way it is.
I don't get the hate for "my music player". What other choice did they have ? "My CD player" ? "My MP3 player" ? Whatever they picked would probably seem out dated in 10 years. So while it may not be optimal, "Music Player" seems like the best choice.
I don't get the hate for "my music player". What other choice did they have ? "My CD player" ? "My MP3 player" ? Whatever they picked would probably seem out dated in 10 years. So while it may not be optimal, "Music Player" seems like the best choice.
It's not the wording. It's that the "my music player" line sounds a bit cheesy
I don't get the hate for "my music player". What other choice did they have ? "My CD player" ? "My MP3 player" ? Whatever they picked would probably seem out dated in 10 years. So while it may not be optimal, "Music Player" seems like the best choice.
It's not the wording. It's that the "my music player" line sounds a bit cheesy
I don't get the hate for "my music player". What other choice did they have ? "My CD player" ? "My MP3 player" ? Whatever they picked would probably seem out dated in 10 years. So while it may not be optimal, "Music Player" seems like the best choice.
It's not the wording. It's that the "my music player" line sounds a bit cheesy
I think the quick crying section is more cheesy, but I love cheese. :metal
I don't get the hate for "my music player". What other choice did they have ? "My CD player" ? "My MP3 player" ? Whatever they picked would probably seem out dated in 10 years. So while it may not be optimal, "Music Player" seems like the best choice.
It's not the wording. It's that the "my music player" line sounds a bit cheesy
criticisms of too many ballads, filler songs, not enough stand alone content; all miss the point.
Well... 'The Point' is liking it or not. So if you don't like ballads, or feel certain songs to be filler songs, or if you happen to like standalone content, you don't like the album. How could disliking something be 'missing the point'?
Lord Nafaryus is one of my favorite songs off the album. It's amazing.
criticisms of too many ballads, filler songs, not enough stand alone content; all miss the point.
Well... 'The Point' is liking it or not. So if you don't like ballads, or feel certain songs to be filler songs, or if you happen to like standalone content, you don't like the album. How could disliking something be 'missing the point'?
Disliking something certainly is not missing the point. If you don't like the sound, you don't like it. Vocalizing your dislike with the criticism of saying what the album isn't, isn't good criticism. You may disagree with the approach, but that isn't good criticism. It can be a perfect reason to dislike somethig personally. It contributes nothing to rating the album though. It misses the point.
Much how saying "I haven't digested it all . . . I don't like it" is more of an illogical emotional response than a critical one. Digest the whole thing, if you are going to openly state your dislike, find solid reasoning. I'm not saying you personally haven't done this (I don't know), but many are treading on the album because of a) "I" can't work through it's complexity b) "they" phoned it in.
The first says more about the listener than the music, the 2nd is CritFic: lazy criticism that creates a fictualization rather than explanation of why something isn't "good."
There's only a couple of albums that I'm as excited about as this one, 2015 was an amazing year for music, but this album keeps growing on me on every listen, I know I'm kinda getting ahead of myself but I can very easily see this album being top half DT material, might even crack the top 3.
Like I predicted though, the 'standout' tracks of the first few listen won't be as shockingly good as they were on first listen compared to the other songs, songs like Three Days and Lord Nafaryus, I still love Three Days very much though.
Don;t want to derail but what came out in 2015? I feel like I missed out.
I don't get the hate for "my music player". What other choice did they have ? "My CD player" ? "My MP3 player" ? Whatever they picked would probably seem out dated in 10 years. So while it may not be optimal, "Music Player" seems like the best choice.
It's not the wording. It's that the "my music player" line sounds a bit cheesy
First, awesome music! Must say though that I was amazed how cheesy the lyrics are :P It's better not listening them so closely.
I don't get the hate for "my music player". What other choice did they have ? "My CD player" ? "My MP3 player" ? Whatever they picked would probably seem out dated in 10 years. So while it may not be optimal, "Music Player" seems like the best choice.
It's not the wording. It's that the "my music player" line sounds a bit cheesy
Brother, Can You Hear Me? has become one of my favourite JLB efforts, ever. He's really acing in that song.
"I sing the song of freedom, my courage knows no bounds.
Brother, now I stand on solid ground.
Brother, I will never let you down.
Never LET YOUUUUU DOOOOOOOOOWN!"
So many shivers down my spine. So fucking great. :yarr
Has anyone been able to figure out what is that choir singing in the final seconds of Three Days, right after the tango section?
Can't tell if serious or not.:lol Not sure how a fadeout is "lazy songwriting." That doesn't even make sense. "The band didn't end a song the way I think it should have ended" is not "lazy."
::) The CD is one second shy of being A FULL DISC. Fuck you Dream Theater. I want that god damned second you thieving gypsies !!!
I think we can all say that there is plenty of music here, but why not add that extra second? :facepalm:
Nah it's more bluesy if anything.Agreed. It's their best album in 10 years, without a doubt.
In my opinion - The Astonishing would have carried on that amazing run of Scenes - Six Degrees - Train of thought - Octavarium.
It feels like it picks up where Octavarium left off.
The best :soon: album in my opinion.
Easily the best Mangini album.
:)
I'm a huge fan of "A Savior In The Square"/"When Your Time Has Come." So beautiful and grandiose, and constantly stuck in my head. Don't understand how anyone could find stuff like that forgettable. Not to mention all the other great stuff stuck in my head like "A New Beginning," "Moment of Betrayal," "Our New World" and so much more.
The question remains.Has anyone been able to figure out what is that choir singing in the final seconds of Three Days, right after the tango section?
https://docs.google.com/document/d/18fcD1U7H-v8l8raLuIPfoVNVs65vMGvbHQS00IUCpUk/preview#heading=h.95l4jmoloywa
Nah it's more bluesy if anything.Agreed. It's their best album in 10 years, without a doubt.
In my opinion - The Astonishing would have carried on that amazing run of Scenes - Six Degrees - Train of thought - Octavarium.
It feels like it picks up where Octavarium left off.
The best :soon: album in my opinion.
Easily the best Mangini album.
:)
I don't like it. At all. I am a huge DT fan and have seen them numerous times. I was looking forward to this tour, but I won't be going to watch them perform this album. I just couldn't get into it. Of course the musicianship is incredible. I also feel the this is James' best album of vocals. He was brilliant. However after listening to the album 3 times, I can't remember ONE single track that stands out that made me hum or sing a chorus to or catchy riff. For me, the tracks are too short and they never got into songs. I guess it's just a rock opera that HAS to be listened to over the entire act. To me, they focused way too much on the story and characters than the music. I assume now that this tour will be more of a visual play and DT just happens to be standing there playing background tracks. That's just not my thing. So for me, The Astonishing was a big let down and I will pass on it. I also didn't like BCaSL. I would rank this one right down near the bottom with it. I will just listen to Score for a while to restore my FAYTHE....see what I did there?
So we did not hear the same album. Plenty of catchy melodies for me. To say that they did not write songs is beyond my understanding. Sorry, mate, to each their own but... Some tracks still don't click with me, but it's not because they are not songs.
B.Lee
I have a hard time separating the tracks in my head. I'm constantly waking my phone up to see what song I'm on. The album becomes one huge blur (not complaining).
The question remains.Has anyone been able to figure out what is that choir singing in the final seconds of Three Days, right after the tango section?
https://docs.google.com/document/d/18fcD1U7H-v8l8raLuIPfoVNVs65vMGvbHQS00IUCpUk/preview#heading=h.95l4jmoloywa
Can't tell if serious or not.:lol Not sure how a fadeout is "lazy songwriting." That doesn't even make sense. "The band didn't end a song the way I think it should have ended" is not "lazy."
::) The CD is one second shy of being A FULL DISC. Fuck you Dream Theater. I want that god damned second you thieving gypsies !!!
I think we can all say that there is plenty of music here, but why not add that extra second? :facepalm:
I believe it's "Judgment Day is coming and you've only got three days... just three days!"Has anyone been able to figure out what is that choir singing in the final seconds of Three Days, right after the tango section?All I could make out was "Judgment Day is coming...."
It might have sounded better if songs flowed in and out of the NOMAC tracks instead of them being stand alone. Then they would have been more like transitional sounds between songs. It sounds awkward the way it is now to me.
It might have sounded better if songs flowed in and out of the NOMAC tracks instead of them being stand alone. Then they would have been more like transitional sounds between songs. It sounds awkward the way it is now to me.
I wondered about this too. Also, two or three songs contain in-song NOMAC sounds, yes? It feels like they're present in that abrupt transition in "Savior in the Square," and one Act II song I can't think of at the moment... also, whooshing noises in the overture I assumed were NOMACs. Anyone able to back me up on this?
There's alot of parts on the album that sound like pure Disney to me ESPECIALLY Begin Again. obviously not exact but alot of the faythe stuff reminds me of Menken.
Dream Theater (https://youtu.be/u2iWardV_7E?t=1m59s)....What I Hear (https://youtu.be/Ad7ejBn3KSQ?t=2m45s)
a
I don't like it. At all. I am a huge DT fan and have seen them numerous times. I was looking forward to this tour, but I won't be going to watch them perform this album. I just couldn't get into it. Of course the musicianship is incredible. I also feel the this is James' best album of vocals. He was brilliant. However after listening to the album 3 times, I can't remember ONE single track that stands out that made me hum or sing a chorus to or catchy riff. For me, the tracks are too short and they never got into songs. I guess it's just a rock opera that HAS to be listened to over the entire act. To me, they focused way too much on the story and characters than the music. I assume now that this tour will be more of a visual play and DT just happens to be standing there playing background tracks. That's just not my thing. So for me, The Astonishing was a big let down and I will pass on it. I also didn't like BCaSL. I would rank this one right down near the bottom with it. I will just listen to Score for a while to restore my FAYTHE....see what I did there?
Brother, Can You Hear Me? has become one of my favourite JLB efforts, ever. He's really acing in that song.Anyone else think of "Some Enchanted Evening" ("Ne... ver... let... her... goooooo!") on that last line?
"I sing the song of freedom, my courage knows no bounds.
Brother, now I stand on solid ground.
Brother, I will never let you down.
Never LET YOUUUUU DOOOOOOOOOWN!"
So many shivers down my spine. So fucking great. :yarr
Bands usually bring songs to a proper end when playing live, even if the studio version fades out.
Thanks, that's the one! For reference, the timestamps where I'm noticing NOMACs:Also, two or three songs contain in-song NOMAC sounds, yes? It feels like they're present in that abrupt transition in "Savior in the Square," and one Act II song I can't think of at the moment... also, whooshing noises in the overture I assumed were NOMACs. Anyone able to back me up on this?I believe the song in Act II you are looking for is "The Path That Divides".
Regarding the "my music player" line--which I also find grating and takes me out of the story...This is my favorite moment of the album. Made me tear up on first listen. Just reaches right into that part of my memory when I was a new kid at school in 7th grade (brutal year to be the new kid) and the only friend I had was my music player.
I just re upload it here https://vimeo.com/153834854 :lolAs you know I've been dying waiting for a true second video in The Astonishing web page, I make my own video then, hahaha
Well, it is not really my own video, but I just realize the video from The Gift of Music in Dream Theater official youtube (the one they use for TGoM release for the first time) is matching with Descent of NOMACS.
So I just put and sync the audio of Descent of NOMACS with that video, and it absolutely great & cool !!!
I am a little bit sure, this video will be used as an opening video before their start playing live in their upcoming concert.
You can watch it heredeleted
Blocked in my country because of copyrights.
B.Lee
Regarding the "my music player" line--which I also find grating and takes me out of the story...This is my favorite moment of the album. Made me tear up on first listen. Just reaches right into that part of my memory when I was a new kid at school in 7th grade (brutal year to be the new kid) and the only friend I had was my music player.
This is not to say you're wrong... I have plenty of thoughts on where JP & co. might have used a second pair of eyes when lyric-writing over the past several albums... but just, one's trash lyric is another's treasure. :)
I just re upload it here https://vimeo.com/153834854 :lol
Bands usually bring songs to a proper end when playing live, even if the studio version fades out.
are you sure it is sound of NOMACS?? I think that's sound of... umm, I dont know what it is, some kind of flying machines the realm family ride when they traveling to ravenskill.Thanks, that's the one! For reference, the timestamps where I'm noticing NOMACs:Also, two or three songs contain in-song NOMAC sounds, yes? It feels like they're present in that abrupt transition in "Savior in the Square," and one Act II song I can't think of at the moment... also, whooshing noises in the overture I assumed were NOMACs. Anyone able to back me up on this?I believe the song in Act II you are looking for is "The Path That Divides".
Dystopian Overture: 1:12
Savior in the Square: 3:25
Path That Divides: 0:36
Anyone able to figure out what the choir is singing in those stabs around 3:20 of "Savior in the Square"?
well, I think that is right lyric for the choir :tupI believe it's "Judgment Day is coming and you've only got three days... just three days!"Has anyone been able to figure out what is that choir singing in the final seconds of Three Days, right after the tango section?All I could make out was "Judgment Day is coming...."
Thankyou man ;DI just re upload it here https://vimeo.com/153834854 :lolPringka this is better than anything we officially got so far, certinly better than the trailer they gave us, great work dude :tup
I'm going to make my dream fan-edit of the Astonishing, It'll be interesting, I'll get back when I'm done ;DWhat it is? Video, audio or pic?? Cant wait it man :tup
Our New World is one of my least favorite songs on the record, kinda surprises me to see people rank it so highly. I love the guitars, sure, but the chorus is boring and they say "world" more times in it than Asian Kung-Fu GenerationYeah same, I mean I like it well enough but I definitely don't find it one of the exciting tracks.
There's only a couple of albums that I'm as excited about as this one, 2015 was an amazing year for music, but this album keeps growing on me on every listen, I know I'm kinda getting ahead of myself but I can very easily see this album being top half DT material, might even crack the top 3.
Like I predicted though, the 'standout' tracks of the first few listen won't be as shockingly good as they were on first listen compared to the other songs, songs like Three Days and Lord Nafaryus, I still love Three Days very much though.
Don;t want to derail but what came out in 2015? I feel like I missed out.
Here you can find some of DTF's faves: https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=44941.0
Highlights in the end for me were The Dear Hunter - Act IV, Native Construct - Quiet World and Periphery - Juggernaut.
Back on-topic: Just came back from a local music store and I got the salesman to check out The Astonishing with my convincing words :metal
Thankyou man ;DI just re upload it here https://vimeo.com/153834854 :lolPringka this is better than anything we officially got so far, certinly better than the trailer they gave us, great work dude :tup
But I still hope second video from astonishing website page is a great animation video, I always hope it will be Dystopian Overture Video Clip ;D
Symphony X =Underworld is a fantastic album from 2015!There's only a couple of albums that I'm as excited about as this one, 2015 was an amazing year for music, but this album keeps growing on me on every listen, I know I'm kinda getting ahead of myself but I can very easily see this album being top half DT material, might even crack the top 3.
Like I predicted though, the 'standout' tracks of the first few listen won't be as shockingly good as they were on first listen compared to the other songs, songs like Three Days and Lord Nafaryus, I still love Three Days very much though.
Don;t want to derail but what came out in 2015? I feel like I missed out.
Here you can find some of DTF's faves: https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=44941.0
Highlights in the end for me were The Dear Hunter - Act IV, Native Construct - Quiet World and Periphery - Juggernaut.
Back on-topic: Just came back from a local music store and I got the salesman to check out The Astonishing with my convincing words :metal
Thanks. Will have to check some of those out. The only ones that I remembered off the top of my head were Iron Maiden, Def Leppard, and Faith No More.
With the Dream Theater and Megadeth releases this early in the year....I think this year will be even better.
You will find out what it is :soon:
at least give us a little spoiler :sad: :sad: :sad:Thankyou man ;DI just re upload it here https://vimeo.com/153834854 :lolPringka this is better than anything we officially got so far, certinly better than the trailer they gave us, great work dude :tup
But I still hope second video from astonishing website page is a great animation video, I always hope it will be Dystopian Overture Video Clip ;D
You will find out what it is soon...
I can't even imagine how dragged out a 3 Act version would be.
It would have allowed space for more music to balance the narrative and cater to traditional Dream Theater fans, not talking about myself.
Thankyou man ;DI just re upload it here https://vimeo.com/153834854 :lolPringka this is better than anything we officially got so far, certinly better than the trailer they gave us, great work dude :tup
But I still hope second video from astonishing website page is a great animation video, I always hope it will be Dystopian Overture Video Clip ;D
You will find out what it is soon...
I am seeing very little chatter about Dystopian Overture, probably them doing another overture isn't as chatter-worthy as much of what they did elsewhere on this record, but the middle section where the orchestra plays one of the main themes followed by the full band coming back in with the choir singing is freaking AWESOME. :hefdaddy :hefdaddyI think it's their best overture. My favorite part is definitely the last section with Jordan's synth lead and the choir, but the whole thing is great.
I am seeing very little chatter about Dystopian Overture, probably them doing another overture isn't as chatter-worthy as much of what they did elsewhere on this record, but the middle section where the orchestra plays one of the main themes followed by the full band coming back in with the choir singing is freaking AWESOME. :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
I am seeing very little chatter about Dystopian Overture, probably them doing another overture isn't as chatter-worthy as much of what they did elsewhere on this record, but the middle section where the orchestra plays one of the main themes followed by the full band coming back in with the choir singing is freaking AWESOME. :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
that's because most of the chatter is being done by machines. :neverusethis:
I am seeing very little chatter about Dystopian Overture, probably them doing another overture isn't as chatter-worthy as much of what they did elsewhere on this record, but the middle section where the orchestra plays one of the main themes followed by the full band coming back in with the choir singing is freaking AWESOME. :hefdaddy :hefdaddyI think it's their best overture. My favorite part is definitely the last section with Jordan's synth lead and the choir, but the whole thing is great.
Look like he does,Thankyou man ;DI just re upload it here https://vimeo.com/153834854 :lolPringka this is better than anything we officially got so far, certinly better than the trailer they gave us, great work dude :tup
But I still hope second video from astonishing website page is a great animation video, I always hope it will be Dystopian Overture Video Clip ;D
You will find out what it is soon...
Do you know something we don't Bosky?
I can't go that far - it's hard to top Overture 1928 - but it's pretty great.Overture 1928 was formerly my favorite. It has now moved down to second place. Both are great!
I am seeing very little chatter about Dystopian Overture, probably them doing another overture isn't as chatter-worthy as much of what they did elsewhere on this record, but the middle section where the orchestra plays one of the main themes followed by the full band coming back in with the choir singing is freaking AWESOME. :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
You will find out what it is :soon:
:emo:
Fingers crossed Petrucci was lying about there being no behind the scenes and it's 2 hours and 10 minutes of studio footage
:drool:
I'm only on my second listen. I feel like the overture will be much more amazing once I get all the musical themes on the album. The second listen and I am already much more enjoying the album since instead of following the story like I did the first time, I am just really enjoying the music.
In terms of overtures, the first one is cool and sets the mood. The second one though is superfluous.
In terms of overtures, the first one is cool and sets the mood. The second one though is superfluous.
Looked at as a musical theater production, it is not superfluous. It is an entr'acte, which bridges the two acts.
having Xander flying on the back of a raven (or whatever) has nothing to do with the story...right?I have same question about this :huh:
A thought on the live production of this album. I mean, I love JP and all, but it would do the show a great disservice to have him as the only other singer to JLB. A few really skilled backup singers would just push this album over the top.
Thoughts?
Man, reading through some of the comments on reviews online and people are not getting it, or downright hating it. Looks like a knee-jerk reaction after a one time skip through listen to me..... :tdwn
The Answer
ARHYS
They ask me Arhys,
Could things be any tougher,
The answer's no surprise
I heard this part and I was thinking " oh please, *don't* go " Yes. They. Could! " :lol
The Answer
ARHYS
They ask me Arhys,
Could things be any tougher,
The answer's no surprise
I heard this part and I was thinking " oh please, *don't* go " Yes. They. Could! " :lol
It's from A Better Life not The Answer
Wow, so much to read in this thread. I hope my own opinion isn't too late or repetitive.
You didn't like the way
I put the knife in wrong
You didn't like the way
My blood spilled on your brand new floor
Whole lotta this in this thread.
But I suppose I shouldn't be surprised when this fandom is one of the most ravenous, demanding and pretentious ones around (and I say that with a finger pointing at myself as well ;D )
This is the 12th studio album this band has released since I became a fan, and with the exception of SFAM, each one has always taken a few days of listening to sink in and grow into the mnemonic milepost of life that each one is for me. And that's what has kept me a fan through 20 some odd years.
That being said, I recognize this effort for what it is. Their attempt at doing something between an audible movie and a soundtrack. I didn't go into this expecting another Scenes or Six Degrees type album, and I suspect some of those that are the most angry or dislike it probably did just that to varying degrees.
We as a fandom have cried for something epic and different from them over the last few releases. Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts, still releasing great material, but lacking the different flavors and directions we'd come to love from 8V and before.
The refrains went something like this:
"Man, this is a alright album, but it's no SFAM, SDoIT or 8v... wish they would do something epic like that again.. come on, they're DREEEEAAAMM THEATER!"
So here we are. They just gave us a 2:30-ish long album filled with so many new flavors and directions that at times it's like you're listening to a OST. Something they've never done before and few bands could even conceptualize.
Thanks, guys. Really. Thanks for this. You had the guts to do a complete 90 degree turn and reach for something incredible.
Sure, they could have used some help in the lyrics department (but that's always been an enduring trait of this band for me) and probably could have found a slightly less cliche story and characters. But I'm not entirely sure the story and characters weren't supposed to be cheesy and cliche. I could totally see JP having a laugh going "Heh... Faythe, Nefaryus... People are gonna freakin laugh their butts off when they read this. It'll be fun!"
Or maybe not *shrugs* Who knows. But I seriously doubt all parties involved in the creation of this honestly thought the characters and story were so unique and ground breaking that it should be taken seriously. :police: I think we're the only ones projecting that.
Point is... I don't really care much. This band did what I've always loved them for, and that's take me on a musical adventure somewhere with melodies and harmonies that are completely new that I find myself humming randomly out of the blue. To compare this to anything else they've done and then point to it's flaws is pretty closed minded, if you ask me. We wanted them to do something different, and they did. It's like eating salad everyday, complaining about it, then complaining the soup you got doesn't taste like a salad.
And to those that complain there isn't ONE track on here that's amazing all the way through, I think the whole album is intended to be "watched" like you do a movie, from start to finish, without trying to take scenes by themselves and then lament when they don't stand on their own.
Even the scene at the end of Aliens where Ripley appears in the loader to challenge the queen xenomorph and protect Newt doesn't hold much power without watching the struggle that's taken place up to that moment.
It's going to get the customary 20 more listen throughs (on top of the 10 or so it's already had) and then go in my library, to be pulled out for specific occasions that fit it. My next road trip, for example. This is a perfect road trip album.
And I don't regret spending the money on it one bit. Or buying the ticket for the live show coming in a couple of months.
Dystopian Overture is awesome, and has a great mood that sets it apart from the rest of the album. While I understand the place and purpose of the other instrumental, it feels more patched together and doesn't flow great imo.I think of it in terms of the live show. After an intermission of maybe 20-30 minutes (time enough to towel off, go to the bathroom, possibly change clothes, and rehydrate) the reminder of the themes that went on in act 1 would be appreciated. That's likely how they planned it. They recorded it as they'll perform it live.
Dystopian Overture is awesome, and has a great mood that sets it apart from the rest of the album. While I understand the place and purpose of the other instrumental, it feels more patched together and doesn't flow great imo.I think of it in terms of the live show. After an intermission of maybe 20-30 minutes (time enough to towel off, go to the bathroom, possibly change clothes, and rehydrate) the reminder of the themes that went on in act 1 would be appreciated. That's likely how they planned it. They recorded it as they'll perform it live.
Awesome first post.
I can truly understand how some/many fans would not connect with this if their expectations weren't tweaked in advance. This
album is a different animal with the sole intent of grandiosity, and creating a mental image through the aural medium. I just
hope that the fans who don't like it at least respect the risk they took and the amount of sheer effort that went into it's creation.
Welcome to DTF!
having Xander flying on the back of a raven (or whatever) has nothing to do with the story...right?I have same question about this :huh:
Dystopian Overture is awesome, and has a great mood that sets it apart from the rest of the album. While I understand the place and purpose of the other instrumental, it feels more patched together and doesn't flow great imo.I think of it in terms of the live show. After an intermission of maybe 20-30 minutes (time enough to towel off, go to the bathroom, possibly change clothes, and rehydrate) the reminder of the themes that went on in act 1 would be appreciated. That's likely how they planned it. They recorded it as they'll perform it live.
As I said, I do understand it has its place and purpose in the grand scheme of the album. Nonetheless, it doesn't work for me as a piece of music to listen to.
Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan the future… trouble is coming :sad:
Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan the future… trouble is coming :sad:
Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan the future… trouble is coming :sad:
And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus? :neverusethis:
having Xander flying on the back of a raven (or whatever) has nothing to do with the story...right?I have same question about this :huh:
And to those that complain there isn't ONE track on here that's amazing all the way through, I think the whole album is intended to be "watched" like you do a movie, from start to finish, without trying to take scenes by themselves and then lament when they don't stand on their own.
Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan the future… trouble is coming :sad:
And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus? :neverusethis:
Because his gift only works when his music can be heard. :P
And to those that complain there isn't ONE track on here that's amazing all the way through, I think the whole album is intended to be "watched" like you do a movie, from start to finish, without trying to take scenes by themselves and then lament when they don't stand on their own.
The more I listen to this, the more I hear this as a Broadway type stage play. It's pretty great!
People need to read the small text at the bottom of the contract before requesting his healing services.Because his gift only works when his music can be heard. :PDaryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan the future… trouble is coming :sad:
And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus? :neverusethis:
:lol So he can go around curing blindness, but not deafness. That's a shame.
Thankyou man ;DI just re upload it here https://vimeo.com/153834854 :lolPringka this is better than anything we officially got so far, certinly better than the trailer they gave us, great work dude :tup
But I still hope second video from astonishing website page is a great animation video, I always hope it will be Dystopian Overture Video Clip ;D
You will find out what it is soon...
Do you know something we don't Bosky?
I am seeing very little chatter about Dystopian Overture, probably them doing another overture isn't as chatter-worthy as much of what they did elsewhere on this record, but the middle section where the orchestra plays one of the main themes followed by the full band coming back in with the choir singing is freaking AWESOME. :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
A thought on the live production of this album. I mean, I love JP and all, but it would do the show a great disservice to have him as the only other singer to JLB. A few really skilled backup singers would just push this album over the top.
Thoughts?
I'm always opposed to the idea of bringing guest vocalists due to how it would attach the specific songs to people who are not always going to be available in future tours. The lady from SFAM had about as big a role as I would like a guest vocalist to have on a DT album.Yeah... I can't watch the Live Metropolis version of Spirit Carries On without tearing up a bit at the end. Theresa Thomason and that choir MADE that song what it is. And it's never the same without them.
Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts
Eh.. the word "Mostly" was in there for a reason. I personally didn't feel that way either, but a good portion of fellow fans I know did. Your mileage may vary.Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts
Good post. But as for the part I quoted, just...no. Yes, that is a common opinion. But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority. Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut." Ever.
Eh.. the word "Mostly" was in there for a reason. I personally didn't feel that way either, but a good portion of fellow fans I know did. Your mileage may vary.Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts
Good post. But as for the part I quoted, just...no. Yes, that is a common opinion. But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority. Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut." Ever.
It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?
Eh.. the word "Mostly" was in there for a reason. I personally didn't feel that way either, but a good portion of fellow fans I know did. Your mileage may vary.Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts
Good post. But as for the part I quoted, just...no. Yes, that is a common opinion. But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority. Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut." Ever.
:tup[Eh.. the word "Mostly" was in there for a reason. I personally didn't feel that way either, but a good portion of fellow fans I know did. Your mileage may vary.Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts
Good post. But as for the part I quoted, just...no. Yes, that is a common opinion. But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority. Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut." Ever.
No problem. But when people post something that assumes a general consensus that is probably not actually the consensus, I just feel the need to step in and point out that that assumption is not entirely accurate.
Anyhow, that is largely immaterial to the discussion as a whole, so...carry on.
It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?
Yeah, that's not a bad way to do it either.It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?
This may seem like a joke, but break it up based on the NOMACS tracks. It works.
People need to read the small text at the bottom of the contract before requesting his healing services.Because his gift only works when his music can be heard. :PDaryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan for the future… trouble is coming :sad:
And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus? :neverusethis:
:lol So he can go around curing blindness, but not deafness. That's a shame.
People need to read the small text at the bottom of the contract before requesting his healing services.Because his gift only works when his music can be heard. :PDaryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan for the future… trouble is coming :sad:
And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus? :neverusethis:
:lol So he can go around curing blindness, but not deafness. That's a shame.
I suppose there are no hospitals in T.G.N.E. anymore, just music venues for Gabriel to play his show :lol
Depends on what you got into them for in the first place. I'm always amazed when people say they got into this band for how heavy they are. Personally, I've never thought of them as such 0_oEh.. the word "Mostly" was in there for a reason. I personally didn't feel that way either, but a good portion of fellow fans I know did. Your mileage may vary.Everyone mostly agrees that they'd gotten into a rut of sorts
Good post. But as for the part I quoted, just...no. Yes, that is a common opinion. But it is also a minority one, even if it may be a sizable minority. Personally, I have NEVER felt that the band was in a "rut." Ever.
Also, I think 'rut' is a tricky word as I believe in bands trying new directions/styles in growth through the years, but I also want to hear them as "them" by keeping to a certain familiarity that attracted me to the music in the first place, which some would call a 'rut', I guess, if that makes sense.
I can't understand people complaining The Astonishing isn't technical enough.
It's their THIRTEENTH album.
if you want technical Dream Theater - go and listen to any of the past TWELVE albums....
::)
My theory back when the video was posted is that Ravenskill is called that way because their people literally have skills at riding giant ravens.I'm assuming it's just a cool-sounding place name JP came up with based on real places. There are a lot of "kills" in the NY area and thereabouts -- it's a Dutch word for creek or river.
I've climbed the mountain that is this thread, and I'm not surprised by anything I've read. Lots of unique opinions, and for 2+ hours of music, I'm glad to see mostly positive reactions. I'm disappointed by the lack of love given specifically to the song Ravenskill (I think it might be my favorite, I'm still deliberating), but one thing remains clear: This album requires multiple listens. Unless you're the type of person who specifically seeks out analysis and breakdowns, there are so many nuggets in this album, and links and themes that the gravity of it is almost certainly something that bears weight (no pun intended).
RE: A New Beginning fade out - I have a feeling the fade out is 1) due to the time constraint of mortal CDs and 2) an opportunity for the band to take an extended jam session in the live show. I don't think it abrupt or out of place (especially given what it leads up to). I will say that I mistakenly coined it as the end of act 1 the first 3-4 listens, forgetting that The Road to Revolution is right after.
RE: My muuusiiiic plaaaaayerrrrr - I didn't find it as grating as I expected from early reviews, and my wife outright loves the song. This was discussed somewhere else, but I think there's just a certain level of 'cheese' that us manly metal men have problems digesting because we think it 'uncool'. When my wife said she started liking Act of Faythe more than Three Days, I started to gain an understanding from her outside perspective. Nothing on the album reached levels of "I'm just a poor girl..." or "Beginnings get complicated..." to me.
I'm still listening 30 minutes at a time to and from work every day, and this weekend I'll sit down again with the HDTracks version.
Post
Speaking of the HD version, if anyone has the regular cd and the HD tracks, is there a significant difference?
Doesn't seem like a joke at all -- that's how the band intended it to be broken up, yeah? I assumed that's why they put the NOMAC tracks where they are.Yeah, that's not a bad way to do it either.It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?
This may seem like a joke, but break it up based on the NOMACS tracks. It works.
People need to read the small text at the bottom of the contract before requesting his healing services.Because his gift only works when his music can be heard. :PDaryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan for the future… trouble is coming :sad:
And why does Gabriel's music cure stabbing, but not tinnitus? :neverusethis:
:lol So he can go around curing blindness, but not deafness. That's a shame.
I suppose there are no hospitals in T.G.N.E. anymore, just music venues for Gabriel to play his show :lol
Heaven's Cove Hospital?
I'm probably of the minority who thinks that ADToE was a feeling of revitalization in the DT camp.
I can't understand people complaining The Astonishing isn't technical enough.
It's their THIRTEENTH album.
if you want technical Dream Theater - go and listen to any of the past TWELVE albums....
::)
And even though it may not be their most technical album, I probably still couldn't play more than half of it on guitar :lol
My theory back when the video was posted is that Ravenskill is called that way because their people literally have skills at riding giant ravens.I'm assuming it's just a cool-sounding place name JP came up with based on real places. There are a lot of "kills" in the NY area and thereabouts -- it's a Dutch word for creek or river.
I feel like the DT 'rut' was most apparent during BCSL. I'm probably of the minority who thinks that ADToE was a feeling of revitalization in the DT camp. Did they play it a bit safe? Maybe, but I felt the fun and enjoyment in the music they made.
I feel like the DT 'rut' was most apparent during BCSL. I'm probably of the minority who thinks that ADToE was a feeling of revitalization in the DT camp. Did they play it a bit safe? Maybe, but I felt the fun and enjoyment in the music they made.
Never understood this opinion at all. ADTOE is the most stale rutty album DT have ever made imo, going through the motions to stay on their regular schedule (that's not to say it's bad, I mostly liked it, but I feel no excitement or energy in it, and it wore out quickly). The fun element disappeared when MP left, and finally returned with TA. This album is the first time in a while I've felt that energy and passion that I get from say SFAM. I can't wait to hear what they do when they return to a regular album format.
Haha figured. And yeah, there's Arthur Kill, Fresh Kills, Kill van Kull... the Schuylkill which runs through Philly, and a lot down in Delaware too, including the amazingly named Murderkill River. * The More You Know *Yeah, my theory was not meant to be taken seriously. I also figured it was just for the cool factor. Although I didn't knew about the fact there was a lot ''kills'' in the area of New-York. And I also didn't knew what it meant. So thanks for the new knowledge :)My theory back when the video was posted is that Ravenskill is called that way because their people literally have skills at riding giant ravens.I'm assuming it's just a cool-sounding place name JP came up with based on real places. There are a lot of "kills" in the NY area and thereabouts -- it's a Dutch word for creek or river.
Speaking of the HD version, if anyone has the regular cd and the HD tracks, is there a significant difference?
I feel like the DT 'rut' was most apparent during BCSL. I'm probably of the minority who thinks that ADToE was a feeling of revitalization in the DT camp. Did they play it a bit safe? Maybe, but I felt the fun and enjoyment in the music they made. DT12 felt like an attempt to buckle down and make something cohesive (Illumination Theory not withstanding) that could come across as their most radio safe record as a whole. The Astonishing completely surpassed all expectations set by the current lineup IMO. Nothing safe, standard or ordinary about this album.
I feel like the DT 'rut' was most apparent during BCSL. I'm probably of the minority who thinks that ADToE was a feeling of revitalization in the DT camp. Did they play it a bit safe? Maybe, but I felt the fun and enjoyment in the music they made.
Never understood this opinion at all. ADTOE is the most stale rutty album DT have ever made imo, going through the motions to stay on their regular schedule (that's not to say it's bad, I mostly liked it, but I feel no excitement or energy in it, and it wore out quickly). The fun element disappeared when MP left, and finally returned with TA. This album is the first time in a while I've felt that energy and passion that I get from say SFAM. I can't wait to hear what they do when they return to a regular album format.
I don't know how you listen to LNF, BitS, Outcry and BAI and not feel the energy and fun. I would understand people saying DT12 is stale and rutty (something about the dark production), but ADToE had the spark for me, and clearly for the band.
I've also always been of the mindset that complexity isn't always about the individual players either. Look at Pain of Salvation - some of their best and most complex sounding parts simply come from the juxtaposition they create between two simpler guitar parts. You get a lot of that on The Astonishing between JP and JR.
Is The Astonishing generally considered a bad album by most fans? I was looking at this site:
https://www.sputnikmusic.com/bands/Dream-Theater/49/ (https://www.sputnikmusic.com/bands/Dream-Theater/49/)
and saw that it is so far rates as the second worst DT album, only ahead of WDADU. I come here and see 80-90 percent of people really liking it, and other places everyone seem to hate it...
I have read people complaining that this is album is musically too simple.
Let me just say :facepalm:
I played along to A Life Left Behind on my piano last night and was marvelling at JP+JR's composition. For such a serene sounding, typical 6/8 ballad - they really pulled out all the stops. MULTIPLE modulations of key centre between verse and chorus, and multiple shifts of mood as well - all packed into one badass song.
It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?
Personally, if I had to pick a favorite, standout section of the album, it would be the run of songs in Act I from Ravenskill through A New Beginning. That is a good combo to get a good flavor for both the music and the story.
To me, some of the "chunks" that I feel have good flow and I am beginning to gain the most familiarity are:
-Act I, tracks 1-8 (yeah, I know that is a LONG stretch, but it makes logical sense in terms of story, and has a good pacing; to me, the pacing drops off a bit at Act of Faythe).
-Act I, tracks 14-19 (which is what I recommended above)
-Act II, tracks 1-5 (sets up the first half of Act II nicely and has really good flow)
-Act II, tracks 7-10 (these songs just feel right as one unit, and are unified by the action of the story)
-Act II, tracks 11-14 (as with the previous section, this section is very unified in terms of the action of the story; music-wise, it is less intense and doesn't feel as climactic as I would normally expect for the conclusion of an album. But it fits together well, so to respond to your question about logical "chunks," this one makes sense in terms of helping digest the story)
It's hard for me to find time to sit down and listen to The Astonishing in full, and I still dont really know the album all that well. I feel like it's easy for me to break it down into several small chunks, like 3-5 songs at a time. Any suggestions on what would be good combinations ?
This may seem like a joke, but break it up based on the NOMACS tracks. It works.
I have read people complaining that this is album is musically too simple.
Let me just say :facepalm:
I played along to A Life Left Behind on my piano last night and was marvelling at JP+JR's composition. For such a serene sounding, typical 6/8 ballad - they really pulled out all the stops. MULTIPLE modulations of key centre between verse and chorus, and multiple shifts of mood as well - all packed into one badass song.
Daryus ends up deaf, but he still is the Crown Prince, right? So that evil bastard is the future king of an Empire where music will rise again… and he's deaf? I don't really think he'll stick to Nafaryus' plan the future… trouble is coming :sad:I highly doubt they're obliged to keep the father to son tradition as it has only been there for less than 300 years. Considering how Gabriel will marry the princess, Nafaryus owes his daughter's life to Gabriel, the people owe their freedom to Gabriel, Daryus defied his parents' orders, and he will be deaf in a more musical society than ever...
I have a weird feeling today. I just hope i'm not in the mood for music, because i have absolutely no desire to listen to the album. I've only listened to it five times, and it was getting better every time. The fifth time i believe every track except the Nomac tracks gave me chills. I tried listening to it yesterday but i wasn't feeling it, so i turned it off halfway though. Today i just don't want to put it on. I don't understand it, because i absolutely love the album...That's over 11 hours of music, you're probably just zoned out.
I have a weird feeling today. I just hope i'm not in the mood for music, because i have absolutely no desire to listen to the album. I've only listened to it five times, and it was getting better every time. The fifth time i believe every track except the Nomac tracks gave me chills. I tried listening to it yesterday but i wasn't feeling it, so i turned it off halfway though. Today i just don't want to put it on. I don't understand it, because i absolutely love the album...That's over 11 hours of music, you're probably just zoned out.
I hope and believe that it's just this. I haven't had a desire to listen to anything else either.
I'm on listen number 8 or 9. Still really enjoying it.I'm in the same boat as well, although I haven't had the time to sit through more than an Act at a time in the last two days because of work. :lol
I'm on listen number 8 or 9. Still really enjoying it.I'm in the same boat as well, although I haven't had the time to sit through more than an Act at a time in the last two days because of work. :lol
I hope and believe that it's just this. I haven't had a desire to listen to anything else either.
I'm in one of those periods right now. Been going pretty strong for a few months now.
The most shocking part of this album is JLB. Where has he been for the past 15 years? He sounds amazing on this album, nearly as good as he did on SDOIT.. maybe even as good.
Is it possible that Portnoy was not allowing him to sing as flamboyantly and over the top? Or perhaps it was the way they were producing the vocals? James' soaring over the top vocals is what originally got me into DT so its nice to see him released from his cage on this album!
Noob question but can somebody say which are each characters' themes/melodies? Faythe is quite obvious (Act of Faythe) but others?
Themes seem less assigned by character and more assigned by emotion / mood.Noob question but can somebody say which are each characters' themes/melodies? Faythe is quite obvious (Act of Faythe) but others?
Faythe - Act of Faythe themes
Gabriel - The Answer Themes and it's variations
Arhys - Brother Can You Hear Me? / A better life themes
Nefaryus - Anything dark, evil and edgy (with a Disney villain feel) ;D
Xander, Evangeline and The Empress don't really seem to have a reoccurring theme of their own.
Nearest I can tell anyways. You can hear the different themes revisited on the final track 34 Astonishing.
Yeah, you're not wrong in the slightest. The themes are more based on events or emotions rather than character. But if you had to draw a dotted line to each one, that's how I'd do it.Themes seem less assigned by character and more assigned by emotion / mood.Noob question but can somebody say which are each characters' themes/melodies? Faythe is quite obvious (Act of Faythe) but others?
Faythe - Act of Faythe themes
Gabriel - The Answer Themes and it's variations
Arhys - Brother Can You Hear Me? / A better life themes
Nefaryus - Anything dark, evil and edgy (with a Disney villain feel) ;D
Xander, Evangeline and The Empress don't really seem to have a reoccurring theme of their own.
Nearest I can tell anyways. You can hear the different themes revisited on the final track 34 Astonishing.
There's a "musical analysis" thread that might have more on this (but I haven't checked it recently).
I don't see how any DT fan could hate on Moment Of Betrayal. Snare sound aside, and no it doesn't sound like Awake, but isn't songs like this why you listen to DT??? It is for me.
Heh...yea...when I first saw Ravenskill I thought of the killing of ravens.
Faythe - Act of Faythe themesAnd Daryus, I would say, is the main theme of A Tempting Offer and its variations near the end of The Path That Divides.
Gabriel - The Answer Themes and it's variations
Arhys - Brother Can You Hear Me? / A better life themes
Nefaryus - Anything dark, evil and edgy (with a Disney villain feel) ;D
Xander, Evangeline and The Empress don't really seem to have a reoccurring theme of their own.
Nearest I can tell anyways. You can hear the different themes revisited on the final track 34 Astonishing.
I'm generally a fan of this guy, but he just doesn't get prog rock/metal it seems... He's almost always bashing prog when he reviews it, but to call The Astonishing "All proficiency, no soul" is just wrong.
https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s (https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s)
I'm generally a fan of this guy, but he just doesn't get prog rock/metal it seems... He's almost always bashing prog when he reviews it, but to call The Astonishing "All proficiency, no soul" is just wrong.
https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s (https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s)
Man, I just love the main rift and grove of Our New World. Have never heard anything like this from DT before.
I'm generally a fan of this guy, but he just doesn't get prog rock/metal it seems... He's almost always bashing prog when he reviews it, but to call The Astonishing "All proficiency, no soul" is just wrong.
https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s (https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s)
He's full of shit, he says he's hoping the album would put the final nail into rock opera's coffin, what fan of music would wish something like that on fellow fans? I fuckin hate rap but I don't wish it to die since I know that brings it's fans joy!
Except dance music that's made for the sole purpose of dancing in big parties/raves, these fuckers deserve joy to be taken away from them. /hypocrisy in the afternoon
I'm generally a fan of this guy, but he just doesn't get prog rock/metal it seems... He's almost always bashing prog when he reviews it, but to call The Astonishing "All proficiency, no soul" is just wrong.
https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s (https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s)
He's full of shit, he says he's hoping the album would put the final nail into rock opera's coffin, what fan of music would wish something like that on fellow fans? I fuckin hate rap but I don't wish it to die since I know that brings it's fans joy!
Except dance music that's made for the sole purpose of dancing in big parties/raves, these fuckers deserve joy to be taken away from them. /hypocrisy in the afternoon
He was bashing the las\test two Steven Wilson albums as well.
He was bashing the las\test two Steven Wilson albums as well.
Wait...so now he does have good taste? I'm confused. ???
He was bashing the las\test two Steven Wilson albums as well.
Wait...so now he does have good taste? I'm confused. ???
(https://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/kingshmegland/download%201_zpsfaos0oat.jpg) (https://s583.photobucket.com/user/kingshmegland/media/download%201_zpsfaos0oat.jpg.html)
:corn I know you don't like him, but it was just an example of some other prog rock that reviewer guy was bashing :lol. I've only seen him liking one prog rock album, and that was "In the Court of the Crimson King".He was bashing the latest two Steven Wilson albums as well.
Wait...so now he does have good taste? I'm confused. ???
And here's another reason why you have to listen to DT albums like this several times...
I'm on probably the the 10th listen through or so, and just now caught the forshadowing of "Our New World" as the intro to "A Savior In The Square"
Can't help but think this album would be a little better with MP's drumming. I miss all his different percussion sounds he'd make.
I'm generally a fan of this guy, but he just doesn't get prog rock/metal it seems... He's almost always bashing prog when he reviews it, but to call The Astonishing "All proficiency, no soul" is just wrong.
https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s (https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s)
He's full of shit, he says he's hoping the album would put the final nail into rock opera's coffin, what fan of music would wish something like that on fellow fans? I fuckin hate rap but I don't wish it to die since I know that brings it's fans joy!
Except dance music that's made for the sole purpose of dancing in big parties/raves, these fuckers deserve joy to be taken away from them. /hypocrisy in the afternoon
This album has a bitter/sweet feel for me. I Love it the whole way through and gets better with each listen. My wife (who's name is Victoria) passed away last summer, she loved DT's softer side and was a huge fan of James Labrie. Everytime I listen to TA, I know how much she would have been enjoying listening to this. Probably more so than any other album. Her fav song was Beneath The Surface.. This album is loaded with songs with feel and emotion and JLB shines! I personally dedicate this to her...
Who does the " Troops fall in " etc etc at the beginning of The Answer ??Do you mean A Better Life? Because that's what I'm talking about as well
This album has a bitter/sweet feel for me. I Love it the whole way through and gets better with each listen. My wife (who's name is Victoria) passed away last summer, she loved DT's softer side and was a huge fan of James Labrie. Everytime I listen to TA, I know how much she would have been enjoying listening to this. Probably more so than any other album. Her fav song was Beneath The Surface.. This album is loaded with songs with feel and emotion and JLB shines! I personally dedicate this to her...
Faythe - Act of Faythe themesAnd Daryus, I would say, is the main theme of A Tempting Offer and its variations near the end of The Path That Divides.
Gabriel - The Answer Themes and it's variations
Arhys - Brother Can You Hear Me? / A better life themes
Nefaryus - Anything dark, evil and edgy (with a Disney villain feel) ;D
Xander, Evangeline and The Empress don't really seem to have a reoccurring theme of their own.
Nearest I can tell anyways. You can hear the different themes revisited on the final track 34 Astonishing.
And here's another reason why you have to listen to DT albums like this several times...When I first realized this, I literally yelled "YES!"
I'm on probably the the 10th listen through or so, and just now caught the forshadowing of "Our New World" as the intro to "A Savior In The Square"
This album has a bitter/sweet feel for me. I Love it the whole way through and gets better with each listen. My wife (who's name is Victoria) passed away last summer, she loved DT's softer side and was a huge fan of James Labrie. Everytime I listen to TA, I know how much she would have been enjoying listening to this. Probably more so than any other album. Her fav song was Beneath The Surface.. This album is loaded with songs with feel and emotion and JLB shines! I personally dedicate this to her...
I
Can't
Stop
Listening
To
This
Album
I'm getting closer and closer to calling this something that starts with M.
This album has a bitter/sweet feel for me. I Love it the whole way through and gets better with each listen. My wife (who's name is Victoria) passed away last summer, she loved DT's softer side and was a huge fan of James Labrie. Everytime I listen to TA, I know how much she would have been enjoying listening to this. Probably more so than any other album. Her fav song was Beneath The Surface.. This album is loaded with songs with feel and emotion and JLB shines! I personally dedicate this to her...Sorry to hear that. Be brave my brother :'(
Thankyou man ;DI just re upload it here https://vimeo.com/153834854 :lolPringka this is better than anything we officially got so far, certinly better than the trailer they gave us, great work dude :tup
But I still hope second video from astonishing website page is a great animation video, I always hope it will be Dystopian Overture Video Clip ;D
You will find out what it is soon...
Do you know something we don't Bosky?
Of course. That should be clear. I know exactly what the video is, and I know it is scheduled to be posted very soon. On the original schedule, it was supposed to have already been released. But, again, marketing schedules are typically fluid and subject to change, and things have been moved around a bit for various reasons. The other video is going to be pretty cool. Nothing earth-shattering. But I am confident most people will really enjoy it.
This album has a bitter/sweet feel for me. I Love it the whole way through and gets better with each listen. My wife (who's name is Victoria) passed away last summer, she loved DT's softer side and was a huge fan of James Labrie. Everytime I listen to TA, I know how much she would have been enjoying listening to this. Probably more so than any other album. Her fav song was Beneath The Surface.. This album is loaded with songs with feel and emotion and JLB shines! I personally dedicate this to her...
This album has a bitter/sweet feel for me. I Love it the whole way through and gets better with each listen. My wife (who's name is Victoria) passed away last summer, she loved DT's softer side and was a huge fan of James Labrie. Everytime I listen to TA, I know how much she would have been enjoying listening to this. Probably more so than any other album. Her fav song was Beneath The Surface.. This album is loaded with songs with feel and emotion and JLB shines! I personally dedicate this to her...Aw man, that's such a touching sentiment. My heart breaks for ya. "Beneath the Surface"... she had impeccable taste. I hope an album about the connective power of music can bring you some comfort. :)
This album has a bitter/sweet feel for me. I Love it the whole way through and gets better with each listen. My wife (who's name is Victoria) passed away last summer, she loved DT's softer side and was a huge fan of James Labrie. Everytime I listen to TA, I know how much she would have been enjoying listening to this. Probably more so than any other album. Her fav song was Beneath The Surface.. This album is loaded with songs with feel and emotion and JLB shines! I personally dedicate this to her...
Wow, Thanks for the kind words everyone. I think this album will help in some way. The power of music!Sorry for your loss
I am seeing very little chatter about Dystopian Overture, probably them doing another overture isn't as chatter-worthy as much of what they did elsewhere on this record, but the middle section where the orchestra plays one of the main themes followed by the full band coming back in with the choir singing is freaking AWESOME. :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
I know it is easy to get lost in all that has been posted, but I raved about it a week or so before release saying that, IMO, it could very well be the best overture they have done and is up there among the best pure instrumental songs.
The Gift of Music Video premiere is tomorrow, according to DT facebook
Just realized what an amazing one-two punch "Heaven's Cove" and "Begin Again" are. Late to the party as always...Agreed. That last section of "Begin Again" rules. Jordan killing it, as it the usual on this album.
There is a user on the subreddit for Dream Theater that prefers WDADU to The Astonishing and is serious about it.I've seen people say TA is their worst album. Not really sure how to react to that either.
I honestly don't know how to react to that.
TA is a very polarizing album, I am not surprised that you would find a person who thinks that. I mean, RYM gives TA a 2.82 rating, the lowest of DT's discography. While one can certainly dismiss most of those votes as knee-jerk reactions by one-time listens, it still leaves quite a few people who really do not like this album.
TA is a very polarizing album, I am not surprised that you would find a person who thinks that. I mean, RYM gives TA a 2.82 rating, the lowest of DT's discography. While one can certainly dismiss most of those votes as knee-jerk reactions by one-time listens, it still leaves quite a few people who really do not like this album.
I think this will reverse the recent trend...I actually think time will be kind to TA as people accept it for what is is, rather than get pissed about what it isn't....the opposite of BC&SL and some other recent work, which was immediately well-received, but didn't hold up well beyond the first few months.
TA is a very polarizing album, I am not surprised that you would find a person who thinks that. I mean, RYM gives TA a 2.82 rating, the lowest of DT's discography. While one can certainly dismiss most of those votes as knee-jerk reactions by one-time listens, it still leaves quite a few people who really do not like this album.
I think this will reverse the recent trend...I actually think time will be kind to TA as people accept it for what is is, rather than get pissed about what it isn't....the opposite of BC&SL and some other recent work, which was immediately well-received, but didn't hold up well beyond the first few months.
I think many people would only appreciate this when it gets staged as a theatrical production. Then they will understand why the music is written that way.
This album is supposed to be filled with Seaboard. Did anyone managed to catch when its being used?My guess would be the solos on A Tempting Offer and A New Beginning. If not both, at least one of those is, because JR made a video of that sort of sound and said he was recording seaboard lead for the new album. Neither of those tones are ones he has used before anywhere else.
TA is a very polarizing album, I am not surprised that you would find a person who thinks that. I mean, RYM gives TA a 2.82 rating, the lowest of DT's discography. While one can certainly dismiss most of those votes as knee-jerk reactions by one-time listens, it still leaves quite a few people who really do not like this album.
I think this will reverse the recent trend...I actually think time will be kind to TA as people accept it for what is is, rather than get pissed about what it isn't....the opposite of BC&SL and some other recent work, which was immediately well-received, but didn't hold up well beyond the first few months.
I think many people would only appreciate this when it gets staged as a theatrical production. Then they will understand why the music is written that way.
Could be. I guess it makes sense to me as I was in a lot of pit orchestras in college, but certainly not everyone is coming in with that sensibility.
There is a user on the subreddit for Dream Theater that prefers WDADU to The Astonishing and is serious about it.I might agree with that...
I honestly don't know how to react to that.
I understand everyone has their opinion, but WDADU has so many issues with it that makes it inferior to all other DT albums in every objective way.
This album has a bitter/sweet feel for me. I Love it the whole way through and gets better with each listen. My wife (who's name is Victoria) passed away last summer, she loved DT's softer side and was a huge fan of James Labrie. Everytime I listen to TA, I know how much she would have been enjoying listening to this. Probably more so than any other album. Her fav song was Beneath The Surface.. This album is loaded with songs with feel and emotion and JLB shines! I personally dedicate this to her...
And I could probably argue for WDADU being compositionally superior to TA in an objective way. I'm not sure I'd want to get that detailed in this debate, because it would take a lot of writing, and I really do love the new album. However, I do believe that the certain characteristics I find better about WDADU could be defined objectively.
There is a user on the subreddit for Dream Theater that prefers WDADU to The Astonishing and is serious about it.I might agree with that...
I honestly don't know how to react to that.I understand everyone has their opinion, but WDADU has so many issues with it that makes it inferior to all other DT albums in every objective way.
And I could probably argue for WDADU being compositionally superior to TA in an objective way. I'm not sure I'd want to get that detailed in this debate, because it would take a lot of writing, and I really do love the new album. However, I do believe that the certain characteristics I find better about WDADU could be defined objectively.
I'm generally a fan of this guy, but he just doesn't get prog rock/metal it seems... He's almost always bashing prog when he reviews it, but to call The Astonishing "All proficiency, no soul" is just wrong.
https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s (https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s)
And I could probably argue for WDADU being compositionally superior to TA in an objective way. I'm not sure I'd want to get that detailed in this debate, because it would take a lot of writing, and I really do love the new album. However, I do believe that the certain characteristics I find better about WDADU could be defined objectively.
You can't prove "compositional superiority" objectively. At some point, you're still assigning subjective criteria to it.
How could you even compare the composition of both when WDADU was composed as a set of individual songs, while The Astonishing was composed as a whole. Any composition decisions for The Astonishing was made to serve what a particular point in the narrative needs. To even claim that you can compare these two different animals from a composition standpoint really stretches credibility.
And I could probably argue for WDADU being compositionally superior to TA in an objective way. I'm not sure I'd want to get that detailed in this debate, because it would take a lot of writing, and I really do love the new album. However, I do believe that the certain characteristics I find better about WDADU could be defined objectively.
You can't prove "compositional superiority" objectively. At some point, you're still assigning subjective criteria to it.
If not compositional superiority, is there some other superiority that can be defined objectively? The post I was responding to suggests there is.
And "Compositional Superiority" sounds like a great class to take at the University of Prog Rock :lol
How could you even compare the composition of both when WDADU was composed as a set of individual songs, while The Astonishing was composed as a whole. Any composition decisions for The Astonishing was made to serve what a particular point in the narrative needs. To even claim that you can compare these two different animals from a composition standpoint really stretches credibility.
Long story short, you could compare each album's success at accomplishing its respective artistic goals. And then which of the artistic goals accomplishes a stronger effect on a listener. It would be debatable, of course, but I think that would be the discussion.
I'm talking pure objective points like production. TA is miles ahead of WDADU in the production department and it's not even close.There is a user on the subreddit for Dream Theater that prefers WDADU to The Astonishing and is serious about it.I might agree with that...
I honestly don't know how to react to that.I understand everyone has their opinion, but WDADU has so many issues with it that makes it inferior to all other DT albums in every objective way.
And I could probably argue for WDADU being compositionally superior to TA in an objective way. I'm not sure I'd want to get that detailed in this debate, because it would take a lot of writing, and I really do love the new album. However, I do believe that the certain characteristics I find better about WDADU could be defined objectively.
Units of analysis. That's the lesson I will teach tomorrow in research design for the social sciences. :lol
That being said, I'm not sure how someone says that the composition and music on WDADU is better than TA. That's just ridiculous to me.Yeah, I'm sure even MP would disagree.
I feel like the DT 'rut' was most apparent during BCSL. I'm probably of the minority who thinks that ADToE was a feeling of revitalization in the DT camp. Did they play it a bit safe? Maybe, but I felt the fun and enjoyment in the music they made. DT12 felt like an attempt to buckle down and make something cohesive (Illumination Theory not withstanding) that could come across as their most radio safe record as a whole. The Astonishing completely surpassed all expectations set by the current lineup IMO. Nothing safe, standard or ordinary about this album.
100% agree on all that.
Not a minority at all, ADToE is a DT at what they do best, every song was amazing in it's own way and it aged real well, I think it's the best post-6 Degrees album, not including The Astonishing cause it's still too early to say that IMO.
I'm generally a fan of this guy, but he just doesn't get prog rock/metal it seems... He's almost always bashing prog when he reviews it, but to call The Astonishing "All proficiency, no soul" is just wrong.I love this guy's channel and I check it every other day, even though I obviously don't always agree with him. But man, he really dropped the ball with the comment on The Astonishing. :lol
https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s (https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=3m3s)
The ending of Begin Again.....
The ending of Begin Again.....
When Your Time Has Come has standalone potential.
I remember reading somewhere that a mandolin was used somehwere in the album. Could someone point out where it's used?Hymn of a Thousand Voices maybe? 2:13-2:17. Sounds like a mandolin to me.
Just posting to say that while listening to the album at the moment, I just got goosebumps at the point where Arhys gets killed. Definitely another great moment where the music perfectly represents what's going on.
There is a user on the subreddit for Dream Theater that prefers WDADU to The Astonishing and is serious about it.I've seen people say TA is their worst album. Not really sure how to react to that either.
I honestly don't know how to react to that.
I feel like the DT 'rut' was most apparent during BCSL. I'm probably of the minority who thinks that ADToE was a feeling of revitalization in the DT camp. Did they play it a bit safe? Maybe, but I felt the fun and enjoyment in the music they made. DT12 felt like an attempt to buckle down and make something cohesive (Illumination Theory not withstanding) that could come across as their most radio safe record as a whole. The Astonishing completely surpassed all expectations set by the current lineup IMO. Nothing safe, standard or ordinary about this album.
I feel like the DT 'rut' was most apparent during BCSL. I'm probably of the minority who thinks that ADToE was a feeling of revitalization in the DT camp. Did they play it a bit safe? Maybe, but I felt the fun and enjoyment in the music they made. DT12 felt like an attempt to buckle down and make something cohesive (Illumination Theory not withstanding) that could come across as their most radio safe record as a whole. The Astonishing completely surpassed all expectations set by the current lineup IMO. Nothing safe, standard or ordinary about this album.
I don't think you're in the minority thinking AToE was a feeling of revitalization. I think that's a fairly popular belief. I would say greater than 50% think it an improvement over SC and BC&SL.* It got me back into DT.
Faythe - Act of Faythe themesAnd Daryus, I would say, is the main theme of A Tempting Offer and its variations near the end of The Path That Divides.
Gabriel - The Answer Themes and it's variations
Arhys - Brother Can You Hear Me? / A better life themes
Nefaryus - Anything dark, evil and edgy (with a Disney villain feel) ;D
Xander, Evangeline and The Empress don't really seem to have a reoccurring theme of their own.
Nearest I can tell anyways. You can hear the different themes revisited on the final track 34 Astonishing.
Thanks dudes! :tup
You guys realise, that at the concerts, we might see JM and MM walk off stage for a substantial amount of time? There's a lot of tracks with just keyboard/piano and guitar. Just wondering.
I guess JM will walk to his sofa at the side of the stage and drink Starbucks during those times.
Can't help but think this album would be a little better with MP's drumming. I miss all his different percussion sounds he'd make.
As much as it bugs me to admit I agree with this, I do. That's not to say I don't love what I'm hearing here from Mangini. But....yeah....I'd love to hear Portnoy's take on this. Wait, no, that doesn't sound right. I don't want his opinion on this album. I already know what that will be :lol
I mean, I'd love to hear him play what he'd like to play on an album like this.
I absolutely agree that the title track is amazing and a grandiose finale to the whole thing!It is a great ending. I wish they'd cut "again", though, so that "astonishing" was the last word. And as ridiculous as this sounds for a 2 Hr. 10 Min. album, I wish the finale was a little longer.
Can't help but think this album would be a little better with MP's drumming. I miss all his different percussion sounds he'd make.
As much as it bugs me to admit I agree with this, I do. That's not to say I don't love what I'm hearing here from Mangini. But....yeah....I'd love to hear Portnoy's take on this. Wait, no, that doesn't sound right. I don't want his opinion on this album. I already know what that will be :lol
I mean, I'd love to hear him play what he'd like to play on an album like this.
I agree that it would be interesting to hear MP's playing on this album but will say again that, if Portnoy was still in control of this band, we would not have this album for him to play on. No way does he let JP/JR go off on their own and do this and no way would he abandon his attempts to gain metal credibility for DT by going in the totally opposite direction and making a musical theatre album. I would not say that Mangini had no input into this either, I am assuming that he has written his own drum parts.
I absolutely agree that the title track is amazing and a grandiose finale to the whole thing!It is a great ending. I wish they'd cut "again", though, so that "astonishing" was the last word. And as ridiculous as this sounds for a 2 Hr. 10 Min. album, I wish the finale was a little longer.
I have no idea if the reviews seem overly negative because I have not read any but my concern is that IF the majority of fans
end not liking this it could be the end of JP taking the risk(s) that many of us have wished for years. He has always been a little
hesitant to veer from the core DT sound. Then again he seems pretty strong willed and they are on the back nine of their career
so he might feel comfortable doing whatever he wants until retirement. I love the risks they took and I hope he takes it even
further next time!
They are at the point of their career that they do what they want and they are not swayed by fans or reviewers. We don't have that much pull.Well, that and I think they're aware that the core of their fanbase wants them to keep breaking new ground with their musical compositions and is going to enjoy it for what it is. The more I listen to it, the more I realize this is for those of us who embrace and follow them them for ALL their sounds and creativity... not what the industry or a loud, few and late coming, selective fans/reviewers wanted.
Can't wait for the first show of the TA tour, to see how they manage to do it live, the visuals and such - it should be coming up soon right?
I cant'imagine anything but a standing ovation at the end. And Act 1 alone must be an exhausting excercise, God!
Can't help but think this album would be a little better with MP's drumming. I miss all his different percussion sounds he'd make.
As much as it bugs me to admit I agree with this, I do. That's not to say I don't love what I'm hearing here from Mangini. But....yeah....I'd love to hear Portnoy's take on this. Wait, no, that doesn't sound right. I don't want his opinion on this album. I already know what that will be :lol
I mean, I'd love to hear him play what he'd like to play on an album like this.
I agree that it would be interesting to hear MP's playing on this album but will say again that, if Portnoy was still in control of this band, we would not have this album for him to play on. No way does he let JP/JR go off on their own and do this and no way would he abandon his attempts to gain metal credibility for DT by going in the totally opposite direction and making a musical theatre album. I would not say that Mangini had no input into this either, I am assuming that he has written his own drum parts.
In a totally separate issue, I can't believe so many are writing off the title track as either being unnecessary or being a bit of a damp squib which does not end the thing in an epic way. I think it is a totally epic ending (although not in their usual extended soloing kind of a way) and love the last song. In particular (and I know this is weird!) I like the way James sings the word "change" in Fayth's part. It's weird how little things sometimes stick with me like that, it's just different to what I was expecting when I heard him sing that line and I like it.
Yep, that's it. It's mixed left (or right, if I have my headphones on backward). ;) I think the fiddle and mandolin on that track are an absolute highlight of the album.I remember reading somewhere that a mandolin was used somehwere in the album. Could someone point out where it's used?Hymn of a Thousand Voices maybe? 2:13-2:17. Sounds like a mandolin to me.
I remember reading somewhere that a mandolin was used somehwere in the album. Could someone point out where it's used?Hymn of a Thousand Voices maybe? 2:13-2:17. Sounds like a mandolin to me.
I have a feeling that the live show attendence will help JP decide if TA was a good idea rather than reviews.
- I really love the NOMAC tracks. I know it's never going to happen, but I was disappointed in how short they were, and I would have really enjoyed it if they made an entire 4-5 minute song out of one or two of these. They ended just as I was getting in the mood for them.
Just posting to say that while listening to the album at the moment, I just got goosebumps at the point where Arhys gets killed. Definitely another great moment where the music perfectly represents what's going on.
The more I listen to this song (A New Beginning) the more I love it. The rhythm guitar, the vocals, and than that godly instrumental, not just the last solo mind you. Im even starting to accept the fade out, as it fades away right after the big climax in the solo (unlike say Take the Time)
Seriously, I think it may be one of the best songs in their catalog.
Can't wait for the first show of the TA tour, to see how they manage to do it live, the visuals and such - it should be coming up soon right?Just a little over two weeks. I think the first show is on the 18th.
Anyone else love the way James sings the word "rags" in Act of Faythe?
Raahhhygs
I wonder if the Nomac tracks will be the pre-recorded versions from the album as interludes between songs, or if Jordan will play them live from his key pads.. It would be cool to see the Nomacs extended versions for the show..I would be shocked if they weren't pre-recorded interludes.
I put this album on during lunch today. The entire cafeteria, save for a couple of people, hated it. :metal
I put this album on during lunch today. The entire cafeteria, save for a couple of people, hated it. :metal
I put this album on during lunch today. The entire cafeteria, save for a couple of people, hated it. :metal
I have no idea if the reviews seem overly negative because I have not read any but my concern is that IF the majority of fans
end not liking this it could be the end of JP taking the risk(s) that many of us have wished for years. He has always been a little
hesitant to veer from the core DT sound. Then again he seems pretty strong willed and they are on the back nine of their career
so he might feel comfortable doing whatever he wants until retirement. I love the risks they took and I hope he takes it even
further next time!
"My Last Farewell" I think.
edit: I don't think it's disappointing. I like it! ;D
Well, "you murderer!" and "your day will come" were actually more blood-curling than Gabriel's scream on My Last Farewell. Then again, I was listening through my headphones so maybe I was protected and all that.
I put this album on during lunch today. The entire cafeteria, save for a couple of people, hated it. :metalI think this applies here: https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=44345.0
NUGGETZ :PI put this album on during lunch today. The entire cafeteria, save for a couple of people, hated it. :metalI think this applies here: https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=44345.0
I believe we've discussed how to properly introduce someone to DT. These poor people will never be open to listening to DT again :lol
I remember reading somewhere that a mandolin was used somehwere in the album. Could someone point out where it's used?Hymn of a Thousand Voices maybe? 2:13-2:17. Sounds like a mandolin to me.
It starts at 56 seconds in and carries through the entire verse in the left channel, drops out for the chorus and comes back in at 1:40.
Yup. Nice catch! :rollinNUGGETZ :PI put this album on during lunch today. The entire cafeteria, save for a couple of people, hated it. :metalI think this applies here: https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=44345.0
I believe we've discussed how to properly introduce someone to DT. These poor people will never be open to listening to DT again :lol
The reception for this album hasn't been much different than the reception from previous albums - in fact, the prog community seems to more easily accept this than the several last few. The reviews are mixed, as expected (there's never been a case of DT reviews being extremely positive outside of maybe Images and Words and to some degree Scenes From A Memory), and the fan community is split AS ALWAYS HAPPENS. Even SFAM had its fair share of vocal minority people blasting the album for being "too much circus".
If you look at the places where it actually matters (here and progarchives), you'll see that the score is more akin to it being an instant classic than to it being a bomb.
Slightly tongue in cheek comment: Can we make a petition for DT to retire the word "forevermore"? Ever since MP started using it, I can't unhear it whenever they use it.Are you saying their lyrics should forevermore exclude that word?
Well, "you murderer!" and "your day will come" were actually more blood-curling than Gabriel's scream on My Last Farewell. Then again, I was listening through my headphones so maybe I was protected and all that.
:lol
The reception for this album hasn't been much different than the reception from previous albums - in fact, the prog community seems to more easily accept this than the several last few. The reviews are mixed, as expected (there's never been a case of DT reviews being extremely positive outside of maybe Images and Words and to some degree Scenes From A Memory), and the fan community is split AS ALWAYS HAPPENS. Even SFAM had its fair share of vocal minority people blasting the album for being "too much circus".
If you look at the places where it actually matters (here and progarchives), you'll see that the score is more akin to it being an instant classic than to it being a bomb.
This place is the absolute worst in the first weeks for judging the quality of a DT album. Even albums like DT12 that later settled on " middle of the road in their discography " were heralded like Jesus' second coming.
Ow.Slightly tongue in cheek comment: Can we make a petition for DT to retire the word "forevermore"? Ever since MP started using it, I can't unhear it whenever they use it.Are you saying their lyrics should forevermore exclude that word?
Slightly tongue in cheek comment: Can we make a petition for DT to retire the word "forevermore"? Ever since MP started using it, I can't unhear it whenever they use it.Are you saying their lyrics should forevermore exclude that word?
I agree that it would be interesting to hear MP's playing on this album but will say again that, if Portnoy was still in control of this band, we would not have this album for him to play on. No way does he let JP/JR go off on their own and do this and no way would he abandon his attempts to gain metal credibility for DT by going in the totally opposite direction and making a musical theatre album. I would not say that Mangini had no input into this either, I am assuming that he has written his own drum parts.
In a totally separate issue, I can't believe so many are writing off the title track as either being unnecessary or being a bit of a damp squib which does not end the thing in an epic way. I think it is a totally epic ending (although not in their usual extended soloing kind of a way) and love the last song. In particular (and I know this is weird!) I like the way James sings the word "change" in Fayth's part. It's weird how little things sometimes stick with me like that, it's just different to what I was expecting when I heard him sing that line and I like it.
Thanks alot! I heard that sound in the left channel before, but i didn't know that was a mandolin. I wished it was louder, it's barely audible, the violin is very nice but i would like to really make out what the mandolin was playing as well. It just sounds like fast strumming :PWell, most of what it's providing is texture, as mandolins are often utilized as much for percussive strumming as for the melodic notes. It's doing a nice little triplet-feel jangle, and though it's tricky to make out the notes, I think the hard pan separates it out nicely in the mix. :)
NUGGETZ :PI put this album on during lunch today. The entire cafeteria, save for a couple of people, hated it. :metalI think this applies here: https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=44345.0
I believe we've discussed how to properly introduce someone to DT. These poor people will never be open to listening to DT again :lol
I have to say i'm very happy about getting a lot of brass sections with TA. I have alsways liked brass sections in music very much, and we get a lot of them here :tup It adds a nice flavor that isn't present in most rock music.
And MP fapping at the chamber door.*shudders*
I love rock music, but i wouldn't go that far :lol LOTR score is very close to perfect as it is!
I love rock music, but i wouldn't go that far :lol LOTR score is very close to perfect as it is!
Well, okay then, I'm not familiar enough with LOTR scores specifically, it was just an example. But in general, I don't think film scores need to restrain themselves to only using classical instruments, even when they're taking place in medieval or medieval-like fantasy settings.
And MP fapping at the chamber door.*shudders*
Oh god the bagpipe moment in The X Aspect is absolutely thrilling... it really shows how Arhys comes to such a dark place after the offer...Yep, I adore this reprise. :heart In fact, that entire track is glorious, from the piano intro to the verses themselves, especially the one that begins with "Evangeline, I swore to you..."
I put this album on during lunch today. The entire cafeteria, save for a couple of people, hated it. :metal
I mean, if I can judge him somewhat reasonably, he would die to be involved in a project like TA.Yes, but I would imagine that "be involved" for him would not mean allowing JP to come up with the entire story himself and letting JP & JR write all of the music.
Just extracted some songs from the CD to wav, it's not brickwalled but still heavily clipped. :-\
Just extracted some songs from the CD to wav, it's not brickwalled but still heavily clipped. :-\
Wouldn't extracting to FLAC or ALAC be even better? Why settle for wav? I'm not exactly an audiophile so I'm not criticizing you, I'm just curious.
People claiming that FLAC is better than WAV drives home the point for me that most of this stuff is confirmation bias.
The moment I know I truly became the master of an album is the moment it touches me emotionally on a strong level. I shed a tear at 1:23 of the closing track, the verse where Arhys addresses his brother from the other side, such a touching part of the story. Now I know I can leave the album alone for a few days. ;D
That IS a long shower.... hope you don't pay for the water ::)
The moment I know I truly became the master of an album is the moment it touches me emotionally on a strong level. I shed a tear at 1:23 of the closing track, the verse where Arhys addresses his brother from the other side, such a touching part of the story. Now I know I can leave the album alone for a few days. ;DHad this on A Better Life @ 3:44 on my first listen through.
I'm happy that a lot of people do like it. But I'm pretty disappointed. Hats off to anyone who can listen to this in one go, I simply couldn't do it. I found myself going, AGAIN?!? Every time they broke to a piano and vocals part just to chew up some story
Maybe all of you guys, sick & tired with this post of mine, but again...We will, eventually. After seeing Bosk's warning about posting unauthorized material in the TGOM music video thread, I'm sure we got something being released sometime in the future. :soon:
Second video slot in The Astonishing page is still the same video with first slot
So the question is... Is TGoM Official Video not the second video for The Astonishing page?? Or they just have not update it yet??
Will we have another video from Dream Theater?
Yeah, I remember that. So..... That's mean, possibility about we will have another video for astonishing page, is higher then? Hahaha :biggrin:Maybe all of you guys, sick & tired with this post of mine, but again...We will, eventually. After seeing Bosk's warning about posting unauthorized material in the TGOM music video thread, I'm sure we got something being released sometime in the future. :soon:
Second video slot in The Astonishing page is still the same video with first slot
So the question is... Is TGoM Official Video not the second video for The Astonishing page?? Or they just have not update it yet??
Will we have another video from Dream Theater?
Wow, overall what a great album!!
The writing is truly inspired, production is better, and the whole album just has so much heart and energy that's been lacking since at least Octavarium.
My only complaint is that some parts of the album feel bloated.
Certain songs sound like definite filler while other songs are rushed. I think if they had trimmed this album down by about a half hour and let the quality songs breathe a little, it could have been their best record since Awake. Overall it's really really good.
Just passing by to appreciate The Walking Shadow. Short, yes, but incredibly powerful in every way. I think the whole track is complete genius, to be honest. The way they narrate the story and intertwine it with the music had me on the edge of my seat the first time I heard it.
Our New World: Reminds me of prime Saigon Kick (a good thing)
Wow, overall what a great album!!
My only complaint is that some parts of the album feel bloated.
Certain songs sound like definite filler while other songs are rushed. I think if they had trimmed this album down by about a half hour and let the quality songs breathe a little, it could have been their best record since Awake. Overall it's really really good.
Agree with this; a fair deal of good parts are too short, and a fair deal of boring parts are too long. It's the kind of stuff a good outside producer would fix, but they refuse to do that. Overall, though, it's still a marvelous album. Better production could have made it their best ever, I think. And the "highs" of this album are among their best ever.
One of the things I most appreciate about this album is the return to upbeat/major songwriting in the vein of Only A Matter Of Time, Under A Glass Moon or Innocence Faded. It's been missing from the DT sound for a while.
Just passing by to appreciate The Walking Shadow. Short, yes, but incredibly powerful in every way. I think the whole track is complete genius, to be honest. The way they narrate the story and intertwine it with the music had me on the edge of my seat the first time I heard it.
I get how it fits into the story, but musically that might be one of the most uninteresting songs they've ever done. IMO, of course. ;)
Thank goodness most of the rest of the album is so darn good.
Wow, overall what a great album!!
The writing is truly inspired, production is better, and the whole album just has so much heart and energy that's been lacking since at least Octavarium.
My only complaint is that some parts of the album feel bloated.
Certain songs sound like definite filler while other songs are rushed. I think if they had trimmed this album down by about a half hour and let the quality songs breathe a little, it could have been their best record since Awake. Overall it's really really good.
Agree with this; a fair deal of good parts are too short, and a fair deal of boring parts are too long. It's the kind of stuff a good outside producer would fix, but they refuse to do that. Overall, though, it's still a marvelous album. Better production could have made it their best ever, I think. And the "highs" of this album are among their best ever.
Just got done with a second listen, and it's already coming together for me.
Moment of Betrayal verse = Count of The Great Tuscany Debate :biggrin:
Does any of you know if the instrument at 2:20 in Dystopian Overture (left channel) is a mandolin?
Does any of you know if the instrument at 2:20 in Dystopian Overture (left channel) is a mandolin?
I believe it's JR playing a harp patch.
Does any of you know if the instrument at 2:20 in Dystopian Overture (left channel) is a mandolin?
I believe it's JR playing a harp patch.
Yeah that sounds right.
Does any of you know if the instrument at 2:20 in Dystopian Overture (left channel) is a mandolin?
Does any of you know if the instrument at 2:20 in Dystopian Overture (left channel) is a mandolin?
I definitely heard a mandolin in the left channel during a later song on the album, but the song escapes me right now.
as a huge fan since I&W, i am enjoying TA with everything new it has to offer. all the tracks seem like perfect little snippets of Dream Theater gold. i'll admit i'm left wanting a bit though, as killer riffs and beast mode moments seem to go as quick as they come. after 12 albums, i didn't realize how "trained" DT had me as far as enjoying the development of a 10 minute song where the grooves and riffs last a while.
how about a 4 hour album with 34 8 to 10 minute tracks?! :tup :lol
I love that there's so many different "X is my favorite song!" posts/topics. It's the sign of a strong, diverse album. I don't feel like that was the case for the last, oh, 4-5 albums (especially on release). Someone correct me if I'm wrong.No, you're absolutely right, IMO. They've not taken a risk like this in years :metal
P.S. Ravenskill is best song.
I haven't seen this mentioned yet, but has anyone noticed in The Path That Divides @ about 1:33, James does a little, er, "mmmaaahh". It's at the end of the line "When you're facing the path that divides".YES. Top 5 moment.
A cool little thing, and not something he normally does a lot of, I don't think.
I haven't seen this mentioned yet, but has anyone noticed in The Path That Divides @ about 1:33, James does a little, er, "mmmaaahh". It's at the end of the line "When you're facing the path that divides".YES. Top 5 moment.
A cool little thing, and not something he normally does a lot of, I don't think.
I haven't seen this mentioned yet, but has anyone noticed in The Path That Divides @ about 1:33, James does a little, er, "mmmaaahh". It's at the end of the line "When you're facing the path that divides".YES. Top 5 moment.
A cool little thing, and not something he normally does a lot of, I don't think.
I noticed it also, it reminded me of Innocence Faded.
We're definitely getting another video.Yeah, I remember that. So..... That's mean, possibility about we will have another video for astonishing page, is higher then? Hahaha :biggrin:Maybe all of you guys, sick & tired with this post of mine, but again...We will, eventually. After seeing Bosk's warning about posting unauthorized material in the TGOM music video thread, I'm sure we got something being released sometime in the future. :soon:
Second video slot in The Astonishing page is still the same video with first slot
So the question is... Is TGoM Official Video not the second video for The Astonishing page?? Or they just have not update it yet??
Will we have another video from Dream Theater?
I didn't read anyone complaining about the sound and production. I didn't listen to the CD yet. How does it sound?Really good. Nice and open for me with lots of space. Through headphones it's amazing. Can feel every instrument.
I didn't read anyone complaining about the sound and production. I didn't listen to the CD yet. How does it sound?Really good. Nice and open for me with lots of space. Through headphones it's amazing. Can feel every instrument.
Does any of you know if the instrument at 2:20 in Dystopian Overture (left channel) is a mandolin?
I definitely heard a mandolin in the left channel during a later song on the album, but the song escapes me right now.
Hahaha. What do think? What kind video is that? I bet that is animation video ;DWe're definitely getting another video.Yeah, I remember that. So..... That's mean, possibility about we will have another video for astonishing page, is higher then? Hahaha :biggrin:Maybe all of you guys, sick & tired with this post of mine, but again...We will, eventually. After seeing Bosk's warning about posting unauthorized material in the TGOM music video thread, I'm sure we got something being released sometime in the future. :soon:
Second video slot in The Astonishing page is still the same video with first slot
So the question is... Is TGoM Official Video not the second video for The Astonishing page?? Or they just have not update it yet??
Will we have another video from Dream Theater?
I am not aware of any other videos planned. The TGOM video was the only other video I was aware of.If so, then maybe it's time for me to stop refreshing that page almost every hour. :omg:
as a huge fan since I&W, i am enjoying TA with everything new it has to offer. all the tracks seem like perfect little snippets of Dream Theater gold. i'll admit i'm left wanting a bit though, as killer riffs and beast mode moments seem to go as quick as they come. after 12 albums, i didn't realize how "trained" DT had me as far as enjoying the development of a 10 minute song where the grooves and riffs last a while.
how about a 4 hour album with 34 8 to 10 minute tracks?! :tup :lol
One thing that should be noted and congratulated is the trust shown by JM, JLB, and MM in the production of this album. They apparently trusted and believed in JP's vision enough to forego their normal roles as co-writers of music, and go with JP's passion and JR's co-writing. That is as big a reason as any for the album coming out as cohesively as it does.
and love that nothings over 6 minutes.
I am not aware of any other videos planned. The TGOM video was the only other video I was aware of.When I said we were definitely getting another video, my brain, for some reason, forgot about TGOM's music video. :facepalm:
Anyone else cracking up at the "News" shown at the top of the page? :lol
"Daryus unfortunately cannot listen to the new album. Ironic..."
"After two concept albums, it should be clear that the members of Dream Theater may have "brother issues." "
"Faythe lives!"
Anyone else cracking up at the "News" shown at the top of the page? :lolIt's about time that ticker was upgraded! :lol
"Daryus unfortunately cannot listen to the new album. Ironic..."
"After two concept albums, it should be clear that the members of Dream Theater may have "brother issues." "
"Faythe lives!"
I actually clicked on that link thinking it was real ._.Anyone else cracking up at the "News" shown at the top of the page? :lol
"Daryus unfortunately cannot listen to the new album. Ironic..."
"After two concept albums, it should be clear that the members of Dream Theater may have "brother issues." "
"Faythe lives!"
I wanted to post this sooner or later, they crack me up as well! :rollin
Love the one that tells that Uncle Gabriel is a hippie and Xander should be put in a foster home :lol
Just for the whiners - hey should put out a 2 hour 10 minute version of The Astonishing as one track.
::) There you go. It's a 130 minutes song. Long enough for ya ?
Does any of you know if the instrument at 2:20 in Dystopian Overture (left channel) is a mandolin?
I believe it's JR playing a harp patch.
Yeah that sounds right.
I think you either embrace the larger-than-life, Broadway musical-esque nature of it and enjoy it, or you spend so long worrying about what it *isn't* that your disappointment becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. That's not to say that the people who don't like it are wrong - as I say in my review, I can quite understand why this one is especially divisive, even among fans - but expectations can be a terrible thing.
I just physically shuddered at the thought of Casey McPherson in DT. He is the sole reason I can't listen to Flying Colors and didn't buy their second album. Horrible singer, awful forced fake accent when he's singing just drains the songs of any emotion (ahem in my opinion). Sorry just had to get that off my chest, I'm sure many people like him, just not me.
I just physically shuddered at the thought of Casey McPherson in DT. He is the sole reason I can't listen to Flying Colors and didn't buy their second album. Horrible singer, awful forced fake accent when he's singing just drains the songs of any emotion (ahem in my opinion). Sorry just had to get that off my chest, I'm sure many people like him, just not me.Well, I don't understand this at all, since I love Casey and think he has a unique voice.
I just physically shuddered at the thought of Casey McPherson in DT. He is the sole reason I can't listen to Flying Colors and didn't buy their second album. Horrible singer, awful forced fake accent when he's singing just drains the songs of any emotion (ahem in my opinion). Sorry just had to get that off my chest, I'm sure many people like him, just not me.Well, I don't understand this at all, since I love Casey and think he has a unique voice.
But he is certainly not right for DT. We can agree on that.
I just have the CD version but as I watched this review, it seems that the cover shot next to him has more color to it than my CD. Am I correct or just having eye issues?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVLP9oaLkBU&list=LLOXjSHliW8THxMD9po4cVMQ
I just have the CD version but as I watched this review, it seems that the cover shot next to him has more color to it than my CD. Am I correct or just having eye issues?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVLP9oaLkBU&list=LLOXjSHliW8THxMD9po4cVMQ
The guy is a total douchebag! LMAO Go to 4:45 mark. He says the guys in DT have balls the size of walnuts and does a lame attempt to try and recover!
Review here: https://echoesanddust.com/2016/02/dream-theater-the-astonishing/ (https://echoesanddust.com/2016/02/dream-theater-the-astonishing/)Good job on that review - very well written! :tup
I just physically shuddered at the thought of Casey McPherson in DT. He is the sole reason I can't listen to Flying Colors and didn't buy their second album. Horrible singer, awful forced fake accent when he's singing just drains the songs of any emotion (ahem in my opinion). Sorry just had to get that off my chest, I'm sure many people like him, just not me.Well, I don't understand this at all, since I love Casey and think he has a unique voice.
But he is certainly not right for DT. We can agree on that.
I just have the CD version but as I watched this review, it seems that the cover shot next to him has more color to it than my CD. Am I correct or just having eye issues?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVLP9oaLkBU&list=LLOXjSHliW8THxMD9po4cVMQ
The guy is a total douchebag! LMAO Go to 4:45 mark. He says the guys in DT have balls the size of walnuts and does a lame attempt to try and recover!
Dream Theater with Mike Portnoy calling the shots
Just passing by to appreciate The Walking Shadow. Short, yes, but incredibly powerful in every way. I think the whole track is complete genius, to be honest. The way they narrate the story and intertwine it with the music had me on the edge of my seat the first time I heard it.
I get how it fits into the story, but musically that might be one of the most uninteresting songs they've ever done. IMO, of course. ;)
Thank goodness most of the rest of the album is so darn good.
I find it interesting because this is one of the songs where the music was really integral in telling the story. When Mangini entered this metronomic "tic tic tic" in the hi-hat with the occassional off-beat, I really felt the tension. I especially loved the part where Daryus was about to stab Faythe, how the polyrhythms communicated the confusion and the quickening pace.
Just passing by to appreciate The Walking Shadow. Short, yes, but incredibly powerful in every way. I think the whole track is complete genius, to be honest. The way they narrate the story and intertwine it with the music had me on the edge of my seat the first time I heard it.
I get how it fits into the story, but musically that might be one of the most uninteresting songs they've ever done. IMO, of course. ;)
Thank goodness most of the rest of the album is so darn good.
I find it interesting because this is one of the songs where the music was really integral in telling the story. When Mangini entered this metronomic "tic tic tic" in the hi-hat with the occassional off-beat, I really felt the tension. I especially loved the part where Daryus was about to stab Faythe, how the polyrhythms communicated the confusion and the quickening pace.
Again, I get how it fits to tell the story, but I just find it to be uninteresting musically. This album is ripe with memorable melodies, and I cannot recall a single one from that tune.
But I think that to review it fairly or to form a fair opinion, you have to take it on its own terms and at least try to listen to it for what it is, rather than what you might like the band to have done.^^^^^Good advice for appreciating any creative work.
Anyone interested to hear Portnoy's thoughts on The Astonishing?? I think it'd be interesting....
Anyone interested to hear Portnoy's thoughts on The Astonishing?? I think it'd be interesting....
I can honestly say, I have never been as curious about what MP is thinking about the new DT than I am with this album in particular.
I like the fact that the titles of the songs are false spoilers, which misguided me (and possibly other people) when we could only see the track names.Wow man, never thought about that.. I realize some of that title is really 'false spoiler' now :omg: :tup
For example:
When Your Time Has Come - The time of nobody has come
Act Of Faythe - It's inside her head, not really an act of hers
A Life Left Behind - No one died
Moment Of Betrayal - Arhys decided to betray Gabriel, but he doesn't carry on with the plan
My Last Farewell - Not a death
Losing Faythe - She's not lost
Among others with smaller impact, like Three Days, which I thought was about the passage of three days, and The Answer, which could more properly be named "The Question"
Well, I will admit that the middle of Act 2 is kind of a black hole for me (tracks 6-10 are all ones I am skipping already)...:PYou're skipping the album's climax?!
Isn't that beautiful?
Out of the shadows
One by one they came
To shed their light upon his moment
Of doubt and pain
A thousand voices
Ring out through the night
A symphony of mercy for their savior
Too tired to fight
And as the chorus grew
A thousand hearts beat true
Then like a glowing beacon in the dark
Hope came shining through
I like the fact that the titles of the songs are false spoilers, which misguided me (and possibly other people) when we could only see the track names.
For example:
When Your Time Has Come - The time of nobody has come
Act Of Faythe - It's inside her head, not really an act of hers
A Life Left Behind - No one died
Moment Of Betrayal - Arhys decided to betray Gabriel, but he doesn't carry on with the plan
My Last Farewell - Not a death
Losing Faythe - She's not lost
Among others with smaller impact, like Three Days, which I thought was about the passage of three days, and The Answer, which could more properly be named "The Question"
I like the fact that the titles of the songs are false spoilers, which misguided me (and possibly other people) when we could only see the track names.I think you're being a little too literal about it.
For example:
When Your Time Has Come - The time of nobody has come
Act Of Faythe - It's inside her head, not really an act of hers
A Life Left Behind - No one died
Moment Of Betrayal - Arhys decided to betray Gabriel, but he doesn't carry on with the plan
My Last Farewell - Not a death
Losing Faythe - She's not lost
Among others with smaller impact, like Three Days, which I thought was about the passage of three days, and The Answer, which could more properly be named "The Question"
I like the fact that the titles of the songs are false spoilers, which misguided me (and possibly other people) when we could only see the track names.I think you're being a little too literal about it.
For example:
When Your Time Has Come - The time of nobody has come
Act Of Faythe - It's inside her head, not really an act of hers
A Life Left Behind - No one died
Moment Of Betrayal - Arhys decided to betray Gabriel, but he doesn't carry on with the plan
My Last Farewell - Not a death
Losing Faythe - She's not lost
Among others with smaller impact, like Three Days, which I thought was about the passage of three days, and The Answer, which could more properly be named "The Question"
When Your Time Has Come - it's a song Gabriel sings about when someone's time has come, it doesn't necessarily have to be NOW. It's not titled "Your Time Comes Now".
Act of Faythe - it can me a few different things. It's her act, as in her spot to be introduced if it was literally a musical. It's also a song about her "act", like "acting", living in a life and a place where she doesn't belong.
A Life Left Behind - "life" can also mean "way of life", it is used in many contexts. When you "leave your life behind" it normally means you're moving to a new place, forgetting everything you knew and start over. That's exactly what's happening here. It's not necessarily about leaving someone's literal life behind.
Moment of Betrayal - Well, you say there are no betrayals here as he doesn't carry the plan...there are actually two betrayals. This was the song where Arhys and Daryus were about to execute their plan for Arhys to betray Gabriel, then at the final chorus Arhys steps back and betrays Daryus by breaking his promise and going out to fight him.
My Last Farewell - This is a song where a person who has just realized two of his loved ones died says his last farewell. It does exactly what it claims to.
Losing Faythe - when you say you're "losing" a person it generally means that he's dying or deteriorating. If it was literally being lost, it wouldn't be in Present Progressive. It would just be "Faythe is Lost" or "Finding Faythe".
Three Days - the announcement that they only have 3 days to hand Gabriel over.
The Answer - there is no question. He just believes he doesn't have the answer to their suffering and problems, but that doesn't mean it's a question.
Starting Disc 2 tonight then I'll be able to finally try to rank this bad boy. It's going to be at least top 5 possibly top 3.
I wondered if he was the guy addressing the troops.
That's straight from Heaven's Cove. The arpeggio is at least.
I wondered if he was the guy addressing the troops.
I have only gotten through the first half of the first CD and I don't really care for it. Of course the musicianship is amazing as always, but that's nothing new. Good to see DT taking a different approach than the usual GUITAR SHRED KEYBOARD SHRED GUITAR/KEYBOARD UNISON SHRED that they've been doing on every album for the past fifteen years or so.That was my opinion of my first listening too. That it was too slow, poppyish... during the second and third times it started connected and now it feels very cohesive, and not lagging at all. I suggest you give it some more spins, maybe with headphones for improved absortion.
I just think this is... boring. I don't really care for the story, not connecting with it. The melodies kind of don't really go anywhere. I don't know, maybe I have to listen to it another five thousand times or something. But, I honestly couldn't even get through the first CD I was so bored. I literally turned it off. Not that it's bad. It's just... boring. I'm sorry, not trying to be offensive, just giving my opinion.
I must say that even though Hymn of a Thousand Voices is really cheesy, it's pretty emotionally effective. Especially like the first half or so.
I must say that even though Hymn of a Thousand Voices is really cheesy, it's pretty emotionally effective. Especially like the first half or so.
The album is full of brilliant little melodies, some of them are almost hidden. Really enjoying the hell out of it.Agreed. There's so many little layers of things that it demands your attention and multiple listenings to catch them all. It's what I loved about this band in the early years, and happy to have a return to an album that asks that I spend time to get to know it again.
umm, maybe it is me too late, and everybody has already know about this.
But if you wanna hear sound of NOMACS beside from The Astonishing Album, you can visit this DT site https://www.dreamtheater.net/?frontpage=true
and point your mouse to Main NOMACS, the biggest one...
I think that was great, I can hear another NOMACS voice :biggrin:
So, that is the sound everyone hear almost everyday in 2285... :lol
I don't think I am the right one to do it, but I think it'd be a really cool and feasible idea to have a sort of definitive thread for connections between songs.
For example to start with, for Dystopian Overture it could list by timestamp all the parts identified as themes or sections that appear in later songs. Then for each song it could list any connections people find and (what other song it is connected with).
Obviously a gargantuan task for one person, but if there was a thread where people could just post any individual connections they notice, it might not be such a difficult task to eventually list people's contributions in the OP.
With 34 tracks to listen to, I'm sure I'm not the only one who noticed parts familiar from other songs but couldn't quite recall which one it was from - and by the time you listen through the full 2 hour album again you might have forgotten what it was you were looking for.
Is " The Answer " the shortest full band song DT have done ?
I suspect that most of the people who don't like this album are the younger metal guys. With any luck, their tastes will mature with age
sitting at the top of the heap, alongside the previously sacrosanct SFAM.
I suspect that most of the people who don't like this album are the younger metal guys. With any luck, their tastes will mature with age
I'm pretty sure that most of the people who dislike the album are not doing so because of immaturity.
sitting at the top of the heap, alongside the previously sacrosanct SFAM.
Why previously sacrosanct? How did The Astonishing make SFAM not sacrosanct?
sitting at the top of the heap, alongside the previously sacrosanct SFAM.
Why previously sacrosanct? How did The Astonishing make SFAM not sacrosanct?
Unassailable?
One thing I don't understand - why do people seem to think that piano intros = ballads?
On the subject of MM's drumming, I understand it's not your thing. Yet, to say you cannot hear ghost notes is strange because I can hear some very clearly, and I'm not even a musician.I love MM otherwise, he's one of my all time favorite drummers and huge inspiration to me. I just wish they produced his drums differently. Yeah, there have to be some ghost notes here and there, they even had them on DT12 (on Behind the Veil) and that had way worse drums, but the overall theme here is that the snare just needs more dynamics, especially on an album like this.
B.Lee
One thing I don't understand - why do people seem to think that piano intros = ballads?I didn't say that. TA has a bunch of ballads and a bunch of piano intros, they don't necessarily correlate.
That's actually a really good point. But in truth I even meant slow mellow songs - just because a song opens with a slow piano melody doesn't mean it's a slow song. There are very few ballads, in that sense, on TA.One thing I don't understand - why do people seem to think that piano intros = ballads?
When I was a kid, we learned that a ballad is a song that told a story. How is it that a ballad has evolved into a song that is slow and mellow?
This wasn't directed specifically at you, you were just unlucky to be the latest person to say it that caused me to decide to actually say something. :lol But you did say the album was 80% ballads. :POne thing I don't understand - why do people seem to think that piano intros = ballads?I didn't say that. TA has a bunch of ballads and a bunch of piano intros, they don't necessarily correlate.
On the subject of MM's drumming, I understand it's not your thing. Yet, to say you cannot hear ghost notes is strange because I can hear some very clearly, and I'm not even a musician.I love MM otherwise, he's one of my all time favorite drummers and huge inspiration to me. I just wish they produced his drums differently. Yeah, there have to be some ghost notes here and there, they even had them on DT12 (on Behind the Veil) and that had way worse drums, but the overall theme here is that the snare just needs more dynamics, especially on an album like this.
B.Lee
I said it feels like that. It's obviously nowhere near that figure 'objectively'. Perhaps I should have elaborated more clearly, what I was gunning for is that the album drags and feels way to slow, at least the first time around. I often found myself thinking that "ok, now a groovy riff must be coming" and I was hit yet again with a piano intro and soft, whispery vocals.This wasn't directed specifically at you, you were just unlucky to be the latest person to say it that caused me to decide to actually say something. :lol But you did say the album was 80% ballads. :POne thing I don't understand - why do people seem to think that piano intros = ballads?I didn't say that. TA has a bunch of ballads and a bunch of piano intros, they don't necessarily correlate.
final note causing you to stand on your feet in applause... and this one didn't.
Anyone else feel like that?
is there a place to find the lyrics (and who's talking) online? or do you have to buy the CD? Im listening on apple music.
also, do people notice a big difference in sound on HD tracks? (using good headphones or speakers).
This wasn't directed specifically at you, you were just unlucky to be the latest person to say it that caused me to decide to actually say something. :lol But you did say the album was 80% ballads. :POne thing I don't understand - why do people seem to think that piano intros = ballads?I didn't say that. TA has a bunch of ballads and a bunch of piano intros, they don't necessarily correlate.
Am I the only one who has not been skipping ANY of the tracks?Nope! I love listening all the way through. :)
Am I the only one who has not been skipping ANY of the tracks?Nope! I love listening all the way through. :)
One thing I don't understand - why do people seem to think that piano intros = ballads?poor people who skip Three Days then... they have skip one of the best song in this album
Feeling it is the important thing, Sycsa. The first time I heard the album, I found it too long, there were too many ballads....Now, I like it a lot. On the subject of MM's drumming, I understand it's not your thing. Yet, to say you cannot hear ghost notes is strange because I can hear some very clearly, and I'm not even a musician.
B.Lee
Same here... :tupAm I the only one who has not been skipping ANY of the tracks?Nope! I love listening all the way through. :)
Same here.
Just a quick question for those obsessed with the sound of the snare and it's lack of dynamics/warmth, triggered/sampled etc etc.
Do you all have a problem listening to Images & Words where it is actually confirmed as being triggered? Seems to me that this is revered as one of their best albums, if not their actual best album. Just curious why it doesn't seem to spoil people's enjoyment of that record but people are obsessed with it on the Mangini albums.
Well, I will admit that the middle of Act 2 is kind of a black hole for me (tracks 6-10 are all ones I am skipping already)...:PYou're skipping the album's climax?!
And how can you expect songs to be "memorable" if you don't actually listen to them? :P
One thing I don't understand - why do people seem to think that piano intros = ballads?
For those who keep on insisting that the snare has no dynamics. Listen to Losing Faythe. Intently. Hear the ghost notes, in particular. Note the volume of the snare. Then listen to Moment of Betrayal afterwards. Then listen to A New Beginning. If you can still say that the snare played at the same volume in these three songs, then maybe it's just me.
I suspect that most of the people who don't like this album are the younger metal guys. With any luck, their tastes will mature with age and they will come to appreciate this magnum opus for what it is: sitting at the top of the heap, alongside the previously sacrosanct SFAM.
For those who keep on insisting that the snare has no dynamics. Listen to Losing Faythe. Intently. Hear the ghost notes, in particular. Note the volume of the snare. Then listen to Moment of Betrayal afterwards. Then listen to A New Beginning. If you can still say that the snare played at the same volume in these three songs, then maybe it's just me.
It's a big improvement over DT12, and the snare definitely does have some dynamics this time with a lot of ghost notes audible (even when the heavy riff of Three Days kicks in you can hear the dynamics on the snare), but there's definite room for improvement too.
It's still like every hit above 50% sounds identical, and I don't know if it's that drum sound, but even the softer hits don't have a lot of variety in tone, and that detuned sound doesn't cut through well with the rest of the band. It needs that sharp snap. Check out the start of A New Beginning where MM is doing that march sort of snare pattern. You can hear the dynamics, but it's not as wide as it feels it should be, and there's not a lot of variety in the tone as you'd expect from a typical natural snare.
Why does LaBrie use a different voice/accent for Lord Nafaryus one time (such a foolish young man, doesn't seem to understand)? It's weird.
is there a place to find the lyrics (and who's talking) online? or do you have to buy the CD? Im listening on apple music.
also, do people notice a big difference in sound on HD tracks? (using good headphones or speakers).
Yeah I get you, I was being a little facetious. I do the same if I just want to listen to a few songs, or half an album's worth, for whatever reason, I naturally gravitate to the ones that interest me most.Well, I will admit that the middle of Act 2 is kind of a black hole for me (tracks 6-10 are all ones I am skipping already)...:PYou're skipping the album's climax?!
And how can you expect songs to be "memorable" if you don't actually listen to them? :P
I have listened to them; quite a few times, actually. Perhaps a better way to say is that when I am pressed for time, none of them are go-to songs for me, but if I let the album just play, I'll usually let them play.
Many of you seem to know so much about music production. Ever considered a career in it?
Why does LaBrie use a different voice/accent for Lord Nafaryus one time (such a foolish young man, doesn't seem to understand)? It's weird.
And "Saddest of IIiIis to watch how you fall..."
Why does LaBrie use a different voice/accent for Lord Nafaryus one time (such a foolish young man, doesn't seem to understand)? It's weird.
And "Saddest of IIiIis to watch how you fall..."
I've been thinking about this since my last post and I think the reason why I don't care for has to do more with the story. With an album like this, it's not just the music, obviously. It's a package deal. I really hate to be one of those people to compare this to SFAM, but I have to here.
With SFAM, the story just worked. It was simple, but it worked. I don't like the story of this album at all. I just think it's kind of lame. Again, not trying to be offensive to the band or anything, just my opinion. So, if I think the story is lame, anything the music is doing is trying to heighten the story, which I already don't care for to begin with. It's like watching a movie you don't like... you're probably not going to like the film score, either.
I don't think this particular story warrants a two hour concept album.
I think Act 1 flows pretty much perfectly, whilst the second lags a bit after Heaven's Cove and recovers momentum with Hymn of a Thousand Voices. There are DT albums half the length of this one that I think are more pompous. Hell, there are individual DT songs I think are more pompous than this album.
It isn't life changing like Images and Words or Awake, but it's highly enjoyable cheesy fun, and there's nothing wrong with that.
Agreed here. And that is one of my biggest problems with the albumwhen judging it as a story. It probably isn't helped by the fact I don't find Our New World or Astonishing particularly strong as climactic closers for the album, so the real drag after The Walking Shadow caused by spending a bit too long on Losing Faythe and Whispers On The Wind doesn't even pay off.
For me, personally, the moment the albums loses some traction is during Losing Faythe and Whispers On The Wind.
Losing Faythe has the worst album moment - that awful crying (or laughing??) and the fact that it is the only symphonic moment that feels redundant and would have been better if it was acoustic only, as per the first half.
Whispers On The Wind is the only one I would consider filler and has the album's least memorable melody.
This album is a big risk for the band. For me, there is way too much ballads and no epic songs. I have listened to it a few times, I don't feel amazed like I usually feel about their albums. I won't buy it and certainly no go to the show. It's gonna be a first for me.
For me, personally, the moment the albums loses some traction is during Losing Faythe and Whispers On The Wind.
Losing Faythe has the worst album moment - that awful crying (or laughing??) and the fact that it is the only symphonic moment that feels redundant and would have been better if it was acoustic only, as per the first half.
Whispers On The Wind is the only one I would consider filler and has the album's least memorable melody.
For me, personally, the moment the albums loses some traction is during Losing Faythe and Whispers On The Wind.
Losing Faythe has the worst album moment - that awful crying (or laughing??) and the fact that it is the only symphonic moment that feels redundant and would have been better if it was acoustic only, as per the first half.
Whispers On The Wind is the only one I would consider filler and has the album's least memorable melody.
I like the 'Gaaaaaaaaaaabriel, myyyy son' stuff at the end of Losing Faythe.
For me, personally, the moment the albums loses some traction is during Losing Faythe and Whispers On The Wind.
Losing Faythe has the worst album moment - that awful crying (or laughing??) and the fact that it is the only symphonic moment that feels redundant and would have been better if it was acoustic only, as per the first half.
Whispers On The Wind is the only one I would consider filler and has the album's least memorable melody.
I like the 'Gaaaaaaaaaaabriel, myyyy son' stuff at the end of Losing Faythe.
I'd rather the band take a risk once in a while than just churn out an 8 track 75 minute album with a 24 minute epic at the end every two years.
I'd rather the band take a risk once in a while than just churn out an 8 track 75 minute album with a 24 minute epic at the end every two years.
Agree, but the next one I want Train of Thought meets SC type of music. :metal
I would like a super heavy TOT style album with all natural recording. Just drums and amps.
If I had to complain about anything, it would be the details: the packaging of the album (white credits on white background? booklet glued to the case with small lyrics in the most average and common font? come on!),
If I had to complain about anything, it would be the details: the packaging of the album (white credits on white background? booklet glued to the case with small lyrics in the most average and common font? come on!),
The packaging is so annoying! I literally cannot read like a third of the liner notes, and the rest require straining my eyes and tilting the page at just the right angle. And the fact that you can't take it out of the cover? Whose idea was that? The guy in charge of the packaging should be fired.
I don't think I am the right one to do it, but I think it'd be a really cool and feasible idea to have a sort of definitive thread for connections between songs.
For example to start with, for Dystopian Overture it could list by timestamp all the parts identified as themes or sections that appear in later songs. Then for each song it could list any connections people find and (what other song it is connected with).
Obviously a gargantuan task for one person, but if there was a thread where people could just post any individual connections they notice, it might not be such a difficult task to eventually list people's contributions in the OP.
With 34 tracks to listen to, I'm sure I'm not the only one who noticed parts familiar from other songs but couldn't quite recall which one it was from - and by the time you listen through the full 2 hour album again you might have forgotten what it was you were looking for.
This would be a cool idea indeed!
Well, it took me a week but I finally made it through the entire album. I've been really busy and my life is a circus. I have to say that I'm really enjoying this so far. It's certainly the single most ambitious thing I've ever heard them do. Out of the gate, my favorite song is hymn of 1000 voices, but we will see what sticks in the long run.
This album is going to take a very long time to digest in its entirety.
Just popping in here to give my two cents after reading this thread.
While I don't know the writing dynamic I don't really care for JR's contributions on
The Astonishing. I'm assuming he did the orchestration and it's just too much. I feel like they should have taken a more simple approach to this new album instead of the this grand rock album.
Whispers on the Wind is kinda superflous... I understand there has to be the "darkest moment", "we're all screwed" point in the story but it's kinda bland, it could have been just a somber verse tackled at the beginning of Hymn with Gabriel despairing, and then the song changing to a more uplifting tune.I can't agree with this, personally, as it's my favourite of that run. Losing Faythe and Hymn are nice but I prefer Whispers. Kinda reminds me of some of The Dear Hunter's slower songs.
So I've been reading reviews of this album for awhile now, as well as trying to gauge the reaction here amongst the fans. So far, there seems to be quite a bit of love for this album. People really seem to be digging the story, the music, and just the whole idea of this vast world that's being created.
Stupidly, I've also read the comments on the reviews, YouTube "reviews", and even comments on Facebook. There also seems to be quite a bit of hate for this album. A lot of the hate seems to be from people that have no idea of the story, like they haven't read the lyrics or checked out the track explanation page of the website, and they also seem to be completely unaware that the story is what took precedent. And I think that's what makes me so frustrated by some of the backlash - it's ignorant people just spewing crap. Not surprisingly, these seem to be the same people that are still so bitter about MP being out of the band.
Is it just me? Am I crazy to think that if people took the time to fully immerse themselves in the story while listening to the album they'd be able to find some level of enjoyment in it? Perhaps I'm being too sensitive to all of this; I just really am excited about this album and that DT decided to do something so vastly different than anything they'd done before, and really different than anyone else is doing currently.
(I also get that this album just won't click with people, and that's totally cool. If you're one of those that has given it a fair chance, then my strange, stream of conscience rambling above isn't directed at you.)
I don't even compare it to previous DT albums. To me it stands on its own merit.
I don't even compare it to previous DT albums. To me it stands on its own merit.
I agree with this so much. Because it's so long and different, it's really hard to place with the rest of their discography, though in terms of effort it's clearly on top.
I don't even compare it to previous DT albums. To me it stands on its own merit.
I agree with this so much. Because it's so long and different, it's really hard to place with the rest of their discography, though in terms of effort it's clearly on top.
I've been saying since my first listen, it's really incredibly difficult to figure out where this album would place within the discography of DT. It either needs to be on it's under a "Soundtrack" category, or have an asterisks next to the title.
Just popping in here to give my two cents after reading this thread.
While I don't know the writing dynamic I don't really care for JR's contributions on The Astonishing. I'm assuming he did the orchestration and it's just too much. I feel like they should have taken a more simple approach to this new album instead of the this grand rock album.
Just popping in here to give my two cents after reading this thread.
While I don't know the writing dynamic I don't really care for JR's contributions on The Astonishing. I'm assuming he did the orchestration and it's just too much. I feel like they should have taken a more simple approach to this new album instead of the this grand rock album.
I like what they did with this album. It's undoubtedly different and not something I would expect from them at this stage of their career. It'll never be a top 5 Dream Theater CD for me (ADTOE is number 5 and I don't think the new CD will be able to surpass that), but there are a lot of great songs on The Astonishing and it's really starting to grow on me. The first time I heard Moment of Betrayal I was not impressed but now it's one of my favorite songs on the album.
Oh, and to add to my last post -- I think SFAM did a much better job of using the music to convey the story.
The album's ranking on Prog Rock Archives just inched past 4 stars some time in the last 24 hours. The only other DT albums past 4 stars are I&W, Awake, SFAM, and 6DOIT.
I know many fans who think The Astonishing is the only DT album to reach the level of those classics. The pacing problems of Act II relegate it to fourth or fifth place of my top five (still processing), but these are the albums that remind me why I love DT. None of the rest come close, although they all have their strengths.
Key parts, like Nefaryus' change of mind from switching from an oppressive ruler to a benign supporter of the art, are shortchanged and don't come across as believable.Not sure why you think that - at the very latest it starts in A New Beginning where we discover that he is not really such a bad guy after all. Arguably it starts in When Your Time Has Come or thereabouts, where he is visibly moved by Gabriel's singing. So it's pretty clearly signposting and doesn't happen suddenly.
Oh, and if we arbitrarly decide that there are three acts and the first ends with Three Days, I'd say that act is basically perfect. There's not a moment on it that I would change or shorten.
it's like the band have no idea about what makes music cool in the first place. I honestly can't say I prefer The Astonishing over When Dream and Day Unite.
I'm glad everyone's enjoying this, but I'm heartbroken. I was already with the last two albums, but they were alright. At least they still had a little rock 'n roll to them. Don't get me wrong, I like DT's ballads for the most part. But the amount here is just cringeworthy, story or no story. Also, I'm baffled by the amount of seven-string guitar here while not sounding heavy at all.. it's like the band have no idea about what makes music cool in the first place. I honestly can't say I prefer The Astonishing over When Dream and Day Unite.
https://youtu.be/BFK3H5Tl_Lo?t=180
it seems as if the band has forgotten to make a good album from start to finish, that is in its entirety.
B.Lee
A couple more days of letting it sit and I only feel much more strongly that When Dream and Day Unite is a greater work. That album is so absolutely glorious in so many ways, and it's funny how listening to/thinking about that album really brings out to me so many of the most important aspects of powerful song writing that is so missing from The Astonishing.
For many, it is difficult to hear these aspects on WDADU because it's hidden behind low quality production and bad singing (no offense to CD, who I fully respect), and because some of these aspects are a bit deeper and more intricate than what the average (or even DT) listener picks up on at first.
But it is a certain purpose behind the song that drives the direction and makes the writer search for perfection in every note and lyric. That can only be fueled by a passion in the writer to express something, and it's what will ignite that same passion in the listener when they feel it.
I will also add that A Dramatic Turn of Events is a great example of music with that passion and direction. I don't, by any stretch, believe that DT has lost that; I just find Astonishing to be the weakest.
Just popping in here to give my two cents after reading this thread.
While I don't know the writing dynamic I don't really care for JR's contributions on The Astonishing. I'm assuming he did the orchestration and it's just too much. I feel like they should have taken a more simple approach to this new album instead of the this grand rock album.
I like what they did with this album. It's undoubtedly different and not something I would expect from them at this stage of their career. It'll never be a top 5 Dream Theater CD for me (ADTOE is number 5 and I don't think the new CD will be able to surpass that), but there are a lot of great songs on The Astonishing and it's really starting to grow on me. The first time I heard Moment of Betrayal I was not impressed but now it's one of my favorite songs on the album.
I like that they took the the risk and did something different, it's just not for me. I wish they went a bit more stripped down. This album reminds me of "Use Your Illusion" to me in the way that with some trimming it would have made a great single disc. This is all my opinion though.
As the new DT record was released earlier here in Sweden, I bought it last
thursday. I was very hopeful that it was going to be a great album (I had
not heard any samples of the songs before). But I most say that I'm NOT
impressed. This is not the interesting, progressive music heard on the last
albums, but a ordinary Headbangers-Ball-Metal record.
Ok, I'm a lurker who got an early copy of Awake, and I just like to say
people whining about Awake need to find a new list or get their head
examined :-) Its certainly my favorite DT album.
First of all, "When Dream and Day Unite" is perhaps one of my ALL-TIME
favorite progressive/metal albums!!!!
But even with all the hype of this new album and new singer, I was
still kinda skeptical about it...
Well, I popped it in the ol' player and was blown away! (literally)
But, too bad the rest of the songs weren't as spectacular as the
first one...
DT has been "caught in a web" of its own creation by over zealously
falling to the lure of the progressive "one fantastically long track"
syndrome - which albeit worked so often for it and other bands like
Spock's Beard ('Great Nothing'). But this current album and it's SIX
degrees is basically a pile of pooh. Track one is the only one that
comes close to true excellence.
I can't beleive all the good things I am hearing about this new cd set!
I think disc one totally sucks! I have listened to it over and over,but
you can't make yourself like something! It should have been released as
a single CD with just the second Cd's material. They sound like napalm
death and pantera,what a dissapointment!
My point is; polarization of the fan base has been the norm for Dream Theater - and you'll always find the people that don't like it. Even SFAM had its detractors. The interview I posted earlier with Mike from 2004 said it simply: DT themselves don't even know what to do to please their fans, BECAUSE the fanbase is so diverse that regardless of what they do people will love it, people will hate it.
My point is; polarization of the fan base has been the norm for Dream Theater - and you'll always find the people that don't like it. Even SFAM had its detractors. The interview I posted earlier with Mike from 2004 said it simply: DT themselves don't even know what to do to please their fans, BECAUSE the fanbase is so diverse that regardless of what they do people will love it, people will hate it.
I think what makes people forget this is that those albums have properly sunk deep into the DT legacy and have a very well defined purpose to them due to hindsight while it can be difficult to really view how an album like TA fits in the context of DT's discography without biases or kneejerk reactions until there are a few albums afterwards putting it into context. Just look how the reputations of albums such as FII, ToT and Awake have improved, it's because we can now appreciate them for what they are, not what was built up due to hype and expectation. I hope I'm making sense here.
I think it's a good sign this album is winning PASSIONATE love or dislike, rather than the general, 'It's OK I guess because it's more DT' reactions their albums have had for over a decade now.
Or as seen from the negative peoples perspective: "it's just that the newer albums as SO bad that we now see that the old ones were better" ;)"Bad" isn't the correct term, is it? Makes it sound like there's a one size fits all scale to judge any and all music to. Maybe "...SO far away from what I was hoping for..."
My Last Farewell has grown on me a lot. I think the only song on the album I'm not keen on now is Whispers on the Wind.
I might be in the minority that loves Act II.
Hey, why don't Dream Theater do something different for their next album, put some FEEL into it! Hell, it may even get someone to respect them!
I might be in the minority that loves Act II.
Hey, why don't Dream Theater do something different for their next album, put some FEEL into it! Hell, it may even get someone to respect them!
How anyone can say this album doesn't have feel to it is beyond me. There was variety in feel just in the first single!
LaBrie is top notch on every track. It's his career best.Yes. Absolutely. He should feel intensely proud of himself for his performance on this release.
I'm so impressed with this release, and it feels like everywhere else online hates it. I'm glad people on here seem to dig it.They've never been one to appeal to light hearted listeners. 3( And this album needs even seasoned DT fans to invest in opening your ears and mind to more than just disposable earcandy, wankery or crunchy riffs. It's structured, produced and designed as a broadway type musical more than a concept album. A lot of people aren't fans of that and it will turn them right off to the whole thing instantly. And whatever... The biggest and most rewarding risks they've always taken are the ones that don't appeal to broad markets and casual listeners.
Oh, and to add to my last post -- I think SFAM did a much better job of using the music to convey the story.
I made this point to a friend the other day, I think the problem is that JP was trying to drive along the plot with the lyrics of the songs. Not even musicals do that, they always have a lot of spoken dialogue to drive the plot, and then have the songs reserved for crucial sections that usually showcase a crucial emotional element of the plot.
So, TA wastes precious time on lyrics like "can you help me? Nope, busy. Oh, OK." or that Nafaryus goes on a trip. Key parts, like Nefaryus' change of mind from switching from an oppressive ruler to a benign supporter of the art, are shortchanged and don't come across as believable.
IMHO, TA should have been a written short story in the booklet, with all the details necessary to make all parts believable, and the songs would have focused on key characterand plot parts.
Hey, why don't Dream Theater do something different for their next album, put some FEEL into it! Hell, it may even get someone to respect them!
How anyone can say this album doesn't have feel to it is beyond me. There was variety in feel just in the first single!
(https://i3.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/018/467/1355331549061.jpg)
I can't be the only person who doesn't think DT12 was especially heavy. I don't know if maybe the overly loud production makes it sound heavier to a lot of people.
Hey, why don't Dream Theater do something different for their next album, put some FEEL into it! Hell, it may even get someone to respect them!
How anyone can say this album doesn't have feel to it is beyond me. There was variety in feel just in the first single!
(https://i3.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/018/467/1355331549061.jpg)
Spot on there, I thought the green text = sarcasm was universally understood (especially as I've made it clear that I like the album a lot). Apparantly not. Unless dparrott's post wasn't aimed at me.
I can't be the only person who doesn't think DT12 was especially heavy. I don't know if maybe the overly loud production makes it sound heavier to a lot of people.
I can't be the only person who doesn't think DT12 was especially heavy. I don't know if maybe the overly loud production makes it sound heavier to a lot of people.
Indeed.I can't be the only person who doesn't think DT12 was especially heavy. I don't know if maybe the overly loud production makes it sound heavier to a lot of people.
I agree with you. While it think it's a slightly heavier album than, say, ADTOE, it's doesn't have the heaviness of TOT, SC, or even Awake.
I can't be the only person who doesn't think DT12 was especially heavy. I don't know if maybe the overly loud production makes it sound heavier to a lot of people.
Not Train of Thought heavy but thick and chuggy guitars.
No it wasn't. I got the sarcasm, my point was about the mock criticism that DT doesn't put feeling into their music.
I kind of thought Dream Theater was one of their least heavy albums... The Enemy Inside is heavy, perhaps Behind The Veil and The Enigma machine would count too as well as parts of Illumination Theory (though overall it doesn't leave the impression of being a heavy epic) but overall I'd possibly have called it the least heavy since FII.
I feel all post-MP albums have gone back to pre-ToT amount of heavy. I think MP was a strong drive in that direction.
Personally I think it works better for the band. While JP and MP seemed to be in their element in the heavy sections, JR was often struggling to add anything worthwhile.
Hmm, well I don't think I'm on the same wavelength when it comes to judging which album is heavier or not if DT12 could be considered heavier than some of those :P
Perhaps I tend to skew my opinion on what is a heavy album based on having the heaviest individual songs (even if it is mixed with material that is not heavy at all). Very little on DT12 comes close to as heavy as Beyond This Life, Home, The Glass Prison, A Nightmare To Rember, The Shattered Fortress, imo.
its a pretty rocking album, and JR does mostly background and atmospheric lead stuff, playing more to his strengths. Plus, the songs are all really good. :hat
I would like the title of this thread to include "haters stay the f out". :P ;D
DT12 was pretty heavy too make up for it. In fact - seeing as how they were planning The Astonishing for two years - they might have deliberately made DT12 heavy .JP said in the radio interview with Eddie Trunk that he had the initial idea of TA during the promotion of DT12. So no.
I would like the title of this thread to include "haters stay the f out". :P ;D
Are you implying The Astonishing is a dog ? :o :o
I would like the title of this thread to include "haters stay the f out". :P ;D
Are you implying The Astonishing is a dog ? :o :o
haha no, just only want positive posts
::) why make something clickable that doesn't do anything ?They did it just to mess with us
Indeed. dparrott's post does not represent the views of DTF. :PI would like the title of this thread to include "haters stay the f out". :P ;D
Are you implying The Astonishing is a dog ? :o :o
haha no, just only want positive posts
Pssh, it's a discussion thread, not a "slurp TA" one. :P
All opinions, good and bad, should be welcomed.
I can't be the only person who doesn't think DT12 was especially heavy. I don't know if maybe the overly loud production makes it sound heavier to a lot of people.
I still don't understand what people mean by ballads. Is it because most songs begin with piano?
Oh, and to add to my last post -- I think SFAM did a much better job of using the music to convey the story.
I made this point to a friend the other day, I think the problem is that JP was trying to drive along the plot with the lyrics of the songs. Not even musicals do that, they always have a lot of spoken dialogue to drive the plot, and then have the songs reserved for crucial sections that usually showcase a crucial emotional element of the plot.
So, TA wastes precious time on lyrics like "can you help me? Nope, busy. Oh, OK." or that Nafaryus goes on a trip. Key parts, like Nefaryus' change of mind from switching from an oppressive ruler to a benign supporter of the art, are shortchanged and don't come across as believable.
IMHO, TA should have been a written short story in the booklet, with all the details necessary to make all parts believable, and the songs would have focused on key characterand plot parts.
Some musicals are sung-through, Les Mis being probably the most famous example, and not to mention all operas which have little to no spoken parts. It's not like there isn't precedent for this in the arts, but you could still make the argument that some of the tracks aren't as engaging as others because they deal in less interesting subject matter.
::) why make something clickable that doesn't do anything ?
Exactly. People who keep on insisting that they could have reduced this to 1 CD and insist that there is a lot of filler just keep on refusing to judge the work on its own terms. It is a rock musical, with the songs almost 95% telling the story.
Exactly. People who keep on insisting that they could have reduced this to 1 CD and insist that there is a lot of filler just keep on refusing to judge the work on its own terms. It is a rock musical, with the songs almost 95% telling the story.
And some people keep insisting on using "rock opera" to refuse all criticism of the album, as if people who don't like it just don't get it. It's getting tiring and arrogant. Everyone gets it. It's a rock opera. It's different. Moving along....
The point rumby and others are making is that over two hours was not warranted to tell this story. Just because all of the lyrics are telling story doesn't mean it was all necessary, and couldn't have been told much more concisely and effectively. It is still possible to have filler in a story, and it is still possible to have musical filler. Being a rock opera doesn't negate these criticisms, nor does debating the semantics of what constitutes "filler" or not. It's like with a movie. Just because a scene may have had a purpose, doesn't mean it's essential, which is why they can trim them down for the story and pacing to work more effectively as a whole unit.
I disagree with the word "filler", in a narrative context. Complaints about pacing are one thing, and I get why people might feel the pacing is off, but it's all relevant to the narrative. "Filler" has a precise meaning - padding something out just to make it longer - that I just don't think applies in this context, particularly given the amount of narrative that was excluded. And that's probably what is bugging a lot of people. I know it's just semantics, but using a more derogatory word is naturally going to elicit that sort of reaction.Exactly. People who keep on insisting that they could have reduced this to 1 CD and insist that there is a lot of filler just keep on refusing to judge the work on its own terms. It is a rock musical, with the songs almost 95% telling the story.
And some people keep insisting on using "rock opera" to refuse all criticism of the album, as if people who don't like it just don't get it. It's getting tiring and arrogant. Everyone gets it. It's a rock opera. It's different. Moving along....
The point rumby and others are making is that over two hours was not warranted to tell this story. Just because all of the lyrics are telling story doesn't mean it was all necessary, and couldn't have been told much more concisely and effectively. It's arguable it wasn't all that effective as it was, given there were parts of the story that weren't understood even from the lyrics, and required further explanation on the official site. It is still possible to have filler in a story, and it is still possible to have musical filler. Being a rock opera doesn't negate these criticisms, nor does debating the semantics of what constitutes "filler" or not. It's like with a movie. Just because a scene may have had a purpose, doesn't mean it's essential, which is why they can trim them down for the story and pacing to work more effectively as a whole unit.
I disagree with the word "filler", in a narrative context. Complaints about pacing are one thing, and I get why people might feel the pacing is off, but it's all relevant to the narrative. "Filler" has a precise meaning - padding something out just to make it longer - that I just don't think applies in this context, particularly given the amount of narrative that was excluded. And that's probably what is bugging a lot of people. I know it's just semantics, but using a more derogatory word is naturally going to elicit that sort of reaction.Exactly. People who keep on insisting that they could have reduced this to 1 CD and insist that there is a lot of filler just keep on refusing to judge the work on its own terms. It is a rock musical, with the songs almost 95% telling the story.
And some people keep insisting on using "rock opera" to refuse all criticism of the album, as if people who don't like it just don't get it. It's getting tiring and arrogant. Everyone gets it. It's a rock opera. It's different. Moving along....
The point rumby and others are making is that over two hours was not warranted to tell this story. Just because all of the lyrics are telling story doesn't mean it was all necessary, and couldn't have been told much more concisely and effectively. It's arguable it wasn't all that effective as it was, given there were parts of the story that weren't understood even from the lyrics, and required further explanation on the official site. It is still possible to have filler in a story, and it is still possible to have musical filler. Being a rock opera doesn't negate these criticisms, nor does debating the semantics of what constitutes "filler" or not. It's like with a movie. Just because a scene may have had a purpose, doesn't mean it's essential, which is why they can trim them down for the story and pacing to work more effectively as a whole unit.
Agree with the ariich too. Actually I think they must have trimmed down a lot, there's much more that could've gone into it like the turning of Lord Nafaryus (WHY does he use NOMACS if he loved music?), a more in depth explanation of Daryus' comeuppance, more info with the NOMACS themselves...
Also agree with a lot of people about Whispers On The Wind. Pretty sure it could've been one track with Losing Faythe. Also would be a double meaning with Gabriel losing faith in himself.
I only recently realized a highly ironic thing - my favorite song from the album, A New Beginning, has to be the least relevant song to the actual story. I'm not sure what it added to the album lyrically.That one adds quite a lot, I would say. It's the point at which Faythe convinces Nafaryus to give Gabriel a chance, and does quite a bit to open up Nafaryus' character with the revelation that as a young man he liked to listen to music as well. I mean, the song could be shorter as more than half of it is instrumental and solos, but I don't imagine many fans would want to get rid of that stuff. :lol If anything, it's Road to Revolution that doesn't really add much else.
And some people keep insisting on using "rock opera" to refuse all criticism of the album, as if people who don't like it just don't get it. It's getting tiring and arrogant. Everyone gets it. It's a rock opera.
Exactly. People who keep on insisting that they could have reduced this to 1 CD and insist that there is a lot of filler just keep on refusing to judge the work on its own terms. It is a rock musical, with the songs almost 95% telling the story.
And some people keep insisting on using "rock opera" to refuse all criticism of the album, as if people who don't like it just don't get it. It's getting tiring and arrogant. Everyone gets it. It's a rock opera. It's different. Moving along....
The point rumby and others are making is that over two hours was not warranted to tell this story. Just because all of the lyrics are telling story doesn't mean it was all necessary, and couldn't have been told much more concisely and effectively. It's arguable it wasn't all that effective as it was, given there were parts of the story that weren't understood even from the lyrics, and required further explanation on the official site. It is still possible to have filler in a story, and it is still possible to have musical filler. Being a rock opera doesn't negate these criticisms, nor does debating the semantics of what constitutes "filler" or not. It's like with a movie. Just because a scene may have had a purpose, doesn't mean it's essential, which is why they can trim them down for the story and pacing to work more effectively as a whole unit.
I believe that's exactly what they did - what they wanted, I mean ;)
It all still reads like "you can't criticize it because you're judging it wrong". I call BS.
I don't see how wishing it was one CD is a problem. It has nothing to do with not being sung through, it just calls for a shorter story. Or you know, DT can do what they want instead of following a set formula for the sake of semantical classification.
It all still reads like "you can't criticize it because you're judging it wrong". I call BS.
I don't see how wishing it was one CD is a problem. It has nothing to do with not being sung through, it just calls for a shorter story. Or you know, DT can do what they want instead of following a set formula for the sake of semantical classification.
Well, DT did do what they want. They wanted to write a sung through rock opera.
It all still reads like "you can't criticize it because you're judging it wrong". I call BS.
I don't see how wishing it was one CD is a problem. It has nothing to do with not being sung through, it just calls for a shorter story. Or you know, DT can do what they want instead of following a set formula for the sake of semantical classification.
Well, DT did do what they want. They wanted to write a sung through rock opera.
And that's another who missed the point entirely. That had nothing to do with my point about a certain criticism of the album, at least not at all in the way you decided to take it instead. All I wanted was some basic level of respect for opposing viewpoints.
It all still reads like "you can't criticize it because you're judging it wrong". I call BS.
I don't see how wishing it was one CD is a problem. It has nothing to do with not being sung through, it just calls for a shorter story. Or you know, DT can do what they want instead of following a set formula for the sake of semantical classification.
Well, DT did do what they want. They wanted to write a sung through rock opera.
And that's another who missed the point entirely. That had nothing to do with my point about a certain criticism of the album, at least not at all in the way you decided to take it instead. All I wanted was some basic level of respect for opposing viewpoints.
It all still reads like "you can't criticize it because you're judging it wrong". I call BS.
I don't see how wishing it was one CD is a problem. It has nothing to do with not being sung through, it just calls for a shorter story. Or you know, DT can do what they want instead of following a set formula for the sake of semantical classification.
Well, DT did do what they want. They wanted to write a sung through rock opera.
And that's another who missed the point entirely. That had nothing to do with my point about a certain criticism of the album, at least not at all in the way you decided to take it instead. All I wanted was some basic level of respect for opposing viewpoints.
The more Dream Theater music the better is how I look at it. However, I definitely agree that it could have been done in one CD and still got the point of the story across. Metropolis 2 anybody?
It all still reads like "you can't criticize it because you're judging it wrong". I call BS.
I don't see how wishing it was one CD is a problem. It has nothing to do with not being sung through, it just calls for a shorter story. Or you know, DT can do what they want instead of following a set formula for the sake of semantical classification.
Well, DT did do what they want. They wanted to write a sung through rock opera.
And that's another who missed the point entirely. That had nothing to do with my point about a certain criticism of the album, at least not at all in the way you decided to take it instead. All I wanted was some basic level of respect for opposing viewpoints.
All I wanted was a basic level of respect for what the band was presenting to us. They wanted to present to us a sung through rock opera. Respect that that is the product that they are offering us. It is written as such. Criticize it as such.
It all still reads like "you can't criticize it because you're judging it wrong". I call BS.
I don't see how wishing it was one CD is a problem. It has nothing to do with not being sung through, it just calls for a shorter story. Or you know, DT can do what they want instead of following a set formula for the sake of semantical classification.
Well, DT did do what they want. They wanted to write a sung through rock opera.
And that's another who missed the point entirely. That had nothing to do with my point about a certain criticism of the album, at least not at all in the way you decided to take it instead. All I wanted was some basic level of respect for opposing viewpoints.
The more Dream Theater music the better is how I look at it. However, I definitely agree that it could have been done in one CD and still got the point of the story across. Metropolis 2 anybody?
Will SFAM work as a live on-stage musical, though?
This discussion is nearly on page 58 :omg:You move in circles.
NuggETZ
I only recently realized a highly ironic thing - my favorite song from the album, A New Beginning, has to be the least relevant song to the actual story. I'm not sure what it added to the album lyrically.That one adds quite a lot, I would say. It's the point at which Faythe convinces Nafaryus to give Gabriel a chance, and does quite a bit to open up Nafaryus' character with the revelation that as a young man he liked to listen to music as well. I mean, the song could be shorter as more than half of it is instrumental and solos, but I don't imagine many fans would want to get rid of that stuff. :lol If anything, it's Road to Revolution that doesn't really add much else.
For the record, I don't think the pacing is perfect, particularly towards the end. I somewhat agree that Losing Faythe and Whispers in the Wind could have been combined.
And I definitely think than Our New World and the title track could have been covered off in one song. They basically say the same thing. The title track is the only one I see as being pretty unnecessary, both musically and narratively. But what with it being at the end, it's easy enough to just not bother with. :P
Also, does anyone else think that Our New World would have fit perfectly on FII?
Also, does anyone else think that Our New World would have fit perfectly on FII?
It all still reads like "you can't criticize it because you're judging it wrong". I call BS.
I don't see how wishing it was one CD is a problem. It has nothing to do with not being sung through, it just calls for a shorter story. Or you know, DT can do what they want instead of following a set formula for the sake of semantical classification.
The good thing about being too long rather than too short, is that you can cut it down the way you prefer it (or skip).
Yeah I still wouldn't call it filler, though that probably could have happened at the end of ANB while JP was noodling away. :PI only recently realized a highly ironic thing - my favorite song from the album, A New Beginning, has to be the least relevant song to the actual story. I'm not sure what it added to the album lyrically.That one adds quite a lot, I would say. It's the point at which Faythe convinces Nafaryus to give Gabriel a chance, and does quite a bit to open up Nafaryus' character with the revelation that as a young man he liked to listen to music as well. I mean, the song could be shorter as more than half of it is instrumental and solos, but I don't imagine many fans would want to get rid of that stuff. :lol If anything, it's Road to Revolution that doesn't really add much else.
For the record, I don't think the pacing is perfect, particularly towards the end. I somewhat agree that Losing Faythe and Whispers in the Wind could have been combined.
And I definitely think than Our New World and the title track could have been covered off in one song. They basically say the same thing. The title track is the only one I see as being pretty unnecessary, both musically and narratively. But what with it being at the end, it's easy enough to just not bother with. :P
Road to Revolution has an important narrative point, Faythe informing Gabriel that Nafaryus agreed to meet him at Heaven's Cove. Like Astonishing, it can also feel extraneous, but if you imagine a live stage musical, these are the songs where all the main characters are coming out one by one not so much to forward the story, but to sort of receive the applause of the audience to close out the Act.
This is worth noting. If it is trimmed down, some songs that people could like would be cut off, like when you sometimes listen to bonus tracks and think "Why did they cut this?". The band may have a different idea of what is neccesary than many listeners. For example, if TA was cut down, but with a significant amount cut from Act I (like 30 mins) then Act II was kept as is, I doubt people like Blob (who really like Act I and aren't so keen on Act II) will be happy.
I can't be the only person who doesn't think DT12 was especially heavy. I don't know if maybe the overly loud production makes it sound heavier to a lot of people.
I can't be the only person who doesn't think DT12 was especially heavy. I don't know if maybe the overly loud production makes it sound heavier to a lot of people.
Oh, definitely. Until a few weeks ago I was still using it as an example of "modern heavy DT". It was only once I heard the non-brickwalled HDtracks master that I realized most of the album isn't particularly heavy and it's just the strangely one-dimensional sound with the guitar being so prominent that makes it seem that way. The HDtracks version is a big improvement in that respect. Suddenly The Looking Glass does sound like a Rush tune and not like a Roadrunner metal band playing a Rush tune.
2) The song Astonishing is so good I wish they had extended it to about 10 minutes.
TEI, sure, and I'd add parts of IT. And maybe at a stretch FAS is kinda heavy, but in a slightly cheesy power-metal sort of way.I can't be the only person who doesn't think DT12 was especially heavy. I don't know if maybe the overly loud production makes it sound heavier to a lot of people.
Oh, definitely. Until a few weeks ago I was still using it as an example of "modern heavy DT". It was only once I heard the non-brickwalled HDtracks master that I realized most of the album isn't particularly heavy and it's just the strangely one-dimensional sound with the guitar being so prominent that makes it seem that way. The HDtracks version is a big improvement in that respect. Suddenly The Looking Glass does sound like a Rush tune and not like a Roadrunner metal band playing a Rush tune.
I guess this shows how much mastering can change the character of the album, though I still believe that musically, FAS, TEI and EM are some of DT's heaviest stuff.
TEI, sure, and I'd add parts of IT. And maybe at a stretch FAS is kinda heavy, but in a slightly cheesy power-metal sort of way.I can't be the only person who doesn't think DT12 was especially heavy. I don't know if maybe the overly loud production makes it sound heavier to a lot of people.
Oh, definitely. Until a few weeks ago I was still using it as an example of "modern heavy DT". It was only once I heard the non-brickwalled HDtracks master that I realized most of the album isn't particularly heavy and it's just the strangely one-dimensional sound with the guitar being so prominent that makes it seem that way. The HDtracks version is a big improvement in that respect. Suddenly The Looking Glass does sound like a Rush tune and not like a Roadrunner metal band playing a Rush tune.
I guess this shows how much mastering can change the character of the album, though I still believe that musically, FAS, TEI and EM are some of DT's heaviest stuff.
EM I just don't think is heavy at all really; or rather, no more so than DT is normally. It's fun and quirky.
:metal :metal Nice work...
But I always find it funny when people do a cover of their favourite band and they use their signature guitars, use their signature amp, put their logo on the instruments, wear their t shirts - play in
front of a poster of the band... :biggrin:
Hey people! this is me singing MOB! Would you check it out????Great work, man :metal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU)
I'm so happy! :metal
Hey people! this is me singing MOB! Would you check it out????Great work, man :metal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU)
I'm so happy! :metal
You've got an awesome vibrato.
Anybody else find it absolutely hilarious that a bunch of casuals are gonna be buying tickets to see Petrucci shred a night of hard metal, only to be greeted by 2 hours of a ballad heavy sci-fi version of an Andrew Lloyd Webber musical?
It's awesome.
Anybody else find it absolutely hilarious that a bunch of casuals are gonna be buying tickets to see Petrucci shred a night of hard metal, only to be greeted by 2 hours of a ballad heavy sci-fi version of an Andrew Lloyd Webber musical?I'd like to have that instead of shredding.
It's awesome.
Hey people! this is me singing MOB! Would you check it out????
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU)
I'm so happy! :metal
Hey people! this is me singing MOB! Would you check it out????Fabulous job! To everyone involved!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU)
I'm so happy! :metal
Getting a bit tired of reading
" Astonishing is shit because there's no metal on it ".
If you want every album to be the fuking same heavy shit - go listen to Slayer. :facepalm:
My God. I'm so glad Dream Theater exists. They don't make the exact same album every two years and they stick their necks on the line every once in a while.
Kerry King hasn't got the guts to make anything other than a generic thrash album with lyrics about satan and auschwitz.
He wouldn't dare. He'd be terrified of not looking like tr00 methulz
Anybody else find it absolutely hilarious that a bunch of casuals are gonna be buying tickets to see Petrucci shred a night of hard metal, only to be greeted by 2 hours of a ballad heavy sci-fi version of an Andrew Lloyd Webber musical?
It's awesome.
I´m going to see DT perform The Astonishing. That´s what I´m going to see. I knew exactly what to expect when I ordered my ticket, namely that it´s not a regular Dream Theater concert. People that are moaning about TA being disapointing, hey tough. Wait a year and they´ll record a new, probably more regular ´metal´ record. Or not. This is the Astonishing. It is what it is. And I happen to think it´s pretty nifty.Pretty much this.
Maybe "filler" isn't the right word, but the middle of Act II is a somewhat long span of nothing musically remarkable. If you look at the "favorite song" poll on this forum, there's a big gap here, too, so it's not just me.I do kind of agree with you there.
At this point, you've been listening to the same style of rock opera music for an hour and a half. It would have been the perfect opportunity to throw in a curve ball and make Machine Chatter into a full-length song, maybe throw in some ambient guitar for some texture, etc. I feel like I am just starting to get into the groove when it ends abruptly.
Some of us here were lucky cause pringkaarwanda transcribed them from the booklet and posted them here.
Getting a bit tired of reading
" Astonishing is shit because there's no metal on it ".
If you want every album to be the fuking same heavy shit - go listen to Slayer. :facepalm:
My God. I'm so glad Dream Theater exists. They don't make the exact same album every two years and they stick their necks on the line every once in a while.
Kerry King hasn't got the guts to make anything other than a generic thrash album with lyrics about satan and auschwitz.
He wouldn't dare. He'd be terrified of not looking like tr00 methulz
Maybe "filler" isn't the right word, but the middle of Act II is a somewhat long span of nothing musically remarkable. If you look at the "favorite song" poll on this forum, there's a big gap here, too, so it's not just me.I think I disagree, but I want to check what you mean by "middle of Act II". I think the run from Path That Divides through to My Last Farewell is fantastic, both musically and narratively (though the two are of course related). The few songs after that are a bit more middle-of-the-road, but I would have said that's towards the end of the Act.
At this point, you've been listening to the same style of rock opera music for an hour and a half. It would have been the perfect opportunity to throw in a curve ball and make Machine Chatter into a full-length song, maybe throw in some ambient guitar for some texture, etc. I feel like I am just starting to get into the groove when it ends abruptly.
Yeah, I mean it was very clear in the marketing and when buying tickets that this was DT presents The Astonishing. I can see that some people might have had a friend or relative say "want to come see DT" and they go "yeah!" and therefore don't know, but for most if they're not aware, then they really weren't paying attention.Anybody else find it absolutely hilarious that a bunch of casuals are gonna be buying tickets to see Petrucci shred a night of hard metal, only to be greeted by 2 hours of a ballad heavy sci-fi version of an Andrew Lloyd Webber musical?
It's awesome.
Dream Theater are big, but not THAT big to the point that people know about them from the past and go to see them "because it's Dream Theater". I think their fanbase is dedicated enough to know what's going on with the band and be prepared.
I don't think there will be a case like Iron Maiden in 2006, with people deciding to go to see the mighty Maiden they saw back in the '80s, thinking "Surely I will hear Run to the Hills and The Trooper", and getting the whole new album (new by then) front to back.
People seem to find it difficult to know which character is saying which lines, I don't have that problem cause I've sat with the lyrics all the way through the album on my first listen and haven't had any problems identifying who's talking on subsequent listens...
There's plenty of heavy guitar on this album. Are people on crack?
Can you imagine the tedium if this album was 130 minutes of " This Dying Soul " ?
There's plenty of heavy guitar on this album. Are people on crack?
Can you imagine the tedium if this album was 130 minutes of " This Dying Soul " ?If they managed to make 130 minutes of music up to the quality of one of their best songs, it would be a pretty good album indeed :P
I wonder how a song like Three Days would have been welcomed on a regular DT album. You know, a "standard" DT album like the first two with Mangini, and then a song goes batshit insane with its style and those jazz incursions.The song is great but it is hard to see it working as well without having lyrics that are part of a story to really commit to. A random "villain song" on an album of otherwise unrelated songs would definitely be a bit weird, but the random styles of music wouldn't be a problem.
For me, I would have loved it, I wish more bands would have the odd, crazy songs here and there, completely unlikely anything they've ever done.
There's plenty of heavy guitar on this album. Are people on crack?But the guitar isn't the loudest entity in the mix and the master isn't brickwalled until the loud guitar obliterates any sonic details from the other instruments. This isn't how DT albums sounded for the past ten years.
There's plenty of heavy guitar on this album. Are people on crack?
The Hashtonishing
Dream Theater really needs to make our new World their next single, make a hopeful video of people helping other people when in despair and this song can easily be a major hit!
Dream Theater really needs to make our new World their next single, make a hopeful video of people helping other people when in despair and this song can easily be a major hit!
They aren't planning on releasing any singles from this album.
Dream Theater really needs to make our new World their next single, make a hopeful video of people helping other people when in despair and this song can easily be a major hit!
They aren't planning on releasing any singles from this album.
There's plenty of heavy guitar on this album. Are people on crack?
The Hashtonishing
Those were the days - smoking hash in the dorm - 1977 rocked
But then of course, disliking that hypothetical album due to it lacking in softer stuff would be completely valid, while it's OK to give people shit for disliking The Astonishing if they find it lacking in the metal side (which is as much a part of DT's history as anything else).Well no, the problem wouldn't be a lack of softer stuff (I like plenty of albums with no soft songs whatsoever) but everything being the same style. I think that's what Kotow was getting at. I know for a fact that he likes heavy music.
There's plenty of heavy guitar on this album. Are people on crack?
The Hashtonishing
Those were the days - smoking hash in the dorm - 1977 rocked
It seems to be pretty intuitive figuring out which character is singing during a given song.
Some of us here were lucky cause pringkaarwanda transcribed them from the booklet and posted them here.
Did he do that? I thought he just posted the link he got from reddit
You're 26 ? :)
Agreed. Once reading the lyrics through and paying attention, it's easy enough to remember. But it's definitely not that easy to get each line from just listening through.It seems to be pretty intuitive figuring out which character is singing during a given song.
Well, one instance that comes to mind is "In peace, we gather here today", which Arhys said in response to Nafaryus asking them to carry on with Gabriel's singing in the square event, to which Daryus responds "Don’t make him ask again", it plays like "Show us what we’ve heard so much about? In peace, we gather here today, Don’t make him ask again", I imagine a listener without lyrics would be confused for a second.
Arabelle has few lines here and there but I feel like she always comes out of nowhere and it's not easy to figure out it's her instantly.
Admittedly, as a victim of ITUNES and their "Not gonna give you any artwork" purchase...Agreed. Once reading the lyrics through and paying attention, it's easy enough to remember. But it's definitely not that easy to get each line from just listening through.It seems to be pretty intuitive figuring out which character is singing during a given song.
Well, one instance that comes to mind is "In peace, we gather here today", which Arhys said in response to Nafaryus asking them to carry on with Gabriel's singing in the square event, to which Daryus responds "Don’t make him ask again", it plays like "Show us what we’ve heard so much about? In peace, we gather here today, Don’t make him ask again", I imagine a listener without lyrics would be confused for a second.
Arabelle has few lines here and there but I feel like she always comes out of nowhere and it's not easy to figure out it's her instantly.
It seems that most people have disliked the middle of Act II, but that's honestly probably my favorite series of songs.
It seems to be pretty intuitive figuring out which character is singing during a given song.
I read through the booklet lyrics on first listen (annoying as it was given the packaging), which was enough to get the story in one go (apart from a couple of things only described on their site such as Daryus's deafness, exactly what "Bug" is...).
If I remember correctly I had this approach:
First listening: read the lyrics
Second listening: focused only on the music
Third listening: read the lyrics again
Fourth listening: reading not the lyrics but the song descriptions of the site.
That gave me quite a good understanding, then for all the little details there's this forum :biggrin:
Also, didn't Gabriel say the Noise Machines would be quiet that night, yet they appear right after The Path That Divides.
Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?
Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?
• Play to a click track.
• Play the tracks over the PA.
Hey people! this is me singing MOB! Would you check it out????
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU)
I'm so happy! :metal
Great job! When doing DT covers, I think the vocalist almost always has the greatest challenge. Very few people can sing with authority in the range James sings in.
Is there music/tabs available for this already, or did you guys all do it by ear? I'm trying to learn the Our New World solo on guitar, but can't figure out those sweep-picking arpeggios, etc. No tab so far in the usual spots online.
Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?
• Play to a click track.
• Play the tracks over the PA.
Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.
It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance.
Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them.
Um, no. On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation.
Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.
There's plenty of heavy guitar on this album. Are people on crack?There's a LOT of 7 string, too.
This is exactly what I did. The song summaries/explanations on the website are insanely helpful in understanding the story.People seem to find it difficult to know which character is saying which lines, I don't have that problem cause I've sat with the lyrics all the way through the album on my first listen and haven't had any problems identifying who's talking on subsequent listens...
I still have not done that. But I did read the summaries on DT.net, which give a great overview of the story itself. And I have found that with that knowledge alone, combined with James' voice inflection changes when he is changing characters, it usually isn't difficult to figure out who is speaking at any given point in the story, with just a few exceptions.
One thing not even explained in the website is whether or not Xander was kidnapped, the lyrics clearly state that he followed his father to Heaven's Cove so why was he worried about his life? And why did Daryus threaten him with his son's life?
*shrugs*Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?
• Play to a click track.
• Play the tracks over the PA.
Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.
It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance.
Um, no. On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation.
Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.
YES! Not just after The Path That Divides but they can also be clearly heard at the beginning of that very song! that's one thing I forgot to mention up there; why did he say the NOMAC's were "laying still"? the emperor didn't agree to that when he agreed to meet Gabriel, but also it contradicts what I felt was the whole point of going to Heaven's Cove which is to be away from the NOMAC's sounds and influence, which-stay with me here- brings us to the big elephant in the room; the nature and patterns of the NOMAC's presence, are they patrolling or are they always around? The scenes from the trailer drives me to believe there is hundreds, if not thousands, of them, so they don't take breaks or go in for maintenance or generally be in any situation where they're simply off.
Maybe they only patrol populated places and that's why Heaven's Cove was perfect for the meeting, but then Gabriel saying they "the noise machines lie still tonight" doesn't make sense.
*shrugs*Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?
• Play to a click track.
• Play the tracks over the PA.
Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.
It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance.
Um, no. On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation.
Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.
We'll all find out at some point then, won't we?
Well, there's definitely an imbalance of heavy and lighter stuff, so I think people are just confusing that with there being 'no heavy sections or songs'.There's plenty of heavy guitar on this album. Are people on crack?There's a LOT of 7 string, too.
One thing not even explained in the website is whether or not Xander was kidnapped, the lyrics clearly state that he followed his father to Heaven's Cove so why was he worried about his life? And why did Daryus threaten him with his son's life?
Well, the way I see it, had Xander been kidnapped by Daryus, Arhys wouldn't have stayed all night in his home (which the track description for "A Tempting Offer" makes me believe he did). Knowing who Arhys is, I guess he would have chased Daryus and get his son back. So, in my opinion: no, he wasn't kidnapped.
Regarding the second question: I don't think Daryus threatened Arhys with Xander's life. From what I've read, Daryus offer was:
A. for the Empire to have Gabriel and for Xander to have a better life, or
B. for the Empire to try having Gabriel and for Xander to remain as is,
Daryus did threaten to kill Xander, but that was once Arhys was dead and Xander appeared out of nowhere surprising the Prince. I guess he threaten to kill him so there'd be no witness to the crime. He would have had to act fast to cover up - I think that there still was time ;)
Anyway, that's all speculation, and maybe I'm forgetting a bit of text, so be sure to correct me if I'm missing something!
[Arhys]
How dare you step inside my home?!
[Daryus]
His life is in my hands!
[Arhys]
You monster, leave my son alone!
[Daryus]
You do know who I am
Your love for him is strong
[Arhys]
He’s just a boy
He’s done no wrong
This fight’s not his to lose
Daryus threatened to kill Xander on Tempting Offer, at least that's what this stand off insinuated:
Daryus offer was life and riches to Xander and also I don't think Daryus cares if he was found after he killed the leader of the rebellion and his son, it's not like they have a parliament or public opinion, he's the the emperor's son in a dictatorship, he's essentially Kim Jong-un :lol
Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?
• Play to a click track.
• Play the tracks over the PA.
Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.
It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance.
Um, no. On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation.
Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.
YES! Not just after The Path That Divides but they can also be clearly heard at the beginning of that very song! that's one thing I forgot to mention up there; why did he say the NOMAC's were "laying still"? the emperor didn't agree to that when he agreed to meet Gabriel, but also it contradicts what I felt was the whole point of going to Heaven's Cove which is to be away from the NOMAC's sounds and influence, which-stay with me here- brings us to the big elephant in the room; the nature and patterns of the NOMAC's presence, are they patrolling or are they always around? The scenes from the trailer drives me to believe there is hundreds, if not thousands, of them, so they don't take breaks or go in for maintenance or generally be in any situation where they're simply off.
Maybe they only patrol populated places and that's why Heaven's Cove was perfect for the meeting, but then Gabriel saying they "the noise machines lie still tonight" doesn't make sense.
Well, maybe the NOMACs did patrol in Heaven's Cove too, and would have been 'turned off' by Nafaryus during Faythe's and Gabriel's song, but not before. I guess that's why their music can be heard in both "The Path That Divides" and "Machine Chatter" - neither the Emperor/Arabelle nor Faythe/Gabriel had arrived at Heaven's Cove by that time, so the NOMACs were still normally functioning.
I've been thinking about these details for a couple of days. It still isn't clear to me what are all of their purposes, or how do people hear their music (in the first e-mail sent by Nafaryus, he talked about "transmitters inside of the flesh", and Arhys says in his first e-mail that his people had managed to "biohack" them, but there is nothing about this, either in the lyrics or in the track descriptions).
Or maybe there are NOMACS that accompany Daryus. They always appear near songs where he had major scenes.+1000
These discussions are freak in GREAT! Only Dream Theater fans would delve into the details and Take The Time to discuss and help each other understand the story better. :tupYES! Not just after The Path That Divides but they can also be clearly heard at the beginning of that very song! that's one thing I forgot to mention up there; why did he say the NOMAC's were "laying still"? the emperor didn't agree to that when he agreed to meet Gabriel, but also it contradicts what I felt was the whole point of going to Heaven's Cove which is to be away from the NOMAC's sounds and influence, which-stay with me here- brings us to the big elephant in the room; the nature and patterns of the NOMAC's presence, are they patrolling or are they always around? The scenes from the trailer drives me to believe there is hundreds, if not thousands, of them, so they don't take breaks or go in for maintenance or generally be in any situation where they're simply off.
Maybe they only patrol populated places and that's why Heaven's Cove was perfect for the meeting, but then Gabriel saying they "the noise machines lie still tonight" doesn't make sense.
Well, maybe the NOMACs did patrol in Heaven's Cove too, and would have been 'turned off' by Nafaryus during Faythe's and Gabriel's song, but not before. I guess that's why their music can be heard in both "The Path That Divides" and "Machine Chatter" - neither the Emperor/Arabelle nor Faythe/Gabriel had arrived at Heaven's Cove by that time, so the NOMACs were still normally functioning.
I've been thinking about these details for a couple of days. It still isn't clear to me what are all of their purposes, or how do people hear their music (in the first e-mail sent by Nafaryus, he talked about "transmitters inside of the flesh", and Arhys says in his first e-mail that his people had managed to "biohack" them, but there is nothing about this, either in the lyrics or in the track descriptions).
Or maybe there are NOMACS that accompany Daryus. They always appear near songs where he had major scenes.
*shrugs*Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?
• Play to a click track.
• Play the tracks over the PA.
Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.
It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance.
Um, no. On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation.
Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.
We'll all find out at some point then, won't we?
But why would you think they wouldn't do it? That's what they did (barring 1 show) with Illumination theory. Another song with an orchestra and stuff. So it's what they've been doing it for the past few tours. Why would you assume they'd stop?
Dream Theater really needs to make our new World their next single, make a hopeful video of people helping other people when in despair and this song can easily be a major hit!
They aren't planning on releasing any singles from this album.
Pretty much my thoughts on the matter as well. All the times I've seen them, never heard them make widespread use of click tracks and tapes other than intro stuff and random patches during a rare song here and there. Much less a 2 hour long performance. Even on the SFAM tour, I don't recall them using a backing track for the chorus on SCO, a song that used the most obvious choir arrangement up until TA and would have been easy to do so.*shrugs*Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?
• Play to a click track.
• Play the tracks over the PA.
Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.
It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance.
Um, no. On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation.
Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.
We'll all find out at some point then, won't we?
But why would you think they wouldn't do it? That's what they did (barring 1 show) with Illumination theory. Another song with an orchestra and stuff. So it's what they've been doing it for the past few tours. Why would you assume they'd stop?
For me there's a big difference between a few minutes of one song and 90% of songs during a 2 and a half hour performance. I'm just thinking it could be a LOT of pressure
Agreed. Once reading the lyrics through and paying attention, it's easy enough to remember. But it's definitely not that easy to get each line from just listening through.It seems to be pretty intuitive figuring out which character is singing during a given song.
Well, one instance that comes to mind is "In peace, we gather here today", which Arhys said in response to Nafaryus asking them to carry on with Gabriel's singing in the square event, to which Daryus responds "Don’t make him ask again", it plays like "Show us what we’ve heard so much about? In peace, we gather here today, Don’t make him ask again", I imagine a listener without lyrics would be confused for a second.
Arabelle has few lines here and there but I feel like she always comes out of nowhere and it's not easy to figure out it's her instantly.
It seems to be pretty intuitive figuring out which character is singing during a given song.
I can't really tell when he's changing characters when I'm listening to it. But I brought it over to my friend's house this weekend, as he and his wife like more clasically-inspired rock music (the are both big Muse fans, but they've always been open to listening to DT, and while they don't go by the albums, they enjoy it when I am over and play it)--and she could tell right away without even knowing much about the plot when James was singing the female versus male lines. I thought it was amazing, because I being the DT aficionado and being well-versed in the plot, still couldn't tell which character was singing without reading the lyric book.
For me there's a big difference between a few minutes of one song and 90% of songs during a 2 and a half hour performance. I'm just thinking it could be a LOT of pressure
All tours since ADTOE have been played to a click track, so i wonder why is there any question about this one, especially given that they need to run massive backing tracks and visuals.
Does anybody know if MM is the only one who actually hears the click-track?
Does he have the "secret cowbell" that MP had?
I'm curious to see if they'll play the two overtures or whether the band will just come in on TGOM and MOB for each Act. I seem to remember that they didn't play the SDOIT overture live, just piped in, and obviously didn't play False Awakening Suite on last tour, just a video presentation.
Looking pretty cool! Any higher res pics?
That's a shame. Can't wait to see more pics of it. It looks like a fair bit of finishing work has gone into it, probably sanding back the printed layers, painting it silver, and giving it a wash of black to bring out the details.
I'm curious to see if they'll play the two overtures or whether the band will just come in on TGOM and MOB for each Act. I seem to remember that they didn't play the SDOIT overture live, just piped in, and obviously didn't play False Awakening Suite on last tour, just a video presentation.
I'm curious to see if they'll play the two overtures or whether the band will just come in on TGOM and MOB for each Act. I seem to remember that they didn't play the SDOIT overture live, just piped in, and obviously didn't play False Awakening Suite on last tour, just a video presentation.
I'd be shocked if they didn't play both.
I think False Awakening Suite was specifically written to open the show and be their lead-in, just as the "easter egg" acted as the credits music for the show, like musical book-ends. They could have played it live, but I get the impression it was possibly never their intention to do so.
SDOIT Overture was simply too hard to pull off live, since it had such an "orchestra" heavy arrangement, and it's a hard song to hold together with the orchestral style percussion and changing tempos. They probably attempted it and realized it wasn't going to work live, so opted for the backing track instead.
I think TA was designed to be played through from start to finish, and I can't see any reason why the two instrumental tracks wouldn't be played here. They're important to establishing and re-establishing the musical themes, and aren't difficult songs by DT standards.
Hey I haven't checked in on the thread in a while and am too lazy to read back; you guys say anything other than what is metal and what is ballads and the same copy-pasted pro and con arguments about rock operas?Nope you've pretty much got it covered.
Oh there are 3D printed NOMACs that's cool.
For those who are more knowledgeable about guitar here, is there a similarity in the TGOM intro and The Answer intro or is it just the plucking pattern?
:3So you listened to the album once in the last week. :lol Plus 2 songs again presumably. Which ones were they?
For those who are more knowledgeable about guitar here, is there a similarity in the TGOM intro and The Answer intro or is it just the plucking pattern?
More than likely the latter, but maybe it was intentional. They are definitely in different keys though.
:3So you listened to the album once in the last week. :lol Plus 2 songs again presumably. Which ones were they?
:3So you listened to the album once in the last week. :lol Plus 2 songs again presumably. Which ones were they?
shut up I've listened to it like 6 times that didn't get scrobbled because I was at work come on rich you don't mod my LIFE :'(
I'm curious to see if they'll play the two overtures or whether the band will just come in on TGOM and MOB for each Act. I seem to remember that they didn't play the SDOIT overture live, just piped in, and obviously didn't play False Awakening Suite on last tour, just a video presentation.
I'd be shocked if they didn't play both.
I think False Awakening Suite was specifically written to open the show and be their lead-in, just as the "easter egg" acted as the credits music for the show, like musical book-ends. They could have played it live, but I get the impression it was possibly never their intention to do so.
SDOIT Overture was simply too hard to pull off live, since it had such an "orchestra" heavy arrangement, and it's a hard song to hold together with the orchestral style percussion and changing tempos. They probably attempted it and realized it wasn't going to work live, so opted for the backing track instead.
I think TA was designed to be played through from start to finish, and I can't see any reason why the two instrumental tracks wouldn't be played here. They're important to establishing and re-establishing the musical themes, and aren't difficult songs by DT standards.
For me not playing Dystopian Overture would be like not playing Overture 1928.
Just imagine the show: lights go out, you hear Descent of the Nomacs, there are those two loud noises at the end and then....... nothing? it would be the most anticlimatic beginning of a show in DT history.
For me not playing Dystopian Overture would be like not playing Overture 1928.
Just imagine the show: lights go out, you hear Descent of the Nomacs, there are those two loud noises at the end and then....... nothing? it would be the most anticlimatic beginning of a show in DT history.
Except that you wouldn't be hearing "nothing." You would be hearing Dystopian Overture. And then after the overture ends, the lights will come up to the band coming onstage for the mellow opening to The Gift of Music, very similar to when they played Six Degrees on the Six Degrees tour.
That one adds quite a lot, I would say. It's the point at which Faythe convinces Nafaryus to give Gabriel a chance, and does quite a bit to open up Nafaryus' character with the revelation that as a young man he liked to listen to music as well.Good points. :tup
I wouldn't be surprised either way. They could play a number of pieces that they don't actually play and just use a tape for (e.g., Six Degrees Overture, False Awakening Suite, Metropolis Pt. 1 opening, etc.). Whatever they decide to do will make sense in the context of the show for reasons we have absolutely zero idea about, so I wouldn't speculate one way or the other.
YES I DO I OWN YOU:3So you listened to the album once in the last week. :lol Plus 2 songs again presumably. Which ones were they?
shut up I've listened to it like 6 times that didn't get scrobbled because I was at work come on rich you don't mod my LIFE :'(
Okay, but that directly supports what I just said. They have a history of using intro tapes for songs or parts of songs that they clearly could play if they wanted to. There is clear precedent that would make any hypothetical decision to not play Dystopian Overture "par for the course."I wouldn't be surprised either way. They could play a number of pieces that they don't actually play and just use a tape for (e.g., Six Degrees Overture, False Awakening Suite, Metropolis Pt. 1 opening, etc.). Whatever they decide to do will make sense in the context of the show for reasons we have absolutely zero idea about, so I wouldn't speculate one way or the other.
Well, I wouldn't really say that we have "zero idea" about it, this entry (a bit dated, ok) from MP's FAQ explains what works also for basically every other band:
"On Once in a LIVEtime, who is playing the acoustic guitar and piano at the beginning of The Crimson Sunrise? faq id: 211
MP: Both the Acoustic Guitar and Piano are part of a Pre-recorded intro tape. We've done the same throughout our career with Metropolis, Pull Me Under and even Regression. The reason is to help build the anticipation and excitement at the start of the show (or encore) and to have a more exciting entrance when we arrive on the stage. It has nothing to do with not being able to play those intros, as we have played each one of these songs both ways throughout our career."
Anyway, did they actually play the intro of Metropolis? I think they've always played it as opener or as an encore song, therefore warranting the use of the intro tape...
Actually my last.fm only scrobbles 33 tracks per listen, Hovering Sojourn is apparently too short to register or some shit. :lol:3So you listened to the album once in the last week. :lol Plus 2 songs again presumably. Which ones were they?
i just watched TGOM music video because i'm late and
okay
is it just me or is Myung more audible in the video than he actually is on the album? I wasn't even really paying attention to the bassline at first but it caught my ear pretty easily, whereas I've never really noticed his parts on the album version
i just watched TGOM music video because i'm late and
okay
is it just me or is Myung more audible in the video than he actually is on the album? I wasn't even really paying attention to the bassline at first but it caught my ear pretty easily, whereas I've never really noticed his parts on the album version
i just watched TGOM music video because i'm late and
okay
is it just me or is Myung more audible in the video than he actually is on the album? I wasn't even really paying attention to the bassline at first but it caught my ear pretty easily, whereas I've never really noticed his parts on the album version
These are the first DT ballads I have actually liked since SFAM.
i get bass plenty fine on a lot of other albums i've been listening to as recently as yesterday, so it's just The Astonishing that's having the problem of bass being way low in the mixi just watched TGOM music video because i'm late and
okay
is it just me or is Myung more audible in the video than he actually is on the album? I wasn't even really paying attention to the bassline at first but it caught my ear pretty easily, whereas I've never really noticed his parts on the album version
do you have an EQ on your music app?
unrelated:
i'm really sad that A Life Left Behind starts out so cool but then turns into another ballad, even if i do like the chorus of the track a lot, i wish they'd have done more with the opening bit that's pretty much completely detached from the rest of the song
Yeah, I had this feeling too, that I really noticed the bass when I could see him playing -- I think it was just a psychological effect. P sure it's an identical audio track.is it just me or is Myung more audible in the video than he actually is on the album? I wasn't even really paying attention to the bassline at first but it caught my ear pretty easily, whereas I've never really noticed his parts on the album versionFunny, I was gonna say something similar. I don't know that I'd say the mix was different (that would be pretty interesting) but I absolutely noticed the bass parts that I'd never really heard, simply due to actually watching JMX playing it close up, so you can't miss it. And that kind of happened with other parts for me too; there's so much going on musically in that song, that it's hard to really pay attention to everything that's there, and watching them is a cool experience because it makes more sense of it to your ears :)
unrelated:
i'm really sad that A Life Left Behind starts out so cool but then turns into another ballad, even if i do like the chorus of the track a lot, i wish they'd have done more with the opening bit that's pretty much completely detached from the rest of the song
I suppose it's both a blessing and a curse that the songs on TA go through multiple 'movements' which they often never return to within the same song.
I actually like that, keeps it interesting for me.
Conclusion: The Astonishing, despite a few flaws, is incredible. I don't care what anyone says. DT still have it. After 30 years.
Conclusion: The Astonishing, despite a few flaws, is incredible. I don't care what anyone says. DT still have it. After 30 years.
My opinion in a nutshell. It's not gloriously perfect but it's wonderful.
I don't care what anyone says. DT still have it. After 30 years.
I was going to say Judas Priest, but no one cared for Nostradamus sadly :biggrin:
Well, not really no one, I love that album and I applaud them for taking the chance just as I applaud DT for The Astonishing. Too bad I'm in the vast minority.
I was going to say Judas Priest, but no one cared for Nostradamus sadly :biggrin:
Well, not really no one, I love that album and I applaud them for taking the chance just as I applaud DT for The Astonishing. Too bad I'm in the vast minority.
Conclusion: The Astonishing, despite a few flaws, is incredible. I don't care what anyone says. DT still have it. After 30 years.
My opinion in a nutshell. It's not gloriously perfect but it's wonderful.
It's pretty damn close to perfection IMO. A few more little guitar solos and it would be there.
2:50 in The Path That Divides :metal
I get goosebumps all over the place. I absolutely think it's a remarkable album.
I wouldn't be surprised either way. They could play a number of pieces that they don't actually play and just use a tape for (e.g., Six Degrees Overture, False Awakening Suite, Metropolis Pt. 1 opening, etc.). Whatever they decide to do will make sense in the context of the show for reasons we have absolutely zero idea about, so I wouldn't speculate one way or the other.I would be disappointed if they didn't play Dystopian Overture live , it's just too powerful to have it piped in. I want to hear it in full force with the attention on the band with big bright lights!
Maybe "filler" isn't the right word, but the middle of Act II is a somewhat long span of nothing musically remarkable.
I like it..These are the first DT ballads I have actually liked since SFAM.
I still like The Answer Lies Within - even though I appear to be the only DT fan in existence that does.
Regarding the "my music player" line--which I also find grating and takes me out of the story...This is my favorite moment of the album. Made me tear up on first listen. Just reaches right into that part of my memory when I was a new kid at school in 7th grade (brutal year to be the new kid) and the only friend I had was my music player.
This is not to say you're wrong... I have plenty of thoughts on where JP & co. might have used a second pair of eyes when lyric-writing over the past several albums... but just, one's trash lyric is another's treasure. :)
I loved that line also because my music player is so integral to my lifestyle that I can listen to two full runs of TA in a day. That's how much time I spend listening to it.
Can't help but think this album would be a little better with MP's drumming. I miss all his different percussion sounds he'd make.
I don't even compare it to previous DT albums. To me it stands on its own merit.
I agree with this so much. Because it's so long and different, it's really hard to place with the rest of their discography, though in terms of effort it's clearly on top.
I've been saying since my first listen, it's really incredibly difficult to figure out where this album would place within the discography of DT. It either needs to be on it's under a "Soundtrack" category, or have an asterisks next to the title.
I might sound as a fanboy in which I am, I really applaud the band & John Petrucci for having the balls to create this idea at this point in DT history. From the characters, the story, the map is outstanding work. There will be critics of course, but many of us fans can't wait to see this on stage & how James will portray each character live, which will be a challenging task, but he will pull it off well
Agree with the ariich too. Actually I think they must have trimmed down a lot, there's much more that could've gone into it like the turning of Lord Nafaryus (WHY does he use NOMACS if he loved music?), a more in depth explanation of Daryus' comeuppance, more info with the NOMACS themselves...
Also agree with a lot of people about Whispers On The Wind. Pretty sure it could've been one track with Losing Faythe. Also would be a double meaning with Gabriel losing faith in himself.
As far as the NOMACS go, my 13-year-old son who likes TA a lot told me this morning : "The NOMACS don't really serve any purpose. It's a shame, I would have liked something more coming out of it". I completely agree with him.
For those who are more knowledgeable about guitar here, is there a similarity in the TGOM intro and The Answer intro or is it just the plucking pattern?
The Bridge: "you've got the future on your side, etc.." is one of my favorite parts on the album. I don't love the album though so take that for what its worth. Its a decent song.I like it..These are the first DT ballads I have actually liked since SFAM.
I still like The Answer Lies Within - even though I appear to be the only DT fan in existence that does.
I don't care what anyone says. DT still have it. After 30 years.
It really is amazing how much passion and ambition DT still have for the kind of band that they are and how long they've been active. What other band creates their grandest work 30 years into their discography and gets praised by critics for it?
I don't care what anyone says. DT still have it. After 30 years.
It really is amazing how much passion and ambition DT still have for the kind of band that they are and how long they've been active. What other band creates their grandest work 30 years into their discography and gets praised by critics for it?
Well, Rush did. 40 years in their career.
It's 100% definitely the best produced of the last 3.
It's 100% definitely the best produced of the last 3.
Not that that means much. The two before it were easily among DT's worst sounding albums. I really like the production on TA though. By far their best of the RR era.
Not that that means much. The two before it were easily among DT's worst sounding albums. I really like the production on TA though. By far their best of the RR era.
I would agree with all of this. :tupIt's 100% definitely the best produced of the last 3.
Not that that means much. The two before it were easily among DT's worst sounding albums. I really like the production on TA though. By far their best of the RR era.
Yes. if we're doing a really specific ranking : :lol
Production of the RoadRunner albums :
1. The Astonishing
2. Black Clouds & Silver Linings
3. Systematic Chaos
4. A Dramatic Turn of Events
5. DT12
Although I don't mind the sound of Dramatic Turn. It's just a bit demoey sounding and the drum mix is too quiet.
Well it's not that hard to top Octavarium.
PS. does anyone else feel like A Better Life could easily find a home on a Rocky soundtrack? That's a good thing ...
I'm not sure "under-developed" would be an accurate description since they spent the better part of 2 years writing and fleshing
out ideas. I'm totally cool with people not liking it but for the reasons people have mentioned not liking it, I am feeling the opposite.
I have felt that far too many DT songs went on 2-5 minutes longer than necessary and found myself skipping long endings.
So for me this album represents a DT that gets concise and focused and keeps me wanting more. I never feel like skipping sections
of songs and I am always anxious to spin the whole thing again.
I don't think I can fall in love with this album. The fantastic moments, and there are many, are frustratingly buried in stuff I'm not overly keen on and/or are under-developed. I can't count how many times while listening I hear a wonderful theme that I want to latch onto and ride for a while, only to have it end way too soon for my liking.I sort of understand you, though I agree with emtee that I'm not sure "under-developed" is really the right word. I really do feel that they did an excellent and very careful job with recurring themes, music fitting narrative, and so on.
For example, in The X Aspect, I wish the concept part from 2:34 to 3:34 was a 6 minute song ... instead of a 1 minute "snippet"!
That said, for me personally the themes that seem to recur the most - Brother Can You Hear Me, for example - are the ones I'm generally least excited about. Whereas my favourite themes/melodies have little or no recurrence, like the two different Evangeline bits, all that great stuff in Three Days, the climax in Ravenskill, pretty much everything in A Life Left Behind.
I actually think the production on DT12 is quite good, one of my fav DT albums.. The production TA is top notch though, very easy on the ears!It's 100% definitely the best produced of the last 3.
Not that that means much. The two before it were easily among DT's worst sounding albums. I really like the production on TA though. By far their best of the RR era.
That said, for me personally the themes that seem to recur the most - Brother Can You Hear Me, for example - are the ones I'm generally least excited about. Whereas my favourite themes/melodies have little or no recurrence, like the two different Evangeline bits, all that great stuff in Three Days, the climax in Ravenskill, pretty much everything in A Life Left Behind.
That said, for me personally the themes that seem to recur the most - Brother Can You Hear Me, for example - are the ones I'm generally least excited about. Whereas my favourite themes/melodies have little or no recurrence, like the two different Evangeline bits, all that great stuff in Three Days, the climax in Ravenskill, pretty much everything in A Life Left Behind.
BCYHM doesn't actually recur that often, it's just very identifiable whenever it comes up.
BCYHM doesn't actually recur that often, it's just very identifiable whenever it comes up.For sure it's not that often, but still more than any other I think.
Not sure what you mean by climax in Ravenskill - the heavy middle section or the ending - but both of those do recur more than once. Especially the latter is one of the most dynamic motifs of the whole thing.I especially mean the meeting between Faythe and Arhys - really fantastic stuff. The build up just before that is great too. I didn't think either of those recurred, but I haven't spotted everything yet.
So I've given this thing a few spins and my conclusion is that it's not really for me. There's no questioning the creativity and musicianship required to conceive and execute such an album; it's just that this isn't what I what DT to be applying all that talent towards.
I don't think I can fall in love with this album. The fantastic moments, and there are many, are frustratingly buried in stuff I'm not overly keen on and/or are under-developed. I can't count how many times while listening I hear a wonderful theme that I want to latch onto and ride for a while, only to have it end way too soon for my liking.
For example, in The X Aspect, I wish the concept part from 2:34 to 3:34 was a 6 minute song ... instead of a 1 minute "snippet"!
So I've given this thing a few spins and my conclusion is that it's not really for me. There's no questioning the creativity and musicianship required to conceive and execute such an album; it's just that this isn't what I what DT to be applying all that talent towards.
I don't think I can fall in love with this album. The fantastic moments, and there are many, are frustratingly buried in stuff I'm not overly keen on and/or are under-developed. I can't count how many times while listening I hear a wonderful theme that I want to latch onto and ride for a while, only to have it end way too soon for my liking.
For example, in The X Aspect, I wish the concept part from 2:34 to 3:34 was a 6 minute song ... instead of a 1 minute "snippet"!
I love the album, but I completely agree with the bolded part.
That said, for me personally the themes that seem to recur the most - Brother Can You Hear Me, for example - are the ones I'm generally least excited about. Whereas my favourite themes/melodies have little or no recurrence, like the two different Evangeline bits, all that great stuff in Three Days, the climax in Ravenskill, pretty much everything in A Life Left Behind.
I don't know what theme recurs how often, but I have the same feeling. The themes I don't like - Brother Can You Hear Me and Faythe's theme - I feel like they're all over the album. :lol And yeah, absolutely gorgeous Evangeline theme almost isn't featured at all.
For sure it's not that often, but still more than any other I think.
legit don't get why ravenskill is getting so much love, i find it one of the least interesting tracks on the first disc
Why do you guys keep saying that?I more or less see it as harmless fun. It's kind of a thing that me and Parama more or less never agree on anything, so I don't see anything wrong with making a little fun out it. :justjen
Parama has his own opinions and such, but you guys say that he is wrong. Why??
I have listened to it every day since release.
Why do you guys keep saying that?I more or less see it as harmless fun. It's kind of a thing that me and Parama more or less never agree on anything, so I don't see anything wrong with making a little fun out it. :justjen
Parama has his own opinions and such, but you guys say that he is wrong. Why??
Why do you guys keep saying that?
Parama has his own opinions and such, but you guys say that he is wrong. Why??
I mean, Black Clouds is my favorite Dream Theater album. For you guys it may be wrong, but for me, it isn't. What about people who dislike Ravenskill and thinks its uninteresting. Is that "wrong" or is that a "bad" opinion, simply because their tastes are different?
Why do you guys keep saying that?
Parama has his own opinions and such, but you guys say that he is wrong. Why??
I mean, Black Clouds is my favorite Dream Theater album. For you guys it may be wrong, but for me, it isn't. What about people who dislike Ravenskill and thinks its uninteresting. Is that "wrong" or is that a "bad" opinion, simply because their tastes are different?
don't worry, not all of us see music as having objective quality. there is no 'bad' or 'good'
:3So you listened to the album once in the last week. :lol Plus 2 songs again presumably. Which ones were they?
So far, there are several tracks I love, but the rest just blur together, and so far I don't really like Act II at all.
The high points on this album are way up there, and reminds of the type of writing they haven't done since SFAM/SDOIT, and are easily the best I've heard in the MM era, but there are too many misses for me at this point, and too many songs that felt like they started the same. Three Days is classic DT, and the kind of thing I've been itching to hear for a long time. Hits the spot goooood. I've already listened to it more than anything from ADTOE and DT12 combined.
Let's see how I feel after a few more listens though. :)
https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#comments
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
Amen brother! I have been waiting so long for DT to get to this point, they are just too talented not to. I sincerely hope they continue along these lines. If it's not metal enough for you, then there's plenty of other bands to bang your head to.
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."This makes me so happy.
https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#comments
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
Amen brother! I have been waiting so long for DT to get to this point, they are just too talented not to. I sincerely hope they continue along these lines. If it's not metal enough for you, then there's plenty of other bands to bang your head to.
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
And yeah, absolutely gorgeous Evangeline theme almost isn't featured at all.
https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#comments
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
Amen brother! I have been waiting so long for DT to get to this point, they are just too talented not to. I sincerely hope they continue along these lines. If it's not metal enough for you, then there's plenty of other bands to bang your head to.
This reminds me of the Slayer analogy. Also they have plenty of metal in older albums.
Where are all of the reasonable people in between the two ridiculous extremes?
Where are all of the reasonable people in between the two ridiculous extremes?
Not on the internet.
Where everything is either " OMFH AMAZOING WTFFF SO G~OOD "
or
" WORST ALBUM EVER MADE IN THE HISTORY OF MUSIC "
Why don't you guys go find a different bowl of cereal topissshit in? Spoil sports.
Where are all of the reasonable people in between the two ridiculous extremes?
Where are all of the reasonable people in between the two ridiculous extremes?
Which extremes would that be?
I thought the concept of extremes was self explanatory. Kotowboy got it.
I thought the concept of extremes was self explanatory. Kotowboy got it.
There's a decent amount of heavy parts on this album and JP is using his 7 string quite a bit.https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#comments
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
Amen brother! I have been waiting so long for DT to get to this point, they are just too talented not to. I sincerely hope they continue along these lines. If it's not metal enough for you, then there's plenty of other bands to bang your head to.
:tup :tup to JR's comment. He is basically saying in a nice way, "Upset there's not enough metal? Go cry about it somewhere else." And I totally agree with him. DT has 12 other studio albums, almost all of which have quite a bit of metal. If you want metal, go listen to those and stop crying that TA isn't something you want it to be, rather than what it is. /end rant :P
The fact that there is less heavy stuff on the album makes the heavy stuff that there is stand out more. So much better when it isn't overkill.
Been reading DT facebook page for the first time in weeks, i have to say that the level of criticism is pretty high, even for Dt standards.
Expected as it was for this kind of album, maybe more than the sold copies of the album, the success, or failure, of the tour will say us more about the future of the band.
The fact that there is less heavy stuff on the album makes the heavy stuff that there is stand out more. So much better when it isn't overkill.
The fact that there is less heavy stuff on the album makes the heavy stuff that there is stand out more. So much better when it isn't overkill.
Exactly and totally this! Said from a metalhead.
IT'S NOT TOO LATE
I WON'T BETRAY HIIIIM
*PUNKASS RIFF*
IT'S NOT TOO LATE
I WON'T BETRAY HIIIIM
*PUNKASS RIFF*
This reminds me, does anyone know what the choir says during this time?
All I could pick up was "Daryus. Arhys. ?????. Pray for your Life?"
https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#commentsDisappointing commentary right there by JR, but I'm unsurprised that it's coming from him.
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
Well, you are definitely reading more into what he said than, well, what he said.I agree about The Path, and I quoted that one as a standout on TA for me in an earlier post. I'd suggest that this track contains the elements of "metal" that DT gives us that we like, while remaining unquestionably DT.
I would also just like to report that The Path That Divides rocks my face.
Well, you are definitely reading more into what he said than, well, what he said.
I would also just like to report that The Path That Divides rocks my face.
I would also just like to report that The Path That Divides rocks my face.
https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#commentsDisappointing commentary right there by JR, but I'm unsurprised that it's coming from him.
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
I don't think any reasonable dissenter has suggested that this record isn't a great accomplishment, and one that they shouldn't be proud of. Nor do I think that any reasonable dissenter has suggested that the band compose "driving metal the whole time".
His comments make it seem like he's unable to filter away mindless criticisms of haters who seem to expect DT to be Slayer 2.0. Guess what? There's a component of DT fans who were and are attracted to the band's metal influences. That doesn't mean we expect balls-to-the-wall shredding for 80 minutes ...
In this one statement he basically gives us the one-finger salute, telling us that we should go elsewhere to fulfil that need because they've matured beyond our tastes. I guess there's no room left on the wagon for us anymore?
https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#commentsDisappointing commentary right there by JR, but I'm unsurprised that it's coming from him.
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
I don't think any reasonable dissenter has suggested that this record isn't a great accomplishment, and one that they shouldn't be proud of. Nor do I think that any reasonable dissenter has suggested that the band compose "driving metal the whole time".
His comments make it seem like he's unable to filter away mindless criticisms of haters who seem to expect DT to be Slayer 2.0. Guess what? There's a component of DT fans who were and are attracted to the band's metal influences. That doesn't mean we expect balls-to-the-wall shredding for 80 minutes ...
In this one statement he basically gives us the one-finger salute, telling us that we should go elsewhere to fulfil that need because they've matured beyond our tastes. I guess there's no room left on the wagon for us anymore?
A HELL LOTSounds like a Parking Lot where every time you find an empty space, a car gets there before you.
If you're not comfortable with change and progression, you can always check out Megadeth's Dystopia new album.
The album is definitely more soft than any other DT album, but there is still a shit ton of heavy metal in this. The music is beautiful and tasteful and is part of the story. What kind of story is all out balls to the wall metal? Most other concept albums and rock operas have a large "soft" side to them because it's part of the mood of telling the story.
or one where the best spot is always reserved by a cone.A HELL LOTSounds like a Parking Lot where every time you find an empty space, a car gets there before you.
.
The album is definitely more soft than any other DT album, but there is still a shit ton of heavy metal in this. The music is beautiful and tasteful and is part of the story. What kind of story is all out balls to the wall metal? Most other concept albums and rock operas have a large "soft" side to them because it's part of the mood of telling the story.
Isn't FII a bit softer? Sure, there's NM, PS, BMS, LitS and JLMB which are quite heavy, though more in a rock way than a metal way. TA has Three Days, A Tempting Offer, Moment of Betrayal, The Path That Divides and The Walking Shadow / My Last Farewell that are definitely driven by a metallic heaviness, among quite a few other songs like A Better Life, Lord Nafaryus, Ravenskill and A New Beginning which have prominent heavy sections. It might be pretty close, actually. I'm not really sure about it.
DT need to get more jazzy again.
Lines In The Sand is one of their top 3 songs for me.
He didn't give anyone the one-finger salute, you're just seeing what you want to see.Actually it's quite the contrary, I saw what I was afraid of seeing, not what I wanted to see.
His post was spot on, given that it was directly in response to people literally saying that The Astonishing is not metal enough, and many of them doing so in a very disrespectful way. If you cannot distinguish between those kinds of posts, on one hand, vs. those respectfully saying they are attracted to DT's more metal side, then the fact that you completely missed Jordan's point is on you rather than him.I'll concede guilt in that I didn't read the interview from which the quotation was extracted; I merely read it as posted in this thread and took it as if to say "we're shedding the metal side of DT as we mature, so tough luck if that's what you like".
The album is definitely more soft than any other DT album, but there is still a shit ton of heavy metal in this. The music is beautiful and tasteful and is part of the story. What kind of story is all out balls to the wall metal? Most other concept albums and rock operas have a large "soft" side to them because it's part of the mood of telling the story.This pretty much sums why I got into DT and remain so. It also expresses some of my feelings about this record.
This is coming from a metal fan, someone who got into DT because of the heaviness, but it is their melody that really keeps me into them. The melodies are awesome on this album, my biggest problem with the album is that some of the best melodies aren't repeated.
The album is definitely more soft than any other DT album, but there is still a shit ton of heavy metal in this. The music is beautiful and tasteful and is part of the story. What kind of story is all out balls to the wall metal? Most other concept albums and rock operas have a large "soft" side to them because it's part of the mood of telling the story.
Isn't FII a bit softer? Sure, there's NM, PS, BMS, LitS and JLMB which are quite heavy, though more in a rock way than a metal way. TA has Three Days, A Tempting Offer, Moment of Betrayal, The Path That Divides and The Walking Shadow / My Last Farewell that are definitely driven by a metallic heaviness, among quite a few other songs like A Better Life, Lord Nafaryus, Ravenskill and A New Beginning which have prominent heavy sections. It might be pretty close, actually. I'm not really sure about it.
Might be true. The thing is even a lot of the heavy songs have really soft parts and the album lengths are quite different so hard to compare.
As much as I appreciate James being able to go to town on the material, I still think a female singer would have enriched the album immensely. Especially for the weeping intro of Losing Faythe, where clearly a guy is trying to sound like a woman.I'm honestly a little surprised they didn't just use stock sound effects for that section.
https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#commentsDisappointing commentary right there by JR, but I'm unsurprised that it's coming from him.
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
I don't think any reasonable dissenter has suggested that this record isn't a great accomplishment, and one that they shouldn't be proud of. Nor do I think that any reasonable dissenter has suggested that the band compose "driving metal the whole time".
His comments make it seem like he's unable to filter away mindless criticisms of haters who seem to expect DT to be Slayer 2.0. Guess what? There's a component of DT fans who were and are attracted to the band's metal influences. That doesn't mean we expect balls-to-the-wall shredding for 80 minutes ...
In this one statement he basically gives us the one-finger salute, telling us that we should go elsewhere to fulfil that need because they've matured beyond our tastes. I guess there's no room left on the wagon for us anymore?
You may want to read a few posts above where I concluded my thoughts on JR's comment. The post you've quoted has been superseded by that one.https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#commentsDisappointing commentary right there by JR, but I'm unsurprised that it's coming from him.
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
I don't think any reasonable dissenter has suggested that this record isn't a great accomplishment, and one that they shouldn't be proud of. Nor do I think that any reasonable dissenter has suggested that the band compose "driving metal the whole time".
His comments make it seem like he's unable to filter away mindless criticisms of haters who seem to expect DT to be Slayer 2.0. Guess what? There's a component of DT fans who were and are attracted to the band's metal influences. That doesn't mean we expect balls-to-the-wall shredding for 80 minutes ...
In this one statement he basically gives us the one-finger salute, telling us that we should go elsewhere to fulfil that need because they've matured beyond our tastes. I guess there's no room left on the wagon for us anymore?
That's not what he's saying. You're completely misconstruing the meaning behind his words. He is completely within his right to say what he said, and it's well within reason. The members of the band don't owe us anything except the music THEY want to make. If this was a complete all out metal album, another group would be complaining about the sound. All Dream Theater can do is make music they're passionate about and either we're going to either like it or not. This disrespectful commentary coming from some people is uncalled for. It's one thing to not like it, but when it becomes insults and cheap shots, grow the fuck up.
You may want to read a few posts above where I concluded my thoughts on JR's comment. The post you've quoted has been superseded by that one.https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#commentsDisappointing commentary right there by JR, but I'm unsurprised that it's coming from him.
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
I don't think any reasonable dissenter has suggested that this record isn't a great accomplishment, and one that they shouldn't be proud of. Nor do I think that any reasonable dissenter has suggested that the band compose "driving metal the whole time".
His comments make it seem like he's unable to filter away mindless criticisms of haters who seem to expect DT to be Slayer 2.0. Guess what? There's a component of DT fans who were and are attracted to the band's metal influences. That doesn't mean we expect balls-to-the-wall shredding for 80 minutes ...
In this one statement he basically gives us the one-finger salute, telling us that we should go elsewhere to fulfil that need because they've matured beyond our tastes. I guess there's no room left on the wagon for us anymore?
That's not what he's saying. You're completely misconstruing the meaning behind his words. He is completely within his right to say what he said, and it's well within reason. The members of the band don't owe us anything except the music THEY want to make. If this was a complete all out metal album, another group would be complaining about the sound. All Dream Theater can do is make music they're passionate about and either we're going to either like it or not. This disrespectful commentary coming from some people is uncalled for. It's one thing to not like it, but when it becomes insults and cheap shots, grow the fuck up.
They can not possibly be stock. I mean, they're bad, really bad.
They should have invited Mike Portnoy for My Last Farewell
"Hear my last farewell!!"
"ROOOOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRHH!!"
My review of The Astonishing. In a nutshell...I draw comparisons to The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway
https://youtu.be/qH6C3gaIsjc
I have found The Astonishing to be a masterpiece, but still "exhausting" in a way. I have only been able to listen to it all the way through about 6 times. I just don't feel the desire to listen to it on repeat like so many other albums when they are new.
I think that the way to (hypothetically) improve The Astonishing is to actually add more music rather than remove songs.Agreed.
Remove Our New World ?
That's silly !
You're silly ! :angry: !
As much as I appreciate James being able to go to town on the material, I still think a female singer would have enriched the album immensely. Especially for the weeping intro of Losing Faythe, where clearly a guy is trying to sound like a woman.
https://www.metalwani.com/2016/02/interview-dream-theaters-jordan-rudess-on-the-astonishing.html#commentsDisappointing commentary right there by JR, but I'm unsurprised that it's coming from him.
Jordan: "I'm so proud of this...anybody who comes and says it's not metal enough, you know what? That's fine, you can go listen to some other band that has driving metal the whole time...I feel like this is the next level of Dream Theater where the band has matured to a point where we can just make music."
I don't think any reasonable dissenter has suggested that this record isn't a great accomplishment, and one that they shouldn't be proud of. Nor do I think that any reasonable dissenter has suggested that the band compose "driving metal the whole time".
His comments make it seem like he's unable to filter away mindless criticisms of haters who seem to expect DT to be Slayer 2.0. Guess what? There's a component of DT fans who were and are attracted to the band's metal influences. That doesn't mean we expect balls-to-the-wall shredding for 80 minutes ...
In this one statement he basically gives us the one-finger salute, telling us that we should go elsewhere to fulfil that need because they've matured beyond our tastes. I guess there's no room left on the wagon for us anymore?
That's not what he's saying. You're completely misconstruing the meaning behind his words. He is completely within his right to say what he said, and it's well within reason. The members of the band don't owe us anything except the music THEY want to make. If this was a complete all out metal album, another group would be complaining about the sound. All Dream Theater can do is make music they're passionate about and either we're going to either like it or not. This disrespectful commentary coming from some people is uncalled for. It's one thing to not like it, but when it becomes insults and cheap shots, grow the fuck up.
They've already confirmed that no additional musicians or singers will be with them, so James is gonna go Faythe on us!
They've already confirmed that no additional musicians or singers will be with them, so James is gonna go Faythe on us!
:lolThey've already confirmed that no additional musicians or singers will be with them, so James is gonna go Faythe on us!
OK but they could still pull a rabbit out of the hat for the NY DVD show! Teresa as Faythe, MP as Nafaryus, Kevin Moore as Xander!
Spun this again this morning while on a long road trip visiting customers. Don't get me wrong I really like the first part of Disc 1...Nailed my feelings exactly. Upon the first listen, I actually wasn't feeling disk 1 at all until A Lie Left Behind - then it was smooth sailing. Now, listening back, I've grown rather fond of the first half of disk 1, but the album doesn't reach its peak for me until A Lie Left Behind, and after it peaks, it stays at its peak.
really like it, but from the point of A Life Left Behind all the way through Disc 2 this is masterpiece level music.
:metalThey've already confirmed that no additional musicians or singers will be with them, so James is gonna go Faythe on us!
I heard he's going to don his makeup from the Winter Rose days.
Whoa! So they are filming the New York show, is this official???They've already confirmed that no additional musicians or singers will be with them, so James is gonna go Faythe on us!
OK but they could still pull a rabbit out of the hat for the NY DVD show! Teresa as Faythe, MP as Nafaryus, Kevin Moore as Xander!
No. There has been no such announcement. Not sure where that is coming from.Whoa! So they are filming the New York show, is this official???They've already confirmed that no additional musicians or singers will be with them, so James is gonna go Faythe on us!
OK but they could still pull a rabbit out of the hat for the NY DVD show! Teresa as Faythe, MP as Nafaryus, Kevin Moore as Xander!
No. There has been no such announcement. Not sure where that is coming from.Whoa! So they are filming the New York show, is this official???They've already confirmed that no additional musicians or singers will be with them, so James is gonna go Faythe on us!
OK but they could still pull a rabbit out of the hat for the NY DVD show! Teresa as Faythe, MP as Nafaryus, Kevin Moore as Xander!
NY was just a wild guess based on where they filmed the SMAF show. Sorry New Yorkers if I got you a little wound up!
https://www.instagram.com/p/BBtD_8wN93-gtt-Cbk6w3K4l-lQbCvwOJbpFkE0/
:) :)
And it took me ages to get it under my fingers :lol
I'm not the most elegant of guitarists.
However I do have a good ear and worked it out by ear alone. :)
The Our New World intro is too fast for me to play clean.
Don't know where or when but will be amazed if there is not a live DVD and if that DVD does not feature an orchestra, choir etc. I would maybe think that the London Palladium would be a cool venue for that if it had been later in the tour but no way they do they do all that on the opening night.Being that Dave Campbell is from California and the Orchestra tracks were recorded there, I wouldn't be surprised if they film the concert somewhere in California or up the west coast (just my theory). The Paramount Theater in Seattle is a beautiful venue and would be perfect for this. :tup
Any else get the feeling that Our New World was a JP solo album song?
They've already confirmed that no additional musicians or singers will be with them, so James is gonna go Faythe on us!
They've already confirmed that no additional musicians or singers will be with them, so James is gonna go Faythe on us!
Oh dear James with pink wig and hood
I really don't want to see that :lolpalm:
Any else get the feeling that Our New World was a JP solo album song?No.
Any else get the feeling that Our New World was a JP solo album song?No.
Any else get the feeling that Our New World was a JP solo album song?No.
Yeah, not at all.
Any else get the feeling that Our New World was a JP solo album song?No.
Am I the only that feels at 3:00 of Dystopian Overture = The Lion King?
I can picture Mufassa and Simba strutting out bobbing there heads to the music! :lol
:metal :lolAm I the only that feels at 3:00 of Dystopian Overture = The Lion King?
I can picture Mufassa and Simba strutting out bobbing there heads to the music! :lol
That's EXACTLY what I think of whenever I hear that part of the song :lol
They've already confirmed that no additional musicians or singers will be with them, so James is gonna go Faythe on us!
Oh dear James with pink wig and hood
I really don't want to see that :lolpalm:
Am I the only that feels at 3:00 of Dystopian Overture = The Lion King?
I can picture Mufassa and Simba strutting out bobbing there heads to the music! :lol
That's EXACTLY what I think of whenever I hear that part of the song :lol
What ONW adds to the story isn't immediately obvious just from listening, but it's Gabriel and Faythe promising to raise young Xander and build a better future, in memory of both his parents.
Another point I keep thinking of: The Road to Revolution, in concept, reminds me in some ways of the Tonight Quintet from West Side Story. Sudden scene changes with the different characters looking ahead in anticipation of the pivotal events to come later that night. Then at the end, everyone comes together (albeit still in their separate locations) to sing the closing lines.
Another point I keep thinking of: The Road to Revolution, in concept, reminds me in some ways of the Tonight Quintet from West Side Story. Sudden scene changes with the different characters looking ahead in anticipation of the pivotal events to come later that night. Then at the end, everyone comes together (albeit still in their separate locations) to sing the closing lines.
It really is a great way to close the first Act. There's definitely a feeling of anticipation and tension in TRTR.
As much as I appreciate James being able to go to town on the material, I still think a female singer would have enriched the album immensely. Especially for the weeping intro of Losing Faythe, where clearly a guy is trying to sound like a woman.
I am completely blown away by The Astonishing and i cannot stop listening to it. First time i listened to it i listened in its entirety and completely took it in and understood the story. I love DT my favorite band since 1992 but i am disappointed by the critical nature of many of DT's fans. I just cannot comprehend comparing any new DT release to that of previous albums kinda defeats the purpose of buying anything new by them. How and why could anyone want them to repeat anything they've ever done. Approaching the first time listening experience of a DT record expecting to hear something they've already done of course it won't measure up. Any new album has to be listened with fresh ears free from influence of any other record they have produced. The Astonishing is Amazing! No comparison needed. It stands alone and is the most Beautiful recording they have ever produced. I wept all through my first listening and i knew it was special. I have my headphones on right now listening as i type this and Act of Faythe is playing. This album begs to be listened with your special someone, your lover and i am singular on this night. What a great Valentines experience it would be to listen to this with your woman. I long to share this with a new love. If this post is as cheesey as some think The Astonishing is i am not ashamed. Amazingly beautiful record with moments of hard rocking technical complexity.Great post, and welcome to DT forums. I agree with everything you said!
Sooo...Apart from there being no music...Is there anything else about the story that is oppressive ?
Because just having no music would hardly be " a struggle to survive "...
And faythe is observing: "I never knew they spent their days in rags", implying that the people are very poor.This. It's pretty classic dystopian setting - rich, powerful leadership living in luxury while the rest toil away just to survive.
And faythe is observing: "I never knew they spent their days in rags", implying that the people are very poor.This. It's pretty classic dystopian setting - rich, powerful leadership living in luxury while the rest toil away just to survive.
And faythe is observing: "I never knew they spent their days in rags", implying that the people are very poor.This. It's pretty classic dystopian setting - rich, powerful leadership living in luxury while the rest toil away just to survive.
Incidentally just like the movie Metropolis, from 1927 (oh so close). METROPOLIS PART 3 CONFIRMED.
Overall I love the album. There are some highs and lows for sure. One of my highs is Savior in the Square... just frikken LOVE the whole....
Nafaryus:
"Please don't stop on my account,
Show us what we heard so much about?
Arhys:
In peace, we gather here today."
Daryus:
Don't make him ask again
Do as my father says!
Gabriel:
Brother, worry not, today
I will share my music, and they will soon be on their way
They only know the noise machines
So I'll treat them all to sonic ecstasy
:metal :metal :metal :metal :metal :metal
To me, when you can completely visualize a scene in your mind, the artist has succeeded :tup
Came here to post that this album has now taken over the #1 spot on my list of favorite Dream Theater albums. I think I'd even call this their Magnum Opus.
Brilliant writing, brilliant musicianship. Not a single moment across two entire discs that I don't want to hear every time I listen.
5 star album
Came here to post that this album has now taken over the #1 spot on my list of favorite Dream Theater albums. I think I'd even call this their Magnum Opus.
Brilliant writing, brilliant musicianship. Not a single moment across two entire discs that I don't want to hear every time I listen.
5 star album
Came here to post that this album has now taken over the #1 spot on my list of favorite Dream Theater albums. I think I'd even call this their Magnum Opus.
Brilliant writing, brilliant musicianship. Not a single moment across two entire discs that I don't want to hear every time I listen.
5 star album
Completely agree. I have been listening to TA solidly since it came out and I think I can now honestly say that this is without doubt my favourite Dream Theater album. Not only that but I now believe I will hold this album in the same regard as I hold Animals, Wish You Were Here, Selling England By The Pound and the like. I just finished listening to the title track, which I know some have said is a bit of an anti-climax, but it's just hit me really hard. What a stunning end to a classic album. So looking forward to Thursday at the Palladium.
What a stunning end to a classic album. So looking forward to Thursday at the Palladium.
Came here to post that this album has now taken over the #1 spot on my list of favorite Dream Theater albums. I think I'd even call this their Magnum Opus.
Brilliant writing, brilliant musicianship. Not a single moment across two entire discs that I don't want to hear every time I listen.
5 star album
Astonishing - the song - has trouble sticking in my memory. I listened to all of Act II one day and paid close attention to Astonishing.
It acts as kind of an overture to close the album. Except it has lyrics. I don't know how operas or musicals work having no interest in either of them -
- but do you have a piece at the end to "sum up" all the themes ?
That's kind of what it does.
Astonishing - the song - has trouble sticking in my memory. I listened to all of Act II one day and paid close attention to Astonishing.
It acts as kind of an overture to close the album. Except it has lyrics. I don't know how operas or musicals work having no interest in either of them -
- but do you have a piece at the end to "sum up" all the themes ?
That's kind of what it does.
:lol
Anyway, if I would do a studio album edit and not structure this as a stage production, I would leave out Road, the Entracte and The Astonishing. Those are the pieces that are purely a stage production choice.
:lol
Anyway, if I would do a studio album edit and not structure this as a stage production, I would leave out Road, the Entracte and The Astonishing. Those are the pieces that are purely a stage production choice.
Why Entr'acte 2285? I think the decision to have an overture for both discs can work outside of a stage production.
Overall I love the album. There are some highs and lows for sure. One of my highs is Savior in the Square... just frikken LOVE the whole....
Gabriel:
Brother, worry not, today
I will share my music, and they will soon be on their way
They only know the noise machines
So I'll treat them all to sonic ecstasy
Came here to post that this album has now taken over the #1 spot on my list of favorite Dream Theater albums. I think I'd even call this their Magnum Opus.
Brilliant writing, brilliant musicianship. Not a single moment across two entire discs that I don't want to hear every time I listen.
5 star album
Astonishing - the song - has trouble sticking in my memory. I listened to all of Act II one day and paid close attention to Astonishing.
It acts as kind of an overture to close the album. Except it has lyrics. I don't know how operas or musicals work having no interest in either of them -
- but do you have a piece at the end to "sum up" all the themes ?
That's kind of what it does.
Yes, it does reprise themes, but not just for the sake of it. It fits. As does every single element of this album. Everything that is there is where it's supposed to be, and I couldn't imagine it not being there.
Im missing Darius at the ending, should have snipped him in somehow
Anyone else waiting patiently for Nicky Spanjaards to cover a song off The Astonishing?
He would knock that one out of the park!Anyone else waiting patiently for Nicky Spanjaards to cover a song off The Astonishing?
:hefdaddy Dystopian Overture
Yes, I've been trying to rationalize what that sound is. A whip doesn't make sense, so I imagine Daryus punching Arhys in the face.I'm gonna go with punch, because that also kinda makes sense in a comic book onomatopoeia sort of way.
Anyone else waiting patiently for Nicky Spanjaards to cover a song off The Astonishing?
Anyone else waiting patiently for Nicky Spanjaards to cover a song off The Astonishing?
So, we've had this album for over 3 weeks now.
So, we've had this album for over 3 weeks now.
I think you mean 2 weeks, unless you're a time traveler, or I suck with dates. I'd say both are equally likely.
My 5-year-old son started singing along to "bow down to Nafaryus" while it was playing in the car.That is absolutely amazing.
My life is complete.
My 15 month old daughter headbangs to the start of Dystopian Overture with a massive grin on her face. Every time!
(https://stream1.gifsoup.com/view4/4289723/you-serious-clark-o.gif)Anyone else waiting patiently for Nicky Spanjaards to cover a song off The Astonishing?
Who?
Starlord.Anyone else waiting patiently for Nicky Spanjaards to cover a song off The Astonishing?
Who?
My 15 month old daughter headbangs to the start of Dystopian Overture with a massive grin on her face. Every time!
Can you please get this on video?!
Starlord, man. Legendary outlaw? Guys? (https://youtu.be/IAC7Ztu1Hao?t=41s)Starlord.Anyone else waiting patiently for Nicky Spanjaards to cover a song off The Astonishing?
Who?
This tour might do JLB's voice in for good. At least in the past there have been long instrumental breaks.
Starlord.Anyone else waiting patiently for Nicky Spanjaards to cover a song off The Astonishing?
Who?
This tour might do JLB's voice in for good. At least in the past there have been long instrumental breaks.
I'm not so sure, it's going to be just over a 2 hour show which is fairly standard for a lot of established bands and he has an intermission in the middle to recover which is unusual. There's also still quite a lot of non-singing parts apart from the two overtures and NOMAC tracks. Lots of orchestration and piano moments with no singing. Even something like Heavens Cove has a fairly lengthy instrumental intro. We'll soon see though, I'll be there on Thursday night.
I am waiting for the first live show fan reviews on Thursday. Have a great time!!This tour might do JLB's voice in for good. At least in the past there have been long instrumental breaks.
I'm not so sure, it's going to be just over a 2 hour show which is fairly standard for a lot of established bands and he has an intermission in the middle to recover which is unusual. There's also still quite a lot of non-singing parts apart from the two overtures and NOMAC tracks. Lots of orchestration and piano moments with no singing. Even something like Heavens Cove has a fairly lengthy instrumental intro. We'll soon see though, I'll be there on Thursday night.
This tour might do JLB's voice in for good. At least in the past there have been long instrumental breaks.
I'm not so sure, it's going to be just over a 2 hour show which is fairly standard for a lot of established bands and he has an intermission in the middle to recover which is unusual. There's also still quite a lot of non-singing parts apart from the two overtures and NOMAC tracks. Lots of orchestration and piano moments with no singing. Even something like Heavens Cove has a fairly lengthy instrumental intro. We'll soon see though, I'll be there on Thursday night.
Lots of the songs have instrumental intros well over a minute long (eg. ASITS, BCYMH, ALLB). That's plenty of time for JLB to run backstage and have a quick swig of whatever he swigs on during concerts.
My 5-year-old son started singing along to "bow down to Nafaryus" while it was playing in the car.
My life is complete.
(https://stream1.gifsoup.com/view4/4289723/you-serious-clark-o.gif)Anyone else waiting patiently for Nicky Spanjaards to cover a song off The Astonishing?
Who?
(https://stream1.gifsoup.com/view4/4289723/you-serious-clark-o.gif)Anyone else waiting patiently for Nicky Spanjaards to cover a song off The Astonishing?
Who?
Just googled him. I will ask again: who??
(https://i.imgur.com/nyPYeUe.jpg)
:o
So I'll treat them all to sonic ecstasy... BUM. BUM BUM. budududududuududud BUM. BUM BUM BUM.
absolutely love that moment
So I'll treat them all to sonic ecstasy... BUM. BUM BUM. budududududuududud BUM. BUM BUM BUM.
absolutely love that moment
I was thinking about this. I assume WYTHC is the song he sings publicly in front of Nafaryus? If so, it seems underwhelming to me. I think a different song should have been used to blow Nafaryus away. Maybe I'm misinterpreting the scene.
Yeah exactly. And it's a really nice song.So I'll treat them all to sonic ecstasy... BUM. BUM BUM. budududududuududud BUM. BUM BUM BUM.
absolutely love that moment
I was thinking about this. I assume WYTHC is the song he sings publicly in front of Nafaryus? If so, it seems underwhelming to me. I think a different song should have been used to blow Nafaryus away. Maybe I'm misinterpreting the scene.
I think the intention wasn't to 'blow him away' as such. WYTHC works as something to bring out the emotion in Nafaryus ('notably moved by Gabriels song') rather than to impress him.
(https://i.imgur.com/nyPYeUe.jpg)Mike Portnoy / Nafaryus was more striking.
:o
Besides, the people in the story haven't heard anything, except NOMAC stuff.
(Yeah Nafaryus had the iPod when he was a child, but maybe hasn't listened to the stuff that's in it since he was crowned, so the song might even bring back some memories to him from his childhood, moving him even more.)
(https://i.imgur.com/nyPYeUe.jpg)
:o
I second mikemangioy's point of view, the point is not When Your Time Has Come vs. today's music, the point is that people never heard any kind of music AT ALL, so the contrast and the emotion was overwhelming.
While I agree that that notion is portrayed in some parts of the story, I feel the lyrics of TGOM paint a different picture. "People just don't have the time for music any more.
And no one seems to care" is not something you say when people have never heard music. Similarly, it's hard to believe that the while population is unaware of the existence of music when the whole royal household has been growing up with music players and Gabriel randomly finds a functioning (!) guitar.
You're looking way too much into that.I second mikemangioy's point of view, the point is not When Your Time Has Come vs. today's music, the point is that people never heard any kind of music AT ALL, so the contrast and the emotion was overwhelming.
While I agree that that notion is portrayed in some parts of the story, I feel the lyrics of TGOM paint a different picture. "People just don't have the time for music any more.
And no one seems to care" is not something you say when people have never heard music. Similarly, it's hard to believe that the while population is unaware of the existence of music when the whole royal household has been growing up with music players and Gabriel randomly finds a functioning (!) guitar.
So I'll treat them all to sonic ecstasy... BUM. BUM BUM. budududududuududud BUM. BUM BUM BUM.
absolutely love that moment
I was thinking about this. I assume WYTHC is the song he sings publicly in front of Nafaryus? If so, it seems underwhelming to me. I think a different song should have been used to blow Nafaryus away. Maybe I'm misinterpreting the scene.
So I'll treat them all to sonic ecstasy... BUM. BUM BUM. budududududuududud BUM. BUM BUM BUM.
absolutely love that moment
I was thinking about this. I assume WYTHC is the song he sings publicly in front of Nafaryus? If so, it seems underwhelming to me. I think a different song should have been used to blow Nafaryus away. Maybe I'm misinterpreting the scene.
Well he could have just played Dance of Eternity if he wanted to impress him... that is if he could pull it off with a beaten up acoustic and his voice to imitate the beatbox cover guy :lol
My thoughts on the discussion here (and also about this plot hole issue) is that one shouldn't try to make sense out of certain things in the story, because there's no real, convincing explanation.
For instance, I can't understand how Gabriel (who never in his life listened to other music except from NOMACs') could come up just by himself with all these chords, chord progressions and melodies so similar to those found in Western pop music (from hundreds of years before he was born). I like to think that "When Your Time Has Come" is not the actual song he plays, but a musical dramatization of the scene*. Obviously, the lyrics are what he sings - but as far as the music, I like to think the "real" song is actually much different.
Or, maybe he had guitar lessons from someone who taught him all those chords and progressions from centuries ago, so the spirit (of pop music) carries on.
* I bet that's the whole point of an opera/musical, but I'm not familiar with the genre so maybe someone can explain?
So you're saying that the music we hear is not the greatest song in the world, just a tribute?
TENACIOUS D PT 2 CONFIRMED
I think they took creative liberties with the music on WYTHC, as in the 'real' version would've likely been just voice and guitar, with maybe the guitar being slightly out of tune with a duller tone than on the album. Also, things like the synth melody and drum pattern in the beginning add a lot and sound great.
So you're saying that the music we hear is not the greatest song in the world, just a tribute?:P
TENACIOUS D PT 2 CONFIRMED
Dress rehearsal!
Dress rehearsal!
Would the Dream Theater members dress their part? How many costume changes would James make? :p
Dress rehearsal!
Would the Dream Theater members dress their part? How many costume changes would James make? :p
I had posted a comment on dress change a while ago quoting a JLB tweet, but nobody remarked. Well, I'm eagerly waiting to see JLB dressed as Faythe, pink wig and all. :metal :rollin :rollin :rollin
B.Lee
Dress rehearsal!
Would the Dream Theater members dress their part? How many costume changes would James make? :p
Mike Mangini update, specifically addressed to those who would attend the live show:
"Our Dress rehearsal tonight is over. I don't want to post any kit pics etc or anything about this spectacle until after the first show. I also am interested in the reactions, more the feelings, of those there at the show and those there over time to really get a database of opinions to average out. I don't value YouTube reflections and thus comments because that medium has no bone-rattling feel while analog reality is just another animal. My phone clips don't come close to how it is in person. Odd thing how unrelated a cell phone view is to the real thing. Not even comparable.This show is another animal too because of the space in the music; the raw instrument sounds off of the stage; the impact of the really quiet parts vs. the huge entrances through a PA system that will shake the wooden chairs. I didn't realize while recording it how the opposing volumes, melodies and energy that make it what it is. DT does Space! I've already posted how hard it is to make the space not rush; to not succumb to the excuse of "feel" and have the intended timing and real intended feel suffer. I'll say that playing at home with a CD has nothing to do with what I felt today, but It is about the attendees starting tomorrow, not me. Have fun if you're joining us."
:metal
Dress rehearsal!
From what I have heard of Ghost (which, admittedly, is not much), I'm not sure I would classify them as "metal."I'm not a fan.
After 6 listens, I decided to make the 7th listen the complete journey. I already loved the hell out of this album, but after 130 minutes of subsequent, pure, musical bliss... i'm safe to say that The Astonishing has become my favourite album of Dream Theater. I'll say it to you all, TA is meant to be listened in its whole. You will get the complete experience and be blown away by a cyclone of melodies, riffs, vocals, drums, synths, violins, strings and more. Dream Theater has completely outdone themselves with this and I couldn't be any more happier. There is SO much great stuff going on, astonishing might indeed be my only definition. And the real MVP...of course it's none other than JLB. Easily his best performance since SFAM. Where the hell did he hide this voice all the time?!! I cannot choose the best vocal part, it's impossible. First I loved the chorus on Brother... , then Losing Faythe's "farewell" reprise by Nafaryus become by favourite vocal part, then the finale of Hymn of a Thousand Voices, then his high on ravenskill, and so forth. While there's a lot of melodic slow stuff, there's also a well-balanced heavier riffy portions on this album. So to make this short, everyone that already loves the crap out of this album but haven't listened it in one go, do it. It's probably demanding for a lot of people but I feel that this album has been created to listen it in its whole. Can't wait to see the guys performing The Astonishing in front of my eyes, upcoming Monday.
Peace out, DTF'ers!
From what I have heard of Ghost (which, admittedly, is not much), I'm not sure I would classify them as "metal."
From what I have heard of Ghost (which, admittedly, is not much), I'm not sure I would classify them as "metal."I'm not a fan.
But they LOOK awesome.
It would be very cool if each show everyone dressed as a character. One day they're all Xanders, next day they're all Faythes, and so on.
It would be very cool if each show everyone dressed as a character. One day they're all Xanders, next day they're all Faythes, and so on.
Can you just imagine JP with a Faythe look? Quick, someone has to do a photoshop of it!! :biggrin:
B.Lee
Where are the London reviews?
So you're saying that the music we hear is not the greatest song in the world, just a tribute?
TENACIOUS D PT 2 CONFIRMED
:lol I'd forgotten that one.So you're saying that the music we hear is not the greatest song in the world, just a tribute?
TENACIOUS D PT 2 CONFIRMED
Can't wait for Gabriel to write a song about cock pushups.
I actually wish DT went the Tenacious D Master Exploder route for Gabriel's deafening scream.
Then again, that scream as is now can actually be considered comedy.
A tiny nitpick: It would have been cool to have some of the dialogue passages shift back and forth between the left and right stereo channels, à la The Great Debate. I'm thinking particularly the fast section between Daryus and Arhys in The Path That Divides. Because they use the same vocal effect on JLB for both characters, it's hard to tell that it's two different characters speaking.
Jesus, whose idea was it to put white text over an image of clouds? :facepalm:
Well, my point was... when you hear Illumination Theory, for example, you listen the orchestral interlude, unless I'm forgetting something it is the first time - Six Degrees Overture aside - that there's only an orchestra in a DT song, so you can go "wow, they've put a completely orchestral interlude in this song". Hell, you can even be surprised at DT' first and never heard before attempt at "growl" vocals on A Nightmare To Remember.So?
With The Astonishing, it's not that I go "Listen to this song, it's so short! they've never done such a short song!" or "Listen to this song, it's so theatrical, James is acting, there's this weird atmosphere going on, this is unlilke anything they've ever done"... because I already know the album is anything unlike they've ever done. It's a rock opera that spans 2 CDs and has 34 songs. I expect all the weird stuff and song structures never used before, because *the entire album* is based on a different format.
So my point is that if you get a surprise in a normal DT song on a normal DT album, you can be truly amazed. When you get it on a 34 SONGS ROCK OPERA, you still can enjoy it but well, you already knew beforehand things would have been completely different.
So?
I still don't get your point. I knew it was going to be different, but I still know the band creating it, so I was still able to marvel at things I would have marveled at anyway.
(https://i.imgur.com/PFA795W.jpg)
For anyone that wants to read the credits.
(https://i.imgur.com/PFA795W.jpg)
For anyone that wants to read the credits.
...good luck with that. Yea, I don't see how that passed QA.
I'm surprised no one has commented on this yet: The beginning of the Palladium concert is up on YouTube! It's NOT a very good video. The camera wobbles around a lot, and the sound cuts out a LOT, including the ending being cut off, but it has an intro and for the most part it is the first three Astonishing tracks. At least it gives us some idea of what the show is and will be...Have you even read the Palladium thread? There are a ton of videos posted there (i.e., in the thread where they belong), including a couple of different ones of the opening songs.
Jesus, whose idea was it to put white text over an image of clouds? :facepalm:
Jesus, whose idea was it to put white text over an image of clouds? :facepalm:
Probably the same nimrod who decided to staple the booklet to the inside of the digipak (or whatever the hell it is called).
As great as the music is on this record, the packaging was epic fail. It was clearly done by someone who has never owned a CD, since no one who has, with a brain, would have done that.
So I saw some of the live show videos, and it confirmed what I was suspecting back then.This is why I wish they would release instrument stems for the entire album. I doubt they will, but man it'd be awesome. Then we could really hear all of Mangini's details as well as some of the choir lyrics that aren't printed.
The Astonishing studio record shortchanged Mangini because the cymbals were too low in the mix. Once you hear what the cymbals are really doing, then you would really get how well Mike composed his parts.
A brilliant album. I think Arhys is one of my favorite fictional characters of all time. His famil
Means so much to him, especially Xander and Gabriel. One of my favorite parts is in the title track when he speaks from beyond the grave telling Gabriel to show his son love and courage and to let him
Know that courage is boundless. Very powerful album, I love it ! :metal
I don't find it all that interesting, but I have to say that in the live show last night and the way they treated it as an encore, it was really great. Really worked perfectly in that way.A brilliant album. I think Arhys is one of my favorite fictional characters of all time. His famil
Means so much to him, especially Xander and Gabriel. One of my favorite parts is in the title track when he speaks from beyond the grave telling Gabriel to show his son love and courage and to let him
Know that courage is boundless. Very powerful album, I love it ! :metal
I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels this way...in spite of it not being the "big rock epic" I STILL feel that he closing track is one of the best parts of the story, and for me, at least, will be considered a DT classic.
That's why I prop it up against something
The booklet attached to the digi would be fine if it were just credits, but yea no one thought of having to HOLD THAT THING FOR 2 HOURS! >:(
(https://i.imgur.com/PFA795W.jpg)
For anyone that wants to read the credits.
...good luck with that. Yea, I don't see how that passed QA.
Has anyone drastically changed their opinion either negative or positive with multiple spins under the belt?
Has anyone drastically changed their opinion either negative or positive with multiple spins under the belt?
Has anyone drastically changed their opinion either negative or positive with multiple spins under the belt?
No, Loved it from 1st spin until present.
Just looking at the map in the tour book (much clearer double page spread so you can actually make out everything). Doesn't it seem like a missed chance and, ultimately, pointless? There seems to be so many places spread out and really, the Palace and Ravenskill are not that far away.
Plus some of the names sound intriguing. Hell's Gateway? Lake of the Clouds? Sunken Hook?
Something that I haven't seen mentioned yet:
In the credits (if you look closely) it says "Nafaryus spoken vocal by Richard Chycki". Apart from lines in Lord Nafaryus and Three Days which I'm 99% certain are spoken pompously by JLB, there are no other spoken passages. Unless it refers to the crying section at the beginning of Losing Faythe. In which case, they could easily have got a woman from the choir to do Arabelle's crying, and Faythe's getting-stabbed sounds (which sound like an actual girl rather than JLB).
Something that I haven't seen mentioned yet:I think this has come up before, and folks have floated the theory that it's a misprint -- it's meant to be Arhys, and it's the spoken lines at the beginning of "A Better Life."
In the credits (if you look closely) it says "Nafaryus spoken vocal by Richard Chycki". Apart from lines in Lord Nafaryus and Three Days which I'm 99% certain are spoken pompously by JLB, there are no other spoken passages. Unless it refers to the crying section at the beginning of Losing Faythe. In which case, they could easily have got a woman from the choir to do Arabelle's crying, and Faythe's getting-stabbed sounds (which sound like an actual girl rather than JLB).
2. Songs on future albums or EPs telling the events leading up to TA. (would be cool, like a new 12 step suite sort of thing)I was thinking this very thing. Given the sheer amount of work that recording this album entailed, I would imagine that a full prequel or sequel album is doubtful.
Darren Redick said last night on his One Man and his Prog show that we shouldn't worry if we didn't get to London this week, as the band WILL be returning to the UK with the Astonishing tour. No further details were given, just that he "thinks he's allowed to say this now"....
Same here.Darren Redick said last night on his One Man and his Prog show that we shouldn't worry if we didn't get to London this week, as the band WILL be returning to the UK with the Astonishing tour. No further details were given, just that he "thinks he's allowed to say this now"....
I hope the do another US leg as I am likely missing this one.
Darren Redick said last night on his One Man and his Prog show that we shouldn't worry if we didn't get to London this week, as the band WILL be returning to the UK with the Astonishing tour. No further details were given, just that he "thinks he's allowed to say this now"....
Has anyone drastically changed their opinion either negative or positive with multiple spins under the belt?
seriously, how great is Dystopian Overture?
seriously, how great is Dystopian Overture?
seriously, how great is Dystopian Overture?Easily in my top 3 DT instrumentals.
Dance of Eternity can suck a dick imo
Dance of Eternity can suck a dick imoAs long as it's my dick, and I get to listen to it at the same time, I really don't care.
Dance of Eternity can suck a dick imo
seriously, how great is Dystopian Overture?
Dance of Eternity can suck a dick imo
It seemed to me that they did it that way for the CD split on SFNY.
Dance of Eternity can suck a dick imoI wouldn't go that far, but I am quite sick of it myself.
Darren Redick said last night on his One Man and his Prog show that we shouldn't worry if we didn't get to London this week, as the band WILL be returning to the UK with the Astonishing tour. No further details were given, just that he "thinks he's allowed to say this now"....
I think this has come up before, and folks have floated the theory that it's a misprint -- it's meant to be Arhys, and it's the spoken lines at the beginning of "A Better Life."
Hi everyone!
This is my first post here :-)
Here's my solo cover video from the new album The Astonishing, check it out!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvuiVKc2A6A
Has anyone drastically changed their opinion either negative or positive with multiple spins under the belt?
Has anyone drastically changed their opinion either negative or positive with multiple spins under the belt?
Has anyone drastically changed their opinion either negative or positive with multiple spins under the belt?
Yes. While the first few spins left me a bit underwhelmed, I'm now finding it to be an amazing album. The lyrics are still a bit mediocre at certain points, but the orchestration is brilliant.
Has anyone drastically changed their opinion either negative or positive with multiple spins under the belt?
Yes. While the first few spins left me a bit underwhelmed, I'm now finding it to be an amazing album. The lyrics are still a bit mediocre at certain points, but the orchestration is brilliant.
Essentially this. The more listens, the more I enjoy it. Although I think I might have reached my point of where I totally get it and am no longer enjoying it more on each listen, but it certainly took awhile to get here.
seriously, how great is Dystopian Overture?
Yeah, it's pretty top notch.seriously, how great is Dystopian Overture?
It's fucking glorious.
I'm curious what the beginning of Heaven's Cove is, story wise. Is it just outdoor atmosphere noises?
Yeah, it's pretty top notch.seriously, how great is Dystopian Overture?
It's fucking glorious.
On the topic of "Heaven's Cove": any of you could explain why "Begin Again" comes in between "Heaven's Cove" and "The Path That Divides"? Because it doesn't make sense to me: according to the booklet, "Begin Again" takes place over the day, at the Emperor's Palace, but "Cove" and "Path" are at night in the amphitheater. Any theories?I swapped them in my playlist because I currently listen A LOT to heaven's cove + the path that divides + walking shadow + my last farewell, but I don't skip begin again because of the christmas theme that I like :)
I saw them perform the song live two days ago. Wow, very very good. A little bit slower than the album version but spot on.Yeah, it's pretty top notch.seriously, how great is Dystopian Overture?
It's fucking glorious.
I saw them perform the song live two days ago. Wow, very very good. A little bit slower than the album version but spot on.
I imagine the show would last over 130 actual minutes since they'd have pauses between songs i'd imagine ?It is longer, yeah. Firstly for pauses between songs, secondly for the slightly extended ending for AND, and also for the introduction before Descent, which lasts a couple of minutes.
Spoke to JP after last night gig in Amsterdam and he told me a somewhat dramatic story about the recordings. They intended to have the Nomacs parts shorter than they turned out to be. So after mastering he received a call where he was told that Act 1 wouldn't fit on one disc. Since everything with regards to artwork and tracklists were already published they had to make a hard decision to cut the guitar solo of New Beginning. That's why it fades out. Originally the solo lasted 3 to 4 minutes longer!
But.......during the live shows you will witness the full guitarsolo how it was intented to be. Hands down one of the most beautiful solos ever.
Thoughtt you might like this info.
Spoke to JP after last night gig in Amsterdam and he told me a somewhat dramatic story about the recordings. They intended to have the Nomacs parts shorter than they turned out to be. So after mastering he received a call where he was told that Act 1 wouldn't fit on one disc. Since everything with regards to artwork and tracklists were already published they had to make a hard decision to cut the guitar solo of New Beginning. That's why it fades out. Originally the solo lasted 3 to 4 minutes longer!
But.......during the live shows you will witness the full guitarsolo how it was intented to be. Hands down one of the most beautiful solos ever.
Thoughtt you might like this info.
Spoke to JP after last night gig in Amsterdam and he told me a somewhat dramatic story about the recordings. They intended to have the Nomacs parts shorter than they turned out to be.
He probably meant longer.
Spoke to JP after last night gig in Amsterdam and he told me a somewhat dramatic story about the recordings. They intended to have the Nomacs parts shorter than they turned out to be.
Cool little nugget. When you say they intended to have the nomacs parts shorter, does that mean they extended them on purpose? Not sure I understand that bit. :huh:
Even if the tracklist wasn't already published, I guess the format of the story would have doomed them anyway... it would have made no sense to have The Road to Revolution as opener of the second disc for example.
Didn't Metalica have to cut out the last minute of Load for example? the live version of A New Beginning will go down as the "uncut" version hehe!
I took it the opposite of how you did. I understood him to mean that they were originally planned to be shorter such that everything intended to be on disk 1 would have fit. But once all the sounds were mixed and finalized, those NOMAC tracks ended up being a bit longer than he thought they would have been, which messed everything up.
If that is the case, yeah, they could theoretically have re-recorded the NOMAC tracks. But if it was very late in the production process, even doing that could have caused a chain reaction in the process that could have ended up bumping the release date, which they did not want to do given the shows planned. It was probably much easier to take an existing song that is already mixed and mastered and fade out the ending.
Spoke to JP after last night gig in Amsterdam and he told me a somewhat dramatic story about the recordings. They intended to have the Nomacs parts shorter than they turned out to be. So after mastering he received a call where he was told that Act 1 wouldn't fit on one disc. Since everything with regards to artwork and tracklists were already published they had to make a hard decision to cut the guitar solo of New Beginning. That's why it fades out. Originally the solo lasted 3 to 4 minutes longer!I actually thought that might be the case, given the length of the disc and the fact that this never-ending outro was the only fadeout.
But.......during the live shows you will witness the full guitarsolo how it was intented to be. Hands down one of the most beautiful solos ever.
Thoughtt you might like this info.
Mangini's latest FB post:
.... I can tell the acoustics and smallest details of the drums are being heard given the design of the venues....
I'm not sure it was a third party. I think it was all Jordan. But those NOMAC sounds consist of several different tracks of Jordan playing a bunch of different sounds. I imagine it wasn't really clear exactly how long they would be until whoever was in charge of mixing them mixed all the various tracks together to produce the final version of each of those.
Though this is definitely a “Dream Theater album,” it called upon us to go even deeper and broader than we normally do. It’s . . . fusion of sorts. In one sense it’s “prog,” but it goes beyond any combination of elements we’ve ever done. Some of that fell to me. I had to go into my electronica world to create the sound of the Noise Machine creatures, which enforce for the bad guys.
Yup it was great live! They also got a big standing ovation in Amsterdam afterwards. Lasted a couple of minutes actually.Spoke to JP after last night gig in Amsterdam and he told me a somewhat dramatic story about the recordings. They intended to have the Nomacs parts shorter than they turned out to be. So after mastering he received a call where he was told that Act 1 wouldn't fit on one disc. Since everything with regards to artwork and tracklists were already published they had to make a hard decision to cut the guitar solo of New Beginning. That's why it fades out. Originally the solo lasted 3 to 4 minutes longer!
But.......during the live shows you will witness the full guitarsolo how it was intented to be. Hands down one of the most beautiful solos ever.
Thoughtt you might like this info.
Nice! Thanks for sharing. It was great live, on Friday it got a big standing ovation.
I thought it was pretty common knowledge from before the album came out that Jordan was responsible for creating the NOMAC tracks.I'm not sure it was a third party. I think it was all Jordan. But those NOMAC sounds consist of several different tracks of Jordan playing a bunch of different sounds. I imagine it wasn't really clear exactly how long they would be until whoever was in charge of mixing them mixed all the various tracks together to produce the final version of each of those.
Looks like you were right about Jordan creating the NOMAC sounds. From this article, which is a good read: https://www.keyboardmag.com/artists/1236/astonishing-the-many-facets-of-jordan-rudess/56682QuoteThough this is definitely a “Dream Theater album,” it called upon us to go even deeper and broader than we normally do. It’s . . . fusion of sorts. In one sense it’s “prog,” but it goes beyond any combination of elements we’ve ever done. Some of that fell to me. I had to go into my electronica world to create the sound of the Noise Machine creatures, which enforce for the bad guys.
Spoke to JP after last night gig in Amsterdam and he told me a somewhat dramatic story about the recordings. They intended to have the Nomacs parts shorter than they turned out to be. So after mastering he received a call where he was told that Act 1 wouldn't fit on one disc. Since everything with regards to artwork and tracklists were already published they had to make a hard decision to cut the guitar solo of New Beginning. That's why it fades out. Originally the solo lasted 3 to 4 minutes longer!
But.......during the live shows you will witness the full guitarsolo how it was intented to be. Hands down one of the most beautiful solos ever.
Thoughtt you might like this info.
Spoke to JP after last night gig in Amsterdam and he told me a somewhat dramatic story about the recordings. They intended to have the Nomacs parts shorter than they turned out to be. So after mastering he received a call where he was told that Act 1 wouldn't fit on one disc. Since everything with regards to artwork and tracklists were already published they had to make a hard decision to cut the guitar solo of New Beginning. That's why it fades out. Originally the solo lasted 3 to 4 minutes longer!I actually thought that might be the case, given the length of the disc and the fact that this never-ending outro was the only fadeout.
But.......during the live shows you will witness the full guitarsolo how it was intented to be. Hands down one of the most beautiful solos ever.
Thoughtt you might like this info.
I've always felt that A New beginning fades out because they needed to fit the entire act one on the disc. It's still a masterpiece of a solo, though, I can only imagine what it would be like if it were longer.
Mangini's latest FB post:
.... I can tell the acoustics and smallest details of the drums are being heard given the design of the venues....
That's probably true for the European venues, but the Orpheum in Boston will not be that. It's an old theater venue that was run down by decades of drunken metal fans, with the stucco falling off, and the PA booming the place to a pulp. Now, the Boston Opera House that BTFW was filmed in, that was a nice venue.
10 minute mark? That doesn't sound right at all. At the London show, they only went on maybe another 30 seconds.I've always felt that A New beginning fades out because they needed to fit the entire act one on the disc. It's still a masterpiece of a solo, though, I can only imagine what it would be like if it were longer.
Your assumption is correct. The solo/instrumental section was supposed to go past the 10 minute mark, and I heard they're doing the full version on tour.
Spoke to JP after last night gig in Amsterdam and he told me a somewhat dramatic story about the recordings. They intended to have the Nomacs parts shorter than they turned out to be. So after mastering he received a call where he was told that Act 1 wouldn't fit on one disc. Since everything with regards to artwork and tracklists were already published they had to make a hard decision to cut the guitar solo of New Beginning. That's why it fades out. Originally the solo lasted 3 to 4 minutes longer!
But.......during the live shows you will witness the full guitarsolo how it was intented to be. Hands down one of the most beautiful solos ever.
Thoughtt you might like this info.
By "real" I assume you mean the version they recorded in the studio originally, correct? I think the odds are slim to none. They aren't planning on releasing singles from this album, so there is no shot at it being released that way (and it is long for a single anyway). I can't see them releasing it in any other format.
I just find it such a shame. It really is one of my favoriets solo of JP, and to think it supposed to last for 3 more mins makes me want to hear it so bad.As I said above, 3 minutes doesn't sound right. keys76 said we're getting to hear the full thing like, and it only went on about 30 seconds more.
I just find it such a shame. It really is one of my favoriets solo of JP, and to think it supposed to last for 3 more mins makes me want to hear it so bad.As I said above, 3 minutes doesn't sound right. keys76 said we're getting to hear the full thing like, and it only went on about 30 seconds more.
Mangini's latest FB post:
.... I can tell the acoustics and smallest details of the drums are being heard given the design of the venues....
That's probably true for the European venues, but the Orpheum in Boston will not be that. It's an old theater venue that was run down by decades of drunken metal fans, with the stucco falling off, and the PA booming the place to a pulp. Now, the Boston Opera House that BTFW was filmed in, that was a nice venue.
It's still better than the Palladium in Worcester, Mass. I can only assume that is what hell is like.
Did JP really say that the ANB solo is supposed to be 3-4 minutes longer? Or did he mean that it was supposed to be 3-4 minutes long in total, not the 2min + solo that we got in the studio version?This seems more realistic.
What is there left to sort out? The solo fades out a bit before the end because they ran out of space on the album. JP is playing pretty much the full solo at the shows. What is the issue?
Act 1 is near-enough 80 minutes (my player displays 79:59), and the NOMAC tracks on that disc totals 2:14, so that's the longest possible extra time for the solo to be extended if the NOMAC tracks were removed.
It fades out before the end. Of course there is a longer version.This. There is no revelation here.
Act 1 is near-enough 80 minutes (my player displays 79:59), and the NOMAC tracks on that disc totals 2:14, so that's the longest possible extra time for the solo to be extended if the NOMAC tracks were removed.
Act 1 is near-enough 80 minutes (my player displays 79:59), and the NOMAC tracks on that disc totals 2:14, so that's the longest possible extra time for the solo to be extended if the NOMAC tracks were removed.
My stereo displays 80:01, which doesn't make much sense to me. I'm now thinking that all of this time the stereo has added 2 extra seconds to the original lengths of my CDs. I was wrong all this time! :P
What does your player display for Act 2? I get 50:41.
Importing songs into certain programs can lead to an extra second being add here or there.Act 1 is near-enough 80 minutes (my player displays 79:59), and the NOMAC tracks on that disc totals 2:14, so that's the longest possible extra time for the solo to be extended if the NOMAC tracks were removed.
My stereo displays 80:01, which doesn't make much sense to me. I'm now thinking that all of this time the stereo has added 2 extra seconds to the original lengths of my CDs. I was wrong all this time! :P
What does your player display for Act 2? I get 50:41.
Mine says 80:01 as well. Adding 2 seconds to the total time might be the case on many systems.
My CD player says 80:01 also.
Mine says 79:59 for Act 1 and 50:39 for Act 2
Mine says 80:01 as well. Adding 2 seconds to the total time might be the case on many systems.
My foobar says that my HDTracks version of TA Disc 1 is 1 hour 19 minutes and 58.966 secondsThat's.....oddly specific.
Act 1 is near-enough 80 minutes (my player displays 79:59), and the NOMAC tracks on that disc totals 2:14, so that's the longest possible extra time for the solo to be extended if the NOMAC tracks were removed.
My stereo displays 80:01, which doesn't make much sense to me. I'm now thinking that all of this time the stereo has added 2 extra seconds to the original lengths of my CDs. I was wrong all this time! :P
What does your player display for Act 2? I get 50:41.
Been a fan since Images… watched the band evolve, stretch their minds and challenge their musical prowess. They have never shied away from trying new things, venturing into uncharted territory. Each new album unveiled some new talent/ability/idea. I'm also an un-apologetic fan of SciFi and speculative fiction--hell, DT actually influenced a few of my novels and short stories. The Great Debate inspired me to pen my stem cell tech thriller: Rubicon Harvest [url]https://cwkesting.com/Home_Page.html/url]!!! I grew up with the classic "rock opera" masterpieces: Rush's 2112, Hemisphere's, etc... Pink Floyd's The Wall. Queensryche's Operation:Mindcrime. Even DT's own Metropolis and SDOIT. These are enduring effective classics. They shake up your psyche and affect you viscerally. They are so good that any individual chapter in any particular story can stand alone as a seminal piece. But then there are the many other failing attempts at elaborate "concept musical theatrics". Saga's Generation 13 comes to mind.
So I was excited and intrigued about TA. Especially from my favorite artists.
That being said, I really wanted--perhaps expected--to enjoy this new project. And that's what Astonishing feels like, a project. A LONG project that sat on JP's creative shelf for far too long and while perhaps it needed air, should've been edited a bit more before being rolled out . So here's my two cents:
In a phrase, DT "jumped the shark" with this one. It's a sluggish slog through an adolescent fantasy world that doesn't deliver on it's promise. Clearly JP wanted to make this for awhile and the rest of the guys acquiesced. That's what lifelong friends and professionals do. So they let JP entertain this teenage muse of his that has been gnawing away at the creative folds of his brain ever since he listened to 2112 for the first time--(For clearly, that is what TA aspires toward). The problem is that the story itself never gets there, in my opinion. The difference here is that Neil Peart understood Ayn Rand and her brilliant story, Anthem, so well, that he was able to condense the philosophy into lyrical perfection. In the case of TA, we don't actually see anything new (or exciting or thought provoking) happening here other than it's happening in some make-believe World of Warcraft realm. The plot is loose, convoluted and eventually (after two hours) contracts a serious case of deus ex machina . It reads like Shakespeare trying his hand at a Spanish soap opera, unfortunately. I won't take up too much space here dissecting the characters, other than to start with their ridiculous names (Nafaryus, really?) and end with their weak motivations. There's also a HUGE void in the concept: From start to finish I kept asking WHY? Why does this dystopian society reject music? And how does that give Nafaryus control over the people? What exactly is Gabriel's musical "power" (gift, talent, whatever)--we're led to believe it's his "song". Is this metaphorical or literal; and how do either give him actual power? How in the hell do all the people suddenly and inexplicably unify their voices--and again why? So what? What new world are they pining for and why is the current world so bad. We never see the oppression of Nafaryus's reign. It's simply assumed that he is bad ('cuz he's.. you know Nafaryus). And the NOMACS? What are they, why are they and who cares? Yet, they're the de facto "face of the album".
I think JP was hoping we'd all get the same shivers we got when Jon discovered the relic guitar in 2112 and took it to the Priests in the Temple of Sirynx. But Rush accomplished this magic in a fraction of the time and space that JP did. Don't get me wrong--I love JP and in my opinion he is one of--if not THE--best guitarists around. But as a lyricists (or even conceptualist) he is lacking. I think, overall, DT has lost a step (or ten) in their "lyrical composition" since parting ways with MP. Granted, we were all pretty tired of the alcoholic diatribes and aggressive pomposity that MP saturated us with (BTW, I am an alcoholic and appreciate his efforts the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd times. It got preachy-old after that). But, overall TA is a weak attempt at telling a worn-out tale while dressed as a MMORPG.
As for the musicality, well…. it's also less than impressive. And that probably bums me out the most. I could always count on the guys blowing me away with their individual craftsmanship--even if the lyrics didn't ring my bell. But with TA… I see none of the sweeping melodies that transition to amazing solo sections. I see none of the showcase bridges anywhere within this epic movie score. No memorable guitar riffs, no heart thumping bass wakeup calls, no staccato drum segue's. Just a lot of James crooning and Jordan's nimble fingers. Oh, there are little tastes: brief wiffs of something developing on the periphery of all the costume pomp and melodrama. But aside from the NOMACS creepy cool mechanizations… there's nothing that gives me that classic DT shot-in-the arm. I always try to get my 15 year old son to appreciate DT and he has grown to enjoy the classics. We have moments when we both are like: "Now THAT"S why JP is one of the best guitarist! Just listen to Myung's bas riff here--the speed and dexterity!! Have you ever heard drumming that precise?!" There was none of that for me anywhere in TA. And that, more than the cheesy plot material, disappoints the greatest.
I hope they get this silliness out of their system, have a great tour, and get back to composing music with substance and style. They already nailed the rock opera genre with Metropolis; scored symphonically with SDOIT and An Evening with… In my humble opinion, The Astonishing didn't need to be made other than to get it out of JP's head and clear the way for better stuff.
Just one old fan's opinion.
Thanks and sorry for the long post. I don't post much (if ever) but this album bugged me enough...
The album doesn't try to be 2112 Pt. 2. It is more like a Romeo-and-Juliet-like story in a dystopian setting. I think some people may be setting themselves up to disappointment with their expectations.
sing-through musical set in a MMORPG ... It's like Les Miserables meets Camelot with wacky robot orbs flitting about ... musical pre-teen comic book love story.I'd be interested in what other albums fit these descriptions. :P
The Walking Shadow is so fucking cool
The album doesn't try to be 2112 Pt. 2. It is more like a Romeo-and-Juliet-like story in a dystopian setting. I think some people may be setting themselves up to disappointment with their expectations.
Perhaps. But then doesn't that beg this question: With over 20 years of progressive music created by a group who--most in this forum community would agree-- is the best assemblage of musicians in their craft; whom never felt the need to bend to trend or latch on to whatever meme-d'jour was floating through the ether; why would they chose now to slip from their maverick progressive philosophy and simply mash up a bunch of tired genres in an attempt to re-heat some left-over themes?
So yes… As fans, we are allowed expect more and we are entitled to be disappointed when we have purchased this garden variety version of a sing-through musical set in a MMORPG. It's like Les Miserables meets Camelot with wacky robot orbs flitting about just remind us that the setting is meant to be science-fiction-y. This double disk indulgence is nothing more than a musical pre-teen comic book love story.
I think (hope) that they're better than this album. It is my opinion that this entire effort is beneath them and ultimately very disappointing. This concept has been worn gossamer thin (by Hollywood and print alike!!), the characters lame and the plot derivative--if not predictable. It's not like Dream Theater never tried their hand at a full-storied concept before. While not the best "theatrical story album"Scenes from a Memory is incredible compared to Astonishing. If they wanted to go "Rock Opera", then go for it; but do it with originality and style: CREATE an entirely new World (if that's what you want) but make it special. Unique. Filled with wonderful leads that have dynamic motivations and proper emotional investment. People (or beings) that we actually care about…can relate to. Was anyone really surprised that Brother killed brother? Did anyone really care? Anyone floored by the father versus independent daughter chemistry? And Xander? Why is he even here? Again, who cares? YAWN….
Give us a backstory--some historical perspective as to why the world is the way it is. How it became that way and why folks in it want something different. Why was there a resistance and what was it, exactly, the folks of Ravenskill were resisting in the first place?
Like I said, They really jumped the shark!!!
I'm hopeful they get this out of their system and move forward--PROGRESSIVE--in their next endeavor. These talented guys are capable of far better.
Yes the concept and lyrics could be better but if I want a good story I go to a movie or a book. If I want good music however I go to TA... best album in a long while.
That is a very peculiar argument to make for an album whose story is the main focus. Saying "if I want a good story, I'll read a book" for a rock opera/musical, IMHO relegates the key aspect of this whole thing.
That is a very peculiar argument to make for an album whose story is the main focus. Saying "if I want a good story, I'll read a book" for a rock opera/musical, IMHO relegates the key aspect of this whole thing.
That is a very peculiar argument to make for an album whose story is the main focus. Saying "if I want a good story, I'll read a book" for a rock opera/musical, IMHO relegates the key aspect of this whole thing.
That is a very peculiar argument to make for an album whose story is the main focus. Saying "if I want a good story, I'll read a book" for a rock opera/musical, IMHO relegates the key aspect of this whole thing.
I would disagree that the story is necessarily the main focus. The story is important, sure, but how it interacts with the music is even more important. What matters to me, personally, is the entire experience. So, as an example, I have read a lot of criticisms over how happy the end of the album is. To me though, the plausibility of the situation isn't the point. What makes it a great ending isn't the storytelling of it all, but rather that when LaBrie sings, "Our lives will be astonishing again!", the music makes me believe him.
It's got family drama, betrayal, social inequality, love stuff, flying robots
It's got family drama, betrayal, social inequality, love stuff, flying robots
This seems a pitch for an Hollywood blockbuster movie ;D
I wonder if JP has a lot more story to be told. Like, the album is the basics of the story, it does its job of portraying the plot and significant ideas. Yet, he has more of the story he wants to release in another form that an album just can't portray.
Take the game being released, that'll likely explore more of the map areas. Give you more of a glimpse into the GNE.
It's the first in a series of 9 double albums to come.
it's the new Star Wars.
It'll be a film trilogy , prequel trilogy and sequel trilogy
And Netflix series.
Prequel:
Bug's Adventures.
I wonder if JP has a lot more story to be told. Like, the album is the basics of the story, it does its job of portraying the plot and significant ideas. Yet, he has more of the story he wants to release in another form that an album just can't portray.
Take the game being released, that'll likely explore more of the map areas. Give you more of a glimpse into the GNE.
He did mention having more of the story that he would perhaps release in a novelization. This was the quote from the AMA that he did.
"They are an artificial intelligence of sorts who automate a soulless cacophony. On the album the story is focused more on the human characters and their struggles, however the NOMAC story will be explored further in future novelization."
Prequel:
A Bug's Life.
the title track makes me smile like an idiot, idc
Prequel:
Bug's Adventures.
:tup :tup :tupPrequel:
A Bug's Life.
FTFY
I'm at a billiards and bar. They have an online Jukebox. Someone played ACOS. then I played The Path That divides. Cool they have a lot of the Astonishing songs on there.I would play only 5 DT songs: ACOS, 6DOIT, 8VM, ITPOE and IT.
I'm at a billiards and bar. They have an online Jukebox. Someone played ACOS. then I played The Path That divides. Cool they have a lot of the Astonishing songs on there.I would play only 5 DT songs: ACOS, 6DOIT, 8VM, ITPOE and IT.
This guy is working on covering the entire album and has been posting both album and drums only covers of the songs. He's amazing!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8a4K4xSbgYg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8a4K4xSbgYg)
Is it fair to say that your opinion of the album is colored by your dislike of plays/theater and the genres of sci-fi/fantasy? Not trying to put words in your mouth, just looking for clarification.
"...No offense, but... wow. Comparisons to an MMORPG (because... reasons? I honestly can't understand this), comparing members to pre-teens (I'd like to see pre-teens write an album like TA), saying the album is beneath them (no it isn't, they made the album and are proud of it), saying it isn't relatable (there are some very real and relatable themes in this album like trust, issues of family, loyalty etc.), completely ignoring key plot points (Xander is what causes Ahrys's to betray his brother, to protect Xander, his son, pretty important) , saying they 'jumped the shark' (fair enough if you don't like it, but this is still very much Dream Theater and has enough critical and commercial success to justify the risk). As I said, fine if you don't like it, but those claims are pretty unfounded. People have complained about the execution of the lyrical style, length of the album, the pacing and some of the more bizzare plot points. These have been well supported and understandable criticisms, even if I don't neccesarily agree with them. However, stuff like "we have purchased this garden variety version of a sing-through musical set in a MMORPG" is kind of baffling and just plain weird."
First, you misunderstood my "pre-teen" comment. I never compared the members of the band to actual pre-teens. Hell, they are my age and I respect each of them for all that they have contributed. My argument was that it seems that their target audience for this project were pre-teens. I likened the content of TA to something I could pluck off the shelf in the young adult section of any book store. And to be honest, most of that tripe is written by much older authors. You have to admit that even the cartoonish portraits of the main characters in TA on the website are a bit much: They all look like something from an English fantasy graphic novel… quite cheesy and again, in my opinion, a bit adolescent. Which segue's into my MMORPG comment. ALL the characters, their profiles, their motis operandi… all read like character studies from any one of the thousands of MMORPG platforms out there. Even the goofy map and costumes have an ethereal Camelot-y /Wizard and Warlock feel. Sorry if I confused the issue, but in my opinion--the whole concept is campy. At best. Much like the MMORPG realms that are created by today's version of D&D geekdom.
It is a sing-through musical, with acts and scene headings and everything. By definition, a play. The entire tale is communicated through lyrical narrative and dialogue. That's fine for those that like that. We are all entitled to our opinions. That's the beauty of forums. And I do wish the music was better… as I said there are moments of musical greatness and I would like to enjoy the music by itself. The problem is that, for me at least, the moments with good music--those stand alone pieces--are few and far between while the rest is bogged down with extraneous and sluggish characters and sung though dialogue.
Hey, we all have our opinion and I just wanted to put another perspective out there. There's so much love out there for this album and I just don't feel it myself. Not even close.
I love DT. There's not much in their extensive catalogue that I haven't been able to find something about which to enjoy. This is the first time I've been discouraged and disappointed in something they've developed. I suppose because of the grand scale and the build up to the albums roll out... the let down for me was even greater.
Again, just one old fan's opinion. I'll simply pass on this album and look forward to the next; while hoping this doesn't spawn a sequel (ala MindCrime 2) Some things shouldn't be done. Just because you can doesn't mean you should.
Unfortunately both SDOIT and ITPOE are in multiple tracks so wouldn't count as one, unless you choose the Score version of SDOIT, which I recall people have done before for these types of jukeboxes. :lol
Unfortunately both SDOIT and ITPOE are in multiple tracks so wouldn't count as one, unless you choose the Score version of SDOIT, which I recall people have done before for these types of jukeboxes. :lol
That must clear the room pretty fast! haha
DT have done that once before, in The Great Debate, where they switched to "addressing the reader" directly. ("Pay attention to the questions we have raised")To some extent, I find that with the use of a narrator throughout. That particular moment doesn't actually bother me at all, I find it really enjoyable, but there are some others where I definitely felt like there was no need for it to be a narrator and the key points could easily have been done as dialogue between characters.
There's probably a fancy literature term for it, but it's essentially the fact that in my mind, I'm going from watching characters interact, to some guy telling me about what's happening.
DT have done that once before, in The Great Debate, where they switched to "addressing the reader" directly. ("Pay attention to the questions we have raised")
There's probably a fancy literature term for it, but it's essentially the fact that in my mind, I'm going from watching characters interact, to some guy telling me about what's happening.
I am really not all familiar with musicals and operas, but is that something that is done outside of plays? In plays those "off speaker" statements are more meant for the director to direct the acting in a certain way ("X and Y stay behind, pensive"), but it strikes me as uncommon outside of that.That's a bit different I think, what DT have done in TA is use an up-front ("on stage") narrator as part of the thing itself. Which definitely happens in musicals - a great example of this is in Evita (where the narrator was played by Antonio Banderas in the movie version). I wouldn't say it's super common, but it's not entirely rare either.
For people who have seen the live performance, do the videos running in the background help making that distinction?
For people who have seen the live performance, do the videos running in the background help making that distinction?Nah not remotely. They mainly just add to the tone of what's going on, but you wouldn't be able to follow the story at all from the live show alone if you didn't know it a bit already.
During the Q&A on sunday, we got clarification that the stuff thats been written on the emails, website and tourbook is all a guy (Ryan something). He's the one that came up with a lot of the world outside of whats within the concept and lyrics itself...
2028 was his (it was a question actually)
Usually with a new DT album I look forward to 2-3 great songs, 3-4 pretty good, and maybe 1 I don't like. TA has like 20 great songs, about 5 good to very good, and a couple I don't care for. That's a great ratio.
Ryans. The question was regarding all the seeming "links" to old stuff (particularly 1928/2028/metropolis), and JP basically answered "I wish I was that smart - I'd not even thought off all the things you mentioned now. all of that was ryan"
Identical situation in my case as well.Usually with a new DT album I look forward to 2-3 great songs, 3-4 pretty good, and maybe 1 I don't like. TA has like 20 great songs, about 5 good to very good, and a couple I don't care for. That's a great ratio.
That's about where I am too.
Usually with a new DT album I look forward to 2-3 great songs, 3-4 pretty good, and maybe 1 I don't like. TA has like 20 great songs, about 5 good to very good, and a couple I don't care for. That's a great ratio.
That's about where I am too.
So maybe this has been answered in this thread already, but I can't be bothered to search for it. :yarr
At the end of SitS there's a lyric that says: They only know the Noise Machines, so I will treat them to sonic ecstasy. This is immediately followed by a bit of dissonant wankery, then Gabe sees Faythe over a mellow bit. Which part is supposed to be the "sonic ecstasy"?
To me, the dissonant wankery represent the moment where JP and JR said "hey that sounds cool, let's keep it"That's probably right. But at least it makes sense and has parallels with the story! :lol
The riff starting at about 2:52 of My Last Farewell is a gem I long overlooked. I cannot place what it reminds me of, but I like it.
That rapping part in 'TPTD'
No, that isn't what I was thinking. I was thinking something outside of DT. Not a specific song, but a general sound. Maybe like something from Lacuna Coil or Alter Bridge? I'm just not placing it.The riff starting at about 2:52 of My Last Farewell is a gem I long overlooked. I cannot place what it reminds me of, but I like it.
I agree! It sounds like something taken straight out of Home :metal
No, that isn't what I was thinking. I was thinking something outside of DT. Not a specific song, but a general sound. Maybe like something from Lacuna Coil or Alter Bridge? I'm just not placing it.
That rapping part in 'TPTD'
I have no idea what you are referring to.
It's definitely not a rap though because it doesn't have rhymes or anything
It's definitely not a rap though because it doesn't have rhymes or anything
I knew the day would COME
And you would be TEMPTED
To give up the chosen ONE
and finally END THIS
Do anything for your SON
A terminal Weakness
But now you're as good as DONE
I didn't have a CHOICE
And I was defENSELESS
I didn't believe his VOICE
The fighting was SENSELESS
But now I can see the truth
I've got to my SENSES
I shouldn't have trusted you
Those look pretty rhyme-ey to me. Some of the first parts are more assonances or partial rhymes, but most raps have those anyway.
I was listening to the album while I was out earlier and when that riff started I thought to myself "I bet that's the riff someone mentioned on DTF earlier today", even though I couldn't remember which song had been mentioned in the post ;D So yeah, it reminds me of something too actually but I don't know what.No, that isn't what I was thinking. I was thinking something outside of DT. Not a specific song, but a general sound. Maybe like something from Lacuna Coil or Alter Bridge? I'm just not placing it.The riff starting at about 2:52 of My Last Farewell is a gem I long overlooked. I cannot place what it reminds me of, but I like it.
I agree! It sounds like something taken straight out of Home :metal
It has the rhythmic properties of rapping, but I don't consider any pitched vocals to be rapping. Rapping is rhythmic talking as far as I'm concerned.
Yeah I honestly can't see how that couldn't a rap. It has a repeated rhythm, is relatively monotone melodically and emphasises the rhymes (and slant rhymes, which are common in rapping). Saying that it couldn't be a rap is like saying the similar quickly-sung section in TDS couldn't be one (or the one in HTF).
Yeah I honestly can't see how that couldn't a rap. It has a repeated rhythm, is relatively monotone melodically and emphasises the rhymes (and slant rhymes, which are common in rapping). Saying that it couldn't be a rap is like saying the similar quickly-sung section in TDS couldn't be one (or the one in HTF).
The melody is the same as the guitar riff behind it.
It has the rhythmic properties of rapping, but I don't consider any pitched vocals to be rapping. Rapping is rhythmic talking as far as I'm concerned.So, do you listen to a lot of rap?
In other news, my 5 year old has figured out his favorite songs, and we listen to it everytime we get in the car:This is fantastic. The bad guy song. :rollin
"The Bad guy song" (Three Days)
"The song where the guy grabs the boy"
"The creepy song where the girl gets stabbed"
I actually legitimately did not know what section he was talking about.
It's not rap. It's really cool, and I dig it like crazy, but it's not rap.It doesn't quite feel like rap, but I knew what he was talking about. And if I'm being objective about it, it is hard to distinguish why it can't be considered rap.
I actually legitimately did not know what section he was talking about.Ok, but in fairness, most people probably did. :lol
Just discovered that the big NOMAC in https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishing (https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishing) produces music as your mouse pointer is on it. There are various different bits of music, not just one.
Whatsmore, now a third eye has red light going on and off. No eye produces anything when clicked, though. That said, the music stops whenever your pointer is on the eyes.
PS: I hope these NOMAC outtakes come as bonus tracks on the album's re-mastered edition in 2028 :P
Just discovered that the big NOMAC in https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishing (https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishing) produces music as your mouse pointer is on it. There are various different bits of music, not just one.
Whatsmore, now a third eye has red light going on and off. No eye produces anything when clicked, though. That said, the music stops whenever your pointer is on the eyes.
PS: I hope these NOMAC outtakes come as bonus tracks on the album's re-mastered edition in 2028 :P
I ripped them and made them a download a while ago.
It has the rhythmic properties of rapping, but I don't consider any pitched vocals to be rapping. Rapping is rhythmic talking as far as I'm concerned.So, do you listen to a lot of rap?
I can't believe we went through this whole discussion about James rapping without someone posting this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BKmnlvO47E
I actually legitimately did not know what section he was talking about.Yes, sorry, wasn't calling you out specifically -- just making the point that calling that section of Path That Divides a "rap" would be generally understandable to most people as an appropriate label without having to get into definitions of what rap is or isn't according to DT fans.
I knew immediately what he was talking about when he said rap section :lolThere's only one rap song in that album. And it's pretty bad. :laugh:
It's definitely not a rap though because it doesn't have rhymes or anything, it's just said really fast.... Kinda like when people refer to that part in This Dying Soul as a rap
Just discovered that the big NOMAC in https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishing (https://www.dreamtheater.net/theastonishing) produces music as your mouse pointer is on it. There are various different bits of music, not just one.
Whatsmore, now a third eye has red light going on and off. No eye produces anything when clicked, though. That said, the music stops whenever your pointer is on the eyes.
PS: I hope these NOMAC outtakes come as bonus tracks on the album's re-mastered edition in 2028 :P
I ripped them and made them a download a while ago.
Oh cool! Do you know how many different bits of music there are? From a quick listening, I figured there must be at least 10.
There's only one rap song in that album. And it's pretty bad. :laugh:Honor Thy Father?
What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
Pretty sure he didn't do very much rapping.What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
Django Reinhardt?
Pretty sure he didn't do very much rapping.What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
Django Reinhardt?
What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
Django Reinhardt?
What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
Django Reinhardt?
No, Derek Roddy. He was the actual drummer/rapper who recorded those parts back in the day. Much later in 2010 he was offered the full time job, but he declined (because he hadn't been given credit on the albums). It's very clear in the docummentary, you can see how angry he was about that: https://youtu.be/NiDZKY96H9Y?t=1m57s (https://youtu.be/NiDZKY96H9Y?t=1m57s)
What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
Blame the Kindle I was using at the time! That thing doesn't know how to SPELL!
A better life ballad, good
Brother can you hear me? ballad, a military anthem, nice one
A life left behind beautiful ballad
There's only one rap song in that album. And it's pretty bad. :laugh:Honor Thy Father?
Um, clearly you guys haven't heard his underground mixtape, "Django Unchained."Not that we know of. :justjenPretty sure he didn't do very much rapping.Django Reinhardt?What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
A better life ballad, good
Brother can you hear me? ballad, a military anthem, nice one
A life left behind beautiful ballad
tbh I wouldn't call any of those ballads. At least not purely (around 2-3 mins of ALLB is a ballad, but the rest frame it in a way that the song becomes not one if that makes sense). A Better Life is a Prog Metal song and BCYHM is as you said, an anthem. Glad to see the album has grown on you though. I'm interested in why you don't like Ravenskill or A Temping Offer. Those may be some of my favourite tracks on the album.
Um, clearly you guys haven't heard his underground mixtape, "Django Unchained."Not that we know of. :justjenPretty sure he didn't do very much rapping.Django Reinhardt?What's with all this obsession about DR doing rap?Who is DR?
Anew beginning good rock song with Kansas influence. the guitar solo at the end is boring and too long. Reminds me of the one at the end of Genesis's Abacab.
Anew beginning good rock song with Kansas influence. the guitar solo at the end is boring and too long. Reminds me of the one at the end of Genesis's Abacab.
Good luck with that one. You're probably the first person I've seen say that. To each his own but to me, that's one of the best JP solos in years. It has a beautiful flow to it and (if anything) most people wanted it to actually last longer than it does.
Here it is like they just fill a space with a long solo. And honestly, that is not a complicated one, certainly not to JP standards. If you listen to Lines on the sand or The spirit carries on, you will notice all the variations on the volume, the picking, a certain blues approach at times. And in fact, as I was saying, all the components of the solo could have been better. If there would have been some kind of explosions from the drum parts, you know, something happening a little bit more to make my eyes open and say wow. That's my opinion.
There's only one rap song in that album. And it's pretty bad. :laugh:Honor Thy Father?
Lol yep. The only song from that album I actually skip.
If there would have been some kind of explosions from the drum parts, you know, something happening a little bit more to make my eyes open and say wow. That's my opinion.
I don't see any similiarity between Goodnight Kiss and Act of Faythe.
Personally, I'm ok with them cutting out the spoken intro. It was pretty cool as an intro to the live show, but I think it may have been a little distracting, and a step too far on the album.I would have loved that extra noise from the NOMAC at the end of Descent of the NOMACs
Just leave the music to tell the story.
Pretty late to the party on saying that, but just saw "red barchetta"'s review of CD1 and it reminded me how much it surprises me when people think Disney before SDOIT (specifically Goodnight Kiss) when they listen to Act of Faythe. I mean yeah, there is some resemblance to Disney there, but am I the only one who really feels like that's basically Goodnight Kiss 2.0 (and love it for that)?
The Answer and Chosen give off a much stronger Disney/Aladdin vibe to me, but then again, I love Disney music so that's not an issue for me personally (also Lord Nafaryus is basically James LaBrie doing Matthew Bellamy doing a Disney villain impersonation, aka best song on the album).
What Disney song sounds like Act of Faythe? Specifics please.
Personally, I'm ok with them cutting out the spoken intro. It was pretty cool as an intro to the live show, but I think it may have been a little distracting, and a step too far on the album.
Just leave the music to tell the story.
Pretty late to the party on saying that, but just saw "red barchetta"'s review of CD1 and it reminded me how much it surprises me when people think Disney before SDOIT (specifically Goodnight Kiss) when they listen to Act of Faythe. I mean yeah, there is some resemblance to Disney there, but am I the only one who really feels like that's basically Goodnight Kiss 2.0 (and love it for that)?Well, parts of SDOIT sound like Disney (especially the overture) so I guess both comparisons can be valid at the same time. :lol
The Answer and Chosen give off a much stronger Disney/Aladdin vibe to me, but then again, I love Disney music so that's not an issue for me personally (also Lord Nafaryus is basically James LaBrie doing Matthew Bellamy doing a Disney villain impersonation, aka best song on the album).
Pretty late to the party on saying that, but just saw "red barchetta"'s review of CD1 and it reminded me how much it surprises me when people think Disney before SDOIT (specifically Goodnight Kiss) when they listen to Act of Faythe. I mean yeah, there is some resemblance to Disney there, but am I the only one who really feels like that's basically Goodnight Kiss 2.0 (and love it for that)?Well, parts of SDOIT sound like Disney (especially the overture) so I guess both comparisons can be valid at the same time. :lol
The Answer and Chosen give off a much stronger Disney/Aladdin vibe to me, but then again, I love Disney music so that's not an issue for me personally (also Lord Nafaryus is basically James LaBrie doing Matthew Bellamy doing a Disney villain impersonation, aka best song on the album).
Didn't want to start a new thread...- - - - - Six Degrees Disc Two VS The Astonishing - - - - -
• Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence Disc 2
or
• The Astonishing
Which is your favourite ?
What Disney song sounds like Act of Faythe? Specifics please.
I don't think anyone said it sounds like a specific Disney song, just that it sounds like it could be a Disney song.
I was at the concert sunday in paris, my fiance who never really liked DT, never wanted to listen to it more then one minute ;), was going with me, and she really loved it. :metal
I really think the astonishing as alive experience can gain many new fans for DT.
I think the idea to only go to opera/theatre venus was a brillant one and fits perfect for the concept.
that beeing said, I am looking forward to headbang in the frontrow again the next tour comming :metal
I was at the concert sunday in paris, my fiance who never really liked DT, never wanted to listen to it more then one minute ;), was going with me, and she really loved it. :metal
I really think the astonishing as alive experience can gain many new fans for DT.
I think the idea to only go to opera/theatre venus was a brillant one and fits perfect for the concept.
that beeing said, I am looking forward to headbang in the frontrow again the next tour comming :metal
Light to dark, dark to light Blob?
I was at the concert sunday in paris, my fiance who never really liked DT, never wanted to listen to it more then one minute ;), was going with me, and she really loved it. :metal
I really think the astonishing as alive experience can gain many new fans for DT.
I think the idea to only go to opera/theatre venus was a brillant one and fits perfect for the concept.
that beeing said, I am looking forward to headbang in the frontrow again the next tour comming :metal
Glad that your fiancé loved the concert. If my buddy does not go to Cincy with me, I may sell my tickets. Not sure I want to make a 6 hour drive for this concert. My wife says she will go, and to be honest she may like the TA concert more than myself. Of course if she goes, we will have to make a stop at Ikea near Cincy. :facepalm:
I'm with you on this guys. For me the solo diminishes the best song in the album.Anew beginning good rock song with Kansas influence. the guitar solo at the end is boring and too long. Reminds me of the one at the end of Genesis's Abacab.
Good luck with that one. You're probably the first person I've seen say that. To each his own but to me, that's one of the best JP solos in years. It has a beautiful flow to it and (if anything) most people wanted it to actually last longer than it does.
Not only the guitar solo is boring but most importantly all the music composure is. Usually JP will take us with his solos using different tempos, often taking us to a crescendo part. If I feel something, I would tell. Here it is like they just fill a space with a long solo. And honestly, that is not a complicated one, certainly not to JP standards. If you listen to Lines on the sand or The spirit carries on, you will notice all the variations on the volume, the picking, a certain blues approach at times. And in fact, as I was saying, all the components of the solo could have been better. If there would have been some kind of explosions from the drum parts, you know, something happening a little bit more to make my eyes open and say wow. That's my opinion.
Dark website backgrounds should be illegal.
Didn't want to start a new thread...- - - - - Six Degrees Disc Two VS The Astonishing - - - - -
• Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence Disc 2
or
• The Astonishing
Which is your favourite ?
For me it's the exact opposite :lolDidn't want to start a new thread...- - - - - Six Degrees Disc Two VS The Astonishing - - - - -
• Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence Disc 2
or
• The Astonishing
Which is your favourite ?
Listened to both yesterday and TA blows SDOIT out of the water. I find SDOIT starts strong with Overture and About to Crash, then gets boring/meanders along until About to Crash (reprise) and Grand Finale.
You could make a disc with the best songs on TA and it wouldn't even come close to beat SDOIT Disc 2.
You could make a disc with the best songs on TA and it wouldn't even come close to beat SDOIT Disc 2.
True...
It would actually beat it instead. :biggrin:
You could make a disc with the best songs on TA and it wouldn't even come close to beat SDOIT Disc 2.That would be absurd, considering that TA is about the whole experience and not individual songs.
I probably slightly prefer TA to the SDOIT title track (disc 2), but the rest of SDOIT is so ridiculously good that the album overall kicks TA's arse.
That's, like, the opposite of my opinion. :lolI probably slightly prefer TA to the SDOIT title track (disc 2), but the rest of SDOIT is so ridiculously good that the album overall kicks TA's arse.
Never really got into disc one either. Glass Prison is ok, Blind Faith is amazing, Misunderstood is good (love the trippy ending), Great Debate bores me to tears and Disappear is meh. All IMO, of course!
Disc One is where it's at.
To me, Disc 2 is useless. It's music that is way beneath them, and I still don't understand why they did it. There is NO part on it that I go "Holy Shit". I like SS and GF and the solo from GK, but that's it. There's nothing remotely interesting about any of it, really.
Disc One is where it's at.
6 D's I assume you're talking about.
To me, Disc 2 is useless. It's music that is way beneath them, and I still don't understand why they did it. There is NO part on it that I go "Holy Shit". I like SS and GF and the solo from GK, but that's it. There's nothing remotely interesting about any of it, really.
And TGP is one song that is not aging well for me. And people call ANTR long??
Disc 1 as a stand alone disc is excellent. But as a whole, I'm take TA easily.
Disc One is where it's at.
6 D's I assume you're talking about.
To me, Disc 2 is useless. It's music that is way beneath them, and I still don't understand why they did it. There is NO part on it that I go "Holy Shit". I like SS and GF and the solo from GK, but that's it. There's nothing remotely interesting about any of it, really.
And TGP is one song that is not aging well for me. And people call ANTR long??
Disc 1 as a stand alone disc is excellent. But as a whole, I'm take TA easily.
Such a beautiful song.
Disc One is where it's at.
6 D's I assume you're talking about.
To me, Disc 2 is useless. It's music that is way beneath them, and I still don't understand why they did it. There is NO part on it that I go "Holy Shit". I like SS and GF and the solo from GK, but that's it. There's nothing remotely interesting about any of it, really.
Such a beautiful song.
Mm, I'm not liking "Chosen" yet. The chorus is too... 'Bon Jovi' for my taste. I've grown tired of that chord progression after 15 years of hearing it everywhere. Good for you, though!
I don't get a Bon Jovi vibe from it. I'd probably like it even more if I did! :biggrin: (I like it anyway)
I don't get a Bon Jovi vibe from it. I'd probably like it even more if I did! :biggrin: (I like it anyway)
The chorus has that vibe for me. Think Bon Jovi singing:
"But I can't climb this mountain without you
No, I can't face this on my own
With you by my side, we will open his eyes
And the truth will deliver us home."
Use the style of one those post-Keep The Faith Bon Jovi songs, ala These Days. :lol
I'm strictly pre-Keep the Faith for Bon Jovi. Still don't hear it though.
I'm strictly pre-Keep the Faith for Bon Jovi. Still don't hear it though.
I pretty much stopped listening around that same time. They were my favorite band way back when.
I'm strictly pre-Keep the Faith for Bon Jovi. Still don't hear it though.
I pretty much stopped listening around that same time. They were my favorite band way back when.
Me too actually. I haven't bought any of their albums since KTF.
Dry County came up on 'shuffle' a couple of weeks back - that's a great song. :)
I'm strictly pre-Keep the Faith for Bon Jovi. Still don't hear it though.
I'm strictly pre-Keep the Faith for Bon Jovi. Still don't hear it though.
I probably slightly prefer TA to the SDOIT title track (disc 2), but the rest of SDOIT is so ridiculously good that the album overall kicks TA's arse.
Never really got into disc one either. Glass Prison is ok, Blind Faith is amazing, Misunderstood is good (love the trippy ending), Great Debate bores me to tears and Disappear is meh. All IMO, of course!
I'm strictly pre-Keep the Faith for Bon Jovi. Still don't hear it though.
During "Chosen" I keep hearing the choruses of a slower "Livin' On A Prayer"/"Stick To Your Guns"/"I'll Be There For You" (or, for post-New Jersey material, "Always"/"Bed Of Roses"/"Thank You For Loving Me").
Some people must still be on that post-release sugar high to rank TA higher than SDOIT. I mean, not even close.
Some people must still be on that post-release sugar high to rank TA higher than SDOIT. I mean, not even close.
SDOIT is awesome, but it feels longer to me than The Astonishing despite actually being shorter. I dunno... The album as a whole just doesn't gel as nicely, IMO. Still a great record, though.
SDOIT is awesome, but it feels longer to me than The Astonishing despite actually being shorter. I dunno... The album as a whole just doesn't gel as nicely, IMO. Still a great record, though.
Complete opposite for me. SDOIT, song and album, have always flown by for me every single time, without skipping a thing. TA has been a thorough slog to get through for me, and there's no way I could manage it in one go without skipping half of it.
Some people must still be on that post-release sugar high to rank TA higher than SDOIT. I mean, not even close.
I wouldn't say TA feels shorter, because it's significant;y longer, but I get the sentiment. TA flows much better as a whole than SDOIT, I always felt that song was more of separate tracks than one song because of that reason. TA's two acts almost feel like they could be a long song each, the flow and musical themes just go much better IMO.
TA started off very low in my rankings, but over time it got to 2nd place. That's not a 'post-release sugar high'.
TA started off very low in my rankings, but over time it got to 2nd place. That's not a 'post-release sugar high'.
Over time?? It's only been out 6 weeks! :lol
Some people must still be on that post-release sugar high to rank TA higher than SDOIT. I mean, not even close.
Why isn't it close?
:lol Yeah, like a combo of Always and Thank You For Loving Me. That vibe.
Or better yet.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Lz9gm0vlhlY
:lol
Some people must still be on that post-release sugar high to rank TA higher than SDOIT. I mean, not even close.
Chosen is my favorite song on the albumThat is one incredible song! So we'll written and the sound and melody lines are just perfect. This should be a hit single all over the radio right now..
I love TA more and more with each listen. I went through it three times today. There I was, on the 2 train, heading to a site. I'm listening to the second half of the second act. As everything in the story unfolds: Faythe's almost death, Gabriel refinding his voice, Nafaryus having a change of heart, tears are welling up in my eyes on everything from My Last Farewell to The Astonishing. So much so that the woman next to me turned and asked if I was alright.
I think the second disc is by far the more powerful of the two in regards to the story. It's so intense and profound that I find it hard to get through without feeling something from it.
I love TA more and more with each listen. I went through it three times today. There I was, on the 2 train, heading to a site. I'm listening to the second half of the second act. As everything in the story unfolds: Faythe's almost death, Gabriel refinding his voice, Nafaryus having a change of heart, tears are welling up in my eyes on everything from My Last Farewell to The Astonishing. So much so that the woman next to me turned and asked if I was alright.
I think the second disc is by far the more powerful of the two in regards to the story. It's so intense and profound that I find it hard to get through without feeling something from it.
You're an emotional dude, huh?
And yes, TA is amazing.
I love TA more and more with each listen. I went through it three times today. There I was, on the 2 train, heading to a site. I'm listening to the second half of the second act. As everything in the story unfolds: Faythe's almost death, Gabriel refinding his voice, Nafaryus having a change of heart, tears are welling up in my eyes on everything from My Last Farewell to The Astonishing. So much so that the woman next to me turned and asked if I was alright.This
I think the second disc is by far the more powerful of the two in regards to the story. It's so intense and profound that I find it hard to get through without feeling something from it.
I love TA more and more with each listen. I went through it three times today. There I was, on the 2 train, heading to a site. I'm listening to the second half of the second act. As everything in the story unfolds: Faythe's almost death, Gabriel refinding his voice, Nafaryus having a change of heart, tears are welling up in my eyes on everything from My Last Farewell to The Astonishing. So much so that the woman next to me turned and asked if I was alright.This
I think the second disc is by far the more powerful of the two in regards to the story. It's so intense and profound that I find it hard to get through without feeling something from it.
From first listen to know, I have tears each time I listen to act 2, I'm not able to sing along path of divide or my last farewell or hymn of a thousand voices, they hit my guts so hard.
So much so that the woman next to me turned and asked if I was alright.
So much so that the woman next to me turned and asked if I was alright.
^ Ha, this is great. I have to admit to getting a bit misty at certain sections too. :'(
The album is still holding up well for me. Most folks in our office sit with headphones on most of the day, so it allows me to listen to large chunks at a time. Besides, being in IT, nobody likes to communicate verbally anyway. IM-ing the guy sitting right beside you 3 ft away at the next desk is not uncommon.. :lol
Every company should have an acceptable murder rate!That's a KILLER idea!
Chosen is definitely great.
It also sounds nothing like Bon Jovi.
I always thought that the chorus of Status Seeker sounded like 7800 Degrees Farenheit - era Bon Jovi.
I keep imagining the life of the characters after the album ends. Just think: Nafaryus (through Faythe) becomes Xander's step-grandfather. (Gabriel: "We're going to visit Grampa Nafaryus today!") Also, he's stuck with that name long after he turned "good". Someone's bound to ask him "Why are you called Nafaryus?" at some point down the line.'It was prettier than Bug'
The ever-reliable Wikipedia tells us:
"The album's title was a reference to the supposed melting point of rock"
(https://buckomania.files.wordpress.com/2015/04/magma2.jpg)
Labrie confirmed in Twitter that Rich doesn't speak on the album at all. He was supposed to do an intro to the album but it got dropped.
Labrie confirmed in Twitter that Rich doesn't speak on the album at all. He was supposed to do an intro to the album but it got dropped.
Which apparently serves as the intro tape to The Astonishing live shows.
Labrie confirmed in Twitter that Rich doesn't speak on the album at all. He was supposed to do an intro to the album but it got dropped.
Which apparently serves as the intro tape to The Astonishing live shows.
That's pretty much it, as far as I know.
So it's James doing "Attention Batallion!" ??
Here's a question: Why would Nafaryus tolerate a fully-fledged paramilitary battalion that operates in the open? A battalion is 500-1000 people.
Here's a question: Why would Nafaryus tolerate a fully-fledged paramilitary battalion that operates in the open? A battalion is 500-1000 people.
Here's a question: Why would Nafaryus tolerate a fully-fledged paramilitary battalion that operates in the open? A battalion is 500-1000 people.
Or maybe the story of a dystopian future where music is what makes life astonishing and human suffering is caused by the lack of music should be taken as a bunch of metaphors, rather than judged with realistic logic.
Or maybe the story of a dystopian future where music is what makes life astonishing and human suffering is caused by the lack of music should be taken as a bunch of metaphors, rather than judged with realistic logic.
It's a rebel militia in a dystopian future. These peasants presumably have little knowledge of a real military as we know it.Both of these, but especially the first. Think you're being a bit too literal, Rumby.
And it's probably a stock sample that happened to best fit along with the marching stock sample.
I love The Astonishing, but hate that invisible blanket covering the speakers.
I love The Astonishing, but hate that invisible blanket covering the speakers.
I love The Astonishing, but hate that invisible blanket covering the speakers.
WHAT?
Do I have an amazing sound system? The Astonishing is one of the best albums I have ever heard, sound-wise!
That makes no sense to me. Even today I was listening to a lot of great bands and thinking - the sound of this cd is not as clear as The Astonishing.
I admit that comment left me almost confused - my sound system is not cheap, but it´s not state-of-the-art... I guess.
I love The Astonishing, but hate that invisible blanket covering the speakers.No clue what you're talking about. Probably their best-sounding album since, well, a long damn time.
I really enjoy the mix overall. Definitely one of their best sounding albums IMO and easily the best in awhile although I don't have the complaints that are typical on DTF regarding the sound/mix.
The only thing that bugs me to no end regarding the production is the ending of A Tempting Offer (bummer given I love that song very much) with the weird 'take the evening to deci-----de'. I know JP already ruled any mistakes out, but it just sounds weird. Once it was pointed out and I payed attention, it's been impossible to unlisten.
:rollinEvery company should have an acceptable murder rate!That's a KILLER idea!
Unless you are suggesting he was using the term in jest as a nickname ("my little battalion") ... no. Military is super anal about using correct nomenclature.
It's just thrown-together samples, sadly. As someone else pointed out, he asks his battalion to march when they are already marching.
Yes, but as already pointed out, this is not a professional military. It is a peasant militia. But going back to the original question about why Naf' allowed it to exist, I wondered that myself. A few possible explanations I came up with:
1. It could be that the Empire actually encouraged militias in outlying areas with the thought that they are peasant military forces that the Empire can call upon in times of need (or when the Empire needs cannon fodder troops to send in somewhere to minimize the casualties of the actual regular army).
2. Naf' knew about them, but did not know how big or organized they were, and did not take action because he did not see them as an actual threat.
3. Naf' didn't actually know about them.
4. Actual plot hole.
Who knows whether it is any of these options or something else?
I remain shocked anyone is able to get by without hearing it immediately. It was so jarring to my ear from first listen.The only thing that bugs me to no end regarding the production is the ending of A Tempting Offer (bummer given I love that song very much) with the weird 'take the evening to deci-----de'. I know JP already ruled any mistakes out, but it just sounds weird. Once it was pointed out and I payed attention, it's been impossible to unlisten.oh my god why did you have to do this
I'm not hearing a mistake. I am hearing a vocal part that is very soft, almost a whisper, and James drawing out the consonant sound as the drums and other instruments sound.
I'm not hearing a mistake. I am hearing a vocal part that is very soft, almost a whisper, and James drawing out the consonant sound as the drums and other instruments sound.You're probably right, but to me it sounds like someone hit pause on JLB and then hit play again.
What is supposed to be wrong with that section?
Yes, but as already pointed out, this is not a professional military. It is a peasant militia. But going back to the original question about why Naf' allowed it to exist, I wondered that myself. A few possible explanations I came up with:In my opinion it was probably 3 (or maybe 2). After all, they are called 'Ravenskill Rebel Militia'.
1. It could be that the Empire actually encouraged militias in outlying areas with the thought that they are peasant military forces that the Empire can call upon in times of need (or when the Empire needs cannon fodder troops to send in somewhere to minimize the casualties of the actual regular army).
2. Naf' knew about them, but did not know how big or organized they were, and did not take action because he did not see them as an actual threat.
3. Naf' didn't actually know about them.
4. Actual plot hole.
Who knows whether it is any of these options or something else?
Yes, that is true. Good point. BUT it is #1 is still possible in that the GNE had militias, but the Ravenskill militia secretly referred to themselves as a "rebel" militia.Yes, but as already pointed out, this is not a professional military. It is a peasant militia. But going back to the original question about why Naf' allowed it to exist, I wondered that myself. A few possible explanations I came up with:In my opinion it was probably 3 (or maybe 2). After all, they are called 'Ravenskill Rebel Militia'.
1. It could be that the Empire actually encouraged militias in outlying areas with the thought that they are peasant military forces that the Empire can call upon in times of need (or when the Empire needs cannon fodder troops to send in somewhere to minimize the casualties of the actual regular army).
2. Naf' knew about them, but did not know how big or organized they were, and did not take action because he did not see them as an actual threat.
3. Naf' didn't actually know about them.
4. Actual plot hole.
Who knows whether it is any of these options or something else?
Yes, that is true. Good point. BUT it is #1 is still possible in that the GNE had militias, but the Ravenskill militia secretly referred to themselves as a "rebel" militia.Didn't think about that. Makes sense!
Looks like they updated the trailer. I'm not sure if I'm the last to know, or what?I'd say you were the first to know! (it seems it was uploaded just an hour ago). Cool trailer! I suppose most of it is part of the video projections in the show (anyone can confirm?). My favourite bits were the eye at 0:52, and Daryus' 'disfigured' head at 1:13.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LHFswk8K3o
Looks like they updated the trailer. I'm not sure if I'm the last to know, or what?I'd say you were the first to know! (it seems it was uploaded just an hour ago). Cool trailer! I suppose most of it is part of the video projections in the show (anyone can confirm?). My favourite bits were the eye at 0:52, and Daryus' 'disfigured' head at 1:13.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LHFswk8K3o
Also: nice to see some confirmation that they plan on continuing to tour next year!
Okay, I tried to focus in on it at higher volume on a better system, and I definitely hear what you mean now. But I am still not sure it is a mistake. It just sounds odd. When James switches to the near whisper and the word starts to fade out, I usually stop paying attention to the vocals, and my attention shifts to what the instruments are doing, which is why I think I never noticed it before. But right when the drums and other instruments sound, it sounds like the vocals come back in right in the middle of the word at full volume. So, yeah, it does sound like that is a remnant from another take. Whether it is or not, who knows? It just may be a quirk in the way James sang it. Wouldn't be the first time.I'm not hearing a mistake. I am hearing a vocal part that is very soft, almost a whisper, and James drawing out the consonant sound as the drums and other instruments sound.You're probably right, but to me it sounds like someone hit pause on JLB and then hit play again.
I'm not hearing a mistake. I am hearing a vocal part that is very soft, almost a whisper, and James drawing out the consonant sound as the drums and other instruments sound.
This. I don't think it's a mistake. I just never noticed it and it sounds pretty awful now that I know it's there.
I took a self imposed necessary 2 week break from the album because I was wearing it out. The result was a fresh new perspective, hearing songs differently than before. Songs like Moment of Betrayal, The Walking Shadow, My last Farewell and others have really come to life.
Sometimes distancing yourself from an album and returning down the road can bring the music to a whole other level.
I took a self imposed necessary 2 week break from the album because I was wearing it out. The result was a fresh new perspective, hearing songs differently than before. Songs like Moment of Betrayal, The Walking Shadow, My last Farewell and others have really come to life.
Sometimes distancing yourself from an album and returning down the road can bring the music to a whole other level.
I tried to do this. I lasted 24 hours.
I guess my car speakers just suck, because the album sounds pretty clear on my headphones.
I'm not hearing a mistake. I am hearing a vocal part that is very soft, almost a whisper, and James drawing out the consonant sound as the drums and other instruments sound.
This. I don't think it's a mistake. I just never noticed it and it sounds pretty awful now that I know it's there.
Unreal, I've listened to this track 20 times and never noticed this. Now that I know about it its going to bug me, because it is - without a doubt - a mistake. Yuck!
People talk about the "deciiiiiiiide" section, but I've yet to see a comment about the vocal delivery of "And let me bring you back to earth". That one is ... odd, to say the least.
I guess my car speakers just suck, because the album sounds pretty clear on my headphones.
With most music (not all), there's a world of difference between listening to music on headphones and a generic car stereo.
People talk about the "deciiiiiiiide" section, but I've yet to see a comment about the vocal delivery of "And let me bring you back to earth". That one is ... odd, to say the least.
I guess my car speakers just suck, because the album sounds pretty clear on my headphones.
With most music (not all), there's a world of difference between listening to music on headphones and a generic car stereo.
How dare you assume my car stereo is generic even though it totally is.
Something I loved about my old car's speakers is that when one blew out, it made Iced Earth's Dante's Inferno sound even more awesome with the enhanced bass, which was just a broken speaker rattling, but it still sounded cool.
Will you guys stop over analyzing! Its vintage James, in all his glory! :tick2:I'm not hearing a mistake. I am hearing a vocal part that is very soft, almost a whisper, and James drawing out the consonant sound as the drums and other instruments sound.
This. I don't think it's a mistake. I just never noticed it and it sounds pretty awful now that I know it's there.
Unreal, I've listened to this track 20 times and never noticed this. Now that I know about it its going to bug me, because it is - without a doubt - a mistake. Yuck!
Not necessarily. Again, it could just be the way James phrased it. It is hard to hear exactly what is going on during that vocal transition because of the drum hit and other instruments, so although it sounds like punching in from another take, it may not be that at all.People talk about the "deciiiiiiiide" section, but I've yet to see a comment about the vocal delivery of "And let me bring you back to earth". That one is ... odd, to say the least.
Yeah, it definitely is. I was just thinking that again this morning. :lol
I guess my car speakers just suck, because the album sounds pretty clear on my headphones.
With most music (not all), there's a world of difference between listening to music on headphones and a generic car stereo.
How dare you assume my car stereo is generic even though it totally is.
Something I loved about my old car's speakers is that when one blew out, it made Iced Earth's Dante's Inferno sound even more awesome with the enhanced bass, which was just a broken speaker rattling, but it still sounded cool.
Not only did I dare, but I triple dog dared. I'm surprised my car speakers are still going ten years later. I guess Hyundai Motors makes durable speakers. :lol
I guess my car speakers just suck, because the album sounds pretty clear on my headphones.
With most music (not all), there's a world of difference between listening to music on headphones and a generic car stereo.
How dare you assume my car stereo is generic even though it totally is.
Something I loved about my old car's speakers is that when one blew out, it made Iced Earth's Dante's Inferno sound even more awesome with the enhanced bass, which was just a broken speaker rattling, but it still sounded cool.
Not only did I dare, but I triple dog dared. I'm surprised my car speakers are still going ten years later. I guess Hyundai Motors makes durable speakers. :lol
Funny, my Hyundai Elantra is going on 11 years old. I'm a little behind on maintenance, but I've been told that Hyundais can last quite a long time if taken care of.
Will you guys stop over analyzing! Its vintage James, in all his glory! :tick2:I'm not hearing a mistake. I am hearing a vocal part that is very soft, almost a whisper, and James drawing out the consonant sound as the drums and other instruments sound.
This. I don't think it's a mistake. I just never noticed it and it sounds pretty awful now that I know it's there.
Unreal, I've listened to this track 20 times and never noticed this. Now that I know about it its going to bug me, because it is - without a doubt - a mistake. Yuck!
Not necessarily. Again, it could just be the way James phrased it. It is hard to hear exactly what is going on during that vocal transition because of the drum hit and other instruments, so although it sounds like punching in from another take, it may not be that at all.People talk about the "deciiiiiiiide" section, but I've yet to see a comment about the vocal delivery of "And let me bring you back to earth". That one is ... odd, to say the least.
Yeah, it definitely is. I was just thinking that again this morning. :lol
My point and I'm joking is James at his best gives some odd deliveries.Will you guys stop over analyzing! Its vintage James, in all his glory! :tick2:I'm not hearing a mistake. I am hearing a vocal part that is very soft, almost a whisper, and James drawing out the consonant sound as the drums and other instruments sound.
This. I don't think it's a mistake. I just never noticed it and it sounds pretty awful now that I know it's there.
Unreal, I've listened to this track 20 times and never noticed this. Now that I know about it its going to bug me, because it is - without a doubt - a mistake. Yuck!
Not necessarily. Again, it could just be the way James phrased it. It is hard to hear exactly what is going on during that vocal transition because of the drum hit and other instruments, so although it sounds like punching in from another take, it may not be that at all.People talk about the "deciiiiiiiide" section, but I've yet to see a comment about the vocal delivery of "And let me bring you back to earth". That one is ... odd, to say the least.
Yeah, it definitely is. I was just thinking that again this morning. :lol
Making an observation that an odd delivery is odd is not overanalyzing.
You really don't hear the oddness? For lack of a better description, it kinda sounds as if he's about to throw up :lol
You really don't hear the oddness? For lack of a better description, it kinda sounds as if he's about to throw up :lol
By that point, Nafaryus is pretty pissed that not only does he think Gabriel is trying to overthrow him, but he's also making googly eyes with his daughter. The delivery sounds of that of an angry man. I'm sure if Portnoy were still in the band, he would have pushed a medieval growl that section.
You really don't hear the oddness? For lack of a better description, it kinda sounds as if he's about to throw up :lol
By that point, Nafaryus is pretty pissed that not only does he think Gabriel is trying to overthrow him, but he's also making googly eyes with his daughter. The delivery sounds of that of an angry man. I'm sure if Portnoy were still in the band, he would have pushed a medieval growl that section.
FTFY :lol
If portnoy were still in the band this album probably would had never been recorded, unless he had control and the credit.You really don't hear the oddness? For lack of a better description, it kinda sounds as if he's about to throw up :lol
By that point, Nafaryus is pretty pissed that not only does he think Gabriel is trying to overthrow him, but he's also making googly eyes with his daughter. The delivery sounds of that of an angry man. I'm sure if Portnoy were still in the band, he would have pushed to growl that section.
I highly doubt that. If John wanted it to happen the way it did (with only him and Jordan writing), I can pretty much guarantee it would have gone down that way regardless of who was behind the kit.If portnoy were still in the band this album probably would had never been recorded, unless he had control and the credit.You really don't hear the oddness? For lack of a better description, it kinda sounds as if he's about to throw up :lol
By that point, Nafaryus is pretty pissed that not only does he think Gabriel is trying to overthrow him, but he's also making googly eyes with his daughter. The delivery sounds of that of an angry man. I'm sure if Portnoy were still in the band, he would have pushed to growl that section.
And John is a MUCH stronger personality than I think most people realize. He has a laid back, easy going demeanor. But make no mistake about the fact that he has ALWAYS had his say in this band.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LHFswk8K3o (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LHFswk8K3o)
Here's the 2nd Trailer. Is this what the second video was supposed to be?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LHFswk8K3o (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LHFswk8K3o)
Here's the 2nd Trailer. Is this what the second video was supposed to be?
Interesting. I think this one is better than the first. Also, the world tour will continue into 2017!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LHFswk8K3o (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LHFswk8K3o)No, the second video (of the two on the website) was originally supposed to be the performance video of The Gift of Music.
Here's the 2nd Trailer. Is this what the second video was supposed to be?
Just wondering ichangeworld tour will go to Mexico and South America and then back around thru Europe and then back to the US and if it does, would they do the same tour with just TA or a varied set list. I was hoping for a varied set list if they came to Atlanta later in the year or early 2017.
JP said in a recent interview for a brazilian magazine, Roadiecrew, that the show's format won't change wherever they play in TA tour.Did he happen to mention if there will be a South American tour? (I'm from Argentina, so I'm interested).
JP said in a recent interview for a brazilian magazine, Roadiecrew, that the show's format won't change wherever they play in TA tour.Did he happen to mention if there will be a South American tour? (I'm from Argentina, so I'm interested).
Faythe wore proper ear protection. Carol did not wear her safety goggles. Don't be like Carol.
No, it's older than that.Faythe wore proper ear protection. Carol did not wear her safety goggles. Don't be like Carol.
This is so a Direct TV commercial. :lol
OH! I can't place it.......
OH! I can't place it.......
Neither could Carol.
True story.OH! I can't place it.......
Neither could Carol.
I see that they decided to scrap Xander flying on a raven :lol
Hi, Sebastian!Thanks!
The interviewer only asked him about a brazilian tour and he answered that there will be one, without mention any dates. So I imagine that there will be another South American Tour, like it's happening the last 10 years. I suppose (JP didn't say that too) maybe that it will be in a fewer cities as the usual, like they're doing in Europe now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7sLmlhPZ9U&ebc=ANyPxKr5GsosIX-qL3Y8LhlR_LPj5PMdYxJOtW00WE9rbgs_epagXVCTxT1YVo7xdYc3GEeFyGjfnD0iPx6rgsg1jri_0UKcrgThanks as well! I've been learning some stuff on the album, so this one was very useful - wether because I was playing some riffs the wrong way, or because I was playing other ones the right way.
JP showing us some riffs from the Astonishing.
As much as I love Green Day - I think they milked American Idiot . I hope Dream Theater just don't milk The Astonishing for the next few years.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wRE3VT8tvM
Amazing tone !!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7sLmlhPZ9U&ebc=ANyPxKr5GsosIX-qL3Y8LhlR_LPj5PMdYxJOtW00WE9rbgs_epagXVCTxT1YVo7xdYc3GEeFyGjfnD0iPx6rgsg1jri_0UKcrg
JP showing us some riffs from the Astonishing.
After listening to TA non-stop for like a month, putting it away for a couple weeks, and coming back to it in the last few days, I apparently have come around to now liking The Walking Shadow, largely because JP's riffage in it is pretty freaking great. I can't say I still like some of the vocal melodies in it, but I do like the song now as a whole. How about that? :biggrin:
https://www.yahoo.com/music/dream-theater-live-out-sci-fi-fantasies-with-the-000938042.html (https://www.yahoo.com/music/dream-theater-live-out-sci-fi-fantasies-with-the-000938042.html)
Nice read and a confirmation about the earlier announced novel
https://www.yahoo.com/music/dream-theater-live-out-sci-fi-fantasies-with-the-000938042.html (https://www.yahoo.com/music/dream-theater-live-out-sci-fi-fantasies-with-the-000938042.html)
Nice read and a confirmation about the earlier announced novel
Do what they must of course, but ... there is a distinct danger that this will fall very, very flat on its face. A smartphone game, a novel, all for an album that frankly has received VERY mixed reviews.
https://www.yahoo.com/music/dream-theater-live-out-sci-fi-fantasies-with-the-000938042.html (https://www.yahoo.com/music/dream-theater-live-out-sci-fi-fantasies-with-the-000938042.html)
Nice read and a confirmation about the earlier announced novel
Do what they must of course, but ... there is a distinct danger that this will fall very, very flat on its face. A smartphone game, a novel, all for an album that frankly has received VERY mixed reviews.
Are the fans showing up to the shows? I think attendance is the best way to see how well liked this album is.
Here's my impression of how the album has been reviewed by listener base:
- Press: Very good reception in general, above average compared to most Dream Theater albums
- Hardcore fans: Very good reception, only time will tell if the strong reception holds
- Fans of the genre: Good reception, based on Prog Archives
- Non-fans: Mixed reception, based on AllMusic, Amazon, and Rate Your Music
Obviously this is far from scientific and I probably got something completely wrong, but for what it's worth, that's my speculation.
(https://i65.tinypic.com/ndkc28.png)
so mixed
I find that Wiki page really disingenuous frankly. It cherry-picked the nice ones, and completely disregard whole sites altogether.
Still got an 80 on metacritic which should take into account the negative as well?
I don't know what is considered a good score on metacritic though.
I find that Wiki page really disingenuous frankly. It cherry-picked the nice ones, and completely disregard whole sites altogether.
It's even more grand to suggest the opposite.
2. Wikipedia does not allow for ratings from sites like Rate Your Music to be listed in those review blocks. They only want formal press reviews.
It's even more grand to suggest the opposite.
How so? By default, unless one has good reason to believe otherwise, one should assume that there is no difference in demographic between DT fans who go to concerts and DT fans who rate an album on Sputnik and RYM.
It's even more grand to suggest the opposite.
How so? By default, unless one has good reason to believe otherwise, one should assume that there is no difference in demographic between DT fans who go to concerts and DT fans who rate an album on Sputnik and RYM.
And how do we know that the people who rate DT albums on Sput/RYM are mostly DT fans? Oh wait, we don't. Both sites are increasingly prone to troll ratings and is often a place to vent for negative opinions. I wouldn't class the clusters of people who gave TA the lowest score on RYM 'DT fans', that's just not very likely.
And that is problematic, to say the least. Official press ratings have their own bias; they need to maintain their stream of pre-release material, so they can't afford to be honest in many cases.
EDIT: In particular I find it weird that it would allow Metacritic, which has an entirely arbitrary accumulation and weighting scheme.
I actually agree with you that it would be very helpful to be able to include RYM and other public scores. I'm honestly not sure why those sorts of things are frowned upon. :lol
By default, unless one has good reason to believe otherwise, one should assume that there is no difference in demographic between DT fans who go to concerts and DT fans who rate an album on Sputnik and RYM.Both groups may come from the same demographic, but that is not the same as saying both groups are the same group.
RYM and Sputnik have rated DT albums normally in the past, much like DTF rates them. Again, unless you have a compelling reason for why this would be different for TA, one must assume the demographic of voters is the same as with previous albums.
It's unfair to count a full play of TA as 29 and a full play of I&W as 8.OK, fair point. Still, you can think of it this way:
If we want to measure the importance the songs are given in the concerts, we should also worry about the time spent playing the songs.
By default, unless one has good reason to believe otherwise, one should assume that there is no difference in demographic between DT fans who go to concerts and DT fans who rate an album on Sputnik and RYM.That's an absolutely bonkers claim. For a start, a lot of people rate things on those sites who are NOT fans. I rate absolutely tons of albums for bands that I'm not a fan of. If I listen to an album, I'll rate it.
BTW, I can't unhear the following: "Arhys time is running out, what will your decision be, if you still have any doubt, think about Mangini...".
I mean, even knowing the lyrics, I still don't hear "Evangeline" in that :lol
Burning rolls
Secret sauce
Moment of betrayal
I fucking love the secret sauce :metal
I fucking love the secret sauce :metal
I've read this about you in the Lonely Hearts Club Thread.
Had a gig last night in a tiny local club in one of the smaller Serbian cities, so to speak. At some point before we went on stage, Lord Nafaryus started playing from the PA. I don' think anyone knew what it was, but I lost my shit. :metal
Even as someone who really likes the new album, I would prefer they just focus on the music and not dwell on the TA universe in other ways than the album as presented.
Even as someone who really likes the new album, I would prefer they just focus on the music and not dwell on the TA universe in other ways than the album as presented.
Absolutely this. And it has nothing to do with the album. I listen to DT for new music (the listen implies that).
Wow, it would be really cool if Jordan and I could sit down just together alone, without anybody else there, and just write this music
When I was brought into the band, I was brought in because John Petrucci really needed to have a writing partner. He was basically doing it by himself, for the most part
You keep getting hung up on credit. That's not what I'm talking about.
If Myung and Mangini wrote their own parts, then they should get writers credit.
If Myung and Mangini wrote their own parts, then they should get writers credit.
So Ringo Starr should be given writers credit in all Beatles songs? Marco Minnemann, Guthrie Govan in Steven Wilson's solo albums?
Having gone through this (as many others have I'm sure), the idea of credit on songwriting is slippery. But we aren't even talking about credit. We are talking about contributions and working relationships.
The most important part is usually the spark. Coming up with the hook or theme or intro or big riff. And then you can have somebody that is a co-writer. They can be an equal or just 2nd strongest writer. This usually adds some magic that neither person can get alone.
Now you had MP that acted as a sounding board / arranger. And what I always hear about Myung is he comes up with some great parts, but isn't great at completing a song by himself. Well, those are important contributions nevertheless. Arguing about credit as to whether that drum part is worth 5% or 10% is purely for the financial part of the arrangement. And it might have been 5% of the perspiration, but some could argue that it took the song from great to classic.
But they are talking about cutting Mangini and Myung out of the majority of the creation process. And LaBrie nearly from the beginning. The first thing I recall during the MP exit was how he was holding back everybody from contributing and now they could finally be a real band again. Where Myung could give his one crazy part and they'd accept it instead of scolding him for not having it more developed. But then I read that not only are they not doing that, but it seems even less band oriented than before. And it doesn't sound like it will be that way for just this one album. That doesn't sound promising.
Still loving the music but I can't connect with the story at all.
Still loving the music but I can't connect with the story at all.
The story is okay imo, but I don't really care about it. I listen to music for the music, if I wanted a top notch story, I'd watch a series or read a book. :tup
Songwriting credit almost always goes to the person or persons who wrote the melodies and/or arrangement. Things like solos, fills, etc. are, in simple terms, considered embellishment, and not part of the songwriting process from a credit standpoint, in most cases. Like it or not, it's the way it usually is.Songwriting credit is left up to those that decide the credit. Anything other than appropriate credit discourages participation.
Yes, but what is appropriate? Most people don't consider coming up with drum parts writing-credits-worthy.Songwriting credit almost always goes to the person or persons who wrote the melodies and/or arrangement. Things like solos, fills, etc. are, in simple terms, considered embellishment, and not part of the songwriting process from a credit standpoint, in most cases. Like it or not, it's the way it usually is.Songwriting credit is left up to those that decide the credit. Anything other than appropriate credit discourages participation.
If Myung and Mangini wrote their own parts, then they should get writers credit.
So Ringo Starr should be given writers credit in all Beatles songs? Marco Minnemann, Guthrie Govan in Steven Wilson's solo albums?
If they write their own parts? Of course.
These types of arguments have broken up a LOT of great bands. I wish more of them would split the $ diplomatically.
These types of arguments have broken up a LOT of great bands. I wish more of them would split the $ diplomatically.
U2. Split the money 25%. Same 4 guys since 1976.
These types of arguments have broken up a LOT of great bands. I wish more of them would split the $ diplomatically.
U2. Split the money 25%. Same 4 guys since 1976.
Rush did the same thing for 41 years with the same three guys splitting their cut evenly every time, no matter what.
I can understand someone not wanting to do that if they are doing all or most of the heavy lifting from a songwriting standpoint, however.
These types of arguments have broken up a LOT of great bands. I wish more of them would split the $ diplomatically.
U2. Split the money 25%. Same 4 guys since 1976.
From what we've been told, it isn't that Myung has no ideas, but that his ideas are more sections and parts than fully developed ideas.
Mangini, I'm at a loss for what his writing process is. They made a big deal out of jamming ideas of each other during the drummer auditions, so it would be hard to say he can't be there adding to the spark. Why, as Jordan put it, minimize the writing sources?
Not sharing credit with someone who didn't actually write the song =/= douchebaggery.
If Myung and Mangini wrote their own parts, then they should get writers credit.
So Ringo Starr should be given writers credit in all Beatles songs? Marco Minnemann, Guthrie Govan in Steven Wilson's solo albums?
If they write their own parts? Of course.
Yeah, I agree with that. For me, the chord progressions and melodies are no more important than the drumming beats or rhythmic accents. The notion of the melody being the most important part of a composition is silly to me. Whoever contributed a written part should get credited for writing (just as you'd expect whoever contributed a recorded part should get credited for recording).
The credit option is an interesting angle.
But for the record, my original comment had nothing to do with royalties and songwriting percentages. It was the idea that there seems to be an exuberance for purposefully cutting the rest of the band out of the process. From what we've been told, it isn't that Myung has no ideas, but that his ideas are more sections and parts than fully developed ideas. Mangini, I'm at a loss for what his writing process is. They made a big deal out of jamming ideas of each other during the drummer auditions, so it would be hard to say he can't be there adding to the spark. Why, as Jordan put it, minimize the writing sources?
Depends. In a lot of bands, if a drummer comes in with a cool beat, and a song ends up being written around it, the drummer gets writing credit. If, say, the guitarist comes in with the song, and the drummer creates a beat after the fact that fits the song, the drummer usually does not get credit. That is how it usually works.Flawless logic right there. I also think that's exactly how it works.
In any case, when I see them in May, I am going to try to do my best to remember to discuss this with them and try to get more of a handle on the nuts and bolts of their writing process, and will share whatever I can about whatever I learn.
So if I write a full song, but get sessionists to "write" their parts becausr I know nothing about drums or bass, they should get songwruting credit?If you 'know nothing' about drums/bass, and those were part of the song, then you didn't write a full song - you wrote the majority of the song, at most. So yeah, sessionists should get songwriting credit (from my perspective).
I think I would only be amenable to "arranged by"
For the first time in DT history watch a band member eating and drinking for 9 minutes straight !!! :rollin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NnLo-ihSF8
There's a difference between adding/writing a part of a song, and writing a part of the song that is crucial and distinctive enough to the song to be a part of the copyrighted composition.
Drums rarely count (in the legal sense) because their purpose is largely to keep the beat of a song, and is not usually an essential and unique enough component. Does Phil Rudd deserve a writing credit for playing a basic 4/4 beat to every single AC/DC song? Where do we draw the line? Even though that's a more extreme case, I'd say there are very few times the drums count for enough to deserve credit, regardless of how intricate or difficult they may be.
Copyright is really about who created the bare essence of a song. Whether DT want to credit the whole out of diplomacy, or credit people individually, doesn't make a difference to me. We know every member of the band has contributed their own part to the album.
For those in the know, how does it work for some talentless ho like Britney Spears who has never written a note but makes millions? Is the contract based around "performer" royalties, or what?
For those in the know, how does it work for some talentless ho like Britney Spears who has never written a note but makes millions? Is the contract based around "performer" royalties, or what?
In many cases (especially in pop) the songs are written by an individual or group, then sold to the artist for a 1 time fee at which point the writers lose all rights to future royalties.
Why would they do that? Seems like there's a large potential of money to be made by not selling your rights to a pop artist.
For those in the know, how does it work for some talentless ho like Britney Spears who has never written a note but makes millions? Is the contract based around "performer" royalties, or what?
In many cases (especially in pop) the songs are written by an individual or group, then sold to the artist for a 1 time fee at which point the writers lose all rights to future royalties.
Why would they do that? Seems like there's a large potential of money to be made by not selling your rights to a pop artist.
For those in the know, how does it work for some talentless ho like Britney Spears who has never written a note but makes millions? Is the contract based around "performer" royalties, or what?
In many cases (especially in pop) the songs are written by an individual or group, then sold to the artist for a 1 time fee at which point the writers lose all rights to future royalties.
Why would they do that? Seems like there's a large potential of money to be made by not selling your rights to a pop artist.
Some of that is just knowing somebody (or somebody that knows a dude that knows a chick)
The Mangini gives no fucks about anyone or anything.
He just eats.
That's the dream.
The Mangini gives no fucks about anyone or anything.
He just eats.
That's the dream.
In French eating means "manger" spelled "mangeh" and who he eats may be called mangini :P.
A "Making Of" video now up on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65nGsTQSnv8
It's about the making of the visuals for the tour, rather than the recording of the album.
A "Making Of" video now up on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65nGsTQSnv8
It's about the making of the visuals for the tour, rather than the recording of the album.
I don't think that was meant to be released yet as it is now private.
A "Making Of" video now up on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65nGsTQSnv8
It's about the making of the visuals for the tour, rather than the recording of the album.
I don't think that was meant to be released yet as it is now private.
You're right! I must have been lucky to watch it before they set it as private.
Oh well, I'm sure it will be released in due course. I'll not spoil the surprise. :)
For the first time in DT history watch a band member eating and drinking for 9 minutes straight !!! :rollin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NnLo-ihSF8
:dunno: It's very distracting, but appears to be delicious :rollin Once you can actually hear some of the other questions and answers, it's very informative. :tupFor the first time in DT history watch a band member eating and drinking for 9 minutes straight !!! :rollin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NnLo-ihSF8
What is that thing ? Ice Cream and chocolate ?!
Wonder where James and John M. were...James is to John Petrucci's left. At 9:27 he is asked a question, so you can see him there.
Looks like the video is there again, but at this link now: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZcT5ECISN4Great video, thanks. It looks like it was a lot of work to create the visuals and silhouettes (they even had the kids dressed as Xander and Faythe) - to think I was bitching about the visuals in the trailer in January.
Even though I still find hearing the chorus only once in The Road to Revolution to be a major tease, I find that when combining it with 2285 Entr'acte and Moment of Betrayal as a 3-song run, it works really well. That moment in 2285 Entr'acte when the The Road to Revolution melody is playing by the strings is freaking stellar (around 1:15, I think).
I was confined in the hospital for a week and TA was in my regular rotation to keep me from being bored. Yesterday I played it out loud because I was alone in the room, and I found myself singing along to the whole musical. :rollin Looks like I already memorized this album by heart.
I was confined in the hospital for a week and TA was in my regular rotation to keep me from being bored. Yesterday I played it out loud because I was alone in the room, and I found myself singing along to the whole musical. :rollin Looks like I already memorized this album by heart.
Yikes! Hope you are feeling better.
I am home now, thanks. :) I had a nasty case of ischiorectal abscess.
I am home now, thanks. :) I had a nasty case of ischiorectal abscess.
Man that sucks, good to know that you are well now. :tup Those things can spread real fast.
I am home now, thanks. :) I had a nasty case of ischiorectal abscess.
Man that sucks, good to know that you are well now. :tup Those things can spread real fast.
Yikes, had something very similar myself in the fall. Needed surgery, but luckily it was outpatient for me, but man that is such an area that really sucks to get surgery
I'm really into Act of Faythe now. Really good ballad, with nice vocals in the vein of Anna Lee with Lifting Shadows.
I'm really into Act of Faythe now. Really good ballad, with nice vocals in the vein of Anna Lee with Lifting Shadows.¨
Yea, I really enjoy Act of Faythe. It wasn't a song that hit me at first, but after many listens I have grown to really like it.This. I guess I couldn't get over 'my music player' part but rest of the chorus is beautiful.
Yea, I really enjoy Act of Faythe. It wasn't a song that hit me at first, but after many listens I have grown to really like it.This. I guess I couldn't get over 'my music player' part but rest of the chorus is beautiful.
That part brought tears to my eyes on first listen. So, to each one's own, I guess.My first listen I kind of giggled at that line, but now it's actually one of my favorite parts. Sure the lyrics are cheesy, but it's really awesome.Yea, I really enjoy Act of Faythe. It wasn't a song that hit me at first, but after many listens I have grown to really like it.This. I guess I couldn't get over 'my music player' part but rest of the chorus is beautiful.
That part brought tears to my eyes on first listen. So, to each one's own, I guess.My first listen I kind of giggled at that line, but now it's actually one of my favorite parts. Sure the lyrics are cheesy, but it's really awesome.Yea, I really enjoy Act of Faythe. It wasn't a song that hit me at first, but after many listens I have grown to really like it.This. I guess I couldn't get over 'my music player' part but rest of the chorus is beautiful.
Listening to my abridged CD today, wow...the hi-hat and cymbals...yea they're pretty flat. Didn't notice that until I read it here. Are the HD tracks any better?
What do you mean flat? They are a bit low in the mix.
I haven't been on in a few weeks, so this may have been spoken about... but can we give some love to the solo in A Better Life, one of the best on the album and seems a little underrated.
Wonderful solo.
I haven't been on in a few weeks, so this may have been spoken about... but can we give some love to the solo in A Better Life, one of the best on the album and seems a little underrated.Yup. Very good. There is a thread for that song in particular. The whole song is top notch.
Wonderful solo.
...but guess what's on right now ?
For me it's different. I adore the album, but I've listened to it only three times in full (even though I remember many moments off of it by heart). It's not because I can't find the time, it's just that I'm afraid of overplaying it. I have this fear with many other albums and I don't think I've listened to any one Dream Theater album in full for more than 10 times. Is this an unfounded fear?
For me it's different. I adore the album, but I've listened to it only three times in full (even though I remember many moments off of it by heart). It's not because I can't find the time, it's just that I'm afraid of overplaying it. I have this fear with many other albums and I don't think I've listened to any one Dream Theater album in full for more than 10 times. Is this an unfounded fear?I'm absolutely in fear of overplaying it. Which is why I'm actively trying to listen to other stuff. But sometimes I really want to listen to a particular track and I am unable to turn it off. Thankfully, I haven't become remotely sick of it yet. I wish I knew how often I'd listened to it. It has to be going on 100 or so I would think.
I never worry about overplaying something. If I love something enough that it makes me want to keep listening over and over, I listen over and over. Most of my favorite albums are ones I listened to to death, and they are still my favorites despite bludgeoning myself with them over and over and over... :lol
I never worry about overplaying something. If I love something enough that it makes me want to keep listening over and over, I listen over and over. Most of my favorite albums are ones I listened to to death, and they are still my favorites despite bludgeoning myself with them over and over and over... :lol
But what about the rule of diminishing returns when the mystery of the music is gone (i.e. when you remember everthing about it including the tiny intricacies)? Does that not apply?
BETTER TO SAVE THE MYSTERY THAN SURRENDER TO THE SECREEEEEET
But seriously, great music doesn't diminish once the mystery is gone. It remains enjoyable to listen to because it's good. Most of DT's older music still sounds as fresh and exciting to me as the first time I heard it over a decade ago, and I listened to basically nothing else at the time. :tup
I never worry about overplaying something. If I love something enough that it makes me want to keep listening over and over, I listen over and over. Most of my favorite albums are ones I listened to to death, and they are still my favorites despite bludgeoning myself with them over and over and over... :lolThis.
But seriously, great music doesn't diminish once the mystery is gone. It remains enjoyable to listen to because it's good. Most of DT's older music still sounds as fresh and exciting to me as the first time I heard it over a decade ago, and I listened to basically nothing else at the time. :tupAnd this.
I used to overplay music like crazy. It took me years before I could feel some songs again. It's such a weird thing, I don't know how to explain it. It never happened with Dream Theater, though.
I used to overplay music like crazy. It took me years before I could feel some songs again. It's such a weird thing, I don't know how to explain it. It never happened with Dream Theater, though.
I find that music that takes a few listens to really sink in and become favorites can't be overplayed.
Music that hits you immediately on the other hand often tends to be possible to overplay and get really tired of.
^All of that. "Overplaying" is generally not an issue. I mean, as new music comes out, the amount of spins I give a particular disk diminishes just because time is finite and I am spending some of that time on newer stuff. But that doesn't mean I like the album less. For example, Six Degrees is still my all time favorite DT album. When I listen to it, I enjoy it immensely. During that album cycle, I was obsessed with the album and listened to it nonstop. The fact that I listen to it less nowadays is not a factor of having overplayed it and its stature being diminished in my eyes. It is just a factor of DT having released seven more studio albums and several live releases since then, as well as all the other music that has been released since 2002.I never worry about overplaying something. If I love something enough that it makes me want to keep listening over and over, I listen over and over. Most of my favorite albums are ones I listened to to death, and they are still my favorites despite bludgeoning myself with them over and over and over... :lolThis.But seriously, great music doesn't diminish once the mystery is gone. It remains enjoyable to listen to because it's good. Most of DT's older music still sounds as fresh and exciting to me as the first time I heard it over a decade ago, and I listened to basically nothing else at the time. :tupAnd this.
I don't get the whole overplaying thing. Sometimes I get pretty obsessive about an album for a while so I listen absolutely loads. That obsession eventually wears off, and of course I only sometimes to listen to the album after that, but that doesn't mean I like it any less. Seems to me that forcing myself to listen to it less early on would eventually just end up with the same result in terms of total listens, and it terms of how much I like it, but I'd be making myself miserable forcing myself to not listen to it. So no thanks.
Where I do find that "overplaying" is a bit of an issue for me is with particular songs if I play them in isolation. For instance, I typically find that if I overplay a lead single from an album before the album has come out, I tend to subconsciously gloss over that song when playing the entire album rather than enjoying the song more fully in context of the album. I kinda did that with ATBOA and The Enemy Inside where I had played them a LOT before the albums came out, and then would gloss over them a bit initially once the albums finally came out. But as with any good song, I eventually really came to appreciate both of those on their own merits.
Made myself take a month or so without listening to the album so that I can listen with "fresh ears". I was a bit apprehensive as the hype isn't there any more, but i just listened to the whole thing and holy shit, it's just perfect.
It makes me sad that they'll likely never make anything like this again.
Do you think The Astonishing (or "The Gift Of Music") might get nominated for the Grammys next year? Do you think it could win?If it depends on its quality, of course! If it depends on its popularity, probably not.
Do you think The Astonishing (or "The Gift Of Music") might get nominated for the Grammys next year? Do you think it could win?If it depends on its quality, of course! If it depends on its popularity, probably not.
Do you think The Astonishing (or "The Gift Of Music") might get nominated for the Grammys next year? Do you think it could win?Don't think so, son.
Well, it gets my vote for album of the year. I don't need to hear anything else. :P Adele schmedele! Let's see her do an album like this!
I currently think The Astonishing is the best album of the millennium, let's see how it'll be after more months.
Seeing dparrott's profile picture made me remember being disappointed that the clock tower that is seen in the trailer and the live video for Machine Chatter never came into the story at all and plays no significance. It's featured a decent amount in the trailers and it's never mentioned.Not even in the video projetions during shows? I seem to remember (either in a trailer or in one live YouTube clip) that Xander was inside the clock tower (just like in his picture on the website), so I assumed the clock tower was maybe Arhys' home?
I just remember thinking it was gonna play a huge role.
The ADonishing
(https://orig00.deviantart.net/fd44/f/2016/092/a/e/dontheater_theasdonishing_by_cdrice-d9xfidb.jpg)
Seeing dparrott's profile picture made me remember being disappointed that the clock tower that is seen in the trailer and the live video for Machine Chatter never came into the story at all and plays no significance. It's featured a decent amount in the trailers and it's never mentioned.Not even in the video projetions during shows? I seem to remember (either in a trailer or in one live YouTube clip) that Xander was inside the clock tower (just like in his picture on the website), so I assumed the clock tower was maybe Arhys' home?
I just remember thinking it was gonna play a huge role.
(Having said that, I'm not sure if the tower is in Ravenskill or New Maineland)
Nice photoshop work. It took me some time to notice.The ADonishing
(https://orig00.deviantart.net/fd44/f/2016/092/a/e/dontheater_theasdonishing_by_cdrice-d9xfidb.jpg)
Anyone else a little confused over the distances involved in the GNE? Nafaryus talks about "the far off reaches of the land" and so forth but then it seems Faythe can zip back and forth between the palace and Ravenskill like it's nothing.
Yes, but on the third day she is:Anyone else a little confused over the distances involved in the GNE? Nafaryus talks about "the far off reaches of the land" and so forth but then it seems Faythe can zip back and forth between the palace and Ravenskill like it's nothing.
Well, she does take a while to get there. From ALLB to Ravenskill, it turns from night to day.
Yes, but on the third day she is:Anyone else a little confused over the distances involved in the GNE? Nafaryus talks about "the far off reaches of the land" and so forth but then it seems Faythe can zip back and forth between the palace and Ravenskill like it's nothing.
Well, she does take a while to get there. From ALLB to Ravenskill, it turns from night to day.
-In her palace during "A New Beginning"
-In Gabriel's hideout (which is probably in Ravenskill) during "The Road To Revolution"*
-In her palace again during "Begin Again"
-In Heaven's Cove during "The Walking Shadow" et al.
So, yeah, she travels a lot al by herself in just one day, I think.
(* that's if Faythe and Gabriel actually meet, and are not just talking on the phone :P)
I have absolutely no idea what that means.
I have absolutely no idea what that means.
It's possible that she is travelling using that hovering thing you see at the end of the LN live video.Oh yeah, you're right.
Anyone else a little confused over the distances involved in the GNE? Nafaryus talks about "the far off reaches of the land" and so forth but then it seems Faythe can zip back and forth between the palace and Ravenskill like it's nothing.
There's a word that rarely exists to describe a DT album....and that is 'fun'.
There's a word that rarely exists to describe a DT album....and that is 'fun'.
IMO that's not right. Name 3 DT releases that aren't fun. That's one of their main qualities for me.
There's a word that rarely exists to describe a DT album....and that is 'fun'.
IMO that's not right. Name 3 DT releases that aren't fun. That's one of their main qualities for me.
SC and BC&SL.....mostly dark and depressing. I guess I'd throw in Six Degrees.....most of the tracks are musically fantastic, but the topics deal with depression.
TA....I laughed aloud and smiled at various points. That was a different experience. After all, there's nothing about partying, or cruisin' 80 mph down the highway with buddies, or raising hell, or having good times in their catalogue.
There's a word that rarely exists to describe a DT album....and that is 'fun'.
IMO that's not right. Name 3 DT releases that aren't fun. That's one of their main qualities for me.
SC and BC&SL.....mostly dark and depressing. I guess I'd throw in Six Degrees.....most of the tracks are musically fantastic, but the topics deal with depression.
TA....I laughed aloud and smiled at various points. That was a different experience. After all, there's nothing about partying, or cruisin' 80 mph down the highway with buddies, or raising hell, or having good times in their catalogue.
SC is all fictional stories. I'd say that's pretty fun (like, TDEN is so incredibly silly it's hard to take the lyrics seriously).
BC&SL deals with dark topics, but I'd say the music is pretty uplifting actually.
I guess I don't associate something being fun with whether it is dark or happy. If something is fun, it means I enjoy it for me.
There's a word that rarely exists to describe a DT album....and that is 'fun'.
IMO that's not right. Name 3 DT releases that aren't fun. That's one of their main qualities for me.
Awake is my favorite DT album, but I'd hardly call it fun. An album doesn't need to be fun to be great.
It's a major element I've personally felt is largely lacking since MP left, but TA brought it back with songs like Three Days.
I'd say the same (minus some of the greatness) for ADTOE and DT12.
Awake is my favorite DT album, but I'd hardly call it fun. An album doesn't need to be fun to be great.
I don't think anyone was arguing an album had to be fun to be great.
Although Awake, DT12 and ADTOE are all ranked right at the bottom for me, so maybe that's not entirely a coincidence here.
It's a major element I've personally felt is largely lacking since MP left, but TA brought it back with songs like Three Days.I'd say the same (minus some of the greatness) for ADTOE and DT12.
I don't understand. BitS, BAI, EM and StR among quite a few other songs (LNF, FAS, TLG, BtV, AftR and IT) are extremely fun sounding to me. You say "there's often a playful element to the music, and you know they're enjoying making music" and that is certainly present throughout all 3 MM-era albums.
I don't know what about BAI would be considered fun, it's quite serious.
Similar with STR.
MARRIAGE ANALOGY TIME! SFAM was like a new couple who can't wait to screw each other all over the house and have a lot of fun. ADTOE is a married couple of 15 years with 3 kids organizing a date night a month in advance where an uncle babysits so they can go out and eat at their favourite dependable restaurant and talk about their day at work, and are home by 9pm because they start to worry about the kids having too much sugar before bed.
We definitely have very different concepts of fun, because to me you're mostly describing proggy, which to me is anti-fun. :lol "Jovial" is not a word that comes to mind with BAI.
I think the analogy works well enough, as far as a silly analogy goes. SFAM had a new DT member / major composer, for a completely new writing dynamic that was fresh and exciting, with so many new ideas. ADTOE was a band down a member, but was otherwise the same lineup they'd had for over a decade at that point. To me it sounded like they were going through the motions to continue. All imo of course! I think we're at the point of "agree to disagree". :tup
Of course, his opinion is still valid.Perhaps. But while maybe valid, it is still worthy of being mocked and marginalized.
I have to stop listening to albums at the edge of ear pain
We definitely have very different concepts of fun, because to me you're mostly describing proggy, which to me is anti-fun. :lol "Jovial" is not a word that comes to mind with BAI.
I think the analogy works well enough, as far as a silly analogy goes. SFAM had a new DT member / major composer, for a completely new writing dynamic that was fresh and exciting, with so many new ideas. ADTOE was a band down a member, but was otherwise the same lineup they'd had for over a decade at that point. To me it sounded like they were going through the motions to continue. All imo of course! I think we're at the point of "agree to disagree". :tup
Proggy is anti-fun? Ok...
That's like saying a comedy movie can't be funny just because you don't find humor in it. :lol
That's like saying a comedy movie can't be funny just because you don't find humor in it. :lol
You obviously haven't seen any of Adam Sandler's recent output.. :P
FTFYThat's like saying a comedy movie can't be funny just because you don't find humor in it. :lol
You obviously haven't seen any of Adam Sandler's recent output.. :P
Why would ANYONE want to do that? :lol
FTFE (Everyone)That's like saying a comedy movie can't be funny just because you don't find humor in it. :lol
You obviously haven't seen any of Adam Sandler's recent output.. :P
Why would ANYONE want to do that? :lol
We definitely have very different concepts of fun, because to me you're mostly describing proggy, which to me is anti-fun. :lol "Jovial" is not a word that comes to mind with BAI.
I think the analogy works well enough, as far as a silly analogy goes. SFAM had a new DT member / major composer, for a completely new writing dynamic that was fresh and exciting, with so many new ideas. ADTOE was a band down a member, but was otherwise the same lineup they'd had for over a decade at that point. To me it sounded like they were going through the motions to continue. All imo of course! I think we're at the point of "agree to disagree". :tup
Proggy is anti-fun? Ok...
I don't get that either. That's like saying a comedy movie can't be funny just because you don't find humor in it. :lol
It's more like finding solving complex math problems fun.
We definitely have very different concepts of fun, because to me you're mostly describing proggy, which to me is anti-fun. :lol "Jovial" is not a word that comes to mind with BAI.
I think the analogy works well enough, as far as a silly analogy goes. SFAM had a new DT member / major composer, for a completely new writing dynamic that was fresh and exciting, with so many new ideas. ADTOE was a band down a member, but was otherwise the same lineup they'd had for over a decade at that point. To me it sounded like they were going through the motions to continue. All imo of course! I think we're at the point of "agree to disagree". :tup
Proggy is anti-fun? Ok...
I don't get that either. That's like saying a comedy movie can't be funny just because you don't find humor in it. :lol
That comparison would assume that prog is supposed to be fun. It's more like finding solving complex math problems fun. Some people will find fun in it, but it doesn't mean that solving complex math problems is generally considered a fun activity. :P
But you're just using the generic, and often incorrect, assumption that all prog is complex. :P
But you're just using the generic, and often incorrect, assumption that all prog is complex. :P
I know, I was basing it on Enigmachine's description of what makes BAI fun, some of which to me is the stereotype prog stuff.
And it's more fun for me this way. :P
I have never smiled as much as I have with this release. There's a word that rarely exists to describe a DT album....and that is 'fun'.
Had not Portnoy left, I think DT11 or DT12 could have been concept albums, without waiting for DT13. Now for sure the next one won't be a concept and most likely the next after that, but from DT16 onwards I don't see no strict rule that forbids them to do another concept if they want to...
Also, for how much JLB shines on this, I wish I didn't feel he was breathing on the back of my neck during most of the gentler parts.
Also, for how much JLB shines on this, I wish I didn't feel he was breathing on the back of my neck during most of the gentler parts.
JLB has always had that breathy voice during ballads. Especially post SFAM.
Had not Portnoy left, I think DT11 or DT12 could have been concept albums, without waiting for DT13. Now for sure the next one won't be a concept and most likely the next after that, but from DT16 onwards I don't see no strict rule that forbids them to do another concept if they want to...
I think I remember MP talking in an interview or something about their original plans for DT11 before he left... it was going to be a concept album, and the live tour would be a static setlist. Set 1 would be the concept album in full, and set 2 would be the 12 steps suite in full.
" A long long time ago.. . . I can still remember how the music used to make me smile..."..........
I remember from the show that "THE EMPIRE IS OBEDIENT TO YOU BECAUSE YOU ARE OBEDIENT TO THE EMPIRE." thing.
Haha. I'm joking. That's American Pie. :biggrin: :biggrin:What?? I dont know that?? Hahahaha :omg: :lol
This is what Nafaryus says at the beginning of the show:Thank you man !!! :tup :tup :tup
Do not be deceived by those who speak of new wonders born of “sound,” as this is the work of devilish malcontents whose search for wisdom will result only in ignorance. The NOMACS have secured you just as your daily work has defined you. FEAR and BEWARE the destabilization of our most hallowed traditions that have kept you safe and serene.
The Empire toils for you so that you may toil for the Empire.
THE EMPIRE IS OBEDIENT TO YOU BECAUSE YOU ARE OBEDIENT TO THE EMPIRE.
The Empire protects you because you protect the Empire.
Are you sure there's a third version? I have the longer version (2:04), with the narration.
What's Lord Nafaryus' first name ?:clap:
Neil.
Neil before Nafaryus
I finally got around to listening to this album and I'm really enjoying it so far :metal I am going to see them at Radio City on Saturday so I'm trying to familiarize myself with the new material as much as possible. Favorite tracks so far are A Better Life and Lord Nafaryus.
What's Lord Nafaryus' first name ?:clap:
Neil.
Neil before Nafaryus
..and then... "MAH MUSIC PLAYAH!"??? Really? That's worse than The Best of Times right there.
LaBrie's laughter in 3 days. Makes me think of Scut Farkus.
Just realized lately how much I like the drumming in ONW. Relatively simple, but spot on.Agreeed. Mathias's drum cover really helped me understand the nuances of MM's playing on the track. It fits the music
Just realized lately how much I like the drumming in ONW. Relatively simple, but spot on.Agreeed. Mathias's drum cover really helped me understand the nuances of MM's playing on the track. It fits the music
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30f3B3c_cbM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30f3B3c_cbM)
Just realized lately how much I like the drumming in ONW. Relatively simple, but spot on.
Still think it could of been better if they had different singers do each character seriously how are we suppose to tell when faythe is singing lol thank god they have an site the gives a nice detail of each song
Still think it could of been better if they had different singers do each character seriously how are we suppose to tell when faythe is singing lol thank god they have an site the gives a nice detail of each song
JLB uses a different vocal delivery when it is Faythe. It is noticeable in the Ravenskill conversation between Faythe and Arhys.
Still think it could of been better if they had different singers do each character seriously how are we suppose to tell when faythe is singing lol thank god they have an site the gives a nice detail of each song
JLB uses a different vocal delivery when it is Faythe. It is noticeable in the Ravenskill conversation between Faythe and Arhys.
Still think it could of been better if they had different singers do each character seriously how are we suppose to tell when faythe is singing lol thank god they have an site the gives a nice detail of each song
JLB uses a different vocal delivery when it is Faythe. It is noticeable in the Ravenskill conversation between Faythe and Arhys.
Plus Faythe has one of the most prominent musical themes attached to her. Remember that music was written first based on the script, and lyrical arrangement was done last.
Great choice of song to go with too.
Great choice of song to go with too.
Agreed! It's one of my favorites.
Great choice of song to go with too.
Agreed! It's one of my favorites.
Definitely one of my favourites from the album, and I think it's also one of the songs that works best out of the context of the whole. The lyrics aren't too specific, it musically feels self contained, and it's a strong song, instantly kicking off with a great riff, has a catchy chorus, and a killer guitar solo.
I'm interested to see what they choose to do for the video, whether it's just them in a room performing, or whether they'll include some of the animation again.
Did they film live footage of the band performing the song for the music video? I thought I saw someone else say that...
Did they film live footage of the band performing the song for the music video? I thought I saw someone else say that...
I think they're just going to use some fans' cell-phone videos.
Did they film live footage of the band performing the song for the music video? I thought I saw someone else say that...
I think they're just going to use some fans' cell-phone videos.
:rollin
Great choice of song to go with too.
Agreed! It's one of my favorites.
Definitely one of my favourites from the album, and I think it's also one of the songs that works best out of the context of the whole. The lyrics aren't too specific, it musically feels self contained, and it's a strong song, instantly kicking off with a great riff, has a catchy chorus, and a killer guitar solo.
I'm interested to see what they choose to do for the video, whether it's just them in a room performing, or whether they'll include some of the animation again.
It'll probably be the same as The Looking Glass with some minor animations included. It would be great if they could get a couple of actors to play Faythe and Gabriel in the video.
The song itself completely reminds me of Six Degrees (About to Crash & Reprise). It has a good upbeat feel to it.
Great choice of song to go with too.
Agreed! It's one of my favorites.
Definitely one of my favourites from the album, and I think it's also one of the songs that works best out of the context of the whole. The lyrics aren't too specific, it musically feels self contained, and it's a strong song, instantly kicking off with a great riff, has a catchy chorus, and a killer guitar solo.
I'm interested to see what they choose to do for the video, whether it's just them in a room performing, or whether they'll include some of the animation again.
It'll probably be the same as The Looking Glass with some minor animations included. It would be great if they could get a couple of actors to play Faythe and Gabriel in the video.
The song itself completely reminds me of Six Degrees (About to Crash & Reprise). It has a good upbeat feel to it.
This was never a top song for me from the album, although I do enjoy it, but it definitely has a good upbeat feel plus seeing it live was awesome because it was at the point int he concert where people finally stood and got to rock out so that has added some more likes from me for this song. I do think it's a good choice for a music video too, actually has some marketability to people outside of the prog metal genre.
I was at the Cinct show last night. Great show. I really hope they have another US tour. That album took a while to grow on me. I'd love another chance to see it.I was there as well. While the album worked out really well for me in my first few listens, hearing the whole thing live really gave me a new appreciation for it. To me, it sounds huge live and I love that. I'm hoping for another tour as well here in the States, because I would see it again without a doubt.
It'll probably be the same as The Looking Glass with some minor animations included. It would be great if they could get a couple of actors to play Faythe and Gabriel in the video.
The song itself completely reminds me of Six Degrees (About to Crash & Reprise). It has a good upbeat feel to it.
It'll probably be the same as The Looking Glass with some minor animations included. It would be great if they could get a couple of actors to play Faythe and Gabriel in the video.
The song itself completely reminds me of Six Degrees (About to Crash & Reprise). It has a good upbeat feel to it.
That's why I love the song so much. Totally has an ATC vibe about it.
But I'd steer well away from anything involving Faythe/Gabriel in the video, and just keep it really simple.
I thought the Looking Glass video was quite classy, aside from the overly literal interpretation of the song title the director did to come up with a girl holding a looking glass. :lol
It's such an epic song, I love it.
In terms of video, I wish they did something fun for a change. For example, recreate classic music videos, like Slash standing on the cliff during the November Rain solo, but this time JP with a top hat. Stuff like that would be so awesome.
Seeing as The Astonishing is maybe Dream Theater's least technical album overall and focuses way more on the actual songs than the shredding etc...
I'd *love* to read an interview with Mangini about his playing on the album to see if he talks about playing for the music this time around..
...or whether he bangs on about playing 19/5 again :biggrin:
I remember him making a huge post on FB where he talked about one snare roll in like three paragraphs. I really doubt playing for music is the case with him ever. :lol Music is just numbers to him.
I remember him making a huge post on FB where he talked about one snare roll in like three paragraphs. I really doubt playing for music is the case with him ever. :lol Music is just numbers to him.
Because knowledge and application of advanced music theory has never been used to complement the music. Never.
:facepalm:
I'm not saying Mangini doesn't do that but he almost exclusively talks about what he's doing numbers wise.
I've always thought of that as 'if you're extremely technical in your playing/thinking you can't be emotional with music' as bullshit.
I've always thought of that 'if you're extremely technical in your playing/thinking you can't be emotional with music' phrase as bullshit.
Assuming we're engaging in a general discussion about the matter, and not necessarily only talking about DT: I think the issue is often not that the technical player can't play with emotions at all, but rather he/she *prioritizes* the technical aspect over other considerations (such as whether it jives well with the rest of the music, creates a consistent whole). For example, I have known many a guitar player who was under the belief that a good, interesting guitar solo is created once one employs concepts such as modes (e.g. play in mixolydian) and sweeping etc.I will just add that, it is something that is still so subjective that it is hard to pin down even if one is regarded as having a ton of "taste" and "experience." As you rightly point it, it is very fuzzy.
It's a tempting mistake to make. Technicality can always be improved by applying yourself more, spending more time on the instrument. On the other hand, "flows well" and "integrates well into song" are concepts that are much harder to pin down and, frankly, require taste and experience.
Assuming we're engaging in a general discussion about the matter, and not necessarily only talking about DT: I think the issue is often not that the technical player can't play with emotions at all, but rather he/she *prioritizes* the technical aspect over other considerations (such as whether it jives well with the rest of the music, creates a consistent whole). For example, I have known many a guitar player who was under the belief that a good, interesting guitar solo is created once one employs concepts such as modes (e.g. play in mixolydian) and sweeping etc.I will just add that, it is something that is still so subjective that it is hard to pin down even if one is regarded as having a ton of "taste" and "experience." As you rightly point it, it is very fuzzy.
It's a tempting mistake to make. Technicality can always be improved by applying yourself more, spending more time on the instrument. On the other hand, "flows well" and "integrates well into song" are concepts that are much harder to pin down and, frankly, require taste and experience.
Hahaha...actually their backing tracks messed up at the Denver show.
Is it me, or this review is really disturbing and weird?
https://www.portlandmercury.com/music/2016/05/04/18007976/a-commentary-on-dream-theaters-magnum-opus
Is it me, or this review is really disturbing and weird?
https://www.portlandmercury.com/music/2016/05/04/18007976/a-commentary-on-dream-theaters-magnum-opus
That may be the most pointless review ever written. Ned needs to dial it back a little. No one can be that much of an insufferable di** in real life.
Nevermind, pretty sure Ned is.
I actually found the interview funny even though I love the album. You people need to take a :chill
I think Chino said it way back in the middle of the thread, but 1:22-1:38 in Lord Nafaryus is not the best bit I've heard on a DT album. It's just a bit too high for JLB
Someone mentioned recently that they have not yet shipped, but are supposed to later this month.
I think Chino said it way back in the middle of the thread, but 1:22-1:38 in Lord Nafaryus is not the best bit I've heard on a DT album. It's just a bit too high for JLB
Unfortunately this happens a lot with LaBrie on the last two albums. He pushes himself for no reason and it A) doesn't sound good AT ALL B) makes it hard for him to perform live. No idea why he can't just stay in the midrange where he shines the most. Most of ADTOE was great in this aspect.
I wouldn't mind a "tour journal" type video a la Wither...
But seeing as it's part of The Astonishing - it will probably be similar to The Gift Of Music.
Great video. How awesome would it be getting a live DVD with that footage quality?
Made me think of Wither.
I know there are varied opinions on The Astonishing as an album but i wanted to share something Mike Mangini told me last night at the meet and greet that really stuck to me. Pardon my ignorance if this has been shared before in this thread or in an interview. I told Mike and other band members that I did not listen to the album before the show and I wanted to feel that feeling I had when I first listened to dream theater. Mike told me that the album was made to be seen. That statement just stuck with me during the concert and I think I agree that this album was made to be seen and made the music and the concert so much better in my opinion.
Just finished another run of The Astonishing.
Whenever I have time to listen to music, I'm a binge listener... an album ends, the next one begins. Am I the only one that needs to let it all sink in for a moment after Astonishing ends, and revel in the beauty of what has just happened rather than going immediately on to some other music?
Makes you wonder what DT will do next time.
Will be weird releasing another album of 7 eight minute songs and a 20 minute epic.
Would like for them to get Nolly Getgood and make an album that actually sounds good in all aspects. :neverusethis:
Would like for them to get Nolly Getgood and make an album that actually sounds good in all aspects. :neverusethis:
What other albums has he engineered? I only know the Periphery stuff and I think he engineered the next Devin Townsend album..other than that, what else is out there engineered by him?
Oh man. What I would give for a TFTO-style four-sider from DT.Makes you wonder what DT will do next time.Would like them to do their own "Tales from Topographic Oceans" with a bunch of epics with unique structures and a loose concept. That or a more compact album in the vein of Train of Thought with song lengths of 3-8 mins.
Will be weird releasing another album of 7 eight minute songs and a 20 minute epic.
Saw the show in Oakland last night, and I just have to say: This album was really meant to be experienced live. The Youtube clips cannot do the performance and stage production justice at all.That's great to hear.
They are definitely planning on filming. They just have not decided on some logistics and other creative decisions. So, yes, anyone who has not been able to see this tour will still get to see it.
They are definitely planning on filming. They just have not decided on some logistics and other creative decisions. So, yes, anyone who has not been able to see this tour will still get to see it.Ah, fantastic! I had not heard that!
I don't think it has been officially stated, but I asked JP last night and he said it is definitely a yes.:happydance:
I assume they would use this first round of concerts to take note of their favorite venues, be it for the aesthetics or just for the sound quality.I hadn't thought about that, but that's actually an interesting thought. For northern California, I think they have definitely found a new favorite. This is the first time they have played the Fox Theater in Oakland, and it is a GORGEOUS theater--probably the nicest I have ever been in. Apparently, it sat abandoned for 43 years, and it was completely restored and reopened in 2009. JP and James both commented on how much they loved it, and James in particular said he likes it a LOT better than the Warfield in SF (which has been their go-to for years).
The Youtube clips cannot do the performance and stage production justice at all.
Great new live video for Our New World! This was recorded in Milan, and features footage from the 18th and 19th March shows. Damn, I squandered my chance to appear on a DT video getting tickets for the March 17th show :D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnLdx2FyNqg
I don't think it has been officially stated, but I asked JP last night and he said it is definitely a yes.
To those who have seen the show: Am I the only one who thought it was completely asinine for them to say goodnight after Our New World and then come out for the "encore" and do the last 2 tracks?
To those who have seen the show: Am I the only one who thought it was completely asinine for them to say goodnight after Our New World and then come out for the "encore" and do the last 2 tracks?
To those who have seen the show: Am I the only one who thought it was completely asinine for them to say goodnight after Our New World and then come out for the "encore" and do the last 2 tracks?
To those who have seen the show: Am I the only one who thought it was completely asinine for them to say goodnight after Our New World and then come out for the "encore" and do the last 2 tracks?
Everyone does the fake encore now. I personally hate it.
To those who have seen the show: Am I the only one who thought it was completely asinine for them to say goodnight after Our New World and then come out for the "encore" and do the last 2 tracks?
To those who have seen the show: Am I the only one who thought it was completely asinine for them to say goodnight after Our New World and then come out for the "encore" and do the last 2 tracks?
No, because:
(1) Like it or not, the "traditional" and expected concert structure is to include an encore, even though it is almost always completely pre-planned. And
(2) The reason they are doing that is because fans specifically requested that after the first show on the tour when they were not doing the "mock encore" and a good chunk of people in the audience were confused and didn't like that structure.
So, no, it's not "completely asinine." What is asinine is calling out the band for doing something the fans wanted in the first place.
To those who have seen the show: Am I the only one who thought it was completely asinine for them to say goodnight after Our New World and then come out for the "encore" and do the last 2 tracks?They only do it because people actually sit there and wait, and eventually call boo, if they don't. They did the first show or two of this tour without the whole charade, and many people were booing, some for real and some as a joke. You can't force every single concert goer to read the ticket and see that it says "The Astonishing Live" or check details online so they just added the stupid charade.
To those who have seen the show: Am I the only one who thought it was completely asinine for them to say goodnight after Our New World and then come out for the "encore" and do the last 2 tracks?
No, because:
(1) Like it or not, the "traditional" and expected concert structure is to include an encore, even though it is almost always completely pre-planned. And
(2) The reason they are doing that is because fans specifically requested that after the first show on the tour when they were not doing the "mock encore" and a good chunk of people in the audience were confused and didn't like that structure.
So, no, it's not "completely asinine." What is asinine is calling out the band for doing something the fans wanted in the first place.
Didn't mean any disrespect, just thought it was kind of odd
Sure was. They got the "play" feeling down perfect.
Pretty sure my fave vocal passage on TA is in MLF beginning with "Don't leave me now . . . ". There are a ton of others.
Pretty sure my fave vocal passage on TA is in MLF beginning with "Don't leave me now . . . ". There are a ton of others.Mine is :
Pretty sure my fave vocal passage on TA is in MLF beginning with "Don't leave me now . . . ". There are a ton of others.Mine is :
Gabriel, my son
I see the tide is turning
Can the Chosen One
Keep her fire burning?
I would trade my life
Just for one last moment
Use your gift, I beg
Make life begin again
Make life begin again!
Yum.
Pretty sure my fave vocal passage on TA is in MLF beginning with "Don't leave me now . . . ". There are a ton of others.The little flair he puts on "now" is awesome!
Pretty sure my fave vocal passage on TA is in MLF beginning with "Don't leave me now . . . ". There are a ton of others.
Has anyone else noticed the tiny fact that every other person in mentioned by name at some point,but Daryus and Xander are always just called sons?Xander is mentioned, in "The Path That Divides":
Has anyone else noticed the tiny fact that every other person is mentioned by name at some point,but Daryus and Xander are always just called sons?Xander is mentioned, in "The Path That Divides":
- By the Narrator, although not by his full name ('Confused and deathly afraid, X watched his hero be brave')
- By Daryus ('Well, you just threw your life away, along with Xander's dreams')
But yeah, Daryus is never mentioned, I think.
Xander's name is uttered in "A Tempting Offer" as well.
Xander's name is uttered in "A Tempting Offer" as well.
"and best of all, Xandar would be free" I think is the line
A Tempting Offer is one of my favorites off the album. The chord progression is so amazing.Agreed. I hate to keep repeating myself, but the 4 song run from Ravenskill through The X Aspect (excluding the NOMAC interlude as a "song") is my favorite part of the album. Those 4 are among the strongest on the album, and to have them back to back is just incredible.
Xander's name is uttered in "A Tempting Offer" as well.
"and best of all, Xandar would be free" I think is the line
A Tempting Offer is one of my favorites off the album. The chord progression is so amazing.Agreed. I hate to keep repeating myself, but the 4 song run from Ravenskill through The X Aspect (excluding the NOMAC interlude as a "song") is my favorite part of the album. Those 4 are among the strongest on the album, and to have them back to back is just incredible.
Having a twenty-one year old daughter, I absolutely love how James sings: "To think I didn't notice the way you looked at her! Now come down from your throne and let me bring you back to earth." The menace in his voice captures a doting father perfectly. :yarr
A Tempting Offer is one of my favorites off the album. The chord progression is so amazing.Agreed. I hate to keep repeating myself, but the 4 song run from Ravenskill through The X Aspect (excluding the NOMAC interlude as a "song") is my favorite part of the album. Those 4 are among the strongest on the album, and to have them back to back is just incredible.
I disagree. Chosen is one of my favorite ballads they have ever written. And story-wise, I feel like it is a great interlude between Ravenskill, where we get a sense of foreboding because Faythe's and Gabriel's plan is coming together but we know Daryus' machinations are going to cause problems, and A Tempting Offer, where we see that come to fruition. It is fitting that we get that interlude right at that spot, and Gabriel's role as the chosen one is fitting to be expanded upon at that time because his role actually is expanded by virtue of him accepting Faythe's invitation to persuade her father.A Tempting Offer is one of my favorites off the album. The chord progression is so amazing.Agreed. I hate to keep repeating myself, but the 4 song run from Ravenskill through The X Aspect (excluding the NOMAC interlude as a "song") is my favorite part of the album. Those 4 are among the strongest on the album, and to have them back to back is just incredible.
OK, so I LOVE The Astonishing. But I also feel that the criticisms of too many slow parts is totally fair. And this passage is an example. I feel like Chosen, which by itself is a fine song, breaks up that whole passage and makes it feel a little choppy.
A Life Left Behind is good, but doesn't quite rise to the level of the four I cited. And while I don't dislike A New Beginning, I am not as crazy about it as some. The latter instrumental half is really good, but the first half doesn't grab me nearly as much. Both are still really good songs, but if I'm picking out the strongest run of songs on the album, I'm not going to include those.A Tempting Offer is one of my favorites off the album. The chord progression is so amazing.Agreed. I hate to keep repeating myself, but the 4 song run from Ravenskill through The X Aspect (excluding the NOMAC interlude as a "song") is my favorite part of the album. Those 4 are among the strongest on the album, and to have them back to back is just incredible.
I would expand that to include A Life Left Behind thru A New Beginning. Easily my favorite part of the album.
Has anyone else noticed the tiny fact that every other person is mentioned by name at some point,but Daryus and Xander are always just called sons?
Has anyone else noticed the tiny fact that every other person is mentioned by name at some point,but Daryus and Xander are always just called sons?
As mentioned before, Xander has been mentioned. But I love how Daryus' name was never mentioned. It gives the impression of not really being cared for by Nafaryus, which is why he's always trying to prove himself to his father who obviously shows more affection for Faythe.
"And I won't have to stand
In Faythe's dark shadow anymore
I am through with being pushed aside
Tired of fighting for my father's pride"
I do find the following lines by Nafaryus in Astonishing too cold BECAUSE HE STILL PLAYS FAVORITES UNTIL THE END:
"When the light of my existence
Was slipping through my hands
Pride and ignorance receded
To reveal the humbled man
My prince, my son
You got lost along the way
In light of this new burden that you face
You are forgiven at this day!"
Bad father! :lol
I agree completely, except I would actually extend it to A Lie Left Behind also.A Tempting Offer is one of my favorites off the album. The chord progression is so amazing.Agreed. I hate to keep repeating myself, but the 4 song run from Ravenskill through The X Aspect (excluding the NOMAC interlude as a "song") is my favorite part of the album. Those 4 are among the strongest on the album, and to have them back to back is just incredible.
my interest has not yet waned.
It's weird when you're sure a singer sings something and when you see the official lyrics - it's nothing like what you thought.
It's weird when you're sure a singer sings something and when you see the official lyrics - it's nothing like what you thought.
Which song/lyric are you thinking of?
It's weird when you're sure a singer sings something and when you see the official lyrics - it's nothing like what you thought.The first time I listened to this album without lyrics I could've sworn by my first born that on The Walking Shadow JLB was singing 'WHAT HAAVE YOU DOOONE, MY SON IS DEAAAAD!" which I interpreted as Arabelle lamenting the death of Daryus or something like that. :lol
The fact that Daryus is not mentioned by name, by either of his parents is reason for him to feel that Faythe is the "favourite child", fuelling his jealousy and desire to capture Gabriel and stop the revolution.
What is everybody's 1 disc super version of the album? I've been thinking I want to listen to it that way, the album is too damn long, and I listen to The Flower Kings. I'll listen digitally so it can go over 1:20:00 standard length of a CD.
What is everybody's 1 disc super version of the album? I've been thinking I want to listen to it that way, the album is too damn long, and I listen to The Flower Kings. I'll listen digitally so it can go over 1:20:00 standard length of a CD.
What is everybody's 1 disc super version of the album? I've been thinking I want to listen to it that way, the album is too damn long, and I listen to The Flower Kings. I'll listen digitally so it can go over 1:20:00 standard length of a CD.
Honestly I would just take the entire first disc and then a couple selections from the second, pick your favorites. I'd personally go with Entr'acte, Moment of Betrayal, Begin Again, Our New World, and Astonishing. So much flab on that second disc.
Not sure I would want a one-disc version.Same here. Although I have my lesser favorites, I certainly wouldn't vibe with a so much shorter version.
Yup. I still think a track early on in Act II about the fighting between the common folk and the GNE would have been cool and added just a bit more depth and dimension to the story, while also serving to make Act II just feel a bit more meaty and adding balance between the two acts.
I was totally hoping a "My brother Gabriel is all the hope..." TGOM reprise at Astonishing, was a colossal letdown when it didn't happen.
I think the issue with the last part of the album is that it lacks this anthemic feel that TGOM sets, sure, it's awesome at Hymn of a Thousand Voices, but that's pretty much it.
HTV is totally anthemic, just not in the same way as TGOMI was totally hoping a "My brother Gabriel is all the hope..." TGOM reprise at Astonishing, was a colossal letdown when it didn't happen.
I think the issue with the last part of the album is that it lacks this anthemic feel that TGOM sets, sure, it's awesome at Hymn of a Thousand Voices, but that's pretty much it.
If Hymn of a Thousand Voices is supposed to be an anthemic climax then LOL
I was totally hoping a "My brother Gabriel is all the hope..." TGOM reprise at Astonishing, was a colossal letdown when it didn't happen.
I think the issue with the last part of the album is that it lacks this anthemic feel that TGOM sets, sure, it's awesome at Hymn of a Thousand Voices, but that's pretty much it.
Yup. I still think a track early on in Act II about the fighting between the common folk and the GNE would have been cool and added just a bit more depth and dimension to the story, while also serving to make Act II just feel a bit more meaty and adding balance between the two acts.
I was totally hoping a "My brother Gabriel is all the hope..." TGOM reprise at Astonishing, was a colossal letdown when it didn't happen.
I think the issue with the last part of the album is that it lacks this anthemic feel that TGOM sets, sure, it's awesome at Hymn of a Thousand Voices, but that's pretty much it.
For me, the ending is pretty anthemic, specifically the following:
The ending of Hymn of a Thousand Voices
Our New World, which really feels like a 90s rock anthem
The ending of The Astonishing "Eternally in harmony..." is really an epic closer
Wasn't bosk himself that reported that Petrucci told him that it's a too much expensive production to use it one time only? I assume there will be more full Astonishing shows, we'll see I guess...
I agree 100%. Like, I can't even understand when people say that the ending is lackluster or even that Disc 2 is weak. I understand that opinions vary, but that just doesn't make any sense to me.I was totally hoping a "My brother Gabriel is all the hope..." TGOM reprise at Astonishing, was a colossal letdown when it didn't happen.
I think the issue with the last part of the album is that it lacks this anthemic feel that TGOM sets, sure, it's awesome at Hymn of a Thousand Voices, but that's pretty much it.
For me, the ending is pretty anthemic, specifically the following:
The ending of Hymn of a Thousand Voices
Our New World, which really feels like a 90s rock anthem
The ending of The Astonishing "Eternally in harmony..." is really an epic closer
There are already 11 single-disc DT albums. TA is great as it is. If it was a matter of choosing, I would prefer it to be longer than shorter.
Wasn't bosk himself that reported that Petrucci told him that it's a too much expensive production to use it one time only? I assume there will be more full Astonishing shows, we'll see I guess...
Given the lukewarm reaction by fans to the album, I wouldn't be surprised if they changed plans.
Given the lukewarm reaction by fans to the album, I wouldn't be surprised if they changed plans.
lukewarm? What brings you to this conclusion?
Given the lukewarm reaction by fans to the album, I wouldn't be surprised if they changed plans.
lukewarm? What brings you to this conclusion?
Yup. I still think a track early on in Act II about the fighting between the common folk and the GNE would have been cool and added just a bit more depth and dimension to the story, while also serving to make Act II just feel a bit more meaty and adding balance between the two acts.This would've actually worked well for the narrative. It isn't uncommon for the second act of a 2 act structure to open with something that doesn't focus on the main characters, but rather highlights the overarching conflict/etc, before going back to the story with the main characters. Not only does this give the audience a break from the main storyline, but it creates suspense and gives us an idea of the stakes and struggle of the story. The album is kind of missing these things, especially in the second act. It just gets too focused on the main characters and the whole conflict seems extremely small scale.
I agree 100%. Like, I can't even understand when people say that the ending is lackluster or even that Disc 2 is weak. I understand that opinions vary, but that just doesn't make any sense to me.I was totally hoping a "My brother Gabriel is all the hope..." TGOM reprise at Astonishing, was a colossal letdown when it didn't happen.
I think the issue with the last part of the album is that it lacks this anthemic feel that TGOM sets, sure, it's awesome at Hymn of a Thousand Voices, but that's pretty much it.
For me, the ending is pretty anthemic, specifically the following:
The ending of Hymn of a Thousand Voices
Our New World, which really feels like a 90s rock anthem
The ending of The Astonishing "Eternally in harmony..." is really an epic closer
The major problem with the second disc for me is that the music just isn't very interesting and it's too focused on the story. The first disc really hit that sweet spot between telling a story while also having really engaging music and the second disc dropped the ball on that. In DT's defense though, this is a pitfall of nearly every double concept album ever made.
People on the internet are jerks. It's like being behind a computer entitles everyone to talk shit about anything/anyone. This is one of the few places where I can have nice conversation with people about music (prog, for example) without them going like DT SUX LAME JLB SUX HAKEN IS TEH NEW DT THEY GODS THE REST OF PROG SHIT.Unless you go into the Haken thread. :neverusethis:
People on the internet are jerks. It's like being behind a computer entitles everyone to talk shit about anything/anyone. This is one of the few places where I can have nice conversation with people about music (prog, for example) without them going like DT SUX LAME JLB SUX HAKEN IS TEH NEW DT THEY GODS THE REST OF PROG SHIT.
I agree 100%. Like, I can't even understand when people say that the ending is lackluster or even that Disc 2 is weak. I understand that opinions vary, but that just doesn't make any sense to me.I was totally hoping a "My brother Gabriel is all the hope..." TGOM reprise at Astonishing, was a colossal letdown when it didn't happen.
I think the issue with the last part of the album is that it lacks this anthemic feel that TGOM sets, sure, it's awesome at Hymn of a Thousand Voices, but that's pretty much it.
For me, the ending is pretty anthemic, specifically the following:
The ending of Hymn of a Thousand Voices
Our New World, which really feels like a 90s rock anthem
The ending of The Astonishing "Eternally in harmony..." is really an epic closer
It seems lukewarm even on this forum. An album like The Astonishing was pretty much guaranteed to divide the fan base.Yup. I still think a track early on in Act II about the fighting between the common folk and the GNE would have been cool and added just a bit more depth and dimension to the story, while also serving to make Act II just feel a bit more meaty and adding balance between the two acts.This would've actually worked well for the narrative. It isn't uncommon for the second act of a 2 act structure to open with something that doesn't focus on the main characters, but rather highlights the overarching conflict/etc, before going back to the story with the main characters. Not only does this give the audience a break from the main storyline, but it creates suspense and gives us an idea of the stakes and struggle of the story. The album is kind of missing these things, especially in the second act. It just gets too focused on the main characters and the whole conflict seems extremely small scale.
That's really nitpicking it though. The major problem with the second disc for me is that the music just isn't very interesting and it's too focused on the story. The first disc really hit that sweet spot between telling a story while also having really engaging music and the second disc dropped the ball on that. In DT's defense though, this is a pitfall of nearly every double concept album ever made.
People on the internet are jerks. It's like being behind a computer entitles everyone to talk shit about anything/anyone. This is one of the few places where I can have nice conversation with people about music (prog, for example) without them going like DT SUX LAME JLB SUX HAKEN IS TEH NEW DT THEY GODS THE REST OF PROG SHIT.
True. I mean its cool to have negative opinions given music is subjective, but when people just say something like the example above (which is exaggeration, but we've all seen it) is when it's just annoying. Here we can talk about the album freely given the rules of the forum, just be respectful. The album's great if you ask me, but that doesn't mean I have some negative feelings towards different parts. I'm still lost on how this album ranks compared to the discography, but I know it's not near the bottom nor is it near the top.
There are positive comments as well, but it usually goes like this:
*In response to Rudess saying that the next album is gonna be different*
Person 1: I'm glad... because The Astonishing BLOWS. I really hope they get their shit together and write something heavy, dark with balls!! They are so lame now.
Person 2: Yeah, WTF were they thinking? DT died with Portnoy's departure
Person 3: Hey, I LOVED The Astonishing. Keep it up DT! Screw the haters.
Person 4: Last good album was Metropolis Pt. 2.
Same people that keep posting on MP's facebook page 6 years after his departure after he has stated several times that reading such comments is hurtful to some extent:
Pls come back...DT is not the same without you. OR
DT is so much better without you.
I mean, internet is a good place to be open about things but are people just that ungrateful and bitter about some things? It's music, for God's sake. It's something that exists to make our lives better, not to create a friggin' competition and hate. I don't like Beyoncé, but I don't go through life bitching about how much she sucks or how much pop music sucks or whatever. I respect and admire that her music touches the souls of so many people, and that should be enough... I mean, that's what music is about, isn't it? It's okay if you don't like a certain album or band, but you don't have to be so bitchy and vocal about it, while insulting the band's hard work (and the band themselves) on the process.
At moments, I feel that such comments fall easily under the 'HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT ME! I HATE THIS ALBUM BECAUSE MY MUSIC TASTE IS SO REFINED AND SUPERIOR!', and sadly I think that many prog fans over the globe fall under that category.
There are positive comments as well, but it usually goes like this:
*In response to Rudess saying that the next album is gonna be different*
Person 1: I'm glad... because The Astonishing BLOWS. I really hope they get their shit together and write something heavy, dark with balls!! They are so lame now.
Person 2: Yeah, WTF were they thinking? DT died with Portnoy's departure
Person 3: Hey, I LOVED The Astonishing. Keep it up DT! Screw the haters.
Person 4: Last good album was Metropolis Pt. 2.
Same people that keep posting on MP's facebook page 6 years after his departure after he has stated several times that reading such comments is hurtful to some extent:
Pls come back...DT is not the same without you. OR
DT is so much better without you.
I mean, internet is a good place to be open about things but are people just that ungrateful and bitter about some things? It's music, for God's sake. It's something that exists to make our lives better, not to create a friggin' competition and hate. I don't like Beyoncé, but I don't go through life bitching about how much she sucks or how much pop music sucks or whatever. I respect and admire that her music touches the souls of so many people, and that should be enough... I mean, that's what music is about, isn't it? It's okay if you don't like a certain album or band, but you don't have to be so bitchy and vocal about it, while insulting the band's hard work (and the band themselves) on the process.
At moments, I feel that such comments fall easily under the 'HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT ME! I HATE THIS ALBUM BECAUSE MY MUSIC TASTE IS SO REFINED AND SUPERIOR!', and sadly I think that many prog fans over the globe fall under that category.
while there are a lot of us who love the album, there are a lot who do notThat literally happens with every album they have put out since I&W.
As a fan, as a client, you have the right to expose your opinions.True, but a couple of observations:
Awesome post.:-*
I really hope the band sticks to their guns and continues performing the entire album throughout the rest of the tour. It would be weird if they needed to compromise now, it's not like their other albums never divided the fan base. It's up to the band's management to find locations that are willing to bring the band even though they're performing only the new stuff and figure out how to make enough money out of it.
It was evident that there wasn't as much interest for this type of show in the Eastern Europe, that's why no Eastern Europe cities got this show. But if they come to Budapest or Vienna going "alright, we fixed the set, we'll only play some of The Astonishing, plus stuff like Pull me under, The Spirit carries on and On the backs of angels", I'd be disappointed not to see the entire rock opera the way it was intended to be seen.
I don't think that anyone is saying you can't expose your opinions. I think the point is that people should expose their opinions as though they were giving feedback to the band face-to-face, in which case most people would probably be cool about it, and not say ridiculous things like, "DT SUCKS THIS BAND IS EMBARRASSING ROAR!"There are positive comments as well, but it usually goes like this:
*In response to Rudess saying that the next album is gonna be different*
Person 1: I'm glad... because The Astonishing BLOWS. I really hope they get their shit together and write something heavy, dark with balls!! They are so lame now.
Person 2: Yeah, WTF were they thinking? DT died with Portnoy's departure
Person 3: Hey, I LOVED The Astonishing. Keep it up DT! Screw the haters.
Person 4: Last good album was Metropolis Pt. 2.
Same people that keep posting on MP's facebook page 6 years after his departure after he has stated several times that reading such comments is hurtful to some extent:
Pls come back...DT is not the same without you. OR
DT is so much better without you.
I mean, internet is a good place to be open about things but are people just that ungrateful and bitter about some things? It's music, for God's sake. It's something that exists to make our lives better, not to create a friggin' competition and hate. I don't like Beyoncé, but I don't go through life bitching about how much she sucks or how much pop music sucks or whatever. I respect and admire that her music touches the souls of so many people, and that should be enough... I mean, that's what music is about, isn't it? It's okay if you don't like a certain album or band, but you don't have to be so bitchy and vocal about it, while insulting the band's hard work (and the band themselves) on the process.
At moments, I feel that such comments fall easily under the 'HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT ME! I HATE THIS ALBUM BECAUSE MY MUSIC TASTE IS SO REFINED AND SUPERIOR!', and sadly I think that many prog fans over the globe fall under that category.
Awesome post.
As a fan, as a client, you have the right to expose your opinions.True, but a couple of observations:
1) The band is not doing you any favors when they release new music. If you don't like their most recent output, you're totally free to ignore it and state you don't like it in a respectful, constructive manner; which is very, very different to state you absolutely hate it, that you think it's pure shit and that the band should quit and fire James LaBrie because he can't sing anymore and that the band died when Mike Portnoy left (I'm purposely using hyperbole in my recent posts to help me illustrate my point and not because every criticism sounds like that). That's pure, unaltered education.
2) As TOX stated, the face-to-face thing is very important in my opinion. Writing whatever mindless hate and bashing comes to you behind a computer makes things easier because you can just rant about things and no one will care or see you, except those who take very seriously comments found on websites like youtube. I mean, one can meet James LaBrie at the subway or something and just be respectful even if you don't like what the man brings to the table. Is it so hard to be like that on the internet? I think it is. Speaking of the prog fans I mentioned on my post, the urge of letting the world know your music taste is so refined is big.Awesome post.:-*
Not sure what they could do next that wouldn't be a letdown for me relative to TA, to be honest :lol
Not sure what they could do next that wouldn't be a letdown for me relative to TA, to be honest :lol
Not sure what they could do next that wouldn't be a letdown for me relative to TA, to be honest :lol
For me it would mean taking this approach of focusing on melodies and let the song theme direct the music and use it for regular songs.
Only in a concept album you would get a short, full 2 minutes song or one that starts very theatrical and ends in a metal jazz section, why can't this happen on a "normal" album? DT12 was a conscious attempt in doing more concise songs, now I would like the next album to have songs of a wide array of lenghts that can be as unique and peculiar in their structure as the ones on The Astonishing.
Not sure what they could do next that wouldn't be a letdown for me relative to TA, to be honest :lol
TA is one of my top 3 DT albums....
Did not think they had it in them to do such a masterpiece this late in their career.
This would be very hard to top.
While listening to TA most of the time, Octavarium has been finding it's way to my CD player alot lately..
Interesting. Me too.
Interesting. Me too.
Same here... any explanation?
It is impossible for the next album to be a let down unless they go country style and even so.
It is impossible for the next album to be a let down unless they go country style and even so.
Progressive country? :lol :puke:
It is impossible for the next album to be a let down unless they go country style and even so.
Progressive country? :lol :puke:
Country is never good no matter what type it is. :lol
Casualties of Cool exists though. That's pretty good. Not sure if it's actually country though.
Casualties of Cool exists though. That's pretty good. Not sure if it's actually country though.
Yeah except in my opinion it's pretty bad. :lol
I think Casualties of Cool is better than some of DTP's albums. I love it.Casualties of Cool exists though. That's pretty good. Not sure if it's actually country though.
Yeah except in my opinion it's pretty bad. :lol
Oh.
:sadpanda:
Casualties of Cool exists though. That's pretty good. Not sure if it's actually country though.
Casualties of Cool exists though. That's pretty good. Not sure if it's actually country though.
It's not. It has bits of a country vibe here and there, but still not nearly enough to be labeled as such.
Is it my imagination or they announced some months ago that they were gonna release a game? I feel like it's been ages. :lolWell, on one press release it was stated the game would be released on late April. But, on anothe one (I think on the company's Facebook profile), the release date is "Q2 2016", so it could still be released this month.
It is impossible for the next album to be a let down unless they go country style and even so.
Progressive country? :lol :puke:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dml7W37AWlY
Hymn of a Thousand Voices with Tour Visuals.
I always figured if they released a DVD of this tour that a bonus feature would be just the visuals from the songs. Pretty cool to see this released.
Nothing official from the band. But JP told me in early May that they really wanted to. So the desire is definitely there. It's just a matter of making it happen.I always figured if they released a DVD of this tour that a bonus feature would be just the visuals from the songs. Pretty cool to see this released.
since I never got to see the tour, will be sooooo disappointed if they don't release it on dvd. do we know if this is coming?
well...doesn't this involve some planning? don't they have to decide to do this in advance so they have all the necessary equipment there to film it?
well...doesn't this involve some planning? don't they have to decide to do this in advance so they have all the necessary equipment there to film it?
My completely personal assumption is that they use the first round of concerts in Europe, USA and elsehwere to get a feel of the venues and theaters, and in the second legs that will follow, they will record the DVD in the venue that either sonically or aestetically pleases them most.
well...doesn't this involve some planning? don't they have to decide to do this in advance so they have all the necessary equipment there to film it?
My completely personal assumption is that they use the first round of concerts in Europe, USA and elsehwere to get a feel of the venues and theaters, and in the second legs that will follow, they will record the DVD in the venue that either sonically or aestetically pleases them most.
They could also be looking at places that are good to allow for an orchestra/choir too. That's just wishful thinking on my part, but who knows.
I hear you, but since it would be warranted this time around, I wouldn't mind. To me, it more depends on the music. If the music calls for it, I'm fine with them doing it again. Epica and Within Temptation have done it for more than one live release as well, but their music calls for it, so it's cool.well...doesn't this involve some planning? don't they have to decide to do this in advance so they have all the necessary equipment there to film it?
My completely personal assumption is that they use the first round of concerts in Europe, USA and elsehwere to get a feel of the venues and theaters, and in the second legs that will follow, they will record the DVD in the venue that either sonically or aestetically pleases them most.
They could also be looking at places that are good to allow for an orchestra/choir too. That's just wishful thinking on my part, but who knows.
I'm really done with alive DVD with an orchestra. I feel like if a band wants to do it once, fine. I thought it was unnecessary.
The thing is, this should be the time they should use one. But it would now be the third time they film with an orchestra, and THB, I have no interest in it. I'd be happy just to hear how the band pulled it off by themselves each night.
Is that the one where James goes, "You know why we love to play Santiago? You know WHY? Because you people really know how to partaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!"
With orchestra/choir, without orchestra/choir, whatever.This is the dream. Awesome shots/quality/overall vibe.
Just shoot it like the video for Our New World. That was awesome. Give me 34 songs worth of THAT.
Yeah, I love that part too (as well as the next lines that follow before the transition).
My single favorite moment of the entire album(s) is during Savior In The Square where Gabriel sings:
"Brother, worry not today.
I will share my music,
and they will soon be on their way."
Goosebumps. Every. Single. Time.
For me, the album's major tease in terms of an ever-so-brief epic moment that screams out to be repeated and never is, is the riff in Ravenskill at 2:22. (and I am guessing that you don't even need to look it up the timestamp)
I think that "Chosen" should definitely be played again on future tours. A really fun song on the album, but perfect for a live setting.
I bet Chosen was nice live, but it's one of the songs I usually skip. It will be interesting to see how this album will be represented on future tours. Will two smaller pieces be paired like War/Test? There are plenty of standalone songs, Gift Of Music, Ravenskill, Chosen, Our New World..
I think that "Chosen" should definitely be played again on future tours. A really fun song on the album, but perfect for a live setting.That is a fantastic song.
After taking a two months break to listen to some other GREAT albums released this year, plus a couple of discog dives, I've spun The Astonishing last night and again tonight.Interesting. I am in almost exactly the same spot, except that my break from the album wasn't quite two months. But otherwise, yeah, exactly that. I can't say I am tired of the album at all, but there has just been other new stuff to check out that I was listening to a lot more. And then I recently came back to this one and feel the same way you do about it.
This album is an amazing journey. And again, bravo James!
I think that "Chosen" should definitely be played again on future tours. A really fun song on the album, but perfect for a live setting.Yeah, it's a great song. The problem I think they often run into with their "ballads" is that there is only so much room in a set to slow things down and play ballady-type songs, so it is not easy to work in many of the older ones unless the band or fanbase feels that there is truly something "special" about them. I fear that Chosen may likely fall by the wayside in the future because of that.
It will be interesting to see how this album will be represented on future tours. Will two smaller pieces be paired like War/Test? There are plenty of standalone songs, Gift Of Music, Ravenskill, Chosen, Our New World..
Yes, you most definitely did. And I agree--IF they are still doing an "evening with" format where they have a second set. But even if they do a more "standard" type of show where they have an opener and do about a two hour set, it could easily work either as a "suite" or with groups of those songs sprinkled throughout, don't you think?
And while I could be dead wrong, I think that after doing "evening with" shows on the last tour, and this run of VERY difficult "evening with" shows playing The Astonishing (especially difficult for James), it seems likely to me that they would retire that format for a second leg and do the "standard" one set type of show.
2. When Gabriel screams, he covers X's ears, and Faythe has her earbuds in (I'll suspend belief on this one). But his own ears aren't protected - shouldn't he become deaf like Daryus?
1. On the track listing for The Path That Divides, it says that X followed Arhys to Heaven's Cove and was hiding behind a tree as he met Daryus. And in the description for The Walking Shadow, it says "X comes running out of the dark, crying and clinging to his fathers lifeless body, startling Daryus who was unaware that he was present." But wasn't X supposed to be Daryus' prisoner? Did he escape from Daryus? Or did Daryus let him go? But if he let him go, then how was he going to exchange X for Gabriel?
2. When Gabriel screams, he covers X's ears, and Faythe has her earbuds in (I'll suspend belief on this one). But his own ears aren't protected - shouldn't he become deaf like Daryus?
And I should also point out that Arhys didn't decide to give up the revolution. He was tempted, and was leaning that way. But as far as I understand the story, he hadn't actually decided.
A random thought:
I feel underwhelmed on how little the geography on this fictional world is used. I mean, they did a whole friggin' map and the story basically takes place at: Palace, Ravenskill and Heaven's Cove.
And I should also point out that Arhys didn't decide to give up the revolution. He was tempted, and was leaning that way. But as far as I understand the story, he hadn't actually decided.
I thought in Moment of Betrayal was when Arhys actually decided to take Daryus' offer and hence why Daryus knew to go to Heaven's Cove where Gabriel would be alone, but Arhys then reverts on his decision shortly after.
And I should also point out that Arhys didn't decide to give up the revolution. He was tempted, and was leaning that way. But as far as I understand the story, he hadn't actually decided.
I thought in Moment of Betrayal was when Arhys actually decided to take Daryus' offer and hence why Daryus knew to go to Heaven's Cove where Gabriel would be alone, but Arhys then reverts on his decision shortly after.
Did he actually decide though, or is he just playing it out in his own mind? I always took it as the latter, with the thought that the first time we hear the story, we are meant to think he actually did it rather than simply getting there in his mind, but not going through with it. But I could be mistaken. Either way though, I don't think it changes the overall point.
And I should also point out that Arhys didn't decide to give up the revolution. He was tempted, and was leaning that way. But as far as I understand the story, he hadn't actually decided.
I thought in Moment of Betrayal was when Arhys actually decided to take Daryus' offer and hence why Daryus knew to go to Heaven's Cove where Gabriel would be alone, but Arhys then reverts on his decision shortly after.A random thought:
I feel underwhelmed on how little the geography on this fictional world is used. I mean, they did a whole friggin' map and the story basically takes place at: Palace, Ravenskill and Heaven's Cove.
This is true. Could leave things open for more stories in this universe though.
It would be pretty cool if they did another song/songs in this universe. Doesn't have to be a whole rock opera again, but maybe a 23 min song to close off an album which is a sequel. I can totally imagine a Star Wars-esque scenario set in the future where Gabriel and Faythe ruled well but then X has an Anakin Skywalker type moment and becomes the next Nafaryus.
What I don't grasp is how Gabriel, in the midst of his desperation of seeing his brother killed and his love dying, had the instict to cover Xander's ears and most of all, how did he know his scream was deafening? did he practice on his own when he was alone and noticed he sent some birds deaf so he knew what was happening?You have to remember that, once the choir joins him during "Hymn Of 1000 Voices", Gabriel somehow finds his voice works again, and it brings Faythe back to life as well. I don't think John intended for every part of the story to be analyzed so rationally. Maybe he did have a superpower :P
I would just like to say that after months of listening, Disc 2 is better than Disc 1.
I can definitely say disc 2 is better than I first gave credit for, but disc 1 is just too much awesome music to be taken over by a much shorter disc 2.
I would just like to say that after months of listening, Disc 2 is better than Disc 1.
would like to have a heavier more prog prequel focusing on the actual conflict set right before TA, where Gabriel's influence on people is just being revealed.
I agree. No prequels or sequels necessary.would like to have a heavier more prog prequel focusing on the actual conflict set right before TA, where Gabriel's influence on people is just being revealed.
I wouldn't. I mean, it's cool to speculate about all the unanswered questions and unexplored territory. But it's a fairly simple, straightforward story. And, more importantly, it's a story told through a rock opera. We don't need all questions answered or more territory explored to enjoy it for what it is.
They should've stopped Star Wars after the original. Why mess with perfection?We're not talking about a whole album here again, exploiting it would be making more albums here, which isn't necessary, but I don't see why would an EP with maybe an epic be out of place. We don't call the shots, but I bet on something like that.
I agree. No prequels or sequels necessary.would like to have a heavier more prog prequel focusing on the actual conflict set right before TA, where Gabriel's influence on people is just being revealed.
I wouldn't. I mean, it's cool to speculate about all the unanswered questions and unexplored territory. But it's a fairly simple, straightforward story. And, more importantly, it's a story told through a rock opera. We don't need all questions answered or more territory explored to enjoy it for what it is.
Next album is gonna mess people up, I've got a good feeling.
I agree. No prequels or sequels necessary.would like to have a heavier more prog prequel focusing on the actual conflict set right before TA, where Gabriel's influence on people is just being revealed.
I wouldn't. I mean, it's cool to speculate about all the unanswered questions and unexplored territory. But it's a fairly simple, straightforward story. And, more importantly, it's a story told through a rock opera. We don't need all questions answered or more territory explored to enjoy it for what it is.
Agreed. What would even be the point of extending the story? If anything, didn't JP say he might turn it into a novel?
I agree. No prequels or sequels necessary.would like to have a heavier more prog prequel focusing on the actual conflict set right before TA, where Gabriel's influence on people is just being revealed.
I wouldn't. I mean, it's cool to speculate about all the unanswered questions and unexplored territory. But it's a fairly simple, straightforward story. And, more importantly, it's a story told through a rock opera. We don't need all questions answered or more territory explored to enjoy it for what it is.
Agreed. What would even be the point of extending the story? If anything, didn't JP say he might turn it into a novel?
Honestly, a novel would be pretty bad if it were following the storyline of the album. I like the plot of the story insofar as it connects to the music, but if you remove the music, it has to be one of the more cheesy and lame stories of modern times. If anything, I'd want SFAM to be turned into a novel (not that I do, to be clear).
I agree. No prequels or sequels necessary.would like to have a heavier more prog prequel focusing on the actual conflict set right before TA, where Gabriel's influence on people is just being revealed.
I wouldn't. I mean, it's cool to speculate about all the unanswered questions and unexplored territory. But it's a fairly simple, straightforward story. And, more importantly, it's a story told through a rock opera. We don't need all questions answered or more territory explored to enjoy it for what it is.
Agreed. What would even be the point of extending the story? If anything, didn't JP say he might turn it into a novel?
Honestly, a novel would be pretty bad if it were following the storyline of the album. I like the plot of the story insofar as it connects to the music, but if you remove the music, it has to be one of the more cheesy and lame stories of modern times. If anything, I'd want SFAM to be turned into a novel (not that I do, to be clear).
I agree. No prequels or sequels necessary.would like to have a heavier more prog prequel focusing on the actual conflict set right before TA, where Gabriel's influence on people is just being revealed.
I wouldn't. I mean, it's cool to speculate about all the unanswered questions and unexplored territory. But it's a fairly simple, straightforward story. And, more importantly, it's a story told through a rock opera. We don't need all questions answered or more territory explored to enjoy it for what it is.
Agreed. What would even be the point of extending the story? If anything, didn't JP say he might turn it into a novel?
Honestly, a novel would be pretty bad if it were following the storyline of the album. I like the plot of the story insofar as it connects to the music, but if you remove the music, it has to be one of the more cheesy and lame stories of modern times. If anything, I'd want SFAM to be turned into a novel (not that I do, to be clear).
I don't agree. While it's not the greatest plot, I can name many books where the plot was terrible and unoriginal, so I don''t see JP's story being any worse than those. However, the main point I'm trying to get at here is that the whole story isn't just about saving music. There's a lot going on throughout the story. It's about love, loss, hope, redemption, and so on. I see it as a touching story where, in the end, it's more than just music that was saved; it was people's freedom.
I agree. No prequels or sequels necessary.would like to have a heavier more prog prequel focusing on the actual conflict set right before TA, where Gabriel's influence on people is just being revealed.
I wouldn't. I mean, it's cool to speculate about all the unanswered questions and unexplored territory. But it's a fairly simple, straightforward story. And, more importantly, it's a story told through a rock opera. We don't need all questions answered or more territory explored to enjoy it for what it is.
Agreed. What would even be the point of extending the story? If anything, didn't JP say he might turn it into a novel?
Honestly, a novel would be pretty bad if it were following the storyline of the album. I like the plot of the story insofar as it connects to the music, but if you remove the music, it has to be one of the more cheesy and lame stories of modern times. If anything, I'd want SFAM to be turned into a novel (not that I do, to be clear).
Meh, you can't please fanbases. They hated this for not being ballsie enough yet they also hated ToT for being too much.
I can't understand how can someone call this a shortage of inspiration, true, it might not be your cup of tea, but generic? Lazily written? Where?
https://rateyourmusic.com/release/album/dream_theater/the_astonishing/ (https://rateyourmusic.com/release/album/dream_theater/the_astonishing/)
Most underrated album ever.
Prog Archives is a useful guide, but the way people rate albums is terrible. Albums often get rated based on how proggy they are, with far less regard to quality - see: Thick as a Brick always being their number 1 or 2 album of all time (BECAUSE, OMG, IT'S AN ALBUM FEATURING ONLY A 40-MINUTE PLUS SONG!!!) - plus collaborators reviews count for twice as much as anybody else's, so all it takes is a few collaborators to not like a band, and it becomes difficult for that band to get too high of a ranking since they will go in and trash all of their albums and give them low scores. Like I said, that site is a useful guide, but their rating system is deeply flawed. Granted, there is no perfect system.
Given its length, I suspect a lot of people gave it one or two listens, decided they didn't like it, and then gave it a poor score. Plus, Rate Your Music is a sight where your average hipster :lol goes to first to rank stuff, so you have to take that into consideration as well. DT albums as a whole do not fair well. Their Big Four have rankings of:
I&W 3.73
Awake 3.66
Scenes 3.74
6DOIT 3.54
So yeah, RYM is not the place to go to if you want to see DT albums rated well.
I find there's a lot of acrobatics going on in this place to make it look as if TA was better received than it was.
I find there's a lot of acrobatics going on in this place to make it look as if TA was better received than it was.
I didn't hear/see a single person qqing about TA at today's show which was almost sold out.
We all sang our asses and I saw plenty of tears around, including mine. Seriously, what a crowd.
Also, we sang Happy Birthday to JP.
The crowd interaction was great and even JM moved alot around stage.
So not well received my ass, it is totally up there. And thank god they played it.
I know mine is an unpopular opinion but I was just astoundingly disappointed with this release. It's riddled with sloppy lyrics, unimaginative musicianship, (Except for a few amazing moments of progness) and there is even a few sloppy editing slip ups I heard. The very end of a Tempting Offer around 3:38. Read the lyrics and just hear how messed up that sounds. It's unexcusable and no other DT album would have allowed that sort of slip up to occur. Portnoy was half of the production team. Now it's all Petrucci and I feel it's Petrucci's fault for how this album sounded. It was all his idea, his lyrics, his music, all his. This should have been john Petrucci's The Astonishing.I suspect you didn't like it.
I'm just confused when people call this a masterpiece. It doesn't match up to other epics of it's kind, it doesn't match up to DT's history of prog epis, it doesn't even compare to Prog epics that exist in the 2010's. It just falls so short of its goal that it doesn't even deserve its title. It was so hyped to be the epic to break all epics and it wasn't! By the time I get to Act of Faythe I just started crying by how boring the music And lyrics were. Petrucci put the story first above everything, and if the listener won't care about the story, then the music suffers for it. When music is first like let's say any other Dream Theater album, the lyrics could be Meh but it still had the music to fall on. Not in this album. It's just so broken. This is the Sonic Boom/ Phantom Menace of Dream Theater albums. Sorry guys.
I am a huge DT/Prog/Music fan which is why I feel so strongly about my hatred for this album.
I know mine is an unpopular opinion but I was just astoundingly disappointed with this release. It's riddled with sloppy lyrics, unimaginative musicianship, (Except for a few amazing moments of progness) and there is even a few sloppy editing slip ups I heard. The very end of a Tempting Offer around 3:38. Read the lyrics and just hear how messed up that sounds. It's unexcusable and no other DT album would have allowed that sort of slip up to occur. Portnoy was half of the production team. Now it's all Petrucci and I feel it's Petrucci's fault for how this album sounded. It was all his idea, his lyrics, his music, all his. This should have been john Petrucci's The Astonishing.You don't have to be sorry. It's nice to have differing opinions, but I don't think you get what the album is at all.
I'm just confused when people call this a masterpiece. It doesn't match up to other epics of it's kind, it doesn't match up to DT's history of prog epis, it doesn't even compare to Prog epics that exist in the 2010's. It just falls so short of its goal that it doesn't even deserve its title. It was so hyped to be the epic to break all epics and it wasn't! By the time I get to Act of Faythe I just started crying by how boring the music And lyrics were. Petrucci put the story first above everything, and if the listener won't care about the story, then the music suffers for it. When music is first like let's say any other Dream Theater album, the lyrics could be Meh but it still had the music to fall on. Not in this album. It's just so broken. This is the Sonic Boom/ Phantom Menace of Dream Theater albums. Sorry guys.
I am a huge DT/Prog/Music fan which is why I feel so strongly about my hatred for this album.
The very end of a Tempting Offer around 3:38. Read the lyrics and just hear how messed up that sounds. It's unexcusable and no other DT album would have allowed that sort of slip up to occur.
Wait, what? Which moment are you referring to?The very end of a Tempting Offer around 3:38. Read the lyrics and just hear how messed up that sounds. It's unexcusable and no other DT album would have allowed that sort of slip up to occur.
Except SFaM (in Fatal Tragedy).
Wait, what? Which moment are you referring to?The very end of a Tempting Offer around 3:38. Read the lyrics and just hear how messed up that sounds. It's unexcusable and no other DT album would have allowed that sort of slip up to occur.
Except SFaM (in Fatal Tragedy).
I'm just confused when people call this a masterpiece.
Well...
Growling "SELF-RESTRAINT!" "INVENTORY" "ANALYSIS" and "I am responsible!" are the worst lyrics in any DT song for me.
But I see your point, I personally think they could have used the full near 160 minutes both CD's have. JLB is a skilled lyricist, so maybe JP should have asked for assistance?
I'm just confused when people call this a masterpiece.
Outside this forum, it's not.
Well, that's of course another aspect, and one that's been plaguing them for a long time. There's 5 guys in the band, but somehow it seems to fall to always 2 guys to do the whole thing. JP wrote the lyrics and the story, JP+JR wrote the music... What did JM, JLB and MM do? Is there such a two-tier system in DT now that the "lower ranks" have no say at all anymore, not even percolating up suggestions?
I'm just confused when people call this a masterpiece.
Outside this forum, it's not.
So you are going to tell me that nobody out there thinks this is a masterpiece except those on this forum? :lol Come on. It might not be their best work, but you're just coming up with shortsighted and bitter statements like that one because of how you feel about it.
I'm just confused when people call this a masterpiece.
Outside this forum, it's not.
So you are going to tell me that nobody out there thinks this is a masterpiece except those on this forum? :lol Come on. It might not be their best work, but you're just coming up with shortsighted and bitter statements like that one because of how you feel about it.
So, you're using the "well, I know a guy who isn't on DTF but likes the album" argument? The best proxy for public opinion on the album we have is RYM and Sputnik. I can personally say that my friends have been vocally saying "wtf?" about the album.
I'm just confused when people call this a masterpiece.
Outside this forum, it's not.
So you are going to tell me that nobody out there thinks this is a masterpiece except those on this forum? :lol Come on. It might not be their best work, but you're just coming up with shortsighted and bitter statements like that one because of how you feel about it.
So, you're using the "well, I know a guy who isn't on DTF but likes the album" argument? The best proxy for public opinion on the album we have is RYM and Sputnik. I can personally say that my friends have been vocally saying "wtf?" about the album.
I'm using common sense to defuse your statement. Nothing more. Nothing less. They have a couple of million likes on their Facebook. Don't tell me none of those people think that it's a masterpiece and do not come to this forum.
Lets be honest though guys this isn't a normal DT album and it was going to bring out a love of either "Holy Cow this is awesome!" to "WTF did I just listen to? This isn't my Kevin Moore?"
Lets be honest though guys this isn't a normal DT album and it was going to bring out a love of either "Holy Cow this is awesome!" to "WTF did I just listen to? This isn't my Kevin Moore?"
For me, A New Beginning 3:25-3:50 is so mind-boggingly the worst music DT has ever penned
I'm just confused when people call this a masterpiece.
Outside this forum, it's not.
So you are going to tell me that nobody out there thinks this is a masterpiece except those on this forum? :lol Come on. It might not be their best work, but you're just coming up with shortsighted and bitter statements like that one because of how you feel about it.
So, you're using the "well, I know a guy who isn't on DTF but likes the album" argument? The best proxy for public opinion on the album we have is RYM and Sputnik. I can personally say that my friends have been vocally saying "wtf?" about the album.
I'm using common sense to defuse your statement. Nothing more. Nothing less. They have a couple of million likes on their Facebook. Don't tell me none of those people think that it's a masterpiece and do not come to this forum.
It's a strawman argument. My comment of "outside of this forum, it's not considered a masterpiece" obviously wasn't meant as "there is not a single person outside of DTF, not even in the deserted jungles of the Yanomamo people, who considers TA a masterpiece". The point I was making obviously was, the general consensus, i.e. the mode of the distribution, outside of DTF, is that it did not live up to its own hype.
... And the Boston audience response was very reserved.
... And the Boston audience response was very reserved.
That's because I wasn't there! ;D
... And the Boston audience response was very reserved.
That's because I wasn't there! ;D
I think all of the audiences were reserved given the whole theater presentation of the show. Really sucks the life out of a concert if you cant rock out. I know I tried my best to rock out but I could only do so much :metal
... And the Boston audience response was very reserved.
That's because I wasn't there! ;D
I think all of the audiences were reserved given the whole theater presentation of the show. Really sucks the life out of a concert if you cant rock out. I know I tried my best to rock out but I could only do so much :metal
Watching your drunkenness rock out was almost as awesome as the show. :lol I know we've said this before but... That poor usher.
... And the Boston audience response was very reserved.
That's because I wasn't there! ;D
:lol... And the Boston audience response was very reserved.
That's because I wasn't there! ;D
I know. I didn't see a walker in the aisles.
... And the Boston audience response was very reserved.
That's because I wasn't there! ;D
I think all of the audiences were reserved given the whole theater presentation of the show. Really sucks the life out of a concert if you cant rock out. I know I tried my best to rock out but I could only do so much :metal
Watching your drunkenness rock out was almost as awesome as the show. :lol I know we've said this before but... That poor usher.
(https://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/247/207/813.gif)
EDIT: Honorable mention to the beginning of "Losing Faythe", which is total wtf too. First, the pun (Faith vs Faythe) that was overused by that point. Then, the freesound.org sample of the crickets. And then, yes, a guy pretending to be a woman crying.I'm curious, honestly - has it been officially confirmed that James did those crying sounds? Or was it someone else, and I haven't read about it? Thanks!
For me, A New Beginning 3:25-3:50 is so mind-boggingly the worst music DT has ever penned, I just can't fathom that the same guys who wrote SFAM didn't stop halfway into writing that part and said "aaaaand, onto the cutting floor". That 25 seconds section encapsulates all that is wrong with the album, IMO. Sequencer-sounding drums, wtf lyrics, "Frozen"-style music.
EDIT: Honorable mention to the beginning of "Losing Faythe", which is total wtf too. First, the pun (Faith vs Faythe) that was overused by that point. Then, the freesound.org sample of the crickets. And then, yes, a guy pretending to be a woman crying.
Petrucci put the story first above everything, and if the listener won't care about the story, then the music suffers for it.
On the Eddie Trunk interview, JP said that he and JR approached the band and asked that the entire thing be written by them, without input from the other guys.That's what happens when the producer of the album is a band member. Someone has to be on the helm, and it happens to be JP in this case. I know that some people have been pleading for an outside producer for DT for years, but that isn't gonna happen. Even if JP (and MP) have made some questionable decisions as producers, they have also made some outstanding work as well (SFAM? SDOIT?).
I can see why they had that idea, but it might have been beneficial to present the band with the finished product (as we hear it today) and get their input. Really all The Astonishing needed was an editor. It sounds like nobody wanted to question JP's creative decisions.
For me, it simply comes down to, JP and JR aimed way too high. Like, wayyyyy too high. So, even though they gave themselves more time than usual, the vast scope of the album (music, lyrics, story, artwork etc etc) stretched them so thin that each aspect came out poor.
To me, the,band needs an outside producer. It always invigorates a band.
Just because something is working doesn't mean you still can't change it. There's no fun in being safe. ;) To use Rush as an example again, things were going awesome for them in the early 80s - that was arguably the height of their popularity - but they needed a change, so they chucked their longtime friend and producer Terry Brown, because they wanted a challenge and different ears to treat their music. I doubt DT will ever get an outside producer again, but I'd love it if they did.
For me, it simply comes down to, JP and JR aimed way too high. Like, wayyyyy too high. So, even though they gave themselves more time than usual, the vast scope of the album (music, lyrics, story, artwork etc etc) stretched them so thin that each aspect came out poor.
Petrucci put the story first above everything, and if the listener won't care about the story, then the music suffers for it.
I still totally disagree with this. I have been listening to this a lot since the day it came out, 5 1/2 months ago, and I still have NEVER go out of my way to read the lyrics, and while I know the general gist of the story now, I still don't much of the particulars, yet I love most of it*...because the music is mostly great.
Just because something is working doesn't mean you still can't change it. There's no fun in being safe. ;) To use Rush as an example again, things were going awesome for them in the early 80s - that was arguably the height of their popularity - but they needed a change, so they chucked their longtime friend and producer Terry Brown, because they wanted a challenge and different ears to treat their music. I doubt DT will ever get an outside producer again, but I'd love it if they did.
It would be interesting to see who they would actually pick. Of course I'd hope for Steven Wilson, but that would never happen. As far as sound, I think getting Kevin Shirley would be awesome. FII, while one of their poorest albums as far as song composition and song choice, was sonically one of their best releases. I don't want him fucking with the songs themselves! We don't need another Hawaiian intro to Take Away My Pain. :lol
It would be interesting to see who they would actually pick. Of course I'd hope for Steven Wilson, but that would never happen.
Just because something is working doesn't mean you still can't change it. There's no fun in being safe. ;) To use Rush as an example again, things were going awesome for them in the early 80s - that was arguably the height of their popularity - but they needed a change, so they chucked their longtime friend and producer Terry Brown, because they wanted a challenge and different ears to treat their music. I doubt DT will ever get an outside producer again, but I'd love it if they did.
It would be interesting to see who they would actually pick. Of course I'd hope for Steven Wilson, but that would never happen. As far as sound, I think getting Kevin Shirley would be awesome. FII, while one of their poorest albums as far as song composition and song choice, was sonically one of their best releases. I don't want him fucking with the songs themselves! We don't need another Hawaiian intro to Take Away My Pain. :lol
I don't even know what that means. :lol :biggrin: Nothing wrong at all with the intro to Take Away My Pain or the song in general; it's a fine tune overall, as recorded and released on FII. :coolio
It would be interesting to see who they would actually pick. Of course I'd hope for Steven Wilson, but that would never happen.
I like DT. I like Steven Wilson (as a musician, songwriter, and producer). But, I don't think that would be a good match for variety of reasons.
That's why I said I it would never happen. :)
The more I listen to The Astonishing, the more I appreciate Myung's subtle contributions. Every now and then, neither the guitar nor the keyboard is in the forefront, and JM knows that's his time to add a little something to a section that might sound slightly empty otherwise. He sure found his place on this album, it's impressive.
That's why I said I it would never happen. :)
So why would you hope for it if you agree it wouldn't be a good match? :lol
That's why I said I it would never happen. :)
So why would you hope for it if you agree it wouldn't be a good match? :lol
I think DT could benefit from his production expertise.
I don't think they need any help with song arrangements, though I'm sure they would be open to a producer's opinion. I think SW would be exceedingly beneficial from a sonic perspective. I love how his albums sound. They're this perfect balance between each instrument and vocals. Granted, his albums portray a different mood from that of DT, but I can't help but feel that there are a handful of moments on the last few releases that could have been approached better.
I know that SW working with DT is a lot of folks' prog wet dream, but it ain't gonna happen. DT's style doesn't fit SW in any sense, so it wouldn't be very beneficial to the band having him.
I don't think they need any help with song arrangements, though I'm sure they would be open to a producer's opinion. I think SW would be exceedingly beneficial from a sonic perspective. I love how his albums sound. They're this perfect balance between each instrument and vocals. Granted, his albums portray a different mood from that of DT, but I can't help but feel that there are a handful of moments on the last few releases that could have been approached better.
That's fair, I'd agree that Steven's stuff usually sounds fantastic from a sonic perspective. It's the difference in mood that would cause me to pause, but it would definitely be an interesting collaboration.
Not at all, but it's different. SW has stated several times that he's a fan of death metal and of Mikael Akerfeldt's work, so working with Opeth made sense. On the other hand, he has also stated he's not a big fan of Dream Theater.I know that SW working with DT is a lot of folks' prog wet dream, but it ain't gonna happen. DT's style doesn't fit SW in any sense, so it wouldn't be very beneficial to the band having him.
Though at the time of Stupid Dream did you ever think SW would work with Opeth? I sure didn't.
I don't think they need any help with song arrangements, though I'm sure they would be open to a producer's opinion. I think SW would be exceedingly beneficial from a sonic perspective. I love how his albums sound. They're this perfect balance between each instrument and vocals. Granted, his albums portray a different mood from that of DT, but I can't help but feel that there are a handful of moments on the last few releases that could have been approached better.
That's fair, I'd agree that Steven's stuff usually sounds fantastic from a sonic perspective. It's the difference in mood that would cause me to pause, but it would definitely be an interesting collaboration.
From a sonic perspective, I think The Astonishing sounded great so maybe DT is on the right track. The cymbals could be higher in the mix but my guess is that it's already competing with the sonic space filled by the orchestra, so they dialed it down.
Not at all, but it's different. SW has stated several times that he's a fan of death metal and of Mikael Akerfeldt's work, so working with Opeth made sense. On the other hand, he has also stated he's not a big fan of Dream Theater.I know that SW working with DT is a lot of folks' prog wet dream, but it ain't gonna happen. DT's style doesn't fit SW in any sense, so it wouldn't be very beneficial to the band having him.
Though at the time of Stupid Dream did you ever think SW would work with Opeth? I sure didn't.
Now that I remember, in the original TA announcement thread, I joked with other guys (Don't recall who) about a possible TA plot
"Arhys will be the hero, as he will sacrifice his life and neglect his kid and wife, all for Gabriel to be happy"
Well, shit.
YES, THE ASTONISHING idea was originally MINE, not HIS, I conceived it waaay back in 2005 with OCTAVARIUM, the song NEVER ENOUGH was foreshadowing this, but I couldn't work on it because that was THE CONCEPT ALBUM I planned to do after BC&SL!!! The first act would have been this new album and the second act would be MY 12 STEP SUITE.
So it's confirmed.
I don't think they need any help with song arrangements, though I'm sure they would be open to a producer's opinion. I think SW would be exceedingly beneficial from a sonic perspective. I love how his albums sound. They're this perfect balance between each instrument and vocals. Granted, his albums portray a different mood from that of DT, but I can't help but feel that there are a handful of moments on the last few releases that could have been approached better.
That's fair, I'd agree that Steven's stuff usually sounds fantastic from a sonic perspective. It's the difference in mood that would cause me to pause, but it would definitely be an interesting collaboration.
From a sonic perspective, I think The Astonishing sounded great so maybe DT is on the right track. The cymbals could be higher in the mix but my guess is that it's already competing with the sonic space filled by the orchestra, so they dialed it down.
It was better, I'd say the one sonic element that could have been better were the drums. Like you said, a lot of the cymbal work was lost.
Steven usually goes for a mix that has a good bit of breathing room, DT usually does not.
Now that I remember, in the original TA announcement thread, I joked with other guys (Don't recall who) about a possible TA plot
"Arhys will be the hero, as he will sacrifice his life and neglect his kid and wife, all for Gabriel to be happy"
Well, shit.
YES, THE ASTONISHING idea was originally MINE, not HIS, I conceived it waaay back in 2005 with OCTAVARIUM, the song NEVER ENOUGH was foreshadowing this, but I couldn't work on it because that was THE CONCEPT ALBUM I planned to do after BC&SL!!! The first act would have been this new album and the second act would be MY 12 STEP SUITE.
So it's confirmed.
What's that you wrote in green letters? Who said those words? Where? Source?
Wife and I cranked TA in its entirety on a trip to the Maine coast this weekend. Such great melodies and amazing vocals, I just can't comprehend not liking it.
Wife and I cranked TA in its entirety on a trip to the Maine coast this weekend. Such great melodies and amazing vocals, I just can't comprehend not liking it.
I just realized, I haven't listened to the Astonishing since I saw it live at the end of April. Kinda odd, It's not like I dislike it or anything. Maybe I just got burned out on it a bit, I did power listen too it a lot leading up to the show.
It happens also to me to have the attention for an album climaxing with the concert. Especially when the show is so good and I feel like "How can I top this listening experience?", so I just revel in the memories of the concert.
Sometimes the best music comes out of Inner turmoil, disagreements and being pushed.
Not about that at all. Tim, tell me KISS isn't at their best when a producer pushes them.
Steven Wilson or not, Bands need to be pushed. I feel DT needs that.
Tim, come on. Don't play these games. The right producer is like the right coach. Sometimes a band needs a change like a team.
It gives them a boost of energy. I do not see why it's a bad thing?
Tim, come on. Don't play these games. The right producer is like the right coach. Sometimes a band needs a change like a team.
It gives them a boost of energy. I do not see why it's a bad thing?
I think it is a bit much to say their albums are so different from one another. At their core, every single DT album is a prog metal album. Yeah, they do a good job of making every album not sound the same, but saying they are all very different from one another seems like a bit of an exaggeration, no?
I think it is a bit much to say their albums are so different from one another. At their core, every single DT album is a prog metal album. Yeah, they do a good job of making every album not sound the same, but saying they are all very different from one another seems like a bit of an exaggeration, no?
I don't think so. What band has such different albums in their catalog? Most bands fall into "_____" genre. I believe within DT's confines they have varied albums. Now if you want to blow open their confines, then fine. What style would you like them to play in? No one can tell me this.
I didn't say I want to see them play in another style; they do a fine job playing in the one they're in. Just don't tell me that any of their albums don't fall into the prog metal genre.
Snakes And Arrows blows. BUT, I'll give you this...it is easily their best sounding album since Moving Pictures.
See the making of Snakes and Arrows from Rush. It's a prime example of what I'm talking about.
Check it out online. Seriously. You'll get it.
The making of the album online.
You're missing the second best song yet kept all the bottom 5 songs in. :eek
You're missing the second best song yet kept all the bottom 5 songs in. :eek
My talets are limitless, you see...
Are you trying to say toilets?
And now we know what happened to the holograms that the band had talked about earlier but never happened. That would have been really cool!Yeah, I was thinking about this. I was worried that at my show last month, there had been holograms and I hadn't payed attention.
I think the band had good plans but they fell through. My god, this has to be the saddest promotion ever for a band. They, had big plans, the record company couldn't deliver. So I see why quite a few bands left roadrunner records.
I guess people were expecting some sort of Pixar/Dreamworks animation to cover everything.I suppose people were expecting much better, since it was the band/label/companies who announced cool things that eventually fell through or have been indefinitely postponed (the holograms, the deluxe packages, the videogame). I'm not complaining, since I didn't really think any of those things was really that important, but I do think it's reasonable for others to complain.
But please, TA sold well, don't go as far as to say it was a sad promotion because it wasn't.
I guess people were expecting some sort of Pixar/Dreamworks animation to cover everything.I suppose people were expecting much better, since it was the band/label/companies who announced cool things that eventually fell through or have been indefinitely postponed (the holograms, the deluxe packages, the videogame). I'm not complaining, since I didn't really think any of those things was really that important, but I do think it's reasonable for others to complain.
But please, TA sold well, don't go as far as to say it was a sad promotion because it wasn't.
Blaming the label for things such as the animation and the videogame is absurd, as the bandmembers were the ones who approached them in the first place. As for the videogame, well, it's an autonomous company who has it delayed.
Six months in, and I still can't stop listening to this album. I don't think I've ever enjoyed a new album almost exclusively for this long without getting burned out on it (I still haven't given the new Avantasia, which came out the same day, a full listen through). I think I can safely say TA will probably end up as my favorite DT release. It has so much variety, which is what I really like about DT (and music in general). I'm a sucker for ballads/power ballads, so I love Act of Faythe, Chosen, A Life Left Behind, Begin Again, Losing Faythe, and Hymn of a Thousand Voices. But when I want something heavier, I can go to A Tempting Offer, Moment of Betrayal, The Path That Divides, Walking Shadow, or to the craziness of Lord Nafaryus and Three Days. And of course there's The Gift of Music, A New Beginning, Our New World, A Better Life, Savior in the Square, and the beautiful Heaven's Cove. So much good stuff... I made a single CD version for my car, but had to leave out a lot of great songs that just wouldn't fit.
This album is unlike anything else in their catalog. I love the orchestration, the choirs, the piano, James Labrie, JP's guitar solos in A Better Life, Savior in the Square, When Your Time Has Come, A New Beginning, Chosen, etc, and MM's sometimes subtle drum work. There's so many great melodies from this album that are constantly stuck in my head. I think I'm addicted to it, and I may need help. :lol
Blaming the label for things such as the animation and the videogame is absurd, as the bandmembers were the ones who approached them in the first place. As for the videogame, well, it's an autonomous company who has it delayed.
In general, a band of five people can hardly use lack of creative resources as an explanation. Not utilizing the other band members seems to have been a fully conscious decision.
I think the band had good plans but they fell through. My god, this has to be the saddest promotion ever for a band. They, had big plans, the record company couldn't deliver. So I see why quite a few bands left roadrunner records.
I think this is too exagerated.
DT, as well as many people, consider this a success. The only issue I see is the preorder scandal, but other than that, I don't see how is it sad or bad.
The animating company didn't have too much time and two hours of animation is a very long shot, yet I think they did a good job and made it very enjoyable.
I guess people were expecting some sort of Pixar/Dreamworks animation to cover everything.
But please, TA sold well, don't go as far as to say it was a sad promotion because it wasn't.
Blaming the label for things such as the animation and the videogame is absurd, as the bandmembers were the ones who approached them in the first place. As for the videogame, well, it's an autonomous company who has it delayed.Hey, I agree that the label probably wasn't responsible for the animation and videogame. What (I understand) they are responsible for is the delay on the deluxe packages.
Now if the label had told them "Here, use these guys" we would be talking differently, but as far as the interviews prove, all the label did was greenlighting stuff.
Well, when you're trying to pull off such an enormous project like this, something's just bound to go wrong. Taking all the different complicated factors that went into all of this, I'm impressed Dream Theater's gone this far with all of it. People forget how much work was involved in every little detail and aspect of The Astonishing.
Well, when you're trying to pull off such an enormous project like this, something's just bound to go wrong. Taking all the different complicated factors that went into all of this, I'm impressed Dream Theater's gone this far with all of it. People forget how much work was involved in every little detail and aspect of The Astonishing.Agreed. It's way easier to pick on the things that one doesn't like, but enjoy it or not the enormous effort has to be recognised nevertheless.
Indeed.Well, when you're trying to pull off such an enormous project like this, something's just bound to go wrong. Taking all the different complicated factors that went into all of this, I'm impressed Dream Theater's gone this far with all of it. People forget how much work was involved in every little detail and aspect of The Astonishing.Agreed. It's way easier to pick on the things that one doesn't like, but enjoy it or not the enormous effort has to be recognised nevertheless.
Well, when you're trying to pull off such an enormous project like this, something's just bound to go wrong. Taking all the different complicated factors that went into all of this, I'm impressed Dream Theater's gone this far with all of it. People forget how much work was involved in every little detail and aspect of The Astonishing.Agreed. It's way easier to pick on the things that one doesn't like, but enjoy it or not the enormous effort has to be recognised nevertheless.
THAT MASTERING ERROR AT THE END OF A TEMPTING OFFER COMPLETELY RUINS THE ALBUM EXPERIENCE FOR ME.
THAT MASTERING ERROR AT THE END OF A TEMPTING OFFER COMPLETELY RUINS THE ALBUM EXPERIENCE FOR ME.
THAT MASTERING ERROR AT THE END OF A TEMPTING OFFER COMPLETELY RUINS THE ALBUM EXPERIENCE FOR ME.
THAT HORRIBLE LOOPING CRICKET SOUND AT THE START OF THE PATH THAT DIVIDES COMPLETELY RUINS THE ALBUM EXPERIENCE FOR ME.
Hugh Syme would have done a better job at it, I can only imagine the top notch quality cover of TA by HS.
Top 2 joke here! :biggrin:
IMO top 1 was: What's Nafaryus first name? Neil... :hefdaddy :rollin
I didn’t remember that, so, you should be very proud of it! :tup
As expected, anybody who has a Star Trek avatar has to be a funny and cool guy! :coolio
Top 2 joke here! :biggrin:
IMO top 1 was: What's Nafaryus first name? Neil... :hefdaddy :rollin
Proof that DT sees Neal (Disguised as Neil) Morse as the terrible bad guy who took Portnoy away.
Proof that DT sees Neal (Disguised as Neil) Morse as the terrible bad guy who took Portnoy away.
Is there any Morse code on that song ?
ILLUMINATI CONFIRMED
∆∆∆∆∆∆∆∆∆∆∆∆∆∆∆∆∆
I'm glad JP decided to do this concept about Machines/Robots being the only thing creating music. Because it gets more true each day. I just read about a robot that can song on its own.
As an example the reoccurring melody that opens and closes “Our New World” and “Savior in the Square” is pure musical bliss that I guarantee to you Beethoven, Bach and Brahms would be kicking themselves in the ass for not writing.(https://orig11.deviantart.net/39df/f/2013/127/4/0/spongebob_excited_by_allkawaii-d64i21r.jpg)
Nice to laugh at some of the stuff in the last 2 pages of this thread. :clap: (Especially Kotow for Neil Nafaryus. :tup)
Speaking of Myung, I cranked up The Gift of music yesterday and realized how tremendous the bass lines all the way through are. Whoever thinks Myung doesn't stand out on the album isn't paying attention. Just turn up the bass and enjoy, it's magnificent how JM knows how to find his space within the other more dominant instruments and adjust his bass lines to both stand out and melt into the instrumentation. He's incredible.
The Astonishing is a really good sounding album in general, I think.
Speaking of Myung, I cranked up The Gift of music yesterday and realized how tremendous the bass lines all the way through are. Whoever thinks Myung doesn't stand out on the album isn't paying attention. Just turn up the bass and enjoy, it's magnificent how JM knows how to find his space within the other more dominant instruments and adjust his bass lines to both stand out and melt into the instrumentation. He's incredible.
That's why I just laughed when The Astonishing was eliminated very early in the Survivor thread for Bass playing.
Not a fan of the Astonishing at all, have tried and tried. Like maybe three, four songs tops, and none would make my top 30. I went to the Radio City show, sadly for me it was the worst DT show I have been since I first started seeing them in 1998. This second leg I have no interest in seeing at all. It will be the first time I have ever not gone to see them when I had the chance.If my DT intuition is correct I am sure the next album will be billed as their heaviest ever in my guesstimation, but I don't even like the sound of the new production. ADToE sounded good to me and I do like most of those songs but hated these last two. So over produced and almost industrial especially the drum sound.
Any way it is sad and pathetic the amount of tickets sold so far for this leg, they should cancel this tour or quickly make the call to change the setlist. It will be embarrassing at some of these shows, unless there are some miraculous last minute ticking buying binges. I don't see it happening.
I hate being disappointed in my favorite band for that last 25 years ( discovered during release of Awake) but I guess life goes on. Haken, Between the Buried and Me, Symphony X, and yes Opeth are IMHO putting out better stuff these day.
At least you tried by going to the show. But me, after a couple of months listening to the album, I was not psyched up for that.
This album has not lost any steam for me. I'll take a break from it for a while, but when I return to it, it just keeps getting better. I think it's by far their most melodic album, and they have never been short on good melodies on all their albums.
I really hope they do something special as far as making a dvd production from this tour. It would be a crime not to!
Haken, Between the Buried and Me, Symphony X, and yes Opeth are IMHO putting out better stuff these day.
This album has not lost any steam for me. I'll take a break from it for a while, but when I return to it, it just keeps getting better. I think it's by far their most melodic album, and they have never been short on good melodies on all their albums.
I really hope they do something special as far as making a dvd production from this tour. It would be a crime not to!
This. I'll proudly say that this album has topped I&W as my favorite album and I can't wait to see it played live for the third time. I play it almost daily.
This album has not lost any steam for me. I'll take a break from it for a while, but when I return to it, it just keeps getting better. I think it's by far their most melodic album, and they have never been short on good melodies on all their albums.
I really hope they do something special as far as making a dvd production from this tour. It would be a crime not to!
This. I'll proudly say that this album has topped I&W as my favorite album and I can't wait to see it played live for the third time. I play it almost daily.
Nice to see others who think so highly of the album. I love it to death and play it often. :metal
Sorry I still can't get into this album. I just don't like it at all. I gave up around March and said I would try again later. I did that in September, but it's just not for me.
It's awesome that so many of you think it's great. I am glad you have something you like listening to. For me, it's been a 2 year DT void now. I will get excited when they hit the studio again. At least there is lots of DT material to go back and listen to though.
Sorry I still can't get into this album. I just don't like it at all. I gave up around March and said I would try again later. I did that in September, but it's just not for me.
It's awesome that so many of you think it's great. I am glad you have something you like listening to. For me, it's been a 2 year DT void now. I will get excited when they hit the studio again. At least there is lots of DT material to go back and listen to though.
DT also needs to get their pricing under control. I saw Opeth for $35 last weekend, whereas DT's cheapest seats these days are $60 and more.I got DT tickets at the box office in Seattle for $39.00 each back in May. Middle balcony. Great show and I would see it again. It wasn't sold out, the upper teir of the balcony was empty. It was a Tuesday night however, then again concept albums aren't as well received as they were in the seventies, which is too bad.. The crowd that night was enthusiastic though.
Sorry I still can't get into this album. I just don't like it at all. I gave up around March and said I would try again later. I did that in September, but it's just not for me.
It's awesome that so many of you think it's great. I am glad you have something you like listening to. For me, it's been a 2 year DT void now. I will get excited when they hit the studio again. At least there is lots of DT material to go back and listen to though.
I'm curious - for those who don't like TA as a whole, surely there are SOME songs you like. Our New World for instance seems to me a song that should have massive appeal, along with A New Beginning and many others.
DT also needs to get their pricing under control. I saw Opeth for $35 last weekend, whereas DT's cheapest seats these days are $60 and more.
Sorry I still can't get into this album. I just don't like it at all. I gave up around March and said I would try again later. I did that in September, but it's just not for me.
It's awesome that so many of you think it's great. I am glad you have something you like listening to. For me, it's been a 2 year DT void now. I will get excited when they hit the studio again. At least there is lots of DT material to go back and listen to though.
I'm curious - for those who don't like TA as a whole, surely there are SOME songs you like. Our New World for instance seems to me a song that should have massive appeal, along with A New Beginning and many others.
DT also needs to get their pricing under control. I saw Opeth for $35 last weekend, whereas DT's cheapest seats these days are $60 and more.I got DT tickets at the box office in Seattle for $39.00 each back in May. Middle balcony. Great show and I would see it again. It wasn't sold out, the upper teir of the balcony was empty. It was a Tuesday night however, then again concept albums aren't as well received as they were in the seventies, which is too bad.. The crowd that night was enthusiastic though.
Am I the only person who has no intention of ever seeing a Dream theater concert ?
I'm not the biggest fan of live gigs. Once in a blue moon. But with DT playing to a click and triggering stuff - you're pretty much gonna get the CD but super loud.
Am I the only person who has no intention of ever seeing a Dream theater concert ?
I'm not the biggest fan of live gigs. Once in a blue moon. But with DT playing to a click and triggering stuff - you're pretty much gonna get the CD but super loud.
Am I the only person who has no intention of ever seeing a Dream theater concert ?
I'm not the biggest fan of live gigs. Once in a blue moon. But with DT playing to a click and triggering stuff - you're pretty much gonna get the CD but super loud.
Am I the only person who has no intention of ever seeing a Dream theater concert ?
I'm not the biggest fan of live gigs. Once in a blue moon. But with DT playing to a click and triggering stuff - you're pretty much gonna get the CD but super loud.
No i've never seen DT live.
I'm not big on going to gigs as it is.
I know that bands are often playing to a click nowadays. The son of an old friend is making a good living since graduating in music, playing drums for artists on tour. He plays always with a click, I could not believe it. I mean, the drummer used to be the leader and I can believe they do that even for a 3 chord rock song.
And from what I hear - they just sort of stand there and play to a click. That would be boring to me.
I'll stick with the live DVDs.
I know that bands are often playing to a click nowadays. The son of an old friend is making a good living since graduating in music, playing drums for artists on tour. He plays always with a click, I could not believe it. I mean, the drummer used to be the leader and I can believe they do that even for a 3 chord rock song.
I would be surprised if a hired gun, touring drummer would not be told he was going to be playing to click in that situation. Usually, artists that hire touring musicians like that have a musical director that literally would hand the drummer all the click tracks pre-programmed for the show in rehearsals. That's the norm nowadays. I have several friends that have gotten gigs as touring musicians and that's pretty much been there experience every time. As a side note though, I'd bet you that 90% of the audience either (1) doesn't even know what a click track is or (2) can't tell or doesn't notice during the show that the band is using one.
Click tracks aside though, Kotow you should go to a DT show. Do it.
I'm not crazy about the fact they kind of just stand there, but they are also playing such complicated music that running around isn't really possible
No i've never seen DT live.All opinions are valid, but it's kinda weird that you assume it's gonna be boring without having experienced it beforehand. A live concert, regardless of its format, is an experience filled with emotion and excitement. Why do you think electronic music concerts are so popular? Even though there's not really a 'musical performance' going on per se, there's something magical in watching the artist doing his/her thing on a stage. It's ok if you're not big on gigs, but it's just kinda weird given you're a musician lol.
I'm not big on going to gigs as it is.
And from what I hear - they just sort of stand there and play to a click. That would be boring to me.
I'm not crazy about the fact they kind of just stand there, but they are also playing such complicated music that running around isn't really possible
Well, they could, but they don't feel that need anymore
I know that bands are often playing to a click nowadays. The son of an old friend is making a good living since graduating in music, playing drums for artists on tour. He plays always with a click, I could not believe it. I mean, the drummer used to be the leader and I can believe they do that even for a 3 chord rock song.
I would be surprised if a hired gun, touring drummer would not be told he was going to be playing to click in that situation. Usually, artists that hire touring musicians like that have a musical director that literally would hand the drummer all the click tracks pre-programmed for the show in rehearsals. That's the norm nowadays. I have several friends that have gotten gigs as touring musicians and that's pretty much been there experience every time. As a side note though, I'd bet you that 90% of the audience either (1) doesn't even know what a click track is or (2) can't tell or doesn't notice during the show that the band is using one.
Click tracks aside though, Kotow you should go to a DT show. Do it.
Green day for me too probably and I definitely prefer a spontaneous band like that over a band that basically plays the CD live.Neither here nor there, but I remember an interview with Tre and he was talking about how they don't play with a click track live because he feels that it ruins the experience and that it doesn't feel natural
I saw them in 2009 and they played for 2 hours and 40 minutes and after that I was ready to go home.
Standing in one place gets old after 5 hours.
I also just looked, for the Worcester venue there's a massive amount of seats left. It looks like they will play in front of a half-empty venue.
Green day for me too probably and I definitely prefer a spontaneous band like that over a band that basically plays the CD live.Neither here nor there, but I remember an interview with Tre and he was talking about how they don't play with a click track live because he feels that it ruins the experience and that it doesn't feel natural
I saw them in 2009 and they played for 2 hours and 40 minutes and after that I was ready to go home.
Standing in one place gets old after 5 hours.
Kev, we're saying nobody wants to eat at McDonald's twice in a row, whereas you're saying you've eaten two five-star dinners in a row. Those two statements aren't mutually exclusive.
Green day for me too probably and I definitely prefer a spontaneous band like that over a band that basically plays the CD live.Neither here nor there, but I remember an interview with Tre and he was talking about how they don't play with a click track live because he feels that it ruins the experience and that it doesn't feel natural
I saw them in 2009 and they played for 2 hours and 40 minutes and after that I was ready to go home.
Standing in one place gets old after 5 hours.
I could never play to a click. That's not what playing live is to me and it would feel like an exam and not a gig.
At the Baltimore show last spring, I met a couple and their kids from Florida, saw NC and PA and Va and TN license plates in the parking garage.....it was the closest/most convenient day for many to attend. Most are not going to see TA again. We did enjoy the first experience, to sit and watch and listen and enjoy, but not again.
On the heels of an album/tour that has had lukewarm responses, the band toured again, and often in oversaturated areas. The band did not ask, but......a 60 minute 'best of' TA, followed by 75-90 minutes of 9-12 tracks from a rotating list of 15-18 songs would have worked out so much better. I would have gone to a weeknight show in PA, and my wife would have joined me for tonight's gig, if something along these lines had been offered.
Green day for me too probably and I definitely prefer a spontaneous band like that over a band that basically plays the CD live.Neither here nor there, but I remember an interview with Tre and he was talking about how they don't play with a click track live because he feels that it ruins the experience and that it doesn't feel natural
I saw them in 2009 and they played for 2 hours and 40 minutes and after that I was ready to go home.
Standing in one place gets old after 5 hours.
I could never play to a click. That's not what playing live is to me and it would feel like an exam and not a gig.
An exam and kind of cheating at it. But I understand that for that act there are some music pre recorded and to mix the whole thing together is easier with a click. I'm not a big fan of that for any kind of live shows though.
Another difference with the Scenes tour is they didn't only play Scenes.
Another difference with the Scenes tour is they didn't only play Scenes.
I wouldn't get to excited over the medley they played after the Scenes album.
Right, the spring tour in 2000 was all of Scenes and then the I&W/WDADU medley as the encore. That was it. And it was awesome.
Fascinating. You learn something new every day.
Right, the spring tour in 2000 was all of Scenes and then the I&W/WDADU medley as the encore. That was it. And it was awesome.
Well, the analogy was obviously a bit exaggerated. But, the point is that *obviously* very few people will have a problem watching a rendition of the top 1 album of a band twice. TA live is far less exciting, and so maybe it shouldn't be too surprising when people say "it's only gotten more mechanical over the years, so I would see an exact duplicate of a show that already wasn't too exciting".
I knew it was supposed to be a real theater atmosphere, but I couldn't help but feel a bit uncomfortable watch a metal rock show while sitting and the few people around me (among many empty seats) just sating there with blank looks on their faces. It felt so impersonal. I definitely wouldn't want to go through that again unless I felt like I could support the band more than just...sitting there.
Like always on DTF, I think these are complaints on a very high level, I saw TA twice this year in Paris and in Frankfurt, I really loved it, it was very different to the 8 DT concerts I saw before that, but just the right thing for TA.
After beeing at the concerts I liked TA even more, it did bring the whole thing to live, the guys are so nice, brilliant and humble when you get to talk to them.
It always almost hurts me when people complain about stuff I just don't get.
I really hope there will be a TA DVD.
I am looking forward to a new album with harder material, but TA is very much up on my favorite list.
:metal :hefdaddy :heart
Like always on DTF, I think these are complaints on a very high level, I saw TA twice this year in Paris and in Frankfurt, I really loved it, it was very different to the 8 DT concerts I saw before that, but just the right thing for TA.
After beeing at the concerts I liked TA even more, it did bring the whole thing to live, the guys are so nice, brilliant and humble when you get to talk to them.
It always almost hurts me when people complain about stuff I just don't get.
I really hope there will be a TA DVD.
I am looking forward to a new album with harder material, but TA is very much up on my favorite list.
:metal :hefdaddy :heart
I think I'm on the same page as you. I saw the band at Radio City and thought they were amazing (although it was my first DT show, so I'm probably biased). Whether or not the band plays with a click or rotates their setlist doesn't really matter to me. I'm still going to see songs I like being played by some of the best musicians in the world.
That said, obviously if you're not as high on TA as us, this tour probably isn't for you. :lol
Great! Now whenever I hear those opening chords of "Our New World" this is what I'm going to see in my head.
(https://m.popkey.co/454901/E8zk6_s-200x150.gif)
Personally I can't argue, I'm going to Dream Theater Presents The Astonishing Live for the final leg. This marks the first time I'd get to see them live, was too young and dumb to have seen them 11 years ago for the Gigantour when they came the first time to my knowledge. So I feel excited to get to see them in concert.
I love both images.Great! Now whenever I hear those opening chords of "Our New World" this is what I'm going to see in my head.
(https://m.popkey.co/454901/E8zk6_s-200x150.gif)
Could be worse. You could have this pop in your head:
(https://66.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcu5v00Yv11qakh43o1_500.gif)
Hey everyone!
Oh man, the violin and hand clapping noises in "Hymn of a thousand voices" is so far out of DTs normal comfort zone, I'm really appreciating that kind of experimentation. I think that's really what I'm finding so intriguing about this album; DT had settled into a very predictable album-writing pattern, and this album completely demolishes that pattern. I hope they continue this spirit on their next album.
Oh man, the violin and hand clapping noises in "Hymn of a thousand voices" is so far out of DTs normal comfort zone, I'm really appreciating that kind of experimentation. I think that's really what I'm finding so intriguing about this album; DT had settled into a very predictable album-writing pattern, and this album completely demolishes that pattern. I hope they continue this spirit on their next album.
Totally agree.
All these little elements like the violin, mandolin and bagpipes were really cool and i enjoy seeing the band trying different things. For that reason alone i enjoyed TA so much more than DT12So much better than DT12. It has not aged well for me at all. STR is still a top song for me, though.
You know what would be funny...if they didn't release it live at all, which would justify them doing two legs and saying it pretty much was the only chance to see it live.
You know what would be funny...if they didn't release it live at all, which would justify them doing two legs and saying it pretty much was the only chance to see it live.
I can see this being the case.
I wish they did a more interesting live album setting for a change. Except the almost unwatchable Chaos in Motion, DT's DVDs have been dark indoor concerts. Rush had their Rush in Rio, Pink Floyd had Pompeii, Queen had Live at Wembley. It would be nice to have a good outdoor DVD.
You know what would be funny...if they didn't release it live at all, which would justify them doing two legs and saying it pretty much was the only chance to see it live.
I wish they did a more interesting live album setting for a change. Except the almost unwatchable Chaos in Motion, DT's DVDs have been dark indoor concerts. Rush had their Rush in Rio, Pink Floyd had Pompeii, Queen had Live at Wembley. It would be nice to have a good outdoor DVD.
pretty good idea!
The Official Bootleg in Chile is the best example of this for DT though. That concert is actually really awesome cause the crowd is nuts too and it's a full blown DT set without any props.
Listening to a lot of Trans-Siberian Orchestra lately (we celebrate Christmas here starting September :lol ) and for some reason, I always think of The Astonishing as being in the same spirit as the TSO albums.
Seeing them live last night just confirmed to me that Act I is far superior to Act II. Most of the best songs are from Act I, and the few songs I can take or leave are on Act II (not counting the NOMAC tracks).
Ace of Faythe is definitely one of the more underrated songs from the record. The melodies in that one are just glorious.
Because, it is definitely not awesome at all. But it's cute you think so.
That part is amazing. It reveals what she's always been hiding and what's helped her through her life. The music player is significant for the character of Faythe.
That part is amazing. It reveals what she's always been hiding and what's helped her through her life. The music player is significant for the character of Faythe.
Kev and I love it.
That part is amazing. It reveals what she's always been hiding and what's helped her through her life. The music player is significant for the character of Faythe.
That part is amazing. It reveals what she's always been hiding and what's helped her through her life. The music player is significant for the character of Faythe.
Yes, I agree. Well said.
:)
Thanks Kev. You were right about the post you made back then. You are a really cool guy.
Ace of Faythe is definitely one of the more underrated songs from the record. The melodies in that one are just glorious.
Underrated? Actually, I find Act of Faythe to be really silly: "My MUUUUUSIC player"
That part makes me want to barf. It's so.....ugh. :-\
Reported for trying to egg on an argument.Don't waste my time like this. You were the only one I saw egging anything on. She and Kev were just standing up for their opinions, which you had already slagged. If you can't take it, then you sure as hell shouldn't dish it out.
Add me to the group that loves Act of Faythe.Yes
On my first few listens I did think that "my music player" part was kind of cheesey.Yup
But once you get passed that, you realize the song is really amazing and the melodies are so good.Definitely
It's one of the best ballads on the album,Agreed
but can't beat Chosen.:facepalm:
Cram takes a no hitter in a 0-0 game into the bottom of the 9th, and gives up a walk off home run.
Murican sportball?(https://fotos.fotoflexer.com/e81ae6c12ed22701a5462a2e3ac34b74.jpg)
Murican sportball?(https://fotos.fotoflexer.com/e81ae6c12ed22701a5462a2e3ac34b74.jpg)
Chosen is a track that I usually skip. I just don't think it goes anywhere.
Fave ballad. Well, they're all ballads aren't they? :lol
I think My Last Farewell is quite powerful. Losing Faythe is also pretty cool. The "Gabriel my son" part is awesome.
Ah, I'm with Cram on this one... Chosen is my favorite ballad on the album easily.Same here. I'm not generally a DT ballad guy. But they have written some fantastic ones in the Mangini era, and Chosen is right up there with the best of them.
Same here. I'm not generally a DT ballad guy. But they have written some fantastic ones in the Mangini era, and Chosen is right up there with the best of them.
Agreed about Chosen. Also, it's one of their more accessible songs that could be used to point a potential new fan to.
I think the best ballad is The X Aspect. One of the most touching lyrically.
Should I turn my back on him?
Abandon all our plans for revolution?
Will hope and freedom die by morning light?
My favorite part of the album is the guitar solo followed by "This very moment was always meant to be..." in When your time has come.
That gets me everytime
I am truly obsessed with Chosen. I actually think it's my favorite song on the whole album. That guitar solo was one of those moments when you just close your eyes while "seeing" it live and soak it in.
Losing Faythe is also pretty cool. The "Gabriel my son" part is awesome.
I think the best ballad is The X Aspect. One of the most touching lyrically.
That's true, This Is the Life, Beneath the Surface, The Bigger Picture, plus some good ballads on TA... That's a really good grouping of ballads.
Chosen is great, I also really like Begin Again a lot.
It really is hard to narrow it down to just a few favorites, but Chosen is up there; it's just a melodic gem.
...
Losing Faythe is one of my least favorites from the whole album, but that "Gabriel, my son" part at the end is pretty amazing. :hat
:rollin
What's your favorite ballad then? I am truly obsessed with Chosen. I actually think it's my favorite song on the whole album. That guitar solo was one of those moments when you just close your eyes while "seeing" it live and soak it in.
The echoey effects for the first section of Ravenskill put the picture in my mind that it's a misty morning, and despite the lyric "Through crowded streets...", I imagine the town square to be not that crowded at all, maybe around 7-8am. A few people here and there, perhaps going to get Ravenskill's equivalent of the morning paper, and it's one of these that Faythe speaks to.
I really think after many many listens and seeing the show twice that Whispers in the Wind is the only song I really am not a big fan of. There were a few other tracks that I didn't really enjoy initially, but over time I've come to enjoy them except this one.
I really think after many many listens and seeing the show twice that Whispers in the Wind is the only song I really am not a big fan of. There were a few other tracks that I didn't really enjoy initially, but over time I've come to enjoy them except this one.
I'm with you on Whispers. It's pretty short, but I feel it kinda takes away some of the momentum that was built up towards the end of Losing Faythe.
The echoey effects for the first section of Ravenskill put the picture in my mind that it's a misty morning, and despite the lyric "Through crowded streets...", I imagine the town square to be not that crowded at all, maybe around 7-8am. A few people here and there, perhaps going to get Ravenskill's equivalent of the morning paper, and it's one of these that Faythe speaks to.
It really is hard to narrow it down to just a few favorites, but Chosen is up there; it's just a melodic gem.
...
Losing Faythe is one of my least favorites from the whole album, but that "Gabriel, my son" part at the end is pretty amazing. :hat
Considering that the first significant part of Losing Faythe is a direct reprise of Chosen, these statements are somewhat contradictory, with all due respect.
When I listen to the album, one of the songs that sticks out to me is Ravenskill. I feel like that track embodies the theatrical nature they were going for, especially the part after "Take my hand, we haven't time to spare" That riff with the keyboard sounds awesome and then after "Will be revealed, when she sheds her disguise" that choir patch that JR uses. It just has so many epic moments and feels theatrical--like I can picture it happening onstage during a play. The emotion that JLB puts into Faythe's part "There's a chance we can still end this game"
I just really like that song
If I went to the show and they skipped The X Aspect of all things, I would've been greatly disappointed
I don't know, it sounds like they are making up the increased play time by cutting TA songs. Maybe it's a curfew problem or something.I hope that's what it is.
I don't know, it sounds like they are making up the increased play time by cutting TA songs. Maybe it's a curfew problem or something.I hope that's what it is.
Does ANYONE besides me like Whispers on the Wind? I know for a lot of you it kills the mood or something, maybe I'm just weird, but I really liked it.
I don't know, it sounds like they are making up the increased play time by cutting TA songs. Maybe it's a curfew problem or something.I hope that's what it is.
I think the San Antonio show had a curfew. The show ended at 10:15pm and the parking was only valid until 1030pm. I think most of these opera houses/theater venues have early curfews.
Man, that's rough then. I mean, I'm not even that much a fan of TA, but when I went to see them in Boston, I came to see TA in totality. Had they replaced songs with staple songs, I probably wouldn't have been happy.
When I listened to it the other day, it dawned on me that Dystopian Overture sounds "right" as a piece of music. Every section is meant to be there, and to be preceded and followed by the sections/themes they are preceded and followed by. It's not just a procession of themes for the sake of it. It serves a purpose to transport us into the world of the story.
Whispers on the wind is wonderful, the darkest point of the album as far as I'm concerned. Excellent song.
Still love this album, i have to say. Even though it's not suited for a casual listen, it's ambitious, it's different and it showed a DT that is willing to take risks and try something different. I really appreciate that mentality.I love the epic endings, it elevates to a whole new level and puts me in a better mood.. I say keep up the good work DT!!!
The only downside which seems to be the case with all the recent DT albums, is the forced "epicness" especially during the song endings, which becomes a little cheesy and a little stale after a few times.
Still love this album, i have to say. Even though it's not suited for a casual listen, it's ambitious, it's different and it showed a DT that is willing to take risks and try something different. I really appreciate that mentality.I love the epic endings, it elevates to a whole new level and puts me in a better mood.. I say keep up the good work DT!!!
The only downside which seems to be the case with all the recent DT albums, is the forced "epicness" especially during the song endings, which becomes a little cheesy and a little stale after a few times.
I see a live DVD release highly unlikely at this point. It appears they are done with their Astonishing shows for good (given the upcoming I&W European tour). Maybe there will be an Asian leg for the Astonishing live, but the DVD possibility seems to be less likely each passing day.
I hope I'm wrong tho. A live release would be very nice.
Maybe they have allready filmed a show and are just keeping hush hush about it. If that was the case though, some fan would have likely posted something about it on this forum or on social media.
Just a note from a youtube video I was watching today, I think it's one of mr.dreamtheater2's vids. 1993 rare studio jam or something, with newspaper interviews as the background. In one of those interviews, James actually states that way back then, one of the things that he wanted to do was a musical. Looks like he got his wish many, many years later haha.
Oh absolutely, that was a show I wish I could have been to for sure.Just a note from a youtube video I was watching today, I think it's one of mr.dreamtheater2's vids. 1993 rare studio jam or something, with newspaper interviews as the background. In one of those interviews, James actually states that way back then, one of the things that he wanted to do was a musical. Looks like he got his wish many, many years later haha.
Very true. The Theater Equation was pretty awesome. :hat
So why is DT skipping songs from TA on the past few shows? I saw it being discussed, just don't know if anyone knew the reason.
Does anyone know for sure what songs from TA were left out of the recent tour to make room for the encore tunes?
That is correct.
Holy crap, some amazing songs were left out. I really think doing that was a bad idea.Does anyone know for sure what songs from TA were left out of the recent tour to make room for the encore tunes?
The X Aspect
The Road to Revolution
Heaven's Cove
Begin Again
Whisper's in the Wind
At least that's what Setlist.fm says was cut from the show on Nov. 20th.
Holy crap, some amazing songs were left out. I really think doing that was a bad idea.Does anyone know for sure what songs from TA were left out of the recent tour to make room for the encore tunes?
The X Aspect
The Road to Revolution
Heaven's Cove
Begin Again
Whisper's in the Wind
At least that's what Setlist.fm says was cut from the show on Nov. 20th.
everything is never enough lolsHoly crap, some amazing songs were left out. I really think doing that was a bad idea.Does anyone know for sure what songs from TA were left out of the recent tour to make room for the encore tunes?
The X Aspect
The Road to Revolution
Heaven's Cove
Begin Again
Whisper's in the Wind
At least that's what Setlist.fm says was cut from the show on Nov. 20th.
I guess DT can't win no matter what they do.
The Astonishing is 2:10. Add a little applause, etc, it's maybe 2:15 live. They added about 25 minutes. Add 5 more for the encore break and you're at 2:45 which is right around what the Along for the Ride tour was. So they could have done it. They just chose not to. Which is their prerogative but it wasn't undoable to do the whole of The Astonishing and still add 30 minutes.Holy crap, some amazing songs were left out. I really think doing that was a bad idea.Does anyone know for sure what songs from TA were left out of the recent tour to make room for the encore tunes?
The X Aspect
The Road to Revolution
Heaven's Cove
Begin Again
Whisper's in the Wind
At least that's what Setlist.fm says was cut from the show on Nov. 20th.
I guess DT can't win no matter what they do.
The Astonishing is 2:10. Add a little applause, etc, it's maybe 2:15 live. They added about 25 minutes. Add 5 more for the encore break and you're at 2:45 which is right around what the Along for the Ride tour was. So they could have done it. They just chose not to. Which is their prerogative but it wasn't undoable to do the whole of The Astonishing and still add 30 minutes.Holy crap, some amazing songs were left out. I really think doing that was a bad idea.Does anyone know for sure what songs from TA were left out of the recent tour to make room for the encore tunes?
The X Aspect
The Road to Revolution
Heaven's Cove
Begin Again
Whisper's in the Wind
At least that's what Setlist.fm says was cut from the show on Nov. 20th.
I guess DT can't win no matter what they do.
I imagined it first as a Dream Theater show, and then of course as a Dream Theater album, but beyond that, there’s a video game that is in development, there’s a novel that is in development. And one of the other things is that, yes, it would fit perfectly, I think, adapted as a musical, in the same way that The Who did that successfully with ‘Tommy’, and Green Day more recently with ‘American Idiot’ on broadway. So yeah, that would be amazing.
None of that stuff will happen, honestly. The first leg of the tour went fine, but the second one was a plain disaster. Who will honestly play a smartphone game a year after an album came out? Not many. Who would read a novel about a plot that already in lyrics form was cringeworthy in a lot of places? Not many.
DT aren't screenwriters, or authors. They are musicians. The earlier they return to what they are best at, the better.
TA wasn't well received, and DT is best advised moving on. To some degree I think they know that, I think the IAW tour is a direct acknowledgement of that.Are you saying that you believe this next run of European dates was originally intended to be a TA leg?
DTF for many reasons isn't a good measuring stick. If you look at social media like Facebook or YouTube, rating sites like Sputnik and RYM, and ticketing sites like Ticketmaster,
I'm really debating if I should go see TA live. They are in Charlotte the 28th and while I don't care for TA I'd like to support the guys. There are tickets a plenty.
Are you saying that you believe this next run of European dates was originally intended to be a TA leg?
I think for DT, DTF is a relatively decent measuring stick. TA got plenty of criticisms around here. I think DT has always been fairly scrutinized around here.
Dude, what? Really??
I'm assuming we will now go into the "discredit each site separately, ignoring its aggregate power" part of the discussion.
I wouldn't even know where to begin trying to discredit those sites. I've never heard of them. Looks like you can submit ratings.
The album has had a mediocre lukewarm reception here. I don't have any issues using DTF as a barometer.
As I said, we now entered the "diss every site separately, disregarding their aggregate power" state of the discussion. I mean, of course, each of those 1,500 votes are just one single guy's opinion! Even when they liked IAW and SFAM beforehand!
Sigh.
DTF for many reasons isn't a good measuring stick. If you look at social media like Facebook or YouTube, rating sites like Sputnik and RYM, and ticketing sites like Ticketmaster, there's one conclusion: TA wasn't well received, and DT is best advised moving on. To some degree I think they know that, I think the IAW tour is a direct acknowledgement of that.
I guess I have a few thoughts on The Astonishing.
- Based on overall tour attendance and low ratings in certain corners of the internet, I think it's fair to say that The Astonishing had a mixed reception. :sadpanda:
- Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but if I remember correctly, the European and first American legs of the tour were relatively successful. Maybe attendance was a little down, but that's to be expected when you're only playing new stuff.
It seems like where things started to go off the rails a little was the second American leg. The decision to play so many shows in so many weird markets was a strange one, at least to me. Even if the band was doing greatest hit-type shows, would that leg have been a success? I don't know. It would have been tough, either way.
- While the album's ratings on some websites are bad, I don't think it's all doom and gloom. Prog Archives rates the album as being around the middle of the band's discography. Critical reception was actually very good. Most YouTube videos have a 90% like rating. Look, it doesn't have the same esteem as OK Computer or even Scenes from a Memory, but it's not Lulu either. :lol
I guess my general point of view is that there are areas for concern in the Dream Theater world right now, but as long as the band learns from a few of the mistakes they've made along the way, all will be fine. I personally think that The Astonishing was one of their best albums, and can't wait to see it live in a few weeks.
DTF for many reasons isn't a good measuring stick. If you look at social media like Facebook or YouTube, rating sites like Sputnik and RYM, and ticketing sites like Ticketmaster, there's one conclusion: TA wasn't well received, and DT is best advised moving on. To some degree I think they know that, I think the IAW tour is a direct acknowledgement of that.
Oh I have already said that (about FB and shows attendances)and my comments were described as "laughable" to say the least. I salute you for daring sharing your opinion like that.
That price looks about right when you look at the extras it comes with, but are they going to release a standard edition of the book that's cheaper? The novel only had niche appeal to begin with, and this is niche even within that niche.
That would make no business sense at all. I just can't see them only selling this is a limited high-cost special edition, so I would expect a normal edition to follow on paperback & kindle. I have no inside knowledge at all by the way, but not doing a full release would be the dumbest idea.That price looks about right when you look at the extras it comes with, but are they going to release a standard edition of the book that's cheaper? The novel only had niche appeal to begin with, and this is niche even within that niche.
The facebook post makes it seem like this is the first press, period.
A little disappointed by that, honestly. I was hoping they'd do a novel that would stand on its own merits, rather than a novelty item.
That would make no business sense at all. I just can't see them only selling this is a limited high-cost special edition, so I would expect a normal edition to follow on paperback & kindle. I have no inside knowledge at all by the way, but not doing a full release would be the dumbest idea.That price looks about right when you look at the extras it comes with, but are they going to release a standard edition of the book that's cheaper? The novel only had niche appeal to begin with, and this is niche even within that niche.
The facebook post makes it seem like this is the first press, period.
A little disappointed by that, honestly. I was hoping they'd do a novel that would stand on its own merits, rather than a novelty item.
In my eyes TA was an ambitious project for DT and I think they fell short.
I don't know what DT were planning, but I think after playing to 10 rows of fans in several venues, they said "We're hemorrhaging money, we need to bring back the fans. IAW 25th is coming up, let's tour on that."
There's certainly potential for a novelisation to be very good. I sort of agree that all the world-building was a bit too big in scope for the actual album which really only ended up covering the character story. So there should be plenty of scope to cover much more ground and produce something much deeper, narratively, and from what the author has said it sounds like JP is very open to that.In my eyes TA was an ambitious project for DT and I think they fell short.
My main theory in that regard is that the scope of the project was just so vast that they stretched themselves too thin.
I must say, there's a danger this multilevel, multimedia novel falls into the same trap. The size of this thing already reads like a Lord of the Rings Collector Edition.
I don't know what DT were planning, but I think after playing to 10 rows of fans in several venues, they said "We're hemorrhaging money, we need to bring back the fans. IAW 25th is coming up, let's tour on that."
:lol I can guarantee that that wasn't the conversation.
There's certainly potential for a novelisation to be very good. I sort of agree that all the world-building was a bit too big in scope for the actual album which really only ended up covering the character story. So there should be plenty of scope to cover much more ground and produce something much deeper, narratively, and from what the author has said it sounds like JP is very open to that.In my eyes TA was an ambitious project for DT and I think they fell short.
My main theory in that regard is that the scope of the project was just so vast that they stretched themselves too thin.
I must say, there's a danger this multilevel, multimedia novel falls into the same trap. The size of this thing already reads like a Lord of the Rings Collector Edition.
So it all depends on the execution. It could turn out incredibly corny.
For instance, I hope they don't feel like they need to write a "musical" to justify softer ballads, interesting vocal parts and deliveries, and less traditionally structured songs. Hope they return to some of these ideas with a less "out there" lyrical concept.
Quite simply, The Astonishing was a bust!
Quite simply, The Astonishing was a bust!
Not by any realistic standard. Sorry, but you could not be more wrong.
The problem is when people start calling it crap or a failure instead of just saying "I didn't like it". Lots of times, people mistake personal opinion with saying whatever they want, and that's awful.
I mean I read one theory that they are playing I&W instead of TA because TA is not going over well. Yikes. C'mon !I'm not one of the "lol asstonishing sucks" haters, but I can't help thinking that the mediocre attendances on the 2nd US leg affected their plans, because in early October JP posted this video (https://www.facebook.com/dreamtheater/videos/10153777934577181/), where he said European and Asian fans would get one more chance to see TA live next year. Clearly the band had intended to add more dates, but for one reason or another we're getting the I&W tour instead.
unfortunately even the individual good tracks don't get a lot of plays from me, because they don't work that well out of context.
I mean I read one theory that they are playing I&W instead of TA because TA is not going over well. Yikes. C'mon !I'm not one of the "lol asstonishing sucks" haters, but I can't help thinking that the mediocre attendances on the 2nd US leg affected their plans, because in early October JP posted this video (https://www.facebook.com/dreamtheater/videos/10153777934577181/), where he said European and Asian fans would get one more chance to see TA live next year. Clearly the band had intended to add more dates, but for one reason or another we're getting the I&W tour instead.
Quite simply, The Astonishing was a bust!
Not by any realistic standard. Sorry, but you could not be more wrong.
Between the bitching and linking of JLB performances, to a new negative thread about the novel, to comments about how unpopular the albums is, it's all just really tiring. While I understand it's critiques, personally I like the album, but there seems to be a handful of folks here that just can't get past it for some reason.
At this point, EVERY album seems to divide the fans. Discussion is one thing, but there's a constant "nagging" going on. I mean I read one theory that they are playing I&W instead of TA because TA is not going over well. Yikes. C'mon ! Let it go folks, and maybe you'll like the next album. Meanwhile TA is almost a year old and the repointing out of every wart it has is just plain exhausting.
Quite simply, The Astonishing was a bust!
Not by any realistic standard. Sorry, but you could not be more wrong.
Between the bitching and linking of JLB performances, to a new negative thread about the novel, to comments about how unpopular the albums is, it's all just really tiring. While I understand it's critiques, personally I like the album, but there seems to be a handful of folks here that just can't get past it for some reason.
At this point, EVERY album seems to divide the fans. Discussion is one thing, but there's a constant "nagging" going on. I mean I read one theory that they are playing I&W instead of TA because TA is not going over well. Yikes. C'mon ! Let it go folks, and maybe you'll like the next album. Meanwhile TA is almost a year old and the repointing out of every wart it has is just plain exhausting.
Thanks for posting this. I agree. Some of the recent complaints seemed to be piling it on a little. Remember to always keep it seasoned, people! :hat
Quite simply, The Astonishing was a bust!
Not by any realistic standard. Sorry, but you could not be more wrong.
Between the bitching and linking of JLB performances, to a new negative thread about the novel, to comments about how unpopular the albums is, it's all just really tiring. While I understand it's critiques, personally I like the album, but there seems to be a handful of folks here that just can't get past it for some reason.
At this point, EVERY album seems to divide the fans. Discussion is one thing, but there's a constant "nagging" going on. I mean I read one theory that they are playing I&W instead of TA because TA is not going over well. Yikes. C'mon ! Let it go folks, and maybe you'll like the next album. Meanwhile TA is almost a year old and the repointing out of every wart it has is just plain exhausting.
Thanks for posting this. I agree. Some of the recent complaints seemed to be piling it on a little. Remember to always keep it seasoned, people! :hat
I agree for the most part as well. TA hit #11 on the billboard charts, that alone to me shows it's not a bust. But I do believe the 2nd round of TA shows in NA were a bust and I won't say that I&W tour is directly due to that, but I can't help but believe that DT as a band feel they need to do something to gather more positive attention following a poor fan turnout on that second leg.
Bad news. Doctor told me I had to cut cheese out of my diet. So long The Astonishing. :angel::rollin
Bad news. Doctor told me I had to cut cheese out of my diet. So long The Astonishing. :angel:
poor fan turnout on that second leg.
Almost a year down the line and the newness has definitely worn off. I still stand by my opinion that this is the best thing they've ever released. It's not perfect, but it has more chills down the spine moments than any other album I've ever listened to.
I'm actually gutted that the fan reaction will probably mean that we won't get anything like this again.
I'm actually gutted that the fan reaction will probably mean that we won't get anything like this again.
Idea for DT14 :
Everyone in the band - all 5 members - write an album of their own songs. They then take the best songs - not necessarily an equal amount of each - just the best songs overall.
Petrucci pretty much wrote The Astonishing on his own [with Rudess also composing] - but JP came up with the idea and the characters and story and ALL the lyrics.
And it was a double album. He probably wouldn't mind doing less next time.
Listening to The Astonishing again to cap off 2016.
Wow, Myung's bass playing is superb. That's how you play bass with all the layered orchestration of numerous instruments.
Almost a year down the line and the newness has definitely worn off. I still stand by my opinion that this is the best thing they've ever released. It's not perfect, but it has more chills down the spine moments than any other album I've ever listened to.Well, I also think it was fantastic, but I wouldn't want anything like this again.
I'm actually gutted that the fan reaction will probably mean that we won't get anything like this again.
I don't think that type of album would sound like a DT album.
Almost a year down the line and the newness has definitely worn off. I still stand by my opinion that this is the best thing they've ever released. It's not perfect, but it has more chills down the spine moments than any other album I've ever listened to.
I'm actually gutted that the fan reaction will probably mean that we won't get anything like this again.
I agree with all of this! I guess I can see why so many fans may not feel the same way. The downside to DT being so varied in their music, is that the fans are varied also. They will never be able to please everyone. But in my opinion it is their greatest work and I'm still finding new moments that I'm loving even more!
I don't think that type of album would sound like a DT album.It doesn't have to, though.
Even if The Astonishing was terrible - i'd rather they took a risk once in a while instead of putting out safe album after safe album.
Album of the year for me. Saw it live twice and still haven't gotten tired of listening to it.
Even if The Astonishing was terrible - i'd rather they took a risk once in a while instead of putting out safe album after safe album.
Exactly. I happen to love it, but there's no way anyone can call it DT By Numbers.
Well, re-listening to the Astonishing (this is probably the 3rd time that I've listened to it in full, aside from hearing the songs as their own from time to time,) and it holds up well. I'm approaching Hymn of a Thousand Voices and I'm re-reading the concept of The Astonishing on, yes, Wikipedia and I actually shed a bit of a tear now regarding the whole people in the town coming together and singing which led to Gabriel regaining his ability to sing and bring Faythe back to life.
The power of music is a powerful tool indeed. So, if there's one thing that I'm glad Dream Theater brought with this album, is their ability to tell a story about how great music can be and the obstacles it goes through to be presented in its purest form, but present it in their own way through a fictional story.
Even if The Astonishing was terrible - i'd rather they took a risk once in a while instead of putting out safe album after safe album.
I'm very, very pleased with this album. It has been a total trip to listen to.
I stopped listening to it, but because of the natural cycle of listening to music and finding new stuff and new releases, not because I got bored of it. I enjoyed entirely the album and I still have it on my mp3 player just in case, I haven't removed it yet.
I stopped listening to it, but because of the natural cycle of listening to music and finding new stuff and new releases, not because I got bored of it. I enjoyed entirely the album and I still have it on my mp3 player just in case, I haven't removed it yet.
So, you still have it in your muuuuuusic plaaaaaayer :biggrin:
Even if The Astonishing was terrible - i'd rather they took a risk once in a while instead of putting out safe album after safe album.
Exactly. I happen to love it, but there's no way anyone can call it DT By Numbers.
Same here. I still have a difficult time ranking the album. And I still feel that, because of the different nature of the album as well as its length, it may not have the staying power for me in the discography ranking. But here's the thing...I fully expected that I would really like the album for a few months, and then it would gradually start to fall off my radar and fade away as I began looking forward to the new album. That is the complete opposite of what happened the last two album cycles. When the s/t came out, I was still spinning ADTOE constantly and couldn't get enough of it, and I could hardly believe a new album was almost upon us already when I wasn't even remotely tired of the previous one. When TA came out, I felt the same way about DT12. I fully expected that to NOT happen with TA, and expected that it would be slipping by now. Actually, quite the opposite. I am loving it now more than ever, and that honestly surprises me.
To put it another way, I was thankful for the grand experiment that was The Astonishing when it came out. And as a grand experiment so late in their career, I recognized that it is a huge accomplishment and a significant milestone. But beyond that, I did not expect it to have a lasting musical impact on me. Or at least, I wasn't sure that it would. I am pleasantly surprised to find that I feel it is an important part of the musical landscape of DT's career, and I am hugely thankful that they composed this album for us to listen to and enjoy.
Also somewhat unexpectedly, one of the things that pushed it over the edge for me was the second time I saw the live show in Reno. That night was so unexpectedly magical. Oddly, talking to the band after the show, I'm not sure they felt the same way from the stage. But everyone around me in the pit and those I talked to afterwards back in the seats all thought it was a fantastic show. I still involuntarily think back on that show when I listen to the album, and that gives a new dimension to the songs.
Also somewhat unexpectedly, one of the things that pushed it over the edge for me was the second time I saw the live show in Reno. That night was so unexpectedly magical. Oddly, talking to the band after the show, I'm not sure they felt the same way from the stage. But everyone around me in the pit and those I talked to afterwards back in the seats all thought it was a fantastic show. I still involuntarily think back on that show when I listen to the album, and that gives a new dimension to the songs.
My musical theater friends liked it more than my friends who are prog fans. :lol I hope one day it would be performed with different vocalists to realize the musical's potential.
My musical theater friends liked it more than my friends who are prog fans. :lolAlso somewhat unexpectedly, one of the things that pushed it over the edge for me was the second time I saw the live show in Reno. That night was so unexpectedly magical. Oddly, talking to the band after the show, I'm not sure they felt the same way from the stage. But everyone around me in the pit and those I talked to afterwards back in the seats all thought it was a fantastic show. I still involuntarily think back on that show when I listen to the album, and that gives a new dimension to the songs.
I will never get a chance to see Dream Theater live. But when I listened to TA, I knew already that it would translate well live because it was really written as a stage musical. That's why I was annoyingly insistent to the other posters that this is not really a concept album ala SFAM, Operation: Mindcrime, Savatage's Streets, etc. It's a musical, although sung by just a single vocalist, more akin to Jesus Christ Superstar, as pointed out by another DTF member, Sebastian. My musical theater friends liked it more than my friends who are prog fans. :lol I hope one day it would be performed with different vocalists to realize the musical's potential.
My musical theater friends liked it more than my friends who are prog fans. :lolAlso somewhat unexpectedly, one of the things that pushed it over the edge for me was the second time I saw the live show in Reno. That night was so unexpectedly magical. Oddly, talking to the band after the show, I'm not sure they felt the same way from the stage. But everyone around me in the pit and those I talked to afterwards back in the seats all thought it was a fantastic show. I still involuntarily think back on that show when I listen to the album, and that gives a new dimension to the songs.
I will never get a chance to see Dream Theater live. But when I listened to TA, I knew already that it would translate well live because it was really written as a stage musical. That's why I was annoyingly insistent to the other posters that this is not really a concept album ala SFAM, Operation: Mindcrime, Savatage's Streets, etc. It's a musical, although sung by just a single vocalist, more akin to Jesus Christ Superstar, as pointed out by another DTF member, Sebastian. My musical theater friends liked it more than my friends who are prog fans. :lol I hope one day it would be performed with different vocalists to realize the musical's potential.
You have to be kidding :rollin
Without having to scroll through this entire thread, is there any possibility they are going to release this on DVD/BluRay? I'd really like to have this presented live. I truly enjoy this release and have listened to it many times.
That would be awesome! I hope that comes to fruition, it would be a shame not to. It is too good of a production and performance to let slip through the cracks..
If they aren't doing it before the I&W tour, I don't think they'll ever do it. DT has always maintained a tight schedule. My guess is they'll go straight into working on the next album after I&W, tour for that, and The Astonishing related projects will gradually disappear.Well, no. I just addressed this three posts above yours. They are NOT going to do it before the I&W tour and are still deciding whether it will work and make sense to do it immediately after.
I think it's more about the effort it would take to resurrect the whole album after many months of not playing it. That's a sizeable amount of work; of course it can be done, but DT is usually not a particularly backward-looking band, I think they would just enter the studio and go for the next album instead.
I think it's more about the effort it would take to resurrect the whole album after many months of not playing it. That's a sizeable amount of work; of course it can be done, but DT is usually not a particularly backward-looking band, I think they would just enter the studio and go for the next album instead.Yes, and JP expressed that exact sentiment. But at the same time, he and the rest of the band also feel it is important to try to capture it, so they are leaving the door open and will decide once the I&W tour is winding down. The distinct impression I got is that it really could go either way. While what you are saying is dead on, keep in mind that they also have a specific city in mind, which isn't something they would have decided on if they were leaning heavily toward completely scrapping the idea.
I think it's more about the effort it would take to resurrect the whole album after many months of not playing it. That's a sizeable amount of work; of course it can be done, but DT is usually not a particularly backward-looking band, I think they would just enter the studio and go for the next album instead.Yes, and JP expressed that exact sentiment. But at the same time, he and the rest of the band also feel it is important to try to capture it, so they are leaving the door open and will decide once the I&W tour is winding down. The distinct impression I got is that it really could go either way. While what you are saying is dead on, keep in mind that they also have a specific city in mind, which isn't something they would have decided on if they were leaning heavily toward completely scrapping the idea.
Yes I saw that post. I was not saying that I think there is any possibility of them doing it before the I&W tour. I get that they are still considering it but a lot can change in a year. By the time they've finished the I&W tour and possibly come up with music for the next album, they might no longer be interested. Fan demand could make a difference too.If they aren't doing it before the I&W tour, I don't think they'll ever do it. DT has always maintained a tight schedule. My guess is they'll go straight into working on the next album after I&W, tour for that, and The Astonishing related projects will gradually disappear.Well, no. I just addressed this three posts above yours. They are NOT going to do it before the I&W tour and are still deciding whether it will work and make sense to do it immediately after.
It can go either way... Hmm, that seems fitting.
Should I turn my back on TA?
Abandon all our plans for a live DVD?
One thing that is slightly bothering me, that didn't until recently, (and once you hear it, you can't un-hear it) is the effects added to the vocals at various parts. I hesitate to say "autotune", but there's an unnatural, metallic-sounding effect that can be noticeable and distracting.I'm sure that line had to be worked on with studio trickery, but I don't think it's audible.
"Open eyes, let me see which choice is riiiiggghhhhttt" at the end of The Road to Revolution is a good example.
Yeah theres bit of that all over the disc. Most noticable for me is at the end of Act of Faythe, the very last line. Just sounds real weird!
It's still holding up well for me too, but these days I would tend to dip in and out of it rather than listen in a full pass.
One thing that is slightly bothering me, that didn't until recently, (and once you hear it, you can't un-hear it) is the effects added to the vocals at various parts. I hesitate to say "autotune", but there's an unnatural, metallic-sounding effect that can be noticeable and distracting.
"Open eyes, let me see which choice is riiiiggghhhhttt" at the end of The Road to Revolution is a good example.
It may just be the iTunes master - I haven't heard what the original CD sounds like.
[relatively] short answer: Yes, there is a possibility. How likely, we don't know. The Astonishing tour is done, and there are no specific plans in place to play the entire thing again. But that doesn't mean they won't do it. When I asked John Petrucci about it in November, he told me the plan is to focus on the I&W and Beyond tour right now, and there are no plans to do another leg for The Astonishing. However, they are considering whether to do a one-off show for a DVD. It is undecided. But if they do it, they already have a city picked out that they are leaning towards.
Okay, this might sound weird to some of you but do you know what I would like them to do? Release the files for the extended (and IMO proper) versions of the NOMAC tracks from Act 1. I've checked the run times of these live against the album and none of Act 2s were extended so its clear these were cut down due to disc space.I love that bit. It really set the stage for the story in the live setting. But then again, I have really developed an affinity for The Hunger Games, and the fact that that spiel is SO blatantly derivative of The Hunger Games that I can't help but love it. (same with the "song birds" line in The Gift of Music)
The thing is, to me they are the true versions. I love the effects and more importantly, with Descent you get the whole "The Empire toils for you so that you can toil for the Empire" spiel which actually sets the scene a bit better.
Just the MP3 files? They clearly exist somewhere!
Or is it just me who feels this way? :-\
[relatively] short answer: Yes, there is a possibility. How likely, we don't know. The Astonishing tour is done, and there are no specific plans in place to play the entire thing again. But that doesn't mean they won't do it. When I asked John Petrucci about it in November, he told me the plan is to focus on the I&W and Beyond tour right now, and there are no plans to do another leg for The Astonishing. However, they are considering whether to do a one-off show for a DVD. It is undecided. But if they do it, they already have a city picked out that they are leaning towards.
An album and show as grand as The Astonishing deserves a grand stage. For me that would be the Royal Albert Hall in London.
I just want the whole tracks dagnabbit!The request has been made and is being put through the proper channels.
I just want the whole tracks dagnabbit!The request has been made and is being put through the proper channels.
FYI, the tracks they used for the live show ARE the full tracks. So if you saw The Astonishing live, you have experienced the full NOMAC tracks.
FYI, the tracks they used for the live show ARE the full tracks. So if you saw The Astonishing live, you have experienced the full NOMAC tracks.
I just want the whole tracks dagnabbit!The request has been made and is being put through the proper channels.
FYI, the tracks they used for the live show ARE the full tracks. So if you saw The Astonishing live, you have experienced the full NOMAC tracks.
Excellent news bosk cheers!
I thought just as much, just seemed weird that all of them in Act 1 were extended from the album yet Act 2 was untouched!
Hey bosk, since they ended up scrapping the plans for a dvd, can you tell us what city they had their eye on?
If they do a "one-off" Astonishing show and put the word out that it will be filmed for a dvd, there are plenty of DT fans that would get plane tix and travel to the venue. It would be a sold out show and would be an epic release! I think I would travel for that one to be part of it. I really think they should do it, it just NEEDS to happen!
As far as the proper venue, Red Rocks amphitheater in Colarodo would be perfect. An easy place for fans to get to from around the country. Somewhere in Japan, England, or Italy would probably guarantee a big draw too. Still hoping this even happens.
"I watch, and I wait, and I praaayyy for an answer" :metal
[relatively] short answer: Yes, there is a possibility. How likely, we don't know. The Astonishing tour is done, and there are no specific plans in place to play the entire thing again. But that doesn't mean they won't do it. When I asked John Petrucci about it in November, he told me the plan is to focus on the I&W and Beyond tour right now, and there are no plans to do another leg for The Astonishing. However, they are considering whether to do a one-off show for a DVD. It is undecided. But if they do it, they already have a city picked out that they are leaning towards.
Vancouver is not the city.
Vancouver as not the city. But you are in the right country. :censored
Vancouver as not the city. But you are in the right country. :censored
Had to dig quite a whole to find this buried topic, but to me surely worthwhile. Since the Astonishing is aging so well on me, the novell as well as the album, I pretend on digging through these 121 pages. Just 'cause its fun and helping me with different perspectives on the album. Especially this album, being so different then all of their discography, it wouldn't bite me to read a lot about.