DreamTheaterForums.org Dream Theater Fan Site
General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: Nick on October 31, 2014, 12:44:22 PM
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Old one here: https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=1736.0
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Hey, I like this band, I think they are going places.
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Hey, I like this band. I will going places to see them.
(I know, I've said that like four times already. Well, I won't stop. SO EXCITED)
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Dude, I'm jealous.
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So the EP is excellent.
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Aquarius, such fresh sound, many sound of fishings being made. Circus.
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From previous thread:
Yet I was at their first international show. Ha!
That's pretty good I guess.
I was at their first show. :P
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I liked them before it was cool.
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Crystalised is a really great song.
The chorus has a very "The Mountain"-esque sound.
A bit like "Atlas Stone"...awesome!
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I liked them until they decided the US has to wait two weeks more than the rest of the world to buy their EP. Fine, I won't give you my money.
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The Mountain is prog classic in the league of Close To the Edge and Images & Words. One of the most refreshing albums I've heard in a long time. One year later and it still holds up for me.
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Nov 11th on iTunes? Ugh... Thanks for the info Hef.
I know as soon as I listen to the EP, I'm gonna wish it was a full length album.
The Mountain is prog classic in the league of Close To the Edge and Images & Words. One of the most refreshing albums I've heard in a long time. One year later and it still holds up for me.
Yeah, no doubt and during that year it kept getting better. :tup
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Following!
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The Mountain is prog classic in the league of Close To the Edge and Images & Words. One of the most refreshing albums I've heard in a long time. One year later and it still holds up for me.
Absolutely THIS! I could not agree more. As a matter of fact, it may eventually knock Hemispheres off the top spot as my personal favorite...but only the staying power of several years will tell for sure.
Seriously can't get enough of The Mountain
And my copy of Restoration just arrived today (I got *my* physical CD :metal :loser: ) and I'm seriously loving it. These guys can just do no wrong right now.
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It would definitely have to be in my top ten and among the prestigious league of perfect albums. Every single second of it is bliss.
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I liked them before it was cool.
I think I can apply for that as well :)
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Crystallised is so close to perfect it's insane
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The Mountain aged very well for me. Since I first heard it, it has only gotten better and better.
Restoration however, is probably my second favorite Haken release after Aquarius. Why it only takes the second spot is just because it's so 'short'. Had this EP been a full length album, it would have easily been my favorite of Haken's.
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I have ridiculous expectations on the next album, after the brilliance of The Mountain and now Restoration.
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Was at the gig in Manchester last night, great time, Ross has a great way of interacting with the crowd.
The only problem I had was the second support played too long so Haken had to skip the encore... Which if you had seen the setlist from a previous show, which I had, you'd understand why I was annoyed.
It was strange hearing some songs for the first time live because I haven't heard the EP yet.
I managed to get a high five and a handshake off Ray the drummer, had a quick chat too.
They all played in Christmas jumpers too ;D
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Was at the gig in Manchester last night, great time, Ross has a great way of interacting with the crowd.
The only problem I had was the second support played too long so Haken had to skip the encore... Which if you had seen the setlist from a previous show, which I had, you'd understand why I was annoyed.
I've got a bad feeling something similar is going to happen tonight in Edinburgh - the venue say the show will only go on until 10pm. The doors only open at 7, so that doesn't seem like long enough to get a good length of set from Haken with 2 other bands playing. :-\
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Was at the gig in Manchester last night, great time, Ross has a great way of interacting with the crowd.
The only problem I had was the second support played too long so Haken had to skip the encore... Which if you had seen the setlist from a previous show, which I had, you'd understand why I was annoyed.
I've got a bad feeling something similar is going to happen tonight in Edinburgh - the venue say the show will only go on until 10pm. The doors only open at 7, so that doesn't seem like long enough to get a good length of set from Haken with 2 other bands playing. :-\
Yeah, well our doors we're meant to be 7pm too but they opened around 7.30, so that combined with a lengthy support set meant Haken went past the curfew of 11pm WITHOUT the encore...
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If they are support bands, why don't Haken tell them to shorten their set and let the main event get their full show?
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When a band has a 2nd thread started about them, it surely means they're in the big leagues now. Last thread started well before their debut came out, so it's followed their progress since those very early days.
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Leprous are as awesome as Haken, it's right that they played almost the same time :biggrin:
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I'm watching their tour diaries on YouTube, they're hilarious :lol
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Leprous are as awesome as Haken, it's right that they played almost the same time :biggrin:
By the looks of the sets, they played longer than Haken last night!
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I'm watching their tour diaries on YouTube, they're hilarious :lol
I laughed so much watching them for the first time! The slow-mo Careless Whisper bit. The YMCA dance. :lol
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I'm watching their tour diaries on YouTube, they're hilarious :lol
Yea just saw MPs studio diary from the recording. :lol
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It was great to finally see these guys live last night, they put on a great show - brilliant performance. I was curious to see how Ross' vocals would hold up live, but he was pretty much perfect and seems like a really good front man too. Some of his dancing during a couple of the little jazzy breaks was :rollin
Not impressed with the venue though. They set a curfew of 10pm because they had another event on afterwards. This meant the doors opened at 6pm instead of 7pm. The venue didn't mention this change on their site, their Facebook page or anything. The only place the info was given out was by Haken on their own FB page a few hours before the start. I don't live in Edinburgh, so I couldn't get there for the early start, meaning I completely missed Maschine and a chunk of Leprous too. I don't know how many people were there for the start, but I doubt Maschine could have had many people watching them :'( Also, despite the early start, Haken still couldn't play as long as they wanted, so we didn't get Crystallised :sad:
But apart from that :P it was really good. Hope they come back to Scotland soon - preferably to a different venue!
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I'm watching their tour diaries on YouTube, they're hilarious :lol
The one from six months ago? That was awesome. :lol
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I'm watching their tour diaries on YouTube, they're hilarious :lol
The one from six months ago? That was awesome. :lol
Yeah, this one :lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SD1waw3qKSM
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Should we consider Haken among prog(-metal)'s big league now? Have they reached that status already with just three very-highly-regarded albums out? I certainly think so. In prog terms, I think Dream Theater defined the 90s and Porcupine Tree defined the 00s, and halfway through this decade, I think we can add Haken as the defining prog band of the 10s.
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I totally agree with DT defining the 1990s and Haken being the hottest band of the 2010s so far, but I never regarded Porcupine Tree as defining. Maybe Opeth?
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Should we consider Haken among prog(-metal)'s big league now? Have they reached that status already with just three very-highly-regarded albums out? I certainly think so. In prog terms, I think Dream Theater defined the 90s and Porcupine Tree defined the 00s, and halfway through this decade, I think we can add Haken as the defining prog band of the 10s.
No. Because as good as they are, they're very much a niche prog band and aren't anywhere near big enough to be the defining band of a decade yet. And highly regarded in this thread does not equal universal regard. People here oversell every band they like :rollin
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Should we consider Haken among prog(-metal)'s big league now?
Not as long as things like this happen.
They set a curfew of 10pm because they had another event on afterwards.
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:lol
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Is there even a "big league" of prog metal other than DT?
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DT is the biggest fish in the prog metal pond, yes. There are some bigger fish depending on how you define prog metal-Opeth, Between The Buried And Me-and then a layer of bands that are well known in the prog community but don't make much of a dent on the charts like Symphony X.
And then you have the layer Haken is in. :lol
In terms of exposure, Dream Theater is far and away the biggest prog metal band ever.
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I'm unsure that modern prog bands will even be able to ever reach DT's "fame level", since there are just so incredibly many prog bands out there these days. It only takes an hour of research to find several great prog bands. Haken is in my opinion the best of them all at the moment, and they are definetely pushing things farther than many others. But I don't they'll ever reach DT's league, even though I with my whole heart think they deserve it.
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In terms of exposure, Dream Theater is far and away the biggest prog metal band ever.
This, and like it or not it's probably going to stay that way. As much as we love Haken and other prog bands they aren't getting as big as DT got back in 92.
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In terms of exposure, Dream Theater is far and away the biggest prog metal band ever.
This, and like it or not it's probably going to stay that way. As much as we love Haken and other prog bands they aren't getting as big as DT got back in 92.
Yep have to agree on this. Pretty much the same as alot of these old rock/metal bands like IM, Metallica, Judas Priest, AC/DC, Black Sabbath and so on. The share amount of rock/metal bands these days makes it hard for one band to stick out and reach that level of fame like all the classic acts have done.
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Available now at Amazon and Itunes in the US
Itunes 9.99
Amazon 2.67 (have no idea why, but grab it while the price lasts)
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In terms of exposure, Dream Theater is far and away the biggest prog metal band ever.
This, and like it or not it's probably going to stay that way. As much as we love Haken and other prog bands they aren't getting as big as DT got back in 92.
Yep have to agree on this. Pretty much the same as alot of these old rock/metal bands like IM, Metallica, Judas Priest, AC/DC, Black Sabbath and so on. The share amount of rock/metal bands these days makes it hard for one band to stick out and reach that level of fame like all the classic acts have done.
Muse is doing pretty well ;)
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Muse is the perfect example of a band that was playing the right style of music in the right time in the right place.
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Been checking out Restoration and really starting to dig it. I think Haken is largely underrated because they are just out there. Way out there. However, I think they are pushing the envelope right now in directions that, in some ways, go beyond what DT has done.
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currently listening to the demo on youtube.
is there anyway I can get a hold of the files for each song from the demo? other than a youtube rip, of course...
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currently listening to the demo on youtube.
is there anyway I can get a hold of the files for each song from the demo? other than a youtube rip, of course...
Available now at Amazon and Itunes in the US
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no, I mean the 2007/08 demo. I have restoration.
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I didn't mean the "big league" in terms of mainstream success. Mainstream is totally separate from prog music, and the two will never fully intertwine. Sometimes they come close (DT in '92), but it never lasts, before going back to the dedicated fanbase who will follow the bands through every album.
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no, I mean the 2007/08 demo. I have restoration.
I'm not sure if they're still doing this, but if you contact their management they'll send you a copy of the demo.
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no, I mean the 2007/08 demo. I have restoration.
Oh, my bad.
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OK, so I finally got time to listen to Restoration.
Stunning. After one listen, I think this may be more powerful than The Mountain.
Maybe.
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no, I mean the 2007/08 demo. I have restoration.
I'm not sure if they're still doing this, but if you contact their management they'll send you a copy of the demo.
A couple of years ago, before Visions was released, you could still get their demo from them. I don't think they do this anymore.
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no, I mean the 2007/08 demo. I have restoration.
I'm not sure if they're still doing this, but if you contact their management they'll send you a copy of the demo.
A couple of years ago, before Visions was released, you could still get their demo from them. I don't think they do this anymore.
They did it for me a few months ago...but it was before Restoration came out. With this release, I'm not sure if they would still do it or not...but you could try. I just contacted them through their Facebook page.
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currently listening to the demo on youtube.
is there anyway I can get a hold of the files for each song from the demo? other than a youtube rip, of course...
I second this. I would love to have a copy. The song Manifolds is great. Would love to see that one live.
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Listened to the demo a couple of times. Not a big fan of the first 2 songs but Crystallised might just be my favorite Haken song.
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Listened to the demo a couple of times. Not a big fan of the first 2 songs but Crystallised might just be my favorite Haken song.
Demo? Do you mean the EP?
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Listened to the demo a couple of times. Not a big fan of the first 2 songs but Crystallised might just be my favorite Haken song.
Demo? Do you mean the EP?
Yeah, you know what I meant :P
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:omg: No post in a month?
So I have been listening on Restoration since it's release but haven't really voiced any reaction on it, on the other hand I have no desire writing any lengthy at this moment so I will keep it short.
All 3 songs have elements that I love about Haken. Darkest Light have the crunchy technical prog metal stuff. Earthlings is atmospheric, melancholic and moody. Crystallised is the grand epic that's like a honeypot with everything I like about Haken and prog metal in general. I love when they go back to the Verse/Chorus at 15:54 so epic and towards the end from 17:05 you have that nice feeling that you've been on a great adventure.
In short: I love it! :metal
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:tup :tup
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Crystallised is still one of the best songs I have heard. I hope they make something that can top it on their next album.
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From Facebook:
We're starting to put quite a collection of crazy music together for album #4! Hopefully all you ladies and gents will like it...
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:metal
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And the circus continues.. :caffeine:
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Awesome. If this gets a 2015 release it will definetely be one of my most anticipated of the year.
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So many great releases coming. 2015 is going to be an awesome year.
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I can't remember if I've asked this before or not, but I would like if someone with a working knowledge of music theory could breakdown what the heck is happening in the intrumental break of Deathless.
The base of the song is in standard 4/4, I understand that. But then the first part of the instrumental passage starts in 16th notes playing in a pattern of 1,2,3, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3, 4. At least, that's the way I hear it. I mean....it doesn't sound like a standard beat.... is that then 12/16? Or are they switching between 5/16 and 7/16? Also, what is that back rhythm that the bass and keyboards start playing when the guitar comes back in with the main 4/4 riff? It's just freaking SICK when they do it, but I get lost.
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Sounds like the whole thing is going from 5 to 7 for me.
As for the second part you mentioned, I hear it as the drums and guitar in 3/4 (what was previously the eighth note is now the quarter note) and the bass and keyboards are in 5/8. So it sounds all over the place but lines up every two bars. At around 6:37 everybody is in 3/4. You're right it is a strange part!
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Sounds like the whole thing is going from 5 to 7 for me.
As for the second part you mentioned, I hear it as the drums and guitar in 3/4 (what was previously the eighth note is now the quarter note) and the bass and keyboards are in 5/8. So it sounds all over the place but lines up every two bars. At around 6:37 everybody is in 3/4. You're right it is a strange part!
Oh that is just ********ING SICK!! I've said before (I think in the BTBAM thread) that I have a deep love for music that has a "puzzle box" aspect to it. There is a certain joy in trying to figure out something that is confusing on the surface.
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I remember a picture on their facebook showing the meter changes to a song from Visions with one bar in 31/32. Has anyone found where that measure is yet? ;D
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It would be extremely difficult to notice a bar like that. Honestly, I don't see the point if that's actually somewhere in there.
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I don't either.
They are just fucking with people now.
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I hate them because of this.
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I can't remember if I've asked this before or not, but I would like if someone with a working knowledge of music theory could breakdown what the heck is happening in the intrumental break of Deathless.
The base of the song is in standard 4/4, I understand that. But then the first part of the instrumental passage starts in 16th notes playing in a pattern of 1,2,3, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3, 4. At least, that's the way I hear it. I mean....it doesn't sound like a standard beat.... is that then 12/16? Or are they switching between 5/16 and 7/16? Also, what is that back rhythm that the bass and keyboards start playing when the guitar comes back in with the main 4/4 riff? It's just freaking SICK when they do it, but I get lost.
Yea to me that sounds correct. 12/16 is the meter and the guitar, bass distribute/play in 1,2,3, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3, 4. You can count the 6:37 as 6/8 but I think they still do 12/16 but with a triple feel. In the end though, who knows.
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I'm absolutely loving kicking this subject around. I've turned this question in to their Facebook PM....I'll see if I get a response on that and/or the 31/32 question. :nerd
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Holy crap! And now another DT fan from FB (not sure if he hangs around here or not....I don't always match up real names with DTF names) has pointed out that there's a shift at the 5:09 mark. Starting there, the count is 1,2,3,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3 The last "4 count" is dropped off the cycle. So it becomes a 5/16, 7/16, 5/16, 6/16 shift. Am I doing that right?
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HAKEN US TOUR DATES
https://hakenmusic.com/blog/post/north-american-tour-dates-2015-announced
I don't care what I have planned for that Sunday in Chicago. It's not as important.
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It sucks that they overlapped the Philly show with RoSfest, as I will have to see them in NYC instead. Hate going to NYC when Philly is an option. Still, I'll have the opportunity to see them twice, and won't pass that up.
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Anyone know anything about Bull Shooters Saloon? I mean, from the name, I'm picturing Bob's Country Bunker from The Blues Brothers movie.
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Awesome, great to see them get a US tour at last! :D
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Anyone know anything about Bull Shooters Saloon? I mean, from the name, I'm picturing Bob's Country Bunker from The Blues Brothers movie.
It be something special to hear them play rawhide all night.
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Anyone know anything about Bull Shooters Saloon? I mean, from the name, I'm picturing Bob's Country Bunker from The Blues Brothers movie.
It be something special to hear them play rawhide all night.
:metal
BTW, a date in Virginia? That MAY just be doable!
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Anyone know anything about Bull Shooters Saloon? I mean, from the name, I'm picturing Bob's Country Bunker from The Blues Brothers movie.
It be something special to hear them play rawhide all night.
If any band could pull that off it would damn sure be Haken :lol
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yeah, but it would be all circusy
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I'll be going to the NYC show! So excited!
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yeah, but it would be all circusy
Southerners like that sort of thing.
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I was considering the Springfield date until I found out that the date was at the venue that was formerly known as Jaxx, which makes it highly likely that it's just as much a dump as Jaxx was. I went there two times-once to see Blind Guardian and Symphony X and once to see Opeth, Nevermore, and Into Eternity-and the place was just awful. I never got why so many bands made it their stop in Northern Virginia, and honestly I should've figured out that the Empire venue was just Jaxx renamed.
Sorry, Haken, but I'm not driving six hours round trip to see you there. :lol
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Any Canadian fans that would want to see them in Toronto on their tour should join this (sorry to post this here) https://www.facebook.com/groups/339261966282405/?notif_t=group_r2j_approved
On their NA tour they're making it to Montreal but not anywhere near here and theres a bunch of us that want to make it happen!
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I think every thread needs to be about Haken. ;D
What a FREAKIN amazing band. My son and I were just talking about them today, and commenting about how we just don't seem to get burnt out on them. It's like, when you've heard some bands, you really like them for awhile but then you sortof get sick of listening to them and move on to something else. I just keep listening to Haken and never getting bored.
Even though The Mountain (for lyrical reasons) is still my favorite album with no contest (and the run of The Path-Falling Back to Earth may be the best opening 6 tracks of any album in history)....I think I am starting to get won over to Visions on a musical level. The Mountain goes from "ungodly" at the beginning to "fantastic" at the end. Visions is musically between the two...but for the entire album, rendering it more consistent. And it's almost a shame that Aquarius gets lost in the shuffle. Incredible album that just doesn't quite get to the otherworldly level of the other two.
I can't remember the last time I loved a band like this.
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Label me as one completely taken by their music...I may get hugely flamed for saying this here, but they were the first band to successfully dethrone DT as my favourite band (and DT held the title for a solid decade or so). What's even crazier is I've been able to take Skype lessons with Richard...that to me is just unreal; been easily wasting 15-20 minutes of every lesson asking him questions! lol
I'll be driving from Toronto to see them in Detroit, since Toronto was skipped over on the tour. Should be a crazy good time though, venue seems very small and intimate.
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Any Canadian fans that would want to see them in Toronto on their tour should join this (sorry to post this here) https://www.facebook.com/groups/339261966282405/?notif_t=group_r2j_approved
On their NA tour they're making it to Montreal but not anywhere near here and theres a bunch of us that want to make it happen!
Or if Facebook isn't your cup of tea, go here -> https://www.change.org/p/haken-management-and-respective-promoter-add-a-toronto-stop-to-the-upcoming-tour?just_created=true
Worst case we don't make anything happen, but at least we're able to show the band there is SOME love from people in this area.
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Certainly can't hurt, so go for it! The band are definitely aware of having a decent following in various places, but they have very limited say on where they can play, it's down to the promoters really. If this north American tour is well attended, though, I imagine the next one will be more extensive. This is a sort of testing-the-waters tour as it's their first one!
What's even crazier is I've been able to take Skype lessons with Richard...that to me is just unreal; been easily wasting 15-20 minutes of every lesson asking him questions! lol
That's awesome! Hen is such a cool guy.
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Certainly can't hurt, so go for it! The band are definitely aware of having a decent following in various places, but they have very limited say on where they can play, it's down to the promoters really. If this north American tour is well attended, though, I imagine the next one will be more extensive. This is a sort of testing-the-waters tour as it's their first one!
What's even crazier is I've been able to take Skype lessons with Richard...that to me is just unreal; been easily wasting 15-20 minutes of every lesson asking him questions! lol
That's awesome! Hen is such a cool guy.
Indeed...my understanding is that the promoter is the same one who brought Leprous and Pain of Salvation to Toronto, to a quite disappointing turnout. I think said promoter is just not willing to put his dime on the line for another poor turnout. What I was trying to do is see if all the DT fans I run into at Massey Hall have heard of Haken and would be willing to go see them. Might not make a difference for this tour, but could make a difference on the next one, like you said.
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I may get hugely flamed for saying this here, but they were the first band to successfully dethrone DT as my favourite band (and DT held the title for a solid decade or so).
Same for me. DT is probably, like, my 4th or 5th favorite band now, but Haken were the first to surpass them.
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Pain of Salvation and Oceansize both surpassed them before Haken for me :lol
But yeah DT's never written an album as good as The Mountain so I guess Haken is better but it's close.
(It's not even close for the other two I listed before, though >.> )
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Pain of Salvation and Oceansize both surpassed them before Haken for me :lol
But yeah DT's never written an album as good as The Mountain so I guess Haken is better but it's close.
(It's not even close for the other two I listed before, though >.> )
Never heard of Oceansize but I've tried to listen to PoS and there's something about it that doesn't grip me in the same way as DT and Haken...can't really put my finger on it. I think the draw to Haken and DT for me are those cinematic/orchestral moments, where you could literally replace the instruments and vocals with a symphony and it would sound epic in its own right.
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PoS never did anything for me either. The acronym is frighteningly accurate.
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PoS never did anything for me either. The acronym is frighteningly accurate.
*giggle*
Dunno that I'd go that far, but their stuff always sounded very generic/stock to me...unless I haven't listened to the right material, not sure.
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PoS never did anything for me either. The acronym is frighteningly accurate.
*giggle*
Dunno that I'd go that far, but their stuff always sounded very generic/stock to me...unless I haven't listened to the right material, not sure.
I don't think it sounds generic. It's just that what it sounds like doesn't appeal to me.
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Fair...it's possible I haven't given them enough of a chance :S
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I was considering the Springfield date until I found out that the date was at the venue that was formerly known as Jaxx, which makes it highly likely that it's just as much a dump as Jaxx was. I went there two times-once to see Blind Guardian and Symphony X and once to see Opeth, Nevermore, and Into Eternity-and the place was just awful. I never got why so many bands made it their stop in Northern Virginia, and honestly I should've figured out that the Empire venue was just Jaxx renamed.
Sorry, Haken, but I'm not driving six hours round trip to see you there. :lol
Ummm....the band doesn't have control of where they play at. It's booking and promoters.
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I don't see what that has to do with what Jaq said.
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PoS never did anything for me either. The acronym is frighteningly accurate.
*giggle*
Dunno that I'd go that far, but their stuff always sounded very generic/stock to me...unless I haven't listened to the right material, not sure.
Even as a defender of their most recent work....it is admittedly hit and miss.
But if you haven't heard The Perfect Element or Remedy Lane, you *have not* heard what everyone has been drooling over for a decade. BE has gotten kinder reviews more recently than when it came out...and it's really amazing as well...but I don't think it's a good starter album just because it's more of a "performance art" piece than an actual album. Feels almost more like a soundtrack. It's definitely a concept piece that is stunning from start to finish, but there's really only about 4 or 5 "songs" that can be lifted and played out of context without sounding weird.
But seriously. The Perfect Element and/or Remedy Lane. If you like those better than what you've already heard, then test the water with BE.
But I don't want to turn this into a PoS thread so....
Has anyone heard a decent live performance from Ross? His studio vocals are so beautiful to me...and I absolutely love his voice...but he seems to have some serious issues trying to do it live. Even in the best ones I've seen, he's really breathy...thin...and pitchy. I suppose it could just be his falsetto style, but I know other falsetto singers that are able to "bring it" live. Jon Anderson for one. When I first heard Ross on album, I thought he could be this generation's JA...but he needs to do exercises or get some vocal coaching or something. Cause his live stuff is just not cutting it.
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I agree, and also, Ray has some issues too. Nothing incredibly major, but I see that he messes stuff up a bit live. Though he is capable of incredible stuff (Darkest Light)
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I really don't wanna turn this into a PoS thread, but I just wanna quickly say while I can get why PoS's music isn't everyone's cup of tea, I can not for the life of me understand calling them generic.
Sorry, I'll shut up now. Yay Haken and all that jazz.
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Has anyone heard a decent live performance from Ross? His studio vocals are so beautiful to me...and I absolutely love his voice...but he seems to have some serious issues trying to do it live. Even in the best ones I've seen, he's really breathy...thin...and pitchy. I suppose it could just be his falsetto style, but I know other falsetto singers that are able to "bring it" live. Jon Anderson for one. When I first heard Ross on album, I thought he could be this generation's JA...but he needs to do exercises or get some vocal coaching or something. Cause his live stuff is just not cutting it.
I was a bit concerned about how he was going to sound when I saw them in Edinburgh, but I thought he was great. But I'm not a vocal expert or even a musician, so I probably don't notice certain things. I guess I should check out some other live stuff on Youtube and see how it might compare to when I saw them.
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I've never seen them live, but when the first live videos of Atlas Stone appeared on Youtube, I thought he sounded.. Not very good. Then again, he is great on the Celestial Elixir live video. The high quality one. And from what I have heard he gets better and better.
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Jammin, is that based on amateur youtube videos? You should surely know that those are basically meaningless.
Ross' voice is variable live. Sometimes it's really good, sometimes it's still strong but his pitching wavers a bit, and on occasion it's a little weak, especially if he's got a cold or something. Overall I would say he's a good but inconsistent live singer. I would also say that I think on the whole he's been getting better and better, and I've seen them live a LOT.
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I've never seen them live, but when the first live videos of Atlas Stone appeared on Youtube, I thought he sounded.. Not very good. Then again, he is great on the Celestial Elixir live video. The high quality one. And from what I have heard he gets better and better.
Yeah that's the only pro recording of them and he sounds great on it. And that was a few years ago and on his good nights he's stronger than that now, so yeah.
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Rich, can you talk them into shooting a professional live video? :P
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Rich, can you talk them into shooting a professional live video? :P
I'm fairly certain they're already keen on the idea, just a matter of the label being interested I imagine. They're touring more now, and what with the success of The Mountain and Restoration I imagine it's only a matter of time.
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Excellent!
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I'm happy he's been getting better. I know there can often be a "transition phase" when singers go from playing gigs a few times a month while still holding down a day job, to touring for 3 months solid or more.
Again, I want to stress that I LOVE Ross' voice. I'll have to look at the pro-shot Celestial Elixir video.
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Can't believe you haven't seen it already!
Here you go, Mr Dude: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GyFQAHc8oao
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PoS never did anything for me either. The acronym is frighteningly accurate.
*giggle*
Dunno that I'd go that far, but their stuff always sounded very generic/stock to me...unless I haven't listened to the right material, not sure.
Even as a defender of their most recent work....it is admittedly hit and miss.
But if you haven't heard The Perfect Element or Remedy Lane, you *have not* heard what everyone has been drooling over for a decade. BE has gotten kinder reviews more recently than when it came out...and it's really amazing as well...but I don't think it's a good starter album just because it's more of a "performance art" piece than an actual album. Feels almost more like a soundtrack. It's definitely a concept piece that is stunning from start to finish, but there's really only about 4 or 5 "songs" that can be lifted and played out of context without sounding weird.
But seriously. The Perfect Element and/or Remedy Lane. If you like those better than what you've already heard, then test the water with BE.
I've given all of those multiple listens.
I don't like them. I'm not picking up what they are laying down. I'm happy that you do.
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I listened the old demos today. I have listened to them maybe once earlier but now when Restoration is out, it was interesting to hear the differences. This made me appreciate the new versions even more. There is a few great sections in Snow but I think they did pretty great job cutting and pasting parts for Crystallised.
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I remember a picture on their facebook showing the meter changes to a song from Visions with one bar in 31/32. Has anyone found where that measure is yet? ;D
Ok, so I asked Rich about this today during my guitar lesson - turns out it's not actually a bar in 31/32 in the sense that it's done that way to get a certain groove or off-timing or anything; he was saying sometimes using the software that they use, they have a need to ground the tune back to a standard 4/4 or something for timing purposes...so that 31/32 was merely added in order to return the song to standard timing for time-matching purposes.
I know this may be disappointing to some, but I thought it was pretty interesting.
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Cool that you got an answer! In all seriousness I figured that's what probably happened, awesome to get confirmation.
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I remember a picture on their facebook showing the meter changes to a song from Visions with one bar in 31/32. Has anyone found where that measure is yet? ;D
Ok, so I asked Rich about this today during my guitar lesson - turns out it's not actually a bar in 31/32 in the sense that it's done that way to get a certain groove or off-timing or anything; he was saying sometimes using the software that they use, they have a need to ground the tune back to a standard 4/4 or something for timing purposes...so that 31/32 was merely added in order to return the song to standard timing for time-matching purposes.
I know this may be disappointing to some, but I thought it was pretty interesting.
Funny because I wrote their Facebook page (where I occasionally will get replies from "Charlie"...assuming that's Griffiths) asking about the time signatures at the end of Deathless and this rumored 31/32 bar. Here was the reply I got:
"Sorry to shatter the illusion, but we don't really remember what's on the record either - live we just jam it and see what happens. Every time is an experiment! That 31/32 bar was just a terrible prog joke. We're gonna play a few US dates at the end of May - hopefully you'll be able to make it to one of them."
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I remember a picture on their facebook showing the meter changes to a song from Visions with one bar in 31/32. Has anyone found where that measure is yet? ;D
Ok, so I asked Rich about this today during my guitar lesson - turns out it's not actually a bar in 31/32 in the sense that it's done that way to get a certain groove or off-timing or anything; he was saying sometimes using the software that they use, they have a need to ground the tune back to a standard 4/4 or something for timing purposes...so that 31/32 was merely added in order to return the song to standard timing for time-matching purposes.
I know this may be disappointing to some, but I thought it was pretty interesting.
Funny because I wrote their Facebook page (where I occasionally will get replies from "Charlie"...assuming that's Griffiths) asking about the time signatures at the end of Deathless and this rumored 31/32 bar. Here was the reply I got:
"Sorry to shatter the illusion, but we don't really remember what's on the record either - live we just jam it and see what happens. Every time is an experiment! That 31/32 bar was just a terrible prog joke. We're gonna play a few US dates at the end of May - hopefully you'll be able to make it to one of them."
Yea makes sense - to be fair Rich initially was like "I don't really remember that"...then when I started talking about that facebook post and such that's when it seemed to ring a bell and say it was only for grounding the track back to a normal timing or something.
He did reference another artist that once made use of 63/64...that's just insane lol Don't recall exactly whom or when because this was towards the end of the lesson and he was in a rush to head out.
But I mean, both answers seem in line to me, really, if you think about it.
What reply did you get about the time changing in Deathless? I would have asked about that too but could not for the life of my remember what you guys were hypothesizing on here (nevermind that until I came on here this morning I thought the track in question was Pareidolia lol)
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That's what the "I don't remember what's on the record either" was in regard to. He was basically just saying that they make it up as they go and don't worry about what time it's in.
I suppose I could kinda see that from a guitarists POV...but doesn't the drummer generally NEED to know how to count this stuff out so everyone is on the same page?
The idea that these guys just randomly throw paint at the wall and have the Mona Lisa spontaneously appear is just insane to me. SOMEONE in that band is a mathematical genius...even if maybe it's on a "idiot savant" level and they are not even realizing they're doing it.
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He did reference another artist that once made use of 63/64...that's just insane lol Don't recall exactly whom or when because this was towards the end of the lesson and he was in a rush to head out.
I think that's Spiral Architect or someone like that. :lol Me and my brother (Haken's original keyboardist) used to listen to stuff like that sometimes for a laugh, so I expect Hen knows that stuff too.
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That's what the "I don't remember what's on the record either" was in regard to. He was basically just saying that they make it up as they go and don't worry about what time it's in.
I suppose I could kinda see that from a guitarists POV...but doesn't the drummer generally NEED to know how to count this stuff out so everyone is on the same page?
The idea that these guys just randomly throw paint at the wall and have the Mona Lisa spontaneously appear is just insane to me. SOMEONE in that band is a mathematical genius...even if maybe it's on a "idiot savant" level and they are not even realizing they're doing it.
I honestly think you're overthinking it...31/32 is so miniscule that it may have made a difference on software to get the clicks to line up to 4/4 again or something, but realistically, in a live environment, would make little to not difference whatsoever...unless they were using a click track, which I don't think they do.
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He did reference another artist that once made use of 63/64...that's just insane lol Don't recall exactly whom or when because this was towards the end of the lesson and he was in a rush to head out.
I think that's Spiral Architect or someone like that. :lol Me and my brother (Haken's original keyboardist) used to listen to stuff like that sometimes for a laugh, so I expect Hen knows that stuff too.
Your brother is Peter Jones? May I ask why he left the band?
On an side note, but still keyboard related, Rich seems to do a lot of the keyboard work anyway...I had to ask him today what Diego actually plays lol
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Ariich will obviously give you a better answer, but if memory serves it was Peter unable to give full time commitments to the band and keep up with things. I could be off, but I think I recall that.
As for Diego, what is done in the studio I don't know, but live he is clearly the main keyboard player.
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Yea for sure...I was just surprised, for example, to see that for Streams, it's Rich that plays that main intro riff...thought it would be left to Diego
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I've come to the conclusion that making a Haken "mix CD" is just nothing short of impossible. I don't recall that I've *ever* with any other band had this much trouble trying to make a diverse mix CD that represents every album. I mean...their catalog is SO DENSELY GOOD that I'm having a tough time picking favorites.
This is a mix that I came up with, but the songs I had to leave off were so painful that it almost seems anti-climactic.
1. Premonition
2. Cockroach King
3. Streams
4. Earthlings
5. Falling Back to Earth
6. Drowning in the Flood
7. Deathless
8. Crystallised
Total Time - 79:10
Every release is represented by 2 songs...not necessarily "the best" 2 songs either, as "flow" had to be taken under consideration.
If you had to make a mix CD representing the bands entire catalog...what would you choose? Anyone?
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I've come to the conclusion that making a Haken "mix CD" is just nothing short of impossible. I don't recall that I've *ever* with any other band had this much trouble trying to make a diverse mix CD that represents every album. I mean...their catalog is SO DENSELY GOOD that I'm having a tough time picking favorites.
This is a mix that I came up with, but the songs I had to leave off were so painful that it almost seems anti-climactic.
1. Premonition
2. Cockroach King
3. Streams
4. Earthlings
5. Falling Back to Earth
6. Drowning in the Flood
7. Deathless
8. Crystallised
Total Time - 79:10
Every release is represented by 2 songs...not necessarily "the best" 2 songs either, as "flow" had to be taken under consideration.
If you had to make a mix CD representing the bands entire catalog...what would you choose? Anyone?
I honestly couldn't...their albums just have this amazing flow where some songs are made better by their placement and context.
Having said that, if you put a gun to my head and absolutely made me choose, it would probably consist of their epics (in no particular order, for the sake of discussion, and on an 80 minute disc);
- Crystallised - 19:23
- Celestial Elixir - 16:56
- Visions - 22:25
- Falling Back to Earth - 11:50
- The Mind's Eye -> Portals -> Shapeshifter (I equate this to DT's A Mind Beside Itself) - 17:40
Ok, so this comes in at 85 minutes or so...in order to keep it at 80 I'd either replace Celestial Elixir or the last set of tracks with either Streams or Aquarius...this should then keep it under 80 minutes.
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That's what the "I don't remember what's on the record either" was in regard to. He was basically just saying that they make it up as they go and don't worry about what time it's in.
I suppose I could kinda see that from a guitarists POV...but doesn't the drummer generally NEED to know how to count this stuff out so everyone is on the same page?
The idea that these guys just randomly throw paint at the wall and have the Mona Lisa spontaneously appear is just insane to me. SOMEONE in that band is a mathematical genius...even if maybe it's on a "idiot savant" level and they are not even realizing they're doing it.
I honestly think you're overthinking it...31/32 is so miniscule that it may have made a difference on software to get the clicks to line up to 4/4 again or something, but realistically, in a live environment, would make little to not difference whatsoever...unless they were using a click track, which I don't think they do.
I think they do record to a click. The screenshot looks like it's from Logic and the only reason you'd put the time signatures there is if you were recording to a click. Plus if they track instruments separately they might not always do drums first which means a click is necessary. That's probably what happened: Someone recorded their part to a click (maybe not even the drums) and it was slightly off in a bar which threw the rest of the track out of sync and instead of redoing it they just dropped that measure by a 32nd.
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Yup, that seems right...you pretty much articulated what I was trying to say lol
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Your brother is Peter Jones? May I ask why he left the band?
Yep! Pete was only a teenager when he was in the band still in secondary school or high school for you north Americans - side note: he's the same age as Ray Hearne, they were at school together and are still good friends - in fact, he was the one who introduced Ray to the band in the first place.
He left because he wanted to go to university and realised that it wasn't going to be practical balancing that with being in the band, and even if the band had made it big (which they subsequently did) he wasn't really interested in the touring lifestyle anyway. It was a good decision as he made good use of his university route and is now doing a PHD in theoretical physics. :lol He's still on great terms with the band and we both make it to most of their gigs.
On an side note, but still keyboard related, Rich seems to do a lot of the keyboard work anyway...I had to ask him today what Diego actually plays lol
Mm, not really, unless you'd also suggest that Charlie doesn't really do anything either. :lol Haken has a lot of keyboard going on, and they have 2 keyboard parts nearly as much as they have 2 guitar parts. Basically Charlie plays guitar, Diego plays keys and Hen plays either, whichever is needed.
I think they do record to a click.
They definitely do. They don't usually play live to a click though, but they have done sometimes.
I'll have a go at a "mix CD" in a bit, but it's going to be damn hard. Fortunately I don't smile all over the longest songs like most people, so that particular challenge won't be difficult for me. :lol
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I generally like the longest the most, but I wouldn't put them on a mix CD, except for maybe one. As jammindude said, 'flow' has to be considered. And a CD with all the epics wouldn't flow very well.
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Your brother is Peter Jones? May I ask why he left the band?
Yep! Pete was only a teenager when he was in the band still in secondary school or high school for you north Americans - side note: he's the same age as Ray Hearne, they were at school together and are still good friends - in fact, he was the one who introduced Ray to the band in the first place.
He left because he wanted to go to university and realised that it wasn't going to be practical balancing that with being in the band, and even if the band had made it big (which they subsequently did) he wasn't really interested in the touring lifestyle anyway. It was a good decision as he made good use of his university route and is now doing a PHD in theoretical physics. :lol He's still on great terms with the band and we both make it to most of their gigs.
On an side note, but still keyboard related, Rich seems to do a lot of the keyboard work anyway...I had to ask him today what Diego actually plays lol
Mm, not really, unless you'd also suggest that Charlie doesn't really do anything either. :lol Haken has a lot of keyboard going on, and they have 2 keyboard parts nearly as much as they have 2 guitar parts. Basically Charlie plays guitar, Diego plays keys and Hen plays either, whichever is needed.
I think they do record to a click.
They definitely do. They don't usually play live to a click though, but they have done sometimes.
I'll have a go at a "mix CD" in a bit, but it's going to be damn hard. Fortunately I don't smile all over the longest songs like most people, so that particular challenge won't be difficult for me. :lol
Good stuff...this forum should have a 'like' feature to avoid space-wasting replies like this :)
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I've come to the conclusion that making a Haken "mix CD" is just nothing short of impossible. I don't recall that I've *ever* with any other band had this much trouble trying to make a diverse mix CD that represents every album. I mean...their catalog is SO DENSELY GOOD that I'm having a tough time picking favorites.
This is a mix that I came up with, but the songs I had to leave off were so painful that it almost seems anti-climactic.
1. Premonition
2. Cockroach King
3. Streams
4. Earthlings
5. Falling Back to Earth
6. Drowning in the Flood
7. Deathless
8. Crystallised
Total Time - 79:10
Every release is represented by 2 songs...not necessarily "the best" 2 songs either, as "flow" had to be taken under consideration.
If you had to make a mix CD representing the bands entire catalog...what would you choose? Anyone?
I like your mix! I am pretty good playlist maker, I think, so here is my 79+ minutes of Haken goodness.
The Path
Atlas Stone
Drowning in the Flood
The Mind's Eye -> Portals -> Shapeshifter
Darkest Light
Falling Back to Earth
Visions
I think this flows like a real album and showcases all the facets of Haken except their old growling vocals, which I am trying to erase from memory. LOL
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As for the mix... that's going to be damn tough...
Well it clearly shows my preferences for The Mountain and the debut, here is mine.
Darkest Light
Cockroach King
Drowning in the Flood (could be substituted with Point of No Return)
Nocturnal Conspiracy
Falling Back to Earth
Pareidolia
Celestial Elixir
77 minutes.
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Inspired by this thread, I now have a second mix playlist in my phone. My B playlist:
Premonition
Nocturnal Conspiracy
Cockroach King
Crystallized
In Memoriam
Deathless
Celestial Elixir
Just around 75 minutes.
My A playlist is still far superior, though. :)
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I am definitely going to save up to go see them in Montreal. Anyone else planning on going?
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I am definitely going to save up to go see them in Montreal. Anyone else planning on going?
I chose Detroit over Montreal because Spock's Beard caused the ticket prices to triple!
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Only checking into the thread for asking, is it for real that they are touring with Next to None?
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Yes.
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Only checking into the thread for asking, is it for real that they are touring with Next to None?
Only on US Tour dates, and with the exception of the RoSFest date.
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Is having Visions as the favorite Haken album a minority position here? I have read the posts and most seem to like The Mountain. I love that album also but Visions has the same effect on me as Awake. It also has my favorite Haken piece: the three song run from The Mind's Eye to Portals to Shapeshifter. It also has Visions, my second favorite Haken piece.
I am not that happy with Restoration, as Crystallised did not really click with me. Especially when they channeled DT's The Great Debate. :lol
Doing the mix CDs, am I the only one who noticed that the albums got louder after Visions? I had to adjust volume when a song from The Mountain or Restoration comes up after a song from Visions or Aquarius.
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Indeed. Aquarius and Visions are dynamic sounding and well produced albums.
After that, the band got picked up by a bigger label and The Mountain and Restoration were brickwalled by "professionals" from the music industry.
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Brickwalled? Wtf? The Moutain and Restoration sound fantastic.
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Yeah I don't hear any brickwalling in their albums at all.
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I don't think they are brickwalled, but they are definitely mixed louder. Atlas Stone is louder than Drowning in the Flood if you play them back to back.
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I'm not saying The Mountain isn't louder, but let's be clear, it sounds really good. There are a myriad of other much much worse examples, that pretty much keep anything Haken has done out of the discussion on brickwalling.
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I don't think they are brickwalled, but they are definitely mixed louder. Atlas Stone is louder than Drowning in the Flood if you play them back to back.
Yeah but louder =/= worse or more compressed.
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In the case of The Mountain, it is.
We're not talking about level shifts here. Aquarius and Visions are less loud on average (-7,6 and -6,3 dB ReplayGain respectively) AND still peak at the CD maximum. The Mountain has an average of -9,4dB.
I surprised at the reaction to my previous post. The excessive compression on The Mountain annoyed me since my first listen. It's especially annoying since I consider Visions to be one of the best sounding Metal albums of this decade, why did they need to take a turn for the worse in sound quality as their songwriting matured?
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I think The Mountain sounds better than Visions. Visions is a bit mushy.
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why did they need to take a turn for the worse in sound quality as their songwriting matured?
They didn't. The Mountain sounds, in my opinion and the opinion of apparently a lot of others, vastly superior.
And quoting numbers doesn't mean anything on its own. There's a lot of discussion about that over on the DT-side, but it comes down to each person using their own ears. If you don't like how The Mountain sounds, that's totally cool, but a lot of people (including people who have complained about the over-compression of recent albums by DT, BG, etc) think it sounds great.
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I agree with Rich. I think The Mountain was their best sounding album to date overall.
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There's a lot of discussion about that over on the DT-side, but it comes down to each person using their own ears.
Do you want to imply that I didn't LISTEN extensively to the three Haken albums? Look at my profile picture and personal text ;D
Using numbers like ReplayGain values to formulate what you hear in a short text is fine IMO. I only wrote them because they correlate with what I hear.
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There's a lot of discussion about that over on the DT-side, but it comes down to each person using their own ears.
Do you want to imply that I didn't LISTEN extensively to the three Haken albums? Look at my profile picture and personal text ;D
:lol No, I just meant that each person will use their own ears, so it's totally understandable that different people will have different views on how something sounds. It's only really the extreme cases (like Death Magnetic) where pretty much everyone agrees. Even then it's not everyone!
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The Mountain is louder, but there is nothing wrong with the sound quality. It sounds incredible.
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The Mountain is modern metal production done right. It's so spacious and dynamic. It kinda reminds me of Terria by Devin Townsend or even Octavarium to some degree but even better sonically. I don't understand why that production style isn't the norm for modern metal.
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The Mountain is modern metal production done right. It's so spacious and dynamic.
I was considering saying something like this earlier, so thank you for doing it instead. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't put The Mountain in the category of best sounding albums I've heard, but it is a great production job that, as you mentioned, keeps up with the times and still sounds very good.
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i hated how visions sounded, it was a decent part of why i didn't like it as much as Aquarius or The Mountain, I have no complaints about the production on the other two though. Visions just sounds really... stiff.
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The Mountain is modern metal production done right. It's so spacious and dynamic.
I was considering saying something like this earlier, so thank you for doing it instead. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't put The Mountain in the category of best sounding albums I've heard, but it is a great production job that, as you mentioned, keeps up with the times and still sounds very good.
I'd place The Mountain as one of the best sounding Metal records in the last 15 years. Only other albums I can think of that would come close are Six Degrees or maybe something by Opeth or BTBAM.
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I am not that happy with Restoration, as Crystallised did not really click with me. Especially when they channeled DT's The Great Debate. :lol
And what part is that, exactly?
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Starting 4:08 instrumentals going to these lyrics:
"Passages of time
Buried in the chaos of my mind
Chronicles of life
Concealing a truth I left behind
Passages of time
Buried in the chaos of my mind
Chronicles of life
Concealing a truth I can't deny"
To my ears, it's like a marriage between the stanza of Great Debate and the portion of the Sacrificed Sons instrumental that references Octavarium. :lol
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Funny... I always hear the exact chord progression of "Beyond This Life" in the Visions album somewhere, but the song slips my mind at the moment.
I know the section you're talking about in Crystallized and I still don't hear it. But BTL in Visions I definitely hear. I hear it every time.
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Funny... I always hear the exact chord progression of "Beyond This Life" in the Visions album somewhere, but the song slips my mind at the moment.
I know the section you're talking about in Crystallized and I still don't hear it. But BTL in Visions I definitely hear. I hear it every time.
Hahaha. I have not heard BTL in the Visions album. I have heard TMOLS, though. The acoustic guitar portion leading to the vocals has some similarities to the acoustic guitar of Nocturnal Conspiracy.
Anyway,
https://youtu.be/4z6vpiXQJNA?t=2m52s
plus
https://youtu.be/3nBpLzNwkZw?t=5m21s
equals
https://youtu.be/Zk9Wk96yzBY?t=4m10s
Of course, I am just having fun with this. :rollin
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Funny... I always hear the exact chord progression of "Beyond This Life" in the Visions album somewhere, but the song slips my mind at the moment.
I know the section you're talking about in Crystallized and I still don't hear it. But BTL in Visions I definitely hear. I hear it every time.
Shapeshifter, 28 seconds in. I feel like they had no intention of being subtle with that nod to DT. It's like they actively wanted fans to think of DT with that little passage.
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Funny... I always hear the exact chord progression of "Beyond This Life" in the Visions album somewhere, but the song slips my mind at the moment.
I know the section you're talking about in Crystallized and I still don't hear it. But BTL in Visions I definitely hear. I hear it every time.
Shapeshifter, 28 seconds in. I feel like they had no intention of being subtle with that nod to DT. It's like they actively wanted fans to think of DT with that little passage.
Is that it? That's the circus-y portion right? I don't really hear the BTL chord progression there. I think the portion jammindude is referring to is the chord progression in the instrumental of Visions, around 7:05.
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Well, it's not just "the circusy part"...it's that whole chord progression that gets used on the verses...even though it starts circusy...
The first time I heard it, and every time I hear it, my mind *immediately* heard the phrase, "what we have been is whaaaaaat we aaaaaaarrreee". That chord progression was so imbedded in my brain that the reaction was automatic.
I think that gets repeated elsewhere on the album as well. Possibly Premonition?
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Oh, I get it now. :tup I thought you were referring to the chord progression at the start of BTL.
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I usually don't pay attention to sound quality, unless it's really bad. So with the Mountain, while i does sound great, I didn't really think about it, and just enjoyed the music. But on Restoration, it really stuck out to me as my favorite sounding Haken release. Everything on there just sounds awesome.
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Interesting that some of you are actively reminded of DT songs while listening to Haken material. To me there's always been an obvious similarity, but until now hadn't really thought any particular section/song sounded like a specific DT section/song.
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Although I had never noticed it previously, I can definitely hear the similarity now in Shapeshifter.
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Although I had never noticed it previously, I can definitely hear the similarity now in Shapeshifter.
Same here. Nice spot!
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...and for the record. I never viewed it as a bad thing. The difference between "homage" and "rip off" to me is a matter of subtlety (you get a bit more leeway if you're doing it to yourself like The Kinks did). In this case, it's only a few notes, and not the entire song or anything. Also, it seemed fitting that since you are also making an album with similar themes (re-incarnation and a murder mystery), it seemed a nice way to "tip your hat" to something that was obviously immensely influential...whether it was a conscious addition or not.
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I've just noticed the analogy: Visions which talks about time travel, murders and stuff like that (Metropolis Part 2) is also the most DT-sounding record of the three, neat.
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I finally get to see Haken at RoSfest this May with Nick and DT. DTVT. :metal
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From their Facebook:
"So far we've got LOADS of music floating around for album #4! Gotta start filtering out all the rubbish now..."
What rubbish? :lol
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just release a bonus disc of demos for the stuff that doesn't make the cut with the album, nobody would complain :tup
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Based on what I know about how they write, I don't think you'd have full demos left over. More likely is that there will ideas/sections that they played around with but didn't fit with anything else.
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I read an interview where Henshall said that there was leftover material from the Aquarius and Visions sessions. He didn't say how finished it was though.
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I was hoping to get this album in 2015, but at the same time if they need the time to work it up, I'm more than happy to wait until 2016 :metal
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They were originally thinking late 2015 at the earliest, which I guess is still on the cards but early 2016 seems more likely.
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Because the chance of me getting to see Haken in my lifetime is close to nil, I just created this imaginary setlist which I am now playing.
AN EVENING WITH HAKEN
Set 1
The Path
Atlas Stone
Drowning in the Flood
The Mind's Eye
Portals
Shapeshifter
Aquarium
Crystallised
Set 2
Falling Back to Earth
Streams
Darkest Light
In Memoriam
Visions
Encore
Celestial Elixir
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Because the chance of me getting to see Haken in my lifetime is close to nil, I just created this imaginary setlist which I am now playing.
AN EVENING WITH HAKEN
Set 1
The Path
Atlas Stone
Drowning in the Flood
The Mind's Eye
Portals
Shapeshifter
Aquarium
Crystallised
Set 2
Falling Back to Earth
Streams
Darkest Light
In Memoriam
Visions
Encore
Celestial Elixir
You've got my vote. Perfect setlist IMO. Has all of my favourite tunes.
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Missing Deathless, and contains their least good song (Mind's Eye), so that's a no from me. :P
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Really? What's the problem with The Mind's Eye? I never view it individually but always as part of the three-song suite, and I never had any problems with that song from that angle. :)
But yeah, I think substituting Deathless for that three song suite is ok. The songs have to be rearranged though, because Deathless back to back with Aquarium may be too dragging.
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Crystallised has to be one of the best prog epics ive heard in ages....absolutely superb.Haken have this hypnotic way of keeping you hooked with their clever writing skills and virtuoso performances on each instrument.Next to DT they are my favourite prog band by far with Rush and Transatlantic 3rd and 4th.Cant wait for album 4 as this band just seem to get better and better.
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Really? What's the problem with The Mind's Eye?
No problem with it, just don't find it all that interesting.
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Crystallised has to be one of the best prog epics ive heard in ages....absolutely superb.Haken have this hypnotic way of keeping you hooked with their clever writing skills and virtuoso performances on each instrument.Next to DT they are my favourite prog band by far with Rush and Transatlantic 3rd and 4th.Cant wait for album 4 as this band just seem to get better and better.
One of my problems with Crystallised is that there are parts of the instrumental section where they hit on a single musical idea for several bars. They cpuld have cut out some of the parts when it stopped saying something new.
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Aquarius is no longer on Spotify... :(
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So, what you're saying is, people can no longer access their streams?
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No more Haken at the local circus then :(
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So, what you're saying is, people can no longer access their streams?
As a man over 45, I have a completely different automatic definition for "streams", so this took me a second.
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Well looks like we are at the point of no return, either you buy it or you torrent it.
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How strange. I guess Visions could be next to go as that's on the same label.
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No more Haken at the local circus then :(
:biggrin:
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Aquarius is no longer on Spotify... :(
That sucks major balls.
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From Haken's facebook page:
We've got not one but two HUGE announcements coming your way pretty soon.....
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First two albums remastered by Jens Bogren (the reason why they're being pulled from Spotify)?
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First two albums remastered by Jens Bogren (the reason why they're being pulled from Spotify)?
As of right now, Visions is still there...
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Crystallised has to be one of the best prog epics ive heard in ages....absolutely superb.Haken have this hypnotic way of keeping you hooked with their clever writing skills and virtuoso performances on each instrument.Next to DT they are my favourite prog band by far with Rush and Transatlantic 3rd and 4th.Cant wait for album 4 as this band just seem to get better and better.
One of my problems with Crystallised is that there are parts of the instrumental section where they hit on a single musical idea for several bars. They cpuld have cut out some of the parts when it stopped saying something new.
Apply that logic to Illumination Theory (which you seem to love so much) and you're cutting out 95% of the song. IT is nothing but a fragmented mess of nothing new. So what's the point? Just cut it all out...
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It's weird because, while I recognize that most 20+ min epics are going to have "movements" that often resemble parts of songs squished together, there are a few exceptions where the entire song truly feels like one, single, cohesive piece of music. Crystallized is too me, one of those rare epics.
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I'd be totally fine with cutting most of Illumination Theory, can we do that
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Crystallised has to be one of the best prog epics ive heard in ages....absolutely superb.Haken have this hypnotic way of keeping you hooked with their clever writing skills and virtuoso performances on each instrument.Next to DT they are my favourite prog band by far with Rush and Transatlantic 3rd and 4th.Cant wait for album 4 as this band just seem to get better and better.
One of my problems with Crystallised is that there are parts of the instrumental section where they hit on a single musical idea for several bars. They cpuld have cut out some of the parts when it stopped saying something new.
Apply that logic to Illumination Theory (which you seem to love so much) and you're cutting out 95% of the song. IT is nothing but a fragmented mess of nothing new. So what's the point? Just cut it all out...
I think you misunderstand me. I am not criticizing Crystallized's coherence. I am criticizing its tendency to hit on a single musical movement for several bars without any new movement. So there were sections where I was going OK you've made your point, when are we moving on?
I don't know why you had to drag IT into this. Yes, I am a big fan of IT, and one of the reasons is precisely because it does not linger too much on a singular musical idea. I have stopped convincing people that hate it to like it, because if a listener is predisposed to see a mess, he will see a mess regardless of how hard I try to show the structure of the song.
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I think you misunderstand me. I am not criticizing Crystallized's coherence. I am criticizing its tendency to hit on a single musical movement for several bars without any new movement. So there were sections where I was going OK you've made your point, when are we moving on?
I don't know why you had to drag IT into this. Yes, I am a big fan of IT, and one of the reasons is precisely because it does not linger too much on a singular musical idea. I have stopped convincing people that hate it to like it, because if a listener is predisposed to see a mess, he will see a mess regardless of how hard I try to show the structure of the song.
Phrases repeat. It's sort of a thing in all music ever. Are you that uninterested in what they're doing with the music at any given point in the song you just want them to change the idea? In music, phrases and melodies are repeated to familiarize the listener with them, to get the themes stuck in somebody's head. Music has done this since the earliest music ever created.
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Most likely it's a combination of repetition and the repeated idea just not too interesting for me. One particular section is around the 13:00 to 15:30. There is a basic idea and they play around it for two and a half minutes. The variations are there, but the basic idea is not that interesting in the first place.
Funnily enough, they do a lot of repetition in Visions, a song I really love. I find that the variations are enough to make the repetition interesting. With Crystallised, the repetitions were overbearing the variations. It's the same reason why I did not warm up with Pareidolia also.
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I have to kind of agree. The 'passages of time' section is a bit draggy for me, but it's ok the way it is. Everything else is awesome.
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I have to kind of agree. The 'passages of time' section is a bit draggy for me, but it's ok the way it is. Everything else is awesome.
Oh man. Seriously? I'm one of those that wish that part would never end! I'm not trying to be contrary...that's just seriously my favorite part of the whole song!
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I have to kind of agree. The 'passages of time' section is a bit draggy for me, but it's ok the way it is. Everything else is awesome.
Oh man. Seriously? I'm one of those that wish that part would never end! I'm not trying to be contrary...that's just seriously my favorite part of the whole song!
The Great Debate. :lol
The part that dragged for me was the stop and go instrumental part after Snow. It was cute at first, then they stretched it.
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I have to kind of agree. The 'passages of time' section is a bit draggy for me, but it's ok the way it is. Everything else is awesome.
Oh man. Seriously? I'm one of those that wish that part would never end! I'm not trying to be contrary...that's just seriously my favorite part of the whole song!
Yeah I love that part as well.
Have to say, for all the people who would complain about bands like Haken being disjointed and jumping from idea to idea, it's nice that there are others who would make the opposite complaint. :lol
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Crystallised is the only Haken song that feels disjointed to me. It seems like two unrelated songs cut together.
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Two? I could understand if you'd feel that way about it being a whole load of different songs (I wouldn't agree, but I'd understand), but only two?
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It feels like song A that shifts to song B halfway through and than back to song A for the finale.
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So it's like TCoT?
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RANKINGS.
Have we done this yet?
Elixir > Falling > Crystallised > Visions
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Celestial Elixir
Crystallised
Falling Back To Earth
Visions
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That is a nearly impossible ranking for me to do. But do it I shall. This is how it looks at this very moment:
1. Celestial Elixir
2. Crystallised
3. Visions
4. Falling Back to Earth
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So it's settled then. Celestial Elixir is the best them. No further discussion on this topic needed. :biggrin:
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Visions>Celestial Elixir>Crystallised>>>Falling Back To Earth
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1. Crystallised
2. Falling Back to Earth
3. Visions
4. Celestial Elixir
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Celestial
Falling Back to Earth
Visions
Crystallized
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Celestial Elixir
Falling Back to Earth
Visions
I know this is bad, but I've actually only listened to Restoration twice. So...
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Visions won the Survivor this year over Celestial Elixir.
Best epic for me is still The Mind's Eye - Portals - Shapeshifter.
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Celestial Elixir
Falling Back To Earth
Crystallised
Visions
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The Visions haters are out!
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does anyone actually hate visions
but yeah elixir would be my top and crystallized would be next
the rest go somewhere
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My ranking:
1. Visions - a musical composition masterpiece. The extended ending really plays well not just as a closer for the album, but as a closer for live shows, as well. It also has the best drumming in a Haken song by Raymond Hearne (Darkest Light is second best drumming in my book). The only thing I wish to be changed in this song is the fast guitar playing backing the vocals at around 14:58-15:21. A more skilled guitarist would have pulled that off more smoothly and with more precision.
2. Falling Back to Earth - beautiful. that's all.
3. Crystallised - Beginning and ending is amazing. Middle part is a bit too extended and repetitive as I noted in my earlier posts.
4. Celestial Elixir - this is a good song, but it has one structural defect as an "epic." It does not have a payoff section. For me, a long song really needs a definitive climax to make the long journey worth it.
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Crystallized
Falling Back to Earth
Visions
Celestial Elixir
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Visions
Falling Back To Earth (really close)
Celestial Elixir
Crystallised
Although every song is :hefdaddy
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The Visions haters are out!
I don't hate Visions, but I just like the other three more. :biggrin:
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Yeah, I think I used too strong a term with hate. :p
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Visions won the Survivor this year over Celestial Elixir.
... No, it didn't... The final round was a tie. If the "which one got more votes in the previous round" method was used, which it wasn't, Celestial Elixir would have won. But there is no possible interpretation of those results in which Visions won.
But, yeah, I don't hate Visions. Celestial Elixir is my favorite Haken song, and I just like FBTE a smidgen more than Visions. And, as I said, I've only heard Crystallised twice in my life, so I have little to say on that subject.
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Right, it ended up in a tie. My Visions bias must have muddled my memory.
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Visions > Crystallised = Falling Back to Earth > Celestial Elixir
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Just chiming in to say that the section at 9.54-10.04 in Crystallised is sooo awesome.
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That's great but the section at 5:44-6:04 is blowing my mind every time I hear it. It's that kind of music which I love so much.
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Both of those parts are really great, though I like Zydar's more. The whole song is a sonic pleasure
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Visions won the Survivor this year over Celestial Elixir.
... No, it didn't... The final round was a tie. If the "which one got more votes in the previous round" method was used, which it wasn't, Celestial Elixir would have won. But there is no possible interpretation of those results in which Visions won.
I just came here to say this as well. Visions did win the 2012 and 2013 survivor though.
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Those are cool parts. There's lots of cool sections in Crystallised I just think the build up to the last chorus and the whole ending is really great especially the tasty guitar lead at 17:05.
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Haken announced swedish tour dates today! I will probably see them at Sticky Fingers.
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Is anyone else here going to the concert in Chicago this Sunday? :metal
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Those are cool parts. There's lots of cool sections in Crystallised I just think the build up to the last chorus and the whole ending is really great especially the tasty guitar lead at 17:05.
And how about that epic gong at the very end. SO MUCH POWAH!
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does anyone know what's happened to Aquarius? I saw mentions that it's not on spotify anymore, but its also not on iTunes! I don't know the album at all but wanted to familiarize myself before their philly show next week. any word on why this isn't available anywhere?
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No idea, but it's not available for download on Amazon either.
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Hmmm...interesting. Maybe they plan on releasing a remastered version and pulled the old one? Not sure why they would do that, but I can't think of any other reason that makes sense. Oh bummer. :-\
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Yea it's not on Spotify anymore, weird.
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Haken is coming to Finland!!! :metal :metal
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Hoping they would come to the Southeast USA, but they would get run out of town because most folks would think the EP cover was porn. Not me, I think it is cool.
Hoping that you all get a good long set list.
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So I have the Haken concert tomorrow and VIP tickets, but I have no idea what the VIP means. I think we get in early, but I have no idea how early or anything else really. I can't find any information on it anywhere. Does anyone have any ideas?
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https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/haken/2015/token-lounge-westland-mi-6bc8d6be.html
setlist from last night's show if anyone's interested. first time seeing them friday in philly, can't wait!! :metal :metal
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Very cool set list. And by my count, that's about a 2 hour set! That makes me very happy, as I've seen quite a few setlists from them in the past that only added up to about an hour and a half which included the encore. Nice to see them playing a bit longer.
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Good lord that's a good setlist!
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the last two songs back-to-back will be eargasm worth :hefdaddy
and yeah its nice to see they'll be playing a long show, now my only concern is that it'll go so late i won't be able to catch the train back and end up stranded there :lol
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Must... not... look...
They played about 1.5 hours worth of material on the cruise, and so with a 2hr RoSfest slot I had expected they'd do basically the same + Crystallised.
In all honesty, they played so many of my favorites on the cruise that the only thing I'm still REALLY hoping to see is Celestial Elixir. Just so I can manage expectations, can someone tell me if that is or is not in the set?
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It isn't.
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Thank you. :(
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I was at the Haken show in Detroit, they were amazing! Also Mike Portnoy was there and he sat in on drums with Tiles for a cover of "The Spirit of Radio". Pretty sick.
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I know that it's the way it probably had to happen, given NtN is direct support, but go ahead and tell me...
Tiles had to play before Next to None, didn't they?
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Yeah, Tiles opened things up. Next to None went on right before Haken.
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What a pathetic joke MP. Tiles is an established, quality band. NtN are still rookies without an albums worth of material.
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Very cool set list. And by my count, that's about a 2 hour set! That makes me very happy, as I've seen quite a few setlists from them in the past that only added up to about an hour and a half which included the encore. Nice to see them playing a bit longer.
They only managed about 70 minutes when I saw them last year :'( The crappy venue gave them such an early curfew, they had to leave out Crystallised :censored
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What a pathetic joke MP. Tiles is an established, quality band. NtN are still rookies without an albums worth of material.
It's not really MP or anyone's fault. Next to None is the tour support, Tiles was an add-on to that show, and as such plays first. I would have liked for the bands to have thought to let Tiles play 2nd that show, but I can't blame them for not going out of their way.
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I'm not all too surprised tbh. It was clear that MP pulled all those strings to promote NtN, not because he liked Haken or Tiles so much.
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Outrun the Sunlight was pretty good. Marbin was amazing. Now time for Portnoy Jr. and the Next to None crowd.
Edit: Fucking amazing show. Might talk more about it tomorrow. :metal
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I'm not all too surprised tbh. It was clear that MP pulled all those strings to promote NtN, not because he liked Haken or Tiles so much.
Dunno about Tiles, but MP definitely loves Haken. Don't get me wrong, for sure he is wanting to promote NtN massively, but don't underestimate the fact that MP has been a big Haken fan since The Mountain came out and added his own little cameo on the latest EP.
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Outrun the Sunlight was pretty good. Marbin was amazing. Now time for Portnoy Jr. and the Next to None crowd.
Marbin played with them?! That is awesome. I saw those guys open for Holdsworth/Donati a few years back, and I spontaneously bought both their albums.
@aarich, didn't know MP was such a Haken fan. That said, I still don't think this tour would exist without MP trying to market NtN.
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@aarich, didn't know MP was such a Haken fan. That said, I still don't think this tour would exist without MP trying to market NtN.
Considering that the tour was announced before Next to None was even mentioned as a supporting act, I'm not so sure this is correct.
EDIT: To clarify, the time in between original tour announcement and announcement that NtN was joining was long enough that it suggests NtN was added after. To further drive this point home, tickets for Detroit were being sold for $14 before NtN was announced, and then went up to $18 or something. If NtN had been involved in the plan since the get-go, it wouldn't have gone down like that.
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Marbin played with them?! That is awesome. I saw those guys open for Holdsworth/Donati a few years back, and I spontaneously bought both their albums.
They did, and they slayed. I'm glad to have been introduced to them.
So here I'll talk about the show. It was the best show I've been to (though I haven't been to many). It was the smallest venue I've been to, so being able to stand right up against the stage with no security in between was amazing. Outrun the Sunlight sounded great, though the band members looked a bit like zombies. They didn't really interact with the audience and the bassist who was playing right in front of us looked rather pale and tired. lol I enjoyed it.
Marbin surprised everyone in the room who didn't already know who they were. We were in the front basically stage left so we were right in front of Slor, the saxophonist. As someone in the crowd said when they finished, they blew off everyone's socks. Really amazing. The drummer even broke his snare at one point, and Dani the guitarist got an extended solo while they replaced it. Well done.
Then the man himself, Mike Portnoy, came out to introduce his son's band. He talked about how he remember touring with Dream Theater for the first time in a van 23 years ago, going to play Chicago for the first time, and how we were going to make the same memories for those kids. And they were decent. It was obvious from how they played that had most likely been given everything, as in the opportunities from connections like MP. They were acting like quite the rock stars and playing it up. Max through his shaker into the audience as well as a drum stick. It didn't come across in a stuck-up sort of way though. It just looked like they were having a ton of fun. So for the most part, it worked. My friend got the guitarist to hand him the setlist, which consisted of rather creative names for their songs, including Cunt Roll (Control) and Blood on my Wang (Blood on my Hands).
Then Haken. The setlist was the same as in Detroit and of course amazing. I got to stand right in front of Charles and exchanged scowls with him the whole night. Got to high five him and Ross during the songs a couple times. The crowd was really into it, which shouldn't come as any surprise. At the end of the encore, everyone was chanting "holy shit!" Though Richard wasn't there, they were all top notch. To be honest I was a bit surprised at how well Ross sounded live. I'm always a bit nervous about vocals with most progressive acts (probably just due to mostly seeing older bands). After the show, my friends and I walked out and forgot our posters, so we went back in to find the band all taking down the equipment and signing autographs. Thanks to our forgetfulness we got our posters/booklets signed by all or most of the band as well as a couple pictures with Ross. I definitely look forward to them returning to the US again. (Shitty pictures below. In the group picture, I'm the one on the left, Sintheros next to me, then my other friend on the right.)
(https://41.media.tumblr.com/466778b4529cf28bee1ae4ff5a358253/tumblr_nngz1vYdK21qgg53uo3_1280.jpg)(https://40.media.tumblr.com/2a4c4c01e2e23b8dd668e34accbd3ebf/tumblr_nngz1vYdK21qgg53uo2_1280.jpg)(https://40.media.tumblr.com/2337bfa8093a3b4bdb769db624ced719/tumblr_nngz1vYdK21qgg53uo1_1280.jpg)
(https://41.media.tumblr.com/a8b7ee5481a5a4b12824e8104a9bde52/tumblr_nngz1vYdK21qgg53uo4_1280.jpg)
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:metal
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The setlist was the same as in Detroit
Noop! You keep forgetting that they swapped Nocturnal Conspiracy for Insomnia. A strong improvement if I do say so. :P
EDIT: Looks like it was the same set and the set was incorrect when I looked at it yesterday? Cause they match now.
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Though Richard wasn't there
Wait what?
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He's ill. I'm not sure if that was just a Chicago thing or the whole NA tour thing.
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How did they play without him?
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Ok...time for clarification; Hen had a visa issue, he is not ill.
Charlie and Diego covered his parts perfectly...Hen was missed, but the show is still very much a kick ass experience even with his absence.
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Thanks, Ben. Someone told me he was ill. Glad to hear he isn't.
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I was at work and couldn't post, but I actually did speak with Hen earlier today and he told me it was a visa issue. And for however disappointed any fans might be, I can say he sounded just as disappointed not to be here. He did sound optimistic however that there would be a next tour, and he would be here for it.
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Is tomorrow night's concert Haken's first-ever in NYC?
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Aside from the cruise, Mexico, or Atlanta for PPUSA, this is their first time in any of North America, I believe.
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Is tomorrow night's concert Haken's first-ever in NYC?
So envious of those going to this show...gonna be a special one!
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Thought I'd share this, since I was thoroughly amazed at how it came out:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXIe50LZjgs
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So according to FB, Haken was joined on stage by both Portnoy and Rudess. :metal First time sharing a stage since the split?
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Portnoy just came out at the end to hit the gong, Rudess had a full blown, and I hate to utter these words... guest iPad solo during Visions. That said, it was really good solo, and the crowd absolutely loved it. I was first in line, and that got me front and center, with no barrier. It was an amazing show.
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That's really awesome. Have they been playing the same setlist each night on this tour?
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"With @mikeportnoy Max and @erenbasbug at the Haken and Next to None show in NYC tonight!"
(https://i.imgur.com/93XoVZd.jpg)
From MP's Facebook:
(https://i.imgur.com/vBhzc43.jpg)
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That is so fucking awesome!! :metal
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That's fantastic!
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:tup
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That's really awesome. Have they been playing the same setlist each night on this tour?
Yep!
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anyone know how late these shows are going? seeing the philly tonight and need to take the 11:25 train back into the city, hoping i don't have to miss anything :/
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The concert in Chicago didn't end until after midnight. They went on at like 10:20PM and their setlist is pretty much 2 hours.
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thanks. good to know that now as opposed to by the time the concert is ending :lol
looks like there's buses i can take, hopefully that works
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Portnoy just came out at the end to hit the gong, Rudess had a full blown, and I hate to utter these words... guest iPad solo during Visions.
well that's still pretty cool.
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The concert in Chicago didn't end until after midnight. They went on at like 10:20PM and their setlist is pretty much 2 hours.
Yep, same for Detroit and Toronto - shows goes into the midnight thirty mark or so...
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Great show last night! Hearing "Crystallised" was definitely the highlight for me. That song is pure awesomeness.
Got pics with Ross and Jordan too! :metal
(https://s16.postimg.org/vtfxl2rw5/Haken1.jpg)
(https://s29.postimg.org/51hc3sfc7/Haken2.jpg)
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:metal
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Great show last night! Hearing "Crystallised" was definitely the highlight for me. That song is pure awesomeness.
Got pics with Ross and Jordan too! :metal
(https://s16.postimg.org/vtfxl2rw5/Haken1.jpg)
(https://s29.postimg.org/51hc3sfc7/Haken2.jpg)
:tup
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Anyone going to the 3 May gig in Sprinfield VA?
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Show yesterday in Philadelphia was phenomenal. We talked to Conner and Ross after the show and they confirmed that Haken will be coming to the U.S. next year after they release the next album, which was music to my ears.
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So Haken played Fade to Black, The Mirror, and Empire recently with Max/Mike Portnoy as guest musicians. There's some partial videos on YouTube. Pretty awesome!
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Oh yeah, here's The Mirror!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZREY7Q_rDgY
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That's really cool, although Ross isn't quite suited for those JLB vocals.
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Oh yeah, here's The Mirror!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZREY7Q_rDgY
Cool that they did that, but the singer sounds absolutely dreadful.
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I think from that clip he sounded like he did a good job of it, but I knew before watching it that his voice would sound weird with it. It'd be the same story if JLB sang Cockroach King for example. But it was just a one-off thing and they had fun, I would have loved to seen it in person!
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I think from that clip he sounded like he did a good job of it, but I knew before watching it that his voice would sound weird with it. It'd be the same story if JLB sang Cockroach King for example. But it was just a one-off thing and they had fun, I would have loved to seen it in person!
Pretty much. It got me thinking, and there aren't many artists I can see Ross covering without it sounding somewhat weird. Love him with Haken though, and can't see many singers coming in and pulling off what he does while sounding similar.
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I think his style would work fine on individual songs by a bunch of bands and artists, DT included, but yeah The Mirror is very much a mid-90s JLB song vocally. Hell, even JLB himself doesn't do it especially great these days. :lol
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Seeing them live I have no problem with Ross. Nick told me he's grown as a singer. To me, he commanded the stage and was just what I expected singing. The highlight of RoSfest.
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Ross was always a good showman, but his vocal abilities live have very much improved. When I told Ross I thought his stability has gone way up over the years he credited it to practice, and being able to hear himself a lot better nowadays, due to better monitor systems they get to use.
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I think his style would work fine on individual songs by a bunch of bands and artists, DT included, but yeah The Mirror is very much a mid-90s JLB song vocally. Hell, even JLB himself doesn't do it especially great these days. :lol
JLB did it great in the recent tour. It was like the confirmation that his voice is in great shape nowadays. :)
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Seeing them live I have no problem with Ross. Nick told me he's grown as a singer. To me, he commanded the stage and was just what I expected singing. The highlight of RoSfest.
Well, that makes sense. :neverusethis:
Saw them yesterday here in Mexico City. Amazing show, much better than last year I saw them on a smaller venue (almost bar-like). I'm probably falling into the majority here, but the highlights were both Crystallised and Visions. Absolutely amazing.
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Seeing them live I have no problem with Ross. Nick told me he's grown as a singer. To me, he commanded the stage and was just what I expected singing. The highlight of RoSfest.
I saw them at RoSFest as well. I expected an awesome set by Haken but they really blew me away with how good the show was. I would put it up there with any of the many Dream Theater shows I've seen over the years. I think there was only one point where I heard Ross hit a bad note but he seemed to correct himself fairly quickly. I was a bit surprised to see Richard Henshall was absent but they seemed to cover the material fine without him. Does anyone know why he wasn't with him? I can't find anything online about it.
Haken was definitely the highlight of the festival for me. Spock's Beard and Enchant were also good but nowhere near the level of Haken. Of the other acts there I enjoyed Low-Fi Resistance the most.
But all in all as far as Haken goes, I really hope they do a bigger tour of the states next time around. Hopefully something in Colorado though I think I'd travel to see them again. :)
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Hen couldn't make it over due to visa issues. He apparently recorded a bunch of his parts (the most important ones) for backing track so that no key parts of the music were missing.
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Hen couldn't make it over due to visa issues. He apparently recorded a bunch of his parts (the most important ones) for backing track so that no key parts of the music were missing.
There were certain sections where Hen was indeed missed, as Diego handled the parts rather than having a backing track (or so it seemed, as Diego covered what are Hen's parts). The two I most recall are the solo on Cockroach King (starting @ ~5:17) and the funky clean-sounding chord breakdown of the Crystallised jam (starting @ ~13:48).
Diego did a phenomenal job covering both note for note. Both even had a cool vibe being played on keys rather than guitar.
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Cool, I had assumed that the backing track stuff wouldn't include solos, so good to have that confirmed. Makes sense as well, pre-record the important riffs chords etc needed to make sure the music sounds full enough, but leave the soloing to whoever is there.
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"We are extremely proud to announce... (Actually, 'extremely' doesn't quite do it justice but if anyone can think of a more suitable word then feel free to add it to the comments!)
'Classic Rocknacht' with Dream Theater and Devin Townsend Project, 9/7/15 - Bonn, Germany"
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HOLY FUCKING SHIT.
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"We are extremely proud to announce... (Actually, 'extremely' doesn't quite do it justice but if anyone can think of a more suitable word then feel free to add it to the comments!)
'Classic Rocknacht' with Dream Theater and Devin Townsend Project, 9/7/15 - Bonn, Germany"
I hate Germany.
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"We are extremely proud to announce... (Actually, 'extremely' doesn't quite do it justice but if anyone can think of a more suitable word then feel free to add it to the comments!)
'Classic Rocknacht' with Dream Theater and Devin Townsend Project, 9/7/15 - Bonn, Germany"
(https://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/31/slowly_take_glasses_off..gif)
it's too bad I don't live in Germany, or anywhere near Europe :P
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That is so fucking epic.
BUT I CAN'T BE THERE :(
I'll be on tour in Italy singing Bach in a choir by then, which will probably be the most fun thing I'll do this year. But missing this is just...
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I'm seriously considering selling my Night of the Prog ticket just so I can go to this. Money doesn't allow me to do both, plus I wouldn't get the time off so close to the Night of the Prog weekend anyway. :'(
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I'd rather go to that show than to Night of the Prog. Of course, it all comes down to personal taste, but Dream Theater, Haken and Devin Townsend are all in my top 10 artists/bands (Devin even occupies #1)...
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"We are extremely proud to announce... (Actually, 'extremely' doesn't quite do it justice but if anyone can think of a more suitable word then feel free to add it to the comments!)
'Classic Rocknacht' with Dream Theater and Devin Townsend Project, 9/7/15 - Bonn, Germany"
I hate Germany.
LOL I feel your pain. Besides Rush in Atlanta, the only other bands I want to see are no where near Tennessee. My wife is from England and I told her if and when I retire, I want to go over there in the summer time and hit the festivals.
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I'd rather go to that show than to Night of the Prog. Of course, it all comes down to personal taste, but Dream Theater, Haken and Devin Townsend are all in my top 10 artists/bands (Devin even occupies #1)...
Yeah, probably going to put my Night of the Prog ticket on sale tomorrow. Anybody have any suggestions for good sites where I can get good value for concert tickets?
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From RoSfest.
(https://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/kingshmegland/Mobile%20Uploads/20150502_234225_001_zpsdjy3sdro.jpg) (https://s583.photobucket.com/user/kingshmegland/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150502_234225_001_zpsdjy3sdro.jpg.html)
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nudity bant
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Isn't there a "tree nymph booby" exception? :angel:
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Art, not sex and that show was art.
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Surprised not to see it mentioned here, but Symphonic Theater of Dreams (the guys who did the DT symphonic covers!) have just launched their PledgeMusic campaign to fund their new album "A Symphonic Tribute to HAKEN". You can go pledge here (https://www.pledgemusic.com/projects/symphonic-tribute-to-haken). I'm ordering the A2 poster with artwork - my flat looks so depressing with the bare walls :lol .
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Saw that earlier, and my immediate rage came from wanting the bonus DVD, but not wanting a shitty digipack.
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From RoSfest.
(https://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/kingshmegland/Mobile%20Uploads/20150502_234225_001_zpsdjy3sdro.jpg) (https://s583.photobucket.com/user/kingshmegland/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150502_234225_001_zpsdjy3sdro.jpg.html)
Sick man! Hold on to that for next time they come so that Hen can complete it!
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Saw that earlier, and my immediate rage came from wanting the bonus DVD, but not wanting a shitty digipack.
This...why can't I just have a DVD and a CD?
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Saw that earlier, and my immediate rage came from wanting the bonus DVD, but not wanting a shitty digipack.
This...why can't I just have a DVD and a CD?
So much this.
There is also a "Jewel box in slipcase" for 50€(!). What exactly does jewel box mean?
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So when is Haken's 4th album coming out? I'm behind.
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They have been working on it, likely later this year or Q1 of 2016 I reckon.
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Thanks!
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Can't wait for the new album. :2metal:
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Saw that earlier, and my immediate rage came from wanting the bonus DVD, but not wanting a shitty digipack.
This...why can't I just have a DVD and a CD?
So much this.
There is also a "Jewel box in slipcase" for 50€(!). What exactly does jewel box mean?
A jewel box is the standard plastic cd case.
And I just listened to Haken's discography on a road trip. How are they so good?
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H4KEN! :metal
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THey posted this on their FB page:
"This Thursday, we will be sharing the stage with two bands who, for many years, have had a pretty major impact on us as individual musicians and on Haken as a band. The Devin Townsend Project and everything else that Mr. Townsend creates is crazy, wonderful and hilarious. Dream Theater, simply put, produced a blueprint for progressive metal and have been slamming it down all over the world for 30 years! And now we get to open for them and then enjoy their mind-blowing sets afterwards! It's gonna be a pretty good day
Classic Rocknacht, Bonn, Germany - This Thursday 9th July
We're on at 6pm. Don't be late!!!!"
isn't that beautiful? "Dream Theater, simply put,produced a blueprint for progressive metal and have been slamming it down all over the world for 30 years!"
I envy you Germans for this concert (but not for you debtors ;D)
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I'm hoping to get some videos from this epic evening.
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This needs to be a tour.
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It's basically everything your average DTFer would want in a concert.
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That is one hell of a lineup.
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It's basically everything your average DTFer would want in a concert.
Yeah, indeed. But in the middle of the week, it's simply too far away from my place... :sad:
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Germany gets to see Haken AND Dream Theater? That just isn't fair dammit. DT doesn't even come to Florida anymore it seems. I would kill to attend that concert.
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I'm trying to get into these guys ahead of seeing them at a festival coming up (yeah, with DT and Anathema and Riverside and the Pineapple Thief... shoot me ;) ), been listening to The Mountain and it's not really doing much for me so far other than Atlas Stone which is pretty awesome. Times like this I really hate myself for how hard I find it to listen to new music and give it a good shot, I've heard so many good things about Haken from practically everyone I know who has similar tastes to me so giving it my best shot...
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Keep at it, and hopefully they will click for you.
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I suggest you give Visions and Aquarius a chance before you scrub them of, atleast Visions imo.
This video was the one that caught my interest in Haken, never heard about Haken before so I was intrigued by it.
Haken - Visions ( Music Video by Marc Papeghin ) (https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2q3g4c_haken-visions-music-video_music)
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I'm trying to get into these guys ahead of seeing them at a festival coming up (yeah, with DT and Anathema and Riverside and the Pineapple Thief... shoot me ;) ), been listening to The Mountain and it's not really doing much for me so far other than Atlas Stone which is pretty awesome. Times like this I really hate myself for how hard I find it to listen to new music and give it a good shot, I've heard so many good things about Haken from practically everyone I know who has similar tastes to me so giving it my best shot...
What type of music do you like? The sound of Haken really changed a lot from album to album. My favorite is Visions, and I think you will like that album if you are into Awake-like stuff, to give a DT comparison.
What exactly did you like about Atlas Stone?
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Interesting question as to what I liked about Atlas Stone, upon further listening it's more Falling Back to Earth I'm liking, Atlas Stone has a beautiful intro (reminds me so strongly of Everything by Anathema) but the instrumental section about 2:30 onward is what made it stand out for me, Falling Back to Earth is the standout track atm though I reckon. I am really digging the heavy Meshuggah-esue guitars. TBH I'm just rambling outta my ass cos I barely know the record yet after a few listens through!
As for what kinda music I normally listen to, broad question. Awake is a great album but not one of my favourite DT records. I'm gonna give their other albums a spin.
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My personal favorites are Aquarius and the Restoration EP, but Visions is easier to get into for someone new I'd say. I've heard people call Visions "the best Dream Theater album in many years". I agree that it's pretty similar to DT sometimes, so that would be something more familiar. The other albums have unique sounds though.
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Listening to Visions now. From the first track I already like it better than the bits I've heard from the other albums.
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Got back home to Manchester from the best gig of my life, the one in Bonn.....
What a night, unfortunately only 30 mins from haken...
But then after the gig.....
I GOT TO BUY THEM A ROUND AND CHATTED TO THEM FOR ABOUT 2 HOURS! :metal :metal :metal :metal :metal :eek
(https://i61.tinypic.com/2lxb95c.jpg)
(https://i60.tinypic.com/25jw7k4.jpg)
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That's awesome! :metal
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Oh dude, that`s awesome! I only saw them right after Devin Townsend in the Front of Stage area, but they seem to be very nice people.
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Oh dude, that`s awesome! I only saw them right after Devin Townsend in the Front of Stage area, but they seem to be very nice people.
Yeah, I met Ray after a show in Manchester in 2014 for a quick chat,
But this really made my night, Such awesome guys and just cool with people :smiley:
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I uploaded a video of mine + a friends footage of cockroach king from the gig at Bonn,
Sorry for the quality Audio/Videophiles but it gets slightly better at 1:30 when I took my friends footage :smiley:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZogJiU4OyY
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HAKEN - the 'final farewell to the Empire' jam, (feat. Next to None and Mike Portnoy) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfWccwZrrLg)
Love the guy going bezerk in The Mirror and doing "the windmill" while levitated. :rollin
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Nice, and it's the first time I've heard Fade To Black with keyboards.
I wonder how it must feel for MP to play DT songs now that he's not in the band anymore.
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So good that you can buy a round of drinks and talk awhile. Cheaper than the meet and greet packages.
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So good that you can buy a round of drinks and talk awhile. Cheaper than the meet and greet packages.
Not only that - they have not yet been jaded by the recognition and fame, so when they hang with fans it's a legitimate wanting to speak to people and hang out with them...does not at all have a vibe of obligation or going through the motions of them doing their job.
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So good that you can buy a round of drinks and talk awhile. Cheaper than the meet and greet packages.
Not only that - they have not yet been jaded by the recognition and fame, so when they hang with fans it's a legitimate wanting to speak to people and hang out with them...does not at all have a vibe of obligation or going through the motions of them doing their job.
Exactly it was just a casual chat and it just felt like talking to a good friend :smiley:
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Haken have at last overtaked DT in my rankings, It took a while of then both being tied 1st but haken have now edged at as I just listen to crystallised every day now!
The part at 9:15 and the bass at 13:50 are incredible!
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Haken have at last overtaked DT in my rankings, It took a while of then both being tied 1st but haken have now edged at as I just listen to crystallised every day now!
The part at 9:15 and the bass at 13:50 are incredible!
That happened to me a few days after discovering them. Awesome stuff.
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Yeah, I like The Mountain and Aquarius more than most anything DT have done. It's odd, because there is obvious DT influence, but they just do it better for me.
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They were awesome at NotP! Especially Insomnia (dat instrumental section <3) and Cockroach King (which I had heard before, but it still slayed). I was in the second row and I could really see how much fun they were having. Awesome!
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Saw these guys play at a festival last weekend, as I've mentioned I reallllllly couldn't get into them on CD, was listening to The Mountain tonnes and it was doing nothing for me. Anyway I saw them, and holy crap they were incredible live, they were amazing to watch, so engaging, every minute felt different, great performers and really interesting to listen to. Came back from the festival and been listening to and loving The Mountain ever since, it's weird, it's like I've been given a different set of ears with which to listen to them and I can't understand how it didn't make any sense before.
So many of my friends are laughing and saying they told me so, as they've been recommending that album for the past year.
So yeah, count me as a fan... I'm in that delicious stage where it's all I'm listening to, but a certain few songs are grabbing me so hard it's hard to move onto any others, then I do, and they blow my mind just as much if not more. So glad to have found a new awesome band.
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That's great! Which are your favourites at the moment from The Mountain?
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-oops-
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That's great! Which are your favourites at the moment from The Mountain?
At first I think it was Cockroach King and Falling Back to Earth, then I found the beauty of In Memoriam and was stuck on that for a few days, and then I heard Pareidolia and was absolutely blown away. So, so many cool parts of all of those songs. At times through the album I've heard bits that sound similar to Pain of Salvation, Muse, and a part that's almost a carbon copy of a part from The Count of Tuscany. I'm really enjoying getting to know it, tasting all of these flavours as they slowly appear.
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Pareidolia is probably my favorite of the album too. Though Falling Back to Earth is a strong challanger.
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My favorite hops around as well. Currently I just can't stop listening to the 1-2 punch of In Memoriam and Because It's There.
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My favorite hops around as well. Currently I just can't stop listening to the 1-2 punch of In Memoriam and Because It's There.
:tup It's nice to see someone else who like Because It's There. I rarely see it mentionned, but I think it might be my favorite Haken song.
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Just reading this I'm remembering again how great an album The Mountain is. In Memoriam–Because it's There is an excellent combo. Pareidolia is my favorite, though.
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September 11, Restoration finally gets a standalone release. Glad I held out.
https://www.prog-sphere.com/news/haken-release-restoration-ep-cd-september-11/
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Is there a reason why a CD version of Restoration was not released around the same time as the digital version? It almost feels like they separated the digital and physical releases in such a way to get fans to buy twice and make a little bit more money. Nothing wrong with that -- it's business. But still...
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September 11, Restoration finally gets a standalone release. Glad I held out.
https://www.prog-sphere.com/news/haken-release-restoration-ep-cd-september-11/
Ah great. I was trying to hunt down an LP, get the CD, and re-sell the LP without the CD just to get a physical copy of the album. Glad I procrastinated doing that..
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Oooh, I'm so getting this.
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I love Haken and I still haven't even heard these three tracks. :lol
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I love Haken and I still haven't even heard these three tracks. :lol
Oh they're great, especially Crystallised.
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I love Haken and I still haven't even heard these three tracks. :lol
I've only heard them twice. They didn't do much for me and I never got around to listening to them again. Not to say that they're not good, or whatever, but that's my story.
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All three tracks are amazing.
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Is there a reason why a CD version of Restoration was not released around the same time as the digital version? It almost feels like they separated the digital and physical releases in such a way to get fans to buy twice and make a little bit more money. Nothing wrong with that -- it's business. But still...
Maybe they didn't feel it would be economically feasible to produce a CD with three songs?
But given the great reception it's received, they have now decided to do so?
I don't know, just spitballin'.
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Awesome! I'll definitely pick that up. I love the EP, but buying the vinyl makes no sense for me, and I'm not a fan of digital-only, so it's really cool they're finally releasing it on CD!
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Is there a reason why a CD version of Restoration was not released around the same time as the digital version? It almost feels like they separated the digital and physical releases in such a way to get fans to buy twice and make a little bit more money. Nothing wrong with that -- it's business. But still...
Fairly sure it was the label's idea rather than the band's. But yeah, no doubt it was for business reasons. Pretty annoying.
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Is there a reason why a CD version of Restoration was not released around the same time as the digital version? It almost feels like they separated the digital and physical releases in such a way to get fans to buy twice and make a little bit more money. Nothing wrong with that -- it's business. But still...
Fairly sure it was the label's idea rather than the band's. But yeah, no doubt it was for business reasons. Pretty annoying.
That way of doing things seems... InsideOut. :neverusethis:
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In the game industry, it has become common to release games on consoles first (with the technical limitations that the console imposes) and to withhold the PC version for a few months, hoping that gamers end up buying both versions eventually.
Let's hope that the music industry doesn't "learn" from this.
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For those who haven't listened much to the tracks, how? Crystallised is like, Haken's best song yet.
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I mean, it's easily their best epic, if you get knocked about the head several times and lose all memory of Celestial Elixir and Falling Back to Earth. :p
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Of all their epics, Crystallized is definitely their most cohesive. I think it's easily their greatest song. But the other epics are phenomenal as well.
This band is just at their "can do no wrong" phase and I'm just eating it up at the moment.
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I'm very excited for the next album! I know that it will be Haken at its core but I also know that at this stage in their career, it will be a considerable change from the last album (as the previous releases have been).
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Yeah, Crystallised is their best song, easily.
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I listened to all the albums and Restoration today. I am thoroughly convinced that Haken is where it's at. There was not a bad song in the bunch. A live album would be amazing if the ppusa video of Celestial Elixir is any indicator of what we could expect.
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I don't even think Crystallised is the best song on the EP, let alone in their catalogue.
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Oh, I think it is the best on the EP, but it's a really strong EP.
Their best song overall? I'm not sure. Celestial Elixir is probably still it for me.
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I still think Visions is their best epic, and probably their best song, but if there's any song that competes for best song in my books, its Cockroach King. It's generally the song I show to people that gets them into the band because it's so wacky and catchy.
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I'm not a huge fan of Haken's mega epics. Cockroach King and Deathless remain their best songs imo.
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I'm not a huge fan of Haken's mega epics. In Memoriam and Deathless remain their best songs imo.
FTFM.
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Best song for me is still the unofficial epic The Mind's Eye - Portals - Shapeshifter. Love the melodies, the lyrics, and the instrumental is really impressive.
But for an "official" song, Visions is the best for me. The narrative is great, the music fit the narrative, and the feel is epic. And it also has Ray's best drumming performance.
Celestial Elixir is good, but what pulls it down for me is the lack of a climax. I think a long song always needs a climax so that there would be a payoff for listening to a very long song. Crystallized feels like a manufactured epic. The start is great, and then it descended into redundant and repetitive instrumentals that do not add enough variety to justify its length.
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I consider Nobody to be one of their best songs. Its simple, beautiful, has great vocals, and powerful lyrics. I'm amazed it's a bonus song.
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ive never been too sold on Restoration, I think the songs are alright but none of them do that much for me. I don't like Darkest Light as much as Blind, for starters, some of the best parts got cut and it's really repetitive and dull for the last minute or so.
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I consider Nobody to be one of their best songs. Its simple, beautiful, has great vocals, and powerful lyrics. I'm amazed it's a bonus song.
Isn't it an alternative orchestration of Somebody?
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It speaks to the strength of the band that there are so many different answers to "What is your favorite song by *insert band name*?"
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So everyone still love Haken?
I've been listening non stop, Going seeing them again this Friday.
First time I met and chatted with Ray,
Second time I met them all and chatted for a few hours!
Who knows what will happen the third time!!! ;D :metal
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So everyone still love Haken?
I've been listening non stop, Going seeing them again this Friday.
First time I met and chatted with Ray,
Second time I met them all and chatted for a few hours!
Who knows what will happen the third time!!! ;D :metal
A lot of the bands I want to see are overseas. Haken, Beardfish, Steven Wilson. I want to make a trip to England. My wife is from Derby and I told her that we could go and while she visited family, I could take in the concerts in England and surrounding countries.
Enjoy the show! Cannot wait for the new cd!
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I've been overwhelmed by new stuff lately...but still love my Haken. Best new band in a decade...
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Going to see them in Gothenburg in a few weeks, first time!
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Seeing them tonight and then hopefully hanging with them (or Hen and Ray at least) for BTBAM's set.
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Still a fan, yes.
This FB status update from 7 September is an interesting one:
"If we were to say that album #4 will have a strong '80s' influence, how would that make you feel?"
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Oh that caught my attention! :tup
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Seeing them tonight and then hopefully hanging with them (or Hen and Ray at least) for BTBAM's set.
Last night I dreamt that Ross was the star of some hollywood action movie. Rocking Matrixy sun glasses and kicking ass. It was awesome. Tell him if you see him. Or is that weird? :lol
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Still a fan, yes.
This FB status update from 7 September is an interesting one:
"If we were to say that album #4 will have a strong '80s' influence, how would that make you feel?"
Look for my post on that FB post Zy. They respond to fans all the time. Very cool. I posted a pick from the RoSfest show and the bass player and family liked the picture. Really cool seeing the family involved in following the band.
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That's something I like about Haken. They're super down to earth. (There's got to be a falling back to earth joke here somewhere).
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Really cool seeing the family involved in following the band.
Definitely! Ray's parents are family friends that we've known for years and they're awesome (and incredibly Irish). And Hen's dad and wife (and his siblings usually) make it to basically every London show plus some of the others.
I caught Hen for a good catch up after their set tonight, always a pleasure. Learning more and more about his new Nova Collective band with Dan Briggs of BTBAM (though I already know quite a bit about it through other means that I can't disclose). Really exciting stuff.
I also finally got to meet Connor, who seemed like a really cool guy, definitely a great fit for the band!
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Rich, the interaction I had was fantastic. I joked with Connor if he's got the British lingo yet, and the band broke out in laughter and Connor sadly said no and laughed. They were great.
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:lol Nice.
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Really looking forward to the next full length album. 3 albums and an EP just isn't enough.
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Still a fan, yes.
This FB status update from 7 September is an interesting one:
"If we were to say that album #4 will have a strong '80s' influence, how would that make you feel?"
My first thought was the hair metal bands of the 80's. That would not be a good fit for Haken.
I like the way they are taking the time to record the album. Should sound great.
Never would happen, but would love to see Haken, Beardfish and Frost in one concert.
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What if they go full disco.
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What if they go full disco.
Well, except for their EP, their albums have filled an entire disco. :hat
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Awesome gig last night, and once again I shared a few words with them as Rich and Conner were locked out of their back room for a few minutes :lol Then I saw Ross and met Diego for the first time, seemed welcoming of my comments :smiley:
Such a down to earth band, met them every time i've seen them almost by accident :lol
A few blurry photos; I was rather close, Also pic 3... Diego with a keytar!! :metal
(https://i61.tinypic.com/wlwuf6.jpg)
(https://i62.tinypic.com/1234ld0.jpg)
(https://i61.tinypic.com/2w6a2wl.jpg)
(https://i57.tinypic.com/oqb22t.jpg)
(https://i62.tinypic.com/30jr5t2.jpg)
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Just got my Restoration CD :metal
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Also...
(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xft1/v/t34.0-12/12004896_10153203899891545_3573107122352653276_n.jpg?oh=aa949adc24aa71caf477d02d3f153882&oe=55FF5146)
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wow, how retro :lol
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Turns out there's only 250 of them made, and it only cost £5 :tup
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Nice, I have one of those as well.
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Really cool seeing the family involved in following the band.
Definitely! Ray's parents are family friends that we've known for years and they're awesome (and incredibly Irish). And Hen's dad and wife (and his siblings usually) make it to basically every London show plus some of the others.
I caught Hen for a good catch up after their set tonight, always a pleasure. Learning more and more about his new Nova Collective band with Dan Briggs of BTBAM (though I already know quite a bit about it through other means that I can't disclose). Really exciting stuff.
I also finally got to meet Connor, who seemed like a really cool guy, definitely a great fit for the band!
Hey Rich, you had mentioned before that you're Pete's (Haken's old keyboardist) brother, right?
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Saw Haken in Gothenburg earlier tonight with the my dad and the guys in my band. Amazing show. Just great. Me and the guys had had a bit to drink so we were rockin' out hard and singing along passionately to every song. It was awesome. Didn't get to "talk" to anyone though, except for telling Conner that it was a great show and him saying thanks. I did get Rich's pick after the show though, which is awesome.
Here a pic of my dad, Sam (my band's keyboard player/guitarist/saxophone player), and me. And of course, Rich's pick in the middle.
(https://s17.postimg.org/uhb0m9un3/IMG_0756.jpg)
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Really cool seeing the family involved in following the band.
Definitely! Ray's parents are family friends that we've known for years and they're awesome (and incredibly Irish). And Hen's dad and wife (and his siblings usually) make it to basically every London show plus some of the others.
I caught Hen for a good catch up after their set tonight, always a pleasure. Learning more and more about his new Nova Collective band with Dan Briggs of BTBAM (though I already know quite a bit about it through other means that I can't disclose). Really exciting stuff.
I also finally got to meet Connor, who seemed like a really cool guy, definitely a great fit for the band!
Hey Rich, you had mentioned before that you're Pete's (Haken's old keyboardist) brother, right?
Yes indeed, why?
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Really cool seeing the family involved in following the band.
Definitely! Ray's parents are family friends that we've known for years and they're awesome (and incredibly Irish). And Hen's dad and wife (and his siblings usually) make it to basically every London show plus some of the others.
I caught Hen for a good catch up after their set tonight, always a pleasure. Learning more and more about his new Nova Collective band with Dan Briggs of BTBAM (though I already know quite a bit about it through other means that I can't disclose). Really exciting stuff.
I also finally got to meet Connor, who seemed like a really cool guy, definitely a great fit for the band!
Hey Rich, you had mentioned before that you're Pete's (Haken's old keyboardist) brother, right?
Yes indeed, why?
Hen mentioned that he was thinking of coming back to music...I admire his work on the demo and was wondering if you've any scoop on how seriously he's considering this? Feel free to tell me to bugger off all the same, just figured it couldn't hurt to ask ;)
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Haha no need to bugger off, though I don't have all that much to tell. Yeah he's definitely thinking about it pretty seriously, he's over halfway through his PhD at the moment (academia was the reason he left Haken, he was only 17 at the time) and isn't sure what he wants to do after that.
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Haha no need to bugger off, though I don't have all that much to tell. Yeah he's definitely thinking about it pretty seriously, he's over halfway through his PhD at the moment (academia was the reason he left Haken, he was only 17 at the time) and isn't sure what he wants to do after that.
Here's hoping he figures out what to do, and that he goes with what makes him happiest. That said, count me in as one who would be looking forward to his musical releases :tup
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Yeah whatever he does I'll be plugging on DTF for sure. :P
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Yeah whatever he does I'll be plugging on DTF for sure. :P
Awesome...keep the masses informed!
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I was watching them in Helsinki yesterday for the first time. The setlist was amazing, all the best songs :heart I would have liked to hear them more, BTBAM could have been opener and Haken have done 1,5h set... ::) Awesome performance by awesome band. I couldn't have asked more! Hope to see them again in Finland!
I got a drum head with autographs by all Haken band. I think that's cool remembrance from the show for a little fan boy..! :corn
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Nice!
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I was watching them in Helsinki yesterday for the first time. The setlist was amazing, all the best songs :heart I would have liked to hear them more, BTBAM could have been opener and Haken have done 1,5h set... ::) Awesome performance by awesome band. I couldn't have asked more! Hope to see them again in Finland!
I got a drum head with autographs by all Haken band. I think that's cool remembrance from the show for a little fan boy..! :corn
Damn, the oversees folks see all of the cool bands. Glad you enjoyed the show. Still hoping to see Beardfish, Haken and Steven Wilson someday. I have two things against me. One I live in the States and two I live in the Southeast. Atlanta is my only hope.
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Well I live in America and I've seen all 3 bands. *prog gangsta pose* :lol
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Well I live in America and I've seen all 3 bands. *prog gangsta pose* :lol
I am a newbie to progressive music, so really have not had a chance to see any of the three plus DT. I was so disappointed when DT did not make it to Atlanta last tour. Hopefully they will make it this time around.
My wife is from England, so I told her that I would consider a trip to England one summer in the future. She could see her family and I could make the concert circuit.
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That is a must!
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Fun fact:
Wearing a Haken shirt to a Ghost concert will get you hugs from attractive ladies at said concert. It happened twice last night. True story.
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Cool!
Speaking of which, I just placed an order for this shirt.
(https://i.imgur.com/vgSBMmG.png)
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Fun fact:
Wearing a Haken shirt to a Ghost concert will get you hugs from attractive ladies at said concert. It happened twice last night. True story.
:metal
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Zydar - that's the lucky shirt.
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I just got refunded since the shirt is out of stock. You'd think they would update the webshop when I ordered it but oh well.
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I just got refunded since the shirt is out of stock. You'd think they would update the webshop when I ordered it but oh well.
They just knew that you and that shirt combined would be too much sexy for the world to handle.
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:zydar:
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We enter the studio in 2 days to start tracking #H4KEN!
#MoreCowbell #KeytarSolo #Perm
:tup :metal
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This excites me more than any great northern empires!
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That makes me moister than an oyster.
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That makes me moister than an oyster.
Wow, that quote made me excited and disgusted at the same time.
Really excited about the 2016 releases. DT, Haken, Beardfish? and more...
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That makes me moister than an oyster.
(https://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i238/hefdaddy42/funny/Kool-AidMan.jpg)
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That's great news!
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Our first snippet of H4KEN!
https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/videos/vb.102787549743/10153801801064744 (https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/videos/vb.102787549743/10153801801064744)
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Niiice :tup
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that is the kind of bassline i'd love to hear more of omg
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Sounds like Haken
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lol that lamp :lol
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Oh my god I am so excited for this album now just from that! It is SO very Haken but still fresh and new!
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Actually, I`m suddenly really excited for what Haken comes up with! I love The Mountain, so I`m ready for the next album I think!
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actually i just realized, that sounds a lot like this song's first bit :lol https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkX_r1COE6Y
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actually i just realized, that sounds a lot like this song's first bit :lol https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkX_r1COE6Y
That sounds really interesting, need to check that band out.
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Nice
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Finally coming around a little on this band. I like most of The Mountain, with Atlas Stone, Pareidolia, Because It's There, and (especially) Falling Back to Earth all being highly enjoyable.
Still need to give a good listen to those first two albums and last year's EP.
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I would guess at the first two being less your thing, but the EP is not dissimilar in writing style and approach to The Mountain. Glad you're coming around though! :tup
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Our first snippet of H4KEN!
https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/videos/vb.102787549743/10153801801064744 (https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/videos/vb.102787549743/10153801801064744)
Totally missed this, but I love it! Can't wait to hear more.
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I would guess at the first two being less your thing, but the EP is not dissimilar in writing style and approach to The Mountain. Glad you're coming around though! :tup
Out of curiosity, how so?
I ask, because I gave Celestial Elixir a whirl last night, and that song sounds pretty awesome to my ears. Some of the instrumental sections are totally bad ass. :hat
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The Mountain was less out their Kev. Got to say, seeing them live upped my love for them.
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I would guess at the first two being less your thing, but the EP is not dissimilar in writing style and approach to The Mountain. Glad you're coming around though! :tup
Out of curiosity, how so?
I ask, because I gave Celestial Elixir a whirl last night, and that song sounds pretty awesome to my ears. Some of the instrumental sections are totally bad ass. :hat
I could be totally wrong, of course. Just that I would say that, quirky as they are, the first two have a bit more of what critics would call "prog wankery" and "circus music" about them. Then again, you liked Celestial Elixir so that bodes fairly well!
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The Mountain was less out their Kev.
Gotcha.
Just that I would say that, quirky as they are, the first two have a bit more of what critics would call "prog wankery" and "circus music" about them. Then again, you liked Celestial Elixir so that bodes fairly well!
Not that they really sound like Spock's Beard, but I've heard enough of their stuff now to say that they do enough quirky, like SB, to where it sounds natural when they do it, not shoehorned in (which DT is guilty of at times, I think).
Of the three long epics, my early thoughts are that it is close call between Crystallised and Celestial Elixir as to which is the best of them; both are pretty great to me after only a couple listens each. Visions seems solid, but not as good.
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Not that they really sound like Spock's Beard, but I've heard enough of their stuff now to say that they do enough quirky, like SB, to where it sounds natural when they do it, not shoehorned in (which DT is guilty of at times, I think).
Very true, and one of the reasons I find Haken that bit more consistent than DT, for my tastes anyway.
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Of the three long epics, my early thoughts are that it is close call between Crystallised and Celestial Elixir as to which is the best of them; both are pretty great to me after only a couple listens each. Visions seems solid, but not as good.
Dammit Kev. Not only are you getting into Haken, but you're with me on the correct ordering of the epics. This is scary.
In related news, on Cruise to the Edge I got to see Haken shows #5 and #6, and continue to love them more and more. At this rate, if the new album lives up to expectations, I plan on taking a big leap for the US tour in September. My two tattoos now are Rush themed and DT themed, and the next one may very well be a Haken tattoo. I'm hoping that if I do it, they give me something good to work with in the artwork of the next album.
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Damn it, where's that edit post button...? :lol :biggrin:
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Not that they really sound like Spock's Beard, but I've heard enough of their stuff now to say that they do enough quirky, like SB, to where it sounds natural when they do it, not shoehorned in (which DT is guilty of at times, I think).
Very true, and one of the reasons I find Haken that bit more consistent than DT, for my tastes anyway.
Nowadays, that is kind of an unfair comparison, since DT is about to be 13 albums in, and Haken is only 3 (plus an EP) in. Most bands are at their best and most consistent early on, as you say Haken is, and as Dream Theater was early in their career as well.
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Oh totally, only time will tell.
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This discussion is too British. Now take your monical off Rich and stop agreeing. :lol
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Nowadays, that is kind of an unfair comparison, since DT is about to be 13 albums in, and Haken is only 3 (plus an EP) in. Most bands are at their best and most consistent early on, as you say Haken is, and as Dream Theater was early in their career as well.
I actually think that if I'm going to compare the bands at a similar stage in their career, Haken would beat Dream Theater.
Aquarius >>>>> WDaDU (Not even close)
Visions < IaW (Hard to go up against a classic, but Visions is still surprisingly close)
The Mountain = Awake (Both are godly, this is too hard :lol)
Restoration >> ACoS (In terms of value for money as an EP, Restoration dominates as it has 10 more minutes of great original material while ACoS is followed with live covers as filler)
If Haken release 2 or 3 more albums, I think they could take over DT as my favourite band.
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Okay, but what are the odds that they keep making album after album at this supposedly high level? Very few bands have done it, without a hiccup in there somewhere.
For the record, while I am getting more into them now, I am finding much more of the material to be good rather than having the wow factor. The really good songs are really good, but they are in the vast minority. That is a major contrast to DT, who pretty much wowed me non-stop from 1992-2002, with only several tracks from FII not being particularly great. The Mountain is very good, but no way can I say it is better than the best six or even seven albums by DT. But that's me.
Oh totally, only time will tell.
(https://www.travellersintime.com/UniversalWheels/asia_band_1982.jpg)
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Restoration definitely has the benefit of 3 original songs, as opposed to one brand new original song on ACOS, but I would take ACOS over all 3 songs on Restoration. It was a good EP, but didn't wow me. Also, funny coincidence that both DT and Haken's 4th studio releases were EPs featuring reworkings of older material.
As for Haken's longevity, it's really impossible to say. I'd say right now they're just as good as DT were in their prime, so the test is how long will that last. Few bands have kept me interested into their 13th album, so it's not super likely but possible. With that said, topping The Mountain is going to be extremely difficult.
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i'unno the only DT album I like more than The Mountain is Awake, personally
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I don't think making an album where the least best song is better than Cockroach King, which I still find annoying as hell*, will be difficult.
*Vocally; musically, it is fine, but man oh man, those vocal melodies are cringeworthy.
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Those vocals were a perfect case of so bad they're good for me, especially after watching a live version where they hand out the puppets from the music video :lol
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Those off kilter harmonies in the bridge are the greatest moment of the ENTIRE ALBUM imo. Just amazing!
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Restoration definitely has the benefit of 3 original songs, as opposed to one brand new original song on ACOS, but I would take ACOS over all 3 songs on Restoration. It was a good EP, but didn't wow me. Also, funny coincidence that both DT and Haken's 4th studio releases were EPs featuring reworkings of older material.
One important distinction that should be made; Dream Theater were re-working a song written during their second album. Haken were re-working songs from PRIOR to their first album. It would have been very interesting had Dream Theater essentially taken tracks from the Majesty Demos and turned them into something new.
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For me there is no doubt, Haken is a much better band than DT is or was.
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Let's put it like this: I have enjoyed Hakens albums more than i've enjoyed DTs 3 latest albums however the biggest problem I have with DT these days are JLBs vocals, I just can't stand JLB whenever he goes highpitched live. Even though Ross might not be the most original vocalist his voice and vocals are much more enjoyable to listen to.
I still have tremendous respect for each member in DT including JLB as musicians and i'm very intrigued hearing DT13.
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This discussion is too British. Now take your monical off Rich and stop agreeing. :lol
:ariich:
Okay, but what are the odds that they keep making album after album at this supposedly high level? Very few bands have done it, without a hiccup in there somewhere.
For sure, this was what I meant as well. And things change over time - Hen started out as the primary songwriter and even on The Mountain came up with most of the initial ideas that the band then developed, but as I understand it they are going more and more in the direction of full-band writing.
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Yeah, I was actually talking to Hen about that on the cruise. They are definitely being more collaborative this time around.
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I don't think making an album where the least best song is better than Cockroach King, which I still find annoying as hell*, will be difficult.
*Vocally; musically, it is fine, but man oh man, those vocal melodies are cringeworthy.
cockroach king is like top 3 on the mountain but ok
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I don't think making an album where the least best song is better than Cockroach King, which I still find annoying as hell*, will be difficult.
*Vocally; musically, it is fine, but man oh man, those vocal melodies are cringeworthy.
cockroach king is like top 3 on the mountain but ok
I'd say top 1, but who's keeping score?
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it can be #2 or #3 depending on my mood but I don't think anything is beating Falling Back to Earth
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Basically, tracks 1-6 are about as close to progressive perfection as you can possibly get. ;D
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1. Pareidolia
2. In Memoriam
3. Somebody / Nobody
4. Falling Back To Earth
5. Because It's There
6. Cockroach King
7. - 9. whatever order
Cockroach King is a fine song ruined by atrocious vocals. A shame really since the instrumental parts are amazing.
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do you guys like have an alternate version of the song where he was drunk while singing or something because the vocals are fine as far as I've ever heard them
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I don't think making an album where the least best song is better than Cockroach King, which I still find annoying as hell*, will be difficult.
*Vocally; musically, it is fine, but man oh man, those vocal melodies are cringeworthy.
cockroach king is like top 3 on the mountain but ok
I'd say top 1, but who's keeping score?
I am, and I'll confirm the top 1.
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I don't think making an album where the least best song is better than Cockroach King, which I still find annoying as hell*, will be difficult.
*Vocally; musically, it is fine, but man oh man, those vocal melodies are cringeworthy.
cockroach king is like top 3 on the mountain but ok
I'd say top 1, but who's keeping score?
No, Nick. Falling Back to Earth or GTFO.
Nick, is Hen's visa issue resolved since he had to enter the States to board? Or did he use another way to enter the country? I have no idea how international travel and visas work.
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I don't think making an album where the least best song is better than Cockroach King, which I still find annoying as hell*, will be difficult.
*Vocally; musically, it is fine, but man oh man, those vocal melodies are cringeworthy.
cockroach king is like top 3 on the mountain but ok
I'd say top 1, but who's keeping score?
No, Nick. Falling Back to Earth or GTFO.
Nick, is Hen's visa issue resolved since he had to enter the States to board? Or did he use another way to enter the country? I have no idea how international travel and visas work.
Hen is ready to go for the next US tour at this time. That said, stupid things can happen with entering the US, so I would never give a 100% guarantee, but as of now, all is well.
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I'd say top 1, but who's keeping score?
I am, and I'll confirm the top 1.
That could be the case if it was not for Because It's There.
I guess you could say that Cockroach King is not there yet :coolio... :emo:
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do you guys like have an alternate version of the song where he was drunk while singing or something because the vocals are fine as far as I've ever heard them
Nope, it's the regular version. The vocals are too cartoonishly laughable for my ears.
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The vocals on CK are pretty goofy, but they're also really fun and I enjoy them very much.
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Of the three long epics, my early thoughts are that it is close call between Crystallised and Celestial Elixir as to which is the best of them; both are pretty great to me after only a couple listens each. Visions seems solid, but not as good.
Update:
Celestial Elixir is by far, not only the best of the three long epics, but the best song that I have heard by them thus far.
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in case everyone hasn't seen Haken's epic christmas sweater :metal
https://www.merchconnectioninc.com/collections/haken/products/haken-2015-holiday-sweater
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Celestial Elixir is by far, not only the best of the three long epics, but the best song that I have heard by them thus far.
I agree, but for me, Crystallised is a close second.
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Bumping this thread to acknowledge the awesomeness of the band and those working their web store. A few months ago I ordered a Charcoal Restoration shirt but it was out of stock after I had placed the order. I thought "oh well", and the time went on.
Today I got home from work and found a delivery from their web store - it was a 'Climbing The Mountain Tour 2014' shirt AND a handwritten letter to inform me that they've found an old shirt in my size to make up for the inconvenience. And a "Merry Christmas from HAKEN".
:metal
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Of the three long epics, my early thoughts are that it is close call between Crystallised and Celestial Elixir as to which is the best of them; both are pretty great to me after only a couple listens each. Visions seems solid, but not as good.
Update:
Celestial Elixir is by far, not only the best of the three long epics, but the best song that I have heard by them thus far.
Celestial Elixir is, indeed, amazing... but I wouldn't put it on the same level as Visions or Crystallised.
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Bumping this thread to acknowledge the awesomeness of the band and those working their web store. A few months ago I ordered a Charcoal Restoration shirt but it was out of stock after I had placed the order. I thought "oh well", and the time went on.
Today I got home from work and found a delivery from their web store - it was a 'Climbing The Mountain Tour 2014' shirt AND a handwritten letter to inform me that they've found an old shirt in my size to make up for the inconvenience. And a "Merry Christmas from HAKEN".
:metal
That's awesome! :tup
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Is the consensuses here that everyone likes The Mountain? I didn't read through the thread.
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Is the consensuses here that everyone likes The Mountain? I didn't read through the thread.
More or less, there are some people who are not fond of it IIRC.
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Yup, but good thing they're the minority :police:
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Yeah in general it's their most popular album.
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That's odd, I'll give it a couple more spins then. I had only heard Visions before and I found The Mountain to lack everything I like about Visions which was very rich in instrumental composition to me, The Mountain felt very vocals-oriented.
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A bit related to Haken, from Radiant newsletter:
Eric Gillette Announces New Solo Album
"The Great Unknown"
We are excited to announce the upcoming release of Eric Gillette's new solo album,
"The Great Unknown", featuring Eric on Lead Vocals and Guitar, as well as an incredible collection of musicians including the extraordinary Thomas Lang on Drums. The group is rounded out by Haken members, Diego Tejeida on Keyboards, and Connor Green on Bass.
"The Great Unknown", due out on May 2, 2016, boasts 7 original tracks, including
the 18 minute epic "Escape" and is produced by Eric Gillette and Chris Thompson,
in partnership with T4 Music.
The album will be mastered by audio genius, Rich Mouser (Transatlantic, Spock's Beard, Neal Morse) at Mouse House Studio.
Available in April for worldwide pre-sale, through
www.ericgillettemusic.com and www.radiantrecords.com
Releasing worldwide on May 2, 2016!
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https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/videos/vb.102787549743/10153935315869744/?type=3&theater (https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/videos/vb.102787549743/10153935315869744/?type=3&theater)
Mastering of H4KEN is under way!
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Bring it on!
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This is one of the albums I'm most excited about this year.
The Mountain is still fresh, inspired and amazing to my ears. I can't wait to see how they plan in topping that one.
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So, I've had some insights on the direction they're taking the new album in, but I'm not sure I'm allowed to say what they are. They definitely intrigue me though!
And great to see that Jens Bogren is producing again, the man is amazing.
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I'm a bit out of the loop, but are they really calling it H4KEN?
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Yes, join the future, be one with #H4ken.
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That would be a bit lame.
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Pretty sure they're not, they're just calling it that as a working title like pretty much all bands do. I think they did something similar with HAK3N, i.e. The Mountain.
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It'd be funny if they did though.
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Pretty sure they're not, they're just calling it that as a working title like pretty much all bands do. I think they did something similar with HAK3N, i.e. The Mountain.
Yeah, just like the working title of the Cockroach King was Hacock. #RealFact
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This (https://prog.teamrock.com/news/2016-01-28/haken-see-album-format-as-musical-journey) article from Prog names Haken's fourth album as Verbatim.
(If that's the case, this thread should be renamed "Verbacontim". Calling it now.)
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Yeah I think they got that from this image Haken posted to their facebook a few days ago:
(https://scontent-arn2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/12541046_10153940428689744_9048567952898038281_n.jpg?oh=0321bbf0065a907e6f9547d9a9c3d8a4&oe=57443DFF)
:lol
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haha :lol
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I can picture a band that wants to screw their fanbase real bad and name an album 'Verbatim'. How awesome would that be.
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I can picture a band that wants to screw their fanbase real bad and name an album 'Verbatim'. How awesome would that be.
That would be a really good album title though. Very proggy, and very Haken.
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feature on Into the Machine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgD1tEjtF2g
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Very cool.
A nice insight into their lives. It's really a shame that they are the epitome of the independent modern musician, given they have to work other jobs. Really puts you to think, eh.
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This (https://prog.teamrock.com/news/2016-01-28/haken-see-album-format-as-musical-journey) article from Prog names Haken's fourth album as Verbatim.
(If that's the case, this thread should be renamed "Verbacontim". Calling it now.)
Saw this earlier today, and I'm pretty sure the guys at the Prog offices did NOT get the joke. :rollin
-Marc.
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This (https://prog.teamrock.com/news/2016-01-28/haken-see-album-format-as-musical-journey) article from Prog names Haken's fourth album as Verbatim.
(If that's the case, this thread should be renamed "Verbacontim". Calling it now.)
Saw this earlier today, and I'm pretty sure the guys at the Prog offices did NOT get the joke. :rollin
-Marc.
For anyone who didn`t understand:
https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/photos/a.102809109743.113889.102787549743/10153940428689744/?type=3&theater
That`s some bad work of this magazine to misinterpret this to think "Verbatim" would be the real album name.
EDIT: Oh nevermind, was already posted on the last page.
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Excellent trolling from the guys: https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/photos/a.102809109743.113889.102787549743/10153958586594744/?type=3
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I don't know what parts of that I should consider trolling and what to take seriously, or if all of it is trolling. At first I thought the tracks and track lengths themselves were serious, working titles obviously, but at least real. But then the 50 minute track had me doubting that too. I'm not sure how to interprate this :lol
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I don't know what parts of that I should consider trolling and what to take seriously, or if all of it is trolling. At first I thought the tracks and track lengths themselves were serious, working titles obviously, but at least real. But then the 50 minute track had me doubting that too. I'm not sure how to interprate this :lol
Considering the total length of those tracks reaches 95 minutes, and the "Verbatim" CD-r only holds 80 minutes, I'd say it's a fake track list, at least length-wise.
-Marc.
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I know for a fact that everything about that is trolling. :lol
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:rollin :rollin
This is amazing. I like to think The Very Table is a Metallica reference, they're pretty close in length too. H4KEN ft. James Hetfield?
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I have to admit I falled for "Verbatim", then I realised. Haken are master comedians.
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:rollin :rollin
This is amazing. I like to think The Very Table is a Metallica reference, they're pretty close in length too. H4KEN ft. James Hetfield?
It's a play on "the veritable".
And I know what the album is actually going to be called. :hat
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Teltron?
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:rollin :rollin
This is amazing. I like to think The Very Table is a Metallica reference, they're pretty close in length too. H4KEN ft. James Hetfield?
It's a play on "the veritable".
And I know what the album is actually going to be called. :hat
Do you know about when the CD will be released? If it is anywhere near the quality of The Mountain, I will be happy.
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And I know what the album is actually going to be called. :hat
Oh you...
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And I know what the album is actually going to be called. :hat
Datalife? Maxell?
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Do you know about when the CD will be released?
Don't know, sorry. Given that they've confirmed that it's been mastered, my guess would be mid-late spring, but that's only a guess based on how long these things normally take.
And I know what the album is actually going to be called. :hat
Datalife? Maxell?
Betamax.
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Damn I was hoping it would be Laserdisc.
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Let the hype begin...
https://hakenmusic.com/haken-os-console
Password should be pretty obvious if you've been following their Facebook posts ;)
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Cool :lol
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Let the hype begin...
https://hakenmusic.com/haken-os-console
Password should be pretty obvious if you've been following their Facebook posts ;)
and if we haven't?
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It's simply the album title
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It's simply the album title
And if we don't know the album title?
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OK I searched the last 2 pages, it's Verbatim??? Why?
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OK I searched the last 2 pages, it's Verbatim??? Why?
Zing!!!!
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Goddamnit, they keep teasing us! :lol
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The password is verbatim.
The album is not called Verbatim. That was always a joke that they've subsequently been trolling about because Prog magazine didn't realise it was a joke. :lol
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I like H4KEN as the album title. It's a clever way of having a self-titled, and I don't even like when bands do a "self titled" unless it's their first album, even then an actual title is usually better. But this would be cool.
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Rich said they just used it as a working title, similar to The Mountain being refered to as HAK3N. So I wouldn't count on it, pretty badass name tho.
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They posted a picture of the master disc and it was burned on a Verbatim brand blank CD.
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It would be hilarious if when the album actually comes out, people get confused because they still thought the album would be called Verbatim. :lol
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(https://media2.giphy.com/media/8miYQYfpol1qU/200_s.gif)
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I guess we'll get a single soon.
ariich, you said that the band took a specific direction with this album. Is it something that will be obvious by a single song?
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Rich said they just used it as a working title, similar to The Mountain being refered to as HAK3N. So I wouldn't count on it, pretty badass name tho.
Correct. It is neither H4KEN nor Verbatim.
ariich, you said that the band took a specific direction with this album. Is it something that will be obvious by a single song?
From what I know, no. As with their previous albums, it won't be a complete overhaul of their sound (i.e. it will be obviously recogniseable as Haken) but there will be some new things and certain aspects of their sound will be more prominent than usual. Basically, what you'd expect from a prog band that wants to do something different each time.
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From what I know, no. As with their previous albums, it won't be a complete overhaul of their sound (i.e. it will be obviously recogniseable as Haken) but there will be some new things and certain aspects of their sound will be more prominent than usual. Basically, what you'd expect from a prog band that wants to do something different each time.
Are you suggesting that it could be an album full of Cockroach King style songs? I'm sure that it's the kind of album that would make every fans happy. :neverusethis:
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(https://media2.giphy.com/media/8miYQYfpol1qU/200_s.gif)
This is how I feel.
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Don't we all, my good friend?
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From what I know, no. As with their previous albums, it won't be a complete overhaul of their sound (i.e. it will be obviously recogniseable as Haken) but there will be some new things and certain aspects of their sound will be more prominent than usual. Basically, what you'd expect from a prog band that wants to do something different each time.
Are you suggesting that it could be an album full of Cockroach King style songs? I'm sure that it's the kind of album that would make every fans happy. :neverusethis:
Cockroach King is fucking amazing! Theres nothing like it in the progmetal scene so I wouldn't mind a whole CK album.
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Images & Verbatim, Pt. 2: Scenes From An Astonishing
Ft. "In the Court of the Cockroach King"
Leaked lyrics:
I sympathize...
With a Cockroach,
And a Cockroach...
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Guest vocalist: Evermind 'hell yes, I got this, lyrics are a piece of cake'
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:rollin
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From what I know, no. As with their previous albums, it won't be a complete overhaul of their sound (i.e. it will be obviously recogniseable as Haken) but there will be some new things and certain aspects of their sound will be more prominent than usual. Basically, what you'd expect from a prog band that wants to do something different each time.
Are you suggesting that it could be an album full of Cockroach King style songs? I'm sure that it's the kind of album that would make every fans happy. :neverusethis:
Cockroach King is fucking amazing! Theres nothing like it in the progmetal scene so I wouldn't mind a whole CK album.
I really like Cockroach King, but wouldn't want an entire album of that stuff. It'd just be too much.
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From what I know, no. As with their previous albums, it won't be a complete overhaul of their sound (i.e. it will be obviously recogniseable as Haken) but there will be some new things and certain aspects of their sound will be more prominent than usual. Basically, what you'd expect from a prog band that wants to do something different each time.
Are you suggesting that it could be an album full of Cockroach King style songs? I'm sure that it's the kind of album that would make every fans happy. :neverusethis:
Cockroach King is fucking amazing! Theres nothing like it in the progmetal scene so I wouldn't mind a whole CK album.
I really like Cockroach King, but wouldn't want an entire album of that stuff. It'd just be too much.
Same here. If they decided to do more of that on album (which, no, was not what I was referring to this time), I would guess at either it being still only PART of an album, or maybe something shorter like an EP.
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Cockroach King is fucking amazing! Theres nothing like it in the progmetal scene so I wouldn't mind a whole CK album.
That would be the worst album ever.
Then again, I hate Cockroach King, so there ya have it. :lol :lol
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Cockroach King is fucking amazing! Theres nothing like it in the progmetal scene so I wouldn't mind a whole CK album.
That would be the worst album ever.
Then again, I hate Cockroach King, so there ya have it. :lol :lol
Yea my bad, that was my tipsy self trying to express its love for CK. I love the song, but I don't want an entire album of it. Just like The Astonishing, I don't mind the couple of out-of-the-ordinary songs like Three Days and Lord Nafaryus, hell, I love them, but I don't want a whole album of it.
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I really like Cockroach King, but wouldn't want an entire album of that stuff. It'd just be too much.
Same here. If they decided to do more of that on album (which, no, was not what I was referring to this time), I would guess at either it being still only PART of an album, or maybe something shorter like an EP.
My comment was more facetious than anything. :D It just seems that while a lot of people seems to enjoy it (me included), the people who don't like the song seems to really hate it a lot.
Anyway, I'm looking forward to this new album whether or not it contains a Ladybug Queen song.
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https://hakenmusic.com/haken-album-four-press-release Press release for the new album, it's called Affinity!
Einar Solberg on guest vocals on a 15 minute song! Fuck yeah! And the teaser sounds really good! Link to the teaser: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3t4MKqsf3Q
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April 29th is the date.
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Awesome! Man all of my favorite bands are putting out stuff in the first four months of 2016. Is there anything coming out over the summer?
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That teaser is such a tease. :lol
Also can't work out if that's the album art that appears on the site. Looks fittingly retro if so!
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Not gonna lie that cover looks pretty badass, also affinity.exe has got to be the coolest track name I've seen all year.
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Dear God. I'm ready for this.
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Wow, the teaser sounds amazing. The production is spot on.
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GIMME!
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Fantastic!
Also, the tracklist for anyone who wants to know the quick way:
01 - affinity.exe (1:24)
02 - Initiate (4:16)
03 - 1985 (9:09)
04 - Lapse (4:44)
05 - The Architect (15:40)
06 - Earthrise (4:48)
07 - Red Giant (6:06)
08 - The Endless Knot (5:50)
09 - Bound by Gravity (9:29)
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All kinds of: :metal
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:coolio
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Oh man, it all sounds so tasty. 2 and a half-ish months is too long!!
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Fantastic!
Also, the tracklist for anyone who wants to know the quick way:
01 - affinity.exe (1:24)
02 - Initiate (4:16)
03 - 1985 (9:09)
04 - Lapse (4:44)
05 - The Architect (15:40)
06 - Earthrise (4:48)
07 - Red Giant (6:06)
08 - The Endless Knot (5:50)
09 - Bound by Gravity (9:29)
All still fine
Nineteeeen eiiighty five
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It's been confirmed that 1985 is a direct response to Taylor Swift's 1989.
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Not gonna lie that cover looks pretty badass
I agree with this statement.
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Fantastic!
Also, the tracklist for anyone who wants to know the quick way:
01 - affinity.exe (1:24)
02 - Initiate (4:16)
03 - 1985 (9:09)
04 - Lapse (4:44)
05 - The Architect (15:40)
06 - Earthrise (4:48)
07 - Red Giant (6:06)
08 - The Endless Knot (5:50)
09 - Bound by Gravity (9:29)
All still fine
Nineteeeen eiiighty five
:rollin I sang the same part in my mind when I read the tracklist here
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Fantastic!
Also, the tracklist for anyone who wants to know the quick way:
01 - affinity.exe (1:24)
02 - Initiate (4:16)
03 - 1985 (9:09)
04 - Lapse (4:44)
05 - The Architect (15:40)
06 - Earthrise (4:48)
07 - Red Giant (6:06)
08 - The Endless Knot (5:50)
09 - Bound by Gravity (9:29)
Album is 61:26. This means the album is their shortest, though an hour long album is hardly short. The teaser sounds fantastic.
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https://hakenmusic.com/haken-album-four-press-release
Affinity!
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Amazing news, this sounds incredible.
edit: Here's the cover art.
(https://hakenmusic.com/images/affinity.jpg?v=1.0)
dang now I want the album on a floppy disc.
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Great track names, great album name, just great all around!!! An hour of music suits me just fine, and I'm sure they whittled it down to just the best stuff! :tup
I love that they're continuing with single word album titles (well, not counting the "The" in The Mountain).
-Marc.
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That album art is so different than what I'd ever expect from this band. Love it.
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This album has me fired up! I like where on the website where it pauses saying processing low noise/ high output audio, which gives me hope for a HDTracks master along with the Mountain and Aquarius
Edit: Also how can Aquarius be sold out on their site and Amazon? Thats rather bizarre.
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The teaser sound great! I really like that Einar is doing guest vocals, really can't wait.
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Amazing news, this sounds incredible.
edit: Here's the cover art.
*snip*
dang now I want the album on a floppy disc.
I sort of doubt that it will be the final album art, seems to be just keeping in with the retro aesthetic of the site (unless the site is built around the retro aesthetic of the album art but I find that less likely).
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I wouldn't mind it at all if that were the cover art. It seems so unexpected for a prog release, but looks so fitting with the retro technology aesthetic they seem to be going for here.
All the music in the teaser sounds great. Color me hyped. :tup
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I'm pretty sure that's the actual cover art. The "retro" thing is clearly a theme for the album.
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Yeah, that's the final cover art. Haken confirmed it in a comment on Facebook.
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It feels like they should have the limited edition release be a cassette tape rather than the usual vinyl.
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Yeah, that's the final cover art. Haken confirmed it in a comment on Facebook.
I highly approve of this :tup
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It feels like they should have the limited edition release be a cassette tape rather than the usual vinyl.
They already did that with The Mountain. :P
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Also, this time the so called "centerpiece" is actually in the middle of the album. Lol.
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I expect some 8-bit bits (badum tssss) in the release :metal :corn
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I want a ten-minute single. 1985 is an intriguing song title.
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It's fun knowing stuff that you guys don't. Now I know how bosk felt in the run up to The Astonishing. :biggrin:
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The press release was awesomely intuitive. Very nice!
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It's fun knowing stuff that you guys don't. Now I know how bosk felt in the run up to The Astonishing. :biggrin:
I feel the urge to post this album cover.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/3e/Queensryche_with_Geoff_Tate_-_Frequency_Unknown.jpg)
No specific reason... :angel:
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:lol sorry not sorry
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Also, this time the so called "centerpiece" is actually in the middle of the album. Lol.
And the classic DTF debate returns once again.... :hat
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Also, this time the so called "centerpiece" is actually in the middle of the album. Lol.
They already did that with The Mountain. :P
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EU tour dates announced, here's a link, it's also on their FB https://www.insideoutmusic.com/newsdetailed.aspx?IdNews=16746&IdCompany=8
Gonna see them the 27th of May @ De Boerderij :metal
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Why is every band I like leaving out Czech Republic this year? It's such a pain having to travel to Germany everytime I wanna see a band I like. >:(
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EU tour dates announced, here's a link, it's also on their FB https://www.insideoutmusic.com/newsdetailed.aspx?IdNews=16746&IdCompany=8
Gonna see them the 27th of May @ De Boerderij :metal
Awesome! I think I am going to go to, I'd love to, but I'm not yet sure if I can.
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EU tour dates announced, here's a link, it's also on their FB https://www.insideoutmusic.com/newsdetailed.aspx?IdNews=16746&IdCompany=8
Gonna see them the 27th of May @ De Boerderij :metal
Definitely going on 18th of June in Cologne; I`m incredibly hyped.
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EU tour dates announced, here's a link, it's also on their FB https://www.insideoutmusic.com/newsdetailed.aspx?IdNews=16746&IdCompany=8
Gonna see them the 27th of May @ De Boerderij :metal
Hope there's more to be added, only 1 UK headline show seems a bit odd.
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Praying they come to the US at some point this year. Their show was one of the highlights of 2015.
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EU tour dates announced, here's a link, it's also on their FB https://www.insideoutmusic.com/newsdetailed.aspx?IdNews=16746&IdCompany=8
Gonna see them the 27th of May @ De Boerderij :metal
Awesome! I think I am going to go to, I'd love to, but I'm not yet sure if I can.
Dang, my buddy might bail out because he has finals shortly after. Keep me updated, if you're willing to go shoot me a PM and I'll join.
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EU tour dates announced, here's a link, it's also on their FB https://www.insideoutmusic.com/newsdetailed.aspx?IdNews=16746&IdCompany=8
Gonna see them the 27th of May @ De Boerderij :metal
Scandinavian dates but no Finland?! :'( ???
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That little sampler they posted sounds fantastic. I'm excited for this album!!
:metal :metal :metal :metal
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EU tour dates announced, here's a link, it's also on their FB https://www.insideoutmusic.com/newsdetailed.aspx?IdNews=16746&IdCompany=8
Gonna see them the 27th of May @ De Boerderij :metal
Awesome! I think I am going to go to, I'd love to, but I'm not yet sure if I can.
Dang, my buddy might bail out because he has finals shortly after. Keep me updated, if you're willing to go shoot me a PM and I'll join.
Cool, I'll send you a PM if I'm going! Might take a while before I know, my main issue is that I'm not sure if I can still go home with the train after the show.
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Just listened to Aquarius for the first time in probably 2 1/2 years
Me:
(https://i.imgur.com/Nz2R23q.gif)
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Praying they come to the US at some point this year. Their show was one of the highlights of 2015.
If DT does a standard tour with guest later in the year, Haken would be a great opener in the US.
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True, but to be honest, I'd rather a night with Haken. The small venue and intimate experience is what made the concert. (Also the kick ass music of course)
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EU tour dates announced, here's a link, it's also on their FB https://www.insideoutmusic.com/newsdetailed.aspx?IdNews=16746&IdCompany=8
Gonna see them the 27th of May @ De Boerderij :metal
Awesome! I think I am going to go to, I'd love to, but I'm not yet sure if I can.
Dang, my buddy might bail out because he has finals shortly after. Keep me updated, if you're willing to go shoot me a PM and I'll join.
Cool, I'll send you a PM if I'm going! Might take a while before I know, my main issue is that I'm not sure if I can still go home with the train after the show.
Pretty sure concerts like this end around 11PM-midnight max. I'm taking the train aswell.
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Just listened to Aquarius for the first time in probably 2 1/2 years
Me:
(https://i.imgur.com/Nz2R23q.gif)
I love Aquarius except for the death growls. I know there aren't many but they're just so distracting that it's enough to keep the album at the bottom for me.
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Just read the info about the new album.
I'm so hard right now.
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I ordered a t-shirt off Hakens store on Wednesday and the email said:
"It can take up to 5 working days for your order to be processed. Please allow approximately 10 - 14 working days for delivery from this date"
Pleasantly surprised to receive it this morning :tup Now I can wear it at Symphony X on Tuesday ;D :metal
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Anybody willing to part with Aquarius? I'm having trouble finding it on the interwebs. Looking for a physical copy.
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Anybody willing to part with Aquarius? I'm having trouble finding it on the interwebs. Looking for a physical copy.
Ask the band on Facebook - I'm sure they'll be able to get a copy to you.
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Praying they come to the US at some point this year. Their show was one of the highlights of 2015.
Well they're already going to be in the states for a show around September 10th (ProgPower in Atlanta) so I wouldn't be at all surprised if they cushioned that show with a small tour either before or after.
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Yeah, why did Aquarius disappear from everywhere?
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Yeah, why did Aquarius disappear from everywhere?
This. I`m basically looking everywhere to find a copy, since I`m a fan only since last year and it`s a struggle to not have one album, especially because I love the other ones.
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Praying they come to the US at some point this year. Their show was one of the highlights of 2015.
Well they're already going to be in the states for a show around September 10th (ProgPower in Atlanta) so I wouldn't be at all surprised if they cushioned that show with a small tour either before or after.
The Magic 8-Ball says "I'd count on it". ;)
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Now I just need a tour date in SLC or Vegas! :D
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Yeah, why did Aquarius disappear from everywhere?
This. I`m basically looking everywhere to find a copy, since I`m a fan only since last year and it`s a struggle to not have one album, especially because I love the other ones.
Probably because it is sold out, and they have not reprinted it yet.
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Yeah, why did Aquarius disappear from everywhere?
This. I`m basically looking everywhere to find a copy, since I`m a fan only since last year and it`s a struggle to not have one album, especially because I love the other ones.
Probably because it is sold out, and they have not reprinted it yet.
I'm glad I snagged a copy from my local store when I was introduced to the band, which was a few months after Visions came out. I wish there was a CD of the recent EP that came out (which by the way, the epic Crystallised is probably the band's best song)
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Restoration was released on CD last year.
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Finally gotten around to giving this band a proper chance after hearing so many good things about them on here. Downloaded The Mountain on Saturday night and have certainly not been disappointed, I then had a little look on iTunes last night and noticed that their last EP was only £1.49. I obviously purchased that on the spot and am very much looking forward to giving it a good listen after work :metal
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... So nobody else is on the Burning Shed mailing list, then?
(https://www.burningshed.com/covers/large5819.jpg) (https://www.burningshed.com/store/InsideOutMusic/product/523/7320/)
Haken's fourth album sees the band drawing influence from the oft-neglected Progressive scene of the 1980s.
"The 1970s was a golden age for prog music," explains guitarist Charles Griffiths. "In the past we've taken a lot from bands of that era, especially Gentle Giant, but this time, we've gone more towards the next decade for our inspiration. It means albums like 90125 from Yes, Toto IV and King Crimson's Three of a Perfect Pair. We all love the sounds they used and we've incorporated some of that approach on Affinity."
Includes the 16 minute The Architect featuring Leprous vocalist Einar Solberg.
Limited edition double cd in media book with signed postcard.
Pre-order for April 29th release.
CD 1:
1) affinity.exe (1:26)
2) Initiate (4:16)
3) 1985 (9:08)
4) Lapse (4:44)
5) The Architect (15:40)
6) Earthrise (4:48)
7) Red Giant (6:06)
8) The Endless Knot (5:50)
9) Bound By Gravity (9:29)
CD 2:
1) affinity.exe (1:26)
2) Initiate (instrumental version) (4:16)
3) 1985 (instrumental version) (9:08)
4) Lapse (instrumental version) (4:44)
5) The Architect (instrumental version) (15:40)
6) Earthrise (instrumental version) (4:48)
7) Red Giant (instrumental version) (6:06)
8) The Endless Knot (instrumental version) (5:50)
9) Bound By Gravity (instrumental version) (9:29)
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I am so getting this.
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Oh my
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I am excite.
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Well, now I'm all :caffeine:
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Bit off-topic, but has anyone living in Europe previously preordered something on Burning Shed and did the article arrive on time? I`m thinking about preordering Affinity there, but I could also wait until it hits Amazon (I hope the Limited Edition will), because I`m almost 100% sure Amazon will send it on release date.
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*Touches himself*
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Bit off-topic, but has anyone living in Europe previously preordered something on Burning Shed and did the article arrive on time? I`m thinking about preordering Affinity there, but I could also wait until it hits Amazon (I hope the Limited Edition will), because I`m almost 100% sure Amazon will send it on release date.
I'm in Canada and get stuff a day or two after release date. So I'm pretty sure you'd get it like a week before me! Obviously depends on when they actually receive stock, though.
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OK, thanks for the info! I`ll probably preorder Affinity and get tickets for the show in Cologne by tomorrow then. the hype is real
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Saw the pre-order up on Burning Shed, went ahead and pre-ordered it, as well as ordering Restoration on CD (which I had not owned yet). I'm excited for this one! I'm going to avoid samples and what not until it comes out, since it will come out in a couple of months anyway. Lots of good music coming out in the first half of this year!!!
-Marc.
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https://progressivemusicplanet.com/2016/03/02/haken-affinity/
THE DEATH GROWLS ARE BACK :metal
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This sounds like it's going to be an amazing album. I really can't wait!
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https://progressivemusicplanet.com/2016/03/02/haken-affinity/
THE DEATH GROWLS ARE BACK :metal
TBH, I'm not crazy about the death growls being back.
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I've been trying so hard to not get unreasonably hyped for this album in fear of holding it to ridiculous expectations, but they just keep making it so hard not to.
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My prog boner is OVER 9000!!!
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https://progressivemusicplanet.com/2016/03/02/haken-affinity/
THE DEATH GROWLS ARE BACK :metal
TBH, I'm not crazy about the death growls being back.
This, I don't mind death growls when they add to the music and are done well (Opeth & BTBAM). The death growls in Aquarious, while minimal, always distract from the amazing music and melodies and yank me out of the music. I'll reserve judgement until I hear the album, but I'm slightly concerned.
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My prog boner is OVER 9000 FEMTOMETERS!!!
Sacul just admitted to having a micropenis because I had to assume units.
Remember folks, units are important :tup
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And I'm an engineering student :lol :facepalm:
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All right, hadn't listened to the teaser yet, now I'm really really excited about this
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https://progressivemusicplanet.com/2016/03/02/haken-affinity/
THE DEATH GROWLS ARE BACK :metal
TBH, I'm not crazy about the death growls being back.
This, I don't mind death growls when they add to the music and are done well (Opeth & BTBAM). The death growls in Aquarious, while minimal, always distract from the amazing music and melodies and yank me out of the music. I'll reserve judgement until I hear the album, but I'm slightly concerned.
It's not like the growls were thrown atop a beautiful section that they didn't fit. The moments in Aquarius were asking for it.
I would even forget about it if the band stopped writing music that demanded growls, nothing wrong with that. The section near the end of Pareidolia feels off with clean vocals.
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https://progressivemusicplanet.com/2016/03/02/haken-affinity/
THE DEATH GROWLS ARE BACK :metal
TBH, I'm not crazy about the death growls being back.
This, I don't mind death growls when they add to the music and are done well (Opeth & BTBAM). The death growls in Aquarious, while minimal, always distract from the amazing music and melodies and yank me out of the music. I'll reserve judgement until I hear the album, but I'm slightly concerned.
It's not like the growls were thrown atop a beautiful section that they didn't fit. The moments in Aquarius were asking for it.
I guess we can agree to disagree.
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SPOILERS I GUESS
For what it's worth:
1. The "death growls" are probably technically not death growls. They are definitely harsh vocals, though, and that short segment of The Architect has a definitely nordic metal feel to it so they fit well, more so than on Aquarius IMO (though I still thought they were fine there).
2. This time the harsh vocals are provided by Einar Solberg of Leprous, so they sound VERY different to the Aquarius growls.
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Very spoilery... Maybe I should stay out of this thread until the album is out.
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Very spoilery... Maybe I should stay out of this thread until the album is out.
Good point, added a warning in my post. But yeah, reviews will start coming out now, so there will definitely be spoilers. :lol
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Have you formed an opinion on the album yet?
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ariich all I want to know is are there beautiful harmonies or any a capella sections? Those are always my favoriteeee
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ariich all I want to know is are there beautiful harmonies or any a capella sections? Those are always my favoriteeee
This.
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I haven't heard the album yet, but I will already say there are probably beautiful harmonies. :p
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SPOILERS IN RESPONSE TO QUESTIONS
No a capella sections like Cockroach King or Crystallised this time.
Yes plenty of really f-ing good vocal harmonies and generally epic Haken choruses.
Yes I have definitely formed an opinion and I absolutely love it. Took a handful of listens to really sink in.
I'll be publishing a review soon so can give more detail then!
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SPOILER (just because I'm responding to Rich's comments)
Wow, harsh vocals by Einar, that's amazing! I'm really curious now!
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Album of the year -- Im calling it! Sorry DT!
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Is this new album the first recording with the new bassist? (I know no one's name in the band)
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Is this new album the first recording with the new bassist? (I know no one's name in the band)
It's the first *full length* release with Connor (the new bassist). The Restoration EP was the first recording to feature him.
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Is this new album the first recording with the new bassist? (I know no one's name in the band)
It's the first *full length* release with Connor (the new bassist). The Restoration EP was the first recording to feature him.
It's also therefore the first entirely original material with Conner, as Restoration was reworkings of old demo songs.
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No a capella sections? :tdwn
Growls are back? :tdwn
But still Haken, the album is gonna be great, and we all know that... hard to be better than The Mountain, though.
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Just curious but it may have been mentioned already, but doesn't this album not come for basically another 2 months? Did you guys get press copies or something?
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No a capella sections? :hefdaddy
Growls are back? :metal
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Just curious but it may have been mentioned already, but doesn't this album not come for basically another 2 months? Did you guys get press copies or something?
Press copies have started to go out I think, but literally only in the last couple of days so I'm not sure anyone else has got it yet. In my case, though, it's because I know the band.
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It's a bloody shame Visions isn't available on vinyl. What a masterpiece!
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SPOILER (I guess)
I'm actually somewhat bummed those a capella sections aren't making a comeback. Those parts of CK and Crystallized are among my favorite.
Regardless, this album gon be gud. Surpassing The Mountain is quite the task I imagine, but Haken have done nothing to make me doubt them so far.
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I'm pretty surprised at the reactions to the lack of those a capella sections. I mean, they've only done two in their entire history. It's not remotely, in any way, a core part of Haken's sound.
Furthermore, there's a whole bunch of new styles and ideas on this album. In the same way that they introduced things like the a capella and others on the Mountain (and broadly stuck with that style on Restoration), they're continuing to introduce more new things as well.
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SPOILERS IN RESPONSE TO QUESTIONS
No a capella sections like Cockroach King or Crystallised this time.
Yes plenty of really f-ing good vocal harmonies and generally epic Haken choruses.
Yes I have definitely formed an opinion and I absolutely love it. Took a handful of listens to really sink in.
I'll be publishing a review soon so can give more detail then!
THANK GOD!!!! :big grin:
I'm a fan of this band, but not a hardcore one like many of you. I'll still check this out for sure. :coolio
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this album is going to be
a haken album
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this album is going to be
a haken album
SPOILERS!!!1
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Who wants this band to do the same thing every album? I am very excited about it.
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I'm pretty surprised at the reactions to the lack of those a capella sections. I mean, they've only done two in their entire history. It's not remotely, in any way, a core part of Haken's sound.
It's because people are being whiny little bitches.
I will take what they give and love it, like a prison bitch.
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I'm pretty surprised at the reactions to the lack of those a capella sections. I mean, they've only done two in their entire history. It's not remotely, in any way, a core part of Haken's sound.
It's because people are being whiny little bitches.
I will take what they give and love it, like a prison bitch.
"IIIII'm Nappa. And this is Vegeta. He was a prison bitch."
On topic, le excitement!! :caffeine:
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I'm really looking forward to this album. TA didn't really live up to my expectations, so I guess this will be my Album Of The Year.
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There would be growls again? Maybe I will pass.
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There would be growls again? Maybe I will pass.
Because of one short section in one song? ???
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There would be growls again? Maybe I will pass.
Your loss :lol
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Well, those a capella sections are not as "core" of the band as a distorted guitar sound, for instance, but they are somehow particular to them. And remember, the difference is always on the details.
That being said, I'm gonna listen to this album with my pants wet anyway.
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Well, those a capella sections are not as "core" of the band as a distorted guitar sound, for instance, but they are somehow particular to them.
Particular to them.
And Spock's Beard.
And probably several others which currently escape me.
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We have a 10/10 review and ariich's word that the album is indeed great, yet some fans expect to be disappointed :lol
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You can't hate on a band's new album until their 6th album, AND they've been around for at least 10 years. That's the rock and roll rules.
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There would be growls again? Maybe I will pass.
Your loss :lol
Love Visions and The Mountain. Can't listen to Aquarius because I am still bummed by how the song with my favorite melody, Streams, was horribly sidetracked by growls that do not make any musical or narrative sense.
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So a few seconds ruin the entire album for you? That sucks.
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So a few seconds ruin the entire album for you? That sucks.
It ruins the album-listening experience because I usually listen to albums in full. Normally, I am not bothered by a few seconds of music I don't like, but because it is in the song which has the album highlight for me, my negative reaction is magnified.
I listen to songs in Aquarius now on a per track basis, although lately it is just Drowning in the Flood. I often see Aquarius as Haken still learning to write good songs, throwing several ideas but not knowing when enough is enough. Or when a musical theme has played on too long, with no good sensenof pace or climax (which I find in Celestial Elixir). Visions, though, really clicked with me. Love love love that album.
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I often see Aquarius as Haken still learning to write good songs, throwing several ideas but not knowing when enough is enough.
I guess I agree with that, to an extent, though I love Celestial Elixir. I don't have a problem with growls at all, but they were definitely poorly-performed/misplaced on Aquarius.
I'm pretty confident they'll do better this time around, though.
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As long as ariich would assure me that the growling in this new album is nothing like how they placed it in Streams, then of course I will give the album a chance. :lol I was just being hyperbolic after all.
Celestial Elixir is good, but it really just does not have that sense of having ups and downs, which I personally prefer when I listen to very long songs. It's what makes Visions for me much better than Celestial Elixir. Celestial Elixir just does not have a climax. It's also the reason why I prefer Falling Back to Earth over Pareidolia. I do appreciate drawing out a musical idea when the narrative calls for it. Deathless is a very good example.
My favorite, though, is still the unofficial "suite" of The Mind's Eye -> Portals -> Shapeshifter. A long "song" that does not dwell too long on specific musical ideas.
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As long as ariich would assure me that the growling in this new album is nothing like how they placed it in Streams, then of course I will give the album a chance. :lol I was just being hyperbolic after all.
Obviously I've no idea how you'll find them, but they definitely don't SOUND anything like the growls on Streams (I wouldn't even call these ones growls, the pitch is higher). In my opinion, the placement works well too - The Architect has an amtospheric middle section that builds up to the harsh vocals bit. The flow is good IMO.
And I am with you that flow on Aquarius was not something they had mastered at that stage - even in Celestial Elixir the sudden jump into trad jazz was quite off-putting. That's why DITF is easily my favourite on the album.
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OK, you sold me. :)
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OK, you sold me. :)
Just to reiterate my disclaimer that I've no idea whether you'll dig these or not. Only that, assuming you don't dislike all harsh vocals in general, those in The Architect are very different to those on Aquarius and so opinions of the former may well be very different to opinions of the latter.
There, I think I've covered myself for all eventualities. :lol
Ugh this album is so good.
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Yes, more talk about the album please.
How does it compare to previous Haken albums stylistically? Song or album focused, songs that are comparable to previous material, repeated themes, possible Leprous influence...
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I'm pretty surprised at the reactions to the lack of those a capella sections. I mean, they've only done two in their entire history. It's not remotely, in any way, a core part of Haken's sound.
Furthermore, there's a whole bunch of new styles and ideas on this album. In the same way that they introduced things like the a capella and others on the Mountain (and broadly stuck with that style on Restoration), they're continuing to introduce more new things as well.
They've done a capella more than twice I believe (Because It's There, Cockroach King, Crystallised) but even if there aren't those parts as long as there are parts with multiple layers of singing and harmonies I'll be fine, haha. I'm very excited.
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OK, you sold me. :)
Just to reiterate my disclaimer that I've no idea whether you'll dig these or not. Only that, assuming you don't dislike all harsh vocals in general, those in The Architect are very different to those on Aquarius and so opinions of the former may well be very different to opinions of the latter.
Yeah, I am ok with harsh vocals as long as they make sense in the structure of the song. :metal
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does anyone know if there will be a US preorder for the album? I'm willing to pay for the vinyl to be imported, just want to know before I order if there will be a cheaper option.
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Haken still not doing HD Tracks?
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FWIW, I got the promo today, and here are some notes:
US formats:
2CD digipak (incl. bonus disc – instrumental version of Affinity)
CD jewel case
digital download
deluxe digital download
180-gram double vinyl (gatefold sleeve, ltd. 500, exclusive orange wax for North America)
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Hey guys, help me like Crystallised more.
It is the one song I simply can't get into no matter how much I try. The song has a FANTASTIC intro, fun verses, and a soaring chorus. Then, from 4:26 - 15:53 I lose all interest. I despise the vocal melody in that "Passages of time" verse (what the hell were they thinking there??) and the instrumental section does not hold me at all. I do appreciate those happy little acoustic guitar riffs sprinkled in there, though. Sometimes I feel Haken should just stop with those wacky instrumental sections completely and stick to melodic, beautiful instrumentals (e.g. those moments in Celestial Elixir, Drowning In The Flood, Falling Back To Earth, and the coda in Visions). Coming back to Crystallised, the ending is pretty good, and a nice way to finish off the song. It's just those 11 minutes in between the first and last sections that put me to sleep.
But ehh. One failed experiment in 3.5 albums worth of magic I can forgive :laugh:
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But ehh. One failed experiment in 4.5 albums worth of magic I can forgive :laugh:
I fixed that for you if that's how you feel about Crystallized.
I just finished my third spin of the new album. It's really good, and I'm understating that. Review coming in a week or so probably.
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It is the one song I simply can't get into no matter how much I try.
This is me with the song Visions. It still hasn't "clicked" for me.
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My review of Affinity for LadyObscure is pubished!
https://ladyobscure.com/albums/haken-affinity/
For those who were asking for more of my detailed thoughts, here they are! Happy to answer any other questions though. :)
The review is pretty detailed (the most in-depth review I've written) as it includes a track-by-track for the second half. Anyone who wants to avoid spoilers (of the musical kind, I haven't really talked about the lyrics) is best off not reading that part! :P
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Awesome review :tup I'm a sucker for detailed thoughts cause I can't wait much longer, you delivered.
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My review of Affinity for LadyObscure is pubished!
https://ladyobscure.com/albums/haken-affinity/
For those who were asking for more of my detailed thoughts, here they are! Happy to answer any other questions though. :)
The review is pretty detailed (the most in-depth review I've written) as it includes a track-by-track for the second half. Anyone who wants to avoid spoilers (of the musical kind, I haven't really talked about the lyrics) is best off not reading that part! :P
Thats a very nice review thanks! Really hyped now :azn:
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Great review. Sounds like 1985 will be the Cockroach King of this album.
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Great review. Sounds like 1985 will be the Cockroach King of this album.
It's not nearly as quirky as CK, but it's definitely got the biggest sense of fun on the album.
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Great review! Can't wait for this album.
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I knew I shouldn't read that review Dammit! Now I'm super hyped about the album...
Great work Rich :ariich:
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Great review man! Looking forward to this album for sure.
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New review!
https://wpapu.com/review-haken-affinity/
And yes, I'm aware I hit on many of the same pointd as Rich. That tallywhacker had a head start on me!
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New review!
https://wpapu.com/review-haken-affinity/
And yes, I'm aware I hit on many of the same pointd as Rich. That tallywhacker had a head start on me!
No problem. Going to give this a read regardless, you both seem very positive about it, this is promising!
On another note, this update on Haken's FB just got posted yesterday: https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/videos/10154066030069744/?video_source=pages_finch_main_video
Thinking we get a new song Friday, not going to bet on it, but it sure looks like it.
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I got my Haken pre-release AffiniTee in today! Anyone grab that?
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I got my Haken pre-release AffiniTee in today! Anyone grab that?
Mine showed up today too! ;D
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I purchased the shirt, but it didn`t arrive (yet), but at least the tracking function tells me that the shirt is at least already in my country, so it probably only takes a few days from now on.
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New review!
https://wpapu.com/review-haken-affinity/
And yes, I'm aware I hit on many of the same pointd as Rich. That tallywhacker had a head start on me!
:lol. I have not heard the tally whacker reference since the Porkys 2 movie back in the 80's.
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Just confirmed an interview with Diego on Friday, will likely have it up on Saturday. :)
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Nice!
Great review too, even if it did mostly just copy mine. :P
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So no one's talking about the new track? It's been up on Spotify since this morning. I'll post my thoughts when I get home tonight.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7pEXGCtnnk
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Well, that's a bit disappointing to be honest. More of the same, really.
Not that it's bad, but it's not all that interesting to me at first listen.
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As I said in my review, that song is the most standard Haken song. By quite a long way in fact.
Brilliant vid though!
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Nice video! A standard song like that is a good way to pull newcomers in. I like it.
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Okay good, I'm still looking forward to the album, because your review made it sound very promising indeed :D
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It's got a nice mix of atmospheric and heavy parts I think :azn: Not too special, but it's a nice single!
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Yeah I saw it this morning, I really liked it. Has the great atmospheric aspects from The Mountain and the sorta straightforward proggy stuff, spot on with the review on this track ariich :tup if that's any indication of how well you described the tracks in your review, this album should be very solid.
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I just heard it and was a bit underwhelmed by it. I love the break down part. I still have high hopes based on several reviews. But this song is just decent....not mind blowing.
I'm still excited though because....NEW HAKEN!!!! :panicattack:
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I only gave it a brief listen through my crappy PC speakers here at work, I'll give it a proper listen tonight at home.
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As I said in my review, that song is the most standard Haken song. By quite a long way in fact.
Brilliant vid though!
Agreed, very standard Haken song. Not bad at all, but not really that interesting. I want more!
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Eh, the single was okay... nothing too memorable from it though.
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Pretty average by Haken standards. Nothing exciting to be honest.
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Average by Haken standards or not, I really like this song.
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A couple of other observations about the song, which I also mentioned my in my review.
1. The whole album, in my opinion, takes a few listens to really sink in.
2. This is very much an opening song that introduces the album. Stylistically it's the most typically-Haken song on the album, but it introduces musical themes and lyrical concepts that are explored in later songs. In particular, there is a glorious reprise of the chorus (though adapted) at the end of The Architect, and the main rhythmic motif is similarly reprised in a more atmospheric way to close off the album at the end of Bound by Gravity.
My point is, this song makes more sense as a part of the album. From that point of view, it's an unusual single choice, as other songs are more clearly defined on their own. I guess it was the "safe" single for fans who like their style.
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Wanted to post a lengthy speculation how it feels like a song that leads up to later things, but ariich rendered any speculation unnecessary.
Next time, give us some time for discussion before you come with the facts ;)
Love the Leprous influence, the drumming is really tasty, but I won't spin this single as often as I did Atlas Stone. It's not exciting on its own.
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okay when i was joking that DT should make djent I didn't expect Haken to go and actually do it
i mean it's not pure-brootal-djent or anything but the rhythmic chords throughout and the grooves of the instrumental bit in the middle are obviously djent-inspired
anyways i find it pretty meh
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It's a decent song, just not much more IMO. Not the most satisfying of endings when it sorta just fizzles out so it doesn't really work as a stand-alone song for me, but I'm sure it'll work much better in context with the rest of the album.
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okay when i was joking that DT should make djent I didn't expect Haken to go and actually do it
i mean it's not pure-brootal-djent or anything but the rhythmic chords throughout and the grooves of the instrumental bit in the middle are obviously djent-inspired
I really like this song.
See, it's obviously not djent.
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Wanted to post a lengthy speculation how it feels like a song that leads up to later things, but ariich rendered any speculation unnecessary.
Next time, give us some time for discussion before you come with the facts ;)
:lol Sorry, I'll try and be less helpful in future.
Love the Leprous influence, the drumming is really tasty, but I won't spin this single as often as I did Atlas Stone. It's not exciting on its own.
Yeah this is not a song I would listen to on its own.
okay when i was joking that DT should make djent I didn't expect Haken to go and actually do it
i mean it's not pure-brootal-djent or anything but the rhythmic chords throughout and the grooves of the instrumental bit in the middle are obviously djent-inspired
Indeed, though they were already doing this on The Mountain and even in one of two places on Visions.
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Really great song. Unexpectedly mid-paced and melancholy (sounds like a mid-album track really as opposed to something more upbeat like Atlas Stone), but still works really well. Leprous influence is welcomed from me.
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Just watched the vid again and it really highlights how awesome Conner's bass work on the song is.
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I really like the new song! Can't wait for the rest of the album!
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Just watched the vid again and it really highlights how awesome Conner's bass work on the song is.
I just now listened on my phone and was coming here to post how the bass and drum sound is impressive. Whomever is responsible for the sound on Haken's cd's does a wonderful job. It will be difficult to match The Mountain, but I am sure that I will love it.
Concerning Aquarius, I notice the cd is not available on the Haken site and some folks say it may be out of print, but why would it not be available on iTunes? I would purchase it if is was available.
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Aquiarius is not available in Spotify either. Maybe there's a legal problem with it?
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Yeah I noticed that. I think it might be some sort of issue with licensing renewal as far as Spotify is concerned. Every Cicus Maximus album expect Nine disappeared for a long time but was finally added again. Digging the new song tho
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New song is great, glad to hear it's also the most Haken-y of the songs!
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I love the track.
Singles are rarely among my favorites from any album, and if that is true here as well then this album will be amazeballs.
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Didn't really care for it, hope the rest is better.
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Didn't really care for it, hope the rest is better.
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Well, comparing to the first "non-intro" full songs from the first three albums (The Point of No Return, Nocturnal Conspiracy, Atlas Stone), this is pretty underwhelming.
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It's like everyone's listening to a different song than I did.
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I like the Initiate. It is standard Haken and that is more than good enough for me. I have high hopes for the album with so many other disappointing releases this year.
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Well, comparing to the first "non-intro" full songs from the first three albums (The Point of No Return, Nocturnal Conspiracy, Atlas Stone), this is pretty underwhelming.
Apparently this time around, the intro track "affinity.exe" is just sound effects. "Initiate" (according to ariich) introduces musical themes that are expanded later in the album, not unlike "Premonition" from Visions. I don't think it's appropriate to compare it to "Atlas Stone" and "Nocturnal Conspiracy".
EDIT: But this doesn't change that it's a bad single.
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I hope so. But Haken opened their past three Lbums well, so I was kind of let down by this one.
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Pretty below average song; don't care to hear it again.
Then again, their stuff is usually hit or miss for me; I am sure the new album will have some songs I will enjoy. :hat
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I have high hopes for the album with so many other disappointing releases this year.
Yeah, it's the album I am waiting the most for this year. TA didn't really do it for me.
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Nothing on The Astonishing is as good as Initiate.
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Nothing on The Astonishing is as good as Initiate.
Debatable, but only because i'm in love with the verse to Life Left Behind. Initiate is better than 99% of The Astonishing.
Count me in the with the crowd that loves it. Really looking forward to the album.
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Well, the Haken cup overfloweth as of late.
https://wpapu.com/interview-diego-tejeida-of-haken/
There is my interview with Diego, enjoy!
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Even though I think Initiate is good, I don't think it's as good as at least half the stuff on TA.
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Just bought tickets to my first Haken concert ever! :metal Really pumped for this.
Checked out that supporting act, not crazy about it, but it's pretty cool.
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See you there then!
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:tup
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Really getting to the point where I'm starting to fall in love with this band. I ordered a t-shirt off their website and everything :lol I'm going to try not to OD on them but it's pretty hard.
Plus I've just realised they're playing about a 45 minute drive away from me at the end of May. May have to buy 2 tickets and get a friend into them by then, no chance my girlfriend will be up for it :tdwn
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I gotta say after a few listens the song has started to grow on me. A much better single than Atlas Stone (easily the worst song on Mountain, will never get the love for it).
Also god damn it, everytime I watch a Haken video I want to get a .strandberg guitar.
On the djent thing, the only "djenty" part is the breakdown halfway through the song, and that has been on Haken releases before.
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I love the break down, and think it's awesome how you can follow it in both 4/4 or 3/4 if you want and still have it work fine both ways. That's pretty djenty, but it still sounds very much like Haken.
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Atlas Stone is the worst song on The Mountain?!
The new song gets better with each play!
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Atlas Stone is the worst song on The Mountain?!
That would be news to me as well.
What, did we chuck Cockroach King from the record? :P
I think the problem for me with this band is often the singer's voice. I almost never hear a song of theirs for the first time and like it a lot, mostly because his voice isn't really to my liking, but I eventually come around to being able to deal with it when the song is more than good enough musically. I'd definitely like this band a whole lot more if they had a different, and better, singer.
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Wtf, Cockroach King and Ross' voice are amazing.
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The Mountain in an album without weak spots. Whatever your least favourite song is, 10/11 of the Haken fanbase will disagree.
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Wtf, Cockroach King and Ross' voice are amazing.
Agree to disagree. :)
The Mountain in an album without weak spots.
Take our track 3 and I agree. :big grin:
Whatever your least favourite song is, 10/11 of the Haken fanbase will disagree.
That's fine. How boring would it be if we all loved the same stuff?
I still think Celestial Elixir is unquestionably the best song they've done. That synth lead part around 10:40 is probably the best 55 seconds of music they have done to date. :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
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I almost never hear a song of theirs for the first time and like it a lot, mostly because his voice isn't really to my liking, but I eventually come around to being able to deal with it when the song is more than good enough musically. I'd definitely like this band a whole lot more if they had a different, and better, singer.
I expect you'll like this song more in the context of the album, once you've listened to the full thing a few times.
It's still one of the less interesting songs on the album IMO, but it works really well as an opener.
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I almost never hear a song of theirs for the first time and like it a lot, mostly because his voice isn't really to my liking, but I eventually come around to being able to deal with it when the song is more than good enough musically. I'd definitely like this band a whole lot more if they had a different, and better, singer.
I expect you'll like this song more in the context of the album, once you've listened to the full thing a few times.
It's still one of the less interesting songs on the album IMO, but it works really well as an opener.
Yeah, great opening to the album, but there are at least 4 songs that I prefer to it on the album.
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Actually, I'd say I prefer everything else except probably Lapse, and even that has an amazingly groovy guitar solo better than anything in Initiate.
But yeah, that's just my opinion.
Oh and also just to clarify something:
Apparently this time around, the intro track "affinity.exe" is just sound effects.
The first half of the track is sound effects, and the second half of the track is where the video for Initiate starts. The two tracks are one opening song, really.
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The first half of the track is sound effects, and the second half of the track is where the video for Initiate starts. The two tracks are one opening song, really.
Never understood why bands sometimes have an intro track, when it's basically inseperable from the following song. The band should just merge them together. Not a big issue, but when this happens, I always feel the need to merge them into one track using Wavepad Sound Editor.
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It's an obvious link for a band that a has a story. I want bands to mix it up like that then like you said have it in the song itself. Any way is the right way for an artist.
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The first half of the track is sound effects, and the second half of the track is where the video for Initiate starts. The two tracks are one opening song, really.
Never understood why bands sometimes have an intro track, when it's basically inseperable from the following song. The band should just merge them together. Not a big issue, but when this happens, I always feel the need to merge them into one track using Wavepad Sound Editor.
It is a bit odd. Initiate starts when the full band kicks in, which I sort of get from the point of view of releasing a single (and indeed the single on Spotify etc. is like that) but in the video they've used half of affinity.exe anyway.
Then again, Haken is very much an album band, Affinity at least as much as the previous ones, so I don't really care. :lol
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Well, the Haken cup overfloweth as of late.
https://wpapu.com/interview-diego-tejeida-of-haken/
There is my interview with Diego, enjoy!
Thanks, great interview.
Diego says that they paid more attention to vocal melodies. Did you notice it while listening?
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Well, the Haken cup overfloweth as of late.
https://wpapu.com/interview-diego-tejeida-of-haken/
There is my interview with Diego, enjoy!
Thanks, great interview.
Diego says that they paid more attention to vocal melodies. Did you notice it while listening?
Hmm, that's a good question, I didn't really mention the vocals much in my review, in hindsight.
As far as LEAD vocals go, I'd say that's one area that made this an A album instead of an A+. I thought Ross showed great growth through the first few albums, and peaked on The Mountain, and that the way he was used on this album was a small step back. That said many of the other vocals are really strong, even if they never stand out as much as they did on something like Cockroach King. I think it really varies between songs/parts of songs as well, as it's really only certain times that I have a problem with the vocals.
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i just noticed train's user titles :corn
also i think it is totally fair to compare this one to atlas stone because The Path on The Mountain is, while good, not really the first metal track of the album :P
preminition though is fair
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i just noticed train's user titles :corn
:tup Evermind is my lyrics booklet.
I don't think I saw the video for this yesterday, I really like it. This song is bliss, man. Huge chorus, awesome breakdown, and from what I understand, the album is packed with even more epic songs.
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The Mountain is an album without weak spots.
This must be the most true statement ever made here.
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Just watched the new music video. The bit at the beginning reminds me of the reactor Avalanche go to blow up at the beginning of Final Fantasy VII.
Wasn't blown away musically but I'm 100% getting the album.
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I liked it on first listen, great song.
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Placed my pre-order today for the vinyl! :metal
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Does anyone know if they're doing a vinyl + CD version like the other releases? I can't find anything on the Inside Out site but maybe I'm looking in the wrong place.
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It's ungodly to ship outside of America, but there is the 2xOrange LP + CD for us.
https://www.insideoutmusicshop.com/b/haken/?sort=newest&image=large
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Wait, who said Atlas Stone was worst on The Mountain? It's honestly probably my favorite Haken song most of the time.
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Just watched the new music video. The bit at the beginning reminds me of the reactor Avalanche go to blow up at the beginning of Final Fantasy VII.
Wasn't blown away musically but I'm 100% getting the album.
Funny you should say that. The very end of Celestial Elixir reminds me of the start of J-E-N-O-V-A from FFVII
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6GrZYE2il0
Perhaps the boys are Nomura fans? Haken do excel at melodic, grandiose music after all.
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Just watched the new music video. The bit at the beginning reminds me of the reactor Avalanche go to blow up at the beginning of Final Fantasy VII.
Wasn't blown away musically but I'm 100% getting the album.
Funny you should say that. The very end of Celestial Elixir reminds me of the start of J-E-N-O-V-A from FFVII
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6GrZYE2il0
Perhaps the boys are Nomura fans? Haken do excel at melodic, grandiose music after all.
Yea man, I hear that. I think you mean Nobuo fans? Or I might be mistaken by who you mean by Nomura?
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Nobuo*, oopsy daisy
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celestial elixir you guys
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It's p good.
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It's ok.
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It's ok.
(https://i.imgur.com/vOwAQab.gif)
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Haken's Conner Green did a rather excellent bass playthrough of Initiate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--LMKOB1jEU
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It's ok.
(https://i.imgur.com/vOwAQab.gif)
:angel:
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Haken's Conner Green did a rather excellent bass playthrough of Initiate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--LMKOB1jEU
He is my bass idol. And my hair idol.
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And my hair idol.
That's some bad taste right here. :loser:
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He just looks so relaxed with that hair style. I like it.
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And my hair idol.
Well, I can say it's mine too because we have so similar hairstyle :zydar:
That beard instead is gorgeous! I would need like 50 years to grow that!
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26 days left :metal
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Haken just announced that on monday The Endless Knot will be released as the second single! :eek
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:metal
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Kind of like the 'Pareidolia' choice for a single from The Mountain. According to reviews, it's the last intense proggy song before the mellow ending. Weird choice.
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Looking forward to it!
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So the teaser for "A never ending Entanglement" turned out to be "The endless Knot". Who would have thought :omg:
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Kind of like the 'Pareidolia' choice for a single from The Mountain. According to reviews, it's the last intense proggy song before the mellow ending. Weird choice.
I would say it's a great choice. It's proggy, particularly rhythmically, but it's energetic, has a great chorus and works well as a standalone song. As I think I said in my review, it's a little reminiscent of In Memoriam, but with added dubstep.
EDIT: Also, I don't think was their original thought for the second single (I was expecting something else), but it's a terrific choice.
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I would say it's a great choice. It's proggy, particularly rhythmically, but it's energetic, has a great chorus and works well as a standalone song. As I think I said in my review, it's a little reminiscent of In Memoriam, but with added dubstep.
EDIT: Also, I don't think was their original thought for the second single (I was expecting something else), but it's a terrific choice.
In Memorian with added dubstep? You make that sound really up my alley. This hyped wait is killing me!
But yeah, from the reviews I expected the next single to be 1985 for some reason.
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Kind of like the 'Pareidolia' choice for a single from The Mountain. According to reviews, it's the last intense proggy song before the mellow ending. Weird choice.
I would say it's a great choice. It's proggy, particularly rhythmically, but it's energetic, has a great chorus and works well as a standalone song. As I think I said in my review, it's a little reminiscent of In Memoriam, but with added dubstep.
EDIT: Also, I don't think was their original thought for the second single (I was expecting something else), but it's a terrific choice.
Yeah, but as the last song of its kind of the album it feels like a kind of spoiler. I know that seems weird to say, but I don't see many bands picking closing tracks as singles and that may be why.
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Nah Bound By Gravity is very much the closer. This album is structured unusually for a prog album, doesn't end with a big epic in the usual sense, but trust me it works really well.
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Nah Bound By Gravity is very much the closer. This album is structured unusually for a prog album, doesn't end with a big epic in the usual sense, but trust me it works really well.
Ok then, I'll take your word for it.
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Nah Bound By Gravity is very much the closer. This album is structured unusually for a prog album, doesn't end with a big epic in the usual sense, but trust me it works really well.
Would you say its structure is similar to The Mountain's?
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Kind of like the 'Pareidolia' choice for a single from The Mountain. According to reviews, it's the last intense proggy song before the mellow ending. Weird choice.
I would say it's a great choice. It's proggy, particularly rhythmically, but it's energetic, has a great chorus and works well as a standalone song. As I think I said in my review, it's a little reminiscent of In Memoriam, but with added dubstep.
EDIT: Also, I don't think was their original thought for the second single (I was expecting something else), but it's a terrific choice.
As I said in my review, it's my favorite short song on Affinity, so I'm happy that The Endless Knot got the nod for a second single. That said I'm also surprised. Earthrise was the obvious choice if they wanted something radio friendly, and if they went all out I thought they might go with 1985. Excited to see the video on Monday. Initiate's video wasn't horrible, and as far as music video's go, that's pretty high in my book.
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Yeah it's been a while since I saw a really good music video. Initiate was fine I suppose, but really good music videos seem to be hard to make.
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Yeah it's been a while since I saw a really good music video. Initiate was fine I suppose, but really good music videos seem to be hard to make.
What are some really good music videos?
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I don't even know. I'm sure there are some but I'm too lazy to look for them, be it in my memories or on the internet.
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Bowie's Lazarus and Blackstar are amazing music vids imo.
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One recent one in my mind would be Lucky Animals from Devin Townsend.
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One recent one in my mind would be Lucky Animals from Devin Townsend.
The one with only Devin dancing is comedy gold.
Anyway I always liked Periphery's Icarus Lives and Scarlet videos and Rammstein videos never disappoint.
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Probably a topic for another thread, but what purpose do music videos serve in this modern age? It's not the 80s anymore. MTV is dead.
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Anyway I always liked Periphery's Icarus Lives and Scarlet videos and Rammstein videos never disappoint.
Scarlet is funny, but it's not a good video. Icarus Lives is pretty cool though. The through-the-glass-and-water thing is a pretty good idea.
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Probably a topic for another thread, but what purpose do music videos serve in this modern age? It's not the 80s anymore. MTV is dead.
True, but YouTube isn't, and having your singles up there helps immensely with getting new people to see what you're doing. I mean, you don't really need a full-on video, it could just be a lyrics video. But still, I cannot count the number of people I introduced to Haken through that Cockroach King video (which I'd say is a good example of a good video: it's quirky, fun and unpretentious).
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Probably a topic for another thread, but what purpose do music videos serve in this modern age? It's not the 80s anymore. MTV is dead.
Good promotion. Considering how big YT is now, a video can do more than just the song played over a blank screen.
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Probably a topic for another thread, but what purpose do music videos serve in this modern age? It's not the 80s anymore. MTV is dead.
Sometimes music video's can really add to the mood of the song. In case of The Raven that refused to sing by Steven Wilson for example, the video really enhances the music/lyrics.
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Check Intronaut's Fast Worms video. Nothing short of brilliant.
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Probably a topic for another thread, but what purpose do music videos serve in this modern age? It's not the 80s anymore. MTV is dead.
Sometimes music video's can really add to the mood of the song. In case of The Raven that refused to sing by Steven Wilson for example, the video really enhances the music/lyrics.
Yes, that video is fantastic!
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Probably a topic for another thread, but what purpose do music videos serve in this modern age? It's not the 80s anymore. MTV is dead.
Sometimes music video's can really add to the mood of the song. In case of The Raven that refused to sing by Steven Wilson for example, the video really enhances the music/lyrics.
The video for 'Routine' even moreso IMO.
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Probably a topic for another thread, but what purpose do music videos serve in this modern age? It's not the 80s anymore. MTV is dead.
Sometimes music video's can really add to the mood of the song. In case of The Raven that refused to sing by Steven Wilson for example, the video really enhances the music/lyrics.
Keyword there is "sometimes". I would argue that most music videos still don't really add to the songs, like the Haken videos. Steven Wilson's videos being an exception.
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Anathema's dreaming light is a phenomenal video that tugs at the heart strings: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk0OF9DdVhw
Also that zeroG music video I saw was pretty cool, but dont remember the song or band :)
On another note, Im a bit sad that all of the preorder stuff is sold out in the US. I take it CMdistro is the best way to support the band?
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Probably a topic for another thread, but what purpose do music videos serve in this modern age? It's not the 80s anymore. MTV is dead.
Good promotion. Considering how big YT is now, a video can do more than just the song played over a blank screen.
Yeah, and some people (mainly the mainstream) are still very video-driven. They like watching stuff while listening to music.
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Probably a topic for another thread, but what purpose do music videos serve in this modern age? It's not the 80s anymore. MTV is dead.
Good promotion. Considering how big YT is now, a video can do more than just the song played over a blank screen.
Yeah, and some people (mainly the mainstream) are still very video-driven. They like watching stuff while listening to music.
True, and for some of those artists, mainstream or not, music videos can be used as an outlet for artistic expression in ways that music alone cannot produce. One of my favorite music videos of recent years has to be Justin Timberlake's video for his 8-minute song "Mirrors", and while the song itself is pretty amazing already, the video just adds so much to the piece, fleshing out the song's lyrics with on-screen characters, as well as a trippy dance in a house of mirrors in the second half of the video/song.
For many rock musicians and bands, where the focus is more on the instrumentation and instrumentalists themselves, music videos are more about capturing their performance, but for others, especially mainstream artists, it's a chance to express their non-musical ideas in a way that breathes life into their music.
-Marc.
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New Song:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3&v=IVZHNPyMhMo
:metal
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Holy crap that was insanely good. I'm loving the djenty and electronic influences in this song. This is shaping up to be my favourite release of 2016 so far!
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Dubstep metal.
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I liked the instrumentation on that track, but honestly the vocals felt really forced and only stuck out as something I could grab onto during the chorus. Still a pretty cool song though, and I'll definitely check the album out.
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What a great song! On a scale of one to ten, my hype would have to be at eleven!
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I liked the instrumentation on that track, but honestly the vocals felt really forced and only stuck out as something I could grab onto during the chorus.
Even though I love Haken with all my heart that's something that I find in their music a lot that's not entirely to my liking. Because most of their songs are in weird time signatures and such, lots of vocal melodies feel forced to me because they get accented often with the odd signatures. I get used to them after a while, tho.
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Nice one!
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That's more like it, yes! Awesome track.
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I liked the instrumentation on that track, but honestly the vocals felt really forced and only stuck out as something I could grab onto during the chorus.
Even though I love Haken with all my heart that's something that I find in their music a lot that's not entirely to my liking. Because most of their songs are in weird time signatures and such, lots of vocal melodies feel forced to me because they get accented often with the odd signatures. I get used to them after a while, tho.
I sort of know what you mean in general, though I don't find that myself, but I have to say I love the vocal melodies in this song and not just the chorus. The vocal lines in the verses are dark and brooding (my favourite part being "Confronting facts to prove the fiction, right to the point of mass extinction"), the pre-chorus is nice and the chorus is a typically huge Haken chorus.
EDIT: Oh and on the point about the vocal lines being awkward because of the strange rhythms, I do agree about that on first listen, but once you know the rhythms, it's f***ing awesome.
Except the rhythms for the intro, where I've heard the song like 25 times and I still have no idea what's going on. :lol
EDIT 2: Also, there's a recurring theme that I had totally failed to notice before until I saw the lyric video was that the bridge section halfway through recalls the chorus from 1985 - not really melodically, but lyrically. I therefore missed that from my review.
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I sort of know what you mean in general, though I don't find that myself, but I have to say I love the vocal melodies in this song and not just the chorus. The vocal lines in the verses are dark and brooding (my favourite part being "Confronting facts to prove the fiction, right to the point of mass extinction"), the pre-chorus is nice and the chorus is a typically huge Haken chorus.
Yeah, I agree. Song is awesome.
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I liked the instrumentation on that track, but honestly the vocals felt really forced and only stuck out as something I could grab onto during the chorus.
Even though I love Haken with all my heart that's something that I find in their music a lot that's not entirely to my liking. Because most of their songs are in weird time signatures and such, lots of vocal melodies feel forced to me because they get accented often with the odd signatures. I get used to them after a while, tho.
I sort of know what you mean in general, though I don't find that myself, but I have to say I love the vocal melodies in this song and not just the chorus. The vocal lines in the verses are dark and brooding (my favourite part being "Confronting facts to prove the fiction, right to the point of mass extinction"), the pre-chorus is nice and the chorus is a typically huge Haken chorus.
EDIT: Oh and on the point about the vocal lines being awkward because of the strange rhythms, I do agree about that on first listen, but once you know the rhythms, it's f***ing awesome.
Except the rhythms for the intro, where I've heard the song like 25 times and I still have no idea what's going on. :lol
Yeah, its definitely the sort of thing that improves upon further listens (it has for me with some of their older stuff), I think its just that syncopated feel when the vocals accent right along with the music that throws me off sometimes. Cool song though, chalk full of awesome playing.
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Dat dubstep-metal minisection, tho. :metal :metal :metal
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It's OK I guess. Don't really digging this new direction shown by the singles.
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Sounded really interesting on first listen! Needs more spins to say an opinion.
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alright, i like this a fair bit more than initiate on first listen
still kinda djenty though but it's done better here :lol
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It's Ok. I feel like they are going more towards the music that they did on The Mountain than on their previous releases and that bugs me a bit cause I don't like that new style but I'll wait to hear more of the new album before coming to any conclusions.
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You guys have a lot more yet to come. 1985 and The Architect especially go in directions not even touched on during these two tracks. And of course, I <3 The Endless Knot.
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alright, i like this a fair bit more than initiate on first listen
still kinda djenty though but it's done better here :lol
Nothing wrong with a bit of tasteful djenting.
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Really cool track! I love the direction it's going in so far.
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I like Initiate more than this one. However, that dubstep-like break is one of my favourite parts in the album. As is that jazzy keyboard solo in Lapse. Some great moments in this album, which is overall below The Mountain, IMO.
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Endless Knot only gets better and better with each subsequent listen. I wouldn't be surprised if it ends up being my favorite on the album. :metal
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Wow, what a song! Maybe it's just because it's new, but I quite love this. After way too many listens, it may be one of my favorite Haken songs. The drums in particular put in so much work! Oh, and that dubstep moment, followed by that solo... Just wow.
Also, I quite like the vocals throughout, they feel more like an instrument than just someone singing, which makes it sound kind of unique to me.
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I like Initiate more than this one. However, that dubstep-like break is one of my favourite parts in the album. As is that jazzy keyboard solo in Lapse. Some great moments in this album, which is overall below The Mountain, IMO.
Even though I think the Mountain is great, I must say that I like Affinity a lot better. It might be my favorite Haken album yet, even beating Aquarius which I was beginning to doubt they ever would.
I liked the instrumentation on that track, but honestly the vocals felt really forced and only stuck out as something I could grab onto during the chorus. Still a pretty cool song though, and I'll definitely check the album out.
The chorus is actually my least favorite part of The Endless Knot. Like arrich said, once you get to know the weird rhythmical vocals melodies it's really really awesome.
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The chorus is actually my least favorite part of The Endless Knot. Like arrich said, once you get to know the weird rhythmical vocals melodies it's really really awesome.
And that's exactly the opposite for Initiate. The song got so much less interesting once I just realized it was just (mostly) in 7. Still good though.
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The chorus is actually my least favorite part of The Endless Knot. Like arrich said, once you get to know the weird rhythmical vocals melodies it's really really awesome.
And that's exactly the opposite for Initiate. The song got so much less interesting once I just realized it was just (mostly) in 7. Still good though.
I'm glad I don't give a shit what time signature music is in so it doesn't ruin songs for me as it does for you. :lol
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I loved it before I understood the time sig, and I still love it just as much after. Don't know why figuring that out would change anything other than make it better.
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Really glad you're digging Affinity so much, BlackInk! :D
Have to say, for me I think it's on a par with The Mountain which I already absolutely adored and didn't think they'd top. First 5 listens, maybe more, I didn't think it was quite as brilliant but it really grows once some of the more unusual stuff sinks in and you get to know it.
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it's actually a measure in 3, a measure in 6, and then a measure in -2. Does that help, Implode?
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Really glad you're digging Affinity so much, BlackInk! :D
It's pure magic.
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it's actually a measure in 3, a measure in 6, and then a measure in -2. Does that help, Implode?
:lol
No, no. Guys. I don't mean to say I hate the meter or anything. But it was a lot more fun for me when the chugging seemed kind of random. It's kind of like the same thing that happens when you listen to a song too many times. You already know everything, there's fewer things to grab your attention, and you tired it out. I don't mean to say it makes the song worse or anything. I still love the song; it's not ruined for me by any means.
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Also, I'm about a week into it and Red Giant still messes with my mind.
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EARTHRISE IS SO GOOD
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can we not keep talking about the album until it officially releases
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can we not keep talking about the album until it officially releases
just don't come here until the album comes out if it's such a huge problem for you
easy fix'd
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EARTHRISE IS SO GOOD
YES YES YES
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AFFINITY IS SO GOOD
FTFY
Also, I've been mostly quiet and waiting for the album to come out, but I'll say this. I was so nervous that this album wouldn't even be close to The Mountain because it was just so good, not to mention, all of Haken's albums so far have been anywhere from great to amazing. I was almost skeptical as to how long they could continue this caliber of quality output.
Affinity showed me that I should never doubt them again.
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+1 on all that Implode said.
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For anyone interested, I just talked to Ray Hearne for almost an hour yesterday.
Check it out!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbfIKQL4n_o (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbfIKQL4n_o)
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EARTHRISE IS SO GOOD
YES YES YES
I love whenever Haken uses entirely major chords, sounding so happy. Bound by Gravity is like that, but in a more beautiful way.
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can we not keep talking about the album until it officially releases
I actually agree with this
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I don't see what's wrong with those who have heard the album discussing it. Given that there will likely be no more news or singles, it probably wouldn't hurt to just not check the thread for a couple more days.
I guess this is why people have made separate threads in the past, haha.
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can we not keep talking about the album until it officially releases
I actually agree with this
Yeah. Fair enough if it was a few days after release date, but it seems more sensible to wait until the official release to me. I'm not really that bothered about it though.
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"To our incredibly supportive fans!
Over the past year, we've received an overwhelming amount of messages regarding the disappearance and unavailability of our first album Aquarius. Without going into too much of the boring details, we've spent the past few months working to resolve this issue and we're sure you'll all be happy to know that, in a few months time, Aquarius will be back! More details to follow...
Haken"
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Finally, I'll be able to listen to Aquarius. In CD form.
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whoa, they aren't kidding, this just spontaneously appeared in my hand :o
(https://s31.postimg.org/ibah0wumz/20160424_090157.jpg)
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Nice. Doesn't seem to work for me though :-[
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I don't get why people care so much about CDs in this day and age. Vinyls I can understand, but CDs only complicate things nowadays when you can fit thousands of albums in high-quality mp3 on a phone or something. :justjen
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1. album/cd art and booklets, yo
2. honestly a lot of the time it's hard to really feel like I "own" an album unless I can pop in the disc and listen to it
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Yep. The other day I forgot whether I actually owned an album because it was digitally, it doesn't feel like it's part of my collection. It's just for the same reason people collect anything really, mostly for a sense of collection/completion.
(https://s31.postimg.org/ibah0wumz/20160424_090157.jpg)
I wish my copy had white sprinkles too, looks tasty
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that's probably just dust or something :lol
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Remastered/remixed deluxe edition of Aquarius?
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I don't really care about collection or things like that, I'm fine with having most music digitally. I just buy the stuff to do what I can to support the bands I like.
Like TesseracT's Polaris. Bought and payed for, but never showed up in the mail. I'm not even that upset about it, because I can still listen to the album whenever I want and I still supported the band.
I am looking forward to Aquarius coming back. Been hearing that album far too little since it went away from everywhere.
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Anyone here have experience with burning shed preorders? Do they send shipping notifications?
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I don't understand why Affinity costs 11$ in USA and about 20€ in Europe. :facepalm:
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I don't understand why Affinity costs 11$ in USA and about 20€ in Europe. :facepalm:
Because FU Europe
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I'm more bothered that they're forcing an instrumental version of the album on us in the cd, I do not want this and will never listen to it more than once tbh
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I too would prefer a sturdy jewel case with a single disc over a two-disc digipak. I'd even pay more for it.
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I'm more bothered that they're forcing an instrumental version of the album on us in the cd, I do not want this and will never listen to it more than once tbh
I always like instrumental versions. Sure, they won't be listened to very often after a while, but it's still fun to have.
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I don't get why people care so much about CDs in this day and age. Vinyls I can understand, but CDs only complicate things nowadays when you can fit thousands of albums in high-quality mp3 on a phone or something. :justjen
I was going to buy Aquarius on ITunes, but not available. I even looked on ebay for a used one, but no luck last week.
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I'm more bothered that they're forcing an instrumental version of the album on us in the cd, I do not want this and will never listen to it more than once tbh
I always like instrumental versions. Sure, they won't be listened to very often after a while, but it's still fun to have.
I just feel like, hey, just give me a digital code for them if you really want to release it, don't drive up the price by adding a second disc :lol
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CDs also have the best sound quality, and I can't take FLAC's to-go, nor have a player to play them anyway, besides VLC player, but all my music is conveniently all organized in my iTunes folder as I use an iPod sometimes.
Haven't heard a note of H4KEN. When is the release date??
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Haven't heard a note of H4KEN. When is the release date??
This Friday.
:panicattack:
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I'm more bothered that they're forcing an instrumental version of the album on us in the cd, I do not want this and will never listen to it more than once tbh
Who's forcing what now?
2-disc version: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Affinity-Haken/dp/B01C3Z02B6/
Regular 1-disc version: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Affinity-Haken/dp/B01C3Z042S/
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not the case in the us.
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not the case in the us.
Ah ok, but then again you pay $14 for the 2-disc which is the same price (around £10) as our 1-disc.
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I mean yeah it's not super expensive but I would prefer paying a few dollars less and not getting the bonus disc but ehh, it's more that I feel obligated to listen to it if I have it, spmehow
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:lol Fair enough. I don't even know how many bonus CDs or DVDs I have that I've never bothered to watch/listen to.
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Haven't heard a note of H4KEN. When is the release date??
This Friday.
:panicattack:
Oh snap. Nice.
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I'm in the opposite boat as a lot of people here. I'm interested in the instrumental version, but I ordered the vinyl and I'm assuming that isn't included? Not gonna buy it twice unless I really like it (which given Haken's batting average, is at least very likely).
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FWIW, the vinyl comes with the single disc. Not really helpful if you don't want the vinyl, but that's what I did.
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Wait really? I just ordered the CD and the vinyl. Oops.
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Wait really? I just ordered the CD and the vinyl. Oops.
Yeah, not sure how often you do vinyl, but that is the norm now. It won't have a CD case or booklet or anything, but most new vinyl comes with a CD in a clear plastic sleeve.
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You don't truly own the album unless you have a physical copy, whether vinyl or CD. Thankfully, there are lots of people who still care for physical music, and the CD revival will happen eventually.
Nice to see as well that Haken have acknowledged the Aquarius issue.
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No way, CD revival will never happen. Vinyl is popular again mostly for aesthetic reasons, CDs are more of an inconvenience to most people and don't really have any advantages in sound.
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You don't truly own the album unless you have a physical copy, whether vinyl or CD.
Bullshit.
No way, CD revival will never happen. Vinyl is popular again mostly for aesthetic reasons, CDs are more of an inconvenience to most people and don't really have any advantages in sound.
This x100
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CDs are nice since they are a tangible product AND sound good. Downloads and vinyl each fail in one of these aspects.
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No one thought the vinyl revival would happen, but it has. Everything comes round in cycles. So the CD revival WILL happen someday. It's a generational thing. CDs have served us well for 30 years. We must appreciate that.
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You don't truly own the album unless you have a physical copy, whether vinyl or CD. Thankfully, there are lots of people who still care for physical music, and the CD revival will happen eventually.
Nice to see as well that Haken have acknowledged the Aquarius issue.
All of this +1
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Wait really? I just ordered the CD and the vinyl. Oops.
Yeah, not sure how often you do vinyl, but that is the norm now. It won't have a CD case or booklet or anything, but most new vinyl comes with a CD in a clear plastic sleeve.
I'll keep that in mind for next time. Though to be honest, I have no problems with having given them extra money.
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You don't truly own the album unless you have a physical copy, whether vinyl or CD. Thankfully, there are lots of people who still care for physical music, and the CD revival will happen eventually.
Nice to see as well that Haken have acknowledged the Aquarius issue.
All of this +1
Agreed. It's for this reason that I very rarely buy digital-only media and usually only go digital if there's exclusives.
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2012/sep/03/do-you-own-your-digital-content
Here's a good article from a couple years ago but I'm not sure if any ideas or laws have changed since then. Either way, ice spent over 12 years building a physical library of music and as long as there's a physical format (especially CDs), I'll still keep buying them.
Back to Haken, I was ecstatic to see that they've addressed the Aquarius issue, so now I can wait for the re-release and not pay insane money for an original release.
-Marc.
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SPOILER ALERT
I got a copy from my friend early and I have listened this now a few days :metal :metal
Just loving what I hear. It's interesting how there's so dark heavy songs but then few happy songs and few mellow songs. Really big variety I think. Hopefully this will raise your hype! :corn
affinity.exe = interesting nugget for somebody who wants to translate the morse code on the background, I have feeling it could mean something funny! But yeah, nothing more in that track, just "intro" for the album.
Initiate = I like how they use that intro rhythm later on Bound By Gravity and the chorus on The Architect. This song have raised but it's just somewhere in the middle on my rankings. That heavy interlude is kicking so much my ass :metal
1985 = Damn those 80's sounds and synth drums!! Maybe one of my favorites of the album. That Rudess-style keyboard at the beginning is really cool. The chorus is cool, not the strongest one but liking it a lot! But that 80's synth interlude is :heart Really strong track and I really like to see this live!
Lapse = Positive vibes, nice song with catchy chorus but not in my faves. Funky synth solo is quite cool though.
The Architect = Really complex was my first thought. This has everything. If you're trying to air drumming this (at least the intro), you will fail.The chorus is the best one, strong and huge and in my mind all the time! Interesting Opeth-part before Einar's part. I first thought it's Ihsahn screaming but well, Einar has his influences ;) Initiate chorus at the end is majestic. I know this song will be raising on my list, it's just too complex for me for now :angel:
Earthrise = Another positive song with double bass and 7-string. It's really awesome that they can make this kind of uplifting songs with 7-string! Chorus is great and there are a lot of nice elements here. That part at the 4 minute mark reminds me of Coldplay, really meldic song overall! :)
Red Giant = Quite strange song, first time I waited when the song is starting properly but it is not going to fly in any place. I would have liked a little stronger, huge chorus but this left me a little cold.
The Endless Knot = When I first heard this single, I really liked it. Now I like it even more in the context of album. One of my favorites of album. Dupstep part is the highlight. A strong raiser on my rankings.
Bound By Gravity = Became a skip track sadly really fast. Mellow song. I like the "is this the life..." backing vocals and last verse with Initiate rhythms and majestic ending. But still a bit boring I could say.
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1985 is easily the best song on the album (mainly because of the great 80's synths) and might be a top 3 Haken song ever.
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The Architect and The Endless Knot are my favorites by a pretty big margin. Though it's still growing on me and 1985 is right behind those two, great album honestly, probably my #2 Haken.
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Tbh I don't like The Architect at all once the first part is over and the ambient interlude kicks in. Gets incredibly boring for me. :(
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omg why isn't it Friday yet dies dies dead dying death
I'm gonna listen to the album Friday even tho obviously I won't be getting the cd then
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Unpopular opinion: there is neither djent nor dubstep on this album. :P
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Oh, I'm going to listen to it soon and see for myself if there's any djent.
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Unpopular opinion: there is neither djent nor dubstep on this album. :P
A few passages feel pretty djenty to me. Not all-out djent, but there is that polyrhytmical quality and "duhjent" tone.
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And that part in The Endless Knot is definetely dubstep. At least metal/dubstep fusion. Don't think that's really up for debate.
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There's some Drum 'n Bass-esque stuff at the end of Red Giant too :metal though this could be up for debate. That Endless Knot section is without a question dubstep.
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Bound by Gravity might seem boring at first, but once you listen to it a good bit, it cements itself as one of the best. The melodies are gorgeous, the lyrics are good, and the overall song is quite beautiful.
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1. The Architect
2. 1985
3. Red Giant
4. Bound by Gravity
5. Initiate
6. Earthrise
7. Lapse
8. The Endless Knot
It was just a matter of time.
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Hard but I try.
1. 1985
2. The Architect
3. The Endless Knot
4. Earthrise
5. Initiate
6. Lapse
7. Red Giant
8. Bound By Gravity
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I literally can't rank all the songs. Best I can do is put them into 2 tiers.
Tier 1:
1985, Earthrise, Red Giant, The Endless Knot
Tier 2:
affinity.exe/Initiate, Lapse, The Architect, Bound by Gravity
It's all bloody great though. For me the weakest stuff is in The Architect, but that song has some glorious stuff as well so I can't really rank it any lower than the others in tier 2.
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but what about affinity.exe
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Tier 1: The Architect, The Endless Knot, 1985, affinity.exe/Initiate
Tier 2: Red Giant, Bound By Gravity
Tier 3: Earthrise, Lapse
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but what about affinity.exe
I don't really consider it separately from Initiate, so I edited my post.
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tbh ive never even heard it so :lol
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tbh ive never even heard it so :lol
If you've listened to the Initiate youtube vid then you've heard half of affinity.exe already.
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Wow, my unpopular opinion is more unpopular than I thought. :lol Sure, there are sounds that sound like dubstep, but dubstep is a completely different rhythmic feel and speed. There's not even a drop. There's about as much dubstep in this album as there is circus music in Aquarius.
But....that's just like...my opinion, man.
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Wow, my unpopular opinion is more unpopular than I thought. :lol Sure, there are sounds that sound like dubstep, but dubstep is a completely different rhythmic feel and speed. There's not even a drop. There's about as much dubstep in this album as there is circus music in Aquarius.
But....that's just like...my opinion, man.
Has anyone suggested that there's a remotely significant amount of dubstep on the album? I'm pretty sure it's only the instrumental in Endless Knot, and that is very definitely a dubstep infusion, though not pure dubstep obviously.
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Having the ".exe" in the title isn't going to fuck with the sound file in my computer as long as I have the ".mp4" or whatever afterward, is it? I don't want to rip the album just to find the first track won't play because the computer reads it as an executable file. :lol
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Wow, my unpopular opinion is more unpopular than I thought. :lol Sure, there are sounds that sound like dubstep, but dubstep is a completely different rhythmic feel and speed. There's not even a drop. There's about as much dubstep in this album as there is circus music in Aquarius.
But....that's just like...my opinion, man.
Has anyone suggested that there's a remotely significant amount of dubstep on the album? I'm pretty sure it's only the instrumental in Endless Knot, and that is very definitely a dubstep infusion, though not pure dubstep obviously.
Nah, I just wouldn't use dubstep to describe, but I can understand why other people do.
Having the ".exe" in the title isn't going to fuck with the sound file in my computer as long as I have the ".mp4" or whatever afterward, is it? I don't want to rip the album just to find the first track won't play because the computer reads it as an executable file. :lol
:rollin You'll be fine. It's the last extension that matters.
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8. Lapse
7. Red Giant
6. Bound By Gravity
5. Initiate
4. Earthrise
3. The Architect
2. 1985
1. The Endless Knot
1-4 are tier 1 amazing songs.
5-6 are really good tier 2 songs.
7-8 are good tier 3 songs.
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I literally can't rank all the songs. Best I can do is put them into 2 tiers.
I'm pretty much the same way, except I have 3 tiers:
Godtier: 1985, The Architect, Endless Knot
Greatier: Initiate, Lapse, Earthrise, Bound by Gravity
Goodtier: Red Giant
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Nah, I just wouldn't use dubstep to describe, but I can understand why other people do.
I mean, this is basically as if they'd have a guest rapper do a verse on one of the songs, but you'd refuse to call it rapping because the whole song isn't like that.
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Nah, I just wouldn't use dubstep to describe, but I can understand why other people do.
I mean, this is basically as if they'd have a guest rapper do a verse on one of the songs, but you'd refuse to call it rapping because the whole song isn't like that.
Well, no, there might be another specific genre that it sounds closer to that Implode knows of. It's still splitting hairs though.
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This is album is awesome! I can't stop listening to it. My favourites right now are 1985 and Earthrise but everything on Affinity is magical in a way only Haken can pull off.
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1985, holy hell. It's my favourite right now - and a Top 5 Haken song.
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It's funny, people are ranking lapse rather low and I think it's one of my favorites on the album. That chorus is really powerful. But to each his own I suppose.
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people not able to agree on a best song is good imo it means they all rule
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It's funny, people are ranking lapse rather low and I think it's one of my favorites on the album. That chorus is really powerful. But to each his own I suppose.
I feel that way about Red Giant.
people not able to agree on a best song is good imo it means they all rule
Definitely!
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Maybe a dumb q but should I expect the album tomorrow if I preordered it? Never preordered anything before and CM Distro hasn't given me a tracking # yet.
-
it'll probably ship tomorrow
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Mine shipped from Amazon today, so I might get it tomorrow. Here's to hoping! :metal
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Maybe a dumb q but should I expect the album tomorrow if I preordered it? Never preordered anything before and CM Distro hasn't given me a tracking # yet.
I was JUST ABOUT to address the exact same issue!
I don't know what's going on...but I've got a double whammy because I ordered as a guest (I was not signed in to any CM Distro account) and it let me pay thru my PayPal account without signing into to CM Distro. So....no account = no email confirmation and no tracking number.
But now there's a bigger problem. PayPal is saying that my transaction was processed by TheCenturyFamily, Inc. I tried sending an email to the contact address provided and it was immediately kicked back to me as being a non-existent address. So I tried the given phone number....that was also non-existent. So I went to the website and created an account and tried to send a contact message...but it won't send. It says to click on the "airplane" icon, but when you do that, nothing happens.
So....transaction processed, but no way to contact anyone. What.....the.....crap????
EDIT!!! - Update....the contact message *DID* go through. After hitting the icon, you then have to hit "send" DOH!!!
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Having the ".exe" in the title isn't going to fuck with the sound file in my computer as long as I have the ".mp4" or whatever afterward, is it? I don't want to rip the album just to find the first track won't play because the computer reads it as an executable file. :lol
:rollin You'll be fine. It's the last extension that matters.
I mean, really, I should know better, but still. Made me raise an eyebrow. :lol
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I'm going to go with 4 tiers. I don't know how to rank this album, but it's not Haken's best one (it is The Mountain, in case you had any doubt ;D).
God: 1985
Great: The Architect, Initiate
Good: Lapse, Earthrise, Red Giant, The Endless Knot
Meh: Bound by Gravity
Great and good tiers could perfectly change, though.
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It's out now on Spotify :tup
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It's out now on Spotify :tup
Nice. :metal
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Asked about this album in a record store today and they said they'll get it next week. So I guess I wait.
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I just got the CD, listening now. HOLY SHIT 1985 IS AMAZING
-
HOLY SHIT 1985 IS AMAZING
So much this, but I think I enjoyed Bound by Gravity more, it's just such a beautiful song.
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Checking out the instrumental version of the album, and it's actually rather cool. The album is that much more delicate and coherent that it works really well as a sort of post-rock/post-metal album. I normally have no interest in instrumental versions of albums, but this one is not bad.
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I'm now on my second listen. Seriously, I was not expecting it to be this good... wow.
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Checking out the instrumental version of the album, and it's actually rather cool. The album is that much more delicate and coherent that it works really well as a sort of post-rock/post-metal album. I normally have no interest in instrumental versions of albums, but this one is not bad.
One thing I noticed (even more than before) when I listened to the instrumental version is how damn good this album sounds. The production is so good it makes me sad.
I'm rarely alone in the car these days, but I hope I will be soon so I can rock and try to sing along with the instrumental versions.
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placed my order with importcds so odds are it'll be here tuesday (bless importcds) but i'mma give the album a listen tonight 'cause i can't wait
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Sweet, we can talk even more about the album now. How good is it?
OUT OF THIS WORLD: Earthrise
Amazing: The Endless Knot, The Architect, 1985, Bound by Gravity
Great: Lapse, Initiate, Red Giant
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I'm just now finishing my listen of the whole album. Incredible. What an legitimately enjoyable listen, both in regards to content and production. Of all the newer prog bands out there, I really think Haken is the top, at least for now.
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This is one awesome album. My favorite tracks definitely are 1985 and Bound by Gravity.
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On my first listen of the vinyl. Very, very nice! :hat
Oh, and I LOVE the artwork!
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I`m on second listen and I`m
astonished amazed. My favourites at this point are 1985 (pure genius), The Architect (not as great as Falling Back to Earth or Crystallized, but still fantastic) and The Endless Knot (great modern metal track).
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Listening for the second time right now. I'm really a huge fan. It's like they asked me what aspects of their sound are my favorite, and then did exactly all of my favorite things. This isn't much better than I was expecting, as the singles really set the bar high imo, but it's still surprised me frequently with how well done it is.
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I'm now on my second listen. Seriously, I was not expecting it to be this good... wow.
This was me. Definitely was not expecting something this amazing. I'm so glad.
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part way through my first go. so far so good!
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OUT OF THIS WORLD: Earthrise
Yay, that's probably my favourite too! :D
o/
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Listening to 1985 right now. Really great indeed.
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Gave the album another full spin today. I think I might be able to rank it based on my first impressions (first 5 listens):
1. 1985
2. The Endless Knot
3. Earthrise
4. Initiate
5. Red Giant
6. The Architect (kind of a let down at first, but it's slowly growing on me)
7. Lapse
8. Bound By Gravity (this one is gonna need a lot more listens before I appreciate it more)
All the tracks are really strong though. This might be my favourite Haken album so far, since I don't feel the urge to skip any tracks unlike the other three albums. (looking at you Cockroach King and Atlas Stone)
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(looking at you Cockroach King and Atlas Stone)
Skipping the best two songs on the album! :o
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10:17 of The Architect sounds like it was taken straight from an Opeth song.
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(looking at you Cockroach King and Atlas Stone)
Skipping the best two songs on the album! :o
I sympathize...
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...with train of naught.
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I honestly hate Cockroach King. That song alone is the reason I prefer Visions over The Mountain. Luckily for me, nothing on the new album sounds like Cockroach King.
-
...with train of naught.
And a cockroach.
-
The Train of Naught sits on his throne
I honestly hate Cockroach King.
:'(
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The Train of Naught sits on his throne
I honestly hate Cockroach King.
:'(
Listening to the song right now and here's what I've got.
They can't sleep
I was gazing at the mirror
I learned to be
Earn a pass hold
Of a self-made man
Hopelessly
I paved in my ignorance
Desperately
Talking on the roachifying me
I mean, ToN, if we meet up next year in Germany, we need to go to the karaoke bar and I hope they have Cockroach King. :lol
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I'd be down, I think some bars allow customer CD's so you could bring a copy of The Mountain :lol I do a mean Ross Jennings dude, you don't know who you're competing against.
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I'd be down, I think some bars allow customer CD's so you could bring a copy of The Mountain :lol I do a mean Ross Jennings dude, you don't know who you're competing against.
You won't be competing after you hear my version of Cockroach King. I've only got these lyrics because I was actively listening to this song. They'll probably hospitalize you because of extensive laugh which is bad for your stomach or something. :lol
But hey, there are some harmonies too, we can do this together and everyone will be throwing up in awe. Actually, why am I striking this out? Everyone will be throwing up in awe.
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1985 is just pure fun! Having my first listen right now so alot to take in.
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The Architect is a prog beast.
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I'd be down, I think some bars allow customer CD's so you could bring a copy of The Mountain :lol I do a mean Ross Jennings dude, you don't know who you're competing against.
You won't be competing after you hear my version of Cockroach King. I've only got these lyrics because I was actively listening to this song. They'll probably hospitalize you because of extensive laugh which is bad for your stomach or something. :lol
But hey, there are some harmonies too, we can do this together and everyone will be throwing up in awe. Actually, why am I striking this out? Everyone will be throwing up in awe.
I hope we don't bail on this one :lol looking forward to it.
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I'd be down, I think some bars allow customer CD's so you could bring a copy of The Mountain :lol I do a mean Ross Jennings dude, you don't know who you're competing against.
You won't be competing after you hear my version of Cockroach King. I've only got these lyrics because I was actively listening to this song. They'll probably hospitalize you because of extensive laugh which is bad for your stomach or something. :lol
But hey, there are some harmonies too, we can do this together and everyone will be throwing up in awe. Actually, why am I striking this out? Everyone will be throwing up in awe.
I hope we don't bail on this one :lol looking forward to it.
That depends... but the fact I'm travelling to Germany in 2017 is pretty much settled unless Gilmour announces his tour elsewhere, and I've got The Mountain CD, so I think the probability is quite high here. :biggrin:
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The Architect is a prog beast.
That extended bass solo. :metal
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I'm not halfway through, but, man, what an album!
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OUT OF THIS WORLD: Earthrise
Yay, that's probably my favourite too! :D
o/
*\o
Man, been awhile since I had a nice quality interception.
-
It's also been quite a while since my last DAMMIT NICK
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i want my vinyl copy to arrive cause i don't want to listen to it any other way until then :'(
haven't gotten any kind of shipping notification, but that doesn't always mean anything. i ordered the vinyl of The Mountain with it, hope that wasn't holding anything up for some reason..
excited to have it though :metal
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Haven't posted for a while here.
But this album is something else, really. I didn't think that the follow up for something so good as The Mountain, could be so satisfying and mature.
Calling it:
The Moutain = Images And Words
Affinity = Awake
My favorite is 1985. It's a near perfect song. Along that, Earthrise and The Architect, but truly, each song is incredible on its own.
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I've always struggled to get into Haken. Despite giving all of their albums several tries. Aquarius has probably been my favorite of the first three, but even that one struggles to get me going consistently.
No idea why this is the case, but the new album seems to me so much better. Not sure why it should be more suited to my tastes, but I'm loving this. The four song run from 1985 to Earthrise has got to be one of my favorite ~35 minutes of Haken, and it's not even close. Lapse comes on and I just have to dance.
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Echoing the sentiments towards "1985" here, and as a kid that grew up with the Transformers of the 80's, and especially the 1986 film, the Vince DiCola inspired sounds of "1985" tickle a nostalgic spot deep inside my musical mind and soul. Everything about the song is just so retro but so fresh, too.
This album is SO different but SO good, as solid as The Mountain and Visions for me. These three albums are all stellar, all the while being different enough from each other. It'll be interesting to see what Haken does next, but for now, I am extremely happy with their output so far.
-Marc.
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I guess I should get this album soon, since the two songs I've heard just keep growing on me.
One day.
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As others have stated - 1985 :hefdaddy
Two things came to me on the first listen. The band is really tight(in a good way) and the drumming is so damn good.
I envy those that will get to see the band live on this tour. I live in Tennessee, so my only shot would probably be Atlanta, if the come to the states and the southeast.
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I hear the dynamics on the toms here and wish DT would go this way. First listen and blown away.
-
Has anyone decoded the Morse code at the end of Bound by Gravity yet? Which by the way is a phenomenal way to end the album.
Edit wingof war on reddit states Okay, first part of Affinity.exe is .- ..-. ..-. .. -. .. - -.-- which spells out... you guessed it, AFFINITY. After the other ambient noises kick in it's hard to hear. But it for sure starts with .... .- (which spells out HA so we can assume it spells out HAKEN).
Gravity is weird. I'll update as I go. It looks like the right channel is slowed down morse too.
>AFFINITY HAKEN *LM985 AFFINITY HAKEN *LM98 HAFFINITY HAKEN
Basically it keeps repeating HAKEN AFFINITY and LM98 (I think) on the left channel. Right channel looks like morse, but I can't find a pattern in it. Maybe someone better at listening can pick it out. I've only practiced enough to pick out words at about 7 wmp, so this was super challenging to pick up by ear.
* for unsure
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They are already confirmed for ProgPower in Atlanta this September. They will play other dates, just no clue if any will be closer to you.
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have they put up an official album stream of this yet tho
okay i guess i'll use spotify for this one specific thing o well
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Yeah this isn't bad.
-
it's pretty solid.
i'm not immediately in love with it like i was with the mountain but i'll probably like it a lot more if i give it a few listens, which i won't be doing until i actually have the cd
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I feel bad for everyone that isn't enjoying Bound by Gravity. One listen in and it's probably the one that grabbed me the most and made me completely drop what I was doing. Absolutely gorgeous song on the first listen and I can only imagine it'll get better as I get more familiar with it. Also, I feel like the opening for the Architect would fit really well with the beginning few minutes of Illumination Theory.
-
Bound By Gravity is probably the most beautiful thing I heard in a long time. It's absolutely blowing me away.
-
Agreed.
Only have one spin on it so far. But I went back and listened to 1985 twice more. LOVE that track.
I was expecting to like The Architect a lot more than I did. Everyone's been clamoring about it, and it is the epic track, so I figured it was a no-brainer that I would be blown away by it. But the first time through didn't really grab me the way I thought it would. There were parts I really loved, so maybe that track just has to sink in.
For me personally, I've never heard this particular mix of influences on a progressive metal album before. I love it when bands are in their prime and break new ground in the genre. This is a really great album. For personal reasons, The Mountain will always be my favorite. The lyrical themes just hit me at a very important time, and so that album is always just going to be deeply personal. But Affinity is musically entering territory that changes up the landscape. I think it's going to end up being a very important album...
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Agreed.
Only have one spin on it so far. But I went back and listened to 1985 twice more. LOVE that track.
I was expecting to like The Architect a lot more than I did. Everyone's been clamoring about it, and it is the epic track, so I figured it was a no-brainer that I would be blown away by it. But the first time through didn't really grab me the way I thought it would. There were parts I really loved, so maybe that track just has to sink in.
For me personally, I've never heard this particular mix of influences on a progressive metal album before. I love it when bands are in their prime and break new ground in the genre. This is a really great album. For personal reasons, The Mountain will always be my favorite. The lyrical themes just hit me at a very important time, and so that album is always just going to be deeply personal. But Affinity is musically entering territory that changes up the landscape. I think it's going to end up being a very important album...
Great post. The Mountain is also special to me lyrically and I love the vocals. The epic is growing for me and those first 3 minutes are just golden. I did not expect to like Bound by Gravity, but the song is just beautiful.
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I was expecting to like The Architect a lot more than I did. Everyone's been clamoring about it, and it is the epic track, so I figured it was a no-brainer that I would be blown away by it. But the first time through didn't really grab me the way I thought it would. There were parts I really loved, so maybe that track just has to sink in.
Well, it's the longest track on the album, so it's obvious that there will be hype about it. But after many many listens to the album, it's definitely lower in the rankings for me. But really that's only because the album is just so damn good.
The other thing about The Architect is that structurally it's similar to Falling Back to Earth, but it's just not quite as brilliant.
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The Architect isn't close to being the best track on this album. It's great and it has some fudgin' amazing moments (the outro is spectacular) but at times I feel like there's too much going on. I couldn't help but think on A Nightmare to Remember on that interlude as a 'what could've been' :lol .
As I mentioned earlier, I think the best two tracks in the album are 1985 and Bound by Gravity. 1985 is one of those songs I can play continuously and still be amazed by how fresh and how inspired it sounds. Bound by Gravity is an amazing album closer and such a nice breath of fresh air! I love the ending where the full band comes in with the epic melody played by Diego.
I really dig how they explored electronics in this release, but at moments I feel like it was too much. Also, this is gonna sound weird for some but I miss the vocal approach of Aquarius/Visions/Mountain a little bit. A lot of the vocal melodies sound super imposed to me because well, let's be honest, most of these songs are in odd time signatures, but I miss the good ole simple melody that can get stuck in my head for days (which is why I love Bound by Gravity so much). The Djenty influence on the rhythms throughout most songs are pretty cool but they can't be so easy to handle. This isn't an album I can put any day/anywhere like The Mountain, but it's an album I will definitely cherish in the days to come.
Affinity doesn't reach the God-tier level The Mountain reached, but it's quite high!
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Affinity is the first Haken album to click for me.
I've tried many times to get into them, but alas no success.
Normally I wouldn't have bothered with this album, but I saw a number of reviews mentioning
Yes '90125' album and comparing it to that classic album.
My eyes lit up when I saw this, 90125 is one of my fave albums and any comparison is worth my attention.
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I feel bad for everyone that isn't enjoying Bound by Gravity. One listen in and it's probably the one that grabbed me the most and made me completely drop what I was doing. Absolutely gorgeous song on the first listen and I can only imagine it'll get better as I get more familiar with it. Also, I feel like the opening for the Architect would fit really well with the beginning few minutes of Illumination Theory.
I haven't checked this thread in a long time, but I've listened to the album quite a few times now. I was totally expecting to see everyone rave about this song. This song is the highlight of the album for me. But then again I'm a sucker for albums that have repeated themes in them, so having the rhythm from Initiate come in with that majestic ending just makes me love it.
Overall a great album. I thought it was OK on the first listen, but definitely has grown for me on each listen.
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For me, it's kinda refreshing that for once the best song in the album isn't the epic. :lol Nice shift of a prog paradigm. (SEE WHAT I DID THERE LOL SO FUNNEY)
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there are many albums where the epic isn't the best song, like octavarium
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there are many albums where the epic isn't the best song, like octavarium
no u
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there are many albums where the epic isn't the best song, like octavarium
(https://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/kingshmegland/images%2016_zpswxabrqse.jpg) (https://s583.photobucket.com/user/kingshmegland/media/images%2016_zpswxabrqse.jpg.html)
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yes, this is the reaction i was hoping to get
(i'm not kidding tho)
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Were playing too. Everybody has their personal favorites.
BUT STILL!! :lol
-
I will say this, These Walls offers the best 7-minute chunk of music on the album, but Octavarium is still the better song.
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These Walls, Sacrificed Sons and The Root of All Evil are all miles ahead of Octavarium
Also Affinity is amazing. Contrary to other people, I'm really loving The Architect, definitely in my Top 3 on the album, along with 1985 and either Earthrise or Bound by Gravity, depending on how I'm feeling from day to day. But really, the whole album (aside from Lapse, which I have trouble remembering much about, sadly) is just stunning. Not sure if it's as good as The Mountain, but it's definitely a worthy follow-up.
Tentative ranking:
1. 1985
2. The Architect
3. Bound by Gravity
4. Earthrise
5. The Endless Knot
6. Red Giant
7. Initiate
8. Lapse
9. affinity.exe
I guess the middle ground might be subject to change, both the Top 2 and the bottom are pretty much locked in.
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This album is just phenomenal.
-
Sacrificed Sons and The Root of All Evil are all miles ahead of Octavarium
TROAE isn't miles ahead for me, but overall I agree with this statement.
For me, it's kinda refreshing that for once the best song in the album isn't the epic.
Wait The Architect isn't the fan favorite here? I love it! Easily my favorite, got better with every listen for me too.
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After 3 or 4 more spins today, I'm liking it more and more. And Initiate (which I was extremely lukewarm on at first) is quickly becoming a favorite.
Still not feeling The Architect. I love parts of it. I'm sure it will continue to grow on me.
The strength of the mellower tracks are what's really impressing me. Lapse, Red Giant, and Bound By Gravity are just GORGEOUS pieces of music.
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Didn't expect to be alone in saying this, but The Architect is now God-Tier for me, along the likes of Visions, Celestial Elixir, FBTE. Like every epic, it feels "meh" on the first few spins. But when it clicks? Sweet baby Jesus! Also, PHENOMENAL ending. Everything from the guitar solo reprise of Initiate's chorus to the end is just :omg:
A prediction of how the beginning and end of setlists are going to look like:
0. affinity.exe
1. Initiate
....
12. The Architect
---
13. Bound By Gravity
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A prediction of how the beginning and end of setlists are going to look like:
0. affinity.exe
1. Initiate
....
12. The Architect
---
13. Bound By Gravity
The beginning seems pretty obvious, but please DON'T end with Bound by Gravity. I'd say more, don't play it :-[
I'd love to hear something like:
0. affinity.exe
1. Initiate
2. 1985
3. Drowning in the Flood
4. Portals
5. The Endless Knot
6. Crystallised
7. Atlas Stone
8. Pareidolia
9. Earthrise
10. The Architect
11. Falling Back to Earth
12. Visions/Celestial Elixir
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The beginning seems pretty obvious, but please DON'T end with Bound by Gravity. I'd say more, don't play it :-[
.... I love Bound by Gravity :blush
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Checked out some of the new songs online, and I suspect my experience with this will be the same as always with Haken: my lack of fondness for the singer is making it difficult to grab me at first, but I will eventually come around to liking some of it. The music definitely sounds really good in that songs I listened to.
I honestly hate Cockroach King.
Looks like I am not alone. (https://static2.businessinsider.com/image/53fcc7e669beddcb441022d0/aaron-paul-bryan-cranston-emmy-speech.gif)
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Checked out some of the new songs online, and I suspect my experience with this will be the same as always with Haken: my lack of fondness for the singer is making it difficult to grab me at first, but I will eventually come around to liking some of it. The music definitely sounds really good in that songs I listened to.
There is a complete instrumental version of the record included in this double CD version (https://www.amazon.de/Affinity-Ltd-2CD-Mediabook-Haken/dp/B01C3Z02B6) if you dig the music. :)
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I appreciate the link :), but instrumental music of a CD that normally has vocals doesn't really interest me.
Plus, I don't like Haken that much to spend that kind of money on a double CD.
Plus part II, I don't buy CDs anymore (except on special occasions).
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I appreciate the link :), but instrumental music of a CD that normally has vocals doesn't really interest me.
Plus, I don't like Haken that much to spend that kind of money on a double CD.
Plus part II, I don't buy CDs anymore (except on special occasions).
You mean like the $11.88 I spent on it? :lol
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The beginning seems pretty obvious, but please DON'T end with Bound by Gravity. I'd say more, don't play it :-[
.... I love Bound by Gravity :blush
Most of us do. :D
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I appreciate the link :), but instrumental music of a CD that normally has vocals doesn't really interest me.
Plus, I don't like Haken that much to spend that kind of money on a double CD.
Plus part II, I don't buy CDs anymore (except on special occasions).
You mean like the $11.88 I spent on it? :lol
Exactly. :lol
Fine, remove that from my post and my other two points still stand. :biggrin:
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:lol
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I'd happily buy the two-disc version if it wasn't a stupid digipak. Jewel case for me, baby!
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I ended up preordering the digipak because I didn't know a jewel case existed :-[
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This is such a great album! Though the music isn't nearly as emotional as The Mountain's, which I felt would be the case, the songwriting is more mature and concise and is their most musically genius album yet. I'm not sure if I can put it above The Mountain yet, but time will tell.
If I had to rate the songs it would probably be:
Excellent:
1. 1985
2. The Architect
3. Lapse
Great:
4. The Endless Knot
5. Bound By Gravity
6. Affinity.exe/Initiate
Good:
7. Earthrise
8. Red Giant
Not a stinker on the album, at least on first impressions. Also the first Haken album where I don't feel urged to skip any songs :biggrin:
It took until 2016 for me to actually like and appreciate The Mountain as much as I do, but Affinity I enjoyed from the first listen.
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Yeah, that's a good way to put it, The Mountain definitely feels more emotional. I think that there are definitely moments here which reach as high or higher than The Mountain, though, but I'd still rate The Mountain higher.
I agree with the sentiment that the "epics" aren't necessarily the best songs here this go around. While 1985 and The Architect are amazing, I find myself coming back to Earthrise, The Endless Knot, and Bound by Gravity the most.
And ariich, despite Nick's interception here's your high five returned kind of late! *\o Earthrise definitely stands as my favorite.
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I dunno... Early days still, but I think this is better than The Mountain and more emotional, too. It just keeps getting better
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I dunno... Early days still, but I think this is better than The Mountain and more emotional, too. It just keeps getting better
I love The Mountain, but I appreciate that Affinity seems to be a little smaller in scale.
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10:17 of The Architect sounds like it was taken straight from an Opeth song.
Yeah it sounds like its directly taken from Drapery Falls
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I am absolutely blown away by how great this album is. I dare to say I am more blown away than by The Astonishing (there I said it, now you are allowed to slaughter me). The Mountain needed some time, and in the end kicked DT12 from the throne of the album of the year 2013. Affinity had the Aquarius Effect on me: I am so speechless. There is just so much going on! The Architect, MY GAWD. 1985 is one hell of beast as well. I love the Dubstep-Metal part in Endless Knot, as well as the part that sounds like a snippet out of a House-Set right before the beat drops (I don't like House dough).
For anyone wanting to find out about reprises and things to discover in Affinity, stop reading here:
Has anyone noticed the two Initiate reprises in the album? The chorus comes again at the end of The Architect, and the first rhythm pattern can be found at the end of Bound By Gravity before the coda I think. Also, I noticed the "Shifting frame by frame" reference from 1985 in Endless Knot.
BTW, "frame by frame" - King Crimson anyone? Together with the Neal Jack & Me guitars in the verse? Cool reference.
I can't believe that this has not been discussed more:
Has anyone decoded the Morse code at the end of Bound by Gravity yet? Which by the way is a phenomenal way to end the album.
Edit wingof war on reddit states Okay, first part of Affinity.exe is .- ..-. ..-. .. -. .. - -.-- which spells out... you guessed it, AFFINITY. After the other ambient noises kick in it's hard to hear. But it for sure starts with .... .- (which spells out HA so we can assume it spells out HAKEN).
Gravity is weird. I'll update as I go. It looks like the right channel is slowed down morse too.
>AFFINITY HAKEN *LM985 AFFINITY HAKEN *LM98 HAFFINITY HAKEN
Basically it keeps repeating HAKEN AFFINITY and LM98 (I think) on the left channel. Right channel looks like morse, but I can't find a pattern in it. Maybe someone better at listening can pick it out. I've only practiced enough to pick out words at about 7 wmp, so this was super challenging to pick up by ear.
* for unsure
This is VERY INTERESTING in my opinion! And it makes Affinity a lot more sympathetic. You can see so much love for details here. AWESOME. I would love to know what LM98 could mean.
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I am absolutely blown away by how great this album is. I dare to say I am more blown away than by The Astonishing (there I said it, now you are allowed to slaughter me).
I MUCH prefer Affinity over TA, so you'll get no slaughter from me :P
We're talking Album Of The Year material right here.
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I went on Amazon.com on Friday afternoon and bought the MP3 version - it was only available in the deluxe version (all songs with and without vocals) if you wanted MP3 but that was fine, it was $3.00 more than a regular album but I'm cool with that. $3.00 for an instrumental version of the album -which I will listen to- is more than fair in my mind. And a good way for them to make a little extra scratch, which I'm also OK with.
So, anyway, this is a band that I've really wanted to love but just never could seem to figure out what all of the hype was about. Now, don't get me wrong here. There is no doubt that this is an extremely talented group of musicians. My biggest beef with them has been that I always felt like that quirky/complexity thing was being milked a little too much and the result was the albums are very, very dense and take a very long time to sink in. Plus, for me at least, I need a little more emphasis on melody rather than complexity in order to connect with a piece of music on an emotional level. I found that while I very much enjoyed listening to Aquarius, Visions, The Mountain and the Restoration EP, I never really connected with any of the songs and I am still hard pressed to name any tracks on any of those albums. I rarely reach for them.
Despite all of this, I still admire their skill and talent and enjoy their music enough that spending a few bucks on a download version of their album is the least I can do to support a good band that's putting out this kind of music. And to my pleasant surprise, after two spins I've gotta say that this one is definitely going to be my favorite of the bunch. The vocalist has improved with each release, and that's good because I've generally considered the vocals to be the weakest element with this band. But with this new album I think they did a much better job of keeping the vocals more interesting, more melodic and less....I don't know...angular? The melodies are smoother and they built some nice harmonies in a lot of places that I've really not heard a lot of on previous albums.
To me, the mark of a good musician is one who can play their instrument and not get distracted or upset by criticism. The mark of a great musician is one who takes criticism as assistance and uses it to propel themselves forward. I'd put Haken -and particularly Ross Jennings in the latter category.
It's far too soon for me to rate it, but if my gut is right - and it usually is - this one's going to be my favorite of theirs.
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the astonishing is incredibly meh so i'm already pretty sure i like this one more even after just one listen
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You'd get slaughtered if you said The Astonishing is better :lol
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Excellent:
1. 1985
2. The Architect
3. Lapse
Great:
4. The Endless Knot
5. Bound By Gravity
6. Affinity.exe/Initiate
Good:
7. Earthrise
8. Red Giant
"Earthrise" and RG are actually two of my favourites on the album right off the bat. The first part of E and the second part of RG in particular are up there with the band's finest moments.
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the astonishing is incredibly meh so i'm already pretty sure i like this one more even after just one listen
Absolutely! Just listened to it for the first time earlier. Love it!
You'd get slaughtered if you said The Astonishing is better :lol
Yeah, because Affinity slaughters TA! :2metal:
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Yeah, because Affinity slaughters TA! :2metal:
I wouldn't say that myself because I love TA but Haken is probably more loved than DT on DTF :lol
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I went on Amazon.com on Friday afternoon and bought the MP3 version - it was only available in the deluxe version (all songs with and without vocals) if you wanted MP3 but that was fine, it was $3.00 more than a regular album but I'm cool with that. $3.00 for an instrumental version of the album -which I will listen to- is more than fair in my mind. And a good way for them to make a little extra scratch, which I'm also OK with.
So, anyway, this is a band that I've really wanted to love but just never could seem to figure out what all of the hype was about. Now, don't get me wrong here. There is no doubt that this is an extremely talented group of musicians. My biggest beef with them has been that I always felt like that quirky/complexity thing was being milked a little too much and the result was the albums are very, very dense and take a very long time to sink in. Plus, for me at least, I need a little more emphasis on melody rather than complexity in order to connect with a piece of music on an emotional level. I found that while I very much enjoyed listening to Aquarius, Visions, The Mountain and the Restoration EP, I never really connected with any of the songs and I am still hard pressed to name any tracks on any of those albums. I rarely reach for them.
Despite all of this, I still admire their skill and talent and enjoy their music enough that spending a few bucks on a download version of their album is the least I can do to support a good band that's putting out this kind of music. And to my pleasant surprise, after two spins I've gotta say that this one is definitely going to be my favorite of the bunch. The vocalist has improved with each release, and that's good because I've generally considered the vocals to be the weakest element with this band. But with this new album I think they did a much better job of keeping the vocals more interesting, more melodic and less....I don't know...angular? The melodies are smoother and they built some nice harmonies in a lot of places that I've really not heard a lot of on previous albums.
To me, the mark of a good musician is one who can play their instrument and not get distracted or upset by criticism. The mark of a great musician is one who takes criticism as assistance and uses it to propel themselves forward. I'd put Haken -and particularly Ross Jennings in the latter category.
It's far too soon for me to rate it, but if my gut is right - and it usually is - this one's going to be my favorite of theirs.
I couldn't have said it any better. All of this applies to me.
I think the quirkiness of the music was a little too much for me on their first three albums. Too many video game/circus moments which distracted me and made it difficult for me to get emotionally attached. And while those elements are still here, I think they fit much better with the retro theme of the album. It feels more purposeful, on Affinity. And much more importantly, I agree that the vocals feel much smoother here. On past albums they often jumped into a kind of musical/a cappella style which I don't like much.
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^yeah, I agree with that. :)
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I am absolutely blown away by how great this album is. I dare to say I am more blown away than by The Astonishing (there I said it, now you are allowed to slaughter me).
I MUCH prefer Affinity over TA, so you'll get no slaughter from me :P
We're talking Album Of The Year material right here.
Yea, too bad there is not a progressive category for the Grammy's. The Mountain would have been a contender and Affinity would certainly be a contender.
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You'd get slaughtered if you said The Astonishing is better :lol
But TA is better. Okay, I have only heard Affinity once, but most of it sounded like the usual okay to pretty good Haken stuff, while much of TA is pretty great. Not even close in my book.
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You'd get slaughtered if you said The Astonishing is better :lol
But TA is better. Okay, I have only heard Affinity once, but most of it sounded like the usual okay to pretty good Haken stuff, while much of TA is pretty great. Not even close in my book.
To quote myself :P
Yeah, because Affinity slaughters TA! :2metal:
I wouldn't say that myself because I love TA but Haken is probably more loved than DT on DTF :lol
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You'd get slaughtered if you said The Astonishing is better :lol
But TA is better. Okay, I have only heard Affinity once, but most of it sounded like the usual okay to pretty good Haken stuff, while much of TA is pretty great. Not even close in my book.
Compared to Affinity, I wouldn't be comfortable calling The Astonishing proper music.
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I really liked Affinity after hearing it for the first time. Don't know if I can even properly compare it to TA, maybe it's about the same level of quality for me.
You'd get slaughtered if you said The Astonishing is better :lol
But TA is better. Okay, I have only heard Affinity once, but most of it sounded like the usual okay to pretty good Haken stuff, while much of TA is pretty great. Not even close in my book.
Compared to Affinity, I wouldn't be comfortable calling The Astonishing proper music.
WTF
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You'd get slaughtered if you said The Astonishing is better :lol
But TA is better. Okay, I have only heard Affinity once, but most of it sounded like the usual okay to pretty good Haken stuff, while much of TA is pretty great. Not even close in my book.
Compared to Affinity, I wouldn't be comfortable calling The Astonishing proper music.
:facepalm: That's the same as stating that any music you don't like isn't proper music.
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I've listened to this album a couple times now and I can definitely say its really good. 1985 is so cool.
Can't wait to spin this one more! :metal
Compared to Affinity, I wouldn't be comfortable calling The Astonishing proper music.
Seriously man? It's perfectly fine if you don't like TA but how is it not proper music?
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These extreme comparisons are always just a cry for attention it seems to me. If you honestly dislike an album and nothing more, you wouldn't be throwing it in people's face all the time.. right?
I think TA and Affinity are both great, maybe I like Affinity a tiny bit more but it's pretty close.
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Oh come on, of course I consider it proper music. It was an exaggeration to get the point of how much more I like Affinity across. It should be clear.
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Oh come on, of course I consider it proper music. It was an exaggeration to get the point of how much more I like Affinity across. It should be clear.
You're on DTF. We only deal in absolutes here.
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I've should have known you are all sith lords.
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So the big "O" in your avatar if fake.
I knew it.
I'very been a big DT nut for a long time but I have to admit this is a better album than TA. Doesn't mean TA is bad, just that the new Haken album is that good.
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I haven't played Affinity yet, as I just got it today and I'm doing a discography run leading into it, but right now I'm enjoying Restoration about ten times more than I have had before. I must have listened to this 4-6 times before, and never really liked it too much, but it's just suddenly clicking today. Anybody else have a similar experience with Restoration, that it just totally missed the mark at first and then turned into a massive grower?
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not i, I listened to it a few months back and it still did little for me :tup
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Totally get that feeling. Before today, I would have said Earthlings is a solid track and that's about it. Something just clicked somehow.
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Yeah, because Affinity slaughters TA! :2metal:
I wouldn't say that myself because I love TA but Haken is probably more loved than DT on DTF :lol
Even if I loved TA (which is never gonna happen), Affinity would still be light years ahead of it.
I haven't played Affinity yet, as I just got it today and I'm doing a discography run leading into it, but right now I'm enjoying Restoration about ten times more than I have had before. I must have listened to this 4-6 times before, and never really liked it too much, but it's just suddenly clicking today. Anybody else have a similar experience with Restoration, that it just totally missed the mark at first and then turned into a massive grower?
Aquarius was somewhat like that for me and maybe Visions a little bit. The Mountain may have taken a little while also, but not too long. Restoration and now Affinity clicked immediately for me.
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I prefer everything Haken have released to any DT album besides Images and Words and SDOIT tbh, I've really grown off of DT in the last two years
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I've listened to almost 12 albums released this year so far and TA is probably the weakest of them all, and Affinity might end up in my top 5 :P
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If I had to rank Haken albums with DT albums in between it'd be like this:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. SFAM
4. I&W
5. SDOIT
6. Visions
7. Awake
8. ADTOE
9. Aquarius
Some of these are very and hard to rank, but I think it's close enough. In all reality, right now I feel like Affinity should be at the top of the list, but I'll admit I'm still in the honeymoon phase with it. :lol
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Just had my first listen! This is really good. I liked the addition of more atmospheric sections and the lyrical direction they took. Ross's singing just keeps getting better and better. Lapse, Earthrise and Bound by Gravity are the immediate standouts to me.
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on my second listen now, feeling like Bound By Gravity is the best track here but I really like Earthrise and The Endless Knot too
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I have to admit, i have never cared about Haken. I have listened their other albums(and ep.), and i just never cared for those.
This album is a whole different story! Possibly the freshest sounding prog album, of the last 5 years! I would like a little less downtuned guitar, but i'ts not a big negative. I just love the songs "1985" and "Bound by Gravity"!
This is easily the best album they've done. And like i said, a true breath of fresh air for this genre of music! And needless to say, this demolishes the last two DT albums in every way!
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I would like a little less downtuned guitar, but i'ts not a big negative.
Haken's 8 string riffs are the best thing ever.
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I would like a little less downtuned guitar, but i'ts not a big negative.
Haken's 8 string riffs are the best thing ever.
Agreed. Those heavy riffs in the finale of The Architect in combination with the epic melody are just .. Well, astonishing.
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Received the clear vinyl today - starting my first listen of the new album right now. Turntable engaged.
EDIT: Initiate was nice. Starting 1985 now. Wow, nice and proggy. Sounds good!
EDIT 2: Woo, nice low riffs! Yuck, those vocal effects are disgusting.
EDIT 3: loving the guitar sound on this record so far.
EDIT 4: this song is great
EDIT 5: this song has an awesome solo. The rest is less good than the previous track
EDIT 6: I've been wanting to hear this track ever since the tracklist came out
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I would like a little less downtuned guitar, but i'ts not a big negative.
Haken's 8 string riffs are the best thing ever.
Agreed. Those heavy riffs in the finale of The Architect in combination with the epic melody are just .. Well, astonishing.
I love how fast the internet is with stuff like that (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtcOEKJRwhA)
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EDIT 7: Ooh nice bass solo - that chorus was pretty awesome as well.
EDIT 8: uhm, this sounds oddly out of place to be honest ???
EDIT 9: that was overall quite disappointing. Now the second LP.
EDIT 10: I'm pretty sure that was the best track so far.
EDIT 11: that song had some interesting stuff going on, but I can't recall any of it now that the next track has started.
EDIT 12: Perhaps this track is even better than the one in edit 10. I'm loving the phased input of electronic stuff throughout the album. The electronic breakdown here was awesome.
EDIT 13: That was nice too.
Final thoughts: overall, I enjoyed that quite a bit, but I think I need a lot more listens before I can fully appreciate this. Preliminary rankings (after one listen!):
1. Earthrise
2. The Endless Knot
3. 1985
4. The Architect
5. Bound by Gravity
6. Red Giant
7. Initiate
8. Lapse
9. affinity.exe
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I haven't heard H4KEN yet, but I mean, was Yes' new stuff in 1994 or 1999 wasn't nearly as good as DT's. Haken is the "new hotness" in prog
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Until I had the CD to see the lyrics, I kept hearing the first line of The Architect as, "Mr. Jonas Green before me", and I kept wondering who Jonas Green was :lol
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I have a crush on the chorus in Lapse.
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I have a crush on the chorus in Lapse.
I've listened to the album many times and I still can't remember what Lapse sounds like :lol
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And I'm the opposite. Zydar, ever since I read your post a couple hours ago, I haven't been able to get the chorus of Lapse out of my head. :lol
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Totally digging the deluxe edition with the instrumental versions. Anybody else get it?
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This album is weird. It's not instantly grabbing me like The Mountain did....but parts of it are...and I can't stop listening to it. I view this as a good thing, because it means that this sound is a drastic left turn from what I'm used to, and my mind has to adjust.
It's just blowing my mind how totally different sounding this album is compared to anything else they've done before. ...or almost anything for that matter. It's like TesseracT on steroids.
EDIT: I've got it! It's like TesseracT and Anathema and the newest album from BTBAM had a baby.
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Only halfway through my first listen, and this album is blowing me away. That bit in 1985 is freaking unreal, matches any of BtBaM's juxtaposed sections.
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I have a crush on the chorus in Lapse.
I've listened to the album many times and I still can't remember what Lapse sounds like :lol
Listen again!
"Days and nights seem never eeeeeendiiiiiiing
Space and time bleed into oooone"
And I'm the opposite. Zydar, ever since I read your post a couple hours ago, I haven't been able to get the chorus of Lapse out of my head. :lol
Awesome! ;D
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I like Lapse - the super groovy guitar solo and the final chorus in particular are great. But it definitely took a few listens for it to sink in. As I said in my review, positioned between the two "epics", it's easy to not really notice it. I prefer it to The Architect now, though, I think.
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Been listening for a while now and I enjoy it alot! There's a lot of musical nuggets everywhere which I love. I feel the album is a good mix of everything I love about Haken combined with some fresh new elements. Honestly haven't really anything negative to say other than I didn't really dig his growl in The Architect, I don't know it just sounds a bit weak and forced but not a big deal overall.
The first three tracks Initiate, 1985 and Lapse are just amazing. Can't really say the album tops Visions which has been my favourite album for along time though.
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The album didn't really grab me on my first listen either, but now I love it really, I've listened to it a lot in the last few days. The electronic, post rock and djentish influences mixed with solid prog metal is just amazing
The architect is probably my favourite now, though Red Giant has by far the best vocal moment/melody imho. Only Lapse hasn't really grabbed me yet, but as Ariich Said, it's between two amazing epics :azn:
Bound by Gravity, especially it's intro reminds me a lot of Sigur Ross (of untitled 3 I think). I
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Didn't pay too much attention to it before, but Red Giant sneakily entered my head and won't leave anytime soon. Great song.
Also, the more I listen to The Architect, the more I feel like it's one of the weaker songs. Will post a ranking after a few more spins.
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After several spins, I can't find anything I dislike about the album. Too early to rank it but it could become my favourite.
It once again demonstrates Haken's ability to craft albums. The are more technically proficient musicians out there, lots of bands that have written better songs and are more avant-garde at pushing boundaries, but I don't know any band that has released four albums in a row that resonate with me like these.
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I didn't really dig his growl in The Architect, I don't know it just sounds a bit weak and forced but not a big deal overall.
The harsh vocals aren't Ross, it's Einar from Leprous.
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It's still too soon to say, but I think Affinity is by far my favourite Haken album :angel:
Btw: any of the Dutch people, any idea how late the show in Zoetermeer ends? I have to leave at 23:00 if I want to get back to Groningen with the train, but with two support acts, I think Haken would only just have started playing then :p
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Yea I don't know if it's worth it if you have to leave at 23:00, like you said there's going to be two supporting acts. Never been to De Boerderij before though so I have no idea how they handle their intermissions and stuff, and they probably arrange that kinda stuff with the bands themselves.
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Didn't pay too much attention to it before, but Red Giant sneakily entered my head and won't leave anytime soon. Great song.
Also, the more I listen to The Architect, the more I feel like it's one of the weaker songs. Will post a ranking after a few more spins.
I feel the same way with Red Giant, it's magnificent. About the Architect, I love the sung parts, but I think the rest of the song is just ok.
Also, guys, do we all agree on the first solo in Lapse being a synth solo? I've found some people saying that this solo (the one breaking just after the vocals) is a guitar with some weird effect, but I'm pretty sure it's a synth solo, followed by a guitar solo.
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The first is definitely a synth solo. You can't get those little pitch shifts on a guitar.
The solos might be a reason why I don't like the song as a whole that much to be honest. It's so incredibly peaceful and immersive (I love the prechorus so much) and then you just get this minute of solos that don't fit the mood of the song at all thrown in. That might just be me growing out of prog though.
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Got my order from BurningShed today, and I've got to say, I'm SOOOO glad I ordered the 2 CD version. I've listened to most of the instrumental disc, and there's a lot of stuff in there that I didn't hear before without the vocals covering them up.
Also, the mediabook is NICELY done, very good hardcover book outside. Also, the band-signed postcard I got with it is pretty sweet, too. Add Haken to my list of bands I have full-band signatures from! :tup
"1985" is still slaying me good, too.
-Marc.
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Very good record indeed. Probably my second favorite this year so far after the new Myrath album,where I love all the tracks. Haken just isn't the kind of band that writes good ballads IMO (almost no-one is, I consider at least 9/10 ballads in general to be emotionless filler tracks), so I find the whole of Bound By Gravity to be boring. Red Giant is ok, but I also find that one to be rather boring after a couple of minutes. The rest of the album is great though, much better than The Mountain. There's only one thing that annoys me elsewhere, and that's the low E's played on guitars. It's just a few notes too low to sound anything near good.
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There's only one thing that annoys me elsewhere, and that's the low E's played on guitars. It's just a few notes too low to sound anything near good.
You must learn to appreciate good dj0nt
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This album was finally delivered today ;D commencing first listen as I type :metal
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This album was finally delivered today ;D commencing first listen as I type :metal
I imagine someone typing this line while affinity.exe builds up in the background :metal
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Finally gave this a few listens. Wow. They did it again. Very, very solid album and amazingly consistent as there isn't a single weak track here.
I'm actually surprised by the lack of love for The Architect. Might be in the top 3 of this album for me. Lapse is also criminally underrated, too.
It still needs to really sink in and I can see it being a grower, but as it is it's a really good effort. Probably an 8/10 for me, though I'm not sure it'll top The Mountain.
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The instrumental part of the Architect after the growls is awesome :metal
The last three tracks are the ones I enjoy less at the moment, but maybe I have to listen more to them. I don't listen to Haken very much usually, even if I love all their tracks and they are one of my favourite bands
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The transition from the second verse of Lapse into the key solo is freaking awesome.
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Great first impression, I only started listening to Haken in January so all their albums still feel fresh to me. Trying not to OD on them but it's tough, really impressive band and don't think they've released a mediocre album yet, all top quality :metal
Along with Native Construct I think they're easily the best musical discovery so far this year for me :hefdaddy
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Affinity is definitely the most interesting album I've heard since Quiet World :metal
Since you mention Haken and Native Construct, have you checked out Leprous? Not that they sound similar, all three bands are very different but they are all top-notch at what they do.
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Affinity is definitely the most interesting album I've heard since Quiet World :metal
Since you mention Haken and Native Construct, have you checked out Leprous? Not that they sound similar, all three bands are very different but they are all top-notch at what they do.
Yea man, I downloaded Bilateral yesterday actually and was really impressed on first listen. I had previously heard a few tracks off The Congregation but wasn't blown away. I've seen a lot of positivity surrounding Bilateral on here so went for that album, not disappointed so will be sure to check out the rest of their back catalogue soon. Also finally got around to downloading Vertebrae by Enslaved, really enjoyed that too so going to slowly digest their back catalogue as well.
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I've listened to the album a few times now and I LOOOVE the album musically. My early impressions vocally though are that I have trouble understanding what Ross is singing in many spots and that hurts my enjoyment a bit at the moment. Maybe if I sit with the lyric sheet that might help. I also feel like his voice isn't my thing over some of the heavier sections when I'd prefer a more powerful voice belting it out, but I always seem to love his voice over softer sections. For example, "As Death Embraces" is my favorite Haken song. I think it's a flawless tune. Overall, I'm impressed with the album. It's nice to see the band continue their string of solid releases. They're really making their mark in progressive metal!
On a related note, with the band providing an instrumental disc of Affinity, I'm curious if various fans and aspiring vocalists will record themselves singing the tunes and post them online. It would be interesting to hear how other vocal styles sound over the music.
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I have some trouble understanding what Ross is singing in various spots and that hurts my enjoyment a bit at the moment.
Wow you must hate DT then. :lol
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I've listened to it about 5 times. It's good, but not as good as The Mountain imo. The only song I consider truly great is 1985. Maybe The Architect. I don't like the Opeth sounding part though because, well, it does sound way too much like Opeth.
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Does anyone else love the "ooooooo-ooooo" at the end of Lapse? I think it's gorgeous
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I can't stop jamming to the architect's chorus (3:50). The guitar line is so aggressive! It gets me amped. :metal
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I've listened to it about 5 times. It's good, but not as good as The Mountain imo. The only song I consider truly great is 1985. Maybe The Architect. I don't like the Opeth sounding part though because, well, it does sound way too much like Opeth.
Meanwhile, I've also hit 5 or 6 listens, and I think it's only barely second place to Visions. There isn't a lesser moment on the whole damn thing for me. The clear vinyl will be mine!
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In my opinion this is their best album yet. Every song has a strong identity by itself, and they all flow together perfectly as an album. It has lots of new ideas and sounds while still being coherent and emotionally impactful. I just adore everything about this album (minus one or two very minor gripes). It's one of those albums that seems like it was written exactly for me. I've loved every Haken album previously but none of them really hit me like this one. I've probably listened through this album 12 times in the past week, and someone I continue to enjoy it more. I'm trying to keep myself from listening to it because I don't want to get old too quickly, but nothing else sounds appealing.
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You'd get slaughtered if you said The Astonishing is better :lol
But TA is better. Okay, I have only heard Affinity once, but most of it sounded like the usual okay to pretty good Haken stuff, while much of TA is pretty great. Not even close in my book.
LOL Kev. Such a fanboy. :lol
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Yea I don't know if it's worth it if you have to leave at 23:00, like you said there's going to be two supporting acts. Never been to De Boerderij before though so I have no idea how they handle their intermissions and stuff, and they probably arrange that kinda stuff with the bands themselves.
I've been there a bunch of times and De Boerderij is usually quite considerate with people that have to leave early. I think the show ends at around 23:30, that would give 3 hours playing time total. 1.5 hours for both support acts and 1.5 hours for Haken. Sounds very reasonable to me.
See you there.
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I've listened to it about 5 times. It's good, but not as good as The Mountain imo. The only song I consider truly great is 1985. Maybe The Architect. I don't like the Opeth sounding part though because, well, it does sound way too much like Opeth.
Meanwhile, I've also hit 5 or 6 listens, and I think it's only barely second place to Visions.
saying it's second to their least good album isn't much of a compliment :neverusethis:
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affinity.exe + Initiate
The opening sounds like a tame version of Descent of the NOMACS. I really dig Initiate and love how the main riff returns a few times later on.
1985
Full on 80's sound. Might take some getting used to, but there is something about those 80's drums that makes me smile everytime. The whole thing kind of shows that Haken still have that sense of humour.
Lapse
Didn't leave much of an impression really. The instrumental part reminds me of Polyphia and I like the upbeat approach, but this one is probably the weakest track for me.
The Architect
This one is a little tough because long tracks usually take some time to digest. I enjoy how the song get's heavier as it progresses, but it drags a little bit to me, especially the King Crimson Discipline part. I'm indifferent regarding the growling - but I'm not a fan of growls anyway, so the fact that they don't bother me here is probably as good as it's gonna get for me. I know many people love the song, but I feel like it's one of the weaker tracks.
Earthrise
Nice change of the mood after the previous song, but in the end, Earthrise falls into the same category as Lapse for me. Neat song, but didn't leave too much of an impression.
Red Giant
Awesome! Love the way the drums progress basic beat throughout the song. Love the vocals and the vocal effects, love the atmosphere, just a great song overall.
Endless Knot
Okay song, but it get's some bonus points because of the instrumental breakdown. Great bass!
Bound by Gravity
Really enjoy this one, especially the vocals and the ambient, spacey atmosphere. Works really well as a last song.
I can't really rate song by song, but if I introduce three tiers, this would be my rating:
top tier: Red Giant, affinity.exe + Inititate, Bound by Gravity
middle tier: 1985, The Architect, Endless Knot
lower tier: Lapse, Earthrise
Great album!
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Right now for me:
1. The Architect
2. The Endless Knot
3. Bound By Gravity
4. .exe + Initiate
5. Red Giant
6. 1985
7. Earthrise
8. Lapse
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6. 1985
7. Earthrise
8. Lapse
You make me violently angry.
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like, just look at his signature tho
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Early rankings:
1. 1985
2. Lapse
3. The Architect
4. The Endless Knot
5. Earthrise
6. Affinity.exe + Initiate
7. Bound By Gravity
8. Red Giant
The only reason I've ranked Gravity and Giant so low is because they haven't "clicked" for me yet, a couple of more spins though and I'm sure they will sink in as well.
I'll rank the albums as well:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Aquarius
4. Visions
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6. 1985
7. Earthrise
8. Lapse
You make me violently angry.
:lol The great thing about this cd is the top songs vary so much by person. I am going to try Earthrise and 1985 on my wife and get her reaction. I believe these two songs will appeal to a lot of folks that do not normally listen to Haken.
Just a couple of items:
Haken is playing in Atlanta at he prog festival in September. It would be great if they hit some cities and played some clubs in the 500-1000 attendance range.
How does Haken sound live? Would be nice to have a cd/dvd of them live.
Of course funding plays a part in both of these items.
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Track rankings:
1. 1985
2. The Architect
3. Lapse
4. Bound By Gravity
5. Earthrise
6. The Endless Knot
7. Initiate
8. Red Giant
As for as their albums go:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Visions
4. Aquarius
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Haken is playing in Atlanta at he prog festival in September. It would be great if they hit some cities and played some clubs in the 500-1000 attendance range.
I was a bit disappointed when I looked at the ProgPower site, and saw they were sold out. It looks like the Center Stage only holds a couple of thousand people. :( I would have thought it would be bigger.
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Do Haken have a big enough following to do a headlining US tour? Honestly asking cause I'm not sure how big their fan base is here.
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Do Haken have a big enough following to do a headlining US tour? Honestly asking cause I'm not sure how big their fan base is here.
You mean like the one they did last year? :P
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Do Haken have a big enough following to do a headlining US tour? Honestly asking cause I'm not sure how big their fan base is here.
You mean like the one they did last year? :P
Umm, I don't really follow the band that closely, but looking quickly on setlist fm, do you mean the ResTOURation 2015? Because if so, I don't know if I'd consider 6 shows in the US a headlining tour...
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Well, they were headlining...
And they sounded amazing. Easily my favorite concert I've been to.
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I got to see them headline the Saturday night at RoSfest last year. Best band at the festival.
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Okay, my band can go out and book 6 headlining shows, but that doesn't equal a tour.
Alrighty though, I guess I'll rephrase: do you guys think the demand is there for Haken to be able to book a substantial US tour that covers a good portion of the country?
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Well, they were headlining...
And they sounded amazing. Easily my favorite concert I've been to.
Really? To be honest I haven't been to a concert in years that sounded anything near good. Always 20 dB too loud to sound good, so all the details are lost and all that's left is a wall of muddy noise. Concerts to me in general are a waste of time as musical experiences, when I go it's just to support the bands.
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I admit I have limited concert experiences. That being said, Haken was the quietest metal concert I've been too. I usually use ear plugs and did when I was Dream Theater and Devin Townsend. For Haken I didn't and could still hear at the end of the night, though part of me thinks that's because I was standing right up against the stage and the largest speakers were above me. Either way, sound-wise, I thought it was excellent.
The energy in the band and the venue was amazing. And Ross sounded much better than I was expecting given the live videos I saw on youtube. He's gotten so much better since he started out, and it really shows. Also, the band stuck around for like 40 minutes after the show and talked to people still in the venue and even signed things. We got a photo with Ross as well. It was a great experience.
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I'll rank the albums as well:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Aquarius
4. Visions
My lord, look, he has found the right ranking! :D
As for touring, the one they are doing in September should be bigger than the last tour. (which I believe was more than 6 shows)
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Have to say i'm glad I bought the double CD because I listen to the instrumental today and man there's lots of stuff I didn't notice during some vocal part especially during the verses. The Endless Knot for example! :metal
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Rankings are something like this for me at the moment:
1985
----
The Architect - The first and final thirds are awesome, but the middle kind of lets it down for me
affinity.exe/Initiate
The Endless Knot
----
Lapse
Bound by Gravity
----
Red Giant
Earthrise
The bottom 4 were pretty forgettable on my first few listens to the album. Thankfully, Lapse and Bound By Gravity are beginning to grow on me quite a bit - hopefully the same happens with Red Giant and Earthrise eventually. But at the moment, this is my least favourite Haken album - still great though!
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You'd get slaughtered if you said The Astonishing is better :lol
But TA is better. Okay, I have only heard Affinity once, but most of it sounded like the usual okay to pretty good Haken stuff, while much of TA is pretty great. Not even close in my book.
LOL Kev. Such a fanboy. :lol
Is that really the best you've got?
:lol :lol
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right now I'm finding this album "pretty solid" with a "ends with two great tracks" addendum, really
i think the album is generally better post-Architect, Red Giant is just alright but the other three are my favorite songs here, easily
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You'd get slaughtered if you said The Astonishing is better :lol
But TA is better. Okay, I have only heard Affinity once, but most of it sounded like the usual okay to pretty good Haken stuff, while much of TA is pretty great. Not even close in my book.
LOL Kev. Such a fanboy. :lol
Is that really the best you've got?
:lol :lol
No. The best I got would probably get me banned. :rollin
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Well, it's too bad that you can't grasp the concept of someone liking an album by one of his three favorite bands over an album by a band of which he is only a lukewarm fan.
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Haken are amazing live.
As for album rankings:
1. Affinity
2. Aquarius
3. The Mountain
4. Visions
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A word from a new fan - I love Aquarius, think The Mountain is also very good, but Affinity doesn't really do a whole lot for me. Not the best time to become a Haken fan, I guess. I don't find it melodically convincing enough, and some of the modern, electronic influences really aren't my cup of tea. Initiate and Earthrise are great, though, and the epic is fine, although a far cry from tracks like Falling back to Earth, Nocturnal conspiracy and Celestial elixir.
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I'll rank the albums as well:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Aquarius
4. Visions
My lord, look, he has found the right ranking! :D
;D
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Interesting, my ranking would be:
1. Visions
2. Affinity
3. The Mountain
4. Aquarius
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8. Red Giant
8. Red Giant
Red Giant is just alright
You guys are killing me. :-[
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I think I'd rank the songs like this:
1. The Architect
2. Red Giant
3. 1985
5. The Endless Knot
5. Bound By Gravity
6. Earthrise
7. Initiate
8. Lapse
I am really sure about 1,2 and 8. The others are at about the same (amazing) level for me.
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Man I just gonna say it, the instrumental version of The Endless Knot is amazing. I listened to it in my car yesterday and was blown away by the synths and ambient stuff in background. You just hear everything more clearly because with vocals your ears are instantly drawn to it but without it's much easier to hear what's beneath.
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That's the sad truth of brickwalled audio production. Rather than layering sounds atop each other everything is compressed into a tight dynamic space.
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That's the sad truth of brickwalled audio production. Rather than layering sounds atop each other everything is compressed into a tight dynamic space.
Things are definitely smooshed, but the mix isn't magically un-layered just because of it. I can hear all the layers just fine.
That said, it'd be even better if it got an SW-style "anti-loudness" master put out on HDtracks or whatever.
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Well, it's too bad that you can't grasp the concept of someone liking an album by one of his three favorite bands over an album by a band of which he is only a lukewarm fan.
I grasp it just fine Kev. No need to get all butt hurt when I was just messing with you. However, you did come here and say Affinity doesn't even come close to TA after only 1 listen. What did you expect? Is that really the best you got? :lol :lol
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I've only owned The Mountain a month (and think it's incredibly good) and got Affinity on release day. Loving this band so much. Incredibly good, complex and tasteful. So many feels and styles merged so smoothly.
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Does anyone else get an Asia feel in the song 1985?
Now I wish that I had held off and gotten the actual with the lyrics. I may still spring for it on ebay at 14.99.
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I get a Toto vibe from the song
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Marillion or Genesis for me.
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I ordered the sample cd from Marillion's web site. Hopefully I will like them. Loving Earthrise. Cannot get the lyrics out of my head.
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I get a Toto vibe from the song
I get a "We Built This City" vibe, which is probably why it is called 1985. :P
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I get a Toto vibe from the song
I get a "We Built This City" vibe, which is probably why it is called 1985. :P
Hey sour puss. :lol
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I ordered the sample cd from Marillion's web site. Hopefully I will like them. Loving Earthrise. Cannot get the lyrics out of my head.
Make sure you listen to "Ocean Cloud" (I doubt it's on that CD). Just... make sure you do. Now, if possible.
"Earthrise" and "Red Giant" are still destroying for me, but now "Lapse" and... the rest of the non-epics :lol are up to the same level. This is just a complete statement without any filler, failed ideas, or wastes of time. Even "affinity.exe" is fantastic. Vinyl is getting my purchase next BurningShed order time (likely with Night by Gazpacho) – they carry it on clear, which is far better than the orange US variant.
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Yeah. This is easily the best Haken album by a long shot. Album of the year so far. :metal
1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Restoration
4. Aquarius
5. Visions
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First listen, finally. I always want my first listen to an album I've been anticipating to be perfect, quiet setting, no distractions, etc... If I can't do it right away when I get the CD, I wait.
Anyway, I'm enjoying it so far. I'm almost done with The Architect, so far it sounds like a very energetic album, with some nice calmer moments. 1985 is definitely the most progressive song on first listen, sticks right out. The rest I'll have to listen a few more times to give any real comments other than "cool" or "awesome".
Yea I hear that Opeth influence in The Architect, sounds like the opening segment of The Drapery Falls.
The overall 80s influence is mixed with 90s/2000s prog metal nicely, with a 2010s djent and modern rock sound twist, and I hear some Frank Zappa influence in there as well; it is something quite unique as far as I know, and it's pulled off nicely.
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right now i'm at
1. The Mountain
2. Aquarius
3. Affinity
4. Visions
5. Restoration
but this could change. maybe it'll grow enough on me to overtake Aquarius, but I really doubt it'll overtake The Mountain, ever
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A video for Earthrise is here!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQ8KqJJJJhk&feature=youtu.be
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I really love the video till 0:40, I can't take Ross seriously here :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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A video for Earthrise is here!
... and it's hilarious! :rollin I know this is supposed to be a 'fun' song and all, but this looks a bit too foolish to me. :lol
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Holy fuck Ross just cracks me up everytime he's on the screen in that video. :rollin
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Ross is just ridiculous! :lol Am I the only one who thinks that his voice doesn't match his face?
Going back to the album, this might be AOTY for me which is something I did not expect after how bummed I was by The Mountain.
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I watched only the first minute because I don't want too much spoilers until I get the CD and hahahaha Ross. :rollin
In other news, been in the record store today and they told me they've sold out all the album copies already and that I should get back next Friday to get it. Either it's really popular here in Russia or they've ordered like two copies of Affinity or something.
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Or, perhaps, there, the album must order you? :D
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:facepalm: :lol
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affinity.exe makes Initiate so much more powerful.
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Or, perhaps, there, the album must order you? :D
:lol
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Ross went from Cockroach King to donut king. Packed on a few pounds. :omg:
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Ross went from Cockroach King to donut king. Packed on a few pounds. :omg:
I noticed that in their first video. I guess having some stability means you can eat regularly.
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Ross went from Cockroach King to donut king. Packed on a few pounds. :omg:
Makes sense. Cockroaches are much healthier for you.
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Ross went from Cockroach King to donut king. Packed on a few pounds. :omg:
Makes sense. Cockroaches are much healthier for you.
They make terrible songs though.
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Hey now. There is no need for that kind of talk.
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Hey now. There is no need for that kind of talk.
Are you asking us to move along?
(https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11121/111215098/4973517-wiggum_donut_crop.jpeg)
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You go to your room Ralfie.
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In fairness to Ross, I think it almost always looks a little weird in music videos when singers are singing facing the camera but they aren't holding or standing in front of a microphone. He doesn't look as weird in the Initiate video, and I think a big part of that is that they gave him a microphone in that one.
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Ah 425, people have a need to take others in better positions then themselves down. He could care less about these kind of comments.
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Oh, I'm sure. I'm just pointing out what I think is the reason why he looks weird in that video. My feeling is, if you're making a music video, and you have a singer who does not play an instrument, you need to either give him a mic or have him act. Or have him be Tommy Karevik, because he can pull it off.
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Yup. It's like, "What do I do with my hands"?
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My Vinyl pre-order finally came today. I'm looking forward to playing it tomorrow!
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Affinity is not doing nearly as much to me as I had hoped.
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Oh, I'm sure. I'm just pointing out what I think is the reason why he looks weird in that video. My feeling is, if you're making a music video, and you have a singer who does not play an instrument, you need to either give him a mic or have him act. Or have him be Tommy Karevik, because he can pull it off.
For sure, but then not having a mic adds to the cheesy, 80s vibe of the whole video. I don't know if that's what they were going for. :lol
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Oh, I'm sure. I'm just pointing out what I think is the reason why he looks weird in that video. My feeling is, if you're making a music video, and you have a singer who does not play an instrument, you need to either give him a mic or have him act. Or have him be Tommy Karevik, because he can pull it off.
For sure, but then not having a mic adds to the cheesy, 80s vibe of the whole video. I don't know if that's what they were going for. :lol
I think that's what they were going for. Loving this album.
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I only get the 80s vibe from the song 1985. In other songs I get a much more contemporary feeling. Am I missing something?
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I only get the 80s vibe from the song 1985. In other songs I get a much more contemporary feeling. Am I missing something?
I don't think so, a lot of the influences like djent and electronic (wub wub wub) give me a more contemporary feeling too. Only some of the synthesizer stuff in 1985 has a really 80s vibe I think
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I only get the 80s vibe from the song 1985. In other songs I get a much more contemporary feeling. Am I missing something?
There are some 80's prog moments, particularly some 80's King Crimson feels here and there.
-Marc.
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Affinity is not doing nearly as much to me as I had hoped.
To be honest, even for me.
If I were a reviewer I would give not less than a 9\10, there's not even a moment with unoriginal ideas in the whole album. But I don't want to listen to it, I prefer listening to other recent discoveries of this year as the albums of bands like The Mercury Tree, British Theatre, Ihsahn and Black Peaks at the moment.
Maybe I don't like much the more modern sound they had introduced with Restoration.
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I only get the 80s vibe from the song 1985. In other songs I get a much more contemporary feeling. Am I missing something?
Also the few measures before the first verse in The Architect.
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If you consider the 80s King Crimson influences on the album as "80s vibes" then it's on more than 1985.
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There are some King Crimson inspired moments, the part of The Architect that leads into the growling sounds a lot like something from Discipline. In addition, and I know that this might sound weird, the 80's feel kind of bleeds into the other songs for me, especially the ones with the more spacey feel (Red Giant and Bound by Gravity).
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Affinity is not doing nearly as much to me as I had hoped.
To be honest, even for me.
If I were a reviewer I would give not less than a 9\10, there's not even a moment with unoriginal ideas in the whole album. But I don't want to listen to it, I prefer listening to other recent discoveries of this year as the albums of bands like The Mercury Tree, British Theatre, Ihsahn and Black Peaks at the moment.
Maybe I don't like much the more modern sound they had introduced with Restoration.
Exactly. The album is good, I can not deny that, but I don't really feel any strong urge to listen to this record after having heard it only 3 times. I didn't like Restoration (in fact, I believe it's by far their weakest release), but I don't necessarily hear a continuation of that particular style on this record. I really, really want to like Affinity and enjoy it as much as I enjoyed the older Haken records, but this could very well a case of me having grown out of or tired with this style of progressive metal. Not to sound bitter or anything, but I have known Haken for 6 years already - the 'newness'-factor has long since worn off. That said, I can definitely hear that it's freaking awesome. I'm actually rather sad that I can't enjoy this music as much as I used to. Perhaps in half a year's time when I listen to it again I can find joy in listening, but for now it doesn't do a lot to me.
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There are some King Crimson inspired moments, the part of The Architect that leads into the growling sounds a lot like something from Discipline. In addition, and I know that this might sound weird, the 80's feel kind of bleeds into the other songs for me, especially the ones with the more spacey feel (Red Giant and Bound by Gravity).
1985 is the song where the whole band goes 80s for almost 10 minutes, but the 80s keyboard patches are all over the album. Some of the sounds are a bit buried and easier to spot on the instrumental version.
Some drum sounds on Endless Knot are also very 80s, as are some guitar tones in Earthrise the vocal delivery in the verses. There's nuggets to be discovered everywhere.
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I call that keyboard melody in 1985(around 5:46) the Rocky riff :P
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I call that keyboard melody in 1985(around 5:46) the Rocky riff :P
Has anyone posted that video here yet? :lol
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I think so :lol
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I swear I didn't see it :lol watching it now
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There's a bit o cheese in there but it's oh so fucking good.
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"1985" is just so amazing to me because, as a child, I grew up with the 1986 Transformers animated film, which had some of the best OSTs ever, composed by Vince DiCola, and "1985" is pretty much a love-letter to him and his work on the TF movie, and on Rocky IV. Great stuff, and it tickles that 80's-nostalgia part of my musical heart.
-Marc.
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I don't have a timestamp...but one of the keyboard solos it TOTALLY a patch from The Final Countdown.
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I don't have a timestamp...but one of the keyboard solos it TOTALLY a patch from The Final Countdown.
Maybe you could give us a timestamp from before the solo and make it a literal countdown. :hat
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It's a brass-like synth lead. It was fairly common in the 80s!
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It's a brass-like synth lead. It was fairly common in the 80s!
Rocky riff in 1985
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It's a brass-like synth lead. It was fairly common in the 80s!
Rocky riff in 1985
That's the stuff.
I friggin' love 1985, it just keeps growing on me.
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Here is hoping that Haken travels to some US cities close to Atlanta after the upcoming prog festival. We have plenty of places in the under 1K attendance range in Nashville. It would be awesome to see these guys play a full set in a more intimate setting.
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Initiate is a weird track for me. I thoroughly enjoy every track on the album, though some more than others. By itself, Initiate is a Middle ranking track imom but when I pair it with Affinity.exe, it's close to being my favorite. Somehow it becomes so much more impactful. Absolutely epic when I listen to it as the album opener rather than just a track.
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To my aggravation, they were only selling the 2-CD at the record store, so... yeah. Bought that one.
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To my aggravation, they were only selling the 2-CD at the record store, so... yeah. Bought that one.
But...but...the Media Book is so gorgeous!
-Marc.
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To my aggravation, they were only selling the 2-CD at the record store, so... yeah. Bought that one.
That's the one you want. No aggravation required. :biggrin:
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I wonder if Dream Theater knows they've been dethroned by a cheeky London prog band
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I wonder if Dream Theater knows they've been dethroned by a cheeky London prog band :lol
this labum rules
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I tried editing and I couldn't do it
i am sorry
cordially,
bacong
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Well, considering Jordan regularly praises them, has played with them, and is having Diego teach at his keyboard workshop, I'd say they are aware of the competition. :p
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I wonder if Dream Theater knows they've been dethroned by a cheeky London prog band :lol
this labum rules
durnk?
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I wouldn't say they've been dethroned, personally. DT most recently played at Radio City (capacity 6,105) in NYC, while Haken most recently played at The Webster Underground (1,200 capacity) in NYC. Maybe in 5-10 years time that could be the case.
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I honestly don't expect Haken to ever dethrone DT in that sense. But in terms of who makes the best music, yeah Haken all the fucking way.
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I wouldn't say they've been dethroned, personally. DT most recently played at Radio City (capacity 6,105) in NYC, while Haken most recently played at The Webster Underground (1,200 capacity) in NYC. Maybe in 5-10 years time that could be the case.
Unfortunately, I don't see this happening anywhere in the near or far future. And this is not a diss at Haken, and I do hope they make it big...But it seems like the big bands are going away (except for the Arena bands like Journey, Poison, Kiss, etc..). I think DT might be one of the last "big bands" out there...Seems like the trend for bands not (that are not big) is playing in 1k - 3k venues with the 6k size venue here and there or as a one time gig.
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I honestly don't expect Haken to ever dethrone DT in that sense. But in terms of who makes the best music, yeah Haken all the fucking way.
And Leprous, Riverside, BTBAM, and others have taken DT's crown long time ago imo.
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Steven Wilson dethroned DT in the prog world IMO.
Haken might dethrone SW, Haken are still a young band.
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Steven Wilson dethroned DT in the prog world IMO.
This.
Haken might dethrone SW, Haken are still a young band.
And a giraffe might fly out of my left ear tomorrow...
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:lol
Oh Kev and everyone else.
Hey, I absolutely love the new Haken album. They need to have 20 yea Rd s under their belt moving into 2000 to 3000 seat arenas. I love what they are doing now.
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I dunno, man. Haken's first 4 albums +1 EP are probably even better over all than DT's first 4 +1 EP. And if not, it's pretty close.
That said, Haken is in no way ever going to be as big as DT is. That just isn't happening unless they have a mainstream hit like DT.
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So one song them? Lol
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I dunno, man. Haken's first 4 albums +1 EP are probably even better over all than DT's first 4 +1 EP. And if not, it's pretty close.
That said, Haken is in no way ever going to be as big as DT is. That just isn't happening unless they have a mainstream hit like DT.
As good as Haken's first 4 albums are, none are as progressive, innovative, or just plain as good as I&W, Awake, or ACOS.
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I'm not even sure Haken's 4 studio albums are as good as DT's 4 least best albums. Some will laugh, but that is how I see it. And remember, I think Haken is a solid band with a handful of really good tunes; I do not genuflect to them like others do.
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I'm not even sure Haken's 4 studio albums are as good as DT's 4 least best albums. Some will laugh, but that is how I see it. And remember, I think Haken is a solid band with a handful of really good tunes; I do not genuflect to them like others do.
^This.
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That's just an outrageous statement. The Mountain and Affinity aren't as good as Systematic Chaos? BC&SL? DT? WDADU???
That makes sense to me if you don't like Haken, but...I can't comprehend someone liking both bands and thinking that.
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Collectively. Haken's 4 studio albums taken as a whole are not as good as DT's least best 4 as a whole. At least albums like SC and BC&SL are mostly good, with only a few meh songs on the two combined. I think there are two songs from the first two Haken albums that I have any use for, maybe three.
Oh, and DT12 a) isn't one of DT's least best 4, and b) is much better than any album Haken has done to date.
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This is how they stack up for me:
If I had to rank Haken albums with DT albums in between it'd be like this:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. SFAM
4. I&W
5. SDOIT
6. Visions
7. Awake
8. ADTOE
9. Aquarius
Some of these are very and hard to rank, but I think it's close enough. In all reality, right now I feel like Affinity should be at the top of the list, but I'll admit I'm still in the honeymoon phase with it. :lol
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DT12 is significantly less inspired than any Haken album
that being said iirc only one haken album made my top 50, while three DT albums made it, Awake up at like #4 or something
it doesn't help that i've been moving away from prog metal a bit lately and affinity isn't doing as much for me as it probably should be, since i can recognize it's pretty great while also not really falling in love with it like the mountain
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It's a bit unfair to compare DT12 to the first four albums from a new, younger band.
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I agree. DT12 sounds like a seasoned effort by a veteran band firing on all cylinders, while even the new Haken still sounds like a band still trying to find its way. The talent is there; we'll see if they can get better as time goes on. :)
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>seasoned effort
>firing on all cylinders
what
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DT12 is significantly less inspired than any Haken album
Agreed. I'm not even a fan of Haken but Aquarius and Visions at least are miles ahead of DT12 and an handful of DT albums.
Also, DT firing on all cylinders would be SFAM for me, definitely not DT12.
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I love Haken's output thus far, but I don't think I could ever really say that they've had a masterful work on the level of I&W or SFAM, at least not yet.
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I love Haken's output thus far, but I don't think I could ever really say that they've had a masterful work on the level of I&W or SFAM, at least not yet.
Also agree with this.
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The Mountain comes close, but it is way too young to be even considered next to those albums. Honestly comparing DT to Haken in general seems a bit silly to me. There is room for both and Haken clearly wouldn't exist without DT.
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I'm not even sure Haken's 4 studio albums are as good as DT's 4 least best albums. Some will laugh, but that is how I see it. And remember, I think Haken is a solid band with a handful of really good tunes; I do not genuflect to them like others do.
I like any of Haken's albums over DT12 or The Astonishing, easily.
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SDOIT
SFAM
I&W
Awake
The Mountain
Visions
ADTOE
Affinity
8vm
(ACOS)
BC&SL
(Restoration EP)
TOT
Aquarius
FII
SC
WD&DU
The Astonishing
DT12
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Like I said earlier, everything Haken have made I prefer over DT. Images and Words and SDOIT are on par with any Haken album besides The Mountain for me, though.
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I'd say The Mountain is at the same level as I&W and SFAM, and the other 3 albums might be at the same level as SDOIT, Awake, ToT, TA, ADToE... Haken still has no low-tier album, DT has some of them.
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Hmm, bit weird to rank all the DT & Haken albums as there's no particular connection between the two. I prefer Haken, personally, because their quirkier and more varied style (harmonically, sonically) sits more comfortably with my tastes than DT's which is more straightforward, but plenty of people will be the other way round. The two bands have quite a different approach, really.
But here goes anyway.
1.
The Mountain
Affinity
2.
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
3.
Visions
Restoration
Images & Words
A Dramatic Turn of Events
4.
Aquarius
Awake
A Change of Seasons
Falling Into Infinity
Black Clouds & Silver Linings
The Astonishing
5.
Haken demo
Scenes from a Memory
Train of Thought
Octavarium
Systematic Chaos
Dream Theater
6.
When Dream and Day Unite
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Scenes from a memory
Images and words
Awake
A Dramatic turn of events
The Astonishing
Six degrees of inner turbulence
Systematic chaos
Aquarius
Black clouds & silver linings
Train of thought
The Mountain
Octavarium
Dream Theater
When dream and day unite
Visions
Affinity
Falling into infinity
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I like the new album, but vocals-wise it sounds a lot like the last Anathema albums to me....
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Honestly comparing DT to Haken in general seems a bit silly to me. There is room for both and Haken clearly wouldn't exist without DT.
This. I don't get the obsession with them 'dethroning' DT. If we're talking objectively (sales, popularity, innovation etc.), they won't even touch them.
>seasoned effort
>firing on all cylinders
what
IMO DT12 is this.
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???
Why has this thread turned into a DT vs Haken thread?
.. It's clearly The Mountain>Aquarius>Affinity>DT12>Visions
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I'm not even sure how I rank Haken's albums by themselves, let alone throwing in DT's as well :lol
What Haken have done with their first 4 albums and EP though, is made a very high quality and consistent collection of music - but DT's first 4/EP have plenty of low points. On the other hand, I can't see Haken ever making anything close to I&W. Also, even on most of their weaker albums, DT have this knack of managing to write one or two incredible tracks. As much as I love Haken, DT's best individual tracks are almost untouchable to me and that's part of why they've lasted so long I think. If Haken's consistency starts to drop, it might be a struggle to match that longevity that DT has.
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This discussion again? Come on
Anyways, I can't believe how much I'm enjoying this album. I thought it was the retro vibe that did it for me but I've been paying a lot more attention to it lately and I'm finding so many King Crimson moments which I love so much.
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>seasoned effort
>firing on all cylinders
what
I can repeat it for you:
DT12 sounds like a seasoned effort by a veteran band firing on all cylinders.
That better? :biggrin:
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It's all in good fun and completely subjective! I'm not exactly trying to pit them against each other. It's not like we can't listen to both after all. :P
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Honestly comparing DT to Haken in general seems a bit silly to me. There is room for both and Haken clearly wouldn't exist without DT.
This. I don't get the obsession with them 'dethroning' DT. If we're talking objectively (sales, popularity, innovation etc.), they won't even touch them.
Bingo. Everything else in the "dethroning" (whatever the hell that means) debate comes down to personal taste.
Haken's 4 studio albums taken as a whole are not as good as DT's least best 4 as a whole.
I think I'd agree with that. And that's not a knock on Haken, I think they are a really good band, I'm a little surprised at the level of responses in this thread ranking Haken albums above I&W, SDOIT, SFAM, etc... In my book that's not even close. But opinions...
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I still love Visions and The Mountain more but Affinity is one of the best albums of the year so far. I can't say I love all songs but every is at least good.
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SDOIT
SFAM
Images
Awake
ToT
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Octavarium
ADTOE
I would probably put Aquarius and Visions just below ToT and together with Octavarium and ADTOE.
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I'm always astounded (astonished? :neverusethis:) by how quickly people are able to rank new releases. I'm not at a place where I feel comfortable ranking either The Astonishing or Affinity in the respective bands' discographies. I mean, Affinity is an album I've known for like three weeks up against albums I've known for years? And The Astonishing is just ridiculously long.
But without those two involved, I'd probably do this.
- Images and Words
- The Mountain
- A Dramatic Turn of Events
- Scenes from a Memory
- Black Clouds & Silver Linings
- Dream Theater
- Aquarius
- Train of Thought
- Awake
- Octavarium
- Falling Into Infinity
- Visions
- Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
- Systematic Chaos
- When Dream and Day Unite
But my DT rankings are constantly shifting and changing, so who knows. Pretty certain about #1-4 on this list, but that's about it.
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I already know I can rank affinity above visions but not other haken albums :P
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I'm pretty sure that it doesn't beat The Mountain. Beyond that, I couldn't tell you.
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Does anyone else get a slight Mars Volta vibe from the chorus of Lapse, or is that just me?
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What's up with everyone liking The Mountain so much? It's by far my least favorite Haken record.
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because it's the best by far :corn
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What's up with everyone liking The Mountain so much? It's by far my least favorite Haken record.
Are you actually surprised though? It's not like everyone hated it and all of a sudden it's the best Haken album, it's left that impression on me since the very first listen.
:corn
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What's up with everyone liking The Mountain so much? It's by far my least favorite Haken record.
Because people love the Cockroach. I mean it's the worst Haken song ever, but people love it here.
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What's up with everyone liking The Mountain so much? It's by far my least favorite Haken record.
I'm with you here, I know there's lots of people that love it but I think it's their worst effort to date.
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worst haken song is the minds eye tbh which is still a pretty solid song so
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What's up with everyone liking The Mountain so much? It's by far my least favorite Haken record.
Because people love the Cockroach. I mean it's the worst Haken song ever, but people love it here.
I SYMPATHIIIIIIZE, WITH A COCKROACH,
AND A COCKROACH!
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(https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/forumavatars/avatar_10133_1458463866.jpeg)
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What's up with everyone liking The Mountain so much? It's by far my least favorite Haken record.
Because people love the Cockroach. I mean it's the worst Haken song ever, but people love it here.
How can Cockroach King be the worst Haken song ever :omg: :omg: :omg:
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worst haken song is the minds eye tbh which is still a pretty solid song so
The Mind's Eye isn't even the worst song on Visions imo.
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When I think of The Mind's Eye in the context of the TME/Portals/Shapeshifter trilogy, it becomes a lot stronger (though it's good on its own too, even though the track doesn't have a proper standalone ending).
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actually I forgot about restoration tbh but I'd still take darkest light over minds eye slightly
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worst haken song is the minds eye tbh which is still a pretty solid song so
:whatisthisidonteven:
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Mind's Eye gets a bad rap. It's terribly underrated.
My least favorite Haken song is Nocturnal Conspiracy. It's just so boring to me, but apparently tons of people like it.
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While The Mountain isn't my favorite Haken album (it's my #3), I do consider it the album where they truly defined themselves. The two albums before it, while great, sounded a bit like they were still developing their sound.
And I think Cockroach King is really cool, but it's not my favorite on the album. It's somewhere in the middle for me.
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What's up with everyone liking The Mountain so much? It's by far my least favorite Haken record.
Because people love the Cockroach. I mean it's the worst Haken song ever, but people love it here.
How can Cockroach King be the worst Haken song ever :omg: :omg: :omg:
The video of cockroach with the muppets is funny
The mountain rules!
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I won't bag on Cockroach King anymore, since I've stated my dislike for it more than enough :p, but I will say that aside from that song, The Mountain is consistently very good. Most of the Haken songs I like are from it.
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Cockroach King is delightfully quirky in a way that no other Haken song really is. I wouldn't want an album full of songs like that, but I think it's perfect for what it is.
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And I think Cockroach King is really cool, but it's not my favorite on the album. It's somewhere in the middle for me.
Ditto for me.
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Cockroach King is delightfully quirky in a way that no other Haken song really is. I wouldn't want on album full of songs like that, but I think it's perfect for what it is.
exactly
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Nah. I just can't stand listening to it. Everything from the instruments to the vocals just puts me off.
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DT12 is one album I regret buying, but it ended with my DT fanboyism so it was worth it I guess? Oh, back to Haken...
The Mountain is their best album and they'll never surpass it. And I'm fine with that :smiley:
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I don't get the "I regret" stuff. DT12 is not bad. It's average. I Olympic regret terrible albums. It's not at that bad level.
On the Haken front, I just love the last two albums a ton.
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I don't get the "I regret" stuff. DT12 is not bad. It's average. I Olympic regret terrible albums. It's not at that bad level.
This. Sometimes I get the feeling on this forum that some people actively want to dislike DT. It's bizarre. Every time Haken does something there has to be a discussion on how much better than DT they are. I don't know why it matters.
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I don't get the "I regret" stuff. DT12 is not bad. It's average. I Olympic regret terrible albums. It's not at that bad level.
This. Sometimes I get the feeling on this forum that some people actively want to dislike DT. It's bizarre. Every time Haken does something there has to be a discussion on how much better than DT they are. I don't know why it matters.
Because DT12 is bad, not average. :hat
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i'd like DT more nowadays if they were putting out better music :corn
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Please. It's not that bad. People exaggerate to make a point.
Folks. I have really enjoyed the last 2 Haken albums more than DT. That doesn't lessen my love for DT. It's not race, ranking or a list. It's my love for music. Sometimes bands kill it. Sometimes they miss the mark.
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Haken lacks something DT had very early on: Their huge MTV exposure/huge brand endorsement and recognition that came to them during the I&W tour.
I can't see any 'prog metal' band being bigger than DT in the near future for that very simple reason. I love Haken with all my heart and I do think that the future of prog lies with them, but I can't see them playing Madison Square Garden ever, you know? They're probably gonna stay as the new poster boys of prog, playing awesome shows to 1000 peeps per night, but I can't imagine them going further (as DT did back in their time). Hope I'm wrong, tho. These guys deserve the best.
Also, a big lol and facepalm at the people comparing The Astonishing and Affinity.
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DT is a fluke. Even they werent able to replicate the success they had with PMU. But they more or less defined a genre, which very few can say.
One thing to also keep in mind is that DT of the early 90s had a lot traits that were fashionable in Metal at the time. I don't think it's a coincidence that glam metal gets discussed as frequently as it does by some of the older members here. If a Prog metal band was to hit DT level success again, it'd have to be a band that embraces trendy sounds.
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Haken lacks something DT had very early on: Their huge MTV exposure/huge brand endorsement and recognition that came to them during the I&W tour.
I can't see any 'prog metal' band being bigger than DT in the near future for that very simple reason. I love Haken with all my heart and I do think that the future of prog lies with them, but I can't see them playing Madison Square Garden ever, you know? They're probably gonna stay as the new poster boys of prog, playing awesome shows to 1000 peeps per night, but I can't imagine them going further (as DT did back in their time). Hope I'm wrong, tho. These guys deserve the best.
Also, a big lol and facepalm at the people comparing The Astonishing and Affinity.
Anen. I'm just happy I got to see them live,,
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What's up with everyone liking The Mountain so much? It's by far my least favorite Haken record.
Because people love the Cockroach. I mean it's the worst Haken song ever, but people love it here.
Cockroach King has very little to do with why I love The Mountain. It's one of my less favorite of the main songs on there—still very, very good, but just not in my list of favorites. The album is just impressive all the way through. Each and every song is fantastic. It's really just one of those that's fantastic top to bottom. I know it has its big fans, but I don't get why you would think that Cockroach King is THE reason people like The Mountain? ???
worst haken song is the minds eye tbh which is still a pretty solid song so
The Mind's Eye is pretty cool though. I'd rate it ahead of Insomnia. Which I guess is the worst Haken song? I don't know. Or Streams. Or Darkest Light. Or something from Affinity, idk. But either way, "worst Haken song" is like "least beautiful Miss Universe contestant."
I don't get the "I regret" stuff. DT12 is not bad. It's average. I Olympic regret terrible albums. It's not at that bad level.
This. Sometimes I get the feeling on this forum that some people actively want to dislike DT. It's bizarre. Every time Haken does something there has to be a discussion on how much better than DT they are. I don't know why it matters.
Because DT12 is bad, not average. :hat
DT12 is, in fact, neither bad nor average. It's actually really good.
Mosh, I get that sense sometimes, too. Then again, I think there's a general trend among music fans to describe a band's early material as better than it is and their later material as worse than it is, and I think that may play into how DT12 and TA get talked about.
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Mosh, I get that sense sometimes, too. Then again, I think there's a general trend among music fans to describe a band's early material as better than it is and their later material as worse than it is, and I think that may play into how DT12 and TA get talked about.
For sure. DT is definitely in that stage of their career where there's always going to be naysayers for the new stuff, it just seems weird to me that a forum dedicated to the band has such a vocal (albeit small) segment of posters who seem almost proud of themselves for not liking DT anymore.
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Sometimes I get the feeling on this forum that some people actively want to dislike DT. It's bizarre. Every time Haken does something there has to be a discussion on how much better than DT they are. I don't know why it matters.
I don't get it either. It's like some Haken fans can't just enjoy their music; they have to make it a contest. It's weird.
Also, a big lol and facepalm at the people comparing The Astonishing and Affinity.
Agreed. The Astonishing is so much better that it is definitely LOL-worthy to compare Affinity to it.
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I don't get the "I regret" stuff. DT12 is not bad. It's average. I Olympic regret terrible albums. It's not at that bad level.
Exactly that, I don't want average albums sitting on my shelves accumulating dust because I never play them - I haven't listened to DT12 in almost 2 years now.
And I still love some DT records, like Six Degrees and Awake :metal I just think after the former they went downhill.
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I most definetely regret buying DT12. Especially since I bought the damn deluxe super edition.
That doesn't mean that I can't enjoy their music just because I'm a Haken fan though. There are still plenty of DT albums that I think are great. Just not the last few.
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i was bored, and
(https://s32.postimg.org/bapus8o1x/affinity.png)
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Sometimes I get the feeling on this forum that some people actively want to dislike DT. It's bizarre. Every time Haken does something there has to be a discussion on how much better than DT they are. I don't know why it matters.
I don't get it either. It's like some Haken fans can't just enjoy their music; they have to make it a contest. It's weird.
I don't think it really has anything to with Haken. Some people are just down on the recent output from the biggest prog bands (DT, Opeth, etc.), and Haken are one of the most popular among the currently active bands and so are the natural place to turn.
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I think the worst Haken song is probably somewhere between The Point of No Return and Darkest Light.
That being said, I think Haken has not a single bad song. And I think they're never going to reach DT's levels of mainstream because they don't have any media support at all, but they are very talented and their music is just pure awesomeness.
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Right now i'm into Haken more than DT because they have a more refreshing sound. I've listened to DT for almost 20 years and Haken only 3-4 years so that says something.
We're on a DT forum so of course the main attraction will always be compared to other prog metal acts, that's just how it is and has always been.
When it comes to DT vs Haken and what everyone likes about their respective music is all about taste which is an opinion not a fact and highly subjective to you.
When it comes to Hakens popularity compared to DT one has to remember that DT is THE biggest prog metal band in the world and that's a fact not an opinion based on the amount of fans attending their shows and record sales. I don't think it's possible for any prog metal band to dethroned them because DT basically wrote the history for prog metal so the amount of respect for DTs legacy across the prog metal community is massive. Even though Haken is popular on this forum keep in mind that this forum is only a tiny speck in the ocean of DT fans across the world.
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Even though Haken is popular on this forum keep in mind that this forum is only a tiny speck in the ocean of DT fans across the world.
It's really not limited to this forum; Haken are really popular across the prog community. The big difference though is that they're not really known at all outside the prog community (and parts of the metal one). That's why DT are so successful - they have a much broader reach, despite their technical prowess.
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I know it has its big fans, but I don't get why you would think that Cockroach King is THE reason people like The Mountain? ???
DT12 is, in fact, neither bad nor average. It's actually really good.
Mosh, I get that sense sometimes, too. Then again, I think there's a general trend among music fans to describe a band's early material as better than it is and their later material as worse than it is, and I think that may play into how DT12 and TA get talked about.
It was a joke, calm down. :lol
It is bad. Very. To me.
I don't even like the early material that much. I prefer the SDOIT - Octavarium run.
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Even though Haken is popular on this forum keep in mind that this forum is only a tiny speck in the ocean of DT fans across the world.
I agree, it would be hard for Haken to reach a mainstream audience like DT did in the early 90s, but I see Haken's name here and there now. They definitely have a fan base at Prog Archives. I've even seen their name more than once on Phish forums of all places.
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It was a joke, calm down. :lol
I figured it might be a joke, but as it was the first answer given to a serious question, I thought I'd push back against it regardless. I don't see why it's so bad of me to do that.
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I'm not even sure Haken's 4 studio albums are as good as DT's 4 least best albums. Some will laugh, but that is how I see it. And remember, I think Haken is a solid band with a handful of really good tunes; I do not genuflect to them like others do.
You're right about one thing. It is laughable. :lol :lol
Sometimes I get the feeling on this forum that some people actively want to dislike DT. It's bizarre. Every time Haken does something there has to be a discussion on how much better than DT they are. I don't know why it matters.
I don't get it either. It's like some Haken fans can't just enjoy their music; they have to make it a contest. It's weird.
Also, a big lol and facepalm at the people comparing The Astonishing and Affinity.
Agreed. The Astonishing is so much better that it is definitely LOL-worthy to compare Affinity to it.
Do you not realize that saying TA is better than Affinity is comparing and competitive? :rollin
At least the Haken fans don't go into the DT forum and say Affinity is better than TA.
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At least the Haken fans don't go into the DT forum and say Affinity is better than TA.
Not sure if you are serious or not.... If you are serious, maybe you want to read this thread, haha
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Affinity is a serious album. Astonishing isn't something I can take seriously. I take it about as seriously as I do the CD with various Smurfs songs I had when I was little. Or like, the soundtrack to a cartoon disney movie. It's fun, and funny at times, but not something I would ever consider even in the same category as Affinity.
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I've been listening to Affinity non-stop since the release date. It's been a while since an album has caused such an impact...There's only a few: DT- Images, Porcupine Tree - In Absentia, Katatonia - Night is the New Day, among others...I'm probably one of the few that thinks this but for me The Architect is probably one of the weaker songs in the album. Love the chrous though.
My favorites so far are 1985, Endless Knot and Bound by Gravity.
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Don't you think that's a little strong BlackInk? Equating TA to the Smurfs? :lol
That's pushing it. It's a play and some don't like the format. I get it but Jesus. The SMURFS?!?! :lol
I've been listening to Affinity non-stop since the release date.
As have I.
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Okay fine, not as non-serious as that, but definetely the same type of serious. Like, it's a story for kids. That's fine I guess, but it's just not for me.
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I'm probably one of the few that thinks this but for me The Architect is probably one of the weaker songs in the album. Love the chrous though.
Agreed. I'd probably rank it at the bottom to be honest. But it's still great. :lol
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The Architect's ending is awesome. It has definitely grown since the first time I listened to the album, but it's not still on a 1985 league.
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Okay fine, not as non-serious as that, but definetely the same type of serious. Like, it's a story for kids. That's fine I guess, but it's just not for me.
I think that's my biggest problem with TA, the story is VERY amateur. I appreciate the scope of what they were trying to do but it didn't pay off in my opinion. I love both bands but at this point feel like I'm listening to TA out of duty to a band I have supported and loved for a long time. Whereas I'm listening to Haken a lot because I want to, and can't stop :biggrin:
You can't compare and DT are obviously always going to be bigger, they came from a time where there wasn't really any competition for the prog metal crown. Haken are great but this is a totally different time in music and I can't ever see them selling like DT unfortunately (although I would love them to).
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The Architect's ending is awesome. It has definitely grown since the first time I listened to the album, but it's not still on a 1985 league.
The opening few minutes are brilliant and the end is brilliant (dat Initiate reprise!); it's the middle that I get a little bored with. Falling Back to Earth did that structure much more successfully IMO.
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The Architect's ending is awesome. It has definitely grown since the first time I listened to the album, but it's not still on a 1985 league.
The opening few minutes are brilliant and the end is brilliant (dat Initiate reprise!); it's the middle that I get a little bored with. Falling Back to Earth did that structure much more successfully IMO.
Now that was a great song!
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The Architect's ending is awesome. It has definitely grown since the first time I listened to the album, but it's not still on a 1985 league.
The opening few minutes are brilliant and the end is brilliant (dat Initiate reprise!); it's the middle that I get a little bored with. Falling Back to Earth did that structure much more successfully IMO.
I think they need to move away from the tense building "ascending" first half/calmer "descending" second half song structure. The Architect deviates a little bit, but still. They're already done it on Falling Back to Earth, Nocturnal Conspiracy and Drowning in the Flood. All really good songs, but it might be time to give that structure a couple albums' rest.
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i was bored, and
(https://s32.postimg.org/bapus8o1x/affinity.png)
:rollin :rollin Took me a second to get it!!
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I still don't. :sadpanda:
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I still don't. :sadpanda:
Woooohoooohoooo you turned your back, turned your back on Affinity
Woooooohoooohoooooo, now it's turning to, turning to Toxicity!
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The Architect's ending is awesome. It has definitely grown since the first time I listened to the album, but it's not still on a 1985 league.
The opening few minutes are brilliant and the end is brilliant (dat Initiate reprise!); it's the middle that I get a little bored with..
Same here. Such a pity, because the ending is right up there with my favourite passages of music they've done.
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aww man don't explain the joke :(
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At least the Haken fans don't go into the DT forum and say Affinity is better than TA.
Not sure if you are serious or not.... If you are serious, maybe you want to read this thread, haha
Of course I'm serious. Maybe you should read my post. I said DT Forum. This is General Music Discussion.
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At least the Haken fans don't go into the DT forum and say Affinity is better than TA.
Not sure if you are serious or not.... If you are serious, maybe you want to read this thread, haha
Of course I'm serious. Maybe you should read my post. I said DT Forum. This is General Music Discussion.
Maybe you should go back and re-read this thread. DT fans aren't charging in here to be spoil sports and rain on the Haken parade; it is the big time Haken fans who are almost always starting the DT comparisons, and given that this is a DT forum and everywhere likes the band to some degree, it only makes sense that those of us in this thread who like DT way more are on their side when the DT vs Haken thing comes up.
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So The Architect is growing on me. Badass song.
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I love The Architect and it is my favorite for a whole bunch of reasons. The ending being the biggest.
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At least the Haken fans don't go into the DT forum and say Affinity is better than TA.
Not sure if you are serious or not.... If you are serious, maybe you want to read this thread, haha
Of course I'm serious. Maybe you should read my post. I said DT Forum. This is General Music Discussion.
Maybe you should go back and re-read this thread. DT fans aren't charging in here to be spoil sports and rain on the Haken parade; it is the big time Haken fans who are almost always starting the DT comparisons, and given that this is a DT forum and everywhere likes the band to some degree, it only makes sense that those of us in this thread who like DT way more are on their side when the DT vs Haken thing comes up.
No need to re-read anything. I never said DT fans are charging in here. I said Haken fans don't go over to the DT side and make those comparisons. You said the comparisons are silly, yet you are adding fuel to it with your own comparisons. Pretty silly.
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Guys, Lapse, 2:25. Is it a synth solo or a guitar solo with strange effects? I had reasonably clear that it was a synth solo, as a keyboard player, but I've found some people saying that it's a guitar solo. What do you think?
The Architect's ending is awesome. It has definitely grown since the first time I listened to the album, but it's not still on a 1985 league.
The opening few minutes are brilliant and the end is brilliant (dat Initiate reprise!); it's the middle that I get a little bored with. Falling Back to Earth did that structure much more successfully IMO.
Agreed.
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Guys, Lapse, 2:25. Is it a synth solo or a guitar solo with strange effects? I had reasonably clear that it was a synth solo, as a keyboard player, but I've found some people saying that it's a guitar solo. What do you think?
It's obviously a synth solo. I've commented on this before.
It was also you who asked this exact same question.
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Yep, no way it's a guitar. Having an actual guitar solo directly after makes it kind of obvious too IMO. :lol
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Maybe you should go back and re-read this thread. DT fans aren't charging in here to be spoil sports and rain on the Haken parade; it is the big time Haken fans who are almost always starting the DT comparisons, and given that this is a DT forum and everywhere likes the band to some degree, it only makes sense that those of us in this thread who like DT way more are on their side when the DT vs Haken thing comes up.
No need to re-read anything. I never said DT fans are charging in here. I said Haken fans don't go over to the DT side and make those comparisons. You said the comparisons are silly, yet you are adding fuel to it with your own comparisons. Pretty silly.
Seems like there may be a bit of a disagreement over whether the Haken thread on the Dream Theater forum is Haken's turf or Dream Theater's turf.
EDIT: :lol I accidentally changed the date on one of the quotes to 1974. I'm just going to leave it.
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Maybe you should go back and re-read this thread. DT fans aren't charging in here to be spoil sports and rain on the Haken parade; it is the big time Haken fans who are almost always starting the DT comparisons, and given that this is a DT forum and everywhere likes the band to some degree, it only makes sense that those of us in this thread who like DT way more are on their side when the DT vs Haken thing comes up.
No need to re-read anything. I never said DT fans are charging in here. I said Haken fans don't go over to the DT side and make those comparisons. You said the comparisons are silly, yet you are adding fuel to it with your own comparisons. Pretty silly.
Seems like there may be a bit of a disagreement over whether the Haken thread on the Dream Theater forum is Haken's turf or Dream Theater's turf.
EDIT: :lol I accidentally changed the date on one of the quotes to 1974. I'm just going to leave it.
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You should have changed it to 1985.
Wow, ninja'd.
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:rollin
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Now it's turned to Toxicity
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I Olympic regret terrible albums.
This is one of the better Kinganese / autocorrects I've seen in a while, because it kind of makes sense.
Also, wanted to give Parama props for his four panel comic. :clap:
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:lol
Holy crap.
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Does anyone know how the three supporting acts are scheduled? On my ticket it doesn't say anything about which supporting act is opening for Haken, and I assume it's not going to be all three of them unless they play like 20 minute sets.
Arkentype sounds awesome by the way.
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Nah it's two support acts for any given bit of the tour - I think it should say on the tour schedule or maybe some older Facebook posts from them which bands are playing at which.
I know we're getting Arkentype in London, which I'm excited for as they're absolutely bonkers Norwegian prog metal, very fun.
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Found the post on FB, thanks :tup here it is: https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/photos/a.102809109743.113889.102787549743/10154022585164744/?type=3&theater
Looks like we're getting Arkentype and Special Providence in The Netherlands. :metal
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I know we're getting Arkentype in London, which I'm excited for as they're absolutely bonkers Norwegian prog metal, very fun.
But are they better than the opening act Dream Theater would have? :neverusethis:
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So how much time will each band play? I don't want an 80 minutes gig from Haken so that other two bands can play 60 minutes. Not to disrespect the other bands, I know that they want to promote themselves and I'm fine with that, but it always happens that live music has to end at a certain time (depending on the city) and then the last band has to cut its setlist :(
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So how much time will each band play? I don't want an 80 minutes gig from Haken so that other two bands can play 60 minutes. Not to disrespect the other bands, I know that they want to promote themselves and I'm fine with that, but it always happens that live music has to end at a certain time (depending on the city) and then the last band has to cut its setlist :(
Just so you know, Haken's sets are always around an hour and a quarter, maybe hour and a half at most. So 80 minutes is probably about right, and that has nothing to do with the support acts' set lengths.
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So how much time will each band play? I don't want an 80 minutes gig from Haken so that other two bands can play 60 minutes. Not to disrespect the other bands, I know that they want to promote themselves and I'm fine with that, but it always happens that live music has to end at a certain time (depending on the city) and then the last band has to cut its setlist :(
Just so you know, Haken's sets are always around an hour and a quarter, maybe hour and a half at most. So 80 minutes is probably about right, and that has nothing to do with the support acts' set lengths.
As good as Haken's material is, it will be tough to make an 80 or 90 minute set list.
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Affinity.exe
Initiate
In Memoriam
The Architect
Earthrise
Nocturnal Conspiracy
1985
The Endless Knot
Pareidolia
Celestial Elixir
86 minutes. I'd kill for a setlist like this.
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So how much time will each band play? I don't want an 80 minutes gig from Haken so that other two bands can play 60 minutes. Not to disrespect the other bands, I know that they want to promote themselves and I'm fine with that, but it always happens that live music has to end at a certain time (depending on the city) and then the last band has to cut its setlist :(
Just so you know, Haken's sets are always around an hour and a quarter, maybe hour and a half at most. So 80 minutes is probably about right, and that has nothing to do with the support acts' set lengths.
As good as Haken's material is, it will be tough to make an 80 or 90 minute set list.
Not sure what you're saying - do you mean it would be hard to fill 90 minutes, or it would be hard to wittle down to only 90 minutes?
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Affinity.exe
Initiate
In Memoriam
The Architect
Earthrise
Nocturnal Conspiracy
1985
The Endless Knot
Pareidolia
Celestial Elixir
86 minutes. I'd kill for a setlist like this.
Didn't they say on Facebook (or possibly an interview) that the set will be pretty balanced across their albums? So I very much doubt we'll get 1985 and The Architect. Just one is possible, but I doubt both.
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Every part of me hopes they'll play The Architect but if it's true they're balancing out the albums (which is great because I love The Mountain and Aquarius) I think they will give the edge to 1985, definitely one of the fan favorites, probably the favorite.
Fantasy setlist time?
1. affinity.exe
2. Initiate
3. Cockroach King
4. Aquarium
5. The Endless Knot
6. Insomnia
7. Shapeshifter
8. Drowning in the Flood
9. The Architect
---
10. Falling Back to Earth
Aquarius: 2
Visions: 2
The Mountain: 2
Affinity: 3 (4 if you count .exe)
I think this fits? Not entirely sure but I think so.
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I think this fits? Not entirely sure but I think so.
It doesn't. There's Cockroach King. :millahhhh
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What's with the hate towards Cockroach King? I think it's a pretty sick tune. :metal
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If I ever see Haken live, I definitely want them to play Cockroach King at that show. :biggrin:
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I've seen them play Cockroach King live. :biggrin:
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Yeah, it's a great live song. "gimme some jaaazz!"
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They shouldn't start with affinity.exe. Start with two older songs, Darkest Light followed by Cockroach King would be a great opening, and after the crowd is hyped go into affinity.exe/Initiate/1985 :metal
Too bad Haken (and many other smaller prog bands) never set foot Vienna. They tour circles around it and play in cities with less then a tenth the population, but not here.
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you turned your back on cockroachfinity
now it's turned to kingxicity
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The Path
Atlas Stone
In Memoriam
Streams
Insomnia
The Path Unbeaten
(Conner Green bass solo)
Pareidolia
Cockroach King
Falling Back to Earth
Shapeshifter
Because It's There
Visions
Celestial Elixir
I've seen this setlist live, clocking around 2 hours. I don't know why they should play only 80 minutes, if they're not doing festivals.
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I've only been listening to Haken for a few months, but I'll give it a shot constructing an ideal set list.
1. Affinity.exe/Initiate
2. Cockroach King
3. Aquarium
4. Earthrise
5. Insomnia
6. Falling back to Earth
7. As death embraces
8. Premonition
9. Nocturnal conspiracy
10. The Point of no return
11. Atlas stone
- - - -
12. Celestial elixir
There are a few more songs I consider great, but this show would be long enough.
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Affinity.exe\Initiate
1985
Cockroach King
Earthrise
The Point Of No Return
Insomnia
Darkest Light
As Death Embraces
Pareidolia
Encore:
The Architect
Celestial Elixir
I would be happy with something like this, giving myself the constraint of at least one or two songs per album as Ariich said this year the setlist will be balanced. Maybe there's time for another song, I didn't checked the minutes but it's around 90 I think.
Last time I saw Haken there was an encore with Visions + Celestial Elixir. I hope they will repeat something similar.
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you turned your bacon affinity
now it's turnip to toxicity
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What's with the hate towards Cockroach King? I think it's a pretty sick tune. :metal
No idea why CK is disliked. Just because it's a little quirky doesn't make it bad. I find it a rather interesting listen.
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So how much time will each band play? I don't want an 80 minutes gig from Haken so that other two bands can play 60 minutes. Not to disrespect the other bands, I know that they want to promote themselves and I'm fine with that, but it always happens that live music has to end at a certain time (depending on the city) and then the last band has to cut its setlist :(
Just so you know, Haken's sets are always around an hour and a quarter, maybe hour and a half at most. So 80 minutes is probably about right, and that has nothing to do with the support acts' set lengths.
As good as Haken's material is, it will be tough to make an 80 or 90 minute set list.
Not sure what you're saying - do you mean it would be hard to fill 90 minutes, or it would be hard to wittle down to only 90 minutes?
Sorry, I meant wittle down to 90 minutes.
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I hate when I go to the circus and all they fucking play is ... Wait. Nevermind.
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I've seen them play Cockroach King live. :biggrin:
6 times. :biggrin:
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I've seen them play Cockroach King live. :biggrin:
6 times. :biggrin:
.You are a whore. :lol
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I've seen them play Cockroach King live. :biggrin:
6 times. :biggrin:
.You are a whore. :lol
I prefer the term disciple.
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Painting a pig...... :biggrin:
Well, Rich out whores us all!
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I've seen them play Cockroach King live. :biggrin:
6 times. :biggrin:
.You are a whore. :lol
I prefer the term disciple.
More like disciple of the cockroach, choking on the roach of phallusy
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Painting a pig...... :biggrin:
Well, Rich out whores us all!
Nick is slowly catching up. :lol
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Last night's gig at The Garage in London was just so damn good.
The sound was decent enough at the back - apparently it was terrible right at the front, and the guitars were barely audible. This is why it's always better to stand back a bit.
Performances were solid.
Setlist was pretty amazing (I won't post it here because spoilers, but it can be seen easily on setlist.fm).
The most exciting thing though was how big, and enthusiastic, the crowd was. The queue was stretching up the road when doors opened - something I've never seen at a Haken show before, and the venue was pretty packed once Haken were on stage. And the crowd were totally into it - serious amounts of singing along and throwing hands in the air, which is hard enough to get at a prog gig in the UK, but definitely a big step up for Haken.
Highlights (with SPOILERS), which incidentally cover possibly my three favourite Haken songs:
- Deathless was beautiful, the instrumental second half really got me emotionally.
- Endless Knot was outrageously good, and seeing 600 prog fans dance to the dubstep breakdown from friggin' awesome.
- Falling Back to Earth reminded me that, as much as I absolutely adore Affinity, nothing on it quite matches up.
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So, setlist spoilers ahead from me too guys.
- I'm not a big fan of Deathless but it seems they plan to keep on playing it. It's still an awesome song but I don't like it nearly as much as the other Visions song of the same length, Shapeshifter.
- I thought they were balancing out the setlists across all albums? Aquarius only had one song the last 2 days and Visions had 2. I love The Mountain so you don't see me complaining, but it doesn't seem balanced at all to me.
- Cockroach King AND Falling Back To Earth :metal :metal played on both nights!
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Yeah, it wasn't even slightly balanced. :lol Half the songs were from Affinity, a quarter from The Mountain, and the rest spread across the remaining albums.
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Yeah, seems like Crystallised as the encore is going to be a trend too, that atleast slightly balances it out. Though it's probably my least favorite of the 'epics' and I would love to see Celestial Elixir live, but I doubt it'll happen today.
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Yeah, Crystallised and The Architect are definitely my least favourites of their "epics", and they take up quite a lot of the set. Both have lots of great stuff in them though, and the rest of the set was pretty spectacular.
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Yeah, Crystallised and The Architect are definitely my least favourites of their "epics", and they take up quite a lot of the set. Both have lots of great stuff in them though, and the rest of the set was pretty spectacular.
:whatisthisidonteven:
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Falling Back To Earth has got to be the most overrated Haken song imo. I mean it's pretty good, but nowhere near the top of the album for me.
Celestial Elixir and The Architect are probably the best epics so far.
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I think FBTE is their best song. Awesome from start to finish.
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Crystalized, to me, is not only their best song, but one of the best and most cohesive epics I've ever heard!
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Crystalized, to me, is not only their best song, but one of the best and most cohesive epics I've ever heard!
This. And surprises me how few people here has this taste/opinion. Well, of course, that's fine!
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Crystalized, to me, is not only their best song, but one of the best and most cohesive epics I've ever heard!
This. And surprises me how few people here has this taste/opinion. Well, of course, that's fine!
Obviously different tastes and all. I can understand why some people love it so much (I still think it's great), but "cohesive"? No way. I mean, for the most part yeah, it's going so well, but the wacky instrumental towards the end is just so out of place, even by Haken standards, and that's something that rarely bothers me. :lol
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I think the weakest part of Crystallised is the finale. It feels a bit too much like epic finale just for the sake of epic finale because long songs are "supposed" to end that way. The instrumental section doesn't bother me at all. I absolutely love the rest though.
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It might be a bit cliché, but those types of things became cliché for a reason. When they are well done, they are perfect! And the ending of Crystalized is perfect!
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I did not like Crystallised at all for a while, but when Restoration clicked for me a few weeks ago, I came to really like it. I still don't know where I'd rank it among the epics, though. Pretty much every song Haken has made is really good, so it wouldn't matter much where I ranked it if I wasn't a DTF member. ;)
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Well, that was awesome!! I only just came home.
More details later, including the ToN/Elite meetup. Oh, the setlist was pretty good too ;)
:D
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Crystallised has some really good moments, and the ending is nice, but as a whole, it cannot touch Celestial Elixir. I'm still not completely sold on the vast majority of this band's material, but that song is terrific.
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Crystalized is one of my favorite Haken songs.
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It might be a bit cliché, but those types of things became cliché for a reason. When they are well done, they are perfect!
Definetely, but I don't think it's perfect in Crystallised. The epic ending to The Architect may be a perfect epic ending for me.
Still love Crystallised as a whole though, and it's still in my top 3 Haken songs.
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Saw Haken last night, damn! Good show folks.
Highlights were the ending of The Architect, during the Initiate reprise, that's gotta be one of the most epic Haken moments. Cockroach King goes without saying, brilliant song and great live.
In the end I'm glad they didn't balance the setlist too much because I got to hear my favorite songs off every album (except Visions), wouldn't care for one or two Affinity omissions, Earthrise or something, but since it's the affinitour it's understandable.
As it was kinda the first prog concert I've been to I had no idea what the crowds were like. Apparently a bit more passive and kind of immersed into the music or something? Had to get used to this but I slowly adapted. :D
Aaand I met Elite during the break between Special Providence (these guys have one hell of a keyboard player) and Haken :tup was great to meet up. Those band video's really come in handy, otherwise I'd have never recognized you :lol
Crystallised has some really good moments, and the ending is nice, but as a whole, it cannot touch Celestial Elixir.
Same here, I loved the acapella section live (listening to it at home I don't really care for it) and the chorus is a-ma-zing but I have a hard time listening to the whole thing without losing attention. Celestial Elixir on the other hand...
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Falling Back To Earth has got to be the most overrated Haken song imo. I mean it's pretty good, but nowhere near the top of the album for me.
Celestial Elixir and The Architect are probably the best epics so far.
WAT
I also think it's probably their best song. Powerful verses, celestial chorus, and that second half of the song... 10/10 would listen forever.
By the way, I've one question for those who have already been to one of their gigs. Seeing that Haken play for around 2 hours, how much do the other bands play? At what time starts and ends the whole thing?
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Arkentype played about 30 mins, Special Providence maybe 45? Bit hard to tell with the latter, as their music gets a bit samey after a while.
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Train, you missed the special encore :(
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I know, I can't believe it man.. still kicking myself for this, I just couldn't stay any longer as I just barely caught the last train to Amsterdam . Part of me thought Crystallised was the last song too as it was the case for the other shows but I knew they hadn't done an encore yet. I just wish they swapped them around, Celestial Elixir is my favorite epic and Crystallised is probably my least favorite.
Apparently I wasn't alone in this, or maybe some people were just tired, but really didn't expect the entire show to last longer than 4 hours.
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Well, now I can finally look forward to hearing Celestial Elixir if things work out! I'll catch several shows on the US tour, so even if it's not played every night, I'm hopeful.
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I really have tried, but I just can't get into this band. The music is mostly amazing, but the vocals are so flat and droning, that it just kills it for me. I can't seem to identify any real hooks or melodies, even in the choruses.
Endless Knot is great, but it needs a big melody to contrast against the djenty parts. 1985 has an amazing keyboard and guitar solo and I love the ominous building chord sequence that comes afterwards. The rest of the song just bores me though.
I can't stress enough how much I want to like this band, but I just can't do it. I've known them since the Aquarius days (Celestial Elixir is great) and always come back to them periodically to see whether anything has changed...
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It took a VERY long time for me to get into Haken's vocals, but now I adore Ross.
imo Endless Knot has enough melody. It's a perfect song and one of my favourites from Haken.
I agree that the first half of 1985 is pretty lackluster compared to the second one, but is it boring? I wouldn't say so.
I totally get why some people wouldn't like Haken though. To be honest the point you have brought up is what defines Leprous for me. I can't stand the vocals, the music is pretty good at times but ultimately most of the songs I've heard I found boring. :justjen
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I'm gonna keep trying, because I know the problem must be me, not them! To be honest, having noted the bands that have their own threads on this subforum may explain the Haken thing for me. I'm coming at them from a Dream Theater, Sonata Arctica, Circus Maximus, Seventh Wonder angle and it seems most of their fans are more into Steven Wilson, Opeth, Periphery, etc.
I suppose my musical centre leans more towards the melodic metal sort of stuff.
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The setlist looks amazing. I would trade Cockroach King (which, although I like very much, has been quite overplayed IMO) for another song off The Mountain or from Aquarius and it would be ready to go.
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Cockroach King is probably going to go down as one of their signature songs that gets played nearly every concert.
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It already is.
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Makes me want to go see Haken that much more :neverusethis:
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Cockroach King is probably going to go down as one of their signature songs that gets played nearly every concert.
For a long time, people thought that this was going to be Pull Me Under with DT. But then, one tour, they just didn't. And no one blinked an eye.
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I can see that, except I'm not thinking of Cockroach King as a "hit" as much as just a song they really like and seems to go down well live. I'm thinking more along the lines of Hallowed Be Thy Name by Iron Maiden. That's not to say they'll play it at every concert like Maiden does, but I could see it eventually becoming their most played song.
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According to setlist.fm it already is. It has a lot of shows missing I guess so it might not be perfectly true.
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Interesting. I assumed that would be Celestial Elixir or Visions.
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Interesting. I assumed that would be Celestial Elixir or Visions.
Celestial Elixir is one they don't play as much live. They keep this as a special song to whip out occasionally, like they did last Friday.
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OK, I didn't know that! I thought it was their typical closer (alternating with Visions).
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I've been living under a rock and totally forgot that Haken released an album. Holy Shit I am loving it :hefdaddy :hefdaddy. Affinity is easily the best Album of the year. After so many disappointing releases by all my other favorite bands, Haken saved the day and the year with something truly special. I can't decide which track is my favorite with so many stand outs. I've only given it a few spins and it is consistently great, not a single weak track in the bunch. Bravo Haken, Bravo!
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I like the album.
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I've been living under a rock and totally forgot that Haken released an album. Holy Shit I am loving it :hefdaddy :hefdaddy. Affinity is easily the best Album of the year. After so many disappointing releases by all my other favorite bands, Haken saved the day and the year with something truly special. I can't decide which track is my favorite with so many stand outs. I've only given it a few spins and it is consistently great, not a single weak track in the bunch. Bravo Haken, Bravo!
Amen to that. Honestly, the only part of this album I don't care for is the 20 or 30 sec growling section in "The Architect". Not that I don't like growling vocals, but it just didn't quite do it for me they way they did it. If they had been deeper like in "Streams", I could probably appreciate them more.
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Yeah, I could see why people wouldn't like those growls, I don't think they're spectacular either on the original. Ross did them himself live though and it was pretty amazing, the dude can growl alright.
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That entire instrumental part of The Architect really brings it down to me to be honest. It's a shame, because the first part and the outro could easily make it the best Haken song.
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Yeah, I agree, The Architect has some awesome parts, as the intro, the first vocal part, and the ending. However, all the middle part just is not as good, for me.
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After a few more listens, The Architect turned out to be pretty awesome. Love the rhythmic theme in the instrumental part.
Also, seeing Haken this month! Woo!
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Bought Affinity today. Listening now for the first time. Really impressed by it.
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I just came from Haken's gig in Barcelona, what a concert!! It's a shame that concert halls are actually NOT prepared to host concerts, acoustics-wise. :sad:
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I've had the EP and 4 albums on shuffle for a few days now. Nothing but Haken since the release of Affinity. :hefdaddy
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Okay, a buddy of mine (who has a similar opinion to me on the band) burned me a copy of the new CD recently and I listened to it in the car for much of the last few days.
The really good:
Earth rise (really good song)
Bound by Gravity (another really good one)
The beginning of The Architect (the first minute is killer)
The mix (everything sounds great)
The pretty good, and could be even better with more time:
1985 (vocal melodies are falling flat with me on this one, but musically it is quite good)
Red Giant (something about that herky jerky stuff they do is cool in this one)
The not so good:
Initiate (what a bland opening song, not counting the short intro tune)
The rest of The Architect (that first minute is so great, and then they cut it off and go into this DT-like unison stuff that ruined the cool vibe they had built up; the rest of the song is okay, but nothing has grabbed me)
Overall, sounds like a good, solid album. I'd give it 3 stars out of 5. A slight step back from The Mountain, which was mostly good, but a big step up over the first two albums, except for the stellar Celestial Elixir.
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Considering I only got The Mountain (my first Haken album) back in January, all of their albums still feel fresh and new to me. I seriously love all of their output. After giving Affinity a few listens I probably would have rated the albums:
1. The Mountain
2. Aquarius
3. Restoration
4. Affinity
5. Visions
Visions and Affinity (still the album I've listened to least) are growing on me big time and getting better with each listen. I do really love Aquarius though, something about it hits the sweet spot for me. I might have to just rate all their albums as a five way tie soon :hefdaddy
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I listened to Affinity on a work trip today and it stunned me even harder after a few weeks of ignoring it (for fear of over-familiarity ruining it for me). This album is such a meisterwerk (after Visions), man. My album of the year if Devin Townsend doesn't beat it.
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put restoration at the bottom and my ranking lines up with luke's exactly tbh
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put restoration at the bottom and my ranking lines up with luke's exactly tbh
I think Restoration will likely end at the bottom eventually. Visions is growing on me especially at the moment, more so than Affinity. I'll give it another month or two and I'll rank again.
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Visions is the only Haken album I wouldn't call great or good, but just okay. I'm not a fan of the title track at all.
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Visions may not be great. It may not even be good, but I think it's great.
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Visions may not be great. It may not even be good, but I think it's great.
I'm not trying to be antagonistic, I seriously don't understand what you're trying to say here? It's great, but not good? I'm confused.
In other news, Affinity still rules. It's definitely battling The Mountain for the top spot valiantly, though it doesn't quite reach The Mountain's lofty heights. I'd still consider both of them a tier above their first two albums (which are good, but I feel like I love them far less than most people do).
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Just finished another spin of Affinity. Even though I already loved it at release, it managed to grow on me even more. It has the maturity of The Mountain and moves me emotionally in the way Aquarius did. I never could decide whether I prefer Aquarius or The Mountain, Affinity is shaping up to become the best of both worlds.
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Visions may not be great. It may not even be good, but I think it's great.
I'm not trying to be antagonistic, I seriously don't understand what you're trying to say here? It's great, but not good? I'm confused.
I think he means that objectively it might not be good, but he still loves it.
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In the interest of not reviving the old "is there objectivity in music" discussion, I'll just step out of this politely if that is indeed what he meant.
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Y'all are being insane about Visions anyway. It is unquestionable brilliance. I find it really strange when people are all over The Mountain and Aquarius but don't get Visions. It's mind-boggling.
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It's hard for me to get past the first 3 tracks on Visions and Aquarius without getting tired. I think they really hit balancing and sequencing right with The Mountain, and refined it further on Affinity (though I think The Mountain flows better).
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I love a few tracks off Visions, Nocturnal Conspiracy and Shapeshifter mostly, but I never enjoyed the full album as much.
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I love a few tracks off Visions, Nocturnal Conspiracy and Shapeshifter mostly, but I never enjoyed the full album as much.
Nocturnal Conspiracy has a killer first part, but I kinda nod off as it progresses.
They really hit the vibe of the song in the first part, it truly feels dreadful and menacing.
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Visions is at time great, and at times alright. It's their only long song that I do not find to be stellar. I think The Architect, Crystallised, Falling Back to Earth, and Celestial Elixir are all superb, and Visions just falls short of all of them. It's a big part of the reason I find Visions as an album to be their only non-excellent release to date, which kills me, as I'm actually in the thanks for Visions.
That said, I still really enjoy the album, and it is not in any way bad, it just does not put me over the top as every other release has.
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Sometimes I like being wrong.
I gave The Architect another shot on the way to work this morning...and it sounded really good.
Listened again a bit ago on the way home...and it sounded even better than really good.
I guess I just have to accept that my normal process with this band will always be, I am never wild over their stuff at first, usually because it always takes time to warm up to the vocals, but once I get used to and can deal with them, the good songs come off as really good.
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Could we somehow do a top-10 Haken song ranking or something like that?
Edit: yes, we can. Vote!!
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=47512.0
Edit2: you can explain here or there your particular order, if you want.
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We do that every year with Elite's Haken survivor, but that's a different kind of list I guess.
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Just posted this in the 'Top 10 Haken songs' poll but wanted to post it here too:
So, I've listened through all the albums this afternoon, ranking the songs as I went along, and managed to make a top 10. Most of this came as much of a surprise to me, never really ranked individual songs. Usually just stick with attempting to rank the albums of bands. So anyway:
1. Aquarium
2. Visions
3. Celestial Elixir
4. Premonition
5. Cockroach King
6. The Path
7. Atlas Stone
8. Because It's There
9. Pareidolia
10. 1985
So that's
Aquarius - 2
Visions - 2
The Mountain - 5
Restoration - 0
Affinity - 1
Controversial comments to follow. After listening through I've realised that I really like both Aquarius and Visions, more so than Affinity at this point. The Mountain is my favourite, I think, because of the vocal delivery of the whole band. There are some great vocal harmonies that elevate this album above everything else they have done. Affinity still has room to grow as it still hasn't had as many listens as all the rest. However, I'm not feeling as strongly towards it as a lot of other people. I appreciate the feel/sound they were going for, I really like it and do feel it sounds fresh. Do I like as much as their other albums? No, not at this point. Restoration is a nice listen but it's my least favourite, but that's probably due to it being an EP.
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Hmm, top 10 Haken songs you say...
In no particular order...
Eternal Rain*, Insomnia*, Celestial Elixir, Cockroach King, Falling Back to Earth, Pareidolia, Crystallised, 1985, The Endless Knot, The Architect
With both Eternal Rain and Insomnia, it was hard to pick one song from the respective albums, though I believe both deserve to be recognized aside from Celestial Elixir which is an easy choice. There are 3-4 tracks from both the first two albums that I could have chosen in place of Eternal Rain or Insomnia.
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By some weird twist of fate I happened to be perusing DTforums and stumbled across this thread at exactly the same moment that I was also rocking out to the end of Crystallised.
So I thought I'd just pop in and say: damn. This song is rad! :metal
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I'm still somewhat of a lukewarm fan, but doing a top 10 for this was easy:
Celestial Elixir
Atlas Stone
In Memoriam
Because It's There
Falling Back to Earth
Pareidolia
The Architect
Earthrise
Red Giant
Bound by Gravity
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After a couple dozen spins, I've decided that Affinity is a really amazing album, but it doesn't hit me emotionally the way The Mountain did.
Here's my review on Jammin Dude's Neighborhood.
https://youtu.be/MZdzcuGWyC4
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Cool review. I don't agree with everything you said, but well done. :tup :tup
Also, I forgot about Crystallized when doing my top 10. At the end of the work day today, I was able to have time to myself, so I listened to that, Celestial Elixir and Visions all back-to-back-to-back, and I can safely say that this band does long epics very well. Visions isn't as good as the other two, but it is still a very niece piece of music, with some great parts, and the other two are both pretty bad ass in general. The instrumental section in Celestial Elixir, from around 8:03 to 11:30, is nothing short of magnificent. :hat
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The instrumental section in Celestial Elixir, from around 8:03 to 11:30, is nothing short of magnificent. :hat
Oh definitely, but myself I think the verses of Celestial Elixir are the band's greatest work yet. The guitar melody is one of my favourites in music overall.
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Their a capella cover of Toto's Africa - in a car :lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtKILgW6OQg&feature=share (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtKILgW6OQg&feature=share)
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Stolen! :lol
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Their a capella cover of Toto's Africa - in a car :lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtKILgW6OQg&feature=share (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtKILgW6OQg&feature=share)
Woha awesome! :lol
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After a couple dozen spins, I've decided that Affinity is a really amazing album, but it doesn't hit me emotionally the way The Mountain did.
Yeah, I've decided it's just as good an album, but has a different approach. In Myers Brigg terms, The Mountain is Feeling whereas Affinity is Thinking. I think the lyrical quality on Affinity is far superior, and the music quality is more consistent and experimental, but The Mountain is more moving and has some higher highs. They're both amazing, and because they're quire different, I really can't choose between them.
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After a couple dozen spins, I've decided that Affinity is a really amazing album, but it doesn't hit me emotionally the way The Mountain did.
This absolutely.
I highly recommend the instrumental version of Bound By Gravity; very trippy!
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Affinity has grown on me a lot since the first couple spins, and I've been listening to it daily. It didn't grab me as much as I hoped upon my first listens, as I said earlier in the thread. Just wanted to say that those days are done, and I'm really liking it a lot now.
Also, I was wondering if anyone knows what the morse code sounds at the beginning and end of the album say?
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I liked it a lot in the beginning and even more so now. Could easily be the prog metal album of the year...and the year is only half over.
BTW, good review jammindude. :tup
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I had read somewhere that the Morse code it spells out affinity.
Thank you everyone for the great feedback on the review! This one felt a lot more natural and I think I'm going to be sticking with what really moves me.
Would you believe I only just today figured out the riff for initiate? That one's really hard to tap out on a steering wheel. LOL
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Also, I was wondering if anyone knows what the morse code sounds at the beginning and end of the album say?
Somebody here said it's just HAKEN AFFINITY and some random stuff looped.
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BIG FUCKING NEWS
https://www.reggieslive.com/show/haken-2/
It looks like Thank You Scientist will be the support for Haken's US tour.
I'm busting a nut over here. It could not get any freaking better!
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HOLY
CRAP
I'M
DYING
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I CAN'T THROW MY MONEY AT A SEATTLE SHOW YET GODDAMMIT WHERE IS IT
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You know what, this has never been more appropriate:
(https://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/walkingdead/images/3/3f/Shut-up-and-take-my-money.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/640?cb=20140829235648)
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MEET AND GREET.
I need it.
Edit: Does anyone know when they might actually go on sale? It says Monday the 20th, but is there a time? Midnight? Midday?
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Also wish I could see this.
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MEET AND GREET.
I need it.
Edit: Does anyone know when they might actually go on sale? It says Monday the 20th, but is there a time? Midnight? Midday?
Settle down, sparky.
It's not like Dream Theater. This will be GA and the tickets/meet and greet won't sell out immediately, so you're fine.
Also, we'll see how routing works out. Hopefully I can do a normal East Coast run after ProgPower, but if they run down the coast before their appearance I'll be looking for other chances to see this tour. If I head midwest I hope to see some of you folks. :)
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BIG FUCKING NEWS
https://www.reggieslive.com/show/haken-2/
It looks like Thank You Scientist will be the support for Haken's US tour.
I'm busting a nut over here. It could not get any freaking better!
I'm not seeing anything but banners for a King's X show and a Dick Dale show.
Did something get taken down or am I not seeing something?
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If you have a chance to see them live, go for it! Saw them in Cologne last saturday and it was amazing. There was an older lady (70ish) rocking out to 1985 which was pretty neat.
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Wow, if Haken and Thank You Scientist come anywhere near me on tour, that's a no-brainer. Can't wait to see some dates.
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BIG FUCKING NEWS
https://www.reggieslive.com/show/haken-2/
It looks like Thank You Scientist will be the support for Haken's US tour.
I'm busting a nut over here. It could not get any freaking better!
I'm not seeing anything but banners for a King's X show and a Dick Dale show.
Did something get taken down or am I not seeing something?
It's still there for me, under the banners that you're talking about.
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If you have a chance to see them live, go for it! Saw them in Cologne last saturday and it was amazing. There was an older lady (70ish) rocking out to 1985 which was pretty neat.
I also was there! I actually saw the old lady and I thought it was pretty funny. Anyways fantastic concert, if you are able to see them, do it.
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I'm not seeing anything but banners for a King's X show and a Dick Dale show.
Did something get taken down or am I not seeing something?
Are you viewing on mobile? You need to request the desktop site or the page will mostly be blank.
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Called Reggie's because nothing is up, and they said tickets would be up probably some time tomorrow.
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So here are the first dates I think?
(https://scontent-arn2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13450807_1732205103706227_3619239445530188273_n.jpg?oh=a0eeb5477d1bcb73bb95df3221acf006&oe=57C59243)
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Ah man, not coming anywhere close to me unfortunately.
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Well, initially I had hoped to do the East Coast run after ProgPower, but of course the worst case scenario has happened and they'll be in NYC, PA, MD, and VA while I'm either traveling to or at the festival. So I'm going full tour mode and thinking I'll do Niagara through Boston, booya.
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Boston baby!!! WOOT!!
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Ah, man, no Charlotte date. I don't go to many concerts, but I probably would have gone to Haken if they came to Charlotte.
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Fuck me.
I have NO reason to NOT see them in LA.
Holy shit.
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yeah, that seattle venue is a 30 min. walk from where i live. i guess i can go :corn
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I'll definitely be at the San Antonio show. Really surprised they are playing there. Might be able to Dallas as well.
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I'm going to try to go to the Chicago show... however, I'm going to be attempting to put a crap ton of money down on Hamilton tickets in less than a hour so it's all dependent on funds :lol
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Well, initially I had hoped to do the East Coast run after ProgPower, but of course the worst case scenario has happened and they'll be in NYC, PA, MD, and VA while I'm either traveling to or at the festival. So I'm going full tour mode and thinking I'll do Niagara through Boston, booya.
Oh just come to Chicago too while you're at it. You fucking posted the link to Reggies :lol
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I live an hour south of Atlanta but I don't have tickets to progpower so I guess I'll have to miss out. Damn.
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Well, initially I had hoped to do the East Coast run after ProgPower, but of course the worst case scenario has happened and they'll be in NYC, PA, MD, and VA while I'm either traveling to or at the festival. So I'm going full tour mode and thinking I'll do Niagara through Boston, booya.
Oh just come to Chicago too while you're at it. You fucking posted the link to Reggies :lol
It's 11 hours out and then 10 back to Niagara, so no. I can get to Niagara in 5 and then do about 3 hours travel between shows from there.
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So glad they are coming to Phoenix. I think this will be the first time they play here.
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First time for the South or West.
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I live an hour south of Atlanta but I don't have tickets to progpower so I guess I'll have to miss out. Damn.
Someone just attempted to sell their saturday ticket to me and I just got mine yesterday so you can get the tickets if you want (not from me, but the tickets are out there for resell).
Having said that, Haken is one of the bands playing the festival who I am not familiar with so I am trying to listen to some of the bands so I am more familiar when I see them. Just watched the video for Earthrise, interesting song. This seems like music I need to digest before having an idea as to whether or not I like it.
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First time for the South or West.
No wonder. :lolpalm:
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Tickets are up on Reggie's now for the Chicago show. :metal
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Tickets on sale Friday for Boston. Awe yeah. Been there before. I love the small venue.
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Just for you to know, after 29 votes, these turned out to be DTforums' members 10 favourite Haken songs:
1. Pareidolia (21)
2. Celestial Elixir (19)
3. Falling Back to Earth (18)
4. 1985 (18)
5. The Architect (18)
6. Atlas Stone (15)
7. Cockroach King (15)
8. Visions (13)
9. Crystallised (13)
10. In Memoriam (11)
On the other hand, Eternal Rain (0), Sun (1), The Mind's Eye (1), Portals (1), The Path (1) and affinity.exe (0) were the less voted.
Now this was interesting to see the general preferences among all the songs, but I don't think the order would be the same if we voted only for our favourite song. That top-10 would make an awesome setlist, though ;D
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Wow... Just blows my mind because Pareidolia wouldn't even crack my top 10 (although it's still absolutely amazing) and The Mind's Eye is one of my favorites.
Stopping to think of my top 10.
1. Crystallised
2. The Cockroach King
3. Deathless
4. Drowning in the Flood
5. Falling Back to Earth
6. Because It's There
7. Bound by Gravity
8. 1985
9. Mind's Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter (yes...I know this is kinda cheating...but I can't separate them. This whole section of the album just freakin rules)
10. Streams
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Really surprised to see Pareidolia and 1985 so high, certainly not among my favorites. Eternal rain, on the other hand, is excellent and deserves more love.
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Wow... Just blows my mind because Pareidolia wouldn't even crack my top 10
Same here. Although, it's still a good song. It just never grabbed me right away. Not like most of their other songs.
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You have to consider that list like you would a Rotten Tomatoes score. It's not actually a rating of how good the song is, but more like who likely it is that you'll like it.
It means Pareidolia is the most universally liked.
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Yeah, we get it. But, we're talking about only 29 votes. Not even close to a good sample size to be considered universal.
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My top five Haken songs: 1. 1985 2. 1985 3. 1985 4. 1985 5. 1985
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Just for you to know, after 29 votes, these turned out to be DTforums' members 10 favourite Haken songs:
1. Pareidolia (21)
2. Celestial Elixir (19)
3. Falling Back to Earth (18)
4. 1985 (18)
5. The Architect (18)
6. Atlas Stone (15)
7. Cockroach King (15)
8. Visions (13)
9. Crystallised (13)
10. In Memoriam (11)
I would probably agree with eight of those, the exceptions being 1985 and Cockroach King, so not bad. :tup :tup
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Tickets have been purchased for the Boston show. 4 foods down is a restaurant that has 120 beers on tap. Aaaawwwweeee yeeeeaaaaahhh.
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Got Affinity vinyl in the mail yesterday! Can't wait to spin it when I finally get some time off (along with the rest of the stack I've gotten recently).
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Imma just leave this here...
https://youtu.be/xp_gBuEFqTE
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I think tracks 4-7 from the new album is their best four-song run to date. All four songs are really good or great.
The Endless Knot had the potential to make it five in a row, but after starting out great, it wanders off into something else and is rather ordinary more often than not. Why they didn't revisit the style and melody of the first verse later in the song is a total mystery to me. ???
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Ah Kev, I love The Endless Knot.
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I love the beginning of it; I just wish the last 2/3 was close to as good as the first 1/3. >:(
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That dubstep section really kicks the song up another notch, IMO.
Totally out of left field but still fits in perfectly.
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The album is really growing on me. The Mountain will always be "next level" for me because of the personal connection to the lyrics. But Affinity just keeps getting better and better with every listen.
And the ending of Bound by Gravity... :panicattack:
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:omg:see
That dubstep section really kicks the song up another notch, IMO.
Totally out of left field but still fits in perfectly.
Then the solo following the dubstep is amazing.
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Endless Knot has no dull moments for me. Each section is stellar.
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EK is fantastic from beginning to end.
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And the ending of Bound by Gravity... :panicattack:
Yep, great ending to a really good tune. I have liked that one from the start. :coolio
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Bound by Gravity is, to me, one of this album's very best.
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Okay, so things are looking a lot more definite now. :D
Anyone seeing the following shows? Speak up, I hope to get to see a few DTFers in parts of the world I rarely, if ever, have visited!
Niagara Falls
Toronto
Montreal
Quebec City
Boston
Got a lot of planning to do, but already super psyched.
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I am going to see them in NYC on September 6th. I will also be meeting them as I purchased the meet and greet ticket! Just another great band that I have discovered on this forum :metal Can't get enough of the new album.
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Okay, so things are looking a lot more definite now. :D
Anyone seeing the following shows? Speak up, I hope to get to see a few DTFers in parts of the world I rarely, if ever, have visited!
Niagara Falls
Toronto
Montreal
Quebec City
Boston
Got a lot of planning to do, but already super psyched.
I can't wait to get you on my couch or floor again.
:eyebrows:
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Is there a VIP package for this tour? I'm not seeing one at the official website...
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Okay, so things are looking a lot more definite now. :D
Anyone seeing the following shows? Speak up, I hope to get to see a few DTFers in parts of the world I rarely, if ever, have visited!
Niagara Falls
Toronto
Montreal
Quebec City
Boston
Got a lot of planning to do, but already super psyched.
I can't wait to get you on my couch or floor again.
:eyebrows:
:eyebrows:
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it appears Nick is getting the VIP package, amirite?
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kings casting couch is the VIP treatment?
How badly do I want this part?
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I am addicted to Earthrise right now. I think Affinity may be my favorite Haken album. :metal
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kings casting couch is the VIP treatment?
How badly do I want this part?
It's all up to you. Also, I do cook breakfast as well.
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Ya...well.....I steal cab fare.
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kings casting couch is the VIP treatment?
How badly do I want this part?
It's all up to you. Also, I do cook breakfast as well.
That's 98% of why I'm doing this.
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I finally got around to listening to Restoration and I am loving it. Earthlings is one of my favorite Haken songs now. :tup
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As I was working on things today, I noticed a change that I haven't seen advertised. The Niagara Falls show has been moved to Buffalo.
I noticed this because...
Most tickets are bought, and all hotels are booked, and Hakation is official, booya!
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I'm really digging the use of polyrhythms on Affinity, particularly on Initiate and The Endless Knot. Plenty of unusually-placed drum rhythms through the other tracks on here as well. I'm just going to say it...Affinity is a stunning album!
Also, WHY IS AQUARIUS STILL UNAVAILABLE?!! The completist in me won't be satisfied until it is.
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Also, WHY IS AQUARIUS STILL UNAVAILABLE?!! The completist in me won't be satisfied until it is.
Ross mentioned in Facebook that they are dealing with some legal issues but that they are trying to make it available again.
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Man, Affinity is almost a flawless album. Red Giant is the only weak spot I can find in there and even that is a song I don't dislike. AOTY by miles and to me Haken's best effort so far.
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Man, Affinity is almost a flawless album. Red Giant is the only weak spot I can find in there and even that is a song I don't dislike. AOTY by miles and to me Haken's best effort so far.
I do not know this "weak spot" of which you speak. Everything is a real gem on this one!
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Red Giant is one of my favourites.
You silly, Diego.
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Red Giant is one of my favourites.
You silly, Diego.
No wonder, even though we like a lot of the same bands you usually prefer the songs that I dilsike
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Red Giant is one of my favourites.
This. It's wonderful.
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Red Giant is one of my favourites.
You silly, Diego.
No wonder, even though we like a lot of the same bands you usually prefer the songs that I dilsike
It's true. :lol We have very similar tastes at band-level, but not at song-level.
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Great CD!
Earthrise - As I inhale the hurricane I touch the void and feel no pain
Bound by Gravity - If we dictate the cause and face no consequences would our worlds still intertwine?
Awesome lyrics!
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Initiate is becoming one of my favourite tracks on Affinity. The outro from 3:40 onwards just gives me goosebumps everytime.
The entire album is probably the best thing I've heard in the last few years tbh.
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I can't wait to see them play the songs live.
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I also think Red Giant is one of the best tracks on the new album, along with Earthrise, The Architect and Bound by Gravity.
Initiate is really the only song I literally never listen to (along with the short intro track).
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Hi, my name's Bill, and I've been having a hard time listening to anything that's not Restoration or The Mountain for about a week now. Going to grab the new album soon. Anybody else on the forum going to the NYC show?
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Red Giant is one of my favourites.
You silly, Diego.
I thought it was weird at first, but now I totally love it. The guitar outro is perfection.
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Hi, my name's Bill, and I've been having a hard time listening to anything that's not Restoration or The Mountain for about a week now. Going to grab the new album soon. Anybody else on the forum going to the NYC show?
I think Nick is going Bill.
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Never go full Bill.
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:lol
I saw his earlier post. He is not.
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I haven't had the chance to listen myself yet, but the guy that did a bunch of DT and Rush 8-bit covers a few years ago just did The Mountain.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLKgrWbPICndmEN-Xl0vgBk664UtchqQGc
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Just listened to Crystallised for the first time :metal :metal Been trying to listen to songs on youtube to familiarize myself before progpower and digging a lot of it
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Has anyone done the Meet & Greet with Haken yet? I have M&G tickets for tomorrow night in Chicago, and I don't really know if it happens before or after. The ticket has no other information other than the 7pm starting time.
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Has anyone done the Meet & Greet with Haken yet? I have M&G tickets for tomorrow night in Chicago, and I don't really know if it happens before or after. The ticket has no other information other than the 7pm starting time.
Where can I buy Meet and Greet tix? The San Antonio show doesn't have an option to get M&G ticket.
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Has anyone done the Meet & Greet with Haken yet? I have M&G tickets for tomorrow night in Chicago, and I don't really know if it happens before or after. The ticket has no other information other than the 7pm starting time.
Where can I buy Meet and Greet tix? The San Antonio show doesn't have an option to get M&G ticket.
Only a handful of the N. American dates have VIP/M&G options. Chances are your show does not.
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So my friend and I got to the venue 90 minutes before the doors opened to general admission and we missed Haken's M&G and sound check, so if your show has that, get there sooner. I'm not terribly disappointed though. The show was still amazing and we still got in plenty early to get great spots right in front. The show was amazing, just as I expected. They even played Celestial Elixer, which I wasn't expecting at all. I was also able to catch them after the show to get a couple signings, so it all turned out all right in the end!
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Has anyone done the Meet & Greet with Haken yet? I have M&G tickets for tomorrow night in Chicago, and I don't really know if it happens before or after. The ticket has no other information other than the 7pm starting time.
Where can I buy Meet and Greet tix? The San Antonio show doesn't have an option to get M&G ticket.
Only a handful of the N. American dates have VIP/M&G options. Chances are your show does not.
I see. Thanks for the info.
Shit, this means I got to stalk the band afterwards :biggrin:
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So my friend and I got to the venue 90 minutes before the doors opened to general admission and we missed Haken's M&G and sound check, so if you're show has that, get there sooner. I'm not terribly disappointed though. The show was still amazing and we still got in plenty early to get great spots right in front. The show was amazing, just as I expected. They even played Celestial Elixer, which I wasn't expecting at all. I was also able to catch them after the show to get a couple signings, so it all turned out all right in the end!
I'd be livid if I paid for this, received no information, tried to get there early and still missed it.
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They're playing at a dive bar here in Phx on 9/16. I'm not really impressed with them playing in that type of venue. It's kinda far away too. As much as I'd like to see them, still debating on whether to go or not. :-\
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That's the best places to see bands. To hell with the big venues.
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That's the best places to see bands. To hell with the big venues.
Agreed, I'd love to see some of my favorite bands in a dive bar. Get up close and sweaty with the band and feel like you are experiencing something a bit more personal.
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Yeah, I know what you mean. Seen plenty of bands in bars during my younger years. I guess I'm getting too old for this shit. :lol
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The one negitive is in those venues bands go on late. I'm getting to old to stay up late. :lol
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The one negitive is in those venues bands go on late. I'm getting to old to stay up late. :lol
I hear ya on that. Maybe I am starting to show my age as well, but I enjoy the 11pm curfew at most of the big venues. Bars... well yea I can't stay up so late during the weeknights like that anymore and expect to be able to work professionally the next day :lol
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Yeah, sleeping for only a few hours last night wasn't fun. :lol
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I'm Danny Glover. I'm too old for this ........
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Local act done. TYS here in Buffalo in a few and then HAKEN!
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WOOOOTTTT!
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Local act done. TYS here in Buffalo in a few and then HAKEN!
Local act was Fire Garden, right? How were they? Never had a chance to spin his last album but I know they had JR and Jimmy Keegan as special guest on it.
Also, I had to cheat and looked at the setlist...don't think my progboner will subside till showtime on the 18th....
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The one negitive is in those venues bands go on late. I'm getting to old to stay up late. :lol
I hear ya on that. Maybe I am starting to show my age as well, but I enjoy the 11pm curfew at most of the big venues. Bars... well yea I can't stay up so late during the weeknights like that anymore and expect to be able to work professionally the next day :lol
If I go to a show on a weekday, I always take the next off. Works perfect for shows on Thursday nights. Another thing about small venues is standing room only most of the time. Larger venues allow this old man to sit for a while if I need to.
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When I was younger, I could drive from El Paso, Texas to Phoenix the day of the show and drive back right after show ended. It's a 6 hour drive. Now, 20 yrs later, I can't..LOL. I'm seeing Haken in San Antonio next week and will be driving from Austin. It's a 1.5 hr drive. I'll be staying at a hotel in SA and wake early and drive straight to work. Getting older sucks. :rollin
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The one negitive is in those venues bands go on late. I'm getting to old to stay up late. :lol
I hear ya on that. Maybe I am starting to show my age as well, but I enjoy the 11pm curfew at most of the big venues. Bars... well yea I can't stay up so late during the weeknights like that anymore and expect to be able to work professionally the next day :lol
That's what I'm doing. I took the 5th off. I'll be dead all day. :lol
If I go to a show on a weekday, I always take the next off. Works perfect for shows on Thursday nights. Another thing about small venues is standing room only most of the time. Larger venues allow this old man to sit for a while if I need to.
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LOL King. I never said that. :lol
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Oh crap, I didn't quote correctly. I mean that's why I'm taking off the 5th! :lol
Oops! My bad! lol
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My ringtone is the line from Crystallised: "Someone's calling me"
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What did I have with my dinner tonight? A side of Haken!
(https://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/kingshmegland/image000000_zpstyqhl2tq.jpg) (https://s583.photobucket.com/user/kingshmegland/media/image000000_zpstyqhl2tq.jpg.html)
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Are some of those guys members of the band?
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Are some of those guys members of the band?
Yeah! Even Nick.
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Are some of those guys members of the band?
Yup 2 of them. Though all were there earlier. :metal
Had some beers at a bar with them as well.
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Very nice. :hat
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Very nice indeed! :metal
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It's all thanks to Nick. I'd never have the intimate settings to hang without him.
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Joe, all I can picture is you going all Chris Farley on them...
"Remember when you sang (random haken song)......
......that was AWESOME!"
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I was much cooler than that!
*in my head am I was* :lol
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*in my head am I was*
*runs to get the Kingshmegland Decoder Ring out of the drawer*
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I know him - Inmahed Amaywaz - plays cricket for Pakistan.
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Yeah, he's the guy that has his name misspelled on his jersey.
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It cracked me up the few times I checked in on splent's roulette ................kingschmegland :lol I'm guessing that wasn't on purpose but a nice touch anyway ;D
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:metal :metal :metal that's awesome King and Nick
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That wasn't a typo though Brent, there's a story to why.
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That wasn't a typo though Brent, there's a story to why.
Well that ruins it ;D
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I know him - Inmahed Amaywaz - plays cricket for Pakistan.
Hahaha. :rollin
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That wasn't a typo though Brent, there's a story to why.
Well that ruins it ;D
:lol
For you yes. Lol
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So the main leg of Hakation is over. I've gotta reset and get ready for ProgPower, but a few thoughts.
-If you can reasonably see this and you aren't, shame on you. These are two amazing young bands, and both are on fire.
-Thank You Scientist is SO MUCH FUN live. Seen them before, but now a few times right up front and it is just such a blast. They are awesome guys too, and I've had way too much fun talking to them over the past few days.
-Haken's set is quite amazing, and they went pretty all out on the top live stuff. They are tighter than ever, and it's amazing to see how far they've come. They've got a young and large crowd at every show. Buffalo, a relatively small market probably had at least 200 people. Montreal had over 350. I've seen progmetal bands come over and struggle to play to 50 people. What they have accomplished is awesome.
-Celestial. Fucking. Elixir. Finally, and it is everything I hoped live.
-King makes the best fucking breakfast. He is on top of his chef game, and you always have my eternal thanks for your awesome hospitality.
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So pumped for the NYC show tonight. My body is not ready for Crystallised live.
Also, was out for a run before work this morning, and I turned a corner right as the sun was coming up over the trees and Bound by Gravity was playing. Just a really nice, quiet moment that really struck me.
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So pumped for the NYC show tonight. My body is not ready for Crystallised live.
Also, was out for a run before work this morning, and I turned a corner right as the sun was coming up over the trees and Bound by Gravity was playing. Just a really nice, quiet moment that really struck me.
I hate to tell you this, and I'm not joking, your body may not have to be ready...
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So pumped for the NYC show tonight. My body is not ready for Crystallised live.
Also, was out for a run before work this morning, and I turned a corner right as the sun was coming up over the trees and Bound by Gravity was playing. Just a really nice, quiet moment that really struck me.
I hate to tell you this, and I'm not joking, your body may not have to be ready...
Ah, oh well :(
-King makes the best fucking breakfast. He is on top of his chef game, and you always have my eternal thanks for your awesome hospitality.
Now I'm just jealous that I was always halfway in between king and the shows that we went to, I want delicious breakfast.
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Imagining brewing, staying over then the breakfast. Make it so Bill.
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So pumped for the NYC show tonight. My body is not ready for Crystallised live.
Also, was out for a run before work this morning, and I turned a corner right as the sun was coming up over the trees and Bound by Gravity was playing. Just a really nice, quiet moment that really struck me.
Would love to see these guys. I did not realize they were playing to that small of a crowd. Heck, Nashville could draw that many or more.
Bound by Gravity is my last song I listen to each night on my ipod. Awesome song!
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(https://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/kingshmegland/20160905_011823_zpso77qom6b.jpg) (https://s583.photobucket.com/user/kingshmegland/media/20160905_011823_zpso77qom6b.jpg.html)
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I'll see your bet and raise you...
(https://www.wpapu.com/images/Haken01.jpg)
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:lol
I have about 40. Lol
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I tried to take out my phone as little as possible for this time. :lol
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Spoiler.
I wish I took out my phone to video the fans during the dubstep section in The Endless Knot. The fans were jumping up and down and it was so damn fun to see.
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I was thinking that too. Awesome moment.
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Okay, here we go, words I never thought I'd say.
I really loved jumping with the crowd every night when the dubstep started.
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That's one of my favorite moments on the album. I'll be jumping come saturday.
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is anyone here by any chance selling a ticket to the LA show? waited too long to move on it and they sold out :-\
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I was thinking about this the other day - have Haken ever given thought to releasing a live album? AFAIK, they don't have any official live offerings, be it a CD or video release, but I'd love to get one someday, especially considering they have 4 albums of material under their belts, there's a LOT of music they could release from touring.
-Marc.
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They have definitely given it thought (I discussed it with Ray when we went to see The Dear Hunter, I think) and want to do it - it's just a matter of when it'll make sense, where to record it, etc.
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Damn, you guys got me fucking pumped for the show!!!! Just eleven more days!!!
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Damn, you guys got me fucking pumped for the show!!!! Just eleven more days!!!
Gird your loins.
Okay, here we go, words I never thought I'd say.
I really loved jumping with the crowd every night when the dubstep started.
That's one of my favorite moments on the album. I'll be jumping come saturday.
Yeah, definitely one of the best parts of the show the other night. That section's so good I basically get impatient listening to the first two minutes of the song waiting for the :hat-ness to get here. Same thing happens when Hymn of a Thousand Voices is on and I'm just sitting here impatient for the awesome riff of Our New World to kick in.
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They have definitely given it thought (I discussed it with Ray when we went to see The Dear Hunter, I think) and want to do it - it's just a matter of when it'll make sense, where to record it, etc.
Saturday seems like a good opportunity since it seems like progpower is recorded anyway and other bands have released live albums from that show.
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HAKEN IS ROCKING FREDERICK RIGHT NOW! Nice small venue... The band walked right by at arms length and waved. ... They are killing it now. So good live!
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Great concert... Here's the set list:
Affinity
Falling Back To Earth
1985
Earthrise
Pareidolia
The Architect
Deathless
Cockroach
Endless Knot
What a class act. It was great meeting the band and shaking their hands. Unbelievable!
If you like Haken I think it's a good idea to try and catch them now because as they grow they may not be as accessible as they are now. ... The band was great.
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I saw them on Tuesday and it was one of the best shows I've been to in a long time. I got to meet Rich briefly and he seems like such a genuinely nice, humble guy. Haken is becoming one of my favorite bands. I had to hit up the merch table and bought an awesome hoodie, t-shirt and sticker. I want to rep these guys, more people need to know about them! :metal
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If you like Haken I think it's a good idea to try and catch them now because as they grow they may not be as accessible as they are now. ... The band was great.
I'm curious as to what you think their upside is from a popularity standpoint. Given their style, it's hard to imagine their appeal getting any broader than it is now. And that's okay. The last two albums are very good and they appear to have established themselves as one of the most well-liked bands in a niche subgenre at the moment. Nothing wrong with that. :tup :tup
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If you like Haken I think it's a good idea to try and catch them now because as they grow they may not be as accessible as they are now. ... The band was great.
I'm curious as to what you think their upside is from a popularity standpoint. Given their style, it's hard to imagine their appeal getting any broader than it is now. And that's okay. The last two albums are very good and they appear to have established themselves as one of the most well-liked bands in a niche subgenre at the moment. Nothing wrong with that. :tup :tup
I just think as record sales and exposure increase then so do the crowds. It's not a season for metal/prog so I don't think they'll have a Pull Me Under hit on the radio, but in the prog world they could grow as popular as DT, me thinks.
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I saw them on Tuesday and it was one of the best shows I've been to in a long time. I got to meet Rich briefly and he seems like such a genuinely nice, humble guy. Haken is becoming one of my favorite bands. I had to hit up the merch table and bought an awesome hoodie, t-shirt and sticker. I want to rep these guys, more people need to know about them! :metal
One of my best shows too. I never do Merch (expensive) but I got a T for $20 this time. I had such a great time, I would have bought another, but I had a few beers and ran out of cash. 🙂 I got to chat with Dieggo for awhile. We had a cigarette together right out front after the show. Lol. So fun!
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I fucking love Visions (the song).
It may seem a bit controversial but it's my favourite of all their epics I think. I really love it.
Everyone generally seems to rank others higher from what I remember though.
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Pumped to see them in a few hours! :metal :metal
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I fucking love Visions (the song).
It may seem a bit controversial but it's my favourite of all their epics I think. I really love it.
Everyone generally seems to rank others higher from what I remember though.
You're right, and I don't get it. It's still my favourite record too, even though Affinity is right up against it.
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I fucking love Visions (the song).
It may seem a bit controversial but it's my favourite of all their epics I think. I really love it.
Everyone generally seems to rank others higher from what I remember though.
You're right, and I don't get it. It's still my favourite record too, even though Affinity is right up against it.
I think I prefer Visions over Affinity too just slightly. I still think The Mountain is their #1 for me but honestly I think all their albums are great and ranked very close together.
There was a lot of hype around Affinity when it came out and I heard lots of people saying it was going to be their album of the year. That's fair enough but for me I don't think it will be AOTY. It will likely make my top 10 though. Lots of great albums this year.
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just getting into Haken in the last days. I had listened to them before, but it never "clicked". I had tried Aquarius at that time.
I liked Visions, but was not blown away. I love The Mountain and Restoration, though. The material on this album and EP is really strong!
Haven´t listened to Affinity yet.
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is anyone here by any chance selling a ticket to the LA show? waited too long to move on it and they sold out :-\
Still looking if anyone is selling! :tup
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just getting into Haken in the last days. I had listened to them before, but it never "clicked". I had tried Aquarius at that time.
I liked Visions, but was not blown away. I love The Mountain and Restoration, though. The material on this album and EP is really strong!
Haven´t listened to Affinity yet.
Be prepared for a COMPLETELY different sound. I think it's amazing, and it's gotten great reviews....but it does put meaning into the term "progressive"
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just getting into Haken in the last days. I had listened to them before, but it never "clicked". I had tried Aquarius at that time.
I liked Visions, but was not blown away. I love The Mountain and Restoration, though. The material on this album and EP is really strong!
Haven´t listened to Affinity yet.
Be prepared for a COMPLETELY different sound. I think it's amazing, and it's gotten great reviews....but it does put meaning into the term "progressive"
Tell me about it! I hve listened to Affinity 3 or 4 times now and it it, for me, their best material! AOTY contender for sure! :metal
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I think it's a major exaggeration to say it is a completely different sound, but they definitely added some new elements to their pre-existing sound.
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I thought it sounded somewhat grounded for their standards. Some new elements for sure but overall the first time I came out of a Haken album thinking "that sounded like your typical Haken album". Maybe that's a controversial opinion? :lol
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I for one think it doesn't sound anything like the old Haken. Feels like a different band to me.
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Doesn't sound like old Haken, but it sounds like a followup to The Mountain. Conversely, The Mountain sounded like a total change in direction from Visions.
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And for me, that's a good thing. I like bands that sonically don't stand still.
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I really disagree...but to each their own. I thought every album was different, but a natural progression from the previous album. Affinity seemed like a complete left turn to me. But in a good way.
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The Mountain was tighter and sonically different.
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I thought it sounded somewhat grounded for their standards. Some new elements for sure but overall the first time I came out of a Haken album thinking "that sounded like your typical Haken album". Maybe that's a controversial opinion? :lol
Well they were 'bound by gravity'. I like the mountain more, but affinity is solid.
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In line..... Giggity....
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In line..... Giggity....
I feel you mate, this band gives me nothing but boners.
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Just fucking ridiculous man, I had nothing left after the Pareidolia /Architect duo. They sounded so fucking perfect.
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I'm AT the venue with an extra ticket! Any takers?
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FANTASTIC SHOW!!!!
I couldn't believe how wild the crowd was for a Tuesday! There was a big mosh pit for nearly every song. Ross was even moved to exclaim, "Wow! You guys are a wild bunch, aren't you?" :metal
Great set. Minor sound issues. Band was tight and really got into the energy of the crowd.
I got to meet everyone but Diego briefly. Everyone was awesome. Thank You Scientist was really awesome as well. There were a surprising amount of supporters and a few new converts.
I was really blown away at how much Ross has improved his stage presence. Older videos just show him being the singer, but now he's much more of "a frontman". But the whole band was on fire IMO.
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I'm sorry I missed the show in Phx last Friday. :(
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I just looked at the Comcast home page and there is a video about a dying star tearing planets apart and immediately thought of Hakens affinity album.
Lots of great lyrics on this cd.
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Just a heads-up, it's november again, which means the annual Haken Survivor is starting in Polls & Survivors. I posted the intro post in the Results&Discussion (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=48779.0). Let's do this once again. I'll post the first actual poll tomorrow at around this time.
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Hype.
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Sweet, I'll get in on this action.
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............
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YES!
The band comes back to Europe, also Germany AND ALSO MY HOMETOWM DRESDEN OMG
I offered them to show them around the town, they just answered with "That's be great!" :D
22nd March – Rescue Rooms, Nottingham, UK
23rd March – O2 ABC2, Glasgow, UK
24th March – Academy 3, Manchester, UK
25th March – O2 Academy 2, Birmingham, UK
26th March – Islington Assembly Hall, London, UK
28th March – Le Splendid, Lille, France
29th March – La Maroquinerie, Paris, France
30th March – La Laiterie, Strasbourg, France
31st March – KIFF, Aarau, Switzerland
1st April – Keller Klub, Stuttgart, Germany
3rd April – Zona Roveri, Bologna, Italy
4th April – Szene, Vienna, Austria
5th April – Dürer-Kert, Budapest, Hungary
6th April – Futurum, Prague, Czech Republic
7th April – Beatpol, Dresden, Germany
9th April – Chez Heinz, Hannover, Germany
10th April – Kesselhaus, Wiesbaden, Germany
11th April – Turock, Essen, Germany
12th April – Rockhal, Esch-Sur-Alzette, Luxembourg
13th April – Melkweg OZ, Amsterdam, Holland
15th April – Bascula Club, Tel Aviv, Israel
Also, Aquarius & Visions will be remastered and re-released as 2CD and vinyl. YEY!
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Yep, I'll definitely be going to the Birmingham show :tup
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Exciting news! I'm definetely getting Aquarius and Visions vinyls.
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Yes, I do want them as well, even though I have both records on CD already :lol
I'm hoping for a Green one for Aquarius and Blue/Purple for Visions :biggrin:
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23rd March – O2 ABC2, Glasgow, UK
:metal :metal :metal :metal
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Awesome, I hope I can go to the show in Amsterdam :metal
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I might just check them out again when they go to Amsterdam. Hope they are included in the batch of free concerts for Melkweg members, I know BTBAM and Protest the Hero were and Haken aren't much bigger so there's a chance I could enter for free :corn
I hope that since this is no longer the AffiniTour they play a more balanced set, I like Affinity but would love to see some more Aquarius love next time around.
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Hope they are included in the batch of free concerts for Melkweg members, I know BTBAM and Protest the Hero were and Haken aren't much bigger so there's a chance I could enter for free :corn
I'm pretty sure Haken aren't nearly as big as BTBAM, or PTH for that matter.
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I can't say for sure, but all I know is I've been to both shows last year, and Haken was way more packed than BTBAM/PTH. Neither had an absolutely massive crowd though.
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Well going by Facebook followers, BTBAM and PTH both have nearly 5 times as many followers as Haken. Not sure how much that actually reflects how 'big' they are.
More to the point though, Haken are infinitely better than BTBAM and PTH (and I do like both of those bands)
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You guys are probably right, I do not have any ground to judge these band's popularity outside of the information I have been given since I only know a handful of fans of these bands in person. So I assumed a concert's turnout was the most accurate way of telling, but facebook likes is probably more accurate.
Nonetheless, I like them both way better than Haken but that's just me :lol and since I am in the vast minority here I will just keep my mouth shut and continue the actual Haken discussion. Very likely going to that Melkweg show, should be good!
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I hope that since this is no longer the AffiniTour they play a more balanced set, I like Affinity but would love to see some more Aquarius love next time around.
Their website says:
In honour of the ten years Haken has existed, we'll be revisiting material from our entire back catalogue with a special focus on our first two albums 'Aquarius' and 'Visions', which are to be re-released in advance of the tour
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Really hope they do some dates in America around ProgPower this go around with this type of set. I was tentatively looking at attending ProgPower again, but now September has other interests in store...
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So it looks like I'll have to get a 2nd copy of Visions in order to get Aquarius. I'm fine with that, if that's what has to be done.
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Not too thrilled about the remasters. Bogren's full remix of Remedy Lane is interesting, but I don't see much potential in simply remastering albums that had decent masters to begin with
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So it looks like I'll have to get a 2nd copy of Visions in order to get Aquarius. I'm fine with that, if that's what has to be done.
I don't think so. My understanding of the announcement is that they are being released separately as DIFFERENT 2CD versions, where the second disc on each is an instrumental version of the album (like they did on Affinity). Personally I don't really have any interest at all in that second disc, but there you go.
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OK, that's cool! Just happy to see that Aquarius will be reissued, as I missed it the first time round. Will be nice to be able to complete the discography.
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So it looks like I'll have to get a 2nd copy of Visions in order to get Aquarius. I'm fine with that, if that's what has to be done.
I don't think so. My understanding of the announcement is that they are being released separately as DIFFERENT 2CD versions, where the second disc on each is an instrumental version of the album (like they did on Affinity). Personally I don't really have any interest at all in that second disc, but there you go.
Meh. I kinda want it for completionists sake, but have no reason for that. I'll likely get the vinyl version of both albums though.
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Instrumental versions are always fun for me. I very rarely listen to them, but it's fun to have if you want to like sing along by yourself or something or just to hear more of what's going on behind the vocals.
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I want the vinyl albums and at least the CD for Visions since I don't own it yet. Would be cool if they had a Vinyl+CD combo like what they usually do.
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I assume that, like with most releases, the vinyl will come with the main disc.
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If it's true that the second disc is all instrumental mixes (is this confirmed?) then I will probably just stick with the vinyl.
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Burning Shed and Amazon both have the reissues of Aquarius and Visions available for pre-order, with a February 3rd release date. 2nd CD in each case is an instrumental mix of the album.
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The way they're splitting the Visions vinyl is bloody stupid. They made side B run 25 minutes (huge no-no for sound quality) just so side D can be Visions instrumental. One of the dumbest decisions I've ever seen.
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Vinyl in itself is a huge no-no for sound quality, so...
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Vinyl in itself is a huge no-no for sound quality, so...
That's pretty debatable, and not in the nostalgic/fetishistic/"it sounds warm" way – in the way that it's not blown out and crushed like most digital/CD masters are now. I'll gladly take a well mastered digital version over vinyl anyday, but the fact is almost nobody except Steven Wilson is doing that. It's starting to spread more, but it's usually still lifeless and loud for no reason. So vinyl is usually the only way to avoid that and just hear what the album bloody sounds like. As long as you keep the record clean, it doesn't really get marred by rumble very much, and it breathes better. The only bad thing is the companies cheaping out by sending the CD master to the vinyl manufacturers. Eugh.
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I think I've mentioned this before, but you can't say that vinyl is universally a better or worse format. There are good vinyl masters and bad ones. But the CD format tends to get abused more often. The Visions vinyl layout is disappointing, but I'll get it anyway. 25 minutes is rough, especially when the end of the song is so loud.
Been awhile since I've listened to Visions but Aquarius could use a new mix. Are these remixed too or just remastered?
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Just remasters.
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I don't take my vinyls out of the plastic, so it's all good to me as long as I get the Visions cover in vinyl format on my shelf.
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I don't take my vinyls out of the plastic, so it's all good to me as long as I get the Visions cover in vinyl format on my shelf.
Do you mean the shrinkwrap they come in when you buy them (usually)? If so, that's a bad idea. The pressure bends the corners and will help create cover rings you see on all those ancient albums, even when they haven't been abused. The best way to keep the cover pristine is to keep the albums in polybag sleeves, with the records out of the gatefold (keep them in the polybag, just behind the gatefold itself). Guarantees very little dust and no cover warping.
Gonna try to keep this as the last vinyl nerd post in the thread. :lol
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Just watched the ProgPower 2011 performance of Celestial Elixir. Again. This band is just all kinds of awesome. That is all.
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I just discovered this band. I listened to Celestial Elixir and Visions.
:hefdaddy :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
Jesus. Both songs are simply magnificent. Celestial Elixir hit me emotionally in a way that hasn't happened since I first heard Octavarium and Visions is one of the most epic pieces of music I have ever heard. I definitely have to check out more of their stuff and if it's anywhere close to those two songs, they have a new fan in me.
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Welcome to Haken-land, it's awesome here.
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[removed]
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I love listening to the instrumental version of Affinity, have nothing against Ross but there's so much happening in the music arrangements that's easy to miss when you have the vocal layers in the way.
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Had just recently been introduced to Haken and that was through suggestions after listening to a Steven Wilson song. First song was "The Point of No Return" and found out I liked that song very much, especially the instrument solo that was divided into sections. Since then, I've been growing used to them a lot.
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So I'm not usually one to edit albums around, but one of my issues with Affinity has been that I feel the second half (or disc, if you've got the vinyl) isn't quite as strong. I find that listening to the first disc of the vinyl by itself actually works as a full album. So I just made a playlist of that, but with Endless Knot as the closing track. It actually works really well as a 40 minute album to my ears. Maybe check it out sometime if you want a different take on the album.
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So I'm not usually one to edit albums around, but one of my issues with Affinity has been that I feel the second half (or disc, if you've got the vinyl) isn't quite as strong. I find that listening to the first disc of the vinyl by itself actually works as a full album. So I just made a playlist of that, but with Endless Knot as the closing track. It actually works really well as a 40 minute album to my ears. Maybe check it out sometime if you want a different take on the album.
I'd sooner drop the opening duo, "Lapse," and "The Endless Knot" than leave out the three you've excised. They're the best on the record after the epics, imo.
01. 1985
02. Earthrise
03. Red Giant
04. The Architect
05. Bound by Gravity
Not that they needed to leave anything off, obviously. The material is strong throughout.
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So I'm not usually one to edit albums around, but one of my issues with Affinity has been that I feel the second half (or disc, if you've got the vinyl) isn't quite as strong. I find that listening to the first disc of the vinyl by itself actually works as a full album. So I just made a playlist of that, but with Endless Knot as the closing track. It actually works really well as a 40 minute album to my ears. Maybe check it out sometime if you want a different take on the album.
I'd sooner drop the opening duo, "Lapse," and "The Endless Knot" than leave out the three you've excised. They're the best on the record after the epics, imo.
01. 1985
02. Earthrise
03. Red Giant
04. The Architect
05. Bound by Gravity
Not that they needed to leave anything off, obviously. The material is strong throughout.
Pretty much the last statement, but that's a solid 5 track punch. Hard to leave the Endless Knot off it though (or really the rest of the album).
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So I'm not usually one to edit albums around, but one of my issues with Affinity has been that I feel the second half (or disc, if you've got the vinyl) isn't quite as strong. I find that listening to the first disc of the vinyl by itself actually works as a full album. So I just made a playlist of that, but with Endless Knot as the closing track. It actually works really well as a 40 minute album to my ears. Maybe check it out sometime if you want a different take on the album.
I'd sooner drop the opening duo, "Lapse," and "The Endless Knot" than leave out the three you've excised. They're the best on the record after the epics, imo.
01. 1985
02. Earthrise
03. Red Giant
04. The Architect
05. Bound by Gravity
Not that they needed to leave anything off, obviously. The material is strong throughout.
I don't really care for Initiate, but I was trying to preserve the thematic flow of the album at least a little. I also considered Endless Knot as the album opener and Earthrise as the closer.
I think Lapse is a great little song. Maybe overshadowed by some of the more involved tunes.
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I'm surprised to see many people dont like Bound by Gravity. I like it
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I'm surprised to see many people dont like Bound by Gravity. I like it
I like it too
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Bound by gravity is the best song on the album tbh
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"Bound by Gravity" is my favorite song on the album.
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Bound by gravity is the best song on the album tbh
yes
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I can't call it the best or my favorite, but it's definitely pretty great. Certainly at least in the conversation for best song from the record.
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Bound by gravity is the best song on the album tbh
yes
2nd best behind 1985 to me but I'm also surprised at the amount of people that don't like it
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Bound by Gravity is somewhere in the middle of the album for me, but it's a song that I can't see people really disliking. It is surprising to me to see people with an active distaste for it.
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It's not my favourite, but I certainly prefer it to Red Giant and Earthrise.
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Love me some Bound By Gravity. Red Giant is the only song that hasn't really clicked yet with me from the new album.
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Just stumbled across some surprisingly good footage of their Progpower 2016 show:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVVYUthc76k&list=PLG5p64sB1pnfLGL7s8NhxsOwQqQE-BKbI
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anyone know if there will be US-based vinyl available for the reissues? really want the color variants from InsideOut EU but its super expensive once you add the import shipping, so wondering if i can get something cheaper without missing out on something cool and limited :mehlin
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I think Bound by Gravity is, by far, the weakest song in the album. It's just an OK song to me.
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I feel like "Bound by Gravity" is to Affinity, as "Space-Dye Vest" is to Awake, in a way.
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anyone know if there will be US-based vinyl available for the reissues? really want the color variants from InsideOut EU but its super expensive once you add the import shipping, so wondering if i can get something cheaper without missing out on something cool and limited :mehlin
Try burningshed. Not sure if those are the colored ones, I assumed they all were but could be wrong. Anyway, it's $30 each including shipping which is pretty reasonable IMO.
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Supporting acts for the Haken tour confirmed:
- The Algorithm
- Next To None
Very weird line-up for a Haken show to be honest, but I bet the band is just friends with Portnoy and therefore made the connection with his son or something. I really really want to see The Algorithm so I might try and make it to this show even though I'm not dying to see Haken again.
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meh, i was hoping for some quality bands :loser:
Now on a serious note, I have no idea who The Algorithm are and I don't really like Next To None. Their instrumentals are ok I guess, but I can't stand the teenage vocals
how come I like Spencer Sotelo then...? :neverusethis:
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You'll probably hate them lol (The Algorithm). It's one producer and a drummer IIRC, the producer is super cringy because he always turns knobs on the DJ booth like it is rocket science when really he is just adjusting the volume or something.
Their music is like extremely djent-y proggy electronic music, many would call them 'complex for the sake of complex'. I personally think they are awesome though, and their shows seem pretty sick.
Next To None sounds like an average metalcore band, but yeah, the vocals are pretty bad and are the single reason why I haven't put in the effort to listen to a full album despite the instrumentals being fine.
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I don't know why you would make the assumption I wouldn't like them. I listen to a lot of electronic music and djent. :biggrin: Definitely a weird combination though.
I checked out the songs "pointers" and "Trojans" and it's pretty dope to be honest. Must be very cool live, but god you were 100% right about the producer/guitarist guy. Definitely will check them out more after I'm finished with my exams.
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Alright, cool! I don't know, for some reason I assumed you didn't like electronics in metal.
"Bouncing Dot" is my favourite song, though the new album "Brute Force" as a whole is probably stronger than the album that song is off (forgot the name even).
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Alright, cool! I don't know, for some reason I assumed you didn't like electronics in metal.
Might be because I bashed the electronics in Periphery's Remain Indoors a lot back when the album was released. I still believe that those are trully horrendous electronics though.
Jake's electronic album is my favourite thing to spin when I'm studying something that doesn't require full concentration.
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This is one of those very rare instances where the US made out on touring... we got Thank You Scientist and Europe gets... not Thank You Scientist, to put it kindly.
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This is one of those very rare instances where the US made out on touring... we got Thank You Scientist and Europe gets... not Thank You Scientist, to put it kindly.
Yea, I'm still waiting to see Thank You, Scientist. Coheed and Cambria toured over here twice last year and TYS supported on neither :censored
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This is one of those very rare instances where the US made out on touring... we got Thank You Scientist and Europe gets... not Thank You Scientist, to put it kindly.
Yea, I'm still waiting to see Thank You, Scientist. Coheed and Cambria toured over here twice last year and TYS supported on neither :censored
meanwhile C&C never come to my country so don't complain :lol
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This is one of those very rare instances where the US made out on touring... we got Thank You Scientist and Europe gets... not Thank You Scientist, to put it kindly.
Yea, I'm still waiting to see Thank You, Scientist. Coheed and Cambria toured over here twice last year and TYS supported on neither :censored
meanwhile C&C never come to my country so don't complain :lol
Fair point. Too easy to take these things for granted :lol thanks for the reality check.
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Isn't this cool, peaceful and goosebumps-giving?
https://www.facebook.com/RichHenshall/videos/700525333449293/
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Haken is headlining the opening night at ProgPower USA in September? I just noticed that. Very cool!
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https://metalblade.com/novacollective/
Very interesting side project :tup
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Haken is headlining the opening night at ProgPower USA in September? I just noticed that. Very cool!
With all of Visions live :o
https://bravewords.com/news/haken-streaming-remastered-version-of-streams-track-band-look-back-on-aquarius-in-new-video
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https://metalblade.com/novacollective/
Very interesting side project :tup
Sounds very nice indeed.
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Haken is headlining the opening night at ProgPower USA in September? I just noticed that. Very cool!
With all of Visions live :o
https://bravewords.com/news/haken-streaming-remastered-version-of-streams-track-band-look-back-on-aquarius-in-new-video
Woah, that remastered Streams sounds nice!
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It seems almost remixed, very good job!
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Yes, better than I expected. The "deadly" section in the middle seems to be held back by limitations of the mix, but the rest of the track is a clear improvement.
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Been listening to the remasters for a couple of weeks now. I won't say there isn't improvement, but overall I haven't been as taken by them as you guys are. Did some side by side comparisons and it's definitely better, but only marginally I thought, though it is of course louder.
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I'm just excited for the albums to be officially available again.
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I'm just excited for the albums to be officially available again.
Same! I'm probably going to pick up both albums on vinyl even though I own both on CD already :lol . I also thought the remaster of Streams improves on the original, it sounds a bit less cluttered and more open and clear. I especially heard the difference with the snare drum and the clearness of the vocals.
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Been listening to the remasters for a couple of weeks now. I won't say there isn't improvement, but overall I haven't been as taken by them as you guys are. Did some side by side comparisons and it's definitely better, but only marginally I thought, though it is of course louder.
How does the Visions remaster fare compared to Aquarius?
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I reviewed Haken's reissues (https://www.musicalypse.net/2017-haken-aquarius-visions-reissues/) with fresh ears, having only heard Affinity from them before. I already got some shit from a fellow staff member for criticizing Celestial Elixir, so this might be a controversial read. :lol
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I reviewed Haken's reissues (https://www.musicalypse.net/2017-haken-aquarius-visions-reissues/) with fresh ears, having only heard Affinity from them before. I already got some shit from a fellow staff member for criticizing Celestial Elixir, so this might be a controversial read. :lol
It's "Drowning in the Flood" not "Lost in the Flood" (just pointing out an oversight)......and I *LOVE* the ending of that track!!! The key change over the harmony is literally my favorite moment on the entire album.
Just shocked. Everyone carry on... :metal
EDIT: And you still haven't heard their best album....their masterpiece....IMO, the best prog rock album of the ENTIRE DECADE!!!! I'm dying here!!! :lol
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And you still haven't heard their best album....their masterpiece....IMO, the best prog rock album of the ENTIRE DECADE!!!! I'm dying here!!! :lol
You should have read the review more thoroughly. He clearly stated that he had listened to Affinity ;)
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And you still haven't heard their best album....their masterpiece....IMO, the best prog rock album of the ENTIRE DECADE!!!! I'm dying here!!! :lol
You should have read the review more thoroughly. He clearly stated that he had listened to Affinity ;)
And you call yourself a disciple...
criticizing Celestial Elixir
(https://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachments/55350d1334173072-get-f-ck-eric_cartman_south_park_get_the_fudge_out.jpg)
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And you call yourself a disciple...
I, indeed, have strayed far from the path :blush
Anyway, I listened to the remastered Aquarius today and find it to be a mixed bag. I like how the low end is less boomy and makes bass lines easier to follow, but the added compression is really annoying at times.
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Been listening to the remasters for a couple of weeks now. I won't say there isn't improvement, but overall I haven't been as taken by them as you guys are. Did some side by side comparisons and it's definitely better, but only marginally I thought, though it is of course louder.
How does the Visions remaster fare compared to Aquarius?
Sorry, missed this. I think the obvious thing with them being both remastered at the same time by the same person is that they end up sounding a little more like each other.
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I reviewed Haken's reissues (https://www.musicalypse.net/2017-haken-aquarius-visions-reissues/) with fresh ears, having only heard Affinity from them before. I already got some shit from a fellow staff member for criticizing Celestial Elixir, so this might be a controversial read. :lol
??? Why would you criticize their best song??
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Waiting on the vinyl to listen to the remastered Aquarius, but my main problem was the drum sound. Is it better?
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Having only listened to a couple of the songs so far, I'd say the drums is the biggest difference. In my opinion they are much better and clearer/cleaner now.
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It's "Drowning in the Flood" not "Lost in the Flood" (just pointing out an oversight)......and I *LOVE* the ending of that track!!! The key change over the harmony is literally my favorite moment on the entire album.
Whoopsie, thanks for pointing out that error!
I reviewed Haken's reissues (https://www.musicalypse.net/2017-haken-aquarius-visions-reissues/) with fresh ears, having only heard Affinity from them before. I already got some shit from a fellow staff member for criticizing Celestial Elixir, so this might be a controversial read. :lol
??? Why would you criticize their best song??
That's the exact comment I got from the fellow writer. :P I don't like the circus sections, but the rest of the song is fine - more than fine actually, because that chorus = :hefdaddy
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So, is The Mountain the only release without instrumental versions now? How cool would be having instrumental versions of every Haken release? Damn, that album is just too perfect...
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Does Restoration have instrumental versions? I don't remember.
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Does Restoration have instrumental versions? I don't remember.
True, I think Restoration does not have them either.
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It wouldn't surprise me if, eventually, The Mountain and even possibly Restoration get this reissue treatment, with the instrumental versions included.
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They both are already under the control of Inside Out Music. I don't see a reissue happening soon.
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Ah! Aquarius is finally on Spotify. *Dances naked*
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They both are already under the control of Inside Out Music. I don't see a reissue happening soon.
That, and The Mountain is such a vocal centric album. So many songs would be incomplete or have a lot of empty space in them because of all the a cappella sections.
Restoration wouldn't be as bad. You'd only have to cut out that a cappella section in the middle of Crystallised(Starting at 9:16)
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Just seen the back cover of the Aquarius CD reissue on Amazon, and track 7 is listed as "Celestial", without "Elixir". Is it a typo or have they actually changed the song title 7 years on?
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I don't have my reissues in from Germany yet, but yesterday they introduced it as Celestial Elixir.
On the US tour I got to see it a couple of times, but Hen didn't have a keyboard along, so some parts were slightly different. Not a problem on the boat, finally got it in its full glory.
Also worth noting we got the premier of Lapse.
Also worth noting Bill and I beat Ray in soccer, so he has brought shame to his country.
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Also worth noting Bill and I beat Ray in soccer, so he has brought shame to his country.
Yeah Ireland sucks at football. :P
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I'm waiting for the reissues to arrive, since I don't have the original versions on CD.
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Already had Visions before the re-issue :>
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Anyone know why their albums aren't available as digital copies from Amazon and the like? I only buy downloads.
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Anyone know why their albums aren't available as digital copies from Amazon and the like? I only buy downloads.
Yes, they are available in Amazon.
Here's Affinity, but the others are available as well.
https://www.amazon.com/Affinity-Haken/dp/B01CA6IH6A/ref=sr_1_2_twi_mus_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1486938107&sr=8-2&keywords=haken
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Anyone know why their albums aren't available as digital copies from Amazon and the like? I only buy downloads.
Yes, they are available in Amazon.
Here's Affinity, but the others are available as well.
https://www.amazon.com/Affinity-Haken/dp/B01CA6IH6A/ref=sr_1_2_twi_mus_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1486938107&sr=8-2&keywords=haken
Cool. I've been checking Amazon for a long time but I see they just came out with these re-issues last week. Nice!
I think The Mountain was available all along but the first two weren't available for download. I'm not a fan of Affinity but I've only heard it once. I'll be buying the first three definitely. Thanks.
Edit: Wow the bass sounds a lot more present on Aquarius. Very nice.
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Got my copies of the remasters on vinyl yesterday and listened to them today.
They sound great. Very well mastered. There was some concern in this thread about side 2 of Visions running long but it's not a problem at all. That album is sequenced unfortunately, since Mind's Eye-Shapshifter have to be on the same side, but it works out fine. Deathless is a mostly quiet track so it isn't affected by running toward the inner edge of the record. No compromise in sound quality.
The remaster is good. They didn't do a lot to it, but I think that's a good thing. They were able to maintain the spirit of the originals while evening out the edges. Small details like bass presence and cymbals are fixed up. That's all these albums needed.
Also, it's funny revisiting these albums now. They've changed quite a bit since Visions. Forgot how manic some of their songs were, structure-wise.
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Just seen the back cover of the Aquarius CD reissue on Amazon, and track 7 is listed as "Celestial", without "Elixir". Is it a typo or have they actually changed the song title 7 years on?
From what I've seen the CD is misprinted. The vinyl is correct.
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I have no idea why it took me this long to buy Affinity. It's great. 1985 is such a fun song and I love the whole thing about that song.
I'll be playing this a lot now. Not too much to get tired of it. But I don't usually do that.
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Ok. I think I am officially hooked.
I am not the biggest fan of Ross's voice (too.. clean?) but still.. I think I am officially on the bandwagon.
I do have to say.. the riff at about 5min in on Celestial Elixir is so fucking pretty... it's kinda what pulled me in.
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This is seriously one of those bands that I absolutely love every....single....note. So rare that happens.
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I had not listened to one note of Haken until last week. Now I cannot stop, I just roll through the discography over and over. I can't believe I missed out on this awesomeness for so long.
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What did it for me was seeing a proshot / recording of Celestial Elixir. Just seeing them pull this shit off live is awesome.
I actually listened to the debut and the second album a lot as background music a few years back, but never really digested it.
I gave them another try when Affinity came out. But NOW Its finally happening.
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Most of the first two albums still leave me hollow, but the bulk of the Mountain is pretty great, and Affinity is their best record yet. I think they are on the verge of making their first great record.
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Most of the first two albums still leave me hollow, but the bulk of the Mountain Affinity is pretty great, and Affinity The Mountain is their best record yet. I think they are on the verge of making their first great record.
Agreed. The debut I just don't care for much of and Visions feels waaay too DT-like at times. I like it, but it has less of a personality than The Mountain and Affinity and I don't have much desire to go back and listen to it.
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I've been listening to the first two albums a lot lately because of the remasters. Their sound has definitely changed for the better. Even listening to Affinity after the two albums, an album I wasn't crazy about, I at least prefer them going in that direction. A lot of songs on the first two albums are pretty bloated. Like Streams really doesn't need to be 11 minutes.
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It was pretty awesome on the cruise, I've met the guys from Haken each time I've seen them, to the point now where Ray and Richard recognised me and my friend :lol
Spent quite a bit of time drinking with Ray, singing karaoke with Ray and watching Portnoy with Ray :rollin
On the last night we got absolutely hammered and we met outside the ship the next morning... looking pretty rough.
Pic related.
(https://image.ibb.co/fnCCdv/ray.jpg)
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:metal :metal :metal
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Most of the first two albums still leave me hollow, but the bulk of the Mountain Affinity is pretty great, and Affinity The Mountain is their best record yet. I think they are on the verge of making their first great record.
Agreed. The debut I just don't care for much of and Visions feels waaay too DT-like at times. I like it, but it has less of a personality than The Mountain and Affinity and I don't have much desire to go back and listen to it.
I know what you mean. It's sounds like well-played prog, but the hooks aren't there, and it doesn't help that the singer's voice is always such an obstacle for me to get over.
I've been listening to the first two albums a lot lately because of the remasters. Their sound has definitely changed for the better. Even listening to Affinity after the two albums, an album I wasn't crazy about, I at least prefer them going in that direction. A lot of songs on the first two albums are pretty bloated. Like Streams really doesn't need to be 11 minutes.
Very true. I still think Celestial Elixir is pretty great, largely because that instrumental section in the middle is stellar (with the rest of the song being just good), but just about every other song on Aquarius feels like work to get through.
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The second half of Drowning in the Flood is a top 3 all time Haken moment for me.
That key change on the repeat.....GOOSEBUMPS!!!!!!
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The second half of Drowning in the Flood is a top 3 all time Haken moment for me.
That key change on the repeat.....GOOSEBUMPS!!!!!!
Fuck yes. Best song on the album, though CE is also great.
I still love Visions, but yeah I agree that those two albums were still their formative years. The Mountain and Affinity are where they've really found their style and hit their stride.
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Most of the first two albums still leave me hollow, but the bulk of the Mountain is pretty great, and Affinity is their best record yet. I think they are on the verge of making their first great record.
To me, The Mountain is the best album ever made. I think it is way more than a great record, to be honest.
And so are the others, they're all great albums, with a lot of variety and great melodies and sections.
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I agree that they took a big step up from the first two with The Mountain. I prefer Aquarius over Visions (and CE is my favourite Haken track), I can't find anything on Visions that grabs me like the other albums do.
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So...... back in the day ariich posted "Snow" on the forums, and I listened to it and loved it.
I remember when Aquarius was getting ready to drop and I was like "I'll get that".
But for whatever reason I never did.
Haken was a band that I knew that I would love if I gave a chance.
But for whatever reason I never did.
Finally, last Saturday, I signed up for Spottily. I thought of some bands that I wanted to check out but haven't purchased any of their stuff yet. (I don't illegally download music or mess with youtube). I put a shuffle on Haken to see what I've been missing... and holy shit. Shame on me.
I've been listening to it all non-stop. I'm not ready to rank anything.... except maybe Visions being the best album.... but damn, I missed out on a band that ariich gave us ground floor access to!
Better late than never I suppose!
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except maybe Visions being the best album
wat
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Told you, DoC! :P
Better late than never man, welcome to the club.
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except maybe Visions being the best album
wat
Hey, I'm not saying Visions is the best but I bloody love it and think it is only a hair behind The Mountain and Affinity. Visions doesn't seem to get anywhere near as much love as I think it deserves.
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I need to ask..
How is Haken pronounced?
Like Taken?
Like Hack'n?
Like Hawk en?
Its been bugging me lately..
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I need to ask..
How is Haken pronounced?
Like Taken?
Like Hack'n?
Like Hawk en?
Its been bugging me lately..
Check the thread title :lol
I'm assuming at some point it was titled Haken v. like Bacon then was updated to like Baconisions, v. The Bacontain :tup
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visions is just kinda bland tbh. it's not bad but it's flavorless compared to their other stuff
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I need to ask..
How is Haken pronounced?
Like Taken?
Like Hack'n?
Like Hawk en?
Its been bugging me lately..
Check the thread title :lol
I'm assuming at some point it was titled Haken v. like Bacon then was updated to like Baconisions, v. The Bacontain :tup
Fuck me.. that didn't even register.
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Is it really like bacon? :lol I always thought thread title meant Haken is good as bacon. It seems like I've been pronouncing it wrong the whole time...
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I have been pronouncing it Hack-en
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Yep, definitely pronounced like bacon. I'm pretty sure they have a t-shirt which even has a picture of Kevin Bacon on it :lol or did I imagine that?
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At first I thought it was "Haa-ken" like the company that makes the Continuum (the cool synth-pad thing that Jordan Rudess first used on Octavarium), but after I became a fan, the band were quick to point out, on Facebook, that their name is pronounced like Bacon, but with a K.
For the longest time I was also mispronouncing Anathema - it's Uh-NATH-eh-ma, not Anna-THE-ma.
And regarding Visions, I'm on the train that loves it too. Something about the conceptual feel of the album where the title track's various themes are woven throughout the whole album, so that when you get to the end, it feels VERY cohesive. That closing epic is just truly amazing, though, especially the last part!
-Marc.
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And regarding Visions, I'm on the train that loves it too. Something about the conceptual feel of the album where the title track's various themes are woven throughout the whole album, so that when you get to the end, it feels VERY cohesive. That closing epic is just truly amazing, though, especially the last part!
-Marc.
Yep, I totally agree with this. It's the closing epic which really sells this album for me, it's like a perfect example of a prog epic, I truly love it :heart
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I have to admit that most of Visions is a blur for me. Every time I try to listen to it, it just moves along with nothing really grabbing me. It all sounds like well-played prog, but the hooks are not there for me on that one. Same goes for the first album, too, except for that amazing instrumental section in Celestial Elixir. I think almost all of their best songs are from the last two albums:
The Path/Atlas Stone
In Memoriam
Because It's There
Falling Back to Earth
Pareidolia
The Architect
Earthrise
Bound by Gravity
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Yep, definitely pronounced like bacon. I'm pretty sure they have a t-shirt which even has a picture of Kevin Bacon on it :lol or did I imagine that?
That depends, can your imagination think up something quite this sexy?
(https://www.wpapu.com/images/HakenBacon.jpg)
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6 degrees of Kevin Haken.
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I'm surprised by the lack of love for Visions. I think a lot of it is just down to the fact they've released more albums since, so people have something to compare it to. When it was newly-released, there was a ton of love for it. But then, I should be used to this. (Many of) You lot always seem to hate the great albums.
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i've been following haken since their demo days & i felt visions was a bit of a disappointment on release. i've hardly ever revisited it since the mountain was released, and i still come back to aquarius occasionally
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I'm surprised by the lack of love for Visions. I think a lot of it is just down to the fact they've released more albums since, so people have something to compare it to. When it was newly-released, there was a ton of love for it. But then, I should be used to this. (Many of) You lot always seem to hate the great albums.
Yeah, I never liked Visions that much :lol. It has some great songs on it though, I love Shapeshifter, Nocturnal Conspiracy and Insomnia
I'm also not a huge Haken fan, but I think Aquarius and The Mountain are better in almost every aspect so it's more likely for me to put those ones on if I happen to listen to them
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I'll join the bandwagon too, never been able to get into Visions at all. I think everything they've been doing since then ranges from good to great though, especially Affinity.
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I really do love all their albums and I'd rank The Mountain>Affinity>Visions>Aquarius>Restoration. Visions is quite a bit better than Aquarius for me, I guess Aquarius feels like the debut that it is and Visions feels more refined. As I've said before though, I love the title track and it is the main highlight. The rest of the album is pretty solid but it's the climax of the album that seals the deal for me. If I wasn't a fan of the title track though (and I can understand why some of you aren't) the album would end up ranking lower I guess.
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I'd rank Visions last of their albums. Not that there's anything wrong with the album, there's just no track that grabs me like their other albums do.
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I'd rank Visions last of their albums. Not that there's anything wrong with the album, there's just no track that grabs me like their other albums do.
This.
Although the title track is amazing. I love when they play it live as last song and after they finish, the whole crowd goes OOOH-OOH-OOH-OOOOH-OOOH-OOOOOH and just continues to sing the melody! That always gives me goosebumps.
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I never understood the pronounciation confusion. Why would it be pronounced any other way than Taken but with an H? Or why would any other way to say it be your first assumption?
Also, I think Visions is a fantastic album even though I rank it last among their full length releases.
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I never understood the pronounciation confusion. Why would it be pronounced any other way than Taken but with an H? Or why would any other way to say it be your first assumption?
When I saw the band's name in the font they used on Aquarius/Visions, I imagined a Scandinavian Black Metal band spelled Haah-Ken.
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I don't think I've got through Visions entirely more than once. I just really don't like a single song except for Nocturnal Conspiracy.
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The first three songs on Visions are as fantastic as any of the band's other amazing songs. After that, the album starts to lose me and even with the title track doesn't pick up that much. But the first three tracks alone make the album better than Affinity overall.
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I always loved Premonition, fantastic intro. I don't really like the first half of Nocturnal Conspiracy. Some of the weakest Haken moments for me. Insomnia, Deathless and the 3-part suite in the middle are great though. Visions the song just blows me away.
Also I have to say, I never really liked the snare drum sound on Visions.
With Affinity they have taken their music to a whole other level. The keyboard sounds are amazing, Ray is just on fire, the melodies are great (Architect, wow). I love all Haken albums but I think Affinity is my favorite.
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I never understood the pronounciation confusion. Why would it be pronounced any other way than Taken but with an H? Or why would any other way to say it be your first assumption?
I did think it was pronounced "Har-ken" at first, because it made me think of the sea monster, the kraken.
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I think The Mountain has higher highs than Affinity, but Affinity is far more consistent. The Mountain has three songs I can do without (Cockroach King, As Death Embraces, Somebody), while Affinity really only has one skipper (Initiate), not counting the intro track 1.
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while Affinity really only has one skipper (Initiate)
a.k.a the second best song on the album
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while Affinity really only has one skipper (Initiate)
a.k.a the best song on the album
FTFM
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I think The Mountain has higher highs than Affinity, but Affinity is far more consistent. The Mountain has three songs I can do without (Cockroach King, As Death Embraces, Somebody), while Affinity really only has one skipper (Initiate), not counting the intro track 1.
Wow that's weird :D Cockroach King???
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Holy crap, I love this band.
They have been on non-stop rotation in my life for the past month or so.
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I think The Mountain has higher highs than Affinity, but Affinity is far more consistent. The Mountain has three songs I can do without (Cockroach King, As Death Embraces, Somebody), while Affinity really only has one skipper (Initiate), not counting the intro track 1.
Wow that's weird :D Cockroach King???
In full agreement with Kev on CK and Initiate. For the record ;)
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Still playing this stuff non-stop. As of now, my two favorite songs are Visions and The Architect.....but gonna keep spinning them before I come up with actual rankings. Just in awe at how ridiculously great this band is.
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I think The Mountain has higher highs than Affinity, but Affinity is far more consistent. The Mountain has three songs I can do without (Cockroach King, As Death Embraces, Somebody), while Affinity really only has one skipper (Initiate), not counting the intro track 1.
Wow that's weird :D Cockroach King???
In full agreement with Kev on CK and Initiate. For the record ;)
*high five* :hat
I think The Mountain has higher highs than Affinity, but Affinity is far more consistent. The Mountain has three songs I can do without (Cockroach King, As Death Embraces, Somebody), while Affinity really only has one skipper (Initiate), not counting the intro track 1.
Wow that's weird :D Cockroach King???
I feel like I've addressed this 384 times already :lol. but musically it is great, but vocally it is not, IMO. The vocals are way too cartoonish, and in a cringe-worthy way. I get that it's a song most fans love, but it's not for me. Those kind of harmonies I often do not like when Spock's Beard and Neal Morse do them (and I a huge fan of both of them). They often just sound silly. And they were inspired originally by Gentle Giant, who I think sucks swap water.
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Still playing this stuff non-stop. As of now, my two favorite songs are Visions and The Architect.....but gonna keep spinning them before I come up with actual rankings. Just in awe at how ridiculously great this band is.
Welcome aboard the Haken train! (Not sure if we serve bacon yet, but...)
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I have been pronouncing it Hack-en
I did as well until I saw them. I didn't get the thread title either until after this realization.
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I have been pronouncing it Hack-en
I did as well until I saw them. I didn't get the thread title either until after this realization.
Glad I am not alone :lol
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Jay you Hak
en.
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Jay you Hak
en.
:slowclap:
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I actually had to go and look up an interview on youtube ahead of seeing them last year so I could hear the name pronounced because I had no clue as to the proper way :lol
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IMO:
Aquarius: 9/10
Visions: 9/10
The Mountain: 10/10
Affinity: 9'5/10
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Ordered my copy of Aquarius, which should be here tomorrow. At last!
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I'm going to be that guy for a second, but I remember way back when Aquarius first came out. And I remember randomly just finding the album on youtube at the time, and it didn't have too many views... I was just immediately pulled in and I was so impressed with how inspired the band sounded. I liked it all man, the growls and the 'mm-bop-bop' included. For some reason I never expected them to become the giants that they are today, but I'm really glad that they found their stride and gained some serious popularity.
Aquarius holds a special place in my heart with them, but I would say that The Mountain is probably their greatest work so far. Just an extremely talented group, and I hope that they take the DT route and work hard throughout their career.
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I love Affinity, but does anyone else feel the overall sound is cleaner on Visions and The Mountain?
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I'm going to be that guy for a second, but I remember way back when Aquarius first came out. And I remember randomly just finding the album on youtube at the time, and it didn't have too many views... I was just immediately pulled in and I was so impressed with how inspired the band sounded. I liked it all man, the growls and the 'mm-bop-bop' included. For some reason I never expected them to become the giants that they are today, but I'm really glad that they found their stride and gained some serious popularity.
Aquarius holds a special place in my heart with them, but I would say that The Mountain is probably their greatest work so far. Just an extremely talented group, and I hope that they take the DT route and work hard throughout their career.
I discovered the band randomly when Aquarius came out, because I saw a 90/100 review for a progressive metal album. I would like to find awesome discoveries like that also in these years.
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I love Affinity, but does anyone else feel the overall sound is cleaner on Visions and The Mountain?
I think I like Affinity's production the most out of all their albums actually
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I'm going to be that guy for a second, but I remember way back when Aquarius first came out. And I remember randomly just finding the album on youtube at the time, and it didn't have too many views... I was just immediately pulled in and I was so impressed with how inspired the band sounded. I liked it all man, the growls and the 'mm-bop-bop' included. For some reason I never expected them to become the giants that they are today, but I'm really glad that they found their stride and gained some serious popularity.
Aquarius holds a special place in my heart with them, but I would say that The Mountain is probably their greatest work so far. Just an extremely talented group, and I hope that they take the DT route and work hard throughout their career.
I discovered the band randomly when Aquarius came out, because I saw a 90/100 review for a progressive metal album. I would like to find awesome discoveries like that also in these years.
That's awesome. Yeah, it's a great feeling when you randomly discover something great like Haken or what have you. I also remember listening to one of the posters on this forum's prog-cast and discovering Frost* from one of their shows. That was an epic feeling hearing No Me No You for the first time.
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I'm going to be that guy for a second, but I remember way back when Aquarius first came out. And I remember randomly just finding the album on youtube at the time, and it didn't have too many views... I was just immediately pulled in and I was so impressed with how inspired the band sounded. I liked it all man, the growls and the 'mm-bop-bop' included. For some reason I never expected them to become the giants that they are today, but I'm really glad that they found their stride and gained some serious popularity.
Aquarius holds a special place in my heart with them, but I would say that The Mountain is probably their greatest work so far. Just an extremely talented group, and I hope that they take the DT route and work hard throughout their career.
I discovered the band randomly when Aquarius came out, because I saw a 90/100 review for a progressive metal album. I would like to find awesome discoveries like that also in these years.
That's awesome. Yeah, it's a great feeling when you randomly discover something great like Haken or what have you. I also remember listening to one of the posters on this forum's prog-cast and discovering Frost* from one of their shows. That was an epic feeling hearing No Me No You for the first time.
I'm going to guess that was me, just basing off the fact that half the time I play Frost* it's that song. :lol
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Nick just got a big prog woody.
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I love Affinity, but does anyone else feel the overall sound is cleaner on Visions and The Mountain?
I think I like Affinity's production the most out of all their albums actually
Same here. I don't have an issue with the sound of any of their albums. but Affinity really stands out, especially in the lower end, which really has a major punch at times, and without ever overpowering the rest of the music. That section around 2:20 or so in The Endless Knot (which I think it was people refer to as the dubstep section) wouldn't have worked nearly as well if it the production had let it down. Sonically, that section sounds perfect.
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Kev, that section live was so amazing. Even middle age fat dudes (yup, I'm calling myself out) got into the moment and jumped up and down be dammed of injury. :lol
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I can see that. I mean, I don't wanna see that :p, but I can see it. :lol :lol
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Seriously. :lol
No, seriously.
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That section is one of the only times at any concerts I actively look forward to and participate in that sort of shenanigan.
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Lol yep, it was When Prog and Power Unite alright. So thanks for that, Nick. Haha. :metal
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Kev, that section live was so amazing. Even middle age fat dudes (yup, I'm calling myself out) got into the moment and jumped up and down be dammed of injury. :lol
Definitely one of the most fun live moments from their show :metal
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Trying to get in to Haken today. It's been awhile since I made the attempt. I decided to do it different this time and start at Affinity and go backward, which looks like it was a good idea. So far I'm really enjoying it. 1985 and Lapse particularly.
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That section is one of the only times at any concerts I actively look forward to and participate in that sort of shenanigan.
So glad they saved that for the outdoor set at CttE, such a cool moment :hat
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Listening to Aquarius in full for the first time. Prior to this, I was only familiar with Celestial Elixir, so the remaining songs are pretty much new to me. First of all, pretty cool to hear bits of Celestial Elixir in Point of No Return and Streams. Second, I didn't realise this was a concept album. It's quite easy to pick up the story by reading the lyrics.
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I think I'm finally coming around on 1985. I was iffy on it at first, but really liking it now. Not sure if this has been pointed out, but the vocal effect around the 4:20 or so mark sounds totally like the one in the Buggles' Video Killed the Radio Star. Given the 80s vibe of the song, that has to have been intentional.
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I think I'm finally coming around on 1985. I was iffy on it at first, but really liking it now. Not sure if this has been pointed out, but the vocal effect around the 4:20 or so mark sounds totally like the one in the Buggles' Video Killed the Radio Star. Given the 80s vibe of the song, that has to have been intentional.
Very plausible, if not entirely intentional. "1985" was honestly the first song to REALLY grab me when I first listened to Affinity, easily an instant favorite, and it still is. I think I have an affinity (har har) towards those synths and electronic drum sounds because I grew up with Transformers, and when the 1986 movie came out, I was still just a baby, but my brother was a Transformers fan, and I grew up to be one too, so when I was old enough to understand it, I watched the HELL out of that movie, and fell in love with Vince DiCola's sound track, so hearing his influence in a Haken song just really touched me in a super-nostalgic way. You could play that entire middle section in the Transformers movie and it'd fit right in with every other DiCola track!
-Marc.
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A friend of mine, who doesn't have nearly the love for 80s music that I do, was surprised right away when I wasn't a fan of 1985; he figured it would be right up my alley. :lol :lol I have said before that most of their songs take time to really grow on me because of the vocals, and that one just took longer.
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Since my move last year to Raleigh, I have been WAY behind on music purchases. Just received Affinity in the mail. Will be listening to it over the next few days.
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As I am seeing Haken on Saturday, for the first time, I am currently just blasting all their music. I really do love all their albums and would love them to do a set that really represents all albums equally (closing with Visions :heart) but I know that is unlikely to happen :tdwn
I do really like Affinity though so I won't complain about a Affinity heavy set.
Anyway, back to Pareidolia :metal :metal :metal
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Pretty sure they're playing Visions/Aquarius heavy sets man, since they're celebrating the re-issues of those albums. Though last year when Affinity just came out, the setlist was very Mountain/Affinity heavy and it was still an awesome concerts. Even songs I normally don't like (1985 and Earthrise) came out great.
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I would love them to encore with Visions but I think I might be getting my hopes up.
I've just been on setlist.fm and their average set for 2017 so far is:
https://www.setlist.fm/stats/average-setlist/haken-2bd434ee.html?year=2017 (https://www.setlist.fm/stats/average-setlist/haken-2bd434ee.html?year=2017)
I'll be plenty happy with a set like that so I know I'm not going to be disappointed. My personal preference would be to just change the encore to Visions. I'm taking two friends who have never heard of Haken (one doesn't even listen to metal or know what prog is :lol and the other has a history of getting knocked out at gigs and me taking him to the hospital) so it should be fun times.
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Yeah, but this is a separate tour celebrating their 10th anniversary and the recent reissue of their first two albums, so I would expect a fairly different setlist from the above, with a bit more of their older stuff worked in.
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Dude can you please take the setlist off this thread and just put a link in here? I don't want to know what they're gonna play and it's almost impossible not to see a couple of songs when scrolling through.
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Since my move last year to Raleigh, I have been WAY behind on music purchases. Just received Affinity in the mail. Will be listening to it over the next few days.
Let us know how you like it.
My last song of the night before sleep is Bound by Gravity.
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I've really come around on Visions (the song) and think it might be their best long epic yet. I think it is more consistently great than Celestial Elixir, which has that bad ass instrumental section, but is merely good the rest of the way, IMO. Visions is a great listen from start to finish.
However, I am still struggling to get into any of the other songs from the Visions CD.
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Yeah I'll be expecting a lot more from Visions and Aquarius. The promoters of tomorrow's show in Glasgow have said it's a 1hr 45 set, so there should still be space for some of the newer stuff too.
They played Visions the last time I saw them, so I'm hoping for Celestial Elixir instead. Would love to see The Architect and 1985 too.
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I've really come around on Visions (the song) and think it might be their best long epic yet. I think it is more consistently great than Celestial Elixir, which has that bad ass instrumental section, but is merely good the rest of the way, IMO. Visions is a great listen from start to finish.
However, I am still struggling to get into any of the other songs from the Visions CD.
I'm totally on the opposite side here. I think the instrumental section is the weakest part of Celestial Elixir. I absolutely love every part with the vocals, but the instrumental section is just alright.
And I really can't get into Visions (the song) at all. My least favourite epic by them, and I actually prefer Nocturnal Conspiracy, Shapeshifter and Deathless to it.
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Yeah, but this is a separate tour celebrating their 10th anniversary and the recent reissue of their first two albums, so I would expect a fairly different setlist from the above, with a bit more of their older stuff worked in.
Totally forgot about that. I might be in for a Visions encore after all then :metal
If they are doing a 1hour 45 minute set then I am cautiously optimistic. Think I will be just playing this band on repeat until Saturday.
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Yeah, but this is a separate tour celebrating their 10th anniversary and the recent reissue of their first two albums, so I would expect a fairly different setlist from the above, with a bit more of their older stuff worked in.
Totally forgot about that. I might be in for a Visions encore after all then :metal
If they are doing a 1hour 45 minute set then I am cautiously optimistic. Think I will be just playing this band on repeat until Saturday.
Take that set time with a pinch of salt, it might depend on the venue. I've just noticed that there's a club night on at the venue in Glasgow tomorrow, meaning the curfew for the gig is 10pm, instead of the usual 11pm. The doors are opening 30 minutes earlier than usual, but with 2 support bands, it'll be a squeeze to get 1hr45 from Haken. I'll be raging if we get a shorter set than in other places - exactly the same thing happened the last time they came to Scotland and Crystallised got cut from the set :censored :'(
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Yeah, all you guys talking about the epics are forgetting that Crystallised > all.
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For fans of "Visions" (the song), here's a video made by French Horn player Marc Papeghin, known for doing covers of Dream Theater, Haken, Neal Morse music, as well as video game (Final Fantasy) and film scores.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSFtMPalklo
It's an excellent video for just being a pieced-together mish-mash of various films and other works. Definitely fits the mood of the song.
-Marc.
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For fans of "Visions" (the song), here's a video made by French Horn player Marc Papeghin, known for doing covers of Dream Theater, Haken, Neal Morse music, as well as video game (Final Fantasy) and film scores.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSFtMPalklo
It's an excellent video for just being a pieced-together mish-mash of various films and other works. Definitely fits the mood of the song.
-Marc.
I've seen this before and it is so well put together. I have literally used this to try to get friends into Haken.....so far it hasn't worked :lol
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Yeah, all you guys talking about the epics are forgetting that Crystallised > all.
Why I would forget something so inaccurate? :P
I'm totally on the opposite side here. I think the instrumental section is the weakest part of Celestial Elixir. I absolutely love every part with the vocals, but the instrumental section is just alright.
:eek :eek :eek
To each his own. :biggrin:
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Well according to setlist.fm, the anniversary tour is basically the Affinity tour with a shorter setlist and a medley. Needless to say I'm pretty disappointed :(
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Well according to setlist.fm, the anniversary tour is basically the Affinity tour with a shorter setlist and a medley. Needless to say I'm pretty disappointed :(
Yea, I'm pretty disappointed about that :yeahright here's hoping they rotate the set a lot on this tour. Are they a band that's known to do that sort of thing or not?
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With Affinity being out for almost a year, by now I think it's their best album. The Mountain was a huge accomplishment, but Affinity is even more compact in structure and sound. They tried something completely new with the inclusion of the 80s sounds but it's only a gimmick and doesn't have any influence on the compositions. Also I think it's very good that the whole band was involved with the songwriting this time. I suppose Richard still did the biggest part of the songwriting, but you can hear the influence of the others. The album is totally nuts in terms of rhythm. Sometimes it's even hard to find a "1" somewhere. Ray's drums have improved so much; his effort on the other albums is nothing compared to this. It's incredible. Same can be said about Diego. The diversity of sounds he uses here is impressive, from 80s synth sounds (1985, Architect) to technoid (Red Giant, Endless Knot) and even dubstep like stuff (Endless Knot).
I feel like you can really watch this band grow. In terms of composition and success.
Oh and The Architect is the best Haken longtrack for me! I love all of them, but the combination of a huge epic melody with 8-string riffs never worked so well as in the finale of this track.
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I love the middle section of Aquarium! That whole descending bassline bit that, in the subsequent instrumental break, changes key so many times in such a cool way!
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Alright getting near 2 straight weeks of nothing but Haken. I have a clear cut #1 best song that's heads and shoulders above everything else that they've ever done.
All four albums are great. At this point, start to stop, I'd rank them as follows.
1. Visions
2. Affinity
3. The Mountain
4. Aquarius
Aquarius is a hell of a debut album. Lots of great tunes. I like Celestial Elixir, but I don't love it. I do love the intro and some of the instrumental sections... but the verses, chorus leave much to be desired. But a hell of a "first" effort for sure.
Visions is one epic, concise story, and I think that it was well executed. Nocturnal Conspiracy is a beast of a song, and it, along with Premonition set the tone of the album nicely. Portals and Shapeshifter are a great 1/2 punch. And the title track is my 2nd favorite Haken song. Just a fantastic epic in every single way possible. Incredible everything!
The Mountain... you can tell they're finding their sound and coming of age. Really awesome album for sure. Highlights are when the choir kicks in during the intro of The Atlas Stone and the bulk of Cockroach King, which is my favorite song from this album. Somebody comes at a close second, and it's my favorite Ross performance. I find him to be a fantastic singer and do not get the complaints unless one is talking about specific tones or styles he implements because dude is a fantastically gifted chameleon. All of the other players are out of this world of course!
Affinity, what can I saw. A little rearranging, and this could have been even better. But what we did get is incredible. A lot of great songs.... an incredible mix and their best "work" to date. Which brings me to the main thing I wanted to address.
The Architect is one of the greatest songs that I've ever heard, and by leaps and bounds is Haken's crowning achievement.
I mean.. this song has it all. The technical precision throughout is awe inspiring. The intro is incredible. Every note Ross sings is incredible. The middle section sounds simple, but it's is complex and extremely impressive. The outro is insanely epic and for a band that does great outros.... this is their finest. I can forgive anyone who says that this isn't their favorite Haken song because it's lacking the "fun" that other great Haken songs have..... but good lord this song is absolute perfection.
I hate to say it like this, but the band should have named the song Affinity (the word is clearly used plenty in the song) and made it the last track instead of that song that lulls me to sleep. The Initiate reprise in the outro would have been the perfect bookend for the album. I'm sure that more people would fap over it if it were called Affinity and the last track because I know how most prog fans are :)
To top it off, I wouldn't have blamed the bandmembers for shooting themselves in the head after recording the musical perfection that is The Architect.
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Yeah, all you guys talking about the epics are forgetting that Crystallised > all.
haha no, it's inferior to the original version even
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DOC, while my praise won't be quite as effusive as yours, I agree that The Architect is pretty awesome. The first minute alone is possibly the most bad ass thing they've done to date, and the rest of the song is pretty damn great; I think it is certainly in the conversation for best Haken song.
You do need to be smacked for saying Bound by Gravity puts you to sleep, however. :P I think that and Red Giant are the two most underrated tracks on the album by far. I will take either over Initiate and The Endless Knot (the two least best tunes, IMO) by a wide margin.
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Kev, The Endless Knot is so freekin' Incredible live it would change your mind. Seriously, the place goes nuts.
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Perhaps, but I just feel like the latter half of the song doesn't come close to living up to the first half. It's like you're waiting for that awesome chorus...that never comes.
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When they first released it is was like , ok, it's good. It grows on you. The poor people in cars next to me when the dubstep part comes on blasting. I look like I'm having a seizure. :lol
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Yeah, we are gonna need to see video of that. :tup :tup
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DOC, while my praise won't be quite as effusive as yours, I agree that The Architect is pretty awesome. The first minute alone is possibly the most bad ass thing they've done to date, and the rest of the song is pretty damn great; I think it is certainly in the conversation for best Haken song.
You do need to be smacked for saying Bound by Gravity puts you to sleep, however. :P I think that and Red Giant are the two most underrated tracks on the album by far. I will take either over Initiate and The Endless Knot (the two least best tunes, IMO) by a wide margin.
I do like Red Giant, but I have no interest whatsoever in Bound by Gravity. I mean, it's not bad (no Haken song that I've head is), it just doesn't grab my interest.
Initiate on the other hand, for me, is the 2nd best song on the album. That run between 'TIL MY DYING DAY through when the song slows down again is absolutely incredible.
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DOC, while my praise won't be quite as effusive as yours, I agree that The Architect is pretty awesome. The first minute alone is possibly the most bad ass thing they've done to date, and the rest of the song is pretty damn great; I think it is certainly in the conversation for best Haken song.
You do need to be smacked for saying Bound by Gravity puts you to sleep, however. :P I think that and Red Giant are the two most underrated tracks on the album by far. I will take either over Initiate and The Endless Knot (the two least best tunes, IMO) by a wide margin.
I do like Red Giant, but I have no interest whatsoever in Bound by Gravity. I mean, it's not bad (no Haken song that I've head is), it just doesn't grab my interest.
Initiate on the other hand, for me, is the 2nd best song on the album. That run between 'TIL MY DYING DAY through when the song slows down again is absolutely incredible.
I was going to express my opinions after reading the last messages on this topic, but then I read yours, which expresses perfectly what I wanted to say: I don't get why Initiate is not loved, it is awesome. Red Giant is fantastic. And Bound by gravity is dull, not bad (none of Haken's tunes are bad) but just not interesting to me.
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Yeah, we are gonna need to see video of that. :tup :tup
If you want to be blinded. :lol
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Yeah, all you guys talking about the epics are forgetting that Crystallised > all.
haha no, it's inferior to the original version even
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Red Giant is fantastic.
This. :tup :tup
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Did it take anyone of you a long time to get into Aquarius? I don't know why, but I love Visions, The Mountain and Affinity, but I can't get into Aquarius. I don't dislike it, but I really don't love it.
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It was the first Haken album I heard and I loved it immediately. Probably still my favorite, I can't really decide between it and Affinity.
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So ready to see Haken tonight :metal
Just checked setlist.fm and they have played my preferred 'epic encore' of choice the last two nights. Here's hoping they make it 3/3, I will be beyond happy if they do :metal
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Did it take anyone of you a long time to get into Aquarius? I don't know why, but I love Visions, The Mountain and Affinity, but I can't get into Aquarius. I don't dislike it, but I really don't love it.
I'm kind of the same but with Visions instead.
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Did it take anyone of you a long time to get into Aquarius? I don't know why, but I love Visions, The Mountain and Affinity, but I can't get into Aquarius. I don't dislike it, but I really don't love it.
Out of all the Haken albums, I don't like Aquarius. It was a young Haken and they do not know yet how build up, how to write a climax for songs, so the songs (especially Celestial Elixir) felt like songs that do not have much ups and downs. And the growls are out of place.
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Out of all the Haken albums, I don't like Aquarius. It was a young Haken and they do not know yet how build up, how to write a climax for songs, so the songs (especially Celestial Elixir) felt like songs that do not have much ups and downs. And the growls are out of place.
I couldn't disagree more.
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I think it's amusing that you should mention the growls being out of place as if the placement of growls in Haken's music got better over time. *Looks at The Architect*
I actually kinda like the growl section in Streams, I don't like the transition into it but as soon as it has kicked off I enjoy them. As for Einar, his growls have their time and place and I don't think they're outstanding on their own, but when you listen to the second half of "Slave" for example, you'll find out that Leprous are pretty damn good at building the music around his vocals.
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I've always thought Celestial Elixir was great, but I've had a tough time with the rest of Aquarius. The long epic aside, the songs I probably like the most right now are Streams and Aquarium, and even those are ones I just kinda like. I think as I listen to them more, they will grow on me. Not much else from it has grabbed me.
It seems to me they were great from the start at writing the long epics, but it took them a few albums to really get down writing the shorter ones (if we can call 8 minute songs shorter ones :lol). Most of the songs under 10 minutes on the last two albums are, at worst, really good.
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Out of all the Haken albums, I don't like Aquarius. It was a young Haken and they do not know yet how build up, how to write a climax for songs, so the songs (especially Celestial Elixir) felt like songs that do not have much ups and downs. And the growls are out of place.
I couldn't disagree more.
So what is the climax of Celestial Elixir? It starts with a 3 and a half minutes of reprise of album themes, followed by 4 and a half minutes of a moody song, then about three and a half minutes of an upbeat instrumental, then around two minutes of the moody song, then a couple of minutes of a repeating chord progression that changes tempo midway, then a cooling down outro. And I am left wondering, where did the song peak? It's like there really is just eight to ten minutes' worth of a song but there is a long reprise at the start, and three minutes of outro of a single repeating chord progression.
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Well, can't speak for anyone else, but for me, it's in the last chorus where they alter the melody slightly.
Also, I think both Drowning in the Flood and Sun have fantastic climaxes.
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Out of all the Haken albums, I don't like Aquarius. It was a young Haken and they do not know yet how build up, how to write a climax for songs, so the songs (especially Celestial Elixir) felt like songs that do not have much ups and downs. And the growls are out of place.
I couldn't disagree more.
So what is the climax of Celestial Elixir? It starts with a 3 and a half minutes of reprise of album themes, followed by 4 and a half minutes of a moody song, then about three and a half minutes of an upbeat instrumental, then around two minutes of the moody song, then a couple of minutes of a repeating chord progression that changes tempo midway, then a cooling down outro. And I am left wondering, where did the song peak? It's like there really is just eight to ten minutes' worth of a song but there is a long reprise at the start, and three minutes of outro of a single repeating chord progression.
There are several climaxes in that song.
For one, the synth part at the end of the instrumental section is a major climax, especially when the vocals come in doing that wordless stuff. If you don't think that is climatic, then I can't help you. :biggrin:
Also, the climax at the end is more of a slow burn, rather than an over the top, bombastic one, but it's still a climax, nonetheless. Not every long epic has to have a majorly bombastic ending.
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Also, I think both Drowning in the Flood and Sun have fantastic climaxes.
Drowning in the Flood is my favorite in Aquarius for that reason. :metal
There are several climaxes in that song.
For one, the synth part at the end of the instrumental section is a major climax, especially when the vocals come in doing that wordless stuff. If you don't think that is climatic, then I can't help you. :biggrin:
Also, the climax at the end is more of a slow burn, rather than an over the top, bombastic one, but it's still a climax, nonetheless. Not every long epic has to have a majorly bombastic ending.
Personally, I really just want any song that makes me listen for more than fifteen minutes have a payoff, which is something I did not get from Celestial Elixir (and Crystallised, for that matter). I often have problems with long songs that harp on the same theme or chord progression for several measures because it makes me feel the length of the song.
They did much better with Visions, although that song ironically suffers from too many moments that felt like the climax. :lol My personal favorite Haken epic, though, is the unofficial epic The Mind's Eye - Portals - Shapeshifter. Beautiful melodies and beautifully paced as well.
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Out of all the Haken albums, I don't like Aquarius. It was a young Haken and they do not know yet how build up, how to write a climax for songs, so the songs (especially Celestial Elixir) felt like songs that do not have much ups and downs. And the growls are out of place.
I couldn't disagree more.
So what is the climax of Celestial Elixir? It starts with a 3 and a half minutes of reprise of album themes, followed by 4 and a half minutes of a moody song, then about three and a half minutes of an upbeat instrumental, then around two minutes of the moody song, then a couple of minutes of a repeating chord progression that changes tempo midway, then a cooling down outro. And I am left wondering, where did the song peak? It's like there really is just eight to ten minutes' worth of a song but there is a long reprise at the start, and three minutes of outro of a single repeating chord progression.
Celestial Elixir has multiple highlights, but the climax for me is the section from 10:40 to 11:40. It's at the end of the freeform part, before the chorus repetition kicks in, a very "traditional" spot for a climax in a prog song IMO.
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Looks like I'm flying solo tonight at the Haken gig, my friend bailed (as I suspected he would). First gig on my own :| I'm getting full on in that pit :metal
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So what is the climax of Celestial Elixir? It starts with a 3 and a half minutes of reprise of album themes, followed by 4 and a half minutes of a moody song, then about three and a half minutes of an upbeat instrumental, then around two minutes of the moody song, then a couple of minutes of a repeating chord progression that changes tempo midway, then a cooling down outro. And I am left wondering, where did the song peak? It's like there really is just eight to ten minutes' worth of a song but there is a long reprise at the start, and three minutes of outro of a single repeating chord progression.
There are several climaxes in that song.
For one, the synth part at the end of the instrumental section is a major climax, especially when the vocals come in doing that wordless stuff. If you don't think that is climatic, then I can't help you. :biggrin:
Also, the climax at the end is more of a slow burn, rather than an over the top, bombastic one, but it's still a climax, nonetheless. Not every long epic has to have a majorly bombastic ending.
Celestial Elixir has multiple highlights, but the climax for me is the section from 10:40 to 11:40. It's at the end of the freeform part, before the chorus repetition kicks in, a very "traditional" spot for a climax in a prog song IMO.
You don't say? :P (see the bolded above)
Personally, I really just want any song that makes me listen for more than fifteen minutes have a payoff
I totally get that. If I am investing that much time to a single song, it had better have a sweet payoff. For example, while it's a good song and a nice piece of music, I never listen to The Flower Kings' The Truth Will Set You Free anymore because the payoff doesn't justify the length.
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Haken were pretty great last night. I wasn't completely happy with everything they played but the set was pretty good. They opened with the obligatory Initiate, which was an ok opener. The real highlights for me were 1985, Cockroach King and the Aquarius medley. 1985 was great live and really got the place moving. Cockroach King is obviously a lot of fun but the real surprise was the Aquarius medley, it really had all my favourite bits from the album and flowed pretty well. The main disappointments for me were Red Giant and The Endless Knot, I'm just not a huge fan of either of these songs to be honest and I could have picked a number of songs I'd rather have heard. The Architect worked really well live and I do appreciate it a bit more after seeing it but I'm not on the bandwagon of it being one of their top 10 songs. Finally, they encored with Visions :metal
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Nice.
[spoiler]
Not to spoil it for anyone reading, but I am kind of surprised the longest song from The Mountain wasn't played. I would think that would be an every night mainstay.
[/spoiler]
Updates on the first two albums, which I have been giving more listens to...
-Aside from Celestial Elixir, Streams and Aquarium are the clear standouts from Aquarius, IMO; those are both really good, although that growling section in the middle of Streams seems like a major WTF. Sun seems pretty good, as well. The others all seem not worth many more listens.
-Aside from the great title track from Visions, Insomnia, Portals and Shapeshifter all seem quite good from that one. Nocturnal Conspiracy has some good stuff, but the melodies just seem weird or something; that one might take a bit more time.
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Aquarium is climbing up my list. Absolutely infectious song.
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Drowning in the Flood is also one of my favs.
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Aquarium is climbing up my list. Absolutely infectious song.
This. It's certainly my favourite of the "new" songs I've only heard since getting the album. It might even be top of my ranking now. If I've even come up with a ranking.
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Eternal rain doesn't get enough love. It's as great as the epic tracks, it's just very concise.
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Drowning in the Flood is also one of my favs.
I keep giving that song chances, but I really dislike the verses. A little too obnoxious for me. :lol :lol
Speaking of obnoxious...
Eternal rain doesn't get enough love. It's as great as the epic tracks, it's just very concise.
I'm not sure what the point was of that instrumental section, but I hate it. I can't even remember what the rest of the song is like.
Aquarium is climbing up my list. Absolutely infectious song.
Yep, it's really good. To me, three songs from the debut stand far above the others, and that is one of them.
I would rank the songs from the debut like this:
1. Celestial Elixir
2. Streams
3. Aquarium
HUGE GAP
4. Sun
ANOTHER BIG GAP
5. The Point of No Return
6. Drowning in the Flood
7. Eternal Rain
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Eternal rain doesn't get enough love. It's as great as the epic tracks, it's just very concise.
Absolutely :heart
I also think The Point Of No Return is extremely underappreciated. It's a perfect opener for the album and definitely my favourite, although the entire album is fanatastic. Their overall strongest work imo.
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Eternal rain doesn't get enough love. It's as great as the epic tracks, it's just very concise.
Absolutely :heart
I also think The Point Of No Return is extremely underappreciated. It's a perfect opener for the album and definitely my favourite, although the entire album is fanatastic. Their overall strongest work imo.
The Point Of No Return is definitely my favourite too
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I'd say:
1. Celestial Elixir
2. Drowning in the Flood
3. Aquarium
4. Eternal Rain
5. Streams
6. Sun
7. The Point of No Return
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Eternal rain doesn't get enough love. It's as great as the epic tracks, it's just very concise.
I'm not sure what the point was of that instrumental section, but I hate it. I can't even remember what the rest of the song is like.
Yeah, the instrumental is pretty silly, but I still enjoy it. However, the chorus is absolutely epic, especially with the answering backing vocals near the end. The ending is soaring as well, truly triumphant.
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1. Drowning in the Flood (just love the groovy heaviness in the first half and the gorgeous climax in the slower section)
2. Celestial Elixir
3. Sun
4. Eternal Rain
5. the first three songs
The first three songs on the album are solid enough and have some excellent moments, but I think of them as all running together quite a bit.
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I also think The Point Of No Return is extremely underappreciated. It's a perfect opener for the album and definitely my favourite, although the entire album is fanatastic. Their overall strongest work imo.
The Point Of No Return is definitely my favourite too
I don't dislike it. It's got some really cool parts, but seems kind of all over the place, which I get can be part of its charm.
1. Drowning in the Flood (just love the groovy heaviness in the first half and the gorgeous climax in the slower section)
The slower section is really nice, for sure. I just wish I liked the first half of the song.
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Ugh.
So I can't stop listening to Affinity.
I think I need help.
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Just saw them live this weekend. Although the entire show was great, the Aquarius medley was just absolutely perfect. The Algorithm did a fantastic job as well (I did not really care for Next To None), and their DJ/guitarist/songwriter is such a nice and humble guy.
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What songs/parts comprise the Aquarius medley?
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What songs/parts comprise the Aquarius medley?
Every song except Sun makes an appearance
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What songs/parts comprise the Aquarius medley?
Every song except Sun makes an appearance
It's basically orgasm after orgasm after orgasm...
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Saw Haken yesterday. They were brilliant, much better then i thought - very nice blend of art rock and metal and retro elements. Glad i finally checked them out.
Support:
The Algoritm are a genre mash up of Techno/Glitch/Metal, very entertaining.
Next to None obviously only got their spot because of the Portnoy-connection. Very immature (well, of course, they're all 18-20yrs old) songwriting, busy, unfocused and disjointed. And Max is a poser, just like his dad.
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A question for the people who've seen them on this tour: How long did the support acts play? Or how long after the venue opened did Haken start?
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A question for the people who've seen them on this tour: How long did the support acts play? Or how long after the venue opened did Haken start?
In Vienna:
Doors 19:30
Next to None 20:00-20:30
Algorithm 20:50-21:30
Haken 22:00-23:50
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What songs/parts comprise the Aquarius medley?
Every song except Sun makes an appearance
It's basically orgasm after orgasm after orgasm...
More like tease after tease after tease (medleys usually suck, since you are just getting into a song live and then they suddenly go into something else).
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Wait until you hear it.
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They posted this on their FB and Twitter
(https://i.imgur.com/sJBihWj.jpg)
Teasing North American and Australian dates for the anniversary tour
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I see New York City in there! :metal :metal
I'd imagine they will be touring the US in the fall possibly since they will be here for ProgPower and also assuming the guys are still backing MP's Shattered Fortress, also in September.
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Man, that's an extensive tour, how awesome for them. I reaaaaaally wish I had the time off to do another Hakation, but it's likely just Philly and NYC for me.
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I want dates and I want them now. Would definitely like to catch multiple dates if possible.
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Boston! Boston! Boston!
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Oh man, I see Pittsburgh in there. If they come this way, I'll definitely hit up the show!
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Seeing the Architect live is now on my bucket list.
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DURHAM
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DURHAM
I KNOW!!
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St. Louis is in there. Nice!!
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I've determined that Diego Tejeida is definitely my favorite member of this band. His playing is awesome, both doing leads and background atmospheric stuff. :hat
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Hollywood is on that list.
FUCK. YES.
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I've determined that Diego Tejeida is definitely my favorite member of this band. His playing is awesome, both doing leads and background atmospheric stuff. :hat
I have had him marked as my keyboardist of the year before (at least once), and he was the standout star of both The Mountain and Affinity to me. Especially with Affinity, it's hard to tell when it comes to songwriting who is most important, so set that aside a moment, but at this point I find him to be the least replaceable person in the band. Make no mistake, I love all the guys, and I hate even saying this, but I think if they lost a guitarist, they could find someone who would be able to step in. Same with bass, drums, and vocals. Not saying it would be the same, but I think they'd be able to keep on chugging away. Diego though has an amazing technical mind for keyboard sounds and utilization. As you say it allows him to excel in both background and foreground. I would be most scared of hearing a new Haken album without him on it.
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His sound design is incredible and adds a hell of a lot to the band's sound. I don't find his lead playing particulary exciting for the most part though, especially compared with Hen's guitar playing.
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I mostly agree with Nick.
I think Tejeida's lead playing is plenty exciting. To me, the last 50 seconds of the instrumental section in the middle of Celestial Elixir (starts around 10:45) is the best Haken moment to date, and that is thanks to incredible synth lead that Tejeida plays there.
And as a sidebar, as iffy as I have been on the singer's voice at times, where he is really great is doing wordless, background stuff that compliments the music, like the latter half of that synth section in Celestial Elixir (I think his voice comes in around 11:13). Or the mellow section of Falling Back to Earth. Or the part around 4:20 or so in Red Giant. He really excels at stuff like that.
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NA Tour dates:
(https://i.imgur.com/QVw4zNQ.jpg)
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I am looking forward to seeing them in Durham, but the place they are playing looks a little sketchy.
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Looks like a new venue to attend (never been to the highline ballroom), I am planning on being at the NYC show :metal
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Looks like I'll be heading to The Rex! :metal
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Definitely in for NYC and Philly, and considering DC just because I have off on Monday for Labor Day. Really wish Boston was on a Saturday, but I may try to make that work as well.
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:metal Sweet....a St. Louis Date :metal And I love Sith Aye as well!!! Delmar Hall is the same venue that the Neal Morse band played....very intimate with great acoustics....can't wait!!!
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No Texas dates
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:metal Sweet....a St. Louis Date :metal And I love Sith Aye as well!!! Delmar Hall is the same venue that the Neal Morse band played....very intimate with great acoustics....can't wait!!!
We are so gonna be there. :metal
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So Haken came to my hometown on Saturday. It was easily the best concert I have seen of the guys and one of the best I have seen overall. My friend and I booked a VIP Upgrade, best 40 bucks I ever spent. We saw the whole soundcheck, got to chat with the guys for quite a while, I got ALL my Haken vinyls signed, not to compare with the shitty Dream Theater M&G where they gave you 25 mins of instruction what you can't do and can't ask and charged 5x the money for 1/5 of the time.
I had chatted with the band quite a few times before (it was my 4th Haken concert) and always invited them to come play in Dresden, of course I never thought they'd really do it. But when we came in at 4pm for the soundcheck, Richard actually came to me and said something like "Hey Fritz, finally in Dresden!". Very cool!
Before the concert my friend and I printed some shirts for some more friends who were joining us at the concert. Haken loved it! Richard posted the picture of us with the shirts on his Facebook wall, I'm the dude in the middle with the K.
The next day we actually showed Richard and Ray around town a little because the part of town where they played was a not very nice, and the Dresden old town is beautiful. Then we had a beer on the Old Market ;)
Here's some pictures, I hope this works. (Yes that's Charlie & me gettin intimate)
https://ibb.co/iGYP1Q
https://ibb.co/esumFk
https://ibb.co/ct48T5
(https://scontent-fra3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/17799442_1888142208137232_708299178369213645_n.jpg?oh=409e0ef692290a93b0671e9cef69c6cf&oe=59966706)
Awesummmmm 24hs.
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That's awesome :metal :metal
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Charlie looks like he's sticking his tongue in your ear...haha. That's awesome though.
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That's great! :D
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We have the tools, and we have the talent!
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That's a big Twinkie.
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Charlie looks like he's sticking his tongue in your ear...haha. That's awesome though.
Actually after the picture was taken Charlie kept on kissing my face almost raping me :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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:metal Sweet....a St. Louis Date :metal And I love Sith Aye as well!!! Delmar Hall is the same venue that the Neal Morse band played....very intimate with great acoustics....can't wait!!!
We are so gonna be there. :metal
Tickets for my bro and I purchased :metal thanks for the text with the pre-sale code :tup
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So is this Haken concert also a dinner (for NYC at least)? :lol
Eddie Trunk & Q104.3 Present
Haken - 10th Anniversary Tour w/ Sithu Aye
Saturday, Sep 02, 2017 7:30 PM EDT (5:30 PM Doors)
Highline Ballroom, New York, NY
VIP Gold Circle Reserved Seating
Reserved seating. Exact seating first come, first served. $10 min/person at tables. All ages.
VIP Admission $35.00
General Admission
Limited seating available, First come first served. Full dinner menu available. $10 min/person at tables. All ages.
General Admission $20.00
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Got my ticket to see Haken in Durham. Really looking forward to this!
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Got my tickets for the Chicago show! Waiting on what the VIP is, they don't have anything listed as of yet...
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Grabbed tickets for myself and Nick for the NYC and Philly shows. Still contemplating DC and/or Boston.
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Grabbed tickets for myself and Nick for the NYC and Philly shows. Still contemplating DC and/or Boston.
Grabbed Nick eh?
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Grabbed tickets for myself and Nick for the NYC and Philly shows. Still contemplating DC and/or Boston.
Grabbed Nick eh?
Indeed. You going to the Boston show Joe?
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I want to. Talking to the wife. Our vacation is the week before so I'll have both of us take Monday off. I'll let both of you know if so.
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I want to. Talking to the wife. Our vacation is the week before so I'll have both of us take Monday off. I'll let both of you know if so.
Keep me in the loop. If I do go I'll come up Saturday morning to make a weekend of it with some friends and family up that way, and then end up going right from the show on Sunday to the bus station and take a 1am bus home so I can work from home on Monday.
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Will do.
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:metal Sweet....a St. Louis Date :metal And I love Sith Aye as well!!! Delmar Hall is the same venue that the Neal Morse band played....very intimate with great acoustics....can't wait!!!
We are so gonna be there. :metal
Tickets for my bro and I purchased :metal thanks for the text with the pre-sale code :tup
Hell yeah! And we got the same row as you! :tup :tup
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I just found this. Horn/Trumpet cover of The Architect.
https://youtu.be/qYjTK5Uw0Ys
The guy has many other covers on his channel, some DT stuff too.
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I saw Haken live on the 26th of March. It was amazing omg. Did so much headbanging and belting out lyrics at the top of my lungs. The night before the concert, I painted my nails so one of my hands had all 4 album covers, plus Restoration, and the other hand had "Haken" written on it, one letter for each nail. After the show, I got to say hi to everyone in the band except Ross, and I showed them my nails. They all seemed genuinely impressed and happy that I'd painted my nails. Ray even took a photo, and posted it on instagram! :D I also showed my nails to Tom Maclean, who was a guest for one of the songs for that show (don't want to spoil the setlist for anyone), and he thought I'd been to a nail salon, lol. All in all, fantastic evening.
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I just found this. Horn/Trumpet cover of The Architect.
https://youtu.be/qYjTK5Uw0Ys
The guy has many other covers on his channel, some DT stuff too.
Wow that was really cool! Btw got me thinking on how great brass arrangements can work in metal music, it's usually more focus on strings and orchestra in general.
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I just found this. Horn/Trumpet cover of The Architect.
https://youtu.be/qYjTK5Uw0Ys
The guy has many other covers on his channel, some DT stuff too.
Wow that was really cool! Btw got me thinking on how great brass arrangements can work in metal music, it's usually more focus on strings and orchestra in general.
You ever try Thank You Scientist? If not I bet you'd love them.
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I'm not a fan of Haken, but I have to admit, this is impressive:
https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?q=%2Fm%2F0jn38,%2Fm%2F0fqv7jg
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I'm not a fan of Haken, but I have to admit, this is impressive:
https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?q=%2Fm%2F0jn38,%2Fm%2F0fqv7jg
Do note that quite a large part of the relevant search items are not people searching for the band Haken but rather dutch people searching for how to knit something (haken is a dutch verb for knitting). Also explains why the Netherlands has such a high score on the interest per region. :P
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I'm not a fan of Haken, but I have to admit, this is impressive:
https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?q=%2Fm%2F0jn38,%2Fm%2F0fqv7jg
Help me out, cause I'm trying to figure a couple things out. The interest over time graph at the top is the only impressive thing I see on this page... It seems like the only place in the world that shows up in Haken's favor is Germany. Isn't haken a German word? Seeing how a lot of the search results for Haken don't seem to have anything to do with the band...? Or am I misunderstanding?
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It's a Dutch word for knitting yeah :lol look at my post above yours
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It's a Dutch word for knitting yeah :lol look at my post above yours
Ah, okay sorry, I missed your post!
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Haken is actually German for hook :D
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Haken is somewhat close to my first name (Håkan).
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Haken is somewhat close to my first name (Håkan).
I know, I get you 2 mixed up all the time.
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Haken is somewhat close to my first name (Håkan).
I know, I get you 2 mixed up all the time.
I won't be going out on tour though.
I bring the victims home to me instead.
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Still sounds like a rock star to me.
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Is Google Trends that stupid though? I always assumed they classified search terms by what people clicked on afterwards. I mean, yes, Haken ist a German word meaning "hook" (knitting would be häkeln), but searching for hook seems an odd thing to do.
EDIT: You can also compare to Haken as a pure search term, and that's more. So Google definitely does some filtering.
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Is Google Trends that stupid though? I always assumed they classified search terms by what people clicked on afterwards. I mean, yes, Haken ist a German word meaning "hook" (knitting would be häkeln), but searching for hook seems an odd thing to do.
Does Robin Williams' take on Peter Pan have a big following in Germany?
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The name of that movie in German is ... Hook :lol
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Flawless
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:lol Great movie too
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:lol It is a great movie.
Is Google Trends that stupid though? I always assumed they classified search terms by what people clicked on afterwards. I mean, yes, Haken ist a German word meaning "hook" (knitting would be häkeln), but searching for hook seems an odd thing to do.
EDIT: You can also compare to Haken as a pure search term, and that's more. So Google definitely does some filtering.
I don't think Google trends is stupid, but when I look through the lists of related queries everything in the DT list is associated with the band Dream Theater. I can only say for sure that one search in the Haken list is associated with the band. I might be wrong, cause most of it is in languages I don't speak, just thought it was worth mentioning.
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I don't think Google trends is stupid, but when I look through the lists of related queries everything in the DT list is associated with the band Dream Theater. I can only say for sure that one search in the Haken list is associated with the band. I might be wrong, cause most of it is in languages I don't speak, just thought it was worth mentioning.
That's related queries, which suggests that the trend tracker is looking at queries that are just "Haken" or "Dream Theater".
I agree with Ralf that it's unlikely many Germans will be simply searching for "hook". But Dutch people just searching for "knitting" could potentially be bolstering numbers.
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One thing I really love about this album are the lyrics. Especially Earthrise and Bound by Gravity.
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Bound by Gravity is slowly climbing my list of some of the greatest songs ever written. Completely serious. The build up in that song is not to be believed. Complete eargasm.
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One thing I really love about this album are the lyrics. Especially Earthrise and Bound by Gravity.
Yea there are some nice lyrics on Affinity
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Bound by Gravity is slowly climbing my list of some of the greatest songs ever written. Completely serious. The build up in that song is not to be believed. Complete eargasm.
Yes Bound by gravity is normally the last song I listen to at night before going to bed.
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Affinity was released one year ago today :metal
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Affinity was released one year ago today :metal
Still my favourite Haken album by far :metal
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Affinity was released one year ago today :metal
Still my favourite Haken album by far :metal
:2metal:
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Affinity was released one year ago today :metal
Still my favourite Haken album by far :metal
:2metal:
:hefdaddy
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Giving Affinity another listen to while at work this morning.
Too bad I can't blast it too loudly though...
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It might be their most superior album musically. The message of The Mountain was just really personal to me. I don't think it can be topped for that reason.
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It's a really strong album, but it is the first time a Haken album doesn't seem lightyears ahead of what they did previously. Granted, The Mountain is such a masterpiece that such a task was probably impossible to begin with.
I also kinda wish the album was shorter. Not every Prog album has to be a double LP. I think it would've been a stronger statement if they cut a few songs and kept it in the 50 minute range.
Negatives aside, I'm still coming back to it fairly frequently and enjoying quite a bit of it. 1985 is excellent, The Architect is very cool, The Endless Knot is possibly their best "short" song.
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Bound by Gravity is slowly climbing my list of some of the greatest songs ever written. Completely serious. The build up in that song is not to be believed. Complete eargasm.
Agreed. I get that it's easy to go nuts over something like The Endless Knot because that song is (from all accounts) fun as heck live, but a song like Bound by Gravity blows it out of the water. I think the album closer from The Mountain, Somebody, gets the short end of the stick, too, for the same reasons (not as energetic and rocking, therefore not a live staple).
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I still feel that The Mountain is a perfect album, every song is a 10/10, has its pace and place in the album, and is simply perfect. Affinity is an excellent album, just as Visions and Aquarius, but all of them have little flaws that make The Mountain the best album ever, for me.
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I still feel that The Mountain is a perfect album, every song is a 10/10, has its pace and place in the album, and is simply perfect. Affinity is an excellent album, just as Visions and Aquarius, but all of them have little flaws that make The Mountain the best album ever, for me.
I'm with you.
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Yeah, Affinity is great and all but it's no The Mountain.
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I think The Mountain is awesome, but there's something about Affinity that just clicks with me on another level. I don't think there has ever been an album that inspired me musically as much as Affinity did.
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I love both but Affinity is just a hair better in my book.
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This might've been mentioned before, but I could easily see years from now The Mountain vs Affinity being discussed in the same way that DT fans discuss I&W vs Awake.
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This might've been mentioned before, but I could easily see years from now The Mountain vs Affinity being discussed in the same way that DT fans discuss I&W vs Awake.
And just like with that debate, the earlier album is clearly the better one. :D
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The Mountain and Affinity are both incredible, and I find my favorite switching between the two depending on my mood. They are definitely different enough to make the choice incredibly difficult.
However, one objective thing The Mountain does have: a longer runtime. :laugh:
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The Mountain and Affinity are both incredible, and I find my favorite switching between the two depending on my mood. They are definitely different enough to make the choice incredibly difficult.
However, one objective thing The Mountain does have: a longer runtime. :laugh:
In your opinion.
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Affinity rules tho!
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I find that the high points of The Mountain are better than Affinity for me (The Architect doesn't have a partner on the same level to compare against the Falling Back to Earth + Pareidolia tag team), but Affinity is overall a more consistent album with fewer songs that I don't at least really like yet.
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Like Haken? Click and join the fun over at P&S.
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=50221.0
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I totally missed the boat on it when I first heard this band, but The Point of No Return is one of their best songs. That main keyboard melody (first heard around :45) is totally awesome, and when it is brought back at the climax at the end of the song, that is great, great stuff. :tup :tup
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Hmmmm, my attempt to bump this thread failed.
Looks like I need to talk smack about the singer's voice and/or Cockroach King again...:P :biggrin:
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Got the VIP upgrade for the Philly show. Once you factor in the free t-shirt it comes with, not a bad deal.
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:lol
Kev, I've stayed away from playing them for a while because I was overplaying them but im ready to spin them again.
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See, for me, after being a lukewarm for a while, I have finally gotten into them in a big way and have overplayed them this spring. They really only have a few songs I do not like at all now.
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I keep on meaning to spend some quality time with Aquarius and Visions, but Restorations, The Mountain, and Affinity are just too damn good to not listen to.
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It's easy for me to hit it all since I made an mp3 CD for the car, and since the only have four albums plus an EP, it all fits on there. My growing love for The Point of No Return is helped by it being the first song on the CD (the songs are on the CD in chronological order), so when I pop the CD in, I will always listen to that before skipping around.
Really, the only songs I never or almost never listen to are Darkest Light, Eternal Rain and Initiate. Those three stand out to me as the three weakest songs they have done. I don't listen to Nocturnal Conspiracy a lot, because for me to listen to a 13-minute song on a regular basis, it has to be damn good (at worst), and while not a bad song, it's not damn good.
At this rate, my 10 favorites would be:
The Point of No Return
Streams
Celestial Elixir
Deathless
Visions
The Path/Atlas Stone
Because It's There
Falling Back to Earth
Somebody
1985
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My favorite song at the moment is Endless Knot, it has so much power that I'm always headbanging when it comes from the playlist :metal
1985 is my another favorite, I love Ray's drum work in Affinity, especially the first minute in 1985 and first minutes in Architect are so challenging that I always get lost somewhere!
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The keyboard player is still my favorite member of the band, but the drummer is pretty great, too. Both guitarists sound really good, although I have no clue who plays what. :lol :lol
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The keyboard player is still my favorite member of the band, but the drummer is pretty great, too. Both guitarists sound really good, although I have no clue who plays what. :lol :lol
I have the same problem, they're both equally skilled at playing and their style of playing is also pretty similar. They have small nuances in their solos that make them stand out but sometimes I find out I'm wrong when I guess who plays what.
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The keyboard player is still my favorite member of the band, but the drummer is pretty great, too. Both guitarists sound really good, although I have no clue who plays what. :lol :lol
I have the same problem, they're both equally skilled at playing and their style of playing is also pretty similar. They have small nuances in their solos that make them stand out but sometimes I find out I'm wrong when I guess who plays what.
They're honestly really not. Hen has a much smoother, jazzier, style, more legato playing, more tapping, more versatility. Charlie is more JP in style, more shreddy.
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Rich is dead on. You see that live.
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Also to say that in terms of soloing, I don't find Diego that interesting for the most part. But his sound design is phenomenal and a huge part of Haken's overall sound.
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Sort of like Tony Kaye in the 80's Yes.
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How much did Kaye actually play on those records? I always thought that Rabin did a lot of the keyboard work and Kaye was there in name only to play a little and give more credence to them using the Yes name (even though Kaye was part of the original Cinema group before Anderson came aboard and it became a Yes record).
Off the top of my head, I cannot think of that many solos Tejeida plays, but that is okay, since keyboard solos are not easy to nail. His overall sound and style are both awesome, though. The solo at the end of Drowning in the Flood definitely sounds like they borrowed Jordan Rudess for that song. :lol :lol
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I can't answer that but I've seen many pictures of Kaye in the studio for those albums.
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BTW, why is the band touring for the 10 year anniversary of their first album when it came out 7 years ago?
Second, why is a band this new already doing an anniversary tour for a record? Seems like that is what bands do once they are past their prime and are needing a hook to sell concert tickets.
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The tour is for the 10th anniversary of the band not of their first album :P And I don't think they need it as a hook to sell tickets as they just did a headlining tour for affinity before this and afaik are still rising in popularity in the prog scene.
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Right, I get that. Neither of my questions were meant to be a criticism of any kind. It just seems kinda weird.
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They are riding their new popularity and this is really the first year the tour is worldwide. It with help them immensely.
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Yeah, it's definitely weird for a band to do it this early in a tour, but they are riding that line between Haken as a hobby and Haken as a possible main job, and if this helps them ride the wave towards that, I'm all for it.
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The tour is for the 10th anniversary of the band not of their first album :P
This.
And yeah I guess maybe 10th anniversary is a fairly early one, but at the same time they're not making a huge song and dance of it. I think they were just looking to tour more after the Affinity tour, and it being the 10th anniversary gave a nice thing to tour around.
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Makes sense. :coolio
Yeah, it's definitely weird for a band to do it this early in a tour, but they are riding that line between Haken as a hobby and Haken as a possible main job, and if this helps them ride the wave towards that, I'm all for it.
Is that a legit thing being discussed within the band? If so, that would suck to see them become like Spock's, where the albums become less frequent because it is their hobby on the side, rather than their main gig/job. Hopefully, the tour this year will go well, and you have to think that over half of the band playing on that Shattered Fortress thing could give them more exposure.
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What I remember from talking with I think Rich on CttE was that they're approaching but not quite at the point where they can ditch their day jobs for doing Haken full time.
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Is that a legit thing being discussed within the band? If so, that would suck to see them become like Spock's, where the albums become less frequent because it is their hobby on the side, rather than their main gig/job. Hopefully, the tour this year will go well, and you have to think that over half of the band playing on that Shattered Fortress thing could give them more exposure.
They all have day jobs already, or at least other ways to make money such as other bands/projects, teaching, etc. And Haken has been buiding in stature, popularity and success so I don't think any of them are looking to make Haken less of a thing - if anything I think they see it as being more reliable and steady.
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Ah, okay. That is good to hear. :coolio
I listened to all of Visions the other day from start to finish and really enjoyed how it was a concept album that had little nods along the way that reminded you that was a concept album. As much as I love Neal Morse's music, the whole "Let's beat you over the head with reprises on every concept album" (that, really, The Who started with both of their concept albums) can be a bit tiresome at times, and it's good to see that other prog acts do not succumb to that way of thinking.
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Yeah I like that Haken still has very distinctive songs on the concept albums, but a handful of nods and reprises to notice and enjoy.
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The 10th Anniversary tour also makes sense since a lot of fans (especially outside of Europe) are getting to see them live for the first time. I've been following them since the beginning but they're only coming to Denver now, so I'm looking forward to a more "career spanning" setlist. After this I assume we're going to hear music from the first two albums less.
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I honestly have no idea if they have been to St. Louis before, but it's pretty sweet that they are coming here this year now that they finally clicked with me. :hat
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Is that a legit thing being discussed within the band? If so, that would suck to see them become like Spock's, where the albums become less frequent because it is their hobby on the side, rather than their main gig/job. Hopefully, the tour this year will go well, and you have to think that over half of the band playing on that Shattered Fortress thing could give them more exposure.
I believe they are looking to make Haken a full-time thing in the future. Pretty sure it was said in an interview, although I can't remember which one.
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Sorry for the confusion Kev, never meant to imply that Haken plans to become vastly less active, just that they currently can't support themselves on Haken and all have to rely on full time jobs.
Haken is one of the only bands I can think of that I could reasonably watch as a fan legitimately change from part time band to main gig, and I really hope they pull that off.
They've been on the rise in general, are getting a boost from The Shattered Fortress, and are using the 10th anniversary to keep things going. I really hope it all translates to them being able to continue to do it more full time in the future.
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I did not know these guys were not full timers. I guess it makes sense given the musical field they are in, but they seem to have definitely been on a rise of late so that thought never even crossed my mind. Having said that, I was thinking it would be cool if they were the opener for a DT tour in the states. I think DT shows could benefit from an up and coming prog metal band opening and allowing DT to have 2 hour rotating setlists again and Haken would get a lot more exposure from a fan base that would more likely be into them.
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I did not know these guys were not full timers. I guess it makes sense given the musical field they are in, but they seem to have definitely been on a rise of late so that thought never even crossed my mind. Having said that, I was thinking it would be cool if they were the opener for a DT tour in the states. I think DT shows could benefit from an up and coming prog metal band opening and allowing DT to have 2 hour rotating setlists again and Haken would get a lot more exposure from a fan base that would more likely be into them.
Just because DT would move to a two hour set I don't think that automatically means they will rotate sets. And I would have to assume that if DT took an opener again Haken would have to be on the list of candidates.
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I did not know these guys were not full timers. I guess it makes sense given the musical field they are in, but they seem to have definitely been on a rise of late so that thought never even crossed my mind. Having said that, I was thinking it would be cool if they were the opener for a DT tour in the states. I think DT shows could benefit from an up and coming prog metal band opening and allowing DT to have 2 hour rotating setlists again and Haken would get a lot more exposure from a fan base that would more likely be into them.
Just because DT would move to a two hour set I don't think that automatically means they will rotate sets. And I would have to assume that if DT took an opener again Haken would have to be on the list of candidates.
Totally, wasn't really trying to tie this into a DT discussion, just thinking they could benefit (and I think DT too) from such a scenario. I just think there is so much overlap and even more so potential overlap between fan bases that it makes a lot of sense (in my mind).
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Is that a legit thing being discussed within the band? If so, that would suck to see them become like Spock's, where the albums become less frequent because it is their hobby on the side, rather than their main gig/job. Hopefully, the tour this year will go well, and you have to think that over half of the band playing on that Shattered Fortress thing could give them more exposure.
I believe they are looking to make Haken a full-time thing in the future. Pretty sure it was said in an interview, although I can't remember which one.
Gotcha.
Sorry for the confusion Kev, never meant to imply that Haken plans to become vastly less active, just that they currently can't support themselves on Haken and all have to rely on full time jobs.
Haken is one of the only bands I can think of that I could reasonably watch as a fan legitimately change from part time band to main gig, and I really hope they pull that off.
They've been on the rise in general, are getting a boost from The Shattered Fortress, and are using the 10th anniversary to keep things going. I really hope it all translates to them being able to continue to do it more full time in the future.
It's all good. I was not aware that they were still working full time jobs and doing the band thing on the side, in essence.
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Kev, when I had dinner with Haken (Thanks to Nick!)We takes. About their aspirations of making Haken a full time job and what they did for work when not touring and recording.
Hen was a blast to talk to.
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Um, what? :lol :lol
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We talked. Come on man. I know you speak Kingenese. :lol
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Kinda sad that this is the state of the music business nowadays for artists of this style.
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Eh, I don't think Haken's style was ever going to be marketable to a large audience. If anything, the internet has helped them reach an audience that might be unaware of them otherwise.
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Live shows is what helps build an audience. Now they are playing all over the world and that builds their fanbase.
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Live shows is what helps build an audience. Now they are playing all over the world and that builds their fanbase.
Definitely, I never would have started listening to Periphery or Leprous if I haven't heard them supporting Devin Townsend in both cases.
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Eh, I don't think Haken's style was ever going to be marketable to a large audience. If anything, the internet has helped them reach an audience that might be unaware of them otherwise.
It was thanks to DTF that I became aware of them, so yeah that is true :lol
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Eh, I don't think Haken's style was ever going to be marketable to a large audience. If anything, the internet has helped them reach an audience that might be unaware of them otherwise.
It was thanks to DTF that I became aware of them, so yeah that is true :lol
Same here. And as Jake mentioned Leprous - I probably would never have listened to them if they didn't do a tour with Haken a few years back.
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Eh, I don't think Haken's style was ever going to be marketable to a large audience. If anything, the internet has helped them reach an audience that might be unaware of them otherwise.
I don't disagree at all. I just think it's sad that in spite of the internet and a heightened amount of touring they aren't even at the point where the band can be their full-time job yet. It's depressing to think about the fact that, unless the music industry changes significantly, DT will be the last prog-metal band to really "make it" to the degree in which they did.
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Agree, it makes me kind of sad that this kinds of bands can't get a proper income out of their music while al those lousy R&B and hiphop artist are making millions out of their nonsense.
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Agree, it makes me kind of sad that this kinds of bands can't get a proper income out of their music while al those lousy R&B and hiphop artist are making millions out of their nonsense.
So because you don't like a style of music it's automatically nonsense?
kay.
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Agree, it makes me kind of sad that this kinds of bands can't get a proper income out of their music while al those lousy R&B and hiphop artist are making millions out of their nonsense.
So because you don't like a style of music it's automatically nonsense?
kay.
He didn't say ALL R&B and hip hop....he said LOUSY R&B and hip hop. Are you saying lousy R&B and hip hop don't exist? :angel:
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Agree, it makes me kind of sad that this kinds of bands can't get a proper income out of their music while al those lousy R&B and hiphop artist are making millions out of their nonsense.
So because you don't like a style of music it's automatically nonsense?
kay.
He didn't say that.
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Well usually when people talk about a music style they tend to categorize it as a whole, so that's the way I took it. :natalieportman:
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I think Mark from Epica said in an interview recently that you don't play this music to make money. It's a sad reality because us, fans, love it and would love for our bands to be able to live off it (comfortably).
Getting out to a concert is the best way to support a band. Hope Haken gets lots of love on their second trek around the US.
I've been catching Delain concerts for awhile now and watched them go from opener at small show to opener at bigger show to headlining small show. If you keep touring, the fan base will grow, but you need to be able to tour consistently (Delain just announced another NA tour) and if you can't keep the band consistent because you can't survive then you can't keep touring either. I got to think this second go around is big for Haken.
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I think Mark from Epica said in an interview recently that you don't play this music to make money. It's a sad reality because us, fans, love it and would love for our bands to be able to live off it (comfortably).
Getting out to a concert is the best way to support a band. Hope Haken gets lots of love on their second trek around the US.
I've been catching Delain concerts for awhile now and watched them go from opener at small show to opener at bigger show to headlining small show. If you keep touring, the fan base will grow, but you need to be able to tour consistently (Delain just announced another NA tour) and if you can't keep the band consistent because you can't survive then you can't keep touring either. I got to think this second go around is big for Haken.
It's not only attending concerts but the fans buying merch is crucial for a band to survive financially when touring. The tshirts and hoodies have a higher profit margin than a concert ticket or even the fee they get when they play live. I once bought a Fates Warning contract on Ebay...$500 bucks is what they charged the promoter to play...and this was when they were touring with Parallels or Inside Out I believe, which was when the band was more commercially successful.
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That is all true. but sadly I never buy merchandise at concerts. I bought plenty of concert t's my first few years as a concert goer, but I literally have not bought one since seeing Pink Floyd in 1994. :eek :eek I was, however, thisclose to buying one at the Devin Townsend show last month, but the only shirts he had that I liked were all too small, otherwise I would have bought my first one in 23 years.
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Agree, it makes me kind of sad that this kinds of bands can't get a proper income out of their music while al those lousy R&B and hiphop artist are making millions out of their nonsense.
So because you don't like a style of music it's automatically nonsense?
kay.
Never too late for a reaction ;)
First of all, I'm nog a big fan of that style of music and I think it gets too much attention on commercial radio.
Calling it nonsense might be a bridge too far but it's just an opinion.
I'm just a bit frustrated by the lack of attention and airtime for extremely talented bands like Haken (it's their topic..). Sure, it ain't for the masses but I feel commercial radio has a duty to ''educate' people musically.
DT for example will never be mainstream (and I'm happy with that) but they have a bunch songs (like Our New World) that are perfectly fitted for mainstream public.
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Eh, like anything else, commercial radio is a business, which means they need to make money, and they aren't going to do that by trying to educate the masses with a bunch of unknown artists that aren't going to appeal to them anyway. This is why if you turn on your local classic rock FM station, you'll hear Black Dog, Hotel California and You Shook Me All Night Long all played 11 times a day.
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What's your favorite Haken song?
Me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1I7niXACtPE
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Probably Aquarium. Or Celestial elixir. :heart
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Haken are so talented, and they're all lovely people. I do hope it won't be too long before they can make a living solely off the band. I can only imagine how busy they must be, balancing full time jobs with writing, recording, and touring.
My favourite Haken song is probably Crystallised. :)
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A few weeks ago, I would have said Crystallized. But recently, I've been getting more and more into Bound By Gravity. Now I think that's taken over the #1 spot with a bullet.
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My favorite is Somebody.
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Visions is great, love all their albums, Cockroach King Rules !!!!! :metal
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Usually I would say Pareidolia, but it has to be Bound By Gravity right now.
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I'll stick to Celestial Elixir. Strong contenders are 1985, In Memoriam, and Crystallized.
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Sheesh, don't know if I can pick a single favourite. Those that are right up there at the top for me are Drowning in the Flood, Deathless, In Memoriam, Falling Back to Earth, 1985, Red Giant and The Endless Knot.
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It's really tough to pick just one so I'm gonna go with either Pareidolia, Earthlings or Falling Back to Earth depending on my mood :lol
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For me it's definitely still Crystallised.
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The Point Of No Return or Snow. I used to say Pareidolia but I listen to that song really rarely so I cannot say it's my favourite anymore.
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No idea why you would listen to Snow when Crystallised exists, but ok. I feel like they improved the song in every possible way.
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I think my favourites are Cockroach King, Red Giant and The Endless Knot.
For me it's definitely still Crystallised.
Crystallised has some of my favourite moments in any Haken song, but overall I feel it's just a little too disjointed.
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No idea why you would listen to Snow when Crystallised exists, but ok. I feel like they improved the song in every possible way.
Hmm, I'd say that's debatable. The two have a pretty different sound, due to half of the band being different. Snow has a more dark, emotional feel to it, and appears to be more focused on falling into a depression and then getting better again, while Crystallised is less dark and the story seems to focus on growing up and learning to live with the fact you aren't a kid anymore. That's just my take on it though, feel free to disagre. I personally prefer Crystallised, as I think it sounds better, but it doesn't feel as emotional as Snow does, so I can understand why some people prefer Snow. I still sometimes listen to Snow because it's nice to hear something different.
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My favorite is still Celestial Elixir. No other song has had that big an impact on me on first listen.
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No idea why you would listen to Snow when Crystallised exists, but ok. I feel like they improved the song in every possible way.
I think I've listened to Crystallized less than 10 times. I liked it at first listen but after that I felt it was disjointed particularly near the end. The chorus of Crystallized and the ending doesn't give me almost any emotion, while in Snow I love them. I don't know why, because they are similar.
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I plan on seeing them in September. Anyone have any info on what they've got at their merch booth for this tour? Prices?? I'm super stoked to see them!
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For me it's definitely still Crystallised.
This. Celestial Elixir and Streams are close though.
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Is that a legit thing being discussed within the band? If so, that would suck to see them become like Spock's, where the albums become less frequent because it is their hobby on the side, rather than their main gig/job. Hopefully, the tour this year will go well, and you have to think that over half of the band playing on that Shattered Fortress thing could give them more exposure.
Aha, finally found the interview where Richard says they're looking to make Haken a full time thing: https://youtu.be/HgD1tEjtF2g?t=2m49s
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Is that a legit thing being discussed within the band? If so, that would suck to see them become like Spock's, where the albums become less frequent because it is their hobby on the side, rather than their main gig/job. Hopefully, the tour this year will go well, and you have to think that over half of the band playing on that Shattered Fortress thing could give them more exposure.
Aha, finally found the interview where Richard says they're looking to make Haken a full time thing: https://youtu.be/HgD1tEjtF2g?t=2m49s
Thanks for posting that. :tup :tup
Sadly, their upside is probably limited due to the style of music they play, so it will tough to get to that point where they can all afford to be full time musicians with nothing on the side. Having six guys in the band probably makes it hard for each individual to make too much of a profit either.
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My favourite Haken song is Visions, followed closely by Celestial Elixir, then 1985 and Aquarium.
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Thanks for posting that. :tup :tup
Sadly, their upside is probably limited due to the style of music they play, so it will tough to get to that point where they can all afford to be full time musicians with nothing on the side. Having six guys in the band probably makes it hard for each individual to make too much of a profit either.
Yeah. £100 split between all 6 of them is roughly £16.6 each. :(
They deserve so much success. They're talented, they're clearly very passionate about the music, and they're lovely people.
It's a shame how underappreciated prog is by the general population. Prog is beautifully complex and amazing. It deserves so much more recognition.
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Thanks for posting that. :tup :tup
Sadly, their upside is probably limited due to the style of music they play, so it will tough to get to that point where they can all afford to be full time musicians with nothing on the side. Having six guys in the band probably makes it hard for each individual to make too much of a profit either.
Yeah. £100 split between all 6 of them is roughly £16.6 each. :(
They deserve so much success. They're talented, they're clearly very passionate about the music, and they're lovely people.
It's a shame how underappreciated prog is by the general population. Prog is beautifully complex and amazing. It deserves so much more recognition.
While this is all mostly true, Haken have managed to push things much further than other bands in their genre and could pull it all off with a break or two. Ask yourself this, how many bands formed in the last 10 years have managed to not only very successfully tour Europe, but also have managed to crack North America with no major commercial acclaim or big publicity break? They are about to embark on the scope of a headlining tour unparalleled by almost any of their peers in that regard.
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While this is all mostly true, Haken have managed to push things much further than other bands in their genre and could pull it all off with a break or two. Ask yourself this, how many bands formed in the last 10 years have managed to not only very successfully tour Europe, but also have managed to crack North America with no major commercial acclaim or big publicity break? They are about to embark on the scope of a headlining tour unparalleled by almost any of their peers in that regard.
That's very true, actually. I saw them live for the first time in March, and my brother who saw them in the same city last year said the venue they played in this year is considerably larger than the one last year. I do hope they keep growing at this pace. :D
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Haken's success is insane. I have no doubt that as long as they continue touring and making new music at the same consistency they will continue on their trajectory of success. Probably among the few (if not the only) prog band from this decade that will be able to keep up with other "middle tier" prog draws, such as Devin Townsend.
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I'm pumped to see them this September! I still can't believe they're coming through St. Louis but I'll take it! I dig Sith Aye as well and they're opening for them.
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Thanks for posting that. :tup :tup
Sadly, their upside is probably limited due to the style of music they play, so it will tough to get to that point where they can all afford to be full time musicians with nothing on the side. Having six guys in the band probably makes it hard for each individual to make too much of a profit either.
Yeah. £100 split between all 6 of them is roughly £16.6 each. :(
They deserve so much success. They're talented, they're clearly very passionate about the music, and they're lovely people.
It's a shame how underappreciated prog is by the general population. Prog is beautifully complex and amazing. It deserves so much more recognition.
While this is all mostly true, Haken have managed to push things much further than other bands in their genre and could pull it all off with a break or two. Ask yourself this, how many bands formed in the last 10 years have managed to not only very successfully tour Europe, but also have managed to crack North America with no major commercial acclaim or big publicity break? They are about to embark on the scope of a headlining tour unparalleled by almost any of their peers in that regard.
I suppose that is true, even if the venue they are playing at here holds no more than 200-300 people.
With any luck, they will be back in a few years and be playing the venue next door to 2-3 thousand people. :hat
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Kev.... Delmar Hall is supposed to max out at 750. Seems high but that'd pack that place out. I would imagine the show this fall will have 300 or so there.
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Still debating whether or not to see them in Pittsburgh at the end of August.
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Thanks for posting that. :tup :tup
Sadly, their upside is probably limited due to the style of music they play, so it will tough to get to that point where they can all afford to be full time musicians with nothing on the side. Having six guys in the band probably makes it hard for each individual to make too much of a profit either.
Yeah. £100 split between all 6 of them is roughly £16.6 each. :(
They deserve so much success. They're talented, they're clearly very passionate about the music, and they're lovely people.
It's a shame how underappreciated prog is by the general population. Prog is beautifully complex and amazing. It deserves so much more recognition.
While this is all mostly true, Haken have managed to push things much further than other bands in their genre and could pull it all off with a break or two. Ask yourself this, how many bands formed in the last 10 years have managed to not only very successfully tour Europe, but also have managed to crack North America with no major commercial acclaim or big publicity break? They are about to embark on the scope of a headlining tour unparalleled by almost any of their peers in that regard.
Delain has done this as well, saw them as an opening act in the US for awhile and they did their first full headline tour earlier this year, same with Amaranthe who've now done multiple headlining US tours. Granted, they aren't progressive, but small time European metal bands that have broke into the US market on some level. Sadly, Haken arent at their level yet if I am comparing the venues and attendance, but they can get there with continued touring. They definitely have the chops, but they need to be able to keep touring here. That's the one thing similar to the bands I mentioned, the constant touring of the US. I feel like those bands play here twice a year and that's how they get the exposure. Delain is already coming back again. It's another reason why I think Haken touring as the opener for a much bigger band, say DT, would be huge for them.
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It's a shame how underappreciated prog is by the general population. Prog is beautifully complex and amazing. It deserves so much more recognition.
I totally agree with this, but the majority probably want music they can just stick on as background noise to their daily tasks, ie. they don't actually want to *listen* to music. Many of those same people can quite easily spend 2 hours or more watching a movie or reading a book, but they aren't willing to put in what is more often than not less time to listen to an album or a symphony, which are movies and books for the ears.
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Still debating whether or not to see them in Pittsburgh at the end of August.
The correct answer is yes.
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Still debating whether or not to see them in Pittsburgh at the end of August.
The correct answer is yes.
:lol
I know, I know... Honestly, these guys have never clicked for me the way they seem to for many here. I don't dislike them, just not super into them.
I'm sure they put on a killer show though and tickets are cheap so I'm sure I'll end up going.
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Go man! I decided last minute to go see them when they came near and it was a fantastic decision :azn:
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Still debating whether or not to see them in Pittsburgh at the end of August.
The correct answer is yes.
:lol
I know, I know... Honestly, these guys have never clicked for me the way they seem to for many here. I don't dislike them, just not super into them.
I'm sure they put on a killer show though and tickets are cheap so I'm sure I'll end up going.
If you are a fan at all, given how cheap tickets are, I'd go. I probably would have gone a year ago, when I was still lukewarm on the bulk of their material (as opposed to now, having finally gotten into them in a big way).
Kev.... Delmar Hall is supposed to max out at 750. Seems high but that'd pack that place out. I would imagine the show this fall will have 300 or so there.
Sounds about right. I expect a similar turnout as we had at the Neal Morse Band concert.
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Still debating whether or not to see them in Pittsburgh at the end of August.
The correct answer is yes.
:lol
I know, I know... Honestly, these guys have never clicked for me the way they seem to for many here. I don't dislike them, just not super into them.
I'm sure they put on a killer show though and tickets are cheap so I'm sure I'll end up going.
If you are a fan at all, given how cheap tickets are, I'd go. I probably would have gone a year ago, when I was still lukewarm on the bulk of their material (as opposed to now, having finally gotten into them in a big way).
Thats pretty much where my train of thought is at the moment. I checked last night, and it looks like even if I don't get around to ordering tickets ahead of time, I could walk up night of the show and get in for $25. I'll probably end up ordering a couple ahead of time and trying to find someone to go with me though :lol
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Thats pretty much where my train of thought is at the moment. I checked last night, and it looks like even if I don't get around to ordering tickets ahead of time, I could walk up night of the show and get in for $25. I'll probably end up ordering a couple ahead of time and trying to find someone to go with me though :lol
Where's your Octavarium though?
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:clap:
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:lol
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It's a shame how underappreciated prog is by the general population. Prog is beautifully complex and amazing. It deserves so much more recognition.
I totally agree with this, but the majority probably want music they can just stick on as background noise to their daily tasks, ie. they don't actually want to *listen* to music. Many of those same people can quite easily spend 2 hours or more watching a movie or reading a book, but they aren't willing to put in what is more often than not less time to listen to an album or a symphony, which are movies and books for the ears.
I laughed when I read your post and it rings so true. Nick can relate to my comment. Beardfish has a song called 'Ode to the rock and roller' that speaks of your comment. One line from the song is 'they didn't come here to listen, they just came here to drink, so play those three cords over and over so they don't have to think'.
I miss beardfish :sad:
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I've been relistening to Restoration and I must say I found new appreciation for Crystallized. The melody starting at about 4:20 and the entire "passages of time" section is so beautiful.
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Yeah it really has some great parts. I really love the "Snow is falling all around me" as well. My critique is that it just doesn't feel as one coherent song to me.
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Yeah it really has some great parts. I really love the "Snow is falling all around me" as well. My critique is that it just doesn't feel as one coherent song to me.
True, but then again most epics don't feel like a coherent song. Even ACOS suffers from this imo.
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It doesn't seem any less coherent to me than most other epics of similar length; the structure of it is fine.
For me, it just lacks any super amazing parts. The whole song ranges from solid to good, but when a song is that long, it has to be pretty freaking great for me to want to listen to it many times, and Crystallised just doesn't pass the sniff test for me in that regard.
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I haven't been around for a LONG time, but I seem to remember someone on this forum bringing up Haken when they were writing/releasing Aquarius. Am I remembering this correctly? I thought a friend/relative might have brought them up either here or in the Musicians forum. Does anyone else remember this?
Sorry if I'm way out of the loop. I've been away for awhile.
Favorite song is probably The Architect
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I'm guessing that might have been ariich. His brother was the original keyboardist in Haken (and plays with Rich now in Nova Collective), though he left before Aquarius was recorded.
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I'm guessing that might have been ariich. His brother was the original keyboardist in Haken (and plays with Rich now in Nova Collective), though he left before Aquarius was recorded.
Sup. :hat
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I do agree that the outro section in Crystallised, while good, feels a bit out of place. I have no problem with the rest of the song though. And I still like the outro, so it doesn't "hurt" it much at all.
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I'm guessing that might have been ariich. His brother was the original keyboardist in Haken (and plays with Rich now in Nova Collective), though he left before Aquarius was recorded.
Thank you. I couldn't place who that was, but thought that it was in relation to the keyboardist.
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I made a Haken singing game. https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=50511.0
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I'm guessing that might have been ariich. His brother was the original keyboardist in Haken (and plays with Rich now in Nova Collective), though he left before Aquarius was recorded.
Sup. :hat
Sup Rich. What've you been up to? Finally getting around to all that sexing that was promised for later?
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Should be interesting to see what the set list is on the tour this fall, their first big one in the U.S.
I would be stunned if Falling Back to Earth wasn't back in the set list. They have to know how wildly popular that song is among their fans, and with them playing to many fans who are seeing them for the first time in various cities, not playing that would be...odd.
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Yea I'm hoping it's more of a "Greatest Hits" set list with no focus on any one album in particular.
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Given that they have to keep the Shattered Fortress stuff rehearsed, and that they already threw in some new stuff for the 10th Anniversary tour, I doubt that they'll change up the set too much.
As for Falling Back to Earth specifically, I was happily surprised they left that out. Don't get me wrong, it's a stunning song and I love seeing it, but they played it at every show on both US tours so far, as well as in at least one set on all three cruises they've participated in. And it of course is lengthier and I'm glad to have fresh stuff in.
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Right, but they are playing a lot of new cities and areas this time around. Bring the heavyweights!! :coolio
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Finally just purchased my ticket for the NYC show. Kind of forgot to scoop that up. Maybe the cheapest of the ~25 concert tickets bought this year :metal :metal
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Personally, I'd be very disappointed if they didn't play FBTE. One of their best all time on the best album, imo.
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If it was up to me, they'd do 2 songs from each album, plus maybe something from the EP if there's still time. My picks:
The Point Of No Return
Celestial Elixir
Nocturnal Conspiracy
Visions
Atlas Stone
Falling Back To Earth
1985
The Endless Knot
Darkest Light
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Let me ask this...and I mean this respectfully.
I've twice now tried to listen to The Mountain. I get to the first track with singing, and I need to turn it off. Is that pretty much reminiscent of what Haken is about vocally?
Or can you guys recommend songs to check out? I hear so much positive commentary about Haken, and I'm always told to check out The Mountain, but...
Let me know what other tunes?
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Ross' voice is an acquired taste, but some people just don't like him. I think he has a good voice but it doesn't do it for me on every song. I'm mostly into Haken for the music. It would be difficult for me to recommend you songs Samsara. All I can say is try to stick with it and see if some of his vocals grow on you.
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I don't know, maybe try Affinity instead. Could be that the song Initiate would be more for you. Not sure though.
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Its going to be like some people with Rush. I know people who recognize that there is some amazing stuff going on there....but can't get past Geddy's vocals.
Haken is just like that.
Though, I can't imagine any Yes fan not digging it....because Ross (to my ears) is the 21st Century Jon Anderson.
I will say that you really need to hear The Mountain all the way through. And ESPECIALLY Falling Back to Earth.
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I actually think that the singer on the Affinity album is a dead ringer for the other Yes vocalist, Trevor Horn on quite a few songs.
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Yea, it seems Ross's voice is kind of divisive. My first listen I wasn't totally digging it, but I kept coming back and eventually started to really enjoy it.
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Its going to be like some people with Rush. I know people who recognize that there is some amazing stuff going on there....but can't get past Geddy's vocals.
Haken is just like that.
Though, I can't imagine any Yes fan not digging it....because Ross (to my ears) is the 21st Century Jon Anderson.
I will say that you really need to hear The Mountain all the way through. And ESPECIALLY Falling Back to Earth.
Good post dude. :tup
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I've never had an issue with Ross vocals, but I can understand that it's an acquired taste. I had a harder time with Geddy though (at least on the earliest albums).
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I've been relistening to Restoration and I must say I found new appreciation for Crystallized. The melody starting at about 4:20 and the entire "passages of time" section is so beautiful.
One of my favorite Haken epics. :tup
I've never had an issue with Ross vocals, but I can understand that it's an acquired taste. I had a harder time with Geddy though (at least on the earliest albums).
True. Geddy was a lot more raw and rough around the edges in the early days, but still loved it.
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Let me ask this...and I mean this respectfully.
I've twice now tried to listen to The Mountain. I get to the first track with singing, and I need to turn it off. Is that pretty much reminiscent of what Haken is about vocally?
Or can you guys recommend songs to check out? I hear so much positive commentary about Haken, and I'm always told to check out The Mountain, but...
Let me know what other tunes?
I've had the same problem with them when I was getting into their music so I know what You mean. But, I'm more into Haken because of music which is almost always, outstanding. I enjoy his vocals now, in some songs his voice is too sweet for me but as I said, music wins ;) You should try Affinity in my opinion.
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All one has to do is read this thread to see what a MOUNTAIN Jennings' vocals were for me to overcome. :lol :lol
It took some time. but I mostly enjoy his voice now. There is still a moment there and a moment there that makes me wince a little, but I can overlook them now since everything else about the band is so good.
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I loved Ross' vicals from the first moment I heard it, and I still do.
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His voice never bothered me. It was the weird keyboard patches from the first 2 albums that bothered me. Glad they've got away from that.
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His voice never bothered me. It was the weird keyboard patches from the first 2 albums that bothered me. Glad they've got away from that.
This.
Ross's voice has never outright bothered me, though he's only very seldom amazed me. I'd say he's just an alright vocalist though I think he has gotten better with each release.
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When Affinity first came out, I was crazy about it. Maybe I listened to it too much. For some reason, it just hasn't aged well for me. Don't get me wrong. Still a great album, but as far as aging goes, I think The Mountain has done a better job of that. Anybody else?
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Apparently there's new stuff coming next friday.
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Just the opposite for me. Affinity was just "really way above average....but not as good as The Mountain" for me. But it has aged phenomenally for me. The Mountain is personal for me on a lyrical level, so it will probably never be topped for that reason. But Affinity is a huge musical leap forward. I consider it to be musically superior to The Mountain, and Bound by Gravity is the greatest album closer they have ever done. It may even be creeping into my all time top 10 songs by anybody.
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I haven't listened to Affinity since January probably, but that's because it made up like 80% of my music last year and I've been exploring new bands lately. Should give it a spin sometime soon to see how well it aged for me.
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Interestingly, Affinity is my least favorite album of theirs. But it might be because for some reason, I never really listen to it. Every time I do, I think to myself "woah this album rips! Why don't I listen to it more often?" but then the next day I still just listen to Visions or Aquarius or The Mountain instead...
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I'd rank them this way:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Aquarius
4. Visions
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Once I got into all of their albums, which admittedly took quite a bit of time, Affinity became the album I listened to the least. I thought it was their best album a year ago, but now I think it is probably my least favorite. Still a very good effort, and most of it is really good, but the others are just better, I think.
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I find that Affinity has some GREAT songs, but, as an album, it doesn't rank too high for me either. Songs like BBG and Earthrise just don't feel right to me. The Mountain is a complete masterpiece.
I rank them:
1. The Mountain
2. Visions
3. Affinity
4. Aquarius
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YAY RANKINGS
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Restoration EP
4. Visions
5. Aquarius
6. Demo
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I feel like this is the third or fourth time I'm doing rankings in this thread. :lol
1. The Mountain
2. Aquarius
3. Affinity
4. Visions
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I find that Affinity has some GREAT songs, but, as an album, it doesn't rank too high for me either. Songs like BBG and Earthrise just don't feel right to me. The Mountain is a complete masterpiece.
I rank them:
1. The Mountain
2. Visions
3. Affinity
4. Aquarius
I think I might agree with this ranking the most, though Affinity might beat out Visions depending upon the day. Maybe.
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1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Visions
4. Aquarius
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1. The Mountain
2. Aquarius
3. Affinity
4. Visions
If I included Restoration it would be on par with Affinity.
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1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Restoration
4. Aquarius
5. Visions
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Seems like many people here don't like Visions too much, can I ask why? I think it took all the good elements from Aquarius, but with a much more cohesive and mature sound.
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Seems like many people here don't like Visions too much, can I ask why? I think it took all the good elements from Aquarius, but with a much more cohesive and mature sound.
Lack of good melodies and annoying instrumental parts imo.
Also Aquarius has Celestial Elixir, that song alone is better than the whole Visions album.
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1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Restoration
4. Aquarius
5. Visions
Perfect :tup
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I'd probably rank as follows:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Visions
4. Aquarius
5. Restoration
To be honest Affinity and Visions are very close. I think Affinity is a better album but the song Visions is easily my favourite Haken song, so there's that.
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1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Visions
4. Restoration
5. Aquarius
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Seems like many people here don't like Visions too much, can I ask why? I think it took all the good elements from Aquarius, but with a much more cohesive and mature sound.
I totally agree with you. Love Visions and might even rate it higher then The Mountain with Affinity being my number 1.
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I still think TM is their masterpiece. Visions is a close second for me, just love the whole vibe of the album.
Affinity is a mixed bag for me, love half of the album (Initiate, 1985, Lapse, The Architect and The Endless Knot) but the other half doesn't really do too much for me. I'm starting to like Red Giant more, though. Earthrise and BBG? Nothing.
Aquarius is a pretty solid debut album, in fact, Celestial Elixir was the first Haken song I listened to and was inmediately sold, but some other stuff just doesn't work, like those growls in the middle of streams :huh:
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I'm just listening to The Mountain and it's definitly best Haken album for me. Almost every song clicked from the first time, and I love that bass soooo much.... on every album to be precise ;)
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I still think TM is their masterpiece. Visions is a close second for me, just love the whole vibe of the album.
Affinity is a mixed bag for me, love half of the album (Initiate, 1985, Lapse, The Architect and The Endless Knot) but the other half doesn't really do too much for me. I'm starting to like Red Giant more, though. Earthrise and BBG? Nothing.
Aquarius is a pretty solid debut album, in fact, Celestial Elixir was the first Haken song I listened to and was inmediately sold, but some other stuff just doesn't work, like those growls in the middle of streams :huh:
I was really lukewarm on BBG for awhile. But then I saw it in a fan video over some nature shots (since been removed....total bummer) and that ending just hit me really hard. That song is literally like sex with really slow foreplay followed by an amazing pay off!
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They just released a music video for 'Lapse'.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdabtT7mUGI
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They just released a music video for 'Lapse'.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdabtT7mUGI
:metal cool video, I'm guessing they plan on playing it this tour
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There's a bit of a campaign to gauge/generate support for the label to support a Haken DVD release. Someone set up a pretty basic way to get people to express interest for now using Google Docs, but encourage anyone vaguely interested to tick the box (just needs a valid email address).
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1l2IileRs0TydxDccQg24NwfIQxiUW22ycD61Ysv1r4c/edit
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Just did Rich!
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I did it too! I've been waiting for a Haken live DVD (or, at least some good pro-shot footage) for ages!
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DONE
There is ONE soundboard recording I've found on Youtube. Celestial Elixir from Progpower a few years ago. THAT is what actually hooked me.
SO YES for a live album. YES YES YES
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So hilarious that the only option is "Yes". I mean, I can't see anyone not wanting one, so I guess having a "No" option would technically be pointless, but still. xD
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Done as well. I saw a lot of those comments on facebook. Honestly though, if the band isn't quite there yet to be a full time thing, I can see why maybe a live DVD is not something the label wants to do yet. However, the ability to make these is easier these days I believe. They are headlining a night at progpower this year. Progpower has the cameras set up and Pagan's Mind and Seventh Wonder have used it before to make DVDs (Pagan's Mind blu-ray is amazing quality). I think it could be done. I'd buy it, I love concert videos.
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The reality is that out of those 400 or so entries, I'm estimating that only 200-300 would be sold. In my opinion, a crowd funding campaign would be a better way to go. A campaign, that if the funds are not reached, then the show wouldn't be filmed so everybody doesn't lose any money (including band and label).
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The reality is that out of those 400 or so entries, I'm estimating that only 200-300 would be sold. In my opinion, a crowd funding campaign would be a better way to go. A campaign, that if the funds are not reached, then the show wouldn't be filmed so everybody doesn't lose any money (including band and label).
Crowdfunding a live dvd worked for Leprous. But I think the idea here is more to see if there's any substantial interest at all.
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The reality is that out of those 400 or so entries, I'm estimating that only 200-300 would be sold. In my opinion, a crowd funding campaign would be a better way to go. A campaign, that if the funds are not reached, then the show wouldn't be filmed so everybody doesn't lose any money (including band and label).
That's a good point. Might mention that to Ray or Hen next time I speak to them to see if they've considered it.
But I think the idea here is more to see if there's any substantial interest at all.
As I understand it, that's right. Just to have something to say to the label "just from some quick interest-gauging on facebook and some internet forums hundreds/thousands of people have expressed an interest".
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The reality is that out of those 400 or so entries, I'm estimating that only 200-300 would be sold. In my opinion, a crowd funding campaign would be a better way to go. A campaign, that if the funds are not reached, then the show wouldn't be filmed so everybody doesn't lose any money (including band and label).
Crowdfunding a live dvd worked for Leprous. But I think the idea here is more to see if there's any substantial interest at all.
Crowdfunding worked for Circus Maximus as well. I think Haken could pull it off very well, specially now that the Haken Heaven official Facebook group has more than 2k people in it, they could reach a large amount of fans pretty easily.
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Just checked out how tickets were selling for HAKEN for their St. Louis show and it looks like there are only (8) regular seats left and a handful of standing room. the venue is only a 750 seat venue but considering there were probably 100 seats still open for The Neal Morse band when they were in town....it'll be neat to see a sold out show..
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They just released a music video for 'Lapse'.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdabtT7mUGI
:metal cool video, I'm guessing they plan on playing it this tour
Yes, I like it a lot. :tup
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https://youtu.be/aLSmk1p9Fi0
A short interview with Hen and Charlie, and then a live clip of 1985 in full.
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Cool interview and awesome performance (bar a couple of moments in the backing vocals :lol)
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To be fair, the backing vocals were never Haken's strongest asset when playing live.
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That falsetto is fucking painful to listen to.
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On the backing vocals, I'm not going to defend them, as they are not exactly great in this, but I will say I've seen Haken a lot and they are never mixed this high in the audience mix. Typically they are quite a bit more buried and just adding the extra layer, not out front like that.
Edit: Also worth noting it's quite difficult to play drums and deliver those type of vocals.
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I respect them for trying.
lol
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I just wonder why Ray is singing falsetto at all, he could sing other melody in his own register, could sound better at least :\
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I just wonder why Ray is singing falsetto at all, he could sing other melody in his own register, could sound better at least :\
I think it might be Conner rather than Ray. Ray normally sings in a normal register. He's actually got a pretty good tenor voice.
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I just wonder why Ray is singing falsetto at all, he could sing other melody in his own register, could sound better at least :\
I think it might be Conner rather than Ray. Ray normally sings in a normal register. He's actually got a pretty good tenor voice.
Oh really? I was almost 100% sure I saw only Ray sang to the mic in the chorus but I could be wrong. Interesting that they don't use backing track like many bands nowadays. They don't use click?
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I just wonder why Ray is singing falsetto at all, he could sing other melody in his own register, could sound better at least :\
I think it might be Conner rather than Ray. Ray normally sings in a normal register. He's actually got a pretty good tenor voice.
Oh really? I was almost 100% sure I saw only Ray sang to the mic in the chorus but I could be wrong. Interesting that they don't use backing track like many bands nowadays. They don't use click?
They are too closely associated with Portnoy to use a click.
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As a Haken-noob, to me there is definitely a moment where the lead singer sings in a not-so-good falsetto, since it is the only vocal line that seems to sync up with what he is doing on stage.
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I just wonder why Ray is singing falsetto at all, he could sing other melody in his own register, could sound better at least :\
I think it might be Conner rather than Ray. Ray normally sings in a normal register. He's actually got a pretty good tenor voice.
Oh really? I was almost 100% sure I saw only Ray sang to the mic in the chorus but I could be wrong. Interesting that they don't use backing track like many bands nowadays. They don't use click?
They all play to a click now. They went from no click, to Ray only click, to full click. Just because you use a click doesn't mean you have to using backing vocal tracks.
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I'm seeing them in Toronto tomorrow!!! Anyone else?
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https://youtu.be/aLSmk1p9Fi0
A short interview with Hen and Charlie, and then a live clip of 1985 in full.
Love the glasses and how you can see the people who caught them wearing them from the stage :metal
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I have a question about their current setlist. Some sources say there´s an Aquarius Medley halfwat through the set, but I´ve seen reports where they played three songs off Visions instead: The Mind's Eye, Portals and Shapeshifter. I barely know Visions and dont know Aquaruis, and would liek to hear the songs they´ll play before the show tomorrow. Do you guys know what exactly they´re playing?
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I would check setlist.fm tomorrow because tonight's the first show of the NA leg.
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I would check setlist.fm tomorrow because tonight's the first show of the NA leg.
Will do. Thanks!
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HAKEN, The Shelter, Detroit, MI, USA
23.08.2017
1. Premonition
2. Nocturnal Conspiracy
3. In Memoriam
4. 1985
5. Red Giant
6. Aquarius Medley
7. Cockroach King
8. The Architect
9. The Endless Knot
encore
10.Visions
----------------
That's a hell of a setlist for me. I regret that I don't live in USA... They were in Poland in 2015 I think... or 2016... Anyway, I couldn't attend.... :(
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HAKEN, The Shelter, Detroit, MI, USA
23.08.2017
1. Premonition
2. Nocturnal Conspiracy
3. In Memoriam
4. 1985
5. Red Giant
6. Aquarius Medley
7. Cockroach King
8. The Architect
9. The Endless Knot
encore
10.Visions
----------------
That's a hell of a setlist for me. I regret that I don't live in USA... They were in Poland in 2015 I think... or 2016... Anyway, I couldn't attend.... :(
I saw that!!! Really cool, but it´s a shame they took out Atlas Stone. That´s ok though, should be a great show tonight. I love that they added Premonition as the first song of the show.
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Interesting set list. If that holds up for this tour. one of the friends going with me is going to be annoyed as heck, since he is a monster fan of Falling Back to Earth and a solid/good fan of most of their other stuff.
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I think the most likely changes we'll see as shows push off is them rotating around the songs from Visions to keep everything practiced for ProgPower when they perform the album in full.
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When I saw them in London earlier this year, Atlas Stone wasn't on the setlist, but it was still completely kickass :D
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Just heard from the promoter of their show in Québec City saying that the Nova Collective wouldn't be playing here because of visa issues (not Richard Henshall fortunately!). I'm guessing it'll be the same for the show in Montréal. That's a shame. I was really looking forward to seeing them play. :tdwn
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Nova Collective weren't at the show in Toronto.
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Yeah I thought this was known - unfortunately the visa situation was really complicated for Pete. Dan and Matt don't need visas, being Americans themselves. As half the band is American, US customs wouldn't treat them as an overseas band, and so wouldn't do a band visa. Hen is on the Haken one, so he's fine, which just left Pete. He would therefore have had to apply for an individual visa, which probably would have taken too long and might not have been successful anyway.
Such a shame it didn't work out. Stupid American immigration systems.
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Yeah I thought this was known - unfortunately the visa situation was really complicated for Pete. Dan and Matt don't need visas, being Americans themselves. As half the band is American, US customs wouldn't treat them as an overseas band, and so wouldn't do a band visa. Hen is on the Haken one, so he's fine, which just left Pete. He would therefore have had to apply for an individual visa, which probably would have taken too long and might not have been successful anyway.
Such a shame it didn't work out. Stupid American immigration systems.
And remember Hen was screwed when they played RoSfest a few years ago as well.
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I took this one right after the concert. Richard was quite nice!!
(https://s19.postimg.org/ehy8ge7yb/Haken.jpg)
Soon after that I met Ross too, he was heading for their bus, and I just said "great show, man, thanks so much!!" and got a high five.
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:metal :metal
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Haken tonight!!! :metal
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Just talked to Diego on the street next to the venue.
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That's cool :tup
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Here is a very cool moment with Conner having a bass lesson with a young fan behind the venue last night.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/550x300q90/922/DtRTgZ.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/f/pmDtRTgZj)
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I saw on social media they were advertising doing music lessons with members of the band... is that how they are seriously doing them? lol just seems odd
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I saw on social media they were advertising doing music lessons with members of the band... is that how they are seriously doing them? lol just seems odd
That guy might've been the only one, haha.
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Yeah but it depends on timing. maybe it was sound check for the other bands and they couldn't go on stage. you know sometimes somebody can't show up to the gig to the later and that's all they can do
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Yea, I mean, whatever works. I'm just thinking if I paid for it, I'd be kind of bummed to get my lesson in the street :lol but then again, maybe that's what they agreed upon.
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The kid was enjoying every minute. At least what I saw. I parked behind the venue and was blown away to see this.
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I can assure you that most of their lessons are not like that. :lol
I imagine that was either a choice or it was the only way to be able to fit it in.
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I can assure you that most of their lessons are not like that. :lol
Exactly! Still it was such a cool moment.
I imagine that was either a choice or it was the only way to be able to fit it in.
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Wasn't trying to shit on the moment, just thought it looked odd. BUt of course, if the guy enjoyed it and Conner was happy to do it, then all the merrier. I will say, I would have been like King and just astonished to see that as you are approaching the venue. Maybe I catch some lessons on the NYC streets this weekend :lol
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I was! Hey, it's Conner! My wife goes over running to take pictures I'm like hey hey hey! Don't go over there and bug him kid paid for it. LOL
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Yea true, I wouldn't want to take any thing away from the guys experience. Must be awesome to get a one on one with a musician you really like.
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So last year when I finally realized I was going to Progpower was when I first listened to Haken, I dug the Earthrise and Endless Knot videos on youtube and being their newest release, got Affinity and really liked it. I listened to some other songs I knew they'd be playing from following setlist.fm and while I really had a good time, but I never came back to listen to their older albums. Knowing I was going to see them this fall, I finally got around to listening to Haken some more. Over the last week or two, I've started really loving Visions. Not totally crazy about the title track, but the rest of the album is simply amazing. I've also got the Mountain now, which is also really good, but I've been sinking my teeth into Visions that I haven't given the Mountain enough attention to really digest yet. Regardless, I'm really excited to see them Saturday, just about a full year after seeing them the first time. :metal
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I saw on social media they were advertising doing music lessons with members of the band... is that how they are seriously doing them? lol just seems odd
Link to this? I'd be up for a lesson if they're still offering this.
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I saw on social media they were advertising doing music lessons with members of the band... is that how they are seriously doing them? lol just seems odd
Link to this? I'd be up for a lesson if they're still offering this.
Not sure how to link to a facebook post but it's on their wall from August 19th and it reads:
TOUR LESSONS! Slots are filling up fast for this tour so be sure to get in touch with your instrumentalist of choice if you'd like a lesson in your city. Tour dates: www.hakenmusic.com/tour
Charlie Griffiths - Guitarist: charlie@hakenmusic.com
Diego Tejeida - d'Tej: diego@hakenmusic.com
Ray Hearne: ray@hakenmusic.com
Conner Green: connergreenbass@gmail.com
Richard Henshall: rich@hakenmusic.com
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I saw on social media they were advertising doing music lessons with members of the band... is that how they are seriously doing them? lol just seems odd
Link to this? I'd be up for a lesson if they're still offering this.
Not sure how to link to a facebook post but it's on their wall from August 19th and it reads:
TOUR LESSONS! Slots are filling up fast for this tour so be sure to get in touch with your instrumentalist of choice if you'd like a lesson in your city. Tour dates: www.hakenmusic.com/tour
Charlie Griffiths - Guitarist: charlie@hakenmusic.com
Diego Tejeida - d'Tej: diego@hakenmusic.com
Ray Hearne: ray@hakenmusic.com
Conner Green: connergreenbass@gmail.com
Richard Henshall: rich@hakenmusic.com
Conner doesn't get a Haken email address :lol
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I saw on social media they were advertising doing music lessons with members of the band... is that how they are seriously doing them? lol just seems odd
Link to this? I'd be up for a lesson if they're still offering this.
Not sure how to link to a facebook post but it's on their wall from August 19th and it reads:
TOUR LESSONS! Slots are filling up fast for this tour so be sure to get in touch with your instrumentalist of choice if you'd like a lesson in your city. Tour dates: www.hakenmusic.com/tour
Charlie Griffiths - Guitarist: charlie@hakenmusic.com
Diego Tejeida - d'Tej: diego@hakenmusic.com
Ray Hearne: ray@hakenmusic.com
Conner Green: connergreenbass@gmail.com
Richard Henshall: rich@hakenmusic.com
awesome thanks
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Does any of you, Haken fans and, probably, guitarists, know what 8 string guitar tuning are Rich and Charlie using?
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Drop E
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Saw my first Haken show in NYC Sunday night. Awesome show! And running into some of DTF's finest (Axe/Bill, Nick) is always a good thing!
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Saw my first Haken show in NYC Sunday night. Awesome show! And running into some of DTF's finest (Axe/Bill, Nick) is always a good thing!
Nice :metal :metal was there as well and ran into Axeman at the end at the merch stand.
Had a great time watching them. Really good performance and atmosphere at the show. It sucked it was pouring so I got there completely drenched. I chilled in the back near the bar. The venue was pretty full, I had never been there before but it was a nice spot. I was most impressed by Ross. I feel like he impressed me the most last time I saw them as well, but they played some different songs this time that used his vocals a bit more and in a bit different ways such as with As Death Embraces. I've been really loving Visions lately, so was kind of bummed they only played the opening and closing track, but the song Visions live was very awesome. I haven't really listened to Aquarius so the medley was pretty much new music for me which I thought was cool to see all together like that. At the end I got to shake hands with Charlie and Connor, both chilled near the stage after the show to meet with fans and both seemed like cool chill dudes appreciating the fans.
Got lots of video footage from the back:
Haken Live in NYC with cramx3 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVTumEpI-Ng)
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Saw my first Haken show in NYC Sunday night. Awesome show! And running into some of DTF's finest (Axe/Bill, Nick) is always a good thing!
Nice :metal :metal was there as well and ran into Axeman at the end at the merch stand.
Had a great time watching them. Really good performance and atmosphere at the show. It sucked it was pouring so I got there completely drenched. I chilled in the back near the bar. The venue was pretty full, I had never been there before but it was a nice spot. I was most impressed by Ross. I feel like he impressed me the most last time I saw them as well, but they played some different songs this time that used his vocals a bit more and in a bit different ways such as with As Death Embraces. I've been really loving Visions lately, so was kind of bummed they only played the opening and closing track, but the song Visions live was very awesome. I haven't really listened to Aquarius so the medley was pretty much new music for me which I thought was cool to see all together like that. At the end I got to shake hands with Charlie and Connor, both chilled near the stage after the show to meet with fans and both seemed like cool chill dudes appreciating the fans.
Got lots of video footage from the back:
Haken Live in NYC with cramx3 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVTumEpI-Ng)
I posted your video on my Facebook page!
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:metal :metal
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Howdy, friends and neighbors!
I am seeing Haken TONIGHT in Durham. Really excited to see them live.
Do they have an opening act?
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Howdy, friends and neighbors!
I am seeing Haken TONIGHT in Durham. Really excited to see them live.
Do they have an opening act?
Yes! Sithu Aye is the opening act and I would definitely recommend getting there in time for at least a chunk of his set. Really enjoyable instrumental prog rock/metal.
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Cool. Thanks, Bill!
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One thing I forgot to mention about the NYC show, I think they had some lighting issues. At one point the back screen went to an error and then went completely black and the front stage lights were dark for awhile in the beginning of the set, it seems they eventually got things figured out, but you can even notice in my video how dark it is in the beginning but gets brighter and normal towards the end.
I always love when stuff like that happens, makes the experience unique. Similar to last week when I saw Deep Purple and they came out and started playing without any lights on (like completely dark, not slightly dark like Haken) :lol
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Cool. Thanks, Bill!
I second what Bill said. The opener is pretty killer and worth catching
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Just got to the venue. Will report back later.
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Hell yeah Hef!! Enjoy!!
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You are in for a good night of music :yarr :metal
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OK, just got home.
In my professional medical opinion: holy fucking shit. That show was hella awesome!
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The song Visions live was just orgasmic, when I saw them earlier this year :hefdaddy :metal :hefdaddy :metal
It's my favourite song of theirs and it just ended the night in the most triumphant way.
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Yeah, that's how they ended the show last night.
Also, they were loud as hell. :metal
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I suspect only Rich might have an insight for me, but did anyone else find it odd that for ProgPower they played all of Visions, The Architect, and nothing else?
They had a headline set and could have played as long as they liked, and unless I'm mistaken I don't think this set was even as long as their typical sets have been on this tour. Just seems odd not to have started with a few random songs from the tour, then play what they did.
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Maybe they started late? Seems there should be room for at least another song in that set.
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Maybe there were delays in setting up all the gear/sound, etc for all the bands and they had to start a little late? That's always an issue when you have a big festival with many bands coming in.
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Maybe there were delays in setting up all the gear/sound, etc for all the bands and they had to start a little late? That's always an issue when you have a big festival with many bands coming in.
I kind of recall that being a problem at PP day 1 last year, there were some really large breaks between the bands at the end of the day.
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More than likely delays with stage set up. I've notices that the time between sets is usually 15min. Thats not a lot of time. Id like a 20 min. Between sets. That way you dont eat up band time.
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No particular insight to offer I'm afraid.
I don't know what PPUSA is normally like, but for festival headliners here 1.5 hours is pretty normal, which is basically just time for Visions plus one more long song.
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No particular insight to offer I'm afraid.
I don't know what PPUSA is normally like, but for festival headliners here 1.5 hours is pretty normal, which is basically just time for Visions plus one more long song.
For ProgPower headliners are scheduled for two hours, but they are also the only act that can go over without any grief. Typically they are very stringent on the lower acts but headliners have all the time they need.
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Anyone in the US check out the merch stand? Wondering how much cash I should bring.
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Anyone in the US check out the merch stand? Wondering how much cash I should bring.
Shirts are $25 or $35 depending on the shirt. I think the album vinyls they were selling were $40, could be wrong though. Drum and guitar books for Affinity were $20 and $30 respectively. The light up Haken glasses for 1985 were only $5. I know they had coffee and some other stuff, forget how much that was. Definitely bring cash though, it may or may not be cash only depending on the wifi situation at the venue.
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Or you can just get the cash from Axeman, but, like wifi, availability at your venue may vary.
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So, of course Haken absolutely killed it last night, so fucking good. Scored a setlist Diego handed to my bro, needless to say, from being unaware of Haken, in one night they managed to make him a fan...
(https://scontent.fsnc1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/21730979_1343541189077318_8832678244419110324_n.jpg?oh=4a3857a7e65c6e15eb60213a6581f441&oe=5A5242AF)
(yes, they had it on a paper plate lol)
On a downer note, seems some asshole ripped off some of their merch, say Ray post about it on FB this morning with a few 'fucking cunt' thrown in there. So lame, they laid it all out there for the crowd, and some dick has to be like that.
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Atlas Stove
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WTF, who does something like that to a band like Haken? That must feel like a kick to the balls to the band. I hate people sometimes.
Also, you went to the show without knowing the songs? Glad to see you had a good time, and that setlist :lol
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Anyone in the US check out the merch stand? Wondering how much cash I should bring.
Shirts are $25 or $35 depending on the shirt. I think the album vinyls they were selling were $40, could be wrong though. Drum and guitar books for Affinity were $20 and $30 respectively. The light up Haken glasses for 1985 were only $5. I know they had coffee and some other stuff, forget how much that was. Definitely bring cash though, it may or may not be cash only depending on the wifi situation at the venue.
awesome, that's exactly what I wanted to know. Also I had no idea there's an Affinity guitar book. Going to be spending a lot more than I planned. :lol
Can anyone confirm the records were being sold for $40? That seems really steep, especially since there's no import/shipping involved. I'm still missing Restoration and The Mountain and wouldn't mind buying directly from them if it's a reasonable price.
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From their FB
URGENT: Anyone in San Francisco Bay Area able to help out HAKEN by transporting some very important gear we left in SF last night down to Las Vegas for tomorrow's show? Endless rewards available.
PLEASE SHARE
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Oh snap
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Wow, San Fran to Vegas? That's tough and wtf happened. :sad:
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From their FB
URGENT: Anyone in San Francisco Bay Area able to help out HAKEN by transporting some very important gear we left in SF last night down to Las Vegas for tomorrow's show? Endless rewards available.
PLEASE SHARE
Yeah, I don't love any band (except IQ) enough to drive round trip to Vegas.
WTF, who does something like that to a band like Haken? That must feel like a kick to the balls to the band. I hate people sometimes.
Also, you went to the show without knowing the songs? Glad to see you had a good time, and that setlist :lol
My brother didn't know them, I told him he had to go. He's very thankful today for that lol
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One week till I see them! :metal
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One week till I see them! :metal
Yep. Cant wait!
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5 days to the concert and this crap happened last night:
https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/protests-turn-violent-in-delmar-loop-late-saturday-second-night/article_d93c9b0b-3958-5bba-a00b-bc971b2e9f4a.html
For those unaware, the Delmar Loop is where the Haken concert is next Friday.
:( :( :(
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5 days to the concert and this crap happened last night:
https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/protests-turn-violent-in-delmar-loop-late-saturday-second-night/article_d93c9b0b-3958-5bba-a00b-bc971b2e9f4a.html
For those unaware, the Delmar Loop is where the Haken concert is next Friday.
:( :( :(
Yeah. This sucks. I still plan on going at this point. I can't imagine that these 'protestors' will have the stamina to make it all week. All the out of Towners who were paid to travel to St Louis would surely be gone by this Friday, right?
What ticks me off is that Delmar Hall wands people so my right to protect myself by Conceal Carrying my weapon is being taken from me. When in reality that scenario is the Exact scenario on why I'd need protection. Anyaway....
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Holy crap that was good. Top 5 concerts
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Still haven't had the opportunity to see Haken live...yet. :(
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I saw Haken last week in Mexico city, it was awesome. Me and my wife have been fans for the past 4 years but this was the first time we could catch them on tour. I enjoyed the Haken's set much more than Shattered Fortress' (they played awesome but I had the feeling of watching a cover band).
I just wished their set would be longer (beside they didn't play our favorite song, Celestial Elixir).
Again, awesome show!
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Yea, that Mexico show got a short set list. I guess given they were essentially playing two shows in one night, that's what they needed to do.
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They were phenomenal in Hollywood. My god... I've never heard a singer sound that good live before. NEVER.
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They were phenomenal in Hollywood. My god... I've never heard a singer sound that good live before. NEVER.
I haven't seen Haken live yet, but I have been at the MPs Shattered Fortress show in Luxembourg - and I have to agree he sounded awesome live.
Hope Haken come to Germany again soon!
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They were phenomenal in Hollywood. My god... I've never heard a singer sound that good live before. NEVER.
I haven't seen Haken live yet, but I have been at the MPs Shattered Fortress show in Luxembourg - and I have to agree he sounded awesome live.
Hope Haken come to Germany again soon!
I mentioned in my review of the NYC show that I was most impressed by Ross which is pretty impressive when you are surrounded by so much talent. He just sounded great live and was able to pull off all the vocal parts, didn't struggle, had good stage presence. He's not my favorite vocalist, but he sure was a good performer.
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How does the band feel about people taking photos during performances? Obviously not flash, not a huge camera, and not a big bright cell phone held above the crowd. Is this acceptable?
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I'm guessing they're fine with it cause they would pose if they saw a camera pointed at them in Denver.
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They are okay with it. Hell, I even saw a video on a Facebook fan page where Ross grabbed the camera phone from the guy in the front row, turned it around to the fans while I was singing the song.
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I got plenty of video and pictures at the NYC show. They don't care, they are better one social media than lots of bands and probably realize that fans getting pictures and videos and sharing them is big for getting exposure.
(https://scontent.fewr1-3.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/21246515_10114911295301574_5709848075731344562_o.jpg?oh=94d33be41d067885401280e75503e5e6&oe=5A590AF6)
(https://scontent.fewr1-3.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/21246317_10114911295740694_3267121530135253085_o.jpg?oh=189f4a5d793507b0cc6002b40be3c56d&oe=5A58D027)
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tomorrow night!!!! Cannot wait :metal
for as pumped as I am to see HAKEN I'm also stoked to see Sythe Aye, and they have a band named Mammoth opening for them as well. I checked out Mammoth and they seem like they're in the same vein as Sythe Aye....instrumental prog rock.
Mammoth plays from 8:00-8:45, Sythe from 8:45-10:00....then HAKEN.
There is a statement on Delmar Halls info page for the concert that says "Small Cameras (NO detachable lens) OK. NO Audio. NO Video." So it looks like phones are alright.
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tomorrow night!!!! Cannot wait :metal
for as pumped as I am to see HAKEN I'm also stoked to see Sythe Aye, and they have a band named Mammoth opening for them as well. I checked out Mammoth and they seem like they're in the same vein as Sythe Aye....instrumental prog rock.
Mammoth plays from 8:00-8:45, Sythe from 8:45-10:00....then HAKEN.
There is a statement on Delmar Halls info page for the concert that says "Small Cameras (NO detachable lens) OK. NO Audio. NO Video." So it looks like phones are alright.
Wow the headliner doesn't go on till 10:00? When's the sound curfew there?
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tomorrow night!!!! Cannot wait :metal
for as pumped as I am to see HAKEN I'm also stoked to see Sythe Aye, and they have a band named Mammoth opening for them as well. I checked out Mammoth and they seem like they're in the same vein as Sythe Aye....instrumental prog rock.
Mammoth plays from 8:00-8:45, Sythe from 8:45-10:00....then HAKEN.
There is a statement on Delmar Halls info page for the concert that says "Small Cameras (NO detachable lens) OK. NO Audio. NO Video." So it looks like phones are alright.
Wow the headliner doesn't go on till 10:00? When's the sound curfew there?
I'd have to let KevShemv answer that if he knows. I don't go to near enough concerts to know. All I know is that Delmar Hall is right next to the Pagent (a very popular venue in St. Louis) and they are located in a very 'trendy' area of town where concerts etc. are common place.
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Wow, Haken went on at 8:30pm sharp in NYC. That's one late show.
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I'd have to let KevShemv answer that if he knows. I don't go to near enough concerts to know. All I know is that Delmar Hall is right next to the Pagent (a very popular venue in St. Louis) and they are located in a very 'trendy' area of town where concerts etc. are common place.
Gotcha, well have fun! That just caught my eye because a lot of venues around me have to wrap the shows by 11:00 due to sound curfew.
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Wow, Haken went on at 8:30pm sharp in NYC. That's one late show.
did they have the same opening acts?
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Wow, Haken went on at 8:30pm sharp in NYC. That's one late show.
did they have the same opening acts?
It was just Sithu Aye with them for the East Coast dates.
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Wow, Haken went on at 8:30pm sharp in NYC. That's one late show.
did they have the same opening acts?
It was just Sithu Aye with them for the East Coast dates.
I would be surprised if Sithu Aye plays for 1.25 hours, that seems wrong. There was only one opener for our shows and they only played 45 minutes I think, but it definitely wasn't over an hour.
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I thought concerts in the Loop always end at 11pm. I'll have to look on Twitter later and see if there's any word on when the bands all go on.
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I thought concerts in the Loop always end at 11pm. I'll have to look on Twitter later and see if there's any word on when the bands all go on.
Their website says doors open at 7:00, first band starts at 8:00
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I thought concerts in the Loop always end at 11pm. I'll have to look on Twitter later and see if there's any word on when the bands all go on.
Their website says doors open at 7:00, first band starts at 8:00
Hmmmm, I guess we'll see. I hope those times are not correct, though. It's bad enough to have to sit through two opening acts, but Haken not starting till 10 pm would be rough (especially since I have to be up at 6 am Saturday :facepalm: :facepalm:).
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Anyone going to see them in Chicago and have VIP passes? Once again, I can't find any info on exactly when the soundcheck starts. In the email it just says it'll last 30 minutes, and the hang out will also last about 30 minutes. Doors open at 7pm, so at the latest I guess that's 6pm. Anyone know where I might be able to find more concrete info?
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Anyone going to see them in Chicago and have VIP passes? Once again, I can't find any info on exactly when the soundcheck starts. In the email it just says it'll last 30 minutes, and the hang out will also last about 30 minutes. Doors open at 7pm, so at the latest I guess that's 6pm. Anyone know where I might be able to find more concrete info?
When I did VIP I didn't get the email with info until early the morning of. I would guess more likely starting somewhere between 3:30 and 5.
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Oh damn that early? Okay.
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Check your messages Implode.
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Great show tonight in St. Louis. Highlights, for me, were 1985, Pareidolia, the Aquarius medley and Visions.
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Great show tonight in St. Louis. Highlights, for me, were 1985, Pareidolia, the Aquarius medley and Visions.
Yeah. That was a blast! SO glad they came through St. Louis. Great live performance band.
I was thrilled with the opening acts as well. Mammoth and Sithu Aye sounded great as well.
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Wow, Haken went on at 8:30pm sharp in NYC. That's one late show.
did they have the same opening acts?
It was just Sithu Aye with them for the East Coast dates.
I would be surprised if Sithu Aye plays for 1.25 hours, that seems wrong. There was only one opener for our shows and they only played 45 minutes I think, but it definitely wasn't over an hour.
Mammoth played from 8:00 to right around 8:30 or so. Sithu Aye played from 9:00ish to 9:45ish Anne then HAKEN played from 10:00 until literally right at midnight.
Was a long night of awesome music.
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Haken set list:
Initiate
In Memoriam
1985
Pareidolia
Atlas Stone
Aquarius medley
As Death Embraces
Cockroach King
The Endless Knot
The Architect
Visions
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We got Red Giant instead of Pareidolia, would've preferred the latter. Still a fantastic gig.
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Sing them tonight!
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We got Red Giant instead of Pareidolia, would've preferred the latter. Still a fantastic gig.
Same here, although they played Pareidolia last year so the different song was cool for me even if it's not a favorite. Still wishing we got more of Visions in NYC. Some of the lead up gigs to ProgPower featured a bunch of those songs and that would have been cool. Like this is probably my favorite setlist of the tour https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/haken/2017/motorco-music-hall-durham-nc-2be2cc2e.html (https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/haken/2017/motorco-music-hall-durham-nc-2be2cc2e.html)
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Insomnia and Shapeshifter definitely would've been cool. I don't really have any complaints though. The only song on the set that didn't do it for me was Red Giant, the rest of the show was awesome. Even Initiate, one of my least favorite Haken songs, was a lot of fun live. The show really got going with the Aquarius medley though. Everything from there to the end was amazing and the crowd was really into it.
The highlight of the show probably ended up being Cockroach King. When The Mountain came out I didn't care for it, but it's grown on me since and seeing it live boosted it even more. They put so much energy into it. I will not be surprised if it becomes their Metropolis or Hallowed Be Thy Name, maybe it already has.
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I think Cockroach King and The Endless Knot will be two of those songs they pretty much always play, and I can see why. Neither is a favorite of mine, but both are a lot of fun live and get the crowd going.
I can do without Initiate, even live where it was still kinda bland. but it's short enough to where it's over quickly. The concert went nowhere but up after that was the first song! :lol :lol
I will say that Ross Jennings was a pleasant surprise. His voice took me a while to really get into, but he nailed pretty much everything last night. And he is a surprisingly good front man (his JLB routine of darting off the stage on occasion during an instrumental section aside :P); he is very active and interacts well with the crowd.
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I will say that Ross Jennings was a pleasant surprise. His voice took me a while to really get into, but he nailed pretty much everything last night. And he is a surprisingly good front man (his JLB routine of darting off the stage on occasion during an instrumental section aside :P); he is very active and interacts well with the crowd.
Absolutely this. His vocals took me a bit to 'get' when I first started listening to HAKEN, which was only with the release of Affinity......but as I listened more and more I now enjoy them just fine.
And last night he was on big time and pretty much nailed every note he needed to nail. Very powerful voice.
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Has anyone actually listed the songs in the Aquarius Medley? Did I miss it?
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Every song except Sun, in album order.
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I can't give time stamps on anything, but going from memory, the medley had something like:
-First 3-4 minutes of Point of No Return
-I think one verse from the first half of Streams and then the instrumental section that climaxes around 3:30 in the song
-A couple of minutes from the rocking second half of Acquariam (I wanna say where it kicks in around 5:45, but I wouldn't swear on it)
-A little bit of Eternal Rain (cannot say what parts, since I do not listen to that song enough to have been able to pick out which verses/parts/etc.)
-I think one verse of the opening section of Drowning in the Flood, followed by most of the mellow second half. Where it normally climaxes and goes into the synth solo, that ends the song, they went into...
-Celestial Elixir from around 10:40 (where that amazing synth part kicks in near the end of the instrumental section) till the end (although the end might have been truncated; hard to remember).
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From what I remember, they started with the instrumental section of Eternal Rain and then went back to the first verse. Can't remember where they went from there.
Btw I forgot to mention how impressive Ross was. He's grown into a great singer and frontman. I was blown away by him more than anyone else.
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Haken set list:
Initiate
In Memoriam
1985
Pareidolia
Atlas Stone
Aquarius medley
As Death Embraces
Cockroach King
The Endless Knot
The Architect
Visions
This is pretty much what we got in Milwaukee, minus As Death Embraces. Cockroach King, Visions, 1985, and Atlas Stone seemed like the most 'crowd pleasing' songs of the evening which is not surprising as all were fucking awesome. Even Cockroach King, my least favorite from The Mountain, was pretty damn good.
I think Cockroach King and The Endless Knot will be two of those songs they pretty much always play, and I can see why. Neither is a favorite of mine, but both are a lot of fun live and get the crowd going.
I can do without Initiate, even live where it was still kinda bland. but it's short enough to where it's over quickly. The concert went nowhere but up after that was the first song! :lol :lol
I will say that Ross Jennings was a pleasant surprise. His voice took me a while to really get into, but he nailed pretty much everything last night. And he is a surprisingly good front man (his JLB routine of darting off the stage on occasion during an instrumental section aside :P); he is very active and interacts well with the crowd.
I agree with all of this. Ross was a very pleasant surprise. His vocals were great, he was good with the crowd, and he even did well with the harsh vocals on the Aquarius medley and The Architect.
Also, I swear I heard a bit of Sun in the medley but I'm not 100% sure as that album is my least favorite so I don't listen to it all that much compared to the others.
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Unless a part of it was snuck in there not in sequential track order (which I do not believe it was), nothing from Sun was in the medley.
I, too, was impressed with how well Jennings did with the deeper and harsher vocals. He has more diversity with his singing than I thought before. He still has this one specific tone/range he hits that kind of bugs me, but I can overlook it. :biggrin:
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Ross' growls improved big time. He nailed The Architect.
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I will say that Ross Jennings was a pleasant surprise. His voice took me a while to really get into, but he nailed pretty much everything last night. And he is a surprisingly good front man (his JLB routine of darting off the stage on occasion during an instrumental section aside :P); he is very active and interacts well with the crowd.
Absolutely this. His vocals took me a bit to 'get' when I first started listening to HAKEN, which was only with the release of Affinity......but as I listened more and more I now enjoy them just fine.
And last night he was on big time and pretty much nailed every note he needed to nail. Very powerful voice.
I can't remember the last time I was able to stand Front Row - Center for a band the quality of Haken. They are the real deal. I can see why MP chose them basically as his Shattered Fortress band. Btw - been jamming on the Mammoth cd I bought at the show - some seriously good prog fusion.
Also, Richard Henshall was playing what I believe to be an 8-String Strandberg, but his guitar had those jagged frets. Does anyone know what specific model his guitar is?
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Excited to see Haken tonight... with MP's The Shattered Fortress :metal Would have been cool if Haken played as well
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Nick and I were front row center last night for them... I was BLOWN AWAY.
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I will say that Ross Jennings was a pleasant surprise. His voice took me a while to really get into, but he nailed pretty much everything last night. And he is a surprisingly good front man (his JLB routine of darting off the stage on occasion during an instrumental section aside :P); he is very active and interacts well with the crowd.
Absolutely this. His vocals took me a bit to 'get' when I first started listening to HAKEN, which was only with the release of Affinity......but as I listened more and more I now enjoy them just fine.
And last night he was on big time and pretty much nailed every note he needed to nail. Very powerful voice.
I can't remember the last time I was able to stand Front Row - Center for a band the quality of Haken. They are the real deal. I can see why MP chose them basically as his Shattered Fortress band. Btw - been jamming on the Mammoth cd I bought at the show - some seriously good prog fusion.
Also, Richard Henshall was playing what I believe to be an 8-String Strandberg, but his guitar had those jagged frets. Does anyone know what specific model his guitar is?
I am not a tech guy at all when it comes to guitar and whatnot, so I am no help at all.
Good meeting you the other night...for about 10 seconds! :lol :tup :tup
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Also, Richard Henshall was playing what I believe to be an 8-String Strandberg, but his guitar had those jagged frets. Does anyone know what specific model his guitar is?
He has a custom 8-string Strandberg with true temperament frets. It's supposed to help intonation. If you really wanted you could probably order something similar on the Strandberg website but they are pretty costly.
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I can't remember the last time I was able to stand Front Row - Center for a band the quality of Haken. They are the real deal. I can see why MP chose them basically as his Shattered Fortress band. Btw - been jamming on the Mammoth cd I bought at the show - some seriously good prog fusion.
These guys were a great surprise!!! Really good music and they sounded great live. As much as I love listening to Sithu Aye....I'd have preferred to have had Sithu open with the shorter set and heard a couple more from Mammoth.
And like Kev said....it was great to have met you and chat a bit. :tup
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We got the best of both in Chicago. At the end of Mammoth's set the boys from Sithu Aye joined them on stage for a cool jam.
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We got the best of both in Chicago. At the end of Mammoth's set the boys from Sithu Aye joined them on stage for a cool jam.
Sithu's guitarist joined Mammoth in St. Louis for a Jam but he didn't.
I talked to Sithu's bass player after their set and he confirmed that all Sithu's releases are written and recorded by him....the bass, drums are programmed etc. And, while I totally enjoyed getting to hear some of the songs I dig live they 'lost' something for me in the translation. And I think the biggest difference was the drumming. The recorded/programmed drums are very progressive and on point but (not trying to bash him) the gentlemen he had drumming for him on tour...while very good....did not capture the original recorded 'feeling' of the drums. It was more rough IMO. Again....loved hearing him live but if I had my dithers I'd have swapped the time allotted to give Mammoth a few more songs.
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I hope Haken puts some of the leftover mech from the US tour on their store for sale. So bummed out that I missed them.
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I hope Haken puts some of the leftover mech from the US tour on their store for sale. So bummed out that I missed them.
It is certainly possible, or also likely it might get stored here and be sold cheaply on the next tour, or a combination of those two things.
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One odd thing about the Haken show: the guy who kept coming out and taking videos of the band. It was distracting having him stand in front of the drummer or bass player for minutes at a time just taping them.
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The Chicago show was awesome for me. Also had a great time meeting and hanging out with Nick and splent. The photographer on stage didn't bother me much personally. If anything, the person taking videos from in the crowd looked like they may have annoyed people, but with no photographer pit, there isn't much to do about that.
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Yeah it was a little distracting but nothing more than that. I thought it was overall a great show.
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One odd thing about the Haken show: the guy who kept coming out and taking videos of the band. It was distracting having him stand in front of the drummer or bass player for minutes at a time just taping them.
I have to say you just got a bit unlucky at your show. That fine gentleman is Simen and he's been posted the tour videos and is doing a ton of other stuff for the band. Typically he stays in the back, side, or is in the crowd filming. My guess is they had a specific reason for needing footage of whatever he was taping at that show.
The Chicago show was awesome for me. Also had a great time meeting and hanging out with Nick and splent. The photographer on stage didn't bother me much personally. If anything, the person taking videos from in the crowd looked like they may have annoyed people, but with no photographer pit, there isn't much to do about that.
Well, that was just a bit of poor planning. Basically someone had come up from Mexico with a bunch of cameras, most of which were mounted on stage, and they gave an extra to that guy and basically said just point it at whatever you think you should. Bigger issue was he was in the 2nd row. Had they given it to someone in front they could have held it lower and not have been in anyone's way.
While all this makes for great social media videos I do hope that if and when they do a proper concert film that they get a proper film crew for it. Augment it with whatever extra cameras you might have, but do the main bit right.
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I would love to be able to do serious photography for a band like Haken some day. So many times during the show, I kept seeing all these amazing shots in my head.
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One odd thing about the Haken show: the guy who kept coming out and taking videos of the band. It was distracting having him stand in front of the drummer or bass player for minutes at a time just taping them.
I have to say you just got a bit unlucky at your show. That fine gentleman is Simen and he's been posted the tour videos and is doing a ton of other stuff for the band. Typically he stays in the back, side, or is in the crowd filming. My guess is they had a specific reason for needing footage of whatever he was taping at that show.
I noticed him walking on stage in NYC, but it wasn't for too long nor was it really that distracting for me. But if you haven't, you should check out the videos he's making on Haken's social media and youtube. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKtyrA23LNo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKtyrA23LNo) The sound and quality of these videos is really making me drool wanting a blu ray.
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Thanks for the link cramx..... was curious as to where to find any of that photage.
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I am wondering if the Southeast U.S. promotors will try and book Haken for cities like Nashville, Birmingham, Memphis, etc. Not counting the Progressive Festival in Atlanta, has Haken ever toured the Southeastern U.S.? What would the average attendance and ticket price be for the U.S cities they are currently touring?
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In regards to their touring it will be very interesting to see what happens on their next tour as it may be the first in the US that isn't based around a festival. It'll be too soon for ProgPower again and likely too soon for RoSfest as well. They also won't have set places to be for Shattered Fortress. With that being said it'll be the first tour were they really go were the best offers and routing is, and I'm interested to see how that plays out.
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One odd thing about the Haken show: the guy who kept coming out and taking videos of the band. It was distracting having him stand in front of the drummer or bass player for minutes at a time just taping them.
I have to say you just got a bit unlucky at your show. That fine gentleman is Simen and he's been posted the tour videos and is doing a ton of other stuff for the band. Typically he stays in the back, side, or is in the crowd filming. My guess is they had a specific reason for needing footage of whatever he was taping at that show.
I figured as much. It only happened a handful of times, where he seemed to overstay his welcome on stage, but when you are standing there blocking fans for several minutes for watching one of the band members during an instrumental section, that is overdoing it a bit. Like I said before, just a little distracting at times. Not a big deal.
Also, one of the friends I went with stayed after the show to get his albums signed, and said that one of the guys said they will start working on the next album in January, but wouldn't give any hints as to what direction they are going.
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One odd thing about the Haken show: the guy who kept coming out and taking videos of the band. It was distracting having him stand in front of the drummer or bass player for minutes at a time just taping them.
I have to say you just got a bit unlucky at your show. That fine gentleman is Simen and he's been posted the tour videos and is doing a ton of other stuff for the band. Typically he stays in the back, side, or is in the crowd filming. My guess is they had a specific reason for needing footage of whatever he was taping at that show.
I figured as much. It only happened a handful of times, where he seemed to overstay his welcome on stage, but when you are standing there blocking fans for several minutes for watching one of the band members during an instrumental section, that is overdoing it a bit. Like I said before, just a little distracting at times. Not a big deal.
Also, one of the friends I went with stayed after the show to get his albums signed, and said that one of the guys said they will start working on the next album in January, but wouldn't give any hints as to what direction they are going.
The band very well may have a plan for the next album that they are keeping secret, but I find it just as, if not more likely that they may not know themselves. Affinity was far more collaborative than anything before it, and if that trend continues it's hard to judge where it will go unless they do have some strong preference already in mind.
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Forgive me if these kinds of things aren't allowed, but a friend on mine has created a Haken discord group (https://discord.gg/agx8qrq) if anyone is interested in joining. There was one already, but apparently it was run mostly by kids.
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I noticed him walking on stage in NYC, but it wasn't for too long nor was it really that distracting for me. But if you haven't, you should check out the videos he's making on Haken's social media and youtube. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKtyrA23LNo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKtyrA23LNo) The sound and quality of these videos is really making me drool wanting a blu ray.
Haken have one of the best social media guy in the business. I really wish more bands produced content like that on their tour.
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I noticed him walking on stage in NYC, but it wasn't for too long nor was it really that distracting for me. But if you haven't, you should check out the videos he's making on Haken's social media and youtube. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKtyrA23LNo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKtyrA23LNo) The sound and quality of these videos is really making me drool wanting a blu ray.
Haken have one of the best social media guy in the business. I really wish more bands produced content like that on their tour.
Indeed. Ray has done a ton on that front in staying connected and still does, but Simen pushes content quality to a new level.
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Yep, that video that cramx3 posted was very cool. :hat
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I noticed him walking on stage in NYC, but it wasn't for too long nor was it really that distracting for me. But if you haven't, you should check out the videos he's making on Haken's social media and youtube. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKtyrA23LNo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKtyrA23LNo) The sound and quality of these videos is really making me drool wanting a blu ray.
Haken have one of the best social media guy in the business. I really wish more bands produced content like that on their tour.
Indeed. Ray has done a ton on that front in staying connected and still does, but Simen pushes content quality to a new level.
+1
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My little end of tour collection:
(https://www.wpapu.com/images/HakenWall.jpg)
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My little end of tour collection:
(https://www.wpapu.com/images/HakenWall.jpg)
:hefdaddy
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:metal
Love the song Cock
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Me too. It's my favorite along with Atlas stoVe that they played a while ago as well.
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I'll be curious to see which of the two longer songs from Affinity (that got played all this tour, 1985 and The Architect) gets kept in the set list on the next tour. Hopefully, it's 1985 since that is the better song and is shorter, thus taking up less time in the set.
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I know this is a big time bias on my part having seen them a ridiculous number of times in support of Affinity, I would be totally fine if for the next tour they play Bound By Gravity and nothing else, or just one shorter song.
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I'd be fine with that, too - Bound by Gravity is one of the best songs on the record, IMO - but I doubt they won't not play The Endless Knot on the next tour. That song is too much of a crowd pleaser to stop playing already.
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If there were to be a setlist staple from affinity, my vote goes to 1985.
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If there were to be a setlist staple from affinity, my vote goes to 1985.
Same. I expect 1985 to be part of pretty much every setlists like Cockroach King since The Mountain's release.
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I also expect "1985" to be a live staple from Affinity, altough I would like "The Architect" to become a staple aswell, I really love that song and I hope to hear it live again in the future.
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I personally prefer TEK over 1985.
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I love TEK too, but there's no doubt that 1985 killed live. Really got the crowd going so I can easily see it becoming a staple in future shows.
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I really really love Bound By Gravity. The lyrics are lovely and resonate with myself as a person.
I imagine an early morning, before dawn, when the dew appears. When all of life is waking up. Then as the song progresses, and gets heavy its when the Sun finally breaks the horizon and its rays shine brightly giving us all life. The ethereal force that gives us the beat in our hearts.
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Nice description. :tup :tup
Bound by Gravity is such a great tune.
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Haken just uploaded a new pic on their social media.
https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/
It's the same color scheme as Affinity, so I don't know if it's a hint towards another studio album. Live release perhaps?
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I can dig a full live album. Even if its studio, they'll play Bound By Gravity.
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Thought the same thing. It's the Affinity Design, I think this might have something to do with a live release- which would be dope
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They’re just messing with us :lol
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They’re just tooling with us :lol
FTFY
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https://www.roooar.com/music_uk/cd-dvd-haken-l-1ve-22470.html
We can trust in this site? Apparently is a live CD and DVD from Amsterdan and Atlanta. The list of the songs is in the cover:
Amsterdan: Affinity.exe/initiate, in memorian, 1985, red giant, aquamedley
races(?), atlas stone, cockroach king, the architect, the endless knot, visions
Atlanta: falling back to earth, earthrise, pareidolia, chrystallised
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https://www.roooar.com/music_uk/cd-dvd-haken-l-1ve-22470.html
We can trust in this site? Apparently is a live CD and DVD. The list of the songs is in the cover.
If this isn't fake, it would be a dream come true :o
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I can make out a few tracks, but my picture is extremely blurry. Can someone post what the tracklist is if you have a better picture than I do?
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I can make out a few tracks, but my picture is extremely blurry. Can someone post what the tracklist is if you have a better picture than I do?
Amsterdan: Affinity.exe/initiate, in memorian, 1985, red giant, aquamedley
races (?), atlas stone, cockroach king, the architect, the endless knot, visions
Atlanta: falling back to earth, earthrise, pareidolia, chrystallised
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Interesting. I know at least one, and probably more guy was kinda dead set against a live release. My guess is with audio only and split across multiple shows they would be able to find stuff they're happy with. That being said given the attitudes I've experienced on certain things I'd be shocked if there was not at least some light touch up stuff after the fact.
As for the list itself, if any of this is indeed true, I'm glad it has the Aquarius Medley on it, and am glad for the Atlanta set that's from 2016, as I was at that show as opposed to 2017. And it can be noted, whether you see it or not, during Crystallised I was the first one Ross reached out to. :D
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So I posted that link to the Haken FB group and it was immediately deleted, so you can take it to the bank that it is indeed tomorrow's announcement. Well done finding that Dev.
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As for the list itself, if any of this is indeed true, I'm glad it has the Aquarius Medley on it, and am glad for the Atlanta set that's from 2016, as I was at that show as opposed to 2017.
Same here, that'll be pretty cool to get this on video.
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As for the list itself, if any of this is indeed true, I'm glad it has the Aquarius Medley on it, and am glad for the Atlanta set that's from 2016, as I was at that show as opposed to 2017.
Same here, that'll be pretty cool to get this on video.
Yeah, and I misspoke earlier, listed as CD+DVD, so apparently this will be on video. Really surprised, frankly.
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As for the list itself, if any of this is indeed true, I'm glad it has the Aquarius Medley on it, and am glad for the Atlanta set that's from 2016, as I was at that show as opposed to 2017.
Same here, that'll be pretty cool to get this on video.
Yeah, and I misspoke earlier, listed as CD+DVD, so apparently this will be on video. Really surprised, frankly.
Most of the guys have been really keen on getting a live album/DVD out, so I don't consider it all that surprising.
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From what I've seen, they seem like a very good live band. Incredibly tight.
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As for the list itself, if any of this is indeed true, I'm glad it has the Aquarius Medley on it, and am glad for the Atlanta set that's from 2016, as I was at that show as opposed to 2017.
Same here, that'll be pretty cool to get this on video.
Yeah, and I misspoke earlier, listed as CD+DVD, so apparently this will be on video. Really surprised, frankly.
Most of the guys have been really keen on getting a live album/DVD out, so I don't consider it all that surprising.
And almost every fan of the band has asked for a live album so why not release one? :metal
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So I posted that link to the Haken FB group and it was immediately deleted, so you can take it to the bank that it is indeed tomorrow's announcement. Well done finding that Dev.
Interesting that a guy posted the cover of the album in the Haken's facebook page in the comments about the updating of theirs facebook background photo (guy's post was probably deleted) - with a little better resolution, hence I could read the song titles. From the cover, I saw the album title and I found that site through google.
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Damn, I was at the Amsterdam show. Will this be my first feature in a live concert dvd?
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Damn, I was at the Amsterdam show. Will this be my first feature in a live concert dvd?
Umm... Ayreon?
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Oh yes, there was that one as well :lol
Am I actually visible on the Ayreon dvd though?
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People in the Haken Haven group did start a petition for a live dvd a while back, and they've actually had this material "on hand" for quite a while, just waiting for the record company to agree to publish it. The petition was created for pushing the record company in the right direction. So it has been a long time coming.
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Niiiiiice! I think I was at that show as well :angel:
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And here we have an official link:
https://hakenmusic.com/blog/post/l-1ve-live-album-2018-announcement
(https://hakenmusic.com/images/l-1ve_cover.png)
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Pre-ordered.
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Only one (very minor) complaint. Deathless was played for much of this tour and didn't get inclusion. But honestly, that track list gets an A- from me. This is going to be amazing.
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My only complaint is no blu-ray release, but I understand the band/label probably wants a single package for costs and whatnot. The fact they relied on the fans to kind of push this means I can't be mad I don't get my blu-ray. This is a certain buy for me regardless.
Only one (very minor) complaint. Deathless was played for much of this tour and didn't get inclusion. But honestly, that track list gets an A- from me. This is going to be amazing.
Also, bummed there's no Deathless on this, but I don't think I am going to complain about the setlist either. It is otherwise awesome, and really excited to see the ProgPower bonus footage... speaking of, since we'll get the professional version of it, my recording of:
Haken - Earthrise Live from ProgPower (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrXlaMVEETY)
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I'd wanted to have my favourite Haken track (Celestial Elixir) on there, but I don't know if it was played on the tour or not?
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I'd wanted to have my favourite Haken track (Celestial Elixir) on there, but I don't know if it was played on the tour or not?
It was played on the first leg of the Affinity tour. It was rotated in and out each other show.
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The main show is from this footage?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMQoJDWGBVs
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Only one (very minor) complaint. Deathless was played for much of this tour and didn't get inclusion. But honestly, that track list gets an A- from me. This is going to be amazing.
On that, there is a reason. Deathless was not played during the 10th Anniversary tour and it was NOT played at ProgPower the year the bonus footage is from. The reason for that is they had to cut down there set just a bit for time, and while I haven't confirmed this with them Deathless made the most sense to cut as the band had already been confirmed as coming back the next year to play Visions in full.
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So, real quick I have to have my fanboy yeshomo moment here.
During the Atlanta show that is included in this release I was in the front row, as I have been several times while seeing Crystallized live before. Sometimes during the "I hold your hand" portion Ross I would get the interaction, often not, but when it came to ProgPower, with a more general audience I really believe that knowing I'd know what to do the first round he came right to me for that bit. And so I'll have that on the DVD and I am quite thrilled about that. :D
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They say it'll be available as digital download as well, but I don't see it on the pre order links. Anyone know if we can preorder the digital download? Would love to get this, but I don't want to pay extra for the shipping, since I live in South America.
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Personally not a big fan of live albums in general, but I'm glad they're doing this one for the fans, though surprised that it took them four albums to put it out.
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I am very happy that they finally release some live stuff! It must have been my influence, since I told them several times that it would be awesome. Just as the Restoration EP was my idea :biggrin: :biggrin:
BUT
I find it VERY sad that they won't release it on vinyl. I'm not even able to play CDs at home... bummer. Maybe they'll release it later?
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They say it'll be available as digital download as well, but I don't see it on the pre order links. Anyone know if we can preorder the digital download? Would love to get this, but I don't want to pay extra for the shipping, since I live in South America.
Links for download purchases are listed here: https://haken.lnk.to/L-1VE
But I'm not sure whether the will be a video download, maybe audio only.
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They say it'll be available as digital download as well, but I don't see it on the pre order links. Anyone know if we can preorder the digital download? Would love to get this, but I don't want to pay extra for the shipping, since I live in South America.
Links for download purchases are listed here: https://haken.lnk.to/L-1VE
But I'm not sure whether the will be a video download, maybe audio only.
I’ll probably end up pre ordering the audio download and hoping the videos hit YouTube eventually. I’ve wanted a Haken live album for years :hefdaddy
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This just shows that if we all bitch enough, we can get what we want.
So let's start a new petition....
Re-releases with a 5.1 MIX!!!!
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It comes with a 5.1 mix ;)
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I mean the albums, silly!! :P
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I mean the albums, silly!! :P
let me see if I can talk to my dad and see if I can put together his old quadraphonic stereo system for you. LOL
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I don't care about the live CDs, but I am sure the live DVDs will be cool. :coolio
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I don't care about the live CDs, but I am sure the live DVDs will be cool. :coolio
That's what I'm interested in. I gotsta get those...
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I don't care about the live CDs, but I am sure the live DVDs will be cool. :coolio
That's what I'm interested in. I gotsta get those...
I dont mind the live CD. Its just why is Earthrise on the dvd only.
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I think some of the DVD stuff is official music videos. As a bonus. Maybe that explains you question.
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I think some of the DVD stuff is official music videos. As a bonus. Maybe that explains you question.
Well there is that, but I think it's because the CD/DVD is supposed to be the Amsterdam concert with the ProgPower footage just a bonus for the DVD. I'm guessing they might need a second CD to add those songs so they kept it as a video bonus because they could pack the bonus DVD with the music videos as well. Just my guess.
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Yikes, that is one ugly cover (of this upcoming live release). I hadn't noticed that yet, but that is really ugly.
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I don't find it so ugly! It's not a masterpiece or anything but it fits well into the whole 80s thing of Affinity.
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I think that's a pretty fitting cover tbh
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Finally bought The Mountain today. Spinning it now for the first time. I only need the Restoration EP and I'll have caught up with their studio discography.
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https://www.facebook.com/InsideOutMusic/posts/10156437934025439
How is this not in here yet? :o
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:metal :metal :metal
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:hefdaddy
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The mix on the instruments sounds great, but holy over-dubbed vocals batman :lol
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Interesting setup for this show. In all the shows I've seen drums are center and Conner is off to the side, odd to see that switched up.
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Interesting setup for this show. In all the shows I've seen drums are center and Conner is off to the side, odd to see that switched up.
I noticed that as well, I also noticed they didn't have a camera (or at least didn't show a shot) right on the drummer. I love those over the shoulder drummer views of the kit on concert DVDs.
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Wow, awesome video! Wish it was coming out in blu ray, but still a must buy for me.
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but holy over-dubbed vocals batman :lol
:lol noticed this inmediately too. Anyway, we've all been asking for a Haken live album for years, so I guess it's better to have a slighly improved version of a real live show released rather than nothing at all ;D
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So awesome! (despite the edited vocals)
You can see both Elite and me at 2:32 :laugh:
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So awesome! (despite the edited vocals)
You can see both Elite and me at 2:32 :laugh:
Yeah, I watched it and also noticed you guys, awesome! :tup
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What parts are overdubbed?
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What parts are overdubbed?
Pretty sure the backing vocals. :lol
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So awesome! (despite the edited vocals)
You can see both Elite and me at 2:32 :laugh:
Yeah, I watched it and also noticed you guys, awesome! :tup
I'M GOING TO BE ON A DVD :squee:
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Here's something I don't get. The one live video I've seen of them that really knocked my socks off was Celestial Elixer recorded at PPUSA. It was pro-shot and sounded pretty good. If that's the same show they're pulling the bonus footage from for this, why wouldn't they have included this, perhaps their most iconic song?
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So, real quick I have to have my fanboy yeshomo moment here.
During the Atlanta show that is included in this release I was in the front row, as I have been several times while seeing Crystallized live before. Sometimes during the "I hold your hand" portion Ross I would get the interaction, often not, but when it came to ProgPower, with a more general audience I really believe that knowing I'd know what to do the first round he came right to me for that bit. And so I'll have that on the DVD and I am quite thrilled about that. :D
That's awesome Nick! :tup
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Here's something I don't get. The one live video I've seen of them that really knocked my socks off was Celestial Elixer recorded at PPUSA. It was pro-shot and sounded pretty good. If that's the same show they're pulling the bonus footage from for this, why wouldn't they have included this, perhaps their most iconic song?
They had been rotating Celestial and Crystallized in the US on the Affinity tour, with the general guide being they'd play Celestial in the markets that had seen Crystallized on the previous tour. ProgPower was an odd duck in that it was the only market to get Celestial in the US prior to that during their first appearance at the festival, so it made sense coming back in 2016 to play Crystallized. And to be clear, the bonus footage does not come from the same year at ProgPower that the footage of Celestial Elixir was from.
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That Celestial Elixir video was years ago, EB. :lol
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Here's something I don't get. The one live video I've seen of them that really knocked my socks off was Celestial Elixer recorded at PPUSA. It was pro-shot and sounded pretty good. If that's the same show they're pulling the bonus footage from for this, why wouldn't they have included this, perhaps their most iconic song?
They had been rotating Celestial and Crystallized in the US on the Affinity tour, with the general guide being they'd play Celestial in the markets that had seen Crystallized on the previous tour. ProgPower was an odd duck in that it was the only market to get Celestial in the US prior to that during their first appearance at the festival, so it made sense coming back in 2016 to play Crystallized. And to be clear, the bonus footage does not come from the same year at ProgPower that the footage of Celestial Elixir was from.
Boston was lucky on thast tour with the power outage. We missed seeing TYS but Haken played both songs, as you know Nick.
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That Celestial Elixir video was years ago, EB. :lol
Not sure what's funny about it, but thanks.
Truth is that I've been a fan for all of about 6 months now, so I have no idea what they were up to before that. What I do know is that most of the live stuff I've seen from them left me less than impressed. That one performance was excellent, though. That's why I was curious.
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That Celestial Elixir video was years ago, EB. :lol
Not sure what's funny about it, but thanks.
Truth is that I've been a fan for all of about 6 months now, so I have no idea what they were up to before that. What I do know is that most of the live stuff I've seen from them left me less than impressed. That one performance was excellent, though. That's why I was curious.
Given that video did get them a good amount of attention it would have been a cool inclusion as a bonus track.
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LotsOfMuzik has been given the chance to interview Haken. Do you guys have sone question for them?
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LotsOfMuzik has been given the chance to interview Haken. Do you guys have sone question for them?
All of Haken got to play in MP's Shattered Fortress tour, playing a lot of DT material. Do you (Haken) think this will affect/influence the writing on Haken 5?
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I still haven't seen them live. :(
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LotsOfMuzik has been given the chance to interview Haken. Do you guys have sone question for them?
Has Haken ever thought of doing a pledge campaign for their next album (Kickstarter, Pledgemusic, etc)?
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Keep questions coming.
BTW we will be interviewing Richard in case yu want to know
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I talked to Richard once when he talked about seeing DT for the first time on the I&W tour at the famous venue, The Marquee.
Ask him about if that lead him down the musical path he is on now.
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Wow, some good questions there!
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Question: You have Haken, Nova Collective, and now Rainmask. How do you approach your writing for each different band/project you are in? How do you decide which ideas are better for one band or the other?
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Question: You have Haken, Nova Collective, and now Rainmask. How do you approach your writing for each different band/project you are in? How do you decide which ideas are better for one band or the other?
I asked the same question to Jordan and John Mitchell, and this always intrigues me. Good one too!
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Question: You have Haken, Nova Collective, and now Rainmask. How do you approach your writing for each different band/project you are in? How do you decide which ideas are better for one band or the other?
I asked the same question to Jordan and John Mitchell, and this always intrigues me. Good one too!
Music writing is something I've always wanted to do and never managed to not suck at it :lol So it amazes me how easily some musicians can write for different bands and projects without repeating themselves.
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Nice questions guys. If you have some more, just send them here
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Question: You have Haken, Nova Collective, and now Rainmask. How do you approach your writing for each different band/project you are in? How do you decide which ideas are better for one band or the other?
I asked the same question to Jordan and John Mitchell, and this always intrigues me. Good one too!
Music writing is something I've always wanted to do and never managed to not suck at it :lol So it amazes me how easily some musicians can write for different bands and projects without repeating themselves.
Well, like anything else, it takes lots of practice and (usually) studying. It can be hard to tell sometimes because we usually see the end results of months or years of hard work, but most of the artists we love to listen to had a "formative period" where they found their voice and learned basic skills. So don't give up! It takes a lot of work, but almost anyone can do it if they really apply themselves and have the drive and desire for it.
And, to answer that second point, it comes down to having a diverse "musical vocabulary" or lots of "tools" in your "musical toolbox". Then you apply those specific tools to contexts that are appropriate. Basically, the more music you study and the more concepts you learn about and practice with, the more tools you have to make music.
As for some questions:
-Were there any new influences or more emphasized influences between The Mountain and Affinity, and/or between Affinity and HAK5N that influenced the direction the albums took/are taking?
-Will we be getting scores/sheet music/tabs for The Mountain or the other instruments of Affinity?
-If you could (or had to) collab with any modern pop singer, or rapper who would it be and why?
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Got my copy already. :D
(https://i.imgur.com/5UOuUaz.jpg)
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How in the world did you do that :lol
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Connections :hat
(I know the band (well, half of them)).
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So, is it even good? :laugh:
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I'm about a third of the way through and yeah it's awesome so far. The sound is fantastic. I'm digging the visual style as well though it won't be to everyone's tastes - lots of strobe lighting and close up handheld camera work. If you saw some of the short videos they posted on Facebook throughout the tour, it's generally in that style.
The one thing I personally would have liked more was for it to sound a bit more different from the studio versions. I'm on the Aquamedley and by its nature it's a little different, which is really cool. The songs preceding it for the most part sound like fantastic performances of exactly what's in the studio, which is great but I do rather like it when bands change things up a little on stage. (EDIT: Actually I'll retract that having seen more of the DVD! https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=42638.msg2440910#msg2440910)
But that's a minor preference, otherwise it's great.
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lots of strobe lighting and close up handheld camera work. If you saw some of the short videos they posted on Facebook throughout the tour, it's generally in that style.
That sounds promising!
The songs preceding it for the most part sound like fantastic performances of exactly what's in the studio, which is great but I do rather like it when bands change things up a little on stage.
I agree, live versions should sound different.
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Actually thinking about it Red Giant was very cool too, again the nature of that track means it'll always sound a little different live.
Also another thing I dig is that the mix is consistently Charlie on the left and Hen on the right so in quite a few places the guitar parts are more distinct that the studio versions.
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What about the vocal mix? There were talk about overdubbing/editing when the In Memoriam video was released.
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What about the vocal mix? There were talk about overdubbing/editing when the In Memoriam video was released.
Pretty sure there's a fair bit of correcting/overdubbing - from memory Ross was pretty unwell for that show so it'd be silly not to do so. To me it sounds pretty seamless though so it doesn't bother me at all. I've seen plenty of shows where he's sounded this good (and others where he's been on less good form of course) so it's a fair reflection of their live performances.
In terms of the mix, the vocals aren't especially prominent in the mix, but then that's always the case with Haken, it's part of their style.
I'll also retract my initial comment about sounding different from the studio - I think it was mainly just the first few tracks. Atlas Stone and Cockroach King have sounded absolutely fantastic.
EDIT: I'll also add that the camera work is pretty varied. Quieter moments are reflected in calmer editing. It's very nicely done on the whole!
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Ray posted this: https://www.facebook.com/rayhearnemusic/photos/a.445179748952866.1073741831.436228399848001/1233321816805318/?type=3&theater
Looks like they started drum recordings today, and they have Nolly working on drum tones :metal
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Not sure if Nolly's the best bet for Haken's drum sound though. Nolly makes good drum tones that sound kinda programmed-ish for metalcore and djent, but that's about it.
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Not sure if Nolly's the best bet for Haken's drum sound though. Nolly makes good drum tones that sound kinda programmed-ish for metalcore and djent, but that's about it.
With the use of the pads on the last album that could perhaps be the direction they are moving for some of the stuff, at least drum wise. In any case I'm excited to hear if this makes a noticeable difference on the final product, good or bad.
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Not sure if Nolly's the best bet for Haken's drum sound though. Nolly makes good drum tones that sound kinda programmed-ish for metalcore and djent, but that's about it.
I think he can do more than that. His engineering work on Good Tiger's last record was a more organic drum sound. For my money, Nolly is one of the best engineers/mixers for metal/heavy rock modern stuff out there today.
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Not sure if Nolly's the best bet for Haken's drum sound though. Nolly makes good drum tones that sound kinda programmed-ish for metalcore and djent, but that's about it.
I think he can do more than that. His engineering work on Good Tiger's last record was a more organic drum sound. For my money, Nolly is one of the best engineers/mixers for metal/heavy rock modern stuff out there today.
He also engineered drums for DTP Transcendance and, man, they sound very good. I know Nolly is a very versatile producer, so I'm sure Ray's kit will sound amazing :metal
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Not sure if Nolly's the best bet for Haken's drum sound though. Nolly makes good drum tones that sound kinda programmed-ish for metalcore and djent, but that's about it.
I think he can do more than that. His engineering work on Good Tiger's last record was a more organic drum sound. For my money, Nolly is one of the best engineers/mixers for metal/heavy rock modern stuff out there today.
He also engineered drums for DTP Transcendance and, man, they sound very good. I know Nolly is a very versatile producer, so I'm sure Ray's kit will sound amazing :metal
He's one of my favorite engineers/producers out there right now. I think I've posted over on the DT side several times I'd love if DT used him as an engineer.
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Not sure if Nolly's the best bet for Haken's drum sound though. Nolly makes good drum tones that sound kinda programmed-ish for metalcore and djent, but that's about it.
I think he can do more than that. His engineering work on Good Tiger's last record was a more organic drum sound. For my money, Nolly is one of the best engineers/mixers for metal/heavy rock modern stuff out there today.
The new Good Tiger is an amazing sounding record. I second this statement. Would love for Nolly to engineer the next DT album (highly doubt it though).
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I agree with both of you, it would be amazing to have Nolly mix a DT album :metal
Anyway, back to Haken, if they just started recording drums, should we expect Haken 5 for the end of the year? I seriously cannot wait for more Haken music.
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I agree with both of you, it would be amazing to have Nolly mix a DT album :metal
Anyway, back to Haken, if they just started recording drums, should we expect Haken 5 for the end of the year? I seriously cannot wait for more Haken music.
The original plan was either end of this year, beginning of next. Considering along with Cruise to the Edge the festival leaked that there will be a South American tour leading up to the cruise, I'd expect they plan to have it out before then. As December is the absolute worst month to release anything music related I'd guess either November or January.
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I agree with both of you, it would be amazing to have Nolly mix a DT album :metal
Anyway, back to Haken, if they just started recording drums, should we expect Haken 5 for the end of the year? I seriously cannot wait for more Haken music.
The original plan was either end of this year, beginning of next. Considering along with Cruise to the Edge the festival leaked that there will be a South American tour leading up to the cruise, I'd expect they plan to have it out before then. As December is the absolute worst month to release anything music related I'd guess either November or January.
I want to have it earlier, but wish they don't rush things up in order to have it released before the tour. Anyway, they always deliver amazing stuff, so I'm excited :D
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No band in existence has given me a debut 4 as strong as Haken has. POS is a close second.
I really hope they keep up the run of amazing material.
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No band in existence has given me a debut 4 as strong as Haken has. POS is a close second.
I really hope they keep up the run of amazing material.
Queensryche would like a word with you.
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No band in existence has given me a debut 4 as strong as Haken has. POS is a close second.
I really hope they keep up the run of amazing material.
Queensryche would like a word with you.
So would Coheed and Cambria...
But yea, Haken rule :tup
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No band in existence has given me a debut 4 as strong as Haken has. POS is a close second.
I really hope they keep up the run of amazing material.
Queensryche would like a word with you.
So would Coheed and Cambria...
But yea, Haken rule :tup
Add Agalloch, The Dear Hunter and Diablo Swing Orchestra to that list imo. And they only have three albums, but iamthemorning and Ne Obliviscaris would too...
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No band in existence has given me a debut 4 as strong as Haken has. POS is a close second.
I really hope they keep up the run of amazing material.
Queensryche would like a word with you.
Uhhhh.....no. Not even close. The Warning is very good, but kinda disappointing in a way. I thought the EP was so amazing when it first came out, that I went and bought The Warning as soon as it came out....and other than a couple of highlights, I didn't much care for it at first. To the point that I didn't even buy Rage when it came out. A few months later, my cousin had it on cassette and didn't like it, so he let me have it. I hated WitS at first, but the rest of the album grabbed me and turned me into a huge fanboy....and then I revisited The Warning, and liked it more than on my first listen, but it's still a bit like WDADU....strong material killed by a poor production. If you're going with The Warning - Empire, I still have the same problem with Warning, and then add the fact that Empire is just too glossy for me....and JCW and ARNWY should be forever deleted from the QR catalog. I'd rather listen to the entirety of Dedicated to Chaos than ever hear those songs again.
TLDR version....NO
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No band in existence has given me a debut 4 as strong as Haken has. POS is a close second.
I really hope they keep up the run of amazing material.
Queensryche would like a word with you.
So would Coheed and Cambria...
But yea, Haken rule :tup
C&C is excellent for the first three. I never cared for NWFT.
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Led Zeppelin, Van Halen, Camel, Queen, the Flower Kings and Dream Theater would all like a word with all of those bands.
Also, while I still love the title track and Deathless, I think Visions is clearly the least best of the four Haken albums thus far. I find that I listen to the first album and The Mountain by far the most.
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I honestly have a tough time choosing. The Mountain is very personal album for me, so I imagine that will always be #1, but it's a 3-way tie for 2nd.
Visions to me is lyrically their worst, but possibly musically their strongest. The trifecta of Mind's Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter just blows my mind.
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I made no bones about the fact that Ross Jennings' voice annoyed the hell out of me for a long time, but I finally got used to it and came around to it. However, he still has a certain tone that he uses on occasion that I wince at a little, and he uses it a lot on Falling Back to Earth, which is certainly one of their better songs, but I find that I never listen to that song anymore because of his voice in it. Between the four albums and the EP, there are probably about 20 songs I would say I listen to way more than all of the others, and Falling Back to Earth is not one of them.
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No band in existence has given me a debut 4 as strong as Haken has. POS is a close second.
I really hope they keep up the run of amazing material.
Queensryche would like a word with you.
So would Coheed and Cambria...
But yea, Haken rule :tup
C&C is excellent for the first three. I never cared for NWFT.
I know that's a fairly common view and a lot of Coheed fans don't rate it that high but I'm still always like :omg: :omg: :omg: it's one of my top 10 albums of all time, it's fucking killer!
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Judging from what I've read and heard, I must be the ONLY person in the ENTIRE universe who really liked Ross Jenning's voice from the get go. It was one of the selling points of the band for me, especially the second part of Nocturnal Conspiracy and that epic falsetto "meeeheehee" in Falling Back to Earth. The only thing I don't really like about his singing was his growls in Aquarius, but those were really doctored up in the studio from what I heard so idk.
Also, as far as album rankings go: The Mountain > Affinity > Restoration > Visions > Aquarius. Only songs I really find myself going back to on Aquarius are Streams (which imo should be split into two songs, because the first half is one of my favorite things ever and the second half is eh) and Celestial Elixir and sometimes Point of No Return. Almost everything else I only listen to if I'm going through the whole album.
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No band in existence has given me a debut 4 as strong as Haken has. POS is a close second.
I really hope they keep up the run of amazing material.
Queensryche would like a word with you.
So would Coheed and Cambria...
But yea, Haken rule :tup
C&C is excellent for the first three. I never cared for NWFT.
I know that's a fairly common view and a lot of Coheed fans don't rate it that high but I'm still always like :omg: :omg: :omg: it's one of my top 10 albums of all time, it's fucking killer!
Losing Josh on the drums was the killer of that album. I’ve always been an “interesting rhythm” kind of guy, and Josh's drum parts on FFTTEOM was what made that album so amazing. It was the key element that elevated them above a standard straight up metal band. The drum parts on NWFT were generic, and it just made the whole album sound like generic rock to me. It’s OK....but such a big letdown. The Afterman albums are freakin incredible though. They really need Josh or the whole thing just doesn’t work.
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Judging from what I've read and heard, I must be the ONLY person in the ENTIRE universe who really liked Ross Jenning's voice from the get go. It was one of the selling points of the band for me, especially the second part of Nocturnal Conspiracy and that epic falsetto "meeeheehee" in Falling Back to Earth. The only thing I don't really like about his singing was his growls in Aquarius, but those were really doctored up in the studio from what I heard so idk.
Also, as far as album rankings go: The Mountain > Affinity > Restoration > Visions > Aquarius. Only songs I really find myself going back to on Aquarius are Streams (which imo should be split into two songs, because the first half is one of my favorite things ever and the second half is eh) and Celestial Elixir and sometimes Point of No Return. Almost everything else I only listen to if I'm going through the whole album.
Count me in as someone who loved the vocals from the get go. CK was my first song, and I was in love immediately.
I know I’m going all fanboy on this band, but they are just so amazing to me. It feels a lot like when I first discovered Rush, and later Dream Theater. I literally play all 4 albums (and the EP) constantly in rotation. There’s not a single note I don’t adore. I even play Into The 5th Demention (the original demo) all the time. I LOVE IT.
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I also loved Ross’ vocals frim the first time I heard them. Like with Ninjabait, it was a major selling point for me.
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I also liked Ross's vocals since the beginning, although I understand that he has a very unique voice that not everyone will like. I actually thought his vocals were a bit weaker and cleaner sounding on Affinity than say on Visions or the Mountain though, not sure if it's because of production or the vocal lines themselves or he just decided to stay away from straining his voice too much. I haven't heard him do a really aggressive vocal part like on Drowning in the Flood since that album pretty much. Avoiding strain is a good idea though, especially live.
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Fritzinger review of the upcoming release:
https://lotsofmuzic.weebly.com/home/haken-l-1ve-review-by-friedrich-stenzel
:metal
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Has anyone hadd problems with the link? Diego Tejeida says he has problems with it.
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Yeah, it doesn't work for me either.
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Yeah, it doesn't work for me either.
Cam you try accessing from here:
https://lotsofmuzic.weebly.com
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Works fine for me. Great review, btw :tup
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Works fine for me. Great review, btw :tup
Thanks gzarruk :)
The link works perfectly for me too! Might this have anything to do with in which country you are? (I have no idea about such things :huh: )
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Yeah, it doesn't work for me either.
Cam you try accessing from here:
https://lotsofmuzic.weebly.com
Still doesn't work :(
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Works for me.
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Works for me
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Works for me.
-Marc.
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Works for me.
-Marc.
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Works for me.
-Marc.
You're not Marc!
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Works for me.
-Marc.
You're not Marc!
Yea stop it with that
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Have you ever seen Marc and I in the same room at the same time?
Also..
I am so stoked for this release.
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https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=PMzgh_1j838
The Endless Knot (Live)
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Looks cool, although I noticed that the lighting was annoying at certain points. When the vocals first start, for like 1-2 seconds, the lighting is almost blinding/distracting to where you can't really see much. I noticed it at certain others spots as well.
Oh well, that will be one of the least best songs on the DVD, so I likely won't watch that song a lot. :P
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https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=PMzgh_1j838
The Endless Knot (Live)
Love the sound of this. Just pre-ordered the cd/dvd. The video isn't the greatest, but I already knew that was going to be the case so knowing so makes it not as much of an issue. Liked how the camera guy was practically in the pit for the dance part.
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Still no footage of Ray, though :lol
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So, when will this be released officially? I pre-ordered it, but I can’t wait to see myself.
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So, when will this be released officially? I pre-ordered it, but I can’t wait to see myself.
June 22 (two weeks from today).
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My L-1VE preorder shipped today :metal
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As we're in the home stretch, here is my most favorite moment from DVD 2. :D
(https://www.wpapu.com/images/Haken37.jpg)
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I can't believe no one has posted the most amazing unboxing video in the history of filmed footage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iU37zI5oi3Y
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Amazon confirmed I should get my pre-order on release day :metal Actually forgot that was this week, but really looking forward to the DVD and the bonus DVD more importantly for that progpower footage.
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I can't believe no one has posted the most amazing unboxing video in the history of filmed footage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iU37zI5oi3Y
Glad to see the unboxer's finger has healed since he/she wore a big band-aid last week in the Fates Warning unboxing video!
(Sorry, I notice things like that, lol.) :P
-
Just got done editing an interview with Ray. Pushing hard to get everything finished up to have it out tomorrow. Some great nuggets, including when we can expect album #5.
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I can't believe no one has posted the most amazing unboxing video in the history of filmed footage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iU37zI5oi3Y
yeah, that was astonishing
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Just got done editing an interview with Ray. Pushing hard to get everything finished up to have it out tomorrow. Some great nuggets, including when we can expect album #5.
He had to sit through an interview with you? There really is no #JusticeForRay
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Just got done editing an interview with Ray. Pushing hard to get everything finished up to have it out tomorrow. Some great nuggets, including when we can expect album #5.
Nice, would love to see them hit the ground running with a new album and world tour. Continue to build on their success from Affinity and its touring.
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Just got done editing an interview with Ray. Pushing hard to get everything finished up to have it out tomorrow. Some great nuggets, including when we can expect album #5.
He had to sit through an interview with you? There really is no #JusticeForRay
:millahhhh
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Here is the interview with Ray, enjoy!: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-raymond-hearne/
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Here is the interview with Ray, enjoy!: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-raymond-hearne/
Listening now Nick.
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I know very well about Ray's vegan meals thanks to Nick!
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I know very well about Ray's vegan meals thanks to Nick!
Yeah Ray has been posting hilarious instagram stories about baking vegan cakes for his mum :lol
I had the pleasure to hang out with the guy once, he is a hilarious and ver humble dude.
-
Thanks to Nick we are with Ray, Rich and Joey Frevola from Kyros. Oh and Nick :lol at a vegan restaurant. The food was dynamite!
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/750x400q90/921/pxA27F.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/f/plpxA27Fj)
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Thanks to Nick we are with Ray, Rich and Joey Frevola from Kyros. Oh and Nick :lol at a vegan restaurant. The food was dynamite!
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/750x400q90/921/pxA27F.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/f/plpxA27Fj)
Dude, if that place was near me I'd eat Vegan regularly, it was insanely good.
-
Vegan food, when done right, is delicious.
(Disclaimer: one of my best friends part owner of a restaurant specializing in vegan dishes)
-
I know very well about Ray's vegan meals thanks to Nick!
Yeah Ray has been posting hilarious instagram stories about baking vegan cakes for his mum :lol
Ray's parents are absolutely lovely.
-
Nick, I could eat that every day it was that good.
I can't wait to pick up the CD tomorrow!
-
L-1ve is now out basically everywhere!
In additional to the interview with Ray already posted we also talked about the new live set (and upcoming set from Devin Townsend) on our latest discussion podcast here: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/features/talking-perspectives-episode-eight/
-
So the main takeaway from that is that the new studio album could well be here before the year is out. That's exciting news indeed!
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Nothing new album related......
But....I was listening to Haken and for some reason I thought about making my own dream setlist...This is what it became.
(I don't own Aquarius or else there'd be plenty of them. Still need to acquire and listen to that album...)
The Path
Earthrise
Portals
Pareidolia
Bound By Gravity
Visions
-------
Shapeshifter
The Endless Knot
Edit: I just realized Shapeshifter needs to be after Portals. Duh...
Edit 2: It actually does work both ways. I just can't choose...
-
With the exception of Initiate, the set list on that last tour was pretty stellar. I am not always fond of medleys, but the one they did for the first album was very well done, we got Visions in full, and tons of stuff from the last two albums.
-
I’m also not a big fan of medleys, but I also think they did a great job on aquamedley. And it was a great selection of songs, no doubt, although if L-1VE had insomnia, mind’s eye, portals and shapeshifter instead of visions I would be even happier 😉
It seems Nolly from Periphery is mixing the new album:
https://www.loudersound.com/news/haken-plan-to-release-new-studio-album-later-this-year
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Over time, I find that, while I like the whole album, the only songs I got out of way to listen from Visions are the title track and Deathless (two of my favorite songs by the band in general). Meanwhile, I listen to most or all of the other three albums.
-
I got my CD/DVD yesterday but didn't have any time to watch, I plan on doing that today :metal
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I was pretty happy with the medley. It was my first time seeing them (and probably the first time many people in the states have seen them) and I wanted a setlist that covered as much ground as possible. Condensing the Aquarius stuff into one medley that managed to hit most of the highlights was a nice way to make that happen IMO.
-
I’m also not a big fan of medleys, but I also think they did a great job on aquamedley. And it was a great selection of songs, no doubt, although if L-1VE had insomnia, mind’s eye, portals and shapeshifter instead of visions I would be even happier 😉
It seems Nolly from Periphery is mixing the new album:
https://www.loudersound.com/news/haken-plan-to-release-new-studio-album-later-this-year
FWIW that article is just referencing the interview I already posted here! :p
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Yes, it’s true!
I didn’t heard the original interview, is it correct the information of Nolly mixing the new album?
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So I watched the DVDs last night and, I'm not sure if it's the tv I played it through or not, but was it just me or were the vocals a bit hard to hear in some songs/sections? They seemed buried in the mix to me at times, and I couldn't quite make out his words, let alone hear them at all in some moments. The instruments all sounded nice and crisp, but the vocals were drowned out and it was kind of a downer. Maybe I need to watch them on a different tv or something, but I'd like to hear what others say about it first before I think I'm going crazy...
Over-all, though, it's an amazing concert, and a great set list! What a superb first live album for the band. I hope they continue releasing live albums from here on out if they're this good or better!
-Marc.
-
The instruments all sounded nice and crisp, but the vocals were drowned out and it was kind of a downer.
Drowned in a flood? :biggrin:
-
So I watched the DVDs last night and, I'm not sure if it's the tv I played it through or not, but was it just me or were the vocals a bit hard to hear in some songs/sections? They seemed buried in the mix to me at times, and I couldn't quite make out his words, let alone hear them at all in some moments. The instruments all sounded nice and crisp, but the vocals were drowned out and it was kind of a downer. Maybe I need to watch them on a different tv or something, but I'd like to hear what others say about it first before I think I'm going crazy...
Over-all, though, it's an amazing concert, and a great set list! What a superb first live album for the band. I hope they continue releasing live albums from here on out if they're this good or better!
-Marc.
It was very weird for me, I had the same feeling at the beginning playing those tunes on iTunes (just over a portable Bose speaker). When I watched the promo video file with headphones, his voice was perfectly hearable... I later re-listened on iTunes/Bose and Ross' voice was audible way better..
I can't explain that at all :rollin
-
So I watched the DVDs last night and, I'm not sure if it's the tv I played it through or not, but was it just me or were the vocals a bit hard to hear in some songs/sections? They seemed buried in the mix to me at times, and I couldn't quite make out his words, let alone hear them at all in some moments. The instruments all sounded nice and crisp, but the vocals were drowned out and it was kind of a downer. Maybe I need to watch them on a different tv or something, but I'd like to hear what others say about it first before I think I'm going crazy...
Over-all, though, it's an amazing concert, and a great set list! What a superb first live album for the band. I hope they continue releasing live albums from here on out if they're this good or better!
-Marc.
It was very weird for me, I had the same feeling at the beginning playing those tunes on iTunes (just over a portable Bose speaker). When I watched the promo video file with headphones, his voice was perfectly hearable... I later re-listened on iTunes/Bose and Ross' voice was audible way better..
I can't explain that at all :rollin
Very odd, indeed. I'll have to listen to the CDs at some point soon and see if they're any better.
Also, any chance we'll ever get the ProgPower tracks as a digital download from the band at some point? I'd love to add them to the live album proper as a sort of "bonus tracks" set! I suppose I could try and rip the audio from the DVD, but that's such a pain. I'd rather throw a couple bucks to the band directly for downloads of those four songs, which total nearly 48 minutes! That's practically a live album in itself! A shame they couldn't have been on the CDs themselves since the live album is only 114 minutes - with some clever editing, all the songs could have fit onto 2 CDs...ah well.
-Marc.
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I ripped my CDs into iTunes and then onto my iPod and I didn't notice any issue with the vocals.
-
I watched most of the DVD and bonus DVD over the weekend. I wouldn't say there was an issue with the vocals, but there were a few spots I feel like I agree that the vocals got muddied in the mix, but not to the point of annoyance, just that it was noticeable a few times.
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I’m also not a big fan of medleys, but I also think they did a great job on aquamedley. And it was a great selection of songs, no doubt, although if L-1VE had insomnia, mind’s eye, portals and shapeshifter instead of visions I would be even happier 😉
It seems Nolly from Periphery is mixing the new album:
https://www.loudersound.com/news/haken-plan-to-release-new-studio-album-later-this-year
That's good for Haken. Nolly's mixes are fantastic!
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I’m also not a big fan of medleys, but I also think they did a great job on aquamedley. And it was a great selection of songs, no doubt, although if L-1VE had insomnia, mind’s eye, portals and shapeshifter instead of visions I would be even happier 😉
It seems Nolly from Periphery is mixing the new album:
https://www.loudersound.com/news/haken-plan-to-release-new-studio-album-later-this-year
That's good for Haken. Nolly's mixes are fantastic!
Agree :metal
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Okay, I give in. I've been lowkey listening to Haken on and off since The Mountain, but I never caved in and became a big fan the same way most of DTF did. Until now. I embrace Haken in all of their glorious prog, humor, cheese, heaviness, complexity and neon sunglasses. :lol
Just ordered L-1VE on Amazon, bought it again on iTunes, along with The Mountain and Restoration. Should be a good enough start for now, since L-1VE has most of Affinity on it already and I'm not as familiar with Aquarius and Visions as I am the two more recent albums.
Can't wait to hear this heavier-sounding, Nolly-produced new studio album coming later in the year! :hefdaddy :metal
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Love the new live album and Ross is kicking ass! They all are!! :tup
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I've watched it twice now (it arrived yesterday), and this release has definitely taken them up a few more spots on my list of favourite bands ever.
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I discovered that all of the audio was posted on the official Haken YouTube page so I gave it a listen. It sounds really, really good! Still excited for the DVD to come in the mail and watch it though.
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Still need to get the DVD. Wow, the audio is really good on this live album. Love it. :hefdaddy
Edit: Wish they could've fit in Falling Back to Earth. :( Still...an awesome live album.
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It's goofy that neither Falling Back to Earth nor Pareidolia are part of the main concert, instead relegated to being on the additional DVD as bonus footage, but the set list is still mostly really good. I got this the other night and haven't had a chance to watch all of it yet, but I did check out 1985, the Aquarius medley and Visions. Looked good to me, although the camera barely showing the guitarist playing that incredible solo about 14 minutes into Visions was a major epic fail.
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I feel like the live release doesn't really do justice to the live Haken experience. Wish the crowd was mixed more since that's (at least me) appreciates the energy in a Haken live show. Been enjoying the FW live album more...
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Been listening to Aquarius a lot lately. Such a great album! :metal
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Oh yes, fantastic :metal
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Finally watched the live DVD from start to finish last night at a friend's house. Pretty great. :metal
I am not sure who Raymond Hearne pissed off to where he got so little up-close screen time, but considering the small budget they had for this, they did mostly a good job. Hopefully, their popularity will surge and they will be able to upgrade the look and quality for the next DVD shoot a few albums down the line or whenever. Despite those flaws, this is a must-have for any current fan. :coolio
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As always I'm late to the party. Had heard of them but for whatever lame reason I never gave them a go. Just gave them a first listen. SERIOUSLY impressed!!! Listening to "Visions" Remastered.
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If you think Vision is really good (it is!), wait till you hear the other albums.
And I have to say I am envious of those who "get" Haken right away, as it took me a while. :facepalm:
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If you think Vision is really good (it is!), wait till you hear the other albums.
And I have to say I am envious of those who "get" Haken right away, as it took me a while. :facepalm:
I had heard so many folks say they were great and I have no clue why it took me so long to give them a listen. I just started the "Streaming" thing yesterday. It got me fired up to just start really trying to check out some other bands. But yeah.... these guys have some serious talent! Can't wait to start absorbing the discography!
-
THE. FREAKIN. MOUNTAIN.
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I haven't listened to Haken in a while, but Aquarius was my favorite with The Mountain being close behind.
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The Mountain would be my favourite, but Affinity is very close on 2nd. Aquarius would be 3 and Visions 4. They're all great though.
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Affinity gets slightly dinged for me because it has the only song of any of their studio albums that I flat-out do not like (Initiate), but the rest is just so good. 1985 is a top 5 Haken tune, and songs like Red Giant, Bounded by Gravity and Lapse are great songs that seem to rarely get mentioned. Plus, the sound of the CD is killer.
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I didn't like Initiate for the longest time. But once I saw how it musically meshed with the rest of the albums and how the repeating themes made the whole thing tie together, I loved it for what it was.
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I agree that Initiate is weaker than the rest, and I actually find their straight-ahead prog-metal songs to be their weakest overall (Darkest Light, In Memoriam, Initate, The Mind's Eye).
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The Mind's Eye doesn't stand out, but I find it to be a good, enjoyable song.
I agree that Darkest Light is weak.
In Memoriam is great.
I would describe Earthrise and Lapse as straight-ahead songs as well, and both of those kick ass.
-
In Memoriam is in my Top 5 Haken songs.
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I love The Mind's Eye....but I suppose that's mostly because I can never just hear that song by itself. It's the whole Mind's Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter Suite that I adore.....that payoff at the end of Shapeshifter is where the whole thing really hits home. So I can't hear them individually in my head any more.
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I love The Mind's Eye....but I suppose that's mostly because I can never just hear that song by itself. It's the whole Mind's Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter Suite that I adore.....that payoff at the end of Shapeshifter is where the whole thing really hits home. So I can't hear them individually in my head any more.
I dont care what anyone says, but Visions is my favorite Haken album. Love that run of songs.
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As always I'm late to the party. Had heard of them but for whatever lame reason I never gave them a go. Just gave them a first listen. SERIOUSLY impressed!!! Listening to "Visions" Remastered.
I only got into them a few months ago, myself. Aquarius and The Mountain are both fantastic albums. I have nothing against Visions, but if you're really into that those two oughtta knock you on your ass. And don't forget the two EPs.
-
Just want to drop a comment about how great Ross is. The performance of As Death Embraces on L-1VE is probably my favourite Ross performance ever. It's SOO good and even better than on the album. A true testament to what a great singer he is.
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Thanks for all the feedback guys. I can tell this is gonna be a fun journey absorbing their work. Live DVD/CD is on the way. I figure an album a month to digest them all.
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Thanks for all the feedback guys. I can tell this is gonna be a fun journey absorbing their work. Live DVD/CD is on the way. I figure an album a month to digest them all.
Don't forget to check their Restoration EP as well :metal
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I love The Mind's Eye....but I suppose that's mostly because I can never just hear that song by itself. It's the whole Mind's Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter Suite that I adore.....that payoff at the end of Shapeshifter is where the whole thing really hits home. So I can't hear them individually in my head any more.
I dont care what anyone says, but Visions is my favorite Haken album. Love that run of songs.
It's not quite my favourite, but I adore it. The main reason is the title track, it's easily their best 'epic', as far as I'm concerned.
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It's not quite my favourite, but I adore it. The main reason is the title track, it's easily their best 'epic', as far as I'm concerned.
But Visions is the worst track on the album though :justjen
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It's not quite my favourite, but I adore it. The main reason is the title track, it's easily their best 'epic', as far as I'm concerned.
But Visions is the worst track on the album though :justjen
These might both be true
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I guess I'm in some weird minority regarding "Visions" (the song and album), because I *love* that epic, and I think part of the reason is because I really love the video that Marc Papeghin made for "Visions" - it really sold the song on me and it's become one of my favorite epics by any band in the last 10 years! That ending gets me every single time!
-Marc.
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Yeah the actual song Visions is awesome, and one of their best songs ever.
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I go back and forth between what I think their best song is: Visions or Celestial Elixir. The latter has their best moments ever (that godly instrumental section in the middle), but Visions seems to be more consistent and just gets better and better as the song moves along. Tough call.
-
In my opinion, the great thing about Celestial Elixir is that it’s not a suite made of different parts, but actually a very slowly built up SONG.
My favorite Haken song still might be The Archtect though.
-
Celestial Elixir was the song that introduced me to Haken, so it has a special place in my heart, but I think Visions is better. Their best song, though? That might be Crystallised, imo.
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Where is the love for Crystallized tho? Absolutely my favourite epic from Haken.
-
Crystallized is really good, but doesn't have the wow factor that both Visions and Celestial Elixir have; I would say the same thing about The Architect, except for the 1-minute intro, which is totally bad ass. Neither Crystallized nor The Architect would make my Haken top 10, even if I like both a lot.
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Crystalized is my favorite. Sorry. I've seen all 3 songs live and it was the best seeing it played live.
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"LOOK AT ME! I HAVE SEEN EVERY CONCERT EVER!!"
:biggrin:
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*Beats chest* :lol
I'm just speaking from experience you plebeian. :lol :lol :lol
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Heard Crystallized for the first time. My god its pretty good.
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Heard Crystallized for the first time. My god its pretty good.
By far my favorite epic from them. One of the most cohesive epics I’ve ever heard. It’s just a masterpiece.
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See Kev! :lol
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All I see are wrong opinions. :P
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:lol
I love that the love is spread out. It means their music transcends.
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For sure. Should be interesting to see if they do another long one on the next album...
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I just love that they hint at a heavy album. When DT was at their prime, we had to guess where they were going stylistically. Haken feels that way now.
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Heard Crystallized for the first time. My god its pretty good.
By far my favorite epic from them. One of the most cohesive epics I’ve ever heard. It’s just a masterpiece.
I agree, it's masterfully composed, the only thing that bothers me A LITTLE sometimes is that the final melody/motive doesn't appear anywhere else in the song. But I have already pretty much gotten over that.
I guess I'm just such a prog nerd that I'm used to all that this-story-ends-where-it-began stuff.
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Funny how tastes differ. Crystallized always felt more disjointed than CE and Visions to me.
+1 on CE being amazing by how cohesive it is.
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Crystalized is my favorite. Sorry. I've seen all 3 songs live and it was the best seeing it played live.
"LOOK AT ME! I HAVE SEEN EVERY CONCERT EVER!!"
:biggrin:
Pfft, both plebs. :p
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Crystalized is my favorite. Sorry. I've seen all 3 songs live and it was the best seeing it played live.
"LOOK AT ME! I HAVE SEEN EVERY CONCERT EVER!!"
:biggrin:
Pfft, both plebs. :p
Says the total Haken noob. :P
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Rich wins.
For Haken.
I'm up to 243 concerts. That's counting festivals as 1 show. Come at me bros.
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Crystallised is easily their worst epic and Celestial Elixir is their best song.
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Rich wins.
For Haken.
I'm up to 243 concerts. That's counting festivals as 1 show. Come at me bros.
I'm making my way
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Rich wins.
For Haken.
I'm up to 243 concerts. That's counting festivals as 1 show. Come at me bros.
I'm making my way
And documenting. You're nuts! :lol
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Rich wins.
For Haken.
Well, Nick has overtaken me in terms of number of performances (though sometimes it's been multiple performances at the same festival/cruise, so eh). But I'll always be the longest-serving fan and been to gigs for the longest period on here (and indeed anywhere, as I went to their first ever gig). :P
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Crystallised is easily their worst epic
this guy gets it
-
Celestial Elixir wins.
Cyrstallised is close though.
Fight me.
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Heard Crystallized for the first time. My god its pretty good.
By far my favorite epic from them. One of the most cohesive epics I’ve ever heard. It’s just a masterpiece.
I agree, it's masterfully composed, the only thing that bothers me A LITTLE sometimes is that the final melody/motive doesn't appear anywhere else in the song. But I have already pretty much gotten over that.
I guess I'm just such a prog nerd that I'm used to all that this-story-ends-where-it-began stuff.
I wish that ending guitar would've gone a bit longer its a nice melody that just suddenly ends. It needed a couple more bars.
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YES
(https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/36910939_10156603166899744_5494548964533338112_n.png?_nc_cat=0&oh=1d460ff2536113b27ee9868a16db508e&oe=5BCEC906)
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Ohhhh sweet!! Definitely not missing this one. I will have to consider trying to get into Leprous again too. Didn't get too far last time, but that was probably 3-4 years ago so maybe my tastes have changed enough.
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Nice, did not expect another tour of the US so soon, but happily surprised!
I expect to be at the NYC show :metal
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Looks like a Denver trip for me. this lineup is too good not to miss. Bent Knee are really good, followed by Leprous whom are amazing as well, and Haken whom I have yet to see.
-
Austin. SO ESSITE
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Nice!! A Monday night concert will be rough, but I’ll tough it out.
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fucking hell, I want to go to that one too
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AWE YEAH. On my wife's birthday in Boston. She already said, "That's my present, right"?
Good girl.
-
Great news on the tour. I never thought they would come to Nashville and the Exit/In. Of course I am cautiously optimistic after DT was schedule for Nashville and someone made an error in the stage footprint needed and they had to cancel.
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AWE YEAH. On my wife's birthday in Boston. She already said, "That's my present, right"?
Good girl.
:lol you've got a good one indeed
-
Might have to hit up the Pittsburgh date this time around.
-
Too bad it's US only. I just happened to discover Bent Knee last week, this would have been a dream lineup for me.
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Heard Crystallized for the first time. My god its pretty good.
By far my favorite epic from them. One of the most cohesive epics I’ve ever heard. It’s just a masterpiece.
I agree, it's masterfully composed, the only thing that bothers me A LITTLE sometimes is that the final melody/motive doesn't appear anywhere else in the song. But I have already pretty much gotten over that.
I guess I'm just such a prog nerd that I'm used to all that this-story-ends-where-it-began stuff.
I think the ending totally fits, though. You get the build-up of the "Someone's calling me..." section, which was heard earlier in the song several times, and the transition to both the guitar lead and final vocal section is very smooth. Sure, the "story ends where it began" style of epic writing really works sometimes, as perfected by Neal Morse, but the long epics don't always have to end that way, Mr. Prog Nerd. :P :biggrin:
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I wish I would have remembered Bent Knee sooner....I just went to check out Leak Water, and realized that I went NUTS for that song when it came out, but then.....life happened....and I just forgot all about it.
And now I discover that they were JUST at a local club June 30th, and I totally would have gone if I had remembered. But at least I’ll get to see them open for Haken now.
Wish it wasn’t on a Tuesday.
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The color scheme of the poster could be the color scheme of the next album.
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Haven't been keeping up with their recent activity, is it likely that the album will be out before this tour?
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Haven't been keeping up with their recent activity, is it likely that the album will be out before this tour?
Not sure of the release date, but
https://www.loudersound.com/news/haken-finish-album-no5-and-announce-co-headline-tour-with-leprous (https://www.loudersound.com/news/haken-finish-album-no5-and-announce-co-headline-tour-with-leprous)
album is finished and they will be playing new songs on the tour
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I can't remember who said it, but one of the band definitely said they want it released before this year is out. Which is very likely now considering it's finished and it's only mid-July. I'm going for possibly a November/December release. It often takes like 3 months or so from finishing the album to actually releasing it into the wild.
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I can't remember who said it, but one of the band definitely said they want it released before this year is out. Which is very likely now considering it's finished and it's only mid-July. I'm going for possibly a November/December release. It often takes like 3 months or so from finishing the album to actually releasing it into the wild.
Backing up your post, that was Nick who posted the interview with Ray Hearne a month ago:
Here is the interview with Ray, enjoy!: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-raymond-hearne/
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Nice!! A Monday night concert will be rough, but I’ll tough it out.
I'll be there with ya :tup
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Nice!! A Monday night concert will be rough, but I’ll tough it out.
I'll be there with ya :tup
:coolio :hat
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2 of my favorite bands on my Birthday! Don’t think I can miss that.
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VIP tickets ordered for the Orlando show. Can't wait!
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Ticket bought for NYC :metal
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Kinda bummed that the St. Louis show is all general admission this time (no seats, ugh), but we still got our tickets. :metal
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So mainly dictated by the calendar and limited days off this time around it's looking like Philly, NYC, Boston, and Chicago for me most likely.
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Damn....it's the weekend we're flying to Mex City for the Rams game. :'( Not a real big fan of ubering 40 miles each way either. Pomona?? :tdwn
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So mainly dictated by the calendar and limited days off this time around it's looking like Philly, NYC, Boston, and Chicago for me most likely.
Hmmm, Chicago...
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I'll be at the Chicago show as usual!
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I've never been to a concert with reserved seating, but I chose the standard GA ticket just because it looks like it's closer to the stage. Hopefully I won't regret not being able to sit. :lol
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Kinda bummed that the St. Louis show is all general admission this time (no seats, ugh), but we still got our tickets. :metal
Yes, same here in Nashville. Standing is going to be a challenge for me, but this may be my only chance to see Haken. Also, kind of a bummer to go alone, but nobody I know has ever heard of Haken and is not into progressive rock. I listened to some Leprous, but so far the music is not clicking for me, but will try some more.
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I am going to the Haken show in Nashville and this will be my first show in a club, small crowd setting. For those that have attended these types of shows, do the bands normally hang around after the show and speak with the concert goers? There is no meet and greet at the Nashville show.
By the way, I have been listening to some Leprous and the music did not click at first, but I really like Bilateral. I listened to Malina last night and this one may take few listens, but the song 'Weight of Disaster' is really good.
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I am going to the Haken show in Nashville and this will be my first show in a club, small crowd setting. For those that have attended these types of shows, do the bands normally hang around after the show and speak with the concert goers? There is no meet and greet at the Nashville show.
When I saw them in NYC last year, after the show Charlie and Connor were both hanging out near the stage talking to fans and taking picutres. I don't recall seeing any of the other guys doing the same, but maybe they were. I can only speak to my own experience, I shook both guys hands, but have no idea if that's normal or not for them.
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I am going to the Haken show in Nashville and this will be my first show in a club, small crowd setting. For those that have attended these types of shows, do the bands normally hang around after the show and speak with the concert goers? There is no meet and greet at the Nashville show.
By the way, I have been listening to some Leprous and the music did not click at first, but I really like Bilateral. I listened to Malina last night and this one may take few listens, but the song 'Weight of Disaster' is really good.
Are you sure there is no M&G? I'm pretty sure the VIP package is available on every show in America. And typically some, if not all the guys will talk to people after the show.
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Nick, you are correct, there is a M&G package separate from the ticket purchase at the venue.
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Haken guys are shooting new music video today. Wonder how long it will take to release the single/music video.. ::)
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For what song? :justjen
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For what song? :justjen
Cockroach King Pt. 2, surely.
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For what song? :justjen
Cockroach King Pt. 2, surely.
Cockroach King Pt. 2: Return of Cockroach Jafar's New Groove (electric boogaloo)
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Bought my ticket and VIP upgrade for Seattle last night.
Still ticked that it’s on a Tuesday, but I’ll be there.
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Any chance of another small Chicago meetup before the show?
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I'll be flying into Chicago Saturday morning for the show, I foresee much beer in mine and Splent's future.
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For what song? :justjen
Cockroach King Pt. 2, surely.
Nah, I think it's obvious that they're taking up the huge task of writing Despacito 2
Godspeed, Haken, Godspeed.
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Don’t you mean...
Godspeed You! Black Cockroach
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https://hakenmusic.com/blog/post/haken-vector-fifth-studio-album
(https://scontent-dfw5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/38209654_10156662730439744_5375867688021131264_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=0136effad3a1b04febb9d9bc304af8ab&oe=5BD3DDA5)
HAKEN, one of progressive music’s most exciting bands, have announced details of their much-anticipated fifth studio album titled ‘Vector’, due for release on the 26th October 2018.
Track listing
1. Clear
2. The Good Doctor
3. Puzzle Box
4. Veil
5. Nil By Mouth
6. Host
7. A Cell Divides
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0j8aH2KjHU
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:metal
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Cool artwork, looking forward to hearing a track. Hopefully this record sits a little better with me than Affinity (which was kinda hit or miss).
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:letam: :2metal: :metal
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Niiice :metal
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Waiting begins! :corn :corn :corn :corn
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:metal
So awesome.....
Also, I can't see the panda bear towards the bottom of the image.
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:metal
Heavier direction sounds nice.
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Nice, and a week before I see them so should be enough time to dig into the new album to see some of it live :metal
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Some good info in the link......in case you didn't want to click it for whatever reason...
[/Since their inception in 2007, Haken have shown over four previous studio albums, one EP and a live release that they never stand still, merely satisfied to rely on past triumphs. Rather, Haken always look for ways to challenge themselves as musicians and artists, and also to keep the listeners on their collective toes.
Vocalist Ross Jennings laughs
"We don't like to make simple music. We always aim to defy expectations, and I believe we've surpassed what we aimed to achieve with our new album."
Their fifth studio record sees the band going in a heavier direction with the music.
Guitarist Charlie Griffiths explains
"We’ve always had a heavy influence, but it was obvious from the riffs that were naturally coming out of us early in the writing process that this would be a more metal album. These are some of the most riff driven songs we’ve ever written."
As is usual, Haken produced the album themselves, but for the first time they have enlisted Adam 'Nolly' Getgood during the recording and mixing stages. Formerly bassist with Periphery, in the last couple of years he has built a reputation as a fine producer.
Jennings insists
"We produced the album ourselves, as we always do. But we're fans of what Adam has done with Periphery, Sikth and Devin Townsend. He has a great reputation for the heavier end of our genre."
But if this album is musically heavy, then there's an underlying theme running through the seven songs which is certainly esoteric and fascinating.
Griffiths explains
"The scene is set with the track The Good Doctor, which was a really fun song. Musically it feels like a logical step from 'Affinity', but lyrically it’s a bit more theatrical and about as ‘rock opera’ as Haken has ever got. It’s about a Doctor with an intriguing, perhaps sinister interest in a particular patient. From there the story enters the point-of-view of the patient - who appears to be catatonic, but his mind is sparking with what could be memories, or delusions brought on by the treatment he’s receiving - we leave this up to the listeners to decide. Although we don’t want to give too much away, people who are familiar with our back catalogue will have fun discovering further clues we’ve planted throughout the album. And that's the challenge for the fans – to find out for themselves their own meaning for 'Vector' as an album."quote]
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Cool
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:metal
Cool artwork, looking forward to hearing a track. Hopefully this record sits a little better with me than Affinity (which was kinda hit or miss).
It's going to be very different.
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:metal
Cool artwork, looking forward to hearing a track. Hopefully this record sits a little better with me than Affinity (which was kinda hit or miss).
It's going to be very different.
Yeah, I just read that write up Destiny of Chaos posted, it sounds like it definitely will be. I like the idea of going a heavier direction and I really like that they got Nolly to engineer and mix. Like I said, I'm looking forward to hearing the first track.
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Given how they talk details about "The Good Doctor", this could be their first single. Sounds like it could be related to Visions.
Anyway, hyped to hear more from Haken.
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I'm 95% certain The Good Doctor will be the first single.
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I am 100% certain that I love the little teases you hand out regarding new Haken releases.
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I'm down. I enjoy The Mountain and Affinity, still not crazy about Ross's voice but that's some cool artwork. Another exciting 2018 release :)
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I'm 95% certain The Good Doctor will be the first single.
I am 100% certain that I love the little teases you hand out regarding new Haken releases.
I'm 300% certain that first single can't hit my ears soon enough.
I'm going to be having a heart attack every time my music email alert goes off from mid-September on.
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This is gonna be so awesome!!! Can’t wait for October.
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I am 100% certain that I love the little teases you hand out regarding new Haken releases.
:lol
I'm sure some people love them and others hate me for it, but whatevs I'm just going to keep doing it. :P
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:metal
Cool artwork, looking forward to hearing a track. Hopefully this record sits a little better with me than Affinity (which was kinda hit or miss).
It's going to be very different.
Yeah, I just read that write up Destiny of Chaos posted, it sounds like it definitely will be. I like the idea of going a heavier direction and I really like that they got Nolly to engineer and mix. Like I said, I'm looking forward to hearing the first track.
Heavier is good with me too. Not that I felt they weren't heavy enough, but I've got no issues with good heavy riffage as they are suggesting.
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:metal
Cool artwork, looking forward to hearing a track. Hopefully this record sits a little better with me than Affinity (which was kinda hit or miss).
It's going to be very different.
Have you heard it yet?
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A couple things we can pick out already. It was hinted in the article that Good Doctor is technically the first actual song, which means Clear is just an intro.
And from the contest, I deduce that the entire album will fit on 3 sides of a double album, meaning it might be a bit shorter....probably just under 60 min.
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Have you heard it yet?
:-X
A couple things we can pick out already. It was hinted in the article that Good Doctor is technically the first actual song, which means Clear is just an intro.
:-X
And from the contest, I deduce that the entire album will fit on 3 sides of a double album, meaning it might be a bit shorter....probably just under 60 min.
:-X
Although I would point out that 60 mins is the length of Affinity, so that wouldn't exactly make it "shorter".
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Have you heard it yet?
:-X
A couple things we can pick out already. It was hinted in the article that Good Doctor is technically the first actual song, which means Clear is just an intro.
:-X
And from the contest, I deduce that the entire album will fit on 3 sides of a double album, meaning it might be a bit shorter....probably just under 60 min.
:-X
Although I would point out that 60 mins is the length of Affinity, so that wouldn't exactly make it "shorter".
To be fair, I did say “just under”...I’m betting somewhere around 55ish min.
EDIT - Affinity was 61 1/2.
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A couple things we can pick out already. It was hinted in the article that Good Doctor is technically the first actual song, which means Clear is just an intro.
Exactly what I was thinking! It could be a short intro like affinity.exe or something like an overture, like Premonition. Anyway, I just can’t wait for The Good Doctor to be released soon :metal
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A couple things we can pick out already. It was hinted in the article that Good Doctor is technically the first actual song, which means Clear is just an intro.
Exactly what I was thinking! It could be a short intro like affinity.exe or something like an overture, like Premonition. Anyway, I just can’t wait for The Good Doctor to be released soon :metal
Just to caveat that I might be completely wrong about that. My assumption is just based on the fact that they explain it in the press release, plus all the little teases they've been posting on Facebook ("the prescription you've been waiting for", etc).
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Exciting news! This autumn's already tons better for albums I want than last year.
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Exciting news! This autumn's already tons better for albums I want than last year.
Agreed - I'm pretty hyped for this and the new Riverside, and on top of those, the possible release of the new Neal Morse Band album in the late fall as well will make for an exciting fall music slate!
-Marc.
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Whoa, that came out of nowhere!
I didn't like Affinity that much, but I'm looking forward to checking this one out.
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Whoa, that came out of nowhere!
No, it didn't.
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Whoa, that came out of nowhere!
No, it didn't.
Right? :lol
The band have been pretty transparent about regular updates regarding their next album, I think, and it was more or less revealed on here that their next album would come out this fall, so this was very expected. Revealing the release date TODAY might have been "out of nowhere", but the eventual release and target time-span were fairly well-known.
-Marc.
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Just shows how much I was paying attention. To me, it was all talk about the new live album, and then, "oh yeah, there will be a new studio album in a few months."
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Excellent...excellent.
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(https://i1377.photobucket.com/albums/ah58/jorge_pozo1/CFD9527B-FD37-4B33-AD9A-62DC504C3788_zpsji17ufku.png) (https://s1377.photobucket.com/user/jorge_pozo1/media/CFD9527B-FD37-4B33-AD9A-62DC504C3788_zpsji17ufku.png.html)
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:lol is he spoiling Haken with giving up that info? Not that it matters to me, wonder if it matters to the band though.
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Best instrumental since Opus Maximus? OM is awful :lol
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It's actually awesome. If there's been a better one released since then, I'd love to hear it
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Shocking that Portnoy would say that. :lol :lol
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It's actually awesome. If there's been a better one released since then, I'd love to hear it
Well the Incredibles 2 soundtrack was mostly instrumental sooooo
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Dang, another release to follow. Five of my favorites releasing albums this year. I don't really listen to that much metal, so this is quite extraordinary. Orphaned Land, Michael Romeo, this, Seventh Wonder and Myrath. Then DT next year. Hopefully I'll be able to listen to all of this, I should have become a dad before the DT album drops next year.
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Well, that's the last time MP gets an advance copy :lol
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Well, that's the last time MP gets an advance copy :lol
I challenged him on it on Twitter and he said he asked Charlie first. :lol
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Dang, another release to follow. Five of my favorites releasing albums this year. I don't really listen to that much metal, so this is quite extraordinary. Orphaned Land, Michael Romeo, this, Seventh Wonder and Myrath. Then DT next year. Hopefully I'll be able to listen to all of this, I should have become a dad before the DT album drops next year.
Hang on, wait, Myrath is dropping an album this year??
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Hang on, wait, Myrath is dropping an album this year??
I expect so. AFAIK recording was done months ago, not sure why it's not out yet. They just recorded a live show for DVD/blu-ray release, maybe they want to release that simultaneously.
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Rich, I need info on whether or not there will be any melodic/a cappella sections akin to Crystallised, or anything as atmospheric as Bound by Gravity! :D
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Rich, I need info on whether or not there will be any melodic/a cappella sections akin to Crystallised, or anything as atmospheric as Bound by Gravity! :D
There might be!
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Rich, I need info on whether or not there will be any melodic/a cappella sections akin to Crystallised, or anything as atmospheric as Bound by Gravity! :D
https://hakenmusic.com/blog/post/haken-vector-fifth-studio-album
Their fifth studio record sees the band going in a heavier direction with the music.
Guitarist Charlie Griffiths explains
"We’ve always had a heavy influence, but it was obvious from the riffs that were naturally coming out of us early in the writing process that this would be a more metal album. These are some of the most riff driven songs we’ve ever written."
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But Rich, its it riffy acapella? :lol
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Good that it's going in a heavier direction. I felt that Affinity was a little too disjointed in its sound, radically switching the mood almost every single track. Hopefully the increased heaviness will mean more consistency.
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Affinity was deep. It didn't really come across as "disjointed" to me, but I can kinda get what you're saying.
I tend to like albums more when they don't necessarily maintain a single sound all the way through. Using DT as an example, I really love Train of Thought for having a singular vision all the way through it, but I much prefer something like IAW which starts off super balls and chunk riff heavy, goes directly into a nearly Kenny G level of ballad, then goes into this hyper jazzy, exercise in musical gymnastics. The variety of sounds, to me is what keeps the album interesting on repeated listens.
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Affinity was deep. It didn't really come across as "disjointed" to me, but I can kinda get what you're saying.
I tend to like albums more when they don't necessarily maintain a single sound all the way through. Using DT as an example, I really love Train of Thought for having a singular vision all the way through it, but I much prefer something like IAW which starts off super balls and chunk riff heavy, goes directly into a nearly Kenny G level of ballad, then goes into this hyper jazzy, exercise in musical gymnastics. The variety of sounds, to me is what keeps the album interesting on repeated listens.
For me, I don't think either approach is inherently superior, but I do find I need more variety in long albums, whereas albums that stick with one mood (sometimes for artistic merit) are better if they're not too long so they still pack the punch they're going for. For me ToT's problem is it's a bit too long to sustain such a similar vibe all the way.
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Despite the variety, Affinity manages to sound very cohesive to me, probably because the songs all kind of have, for lack of a better term, that slightly electronic 80's backdrop. That identifiable production cannot be found on any other Haken record, so when you hear it, you know it is from that album.
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Affinity was deep. It didn't really come across as "disjointed" to me, but I can kinda get what you're saying.
I tend to like albums more when they don't necessarily maintain a single sound all the way through. Using DT as an example, I really love Train of Thought for having a singular vision all the way through it, but I much prefer something like IAW which starts off super balls and chunk riff heavy, goes directly into a nearly Kenny G level of ballad, then goes into this hyper jazzy, exercise in musical gymnastics. The variety of sounds, to me is what keeps the album interesting on repeated listens.
I get that and still like the album, but I think that from song-to-song it never really gets a chance to rest, with some sort of stylistic / mood whiplash almost every single song.
Like this: 'Initiate' - subtle and dark, then '1985' - Quirky epic that doesn't take itself seriously. 'The Architect' to 'Earthrise' is another jolt, as is every other song from then. Great album, but the song-to-song progression of 'The Mountain' or 'Visions' makes them feel more cohesive in my mind. The shifts in an album like IaW don't sound quite as strong to my ears, as 'Pull Me Under' and 'Another Day' are both pretty serious and deep tracks, even though they're musically very different.
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In all honesty I don't want bands to have the same formulas for every album. That's just boring.
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I mean, I'm all for a heavier direction, but it's the melodious and lighter sections that I find really allow the music to breathe, and I hope it isn't just entirely one sound for the duration of the album. I trust Haken to make quality music, though-- easily my favorite prog band, but I just hope that they don't forgo an aspect of their music that they are extremely talented at.
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I hope it isn't just entirely one sound for the duration of the album.
Don't worry, it isn't. Don't expect much of what I'd call "pretty" stuff like BBG, but plenty of respite and lots of great melodies and harmonies. Every Haken album is pretty different, but I'd say things like that are a core part of their identity and aren't going away any time soon no matter what new things they try or how the balance of styles shifts on any particular album.
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Yep, I don't expect the strong melodies to disappear just because the music is heavier.
Looking ahead, what songs do you think they'll play on the tour this fall? With it being a co-headlining thing, is it fair to assume they will get 90-105 minutes a night? If so, I would guess we'll get 30 minutes or so of new music. I would be surprised if they hit the new album too heavy on a tour with a shorter set list. Once they tour as a solo headliner, then I would think more new stuff would get played since the set list will be longer. Cockroach King and The Endless Knot are gimmes, since I think those are already two songs I think they will play at every show for years. I think 1985 is the other Affinity tune likely to get played again this year, and since it wasn't played much on the NA tour last year, I could see Falling Back to Earth being a regular. I would bet the first two albums won't be featured much, outside of maybe a song or two combined. I would guess for another song or two from The Mountain, In Memoriam being the most likely. I'd be surprised to see any of their longest epics (Visions, Crystallized, Celestial Elixir, The Architect) get played on this tour.
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Yep, I don't expect the strong melodies to disappear just because the music is heavier.
Looking ahead, what songs do you think they'll play on the tour this fall? With it being a co-headlining thing, is it fair to assume they will get 90-105 minutes a night? If so, I would guess we'll get 30 minutes or so of new music. I would be surprised if they hit the new album too heavy on a tour with a shorter set list. Once they tour as a solo headliner, then I would think more new stuff would get played since the set list will be longer. Cockroach King and The Endless Knot are gimmes, since I think those are already two songs I think they will play at every show for years. I think 1985 is the other Affinity tune likely to get played again this year, and since it wasn't played much on the NA tour last year, I could see Falling Back to Earth being a regular. I would bet the first two albums won't be featured much, outside of maybe a song or two combined. I would guess for another song or two from The Mountain, In Memoriam being the most likely. I'd be surprised to see any of their longest epics (Visions, Crystallized, Celestial Elixir, The Architect) get played on this tour.
The Endless Knot I'd LIKE to be that song, but it wasn't even played at every possible show on the last tour tours, so I wouldn't automatically set it as a definite piece.
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Agreed. Cockroach King and 1985 are the only automatic “gimmies” that I can think of.
Strong probably’s would be Endless Knot, In Memorium, and I think at least one song from Visions with Deathless being a top contender.
Agreed that I don’t think we will see any epics at all unless it’s the new one.
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Agreed that I don’t think we will see any epics at all unless it’s the new one.
I'd be pretty surprised if they don't play it, to be honest.
EDIT: But it's also not as long as the "epics" in Kev's list.
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Agreed. Cockroach King and 1985 are the only automatic “gimmies” that I can think of.
Strong probably’s would be Endless Knot, In Memorium, and I think at least one song from Visions with Deathless being a top contender.
Agreed that I don’t think we will see any epics at all unless it’s the new one.
Firstly, I'm going to assume 90 minutes since this is a co-headlining run, want more, but logistics might not make it possible. Keep in mind on the Affinity tour Haken played usually two hours while TYS played one hour. So 90 minutes each for Leprous and Haken would make sense. And with Bent Knee a nationwide opening you'll likely not have enough time for two hour sets in most places.
In specific reference to Deathless, highly doubt that. They only played one song from Visions the whole of the Affinity tour (minus ProgPower), and that was Deathless. While I loved seeing that song live there is no reason for them to bring it back into the fold as a nightly staple so soon.
As for staples that will be in, there is definitely an Affinity problem to navigate around. They cemented certain things as "moments" during the very extensive touring they did for that. 1985, The Endless Knot, and The Architect all had big live moments, Red Giant had specific merch dedicated to it, and Bound By Gravity is the only song they haven't played yet. Because of that last point I really hope they do play BBG, but with the new album probably taking up at least 30 minutes of the set, and realistically more like 45, and Cockroach King likely taking up 8 minutes, you probably have about 40 minutes of that to dedicate to all the other material.
So the big question for me is, given that they JUST played so much of that material so often how much set time does it get this time around? Personally I hope BBG gets in, and while I have preferences for more Affinity material beyond that if they are playing more, I kinda hope they keep it to just BBG and hit some lesser played stuff from the other albums.
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Why not just drop Cockroach King from the set for one tour? They've played that one on basically all the past tours.
Not that I would gain anything from it, but I'd like to see a random Aquarius song in the set, like Drowning in the Flood or - if it ever happens again - Streams.
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Why not just drop Cockroach King from the set for one tour? They've played that one on basically all the past tours.
Not that I would gain anything from it, but I'd like to see a random Aquarius song in the set, like Drowning in the Flood or - if it ever happens again - Streams.
I would also prefer Cockroach King gets dropped for awhile, but don't know if it'll happen.
And yes, I'm happy with any and all Aquarius inclusions, but given that we got the big medley last tour, and two of the guys aren't overly fond of playing from it, my guess is that the album gets heavily shafted this tour.
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and two of the guys aren't overly fond of playing from it
is that so? I didn't know that!
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and two of the guys aren't overly fond of playing from it
is that so? I didn't know that!
Those 2 guys do not like circus music.
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I'd like to see them give all of their previous epics a rest and focus on the new album's epic and regular album tracks. I think live debuts of Earthlings and/or Bound By Gravity are likely, and I also think Lapse will get a decent amount of play since it was ignored on the Affinity tour. I really think the setlist will focus heavily on Vector and Affinity with no Aquarius tracks and a shorter Visions track if any is even included (Mind's Eye or Insomnia). 1985 and Cockroach King are pretty much guaranteed as CK is the closest thing they have to a "hit" and 1985 is just a damn good song that represents Affinity well.
My guess would be something like this:
1. New Song (or album intro)
2. New Song
3. 1985
4. Insomnia (or Mind's Eye)
5. New Song
6. Lapse
7. Bound By Gravity (or Earthlings)
8. In Memoriam
9. New Song
10. Earthrise
11. Cockroach King
----
12. New Song (Epic)
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^ I would LOVE to see Earthlings. It does not get much love.
Also I'm 99% sure I'm gonna be going to the Montreal show! :metal
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More than two years after the release of Affinity and I still don't know what is it that people like about Earthrise or BBG. Those two songs never clicked with me, and I don't think they ever will. And I think that's why I don't rank Affinity higher, since it's the first album, since Aquarius, that has songs that don't work well for me, in contrast with Visions or The Mountain that are just perfect listening experiences from start to finish :hefdaddy
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I'd like to see them give all of their previous epics a rest and focus on the new album's epic and regular album tracks. I think live debuts of Earthlings and/or Bound By Gravity are likely, and I also think Lapse will get a decent amount of play since it was ignored on the Affinity tour. I really think the setlist will focus heavily on Vector and Affinity with no Aquarius tracks and a shorter Visions track if any is even included (Mind's Eye or Insomnia). 1985 and Cockroach King are pretty much guaranteed as CK is the closest thing they have to a "hit" and 1985 is just a damn good song that represents Affinity well.
My guess would be something like this:
1. New Song (or album intro)
2. New Song
3. 1985
4. Insomnia (or Mind's Eye)
5. New Song
6. Lapse
7. Bound By Gravity (or Earthlings)
8. In Memoriam
9. New Song
10. Earthrise
11. Cockroach King
----
12. New Song (Epic)
I wouldn't be so sure about Lapse, they were pretty disappointed with the crowd reaction when they busted it out for CttE 2017.
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It would be sick if they did a Visions medley like the one they did for Aquarius. Also I think As Death Embraces is a fantastic song to keep in the set - kind of a Ross solo spot thing. I was bummed they had omitted it before I saw them in Hollywood in their 10th anniversary tour.
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I wouldn't be so sure about Lapse, they were pretty disappointed with the crowd reaction when they busted it out for CttE 2017.
I am not sure a cruise crowd is a good judge of how songs go over live, though.
The Endless Knot I'd LIKE to be that song, but it wasn't even played at every possible show on the last tour tours, so I wouldn't automatically set it as a definite piece.
That surprises me. Given how the crowd goes bonkers over "we know which part," I will still be surprised if it doesn't become a mainstay.
As for staples that will be in, there is definitely an Affinity problem to navigate around. They cemented certain things as "moments" during the very extensive touring they did for that. 1985, The Endless Knot, and The Architect all had big live moments, Red Giant had specific merch dedicated to it, and Bound By Gravity is the only song they haven't played yet. Because of that last point I really hope they do play BBG, but with the new album probably taking up at least 30 minutes of the set, and realistically more like 45, and Cockroach King likely taking up 8 minutes, you probably have about 40 minutes of that to dedicate to all the other material.
So the big question for me is, given that they JUST played so much of that material so often how much set time does it get this time around? Personally I hope BBG gets in, and while I have preferences for more Affinity material beyond that if they are playing more, I kinda hope they keep it to just BBG and hit some lesser played stuff from the other albums.
I'd love to see Bound by Gravity. That would be a great last song of the set. Same goes for Somebody, which I still think is a top 5 Haken tune, but I don't expect that one any time soon. :(
^ I would LOVE to see Earthlings. It does not get much love.
Hell yeah. That is a good one that needs to get played.
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I don't understand why they made a music video for Lapse if they weren't going to play it live, but they didn't. I'd rather see BBG personally.
And I'd be cool if they dropped Cockroach King. It's good, but I think it's a bit overrated. I'd rather 1985 be the setlist staple if Haken were to have one (although I understand CK has been that song longer)
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My complete shot in the dark guess....
1. Clear
2. The Good Doctor
3. Insomnia
4. In Memoriam
5. Veil
6. Earthrise
7. Pareidolia
8. Nil By Mouth
9. A Cell Divides
10. The Endless Knot
Encore
Bound by Gravity
1985
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I find it remarkable that, at least as far as studio albums (and thus wider recognition) goes, Haken are entirely a product of this decade. Aquarius, their first album, came out in 2010. Now 8 years later, the arrival of album number 5 is on horizon, and it feels like a significant release in the progressive music world for this year, with plenty of anticipation for it, as this thread is currently demonstrating. Haken are certainly a contender to be among the defining prog bands of this decade, the way that Porcupine Tree defined the first decade of this 21st century.
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I find it remarkable that, at least as far as studio albums (and thus wider recognition) goes, Haken are entirely a product of this decade. Aquarius, their first album, came out in 2010. Now 8 years later, the arrival of album number 5 is on horizon, and it feels like a significant release in the progressive music world for this year, with plenty of anticipation for it, as this thread is currently demonstrating. Haken are certainly a contender to be among the defining prog bands of this decade, the way that Porcupine Tree defined the first decade of this 21st century.
COMPLETELY agree!
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Sums up how I've been feeling about Haken for the past seven years.
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It is pretty cool to see this band grow, I just hope there is a lot more room to grow. The genre is very niche, but would be cool to see them make it to the next level. Consistent touring will help. It's nice that they are doing a 3rd tour of the US in 3 years. Bands like Sabaton and Delain have come to the US every year for like 7 years in a row and their attendance shows that it helps.
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I find it remarkable that, at least as far as studio albums (and thus wider recognition) goes, Haken are entirely a product of this decade. Aquarius, their first album, came out in 2010. Now 8 years later, the arrival of album number 5 is on horizon, and it feels like a significant release in the progressive music world for this year, with plenty of anticipation for it, as this thread is currently demonstrating. Haken are certainly a contender to be among the defining prog bands of this decade, the way that Porcupine Tree defined the first decade of this 21st century.
Mike Portnoy could not have said it better.
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I'd like to see them give all of their previous epics a rest and focus on the new album's epic and regular album tracks. I think live debuts of Earthlings and/or Bound By Gravity are likely, and I also think Lapse will get a decent amount of play since it was ignored on the Affinity tour. I really think the setlist will focus heavily on Vector and Affinity with no Aquarius tracks and a shorter Visions track if any is even included (Mind's Eye or Insomnia). 1985 and Cockroach King are pretty much guaranteed as CK is the closest thing they have to a "hit" and 1985 is just a damn good song that represents Affinity well.
My guess would be something like this:
1. New Song (or album intro)
2. New Song
3. 1985
4. Insomnia (or Mind's Eye)
5. New Song
6. Lapse
7. Bound By Gravity (or Earthlings)
8. In Memoriam
9. New Song
10. Earthrise
11. Cockroach King
----
12. New Song (Epic)
I wouldn't be so sure about Lapse, they were pretty disappointed with the crowd reaction when they busted it out for CttE 2017.
That sucks, but I'd hate for them to make a judgment based on just one performance at such an odd venue as a cruise.
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I find it remarkable that, at least as far as studio albums (and thus wider recognition) goes, Haken are entirely a product of this decade. Aquarius, their first album, came out in 2010. Now 8 years later, the arrival of album number 5 is on horizon, and it feels like a significant release in the progressive music world for this year, with plenty of anticipation for it, as this thread is currently demonstrating. Haken are certainly a contender to be among the defining prog bands of this decade, the way that Porcupine Tree defined the first decade of this 21st century.
Mike Portnoy could not have said it better.
The quote doesn't contain any spin that redirects the spotlight on MP or his son, therefore: NO, your joke falls flat.
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I find it remarkable that, at least as far as studio albums (and thus wider recognition) goes, Haken are entirely a product of this decade. Aquarius, their first album, came out in 2010. Now 8 years later, the arrival of album number 5 is on horizon, and it feels like a significant release in the progressive music world for this year, with plenty of anticipation for it, as this thread is currently demonstrating. Haken are certainly a contender to be among the defining prog bands of this decade, the way that Porcupine Tree defined the first decade of this 21st century.
Mike Portnoy could not have said it better.
The quote doesn't contain any spin that redirects the spotlight on MP or his son, therefore: NO, your joke falls flat.
Sorry, Did not mean any harm. I actually agree with RoeDent's post.
I am just getting into Leporus and the song forced entry off of Bilateral has that Haken sound.
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I find it remarkable that, at least as far as studio albums (and thus wider recognition) goes, Haken are entirely a product of this decade. Aquarius, their first album, came out in 2010. Now 8 years later, the arrival of album number 5 is on horizon, and it feels like a significant release in the progressive music world for this year, with plenty of anticipation for it, as this thread is currently demonstrating. Haken are certainly a contender to be among the defining prog bands of this decade, the way that Porcupine Tree defined the first decade of this 21st century.
As good a decade as Haken as had, I can't put them ahead of solo Steven Wilson, Devin Townsend or Neal Morse.
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I find it remarkable that, at least as far as studio albums (and thus wider recognition) goes, Haken are entirely a product of this decade. Aquarius, their first album, came out in 2010. Now 8 years later, the arrival of album number 5 is on horizon, and it feels like a significant release in the progressive music world for this year, with plenty of anticipation for it, as this thread is currently demonstrating. Haken are certainly a contender to be among the defining prog bands of this decade, the way that Porcupine Tree defined the first decade of this 21st century.
As good a decade as Haken as had, I can't put them ahead of solo Steven Wilson, Devin Townsend or Neal Morse.
While I might agree with this, those guys have had years of experience making music BEFORE 2010 (with plenty of other groups, especially in the case of SW and NM), while Haken have only been around in THIS decade alone. Given that, they've put out a lot of quality stuff in such a short time. When they reach 20-25 years of making music, then you can probably compare them to where SW and NM are now.
-Marc.
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I find it remarkable that, at least as far as studio albums (and thus wider recognition) goes, Haken are entirely a product of this decade. Aquarius, their first album, came out in 2010. Now 8 years later, the arrival of album number 5 is on horizon, and it feels like a significant release in the progressive music world for this year, with plenty of anticipation for it, as this thread is currently demonstrating. Haken are certainly a contender to be among the defining prog bands of this decade, the way that Porcupine Tree defined the first decade of this 21st century.
As good a decade as Haken as had, I can't put them ahead of solo Steven Wilson, Devin Townsend or Neal Morse.
Well, that's just a matter of taste and they've been doing it longer. But everyone knows that you turned your back on Affinity and now it's turned to toxicity despite all the baconinity.
:lol :rollin :lol
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Yea, sure Wilson, Townsend, and Morse are more successful, they've also been around for much long and with experience with other bands as well. Hard to really compare them to Haken when only looking at the last 10 years.
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Okay, but in the context of the post I was quoting, that basically gave PT the nod for the 00's even though they had been around since 1990, I thought what I said made sense.
But everyone knows that you turned your back on Affinity and now it's turned to toxicity despite all the baconinity.
:lol :rollin :lol
:lol :lol
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I find it remarkable that, at least as far as studio albums (and thus wider recognition) goes, Haken are entirely a product of this decade. Aquarius, their first album, came out in 2010. Now 8 years later, the arrival of album number 5 is on horizon, and it feels like a significant release in the progressive music world for this year, with plenty of anticipation for it, as this thread is currently demonstrating. Haken are certainly a contender to be among the defining prog bands of this decade, the way that Porcupine Tree defined the first decade of this 21st century.
Mike Portnoy could not have said it better.
MP would have thrown in something like "so proud of my boys" or something else that sounds like he thinks he's their mentor or they're some kind of students of his.
My first thought of MPs Vector post the other day was "man the dudes from Haken must be pissed that he's spoiling stuff and reveals information about the album before the band themselves did". Plus, he still managed to make the post about himself by mentioning Opus Maximus and advertising his own band. Man I don't know why he always has to do things like that.
That being said, I totally agree with Roe. Regarding quality, Haken are already among the greats like Steven, Neal or even Dream Theater for me.
Concerning the setlist: I remember talking to Richard about Earthlings right after the EP came out. He said that the band thought it wouldn't work so well in a live concert. I personally agree. And I feel similar about Bound By Gravity.
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I believe he got the ok from Charlie to post about the album. I read that somewhere.
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I believe he got the ok from Charlie to post about the album. I read that somewhere.
Yeah, ariich asked him on Twitter.
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That's right. Man, is it bad I already forgot that? Lol
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For those of us who don't "tweet" , what did Portnoy say?
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For those of us who don't "tweet" , what did Portnoy say?
(https://i1377.photobucket.com/albums/ah58/jorge_pozo1/CFD9527B-FD37-4B33-AD9A-62DC504C3788_zpsji17ufku.png) (https://s1377.photobucket.com/user/jorge_pozo1/media/CFD9527B-FD37-4B33-AD9A-62DC504C3788_zpsji17ufku.png.html)
-Marc.
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GOT MY TICKET IN HAND!!!!!
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GOT MY TICKET IN HAND!!!!!
Is your direction misaligned?
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GOT MY TICKET IN HAND!!!!!
Is your direction misaligned?
Not even sure what my work situation will be....so I'm literally playing this role with the cast of a die. :angel:
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Concerning the setlist: I remember talking to Richard about Earthlings right after the EP came out. He said that the band thought it wouldn't work so well in a live concert. I personally agree. And I feel similar about Bound By Gravity.
I don't agree at all. Not every song has to rock live, and I think throwing in a few songs that bring it down a few notches for the whole song is always cool. I know they have plenty of songs that go back and forth between rocking and mellow, but I don't see how songs like that wouldn't work.
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That's disappointing to hear that he said that about Earthlings, it's actually one of my favorite Haken songs. I don't agree either that it wouldn't work well live.
I did get tickets to see them in NYC in November, I'm stoked that it's on a weekend again like last year in NYC. They've made my short list of bands that I make every effort not to miss when they're local.
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It was directly after Restoration was released, so 4 years ago, maybe they have changed their minds by now... I don't wanna kill you guys' hopes and dreams :D
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It was directly after Restoration was released, so 4 years ago, maybe they have changed their minds by now... I don't wanna kill you guys' hopes and dreams :D
No, in a conversation with Hen more recently I was given the same impression. Not that it means it won't get played, but I doubt they are in any rush to dig it out.
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Also, on FB there were questions about set times on the upcoming tour and Haken's manager liked my comment saying I'd bet on equal 90 minute sets. So while that's not exactly official, it's certainly what I'd go by.
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It's a co-headline tour by two bands of roughly equal popularity. I would find it strange if one would get (much) more play-time than the other.
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It's a co-headline tour by two bands of roughly equal popularity. I would find it strange if one would get (much) more play-time than the other.
As would I, this was more a confirmation that the equal time is likely 90 minutes.
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It's a co-headline tour by two bands of roughly equal popularity. I would find it strange if one would get (much) more play-time than the other.
As would I, this was more a confirmation that the equal time is likely 90 minutes.
If the set list is fairly even, hopefully Leprous will play a song or two from TPS or Bilateral. Not really counting on it though.
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Even though I like The Architect a lot, even if Haken is only getting 90 minutes, I'd rather they not dedicate 15-16 minutes to it, but I have a feeling they will, simply so Einar Solberg can come out and do the harsh vocals like he did on the studio version.
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Even though I like The Architect a lot, even if Haken is only getting 90 minutes, I'd rather they not dedicate 15-16 minutes to it, but I have a feeling they will, simply so Einar Solberg can come out and do the harsh vocals like he did on the studio version.
I've been pondering that, and it presents an interesting dilemma. I'm sure they'd like to do it, but The Architect isn't an early in the set kinda song, but you're certainly not going to make Einar sit around while Haken sets up and be ready an hour later every night, not fair to him. So I can honestly see them skipping the song just so they don't have to try to impose on him on a nightly basis.
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And with the new songs slightly long, they will take up the time making the older, shorter songs ideal.
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You guys are probably right. :tup :tup
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He did come out a couple of times the last time Haken & Leprous toured, right? I’m pretty sure I saw footage of Einar doing the harsh vocals once.
In Romania two weeks ago Einar did it and it was amazing :biggrin:
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Even though I like The Architect a lot, even if Haken is only getting 90 minutes, I'd rather they not dedicate 15-16 minutes to it, but I have a feeling they will, simply so Einar Solberg can come out and do the harsh vocals like he did on the studio version.
I've been pondering that, and it presents an interesting dilemma. I'm sure they'd like to do it, but The Architect isn't an early in the set kinda song, but you're certainly not going to make Einar sit around while Haken sets up and be ready an hour later every night, not fair to him. So I can honestly see them skipping the song just so they don't have to try to impose on him on a nightly basis.
Bands regularly have a singer from an opening act come out later during the headliner. It's not uncommon although I've always wondered what the dynamic is for the singer to kind of come down from their show then get back up to come out for a song. I'd rather see them not play it though, on a shorter set list, I'd rather see the 15 minutes spent somewhere else.
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He did come out a couple of times the last time Haken & Leprous toured, right? I’m pretty sure I saw footage of Einar doing the harsh vocals once.
In Romania two weeks ago Einar did it and it was amazing :biggrin:
Yes, I believe he did, but those were a handful of dates and a one off, not a month long tour. Not saying it won't happen, it very well may, but it just seems like a lot of constraint on Einar for 10 seconds of stage time.
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Finally grabbed my tix for the St. Louis show :metal Like Kev mentioned.....it's a General Admission so gonna make sure to get there early to snag a good spot
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"Vector, like Baconector"?
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Haken v.
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Yeah a new thread title would be smashing.
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Finally grabbed my tix for the St. Louis show :metal Like Kev mentioned.....it's a General Admission so gonna make sure to get there early to snag a good spot
For the NYC show, it's GA, but there is VIP seating (and a minimum tab). I had never been to that venue before seeing Haken there last year, but while the VIP seating didn't seem to be a better seat (it's along the perimeter of the floor of the venue) I do recall seeing people standing on the seats (which would then give the best view). Hoping to be able to do that for this show.
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I know most here won't get it, but I'd love something like Haken v. Secure your home.
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Haken v. like the number
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Don't know if it effects anyone here, but a New Orleans date was added Nov. 12.
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So Page 1 of this thread has a link to the first Haken thread, so I'm currently reading through the first pages of that, back before and around the release of Aquarius in 2010. Remarkable how far Haken have come in the years since then.
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So Page 1 of this thread has a link to the first Haken thread, so I'm currently reading through the first pages of that, back before and around the release of Aquarius in 2010. Remarkable how far Haken have come in the years since then.
Awesome. Just goes to show how much they've accomplished so quickly, when we've had post-crash DTF threads since before their first album came out. :hat
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HAKEN'S VECTOR is now available for pre-order!
I also found the track lengths on the insideout shop website.
Not sure if you guys want it spoiled, so here's a little warning: Warning.
01. Clear (01:52)
02. The Good Doctor (03:55)
03. Puzzle Box (07:42)
04. Veil (12:35)
05. Nil By Mouth (06:51)
06. Host (06:45)
07. A Cell Divides (04:57)
08. Verbal Summator (01:02)
So it seems, that this will be a very short album, not longer than 45mins if I counted correctly. I wonder why they would press it on 2 LPs though.
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A lot of big prog bands seem to be doing this. And honestly I've also really been into shorter albums lately. TesseracT, Parius and Between the Buried and Me if you consider both sides as separate all put out some of the best albums of the year, with relatively short releases.
I know very few albums over an hour that have really wow'd me to be honest. Obviously Odyssey to the West doesn't count because that album is perfect.
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Maybe they'll master it in 45 rpm speed, like To The Bone?
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https://burningshed.com/store/InsideOutMusic
Oddly enough, the track listings given on BurningShed are different, and give the layout of the vinyl sides.
According to the above listing, its 45:39, but looking at the lists on BurningShed, the album is 45:19 and lists only 7 tracks.
Either way, gonna pre-order the 2cd set!
-Marc.
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What the! Haken added an extra track!
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I wonder why they would press it on 2 LPs though.
Well, an LP only holds around 45 mins, so even if it would theoretically fit on one, you don't really want a break in the middle of a song!
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What the! Haken added an extra track!
So wait...which website has the correct listing? InsideOut or BurningShed?
Also, here is the link for anyone looking to order the other colored vinyl sets and/or getting a tshirt- https://www.omerch.eu/shop/haken/
-Marc.
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I don't know for certain. My guess would be InsideOut. There was only ever 7 tracks before (including the original press release) so I can't imagine where else IO would have got an eighth track name and length!
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The most difficult thing about pre-ordering this album is deciding which colour vinyl I'd like to have.
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I don't know for certain. My guess would be InsideOut. There was only ever 7 tracks before (including the original press release) so I can't imagine where else IO would have got an eighth track name and length!
Worst insider ever
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I don't know for certain. My guess would be InsideOut. There was only ever 7 tracks before (including the original press release) so I can't imagine where else IO would have got an eighth track name and length!
Maybe a hidden track?
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Looks like an outro track to me.
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I don't know for certain. My guess would be InsideOut. There was only ever 7 tracks before (including the original press release) so I can't imagine where else IO would have got an eighth track name and length!
Worst wannabe insider ever
fixed
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Looks like an outro track to me.
Yeah looks like it.
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So, do we think this extra track is on all versions, or just on the InsideOut releases?
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Interesting how Haken albums have got progressively shorter over time.
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So, do we think this extra track is on all versions, or just on the InsideOut releases?
It's surely on all versions. If it was a late addition then other places just might not have got the updated information. The track times on the IO page for 1-7 are definitely accurate whereas the Burning Shed ones are too long.
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Where are you guys seeing an 8th track?
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Where are you guys seeing an 8th track?
01. Clear (01:52)
02. The Good Doctor (03:55)
03. Puzzle Box (07:42)
04. Veil (12:35)
05. Nil By Mouth (06:51)
06. Host (06:45)
07. A Cell Divides (04:57)
08. Verbal Summator (01:02)
And this is the tracklist elsewhere:
1 Clear 1:57
2 The Good Doctor 3:58
3 Puzzle Box 7:45
4 Veil 12:41
5 Nil By Mouth 7:11
6 Host 6:47
7 A Cell Divides 5:00
Looking at it side-by-side with the tracklist on BurningShed, it looks like the first seven tracks are all shorter by 2-6 seconds each, with the exception of "Nil By Mouth", which is 20 seconds shorter. Over-all, it's a total of 42 seconds shorter than the original 7-track listing, but it also adds 1:02 with the 8th track, so an over-all net-gain of 20 seconds.
It's been my experience that often-times, the track times posted in press releases and website stores are different than what's on the packaging and even the actual disc track lengths, so I guess we won't know for sure until a final physical product is in our hands!
-Marc.
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I'm not really sure it makes a difference to me, an extra minute of outro music isn't changing things a whole lot for me (I'm already excited but this doesn't move the needle). Now, if we find out there's a legit hidden track or something else, I am interested in knowing more about it.
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I'm sure the music will be awesome, but I hate to say that the track times leave me underwhelmed. I realize how stupid that sounds, but I guess I'm just used to a bit more material from these guys. Short albums are usually pretty great, but I absorb the material so quickly that I usually only listen to it a dozen times before I move onto something else. I wonder if they're saving some tracks for an EP release down the line.
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Okay I ordered the lilac vinyl and my friend the petrol green vinyl. Can't wait for this album!
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Tracklist on InsideOut shop has been changed. The eight track is gone.
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Tracklist on InsideOut shop has been changed. The eight track is gone.
Controversial!
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Tracklist on InsideOut shop has been changed. The eight track is gone.
Controversial!
Coverup.exe.
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Tracklist on InsideOut shop has been changed. The eight track is gone.
Controversial!
Coverup.exe.
I blame Toxicity.
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Tracklist on InsideOut shop has been changed. The eight track is gone.
Controversial!
Coverup.exe.
I blame Toxicity.
And after they turned their backs on Affinity for it...
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Don't know if this has been brought up yet, but they seem to me to be playing 29 gigs with only 4 nights off on this tour. How do people think Jennings is going to sound at the end of that 9 show stretch in the middle? I'm trying to decide where to see them and that's something I figure I should take into consideration. From what I've seen on YT the dude's already kind of iffy live. I'm thinking it'd be best to try and line things up in his favor.
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Looks like a hidden (not so hidden anymore :lol) track to me :tup
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From what I've seen on YT the dude's already kind of iffy live. I'm thinking it'd be best to try and line things up in his favor.
Really? Maybe I got lucky, when I saw them Ross was near perfect! One of the best live singers I've experienced to this day
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From what I've seen on YT the dude's already kind of iffy live. I'm thinking it'd be best to try and line things up in his favor.
Really? Maybe I got lucky, when I saw them Ross was near perfect! One of the best live singers I've experienced to this day
I found Ross to be extremely good live both times I've seen them, but even the best are going to wear out after 9 nights singing. I guess doing maybe a shorter set would help though.
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Don't know if this has been brought up yet, but they seem to me to be playing 29 gigs with only 4 nights off on this tour. How do people think Jennings is going to sound at the end of that 9 show stretch in the middle? I'm trying to decide where to see them and that's something I figure I should take into consideration. From what I've seen on YT the dude's already kind of iffy live. I'm thinking it'd be best to try and line things up in his favor.
Ross is never going to blow you away but the 4 times I've seen him, I've loved the show and he was great.
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Don't know if this has been brought up yet, but they seem to me to be playing 29 gigs with only 4 nights off on this tour. How do people think Jennings is going to sound at the end of that 9 show stretch in the middle? I'm trying to decide where to see them and that's something I figure I should take into consideration. From what I've seen on YT the dude's already kind of iffy live. I'm thinking it'd be best to try and line things up in his favor.
I didn't notice any observable falloff in seeing him three consecutive nights on their last tour. Obviously nine will be a lot more taxing, but they won't be playing a full headlining set so each night should be a little bit less strenuous.
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Do we know for sure they're playing a short set? Do we know what that means, exactly? I'd love to see the guys, but I'm not sure I want to fly around the country if they're only doing a 75 minute set.
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Co headlining with 3 bands playing so the guess here is 1 1/2 hour sets. for them and Leprous. with Bent Knee having the shorter set.
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from Diego Tejeda FB:
- A sneaky preview of HAKEN's upcoming album, Vector.
- An in depth written and video interview.
-My first ever signature sound library released to the public!
All of this and more on this article for ARTURIA. 🎶🎵🎼🔈
https://www.arturia.com/diego-tejeida
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honestly the album length is kinda reassuring, I'll take 45 killer minutes over 70 minutes of mixed quality any day
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Really tasty keyboard sounds in that clip.
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Nice, sounds like all the snippets are from the same track. Plus some non-Vector things.
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That synth line at the start reminds me a lot of Visions (the song), but it all sounds completely amazing :hefdaddy Seriously can’t wait for this new album.
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That video was awesome. Dude is amazing. Band is amazing. Vector will be amazing.
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That synth line at the start reminds me a lot of Visions (the song), but it all sounds completely amazing :hefdaddy Seriously can’t wait for this new album.
Yes I immediately thoght to a more modern version of the sound of Visions. I'm confident I will like Vector more than Affinity!
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Whoa this music he's playing sounds awesome :metal
Really awesome video too. I get it's really like an ad for the product, but it's really well done and isn't in your face to sell the product. Really sells his ideas that can be expressed through the product. I really enjoyed it.
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Haken announce European & Latin American tour dates in support of "Vector".
https://hakenmusic.com/blog/post/haken-vector-eu-latin-america-tour-2019 (https://hakenmusic.com/blog/post/haken-vector-eu-latin-america-tour-2019)
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(https://media.giphy.com/media/5GoVLqeAOo6PK/giphy.gif)
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:lol
Diego, have you seen them before?
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:lol
Diego, have you seen them before?
I saw them when they came with TSF and blew my mind, but they have never toured South America playing Haken stuff which is why I'm so excited about this
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That is awesome! Starting to make it globally.
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(https://media.giphy.com/media/5GoVLqeAOo6PK/giphy.gif)
:lol :lol :lol Indeed!
I'm really considering to make a trip from João Pessoa to São Paulo just to see them... :omg:
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That synth line at the start reminds me a lot of Visions (the song), but it all sounds completely amazing :hefdaddy Seriously can’t wait for this new album.
(https://i1377.photobucket.com/albums/ah58/jorge_pozo1/DFE514E3-1533-4BB3-81BE-4ECD67EBB91A_zps59iavzrk.jpg) (https://s1377.photobucket.com/user/jorge_pozo1/media/DFE514E3-1533-4BB3-81BE-4ECD67EBB91A_zps59iavzrk.jpg.html)
They are playing LIMA!!!!
I’ll see you there.
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That synth line at the start reminds me a lot of Visions (the song), but it all sounds completely amazing :hefdaddy Seriously can’t wait for this new album.
(https://i1377.photobucket.com/albums/ah58/jorge_pozo1/DFE514E3-1533-4BB3-81BE-4ECD67EBB91A_zps59iavzrk.jpg) (https://s1377.photobucket.com/user/jorge_pozo1/media/DFE514E3-1533-4BB3-81BE-4ECD67EBB91A_zps59iavzrk.jpg.html)
They are playing LIMA!!!!
I’ll see you there.
YES! We’ll be there, man :metal
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I wonder how many album cycles it'll take them to become popular enough to play in Russia.
Really excited for our fellow Latin American DTFers though, pretty sure this show is going to be a blast!
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I'm surprised they are not doing a single show in Russia during the European leg yet they are coming down here. That is weird.
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I have to go to Ireland for work early next year, might have to see if I can spin that into also taking a European Hakation (no Nick, I will not pay you royalties for that term).
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(no Nick, I will not pay you royalties for that term).
Then you'll be hearing from my lawyer.
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I remember, for years I'd read about Haken here on DTF - everyone would be ranting and raving about them and I was over here like, "Pffft. How good could they possibly be?" and I never gave them a shot until one day, right before Affinity came out I listened to The Mountain and holy mother of god. I was like, "Oh shit, THAT'S how good..." No band has risen through the ranks and made it into my top 3 favorite bands as quickly as Haken. Haken is love, Haken is life.
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I remember, for years I'd read about Haken here on DTF - everyone would be ranting and raving about them and I was over here like, "Pffft. How good could they possibly be?" and I never gave them a shot until one day, right before Affinity came out I listened to The Mountain and holy mother of god. I was like, "Oh shit, THAT'S how good..." No band has risen through the ranks and made it into my top 3 favorite bands as quickly as Haken. Haken is love, Haken is life.
Took longer than we may like, but happy you've finally taken Haken into your heart and into your life.
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I'm so happy for these guys. They deserve every inch of success.
I'm buying my Mexico City ticket as soon as it comes out.
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I'm surprised they didn't release a single yet. It's been two weeks since the preorder went up.
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I'm surprised they didn't release a single yet. It's been two weeks since the preorder went up.
Soon, I'm sure, but from a business standpoint here is the theory I'm guessing they're subscribed to. Best to get tickets on sale for all the dates they can announce first. That way people will buy tickets based on liking what they've done to this point. Once they release the single there are people who may not like it and who would have then decided not to buy tickets, but once they have them will likely still go to the show. And of course people might love the new single and buy tickets when they hadn't previously, so really a win-win situation to get tickets out first.
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I'm so happy for these guys. They deserve every inch of success.
I'm buying my Mexico City ticket as soon as it comes out.
I'm also waiting to the Mexico tickets to go on sale to grab mine. They're playing with Intervals as opener, I don't think I've listened them.
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I'm going to try my best to resist listening to any single(s) until the album comes out, so I can listen to it all as one piece for the first listen. This is a pretty short album, so I don't want to make the "unheard" portion even shorter when I get the album.
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Also, they filmed a video recently so they could be waiting for that to be cut together to release the song and video simultaneously. That kinda stuff can take a ton of time actually. Something as basic as proper color correction can be a lengthy process depending on the type of camera used. Footage filmed on a Blackmagic for example is much easier to color correct because of how flat the footage is - you normally only have to bring in the colors you want, vs other cameras where you not only have to bring in the colors you want but also remove colors you don't want. Depending on the footage/software/skill level of the guy/guys/gal/gals doing it, it could take a bit of time to get it perfect.
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I'm going to try my best to resist listening to any single(s) until the album comes out, so I can listen to it all as one piece for the first listen. This is a pretty short album, so I don't want to make the "unheard" portion even shorter when I get the album.
I'm trying to do that for around 3 years now, and I mostly manage to do it. It's pretty awesome to hear the full thing rather than listening to 2 new songs, than one you already completely know by heart and then 3 more new songs. Because then you only want to listen to the new ones and not the one you already know. Completely screws with the album's dramaturgy imo.
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I'm going to try my best to resist listening to any single(s) until the album comes out, so I can listen to it all as one piece for the first listen. This is a pretty short album, so I don't want to make the "unheard" portion even shorter when I get the album.
I'm trying to do that for around 3 years now, and I mostly manage to do it. It's pretty awesome to hear the full thing rather than listening to 2 new songs, than one you already completely know by heart and then 3 more new songs. Because then you only want to listen to the new ones and not the one you already know. Completely screws with the album's dramaturgy imo.
I know that feeling. It feels awkward for the first few spins, but the singles quickly find a new meaning for me in the context of the album.
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I'm going to try my best to resist listening to any single(s) until the album comes out, so I can listen to it all as one piece for the first listen. This is a pretty short album, so I don't want to make the "unheard" portion even shorter when I get the album.
I'm trying to do that for around 3 years now, and I mostly manage to do it. It's pretty awesome to hear the full thing rather than listening to 2 new songs, than one you already completely know by heart and then 3 more new songs. Because then you only want to listen to the new ones and not the one you already know. Completely screws with the album's dramaturgy imo.
I know that feeling. It feels awkward for the first few spins, but the singles quickly find a new meaning for me in the context of the album.
Ok, I also can't disagree with that. Last DT single I listened to was The Enemy Inside. I always liked it, but it worked a lot better in the context of the False Aw Suite and The Looking Glass.
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I'm surprised they didn't release a single yet. It's been two weeks since the preorder went up.
Soon, I'm sure, but from a business standpoint here is the theory I'm guessing they're subscribed to. Best to get tickets on sale for all the dates they can announce first. That way people will buy tickets based on liking what they've done to this point. Once they release the single there are people who may not like it and who would have then decided not to buy tickets, but once they have them will likely still go to the show. And of course people might love the new single and buy tickets when they hadn't previously, so really a win-win situation to get tickets out first.
That has been the M.O. of a lot of bands in recent years. I get why it is done, as it is smart from a business standpoint, but it feels a little sneaky.
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Although I'm not really sure about the logic. How many people would really not buy tickets on the basis of one single? And among those, how many really going to have bought tickets having heard nothing at all?
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Although I'm not really sure about the logic. How many people would really not buy tickets on the basis of one single? And among those, how many really going to have bought tickets having heard nothing at all?
In my case, I'm desperately trying to buy a ticket for the concert in Lima, but they aren't available yet :'(
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Although I'm not really sure about the logic. How many people would really not buy tickets on the basis of one single? And among those, how many really going to have bought tickets having heard nothing at all?
Even if it's 5 people, it's still a win. Hype from the tour, then hype from the new music. If the new music is a letdown to people, and then you announce the tour, they won't be hyped about that either.
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Although I'm not really sure about the logic. How many people would really not buy tickets on the basis of one single? And among those, how many really going to have bought tickets having heard nothing at all?
Even if it's 5 people, it's still a win. Hype from the tour, then hype from the new music. If the new music is a letdown to people, and then you announce the tour, they won't be hyped about that either.
I'm hyped if a band I enjoy decides to come here. Usually an instant buy, regardless of the album.
Its not like they're Coheed and Cambria. They release a new album, only play like 3-4 songs from it and the rest of the set is the same songs they always play. I looked at their setlist recently and its all the same exact songs they always play. So, I guess in a way me seeing them depends on the new album and if they decide to change the set.
Its sad when I can predict the set for most bands that tour. I like when bands switch it up every tour.
I really wish Haken could come here. But our promoters would say "who the fuck is Haken". But they did get Bent Knee which I was surprised happened, although it was a small crowd.
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Although I'm not really sure about the logic. How many people would really not buy tickets on the basis of one single? And among those, how many really going to have bought tickets having heard nothing at all?
Even if it's 5 people, it's still a win. Hype from the tour, then hype from the new music. If the new music is a letdown to people, and then you announce the tour, they won't be hyped about that either.
I'm hyped if a band I enjoy decides to come here. Usually an instant buy, regardless of the album.
Its not like they're Coheed and Cambria. They release a new album, only play like 3-4 songs from it and the rest of the set is the same songs they always play. I looked at their setlist recently and its all the same exact songs they always play. So, I guess in a way me seeing them depends on the new album and if they decide to change the set.
Its sad when I can predict the set for most bands that tour. I like when bands switch it up every tour.
I really wish Haken could come here. But our promoters would say "who the fuck is Haken". But they did get Bent Knee which I was surprised happened, although it was a small crowd.
Definitely get where you're coming from, but to my point, whether they announce tour to your area first or release new music first, they aren't losing with you either way, they only stand to gain.
As for Coheed specifically, they at least have had at least had the Neverender tours which has forced them to play rare stuff for parts of the evening.
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https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/videos/236304803678168/
Apparently, Haken will release a single today! It will be hard not to listen to it...
But I'm looking forward to all your opinions!!
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I will finally be able to express mine. :P
Looks like it's the video, so I think it'll be The Good Doctor.
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:caffeine:
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https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/videos/236304803678168/
Apparently, Haken will release a single today! It will be hard not to listen to it...
But I'm looking forward to all your opinions!!
hell yea :metal
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BRACE FOR IMPACT!
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My body is ready
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Pure anticipation and all that.
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Cool, looking forward to hearing it.
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Aussies apparently have it on streaming services, because they live in the future. I imagine the video will pop up tonight or tomorrow therefore!
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Checked the Russian streaming service I use just in case, but no dice.
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Checked the Russian streaming service I use just in case, but no dice.
I'll try Trump. :lol
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Patiently waiting for midnight to come... :'(
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https://youtu.be/mbELRcPysTk
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Guess we in the US have to wait.
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I feel so teased. And not in the good way.
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Interesting song, but I'm hoping this is a repeat of Affinity where the lead single ended up being one of the weaker tracks.
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Just listened to it, and it’s really good! :metal There’s a lot going on, but I definitely like it. Need more listens, though.
Btw, the way the song starts definitely shows that Clear is an intro piece like affinity.exe.
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oh i like this way more than i liked initiate, i'm excited
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I love all the HAKEN especially the mountain, the ep, afffinity. The new one? i Love it!
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Okay, this new single is awesome. Aside from the obvious added focus on heavy riffs, this song is also really catchy IMO. I love Ross' singing on this track.
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Gave it a listen this morning before work. Catchy stuff ("Electricityyyy"), I'll be spinning it a lot this weekend.
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Ross indeed sounds better than ever. The songs seems to serve a similar function like Initiate did on Affinity (for which I needed the context of the album to fully enjoy), but as a standalone track I like it more than Initiate.
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Waking up to this friend activity on Spotify made it pretty obvious Haken released something :lol
(https://i.snag.gy/6Qrzlp.jpg)
Checking it out now :metal
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:lol
Brilliant
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It’s on YouTube now:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BD3v8w57_lU (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BD3v8w57_lU)
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Not as good as Affinity's lead single but this is promising. Sounds very adventurous for a single so I have no doubt Haken will keep doing weird things while keeping the songwriting on point. Hope I can get over the corny lyrics as soon as I hear the whole album :lol
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Not as good as Affinity's lead single but this is promising.
Pretty much my thoughts too.
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I liked it. Nothing fantastic, but very good.
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Anybody have the lyrics yet? :P (I like reading the lyrics along to the music).
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Anybody have the lyrics yet? :P (I like reading the lyrics along to the music).
Nope, but I'm pretty sure it's "electricity is", not just "electricityyyyy". :P
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Okay, so I never got into Haken, mainly because I dislike the vocals (The Mountain), but I actually really like this single, including the vocals, which sound great here. Guess I'll check out the new album once it arrives.
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Anybody have the lyrics yet? :P (I like reading the lyrics along to the music).
Nope, but I'm pretty sure it's "electricity is", not just "electricityyyyy". :P
Yeah yeah ;D
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I like it very much on first listen, especially the chorus and the instrumental. Good job, Haken. :tup
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Not as good as Affinity's lead single but this is promising.
Pretty much my thoughts too.
Mine too. Enough to get me excited.
Affinity was the album that got me into this band, so I'm no doubt gonna check this new one out!
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I like the 80 drumming and the catchyness of the song, not a fan of the prog by numbers instrumental. I hate when they break the melody like that but overall it's good. I also just got my ticket for the January show :metal
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Both Monuments and Haken release kickass singles on the same day?
That makes me very happy :heart
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It's good but I'm honestly pretty tired of prog metal singing about mental illness/strange behaviors and doctors and institutions because I get nothing out of it. Instrumentally, nice, looking forward to the album
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Anybody have the lyrics yet? :P (I like reading the lyrics along to the music).
This is my best effort to work them out from a few weeks ago. I'm not confident about "caved in broken life". The rest I think is probably right.
(EDIT: I changed Dr X to Dr Rex, as someone on Facebook pointed out that Rex means King, and the song includes a couple of little references to Cockroach King. Also changed "fake" to "vague", and now feeling more confident about caved in broken life)
The Good Doctor
Calling Dr Rex to Cell Block 2, the nurses cry
Twenty inmates scream in their beds, but one… one is silent
An unusual case, this one: deluded, psychotic, then catatonic
The good doctor looks him up and down and smiles: It’s time for a game
Electricity is the prescription he needs, bring him back to society
Electricity is the cure that really needs, bring an empire to its knees
Inside his mind, sparks fly, vague memories of a caved in broken life
Inside his mind, sparks fly, vague memories of a caved in broken life
Electricity is the prescription he needs, bring him back to society
Electricity is the cure that he really needs, bring an empire to its knees
Make sure his arms are bound and all his pills go down
Make all his secrets drown, render his mind unsound
Inside his mind, sparks fly, vague memories of a caved in broken life
Inside his mind, sparks fly, vague memories of a caved in broken life
Electricity is the prescription he needs, bring him back to society
Electricity is the cure that he really needs, bring an empire to its knees
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Wow, thanks!
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Maybe Dr. X is a Queensryche ester egg? :P
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What a great song to wake up to on my Birthday. I love the slapping verse. Sounds awesome with Bass and Guitar slapping together.
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Single was okay. I like the mix and the instrumentation. I like the verses and instrumental section. Not a fan of the chorus at all.
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ariich where does this song rank on the album
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Rich, I loved seeing Ross rag on you about the lyrics on Facebook. Lol
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Rich, I loved seeing Ross rag on you about the lyrics on Facebook. Lol
Didn't see that! What did he say? :lol
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ariich where does this song rank on the album
Rather depends on what you like or don't like. :P
It's in the top half of the album for me (I probably slightly prefer Puzzle Box and Host), but it's also not really representative of the album other than production-wise. It's by far the most fun track, everything else is pretty serious (in Haken terms anyway, so there's obviously a certain playfulness particularly in instrumental sections, like all their stuff has).
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Saw an interesting theory on FB that the patient in this song is the main character from Visions
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Saw an interesting theory on FB that the patient in this song is the main character from Visions
Ooooh I like that theory.
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I am probably one of only a few that are going to try and hold out listening until the full album comes out late October. Looking forward to seeing Haken, Leprous and Bent Knee in Nashville.
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On the first listen, sounded like a decent song. Kind of reminded me of Initiate in that it sounds like a short song written to be a single, yet really lacks a hook. We'll see how it sounds after a few more listens...
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Rich, I loved seeing Ross rag on you about the lyrics on Facebook. Lol
Didn't see that! What did he say? :lol
He deleted his post! It was hilarious! It took a jab at you saying you were 80% correct and no too shabby. Lol
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That first verse is so awesome, I absolutely love the drum and bass and synth. That combo is deadly with a kind of funky 80s groove. I don't love the song (yet, just had my first listen and now my 2nd as writing this) but it's solid. After watching that keyboard video and hearing how this album would be heavy, this song seems to fit all that so I think there's hope this album is as advertised and will be really good. I'd say this is a much better single than Earthrise :metal
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I'd say this is a much better single than Earthrise :metal
I'm not sure if you're referring to my original comment to which some people agreed, but at least I (and I'm guessing the others) referred to the lead single of Affinity when making that statement, so Initiate. But that's a no-brainer for me since Initiate is one of my favourite Haken songs, Earthrise could very well be my least favourite Haken tune. :lol
If you weren't referring to that and were simply saying it's better than Earthrise: don't mind this comment
and also: couldn't agree more :lol
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So to sum is up for Train,
He agrees. :lol
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I like rambling on forever and avoiding the purpose of the comment king, makes my comment seem more substantial than it really is. :lol
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:lol
It felt like a run on sentence that could have been completed in two words. :lol
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I like rambling on forever and avoiding the purpose of the comment king, makes my comment seem more substantial than it really is. :lol
Or to put it another way:
"Shut up, you."
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I like rambling on forever and avoiding the purpose of the comment king, makes my comment seem more substantial than it really is. :lol
Or to put it another way:
"Shut up, you."
Be my lifecoach, you could save me a lot of time.
But part of what I do for a living currently involves writing bullshit, so this is a good place to practice!
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I'd say this is a much better single than Earthrise :metal
I'm not sure if you're referring to my original comment to which some people agreed, but at least I (and I'm guessing the others) referred to the lead single of Affinity when making that statement, so Initiate. But that's a no-brainer for me since Initiate is one of my favourite Haken songs, Earthrise could very well be my least favourite Haken tune. :lol
If you weren't referring to that and were simply saying it's better than Earthrise: don't mind this comment
and also: couldn't agree more :lol
I didn't even see your comment :lol but I didn't become a fan until Haken had already released Affinity and Earthrise was the top video if you youtubed Haken so I guess I had assumed that was their lead single for the album. I'll add, I like this song more than Initiate as well.
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I like rambling on forever and avoiding the purpose of the comment king, makes my comment seem more substantial than it really is. :lol
Or to put it another way:
"Shut up, you."
:lol. YES SIR!
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I like rambling on forever and avoiding the purpose of the comment king, makes my comment seem more substantial than it really is. :lol
Or to put it another way:
"Shut up, you."
Be my lifecoach, you could save me a lot of time.
But part of what I do for a living currently involves writing bullshit, so this is a good place to practice!
Whereas genuinely an important feature of my job is writing concisely. :lol
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I like rambling on forever and avoiding the purpose of the comment king, makes my comment seem more substantial than it really is. :lol
Or to put it another way:
"Shut up, you."
Be my lifecoach, you could save me a lot of time.
I sympathize,
with a lifecoach,
and a lifecoach
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A YouTube channel I subscribe to has already made an 8-bit version of The Good Doctor (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBc4RsC7UZo). It's pretty good
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The drums on this album sounds more organic, a huge improvement over the drum sound of Affinity
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The drums on this album sounds more organic, a huge improvement over the drum sound of Affinity
To be fair though, I think that drum sound was purely intentional (unlike the botch jobs we've seen in a couple of DT releases....which my ears don't hear as being that terrible, but I know most people talk about it).
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The main difference is that the previous albums were mixed by Jens Bogren, who is really really good, vs Vector, that was mixed by Nolly, aka the king of mixing drums in prog metal.
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The main difference is that the previous albums were mixed by Jens Bogren, who is really really good, vs Vector, that was mixed by Nolly, aka the king of mixing drums in prog metal.
That certainly it’s relevant.
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More insights on this after I speak with Rich and Charlie this afternoon. Thanks MinistroRaven for setting this up!
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So who is going to which European shows? I'm thinking I should just schedule a small vacation to see these guys on one of these gigs.
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London for me, obviously.
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With renewed vacation time I'll be at all the January dates.
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So who is going to which European shows? I'm thinking I should just schedule a small vacation to see these guys on one of these gigs.
Boerderij in the Netherlands. Possibly Copenhagen as well.
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With renewed vacation time I'll be at all the January dates.
That’s the South America tour. You’re doing that?
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With renewed vacation time I'll be at all the January dates.
That’s the South America tour. You’re doing that?
:lol No, forgot those were in January, I meant I'm hitting all the European shows in January, of which there are none.
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With a little luck I'm going to schedule a work trip to Ireland for the first full week in March and then take some time off while I'm over there and hit the Madrid, Paris, and London shows :hat
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I saw them when they came with TSF and blew my mind, but they have never toured South America playing Haken stuff which is why I'm so excited about this
And what a show that was :metal I'm sure those shows here were key for them to decide coming again as Haken... (and maybe they convinced Leprous, who knows)
Ok, very excited for this excellent news as well as for the single, which is great.. Also, the album lenght really surprised me.. Hope they are somehow teasing us with that.. :huh:
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Got the tickets for Montreal!! SO excited! :metal
Been getting into Leprous lately as well -- they have some really amazing stuff, and they're a good touring partner for Haken.
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Sadly I won't make it to the Toronto show because my wife will be out of town and I'll have to look after our daughter. If you live here you should definitely go - it's on Halloween night, and they're planning to wear costumes on stage!
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Does anybody know the configuration for the Highline show? Is it all GA, or will there be those idiotic tables up front with GA behind them?
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Does anybody know the configuration for the Highline show? Is it all GA, or will there be those idiotic tables up front with GA behind them?
Assuming it's done like last tour the furniture will be rearranged to the perimeter of the venue. Bill and I had our arms on the stage last time around and it only makes sense to have that setup again for this go round.
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Does anybody know the configuration for the Highline show? Is it all GA, or will there be those idiotic tables up front with GA behind them?
Assuming it's done like last tour the furniture will be rearranged to the perimeter of the venue. Bill and I had our arms on the stage last time around and it only makes sense to have that setup again for this go round.
Excellent. Thanks. When I was there a few years ago it was GA behind seats, which blows.
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Has anyone seen the video they posted? They're talking about the new album. But I don't wanna watch it because I don't want to listen to teasers and spoilers.
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Has anyone seen the video they posted? They're talking about the new album. But I don't wanna watch it because I don't want to listen to teasers and spoilers.
I did. No spoilers, but they play a few parts of The Good Doctor as background.
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Has anyone seen the video they posted? They're talking about the new album. But I don't wanna watch it because I don't want to listen to teasers and spoilers.
I saw it. Like gzarruk said, they play a few parts of The Good Doctor in the background and mostly just talk about the musical influences they had for the record (one band they mentioned in particular really excites me to see as an influence), though they don't refer to any particular songs on the album IIRC.
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Has anyone seen the video they posted? They're talking about the new album. But I don't wanna watch it because I don't want to listen to teasers and spoilers.
I did. No spoilers, but they play a few parts of The Good Doctor as background.
There is an interview with Diego on YouTube about this new keyboard he used on the album - avoid that video because there are what sounds like a lot of spoilers on that.
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Has anyone seen the video they posted? They're talking about the new album. But I don't wanna watch it because I don't want to listen to teasers and spoilers.
I did. No spoilers, but they play a few parts of The Good Doctor as background.
There is an interview with Diego on YouTube about this new keyboard he used on the album - avoid that video because there are what sounds like a lot of spoilers on that.
That's a great video to watch too, but definitely has some spoiler keyboard parts in it and they do sound glorious
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My take on the album after several listens, and without spoilers: what I like about Haken is definitely there and sounds great. And there is less of what I DON'T like about the band. All in all, Vector has the potential to be my favourite Haken album.
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Will be speaking with Conner on Friday, and I have a pretty heavy slate of questions already, but if someone has anything really good for him I'll try to slip it in.
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Will be speaking with Conner on Friday, and I have a pretty heavy slate of questions already, but if someone has anything really good for him I'll try to slip it in.
Could you ask him about the gear he used on the new album?
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Ask him if anybody else is a tea fanatic in the band like he is?
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Ask him if anybody else is a tea fanatic in the band like he is?
Didn’t know that! A bunch of British guys and the one American guy happens to be the tea fanatic? :lol
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Dammit, The Good Doctor is such a catchy awesome tune. I am suuuper :caffeine: for the album now!
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Ask him if anybody else is a tea fanatic in the band like he is?
Didn’t know that! A bunch of British guys and the one American guy happens to be the tea fanatic? :lol
Oh yeah. Funny right?! Lol
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Minute long video is up on the band's FB (evidently the first in a series) with about a minute of Puzzle Box. It sounds pretty damn awesome :metal
Also, because we all know this forum loves nuggets, the videos were "unearthed from the Mountview Institution Archives", and at the end of the video it flashes that it's copyright "The V.I.S.I.O.N.S. Institute" :omg:
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Looks like they’re going to release the song in 6 parts and we have to put them all together for it to be properly released, just like a puzzle box :tup
The song fragment sounds sick, btw :metal
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Looks like they’re going to release the song in 6 parts and we have to put them all together for it to be properly released, just like a puzzle box :tup
The song fragment sounds sick, btw :metal
I'm honestly hoping for a good troll and they just use the same audio in each video, just with a different member of the band trying to figure out the puzzle box.
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I'm assuming each one is a genuine vid of each band member attempting to solve that puzzle box. I wonder if one of them managed it and that'll be the sixth vid.
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Looks like they’re going to release the song in 6 parts and we have to put them all together for it to be properly released, just like a puzzle box :tup
The song fragment sounds sick, btw :metal
I'm honestly hoping for a good troll and they just use the same audio in each video, just with a different member of the band trying to figure out the puzzle box.
:rollin
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I was abstaining from listening to anything new until the album drops, but if they're putting in this sort of effort, I may as well take them up on it!
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Click to stare into the eyes of the promo photo used, stay to listen to the interview with Conner. :D
https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-conner-green/
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Thanks for all that insight on...tea...... I guess.
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Thanks for all that insight on...tea...... I guess.
You're welcome.
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Thanks for all that insight on...tea...... I guess.
Conner typically doesn't do interviews and specifically told me he isn't good at answering the typical new album stuff, so I put those items in there to make things more comfortable for him and allow him to talk about something he can more easily express, in hopes of making the final bit about Vector go easier for him.
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How about learning something personal about a musician you follow?
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For those who may be interested, Haken already put on youtube 5/6 of the song Puzzle Box and the right order (from my perception) to listen to the “test subjects” is: 3, 19, 4, 17 and 9. I guess is missing only the first 1/6 of the song. Very cool and different song so far!
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I'm just waiting for them to post the whole song already :lol
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I'm just waiting for them to post the whole song already :lol
This.. :lol
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Just to tease you both, I must say that these 5/6 of the song already released seem like a complete song! I guess it's the beauty of prog music... ;D
Can you really wait any longer?! ;)
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I'm just waiting for them to post the whole song already :lol
This.. :lol
Same, the whole puzzle is cool for those interested, but I just want the full song and not to play games personally. I watched one of the videos and just figured I'd wait for it to be done. But for everyone else that loves this stuff, that's great. I think its cool of the band to find new ways to premiere music, especially this way which makes it feel proggy in the release too.
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Yeah I haven't watched the puzzle videos at all. I'll just wait for the whole song instead.
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All 6 vids are now online. I assume they'll probably put something up that has the whole track sometime soon!
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All 6 vids are now online. I assume they'll probably put something up that has the whole track sometime soon!
Tomorrow probably cause Friday is usually new single day in Spotify and other streaming services.
Damn good song!! :2metal:
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Damn good song!! :2metal:
Yeah, Good Doctor and Puzzle Box are great so far. Super hyped for the album.
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Tomorrow can’t come soon enough :metal
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Sounds really really awesome so far!! I actually really like the atmospheric/electronic section in the middle. I can definitely hear the guitar-oriented riffs coming through as well. Almost like Affinity meets Visions.
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From the Wikipedia page:
(https://i.imgur.com/fAvAErn.png)
Which one of you did this :lol
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From the Wikipedia page:
(https://i.imgur.com/fAvAErn.png)
Which one of you did this :lol
I'm still not sure if they are instrumental or not. Would someone be able to clarify?
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Puzzle Box is on Spotify. Listened to it a couple times. Pretty much how I felt about the first track, solid instrumentation and the production sounds killer, but the vocals are a let down for me personally.
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Gave it a listen after work. It's not as immediate as The Good Doctor, it needs a couple of listens for me to grasp it all. But a fine track nonetheless.
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It's a nice track. The little instrumental in the middle throws me off a bit but the rest of the song is good.
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It's a nice track. The little instrumental in the middle throws me off a bit but the rest of the song is good.
Careful what you say about that electronic middle section. :P
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It's a nice track. The little instrumental in the middle throws me off a bit but the rest of the song is good.
Careful what you say about that electronic middle section. :P
:lol As with most of the material in the mountain, I don't enjoy when they go with prog just for the sake of prog and break the flow of the song. But since it's just a small part I think I can mostly ignore it in this song.
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Had a few listens of Puzzle Box today (finally without the breaks of switching videos) and wow, what a ride. Introducing it in parts did the song a disservice IMO.
The track is top notch, I didn't even notice the absence of guitar solos until I read about it.
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I really like that Haken did something a bit different structurally with Puzzle Box. They so often do some sort of chorus reprise, even after long proggy songs, that it was quite refreshing for them to do an ABABCDE structure in a way that flows well and feels tonally consistent even though themes aren't repeated (except the opening verses and choruses). I remember thinking something similar with DT's The Bigger Picture.
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I am liking this song WAY more than the first one.
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Puzzle Box is so damn good, just can't stop spinning it. It's gonna kick some serious ass live.
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It seems that Haken are going to release a vinyl LP with the 4 L-1VE bonus tracks recorded at Prog Power!
https://www.insideoutshop.de/Item/Haken_-_L-1VE_-black_LP-CD-/16496
I don't quite understand this release but Haken is always a no brainer for me.
I just hope they will release the "actual" L-1VE on vinyl too!
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Is the new song any good? I refuse to listen to it until I get the vinyl.
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Been killing me to sit on it, but finally, a review of the new album!: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/album-reviews/haken-vector/
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I liked the puzzle box waaay more than the good doctor
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Been killing me to sit on it, but finally, a review of the new album!: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/album-reviews/haken-vector/
Nice write up Nick!
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Been killing me to sit on it, but finally, a review of the new album!: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/album-reviews/haken-vector/
Nice write up Nick!
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You didn't credit your peer reviewer! ;)
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You didn't credit your peer reviewer! ;)
I don't know what you're talking about, it's clearly there. :D
I'm a dumbass, and thank you!
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Been killing me to sit on it, but finally, a review of the new album!: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/album-reviews/haken-vector/
Nice write up Nick!
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Been killing me to sit on it, but finally, a review of the new album!: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/album-reviews/haken-vector/
The hype is getting serious now. :caffeine:
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https://progreport.com/haken-vector-album-review/
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It seems that Haken are going to release a vinyl LP with the 4 L-1VE bonus tracks recorded at Prog Power!
https://www.insideoutshop.de/Item/Haken_-_L-1VE_-black_LP-CD-/16496
I don't quite understand this release but Haken is always a no brainer for me.
I just hope they will release the "actual" L-1VE on vinyl too!
I'm just gonna repost this here since it was completely ignored and I'm not sure if it was just overseen between all the Puzzle Box hype :lol
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It seems that Haken are going to release a vinyl LP with the 4 L-1VE bonus tracks recorded at Prog Power!
https://www.insideoutshop.de/Item/Haken_-_L-1VE_-black_LP-CD-/16496
I don't quite understand this release but Haken is always a no brainer for me.
I just hope they will release the "actual" L-1VE on vinyl too!
I'm just gonna repost this here since it was completely ignored and I'm not sure if it was just overseen between all the Puzzle Box hype :lol
I saw it, but release date says July 12, so it seems it has already been released.
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It seems that Haken are going to release a vinyl LP with the 4 L-1VE bonus tracks recorded at Prog Power!
https://www.insideoutshop.de/Item/Haken_-_L-1VE_-black_LP-CD-/16496
I don't quite understand this release but Haken is always a no brainer for me.
I just hope they will release the "actual" L-1VE on vinyl too!
I'm just gonna repost this here since it was completely ignored and I'm not sure if it was just overseen between all the Puzzle Box hype :lol
I saw it, but release date says July 12, so it seems it has already been released.
notsureifserious
That's the European store, so the date is 7th December.
Silly Yank. :P
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Where is the preorder for the deluxe edition? Isn’t there a bundle or something?
The official site only has the VIP upgrades in their store, and Amazon is only listing the CD by itself.
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It seems that Haken are going to release a vinyl LP with the 4 L-1VE bonus tracks recorded at Prog Power!
https://www.insideoutshop.de/Item/Haken_-_L-1VE_-black_LP-CD-/16496
I don't quite understand this release but Haken is always a no brainer for me.
I just hope they will release the "actual" L-1VE on vinyl too!
I'm just gonna repost this here since it was completely ignored and I'm not sure if it was just overseen between all the Puzzle Box hype :lol
I saw it, but release date says July 12, so it seems it has already been released.
notsureifserious
That's the European store, so the date is 7th December.
Silly Yank. :P
Took me a while to understand what you meant :rollin
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Nice review Nick, I echo a lot of those sentiments.
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Where is the preorder for the deluxe edition? Isn’t there a bundle or something?
The official site only has the VIP upgrades in their store, and Amazon is only listing the CD by itself.
I don't think there are deluxe editions for Vector. Just multiple colored vinyls, 2CD digipack case, 2CD mediabook and 1CD jewel.
https://www.lasercd.com/search_results?fulltext=haken
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I was supposed to review this album, but I just can't. I find it almost impossible to find enough positive things to say to outweigh how much of a chore this is to listen to.
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I was supposed to review this album, but I just can't. I find it almost impossible to find enough positive things to say to outweigh how much of a chore this is to listen to.
(https://scifanatic-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/facepalm-head.jpg)
I've never been closer to a blaze of glory ban of your account in which you then get back in as an admin and ban me forever.
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Sorry to disappoint. :lol Honestly, I've really been trying to get into this album for the better part of a month. But I just find it to be...awful. Sorry.
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I was supposed to review this album, but I just can't. I find it almost impossible to find enough positive things to say to outweigh how much of a chore this is to listen to.
Were you a fan previously?
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No. I have never really liked them. But this is the first time I have REALLY focused for a sustained period of time on their music. So if you are a fan, please do NOT take this as an indictment against this particular album. I can't say it is any better or worse than their prior work.
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I've been trying to get into them for years too, Bosk. I should give it another try when the new album drops.
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I was supposed to review this album, but I just can't. I find it almost impossible to find enough positive things to say to outweigh how much of a chore this is to listen to.
Let me review it for you. I'd be glad to help :angel:
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I love both The Good Doctor and Puzzle Box so far. Can't wait for my preorder to arrive.
That being said, Haken isn't for everyone, and I don't mean this in a condenscending way. My best friend, who's also into rock and metal—I introduced him to a lot of artists from Steven Wilson to Ayreon to Agalloch—likes most of the prog metal I send his way, but just can't stand Haken for some reason.
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That being said, Haken isn't for everyone, and I don't mean this in a condenscending way.
Agreed. It took me awhile to get into them, mostly the vocals really and not his voice, but style that I had to ease into.
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I've been trying to get into them for years too, Bosk. I should give it another try when the new album drops.
Ditto, I usually try to get into their new stuff when it's released, but none of it has had real staying power with me.
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Even though I am a much bigger fan now than I was a couple years ago, I am still having difficulty with this new stuff. Ross' voice just never hits me in a good way at first, but I get there eventually most of the time.
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Sometimes, the answer to why someone doesn't like something just boils down to, "I don't like it," and it may be difficult to quantify specific reasons. There is definitely some of that going on. But here is what I can definitely say:
As with a lot of progressive metal, there is a lot that is so complex that it can feel a-tonal, a-rhythmic, and/or not melodic. When you take the time to understand it in context of what the band is doing, the complexity often falls away and it just works. With Haken, I find all of those elements to be present, and it does NOT work for me. To compound the problem, I find the vocals to be especially grating, which REALLY distracts me from the music and from possibly getting the music. Not sure whether I worded that in a way that makes sense, but that's my best effort.
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You don't like Haken, and that's fine. Different people like different things. While your reasons might not make sense to me or others, if they make sense to you, that's all that matters. It is just music after all.
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Sometimes, the answer to why someone doesn't like something just boils down to, "I don't like it," and it may be difficult to quantify specific reasons. There is definitely some of that going on. But here is what I can definitely say:
As with a lot of progressive metal, there is a lot that is so complex that it can feel a-tonal, a-rhythmic, and/or not melodic. When you take the time to understand it in context of what the band is doing, the complexity often falls away and it just works. With Haken, I find all of those elements to be present, and it does NOT work for me. To compound the problem, I find the vocals to be especially grating, which REALLY distracts me from the music and from possibly getting the music. Not sure whether I worded that in a way that makes sense, but that's my best effort.
I think you've just put in words exactly my feelings about this band. The closest I've come to liking them was with The Mountain.
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You don't like Haken, and that's fine. Different people like different things. While your reasons might not make sense to me or others, if they make sense to you, that's all that matters. It is just music after all.
TL;DR: TASTES!
Although I do find it encouraging in terms of Haken's status and reach that quite a number of people appear to follow this thread who aren't even fans.
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I feel that alot of new prog bands have a tendency to write more and more complex songs and out do themselfs with every new release. Not saying that's a bad thing but to me Puzzle Box feels forcefully complex almost like "let's put all our crazy ideas into one song". Again that dosen't mean it couldn't be a good song but that's what Puzzle Box feels like to me. A bit too much of everything. I feel Ross's voice don't really suite that kind of music with lots of rythmic vocal lines.
With that being I only heard the song a few times so hopefully my opinion might change.
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I get that feeling with the first metrically weird section, but those after flow very well imo.
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I feel that alot of new prog bands have a tendency to write more and more complex songs and out do themselfs with every new release. Not saying that's a bad thing but to me Puzzle Box feels forcefully complex almost like "let's put all our crazy ideas into one song". Again that dosen't mean it couldn't be a good song but that's what Puzzle Box feels like to me. A bit too much of everything. I feel Ross's voice don't really suite that kind of music with lots of rythmic vocal lines.
With that being I only heard the song a few times so hopefully my opinion might change.
Interesting, I really don't find Puzzle Box especially complex, other than that one manic section after the ambient bit. The "truth or deception" bit is quite odd rhythmically, but no more so than a lot of Haken's music, the interesting rhythms has been their staple all along really. Otherwise the song is all pretty straightforward, and structurally not very complex (ABABCDE, essentially).
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Well, I won't listen to the new album until it's released so I can't say if it's good or not. Based on all their previous releases, I expect it to be good even if it takes me 10 spins to get into it. I really don't see how someone can be a DT fan and not like Haken. Makes no sense. I think ya'll just missed the boat. :p
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Even though I am a much bigger fan now than I was a couple years ago, I am still having difficulty with this new stuff. Ross' voice just never hits me in a good way at first, but I get there eventually most of the time.
Same for me. It takes some time to really appreciate their new stuff mainly because Ross' voice isn't really my thing.
In the end I get there and they are one of my favorite bands right now.
Really looking forward to this release
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Well, I won't listen to the new album until it's released so I can't say if it's good or not. Based on all their previous releases, I expect it to be good even if it takes me 10 spins to get into it. I really don't see how someone can be a DT fan and not like Haken. Makes no sense. I think ya'll just missed the boat. :p
This for me.
I mean, starting with The Mountain they started to become more of their own thing. But the first 2 albums (Visions in particular) are SOOOO much like Dream Theater that it borders on derivative. But they manage to be talented enough to outshine their own hero-worship.
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My biggest difficulty really getting behind Haken despite being a bring Dream Theater fan is the same thing that Nekov brought up a little while back, where a lot of the time it feels like the band just decides to throw some goofy section into an otherwise straight-faced song just for the sake of being goofy and kill the flow / mood of the song. That's why out of all their albums Affinity and Visions are my favorite, since the song structures feel a lot more mature and refined to me, and there's a lot less "LOL RANDOM JAZZ / CIRCUS MUSIC / WEIRD KEYBOARD NOISES / CHIPTUNE SECTION". Visions has a little bit of that with the goofy-sounding vocals in parts of the title track, but the only other instance I can think of is the chiptune break in Insomnia, which at least is short and sets up the next section quite well. Affinity is, in my opinion, their best album by far because each song feels very maturely-written and keeps consistent with its own aesthetic and mood throughout. Going back to The Mountain (which I'm not a big fan of), Cockroach King is actually my favorite song on that album because the song as a whole is goofy, so the random musical sections fit the mood and don't feel out of place. Whereas in say, Atlas Stone, that silly jazzy bit after the first chorus completely ruins the soaring, pretty atmosphere that the song was establishing up to that point.
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^^^ I actually agree with everything you said, except that I think Falling Back to Earth is TM's best song... and, well, that I am a fan of the band..
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I'm a fan of the band too. I'm seeing them live next month and I'm really excited (having Leprous there is a big plus too). I'm just not as big of a fan as a lot of people on here! :lol
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lol I misread that then...
But I count myself in that group of people either way :lol..
Can't wait to see them live too... for first time in January!.. (same for Leprous, in March) :caffeine:
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My biggest difficulty really getting behind Haken despite being a bring Dream Theater fan is the same thing that Nekov brought up a little while back, where a lot of the time it feels like the band just decides to throw some goofy section into an otherwise straight-faced song just for the sake of being goofy and kill the flow / mood of the song. That's why out of all their albums Affinity and Visions are my favorite, since the song structures feel a lot more mature and refined to me, and there's a lot less "LOL RANDOM JAZZ / CIRCUS MUSIC / WEIRD KEYBOARD NOISES / CHIPTUNE SECTION". Visions has a little bit of that with the goofy-sounding vocals in parts of the title track, but the only other instance I can think of is the chiptune break in Insomnia, which at least is short and sets up the next section quite well. Affinity is, in my opinion, their best album by far because each song feels very maturely-written and keeps consistent with its own aesthetic and mood throughout. Going back to The Mountain (which I'm not a big fan of), Cockroach King is actually my favorite song on that album because the song as a whole is goofy, so the random musical sections fit the mood and don't feel out of place. Whereas in say, Atlas Stone, that silly jazzy bit after the first chorus completely ruins the soaring, pretty atmosphere that the song was establishing up to that point.
I agree completely.
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What fascinates me is that the people who don't care for Haken generally cite the same two reasons. They don't like the singer and they feel like there's pointless wankery. Those are my two biggest problem with DT. Haken to me is a big improvement. I suspect my bewilderment for the people who adore DT and don't get Haken is pretty evenly reciprocated. Eh, there are some weird people in the world. SMH
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James LaBrie in his prime is way above anything I expect Ross Jennings to achieve, but in terms of prog-wankery DT are the worse offenders IMO.
The weird sections of Haken songs may seem jarring at first but I always find them refreshing in the flow of the album. I can't say the same about Rudess' wankery and his solo tradeoffs with Petrucci.
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The weird sections of Haken songs may seem jarring at first but I always find them refreshing in the flow of the album. I can't say the same about Rudess' wankery and his solo tradeoffs with Petrucci.
I find the wankery in Haken more interesting and original than in DT. The wankery in DT has become very predictable as me7 said.
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James LaBrie in his prime is way above anything I expect Ross Jennings to achieve, but in terms of prog-wankery DT are the worse offenders IMO.
I totally agree with both points.
Jennings cannot touch LaBrie when it comes to greatness as a singer (in the studio).
And I have never thought Haken was that wanky. Maybe it's because their wankery comes in the form of full band rhythmic blast-offs, as opposed to long sections with trading solos being a regular thing.
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Here's Rodrigo Altaf latest interview. This time with Charlie Griffiths from Haken.
Enjoy.
https://lotsofmuzic.weebly.com/home/each-album-is-its-own-fresh-start-and-you-shouldnt-compare-it-to-what-weve-done-before-charlie-griffiths-of-haken-talks-about-their-new-album-vector
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What fascinates me is that the people who don't care for Haken generally cite the same two reasons. They don't like the singer and they feel like there's pointless wankery. Those are my two biggest problem with DT. Haken to me is a big improvement.
I think it might be fair to say that in Haken, generally, the wankery is more of a "here's some completely different musical style that you didn't expect" sort, while in DT it's generally more of a "here's a bunch of fast solos and some weird time signatures" thing. And then some people would prefer one or the other.
FWIW, between the two bands, I prefer Dream Theater. I think James is a stronger singer, I like that the keyboards have a stronger lead presence (whether it's KM, DS or JR), and I think DT's catalogue captures a greater range of styles and moods that line up with what I see as significant (while it's possible that could change as Haken's discography grows, I would say the same thing if DT's discography only included WDADU/IAW/Awake/ACOS/FII—four albums and an EP, the same as Haken's pre-Vector).
But that isn't to sell Haken short at all. I would put The Mountain and Aquarius right up among the top 4 or so DT albums. And I would actually disagree that Aquarius feels derivative of DT. That album has a distinct style all of its own. With Visions, I think the comparison has some real legitimacy.
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And I would actually disagree that Aquarius feels derivative of DT. That album has a distinct style all of its own. With Visions, I think the comparison has some real legitimacy.
I agree with this. There are a few DT moments on Aquarius, but it definitely has its own style.
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Rudess has a stronger lead presence (for better or worse) but what Tejeida does for the music in the background with his tasteful patches is IMO unparalleled in the modern prog world.
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Oh, Tejada does some awesome stuff for sure. I think it's again a matter of preference in terms of which approach one prefers. I just happen to prefer DT's.
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First listen of Puzzle Box I thought it was kind of annoying but I'm starting to enjoy it, could've been shorter though but the chorus is :hefdaddy but I probably like The Good Doctor even better. This album is shaping up pretty nicely
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The weird sections of Haken songs may seem jarring at first but I always find them refreshing in the flow of the album. I can't say the same about Rudess' wankery and his solo tradeoffs with Petrucci.
I find the wankery in Haken more interesting and original than in DT. The wankery in DT has become very predictable as me7 said.
Besides the fact that I hate the word "wankery" (is an insulting word and concept to the musician and the people that actually likes those sections, where I personally focus on the riffs so I don't care about the million per seconds notes nonsense anyways)... I've always felt that the predictable band regarding these kind of sections is Haken.. They not only seem to create those sections just for the sake of it, but some of the riffs beneath the solos are very inspired in DT riffs.. The vibe of some sections sounds so similar... The same happens with BtBaM.. It's like they're trying to imitate (or maybe doing a homage, who knows, to) sections that are some of DT's quintessences..
When DT does it, maybe it could sometimes be like a little repetitive, but it feels anyways right because it sounds like them... when another band tries to do what they do, it feels a bit awkward... Not saying I don't like those sections.. I like them.. But every time I'm listening to them I think more in DT and the inspiration they gave to others band than the band that I'm actually listening to..
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James LaBrie in his prime is way above anything I expect Ross Jennings to achieve, but in terms of prog-wankery DT are the worse offenders IMO.
I totally agree with both points.
Jennings cannot touch LaBrie when it comes to greatness as a singer (in the studio).
And I have never thought Haken was that wanky. Maybe it's because their wankery comes in the form of full band rhythmic blast-offs, as opposed to long sections with trading solos being a regular thing.
JLB is certainly the more gifted singer. Yet I'll happily trade a reasonable amount of talent to get to somebody that I don't find shrill and annoying. The criticism I hear of Jennings is that he's bland or generic. Compared to JLB that's very definitely true, but under the circumstances I'm obviously cool with that. Where I will give JLB props is for being the more expressive of the two. Jennings couldn't pull of SDoIT. By and large I'd take RJ any day, but he does limit the band somewhat with what they can do. JLB's versatility gives them opportunities that Haken won't get.
As for the wankery (and that is the most applicable term), with Haken I often find it to be stylistically linked to the story in some way. That's a good thing. It never seems to be there simply because that's what the fanbase expects.
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Jennings is his own thing. He’s the modern day Jon Anderson, and you either dig that style, or you don’t. Lots of people don’t like JA either.
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Jennings is his own thing. He’s the modern day Jon Anderson, and you either dig that style, or you don’t. Lots of people don’t like JA either.
He's far more annoying to me than Jon Anderson, but I get the analogy.
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I don’t understand how Ross’ voice can be annoying to some of you, it’s fine to me and it works well with Haken’s music. Don’t like when he growls, but I’m glad it’s only happened on a couple songs.
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He has a distinctive way of pronouncing some words. Particularly, it sometimes sounds like he's inserting an "R" sound into places where there is no "R" (I feel like this tendency has reduced over time). I can see how that would bother some people, though it does not bother me.
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I've never understood the criticism over Jennings' voice. At least it's not ridiculous like the bloke from ACDC or Axl Rose or whoever. It's a somewhat neutral, but still unique voice, absolutely perfect for Haken.
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I've never had issues with vocals in Haken. It sounds like your typical progressive metal singer. And I don't mean typical in a negative way, it's more that I don't find it any more different or controversial than other singers in the genre.
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I've never had any issue with Ross' vocals either. And I'm usually very picky when it comes to the vocals whenever I'm getting into a new band.
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He has a certain tone that still makes me wince (like when he sings the line "free from your burden" during Falling Back to Earth's chorus), but those moments are rare enough that I can deal with them. And he does the background/wordless stuff really well. The instrumental section in the middle of Celestial Elixir is still the greatest section of music they've ever done and his wordless singing at the very end is fantastic.
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The second half of Drowning in the Flood is among my favorite vocal moments in prog history.
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The second half of Drowning in the Flood is among my favorite vocal moments in prog history.
Same! The "will we live to tell the taaaaale?" Part is SO good. The really low, powerful guitar there really brings it to another level too.
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Generic? Typical? I can’t think of a single singer that sounds like him.
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Generic? Typical? I can’t think of a single singer that sounds like him.
This. Ross' voice is unique imo.
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Generic? Typical? I can’t think of a single singer that sounds like him.
This. Ross' voice is unique imo.
Same. I really don't think he has a typical prog/metal voice.
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I've just come to say that The Mountain is still the best album I've ever listened to, my mind has not changed for the last 5 years.
About the new stuff, I like The Good Doctor as a single, but Puzzle Box is just OK for me, it's like they've written it in auto mode. They can do much better, for sure.
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I just listened to Puzzle Box for the first time and I really enjoyed it. I can't wait for the new album, I really need something new to listen to these days. So excited to see them in NYC in less than a month :metal
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He has a distinctive way of pronouncing some words. Particularly, it sometimes sounds like he's inserting an "R" sound into places where there is no "R" (I feel like this tendency has reduced over time).
That's probably because British people don't usually pronounce r's and he's trying to cater to the American audience :P
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Wait...British people don’t pronounce R’s?
People who come from gReat bRiton don’t pronounce R’s?
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Wait...British people don’t pronounce R’s?
People who come from gReat bRiton don’t pronounce R’s?
They pronounce less r's than American people do. Have Arich send you an audio of him saying, car, care, nurse, poor and you'll see :P
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I just listened to Puzzle Box for the first time and I really enjoyed it. I can't wait for the new album, I really need something new to listen to these days. So excited to see them in NYC in less than a month :metal
:metal I can't believe how quickly this is coming up, definitely looking forward to binging the album before the show
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Wait...British people don’t pronounce R’s?
People who come from gReat bRiton don’t pronounce R’s?
They pronounce less r's than American people do. Have Arich send you an audio of him saying, car, care, nurse, poor and you'll see :P
This isn't quite correct. It's true for some accents (like BBC English and most other accents from south east England). But most other regional accents have quite strong pronounciations of Rs, even in words that don't have Rs in them. The west country in particular is famous for it.
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Wait...British people don’t pronounce R’s?
People who come from gReat bRiton don’t pronounce R’s?
They pronounce less r's than American people do. Have Arich send you an audio of him saying, car, care, nurse, poor and you'll see :P
This isn't quite correct. It's true for some accents (like BBC English and most other accents from south east England). But most other regional accents have quite strong pronounciations of Rs, even in words that don't have Rs in them. The west country in particular is famous for it.
Hmmm, I had no idear.
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Also, British people are no fun.....
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Fritzinger review of the new album was published today at LotsOfMuzik:
https://lotsofmuzic.weebly.com/home/effortlessly-skipping-every-prog-cliche-our-review-of-hakens-new-album-vektor
:metal
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Fritzinger review of the new album was published today at LotsOfMuzik:
https://lotsofmuzic.weebly.com/home/effortlessly-skipping-every-prog-cliche-our-review-of-hakens-new-album-vektor
:metal
Good review! :metal
One factual error though - it states that Clear has no motifs that appear in the rest of the album, but that's incorrect. Clear largely features a theme from Host.
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Now THAT's a well written review.
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I just realized that Rex, the name of the doctor, means "king" in Latin. The retcon is strong in this one.
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I'm really hoping I can make the Denver show, if tickets don't sell out a week before they play. Finally listened to The Puzzle Box and I feel it'll really rock live. Gonna Pre-order Vector now.
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Now THAT's a well written review.
Thanks a lot :)
Fritzinger review of the new album was published today at LotsOfMuzik:
https://lotsofmuzic.weebly.com/home/effortlessly-skipping-every-prog-cliche-our-review-of-hakens-new-album-vektor
:metal
Good review! :metal
One factual error though - it states that Clear has no motifs that appear in the rest of the album, but that's incorrect. Clear largely features a theme from Host.
Shame on me, I've listened to the whole thing about 50 times now and never realised that!! :facepalm:
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I know those stickers are removable (thank goodness), but whyyyy did IO feel the need to stick Portnoy's over-the-top Instagram quote on there? :facepalm:
Also, after the disaster that was the last couple of IO albums not actually being released on the day they were supposed to, I'm approaching Oct 26th with some trepidation. I wish it wasn't that way, but since IO sold out to Sony things haven't been the same. See what happens when you sell out? I don't know whether I should preorder online or try and get it from my local on the day.
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I know those stickers are removable (thank goodness), but whyyyy did IO feel the need to stick Portnoy's over-the-top Instagram quote on there? :facepalm:
Also, after the disaster that was the last couple of IO albums not actually being released on the day they were supposed to, I'm approaching Oct 26th with some trepidation. I wish it wasn't that way, but since IO sold out to Sony things haven't been the same. See what happens when you sell out? I don't know whether I should preorder online or try and get it from my local on the day.
Because Mike Portnoy is a big name in the Prog-Metal business.. Don't like it either, but I think it's an understandable move by the label.
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I know those stickers are removable (thank goodness), but whyyyy did IO feel the need to stick Portnoy's over-the-top Instagram quote on there? :facepalm:
What sticker?
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https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vector-Limited-2CD-Mediabook-Haken/dp/B07G1YHMQ4/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1539613625&sr=1-1&keywords=haken+vector (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vector-Limited-2CD-Mediabook-Haken/dp/B07G1YHMQ4/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1539613625&sr=1-1&keywords=haken+vector)
Look at the second or third picture of the CDs. The black sticker in the corner.
Meanwhile, I find now there is a standard CD version available. I'm not spending 3 extra quid for a disc I'll probably never play (ie. the instrumental disc).
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I kinda like stuff like that.
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https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vector-Limited-2CD-Mediabook-Haken/dp/B07G1YHMQ4/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1539613625&sr=1-1&keywords=haken+vector (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vector-Limited-2CD-Mediabook-Haken/dp/B07G1YHMQ4/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1539613625&sr=1-1&keywords=haken+vector)
Look at the second or third picture of the CDs. The black sticker in the corner.
Meanwhile, I find now there is a standard CD version available. I'm not spending 3 extra quid for a disc I'll probably never play (ie. the instrumental disc).
Oh. IC
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I know those stickers are removable (thank goodness), but whyyyy did IO feel the need to stick Portnoy's over-the-top Instagram quote on there? :facepalm:
Also, after the disaster that was the last couple of IO albums not actually being released on the day they were supposed to, I'm approaching Oct 26th with some trepidation. I wish it wasn't that way, but since IO sold out to Sony things haven't been the same. See what happens when you sell out? I don't know whether I should preorder online or try and get it from my local on the day.
Because Mike Portnoy is a big name in the Prog-Metal business.. Don't like it either, but I think it's an understandable move by the label.
Also SOA is also an IO band, therefore cross promotion. Anyone who doesn't know SOA who reads that and thinks "What's Opus Maximus?" could potentially look it up, they may very well like SOA, and then buy their album.
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But usually those stickers have proper reviews on them from serious magazine reviews, not gushing Instagram comments.
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But usually those stickers have proper reviews on them from serious magazine reviews, not gushing Instagram comments.
Actually they normally don't have a review at all as they're produced before any reviews are published. Normally they just have promo info like "Latest masterpiece from the masters of prog, featuring the single The Good Doctor" or whatever. I agree this one is a bit weird, to be honest. Feel like it could put off as many people as it attracts! :lol
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I watched the Puzzle Box video on YouTube for the first time. Bizzare!! :omg: It may take a while to wrap my head around that one.
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Haha, what an odd thing to put a Portnoy quote on the cover. Personally, I find it amusing and harmless.
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Haha, what an odd thing to put a Portnoy quote on the cover. Personally, I find it amusing and harmless.
I believe it is not the first time Inside Out uses a Portnoy quote. I think Spock’s Beard Snow had one as well (comparing it to The Who’s Tommy IIRC).
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Wait...British people don’t pronounce R’s?
People who come from gReat bRiton don’t pronounce R’s?
They pronounce less r's than American people do. Have Arich send you an audio of him saying, car, care, nurse, poor and you'll see :P
This isn't quite correct. It's true for some accents (like BBC English and most other accents from south east England). But most other regional accents have quite strong pronounciations of Rs, even in words that don't have Rs in them. The west country in particular is famous for it.
Completely OT, of course, but if anyone is interested in learning more, look up rhotic vs non-rhotic accents.
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Haha, what an odd thing to put a Portnoy quote on the cover. Personally, I find it amusing and harmless.
I agree, I find it odd, amusing, and harmless. That said, I'm far more interested in what's below the MP quote on the sticker (Nolly mixed the album). That's sticker worthy stuff.
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They even put the Opus Maximus reference on the sticker :facepalm:
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Haha, what an odd thing to put a Portnoy quote on the cover. Personally, I find it amusing and harmless.
I agree, I find it odd, amusing, and harmless. That said, I'm far more interested in what's below the MP quote on the sticker (Nolly mixed the album). That's sticker worthy stuff.
Yeah, that's something that's cool, hype-worthy, and you know, actually relevant to the release. :lol
Really glad Nolly is getting so much recognition for his mixing skills (especially since leaving Periphery and being able to devote all his time to), in my opinion he does the best mixes for modern prog metal releases right now, never heard a bad sounding album by him.
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Yeah, that's something that's cool, hype-worthy, and you know, actually relevant to the release. :lol
Yeah for real :lol
Really glad Nolly is getting so much recognition for his mixing skills (especially since leaving Periphery and being able to devote all his time to), in my opinion he does the best mixes for modern prog metal releases right now, never heard a bad sounding album by him.
Yup, I totally agree. For my money, he's the best in the business right now for modern metal.
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Here's another one for you, it just came up on YT a few minutes ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNT_9mmQaS8
Track 7 (closing track) on the album
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Dayum, they've released videos for half the album.
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Dayum, they've released videos for half the album.
as Steven Wilson did for To The Bone last year. That seems to be "normal" nowadays.
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Didn't Metallica even release videos for ALL of their songs off Hardwired?
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Periphery did also release all songs before the release date with PIII: Select Difficult
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Just listened to A Cell Divides... Eh, didn't really do anything for me. Still can't get into the vocals and the music didn't really go anywhere.
I really wish I could get into this band more, on paper they check so many boxes for me, I just haven't connected with their stuff.
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Just listened to A Cell Divides... Eh, didn't really do anything for me. Still can't get into the vocals and the music didn't really go anywhere.
I have no problems with the vocals, but the rest I agree with.
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People (even the band) keep saying they have half the album out, but by running time it's actually only 37%.
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People (even the band) keep saying they have half the album out, but by running time it's actually only 37%.
If you round that up to 50%, that's half of the album.
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It does seem to be a trend of bands releasing a lot more music before album release date now a days.
Song is pretty cool. These music videos have been pretty bad though. Sucks because I thought the videos for the Affinity songs were pretty cool, but these look lazy and boring.
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Sucks because I thought the videos for the Affinity songs were pretty cool, but these look lazy and boring.
*remembers Earthrise video*
Er....
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People (even the band) keep saying they have half the album out, but by running time it's actually only 37%.
If you round that up to 50%, that's half of the album.
:lol
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I listened to The Good Doctor when it first came out...once. And I’ve already forgotten it.
I remember really liking it, but I really want the album to be a fresh experience, so I’ve been avoiding all the other releases completely. Only one more week!!!
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People (even the band) keep saying they have half the album out, but by running time it's actually only 37%.
If you round that up to 50%, that's half of the album.
:lol
:lolSucks because I thought the videos for the Affinity songs were pretty cool, but these look lazy and boring.
*remembers Earthrise video*
Er....
And I had to go and watch it...never though that song could get taken down a notch, but there ya go...the whole time I'm just all "Ross...please just stop..." :lol
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I had no issue with the Earthrise video, it was the first thing I saw/listened to by them. Didn't love it immediately either, but it wasn't a turn off for me.
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It was a fun 80's style video. It poked fun of that style of videos in the 80's. What's not to like about it?
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I inmediately loved TGD and Puzzle Box, but the new song does nothing for me :-\ hope it gets better with more listens. Right now it just sounds like Haken trying to become Leprous.
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It was a fun 80's style video. It poked fun of that style of videos in the 80's. What's not to like about it?
Ross' poses are just cringe-worthy. Not Billy Squire bad, bud on there way.
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It was a fun 80's style video. It poked fun of that style of videos in the 80's. What's not to like about it?
Ross' poses are just cringe-worthy. Not Billy Squire bad, bud on there way.
Just think how many time you had to see that Squire video on MTV back in the day. LOL
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I'm curious—do we know for sure whether Haken will be the de facto headliners in the upcoming shows, i.e., closing the shows, or whether they will be alternating? Though I've seen it done both ways before, and though I'd personally prefer to see Leprous finish the night off when I see them, my impression is that Haken has the larger US audience.
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I've enjoyed all 3 songs so far. Pre-saved it on Spotify. I hope I could catch them this tour. Only time available is the Phoenix show, I doubt I'll make the Denver show. The thing about the Phoenix show is Leprous is playing a headline show the night before.
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I'm curious—do we know for sure whether Haken will be the de facto headliners in the upcoming shows, i.e., closing the shows, or whether they will be alternating? Though I've seen it done both ways before, and though I'd personally prefer to see Leprous finish the night off when I see them, my impression is that Haken has the larger US audience.
My thoughts exactly. With so many "bubbles of thought" these days, caused by the social networks algorithms, it's easy to have a wrong perception about things, but my impression is that Haken are MUCH more popular and talked about than Leprous.
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I have no idea who is or isn't more popular, but Leprous has a youtube video with 1.7 million views, a million more than Haken's best video. Judging by shows listed on setlist.fm both bands have played around 50 times in the US as well. Leprous is new to me, but it seems like they are on fairly even ground with maybe an argument for Leprous actually? I'd love to know for sure who is headlining the NYC show.
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I listened to The Good Doctor when it first came out...once. And I’ve already forgotten it.
I remember really liking it, but I really want the album to be a fresh experience, so I’ve been avoiding all the other releases completely. Only one more week!!!
That's been my impression with all three songs they've released. :lol :lol
Listened to each once, thought they were all okay, and didn't feel the need to revisit any of them again since. Oh well, I will get the whole album next week and see how it is.
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I've recently been spinning The Good doctor like crazy, it's ridiculously infections. However, I decided not to catch up with other singles, given that the album will be relatively short. Friday couldn't come any slower, though.
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First impression: best two songs on the album are GD and PB.. This is not to say I didn't like the album (it's Haken after all), and I feel it'll grow on me.. :metal
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I'm quite amazed that The Good Doctor hasn't got its hooks firmly implanted in some of you.
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Yeah, me too.. It totally rocks.. :metal
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I'm avoiding listening to any of it until the album comes out. I want that nice clean first listen-through.
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I like some hear have listened to all the singles but only a couple times each. I didn't want to spoil the flow of the album, but also didn't want to miss out on a solid taste of it. I found The Good Doctor to be my favorite of the three songs so far, but that could change with more listens.
I've been listening to Leprous a lot to check them out before the show in a couple weeks, but once this new album comes out it'll be time to binge that.
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It seems that Haken are going to release a vinyl LP with the 4 L-1VE bonus tracks recorded at Prog Power!
https://www.insideoutshop.de/Item/Haken_-_L-1VE_-black_LP-CD-/16496
I don't quite understand this release but Haken is always a no brainer for me.
I just hope they will release the "actual" L-1VE on vinyl too!
I'm just gonna repost this here since it was completely ignored and I'm not sure if it was just overseen between all the Puzzle Box hype :lol
Since the new album seems to have overshadowed any attention to the upcoming release of L+1VE, I'm bumping this reply up so I can see if anyone knows where I can order this set within the US so I don't have to pay ridiculous amounts of shipping. I'd really like to get this, mostly because of the CD, unless the band are willing to sell the four tracks as a digital set. I saw one listing on Amazon for the vinyl, but it's not listed as being Available, so I'm not sure if they'll even get it. There isn't even a price listed.
-Marc.
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It seems that Haken are going to release a vinyl LP with the 4 L-1VE bonus tracks recorded at Prog Power!
https://www.insideoutshop.de/Item/Haken_-_L-1VE_-black_LP-CD-/16496
I don't quite understand this release but Haken is always a no brainer for me.
I just hope they will release the "actual" L-1VE on vinyl too!
I'm just gonna repost this here since it was completely ignored and I'm not sure if it was just overseen between all the Puzzle Box hype :lol
Since the new album seems to have overshadowed any attention to the upcoming release of L+1VE, I'm bumping this reply up so I can see if anyone knows where I can order this set within the US so I don't have to pay ridiculous amounts of shipping. I'd really like to get this, mostly because of the CD, unless the band are willing to sell the four tracks as a digital set. I saw one listing on Amazon for the vinyl, but it's not listed as being Available, so I'm not sure if they'll even get it. There isn't even a price listed.
-Marc.
I just checked the shipping from insideout for you, you'd pay 18,99 for the LP (and CD) plus 10€ shipping to the States. That's 29€. Not sure if you wanna spend that kind of money (given that you're not a vinyl collector).
Where does omerch ship from?
I think it's not available on Amazon because it will be released in December! I'm sure it will become available there once it get released.
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Quick past-album post while we wait for Friday:
I think Somebody might now be my favourite Haken album closer. As much as I love Visions, and it remains high on my list, Somebody is stunning.
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Really? For me Somebody is nowhere near Celestial Elixir, Visions nor Bound by Gravity.
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1. Celestial Elixir
2. Visions
3. Somebody
4. Bound by Gravity
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I listened to The Good Doctor when it first came out...once. And I’ve already forgotten it.
I remember really liking it, but I really want the album to be a fresh experience, so I’ve been avoiding all the other releases completely. Only one more week!!!
This applies to me as well. Quite looking forward to hearing the full thing.
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I'm quite amazed that The Good Doctor hasn't got its hooks firmly implanted in some of you.
I mean when you've only listened to it once,
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1. Celestial Elixir
2. Visions
3. Somebody
4. Bound by Gravity
Totally agree with this one, furthermore, Celestial Elixir is still my favorite Haken song!
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Oh yeah by the way extra wrong, bound by gravity is great & visions is the weakest (though not by that much)
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Bound By Gravity by a margin...
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Bound by Gravity is in my top 10 album closers by anyone ever. It would take a lot to top that one.
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I'm afraid that Celestial Elixir will forever be the ultimate closer, although I think Somebody is pretty great as well.
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Celestial Elixir (It's the song that made me fall in love with the band, and still their best epic, if not best song)
Bound By Gravity
A Call Divides / Somebody
Visions
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All four album closers are not only great tunes, but I think all four would be in my Haken top 10.
Controversial opinion: Somebody is the best song on the Mountain. I know most will disagree with that, but it is my favorite.
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All four album closers are not only great tunes, but I think all four would be in my Haken top 10.
Controversial opinion: Somebody is the best song on the Mountain. I know most will disagree with that, but it is my favorite.
I can’t believe that’s a controversial opinion. I don’t only think it’s the best song on The Mountain, I think it’s Haken’s best song.
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There ya go!
My top 5 Haken tunes is pretty firm now (in no specific order):
Celestial Elixir
Visions
Somebody
Crystallized (shut it, Joe :P)
1985
It seems like Cockroach King, Falling Back to Earth and Pareidolia get the most love, and I get why (yes, I have come around to liking CK because the music is so good, vocals are still annoying to me at times on that one), but I think Somebody beats them all. The climax in that song is :hefdaddy :hefdaddy.
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If I even have a minor complaint about The Mountain, it’s that it is a bit anti-climactic. It’s not that Somebody is bad, it’s just that it’s a 9 in a sea of perfect 10s.
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If I even have a minor complaint about The Mountain, it’s that it is a bit anti-climactic. It’s not that Somebody is bad, it’s just that it’s a 9 in a sea of perfect 10s.
I totally agree with this! When I listen to the album on its entirety I like the song, but it's the only song I don't listen on its own.
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There ya go!
My top 5 Haken tunes is pretty firm now (in no specific order):
Celestial Elixir
Visions
Somebody
Crystallized (shut it, Joe :P)
1985
It seems like Cockroach King, Falling Back to Earth and Pareidolia get the most love, and I get why (yes, I have come around to liking CK because the music is so good, vocals are still annoying to me at times on that one), but I think Somebody beats them all. The climax in that song is :hefdaddy :hefdaddy.
LOL Crystallized is my #1 Haken song!
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I have no idea who is or isn't more popular, but Leprous has a youtube video with 1.7 million views, a million more than Haken's best video. Judging by shows listed on setlist.fm both bands have played around 50 times in the US as well. Leprous is new to me, but it seems like they are on fairly even ground with maybe an argument for Leprous actually? I'd love to know for sure who is headlining the NYC show.
Yeah, I'd really like a better idea of how they are working this. My hunch is that Haken "headlines," simply because the tour artwork is clearly Haken dominant. Still, it really wouldn't bug me any if Leprous went on last (presuming equal time, of course). I've been unable to get into them at all, so if I wanted to skip them at one or more of their shows it'd be a whole lot easier that way.
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Assuming equal time I'd LOVE Haken on before Leprous, would mean after hours of no drinks and standing up front I could grab a drink and hang in the back to end the night.
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I'm only going to one show so actually wouldn't care too much since I want to catch both bands full sets, but since I like Haken more and am more familiar, I'd rather them headline.
Speaking of the one show, NYC, I know a bunch of DTFers will likely be there, we doing a pre-show meet up or anything? Since it's a Saturday that seems pretty easy to make happen.
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I'm hoping this album is up on Spotify as soon as midnight turns :metal
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Tomorrow, it happens! :caffeine:
As is my tradition on the evening before a new album is released, I'll listen to the previous album, in this case Affinity, later.
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Tickets secured for the February show in Hamburg!
Can't wait to listen to the new album tomorrow. If the three released songs are any indication, I should love this.
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I've just listened to the whole album for the first time. I know it'll grow on me, as always. However, I'm pretty sure that in a couple of months, when I'll have listened to the album around 50 times, I'll still think that it's the worst Haken record to date. Let me explain.
Haken is my favorite band, by far. They have always managed to create that magic atmosphere where heavyness, softness and weird moments have their own space. Hell, even they introduced electronic bits in The Mountain and Affinity. Even more, they always created unique melodies that stick to my head, probably forever. I still think The Mountain is the best album I've ever heard. If The Mountain is a 10, Affinity is a 9.5 and Visions and Aquarius are a 9.
However, I feel that Vector has lost softness, weird/funny moments and melodic greatness, which have been present in every single Haken record. Vector sounds like pure pointless tech metal to me. It is the first Haken record ever that does not have at least 3 or 4 bits of the songs that catch my attention strongly on the first listen. I'd say more. If Ross' voice weren't so familiar, I could say that this album is not from Haken.
Of course I'll let the album grow and I'm sure I'll eventually like it, but I'll still be disappointed with the album, even more when compared to all they've done previously.
When the first single came out, I remember thinking "The Good Doctor is a good, catchy song. It's ok for a single as Initiate was, but I hope this is the worst song in the album". Now I think it's the best, and by far.
Haken, I love you. And you know that. I've told you on the road, I've thanked Richard mainly for creating the best piece of art I've ever heard. And because you can do such great things, I am disappointed and sad.
PD: this is just my subjective opinion, and I really hope you guys like Vector more than I do.
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Interesting review. I have only heard The Good Doctor once and refrained from listening to the other singles. I hope the vinyl arrives in the mail tomorrow, so that I can listen to it. I'm pretty sure it will be enjoyable, but have read similar comments to yours up here about the album. Looks like Vector will be different than their other records. Could swing both ways I suppose.
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I feel similar but to a softer degree. It still sounds distinctly Haken to me, but it is very focused on one half of their repertoire. Vector is a bit like the first half of "Drowning in the Flood" without the second half.
I don't agree on the "pointless tech metal" label though. "Nil by Mouth" gets close, but by being the only song on the album that's pure djent it stands out and sort of "has a point" ;)
It is still one of the more interesting albums I've heard this year, but will probably end up as my least favourite Haken album in the long run.
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I don't know, less "softness, weird/funny moments" seems like it might be up my alley. I found the weird stuff on The Mountain to be what holds it back for me and why I find Visions to be their best since it's a bit more straight up prog metal without all the jazz and accapella stuff and electronic weirdness. If that's what we will call it.
Regardless, I wasn't really blown away by the 3 releases on my few listens so I think it's possible that it hits what I like about Haken without actually being their best output. We will see. Been listening to Visions and The Mountain a lot this week.
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I'm hoping this album is up on Spotify as soon as midnight turns :metal
It's up, giving the first spin now :tup
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2nd listen in and I'm undecided. I only listened to The Good Doctor once and managed to resist the other singles. I thought it was fine but that was only one listen. It'll take some digesting and I'm certainly going to play the hell out of it.
Plenty of positives and I'm trying not to let others opinions influence mine. I have faith that I'll end up rating this highly as these guys haven't released a bad album as far as I'm concerned.
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First impression: 38 minutes of highly enjoyable music and Nil by Mouth.
Pro tip: punchlines in Puzzle Box and Veil both have the same cadence and the same amount of syllables. You can interchange them during your shower singing sessions.
Paralyzed
Staring through the shadows on the wall
There's no danger sleeping next to me
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One spin in...... gonna spin several more times...hopefully it's a grower.
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Waiting on my pre-order.
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Waiting on my pre-order.
I'm not even sure they shipped mine yet. No shipping notification so far.
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I think it's funny that (I think? Correct me if I'm wrong) they advertised this as their 'metal album' - which it clearly is - but the best song after 2 listens to me is easily the least metal song. Host, seriously, wow.
Not quite wowed by this yet, but I'm sure it'll grow on me more. Nil By Mouth is bad, but everything else I can see getting better over time.
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I actually quite like the instrumental, it reminds me a bit of DT's Enigma Machine in that it's pretty much a vehicle to show off their chops. I don't mind that kind of thing every once in a while. Veil the pick of the bunch though. Decent song, that one.
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Listened on my way into work so only one take in, I really like it, but it just feels short. Veil is fantastic. I'm not sure why there's so much hate for Nil, I mean, it's not some amazing song, but seems like a solid instrumental, I don't really have issues with it although I wish there was another track on this album to maybe make having an instrumental and an opening instrumental track feel like they belong a bit more. Album just felt a bit rushed maybe, like there isn't much breathing room until Host and that is probably my least favorite track.
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I LOVE Nil By Mouth. It's absolutely brutal, fast, very well structured and totally kicks Enigma Machine's butt (sorry DT I love you but it's true) and it ESPECIALLY kicks Opus Maximus's butt. I don't know how MP could think OM compares to this.
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I LOVE Nil By Mouth. It's absolutely brutal, fast, very well structured and totally kicks Enigma Machine's butt (sorry DT I love you but it's true) and it ESPECIALLY kicks Opus Maximus's butt. I don't know how MP could think OM compares to this.
I actually agree with the Enigma Machine vibe, I was thinking it seemed similar to that as well, and I might also agree that it is better. I only had one listen, hard to say, but I think it's also better than Opus Maximus, which I liked more than most people. I feel like Nil would be sick to see live.
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Album just felt a bit rushed maybe, like there isn't much breathing room until Host and that is probably my least favorite track.
Kind of get the same feeling. But damn, Nil by Mouth is brutally sick!! Hopefully they'll play it live.
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Maybe this was already hinted or acknowledged, I'm not sure, but does anyone else think the album is referencing some old songs? I'm hearing melodies similar to the ones in Cockroach king, Initiate and The Point of no return. It might be accidental, though. I'll try to spin it a few more times before I can give any timestamps.
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First listen of the album at work today, not 100% concentrated on the album, but Nil By Mouth is my favourite track until now and the one I want more to relisten soon.
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I think it's funny that (I think? Correct me if I'm wrong) they advertised this as their 'metal album' - which it clearly is - but the best song after 2 listens to me is easily the least metal song. Host, seriously, wow.
I think Host is my early favourite too.
A Cell Divides feels very Leprous-like on the chorus, but I like it. In fact I like every song except the instrumental. Really hope they won't play it on tour, sorry goo-goo. :biggrin:
Also agree that the album feels short. I'd have liked one or two more songs.
Edit: oh, and Rich: any plans for another Haken Survivor now that the new album is out?
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Good that you’re bringing it up! I used to start that thing in november, which is around the corner, so I might fire it up soon, yeah! :)
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One need only read this thread to see that Haken material rarely grabs me at first, but I am extremely underwhelmed by this album after several listens. A Cell Divides, in particular, is bad.
Similar to Mladen, I am definitely hearing some melodies and tidbits that sound like older Haken material.
Hoping this will grow on me...
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Some first thoughts:
I get a lot of vibes from other Haken songs in many songs. The Good Doctor is solid. Great single. Puzzle Box I really enjoy. The beginning of the instrumental section is amazing. The Veil I need to listen to more to digest. Nil is dark and twisted. I actually enjoy most of it, and comparing it to Enigma Machine feels a bit like a disservice lol. Host is really sweet. A Cell Divides has an amazing idea; I just wish the parts other than that idea were slightly stronger.
I actually think it's a solid album. It's amazing that Haken has managed to write 5 solid and distinct sounding albums. This album will kick ass live.
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Good to know I'm not the only one who's thrown off by A Cell divides. The chorus is quite unpleasant to listen to. On the plus side, there are some really cool parts in Puzzle box and Veil.
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And yet I love the chorus to A Cell Divides. It seems like the song is....
....
...
.
Divisive. :lhk:
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Album just felt a bit rushed maybe, like there isn't much breathing room until Host and that is probably my least favorite track.
Kind of get the same feeling. But damn, Nil by Mouth is brutally sick!! Hopefully they'll play it live.
Maybe it's just my own weirdness, but I think NBM would actually make an awesome concert opener :lol
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At first listen, it's more than obvious that this work is much heavier than the previous albums, but I don't think it is any close of being generic.
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Love the album, as expected. Not sure where I’d rank it but it certainly doesn’t touch The Mountain for me. The Veil is fantastic and I’m a huge fan of Clear as well. The singles are still quite wonderful in the context of the album, but I honestly should’ve avoided them because the ratio of new content to music I had already digested was a bit disappointing.
I agree with the sentiments that a bit of the eclectic and unique vibes that the band really drew me in with are a bit more sparse or absent entirely, but as a stylistic choice I understand it. I just hope they don’t continue only in this direction for the future.
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Yeah, I love A Cell Divides chorus.
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Also what do you guys think about the nuggetz?
Like the "bringing an empire to its knees" lyric in The Good Doctor and also 0:47 in Nil? There are probably a bunch more I haven't found yet.
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Love the album, as expected. Not sure where I’d rank it but it certainly doesn’t touch The Mountain for me.
I'm not sure anything Haken produces can touch The Mountain as that's just such a special wonderful album (IMO). On my first listen to Vector I wasn't entirely convinced, and thought maybe mid-ranked, but it's become my second favourite behind TM now.
I actually think it's a solid album. It's amazing that Haken has managed to write 5 solid and distinct sounding albums. This album will kick ass live.
Yeah, I love that they do something different each time. I expect the same thing next time so hopefully anyone not digging the direction on Vector will get more their sort of thing next time.
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Also what do you guys think about the nuggetz?
Like the "bringing an empire to its knees" lyric in The Good Doctor and also 0:47 in Nil? There are probably a bunch more I haven't found yet.
There a whole bunch of Cockroach King nuggets (quite a few lyrical, and couple of musical ones). Also some possible references to other songs but mostly CK.
Plus story similarities to CK.
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Love the album, as expected. Not sure where I’d rank it but it certainly doesn’t touch The Mountain for me.
I'm not sure anything Haken produces can touch The Mountain as that's just such a special wonderful album (IMO). On my first listen to Vector I wasn't entirely convinced, and thought maybe mid-ranked, but it's become my second favourite behind TM now.
Yeah, certainly a magical album that few albums have topped for me, honestly. But yeah, I appreciate that they can provide unique experiences on each album.
Also after a few more listens, Host is becoming a favorite.
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It's possible this album does end up being my least favorite, but that it's still an awesome album. Their catalog is just that strong, it's not meant to be a diss on the album, just that something needs to be last in the list. I'm not ready to commit to that based on one listen, but I think it is possible that it will be my least favorite while still being really awesome.
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I feel like Diego's keyboard solos are very low on the mix. The mastering is a bit hot though. But the mix itself is very crisp and clear.
Oh that drum sound :hefdaddy
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Also after a few more listens, Host is becoming a favorite.
Host was one of my favourites right from the first listen. It's absolutely superb, one of my favourite Haken songs.
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So is the conventional wisdom that they're going to play the thin in its entirety this tour? That's what I've been assuming, but I don't know if they've hinted at anything one way or the other.
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I feel like Diego's keyboard solos are very low on the mix. The mastering is a bit hot though. But the mix itself is very crisp and clear.
Oh that drum sound :hefdaddy
The drums are awesome on this album and Veil is special after one listen.
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So is the conventional wisdom that they're going to play the thin in its entirety this tour? That's what I've been assuming, but I don't know if they've hinted at anything one way or the other.
Haven't read this anywhere, but I would love to hear every song of the album live. If so, the question is if they play it from start to finish without disruption or just play all the songs, but not in the same order and with some other songs in between.
IF they play the whole thing in one sitting, one of the following two scenarios would be the case:
- they open with Clear (as they have been doing it with affinity.exe and The Path) and play the whole album. But then, the first 45 minutes would be dedicated to the new album and the rest of the concert would have nothing to do with Vector.
or
- they open with some other song (maybe a "classic", however you want to define this for Haken) and after 4 songs Ross says something like "alright everyone we have a new album out called Vector and we're gonna play the whole thing for yer now are you guyz ready"
I think both things are a little weird because Haken have never done anything like this before and all of their albums would have deserved to be played in their entirety.
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While I think the short run time would allow for the entire album to be played live, I don't think they'll do that. I think they'll do half or more.... they've got to reherse this stuff right? They're humans like the rest of us, aren't they?
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This album has a lot to digest, need more listens to have a “Clear” opinion, but it’s definitely leaning towards the bottom of their discography, not that I think it’s bad, but it doesn’t touch TM, Visions and Affinity.
So far most of the instrumental sections and riffs blur into sounding too samey, though :-\
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I'm actually really impressed with this on first listen. Better first impression than Affinity.
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After five spins:
The Good Doctor > A Cell Divides > Puzzle Box > Host > Veil > Clear > Nil By Mouth
The Mountain > Affinity > Visions > Aquarius > Vector
In general, the album disappointed me, although I kinda expected it when I read all these "this is the heaviest record to date" reviews. It sounds AMAZING, Diego's work is awesome and the guitars sound crisp, but I just don't like the overall songs as much as in the past albums.
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Here's my attempt at the setlist I'm hoping for—while keeping it realistic—for the upcoming tour. No Aquarius (although I'd love to hear some of it) and almost no Visions, heavy focus on the last three albums. I also never saw them live—this tour would be the first time, and even then I have to travel for it—so I don't know what their usual setlists look like.
Clear
The Good Doctor
Puzzle Box
Earthrise
Shapeshifter / Deathless
Veil
Atlas Stone / In Memoriam
Cockroach King (please no, but I'm sure it'll be in)
As Death Embraces
Host
Initiate
The Endless Knot
Falling Back to Earth
A Cell Divides
Encore:
Pareidolia
Celestial Elixir (optional)
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I don't see the issue with Nil by Mouth, seems fine to me. I'm also in the camp that just feels my main frustration with the album is that it's too short.
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I feel like Diego's keyboard solos are very low on the mix.
You should listen to instrumental mix.
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Nil by Mouth is my favourite, that intro is damn good! Maybe last few mins are bit too comlicated but it's really cool song!
But damn when I listened the three singles before and then it was only three more songs today. So damn short album!
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I think both things are a little weird because Haken have never done anything like this before and all of their albums would have deserved to be played in their entirety.
I’ve seen Visions in it entirety at least three times, so that certainly isn’t true.
Also,haven’t listened yet. Still waiting for my copy to arrive..
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I quite honestly wonder if there is something extra in the pipeline in the not-too-distant future (like, within the next year-to-15 months). It's very unusual for such a short album in the prog-metal genre in modern times. You can't tell me that this is all the music they came up with.
Also, I've heard good things about this Nolly bloke who's mixing this album. Do you think he'd work with Dream Theater?
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I quite honestly wonder if there is something extra in the pipeline in the not-too-distant future (like, within the next year-to-15 months). It's very unusual for such a short album in the prog-metal genre in modern times.
The majority of albums released this year that I've listened to were under 50 minutes. That said, it wouldn't surprise me if Vector II suddenly shows up in 2019.
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I feel like Diego's keyboard solos are very low on the mix. The mastering is a bit hot though. But the mix itself is very crisp and clear.
Oh that drum sound :hefdaddy
First couple listens in to this and I agree. Nolly's mix and his drum sounds are incredible.
The album as a whole, I'm kinda meh on... I'll try to give it a few more spins.
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While I think the short run time would allow for the entire album to be played live, I don't think they'll do that. I think they'll do half or more.... they've got to reherse this stuff right? They're humans like the rest of us, aren't they?
But this is the material they'd have to rehearse the least. It's fresh and they've no doubt heard the whole thing a gazillion times in the last 2 months.
I think both things are a little weird because Haken have never done anything like this before and all of their albums would have deserved to be played in their entirety.
This is a good point, all of their albums could be played in their entirety. But have they ever started a tour 4 days after the album comes out, though?
And I kind of envision 3 or 4 older songs, play the album, and then an epic encore.
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Nothing to go on, but I feel the entire album will get played... over the course of the tour. I'm not sure they will come out playing the full thing every night. I expect a healthy mix from their last three albums and maybe one or two songs between visions/aquarius. I wouldn't be against the whole album though, it's short enough to fit into the entire set (assuming 90 minutes) while leaving ample time for other songs.
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I swear to god if they encore with Celestial Elixer again and not Crystallised I will burn the building down :lol
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I think both things are a little weird because Haken have never done anything like this before and all of their albums would have deserved to be played in their entirety.
I’ve seen Visions in it entirety at least three times, so that certainly isn’t true.
Sorry, didn't know that!
Well, I guess we'll know more in a couple of days :)
I could imagine them playing all of the songs of the album on the upcoming European tour when they're the only headliner. Not sure about the co-headlining tour though. They "only" have around 90 mins after all.
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I knew that riff in the middle of Nil by Mouth sounded familiar...it is very much like the one in Opeth's The Grand Conjuration!
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I swear to god if they encore with Celestial Elixer again and not Crystallised I will burn the building down :lol
Hey, piss off!
Since I'm seeing consecutive shows I'd be really happy if they alternated epics again. Sadly, it won't be either of those this time. Unlikely I'll see either until anniversaries start happening.
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I listened to the album this morning, and I have to say that this is probably my least favorite Haken album for sure. It's not a bad album per se--it is Haken after all--but it doesn't really live up to the quality established in previous albums. Still better than half the prog I hear now tho.
Ranking after first listen:
1. Clear
2. Host
3. The Good Doctor
4. Puzzle Box
5. A Cell Divides
6. Nil by Mouth
7. Veil
The album sounds kind of one-note to me at times, honestly. It feels like the metal dial was left at 8 for most of this album, which doesn't give a whole lot of contrast with timbre or dynamics. Songs kind of blended together sometimes because of this too.
I appreciated what they did with the reoccurring themes in the album, especially since they actually developed and varied those themes a bit instead of just being like "yo remember that theme from the beginning? Here it is completely unchanged out of nowhere". Haken's been pretty good about that on the last three albums. Kind of wish they kept some of that thematic development inside the actual songs themselves tho. It seems like they try to introduce too many new ideas for their own good at times, which creates a lot of overall song flow issues. Hearing the chopped up version of the riff from Puzzle Box in Nil by Mouth was one of the highlights of the album tho.
Veil is just a hot mess. Nothing about this song works. It feels like they just glued two or three different songs together without regards to whether they flowed together or not. The switch from the heavy as frick first half to the atmospheric middle section is literally the most jarring thing I've heard in a Haken song. And it's not the good early/middle Opeth kind of jarring either. I thought it was another song that started. The song just drags on for the last 5 minutes, and I literally found myself checking to see if it was still going half the time. Easily their worst song. Easily.
Nil by Mouth is...okay. It has its moments (like that riff reprise I mentioned earlier), but man it's just got too much going on. Definitely didn't need those solos. Also kind of felt like an instrumental of a song with vocals half the time. I don't think it's necessarily tuneful enough on its own to work as a stand-alone instrumental. Basically, it's Haken's Enigma Machine. The whole album feels like their DT12 honest.
Clear is definitely the best song on the album, hand's down. It's short, sweet, and to the point. Doesn't meander, has a good tune, and maintains enough interest in spite of (or maybe because of) its short length. Hearing that nice classical functional harmony was SUCH a welcome surprise for me too. This is definitely near Top 10 Haken for me.
The Good Doctor and Puzzle Box are good. They may just have the advantage of being near the beginning of the album so you hear them while the sound is fresh. tGD is definitely the better of the two. Definitely the right choices for singles imo.
I'd comment on A Cell Divides, but honestly it's not that memorable. I've heard it 3 times now and I can't tell you anything about it besides it being vaguely heavyish and 7 minutesish. It's not bad, but it's just not great. It's like that SCP thing that you forget about when you're not looking at it.
Host is great. A nice breath of fresh air and one of the few breaks from non-stop metal in the album. Has some internal contrast too, which makes it even more interesting. Definitely one of my favorites.
Overall: it's okay. Doesn't live up to their last couple of albums. Sits at the bottom of Haken album rankings for me (along with Aquarius and Restoration), and would be middle of the road for my prog album rankings.
While I think the short run time would allow for the entire album to be played live, I don't think they'll do that. I think they'll do half or more.... they've got to reherse this stuff right? They're humans like the rest of us, aren't they?
But this is the material they'd have to rehearse the least. It's fresh and they've no doubt heard the whole thing a gazillion times in the last 2 months.
Maybe, but playing something live is super different from playing something in a studio setting. Everything's usually broken up in the studio, so they'd have to make sure that all the different sections are connected and probably review or relearn a lot of sections that they haven't touched for months or weeks.
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So, I was listening to the album twice today. Musically I enjoy it, but I don't think I will ever particularly enjoy the singer. So, given that it was the deluxe version I was listening to, I must confess I liked the instrumental versions of the songs a lot more :(
That said, I'm looking forward to seeing them in November!
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That 1st minute of Nil by Mouth is a musical bliss to my ears. That might be Haken’s dirtiest riff!
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After my second listen, I think I like this more than all of their albums except The Mountain. Excellent album. Controversial opinion, I know.
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I listened to it a few times today. I think it's a good representative of Haken's "riff-ier" elements. Part of me feels like it Vector could very well serve as the heavier half of an album duology, with some future album being its less heavy, more melodic counterpart.
That said, I did enjoy a lot of the songs. The intro to Veil was a lot of fun, and I wouldn't mind seeing more of that. A Cell Divides was excellently Leprous-esque. Host was the big surprise to me. I really liked it. Nil By Mouth is one I'll have to spend more time looking at, because I don't quite "get it" yet.
After one day and a couple of listens, I'll give it a 6/10. Above average, but not earth-shaking. I'll certainly give it another go before making further judgement.
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I mean, yeah, everyone has their own opinion, this is obvious, and is more than understandable that you like to know what other people think of a certain album that's recently been released, and to share your first thoughts about it... But maybe it'd be a bit more reasonable not to through a whole intent of review and start ranking the albums and the songs within the album after the mere first listen!.. :lol
Personally, I have listened to it throughout a whole week now and gave it like 5 or 6 spins, and it's growing with every listen.. The first time I didn't like it too much, but didn't pay the least attention to that feeling, AT ALL.. Because the same happened to me with several prog band albums that I ended up enjoying a lot with more listens.. Moreover, this Vector album seems to be especially tricky in that aspect.. Judging by its lenght, it doesn't look like there's much to digest, but there is.. A lot.. Every song is its own world, and you can't honestly feel it and start feeling what it represents for you not even after a few listens..
tl/dr: give the album more time, don't trust in your first listen!.. ;)
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Did anyone listen to the instrumental mixes? There's an easter egg in the end of A Cell Divides that I'm not sure if hides any kind of message... Probably indicating a sequel?
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This reminds me of when The King of limbs by Radiohead came out, everybody guessed there must be a sequel to a 37 minute long album. There were numerous hints and clues, but nothing ever happened. The album was just short.
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Did anyone listen to the instrumental mixes? There's an easter egg in the end of A Cell Divides that I'm not sure if hides any kind of message... Probably indicating a sequel?
https://www.bfskinner.org/verbal-summator-files/
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Did anyone listen to the instrumental mixes? There's an easter egg in the end of A Cell Divides that I'm not sure if hides any kind of message... Probably indicating a sequel?
https://www.bfskinner.org/verbal-summator-files/
Interesting!
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Did anyone listen to the instrumental mixes? There's an easter egg in the end of A Cell Divides that I'm not sure if hides any kind of message... Probably indicating a sequel?
https://www.bfskinner.org/verbal-summator-files/
That's really clever, I love this.
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Ok. I'm digging this album. Not as good as the last 2 but those were extremely high levels of awesomeness.
The heaviness is cool.
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Given that the new album is mostly pretty rocking, I think it would make sense to incorporate a few mellower tunes from prior albums on the upcoming tour, that way it isn't one rocking tune after another.
I could see a set list like this:
Clear
The Good Doctor
In Memoriam
1985
Puzzle Box
Lapse
Cockroach King
A Cell Divides
Deathless
Veil
The Endless Knot
Bound by Gravity
Celestial Elixir
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HAKEN'S VECTOR is now available for pre-order!
I also found the track lengths on the insideout shop website.
Not sure if you guys want it spoiled, so here's a little warning: Warning.
01. Clear (01:52)
02. The Good Doctor (03:55)
03. Puzzle Box (07:42)
04. Veil (12:35)
05. Nil By Mouth (06:51)
06. Host (06:45)
07. A Cell Divides (04:57)
08. Verbal Summator (01:02)
So it seems, that this will be a very short album, not longer than 45mins if I counted correctly. I wonder why they would press it on 2 LPs though.
I guess we now know where the track "Verbal Summator" came from, and it was only on the instrumental disc. Weird.
-Marc.
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Just gave Vector a good, thorough headphone listen and really enjoyed it! Drums sound great! Can't wait to see the lads next week in Philly and see some of this new material live
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I prefer to speak in short observational bursts, so:
- The first sound on the album makes me think the NOMACs are descending again.
- As I'm listening more and more, some parts are really making me smile, especially on Nil By Mouth.
- I gave Puzzle Box a listen or two when it came out as a single, but now I'm hearing it properly, I am really enjoying it. The final chorus is gorgeous, the vocal melody changing compared to the other choruses, but still fitting the chord progression.
- Host reminds me quite a bit of Sun from their first album Aquarius, not just in its placement as the 2nd-to-last track, but its general mood of being a bit of a breather between the heavier tracks that flank it.
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HAKEN'S VECTOR is now available for pre-order!
I also found the track lengths on the insideout shop website.
Not sure if you guys want it spoiled, so here's a little warning: Warning.
01. Clear (01:52)
02. The Good Doctor (03:55)
03. Puzzle Box (07:42)
04. Veil (12:35)
05. Nil By Mouth (06:51)
06. Host (06:45)
07. A Cell Divides (04:57)
08. Verbal Summator (01:02)
So it seems, that this will be a very short album, not longer than 45mins if I counted correctly. I wonder why they would press it on 2 LPs though.
I guess we now know where the track "Verbal Summator" came from, and it was only on the instrumental disc. Weird.
-Marc.
Very interesting that, in Spotify, the main version of ACD is 4:57, but the instrumental version is 6:04. The hidden track is there, but it's only on the instrumental version and it isn't listed as a separate track, that's why most people haven't noticed about it.
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The hidden instrumental is at the end of A Cell Divides on the standard 1-disc version.
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First listen through, I enjoyed it a lot. Not enough listens to rank. At the moment, Puzzle Box is my favorite, but Veil is up there.
Nil By Mouth is pretty neat as well, although it does get a bit reptitive towards the end. I do like how the instrumental is called Nil By Mouth.
The Cell Divides is a great ending as well. I need to buy the cd, or see the linear notes to get into the concept more. All, I know is its about a guy in a mental ward that is being experimented on.
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I've just noticed the handwriting on the lyric page for A Cell Divides:
"More treatment required
virus spreading.
Begin verbal summator testing."
It's a very very long shot, but as I'm listening now I'm toying with the idea that all the previous Haken albums' concepts are "dreams" of the patient being examined in Vector.
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HAKEN'S VECTOR is now available for pre-order!
I also found the track lengths on the insideout shop website.
Not sure if you guys want it spoiled, so here's a little warning: Warning.
01. Clear (01:52)
02. The Good Doctor (03:55)
03. Puzzle Box (07:42)
04. Veil (12:35)
05. Nil By Mouth (06:51)
06. Host (06:45)
07. A Cell Divides (04:57)
08. Verbal Summator (01:02)
So it seems, that this will be a very short album, not longer than 45mins if I counted correctly. I wonder why they would press it on 2 LPs though.
I guess we now know where the track "Verbal Summator" came from, and it was only on the instrumental disc. Weird.
-Marc.
Very interesting that, in Spotify, the main version of ACD is 4:57, but the instrumental version is 6:04. The hidden track is there, but it's only on the instrumental version and it isn't listed as a separate track, that's why most people haven't noticed about it.
I listened to it too. Why it isn't on the actual album Spotify is odd. It adds to the story too.
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I bought the vinyl/cd version and can also confirm that the hidden nugget is on the main album.
I've listened twice through so far. Gonna go for the old 5-spin rule before judging it too much, but I know that I REALLY like it so far.
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It seems that Haken are going to release a vinyl LP with the 4 L-1VE bonus tracks recorded at Prog Power!
https://www.insideoutshop.de/Item/Haken_-_L-1VE_-black_LP-CD-/16496
I don't quite understand this release but Haken is always a no brainer for me.
I just hope they will release the "actual" L-1VE on vinyl too!
I'm just gonna repost this here since it was completely ignored and I'm not sure if it was just overseen between all the Puzzle Box hype :lol
Since the new album seems to have overshadowed any attention to the upcoming release of L+1VE, I'm bumping this reply up so I can see if anyone knows where I can order this set within the US so I don't have to pay ridiculous amounts of shipping. I'd really like to get this, mostly because of the CD, unless the band are willing to sell the four tracks as a digital set. I saw one listing on Amazon for the vinyl, but it's not listed as being Available, so I'm not sure if they'll even get it. There isn't even a price listed.
-Marc.
I just checked the shipping from insideout for you, you'd pay 18,99 for the LP (and CD) plus 10€ shipping to the States. That's 29€. Not sure if you wanna spend that kind of money (given that you're not a vinyl collector).
Where does omerch ship from?
I think it's not available on Amazon because it will be released in December! I'm sure it will become available there once it get released.
Just got an alert from Amazon saying the item was now available so I preordered it. My total $34.97 after tax, so about the same as 29 euros, which isn't bad. And since its Amazon, I can always cancel my order before I'm charged/it ships, or the price might go down a bit, which would be nice. Either way, I've got at least 6 weeks til release.
-Marc.
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I'm five listens in and I still think this album is awesome. Pretty much every song is great. I like it way more than Affinity and Visions.
Also I just realized that the middle section of Veil (4:00 - 7:00) reminds me of some Porcupine Tree / Steven Wilson song. I don't remember which one though, but the vocal melodies are almost exactly the same if I recall correctly. Anyone?
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I’d tell you if I’d actually heard Vector.
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After a few more listens today...
Clear - cool intro, I suppose.
The Good Doctor - solid tune. Kind of seems like this album's Initiate, but with a better hook. Won't be a favorite of mine, but should make for a (likely) fun concert opener.
Puzzle Box - I didn't know what to make of this at first, but I am starting to really like it. The keyboard instrumental part about halfway through the song is pretty rad.
Veil - I am still trying to wrap my head around this one. It has a lot of cool thins going on and I am still trying to figure out if they all come together or not. :lol
Nil by Mouth - I get why this seems to be the least favorite. Sure, it rocks, but it kind of just seems like an instrumental that runs through a gauntlet of ideas they had without having a lot of direction.
Host - they do this kind of vibe really well and this is no exception. I can see this being one of my two or three favorites once I've fully grasped the whole album.
A Cell Divides - ick. Just ick. The chorus literally makes me cringe. Bummer, since that keyboard part around the 3-minute mark that leads back into the final chorus is really neat, but that chorus is just so bad. This will be my piss break song when I see them next month. :lol :lol
Overall, I like the album, but I'd be shocked if overtakes any of the others, meaning I would call it their least best to date, but that is okay. Not every album is going to be a major winner. Not much new stuff stylistically on this one, as it kind of strikes me as Affinity's sister record, but not every album has to reinvent the wheel.
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I just went through my first listen.
First impressions:
- I don't think this album will ever get close to topping The Mountain or Affinity, which are for me two of the most definitive and quintessential progressive albums of the decade (and the 2000s so far), but I don't mind that. This album is super different to anything they had done up to this point and that's good.
- The musicianship is, as always, incredible. It's impressive how tight they've become. They somehow manage to take djent and extreme progressive metal riffing and make it somewhat melodic and easy to grasp. Somewhat.
- That being said, this album for me is missing some awesome themes and motifs. Both The Mountain and Affinity had some incredible musical motifs and themes tying up the heaviness and the proginess quite nicely, but I didn't feel that in this record. Veil has a pretty awesome theme, but that's about it. Some vocal melodies feel somewhat disjointed and forced and I don't see myself right now singing along to the tunes because it's gonna take me some time to actually digest and learn the melodies; but that's fine, though. In my book, Haken has always had weird and not-so-easily-digestable vocal melodies and they've always managed to stick in my brain at some point. Either way, I was not as excited by the end of this album as I was a couple of years ago with Affinity, for example. That record was intense as hell, but I remember feeling so satisfied by the end even if I couldn't remember a single note of it. I hope this one is a grower in that regard.
- I think my favorite track is Veil so far, and my least favorite is Nil By Mouth. True, the instrumental is pretty impressive and something that's technically light years above most things rock bands do nowadays, but it didn't grab my attention so much as, for example, a Dance of Eternity does. I think they went way too deep into the djent-y realm with this track (and most of the rest as well) and I'm not the biggest fan of that style except for a few albums and bands. To me, that track felt like a bunch of ideas thrown in at once into a song without having a memorable musical resource making everything tie up nicely. I may be wrong, though. I hope the track grows on me because it's very impressive to say the least.
- Production and mixing were awesome. Dream Theater should take a note or two on how Haken are doing their records, because I feel they are sonically light years ahead their last couple efforts. Ironic, given DT has probably twice or more the budget Haken has to create a record.
I know that this album has some mind blowing stuff in it, but it just failed to grab me with the same intensity the past couple Haken albums did. I will spin it a couple more times to see what happens. Either way, I'm really looking forward to the tour (they're coming to Mexico FYEAH) as I can imagine that the new songs will be extremely impressive to watch live.
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- That being said, this album for me is missing some awesome themes and motifs. Both The Mountain and Affinity had some incredible musical motifs and themes tying up the heaviness and the proginess quite nicely, but I didn't feel that in this record. Veil has a pretty awesome theme, but that's about it.
My thoughts as well, and I've listened to the album a lot more times than you. It just feels like a bunch of riffing and chugga chugga, but no motifs or melodic/memorable sections.
- I think my favorite track is Veil so far, and my least favorite is Nil By Mouth. True, the instrumental is pretty impressive and something that's technically light years above most things rock bands do nowadays, but it didn't grab my attention so much as, for example, a Dance of Eternity does. I think they went way too deep into the djent-y realm with this track (and most of the rest as well) and I'm not the biggest fan of that style except for a few albums and bands. To me, that track felt like a bunch of ideas thrown in at once into a song without having a memorable musical resource making everything tie up nicely. I may be wrong, though. I hope the track grows on me because it's very impressive to say the least.
And to compare it to something by Haken and not by DT, take Portals as an example. Portals is technical as hell (like TDOE), but it's still interesting and memorable. NBM sounds to me like a djent fest, that's about it.
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After giving it a few spins this weekend, Puzzle Box is easily my favourite track here. The Good Doctor and A Cell Divides are good too.
Don't know where I'd rank the album this early on, but it's not among the Top 3 right now. It's hard to top The Mountain, Affinity and Aquarius for me.
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After giving it a few spins this weekend, Puzzle Box is easily my favourite track here. The Good Doctor and A Cell Divides are good too.
Don't know where I'd rank the album this early on, but it's not among the Top 3 right now. It's hard to top The Mountain, Affinity and Aquarius for me.
This + a huge appreciation for Host = how I feel about Vector
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I can see from here and FB, as with Red Giant last time around, I'm going to be in the minority not getting all hyped on Host.
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Same here.
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It's easily my least favorite on the album (not including Clear). I don't hate it by any means, I actually LOVE the intro to it. Seems so perfect coming out of Nil by Mouth, and I also really like the ending. Some great vocal parts there, but I feel it just drags in the middle of the song. I guess I can see why people like it though, but it's just not there for me.
Anyway, having had more listens and feeling more comfortable about my views on the songs, here are my track rankings (from top to bottom, best to least best):
Veil
The Good Doctor
Puzzle Box
A Cell Divides
Nil By Mouth
Host
Clear
I am finding I really do like this more metal style personally than the more proggierish of say The Mountain, but there's just not enough content here to make me think this album is better. It's really good and I like the distinction this album has in their catalog, I just wish there were more of it. I guess that's a good thing to be left wanting more, but it also doesn't help when you compare it to such beasts of albums they have.
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I will post more of my thoughts later, because today’s the first day that I’ve really been able to sit down and listen to it a few times through. I’m out running errands and listening to it in the car. But has anybody been able to figure out what the voice at the end says?
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It's easily my least favorite on the album (not including Clear). I don't hate it by any means, I actually LOVE the intro to it. Seems so perfect coming out of Nil by Mouth, and I also really like the ending. Some great vocal parts there, but I feel it just drags in the middle of the song. I guess I can see why people like it though, but it's just not there for me.
To me I've come to the conclusion it's a less extreme version of DTs Disappear for me. I find the first 2/3rds of that song just boring and awful, but think the ending is one of the most brilliant sections of the double album. With Host it simply doesn't excite me at all for awhile and kicks up a notch at the end, but still stays below the album average.
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I fell like Host is similar to Sun (which I love), except darker (which I love) and it does a great job changing the pace a bit (which I love).
So it's awesome for me. One of the best, if not the best song from Vector.
I will post more of my thoughts later, because today’s the first day that I’ve really been able to sit down and listen to it a few times through. I’m out running errands and listening to it in the car. But has anybody been able to figure out what the voice at the end says?
It's basically an audio version of a Rorschach test.
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Yeah Host is the best them.
I will post more of my thoughts later, because today’s the first day that I’ve really been able to sit down and listen to it a few times through. I’m out running errands and listening to it in the car. But has anybody been able to figure out what the voice at the end says?
Read the thread :P
Did anyone listen to the instrumental mixes? There's an easter egg in the end of A Cell Divides that I'm not sure if hides any kind of message... Probably indicating a sequel?
https://www.bfskinner.org/verbal-summator-files/
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Still haven't listened to it.
:(
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Also, it's back: The HAKEN Survivor 2018 (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=53008.0). Starting very soon.
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Hell yes! Thanks for running this once again Rich!
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Well I think I've listened enough to rank the songs...
Veil
Host
A Cell Divides
Puzzle Box
Nil By Mouth
The Good Doctor
Clear
All these songs are amazing. The Good Doctor is your usual Haken song. Veil is amazing, that middle section and solo are very Floydish.
I'm enjoying how they used Djent in their own way. Utilizing the heavy, yet still being melodic. Deigos sounds are what really defines this album, without them it'd sound like your usual prog-djent band.
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The more I listen to this album, the more I hear a "Dream Theater" sound in the music. I'm really digging this album but I keep thinking it's Dream Theater with Ross singing.
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The more I listen to this album, the more I hear a "Dream Theater" sound in the music. I'm really digging this album but I keep thinking it's Dream Theater with Ross singing.
I get that feeling from lots of their songs, definitely on Vector too. I don't think it's too much like DT to be a turn off, but it feels like they have been inspired by them in their music overall though. Which is cool with me being a huge DT fan. I like it, feels more fresh than DT.
Also, we already have DT with Ross, the Mike Portnoy Shattered Fortress show was really good with him singing. I liked it much more than I thought I would.
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I see so much mention of djent, am I the only person here who isn't really hearing more than a couple short djent-y moments on this album?
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I see so much mention of djent, am I the only person here who isn't really hearing more than a couple short djent-y moments on this album?
I don't hear djent too, I like the album.
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Don’t think this has been mentioned enough, so I have to say it again: Ray is the MVP on Vector. #JusticeForRay
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Don’t think this has been mentioned enough, so I have to say it again: Ray is the MVP on Vector. #JusticeForRay
I'd agree. He shines in Nil By Mouth.
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I've been away for two days and haven't had the opportunity to listen to Vector during my time off. Now that I came back to it, it sounds much better. The Good doctor / Puzzle box / Veil is quite a streak of songs. I already like the album better than Affinity, which was very underwhelming to me.
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The Good doctor / Puzzle box / Veil is quite a streak of songs.
Totally agree. Kind of another reason why I don't think it tops other albums though, from Veil on, the album goes a bit downhill for me. Doesn't fall off the cliff, but doesn't reach new highs after that awesome threesome.
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I see so much mention of djent, am I the only person here who isn't really hearing more than a couple short djent-y moments on this album?
Nope. Nil By Mouth is pretty djenty, and then there's the odd little moment elsewhere but that's it. I think it's mostly people who don't like/listen to djent who hear the influence at all and think it's the whole album (like how The Astonishing was entirely ballads).
Also surprised by the DT comparisons in a way. I mean Veil has some VERY DT-esque stuff, and there's one short section in Puzzle Box as well (the 2nd verse) but otherwise I don't hear any DT at all. So a similar amount to their last two albums.
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Funny you mention DT Rich. I was thinking Vector is their TOT album. Just the heavy aspect of it. Not stylistically.
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Yeah, Veil is as overtly DT-like as I think they've ever sounded.
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Yeah, Veil is as overtly DT-like as I think they've ever sounded.
Sure, but no more so than they've sounded before. It's really similar to The Architect, including the DT influence (although to be honest I prefer Veil).
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I'm only a couple spins into it, but will give this album its just due. Lots of things going on in this record. Interesting.
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Now that you guys mention it, the DT-influence gets more and more prominent the more I hear it, and given the band's participation in Portnoy's Shattered Fortress, it definitely makes sense why they might take inspiration from those songs and music and use it to mold the songs for Vector.
As for the album itself, I've given it a few good listen, and couple passive ones, and I have to say, it's grown on me. When I first heard it, nothing grabbed me quite like anything on their first four albums - it just sort of existed. Now that I've gotten more time with it, I think I like it a bit more, but there haven't been many standout moments on it for me yet, just good parts and a good vibe throughout the whole album. With albums like Visions and Affinity, and especially the Mountain, the songs tend to stand out and stand apart, while still contributing to the whole album, but with Vector, it just feels like everything blends together for me so far. Maybe in a couple of weeks, I'll get more used to the individual songs and recognize them apart from each other.
It's not BAD, per se, but it hasn't wow'ed me like Affinity did when it came out.
-Marc.
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I will echo the idea that this feels a bit like Affinity's "heavier little brother". Some songs are better, some others don't quite match up.
The opening is better. I grew to love Initiate, but I still think it's the weak link from Affinity. The Good Doctor is a FAR better opener, and grabs you right away. Puzzle Box is good...but it's no 1984. I'm over the moon about Veil and think that it's quite a bit better than The Architect. Nil By Mouth is the odd one out. A great instrumental, but it doesn't feel like anything from Affinity that I can think of. Possibly some resemblance to the instrumental version of The Endless Knot...but that's a stretch. The album closes pretty good, but I agree that it feels a bit like a drop off. Affinity has the best closer in the entire catalog, so I'm not sure anything will ever touch that in my book.
Vector opens stronger, Affinity closes stronger. As a whole, it's a push. Both are great albums.
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I will echo the idea that this feels a bit like Affinity's "heavier little brother". Some songs are better, some others don't quite match up.
The opening is better. I grew to love Initiate, but I still think it's the weak link from Affinity. The Good Doctor is a FAR better opener, and grabs you right away. Puzzle Box is good...but it's no 1984. I'm over the moon about Veil and think that it's quite a bit better than The Architect. Nil By Mouth is the odd one out. A great instrumental, but it doesn't feel like anything from Affinity that I can think of. Possibly some resemblance to the instrumental version of The Endless Knot...but that's a stretch. The album closes pretty good, but I agree that it feels a bit like a drop off. Affinity has the best closer in the entire catalog, so I'm not sure anything will ever touch that in my book.
Vector opens stronger, Affinity closes stronger. As a whole, it's a push. Both are great albums.
Sure, it's not a Van Halen song, but is it a "1985"? :lol
-Marc.
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After a few more listens, Puzzle Box and Veil are the clear standouts. Veil took some time, but I am really liking that one now. I love how the keyboard does that really cool understated lead under the riffing during what I would call the main theme, and then near the end the guitar does that theme almost as a solo. Very cool.
I just wish the rest of the album was as strong as those two songs.
One thing is for certain: the album sounds awesome. Those guitar tones are absolutely killer.
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I will echo the idea that this feels a bit like Affinity's "heavier little brother". Some songs are better, some others don't quite match up.
The opening is better. I grew to love Initiate, but I still think it's the weak link from Affinity. The Good Doctor is a FAR better opener, and grabs you right away. Puzzle Box is good...but it's no 1984. I'm over the moon about Veil and think that it's quite a bit better than The Architect. Nil By Mouth is the odd one out. A great instrumental, but it doesn't feel like anything from Affinity that I can think of. Possibly some resemblance to the instrumental version of The Endless Knot...but that's a stretch. The album closes pretty good, but I agree that it feels a bit like a drop off. Affinity has the best closer in the entire catalog, so I'm not sure anything will ever touch that in my book.
Vector opens stronger, Affinity closes stronger. As a whole, it's a push. Both are great albums.
Sure, it's not a Van Halen song, but is it a "1985"? :lol
-Marc.
DOH!!!! :facepalm: :rollin
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I love every second of the album, it just really disappoints me that it's so short. If this album was ~20 minutes longer and used that to fix the odd pacing it would probably be my favorite, provided it maintained the same level of quality. And half the songs were already released as singles, which made the whole listening experience less powerful imo.
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As soon as it kicked in, the first time I heard the guitar solo in Veil, one word immediately sprang to mind: Petrucci.
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So, a few days after the initial hype/expectation has worn off, I'm listening to Vector again. I think I enjoy it a bit more now. Veil, Host, and Puzzle Box are probably my three favorites, but there each track has something that I like. So, consider my previous 6/10 changed to a 7/10. It still doesn't replace Affinity as my favorite Haken album, but altogether, it is still quite good.
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Finally had the chance to listen to this thing, as my pre-order arrived today. One listen in and I'm not feeling this one at all. I'm quite underwhelmed. Veil and especially Nil By Mouth struck me as actually bad, which is not exactly a nice thing to say. Host was enjoyable, as was The Good Doctor, the other two (three if you count Clear, which I thought was an awesome opener) are 'alright' at best right now. Keep in mind this is after one listen. I can hear a lot if interesting stuff going on, but nothing has really grabbed me yet.
Rankings, because we do that shit at DTF:
1. The Good Doctor
2. Host
3. Clear
4. A Cell Divides
5. Puzzle Box
6. Veil
7. Nil by Mouth
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Okay, a bit controversial opinion but here's my ranking:
1. Puzzle Box
2. Nil By Mouth
3. The Good Doctor
4. Veil
5. A Cell Divides
6. Host
7. Clear
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1. Puzzle Box
2. The Good Doctor
3. Veil
4. A Cell Divides
5. Host
6. Nil By Mouth
7. Clear
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1. Host
2. Veil
3. Puzzle Box
4. A Cell Divides
5. The Good Doctor
6. Nil By Mouth
7. Clear
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I'm glad to see some appreciation for Clear as an intro. Openers of that kind are often throwaway tracks (remember affinity.exe), but Clear is surprisingly enjoyable on its own.
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I like Clear and particularly the way it uses one of the themes from Host, but I wouldn't say I love it. It's definitely pretty cheesy in a theme-park-rollercoaster-queue sort of way.
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...theme-park-rollercoaster-queue sort of way.
Say, have you heard of Haken? They are famous for their circus music :corn
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...theme-park-rollercoaster-queue sort of way.
Say, have you heard of Haken? They are famous for their circus music :corn
You really don't know who you are talking to don't you. LOL Get ready to have your mind blown. :lol
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...theme-park-rollercoaster-queue sort of way.
Say, have you heard of Haken? They are famous for their circus music :corn
You really don't know who you are talking to don't you. LOL Get ready to have your mind blown. :lol
Pretty sure he does know and was joking around.
And yeah the stuff that gets described as "circus music" on Aquarius I also find quite cheesy.
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:lol
Well damn. He typed that with a straight face! :lol
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I love Clear. I think it could have been improved with some samples of people screaming and such, basically the scene described with the first few lines of The Good Doctor.
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Clear is a cool intro, but it feels weird to rank it amongst the other songs.
Also, first night of the tour is tonight! Someone please post the set list. :hat
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Also, first night of the tour is tonight! Someone please post the set list. :hat
Yes! Very interested to see what’s the setlist :corn
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(From Reddit, I wasn't at the show)
Clear
The Good Doctor
Falling Back To Earth
Puzzle Box
Nil By Mouth
1985
Veil
Encore: Crystalized
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Seven songs? At an hour-ten that's pretty weak.
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Yeah, only about 73-75 minutes of music, unless there were some expanded/jamming sections.
I'll be interested to see what songs they swap out over the course of the tour, if any.
-Marc.
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Well, I really hope European shows will be longer and have better setlist than this.
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Don’t forget it’s basically a coheadlining tour, so leprous will be doing about the same amount. That’s a pretty normal set length considering
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Yeah that's normal length for a co headline set.
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Yeah, but I'm lukewarm on both Crystallized and 1985. Nil by Mouth hasn't clicked with me yet. That leaves only four songs to enjoy, though I guess 1985 will be fun in live setting.
My ticket to the Hamburg show says "Haken plus special guest", so I hope they'll have a bit more time for their set.
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Man they picked out my least favourite Affinity song, my least favourite epic, and my 2/4 Vector songs are my bottom 2 :lol
I'm still not sure whether I'm going to the Haken gig but this isn't looking like my kinda show :/
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I like the song choices....but ya, way too short. :mehlin
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I'm five listens in and I still think this album is awesome. Pretty much every song is great. I like it way more than Affinity and Visions.
Also I just realized that the middle section of Veil (4:00 - 7:00) reminds me of some Porcupine Tree / Steven Wilson song. I don't remember which one though, but the vocal melodies are almost exactly the same if I recall correctly. Anyone?
Yes I heard it too, Hag - Storm Corrosion
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Second listen this morning in the car, after being rather unconvinced with the first listen last night (read my last post in this thread for my 'first impression'). I feel like I was a little too harsh with that post, but I feel the album still has some room to grow (i.e. the second listen was better to me, but still a little underwhelming).
- I still think Clear is an awesome opener.
- The Good Doctor is amazing and might be the best 'single'-ish song they have done.
- Puzzle Box was focking weird last night, but today it clicked a little. Instrumentally, it's impressive, but the chorus didn't grab me at all, but now it did. I still think the middle part is weird, but this song has definite potential to grow on me, for sure.
- Veil is still somewhat of a mess. The first 7 minutes are good, some of it seriously good, but at (and just before) the 7 minute mark, Haken manages to pull off the most jarring transition they have ever done. What a way to lose the flow. The second part builds up nicely, but the way the two parts of the song are linked is just .. not good.
- Nil by Mouth doesn't interest me. There's too much same-ey stuff going on throughout the song, with too little repeating themes (or hell: melody). Again, like Puzzle Box, it's an instrumentally impressive feat, but it's just no fun to listen to. Give me Portals any day of the week. That one is actually awesome. This one, not so much.
- Host got better with the second listen as well. Great tune. I read on Facebook someone call this 'Sun if it was good'. While I see where that person's getting from, I don't think the comparison applies, simply because they're both 'ballads'. Sun is good, this one is slightly less good. The climax at the end of the song is a highlight of the album though.
- A Cell Divides.. I've seen someone call this one 'Haken trying to be Leprous', but I don't see that at all. Yes, it's a little more rhythmic than their other work and I can see how the comparison is drawn to songs like Illuminate, but vocally and melodically it's very unlike Leprous. This one got a lot better on second listen. Very nice, catchy tune. It doesn't really feel like a closer though.. yet.
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Also fun: the vinyl I got has the Verbal Summator after some moments of silence. That was a nice surprise. Initially I thought my record playing was skipping, but then I realised what was going on. The CD I received with the LP, which is what I listened to this morning, also includes the verbal summator. Then I checked Spotify, and A Cell Divides is 4:57 there, while mine is slightly over 6 minutes. On Wikipedia it shows as 4:57 as well. Can other CD owners (maybe people who got a regular copy, and not the vinyl) confirm/deny whether or not the verbal summator is included? :)
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I have the special edition CDs and Verbal Summator is included on both discs.
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I am making yet another attempt to get into Haken. I think this is attempt #4 now.
Some cool music going on, but I really can't get past the singer. His voice is so bland it actually hurts. Honestly they'd have been better grabbing a random person off the street and asking them to sing instead.
It's like going to a really good Indian restaurant, renowned for fabulous cooking, mouth-watering flavours and great inventive use of spices, and being served a plate of boiled peas and mayonnaise.
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I have the special edition CDs and Verbal Summator is included on both discs.
Both discs? That's weird, it should only be at the end of the insturmental one. Or maybe that's just the digital downloads, whereas the physical CDs have it on both?
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The physical discs come with 7 tracks each. The instrumental disc includes Clear and Nil by Mouth. Verbal Summator comes after A Cell divides on both discs.
Kind of a bummer that the download version omits Verbal Summator on the regular A Cell divides.
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Does anyone know who headlined last night? Leprous also did an encore so it's not clear to me judging by setlist.fm They played 12 songs but their songs are shorter.
As for Haken's setlist, kind of bummed it's only 7 songs. Thought 8 or 9 would be possible with a couple shorter songs or a softer song thrown in there. The song choices are pretty stellar though IMO, the three best tracks from Vector, no cockroach king (Much prefer Falling Back to Earth). I'm interested to see what they switch up, assuming they do.
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Don’t forget it’s basically a coheadlining tour, so leprous will be doing about the same amount. That’s a pretty normal set length considering
A co-headline show shouldn't mean that each band plays half a set. Each band could easily play 90 minutes here. I'm just fine with the setlist, and even though I hate TGD they're getting it out of the way early. I'd prefer something other than Puzzle Box, but it's not a dealbreaker. Hopefully they'll alternate encores. Wouldn't surprise me if Cockroach gets played tonight. I'd love for them to go back to Crystalized/Celestial, but I'm not banking on it.
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Looking at my ticket for Saturday...
Doors at 5pm, Show starts at 6pm.
Bent Knee from 6 to 6:30, Haken/Leprous 7-8:30, Haken/Leprous 9-10:30 ? Why isn't 90 minute sets possible? 11pm usually is the end time.
I'm wondering if it's first night of the tour issues and things got delayed cutting sets short? They've got some time to work out the kinks before Saturday at least if thats the case.
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Looking at my ticket for Saturday...
Doors at 5pm, Show starts at 6pm.
Bent Knee from 6 to 6:30, Haken/Leprous 7-8:30, Haken/Leprous 9-10:30 ? Why isn't 90 minute sets possible? 11pm usually is the end time.
I'm wondering if it's first night of the tour issues and things got delayed cutting sets short? They've got some time to work out the kinks before Saturday at least if thats the case.
Haken played that venue last year, also on a Saturday night, and the venue turned over after the concert was over for some sort of hip hop club event, so I wouldn't be surprised if there's something totally different going on in that space after the concert.
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I just listened to the album, and I have to say, the band seems to be stuck with old tricks in writing their instrumentals / solos. I kept on thinking "I heard them do that before"
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Looking at my ticket for Saturday...
Doors at 5pm, Show starts at 6pm.
Bent Knee from 6 to 6:30, Haken/Leprous 7-8:30, Haken/Leprous 9-10:30 ? Why isn't 90 minute sets possible? 11pm usually is the end time.
I'm wondering if it's first night of the tour issues and things got delayed cutting sets short? They've got some time to work out the kinks before Saturday at least if thats the case.
Haken played that venue last year, also on a Saturday night, and the venue turned over after the concert was over for some sort of hip hop club event, so I wouldn't be surprised if there's something totally different going on in that space after the concert.
Yea, true. I vaguely remember that. Maybe this show will end at 10pm since it starts at 6?
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Looking at my ticket for Saturday...
Doors at 5pm, Show starts at 6pm.
Bent Knee from 6 to 6:30, Haken/Leprous 7-8:30, Haken/Leprous 9-10:30 ? Why isn't 90 minute sets possible? 11pm usually is the end time.
I'm wondering if it's first night of the tour issues and things got delayed cutting sets short? They've got some time to work out the kinks before Saturday at least if thats the case.
Those changeover times are too long. Hell, Metallica barely needs 30 minutes and they've got 3 dozen wha-wha pedals to setup. If the setlists don't change, at 70 minutes a pop I reckon we're looking at 6-630, 650-8, 820-930. Throw in some fucking-off time here and there and we're out the door at 10. That's nuts.
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Looking at my ticket for Saturday...
Doors at 5pm, Show starts at 6pm.
Bent Knee from 6 to 6:30, Haken/Leprous 7-8:30, Haken/Leprous 9-10:30 ? Why isn't 90 minute sets possible? 11pm usually is the end time.
I'm wondering if it's first night of the tour issues and things got delayed cutting sets short? They've got some time to work out the kinks before Saturday at least if thats the case.
Those changeover times are too long. Hell, Metallica barely needs 30 minutes and they've got 3 dozen wha-wha pedals to setup. If the setlists don't change, at 70 minutes a pop I reckon we're looking at 6-630, 650-8, 820-930. Throw in some fucking-off time here and there and we're out the door at 10. That's nuts.
Yea, that's really disappointing honestly. And yes, I was padding the times to try and make sense of how they are only giving us 75 minutes each when it seems possible to do more.
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Some venues have curfews, some of the times might the bands' decisions in order to leave a certain place in order to travel and get to the other place on time.
Seems like there is a lot of equipment to be used by all of the bands. Also, not sure how the merch is handled (like the bands themselves handle it or if they have a dedicated merch guy/lady). I know Skyharbor doesn't have a merch person and they sell all the merch themselves. They ended their set at 1030pm so they could have 60-90 mins to sell merch...
Speaking of Skyharbor, at their meet and greet, they said they had to trim the crew and that's why they do everything themselves (each band member has a task assigned). From being gear techs and hauling gear, to selling merch, to act as a band manager, etc in order to maximize their profit. I think it was the band and 1 more person to help the band.
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After a ton of listens (and I still need) more I'm really enjoying the album. I also spent some more time with their whole discography. Currently my ranking would be as follows:
Visions
Affinity
The Mountain
Vector
Aquarius
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Haken was the headliner last night, found out via YouTube. Someone has a video of puzzle box up.
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Haken was the headliner last night, found out via YouTube. Someone has a video of puzzle box up.
Cool, I'll have to check that out. Keen to see if they've used Pete's electronic drum programming for the middle section on backing track or if Ray and/or Diego do something different live.
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Haken was the headliner last night, found out via YouTube. Someone has a video of puzzle box up.
Cool, I'll have to check that out. Keen to see if they've used Pete's electronic drum programming for the middle section on backing track or if Ray and/or Diego do something different live.
He did a great job on that track, btw! :tup
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Haken was the headliner last night, found out via YouTube. Someone has a video of puzzle box up.
Cool, I'll have to check that out. Keen to see if they've used Pete's electronic drum programming for the middle section on backing track or if Ray and/or Diego do something different live.
He did a great job on that track, btw! :tup
Thanks, I'll pass the compliment on! It worked out pretty nicely that the band were looking for something along the sort of lines that Pete had spent a couple of years working on for his solo electronic work, and he enjoyed doing it.
I also hadn't realised (only discovered from the liner notes) that Pete Rinaldi from Headspace, who some fans may remember filled in on bass for Haken between Tom leaving and Conner joining, also contributed some guitar work in Veil and Host. Not sure what he played and whether it included any of the solos, but that's pretty cool.
Anyway checked out the live Puzzle Box on youtube and even by Bootleg standards the sound is pretty poor so I can't really work out how they did the electronics. It sounds like it might have been there in the background, but with Ray also playing some live drums over it.
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Yea, it wasn't really that great of a video so I didn't link it when I mentioned it, but I used that video to extract some info from the person who saw the show.
I'm looking to catch some good video on Saturday.
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Man they picked out my least favourite Affinity song, my least favourite epic, and my 2/4 Vector songs are my bottom top 2
Fixed :)
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They seem to end their sets with an epic each time and it's getting a bit too predictable. I'd honestly rather hear 2 shorter songs in their place. Perfect opportunity to debut Bound By Gravity at the start of the encore and finish off with an upbeat track. Also they did Falling Back To Earth on their last US run sop I'm a bit disappointed they didn't substitute it with something they haven't played. Vector is still growing on me. I'm not in love with it immediately the way I was with Affinity and The Mountain, but I'm liking every single song pretty much (with Nil By Mouth being my favorite so far).
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I also hadn't realised (only discovered from the liner notes) that Pete Rinaldi from Headspace, who some fans may remember filled in on bass for Haken between Tom leaving and Conner joining, also contributed some guitar work in Veil and Host. Not sure what he played and whether it included any of the solos, but that's pretty cool.
Didn't know that, but it makes sense, since Pete Rinaldi has been a guest on every studio release since he filled in as bassist for them:
- Restoration - acoustic guitar on Crystallised
- Affinity - acoustic guitar on Bound By Gravity
And now he's credited as a guest on two songs on Vector. I think it's really cool that they keep inviting him to guest on every release, as he is/was technically also part of the Haken family.
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Knowing nothing about that guy, that does seem pretty cool to keep him involved in some way. Nice to not see a bitter end.
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Knowing nothing about that guy, that does seem pretty cool to keep him involved in some way. Nice to not see a bitter end.
He's the guitar player for Headspace. They're a great prog metal band with Damian Wilson on vocals and Adam Wakeman (Rick's son) on keys. Their first album is AMAZING, I recommend you to check that one out :tup Their second is good too, but the first is my fav.
Haken toured with Headspace for a while iirc, so that's where they (probably) know each other. His direct relationship with Haken comes as he was asked to fill in as their bassist after Tom left and before they could audition a new bass player.
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Knowing nothing about that guy, that does seem pretty cool to keep him involved in some way. Nice to not see a bitter end.
Haken toured with Headspace for a while iirc, so that's where they (probably) know each other.
2012. The 'Anonymous Visions Tour'. Haken had just released Visions and Headspace had just released I Am Anoymous. Both bands played the albums in full. Those were cool gigs.
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That is pretty cool, I didn't discover Haken until a little over 2 years ago so their history is not something I really know much about. I'd love to see VIsions performed fully. Probably should have gone to Progpower 18.
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I am surprised at how short that set list is (barely breaks 70 minutes, and the times I have seen co-headliners, they both seem to get close to 90 minutes), but it is hard to argue with the selection of older songs. Good to see they left A Cell Divides off, although I am sure that will get played once they do a headlining on their own with a full length set.
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Same set, I wonder if there will be any rotation at all. I feel like that would be nice for the fans since they aren't playing a whole lot of songs.
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Given the limited number of songs, I'd be surprised if anything gets rotated. I can't imagine rehearsing a song as long as Crystallized and rotating it. And it's cool that Falling Back to Earth is getting played since that was not played on the US tour last year where they hit a bunch of new cities they had not played before (like mine!). It does look weird to see them doing a set with neither The Endless Knot nor Cockroach King, two songs I thought would be live mainstays.
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Sometimes you give the big song a break for a leg of a tour. Perfect timing with the shorter set.
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Yea, but I'd hope for Haken they wouldn't develop a setlist mainstay. I'm really happy to see them drop those two songs. 1985 is probably my favorite Haken song so if that's the mainstay, I'm OK but even then, I'd be cool if that wasn't the case. As it stands now, I've seen Haken twice and the only songs I haven't seen live from this set are the new ones. Definitely wish they played one or two more songs to include maybe something not played much like Lapse or something short from Visions.
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Yeah, I was expecting to see a setlist closer to 90 minutes, so this is a little bit disappointing given that I'm traveling to see multiple dates. Still though, love every song on the list and I FINALLY get to see Crystallised live :metal
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Yeah, I was expecting to see a setlist closer to 90 minutes, so this is a little bit disappointing given that I'm traveling to see multiple dates. Still though, love every song on the list and I FINALLY get to see Crystallised live :metal
I mean, unless they happen to swap it out for something.
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Oh snap!
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Yeah, I was expecting to see a setlist closer to 90 minutes, so this is a little bit disappointing given that I'm traveling to see multiple dates. Still though, love every song on the list and I FINALLY get to see Crystallised live :metal
I mean, unless they happen to swap it out for something.
I will end you if that happens.
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WWE IN BOSTON!!!
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WWE IN BOSTON!!!
Haken is gonna cover Neal Morse's World Without End??
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:lol
I still feel like I should type WWF.
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:lol
I still feel like I should type WWF.
:sadpanda: :sadpanda: :sadpanda:
-Marc.
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No, wrestling. Not the song! :lol
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No, wrestling. Not the song! :lol
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/2/24/WWF_logo.svg/1200px-WWF_logo.svg.png)
-Marc.
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I finally got around to listening to the album today and Veil is the one track that really stands out to me. It feels a bit bloated, but it's definitely my favorite so far. I'm super excited to have new Haken to listen to, it's the most excited I've been for a new album since SW's To The Bone.
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I did not know! :lol
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Vector keeps getting better just like I knew it would. These guys are in a fuckin' zone. :hat
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I've listened to Vector a couple of times, and I have to say that I've been kinda disappointed. It's not bad, but I feel that it runs together a little too much. There are some standout tracks, like "Clear"/"The Good Doctor", "Veil" and "Host", but I find the album to more one-dimensional than previous Haken albums and that's kind of a shame. I'll give it some more listens, undoubtedly, but the fact that I can't even, off the top of my head remember what the other three songs sound like is not a good sign. :-\
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2 spins isn't enough to recall everything. I'm probably at 5 spins now and it's still not enough.
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Eh, there were plenty of memorable moments that stuck with me from the first listen on on both The Mountain and Affinity. But, like I said, I'm not writing the album off. It's just not hit me as immediately as other Haken albums have and as I had hoped it would.
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Even though the album is very short, it's their hardest to digest. With Affinity, for example, the songs I loved on my first listen are still my favorites now (1985, The Endless Knot, Lapse, The Architect), and the ones I didn't like with my first few spins are still the ones I dislike to this day (Earthrise specially). One or two got better with each listen, like Red Giant, which I really like now, but for the most part, my opinion for the songs hasn't changed much through the years.
Vector feels completely different. After my first 2-3 listens, I still felt like the songs blurred with each other, and it just felt like a single heavy/riffy song all the way through. It's gotten better with more listens, but I still don't know how to rank it against the other albums. Definitely doesn't top The Mountain or Visions, though.
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After listening to the album a few times, my primary hot take is that Host and A Cell Divides are better Leprous songs than anything on Malina, that's for sure.
Beyond that, Ray Hearne is the star of the show for me on this record. I thought Diego was the star of Affinity in terms of both playing and the soundscapes and textures he created. This time around, it seems like he primarily confined himself to doubling the guitar lines and then coming up with the bleeps and bloops. Kinda disappointed there. But, Ray's drumming is pretty much God tier on Vector. That, and Nolly's mix is pretty solid as well.
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After about 5 listens, I'm enjoying it, some nice new ideas/styles. I'm constantly getting several parts stuck in my head, which I always find is a good sign. The length is definitely disappointing though, it's a huge difference to what they've done before - over 15 minutes shorter than their next shortest. What makes things doubly frustrating is that Veil takes up more than a quarter of the run time and it's the song I'm struggling to get in to the most. Their longer songs are usually among my favourites, so I'm really hoping it grows on me a lot more.
The other thing I'm finding is that I don't feel like there's any 'god-tier' tracks here. All their other releases have at least 1 song which I rank among my absolute favourites. Hopefully that will come in time, but I'm not sure at the moment.
Don't want to sound too harsh though, because I do really like it and I still feel like they are yet to release any duds which is very impressive after 5 albums and an EP!
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Show last night in Montreal was phenomenal. Bent Knee was REALLY good, I only knew a couple of their older songs and they played all new ones, but I still enjoyed myself. Leprous, who I have been getting into over the last couple months, was also amazing! They played 2 or 3 songs I didn't recognize, and they also had a cellist with them that opened before Bonneville with a solo. (Anyone know who he is? Is he a new permanent member that I didn't know about?) The highlight of their set I think was probably The Valley, The Price, and Slave, the latter two of which were part of the encore.
But Haken was just next level. Ross was SO on point, it mad me very happy to see how he's improved live over the years. Everyone else performed amazingly as well, no surprise. Hen did fuck up the beginning of the tapping part of Falling Back to Earth a wee bit but it was more funny than anything. Highlight for me was probably Veil and Crystallized, but that's pushing it because the whole show was a highlight pretty much.
Interesting side note, Leprous changed their setlist but Haken did not.
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The more I listen, the more Nil By Mouth sounds like Metallica - Orion. I'm enjoying it a lot though. I bet it kicks ass live.
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The cellist touring with Leprous is most likely Raphael Weinroth-Browne. He played cello on the Leprous albums Coal and Malina.
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Interestingly, I enjoyed Vector on its first spin more than I enjoyed Affinity on its first spin.
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They announced the NYC show tomorrow is a sell out :metal
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They announced the NYC show tomorrow is a sell out :metal
As is Boston.
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WOOOOTTTT!!!
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What does the place hold? 150?? ;D
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What does the place hold? 150?? ;D
We don't allow your type here. Lol
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Aren't there people like having dinner while the concert is going on? :lol
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Aren't there people like having dinner while the concert is going on? :lol
You're in bed by then.
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The cellist touring with Leprous is most likely Raphael Weinroth-Browne. He played cello on the Leprous albums Coal and Malina.
That's him, but he wasn't on Coal. Just Malina.
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Saw them in Philly last night. I actually think Leprous upstaged them a bit and from where I was standing, they also seemed to have a bigger crowd presence. I can see how people would like Bent Knee, but they just were not my thing at all. There's just something about some female vocalists where it feels like their voices sit above the music and never quite "blend" and that's what I heard. Overall, it was an excellent show. Haken's set flew by and all the bands played really well. Leprous' drummer is from another planet...that guy is incredibly good.
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Saw them in Philly last night. I actually think Leprous upstaged them a bit and from where I was standing, they also seemed to have a bigger crowd presence. I can see how people would like Bent Knee, but they just were not my thing at all. There's just something about some female vocalists where it feels like their voices sit above the music and never quite "blend" and that's what I heard. Overall, it was an excellent show. Haken's set flew by and all the bands played really well. Leprous'Haken's drummer is from another planet...that guy is incredibly good.
Sorry, I had to.
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Saw them in Philly last night. I actually think Leprous upstaged them a bit and from where I was standing, they also seemed to have a bigger crowd presence. I can see how people would like Bent Knee, but they just were not my thing at all. There's just something about some female vocalists where it feels like their voices sit above the music and never quite "blend" and that's what I heard. Overall, it was an excellent show. Haken's set flew by and all the bands played really well. Leprous'Haken's drummer is from another planet...that guy is incredibly good.
Sorry, I had to.
Ray is unreal as well! Affinity is easily in my top 3 recorded drum performances ever. But to my ears, Baard is doing shit that is on a whole other rhythmically complex level.
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Philly show was great last night. After seeing Haken 5 times i can say they just keep getting better. Everybody was on point but I would have to say Ray was ON FIRE!! Man, I thought his arms and legs were going to go flying off ,he was drumming with such measured spasticity some times! The stage was pretty small so the guys were somewhat cramped in their movements but boy did they rock the house. I also had the added bonus of reuniting with my old guitarist who i haven't seen in probably 5 or 6 years. It was his first Haken show and I know he was floored so it just made the evening that much more special. Thanks Lads, see you again soon!
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Nil by Mouth definitely seems like their Dance of Eternity: A technical, syncopated mathematical exercise that will undoubtedly wow fans with the skill it takes to perform a song like that, but one severely lacking in melody. To me, the best full band prog instrumentals (featuring bands of players) are always almost the ones that do a great job of balancing melody and chops, like Erotomania (DT) or La Villa Strangiato (Rush), and, for me, Nil By Mouth tilts way too far to the side of chops at the (largely) absence of melody.
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Saw them in Philly last night. I actually think Leprous upstaged them a bit and from where I was standing, they also seemed to have a bigger crowd presence. I can see how people would like Bent Knee, but they just were not my thing at all. There's just something about some female vocalists where it feels like their voices sit above the music and never quite "blend" and that's what I heard. Overall, it was an excellent show. Haken's set flew by and all the bands played really well. Leprous' drummer is from another planet...that guy is incredibly good.
Second that, Baard is amazing!
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Saw them in Philly last night. I actually think Leprous upstaged them a bit and from where I was standing, they also seemed to have a bigger crowd presence. I can see how people would like Bent Knee, but they just were not my thing at all. There's just something about some female vocalists where it feels like their voices sit above the music and never quite "blend" and that's what I heard. Overall, it was an excellent show. Haken's set flew by and all the bands played really well. Leprous' drummer is from another planet...that guy is incredibly good.
Second that, Baard is amazing!
Indeed. His playing is the only reason I’m considering to give Leprous a chance (never cared for them before). Without derailing the thread too much, which Leprous songs do yo recommend me that have great drumming from Baard?
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Leprous drummer is pretty cool from what I've been listening to during my discovery of them over the last couple of weeks. Looking forward to the NYC show tonight :metal :metal I don't see many youtube videos out yet so seems like a good opportunity to capture a new song or something. Looks like no rain which is great for walking through the city today to get there.
I'm thinking I am going to hunker down at a nearby bar to watch the first half of the PSU game at 3:45 today. If anyone wants to meet up, otherwise I'm sure I'll see some of you at the venue. I have a seat so I'll be along the edge somewhere. :yarr
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Listening to the new album a lot last week and enjoyind it a lot! But it isn’t better that The Mountain neither Affinity IMO. It does sound short because, to me, besides the actual lenght, the last 2 songs are a bit weaker compared to the first 5, wich makes me feel like the album ends at Nil by Mouth (tremendous instrumental, by the way) and have 2 bonus tracks. On a side note, Ray’s drumming is stellar, he’s still getting better every album, very impressive his evolution.
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Nil by Mouth and Dance of Eternity comparison
I agree completely, although I’d say DoE had more melody than NbM.
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Nil by Mouth and Dance of Eternity comparison
I agree completely, although I’d say DoE had more melody than NbM.
To me, their TDOE is Portals, not NBM.
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Yeah I'd say Portals too.
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Portals is so much better than Nil by Mouth.
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I'm five listens in and I still think this album is awesome. Pretty much every song is great. I like it way more than Affinity and Visions.
Also I just realized that the middle section of Veil (4:00 - 7:00) reminds me of some Porcupine Tree / Steven Wilson song. I don't remember which one though, but the vocal melodies are almost exactly the same if I recall correctly. Anyone?
Yes I heard it too, Hag - Storm Corrosion
Hell yes, that's it. This has been bugging me for days.
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Ok. I've listened to it several times over this last week. It's gone through my "5 spin" rule, and I've come to the conclusion that it's very good. I really like every song, and I am enjoying the replays so far.
For any other band, this would be a dynamite album. I suppose the problem is that with Haken, the bar is set so unbelievably high, that the expectations can never be met. In other words, this is the very first Haken album ever released that did not make me go :omg: :omg: :omg: :hefdaddy :hefdaddy :hefdaddy on the first few spins. With album number 5, I got the feeling for the very first time that, "Yup....this sure is a Haken album." Not in a bad way. It's just that Aquarius had its quirks, and then Visions was like SFAM 2.0, and then The Mountain was a huge 90 degree turn, and then Affinity was another sharp shift in sounds and experimentation....but Vector is just a very nice blend of things that they've done before. A sortof "This is encapsulating everything we have done and learned up to this point." And it succeeds on that level. Like a really good flashback episode of your favorite TV show.
But ya, it's going to be my least favorite from them. But that really just speaks to the strength of the rest of the albums, not to any weakness on the part of Vector.
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Very well said, I agree with every word.
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Concert was awesome
I was on the side of the stage, so my angle was not great but certainly cool enough to see the action
Haken - The Good Doctor LIVE @ Highline Ballroom NYC (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wvi75P365QY)
Haken - Nil by Mouth LIVE @ Highline Ballroom NYC (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_4vuqm8C8k)
Also got an extended high five from Ross during the set :metal
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Portals is so much better than Nil by Mouth.
Don't agree at all. The technical level of NBM is just amazing and I really don't understand people who say that there is no melody/harmony at all in this song.
There is melody/harmony in this song. Plus, the band specifically announced that this album would be heavier, more riff- oriented. And when they finally released it, people went all "oh no this is way too riff oriented and there is no melody here, I didn't expect that from a Haken album".
It's natural, Haken is a band that evolves and never does the same twice. It's only normal that there will be people that don't like the new style they explore. But just stating that [this older song] is just so much better than [this never song] just because the band doesn't do the same music they did 3,5 albums ago anymore? Sorry, but that's not what the progressive genre is all about for me.
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Portals is so much better than Nil by Mouth.
Don't agree at all. The technical level of NBM is just amazing and I really don't understand people who say that there is no melody/harmony at all in this song.
There is melody/harmony in this song.
Yeah like the part at 1:16. It’s unfortunate it isn’t repeated later in the song.
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Saw them in Philly last night. I actually think Leprous upstaged them a bit and from where I was standing, they also seemed to have a bigger crowd presence. I can see how people would like Bent Knee, but they just were not my thing at all. There's just something about some female vocalists where it feels like their voices sit above the music and never quite "blend" and that's what I heard. Overall, it was an excellent show. Haken's set flew by and all the bands played really well. Leprous' drummer is from another planet...that guy is incredibly good.
Second that, Baard is amazing!
Indeed. His playing is the only reason I’m considering to give Leprous a chance (never cared for them before). Without derailing the thread too much, which Leprous songs do yo recommend me that have great drumming from Baard?
I'm still discovering Leprous myself (mainly listened to Malina & The Congretation).
At this point I would say Slave and Rewind are some pretty good examples
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Portals is so much better than Nil by Mouth.
Don't agree at all. The technical level of NBM is just amazing and I really don't understand people who say that there is no melody/harmony at all in this song.
There is melody/harmony in this song.
Of course there is melody and harmony in the song. All music has that. The technical level being amazing is something that doesn't especially interest me. You can make extremely technically challenging music that's boring to listen to. Nil by Mouth goes too far on the technical scale for me. I think Portals is a more interesting song/composition and I like it better than nil by Mouth.
Plus, the band specifically announced that this album would be heavier, more riff- oriented. And when they finally released it, people went all "oh no this is way too riff oriented and there is no melody here, I didn't expect that from a Haken album".
This doesn't apply to me.
It's natural, Haken is a band that evolves and never does the same twice. It's only normal that there will be people that don't like the new style they explore.
Are they really doing new stuff on the album though? I don't really feel like they're doing anything 'new' at all. That said, how does my initial statement warrant a reply that suggests I don't 'like the new style they explore'?
But just stating that [this older song] is just so much better than [this never song] just because the band doesn't do the same music they did 3,5 albums ago anymore? Sorry, but that's not what the progressive genre is all about for me.
If this progressive genre is about innovation, then there's bands out there who do far more 'new' stuff than Haken does in their music. Then again, why am I not allowed to think Portals is better than Nil by Mouth? I prefer to listen to that one a lot. Am I supposed to enjoy Nil by Mouth more, simply because 'the band doesn't do the same music they did 3,5 albums ago'? That doesn't make any sense whatsoever.
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This whole discussion seems predicated on Nil By Mouth being super-technical. Which it isn't.
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The technical level of NBM is just amazing and I really don't understand people who say that there is no melody/harmony at all in this song.
Who said that?
There is melody/harmony in this song.
There is, yes, but the technical wizardry is so overpowering that it kind of drowns out what melody is there (for most of the song). The balance is not there.
It's natural, Haken is a band that evolves and never does the same twice.
This cliche, really? This album has plenty of things Haken has done before (and there is nothing wrong with that).
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This whole discussion seems predicated on Nil By Mouth being super-technical. Which it isn't.
I would categorize it more as a (mostly) non-stop riff-fest. The song pretty much runs from one heavy riff to another for the majority of it. The little mellow part a minute in is really cool and I wish that would have been explored more as a theme that appeared more often in the song; it could have given the song a main melodic theme that it ended up lacking.
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Yeah, "riff-heavy" is certainly a better descriptor than "technical".
I love it but (or possibly because) it's pretty intense. I can see why some people won't dig it so much.
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Seem the crowd really loved it last night. I know I did. :yarr
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With some more listens, Nil by Mouth is growing me. It's not as good as the best that this album has to offer, but the better I understand it, the more I appreciate it as well. Some of the riffs are absolutely massive in a way that Haken have rarely been before.
Sadly, Puzzle Box and A Cell Divides still haven't really clicked for me. I like them when I listen to them, but nothing is really memorable. If I weren't listening to A Cell Divides right now, I couldn't tell you what it sounds like.
Because this is DTF: tentative rankings!
1. Veil
2. Host
3. Clear/The Good Doctor
4. Nil by Mouth
5. A Cell Divides
6. Puzzle Box
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Interesting. Because Puzzle Box and A Cell Divides are the two that are the most stuck in my brain. Specifically, the main riff for PB, and the chorus for ACD.
Everything you described is what I've been thinking about Host.
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Subject to change:
Veil
Puzzle Box
Clear/The Good Doctor
A Cell Divides
Nil By Mouth
Host
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I would go:
Veil
Puzzle Box
Host
Clear/A Good Doctor
Nil by Mouth
A Cell Divides (which I am pretty sure will become only the 3rd Haken song I delete from my iTunes)
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Host
Puzzle Box
A Cell Divides
Clear / The Good Doctor
Veil (still very good)
Nil By Mouth (not very good)
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My previous ranking still stands:
1. Puzzle Box
2. The Good Doctor
3. Veil
4. A Cell Divides
5. Host
6. Nil By Mouth
7. Clear
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The new material slays live, especially TGD and NBM imo.
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I might have liked the setlist better last time (more diversity and longer) but I think last night was my favorite of the three times I have now seen them. Thought they sounded fantastic and seemed tight all around. Great performance and lots of energy. Leprous was really good too, seemed they ended on an energetic high note and then Haken took it from there. I'd agree that the new material slays live, probably better than the album IMO. Some of the songs just had that added live energy. No real surprises though, the same set they've been playing. But during Crystilized, there were a couple crowd surfers. The first one getting helped on stage by Ross who then said it was officially the first crowd surfer of the tour :lol I had a VIP seat ticket, it was sold out but there were lots of open spots along the side of the stage. I think everyone who had this type of ticket spent their time on the balcony which was packed so I ended up having a full booth to myself which was kind of awkward for a bit, but then they moved the side mixing board during Leprous which allowed me to then get super close essentially just on the side of their stage. Not the best view, but at least I wasn't sitting in a booth alone and I was rocking out with my own space and closeness with the band (and a Mom who rocked out with me the entire Haken set). At one point Ross reached over and there was just enough room from the barrier to get a high five. Was a pretty cool moment. Also was nice to catch up with El Barto before and after the show for a bit :metal
Just finished making my full video of the concert, hope you enjoy:
Haken and Leprous live at sold out Highline Ballroom NYC (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZH2Tr-O2yg)
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I really like A Cell Divides, but it's probably still my least favourite Haken album closer.
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1. Puzzle box
2. The Good doctor
3. Veil
4. Nil by mouth
5. Host
6. A Cell divides
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1. Puzzle Box
2. Nil By Mouth
3. A Cell Divides
4. The Good Doctor
5. Veil
6. Host
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1. Veil
2. Puzzle Box
3. Host
4. The Good Doctor
5. A Cell Divides
6. Nil By Mouth
7. Clear
Every song on the album is good IMO, it feels weird putting Nil By Mouth towards the bottom because I do enjoy it. I was also at the show in NYC on Saturday and it was awesome :metal This band deserves to play in bigger and better venues than that.
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Apparently Jordan Rudess was at the NYC show this Saturday.
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Fantastic show in Boston last night. Haken is really evolving live. So damn tight.
(https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/550x500q90/924/xmBcFI.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/f/poxmBcFIj)
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:metal :metal
Apparently Jordan Rudess was at the NYC show this Saturday.
Nice, would have been cool for him to come out or to have seen him. I had a good view of the side stage and could see just behind the stage, I didn't catch any glimpse of him.
This band deserves to play in bigger and better venues than that.
Hopefully they keep building on their success and we seem them play at bigger and better spots. I don't dislike the Highline Ballroom though.
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That was a crazy DTF meetup! Certainly did not expect to run into El Barto at a Cambridge show!!
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Really liking the album a lot and at this point, I would have to say that Veil is my favorite thus far. :hefdaddy
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That was a crazy DTF meetup! Certainly did not expect to run into El Barto at a Cambridge show!!
Huge surprise. Glad we all got to hang out!
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Anyone going to the Orlando show?
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Apparently Jordan Rudess was at the NYC show this Saturday.
I can confirm that. He was literally right in front of me at one point, sitting at one of the tables on the balcony level. I’m not the kind of person that would go up to him and start talking to him, especially because he looked like he was trying not to be noticed with his black baseball cap on tilted downwards :lol
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Apparently Jordan Rudess was at the NYC show this Saturday.
I can confirm that. He was literally right in front of me at one point, sitting at one of the tables on the balcony level. I’m not the kind of person that would go up to him and start talking to him, especially because he looked like he was trying not to be noticed with his black baseball cap on tilted downwards :lol
He can wear all the kinds of hats/caps he wants, but he can't hide that world famous beard :lol
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That was a crazy DTF meetup! Certainly did not expect to run into El Barto at a Cambridge show!!
Huge surprise. Glad we all got to hang out!
Yeah, really glad I got to meet up with you guys (and the Queen). I've seen plenty of the NY/NJ crowd, as well as the Connecticut guys, so getting to a Boston show to meet up with the gang was something I was keen to do. Sorry Rumbo didn't make it to the bar afterward, and that Tim has such questionable taste in music.
Did make it to the Happy Toast place and thought it was very good. I don't generally go in for French toast, but gave theirs a shot and it was excellent.
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Apparently Jordan Rudess was at the NYC show this Saturday.
I can confirm that. He was literally right in front of me at one point, sitting at one of the tables on the balcony level. I’m not the kind of person that would go up to him and start talking to him, especially because he looked like he was trying not to be noticed with his black baseball cap on tilted downwards :lol
I should have spent more than 1 minute on the balcony
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That was a crazy DTF meetup! Certainly did not expect to run into El Barto at a Cambridge show!!
Huge surprise. Glad we all got to hang out!
Yeah, really glad I got to meet up with you guys (and the Queen). I've seen plenty of the NY/NJ crowd, as well as the Connecticut guys, so getting to a Boston show to meet up with the gang was something I was keen to do. Sorry Rumbo didn't make it to the bar afterward, and that Tim has such questionable taste in music.
Did make it to the Happy Toast place and thought it was very good. I don't generally go in for French toast, but gave theirs a shot and it was excellent.
Yeah that restaurant has some great and eclectic food.
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In case people have missed it by the way...
The HAKEN Survivor 2018 is running in Polls/Survivors. Join in :)
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I see from set list.com that Leprous is mixing up the setlist a bit. Looks like they have played 2 songs from Bilateral on separate nights. Would like Haken to do the same.
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I see from set list.com that Leprous is mixing up the setlist a bit. Looks like they have played 2 songs from Bilateral on separate nights. Would like Haken to do the same.
Yea sucks they played the bilateral stuff at other shows, I would have liked that very much. It seems Haken aren't going to do it. I'm guessing since their performance was tight and heavy on new music, that they are just sticking to that. I'm hoping they come back around next year or something with a full headline set with some different songs being played.
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Now that you guys mention it, the DT-influence gets more and more prominent the more I hear it, and given the band's participation in Portnoy's Shattered Fortress, it definitely makes sense why they might take inspiration from those songs and music and use it to mold the songs for Vector.
Also surprised by the DT comparisons in a way. I mean Veil has some VERY DT-esque stuff, and there's one short section in Puzzle Box as well (the 2nd verse) but otherwise I don't hear any DT at all.
I absolutely love the album, and it'll probably be my favorite when I do the ranking (I always wait until the listens of the new album have approximately reached the listens of the rest to rank it)...
Having quickly told the personal context of how I'm feeling with the album, there's one tinny thing that it might easily represent yet another easter egg within this album and of which I haven't read or heard anywhere.. It has to do with all what I quoted (specially the bolded parts), and I obviously wouldn't mind writing about this if I weren't so sure..
__________________________________________________
So.. I don't know if they've done this on purpose, like the references to other Haken songs or all the other things related specifically with the concept of the album (like the section of TGD from 1:53 to 2:09 in which the riff structure/time signature resembles the Rorschach's images)... but there are two sections that are VERY similar to other "two sections" of two DT songs (which is why I'm a bit surprised no one here mentioned it or realized the similarities, being this a DT forum after all).. I say "two sections", because they are actually four, only that splitted into two different DT songs.. No surprise here keeping in mind the MP's Shattered Fortress shows they've played lots of times just before writing Vector... the songs are The Glass Prison and This Dying Soul.. As songs that are part from the same "saga", they share a few sections, and two out of those are the ones that matter..
First, in Puzzle Box, the structure of the section from 2:44 to 2:59 is not only very similar to TGP 11:39-12:46 and TDS 8:57-9:30, but it's an structure that I don't recall Haken has ever used before -the "structure" is basically intercaling one particular riff with "the" or "a" main riff, which gives you the feeling that the back and forth between the two riffs is never going to finish nor let the song move to another instance.. That "particular riff" is also almost identical to the respective DT ones, almost like being a mixture of the two..
Second, and this one is way more obvious because it involves lyrics, but also more interesting and similar than the previous, the excellent chorus of Veil and its "Save me (...) Teach me (...) Hold me (...) Guide me (...)" not only is textually very similar to the "Help me (...) Save me (...) Heal me (...)" that appears in both DT songs, but the melody is surprisingly almost the same that both DT sort-of-choruses, and, again, it seems like a mixture of the two.. Always talking only about the melody (the bases and time signatures are different in the three mentioned songs/sections)... structurally speaking the choruses of Veil and TGP are almost identical, and they even coincide in having an extra longer phrase in the middle of each "xxxx me"; musically speaking, Veil's and TDS' lines share the exact same three main notes! (B-F#-G)
Maybe there are other sections like this, who knows.. And FWIW, I didn't purposely searched any of this.. I just noticed it while listening to the album, which definitely prog-rocks the way it is anyways...
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Confirmed - Veil is the second chapter of 12 step suite :justjen
First, in Puzzle Box, the structure of the section from 2:44 to 2:59 is not only very similar to TGP 11:39-12:46 and TDS 8:57-9:30, but it's an structure that I don't recall Haken has ever used before -the "structure" is basically intercaling one particular riff with "the" or "a" main riff, which gives you the feeling that the back and forth between the two riffs is never going to finish nor let the song move to another instance.. That "particular riff" is also almost identical to the respective DT ones, almost like being a mixture of the two..
I don't hear that.
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Speaking of MP and Haken, seems they hung at his place the other night
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DrSPb63WsAA36t8.jpg:large)
I think there's no doubt their relationship has rubbed off onto their music a bit and I really enjoy it honestly. Vector really grew a lot on me over the last week as I saw the show. I still think it's bottom level only because of it's shortness, in quality it's right up there with the rest of their catalog. I'd love a Vector Pt2
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First, in Puzzle Box, the structure of the section from 2:44 to 2:59 is not only very similar to TGP 11:39-12:46 and TDS 8:57-9:30, but it's an structure that I don't recall Haken has ever used before -the "structure" is basically intercaling one particular riff with "the" or "a" main riff, which gives you the feeling that the back and forth between the two riffs is never going to finish nor let the song move to another instance.. That "particular riff" is also almost identical to the respective DT ones, almost like being a mixture of the two..
I don't hear that.
The structure is the same.. I think that's very clear (pun not intended).. The Haken's section is a lot more shorter than the other two (specially than TGP), but is obviosuly the same technique or type of structure.. Not that is easy to notice, but once you do, is very hard to unheard it..
Again, have in mind that 5/6 members of the band spent a whole year learning, rehearsing and playing live this songs over and over again.. I think it would be a bit bizarre if they would NOT have "adquire" absolutely nothing from any of those songs, even more when they're from the band they respect the most, have been influenced the most and probably the more related to them too..
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Especially since at least parts of the album were written by the band in hotel rooms while touring for Portnoy's Shattered Fortress shows.
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Wow, didn't know that.. But yeah, giving the timing is obvious they had to do that..
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Just left the show, holy fuck are they good.
That encore man... :hefdaddy
Pity I couldn't get any closer though...
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/46456123_1821916967906402_1720551649530871808_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_ht=scontent-sea1-1.xx&oh=cf1e1c4f4c3645e8ac4955e7b59dd0fe&oe=5C670FBE)
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:metal :metal :metal
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Wish I could've seen them. Nice pic by the way.
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I'd love a Vector Pt2
Victor perhaps?
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Just left the show, holy fuck are they good.
That encore man... :hefdaddy
Pity I couldn't get any closer though...
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/46456123_1821916967906402_1720551649530871808_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_ht=scontent-sea1-1.xx&oh=cf1e1c4f4c3645e8ac4955e7b59dd0fe&oe=5C670FBE)
Awesome pic, man!!!
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Just left the show, holy fuck are they good.
That encore man... :hefdaddy
Pity I couldn't get any closer though...
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/46456123_1821916967906402_1720551649530871808_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_ht=scontent-sea1-1.xx&oh=cf1e1c4f4c3645e8ac4955e7b59dd0fe&oe=5C670FBE)
They look like ants..
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Just left the show, holy fuck are they good.
That encore man... :hefdaddy
Pity I couldn't get any closer though...
(https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/46456123_1821916967906402_1720551649530871808_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_ht=scontent-sea1-1.xx&oh=cf1e1c4f4c3645e8ac4955e7b59dd0fe&oe=5C670FBE)
Hey! It that Lonestar?!
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Right? He totally saw my camera out and threw the horns.
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If you were any closer, you'd be ON STAGE, lonestar!
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If you were any closer, you'd be ON STAGE, lonestar!
Actually the first time I saw them it was at a tiny venue with no barrier, so I was leaning on the stage itself. This time there was about a two foot gap.
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My first (well, only) Haken show, My wife and I were right next to the stage, practically in Charlie Griffiths' shadow the entire time.
Needless to say, that was the concert that convinced me that I needed to wear earplugs all of my future concerts. The ringing didn't stop for two or three days. :(
Amazing show though!
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If you were any closer, you'd be ON STAGE, lonestar!
Actually the first time I saw them it was at a tiny venue with no barrier, so I was leaning on the stage itself. This time there was about a two foot gap.
At my first Haken show there was no stage at all. It was at the Bergkeller Reichenbach and the band was playing in a corner of the room on what looked like a blanket or so. In front of maybe 80-100 people (at best).
The band wanted to start the show and Diego started the tape with the intro and when the band wanted to kick in, they realised Ray wasn't there yet, so Ross just sat down behind the drum kit and they jammed a version of Another Brick In The Wall :D Turned out Ray was still in the restroom :rollin
Right in the middle of the show, between two songs, the owner of the place, Uwe, came onto the "stage" with 6 vodkas and Charlie (who was standing right in front of me) was all dude I can't drink this I have to play crazy difficult shit and just gave the shot to me :D So I would clink glasses with Ross and Uwe and then they continued.
During the finale of Visions Charlie just gave me his pick and I strummed the chords. That was very awesome.
This concert really was something else. Never experienced something like this before of after.
Here's a picture taken in the Bergkeller Reichenbach, but this was the second time I saw them there, a few months later. I'm the dude with the glasses between Conner and Diego. There's also a version of this picture where Charlie gives my buddy on the left a kiss on the cheek :D (unfortunately I can't find it)
(https://scontent-vie1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/10636912_10203203093895235_8289923408290338050_o.jpg?_nc_cat=104&_nc_ht=scontent-vie1-1.xx&oh=c9bf5cc0ed10b05036c5bc69afdf3380&oe=5CABC77A)
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Well if we're going down that road, then my first Haken show was also Haken's first Haken show. :P
It was in a tiny pub in London that doesn't even exist anymore, and there were only about 15 people present and almost all of them were family members of the band.
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Tried on my new Haken shirt last night. It looks and feels great.
(https://i.imgur.com/lLLqMci.jpg)
I prefer the beige over the red one.
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Nice. They really are on top of their game right now.
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I have the same shirt and it's awesome indeed. I'm glad to have one more non-black and non-white t-shirt in my collection.
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damn Fritz that seems like a crazy show
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Guys! I decided to get a hotel downtown because it was close to work and close to the venue. And I just met Richard Henshall in the lobby giving guitar lessons to a kid! I think they’re staying in my hotel!
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Tried on my new Haken shirt last night. It looks and feels great.
(https://i.imgur.com/lLLqMci.jpg)
I prefer the beige over the red one.
By looking at the picture, I take it you play mostly bass but some guitar too?
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Guys! I decided to get a hotel downtown because it was close to work and close to the venue. And I just met Richard Henshall in the lobby giving guitar lessons to a kid! I think they’re staying in my hotel!
Awesome, I hope you have a blast! :metal
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Waiting for Haken to take the stage now.
Anyone notice the between band house music is related to the Vector concept? It’s a riot!! :rollin
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Waiting for Haken to take the stage now.
Anyone notice the between band house music is related to the Vector concept? It’s a riot!! :rollin
Yeah I totally caught that. Just brilliant.
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Tried on my new Haken shirt last night. It looks and feels great.
https://i.imgur.com/lLLqMci.jpg
I prefer the beige over the red one.
By looking at the picture, I take it you play mostly bass but some guitar too?
I used to play bass in a band, but we disbanded last year. Now I only play some guitar at home on my own. I have two basses and two guitars (my acoustic isn't shown in the picture).
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That's cool, at least you're still playing. I haven't played in a band for nearly four years, life itself got too heavy and I lost my enthusiasm for playing music. I just can't justify putting the time into it when there's all these other responsibilities that take up time and resources.
I miss playing music in a band and hope to do it again someday.. It's nice to have great bands like Haken and many others to listen to, to fill that void..
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Seems a very kind person filmed and uploaded the whole SF show. Sound is not too shabby either considering his position. Also, if you see an out of place old dude with a bald spot in the bottom left of the screen throw the horns often, that's me :)
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL7MMs4VYxwUbM5_pDAYWpSVMDB9v7OeOE (https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL7MMs4VYxwUbM5_pDAYWpSVMDB9v7OeOE)
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good lord RJ, your new avatar :lol :lol
That is indeed pretty solid sound :metal
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good lord RJ, your new avatar :lol :lol
That is indeed pretty solid sound :metal
Yeah I lost a bet with Chad in another thread :lol
It's surprising how good the sound is considering he's directly to the side of the main monitors. I was amazed it wasn't overblown.
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more side stage videos?! :lol
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Hey guys anyone check out the merch booth for Haken? Is there a Vector vinyl or tab book? If so how much? Thanks!
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Well if we're going down that road, then my first Haken show was also Haken's first Haken show. :P
It was in a tiny pub in London that doesn't even exist anymore, and there were only about 15 people present and almost all of them were family members of the band.
Okay :corn
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I'm falling in love with Veil :heart
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Hey guys anyone check out the merch booth for Haken? Is there a Vector vinyl or tab book? If so how much? Thanks!
Yes. Vinyls are $40. There is also a Vector drum book by Ray. I believe that was 30.
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Considering the blizzard sweeping through the Central Plains, I'll be interested to see if they make it to Lawrence, KC for tonight's show.
Might be safer to postpone it and head straight to St Louis for tomorrow night's show. :hat
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I'm falling in love with Veil :heart
I came in here to post this too :lol
I've considered Veil to be a very good track since the release day, but it's only gotten better with each listen. I especially love the first verses ("In the witching hour I'll staaaay").
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My favorite from Vector as well, loved it from the beginning. It has the best vocal melodies on the album IMO.
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Puzzle Box is still my favourite, but Veil is close behind.
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Considering the blizzard sweeping through the Central Plains, I'll be interested to see if they make it to Lawrence, KC for tonight's show.
Might be safer to postpone it and head straight to St Louis for tomorrow night's show. :hat
They're just happy to be playing indoors tonight. In Dallas they had to play outdoors in sub-freezing weather.
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Hey guys anyone check out the merch booth for Haken? Is there a Vector vinyl or tab book? If so how much? Thanks!
Yes. Vinyls are $40. There is also a Vector drum book by Ray. I believe that was 30.
Thanks. Unfortunately I had to leave early because of the snowstorm so I missed the merch booth. Haken was excellent though. Bummer about Bent Knee.
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Hey guys anyone check out the merch booth for Haken? Is there a Vector vinyl or tab book? If so how much? Thanks!
Yes. Vinyls are $40. There is also a Vector drum book by Ray. I believe that was 30.
Thanks. Unfortunately I had to leave early because of the snowstorm so I missed the merch booth. Haken was excellent though. Bummer about Bent Knee.
What about Bent Knee? They really stole the show in Seattle. That's the first time in 20 years that I've heard something that I absolutely could not describe (in a good way). The closest I can come is what a friend said....that they sounded a little like a young Grace Slick singing for Thank You Scientist with a dash of Frank Zappa. I would add maybe just a dash of The Mars Volta maybe. But they are really unique. I picked up 2 CDs from them.
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Tour bus accident, Bent Knee are fine but had to miss the show and are trying to catch back up to the tour. Really sucks and feel bad for them.
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Tour bus accident, Bent Knee are fine but had to miss the show and are trying to catch back up to the tour. Really sucks and feel bad for them.
Awwww man. That does suck. :'(
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They are a good band and Ben Levin’s YouTube videos are a must if you’re a musician (especially guitar players). Bummed they couldn’t make it.
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Could anybody pick up a Vector drumming book? I can pay for it plus shipping and beer money or I could trade it for a Haken VIP XL shirt. Whatever your choice. PM please. I live in the states. Dumb for not picking it up in Austin.
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Could anybody pick up a Vector drumming book? I can pay for it plus shipping and beer money or I could trade it for a Haken VIP XL shirt. Whatever your choice. PM please. I live in the states. Dumb for not picking it up in Austin.
Shouldn't be a problem to grab one for you when I hit the Chicago show (assuming they're still in stock).
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Could anybody pick up a Vector drumming book? I can pay for it plus shipping and beer money or I could trade it for a Haken VIP XL shirt. Whatever your choice. PM please. I live in the states. Dumb for not picking it up in Austin.
Shouldn't be a problem to grab one for you when I hit the Chicago show (assuming they're still in stock).
Awesome. Thank you. I’ll PM you shortly.
Btw, seems like tonight’s show is still a go and Bent Knee eill not be performing tonight, until the next one.
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Puzzle Box is still my favourite, but Veil is close behind.
I'm with you on that, Puzzle Box has become my favorite, with Veil as a close second :tup
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Damn, tonight’s show cancelled.
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Just saw, thats a big storm they're unfortunate to be in.
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Saw them in Pomona a couple of weeks ago. They were fuckin killer as usual. I just can't get in to Leporus. Just about every song sounded the same to me, and their singer (who has a crazy range and incredible control by the way) seems like a one trick pony. Has no dynamic to his voice other than high and fuckin high. Also, Haken is a class fuckin act. Always mentioning the other bands that played before them, even Leporus who wasn't opening but co-headlining. Leporus didn't say shit about Haken or Bent Knee. Just seemed kinda douchey and full of themselves to me. But either way, I had a killer time!
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Saw them in Pomona a couple of weeks ago. They were fuckin killer as usual. I just can't get in to Leporus. Just about every song sounded the same to me, and their singer (who has a crazy range and incredible control by the way) seems like a one trick pony. Has no dynamic to his voice other than high and fuckin high. Also, Haken is a class fuckin act. Always mentioning the other bands that played before them, even Leporus who wasn't opening but co-headlining. Leporus didn't say shit about Haken or Bent Knee. Just seemed kinda douchey and full of themselves to me. But either way, I had a killer time!
I get what you are saying about the newer material. This is why I like the first two albums. A lot of variety and more progressive. Hoping all 3 bands make it to St. Louis and then to Nashville.
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Yea theres a lot of samey feels from some of the tracks off malina. I noticed they didnt talk at all to the crowd and wondered if maybe theres a language barrier? Not sure why they didnt engage the crowd at all but thought they were really good live personally.
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The singer stated in interviews that he (and the band in general) doesn't feel comfortable interacting with fans.
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The singer stated in interviews that he (and the band in general) doesn't feel comfortable interacting with fans.
They seemed nice and cordial at the VIP....
....but then again, Geoff Tate was always able to “put on his game face” for those, so that doesn’t always mean anything
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Our VIP experience in Austin was crap. Everything felt disorganized and rushed. Didn't get anything signed (brought some vinyls) or a signed poster (from the VIP package) since they ran out or something. The bands themselves were pretty gracious and talkative. But I guess there were a lot of people (more than 15 I would say). If I was Haken, I would look a bit deeper into the organization of it. From the short chat I had with Richard, seems like Nova Collective will be releasing something next year.
The concert itself was great. Even though I don't like Leprous' music, I enjoyed their live presentation. Maybe the live album can change my mind about them. Have tried getting into them but nothing yet.
Haken's show was great. Vector really shines in a live setting. Even though it was super cold (outdoor gig), they gave everything and Ross' voice sounded great. Great frontman! It was great to see Connor headbanging during Nil by Mouth. I was standing towards Richard's side and man, I was in awe all the time. His playing just slays.
I was hesitant in posting my review just because my experience with the VIP sucked (makes DT's VIP M&G look great LOL). However, two things: a) Glad the money goes directly to the band and was happy to support them. In order for bands to come to your town (once a promoter gets the band to come to your town) is to support the band financially (buying merch or VIPs; streaming their music really doesn't help them); and b) for those hesitating in the VIP and/or concert, do yourself a favor and go. You won't be disappointed.
Edit: Cancelling a show sucks so if anybody can make it to the other gigs and show their support to them, the band will definitely appreciate it.
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I guess that's just Leprous' show. Thats how they were during our one headline show.
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My VIP with Haken last year in April was AWESOME! In Dresden (my hometown) there didn't seem to be that many hardcore fans that did the VIP thing so we were like 10-12 (max 15) people. I loved that it was not too organised, it made the whole thing feel like a spontaneous hang out with the band!
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I've seen a few apologies from Haken towards the VIPs at a few shows this year. I'm thinking their management put them on a tight schedule and they've found it hard to meet it consistently while on tour. It did seem like they would try to make it up to the VIPs in some way, but I can't say if that's been worthy or not. I've never done the VIP thing and have little desire to do so personally.
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Saw them in Pomona a couple of weeks ago. They were fuckin killer as usual. I just can't get in to Leporus. Just about every song sounded the same to me, and their singer (who has a crazy range and incredible control by the way) seems like a one trick pony. Has no dynamic to his voice other than high and fuckin high. Also, Haken is a class fuckin act. Always mentioning the other bands that played before them, even Leporus who wasn't opening but co-headlining. Leporus didn't say shit about Haken or Bent Knee. Just seemed kinda douchey and full of themselves to me. But either way, I had a killer time!
Leprous (Einar) doesn't have a lot of vocal interaction with the fans. Personally I don't care, I can live without the 'how are you doing, you are so great, best gig of the tour' BS. if you don't feel comfortable just put your energy in the music.
When I saw Leprous 2 months ago that was certainly the case. Great performance, great atmosphere, lots of energy
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Random thought: the streak of songs from The Good doctor to Veil is the best three-song run they've ever released. I'm just blown away by those three tracks back to back.
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Random thought: the streak of songs from The Good doctor to Veil is the best three-song run they've ever released. I'm just blown away by those three tracks back to back.
That's an opinion I can get on board with!
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Random thought: the streak of songs from The Good doctor to Veil is the best three-song run they've ever released. I'm just blown away by those three tracks back to back.
Yup, fantastic 3 song run
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Saw them in Pomona a couple of weeks ago. They were fuckin killer as usual. I just can't get in to Leporus. Just about every song sounded the same to me, and their singer (who has a crazy range and incredible control by the way) seems like a one trick pony. Has no dynamic to his voice other than high and fuckin high. Also, Haken is a class fuckin act. Always mentioning the other bands that played before them, even Leporus who wasn't opening but co-headlining. Leporus didn't say shit about Haken or Bent Knee. Just seemed kinda douchey and full of themselves to me. But either way, I had a killer time!
Just got back from the show in St. Louis and this about sums it up for me. Especially when speaking towards Leprous. The band is very talented and tight, the drummer is really good.....but like you mentioned.....all their songs were essentially the same. It reminded me of Scale the Summit’s first album. Really good technical musicianship but it was essentially the same song over and over. And I agree about the singer. Freaking talented as all get out but it was just ‘the same’ for every song. I think if they stick with it and cultivate themselves a bit they have potential to do some great stuff.
Oh and....KevShmev is my witness.....Leprous’s light show nearly gave me a freaking seizure. I must be firmly in ‘old man’ territory now because my mind hurt trying to watch the stage. Thankfully after I spotted Kev and moved to where he was which was dead center my headache vanished....but jeez....talk about strobes of all different colors. ‘Get off my lawn’ please.....
And, I can’t say enough good things about HAKEN. That’s the second time I’ve seen them (can’t believe they’ve stopped in St. Louis twice) and both times they were incredible live. It took me a while to warm up to Ross’s vocals when I first started listening to them.....but he grew on me and man.....can that dude freaking sing! Talk about being diverse vocally....he puts on a show.
And the band themselves are tight.....look to be having fun together and just sound awesome. Although, I spent half the time thinking the bass player’s beard was fake and he was just some guy in witness protection with a really bad fake beard. It looks out of place on him. Anyway.....if your contemplating going to see HAKEN when/if they come through your area.....DO IT!
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Random thought: the streak of songs from The Good doctor to Veil is the best three-song run they've ever released. I'm just blown away by those three tracks back to back.
Yup, fantastic 3 song run
Indeed!
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Saw them in Pomona a couple of weeks ago. They were fuckin killer as usual. I just can't get in to Leporus. Just about every song sounded the same to me, and their singer (who has a crazy range and incredible control by the way) seems like a one trick pony. Has no dynamic to his voice other than high and fuckin high. Also, Haken is a class fuckin act. Always mentioning the other bands that played before them, even Leporus who wasn't opening but co-headlining. Leporus didn't say shit about Haken or Bent Knee. Just seemed kinda douchey and full of themselves to me. But either way, I had a killer time!
Just got back from the show in St. Louis and this about sums it up for me. Especially when speaking towards Leprous. The band is very talented and tight, the drummer is really good.....but like you mentioned.....all their songs were essentially the same. It reminded me of Scale the Summit’s first album. Really good technical musicianship but it was essentially the same song over and over. And I agree about the singer. Freaking talented as all get out but it was just ‘the same’ for every song. I think if they stick with it and cultivate themselves a bit they have potential to do some great stuff.
Oh and....KevShmev is my witness.....Leprous’s light show nearly gave me a freaking seizure. I must be firmly in ‘old man’ territory now because my mind hurt trying to watch the stage. Thankfully after I spotted Kev and moved to where he was which was dead center my headache vanished....but jeez....talk about strobes of all different colors. ‘Get off my lawn’ please.....
And, I can’t say enough good things about HAKEN. That’s the second time I’ve seen them (can’t believe they’ve stopped in St. Louis twice) and both times they were incredible live. It took me a while to warm up to Ross’s vocals when I first started listening to them.....but he grew on me and man.....can that dude freaking sing! Talk about being diverse vocally....he puts on a show.
And the band themselves are tight.....look to be having fun together and just sound awesome. Although, I spent half the time thinking the bass player’s beard was fake and he was just some guy in witness protection with a really bad fake beard. It looks out of place on him. Anyway.....if your contemplating going to see HAKEN when/if they come through your area.....DO IT!
Amen to that! Leprous' music was pretty good, definitely a talented bunch, but their light show was a chore to endure. It's hard to enjoy a set when the lights from the stage are that blinding.
As for Haken, they were great as expected. 1985 was the highlight for me, but Puzzle Box, Veil, Crystallized and Falling Back to Earth were stellar as well. I am not a big fan of Nil by Mouth, but I get why they play it. It rocks pretty hard and the riffing had most of the people on the floor bouncing. It felt like it is their Dance of Eternity (an exercise in musical proficiency, more than anything else).
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Saw them in Pomona a couple of weeks ago. They were fuckin killer as usual. I just can't get in to Leporus. Just about every song sounded the same to me, and their singer (who has a crazy range and incredible control by the way) seems like a one trick pony. Has no dynamic to his voice other than high and fuckin high. Also, Haken is a class fuckin act. Always mentioning the other bands that played before them, even Leporus who wasn't opening but co-headlining. Leporus didn't say shit about Haken or Bent Knee. Just seemed kinda douchey and full of themselves to me. But either way, I had a killer time!
Just got back from the show in St. Louis and this about sums it up for me. Especially when speaking towards Leprous. The band is very talented and tight, the drummer is really good.....but like you mentioned.....all their songs were essentially the same. It reminded me of Scale the Summit’s first album. Really good technical musicianship but it was essentially the same song over and over. And I agree about the singer. Freaking talented as all get out but it was just ‘the same’ for every song. I think if they stick with it and cultivate themselves a bit they have potential to do some great stuff.
Oh and....KevShmev is my witness.....Leprous’s light show nearly gave me a freaking seizure. I must be firmly in ‘old man’ territory now because my mind hurt trying to watch the stage. Thankfully after I spotted Kev and moved to where he was which was dead center my headache vanished....but jeez....talk about strobes of all different colors. ‘Get off my lawn’ please.....
And, I can’t say enough good things about HAKEN. That’s the second time I’ve seen them (can’t believe they’ve stopped in St. Louis twice) and both times they were incredible live. It took me a while to warm up to Ross’s vocals when I first started listening to them.....but he grew on me and man.....can that dude freaking sing! Talk about being diverse vocally....he puts on a show.
And the band themselves are tight.....look to be having fun together and just sound awesome. Although, I spent half the time thinking the bass player’s beard was fake and he was just some guy in witness protection with a really bad fake beard. It looks out of place on him. Anyway.....if your contemplating going to see HAKEN when/if they come through your area.....DO IT!
Amen to that! Leprous' music was pretty good, definitely a talented bunch, but their light show was a chore to endure. It's hard to enjoy a set when the lights from the stage are that blinding.
As for Haken, they were great as expected. 1985 was the highlight for me, but Puzzle Box, Veil, Crystallized and Falling Back to Earth were stellar as well. I am not a big fan of Nil by Mouth, but I get why they play it. It rocks pretty hard and the riffing had most of the people on the floor bouncing. It felt like it is their Dance of Eternity (an exercise in musical proficiency, more than anything else).
Did you all get one song from Bilateral? It seems like every third show gets one song. I was looking at youtube and there was an interview with Ross and I thing the drummer from Leporus and the lady interviewing right off the bat said to the drummer that Bilateral was her favorite Leporus album. He indicated that she was not alone, but the band is taking a different direction. It should be fun for me tonight in Nashville. I have lived here all my life and have never been to the Exit/In. The venue is mostly standing and has a maximum of 500.
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Yea, Bilateral is where it's at for Leprous and myself. And sadly, they don't really play anything from it.
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Did you all get one song from Bilateral?
I honestly have no idea. Was/am completely unfamiliar with Leprous and their song names. I youtube'd them to listen to a song or two of theirs a couple weeks ago just to hear them....but until that point had never heard of them.
Like I said earlier, they were very tight and their sound was good. Singer is very talented....but it all just sounded like one song to me. I did see a few people there that appeared to be familiar with them that were completely digging it....so I'd imagine if you know their stuff you'll enjoy it immensely.
Just bring some sunglasses for the light show. :coolio
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Just bring some sunglasses for the light show. :coolio
:lol I was on the side of the stage so their light show really did nothing for me, but here's a blinding example and I'm sure this might have been tough to watch from some perspectives https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_szu-EmxMM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_szu-EmxMM)
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Just bring some sunglasses for the light show. :coolio
:lol I was on the side of the stage so their light show really did nothing for me, but here's a blinding example and I'm sure this might have been tough to watch from some perspectives https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_szu-EmxMM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_szu-EmxMM)
Dude....I've never felt so old :lol It was brutal on my eyes and brain.....it hurt. Tons of people were digging it.....so I think it was a good light show if you're it to that....but wouldn't know for sure because anytime it started to get going full swing I just looked down or away and closed my eyes a bit. Not even kidding. I started off to the side of the stage but the venue we were at that still put you in front of them really. Then, after Kev pointed out the space next to him was open I moved and we were dead center.
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I'll back up my elder homies in the consensual opinion of Leprous' light show. I would've left till Haken but I didn't want to give up my front row spot. They had a few highlights and decent songs, but the vocalist pretty much ruins leprous for me.
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I'll be the dissenting opinion on Leprous. I saw them a couple times, once up front and once in the middle of the crowd. I didn't have a problem with the lights at all. I have had that problem with other bands and have found that I can usually move around until I find a spot where it's OK for me. So maybe I was just lucky with where I was standing this time around.
As for their live performance - I like how little talking they do. Their English is fine - certainly good enough to waste a whole song's worth of time by chatting with the crowd if they wanted to. :) But I like that they just get on with it and make the most out of the time they have. Einar, the singer, says a few words here and there, but they keep it moving. And aside from not taking too much time, I also think that just fits with their show. Everything works together - not talking much, being very intense on stage, the lighting, it all works and goes with their music. Which I don't at all think all sounds the same, but I understand why others might feel that way, especially if they haven't listened to them much. (People have said that to me about Haken too, and I disagree there as well.)
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I'll be the dissenting opinion on Leprous. I saw them a couple times, once up front and once in the middle of the crowd. I didn't have a problem with the lights at all. I have had that problem with other bands and have found that I can usually move around until I find a spot where it's OK for me. So maybe I was just lucky with where I was standing this time around.
As for their live performance - I like how little talking they do. Their English is fine - certainly good enough to waste a whole song's worth of time by chatting with the crowd if they wanted to. :) But I like that they just get on with it and make the most out of the time they have. Einar, the singer, says a few words here and there, but they keep it moving. And aside from not taking too much time, I also think that just fits with their show. Everything works together - not talking much, being very intense on stage, the lighting, it all works and goes with their music. Which I don't at all think all sounds the same, but I understand why others might feel that way, especially if they haven't listened to them much. (People have said that to me about Haken too, and I disagree there as well.)
I agree. I saw them live once and had a blast (familiar with most of the songs though), would definitely go again.
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I'll be the dissenting opinion on Leprous. I saw them a couple times, once up front and once in the middle of the crowd. I didn't have a problem with the lights at all. I have had that problem with other bands and have found that I can usually move around until I find a spot where it's OK for me. So maybe I was just lucky with where I was standing this time around.
As for their live performance - I like how little talking they do. Their English is fine - certainly good enough to waste a whole song's worth of time by chatting with the crowd if they wanted to. :) But I like that they just get on with it and make the most out of the time they have. Einar, the singer, says a few words here and there, but they keep it moving. And aside from not taking too much time, I also think that just fits with their show. Everything works together - not talking much, being very intense on stage, the lighting, it all works and goes with their music. Which I don't at all think all sounds the same, but I understand why others might feel that way, especially if they haven't listened to them much. (People have said that to me about Haken too, and I disagree there as well.)
I wouldn't argue with this post at all. Totally get it. I think the distance we were from the stage was a 'sweet spot' where most of the lights peak trajectories were hitting. It was brutal.
As far as Leprous performance and music....like I said, they were tight and 'sounded' good. I was/am just completely unfamiliar with them so it was all just a mass of music without distinction to me. But can see where if you knew them and their songs it'd have been a great show...which I witnessed fans who clearly 'knew' them having a great time.
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I really enjoyed them as well, I think they've gone down a too samey path with Malina, but there's a lot of good stuff there and as a first time seeing them, thought they were pretty awesome live. I think the singer is fantastic. I personally like a bit more crowd interaction, just something to let you know we are there, but I can live without the "same story every show" type of interaction some bands do. If I had gotten some Bilateral songs live I think I'd be talking even more about how good they were live.
Overall thought the pairing of those two bands was a fantastic idea although I wish both bands got 90 minutes and not 75.
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Two general points of consensus with the group:
Bilateral is easily Leprous' best album and it's a shame they don't play more from it.
Their light show was awful, not from a performance perspective, but from how often lights ended up pointing into the audience and causing issues. There are literally parts during their show where I have to close my eyes for awhile.
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Bilateral is easily Leprous' best album and it's a shame they don't play more from it.
I'm wondering if the songs from Bilateral they played were somewhere around the 3rd to 5th songs in the set? Because there were a couple songs around that point in the set that really sounded good to me and had the crowd really on their side. Anyone familiar with the set they are playing know kind of 'where' the Bilateral songs fell in the set?
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I checked setlist.fm and it looks like there were no Bilateral tracks in St. Louis.
Song three was "From the Flame" which I really like and five was "The Price" which is their most viewed song on youtube. The 4th song was a cover, I didn't know the original song, but I enjoyed it when I saw them although I'd rather have seen an original song personally since the sets aren't too long.
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When I saw them in Montreal, they played Mb. Indifferentia from Bilateral. I think it was the 4th or 5th song.
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Bilateral is easily Leprous' best album and it's a shame they don't play more from it.
I'm wondering if the songs from Bilateral they played were somewhere around the 3rd to 5th songs in the set? Because there were a couple songs around that point in the set that really sounded good to me and had the crowd really on their side. Anyone familiar with the set they are playing know kind of 'where' the Bilateral songs fell in the set?
Exactly what I felt. There was like a three song run that was solid, then they played that dreadful one someone sent me in my roulette a while back and I just cringed...
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I only saw Leprous once and from the back, but their lighting didn't bother me. They're definitely going for a certain look, though. I'd say it's the James T Kirk as God look. All white and lots of fog.
(https://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/original/3/33425/1756863-kirk_arrives.jpg)
Haken's light show did bug me a little. Leprous had a fair amount of movement in their lighting, but I didn't notice it strobe much. Haken used quite a bit of strobe. At the Dallas show I was behind some [really inept] moshers, and all of the strobing made it particularly hard to tell what was happening in front of me. Either I couldn't see somebody until they were right on top of me, or I'd see somebody coming and get ready to check them only to find they weren't moving at all (which really makes you look silly).
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I checked setlist.fm and it looks like there were no Bilateral tracks in St. Louis.
Song three was "From the Flame" which I really like and five was "The Price" which is their most viewed song on youtube. The 4th song was a cover, I didn't know the original song, but I enjoyed it when I saw them although I'd rather have seen an original song personally since the sets aren't too long.
I wish I had paid attention better as to which song(s) it was that I liked best. I know it was after their first two songs....then it was a couple there that I dug....then I think the one that RJ is talking about came up because i think I seen a video of it and it seemed to be the popular one.
Haken's light show did bug me a little. Leprous had a fair amount of movement in their lighting, but I didn't notice it strobe much. Haken used quite a bit of strobe. At the Dallas show I was behind some [really inept] moshers, and all of the strobing made it particularly hard to tell what was happening in front of me. Either I couldn't see somebody until they were right on top of me, or I'd see somebody coming and get ready to check them only to find they weren't moving at all (which really makes you look silly).
totally opposite in St. Louis. If anything, there was a point where the fog got a bit out of hand with HAKEN....you couldn't even see Diego for a couple minutes.... :lol
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When I saw them in Montreal, they played Mb. Indifferentia from Bilateral. I think it was the 4th or 5th song.
Yes, it looks like they are playing the one above or Acquired Taste from Bilateral every third show. I looked on setlist.com and not sure how reliable it is, but for one of the early shows they apparently played Forced Entry from Bilateral, which is a crowd favorite from the old days and a song that I thought of Haken when I first hear it.
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When I saw them in Montreal, they played Mb. Indifferentia from Bilateral. I think it was the 4th or 5th song.
Yes, it looks like they are playing the one above or Acquired Taste from Bilateral every third show. I looked on setlist.com and not sure how reliable it is, but for one of the early shows they apparently played Forced Entry from Bilateral, which is a crowd favorite from the old days and a song that I thought of Haken when I first hear it.
That's probably my favorite song I've heard from them.
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Could anybody pick up a Vector drumming book? I can pay for it plus shipping and beer money or I could trade it for a Haken VIP XL shirt. Whatever your choice. PM please. I live in the states. Dumb for not picking it up in Austin.
Shouldn't be a problem to grab one for you when I hit the Chicago show (assuming they're still in stock).
PM sent.
Thanks
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I thought the dark stage with Leprous was odd at first, but I get what they are going for. It is cool too when the whole stage lights are flashing and you see the band members in the flickers, especially since they are all moving the whole time. They just need to to something about those blinding lights that aim directly in the crowd and make you wish you had anti-seizure medicine. :lol :lol
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When I saw them in Montreal, they played Mb. Indifferentia from Bilateral. I think it was the 4th or 5th song.
Yes, it looks like they are playing the one above or Acquired Taste from Bilateral every third show. I looked on setlist.com and not sure how reliable it is, but for one of the early shows they apparently played Forced Entry from Bilateral, which is a crowd favorite from the old days and a song that I thought of Haken when I first hear it.
That's probably my favorite song I've heard from them.
Forced Entry is one of my favorite songs by any band. That said, they played it a lot on the last tour, and it is pretty long, so I don't mind them not playing it now to make room for more new material. I'd love to see it again in the future though.
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Just got back from the show in Nashville. The place holds 500 and it was not sold out, but a good crowd.
Bent Knee - They started the set with a chant ' not dead yet ' and happy to be back after the accident. They even had a jar at the merchandise booth for van replacement donations. Musically they were ok, but not my thing.
Leprous - As expected, nothing from Bilateral. About half the songs rocked, but the others sounded similar and not much meat to them. The strings were a nice touch.
Haken - Really tight set that seemed to fly by. The songs sound much better live. Nil by mouth was awesome live and as Lonestar said the encore was :metal. The drummer and keyboard player were particularly awesome.
If you get a chance to see the show, you will not be disappointed.
Now on to my next two concerts, Steven Wilson and Dream Theater. Hopefully they will be as good as Haken.
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Now on to my next two concerts, Steven Wilson
yea man this saturday for me, looking forward to it
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Haken - Really tight set that seemed to fly by. The songs sound much better live. Nil by mouth was awesome live and as Lonestar said the encore was :metal. The drummer and keyboard player were particularly awesome.
Agreed. Everyone in the band does a tremendous job on their respective instrument, but I watch Tejeida and Hearne the most. Tejeida is as good as just about keyboard player out there right now, and I'd be hard pressed to think of a better drummer right now in the prog scene as good as Hearne.
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The Chicago show was amazing as always. It was awesome to see all the familiar faces there. It was unfortunate that my car ended up being broken into during the concert but...that was just due to unfortunate planning on me and my friend's part.
I can't wait for them to come back again!
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The Chicago show was amazing as always. It was awesome to see all the familiar faces there. It was unfortunate that my car ended up being broken into during the concert but...that was just due to unfortunate planning on me and my friend's part.
I can't wait for them to come back again!
Damn that sucks. Did anything special happen for the last show of the tour? Would have been cool to see both bands do something together.
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Not this time. A few of the other bands members messed with Haken as they were playing their encore, one got Richard to mess up one of his solos. But the didn't play together this year.
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Not this time. A few of the other bands members messed with Haken as they were playing their encore, one got Richard to mess up one of his solos. But the didn't play together this year.
Ahh cool, at least good to see some last show shenanigans
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Haken - Really tight set that seemed to fly by. The songs sound much better live. Nil by mouth was awesome live and as Lonestar said the encore was :metal. The drummer and keyboard player were particularly awesome.
Agreed. Everyone in the band does a tremendous job on their respective instrument, but I watch Tejeida and Hearne the most. Tejeida is as good as just about keyboard player out there right now, and I'd be hard pressed to think of a better drummer right now in the prog scene as good as Hearne.
While I agree that the drummer is really good, I don't think he holds a candle to Blake Richardson.
I did finally get around to listening to Vector enough to give it a rating. It ended up with an 8/10. It's really good, but I don't think it was as adventurous as Affinity. At least not to my ears. Definitely one to revisit though.
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The VIP packages for European tour are up at:
https://www.hakenmusic.com/store
Just bought my VIP upgrade for the Hamburg show. :metal
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Any word on the support for the European shows?
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Not yet from what I saw, but there will be some kind of support I guess as my ticket says "Haken plus special guest".
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How awesome it would be to just see Haken perform a Rush-esque 180 minute set.
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It would kill Ross.
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And they only have 5 albums and an EP to pick from. At the moment they'd be playing most of their discography in a single night.
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And they only have 5 albums and an EP to pick from. At the moment they'd be playing most of their discography in a single night.
Yeah....I think we're good with that.
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How awesome it would be to just see Haken perform a Rush-esque 180 minute set.
Did anyone say "wish set list time?" ;)
Set 1:
1. Clear
2. The Good doctor
3. Insomnia
4. Falling back to earth
5. As death embraces
6. Earthrise
7. Aquarium
8. Puzzle box
- - - -
Set 2:
9. Atlas stone
10. Cockroach king
11. 1985
12. Veil
13. Nil by mouth
14. Visions
- - - -
Encore:
15. Celestial elixir
:metal
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Visions followed by Celestial Elixir?
:metal :metal :metal
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Set 1:
Clear/The Good Doctor
1985
In Memoriam
The Mind’s Eye
Portals
Shapeshifter
As Death Embraces
Drowning in the Flood
Earthlings
Falling Back to Earth
Set 2:
The Atlas Stone
Cockroach King
Puzzle Box
Veil
The Endless Knot
Deathless
Celestial Elixir
Encore:
Bound by Gravity
Crystallised
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Some of the tracks I'd really love to hear would be Celestial Elixir, Crystallised, 1985, The Architect, The Endless Knot, The Good Doctor, Puzzle Box and A Cell Divides.
But I just hope it's a good long set because the first time I saw them it was co-headlining with Leprous (which was cool), but it meant quite a short set, which was truncated even more due to the venue curfew. :'(
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Visions followed by Celestial Elixir?
:metal :metal :metal
If I recall correctly, I saw this once, around 2012/13 or so in the Bergkeller Reichenbach (100 people at best). Could be that it was the other way round. It was awesome.
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Set 1:
Clear
The Good Doctor
1985
Cockroach King
Darkest Light
The Mind's Eye
Portals
Shapeshifter
Celestial Elixer
-----------------
Set 2:
affinity.exe
Initiate
Puzzle Box
In Memoriam
Nil By Mouth
As Death Embraces
Veil
Visions
-----------------
Encore:
Bound By Gravity
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Set 1:
Clear/The Good Doctor
1985
In Memoriam
The Mind’s Eye
Portals
Shapeshifter
As Death Embraces
Drowning in the Flood
Earthlings
Falling Back to Earth
Set 2:
The Atlas Stone
Cockroach King
Puzzle Box
Veil
The Endless Knot
Deathless
Celestial Elixir
Encore:
Bound by Gravity
Crystallised
This would be awesome... I love that you included Earthlings too :tup :tup
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Set 1:
Clear/The Good Doctor
1985
In Memoriam
The Mind’s Eye
Portals
Shapeshifter
As Death Embraces
Drowning in the Flood
Earthlings
Falling Back to Earth
Set 2:
The Atlas Stone
Cockroach King
Puzzle Box
Veil
The Endless Knot
Deathless
Celestial Elixir
Encore:
Bound by Gravity
Crystallised
This would be awesome... I love that you included Earthlings too :tup :tup
I made it “from the gut” thinking I might tweak it later, but the more I look at it, the more I love it.
In looking back on it, Vector seems a tad underrepresented (considering this “pipe dream” would be a tour for that album) and with that in mind I would try to squeeze either Host or Nil by Mouth into the 2nd set without changing anything else.
EDIT - I just added up all the times and found that I’m running at a little over 66 min for the first set, and a little over 67 for the 2nd set, and just short of 28 for the encore. That rounds off to about a 160min show. So adding one more might be a stretch. But if I did have a full 180 available, I would add Host to the first set and Nil by Mouth to the 2nd. (That way you have one instrumental in each set as opposed to putting both in the first half of the show)
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Visions followed by Celestial Elixir?
:metal :metal :metal
If I recall correctly, I saw this once, around 2012/13 or so in the Bergkeller Reichenbach (100 people at best). Could be that it was the other way round. It was awesome.
Yeah, I saw the same once as well. Was awesome indeed!
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Support bands for European tour are Bent Knee and VOLA. I guess that means Haken won't get a longer set, but on the other hand, I get to see Bent Knee.
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Haken and Vola playing together is such a great moment in modern prog history. However, I still don't feel like travelling. God, I wish they played my city.
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Well the last times I saw them they also had two support bands, but then played for at least 90 mins.
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Support bands for European tour are Bent Knee and VOLA. I guess that means Haken won't get a longer set, but on the other hand, I get to see Bent Knee.
That's a pity, I was hoping it would only be 1 support band - Haken only played a 70minute set the first time I saw them :(
I've always wondered, what's the reasoning behind having 2 support acts? Is it to pad out the crowd a bit with fans from the smaller bands?
EDIT:
I may have listened to a Vola track a while back, but other than that, I don't know anything about the support bands, so I'll check them out on Youtube :tup
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That's a fucking sweet lineup. Wished Vola toured the States with them. Maybe next run...
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Have to admit I don't know the other two bands but after seeing them receive positive press here and on the Haken FB group I'll def check them out. Just booked my tickets for the Glasgow gig this morning, also got the VIP Upgrade too. Very excited for it :biggrin:
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Never heard of VOLA tbh, gonna have to give them a spin.
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Excellent news indeed. VOLA’s latest album was a surprise last addition to me 2018 albums list. Very nice indeed.
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In the US they had a co-headliner and 1 support band. Here they have two support bands. Assuming Bent Knee stays consistent at 30 minutes and Vola gets 30 minutes instead of Leprous getting 75 that leaves and extra 45 minutes for Haken. At worst they might give each support 45 and play for 90 I'd hope.
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I almost shitted my pants when I saw VOLA is supporting Haken but then I read it again and saw that little printing that they are not going to play in Helsinki.. :(
Wishful thinking but hopefully Haken will play longer set for us Finns when they are the only act for the evening.
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Excellent news indeed. VOLA’s latest album was a surprise last addition to me 2018 albums list. Very nice indeed.
Same here. Gave it a few spins last week and really like it.
Love to see them with Haken.
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Excellent news indeed. VOLA’s latest album was a surprise last addition to me 2018 albums list. Very nice indeed.
Same here. Gave it a few spins last week and really like it.
Love to see them with Haken.
See you at the Boerderij I guess then!
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haken is pretty cool
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haken is pretty cool
I heard they sound like circus music
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haken is pretty cool
I heard they sound like circus music
I heard the same ;D
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Excellent news indeed. VOLA’s latest album was a surprise last addition to me 2018 albums list. Very nice indeed.
Same here. Gave it a few spins last week and really like it.
Love to see them with Haken.
See you at the Boerderij I guess then!
Yes!!
I will be seeing Haken twice that week. Also the 22nd at Prognosis Festival in Eindhoven together with Leprous and Soen among others
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Excellent news indeed. VOLA’s latest album was a surprise last addition to me 2018 albums list. Very nice indeed.
Same here. Gave it a few spins last week and really like it.
Love to see them with Haken.
See you at the Boerderij I guess then!
Yes!!
I will be seeing Haken twice that week. Also the 22nd at Prognosis Festival in Eindhoven together with Leprous and Soen among others
Me too :tup :D
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haken is pretty cool
I heard they sound like circus music
I heard the same ;D
No circus music on the US tour, but would have liked a song from the first 2 albums
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I listened to Falling Back To Earth for the first time yesterday, WOW that middle section is very DT influenced. Almost a rip off. Not that it's a bad thing...
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I listened to Falling Back To Earth for the first time yesterday, WOW that middle section is very DT influenced. Almost a rip off. Not that it's a bad thing...
To me, Visions is the biggest DT rip off in their entire catalogue, and I still absolutely adore it. In fact, I think there are portions where a melody from the SFAM Overture are lifted verbatim as an homage. Still....amazing.
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I will at their show in Lima next Wednesday, I am so fucking excited
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I will at their show in Lima next Wednesday, I am so fucking excited
Will be interested to see if the set list is the same as the US part of the tour
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I listened to Falling Back To Earth for the first time yesterday, WOW that middle section is very DT influenced. Almost a rip off. Not that it's a bad thing...
Wait, which middle section? I hear a lot of BTBAM in some sections of FBTE, but I can't say I've ever noticed any DT (beyond the general prog metal influence).
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I will at their show in Lima next Wednesday, I am so fucking excited
Will be interested to see if the set list is the same as the US part of the tour
I can spoil that tomorrow if you want ;D
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I listened to Falling Back To Earth for the first time yesterday, WOW that middle section is very DT influenced. Almost a rip off. Not that it's a bad thing...
Wait, which middle section? I hear a lot of BTBAM in some sections of FBTE, but I can't say I've ever noticed any DT (beyond the general prog metal influence).
I guess "middle section" is inaccurate. I was referring to 2:50-4:40.
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I will at their show in Lima next Wednesday, I am so fucking excited
Will be interested to see if the set list is the same as the US part of the tour
I can spoil that tomorrow if you want ;D
Yes, please do. The show I went to was great, but would have loved something from visions
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Just saw the setlist, and not going to spoil it, but it makes me REALLY SAD that I'm not going to the concert next week :'(
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I’m seeing them on Friday. So fucking pumped.
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I’m seeing them on Friday. So fucking pumped.
I hope I will see them on friday aswell!
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Just saw the setlist, and not going to spoil it, but it makes me REALLY SAD that I'm not going to the concert next week :'(
Wow what an encore and if you include the songs leading up to it, wow
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I'm pretty sure they won't play that exact setlist in Europe, but holy shit if they keep that encore as it is now I'm gonna be happy as hell.
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I'm going in march, in Vienna! So pumped to meet the guys again, it's been 2 years.
But I don't want any setlist spoilers, so maybe I have to stay away from this thread until then ;)
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Just saw the setlist, and not going to spoil it, but it makes me REALLY SAD that I'm not going to the concert next week :'(
Why not? I was hoping to meet you there
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I will at their show in Lima next Wednesday, I am so fucking excited
Will be interested to see if the set list is the same as the US part of the tour
Here's their setlist from last night https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/haken/2019/teatro-teleton-santiago-chile-1b9589ac.html
I am looking to see if it is the same setlist tonite, that will be a clear indication what will they play next Wednesday
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Just saw the setlist, and not going to spoil it, but it makes me REALLY SAD that I'm not going to the concert next week :'(
Why not? I was hoping to meet you there
As Pink Floyd once said: Moneeeyyy :'(
I also have a couple friends going, will try my best to work it out before wednesday, fingers crossed!
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I will at their show in Lima next Wednesday, I am so fucking excited
Will be interested to see if the set list is the same as the US part of the tour
Here's their setlist from last night https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/haken/2019/teatro-teleton-santiago-chile-1b9589ac.html
I am looking to see if it is the same setlist tonite, that will be a clear indication what will they play next Wednesday
It was the same tonight except we didn't get celestial elixir :'(
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Any chance that was not legit on setlist.fm?
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I needed to sleep before I posted my thoughts. What a great show this guys put last night. It was the first time I saw them perform as Haken (previously with TSF) and they did not disappoint at all, they actually made me want to listen to Vector a little more :lol. Even though the venue they played at is a little shitty when it comes to sound they managed to come through it, though Crystallized could have sounded better.
Everyone performed extremely well but to me the highlight was Charly, simply because he had the best interaction with the crowd. I really want to sit down and have a beer with him, he seems like a really nice guy
Any chance that was not legit on setlist.fm?
Probably is. They started a little late yesterday which is probably why they cut it a bit short.
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I can say I've had a beer with Ray and Rich. :biggrin:
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Lucky you
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Very excited for the show tomorrow in São Paulo! Anybody here will be there?
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Lucky you
Without Nick, that would have never happened.
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Any chance that was not legit on setlist.fm?
A friend of mine went to the Chile show, and he confirmed the setlist.
---
Next Wednesday I will be interviewing Diego Tejeida, if you have some questions for him, write them here.
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What's Diego's favourite Haken tune?
If he did a side project, who would be in the band?
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What's Diego's favourite Haken tune?
If he did a side project, who would be in the band?
Cool, thanks for these
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Next Wednesday I will be interviewing Diego Tejeida, if you have some questions for him, write them here.
If Jordan Rudess were to retire and DT called you, would you take the offer?
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Next Wednesday I will be interviewing Diego Tejeida, if you have some questions for him, write them here.
If Jordan Rudess were to retire and DT called you, would you take the offer?
Added
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What's your favourite pizza?
(yes, that's a serious question)
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I love the new Brute in his rig, but the promo video did a great job touching on that in the studio, but if you wanted to ask something along the line of how it has added to the live setup that would be nice.
With them now hitting South America, getting back to Australia, and hitting N. America and Europe with every album I'd like to hear his take on what the next steps forward for the band is, how they continue to grow and what they plan to do with their growth. I'd specifically like to know if they plan to add a video component at any point in the near future.
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Next Wednesday I will be interviewing Diego Tejeida, if you have some questions for him, write them here.
If you had to name one album that was most influential in shaping the musician you are today, what would it be?
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Just came back from São Paulo show, it was truly amazing!!! Same set from Chile and I coudn’t be happier with the setlist for a 2 hour Haken show, really!
Great performances by the band, all played live, without anything pre-recorded, for my joy!
As performers, Ross, Diego and Ray really shine. Ross is very impressive live, he sings very faithfull to the studio performances and really knows to engage the crowd. In person, he looks like with Steve Augieri a lot. And Connor with Lionel Messi (in his beard phase)! :D
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Just came back from São Paulo show, it was truly amazing!!! Same set from Chile and I coudn’t be happier with the setlist for a 2 hour Haken show, really!
Great performances by the band, all played live, without anything pre-recorded, for my joy!
As performers, Ross, Diego and Ray really shine. Ross is very impressive live, he sings very faithfull to the studio performances and really knows to engage the crowd. In person, he looks like with Steve Augieri a lot. And Connor with Lionel Messi (in his beard phase)! :D
Awesome!
Tomorrow it’s out turn! Can’t wait!
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Just came back from São Paulo show, it was truly amazing!!! Same set from Chile and I coudn’t be happier with the setlist for a 2 hour Haken show, really!
Great performances by the band, all played live, without anything pre-recorded, for my joy!
As performers, Ross, Diego and Ray really shine. Ross is very impressive live, he sings very faithfull to the studio performances and really knows to engage the crowd. In person, he looks like with Steve Augieri a lot. And Connor with Lionel Messi (in his beard phase)! :D
Awesome!
Tomorrow it’s out turn! Can’t wait!
And friday it's Mexico! I hope they keep Celestial Elixir! I've been waiting to hear that song live.
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Cool! You will have a great time, I’m sure.
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Finally listened to Vector a few times over the past month. I really enjoy it! I never was really able to get into Affinity but this one clicked with me on the second listen. Puzzle Box and The Good Doctor are the tracks I keep coming back to, but overall I enjoy the whole thing. I know seven tracks on a Haken album has been done before, but I wish we had more.
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Last night concert was soooooo epic from start to finish, the band was on fire.
They played the same set as in Chile.
The M&G was a bit rushed as their equipments arrived late making the sound check a couple minutes after the meet and greet. The opening act didn’t perform, I feel bad for them as they seemed really happy to be opening for Haken.
But it was a really good and memorable night.
The interview with Diego was amazing. It will be posted soon.
Today I woke up voiceless and with LOTS of pain on my neck.
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Saw this on Haken Haven :lol
(https://i.imgur.com/igfcHKI.jpg)
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Looks like Haken will be supporting Devin Townsend through Europe in late 2019. Hopefully more details soon.
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Looks like Haken will be supporting Devin Townsend through Europe in late 2019. Hopefully more details soon.
If so, here's the tour for Devin Townsend and dates:
(https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/51311648_2656813267677312_8913340827615363072_o.jpg?_nc_cat=102&_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-1.xx&oh=9680e51fd49435d91a0d94695e5b68d2&oe=5CFF916E)
Seeing that combo would be unbelievable IMO. I hope they bring that combo to the US for the same tour.
That last night of ProgPower 17 when Haken performed before DTP was one of my favorite concerts of all time.
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Weren’t there a few dates in 2015 with DTP and Haken supporting DT? I remember this happening during their 30th anniversary mini tour in Europe.
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That would be even more epic, I've been saying for awhile it would be great for Haken to open for a bigger band like DT here in the states, although DT seems to not be going back to having an opener. DTP would be a good band to support as well though, Devin's definitely gotten more popular over the last few years.
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Looks like Haken will be supporting Devin Townsend through Europe in late 2019. Hopefully more details soon.
If so, here's the tour for Devin Townsend and dates:
(https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/51311648_2656813267677312_8913340827615363072_o.jpg?_nc_cat=102&_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-1.xx&oh=9680e51fd49435d91a0d94695e5b68d2&oe=5CFF916E)
Seeing that combo would be unbelievable IMO. I hope they bring that combo to the US for the same tour.
That last night of ProgPower 17 when Haken performed before DTP was one of my favorite concerts of all time.
They are confirmed on the Paris show, and I can't imagine they are flying in to open for one show. So really the only question right now is if they are on a run of shows or the entire tour.
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Today was the Mexico city show, it was awesome. We got the full setlist (with celestial elixir). After crystallized Richard had some issues with his keyboard, the rest of the band started jamming and played Africa (the whole band played it, Richard joined them at the last verse).
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I love when stuff like that happens, awesome :yarr
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Here's the video, just great stuff...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WftKz7rE7k&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR1-3k3G25-qb6DEZjtV7DAhsRkG1wE0BG27EemLYkw0tJW8LoKzyXzNn7g (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WftKz7rE7k&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR1-3k3G25-qb6DEZjtV7DAhsRkG1wE0BG27EemLYkw0tJW8LoKzyXzNn7g)
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Saw this on Haken Haven :lol
(https://i.imgur.com/igfcHKI.jpg)
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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Looks like Haken are doing a covers only set on the cruise to the edge. I wonder if Africa will get played again since it seemed that had that up their sleeves.
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No surprises in the first set, just standard NA tour set. Know a few of the covers for tonight, but won't have connection again till back in Tampa so just keep an eye online. They also have at least one guest coming up for the set.
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https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/haken/2019/ms-brilliance-of-the-seas-tampa-fl-7b952288.html (https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/haken/2019/ms-brilliance-of-the-seas-tampa-fl-7b952288.html)
They did Van Halen's Jump?! I wonder how that went, looks like a cool show
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I've been trying to get into this band for the longest time and just couldn't. Not sure why. The music has everything I'm sure would love. But never clicked. at. all. I think I heard affinity first just couldn't get through it. Then gave parts of The Mountain a shot, couldn't get through it either. I remember the same thing happening with BTBAM when I first tried to get into them. Though after a long time and trying a few more times I finally got into BTBAM and they are now one of my absolute favorite bands.
Went to the Neal Morse Band show this past Saturday and the inhouse music is a playlist curated by Mike Portnoy and of course Haken is on them as he's a huge fan of theirs. I guess something clicked, came home and listened to Vector and enjoyed it immensely. Since then I've listened to Affinity again and have to say not sure how I didn't get into them the first time I heard 1985. That is a track that could very well have been on the transformers movie soundtrack. I also heard The mountain and that was great as well. The band sounds like a blend of Threshold & Meshuggah at times.
I've ordered all the other albums so just waiting to get them in the mail. Can't wait to watch the L-1VE video, really wished it was released on blu-ray but oh well. From the albums I've heard so far Affinity is the favorite so far. though I still have some more listens to go through.
I'm also very sad I missed them on tour when they came in my neck of the woods.
Needless to say I have some catching up to do.
One question, is the live album L+1VE CD only available with the vinyl? Is the CD not sold separately? Plus what's with Affinity not being listed on lasercd's site? All other albums are there. I had to get it off ebay.
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One question, is the live album L+1VE CD only available with the vinyl? Is the CD not sold separately? Plus what's with Affinity not being listed on lasercd's site? All other albums are there. I had to get it off ebay.
Welcome to the Haken fandom, hope you enjoy your time! As for L+1VE, as far as I know, the ONLY physical copies released were the vinyl w/CD set (which I ordered, just to own it physically). Otherwise, I think the band had said on their Facebook page before release date last December that it would also be made available digitally (which I haven't looked up since I haven't needed to). It's well worth buying if you enjoy the four songs present on the EP. It's a great companion to L-1VE, and the live versions of those songs really stand out! I hope we get more live Haken in the future! I'm just happy we've gotten live versions of two of their side-length epics with "Visions" and "Crystallised". Would like to see them release a live version of "Celestial Elixir" some time too!
-Marc.
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Would like to see them release a live version of "Celestial Elixir" some time too!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GyFQAHc8oao :tup
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So is affinity out of print officially?
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So is affinity out of print officially?
Seems like it. Amazon isn't selling it at original retail, and a Google search pulled up eBay and other third party sellers at slightly higher prices. Perhaps they will re-release it in a few years? That's a bummer that it's so hard to find already, despite being less than 3 years old. So glad I got the limited digipak 2CD edition when it came out (which was their first new release after I became a fan).
-Marc.
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Are you guys talking about the CD or the vinyl?
The CD can be bought at German Amazon Prime for 12,99€.
https://www.amazon.de/Affinity-Standard-CD-Jewelcase-Haken/dp/B01C3Z042S/ref=ice_ac_b_dpb_twi_aud_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1550154766&sr=8-1&keywords=haken+affinity
The vinyl can be found for 25,10€ plus shipping here:
https://www.discogs.com/de/Haken-Affinity/release/8453071
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Yeah it's oddly not available in the US amazon or lasercd website.
BTW I have a question, I got my 2 CD edition of affinity today, does it come with a booklet? Mine didn't come with one.
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Yeah it's oddly not available in the US amazon or lasercd website.
BTW I have a question, I got my 2 CD edition of affinity today, does it come with a booklet? Mine didn't come with one.
Looking back at my IG post with the mediabook, it should have booklet inside.
https://www.instagram.com/markymarc413/p/BFAyZbUihzE/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=5mvk7b11r1y5
-Marc.
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Yeah mine is the trifold edition which has a little slot for a booklet which there was none. I emailed the seller and he said he can issue the refund.
Now I have another question, there appear to be a few versions of the 2CD edition. There's one I got - the trifold digipack, another one like the post in your IG. there's also one called a media book edition. I'm going to assume the one in your IG is the mediabook edition. Are they the same or is that different altogether?
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Yeah mine is the trifold edition which has a little slot for a booklet which there was none. I emailed the seller and he said he can issue the refund.
Now I have another question, there appear to be a few versions of the 2CD edition. There's one I got - the trifold digipack, another one like the post in your IG. there's also one called a media book edition. I'm going to assume the one in your IG is the mediabook edition. Are they the same or is that different altogether?
Mine is the Mediabook edition. I wasn't aware there was a tri-digipak!
-Marc.
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I prefer the booklet separate from the spine which is why I got it. Mediabook does look nice too though.
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I prefer the booklet separate from the spine which is why I got it.
This. Apologies for diverting to Dream Theater for a moment, but the fact The Astonishing's booklet is stuck to the case is so annoying. If you want to read it, you have to have space for a three-panel case to open out just to read the booklet. And it's difficult to hold it up if you want to read it closely.
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Just came back from my first ever Haken show. Holy shit!
More on that when I'm back home tomorrow.
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How the hell can anyone say Nil By Mouth is boring?! Have you even heard the damn thing?!! It's their Dance of Eternity, without question. The time signature changes are insane! It just baffles me how wrong everyone is about that song.
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I’d say Portals > Nil by Mouth. Without doing the actual math I’m fairly confident Portals has more time signature changes than Nil by Mouth. And so what if it does? Complexity doesn’t make a good track, much like ridiculously fast playing doesn’t make a good guitar solo. I don’t think Nil by Mouth is all that boring, but if I were to rank Haken’s songs from exciting to boring, it would surely end up quite far on the boring scale.
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NBM is probably my favourite Haken instrumental, but yeah it's certainly nothing to do with complexity and I'm not even sure it is any more complex than the others.
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It's an exciting song and fun to listen to, but I wouldn't call it great.
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Haken has yet to do what I would call a great instrumental, but I feel that they have it in them; it just hasn't come out yet.
Nil by Mouth is good if you like crazy time sigs above all else and view music as a mathematical exercise, but I don't, so it's mostly an afterthought for me.
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Portals is much better and closer to being their own TDOE. I like NBM more now than when it was first released, but I still think it’s just a technical chugga chugga fest.
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Not sure where all the "NBM has so many crazy time signatures" stuff is coming from. Half the song is in 4/4 and half the rest is in 17/8. There's a very crazy section in the middle but loads of Haken songs have things like that.
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Yes, there is a fair bit of 4/4 in it, but the way the 4/4 is broken up is incredibly inventive and thrilling, to give the *impression* of odd time.
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A lot of Meshuggah stuff is in 4/4 and yet it sounds like like an absurd odd time.
How you use your time signature is more important than what it actually is.
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Yes, there is a fair bit of 4/4 in it, but the way the 4/4 is broken up is incredibly inventive and thrilling, to give the *impression* of odd time.
Since I never studied music, I had to have this pointed out to me. I always thought the intro to Giant's Lore by Fates Warning was in some really messed up time signature. But then I had a drummer point out to me that it's actually in 4/4. They just which the riff out from the beat to the offbeat and it makes it sound weird.
I never did double check to see if what he said was accurate. But I got the idea of where he was coming from.
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How the hell can anyone say Nil By Mouth is boring?! Have you even heard the damn thing?!! It's their Dance of Eternity, without question. The time signature changes are insane! It just baffles me how wrong everyone is about that song.
Nil By Mouth is the only Haken song that I removed from my Spotify library because I found it too boring
The rest of the album is killer though, was quite a grower
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None of the album is "boring" to me. But it was the first time a Haken album didn't WOW me. All four of the first 4 albums had my jaw on the floor in one place or another. I was surprised and shocked in a good way. This album just made me go, "Yup. That's a Haken album alright." It's a good album. It's just their first album I would describe as only just "good".
Aquarius - 9
Visions - 9
The Mountain - 10
Affinity - 9.5
Vector - 7
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Hey guys here is the link to our interview with Diego Tejeida while they were here in Lima, Peru.
The audio is in Spanish and there is an English transcription too.
Check it here: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-diego-tejeida/
Or here
https://www.facebook.com/SonicPerspectives/posts/2347939278549917
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Hey guys here is the link to our interview with Diego Tejeida while they were here in Lima, Peru.
The audio is in Spanish and there is an English transcription too.
Check it here: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-diego-tejeida/
Or here
https://www.facebook.com/SonicPerspectives/posts/2347939278549917
:hefdaddy
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Hey guys here is the link to our interview with Diego Tejeida while they were here in Lima, Peru.
The audio is in Spanish and there is an English transcription too.
Check it here: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-diego-tejeida/
Or here
https://www.facebook.com/SonicPerspectives/posts/2347939278549917
Awesome interview, man!!!!
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Cool interview.
I was surprised he didn't mention any of the DT keyboardists as one of his influences, although he did talk about Rudess later on in regards to asking for his okay to play his material with Portnoy.
I'd be down with a project with him and Gillette. :hat
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Cool interview.
I was surprised he didn't mention any of the DT keyboardists as one of his influences, although he did talk about Rudess later on in regards to asking for his okay to play his material with Portnoy.
I'd be down with a project with him and Gillette. :hat
It surprised me too. While asking him the que question, I though he would mention JR at least
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I'd be down with a project with him and Gillette. :hat
And Baard Kolstad :metal
I'm not a Leprous fan, but Baard out of this world. Excellent drummer.
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Great interview! very interesting and nice to hear about his interaction with JR pre-Shattered Fortress.
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So last night, this happened. I'm the dude with the Heineken Haken shirt.
It was once again absolutely out of this world. How do they pull this off live? Plus they are like the nicest dudes ever. It was great meeting them again.
(https://i.imgur.com/BcH0JgG.jpg)
Bent Knee was also amazing, I had to buy an LP after the show. Now I have absolutely no money left. Worth it.
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You guys had two people at the M&G? Not bad. :lol We had five.
Absolutely agree with the statement they're the nicest dudes ever, I've never been to such a relaxed M&G before.
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You guys had two people at the M&G? Not bad. :lol We had five.
Absolutely agree with the statement they're the nicest dudes ever, I've never been to such a relaxed M&G before.
We had a few more (like 6 or so), but my friend Theo and I asked them if we could do an individual picture!
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I was at the show as well. Mind-blowing. Ross has improved noticeably since the Affinity Tour. Ray has evolved into a beast. One of the best concerts I've ever witnessed.
I hope we get a DVD of this tour.
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You guys had two people at the M&G? Not bad. :lol We had five.
Absolutely agree with the statement they're the nicest dudes ever, I've never been to such a relaxed M&G before.
Seems not to be too unusual for Europe, and frankly I'm jealous. Don't get me wrong, I always get a chance at some point during a tour to talk to them, but even during the M&Gs I pay for I tend to hang back and make sure everyone else has a chance to do whatever, and there always seems to be a ton of people. Would love a M&G with like, 1-3 other people. :lol
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I’m jealois of all the posts I read about people seeing them. I haven’t seen them live since last summer (I know I’m spoiled) and am really looking forward to the Vectour show. Seeing them in 1,5 week and then a week after that again :)
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Then we will soon be jealous of you being the most recent to see them. Honestly cant wait for them to do another tour of the US with a longer set, hopefully its not too long of a wait.
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I think I have had the new album long enough now to say that Veil and Host are undoubtedly the two best songs from it. Both are major keepers.
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For those who already saw them on this tour (and SPOILERS about the setlist, although I think they will be quite obvious):
Which of the new songs work best for you guys during a live concert? I think, A Cell Divides has really grown on me. I always thought the song was awesome, but it worked even better in a live setting. My personal favourite was Nil By Mouth though!! This song kicked ass. So much that people behind us were starting a mosh pit. I have nothing against mosh pits since they are mostly peaceful, but I don't always want to take part in them. So it was good we stood in the very first row. But during the whole tune, I was like in a trance, it was absolutely mindblowing.
I was at the show as well. Mind-blowing. Ross has improved noticeably since the Affinity Tour. Ray has evolved into a beast. One of the best concerts I've ever witnessed.
I hope we get a DVD of this tour.
And I agree!! Ross has become SO MUCH better!! I was so stunned by all the high notes he just hit perfectly. And Ray - yes, he is an absolute beast. Incredible player. He needs to get a lot more attention. One of my favourite drummers out there.
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For those who already saw them on this tour (and SPOILERS about the setlist, although I think they will be quite obvious):
Which of the new songs work best for you guys during a live concert? I think, A Cell Divides has really grown on me. I always thought the song was awesome, but it worked even better in a live setting. My personal favourite was Nil By Mouth though!! This song kicked ass. So much that people behind us were starting a mosh pit. I have nothing against mosh pits since they are mostly peaceful, but I don't always want to take part in them. So it was good we stood in the very first row. But during the whole tune, I was like in a trance, it was absolutely mindblowing.
I still thought the latter was better than the studio version, but still was mostly bored. The former was absolutely glorious though, with the audience singing the chorus. I'm glad they've included it into the set in time for me to see it.
I thought the best one was Puzzle Box, it's such a perfect follow-up for the opener. The moment the intro riff kicked in I was in heaven.
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For those who already saw them on this tour (and SPOILERS about the setlist, although I think they will be quite obvious):
Which of the new songs work best for you guys during a live concert? I think, A Cell Divides has really grown on me. I always thought the song was awesome, but it worked even better in a live setting. My personal favourite was Nil By Mouth though!! This song kicked ass. So much that people behind us were starting a mosh pit. I have nothing against mosh pits since they are mostly peaceful, but I don't always want to take part in them. So it was good we stood in the very first row. But during the whole tune, I was like in a trance, it was absolutely mindblowing.
A Cell Divides wasn't in the set when I saw them, I'd say Nil By Mouth was much better live compared to the album, there was a good energy in that song that definitely gets the crowd pumped up.
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I wouldn't have minded A Cell Divides getting played at our show here back in November, as I could have used a bathroom break.
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When I was complimenting them on the inclusion of A Cell Divides in the set, I had a thought like "shit, someone at DTF really hated this song, what if their show is still coming". :lol Glad it worked out for you Kev.
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My favourite was Crystallised. The production on the studio release is somewhat underwhelming IMO, but this live version kicked ass.
EDIT: autocomplete
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My favourite was Crystallised. The production on the studio release is somewhat underwhelming IMO, this live version locked ass.
And they totally nailed the Acapella part!!! Sorry if all this tiny writing is getting ridiculous, but I don't want to spoil anything for anyone :D
Hey, did anyone see the awesome *very* last encore, too? I noticed they didn't play it everywhere. Fuckin AFRICA hell yeah
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I really love A Cell Divides, I would really like it if it were on the setlist, although every song in the setlist was great for me. So, no complains!
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When I was complimenting them on the inclusion of A Cell Divides in the set, I had a thought like "shit, someone at DTF really hated this song, what if their show is still coming". :lol Glad it worked out for you Kev.
I don't hate the song, so much as I dislike the chorus a lot. The rest of the song doesn't bother me, but I will never get past that "nails on a chalkboard" chorus.
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Yep, that chorus is attrocious.
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I don't love the song either, I'd have no issue with it being added to the set though. I like a good rotation of songs and the more the better.
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Yep, that chorus is attrocious.
It's funny how the same thing can be perceived in totally opposite ways. I really, really love that chorus! It's one of 2 or 3 things that stuck in my head after my first listen of the album.
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Yep, that chorus is attrocious.
It's funny how the same thing can be perceived in totally opposite ways. I really, really love that chorus! It's one of 2 or 3 things that stuck in my head after my first listen of the album.
Likewise. It's my favourite song on the album I think.
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I heard Visions when it came out and I've heard The Mountain when it came out. Neither one of them prompted me for a second spin. But I'm hearing too much buzz about this band, any other album recommendation you guys think can get me hooked?
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I heard Visions when it came out and I've heard The Mountain when it came out. Neither one of them prompted me for a second spin. But I'm hearing too much buzz about this band, any other album recommendation you guys think can get me hooked?
If The Mountain didn't bring you back for a 2nd spin, then you just don't like this band.
But I strongly suggest my "5 spin rule". I never judge an album until I've spun it 5 times. Some albums just have an adjustment phase. Especially albums that throw a big curve ball from what you're used to.
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Roger that.
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Affinity is an interesting prog metal album, with some unusual influences. You could give it a spin to get a different take on Haken.
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Yep, that chorus is attrocious.
It's funny how the same thing can be perceived in totally opposite ways. I really, really love that chorus! It's one of 2 or 3 things that stuck in my head after my first listen of the album.
Likewise. It's my favourite song on the album I think.
It's one of my favorites on Vector too. Diego's part that starts at 3:00 is one of my favorite Haken moments on any album.
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I think I am the only Haken regular listener whose favorite album is Visions. I really loved that phase of the band's music.
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I think I am the only Haken regular listener whose favorite album is Visions. I really loved that phase of the band's music.
Nope, its just us two though
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I went though a spell where I thought Visions was their best, but it was fleeting. I do love how the production and keyboard sounds give it kind of a gritty and dirty feel, and the title track and Deathless are undoubtedly two of their best songs.
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Portals and Deathless are undoubtedly two of their best songs.
Sure!
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I think I am the only Haken regular listener whose favorite album is Visions. I really loved that phase of the band's music.
I rank The Mountain first, but Visions is a close second :metal
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I think I am the only Haken regular listener whose favorite album is Visions. I really loved that phase of the band's music.
I, too, really love Visions, both the song and the album. I came in to the band around when The Mountain came out, but it didn't impress me the way Visions did, and I like it the most out of their first three albums. I think I like Affinity slightly more, but Visions is still really high up there for me, especially the title track.
-Marc.
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Since I'm a newish fan of the band and having listened to all the records now quite a few times (though Visions and Aquarius still need more) I would rank them as such
1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Vector
4. Visions
5. Aquarius
All very good but prefer them in this order. For the Restoration EP, I really love Crystallised don't have that much of a connection to the other two.
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Since I'm a newish fan of the band and having listened to all the records now quite a few times (though Visions and Aquarius still need more) I would rank them as such
1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Vector
4. Visions
5. Aquarius
All very good but prefer them in this order. For the Restoration EP, I really love Crystallised don't have that much of a connection to the other two.
That's my ranking too!
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Since I'm a newish fan of the band and having listened to all the records now quite a few times (though Visions and Aquarius still need more) I would rank them as such
1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Vector
4. Visions
5. Aquarius
All very good but prefer them in this order. For the Restoration EP, I really love Crystallised don't have that much of a connection to the other two.
Oddly enough, if you switch 1 and 5, you get my ranking. ;D
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Let's do this:
1. The Mountain
2. Visions
3. Affinity
4. Vector
5. Aquarius
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I went though a spell where I thought Visions was their best, but it was fleeting. I do love how the production and keyboard sounds give it kind of a gritty and dirty feel, and the title track and Deathless are undoubtedly two of their best songs.
For me, the run from Insomnia to Deathless is perfect. I still have a high regard for the epic Visions, but over the years, I got tired listening to it. It has the opposite flaw of Celestial Elixir. While Celestial Elixir's problem is that there is no proper climax or payoff that's worth the time listening to such long piece of music, Visions' problem is that it has so many climaxes.
On another note, I just like to say that I love Ray Hearne's drumming. It's a shame he's not talked about much as one of the top prog drummers of this generation. I guess what's lacking with him is that he does not yet have a signature sound, the way Mangini, Portnoy, Jarzombek, Donati, Minnemann is recognizable just by hearing how the drums are played. He's like the Alan White of prog metal. :lol
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1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Aquarius
4. Vector
5. Visions
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I think I've done this before, but it is pretty set in stone now:
1. The Mountain
2. Aquarius
3. Affinity
4. Visions
5. Vector
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1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Aquarius
4. Vector
5. Visions
Every album is very good though imo.
Also +1 for liking The Cell Divides chorus.
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Vector has solidified itself as my second favourite just slightly edging out Affinity (the latter is more varied but the former is more consistent IMO). I think Restoration has dropped a bit as well, I love the first two tracks, but it's mostly made up of Crystallised which is good but not one of my favourites.
1. The Mountain
2. Vector
3. Affinity
4. Visions
5. Restoration
6. Aquarius
7. Demo
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Oh and also Saturday night's London gig was fantastic, the sound and performances were incredible from all three bands.
In terms of Haken's set, I loved the first hour as it was exciting to hear the Vector songs and they're really great live, and then FBTE and 1985 are among my favourite Haken songs. Bit less exciting after than, Architect is a lower-ranked song for me although some of it is amazing live, and Crystallised similarly has some great bits and pretty meh bits and I always find it slightly underwhelming live personally. And then we got treated to their cover of Africa with a few people from VOLA and Bent Knee (plus some crew) joining them. It was a very cool note to end the tour on.
Also, some of you have probably seen the Haken/Britney Spears mash up that was posted on Facebook a week or two ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqZ7hie6Ng0
Well that's what Ross sang for the final verse in The Good Doctor on Saturday night. :lol
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I have been binge-listening on Haken the past few days and I have got to say that Affinity is one of the most frustrating albums to listen to. It's brillian EVERY OTHER SONG, but it's also really underwhelming every other song. :lol I actually decided to just create an affinity EP in my phone that consists of
Affinity.exe/Initiate
Lapse
Earthrise
The Endless Knot
I am thinking of just combining these songs to the ones I like in Vector as my playlist of this phase in Haken's sound.
Also, why does Haken think it a good idea to split Tracks 1 and 2 in these last 2 albums when they are obviously meant to go together? I don't get it.
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Well that's what Ross sang for the final verse in The Good Doctor on Saturday night. :lol
I'm usually against filming with phones during gigs (occasional photo or two is fine by me), but I need to see the video of that. :lol
I really liked The Architect live, thought the song came across way better than the studio version. Crystallized was a bit of a letdown though, yeah.
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Well that's what Ross sang for the final verse in The Good Doctor on Saturday night. :lol
I'm usually against filming with phones during gigs (occasional photo or two is fine by me), but I need to see the video of that. :lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bj4crz2462g Here you go :lol
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Thank you good sir!
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Saw them last friday and was very impressed (again).
I like the Vector album but those songs work even better in a live setting. Puzzle Box, A Cell Divides and Veil were great and Nil by Mouth was just amazing.
Africa was a great surprise to end an evening that couldn't be better with Bent Knee and VOLA being some of the best support acts I've seen in a while.
I'm already looking forward to my next Haken shows which will be next friday :metal
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Well that's what Ross sang for the final verse in The Good Doctor on Saturday night. :lol
I'm usually against filming with phones during gigs (occasional photo or two is fine by me), but I need to see the video of that. :lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bj4crz2462g Here you go :lol
:clap:
When Meme and Day Unite
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Well that's what Ross sang for the final verse in The Good Doctor on Saturday night. :lol
I'm usually against filming with phones during gigs (occasional photo or two is fine by me), but I need to see the video of that. :lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bj4crz2462g Here you go :lol
:clap:
When Meme and Day Unite
Literally in tears and choking on my soda at this. :rollin :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :rollin
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Best mashup of pop and prog metal since Shaking Inside by Swift Theater.
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Oh and also Saturday night's London gig was fantastic, the sound and performances were incredible from all three bands.
In terms of Haken's set, I loved the first hour as it was exciting to hear the Vector songs and they're really great live, and then FBTE and 1985 are among my favourite Haken songs. Bit less exciting after than, Architect is a lower-ranked song for me although some of it is amazing live, and Crystallised similarly has some great bits and pretty meh bits and I always find it slightly underwhelming live personally. And then we got treated to their cover of Africa with a few people from VOLA and Bent Knee (plus some crew) joining them. It was a very cool note to end the tour on.
I saw them the night before in Zoetermeer, the Netherlands and it was amazing. Both Bent Knee and VOLA were awesome and Haken was probably at their best out of all the gigs I've seen from them. Nil by Mouth was somehow really good live, but I still think Veil is a weak song (sorry). The setlist was really good, with all the hard-hitting metal-ish songs from them, which really made me question the Encores. I already think Crystallised is about their worst song, but to hear it after the onslaught that was the main set was a real let-down for me. The Africa cover that came afterwards was really unnecessary, I thought. All in all though, I had a fantastic evening with lots of friends and great music.
Oh, and the Doctor Hit Me One More Time mash-up performed live was really funny, indeed :)
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Well that's what Ross sang for the final verse in The Good Doctor on Saturday night. :lol
I'm usually against filming with phones during gigs (occasional photo or two is fine by me), but I need to see the video of that. :lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bj4crz2462g Here you go :lol
:lol that worked out really well, they should keep it in the song
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They didn't do the mashup, but they did Africa in Vienna. :lol I couldn't believe what was happening.
This band is getting better and better
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Awesome :lol
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That was just hilarious, I love it when bands embrace memes. Weezer was the ultimate champion, DT did a fine job over the years, but this is new level stuff. :lol
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:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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I'm so happy they did that. :hefdaddy
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It is REALLY difficult for me to rate the catalog. Being newer to the band I recently dove into Affinity and absolutely love it. I was probably least impressed with Vector out of all the albums. I'll get back around to it though.
1. Affinity
2. Visions
3. Mountain
4. Aquarius
5. Vector
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So tonight in Finland there was a guy dressed as a Cockroach King in the audience and he got to go up on stage during that song :rollin
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So tonight in Finland there was a guy dressed as a Cockroach King in the audience and he got to go up on stage during that song :rollin
:rollin I need to see footage of that
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So tonight in Finland there was a guy dressed as a Cockroach King in the audience and he got to go up on stage during that song :rollin
:rollin I need to see footage of that
https://m.facebook.com/groups/1888115678168179?view=permalink&id=2211982889114788
Here you go (need to be in cockroarcposting group I think) ! That guy was right in front of me :lol
What an awesome concert that was! They really were in the top shape tonight!
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They were quite alright as well yesterday.
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So tonight in Finland there was a guy dressed as a Cockroach King in the audience and he got to go up on stage during that song :rollin
:rollin I need to see footage of that
https://m.facebook.com/groups/1888115678168179?view=permalink&id=2211982889114788
Here you go (need to be in cockroarcposting group I think) ! That guy was right in front of me :lol
What an awesome concert that was! They really were in the top shape tonight!
Link isn't working for me :'(
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You should join the Haken cockroachposting group for weak and bad memes and not funny conner pics!
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Haken will be supporting Devin Townsend on his European tour for Empath in November/December!
(https://scontent-frt3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/54730895_10157266399619744_7269762877588766720_o.jpg?_nc_cat=101&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_eui2=AeFSE5ip5XfgZwfDFyoFn9f8y65JJkptElBjJP5tpXUF0BogLgr3tLvY3cvNHechD2g71dNBur9w8hJO3NUGZgutRIXk1b3Mwj0Rc25RHh26hQ&_nc_ht=scontent-frt3-1.xx&oh=fa7b5b9258e47892401af6808a742733&oe=5D467C79)
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Who did they piss off in Finland? :lol
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I hope this is the same tour coming to the US next year
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Who did they piss off in Finland? :lol
Yeah, Finland was the only show without opening acts in this headline tour and now they skip us :huh:
There must be too cold for Brits :|
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I saw both Devin and Haken at Prognosis Festival this weekend.
Devin's first show of the acoustic tour and it was both impressive and funny (as usual). Off course we got a guest appearance by Anneke.
The first two songs of Empath are a bit too weird for me but Haken makes this an instant buy.
I won't skip an opportunity to see them nearby. Those Vector songs are just :metal
Plus living in The Netherlands gives me a fair chance of seeing Anneke & Devin again.
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So tonight in Finland there was a guy dressed as a Cockroach King in the audience and he got to go up on stage during that song :rollin
:rollin I need to see footage of that
There's the whole song:
https://youtu.be/6YKLiWv0ZjM
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So tonight in Finland there was a guy dressed as a Cockroach King in the audience and he got to go up on stage during that song :rollin
:rollin I need to see footage of that
There's the whole song:
https://youtu.be/6YKLiWv0ZjM
He nailed it :rollin
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There's a new interview with Ross, in a brazilian magazine (Roadiecrew ), from the end of january, and he said this:
"we already have material for a new album composed and a demo tape recorded for it.
we should work better that material after the tour and probably record it later this year." :tup
I suspect that they composed more than what was recorded for Vector.
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There's a new interview with Ross, in a brazilian magazine (Roadiecrew ), from the end of january, and he said this:
"we already have material for a new album composed and a demo tape recorded for it.
we should work better that material after the tour and probably record it later this year." :tup
I suspected that they composed more than what was recorded for Vector.
Because Vector is basically a longer EP :lol
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More frequent but shorter releases could be the future of album oriented music. Gotta keep the social media hype continuous.
Funny how vinyl as a dominant medium once dictated albums to be 40-ish minutes long long, of which active bands released one every year. CDs made 60-70 min albums common, usually released every other year.
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and with unlimited time in the digital world, making albums might not even be a thing in the future
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So my middle son (he's 11) is really getting into HAKEN...he listens to them quite a bit. It's kind of neat....like, last weekend I walked into his room and he's just jamming to 'The Mountain' while painting his model War Hammer figures he's been building.
Anyway, yesterday he comes up to me and says "Dad, you want to hear me sing my version of 'Falling Back to Earth'? I say, 'sure'....he then breaks into a controlled scream:
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
as his voice trails off. :lol
I know it's corny and I'm his Dad.....but I lost it. It caught me off guard and I thought it was pretty funny.
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That's awesome
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:lol
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:metal
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So my middle son (he's 11) is really getting into HAKEN...he listens to them quite a bit. It's kind of neat....like, last weekend I walked into his room and he's just jamming to 'The Mountain' while painting his model War Hammer figures he's been building.
Anyway, yesterday he comes up to me and says "Dad, you want to hear me sing my version of 'Falling Back to Earth'? I say, 'sure'....he then breaks into a controlled scream:
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
as his voice trails off. :lol
I know it's corny and I'm his Dad.....but I lost it. It caught me off guard and I thought it was pretty funny.
:lol :lol :tup :tup
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I'm still not the biggest fan of Vector or Nil by Mouth, but I'm not going to lie that synth drop at 1:45 in Nil by Mouth is the squelchiest, nastiest, dirtiest thing I've ever heard. It's easily the best part of the song and imo the entire album.
Like that's a Top 5 Haken moment there. It's so FILTHY
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Trying to get into Haken has been a bit hard for me. Specially since I love some parts of the sound but find the overall sound to be a bit hit and miss. Even find it to lack variation. But puzzle box is the best overall song I heard from them. A good song to understand and get into Haken since it shows unique aspects of their sound but within a very solid listenable experience. Maybe even more so since I am a DT-guy and love that sound so much and Puzzle Box somehow resonates with the DT-sound a bit. The crazy part at ~5:20 is just awesome ;D
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Puzzle Box is easily the best song on Vector and one of the best they've done overall I'd say.
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It's my favourite song on Vector, very closely followed by Veil.
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Trying to get into Haken has been a bit hard for me. Specially since I love some parts of the sound but find the overall sound to be a bit hit and miss. Even find it to lack variation. But puzzle box is the best overall song I heard from them. A good song to understand and get into Haken since it shows unique aspects of their sound but within a very solid listenable experience. Maybe even more so since I am a DT-guy and love that sound so much and Puzzle Box somehow resonates with the DT-sound a bit. The crazy part at ~5:20 is just awesome ;D
Being a DT-guy, how do you feel about Veil?
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Trying to get into Haken has been a bit hard for me. Specially since I love some parts of the sound but find the overall sound to be a bit hit and miss. Even find it to lack variation. But puzzle box is the best overall song I heard from them. A good song to understand and get into Haken since it shows unique aspects of their sound but within a very solid listenable experience. Maybe even more so since I am a DT-guy and love that sound so much and Puzzle Box somehow resonates with the DT-sound a bit. The crazy part at ~5:20 is just awesome ;D
Being a DT-guy, how do you feel about Veil?
It's ok. But it feels quite more standard Haken imo. It uses the unique aspects with these wobbly synth sounds, riffing and all that, but the chorus and insane wobbly parts from Puzzle Box isn't there. I wish they used more classic keyboard/synth sounds like the one at 0:56. Just a nice string synth adding some nice variation. Now it more becomes a song in the same vein as Puzzle Box but without having a strong hook and cool riff parts.
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Someone posted on Reddit asking about the rhythm at 10:55 of Veil. This is my guess. Does that sound right to you guys?
(https://i.imgur.com/mkw0Kmh.jpg)
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Someone posted on Reddit asking about the rhythm at 10:55 of Veil. This is my guess. Does that sound right to you guys?
(https://i.imgur.com/mkw0Kmh.jpg)
Not Great at Music notations so I'm Not sure what The 7:5 actually means. However, I think The entire solo trading section switches between 8/8 and 10/8 except for that one bar at 10:55 which seems to be in 9/8? Perhaps I'm misinterpreting The question? And maybe I'm misinterpreting The Music as well? :lol
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The 7:5 just means 7 eighth notes in the space of 5. I got 5/8 from tapping the eighth notes and the measure seems to be 5 notes long...almost. It seems very slightly off, but that could just be a performance thing because they immediately correct when continuing on. And then there are 7 hits in that rhythm they are actually playing so....7:5.
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I threw it in a DAW and recreated it in MuseScore and it sounds right.
Also, you don't need the :5 part of it. Just the indication that it's a septuplet and a bar line will do fine. It'll be pretty clear from context that it's 7 notes taking up the space of the bar, and you don't need the redundant information (and honestly it's a waste of ink haha).
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To me it sounds more like 2 triplets followed by a regular eighth note, but I'm not sure either.
or rather; a triplet rhythm but with the seventh note (same length as the previous notes) tacked onto the end. Note that this is not the same as a septuplet.
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Oh, that'd be a really fun metric modulation, but I'm not sure that's it. When I tap out triplets to the beat, the notes they are playing seem just a hair slower.
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I come back to Vector every now and then and I'm still surprised by how good it is. I still stand behind saying that The Good doctor / Puzzle box / Veil is their best streak of songs, and while I didn't find Nil by mouth all too memorable at first, there are some awesome bits in it that stuck with me over time.
It's great to be able to put on a rather short progressive metal record on and just rock out for no longer than 45 minutes. The band can still improve on it, though, given that I wasn't crazy about Host and A Cell divides. The idea of finishing an album with a ballad and a short rocker works great on parer, but I didn't find those songs to be that good. If the next album is in similar vein, I'd like it to be more consistent and have a strong ending.
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Puzzle Box is easily the best song on Vector and one of the best they've done overall I'd say.
I completely agree... it's easily a top 5 Haken song at this point for me. I'd even go as far as saying it's one of my favorite songs from the last 10 years.
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The guys return to Europe in the summer and even to my hometown Dresden! :metal
(https://scontent-ber1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/57226394_10157324992129744_5249302329022218240_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_ht=scontent-ber1-1.xx&oh=2254fd853850db0c9840feed813f0e1c&oe=5D36C463)
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If anyone is interested in a used Korg Karma
https://www.ebay.com/itm/333178948346?fbclid=IwAR2g8Q6QQyBKI1tQHutGbs-0hPuvUD-sbZs-qakL3epyNPwQ_TWSqGh-lfs (https://www.ebay.com/itm/333178948346?fbclid=IwAR2g8Q6QQyBKI1tQHutGbs-0hPuvUD-sbZs-qakL3epyNPwQ_TWSqGh-lfs)
Thought these notes were interesting
Condition: Used :
Seller Notes: “Unit is fully functional, with the exception of the floppy drive.The unit is in bad aesthetic shape:- Left and right end plastic caps are cracked/broken.- All original rotary knobs are missing.- One of the 2 rivets that hold the keybed in place is broken, resulting in dangling of the lower register of the keybed.”
I feel like the fact it got used to death is really cool. If I were a collector and had a lot of money to spend, I'd totally like to have something like that in my collection vs. a mint unit.
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If anyone is interested in a used Korg Karma
https://www.ebay.com/itm/333178948346?fbclid=IwAR2g8Q6QQyBKI1tQHutGbs-0hPuvUD-sbZs-qakL3epyNPwQ_TWSqGh-lfs (https://www.ebay.com/itm/333178948346?fbclid=IwAR2g8Q6QQyBKI1tQHutGbs-0hPuvUD-sbZs-qakL3epyNPwQ_TWSqGh-lfs)
Thought these notes were interesting
Condition: Used :
Seller Notes: “Unit is fully functional, with the exception of the floppy drive.The unit is in bad aesthetic shape:- Left and right end plastic caps are cracked/broken.- All original rotary knobs are missing.- One of the 2 rivets that hold the keybed in place is broken, resulting in dangling of the lower register of the keybed.”
I feel like the fact it got used to death is really cool. If I were a collector and had a lot of money to spend, I'd totally like to have something like that in my collection vs. a mint unit.
Pretty sweet. Wish I had the money laying around.
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Been re-listening to Vector recently and I gotta say, if the whole record was on the same quality level as Puzzle Box and Veil it would have been an amazing album. But the rest is just so underwhelming.
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Change that to Veil and Host, and I'd be in total agreement. I like Puzzle Box, but to me, Veil and Host are the clear standouts from the record. Those are the only three songs I ever listen to anymore from the record.
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For me, the only song I don't love is Host, it's only ok. The rest of the album is perfect IMO.
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It’s excellent.
It’s just overshadowed by the perfection of the first 4.
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There was a bit of disappointment.
A band was coming out of the gate with possibly the greatest opening 4 album run in all of progressive rock history, possibly on pace to usurp even the greatest bands of all time.....and then release a 5th album that is only “really really good”.
On its own, it would be better. But it’s hard not compare with the previous 4, and that makes it seem like the weakest link somehow
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The first half is perfect, then the quality drops and never gets back up, imo.
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To my ears, it is as good as anything they did before, maybe even the most solid album they did to date. It's just the first time they didn't outdo themselves and surprise me.
I still spin Vector once a week and it has replaced Affinity as my default Haken album.
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After Veil the album goes a bit downhill. Not bad, but it doesn't keep up the quality of how good it starts and it's just not that long to be able to recover from a couple uninteresting songs (Host, A Cell Divides). Good album for sure, but doesn't top what they've done before.
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The only two songs that do not do a whole lot for me are the last two. If they were overall as strong as the rest of the album, Vector would probably be my favorite release of theirs.
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The only song that doesn't do anything for me is Nil By Mouth. I think the rest is stellar, excellent Haken material. I like Vector way more than Affinity, although I wish it had one or two more songs.
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I like the album a lot, but it's not overwhelming or ground breaking as far as Haken albums go. I'd say they're still on track and I'm looking forward to the next release.
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The only two songs that do not do a whole lot for me are the last two.
This.
The fact the album's so short by modern standards (and by Haken's own standards) puts this, despite having some stellar songs otherwise, at the bottom of my Haken album ranking. But only because something's got to come last.
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Ladies and Gentlemen we hereby present to you "Nil by Mouth... by Mouth"
Brought to you by the good doctors at Freqstv & Zoom Deutschland
After the success of our acapella version of Toto's 'Africa', a new assignment was set to perform one of our own songs acapella... naturally we chose one of our instrumental pieces, and we still didn't let Ross join in!
Also on Youtube: https://youtu.be/2nmCWz65rco
Catch us at a select few summer shows across Europe in June/July. Info, Tickets & VIP upgrades here: https://www.hakenmusic.com/tour
https://www.facebook.com/324552258051454/posts/620693191770691?s=517009568&sfns=xmwa
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Ladies and Gentlemen we hereby present to you "Nil by Mouth... by Mouth"
Brought to you by the good doctors at Freqstv & Zoom Deutschland
After the success of our acapella version of Toto's 'Africa', a new assignment was set to perform one of our own songs acapella... naturally we chose one of our instrumental pieces, and we still didn't let Ross join in!
Also on Youtube: https://youtu.be/2nmCWz65rco
Catch us at a select few summer shows across Europe in June/July. Info, Tickets & VIP upgrades here: https://www.hakenmusic.com/tour
https://www.facebook.com/324552258051454/posts/620693191770691?s=517009568&sfns=xmwa
This is the best video I never knew I needed untill now :rollin
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Ladies and Gentlemen we hereby present to you "Nil by Mouth... by Mouth"
Brought to you by the good doctors at Freqstv & Zoom Deutschland
After the success of our acapella version of Toto's 'Africa', a new assignment was set to perform one of our own songs acapella... naturally we chose one of our instrumental pieces, and we still didn't let Ross join in!
Also on Youtube: https://youtu.be/2nmCWz65rco
Catch us at a select few summer shows across Europe in June/July. Info, Tickets & VIP upgrades here: https://www.hakenmusic.com/tour
https://www.facebook.com/324552258051454/posts/620693191770691?s=517009568&sfns=xmwa
This is the best video I never knew I needed untill now :rollin
Yea that was hilarious. :lol
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:rollin :rollin That's amazing.
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I saw Haken at a festival last night and even though I'm not a diehard fan and they only had a 60-minute slot, they wiped the floor with all the other bands. The show was in a tent, so the crowd wasn't massive, but made up for it with enthusiasm - there were even mosh pits, which you rarely see at prog gigs in Finland. 1985 = :hefdaddy
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I don't mean to offend anyone, but are Haken really that good, or is it the hype? (I'm not too familiar with them, so that's why I ask)
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Probably somewhere in the middle
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I don't mean to offend anyone, but are Haken really that good, or is it the hype? (I'm not too familiar with them, so that's why I ask)
Hmmm, I wonder what fans in this thread will say...:P
I didn't buy the hype at first outside of a few songs, but they slowly won me over, and now I would definitely say they are that good. The singer was a tough hill for me to climb, but I got there eventually.
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I'd say it's an acquired taste. Either you like them, or you don't. A lot of people here like them, and a lot of people, well, don't. My best friend doesn't like them at all, and I throw at him all kinds of music I like and that's basically how I introduced him to Steven Wilson, Agalloch, Wolverine, Leprous, Ayreon; he loves all those bands but he doesn't like Haken. I, on the other hand, love them. They're a breath of fresh air in a prog metal scene.
I travelled to Hamburg to see their show and do a meet and greet with them, and it was worth every penny and then some. I had a blast chatting with them, and the show was fantastic.
Another thing I wanted to kinda mention, I love how diverse their T-shirts are. For Vector tour, I have a beige one, a red one, a black one with green/orange print, the black with insects and then I also bought the green Heineken/Haken one because that one is pretty good. I think among all the bands Haken is the one I own most T-shirts from. :lol
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To anyone still wanting to check them out for the first time, I would strongly recommend to not start with Initiate and The Good Doctor, the lead "singles" from their last two albums. Those have got to be their most bland songs ever; it's almost like they tried to write something short and catchy to attract new fans, but those kinds of songs are not their forte.
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I don't mean to offend anyone, but are Haken really that good, or is it the hype? (I'm not too familiar with them, so that's why I ask)
I don't understand the question. Surely the hype is precisely because a reasonably large number of people think they really are that good.
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To anyone still wanting to check them out for the first time, I would strongly recommend to not start with Initiate and The Good Doctor, the lead "singles" from their last two albums. Those have got to be their most bland songs ever; it's almost like they tried to write something short and catchy to attract new fans, but those kinds of songs are not their forte.
I guess that my unpopular take is that the short, catchy songs might be my favorite songs on Affinity (Initiate, Lapse and Earthrise).
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Is "hype" even an applicable word for a band that has been around for a decade and has released 5 albums?
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I don't mean to offend anyone, but are Haken really that good, or is it the hype? (I'm not too familiar with them, so that's why I ask)
Every single one of their albums rates very good to excellent for me.
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To anyone still wanting to check them out for the first time, I would strongly recommend to not start with Initiate and The Good Doctor, the lead "singles" from their last two albums. Those have got to be their most bland songs ever; it's almost like they tried to write something short and catchy to attract new fans, but those kinds of songs are not their forte.
Darkest Light falls into this category too. Just bland and very typical. I don't think their strength is in that type of song, but Good Doctor is the best of the bunch imo.
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Darkest Light falls into this category too. Just bland and very typical. I don't think their strength is in that type of song, but Good Doctor is the best of the bunch imo.
I agree about Darkest Light. I am not a fan of that one either.
I guess that my unpopular take is that the short, catchy songs might be my favorite songs on Affinity (Initiate, Lapse and Earthrise).
Earthrise is excellent, and I like Lapse quite a bit as well. Initiate is just bland.
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I think Initiate is a best song on Affinity.
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Initiate and Good Doctor both work well as album openers for me. They are both leave me a bit unsatisfied and craving for more. Especially Initiate, which cuts off abruptly to be continued in Architect and Bound by Gravity.
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Ya, I didn't think Initiate was all that great. Fortunately, the album just keeps getting better, and ends with possibly their greatest album closer of all time.
Vector, unfortunately, is just the opposite for me. Pretty good opener, but then just "above average" for most of the rest of the album.
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Gotta be honest, for me the last two albums are a significant drop-off from the first three.
The first three, especially Aquarius and The Mountain were excellent, so a significant drop-off is still good, but it's still there and noticeable for me.
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Affinity, for me, was a drastic "left turn"....but I felt pretty strongly that that is what made it so great. They were in danger of repeating themselves if they didn't do something very different with their 4th album, so that's exactly what they did.
I have to give The Mountain the edge, because the theme and lyrics are extremely personal to me. I heard that album for the first time at a very dark time in my life when I was wondering if it was worth it to go on. But the albums theme of overcoming adversity.....and really doing it in such a positive uplifting way....was just the right music at the right moment. Totally pulled me out of my funk.
That having been said, Affinity is possibly a musically superior album. The musical themes (as opposed to the lyrical themes) are truly breathtaking. Not that The Mountain's aren't, but the musical congruency of Affinity is just....wow.
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I definitely share your high opinion of The Mountain.
Affinity just ain't that for me. I can really for the most part take or leave everything after Earthrise. Red Giant and Bound By Gravity are enjoyable but not memorable, and The Endless Knot is not really my style, though not by any means bad. And I never got the massive hype around 1985. It's a solid song, but it's 5th on the album by a wide margin. For me, Affinity is three very good to great short songs, a very good epic (that nonetheless does not match any of their previous epics in quality), and some stuff that's solid but not exciting.
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the mountain is their best, aquarius is right behind it. affinity and vector are solid, visions is meh.
also, darkest light is maybe the worst haken song because not only is it bland and repetitive but it takes the best song off their demo and makes it significantly less interesting. i don't know why they did that to the song.
anyways the good doctor is great actually
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Going to see the boys tonight in Nürnberg! And next week again in Dresden - can't wait for this cheerful insanity!
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I saw them headline in my hometown in March. I'm going to see them next week in a city two hours away. And I'm going to see them in December, when they open for Devin Townsend.
2019 is a good year :metal
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I'm going to interview Richard about his solo album next week. Questions for him?
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I'm going to interview Richard about his solo album next week. Questions for him?
What he can tell us about the next Haken album? :corn
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I'm going to interview Richard about his solo album next week. Questions for him?
What he can tell us about the next Haken album? :corn
I think it will be a continuation of the last one which many called a conceptual album
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I was just thinking... I'd love to hear Haken do an album of Covers. I'd donate to a crowdfund for that. Include Africa and a DT song :lol
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I was just thinking... I'd love to hear Haken do an album of Covers. I'd donate to a crowdfund for that. Include Africa and a DT song :lol
MP's TSF was pretty close to a show of Haken doing DT and it was really awesome. I'm not sure I'd want them to focus on an album of covers, but if they did a bonus disc of covers for their next album similar to what DT did for BC&SL, I'd be down with that.
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I was just thinking... I'd love to hear Haken do an album of Covers. I'd donate to a crowdfund for that. Include Africa and a DT song :lol
If they ever did a DT song, I really hope they don’t do anything really classic like PMU or Home. Instead it might be cool if they took something older and obscure and did it really different. Make it Haken-ized.
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I'm going to interview Richard about his solo album next week. Questions for him?
Is Nova Collective still working on new material?
What's the song (by any artist) that you played the most when practicing guitar?
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I was just thinking... I'd love to hear Haken do an album of Covers. I'd donate to a crowdfund for that. Include Africa and a DT song :lol
If they ever did a DT song, I really hope they don’t do anything really classic like PMU or Home. Instead it might be cool if they took something older and obscure and did it really different. Make it Haken-ized.
Yeah, I'd pay for that, but I don't want it to be a note-for-note cover. Do something like Nightwish did with High Hopes (well, not the best example because you can't improve High Hopes), do something different or at least make it sound like your song.
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HaKEN ft. Aqua - Barbie Box
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NyXTnZQh1c
YOU CAN TOUCH YOU CAN PLAY BUT YOU CANNOT SOLVE THIS PUZZLE BOX
:metal
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HaKEN ft. Aqua - Barbie Box
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NyXTnZQh1c
YOU CAN TOUCH YOU CAN PLAY BUT YOU CANNOT SOLVE THIS PUZZLE BOX
:metal
This is awful... but I can't stop listening :lol
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omg :lol this is ridiculous but it kind of works, I mean I don't actually enjoy it but it's hilarious
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I finally spoke with Richard Henshall last saturday, and the interview was published today. Check it out!!!
https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-richard-henshall/?fbclid=IwAR3pnOiRsusZomn-HOZ-3BYDVJ_j3M70rvhJWgDWP7NkKszfzMFZuDfTH48
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HaKEN ft. Aqua - Barbie Box
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NyXTnZQh1c
YOU CAN TOUCH YOU CAN PLAY BUT YOU CANNOT SOLVE THIS PUZZLE BOX
:metal
Oh My....
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Burnished just shipped Richard's solo album. I hope I get by end of this week. Very excited about this one!
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Burnished just shipped Richard's solo album. I hope I get by end of this week. Very excited about this one!
It's Haken meets Zappa.
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I finally spoke with Richard Henshall last saturday, and the interview was published today. Check it out!!!
https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-richard-henshall/?fbclid=IwAR3pnOiRsusZomn-HOZ-3BYDVJ_j3M70rvhJWgDWP7NkKszfzMFZuDfTH48
Cool, Rodrigo! It will be a written version of it?
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Great interview.
If you're a Haken fan and don't have time to listen to it, Hen mentions that they are working on a new album and intend to release it in early 2020.
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If you're a Haken fan and don't have time to listen to it, Hen mentions that they are working on a new album and intend to release it in early 2020.
Nice! The sooner, the better. :metal :metal
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I finally spoke with Richard Henshall last saturday, and the interview was published today. Check it out!!!
https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-richard-henshall/?fbclid=IwAR3pnOiRsusZomn-HOZ-3BYDVJ_j3M70rvhJWgDWP7NkKszfzMFZuDfTH48
Cool, Rodrigo! It will be a written version of it?
No, only the audio.
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If you're a Haken fan and don't have time to listen to it, Hen mentions that they are working on a new album and intend to release it in early 2020.
Nice! The sooner, the better. :metal :metal
Who knows, if it’s as short as Vector, we might even have it by the end of the year :lol
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Great interview.
If you're a Haken fan and don't have time to listen to it, Hen mentions that they are working on a new album and intend to release it in early 2020.
Thanks for the information!
He gave any hint about the musical direction?
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I wonder if the shortness of Vector has partially sped up the process of working on HK6. When you've previously dealt exclusively in 60-70-minute albums and you suddenly release one that's only 45, there must be material left over that can be worked on and developed for a future album.
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I wonder if the shortness of Vector has partially sped up the process of working on HK6. When you've previously dealt exclusively in 60-70-minute albums and you suddenly release one that's only 45, there must be material left over that can be worked on and developed for a future album.
Im sure there are. Songs that were written but in the end didn't fit the vibe/mood/etc of the album.
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I wonder if the shortness of Vector has partially sped up the process of working on HK6. When you've previously dealt exclusively in 60-70-minute albums and you suddenly release one that's only 45, there must be material left over that can be worked on and developed for a future album.
Im sure there are. Songs that were written but in the end didn't fit the vibe/mood/etc of the album.
When I interviewed Diego, I asked him about this (sadly, I did it after the interview was done, and was off the record), but he said that due to the tour of Shattered Fortress and that their release cycly was broken (due to SF) it took them longer to put the album out, and they almost did it in a rush, they wanted the album out quickly and that's why it is shorter than others albums. In fact, he said that they almost put it out as an EP with only 3 to 4 songs but the label pushed them to make an album not an EP
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I wonder if the shortness of Vector has partially sped up the process of working on HK6. When you've previously dealt exclusively in 60-70-minute albums and you suddenly release one that's only 45, there must be material left over that can be worked on and developed for a future album.
Im sure there are. Songs that were written but in the end didn't fit the vibe/mood/etc of the album.
When I interviewed Diego, I asked him about this (sadly, I did it after the interview was done, and was off the record), but he said that due to the tour of Shattered Fortress and that their release cycly was broken (due to SF) it took them longer to put the album out, and they almost did it in a rush, they wanted the album out quickly and that's why it is shorter than others albums. In fact, he said that they almost put it out as an EP with only 3 to 4 songs but the label pushed them to make an album not an EP
That's along the lines of my understanding too. As far as I'm aware, there isn't any substantive leftover material (almost certainly discararded ideas, etc, but no full tracks or anything).
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I wonder if the shortness of Vector has partially sped up the process of working on HK6. When you've previously dealt exclusively in 60-70-minute albums and you suddenly release one that's only 45, there must be material left over that can be worked on and developed for a future album.
Im sure there are. Songs that were written but in the end didn't fit the vibe/mood/etc of the album.
When I interviewed Diego, I asked him about this (sadly, I did it after the interview was done, and was off the record), but he said that due to the tour of Shattered Fortress and that their release cycly was broken (due to SF) it took them longer to put the album out, and they almost did it in a rush, they wanted the album out quickly and that's why it is shorter than others albums. In fact, he said that they almost put it out as an EP with only 3 to 4 songs but the label pushed them to make an album not an EP
So we can blame Portnoy? :biggrin:
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I wonder if the shortness of Vector has partially sped up the process of working on HK6. When you've previously dealt exclusively in 60-70-minute albums and you suddenly release one that's only 45, there must be material left over that can be worked on and developed for a future album.
Im sure there are. Songs that were written but in the end didn't fit the vibe/mood/etc of the album.
When I interviewed Diego, I asked him about this (sadly, I did it after the interview was done, and was off the record), but he said that due to the tour of Shattered Fortress and that their release cycly was broken (due to SF) it took them longer to put the album out, and they almost did it in a rush, they wanted the album out quickly and that's why it is shorter than others albums. In fact, he said that they almost put it out as an EP with only 3 to 4 songs but the label pushed them to make an album not an EP
So we can blame Portnoy? :biggrin:
LOL I think we can.
J/K
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Makes me wonder why they didn't just say no to the Shattered Fortress thing. I guess maybe they figured it would give them a little more exposure.
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Yes. And probably they just didn’t want to say no to MP as I think they are close to him
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Given that I have read rumblings that Portnoy really puts pressure on those he has done favors for to be there when he needs a favor in the future, almost like they owe him, I think it's a good possibility that they felt like they couldn't say no.
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Given that I have read rumblings that Portnoy really puts pressure on those he has done favors for to be there when he needs a favor in the future, almost like they owe him, I think it's a good possibility that they felt like they couldn't say no.
That may or may not be, but why would they want to say no? It's time playing music they probably all had a blast playing, all while upping their exposure to many fans who otherwise may not have known them, and all while getting paid probably more than whatever they make touring in Haken. It's a win-win-win. Sure, it delayed some Haken things, but that tour will do more for Haken's future than anything they would have done with Haken during that same time.
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To my knowledge including from conversations with some of the band, the Shattered Fortress thing was something they genuinely wanted to do for both the experience and the exposure. I've never heard any of them suggest there was any kind of obligation to Mike, or anything like that.
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Given that I have read rumblings that Portnoy really puts pressure on those he has done favors for to be there when he needs a favor in the future, almost like they owe him, I think it's a good possibility that they felt like they couldn't say no.
That may or may not be, but why would they want to say no? It's time playing music they probably all had a blast playing, all while upping their exposure to many fans who otherwise may not have known them, and all while getting paid probably more than whatever they make touring in Haken. It's a win-win-win. Sure, it delayed some Haken things, but that tour will do more for Haken's future than anything they would have done with Haken during that same time.
THIS.
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I've got to imagine that anyone who saw that show and wasn't into Haken at least got some appreciation from them for their amazing performance of DT songs. I'd imagine that was good exposure for them and it wasn't that much of a bump of the Haken schedule to fit it in that it would hurt the band.
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Mike Portnoy coming to you and asking you to tour with him playing DT material would be like some small bay area metal band being approached by Hetfield and being asked to tour with him playing Metallica tracks.
How does one say no? :lol
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Mike Portnoy coming to you and asking you to tour with him playing DT material would be like some small bay area metal band being approached by Hetfield and being asked to tour with him playing Metallica tracks.
How does one say no? :lol
Well said.
Also, can't wait to hear the Hen album. My preorder is underway but I'm on vacation right now. I hope it will be available on Spotify.
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Was messing around cooking this morning and just had music going and on comes the whole of Aquarius, Instrumental version. I pretty much never listen to the all instrumentals and this was the first time listening to this. I must say, it's pretty damn good and can definitely stand on it's own!!!
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Was messing around cooking this morning and just had music going and on comes the whole of Aquarius, Instrumental version. I pretty much never listen to the all instrumentals and this was the first time listening to this. I must say, it's pretty damn good and can definitely stand on it's own!!!
The instrumental mix of that album is one of my go to "chillax and go to sleep" albums. Very soothing
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Anyone have any US tour info? I see these dates listed in the link below. When I look on Ticketmaster it takes me to a Devin Townsend gig. Are they supporting him? In small venues?? I sure hope not....
https://www.hakenmusic.com/tour
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Anyone have any US tour info? I see these dates listed in the link below. When I look on Ticketmaster it takes me to a Devin Townsend gig. Are they supporting him? In small venues?? I sure hope not....
https://www.hakenmusic.com/tour
That is correct.
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So pumped for this tour, I'll be going to brooklyn and debating about doing the road trip to Boston as well. Diego is playing in Devin's band as well.
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Man, this show has some big strikes for me. I HATE General admission, but I'd put up with it for a small venue if they were the headliners. But if they're only gonna play for less than 1.5 hours I don't know if I want to deal with the GA AND downtown Los Angeles :( Totally bummed that this isn't a headlining tour. I missed last US leg because I had just discovered the band and there were no tix to the LA show available :(
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I'll most likely take the kiddos to the Nashville show. All three of my boys REALLY got into Haken literally a month or so after they came through St. Louis on the Vector tour. They've been asking ever since when they'd get to see them. My brother in law lives there so we could knock out a visit and see a show.
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I'll most likely take the kiddos to the Nashville show. All three of my boys REALLY got into Haken literally a month or so after they came through St. Louis on the Vector tour. They've been asking ever since when they'd get to see them. My brother in law lives there so we could knock out a visit and see a show.
Make sure you and the kiddos are all wearing Blues Stanley Cup gear. :biggrin: :biggrin:
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I'll most likely take the kiddos to the Nashville show. All three of my boys REALLY got into Haken literally a month or so after they came through St. Louis on the Vector tour. They've been asking ever since when they'd get to see them. My brother in law lives there so we could knock out a visit and see a show.
Make sure you and the kiddos are all wearing Blues Stanley Cup gear. :biggrin: :biggrin:
I text him a championship photo at least once a week. Just to say 'hi' :lol
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I'll most likely take the kiddos to the Nashville show. All three of my boys REALLY got into Haken literally a month or so after they came through St. Louis on the Vector tour. They've been asking ever since when they'd get to see them. My brother in law lives there so we could knock out a visit and see a show.
Make sure you and the kiddos are all wearing Blues Stanley Cup gear. :biggrin: :biggrin:
I text him a championship photo at least once a week. Just to say 'hi' :lol
:metal :metal
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I'll most likely take the kiddos to the Nashville show. All three of my boys REALLY got into Haken literally a month or so after they came through St. Louis on the Vector tour. They've been asking ever since when they'd get to see them. My brother in law lives there so we could knock out a visit and see a show.
Make sure you and the kiddos are all wearing Blues Stanley Cup gear. :biggrin: :biggrin:
They will be in the Cannery Ballroom. I saw Steven Wilson there earlier this year. The venue is a step up from the Exit Inn, where I saw Haken, Leporus and Bent Knee earlier this year.
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From Richard Henshalls solo album:
Matt Lynch - Richard Henshall - Twisted Shadows - Drum Playthrough (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-rA-THg7u0)
I absolutely love Matts playing so tasty, dynamic and creative.
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Just as a side note (I haven't read the whole thread), even though Vector was short, I thought it was a very good album. Also, the news that they might put out a new record next year is really good news!
Haken have become one of my favorite bands and my second favorite progressive band next to DT.
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Just as a side note (I haven't read the whole thread), even though Vector was short, I thought it was a very good album. Also, the news that they might put out a new record next year is really good news!
Haken have become one of my favorite bands and my second favorite progressive band next to DT.
A new album soon would be great. It feels like they lost a little bit of their forward momentum with Vector, which I thought was good but not great, and a new kick ass album would go a long way into getting that trajectory going the right away again, IMO.
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Just as a side note (I haven't read the whole thread), even though Vector was short, I thought it was a very good album. Also, the news that they might put out a new record next year is really good news!
Haken have become one of my favorite bands and my second favorite progressive band next to DT.
A new album soon would be great. It feels like they lost a little bit of their forward momentum with Vector, which I thought was good but not great, and a new kick ass album would go a long way into getting that trajectory going the right away again, IMO.
Exactly the way I feel. They may have the greatest "starting four" of any band I've ever heard....although Pain of Salvation is really close. But Vector was only "really good", which speaks volumes to the quality of the first four. Vector would be the crown jewel of almost any other band. But for Haken, it's an "also ran". I really hope they take a hard left turn on their next one and throw some shocking things at me.
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BUMP!
The Haken vs QR thread got me thinking that I was on such a Haken frenzy for such a long time, that I took quite a long break from listening to them at all, and now I'm kinda wanting to bust out there stuff again.
I was wondering how the Live album has aged for most people? I love the medley, and it has its moments, but I have to say that I was just a tad underwhelmed. I was hoping for a mind blowing "band on fire at their creative peak" face melting experience, but it didn't quite live up to that.
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I absolutely LOVE Haken's music (in case anyone didn't know), but generally I find their live show to be *somewhat* stale and predictable, and I think their use of a click shines through in a live performance a bit too much as they often seem to sync more to that than each other. Pair that with some low quality video (for a live video) and not a lot of cameras and I still love listening to the live album, but don't have much desire to ever watch it.
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(posted in the wrong thread, sorry, nevermind)
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I haven't watched in a while, but, like Nick, the not-great video quality of the DVD took away from it a little bit, although I get they don't have big bucks to make a pristine one yet. Was still cool to get on a live video all of those songs (counting the extras).
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I was underwhelmed with the DVD for the exact reasons stated but I haven't really listened to the CDs much to comment more. I think I just watched the DVD twice and shelved it but kind of forgot it came with CDs. I dont recall the audio being poor so it's probably a much better listen than watch.
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Listened to Affinity for the first. Kind of a different vibe, but I love it.
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Listened to Affinity for the first. Kind of a different vibe, but I love it.
That one was the very definition of "grower not a shower". I was really luke warm on it at first, but now I think it's pure genius. The ending of Bound By Gravity is one of those rare moments of musical perfection.
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Honestly, Vector killed my love for Haken :-\
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Honestly, Vector killed my love for Haken :-\
I think that's a bit much. But I get it. I guess I just think of it this way. No band can keep pumping out *PERFECT* albums over and over again. Vector was the first Haken album that didn't feel "fresh". Maybe they tried to put it out too quickly after the Affinity Tour and Live album. I'm sure they were trying to keep the momentum going, but it was bound to hit a creative speed bump sooner or later.
I still think that if they take a step back and really challenge themselves creatively with this next one, they can bounce back.
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Honestly, Vector killed my love for Haken :-\
That's hard to believe. I love when a band doesn't sit still. Home run or a swing and a miss I love a band that deviates.
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Honestly, Vector killed my love for Haken :-\
That's hard to believe. I love when a band doesn't sit still. Home run or a swing and a miss I love a band that deviates.
Well....speaking only for myself...my problem with Vector is that it DID feel like "sitting still". Every other album felt completely unique. Vector felt like retreads of everything Haken has done up to this point.
Remember when a really good TV show would give the staff a week off and they would do a "flashback" episode? Vector felt like that.
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My issue is that Aquarius was very good, Visions was better and The Mountain was even better than that. Restoration and Affinity already had a few tracks I didn't care about and Vector has some really good moments, but the album isn't consistent at all. I seem to dislike the direction the've been taking since Affinity (or even Restoration) and Vector solidified that opinion for me.
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A change can be sonically and that's what Vector is.
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A change can be sonically and that's what Vector is.
I don't like the darker/depressing direccion they are taking with their music.
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A change can be sonically and that's what Vector is.
I don't like the darker/depressing direccion they are taking with their music.
I hadn't thought about it before, but if there is a change at all with Vector, this is it. The Mountain was an album that *literally* lifted me out of one of the darkest periods of my life when I first heard it. Maybe one of two times in all my 50 years when I was seriously contemplating ending it all. And The Mountain was just all about overcoming obstacles. One of the most positive prog albums I have ever heard. Affinity gets a bit dark with The Architect, but most of it is still very upbuilding and positive. 1985 and Bound By Gravity both make me feel extremely positive and happy.
Vector is extremely dark throughout. And honestly, if we look back at Haken's catalog, Visions is a fairly dark subject matter, but it's juxtaposed with some surprisingly joyful and happy musical moments...the short "video game" homage is a perfect example (I forget which song that appears in) but then Deathless is a pretty dark and somber tune (but still one of their best). But ya, Vector hasn't given me a single uplifting moment that I can recall.
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I thought Vector was overall fairly well received. My only problem is that it's short and it ends with the two worse songs from the album so it feels even shorter of awesome songs. Still a good album though.
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Good album, yes, and I think most liked it based on what I have seen, but there seemed to be a lack of excitement about the album in general. Looking at a variety of sites, its rating is just a shade or two below the ones of the first four albums, but what is glaring is that the number of actual ratings/reviews, which was down pretty significantly from the prior records, and when fans do not take the time to rate or review an album (relative to prior records), that usually tells me that fans didn't love it or dislike it enough to spend the time to rate and/or review it.
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I think that's definitely due to the length and lack of true standout songs. It feels more like an EP and there's no song on there that feels like a 1985 or a Cockroach King (or a Visions or Celestial Elixir, etc). I think if the album would've had an epic length track or some bigger songs in general and ended on a better note than A Cell Divides, then it would've been ranked at least as high as the ones before it.
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My only problem is that it's short and it ends with the two worse songs from the album so it feels even shorter of awesome songs.
Yea, this too.
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I actually really enjoy Vector.
A Cell Divides is a great closer. I like that song a lot, its up there with Bound By Gravity for me.
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Alright so I decided to take the plunge and listen to Haken. I just finished a listen through The Mountain and I don't really get it. The musicianship is great, vocals are good and there are snippets of greatness through out but does every song have to take a detour to a Dance of Eternity style instrumental section? I guess it might not be for me but are there some other albums I should check out?
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Alright so I decided to take the plunge and listen to Haken. I just finished a listen through The Mountain and I don't really get it. The musicianship is great, vocals are good and there are snippets of greatness through out but does every song have to take a detour to a Dance of Eternity style instrumental section? I guess it might not be for me but are there some other albums I should check out?
I think The Mountain was probably the majority of Haken fans' introduction to the band so I'm not sure you'd like anything else if you didn't like that one. They definitely detour into crazy instrumental parts regularly but I never find them to be jarring to the point of feeling unnecessary.
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Haken the League starts now! Go vote for your favorite songs!
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=54657.0
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Alright so I decided to take the plunge and listen to Haken. I just finished a listen through The Mountain and I don't really get it. The musicianship is great, vocals are good and there are snippets of greatness through out but does every song have to take a detour to a Dance of Eternity style instrumental section? I guess it might not be for me but are there some other albums I should check out?
Interesting take. I never got that kind of impression when first hearing their music. I like the fact that their instrumental sections are often "full band solo" sections, rather than one instrument dominating or trading off from one to the other.
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Alright so I decided to take the plunge and listen to Haken. I just finished a listen through The Mountain and I don't really get it. The musicianship is great, vocals are good and there are snippets of greatness through out but does every song have to take a detour to a Dance of Eternity style instrumental section? I guess it might not be for me but are there some other albums I should check out?
I think the Mountain is very good, and very proggy. But for me, it's not my favorite of theirs and I'm a minority person on this opinion, but I'd say check out Visions. You'll still have your instrumental sections, I mean it's part of who they are, but I find that album to be much easier to digest as it's a bit more standard prog metal.
and if that's not your cup of tea, I'm afraid Haken are likely not for you. Having said that, it took me a bunch of listens to really like Haken myself. I was introduced with Affinity as that was their newest when I first saw them live. I'd say I even like that one more than The Mountain as well.
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I'll give Visions a shot. I actually gave the mountain a spin again and I did enjoy it more. I've taken to the later half of the album at lot more than the first half.
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I'm the opposite. I find the 1st 2 albums hit or miss and the last 3 albums & EP amazing.
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Seriously, anyone, whenever you decide to listen to a band for the first time, give it a couple of goes before you even declare that you've done so. Saves U-turns like this, which happen frequently amongst many people.
I just finished a listen through The Mountain and I don't really get it.
I actually gave the mountain a spin again and I did enjoy it more. I've taken to the later half of the album at lot more than the first half.
It is impossible for anyone to form a solid opinion on just one listen. I have frequently found albums a bit meh on first listen, only for that to change as I get used to the music.
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I'll give Visions a shot. I actually gave the mountain a spin again and I did enjoy it more. I've taken to the later half of the album at lot more than the first half.
I hear a HUGE SFAM influence/homage with Visions. In a good way.
The Mind’s Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter medley is PERFECTION!!!
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I'm the opposite. I find the 1st 2 albums hit or miss and the last 3 albums & EP amazing.
:eek :eek
What are the misses on the first album?
I will answer that for you: there are none. :biggrin:
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Harsh vocals in Streams are a pretty gigantic miss.
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:lol
It just doesn't click with me. 🤷♂️
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Seriously, anyone, whenever you decide to listen to a band for the first time, give it a couple of goes before you even declare that you've done so. Saves U-turns like this, which happen frequently amongst many people.
I just finished a listen through The Mountain and I don't really get it.
I actually gave the mountain a spin again and I did enjoy it more. I've taken to the later half of the album at lot more than the first half.
It is impossible for anyone to form a solid opinion on just one listen. I have frequently found albums a bit meh on first listen, only for that to change as I get used to the music.
:tup
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I think the Mountain is very good, and very proggy. But for me, it's not my favorite of theirs and I'm a minority person on this opinion, but I'd say check out Visions. You'll still have your instrumental sections, I mean it's part of who they are, but I find that album to be much easier to digest as it's a bit more standard prog metal.
Bolded the key part. I share this opinion. For me, The Mountain is my least favorite album of theirs and Visions is my favorite, without question.
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Visions is their more DT sounding album, so it's clearly good :lol :biggrin:
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Seriously, anyone, whenever you decide to listen to a band for the first time, give it a couple of goes before you even declare that you've done so. Saves U-turns like this, which happen frequently amongst many people.
I just finished a listen through The Mountain and I don't really get it.
I actually gave the mountain a spin again and I did enjoy it more. I've taken to the later half of the album at lot more than the first half.
It is impossible for anyone to form a solid opinion on just one listen. I have frequently found albums a bit meh on first listen, only for that to change as I get used to the music.
I usually don't give albums multiple spins if they don't click with me but with Haken there was a lot going on in that album plus a lot of praise coming from the forum I figured to give it another go.
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Just saw that HAKEN will be playing a one off show in St. Louis while on tour with Townsend on March 18. Pretty sweet considering we were going to make the trip to Nashville to see them. Now it just became a lot cheaper night.
My boys are really in to HAKEN and they’re my middle sons favorite band. So, we may do some tour bus stalking after the show that night to try and see if we can meet any of them.
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That's pretty sweet :metal
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Just saw that HAKEN will be playing a one off show in St. Louis while on tour with Townsend on March 18. Pretty sweet considering we were going to make the trip to Nashville to see them. Now it just became a lot cheaper night.
My boys are really in to HAKEN and they’re my middle sons favorite band. So, we may do some tour bus stalking after the show that night to try and see if we can meet any of them.
I heard about that, although it looks like a show by themselves (with no Devin). The place where they are playing is a hole in the wall in a part of the city I try to avoid. Okay, I try to avoid all of the city. :lol :lol
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Just saw that HAKEN will be playing a one off show in St. Louis while on tour with Townsend on March 18. Pretty sweet considering we were going to make the trip to Nashville to see them. Now it just became a lot cheaper night.
My boys are really in to HAKEN and they’re my middle sons favorite band. So, we may do some tour bus stalking after the show that night to try and see if we can meet any of them.
I heard about that, although it looks like a show by themselves (with no Devin). The place where they are playing is a hole in the wall in a part of the city I try to avoid. Okay, I try to avoid all of the city. :lol :lol
But, on the off chance you had a far off visitor coming in for the show, surely you'd make the point to be there?
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Just saw that HAKEN will be playing a one off show in St. Louis while on tour with Townsend on March 18. Pretty sweet considering we were going to make the trip to Nashville to see them. Now it just became a lot cheaper night.
My boys are really in to HAKEN and they’re my middle sons favorite band. So, we may do some tour bus stalking after the show that night to try and see if we can meet any of them.
I heard about that, although it looks like a show by themselves (with no Devin). The place where they are playing is a hole in the wall in a part of the city I try to avoid. Okay, I try to avoid all of the city. :lol :lol
But, on the off chance you had a far off visitor coming in for the show, surely you'd make the point to be there?
Of course! Not that I wouldn't go anyway, although those concerts during the week are rough for us old guys. :P
You coming to town??
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Just saw that HAKEN will be playing a one off show in St. Louis while on tour with Townsend on March 18. Pretty sweet considering we were going to make the trip to Nashville to see them. Now it just became a lot cheaper night.
My boys are really in to HAKEN and they’re my middle sons favorite band. So, we may do some tour bus stalking after the show that night to try and see if we can meet any of them.
I heard about that, although it looks like a show by themselves (with no Devin). The place where they are playing is a hole in the wall in a part of the city I try to avoid. Okay, I try to avoid all of the city. :lol :lol
But, on the off chance you had a far off visitor coming in for the show, surely you'd make the point to be there?
Of course! Not that I wouldn't go anyway, although those concerts during the week are rough for us old guys. :P
You coming to town??
It being during the week is the only thing not making it automatic. I'll hopefully make a determination within a week or so. If I did it would unfortunately probably be flying in Wednesday morning, seeing some sights in the afternoon, seeing the show in the evening, and flying back out Thursday.
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It being during the week is the only thing not making it automatic. I'll hopefully make a determination within a week or so. If I did it would unfortunately probably be flying in Wednesday morning, seeing some sights in the afternoon, seeing the show in the evening, and flying back out Thursday.
Would be cool to see ya there! Keep us posted. :hat
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Just saw that HAKEN will be playing a one off show in St. Louis while on tour with Townsend on March 18. Pretty sweet considering we were going to make the trip to Nashville to see them. Now it just became a lot cheaper night.
My boys are really in to HAKEN and they’re my middle sons favorite band. So, we may do some tour bus stalking after the show that night to try and see if we can meet any of them.
I heard about that, although it looks like a show by themselves (with no Devin). The place where they are playing is a hole in the wall in a part of the city I try to avoid. Okay, I try to avoid all of the city. :lol :lol
But, on the off chance you had a far off visitor coming in for the show, surely you'd make the point to be there?
Dude....if you do make the trip make sure to PM me.
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I'm likely going to make a trip out of the St. Louis and/or Louisiana headlining shows.
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I'm likely going to make a trip out of the St. Louis and/or Louisiana headlining shows.
Gimme a shout if you do
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Same here. Would be cool to see a bunch of us DTF'ers at the same show here in STL. :hat
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Jumping in here to give some random Haken musings (can't think of a site that would appreciate it more).
I had a random urge to listen to Haken after largely being off them lately (also Spock's, I feel a general prog phase coming on). Anyway, I ended up listening to Vector and Affinity back-to-back, which was an interesting experience. On one hand, I remember being somewhat underwhelmed by Affinity when it came out, but I had it on constant rotation for at least a year. On the other hand, Vector came out right as I was starting college and as a result I didn't have time for more than a couple listens (although I did see them on the tour and it was awesome). Regardless, Vector left a great first impression, and while I didn't listen to it many times I found it immediately had a lot going for it. Also keeping in mind that both of these albums are living in the shadow of The Mountain, which may very well be my album of the decade.
With that context in mind, listening to the two albums back to back was really ear-opening in that Vector really gets right where Affinity kinda misses the mark for me. The back half of Affinity kinda falls apart, the only song that sticks with me is Endless Knot and while Earthrise is OK, I find Red Giant and Bound By Gravity extremely tedious.
I saw a lot of complaints online about Vector being too short, but it feels the perfect length. Each song packs a punch and they leave you satisfied. I also somehow feel that there's a lot more musical content and variety in the shorter amount of time than the entire Affinity. The band also feels more energized. I'm not sure where it sits in the discography, but I could see it coming close to my second favorite. It's really hard to compare their current work to the pre-Mountain era though.
Affinity would've benefited as a 45ish minute album as well I think. Replace Initiate with Endless Knot and then lose everything after The Architect and you have a pretty excellent album. 1985 is the one song that I think will stick in the upper echelon of their catalog. The album kinda has that sophomore slump vibe, where they just put out an instant classic masterpiece and now are under pressure to follow up. With that being said though, I could easily see this turning into an Images & Words vs Awake situation where there are some fans who feel really favorable toward one or the other. I also thought maybe the underwhelmed feeling I got from Affinity was due to The Mountain being too amazing to followup, but I think after having some time since both albums and also Vector since then, I can safely say that it's just not for me.
Anyway, really excited to go back further and listen to The Mountain again. It's been a long while. I'm also excited for the Devin Townsend tour!
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I need to go back and listen to Vector again. Maybe I was just burnt on Haken when it came out. (I had been glutting on them for about 2 years when that album finally came out).
But we are completely at odd about Bound By Gravity. I'll admit that the "set up" takes awhile, but the climax is one of the most "goosebump moments" in my entire music collection. The long set up is worth the payoff. It's literally (to me) like when you have hours with the Mrs, and there's no rush, and you've decided that the foreplay alone is going to be going on for several hours.
....when the payoff happens, you go to another planet, and by the time it's done, you are surprised to find yourself on the physical planet and actually in a room of a house....much less one that you're familiar with.
I'm sorry, what were we talking about again? :angel: :rollin
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But we are completely at odd about Bound By Gravity. I'll admit that the "set up" takes awhile, but the climax is one of the most "goosebump moments" in my entire music collection. The long set up is worth the payoff. It's literally (to me) like when you have hours with the Mrs, and there's no rush, and you've decided that the foreplay alone is going to be going on for several hours.
....when the payoff happens, you go to another planet, and by the time it's done, you are surprised to find yourself on the physical planet and actually in a room of a house....much less one that you're familiar with.
This is probably the best description I have read about this song. :clap:
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:lol
I've actually listened to Vector last week for the first time in awhile and feel like I did originally. Too short and it ends poorly. Affinity has a much better ending IMO and I feel Vector would have benefitted with one more solid song to end it.
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Just noticed in Devin Townsend's latest social media post that Haken and the Contortionist are rotating as "main support"
https://www.instagram.com/p/B7t0fXDhyl4/?igshid=2et2nstje1vu (https://www.instagram.com/p/B7t0fXDhyl4/?igshid=2et2nstje1vu) shows the dates with * or ** to signify who's the main support. NYC and Philly are both Haken, Boston is not. Not sure that makes plans different for folks.
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Damn it. Would have much preferred a longer set from Haken for the Boston show... The Contortionist doesn't do much for me.
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Does anybody know if St Louis is the only non-Townshend show? Looking in your direction, Nick. I've found references to a Pitt show with just Haken and The Contortionist, but it doesn't seem terribly legit.
Personally, I wish I'd waited to buy my tickets. I'd have preferred to spend that money seeing Haken headline somewhere.
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Does anybody know if St Louis is the only non-Townshend show? Looking in your direction, Nick. I've found references to a Pitt show with just Haken and The Contortionist, but it doesn't seem terribly legit.
Personally, I wish I'd waited to buy my tickets. I'd have preferred to spend that money seeing Haken headline somewhere.
Devin's latest IG post that I shared doesn't show a Pitt date so that may just be Haken and The Contortionist. Now, who headlines that show I have no idea.
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Does anybody know if St Louis is the only non-Townshend show? Looking in your direction, Nick. I've found references to a Pitt show with just Haken and The Contortionist, but it doesn't seem terribly legit.
Personally, I wish I'd waited to buy my tickets. I'd have preferred to spend that money seeing Haken headline somewhere.
Devin's latest IG post that I shared doesn't show a Pitt date so that may just be Haken and The Contortionist. Now, who headlines that show I have no idea.
You're right. Songkick is showing Haken in Pitt on the 17th, though. It's listed as Haken and TC.
edit: Looks like Jefferson, LA, as well.
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Airbnb and ticket purchased for St. Louis. Will likely book a flight next wee :hat
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EB, you going to St Louis too? Would make for an epic dtf meet up. I honestly was looking at going to the dallas show since I need to start burning vacation and I've got no plans plus the brooklyn and boston shows right now seem ridiculous for a ticket. But I dont know if I'll do that and end up just going to philly but if everyone's going to st louis....
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EB, you going to St Louis too? Would make for an epic dtf meet up. I honestly was looking at going to the dallas show since I need to start burning vacation and I've got no plans plus the brooklyn and boston shows right now seem ridiculous for a ticket. But I dont know if I'll do that and end up just going to philly but if everyone's going to st louis....
Giving it very serious thought. If Haken is playing a proper headlining show in this country I want to see it. I'm just figuring out how I could catch one of them on the cheap as I've already got Europe and Mexico on my concert calendar this year.
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EB, you going to St Louis too? Would make for an epic dtf meet up. I honestly was looking at going to the dallas show since I need to start burning vacation and I've got no plans plus the brooklyn and boston shows right now seem ridiculous for a ticket. But I dont know if I'll do that and end up just going to philly but if everyone's going to st louis....
Giving it very serious thought. If Haken is playing a proper headlining show in this country I want to see it. I'm just figuring out how I could catch one of them on the cheap as I've already got Europe and Mexico on my concert calendar this year.
Unfortunately I am likely out for St. Louis. Being in the middle of the week is just a killer considering it falls the week before Cruise to the Edge starts.
That said I'm still looking into swinging the New Orleans show.
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Airbnb and ticket purchased for St. Louis. Will likely book a flight next wee :hat
Awesome. :tup :tup
EB, you going to St Louis too? Would make for an epic dtf meet up. I honestly was looking at going to the dallas show since I need to start burning vacation and I've got no plans plus the brooklyn and boston shows right now seem ridiculous for a ticket. But I dont know if I'll do that and end up just going to philly but if everyone's going to st louis....
...and then you are coming as well, right? ;)
Giving it very serious thought. If Haken is playing a proper headlining show in this country I want to see it. I'm just figuring out how I could catch one of them on the cheap as I've already got Europe and Mexico on my concert calendar this year.
Hope to see ya in town for the show!
Unfortunately I am likely out for St. Louis. Being in the middle of the week is just a killer considering it falls the week before Cruise to the Edge starts.
Bummer, but I get it. Those middle of the week concerts in another city are pretty rough.
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Yeah, its Sundayness certainly helps. I've got the PTO to burn, but I'll be blowing through a lot of my stockpile. I've also got friends that have been wanting to drag me down there for ages. Might give them the opportunity. Franky, though, NO just never really had much appeal to me. Not that StL has been beckoning to me or anything, but it seems more my sort of place than NOLA.
EB, you going to St Louis too? Would make for an epic dtf meet up. I honestly was looking at going to the dallas show since I need to start burning vacation and I've got no plans plus the brooklyn and boston shows right now seem ridiculous for a ticket. But I dont know if I'll do that and end up just going to philly but if everyone's going to st louis....
Giving it very serious thought. If Haken is playing a proper headlining show in this country I want to see it. I'm just figuring out how I could catch one of them on the cheap as I've already got Europe and Mexico on my concert calendar this year.
Unfortunately I am likely out for St. Louis. Being in the middle of the week is just a killer considering it falls the week before Cruise to the Edge starts.
That said I'm still looking into swinging the New Orleans show.
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I was thinking about both STL and NO, but the flight alone for New Orleans is as much as my flight and my airbnb in St. Louis, and then add on weekend lodging in New Orleans... pass.
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Has there been any sort of official confirmation that StL, NOLA, and Pitt are actual Haken headliner shows?
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Has there been any sort of official confirmation that StL, NOLA, and Pitt are actual Haken headliner shows?
HAKEN themselves on social media announced the St. Louis show as a headliner show....I don't believe there's even an opener.
https://redflagstl.com/event/haken/
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Has there been any sort of official confirmation that StL, NOLA, and Pitt are actual Haken headliner shows?
HAKEN themselves on social media announced the St. Louis show as a headliner show....I don't believe there's even an opener.
https://redflagstl.com/event/haken/
Thanks. Just found the post. StL and NOLA are Haken shows, and Pitt/Richmond are co-headliners with TC. That's what I was missing.
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Posted my personal update in the Devin thread too but I bought and booked myself for March 2nd in Philly. Just easier and cheaper than any other option to see Devin Townsend and Haken (as main support). Since I took the day off from work, I hope to get there early. Maybe some good philly cheese steaks after :metal Since the show in Brooklyn is a Saturday, I will wait till the day of to maybe pick up a decent priced second hand ticket, but I almost doubt it considering the prices today that they will be "decent" plus getting to Brooklyn from where I am in NJ is maybe just as long or even worse and more expensive than getting to Philly. I'm open to going to both, but I'm happy to confirm I am going to one of them
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Kev just texted me a cool update that HAKEN announced....looks like St. Louis will be one of four headline shows they're gonna play 'Affinity' in it's entirety along with hinting that it's Aquarius's 10 year anniversary they said "we thought we'd go all out and celebrate that album too". Don't know if that means the whole things is being played but they said it's going to be an 'epic set' so.....sounds like a killer show!!
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Wow thats awesome! :metal :metal
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That's awesome. I'm very tempted to attend the Richmond show. Could be an incredible set.
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That's awesome. I'm very tempted to attend the Richmond show. Could be an incredible set.
Wow thats awesome! :metal :metal
I'm especially happy because HAKEN is my middle sons absolute favorite band. He likes DT a lot.....digs TNMB also....but he listens to HAKEN non stop. He reminds me of me when I was 16 and would just listen to DT non stop. He's always got HAKEN playing when he's painting his models or doing his animating/drawing on his computer....no matter what it is when he's in his room HAKEN is playing. Can't wait for him to see them.
I'm taking my other two sons also...they're in to them as well....just not at the level my middle son is.
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Sucks all those shows are midweek and closests are 6 hours drives (Pittsburgh or Richmond). I'd totally go but I am committed to the Philly midweek show since I really want to see Devin too that I don't think I will burn more vacation and much further travel.
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Fucking crushed.... God I want to see that show, but that level of travel is way out of the question.
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Kind of disappointed about Affinity. The only album of theirs that didn't really click with me. I'd be super-stoked if they played Aquarius, though.
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Gonna be a great concert. :metal :metal
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Will be at the Richmond show as well as the Atlanta show with Devin
:metal :metal
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STL tix bought - Affinity (and bound by gravity)!! Too bad Chicago show they are second support, we may skip that, but so looking forward to the STL headliner.
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If anyone is still thinking of going to the St Louis, let me know. One of our friends had to back out of going and his ticket is up for grabs. Only $27 total. He said he will eat the cost if I cannot find anyone, but just throwing that out there.
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Flight is now booked as well, St. Louis here I come :metal
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Flight is now booked as well, St. Louis here I come :metal
:metal :metal
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I am getting myself a bit too hyped for this tour about to start. Devin says he's going without a setlist and just feeling each show out, but then also we got Haken opening. It reminded me of my first ProgPower and the last day's headliner was Devin Townsend with Haken right before him. It was my first time seeing both bands and it has gone down to be one of my all time favorite concerts (I think Devin having Anneke put it over the top). But I was thinking about this and found my old pictures and this one, I can't believe how good it came out. I know some DTFers saw it on my twitter, but it's a great picture worthy of sharing IMO
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ERlkwLgWoAAM9xs?format=jpg&name=4096x4096)
I wonder if they will do the same setlist from Europe or if they will play more Affinity songs since they will be performing it in full on their off days from the main tour. Since they are rotating with The Contortionist as main support, I'm guessing they will rotate between a 30 and 45 minute set. Luckily, Philly is a Haken show so I expect I'll get a 45 minute set or so.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ESPqjLZXsAAmhk2?format=jpg&name=large)
:metal :metal
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Dammit Nick! :lol
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Exactly what the rest of them were thinking at the time
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Since they're going to be playing Affinity, I'm hoping someone records Bound By Gravity.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ESPqjLZXsAAmhk2?format=jpg&name=large)
:metal :metal
Thanks for grabbing that picture Marc!
It was the shortest Haken set I've ever seen (45 min), but still a fun one. Was on the rail and got to hear A Cell Divides for the first time.
Got to hang with everyone (minus Diego) after the show and got a lot of great information on the rest of the year, and all I will say publically is that 2020 may have started with just some support tours, but it will pack in plenty more excitement for everyone. :D
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Cool pic! Good to get a tidbit of info. If they play A Cell Divides at our show here in two weeks, that will at least give me a chance for a piss break. :lol I will need to prepare myself for Bound for Gravity. :hat
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I asked them about Bound By Gravity where Richard just smiled and said yup, they'll be playing it soon. Such charming guys. So cool just hearing some laughing and then I looked down the street and see Nick in that red sweatshirt with almost the entire band :metal
Haken - A Cell Divides Live in Philly (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCmm3UBfnQk)
also just finished my full double concert video, timestamped for the beginning of the 20 minutes of haken: Devin Townsend Haken and the Contortionist (https://youtu.be/_gpmVflEafk?t=1233)
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Just got home from the show in Richmond tonight. They did play Affinity all the way through for the first time ever
:metal :metal :metal
Didn't know that this was announced beforehand, so it was an awesome surprise. They had the Affinity album cover backdrop up so I had my suspicions before they started playing. Then after Initiate, Ross announced they were playing the whole thing.
Full setlist:
affinity.exe
Initiate
1985 (w/ Owner of a Lonely Heart - Yes spliced in before the solo section)
Lapse
The Architect
Earthrise
Red Giant
The Endless Knot
Bound By Gravity (Live Debut)
Aquamedley
Nil by Mouth
Cockroach King
I'll be seeing them again in Atlanta with Devin Friday night. Can't wait!
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:corn awaiting for the Bound By Gravity vids.
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Good lord. Affinity in its entirety, followed by the highlights of Aquarius, followed by Nil by Mouth and then Cockroach King for the finale :omg:
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Wow the Aquamedley coming back out is a surprise to me. Figured after Affinity they'd do more Vector songs and Cockroach, but didn't think they'd bust that out again. Pretty awesome.
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Do we know why they prefer to do a medley from Aquarius instead of picking out individual songs?
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They've probably done individual songs before, and they want to give token acknowledgment to the album without going all-in on full songs? Idk.
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Just got home from the show in Richmond tonight. They did play Affinity all the way through for the first time ever
:metal :metal :metal
Didn't know that this was announced beforehand, so it was an awesome surprise. They had the Affinity album cover backdrop up so I had my suspicions before they started playing. Then after Initiate, Ross announced they were playing the whole thing.
Full setlist:
affinity.exe
Initiate
1985 (w/ Owner of a Lonely Heart - Yes spliced in before the solo section)
Lapse
The Architect
Earthrise
Red Giant
The Endless Knot
Bound By Gravity (Live Debut)
Aquamedley
Nil by Mouth
Cockroach King
I'll be seeing them again in Atlanta with Devin Friday night. Can't wait!
Looks like The Contortionist was in Richmond, too. How long a set did they play? I'm guessing the shows with just Haken, and likely some local band, will be a bit longer.
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The Contortionist was there. They played for about an hour I think. The opener was Jason Kui.
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The Contortionist was there. They played for about an hour I think. The opener was Jason Kui.
Thanks. That could mean considerably more time for them when they've only got a local band to open.
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Looks like The Contortionist was in Richmond, too. How long a set did they play? I'm guessing the shows with just Haken, and likely some local band, will be a bit longer.
I am hoping. Given that our show here in St Louis will be one of those (I think), I would imagine our set list will be the same as last night's in Richmond, plus a few more songs, probably a couple more songs from Vector. I am still holding out hope that Host and/or Somebody get played, although that's probably getting a bit greedy. :biggrin:
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The new Novena album is out today (Featuring Ross Jennings)
https://youtu.be/yHIay5x-7TE
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:-\
The new Novena album is out today (Featuring Ross Jennings)
https://youtu.be/yHIay5x-7TE
Digging it way more than Vector so far. Reminds me of the 1st two Haken albums.
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:-\The new Novena album is out today (Featuring Ross Jennings)
https://youtu.be/yHIay5x-7TE
Digging it way more than Vector so far. Reminds me of the 1st two Haken albums.
I agree with you. Much better than the last Haken album.
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Looks like The Contortionist was in Richmond, too. How long a set did they play? I'm guessing the shows with just Haken, and likely some local band, will be a bit longer.
I am hoping. Given that our show here in St Louis will be one of those (I think), I would imagine our set list will be the same as last night's in Richmond, plus a few more songs, probably a couple more songs from Vector. I am still holding out hope that Host and/or Somebody get played, although that's probably getting a bit greedy. :biggrin:
I'm guessing at least one local band, and maybe two. I don't know how long that Richmond setlist was, but I haven't gotten the impression those guys are into really long shows. I'm hopeful for a couple of more songs, though.
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Considering they are pulling out some rarities already for that headline set, I wouldn't expect them to do much more as they juggle those headliner shows on their off days from the Devin tour. Seems like it's asking a lot for a longer set than what they did or for even more rare songs. Granted, if my math is correct, at around 90 minutes for that set, it would be cool to sneak another song or two to make it closer to 105 minute set which is typical of a headliner with one opener. Who knows though, maybe you will get lucky.
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:-\The new Novena album is out today (Featuring Ross Jennings)
https://youtu.be/yHIay5x-7TE
Digging it way more than Vector so far. Reminds me of the 1st two Haken albums.
I agree with you. Much better than the last Haken album.
My review of Novena's debut was published today: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/album-reviews/novena-eleventh-hour/
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I'm guessing at least one local band, and maybe two. I don't know how long that Richmond setlist was, but I haven't gotten the impression those guys are into really long shows. I'm hopeful for a couple of more songs, though.
Are you coming to St Louis for the show in 10 days?
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Ci, senor.
From the "It's a small world" department, a friend just texted me a picture from where he's standing at the NOLA show tonight, and I'll be damned if it's not a picture of Nick's head. :lol
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Awesome. We definitely have to coordinate some type of meet-up at the show. Will be hard to do too much before or after since I am working the day of the concert and the next morning. Damn Wednesday night concerts! :censored
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Awesome. We definitely have to coordinate some type of meet-up at the show. Will be hard to do too much before or after since I am working the day of the concert and the next morning. Damn Wednesday night concerts! :censored
Absolutely. The good news is that I'm pretty easy to pick out of a crowd. Other than Axeman and me are any other out-of-towners going to be there?
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Ci, senor.
From the "It's a small world" department, a friend just texted me a picture from where he's standing at the NOLA show tonight, and I'll be damned if it's not a picture of Nick's head. :lol
LOL, nice.
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:-\The new Novena album is out today (Featuring Ross Jennings)
https://youtu.be/yHIay5x-7TE
Digging it way more than Vector so far. Reminds me of the 1st two Haken albums.
I agree with you. Much better than the last Haken album.
I'm on this boat, I like this album much better than Vector. Not really sold on the amount of growls in the album, but otherwise it is really good.
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Ci, senor.
:tup
I'll have the whole Miller crew there that night....including my wife....so hopefully we can 'say hey'
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Ci, senor.
:tup
I'll have the whole Miller crew there that night....including my wife....so hopefully we can 'say hey'
I'll try and be well behaved, but it's hard to tell with these sorts of things. :lol
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Ci, senor.
:tup
I'll have the whole Miller crew there that night....including my wife....so hopefully we can 'say hey'
I'll try and be well behaved, but it's hard to tell with these sorts of things. :lol
:lol I'm sure it'll be fine. I'm looking forward to meeting you and Bill
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Hell yeah. Should be a fun show, and it'll be cool to meet a few more fellow forumers. :hat
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Indeed :metal
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are we expecting Haken to play first tonight in Dallas?
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are we expecting Haken to play first tonight in Dallas?
Yes. I was going to drive from Austin today but totally forgot and committed to other things. Wanted to see Devin too but Empath was a bit of a let down. Haken's Vector was disappointing as well so it didn't feel right to go.
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are we expecting Haken to play first tonight in Dallas?
Haken 1900, Contortionist 2000, Deven 2120. I don't know if they've stopped alternating or what, but Haken seems to be playing the same setlist every night now.
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are we expecting Haken to play first tonight in Dallas?
Haken 1900, Contortionist 2000, Deven 2120. I don't know if they've stopped alternating or what, but Haken seems to be playing the same setlist every night now.
They only alternated on the two nights in one city earlier in the tour, this is the same set they did in Europe too so I wouldn't expect anything different.
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are we expecting Haken to play first tonight in Dallas?
Haken 1900, Contortionist 2000, Deven 2120. I don't know if they've stopped alternating or what, but Haken seems to be playing the same setlist every night now.
They only alternated on the two nights in one city earlier in the tour, this is the same set they did in Europe too so I wouldn't expect anything different.
That's a damn shame. I'm really only going to see H. It's been quite some time since I've gone to a show to see the opener.
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I guess it's a shame for the Haken fans sure, but it's a fucking awesome opener. Do stay for Devin if you can though, he's certainly going to entertain you although he's suffering from a cold and his voice is going to shit (according to himself on twitter)
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I guess it's a shame for the Haken fans sure, but it's a fucking awesome opener. Do stay for Devin if you can though, he's certainly going to entertain you although he's suffering from a cold and his voice is going to shit (according to himself on twitter)
I'll stay for everybody. I don't really care for Devin's music, but he's so damned good at what he does I'm fascinated to see it live.
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:-\The new Novena album is out today (Featuring Ross Jennings)
https://youtu.be/yHIay5x-7TE
Digging it way more than Vector so far. Reminds me of the 1st two Haken albums.
I agree with you. Much better than the last Haken album.
I'm on this boat, I like this album much better than Vector. Not really sold on the amount of growls in the album, but otherwise it is really good.
Got a chance to listen, like the album a lot! But prog/metal spoken word never works... that ruined the last track for me (spoken only works in hip hop, where the words are typically the driving force).
Is not a Vector replacement, I really like some of this esp Corazon, but on the whole I prefer what’s added with Hen/Diego/Hearne too.
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I'm hopeful you guys in St. Louis will get your show, as of now they are still trucking along. I won't say which show as I don't think it has been announced yet, but they've been forced into one cancellation, but they have not chosen to cancel anything yet.
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San Fran on March 25th near the end of the Devin tour has already been cancelled
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I'm hopeful you guys in St. Louis will get your show, as of now they are still trucking along. I won't say which show as I don't think it has been announced yet, but they've been forced into one cancellation, but they have not chosen to cancel anything yet.
I know....I'm really hoping it won't be cancelled but it's (6) days away and who knows what's going to happen. My wife is already nervous because our whole family is going. She's nervous about the kiddos. I mean, I am too a little bit but if the show isn't cancelled I'm still wanting to go.
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Yeah, my airbnb hosts reached out to me the other day to let me know that even though they normally have a strict refund policy (meaning you only get a full refund if you cancel shortly after booking), they'd be willing to be more flexible given what's going on right now. As long as the flights are still running I still plan on coming down. Even if the show is canceled I'll probably take the trip because I booked the flight long enough ago that it's not part of what most airlines are currently offering in terms of refunds for voluntarily canceling your flight.
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Entire Devin Townsend tour has been cancelled it seems, not sure what that means for Haken's solo shows, but I'm guessing they will be cancelled as well.
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Entire Devin Townsend tour has been cancelled it seems, not sure what that means for Haken's solo shows, but I'm guessing they will be cancelled as well.
Which I'm sad because no one uploaded a video for Bound By Gravity.
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Entire Devin Townsend tour has been cancelled it seems, not sure what that means for Haken's solo shows, but I'm guessing they will be cancelled as well.
Major Bummer :'(
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Yeah, my airbnb hosts reached out to me the other day to let me know that even though they normally have a strict refund policy (meaning you only get a full refund if you cancel shortly after booking), they'd be willing to be more flexible given what's going on right now. As long as the flights are still running I still plan on coming down. Even if the show is canceled I'll probably take the trip because I booked the flight long enough ago that it's not part of what most airlines are currently offering in terms of refunds for voluntarily canceling your flight.
AA just revised their policy, again. Since I booked mine before 3/1 (by a day LOL) I should be eligible for a free re-booking. In this case, booking too long ago is preferable. After a point the airlines are taking a "you knew what you were getting into" policy.
Either way, I'd likely just eat the cost of my ticket. The PTO is probably more valuable to me than a day in StL.
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Haken just posted on FB that their remaining headline shows in Pittsburgh and St. Louis have been cancelled.
-Marc.
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Makes me feel less bad that my airbnb host sent a message a while ago that they're canceling all their current bookings.
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Forgot to post here afterwards, but I was at the Richmond show! Seeing them perform Bound by Gravity for the first time ever live was surreal. The entire concert was fantastic, hearing Affinity in full was a joyous occasion, but to add to it they played Aquamedley and then Nil By Mouth followed by the Cockroach King classic. Such an outstanding setlist.
EDIT: Metro, saw you were at the show too, damn-- would've been fun to meet a fellow DTFer. Was there with a couple friends, stood essentially in the middle.
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Forgot to post here afterwards, but I was at the Richmond show! Seeing them perform Bound by Gravity for the first time ever live was surreal. The entire concert was fantastic, hearing Affinity in full was a joyous occasion, but to add to it they played Aquamedley and then Nil By Mouth followed by the Cockroach King classic. Such an outstanding setlist.
EDIT: Metro, saw you were at the show too, damn-- would've been fun to meet a fellow DTFer. Was there with a couple friends, stood essentially in the middle.
That’s right around where I was standing, maybe we saw each other without knowing haha. I was in a black hoodie and a Red Giant t shirt singing along with every single word.
Shame that they had to cancel the remaining dates. The headlining show was truly an awesome show and I really hope they try to do it again later in the year for those that missed it.
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I’m hoping eTix gives a full refund. They state their ticket policy is ‘all sales final’ but I filed a request anyway. If it were just me I’d eat the $27 and be done with it but my total bill was $106 for me and the kiddos.
I was a day away from buying Kev’s extra ticket for my wife but I’m gonna pass on that now Kev :lol
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I of course can't blame them for this, but it truly just sucks for everyone. Fans miss shows and band is likely out a ton of money.
I'm very glad I got down to NOLA as I highly doubt that the cruise is happening or even if it did that Haken will be on it.
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Either way, I'd likely just eat the cost of my ticket. The PTO is probably more valuable to me than a day in StL.
First, I miss Morsefest last year thanks to getting sick a couple days before and not being able to make the trip, and now this gets cancelled. Apparently, the music gods do not want us to hang out and see a concert together. :lol :lol :facepalm: :facepalm:
I’m hoping eTix gives a full refund. They state their ticket policy is ‘all sales final’ but I filed a request anyway. If it were just me I’d eat the $27 and be done with it but my total bill was $106 for me and the kiddos.
I was a day away from buying Kev’s extra ticket for my wife but I’m gonna pass on that now Kev :lol
Haha, so close! :lol :lol
I am hoping for a refund, but if not, stuff happens. Can't do anything about it now. Bummed that we aren't gonna get what was certainly going to be a killer show, but life goes on. Many people around the globe have much bigger issues right now because of the coronavirus, so me missing a rock concert seems pretty trivial in the grand scheme.
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I’m hoping eTix gives a full refund. They state their ticket policy is ‘all sales final’ but I filed a request anyway. If it were just me I’d eat the $27 and be done with it but my total bill was $106 for me and the kiddos.
They’re giving full refunds for the event. Kudos to them :justjen
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I’m hoping eTix gives a full refund. They state their ticket policy is ‘all sales final’ but I filed a request anyway. If it were just me I’d eat the $27 and be done with it but my total bill was $106 for me and the kiddos.
They’re giving full refunds for the event. Kudos to them :justjen
Yep, yep. Just got the email a bit ago about it. :tup :tup
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I’m hoping eTix gives a full refund. They state their ticket policy is ‘all sales final’ but I filed a request anyway. If it were just me I’d eat the $27 and be done with it but my total bill was $106 for me and the kiddos.
They’re giving full refunds for the event. Kudos to them :justjen
Yep, yep. Just got the email a bit ago about it. :tup :tup
Did you have to do anything, or did it just show up? I haven't gotten one.
Sorry we won't all get to meet up. That's a damn shame.
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I emailed yesterday afternoon and had a reply by the time I got home from work a little bit later.
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I’m hoping eTix gives a full refund. They state their ticket policy is ‘all sales final’ but I filed a request anyway. If it were just me I’d eat the $27 and be done with it but my total bill was $106 for me and the kiddos.
They’re giving full refunds for the event. Kudos to them :justjen
Yep, yep. Just got the email a bit ago about it. :tup :tup
Did you have to do anything, or did it just show up? I haven't gotten one.
Sorry we won't all get to meet up. That's a damn shame.
What Kev said EB. Sent eTix an email via their website and had a reply within 24 hrs.
I’m as bummed about missing the opportunity to meet you and Bill as I am about not being able to see HAKEN. Maybe someday there will be another chance.
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I would let Haken keep my thirty bucks if I had a ticket for a cancelled show of theirs. These times are hard for smaller, independent bands like them, I think. But those thirty bucks wouldn't kill me, and if more people would do that, it would make life much easier for Haken. I wouldn't do the same for bigger bands like Tool or so, but artists like Big Big Train (or iamthemorning or IQ...) don't make that much money from their great music in the first place. And having organize and plan a whole tour, pay for the whole thing and THEN having to refund all the paid ticket money... that can't be easy for them.
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I'm not sure how things work, but I get the feeling that money wouldn't even go to the band if they never performed.
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You might well be right. Insomnium and Omnium Gatherum set up a GoFundMe page and said on Facebook that not claiming refunds wouldn't help the band at all, and that it was better to claim their refund and donate instead. Although they set it up in Finland and have had to pause it while they figure out whether it's compatible with Finnish law, but it looks like an American friend of theirs has set another one up in the US instead.
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I'm not sure how things work, but I get the feeling that money wouldn't even go to the band if they never performed.
It just depends on how the original contract was setup by Devin Townsend. Usually support bands don't get paid. Devin might had some guaranteed money from each promoter where he actually played. But he needs to pay everybody else on Devin's touring party (other musicians from HIS band, tour crew, etc) before seeing some money from the gig. The refunded money doesn't go to the band. It goes to the consumer. The best way to help the band right now is buying merch from their website, or donating directly to them (via GofundMe or other means).
Mike Keneally just completed a GoFundMe and was achieved in about a day ($5k).
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This is something I'm genuinely curious about. It'd be fascinating to hear Haken's POV on this. My plan would be to take the refund money and spend it on merch. If them getting the ticket money was more meaningful I'd consider that, though.
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This is something I'm genuinely curious about. It'd be fascinating to hear Haken's POV on this. My plan would be to take the refund money and spend it on merch. If them getting the ticket money was more meaningful I'd consider that, though.
I'm almost certain that spending an equivalent amount on merch gets a lot more money to the band than the tickets.
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This is something I'm genuinely curious about. It'd be fascinating to hear Haken's POV on this. My plan would be to take the refund money and spend it on merch. If them getting the ticket money was more meaningful I'd consider that, though.
I'm almost certain that spending an equivalent amount on merch gets a lot more money to the band than the tickets.
Now they just need to make it available.
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My plan would be to take the refund money and spend it on merch.
I was planning on doing that. None of my kiddos have any HAKEN tee shirts.....they have DT, TNMB, SOA......but no HAKEN. I was gonna go to their site and order up (3) T's
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This is something I'm genuinely curious about. It'd be fascinating to hear Haken's POV on this. My plan would be to take the refund money and spend it on merch. If them getting the ticket money was more meaningful I'd consider that, though.
I'm almost certain that spending an equivalent amount on merch gets a lot more money to the band than the tickets.
That is correct. Seems like Devin and Haken will make the tour merch available as soon as it gets to the Omerch warehouses. I want to get one of the gray Empath hoodies but I need XL. Crossing fingers for that one.
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Just remember, the example here is a Haken only show so it has nothing to do with Devy and their tour together.
I picked up a tshirt at the show I went to, and also went back and ordered more from Devin's shop when he requested people to do so to support the loss of the tour. I haven't yet see Haken say anything similar.
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Just remember, the example here is a Haken only show so it has nothing to do with Devy and their tour together.
I picked up a tshirt at the show I went to, and also went back and ordered more from Devin's shop when he requested people to do so to support the loss of the tour. I haven't yet see Haken say anything similar.
To your point, Haken nor Devin have said anything about donations. Only merch sales. But eventually, they might change their minds. As I said, Mike Keneally just did it over the weekend and Markus Reuter (Devin's guitarist from Europe's Empath leg) also just posted one over the weekend and it's half way there.
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Haken Cockroach Relief GoFund Me page
https://www.gofundme.com/f/my3y3?utm_source=customer&utm_medium=copy_link-tip&utm_campaign=p_cp+share-sheet&fbclid=IwAR3aldmqe0dqQJ45MwgzvW5fBbBXsH6G6FbajRqmPS7s3NbQpSJ1YJPGZDQ
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Just donated a small amount to the relief fund.
Let's hope this crisis will be history in a few weeks and all those fantastic bands will soon be able to tour again.
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HAKEN, one of progressive music’s most exciting bands, are celebrating the 10th anniversary of their spectacular debut album 'Aquarius', originally released on March 29th, 2010. On recent tours, the band has been performing the "Aquamedley" to celebrate the album. You can see a performance of that medley today, taken from the 'L-1VE' release from 2018.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxTAaVIhrkU&feature=youtu.be
:metal
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Or those of us who actually bought the DVD or Blu-ray can watch it in much better quality there. :P
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Or those of us who actually bought the DVD or Blu-ray can watch it in much better quality there. :P
Yup, actually watched the DVD a couple weeks ago for the first time in awhile before I saw them. Good stuff. Wish it was a blu-ray for better picture, but the sound quality is great and I'm glad they released it including the PP17 footage :metal
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Just got a phone reminder that I was supposed to be at the Haken show tonight :-[
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The 5th dimension is selling here in FLAC and with a cool digital booklet https://hakenofficial.bandcamp.com/album/enter-the-5th-dimension
It seems that Haken will sell also live bootlegs here :tup
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Aquarius turns 10 years today! So I'm giving it a spin now.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EP1TIWVNEQw (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EP1TIWVNEQw)
HAKEN – Live at the Roundhouse, London 2019 (Official Bootleg)
includes a few seconds of a clip from a new music video at the end it seems, but it's the full opening set they did in Europe opening for Devin Townsend. Good quality for "official bootleg"
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Keep an eye on this space April 3rd.
If plans haven't been sidetracked due to world events, which is entirely possible, we'll hopefully be getting a big announcement that day.
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Keep an eye on this space April 3rd.
If plans haven't been sidetracked due to world events, which is entirely possible, we'll hopefully be getting a big announcement that day.
:tup
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Sweet.
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If anything, musicians should move album releases forward right now. People have more time for music consumption nowadays than they normally have.
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If anything, musicians should move album releases forward right now. People have more time for music consumption nowadays than they normally have.
Unless they have small children...
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Keep an eye on this space April 3rd.
If plans haven't been sidetracked due to world events, which is entirely possible, we'll hopefully be getting a big announcement that day.
:tup
Certainly looks like it, doesn't it?
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It could be that the new album cover is yellow. The pictures posted on social media always showed some ketchup (red --> Vector) and a yellow sauce bottle. Don't know why the label was always upside down though.
I'm calling that the new album is called Virus, that it has a yellow color and that it's a sequel to Vector.
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It could be that the new album cover is yellow. The pictures posted on social media always showed some ketchup (red --> Vector) and a yellow sauce bottle. Don't know why the label was always upside down though.
I'm calling that the new album is called Virus, that it has a yellow color and that it's a sequel to Vector.
People on reddit said that if you Shazam the new music snippet it says the song is called Prosthetic and the album is called Virus.
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Kind of unfortunate given the current situation, but it is what it is I guess.
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(https://i.imgur.com/Akosz0K.jpg)
Could the yellow spidery thing be the new album cover perhaps?
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Oh shit, I didn't even catch that the first time going through that vid. Wow!
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Where are you guys seeing this video / snippet?
Link?
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Where are you guys seeing this video / snippet?
Link?
Haken posted it on their FB page.
https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/videos/4199321863426630/
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It could be that the new album cover is yellow. The pictures posted on social media always showed some ketchup (red --> Vector) and a yellow sauce bottle. Don't know why the label was always upside down though.
I'm calling that the new album is called Virus, that it has a yellow color and that it's a sequel to Vector.
People on reddit said that if you Shazam the new music snippet it says the song is called Prosthetic and the album is called Virus.
Remember, you heard it from me first :lol
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Have a little look over here maties: https://music.apple.com/nz/album/virus/1503491157 (and thank me later, no, just joking)
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:dangerwillrobinson:
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:dangerwillrobinson:
eh?
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Holy shite I'm freaking out
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No focking way, how did somebody find that already?
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No focking way, how did somebody find that already?
that's an easy one actually: you just have to find out where it's Friday in the world already (New Zealand being one of them) and then enter that country's TLD in Apple Music
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:metal
Only two months of waiting and 51 minutes of new Haken material, I'm pumped.
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And a new 16 min epic!
The layout looks very much like Vector so I think we can assume that Virus is a sequel to Vector.
I also love the small nuggets:
Vector, their 5th album, begins with V (and has 6 letters).
Virus, their 6th album, begins with Vi (and has 5 letters).
-
Ectobuis Rex translates to 'Cockroach King'.
'Prosthetic' will apparently be on Spotify tomorrow Friday :metal
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Oh damn, this is a nice surprise treat :metal :metal
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Ectobuis Rex translates to 'Cockroach King'.
I remember there being some hints to the King in Vector as well...
The Good Doctor: Bring an empire to its knees
Cockroach King: An Empire fallen to its knees
Also, as mentioned, Doctor "Rex" = King.
Plus, the cockroach on the back of the Vector cover.
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They must have been recording this album completely secretly (or I would guess so anyway, there were no pictures from any studio I could find)
-
Yeah, I was wondering as well - how did they do this?
-
Is it possible it was all done when they did Vector? I mean, with the similarities, it seems it would have been thought out some time ago.
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I hope this one is better. Vector was their weakest output so far (and the shortest).
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I hope this one is better. Vector was their weakest output so far (and the shortest).
The shortness would also make sense if there was a companion release. Wasn't this also thought to be possible when Vector was in the making?
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Breaking up a 16-minute song into six short tracks is super annoying, but great to see new music is coming our way very soon! :metal :metal
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:dangerwillrobinson:
-
I hope this one is better. Vector was their weakest output so far (and the shortest).
I think Vector was amazing. Extremely consistent and consequent.
And the abrupt ending and the shortness have just been justified :)
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(https://i.imgur.com/Akosz0K.jpg)
Could the yellow spidery thing be the new album cover perhaps?
The audio was just released on Bandcamp for Architect Jazzfinity version.
https://hakenofficial.bandcamp.com/track/the-architect-jazzfinity
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Have a little look over here maties: https://music.apple.com/nz/album/virus/1503491157 (and thank me later, no, just joking)
Whoa! A secretly-recorded and soon-to-be-released album! And a companion/sequel to Vector at that! Anyone else want to see them release a third album in the series, with a blue cover, to homage King Crimson's 80s output? What kind of V-title would it have...
The short snippet in that link for Prosthetic sounds pretty good, and now I am super-excited to hear new Haken! June seems so far away, though.
And I got the bandcamp notification earlier about The Architect - Jazzfinity version, which was pretty neat! I'll have to get it later.
I wonder if pre-orders will go up tomorrow when the single is released...
Breaking up a 16-minute song into six short tracks is super annoying, but great to see new music is coming our way very soon! :metal :metal
Eh, it doesn't bother me too much. A couple minutes in Audacity can fix that, and make it a proper 16:58 long single track. The total length of the album being 51:54 makes it a great follow-up to the (comparatively) short Vector, which was 45:42 (which, weirdly enough, both albums track times feature a difference of 3 when comparing the numbers in the minutes and seconds places). A total time of both albums being 97:36, a suitable double-album! Hopefully, for those Haken fans who were disappointed with Vector, they'll like this one. I enjoyed Vector for the most part, but I'll admit I haven't listened to it very much since its release, but with Virus coming out soon, I'll have to dive deep into it to prepare!
-Marc.
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I don't believe it was recorded at the same time as Vector. Mainly basing that off a conversation with Ray and his workload. Seems over the past several months he was juggling practicing the normal songs for the Devin tours, making sure he had all of Affinity down for the special shows, and had been working on new material that he had to learn, presumably for recording Virus.
-
Have a little look over here maties: https://music.apple.com/nz/album/virus/1503491157 (and thank me later, no, just joking)
Whoa! A secretly-recorded and soon-to-be-released album! And a companion/sequel to Vector at that! Anyone else want to see them release a third album in the series, with a blue cover, to homage King Crimson's 80s output? What kind of V-title would it have...
The short snippet in that link for Prosthetic sounds pretty good, and now I am super-excited to hear new Haken! June seems so far away, though.
And I got the bandcamp notification earlier about The Architect - Jazzfinity version, which was pretty neat! I'll have to get it later.
I wonder if pre-orders will go up tomorrow when the single is released...
Breaking up a 16-minute song into six short tracks is super annoying, but great to see new music is coming our way very soon! :metal :metal
Eh, it doesn't bother me too much. A couple minutes in Audacity can fix that, and make it a proper 16:58 long single track. The total length of the album being 51:54 makes it a great follow-up to the (comparatively) short Vector, which was 45:42 (which, weirdly enough, both albums track times feature a difference of 3 when comparing the numbers in the minutes and seconds places). A total time of both albums being 97:36, a suitable double-album! Hopefully, for those Haken fans who were disappointed with Vector, they'll like this one. I enjoyed Vector for the most part, but I'll admit I haven't listened to it very much since its release, but with Virus coming out soon, I'll have to dive deep into it to prepare!
-Marc.
Tomorrow there'll be an official announcement along with the release of the first track. And I think they will have the preorder info at hand too. (fingers crossed)
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Wow! I admit I haven't been too much into Haken for a while now, since Vector was a bit of a disappointment to me and the new direction they're taking doesn't really excite me that much, but this new album has me intrigued.
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I don't believe it was recorded at the same time as Vector. Mainly basing that off a conversation with Ray and his workload. Seems over the past several months he was juggling practicing the normal songs for the Devin tours, making sure he had all of Affinity down for the special shows, and had been working on new material that he had to learn, presumably for recording Virus.
Probably it wasn't record it but they surely had something mapped out as per my conversation with Diego when they came here
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Breaking up a 16-minute song into six short tracks is super annoying, but great to see new music is coming our way very soon! :metal :metal
All of this. More and more I've been using my portable FLAC player to listen to music, so splitting this up into 5 separate tracks means I'll have to go through some extra work to make it a single track. But I'm still excited for the new album. Since this is a sequel of sorts, there's a possibility that if it's REALLY good, it could elevate the somewhat disappointing Vector by context.
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This is the best news I've heard in weeks! I know some here had problems with Vector, but I loved it :metal. This is a 3 inch layer of frosting on the cake.
And I love the nuggets that have been discovered/posted already as well. Very awesome.
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Nice nice nice
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I don't believe it was recorded at the same time as Vector.
It definitely wasn't, nor was it written yet (some it may have been, but not all).
Breaking up a 16-minute song into six short tracks is super annoying, but great to see new music is coming our way very soon! :metal :metal
It's done that way because it'll be more of a suite than a song.
It could be that the new album cover is yellow. The pictures posted on social media always showed some ketchup (red --> Vector) and a yellow sauce bottle. Don't know why the label was always upside down though.
I'm calling that the new album is called Virus, that it has a yellow color and that it's a sequel to Vector.
People on reddit said that if you Shazam the new music snippet it says the song is called Prosthetic and the album is called Virus.
Remember, you heard it from me first :lol
No I didn't. :P
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Breaking up a 16-minute song into six short tracks is super annoying, but great to see new music is coming our way very soon! :metal :metal
It's done that way because it'll be more of a suite than a song.
Comparable to Mind's Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter?
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Breaking up a 16-minute song into six short tracks is super annoying, but great to see new music is coming our way very soon! :metal :metal
It's done that way because it'll be more of a suite than a song.
Comparable to Mind's Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter?
I suppose, in the sense of the tracks being distinct but all running directly from one to the next.
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^I’m guessing more like the house band’s 8 track epic song? (Also 6th album...)
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I think it's appropriate to do a split like that in cases where it's more of a suite. I think of Coheed and Cambria's suites, like The Willing Well and The End Complete, which work much better split up than they would together. I would at least want to hear the album before deciding I was going to combine the tracks.
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When I saw the album was called Virus, I though it must be an April fools joke. Thankfully, I was wrong. I loved Vector, so I'm looking forward to this one.
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I never do this sort of thing, but I stayed up to listen to this new track. Wow, what a banger. I like. :metal
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Nice! I've been staying up much later these days since I mostly WFH, if I remember, I'll check it out at midnight.
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Just realized it's 1:40 AM here, might as well listen to the new Haken song before I go to sleep.
Edit: okay, not so sure about this to be honest, I didn't like it much on my first listen. Seems like a step down from The Good Doctor and Puzzle Box.
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Just realized it's 1:40 AM here, might as well listen to the new Haken song before I go to sleep.
Edit: okay, not so sure about this to be honest, I didn't like it much on my first listen. Seems like a step down from The Good Doctor and Puzzle Box.
I like it A LOT.
If you read the booklet in Vector, the final sentence after the thank you section reads "... Keep spreading the virus..."
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Breaking up a 16-minute song into six short tracks is super annoying, but great to see new music is coming our way very soon! :metal :metal
It's done that way because it'll be more of a suite than a song.
If that is true, then I would probably be okay with it. I guess we'll find out this June. :tup :tup
Edit: okay, not so sure about this to be honest, I didn't like it much on my first listen. Seems like a step down from The Good Doctor and Puzzle Box.
I found the lead singles from the last two albums, Initiate and The Good Doctor, to be boringly bland, so I almost expect the lead single this time around to be similar, and then the rest of the album to be far better, which was the case with both Affinity and Vector (the boring A Cell Divides as well notwithstanding), IMO.
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Wow, really heavy for Haken! Interesting on first listen...
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Two listens now, I really like it. Catchy and heavy :tup
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I'm not seeing any official confirmation of the album info yet though.
Track's pretty awesome, btw.
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I'm not seeing any official confirmation of the album info yet though.
10am UK time (i.e. in half an hour).
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I'm not seeing any official confirmation of the album info yet though.
Track's pretty awesome, btw.
According to their facebook page, something will happen in 30min
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Video for Prosthetic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4EmbYo65Pbs
EDIT: And full announcement: https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial/posts/10158394277499744
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Pre-ordered on InsideOut. I'm not going to listen to the single, but I am beyond excited :omg:
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Summarising the announcement made by Ross: Yes, it was recorded secretly (ha!) and yes, both albums are connected (ha! ha!) aand: they intend to play the both of them for a special live performance at some point.
edit: here you go for reference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_XMWVUQ93io (says the academic part of my personality. Always indicate one's sources.)
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Pretty good song. Excellent in fact. But like someone mentioned earlier, getting the same vibe as Vector (for obvious reasons) which would be great for anyone else, but seems a slight step down from the 4 albums that preceded it. I'm honestly hoping that Virus packs a few more surprises than Vector did.
In fact this gives me an excuse to revisit Vector for the first time in awhile. I liked it when it came out, but it didn't hold my interest for very long and I don't think I've spun it at all in almost a year. :mehlin
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Not really feeling the new song at all.
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It's thrash metal 'prog' featuring a pretty catchy chorus.
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Someone described it as Devin Theater which I thought was a pretty good description. :lol
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Someone described it as Devin Theater which I thought was a pretty good description. :lol
When I reviewed Vector I mentioned how Veil specifically seemed to channel Black Clouds era Dream Theater, and tied them more closely to them than even the early albums did. Feel the same about this song at times, except like you I thought it also came with a strong Devin vibe.
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Only one listen but I dig that song a LOT.
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Wasn’t a fan of Vector (liked the heavyness but there was a lot of noodling). But this... Holy smokes! Super heavy, very cohesive and it truly sounds like a song! The drumming is insane and the riffing is out of this world. Jesus! Ross’s vocals in this range are godly!!
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Someone described it as Devin Theater which I thought was a pretty good description. :lol
When I reviewed Vector I mentioned how Veil specifically seemed to channel Black Clouds era Dream Theater, and tied them more closely to them than even the early albums did. Feel the same about this song at times, except like you I thought it also came with a strong Devin vibe.
Yeah, I remember saying to MP at an Adrenaline Mob show right after Vector came out that certain chunks of it you could tell they had just spent some time playing a bunch of classic DT material and Veil (particularly the instrumental section) was what I had in mind.
I dig the new song, as heavy as I think they get but still with a catchy chorus :metal :metal
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Most welcome news for a bleak Friday. I got an email from Inside Out with info for new Haken and I was like, "wait...what?!" Preordered neon yellow limited LP package! I had passed up seeing the lads with Devin ( not my bag) but it ended up getting cancelled anyway. I'm looking forward to seeing the tour this new work when the world calms down.
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Does anybody know if the European shirts are tighter than US shirts? Would love to get the Haken Virus shirt and usually wear XL but I'm not sure if the sizing varies compared to the US shirts.
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Does anybody know if the European shirts are tighter than US shirts? Would love to get the Haken Virus shirt and usually wear XL but I'm not sure if the sizing varies compared to the US shirts.
Where are you seeing shirts? I don't seen them on the CMUS link.
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Ooo very nice song :metal :metal Those drums :omg:
Perfect way to start a friday since I fell asleep before midnight for the first time in awhile
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Ooo...
Just read Ray's comments on their FB. Glad I did because it explains the Vector concept and think that's an awesome origin to the concept, "Who is The Cockroach King?"
I'm buying this hands down. Going to listen to A Cell Divides first before listening to Prosthetic.
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@goo goo
Not sure if it matters.... But I had ordered a cool Mountain shirt a few years ago and when it arrived I found that the XL fit like a medium. I couldn't even get it on😤
I gave it to my daughter and she wears it to school!
Don't know if it's the same manufacturer so I guess it's a crapshoot.
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Man, there are some super cool riffs on this (granted, also one or two not so cool ones), it's a shame that the chorus and most of the vocals on this are so lame.. I would have really liked it if not for that. Odd, I always felt Ross (or whoever writes the vocals) is super consistent in writing compelling vocal melodies
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I'm okay with the chorus but the verses aren't doing anything for me at all. That being said, I warmed up to the song a bit, the instrumentation is pretty great here.
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The verses remind me of Static-X vocals. The chorus has that mainstream radio rock melody from the 2000's (or more it reminds me of a song from that era I can't remember). Mixed with Devin Townsend's Choir hit patch.
I enjoyed the song and loved the music video for keeping with the loose concept. It's going to be a hit live, I guarantee.
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I enjoyed the single! Some crunchy riffing going on, and over-all, a fairly good follow-up from Vector.
I have pre-ordered the 2-CD Mediabook from Burningshed (so it'll match my mediabook of Vector, also from Burningshed), but for those interested, they have the exclusive Transparent Green vinyl.
https://burningshed.com/index.php?route=product/search&filter_name=Haken&filter_sub_category=true
Looking forward this album! I wasn't expecting very many new albums for me to get this year (as it was really only The Tangent and Transatlantic, both coming out much later this year), so this is exciting to get a new album by summertime.
-Marc.
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It's a good song, but nothing fantastic.
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@goo goo
Not sure if it matters.... But I had ordered a cool Mountain shirt a few years ago and when it arrived I found that the XL fit like a medium. I couldn't even get it on😤
I gave it to my daughter and she wears it to school!
Don't know if it's the same manufacturer so I guess it's a crapshoot.
I'm on the same boat. I have two Haken shirts size L and XL and can't used them. So I guess I'll shoot for the XXL and see if those fit better.
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Does anybody know if the European shirts are tighter than US shirts? Would love to get the Haken Virus shirt and usually wear XL but I'm not sure if the sizing varies compared to the US shirts.
Where are you seeing shirts? I don't seen them on the CMUS link.
On the Omerch website on the Haken store. Hence my questions about European shirt sizing.
https://www.omerch.eu/shop/haken/
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Love the song! Looking forward to this album!
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Does anybody know if the European shirts are tighter than US shirts? Would love to get the Haken Virus shirt and usually wear XL but I'm not sure if the sizing varies compared to the US shirts.
Where are you seeing shirts? I don't seen them on the CMUS link.
On the Omerch website on the Haken store. Hence my questions about European shirt sizing.
https://www.omerch.eu/shop/haken/
Oh, haha. I would have done the bundle if the shirts were yellow instead of black. I'm gonna get the 2 CD from CM.
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I'm very much excited for Virus, but that being said, if this album is as heavy and guitar driven as the single would suggest I really hope the next album returns to the spacier feel of The Mountain or the more keyboard driven feel of the debut. I basically know for a fact I won't get my wish on the latter, but do think there is some hope for the former.
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(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/27/Haken_-_Vector_%282018%29.jpg) (https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/81cd4zp9l2L._SS500_.jpg)
(https://img.discogs.com/YH36CzOrnFxUOUAzbEC9WX_JcYg=/fit-in/600x597/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/discogs-images/R-3424271-1518376810-9860.jpeg.jpg) (https://f4.bcbits.com/img/a4275038733_10.jpg)
Am I the only one? :lol
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I'm very much excited for Virus, but that being said, if this album is as heavy and guitar driven as the single would suggest I really hope the next album returns to the spacier feel of The Mountain or the more keyboard driven feel of the debut. I basically know for a fact I won't get my wish on the latter, but do think there is some hope for the former.
I feel the same way. I feel confident by now that pretty much whatever Haken tries will have a strong chance of succeeding, but I'd be lying if I said the direction they've taken since The Mountain is emphasizing the elements of their sound I like best.
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I knew when Aquarius came out that these guys were going to
take off. Excellent band, consistent and very prolific. If I had to choose
a current top 3 bands, it would be: IQ, Tesseract and Haken.
Cool song. Heavy too!
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Guys....the next album needs to be green.
(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/r47/jammindude/0/heinzpicnic.jpeg)
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:lol I say white for sauerkraut personally, but I've got no objection over pickle green
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Guys....the next album needs to be green.
(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/r47/jammindude/0/heinzpicnic.jpeg)
I mean, Affinity was green-themed. Like I said above, it'd be neat if they followed Virus with a four-letter V-titled album colored in blue, paying homage to King Crimson's 80s albums Discipline, Beat, and Three Of A Perfect Pair, especially given the band's King Crimson influences here and there.
-Marc.
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I knew when Aquarius came out that these guys were going to
take off. Excellent band, consistent and very prolific. If I had to choose
a current top 3 bands, it would be: IQ, Tesseract and Haken.
Cool song. Heavy too!
Emtee..Check out the band Vola. Their last album, "Applause from a Distant Crowd" is a masterpiece in my opinion. I would put Vola up there with your list.
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I'm very much excited for Virus, but that being said, if this album is as heavy and guitar driven as the single would suggest I really hope the next album returns to the spacier feel of The Mountain or the more keyboard driven feel of the debut. I basically know for a fact I won't get my wish on the latter, but do think there is some hope for the former.
I believe that it will be a lot of diversity on this album, from Haken's Facebook:
"Once again, Adam ‘Nolly’ Getgood has mixed what is perhaps the most eclectic Haken album to date, with the 7 tracks revealing hints of influences from multiple genres, all intertwined with Haken’s own recognisable sound."
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So
I absolutely love the single. Mind you I've only listened 1.5 times... But... Yea.
Looking forward to this release!
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I'm very much excited for Virus, but that being said, if this album is as heavy and guitar driven as the single would suggest I really hope the next album returns to the spacier feel of The Mountain or the more keyboard driven feel of the debut. I basically know for a fact I won't get my wish on the latter, but do think there is some hope for the former.
I believe that it will be a lot of diversity on this album, from Haken's Facebook:
"Once again, Adam ‘Nolly’ Getgood has mixed what is perhaps the most eclectic Haken album to date, with the 7 tracks revealing hints of influences from multiple genres, all intertwined with Haken’s own recognisable sound."
I've read far too many press releases (and even worse promo junkets that come with advance music) to put any faith in that, unfortunately.
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Yeah I'm not sure about that particular phrase, and if you look at the rest of the sentence it clearly says "hints of influences from multiple genres". So I wouldn't expect anything too wacky or off-the-wall.
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Just listened to the new song. Holy crap that's heavy! I am sooooooo excited for this album. :metal
And can't wait for the rest. :corn
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Love the new song. Already like it better than anything on Vector.
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Solid song, seems like the "straightforward" single song that every Haken album seems to have. Interested in hearing the 10-min track and the suite as well, personally I'm hoping it has a lot of differentiation and doesn't stick to one style a la Vector.
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Prosthetic absolutely rips. A well-needed dose of badassery this Friday afternoon!
:metal
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Good opener IMO, similar to Initiate and Good Doctor. Neither of these two past openers had me excited by themselves, but they work great in the context of their respective albums.
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I knew when Aquarius came out that these guys were going to
take off. Excellent band, consistent and very prolific. If I had to choose
a current top 3 bands, it would be: IQ, Tesseract and Haken.
Cool song. Heavy too!
Emtee..Check out the band Vola. Their last album, "Applause from a Distant Crowd" is a masterpiece in my opinion. I would put Vola up there with your list.
Thanks Bro. I know we have similar tastes. If you love it, I will too. I'll check it out for sure.
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Wait....is The Messiah Complex a split suite? Because, on their website, it lists Only Stars as track 7. The Messiah Complex parts are named under TMC as track 6.
I'm guessing it's not split.
Well, I guess I just had to look further down...
"Once again, Adam ‘Nolly’ Getgood has mixed what is perhaps the most eclectic Haken album to date, with the 7 tracks revealing hints of influences from multiple genres, all intertwined with Haken’s own recognisable sound"
Edit: Also, just found out that CMUS has now added a Yellow shirt package. Yay for me.
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I'm pretty sure this will be good, so colour me excited.
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Wait....is The Messiah Complex a split suite? Because, on their website, it lists Only Stars as track 7. The Messiah Complex parts are named under TMC as track 6.
I'm guessing it's not split.
Well, I guess I just had to look further down...
Begs the question why any band considers this, especially for a relatively short epic. It's not like it's over 30 minutes, or the only song on the disc.
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Wait....is The Messiah Complex a split suite? Because, on their website, it lists Only Stars as track 7. The Messiah Complex parts are named under TMC as track 6.
I'm guessing it's not split.
Well, I guess I just had to look further down...
Begs the question why any band considers this, especially for a relatively short epic. It's not like it's over 30 minutes, or the only song on the disc.
Considering the iTunes listing showed 11 tracks, with the 5 parts to TMC being split (with different and individual track lengths), I think it's safe to assume the discs will feature 11 tracks, but the band themselves will consider the album as having 7 songs.
This is something that always irks me, especially with prog bands - when artists/labels/press releases cannot differentiate between TRACKS and SONGS on an album. For example, if you consider "Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence" as one song, then the album SDOIT has 6 songs, but the way the CD is pressed, it has 13 tracks (5 on disc one, 8 on disc two).
It seems like Haken have written and composed "The Messiah Complex" as one piece, but have split it on the CD/digital formats for one reason or another. I guess we'll have to wait about 2 months before we can hear it and see how it all plays out, but I suspect it to be something along the lines of SDOIT or Spock's Beard's "The Healing Colors Of Sound", could be considered one song, but might have clear separating points between each part, though they may crossfade into each other.
-Marc.
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Structurally speaking, Spock's Healing Colours of Sound suite is probably a good comparator.
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Have you actually heard it already?
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Structurally speaking, Spock's Healing Colours of Sound suite is probably a good comparator.
Cool, now I have a good idea of how it might sound, at least, structurally. I've kept THCOS as one track on my CD-r and digital versions of the album for years, so I'll more than likely do the same for Haken's TMC, especially since the band insists that the album has 7 songs (which, oddly enough, is like Vector).
-Marc.
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Have you actually heard it already?
:-X
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Finally got to hear the song. The tone, playing and production are flawless :tup :tup :tup
Not too crazy about the song, tho. I wasn't a big fan of Vector overall (LOVE some songs like Veil and Puzzle Box, but not the album as a whole) so I'm not too excited about them releasing a direct sequel to it, both stylistically and conceptually.
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Structurally speaking, Spock's Healing Colours of Sound suite is probably a good comparator.
Happy with this information! I've always heard Healing Colours more as one big (and very good) song.
So... if you are allowed, you could confirm to us if the album has a diversity of styles like it was said in the press release or it's more unidimensional like Vector? In your opinion, of course.
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I didn't find Vector particularly uni-dimensional, so it's not like I'd be a very useful person to ask that question to. Overall it was tonally darker (or perhaps rather, more consistently dark) and more riff-driven than their previous albums, but I still find it pretty varied.
In terms of Virus, I couldn't say really, but I would just point to what the press release actually says. Firstly, as I said before, it says the album is "eclectic", with "hints of influences from multiple genres", which to be honest could describe any Haken album. :lol Also, there's the quote from Hen: "...we wanted the two albums to be sonically connected. But ... it’s obvious that this album will be an evolution of the ‘Vector’ sound."
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Thanks for the response, ariich!
I also don’t think Vector is an unidimensional album, but I think that it has less diversity than Aquarius, Mountain, Restored and Affinity. I agree, Vector is a darker album, which it’s different than to be relentless heavy.
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Structurally speaking, Spock's Healing Colours of Sound suite is probably a good comparator.
Gotcha. To me, Healing Colors is like Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence in that both sound like a bunch of short songs that all run together rather than an actual single song, and if the Haken song is like that, I will likely be fine with them being split up.
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Was listening to Affinity today and honestly i've forgotten how much I enjoyed that album. No diss to Ross what so ever but I really enjoyed listening to the instrumental disc. The music is just superb filled with so much nuggets and details it could almost serve as a standalone instrumental album.
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Instead of listening to the single, Vector has been playing for a few days now and I still absolutely love it. I don't understand why so many people criticise it. To me, it's far superior to f.e. Visions. Probably my second favourite Haken album, closely after Affinity.
In particular, I absolutely love Nil By Mouth. Showcases what a machine of a band Haken is. Especially Ray Hearne. For example, I love how the last theme is introduced quietly, then the band sets in, but Ray plays a very open/broken rhythm for two full rounds of the theme, until he finally breaks the tension and the whole band explodes into one final run-through of the theme. It took me so many times to figure out that this is a 17/16 to 4/4 polyrhythm. It pops into my head very often, even when I'm not in a Haken-binge phase.
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I like Nil by Mouth, but to make a DT comparison, it's a little too much Dance of Eternity. In other words, it tilts way too far to the technical side. Haken, like DT, is at their best when there is a good balance of melody and technical skill. And if they are going to tilt too far to one side, I prefer the melodic side, which is why I will take songs like Host, Deathless and Somebody (all melodic gems) over a technical showcase like Nil by Mouth every day of the week and twice on Sundays.
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I like Nil by Mouth, but to make a DT comparison, it's a little too much Dance of Eternity. In other words, it tilts way too far to the technical side. Haken, like DT, is at their best when there is a good balance of melody and technical skill. And if they are going to tilt too far to one side, I prefer the melodic side, which is why I will take songs like Host, Deathless and Somebody (all melodic gems) over a technical showcase like Nil by Mouth every day of the week and twice on Sundays.
SO MUCH OF THIS!
That's not to say I don't appreciate the technical side. One of the reasons I love Falling Back to Earth so much is because the first half of the song tends to showcase their technical side, and then the second half of the song we get that BRILLIANT harmonious "groove" riff with Ross' vocals that really highlight the harmonies. It's all of what makes Haken so amazing in a single track.
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Just listened to the new single. WOW... pretty damn heavy! Love it. Looking forward to the album release and I'm assuming they chose the name of the album prior to the madness. Sure hope it doesn't give them bad optics.
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SO MUCH OF THIS!
That's not to say I don't appreciate the technical side. One of the reasons I love Falling Back to Earth so much is because the first half of the song tends to showcase their technical side, and then the second half of the song we get that BRILLIANT harmonious "groove" riff with Ross' vocals that really highlight the harmonies. It's all of what makes Haken so amazing in a single track.
I don't rate Falling Back to Earth quite as high as many Haken fans do (still a borderline top 10 Haken song for me), but I agree that it does a great job of showing off all sides of the band. :tup :tup
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I like Nil by Mouth, but to make a DT comparison, it's a little too much Dance of Eternity. In other words, it tilts way too far to the technical side. Haken, like DT, is at their best when there is a good balance of melody and technical skill. And if they are going to tilt too far to one side, I prefer the melodic side, which is why I will take songs like Host, Deathless and Somebody (all melodic gems) over a technical showcase like Nil by Mouth every day of the week and twice on Sundays.
Agree with all of this as well! Both Haken and DT share that ability to use their technicality in a way that suits the emotion and tension in a song, but there have been a couple moments where I feel it veers too far into the "wankery" for lack of a better term. That stuff is still very fun in a live setting, and in those instances there can be a lot of emotion coming from that, but just listening to the studio version, it's more like "neat, they can play really fast :lol )
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They strike the balance right nearly every other time. Nil by Mouth is one song in which they absolutely can (and do) show off their technical ability, and it's brilliant for that! For me it's absolutely the most thrilling song on Vector. I love Good Doctor, Puzzle Box and Veil, but for different reasons.
Now for what I was originally going to post:
I just realized that Virus is the first Haken album where track 1 is a proper song (not just an intro) since Aquarius. Going backwards, we had Clear and affinity.exe, then The Path, and even though Premonition is 4 minutes, it's essentially an overture/preview of Visions, the closing epic.
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They strike the balance right nearly every other time. Nil by Mouth is one song in which they absolutely can (and do) show off their technical ability, and it's brilliant for that! For me it's absolutely the most thrilling song on Vector. I love Good Doctor, Puzzle Box and Veil, but for different reasons.
Same. I'm not really a huge fan of overly technical music, and Nil By Mouth is easily my favorite song on Vector. There's still a lot of atmosphere in the track so it's not just a barrage of notes.
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Prosthetic fuckin rips! I really love the effects they put on Ross's voice during the verses.
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I really like Prosthetic, but I remain patiently waiting for new Nova Collective.
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@goo goo
Not sure if it matters.... But I had ordered a cool Mountain shirt a few years ago and when it arrived I found that the XL fit like a medium. I couldn't even get it on😤
I gave it to my daughter and she wears it to school!
Don't know if it's the same manufacturer so I guess it's a crapshoot.
I'm on the same boat. I have two Haken shirts size L and XL and can't used them. So I guess I'll shoot for the XXL and see if those fit better.
Stupid question here: if my measured chest size is 46 inch (XL), would I need to select a bigger shirt size (xxl)?
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The following is just an idea of mine (and I'm not a fan of Haken. Yet. It may happen at some point): Would anyone here have liked for Vector and Virus to entirely be released this year and for it to be a real double album ? (and then having to wait 4 years between Affinity and the present day in the process) I would have. (but that's because I find it strange to do separate releases)
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I've listened the hell out of Vector (and I still listen to it somewhat regularly) and saw them on tour for Vector for the first time, so no, I wouldn't change a thing.
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The following is just an idea of mine (and I'm not a fan of Haken. Yet. It may happen at some point): Would anyone here have liked for Vector and Virus to entirely be released this year and for it to be a real double album ? (and then having to wait 4 years between Affinity and the present day in the process) I would have. (but that's because I find it strange to do separate releases)
I like the idea of it being a sequel rather than the second-half of a double album, like Pain Of Salvation's Road Salt or Ayreon's Universal Migrator. Haken may have started the writing process for both around the same time, but they obviously had planned to release them apart from each other, which I think was a good idea, to allow fans to digest the first part well enough before giving us the second part. Honestly, though, I need to start spinning Vector again because it's been awhile since I've listened to it, and with Virus due out in less than 2 months, I should really re-familiarize myself with it!
Also, releasing them separately means that the eventual performance of both albums back-to-back will make it an extra special concert (whenever that happens). I hope they do it a couple of times, and record it for audio and video release. It'd be one hell of a show, but I'm sure the encore set would be full of classic stuff, though I'm sure given its connection to Virus (and Vector), "Cockroach King" would definitely be a part of that show's encore set.
-Marc.
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I'm excited for this release, I don't even mind the concept, but I hate that it's tied to The Cockroach King. It almost ruins that song for me.
My interpretation of CK from my first listen was that the Cockroach King was self delusion. Turning him into an actual person with a 2 album concept is....meh. It's like when they turn "John Harrison" into Kahn. It would have been better if the new villain would have been kept separate from the old villain.
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I'm excited for this release, I don't even mind the concept, but I hate that it's tied to The Cockroach King. It almost ruins that song for me.
My interpretation of CK from my first listen was that the Cockroach King was self delusion. Turning him into an actual person with a 2 album concept is....meh. It's like when they turn "John Harrison" into Kahn. It would have been better if the new villain would have been kept separate from the old villain.
It's the King of Delusion. The new album features all the members of Sons of Apollo.
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Would anyone here have liked for Vector and Virus to entirely be released this year and for it to be a real double album ?
Not me.
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Turning him into an actual person with a 2 album concept is....meh.
Except that, exactly like Cockroach King, Vector is on the surface a story about real events but is metaphorical/allegorical/whatevorical underneath.
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But has anyone ever figured abut what it's really about then? (Both CK and Vector)
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But has anyone ever figured abut what it's really about then? (Both CK and Vector)
My interpretation of CK from my first listen was that the Cockroach King was self delusion.
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Wait... Cockroach King and Vector / Virus are linked?
Mind = blown.
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@goo goo
Not sure if it matters.... But I had ordered a cool Mountain shirt a few years ago and when it arrived I found that the XL fit like a medium. I couldn't even get it on😤
I gave it to my daughter and she wears it to school!
Don't know if it's the same manufacturer so I guess it's a crapshoot.
I would get the XXL. Better a bit large than too tight
I'm on the same boat. I have two Haken shirts size L and XL and can't used them. So I guess I'll shoot for the XXL and see if those fit better.
Stupid question here: if my measured chest size is 46 inch (XL), would I need to select a bigger shirt size (xxl)?
I would get the XXL
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After I heard the new album title I automatically thought of Covid 19 then ‘Host’ from Vector.
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I've been interested in giving Haken a shot for a while, mostly because they're highly praised and compared to Dream Theater a lot. What would be some good songs to start out with?
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I've been interested in giving Haken a shot for a while, mostly because they're highly praised and compared to Dream Theater a lot. What would be some good songs to start out with?
Falling Back to Earth is very DTish IMO and really good song. But you can really just start with the new single IMO. Most will say The Mountain is their best album (Falling Back to Earth is from that album). I think Visions is the most DT like and maybe why I like it the most, but they don't have a bad album so that's why I think you can kind of start with wherever.
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I think Visions is the best place to start for any DT fan. It's virtually an homage to SFAM, from the story, right down to the songs. I think I even hear an intentional recreation of the notes from the SFAM overture in at least one spot. I don't mean any of this in a bad way. I think it's brilliant.
But after mirroring their DT heroes to perfection, they definitely became their own "thing" with The Mountain.
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Speaking of DT and Haken, I watched/listened to some of their live chat the other day and I don't remember who said it, but they were asked about their favorite DT album and most said Awake or SFAM but one of them (this is who I forget) said ToT was becoming one of their favorites more recently. Since others here have mentioned their newer heavier stuff being influenced by some of the heavier DT stuff, that's some good supporting evidence if ToT has been getting listens by them.
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I've been interested in giving Haken a shot for a while, mostly because they're highly praised and compared to Dream Theater a lot. What would be some good songs to start out with?
I'd start from the beginning, with Aquarius and go forward chronologically. As a DT Fan, I heard Aquarius the first time back in 2010 and I was a fan after 4 seconds and never looked back.
Also, this way you can follow the changes they've gone through.
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Yep. Haken is one of the bands that starting from the debut and moving forwards chronologically is the best way to discover them.
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I've been on kind of a Haken period these last few days. I listened through The Mountain last night for the first time in a while, and it just confirmed for me that it's a masterpiece of an album.
1. The Mountain
2. Aquarius
3. Affinity
4. Vector
5. Visions
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1. Visions
2. Affinity
3. The Mountain
4. Vector
5. Aquarius
But all of them are really good, although I'm still not very fond of the vocals.
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1. Aquarius
2. The Mountain
3. Vector
4. Visions
5. Affinity
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The Mountain > Aquarius > Affinity = Vector > Visions
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Affinity
The Mountain
-these two are really close-
Vector
Visions
Aquarius
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It is tough for me to rate Visions too low, but I guess I look at this way:
Tracks 3-6 from that record (and track 1) are all good, but they are songs I all merely like; I don't consider any of them essential.
On the flip side, the title track and Deathless are two of their best songs IMO (both would be in my top 6-7 probably), and they take up over 30 minutes of the total 71 minutes. Throw in Nocturnal Conspiracy, which is damn good and pretty essential, and you now have 43 minutes of 71 being essential.
Ultimately, I might give it the slight edge over Affinity for 3rd place since it has more essential minutes (Affinity has probably three essential tunes in my book, which take up less than 25 minutes), plus it doesn't have any throwaways like Affinity does in Initiate. I do think most of the songs on Affinity, though, aside from Initiate, are better than every song on Visions except for the title track, Deathless and Nocturnal Conspiracy.
The Mountain and Aquarius are the obvious 1a and 1b, if you ask me.
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1. Affinity - this is a prog-metal essential ala I&W, Mindcrime, and SFAM. Unfortunately I don't think they'll ever top this one for me at this point.
2. The Mountain - mostly excellent, though Because It's There, Somebody, and As Death Embraces pull it down slightly.
3. Aquarius - extremely solid with tons of great ideas - I think most of the songs are too long however and there's a bit too much "goofiness" in the keyboard sounds.
4. Vector - very solid, but too short with the final two songs being lower quality than the others.
5. Visions - good album, but outside of Shapeshifter, Insomnia, Deathless, and the title track, it doesn't really do it for me. Nocturnal Conspiracy might be one of my least favorite Haken songs along with Darkest Light.
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Oh we are doing this again? Sure, let's go, right now for me it is:
1. Aquarius - lots of fantastic ideas, you can feel it's not as polished as some of the later albums but the spark is there, and I'd argue that this album has the best Haken moments overall as well as Haken's best three song run (Drowning in the Flood - Sun - Celestial Elixir)
2. The Mountain - a polished package, fabulous album, it's obvious for me they were very focused when writing this one, and while I feel some songs may be just a bit lacking, the whole picture comes together extremely well
3. Vector - hey, aside from Nil by Mouth and some moments in Veil, I love every song on this. And Veil has some great moments too, the first verse, chorus, and the quiet section are all great, in my opinion
4. Affinity - I like half the songs and I don't like the other half. It feels as polished as The Mountain, only some of the material isn't strong enough for me to hold up. Still a good album though!
5. Visions - I like Nocturnal Conspiracy, Shapeshifter and Deathless. The rest of the album could be dropped and I wouldn't be disappointed in the slightest.
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On the flip side, the title track and Deathless are two of their best songs IMO (both would be in my top 6-7 probably), and they take up over 30 minutes of the total 71 minutes. Throw in Nocturnal Conspiracy, which is damn good and pretty essential, and you now have 43 minutes of 71 being essential.
Interesting. I think, Nocturnal Conspiracy is one of the weakest tracks in their catalogue. Which of course still doesn't mean it's a bad song.
My rating would be like this:
Affinity
Vector
The Mountain
Aquarius
Visions
But that doesn't mean much, because they are all sooo close...
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1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Visions
4. Aquarius
5. Vector
The first four albums are nearly perfect. In fact I would call it the greatest opening four album run in progressive rock history. Only Pain of Salvation comes close. Vector is good. And for any other band, I would even call it great. But it was definitely a step down from a four album run of near perfection.
So far though, I think I like Prosthetic better than any song off Vector, so that's a good sign.
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The Mountain
Affinity/Visions
Vector
Aquarius
I couldn't decide which is better between Affinity and Visions. Everything is pretty close with only Aquarius being just a bit under the rest. I don't know why we aren't including Restoration in the list, but I would probably tie it with Vector. (I know it's an EP, but that's really just a label isn't it? I mean yeah it's shorter, but Vector is also shorter than the rest, and Virus is following suit, being shorter than all the pre-Vector albums. I think it deserves to be included.)
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1. Aquarius
2. Vision
3. The Mountain
4. Affinity
5. Vector
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1. The Mountain
2= Vector
2= Virus :neverusethis:
4. Affinity
5= Visions
5= Restoration
7. Aquarius
8. Demo
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1. Aquarius
2. Affinity
3. The Mountain
4. Visions
5. Vector
6. Restoration
7. Demo
I *think*
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I always struggle to rank their albums for some reason. I guess it's mainly because they're all great in their own ways and there isn't one that stands head and shoulders above the rest for me.
The only thing I can definitively say is that Vector is my least favourite, but that's partly because it's 25% shorter than even their next shortest previous album. Many of the songs would need to be among their absolute best to make up for that and I don't find that to be the case, even though I don't dislike any of them.
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Oh, I absolutely don't think shorter=less good. I ranked Vector lowest, because I don't really like it. Veil is one of their worst tracks as far as I'm concerned, and I never have the urge to listen to Nil by Mouth either. The Good Doctor I find enjoyable, and Puzzle Box and A Cell Divides I think are really good tracks, but that's not a whole lot then, hence why it's ranked lowest of their proper albums for me.
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The Mountain
Aquarius
Affinity
Visions
Vector
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I'm in the camp that considers Aquarius and The Mountain to be the two clear peaks. Both of those albums are totally distinct in their sound and songwriting—I've never heard an album even remotely similar to either of those two. And both of them are at a very high level.
For a long time I rated Affinity below Visions, but a few months ago it unexpectedly clicked very hard. It just took me a long time to get a handle on the last few songs. Now I would place it a clear third. And then Vector and Visions are both a clear cut below Affinity. They're both good albums, but also distinctly mortal. After having had a while to sit with Vector, I'd rate Visions as the clear weakest.
Restoration is hard to rank next to full-length albums, but I'd place it in the same area as Visions and Vector.
1. The Mountain
2. Aquarius
3. Affinity
4. Vector
5. Restoration
6. Visions
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I gave Visions a full spin last night, to see if it would "click" with me some more, but no - it's still last on my ranking. There's nothing there except the awesome title track (and perhaps Deathless) that really interests me.
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So I was roto tilling my back yard yesterday in preparation for grass seeding today. I listened to all of Haken's studio work in no particular order other than complete albums at a time. Even though it was tiring work I thoroughly enjoyed the tunes- as I rocked out and busted my ass all day. Sure we can nitpick, "I like this or this isn't as good" but they are an extremely talented (and nice bunch) of lads and I am glad I am a fan of them.
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I like doing album rankings, so here we go :).
The Mountain
Affinity
Vector
Restoration
Visions
Aquarius
I don't listen to visions and Aquarius all that much. To me, The Mountian is when Haken finally came into their own. And my first 4 on the list are very tightly packed and I like all of them almost equally.
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These guys seem to be unstoppable. VIRUS keeps raising the bar. :metal
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These guys seem to be unstoppable. VIRUS keeps raising the bar. :metal
:metal
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I really dig the new single Prosthetic. :2metal:
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I really dig the new single Prosthetic. :2metal:
Wait until you listen to the whole album. You are in for a treat.
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I really dig the new single Prosthetic. :2metal:
Wait until you listen to the whole album. You are in for a treat.
You've heard the whole thing? Lucky dog :)
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I really dig the new single Prosthetic. :2metal:
Wait until you listen to the whole album. You are in for a treat.
I hate you.
;D :P :laugh:
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I really dig the new single Prosthetic. :2metal:
Wait until you listen to the whole album. You are in for a treat.
If you've heard it, can we expect some sort of review some time? ;D
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I really dig the new single Prosthetic. :2metal:
Wait until you listen to the whole album. You are in for a treat.
If you've heard it, can we expect some sort of review some time? ;D
I'll start writing a detailed review for Sonic Perspectives soon!
I have heard it twice now and it's absolutely insane. If I had to guess, I'd say it's going to be more popular among fans than Vector.
Plus, it makes Vector whole. The whole "double" package Vector/Virus makes absolute sense.
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Really glad you guys are digging it so much!
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I'm quite lukewarm towards Prosthetic, hoping the rest of the album appeals to me more.
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Ok, so how special does one need to be in order to hear the entire album 6 weeks before release?
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I really dig the new single Prosthetic. :2metal:
Wait until you listen to the whole album. You are in for a treat.
If you've heard it, can we expect some sort of review some time? ;D
Fritzinger will write the review for our outlet.
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Ok, so how special does one need to be in order to hear the entire album 6 weeks before release?
It's just the promo that has been sent out to review outlets.
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Ok, so how special does one need to be in order to hear the entire album 6 weeks before release?
It's just the promo that has been sent out to review outlets.
Or be friends with the band like some mod in this forum...
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:omg:
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I really dig the new single Prosthetic. :2metal:
Wait until you listen to the whole album. You are in for a treat.
If you've heard it, can we expect some sort of review some time? ;D
I'll start writing a detailed review for Sonic Perspectives soon!
I have heard it twice now and it's absolutely insane. If I had to guess, I'd say it's going to be more popular among fans than Vector.
Plus, it makes Vector whole. The whole "double" package Vector/Virus makes absolute sense.
Oh man, now I'm even more excited than I already was. Here's to a back to back Vector/Virus listening session on release day! :corn
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Ok, so how special does one need to be in order to hear the entire album 6 weeks before release?
It's just the promo that has been sent out to review outlets.
Or be friends with the band like some mod in this forum...
Well, yes, but that was more than 6 weeks. :P
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Ok, so how special does one need to be in order to hear the entire album 6 weeks before release?
It's just the promo that has been sent out to review outlets.
Or be friends with the band like some mod in this forum...
Well, yes, but that was more than 6 weeks. :P
HAHAHA correct.
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I bet ariich was even in on the writing sessions :P
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Single number two from Virus will be Canary Yellow, out this Friday: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlVOEl9V-9k
(and I would guess that single number 3 will be out on May 29th as per the usual IO logic)
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Single number two from Virus will be Canary Yellow, out this Friday: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlVOEl9V-9k
(and I would guess that single number 3 will be out on May 29th as per the usual IO logic)
Excellent.
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I still don't understand how a 45 or 50 minute album needs three singles released prior to the actual album release. That's around 16-17 minutes. And then people "wonder" and complain, that there's not too much new music to be heard when the album drops.
Side note, I think Canary Yellow is an interesting choice. I would have gone with The Stain.
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I still don't understand how a 45 or 50 minute album needs three singles released prior to the actual album release. That's around 16-17 minutes. And then people "wonder" and complain, that there's not too much new music to be heard when the album drops.
Side note, I think Canary Yellow is an interesting choice. I would have gone with The Stain.
The Strain, you mean? :lol
I think Invasion, The Strain and Canary Yellow are all pretty good options for singles, and I can definitely see why they've gone for CY as it'll show a very different side to the album than Prosthetic.
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Listened to Vector twice over the last few days and I still love that album. Puzzle Box - Veil - Nil by Mouth may be my favorite 3-song stretch of them.
Very excited about the new album. Virus is one of the things I'm looking forward to in these boring times without bars, restaurants, live-shows and live-sports which are essentially the things that make life enjoyable.
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Prosthetic kind of meh'd me out of the Virus hypetrain but let's see if Canary Yellow can draw me back in this weekend :corn
I wouldn't mind more stuff like Vector to be honest, if I pretend Nil By Mouth exists I actually really dig that album all the way through. Prosthetic does sound like it could have been on Vector maaybe, I just think the vocals are much weaker on Prosthetic than anything on Vector. (not necessarily Ross' ability to execute the vocals, but just the melodies and general approach to vocals on that song)
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Single number two from Virus will be Canary Yellow, out this Friday: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlVOEl9V-9k
(and I would guess that single number 3 will be out on May 29th as per the usual IO logic)
(dances around and squeals like a little school girl)
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Prosthetic kind of meh'd me out of the Virus hypetrain but let's see if Canary Yellow can draw me back in this weekend :corn
I wouldn't mind more stuff like Vector to be honest, if I pretend Nil By Mouth exists I actually really dig that album all the way through. Prosthetic does sound like it could have been on Vector maaybe, I just think the vocals are much weaker on Prosthetic than anything on Vector. (not necessarily Ross' ability to execute the vocals, but just the melodies and general approach to vocals on that song)
I'm in the same boat, except I prefer to pretend Nil By Mouth doesn't exist (which I think you might've meant anyway?), that's the only track on Vector that's outright weak for me and the only one I don't like. The rest is great I would say.
Hopefully I like this new single more.
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Prosthetic kind of meh'd me out of the Virus hypetrain but let's see if Canary Yellow can draw me back in this weekend :corn
I wouldn't mind more stuff like Vector to be honest, if I pretend Nil By Mouth exists I actually really dig that album all the way through. Prosthetic does sound like it could have been on Vector maaybe, I just think the vocals are much weaker on Prosthetic than anything on Vector. (not necessarily Ross' ability to execute the vocals, but just the melodies and general approach to vocals on that song)
A couple of things probably worth noting:
- Canary Yellow is very different to Prosthetic.
- In terms of vocal lines/melodies, Prosthetic is arguably the most "heavy" and least melodic in approach on the album.
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Personally, I liked Prosthetic better than anything from Vector...and this is coming from someone who would rather see them dial back the metal factor just a tad. I like them better when they have a more balanced approach. But Prosthetic was just THAT good.
The suggestion that Prosthetic is one of the more metal tracks on a more diverse album really has me more pumped than I have been in awhile. I've been trying to re-spin Vector lately and even a couple years later it just doesn't seem like the cohesively fantastic brilliant "amazeballs" album that the first 4 were.
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Vector is strange to me. I can't deny that its short length marks it down considerably for me. But The Good Doctor, Puzzle Box and Nil By Mouth are among my favourite Haken tracks. Veil is also very good.
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I don't think Vector is too short. 45 minutes is good album length - not too short but not too long. I think it just feels short because its pacing isn't very good and its final stretch is underwhelming. I think if they took out Nil By Mouth and replaced A Cell Divides with a better, more satisfying closer less people would be complaining.
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Ya, the length wasn't a problem for me either. I don't mind if an album is shorter if the quality is there. Perfect example is ADHD by Riverside. That album is only 45min and it's is still my favorite Riverside album by a long shot, and it's mostly because there is not a single note I don't love. That is their "all killer no filler" album. Everything else they've done varies a bit.
Vector could have been that, but there was less material, and still couldn't pack the quality "front to back" feel that all the first four albums did IMO.
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So in preparation for my Haken marathon (which will probably be coming sooner than later since there's a new album coming out, meaning that'll be yet another album I get to listen to for the first time), I've been gathering YouTube playlists for each album (including the Restoration EP). However, I've noticed that the only playlists I can find for the album Aquarius are remastered versions of the songs. Is it fine to go for these, or are the original versions significantly better and worth finding instead? Also, seeing as this will be my first time listening to all of these albums, is there anything I should know before listening to any of these albums?
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The remasters of both Aquarius and Visions are better, in my opinion.
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Also, seeing as this will be my first time listening to all of these albums, is there anything I should know before listening to any of these albums?
Drowning In The Flood gets better in the second half.
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Also, seeing as this will be my first time listening to all of these albums, is there anything I should know before listening to any of these albums?
Drowning In The Flood gets better eargasmic in the second half.
FTFM
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I gave the album Visions a go tonight. I would've started with Aquarius (as my plan was to go in chronological order), but then I remember some guy somewhere telling me that Visions is comparable to Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence, so I immediately changed my mind.
This album... is great. Like, it is really great. Nocturnal Conspiracy made me think, "Yeah, this is alright," but every song after was so good (and Premonition was pretty good, too). I can definitely hear the Dream Theater influence, but this album feels a lot more like its own thing than other people seemed to think. Some sections got pretty weird, too. Not "sudden country hoedown with people yelling in a bar" levels of weird, but still a little weird (and that's a good thing). It's actually a bit tricky to decide how I'd rank the songs, but here's what I've come up with:
1. Visions
2. Shapeshifter
3. Insomnia
4. Portals
5. Deathless
6. The Mind's Eye
7. Premonition
8. Nocturnal Conspiracy
I'm curious how popular or unpopular of an opinion this ranking is. Well, nonetheless, I really enjoyed Visions and I'll absolutely be checking out the rest of Haken's albums. I was a bit worried I wouldn't like them, but I'm glad to say that after only one listen to one album, I certainly do like these guys!
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Canary Yellow is out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wiyEygDLiz8
I gotta admit, this kinda lowered my hype a bit. I really hope it'll work better in the context of the album, but out of context, I find it... weak... :-\
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Going to have to disagree, I thought it was a gorgeous song, loved the change of pace...something that I found a bit lacking on Vector. Awesome melodies.
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Canary Yellow is out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wiyEygDLiz8
I gotta admit, this kinda lowered my hype a bit. I really hope it'll work better in the context of the album, but out of context, I find it... weak... :-\
It does ;)
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Prosthetic kind of meh'd me out of the Virus hypetrain but let's see if Canary Yellow can draw me back in this weekend :corn
I wouldn't mind more stuff like Vector to be honest, if I pretend Nil By Mouth exists I actually really dig that album all the way through. Prosthetic does sound like it could have been on Vector maaybe, I just think the vocals are much weaker on Prosthetic than anything on Vector. (not necessarily Ross' ability to execute the vocals, but just the melodies and general approach to vocals on that song)
I'm in the same boat, except I prefer to pretend Nil By Mouth doesn't exist (which I think you might've meant anyway?), that's the only track on Vector that's outright weak for me and the only one I don't like. The rest is great I would say.
Hopefully I like this new single more.
Oh yeah I meant didn't exist :lol oops
Prosthetic kind of meh'd me out of the Virus hypetrain but let's see if Canary Yellow can draw me back in this weekend :corn
I wouldn't mind more stuff like Vector to be honest, if I pretend Nil By Mouth exists I actually really dig that album all the way through. Prosthetic does sound like it could have been on Vector maaybe, I just think the vocals are much weaker on Prosthetic than anything on Vector. (not necessarily Ross' ability to execute the vocals, but just the melodies and general approach to vocals on that song)
A couple of things probably worth noting:
- Canary Yellow is very different to Prosthetic.
- In terms of vocal lines/melodies, Prosthetic is arguably the most "heavy" and least melodic in approach on the album.
Don't know if this helps :lol but we'll see, I will listen to the track now
EDIT: they're losing me, oh nooooo
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Canary Yellow is out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wiyEygDLiz8
I gotta admit, this kinda lowered my hype a bit. I really hope it'll work better in the context of the album, but out of context, I find it... weak... :-\
It does ;)
Thanks for clarifying that. I was hoping for a pre-release single that is representative of the overall album, like Atlas Stone, Pareidolia and Puzzle Box were.
Seems well crafted, reminds me of Red Giant but with more memorable melodies.
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I kinda like it, definitely prefer this to Prosthetic.
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I just listened to the new track, and wow! That is a very haunting and sad song, especially when coupled with the video. I have listened to 4 times already and I really like it.
I'm even more pumped for the album now.
I also love that Vector and Virus are telling the story of the Cockroach King. With Vector I wondered if that was the case because of some of the references, but now Haken went right out and said it on their website. Very cool :tup
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The video is amazing.
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Wow sounds of a piece with The Mountain or Affinity (lyrics def Affinity like), really cool for one of their downbeat tracks. And presumably a great pause leading into the big one.
Only 6 more weeks, I can’t wait
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Wow, I somehow got this song and Carousel confused and was disappointed when I saw it was 4 minutes instead of 10. :facepalm:
Must have been subconsciously thinking of the Deafheaven song.
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Seems well crafted, reminds me of Red Giant but with more memorable melodies.
First listen in and I agree with this. I like the track. It doesn't blow me away :biggrin: but it's definitely a type of song that makes an album feel more diverse and well rounded while still being a good song.
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Just listened. Love it. I definitely get the Red Giant feel, so I hope they don't start repeating themselves too much. But I can say with confidence that I already love both of the new tracks more than 80% of what I heard on Vector, so this bodes well.
And I can't help but repeat that the diversity of Haken is what keeps me coming back. The fact that they can do something as heavy as The Architect and yet something as beautiful as Bound By Gravity on a single album is what makes their albums so fun to listen to.
Some bands I can only listen to on shuffle anymore because binging several albums can start to become monotonous. With Haken, it's never boring.
I do have a question for those "in the know"...the video sounds overly compressed to me. Is the album mastered well? It's not brickwalled, is it?
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I do have a question for those "in the know"...the video sounds overly compressed to me. Is the album mastered well? It's not brickwalled, is it?
It's definitely not brickwalled. Mix and master is generally very similar to Vector, but marginally less loud/brickwalled for everything apart from Prosthetic (which is basically the same as most songs on Vector master-wise).
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1. Visions
2. Shapeshifter
3. Insomnia
4. Portals
5. Deathless
6. The Mind's Eye
7. Premonition
8. Nocturnal Conspiracy
I'm curious how popular or unpopular of an opinion this ranking is.
I'd say putting Nocturnal Conspiracy at the bottom is a bit of a hot take. I think the typical ranking for that song is in the top three on the album. I'd have it at #2. But Visions at the top is par for the course (and well-deserved, in my opinion).
Visions might actually be the best place to start, especially coming from Dream Theater, but I'd personally rank it last among their albums. Aquarius is weirder, but I think quite brilliant, so don't forget about that one even though you went to Visions first!
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Surprised to hear the comparison to SDOIT. To me it has always sounded like a direct homage to SFAM right down to the story line. Heck, somewhere through the middle I think I even hear what I assume to be an intentional nod to the SFAM Overture...just a "blink and you'll miss it" chord progression, but I always assumed it was an intentional nod.
As far as ranking the songs, I would also put NC near the bottom. But I seem to be in the minority in thinking that the middle portion of the album is the sweet spot. That section of The Mind's Eye thru Deathless is nothing but pure fire.
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1. Visions
2. Shapeshifter
3. Insomnia
4. Portals
5. Deathless
6. The Mind's Eye
7. Premonition
8. Nocturnal Conspiracy
I'm curious how popular or unpopular of an opinion this ranking is.
I'd say putting Nocturnal Conspiracy at the bottom is a bit of a hot take. I think the typical ranking for that song is in the top three on the album. I'd have it at #2. But Visions at the top is par for the course (and well-deserved, in my opinion).
Count me in the minority as well, then. Nocturnal Conspiracy is incredibly boring and doesn't really play to any of the band's strengths.
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Copy that.
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... But I seem to be in the minority in thinking that the middle portion of the album is the sweet spot. That section of The Mind's Eye thru Deathless is nothing but pure fire.
Agreed, but I would add Insomnia to that portion. Also I think Premonition is really nice. Relatively speaking, NC and Visions are my less favorites from the album.
Canary Yellow is a really good song, it has that great atmosphere and some eletronics sounds like Earthlings and Red Giant.
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... But I seem to be in the minority in thinking that the middle portion of the album is the sweet spot. That section of The Mind's Eye thru Deathless is nothing but pure fire.
Agreed, but I would add Insomnia to that portion. Also I think Premonition is really nice. Relatively speaking, NC and Visions are my less favorites from the album.
Canary Yellow is a really good song, it has that great atmosphere and some eletronics sounds like Earthlings and Red Giant.
Completely with you on all of this.
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Another question for the "in the know crowd". Without spoilers, would you say Virus answers questions about the CK story? Or just stays ambiguous and creates more questions?
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Listening to Haken for the first time, I thought Visions was a great album. Now I've listened to Aquarius, and I'm surprised at how much better it is than Visions (although this may just be recency bias). Visions was great, but this album is amazing. Every single song is of such a high quality. It's possible I'll end up thinking The Mountain, Affinity, and/or Vector are better, but I wouldn't be surprised if by the end of my marathon, that I'd say Aquarius is the most consistent album of them all. Like with Visions, ranking all of these songs is going to be quite tough. In fact, everything but the bottom two could easily change with just another listen, because most of these songs are just about equally great.
1. Celestial Elixir
2. Eternal Rain
3. Aquarium
4. Drowning in the Flood
5. The Point of No Return
6. Sun
7. Streams
Funny thing is, after finishing The Point of No Return, I thought that it would easily be my #1... But look how that turned out! Like before, I'm curious if this ranking is particularly popular or unpopular or whatever. At this point, I'm very excited to see what's in store for me with these next three albums (and one EP). Next is The Mountain, which from what I can tell is the fan-favorite, so I hope I really enjoy it!
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Streams at the bottom is an incredibly controversial choice, but fair enough.
My ranking would be:
#1. Celestial Elixir
#2. Streams
#3. Point Of No Return
#4. Aquarium
#5. Eternal Rain
#6. Sun
#7. Drowning In The Flood
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Another question for the "in the know crowd". Without spoilers, would you say Virus answers questions about the CK story? Or just stays ambiguous and creates more questions?
The promo copy doesn't include the lyrics, unfortunately. With English not being my first language, it's sometimes hard to understand everything. But I'd say it answers some things. Messiah Complex closes a lot of open circles.
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Aquarius is the most consistent album of them all.
Even after 10 years I can still confidently say that Aquarius is my favourite Haken album. It might not be as 'polished' as Affinity or Vector, but it has this youthful experimentalism that none of the other albums have ever truly replicated for me. Plus it was my first experience with them, and I count myself to be very lucky to have seen them and followed them from Aquarius' release onwards.
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Aquarius is the most consistent album of them all.
Even after 10 years I can still confidently say that Aquarius is my favourite Haken album. It might not be as 'polished' as Affinity or Vector, but it has this youthful experimentalism that none of the other albums have ever truly replicated for me. Plus it was my first experience with them, and I count myself to be very lucky to have seen them and followed them from Aquarius' release onwards.
I know what you mean, regarding Aquarius. It sounds like a band just making music they want to and trying any and everything.
The last three albums (new one included) all had lead singles that sound a bit too contrived and generic, almost like they intentionally tried to write something short and catchy to expand their fanbase. Fortunately, the rest of both Affinity and Veil were both mostly a lot better than those lead singles, and I suspect the same will apply to Virus, but it's a slight bummer knowing that this will be the 3rd album in a row for me that I will be skipping the first proper song, especially since this is the same band that once kicked our ass from the start with openers like Point of No Return and The Path/Atlas Stone.
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I'm not seeing it with Initiate. I will say that it is by far the weakest song on Affinity, but I don't see it as contrived. I don't even see it as catchy. If anything, it's kindof jarring, which is exactly what made it a strange choice as both a single and an album opener.
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BTW, at least the promo copy version has the last song as separated tracks.
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The last three albums (new one included) all had lead singles that sound a bit too contrived and generic, almost like they intentionally tried to write something short and catchy to expand their fanbase. Fortunately, the rest of both Affinity and Veil were both mostly a lot better than those lead singles, and I suspect the same will apply to Virus, but it's a slight bummer knowing that this will be the 3rd album in a row for me that I will be skipping the first proper song, especially since this is the same band that once kicked our ass from the start with openers like Point of No Return and The Path/Atlas Stone.
I share these feelings 100%. When Initiate was released as a single, I was a bit worried about the upcoming album. But not only did Affinity deliver, Architect and Bound by Gravity gave additional depth to Initiate by expanding on it. The same can't be said for Good Doctor, though.
However, I like it when albums start with a catchy song and get deeper over their runtime. Helps me to get into the mood for an album. I just prefer singles to be more representative, Puzzle Box was a great choice IMO.
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To be honest, I'm not sure any of the songs on Virus could be called particularly representative (other than being guitar-driven, like Vector was), which I guess does support the band's press release statement that the album is eclectic.
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I feel compelled to defend Initiate and to say that it's really catchy and inspired, in my opinion, and I would go as far as to say it's my favourite song on Affinity.
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I feel compelled to defend Initiate and to say that it's really catchy and inspired, in my opinion, and I would go as far as to say it's my favourite song on Affinity.
Don't spill the beans all at once. When you want to defend it, start a little lower, like saying something along the lines of: 'it's better than affinity.exe, so therefore, it's definitely not the worst on the album'! Save the 'it's my favourite' as a last resort :)
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Aquarius is the most consistent album of them all.
Even after 10 years I can still confidently say that Aquarius is my favourite Haken album. It might not be as 'polished' as Affinity or Vector, but it has this youthful experimentalism that none of the other albums have ever truly replicated for me. Plus it was my first experience with them, and I count myself to be very lucky to have seen them and followed them from Aquarius' release onwards.
I agree with this overall take on Aquarius, and come very close to saying it's my favorite Haken album (I think I would choose The Mountain with a gun put to my head, but it's very, very close).
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BTW, at least the promo copy version has the last song as separated tracks.
Can you disclose whether the movements of Messiah Complex flow into each other seamlessly?
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BTW, at least the promo copy version has the last song as separated tracks.
Can you disclose whether the movements of Messiah Complex flow into each other seamlessly?
TOTALLY!!! And they do it pretty well.
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BTW, at least the promo copy version has the last song as separated tracks.
Can you disclose whether the movements of Messiah Complex flow into each other seamlessly?
TOTALLY!!! And they do it pretty well.
Awesome :D
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Initiate is definitely in my top 10 Haken songs, I never understood why it wasn’t more hyped when it came out and still isn’t really now. The melodies are so strong on that song!
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BTW, at least the promo copy version has the last song as separated tracks.
Can you disclose whether the movements of Messiah Complex flow into each other seamlessly?
TOTALLY!!! And they do it pretty well.
Awesome :D
Messiah Complex only works with all the parts. Playing one of the separate tracks would make no sense... I'm never a fan of splitting up songs into separate tracks, so I programmed a single track out of it :D
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Hm, does it also connect into Only Stars?
If not, I'm curious to find out what Only Stars actually is when the album drops.
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Hm, does it also connect into Only Stars?
If not, I'm curious to find out what Only Stars actually is when the album drops.
Only Stars is its own thing, and is a sort of epilogue in the same way Clear was a prologue (except that it has vocals).
As for Messiah Complex, the tracks do all merge from one to the next, but personally I think it's good broken up as apart from the last track reprising the first, each track is different musically. Hence my previous comparisons to Spock's Beard's Healing Colours of Sound.
Also worth nothing that The Strain transitions smoothly into Canary Yellow as well.
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Initiate is definitely in my top 10 Haken songs, I never understood why it wasn’t more hyped when it came out and still isn’t really now. The melodies are so strong on that song!
It's not a top 10 songs for me but I really don't get the 'hate' for this song. Strong melodies and at the very least a great album opener which it representative for the album as a whole.
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Initiate is definitely in my top 10 Haken songs, I never understood why it wasn’t more hyped when it came out and still isn’t really now. The melodies are so strong on that song!
It's not a top 10 songs for me but I really don't get the 'hate' for this song. Strong melodies and at the very least a great album opener which it representative for the album as a whole.
My issue with it as a lead single is how it "just ends" unresolved. Architect and Bound by Gravity round it up beautifully, but as a single without the context of the album it appears underdeveloped.
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The Initiate reprise in The Architect is one of my favorite things. What a payoff to end the near-perfect first 3 sections.
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I think Initiate works fine for what it is. It doesn't have the epic scope of The Architect or Bound By Gravity, but I don't think it really needs to. It's a nice little song with a (relatively) simple structure. It has some beautiful moments (2nd verse, outro), some heavy moments (1st part of bridge), & some proggy moments (intro, chorus), & I think all of those elements get the listener excited for the album without making anything after it feel underwhelming. It's the perfect opener & lead single imo. :tup
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I think Initiate works fine for what it is. It doesn't have the epic scope of The Architect or Bound By Gravity, but I don't think it really needs to. It's a nice little song with a (relatively) simple structure. It has some beautiful moments (2nd verse, outro), some heavy moments (1st part of bridge), & some proggy moments (intro, chorus), & I think all of those elements get the listener excited for the album without making anything after it feel underwhelming. It's the perfect opener & lead single imo. :tup
I feel the same way. It gets better in the context of the whole album too, with the two reprises in The Architect and Bound by Gravity.
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It works better as an "Overture" than as a standalone song. But that's exactly why I thought it was weird as a lead off single.
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At this point I can pretty assuredly say I won't be able to do a proper review anywhere, so I'll share some Virus thoughts here.
-My biggest overall takeaway is how much more accessible Vector is compared to Virus, despite their similarities. Prosthetic is easily the most "single" like song, and even that features some pretty odd vocal lines. Vector had Good Doctor, Puzzle Box, Nil By Mouth, A Cell Divides, and hell, even Veil, all of which had a pretty high immediate impact. It took a lot more listens for the Virus material to sink in.
-I like the balance they struck in references to Vector and Cockroach King. A few obvious ones and a decent number of more subtle ones, but the references don't beat you over the head or overstay their welcome.
-I'm still not sure if this will be my favorite or least favorite album vocally. Lots of new things tried on that front, it seems like they really tried some change ups on the vocal delivery.
-Overall I really enjoy the record, and for better or worse I end up finding it very consistent, but without much on the top end as a result. Carousel is my favorite track and yet I don't think it'll break into my top 5 Haken songs. I don't feel anyone was particularly poor or left out on this album and yet I don't know if I'd say this was anyone's best album.
-After the heaviness and guitar onslaught that was Vector I definitely loved that this was a bit more metered. It keeps the darker and heavier tone for the most part, but definitely showcases a more clear and organic diversity in its delivery.
On another note, for those unaware Haken have been doing a "Quiz Night" on twitch every Sunday at 1pm ET. This Friday (at the same time I believe) they are going a special stream for Canary Yellow. Probably would be cool to catch that, but you definitely want to catch this Sunday's quiz!
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Here are two quote from the album press release which some of us here might find interesting: Number one: "Longtime Haken collaborators, Blacklake, have designed the visuals and artwork with a stark black viral bacteriophage against an arresting yellow background; the mustard to Vector’s ketchup. Guitarist Charlie Griffiths says, “working with Mark at Blacklake is always so rewarding and creative. As a band, we have a lot of ideas on how we can put the album’s message across visually, but he always comes back with something beyond what we had imagined. When I told him the initial concept was based around a catatonic, institutionalised patient in the 1950s, he revealed that he actually studied psychology at university, so he was able to use that knowledge to make the artwork and booklet reflect in a more interesting and compelling way than I could have imagined. With ‘Virus’, the timeline jumps 20 years ahead, so the artwork portrays an infected, decayed time capsule of the events which have happened since we last visited Mountview Institution”." And number two is: "The first five songs on the album are shorter in structure and each draw on a different aesthetic from the Haken sonic palette and the closing track conclusively bookends the overall arc. The crown jewel of the album is perhaps the 17-minute ‘Messiah Complex’, presented as a five part suite which explicitly and unapologetically references ‘The Mountain’ era’s source material; with a familiar, yet twisted reprise of a Gentle Giant-style a cappella vocal counterpoint, as well as plenty more Easter eggs to discover. Bassist Conner Green explains, “I think this is the most ambitious and challenging Haken song to date, but it came together seamlessly once we were all together on the Devin tour. After we played our support slot each night, we were eager to congregate in the bus lounge (which we had fashioned into a makeshift recording studio). We spent almost every night perfecting the song arrangements, vocal lines and lyrics. It was an exciting and inspiring process, which I think made for an especially cohesive album”."
Please mind the bolded sections.
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Cool.
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With every bit of into you guys keep posting, the more excited I get. Keep it coming!
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Can't wait till June.
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Well, you have to :)
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I listened to The Mountain just now. I don't even know how to describe this one, but it's yet another great album. I'm having a hard time deciding whether or not it's better than Aquarius, but I suppose time will tell. Well, onto the rankings (which, much like Aquarius, could end up quite different upon a second listen):
1. Falling Back to Earth
2. Somebody
3. Pareidolia
4. Cockroach King
5. Atlas Stone
6. In Memoriam
7. As Death Embraces
8. The Path
9. Because It's There
As usual, I'm curious on how popular or unpopular my rankings might be. From what I can tell, Cockroach King and Falling Back to Earth seem to be the fan-favorites for this album, and I think they deserve it. Anyway, I'm quite impressed; three whole albums and there's not a single song I dislike so far! Although if I'm being honest, Because It's There may end up as my least favorite Haken song out of them all... but that aside, these guys are really good, and I'm glad I finally decided to start checking them out. Next up is Restoration, which from what I've heard has what's considered by a lot of people to be the best Haken song of them all.
On a side note, I also decided to check out the Virus single "Prosthetic", and I really like that song!
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Cockroach King is this divisive song which a lot of folks enjoy, but some can't stand.
Falling Back to Earth is usually the #1 track, often followed by Pareidolia and Atlas Stone.
Somebody at #2 is probably the most controversial thing about your rankings.
For comparison's sake, here's the results from the Haken Survivor in 2013/2014/2015/2016
2013:
1. Falling Back to Earth
2. Atlas Stone
3. Pareidolia
4. Because It's There
5. In Memoriam
6. Cockroach King
7. Somebody
8. As Death Embraces
9. The Path
2014:
1. Falling Back to Earth
2. Pareidolia
3. Atlas Stone
4. Cockroach King
5. In Memoriam
6. Because It's There
7. The Path
8. Somebody
9. As Death Embraces
2015:
1. Falling Back to Earth
2. Pareidolia
3. Cockroach King
4. Atlas Stone
5. In Memoriam
6. Because It's There
Somebody
8. The Path
9. As Death Embraces
2016:
1. Falling Back to Earth
Pareidolia
3. Atlas Stone
4. Cockroach King
5. In Memoriam
6. Because It's There
7. As Death Embraces
8. Somebody
9. The Path
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I have very mixed feelings about The Mountain, so take this with a mountain (heh) of salt, but here's my ranking:
#1. Somebody
#2. Atlas Stone
#3. Falling Back To Earth
#4. Because It's There
#5. Cockroach King
#6. Pareidolia
#7. The Path
#8. In Memoriam
#9. As Death Embraces
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I'm having a hard time deciding whether or not it's better than Aquarius, but I suppose time will tell.
Good luck with that. After several years, I still can't decide between Aquarius, Mountain and Affinity.
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I'm having a hard time deciding whether or not it's better than Aquarius, but I suppose time will tell.
Good luck with that. After several years, I still can't decide between Aquarius, Mountain and Affinity.
I had the same problem when Affinity wasn't out yet. The Mountain and Aquarius are on one level for me, although they are very, very different.
The Affinity came out and became my favourite album of the band.
three whole albums and there's not a single song I dislike so far! Although if I'm being honest, Because It's There may end up as my least favorite Haken song out of them all... but that aside, these guys are really good, and I'm glad I finally decided to start checking them out. Next up is Restoration, which from what I've heard has what's considered by a lot of people to be the best Haken song of them all.
I know all albums and there still is not one song by Haken which I don't like.
Because It's There is beautiful in my opinion. It has that very unique sounding choir and a great melody. And a bass solo. And electronic drum samples! There is so much going on in this song, although it's "only" a ballad!
Crystallised is amazing, but not my favourite Haken track. That would be The Architect. Jesus, you don't know Affinity yet! I can't imagine the world before I got to know Affinity :lol Easily one of my favourite prog albums of all time.
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I know all albums and there still is not one song by Haken which I don't like.
Because It's There is beautiful in my opinion. It has that very unique sounding choir and a great melody. And a bass solo. And electronic drum samples! There is so much going on in this song, although it's "only" a ballad!
Crystallised is amazing, but not my favourite Haken track. That would be The Architect. Jesus, you don't know Affinity yet! I can't imagine the world before I got to know Affinity :lol Easily one of my favourite prog albums of all time.
I've heard great things about Affinity. From what I can tell, it's the fan-favorite alongside The Mountain. I think Affinity's actually the album I'm most excited for, so here's hoping I love that one!
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The Affinity came out and became my favourite album of the band.
Seems like we have a similar taste regarding Haken.
You have heard Virus, right? Where do you rank that?
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I know all albums and there still is not one song by Haken which I don't like.
Because It's There is beautiful in my opinion. It has that very unique sounding choir and a great melody. And a bass solo. And electronic drum samples! There is so much going on in this song, although it's "only" a ballad!
Crystallised is amazing, but not my favourite Haken track. That would be The Architect. Jesus, you don't know Affinity yet! I can't imagine the world before I got to know Affinity :lol Easily one of my favourite prog albums of all time.
I've heard great things about Affinity. From what I can tell, it's the fan-favorite alongside The Mountain. I think Affinity's actually the album I'm most excited for, so here's hoping I love that one!
They're becoming more technical with that one, that's not everybody's thing. I personally love that.
The Affinity came out and became my favourite album of the band.
Seems like we have a similar taste regarding Haken.
You have heard Virus, right? Where do you rank that?
Yes- but I don't dare to "finally" rank it yet ;) I think there is still so much more to discover (especially when I read the lyrics).
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My rankings for The Mountain
1. Falling Back to Earth
2. Because It’s There
3. Cockroach King
4. Atlas Stone
5. In Memoriam
6. Pareidolia
7. Somebody
8. The Path
9. As Death Embraces
But honestly, those top 6 are nearly untouchable and often shuffle around a bit.
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The Mountain is my favourite Haken album, I guess I'd rank it this way:
1. In Memoriam
2. Cockroach King
3. Falling Back To Earth
4. Because It's There
5. Atlas Stone
6. Pareidolia
7. Somebody
8. The Path
9. As Death Embraces
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Guys... I'm so excited for Virus. xD
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So the plan was to listen to Restoration, since that was Haken's next release after The Mountain. However, I reeaaally wanted to listen to Affinity, so I decided to listen to that instead. I'll say that after one listen, I would not call it my favorite Haken album. There's a couple songs or so that I thought were just okay. HOWEVER! This has without a doubt two of their best songs so far. They're better than Visions, better than Celestial Elixir, and perhaps even better than my favorites on The Mountain. I like the style they went for with this album. Sometimes that style doesn't do much, but sometimes it works out perfectly. Onto the rankings, which it was really hard not making #1 a tie...
1. The Architect
2. Bound By Gravity
3. The Endless Knot
4. Lapse
5. 1985
6. Earthrise
7. Initiate
8. Red Giant
9. affinity.exe
I get the feeling this list is a somewhat popular opinion, but who knows, perhaps there's a bunch of Red Giant fans who are waiting to ambush me or something! I think this album will grow on me a lot, but for now, I'd probably put this at the bottom of my Haken album rankings. That being said, it's still a good album and I will definitely be revisiting it. Next up is Restoration, for real this time.
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My ranking is almost identical to that, but with Initiate & Lapse switched. :lol
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It’s a good order, but then Red Giant so “low”... my guess is you’ll never stop reordering these it’s such a good album.
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My ranking is very different, with Red Giant and Earthrise right near the top and The Architect at the bottom.
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Alright, so the more I binge Virus the more I think this is their most cohesive work to date. It may take a good number of spins to process, but now I have a hard time imagining most songs as independent pieces. It flows together really well and feels like a full album. Having no real low points or songs I dislike helps in that regard. That being said I am giving "Only Stars" a bit of a pass as it's kinda a epilogue to Vector/Virus, but I really don't find much value in it on its own. I'd say "Clear" does a much better job opening the saga then that song does closing it.
Don't forget, 1pm ET/6pm UK is the Canary Yellow twitch stream today.
And more importantly.
SUNDAY SUNDAY SUNDAY
Same time, quiz night, with what promises to be the best quizmaster yet.
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Btw, my guess for what the third single will be is The Strain. (simply because of its length)
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Alright, so the more I binge Virus the more I think this is their most cohesive work to date. It may take a good number of spins to process, but now I have a hard time imagining most songs as independent pieces. It flows together really well and feels like a full album. Having no real low points or songs I dislike helps in that regard. That being said I am giving "Only Stars" a bit of a pass as it's kinda a epilogue to Vector/Virus, but I really don't find much value in it on its own. I'd say "Clear" does a much better job opening the saga then that song does closing it.
Don't forget, 1pm ET/6pm UK is the Canary Yellow twitch stream today.
And more importantly.
SUNDAY SUNDAY SUNDAY
Same time, quiz night, with what promises to be the best quizmaster yet.
It's happened with me too. Repeated listens gave me a better appreciation of the album. (I liked it from the beginning but now I like it even more)
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Twitch stream. 1pm Eastern, 6pm UK. Make sure you JUST DO IT. #LeBuef #SpellingProbablyWrong
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An informative Interview with Ross is up on YouTube by Sonic Perspectives. Several spoilers regarding Virus.
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Here's something that occured to me: If you take a look at the back cover of Virus (which is here: https://www.amazon.de/Virus-Standard-CD-Jewelcase-Haken/dp/B086PNTJRV/ref=sr_1_1?__mk_de_DE=%C3%85M%C3%85%C5%BD%C3%95%C3%91&keywords=haken+virus&qid=1589191524&s=music&sr=1-1), you can clearly see the album consisting of seven pieces (as Vector was). Now, are there 11 tracks on your CDs (those who were able to review it, ariich and others) or 7?
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Here's something that occured to me: If you take a look at the back cover of Virus (which is here: https://www.amazon.de/Virus-Standard-CD-Jewelcase-Haken/dp/B086PNTJRV/ref=sr_1_1?__mk_de_DE=%C3%85M%C3%85%C5%BD%C3%95%C3%91&keywords=haken+virus&qid=1589191524&s=music&sr=1-1), you can clearly see the album consisting of seven pieces (as Vector was). Now, are there 11 tracks on your CDs (those who were able to review it, ariich and others) or 7?
11. Messiah Complex is split into 5 tracks, but it's still one song to me. As mentioned, I already programmed a one-track-version of the song ;)
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Here we have another fairly newish review: http://tuonelamagazine.com/review-haken-virus/
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https://www.velvetthunder.co.uk/haken-virus-insideout-2020/
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I listened to the Restoration EP just now. It's... my least favorite Haken release so far. It's certainly good, but all of their other releases are a lot better. These are merely first impressions, though, so it's possible that this one will really grow on me, and perhaps even become my favorite Haken release. And since there's only three songs, I'll give my thoughts on each one since it shouldn't take too long.
Darkest Light is #3; I admit that for some reason, I had a hard time staying focused. This isn't the fault of the song, this is just a problem I tend to have when listening to new music. It was still good from what I remember, but that being said, I can't recall anything particularly interesting outside of the intro.
Earthlings is #2. I really like the atmosphere in this song. I can definitely see this one growing on me a lot. I'm not sure what else to say about it for the time being, but it's a very good song.
And #1 is, well, Crystallized. I've seen a lot of people say that this is Haken's greatest song. And I can definitely see why after hearing it only once! That being said, it's not my favorite. It's in my Top 10 Haken songs for sure, but at least as of right now, I wouldn't call it my most favorite of them all. There's nothing really wrong with Crystallized, but I feel like there's a couple parts that should have been shortened or removed, like the acappella section in the middle of the song. I don't mean that the song is too long, I just feel like there were a couple sections that didn't necessarily fit with the song. Like... imagine if you inserted part of BTBAM's "Medicine Wheel" right before The Crimson Sunset in A Change of Seasons; it'd sound really nice, but it wouldn't work. Small criticism aside, amazing song! It's easy to see why it's considered their best song yet.
Well, only one album left to go (until Virus releases, that is). From what I can tell, Vector tends to be a lot of people's least favorite Haken album, but I hope I enjoy it regardless, as I've been really looking forward to this one lately. Coincidentally or not, my favorite albums happen to be the unpopular ones (for instance, my favorite Dream Theater album is BC&SL), so maybe this might end up being my favorite?
Also, as a side-note, ever since I gave my impressions on Affinity, it has grown on me quite a bit, and I love just about everything on it... except Red Giant, that one's still my least favorite.
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Clutching my pearls at the very notion of removing the acappella section of Crytsallized. Possibly my 2nd favorite all time Haken moment (#1 is the key change in the second half of Drowning in the Flood)
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Crystallised is in my bottom 10-15 Haken songs, mostly because it's so bloated and pretentious. As far as 'songs' go Haken have done so much better. I never have the urge to listen to the track and seeing it live was quite underwhelming. That does not mean the song doesn't contain good parts - the a cappella section is great, as is the chorus reprise thing at the end - and this write-up makes it look terrible, which it certainly isn't. There's just too much prog bullshit and needless wankery in the song for me to really consider it among Haken's top songs.
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restoration is interesting because they actively made two of the songs worse and the third one they picked is still somehow weaker than the other two despite being the only one improved
it's their most pointless release for sure
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I was one of those people that had the demo for a very long time before Restoration came out.
I would not say that they made them “worse“. They are just different takes on the same idea. When I first heard them, they were parts I liked better and parts that I didn’t like as much. However I adored Crystalized right away and I still do. I think it’s their best song, but it looks like I’m in the minority. Earthlings took a long time to grow on me, but now I do think I like it better than the original. However I do think that the original Blind is quite a bit better than Darkest Light.
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Count me among those who do not quite get the craze about Crystallised. I like the song, but I like a lot of their other songs better. Also, it's disappointing that it seems like they prefer to rotate between it and Visions when they decide to play a long epic, and neglect Celestial Elixir (which is my #1 Haken song).
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Look at all this blasphemy. Crystallized is one of Haken's best songs.
I probably still have Celestial Elixir as my number one too, though.
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Crystallised is an acquired taste. If you don't like it, acquire some taste. :lol :rollin :lol
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Crystallised is fine, but it's far from Haken's best IMO. Most sections are themselves excellent, but it becomes increasingly incoherent as it goes on, even more so than the original Snow.
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Crystallised is good but yes, a meandering listen in a couple of spots. Still for the aspects of their style on display it’s peak Haken.
Restoration cover art is fantastic.
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Crystallised is fine, but it's far from Haken's best IMO. Most sections are themselves excellent, but it becomes increasingly incoherent as it goes on, even more so than the original Snow.
Hear hear.
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hey hey, psst
1985 is their best song
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Look at all this blasphemy. Crystallized is one of Haken's best songs.
I probably still have Celestial Elixir as my number one too, though.
I agree! Celestial Elixir is my favorite song of theirs, Crystalized is a close second for me. I love every part of it!
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Crystallized took some time to grow on me, but I feel it is one of their best songs now. Not as great as Visions or Celestial Elixir when it comes to "sidelong epics," but still pretty great. It flows really well and doesn't feel as long as it is, which is not always easy to pull off with a song that long.
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I've done it, I've listened to all the Haken albums! Well, unless you count the demos from 2007-2008, in which case, I will probably get to them around the time that I finally take the time to listen to the Falling Into Infinity demos (so basically, it'll probably never happen). Well, anyway, the last album was Vector. I know I've said this for at least the past two albums, but I can see this one really growing on me. That being said, I quite like this album. All things considered, I think it left a stronger impression than Affinity initially did. I get the feeling my rankings for this one will be particularly controversial... so please feel free to prove me right or prove me wrong.
1. Nil By Mouth
2. Veil
3. Host
4. The Good Doctor
5. A Cell Divides
6. Puzzle Box
7. Clear
I've seen Nil By Mouth compared to The Dance of Eternity before... And after listening to it, I just have one thing to say:
Nil By Mouth is way better than The Dance of Eternity. OK, that's an exaggeration, I do really like The Dance of Eternity, but if I had to choose between the two, I'd actually say Nil By Mouth is the better song (even if I've only heard it once).
Well, now that I've listened to all the albums (and the Restoration EP), I'll give my album rankings as of right now:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Aquarius
4. Vector
5. Visions
6. Restoration
I'm very excited for Virus, especially for Messiah Complex. With a title like that, my expectations might be a little too high, but I imagine I'll enjoy it on some level! I'm glad I finally decided to listen to Haken after all this time, every album they've put out is very good.
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Look at all this blasphemy. Crystallized is one of Haken's best songs.
I probably still have Celestial Elixir as my number one too, though.
This and this.
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Here's my silly ranking for Vector:
1. Puzzle Box
2. A Cell Divides
3. Host
4. The Good Doctor
5. Nil by Mouth
6. Veil
(7. Clear)
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I am not excited about Haken that much anymore, but I post my Vector ranking too.
1. Puzzle Box
2. Nil By Mouth
3. The Good Doctor
4. Host
5. A Cell Divides
6. Veil
7. Clear
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#1. Puzzle Box
#2. Host
#3. Veil
#4. A Cell Divides
#5. The Good Doctor
#6. Nil By Mouth
#7. Clear
I think this album is really underrated among people I talk to. I love it for how dense & hard-hitting it is, but Host is a beautiful contrast to the rest of the album & is imho one of Haken's most emotionally moving songs. That said, & I love all my top 5 songs from this album, & the order could change at any minute. Vector is so good & I'm so hyped for Virus being a sequel to it. :metal
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1. A Cell Divides
2. Puzzle Box
3. The Good Doctor
4. Veil
5. Nil By Mouth
6. Host
7. Clear
Positions 3-6 are all very closely matched, not a lot to choose between them. Pretty consistent album really, but still my least favourite of theirs.
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#1. Puzzle Box
#2. Host
#3. Veil
#4. A Cell Divides
#5. The Good Doctor
#6. Nil By Mouth
#7. Clear
This is pretty much my rating, although I think I might swap Nil by Mouth and Clear.
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Can't decide between Puzzle Box and Host for my top 2.
1= Puzzle Box
1= Host
3. The Good Doctor
4. Veil
5. Nil By Mouth
6. A Cell Divides
7. Clear
Also, now that reviews are publishing so I can't spoil anything, I might put together some thoughts on Virus.
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Vector
1. The Good Doctor
2. Veil
3. Nil By Mouth
4. Puzzle Box
5. A Cell Divides
6. Clear
7. Host
A Cell Divides would have likely been higher prior to seeing it live, just wasn't as good in that setting as it was on the album.
Albums
1. The Mountain
2. Aquarius
2. Virus
4. Affinity
4. Vector
6. Visions
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Invasion, coming this Friday!
-Marc.
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Invasion, coming this Friday!
-Marc.
Nice, my favourite on the album and one of my favourite Haken songs already.
Ranking Virus is actually quite hard because, similar to The Mountain and Affinity, it works so well as an album and each song brings something a bit different. I didn't feel this way at the start, I think because the general sound is a clear follow-on from Vector, but over time the album has grown on me more and more, and I now understand why they've been describing it as eclectic. While it's not my favourite Haken album, I do actually think it's their most consistent (for my tastes anyway).
I can probably choose a top 3, which I think would be:
1. Invasion
2. The Strain
3. Messiah Complex
Everything else I like pretty equally, and that's a lot.
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RE: The Crystallized discussion -- it's one of my favorite Haken tracks for sure, but I understand the criticism of the meandering nature of the song. It definitely isn't as cohesive as some of their other works, but I just absolutely adore so many different sections - the intro, the a capella section, the reprise at the end that segues into the beautiful melodic close... an example of the individual pieces being greater than the sum of their parts, but still an awesome song overall.
Also, jammindude, we share the same favorite Haken moment. Drowning in the Flood's key change is just something else.
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Drowning in the Flood's key change is just something else.
When is the key change? I'm not very good with musical terminology...
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Drowning in the Flood's key change is just something else.
When is the key change? I'm not very good with musical terminology...
That moment when they repeat the chorus and the vocals remain the the same key, and the music switches down a key...thus changing the harmony completely. Brilliant moment.
Are there other examples of this in prog rock/metal that I just never noticed before? Because it’s extremely effective at inducing goosebumps.
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Invasion, coming this Friday!
-Marc.
Nice, my favourite on the album and one of my favourite Haken songs already.
Ranking Virus is actually quite hard because, similar to The Mountain and Affinity, it works so well as an album and each song brings something a bit different. I didn't feel this way at the start, I think because the general sound is a clear follow-on from Vector, but over time the album has grown on me more and more, and I now understand why they've been describing it as eclectic. While it's not my favourite Haken album, I do actually think it's their most consistent (for my tastes anyway).
I can probably choose a top 3, which I think would be:
1. Invasion
2. The Strain
3. Messiah Complex
Everything else I like pretty equally, and that's a lot.
I know Carousel is my favorite, but after that it gets tougher. The Strain is probably #2.
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Single no. 3 will be released this Friday and it will apparently be Invasion, see here:https://www.facebook.com/102787549743/posts/10158582572794744?sfns=mo
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Single no. 3 will be released this Friday and it will apparently be Invasion, see here:https://www.facebook.com/102787549743/posts/10158582572794744?sfns=mo
Invasion, coming this Friday!
-Marc.
;)
Looking forward to this! New Haken single and Rise Radiant by Caligula's Horse on the same day, gonna be a good Friday for sure
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Single no. 3 will be released this Friday and it will apparently be Invasion, see here:https://www.facebook.com/102787549743/posts/10158582572794744?sfns=mo
Can't wait! I've really liked the last two singles and considering this one seems to be getting high praise from those who have already heard it, I'm extra excited. :metal
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Single no. 3 will be released this Friday and it will apparently be Invasion, see here:https://www.facebook.com/102787549743/posts/10158582572794744?sfns=mo
Can't wait! I've really liked the last two singles and considering this one seems to be getting high praise from those who have already heard it, I'm extra excited. :metal
I'm neutral about it. (or not emotional anyway)
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Drowning in the Flood's key change is just something else.
When is the key change? I'm not very good with musical terminology...
That moment when they repeat the chorus and the vocals remain the the same key, and the music switches down a key...thus changing the harmony completely. Brilliant moment.
Are there other examples of this in prog rock/metal that I just never noticed before? Because it’s extremely effective at inducing goosebumps.
Okay, so I was really scratching my head over this since I never heard a really prominent key change in this track at all. I'm assuming you mean the final section of the song where they go
'Will we live to tell the tale?
Is it worth the price we paid?
Are we praying for the sun?
Or are we drowning in the flood?'
So I specifically went out of my way to analyse what is happening there and I don't think you could theoretically call this a key change at all, but it does work. Sorry for maybe coming off as an ass, but I wanted to check it out, so here goes:
What's happening is in the first repetition of the lines (sung the exact same way every time on G#-F#G#-F#-G#-A - G#), the chords underneath the vocals alternate between A major and F# minor, last word of every line hitting that 9th (G#) of the F# minor. Then when the backing vocals go 'Drowning in the Flood' after the first repetition the chords change to C# major, A major, C# major and F# minor (repeated twice). The vocal melody stays the same because it works fine, the G# now becomes a major 7th over A major chord and stays a ninth on the F# minor.
In chord symbols it would look like this:
A | F#m | A | F#m (x2 for first repetition)
C# | A | C# | F#m (x2 for second repetition of lyrics)
A | F#m | C# | C# (coda)
And this works, because the chords in the second repetition are a third apart from the chords in the first one. Technically, all of this could be analysed as being in F# minor, with the A being the relative major of that key and the C# the dominant chord.
But yeah, it's a cool switch there nonetheless :)
EDIT Addition: But yes, I can also understand why one could hear this as a key change, because you theoretically analyse the first half as being in A major, with chords alternating between the I and the vi chord, but the second part is so clearly in F# minor, so from a theoretical standpoint I think personally it would make more sense to view both parts as being in F#m, but hey. The chord switch works, who cares about the background and the why, right?
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Actually, that was a really cool explanation! Thank you! You even acknowledge how it could sound like a “key change” to the layman, but the explanation of how it’s technically not is kinda interesting.
:tup
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Drowning in the Flood's key change is just something else.
When is the key change? I'm not very good with musical terminology...
That moment when they repeat the chorus and the vocals remain the the same key, and the music switches down a key...thus changing the harmony completely. Brilliant moment.
Are there other examples of this in prog rock/metal that I just never noticed before? Because it’s extremely effective at inducing goosebumps.
Okay, so I was really scratching my head over this since I never heard a really prominent key change in this track at all. I'm assuming you mean the final section of the song where they go
'Will we live to tell the tale?
Is it worth the price we paid?
Are we praying for the sun?
Or are we drowning in the flood?'
So I specifically went out of my way to analyse what is happening there and I don't think you could theoretically call this a key change at all, but it does work. Sorry for maybe coming off as an ass, but I wanted to check it out, so here goes:
What's happening is in the first repetition of the lines (sung the exact same way every time on G#-F#G#-F#-G#-A - G#), the chords underneath the vocals alternate between A major and F# minor, last word of every line hitting that 9th (G#) of the F# minor. Then when the backing vocals go 'Drowning in the Flood' after the first repetition the chords change to C# major, A major, C# major and F# minor (repeated twice). The vocal melody stays the same because it works fine, the G# now becomes a major 7th over A major chord and stays a ninth on the F# minor.
In chord symbols it would look like this:
A | F#m | A | F#m (x2 for first repetition)
C# | A | C# | F#m (x2 for second repetition of lyrics)
A | F#m | C# | C# (coda)
And this works, because the chords in the second repetition are a third apart from the chords in the first one. Technically, all of this could be analysed as being in F# minor, with the A being the relative major of that key and the C# the dominant chord.
But yeah, it's a cool switch there nonetheless :)
EDIT Addition: But yes, I can also understand why one could hear this as a key change, because you theoretically analyse the first half as being in A major, with chords alternating between the I and the vi chord, but the second part is so clearly in F# minor, so from a theoretical standpoint I think personally it would make more sense to view both parts as being in F#m, but hey. The chord switch works, who cares about the background and the why, right?
I love the breakdown! Now I want to go back and listen to the song again.
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Drowning in the Flood's key change is just something else.
When is the key change? I'm not very good with musical terminology...
That moment when they repeat the chorus and the vocals remain the the same key, and the music switches down a key...thus changing the harmony completely. Brilliant moment.
Are there other examples of this in prog rock/metal that I just never noticed before? Because it’s extremely effective at inducing goosebumps.
Not the same thing harmonically, but I feel a similar thing during Big Big Train's The Transit Of Venus Across The Sun.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvfTO-mErzM
I love that one theme is introduced in 4:25, slowly building up tension. Then, at 4:55, over the same chord progressions, a different theme is introduced. And then, at 5:15, the same vocal line is put into another harmonic context, and suddenly the sun is coming up. It's just brilliantly composed in my opinion, and it gives me goosebumps every time.
Also, this is a live performance. How good is this band? Okay, I'm done with my off topic now :biggrin:
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Apparently they've changed the release date to June 19.
https://burningshed.com/tag/Virus&filter_category_id=261 (https://burningshed.com/tag/Virus&filter_category_id=261)
FYI that's the same day my vacation starts :P
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Apparently they've changed the release date to June 19.
https://burningshed.com/tag/Virus&filter_category_id=261 (https://burningshed.com/tag/Virus&filter_category_id=261)
FYI that's the same day my vacation starts :P
Yeah, I just saw an email from Burningshed about it...
Hi
Thanks for your order.
We are sorry to say that the release date for this album has been put back to June 19th 2020.
We apologise for any inconvenience.
Kind Regards
Pete
Kind of bummed about it, but I guess it can't be helped.
-Marc.
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Do we know if the digital versions have been pushed back too?
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Do we know if the digital versions have been pushed back too?
not as per Itunes and Amazon (and btw, I just checked both Amazon.de and my dealer of choice and the release date didn't change)
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Has it changed anywhere else other than Burning Shed?
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Has it changed anywhere else other than Burning Shed?
I just checked Laser CD and Century Media and both stores still list it as a June 5th street date, so either they haven't updated their pages yet, or they're still releasing at the original date. If the latter is true, I doubt it's an issue with InsideOut and the Mediabook version, because Laser CD still lists the Mediabook version (typically the version that InsideOut Europe gets) as being released on June 5th, along with the digipak version.
So maybe this is just a Burningshed thing? If so, it kind of bums me out because that's where I placed my order because I wanted to be sure to get the Mediabook (so it'll match my copy of Vector). It'd be cool if they could provide a digital download on June 5th if the delay is solely on them and no one else, especially since it probably won't reach my mailbox til near the end of June given the shipping from the UK and how slow postal services have been for transit over the last couple of months.
-Marc.
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Prosthetic left me quite cold, but Canary Yellow and Invasion are impressive.
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Has it changed anywhere else other than Burning Shed?
I just checked Laser CD and Century Media and both stores still list it as a June 5th street date, so either they haven't updated their pages yet, or they're still releasing at the original date. If the latter is true, I doubt it's an issue with InsideOut and the Mediabook version, because Laser CD still lists the Mediabook version (typically the version that InsideOut Europe gets) as being released on June 5th, along with the digipak version.
So maybe this is just a Burningshed thing? If so, it kind of bums me out because that's where I placed my order because I wanted to be sure to get the Mediabook (so it'll match my copy of Vector). It'd be cool if they could provide a digital download on June 5th if the delay is solely on them and no one else, especially since it probably won't reach my mailbox til near the end of June given the shipping from the UK and how slow postal services have been for transit over the last couple of months.
-Marc.
It would be weird if the actual release date had changed but neither the band nor label had said anything about it.
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Has it changed anywhere else other than Burning Shed?
I just checked Laser CD and Century Media and both stores still list it as a June 5th street date, so either they haven't updated their pages yet, or they're still releasing at the original date. If the latter is true, I doubt it's an issue with InsideOut and the Mediabook version, because Laser CD still lists the Mediabook version (typically the version that InsideOut Europe gets) as being released on June 5th, along with the digipak version.
So maybe this is just a Burningshed thing? If so, it kind of bums me out because that's where I placed my order because I wanted to be sure to get the Mediabook (so it'll match my copy of Vector). It'd be cool if they could provide a digital download on June 5th if the delay is solely on them and no one else, especially since it probably won't reach my mailbox til near the end of June given the shipping from the UK and how slow postal services have been for transit over the last couple of months.
-Marc.
It would be weird if the actual release date had changed but neither the band nor label had said anything about it.
I agree, which is why I am thinking this is a Burningshed issue ONLY, as I haven't seen any announcement or changes from any other retailers, the band, or the label about it.
-Marc.
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I just preordered from their official Facebook page which takes you to Omerch and their release date is the 19th. Maybe other sites haven’t had the chance to update yet?
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there we go maties: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYbiNGLtDkY
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there we go maties: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYbiNGLtDkY
Oh cool!
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Says it’s not available.
:-[
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Says it’s not available.
:-[
It's geographical - won't be available until midnight in your country.
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Cool song, but pretty strange as a single upon first listen. As if they just 'had' to release a third single, because that's apparently how Inside Out always does it. I bet this one will work better on the album.
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Cool song, but pretty strange as a single upon first listen. As if they just 'had' to release a third single, because that's apparently how Inside Out always does it. I bet this one will work better on the album.
I agree it's not an obvious single, but then not much on the album is - other than Prosthetic which (if you like that style) works on its own as a heavy, punchy song, everything else works best in the context of the album.
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Invasion is right up my alley. Now I need to fight the urge to overlisten it before the album arrives.
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I don't wanna listen to Invasion... If I do, I'll have heard almost half the album! It'll be tempting to listen to it before Virus releases, though...
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Listening to Invasion now, and I've gotta say, I really like it so far. The driving riff in alternating 6/4 and 7/4 bars is very crunchy, in a good way. Definitely a great song all around, the vocals are nicely done, and everyone seems tight. The last chorus comes in so cliche-like, though, which isn't a slam on Haken, but it sounded very predictable. :lol
Also, I love the artwork for this single, with the little virus being the spaceship from Space Invaders. Seems like this design would have easily been a tour shirt (if there was a tour).
This will probably be my only spin of this song until the album drops, but waiting four weeks now instead of two is going to suuuuuuuuck. At least it gives me more time to get back into the Haken-listening mood after I grow out of spinning the new Pattern-Seeking Animals album too much. :lol
-Marc.
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Just listened to it. I have really liked the last two singles, but this song is a whole other level of good. I'm stunned. What a uniquely arranged song.
This just might become one of my very favorite Haken songs.
The Letter M, what do you mean by 4 weeks instead of 2? Is the album no longer coming out on June 5th?
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The Letter M, what do you mean by 4 weeks instead of 2? Is the album no longer coming out on June 5th?
Apparently the release date has been moved to June 19th. I imagine it might have something to do with the production of some physical products, be it CDs, Vinyls, or the merch (like t-shirts that are coming with some pre-orders). I havent seen any official announcement regarding the date change from the band themselves but I received an email this morning from Burningshed regarding the changed release date.
-Marc.
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Yeah this is much more like it :metal Great song!
edit: the release date is now officially June 19th, yeah. From InsideOut FB page:
Progressive rockers HAKEN are pleased to launch the video for their new single ‘Invasion’, the third track taken from their forthcoming new album ‘Virus’. Unfortunately, due to unforeseen circumstances beyond the label and bands control, the release date for the album has had to be postponed to the 19th June 2020.
The new video for ‘Invasion’ was created by Crystal Spotlight, who also produced the video for ‘Canary Yellow’. Watch it now here: https://youtu.be/2Rkx6b5vFdQ
The band comment: “Lyrically, Invasion deals with themes including but not limited to anxiety, depression and suicidal tendencies. We thought that the discussion of a "Virus of the mind" tied in well to the psychological themes touched upon in the sister record 'Vector' and lent itself to the character development of Virus's manic protagonist.”
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At least they haven't Wilson'd and postponed it for a stupidly long time.
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Killer track...and that graphic better be turned into a shirt.
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Out of the 3 tracks, I liked this one the least. I think this might be their weakest album.
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I think this might be their weakest album.
So you've heard the entire album? Or you're basing it on just three songs?
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We've now heard 17 minutes of a 52 minute album. If I thought those 17 minutes all blew chunks, I'd be tempted to say the same thing.
Fortunately, I feel exactly the opposite. So far, the 17 minutes I've heard have given me a lot of hope that this is going to be better than Vector.
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Admittedly after weeks of listening, I think this could be my second favourite behind The Mountain. But that was very much not the case after the first listen or three.
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The Letter M, what do you mean by 4 weeks instead of 2? Is the album no longer coming out on June 5th?
Apparently the release date has been moved to June 19th. I imagine it might have something to do with the production of some physical products, be it CDs, Vinyls, or the merch (like t-shirts that are coming with some pre-orders). I havent seen any official announcement regarding the date change from the band themselves but I received an email this morning from Burningshed regarding the changed release date.
-Marc.
Well, that's a gigantic bummer.
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I think this might be their weakest album.
So you've heard the entire album? Or you're basing it on just three songs?
We've now heard 17 minutes of a 52 minute album. If I thought those 17 minutes all blew chunks, I'd be tempted to say the same thing.
This.
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Admittedly after weeks of listening, I think this could be my second favourite behind The Mountain. But that was very much not the case after the first listen or three.
Given that we've always agreed about TM being Haken's absolute best, this hypes me up quite a ton.
Invasion is great -- definitely not really a "single" type song but it's so unique. Loving it.
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Admittedly after weeks of listening, I think this could be my second favourite behind The Mountain. But that was very much not the case after the first listen or three.
Given that we've always agreed about TM being Haken's absolute best, this hypes me up quite a ton.
I'm not sure that specifically means that much as it's the favourite for a lot of people who otherwise disagree on the rest. :lol But you and I do share a reasonable amount in terms of tastes (not that we've had much interaction on here for a while - hi by the way!) so I think there's a reasonable chance you'll like it a lot.
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I will obviously listen a lot more, but Invasion sounded good on the first listen.
It is clear from hearing these first few songs from the album that they have found what they consider their sweet spot as far as their sound goes. Very similar guitar tones, sound, mix and production to the previous two albums.
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I will obviously listen a lot more, but Invasion sounded good on the first listen.
It is clear from hearing these first few songs from the album that they have found what they consider their sweet spot as far as their sound goes.
In terms of guitar tones, yeah that's probably right, but in pretty much all other regards I'd say the sound in Affinity is completely different to Vector and Virus. And in thr case of the latter, they intentionally wanted the same general sound (even though the music is more varied) as it's essentially part 2, so I wouldn't be surprised if the overall sound changes again in whatever they do next.
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Affinity is very different. And it is fantastic because of it.
I suppose that was my problem with Vector. It felt a bit more like "Haken by the numbers". Maybe that's not quite right. It's like when the old TV shows would go on vacation and they would air a "flashback episode".
Aquarius a perfect snapshot of new band experimenting with blending different styles.
Visions was an obvious homage to SFAM (so obvious that seemed intentional) and they pulled off their flattery with flying colors.
The Mountain was a major shift in sound and sounded like the band finding their own sound for the first time.
Affinity was an extreme left turn once again, with an intentional shift to sound nothing like any of the previous albums.
Then we have Vector, which sounds more like "OK, so let's sum up...here's everything we've tried so far stuck in a blender." It was the first time that they didn't "throw out the book" and try something completely different, and I think I like the previous four albums better because you never knew what you were getting. Vector is still excellent, and for any other band I would call it a solid debut. It's just that when a band comes out of the gate with four 10/10's in a row, following it up with an 8.5 seems disappointing by comparison.
Of course, your mileage may vary, obviously.
Still, I like what I've heard from Virus so far more than most of what I heard from Vector, so I'm hoping the bigger picture elevates the entire concept. If it feeds into Vector in a good way, it may enhance my appreciation of it more.
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So prog artist Ed Unitsky shared Invasion on Facebook and Roine Stolt replied with:
I recommend; seek for their album *Aquarium* (I think) - before they got sucked into the metal mainstream and super-edited productions - Fantastic debut album !!! - Great melodies & playing !!
Interesting that 1) Roine has listened to Haken, and 2) he thinks their debut is their best.
-Marc.
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So prog artist Ed Unitsky shared Invasion on Facebook and Roine Stolt replied with:
I recommend; seek for their album *Aquarium* (I think) - before they got sucked into the metal mainstream and super-edited productions - Fantastic debut album !!! - Great melodies & playing !!
Interesting that 1) Roine has listened to Haken, and 2) he thinks their debut is their best.
-Marc.
no, logical IMHO (given that Aquarius isn't as heavy as say Vector or (possibly) Virus) and Roine and The Flower Kings aren't the kind of "heavy" prog bands I think
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So prog artist Ed Unitsky shared Invasion on Facebook and Roine Stolt replied with:
I recommend; seek for their album *Aquarium* (I think) - before they got sucked into the metal mainstream and super-edited productions - Fantastic debut album !!! - Great melodies & playing !!
Interesting that 1) Roine has listened to Haken, and 2) he thinks their debut is their best.
-Marc.
no, logical IMHO (given that Aquarius isn't as heavy as say Vector or (possibly) Virus) and Roine and The Flower Kings aren't the kind of "heavy" prog bands I think
Aquarius is also quite quirky and whimsical which is definitely more Roine's kind of thing.
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So prog artist Ed Unitsky shared Invasion on Facebook and Roine Stolt replied with:
I recommend; seek for their album *Aquarium* (I think) - before they got sucked into the metal mainstream and super-edited productions - Fantastic debut album !!! - Great melodies & playing !!
Interesting that 1) Roine has listened to Haken, and 2) he thinks their debut is their best.
-Marc.
no, logical IMHO (given that Aquarius isn't as heavy as say Vector or (possibly) Virus) and Roine and The Flower Kings aren't the kind of "heavy" prog bands I think
Aquarius is also quite quirky and whimsical which is definitely more Roine's kind of thing.
that too of course
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Everything these guys do is fresh, inspired and tight! Great drumming. Excellent song with a cool video as well. Bravo Haken!
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So prog artist Ed Unitsky shared Invasion on Facebook and Roine Stolt replied with:
I recommend; seek for their album *Aquarium* (I think) - before they got sucked into the metal mainstream and super-edited productions - Fantastic debut album !!! - Great melodies & playing !!
Interesting that 1) Roine has listened to Haken, and 2) he thinks their debut is their best.
-Marc.
no, logical IMHO (given that Aquarius isn't as heavy as say Vector or (possibly) Virus) and Roine and The Flower Kings aren't the kind of "heavy" prog bands I think
Aquarius is also quite quirky and whimsical which is definitely more Roine's kind of thing.
Not at all surprised that Roine would find Aquarius to be his favorite Haken album.
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I will obviously listen a lot more, but Invasion sounded good on the first listen.
It is clear from hearing these first few songs from the album that they have found what they consider their sweet spot as far as their sound goes.
In terms of guitar tones, yeah that's probably right, but in pretty much all other regards I'd say the sound in Affinity is completely different to Vector and Virus. And in thr case of the latter, they intentionally wanted the same general sound (even though the music is more varied) as it's essentially part 2, so I wouldn't be surprised if the overall sound changes again in whatever they do next.
You removed "Very similar guitar tones, sound, mix and production to the previous two albums." from my quote, which was the key. The mix and production of the two albums is extremely similar. And these new songs have that same sound. Note that I am talking mostly about the sound and production, not necessarily the style.
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Admittedly after weeks of listening, I think this could be my second favourite behind The Mountain. But that was very much not the case after the first listen or three.
Given that we've always agreed about TM being Haken's absolute best, this hypes me up quite a ton.
I'm not sure that specifically means that much as it's the favourite for a lot of people who otherwise disagree on the rest. :lol But you and I do share a reasonable amount in terms of tastes (not that we've had much interaction on here for a while - hi by the way!) so I think there's a reasonable chance you'll like it a lot.
Hmm, that's true -- but nonetheless I remain hyped, I trust your judgement! (And hello as well -- I haven't been super active here for quite some time, I miss it! If only we had a DTF Discord server, I tend to be more active on Discord these days :lol )
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I will obviously listen a lot more, but Invasion sounded good on the first listen.
It is clear from hearing these first few songs from the album that they have found what they consider their sweet spot as far as their sound goes.
In terms of guitar tones, yeah that's probably right, but in pretty much all other regards I'd say the sound in Affinity is completely different to Vector and Virus. And in thr case of the latter, they intentionally wanted the same general sound (even though the music is more varied) as it's essentially part 2, so I wouldn't be surprised if the overall sound changes again in whatever they do next.
You removed "Very similar guitar tones, sound, mix and production to the previous two albums." from my quote, which was the key. The mix and production of the two albums is extremely similar. And these new songs have that same sound. Note that I am talking mostly about the sound and production, not necessarily the style.
That's weird, I didn't intentionally delete anything from your quote. ??? :lol
So my response probably comes across pretty unclear - the part I was disagreeing with what the comparisons to Affinity, apart from guitar tones. Virus and Vector, absolutely, the sound is extremely similar as they are linked albums. But other than the guitar tones, the mix and general production approach on Affinity is very different.
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Oh God Roine, shut the hell up! If you read the liner notes of the first Kingdom of Colours box, you will learn he straight up has an anti-mainstream agenda. As if making a living out of your creations is a bad things. As with many musicians (Waters, Portnoy), great musician, just shut up.
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Meh....I'm kinda with him. I was in a grung-y (somewhat) band in the Seattle area in the early 90s that showed a bit of promise. I was really proud of what we were making. But one day I had a revelation that if we became successful, then making music would become my "job". The idea honestly made me physically ill. It just seemed wrong on every conceivable level. That was one of several reasons I decided to quit the band. I still occasionally write on my own, but if it was my job to write or make music, I would hate it, and I never want to be in a position where I hate making music.
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If I could actually make money by creating music, rather than teaching it, I would immediately jump at the opportunity.
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Meh....I'm kinda with him. I was in a grung-y (somewhat) band in the Seattle area in the early 90s that showed a bit of promise. I was really proud of what we were making. But one day I had a revelation that if we became successful, then making music would become my "job". The idea honestly made me physically ill. It just seemed wrong on every conceivable level. That was one of several reasons I decided to quit the band. I still occasionally write on my own, but if it was my job to write or make music, I would hate it, and I never want to be in a position where I hate making music.
I seriously have a hard time understanding how the thought of making money doing what you love could be a turn-off to anyone, unless you were about to sign a contract with a major record label for years to come and you weren't sure you would enjoy making music as much in a couple of years..?
Anyway, I can almost guarantee you that a band of Haken's size would not be pushed into a musical direction they're not choosing themselves. I figured Roine would know that?
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The last sentence got accidentally’d I think. Missing a ‘not’
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Oops, thanks! :laugh:
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Does anyone know if Haken plans to continue the tour with Devon or tour as a headliner. I saw them with Bent Knee and Leporus at a 500 capacity crowd.
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It’s just the thought that if your livelihood relied on you making music, you would have customers to answer to. If you happen to make something they don’t like, your means of living is jeopardized. I would never find it possible to organically create anything in that environment. The entire structure would be counter productive to creativity. There would always be things I wish I could do and then run into “nah, no one would ever go for that.” It’s claustrophobic to even consider.
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It’s just the thought that if your livelihood relied on you making music, you would have customers to answer to. If you happen to make something they don’t like, your means of living is jeopardized. I would never find it possible to organically create anything in that environment. The entire structure would be counter productive to creativity. There would always be things I wish I could do and then run into “nah, no one would ever go for that.” It’s claustrophobic to even consider.
That's the case for every career though.
Regardless of whether the "day job" (whether in an office, a building site or a band) means you have to answer to what your boss/customers want, you can also use solo albums and side projects where sales/finances don't really matter to be as creative as you like.
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I will obviously listen a lot more, but Invasion sounded good on the first listen.
It is clear from hearing these first few songs from the album that they have found what they consider their sweet spot as far as their sound goes.
In terms of guitar tones, yeah that's probably right, but in pretty much all other regards I'd say the sound in Affinity is completely different to Vector and Virus. And in thr case of the latter, they intentionally wanted the same general sound (even though the music is more varied) as it's essentially part 2, so I wouldn't be surprised if the overall sound changes again in whatever they do next.
You removed "Very similar guitar tones, sound, mix and production to the previous two albums." from my quote, which was the key. The mix and production of the two albums is extremely similar. And these new songs have that same sound. Note that I am talking mostly about the sound and production, not necessarily the style.
That's weird, I didn't intentionally delete anything from your quote. ??? :lol
So my response probably comes across pretty unclear - the part I was disagreeing with what the comparisons to Affinity, apart from guitar tones. Virus and Vector, absolutely, the sound is extremely similar as they are linked albums. But other than the guitar tones, the mix and general production approach on Affinity is very different.
Haha, all good. I didn't think ya did, as that never seems to be your M.O. :)
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Sorry if I'm stating the obvious, but I think RoeDent was saying that in response to this part of the quote:
I recommend; seek for their album *Aquarium* (I think) - before they got sucked into the metal mainstream and super-edited productions - Fantastic debut album !!! - Great melodies & playing !!
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Sorry if I'm stating the obvious, but I think RoeDent was saying that in response to this part of the quote:
I recommend; seek for their album *Aquarium* (I think) - before they got sucked into the metal mainstream and super-edited productions - Fantastic debut album !!! - Great melodies & playing !!
Correct. He could have just recommended the album and stopped there, but nope. He had to insert that needless crap. If Haken are "mainstream", then mainstream is incredible! I wouldn't say they're any more "mainstream" than Roine's own band The Flower Kings. So on that front it's a bit hypocritical.
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Well he said 'the metal mainstream and super-edited productions' which is something else than 'mainstream'. Their more recent albums, especially the guitar-driven songs, do sound like they try to cater to the 'metal' audience. And you can't really argue that Haken does have 'super-edited productions'.
That said, it's still pretty much a needless comment, and coming from a musician it almost reeks of jealousy. Haken are definitely more popular than they were a few years ago and, judging by their sizes on social media, they're also bigger than The Flower Kings are, so in that sense, yeah, Haken are 'more' mainstream, I guess.
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What I get from the quote, is that he has real admiration for Aquarius and is disappointed that he didn't get more music in that vein to listen to.
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Okay, fair enough. Showing admiration is one thing, but adding the snarky comment afterwards is unnecessary. "You used to look good, but now you're fat and ugly." The first part of that sentence is quite nice, the second doesn't really help the first point.
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It's more like "You used to look good, but all that plastic surgery makes you uglier, not prettier."
I prefer that analogy for complaints about overproduced music.
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That's a better way of wording it indeed, thanks :)
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I took it as Roine liking the band early on when the metal was not too dominant and the prog was heavy. Roine is a major prog guy, and not a huge metal guy, so it's not surprising at all that he would prefer their album that was heavy on the prog and lighter on the metal (relative to their subsequent releases). That is how I took it.
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I disagree on the logic that more metal implies less prog
:metal
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With their rhythmic interplay and tightness, Haken have been more progressive in recent times than the Flower Kings have ever been. Listen to any number of songs on Affinity, but especially something like The Endless Knot. Again, that's not a slight on TFK. They do what they do very well indeed.
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I took it as Roine liking the band early on when the metal was not too dominant and the prog was heavy. Roine is a major prog guy, and not a huge metal guy, so it's not surprising at all that he would prefer their album that was heavy on the prog and lighter on the metal (relative to their subsequent releases). That is how I took it.
I'm not really sure that Aquarius is lighter on the metal, though. It's one of only two albums with substantial growling, and I think it has heavier riffs on the whole than The Mountain at least, and maybe Visions, too.
I mean, I completely believe that Aquarius is more Roine's style than any of the other albums. I'm just not sure about the metal vs. prog part. Tend to agree with me7 on that one.
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Okay, but I did not say that "more metal means less prog."
I said, "Roine is a major prog guy, and not a huge metal guy, so it's not surprising at all that he would prefer their album that was heavy on the prog and lighter on the metal (relative to their subsequent releases)." All of their albums are heavy on the prog, IMO, but the first album seems a little lighter on the metal when compared to their other four albums (not counting the new one yet), even when factoring in the little bit of growling on it.
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Of course, sorry if it seemed I was accusing you of saying that!
I don't really have the same perception of the relative metal-ness of Aquarius, but I also don't really have a clear way to measure how "metal" something is, so I'm not inclined to argue the point.
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No worries, I was just trying to clarify what I meant earlier. All good. :tup :tup
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A detailed review:
https://manofmuchmetal.com/2020/05/22/haken-virus-album-review/
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Porty posted this on his Instagram: (https://www.instagram.com/p/CAwp3yqjxXi/)
"I know I’m not supposed to be prematurely hyping this as it’s still not coming out for a few more weeks...but I spent some time with this masterpiece tonight and I couldn’t contain my excitement...
You already know how much I love @haken_official...my “Band of the Decade”, and my backup band for my Shattered Fortress tour a few years ago (#justiceforray)...but man, they knocked it outta the park with this new one!! Wow...🤯
Continuing to push the boundaries of Prog & Metal...
Congrats to my friends @rosswjennings @charlie_griffiths_haken @rich_henshall @rayhaken @connergreenbass @diegotejeida 🙏😘" (and I won't take it seriously, because I can't. I respect his opinion though, biased as it probably is)
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Not sure what you mean by biased, but he is obviously a massive fanboy and so yeah obviously it doesn't mean everyone will love it. :lol
If anyone could be accused of having a reason to be biased, it's me, but I don't think I am. :P
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Music opinions don't mean a whole lot anyway when it comes to forming your own. I'm glad MP likes it, I expect it to be a good one based not on his review, but everyone's been pretty positive about it and the singles have been good.
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Yeah, for all of the shit many of us give Portnoy, most of it deserved :P, he is still a big music fan and that is Mike Portnoy the music fan talking there, so I don't see the problem there. Sure, they are his buddies and he no doubt wants to help them as much as he can, but I don't think he'd gush online about an album being great if he didn't really think that.
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Mike Portnoy's statement is only making me just a little more excited than before, because I am way too hyped for Virus already (and that's almost solely for Messiah Complex alone). I just want June 19th to get here already!!
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Just noticed the change in the release date. What happened, production delay? :sadpanda:
Really like "Invasion" best of the 3 for me.
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A lot of people have speculated that they had issues shipping the physical copies by the 5th of June because of the coronavirus, but I don't know if that's been officially confirmed by the band or InsideOut.
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I got an email about the release date change. That's unfortunate, but guess I can wait two more weeks. Don't know how the world will be by then though.
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Porty posted this on his Instagram: (https://www.instagram.com/p/CAwp3yqjxXi/)
"I know I’m not supposed to be prematurely hyping this as it’s still not coming out for a few more weeks...but I spent some time with this masterpiece tonight and I couldn’t contain my excitement...
You already know how much I love @haken_official...my “Band of the Decade”, and my backup band for my Shattered Fortress tour a few years ago (#justiceforray)...but man, they knocked it outta the park with this new one!! Wow...🤯
Continuing to push the boundaries of Prog & Metal...
Congrats to my friends @rosswjennings @charlie_griffiths_haken @rich_henshall @rayhaken @connergreenbass @diegotejeida 🙏😘" (and I won't take it seriously, because I can't. I respect his opinion though, biased as it probably is)
At least his comment about this one is more mature than the one about Vector, where he said something like "so proud of my boys" and it even ended up on the hype sticker of the album :lol
Also, some guy accused MP of nepotism, thinking this was an album by Next To None... He made MP veery angry :lol
Let’s get something straight...me posting about my kids is not “nepotism”, it’s called being a good parent & a proud father! (See this idiot’s tweet at me) 😡😡 So if you don’t want to ever see posts about Melody Portnoy, Max Portnoy or Tallah, please unfollow me NOW!! 👋
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You can't blame a guy for plugging his kids' bands. And family or not, MP has always hyped up bands/artists that he likes, which is something I've always appreciated him for. I doubt Haken, Opeth, Neal Morse, Roine Stolt, or Steven Wilson would have the careers they have now without his involvement back then.
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Haken were doing fine before Portnoy showed up.
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Yeah, let's not starting acting like those bands wouldn't have "made it" without Portnoy.
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I just wonder who this person is who cares enough about MP to tweet at him, but also doesn't know anything about Haken.
The only artists on that list who I think demonstrably had their profiles significantly elevated by MP would be Roine and Neal, and even there it's not about MP tweeting an endorsement, but about the fact that there are people who listened to Transatlantic because they liked DT, and then listened to Spock's Beard/The Flower Kings/Neal solo because they liked Transatlantic.
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Agreed. There were definitely some of us who got into Neal and Roine thanks to Transatlantic, but they were already pretty well known within the underground prog scene (which I quickly found out when discovering them).
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To be clear MP tweeting in support of his son's bands is not nepotism.
Next to None getting record deals, shows, tours, etc that they otherwise would aboslutely not have gotten is nepotism. You can argue all you want over whether it's the right thing or not for him to do, but it's still nepotism.
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I agree with Nicholas.
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But MP didn't sign N2N, the record label did. Same for show promoters and the rest. It is not like MP works on the labels or has an agency to book tours.
MP exposed (promoted) his son band, but those in POWER could still have said no.
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MP exposed (promoted) his son band, but those in POWER could still have said no.
Yes and no. MP's name is still big in prog labels. He also at that time had the Jim Pitulski connection with Inside Out. Jim was DT's manager in the early days and was Inside Out's president at the time N2N was signed IIRC. Jim did leave I/O a year or two ago. So it might not have been a direct nepotism for I/O to sign N2N, but the influence/connections were definitely there.
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But MP didn't sign N2N, the record label did. Same for show promoters and the rest. It is not like MP works on the labels or has an agency to book tours.
MP exposed (promoted) his son band, but those in POWER could still have said no.
Just because people could turn things down doesn't mean nepotism wasn't in play, there is an option to say no to basically anything.
I'll give you some direct examples of how MP was in direct control of things. Progressive Nation at Sea, many band conflicts, two of my big ones came on the final day when I had to choose to see Anathema OR Haken, Riverside OR Spock's Beard. Wouldn't you know both of Next to None's gigs were at times when no other shows on the ship. I'll give you one guess who had a big hand in scheduling that.
Shattered Fortress at Irving Plaza in NYC, Next to None opens the show. Sure, without Mike's influence there is an outside chance they could have gotten on anyway, but it's clear that when Mike's people booked the show it was written into the contract they'd have choice of opener and already knew who it would be. Yes, Irving Plaza could have said no deal, but no one was going to nuke what ended up being a sold out show over that.
Steve Harris does the same thing. Lauren Harris would never be opening for Iron Maiden without his direct intervention. Raven Age was at least in the genre ballpark, but you can't say that's not nepotism considering other recent opening acts are on the level of Dream Theater, Alice Cooper, and even Bullet For My Valentine.
Again, it's fair to argue that these folks should use their influence to get their kids ahead in the world, but it is clearly textbook nepotism.
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A new (German) review mentions June 26th as the release date: http://www.musikreviews.de/reviews/2020/Haken/Virus/
Most likely a mistake, but curiously the band never acknowledged the June 19th date in any of their recent promotion videos.
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I've not heard anything about a further delay - as far as I'm aware the plan is still the 19th.
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So... a Canadian online radio just streamed Messiah Complex...
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So... a Canadian online radio just streamed Messiah Complex...
Are they doing it more than once? Is it OK for you to post a link if they are?
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I'm 95% sure they shouldn't have done that, so please do not share any links here.
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I'd heard about them planning to do that for a few days now... I wouldn't think they would be allowed to stream that, but either way I didn't listen to it.
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Yeah, I saw them advertising it on reddit. I can wait two more weeks.
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Is Next 2 None even a thing anymore?
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No.
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Kind of makes me feel nepotism played a big role then, sure just speculation based on what happened, but I feel a true band that worked from the ground up themselves, got a record deal, and was able to play some big shows wouldn't just phase out so quickly.
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maybe Nepotism Complex might have been a working title for Messiah Complex, who knows? (no, just joking)
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Kind of makes me feel nepotism played a big role then, sure just speculation based on what happened, but I feel a true band that worked from the ground up themselves, got a record deal, and was able to play some big shows wouldn't just phase out so quickly.
Surely looks like it though.
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Portnoy's kid can play, and his style is very reminiscent of his pop's, but what I heard from Next to None was awful, awful shit. They made Adrenaline Mob sound like Led Zeppelin. :eek :eek
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Portnoy's kid can play, and his style is very reminiscent of his pop's, but what I heard from Next to None was awful, awful shit. They made Adrenaline Mob sound like Led Zeppelin. :eek :eek
All the kids could play. They are seriously great local (to me) talents. I will defend them as young musicians every day of the week.
What they lacked was great songwriting, which is understandable given their age, and I didn't like Thomas' vocal stylings through much of their music, particularly having a suburban white kid throwing angsty growls and shit at me.
All that said had they not been prematurely raised up by nepotism and from what I understand a couple of other wealthy families no one would know about them right now, which is fine. They would have spent time working on their songwriting, getting things together like so many young bands. And whenever they broke into a wider audience they likely would have had a much better reaction than what they got from any non-Portnoy bootlickers when they were dragged onto the national scene.
I've hung out with Thomas at Haken shows, he's an awesome dude and amazing keyboard player, and I've run into some of the other members at shows and had nice chats with them as well, and I have no problem with any of the people, but there is simply no denying in my book they were pushed into the limelight before they were properly ripened, with all the benefits and drawbacks that entails.
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Nepotism? You mean a bunch of unknown teenagers that got Neal Morse and Bumblefoot to guest on their debut album didn't make it happen by their own merit? :rollin :rollin :rollin
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Nepotism? You mean a bunch of unknown teenagers that got Neal Morse and Bumblefoot to guest on their debut album didn't make it happen by their own merit? :rollin :rollin :rollin
:lol I didn't know this, since I never gave them a listen but yea, that's definitely a big sign there of it all. And honestly, I don't really have a problem with it in general. It's not like my parents never helped me out with something. I got my first job out of college through my dad's former coworker. However, I made a career out of it with my own work but everyone starts somewhere, nothing wrong with having someone help give you a head start. At the end of the day, it's your own work that keeps you on the map.
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I'm 95% sure they shouldn't have done that, so please do not share any links here.
Can we talk about the song if we did hear it though?
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I'm 95% sure they shouldn't have done that, so please do not share any links here.
I didn't know if it was legal or not here on the forum as far as pirated material goes, that's why I asked. Of course I wouldn't want a link if it didn't have the band's blessing. So no harm intended.
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On a side note, speaking of nepotism, would we ever have heard of Jason Bonham or Sean Lennon had it not been for their Dad's fame?
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Their fathers were not alive to promote their music.
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On a side note, speaking of nepotism, would we ever have heard of Jason Bonham or Sean Lennon had it not been for their Dad's fame?
Their fathers were not alive to promote their music.
Yeah, that's not really nepotism. Yes, chances are the family name got them exposure and opportunity they might not otherwise have had, but there was no one really actively assisting or pulling strings for them.
And I can't speak for Sean, but Jason at least is a really good drummer who absolutely stands on his own now.
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Does Dweezil count?
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On a side note, speaking of nepotism, would we ever have heard of Jason Bonham or Sean Lennon had it not been for their Dad's fame?
Their fathers were not alive to promote their music.
Yeah, that's not really nepotism. Yes, chances are the family name got them exposure and opportunity they might not otherwise have had, but there was no one really actively assisting or pulling strings for them.
And I can't speak for Sean, but Jason at least is a really good drummer who absolutely stands on his own now.
Well, he does have a cover band playing his father's music. But yeah, he's in other bands as well, I know.
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Dweezil, like the others, are more cashing in on their father's fame, music, and name recognition. And just like with classic nepotism you can draw your own line on if that is ethical or not, or what goes to far.
But at least from my understanding of nepotism that would be is Frank was still alive and gave Dweezil a spot opening for him, or a spot in his band before he was really qualified for those spots.
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Dweezil, like the others, are more cashing in on their father's fame, music, and name recognition. And just like with classic nepotism you can draw your own line on if that is ethical or not, or what goes to far.
But at least from my understanding of nepotism that would be is Frank was still alive and gave Dweezil a spot opening for him, or a spot in his band before he was really qualified for those spots.
Thought that as well.
So it's more Steve Harris' Daughters' band opening for Iron Maiden.
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This happens in real life so I don't see a big deal. They may get the door open for them but they have to be good at it to stay in the business.
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:rollin
This is what happens when the label decides to delay the release, that was supposed to be tomorrow.
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:lol
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Guys, bad news
Dearest Haken friends, family and fans,
Unfortunately, due to ongoing logistical challenges, our new album ‘Virus’ will now be released on July 10th. We’d like to thank everyone behind the scenes at Inside Out and the various distribution channels who are working as hard as possible to navigate the challenging times in which we find ourselves. We know this news will be as disappointing to you as it is to us, but we want you to know that we really, really appreciate your patience - so a big THANK YOU goes to you for sticking with us while we get through this.
All the best,
Haken
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:sadpanda:
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:'(
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c'mon guys this is the virus we want, rather than the one we've currently got :(
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As long as we get it, I don't mind, but it's still sad news. At least I won't be starved for new music since Frost*, Nick D'Virgilio, Kansas, and McStine & Minnemann will all have new music out before July 10th, so I'll be kept busy with those until Virus comes out.
-Marc.
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As long as we get it, I don't mind, but it's still sad news. At least I won't be starved for new music since Frost*, Nick D'Virgilio, Kansas, and McStine & Minnemann will all have new music out before July 10th, so I'll be kept busy with those until Virus comes out.
-Marc.
Really excited about the Frost* and NDV releases!
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I get it, but it still sucks :-\
c'mon guys this is the virus we want, rather than the one we've currently got :(
Yeeep
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They could release it digitally as planned, postpone physical shipments and send download coupons to people who preordered physical copies.
I assume Haken are among the bigger bands at Inside Out and their releases generate a sizable amount of cash. But maybe I'm wrong about that or the label has an abundance of cashflow at the moment.
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As far as I know, it's not as simple as just releasing the digital album.
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They could release it digitally as planned, postpone physical shipments and send download coupons to people who preordered physical copies.
I assume Haken are among the bigger bands at Inside Out and their releases generate a sizable amount of cash. But maybe I'm wrong about that or the label has an abundance of cashflow at the moment.
I've heard rumours that it's actually a mixing issue that's caused the delay, not a shipping one.
Idk how trustworthy this is, but I thought I'd throw it out there.
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Wouldn't the entire album be mixed around the same time? The three songs which have all been released are all still available to buy digitally at iTunes. It seems odds that the rest of the album would still be needing a proper mix. But what do I know? :lol
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Wouldn't the entire album be mixed around the same time? The three songs which have all been released are all still available to buy digitally at iTunes. It seems odds that the rest of the album would still be needing a proper mix. But what do I know? :lol
Sometimes bands have the singles mixed first to meet the promotional campaign schedule but the rest of the songs will still need to be mixed, but I wouldn't think this is the case, as some people have already got promotional copies to review (and MP to tell us how amazing it is). But, quoting Kev, what do I know? :lol
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I'm not aware of any mixing issue and I'm pretty certain Kev is right that the whole album was mixed and mastered together. No idea where that rumour came from!
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Do we know about any other album release being postponed due to the Corona pandemic or is it just Haken and Steven Wilson? I'm sure other artists are going through the same thing with their upcoming releases.
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Do we know about any other album release being postponed due to the Corona pandemic or is it just Haken and Steven Wilson? I'm sure other artists are going through the same thing with their upcoming releases.
If it's a shipping issue, then I guess Haken underestimated how long it'd take. Maybe that's not the case with other artists whose albums haven't been delayed. But then again, I'd imagine that that'd be decided by the record label & not the band itself, so if other InsideOut albums are getting their albums out on time, then who knows? Perhaps that's why people are suspicious that it may not be a shipping issue, but either way, there's not much we can do except wait another 5 weeks (& hope that it doesn't get delayed again :().
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I personally had 3 instances of postponed releases this year at the record label I work at. But out of those, none of the release dates were already announced.
The most common reason to postpone releases right now is because there can't be any tours to support the release, that's absolutely massive. I totally support the band's / label's decision to do so in most cases.
There was actually one band we strongly adviced to postpone since their release date was 29 May, but they really wanted to stick with it. That's admirable, and one could also argue that right now there will be more spotlights on new releases because everyone is going to be releasing right after the restrictions are lifted.
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I personally had 3 instances of postponed releases this year at the record label I work at. But out of those, none of the release dates were already announced.
The most common reason to postpone releases right now is because there can't be any tours to support the release, that's absolutely massive. I totally support the band's / label's decision to do so in most cases.
There was actually one band we strongly adviced to postpone since their release date was 29 May, but they really wanted to stick with it. That's admirable, and one could also argue that right now there will be more spotlights on new releases because everyone is going to be releasing right after the restrictions are lifted.
Great insight into how these things work!
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Do we know about any other album release being postponed due to the Corona pandemic or is it just Haken and Steven Wilson? I'm sure other artists are going through the same thing with their upcoming releases.
Deep Purple
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The new Carcass album was also pushed back.
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Also Lamb of God
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Wouldn't the entire album be mixed around the same time? The three songs which have all been released are all still available to buy digitally at iTunes. It seems odds that the rest of the album would still be needing a proper mix. But what do I know? :lol
Sometimes bands have the singles mixed first to meet the promotional campaign schedule but the rest of the songs will still need to be mixed, but I wouldn't think this is the case, as some people have already got promotional copies to review (and MP to tell us how amazing it is). But, quoting Kev, what do I know? :lol
Yeah, the promo copy sounds "mixed" to me. No differences whatsoever between the singles and the other songs...
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Now delayed until 10 July.
How on earth did I miss someone posting that right at the top of the page?
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Everything I'm waiting for keeps getting delayed. :sad:
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As long as they're not delaying it until 2021 like Steven Wilson did, it's really not that bad. ;D
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As long as they're not delaying it until 2021 like Steven Wilson did
Yet :biggrin:
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Good thing we got the new Tool album last year or it would have just never came out. :neverusethis:
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Damn, I totally spaced the 6/5 release date. Guess it doesn't matter now. Working from home for the last 3 months, I easily lose track of the days. :lol
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Damn, I totally spaced the 6/5 release date. Guess it doesn't matter now. Working from home for the last 3 months, I easily lose track of the days. :lol
Yea, time just seems so odd these days that this push back really doesn't seem like a big deal to me. 7/10 will be here soon enough and I probably won't even realize until the day of when everyone here is talking about the album :lol Plus it's not like there's a tour happening and now you won't get to listen to the album before you see the songs live.
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I'm hoping they'll do a thing where they stream the album once before it comes out to give us a chance to listen to it early. What do you think the probability of that is?
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I didn't know they did stuff like that anymore. That's more of a 2013 thing.
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Exclusive album premieres are not a myth :lol still very much a thing for as long as online music magazines / blogs continue to exist
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Last time I heard about something like this was before the release of DT12... So I guess it's really a '13 thang
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Deerhoof did that for their new album two months ago. Oddly enough, it was a Facebook stream, yet the album didn't leak for weeks after that.
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Last time I heard about something like this was before the release of DT12... So I guess it's really a '13 thang
Exclusive album premieres are not a myth :lol still very much a thing for as long as online music magazines / blogs continue to exist
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Another delay: 24th of july.
Let's hope there will be some touring now things are opening up a little bit more here in Europe.
Concerts are allowed again in my country, no limited number of visitors as long as the 1,5 meter distance is garanteed.
It still sucks but we might be back in a concert hall soon.
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damn, another delay :censored
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Oh come on
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just put it up for streaming at this point :\
If they're waiting for live shows to come back this album isn't coming out this year.
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Honestly, in these times of streaming. There is no excuse an album shouldn't be released on time. If the packaging is a part of the entire concept, I'm sure many people are willing to wait for a physical release. It's the music we enjoy and want, and go see performed, the other stuff are just nice extras.
I understand if an artist wants to be pretentious and require the listener to buy both the music and packaging/artwork in order to understand the concept or emerge oneself more into it...(Cough...SW...Cough).
With all that said. I'm still convinced it's the name of the album and Haken don't want to give in and rename it because it's the entire point of the name of the album, it being their 6th album and a concept about a VIrus.
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Shit...two more weeks.
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Lame.
At least with Steven Wilson's album, he pushed it (way) back once instead of faking out the fans every few weeks with, "okay, the release date is NOW almost here, oh wait, no it's not." I would think a band that seems to want to connect with their fans would know that, with no concerts and live sports right now, THIS is the time to make your fans happy with new music, not constantly delaying the release of it. This won't affect my potential enjoyment of it, but this is oft-putting.
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I completely understand Kev, but honestly it really is outside of the band's control and it's at least as frustrating for them as it is for the fans.
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Let me guess: the jugheads at the record company are worried that releasing the album when they can't tour will hurt the eventual concert sales?
I just don't buy that. If the album is good, fans won't forget about it in a month.
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It’d be interesting to hear more about why, not cause it matters or we deserve to know, but because this is the third delay. There has to be something unique to this situation.
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I wonder if the new Kansas album will get delayed again, too...weird. It's a bit upsetting and unfortunate, but I can understand if it's something out of their control. Like many others, though, I do wish that outlets that had orders for the album would offer up digital downloads of the album available for fans to listen to, but only for those who have bought, or will buy their discs (so as to give an incentive for folks to order the physical product).
-Marc.
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Last Friday saw the release of both Lamb of God and Protest the Hero. We've also had Testament's and Trivium's album at peak virus time back in April. So the virus is not delaying the release of a lot of albums, must be something else.
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I completely understand Kev, but honestly it really is outside of the band's control and it's at least as frustrating for them as it is for the fans.
I was just gonna write this. Don't be angry at the Haken boys, I'm sure this is the last thing they want.
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Do we know if the issue is still the shipping during the pandemic? Because I'm starting to doubt that that's the only reason, considering how many other IO releases have come out in June. Especially so, considering that I don't think anyone confirmed the delay was because of the pandemic in the first place.
Some of the online Haken circles I'm in have speculated that the band in going through some internal conflict right now (namely towards Diego), which I really hope isn't true, but with how little information we have right now in these uncertain times, it could be fucking anything. :-\
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Do we know if the issue is still the shipping during the pandemic? Because I'm starting to doubt that that's the only reason, considering how many other IO releases have come out in June. Especially so, considering that I don't think anyone confirmed the delay was because of the pandemic in the first place.
Some of the online Haken circles I'm in have speculated that the band in going through some internal conflict right now (namely towards Diego), which I really hope isn't true, but with how little information we have right now in these uncertain times, it could be fucking anything. :-\
Oh no oh no oh no oh no oh oh no oh no oh no.
Please let this Haken lineup be stable. It's perfect. I hope the boys are not having beef with each other.
Where did you find this information?
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Do we know if the issue is still the shipping during the pandemic? Because I'm starting to doubt that that's the only reason, considering how many other IO releases have come out in June. Especially so, considering that I don't think anyone confirmed the delay was because of the pandemic in the first place.
Some of the online Haken circles I'm in have speculated that the band in going through some internal conflict right now (namely towards Diego), which I really hope isn't true, but with how little information we have right now in these uncertain times, it could be fucking anything. :-\
Oh no oh no oh no oh no oh oh no oh no oh no.
Please let this Haken lineup be stable. It's perfect. I hope the boys are not having beef with each other.
Where did you find this information?
From the Haken discord server, & some screenshots of Facebook fan groups that my gf has shown me. I should specify that this is pure speculation, but the things that I've seen brought up are:
-Diego recently released a new EP, which Haken hasn't promoted
-Diego is the only Haken member to not appear on their twitch streams, which are a big bonding event for the other members
-Diego's been really low in the mix of the Virus tracks we've heard so far
-No official personnel have come forward with a definitive reason why Virus has been delayed three times so far
I really don't think that any of these points prove it, & I certainly hope it's just a coincidence, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't really worried too. :'(
Edit: on second thought, I don't think I should be spreading rumours like this, but I'll let you know whether anything gets confirmed or denied, if someone else doesn't post it here first
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Yeah I did some research in Haken Haven and Reddit, and found some of those things too. I'm seriously concerned, Haken is arguably my favourite of all "newer" bands.
By the way, the band has not confirmed that last postponement of the release date, or am I missing something?
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Yeah I did some research in Haken Haven and Reddit, and found some of those things too. I'm seriously concerned, Haken is arguably my favourite of all "newer" bands.
By the way, the band has not confirmed that last postponement of the release date, or am I missing something?
A lot of emails have been sent to pre-orderers saying the release has been postponed. Google Play also lists July 24th as the release date, but idk if the other sites have updated yet (they hadn't when I checked this morning).
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Dammit! This thing's never coming out. It better be the best thing they've ever done at this rate.
I managed to get a Pattern-Seeking Animals CD last month, so CD production is clearly still happening at IO, and things are being relaxed now so that should no longer be an issue. It's obviously something else, something they're not telling us.
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That would suck if any conflict resulted in Diego leaving the band. I’ve said for awhile that he’s the band’s MVP. But the last two albums and these new songs we’ve heard from Virus all seem to be pushing the guitars more up front, which was a contrast to the first three albums all of which had a great keyboard/guitar balance. Maybe he’s not happy about taking a lesser role. I get it if these delays of the new album are out of their control, but to stay mum and not put some kind of statement out to the fans to smooth things over is very odd.
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Maybe there's legal ramifications?
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Maybe there's legal ramifications?
Not sure though about this. If they are changing the credits of the songs, then they would have to reprint the artwork and credits in sleeves, etc. But I remember DT did the songwriting credits on the legal/business aspect side with the appropriate credit and songwriter, etc, and just printed "music by Dream Theater, lyrics by ...." on the cd sleeves.
Legally, they can work it out on the side with the album being released at the same time.
On the Twitch thing, maybe just the time zones don't work for Diego. I think he lives in Mexico City.
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I really hope this news isn't true. I've been so excited for this album to come out. I wonder if Diego isn't happy with the mix? If the album has been delayed again, this could really hurt their sales. The singles are there to build up excitement right before the album lands, and with so much wait time that hype goes away.
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Maybe there's legal ramifications?
Not sure though about this. If they are changing the credits of the songs, then they would have to reprint the artwork and credits in sleeves, etc. But I remember DT did the songwriting credits on the legal/business aspect side with the appropriate credit and songwriter, etc, and just printed "music by Dream Theater, lyrics by ...." on the cd sleeves.
Legally, they can work it out on the side with the album being released at the same time.
On the Twitch thing, maybe just the time zones don't work for Diego. I think he lives in Mexico City.
for all I know (and based on what I've read) he recorded most (if not all) of his keyboard parts in Mexico City,yes. Ross' vocals as well if I'm not mistaken. ("The Bunker, Mexico City" is indicated in the album liner notes for Vector anyway)
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Only thing I can think off that might be a more realistic issue versus to what has been posted would be that Diego just decided to play with Devin Townsend. He was playing double duty with them and found it to be a better role and outlet than what he currently has with Haken. Also, Devin has been rescheduling some of the European shows and maybe there's a scheduling conflict with Haken's plans.
My gut tells me it's just a logistics issue with printing/manufacturing plants and shipping. If the product is coming from Europe, maybe there are some shipment delays with the distributor, pressing plants, customs, Fedex/UPS/DHL. I know I/O had some distributor issues right before the Covid thing and some releases were delayed a bit as well. Remember, the machine doesn't really start going until about 3 months prior to release date. The original one was June 5. If you go back 3 months, that's around March. That's when everything came to a halt. So by the time you get going, pressing plants have already been delayed with the already scheduled releases, plus the new incoming orders, that's just a massive backlog. I know I have had issues with small packages shipping from Europe..Took two months for a non-registered mail package. Customs is another area where there are delays (some of my overseas clients have had issues just getting us parts to us). Some clients have said that UPS and Fedex is only delivering the products using their expensive tiers. Shipping hubs from Fedex and UPS have also been affected and trying to adjust to the new Covid measures. I wouldn't panic yet until an official announcement is posted. I know the band hasn't explicitly said anything about the delay. They only mentioned unfortunate circumstances beyond the label and band's control...which might be what I am talking about in this last paragraph on logistics.
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From Facebook
Hi all, we hope everyone is doing well out there!
We’ve been informed that our new album ‘Virus’ will now be released on Friday 24th July 2020.
We can only apologise for any inconvenience and disappointment this causes. We really, really appreciate everyone for their support and ongoing patience during these unprecedented times. We don’t take it for granted!
-Marc.
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Based off that, it looks like it is a logistics issue and not an internal band issue. Which is good news. Still sucks that the album has been delayed again. But, I will support the band and this will be a day 1 buy for me.
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Only thing I can think off that might be a more realistic issue versus to what has been posted would be that Diego just decided to play with Devin Townsend. He was playing double duty with them and found it to be a better role and outlet than what he currently has with Haken. Also, Devin has been rescheduling some of the European shows and maybe there's a scheduling conflict with Haken's plans.
I think this would be a terrible move for Diego. I love Devin and Devin is a bigger "brand" than Haken, BUT Devin is known for switching musicians and his "backing band" so I couldn't imagine anyone leaving their main band to join Devin and think that would be permanent. However, maybe doing the double duties has made some scheduling difficulties and has lead to Diego not being as involved as he previously was. I'd be really upset if he left Haken, but my gut is going with this being a logistics issue.
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We should start a guessing game about when the album will be released.
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We should start a guessing game about when the album will be released.
Perhaps being optimistic, but I think 24th July will stick.
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I'll go for 8th August just for the sake of it :biggrin:
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We should start a guessing game about when the album will be released.
Perhaps being optimistic, but I think 24th July will stick.
If it doesn't, there's got to be something seriously wrong. At least if the band doesn't come out with an explanation, another delay without reason will have me seriously worried.
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All this will expand into Toolian proportions concerning release dates and taking bets about them :D
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Toolian... This should become a word.
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If the album has been delayed again, this could really hurt their sales. The singles are there to build up excitement right before the album lands, and with so much wait time that hype goes away.
If I may take this another way, I'd say IO's current method of releasing half the album as singles before the album's release isn't really good for album hype. I feel like they start promotion for it a bit too far out.
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If the album has been delayed again, this could really hurt their sales. The singles are there to build up excitement right before the album lands, and with so much wait time that hype goes away.
If I may take this another way, I'd say IO's current method of releasing half the album as singles before the album's release isn't really good for album hype. I feel like they start promotion for it a bit too far out.
Three singles is fairly standard, which seems the case for most of the InsideOut releases. The timing (given the album's original release date) was also completely fine. No point in releasing any singles if you don't give at least some space between them and the album release.
I'm not the biggest fan of IO so I haven't followed many of their releases, but the sweet spot for me is somewhere around 2 months between first single and/or album announcement and the street date, and 2 or 3 singles.
EDIT: Also, the band had a tour planned later this year that they stuck with even when it looked like they probably should cancel it. Maybe this somehow affected the album release, since they most likely wanted to combine this album release with the tour for promotional purposes. When they found out the tour won't happen and can't be announced, I find it likely that the label decided that they don't depend on getting the album out ASAP anymore and perhaps moved around the album release to make more sense on its own merits rather than being the medium to promote their tour.
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We should start a guessing game about when the album will be released.
I'll believe it when it's in my hands. And barely then.
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Someone made an edit to the Wikipedia page for Virus, claiming that it's been delayed to September 10th, 2021, and that it has been delayed 87 times.
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Brilliant marketing. Just like the corona virus numbers the album Virus release numbers are bullshit.
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Since the label gladly took our money when we preordered the album, it would definitely be appropriate to clarify what is going on and why they can't give us a download like other labels did. It's fine that they can't, just explain why they can't provide us the finished product we already paid for.
Protest the Hero and Sheet Happens Publishing are a model example of how to handle this.
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One thing that I observed today (which is somewhat related to Haken and most definitely related to IO) is that Long Distance Calling released their new album (on IO) on time today (so I would guess Haken's third delay might not be IO's fault. Anyway, carry on.
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(https://i.ibb.co/MVpntjr/104668595-3110839929000585-247188405417516403-o.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cFtJZp0)
no puedo ver mis fotos en facebook (https://es.imgbb.com/)
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If it's not even being made available on streaming services. It has something to do within the album itself. Could be legal reasons, if the Diego rumors are true. Could also be the name, and the governments not allowing them to release an album called "Virus" in the middle of a pandemic. Or could be something entirely different than what we gathered so far.
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(https://i.ibb.co/MVpntjr/104668595-3110839929000585-247188405417516403-o.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cFtJZp0)
no puedo ver mis fotos en facebook (https://es.imgbb.com/)
Gotcha covered! ;)
From Facebook
Hi all, we hope everyone is doing well out there!
We’ve been informed that our new album ‘Virus’ will now be released on Friday 24th July 2020.
We can only apologise for any inconvenience and disappointment this causes. We really, really appreciate everyone for their support and ongoing patience during these unprecedented times. We don’t take it for granted!
-Marc.
If it's not even being made available on streaming services. It has something to do within the album itself. Could be legal reasons, if the Diego rumors are true. Could also be the name, and the governments not allowing them to release an album called "Virus" in the middle of a pandemic. Or could be something entirely different than what we gathered so far.
I've been wondering this, too, but it's purely coincidental, and can places really prevent Inside Out from selling an album titled Virus, especially when we've know about it for months already?
-Marc.
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If it's not even being made available on streaming services. It has something to do within the album itself. Could be legal reasons, if the Diego rumors are true. Could also be the name, and the governments not allowing them to release an album called "Virus" in the middle of a pandemic. Or could be something entirely different than what we gathered so far.
I've been wondering this, too, but it's purely coincidental, and can places really prevent Inside Out from selling an album titled Virus, especially when we've know about it for months already?
-Marc.
It's a really amazing coincidence, especially with it being delayed and not on streaming services. That question is why I'm wondering about it.
Plus you know how sensitive people are these days.
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So far this is the most likely scenario. I think the name is the exact reason there is a problem. Which is stupid in my view.
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Amaranthe just released a single today called Viral. I really don't think that's the reasoning.
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Amaranthe just released a single today called Viral. I really don't think that's the reasoning.
I'm also thinking the cover plays into it as well.
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Brujeria released a song today called COVID-666 :rollin
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Amaranthe just released a single today called Viral. I really don't think that's the reasoning.
I'm also thinking the cover plays into it as well.
Why? Am I missing something?
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Some of the speculation in here is borderline ridiculous
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They are working behind the scenes to change the name of the album to "Please Stay, Diego."
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Or they could release a new single “COVID-19” sung to the tune of “Come On, Eileen”
:rollin
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Amaranthe just released a single today called Viral. I really don't think that's the reasoning.
I'm also thinking the cover plays into it as well.
Why? Am I missing something?
It has a Virus on it.
But, all this is just pure speculation, and shouldn't be taken serious.
I'm just still wondering why they couldn't just put it up on streaming services.
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Maybe Haken are having second thoughts about releasing an album called Virus during a global pandemic. Title change incoming. Messiah Complex as an alternative? As that's the dominant track.
I mean, they are largely based in the PC-gone-mad UK, so it's possible.
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Maybe, but I feel like that sort of thing would be more beneficial to sales if the label announced the name change as early as possible.
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Maybe Haken are having second thoughts about releasing an album called Virus during a global pandemic. Title change incoming. Messiah Complex as an alternative? As that's the dominant track.
I seriously hope that won't happen. This name is crucial for the whole concept of the V/VI double decker.
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Maybe Haken are having second thoughts about releasing an album called Virus during a global pandemic. Title change incoming. Messiah Complex as an alternative? As that's the dominant track.
I seriously hope that won't happen. This name is crucial for the whole concept of the V/VI double decker.
they'll change it to Visions 2 :loser:
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Visions Pt. 2: Scenes from a Virus
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Visions Pt. 2: Scenes from a Virus
:rollin
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Maybe Haken are having second thoughts about releasing an album called Virus during a global pandemic. Title change incoming. Messiah Complex as an alternative? As that's the dominant track.
I seriously hope that won't happen. This name is crucial for the whole concept of the V/VI double decker.
This is a good reason to fight to keep the name.
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I saw that the virus is spreading before Haken said it would. ;)
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Every time I see a new post in this thread, I click on it and expect to see a "new album has been postponed to 2022" post. :lol :facepalm:
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or worse, like Diego has left the band
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I saw that the virus is spreading before Haken said it would. ;)
Oh... It's very difficult to control the spread of viruses.
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Someone needs to change the thread title to reflect the latest release date.
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Haken is social distancing their new album release. ??? :lol
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Haken is social distancing their new album release. ??? :lol
I guess so. The irony about all this (to me) is that Tool delayed Fear Inoculum for long as well and AFAIK inoculum means immune. I might be wrong though.
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A Wuhan happened with this album
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A Wuhan happened with this album
:lol
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Someone on reddit posted this
https://www.jbhifi.com.au/products/cd-haken-virus-cd
Release date October 30th
Say it ain’t so...
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Wow wtf
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I would be worried, but my interest/excitement for the band had decreased a lot since Vector, to the point where I only checked the first single and didn't bother with the rest. I'll probably listen to the album once it's out, but I just don't like their current musical direction at all. They're just a fancy djent band at this point.
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I really hope the band at least discloses why they keep postponing it.
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I really hope the band at least discloses why they keep postponing it.
They need to before people check out IMO. I mean, they have their fans and all but the people on the fringe will lose interest if the band doesn't start explaining things.
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I would be worried, but my interest/excitement for the band had decreased a lot since Vector, to the point where I only checked the first single and didn't bother with the rest. I'll probably listen to the album once it's out, but I just don't like their current musical direction at all. They're just a fancy djent band at this point.
Having been “infected with the Virus” so to say, if you didn’t like Vector you probably won’t like the new album.
I don’t mind the new direction, but I feel like they’ve taken it as far as they can without being full blown Djent. I hope they dial it back a bit next time.
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Someone on reddit posted this
https://www.jbhifi.com.au/products/cd-haken-virus-cd
Release date October 30th
Say it ain’t so...
Seems unlikely considering I saw a Facebook post from InsideOutMusic this morning showing off the 2CD Media book and even confirmed the July 24th release date. If it had changed again, I doubt they would have posted that today.
-Marc.
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Someone on reddit posted this
https://www.jbhifi.com.au/products/cd-haken-virus-cd
Release date October 30th
Say it ain’t so...
Seems unlikely considering I saw a Facebook post from InsideOutMusic this morning showing off the 2CD Media book and even confirmed the July 24th release date. If it had changed again, I doubt they would have posted that today.
-Marc.
Yep. There’s also a retweet from 7 hours ago from the label that still shows July 24th as the release date.
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Guys it says this on the JB Hi Fi page. It's just when they expect to get stock.
Please note that due to distributing issues, stock is delayed. Stock is expected to arrive in store & online as per the displayed release date. Expected timeframe is subject to change
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B-b-but Reddit said....
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Ok so as far as I'm aware, there's no change to 30th October and that one website just has a made up date. As I understand it the band is still confident about 24th July.
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I would be worried, but my interest/excitement for the band had decreased a lot since Vector, to the point where I only checked the first single and didn't bother with the rest. I'll probably listen to the album once it's out, but I just don't like their current musical direction at all. They're just a fancy djent band at this point.
The Mountain showed such promise and their sound now sounds far from that.
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Unfortunately, the band’s confidence can make little difference. If IDontNotDoThings is correct (haven’t checked the source yet) and they don’t have an absolutely confirmed set in stone shipping date for the pressings, there’s still a likelihood of postponings (they even warned that it’s subject to change). I don’t know which pressing plant they are at, but we’ve also been experiencing a lot of pressing delays at Pelagic since corona started. Luckily most of these were in production way in advance so won’t result in release delays, but you don’t always have the luxury to start production early.
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I would be worried, but my interest/excitement for the band had decreased a lot since Vector, to the point where I only checked the first single and didn't bother with the rest. I'll probably listen to the album once it's out, but I just don't like their current musical direction at all. They're just a fancy djent band at this point.
The Mountain showed such promise and their sound now sounds far from that.
I wouldn't read too much into "their sound now" - the only reason Virus's core sound is so similar to Vector (despite being a bit more varied) is that it's a direct sequel. The next album won't be, and so I would very much expect it to sound fairly different again.
Unfortunately, the band’s confidence can make little difference. If IDontNotDoThings is correct (haven’t checked the source yet) and they don’t have an absolutely confirmed set in stone shipping date for the pressings, there’s still a likelihood of postponings (they even warned that it’s subject to change). I don’t know which pressing plant they are at, but we’ve also been experiencing a lot of pressing delays at Pelagic since corona started. Luckily most of these were in production way in advance so won’t result in release delays, but you don’t always have the luxury to start production early.
Yeah I wasn't meaning that the band's confidence had any impact on the practicalities of the situation, but rather the other way round - because of where things are with the current situation, the band is more confident about the release date.
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You quote the entire post but it seems like you only reply to my first sentence (which was kind of silly I admit).
I mean to say that if IDNDT’s source is legit, then it’s still very much unsure whether this release date can be confirmed.
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You quote the entire post but it seems like you only reply to my first sentence (which was kind of silly I admit).
:lol Ok fair.
I mean to say that if IDNDT’s source is legit, then it’s still very much unsure whether this release date can be confirmed.
Oh yeah for sure and I'm not stating that it's 100% confirmed (and honestly I don't know whether it is, but it could well be). Obviously I don't know all the details, just that as far as I'm aware things are now on track for 24th.
As for that particular source, it's just one web store.
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I would be worried, but my interest/excitement for the band had decreased a lot since Vector, to the point where I only checked the first single and didn't bother with the rest. I'll probably listen to the album once it's out, but I just don't like their current musical direction at all. They're just a fancy djent band at this point.
The Mountain showed such promise and their sound now sounds far from that.
I wouldn't read too much into "their sound now" - the only reason Virus's core sound is so similar to Vector (despite being a bit more varied) is that it's a direct sequel. The next album won't be, and so I would very much expect it to sound fairly different again.
I hope you're right, but it's not just Vector/Virus, their sound has been slowly morphing into this for a while now. I discovered Haken around 2011, just after Visions was released, but my introduction song was Celestial Elixir, and I loved it instantly. Then The Mountain came and that solidified them as one of my favorite bands at that time.
Restoration was really good and a nice change for those old songs, it was a nice taste of what things could be like for the, then, next album. Then Affinity arrived and there were songs I didn't care at all about, though I still enjoyed the album, it wasn't as much as the previous ones.
Then Vector came and I was disappointed by their musical direction once again and that I was disliking a few songs on a very short album. Not just being "meh" about them, but actually disliking songs.
Now Virus seems to continue those choices even further and, while I've only listened to the first single, I'm not excited at all about this, and that song did absolutely nothing for me vs The Good Doctor which was a fun/catchy single.
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As someone who loved Vector, I anticipate loving Virus. I also have no issue with the delay. When it's ready and available, I listen to it. A delayed album is small potatoes when compared to life's issues, in my opinion.
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I would be worried, but my interest/excitement for the band had decreased a lot since Vector, to the point where I only checked the first single and didn't bother with the rest. I'll probably listen to the album once it's out, but I just don't like their current musical direction at all. They're just a fancy djent band at this point.
The Mountain showed such promise and their sound now sounds far from that.
I wouldn't read too much into "their sound now" - the only reason Virus's core sound is so similar to Vector (despite being a bit more varied) is that it's a direct sequel. The next album won't be, and so I would very much expect it to sound fairly different again.
I hope you're right, but it's not just Vector/Virus, their sound has been slowly morphing into this for a while now. I discovered Haken around 2011, just after Visions was released, but my introduction song was Celestial Elixir, and I loved it instantly. Then The Mountain came and that solidified them as one of my favorite bands at that time.
Restoration was really good and a nice change for those old songs, it was a nice taste of what things could be like for the, then, next album. Then Affinity arrived and there were songs I didn't care at all about, though I still enjoyed the album, it wasn't as much as the previous ones.
Then Vector came and I was disappointed by their musical direction once again and that I was disliking a few songs on a very short album. Not just being "meh" about them, but actually disliking songs.
Now Virus seems to continue those choices even further and, while I've only listened to the first single, I'm not excited at all about this, and that song did absolutely nothing for me vs The Good Doctor which was a fun/catchy single.
Oh, I can understand.
I discovered Haken with The Mountain, and I was very impressed (still love the album). The feeling was that I had finally discovered another great prog metal band (unlike prog rock, I think prog metal is a genre with few good bands and many not so good bands).
After listening to The Mountain several times, I went to check out the old records. OK, not so good as The Mountain. Some cool moments, others very generic here and there. Acceptable, though.
Restoration was very interesting, although I haven't heard this EP in a few years (I need to...). Affinity came and I didn't like it. A very brave change of sound, but I didn't like the result and I never listened to it again (I think I really need to reevaluate the album nowadays).
With Vector I came to the conclusion that it is not a band for me.
Being very strict, I consider that the only album I really love is The Mountain. As it was the first one I listened to, I usually joke that it deceived me. :lol
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Rich, I'm guessing spoilers aren't allowed in the thread, correct? Just have quite the urge to discuss this album haha.
(This is why DTF needs a discord server!)
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Unfortunately, the band’s confidence can make little difference. If IDontNotDoThings is correct (haven’t checked the source yet) and they don’t have an absolutely confirmed set in stone shipping date for the pressings, there’s still a likelihood of postponings (they even warned that it’s subject to change). I don’t know which pressing plant they are at, but we’ve also been experiencing a lot of pressing delays at Pelagic since corona started. Luckily most of these were in production way in advance so won’t result in release delays, but you don’t always have the luxury to start production early.
I get what you're saying, but I think I should mention the detail that JB Hi Fi is an Australian retailer, so the shipping delays there could simply be because of its geographic location (which I doubt IO has a pressing plant at).
Still, it is worrysome that IO may delay the album until it can be shipped everywhere.
(This is why DTF needs a discord server!)
There already is one. https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=50543.0
& there's also a Haken server, which I can DM you the link if you want.
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No clue is the album had already "dripped," but it's inevitable and continued delays will only result in fans finding ways to get it on the down low and then not buying it when it is eventually released next March (or 2022, or 2024). Like it or not, that is the culture we are in now, and it's a huge blunder for both the label and the band to not be specific as to why there have been multiple delays. DoC is right in that there are far bigger issues in the world right now, but that doesn't negate how poorly this whole thing has been handled by both the band and the label. Fans are the customers, and this just isn't good customer service.
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I doubt that fans cancel preorders when an album leaks.
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They might if they don't like the album.
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Can't speak for everyone, but the album must really suck and the band must put a couple of sucky album in a row for me to decide to not buy their new album if I already have all of their previous albums in my collection. I don't have this album pre-ordered as my financial situation is a bit screwed due to Covid, but even if I don't like this album, I'll still buy it because the previous five were good and I would want to have my Haken studio albums collection complete.
This is what happened with Sonata Arctica btw, I kept buying their albums after The Days of Grays because I had all of their other albums but the quality kept declining to the point that I held Talviyo (their latest album) in my hands in Amsterdam music store a few weeks after release and I just put it back on the shelf because I'm done with this band.
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I doubt that fans cancel preorders when an album leaks.
Okay, but I would not assume that all or even most fans pre-order upcoming releases. For many fans, like me, who only buy stuff digitally now, there is no need to pre-order it. Heck, even back when I was still buying physical copies of new CD's, I rarely pre-ordered them.
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I rarely buy albums before listening to them a few times. There are a few bands that I preorder albums from until they consistently drop in quality, Haken are one of them.
Existence of pre-release leaks or streams has zero effect on my purchase behaviour. I don't assume that everyone ticks like me, but I'm certain that my behaviour is rather common nowadays.
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I think Haken's currently in a "can do no wrong" phase for me; all of their releases thus far are absolutely amazing. For album rankings, The Mountain, Affinity, and Vector are all tied for #1, Aquarius is #2, and Visions is #3 (I still haven't revisited Restoration, but I'll get to it). Dream Theater is still the best to me, but I think it's safe to say that Haken is my #2 band.
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Their opening four, to my ears, is the greatest opening four in the history of prog rock with only Pain of Salvation being close.
Vector...wasn’t bad. In fact it would’ve been a fantastic album for anyone else. But the first four were so hard to live up to, and Vector just doesn’t. But I already love the three singles from virus a lot more than I liked anything on vector.
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So, If you pre-order the CD did you get a digital copy now? I ask because my brother in law said "Hey Bro. I received an early release of the Haken album, Virus. Officially it doesn't come out until the 24th. I pre ordered the CD (better quality)"
Now, he's a real stand up guy and have a tough time believing he found a pirated copy? Am I wrong? Or did pre-order folks get a stream link?
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So, If you pre-order the CD did you get a digital copy now? I ask because my brother in law said "Hey Bro. I received an early release of the Haken album, Virus. Officially it doesn't come out until the 24th. I pre ordered the CD (better quality)"
Now, he's a real stand up guy and have a tough time believing he found a pirated copy? Am I wrong? Or did pre-order folks get a stream link?
As far as I know, no outlets have offered a download or streaming option for the album yet. Even if they did, it wouldn't be available until the (currently) official release date.
-Marc.
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Thanks Marc. I will have to ask him when I talk to him next.
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Rich, I'm guessing spoilers aren't allowed in the thread, correct? Just have quite the urge to discuss this album haha.
Really appreciate you asking! :tup Yeah I'd prefer to keep the forum free of spoilery discussion until the release date, apart from what's in official reviews of course.
No clue is the album had already "dripped," but it's inevitable and continued delays will only result in fans finding ways to get it on the down low and then not buying it when it is eventually released next March (or 2022, or 2024). Like it or not, that is the culture we are in now, and it's a huge blunder for both the label and the band to not be specific as to why there have been multiple delays. DoC is right in that there are far bigger issues in the world right now, but that doesn't negate how poorly this whole thing has been handled by both the band and the label. Fans are the customers, and this just isn't good customer service.
With all due respect, this post appears to assume that it was within the band's or label's power to publicly be specific about why the album has been delayed a few times, but there's no evidence that that's the case or that it's been handled badly. The fact that online culture is now considerably more entitled and impatient doesn't mean they could do anything about it.
I do hope people can have just a bit more patience - it's less than two weeks now and from what I understand everything is now on track to meet that.
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So, If you pre-order the CD did you get a digital copy now? I ask because my brother in law said "Hey Bro. I received an early release of the Haken album, Virus. Officially it doesn't come out until the 24th. I pre ordered the CD (better quality)"
Now, he's a real stand up guy and have a tough time believing he found a pirated copy? Am I wrong? Or did pre-order folks get a stream link?
As far as I know, no outlets have offered a download or streaming option for the album yet. Even if they did, it wouldn't be available until the (currently) official release date.
-Marc.
A pirated copy is being shared all over the unofficial Haken discord. I'm holding out, although tempted to download it as I see lots of people talking about it, but I'm mostly just avoiding that place at this point. Less then 2 weeks away, I can wait, but if say it gets pushed to October without any explanation.. I may not be able to resist the temptation.
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I'm holding out, although tempted to download it as I see lots of people talking I can wait, but if say it gets pushed to October without any explanation.. I may not be able to resist the temptation.
:lol :lol :lol
Yeah, I thought what he gave me was legit. I feel a little bad now. Regardless, I will more than likely buy the CD, cause I still like hard copies of my favorite bands works
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I doubt that fans cancel preorders when an album leaks.
Okay, but I would not assume that all or even most fans pre-order upcoming releases. For many fans, like me, who only buy stuff digitally now, there is no need to pre-order it. Heck, even back when I was still buying physical copies of new CD's, I rarely pre-ordered them.
What I am pre-ordering isn't the music itself. It's the Artwork and packaging that go along with it. It's why I pre-ordered The Astonishing Box Set, and realize it was a daunting task to undertake with the 3-D printed NOMAC which is really detailed and nice by the way.
If the artist isn't offering an interesting boxset like that. I'll just pre-order the album.
In these times of Streaming. As I said in an earlier post, there is no excuse not to release the music on a streaming platform.
Which is why, until it does get released, it has to do with the name. Maybe not here, but in other parts of the world.
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I'm holding out, although tempted to download it as I see lots of people talking I can wait, but if say it gets pushed to October without any explanation.. I may not be able to resist the temptation.
:lol :lol :lol
Yeah, I thought what he gave me was legit. I feel a little bad now. Regardless, I will more than likely buy the CD, cause I still like hard copies of my favorite bands works
Don't feel bad. Whether the band or labels fault, it's what was likely to happen once they kept delaying the music and it's out there.
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It's not the band's or the label's fault and this is a shitty enough situation for them.
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My logic on early leaks is I never seek them out, as I am pretty patient when it comes to new album releases (despite my posts about this delay), but if someone emails me a link or something that makes it easy, I will usually not resist and listen. I have no intentions of hearing the Haken album until it is finally released.
With all due respect, this post appears to assume that it was within the band's or label's power to publicly be specific about why the album has been delayed a few times, but there's no evidence that that's the case or that it's been handled badly. The fact that online culture is now considerably more entitled and impatient doesn't mean they could do anything about it.
I do hope people can have just a bit more patience - it's less than two weeks now and from what I understand everything is now on track to meet that.
Patience is not my issue here. I am almost always pretty patient when it comes to new releases. Customer service is what I am taking issue with here, and it is hard to believe that neither the band nor the label cannot let the customers know why these delays keep happening. If the issue is the title, then come out and say it. Legally speaking, what would stop them? I am honestly asking.
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^ agreed this has been poorly handled in PR terms
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With all due respect, this post appears to assume that it was within the band's or label's power to publicly be specific about why the album has been delayed a few times, but there's no evidence that that's the case or that it's been handled badly. The fact that online culture is now considerably more entitled and impatient doesn't mean they could do anything about it.
I do hope people can have just a bit more patience - it's less than two weeks now and from what I understand everything is now on track to meet that.
Patience is not my issue here. I am almost always pretty patient when it comes to new releases. Customer service is what I am taking issue with here, and it is hard to believe that neither the band nor the label cannot let the customers know why these delays keep happening. If the issue is the title, then come out and say it. Legally speaking, what would stop them? I am honestly asking.
Yeah that's my fault as I wasn't clear, but I was more meaning patient with the band in terms of communications etc. I'm not aware of any issue with the title, as far as I know the complications have been things that the band can't talk, or at least can't talk about yet. I hope everything becomes clearer once the album is out as I feel that some people are quite quick to make assumptions and rush to judgement (again, part of the online culture these days I suppose).
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There we go then. That only leaves the Diego situation as the only possible explanation. There has to be an element of truth to that rumour otherwise it wouldn't have come out.
I rushed to judgment. Try and stop me.
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There we go then. That only leaves the Diego situation as the only possible explanation. There has to be an element of truth to that rumour otherwise it wouldn't have come out.
I rushed to judgment. Try and stop me.
what would Diego have to do with all this?
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With all due respect, this post appears to assume that it was within the band's or label's power to publicly be specific about why the album has been delayed a few times, but there's no evidence that that's the case or that it's been handled badly. The fact that online culture is now considerably more entitled and impatient doesn't mean they could do anything about it.
I do hope people can have just a bit more patience - it's less than two weeks now and from what I understand everything is now on track to meet that.
Patience is not my issue here. I am almost always pretty patient when it comes to new releases. Customer service is what I am taking issue with here, and it is hard to believe that neither the band nor the label cannot let the customers know why these delays keep happening. If the issue is the title, then come out and say it. Legally speaking, what would stop them? I am honestly asking.
Yeah that's my fault as I wasn't clear, but I was more meaning patient with the band in terms of communications etc. I'm not aware of any issue with the title, as far as I know the complications have been things that the band can't talk, or at least can't talk about yet. I hope everything becomes clearer once the album is out as I feel that some people are quite quick to make assumptions and rush to judgement (again, part of the online culture these days I suppose).
It is natural that people will speculate, and sometimes there will be fairly wild speculations, if there is no transparent reason given for the delay.
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Yeah that's my fault as I wasn't clear, but I was more meaning patient with the band in terms of communications etc. I'm not aware of any issue with the title, as far as I know the complications have been things that the band can't talk, or at least can't talk about yet. I hope everything becomes clearer once the album is out as I feel that some people are quite quick to make assumptions and rush to judgement (again, part of the online culture these days I suppose).
Who is rushing to judgment? As customers, all some of us are asking for is the reason why the product we have been told is getting released keeps getting delayed. That is more than reasonable for us to ask.
Steven Wilson delayed the release of his new album once (instead of rolling it back several times) and gave us the reason why at the same time. That's how you do it.
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There we go then. That only leaves the Diego situation as the only possible explanation. There has to be an element of truth to that rumour otherwise it wouldn't have come out.
I rushed to judgment. Try and stop me.
But how would that delay the actual release of the album?
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As customers, all some of us are asking for is the reason why the product we have been told is getting released keeps getting delayed. That is more than reasonable for us to ask.
Yup, I totally agree with this.
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There we go then. That only leaves the Diego situation as the only possible explanation. There has to be an element of truth to that rumour otherwise it wouldn't have come out.
I rushed to judgment. Try and stop me.
what would Diego have to do with all this?
Read a few pages back in this thread. He's probably taken them to court for something or other. If it was a logistical problem with pressing discs or a mixing problem, they would tell us. The fact they can't tell us leaves me in no doubt that it's for legal reasons. Otherwise what do they have to hide? They are not being honest with their fans who put bread on their table.
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Truly enjoying the available singles. These guys sizzle!
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There we go then. That only leaves the Diego situation as the only possible explanation. There has to be an element of truth to that rumour otherwise it wouldn't have come out.
I rushed to judgment. Try and stop me.
what would Diego have to do with all this?
Read a few pages back in this thread. He's probably taken them to court for something or other. If it was a logistical problem with pressing discs or a mixing problem, they would tell us. The fact they can't tell us leaves me in no doubt that it's for legal reasons. Otherwise what do they have to hide? They are not being honest with their fans who put bread on their table.
I agree. They're doing all those Twitch sessions (haven't seen anything of it) and are pretty active on Social Media. It doesn't make sense to be completely silent about the delay unless it's something they can't tell right now. I wouldn't be surprised if we get another delay in a few days which will confirm something not right.
I really hope the Diego rumours are just rumours and he stays in the band. If the rumours are true I wouldn't be surprised if he announces a project with Eric Gilette (and probably a certain drummer they both shared the stage with..)
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Actually, Diego said in an interview (which I believe was with MinistroRaven) that he would love to do something with Eric Gillette and Baard Kolstad. That would excite me much more than Haken currently does :metal
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With all due respect, this post appears to assume that it was within the band's or label's power to publicly be specific about why the album has been delayed a few times, but there's no evidence that that's the case or that it's been handled badly. The fact that online culture is now considerably more entitled and impatient doesn't mean they could do anything about it.
I do hope people can have just a bit more patience - it's less than two weeks now and from what I understand everything is now on track to meet that.
Patience is not my issue here. I am almost always pretty patient when it comes to new releases. Customer service is what I am taking issue with here, and it is hard to believe that neither the band nor the label cannot let the customers know why these delays keep happening. If the issue is the title, then come out and say it. Legally speaking, what would stop them? I am honestly asking.
Yeah that's my fault as I wasn't clear, but I was more meaning patient with the band in terms of communications etc. I'm not aware of any issue with the title, as far as I know the complications have been things that the band can't talk, or at least can't talk about yet. I hope everything becomes clearer once the album is out as I feel that some people are quite quick to make assumptions and rush to judgement (again, part of the online culture these days I suppose).
It is natural that people will speculate, and sometimes there will be fairly wild speculations, if there is no transparent reason given for the delay.
Oh absolutely, if you scroll back through the thread since the first delay was mentioned, at no point have I suggested that people shouldn't speculate, and indeed I was speculating a little myself at first. I know some people don't like speculation, but I'm completely fine with it.
It's just that it's one thing to say "maybe it's this", "I wonder if it's that" or even "based on all this stuff, it seems like it's probably that", but another to make assumptions about what is or isn't going on and then form judgements based on those assumptions. I don't really see that as speculating.
Don't get me wrong, I understand it. I just consider it unfair on the band and the label.
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For me,
I would like an explanation about why they couldn't release the music digitally?
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I remember when a German band pretended that a band member didn't exist anymore during the marketing of their new album. Just to weird people out and get them talking.
Maybe Haken are going for something similar...
...a VIRAL marketing stunt :o
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I just hope the July 24th release sticks and we can finally listen to the new album. And I also hope that any rumors about the band itself end up not being true.
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I can't place my thumb on it... But I have a feeling that Godzilla and Al Qaeda have something to do with the delay.
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As someone who cannot really get into Haken due to the vocals, I do not seem to have that problem with Vector, was listening today and like it.
For me,
I would like an explanation about why they couldn't release the music digitally?
Probably because a lot of physical sales tend to be frontloaded? Miss that window and it will likely affect sales.
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As someone who cannot really get into Halen due to the vocals...
Neither the Roth nor the Hager era? Usually people enjoy at least one flavour of Van Halen.
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As someone who cannot really get into Halen due to the vocals...
Neither the Roth nor the Hager era? Usually people enjoy at least one flavour of Van Halen.
Yeah, typo and no I was never able to get into Halen either ;D
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I was thinking about how many artists have still been putting out records and various projects despite the current global situation and wondered why Haken couldn't just do the same and release the thing digitally, which is how most people tend to consume music nowadays. Although I'm open to the idea that I'm simply uninformed, so anyone feel free the correct me if I'm wrong. Could it be that Haken, not being the most popular band in the world, relies predominantly on the physical sales of their studio output when not touring?
Again, I'm well aware that there may be other factors that I haven't considered. I'm just not 100% on how a band on Haken's scale generates the majority of their income when releasing new music.
Not having been the hugest fan of Vector and hearing how similar Virus will be to it, I'm not exactly at the edge of my seat to hear it, but I've been following their output since The Mountain and will definitely always check out anything new they put out.
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I think it's going to be a problem regardless. Apparently, there's a leak of the album out there that people are already listening to, so with the music itself, there's nothing wrong. I'm not interested in looking up the leak myself, since I pre-ordered and will wait for the thing to arrive, but I can imagine some fans will do that. It could hurt their sales if they stall too much, since 'everybody' will have listened to the thing before it's officially released.
I do want to know what's causing this delay, but we might not ever find out.
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But then again, some people might find the leak reassuring. If you pay for a preorder and the album gets pushed back repeatedly, you could begin to wonder what is going on. Maybe you should ask for a refund and see how it plays out.
Listening to the leak and finding out that the album meets your expectations would wash away your worries. The label would get to keep the preorder money in a time, when canceled concerts hurt it's finances.
...just hypothetically, of course. If someone were to listen to the leak :angel:
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But then again, some people might find the leak reassuring. If you pay for a preorder and the album gets pushed back repeatedly, you could begin to wonder what is going on. Maybe you should ask for a refund and see how it plays out.
Listening to the leak and finding out that the album meets your expectations would wash away your worries. The label would get to keep the preorder money in a time, when canceled concerts hurt it's finances.
...just hypothetically, of course. If someone were to listen to the leak :angel:
That's an interesting perspective. I can see how that may calm a fan's fears. From what I can tell, leaks usually don't happen until a week to two weeks before release. So I'd say this is a good sign. And considering there was no such leak prior to June 5th or any of the other proposed release dates, it may be that the album was finally able to move forward to a state where a leak would be possible.
I don't know much about the process of releasing an album, but that's my two cents.
The delays have really bummed me out, but I'm still no less excited for this album.
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That's an interesting perspective. I can see how that may calm a fan's fears. From what I can tell, leaks usually don't happen until a week to two weeks before release. So I'd say this is a good sign. And considering there was no such leak prior to June 5th or any of the other proposed release dates, it may be that the album was finally able to move forward to a state where a leak would be possible.
I don't know much about the process of releasing an album, but that's my two cents.
I think there's a lot of merit in that perspective. Also, the previous delays have always been announced around two weeks before the planned release, because that's (at least) how long it takes to get things in place in terms of distribution etc, for all the reasons that Train talked about previously. So the fact that we're now only 9 days away and Inside Out are confidently talking about 24th July, plus as you say the fact that the album leaked, it's all looking good. I'm now 99% certain that the album will indeed come out on the 24th.
Well done past me:
We should start a guessing game about when the album will be released.
Perhaps being optimistic, but I think 24th July will stick.
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Ok, we're at 9 more days now. Let's hope they don't push it out further. :tup
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Cheers everyone.
might have been posted before, but...
"Ever wondered how the first track on the album Vector would have been in an alternate reality, where different sonic choices were made?
"False Memories
Friday, 17 July 2020" - Diego Tejeida
What do you guys make of this? Just a funny way to announce something or is there bitterness in this?
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Cheers everyone.
might have been posted before, but...
"Ever wondered how the first track on the album Vector would have been in an alternate reality, where different sonic choices were made?
"False Memories
Friday, 17 July 2020" - Diego Tejeida
What do you guys make of this? Just a funny way to announce something or is there bitterness in this?
Link? It isn't Friday 17 juli 2020 in most parts of the world..
If it's real it seems a bit bitter.
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That just sounds like a tease for something and doesn’t sound bitter at all.
Like, he’s talking about Clear, right? The song I forgot existed for months because it’s just a short intro track before the first proper song? If he’s actually bitter about how a specific song turned out it doesn’t make much sense for it to be that one.
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I don't even understand that quote at all. Hard to make any sense of it to form an opinion of it's meaning :lol
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I love how someone created a new account to post this.
Looks like a solo album announcement.
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I love how someone created a new account to post this.
Looks like a solo album announcement.
I'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt, but yeah I wonder. He didn't even introduce himself.
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I love how someone created a new account to post this.
Looks like a solo album announcement.
I'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt, but yeah I wonder. He didn't even introduce himself.
The original quote is from Diego's IG and is legit.
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I love how someone created a new account to post this.
Looks like a solo album announcement.
I'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt, but yeah I wonder. He didn't even introduce himself.
The original quote is from Diego's IG and is legit.
I'm sure it's legit, it's just an odd first post. But then again, what do I know :).
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Sorry, I didn't create a new account, I am new to the forum. Did not know we do introducements here. I am from Germany and I like progressive music. Back to the discussion though:
Diego posted this on Facebook and Instagram today, I just can't seem to find the posts anymore. It seems he deleted them. Here is a screenshot of what it looked like:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Haken/comments/hs63s7/diego_tejeda_hinting_at_something_on_his_instagram/
Anyway I would be very much looking forward to a solo record and hope I interpreted to much into his statement. With 6 musical geniuses in a conglomerate like Haken, I can easily imagine there are differences of opinion when creating a new album. I have had the pleasure of listening to Virus in its entirety for a couple months now and I love everything about it. I hope Diego does too or at least wasn't dissatisfied with how it turned out...
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Ah this all makes sense seeing the actual post now. Sounds like some Deigo music, not sure if I could say it has any meaning towards Haken though just because he mentions different sonic choices. Those could be his own choices he initially made and now changed for whatever project this is.
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Sorry, I didn't create a new account, I am new to the forum. Did not know we do introducements here. I am from Germany and I like progressive music. Back to the discussion though:
Diego posted this on Facebook and Instagram today, I just can't seem to find the posts anymore. It seems he deleted them. Here is a screenshot of what it looked like:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Haken/comments/hs63s7/diego_tejeda_hinting_at_something_on_his_instagram/
Anyway I would be very much looking forward to a solo record and hope I interpreted to much into his statement. With 6 musical geniuses in a conglomerate like Haken, I can easily imagine there are differences of opinion when creating a new album. I have had the pleasure of listening to Virus in its entirety for a couple months now and I love everything about it. I hope Diego does too or at least wasn't dissatisfied with how it turned out...
My apologies man. Welcome to the forums! If you like progressive music you are certainly in the right place :tup
Folks call me Lion or Brother Lion, what would you like to be called?
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That Instagram post seems like Diego is talking about a solo album or a different project, not expressing any kind of bitterness about Haken. That said, I perused through his FB and Twitter pages and he hasn't said a thing about Haken in a while. You would think he would say something about his main band releasing a new studio album. Granted, Ross Jennings posts a lot more often on his Twitter account and hasn't said a lot about it either lately outside of a post about a month ago about how much the delays sucked, but it's just an observation.
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My apologies man. Welcome to the forums! If you like progressive music you are certainly in the right place :tup
Folks call me Lion or Brother Lion, what would you like to be called?
[/quote]
Alright man thanks. Brother Lion it is. I am Marjeaux.
I heard a while back that the many delays for the launch of Virus were not exclusively due to the pandemic. Those were total rumours so pls don‘t quote me on it but back then I read that Diego and the band disagreed on some characteristics of the album. Which is completely understandable with 6 guys all taking part in the writing and recording equally... Anyway I hope they sort it out, if it is true in the first place.
On that note, considering the style change Haken have gone through since Affinity with the last two albums, where do you guys think they will move next, genre-wise? And what would you like to happen?
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I'm kinda hoping they move back toward the Direction they had with The Mountain. Or at least something with a few more mellow areas. Don't get ne wrong, I loved Vector and so far I love what I've heard of Virus, but that's a lot of heavy two albums in a row.
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I can relate to that. Vector was hard and restless, but when I heard Virus for the first time I had to laugh out loud several times because they really took it to another level. The sheer force, brutality and power this album comes across with makes it not easy for the listener to get into it right away, at least that's how it was for me. After 2 or 3 complete runs it really exploded for me and I've been listening to it on heavy rotation ever since.. But, not unlike Vector did before, Virus sacrificed some more of Hakens earlier melodic qualities in order to produce this heaviness. It seems to be where they wanna go right now. I will follow them anywhere of course but if I had the choice, I would love it if they gravitated towards jazzier, lighter and maybe more polyharmonic songs next. That would also give Ross the opportunity to really thrive if he didn't have to assert himself against this huge wall of sound the whole time. I don't know if this will ever happen though. Ever since Affninity, Rich Henshall stepped down from his place as solo-songwriter and Haken turned into a kind of multilateral think tank, coming up with so many great ideas that they seem to have a hard time fitting them all into their songs. I doubt that they will ever return to the (relatively) simple and breezy arrangements we know from their first 3 albums. It seems to me they are yet to reach their climax when it comes to speed, technical advancement and complexity...
Virus isn't even out yet so I don't wanna come across as ungrateful. Let's enjoy this album first but with Haken I always enjoy fantasizing where they could go next...
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I can't help but think that Diego wouldn't have posted something that specific if he wasn't at least a little bit upset about the sonic choices made on said Haken track. I'm also curious whether he's referring to Clear or The Good Doctor as "the first track on Vector", because Clear *is* the first track on Vector even though it's an intro track.
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He's definitely talking about Clear. His False Memories track is up on Spotify if you want to give it a listen. It's actually pretty cool, although musically it's not related to Clear at all apart from the wump wump at the start.
My guess, which is only speculation, is that he's produced something new based on an old demo that was discarded in favour of having the intro be based on a theme from Host. Haken do love their recurring themes, as we know.
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Clear is based on Host? I never noticed that! I'll have to listen again.
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Clear is based on Host? I never noticed that! I'll have to listen again.
Yeah, the "Where I end, you begin" etc bit.
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Oh, I thought that was quite obvious. Haken do a lot of recurring themes, in songs, but also across albums.
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Huh. I've genuinely never spotted that before. Tbh, if two occurrences of the same theme are in different keys or rhythmically different, I won't always notice them. For example, it took me years to figure out the famous idée fixe from Berlioz' Symphonie Fantastique.
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Well, then Virus will keep you occupied for years, trying to spot all the nuggets.
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Clear is based on Host? I never noticed that! I'll have to listen again.
Me neither, but I blame Host for not being memorable enough. :lol
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This is the most promising sign I've seen that 24th July will be the final release date. https://twitter.com/Haken_Official/status/1284133957378936835 (https://twitter.com/Haken_Official/status/1284133957378936835)
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And someone just posted on the official FB group Haken Haven that it has been shipped to him.
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I can relate to that. Vector was hard and restless, but when I heard Virus for the first time I had to laugh out loud several times because they really took it to another level. The sheer force, brutality and power this album comes across with makes it not easy for the listener to get into it right away, at least that's how it was for me. After 2 or 3 complete runs it really exploded for me and I've been listening to it on heavy rotation ever since.. But, not unlike Vector did before, Virus sacrificed some more of Hakens earlier melodic qualities in order to produce this heaviness. It seems to be where they wanna go right now. I will follow them anywhere of course but if I had the choice, I would love it if they gravitated towards jazzier, lighter and maybe more polyharmonic songs next. That would also give Ross the opportunity to really thrive if he didn't have to assert himself against this huge wall of sound the whole time. I don't know if this will ever happen though. Ever since Affninity, Rich Henshall stepped down from his place as solo-songwriter and Haken turned into a kind of multilateral think tank, coming up with so many great ideas that they seem to have a hard time fitting them all into their songs. I doubt that they will ever return to the (relatively) simple and breezy arrangements we know from their first 3 albums. It seems to me they are yet to reach their climax when it comes to speed, technical advancement and complexity...
Virus isn't even out yet so I don't wanna come across as ungrateful. Let's enjoy this album first but with Haken I always enjoy fantasizing where they could go next...
Ugh, the first bolded is not what I wanted to hear. I like Vector, but it definitely seemed like an album where melody took a back seat, while technique and complexity made themselves comfortable in the front seat, and if Virus is similar in that regard, the odds of me loving it are not great.
And to tie that into the second bolded, I fear that the band is so focused on improving their complexity, speed and playing that they are going to lose the plot when it comes to writing memorable melodies. I hope I am wrong.
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+1 to everything Kev just said
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I disagree quite strongly there's any sacrificing of melody. Melodic approach and heavy instrumentation/production are two entirely separate factors. The core sound/production is much the same as Vector because it's a direct sequel, it's a very melodic album too. Though I do agree that, like most Haken albums, it takes a few listens to really get into some of the melodic hooks, and if as a listener you're less inclined towards the heavy sound, it might not come across as immediately melodic in the way that, say, Affinity did.
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agree
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One other thing I'll add actually, for what it's worth. I do love Vector for it's punchiness, but I do agree that there's a bit less focus on big melodies. I mean, there are lots of really good hooks, but very few of those big glorious Haken choruses we love so much (the final section of Puzzle Box, the climax of Host... that might even be it). I don't feel it's less melodic, but there were fewer big cathartic melodic moments that we had loads of particularly on The Mountain and Affinity.
All that is to say that (while reiterating the point that like all Haken albums this one needs time to grow), as someone who has been lucky enough to listen to the album for quite a while, I think there are more of those big melodies again. The run of Invasion, Carousel, The Strain and Canary Yellow is all very melodic IMO, and Messiah Complex is bonkers in the same way that Visions (the song) was but does have some big melodic moments throughout it too. Even Prosthetic, which is the NBM-style "heavy and technical" track this time is a lot more melodic than that was.
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I mean, there are lots of really good hooks, but very few of those big glorious Haken choruses we love so much (the final section of Puzzle Box, the climax of Host... that might even be it).
Veil: "Am I a joke to you?"
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I've heard the album for a couple of times (10+) now, and I can say it is very much like Vector for me—in a sense that there is some of the best Haken material on it up to date, but there is also a few duds which bring the album down. It is definitely a grower; I wasn't all too fond of it during my first listen, but the songs continued to click with me and I think I still haven't discovered all this album has to offer.
I'll post my full thoughts when it's out, but there are a couple of things I can safely say right now and please keep in mind I'm a big Haken fan:
- for now, this album ranks the second worst for me, only topping Visions, but it's not because it's bad, it's because everything else the band released is very good
- Haken tends to write the songs that are difficult to digest, and before Virus, most of them were a big success with me. Somehow, I can't get into the two big tracks of this record
- my favourites from this record are The Strain and Invasion, and my other favourites are weirdly Canary Yellow and Only Stars
- the album absolutely flows better when you listen to it with Vector first. Magnificent job with the flow from the band, great idea and great execution
More spoilers below:
- the death metal tremolo-shred or whatever it's called in Carousel is fantastic. The song had awesome ideas but Ross' vocal melodies pretty much ruined it for me. More than ten listens and I still think the vocal melodies here suck.
- Messiah Complex feels like - I mean, alright, I'm probably wrong but that's how I feel - but it feels like the band wrote a couple of hooks before which later evolved into songs (Puzzle Box, Host/Clear) and then added another couple of hooks as gimmicks from their previous albums (CK, Shapeshifter), and then just filled in the gaps. It probably is my biggest disappointment from Haken since Crystallised. For the grand final of the two album suite, it feels lifeless, boring, it feels contrived and it feels like it was constructed to fill this role, and it doesn't work for me at all. Only Stars is a great finisher though.
I can't help but subconsciously compare Celestial Elixir to Messiah Complex and man, did the band know how to write an epic album closer back then.
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One other thing I'll add actually, for what it's worth. I do love Vector for it's punchiness, but I do agree that there's a bit less focus on big melodies. I mean, there are lots of really good hooks, but very few of those big glorious Haken choruses we love so much (the final section of Puzzle Box, the climax of Host... that might even be it). I don't feel it's less melodic, but there were fewer big cathartic melodic moments that we had loads of particularly on The Mountain and Affinity.
I absolutely disagree with this. I think Vector had by far the best choruses and some of the best melodies Haken came up with, except for maybe Aquarius. Every chorus on Vector is memorable and at least half of them are big as hell (Puzzle Box, Veil, Host, A Cell Divides).
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One other thing I'll add actually, for what it's worth. I do love Vector for it's punchiness, but I do agree that there's a bit less focus on big melodies. I mean, there are lots of really good hooks, but very few of those big glorious Haken choruses we love so much (the final section of Puzzle Box, the climax of Host... that might even be it). I don't feel it's less melodic, but there were fewer big cathartic melodic moments that we had loads of particularly on The Mountain and Affinity.
I absolutely disagree with this. I think Vector had by far the best choruses and some of the best melodies Haken came up with, except for maybe Aquarius. Every chorus on Vector is memorable and at least half of them are big as hell (Puzzle Box, Veil, Host, A Cell Divides).
I think the melodies on Vector are good as well, but I think Affinity takes the cake for great melodies in Haken's work.
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I too perceived Vector as less cathartic, it builds more pressure than it releases afterwards.
Stylistically, Virus feels to me like a middle ground between Affinity and Vector. If Vector/Virus were a double album, it would be among the most diverse and least bloated double albums out there.
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I too perceived Vector as less cathartic, it builds more pressure than it releases afterwards.
Stylistically, Virus feels to me like a middle ground between Affinity and Vector. If Vector/Virus were a double album, it would be among the most diverse and least bloated double albums out there.
If that's the case then you have just hightened my excitement for the albums release :).
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- the death metal tremolo-shred or whatever it's called in Carousel is fantastic. The song had awesome ideas but Ross' vocal melodies pretty much ruined it for me. More than ten listens and I still think the vocal melodies here suck.
Tastes are a funny thing as we seem to have the opposite reactions to these two songs. Well, ok I don't think Veil's melodies suck, but they're not among my favourite, whereas I love them on Carousel. :lol
- Messiah Complex feels like - I mean, alright, I'm probably wrong but that's how I feel - but it feels like the band wrote a couple of hooks before which later evolved into songs (Puzzle Box, Host/Clear) and then added another couple of hooks as gimmicks from their previous albums (CK, Shapeshifter), and then just filled in the gaps. It probably is my biggest disappointment from Haken since Crystallised. For the grand final of the two album suite, it feels lifeless, boring, it feels contrived and it feels like it was constructed to fill this role, and it doesn't work for me at all.
I understand why you feel that way because of all the references, but I strongly disagree that they just filled in the gaps, because the main themes are entirely new.
It also jump around a lot, which is why from very early on I've been saying that it's more of a suite than a song. Each part is it's own thing with no link to the other parts (other than they all segue from one to the next) except the final part reprising the first part. It doesn't really have the structure of a song when taken all together - apart from the one reprise there aren't recurring themes, there isn't a build as such. Instead of a verse-chorus ABABCA structure, it's basically ABCDEA. They don't tend to do that these days - not since the Visions title track really. Anyway I'm going off on a tangent a bit - the suite is pretty mad and I can definitely see some people not really digging it, but I'm really enjoying it.
Only Stars is a great finisher though.
Yeah it's great, glad some others are appreciating it too!
I can't help but subconsciously compare Celestial Elixir to Messiah Complex and man, did the band know how to write an epic album closer back then.
Weird comparison, structurally the songs are nothing like each other. If anything Visions is a closer comparator in the way it works through lots of different unrelated ideas before eventually reprising the original theme. Celestial Elexir is a much more normal song structure.
I too perceived Vector as less cathartic, it builds more pressure than it releases afterwards.
Stylistically, Virus feels to me like a middle ground between Affinity and Vector. If Vector/Virus were a double album, it would be among the most diverse and least bloated double albums out there.
This is a great description. Vector is the build, Virus is the release.
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I agree that CE and Messiah Complex are very different in structure, but I mostly compared them as the long closers of their albums. Apparently Visions is really a better comparison, because I don't like Visions too. :lol
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Ya’ll in here talking like you already heard the album.
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Yes. I thought leaks weren't allowed to be discussed here.
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You realise there are other ways to listen to the album besides downloading a leak, right?
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I think some people get early copies for review purposes.
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Yes.
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If only there was forum rules to reference people. :p
2a. Sharing, requests for sharing, offers to share, or discussion of illegally obtaining pirated material is strictly prohibited. This includes, but is not limited to, warez, direct links, asking for links/files, and hinting at resources for finding the material.
2b. With regard to "leaked" material, you are not allowed to discuss the leaking or sharing of an album by any artist, or that an album has leaked. In addition to the above, with regard to Dream Theater and side-projects by the members of Dream Theater, you may not discuss the leaked material whatsoever. For other bands, you can in most cases discuss the content of the leaked material as long as you do not reference the leak, where you obtained the material, or sharing the leaked material.
With non-Dream Theater related acts you can discuss anything you've heard, as long as you don't break the more critical part of the rule.
I will add that I am not promoting discussing material you've obtained illicitly, as I along with others certainly find it in poor taste, but I'm not going to take any sort of mod action as a result of it.
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I'm just glad it's confirmed and we can all finally hear it.
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I haven't received a shipping notification for my preorder yet. Anyone here received something?
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I haven't received a shipping notification for my preorder yet. Anyone here received something?
Where did you order from? If it's somewhere that does quick deliveries (like Amazon) then I wouldn't expect it to have shipped yet.
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From Insideout Germany.
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Hmm, I've never ordered from IO. Their website unhelpfully says that European orders should arrive "within 2 weeks" but I imagine that actual time depends on how near you are to Germany (assuming you are indeed in Europe).
Anyone else ordered from IO and received/not received a shipping notification?
You could contact IO and just ask of course.
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I ordered from IO a couple of times and they're usually on point with the notifications. You can write them and ask (their customer support was fairly great when I wrote them once about lost package) but I would think that means it hasn't shipped yet.
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Yes, I ordered my previous Haken preorders from them and got timely notifications. This is why I asked whether anyone got a notification from any store.
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Yes, I ordered my previous Haken preorders from them and got timely notifications. This is why I asked whether anyone got a notification from any store.
Not yet. Ordered from Laser's Edge in the US.
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I ordered from BurningShed, still no shipment notification email from them yet, but what's funny is that they sent me a shipping notification for SW's The Future Bites CD back on June 24th... :facepalm: :lol
-Marc.
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Yes, I ordered my previous Haken preorders from them and got timely notifications. This is why I asked whether anyone got a notification from any store.
From some stores, yes definitely, people have been posting pictures of their notifications on Facebook.
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All this just reinforces my way of doing digitial downloads from amazon. After all the delays, I'd be so annoyed if my pre-order didn't arrive on release date. From my experiences doing pre-orders, it seems it never does and then I read about people who got it early. Why can't that ever happen to me? :lol Anyway, I'm looking forward to finally listening to it this week
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Finally got my shipment notification email from BurningShed a little over an hour ago. Guess it'll be here by next weekend!
-Marc.
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Preorders through Amazon used to be pretty good for arriving on release day, and albums used to be available in record shops like HMV on release day, but things seemed to change once InsideOut joined Sony.
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Just got my shipping notification from LaserCD. :metal
Ordered the black vinyl and the mediabook.
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All this just reinforces my way of doing digitial downloads from amazon. After all the delays, I'd be so annoyed if my pre-order didn't arrive on release date. From my experiences doing pre-orders, it seems it never does and then I read about people who got it early. Why can't that ever happen to me? :lol Anyway, I'm looking forward to finally listening to it this week
Yep, I don't buy physical copies of albums anymore either, and haven't for years.
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Just got my shipping notification from LaserCD. :metal
Same here from Insideout.
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All this just reinforces my way of doing digitial downloads from amazon. After all the delays, I'd be so annoyed if my pre-order didn't arrive on release date. From my experiences doing pre-orders, it seems it never does and then I read about people who got it early. Why can't that ever happen to me? :lol Anyway, I'm looking forward to finally listening to it this week
Yep, I don't buy physical copies of albums anymore either, and haven't for years.
Where do you buy digital? I have always bought from iTunes but the last 3 albums I bought downloaded fine to my iPhone but was missing songs when loaded to the library. The titles are there, but the music is missing. That is a problem for me because I use a smaller iPod most of the time. I also burn cds for use in my older truck.
I need to figure out how to copy from my phone to iTunes library.
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All this just reinforces my way of doing digitial downloads from amazon. After all the delays, I'd be so annoyed if my pre-order didn't arrive on release date. From my experiences doing pre-orders, it seems it never does and then I read about people who got it early. Why can't that ever happen to me? :lol Anyway, I'm looking forward to finally listening to it this week
Yep, I don't buy physical copies of albums anymore either, and haven't for years.
Where do you buy digital? I have always bought from iTunes but the last 3 albums I bought downloaded fine to my iPhone but was missing songs when loaded to the library. The titles are there, but the music is missing. That is a problem for me because I use a smaller iPod most of the time. I also burn cds for use in my older truck.
I need to figure out how to copy from my phone to iTunes library.
There's your problem right there :lol. I had an ipod once and I HATED iTunes, it was such a pain in the rear. I buy all my music off of Amazon. I have their music app on my phone and it just downloads strait there. Super easy. However, I use android, so I'm not sure if that app is available for Apple.
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I buy digital from Amazon, and then load it onto my iPod. When buying actual CDs, they're pretty good about getting here by the release date.
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I use bandcamp whenever I can. If the album's not on there I'll use iTunes.
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So TAC and Buddyhunter, how do you get the songs downloaded to your iPod? I like my older iPod because it is smaller and less bulky when using for yard work, etc. I could just convert to my phone and ditch the iPod, but am set in my ways.
I looked and for the missing songs I can supposedly use Iexplorer to move from the phone to the itunes library.
I bought Rush Hemisphere and only 2 of the 4 songs actually downloaded to iTunes. The 2 songs left out were Cygnus and LaVilla. iTunes did refund 2 of the 3 albums with a problem, but still curious why the last 3 purchases downloaded partially.
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I wish everything was available at Bandcamp (or a comparably simple store).
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So TAC and Buddyhunter, how do you get the songs downloaded to your iPod? I like my older iPod because it is smaller and less bulky when using for yard work, etc. I could just convert to my phone and ditch the iPod, but am set in my ways.
I just import them into iTunes, put them into a playlist and sync that to the iPod. I've never had an issue with songs getting left out when syncing... if anything I have the opposite problem when I buy something on the iTunes store and it automatically downloads all of the songs onto my phone, even the ones I don't want on there. :P
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So I have two old iPod Classics.
If I buy a download from Amazon, which I do quite a lot, when I download it on my Amazon Music downloader, it used to also send it right to my iTunes. It doesn't seem to do that anymore, but I just go into my Amazon Music folder, and click and drag the files into iTunes. Then load them onto my iPod.
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There's your problem right there :lol. I had an ipod once and I HATED iTunes, it was such a pain in the rear. I buy all my music off of Amazon.
I feel the same. I had an Ipod touch in the past and a work iphone and absolutely HATED itunes. Such a bloated and poor application for music. I use amazon and just download it right after purchase to my PC and then I move it onto my phone via USB drag and drop into my phone's music folder. Easy and works every time. No sync or application needed.
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So I have two old iPod Classics.
If I buy a download from Amazon, which I do quite a lot, when I download it on my Amazon Music downloader, it used to also send it right to my iTunes. It doesn't seem to do that anymore, but I just go into my Amazon Music folder, and click and drag the files into iTunes. Then load them onto my iPod.
Your default music folder might have changed if you updated iTunes. If you go to settings and changed the default folder to the Amazon Music downloader folder, the issue should get fixed.
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OK thank you.
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iTunes and iPods are the worst.
Also my hard copy of Virus has shipped, woot.
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I use iTunes, though I never buy anything from there, and it works fine.
Also my Virus has shipped. Hurray.
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Do you guys think the mediabook edition will be like the one for Vector? I'm thinking of getting that edition. It looks like only laserCD is selling it.
Regarding the itunes talk, it's a software designed to make YOU conform to it rather than the other way round I felt. You CAN'T get stuff from your phone or ipad unless they are photos. Everything else needs to go from Computer--> iPod/iPhone/iPad. You can technically get stuff from your device but it's a pain.
I hated organizing things in that thing, but having said that, it makes things super easy for people not like me which is the rest of the population lol.
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Do you guys think the mediabook edition will be like the one for Vector? I'm thinking of getting that edition. It looks like only laserCD is selling it.
Burning Shed also has it. It will be probably the same (2CD, with the hardbook cover). This is the edition I bought from LaserCD. My CD has shipped so I can snap a picture and let you know how it looks. I also got the Virus mediabook when it was released. I like mediabooks more than digipacks.
https://burningshed.com/haken_virus_2cd?filter_name=haken&filter_sub_category=true
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Thanks! I too prefer the hardcover over digipacks.
Burning Shed is probably going to ship from the UK though plus it costs more.
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Thanks! I too prefer the hardcover over digipacks.
Burning Shed is probably going to ship from the UK though plus it costs more.
I have also used this store www.importcds.com
https://www.importcds.com/search?q=haken&mod=AP#!?pagenum=1&sortby=AvailabledateNew
The mediabook version is available there but it's on backorder.
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Strangely enough the CD has been available at a music store near me (Boucherville, Quebec) for a few days.
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My Vinyl+CD+Shirt arrived today :hefdaddy
Ordered from omerch.eu, shipped July 17th
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Thanks! I too prefer the hardcover over digipacks.
Burning Shed is probably going to ship from the UK though plus it costs more.
I ordered my Mediabook from Burning Shed and after shipping, it cost me approximately $21.68 after conversion from GPB. Funnily enough, Virus cost a bit more than Vector did when it came out, as I looked at both of my orders from Burning Shed. I spent about $3.86 more for Virus than I did for Vector (prices after shipping).
Anyway, I trust Burning Shed and have ordered from them for YEARS, typically because they'll sometimes send a postcard featuring album artwork, which may or may not be signed by the artist themselves (my Haken Affinity postcard has the whole band's signatures!), so those are fun extras to receive. Also, they'll always carry the Inside Out EU versions of the album, which are sometimes mediabooks where the US version might only be a digipak, and like you faizoff, I also prefer mediabooks. Having the mediabook for Virus was a no-brainer after Affinity and Vector! Now I wonder, was there a mediabook version of The Mountain?
-Marc.
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Do you guys think the mediabook edition will be like the one for Vector? I'm thinking of getting that edition. It looks like only laserCD is selling it.
Regarding the itunes talk, it's a software designed to make YOU conform to it rather than the other way round I felt. You CAN'T get stuff from your phone or ipad unless they are photos. Everything else needs to go from Computer--> iPod/iPhone/iPad. You can technically get stuff from your device but it's a pain.
I hated organizing things in that thing, but having said that, it makes things super easy for people not like me which is the rest of the population lol.
Amen! I can't stand iTunes because of that very reason. With other mp3 players I used to have, it was as simple as plug in my divice and move files too and from without any intermediary software to complicate things. ipods are great devices, I just can't stand the software.
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I've gone through three Creative mp3 players and they were a breeze to setup like you said, they were just like USB drive when you plug in the computer and drag and drop files.
Similar thing with the Note 8 phone I have, drag and drop. For PC playback I use JRiver Media Center as it has the playback audio quality that I like plus it can organize my media according to whatever way I choose.
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Totally. I know supposedly Apple products are supposed to be super easy to use, but my experience has been the complete opposite. Maybe it's because I've tried to jump platforms and maybe it's a lot easier if all you own are apple products and they only need to interact with each other. But try to use it in conjunction with a PC? Forget it! But android works like a dream. I guess I'm just too used to using a PC.
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People are going apeshit about the new album in the Haken Haven FB group :lol (some of them hate the album with a fiery passion).
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People are going apeshit about the new album in the Haken Haven FB group :lol (some of them hate the album with a fiery passion).
Only a handful of people, but yeah it's the same as with Vector. :lol
EDIT: I guess this means Haken is a "big" band now. :lol
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You're doing a fine job with calming them down, and being reasonable with them.
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Just saw Ross doing an unboxing of the album on FB, including the transparent yellow vinyl, single disc jewel case, and double disc mediabook.
The media book looks perfect next to the Affinity and Vectormediabooks, as Ross slotted it onto his CD shelf at the end of the video. Can't wait for mine to arrive!
-Marc.
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That was a cool video, I wish I was into Vinyl in only to get the enlarged artwork. The mediabook looks like the Vector one which is what I'll be getting.
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Why is Amazon Germany telling me that shipping is postponed to 28 July? >:( >:( >:(
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Why is Amazon Germany telling me that shipping is postponed to 28 July? >:( >:( >:(
Because there's a disruption in the supply chain. It's a global pandemic thing. :justjen
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People are going apeshit about the new album in the Haken Haven FB group :lol (some of them hate the album with a fiery passion).
Sounds funny, is it readable without an account?
I enjoy the album immensely.
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People are going apeshit about the new album in the Haken Haven FB group :lol (some of them hate the album with a fiery passion).
Only a handful of people, but yeah it's the same as with Vector. :lol
EDIT: I guess this means Haken is a "big" band now. :lol
I was thinking that too! ;D I mean, in terms of popularity, it's always a very good sign for any musician/band to have people complaining about the new album versus old ones. No doubt, their fan base is increasing :tup
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People are going apeshit about the new album in the Haken Haven FB group :lol (some of them hate the album with a fiery passion).
Sounds funny, is it readable without an account?
I enjoy the album immensely.
I guess so, see if this link works.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/HakenHaven/
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You're doing a fine job with calming them down, and being reasonable with them.
Thanks man, I've had about 15 years of practice from every single DT release here at DTF, so. :P
Just saw Ross doing an unboxing of the album on FB, including the transparent yellow vinyl, single disc jewel case, and double disc mediabook.
The media book looks perfect next to the Affinity and Vectormediabooks, as Ross slotted it onto his CD shelf at the end of the video. Can't wait for mine to arrive!
-Marc.
Yeah I went for the mediabook mainly so it can sit nicely alongside the Vector one - hasn't arrived yet but it looked great in the vid.
People are going apeshit about the new album in the Haken Haven FB group :lol (some of them hate the album with a fiery passion).
Only a handful of people, but yeah it's the same as with Vector. :lol
EDIT: I guess this means Haken is a "big" band now. :lol
I was thinking that too! ;D I mean, in terms of popularity, it's always a very good sign for any musician/band to have people complaining about the new album versus old ones. No doubt, their fan base is increasing :tup
Yeah exactly. Some people complain about the album, and then some more people complain about the people complaining about the album. :lol
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People are going apeshit about the new album in the Haken Haven FB group :lol (some of them hate the album with a fiery passion).
Sounds funny, is it readable without an account?
I enjoy the album immensely.
I guess so, see if this link works.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/HakenHaven/
It's a private group, so I don't think it'll be visible unless you have an account and are a group member.
It's not that entertaining really, you could look at basically each of the last like 6 DT releases, and even the previous couple of Haken ones, and it's basically the same thing.
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You're doing a fine job with calming them down, and being reasonable with them.
Thanks man, I've had about 15 years of practice from every single DT release here at DTF, so. :P
Good point :lol
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I thought the whole point of facebook was just to bitch?
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Eh, no.
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That group though? Often.
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Finally, Tomorrow I can listen to this album while waiting for my physical copy to arrive and I can rip onto itunes...
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The outro in Prosthetic is kickass and it's going to be a beast once it's played live. I've only listened to this single so tomorrow will be a good day.
I might edit the main riff from Nil by Mouth and the outro for Prosthetic and make a loop or something for workout purposes. Those riffs are just massive!
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I'm dying here! I can't wait until tomorrow. I'd stay up till midnight and then download it but I will be a zombie tomorrow at work if I do. But hey, I'll download it first thing and listen to it all day while I work.
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The outro in Prosthetic is kickass and it's going to be a beast once it's played live. I've only listened to this single so tomorrow will be a good day.
I might edit the main riff from Nil by Mouth and the outro for Prosthetic and make a loop or something for workout purposes. Those riffs are just massive!
Prosthetic is an absolute monster of a prog metal song. Love it! I'm anxious to hear the album in its entirety.
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I think I'm allowed to finally get excited for this album now, right? This thing is finally going to be in our hands?
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I think I'm allowed to finally get excited for this album now, right? This thing is finally going to be in our hands?
If you are in certain parts of the world, it's already out so I think it's safe to be excited
I'm not sure if I'll be up at midnight, but if so, I will check it out. Otherwise tomorrow morning will be fun.
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I’ll hold off until I get the physical copy in my mail. Should be here tomorrow afternoon.
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Now that the album is finally coming, will they explain what is/has been going on?
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Now that the album is finally coming, will they explain what is/has been going on?
I sure hope so, unless it's a legal issue. Then they probably can't until the issue is completely resolved.
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Oh well...here we are, the eve of the war. The last night before we have to fight off the complainers who say the album isn't as good as the older stuff, before they have any justifiable reason to come to such rushed conclusions.
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Oh well...here we are, the eve of the war. The last night before we have to fight off the complainers who say the album isn't as good as the older stuff, before they have any justifiable reason to come to such rushed conclusions.
I see this as an overall improvement to many of the things first tried in Vector, so frankly if people were to have that reaction, and certainly some will, I think they would have gotten the brunt of their complaints out on Vector.
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Nick, people never tire of complaining.
I lived through it with Rush through many musical journeys they took.
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Nick, people never tire of complaining.
I lived through it with Rush through many musical journeys they took.
I get that, but to use your example all I'm saying is if people were complaining through Signals and Grace Under Pressure, they may have still been complaining through Power Windows, but hopefully not complaining about "that new fangled keyboard driven sound they have".
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Nick, people never tire of complaining.
I lived through it with Rush through many musical journeys they took.
I get that, but to use your example all I'm saying is if people were complaining through Signals and Grace Under Pressure, they may have still been complaining through Power Windows, but hopefully not complaining about "that new fangled keyboard driven sound they have".
I think you're underestimating how abused people can be.
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I don't know if I follow that logic only because a lot of people who didn't like Vector would hope the band changed to do what they like and when they find out they didn't then they say "not my band anymore" or similar and double down on their opinion.
I just think, as an artist, it's impossible to please everyone so once you put yourself out there (aka release an album) you are going to get criticized and I think that's unfortunate. I'm not part of the facebook Haken group, but I think it's in poor taste if you are shitting on the album there considering I saw it was admin by the band themselves.
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I just think, as an artist, it's impossible to please everyone so once you put yourself out there (aka release an album) you are going to get criticized and I think that's unfortunate. I'm not part of the facebook Haken group, but I think it's in poor taste if you are shitting on the album there considering I saw it was admin by the band themselves.
There are thankfully very few people shitting on it, but I agree it's pretty disrespectful when a number of band members and their family members post there. One guy posted something a bit dickish, and Ross responded in a really classy way so the guy felt bad and took the post down. :lol
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This is why I'm glad this forum exists; if I only had band FB groups/pages to post in about new music, it would get old pretty fast because you do have to be at the very least polite and constructive when you know band members are gonna see it, and sometimes you just wanna say "wow i hated this thank u next". But if they see a lot of negativity pretty soon they're just going to stop reading the comments completely, and no one wants that. Some people see that request ("hey, be at the very least polite and constructive") and act like they've just been told to build a pyramid-sized shrine to every new album release though ::)
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I just think, as an artist, it's impossible to please everyone so once you put yourself out there (aka release an album) you are going to get criticized and I think that's unfortunate. I'm not part of the facebook Haken group, but I think it's in poor taste if you are shitting on the album there considering I saw it was admin by the band themselves.
There are thankfully very few people shitting on it, but I agree it's pretty disrespectful when a number of band members and their family members post there. One guy posted something a bit dickish, and Ross responded in a really classy way so the guy felt bad and took the post down. :lol
ah, as I said, not a member so didn't see but just figured by what was posted here that some of it had to be in poor taste. I thought about joining, but I'm just not a fan of facebook and it feels so toxic (FB in general). I am already a member of the discord channel (although I'm not active on it) so I don't feel the need to connect on facebook.
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Well the album is out now, so now I can finally give my thoughts.
I feel that this album was a letdown. I was a massive fan of Vector for how tight it was, & how well-balanced the heaviness & melodic elements were, but I feel Virus is quite lacking in that department. It feels like every song is trying to be this massive heavy beast, & sadly it gives the album very little room to breathe. Vector was also very dense, but it still felt like it had a balance of catchy melodies & heavy riffs to make it feel like every second was giving me what I wanted. With Virus, the balance just isn't there in my opinion. I feel like there's not as much depth to anything as Haken is typically known for. There's too many sections where the sheer power of the music drowns everything out.
I think a big part of that can be attributed to the mix, which was the guitars, drums, & vocals at the forefront. & they are LOUD. The whole album is really. I've tried listening to Vector & Virus back-to-back & as soon as the Virus material started, I had to turn down the volume. The loudness war doesn't typically faze me personally, but the amount of compression on this album makes it an exhausting listen, & it especially highlights how few layers there are compared to Haken's other material. Maybe the loudness wouldn't have been as noticeable if it actually felt earned, but it really doesn't.
This works fine if you're just listening to a song on its own, because it has a kind of catharsis to it, but when that appeal wears off, my enjoyment as a whole goes down with it.
Take Invasion for example. On first listen, I hear that strong chorus with Ross's soaring vocals & I'm like "fuck yeah", but when I start to analyse the song's progression, the payoff to any of the song's buildups is always those vocals & the djent rhythms of the guitars. It never really goes beyond that "fuck yeah" moment into any kind of deeper appreciation. By the end of the song, I don't feel like I've just heard a piece of the album, I feel like I've just listened to a metal song without my enjoyment ever going beyond that. It works as a single, but not as a part of something greater.
Carousel is a step up from the first two singles, because I feel that it has a more interesting structure & even some interesting dynamics. There's an elephant in the room though, & that's that the song sounds like Tool... like a lot... Now, I like Tool. I like their sound, & I don't mind people taking inspiration from it. I'd be a hypocrite if I didn't, being a modern Dream Theater fan & all. I just think that the Tool influence on Carousel is not quite fitting for Haken, & it does stick out like a sore thumb. Once again, this isn't a bad song, but I think it works better on its own than as a part of something bigger.
Although I think the dynamics on Carousel are something to be praised, sometimes they do feel a bit jumpy too. You have this soft rhythm & then suddenly huge guitars dominating & Ross going "think of aaaaall the peeeeople". It feels less like a build & more like a collection of sections that just happen to be louder & softer. I actually think it works for this song, because it has quite an intricate structure, but in the rest of Virus, it doesn't work nearly as well.
Canary Yellow is possibly the worst example of this. Transitioning out of The Strain, it seems clear that the song is meant to be the more emotional counterpart to it, but the drums (although they're interesting rhythmically) start out absolutely massive in what's supposed to be a soft reflective moment. Then when the outro hits, the guitars are extremely loud, which makes a bit of sense because it's the climax of the song, but I don't think it builds up to it very well, ESPECIALLY to that extreme. Some more buildup would've been nice, but I have some doubts about whether the mix would have done it justice even if a more elaborate buildup was there. Compare this to Host, which balanced its soft & loud parts perfectly to give an emotional experience, & even in the climax of the song, didn't have the guitars drowning out the other layers that the song had built up. I think Virus was written to have Canary Yellow (& to a lesser extent, The Strain) as some breathing room, but the mix just doesn't do it any favours regarding subtlety.
& then we get to Messiah Complex. This absolute mess of a song starts positively enough, with arguably the best chorus on the album & some of the melodic elements of the band actually getting their chance to shine. However, the song quickly devolves into a disaster. It's like an endless chain of unfinished ideas that loosely connect, are damn-near impossible to follow rhythmically, are all loud as fuck, & never end. It feels like every three seconds of Messiah Complex is trying to outdo the previous three seconds in how proggy & heavy it is with very little care for tension & release. & how could I forget the REFERENCES. They come out of nowhere & have the subtlety of a brick. Maybe they make more sense in relation to the story (I know the story relates to the Cockroach King, which is reprised three times), but it further complicates this Frankenstein's Monster of random tiny parts that are all somehow fighting each other for dominance. It's a trainwreck, & the only time it returns to actually establishing a semblance of structure is in the final movement, which reprises both Cockroach King & Prosthetic, but actually recontextualises them to make it feel like a grand closing to this confused & unpleasant epic.
Fortunately, the album doesn't end there, & the album has the absolutely beautiful coda of Only Stars. It's only 2 minutes, & is quite a simple reprise of the Clear melody, but the atmosphere it builds with the binaural sound effects, haunting piano, & frail vocals makes this an incredibly immersive piece of music. You can just feel the emotion with everything that happens, & it's a shame that the album for the most part seems more focussed on being as heavy as possible over exploring the deep & layered musical ideas that Haken have done so well in the past.
TL;DR I didn't like it
5/10
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TL;DR I didn't like it
Wow! I haven't listened to it yet, but after reading your post... this is what I was afraid would end up happening with them. Like I said some days ago, I feel like they just turned into a fancy djent band and completely lost the magic that made them stand out in a sea of over-produced, samey-sounding modern "prog metal" bands.
Just one question (to IDNDT or whoever has listened to the album already), since there's been some rumors about tensions between Diego and the rest of the band... how are keyboards represented throughout the album? I can imagine him being very upset if the album ended up being just a big wall of sound from the guitars/bass drums + the vocals on top and no room for his keys to show up and shine.
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TL;DR I didn't like it
Just one question (to IDNDT or whoever has listened to the album already), since there's been some rumors about tensions between Diego and the rest of the band... how are keyboards represented throughout the album? I can imagine him being very upset if the album ended up being just a big wall of sound from the guitars/bass drums + the vocals on top and no room for his keys to show up and shine.
What keyboards? :lol
Yeah, they're very buried. Maybe some more prominent keyboards would alleviate the issue of the album not being layered enough. Only Stars is the only time where they take the forefront, unless I'm forgetting something. :|
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TL;DR I didn't like it
Just one question (to IDNDT or whoever has listened to the album already), since there's been some rumors about tensions between Diego and the rest of the band... how are keyboards represented throughout the album? I can imagine him being very upset if the album ended up being just a big wall of sound from the guitars/bass drums + the vocals on top and no room for his keys to show up and shine.
What keyboards? :lol
Yeah, they're very buried. Maybe some more prominent keyboards would alleviate the issue of the album not being layered enough. Only Stars is the only time where they take the forefront, unless I'm forgetting something. :|
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
Yeah, I'd be very upset about this if I was Diego, he's an incredible played and it sounds like they underutilized him here, and he's given GREAT performances on the first few Haken albums.
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& then we get to Messiah Complex. This absolute mess of a song starts positively enough, with arguably the best chorus on the album & some of the melodic elements of the band actually getting their chance to shine. However, the song quickly devolves into a disaster. It's like an endless chain of unfinished ideas that loosely connect, are damn-near impossible to follow rhythmically, are all loud as fuck, & never end. It feels like every three seconds of Messiah Complex is trying to outdo the previous three seconds in how proggy & heavy it is with very little care for tension & release. & how could I forget the REFERENCES. They come out of nowhere & have the subtlety of a brick. Maybe they make more sense in relation to the story (I know the story relates to the Cockroach King, which is reprised three times), but it further complicates this Frankenstein's Monster of random tiny parts that are all somehow fighting each other for dominance. It's a trainwreck, & the only time it returns to actually establishing a semblance of structure is in the final movement, which reprises both Cockroach King & Prosthetic, but actually recontextualises them to make it feel like a grand closing to this confused & unpleasant epic.
You pretty much nailed my thoughts about this song.
I'll post my full thoughts about the album on weekend, but I can't see it overcoming Vector in my rankings.
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I've had the album for a few weeks now. I like it but I don't love it, and it might actually be my least favorite album from them. I didn't care for Vector all that much either. It's too short and too samey throughout. Virus doubles down on the heavy, djenty aspect of their sound and I think it goes waaaaaaay too far.
Messiah Complex is the only track I revisit but as IDNDT said, the song is kind of a chaotic mess.
And yeah, the only time Diego is really present on this album is when he has a solo. Otherwise he's inaudible or just not doing anything notable. I hope the rumors of his departure are false, I love what he brings to the table especially on Vector and Affinity, but I don't think there was much for him to do on this record. Maybe he just wasn't involved as much due to playing with Devin Townsend on his past couple of tours?
Overall, I'm really let down by this album. I give it a 5/10 and that's being generous.
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genuinely cannot imagine calling a 51 minute album "too short". that's roughly the length all albums should be imo
uuhh. this one. the first two songs are really boring but it improved after that, though nothing really wowed me either. i'll give it more spins. maybe i'll get it. i feel like haken and caligula's horse are both going the same way of "well they used to be good but they're not interesting anymore" for me. both bands have been on the same trajectory for their past few albums now
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Two listens in, definitely inseparable from Vector. I won’t hold the music style against them as it’s what they set out to do and have proven able to change at their own discretion... if the next album is more of the same I’d worry (but I guess in prog metal, metal pays the bills)
Prosthetic - Good! Anything that could fit in on Demanufacture is a win
Invasion - Ross owns the first half, drags on from there
Carousel - Really intriguing not too high or low, just 10m of the band at their best... probably song of the album
The Strain - nice intro to canary yellow, like it
Canary Yellow - nice follow up to the strain, like it
Messiah Complex - I think the title says it all, relentless and disjointed, this is look what I can do music all the way through. Lots of fun, but no dynamics. Notable when they get to reprise the vocal harmony that defines the band, Ross is left with no option but to yell. Wish they let it breathe more, but again maybe the title is telling as in this is supposed to be manic and complicated. Final chorus is awesome, and prosthetic outro is too.
Only Stars - completes Clear in a very downbeat way. Pretty great actually.
Credit to the band none of these songs repeat earlier sounds, even the connections to Vector are by design and new music. I like it so far, though of the two Vector still has the higher highs.
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Mine is arriving today and I'm still positively minded that I will enjoy it :)
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As I wrote here weeks ago, I consider that the band has only one great record: The Mountain.
Aquarius and Visions are OK albums. I don't really remember Restoration and Affinity. And I really dislike Vector (I only listened to the entire record once or twice, I don't remember).
That said, I decided to revisit the entire discography of the band and then listen to the Virus.
I want to see if I change my opinion about their discography as a whole. It is my "Haken: the last chance" project. :lol
From the comments, I am not at all excited by the new record. :sad:
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I think a big part of that can be attributed to the mix, which was the guitars, drums, & vocals at the forefront. & they are LOUD. The whole album is really. I've tried listening to Vector & Virus back-to-back & as soon as the Virus material started, I had to turn down the volume. The loudness war doesn't typically faze me personally, but the amount of compression on this album makes it an exhausting listen, & it especially highlights how few layers there are compared to Haken's other material. Maybe the loudness wouldn't have been as noticeable if it actually felt earned, but it really doesn't.
I don't really understand this. I get that the mix, like on Vector, is very guitar & drums heavy, and could sound quite exhausting for someone who isn't into that sort of thing, but the mastering is less loud/brickwalled than Vector, closer to TM or Affinity. (EDIT: Actually, I will say that Prosthetic is mastered louder than the rest of the album for some reason, much more like Nil By Mouth, so I guess coming after two slightly quieter songs it does come in with quite a punch).
Take Invasion for example. On first listen, I hear that strong chorus with Ross's soaring vocals & I'm like "fuck yeah", but when I start to analyse the song's progression, the payoff to any of the song's buildups is always those vocals & the djent rhythms of the guitars. It never really goes beyond that "fuck yeah" moment into any kind of deeper appreciation. By the end of the song, I don't feel like I've just heard a piece of the album, I feel like I've just listened to a metal song without my enjoyment ever going beyond that. It works as a single, but not as a part of something greater.
Hard disagree, Invasion is amazing.
& then we get to Messiah Complex. This absolute mess of a song starts positively enough, with arguably the best chorus on the album & some of the melodic elements of the band actually getting their chance to shine. However, the song quickly devolves into a disaster. It's like an endless chain of unfinished ideas that loosely connect, are damn-near impossible to follow rhythmically, are all loud as fuck, & never end. It feels like every three seconds of Messiah Complex is trying to outdo the previous three seconds in how proggy & heavy it is with very little care for tension & release. & how could I forget the REFERENCES. They come out of nowhere & have the subtlety of a brick. Maybe they make more sense in relation to the story (I know the story relates to the Cockroach King, which is reprised three times), but it further complicates this Frankenstein's Monster of random tiny parts that are all somehow fighting each other for dominance. It's a trainwreck, & the only time it returns to actually establishing a semblance of structure is in the final movement, which reprises both Cockroach King & Prosthetic, but actually recontextualises them to make it feel like a grand closing to this confused & unpleasant epic.
Another hard disagree, but I do understand why the mad chaos of Messiah Complex won't be to some people's tastes. It's an approach to songwriting they haven't really used for years as they're much more focused on tighter, coherent structures these days. It wouldn't normally be entirely my thing either (e.g. I'm lukewarm on the first three songs on Aquarius because of the way they meander from idea to idea with little coherence), but in this case I think it's so bonkers that I enjoy for an entirely different reason instead.
Fortunately, the album doesn't end there, & the album has the absolutely beautiful coda of Only Stars. It's only 2 minutes, & is quite a simple reprise of the Clear melody, but the atmosphere it builds with the binaural sound effects, haunting piano, & frail vocals makes this an incredibly immersive piece of music. You can just feel the emotion with everything that happens,
Something we agree on at least, really glad some people are liking Only Stars so much! :)
& it's a shame that the album for the most part seems more focussed on being as heavy as possible over exploring the deep & layered musical ideas that Haken have done so well in the past.
I don't really understand this either, I don't think the album is any heavier than Vector, and I'd argue that it's a little more varied in tone and style. I also disagree that there's less depth or layering, but I wonder if the keyboard parts being quieter in the mix isn't helping in that regard.
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TL;DR I didn't like it
Wow! I haven't listened to it yet, but after reading your post... this is what I was afraid would end up happening with them. Like I said some days ago, I feel like they just turned into a fancy djent band and completely lost the magic that made them stand out in a sea of over-produced, samey-sounding modern "prog metal" bands.
I wouldn't pay much attention to other reviews, or if you do then go for a balance - most fans seem to be liking or loving the album so far (big change in tone today at the Haken Haven FB group and subreddit, a lot of serious positivity so far), and critics have been almost universal in praising it. But yeah as with any album, some people won't like it.
Also really great responses so far in the Reddit progmetal sub, which is great to see.
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Haken's last two albums has been their Systematic Chaos / Black Clouds moment.
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I'm on my first listen on Spotify and there were plenty of interesting bits! It will be so much fun to dig into the album over the next week, there's so much potential.
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Haken's last two albums has been their Systematic Chaos / Black Clouds moment.
Are you comparing Affinity to Systematic Chaos? Couldn't disagree more.
If anything, I'd compare Vector to Train of Thought.
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Haken's last two albums has been their Systematic Chaos / Black Clouds moment.
Are you comparing Affinity to Systematic Chaos? Couldn't disagree more.
If anything, I'd compare Vector to Train of Thought.
I think he means that Vector is like Systematic Chaos & Virus is like Black Clouds.
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So you're saying there's an "EVERYONE SURVIVED! ROOOOOOOOAAAAAR!" moment on here then.
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You're right, this is their Systematic Chaos / Black Clouds & Silver Linings moment.
As in, they released an amazing album and followed it up with an even more amazing album.
...Well, okay, I actually prefer Vector to Virus, but both albums are REALLY good. Personally, I'm not sure I get all the people saying it's a 5/10 and stuff like that. It's not their best album, but Virus is still great even when compared to the rest of Haken's albums.
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Haken's last two albums has been their Systematic Chaos / Black Clouds moment.
Are you comparing Affinity to Systematic Chaos? Couldn't disagree more.
If anything, I'd compare Vector to Train of Thought.
I think he means that Vector is like Systematic Chaos & Virus is like Black Clouds.
I assume he just means because they're heavier/riffier than the albums before them. Other than that, and generally being in the prog metal genre, there isn't really anything else comparable between them.
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Yaaaay first listen right now
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Yaaaay first listen right now
Awesome, glad it arrived!
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Not if it sucks :neverusethis:
No, I’m kidding, ejoying it so far!
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Holy shit The Strain is insane
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Holy shit The Strain is insane
Yessssssssssssss! One of my favourites on the album.
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So, after first listen...
1. I'm glad I didn't read any of the reviews on here beforehand.
2. Oh Nintendo, how I missed you!
I'll do a full review towards the end of the day after I've had lots of time to :metal
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I give these guys a fresh chance which each album. However the vocals are just not my cup of tea and unfortunately that remains with this latest track.
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Initial thought after just one listen:
Holy shit The Strain is insane
and probably the best track on the record, again, after one listen.
I don't know what to make of Messiah Complex just yet, there's a lot to take in. First listen was positive though - contrary to this, my first experience with Veil was not so good and I consider it one of their weakest tracks, same with Crystallised - so I'm curious to hear it again another day. I thought Carousel was a bit strange, though not in a negative way. I had heard all the singles once and enjoyed them. Liked them better in album context than as separate tracks I think. Of the three singles, I think Invasion is the strongest track, because it's the most fleshed out one.
All of this after one listen (second listen for the singles).
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Ordered my copy, should be here tomorrow.
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I don't know if I follow that logic only because a lot of people who didn't like Vector would hope the band changed to do what they like and when they find out they didn't then they say "not my band anymore" or similar and double down on their opinion.
I just think, as an artist, it's impossible to please everyone so once you put yourself out there (aka release an album) you are going to get criticized and I think that's unfortunate. I'm not part of the facebook Haken group, but I think it's in poor taste if you are shitting on the album there considering I saw it was admin by the band themselves.
Your labeled and judged based off your first album released. But then when you release more. Unless your first album is highly regarded, then your judged based on the highly regarded album. Because that is the sound people enjoy the most, and bands cater to them by creating albums similar in sound and style.
For me, I understand music is subjective and vastly similar, I don't care about Bands writing away from their famous sound. If the bands collectively wants to make that album, I say go for it. Could be a game changer like for Anathema.
Now for Virus. It continues that same Heavyness and Low end sound from Vector. The Messiah Complex is the highlight for me. The rest just blurred together and felt less diverse than Vector for me. I prefer Vectors vocal melodies more so than Virus. But Virus does sound more Haken than Vector does.
Not a bad Double Album.
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After one listen, I think I don't like this album, but it's still an "I think..", I wanna give it one or two more tries at the very least.
I will admit Invasion is a great tune, loving this one. I think Carousel I may skip on the next listen, that one does absolutely nothing for me. Prosthetic has some great riffs but I don't like the chorus (and most of the vocals at that). The Strain is my second favourite, pretty good, not mind-blowing but maybe better on revisit. Canary Yellow is one of the weaker tracks imo, but nothing offensively meh. Only Stars is actually great, wish it was a bit longer and could turn into a full track.
Now Messiah Complex takes up such a huge chunk of the album, and has some great moments, but the description I saw elsewhere (I think in this thread) described it perfectly for me. "Every 3 seconds they are trying to outdo the previous 3 seconds", just seems like an endless contest against themselves to throw new ideas in. The Host/Clear reprise is awesome, the Cockroach King one a bit less so but I still dig the theme reprisals in this track overall.. but for such a long track I'm not sure if I find it worthwhile.
Meh.. maybe better than Visions, but not very impressed with this album, especially considering I'm a big fan of Vector (except for Nil By Mouth, which is probably the track that comes closest to the sound on Virus?)
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Love the new album. Ray's incredible.
Only complaint is yeah, we've gone from "Free Ray" to "Free Diego".
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I found that Messiah Complex gets more fun with each listen. Originally I was very overwhelmed and thought that Haken "jumped the shark" with this one. But all its intricacies are so much fun to uncover over time. I now think it was the right decision for their audience.
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My opinion about this album:
Prosthetic, Invasion and Carousel are a very strong run to begin the album, being Carousel awesome! (by the way, I didn’t hear the TOOL similarities at all in this one – and I’m a TOOL fan).
The Strain has a cool Fates Warning vibe in some points, it's a good song, but it's my second least favorite from the album.
Canary Yellow is very, very good, with that electronic/atmospheric side of Haken.
Messiah Complex is also awesome and is the perfect prog-djent-metal epic. Yes, It's relentless almost all the time, it don't have a lot of dynamics, but it works as it is. Interesting how all the Haken epics are so different from each other and I think this one it’s not what you would expect from them as a epic.
Only Stars is the only song I don’t care. I got the Clear melodies, but still...
Compared to Vector, I think Virus is a bit better because of the more diversity, added by songs like Invasion and Canary Yellow and by having an awesome epic like Messiah Complex. But Vector is also an excellent album, I do think its run from Clear to Nil by Mouth is still incredible! And the Vector overall production, mix and mastering is better. Heavy to the point and with the keyboards more present.
And just for reference, my Haken’s favourite phase is still The Mountain-Restored-Affinity.
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I found that Messiah Complex gets more fun with each listen. Originally I was very overwhelmed and thought that Haken "jumped the shark" with this one. But all its intricacies are so much fun to uncover over time. I now think it was the right decision for their audience.
Also, when taken in context of the concept of and story progression of who the Cockroach King is, the song and it's structure make perfect sense. It's as varied and eratic as a mentally ill tyrant should be.
And I love it!
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Listened to the stream, liking it on first impression. I can imagine how some long time fans of the band are a bit miffed about it. The sound is definitely a progression from Vector which is when I became a fan of the band. I like the harsh guitar tone and how front and center they are along with the drums and bass. The keyboards add a nice texture on this album.
Will have to dig in the stream while my mediabook arrives.
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Carousel is sooo good :metal :hefdaddy
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That's the track that did nothing for me on first listen
Unless you're talking about this Carousel (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnLNXquIBVs), which is fantastic.
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I like every song except for Messiah Complex...so far.
For me, it's similar to BtBaM where I can't seem to grab onto any part long enough for it to sink in. The musicianship is insane but I don't enjoy listening to insanity.
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I think Carousel I may skip on the next listen, that one does absolutely nothing for me.
Are you really gonna give up on a song after ONE listen?
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Carousel is sooo good :metal :hefdaddy
It is!
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I like the flow from The Strain to Canary Yellow
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I like every song except for Messiah Complex...so far.
For me, it's similar to BtBaM where I can't seem to grab onto any part long enough for it to sink in. The musicianship is insane but I don't enjoy listening to insanity.
I’m tempted to say the musiciansip here is even more insane than on ay BTBAM album.
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Initial thought after just one listen:
Holy shit The Strain is insane
and probably the best track on the record, again, after one listen.
I love you. This is my favourite track.
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A couple listens in and I'm not really sure what to think of it yet. Seems about on-par with Vector, though that album at least had the amazing one-two punch of Puzzle Box and Veil. Nothing on this album quite reaches that height, I don't think. Some random thoughts:
Prosthetic has grown on me a lot since it was first released; it's a really fun, energetic banger. It reminds me more of TOT-era Dream Theater than more modern, djenty prog metal bands, which is a plus in my book.
Carousel sounds absolutely nothing like Tool except for the clean guitar in the first minute. If there's anything that it reminds me of, the first heavy riff is almost a dead-ringer for Burn After Reading by Circus Maximus. Random comparison and I highly doubt it's intentional.
I'm a bit confused by everyone citing The Strain as the best song on the album - I hardly remember anything about it and it kinda seems like the most inconsequential song of the lot. Could grow on me though.
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Two listens so far. First one combined with Vector, second one just Virus.
I really liked Vector but I'm loving Virus so far. Messiah Complex is a lot to digest and I need some time on that one but I love every song from Prosthetic to Canary Yellow. The flow of Virus is definitely beter compared to Vector.
Ross is the allstar of the album for me. I love the diversity in his voice on this one while he was the main reason it took me some time to really get into their pre-Affinity albums.
Diego's keys could have been a bit more upfront in the mix but I guess it makes sense to be guitar heavy when the guy who mixed the album used to play at Riff Headquarters.
Final thought: six albums in just over ten years and what a journey it has been so far. I'm curious what more this amazing band will bring us in the future.
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After a few years, I listen to the first two albums again.
Curious how I had forgotten some things, especially in Aquarius. I didn't remember the bad growling in "The Point of No Return" (Mike Portnoy feelings :rollin). And I didn't remember that the Djent's chugs were already there from the beginning, here and there.
The cool thing was that I had a lot of fun listening to Aquarius. I thought the album was better than I remembered, and better than Visions. My perception of the second record was exactly as I expected. The record is how I remembered it.
I think that having listened to the two albums in a row may have affected my Visions appreciation a little, in the end I was a little tired of it.
Aquarius is a better record than I remembered and Visions is a good record, but it is not brilliant and a bit repetitive / cliché. The albums are stylistically similar, but I think the songwriting of the first one pleases me more.
Finally, three observations:
- I really like MacLean's participation in Haken. Great bass lines (especially the fretless ones :heart).
- Sun is an incredible song.
- The vocal melodies at various times are very similar. Unless you listen to these records hundreds of times, you can confuse some vocal melodies. At least it happens to me.
Next: The Mountain. I will listen just to follow the discography, because I remember it very well, and it is a masterpiece!
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I like every song except for Messiah Complex...so far.
For me, it's similar to BtBaM where I can't seem to grab onto any part long enough for it to sink in. The musicianship is insane but I don't enjoy listening to insanity.
For the record, I don't like BTBAM either. :P
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Finally, three observations:
- I really like MacLean's participation in Haken. Great bass lines (especially the fretless ones :heart).
A point that surprisingly it's not brought very often... Conner is excellent, super technical, but MacLean had a lot more memorable bass lines.
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So I have two old iPod Classics.
If I buy a download from Amazon, which I do quite a lot, when I download it on my Amazon Music downloader, it used to also send it right to my iTunes. It doesn't seem to do that anymore, but I just go into my Amazon Music folder, and click and drag the files into iTunes. Then load them onto my iPod.
I bought the album thru Amazon and it downloaded to my phone automatically. The songs are now on my pc c drive. Do I need something else to get the songs to iTunes so that I can put them on my iPod and burn a cd for the truck CD player?
Sorry I am technically challenged and a fogey.
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So I have two old iPod Classics.
If I buy a download from Amazon, which I do quite a lot, when I download it on my Amazon Music downloader, it used to also send it right to my iTunes. It doesn't seem to do that anymore, but I just go into my Amazon Music folder, and click and drag the files into iTunes. Then load them onto my iPod.
I bought the album thru Amazon and it downloaded to my phone automatically. The songs are now on my pc c drive. Do I need something else to get the songs to iTunes so that I can put them on my iPod and burn a cd for the truck CD player?
Sorry I am technically challenged and a fogey.
I haven't used itunes in years, but I believe you can drag the songs into itunes and then use itunes to sync it to your ipod.
I really dig Messiah Complex. Only one listen to the album so far, that and The Strain stood out. I didn't totally get Carousel but being a longer and complex song, I expect multiple listens to decide how I feel. I'm not ready to say much more about the album though, one listen is not enough to really form a good opinion on this.
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So I have two old iPod Classics.
If I buy a download from Amazon, which I do quite a lot, when I download it on my Amazon Music downloader, it used to also send it right to my iTunes. It doesn't seem to do that anymore, but I just go into my Amazon Music folder, and click and drag the files into iTunes. Then load them onto my iPod.
I bought the album thru Amazon and it downloaded to my phone automatically. The songs are now on my pc c drive. Do I need something else to get the songs to iTunes so that I can put them on my iPod and burn a cd for the truck CD player?
Sorry I am technically challenged and a fogey.
Click on File, then click on "Add File to Library", find the folder they're in and select all the songs. Usually, it'll sort them out onto the right Artist and everything.
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I think Carousel I may skip on the next listen, that one does absolutely nothing for me.
Are you really gonna give up on a song after ONE listen?
Yeah, most likely. Happens rarely, but if I find no saving graces (and it’s this long) then yeah why not?
There’s too much music I love out there, or music that’s more up my alley anyway, to worry about forcing myself to like something I didn’t like on first impression.
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I like the flow from The Strain to Canary Yellow
Yes :tup
The Messiah Complex is a lot to digest. A couple of times I felt like they were going to sing The Cockroach King.
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I think Carousel I may skip on the next listen, that one does absolutely nothing for me.
Are you really gonna give up on a song after ONE listen?
Yeah, most likely. Happens rarely, but if I find no saving graces (and it’s this long) then yeah why not?
There’s too much music I love out there, or music that’s more up my alley anyway, to worry about forcing myself to like something I didn’t like on first impression.
I have always found the “five spin” rule to be extremely handy. It’s just enough spins to let it grow on me a bit and maybe fall in love with something that didn’t hit me right away, but it also doesn’t spend an exorbitant amount of time trying to force anything.
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Alright, been listening for a week or so and I'd have to say it's definitely a solid album. There are moments of absolute ecstasy (the entirety of The Strain, the gorgeous vocals at the beginning of the Messiah Complex, the interesting solo in Carousel, Only Stars' melodies, Cockroach King reprise in The Sect) but there are also moments I feel as though things either meander too much, switch to something different (and less pleasing) with too much haste, or are just a bit boring / underdeveloped. As with Vector, the instrumentation is absolutely fantastic, and the heavier direction leads to a hell of a lot of headbanging moments, but like others have mentioned, that little bit of "magic" that used to really resonate with me is only there in the occasional spurt rather than a consistent, engaging experience.
When listening to The Mountain, Aquarius, Visions, etc., I always felt a certain sense of wonder, a grandiose nature I suppose -- most of the songs had moments that were just overwhelmingly joyous, or, and I adamantly hate using this word, epic. The use of orchestration, the a capella sections, the lovely piano pieces -- all of these things made them really unique to me. When I saw them live and they played Affinity for the first time in full, it was stunning, but when they played Aquamedley it was twice as immense, and I say that despite loving Affinity. I've always felt like Haken were at their strongest when their music was a bit more 'peculiar' in a sense, and I miss that on this album (as well as Vector.) Again, the heavier direction is certainly not bad, and it makes for a fantastic live experience at times as well, but I miss that mystical-esque nature that Haken employed so pervasively in the past, and I hope their next albums veers back into that sort of exploration of sound. A lot of the moments on this album just feel like a stereotypical 2010s prog metal band rather than the band that stood out from that pack. There's nothing on here that even comes close to 4:30 - 8:30 of Drowning in the Flood, Pareidolia, 1984, the jazziness of Cockroach King -- and that's not even mentioning Celestial Elixir, Visions, or Crystallised.
Despite all of this ranting, I'd still give the album a solid 6.5/10, it's still quite good, as all Haken is, but I hope they aspire to explore a different realm of music for their next album.
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Carousel is growing on me, it's probably my favourite so far beside the singles I'd already heard.
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How would you rank all the songs across Vector and Virus? For me, it'd probably be something like this:
1. Messiah Complex
2. Puzzle Box
3. Prosthetic
4. The Good Doctor
5. Nil by Mouth
6. Host
7. Veil
8. Only Stars
9. Carousel
10. Invasion
11. The Strain
12. Canary Yellow
13. A Cell Divides
14. Clear
It's really hard to rank these, I think all of these songs are really good.
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1. Puzzle Box
2. The Strain
3. Invasion
4. Host
5. Veil
6. A Cell Divides
7. The Good Doctor
8. Only Stars
9. Canary Yellow
10. Prosthetic
11. Carousel
12. Messiah Complex
13. Clear
14. Nil by Mouth
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Virus has improved my opinion on Veil. Veil is a great track, but I was disappointed that a third of Vector is dedicated to a rather generic prog metal track, as well crafted as that track may be. Especially since Vector was rather brief to begin with.
In the context of this 95min double album however, Veil is the only generic track of that kind. I now appreciate it a lot more.
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Probably something like this. Only certain about #1, #12, #13 and #14 though
1. Host
2. Puzzle Box
3. The Good Doctor
4. Invasion
5. Veil
6. A Cell Divides
7. Messiah Complex
8. Only Stars
9. The Strain
10. Prosthetic
11. Clear
12. Canary Yellow
13. Carousel
14. Nil by Mouth
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14. Nil by Mouth
:hifive:
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#1. Puzzle Box
#2. Veil
#3. Host
#4. Only Stars
#5. Carousel
#6. A Cell Divides
#7. The Good Doctor
#8. Nil By Mouth
#9. Invasion
10. Prosthetic
11. Clear
12. Messiah Complex
13. Canary Yellow
14. The Strain
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After just one listen of Virus I can’t rank them.
Ranking Vector is easy though;
1. Puzzle Box
2. Host
3. Leprous Chorus
4. Doctor Rex
5. Disjointed Instrumental
6. Dsjointed Prog ‘Epic’
7. Opener
Everybody ranking stuff under Clear is strange :)
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#1. Puzzle Box
#2. Veil
#3. Host
#4. Only Stars
#5. Carousel
#6. A Cell Divides
#7. The Good Doctor
#8. Nil By Mouth
#9. Invasion
10. Prosthetic
11. Clear
12. Messiah Complex
13. Canary Yellow
14. The Strain
That canary yellow hurts my eyes, but nice touch.
Not sure about Carousel.
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Listening to Virus now for the first time. Carousel is fantastic! I love the guitar solo in the middle, and the chord progression harmonising said solo.
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Puzzle Box
Carousel
Veil
A Cell Divides
Host
The Strain
Prosthetic
The Good Doctor
Canary Yellow
Invasion
Clear
Only Stars
Nil By Mouth
Messiah Complex
Of course Vector has time on its side, and main problem with Virus is MC just doesn’t work for me.
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Tough, but let's give it a go.
Invasion
Host
Puzzle Box
The Strain
The Good Doctor
Canary Yellow
Only Stars
Messiah Complex
Prosthetic
Carousel
Nil By Mouth
Veil
A Cell Divides
Clear
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Tbh, it's too soon to rank all of them, given Virus has the unfair disadvantage of having only been known to the majority of us for a single day.
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Which is why I only ranked Vector (:
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Carousel
The Good Doctor
The Strain
Canary Yellow
Puzzle Box
Messiah Complex
Invasion
Veil
Nil By Mouth
A Cell Divides
Prosthetic
Clear
Host
Only Stars
And to be ahead of the game:
1. The Good Doctor is one of their best songs and an amazing album "opener".
2. Host isn't good, neither was Red Giant, and Canary Yellow is a much needed amazing track in that vein.
3. I find Veil incredibly hard to place weighing my enjoyment of the song against what I see as the closest track they've ever had to Dream Theater.
4. I find Messiah Complex incredibly hard to place as it is the song that has probably bounced around the most as far as what I think of it.
5. A Cell Divides would have been several places higher before I saw it live and was not impressed with it.
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And to be ahead of the game:
1. The Good Doctor is one of their best songs and an amazing album "opener".
2. Host isn't good, neither was Red Giant, and Canary Yellow is a much needed amazing track in that vein.
3. I find Veil incredibly hard to place weighing my enjoyment of the song against what I see as the closest track they've ever had to Dream Theater.
4. I find Messiah Complex incredibly hard to place as it is the song that has probably bounced around the most as far as what I think of it.
5. A Cell Divides would have been several places higher before I saw it live and was not impressed with it.
1. Okay, it's good, but not that good (doctor).
2. What? I find Red Giant amazing, and I think I enjoy both that one and Host more than Canary Yellow.
3. Which Dream Theater track? I find Veil has more resemblance structure-wise to Falling Back to Earth.
4. I can imagine. Only heard it twice myself so far.
5. Then place it higher if the goal is to rank studio versions.
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Copied my Vector ranking from a couple months back:
1. A Cell Divides
2. Puzzle Box
3. The Good Doctor
4. Veil
5. Nil By Mouth
6. Host
7. Clear
Positions 3-6 are all very closely matched, not a lot to choose between them.
I've listened to Virus 6 or 7 times so far, but it's still too early for me to rank the tracks against each other, let alone against Vector tracks as well. I haven't even got an inkling which song is my favourite yet, which is a bit unusual for me.
One thing I can say, is that if I made a compilation of my favourite Haken tracks, nothing from Virus would feature. Nothings really jumping out at me yet, but hopefully that changes after a few more listens, as I certainly don't dislike any of the songs.
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A Cell Divides ... I saw it live and was not impressed with it.
Yes, the live performances I saw also failed to deliver.
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Host is amazing. Third best ballad from Haken besides Sun and Deathless.
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And to be ahead of the game:
1. The Good Doctor is one of their best songs and an amazing album "opener".
2. Host isn't good, neither was Red Giant, and Canary Yellow is a much needed amazing track in that vein.
3. I find Veil incredibly hard to place weighing my enjoyment of the song against what I see as the closest track they've ever had to Dream Theater.
4. I find Messiah Complex incredibly hard to place as it is the song that has probably bounced around the most as far as what I think of it.
5. A Cell Divides would have been several places higher before I saw it live and was not impressed with it.
1. YES
2. I think Host is really good, but I can understand why you might not enjoy Red Giant.
3. There's a couple elements that seem Dream Theater-esque (like the guitar solo at 8:19) but as a whole I wouldn't really compare it to Dream Theater.
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Is it a hot take that Prosthetic is their best album opener? Yes, that's even if you include Atlas Stone and The Good Doctor.
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Atlas Stone somehow manages to be a great album opener and a satisfying single at the same time that represents the band. Good Doctor and Prosthetic are to one-sided to be great on their own.
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Listened to the whole thing, finally. Not my thing at all.
I also agree that there are nowhere near enough keyboards - for whatever reason. Maybe the band want to move away from them, or maybe the keyboardist just isn't into it anymore. Either way, I can sympathize. I'm not into this. They've lost their symphonic/theatrical/proggy side, and are now just making pretty bland, one-dimensional music.
Just my two cents, I'll bow out of this thread now as to not clog it with my negativity and leave it open for the people who enjoy talking about this music.
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Is it a hot take that Prosthetic is their best album opener? Yes, that's even if you include Atlas Stone and The Good Doctor.
I wouldn't argue, I think every album opener they've done is great.
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Everybody saying there's no keyboards seriously need to have another listen and, you know, actively listen. They're everywhere.
This is not a knock on you, Skeever, but I've seen this comment pop up so often that I wanted to post this.
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I tend to wait a few months before ranking the songs. So far my favorites by far are Carousel and Messiah Complex.
Will say that Carousel is exactly what I want to hear in a song called Carousel. Great composition.
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Atlas Stone somehow manages to be a great album opener and a satisfying single at the same time that represents the band. Good Doctor and Prosthetic are to one-sided to be great on their own.
I like Atlas Stone. I think The Good Doctor sucks, I only mentioned it because one could conceivably call Clear the opener for that album instead. :lol
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Everybody saying there's no keyboards seriously need to have another listen and, you know, actively listen. They're everywhere.
This is not a knock on you, Skeever, but I've seen this comment pop up so often that I wanted to post this.
Definitely seems buried in the mix though, doesn't stand out like they do on other Haken albums. Can anyone who had the early promo say if this album on release sounds the same? Just wondering if the delay was because they changed any of the sonic elements to the album.
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Everybody saying there's no keyboards seriously need to have another listen and, you know, actively listen. They're everywhere.
This is not a knock on you, Skeever, but I've seen this comment pop up so often that I wanted to post this.
Definitely seems buried in the mix though, doesn't stand out like they do on other Haken albums. Can anyone who had the early promo say if this album on release sounds the same? Just wondering if the delay was because they changed any of the sonic elements to the album.
There's been no change, I've had the album for a lot longer than the promos and it sounds identical.
And yeah there's keyboard everywhere but I agree it's mostly quieter in the mix than usual.
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The Carousel chorus is kicking my ass today.
"Holding on too tight to let you goooooo"
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Everybody saying there's no keyboards seriously need to have another listen and, you know, actively listen. They're everywhere.
This is not a knock on you, Skeever, but I've seen this comment pop up so often that I wanted to post this.
They are super low in the mix and the parts are so minimal that I listen to them in could just as easily imagine it just being some producer doing some stuff in post.
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I've flipped on Messiah Complex. It's stunningly brutiful after about 5 spins.
These guys are amazing! Killer album. Drummer is off the charts.
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The Carousel chorus is kicking my ass today.
"Holding on too tight to let you goooooo"
This song is a grower :tup
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The Carousel chorus is kicking my ass today.
"Holding on too tight to let you goooooo"
This song is a grower :tup
Indeed. I figured a couple more listens and I'd start really liking it which has been the case
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Either way, I can sympathize.
With a cockroach I hope.
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i'd probably go with:
Veil
The Strain
Messiah Complex
Carousel
A Cell Divides
Puzzle Box
Invasion
Nil Mouth
The Good Doctor
Prosthetic
Canary Yellow
Host
Only Stars
Clear
Sad to see Veil placed lowly in other lists, I thoroughly enjoy it.
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One spin through so far and I am definitely a fan, looking forward to dissecting in the coming weeks.
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The keyboards are far far less prominent in the mix than on previous albums. I would not be surprised if Diego is a bit miffed by that decision, whoever made it.
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Haken is quite good
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Haken is quite good
Yes and no circus music
The album is really starting to click for me.
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The keyboards are far far less prominent in the mix than on previous albums. I would not be surprised if Diego is a bit miffed by that decision, whoever made it.
Nah, it will come around again. Reminds me of Train of Thought. All bands with longevity play with their sonics.
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I've flipped on Messiah Complex. It's stunningly brutiful after about 5 spins.
These guys are amazing! Killer album. Drummer is off the charts.
I’m warming to MC after a couple listens on it’s own. Still find it jarring in the album context like jamming A Change of Seasons between One Last Time and The Spirit Carries On... just tonally doesn’t match.
Songs 1-5 are all top notch, and Carousel is only getting better and better with more time, what a killer song.
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The keyboards are far far less prominent in the mix than on previous albums. I would not be surprised if Diego is a bit miffed by that decision, whoever made it.
Nah, it will come around again. Reminds me of Train of Thought. All bands with longevity play with their sonics.
I wouldn't put too much stock into this if the Deigo rumors weren't swirling around, it all makes me wonder wtf is going on within the band.
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I think I missed whatever rumors were floating around but if Diego were to leave, that would be huge. He’s my favorite member and part of why I think they sound so great.
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If the band just said why the album was delayed, there might not even be a Diego rumor, but people wanted answers and that was the theory with some evidence of Deigo's distance to the band lately and now the album is out and he's mostly buried. Now I'm starting to legit wonder about his status in the band.
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Virus is pretty cool. I don’t really have a whole lot to say about it other than it’s pretty relentless. Definitely lost track of what was going on somewhere in The Messiah Complex. Will take some digesting.
Reflecting a bit....When Vector came out, I absolutely loved it. Though after a month or two I felt the excitement kinda wear off. Then I revisited Affinity and it became my favorite Haken album, which was previously Visions. Affinity is still my favorite to this day.
I love heavy Haken, but it’s not my favorite Haken.
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My physical copy is not shipping until the 31st...
But, I am downloading it now.
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After a few listens I can safely say ‘Virus’ is my least favorite Haken album. That’s not to say it’s ‘bad’......there are some cool sections and instrumentation but for me.....I like the more melodic/progressive Haken over metal Haken. Metal Haken sounds like any number of other prog heavy metal bands out there. I thoroughly enjoy(ed) Visions/The Mountain/Restoration and Affinity. Dug Vector and thought it was pretty tight but for me.....I could sense the pull towards the heavier metal and that’s not what I dig about Haken. Virus is certainly filled with some good music but I’ll be honest that I fear the direction they’re taking with the last two albums is a direction that will lose me if it continues in that direction. I’d prefer to see them more in the vein of their sound a few albums back.
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Here's my perspective as a person who just listens to a few Haken songs but tries to get into the hype every album and always fails ;D
Vector for me really just had Puzzle Box and maybe Nil By Mouth as songs I would continue to listen to, and I seldom feel any need to listen to the album as a whole. For me songs like The Good Doctor doesn't work at all. I always lack a bit of pure beauty when listening to Haken. You know those moments when there's just a piano playing something beautiful without any need for overly complex "cool" stuff going on.
Back to Virus. I actually like this. This is maybe the best album I heard from Haken even. I am not sure if this will be the first album where I go back and listen to it over and over in it's full glory but I really hope so. Maybe it's even the album that got me into the band? That's not to say I have some gripes with it.
The album is more or less full of "crazy", "cool", "crazy", "crazier", "cool", "craziest", "coolest" moments and very dense. I really lack a "slow", "beautiful" or "atmospheric" in there. Honestly I believe this album could cure hunger around the world because it's so dense I stop feeling the need to eat. There's never any good breathing ground or strong build up to the crazier moments.
Prosthetic is a good opener but nothing I will put on repeat really. However it's full of twists and turns and keeps the energy going. A lot better than The Good Doctor imo that just put me off Vector instantly. I think the main chorus isn't for me but just when I am about to get a bit boored there's some cool change that keeps me listening.
Invasion sounds like something I hear on every Haken album. "Why is there bla something problem blaaaaa". I must have heard this before. Something about the melody and the way the singer sounds like a keyboard sample that just reminds me of other Haken songs. Anyway it's pretty ok but the overall melodies aren't that memorable. Actually makes me think that Haken could need a good Petrucci solo now and then. Maybe that's swearing for Haken fans but if Petrucci would pull of a soaring guitar solo near the end there I would honestly like this a bit more.
Anyway Carousel is where it starts getting more interesting! This is much more memorable in some ways. Strong melodies and good flow / variation! Not that typical Haken thing where melodies get 5th priority and crazy stuff gets 1, 2, 3 and 4th priority. I love how the guitar is working beneath the vocals just before the chorus. The songs has some great breakdown moments before it gets back at full speed. Good stuff!
The Strain maybe needs some more time for me but I like the change near the end where it get's a bit calm before going back to speed. Sometimes I feel Haken should just let those calm moment last a bit longer. Are they in a hurry? Great transition into Canary Yellow and some stronger melodies once again. It's a good calmer song with some unusually nice vocal parts.
Messiah Complex. Haha, honestly I am not even close to give my final thoughts on this one. I hear the recurring themes from other albums but honestly don't know the concept. It's just filled with tons of crazy stuff but I do feel excited every time Yellow Canary finishes. Good sign! Sometimes Haken feels so good at the crazy stuff that most songs feels like they follow the same template. This however has so many different sections that really stands out. Disjointed, but cool sections. Ivory Tower has a great melody! However there's these Nintendo sounds with a reprise of a melody, from some Vector I think, and that really sounds off.
Overall this album feels like it delivers on a consistently high level. Just that it's loud, crazy and dense. It's strange how Dream Theater almost feels light, super melodic and even a bit simple after listening to an album of Haken. But also understand that this can be a criticism! Haken should really calm down sometimes and just try to incorporate more simple, strong melodies and just stay away from crazy a bit more. It's like suspense. If you use it all the time it won't be as dramatic. Haken is soooooo good at crazy they do it in their sleep, but since it's there all the time it takes a way bit of the magic. The slower moment doesn't even last a minute before it's back to crazy. I can't even imagine how good this would be with more build ups to those moments.
I really like BTBAM Parallax 2 and somehow that's the best reference I have to this album. It starts of with a calm intro before going into the melodic Astral Body that perfectly builds up to Lay Your Ghosts to Rest, which is just complex, heavy and crazy. This is what I need more of here. Parallax 2 has a far better flow and variation than this album from what I can tell. When the crazy hits it hits so damn hard because it built up to it and I am ready.
Will come back to Messiah Complex again when my brain understands a bit more of it. Also, can someone please tell me what the story is here? I understand it's about Cockroach King, but what is the story there? Are all albums connected? Vector and Virus obviously seems connected.
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Virus is pretty cool. I don’t really have a whole lot to say about it other than it’s pretty relentless. Definitely lost track of what was going on somewhere in The Messiah Complex. Will take some digesting.
Reflecting a bit....When Vector came out, I absolutely loved it. Though after a month or two I felt the excitement kinda wear off. Then I revisited Affinity and it became my favorite Haken album, which was previously Visions. Affinity is still my favorite to this day.
I love heavy Haken, but it’s not my favorite Haken.
100% agree with this. Affinity continues to grow and has replace Visions as my favorite Haken album.
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I still haven't learned to love Visions (the album). It's weird because I really should love it, it's very DT influenced - some say it's even an homage to SFAM.
But aside from the title track, there's nothing there that interest me. And I usually rank it last among the Haken albums.
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When it came out, I was probably one of the biggest Haken fanboys in the world and I thought it was amazing, better than Aquarius even. It hasn't aged that well for me either, and I think I rank it last as well. That said, I still think it's a very good album, and some of the stuff on there is what I consider top Haken (Portals, Shapeshifter and Deathless most notably).
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All I can say is that Vector/Virus are fun albums. They are not the band's best work but they are enjoyable. Still think The Mountain and Affinity are Haken's best works to date.
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All I can say is that Vector/Virus are fun albums. They are not the band's best work but they are enjoyable. Still think The Mountain and Affinity are Haken's best works to date.
[/quote
Agree
Hope to see Haken headline again in the future
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Some random thoughts:
Visions is my favorite Haken record and I don't see the SFAM comparison at all. Maybe a small DT influence but that's all.
The Good Doctor is a phenomenal song.
I have listened to Virus once but can't really comment, too much going on. Needs more listens.
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I still think The Mountain is their best, but Visions is a close 2nd.
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I’m a little disappointed that my ultra package from a place called Music Glue (I believe it was through the band website) said that mine shipped on the 17th...but because I didn’t pay for premium shipment, it could take anywhere from 7 to *27* business days...and no tracking. It also said that I could arrive as late as Sep 4th, and that if I didn’t receive it by then, I should contact them.
So even though I preordered, I could be waiting another 5 weeks. >:( :censored
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I’m a little disappointed that my ultra package from a place called Music Glue (I believe it was through the band website) said that mine shipped on the 17th...but because I didn’t pay for premium shipment, it could take anywhere from 7 to *27* business days...and no tracking. It also said that I could arrive as late as Sep 4th, and that if I didn’t receive it by then, I should contact them.
So even though I preordered, I could be waiting another 5 weeks. >:( :censored
Pretty sure Music Glue are UK-based, so it will depend entirely on the speed and reliability of international shipping. I also ordered from Music Glue and for UK orders it said the same thing but with shorter timescales ("It usually takes 1-11 working days for orders to reach your location. On rare occasions it can take up to 17 working days."), but it arrived after 2 days.
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I’m a little disappointed that my ultra package from a place called Music Glue (I believe it was through the band website) said that mine shipped on the 17th...but because I didn’t pay for premium shipment, it could take anywhere from 7 to *27* business days...and no tracking. It also said that I could arrive as late as Sep 4th, and that if I didn’t receive it by then, I should contact them.
So even though I preordered, I could be waiting another 5 weeks. >:( :censored
Ordered from Music Glue/Omerch too, mine hasn't even shipped yet. :lol
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Oof, I'd just cancel and get a digital download. If you want to physical, buy it via other means or wait awhile until things settle down with the covid world we are in. After the album release delays, I don't think I could be patient to wait another 5 weeks while everyone else was listening. But then again, there are streaming services to hold you over too.
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I remember buying the inaugural edition of Classic Rock Presents Prog magazine. There was an accompanying CD with, at that time, relatively unknown prog bands. Haken was included. From that one song, I bought Aquarius and fell hard for it. I pimped the band big time at MP's site. But for some reason, I never bought any more of their albums. I heard rave reviews for every one, but my music buying was out of control. Now, after buying this one, I feel like buying everything else.
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I remember buying the inaugural edition of Classic Rock Presents Prog magazine. There was an accompanying CD with, at that time, relatively unknown prog bands. Haken was included. From that one song, I bought Aquarius and fell hard for it. I pimped the band big time at MP's site. But for some reason, I never bought any more of their albums. I heard rave reviews for every one, but my music buying was out of control. Now, after buying this one, I feel like buying everything else.
Well sounds like you've just been waiting for the perfect time to discover a lot of good music. Enjoy the journey.
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I ordered from Century Media and my T-shirt bundle won't be shipped until the Thursday on the 31st.
But, it included a digital download. So I still get to listen to it at least.
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My CD from Insideout arrived today.
I wonder where the people ordered who got their deliveries last week?
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https://www.reddit.com/r/Haken/comments/hx796o/its_all_a_big_nocturnal_conspiracy_which_other/
BTBAM references, Periphery references, references to Sabaton and Dream Theater as well as some reprises of Opeth songs. They're all connected to tell the story of Cockroach King. :)
I think I lost a few brain cells reading this
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https://www.reddit.com/r/Haken/comments/hx796o/its_all_a_big_nocturnal_conspiracy_which_other/
BTBAM references, Periphery references, references to Sabaton and Dream Theater as well as some reprises of Opeth songs. They're all connected to tell the story of Cockroach King. :)
I think I lost a few brain cells reading this
I saw some guy on there saying that the lyrics "Garden of delights" was obviously a reference to the Opeth song Garden of Earthly Delights. Like, he knew that the phrase has been around for a super-long time, but he insisted that this was intentionally referencing the song, and wasn't just a coincidence or anything.
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messiah complex actually references every piece of music ever made, including music that has yet to be made, in one way or another
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I definitely noticed lots of haken references, most of which felt familiar but couldn't immediately pinpoint it but the puzzle box references stood out. I definitely enjoy this more than puzzle box though. I feel people liked that the most on Vector but it wasnt my top song, so I think I like these references more in Mesiah Complex
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After being stuck with Visions as my favorite album from Haken, I feel that I am not really in the target audience of the band. I love Visions, has been my companion for two hour bus rides back in the early 2010s.
Virus for me is embodied by the song Invasion. There is a good song in there. But I just felt that the band unnecessarily makes it sound complicated to flash their prog credentials. That is why I said before that these last two albums felt like their DT SC / BCSL moment, that era when DT became technically complicated for its own sake. There are lots of moments in Virus where I felt like singing even dancing along, but I was stopped by a sudden odd beat riff, a change in melodic progression, or a blast beat that does not serve the music.
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The beginning of Invasion sounds like Leprous, not surprising since they both toured together and both have some awesome drumming
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The number of people in the last week who have said that Visions is their favorite album, or was their favorite album until x, is highly disappointing to me.
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This album might have to sink in with me a little bit, but I listened to all the tracks individually online on YouTube and I have to say that while I think it is slightly better than Vector, my sentiments about their sound in general echo those of the masses. (And I hate it when that happens!!)
My favorite thing about Haken is that they could take these heavy moments and then blend them with such beautiful harmonies. Sometimes they had entire songs that were all about harmonies and it was so beautiful in contrast with some of the heavier moments on the rest of the album. Vector and Virus seem to be more focused on “soft bits” to contrast “loud and heavy bits” rather than to create beautiful harmonious pieces.
There’s not a single moment even remotely resembling anything like the gorgeous happy feeling you get from listening to Streams. Even the quiet bits seems more like an ominous setup than a joyous celebration. But that could be just due to the subject of the concept.
But even The Mountain is such a HAPPY album to me. It’s so positive and up building in every way I can think of. In fact I think that’s it. I think every album up until the Vector/Virus concept has had something in the mix that made me feel a sense of joy and happiness. Nothing on the last two albums have given me that feeling.
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https://www.reddit.com/r/Haken/comments/hx796o/its_all_a_big_nocturnal_conspiracy_which_other/
BTBAM references, Periphery references, references to Sabaton and Dream Theater as well as some reprises of Opeth songs. They're all connected to tell the story of Cockroach King. :)
I think I lost a few brain cells reading this
I saw some guy on there saying that the lyrics "Garden of delights" was obviously a reference to the Opeth song Garden of Earthly Delights. Like, he knew that the phrase has been around for a super-long time, but he insisted that this was intentionally referencing the song, and wasn't just a coincidence or anything.
There's a portion of the fanbase who love the idea of a "Hakenverse" where everything is connected. It's quite entertaining, and quite creative. Some people just do it for fun and know that the band hasn't actually created such a thing, although some people are convinced it's all real. I'm 95% certain the only proper connections are Cockroach King, Vector and Virus. But the band loves to throw in lots of other references and easter eggs which is what fuels all this stuff.
After being stuck with Visions as my favorite album from Haken, I feel that I am not really in the target audience of the band. I love Visions, has been my companion for two hour bus rides back in the early 2010s.
Virus for me is embodied by the song Invasion. There is a good song in there. But I just felt that the band unnecessarily makes it sound complicated to flash their prog credentials. That is why I said before that these last two albums felt like their DT SC / BCSL moment, that era when DT became technically complicated for its own sake. There are lots of moments in Virus where I felt like singing even dancing along, but I was stopped by a sudden odd beat riff, a change in melodic progression, or a blast beat that does not serve the music.
I disagree with all of this in general, but also SC & BCSL were not especially technically complicated so it's a weird analogy to begin with.
The beginning of Invasion sounds like Leprous, not surprising since they both toured together and both have some awesome drumming
Yeah Invasion has aspects of Leprous and Periphery mixed in with a typical big emotional Haken chorus. I love it so much.
This album might have to sink in with me a little bit, but I listened to all the tracks individually online on YouTube and I have to say that while I think it is slightly better than Vector, my sentiments about their sound in general echo those of the masses. (And I hate it when that happens!!)
This isn't to discredit your views at all, but specifically on the point about the "masses", this album is actually going down super well so far, both with the Haken fanbase and wider prog fanbase.
My favorite thing about Haken is that they could take these heavy moments and then blend them with such beautiful harmonies. Sometimes they had entire songs that were all about harmonies and it was so beautiful in contrast with some of the heavier moments on the rest of the album. Vector and Virus seem to be more focused on “soft bits” to contrast “loud and heavy bits” rather than to create beautiful harmonious pieces.
Oh man, I disagree so much about the lack of rich harmonies. I sort of agree with Vector - some songs had it (Puzzle Box and Host, mainly) but there was definitely less of it, whereas I think Virus is a return to their wonderful melodic and harmonic approach. It's darker and heavier still, of course, and some of the songs need to time to grow (I'll be interested to see what you think once you've given the full album some proper listens), but it's musically very rich, more so than Vector and comparable with their other albums.
There’s not a single moment even remotely resembling anything like the gorgeous happy feeling you get from listening to Streams. Even the quiet bits seems more like an ominous setup than a joyous celebration. But that could be just due to the subject of the concept.
But even The Mountain is such a HAPPY album to me. It’s so positive and up building in every way I can think of. In fact I think that’s it. I think every album up until the Vector/Virus concept has had something in the mix that made me feel a sense of joy and happiness. Nothing on the last two albums have given me that feeling.
Well now, happy is not the same as harmonious. I like how they blended happy sounds with heavy and melancholy ones on Affinity and to some extent The Mountain (although I really wouldn't call it a happy album at all, it's actually very sad - but I would call it cathartic), but on Aquarius I don't think two blend together nearly as well, which is a large part of why it's my least favourite Haken album.
Like I said, the harmonic approach on this album is classic Haken IMO and there's more variety of tone than on Vector (e.g. Canary Yellow being much lighter), but I agree there isn't really anything happy on Vector/Virus. But as I've said a number of times before, that's not about "what the band's sound is now", it's what they were going for on this two-part concept album(s). Fair enough if it's less to your tastes, can't argue with that, but it doesn't signal what the band's sound is now, just like Affinity didn't signal that the band was going to be all spacey and poppy from now on. And honestly, apart from being heavier and crunchier, I think it's tonally closest to The Mountain, which I think is why I like it so much.
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My CD from Insideout arrived today.
I wonder where the people ordered who got their deliveries last week?
InsideOut (Europe). It arrived on the Friday. Vinyl.
Maybe CDs are later?
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Like I said, the harmonic approach on this album is classic Haken IMO and there's more variety of tone than on Vector (e.g. Canary Yellow being much lighter), but I agree there isn't really anything happy on Vector/Virus. But as I've said a number of times before, that's not about "what the band's sound is now", it's what they were going for on this two-part concept album(s). Fair enough if it's less to your tastes, can't argue with that, but it doesn't signal what the band's sound is now, just like Affinity didn't signal that the band was going to be all spacey and poppy from now on. And honestly, apart from being heavier and crunchier, I think it's tonally closest to The Mountain, which I think is why I like it so much.
That's exactly what I've been thinking for a while now. I've seen quite a few people say that Haken's losing them because of the direction of Virus, but I think it's unlikely their next album is going to be similar to either Vector or Virus. As you said, this is the sound they're going for with a two-part concept album, and not what they're going to stick to from now on.
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The number of people in the last week who have said that Visions is their favorite album, or was their favorite album until x, is highly disappointing to me.
I'm actually quite surprised Visions isn't considered by many to be one of their best, at least around here. I became a fan of them a year or so before the Mountain came out and Visions absolutely floored me. I still think it holds up quite well. Nocturnal Conspiracy and Visions are two of their best songs, I think.
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I love Visions still, but I love everything they've done since more.
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The number of people in the last week who have said that Visions is their favorite album, or was their favorite album until x, is highly disappointing to me.
I'm actually quite surprised Visions isn't considered by many to be one of their best, at least around here. I became a fan of them a year or so before the Mountain came out and Visions absolutely floored me. I still think it holds up quite well. Nocturnal Conspiracy and Visions are two of their best songs, I think.
The Visions - The Mountain period had their best melodies. I can listen to the Mind's Eye - Portals - Shapeshifter suite all day. The next albums just became too riff-driven (actually djenty) to my taste.
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Visions is still my favorite, just a really strong prog metal album from start to finish. It's a bit "prog metal by the numbers" though which I get why it may not be everyone's favorite and why people will compare it to DT, but that doesn't really bother me. Affinity is my next favorite followed by the Mountain. I'm not sure where Virus goes yet, I still have a lot more listening to do, but I kind of don't think it's better than the three albums I just mentioned. It may be better than Vector though, and I still have yet to get Aquarius.
Like I said, the harmonic approach on this album is classic Haken IMO and there's more variety of tone than on Vector (e.g. Canary Yellow being much lighter), but I agree there isn't really anything happy on Vector/Virus. But as I've said a number of times before, that's not about "what the band's sound is now", it's what they were going for on this two-part concept album(s). Fair enough if it's less to your tastes, can't argue with that, but it doesn't signal what the band's sound is now, just like Affinity didn't signal that the band was going to be all spacey and poppy from now on. And honestly, apart from being heavier and crunchier, I think it's tonally closest to The Mountain, which I think is why I like it so much.
That's exactly what I've been thinking for a while now. I've seen quite a few people say that Haken's losing them because of the direction of Virus, but I think it's unlikely their next album is going to be similar to either Vector or Virus. As you said, this is the sound they're going for with a two-part concept album, and not what they're going to stick to from now on.
I'm just not sure how we can say what their next album will sound like. Will the next album drop the keyboards completely? That would certainly make for a different sound and style. While their history shows they've got some various styles on each album, that doesn't mean the next one will be different. Who knows? I feel like the only thing we can base our predictions on are the fact they've gotten much more heavier and technical since The Mountain.
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The Visions - The Mountain period had their best melodies. I can listen to the Mind's Eye - Portals - Shapeshifter suite all day.
Mind's Eye isn't the strongest example of "best melodies", I find it such a bland song. :lol
I feel like the only thing we can base our predictions on are the fact they've gotten much more heavier and technical since The Mountain.
Affinity definitely wasn't more heavy or technical than The Mountain, arguably it was less so on both counts.
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I feel like the only thing we can base our predictions on are the fact they've gotten much more heavier and technical since The Mountain.
Affinity definitely wasn't more heavy or technical than The Mountain, arguably it was less so on both counts.
Yea you are probably right, I was thinking more along the lines of The Architect being the big epic song from Affinity which is also really heavy and technical, but on The Mountain, I don't get the feeling of that heaviness. Listening to the Mountain, I get like a jazzy feeling even in the heavy songs. Yet Vector/Virus takes it to the next level of heaviness. I also think production plays a role in the heaviness. Virus feels like the heaviest album they've done.
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... I still have yet to get Aquarius.
:omg:
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... I still have yet to get Aquarius.
:omg:
:lol saving it for a rainy day
I used to be so obsessive with bands I liked, that I would consume their entire discography once I discovered a band. But I don't do that anymore just because there's so much music out there. I did see the Aquamedley live and have it on the dvd/cd, so I'm not totalyl unfamiliar with it, but yea, I've actually never listened to the album and will do so at some point.
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Oh man, it has my favourite Haken track ever in Celestial Elixir. The Aquamedley doesn't do it justice.
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I feel like the only thing we can base our predictions on are the fact they've gotten much more heavier and technical since The Mountain.
Affinity definitely wasn't more heavy or technical than The Mountain, arguably it was less so on both counts.
Yea you are probably right, I was thinking more along the lines of The Architect being the big epic song from Affinity which is also really heavy and technical, but on The Mountain, I don't get the feeling of that heaviness. Listening to the Mountain, I get like a jazzy feeling even in the heavy songs. Yet Vector/Virus takes it to the next level of heaviness. I also think production plays a role in the heaviness. Virus feels like the heaviest album they've done.
I would say that Falling Back to Earth is at least as heavy as The Architect. But one thing I agree on actually, which possibly contributes to how some people see things post-Mountain, which is that the jazzy side has been much less prominent. It pretty much wasn't there at all on Affinity, and only a bit on Vector/Virus (The Good Doctor and moments in Messiah Complex). Doesn't mean it won't come back though!
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Yeah, the Aquamedley is quite fun, but in no way does it resemble the album as a whole in the same way as listening to the full thing would. There's so much great stuff missing from the medley and that alone says enough of how good Aquarius actually is :)
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What’s your favorite 3 song run from any Haken album?
Mine is The Architect - Earthrise - Red Giant, and it’s not even close.
Or... the Restoration EP.
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To be completely honest, The Good doctor - Puzzle box - Veil is truly remarkable. :hefdaddy
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The Visions - The Mountain period had their best melodies. I can listen to the Mind's Eye - Portals - Shapeshifter suite all day.
Mind's Eye isn't the strongest example of "best melodies", I find it such a bland song. :lol
Bland if taken alone (actually not!), but as the start of that suite, amazing. Especially when it bookends Shapeshifter. Actually, I can't imagine not listening to those three songs together, Haken shoukd have released that as an 18-minute epic.
I guess we just don't see eye to eye on what a good melody is, so hey, you're the Haken expert. Like I said before, I know I am quite the odd man among those who listen to Haken, although I still hope I would hear a song from them that would capture me the same way song in Visions / Mountain did.
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To be completely honest, The Good doctor - Puzzle box - Veil is truly remarkable. :hefdaddy
I really liked The Good Doctor, for about 7 listens. Then I don’t think I ever listened to it again unless I was spinning the album in full. :lol
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What’s your favorite 3 song run from any Haken album?
Off the top of my head, I'm going with Shapeshifter -> Deathless -> Visions
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My favorite 3-song run... That's a tough decision. Here's a few of my favorites, because choosing just one would be too difficult.
The Good Doctor > Puzzle Box > Veil
Veil > Nil By Mouth > Host
Shapeshifter > Deathless > Visions
Canary Yellow > Messiah Complex > Only Stars
As Death Embraces > Pareidolia > Somebody
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1985 > Lapse > The Architect
No contest.
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What’s your favorite 3 song run from any Haken album?
Either
Drowning in the Flood - Sun - Celestial Elixir
or
1985 - Lapse - The Architect
probably.
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Drowning in the Flood - Sun - Celestial Elixir
Yes.
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To be completely honest, The Good doctor - Puzzle box - Veil is truly remarkable. :hefdaddy
I really liked The Good Doctor, for about 7 listens. Then I don’t think I ever listened to it again unless I was spinning the album in full. :lol
The part that plays as if it was over a hospital intercom, complete with faux happy melody, is the side of I hope there is more of. The joy or happiness that someone mentioned earlier.
Point of No Return - Canary Yellow for my minimum 3 song streak :smiley: probably 1985/Lapse/The Architect or Falling Back to Earth/As Death Embraces/Pareidolia
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The Visions - The Mountain period had their best melodies. I can listen to the Mind's Eye - Portals - Shapeshifter suite all day.
Mind's Eye isn't the strongest example of "best melodies", I find it such a bland song. :lol
Bland if taken alone (actually not!), but as the start of that suite, amazing. Especially when it bookends Shapeshifter. Actually, I can't imagine not listening to those three songs together, Haken shoukd have released that as an 18-minute epic.
I guess we just don't see eye to eye on what a good melody is, so hey, you're the Haken expert. Like I said before, I know I am quite the odd man among those who listen to Haken, although I still hope I would hear a song from them that would capture me the same way song in Visions / Mountain did.
Yeah absolutely, there's no right or wrong here - as you say we probably have different tastes. Certainly with Haken, my favourite melodies of theirs tend to be the really melancholic ones - Celestial Elixir, Falling Back to Earth, Invasion, etc.
As for favourite 3-song run, that's a tough one.
In Memoriam > Because It's There > Falling Back to Earth would probably be my favourite.
Other ones I really love though are also:
Shapeshifter > Deathless > Visions
Earthrise > Red Giant > The Endless Knot
Invasion > Carousel > The Strain
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1985 > Lapse > The Architect
No contest.
Yes contest, The Architect is held back by the boring meandering in the middle. :P
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1985 > Lapse > The Architect
No contest.
Yes contest, The Architect is held back by the boring meandering in the middle. :P
I recall Earthrise is same length as the middle part, just splice that in and problem solved :lol
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:lol
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I listened to all the material from beginning to end, then listened again. So, just an opinion.
It's amazing how listening to everything in hindsight helps to reevaluate opinions and perceptions. Someone mentioned that Visions is a "prog metal by the numbers" and I agree. Aquarius is too. And that is why I have always taked them as "smaller albums" in contrast to The Mountain, a masterpiece. Listening to everything again and considering everything that came after The Mountain improved my opinion of the first two records. Ok, "prog metal by the numbers", but better than it would come later.
I do remember that liking Restoration and not liking Affinity, but I didn't remember those records in detail anymore. Restoration is a great remake of songs from the first demo. A great EP.
Affinity has improved in my concept. It is full of modern prog metal/djent features and I understand why I promptly discarded it four years ago. To mention just one example: 1985 is a great song (the best on the record), full of interesting passages, but it has that heavy riff at 2:36 that bothers me so much. And riffs similar to this one are sprinkled throughout the band's discography, especially in recent years.
But OK. I can now be more open-minded, let these characteristics aside and enjoy what I like. And there are a lot of interesting things on the album.
And then we go for Vector / Virus. I confess that I had an even worse memory of Vector. I didn't remember the beautiful flugelhorn in Host (the best song on the album). But it is not a good album. I don't like The Good Doctor, Puzzle Box, Veil. And I think Nil By Mouth is atrocious (I wish I could go back in time with this song, back in the 90s / 2000s, and show it to all my acquaintances who said that DT was self indulgent. "If you were to think that DT was self indulgent, listen to this! ")
Finally, Virus. As the album is recent I will listen to a few more times. For now, I just liked Prosthetic (that works for me) and Canary Yellow, nothing more. Only Stars is boring, which is terrible because I usually like Haken's mellow songs. I hate Invasion and I will be very disappointed if Messiah Complex does not win the "most disjointed progressive suite award of 2020".
It is undeniable that the band is currently delivering a sound that meets what seems to be the preference of fans of the style. It still looks like Haken, but it looks more and more like the endless "new prog metal / djent bands".
I still think The Mountain is a kind of a "one shot" by the band, but my adventure ended up being positive, because I managed to have better opinions about Aquarius, Visions (in a way) and Affinity. I guess it's a kind of happy end. :)
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I'm in the minority (maybe I'm the only one) in that The Mountain is my least favorite Haken album. Still love it... just love the others more.
Current Rankings
1. Aquarius
2. Vector
3. Affinity
4. Visions
5. The Mountain
Virus will probably end up in the 2-4 range.
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Yes contest, The Architect is held back by the boring meandering in the middle. :P
no
I could raise you so many other Haken songs that are more boring and / or meandering than the middle section of The Architect :lol I also don't see how you could consider a simple buildup over the same chord progression "meandering". Boring maybe (even though you're wrong) but certainly not meandering.
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What’s your favorite 3 song run from any Haken album?
The Path - Atlas Stone - Cockroach King
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Yes contest, The Architect is held back by the boring meandering in the middle. :P
no
I could raise you so many other Haken songs that are more boring and / or meandering than the middle section of The Architect :lol I also don't see how you could consider a simple buildup over the same chord progression "meandering". Boring maybe (even though you're wrong) but certainly not meandering.
What songs? Just curious :corn
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Yes contest, The Architect is held back by the boring meandering in the middle. :P
no
I could raise you so many other Haken songs that are more boring and / or meandering than the middle section of The Architect :lol I also don't see how you could consider a simple buildup over the same chord progression "meandering". Boring maybe (even though you're wrong) but certainly not meandering.
What songs? Just curious :corn
Only Stars? I think that song is... not good to say it nicely.
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Yes contest, The Architect is held back by the boring meandering in the middle. :P
no
I could raise you so many other Haken songs that are more boring and / or meandering than the middle section of The Architect :lol I also don't see how you could consider a simple buildup over the same chord progression "meandering". Boring maybe (even though you're wrong) but certainly not meandering.
What songs? Just curious :corn
Well for "meandering" literally every other epic besides Celestial Elixir, for starters :lol
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Atlas Stone / Cockroach King / In Memoriam is probably my favourite 3 song run.
From the new album I'd take Prosthetic / Invasion / Carousel. That's a damn fine album opening.
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Can we just agree that Red Giant is their best song? If anyone agrees with me I’ll buy them a Haken t shirt.
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Can we just agree that Red Giant is their best song? If anyone agrees with me I’ll buy them a Haken t shirt.
I'll agree just to get the shirt. Or the cap they're selling right now.
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Yeah, I think I like the newer Haken, I think this and Vector are two very nice records ;D
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The number of people in the last week who have said that Visions is their favorite album, or was their favorite album until x, is highly disappointing to me.
I must be the only person on this planet that still reps Aquarius. There was just something about that one that seemed special to me and a lot of the unique characteristics did not carry over into the subsequent albums.
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The number of people in the last week who have said that Visions is their favorite album, or was their favorite album until x, is highly disappointing to me.
I must be the only person on this planet that still reps Aquarius. There was just something about that one that seemed special to me and a lot of the unique characteristics did not carry over into the subsequent albums.
Aquarius remains my favourite Haken album and I know for a fact that you and me are not the only people thinking that.
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Can we just agree that Red Giant is their best song? If anyone agrees with me I’ll buy them a Haken t shirt.
Already ordered the yellow t-shirt. Red Giant blows :biggrin:
The number of people in the last week who have said that Visions is their favorite album, or was their favorite album until x, is highly disappointing to me.
I must be the only person on this planet that still reps Aquarius. There was just something about that one that seemed special to me and a lot of the unique characteristics did not carry over into the subsequent albums.
Nah, it's my favourite, and there's a couple of others who share the same opinion.
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Carousel is so Opethy sounding. Not enough to be a rip off but paying homage for sure. Such a brilliant song.
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Can we just agree that Red Giant is their best song? If anyone agrees with me I’ll buy them a Haken t shirt.
As exciting as the prospect of owning a Haken T-shirt is, I must admit that Red Giant is one of my least favorite songs by Haken.
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Yeah, Red Giant is one of the very few Haken songs that I can't get into.
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I think I like it more than Initiate and Earthrise, at the very least.
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I think I like Red Giant just because it sounds like nothing else. Very unique song that has a nice ending, but overall, it's not that great of a song.
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I do like Red Giant... but The Architect is heads and shoulders above anything else Haken (or nearly any other band) have ever produced.
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I would like The Architect more if it didn’t completely rip off Opeth’s The Drapery Falls at 10:17. Still a great song though.
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I would like The Architect more if it didn’t completely rip off Opeth’s The Drapery Falls at 10:17.
I never noticed that and just tried to figure out what you even mean and thought it's still a bit far-fetched.
That said, lots of music rips off other music, so does it even matter?
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I would like The Architect more if it didn’t completely rip off Opeth’s The Drapery Falls at 10:17.
I never noticed that and just tried to figure out what you even mean and thought it's still a bit far-fetched.
That said, lots of music rips off other music, so does it even matter?
It’s not far-fetched at all, that part in The Architect is very similar to the main riff of The Drapery Falls.
No it doesn’t really matter, I still love the song (The Architect).
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What 'Main Riff' in Drapery? The melodic line is similar, but not the same (and also not for more than 7 seconds), everything in the background (as in not the guitar solo (Architect) or long notes (Drapery)) is different.
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Yes contest, The Architect is held back by the boring meandering in the middle. :P
no
I could raise you so many other Haken songs that are more boring and / or meandering than the middle section of The Architect :lol I also don't see how you could consider a simple buildup over the same chord progression "meandering". Boring maybe (even though you're wrong) but certainly not meandering.
What songs? Just curious :corn
Well for "meandering" literally every other epic besides Celestial Elixir, for starters :lol
Do you mean others are more disjointed? In which case I agree, but that's not really what meandering means. Meandering generally has a vague sense of direction, but just kind of wanders off-course in that direction. The term has a pretty slow, rambling connotation to it, so I wouldn't apply it to Haken's more sudden shifts. The middle section of The Architect I just find drags aimlessly for a few minutes until it picks up again, which is why I used the term. The start and end of the song are phenomenal though.
As for the other topics of discussion:
Aquarius is of course great and I love all of Haken's albums, but it's definitely my least favourite of theirs.
And Red Giant is absolutely amazing (as is Earthrise). I wouldn't say it's the absolute best (not even to get a free t-shirt) but it's definitely among my favourites.
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What’s your favorite 3 song run from any Haken album?
These are the first that I came up with:
Red Giant - The Endless Knot - Bound by Gravity
Atlas Stone - Cockroach King - In Memoriam
Prosthetic - Invasion - Carousel
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Only Stars? I think that song is... not good to say it nicely.
You watch what you're saying, good sir. That's my brother on that song. :P
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What 'Main Riff' in Drapery? The melodic line is similar, but not the same (and also not for more than 7 seconds), everything in the background (as in not the guitar solo (Architect) or long notes (Drapery)) is different.
The opening riff.
The chord progression is also very similar.
No need to get defensive, like I said I still think it’s a great song.
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Only Stars? I think that song is... not good to say it nicely.
You watch what you're saying, good sir. That's my brother on that song. :P
:lol no offense was intended, certainly not personal. But what's his role in the song? I only have the digital version download so no cd booklet to look at notes. Honestly, if these Diego rumors turn out to be true, that song kind of feels like DT's Space Dye Vest in a way.
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Only Stars? I think that song is... not good to say it nicely.
You watch what you're saying, good sir. That's my brother on that song. :P
:lol no offense was intended, certainly not personal. But what's his role in the song? I only have the digital version download so no cd booklet to look at notes. Honestly, if these Diego rumors turn out to be true, that song kind of feels like DT's Space Dye Vest in a way.
:lol It's cool, I was joking - tastes are tastes and even as an epilogue it won't be to everyone's. Pete did the full arrangement on that track (having only done electronic percussion stuff on Puzzle Box on Vector, which he also reprised in The Strain) which was really cool.
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I'm not getting defensive, I'm just listening to the tracks and pointing out why I don't think it's a valid comparison.
Both songs make use of 9ths in the chords, but the chords in Drapery go down from Cm(add9), Bb(add9) to Abm and back up, whereas Architect goes from Am(add9) to Cm(add9), up a minor third and the repeating that from the Bb up to Db.
So yes, texturally the chords sound similar, because it's the same chord type being used, but in a different harmonic progression for both songs. Rhythmically it's not the same at all (Drapery is clearly in 6/8, The Architect is .. not) and even the melodic line (which I said does sound similar) isn't remotely the same when you start analysing it. For instance, in Drapery it starts on the fifth of the underlying chord (G to Cmadd9) and in the Architect it starts on the ninth of the chord.
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I'm not getting defensive, I'm just listening to the tracks and pointing out why I don't think it's a valid comparison.
Both songs make use of 9ths in the chords, but the chords in Drapery go down from Cm(add9), Bb(add9) to Abm and back up, whereas Architect goes from Am(add9) to Cm(add9), up a minor third and the repeating that from the Bb up to Db.
So yes, texturally the chords sound similar, because it's the same chord type being used, but in a different harmonic progression for both songs. Rhythmically it's not the same at all and even the melodic line (which I said does sound similar) isn't remotely the same when you start analysing it. For instance, in Drapery it starts on the fifth of the underlying chord (G to Cmadd9) and in the Architect it starts on the ninth of the chord.
I never said it was the same. It’s not the same, but I would be really surprised if whoever came up with that part wasn’t influenced by Opeth.
Others felt the same way here: https://www.last.fm/music/Haken/_/The+Architect/+shoutbox?sort=popular (https://www.last.fm/music/Haken/_/The+Architect/+shoutbox?sort=popular)
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I never said you said it's the same :lol
But to quote yourself, you said it 'completely rips off' The Drapery Falls and I think to say that for a section that's barely 7 seconds with a bunch of provable differences is far-fetched and therefore not a valid comparison
Yes, it does kind-of sound similar, it could be influenced by that particular Opeth thing, but honestly I doubt that and would think it's a coincindence. Analysing it proves it's not that similar at all. That's all.
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Well I’m not the only one who thinks the parts are very similar as seen in the link I posted. Let’s just leave it at that.
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Okay :)
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Really excited to get my copy of Virus this week and listen to it again. Loved every song on first listen except the closer.
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Honestly, if these Diego rumors turn out to be true, that song kind of feels like DT's Space Dye Vest in a way.
Even disregarding that, I think Only Stars is comparable to Space-Dye Vest in terms of its atmosphere. Although, Only Stars goes for a more unsettling and creepy atmosphere whereas Space-Dye Vest is more of a depressing atmosphere.
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I must be the only person on this planet that still reps Aquarius. There was just something about that one that seemed special to me and a lot of the unique characteristics did not carry over into the subsequent albums.
No, there's so many people saying that, that it turned into a meme. The band members mention it in interviews every now and then.
I was in the same boat until Affinity came along.
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re: Diego - hasn't mentioned Haken on his twitter in months. Not even to say something upon the new album release.
I'd say that's pretty fishy. They're not huge celebrities, you know they must be aware of the rumors and would say something about them if they could.
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re: Diego - hasn't mentioned Haken on his twitter in months. Not even to say something upon the new album release.
I'd say that's pretty fishy. They're not huge celebrities, you know they must be aware of the rumors and would say something about them if they could.
I noticed his lack of social media activity regarding Haken as well. Very surprising to not make a post about the new album being released.
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re: Diego - hasn't mentioned Haken on his twitter in months. Not even to say something upon the new album release.
I'd say that's pretty fishy. They're not huge celebrities, you know they must be aware of the rumors and would say something about them if they could.
I noticed his lack of social media activity regarding Haken as well. Very surprising to not make a post about the new album being released.
Yes, and it's been the same over FB, he hasn't said a word
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When everyone is so quiet like this, it makes me thing something legal is happening. That's like the only time when both parties won't say anything. :sadpanda:
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So, Rich, when is your brother going to be officially announced as the new (old) keyboardist for the band? :P ;D
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So, Rich, when is your brother going to be officially announced as the new (old) keyboardist for the band? :P ;D
:lol after learning your brother was involved in the new album today... yes, this ^
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:lol You're not the first people to ask me that. Obviously it goes without saying that I'd absolutely love for it to happen, but I don't even know what's going on with Diego right now so I don't want to get my hopes up.
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:lol You're not the first people to ask me that. Obviously it goes without saying that I'd absolutely love for it to happen, but I don't even know what's going on with Diego right now so I don't want to get my hopes up.
LIAR!!!!
:rollin
J/K
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So, Rich, when is your brother going to be officially announced as the new (old) keyboardist for the band? :P ;D
:lol after learning your brother was involved in the new album today... yes, this ^
He also guested on Vector and there's Nova Collective too... :biggrin:
:lol You're not the first people to ask me that. Obviously it goes without saying that I'd absolutely love for it to happen, but I don't even know what's going on with Diego right now so I don't want to get my hopes up.
:corn
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So, Rich, when is your brother going to be officially announced as the new (old) keyboardist for the band? :P ;D
:lol after learning your brother was involved in the new album today... yes, this ^
Well, he was the original keyboardist for Haken.
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With every spin it gets closer to album of the year. It's that good. An astonishing piece of work.
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I'm late, but I finally listened to the album, and... I'm really underwhelmed. I wasn't the biggest fan of Vector to begin with, but now Virus makes Vector sound like The Mountain in comparison :eek
Obviously I've only listened to the album once, so it's not like I've spent a lot of time analyzing the songs, but after one listen I can say I found absolutely nothing memorable about it. My favorite song, melody-wise, might be Prosthetic, and that's saying a lot! Even Vector, with all the heavyness, managed to get good/memorable melodies and there's 4 songs that I really really like from it (the stretch from TGD to NBM). Here, I found it to be a really tiring experience, with a lot of samey-sounding songs, where I often felt like skipping them to see if there was anything interesting in the next one, but I tried not to.
As for the keyboards, I wonder where Diego was, because he's definitely not in the album :lol But, seriously, I think I heard the keys stand out like 4 or 5 times in an hour long album :huh:
Again, things could get better with more listens, but after going through the album from start to finish, I honestly have no desire to do it again. There's just so much great music out there that I enjoy a lot more, that I really don't want to invest more time in an album like this one :-\ (not saying it's not good, it's just: 1. not really for me 2. not what I want when listening to Haken)
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:lol You're not the first people to ask me that. Obviously it goes without saying that I'd absolutely love for it to happen, but I don't even know what's going on with Diego right now so I don't want to get my hopes up.
Wow, you’re Pete Jonas’s brother? Cool! He made an incredible job on Nova Collective!
About Diego, he was the only Haken member that didn’t post anything about Virus on Facebook since its release. I think this is a real sign that something wrong is happening.
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Update....my package arrived today.
I’m a little bummed that the CD just comes in a plastic slipcover. Now I feel like I have to pick up the digipak from my local CD shop.
I’ll load it onto my player tonight and try to listen at work tomorrow.
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The number of people in the last week who have said that Visions is their favorite album, or was their favorite album until x, is highly disappointing to me.
I must be the only person on this planet that still reps Aquarius. There was just something about that one that seemed special to me and a lot of the unique characteristics did not carry over into the subsequent albums.
Aquarius would be great if there is no pointless growling and Celestial Elixir has a climax.
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At first I did not like the new album, but now it is really growing.
(https://i.imgur.com/tFJ4EPr.jpg)
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Drowning in the Flood - Sun - Celestial Elixir
Yes.
Yeah this isn't even a contest
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Aquarius is probably still my favorite album, tied pretty roughly with The Mountain. Visions is mostly good but doesn't stick with me much, and while I like Earthrise and The Endless Knot a lot, I pretty much never listen to Affinity, and everything I've heard past that just fails to make an impression on me.
Well, I did like Crystallized a lot. I don't remember when that was released.
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There are way too many 3 song runs to pick a favorite. But Mind’s Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter is up there. Certainly my favorite 3 song run from Visions by a landslide.
How about favorite per album?
Drowning/Sun/Elixir
Eye/Portals/SS
In Memoriam/Because/Falling
Giant/Knot/Gravity
Doctor/Puzzle/Veil
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I'm late, but I finally listened to the album, and... I'm really underwhelmed. I wasn't the biggest fan of Vector to begin with, but now Virus makes Vector sound like The Mountain in comparison :eek
Obviously I've only listened to the album once, so it's not like I've spent a lot of time analyzing the songs, but after one listen I can say I found absolutely nothing memorable about it. My favorite song, melody-wise, might be Prosthetic, and that's saying a lot! Even Vector, with all the heavyness, managed to get good/memorable melodies and there's 4 songs that I really really like from it (the stretch from TGD to NBM). Here, I found it to be a really tiring experience, with a lot of samey-sounding songs, where I often felt like skipping them to see if there was anything interesting in the next one, but I tried not to.
As for the keyboards, I wonder where Diego was, because he's definitely not in the album :lol But, seriously, I think I heard the keys stand out like 4 or 5 times in an hour long album :huh:
Again, things could get better with more listens, but after going through the album from start to finish, I honestly have no desire to do it again. There's just so much great music out there that I enjoy a lot more, that I really don't want to invest more time in an album like this one :-\ (not saying it's not good, it's just: 1. not really for me 2. not what I want when listening to Haken)
Exactly this for me. I don't think I've ever felt more underwhelmed after Only Stars finished.
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(https://i.imgur.com/Mo4vWa9.jpg)
Could this be the next one? ;D (not my original content)
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:lol
Someone else suggested it should become a trilogy with the third part called Vaccine.
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Yeah that sounds more plausible :lol
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:lol
Someone else suggested it should become a trilogy with the third part called Vaccine.
This, but it should be stylized VaccIIne, to keep the V/VI/VII going. Also what gets vaccinated back to health? Diego's keyboards return to the fore? The mix is in perfect balance with no one instrument overwhelming the others?
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They should have named this one Victor.
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:lol
Someone else suggested it should become a trilogy with the third part called Vaccine.
This, but it should be stylized VaccIIne, to keep the V/VI/VII going. Also what gets vaccinated back to health? Diego's keyboards return to the fore? The mix is in perfect balance with no one instrument overwhelming the others?
Now I will actually be disappointed if this doesn't happen. ;D
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Would the fans who don't like it be called "anti-vaxxers"?
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Gave Virus another chance again tonight. Now listening to Dream Theater's Awake to recover. :lol
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As for the keyboards, I wonder where Diego was, because he's definitely not in the album :lol But, seriously, I think I heard the keys stand out like 4 or 5 times in an hour long album :huh:
As I was listening to the record, I started singing the Where In the World is Carmen San Diego? theme with "Where in the world is keyboardist Diego?"
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Ray would love that new album cover. LOL
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They should have named this one Victor.
Then their next album could be a double album called “Roger Roger”
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As for the keyboards, I wonder where Diego was, because he's definitely not in the album :lol But, seriously, I think I heard the keys stand out like 4 or 5 times in an hour long album :huh:
As I was listening to the record, I started singing the Where In the World is Carmen San Diego? theme with "Where in the world is keyboardist Diego?"
:rollin
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Invasion might be my least favorite Haken song. I can’t explain it. It just feels so incredibly bland.
I just can’t connect to this album very well. Ross’ vocals this time around just do nothing for me.
There are few moments I love.
Prosthetic - I actually like this one, chorus get a bit old though.
Invasion - look above. Ross brings it down for me.
Carousel - Love the 2nd half, especially the bass work.
The Strain - Really don’t like the chorus. At all. 2:40 until like 3:25 is pretty amazing. I actually love his vocals there.
Canary Yellow - Not bad, kinda reminds me of Bound by Gravity, just not near as good.
The Messiah Complex - I like this for what it is. It’s nowhere near as good as their other epics, though it hardly feels like one anyway. Ectobius Rex is pretty fun.
Only Stars - it exists.
I usually like to wait a while to see if an album clicks before posting thoughts but I didn’t expect I’d be this initially disappointed in a Haken album. There are few vocal melodies that really stick with me, and Diego being so low in the mix really brings it down for me, considering he’s my favorite.
By far the worst Haken album for me. Usually not this negative, but damn, its a very disappointing experience for me.
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Haken 7 will obviously be called $7 Bacon Sandwich
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OK. So I officially gave the album three spins while I was at work today. Twice in a row, and then vector and virus back to back. So I have some initial thoughts.
I find FB‘s comment particularly funny since I just came on here to say that invasion may very well be my favorite song from either album. :rollin I absolutely cannot get that vocal melody or that riff out of my head.
I still don’t think the album is nearly as good as their first four, but I do like it worlds better than vector. The big “if” is going to be messiah complex. It seems a mishmash right now. But it’s a lot to digest. Some cohesiveness might become more apparent with familiarity.
As far as Diego goes, he might be a bit buried in the mix, but once I put on my “Train of Thought goggles” I heard him all over on this album.
I remember everyone in the dream theater community seemingly making the exact same comments about Jordan’s keyboards when train of thought first came out. If I recall correctly, Jordan even had to come out with a statement telling everyone that he was all over on the album, but he just wasn’t using typical keyboard sounds. much of what he plays on train of thought are sound patches and texturing that blend in with the guitars, so you don’t really know it’s there unless you’re looking for sounds that don’t sound like keyboards. Listen to the types of things that Jordan does on train of thought and you will hear Diego doing a lot of very similar things on this album.
That doesn’t mean I’m claiming there’s not problems in the camp. Diego may be unhappy for some other reason. (As I said...he is a bit buried. He might be unhappy with the mix, or possibly even unhappy with the new heavier direction) But if you know what to look for, he’s absolutely not a no-show on this album.
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As far as Diego goes, he might be a bit buried in the mix, but once I put on my “Train of Thought goggles” I heard him all over on this album.
So true! I did the same yesterday and got a much better appreciation for the keyboards. Still I love keyboards so I would like different sounds but it's fine for a very heavy focused album like this.
I am starting to digest the album more and more and overall I like it more and more. Messiah Complex is very much a cool mismash with so much potential. Sadly I think it won't live up to that and just a few tweaks here and there would make all the difference. Reminds me of Shattered Fortress actually.
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I wonder how much of people saying Messiah Complex is a mishmash/not coherent is down to the movements being separated into individual tracks. The chorus of part 1 does repeat at the end, followed by a reprise of the middle theme from Prosthetic. The first part of that sentence feels like standard procedure for many prog epics. Establish "home", go off on an adventure, then return home at the end.
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I wonder how much of people saying Messiah Complex is a mishmash/not coherent is down to the movements being separated into individual tracks.
It wasn't for me. I merged the tracks as soon as I got my hands on them.
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I wonder how much of people saying Messiah Complex is a mishmash/not coherent is down to the movements being separated into individual tracks. The chorus of part 1 does repeat at the end, followed by a reprise of the middle theme from Prosthetic. The first part of that sentence feels like standard procedure for many prog epics. Establish "home", go off on an adventure, then return home at the end.
Look at it like, for example, The Whirlwind by Transatlantic. That's also supposedly a single song, divide into multiple (12) tracks. The fac that it's divided into multiple tracks makes you appreciate some of the separate movements in as different light - as a standalone song. I think the band may have realised that Messiah Complex was too complex (ha!) to be a 'single' song, and therefore decided to divide it into several movements for clarity's sake. That said.. after three listens I don't really think the different movements are really good stand-alone songs. Can you imagine them playing just Part IV at a concert? I think they would always need to play the whole suite in one go. Part of what makes the song so frantic, and I'm quite sure this is deliberate, is that it jumps around a lot. Reprising a bunch of stuff, melodically, rhythmically and lyrically, and signifying the ultimate demise of the Cockroach King through his madness. I think it should be one song, because the separate movements don't make as much sense on their own as for instance the Whirlwind tracks (or SDOIT, if you want), but they do help in structuring this piece.
(Frankly though, I don't really care either way and people complaining about it being split up are making things way too difficult for themselves. Just listen to it in one go if you really want or get rid of your free Spotify subscription so you don't get an ad halfway through.)
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I don't really have a problem with a mismash or whatever we call it. Dream Theater has plenty of that with e.g. Shattered Fortress and I love it. Messiah Complex is really cool, just that the jumps are sometimes so "hard" (they really don't transition into it). Maybe it's mainly the vocals for me that doesn't transition very well between the individual tracks. Also the reprise of Ivory Tower melody (which I love btw) at the end doesn't have that goose bump effect I expected. It needs to build a bit more imo.
My main issue however is The Sect. Some of that instrumentation is just not very good to listen to. Ofc complex and all but so unnecessary and over the top imo.
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I wonder how much of people saying Messiah Complex is a mishmash/not coherent is down to the movements being separated into individual tracks. The chorus of part 1 does repeat at the end, followed by a reprise of the middle theme from Prosthetic. The first part of that sentence feels like standard procedure for many prog epics. Establish "home", go off on an adventure, then return home at the end.
Since I’m listening at work on a music player, I’m not even aware of where one movement starts and another ends. I would have to be looking at my player to see when the tracks switch. So I’m hearing it as a continuous piece and it still seems a bit messy. But it’s only 3 listens.
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I think it's less messy as 5 tracks, because each has its own separate musical identity. It's not done as a single cohesive song with repeating choruses or motifs. Part 1 has a chorus, which gets reprised in part 5. The very start of part 3 is an extension of a riff from part 2. But apart from those, there's no other musical connection between the 5 parts.
So, as a single song I'd see why people might find it messy. But it's not a single song, it's a 5-track suite.
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Anyone had a chance to pour through the lyrics and interpret the story yet?
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I think it's less messy as 5 tracks, because each has its own separate musical identity. It's not done as a single cohesive song with repeating choruses or motifs. Part 1 has a chorus, which gets reprised in part 5. The very start of part 3 is an extension of a riff from part 2. But apart from those, there's no other musical connection between the 5 parts.
So, as a single song I'd see why people might find it messy. But it's not a single song, it's a 5-track suite.
But that only changes the mindset not how it sounds. Also there's a very strong musical connection between the tracks since they flow into each other and are part of the same entity. I can't listen to it differently than the way I am currently doing no matter if it's a single track, suite, individual tracks etc. I don't think I can change the way I look at it and by that make it feel less messy :)
BTW The "Abdicate the throne, majesty ..." part of A glutton for punishment is maybe the best part for me right now. So good! ;D
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I think it's less messy as 5 tracks, because each has its own separate musical identity. It's not done as a single cohesive song with repeating choruses or motifs. Part 1 has a chorus, which gets reprised in part 5. The very start of part 3 is an extension of a riff from part 2. But apart from those, there's no other musical connection between the 5 parts.
So, as a single song I'd see why people might find it messy. But it's not a single song, it's a 5-track suite.
But that only changes the mindset not how it sounds. Also there's a very strong musical connection between the tracks since they flow into each other and are part of the same entity. I can't listen to it differently than the way I am currently doing no matter if it's a single track, suite, individual tracks etc. I don't think I can change the way I look at it and by that make it feel less messy :)
BTW The "Abdicate the throne, majesty ..." part of A glutton for punishment is maybe the best part for me right now. So good! ;D
Yeah agree it of course doesn't change how it sounds, I was just responding to RoeDent's question. But I think mindset does matter somewhat, because our enjoyment of music is all down to what we take from it and how we interpret it, so context like that will matter to a lot of people, to varying degrees anyway.
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BTW The "Abdicate the throne, majesty ..." part of A glutton for punishment is maybe the best part for me right now. So good! ;D
If I were to change one thing about Messiah Complex, it would be to make that part longer. It'd make a near-perfect song even better!
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BTW The "Abdicate the throne, majesty ..." part of A glutton for punishment is maybe the best part for me right now. So good! ;D
If I were to change one thing about Messiah Complex, it would be to make that part longer. It'd make a near-perfect song even better!
Yeah that's one of my favourite parts of the whole album. I love that dark, quirky, theatrical kind of metal. They've not really done it since bits of Visions.
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BTW The "Abdicate the throne, majesty ..." part of A glutton for punishment is maybe the best part for me right now. So good! ;D
If I were to change one thing about Messiah Complex, it would be to make that part longer. It'd make a near-perfect song even better!
This for maybe 10 parts of the song, lots of goodness lost as there’s not enough time to hang on. Also wish Only Stars started with a minute of instrumentation to bring us down from the craziness that is MC.
Songs 1-5 a really great run, with Carousel still scoring 11/10 for me.
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Carousel doesn’t really do anything for me so far. I would currently, after three or four full listens, call it the worst track on the album. Can anyone explain to me why they think it’s so good?
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Regarding some of the comments earlier regarding similarities to TOT keyboards, I can definitely see it. I definitely hear Diego throughout the album, I suppose I’m just more disappointed in the performance. There’s few moments that are sonically pleasing to me, and I don’t know if that’s because of the mix, the lack of inspiration, or what.
I think the reason Affinity is by far my favorite album from them is because Diego sounds incredible on there. Red Giant’s atmosphere and ambience is absolutely perfect and he’s why it’s my favorite Haken song. His work throughout the rest of the album is stellar.
I guess I just feel his contributions aren’t the same on this album. And I’m not so sure if it’s because of the heavier direction over the last 2 albums. I absolutely loved him on Vector. It just feels different here to me. Maybe I’m not explaining it well, I really don’t know how to :lol
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Carousel doesn’t really do anything for me so far. I would currently, after three or four full listens, call it the worst track on the album. Can anyone explain to me why they think it’s so good?
There’s a really cool riff that lasts for like 7 seconds somewhere near the end that I really like, but then it changes so quickly
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Carousel doesn’t really do anything for me so far. I would currently, after three or four full listens, call it the worst track on the album. Can anyone explain to me why they think it’s so good?
Given I admittedly overrate it’s probably just personal taste. For me it changes up frequently but at its heart has 3 or 4 ideas and keeps coming back to them, so there’s a through line that makes it a cohesive song.
Also the one song with singing which usually is one of their strengths... lots of talking/yelling on this album (understandable trying to compete with the wall of sound)
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Carousel starts out really great. One of the best choruses on the album and some really good riffs, too. The flow is a bit weird though... it has their typical mini-epic song structure with a break/change-up in the middle, except instead of happening once it happens twice, with an extra chorus thrown inbetween. The first couple times I heard it I was caught off-guard seeing that it still had a few minutes to go after that third chorus.
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Just a question, anyone else’s jewel case CD version of Virus has a crack in the back under the InsideOut logo? Just wondering because I got 2 copies and both have that same exact crack.
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Anyone had a chance to pour through the lyrics and interpret the story yet?
I'm still waiting for mine to ship. Which it should be tomorrow.
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Mine shipped yesterday. Should arrive no later than September 7th. I expect it to arrive mid-August though.
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Some further thoughts after a couple more lessons at work today.
After listening to both albums back to back on at least two occasions now, I’ve come to the conclusion that they work better as a complete unit. It does manage to be a bit better than the sum of its parts. i’m actually beginning to think that it may have been a mistake to release it as two separate albums two years apart from each other. It’s all one “sound” and all one concept, I think releasing a 2CD concept album after affinity would’ve been the right move. Then we could all sit around and debate about whether we liked disc one or disc two better. But at the end of the day, at least we would have the one album with the one sound and they would’ve gotten that out of their system. Love it or hate it, at least it would be its own entity.
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Some further thoughts after a couple more lessons at work today.
After listening to both albums back to back on at least two occasions now, I’ve come to the conclusion that they work better as a complete unit. It does manage to be a bit better than the sum of its parts. i’m actually beginning to think that it may have been a mistake to release it as two separate albums two years apart from each other. It’s all one “sound” and all one concept, I think releasing a 2CD concept album after affinity would’ve been the right move. Then we could all sit around and debate about whether we liked disc one or disc two better. But at the end of the day, at least we would have the one album with the one sound and they would’ve gotten that out of their system. Love it or hate it, at least it would be its own entity.
I am a very casual fan, granted, but I have listened to every Haken album close to its release date. And I had no idea that the two albums were supposed to be related.
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Start by listening to Clear and Only Stars back to back.
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So how serious is this ‘Diego May leave the band’ rumor? Is there any real evidence of this or is it just internet speculation based off of minimal info?
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So how serious is this ‘Diego May leave the band’ rumor? Is there any real evidence of this or is it just internet speculation based off of minimal info?
It’s all speculation. I’m not taking it very seriously at the moment. But I have to admit that the silence is deafening.
This is a band that is usually halfway decent about their internet presence. But now that these rumors have gotten to critical mass, everyone is suddenly dead quiet. It’s a little weird.
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So how serious is this ‘Diego May leave the band’ rumor? Is there any real evidence of this or is it just internet speculation based off of minimal info?
It’s all speculation. I’m not taking it very seriously at the moment. But I have to admit that the silence is deafening.
This is a band that is usually halfway decent about their internet presence. But now that these rumors have gotten to critical mass, everyone is suddenly dead quiet. It’s a little weird.
That’s how I feel. I would have thought/hoped were this just some dumb rumor it’d have been squashed immediately by Diego and the other guys. But nothing......zippo.....just crickets. That’s why it ‘feels’ like it could be true?
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Got the mediabook today, I really like it and it goes well with the Vector one.
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My last couple of posts have been fairly “stream of consciousness“. Just typing things out as they occur to me.
But I think it’s worth stating that after twice more listening to both albums back to back I have gained a bigger appreciation for both of them. It really does help to view them as a two CD concept album rather than two separate albums. The only thing that really breaks the flow is those weird vocalizations at the end of vector. I seem to remember that a lot of people were complaining that a cell divides didn’t feel like a proper ending. Not everybody, but a few people were definitely of that opinion. And I have to say, that I think that song definitely works better as a close to act one rather than the ending of an album.
I have not been a very big fan of vector ever since it came out. But when I heard that virus was a sequel of sorts I did hold out hope that the material on virus would elevate the whole of the concept starting with vector. At this point, maybe it’s just a placebo effect or maybe it’s just becoming more familiar with the material on both albums after having a lengthy break from Haken since vector was released... But the end result is that I have gained a new appreciation for all the material on both albums. And I find that hearing them both back to back really does make the entire concept flow better.
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Vector
1. Host
2. A Cell Divides
3. Veil
4. Puzzle Box
5. Nil By Mouth
6. The Good Doctor
7. Clear
VIrus
1. Canary Yellow
2. Messiah Complex
3. Carousel
4. The Strain
5. Prosthetic
6. Invasion
7. Only Stars
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I’m not ready to start ranking them yet, but I am starting to change my tune on invasion. It’s truly “a tale of two songs“... I personally think the verses are the catchiest thing they’ve ever recorded. Literally haven’t been able to get the first two minutes of the song out of my head since it was first released....and I’m not even sick of it. I love it more than anything they’ve ever done. But the chorus doesn’t live up to the buildup, and the solo is...well wait, what solo? Did Kurt Cobain rise from the grave to cut a solo for Haken? It’s like...one note, and then another note a bar later. I’m still completely addicted to those verses, but the payoff isn’t there.
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My last couple of posts have been fairly “stream of consciousness“. Just typing things out as they occur to me.
But I think it’s worth stating that after twice more listening to both albums back to back I have gained a bigger appreciation for both of them. It really does help to view them as a two CD concept album rather than two separate albums. The only thing that really breaks the flow is those weird vocalizations at the end of vector. I seem to remember that a lot of people were complaining that a cell divides didn’t feel like a proper ending. Not everybody, but a few people were definitely of that opinion. And I have to say, that I think that song definitely works better as a close to act one rather than the ending of an album.
I have not been a very big fan of vector ever since it came out. But when I heard that virus was a sequel of sorts I did hold out hope that the material on virus would elevate the whole of the concept starting with vector. At this point, maybe it’s just a placebo effect or maybe it’s just becoming more familiar with the material on both albums after having a lengthy break from Haken since vector was released... But the end result is that I have gained a new appreciation for all the material on both albums. And I find that hearing them both back to back really does make the entire concept flow better.
I did just that and both albums do sound better unified. The talking at the end of A Cell Divides does hinder the flow, but it works as Prosthetic fades in.
I really like the way Haken tends to make their slower songs full of atmosphere.
Messiah Complex didn't need to be split up, but I see why they did as each part is its own part of the story. I don't have my physical copy yet so can't understand the full concept, yet.
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Also, hearing it that way makes both Clear and Only Stars much cooler than they were previously. My opinion that they should have released a double album grows stronger with every spin.
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Possible spoilers below (trying to figure out the story / connections etc.):
From listening to Vector and Virus my assumption so far is that all songs (I know most are but maybe not all?) on the two albums are about the story / origin of the Cockroach King? Vector is 20 years earlier (band said this) than Virus. Messiah Complex is that final twist in the movie (if it was a movie) where the viewers suddenly realize that the person we followed all this time was the Cockroach King with all the reprising themes being sort of flashbacks and the puzzle pieces coming together.
Still don't fully understand what or who the Coackroach King is. I guess his name is Ectobius Rex and a doctor (a "good" doctor even hehe). He punishes people using shock therapy. He is wealthy (Midas touch, "The road from rags to riches leads nowhere" etc.). He lives in his ivory tower (metaphorically ofc) and The Strain has a obvious reference to when he starts descending down that path ("The monster inside me ascending the ivory"). But not really sure what all this leads us. Who is he in the end? A wealthy doctor mistreating patients stuck from the world in his own insanity?
Also there's very obvious references to a patient. Puzzle Box, Nil By Mouth, Prosthetic etc. all seems to be from a specific patient's view? At times I even believe Rex is the patient but that would be strange. So I assume it's a patient to Rex. But what happens to this patient?
BTW when googling Marigold is found a fun reference to Midas. Coackroach King has King Midas touch and the daughter of Midas is Marigold who turned to gold from it ("be careful what you wish for ..."). I realize the fan base must have finished analysing all the pieces already but haha yeah.
Edit: Ectobius is ofc a species of coackroaches ;D
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Possible spoilers below (trying to figure out the story / connections etc.):
From listening to Vector and Virus my assumption so far is that all songs (I know most are but maybe not all?) on the two albums are about the story / origin of the Cockroach King? Vector is 20 years earlier (band said this) than Virus. Messiah Complex is that final twist in the movie (if it was a movie) where the viewers suddenly realize that the person we followed all this time was the Cockroach King with all the reprising themes being sort of flashbacks and the puzzle pieces coming together.
Still don't fully understand what or who the Coackroach King is. I guess his name is Ectobius Rex and a doctor (a "good" doctor even hehe). He punishes people using shock therapy. He is wealthy (Midas touch, "The road from rags to riches leads nowhere" etc.). He lives in his ivory tower (metaphorically ofc) and The Strain has a obvious reference to when he starts descending down that path ("The monster inside me ascending the ivory"). But not really sure what all this leads us. Who is he in the end? A wealthy doctor mistreating patients stuck from the world in his own insanity?
Also there's very obvious references to a patient. Puzzle Box, Nil By Mouth, Prosthetic etc. all seems to be from a specific patient's view? At times I even believe Rex is the patient but that would be strange. So I assume it's a patient to Rex. But what happens to this patient?
BTW when googling Marigold is found a fun reference to Midas. Coackroach King has King Midas touch and the daughter of Midas is Marigold who turned to gold from it ("be careful what you wish for ..."). I realize the fan base must have finished analysing all the pieces already but haha yeah.
Edit: Ectobius is ofc a species of coackroaches ;D
Love it! I was driving into work an hour ago saying.. "I really have to figure out this story" Maybe you have it nailed! (or at least in the ballpark). So I've been giving it some serious spins the last week. So far the highlights by far are Carousel and Messiah Complex. The more I listen to MC... the better it gets. Especially parts 2,3 and 5.
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Possible spoilers below (trying to figure out the story / connections etc.):
From listening to Vector and Virus my assumption so far is that all songs (I know most are but maybe not all?) on the two albums are about the story / origin of the Cockroach King? Vector is 20 years earlier (band said this) than Virus. Messiah Complex is that final twist in the movie (if it was a movie) where the viewers suddenly realize that the person we followed all this time was the Cockroach King with all the reprising themes being sort of flashbacks and the puzzle pieces coming together.
Still don't fully understand what or who the Coackroach King is. I guess his name is Ectobius Rex and a doctor (a "good" doctor even hehe). He punishes people using shock therapy. He is wealthy (Midas touch, "The road from rags to riches leads nowhere" etc.). He lives in his ivory tower (metaphorically ofc) and The Strain has a obvious reference to when he starts descending down that path ("The monster inside me ascending the ivory"). But not really sure what all this leads us. Who is he in the end? A wealthy doctor mistreating patients stuck from the world in his own insanity?
Also there's very obvious references to a patient. Puzzle Box, Nil By Mouth, Prosthetic etc. all seems to be from a specific patient's view? At times I even believe Rex is the patient but that would be strange. So I assume it's a patient to Rex. But what happens to this patient?
BTW when googling Marigold is found a fun reference to Midas. Coackroach King has King Midas touch and the daughter of Midas is Marigold who turned to gold from it ("be careful what you wish for ..."). I realize the fan base must have finished analysing all the pieces already but haha yeah.
Edit: Ectobius is ofc a species of coackroaches ;D
OMG...Dr. Rex is Bill Gates.... :xbones :)
I like this guys interpretation.
https://progbreakdown.home.blog/2018/12/05/haken-vector/
I need to do my own. But I want to wait till I get my Virus copy so I can dissect (pun intended) the album artwork.
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Whoever thought that mixing the chorus of Puzzle Box with an almost comedic drum beat is a good idea needs to have his ears checked.
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Whoever thought that mixing the chorus of Puzzle Box with an almost comedic drum beat is a good idea needs to have his ears checked.
well, (slightly off-topic here, but anyway) DT's music features a lot of comedy ever since Jordan joined. Haken's does too apparently. What could be wrong about that? (apart from inaccurate notes, of course)
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I'm not a fan of the Puzzle Box reprise in Messiah Complex either but I don't think the drum beat has anything to do with it?
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I wasn't too hot on that particular reprise at first, but I got used to it and it works well in context with the rest of that movement.
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It feels really awkward to me. Part of that might be the mixing - there's a noticeable dip in volume right when that bit comes in, when it should be the other way around.
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Love all of the reprises but my favorite by far is the reprise of Host in MC-I.
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Love all of the reprises but my favorite by far is the reprise of Host in MC-I.
Messiah Complex is a great example of "The sum of the whole", the same way The Shattered Fortress is to The 12 Step Suite.
Also, hearing it that way makes both Clear and Only Stars much cooler than they were previously. My opinion that they should have released a double album grows stronger with every spin.
The way they were released reminds me of A TV Mini-Series, with 2 seasons. Vector ends with the The patient being reborn as the human abomination of a cockroach. Virus, is the continuance of him after his rebirth.
The best dream Theater connection is this is their Octavarium Nugget album.
I love how they used Ketchup (Amber Red) and Mustard (Canary Yellow) as the album covers, and the double meaning of using Canary. It leads me to believe they really thought it through, and the references to past albums is intentional just as neat nods (nuggets).
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Whoever thought that mixing the chorus of Puzzle Box with an almost comedic drum beat is a good idea needs to have his ears checked.
It fits the theme of the song. It represents the patients frustration of trying to solve and understand The Good Doctor" and his plans. It's central to convey that across to the listener. That's how you use music to tell a story.
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After some more listens, I think I like this more than Vector. I'm a huge fan of The Strain/Canary Yellow. I feel like those two go together and kind of get forgotten between the epics, but I absolutely love that part of the album.
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Possible spoilers below (trying to figure out the story / connections etc.):
From listening to Vector and Virus my assumption so far is that all songs (I know most are but maybe not all?) on the two albums are about the story / origin of the Cockroach King? Vector is 20 years earlier (band said this) than Virus. Messiah Complex is that final twist in the movie (if it was a movie) where the viewers suddenly realize that the person we followed all this time was the Cockroach King with all the reprising themes being sort of flashbacks and the puzzle pieces coming together.
Still don't fully understand what or who the Coackroach King is. I guess his name is Ectobius Rex and a doctor (a "good" doctor even hehe). He punishes people using shock therapy. He is wealthy (Midas touch, "The road from rags to riches leads nowhere" etc.). He lives in his ivory tower (metaphorically ofc) and The Strain has a obvious reference to when he starts descending down that path ("The monster inside me ascending the ivory"). But not really sure what all this leads us. Who is he in the end? A wealthy doctor mistreating patients stuck from the world in his own insanity?
Also there's very obvious references to a patient. Puzzle Box, Nil By Mouth, Prosthetic etc. all seems to be from a specific patient's view? At times I even believe Rex is the patient but that would be strange. So I assume it's a patient to Rex. But what happens to this patient?
BTW when googling Marigold is found a fun reference to Midas. Coackroach King has King Midas touch and the daughter of Midas is Marigold who turned to gold from it ("be careful what you wish for ..."). I realize the fan base must have finished analysing all the pieces already but haha yeah.
Edit: Ectobius is ofc a species of coackroaches ;D
OMG...Dr. Rex is Bill Gates.... :xbones :)
I like this guys interpretation.
https://progbreakdown.home.blog/2018/12/05/haken-vector/
I need to do my own. But I want to wait till I get my Virus copy so I can dissect (pun intended) the album artwork.
OMG! Thanks this makes so much sense. I made the wrong assumptions. The doctor is ofc not cockroach king but the patient! Haha love it! Now the whole story goes somewhere and is actually really terrifyingly cool! :omg:
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I have another take. But this is more just throwing spaghetti into the think tank. (Mixing metaphors for humors sake)
As I listened to the mountain, vector, and virus today at work, I feel like it’s possible that the cockroach king is the doctor. But he is someone who compromised his principles to achieve a comfortable life and scientific truth.
Think about it. We’ve all seen those experiments that prove that the majority of humankind can be desensitized into hurting their fellow man. While at the same time, the majority of us claim that we would never do such a thing. The denial that that side of ourselves exists is exactly what leaves us open for the possibility of it happening. We’re looking at a man who may be came from a very poor background but the rags to riches and the chasing of the “nuclear family“ caused him to start desensitize himself when performing experiments. It may have started small, but slowly graduated into experimenting on people. then, much later in life, he finds that his life is empty. Possibly his family has left him. In the pursuit of a comfortable and happy life he left himself so devoid of love and empathy that he ends up alone in the end. Possibly at the very end he himself is in a hospital with no one to love him and maybe even doctors experimenting on him.
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Just a question, anyone else’s jewel case CD version of Virus has a crack in the back under the InsideOut logo? Just wondering because I got 2 copies and both have that same exact crack.
Bump. Please help appease my OCD.
(https://i.imgur.com/rV2bGvN.jpg)
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I have a theory of my own on the story of Virus. Whether it's accurate or not, I don't know. I could go more into detail but I'd be here a while if I did, so I'll keep it brief.
Simply put, after transforming Patient #21 into a cockroach-human hybrid, Dr. Rex begins doing the same experiment to more patients. At some point, however, the patients begin to get angry with Dr. Rex and start an uprising (the phrase "call to arms" is mentioned a couple times). They succeed, and they overthrow Dr. Rex. He reflects on everything he's done and eventually dies while doing so.
On a side note, I saw someone mention a really interesting theory that states that Dr. Rex was the fisherman from Aquarius and has been haunted by his guilt in being responsible for the mermaid's death.
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Just a question, anyone else’s jewel case CD version of Virus has a crack in the back under the InsideOut logo? Just wondering because I got 2 copies and both have that same exact crack.
Bump. Please help appease my OCD.
I feel your pain. I would love to. But I got the mediabook.
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Just a question, anyone else’s jewel case CD version of Virus has a crack in the back under the InsideOut logo? Just wondering because I got 2 copies and both have that same exact crack.
Bump. Please help appease my OCD.
I feel your pain. I would love to. But I got the mediabook.
Thanks for replying.
I wanted the mediabook but it wasn’t available at the local store I ordered from. I hate jewel cases, they rarely come without cracks.
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I have another take. But this is more just throwing spaghetti into the think tank. (Mixing metaphors for humors sake)
As I listened to the mountain, vector, and virus today at work, I feel like it’s possible that the cockroach king is the doctor. But he is someone who compromised his principles to achieve a comfortable life and scientific truth.
Think about it. We’ve all seen those experiments that prove that the majority of humankind can be desensitized into hurting their fellow man. While at the same time, the majority of us claim that we would never do such a thing. The denial that that side of ourselves exists is exactly what leaves us open for the possibility of it happening. We’re looking at a man who may be came from a very poor background but the rags to riches and the chasing of the “nuclear family“ caused him to start desensitize himself when performing experiments. It may have started small, but slowly graduated into experimenting on people. then, much later in life, he finds that his life is empty. Possibly his family has left him. In the pursuit of a comfortable and happy life he left himself so devoid of love and empathy that he ends up alone in the end. Possibly at the very end he himself is in a hospital with no one to love him and maybe even doctors experimenting on him.
The Cockroach King experiments on the Doctor... :eek
Haha...I really wish I had the physical cd with me now.
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I have a theory of my own on the story of Virus. Whether it's accurate or not, I don't know. I could go more into detail but I'd be here a while if I did, so I'll keep it brief.
Simply put, after transforming Patient #21 into a cockroach-human hybrid, Dr. Rex begins doing the same experiment to more patients. At some point, however, the patients begin to get angry with Dr. Rex and start an uprising (the phrase "call to arms" is mentioned a couple times). They succeed, and they overthrow Dr. Rex. He reflects on everything he's done and eventually dies while doing so.
On a side note, I saw someone mention a really interesting theory that states that Dr. Rex was the fisherman from Aquarius and has been haunted by his guilt in being responsible for the mermaid's death.
I would like to hear your theory. Even if it's long. I am gonna do mine when I get Virus, typing up the Vector one once I find my cd booklet.
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I would like to hear your theory. Even if it's long. I am gonna do mine when I get Virus, typing up the Vector one once I find my cd booklet.
Alright, here's my theory in full:
After doing the whole human/cockroach mutation experiment on Patient 21, Dr. Rex is able to move on to more patients in the mental institution and do the same experiments on them. Perhaps due to a messiah complex, he thinks he's doing the patients a favor by doing this to them, as if he's their savior. This also makes me believe that Dr. Rex is the Cockroach King. However, as more patients become mutated, they begin to feel hopeless (see Invasion and Carousel), but also begin to get angry with Dr. Rex (see Prosthetic and The Strain). Dr. Rex has effectively risen to power with the amount of people he's mutated, but based on songs like Prosthetic and Canary Yellow (specifically the phrase "call to arms" in CY), the patients seem to want to defy him.
In Messiah Complex, it first goes into detail about Dr. Rex's, well, messiah complex. Considering an "ivory tower" is a metaphor to describe a place where people are cut off from the rest of the world, and the fourth movement being called "The Sect", it's easy to guess that this is Dr. Rex transforming the patients for the purpose of serving him. And as mentioned before, he thinks he's doing something good for the patients by doing all these experiments (see Canary Yellow, specifically the lines "You try to save the world, when it’s you that needs help"). In "A Glutton for Punishment", the phrase "call to arms" appears again, implying that the patients are ready to revolt against Dr. Rex at any point now. "Marigold" seems to go into how life is inside the "ivory tower" is, but this movement would also be where the patients finally rise up against Dr. Rex. "The Sect" represents an inner conflict within Dr. Rex (perhaps during the uprising), wondering if he can ever be redeemed for his actions, based on lines such as "Riches back to rags...", "Ostracized by the power of the masses...", and "If humility comes to humble me in my time of need...". I'm a bit unsure what exactly occurs in "Ectobius Rex", but one thing seems clear to me: The patients have conquered Dr. Rex, and he realizes he no longer has control over the mutated patients; he is no longer the Cockroach King. As such, he decides to completely abandon the entire institution before it's too late; he's jumping from his tower of ivory, so to speak.
Only Stars is about Dr. Rex reflecting on everything he's done. He's now far from the messiah he thought he was, and he seems to die while reflecting on this ("As I'm summoned hither / One last breath, I wither"). There's some sounds in the background, some which sound vaguely like insects (representing the cockroaches escaping from his rule) and some other crackling-like noises, which I interpret as the institution, his "ivory tower", being destroyed.
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Still don't fully understand what or who the Coackroach King is. I guess his name is Ectobius Rex ...
Edit: Ectobius is ofc a species of coackroaches ;D
Ectobius is a genus of yellowish cockroaches and rex is king in Latin. So, it makes sense.
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Finally commenting on this. It took me a bit more than three listens for it to finally click and for me to finally start enjoying the album properly. There are some really amazing ideas; unfortunately all my favorites parts are those that are fleeting. That said, this is still a solid album and a great follow up to Vector. Was going through my pictures from all the shows they did in Chicago. I'm missing them for sure.
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The patient experiments on the doctor? I never got that from any of this. Although I admit I have not read all the lyrics.
I have to say that I’m definitely suffering from confirmation bias. For seven years the original cockroach King has always been to me “self”, or “ego” if you will. When I thought the story was more about the doctor rising to power because of his own obsession with self and ego (that is, the cockroach king inside him...or inside all of us) it seemed to be more in harmony with my original thought about the original song. But if they made it an actual person and not the ego that lives inside each one of us, that would kind of suck the wind out of the original concept of the song for me
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The patient experiments on the doctor? I never got that from any of this. Although I admit I have not read all the lyrics.
I have to say that I’m definitely suffering from confirmation bias. For seven years the original cockroach King has always been to me “self”, or “ego” if you will. When I thought the story was more about the doctor rising to power because of his own obsession with self and ego (that is, the cockroach king inside him...or inside all of us) it seemed to be more in harmony with my original thought about the original song. But if they made it an actual person and not the ego that lives inside each one of us, that would kind of suck the wind out of the original concept of the song for me
It's both, just like the original song is both (i.e. a literal story as a metaphor/allegory for greed, obsession, etc.
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Ready to do my Virus track rankings:
Messiah Complex
Carousel
The Strain
Prosthetic
Canary Yellow
Invasion
Only Stars
with really Only Stars being the track that I'm not a fan of. Very strong album and consistent which was my problem with Vector just kind of dying off after Veil.
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Ready to do my Virus track rankings:
Messiah Complex
Carousel
The Strain
Prosthetic
Canary Yellow
Invasion
Only Stars
with really Only Stars being the track that I'm not a fan of. Very strong album and consistent which was my problem with Vector just kind of dying off after Veil.
As of right now... mine and yours are very similar.
Messiah Complex
Carousel
Prosthetic
The Strain
Invasion
Canary Yellow
Only Stars
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The patient experiments on the doctor? I never got that from any of this. Although I admit I have not read all the lyrics.
I have to say that I’m definitely suffering from confirmation bias. For seven years the original cockroach King has always been to me “self”, or “ego” if you will. When I thought the story was more about the doctor rising to power because of his own obsession with self and ego (that is, the cockroach king inside him...or inside all of us) it seemed to be more in harmony with my original thought about the original song. But if they made it an actual person and not the ego that lives inside each one of us, that would kind of suck the wind out of the original concept of the song for me
That's a neat takeaway from the song.
Cockroach King, now makes sense to me, oddly enough. It's so amazing just how much they expanded the concept and story of the Cockroach King as told in the song.
"Tantalized by the cockroach and its promise
I fantasised about soaring with golden wings
"Flying with gold wings"
Hypnotized by the cockroach and its promise
I was compromised by a treasure
That was fit for fools
"Lured by a fool's gold"
Blinded by a fickle fortune
Diamonds in my eyes
Blinded by the grand illusion
Golden wings to fly
The hunter draws closer to its prey
--- Right off that bat we get why the Cockroach King became his namesake, his fascination of the concept of a cockroach, of having it's golden wings to fly. And his lust for that illusion, throwing away all his values, blinded by greed to acquire his dream.
But honestly, now the more I analyze Cockroach King, the more I am seeing it to be about Cannabis and the Grand Illusion of it being a money maker giving you Golden Wings to fly. But it leads down a promise of deceit. The Cockroach King is the main street dealer, and sits upon his throne and the insects multiply meaning the many other things he has him selling, because of the diamond eyes.
I realize how far fetched it is though.
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Ready for a big oof but can't help it really
The Strain
Invasion
Only Stars
Canary Yellow
Prosthetic
Carousel
Messiah Complex
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The patient experiments on the doctor? I never got that from any of this. Although I admit I have not read all the lyrics.
I have to say that I’m definitely suffering from confirmation bias. For seven years the original cockroach King has always been to me “self”, or “ego” if you will. When I thought the story was more about the doctor rising to power because of his own obsession with self and ego (that is, the cockroach king inside him...or inside all of us) it seemed to be more in harmony with my original thought about the original song. But if they made it an actual person and not the ego that lives inside each one of us, that would kind of suck the wind out of the original concept of the song for me
That's a neat takeaway from the song.
Cockroach King, now makes sense to me, oddly enough. It's so amazing just how much they expanded the concept and story of the Cockroach King as told in the song.
"Tantalized by the cockroach and its promise
I fantasised about soaring with golden wings
"Flying with gold wings"
Hypnotized by the cockroach and its promise
I was compromised by a treasure
That was fit for fools
"Lured by a fool's gold"
Blinded by a fickle fortune
Diamonds in my eyes
Blinded by the grand illusion
Golden wings to fly
The hunter draws closer to its prey
--- Right off that bat we get why the Cockroach King became his namesake, his fascination of the concept of a cockroach, of having it's golden wings to fly. And his lust for that illusion, throwing away all his values, blinded by greed to acquire his dream.
But honestly, now the more I analyze Cockroach King, the more I am seeing it to be about Cannabis and the Grand Illusion of it being a money maker giving you Golden Wings to fly. But it leads down a promise of deceit. The Cockroach King is the main street dealer, and sits upon his throne and the insects multiply meaning the many other things he has him selling, because of the diamond eyes.
I realize how far fetched it is though.
I wasn’t sure I wanted to touch this, but I’ve honestly thought something very similar ever since the song came out. To expand on my earlier idea, I find many of the themes to be very closely related to ideas of addiction and overcoming that addiction. I know the common line of thought is that pot is not addictive... But you can Count me in as one of those very small percentage of people who were deeply addicted to it. I had a terrible time trying to break free. But I’ve been off of it now for A little over 25 years.
The dig about “toking on the roach of fallacy“ and then making a noise like he’s hitting on a joint really sold the idea for me.
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Any of you posting have the regular/jewel case version of the Virus CD?
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Any of you posting have the regular/jewel case version of the Virus CD?
I think you should post this in their discord channel, facebook group, or subreddit instead of here again... I bought mine digitally on amazon and you've asked a few times without response so I don't think anyone has the same issue in this discussion. Broaden your search in other areas if you are that concerned.
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But I’m pretty sure some people here mentioned getting the regular/jewel case version of the CD, I don’t understand why they can’t answer to my very simple question.
I’m gonna ask on reddit though.
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Whoever thought that mixing the chorus of Puzzle Box with an almost comedic drum beat is a good idea needs to have his ears checked.
It fits the theme of the song. It represents the patients frustration of trying to solve and understand The Good Doctor" and his plans. It's central to convey that across to the listener. That's how you use music to tell a story.
Sure, it makes sense conceptually. Doesn't mean it sounds good.
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I’m sure anyone who got the jewel case version would have answered. Just most of us didn’t. Too many people in these parts either got the vinyl combo or the digipak.
We weren’t really ignoring you, just figured it was a waste to have 10 people lining up to say “nope, I didn’t”.
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I thought you were one of the ones who had the jewel case version so I was slightly annoyed that you didn’t answer. My bad.
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As with Vector, I never even knew there was a jewel case version. When Vector came out, I only ever saw the digipak at the store. I ordered Virus from Amazon and that showed up as a digipak too.
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The 2CD digipak is the limited deluxe edition. I wanted that but unfortunately the store didn’t have it.
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I thought you were one of the ones who had the jewel case version so I was slightly annoyed that you didn’t answer. My bad.
No worries. :tup
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My gf & I were discussing our theories for the story of Vector/Virus a few days ago, & I think we agreed on this theory.
Clear / The Good Doctor (Doctor POV)- The Patient is admitted to a mental institution where Dr. Rex subjects him to electroshock therapy. It's unknown why The Patient is there in the first place, & it seems his own recollection is merely "vague memories of a caved-in broken life". Dr. Rex hopes that the electricity will help bring him back to being a normal member of society (spoiler: it doesn't).
Puzzle Box (Patient POV) - Amidst all the abuse The Patient is suffering, he struggles to piece together the events of his past, & his confusion only makes him feel more hopeless.
Veil (Alternating POV) - The Patient gives into his hopelessness, desperately pleading to be saved by Dr. Rex's experiments. Dr. Rex tries to reassure The Patient that he's safe with him, which gives The Patient a false sense of trust. The Patient then begs Dr. Rex to do whatever it takes to get him back to normal, & so he does...
Nil By Mouth / Host (Patient POV) - Dr. Rex experiments on The Patient further, subjecting him to a machine that can rewrite The Patient's DNA. The Patient thinks that it will be used to fix his brain, but unbeknownst to him, Dr. Rex has no real intention of helping him, & merely wants a test subject for his experiment. The Patient realises this as the machine's process is taking place, which fills him with even more hopelessness than he had before.
A Cell Divides (Alternating POV) - Unexpectedly, The Patient gruesomely transforms into a cockroach, fulfilling Dr. Rex's wildest dreams. Dr. Rex is proud of his creation, & feeling satisfied, he covers up all evidence of the experiment & goes back to work.
10 years later...
Prosthetic (Patient POV) - Out of the rubble, The Patient is finally discovered. He is then recovered back to human form by the scientists who discovered him, but as soon as he's saved, The Patient turns on the scientists & uses their own technology to overpower them. The Patient is angry about what happened to him, & he wants revenge.
Invasion (Patient POV) - Once alone, The Patient uses his stolen technology to develop a virus that will gruesomely transform & then kill anyone who it's exposed to. He plans to use this on Dr. Rex.
Carousel (Patient POV) - The Patient hunts for Dr. Rex. Along the way, he questions his own motives, but ultimately decides that this is what he needs to do to exact his revenge.
The Strain (Patient POV) - The Patient finally finds Dr. Rex, & seeing his face again triggers a flashback of the hopelessness he felt while he was under Dr. Rex's control.
Canary Yellow (Alternating POV) - The Patient then confronts Dr. Rex, telling him that he's the one that really needs psychological help for all his sadistic tendencies. Dr. Rex retorts by exclaiming that The Patient would've lived a boring normal life if it weren't for his experiments. This enrages The Patient, & he injects Dr. Rex with his virus.
Messiah Complex (Alternating POV) - After seeing what he's done, The Patient feels powerful for overcoming the person who put him through so much misery. He thinks of himself as if he's in an ivory tower. He watches Dr. Rex scream "How did I fail, my holy grail?" as he transforms into a cockroach. The Patient taunts him, saying "Careful what you wish for" as he continues to watch Dr. Rex's own experiment used against him. Finally, Dr. Rex dies from the virus, which The Patient celebrates at first, but then Dr. Rex's words from earlier resonate within him, that he wouldn't be who he is without his experiments. He thinks that for Dr. Rex to really die, his experiment must die too, & so he kills himself, jumping from his tower of ivory.
Only Stars (Patient POV) - In his final moments, The Patient reflects on the trauma of his lifetime as he dies, still feeling the anguish that he did back then, but knowing that it will all be over soon.
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I'm a big fan of Vector but I've never looked into the storyline. Now that Virus is finally out, I decided to start following the narative. Your interpretation helps quite a bit. :tup
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The ‘story’ isn’t literal and had never been confirmed, so anything you see is basically fan interpretations.
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Ready for a big oof but can't help it really
The Strain
Invasion
Only Stars
Canary Yellow
Prosthetic
Carousel
Messiah Complex
Actually this ranking is about what mine would be.
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Puzzle Box
Host
The Strain
Invasion
Messiah Complex
A Cell Divides
Canary Yellow
Prosthetic
The Good Doctor
Nil by Mouth
Carousel
Veil
Only Stars *
(Clear)**
This ranking is subject to change :)
Basically ranking them as if they were standalone songs, despite me listening to albums in full most of the time. This explains some of the admittedly weird placements. Veil, for example, has some fantastic parts, but as a song it suffers enormously from that jarring transition.
* in context of the album it’s better than this ranking would suggest. As a standalone song though.. not really.
** kind of pointless to rank this one as it’s only really an intro and nothing more than that.
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Damn Rich, that's so close to my ranking. I'd just put A Cell Divides lower and The Good Doctor higher.
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The ‘story’ isn’t literal and had never been confirmed, so anything you see is basically fan interpretations.
There must be some sort of a story, though, right? Otherwise there wouldn't be as many musical references.
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Likely, but a lot of it is figurative; it’s not like form example SFAM where the lyrics tell you exactly what’s happening.
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Damn Rich, that's so close to my ranking. I'd just put A Cell Divides lower and The Good Doctor higher.
:hifive:
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Has anyone else gotten their CD from Burning Shed yet? I just got mine in today (even though it shipped a day AFTER MPG's Cover Anthology, which I haven't received yet....hope it's still on its way).....and well, something peculiar has occurred.
I got the signed postcard that came with the CD, and there are only five band signatures on it. I can easily make out Richard, Ray, and Conner, but the other two, I'm not sure, but they look like Charlie's and Ross's signatures.
When I got Affinity, I got a signed postcard with that one, and it has all six members' signatures on it, so I'm not sure what happened here, why Diego wasn't able to sign the postcards... curiouser and curiouser...
-Marc.
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Yeah someone else noticed the same thing with theirs and posted it on Reddit a week ago or so: https://www.reddit.com/r/Haken/comments/hx4f5t/just_received_my_copy_of_virus_from_burning_shed/
It's got to the point now where it'd be weirder if Diego isn't leaving/hasn't left than if he is/has.
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Doesn't Diego live in Mexico? If so, that can easily be explained by Covid making it kinda pointless to send stuff over to Mexico just for him to sign it and send it back to the UK or wherever Burning Shed are based. And he probably couldn't, or didn't want to, fly to the UK in the midst of a global pandemic just for something like that.
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Doesn't Diego live in Mexico? If so, that can easily be explained by Covid making it kinda pointless to send stuff over to Mexico just for him to sign it and send it back to the UK or wherever Burning Shed are based. And he probably couldn't, or didn't want to, fly to the UK in the midst of a global pandemic just for something like that.
That makes the most sense, though I wonder why Burning Shed (which is located in the UK) wouldn't at least put an asterisk on it and say the postcards wouldn't have Diego's signature on it, just to inform fans who might have been expecting the whole band to sign the cards.
-Marc.
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Actually, it's all a trick. Diego is kicking everyone else out of Haken.
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Doesn't Diego live in Mexico? If so, that can easily be explained by Covid making it kinda pointless to send stuff over to Mexico just for him to sign it and send it back to the UK or wherever Burning Shed are based. And he probably couldn't, or didn't want to, fly to the UK in the midst of a global pandemic just for something like that.
That makes the most sense, though I wonder why Burning Shed (which is located in the UK) wouldn't at least put an asterisk on it and say the postcards wouldn't have Diego's signature on it, just to inform fans who might have been expecting the whole band to sign the cards.
-Marc.
If this is the reason for the delay, so fans can get what they paid for with all Band members signatures, I don't see why they couldn't do what you just said. Send an email telling fans due to recent events, Diego will unfortunately not be signing the pre-order packages.
He will be the most sought out member after shows, once they begin again.
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Thomas MacLean's departure was announced roughly one month after the release of The Mountain. If the rumours are true, I expect an announcement in a similar timeframe.
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Thomas MacLean's departure was announced roughly one month after the release of The Mountain. If the rumours are true, I expect an announcement in a similar timeframe.
In that situation, they needed to make the announcement before the shows started. In this situation, there’s not necessarily that element of time pressure because who knows when any live shows will happen.
But I do wish they would say something. It’s possible they have a replacement lined up and don’t want to make an announcement until after the legalities are taken care of. That is **IF** any of this speculation has any merit
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Actually, it's all a trick. Diego is kicking everyone else out of Haken.
Plot twist: Diego is the Cockroach King.
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Honestly I think Virus is slowly becoming my second favorite Haken album (after The Mountain).
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Honestly I think Virus is slowly becoming my second favorite Haken album (after The Mountain).
This is the correct opinion. :biggrin:
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Honestly I think Virus is slowly becoming my second favorite Haken album (after The Mountain).
Honestly, I think it's rising with every listen. I mentioned initially I didn't think it would be a top album, but then later said it was better than Vector. It might be better than Affinity after a few more listens. I love the callbacks to older works that I didn't immediately pick up and the melodies that I am now loving.
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I still don't know where to put the album in my rankings. The Mountain is still #1, but then it's pretty much up in the air how the rest of them place.
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After spending a week and a half with the album, it ended up at the bottom of my list, unfortunately. It is fairly consistent and solid, but not a single song truly blew me away. When I put the best songs on previous albums against this album's highlights, it underwhelms me quite a bit.
Maybe it will turn out to be a grower over the next months, though.
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Thomas MacLean's departure was announced roughly one month after the release of The Mountain. If the rumours are true, I expect an announcement in a similar timeframe.
In that situation, they needed to make the announcement before the shows started. In this situation, there’s not necessarily that element of time pressure because who knows when any live shows will happen.
But I do wish they would say something. It’s possible they have a replacement lined up and don’t want to make an announcement until after the legalities are taken care of. That is **IF** any of this speculation has any merit
Not really, because Thomas McLean was there for all the Mountain shows I saw. I’m fairly sure either his departure announcement came a lot later (way more than a month after the release, I can’t remember) or they did it early because it was a mutual decison and they needed the time to find a replacement.
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The Mountain came out in June and the announcement of Tom leaving was in September, so it was 3 months. And he did play a few more shows after that, so the announcement was before he actually left, which was in October.
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I believe The Mountain got released on 2 September 2013
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I believe The Mountain got released on 2 September 2013
Crap, you're right - it was announced in June, came out in September. So yeah Tom's departure was announced really quickly then. Forgot all about that.
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I guess The Mountain was released to you in June, being an insider ;)
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:lol Fair point, my timescales when it comes to Haken are somewhat confused.
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I am 100% in love with Messiah Complex and first now when I stopped spamming the album over and over do I realize how much I hate when an obvious single track (that isn't even that long) is split into tracks. This is horrible in any normal playlist.
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Psst, I can hook you up with some freeware software, that allows you to edit it together as a single track :coolio
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Messiah Complex isn't a single track, and I maintain works best as 5 separate tracks.
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Looks like Haken are on the Download 2021 bill, should know more about Deigo then :lol
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Psst, I can hook you up with some freeware software, that allows you to edit it together as a single track :coolio
If only Spotify allowed me to utilize that. I do use my own library from time to time but it's getting less often.
Messiah Complex isn't a single track, and I maintain works best as 5 separate tracks.
I don't know. I can see how it's individual tracks logically but I can't see me listening to any of them individually ;D SDOIT works in this way since every piece (except Overture maybe) are long enough and doesn't need to flow to the next piece to work. Here I would say they need each other to work. Every song is so unsatisfying if they just start and end without the other piece.
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Oh actually that brings me to HDtracks. Any difference with the album version there? Is it worth it?
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I can see how it's individual tracks logically but I can't see me listening to any of them individually ;D SDOIT works in this way since every piece (except Overture maybe) are long enough and doesn't need to flow to the next piece to work. Here I would say they need each other to work. Every song is so unsatisfying if they just start and end without the other piece.
I agree with this.
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Psst, I can hook you up with some freeware software, that allows you to edit it together as a single track :coolio
If only Spotify allowed me to utilize that. I do use my own library from time to time but it's getting less often.
You can add local files to Spotify, but only for listening on that device, so you couldn't sync it up to listen elsewhere.
Messiah Complex isn't a single track, and I maintain works best as 5 separate tracks.
I don't know. I can see how it's individual tracks logically but I can't see me listening to any of them individually ;D SDOIT works in this way since every piece (except Overture maybe) are long enough and doesn't need to flow to the next piece to work. Here I would say they need each other to work. Every song is so unsatisfying if they just start and end without the other piece.
I mean, I rarely listen to any songs individually anyway as I'm an album listener. I do occasionally just have a craving to check out an individual song, and indeed with Messiah Complex for example I've listened to A Glutton for Punishment & Marigold a couple of times without the other movements.
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I love how they handle guitar solos nowadays, sparsely but precise. There are just four of them on the album and they all rule.
Usually I listen to albums start to finish, but I jumped a few times to Ectobius Rex to digest that epic Peteucci solo. So I'm in the pro-split camp on this one.
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Usually I listen to albums start to finish, but I jumped a few times to Ectobius Rex to digest that epic Peteucci solo. So I'm in the pro-split camp on this one.
Oh, yeah? :biggrin:
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You can hear Petrucci in some of Haken’s lead. Sounds like a Richard Henshall solo, but he was obviously influenced by Petrucci indeed.
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Yeah that's one of Hen's, although it is more Petrucci-esque in style than the jazzier and/or more tapping approaches he often takes with his leads.
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The ‘jazz’-ish / tapping thing is of the later years though. Definitely a development of an own style, and great to witness.
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Honestly I think Virus is slowly becoming my second favorite Haken album (after The Mountain).
This is the correct opinion. :biggrin:
Close.
Mountain, Aquarius, and then Virus.
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When Haken does start back touring will they tour with Devon or be the headline with one or two other bands? I saw them in a small venue(exit-inn) in Nashville last year and was hoping they get to upgrade the next time around.
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When Haken does start back touring will they tour with Devon or be the headline with one or two other bands? I saw them in a small venue(exit-inn) in Nashville last year and was hoping they get to upgrade the next time around.
I don't think anythings been announced. The devin tour was half way over in the US and he's working on a concert DVD from a Europe show. I wouldn't be surprised if that tour doesn't get rescheduled. I kind of feel Haken need to do a headline or coheadline tour for this new album though. They should definitely do a Vector/Virus concert at some point too.
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theory: messiah complex is split into 5 parts to show that haken are becoming a 5-person band once diego leaves and only stars is technically part of messiah complex but tracked different to represent his departure :splodetard:
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When Haken does start back touring will they tour with Devon or be the headline with one or two other bands? I saw them in a small venue(exit-inn) in Nashville last year and was hoping they get to upgrade the next time around.
I don't think anythings been announced. The devin tour was half way over in the US and he's working on a concert DVD from a Europe show. I wouldn't be surprised if that tour doesn't get rescheduled. I kind of feel Haken need to do a headline or coheadline tour for this new album though. They should definitely do a Vector/Virus concert at some point too.
First tour will probably be Europe (at least that's what I'm hoping for). I would be surprised if we see US-band touring in Europa and vice-versa before may or june next year.
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Can we backtrack a bit? Who started these Diego rumours? And where did they start? Can someone provide a link?
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It started when the album was delayed without any reason provided and Diego abstained from any promotion.
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And then the ‘lack of keyboard’ fueled the idea that Diego may have been unhappy with the direction the band took on this album (or he wasn’t as much involved as he may have liked). Note that none of this has been verified.
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Such a great album. They really nailed it across the board. Complexity that is appealing. Tightness. Supreme sonic quality. Great solos. Inventive compositions. One of the best prog metal albums in recent years.
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LaserCD has re-stocked the 2CD digipack and mediabook, as well as the black vinyl
https://www.lasercd.com/search_results?f[0]=cp_artist1:3043
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After a few listens here's my two cents:
It's not a bad album.....music is really good. It's by far not my favorite Haken album though. I enjoy the old school Haken rather than this newer (last two album) 'metal' Haken. I like the prog more than this chunky 'jugga jugga' metal stuff.....but it sounds good. I just think there are a lot of bands out there that have that 'sound'.
Diego is buried in the mix....which leads one to speculate if that's what is going on? Is he mad about that? With this heavier sound I think it takes away from Ross's strengths and puts him in a position to where I don't feel like his voice 'fits' all the time. Never had that feeling before. And, I just don't 'get' Messiah Complex. It just rambles and has a couple moments of cool sounding music but for the most part....for me....it's a very forgettable song.
I'm sure I'll continue to spin it but as I said.....I prefer the sound of their earlier efforts over this heavier stuff.
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Re: the Diego scuttlebutt...
Didn’t he also post a different mix of one of the Vector songs and say something to the effect of “this is how it should have sounded”?
In addition...their ex-keyboardist Peter did some work on Virus, which gets people wondering why.
There’s just lots of “things that make you go hmmmmm” situations that are happening all at once. Any one of which could be dismissed...but when you take all these things as a whole, and then add in the fact that the rumor is widespread right now and the band being silent about the elephant in the room.... it’s just weird. But hey, maybe it’s nothing.
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fan theory: mike porntoy is leaving haken this year
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Just too much smoke to not be fire with Diego, either party could put it to silence by speaking about it, but neither had. Definitely a lawsuit regarding something likely money related IMO, maybe credits and royalties for his exit and hence the silence because you can't speak about these things or they get used against you in court. I'd imagine if there was a tour coming up, we'd hear something, but there's no rush to make a press release so it is what it is until something is settled and stated by the band.
It just really sucks when these things happen within a band, but sucks even more because I think Diego was a really large part of Haken's sound. However, with Virus, it seems the band can be just fine without him since I really enjoy the album.
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IDK...I’ve warmed up to the two albums when they are put together, but I honestly hope this was their “Train of Thought” and it’s out of their system.
For the record, I *ADORE* ToT for what it is. DT wanted to do “a classic metal album ala Puppets” and I believe they achieved exactly what they set out to do. I’m just glad they did not make it their new direction moving forward. I feel exactly the same way about V/V.
But I agree that Diego’s keyboards are a huge part of their core sound that I hope they don’t lose.
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I found Diego’s new gig. He is in a mental hospital in the Umbrella Academy.
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Reasons why the rumors exist:
1) Diego released an EP which Haken didn't promote
2) Diego removed Haken from all his social media bios
3) Diego hasn't been on any of Haken's livestreams
4) Diego has been really low in the mix for Virus
5) Diego released a new single with a caption "ever wonder what the first track of Vector would sound like if different choices were made?"
6) A few days later, said song mysteriously disappeared from all platforms.
7) Virus delays nor Diego rumours have not been spoken about by any official personnel, even after the album was released.
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I found Diego’s new gig. He is in a mental hospital in the Umbrella Academy.
I just started watching the umbrella Academy so this honestly made me LOL
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Reasons why the rumors exist:
1) Diego released an EP which Haken didn't promote
2) Diego removed Haken from all his social media bios
3) Diego hasn't been on any of Haken's livestreams
4) Diego has been really low in the mix for Virus
5) Diego released a new single with a caption "ever wonder what the first track of Vector would sound like if different choices were made?"
6) A few days later, said song mysteriously disappeared from all platforms.
7) Virus delays nor Diego rumours have not been spoken about by any official personnel, even after the album was released.
Reasons why Rumour exists:
1. Kyros - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tLfGKScPI0
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The Mountain has grown on me big time, I've been spamming the hell out of that album the last couple of days.
I really don't know what happened. Bit of a backstory, I got Visions back when it came out, based on DTF recommendations. I love Visions, I remember I heard it along side Circus Maximus Isolate for a good few month, British DT & Norwegian DT is what I called them back then. I was happy to finally have other bands that does the same exact thing -for my ears- DT is doing, after having been my sole progressive metal band for so long.
So I got The Mountain when it came out right away and was disappointed the band no longer sounded like DT. I gave it a few spins and it didn't click so I gave up on Haken. I remember what repelled me being mainly two things: the increase of vocal parts over instrumental wankery and the vocals doing a lot of overly cute things, like the barbershop quartet parts.
Last Friday, out of nowhere, l started singing to myself the "Lured by a treasure that was fit for fools" section and I couldn't for the life of me figure what band or song was that. Thankfully I remembered the lyrics mostly right so I googled it, dug the album out and somehow I'm in love with every track now, I even very much appreciate all the vocal work on this album.
I'm pretty excited cause I haven't been this hooked on new music in a long time and I know there's an EP and two or three more albums after this. But for now I'll keep milking this masterpiece.
I need to get that live DVD too, it's a shame they don't play the album in it's entirety on it but I'm pretty sure I'll enjoy the whole thing. Also a shame it's not on BR.
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The Mountain has grown on me big time, I've been spamming the hell out of that album the last couple of days.
I really don't know what happened. Bit of a backstory, I got Visions back when it came out, based on DTF recommendations. I love Visions, I remember I heard it along side Circus Maximus Isolate for a good few month, British DT & Norwegian DT is what I called them back then. I was happy to finally have other bands that does the same exact thing -for my ears- DT is doing, after having been my sole progressive metal band for so long.
So I got The Mountain when it came out right away and was disappointed the band no longer sounded like DT. I gave it a few spins and it didn't click so I gave up on Haken. I remember what repelled me being mainly two things: the increase of vocal parts over instrumental wankery and the vocals doing a lot of overly cute things, like the barbershop quartet parts.
Last Friday, out of nowhere, l started singing to myself the "Lured by a treasure that was fit for fools" section and I couldn't for the life of me figure what band or song was that. Thankfully I remembered the lyrics mostly right so I googled it, dug the album out and somehow I'm in love with every track now, I even very much appreciate all the vocal work on this album.
I'm pretty excited cause I haven't been this hooked on new music in a long time and I know there's an EP and two or three more albums after this. But for now I'll keep milking this masterpiece.
I need to get that live DVD too, it's a shame they don't play the album in it's entirety on it but I'm pretty sure I'll enjoy the whole thing. Also a shame it's not on BR.
As time goes by, The Mountain has become my #2 all time favorite album (behind Hemispheres) and given time, might even pull into a tie. But I doubt it. But wow....what an album. The albums overall theme of overcoming adversity was one of the most positive albums I had ever heard in my life and came out at a time when I was pretty much at my darkest point.
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Oh actually that brings me to HDtracks. Any difference with the album version there? Is it worth it?
A lot of the time, the HDTracks version of an album will be more dynamic than the CD/Spotify version. I don't know whether that applies to this album or not.
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As time goes by, The Mountain has become my #2 all time favorite album (behind Hemispheres) and given time, might even pull into a tie. But I doubt it. But wow....what an album. The albums overall theme of overcoming adversity was one of the most positive albums I had ever heard in my life and came out at a time when I was pretty much at my darkest point.
I may be mistaking you for someone else or maybe I misinterpreted something, so I apologize if so, but didn't you say Octavarium was your favorite album of all time?
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As time goes by, The Mountain has become my #2 all time favorite album (behind Hemispheres) and given time, might even pull into a tie. But I doubt it. But wow....what an album. The albums overall theme of overcoming adversity was one of the most positive albums I had ever heard in my life and came out at a time when I was pretty much at my darkest point.
I may be mistaking you for someone else or maybe I misinterpreted something, so I apologize if so, but didn't you say Octavarium was your favorite album of all time?
Octavarium is my favorite DT album of all time
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I just read on the internet that the Cockroach King wants to turn people into cockroaches, so that they can survive the unavoidable nuclear fallout.
The Haken cinematic universe is going places.
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After listening to Virus twenty times, Carousel has warmed up to me, but what a difference it would have made if there's more power and aggression to the vocals in the "Dead among the living..." section. Like Ray Alder or Awake era-Labri aggression.
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Funny, I was reading the lyrics to the Cockroach King from the booklet then came back to browse DTF a bit and I find these lyrics apply to the Spotify guy from a rising musician's perspective, like every bit applies! Except the Spotify guy hasn't been broken his crown yet heh
Pretty cool how open to interpretation these songs are, like initially I thought the song was a pretty clear metaphor on the capitalist dream, but now I just wanna have it be about the Spotify guy :lol
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I always thought, before this whole Vector/Virus thing, that Cockroach King was about drugs and drug dealers. The Cockroach ‘King’ being the kingpin. The illusion of richness beckons for young people that think dealing drugs is the way to go. The ‘King’ built his empire on guile and greed.
Does that make any sense?
I don’t know if the band ever stated what the song was about, but this was always my interpretation. Turning the cockroach king into an actual cockroach kind of makes me reconsider, but I still believe this may havebeen the initial idea behind the song.
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I always thought, before this whole Vector/Virus thing, that Cockroach King was about drugs and drug dealers. The Cockroach ‘King’ being the kingpin. The illusion of richness beckons for young people that think dealing drugs is the way to go. The ‘King’ built his empire on guile and greed.
Does that make any sense?
I don’t know if the band ever stated what the song was about, but this was always my interpretation. Turning the cockroach king into an actual cockroach kind of makes me reconsider, but I still believe this may havebeen the initial idea behind the song.
:lol Me and JamminDude just discussed this in the previous page.
Now they broadened the concept of The Cockroach King. It's about one that has a Messiah Complex, and feels like saving humanity is his will and the only solution 'The Good Doctor' sees is Extracting the DNA of a cockroach, the gene that gives a cockroach is invincibility, and splicing it with our Human DNA, his first experiment is patient 21.
On Virus, the cockroach and human DNA are now mixed, and is implanted in the human as a prosthetic. Many vitcims are now abound and soon rise against 'The Good Doctor'.
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Reasons why Rumour exists:
1. Kyros - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tLfGKScPI0
:clap: Well played, sir.
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I always thought, before this whole Vector/Virus thing, that Cockroach King was about drugs and drug dealers. The Cockroach ‘King’ being the kingpin. The illusion of richness beckons for young people that think dealing drugs is the way to go. The ‘King’ built his empire on guile and greed.
Does that make any sense?
I don’t know if the band ever stated what the song was about, but this was always my interpretation. Turning the cockroach king into an actual cockroach kind of makes me reconsider, but I still believe this may havebeen the initial idea behind the song.
:lol Me and JamminDude just discussed this in the previous page.
Now they broadened the concept of The Cockroach King. It's about one that has a Messiah Complex, and feels like saving humanity is his will and the only solution 'The Good Doctor' sees is Extracting the DNA of a cockroach, the gene that gives a cockroach is invincibility, and splicing it with our Human DNA, his first experiment is patient 21.
On Virus, the cockroach and human DNA are now mixed, and is implanted in the human as a prosthetic. Many vitcims are now abound and soon rise against 'The Good Doctor'.
Oh that is pretty damn lame :lol, thanks for the head up heh
I'll just pretend the Cockroach King is limited to it's The Mountain context. Are Vector and Virus concept albums? Or is it like the AA suite with one song per album? And do they specifically say Cockroach King in the songs you're citing?
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I think The Strain has the best Haken Chorus in a long time :metal come at me
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I always thought, before this whole Vector/Virus thing, that Cockroach King was about drugs and drug dealers. The Cockroach ‘King’ being the kingpin. The illusion of richness beckons for young people that think dealing drugs is the way to go. The ‘King’ built his empire on guile and greed.
Does that make any sense?
I don’t know if the band ever stated what the song was about, but this was always my interpretation. Turning the cockroach king into an actual cockroach kind of makes me reconsider, but I still believe this may havebeen the initial idea behind the song.
:lol Me and JamminDude just discussed this in the previous page.
Now they broadened the concept of The Cockroach King. It's about one that has a Messiah Complex, and feels like saving humanity is his will and the only solution 'The Good Doctor' sees is Extracting the DNA of a cockroach, the gene that gives a cockroach is invincibility, and splicing it with our Human DNA, his first experiment is patient 21.
On Virus, the cockroach and human DNA are now mixed, and is implanted in the human as a prosthetic. Many vitcims are now abound and soon rise against 'The Good Doctor'.
Oh that is pretty damn lame :lol, thanks for the head up heh
I'll just pretend the Cockroach King is limited to it's The Mountain context. Are Vector and Virus concept albums? Or is it like the AA suite with one song per album? And do they specifically say Cockroach King in the songs you're citing?
Everyone in this thread (and every Haken fan board in the world) is working out their own theories for what the actual story is.....but Vector and Virus are definitely parts 1 and 2 of a single concept that is related to The Cockroach King in some way.
That’s why I’m firm in my opinion that this should have been released as a double album instead of 2 albums 2 years apart. They work better together than separately.
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I always thought, before this whole Vector/Virus thing, that Cockroach King was about drugs and drug dealers. The Cockroach ‘King’ being the kingpin. The illusion of richness beckons for young people that think dealing drugs is the way to go. The ‘King’ built his empire on guile and greed.
Does that make any sense?
I don’t know if the band ever stated what the song was about, but this was always my interpretation. Turning the cockroach king into an actual cockroach kind of makes me reconsider, but I still believe this may havebeen the initial idea behind the song.
:lol Me and JamminDude just discussed this in the previous page.
Now they broadened the concept of The Cockroach King. It's about one that has a Messiah Complex, and feels like saving humanity is his will and the only solution 'The Good Doctor' sees is Extracting the DNA of a cockroach, the gene that gives a cockroach is invincibility, and splicing it with our Human DNA, his first experiment is patient 21.
On Virus, the cockroach and human DNA are now mixed, and is implanted in the human as a prosthetic. Many vitcims are now abound and soon rise against 'The Good Doctor'.
Oh that is pretty damn lame :lol, thanks for the head up heh
I'll just pretend the Cockroach King is limited to it's The Mountain context. Are Vector and Virus concept albums? Or is it like the AA suite with one song per album? And do they specifically say Cockroach King in the songs you're citing?
It still didn't change my view of the Cockroach King though, that song I still view as about Drug Dealers.
And, Take what I say as that, a fan theory. I still haven't digested both albums enough yet, i still don't have Virus yet, so I can see the artwork in the Liner Notes.
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Gotcha!
Gotta say guys, it's good to see you both posting consecutively so my lazy mind is finally reassured that you're two different guys heh
I should explain: at some point 5 or 6 years ago, watching jammindude's youtube videos, where he introduced himself as "Ben-Jammin", I started associating both accounts with the same person :lol
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I’ve been Ben “Jammin” since 1986...so I’m pretty sure I had it first, but I give him a pass.
:angel: :P :coolio :rollin
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I’ve been Ben “Jammin” since 1986...so I’m pretty sure I had it first, but I give him a pass.
:angel: :P :coolio :rollin
You get seniority, I get forum claim. 😁
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Such a great album. They really nailed it across the board. Complexity that is appealing. Tightness. Supreme sonic quality. Great solos. Inventive compositions. One of the best prog metal albums in recent years.
Never been a huge fan of Haken, admittedly, but I do agree with this.
I'd also add that the singer's voice finally feels like it fits the music.
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Same for me. Not a huge Haken fan but this albums really have become an entry to their sound. Maybe the other albums will start opening up somewhat now. Also agree with the singer. This fits better than what I heard previously.
Strangely it was the same with DT. I loved TOT initially and that's not my favourite album with them anymore (SDOIT :hat), but it worked as a entry to their sounds and discography. It was hard to understand DT initially, but the sound was so intriguing that I continued trying. SDOIT and SFAM took a long time to digest but being able to go back to TOT whenever I felt overwhelmed helped. I hope Virus / Vector will be the same for Haken.
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Next stop: Affinity.
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Haha I am playing Affinity right now. Good album. Can't see it becoming an all time favourite, but who knows, maybe something is hiding there. The growl in The Architect is the most off-putting thing I heard since Mike in A Nightmare to Remember. Really liked the song and then that happened, whyyyyyyyyyy?!?!
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What do you think of the retro feel of 1985?
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I used to find it a bit dated back when the album came out, but it grew on me. Nowadays, I kind of like how much it reminds me of Images and words.
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1985 is nice. I can see some similarities to I&W that I like. It's light, joyous and melodic which are all traits I think prog bands should use more often :lol
Affinity in general feels quite vibrant which I like. Usually that means the keyboards has great emphasis and are using sounds that changes the landscapes of the songs. Need to digest The Architect, Red Giant and Bound by Gravity a bit more to get a better overall feeling about the record.
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Re: Cockroach King
I was under the impression that the Cockroach King was purely a metaphor for capitalism in The Mountain (a concept album without a direct story, about dealing with success & the aftermath of it). It wasn't until Vector/Virus that they turned him into an actual character with a backstory. That's my understanding anyway.
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Re: Cockroach King
I was under the impression that the Cockroach King was purely a metaphor for capitalism in The Mountain (a concept album without a direct story, about dealing with success & the aftermath of it). It wasn't until Vector/Virus that they turned him into an actual character with a backstory. That's my understanding anyway.
I'm not sure about capitalism, or indeed about drugs - but it can definitely be interpreted to specific issues like those. But certainly it's about greed and ambition. And I've said a couple of times before, that's the case for Vector/Virus as well. It has a more fleshed out story, naturally, because it's a two-part concept album and not a single song, but it's similarly metaphorical/allegorical as the original song. Being more fleshed out as a story also means it touches on other themes as well.
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I always viewed it abstractly, but if I had to assign concrete meaning to it, I'd say it is a song about the temptation to stop investing time in prog dreams and turn into a full time cover band for weddings.
Y'know, to actually make money off of music.
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I feel like Virus is starting to grow on me a little bit, but I still can't say I'm loving it. It's got some fun qualities to it. MESSiah Complex is pretty good but definitely feels like a Shattered Fortress type mix-match to me. Which...isn't necessarily bad. ;) I'm a pretty big fan of jarring transitions in songs, hence why BTBAM is arguably my favorite band.
I think at the moment I still prefer Vector. Songs like Puzzle Box and Veil are better than anything on Virus, at least that's how I feel in this moment. That could change, though.
Didn't feel like going back through this whole thread. But is there anyone that considers Virus to be your favorite Haken album, despite it being so early? If so, I'd love to hear your thoughts about why.
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I see Coackroach King and Vector / Virus kinda like Metropolis Part 1 and Scenes From a Memory. The song is kinda abstract and the CDs a fun interpretation, or possible story, using that concept. Vector/ Virus is more literal even if there's room for interpretation.
In programming Coackroach King would be an interface (maybe abstract class) and Vector / Virus an implementation :\ .... ehrmmm.
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I always viewed it abstractly, but if I had to assign concrete meaning to it, I'd say it is a song about the temptation to stop investing time in prog dreams and turn into a full time cover band for weddings.
Y'know, to actually make money off of music.
:lol
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I was under the impression that the Cockroach King was purely a metaphor for capitalism in The Mountain
That was my impression on first listen as well. Chasing the capitalist dream and getting close enough to see the cruelness and merciless nature of it.
But then if you're a capitalist; you'd probably be able to see it as something else that fits your world view better and that's kinda the beauty of it all, being open to interpretations.
(a concept album without a direct story, about dealing with success & the aftermath of it).
I'm not sure if it's specific to Roger Waters, but he calls these "thematic". Like DSOTM, WYWH & Animals, unlike The Wall which does have an actual plot.
It feels like The Path gives us an overview of what the album is about, pretty clearly too IMO.
This life is a dream
A gift we receive
To live and to love
We forge The Path
Our nightmare in birth
Our struggle for worth
In vain we carry on
Our mission to become
Adapt to this world
It's a chance we must take
We'll sing our song
We'll play our hand
So, to me, this reads like all the topics the rest of the songs cover. Life is beautiful, we're meant to use it to give and receive love without being passive, but it's not that simple. There are immense challenges in the way of doing so, primarily; having to engage and adapt to the world without letting it drag us away from life's initial purpose (to give and receive love). So we try and give it our best shot, but there's also emphasis that luck plays a role.
Taking the time to go over the booklet a bunch of times over the last couple of days; I cannot help comparing this album to The Dark Side of The Moon, an album commonly described as being about "how everyday pressures of modern life can lead to madness", although I don't fully agree with that common assessment. Not the same exact theme as The Mountain, but as close as any other work would get to it, thematically that is.
And to stir the same emotions that DSOTM did to me, to even make your album comparable to DSOTM to me, is such a monumental fuckin achievement if I may say so. Fuckin bravo Haken.
I'm not sure about capitalism
But certainly it's about greed and ambition.
:neverusethis:
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I like the album, but after a couple of listens I have no idea what it's about :lol
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I like the album, but after a couple of listens I have no idea what it's about :lol
Me neither, and honestly, I don't care that much. It's not such a direct story ala SFAM to really follow along. I just enjoy the songs and some of the calls backs to other songs. That's not to say I'm against the story or anything, I just haven't really been too interesting to dig that deep since it's not that literal.
I'm starting to wonder if this is my album of the year. I can't get some of these melodies out of my head.
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I like the album, but after a couple of listens I have no idea what it's about :lol
Me neither, and honestly, I don't care that much. It's not such a direct story ala SFAM to really follow along. I just enjoy the songs and some of the calls backs to other songs. That's not to say I'm against the story or anything, I just haven't really been too interesting to dig that deep since it's not that literal.
I'm starting to wonder if this is my album of the year. I can't get some of these melodies out of my head.
I don't care about it either, although it is fun to analyze it.
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I like the album, but after a couple of listens I have no idea what it's about :lol
Me neither, and honestly, I don't care that much. It's not such a direct story ala SFAM to really follow along. I just enjoy the songs and some of the calls backs to other songs. That's not to say I'm against the story or anything, I just haven't really been too interesting to dig that deep since it's not that literal.
I'm starting to wonder if this is my album of the year. I can't get some of these melodies out of my head.
I don't care about it either, although it is fun to analyze it.
I also really suck at poetry and the like so interpreting words has never been a strong suite for me. I think it's fun to read other people's analysis though. I enjoy the discussion.
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That was quick!
Haken - Messiah Complex - 8-Bit NES-style remix
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiF_IDewUbE
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i figured it all out:
diego -is- the cockroach king!
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i figured it all out:
diego -is- the cockroach king!
B R A V O
O
S
S
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i figured it all out:
diego -is- the cockroach king!
Called it first:
Actually, it's all a trick. Diego is kicking everyone else out of Haken.
Plot twist: Diego is the Cockroach King.
:lol
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no it's kevin moore
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kevin moore is the good doctor, buddy, and diego was his pupil/protege
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Where does Mike Portnoy fit into this?
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Where does Mike Portnoy fit into this?
I literally was about to say this :lol
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Maybe he's the protagonist of Falling Back To Earth :neverusethis:
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Mike Portnoy is the nurse that cries "Calling Dr. Rex to Cell block two".
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Are the Visions & Aquarius reissues significantly better sounding? I just noticed they reissued them in 2017 and debating buying them, I think they sounded just fine before.
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Mixed bag. They are not real remixes, but very aggressive remasters that try to sound like remixes. The intentions are good, but it sounds very artificial at times.
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Are the Visions & Aquarius reissues significantly better sounding? I just noticed they reissued them in 2017 and debating buying them, I think they sounded just fine before.
No, sounding worse actually IMHO. (Aquarius: http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/list?artist=haken&album=aquarius) (Visions: http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/list?artist=haken&album=visions)
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Are the Visions & Aquarius reissues significantly better sounding? I just noticed they reissued them in 2017 and debating buying them, I think they sounded just fine before.
If you think they sound fine, why bother? I'm not a fan of remixes and remasters unless I really disliked the original, otherwise it just feels like a money grab.
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The loudness-war database entries don't do the remasters justice tough. The remasters are not just brickwalled as is often the case.
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Yeah, I like the remasters - there's a tiny bit more punch to them. But it's not a significant difference. The other treat is the instrumental versions. But if you're not interested in those and happy with how the originals sound, not sure how much you'd get out of the reissues (assuming you own the originals already).
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By the way, completely random but I was browsing through old parts of this thread to try and remind myself when Haken started getting to the stage of some fans not liking their new albums (the answer is essentially it happened a bit with The Mountain but really it started with Affinity - I guess Mountain was their breakthrough album that increased the size of their fanbase, so that's pretty natural), and I came across this gem:
You can't hate on a band's new album until their 6th album, AND they've been around for at least 10 years. That's the rock and roll rules.
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Are the Visions & Aquarius reissues significantly better sounding? I just noticed they reissued them in 2017 and debating buying them, I think they sounded just fine before.
If you think they sound fine, why bother? I'm not a fan of remixes and remasters unless I really disliked the original, otherwise it just feels like a money grab.
Well yeah I thought they sounded fine, but my line of thinking was if the band thought there were improvements to be made then there probably were.
I use to not mind the loudness problem with remasters cause they always sounded better in the car, but now that I've got no CD player in the car that could be an issue, they'd wear me out pretty fast in the ear buds.
The instrumental versions alone are worth it in my book, I'm a sing-along-while-doing-house-chores kinda guy and the kids are pretty sick of hearing me sing Dramatic Turn & D/T instrumental tracks over and over :lol
I'll probably wait on these two until I'm through with the albums that came after The Mountain. It's pretty cool having a whole bunch of music -that I'm excited about- ahead of me to explore, it only happens about once or twice per decade for me heh
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I like the Visions remaster because I can finally hear the snare.
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The original version of Aquarius was out of print. I couldn't get a copy until the reissue came out, so on that front the reissue was welcome.
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The original version of Aquarius was out of print. I couldn't get a copy until the reissue came out, so on that front the reissue was welcome.
Yeah it was the same for me too. I couldn't get a hold of the original versions of both Aquarius and Visions, so when the reissues were available I got those instead. And they sound great to me.
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Been listening to Virus a lot lately and I love it. Definitely better than Vector and AOTY contender. Only thing I'm not fan of is production. Maybe it's just me but sounds less "organic" than older albums...
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I just finished listening to Virus (yes, I know it took me a while) and I'm liking it a lot. Much better than Vector, which I haven't revisited since the first couple of times I listened to it. At this point I feel like they are doing one wacky album followed by a more focused and straightforward one.
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Only thing I'm not fan of is production. Maybe it's just me but sounds less "organic" than older albums...
Interesting, personally I really like it (more so than Vector) but it's very... full. So I can definitely see why others wouldn't like it so much, indeed I think it's part of why it took me a few listens to properly get into the album.
I just finished listening to Virus (yes, I know it took me a while) and I'm liking it a lot. Much better than Vector, which I haven't revisited since the first couple of times I listened to it. At this point I feel like they are doing one wacky album followed by a more focused and straightforward one.
Really glad to hear you're liking it Diego, I know you weren't as keen on the last couple!
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Only thing I'm not fan of is production. Maybe it's just me but sounds less "organic" than older albums...
Interesting, personally I really like it (more so than Vector) but it's very... full. So I can definitely see why others wouldn't like it so much, indeed I think it's part of why it took me a few listens to properly get into the album.
I just finished listening to Virus (yes, I know it took me a while) and I'm liking it a lot. Much better than Vector, which I haven't revisited since the first couple of times I listened to it. At this point I feel like they are doing one wacky album followed by a more focused and straightforward one.
Really glad to hear you're liking it Diego, I know you weren't as keen on the last couple!
I agree about it being dense (for lack of a better word) but I think it's less dense than Vector (in some places in the music anyway)
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Only thing I'm not fan of is production. Maybe it's just me but sounds less "organic" than older albums...
Interesting, personally I really like it (more so than Vector) but it's very... full. So I can definitely see why others wouldn't like it so much, indeed I think it's part of why it took me a few listens to properly get into the album.
I just finished listening to Virus (yes, I know it took me a while) and I'm liking it a lot. Much better than Vector, which I haven't revisited since the first couple of times I listened to it. At this point I feel like they are doing one wacky album followed by a more focused and straightforward one.
Really glad to hear you're liking it Diego, I know you weren't as keen on the last couple!
I agree about it being dense (for lack of a better word) but I think it's less dense than Vector (in some places in the music anyway)
The mastering is a bit less loud/brickwalled than Vector, which I think definitely helps.
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Ah yes, that's true.
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Vector/Virus has the same effect as Between The Buried And Me's Automata 1/2.
When I listen to these albums, they sound incomplete without the other disc. So, I end up listening to both as one album.
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Vector/Virus has the same effect as Between The Buried And Me's Automata 1/2.
When I listen to these albums, they sound incomplete without the other disc. So, I end up listening to both as one album.
Great comparison. I agree. And again, those are albums that were released closer together than V/V were.
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I just finished listening to Virus (yes, I know it took me a while) and I'm liking it a lot. Much better than Vector, which I haven't revisited since the first couple of times I listened to it. At this point I feel like they are doing one wacky album followed by a more focused and straightforward one.
Really glad to hear you're liking it Diego, I know you weren't as keen on the last couple!
I quite loved Affinity. In fact, it is my favorite Haken album. The Mountain not so much. That's why I think it's one hit, one miss for me. When they focus on melody and flow they can do amazing things.
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I just finished listening to Virus (yes, I know it took me a while) and I'm liking it a lot. Much better than Vector, which I haven't revisited since the first couple of times I listened to it. At this point I feel like they are doing one wacky album followed by a more focused and straightforward one.
Really glad to hear you're liking it Diego, I know you weren't as keen on the last couple!
I quite loved Affinity. In fact, it is my favorite Haken album. The Mountain not so much. That's why I think it's one hit, one miss for me. When they focus on melody and flow they can do amazing things.
Ah yes, must have been The Mountain I was thinking of. Either way, glad you like it. :D
Vector/Virus has the same effect as Between The Buried And Me's Automata 1/2.
When I listen to these albums, they sound incomplete without the other disc. So, I end up listening to both as one album.
Great comparison. I agree. And again, those are albums that were released closer together than V/V were.
I sort of see it, although the difference is that Automata was all written and recorded together as a single work. In fact I've only ever heard Automata as a single album (EDIT: I promise it's only Haken (+ some side projects) and BTBAM that I've had any privileged access to music from! :lol).
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Ariich give me the run-down on the demos Devin Townsend is currently working on. I KNOW YOU'VE HEARD THEM
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Ariich give me the run-down on the demos Devin Townsend is currently working on. I KNOW YOU'VE HEARD THEM
They're ok I guess.
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@ariich
Ya, but as I’ve stated, with the way that the two albums flow together it was almost a mistake that they didn’t do it that way. Now that both albums are out, I really can appreciate both of them far more. But waiting two years for the other half would’ve been like if BTBAM had just released Automata 1 as just “Automata”, then toured for it, and then two years later recorded and released “Automatic” (or some such).
Fans were already complaining that they split the concept in two. Can you imagine the bitching that would’ve taken place if there was no hint that a part two was in the works? The shortness of the album, the sudden ending etc etc...all complaints would have been amplified by the delayed timeline and information.
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@ariich
Ya, but as I’ve stated, with the way that the two albums flow together it was almost a mistake that they didn’t do it that way. Now that both albums are out, I really can appreciate both of them far more. But waiting two years for the other half would’ve been like if BTBAM had just released Automata 1 as just “Automata”, then toured for it, and then two years later recorded and released “Automatic” (or some such).
Fans were already complaining that they split the concept in two. Can you imagine the bitching that would’ve taken place if there was no hint that a part two was in the works? The shortness of the album, the sudden ending etc etc...all complaints would have been amplified by the delayed timeline and information.
Oh yeah for sure, I agree that the albums work best in combination, and while I don't think they should have held off and released both together, I totally get why you'd feel that way.
I only mean to highlight the different scenarios. In BTBAM's case, they recorded a single album that had two distinct halves but was very much one work. I'm not actually sure what the rationale was for splitting the releases but for whatever reason that's what they did, which is why part II came out fairly quickly. There'd have been no reason to hold it back for two years.
Whereas Vector was written as a standalone complete album, with the intention to do a sequel but nothing actually written. So again holding back a finished album for a year or two would have been quite weird really.
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The Messiah Complex versus Veil - I like Veil much better. To me The Messiah Complex is a hot mess and also love the keyboards in Veil.
On the new album, I love Invasion and Canary Yellow.
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Veil is great. The abrupt transition in the middle sucks but that's the only problem it has.
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Veil and Messiah Complex aren't really anything like each other so it doesn't really make sense to compare them. A more meaningful comparison is between Veil and Carousel as they have much more in common. On balance I marginally prefer Carousel.
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Messiah Complex actually reminds me a bit of Devin Townsend's Singularity, an epic song broken up into 5/6 parts with each part not really flowing into the other, lots of really complex music, and kind of what some might describe as "a hot mess" but the difference is I see Messiah Complex as a significantly more interesting and well put together song, maybe because of the elements from other songs in it, and a reprise of the chorus from ivory tower in ectobius rex that kind of makes it feel more complete and makes it feel nothing like "a hot mess" where as I have still yet to find enjoyment from Singularity as a whole.
I had rated Veil as my favorite from Vector, but I think it's possisble Messiah Complex, Carousel, and The Strain are all better than it. Which I guess just shows that I enjoy Virus much more than Vector.
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I finally found a way to enjoy Virus. I stop at Canary Yellow.
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Had a few more listens and a run through the earlier albums. Good news is I prefer listening to Virus over the nostalgia, so they’re not slowing down yet. Some thoughts:
-Works so well with Vector they’re indistinguishable from a double album, MC benefits the most as it’s too epic for ending a single album, and has many V callbacks
-from both albums Canary Yellow may be my favorite, then Carousel, then all of Vector, then rest of Virus
-think Only Stars should have been fleshed out a la Somebody and Bound by Gravity, or worked into the ending epic like CE or Visions... first ending track I think they got wrong and my first automatic skip of theirs - song is fine but doesn’t fit at all
-On par overall with Aquarius, Visions, Vector... the Mountain and Affinity are both next level
-no reason to think next album won’t have a different sound, they seem to get what they set out to do and we knew these would be heavier
-That said, I’m going to miss Diego
-I take the concept metaphorically, Vector is how one becomes a slave of their own ambition, Virus is how that ambition plays out... CK would work as an overture, interlude, or coda
-MC works as separate tracks as they are clearly parts with some effort put into their transitions (But nothing as cool as the strain to canary yellow, gonna miss Diego)
-“with your cartoon arms”
-I appreciate everything they put into these, the composition and nuggetz, whatever my reaction to the music my takeaway is these guys put in 200% which completely enhances the experience
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The separation of MC into tracks is to maximize streaming revenue, right? If Spotify was big then, Visions and Aquarius may have been broken down also.
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I'm getting the impression I'm lucky that I get to hear both Vector and Virus together for the first time.
Anybody know who produced The Mountain? It doesn't say in the booklet, Wikipedia, nor InsideOut page for the album, it seems like that should mean it's self produced but it doesn't specifically say that anywhere.
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The separation of MC into tracks is to maximize streaming revenue, right? If Spotify was big then, Visions and Aquarius may have been broken down also.
Not to my knowledge. It's possible that was a factor I suppose but I've never heard anything about that.
I'm getting the impression I'm lucky that I get to hear both Vector and Virus together for the first time.
Anybody know who produced The Mountain? It doesn't say in the booklet, Wikipedia, nor InsideOut page for the album, it seems like that should mean it's self produced but it doesn't specifically say that anywhere.
Jens Bogren produced The Mountain, Restoration and Affinity.
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Mixed bag. They are not real remixes, but very aggressive remasters that try to sound like remixes. The intentions are good, but it sounds very artificial at times.
I think they are remixed actually, because there were a couple very subtle changes that could only be done by removing parts of certain tracks. In the song Aquarium, right before the second chorus (Freak of nature, pay to see her..) there's a piano lead-in that originally had a drum fill into the chorus, but the 2017 release gets rid of that drum fill. Likewise, in Insomnia, during the "video-game" break down, there's a bass synth part that's no longer there in the 2017 version.
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Had a few more listens and a run through the earlier albums. Good news is I prefer listening to Virus over the nostalgia, so they’re not slowing down yet. Some thoughts:
-Works so well with Vector they’re indistinguishable from a double album, MC benefits the most as it’s too epic for ending a single album, and has many V callbacks
-from both albums Canary Yellow may be my favorite, then Carousel, then all of Vector, then rest of Virus
-think Only Stars should have been fleshed out a la Somebody and Bound by Gravity, or worked into the ending epic like CE or Visions... first ending track I think they got wrong and my first automatic skip of theirs - song is fine but doesn’t fit at all
-On par overall with Aquarius, Visions, Vector... the Mountain and Affinity are both next level
-no reason to think next album won’t have a different sound, they seem to get what they set out to do and we knew these would be heavier
-That said, I’m going to miss Diego
-I take the concept metaphorically, Vector is how one becomes a slave of their own ambition, Virus is how that ambition plays out... CK would work as an overture, interlude, or coda
-MC works as separate tracks as they are clearly parts with some effort put into their transitions (But nothing as cool as the strain to canary yellow, gonna miss Diego)
-“with your cartoon arms”
-I appreciate everything they put into these, the composition and nuggetz, whatever my reaction to the music my takeaway is these guys put in 200% which completely enhances the experience
Did I miss something or do you know something about the rumors we don't?
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Mixed bag. They are not real remixes, but very aggressive remasters that try to sound like remixes. The intentions are good, but it sounds very artificial at times.
I think they are remixed actually, because there were a couple very subtle changes that could only be done by removing parts of certain tracks. In the song Aquarium, right before the second chorus (Freak of nature, pay to see her..) there's a piano lead-in that originally had a drum fill into the chorus, but the 2017 release gets rid of that drum fill. Likewise, in Insomnia, during the "video-game" break down, there's a bass synth part that's no longer there in the 2017 version.
That's unfortunate, because It bothers me a bit when bands do that. Unless, they specifically state they hated the mix or didn't like that sound in there, but had no control over it, until now.
I haven't heard the originals as I can't find them. Only recently able to find Aquarius, still haven't bought it though. I did buy visions and it's the remaster.
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Had a few more listens and a run through the earlier albums. Good news is I prefer listening to Virus over the nostalgia, so they’re not slowing down yet. Some thoughts:
-Works so well with Vector they’re indistinguishable from a double album, MC benefits the most as it’s too epic for ending a single album, and has many V callbacks
-from both albums Canary Yellow may be my favorite, then Carousel, then all of Vector, then rest of Virus
-think Only Stars should have been fleshed out a la Somebody and Bound by Gravity, or worked into the ending epic like CE or Visions... first ending track I think they got wrong and my first automatic skip of theirs - song is fine but doesn’t fit at all
-On par overall with Aquarius, Visions, Vector... the Mountain and Affinity are both next level
-no reason to think next album won’t have a different sound, they seem to get what they set out to do and we knew these would be heavier
-That said, I’m going to miss Diego
-I take the concept metaphorically, Vector is how one becomes a slave of their own ambition, Virus is how that ambition plays out... CK would work as an overture, interlude, or coda
-MC works as separate tracks as they are clearly parts with some effort put into their transitions (But nothing as cool as the strain to canary yellow, gonna miss Diego)
-“with your cartoon arms”
-I appreciate everything they put into these, the composition and nuggetz, whatever my reaction to the music my takeaway is these guys put in 200% which completely enhances the experience
Did I miss something or do you know something about the rumors we don't?
I feel it's a rather safe assumption at this point. And I'm sure that's all that comment was. As someone mentioned in this thread earlier, it would be more surprising if he was still in the band at this point than out.
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The separation of MC into tracks is to maximize streaming revenue, right? If Spotify was big then, Visions and Aquarius may have been broken down also.
The separation of "short" epics into individual tracks predates the streaming era by some time. Spock's Beard did it on most of their epics from 1999.
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It's probably because it doesn't make sense as a full tack and is more like a suite of tracks that belong together than a 'real' single epic.
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It's probably because it doesn't make sense as a full tack and is more like a suite of tracks that belong together than a 'real' single epic.
Haken truly is Dream Theater now that they have their 6DOIT for fans to eternally debate over whether it's a song or a suite. :lol
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It's probably because it doesn't make sense as a full tack and is more like a suite of tracks that belong together than a 'real' single epic.
I don't mind it being broken up, but after more listens, I kind of feels like it would be fine as a single track. It almost feels like Marigold isn't broken up properly either, like the cut should make that song much shorter and Glutton longer, but then it would be weird.
It's probably because it doesn't make sense as a full tack and is more like a suite of tracks that belong together than a 'real' single epic.
Haken truly is Dream Theater now that they have their 6DOIT for fans to eternally debate over whether it's a song or a suite. :lol
They will truly accomplish this if they release a live version of MC as one track :lol
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The cut between Glutton and Marigold is fine the way it is.
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@ariich
Ya, but as I’ve stated, with the way that the two albums flow together it was almost a mistake that they didn’t do it that way. Now that both albums are out, I really can appreciate both of them far more. But waiting two years for the other half would’ve been like if BTBAM had just released Automata 1 as just “Automata”, then toured for it, and then two years later recorded and released “Automatic” (or some such).
Fans were already complaining that they split the concept in two. Can you imagine the bitching that would’ve taken place if there was no hint that a part two was in the works? The shortness of the album, the sudden ending etc etc...all complaints would have been amplified by the delayed timeline and information.
Oh yeah for sure, I agree that the albums work best in combination, and while I don't think they should have held off and released both together, I totally get why you'd feel that way.
I only mean to highlight the different scenarios. In BTBAM's case, they recorded a single album that had two distinct halves but was very much one work. I'm not actually sure what the rationale was for splitting the releases but for whatever reason that's what they did, which is why part II came out fairly quickly. There'd have been no reason to hold it back for two years.
Whereas Vector was written as a standalone complete album, with the intention to do a sequel but nothing actually written. So again holding back a finished album for a year or two would have been quite weird really.
In BTBAM's case If I remember correctly, they switched to a new record label and if was their wish to separate the two releases.
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It's probably because it doesn't make sense as a full tack and is more like a suite of tracks that belong together than a 'real' single epic.
Haken truly is Dream Theater now that they have their 6DOIT for fans to eternally debate over whether it's a song or a suite. :lol
True. :lol
Although as I've been saying since the tracklist was first revealed, it's structurally most similar to The Healing Colours of Sound by Spock's Beard. I wonder if SB fans ever had similar arguments, particularly as they'd had a number of >15 minute epics by that point as well.
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Welp. I actually like Virus now :lol
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It's probably because it doesn't make sense as a full tack and is more like a suite of tracks that belong together than a 'real' single epic.
Haken truly is Dream Theater now that they have their 6DOIT for fans to eternally debate over whether it's a song or a suite. :lol
I haven't heard what you guys are talking about yet, but that's such an ominous reference, I do not look forward to that shit if it's comparable to the 6DOIT situation :lol
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Had a few more listens and a run through the earlier albums. Good news is I prefer listening to Virus over the nostalgia, so they’re not slowing down yet. Some thoughts:
-Works so well with Vector they’re indistinguishable from a double album, MC benefits the most as it’s too epic for ending a single album, and has many V callbacks
-from both albums Canary Yellow may be my favorite, then Carousel, then all of Vector, then rest of Virus
-think Only Stars should have been fleshed out a la Somebody and Bound by Gravity, or worked into the ending epic like CE or Visions... first ending track I think they got wrong and my first automatic skip of theirs - song is fine but doesn’t fit at all
-On par overall with Aquarius, Visions, Vector... the Mountain and Affinity are both next level
-no reason to think next album won’t have a different sound, they seem to get what they set out to do and we knew these would be heavier
-That said, I’m going to miss Diego
-I take the concept metaphorically, Vector is how one becomes a slave of their own ambition, Virus is how that ambition plays out... CK would work as an overture, interlude, or coda
-MC works as separate tracks as they are clearly parts with some effort put into their transitions (But nothing as cool as the strain to canary yellow, gonna miss Diego)
-“with your cartoon arms”
-I appreciate everything they put into these, the composition and nuggetz, whatever my reaction to the music my takeaway is these guys put in 200% which completely enhances the experience
Did I miss something or do you know something about the rumors we don't?
I feel it's a rather safe assumption at this point. And I'm sure that's all that comment was. As someone mentioned in this thread earlier, it would be more surprising if he was still in the band at this point than out.
Yes just reading the tea leaves. Also didn’t realize Until this thread that the same person produced the mountain/restoration/affinity and none of the others. That guy is awesome - these are a level above the others (which are all good listens)
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I'm getting the impression I'm lucky that I get to hear both Vector and Virus together for the first time.
Anybody know who produced The Mountain? It doesn't say in the booklet, Wikipedia, nor InsideOut page for the album, it seems like that should mean it's self produced but it doesn't specifically say that anywhere.
Jens Bogren produced The Mountain, Restoration and Affinity.
Thanks! Booklet says Mixed & Mastered by Jens Bogren, same as Wikipedia.
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It's probably because it doesn't make sense as a full tack and is more like a suite of tracks that belong together than a 'real' single epic.
Haken truly is Dream Theater now that they have their 6DOIT for fans to eternally debate over whether it's a song or a suite. :lol
True. :lol
Although as I've been saying since the tracklist was first revealed, it's structurally most similar to The Healing Colours of Sound by Spock's Beard. I wonder if SB fans ever had similar arguments, particularly as they'd had a number of >15 minute epics by that point as well.
Neal did the opposite with "So Many Roads" for the Morsefest 2017 official release, and indexed the song into its 6 separate movements. But then he also released "A Whole Nother Trip" as 1 track on Morsefest 2015, when it originally was 4 tracks on his debut album. Similarly, "The Healing Colors Of Sound" was 1 track on Don't Try This At Home, as well as the obvious "Whirlwind" being 1 track on both live albums from the Whrild Tour.
I'm sure Haken would release MC as 1 track on whatever eventual live album they will release in like 2025.
-Marc.
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I joined the tracks as one when I ripped it into my computer because I wanted the symmetry of both Vector and Virus having seven songs each. :lol
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Personally I don't think Messiah Complex really works as separate tracks. It helps to make the structure easier to understand, but I couldn't imagine listening to any of the movements individually. The transitions are too sudden for that imo, which separates it from something like SDOIT or The Whirlwind.
I joined the tracks as one when I ripped it into my computer because I wanted the symmetry of both Vector and Virus having seven songs each. :lol
also this :lol
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Hehe the suite vs single track has a wonderful gray zone that is so hard to define. I am not even sure I can clearly explain why MC doesn't work as individual songs for me more than it feels wrong and I don't see any point in listening to them individually. SDOIT also works best as the full thing but the individual tracks work as well. Solitary Shell is wonderful as just a single track etc.
I don't think they split it because of streaming but that is an interesting thought. Octavarium and similar tracks must be awful on Spotify from revenue pov. I remember Ayreon TTOE was available as a few single track clocking in at around 20 minutes each. Now they are split (as the CD actually). A bit off topic but shouldn't Spotify count the amount of time (let's say to make it easier they say 4 minutes is a single count) instead of number of times?
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It's not hard to define for me.
If it transitions into the next track, I'll usually join them together. If, they can work on it's own without needing the before or after track, then I won't join, unless it's a live album then I'll join them because it's live.
A good example is Between The Buried and Me, Sun of Nothing transitions into Ants of The Sky with any pause or notice of transition. Yet, I keep them separate on the CD rip because I don't want to listen to Sun of Nothing to get to Ants of The Sky. On the live CD rip I have them both joined, because it's live and its weird cutting tracks the flow together live.
I also join tracks because I listen to my music on Shuffle and add a Crossfade of 8 seconds. The tracks flow smoothly into one another sometimes and it's how I find transitions that work pretty well, and how I discovered some songs share the same riff. Like Between The Buried and Me, the end of Turn on The Darkness is nearly identical to Opeth Voice of Treason.
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A good example is Between The Buried and Me, Sun of Nothing transitions into Ants of The Sky with any pause or notice of transition. Yet, I keep them separate on the CD rip because I don't want to listen to Sun of Nothing to get to Ants of The Sky.
Might be the best transition between songs ever. :metal
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Welp. I actually like Virus now :lol
Success!
I'm getting the impression I'm lucky that I get to hear both Vector and Virus together for the first time.
Anybody know who produced The Mountain? It doesn't say in the booklet, Wikipedia, nor InsideOut page for the album, it seems like that should mean it's self produced but it doesn't specifically say that anywhere.
Jens Bogren produced The Mountain, Restoration and Affinity.
Thanks! Booklet says Mixed & Mastered by Jens Bogren, same as Wikipedia.
Yeah I mean in terms of the overall process of production, the band takes responsibility in terms of decision-making etc. but they need outside producers for their technical skills, advice, etc. So Bogren did mixing and mastering on those three albums. On Vector and Virus, Nolly did mixing and drum recording/engineering, but someone else did mastering. So it depends what you mean by production really, in one sense Haken have always been self-produced.
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Must.
Stop.
Listening.
I'm going to burn the album out. But I can't stop!
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Must.
Stop.
Listening.
I'm going to burn the album out. But I can't stop!
I'd say the same, except I still find new nuggets to enjoy after every listen. This is how I know it's a great prog album, the depth of the music leads to new discoveries even after so many listens. I think this is currently my album of the year and each listen it gets better. Like, I'd say Invasion was one of my least favorite songs, but I'm enjoying it so much more now than I ever did before.
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The rhythms in this blow my mind. It would be crazy difficult to play.
And yes, lots of new goodies every spin!
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Pretty sure this is going to be my favorite album from this band. I'm only a casual fan, though. I find they tend to do quite a bit of complexity that doesn't really seem to do anything other than just being a complex phrase or riff. I may need more listens to sort it out, but like a lot of their stuff when I finish listening to it, I can't really remember many of the melodies.
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I'm getting the impression I'm lucky that I get to hear both Vector and Virus together for the first time.
Anybody know who produced The Mountain? It doesn't say in the booklet, Wikipedia, nor InsideOut page for the album, it seems like that should mean it's self produced but it doesn't specifically say that anywhere.
Jens Bogren produced The Mountain, Restoration and Affinity.
Thanks! Booklet says Mixed & Mastered by Jens Bogren, same as Wikipedia.
Yeah I mean in terms of the overall process of production, the band takes responsibility in terms of decision-making etc. but they need outside producers for their technical skills, advice, etc. So Bogren did mixing and mastering on those three albums. On Vector and Virus, Nolly did mixing and drum recording/engineering, but someone else did mastering. So it depends what you mean by production really, in one sense Haken have always been self-produced.
Oh I see what you mean. Cause my perception of the producer is the guy that says things like "That riff doesn't work there", "This song doesn't need a third verse", "That solo is not that great, you can do better", "bass needs to be louder here", "That last chorus needs to sound different", etc.
In addition to bossing around a talented sound engineer for the technical aspects that he's already mastered.
So it makes sense that don't credit as Jens Bogren "producer", yet he may have helped so much with the overall sound that they didn't wanna just take all the credit by writing "Produced by Haken".
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Production means like three completely different things depending on the context, which is kinda bullshit. :lol
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Already feeling a bit of fatigue starting to get the upper hand of the album. Hopefully it will change but maybe this isn't a "stand the test of time" album for me. Was hoping for some of the songs to get better with each spin but sadly doesn't get much of that right now. I think it's the lack of really strong melodies that is my main issue. For me MC is the song with the best and most memorable sections and melodies weirdly. The other songs mainly has crazy instrumentation but that needs to be combined with equally strong melodies imo.
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I think this album has some of Hakens most memorable melodies. I have a hard time getting the ivory tower melody, the strain chorus, and the intro chorus of carousel out of my head.
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I really like Carousel a lot. Still some mixed feelings about the Messiah Complex suite. Overall, the album is growing on me.
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Mixed bag. They are not real remixes, but very aggressive remasters that try to sound like remixes. The intentions are good, but it sounds very artificial at times.
I think they are remixed actually, because there were a couple very subtle changes that could only be done by removing parts of certain tracks. In the song Aquarium, right before the second chorus (Freak of nature, pay to see her..) there's a piano lead-in that originally had a drum fill into the chorus, but the 2017 release gets rid of that drum fill. Likewise, in Insomnia, during the "video-game" break down, there's a bass synth part that's no longer there in the 2017 version.
That is very interesting. I don't think I've heard the original release more than a couple of times before I got the re-issue, so I've never had a chance to A/B the two versions.
I just recently got the 2017 re-release of Visions (despite actually already owning the original release), and now I am wondering if the 2017 version of Visions has any changes compared to the original (outside of general remastering). Does anyone know what they may have changed on Visions?
-Marc.
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Well I've given in at least 10 spins, so I'm getting a good grasp on where this album sits with me so far. It's growing on me the way all of their non-Vector albums have, which is that I have to take a few listens to get used to the weird-ness of it. Vector I found was a bit predictable as far as the Haken sound goes. It was still a great album, but it didn't take very long for me to 'get' it like the rest of their discography. Not a bad or good thing necessarily, just an observation I had.
Prosthetic I think is one of their most unique singles and opening songs. They haven't really done such a thrashy, riffy song like this much, certainly not as one of their singles, and most of their opening tracks are more theatrical, or use an intro of some kind. Only other album to not have an intro track is Aquarius (as well as the Restoration EP). I guess that makes sense if you consider that it's a continuation of the last album, and in that context, it works as an "ACT II Opener" if you will, but in general it's probably their weakest album opening. Still a great track, but probably my least favourite from the album.
After saying what I said about Prosthetic being a unique Haken single, I realized that all the singles from this album were pretty particular. Invasion wouldn't be anywhere near my first guess as to what would be a single from Virus having heard the whole album now. Especially since it's probably one of my favourite songs from Virus. I love how they used the really low, djenty guitar sound, without actually making the song absurdly heavy. (I guess that's something they're known for a little bit by this point though). The lyrics really catch me too, especially "Losing our sense of direction has led us to where we all need to be". The video was really awesome too.
I'm not entirely sold on Carousel yet, but it's growing fast on me, especially a few parts like the jazzy bridge and the end of the final chorus. That jazzy bridge reminds me of the electronic sections with choppy rhythms they would include in songs like The Architect and Because it's There (or the entirety of Red Giant), but without any actual electronic sounds. That was a cool progression of their sound. In terms of other similar-ish songs in their discography, I probably like Veil and the two long songs from The Mountain quite a bit more, but I'll see if that changes at all as I digest it more.
I'm not sure why The Strain was not a single, but it kicks so much ass. Also one of my favourites. Haken has a knack for really powerful and memorable vocal melodies, and this is easily among their best. There's this really cool lead guitar line during the main riff that I really love. Also damn, the vocals in the bridge section are SO good, and once again Haken loves showing off their fusiony chord progressions.
Canary Yellow kind of makes sense as a single since it's more on the accessible and simple side, but it's not the type of sound I would expect Haken to use in a single. Nevertheless, also a really great song. It reminds me of a weird mix of Earthlings, Red Giant, and Host. The lyrics are really good here too.
Ok... now Messiah Complex. Honestly I was a little bit baffled the first few times through this suite, but it grew on me, and all the sections it goes through feels more unified to me. I love all the references it makes, and even though I knew a more blatant Cockroach King reference was gonna happen, as soon as I heard the background vocals in The Sect, I still almost leapt up in the air with pure joy. And then Ectobius Rex.... GOD DAMN! What a dirty, chonky riff that is. It's so great. And then it closes up with the chorus from Ivory Tower and the bridge riff from Prosthetic. What a fantastic climax to this album honestly.
I'm a lot higher on Only Stars than a lot of people are. I like that they made a true, short outro song in the vein of a lot of their intro tracks. They've usually ended with a long, epic song, or at least a regular, fitting closing song. It was a neat little companion to Clear and to me it's just as beautiful and pristine as The Path or As Death Embraces. I think it improves the album a lot. Ending with Ectobius Rex, although climactic, doesn't really give a proper conclusion since it just kinda drops off from a heavy chunky riff.
As far as what I think overall, I think this is probably somewhere in the middle for now, maybe a bit on the stronger side. That's not saying much, since I feel their entire discography is really brilliant, and the level of quality between them all is pretty close. In fact, they're so close that I can't decide between a couple pairs of albums as to which one I like more. I think I'd go like this right now:
1) The Mountain
2) Affinity / Visions (tie)
3) Virus
4) Vector / Restoration (tie)
5) Aquarius
Virus could very well get higher on the list as I listen more. Visions was one of my favourite concept albums since I got into prog music (I got into Haken right as Visions came out and that's when I ventured into the world of prog past Dream Theater and Pink Floyd), so it's a tough act to beat, and Affinity was probably the biggest sound change Haken has done so far, and is a beautiful masterpiece. Sometimes I feel like it's better than The Mountain, it really depends on my current mood and if I've listened to either recently. :lol It's so cool when I've listened to an album many, many times, and then after a while, after not listening to it for maybe over a year or longer, coming back to it and rediscovering what I loved about it and more.
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My copy from Omerch has arrived, that was pretty fast actually. Really enjoying both mediabook (looks awesome in pair with the Vector one) and the yellow t-shirt.
Also got Devin Townsend Empath t-shirt with a cat on it, thanks to Cram for posting about it somewhere and making me aware it exists.
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Also got Devin Townsend Empath t-shirt with a cat on it, thanks to Cram for posting about it somewhere and making me aware it exists.
:metal love that tshirt
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And then Ectobius Rex.... GOD DAMN! What a dirty, chonky riff that is. It's so great. And then it closes up with the chorus from Ivory Tower and the bridge riff from Prosthetic. What a fantastic climax to this album honestly.
I'm such a huge fan on the Ectobius Rex, love how it brings everything back to an ending. The final chorus with The Ivory tower melody but the lyrics referencing all the other songs is such an awesome climax
Crawl out of my skin, a cell keeps dividing
Memories of electricity
Rid this plague within, the veil finally lifts
Jumping from my tower of ivory
plus that chanting outro with some awesome riffage :metal
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Is it timeyet to post our top 10 (or 5, or 15, whatever) Haken songs?
Let’s have a go! If nobody else does, I’ll start when I have more time to post something :)
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Top 10 Haken songs:
1. Visions
2. Messiah Complex
3. The Architect
4. Somebody
5. Bound By Gravity
6. Pareidolia
7. Falling Back to Earth
8. Puzzle Box
9. Eternal Rain
10. Cockroach King
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My 10 favourites, in no particular order except chronological.
1. Celestial Elixir (okay, it's my #1)
2. Visions
3. Cockroach King
4. In Memoriam
5. Falling Back To Earth
6. Crystallised
7. 1985
8. Veil
9. Carousel
10. Canary Yellow
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#1. The Architect
#2. Celestial Elixir
#3. Somebody
#4. Bound By Gravity
#5. Veil
#6. Crystalised
#7. Puzzle Box
#8. Initiate
#9. Atlas Stone
10. Deathless
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Stupidly difficult:
1. Celestial Elixir
2. 1985
3. Pareidolia
4. Aquarium
5. The Architect
6. Puzzle Box
7. Deathless
8. Falling Back to Earth
9. Host
10. Because It’s There
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This was my attempt a few weeks ago when the same question came up on Reddit. It's impossible really though, this could easily change from day to day.
1. Falling Back to Earth
2. The Endless Knot
3. Deathless
4. In Memoriam
5. Invasion
6. Host
7. Red Giant
8. Puzzle Box
9. The Strain
10. 1985
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I deliberately left off any Virus songs, but I could see Invasion making the list.
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I think Invasion might be moving even higher to be honest, maybe number 3. I just love everything about it.
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hmmm ill give it a try but like others, it's not easy and could change
1. 1985
2. Messiah Complex
3. Falling Back to Earth
4. Deathless
5. Visions
6. In Memoriam
7. Bound By Gravity
8. Veil
9. Pareidolia
10. The Strain
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Celestial Elixir
Deathless
Falling Back to Earth
Crystallized
The Endless Knot
The Good Doctor
Carousel
Working through chronologically those were the locks I immediately thought of.
The final 3 becomes really tough, but I'll go with:
The Point of No Return
In Memoriam
The Architect
And I'll round out the top 15 with some honorable mentions:
Drowning in the Flood
Nocturnal Conspiracy
Pareidolia
1985
The Strain
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Roughly something like this:
1. Visions
2. Celestial Elixir
3. Crystallised
4. Pareidolia
5. 1985
6. The Architect
7. Insomnia
8. Falling Back to Earth
9. A Cell Divides
10. Puzzle Box
Aquarium, Atlas Stone, Darkest Light, Initiate, The Endless Knot are all floating around just outside the top 10. Nothing from Virus, though there's still time for songs to grow on me - at the moment Invasion, The Strain and possibly Prosthetic are the ones that could possibly sneak in there.
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Really happy to see love for In Memoriam!
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Should we consider Haken among prog(-metal)'s big league now? Have they reached that status already with just three very-highly-regarded albums out? I certainly think so. In prog terms, I think Dream Theater defined the 90s and Porcupine Tree defined the 00s, and halfway through this decade, I think we can add Haken as the defining prog band of the 10s.
Totally agree with that, but I would address this to prog metal, which, by definition, is only a niche ( although I think DT breaked a bit this frontier).
Edit: nevermind, I replied a very very old post! Hahaha
But, I think it’s a very valid opinion, even more nowadays.
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Really happy to see love for In Memoriam!
Such a beast of a song, my favorite of their shorter songs.
Should we consider Haken among prog(-metal)'s big league now? Have they reached that status already with just three very-highly-regarded albums out? I certainly think so. In prog terms, I think Dream Theater defined the 90s and Porcupine Tree defined the 00s, and halfway through this decade, I think we can add Haken as the defining prog band of the 10s.
Totally agree with that, but I would address this to prog metal, which, by definition, is only a niche ( although I think DT breaked a bit this frontier).
I had kind of considered Haken to be at this level already with the release of Vector and being able to tour the US as a headliner multiple times. But I do agree, it's a niche genre so even being at the highest or near the highest levels in this genre kind of doesn't mean much in the broader music world. Hopefully they continue to rise, there's plenty of room to grow still.
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I mean that post was from 2014 :lol
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:rollin didn't even catch that, but I would have disagreed back then
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I think Haken's status goes beyond just prog metal (where they're among the biggest right now) to being a pretty big band in the wider/overall prog industry/community too.
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Agreed. Every album release is An Event, highly anticipated by a significant amount of the prog fanbase.
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I think Haken's status goes beyond just prog metal (where they're among the biggest right now) to being a pretty big band in the wider/overall prog industry/community too.
Yea, I'd say they are more known now in the prog world than the metal world if you were to split it like that.
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This would be really tough, according to itunes, my top 10 most listened Haken songs are:
1. In Memoriam
2. The Path
3. The Architect
4. Celestial Elixir
5. 1985
6. Puzzle Box
7. The Good Doctor
8. Initiate
9. Earthrise
10. Falling Back To Earth
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I guess this gives me a good reason to listen to Hakens albums, Mainly Visions and Aquarius to get those songs.
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This is Without Aquarius, as I need to listen to it way more. Found a copy of it on Amazon.
1. Earthrise
2. Deathless
3. Bound By Gravity
4. Shapeshifter
5. Falling Back to Earth
6. Visions
7. Host
8. A Cell Divides
9. Insomnia
10. Somebody
Album: The Mountain
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Are we doing top 10s? If so...
1. Visions
2. Atlas Stone
3. The Good Doctor
4. Celestial Elixir
5. Puzzle Box
6. Carousel
7. Nil By Mouth
8. Aquarium
9. Somebody
10. 1985
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A little late to the party as I just picked this up yesterday. After 2 spins, it's too early to tell where it will fall in their catalog. But I can tell you I already like it better than Vector (which I do like by the way). Overall I think it sounds less dense than Vector. I feel like the instruments have a little more room to breath, comparatively, but it still has a pretty heavy sound overall.
I haven't read through all the pages here, so forgive me if this has been mentioned - but I couldn't help but notice the main riff in Messiah Complex 1. Ivory Tower is, shall we say, "influenced" by LTE's Paradigm Shift LOL
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01: Celestial Elixir
02: Crystallised
03: Visions
04: Veil
05: Pareidolia
06: Messiah Complex
07: The Architect
08: Invasion
09: Nil By Mouth
10: Falling Back to Earth
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1. Red Giant
2. Crystallised
3. Bound By Gravity
4. Visions
5. 1985
6. Celestial Elixir
7. Falling Back to Earth
8. Puzzle Box
9. Earthrise
10. Earthlings
And my album rankings:
1. Affinity
2. Restoration EP
3. Visions
4. The Mountain
5. Vector
6. Aquarius
7. Virus
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Well....it’s not news. But Diego just posted a new synth wave jam.
https://youtu.be/PEZ6EbdWl3Y
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Just listened to this for the first time yesterday.
My initial prognosis is that it is quite good.
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1. Affinity
2. Restoration EP
3. Visions
4. The Mountain
5. Vector
6. Aquarius
7. Virus
You silly person.
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I know Affinity would be my #1 but after that I honestly have no clue how to rank them. Affinity's really their only album I like the majority of.
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1. Aquarius
2. The Mountain
3. Vector
4. Visions
5. Affinity
6. Virus
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1. Affinity
2. Restoration EP
3. Visions
4. The Mountain
5. Vector
6. Aquarius
7. Virus
You silly person.
;D
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Album rankings:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Vector
4. Virus
5. Aquarius
6. Visions
7. Restoration
Virus and Aquarius are basically tied. Restoration may go higher once I've given it more listens.
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Oh boy here we go
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Restoration
4. Visions
5. Vector
6. Aquarius
Only listened to Virus once so far so it's hard to say where it'll land, but I'm leaning in between 3 and 4 right now.
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I bought all digital copies of the albums that came after The Mountain, since I don't have a CD player anymore and it sure looks like it's taking ages for people to get Haken CDs anyway.
Here's the thing; for some reason amazon doesn't provide album booklets with the digital downloads anymore and I really like reading those.
So getting to the awkward request, I'd really appreciate it if anyone with a scanner and time would make me some png or jpg scans of the booklets, I know it's a shit ton of time, but I don't have to get them all at once or anything and there's no rush.
I've moved on from The Mountain a bit, listening to Restoration the last couple of days. I love Crystallised and I rarely like songs that cross the 12 minute mark or so.
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1. Affinity
2. Vector
3. Aquarius
4. The Mountain
5. Visions
6. Restoration - EP
7. Virus
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It doesn't really feel fair to rank Restoration among the studio albums but if I had to it'd definitely be at the bottom.
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Guess I'll give it a go, too...
Visions
Affinity
The Mountain
Aquarius
Vector/Virus
Restoration
The V's are pretty much tied for me right now, but I can imagine Virus climbing up to equal Aquarius for me.
-Marc.
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I could never do a top 10 songs. More so than any other band I think it would just kill me. But I can rank the albums.
The Mountain
Visions
Affinity
Vector/Virus
Aquarius
And to be honest, it’s hard to put anything at the bottom. Last year I would’ve put Vector at the bottom. But now that I’ve heard the complete piece of work, I can’t help but see them as a single two CD album. And they’re both better for it.
I am officially declaring this the best opening six albums of any prog rock band I can think of. There is not a single note from any of these six albums that I don’t absolutely adore.
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I could never do a top 10 songs. More so than any other band I think it would just kill me. But I can rank the albums.
The Mountain
Visions
Affinity
Vector/Virus
Aquarius
And to be honest, it’s hard to put anything at the bottom. Last year I would’ve put Vector at the bottom. But now that I’ve heard the complete piece of work, I can’t help but see them as a single two CD album. And they’re both better for it.
I am officially declaring this the best opening six albums of any prog rock band I can think of. There is not a single note from any of these six albums that I don’t absolutely adore.
Bold statement (literally and figuratively), but I can think of a couple others I would put into that category:
-Yes, for one, but that depends on how you feel about their first two and TFTO, since TYA-Fragile-CTTE are fairly universally loved
-Spock's Beard, but I 'm a huge Neal Morse fan and those first six SB albums are pretty perfect in my eyes (yes, even Day For Night)
-I'd also say Riverside has had a great outing since their debut, and their first six are pretty amazing albums
-Kansas would come close, but I've not been huge on Monolith, though the last time I heard it, I liked it more than I remembered
-The same for The Flower Kings, who have an amazing first-five run, but their sixth is a bit divisive
Of any of those, though, I'd definitely put Haken's first six near the top (maybe tied with SB and Yes), if because there's a high quality and consistency for their output that I've thoroughly enjoyed over the last decade or so.
-Marc.
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Hehe I had to check progarchives to check what progmetal (progrock is too big to even begin investigating) band that actually has the best 6 opening albums. Obviously progarchives is 100% objective and the scores there can be treated as fact. Quite quickly the only contenders was Riverside and POS. Maybe missed some bands but don't think so. My feeling was that Riverside (as being maybe the most consistently good band ever) would be the hardest opponent.
Average score of first 6 albums (progarchives obviously rate from 0-5):
Riverside: 4,10
Haken: 4,00
POS: 3,96 (Scarsick took down the score quite dramatically)
Dream Theater: 3,95 (Excluding WDADU obviously ;) (and FII and TOT dragging down the score dramatically ))
Anyway good run so far! :hat
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I've never heard Riverside. Which album should I check out?
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In my opinion Anno Domini High Definition (ADHD). It took some time to digest for me and definitely is their most progmetal sounding record, but it's crazy good. However the new Wasteland album is easier to digest and just delicious. If you like any of them just continue to digest their discography. Their records always sound amazing and they just don't waste time doing bad songs.
But that's for the Riverside thread imo just to not take this off topic :smiley:
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Okay, thanks!
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Re: Riverside
ADHD grabbed me instantly and it’s still my favorite. Most people tend to say their 2nd album Second Life Syndrome is their best. Those are the two I would start with.
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I've never heard Riverside. Which album should I check out?
Any of them, they're all basically the same. :P
I find Riverside a bit dull and very overrated, and I didn't even know they were scored so high on prog archives until this thread.
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There is a very Pink Floyd-ish, atmospheric approach to most of their stuff. ADHD has a little less of that, which is why I think it’s a better starting point.
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There is a very Pink Floyd-ish, atmospheric approach to most of their stuff. ADHD has a little less of that, which is why I think it’s a better starting point.
Yeah definitely! It's not that they sound a lot like Pink Floyd really but it's like they share the same qualities. Their ability to often use less to achieve more and like you say, the atmosphere. Maybe you can say they paint the music with similar tools :) It doesn't hurt that their production is similar to the best of Pink Floyd as well.
BTW both Riverside and Pink Floyd was dull to me before they became amazing.
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Pink Floyd were amazing (at their best anyway) because they combined the atmospheric qualities with strong melodies, which I just don't really get from Riverside.
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Pink Floyd were amazing (at their best anyway) because they combined the atmospheric qualities with strong melodies, which I just don't really get from Riverside.
Hehe I do like how different people can see music since that is exactly how I could describe Riverside as well. What do you feel about a song like Escalator Shrine that actually sounds like an awesome Pink Floyd song? ;D
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Riverside has a handful of good albums but ADHD is easily their best and might be one of the best progressive rock albums ever made.
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I prefer Lunatic Soul over Riverside honestly.
But yes, Haken.
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Here’s another Haken albums ranking:
Affinity
Aquarius
Mountain, The
Restoration
Vector
Virus
Visions
And in order of favourite to least (for me):
1. Aquarius
2. Affinity
3. The Mountain
4. Virus
5. Visions
6. Vector
(7. Restoration)
Virus placement tentative, and I guess Visions and Vector could swap around now and then.
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I'm surprised at how well-liked A Cell Divides is. Like, I don't see it in Top 10 lists, but I've heard basically no negativity about the song, and it seems exactly like the kind of song people would complain about. Let me put it this way: If Dream Theater made A Cell Divides, I think a very large portion of the fanbase would hate it to death and say Dream Theater's selling out or something.
But hey, I'm not complaining, I think A Cell Divides is a pretty great song.
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Songs all close, only top 3 are set in stone:
1. Pareidolia
2. The Architect
3. 1985
4. Carousel
5. Puzzle Box
6. Atlas Stone
7. Bound By Gravity
8. Visions
9. Streams
10. Earthrise
1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Vector + Virus
4. Visions
5. Aquarius
6. Restoration EP
A Cell Divides is good too :tup
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Along with Haken, Riverside are one of the true modern gems in the genre to me. I love pretty much all their stuff, but I'd go with Second Life Syndrome to start.
I will say that even though I consider myself a bigger Haken fan, Riverside live are better than Haken live. Sound is always great, they all come through the mix so well, and it's a very pure and organic experience.
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Riverside live is One of the most surprisingly fantastic experience I have been to. One of the best ever for me. Sounds great and energy was through the roof!
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I really don’t want to turn this into a second Riverside thread, but I have to concur. When Wasteland came out I was not a fan. But seeing the Wasteland tour live changed my attitude about the material.
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Riverside are absolutely fantastic on stage.
I also like Haken.
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I also like Haken.
Never heard of them. We should start a thread about them.
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Haha yeah, that Haken band has a lovely album out too.
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I've never heard Riverside. Which album should I check out?
In my opinion Anno Domini High Definition (ADHD). It took some time to digest for me and definitely is their most progmetal sounding record, but it's crazy good. However the new Wasteland album is easier to digest and just delicious. If you like any of them just continue to digest their discography. Their records always sound amazing and they just don't waste time doing bad songs.
But that's for the Riverside thread imo just to not take this off topic :smiley:
Going to agree with Pettor and others here, ADHD is a great starting point. It was Riverside's newest album when I first got into them, and then I worked my way back, though if you must know their first three albums form a trilogy, so you might want to check those out in release order. Anything after that is fair game for which order you check. ADHD is also their shortest album, I believe, so it's definitely easier to digest.
They do have prog metal elements throughout their works, but I'd also say there's just as much atmospheric/Floydian elements as well. They've got a great sound if you're into those things!
But yes, Haken is good too!
-Marc.
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I'm no drummer, but it seems to me that ever since the rest of the guys went out with Portnoy for the Shattered Fortress, Ray has really stepped up his game. The drumming on Virus is ridiculous. He was also awesome on Vector. Maybe he felt like he had something to prove?
Anyways, here's how I now rank them -
1. The Mountain
2. Virus
3. Affinity
4. Visions / Vector (can change daily)
6. Restoration
I still haven't picked up Aquarius yet. I'll need to fix that soon!
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1. The Mountain
2. Aquarius
3. Virus
4. Visions
5. Vector
6. Restoration EP
7. Affinity
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I'm no drummer, but it seems to me that ever since the rest of the guys went out with Portnoy for the Shattered Fortress, Ray has really stepped up his game. The drumming on Virus is ridiculous. He was also awesome on Vector. Maybe he felt like he had something to prove?
Anyways, here's how I now rank them -
1. The Mountain
2. Virus
3. Affinity
4. Visions / Vector (can change daily)
6. Restoration
I still haven't picked up Aquarius yet. I'll need to fix that soon!
This is one of the best drum performances I've ever heard. Period!
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Ray was a very good drummer since Aquarius, but he’s getting better since then and it’s clear to my ears that he had 3 phases of development: Aquarius/Visions; The Mountain/Restoration/Affinity; and Virus/Vector, in which he became a phenomenal drummer!
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Ray was a very good drummer since Aquarius, but he’s getting better since then and it’s clear to my ears that he had 3 phases of development: Aquarius/Visions; The Mountain/Restoration/Affinity; and Virus/Vector, in which he became a phenomenal drummer!
Man.....I have to say I disagree but it's largely due to I prefer Hakens sound leading into Vector/Virus more than the heavier sound of Vector/Virus. I appreciated his drumming style more in those albums rather than the last two. The last two sound great....don't get me wrong.....and I think he's on fire as well. I just prefer the more nuanced Haken that built atmosphere and created a textured approach to their songs. The last two albums are more in your face.....they're heavier and they abandon that atmospheric approach that they had been famous for....to the point of Diego is non existent in Virus and Ross's singing style feels out of place.
I 'like' Virus.....it's good and all but for me it's not the Haken sound I grew to love and enjoy. It's Haken trying to sound heavy metal.
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I see what you mean, I understand that you prefer Ray's style associated to those albums. But I think that technically he's playing more difficult parts than before and he's playing on Vector and Virus for the heavier style of those albums. Also I believe if Haken had recorded The Mountain and Affinity (by the way, my favorite Haken albums) after Vector and Virus, I'm sure we would hear the same evolution from him. He does sound like someone who is still studying and learning new things on drums.
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I could never do a top 10 songs. More so than any other band I think it would just kill me. But I can rank the albums.
The Mountain
Visions
Affinity
Vector/Virus
Aquarius
And to be honest, it’s hard to put anything at the bottom. Last year I would’ve put Vector at the bottom. But now that I’ve heard the complete piece of work, I can’t help but see them as a single two CD album. And they’re both better for it.
I am officially declaring this the best opening six albums of any prog rock band I can think of. There is not a single note from any of these six albums that I don’t absolutely adore.
Wow! I think I remember you saying some time ago that Affinity was your #1 and The Mountain was your #2. What about Visions made you end up loving it more?
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Riverside has a handful of good albums but ADHD is easily their best and might be one of the best progressive rock albums ever made.
^this
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I could never do a top 10 songs. More so than any other band I think it would just kill me. But I can rank the albums.
The Mountain
Visions
Affinity
Vector/Virus
Aquarius
And to be honest, it’s hard to put anything at the bottom. Last year I would’ve put Vector at the bottom. But now that I’ve heard the complete piece of work, I can’t help but see them as a single two CD album. And they’re both better for it.
I am officially declaring this the best opening six albums of any prog rock band I can think of. There is not a single note from any of these six albums that I don’t absolutely adore.
Wow! I think I remember you saying some time ago that Affinity was your #1 and The Mountain was your #2. What about Visions made you end up loving it more?
When Affinity first came out, it was really close. But I don’t think I ever claimed it was my #1. At one point, I think I made the statement that it “might be superior musically, but thematically, The Mountain was unbeatable”
So Affinity was never going to top The Mountain (which LITERALLY saved me from an incredibly dark chapter in my life, and may have in fact saved me from giving up entirely) but as time has gone by, I’ve just fallen in love with Visions. It’s not only a great homage to SFAM (baffled at how there are a few that don’t see the blatant similarities) but may have equaled it....but not quite. But the musical nuggets are all there to make it a masterpiece.
TBH....all six of these album are so good that this list could shuffle entirely on mood. But for personal reasons, The Mountain will always be my #1 Haken album, and maybe even 2 or 3 all time.
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jammindude: It's amazing how music can help people in dark and difficult times. If one Haken album can do that, it's The Mountain.
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The Mountain really is a very special album.
And yeah Haken's run is my favourite first-six-albums by any band ever, the only other one that I think comes close is The Dear Hunter (their first seven albums in fact).
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Somebody had mentioned Spock’s Beard earlier. And I had honestly forgotten about that six album run. That is a very special opening six. But honestly, I do feel like Snow runs out of gas. It’s about a disc and a half of 5 star material that got bloated into two discs, which makes the second disc feel a little half-baked.
The other two contenders for me are obviously Dream Theater and Rush. And even though I love the “weaker” albums of those runs more than most, doesn’t change the fact that the quality of Haken’s output has surpassed them both.
POS was very close. And again, I don’t hate Scarsick as much as most people do, but it was a letdown after the first four...and then BE which I still sometimes can’t figure out if I really love it, or I’m just fascinated by it.
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Somebody had mentioned Spock’s Beard earlier. And I had honestly forgotten about that six album run. That is a very special opening six. But honestly, I do feel like Snow runs out of gas. It’s about a disc and a half of 5 star material that got bloated into two discs, which makes the second disc feel a little half-baked.
The other two contenders for me are obviously Dream Theater and Rush. And even though I love the “weaker” albums of those runs more than most, doesn’t change the fact that the quality of Haken’s output has surpassed them both.
POS was very close. And again, I don’t hate Scarsick as much as most people do, but it was a letdown after the first four...and then BE which I still sometimes can’t figure out if I really love it, or I’m just fascinated by it.
People hate Scarsick?? I think Scarsick is awesome :metal
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Last night I heard Vector and Virus back-to-back for the first time, I hadn't heard anything from either albums before this and I think they absolutely made the right choice by not making this a double album, it's really overwhelming. And after I was done I couldn't honestly recall one memorable riff or melody, it was just too much, even though I enjoyed the music while listening.
One listen isn't enough to be sure about this but I kinda feel like I get what people mean when comparing this to SC/BC&SL. Haken's first two albums sounded like they were inspired by SFAM stylistically, then The Mountain transcended anything DT has ever done IMO so the comparison dropped.
I wouldn't say Vector & Virus are similar stylistically to SC/BC&SL in particular, but pretty much a mishmash of all post-SFAM/pre-ADTOE albums, not very concrete on it, need more listens, but even if that view stands; I don't see it as a bad thing per se.
I haven't heard Affinity yet.
I don't think I'll re-listen to Vector/Virus right away, or anytime soon for that matter, another side effect from listening to them back to back.
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Somebody had mentioned Spock’s Beard earlier. And I had honestly forgotten about that six album run. That is a very special opening six. But honestly, I do feel like Snow runs out of gas. It’s about a disc and a half of 5 star material that got bloated into two discs, which makes the second disc feel a little half-baked.
The other two contenders for me are obviously Dream Theater and Rush. And even though I love the “weaker” albums of those runs more than most, doesn’t change the fact that the quality of Haken’s output has surpassed them both.
POS was very close. And again, I don’t hate Scarsick as much as most people do, but it was a letdown after the first four...and then BE which I still sometimes can’t figure out if I really love it, or I’m just fascinated by it.
People hate Scarsick?? I think Scarsick is awesome :metal
I think it's got some great material...but on this forum, it occupies the last (or second to last) place on most people's POS album ranking.
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I messaged Ray a couple days ago. Told him I thought his performance was stellar and asked if he ever considered doing an instructional DVD where he could discuss and play through some of more complex sections. He was kind enough to reply. He thanked me for the comments and said he doesn't currently have a set up that would enable him to record, but hopes to soon. I would love to see him count and play through some of those djenty polyrhythms.
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I finally got this album today (ordered from LaserCD and media mail has been badly delayed). I'm only one listen in, but as someone who was somewhat disappointed in Vector, I'm pleasantly surprised. My view could obviously change, but my first impression is that this is a significantly more compelling rendition of the Vector sound.
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I messaged Ray a couple days ago. Told him I thought his performance was stellar and asked if he ever considered doing an instructional DVD where he could discuss and play through some of more complex sections. He was kind enough to reply. He thanked me for the comments and said he doesn't currently have a set up that would enable him to record, but hopes to soon. I would love to see him count and play through some of those djenty polyrhythms.
Rich can probably clarify on this as I believe this is correct but it's just me piecing things together.
I think Ray only has an electric kit at home to play and practice on, so when he wants to really start practicing on an acoustic kit for a tour or album he has to rent a space or studio in order to do that.
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This makes me sad. Haken are one of the best known bands in the genre now (deservedly) and Ray is a friggin master of the drums. And he hasn't got the setup and space to record an instruction video or even an acoustic set to practice whenever he wants to.
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I think that's right Nick, I don't remember him posting a home video where he had an acoustic kit.
This makes me sad. Haken are one of the best known bands in the genre now (deservedly) and Ray is a friggin master of the drums. And he hasn't got the setup and space to record an instruction video or even an acoustic set to practice whenever he wants to.
Well, there's a lot of different factors here. Living costs in London are insane and so even people on a good steady salary generally can't reasonably afford more than a small-ish flat, depending on where they want to live. Secondly, noise pollution for the neighbours. Electric kits are considerate for your neighbours because you can keep the volume low or, if you want to crank it loud, do it with headphones. So having an electric kit at home for extra practice and then keeping your acoustic kit in a studio or wherever where you can really go wild is a pretty sensible balance in the normal course of things, it's only constraining right now due to covid.
Basically, he may well be able to afford to have the set up and might even have the space to do so at home, but chooses not to so that he's not a dick to his neighbours.
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Keep in mind, he might not even be talking about his kit or space. You need multiple cameras and mics to do a proper video. I'd guess it's a combo of all 3. Hopefully he will be able to record soon.
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A few more days in, my early impression of this album is better than it's been for any Haken album since The Mountain. A really good sign. Too early to say where it will end up, but I could see it challenging Affinity for #3 in my list. I doubt they'll ever touch Aquarius or The Mountain for me.
What I'm finally realizing, from actually bothering to look at the songwriting credits, is that the point where my interest in Haken's music dips coincides precisely with the point where the music goes from primarily being credited to Richard Henshall to always being credited to "Haken." Makes me think I should make checking out Henshall's solo album a much higher priority.
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Hen's solo album is fantastic, but if you are looking for a return to the broad, epic style of Haken's first three albums, you'll be disappointed. Cocoon is even harder to grasp and more technical than Haken's last two albums.
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Hen's solo album is fantastic, but if you are looking for a return to the broad, epic style of Haken's first three albums, you'll be disappointed. Cocoon is even harder to grasp and more technical than Haken's last two albums.
How so? (I don't find Haken's music to be overly technical btw, but I only listened to The Mountain and most of Vector. Be that as it may, I may find some more things to analyse I'm sure)
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Hen's solo album is fantastic, but if you are looking for a return to the broad, epic style of Haken's first three albums, you'll be disappointed. Cocoon is even harder to grasp and more technical than Haken's last two albums.
But Cocoon is more playful and humourous than recent Haken, despite being jazzy and technical.
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Hen's solo album is fantastic, but if you are looking for a return to the broad, epic style of Haken's first three albums, you'll be disappointed. Cocoon is even harder to grasp and more technical than Haken's last two albums.
playful and humourous, despite being jazzy and technical.
Why can't jazzy or technical be playful and humorous?
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I meant the way Haken has evolved from Aquarius to Vector/Virus. Recently, Haken have dialed back the humour in their music AND gotten more syncopated and tightly arranged. Cocoon has kept the whimsical melodies of early Haken and features the syncopated guitar work of recent Haken.
Cocoon is living proof that music can be jazzy, technical, playful and humorous at the same time :biggrin:
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For me, the "playful and humorous" side depends on what people refer to when they say that. If they're talking about that carnival section in Celestial Elixir, then I could live without ever having that in another song, but if it's referencing stuff like the "I bet you don't remember me" section from Visions, then I would definitely enjoy more stuff like that.
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For me, the "playful and humorous" side depends on what people refer to when they say that. If they're talking about that carnival section in Celestial Elixir, then I could live without ever having that in another song, but if it's referencing stuff like the "I bet you don't remember me" section from Visions, then I would definitely enjoy more stuff like that.
That's one of my all-time favorite pieces of music! I agree that the "playful and humorous" side of Haken's music is one of the first things that stood out in their music and that is very special about them.
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For me, the "playful and humorous" side depends on what people refer to when they say that. If they're talking about that carnival section in Celestial Elixir, then I could live without ever having that in another song, but if it's referencing stuff like the "I bet you don't remember me" section from Visions, then I would definitely enjoy more stuff like that.
That's one of my all-time favorite pieces of music! I agree that the "playful and humorous" side of Haken's music is one of the first things that stood out in their music and that is very special about them.
To clarify, I really like that section. I just mean that if they never did something like that again, I wouldn't be all that disappointed.
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Bottom line, if you like anything Haken have released but never gave Cocoon a spin, do so as soon as possible.
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Bottom line, if you like anything Haken have released but never gave Cocoon a spin, do so as soon as possible.
Indeed, it's fantastic.
And Vector/Virus are the only albums that don't really have that playful side overtly (although The Good Doctor has a lot of groove and personally I find the epic madness of Messiah Complex to be fun in the same way). I very much doubt that side is gone forever, it just wouldn't have really fit with those albums.
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That whole line of thought reminds me that one of the reasons I love Haken is because they have that ability to be so "feel good", "positive", and "uplifting". (quotes because they tend to be relative and subjective terms)
You know how some people are getting a little sick and tired of *all* comic book movies having to go for that "dark and gritty" feel? I've started to feel the same way about progressive rock. When I first discovered Dream Theater, my immediate draw was side 1 of IAW. Balls and chunk, were followed by the beautiful Another Day, then the rather cheerful Take the Time, and even Surrounded seemed to have a very happy main riff before going into the slightly moodier Metropolis. But the point is that I was really elated to hear a band that didn't have to be so dark and depressing all the time.
It's the same with Haken. My first exposure was The Mountain, and other than Spock's Beard, I don't think I had heard a progressive metal album who's message was so positive and upbuilding in a very long time. Even in the points where the music sounds dark, the message is a continuous "no matter what happens, no matter how bleak things are, you have to overcome and adapt and keep going. You may even get in your own way sometimes. Your own ego may trip you up. But you can learn from that, become more humble and adaptable, and get back up and keep going."
As I went through the rest of their catalog, I was blown away by the musical puzzle box of each piece of art (pun intended) but I am a bit put off by darker lyrical themes of Visions (even though I think it is musically one of their best). And this is probably the reason why I love Affinity so much...because it has a bit of both, and definitely ends on one of the most positive high notes of their career.
With Vector/Virus, I feel like they've gone back to the extremely dark and gritty story approach like what Visions had. But it's musically so strong that they get away with it. I just hope we can get back to the nice balance of dark and happy, because when I'm listening to an entire album, I prefer some dynamics to the mood rather than just maintaining one constant "feel" throughout the entire piece.
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So far, it's my album of the year. Absolutely brilliant album start to finish. Carousel might be my favorite song in the last 10 years. But, every song is amazing and the sound quality is perfect.
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I was today years old when it dawned on me that the ending “hidden track” on Vector begins with the first three notes of the vocal melody to The Cockroach King.
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I was today years old when it dawned on me that the ending “hidden track” on Vector begins with the first three notes of the vocal melody to The Cockroach King.
The first three vocal notes of A Cell Divides are also from that part of Cockroach King (in a different key of course).
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So far, it's my album of the year. Absolutely brilliant album start to finish. Carousel might be my favorite song in the last 10 years. But, every song is amazing and the sound quality is perfect.
Thank you. It's my album of the year as well. 2020 has seen countless amazing releases, but no one touches Haken for me.
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Yeah I'd agree that it's Album Of The Year for me as well. I really like the new Pain Of Salvation too.
We'll see how the upcoming releases from Neal Morse and Fates Warning will be, but I can't see them topping Haken for me this year.
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Yea, I had already mentioned it had knocked out Nightwish to be my current album of the year.
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So far, it's my album of the year. Absolutely brilliant album start to finish. Carousel might be my favorite song in the last 10 years. But, every song is amazing and the sound quality is perfect.
Check out Pineapple Thief's new album "Versions of the Truth". Might have debunked Haken's throne for AOTY in my list.
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So far, it's my album of the year. Absolutely brilliant album start to finish. Carousel might be my favorite song in the last 10 years. But, every song is amazing and the sound quality is perfect.
Check out Pineapple Thief's new album "Versions of the Truth". Might have debunked Haken's throne for AOTY in my list.
Never checked them out. Will do!
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I was today years old when it dawned on me that the ending “hidden track” on Vector begins with the first three notes of the vocal melody to The Cockroach King.
The first three vocal notes of A Cell Divides are also from that part of Cockroach King (in a different key of course).
I had not noticed that! Cool!
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It's a good album but the variation is a bit lacking and MC stands out as the most exciting song by margins for me. POS Panther will def take the throne for AOTY right now but this is a good second place album for me. Could have been a close battle if the other songs (than MC) had more memorable stuff. Ayreon sounds dissappoiting so far sadly.
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It's a good album but the variation is a bit lacking and MC stands out as the most exciting song by margins for me. POS Panther will def take the throne for AOTY right now but this is a good second place album for me. Could have been a close battle if the other songs (than MC) had more memorable stuff. Ayreon sounds dissappoiting so far sadly.
I agree. I'm going to give the nod right now to POS's Panther based on the variety of the songs (and they're all really good to great)! Virus is excellent too, but there's just something that feels "special" to me about Panther
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Why don't you Kram it!
I kid! I kid! It just fit!
I really like the 3 times I've Listened to Panther so it is 1-2, for me. In time we'll see which one wins out.
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Fairly sure Panther will be AOTY for me unless the new Fates Warning will be as awesome as Theories of Flight. I have some hopes for Ayreon but not sure it'll be as good as Panther, we'll see. Virus would be lucky to make my Top 3 unfortunately, although it's still a good album.
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Thanks everyone for the recommendations on Cocoon. I'll make sure to give it a go without expecting The Mountain 2 (which isn't really what I would've been expecting anyway).
I could definitely see Virus competing for AOTY for me (right now it and Nightwish are the main competitors, though there are several I haven't heard or am still waiting on). I'm surprised to see how many people are mentioning Panther. I've never really been able to get much into Pain of Salvation; is this the type of album that might appeal to people who weren't previously fans, or just a strong representation of their typical sound?
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I’d say Pain of Salvation doesn’t have a typical sound, especially as this last one sounds very different from their other stuff.
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Virus is easily my AOTY
because it's the only 2020 album I've listened to
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I should check out that PoS album, was supposed to see them this week at PP and if that festival was going to happen, I probably already would have checked out their new album.
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Definitely check out PANTHER, it's a great album. I'm surprised by the almost universally positive reactions to it though, I thought it would polarise more.
My Versions Of The Truth vinyl is coming in today, I'm very excited to hear Gavin Harrison's magic complementing mellow, well thought-through art pop songs again.
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Definitely check out PANTHER, it's a great album. I'm surprised by the almost universally positive reactions to it though, I thought it would polarise more.
My Versions Of The Truth vinyl is coming in today, I'm very excited to hear Gavin Harrison's magic complementing mellow, well thought-through art pop songs again.
Gavin is as clean and inventive and musical as ever. Nice and dynamic production as well.
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Some songs from L-1ve came up randomly this morning on one of my playlists. Man...awesome! These guys are just kicking my butt lately.
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I'm no stranger to having songs slowly grow on me, but still: I got Affinity on release and have listened to it 15 times according to iTunes (sort of a lot for me; I know it might not be for others), and just this week, over four years in, The Endless Knot finally clicked hard for me. Went from being my least favorite song on the album to probably one of my favorites.
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I'm no stranger to having songs slowly grow on me, but still: I got Affinity on release and have listened to it 15 times according to iTunes (sort of a lot for me; I know it might not be for others), and just this week, over four years in, The Endless Knot finally clicked hard for me. Went from being my least favorite song on the album to probably one of my favorites.
It didn't click for me yet, so I have hope..
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I'm no stranger to having songs slowly grow on me, but still: I got Affinity on release and have listened to it 15 times according to iTunes (sort of a lot for me; I know it might not be for others), and just this week, over four years in, The Endless Knot finally clicked hard for me. Went from being my least favorite song on the album to probably one of my favorites.
It didn't click for me yet, so I have hope..
You have to see it live... it will click the shit out of you.
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I'm no stranger to having songs slowly grow on me, but still: I got Affinity on release and have listened to it 15 times according to iTunes (sort of a lot for me; I know it might not be for others), and just this week, over four years in, The Endless Knot finally clicked hard for me. Went from being my least favorite song on the album to probably one of my favorites.
It didn't click for me yet, so I have hope..
You have to see it live... it will click the shit out of you.
I love The Endless Knot and one of my biggest disappointments seeing Haken live (I had to travel to Germany to see them) is that they didn't play The Endless Knot. I was ready to rock out to that dubstep part so hard.
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I'm no stranger to having songs slowly grow on me, but still: I got Affinity on release and have listened to it 15 times according to iTunes (sort of a lot for me; I know it might not be for others), and just this week, over four years in, The Endless Knot finally clicked hard for me. Went from being my least favorite song on the album to probably one of my favorites.
It didn't click for me yet, so I have hope..
You have to see it live... it will click the shit out of you.
I love The Endless Knot and one of my biggest disappointments seeing Haken live (I had to travel to Germany to see them) is that they didn't play The Endless Knot. I was ready to rock out to that dubstep part so hard.
Yeah you're right, they didn't play it during their Vectours. They dug it out again in March 2020 though. So maybe travel to Germany again, maybe you'll have more luck ;) Where did you go in Germany?
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That time I visited Hamburg for 5 days. It was my birthday vacation. Caught Steven Wilson and Haken back to back on 20th and 21st February 2019 I think. One of my fondest memories lately with all the travel bans and no concerts allowed. I just walked through the town for hours and hours. It was fantastic.
I also stayed in Koln in 2017 for two weeks. I love Germany so I do hope to visit again one day.
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That time I visited Hamburg for 5 days. It was my birthday vacation. Caught Steven Wilson and Haken back to back on 20th and 21st February 2019 I think. One of my fondest memories lately with all the travel bans and no concerts allowed. I just walked through the town for hours and hours. It was fantastic.
I also stayed in Koln in 2017 for two weeks. I love Germany so I do hope to visit again one day.
Hamburg is a beautiful city and having seen SW and Haken within 5 days, it doesn't seem like your trip was in vain, although Endless Knot was not played ;)
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That time I visited Hamburg for 5 days. It was my birthday vacation. Caught Steven Wilson and Haken back to back on 20th and 21st February 2019 I think. One of my fondest memories lately with all the travel bans and no concerts allowed. I just walked through the town for hours and hours. It was fantastic.
I also stayed in Koln in 2017 for two weeks. I love Germany so I do hope to visit again one day.
Hamburg is a beautiful city and having seen SW and Haken within 5 days, it doesn't seem like your trip was in vain, although Endless Knot was not played ;)
The whole trip was one of the best things I've ever experienced so definitely not in vain :)
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Have they given any indication on when they might be touring? Like just some vague part of 2021? Seems that a lot of bands just rescheduled all of their dates for a year later, but as far as I know Haken had no European tour scheduled.
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Have they given any indication on when they might be touring? Like just some vague part of 2021? Seems that a lot of bands just rescheduled all of their dates for a year later, but as far as I know Haken had no European tour scheduled.
They are booked for at least one euro festival next summer. I'm guessing they won't be back in NA until fall of 2021 the earliest, but being they didn't have a tour postponed, I wonder if they'll be pushed out even further since so many tours are already scheduled for 2021 due to postponement.
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Sometimes I have a bad habit of ranking/rating albums too early after release. Not giving myself enough time to really digest them. So I really wanted to take my time with Virus. I've been pretty much listening to it non-stop since it's release. I think overall it comes in at my #1 Haken album. It's just frikking brilliant! The more I listen the more of the nuances, intricacies, and layers I hear. This could very well make a push into my top 10 albums of all time list, time will tell! I've even come around to Canary Yellow, which I really was initially kinda "Blah" on, but now appreciate and enjoy. Carousel and Messiah complex are both simply outstanding. The rest of the tracks are above average with the exception of the very last track.
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I've even come around to Canary Yellow, which I really was initially kinda "Blah" on, but now appreciate and enjoy. Carousel and Messiah complex are both simply outstanding.
I think it's placement makes it sound even better. It flows really well from The Strain and both those songs area a nice break between the two epics.
Virus is a VERY good album IMO.
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I've even come around to Canary Yellow, which I really was initially kinda "Blah" on, but now appreciate and enjoy. Carousel and Messiah complex are both simply outstanding.
I think it's placement makes it sound even better. It flows really well from The Strain and both those songs area a nice break between the two epics.
Yes, the flow is perfect. The drumming at the beginning of Carry Yellow after the fadeout of The Strain is spot-on. Everything about the album is spot-on.
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I've even come around to Canary Yellow, which I really was initially kinda "Blah" on, but now appreciate and enjoy. Carousel and Messiah complex are both simply outstanding.
I think it's placement makes it sound even better. It flows really well from The Strain and both those songs area a nice break between the two epics.
Virus is a VERY good album IMO.
Agreed, the lead into Canary is very good. Something we didn't get to hear when the single was released.
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FWIW, it wasn't announced yet, but Haken had a full US tour lined up for the fall to support Virus. I don't recall the exact timeframe, but they did have a tour get fucked by COVID, on top of the one they were already on.
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FWIW, it wasn't announced yet, but Haken had a full US tour lined up for the fall to support Virus. I don't recall the exact timeframe, but they did have a tour get fucked by COVID, on top of the one they were already on.
SO upset about that tour being cancelled. St. Louis was one of the cities Affinity was going to be played in full. Had our tickets....me, the wife and the boys were ready to go and pumped.....then tour cancelled 6 days before they'd have played here. :censored totally get it but man, that was a tough one to swallow.
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FWIW, it wasn't announced yet, but Haken had a full US tour lined up for the fall to support Virus. I don't recall the exact timeframe, but they did have a tour get fucked by COVID, on top of the one they were already on.
Guess that makes sense that it was in the works, sucks big time. Do you happen to know who they would have been touring with?
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FWIW, it wasn't announced yet, but Haken had a full US tour lined up for the fall to support Virus. I don't recall the exact timeframe, but they did have a tour get fucked by COVID, on top of the one they were already on.
Guess that makes sense that it was in the works, sucks big time. Do you happen to know who they would have been touring with?
Chances are I wouldn't say even if I did know, but I can honestly say I do not know.
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Still hearing cool little nuances. Also getting more comfortable with how the rhythms unfold.
No way any other album tops this for me in 2020. They captured magic in a bottle with this one. Last album that gobsmacked me like this was Ghost Reveries.
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Still hearing cool little nuances. Also getting more comfortable with how the rhythms unfold.
No way any other album tops this for me in 2020. They captured magic in a bottle with this one. Last album that gobsmacked me like this was Ghost Reveries.
I think we're on opposite ends of the spectrum on this one. I have little desire to listen to it. In fact, the only time I hear a song off this album now is when one of my boys picks it on their turn in our car.
I think the music is 'good' and all.....I love HAKEN in general......I just prefer their sound prior to this heavier less melodic kick.
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I revisit it occasionally. I feel better about it than I did during the promo/release date. I don't think it'll end up in my Top 3 this year though, maybe not even Top 5.
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VIRUS is my album of the year. I knew it when I first heard the promo copy and my opinion hasn't changed after 6000 more listens and the release of a buttload of awesome albums since then.
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I like it, but it's my least favorite Haken record.
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Hope they come back to Nashville. They played the 500 capacity Exit-inn last time and hoping they can upgrade to a bit larger venue this time around. Some place with seating would be nice. Last time I stood for all three bands and was wiped at the end.
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Top 5 album for me this year for sure. Maybe number 2 - but I definitely have PANTHER above this which will undoubtedly be my number 1 album this year
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Virus has staying power :metal
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Virus has staying power :metal
clearly :lol
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Agreed. I do hope they change up the sound again for the next album, but these last two albums complement each other wonderfully.
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A song from Virus randomly played in my car a few weeks ago (thanks to the automatic shuffle once I plug my iPhone in) and it occurred to me that it was the first time I had listened to a song from it in months. I can't say I disliked the album, but I wasn't crazy about it, and its shelf life in my rotation was about the same as a carton of milk. Hoping the next album is a return to form.
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Around the time of its release I proclaimed it my Album Of The Year. I haven't listened to it in quite a while now, but I think it has slipped from my top spot, the luster has worn off a bit. It's still in my Top 5 for 2020 though.
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Nothing new. Just wanted to share a neat playlist I made.
1. Sun
2. Deathless
3. Because It's There
4. Lapse
5. Host
6. Canary Yellow
It started from Sun (instrumental) playing on my shuffle. I then thought, "it has a similar vibe to Host", so I played them back to back, and liked the way it sounded. Then, I played Deathless, and thought, hmm...I wonder if Haken has similar songs on all the albums. This is the playlist that I created going chronologically.
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Nothing new. Just wanted to share a neat playlist I made.
1. Sun
2. Deathless
3. Because It's There
4. Lapse
5. Host
6. Canary Yellow
It started from Sun (instrumental) playing on my shuffle. I then thought, "it has a similar vibe to Host", so I played them back to back, and liked the way it sounded. Then, I played Deathless, and thought, hmm...I wonder if Haken has similar songs on all the albums. This is the playlist that I created going chronologically.
Well, might as well...
Deathless / Canary Yellow >>> Sun / Because It's There >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Host / Lapse
I loved Canary Yellow not just as a standalone song when it was released, but more so for its place on the album in lifting up at a critical point when Host and Lapse both took a big chunk out of their respective albums.
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Deathless > Host > Because It's There > Sun > Canary Yellow >>> Lapse
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I think most of these are among the strongest songs on their respective albums (Sun being the main exception, but I hold everything on Aquarius in very high regard), and I'd have a hard time ranking them amongst each other. Really interesting set of tracks.
If I absolutely had to choose a favorite, I think I'd go with Because It's There.
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Host > Lapse > Because It's There > Deathless > Sun > Canary Yellow
which is also pretty close to my ranking of the albums:
Affinity > Vector > Aquarius > The Mountain > Visions > Virus
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Because It's There > Host > Deathless > Sun > Lapse
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Host > Canary Yellow > Lapse > Because it’s there > Deathless > Sun
But in album context Because it’s There is 10/10 perfect midpoint/peak track
For the playlist I’d pop out Lapse and put Red Giant in its place (high similarity to Host and Canary Yellow)
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
Bound By Gravity would like a word with you ;)
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
Bound By Gravity would like a word with you ;)
I totally forgot about that. :facepalm: :lol Why isn't that on here instead? Does it not count because it's the closer?
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
I mean, most of them aren't really ballads (come on, Host is epic), the only ones I'd sort of describe that way are Because It's There and Canary Yellow. But I thought the connection was more about them being moody and slower/quieter, and on that basis I agree the Lapse is an odd inclusion. I'd say Red Giant is the better fit really.
Also where is Earthlings ffs?
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
Bound By Gravity would like a word with you ;)
Best song on the album. Criminally underrated.
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
Bound By Gravity would like a word with you ;)
I totally forgot about that. :facepalm: :lol Why isn't that on here instead? Does it not count because it's the closer?
It's not on here because It's a playlist I made.
The way I make playlists is the songs have a sense of similarity, either with the music, lyrics, structure, rhythm, or vocals. Here I found out, these Haken songs, all are similar in either of those ways. They're jazzy, songs about Death/Renewed-Life, and flow into each other well.
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
Bound By Gravity would like a word with you ;)
Best song on the album. Criminally underrated.
Raise your hand if you've seen it live.
o/
:D
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
Bound By Gravity would like a word with you ;)
Best song on the album. Criminally underrated.
Raise your hand if you've seen it live.
o/
:D
Raise your hand if you've seen Aquarium live
o/
(I know that wasn't the point, but at least I beat you in something Haken live setlist related) :D
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Raise your hand if you've seen Haken live
o/
Because that's how high the bar is currently set for me, only saw them once and had to travel for it. :P
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
Bound By Gravity would like a word with you ;)
Best song on the album. Criminally underrated.
Raise your hand if you've seen it live.
o/
:D
Raise your hand if you've seen Aquarium live
o/
(I know that wasn't the point, but at least I beat you in something Haken live setlist related) :D
To be fair, people do not have a hard time beating me in that department, despite the number of shows I've seen because:
1. I never got to see them in the early days in Europe, or their first PP appearance, meaning I have not seen a lot from the debut.
2. I did not see the PP show where they played Visions in full, so am missing some songs off of that album.
3. The only cruise they've been on that I've missed was the one they played The Mountain in full on, so still missing a song or two from that.
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
Bound By Gravity would like a word with you ;)
Best song on the album. Criminally underrated.
Raise your hand if you've seen it live.
o/
:D
Raise your hand if you've seen Aquarium live
o/
(I know that wasn't the point, but at least I beat you in something Haken live setlist related) :D
Alright then.
Raise your hand if you've seen Africa by Toto by Haken live.
o/
:biggrin:
#edit: in the front row.
:biggrin:
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Also where is Earthlings ffs?
in the trash ;) :P
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
Bound By Gravity would like a word with you ;)
Best song on the album. Criminally underrated.
Raise your hand if you've seen it live.
o/
:D
Raise your hand if you've seen Aquarium live
o/
(I know that wasn't the point, but at least I beat you in something Haken live setlist related) :D
Alright then.
Raise your hand if you've seen Africa by Toto by Haken live.
o/
:biggrin:
#edit: in the front row.
:biggrin:
I mean...
o/
To both points.
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All y'all ranking Lapse last fill me with disappointment. Though to be fair it doesn't really belong with the other songs here IMO; it's the closest Affinity has to a "ballad" I suppose but it's a lot more upbeat and dynamic.
Bound By Gravity would like a word with you ;)
Best song on the album. Criminally underrated.
Raise your hand if you've seen it live.
o/
:D
Raise your hand if you've seen Aquarium live
o/
(I know that wasn't the point, but at least I beat you in something Haken live setlist related) :D
Alright then.
Raise your hand if you've seen Africa by Toto by Haken live.
o/
:biggrin:
#edit: in the front row.
:biggrin:
I mean...
o/
To both points.
Don't tell me how to win this fight. Isn't your life! It isn't your right to take the only thing that's mine!!1!!!!
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Alright then.
Raise your hand if you've seen Africa by Toto by Haken live.
o/
:biggrin:
#edit: in the front row.
:biggrin:
o/
They played that song in Mexico as well, but they played it because Richard's keyboard was not working before starting "Celestial Elixir" so the rest of the band was improvising and they played Africa... and I was in the front row!
I had to share this because most of you would beat me in the Haken-live department since I've only seem them live twice.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ESPqjLZXsAAmhk2?format=jpg&name=large)
:metal :metal
Well, this did happen in 2020 so....
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I saw them open for Devin Townsend in March of 2020. Oh wait, no I didn't. Darn pandemic. I still have tickets for that show though. I wonder if they'll play?
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We're pleased to announce that the elusive YELLOW VINYL is available NOW. But be quick because there are only 100 copies available!!
Shop: www.omerch.com/shop/haken
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I saw them open for Devin Townsend in March of 2020. Oh wait, no I didn't. Darn pandemic. I still have tickets for that show though. I wonder if they'll play?
Me, My wife and three sons were set to see them play in St. Louis where they were going to play all of Affinity.....then, six days before the show everything was cancelled and that was that :'(
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I saw them open for Devin Townsend in March of 2020. Oh wait, no I didn't. Darn pandemic. I still have tickets for that show though. I wonder if they'll play?
Me, My wife and three sons were set to see them play in St. Louis where they were going to play all of Affinity.....then, six days before the show everything was cancelled and that was that :'(
Same tix for both Stl and Pittsburg to see the Affinity shows... oh well at that time we had no idea their next release was so soon and it’s one of the best of the year
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I'm revisiting VIRUS on vinyl right now. Yeah, this is by far the best album released this year...
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Interestingly Haken is pretty much the only band that I've liked less over the years. I bought every album up until Vector, but wasn't enjoying that as much as the previous albums. Virus is just not my cup of tea at all. Apparently most fans are very happy with how they're sounding right now, but to me the change has not been for the better. I guess I'm the weird one, but they really sound very different now than some years back.
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To be fair, people do not have a hard time beating me in that department, despite the number of shows I've seen because:
1. I never got to see them in the early days in Europe, or their first PP appearance, meaning I have not seen a lot from the debut.
2. I did not see the PP show where they played Visions in full, so am missing some songs off of that album.
3. The only cruise they've been on that I've missed was the one they played The Mountain in full on, so still missing a song or two from that.
Oh, alright. In that case, I do beat you in a lot of stuff, because I've seen them at least once on every European tour since 2010. I think the list of songs I haven't seen them play is quite short and contains mainly stuff they have rarely done anyway.
Let's just try to figure it out. I think (omitting Virus for obvious reasons) these are the only songs I haven't seen them play:
Sun (only one known performance)
Because It's There
Somebody
Darkest Light
Earthlings (no performances ever)
Lapse (only three performances ever)
Bound by Gravity (only two performances ever)
Host (no performances ever)
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I love Vector and Virus, but they are indeed different. Though I expect the to change again on the next release.
Anyone who would like something closer to older material should.check out Hen's solo album. Criminally underrepresented, not comparable to typical guitarist solo albums a la Petrucci.
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I love Vector and Virus, but they are indeed different. Though I expect the to change again on the next release.
Anyone who would like something closer to older material should.check out Hen's solo album. Criminally underrepresented, not comparable to typical guitarist solo albums a la Petrucci.
I love The Cocoon by Hen, but I don't think it sounds anything like Haken's earlier material (though the majority of all albums up to The Mountain were written by him). I think, the jazzy/weird/djenty/staccato stuff is more present on that album than on any Haken album, but the music is just not that heavy (if that makes sense).
Fantastic album; I'm one of 100 proud owners of its vinyl edition too (I have yet to get it signed though) :)
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Yes, I was focused on the heaviness. It's definitely jazzier than Haken has ever been.
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I wouldn't call The Cocoon 'jazz' at all, but this is also partly because using the word 'jazzy' to describe music which isn't jazz kind of rubs me the wrong way. No offense meant though, perhaps I'm pretentious :lol
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I wouldn't call The Cocoon 'jazz' at all, but this is also partly because using the word 'jazzy' to describe music which isn't jazz kind of rubs me the wrong way. No offense meant though, perhaps I'm pretentious :lol
If I thought the music was actual jazz, I would have used the actual word jazz instead of jazzy ;) While listening to an album by Dave Brubeck, I would never think of saying "wow that's jazzy". I use this word to express that music of another genre features jazz influences.
And I think The Cocoon does have those influences, especially when it comes to harmonies/voicings and lines.
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Interestingly Haken is pretty much the only band that I've liked less over the years. I bought every album up until Vector, but wasn't enjoying that as much as the previous albums. Virus is just not my cup of tea at all. Apparently most fans are very happy with how they're sounding right now, but to me the change has not been for the better. I guess I'm the weird one, but they really sound very different now than some years back.
I'm 100% in the same boat as you. Vector was good but not their best style change imo, and Virus completely killed the band for me.
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i've been spinning this one for a bit and i've come to a conclusion:
this is the new worst haken album. idk this probably isn;t fundamentally weaker than vector, which i still liked, but god it's just so BORING. there's nothing fresh or exciting about it and not even any good songs to dig into, the shorter length tracks are all completely interchangeable, the epic is a mess, carousel is genuinely the only interesting song on the entire record and even then it doesn't hold a candle to their best stuff
y'all are insane calling this the best album of the year i don't get it :lol
that novena album earlier in the year was really good though?
anyways haken ranking
the mountain
aquarius
affinity
vector
visions
virus
they only have two really good albums in their discography and the last one was released in 2013 it might be time to give up on this band lol
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Well, move on? I don't think it's boring at all. Album of the year for me. I understand people might like the heavy direction, but the epic is far from a mess or boring.
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I wouldn't describe Virus as boring, but as melodically uninteresting. Every time I listened to it, it would end and I would have almost no memory of what I had just heard. The melodies just aren't strong at all.
I won't say I am giving up on this band, but they are starting to trend down, which is a bit concerning.
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y'all are insane calling this the best album of the year i don't get it :lol
ditto
anyways haken ranking
#1. Affinity
#2. Vector
#3. The Mountain
#4. Aquarius
#5. Visions
#6. Virus
Though really, Virus has really chipped away my interest in the band's other material. Affinity is the only Haken album I truly enjoy beginning to end nowadays. :-\
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I wouldn't describe Virus as boring, but as melodically uninteresting. Every time I listened to it, it would end and I would have almost no memory of what I had just heard. The melodies just aren't strong at all.
I won't say I am giving up on this band, but they are starting to trend down, which is a bit concerning.
This! Messiah Complex is really the only song I can remember some great melodies from.
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I wouldn't describe Virus as boring, but as melodically uninteresting. Every time I listened to it, it would end and I would have almost no memory of what I had just heard. The melodies just aren't strong at all.
I won't say I am giving up on this band, but they are starting to trend down, which is a bit concerning.
This! Messiah Complex is really the only song I can remember some great melodies from.
I'm not in any way suggesting that your opinions are wrong or inferior, but I just can't relate to them at all. I think melodically the album is a little less immediate than Vector (though let's be honest, Haken's melodies have never been that immediate), but a lot stronger, and I would say that Invasion, The Strain and Canary Yellow are where the album really shines melodically.
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I wouldn't describe Virus as boring, but as melodically uninteresting. Every time I listened to it, it would end and I would have almost no memory of what I had just heard. The melodies just aren't strong at all.
I won't say I am giving up on this band, but they are starting to trend down, which is a bit concerning.
I'm right there with you. I dug Vector because it was a bit heavier.......but at least there was still a full band at play and there were the nuances that made Haken...HAKEN....for me. Virus drowns out all keyboard efforts and places Ross in a position where his vocals seem out of place for the majority of the songs.
It's good, skillful music....very technical and it does 'sound' good for the most part.....but for me....it's just not Haken. At least not the Haken that I had grown to love. Haken for me is the more melodic, progressive, atmospheric sound of their first few albums. Every member is an intricate part of the sound and they craft beautiful stories as songs.
Virus is just heavy metal with a splash of 'progressive' rock thrown in....most of the heavier sounds they're performing I've heard in other places....it's not original at all. For me it feels like they're trying to be something they're not.
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I love how the vocals on Virus contrast with the riffs.
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I'm starting to think you guys are all high...
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I wouldn't describe Virus as boring, but as melodically uninteresting. Every time I listened to it, it would end and I would have almost no memory of what I had just heard. The melodies just aren't strong at all.
I won't say I am giving up on this band, but they are starting to trend down, which is a bit concerning.
This! Messiah Complex is really the only song I can remember some great melodies from.
I'm not in any way suggesting that your opinions are wrong or inferior, but I just can't relate to them at all. I think melodically the album is a little less immediate than Vector (though let's be honest, Haken's melodies have never been that immediate), but a lot stronger, and I would say that Invasion, The Strain and Canary Yellow are where the album really shines melodically.
Haha and that's what strange about music. Invasion just sounds uninteresting to me and even comes of as uninspired. The chorus is actually just irritating. Yellow is at least the best of the rest (i.e. excluding Messiah Complex) but still just background music at best. Maybe sounds harsh but I can't get how any of these songs will go down as Haken classics. Puzzle Box from Vector is just another league and still not remarkable in the overall discography, but at least highly enjoyable.
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Invasion and The Strain are my favourites from the album, but I'd still say it's their second weakest record after Visions.
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How can one listen to The Strain and say there's no melody on this album?
To each their own. I'm close to thinking Virus is my favorite Haken album. I may have to wait until I see these songs live before I say that though. But then again, I have Visions as my favorite and here it seems most aren't that big of fans of it. I have no issue admitting I like the more "metal" Haken generally.
Anyway, where's Diego? :lol Funny how quiet that has become but I guess it's because of no touring that there's no need to address the elephant in the room.
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After letting this settle for a bit I'd rank accordingly:
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Aquarius
4. Visions
5. Vector
6. Virus
Vector and Virus are basically ranked as equal 5th though, I like Vector more, by the smallest margin. I definitely enjoy Virus but the rest of their albums are just so strong! I think for me there is a big dip in quality from Affinity to Vector/Virus. Virus is in my top 10 albums of the year though.
I guess I loved Haken's progression, and change of direction, each album up until Affinity. I feel that was their creative peak and I love it. I totally have faith that they could release something that I will adore next :lol
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My rankings are probably the same as the last time I brought it up.
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Vector
4. Aquarius
5. Virus
6. Visions
Affinity and Vector are basically tied. I find it interesting that my bottom two Haken albums contain my Top 2 Haken songs (Messiah Complex and Visions)...
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I wouldn't describe Virus as boring, but as melodically uninteresting. Every time I listened to it, it would end and I would have almost no memory of what I had just heard. The melodies just aren't strong at all.
I won't say I am giving up on this band, but they are starting to trend down, which is a bit concerning.
They've never been a favorite of mine, but I've checked out every one of their albums and this is exactly how I've felt about all of them. Generally, I enjoy them when I listen to them, but I rarely make it all the way through one of their albums and I never feel like I need to revisit them. It's probably the lack of melodies that I find compelling or moving. There are plenty of melodies, to be sure, they're just not melodies that I find particularly memorable.
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My rankings:
1. The Mountain
2. Virus
3= Vector
3= Affinity
5. Restoration
6. Visions
7. Aquarius
I've had a renewed love for Affinity which has brought it up to tie with Vector in third place. The middle of The Architect still really, really drags for me, but there's so much wonderful stuff on the album (including other parts of that song).
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How can one listen to The Strain and say there's no melody on this album?
Just to be correct, I don't think anyone argues that the songs lack melodies, just that the melodies aren't very inspiring / interesting. But def to each their own!
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Anyway, where's Diego? :lol Funny how quiet that has become but I guess it's because of no touring that there's no need to address the elephant in the room.
Last time I checked, none of the other band members or even the band account itself followed him on Instagram (yeah, I was bored :lol).
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I wouldn't describe Virus as boring, but as melodically uninteresting. Every time I listened to it, it would end and I would have almost no memory of what I had just heard. The melodies just aren't strong at all.
I won't say I am giving up on this band, but they are starting to trend down, which is a bit concerning.
I'm right there with you. I dug Vector because it was a bit heavier.......but at least there was still a full band at play and there were the nuances that made Haken...HAKEN....for me. Virus drowns out all keyboard efforts and places Ross in a position where his vocals seem out of place for the majority of the songs.
It's good, skillful music....very technical and it does 'sound' good for the most part.....but for me....it's just not Haken. At least not the Haken that I had grown to love. Haken for me is the more melodic, progressive, atmospheric sound of their first few albums. Every member is an intricate part of the sound and they craft beautiful stories as songs.
Virus is just heavy metal with a splash of 'progressive' rock thrown in....most of the heavier sounds they're performing I've heard in other places....it's not original at all. For me it feels like they're trying to be something they're not.
Well said.
How can one listen to The Strain and say there's no melody on this album?
Just to be correct, I don't think anyone argues that the songs lack melodies, just that the melodies aren't very inspiring / interesting. But def to each their own!
Exactly. "Melodically uninteresting" was my description. And any scan of my posts in this thread from 4-5 years ago will show that this band was a tough mountain for me to climb, largely because of Ross' vocals, but the melodies were so strong and interesting back then that I kept going back to listen and eventually his voice grew on me.
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this is a problem with a lot of prog metal bands in the 2010's but their riffing has gotten super flat too. chugging on open notes with the occasional other note and no sense of groove does not a good riff make y'all. i can't even really point to a specific song bcuz off the top of my head almost every song on virus has this problem lol, yet they're all so interchangeable i couldn't tell you which riff comes from where, or even remember most of the riffs
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this is a problem with a lot of prog metal bands in the 2010's but their riffing has gotten super flat too. chugging on open notes with the occasional other note and no sense of groove does not a good riff make y'all. i can't even really point to a specific song bcuz off the top of my head almost every song on virus has this problem lol, yet they're all so interchangeable i couldn't tell you which riff comes from where, or even remember most of the riffs
No sense of groove at all? There's so many great grooves on this record, it's insane. And the songs on there are everything but interchangeable.
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I said this earlier, but it’s relevant to the discussion, so I’ll repeat it here:
I was actually very disappointed with Vector. Which was sad really, because I am of the opinion that Haken has the greatest “opening 4” albums in prog rock history, and possibly of any genre period. Only PoS was close, and I really wanted them to make it 5 out of the gate. So it was very disappointing to be so underwhelmed by Vector.
But Virus is outstanding, and the way it ties together with Vector has elevated them both. I spent quite some time listening to them back to back, and I’ve come to the conclusion that I think it was a mistake to release them separately. The concept works better as a double album, and if they had done that, I would have considered it a masterpiece. Most double concept albums are very front loaded. If this had been released as a single album, it would have been made even better by having “Act II” be stronger than “Act I”.
But since it is what it is, I still think Virus makes Vector a better album. I now think they have the greatest opening 6 albums in all of music, and might be set to surpass even DT as my 2nd all time favorite band.
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I love Vector and Virus, but they are indeed different. Though I expect the to change again on the next release.
Anyone who would like something closer to older material should.check out Hen's solo album. Criminally underrepresented, not comparable to typical guitarist solo albums a la Petrucci.
I love The Cocoon by Hen, but I don't think it sounds anything like Haken's earlier material (though the majority of all albums up to The Mountain were written by him). I think, the jazzy/weird/djenty/staccato stuff is more present on that album than on any Haken album, but the music is just not that heavy (if that makes sense).
Fantastic album; I'm one of 100 proud owners of its vinyl edition too (I have yet to get it signed though) :)
I am really digging the Cocoon album. This one took a few listens and has grown. I liked that the upload in youtube is no commercials and he actually participates in the comments.
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From Haken's Facebook just a few minutes ago:
Who’s ready for some good news tomorrow?!
https://www.facebook.com/100044565693628/posts/245166716978850/
WHAT COULD IT MEAN?!?
-Marc.
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New keyboard player
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New keyboard player
Would that really qualify as "good news" for most fans?
Edit - their page started liking replies to the post but they skipped one comment - "is diego back?"
-Marc.
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I don't know, they're going to have to address it at some point.
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New keyboard player
Would that really qualify as "good news" for most fans?
Edit - their page started liking replies to the post but they skipped one comment - "is diego back?"
-Marc.
I'm not sure that would be considered good news either as they've never officially stated he has left. If they did, then I'd agree that the announcement of a new player would be considered good news, but if they just announce Diego has been replaced, that's going to be met with a lot of ??? ???
I don't know, they're going to have to address it at some point.
I believe they would have if 2020 didn't go to shit because they would have toured and it would have been obvious. I guess not touring has bought them a lot of time to figure this out.
Although if they said something like, we had some issues with Diego but we worked them out and he IS in the band, I think that also would constitute good news.
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If I have to guess I would say it's nothing related to Diego. But a vinyl repress for old albums.
I went to their store and found these:
(https://i.ibb.co/hVcpW76/Captura-de-pantalla-2021-01-14-183923.png)
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I'm about here right now......
#1. Affinity
#2. Virus
#3T. Aquarius
#3T. The Mountain
#5. Visions
#6. Vector
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If I have to guess I would say it's nothing related to Diego. But a vinyl repress for old albums.
I went to their store and found these:
(https://i.ibb.co/hVcpW76/Captura-de-pantalla-2021-01-14-183923.png)
OK, this IS good news... nice find.
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Maybe Restoration II?!
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I have the black Mountain in my collection, but I had to pre-order this overpriced marbled version from my buddies from Haken :lol
The clear Affinity version is also sitting on my shelf, so I didn't buy this marbled version. (or was this a mistake???)
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But I already have those albums :neverusethis:
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If I have to guess I would say it's nothing related to Diego. But a vinyl repress for old albums.
I went to their store and found these:
(https://i.ibb.co/hVcpW76/Captura-de-pantalla-2021-01-14-183923.png)
Interesting. I'm not a vinyl collector, but those t-shirts look nice. I got the Transformers-looking one last summer and it's really great! That vaporwave-y Affinity shirt looks nice as well!
I'll be honest, I was kind of hoping for band news or music news, but at least this isn't BAD news.
-Marc.
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https://www.facebook.com/100044565693628/posts/263629718465883/ (https://www.facebook.com/100044565693628/posts/263629718465883/)
"Prognosis Festival 2022 lineup announcement. We’re going to play a special set: Vector and Virus back to back in their entirety. Looking forward to seeing y’all there!"
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I wouldn't describe Virus as boring, but as melodically uninteresting. Every time I listened to it, it would end and I would have almost no memory of what I had just heard. The melodies just aren't strong at all.
I won't say I am giving up on this band, but they are starting to trend down, which is a bit concerning.
This is how I have felt about Haken since the first album. Very, very talented group of guys who write some really complex but largely unmemorable music. I will say, though, that Cockroach King song from a previous album was stuck in my head for MONTHS. :lol
I always download their albums through Amazon.com when they come out and like you I listen but when it's over I can't really remember any of it, nor do I ever feel particularly interested in hearing it again. I listened to "Virus" maybe 5 or 6 times - impressed by the chops, but not really moved by the music at all.
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https://www.facebook.com/100044565693628/posts/263629718465883/ (https://www.facebook.com/100044565693628/posts/263629718465883/)
"Prognosis Festival 2022 lineup announcement. We’re going to play a special set: Vector and Virus back to back in their entirety. Looking forward to seeing y’all there!"
Will Diego be there, though? :lol
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I wouldn't describe Virus as boring, but as melodically uninteresting. Every time I listened to it, it would end and I would have almost no memory of what I had just heard. The melodies just aren't strong at all.
I won't say I am giving up on this band, but they are starting to trend down, which is a bit concerning.
This is how I have felt about Haken since the first album. Very, very talented group of guys who write some really complex but largely unmemorable music. I will say, though, that Cockroach King song from a previous album was stuck in my head for MONTHS. :lol
I always download their albums through Amazon.com when they come out and like you I listen but when it's over I can't really remember any of it, nor do I ever feel particularly interested in hearing it again. I listened to "Virus" maybe 5 or 6 times - impressed by the chops, but not really moved by the music at all.
I get that regarding Virus and chunks of Vector, but not the first four albums. The first four albums are all pretty great, although it took me a bit of time to get into the band in general (re-read this whole thread if you are bored for some epic fail posts by me from 4-5 years ago :lol), so Virus could always grab me once I get back to it. I just haven't had the urge to revisit it since it was a miss for me last summer/fall.
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Can’t wrap my head around not finding Visions memorable or melodic.
It’s not my favorite album of theirs by any stretch, but it is the one that most often gets melodies stuck in my head. Especially the Premonition overture intro piece. And then the Mind’s Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter trilogy, which goes into the absolutely gorgeous Deathless.
In fact, that 4 song run might be my favorite (musically speaking) song grouping of all time from them. But I can see where the title track kind of jumps around a bit. I remember bits of it, but it doesn’t flow as well as their other epics like Crystallized IMO.
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https://www.facebook.com/100044565693628/posts/263629718465883/ (https://www.facebook.com/100044565693628/posts/263629718465883/)
"Prognosis Festival 2022 lineup announcement. We’re going to play a special set: Vector and Virus back to back in their entirety. Looking forward to seeing y’all there!"
Will Diego be there, though? :lol
Don't bet on it
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https://www.facebook.com/100044565693628/posts/263629718465883/ (https://www.facebook.com/100044565693628/posts/263629718465883/)
"Prognosis Festival 2022 lineup announcement. We’re going to play a special set: Vector and Virus back to back in their entirety. Looking forward to seeing y’all there!"
Ugh, 2022 is gonna be rough. I have a shit ton of time off this year with what my company let us carryover, but no clue if I'll be in the same boat in 2022. That being said that year will already have, at minimum, a cruise to the edge, an Ayreon show, and now it looks like a Vector/Virus show, if not here then somewhere.
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Has there been anything else than fan-made rumors that indicate turmoil between Diego and the rest of the band? None of the members have actually said anything, or did I miss something?
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[Edit: removed the link because some info on it might be used to dox the members, but I have evidence & can DM it to people who want it.]
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That would suck big time. I wonder when they will say something about this and if Diego is still doing the next tour with them.
Still, I remain in denial. Haken is THE dream team in the music business for me right now.
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Roine's never said anything about Bodin leaving The Flower Kings, which is the massive elephant in the room regarding that band. If nothing else, the official statement will come when the next album comes out and Diego isn't on the credits.
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Aaaand, since that's my hometown, I'm basically going.
See you there, Nick!
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Aaaand, since that's my hometown, I'm basically going.
See you there, Nick!
Wait a minute, I just saw that this is in NL. I don't know why but I just presumed this was somewhere in the US.
This is the weekend of Easter.
Vector and Virus back to back?
Count me in :metal
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To those who frequent the festival, do the tickets usually sell out fast? I plan to wait a little bit to see how the Covid situation goes. I've got tickets for this year's ProgPower Europe in NL (actually last year's but you know), and if that happens and I get my visa, it should still be valid for spring 2022. So I may actually go and see this if it's still possible to secure the tickets mid-October this year.
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I've visited all editions of the festival (1, in 2019) and that one was sold-out to the point where it became impossible to see some of the bands. For example they programmed Soen on a smaller stage in between the main stage sets of Haken and Leprous, to many people's chagrin.
Honestly, I have no idea how fast this will go. The 2020 edition wasn't sold out beforehand and almost actually happened, but I'm not sure what this one will do. I can imagine many people sitting out until they're sure the festival can actually continue as planned.
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Ugh, 2022 is gonna be rough. I have a shit ton of time off this year with what my company let us carryover, but no clue if I'll be in the same boat in 2022. That being said that year will already have, at minimum, a cruise to the edge, an Ayreon show, and now it looks like a Vector/Virus show, if not here then somewhere.
Hoping to hear Vector / Virus sets on Cruise to the Edge in April 2022. Typical sets on the cruise are about 75 min and there are 2 sets. Play Vector at first set and encores. Virus for 2nd and encores. Would be awesome. Heck, I will even write their set lists:
Day 1:
Vector
1985
Falling Back to Earth
Day 2:
Virus
Cockroach King
Architect
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[Edit: removed the link because some info on it might be used to dox the members, but I have evidence & can DM it to people who want it.]
nobloodyname, your inbox is full, dummy
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Enough is out there publically at this point that I feel comfortable stating that Diego is 100% out of the band. Won't comment further on anything else about why at this time.
That said I have no inside knowledge of if they've even started the search for a replacement, and if so who that might be, so I'm excitedly looking forward to finding out who that will be. One thing about COVID is it bought them time to make that decision that usually wouldn't be there.
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Enough is out there publically at this point that I feel comfortable stating that Diego is 100% out of the band. Won't comment further on anything else about why at this time.
That said I have no inside knowledge of if they've even started the search for a replacement, and if so who that might be, so I'm excitedly looking forward to finding out who that will be. One thing about COVID is it bought them time to make that decision that usually wouldn't be there.
Damn. :( :(
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Enough is out there publically at this point that I feel comfortable stating that Diego is 100% out of the band. Won't comment further on anything else about why at this time.
That said I have no inside knowledge of if they've even started the search for a replacement, and if so who that might be, so I'm excitedly looking forward to finding out who that will be. One thing about COVID is it bought them time to make that decision that usually wouldn't be there.
Yeah, it was pretty obvious anyway, as he did NOTHING to promote Virus (rightfully so, I hated the album :lol).
What I find interesting is that none of them has said anything officially, there might still be some legal stuff going on behind the scenes.
As for who might replace him, is Peter Jones still available? (Looking at you, Rich).
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What I find interesting is that none of them has said anything officially, there might still be some legal stuff going on behind the scenes.
I'm afraid I don't know as much as people would like me too, and haven't actually talked to anyone from the band about it so all I have is second-hand tidbits. But I do get the impression that they want to announce something but can't because there's some sort of legal stuff that isn't resolved yet. I know some people feel annoyed that they've said nothing, but I can't fathom any situation where they would choose to keep something like that back unless they had to.
As for who might replace him, is Peter Jones still available? (Looking at you, Rich).
It should go without saying that I would love love love for this to happen. :lol But I don't know if would, I mean Pete has a full-time job currently. If at some point it looks like it's a possibility, I'll obviously be doing what I can to try and influence it to happen. :P
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I'm available! But I'm a terrible piano player :)
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I play a mean triangle though.
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I play a mean triangle though.
Don't laugh about triangle players! They're usually studied percussionists and sometimes they have to wait 243 bars until their part comes and if they miss that exact moment, they fuck up 100% of their job :lol
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I play a mean triangle though.
Don't laugh about triangle players! They're usually studied percussionists and sometimes they have to wait 243 bars until their part comes and if they miss that exact moment, they fuck up 100% of their job :lol
:lol
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I feel like there is some context missing in this announcement that Diego is out. Was there some kind of incident or have there been some kind of public feuding between him and others in the group? Someone mentioned that he did nothing to promote "Virus" so there must have been a reason for that, right? I'm assuming there was already some tension for some reason that hasn't been stated here. Am I on the right track here?
I'm just curious because you all seem to be almost expecting this.
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Could be he didn't like the direction they're were going, "Creative/Personal reasons/differences" and decided to stay to record the album and tour. And now the Tour never happened, the legal stuff could be working out what to do since that tour was cancelled.
Could be they found their Keyboardists and are just waiting for this legal stuff to get settled And it's likely a longer process now due to delays and all this fun stuff.
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The point that it seems legally related makes me think something about copyright or writing credits. Just a guess though, I've got no idea.
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I'd be willing to wager that Diego is a member of Devin's next band project. Climbing up the ranks of mid-tier prog metal, then. :laugh:
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Haken has been a case of diminishing returns for me. I got into them shortly after Visions came out. I bought those first 2 albums, loved them, prefer Aquarius the most. I forget how, but I contacted them at some point because I wanted a copy of their old demo and they sent it to me, along with all kinds of stuff like business cards, stickers, etc... I liked the demo as well, I thought this was going to be a favorite new, young band. I was so pumped for The Mountain, but when it came out, I felt underwhelmed. Restoration EP was pretty cool, so I thought maybe they'd get back on track with the next album, but while I liked a couple of the songs, I wasn't into Affinity all that much. The last two albums, let's just say, not my cup of tea. I'm not saying I want them to recreate their first 2 albums, but I just don't care for the direction they've gone in especially the last 2 albums, and I always felt like they deserved a stronger singer as well, especially considering he doesn't play anything.
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I'd be willing to wager that Diego is a member of Devin's next band project. Climbing up the ranks of mid-tier prog metal, then. :laugh:
And then he will come crawling back to Haken when Devin breaks that project up.
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Could be he didn't like the direction they're were going, "Creative/Personal reasons/differences" and decided to stay to record the album and tour. And now the Tour never happened, the legal stuff could be working out what to do since that tour was cancelled.
He did make a comment like "this is what Clear would've sounded like if other creative choices were made" or something along those lines. He also was nowhere to be found on Virus (I know he's in there, but he was given almost no room to do anything interesting on the album, it's like he's Jason Newsted on ...And Justice for All, he's there, but he isn't). They could've hired a session keyboardist and the result would've been almost the same.
I'd be willing to wager that Diego is a member of Devin's next band project. Climbing up the ranks of mid-tier prog metal, then. :laugh:
The problem with that is that nobody, except Dev, is a permanent member of Devin's band(s).
Ninja'd by Cramx3.
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Devin has been working on a few projects, his Puzzle album and also a music for a TV show (I think, he's kind of vague on details) but those projects definitely sound like something he could use Diego's skill set for, but he hasn't (that I noticed) said anything about Diego. Could be he also just won't talk about it until Haken does, but I could totally see Diego working with Devin in the future, but I don't see that being a reason to leave Haken because he likely won't ever be stable with Devin unless there's some sort of deal between them to keep him along for Devin's wild ride through life which just doesn't make sense either given the way Devin ended the DTP due to not wanting to pay people who wouldn't be involved in his next project.
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Could be he didn't like the direction they're were going, "Creative/Personal reasons/differences" and decided to stay to record the album and tour. And now the Tour never happened, the legal stuff could be working out what to do since that tour was cancelled.
He did make a comment like "this is what Clear would've sounded like if other creative choices were made" or something along those lines. He also was nowhere to be found on Virus (I know he's in there, but he was given almost no room to do anything interesting on the album, it's like he's Jason Newsted on ...And Justice for All, he's there, but he isn't). They could've hired a session keyboardist and the result would've been almost the same.
I'd be willing to wager that Diego is a member of Devin's next band project. Climbing up the ranks of mid-tier prog metal, then. :laugh:
The problem with that is that nobody, except Dev, is a permanent member of Devin's band(s).
Ninja'd by Cramx3.
Oh yeah. Forgot about that post. I should try and find it and listen to it.
Seems his ideas were likely shot down enough to where he could have said "Enough of this, I'm recording this and I'm out."
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Seems his ideas were likely shot down enough to where he could have said "Enough of this, I'm recording this and I'm out."
And he probably only recorded the album because of contractual reasons. Something similar happened with Kevin Moore and DT, he recorded Awake and then he was out.
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Considering Diego is like not even audible on the album, I don't see the purpose of that, but it's plausible.
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Considering Diego is like not even audible on the album, I don't see the purpose of that, but it's plausible.
He is...It's just not the tones you expect to hear.
https://youtu.be/hyPQCRcrpUM
Seems his ideas were likely shot down enough to where he could have said "Enough of this, I'm recording this and I'm out."
And he probably only recorded the album because of contractual reasons. Something similar happened with Kevin Moore and DT, he recorded Awake and then he was out.
I could see this...Agreeing to complete the album and record the tones and things you didn't want to and then said once I do record I am out.
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Considering Diego is like not even audible on the album, I don't see the purpose of that, but it's plausible.
He is...It's just not the tones you expect to hear.
https://youtu.be/hyPQCRcrpUM
I thought we were talking about Virus, he's definitely audible on Vector. Especially in this song. I actually watched my own recording of this song the other night and really enjoy watching Diego play. He's got a lot of energy and stage presence for a keyboard player. I also enjoy watching him on the Devin Townsend live album, especially when he's serving drinks :lol
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He had lots of stage presence and, um, instrumental presence on Vector tour. He's also very present on the actual Vector album.
Virus, yeah, that's a different story.
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I play a mean triangle though.
Yea but Haken albums need more COWBELL!!! :metal :metal :metal
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Seems his ideas were likely shot down enough to where he could have said "Enough of this, I'm recording this and I'm out."
Yep, to me that is the big question at this point: were his ideas getting shot down and he left because he felt the keys and his input were becoming less important, or was he leaving anyway and that is why his contributions on Virus were limited (relative to all prior Haken records)?
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Considering Diego is like not even audible on the album, I don't see the purpose of that, but it's plausible.
He is...It's just not the tones you expect to hear.
https://youtu.be/hyPQCRcrpUM
I thought we were talking about Virus, he's definitely audible on Vector. Especially in this song. I actually watched my own recording of this song the other night and really enjoy watching Diego play. He's got a lot of energy and stage presence for a keyboard player. I also enjoy watching him on the Devin Townsend live album, especially when he's serving drinks :lol
:lol
The Virus only part totally went past my head.
Yeah, i can hear that. Need to listen to it again, haven't since a while.
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[Edit: removed the link because some info on it might be used to dox the members, but I have evidence & can DM it to people who want it.]
nobloodyname, your inbox is full, dummy
So it is! Fixed ;D
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You know what I have just realized reading the lyrics to Falling Back to Earth? It isn't "for countless years I have been longing to a power jazz, power jazz".
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You know what I have just realized reading the lyrics to Falling Back to Earth? It isn't "for countless years I have been longing to a power jazz, power jazz".
My second favourite lyric, only behind "non-stop purple force" :lol
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You know what I have just realized reading the lyrics to Falling Back to Earth? It isn't "for countless years I have been longing to a power jazz, power jazz".
My second favourite lyric, only behind "non-stop purple force" :lol
As far as I am concerned, this is the correct lyric, I don't care what anyone says.
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The most prominent Diego is on Virus is the second half of the middle instrumental section of Carousel. BAM...BAM BAM...BAM BAM BAM BAM... in the background of the guitar solo while Ray's on the quieter snare.
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The most prominent Diego is on Virus is the second half of the middle instrumental section of Carousel. BAM...BAM BAM...BAM BAM BAM BAM... in the background of the guitar solo while Ray's on the quieter snare.
And, you know, the entirety of Canary Yellow, the whole The Sect apart of Messiah Complex (including a solo) and a bunch of other spots as well.
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Not sure if this has been posted before, but the people on Haken’s subreddit found the band’s business under a different name on the government website. The whole band is listed as an LLP Designated Member except for Diego, who is listed as ‘Resigned’. I couldn’t see him being in the band anyway but I think this confirms it.
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/OC421678/officers
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Not sure if this has been posted before, but the people on Haken’s subreddit found the band’s business under a different name on the government website. The whole band is listed as an LLP Designated Member except for Diego, who is listed as ‘Resigned’. I couldn’t see him being in the band anyway but I think this confirms it.
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/OC421678/officers
Kinda. I opted to make it private but it was what I was alluding to here:
[Edit: removed the link because some info on it might be used to dox the members, but I have evidence & can DM it to people who want it.]
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I'm seriously wondering what the delay is in announcing his departure. Whatever legal issues regarding writing credits have to be resolved by now, right? I feel like he's been out of the band for over a year now.
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Not surprising to see that at all. Still a major bummer. Between the blandness of Virus and Diego's departure, my interest in this band has completely plummeted. They had become an auto-buy band for me, but I can't say that is the case now. Doesn't mean I don't love the first four albums and part of the fifth album any less, though.
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I think that pretty much confirms what we all knew, sad to see him leave the band. I hope it was for the right reasons and things aren't going to be nasty between the two parties. I liked Virus and hope they can find a suitable replacement and continue to build upon their successes.
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TBH the best thing they could do is make new music (with keys don’t need replacement just have RH play them) they unfortunately had the worst timing possible* with a new album to tour last year, and probable change in prominent band member.
I didnt like the future bites, but the title is apropo, and SW is doing the right thing by rolling it’s tour over into the next one. Haken should do the same.
*just as a matter of timing DT worked out OK, lost some dates but get to put together DT15 on a slightly adjusted schedule. I guess I feel the bands that will do well are those with new/tourable music in early 2022.
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Not surprising to see that at all. Still a major bummer. Between the blandness of Virus and Diego's departure, my interest in this band has completely plummeted. They had become an auto-buy band for me, but I can't say that is the case now. Doesn't mean I don't love the first four albums and part of the fifth album any less, though.
Pretty much this. I didn't mind Virus and Vector for that matter....there's some good music in there to be found. But the sound that I enjoy and what made Haken 'haken' for me was the sound they had in their first four albums. The 'heavier' Haken sounds alright I suppose but there's nothing special about it.....as to where I found plenty special with the first four efforts.
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Happy birthday to debut album Aquarius, 11 years old today.
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Not surprising to see that at all. Still a major bummer. Between the blandness of Virus and Diego's departure, my interest in this band has completely plummeted. They had become an auto-buy band for me, but I can't say that is the case now. Doesn't mean I don't love the first four albums and part of the fifth album any less, though.
Pretty much this. I didn't mind Virus and Vector for that matter....there's some good music in there to be found. But the sound that I enjoy and what made Haken 'haken' for me was the sound they had in their first four albums. The 'heavier' Haken sounds alright I suppose but there's nothing special about it.....as to where I found plenty special with the first four efforts.
Agreed. It always felt like the keys were just as important to the music as the guitars, but with the last two albums and Diego's departure, the balance is clearly tilting one way, and I'd be stunned if they hire a new keyboard guy and let him take a role front and center right off the bat, so I would expect this guitar-dominant phase to not end any time soon.
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I just viewed it as another phase. Every album has been quite different, and I figured this was just the style for these albums (which are, essentially, parts 1&2 of the same story).
I’m anticipating another left turn for the next album. If not, that would be disappointing.
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I just viewed it as another phase. Every album has been quite different, and I figured this was just the style for these albums (which are, essentially, parts 1&2 of the same story).
I’m anticipating another left turn for the next album. If not, that would be disappointing.
All of this.
No idea where Kev is getting the idea that keys aren't important to the band anymore.
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No idea where Kev is getting the idea that keys aren't important to the band anymore.
I think it's because they were buried in their last album. If you were lucky enough to be able to spot when you could hear any contribution from Diego it was fleeting and had no impact on the song....was just an accessory at best. The heavy approach to Virus eliminated Diego completely.....and I'd argue Ross as well. I know a few of you think Ross sounded fine on it but IMO his voice and style of singing was completely out of place in Virus.
Such is the magic of music. It hits us all differently
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No idea where Kev is getting the idea that keys aren't important to the band anymore.
I think it's because they were buried in their last album. If you were lucky enough to be able to spot when you could hear any contribution from Diego it was fleeting and had no impact on the song....was just an accessory at best. The heavy approach to Virus eliminated Diego completely.....and I'd argue Ross as well. I know a few of you think Ross sounded fine on it but IMO his voice and style of singing was completely out of place in Virus.
Such is the magic of music. It hits us all differently
Diego is there. It's the patch and sound choices chosen that blends in with the distortion of the guitar, or the low end of the bass. You really hear him in the instrumental versions.
For why I enjoy Virus and Vector is because the instruments all blend into this sound and tone, creating this atmosphere and setting for the concept.
Also, just realized Ross as well, he wasn't eliminated completely. Listen to the instrumental version of Invasion. Ross' vocals, rhythm and beat, contribute a lot to how the overall song sounds.
Now to me...It feels like maybe Diego wasn't too happy with the patches chosen on these albums. And did the album and tour, and said, "Screw you guys...I'm going home."
I would like to hope though, that his leaving has nothing to do with the music, and is more of a personal "It's a me thing" type of situation.
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atmosphere and setting
This is what I enjoy the heck out of in their first four albums but feel like are missing in Virus for sure....and a bit of Vector. They painted a beautiful atmosphere and setting with the music in those first four albums. Their music/vocals was smoothly poetic even when they cranked into some heavier stuff. But for me the heavier turn they took with Vector and Virus eliminated the subtle approach to building those atmospheres......it wasn't poetic at all it was a more military approach that didn't build anything of significance....for me.
Again....there was some cool music to be heard in there but nothing that I thought 'wow....that's amazing' like I had on multiple occasions in the first four albums.
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I think Vector has a really great atmosphere to it. It's certainly different from albums like Aquarius and The Mountain, but I think there's a strong sense of atmosphere across the whole album.
As for Virus, while I think it's a great album, I do agree that has a lot less atmosphere than the other albums Haken has done.
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No idea where Kev is getting the idea that keys aren't important to the band anymore.
I think it's because they were buried in their last album. If you were lucky enough to be able to spot when you could hear any contribution from Diego it was fleeting and had no impact on the song....was just an accessory at best. The heavy approach to Virus eliminated Diego completely.....and I'd argue Ross as well. I know a few of you think Ross sounded fine on it but IMO his voice and style of singing was completely out of place in Virus.
Such is the magic of music. It hits us all differently
Of course, I mean I don't agree with Virus and I love it, but I understand those sentiments with regard to that album and also to some extent with Vector (although the two are essentially a double album so I see it really as one project). That wasn't what I meant - I mean I don't understand why the approach taken on one album/project would signal a lack of interest in keys in general. I'm 99% certain it's not the case.
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I mean I don't understand why the approach taken on one album/project would signal a lack of interest in keys in general. I'm 99% certain it's not the case.
:tup keys are a vital component to their sound and I can't see why they'd want to eliminate them. I guess that's why I didn't really connect with Virus because they were really buried IMO
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atmosphere and setting
This is what I enjoy the heck out of in their first four albums but feel like are missing in Virus for sure....and a bit of Vector. They painted a beautiful atmosphere and setting with the music in those first four albums. Their music/vocals was smoothly poetic even when they cranked into some heavier stuff. But for me the heavier turn they took with Vector and Virus eliminated the subtle approach to building those atmospheres......it wasn't poetic at all it was a more military approach that didn't build anything of significance....for me.
Again....there was some cool music to be heard in there but nothing that I thought 'wow....that's amazing' like I had on multiple occasions in the first four albums.
This was really prominent for me in The Mountain and Affinity.
The atmosphere of Vector and Virus is not the same as those past albums. This isn't a Happy, uplifting, kind of atmosphere. It's more darker, and sinister, and a bit more distorted. Great to show the concept and the feelings of the subject that becomes The Cockroach King. And this "military approach" suits that extremely well.
Albums are meant to sound the way they are for that very reason of building a certain atmosphere. Grace Under Pressure is a great example of Atmosphere as well, because the production and mixing lead to a more colder, almost, wintery kind of atmosphere that the cover art portrays with it's use of colors.
the Distorted Atmosphere of Vector and Virus, makes it feel like we are experiencing the patients feelings. To me, these feelings are best represented in Puzzle Box, Host, A Cell Divides, Carousel, and Messiah Complex.
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I mean I don't understand why the approach taken on one album/project would signal a lack of interest in keys in general. I'm 99% certain it's not the case.
:tup keys are a vital component to their sound and I can't see why they'd want to eliminate them. I guess that's why I didn't really connect with Virus because they were really buried IMO
For sure, I totally get that.
It's interesting though, I've never seen Haken as being at all defined by their sonic approach, as to me each album (treating Vector/Virus as a single entity) has been so different in that regard. For me their sound has always been defined by their melodic and harmonic approach which I always find quite rich and often beautifully melancholy. That's the thing I connect to most from their music, and I love how sad Virus is which is part of why it's my second favourite behind The Mountain.
I love how different people get such different things from music and connect to it in different ways.
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No idea where Kev is getting the idea that keys aren't important to the band anymore.
From my ears. ;)
Also, to clarify, my comment was, "It always felt like the keys were just as important to the music as the guitars, but with the last two albums and Diego's departure, the balance is clearly tilting one way, and I'd be stunned if they hire a new keyboard guy and let him take a role front and center right off the bat, so I would expect this guitar-dominant phase to not end any time soon," so I didn't say that the keys weren't important anymore, just that the balance had seemingly tilted away from them.
I love how different people get such different things from music and connect to it in different ways.
Oh, for sure, and I get that some are really loving Virus. I just wish I was one of them. :( :(
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I might have found a tour leak for the US next May with Symphony X.
NYC Venue Irving Plaza announced their line up of concerts on twitter and in the list...
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E1mSXRAX0Ag2JFv?format=jpg&name=large)
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Well that’s an instant purchase for me once tickets go on sale.
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Dude, Dude.....That is one awesome lineup, and would be an instant purchase from me.
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Still no keyboardist, tho :lol
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Wow... And I'd probably have a really good in for backstage privelage since a good friend of mine is really close with Russell.
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Holy moly I hope that's a full tour and not just a one-off.
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Holy moly I hope that's a full tour and not just a one-off.
I doubt it's a one off for a band from England.
What's cool is Irving Plaza is twice the size of the typical NYC venue they would play. I'm sure Symphony X helps sell tickets too, but it'll be cool to see Haken move onto a bigger stage.
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Holy moly I hope that's a full tour and not just a one-off.
I doubt it's a one off for a band from England.
What's cool is Irving Plaza is twice the size of the typical NYC venue they would play. I'm sure Symphony X helps sell tickets too, but it'll be cool to see Haken move onto a bigger stage.
A bigger stage, yeah, but not really that one. I was fairly unimpressed with Irving Plaza. Still beats the everloving crap out of Highline, but that's hardly a ringing endorsement.
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Holy moly I hope that's a full tour and not just a one-off.
I doubt it's a one off for a band from England.
What's cool is Irving Plaza is twice the size of the typical NYC venue they would play. I'm sure Symphony X helps sell tickets too, but it'll be cool to see Haken move onto a bigger stage.
A bigger stage, yeah, but not really that one. I was fairly unimpressed with Irving Plaza. Still beats the everloving crap out of Highline, but that's hardly a ringing endorsement.
Irving Plaza was just completely renovated, it was a dump I agree, but it may be nicer now. I'll have to go to a show to find out.
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Holy moly I hope that's a full tour and not just a one-off.
I doubt it's a one off for a band from England.
What's cool is Irving Plaza is twice the size of the typical NYC venue they would play. I'm sure Symphony X helps sell tickets too, but it'll be cool to see Haken move onto a bigger stage.
A bigger stage, yeah, but not really that one. I was fairly unimpressed with Irving Plaza. Still beats the everloving crap out of Highline, but that's hardly a ringing endorsement.
Irving Plaza was just completely renovated, it was a dump I agree, but it may be nicer now. I'll have to go to a show to find out.
Well, they've certainly made it more colorful. Ironically, the death-trap black motif was one of its few saving graces. :lol
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On another note, Ross revealed on Instagram that he was recording demos for the next Haken release.
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We'll see what the next one is like. I hope it's a bounce back, for me anyway, as my interest in this band has plummeted in the last year. The combination of Virus being forgettable and Diego leaving the band has made them fall off of my "must see" list as far as concerts go. I would have zero interest in a concert dedicated to all or most of Vector and Virus.
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We'll see what the next one is like. I hope it's a bounce back, for me anyway, as my interest in this band has plummeted in the last year. The combination of Virus being forgettable and Diego leaving the band has made them fall off of my "must see" list as far as concerts go. I would have zero interest in a concert dedicated to all or most of Vector and Virus.
I'm very sad that Diego is leaving the band. But a concert where Vector and Virus are being played back to back would be a dream come true. I absolutely love those two albums. They are one of my favorite prog metal albums if counted together as a double album (which I think they should).
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They announced that they’re going to be playing Vector and Virus back to back next year at Prognosis Festival in the Netherlands I think, but I’m pretty sure it’s a one off.
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They announced that they’re going to be playing Vector and Virus back to back next year at Prognosis Festival in the Netherlands I think, but I’m pretty sure it’s a one off.
That would be my guess too. Also, if this tour is legit, I wouldn't be surprised if it's coheadline with both bands getting 75 minutes. In which case, not enough time to do both albums.
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The date is confirmed, Haken added the event to Facebook. I'm guessing an announcement soon for a tour.
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Don't they have to finish their tour with Devin Townsend? I've still got tickets!!!
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Don't they have to finish their tour with Devin Townsend? I've still got tickets!!!
I don't have any insider info on this, but my guess is that was Devy's tour, so if the tickets are still valid, it'll be for his shows but potentially with different support.
Anyway, looks like Haken have had to go ahead and announce this seeing as the venue put the info out already :lol
https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=319955639499957
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I'm wondering if this is a way for both bands to complete their postponed Anniversary tours. Which were both, big moments in the bands history's that not celebrating them would be a shame.
Haken with Affinity and Symphony X with their overall 25th anniversary.
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Eh, even though I would have loved seeing all of Affinity last year (okay, almost all of it, I can do without Initiate :lol) - it was less than a week away when the COVID shutdown happened :( - Haken is still too young of a band to start doing anniversary shows.
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Given the chatter in the TA thread, I thought I would give something from the last album another try.
Just gave the Messiah Complex suite another listen.
What a complete and utter train wreck. It just ended and I remember zero about it, other than it felt like it just bounced from idea to idea with no rhyme or reason, and as for memorable melodies? Nada.
It makes me sad to see how quickly this band has fallen off the cliff. :( :(
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You know who's the star of vector/virus...it's Ray. Then it's Conner.
Vector/Virus are groove and rhythm based albums. Mainly the vocals carry the melody. These set the tone for the album. And for me, it's an album that has a dark tone to it. It's not happy like Affinity. These albums are really dark in tone and atmosphere. Which is something different for the band. They never have went full on Dark. They do have some darker elements in their older albums, but the tone of the albums are not dark overall.
The story itself isnt happy, and the music and tone that is set by the band reveals this to me. There are no happy, catchy, melodies or chord progressions, because that would ruin the tone.
And the jarring parts play into the concept and, I see it as why, they made the decision to split Messiah Complex into different songs, as it is jarring when played as one song.
I actually like the contrast the band took from Happy Uplifting Affinity, to the Darker, Sinister, Uneasiness of Vector/Virus.
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Given the chatter in the TA thread, I thought I would give something from the last album another try.
Just gave the Messiah Complex suite another listen.
What a complete and utter train wreck. It just ended and I remember zero about it, other than it felt like it just bounced from idea to idea with no rhyme or reason, and as for memorable melodies? Nada.
It makes me sad to see how quickly this band has fallen off the cliff. :( :(
Surprising take considering how many recalls there to some of their best songs.
I’ve said this before, but I thought Vector was very disappointing, but Virus felt like a much improved “act 2” of a single concept, and now I can only think of them as a double album and it really made the whole greater than the sum of its parts.
Now I love both albums, but I’m also hoping the next album gives us another big change up in direction.
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Given the chatter in the TA thread, I thought I would give something from the last album another try.
Just gave the Messiah Complex suite another listen.
What a complete and utter train wreck. It just ended and I remember zero about it, other than it felt like it just bounced from idea to idea with no rhyme or reason, and as for memorable melodies? Nada.
It makes me sad to see how quickly this band has fallen off the cliff. :( :(
Surprising take considering how many recalls there to some of their best songs.
I’ve said this before, but I thought Vector was very disappointing, but Virus felt like a much improved “act 2” of a single concept, and now I can only think of them as a double album and it really made the whole greater than the sum of its parts.
Now I love both albums, but I’m also hoping the next album gives us another big change up in direction.
If the rumors of Diego’s departure are true (and it’s looking like they are), that change in direction is almost guaranteed as a new keyboard player/songwriter will lead to different musical ideas and a new energy and chemistry within the band.
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You're right, let's take this discussion here ;)
Aquarius is one of the best debut albums of all time for me, but whenever I put on Vector, Virus or Affinity on right after it, Aquarius actually sounds a little childish in comparison :lol
For me, Haken hit a whole new level with Affinity and the last two albums. I might be one of the few people who think so, but that is 100% what I think. It was with Affinity that Haken became one of my all-time favorite bands and Vector and Virus reinforced that.
I totally disagree. Aquarias sounds like a band chock full of energy and melodies and ideas, all of which they threw on that album, while the last two albums sound like a band who has become too focused on being metal and having crazy tempo changes and too often have forgotten what a good melody is. Not saying the metal and tempo changes weren't always there, but the balance is just off now, IMO. Hoping it tilts back on the next record, but losing Diego could be a crippling blow.
As I said, Aquarius is still one of the best debut albums of all (!) time for me. So I agree, Aquarius is awesome. But in my opinion, apart from Visions (which I like slightly less than the debut because it doesn't have that goofy side as much) the band only got better from album to album. That is, if you count Vector and Virus as a double album, which I do.
The melodies are still there. Veil has an amazing chorus, Puzzle Box even has more than one amazing chorus (that finale "how can truth" gets me every time!). Canary Yellow is hauntingly beautiful. Carousel should please every Mountain-fan. And The Strain stays in my head for days whenever I hear it. The melodies are there, they're just standing next to huge 8-string riffs and insane rhythm section work, which you can either love (me) or not love (you, as it looks) ;)
I am, however, very excited but anxious what they're gonna do without Diego. I hope they don't come up with the idea to continue without a keyboard player.
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Now I love both albums, but I’m also hoping the next album gives us another big change up in direction.
It will.
You're right, let's take this discussion here ;)
Aquarius is one of the best debut albums of all time for me, but whenever I put on Vector, Virus or Affinity on right after it, Aquarius actually sounds a little childish in comparison :lol
For me, Haken hit a whole new level with Affinity and the last two albums. I might be one of the few people who think so, but that is 100% what I think. It was with Affinity that Haken became one of my all-time favorite bands and Vector and Virus reinforced that.
I totally disagree. Aquarias sounds like a band chock full of energy and melodies and ideas, all of which they threw on that album, while the last two albums sound like a band who has become too focused on being metal and having crazy tempo changes and too often have forgotten what a good melody is. Not saying the metal and tempo changes weren't always there, but the balance is just off now, IMO. Hoping it tilts back on the next record, but losing Diego could be a crippling blow.
As I said, Aquarius is still one of the best debut albums of all (!) time for me. So I agree, Aquarius is awesome. But in my opinion, apart from Visions (which I like slightly less than the debut because it doesn't have that goofy side as much) the band only got better from album to album. That is, if you count Vector and Virus as a double album, which I do.
The melodies are still there. Veil has an amazing chorus, Puzzle Box even has more than one amazing chorus (that finale "how can truth" gets me every time!). Canary Yellow is hauntingly beautiful. Carousel should please every Mountain-fan. And The Strain stays in my head for days whenever I hear it. The melodies are there, they're just standing next to huge 8-string riffs and insane rhythm section work, which you can either love (me) or not love (you, as it looks) ;)
I am, however, very excited but anxious what they're gonna do without Diego. I hope they don't come up with the idea to continue without a keyboard player.
I feel pretty much exactly the same way as you, except that:
- I prefer the Mountain to the three after; and
- I'm not at all anxious about what they'll do next.
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I am, however, very excited but anxious what they're gonna do without Diego. I hope they don't come up with the idea to continue without a keyboard player.
Nah, there's no way they'd do that. I get that there doesn't seem to be much keyboard stuff on Virus, but I can't possibly see Haken deciding to make music with no keyboards in the future.
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Given the chatter in the TA thread, I thought I would give something from the last album another try.
Just gave the Messiah Complex suite another listen.
What a complete and utter train wreck. It just ended and I remember zero about it, other than it felt like it just bounced from idea to idea with no rhyme or reason, and as for memorable melodies? Nada.
It makes me sad to see how quickly this band has fallen off the cliff. :( :(
Messiah Complex is the least digestible track on the album. Sceptics should start with Invasion.
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I am, however, very excited but anxious what they're gonna do without Diego. I hope they don't come up with the idea to continue without a keyboard player.
Nah, there's no way they'd do that. I get that there doesn't seem to be much keyboard stuff on Virus, but I can't possibly see Haken deciding to make music with no keyboards in the future.
Yeah, I would be absolutely shocked if they did that. Keys are too big a part of their sound.
Messiah Complex is the least digestible track on the album. Sceptics should start with Invasion.
Invasion is so great, my favourite on the album and one of my favourite Haken songs.
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Invasion :metal
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Yeah, I would be absolutely shocked if they did that. Keys are too big a part of their sound.
Judging from Virus it's a fair judgement to say that maybe keys aren't as important to the sound they're after now? Because Diego was pretty buried and non existent in Virus.....he was merely 'around' enough in Vector for people to say "oh....I heard a keyboardist".
We've had this discussion already...but....it's not that I don't 'like' what they've put out recently....it's good enough and all.....But I'm MUCH more of a fan of the sound they had in the first (5) albums than I am of the last two. I really hope that heavy prog metal experiment is over and they return to their earlier approach of creating great atmosphere and utilizing every member of the band. That's when they shine IMO......the sound they had in Virus is a dime a dozen.
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Judging from Virus it's a fair judgement to say that maybe keys aren't as important to the sound they're after now?
No, it isn't. The only fair judgement in that regard is to say that's what they went for on Vector/Virus.
I know they're bigger now, but I don't remember after Affinity came out people thinking that spacey synths and electronics was "their sound now" or whatever.
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Judging from Virus it's a fair judgement to say that maybe keys aren't as important to the sound they're after now?
No, it isn't. The only fair judgement in that regard is to say that's what they went for on Vector/Virus.
I know they're bigger now, but I don't remember after Affinity came out people thinking that spacey synths and electronics was "their sound now" or whatever.
but at least we knew that every member of the band was being utilized creatively. I'm not looking to 'pick a fight' over this or anything.....I still enjoy HAKEN greatly. I just prefer their earlier content over what we've heard from them recently. I even dig most of Vector. Virus however, for me, was such a drastic change in sound and approach that the only time I revisit it is when one of my sons plays songs from that album while in the car. I personally just find it very rudimentary for musicians of their skill level.
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Just gave the Messiah Complex suite another listen.
What a complete and utter train wreck. It just ended and I remember zero about it, other than it felt like it just bounced from idea to idea with no rhyme or reason, and as for memorable melodies? Nada.
It makes me sad to see how quickly this band has fallen off the cliff. :( :(
Is this a common opinion? I love Messiah Complex, I get how it might feel weird if you’re seeing it as one song but I think every part is great, and the callbacks to other songs are really nice. The riff from the start of The Sect is one of my favourite Haken riffs too.
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Given the chatter in the TA thread, I thought I would give something from the last album another try.
Just gave the Messiah Complex suite another listen.
What a complete and utter train wreck. It just ended and I remember zero about it, other than it felt like it just bounced from idea to idea with no rhyme or reason, and as for memorable melodies? Nada.
It makes me sad to see how quickly this band has fallen off the cliff. :( :(
Surprising take considering how many recalls there to some of their best songs.
I’ve said this before, but I thought Vector was very disappointing, but Virus felt like a much improved “act 2” of a single concept, and now I can only think of them as a double album and it really made the whole greater than the sum of its parts.
Now I love both albums, but I’m also hoping the next album gives us another big change up in direction.
The recalls to prior songs doesn't make the new ones good, though, IMO.
And to clarify, I will give them props for the change in direction. Bands who do not stay stagnant are often the best ones, and many of my favorite albums are ones that were considered a radical departure at the time. I just do not care for the direction that Haken went on these records.
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As I said, Aquarius is still one of the best debut albums of all (!) time for me. So I agree, Aquarius is awesome. But in my opinion, apart from Visions (which I like slightly less than the debut because it doesn't have that goofy side as much) the band only got better from album to album. That is, if you count Vector and Virus as a double album, which I do.
The melodies are still there. Veil has an amazing chorus, Puzzle Box even has more than one amazing chorus (that finale "how can truth" gets me every time!). Canary Yellow is hauntingly beautiful. Carousel should please every Mountain-fan. And The Strain stays in my head for days whenever I hear it. The melodies are there, they're just standing next to huge 8-string riffs and insane rhythm section work, which you can either love (me) or not love (you, as it looks) ;)
I am, however, very excited but anxious what they're gonna do without Diego. I hope they don't come up with the idea to continue without a keyboard player.
Some of the songs on Vision are kinda average, but that is still a damn good album on the strength alone of the title track and Deathless, which I consider two of their best songs. And I really like the sound of the record. It sounds a little dirty, a little grimy. I like that.
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Just gave the Messiah Complex suite another listen.
What a complete and utter train wreck. It just ended and I remember zero about it, other than it felt like it just bounced from idea to idea with no rhyme or reason, and as for memorable melodies? Nada.
It makes me sad to see how quickly this band has fallen off the cliff. :( :(
Is this a common opinion? I love Messiah Complex, I get how it might feel weird if you’re seeing it as one song but I think every part is great, and the callbacks to other songs are really nice. The riff from the start of The Sect is one of my favourite Haken riffs too.
Not sure. I can't speak for the fanbase as a whole, but as far as my local circle of friends go, the friends I have gone to see Haken with the last few years were as disappointed with Virus as I was, and we all agree that Messiah Complex is a train wreck.
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Invasion is so great, my favourite on the album and one of my favourite Haken songs.
That is probably the one song from Virus that I will revisit here and there.
(not Carousel, if anyone read my most recent posts before I edited them; I got Infatuation and Carousel confused :lol)
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Messiah Complex has big Black Rose Immortal energy and to me that's not a good thing at all
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Given the chatter in the TA thread, I thought I would give something from the last album another try.
Just gave the Messiah Complex suite another listen.
What a complete and utter train wreck. It just ended and I remember zero about it, other than it felt like it just bounced from idea to idea with no rhyme or reason, and as for memorable melodies? Nada.
It makes me sad to see how quickly this band has fallen off the cliff. :( :(
I know you're specifically talking about MC, but I can expand that to the whole album. Almost a year since I last listened to it and I don't remember ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING! Impressive.
The recalls to prior songs doesn't make the new ones good, though, IMO.
And to clarify, I will give them props for the change in direction. Bands who do not stay stagnant are often the best ones, and many of my favorite albums are ones that were considered a radical departure at the time. I just do not care for the direction that Haken went on these records.
I agree. For me the band only has one really good record, but their restlessness is admirable, trying out different sounds.
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Messiah Complex is the least digestible track on the album. Sceptics should start with Invasion.
Invasion is so great, my favourite on the album and one of my favourite Haken songs.
Invasion, The Strain and Canary Yellow are the songs I keep coming back to.
Virus is still my second least favourite album by the band, but I'm excited to hear what they've got in store with their next album.
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As far as the memorable moments on Virus go, I think Messiah complex has the most of them. But it's still not great overall. I am just as underwhelmed by the entire album as I was a year ago. Which is a shame, because I loved Vector.
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Are we all listening to the same record? Virus blew me away on first listen and it still does a year later.
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Definitely listening to the same record, but I have literally no use for anything this band did after the first couple of albums and even those I can only take in small doses because the vocals are just awful. I think one of the biggest drawbacks for me with this group is their tendency to do complexity for the sake of complexity. I guess I just tend to gravitate more towards music with vocalists who don't sound out of pitch 1/2 the time and music that has more emotional impact. When I listen to Haken I feel like I'm listening to 4 guys trying to 1-up each other.
That said, it all really just comes down to taste and this band is just not something I tend to go for despite valiant efforts on every album of theirs I very rarely reach for any of their music.
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When I listen to Haken I feel like I'm listening to 4 guys trying to 1-up each other.
Okay, now I’m sure you’re talking about a different band.
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No, pretty sure the CDs all have the word "Haken" on them :lol
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Are we all listening to the same record? Virus blew me away on first listen and it still does a year later.
You tell me, as you were the one who talked about these melodies that I feel aren't there. :P
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When I listen to Haken I feel like I'm listening to 4 guys trying to 1-up each other.
This is true for Messiah Complex, but I don't feel that way about them on general.
What I like most about virus is the recording/production/mix. You have bass and keyboard in the center and two guitars left and right. The interplay between the two guitar lines is sooo tasteful at times. Quite the opposite of 1-upping each other in my opinion, it's a 50+ minutes album with only 4 solos, none of them exceeding the 1 minute mark.
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Are we all listening to the same record? Virus blew me away on first listen and it still does a year later.
I enjoy Vector enough, but Virus may be one of the least memorable albums I've ever heard by a band I was completely obsessed with. There's just nothing there to latch onto. If Vector didn't end on such a weak note, it'd probably rank above Visions for me so it's not necessarily the heavier style that turns me off. The music is just boring imo.
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Are we all listening to the same record? Virus blew me away on first listen and it still does a year later.
Fritzinger, I've noticed you and I have similar tastes with a lot of this - I too think Virus is a very strong effort. Not their best, but for the sound and style they where trying to achieve, I think they knocked it out of the park. Now if you don't like that sound and style, fair enough - but IMO, they did a good job with it.
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I can almost wrap my head around not liking Virus. But nothing memorable does not compute for me at all.
I couldn’t get the intro to Invasion out of my head for a week after only hearing it once. Biggest earworm since Cockroach King.
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I can almost wrap my head around not liking Virus. But nothing memorable does not compute for me at all.
I couldn’t get the intro to Invasion out of my head for a week after only hearing it once. Biggest earworm since Cockroach King.
Agreed on all counts.
Also the Invasion chorus is just :heart
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Are we all listening to the same record? Virus blew me away on first listen and it still does a year later.
Fritzinger, I've noticed you and I have similar tastes with a lot of this - I too think Virus is a very strong effort. Not their best, but for the sound and style they where trying to achieve, I think they knocked it out of the park. Now if you don't like that sound and style, fair enough - but IMO, they did a good job with it.
I'm the same way. The album is what it is. And they accomplished that really well. It's jarring, brooding, disjointed, chaotic, pulsating, and ethereal.
That tone is felt perfectly and makes one feel what the "patient" is going through. The jarring, pulsating, chaotic shock treatments, and the brooding, ethereal, disjointed experiments of the "Good Doctor".
I enjoy the album because of that tone, and the atmosphere it creates. A Cell Divides, Host, Canary Yellow, have that ethereal, brooding, atmosphere that represents the effect of the Gene Experiment the Patient undergoes that makes his DNA change form and merge with the Cockroach genes.
Vector is about the "Patient", the host. While Virus, is about the effects of the virus in the host, the conclusion to the "Good Doctors" experiment.
Regardless if it's to my tastes. They're both really good and well done albums.
And I prefer Ketchup.
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Are we all listening to the same record? Virus blew me away on first listen and it still does a year later.
I enjoy Vector enough, but Virus may be one of the least memorable albums I've ever heard by a band I was completely obsessed with. There's just nothing there to latch onto. If Vector didn't end on such a weak note, it'd probably rank above Visions for me so it's not necessarily the heavier style that turns me off. The music is just boring imo.
This. Even though Vector was a bit lacking (just three keepers for me, none of which I would call one of my favorites) and felt like a step back, my fandom for the band didn't really take a hit, but Virus was just so darn blah and mostly forgettable that they are off my automatic buy/go see in concert list as quickly as they were on it. I will take the wait and see approach with them going forward.
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Ross put out the first song from his solo album today
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNqanmamI1c
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Fun song, I like it
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HAKEN’s vocalist ROSS JENNINGS has released the lyric video for his debut single as a solo artist "Words We Can’t Unsay" via Graphite Records.
The song is the first single from his debut solo album ‘A Shadow of my Future Self’ which is set to be released later this year, and sees him take a step into pop territory for the first time.
"Words We Can’t Unsay" features Ross Jennings on vocals and guitar, with Nathan Navarro (Devin Townsend) on Bass, Vikram Shankar (Redemption, Lux Terminus, Silent Skies) on Keyboards & Simen Sandnes (Arkentype) on drums plus special guests Norwegian brass sensations ‘Blasemafian’ also make an appearance. The song is mixed by Karim Sinno & mastered by Ermin Hamidovic (Haken, Plini) with artwork designed by longtime Haken collaborator BLACKLAKE.
Ross has the following to say about the track:
“This was one of the first pieces I committed to demo when embarking on this project. I knew I wanted a more accessible direction but I never predicted how well all the layers and different genre references would come together. The song is about relationships, about those heated moments when we say hurtful things we don’t mean. It’s a very real experience we’ve all had and writing a song about it has been a kind of healing therapy for me.”
The lyric video is created by Jack Vashko, who was selected by Ross based on his incredible fan-made lyric videos of HAKEN songs. Jack has captured the single and album aesthetic perfectly on this video, which you can watch here:
https://youtu.be/UNqanmamI1c
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In conjunction with his first single release, ROSS JENNINGS has also announced details of a Global Livestream event called ‘Acoustic Shadows’ which airs on July 23rd via Munin.live.
Ross will perform acoustic renditions of songs from his forthcoming debut album ‘A Shadow of my Future Self’ and much more including songs from other projects he is known for.
Standard and VIP Tickets are on sale now from https://ross.munin.live/
Ross adds about the event:
“We’re in lockdown and I can’t meet up with my bands to perform, so I’ve decided to make a bold move, dust off that guitar and face a solo live gig head on, even if it is just to cameras!
I haven’t performed solo like this since my days playing open mic nights in the local pub, but I know for sure this is going to be a wildly unique experience”
UK & EUROPE STREAM - FRIDAY JULY 23rd at 8PM BST / 9PM CEST.
NORTH / CENTRAL & SOUTH AMERICA STREAM - FRIDAY JULY 23rd at 6PM PDT / 9PM EDT.
AUS, NZ & ASIA STREAM - SATURDAY JULY 24th at 8PM AEST / 10PM NZST / 7PM JST & KST.
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I like it! I like that it’s completely different from Haken. I hope the new Haken album is as big a shift in style as this is.
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(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/210130847_343906910438163_6322053022301427713_n.jpg?_nc_cat=105&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=8024bb&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ohc=t8CBEPnzIY0AX8QTKbD&_nc_ht=scontent-iad3-1.xx&tp=14&oh=121b978de25c45b38e4dbcbe8ade1f19&oe=60E0DC24)
-Marc.
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(https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/210130847_343906910438163_6322053022301427713_n.jpg?_nc_cat=105&ccb=1-3&_nc_sid=8024bb&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ohc=t8CBEPnzIY0AX8QTKbD&_nc_ht=scontent-iad3-1.xx&tp=14&oh=121b978de25c45b38e4dbcbe8ade1f19&oe=60E0DC24)
-Marc.
Neat :biggrin:
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So at some point they have to announce who's replacing Diego, right? :lol
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So at some point they have to announce who's replacing Diego, right? :lol
Was there an official announcement that he left?
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So at some point they have to announce who's replacing Diego, right? :lol
Was there an official announcement that he left?
There's been everything but an official announcement.
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A 90 minute interview with Diego went up on youtube two weeks ago where he didn't mention Haken even once.
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A 90 minute interview with Diego went up on youtube two weeks ago where he didn't mention Haken even once.
How does that not come up? I guess the interviewer was probably told not to is the only reason.
This situation is so ridiculous because of how long it's been going on. I have to image if there wasn't a pandemic we'd know the situation by now.
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I've said it before, but the band really would be explaining things if they could.
Anyway, the tour news is great, especially the Shepherd's Bush Empire here in London! That'll be the biggest venue they've ever headlined in the UK.
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I've said it before, but the band really would be explaining things if they could.
Which implies, to me, a legal issue. But what if this issue is not resolved before the tour? I mean, I feel like they could just say something basic though. Ignoring has, however, kind of worked. They aren't that big of a band to have such drama blow up in the media or anything. But it's going to be odd if it's not explained before their next live show and either he is there or not.
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I've said it before, but the band really would be explaining things if they could.
Which implies, to me, a legal issue. But what if this issue is not resolved before the tour? I mean, I feel like they could just say something basic though. Ignoring has, however, kind of worked. They aren't that big of a band to have such drama blow up in the media or anything. But it's going to be odd if it's not explained before their next live show and either he is there or not.
True, I can't see how they could tour without being able to say something, even if that's just, as you say, some sort of basic acknowledgement.
To your previous post, I don't know that COVID has necessarily dragged it out it and of itself, but given that nobody can tour and they released an album early in the pandemic anyway, I feel like not being able to say anything hasn't been as problematic as it might otherwise have been.
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It has to be a legal issue. The only other thing I could think is maybe they're trying to "save" the relationship, or "fix" whatever is broken - with the hopes of Diego returning - so no announcement until everything is finalized and "for certain" - but I doubt that
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This seems to be official: https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/OC421678/officers (I'm not a UK resident though, but Diego indeed resigned, date and all)
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This seems to be official: https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/OC421678/officers (I'm not a UK resident though, but Diego indeed resigned, date and all)
Yeah, not surprising. Although I didn't realize there was such an age gap between Charlie and Connor. I mean, one looks much older than the other, just didn't know it's 18 years difference.
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I feel bad for the band and grateful that most of us seem to be minding our own business and keeping speculation outside of their own comment sections for the most part. Like most of us here (except for Rich), I too have no idea what's going on, and I'm patiently waiting for the band to explain, though I do get nosy from time to time.
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So at some point they have to announce who's replacing Diego, right? :lol
Kevin Moore, the obvious replacement, will make the announcement himself. :P
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I thought it was going to be Mike Mangini after a three-part documentary series?
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Well, one of the venues in the Netherlands has a promotional photo of Haken that included all five band-members.
(yes, that means Diego is missing in the picture)
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That's how their photo is on the event pages on Facebook as well. Diego is missing in the picture.
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I've been indifferent about this whole situation but it's kinda fucked that at least some people will be buying tickets for these shows expecting Diego to be there. You'd think announcing his departure should come first before putting tickets on sale for a tour he won't be attending.
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I've been indifferent about this whole situation but it's kinda fucked that at least some people will be buying tickets for these shows expecting Diego to be there. You'd think announcing his departure should come first before putting tickets on sale for a tour he won't be attending.
True. I'm certainly no legal expert, but I don't understand what could be holding them up from announcing he left the band? I mean, either he's leaving or he's not. If there's royalty issues, or something along those lines that need to be worked out, I get it. But why not announce he's left the band and then sort all that out behind the scenes? Maybe I'm missing something here.
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As has already been said here, I can say with 99.99% confidence that if the band felt they were in a position to announce the departure, they would. I am absolutely sure that no one wants this saga behind them more than them.
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I wonder if the Devin Townsend thing had anything to do with Diego leaving. Like, a return of the MP/A7X/DT saga but with Diego/Devin/Haken.
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I wonder if the Devin Townsend thing had anything to do with Diego leaving. Like, a return of the MP/A7X/DT saga but with Diego/Devin/Haken.
If that's the case he'd be even dumber for thinking he'd have a stable position with Devin Townsend than Mike would with A7X.
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I wonder if the Devin Townsend thing had anything to do with Diego leaving. Like, a return of the MP/A7X/DT saga but with Diego/Devin/Haken.
If that's the case he'd be even dumber for thinking he'd have a stable position with Devin Townsend than Mike would with A7X.
Yeah, that would definitely be a silly reason to leave. I only said that because I remember during that tour they did together he made a specific post gushing about playing with Devin and his band and it seemed like.. I don't know, it sounded like he discovered he was having more fun than he'd been having in a while. Either way, I think there's a decent chance Haken's original keyboard player could rejoin the band to replace him. They did a livestream chat with him last summer which seemed like an interesting choice given how that's around the time people started realizing something was going on with Diego. Either way, speculation is fun. I hope however this turns out ends up being what's best for all involved.
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To be honest I still hope that Diego is in the band, I really love his playing. But with all the evidence so far I know it’s pretty much impossible that this is the case
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I wonder if the Devin Townsend thing had anything to do with Diego leaving. Like, a return of the MP/A7X/DT saga but with Diego/Devin/Haken.
I've wondered this as well, he's pretty awesome on the latest Devin Townsend live album.
What's interesting is that the Devin/Haken US leg of the tour that got postponed from the pandemic has not been rescheduled which they said would happen and so far it looks like Haken are likely doing a spring US tour with Symphony X. I get the feeling the Devin tour, if it gets rescheduled at all, won't be with Haken again.
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I wonder if the Devin Townsend thing had anything to do with Diego leaving. Like, a return of the MP/A7X/DT saga but with Diego/Devin/Haken.
I've wondered this as well, he's pretty awesome on the latest Devin Townsend live album.
What's interesting is that the Devin/Haken US leg of the tour that got postponed from the pandemic has not been rescheduled which they said would happen and so far it looks like Haken are likely doing a spring US tour with Symphony X. I get the feeling the Devin tour, if it gets rescheduled at all, won't be with Haken again.
Yikes. :|
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I wonder if the Devin Townsend thing had anything to do with Diego leaving. Like, a return of the MP/A7X/DT saga but with Diego/Devin/Haken.
I've wondered this as well, he's pretty awesome on the latest Devin Townsend live album.
What's interesting is that the Devin/Haken US leg of the tour that got postponed from the pandemic has not been rescheduled which they said would happen and so far it looks like Haken are likely doing a spring US tour with Symphony X. I get the feeling the Devin tour, if it gets rescheduled at all, won't be with Haken again.
Yikes. :|
I'm just speculating. I've got no idea. I will definitely miss him in Haken if he is out. I will also embrace him with DT if that becomes the case. I just don't personally know if that is a good idea since Devin constantly changes band members. He's not at all interested in keeping a steady band after disbanding the DTP IMO.
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Could it be a case of one party owning the rights to the band name, or part of the rights, and not letting the others continue on under said name?
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I wonder if the Devin Townsend thing had anything to do with Diego leaving. Like, a return of the MP/A7X/DT saga but with Diego/Devin/Haken.
If that's the case he'd be even dumber for thinking he'd have a stable position with Devin Townsend than Mike would with A7X.
Yeah, that would definitely be a silly reason to leave. I only said that because I remember during that tour they did together he made a specific post gushing about playing with Devin and his band and it seemed like.. I don't know, it sounded like he discovered he was having more fun than he'd been having in a while. Either way, I think there's a decent chance Haken's original keyboard player could rejoin the band to replace him. They did a livestream chat with him last summer which seemed like an interesting choice given how that's around the time people started realizing something was going on with Diego. Either way, speculation is fun. I hope however this turns out ends up being what's best for all involved.
More fuel to this theory is that Peter Jones (Haken's original keyboard player) collaborated with the band on Virus (namely on Only Stars).
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Peter Jones already collaborated on Vector. I don't interpret much into him having a guest spot.
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Out of interest has there ever been a situation like this before with a band, where it seems like a member has left and seems to be fairly common knowledge for what has been, over a year? Most of the time whenever I've heard of a departure it's been a fair instant affair, the fans get to know when the band announce it.
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The Flower Kings have never publicly acknowledged Tomas Bodin's departure. It was just, he was there and then he wasn't. And they've made two albums since then.
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New single from Ross, this is 'Grounded'.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOaFSrX3Ub8&feature=youtu.be
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New single from Ross, this is 'Grounded'.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOaFSrX3Ub8&feature=youtu.be
That was really nice, I prefer it to the previous song.
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I really liked the first single, but Grounded is on another level.
Did anyone else catch the Acoustic Shadows stream? It was actually phenomenal. The songs are so different from Haken, but they're easily just as good. Ross is truly a great songwriter. His voice was also probably the best I've ever heard it. Seeing him play, just him and a guitar was such a cool experience. The encore songs with Henshall and they other guy from Novena whose name I can't remember right now was cool too! I'm gonna have to check out Novena now since the song they played was really good.
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I'm on holiday so can't watch yet, but I bought a ticket so I can watch on Monday night once I'm home. Great to read such a positive review!
The guy from Novena is Harrison White. If you're checking them out then definitely start with their full length, Eleventh Hour.
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The song Ross sang on for the new Scale the Summit album was easily my favorite track on it, and he was the reason. I'll totally check out a solo album.
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Ross' solo album is starting to sound like a great mix between Prog and some pop qualities.
So far, I really enjoy Grounded from the music, atmosphere and the way he delivers those lyrics. That chorus has me singing along due to the meaning behind it.
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The Mountain has aged like fine wine
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The Mountain has aged like fine wine
Literally in my top 5 all time albums. Maybe 3.
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The Mountain has aged like fine wine
Literally in my top 5 all time albums. Maybe 3.
It's in my top dozen. It's a prog metal classic. Perfection.
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I need to circle back to Haken here at some point. I've barely listened to to them at all since last summer. That stupid Virus (the album, not COVID) was so disappointing that I put the band on the back shelf. The cycle will come around, though, and I'll be cranking those first four albums again sooner rather than later. :hat :hat
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Anyone hear the new Ross Jennings tune? Intriguing! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PCqsu7mMyE
Edit: not only intriguing, I think it's really rather special!
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The Mountain has aged like fine wine
I remember the first time I heard it was after Aquarius, Visions, Affinity, and Vector, and I wasn’t a fan at first since it was so vastly different than those albums. Now it’s far and away my favorite Haken record precisely BECAUSE of how different it is. It sounds much more optimistic than the rest of their discography without losing its edge. Atlas Stone, Falling Back to Earth, and Pareidolia are all in my top 15 Haken songs, while no other album has more than two.
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Revisiting Virus a little over a year later, and I'm still very unimpressed with it. Here's hoping they dial back the metal aspect of their sound to something more like Affinity or The Mountain on the next one, whenever that comes out.
With all this talk of Diego being out of the band, I feel really lucky getting to see them twice in March last year before the pandemic. Seeing them play Affinity all the way through for the first time ever in Richmond, and seeing the live debut of Bound by Gravity was truly special.
2 days later I saw them with Devin Townsend in Atlanta and I did the VIP package thing. I was the first person in line for the meet and greet and I could hear Haken's soundcheck from the lobby area of the venue. At one point I heard someone (I guess Charlie) play the opening riff to Prosthetic, though at the time Virus hadn't been announced yet and I didn't realize what the riff was till a few weeks later when it was announced. I guess in a way I'm kinda-sorta one of the few people to hear a Virus song "live(ish)" with Diego :lol
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That's pretty cool, but I think I'm in the minority on this board who really loves Virus. It was my album of the year last year and I haven't been listening to Haken much lately, but yesterday decided to put Virus on. Mostly because I've been LOVING Unleash the Archer's latest album and was starting to think, after time, that maybe that should have been my album of the year... nope. VIrus still kicks ass! I love it all the way through. And I also may be in the minority in thinking there's lots of catchy melodies in this. I've got no issue with the more metal version of Haken, but I'm also more of a metal head than prog nerd so there's that. I guess it suits my tastes better.
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I thought the Virus was a huge improvement over Vector. it actually elevated Vector by complementing it so well. Now I view them as a double album and I really enjoy them both. But I didn’t like Vector for a long time.
EDIT - even though I didn’t enjoy them quite as much as the previous two albums, I still think this is probably the greatest opening six albums of any band I’ve ever known.
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Ya know, I've never gone back and listened to both back to back. I probably should. I thought Vector was a bit of a let down, but it may be more enjoyable as a double album given how much I love Virus.
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I think I agree they both lift each other up a lot. I thought both were good as standalone albums, but they make way more sense together. I felt like A Cell Divides was weak for an album closer, but it's EXCELLENT as the closing for Act 1 so to speak. And I thought Prosthetic, while a good opener compared to ACD as a closer, makes more sense as the start of Act 2. Of course, Clear is a fantastic opening track, and same goes for Only Stars ending the albums.
I personally can't wait to finally hear Virus live, especially when put together with Vector. If they even come to my area. :lol I also expect them to pull out Cockroach King for the encore considering the lyrical connection. Although they play it a lot, they didn't end up playing it on most of the tour I saw them on, which was the Vector tour at the end of 2018.
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I thought Virus ended up being pretty strong, especially after being somewhat disappointed in Vector. I haven't gone back to it in a while, because the time when I was listening to it a lot coincidence with a painful period in my life, but it may have been my favorite album from what I felt was a pretty weak 2020.
For me, though, Haken will probably always be The Mountain, Aquarius and then the rest.
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Ya know, I've never gone back and listened to both back to back. I probably should. I thought Vector was a bit of a let down, but it may be more enjoyable as a double album given how much I love Virus.
Doing this is exactly what sold me on both albums. And a BIG +1 to Gaspar’s thoughts as well. You practically read my mind.
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Ya know, I've never gone back and listened to both back to back. I probably should. I thought Vector was a bit of a let down, but it may be more enjoyable as a double album given how much I love Virus.
Doing this is exactly what sold me on both albums. And a BIG +1 to Gaspar’s thoughts as well. You practically read my mind.
Dammit, not again! I thought the doctors fixed that :lol
Speaking of weird opening/closing tracks, The Alien seems like a weird opening track too. I might change my mind when I hear the whole album, and it's definitely a badass opener, but the fact that people have said it sounds like it could be linked to Pale Blue Dot makes me think it would work well as the second track on an album where Pale Blue Dot is the opener. :omg: My mind will be blown if that actually turns out to be the case lol. PBD does actually seem like a cool opener song. Imagine if they surprised us and opened their shows with PBD / The Alien.
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Yes, Vector and Virus together become more than the sum of their parts. Probably the least bloated double album I have ever heard.
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Except that the studio albums are not a double album. :lol
If you want to call them companion pieces to one another, have at it, but to call two separate albums a double album is, well, factually incorrect. ;)
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Except that the studio albums are not a double album. :lol
If you want to call them companion pieces to one another, have at it, but to call two separate albums a double album is, well, factually incorrect. ;)
I mean, I agree with you but the difference is pretty moot really.
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Except that the studio albums are not a double album. :lol
If you want to call them companion pieces to one another, have at it, but to call two separate albums a double album is, well, factually incorrect. ;)
I reject your hypothesis and substitute my own
(https://i.imgur.com/UcZNkXq.png)
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Except that the studio albums are not a double album. :lol
If you want to call them companion pieces to one another, have at it, but to call two separate albums a double album is, well, factually incorrect. ;)
I would call them a double album in the same vein that Mezmerize/Hypnotize and Automata I/II are double albums.
Both albums are about the same concept and both utilize the same tones and sounds.
The concept double album just happened to be released as two separate cds, which the labels most likely felt would sell better and I believe they did, as releasing two separate releases also counts as two products. :lol
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You guys are cute. :lol :lol
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Only me who's really taken with Ross Jennings' new song, then? :lol
Just re-checking out the other two. Grounded is brilliant, that chorus. Really liking Words We Can't Unsay, too.
Have to say, I think I'm enjoying these tracks more than anything of Haken's although I really rather enjoyed Virus. Definitely buying the album.
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You guys are cute. :lol :lol
I actually think it would've been neat to do what SOAD did and had both albums combine to form the full double album package.
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Only me who's been really taken with Ross Jennings' new song, then? :lol
Just re-checking out the other two. Grounded is brilliant, that chorus. Really liking Words We Can't Unsay, too.
Have to say, I think I'm enjoying these tracks more than anything of Haken's although I really rather enjoyed Virus. Definitely buying the album.
It was alright, I might find it better when not watching the video. I kept thinking of that Sledgehammer video, and couldn't focus on the song itself. :lol
I prefer Grounded and out of the songs released that is one that I find myself gravitating towards.
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Except that the studio albums are not a double album. :lol
If you want to call them companion pieces to one another, have at it, but to call two separate albums a double album is, well, factually incorrect. ;)
I never actually said that they WERE a double album. I said that the two albums benefit when you view them as a double album. The comparison to Automata 1&2 is perfect. Exactly the same thing.
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Only me who's really taken with Ross Jennings' new song, then? :lol
Just re-checking out the other two. Grounded is brilliant, that chorus. Really liking Words We Can't Unsay, too.
Have to say, I think I'm enjoying these tracks more than anything of Haken's although I really rather enjoyed Virus. Definitely buying the album.
I’ve been swamped so I haven’t even had an opportunity to check it out lately. It’s on my to do list.
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Except that the studio albums are not a double album. :lol
If you want to call them companion pieces to one another, have at it, but to call two separate albums a double album is, well, factually incorrect. ;)
I never actually said that they WERE a double album. I said that the two albums benefit when you view them as a double album. The comparison to Automata 1&2 is perfect. Exactly the same thing.
Another one could be Keeper of The Seven Keys.
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Except that the studio albums are not a double album. :lol
If you want to call them companion pieces to one another, have at it, but to call two separate albums a double album is, well, factually incorrect. ;)
I never actually said that they WERE a double album. I said that the two albums benefit when you view them as a double album. The comparison to Automata 1&2 is perfect. Exactly the same thing.
me7 did, though, and his post was the last one before mine (which is why I didn't feel the need to quote it). :)
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We could just start referring to them as V/VI. :angel:
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I think the BTBAM comparison fits better than the SOAD example. Mezmerize and Hypnotize were two albums that work fine on their own. Both have proper endings, Mezmerize doesn't just leave the listener hanging.
Vector and Virus feel to me more like Automata I and II, given how abruptly Vector cuts off.
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I think the BTBAM comparison fits better than the SOAD example. Mezmerize and Hypnotize were two albums that work fine on their own. Both have proper endings, Mezmerize doesn't just leave the listener hanging.
Vector and Virus feel to me more like Automata I and II, given how abruptly Vector cuts off.
Exactly. I even remember the complaints when Automata 1 came out that Blot, while being a killer track, didn’t sound like a proper ending for an album.
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Blot is a far more satisfying album closer than The Grid. Sorry to bring the BTBAM hot takes into the Haken thread. :lol
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I think the BTBAM comparison fits better than the SOAD example. Mezmerize and Hypnotize were two albums that work fine on their own. Both have proper endings, Mezmerize doesn't just leave the listener hanging.
Vector and Virus feel to me more like Automata I and II, given how abruptly Vector cuts off.
Very true. I just like how they did the album covers for that. :biggrin:
I do like how they were getting people to realize how Virus was going to be by posting pictures of Ketchup and Mustard. :lol
Funny thing is, I have both bands' albums but haven't listened to much of Automata I/II much at all.
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I thought Virus ended up being pretty strong, especially after being somewhat disappointed in Vector. I haven't gone back to it in a while, because the time when I was listening to it a lot coincidence with a painful period in my life, but it may have been my favorite album from what I felt was a pretty weak 2020.
For me, though, Haken will probably always be The Mountain, Aquarius and then the rest.
A lot of the same here. I'll also likely be in the minority, but Vector was just nothing special for me. I felt it sounded like just another prog metal band. Virus came back and it had the spark I was looking for and liked about Haken. To me, I can't say they are Part I and Part II of a concept record or set or whatever. They sound vastly different to me. I'm also the type of fan that has The Mountain at the top of their list. IMO, their best by a long shot.
Also, dang.... Ross is super busy! Haken, Novena, and now his own solo album?? That guy is just cranking it out! Good on him for being so creative and productive.
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6:22- in Streams is a nice section. Love mellow Ross! :heart
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I completely agree about the "least bloated double album" ever statement! Some bands put the same amount of work (or less) into a double album (looking at you MP), whereas Haken released the two halves separately and putting a shit ton of work into each of them - resulting in a double album where without a second too much.
And yeah, Virus is still my album of the year 2020, without anything even coming close. And I'm much more of a prog fan than a metal fan.
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https://youtu.be/Tdk45uQd5Y0
Classical Composer Doug Helvering has posted his first ever Haken reaction - "Cockroach King"!
-Marc.
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And yeah, Virus is still my album of the year 2020, without anything even coming close. And I'm much more of a prog fan than a metal fan.
It's always contextual/subjective. It's almost impossible NOT to compare albums to other albums by the same band. And almost unequivocally, there will be at least ONE of those albums that you use as the template....and the newest stuff will NEVER leapfrog.
But if you COULD hear it in a vacuum.....you would say, whoa? Who the hell is this? Virus is a great example. Another one is Falling Into Infinity. If had never heard DT and listened to Lines In The Sand on the album, or even watched JP doing THIS solo....what would you think? https://youtu.be/DGbDQkxg3SU
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FII was one of the last DT albums I heard (well, of the ones that were released when I got into the band in 2013), but I still feel that way about Lines in the Sand.
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Pretty sure if Virus was the first Haken album I had heard, I would have stopped right there and moved to another band.
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FII was one of the last DT albums I heard (well, of the ones that were released when I got into the band in 2013), but I still feel that way about Lines in the Sand.
Sorry, what do you mean by this? FII is the most recent you've heard of all of DT's albums?
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No, it was one of the last ones I heard—when I got into the band 8 years ago. At the time, they had 11 albums, and I heard 9 of them before FII—I only heard WDADU after it. Since then, of course, they've released three more albums, all of which I obviously heard after FII.
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Good thought! I love Falling Into Infinity and I also love Virus, no matter what came before or next. So, if I could hear those two "in a vacuum", I would still feel the same. Two awesome (and underrated) albums.
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https://www.facebook.com/100044565693628/posts/409505897211597/
Who’s ready for a big announcement tomorrow?!
🤔🤔🤔
-Marc.
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I'm afraid I must claim ignorance, genuinely don't know what it is, but would guess something tour related just based on timing.
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Finally announcing Diego’s replacement?
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I hate announcements of announcements.
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I hate announcements of announcements.
And here we are, announcing that there's been an announcement of an upcoming announcement.
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Finally announcing Diego’s replacement?
I don't think they would post a Facebook status update like this one for Diego's replacement. The band still hasn't announced Diego is even leaving the band so I guess many casual Haken-listeners don't even know it.
I think this is something tour-related. New tour dates or something.
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I'd guess NA tour with Symphony X
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Yup!
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FBadMrvWUAw6-Qj?format=jpg&name=4096x4096)
Pretty cool how it starts in NYC and ends in NJ! I may be able to see the first and last show of this tour
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Is it a co-headline tour? That would make sense, since I'd assume both bands would be perfectly capable of doing such a tour on their own. I might be wrong of course.
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Dammit, I knew our cheap ass state was not going to reschedule this tour with Haken. Oh well, guess it's Denver for me.
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Is it a co-headline tour? That would make sense, since I'd assume both bands would be perfectly capable of doing such a tour on their own. I might be wrong of course.
Nothing I read from the social media posts says "co-headlining" and of course they could tour on their own, but maybe to smaller venues. Last couple times Haken performed in NYC it was at a 500 person capacity venue, this time it's 1000 capacity venue for example.
Personally, I'd rather Haken headline. I've struggled to get into SX, but regardless, I will check them out and maybe my mind will be changed.
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Symphony X eats Haken for breakfast and poops it around 11am. But I will see this show in Toronto.
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Symphony X eats Haken for breakfast and poops it around 11am.
Symphony X has a fast metabolism!
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Symphony X eats Haken for breakfast and poops it around 11am.
Symphony X has a fast metabolism!
They have breakfast pretty early...
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SX have top-billing so I'm fairly sure this is their tour, but I'd guess at Haken having a pretty decent length set.
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Love that they're heading to StL! :metal I was a week away from seeing the HAKEN full Affinity show with the family when it was cancelled due to Covid. We were all super bummed. And, I've never seen SX so that'll be cool!
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FBadMrvWUAw6-Qj?format=jpg&name=4096x4096)
Keswick Theater I AM THERE!!!!!!!!!!!!! :metal
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SX have top-billing so I'm fairly sure this is their tour, but I'd guess at Haken having a pretty decent length set.
Yup, it's a reformation of their 20th anniversary tour that was supposed to be with Primal Fear and Firewind. They, or the people in charge of their tour, decided to add Haken in.
I'm just pissed because I knew that once I saw Haken from that date leak a while back, I knew our tour date was going to be dropped because of the fact that our tour was only coming because of the more Power Metal type of tour lineup, which sells in our state. A reworking with a not well known band here in New Mexico, was the likely factor in the venue not booking dates.
I'm actually quite excited though that Symphony X and Haken are touring together, and it's a great incentive to drive out to Denver, and I saw a Mesa date and may even do that date.
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Symphony X eats Haken for breakfast and poops it around 11am.
Symphony X has a fast metabolism!
If only they were as fast when they write albums.
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Was expecting this to be the announcement, will definitely catch at least one show.
On a personal level though, the venue for the NJ show is *literally* only a mile and a half from my parents' house (where I currently live). No bands anywhere near the top of my favorites list have ever come and played there, the only music concerts I've ever seen there are two tours from Slash and Myles Kennedy (which, to be fair, were great shows). I'm set to move to Florida probably by the spring, and the Wellmont is getting Transatlantic and Haken within less than two months of each other. Total bullshit :lol :censored
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Yeah, show in Santa Ana which is about a 20 minute drive on one street for me? Maybe, depending on scheduling. I'm not familiar with either bands, but two decent name value bands at the local club in the OC? I'm intrigued.
Loudwire says it's co-headlining. Maybe Haken gets an hour and Symphony X gets 75 minutes?
Symphony X will celebrate their 25th anniversary with a 2022 North American tour. The progressive metal act will co-headline with fellow prog fiends Haken.
https://loudwire.com/symphony-x-haken-2022-north-american-tour/
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Are SX more popular than Haken? I know they’ve been around a lot longer, but I thought Haken were like THE darlings of progressive metal at this point. I certainly hear a lot more buzz about them than SX.
I mean, when SX came to Seattle a few years ago they co-headlined with Overkill and I certainly consider Haken to be more popular than Overkill.
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Yeah, show in Santa Ana which is about a 20 minute drive on one street for me? Maybe, depending on scheduling. I'm not familiar with either bands, but two decent name value bands at the local club in the OC? I'm intrigued.
Loudwire says it's co-headlining. Maybe Haken gets an hour and Symphony X gets 75 minutes?
Symphony X will celebrate their 25th anniversary with a 2022 North American tour. The progressive metal act will co-headline with fellow prog fiends Haken.
https://loudwire.com/symphony-x-haken-2022-north-american-tour/
If that's true, I'd guess it'll be similar to the Haken/Leprous tour. Both bands get 75 minutes, but one band (in this case SX) goes on last.
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Well, "Anniversary" tours can be bigger for a band than if SX was doing a regular tour on a new album.
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Are SX more popular than Haken? I know they’ve been around a lot longer, but I thought Haken were like THE darlings of progressive metal at this point. I certainly hear a lot more buzz about them than SX.
I mean, when SX came to Seattle a few years ago they co-headlined with Overkill and I certainly consider Haken to be more popular than Overkill.
I'd say SX being around much longer have probably a slightly bigger draw. SX also haven't toured the US in some time so there could be some more interest than Haken who have been touring the US quite a bit before the pandemic hit. Just some speculation on my part.
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Symphony X have been around much longer but haven't maintained the momentum to really grow their fanbase imo, partially due to Amob taking RA's focus, hopefully this means there'll be some new music on the horizon! Will definitely be at the LA show, haven't seen Symphony X since Wacken '16.
Love the Keswick, seems like a strange venue for this tour though, especially when looking at some of the other venues they're playing. I've been in philly this weekend for the first time in 5 years, the Fillmore seems like a better fit for this show but i'm sure it'll be great either way. :metal
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So who’s going to be on keys?
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So who’s going to be on keys?
It’s just so weird that they are not saying anything. They must know that a good portion of their fan base has figured it out.
They kind of have to say something before the first show, don’t they?
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I mean, you'd surely have to think so!
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They won't announce anything and the entire tour the new keyboardist will be wearing a Michael Meyers-esque mask of Diego.
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I mean, you'd surely have to think so!
It's your brother, isn't it?
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I mean, you'd surely have to think so!
It's your brother, isn't it?
I wish!
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Glenside and Montclair are locks for me. NYC and Baltimore we'll see how things pan out.
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Is it a sure thing that Diego is out of the band? It’s very weird they haven’t said anything. If it is a legal issue, an anonymous keyboard player in a Michael Meyers mask may be an actual possibility.
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Is it a sure thing that Diego is out of the band?
I've done it earlier in the thread, but I will assure you, unequivocally, that Diego is no longer in Haken.
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Is it a sure thing that Diego is out of the band?
Links have been posted a couple of times here and there, but basically legal pubic records came to light that showed Diego was removed from the Haken legal entity. That alongside the stink that Diego raised just before that happened (he put his own version of “Host” I believe it was??? It was quickly removed followed by total silence by all parties)
I’m going from memory, so maybe someone can correct me on the finer details…but I’m relatively certain this is about 95% correct
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And yet the band still says nothing about it? That is kinda poor to announce a new tour and not acknowledge a significant member departure. This isn't 1990. This is 2021 where you can keep fans in the loop easily via social media.
Sadly, I have zero interest in going to this. I don't care about Symphony X, and I am sure Haken is likely to heavily feature the last album, one I didn't really like much, so this is a hard pass from me.
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And yet the band still says nothing about it? That is kinda poor to announce a new tour and not acknowledge a significant member departure. This isn't 1990. This is 2021 where you can keep fans in the loop easily via social media.
As I've also said earlier in this thread, I highly doubt the band is keeping us from an announcement simply because they don't want to let us know. It should tell you something that Diego also hasn't said anything publicly.
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And yet the band still says nothing about it? That is kinda poor to announce a new tour and not acknowledge a significant member departure. This isn't 1990. This is 2021 where you can keep fans in the loop easily via social media.
As I've also said earlier in this thread, I highly doubt the band is keeping us from an announcement simply because they don't want to let us know. It should tell you something that Diego also hasn't said anything publicly.
I will take your word for it, but it just seems bizarre.
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There might be some ongoing legal stuff that prevents any party from making a statement.
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Haken eats Symphony X for breakfast and poops it around 11am.
ftfy
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A friend of mine had brief contact with Ray via social media messages and just asked him about Diego. He just replied that unfortunately he is legally not allowed to talk about it.
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A friend of mine had brief contact with Ray via social media messages and just asked him about Diego. He just replied that unfortunately he is legally not allowed to talk about it.
Interesting, well that's pretty clear really.
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If Diego left there sure is a lot of legal stuff to work out.
But what I don't understand is, what legal obligation is keeping them from saying, yeah, Diego left. Not more and not less, just this annoucement. I would have thought that much is possible, but then I'm no lawyer.
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Maybe there is a dispute whether he left or was let go? And making public statements would compromise that party as the initiator of the split?
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Maybe there is a dispute whether he left or was let go? And making public statements would compromise that party as the initiator of the split?
There must be some nasty break up ramifications that come down to money and neither party is going to say anything to potentially jeopardize what's at risk. Just my thoughts.
However, what if it's not resolved by the time the tour starts? I mean, I guess they still don't have to say something but when someone else (or no one) is playing keys, it'll be beyond obvious that just saying "Diego, for reasons we will not speak about, is no longer in the band" would really make things slightly less confusing for those who aren't following along.
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I am not going to speculate. And even at that, when they announce Diego has left Haken, what makes one believe they will be completely honest in their statement and won't say something like, "Due to personal differences".
I am awaiting that day, and see people discuss their upset about the band not being more upfront. When in fact, the fans do not need to know and the band has no obligation to inform the fans as to why.
It's only recently that Paul McCartney spoke about why the beatles broke up. :lol
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However, what if it's not resolved by the time the tour starts? I mean, I guess they still don't have to say something but when someone else (or no one) is playing keys, it'll be beyond obvious that just saying "Diego, for reasons we will not speak about, is no longer in the band" would really make things slightly less confusing for those who aren't following along.
That'd be quite a mess if they can't get it settled by then, since Diego will definitely not be there. They have a few options, though. Maybe Richard plays the keys, maybe they go the Periphery route and just have the keys play through the backing tracks and they only play the solo sections, maybe they get some touring keyboardist and say nothing...
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However, what if it's not resolved by the time the tour starts? I mean, I guess they still don't have to say something but when someone else (or no one) is playing keys, it'll be beyond obvious that just saying "Diego, for reasons we will not speak about, is no longer in the band" would really make things slightly less confusing for those who aren't following along.
That'd be quite a mess if they can't get it settled by then, since Diego will definitely not be there. They have a few options, though. Maybe Richard plays the keys, maybe they go the Periphery route and just have the keys play through the backing tracks and they only play the solo sections, maybe they get some touring keyboardist and say nothing...
Backing tracks would really suck, this is just not the type of music that can get away with using backing tracks to replace a prominent member IMO. I've got to think it is an option though because the band probably would rather tour with backing tracks than not tour at all.
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However, what if it's not resolved by the time the tour starts? I mean, I guess they still don't have to say something but when someone else (or no one) is playing keys, it'll be beyond obvious that just saying "Diego, for reasons we will not speak about, is no longer in the band" would really make things slightly less confusing for those who aren't following along.
That'd be quite a mess if they can't get it settled by then, since Diego will definitely not be there. They have a few options, though. Maybe Richard plays the keys, maybe they go the Periphery route and just have the keys play through the backing tracks and they only play the solo sections, maybe they get some touring keyboardist and say nothing...
Backing tracks would really suck, this is just not the type of music that can get away with using backing tracks to replace a prominent member IMO. I've got to think it is an option though because the band probably would rather tour with backing tracks than not tour at all.
They did have to use backing tracks for Hen's parts on one previous US tour, when there was some visa issue I think and he couldn't end up touring with them. I agree it's not desirable at all, but would be a last resort and there is some precedent for it.
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However, what if it's not resolved by the time the tour starts? I mean, I guess they still don't have to say something but when someone else (or no one) is playing keys, it'll be beyond obvious that just saying "Diego, for reasons we will not speak about, is no longer in the band" would really make things slightly less confusing for those who aren't following along.
That'd be quite a mess if they can't get it settled by then, since Diego will definitely not be there. They have a few options, though. Maybe Richard plays the keys, maybe they go the Periphery route and just have the keys play through the backing tracks and they only play the solo sections, maybe they get some touring keyboardist and say nothing...
If they just stick to playing songs off of VIRUS they don't even need a keyboardist :biggrin:
Of course I'm only (partially) kidding......I really dig HAKEN and their music but I can completely see how Diego could have been a bit peeved about essentially not even being on the last album. Whatever the reason....HAKEN IMO 'needs' a live keyboardist.....it's who they are and it'd feel weird being there live and not having that aspect of their music be visceral and in the moment.
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I saw them without Hen. They sounded great but a big piece of the puzzle was missing live.
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Haven't been to a show in a LONG time where I intentionally missed the opening act and showed up for just the headliner, but this may be the one. I might just be able to cross SX off the bucket list at long last.
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Haven't been to a show in a LONG time
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Haven't been to a show in a LONG time where I intentionally missed the opening act and showed up for just the headliner, but this may be the one. I might just be able to cross SX off the bucket list at long last.
*smacks*
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Haven't been to a show in a LONG time where I intentionally missed the opening act and showed up for just the headliner, but this may be the one. I might just be able to cross SX off the bucket list at long last.
I might go just for the opener :D (well not the actual opener, I don't know them, but the second opener. you get what I'm trying to say :lol)
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Just heard Lambs by Trope on YT.
It’s not bad. But man…these guys REALLY want to be a female fronted Tool. So badly.
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However, what if it's not resolved by the time the tour starts? I mean, I guess they still don't have to say something but when someone else (or no one) is playing keys, it'll be beyond obvious that just saying "Diego, for reasons we will not speak about, is no longer in the band" would really make things slightly less confusing for those who aren't following along.
That'd be quite a mess if they can't get it settled by then, since Diego will definitely not be there. They have a few options, though. Maybe Richard plays the keys, maybe they go the Periphery route and just have the keys play through the backing tracks and they only play the solo sections, maybe they get some touring keyboardist and say nothing...
If they just stick to playing songs off of VIRUS they don't even need a keyboardist :biggrin:
Of course I'm only (partially) kidding......I really dig HAKEN and their music but I can completely see how Diego could have been a bit peeved about essentially not even being on the last album. Whatever the reason....HAKEN IMO 'needs' a live keyboardist.....it's who they are and it'd feel weird being there live and not having that aspect of their music be visceral and in the moment.
I don't think Diego being less present on Virus lead to him leaving. I think it was already on the horizon that they would part ways and he just contributed to one last album. But ended up putting less effort into his contribution.
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Haven't been to a show in a LONG time where I intentionally missed the opening act and showed up for just the headliner, but this may be the one. I might just be able to cross SX off the bucket list at long last.
*smacks*
I wouldn't dare to smack mighty boskaryus but man am I tempted.
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However, what if it's not resolved by the time the tour starts? I mean, I guess they still don't have to say something but when someone else (or no one) is playing keys, it'll be beyond obvious that just saying "Diego, for reasons we will not speak about, is no longer in the band" would really make things slightly less confusing for those who aren't following along.
That'd be quite a mess if they can't get it settled by then, since Diego will definitely not be there. They have a few options, though. Maybe Richard plays the keys, maybe they go the Periphery route and just have the keys play through the backing tracks and they only play the solo sections, maybe they get some touring keyboardist and say nothing...
If they just stick to playing songs off of VIRUS they don't even need a keyboardist :biggrin:
Of course I'm only (partially) kidding......I really dig HAKEN and their music but I can completely see how Diego could have been a bit peeved about essentially not even being on the last album. Whatever the reason....HAKEN IMO 'needs' a live keyboardist.....it's who they are and it'd feel weird being there live and not having that aspect of their music be visceral and in the moment.
I don't think Diego being less present on Virus lead to him leaving. I think it was already on the horizon that they would part ways and he just contributed to one last album. But ended up putting less effort into his contribution.
I suppose someday we will know the reason(s) behind it all. Speculation is all we have at the moment.
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Don't know anything about this sort of legal stuff, but what if they aren't allowed to bring in a full time replacement before having everything settled in?
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Haven't been to a show in a LONG time where I intentionally missed the opening act and showed up for just the headliner, but this may be the one. I might just be able to cross SX off the bucket list at long last.
*smacks*
I wouldn't dare to smack mighty boskaryus but man am I tempted.
:lol I can't stand Haken, but (1) I certainly can't begrudge anyone for liking them, and (2) it isn't for lack of trying. Some may remember me posting awhile back that I was asked to review one of their albums. I spun it relentlessly and tried to stay objective and find positive things I could say about it. But at the end of the day, I just didn't like it, and didn't feel that I could review it without being pretty negative. So I passed on the review altogether because I don't think it is helpful at all for fans or potential fans of the band to have someone who doesn't like them publicly reviewing their album. They just aren't for me, and I'm fine acknowledging that.
EDIT: And nothing against the band members and their abilities. They can clearly play. I watched video of one of the Shattered Fortress shows, and I thought they did a great job with the material. I just don't like their songs.
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:lol I can't stand Haken, but (1) I certainly can't begrudge anyone for liking them, and (2) it isn't for lack of trying. Some may remember me posting awhile back that I was asked to review one of their albums. I spun it relentlessly and tried to stay objective and find positive things I could say about it. But at the end of the day, I just didn't like it, and didn't feel that I could review it without being pretty negative. So I passed on the review altogether because I don't think it is helpful at all for fans or potential fans of the band to have someone who doesn't like them publicly reviewing their album. They just aren't for me, and I'm fine acknowledging that.
EDIT: And nothing against the band members and their abilities. They can clearly play. I watched video of one of the Shattered Fortress shows, and I thought they did a great job with the material. I just don't like their songs.
I vaguely remember that, but don't remember which album. Do you happen to recall which one it was? Just curious as while there's something consistent about their music, each album is fairly different (except the latest two which were essentially a two-parter).
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Haven't been to a show in a LONG time where I intentionally missed the opening act and showed up for just the headliner, but this may be the one. I might just be able to cross SX off the bucket list at long last.
*smacks*
I wouldn't dare to smack mighty boskaryus but man am I tempted.
:lol I can't stand Haken, but (1) I certainly can't begrudge anyone for liking them, and (2) it isn't for lack of trying. Some may remember me posting awhile back that I was asked to review one of their albums. I spun it relentlessly and tried to stay objective and find positive things I could say about it. But at the end of the day, I just didn't like it, and didn't feel that I could review it without being pretty negative. So I passed on the review altogether because I don't think it is helpful at all for fans or potential fans of the band to have someone who doesn't like them publicly reviewing their album. They just aren't for me, and I'm fine acknowledging that.
EDIT: And nothing against the band members and their abilities. They can clearly play. I watched video of one of the Shattered Fortress shows, and I thought they did a great job with the material. I just don't like their songs.
I get you, Bosk. I completely lost all my interest in Haken's music after Virus and now only hang around this thread because of the Diego situation :lol
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Well the last thing to potentially change your mind would be to see them live and if you do go for SX, I'd say it's still worth it to get there earlier and see Haken. I feel like if you bought a ticket and make the effort to get to the venue, you might as well maximize that and at least see what they are about in person. Lots of live performances have changed my opinion of bands. Not always and it's no guarantee, but since it's part of a tour and not just going to see Haken, it's worth it IMO.
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:lol I can't stand Haken, but (1) I certainly can't begrudge anyone for liking them, and (2) it isn't for lack of trying. Some may remember me posting awhile back that I was asked to review one of their albums. I spun it relentlessly and tried to stay objective and find positive things I could say about it. But at the end of the day, I just didn't like it, and didn't feel that I could review it without being pretty negative. So I passed on the review altogether because I don't think it is helpful at all for fans or potential fans of the band to have someone who doesn't like them publicly reviewing their album. They just aren't for me, and I'm fine acknowledging that.
EDIT: And nothing against the band members and their abilities. They can clearly play. I watched video of one of the Shattered Fortress shows, and I thought they did a great job with the material. I just don't like their songs.
I vaguely remember that, but don't remember which album. Do you happen to recall which one it was? Just curious as while there's something consistent about their music, each album is fairly different (except the latest two which were essentially a two-parter).
I think it was Virus. I had heard some of their songs previously and didn't care for them. But I figured that having time to digest an entire album, I could probably find enough that I liked about it to be able to put together a somewhat-positive review. But I just couldn't do it, and didn't want to do the band the disservice of having a pre-release negative review out there in the press. It's one thing to debate about such things on a discussion forum. But I wouldn't want to give them actual negative press that could hurt their livelihood or legitimately irritate their fan base. That isn't cool.
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:lol I can't stand Haken, but (1) I certainly can't begrudge anyone for liking them, and (2) it isn't for lack of trying. Some may remember me posting awhile back that I was asked to review one of their albums. I spun it relentlessly and tried to stay objective and find positive things I could say about it. But at the end of the day, I just didn't like it, and didn't feel that I could review it without being pretty negative. So I passed on the review altogether because I don't think it is helpful at all for fans or potential fans of the band to have someone who doesn't like them publicly reviewing their album. They just aren't for me, and I'm fine acknowledging that.
EDIT: And nothing against the band members and their abilities. They can clearly play. I watched video of one of the Shattered Fortress shows, and I thought they did a great job with the material. I just don't like their songs.
I vaguely remember that, but don't remember which album. Do you happen to recall which one it was? Just curious as while there's something consistent about their music, each album is fairly different (except the latest two which were essentially a two-parter).
I think it was Virus. I had heard some of their songs previously and didn't care for them. But I figured that having time to digest an entire album, I could probably find enough that I liked about it to be able to put together a somewhat-positive review. But I just couldn't do it, and didn't want to do the band the disservice of having a pre-release negative review out there in the press. It's one thing to debate about such things on a discussion forum. But I wouldn't want to give them actual negative press that could hurt their livelihood or legitimately irritate their fan base. That isn't cool.
Fair enough. Although I remember it being quite a while ago, so it's more likely it was Vector. That and Virus (the sequel) have been somewhat polarising even within the fanbase, so actually I don't think you'd have really rocked any boats. :lol But very cool of you nonetheless.
If you do find yourself hearing any of their earlier albums (particularly The Mountain or Affinity) I'd be really interested to hear what you think, but given your reaction to Vector I completely appreciate you probably don't want to actively seek them out.
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Yeah, it was actually Vector.
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Yeah, it was actually Vector.
Ah, their worst album.
:corn
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Yeah, it was actually Vector.
Ah, their best album.
:corn
I know right?? ;)
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Vector and Virus (the sequel) have been somewhat polarising even within the fanbase
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:lol
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Vector has Puzzle Box and Veil which are two of their best songs but the rest is very meh. Virus is very meh overall.
Affinity best (though even that has a few meh songs too).
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Vector has Puzzle Box and Veil which are two of their best songs but the rest is very meh. Virus is very meh overall.
Affinity best (though even that has a few meh songs too).
So you really could called the Meh-ken?
-Marc.
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Vector has Puzzle Box and Veil which are two of their best songs but the rest is very meh. Virus is very meh overall.
Affinity best (though even that has a few meh songs too).
So you really could called the Meh-ken?
-Marc.
It's pronounced MAYh-ken.
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To me The Mountain is their best and it's not even close. Bosk, have you checked out The Mountain?
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Yeah, the first four albums are all miles better than the last two albums, but I get it if someone doesn't want to proceed after hearing either Vector or (especially) Virus. The band fell off my auto-buy list as quickly as they got on it.
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Haven't been to a show in a LONG time where I intentionally missed the opening act and showed up for just the headliner, but this may be the one. I might just be able to cross SX off the bucket list at long last.
*smacks*
I wouldn't dare to smack mighty boskaryus but man am I tempted.
:lol I can't stand Haken, but (1) I certainly can't begrudge anyone for liking them, and (2) it isn't for lack of trying. Some may remember me posting awhile back that I was asked to review one of their albums. I spun it relentlessly and tried to stay objective and find positive things I could say about it. But at the end of the day, I just didn't like it, and didn't feel that I could review it without being pretty negative. So I passed on the review altogether because I don't think it is helpful at all for fans or potential fans of the band to have someone who doesn't like them publicly reviewing their album. They just aren't for me, and I'm fine acknowledging that.
EDIT: And nothing against the band members and their abilities. They can clearly play. I watched video of one of the Shattered Fortress shows, and I thought they did a great job with the material. I just don't like their songs.
Was that for Jorge? I think I ended up writing that review :tup
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I think you guys are all high. The double decker Vector/Virus is one of the best double albums I have ever heard and I don't understand why it's not regarded a modern classic of the genre :metal
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I think you guys are all high. The double decker Vector/Virus is one of the best double albums I have ever heard and I don't understand why it's not regarded a modern classic of the genre :metal
Well, first off, it's not a double album (sorry, it isn't), and second, the songwriting overall is far below the level of not only their first four albums, but of the best the genre has to offer.
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They spoiled us with The Mountain, so the albums after it has a lot to live up to.
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They spoiled us with The Mountain, so the albums after it has a lot to live up to.
Love The Mountain, but I might love Affinity even more ;)
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I think you guys are all high. The double decker Vector/Virus is one of the best double albums I have ever heard and I don't understand why it's not regarded a modern classic of the genre :metal
Well, first off, it's not a double album (sorry, it isn't), and second, the songwriting overall is far below the level of not only their first four albums, but of the best the genre has to offer.
Yup.
Vector has Puzzle Box and Veil which are two of their best songs but the rest is very meh. Virus is very meh overall.
Affinity best (though even that has a few meh songs too).
I'll forever be unsure whether Crystallised or Veil is their worst 6:30+ song.
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Vector has Puzzle Box and Veil which are two of their best songs but the rest is very meh. Virus is very meh overall.
Affinity best (though even that has a few meh songs too).
I'll forever be unsure whether Crystallised or Veil is their worst 6:30+ song.
Crystallised is easily my least favorite of their epics, sure, but Veil kicks ass. Yeah that transition right in the middle sucks, but that's literally my only problem with it. Great riffs and melodies, and a really good flow apart from that single transition. I love the Dream Theater-esque solo section and how it drops right into the last chorus.
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I do find it funny how Haken have now reached that DT level of polarisation in terms of what the best/worst songs/albums are.
I love Vector and Virus. I agree with Kev that they're not a double album, but they are a two-parter and can definitely be listened to together. They're my second favourite (or second and third) behind The Mountain.
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They spoiled us with The Mountain, so the albums after it has a lot to live up to.
Love The Mountain, but I might love Affinity even more ;)
Same here. The Mountain brought me in, but Affinity closed the deal for me.
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Visions FTW! But seriously, if you like DT (which I know Bosk does) then Visions is probably the best starting point with Haken IMO.
Although I've been a big Visions fan since I started listening to Haken, Virus may actually end up being my favorite album by them. I just love the metal side of Haken
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Haven't been to a show in a LONG time where I intentionally missed the opening act and showed up for just the headliner, but this may be the one. I might just be able to cross SX off the bucket list at long last.
*smacks*
I wouldn't dare to smack mighty boskaryus but man am I tempted.
:lol I can't stand Haken, but (1) I certainly can't begrudge anyone for liking them, and (2) it isn't for lack of trying. Some may remember me posting awhile back that I was asked to review one of their albums. I spun it relentlessly and tried to stay objective and find positive things I could say about it. But at the end of the day, I just didn't like it, and didn't feel that I could review it without being pretty negative. So I passed on the review altogether because I don't think it is helpful at all for fans or potential fans of the band to have someone who doesn't like them publicly reviewing their album. They just aren't for me, and I'm fine acknowledging that.
EDIT: And nothing against the band members and their abilities. They can clearly play. I watched video of one of the Shattered Fortress shows, and I thought they did a great job with the material. I just don't like their songs.
Was that for Jorge? I think I ended up writing that review :tup
Yes, it was. Glad you got to do it. My sincere apologies for causing such a short turnaround time for you though. I held onto it for quite awhile trying to find a way to write it, and just felt that I couldn't do the band or its fanbase any justice.
On a different note, thanks to whoever it was that suggested that I get to the show on time to see them because I might really enjoy their live show even though I haven't liked what I have heard so far (can't remember who it was, and couldn't find the post when I looked--but I am tired, so...). That's a good suggestion. Time permitting (it is a long drive and I have things going on earlier in the day, but I may be able to pull that off), I think I will try to do that.
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I think you guys are all high. The double decker Vector/Virus is one of the best double albums I have ever heard and I don't understand why it's not regarded a modern classic of the genre :metal
Well, first off, it's not a double album (sorry, it isn't), and second, the songwriting overall is far below the level of not only their first four albums, but of the best the genre has to offer.
I couldn't disagree more to this... This post might make me some enemies :lol
Yes, those two albums were released separately, but I really see them as one big piece of music, and here are some arguments why. It opens with Clear and closes with the same musical content in Only Stars and the words "all is clear as I end". Vector ended very abruptly. Virus is the first album since Visions not to feature an intro song. And even Aquarius had somewhat of a small overture. Ergo, it continues where A Cell Divides left off. The musical contents of both albums are brought together in Messiah Complex. Both albums come across differently (and work better imo) when listened to together than when listened apart from each other. Both albums feature the same production and sound. The covers, concepts and names are obviously connected. They tell one continuous story. So yeah, they were released separately so technically they are not a double album. But I do see them and listen to them as one double album.
Concerning the songwriting: I love their first albums. But whenever I listen to V/V and Affinity and then to their first 3 albums immediately afterwards, those first 3 albums sound FAR less mature and sophisticated to me. It's the rhythmical level and masterful drumming of Ray Hearne alone that elevates those later albums above the earlier ones for me. But not just that, songs like Veil, The Architect, 1985, Carousel are masterful compositions. And since apparently we're generalizing stuff like "level of songwriting": I think the later albums are not far below the level of their earlier ones. Quite the contrary: those later compositions are far superior in every way in my opinion. And I have heard few albums released in the last 4-5 years that managed to stand up to them.
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Yes, it was. Glad you got to do it. My sincere apologies for causing such a short turnaround time for you though. I held onto it for quite awhile trying to find a way to write it, and just felt that I couldn't do the band or its fanbase any justice.
No worries, I had fun writing it. And I even got to write one for Virus for Sonic Perspectives last year ;)
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Fritz, I think it's semantics. There's clearly a link between the two albums with call backs in the songs from Virus to Vector and there's also a loose story between the albums. However, being released separately, to me, makes them companion albums and not a single double album. I think it's just semantics though, the artistic vision is pretty clear that the two albums go together. I won't get too hung up on someone calling it a double album personally, but I think semantically, that's not correct IMO.
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I think you guys are all high. The double decker Vector/Virus is one of the best double albums I have ever heard and I don't understand why it's not regarded a modern classic of the genre :metal
Well, first off, it's not a double album (sorry, it isn't), and second, the songwriting overall is far below the level of not only their first four albums, but of the best the genre has to offer.
I couldn't disagree more to this... This post might make me some enemies :lol
Yes, those two albums were released separately, but I really see them as one big piece of music, and here are some arguments why. It opens with Clear and closes with the same musical content in Only Stars and the words "all is clear as I end". Vector ended very abruptly. Virus is the first album since Visions not to feature an intro song. And even Aquarius had somewhat of a small overture. Ergo, it continues where A Cell Divides left off. The musical contents of both albums are brought together in Messiah Complex. Both albums come across differently (and work better imo) when listened to together than when listened apart from each other. Both albums feature the same production and sound. The covers, concepts and names are obviously connected. They tell one continuous story. So yeah, they were released separately so technically they are not a double album. But I do see them and listen to them as one double album.
Concerning the songwriting: I love their first albums. But whenever I listen to V/V and Affinity and then to their first 3 albums immediately afterwards, those first 3 albums sound FAR less mature and sophisticated to me. It's the rhythmical level and masterful drumming of Ray Hearne alone that elevates those later albums above the earlier ones for me. But not just that, songs like Veil, The Architect, 1985, Carousel are masterful compositions. And since apparently we're generalizing stuff like "level of songwriting": I think the later albums are not far below the level of their earlier ones. Quite the contrary: those later compositions are far superior in every way in my opinion. And I have heard few albums released in the last 4-5 years that managed to stand up to them.
I'm with you, I really like Virus and Vector for that matter, I just think The Mountain is better (and yes the songwriting in the Mountain is better IMO). Couldn't agree more about Ray however - he's turned into an absolute beast the last two albums!!
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I think you guys are all high. The double decker Vector/Virus is one of the best double albums I have ever heard and I don't understand why it's not regarded a modern classic of the genre :metal
Well, first off, it's not a double album (sorry, it isn't), and second, the songwriting overall is far below the level of not only their first four albums, but of the best the genre has to offer.
So are Automata 1 and 2 by BTBAM completely separate albums, or two parts of a double album?
Because I honestly see absolutely zero difference between the two Automata albums and V/V
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I wouldn’t call them a double album, but the fact that Haken were planning on playing them back to back live tells me the the band themselves consider them companions.
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I think you guys are all high. The double decker Vector/Virus is one of the best double albums I have ever heard and I don't understand why it's not regarded a modern classic of the genre :metal
Well, first off, it's not a double album (sorry, it isn't), and second, the songwriting overall is far below the level of not only their first four albums, but of the best the genre has to offer.
So are Automata 1 and 2 by BTBAM completely separate albums, or two parts of a double album?
Because I honestly see absolutely zero difference between the two Automata albums and V/V
I'm not sure WHAT to think because even though Ayreon released both The Dream Sequencer AND Flight Of The Migrator simultaneously, they're still counted as the 4th and 5th albums, despite being two parts of the Universal Migrator. I personally consider both parts of a double album and then count The Human Equation as the fifth Ayreon album, but most places consider that the sixth one, so who knows anymore. Both albums were later re-released as a double album. I think the fact that they were written and released simultaneously helps the argument of calling them a double, but that's just me.
-Marc.
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I think you guys are all high. The double decker Vector/Virus is one of the best double albums I have ever heard and I don't understand why it's not regarded a modern classic of the genre :metal
Well, first off, it's not a double album (sorry, it isn't), and second, the songwriting overall is far below the level of not only their first four albums, but of the best the genre has to offer.
So are Automata 1 and 2 by BTBAM completely separate albums, or two parts of a double album?
Because I honestly see absolutely zero difference between the two Automata albums and V/V
Automata I & II were recorded at the same time and it was a conscious decision to release them in two parts. Vector & Virus were written and recorded completely separately two years apart.
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I think you guys are all high. The double decker Vector/Virus is one of the best double albums I have ever heard and I don't understand why it's not regarded a modern classic of the genre :metal
Well, first off, it's not a double album (sorry, it isn't), and second, the songwriting overall is far below the level of not only their first four albums, but of the best the genre has to offer.
So are Automata 1 and 2 by BTBAM completely separate albums, or two parts of a double album?
Because I honestly see absolutely zero difference between the two Automata albums and V/V
I'm not sure WHAT to think because even though Ayreon released both The Dream Sequencer AND Flight Of The Migrator simultaneously, they're still counted as the 4th and 5th albums, despite being two parts of the Universal Migrator. I personally consider both parts of a double album and then count The Human Equation as the fifth Ayreon album, but most places consider that the sixth one, so who knows anymore. Both albums were later re-released as a double album. I think the fact that they were written and released simultaneously helps the argument of calling them a double, but that's just me.
-Marc.
For me, the distinction of Double and Single album only relates to the album contracts musicians have with their labels. Releasing two separate albums of the same single concept, possibly counts as two albums being done under the contract. I see it as a way to handle the legal logistics and all that.
For me, the band releasing one single concept separately doesn't matter as the main focus is on the concept. So therefore for me, Virus and Vector are one concept released in two separate discs.
I liked the way they informed us the next release after Vector was going to be a compliment to it, by showing us through Social Media, pictures of Ketchup and Mustard, like saying "We got Ketchup, what compliments it?....Mustard."
I personally enjoy the albums and the story. The music compliments the story and enhances that mood of the type of story it is about. The music makes it feel as if you are the patient being experimented on by "The Good Doctor".
When I listen to concept albums, I do not treat them as normal albums with a collection of unrelated songs. I see them as a unit that when analyzed, needs to include what the concept is about, how the music is telling the story and also the lyrics, does the music progress the story or enhance the mood. This is a big reason I can enjoy Arjen and his cheese in Ayreon, because Ayreon is a big sci-fi concept and world he created, and the music being cheesy fits that concept of sci-fi in the vein of his favorite sci-fi series, Star Trek.
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I think you guys are all high. The double decker Vector/Virus is one of the best double albums I have ever heard and I don't understand why it's not regarded a modern classic of the genre :metal
Well, first off, it's not a double album (sorry, it isn't), and second, the songwriting overall is far below the level of not only their first four albums, but of the best the genre has to offer.
So are Automata 1 and 2 by BTBAM completely separate albums, or two parts of a double album?
Because I honestly see absolutely zero difference between the two Automata albums and V/V
Automata I & II were recorded at the same time and it was a conscious decision to release them in two parts. Vector & Virus were written and recorded completely separately two years apart.
Correct.
When they made Vector, they planned to do a sequel, but Virus was written entirely separately after Vector was out.
Automata was written entirely as a single work. In fact the early version I got to hear via my brother (who as many of you know is in Nova Collective with Dan Briggs) was a single album, and that was before Automata I had even been announced.
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For me the distinction between a double album and a set of companion albums is whether they have been widely distributed in separate packages. That marks them off as separable artistic units, while them always being released together marks them as a single unit. So something like the Universal Migrator albums are separate albums because they were sold separately, even though they have also been sold together. But something like The Astonishing is one double album, even though it's divided into "Act I" and "Act II," because it's always sold as a single package containing two discs.
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Both albums feature the same production and sound.
I couldn't disagree more. The production on Vector sounds like a band jamming in the same room (despite individual timbres leave a bit to be desired), but on Virus it feels incredibly thin which is poorly made up for by excessive brickwalling. They couldn't be more different imo, & for this reason I find the transition between them jarring.
Re: double albums - by definition, if an artist releases two albums in separately, they are separate (albeit connected) entities. Some bands have done this even when it made zero sense (Periphery, BTBAM, C&C, etc.), but that doesn't change the reality of the situation.
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Both albums feature the same production and sound.
I couldn't disagree more. The production on Vector sounds like a band jamming in the same room (despite individual timbres leave a bit to be desired), but on Virus it feels incredibly thin which is poorly made up for by excessive brickwalling. They couldn't be more different imo, & for this reason I find the transition between them jarring.
Interesting, I don't agree at all. Other that the keyboards being a little low in the mix, I slightly prefer the sound on Virus to Vector but find them generally very similar.
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Automata was written entirely as a single work. In fact the early version I got to hear via my brother (who as many of you know is in Nova Collective with Dan Briggs) was a single album, and that was before Automata I had even been announced.
Interesting nugget. Was the track list similar to Automata I and II appended or did it feature a unique sequencing?
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Automata was written entirely as a single work. In fact the early version I got to hear via my brother (who as many of you know is in Nova Collective with Dan Briggs) was a single album, and that was before Automata I had even been announced.
Interesting nugget. Was the track list similar to Automata I and II appended or did it feature a unique sequencing?
It was identical to the finished products. In fact I think it probably was the finished product, or was possibly pre-mastering.
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Yes, those two albums were released separately, but I really see them as one big piece of music, and here are some arguments why. It opens with Clear and closes with the same musical content in Only Stars and the words "all is clear as I end". Vector ended very abruptly. Virus is the first album since Visions not to feature an intro song. And even Aquarius had somewhat of a small overture. Ergo, it continues where A Cell Divides left off. The musical contents of both albums are brought together in Messiah Complex. Both albums come across differently (and work better imo) when listened to together than when listened apart from each other. Both albums feature the same production and sound. The covers, concepts and names are obviously connected. They tell one continuous story. So yeah, they were released separately so technically they are not a double album. But I do see them and listen to them as one double album.
So do the three Godfather films, but we do not call them collectively one film. It was a story told over three films, just like the Haken story (whatever it is) is told over two albums.
Or think of it this way: the TV show Breaking Bad told a story over the course of 62 episodes. Should we call it all one big episode because they all told one continuous story? Nope.
So are Automata 1 and 2 by BTBAM completely separate albums, or two parts of a double album?
Because I honestly see absolutely zero difference between the two Automata albums and V/V
I do not listen to that band, so I honestly have no idea. :)
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Just saw the new dates. Looks like I'll be getting to the venue at 7:45 and sitting down to dinner in K-Town by 8:45. Pretty disappointing. They're also playing the same bar and grill they played last time through. Even more disappointing. Plus, those dates are so crammed together there's really no possibility of them breaking away for one-off headline gigs like they were doing with Devin Townsend. Starting to wonder if I'm ever going to get to see these guys do a full set.
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Just saw the new dates. Looks like I'll be getting to the venue at 7:45 and sitting down to dinner in K-Town by 8:45. Pretty disappointing. They're also playing the same bar and grill they played last time through. Even more disappointing. Plus, those dates are so crammed together there's really no possibility of them breaking away for one-off headline gigs like they were doing with Devin Townsend. Starting to wonder if I'm ever going to get to see these guys do a full set.
I got to imagine they'll want to do a headlining tour again soon enough, but I'd also expect them to appear at a ProgPower again so you can always make the trip to Atlanta when that happens and maybe get to enjoy a bunch of other bands and good times atmosphere.
But as I mentioned to bosk, you wouldn't at least want to check out the other headliner since you're already there and paid for it? Not sure of your history with SX though, I know bosk wasn't a fan of Haken but also had never seen them live.
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Just saw the new dates. Looks like I'll be getting to the venue at 7:45 and sitting down to dinner in K-Town by 8:45. Pretty disappointing. They're also playing the same bar and grill they played last time through. Even more disappointing. Plus, those dates are so crammed together there's really no possibility of them breaking away for one-off headline gigs like they were doing with Devin Townsend. Starting to wonder if I'm ever going to get to see these guys do a full set.
I got to imagine they'll want to do a headlining tour again soon enough, but I'd also expect them to appear at a ProgPower again so you can always make the trip to Atlanta when that happens and maybe get to enjoy a bunch of other bands and good times atmosphere.
But as I mentioned to bosk, you wouldn't at least want to check out the other headliner since you're already there and paid for it? Not sure of your history with SX though, I know bosk wasn't a fan of Haken but also had never seen them live.
Haken where the first band to play back to back ProgPower years in 10 years, and that was only because of Shattered Fortress and likely a little bit of strong-arming from MP. It's not a festival that likes to repeat themselves too quickly, so I'd guess Haken won't be back there for the next 2 or 3 years at least.
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Just saw the new dates. Looks like I'll be getting to the venue at 7:45 and sitting down to dinner in K-Town by 8:45. Pretty disappointing. They're also playing the same bar and grill they played last time through. Even more disappointing. Plus, those dates are so crammed together there's really no possibility of them breaking away for one-off headline gigs like they were doing with Devin Townsend. Starting to wonder if I'm ever going to get to see these guys do a full set.
I got to imagine they'll want to do a headlining tour again soon enough, but I'd also expect them to appear at a ProgPower again so you can always make the trip to Atlanta when that happens and maybe get to enjoy a bunch of other bands and good times atmosphere.
But as I mentioned to bosk, you wouldn't at least want to check out the other headliner since you're already there and paid for it? Not sure of your history with SX though, I know bosk wasn't a fan of Haken but also had never seen them live.
Haken where the first band to play back to back ProgPower years in 10 years, and that was only because of Shattered Fortress and likely a little bit of strong-arming from MP. It's not a festival that likes to repeat themselves too quickly, so I'd guess Haken won't be back there for the next 2 or 3 years at least.
Yup, just like they may not do another full headline tour of the US in 2-3 years. PP has only a few years left and I'd be shocked if they don't play it again before its ending. I do think a full headline tour should happen before their next PP appearance, but who knows.
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Just saw the new dates. Looks like I'll be getting to the venue at 7:45 and sitting down to dinner in K-Town by 8:45. Pretty disappointing. They're also playing the same bar and grill they played last time through. Even more disappointing. Plus, those dates are so crammed together there's really no possibility of them breaking away for one-off headline gigs like they were doing with Devin Townsend. Starting to wonder if I'm ever going to get to see these guys do a full set.
I got to imagine they'll want to do a headlining tour again soon enough, but I'd also expect them to appear at a ProgPower again so you can always make the trip to Atlanta when that happens and maybe get to enjoy a bunch of other bands and good times atmosphere.
But as I mentioned to bosk, you wouldn't at least want to check out the other headliner since you're already there and paid for it? Not sure of your history with SX though, I know bosk wasn't a fan of Haken but also had never seen them live.
Haken where the first band to play back to back ProgPower years in 10 years, and that was only because of Shattered Fortress and likely a little bit of strong-arming from MP. It's not a festival that likes to repeat themselves too quickly, so I'd guess Haken won't be back there for the next 2 or 3 years at least.
Yup, just like they may not do another full headline tour of the US in 2-3 years. PP has only a few years left and I'd be shocked if they don't play it again before its ending. I do think a full headline tour should happen before their next PP appearance, but who knows.
Early on for them it was essential to get a ProgPower or RoSfest type festival to anchor a tour, but they were at a point, assuming COVID hasn't fucked things up too much, to where they can headline a tour of the US without a festival to tour around.
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I'd like to think so too, just not sure how quickly they will come back after their tour in 2022. Maybe they come right back in 2023 for a headline tour. That would be cool. It also seems like the Devin Townsend rescheduling isn't happening considering the bands are all doing their own tours in 2022.
Also, kind of wanted to see what EB thought about maybe attending a PP.
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Funny enough, Devin just tweeted the US dates are being rescheduled to next fall, but didn't give any other details.
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PP has only a few years left and I'd be shocked if they don't play it again before its ending.
What does this mean? Is PP USA going to stop existing at some give point?
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PP has only a few years left and I'd be shocked if they don't play it again before its ending.
What does this mean? Is PP USA going to stop existing at some give point?
The promoter said he's only doing up to #25, granted someone else could take over but as of now, that's all we know. PP USA 21 is this summer
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PSA: Ross Jennings' solo album is out today.
I've loved the singles, very much looking forward to hearing the whole thing when it arrives.
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I haven't heard a single note of his singles yet, so I'm going into his album blind (or deaf).
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Dua Lipa cover is GREAT!!!
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Listened once so far and it's a very nice album. Nothing like Haken, much more 90s/early 00s pop-rock overall, nice mix of influences but pretty much all in a similar tone and style. My initial reaction is that the album's a bit on the long side - with the bonus track it's 78 minutes, but as it all has a pretty similar mood and style throughout I found it dragging just a little. But otherwise it's a really nice collection of songs and Ross sounds great.
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Ross' solo album is so beautiful. It's one of several album releases that are speaking, describing, overall perfect for where I'm at in my life right now. I don't know what it is, but these albums hit me right in the feels.
Especially, songs like Grounded, Feelings, Young At Heart, Words We Can't Unsay, Since That Day, and especially Phoenix (Now this a beautiful, uplifting song).
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Dua Lipa cover is GREAT!!!
Yeah. I think it's a great way to end the album, which I is pretty good overall. As Rich said, quite different from everything I've heard from him before. The album does drag a bit but overall it's nice and enjoyable. I was not expecting this album to drop, but I'm glad it did.
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I'm loving this album more with each listen. Right now Phoenix is the favourite, especially that solo section.
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Funny enough, Devin just tweeted the US dates are being rescheduled to next fall, but didn't give any other details.
We finally got notification last week that the show is cancelled and got our money back. So the tour is not being rescheduled.
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As both a Haken fan and a Dua Lipa fan (I'm being serious) I have been looking forward to this album during its what feels like 10-year long promotion cycle for this album.
Now that it has been out for a few days, I still haven't listened to it, because everything over the last few days has been overshadowed by David Longdon's sudden death.
I'm still looking forward to hearing this album though!
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looks like The Thing we all knew was coming finally got officially confirmed
I am not going to be specific about it because that's funnier to me but you know what it is anyways
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Yeah, the worst kept secret has been confirmed about Diego leaving.
https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial
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Yup officially official now.
(https://scontent.ftpa1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/259247597_434754621353391_7789434169052390918_n.jpg?_nc_cat=100&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=YT1xb4tgyvwAX-BPT7Q&_nc_ht=scontent.ftpa1-2.fna&oh=789d8b505915178461ba9de5d7dc25e8&oe=61A14138)
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I see Haken has officially made the statement that Diego is leaving. The reason being creative differences isn't surprising. He looked really at ease playing alongside Devin Townsend in the videos I saw on YouTube.
I look forward to his future output and to hear what Haken can bring to fruition. I will miss Diego in Haken though, as he was one of the main reasons for me getting into the band.
I am postulating that Ross felt the same and made his solo album for these creative ideas to be released, rather than keeping them bottled and creating a rift like what happened with Diego. He said in the track-by-track video for Grounded that for the lyrics he left his sleeve out there and it's how he feels. I appreciate that and it does show in his tone, emotion, and passion in his vocals for that song.
It's a really beautiful song with a very uplifting message of hope.
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Finally!
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At least this seems a bit more amicable than some were thinking. I wish Diego all the best, though I have to wonder who they will get to replace him in the band? Any ideas, leads, or suggestions?
-Marc.
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And it took them a year to write this statement? ;)
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At least this seems a bit more amicable than some were thinking. I wish Diego all the best, though I have to wonder who they will get to replace him in the band? Any ideas, leads, or suggestions?
-Marc.
Derek Sherinian? JK
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I just hope they do decide to replace him. Given the direction they’ve been going lately, I would hate to see them continue forward with no keyboardist. The other possibility would be someone pulling double duty and thus minimizing the keyboard input. But we will see
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Well, there it is. And now is Diego's new work going to be with Devin Townsend as rumored?
Honestly, the statement itself isn't really news, but seems to hint at both news from Diego and Haken in the future.
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ok!
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Well, there it is. And now is Diego's new work going to be with Devin Townsend as rumored?
I hope he's smarter than Mike Portnoy and doesn't expect that to be a secure position. :lol
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Finally!
At least this seems a bit more amicable than some were thinking. I wish Diego all the best, though I have to wonder who they will get to replace him in the band? Any ideas, leads, or suggestions?
-Marc.
My bet is someone Rich knows very, very well ;) :lol
Well, there it is. And now is Diego's new work going to be with Devin Townsend as rumored?
I hope he's smarter than Mike Portnoy and doesn't expect that to be a secure position. :lol
Savage :rollin
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At least this seems a bit more amicable than some were thinking.
And it took them a year to write this statement? ;)
These two posts go well together.
I agree the statement does appear amicable.
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To put it another way, the statement seems amicable because it took a year of legal fighting to write it out that way. LOL
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:lol
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So when is the announcement that Pete is the new (old) keyboardist?
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I would 100% bet that they are legally required to leave a gap of time between this announcement and announcing the new keyboard player as to let this push as many people to Diego's solo links as possible.
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I would 100% bet that they are legally required to leave a gap of time between this announcement and announcing the new keyboard player as to let this push as many people to Diego's solo links as possible.
I would be willing to bet that they won't announce Diego's replacement til at LEAST after New Years. They don't tour until early February, so that's about halfway between now and then.
-Marc.
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They could pull an opeth and make the announcement the day before the tour starts. There's really no rush to announce but if they are holding off specifically to help not take away news from Diego, then it sounds like a pretty nice break up.
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They could pull an opeth and make the announcement the day before the tour starts. There's really no rush to announce but if they are holding off specifically to help not take away news from Diego, then it sounds like a pretty nice break up.
True, though I think if ticket sales are a bit underperforming, an announcement a few weeks ahead of the tour might help them boost sales up a bit, especially if their original keyboardist returns.
-Marc.
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Yup officially official now.
(https://scontent.ftpa1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/259247597_434754621353391_7789434169052390918_n.jpg?_nc_cat=100&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=YT1xb4tgyvwAX-BPT7Q&_nc_ht=scontent.ftpa1-2.fna&oh=789d8b505915178461ba9de5d7dc25e8&oe=61A14138)
:'( :'( :'(
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I will GREATLY miss Diego in Haken. He is definitely one of my favorite keyboard players currently.
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Well, there it is. :( :(
Will be interesting to see where the band goes from here and how. My interest had already dropped quite a bit after the last two records, and now this being confirmed has firmly taken them off my auto-buy list, as quickly as they gotten on it. Oh well, at least I got to see them twice with the core lineup intact and saw a lot of the big dogs played. Visions one tour, Crystallized the next. :metal :metal
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Well, there it is. And now is Diego's new work going to be with Devin Townsend as rumored?
I hope he's smarter than Mike Portnoy and doesn't expect that to be a secure position. :lol
Diego hasn’t sent out his press release, so, there’s that. ;) :D
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Yes he did. Check out his Facebook page.
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I hope he wasn't mad about my Haken scores.
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Yes he did. Check out his Facebook page.
Whoops. :facepalm:
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Hey, I'm here for you. Lol
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I hope he wasn't mad about my Haken scores.
He blamed you directly.
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I hope he wasn't mad about my Haken scores.
He blamed you directly.
:lol
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Oh well, at least I got to see them twice with the core lineup intact and saw a lot of the big dogs played.
Which core lineup? :lol I assume you mean the latest one. They've had two bassists since they started putting out full releases.
I am noticing that the people who have complained about Diego making minimal contributions to Virus are generally the ones most negative about his departure, which I find odd. But then maybe I've got more of a picture of what Diego is like from being closer to some of the band for a long time.
I couldn't really say anything about what went wrong in the last couple of years, mainly because I only know snippets so couldn't fairly paint a full picture, plus the bits and pieces I do know it wouldn't be appropriate to talk about anyway. It's quite possible there really was an element of creative differences (which I usually see as a euphemism).
But what I do know is that there were some issues for years. Not sure I've ever posted about this before, but now that he's left I kinda don't mind doing so. In particular, at least when it came to the live setting, Diego never pulled his weight. Definitely as far back as Visions, possibly even the Aquarius tour when he'd only just joined, the band were small and didn't have any crew at all so they needed to set everything up themselves. They would all pitch in to do this as a team, apart from Diego who as far as I know (and observed myself once) refused to help out. So regardless of exactly what happened in the last two years, I feel quite strongly that Diego leaving is a good thing for the band.
In terms of his contributions to Haken, I'm thankfully comfortable separating my opinions on those from my opinions on him. I loved his sound design work on Affinity, and I like As Death Embraces a lot too. So I'm glad for those contributions, but nothing else of his really stands out and I've always found his lead playing very bland.
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Oh well, at least I got to see them twice with the core lineup intact and saw a lot of the big dogs played.
Which core lineup? :lol I assume you mean the latest one. They've had two bassists since they started putting out full releases.
I am noticing that the people who have complained about Diego making minimal contributions to Virus are generally the ones most negative about his departure, which I find odd. But then maybe I've got more of a picture of what Diego is like from being closer to some of the band for a long time.
I couldn't really say anything about what went wrong in the last couple of years, mainly because I only know snippets so couldn't fairly paint a full picture, plus the bits and pieces I do know it wouldn't be appropriate to talk about anyway. It's quite possible there really was an element of creative differences (which I usually see as a euphemism).
But what I do know is that there were some issues for years. Not sure I've ever posted about this before, but now that he's left I kinda don't mind doing so. In particular, at least when it came to the live setting, Diego never pulled his weight. Definitely as far back as Visions, possibly even the Aquarius tour when he'd only just joined, the band were small and didn't have any crew at all so they needed to set everything up themselves. They would all pitch in to do this as a team, apart from Diego who as far as I know (and observed myself once) refused to help out. So regardless of exactly what happened in the last two years, I feel quite strongly that Diego leaving is a good thing for the band.
In terms of his contributions to Haken, I'm thankfully comfortable separating my opinions on those from my opinions on him. I loved his sound design work on Affinity, and I like As Death Embraces a lot too. So I'm glad for those contributions, but nothing else of his really stands out and I've always found his lead playing very bland.
I've worked with lots of bands and there's often one guy in the band or crew who may be perfectly nice but for whatever reason isn't interested in helping set up or tear down. He finds ways to stay away and/or act like he's busy, e.g. engaging in conversations with folks nearby. The rest of the band and crew notice, and it gets on their nerves, but in almost all cases I've experienced it, the guy isn't a jerk or whatever, so it's hard to get too mad at him. He just doesn't want to do the setup/teardown. No idea about Diego but just saying that in general it doesn't surprise me when that's the case.
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Oh well, at least I got to see them twice with the core lineup intact and saw a lot of the big dogs played.
Which core lineup? :lol I assume you mean the latest one. They've had two bassists since they started putting out full releases.
I am noticing that the people who have complained about Diego making minimal contributions to Virus are generally the ones most negative about his departure, which I find odd. But then maybe I've got more of a picture of what Diego is like from being closer to some of the band for a long time.
I couldn't really say anything about what went wrong in the last couple of years, mainly because I only know snippets so couldn't fairly paint a full picture, plus the bits and pieces I do know it wouldn't be appropriate to talk about anyway. It's quite possible there really was an element of creative differences (which I usually see as a euphemism).
But what I do know is that there were some issues for years. Not sure I've ever posted about this before, but now that he's left I kinda don't mind doing so. In particular, at least when it came to the live setting, Diego never pulled his weight. Definitely as far back as Visions, possibly even the Aquarius tour when he'd only just joined, the band were small and didn't have any crew at all so they needed to set everything up themselves. They would all pitch in to do this as a team, apart from Diego who as far as I know (and observed myself once) refused to help out. So regardless of exactly what happened in the last two years, I feel quite strongly that Diego leaving is a good thing for the band.
In terms of his contributions to Haken, I'm thankfully comfortable separating my opinions on those from my opinions on him. I loved his sound design work on Affinity, and I like As Death Embraces a lot too. So I'm glad for those contributions, but nothing else of his really stands out and I've always found his lead playing very bland.
I feel this post. Seriously. I’ve seen “that guy” and I get it.
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@ariich Thanks for sharing your insight in a tactful way.
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I've worked with lots of bands and there's often one guy in the band or crew who may be perfectly nice but for whatever reason isn't interested in helping set up or tear down. He finds ways to stay away and/or act like he's busy, e.g. engaging in conversations with folks nearby. The rest of the band and crew notice, and it gets on their nerves, but in almost all cases I've experienced it, the guy isn't a jerk or whatever, so it's hard to get too mad at him. He just doesn't want to do the setup/teardown. No idea about Diego but just saying that in general it doesn't surprise me when that's the case.
Yep that's all completely fair, and I'd not meant to imply that the live issue alone would have been enough to cause a major rift. Indeed, it went back to the early days and he was in the band for over 10 years.
I guess the purpose of sharing my observation (which I should stress is informed but still partial, and should be taken as such) is to explain why him leaving didn't come as a surprise to me. For what actually led to his departure, I don't know and can only speculate. Maybe the issues with effort/contribution got worse or more pervasive, maybe it genuinely was creative differences, maybe something else entirely, quite possibly a combination of factors. But ultimately it always seemed his position in the band might be unsustainable because of how he approached it.
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"To bring you the music we are passionate about (and we'll have news about that soon)..."
Is it likely just more tour dates, or actual new music being hinted at there? :P
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I seriously hope that they do carry on with a new keyboard player. Some newer prog metal/djenty bands have shown that it's possible to make heavy and at the same time atmospherical music without a keyboard player, but in Haken, the keys take on a more important role than that.
I loved Diego's input in Haken and am thankful for his contributions. But it feels like this step is the most logical for everyone involved and it doesn't sound like there are too many hard feelings involved.
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Well, that was a long time coming. It's good that it's finally out and everyone can move on. I also want to point out that Rich started sharing some inside info about the band and answered some questions, yet he didn't even acknowledge these two posts. I'm taking this a sign.
So when is the announcement that Pete is the new (old) keyboardist?
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Finally!
At least this seems a bit more amicable than some were thinking. I wish Diego all the best, though I have to wonder who they will get to replace him in the band? Any ideas, leads, or suggestions?
-Marc.
My bet is someone Rich knows very, very well ;) :lol
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Well, that was a long time coming. It's good that it's finally out and everyone can move on. I also want to point out that Rich started sharing some inside info about the band and answered some questions, yet he didn't even acknowledge these two posts. I'm taking this a sign.
So when is the announcement that Pete is the new (old) keyboardist?
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Finally!
At least this seems a bit more amicable than some were thinking. I wish Diego all the best, though I have to wonder who they will get to replace him in the band? Any ideas, leads, or suggestions?
-Marc.
My bet is someone Rich knows very, very well ;) :lol
Well, I'd be VERY surprised if Pete doesn't end up returning to the band (unless he's unable to, but not because they didn't want him back).
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As both a Haken fan and a Dua Lipa fan (I'm being serious)
Future Nostalgia is one of my favourite ever albums. It's pop music at its very best (I'm being serious).
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It kinda sounds like he might have been asked to leave, versus "quitting" the band.
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Oh well, at least I got to see them twice with the core lineup intact and saw a lot of the big dogs played.
Which core lineup? :lol I assume you mean the latest one. They've had two bassists since they started putting out full releases.
I can't think of the name of either bassist to be honest, so yeah I will go with the lineup that was intact the last few years as the core lineup. That is my story. :)
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:lol
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No surprise here. Sad to see him leave, but appreciate all the things he contributed to Haken's sound, and wish him the best! Also looking forward to what the future of Haken holds. I'm curious if they're going with a touring keyboardist for the time being, or bringing in a full-time member? I imagine it's actually been a while since Diego "left" so they might have a replacement already, but just aren't saying anything yet out of respect for Diego, and letting people jump on board his other projects first.
The way they recruited Conner was super cool, so I'm curious if they would do that again if they haven't found someone yet.
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I wonder if they'll do a quick EP with the new band member, like they did when Connor joined.
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I wonder if they'll do a quick EP with the new band member, like they did when Connor joined.
Time to re-arrange and re-record the other 3 songs they left from the original demo :tup
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Especially if the guy who played on the original recordings is back
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No offense to Ariich's brother, but does he have the chops to replace Diego? Not just anybody can play his parts. I haven't heard his live playing though, so maybe he's just as good.
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If you dedicate yourself for 10,000 hours, you can become proficient at anything. ;D
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No offense to Ariich's brother, but does he have the chops to replace Diego? Not just anybody can play his parts. I haven't heard his live playing though, so maybe he's just as good.
Nova Collective.
https://youtu.be/HwPe5jVYKe4
-
Progressive rockers, Haken, have announced that they have parted ways with keyboardist, Diego Tejeida.
Says the band: "Dear all, we unfortunately have to announce that Diego is leaving us for pastures new. We’d like to thank him for sharing the journey with us so far and we couldn’t be more proud of the music we’ve created over the years. We are so grateful for all of the accomplishments, adventures and good times we’ve shared together. But never fear! Haken will continue with its mission to bring you the music we are passionate about (and we’ll have news on that soon), but in the meantime, join us in wishing Diego all the best in his future musical adventures."
-
Progressive rockers, Haken, have announced that they have parted ways with keyboardist, Diego Tejeida.
Says the band: "Dear all, we unfortunately have to announce that Diego is leaving us for pastures new. We’d like to thank him for sharing the journey with us so far and we couldn’t be more proud of the music we’ve created over the years. We are so grateful for all of the accomplishments, adventures and good times we’ve shared together. But never fear! Haken will continue with its mission to bring you the music we are passionate about (and we’ll have news on that soon), but in the meantime, join us in wishing Diego all the best in his future musical adventures."
Did you not read the entire page before your post? :rollin
-
Yeah. Heck, even I knew! :lol
-
I think it was officially announced by the band over a week ago now.
It's literally being discussed in the posts directly above. :lol
-
Also, Mike Portnoy, who once hit the gong on a Haken song, has left Dream Theater. Statement to follow...
-
Progressive rockers, Haken, have announced that they have parted ways with keyboardist, Diego Tejeida.
Says the band: "Dear all, we unfortunately have to announce that Diego is leaving us for pastures new. We’d like to thank him for sharing the journey with us so far and we couldn’t be more proud of the music we’ve created over the years. We are so grateful for all of the accomplishments, adventures and good times we’ve shared together. But never fear! Haken will continue with its mission to bring you the music we are passionate about (and we’ll have news on that soon), but in the meantime, join us in wishing Diego all the best in his future musical adventures."
*Flashback to ten days ago...*
looks like The Thing we all knew was coming finally got officially confirmed
I am not going to be specific about it because that's funnier to me but you know what it is anyways
Yeah, the worst kept secret has been confirmed about Diego leaving.
https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial
Yup officially official now.
(https://scontent.ftpa1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/259247597_434754621353391_7789434169052390918_n.jpg?_nc_cat=100&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=YT1xb4tgyvwAX-BPT7Q&_nc_ht=scontent.ftpa1-2.fna&oh=789d8b505915178461ba9de5d7dc25e8&oe=61A14138)
I see Haken has officially made the statement that Diego is leaving. The reason being creative differences isn't surprising. He looked really at ease playing alongside Devin Townsend in the videos I saw on YouTube.
I look forward to his future output and to hear what Haken can bring to fruition. I will miss Diego in Haken though, as he was one of the main reasons for me getting into the band.
I am postulating that Ross felt the same and made his solo album for these creative ideas to be released, rather than keeping them bottled and creating a rift like what happened with Diego. He said in the track-by-track video for Grounded that for the lyrics he left his sleeve out there and it's how he feels. I appreciate that and it does show in his tone, emotion, and passion in his vocals for that song.
It's a really beautiful song with a very uplifting message of hope.
Finally!
I thought this was going to be an announcement for Diego's replacement and thought "Wow, they only gave us ten days to take in that information before announcing his replacement?! They haven't even done a 3-part Audition Drama yet!!!"
-Marc.
-
I did a search and didn’t see it. I’m sorry all, I’ll crawl back under my rock now. :blush :blush :blush
-
Also, Mike Portnoy, who once hit the gong on a Haken song, has left Dream Theater. Statement to follow...
:rollin
-
Breaking news: Roger Waters leaves Pink Floyd.
-
Adam and Eve has been banished from the garden of Eden.
-
Creatures have left the water! Evolution has given us the first primitive land animals
Okay, this is getting silly.
-
(https://i.imgur.com/rgwyE7m.jpg)
-
What happened to Charlie's solo album? It has been teased for a long while, but nothing concrete so far.
-
(https://imgpile.com/images/Up2O3j.jpg)
Just got my advance copy! Review Coming soon!
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
-
(https://f4.bcbits.com/img/a3815850793_5.jpg)
ZAMN this demo is SICK!! These guys are gonna be big one day for sure! :metal
-
:rollin :rollin :rollin
-
A few months ago I noticed I had an unread private message on my Facebook. It was some dude asking me if I'd be willing to give him my extra copy of the Haken demo. I must have mentioned having two copies on some music page. I was about to respond when I noticed... it was from December 2018. I completely ignored this dude by accident and I feel so bad about it. :lol Seems waaay past time to respond now.
I think I actually got the demo because someone on this forum was working for the band and giving them away to us through private message if we wanted? It was like ten years ago now. Who was that?
-
I've actually never given the demo a listen. I should check it out one day, since I really like the Restoration EP (especially Crystallised).
-
They just announced on their Facebook page that they are now postponing their 2022 tour. I’ve been wondering if bands would start doing this.
Even though dream theater is still scheduled to play near me in February, I’m starting to wonder if that will happen either.
-
They just announced on their Facebook page that they are now postponing their 2022 tour. I’ve been wondering if bands would start doing this.
Even though dream theater is still scheduled to play near me in February, I’m starting to wonder if that will happen either.
To be clear, this is only their headlining tour in Europe. The US tour with Symphony X is currently still on.
Really frustrating but it does make sense. European countries are in panic mode over the latest COVID variant and so it makes sense to plan on the basis of that still being the case in February, and crossing borders is particularly problematic.
-
They just announced on their Facebook page that they are now postponing their 2022 tour. I’ve been wondering if bands would start doing this.
Even though dream theater is still scheduled to play near me in February, I’m starting to wonder if that will happen either.
To be clear, this is only their headlining tour in Europe. The US tour with Symphony X is currently still on.
Really frustrating but it does make sense. European countries are in panic mode over the latest COVID variant and so it makes sense to plan on the basis of that still being the case in February, and crossing borders is particularly problematic.
Good point. Thank you for the correction.
-
If the US tour still happens, and as of now, I don't see why it wouldn't, then the NYC show will be the first live performance of the VIrus songs and maybe with a new keyboardist. Kind of makes me a bit more hyped for that show now.
-
Not sure if this has been posted elsewhere, but a Christmas version of Slayer with Haken members plus JR and others.
https://www.metalsucks.net/2021/12/22/members-of-protest-the-hero-dream-theater-haken-etc-cover-slayers-seasons-in-the-abyss-for-christmas/
-
So I think Haken is making some sort of announcement tomorrow morning?
Roughly 3 hours ago on their FB story they posted a countdown time of just under 15 hours, which would be around 7am EST tomorrow morning.
Any idea what this might be?
-Marc.
-
So I think Haken is making some sort of announcement tomorrow morning?
Roughly 3 hours ago on their FB story they posted a countdown time of just under 15 hours, which would be around 7am EST tomorrow morning.
Any idea what this might be?
-Marc.
I hope it’s the long overdue announcement of Diego’s replacement.
-
Meanwhile, Diego has been recording music with a new band which seems to include Eric Gillette :metal
-
So I think Haken is making some sort of announcement tomorrow morning?
Roughly 3 hours ago on their FB story they posted a countdown time of just under 15 hours, which would be around 7am EST tomorrow morning.
Any idea what this might be?
-Marc.
I hope it’s the long overdue announcement of Diego’s replacement.
Thinking this is it, background of their ig story with the same timer is a keyboard.
-
:angel:
-
I think Rich knows something :P
-
Dammit Rich… WE’RE your posse!!! :rollin ;D :angel:
-
It only just now occurred to me…
…did I just date myself by using the term “posse”? ???
-
Dammit Rich… WE’RE your posse!!! :rollin ;D :angel:
Indeed, that's why I'm slightly more open here than elsewhere on the net. :lol :heart Like about the Diego situation back when that was announced.
It only just now occurred to me…
…did I just date myself by using the term “posse”? ???
Yep. :lol
-
Meanwhile, Diego has been recording music with a new band which seems to include Eric Gillette :metal
I saw that Diego is doing something, which excites me, but where did you read about Eric?
-
Here’s the announcement. Pete Jones back in the keyboard seat.
https://www.loudersound.com/news/haken-announce-return-of-original-keyboard-player-pete-jones
Not familiar enough with early Haken to know if that’s a good thing or not. He played in Nova Collective though which I thought was pretty cool.
-
Oh wow, he looks just like Rich! It's insane how alike you guys look :lol
-
Yay! :D
Not familiar enough with early Haken to know if that’s a good thing or not.
He was 15-16 at the time, so I wouldn't use it as much of an indicator. :lol
He played in Nova Collective though which I thought was pretty cool.
That's definitely more relevant. He also has a electronic solo project (Nested Shapes) and provided electronic drums and a few other bits and bobs on Vector and Virus.
-
Oh wow, he looks just like Rich! It's insane how alike you guys look :lol
Yeah seriously. We sound quite similar too in the way we speak. :lol
-
Nice! :lol
I guess congrats are in order, Rich.
-
Nice! :lol
I guess congrats are in order, Rich.
Not to me, but I'll happily pass them to Pete from DTF. :)
-
Nice! :lol
I guess congrats are in order, Rich.
Not to me, but I'll happily pass them to Pete from DTF. :)
Please do, give him our best :)
-
I can't believe Ariich is in Haken
-
I can't believe Ariich is in Haken
That post go well with your avatar :lol
-
Nice! :lol
I guess congrats are in order, Rich.
Not to me, but I'll happily pass them to Pete from DTF. :)
Please do. Just saw the Facebook post.
-
That's awesome Rich!
You'll hook us all up with some Haken swag now amirite? :lol
-
Was it mandatory to grow a beard to join Haken? ;)
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:angel:
How long have you known?
-
Was it mandatory to grow a beard to join Haken? ;)
Yes, according to Haken:
(https://i.imgur.com/E094hgQ.png)
:angel:
How long have you known?
It's been on the cards for a few months.
-
Was it mandatory to grow a beard to join Haken? ;)
Yes, according to Haken:
So that's why the old bassist left...
-
Nice!
-
Great news! And after his involvement with Nova Collective + Vector/Virus, it was a no-brainer, really. Congrats to your brother, Rich! :hefdaddy :metal
As for this:
Meanwhile, Diego has been recording music with a new band which seems to include Eric Gillette :metal
I saw that Diego is doing something, which excites me, but where did you read about Eric?
It's just about putting pieces together, really. There was an interview with Diego from years ago (I think it's the one that MinistroRaven did, but I'm not entirely sure) where he said he'd love to collaborate with Eric and Baard Kolstad someday. Fast-forward to present day, Diego's post says he got his first options for each of the band members AND Eric also shared a video clip of him recording for a new, secret project that sounds an awful lot like Haken when they Diego was actually present in the mix :P (https://www.facebook.com/EricGilletteMusic/videos/4880315675347487/)
-
Great news!! Congratulations to Pete!!
-
Hell yeah!! I came as soon as I saw the fb post!
Excited to see them with Pete, please pass congrats to him ariich!
-
Great news! And after his involvement with Nova Collective + Vector/Virus, it was a no-brainer, really. Congrats to your brother, Rich! :hefdaddy :metal
As for this:
Meanwhile, Diego has been recording music with a new band which seems to include Eric Gillette :metal
I saw that Diego is doing something, which excites me, but where did you read about Eric?
It's just about putting pieces together, really. There was an interview with Diego from years ago (I think it's the one that MinistroRaven did, but I'm not entirely sure) where he said he'd love to collaborate with Eric and Baard Kolstad someday. Fast-forward to present day, Diego's post says he got his first options for each of the band members AND Eric also shared a video clip of him recording for a new, secret project that sounds an awful lot like Haken when they Diego was actually present in the mix :P (https://www.facebook.com/EricGilletteMusic/videos/4880315675347487/)
You, here: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-diego-tejeida/
-
Exciting news! I wonder how long it'll be before they start working on new material with Peter in the band again. Think we'll see a new album this year?
-Marc.
-
Very cool for this to finally be announced.
-
Exciting news! I wonder how long it'll be before they start working on new material with Peter in the band again. Think we'll see a new album this year?
-Marc.
IIRC, I read Ross Jennings (?,not sure. Their singer.) mentioning them being in the studio at some point soon ish for their seventh album yes.
-
So when is the announcement that Pete is the new (old) keyboardist?
Old news. I called it 2 months ago. :biggrin:
-
So when is the announcement that Pete is the new (old) keyboardist?
Old news. I called it 2 months ago. :biggrin:
Some people were calling it 2 years ago (or close enough anyway), genuinely before it was even a thing. :lol
-
Exciting news! I wonder how long it'll be before they start working on new material with Peter in the band again. Think we'll see a new album this year?
-Marc.
Not sure about the timing of an album, but possibly! They have already started working on ideas and Pete has been fully involved already. My understanding from what he's said is that some of the ideas are pretty well developed already, but it's hard to guess how long it'll take to have a full album well developed and ready to record.
-
Great news! And after his involvement with Nova Collective + Vector/Virus, it was a no-brainer, really. Congrats to your brother, Rich! :hefdaddy :metal
As for this:
Meanwhile, Diego has been recording music with a new band which seems to include Eric Gillette :metal
I saw that Diego is doing something, which excites me, but where did you read about Eric?
It's just about putting pieces together, really. There was an interview with Diego from years ago (I think it's the one that MinistroRaven did, but I'm not entirely sure) where he said he'd love to collaborate with Eric and Baard Kolstad someday. Fast-forward to present day, Diego's post says he got his first options for each of the band members AND Eric also shared a video clip of him recording for a new, secret project that sounds an awful lot like Haken when they Diego was actually present in the mix :P (https://www.facebook.com/EricGilletteMusic/videos/4880315675347487/)
You, here: https://www.sonicperspectives.com/interviews/interview-with-diego-tejeida/
That's the one :tup
-
Rich, let Pete know that all the fans have to have a beard to get into the venues to see them as well. LOL
-
Great news! And after his involvement with Nova Collective + Vector/Virus, it was a no-brainer, really. Congrats to your brother, Rich! :hefdaddy :metal
As for this:
Meanwhile, Diego has been recording music with a new band which seems to include Eric Gillette :metal
I saw that Diego is doing something, which excites me, but where did you read about Eric?
It's just about putting pieces together, really. There was an interview with Diego from years ago (I think it's the one that MinistroRaven did, but I'm not entirely sure) where he said he'd love to collaborate with Eric and Baard Kolstad someday. Fast-forward to present day, Diego's post says he got his first options for each of the band members AND Eric also shared a video clip of him recording for a new, secret project that sounds an awful lot like Haken when they Diego was actually present in the mix :P (https://www.facebook.com/EricGilletteMusic/videos/4880315675347487/)
Yes, I saw Eric's post on FB. Plus I felt they had great chemistry together when the played with MP's Shattered Fortress.
-
Rich, let Pete know that all the fans have to have a beard to get into the venues to see them as well. LOL
Damn, locking me out of Haken concerts :lol
-
Rich, let Pete know that all the fans have to have a beard to get into the venues to see them as well. LOL
This probably doesn't affect at least 50% of their current fanbase.
-
Really happy to hear this news. I do hope that their material moving forward has a bit more keyboards out front.
I still can't help but be curious about whether Diego's parts were being forced out because they just happen to be writing more guitar oriented stuff....or if the stuff was more guitar oriented because Diego's contributions just weren't something they were clicking with anymore. Chicken or the egg.
In any event. Sometimes things like this can light a spark.
-
I found Haken in 2009 when someone gave me the first demo and loved it. My favorite album is still Aquarius with Visions a close second. After that they became just another cool prog band. Restoration is reworked demo tunes which is excellent but Virus shows them becoming run of the mill. I like Haken but their identity that captured me when they broke onto the scene has vanished.
-
Rich, let Pete know that all the fans have to have a beard to get into the venues to see them as well. LOL
I'm safe!
-
I found Haken in 2009 when someone gave me the first demo and loved it. My favorite album is still Aquarius with Visions a close second. After that they became just another cool prog band. Restoration is reworked demo tunes which is excellent but Virus shows them becoming run of the mill. I like Haken but their identity that captured me when they broke onto the scene has vanished.
I absolutely can't understand how that is possible :lol Their last albums are just insanely good and I know no band who can produce albums like that.
-
I love all Haken albums, but I can't deny that something changed with The Mountain. It mostly changed for the better IMO, but some amount of slow paced neo-prog innocence was lost along the way. Now Haken do shorter albums that have more ideas crammed into them.
-
Yeah, I'll admit that outside of a few songs (Crystallised, Earthrise) Haken haven't really done anything that's interested me since The Mountain. None of it's been bad necessarily, but they seem to have lost a lot of the quirkiness that defined their early stuff and consequently their new music is just kind of unmemorable.
Seems like they're more popular than ever though so I get that this isn't the majority opinion.
-
I discovered them around 2011 after Visions was released, but it was actually Celestial Elixir that introduced me to the band. I instantly became a fan, but it was with The Mountain that they became one of my favorite bands of all time, only behind DT. I remained a huge fan untill a few months after Vector was out, because that album didn't do quite well with me, but it was still enjoyable and I still followed them closely. Then the dang virus came and it completely killed the band for me (and I'm not talking about covid :P). Hoping the next one, whenever ends up being released, doesn't sound anything like Vector/Virus and that they find their love/use for keyboards again. Let's go, Pete!
-
Well since we're all bringing up when we discovered Haken, I looked back through my emails and Amazon orders and noticed I had ordered Visions back in February of 2013 (along with the first Redemption album). I guess I found them around that time, before The Mountain came out later that year, though apparently I didn't order The Mountain until April 2016. I guess I discovered Haken but they didn't stick with me at the time because I'm not sure why I wouldn't have ordered The Mountain in 2013 after it came out. For some reason, I waited 3 years and ordered it just before Affinity came out, which is an album I really enjoy. I think I may have heard The Mountain online and wasn't too impressed by it at the time, but I remember loving Visions since I got it. Aquarius was really good too when I first heard it.
In retrospect, I'd say Visions and Affinity are still my two favorites. Vector and Virus are fine, but start to veer into territory that feels familiar to other bands and sounds. I really enjoyed what they had going on before hand, as those albums stand out among the rest of my collection and listening. With their original keyboardist back in, I hope they reflect on where they've been and try to rekindled the spark that their earlier work had. I think most fans will appreciate it if their next album wasn't so closely tied to Vector/Virus in terms of over-all sound and feel and do something new and unique for them, like Affinity.
-Marc.
-
I found Haken in 2009 when someone gave me the first demo and loved it. My favorite album is still Aquarius with Visions a close second. After that they became just another cool prog band. Restoration is reworked demo tunes which is excellent but Virus shows them becoming run of the mill. I like Haken but their identity that captured me when they broke onto the scene has vanished.
I absolutely can't understand how that is possible :lol Their last albums are just insanely good and I know no band who can produce albums like that.
I agree, they are great. That's not my point. I just think they became more typical.
-
From that sonicperspectives interview. it seems that Diego was a bit uninterested on prog music lately, hence, this can be the reason for the keyboards being less prominent, specially on Virus. And maybe why he parted ways with the band.
About Vector/Virus I do think they are great, but I just prefer The Mountain and Affinity from all their albums.
-
I actually didn't discover Haken until hearing the first D'virgilio Morse Jennings song and liked it enough to check them out again. I've kind of checked them out throughout the years but didn't try hard. I think normally my initial reaction was not liking the singer much, so I didn't give them much of a chance. But recently when fully discovering them I like the singing.
I decided to start at the beginning of the discography so listened to Aquarius first. Totally loved it and instantly loved the band. Since then I have listened to Virus and Vector quite a bit. Love those albums too but Aquarius is still my favorite.
Trying to get to know the albums pretty well before moving onto the next albums. I'm kind of half familiar with Affinity at this point but haven't dug at all into Mountain or Visions yet.
-
Now that Pete's back, they should give the Restoration treatment to the other 3 songs from the demo :tup
-
Yesss, specially I would love to hear a “restoration” of Manifolds!
-
Rich, let Pete know that all the fans have to have a beard to get into the venues to see them as well. LOL
Does a goatee count? Or does it have to be full on John Petrucci Grizzly Adam's style beard?
-
The first time I heard Haken was definitely their demo, and I seem to halfway remember getting it from ariich, but I may be mistaken on that part.
-
Rich, let Pete know that all the fans have to have a beard to get into the venues to see them as well. LOL
Does a goatee count? Or does it have to be full on John Petrucci Grizzly Adam's style beard?
I would assume since the lead singer has a goatee it's ok. LOL
-
The first time I heard Haken was definitely their demo, and I seem to halfway remember getting it from ariich, but I may be mistaken on that part.
Yeah probably, or at least I'd have pointed you to where to get a download/CD/whatever. I started a thread here pretty much as soon as there was any music to hear. That one died in the 2009 forum implosion though (remember those days of DTF drama?)!
-
The first time I heard Haken was definitely their demo, and I seem to halfway remember getting it from ariich, but I may be mistaken on that part.
Yeah probably, or at least I'd have pointed you to where to get a download/CD/whatever. I started a thread here pretty much as soon as there was any music to hear. That one died in the 2009 forum implosion though (remember those days of DTF drama?)!
Drama? Nahhh. Don't know nothin' 'bout no drama associated with the forum in 2009.
-
In case anyone missed it, Peter posted a photo on his Instagram story of Ray at a mic’d up kit at the same place where he tracked Virus yesterday.
-
In case anyone missed it, Peter posted a photo on his Instagram story of Ray at a mic’d up kit at the same place where he tracked Virus yesterday.
He tracked Virus yesterday? :o
-
In case anyone missed it, Peter posted a photo on his Instagram story of Ray at a mic’d up kit at the same place where he tracked Virus yesterday.
My friend replied to that story "new album??" and Pete just answered with a smiley that has now mouth. Maybe there's something going on? I can't imagine that they already wrote a new album though.
-
Virus' first single was released in April 2020. A new album being written by now wouldn't surprise me.
-
I’d reckon it could be either a new album, or the second version of Restoration. There’s other songs they didn’t redo, and having Peter back is definitely a good reason to do so. Also, it’s three full length albums later (meaning it’s the same distance from the original as the original was from the demo). Add into that the fact that Restoration happened when Connor joined, so this would be a great first release for the next lineup change.
-
I don't use much social media, but I heard that the band teases the seventh album with pictures of sheet music.
-
Virus' first single was released in April 2020. A new album being written by now wouldn't surprise me.
Especcially considering they havent been touring and have a new keyboardist. What else can you do besides start to move forward with a new album?
-
I’d reckon it could be either a new album, or the second version of Restoration. There’s other songs they didn’t redo, and having Peter back is definitely a good reason to do so. Also, it’s three full length albums later (meaning it’s the same distance from the original as the original was from the demo). Add into that the fact that Restoration happened when Connor joined, so this would be a great first release for the next lineup change.
I'd love to see them doing this, but I wouldn't mind a full length new album either :biggrin:
-
In case anyone missed it, Peter posted a photo on his Instagram story of Ray at a mic’d up kit at the same place where he tracked Virus yesterday.
My friend replied to that story "new album??" and Pete just answered with a smiley that has now mouth. Maybe there's something going on? I can't imagine that they already wrote a new album though.
They've not finished writing a whole album yet, no. But there is momentum again and they are actively working on new music, hence Pete's instagram tags of #H7ken.
-
Apparently, Ross has been recording vocals for a couple days already...
-
https://fb.watch/bnvEuCqMKj/
-
:metal
-
Album 7th, has been recorded.
-
:metal :metal :metal
-
Album 7th, has been recorded.
This is cool and all, but did they really have to name it "World War III"? Look how well that turned out last time...
(stole this joke from a random Facebook commenter)
-
Album 7th, has been recorded.
This is cool and all, but did they really have to name it "World War III"? Look how well that turned out last time...
(stole this joke from a random Facebook commenter)
ROFL
-
Album 7th, has been recorded.
Are you sure it's already been recorded? In the video they say that they finished writing it.
-
Album 7th, has been recorded.
Are you sure it's already been recorded? In the video they say that they finished writing it.
Oh, yes, writing. You’re right.
-
It has not all been recorded. It has been written.
There has been some recording so far but definitely not the whole album.
-
Hoping for a fall release date in 2022. Maybe it'll get a 4-letter V-word as the title? Vector, Virus, V___?
-Marc.
-
Hoping for a fall release date in 2022. Maybe it'll get a 4-letter V-word as the title? Vector, Virus, V___?
-Marc.
Victory? vicious? Volatile?
-
Hoping for a fall release date in 2022. Maybe it'll get a 4-letter V-word as the title? Vector, Virus, V___?
-Marc.
Vaxx? :lol
Joking aside, I want them to return to a more melodic approach like previous albums and not make a continuation of Vector and, specially, Virus.
Anyway, very excited about new Haken this year :metal
-
I'm quite certain the new album will not be related to Vector and Virus.
-
Hoping for a fall release date in 2022. Maybe it'll get a 4-letter V-word as the title? Vector, Virus, V___?
-Marc.
Vaxx? :lol
Joking aside, I want them to return to a more melodic approach like previous albums and not make a continuation of Vector and, specially, Virus.
Anyway, very excited about new Haken this year :metal
I would die if it was VAXX. :lol
I kind of hope the music is more like Visions and Affinity than Vector and Virus. Heck, I would take an album even closer to the likes of their debut! No matter what, I just hope for good music either way.
And related to Haken, I finally listened to Ross' solo album online and WOW, what a beautiful piece of work! I've ordered the CD and signed print from his store today so I cannot wait to get the physical disc in hand, but until then, I'll be listening digitally. My only nitpick is that I kind of wish it was a bit shorter, or he had saved some of the songs for a 2nd album and release another one this year. It's a PACKED CD, and I think he could've made his debut 40-50 minutes long, save some of those songs, write a few more, and release another album this year. OR...maybe he just has a LOT of material he doesn't use for Haken. If that's the case, I hope he continues to put out solo albums because I really enjoy what I've been hearing from him!
-Marc.
-
Given how Virus foreshadowed world events in 2020, I hope they haven't been writing an album called War in the past months.
-
It’s their one chance to use VIIsions: Visions 2 pt. 1…
-
No Fred, No.
Sorry. Couldn't help myself. :lol
-
You guys are overlooking the real mystery.
What will be the next condiment?
-
I'm just wondering who will leave the band after the next 3 studio albums :lol
-
No Fred, No.
Sorry. Couldn't help myself. :lol
Perfect haha, username is exactly that… Fred is the family dog :lol
-
:lol
-
Leaked cover art for H7ken
(https://i.imgur.com/sn7ViCU.jpg)
-
Leaked cover art for H7ken
(https://i.imgur.com/sn7ViCU.jpg)
I hope they use it!
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
-
This needs to be shared to them.
-
I don't use social media, so if someone would be so kind :lol
-
:rollin :rollin :rollin
PLEASE Ariich!!! At least show it to them!!
-
Leaked cover art for H7ken
(https://i.imgur.com/sn7ViCU.jpg)
Can you add a cucumber?
-
That's how all us fans feel like. Lol
-
Leaked cover art for H7ken
(https://i.imgur.com/sn7ViCU.jpg)
Can you add a cucumber?
That's a zucchini my man.
*Waits for those to get the joke*
-
Leaked cover art for H7ken
(https://i.imgur.com/sn7ViCU.jpg)
Shouldn't it be blue? :biggrin:
-
I'm not much of a photo editor (I just threw this together in Snapchat :lol) but I added the little blue pill
(https://i.imgur.com/7PgJQ57.jpg)
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:rollin VIIagra!!!
-
When people describe the band's evolution over time, they often forget to consider that Hen stepped down as a keyboard player after The Mountain. If the band wants to differentiate the next album from Vector/Virus, adding some four-handed keyboard sections would be an option.
-
When people describe the band's evolution over time, they often forget to consider that Hen stepped down as a keyboard player after The Mountain. If the band wants to differentiate the next album from Vector/Virus, adding some four-handed keyboard sections would be an option.
He also stepped down as being the main/only writer for the band. Their whole sound changed when they started writing as a full band.
-
When people describe the band's evolution over time, they often forget to consider that Hen stepped down as a keyboard player after The Mountain. If the band wants to differentiate the next album from Vector/Virus, adding some four-handed keyboard sections would be an option.
I remember Nick asking Rich about this after seeing a Haken show a couple tours ago, and Hen immediately shut it down :lol Seemed like he wanted to focus entirely on the guitar.
-
When people describe the band's evolution over time, they often forget to consider that Hen stepped down as a keyboard player after The Mountain. If the band wants to differentiate the next album from Vector/Virus, adding some four-handed keyboard sections would be an option.
I remember Nick asking Rich about this after seeing a Haken show a couple tours ago, and Hen immediately shut it down :lol Seemed like he wanted to focus entirely on the guitar.
Yeah, which greatly saddens me, as generally speaking anytime I've seen them live and both Diego and Hen were on keys it was pretty much always some of my favorite moments of the show. My only hope at this point is that Peter being back inspires some changes in that regard.
-
Does Hen still play keys live on the older songs that need it? I know there's one section in Cockroach King that was him on keys, but live he started playing it on guitar instead. (which I believe stemmed from when he was unable to travel with the rest of the band due to Visa issues and Charlie played that part on guitar)
-
Yes he does.
-
When Virus came out I was totally expecting a third album with a faded green cover called Vaccine, I won't lie. ;D
-
Somehow they already did it with Aquarius. The cover is green and the lyrics talk about a "cure". It's all part of the Haken Extended Universe.
-
I was thinking the same thing. And then someone pointed out that Affinity was mostly green. :justjen
-
I was thinking the same thing. And then someone pointed out that Affinity was mostly green. :justjen
Yeah, a lot of the promotional material for Affinity associated the album with green, so I don't think they'll go with a green album cover this time around. If I had to guess, it might be something black or blue, and probably NOT purple since Ross just used purple for his solo album (if that's a valid excuse for not using the color, but who knows).
Whatever color(s) they pick, I hope it's none of these:
(https://musicglue-images-prod.global.ssl.fastly.net/haken/product/haken-ketchup-tea-towel?u=aHR0cHM6Ly9tdXNpY2dsdWUtdXNlci1hcHAtcC00LXAuczMuYW1hem9uYXdzLmNvbS9vcmlnaW5hbHMvMzA0MWU2N2ItMjdhMi00MDgzLWE0MjMtNDQ5NzI1MDE0MDYx&width=1200&mode=contain)
-Marc.
-
The only band I have LPs for and they’re all wall mounted. A really good run of covers so far, kind of reminds me of Metallica’s first 5 though not as iconic as those. Looking forward to whatever’s next
-
Whatever color(s) they pick, I hope it's none of these:
(https://musicglue-images-prod.global.ssl.fastly.net/haken/product/haken-ketchup-tea-towel?u=aHR0cHM6Ly9tdXNpY2dsdWUtdXNlci1hcHAtcC00LXAuczMuYW1hem9uYXdzLmNvbS9vcmlnaW5hbHMvMzA0MWU2N2ItMjdhMi00MDgzLWE0MjMtNDQ5NzI1MDE0MDYx&width=1200&mode=contain)
-Marc.
Is that an official image? Looks really good! :tup
-
Whatever color(s) they pick, I hope it's none of these:
(https://musicglue-images-prod.global.ssl.fastly.net/haken/product/haken-ketchup-tea-towel?u=aHR0cHM6Ly9tdXNpY2dsdWUtdXNlci1hcHAtcC00LXAuczMuYW1hem9uYXdzLmNvbS9vcmlnaW5hbHMvMzA0MWU2N2ItMjdhMi00MDgzLWE0MjMtNDQ5NzI1MDE0MDYx&width=1200&mode=contain)
-Marc.
Is that an official image? Looks really good! :tup
Yep! I own the towel of it, it's also available as an apron on their official store. I've got the towel magnetted onto my fridge door.
-Marc.
-
With some shows coming relatively soon for the band, I'm hoping they get to do a small headliner tour before the release of H7ken this year. I believe they also said they'd like to have a live album focused on Vector/Virus, and I don't see that happening after the new album drops.
-
I hope we get a live Blu-ray focused on Vector/Virus
-
I hope we get a live Blu-ray focused on Vector/Virus
It was close to happening. Ross tweeted:
ＲＯＳＳ ＪＥＮＮＩＮＧＳ
@RossWJennings
·
Feb 27
Tonight SHOULD have been the
@Haken_Official live filmed performance of Vector & Virus in full at our bucket list London venue Shepherds Bush Empire, cancelled for the 2nd time! But I guess there are more tragic things happening in the world right now than me not doing a show...
-
I hope we get a live Blu-ray focused on Vector/Virus
It was close to happening. Ross tweeted:
ＲＯＳＳ ＪＥＮＮＩＮＧＳ
@RossWJennings
·
Feb 27
Tonight SHOULD have been the
@Haken_Official live filmed performance of Vector & Virus in full at our bucket list London venue Shepherds Bush Empire, cancelled for the 2nd time! But I guess there are more tragic things happening in the world right now than me not doing a show...
Hope they can make it happen at some point :'(
-
We’ve just finished recording our latest single, Nightingale, from our forthcoming album! We are looking forward to getting back on the road soon and seeing our fans, but before that, we would love to give you a chance to be part of our newest upcoming release. We want YOU to create a piece of artwork based on the title of our new single. Send your creations to Haken2022@gmail.com and don’t forget to post your artwork submissions on social media with the hashtag #HakenNightingale and a winner will be chosen by the band as the cover artwork for our new song. The winner will receive a Haken prize pack including one-of-a-kind exclusive autographed memorabilia from the writing sessions, and two tickets to an upcoming show of your choice, anywhere in the world!
The deadline for sending in your entries is 11:59pm (GMT) on 17th March and please make sure to send your artwork as a 300dpi, 3000 x 3000 pixel size format. We can’t wait to showcase the creativity of the best fans in music!
See more details including terms & conditions at hakenmusic.com/nightingale #HakenNightingale
https://fb.watch/bFO8wHUdxy/ (https://www.facebook.com/HakenOfficial)
-
Very excited about the new single! :metal
-
I guess we'll get the single in early April. Excited!
-
:hat
-
I bet you've already heard the entire album, Rich :lol
-
I bet you've already heard the entire album, Rich :lol
That'd be impressive considering it's not been recorded yet. :lol
I have heard Nightingale though. :P
-
A snippet is up on their FB page. It’s only about 10 seconds, but it sounds pretty tasty. :metal
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A snippet is up on their FB page. It’s only about 10 seconds, but it sounds pretty tasty. :metal
It is? Where?
-
What he means might be that snippet of music that underlines Peter Jones' announcement in a recent clip (on FB) where he talks about a competition for fans to submit the possible single art for Nightingale. What you hear there is not connected to any recent Haken piece (that I know of)
-
What he means might be that snippet of music that underlines Peter Jones' announcement in a recent clip (on FB) where he talks about a competition for fans to submit the possible single art for Nightingale. What you hear there is not connected to any recent Haken piece (that I know of)
Isn't that from Messiah Complex?
-
might be, not sure
-
I bet you've already heard the entire album, Rich :lol
That'd be impressive considering it's not been recorded yet. :lol
I have heard Nightingale though. :P
Did they also record Prosthetic before the rest of Virus?
-
I bet you've already heard the entire album, Rich :lol
That'd be impressive considering it's not been recorded yet. :lol
I have heard Nightingale though. :P
Did they also record Prosthetic before the rest of Virus?
I'd say so, because you can actually hear the keyboards on that one :P
-
I bet you've already heard the entire album, Rich :lol
That'd be impressive considering it's not been recorded yet. :lol
I have heard Nightingale though. :P
Did they also record Prosthetic before the rest of Virus?
Not to my knowledge.
-
Sorry…I’m at work. It didn’t sound immediately familiar, and it was playing over an image of some artwork that said “Nightingale” so I put 2 and 2 together and I was apparently mistaken. Sorry for the false alarm.
-
Sorry…I’m at work. It didn’t sound immediately familiar, and it was playing over an image of some artwork that said “Nightingale” so I put 2 and 2 together and I was apparently mistaken. Sorry for the false alarm.
Oh you mean the Instagram stories thing that displays a few fan's entries? I think that had clips from 1985 and Carousel in it.
-
Sorry…I’m at work. It didn’t sound immediately familiar, and it was playing over an image of some artwork that said “Nightingale” so I put 2 and 2 together and I was apparently mistaken. Sorry for the false alarm.
Oh you mean the Instagram stories thing that displays a few fan's entries? I think that had clips from 1985 and Carousel in it.
That was it! And Instagram “stories” are now featured on Facebook…thus adding to the confusion.
-
Sp, if Nightingale drops in April-ish, when should expect the full album to release?
-
Sp, if Nightingale drops in April-ish, when should expect the full album to release?
Well, they have tours coming up, so I wouldn't expect the album to be completed until later in the year.
-
Sp, if Nightingale drops in April-ish, when should expect the full album to release?
Well, they have tours coming up, so I wouldn't expect the album to be completed until later in the year.
Hopefully they can record/release that live album before :tup
-
There’s some very impressive entries in the Nightingale competition and loads of entries that I’d be absolutely horrified if Haken chose, so I’m looking forward to seeing the results. ;D
On another note, surely it can’t be much longer until the rescheduled tour dates are announced? It’s been almost 3 months since they postponed the European tour.
-
There’s some very impressive entries in the Nightingale competition and loads of entries that I’d be absolutely horrified if Haken chose, so I’m looking forward to seeing the results. ;D
Yeah there are some very artistic and talented people out there. A couple of the entries seems to keep with the Vector/Virus theme too. I hope they go for another art direction this time though.
-
I have no idea how to embed instagram posts but I love this one, I’d be really happy if it won.
https://www.instagram.com/p/Ca9DVosNz00/?utm_medium=copy_link
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I have no idea how to embed instagram posts but I love this one, I’d be really happy if it won.
https://www.instagram.com/p/Ca9DVosNz00/?utm_medium=copy_link
That's definitely the best one I've seen so far. One of the comments says it's even better and all the other official Haken album covers :lol
What I was wondering, though, is if the band would want to change their font/logo this time around, since they change it regularly and they already wrapped the Vector/Virus theme. We've had Aquarius and Visions with the same font, then The Mountain and Restoration with another, Affinity was different from all the others; and then Vector and Virus had the same one. Time for a new one?
-
I have no idea how to embed instagram posts but I love this one, I’d be really happy if it won.
https://www.instagram.com/p/Ca9DVosNz00/?utm_medium=copy_link
That's definitely the best one I've seen so far. One of the comments says it's even better and all the other official Haken album covers :lol
What I was wondering, though, is if the band would want to change their font/logo this time around, since they change it regularly and they already wrapped the Vector/Virus theme. We've had Aquarius and Visions with the same font, then The Mountain and Restoration with another, Affinity was different from all the others; and then Vector and Virus had the same one. Time for a new one?
Yeah I thought that too, just from seeing fans using all the different fonts in their submissions.
-
Listened to Vector and Virus, and plan in to do the rest of the studio releases backwards with L1VE at the end. Was thinking of trying to chuck the L+1 tracks into the main set if I can work out a good flow. Anyone got any ideas?
-
Listened to Vector and Virus, and plan in to do the rest of the studio releases backwards with L1VE at the end. Was thinking of trying to chuck the L+1 tracks into the main set if I can work out a good flow. Anyone got any ideas?
Don't do it :)
L+1VE was recorded 1 year before. They're separated on the L-1VE release as well, with the first DVD holding the Amsterdam set (can you spot me in the audience?) and the second having the PPUSA one.
-
Listened to Vector and Virus, and plan in to do the rest of the studio releases backwards with L1VE at the end. Was thinking of trying to chuck the L+1 tracks into the main set if I can work out a good flow. Anyone got any ideas?
Don't do it :)
L+1VE was recorded 1 year before. They're separated on the L-1VE release as well, with the first DVD holding the Amsterdam set (can you spot me in the audience?) and the second having the PPUSA one.
And can you spot me in that PPUSA one? :D
-
L+1VE was recorded 1 year before. They're separated on the L-1VE release as well, with the first DVD holding the Amsterdam set (can you spot me in the audience?) and the second having the PPUSA one.
And can you spot me in that PPUSA one? :D
Based on the fact I don’t know what either of you look like, spotting you in the DVDs will be very tricky.
-
L+1VE was recorded 1 year before. They're separated on the L-1VE release as well, with the first DVD holding the Amsterdam set (can you spot me in the audience?) and the second having the PPUSA one.
And can you spot me in that PPUSA one? :D
Based on the fact I don’t know what either of you look like, spotting you in the DVDs will be very tricky.
I'm actually very easy at one point. During Crystallised, in the "I hold your hand, but you let go" section I'm the first one Ross comes over to.
-
The winner of the cover art contest was announced today. Maybe the single drops this Friday?
-
I feel like they”d have said “Friday” instead of soon though. Here’s hoping though.
-
Nah it won't be quite that quick. I imagine they'll announce it slightly before release.
-
Nah it won't be quite that quick. I imagine they'll announce it slightly before release.
(https://64.media.tumblr.com/712bb09d35015ffb897070aa26e90fe1/46574f869dd03af9-6e/s400x600/3133706592dc4e91c586256cbacb026aab5f2507.gifv)
-
I'm guessing early April :tup
-
I'm guessing early April :tup
2023
-
I'm guessing early April :tup
2023
:rollin
-
The winner of the cover art contest was announced today. Maybe the single drops this Friday?
The artwork that won was pretty cool!
(https://scontent-ort2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/276321491_508811603947692_6597021985189693688_n.jpg?_nc_cat=102&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=I95lARpnEpwAX-XQVkZ&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-1.xx&oh=00_AT-2cBrpnny1U39s1P80Dj4bnNbqidGK5WRU6KD6wbOtAA&oe=6241A1BC)
-
Ooh, that is indeed good. Would have made a cracking album cover.
-
I hope Haken make another contest for the album cover! (But I don't think they will)
AND I wish DT would so something like this.
-
I hope Haken make another contest for the album cover! (But I don't think they will)
AND I wish DT would so something like this.
It would be a tight race between Hugh Syme and Hugh Syme for sure!
-Marc.
-
:lol
-
Personally I think bands as big as Haken and DT should just pay a professional artist instead of mooching free work off of their fanbase...
-
Personally I think bands as big as Haken and DT should just pay a professional artist instead of mooching free work off of their fanbase...
Well, DT for one DOES pay a professional artist, but they generally get results that aren't as good as they would if they mooched free work off of their fanbase.
I think it's a great way for fan involvement, along with getting interesting product.
-
Personally I think bands as big as Haken and DT should just pay a professional artist instead of mooching free work off of their fanbase...
Two trains of thought on this one.
1. Yeah, you’re right, should just lay a professional artist who’s already in the industry. Someone gets paid for the work they do and it comes from a name people already trust. However, a lot of the recent DT artwork by Hugh Syme (a very huge name) has been blank backgrounds and clip art with an attached Majesty symbol. On the other hand Wayne Joyner, who does the animations used in the DoT and AVFTTOTW tours, puts in so much extra attention to detail because there is that fan perspective as well. As a fan, I’m not happy with it, I now have the chance to change it myself, I’m gonna take it up!
2. We don’t know that they aren’t getting paid. Haken could’ve very easily reached out and said “hey, you won, we’ll send you a couple hundred, send us your banking details” but kept it discreet. This also may not be the case. But this artist just got massive exposure. Hell, I want to commission them for artwork. Looks amazing!
-
I'm sure the fan artist got paid, and also got a lot of exposure for their work. I wouldn't call it mooching at all.
-
I think it might be really cool if the band hired the same guy who just won this to make the actual album cover and all that :tup
-
I think it might be really cool if the band hired the same guy who just won this to make the actual album cover and all that :tup
100% should. They’re obviously very very talented.
-
Personally I think bands as big as Haken and DT should just pay a professional artist instead of mooching free work off of their fanbase...
Well, DT for one DOES pay a professional artist, but they generally get results that aren't as good as they would if they mooched free work off of their fanbase.
I agree, and that says to me they need to get another "professional" artist. :lol
I'm sure the fan artist got paid, and also got a lot of exposure for their work. I wouldn't call it mooching at all.
I would hope so (that they got paid). Exposure is obviously good, but the "getting paid in exposure" thing is a massive joke among the artist community for a good reason. Exposure doesn't pay the rent!
I of course don't blame any of the artists for participating. Working for free is obviously an easier pill to swallow if you're doing it simply because you love the band.
-
Also, the band explained all terms and conditions beforehand. I'm sure if one of the graphic artists didn't agree with them, they just wouldn't participate, no big deal.
-
I think it might be really cool if the band hired the same guy who just won this to make the actual album cover and all that :tup
It could be it's what the intent was. They used the Single artwork as a means to work out who to use, and then use them to design their cover art and the other artwork within the album booklet.
But that is a nice, very good single artwork, and I also thought the same exact thing as well, they should use this guy to design their album cover.
-
I know I'm very late to the party, but I'm just now checking Ross' solo album, and oh boy is it good :metal There's some sections where it legit sounds like Jon Anderson singing, and I mean that in a very good way.
He's been killing it lately with everything he's been involved recently (couldn't like Novena, though), which makes me even more excited for Nightingale :tup
-
From Charlie Griffiths:
News and music coming this week!
#insideoutmusic #progressivemetal
#notthehakensongthatscomingsomethingelse
(https://scontent.flim9-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/277977543_407423948055278_1552131544325674334_n.jpg?_nc_cat=109&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_eui2=AeFhS25lAgpYx7d3E2Zk6S5f-b9YB0dWS3n5v1gHR1ZLeYRph63By5BznIcT4h0z1t8&_nc_ohc=vizFVh-g5-8AX9mZC7h&tn=6jtR7BaV_HjVEZAP&_nc_ht=scontent.flim9-1.fna&oh=00_AT8xTaFJ8OjwV1Z4CLVntkGkEDxR7p7Lk-DX0HRY2A-LjA&oe=624FD090)
-
#notthehakensongthatscomingsomethingelse
*cough*
-
#notthehakensongthatscomingsomethingelse
*cough*
I know, but I figured I should post it here anyway :P
-
Still waiting for...whatever?
-
Still waiting for...whatever?
For this? (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=57403.0)
-Marc.
-
Wayyyyyyy late to this party, but for some reason, I decided to give The Mountain another go after several years, and for whatever reason it clicked. It clicked hard, actually.
I'm not sure why it took a decade for me to 'get' the album, but I am sooooo happy I decided to revisit it. I've spent the past week on a massive Haken deep dive, and while the first couple of album's didn't really grab my interest, I think the last four are all stellar.
Obviously, there's a lot to take in, so I'm far from being able to rank the catalog, but with that being said, I'd love it if anyone wanted to give me their personal snapshot/rankings of the Haken catalog.
-
WITH PLEASURE!!!!
The Mountain has quickly become one of my all time favorite albums by anyone ever. So that’s my #1. I was actually in a dark place when I heard that album the first time, and the positive messages about overcoming obstacles (sometimes even the ones you get from your own ego) really lifted me out of a hole. So it’s a very personal album to me.
Visions is probably my #2. The obvious nods and homages to SFAM notwithstanding, it’s still just a very fun and listenable album. The three song trilogy of Minds Eye/Portals/Shapeshifter might be the best thing they’ve ever recorded. And then to follow that up with Deathless is just icing on the cake.
Affinity would be my #3. It was SO DIFFERENT from The Mountain and that’s why I love it. I hate it when a band just repeats themselves (DT is starting to rehash a bit and I find that slightly annoying, but that’s another discussion). I love the variety of dynamics from the album. Experimentation with electronica, some super hefty beefy riffs for the metal crowd, and ending the BEAUTIFUL Bound by Gravity. Just a fantastic album.
Aquarius is #4. Such a great debut. I love it when their harmonies “soar” and there are plenty of those moments on this album. Sun and the ending of Drowning in the Flood are great examples. But Streams, and Point of No Return are incredible as well.
Hard to put any album at the bottom, but I put Vector and Virus in a tie here. I didn’t really care for Vector when it came out, but I liked Virus much better, and because of the continuation of the story, I started listening to them back to back as a single story/concept and I feel like taking it as a single piece elevates both albums. Virus does feel exactly like Vector Part 2…but it also feels like a strong second act to a single story.
Didn’t include the Restoration EP, but I love that as well. And Crystalized to me is the best epic they have ever written.
Haken currently stand as my #3 all time band behind Rush and Dream Theater…but I swear IQ is getting ready to bump them down to #4.
-
I agree with jammindude, the Visions-The Mountain-Affinity streak is their best material + Crystallized and Celestial Elixir.
-
My ranking is pretty similar to jammindude's, but with a few different placements:
1. The Mountain: Also one of my favorite albums of all time. It's wonderfully uplifting even while dealing with some challenging topics. Like Images and Words, I think of this as a lightning-in-a-bottle album, an album that was obviously career-defining as soon as it came out.
2. Aquarius: This is almost 1b for me, and there are times when I prefer it to The Mountain (it's likely that if you search back in this thread for previous rankings, there's at least one where I have it first). It has such an unusual songwriting approach that is definitely not for everyone, but really works for me. Celestial Elixir is still my favorite song by the band, and Drowning in the Flood is top 5. When I think long-range and I'm not in a particular mood, I put this at #2 mainly because it's not as emotionally resonant with me as The Mountain.
3. Affinity: About half of this one took a long time to click with me, but once it did, I came to really enjoy it a lot. The key was the closer, Bound by Gravity. For the longest time, I just wasn't hearing it, and one day it all fell into place, and the other songs I'd been unsure about, Red Giant and The Endless Knot, made so much more sense.
4. Visions: This is their most DT-esque album, and to me it does suffer a bit from not standing out as much stylistically. But the songwriting is undoubtedly there.
5. Virus: I haven't listened to this one since a couple of months after it came out, since it has a difficult personal association for me, but I think it's a good album. I'd have preferred a different stylistic direction to the route they went on the last two albums, but the music is still good.
6. Vector: Still a good album, but just not many memorable songs compared to their other ones.
-
To those who haven’t yet, I strongly recommend listening to Vector and Virus back to back as a single complete piece of work. I promise you that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts
-
I still don't hear the "obvious nods and homages to SFAM" on Visions. Maybe I haven't listened to it enough to pick up on them.
Anyway, this is my ranking.
1. The Mountain
2. Aquarius
3. Affinity
4. Virus
5. Vector
6. Visions
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I swear that the bridge section of Portals is a straight up intentional rip off (in a very tasteful “we’re paying homage” kind of way) to Overture 1928. But there is a list of other similarities that I’m too tired to list tonight.
Nighty night… zzz
EDIT - off the top of my head…the majestic overture with the string section patch in the keyboards and the reincarnation theme. But there’s more. I’m tired.
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We’re doing a ranking? Alright, I’m in.
6. Aquarius - Sorry guys, not a huge fan of this one. I got into Haken post-Affinitour, probably early 2018. It’s not that I don’t have a good time with thus album, it’s great, but this is just so far outside of what I turn to Haken for that it falls to the bottom for me.
Highlights: Aquarium, Drowning in the Flood, Celestial Elixir
5. Vector - I love this album. First new album I was on board for, and it was on this tour that I got to see them for the first time (including meet and greet + lessons with Charlie and Ray). Over time though, it’s proven to be less than I thought it was upon release. A 7 track album, and one of them is an intro tape? Not the best, though it all makes sense now.
Highlights: Good Doctor, Veil, Nil By Mouth
4. Visions - Another great album. I need to stop saying this, because they all are. Visions suffers from the fact that the rest of the album feels very much overpowered by the title track and Nocturnal Conspiracy. Which is more of a problem because I think Nocturnal might actually be my least favourite track on the whole thing. Mind’s Eye-Shapeshifter is a great 3 song run though, and Premonition serving as a full on overture is awesome.
Highlights: Portals, Deathless, Visions
3. The Mountain - This and my number 2 pick are often interchangeable, I just happened to listen to this less recently so it’s lower down. This album is the most perfect balance of ballads and bangers. It’s not often you get an album that can open with something as airy as The Path and end with something as dark and downtrodden as Somebody, yet find room for lounge jazz piano solos, optimistic choruses and outright neck-breakingly heavy riffs. Mountain rules! Cutting it down to three highlights sucks, because there’s way too many tracks deserving of the spotlight.
Highlights: Atlas Stone, Because It’s There, Falling Back to Earth.
2. Virus - Vector’s ending was too open ended? Yeah, that’s for good reason. As Quantum of Solace is to Casino Royale or (retroactively) A New Hope to Rogue One, so is Virus to Vector. And yet, this one trumps it beyond measure. There are great hooks all over this thing, a myriad of callbacks to previous records and so much world building. You want Haken to go more in the direction of Tool and Karnivool? You get Carousel. Wanna hear what it would’ve been like if they were involved in Jeff Wayne’s War of the Worlds? Well, there’s an instrumental hook shared between Prosthetic and Messiah Complex that has you covered. Nah, too much heavy? Have the restraint offered by Canary Yellow. And, being a sequel, we’ll even let Clear have a reprise, but with vocals! The songs left unmentioned are no slouch either, with the building syllables of Invasion’s verses being a vocal highlight, and The Sect proving as a perfect go-between for the heavy and light tracks either side.
Highlights: Prosthetic, Carousel, Messiah Complex
1. Affinity - Bleeps and bloops of machinery whirring to life give way to a rhythmic pulse. A moment of rest, and you’re thrown into my favourite Haken album. I’m 23 (nearly 24), so I wasn’t around for the 80s, but there’s such a nostalgic feel to each song here. 1985 is a masterpiece for Diego’s synth, Bound By Gravity gives me one of the warmest feelings that any song ever has, The Architect is heavy as all hell, Red Giant is haunting, Earthshine is one of the most upbeat tracks in their discography, and the breakdown of The Endless Knot will be played on an endless loop if I ever have my own nightclub. Everything that Haken has been up to this point comes to a head on this album, and you can see why they had to take such a different approach for the following two albums. This was also my introduction to Haken’s music (since my first experience as a whole was through Shattered Fortress), so I hold a particular soft spot with this one. A certain Affinity, if you will.
Highlight: 1985, Architect, Endless Knot.
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My ranking is similar to jammindude's with the exception that I would put the Restoration EP right behind The Mountain.
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Also, is there a band that does reprises better than Haken? Streams in Celestial Elixir, Premonition in Visions, Initiate in Architect and Bound By Gravity, 1985 in Endless Knot and the countless Cockroach King references across Vector and Virus. These guys do it very very right!
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Also, is there a band that does reprises better than Haken? Streams in Celestial Elixir, Premonition in Visions, Initiate in Architect and Bound By Gravity, 1985 in Endless Knot and the countless Cockroach King references across Vector and Virus. These guys do it very very right!
The Dear Hunter has some great reprises all across their "Acts" albums, especially in Act IV and Act V.
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Wow...thank you to everyone who replied!
I listened to 'The Mountain' again on the way into work this morning and damn, that is a solid slice of music.
That being said, I now remember what it was that presented a barrier of entry for me all those years back when I first gave this album a listen—'Cockroach King' is just not at all anything I'm into. I get that this is a fan-favourite, but man, this song does nothing for me.
Interestingly enough, in my intial listen-through last week, it was the 'Vector/Virus' albums that really caught my ear, which are apparently lower on most fans' lists.
I always wondered what it was that 'newer' DT fans saw when they would list albums like D/T or Black Clouds as their favourite, but obviously, anyone who wasn't there from the beginning has a totally different perspective on albums like 'Awake' or 'Scenes.' I suppose, with Haken, I'm approaching their catalog the same way.
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Here are my Haken rankings:
1. The Mountain
2. Vector
3. Affinity
4. Visions
5. Aquarius
6. Virus
3-6 could be sorted in any order for me. I think all of these albums are really great. On top of that, I think Haken has the most consistently great discography out of any band I've listened to.
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That being said, I now remember what it was that presented a barrier of entry for me all those years back when I first gave this album a listen—'Cockroach King' is just not at all anything I'm into. I get that this is a fan-favourite, but man, this song does nothing for me.
Interestingly enough, in my intial listen-through last week, it was the 'Vector/Virus' albums that really caught my ear, which are apparently lower on most fans' lists.
They are also, ironically, based on Cockroach King.
My ranking is still:
1. The Mountain
2. Virus
3. Vector
4. Affinity
5. Visions
6. Aquarius
Although I've been on a bit of an Affinity kick recently so 3 and 4 are probably pretty interchangeable now.
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That being said, I now remember what it was that presented a barrier of entry for me all those years back when I first gave this album a listen—'Cockroach King' is just not at all anything I'm into. I get that this is a fan-favourite, but man, this song does nothing for me.
Interestingly enough, in my intial listen-through last week, it was the 'Vector/Virus' albums that really caught my ear, which are apparently lower on most fans' lists.
They are also, ironically, based on Cockroach King.[/b][/i][/u]
I know—go figure :justjen
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Mine would be,
1. The Mountain
2. Affinity
3. Virus
4. Vector
5. Visions
6. Aquarius
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I'd go:
1. The Mountain
2. Visions
3. Affinity
4. Aquarius
5. Vector
6. Virus
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1. The Mountain
2. Visions
3. Virus
4. Affinity
5. Vector
6. Aquarius
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1. Affinity
2. Virus
3. The Mountain
4. Visions
5. Vector
6. Aquarius
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For the longest time I had Visions as my #1 and I think it still is, but Virus isn't far behind.
That being said, I now remember what it was that presented a barrier of entry for me all those years back when I first gave this album a listen—'Cockroach King' is just not at all anything I'm into. I get that this is a fan-favourite, but man, this song does nothing for me.
I had the same issue. I just couldn't get into Cockroach King and it kind of held The Mountain back for me as being a top Haken album contrary to almost everyone's opinion that it was. Well, I think seeing the song live a bunch of times and just generally more listens, I finally come to enjoy the song for what it is and therefore my enjoyment of the album has really grown. I won't rate it my favorite, but it is up there and it is a really good album even if it took awhile for it to sink in.
sooo
Visions
Virus
The Mountain
Affinity
Vector
still haven't listened to Aquarius
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I enjoy all of the Haken albums.
Affinity
The Mountain
Visions
Vector
Virus
Aquarius
I just enjoy the overall theme that's in Affinity about the shift of perspective. Almost like Technology is affecting how the human mindset is changing and going through a shift.
Aquarius, I just haven't listened to enough.
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Ranking time? Ranking time!
Visions
Affinity
Aquarius / The Mountain
Virus / Vector
Visions and Affinity are definitely my top two, and Visions was where I fell in love with the band, even though The Mountain was their newest at the time. Then Affinity came out and it blew me away, so it sits at second place. The remaining four are grouped in pairs because, and while I enjoy both Aquarius and The Mountain, I don't think I've listened to both enough to really put one above the other, and the same goes for Vector and Virus.
-Marc.
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I'd go:
1. The Mountain
2. Visions
3. Affinity
4. Aquarius
5. Vector
6. Virus
This is probably the closest to my ranking of those posted. I always struggle to pick my favourite Haken album for some reason, favouring any of those top 3 at different times. They're all slightly above Aquarius, which in turn is slightly above Vector. Virus is definitely the one that has the largest gap to the album above it. Still a good listen, but weaker than the rest of what is a phenomenal discography.
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1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Virus
4. Visions
5. Aquarius
6. Vector
I've been listening to Virus a lot lately and it surprised me, I don't remember liking it this much :metal
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1: The Mountain
2: Visions
3: Virus
4: Aquarius
5: Vector
6: Affinity
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1. The Mountain
2. Visions/Affinity
3. Visions/Affinity
4. Aquarius
5. Vector
6. Virus
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I'm giving Visions a fresh spin now. I've always ranked it last, I'm hoping it will "click" with me more, aside from the brilliant title track. Given the DT comparisons I don't know why I'm not more into it.
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Once again I feel like the odd man out. Love every Haken album except The Mountain. Never could connect with it like the others.
Virus and Aquarius are 1 & 2.
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When I listen to Visions, I'm astounded that the band managed to release a Haken-by-numbers album already with their second release. The albums that surround it have much more personality. There are some fine moments on Visions, though, particularly the first three tunes.
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When I listen to Visions, I'm astounded that the band managed to release a Haken-by-numbers album already with their second release. The albums that surround it have much more personality.
I'm not sure that makes any sense to me. How can it be by numbers when you admit its not the same as the other albums?
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To me, it takes the most generic aspects of an otherwise fairly diverse album Aquarius and stretches them out to an album length. The Mountain builds on top of the Haken signature sound from the first two albums and adds new flavors, and then Affinity is a whole different story. The one album that plays it safe and doesn't take too many risks is Visions. That's what makes it Haken-by-numbers to my ears.
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I personally see that a different way. To me, Visions is them stripping the fat off Aquarius, which is overly cluttered at times. The songwriting is significantly stronger on Visions for me. Its my 2nd favourite.
Mountain
Visions
Vector
Virus
Aquarius
Affinity
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There are stylistic reasons why I prefer Aquarius to Visions, which I will get into shortly, but for a shorter reason, it's simply this.
Celestial Elixir is one of the best songs Haken has ever done. Visions is one of the worst (at least for 10+ minutes). And when talking about your closing epics, it's hard to overcome that gap.
Now thankfully Rich had me on board the Haken hype train from early on, and the progression I heard from the demos to the debut was exciting. It took a band in which I saw potential, and in my opinion expanding and delivering on that potential in every way I could have hoped, kinks and all. So my excitement leading into Visions was insane, I wanted to see where the band would go from this amazing starting point. And while I've come to terms with most of the album and enjoy it greatly, at the time it seemed so safe and restrained in some ways. It even took a leap from a band that could be compared to Dream Theater due to every band vaguely in the genre getting that treatment, to a band at times that strayed dangerously close to deserving that comparison.
Thankfully the Mountain came along and took the best of all worlds and blew everyone out of the water, and I've been unquestionably diehard ever since.
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Nick, you make me sad. ;)
While I think Celestial Elixir is great, with the instrumental section in the middle being arguably their best "moment" ever, I think Visions is the slightly better song overall.
I am taking Aquarius over Visions as far as whole albums go, however, as the title track and Deathless are the only top drawer Haken songs on Visions, while most of Aquarius is top drawer for me.
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1. Affinity
2. The Mountain
3. Vector
4. Visions
5. Virus
6. Aquarius
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Nick, you make me sad. ;)
Not as sad as it makes me every time you refuse to acknowledge that Hasse is the lead singer for The Flower Kings. :p
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Nick, you make me sad. ;)
Not as sad as it makes me every time you refuse to acknowledge that Hasse is the lead singer for The Flower Kings. :p
I refuse to acknowledge something that would make me dock them on my list of favorite bands, since one of my favorite bands cannot have that guy as its lead singer. :biggrin:
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Nick, you make me sad. ;)
Not as sad as it makes me every time you refuse to acknowledge that Hasse is the lead singer for The Flower Kings. :p
Is he really the lead singer though? It seems like Roine does a majority of the lead vocals on every album.
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The Flower Kings thread 2.0. Also yes he is. Roine's the lead guitarist first.
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Nick, you make me sad. ;)
Not as sad as it makes me every time you refuse to acknowledge that Hasse is the lead singer for The Flower Kings. :p
Is he really the lead singer though? It seems like Roine does a majority of the lead vocals on every album.
No. Roine was the lead singer from the start, and even with Hasse getting a lot more now than he used to, Roine still sings more lead vocals on just about every album to where he has not been displaced as the lead singer. Nick is just chiding me a little. :biggrin:
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Alright, after spending a couple of weeks listening to nothing but Haken, I humbily submit my 'prisoner-of-the-moment' rankings:
1. The Mountain — A conceptual masterpiece that resonates with me on multiple levels.
2. Virus — A tight, technical assault that reminds me of DT's 'Train of Thought'
3. Affinity — An incredibly diverse set of songs; just wish I liked the epic more :-\
4. Visions — Definitely the most DT-esque offering. Stellar songs occasionally bogged down by derivative sections.
5. Vector — Obviously cut from the same cloth as Virus. Love the production, but the record feels incomplete.
6. Aquarious — Love the epic, but boy am I happy they decided to drop the death growls after this record.
It's also worth mentioning that the E.P. contains what I feel is the band's best epic.
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3. Affinity — An incredibly diverse set of songs; just wish I liked the epic more :-\
More people should.
*looks at Ariich*
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I put the headphones on last night and spun The Mountain. Man, there's a lot going on. Some is melodic and brilliant while other parts seem less so. I think it needs multiple spins to really sink in.
The musicianship is otherworldly. Quite a piece of artistry.
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3. Affinity — An incredibly diverse set of songs; just wish I liked the epic more :-\
More people should.
*looks at Ariich*
:lol Yep I was about to agree with him!
It has some wonderful stuff, but man the second half draaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaags. Probably my least favourite 5 minutes of Haken music.
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Nick, you make me sad. ;)
Not as sad as it makes me every time you refuse to acknowledge that Hasse is the lead singer for The Flower Kings. :p
Is he really the lead singer though? It seems like Roine does a majority of the lead vocals on every album.
No. Roine was the lead singer from the start, and even with Hasse getting a lot more now than he used to, Roine still sings more lead vocals on just about every album to where he has not been displaced as the lead singer. Nick is just chiding me a little. :biggrin:
I'm chiding, but also serious. I've seen TFK like 6 times, their live show makes it clear via person placement and vocal distribution that Hasse is the lead singer of The Flower Kings. Even saying he is one of the lead singers isn't accurate. That's like saying Hasse is one of the lead guitarists of The Flower Kings.
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All this talk, and still no Nightingale :-\
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All this talk, and still no Nightingale :-\
For you, maybe. ;)
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I'm chiding, but also serious. I've seen TFK like 6 times, their live show makes it clear via person placement and vocal distribution that Hasse is the lead singer of The Flower Kings. Even saying he is one of the lead singers isn't accurate. That's like saying Hasse is one of the lead guitarists of The Flower Kings.
Live and the studio are different animals, though. As great as I think Roine is, he is not someone who can sing well while still playing his guitar at his normal high level (I noticed this right away when I saw the early TA DVDs), so I think they intentionally pick a lot of songs that Froberg sings the lead for the live sets so Roine can focus more on his guitar playing. Maybe that is splitting hairs, maybe not, but it seems that way. Interestingly, the one time I saw TFK was late 06, and Roine was positioned on stage closest to front center. I know this because the concert was at some hole in the wall in Chicago and he was literally four feet in front of us the entire show. It was awesome. :coolio :coolio
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All this talk, and still no Nightingale :-\
For you, maybe. ;)
(https://assets.rebelmouse.io/eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiIsInR5cCI6IkpXVCJ9.eyJpbWFnZSI6Imh0dHBzOi8vYXNzZXRzLnJibC5tcy8xNjUxNTgxNi9vcmlnaW4uanBnIiwiZXhwaXJlc19hdCI6MTY4MzA5OTQ3MH0.SF7z80IJm0jVNbY8PcoaEsXMkusTRfjaFQj_FmvGCmw/img.jpg?width=980)
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All this talk, and still no Nightingale :-\
I’d legitimately like to know where Nightingale is. The artwork winner was announced a month ago. We know it’s out there. GIMME!
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All this talk, and still no Nightingale :-\
I’d legitimately like to know where Nightingale is. The artwork winner was announced a month ago. We know it’s out there. GIMME!
Most likely, on ariich's phone :P
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All this talk, and still no Nightingale :-\
For you, maybe. ;)
So, how much of a gag order are you under? Can you at least tell us if keyboards are just a little bit more prominent on this album than they have been on the last couple of albums? Or at least, if you haven’t heard the whole thing, based on what you have heard?
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I've only heard Nightingale, the rest isn't fully recorded yet. So I can't possibly speak for the album, other than I've been told it should apparently be quite varied/diverse. So I'm not drawing any conclusions/assumptions from the sound of Nightingale.
For Nightingale itself, not sure there's a huge amount I can say but to respond to your specific question, it's not a super synth heavy track or anything, but there's plenty of keys all over it.
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Who's up for a Mission: Impossible style heist of ariich's mobile device?
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:rollin
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Ayone up for some iCloud hacking then?
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Good thing I don't use Apple products. :neverusethis:
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Let us know if we take the jokes too far. Just keep in mind that you started it ;)
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Let us know if we take the jokes too far. Just keep in mind that you started it ;)
It's all good. :lol It's not my place to reveal specific details/information, but no harm in sharing vague high-level impressions like that.
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Let us know if we take the jokes too far. Just keep in mind that you started it ;)
It's all good. :lol It's not my place to reveal specific details/information, but no harm in sharing vague high-level impressions like that.
I get that. And trust me I don’t think anybody here really wants to push you into crossing any lines. But at the same time we’re trying to get a feel for what you actually CAN say. Mostly, the reason I asked is because there had been some speculation that they were going away from keyboards a bit and that’s what started the rift with Diego. Now I think we’re all just a little bit curious as to whether or not they are trying to re-incorporate more keyboards or are they generally heading in the same direction that they were with Vector and Virus.
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Mostly, the reason I asked is because there had been some speculation that they were going away from keyboards a bit and that’s what started the rift with Diego. Now I think we’re all just a little bit curious as to whether or not they are trying to re-incorporate more keyboards or are they generally heading in the same direction that they were with Vector and Virus.
Without wanting to be mean about it, people don't know what they're talking about and some seem to feel a need to speculate/make assumptions in order to justify their own pre-conceptions. To be clear, I'm not suggesting this has come from you, but other people make statements like that as though it's fact.
There was never any move away from keyboards (other than what we already knew, that after Visions Hen moved to just guitar so there was only one keyboardist - but that happened before Affinity which is the most keys-focused album they've done). I have repeatedly pointed this out pretty much since Vector came out, but they do something a bit different each time (Virus being the exception as the second part of Vector) and so the style of each work is not "the direction" of the band.
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Just saw Ross do a solo show and it was fun :)
The version of Deathless he played was cool
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"Who's ready to hear Nightingale?! We are so excited to share this one with you all! Pre-save the track now and unlock the teaser. Coming April 26th."
https://forms.sonymusicfans.com/campaign/haken-nightingale-presave/
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"Who's ready to hear Nightingale?! We are so excited to share this one with you all! Pre-save the track now and unlock the teaser. Coming April 26th."
https://forms.sonymusicfans.com/campaign/haken-nightingale-presave/
Can't wait! :metal
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My body is ready.
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I was hoping it would arrive this friday for my birthday, but the 26th isn't too far from it anyway :metal
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Yeah, new music on a Tuesday? 90s themed album confirmed
Imagine they’ll play this at their shows next month, can’t wait
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What a nice sendoff the day before I fly to Morsefest. I am so ready for new Haken!
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Yeah, new music on a Tuesday? 90s themed album confirmed
The band photo they posted along with this announcement does indeed give me some 90s vibes.
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It's no wonder their song 1985 was six years ago. We're probably in 1991 at this point. ;D
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90s themed album confirmed
Bad news for anyone wanting more keyboards on this one :neverusethis:
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You guys figured it out. The album will be based on late 90s nu metal.
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A cover of Headstrong. Can't wait.
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Ariich confrimed it. Quick, someone write a Wikipedia article about it.
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Conner's rap section in Nightingale is surprisingly good.
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Conner's rap section in Nightingale is surprisingly good.
Do they make a call-back to the harmonies of N'Sync and Backstreet Boys, or Boys II Men?
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huh where’s Diego? And who the hell is that ariich looking person in their picture?
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You guys figured it out. The album will be based on late 90s nu metal.
I'd guess you were joking (and I enjoyed that greatly), but this doesn't seem to sound like anything inspired by 1990s music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sojGNcmuwdM&
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There's one open question on my mind regarding the previous albums that I'd like to get closure on before the next album is released:
Has the band ever confirmed or denied that Cockroach King and Vector/Virus were inspired by Boris Johnson?
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You guys figured it out. The album will be based on late 90s nu metal.
I'd guess you were joking (and I enjoyed that greatly), but this doesn't seem to sound like anything inspired by 1990s music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sojGNcmuwdM&
Keyboards are back! :metal :metal :metal
Thanks, Pete :hefdaddy
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You guys figured it out. The album will be based on late 90s nu metal.
I'd guess you were joking (and I enjoyed that greatly), but this doesn't seem to sound like anything inspired by 1990s music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sojGNcmuwdM&
Ooooh that teaser sounds really good! Looking forward to hearing this next week! It honestly feels like forever since Virus came out, but maybe that's because the album hasn't really gotten a lot of plays from me since its release, and as a result, I haven't really listened to a lot of Haken in the last year or so. I've listened to Ross' solo album a lot more in the last few months than I have any Haken album/music.
-Marc.
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Just saw Ross do a solo show and it was fun :)
The version of Deathless he played was cool
Nice! Wish he would come to NY. Maybe a full show of his will be available for streaming at some point. Ross is one of the better vocalists out there.
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I’ve just heard Nightingale through the use of a VPN. It’s AWESOME!! What a great sound they have with their new lineup. Very different and yet fitting in super well with the Haken back catalogue. Bring it on!!
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Interesting choice for a single, easily the least accessible one they released so far.
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Interesting choice for a single, easily the least accessible one they released so far.
Interesting, what makes you think so?
I'm not sure I'd agree. I'd say Puzzle Box and A Cell Divides are comparably so to my ears, if not more in some ways. Maybe Invasion too.
That said, when I first heard it, as is often the case with Haken, some of the melodic hooks didn't go quite where I expected so it it took a couple of listens to "get" the song.
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I forgot that "A Cell divides" was a single. That one takes the crown of weirdness.
But compared to the previous lead singles, this is the least straight rock song. Especially "Prosthetic" was a state-of-the-art single with a simple chorus, an easily recognizable guitar solo and simpler drum patterns.
Nightingale however messes with the listeners expectations regarding choruses, has a lengthy instrumental/less lyrics section with no clear solos and the drums are all over the place.
Very excited for what's to come.
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and the drums are all over the place.
Very excited for what's to come.
I'm excited to hear the drums - as Ray has been off the charts good on the last two albums, and I'm a bass player..
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Haken's lead singles have been a dud for me from the last three albums, even on Affinity (where every other song was a major winner), so I won't write them off if this song isn't to my liking, but I will reiterate that my expectations for them in general are drastically lower following two pretty average albums combined with the departure of my favorite member of the band.
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Kev, have you heard the Nova Colective album. Pete is excellent on it.
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No, I have not, but the last thing I need right now is something new, as I am so behind already. :lol :lol
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Lolol. It would give you an idea of Pete's playing style.
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A couple listens in and I already like this song much more than all of Virus :lol
The Haken I love is back :metal :metal :metal
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So freaking jealous right now. :angry:
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My first impression is that it sounds a bit like the more offbeat whackiness of The Mountain, but with riffs akin to what's on Vector/Virus, but also something new I can't quite put my finger on. It's not quite as a dark as Virus, but more on par with the darkest songs from the first four albums. Something that struck me production-wise (at least from the YouTube version which is all I've heard, is how not up-front the guitars are, despite being pretty audible. That's some magic mixing wizardry there. The keyboards have tons of room to breathe.
Another note, is it just me, or does Ross sound ridiculously good on this? Something about his performance, and the way his voice is produced/mixed on this song, seems to bring out all the best from his voice.
Btw, I noticed they got Jens Bogren back on board. I liked what he did for them from The Mountain to Affinity, and this sounds even better than those by a wide margin.
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https://youtu.be/zh-zbJfDO40
After 1 listen - I don't hate it, but I didn't really get into it right away. Album context might bring me around to it though. Very rhythmically complex!
-Marc.
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My first impression is that it sounds a bit like the more offbeat whackiness of The Mountain, but with riffs akin to what's on Vector/Virus, but also something new I can't quite put my finger on. It's not quite as a dark as Virus, but more on par with the darkest songs from the first four albums. Something that struck me production-wise (at least from the YouTube version which is all I've heard, is how not up-front the guitars are, despite being pretty audible. That's some magic mixing wizardry there. The keyboards have tons of room to breathe.
Another note, is it just me, or does Ross sound ridiculously good on this? Something about his performance, and the way his voice is produced/mixed on this song, seems to bring out all the best from his voice.
Btw, I noticed they got Jens Bogren back on board. I liked what he did for them from The Mountain to Affinity, and this sounds even better than those by a wide margin.
This is all really perceptive, some great observations. A few thoughts in response:
Yep, Bogren is back. What I really like about this is that he's managed to maintain enough of the punchy sound from Vector/Virus, but not at the expense of his trademark sense of atmosphere. The man is a genius and I'm really glad Haken are using him again, and I completely agree that this is the best he's made Haken sound.
Your comments on the guitars/keys mix are great to read. My understanding is that the band paid attention to this - not in a "this is a keys-led song" way or anything, but in more of a "the guitars are too dominant in some places" sort of way.
Also cool to see your comments about Ross, again I agree. I think (but I might be wrong) that on Vector and Virus he'd recorded his vocals with Diego and they ended up sounding a bit processed (although I personally still thought he sounded great). He sounds more natural here and stronger for it.
Finally in terms of style, yes my view is similar. Some Mountain, with a bit of Vector and in my opinion a bit of Visions in there too.
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https://youtu.be/zh-zbJfDO40
After 1 listen - I don't hate it, but I didn't really get into it right away. Album context might bring me around to it though. Very rhythmically complex!
-Marc.
Not sure it's unusually complex for them (some sections of other songs I still can't quite follow having listened for years :lol - which isn't the case here). But yes it's not a very immediate song - it's somewhat rhythmically complex, the song structure is unusual, and the melodic hooks don't quite go where you might expect at first.
If you plan to give it several listens now (rather than waiting for an album) I'd be interested to see what you think.
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I prefer the atmosphere over Virus, but I miss the ability to easily distinguish both guitar lines at all times.
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Could this be their best song in years?
Unsure yet whether I prefer this one over Invasion and Puzzle Box (my favourites from the last two albums), but I can see it overtaking them eventually.
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I gave it a listen this morning, and as expected it's a lot to take in. It needs many more spins before it all clicks with me. But I really like the sound and mix of it.
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First spin was at 4 am while waking up. I don't recommend this 😀.
Not sure what to think yet.
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I love the chorus and the general mix sounds good but to my ears the drums don’t sound as punchy as they did on Vector/Virus.
I do like it from the first listen but it’ll definitely be a grower, it’s a lot to take in.
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That was a great track. Is that the artwork they're going for just the track or the whole album?
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Watch the video here: https://youtu.be/IeENKWcitCw
Stream & download the track here: https://haken.lnk.to/Nightingale-Single
The band comments:
"Nightingale was the first track Pete Jones presented to the band after rejoining Haken this year. The initial song idea quickly inspired of the classic Haken sound and naturally evolved into some new harmonic territory. The song ranges from delicate moments to monstrous riffs.
We enlisted Jens Bogren to mix Nightingale and, as always, he’s blown us away by capturing every detail while delivering power and energy. We couldn’t be happier with the finished product.
Lyrically, the song reflects on the creative process itself; with a message that although it may be difficult of late, we must remember to be thankful for the positives in life; be they big or small."
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Just gave Nightingale a spin and I liked it more than most of the stuff Haken I've heard (which isn't much to begin with). I love the heaviness of the track but I don't like the quirkiness of it. I'm interesting in giving the album a spin because this song does have some beautiful moments.
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On the first spin, I really really really liked that!
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My first impression is that it sounds a bit like the more offbeat whackiness of The Mountain, but with riffs akin to what's on Vector/Virus, but also something new I can't quite put my finger on. It's not quite as a dark as Virus, but more on par with the darkest songs from the first four albums. Something that struck me production-wise (at least from the YouTube version which is all I've heard, is how not up-front the guitars are, despite being pretty audible. That's some magic mixing wizardry there. The keyboards have tons of room to breathe.
Another note, is it just me, or does Ross sound ridiculously good on this? Something about his performance, and the way his voice is produced/mixed on this song, seems to bring out all the best from his voice.
Btw, I noticed they got Jens Bogren back on board. I liked what he did for them from The Mountain to Affinity, and this sounds even better than those by a wide margin.
Yes! This is, by far, more interesting to my ears than virtually anything on the previous two albums.
Listening to Aquarious and Visions, I'm always struck by the raw emotion in Ross' voice, emotion that becomes muted by the prouduction tecniques used on later albums.
His solo disc proves that he has the chops to croon, and there are a few moments here where he does just that.
As for the music, Gaspar is spot on: a solid mix of styles here.
Can't wait to hear this in the context of the record!
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Great mix on this, sound is great here. First listen and as others have said, I'm going to need more to really "get" this song. Having said that, I did enjoy it on first listen, but kind of hard to form much of an opinion besides what is very clear to me that this is a good mix and the band sounds great.
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So. Fucking. Good.
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My first impression is that it sounds a bit like the more offbeat whackiness of The Mountain, but with riffs akin to what's on Vector/Virus, but also something new I can't quite put my finger on. It's not quite as a dark as Virus, but more on par with the darkest songs from the first four albums. Something that struck me production-wise (at least from the YouTube version which is all I've heard, is how not up-front the guitars are, despite being pretty audible. That's some magic mixing wizardry there. The keyboards have tons of room to breathe.
Another note, is it just me, or does Ross sound ridiculously good on this? Something about his performance, and the way his voice is produced/mixed on this song, seems to bring out all the best from his voice.
Btw, I noticed they got Jens Bogren back on board. I liked what he did for them from The Mountain to Affinity, and this sounds even better than those by a wide margin.
Yes! This is, by far, more interesting to my ears than virtually anything on the previous two albums.
Listening to Aquarious and Visions, I'm always struck by the raw emotion in Ross' voice, emotion that becomes muted by the prouduction tecniques used on later albums.
His solo disc proves that he has the chops to croon, and there are a few moments here where he does just that.
As for the music, Gaspar is spot on: a solid mix of styles here.
Can't wait to hear this in the context of the record!
Good song, the denser visions sound but with their more all over the place writing.
Ross comment on a Reddit post comparing Nightingale to his solo and Novena work:
Thanks for the comment! For Nightingale, I made the decision to have my vocals engineered by the same guy who produced Novena's stuff, since I also felt they sit among my finest work. We have a great working relationship and he really gets the best out of my voice. His name is Paul Winstanley and he also engineered my solo album vocals too! All previous Haken releases have been self produced/engineered by band members. Rj
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This just in:
The new single is pretty damn good.
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This just in:
The new single is pretty damn good.
Excellent, I'll let Pete know that the hef hath spoken.
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This just in:
The new single is pretty damn good.
Excellent, I'll let Pete know that the hef hath spoken.
Tell him The Dude abides!!
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This just in:
The new single is pretty damn good.
Excellent, I'll let Pete know that the hef hath spoken.
Tell him The Dude abides!!
He's going to think I've lost my mind. :lol
Perhaps I'll just let him know that DTF digs the song and sends their best wishes. :P
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Just listened to it once, and I agree with the positive impressions that have been posted here. Definitely a move in a stylistic direction that interests me more than the last couple of albums did, and I liked the song itself.
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This just in:
The new single is pretty damn good.
Excellent, I'll let Pete know that the hef hath spoken.
Tell him The Dude abides!!
He's going to think I've lost my mind. :lol
Perhaps I'll just let him know that DTF digs the song and sends their best wishes. :P
Send him a picture of the Hefnotoad.
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This just in:
The new single is pretty damn good.
Excellent, I'll let Pete know that the hef hath spoken.
Yes, and ask when there will be another Nova Collective project, because that shit is fire.
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To echo some of the comments already made here, Nightingale is amazing :metal :metal :metal
To me, it sounds like Visions and The Mountain combined with a little bit of Vector thrown in there, and I agree that bringing Jens Bogren back was the best decision sonically, as I'm not a fan of the sound of Virus at all.
Now, some things I hope happen next in Haken land are:
- They get to finally record that Vector/Virus live album this year and include a live version of Nightingale with it.
- We also get the new studio album soon, either later this year or very early next year.
- They give the Restoration treatment to the other 3 songs from the original demo to bring them full circle now that Pete's back in the band. They could probably include them as bonus tracks on their new album, since they apparently write shorter albums now.
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Gotta say, how I'm listening to Nightingale is really affecting how much I enjoy it. Generally at work I have one earbud in, with everything mono to it, and I was having a hard time. But then when I was able to listen with both or watch the video at home it's certainly growing on me. I generally agree however with those that say it's a pretty hard "single" to get into.
Knowing that their cruise sets will most likely be an hour each, here is my prediction based on what was originally hoped for 2020.
Set 1:
Vector in full
The Endless Knot or Initiate
Cockroach King
Set 2:
Virus in full
Nightingale
Then, for the SX tour I'm expecting something like:
Prosthetic
The Good Doctor
The Endless Knot
Nightingale
Carousel (That's what I want, but it'll likely be Invasion or The Strain more realistically)
Cockroach King
And even that might be a little long.
I think they wanted to get a Peter song out and in front of people for a reason and so I think they'll play that, otherwise they could have held it till after the tour and closer to album release.
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Will need more listens, but the new song sounded pretty good on the first one. Sound and production reminded me of the last three albums.
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Knowing that their cruise sets will most likely be an hour each, here is my prediction based on what was originally hoped for 2020.
Set 1:
Vector in full
The Endless Knot or Initiate
Cockroach King
Set 2:
Virus in full
Nightingale
Nope. :P
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Well, the new song is definitely not for me. But that is to be expected. Based on the latest trend with Haken, this is an album that I probably won't like. I'll have to wait for the next one :lol
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Knowing that their cruise sets will most likely be an hour each, here is my prediction based on what was originally hoped for 2020.
Set 1:
Vector in full
The Endless Knot or Initiate
Cockroach King
Set 2:
Virus in full
Nightingale
Nope. :P
I'd be a little surprised if they don't throw in anything from the Restoration EP.
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Knowing that their cruise sets will most likely be an hour each, here is my prediction based on what was originally hoped for 2020.
Set 1:
Vector in full
The Endless Knot or Initiate
Cockroach King
Set 2:
Virus in full
Nightingale
Nope. :P
Eh, I kind of figured the years of lag might change things up. Well, let me change things up then. What I'd really like to see is:
-Plenty of Virus material, as obviously that hasn't been touched yet.
-Some rarer stuff from Aquarius
-Stuff from Restoration that isn't 30 minutes long.
We'll see if I get lucky on any of that.
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I'll be pretty upset if Virus doesn't get good live representation. Sort of how a lot of bands stray away from playing songs from an album when the band went through some issues (Diego leaving). Add in the timing since the release of the album and finally touring for it. Looking forward to the NYC show in a few weeks to kick off the tour :metal
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I'll be pretty upset if Virus doesn't get good live representation. Sort of how a lot of bands stray away from playing songs from an album when the band went through some issues (Diego leaving). Add in the timing since the release of the album and finally touring for it. Looking forward to the NYC show in a few weeks to kick off the tour :metal
I think the plan is still to play both Vector and Virus in full for when they do their headlining tour (Rich, feel free to fact-check this :P) but these earlier shows will probably be more of a mix of everything. I also think they'll bring back some of the Restoration tracks since Pete's now back in the band. Hoping for Manifolds too ;D
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Listening to Nightingale now. I like this. Very interesting rhythmically.
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It's really a very cool and not "easy" song, even for Haken's standarts. Since it has a lot of complexity rhytmically, it reminded me much more something from Vector/Virus, but with a jazzy/lighter touch. In fact, reminded me something closer to Richard Henshall's solo album.
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Just checking in from cruise land to confirm for everyone that Haken will have 1 hour on the coming tour.
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:tup
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So I guess it isn't coheadlining? I kind of recall some saying it was but it didn't seem to be advertised that way. That sucks, but 1 hour is still a good amount of time for not headlining.
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It's technically a coheadline tour, but SX will have the longer set.
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The official Haken website says: supporting Symphony X.
I'm waiting for the European Tour. Seeing both Ross and Novena at Prognosis Festival made me miss the Haken show even more.
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If anyone is going to the NYC show (and maybe others, I only know the NYC one is listed and not the NJ one) there's a livenation sale for $25 flat for a ticket. I grabbed mine this morning. Can't beat that deal.
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That's great to know. An hour set is great for supporting. Looks like Symphony X may get 2 hours or 1min30 for their set.
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I just saw their setlist from last night, pretty interesting stuff :lol
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I just saw their setlist from last night, pretty interesting stuff :lol
Why did they do a full cover set again?
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Pretty cool choice of songs for the covers set
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The official Haken website says: supporting Symphony X.
I'm waiting for the European Tour. Seeing both Ross and Novena at Prognosis Festival made me miss the Haken show even more.
I'm saying exactly what the band said. Logistically it's setup like a coheadline. Sym X will be 90 minutes max I'd think.
Set last night was awesome. Salisbury Hill is a favorite of mine. Pete did great in his re debut.
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I just saw their setlist from last night, pretty interesting stuff :lol
Why did they do a full cover set again?
I was constantly checking setlist.fm to see what their first setlist in two years would be. Needless to say, I was shocked :lol
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Next set in the theater will be a normal set, and will be close to, if not identical to the tour set.
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Next set in the theater will be a normal set, and will be close to, if not identical to the tour set.
Let's see if they have any surprises planned :metal
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I just saw their setlist from last night, pretty interesting stuff :lol
Why did they do a full cover set again?
To offer a little insight on this, they get two 1-hour sets on the cruise and the plan was always to do one regular and one covers. They wanted the covers to be the set at the pool stage (rather than the theatre) as it has a more fun, relaxed vibe. Quite unfortunate that this was the first slot they were given, so it did mean their first show back was mostly covers. :lol But I think it still made sense this way round, and it sounds like it went down well!
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I've listened to the new single at least three times and I still can't recall any melodies or riffs from it. :justjen
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I've listened to the new single at least three times and I still can't recall any melodies or riffs from it. :justjen
Not even the chorus?
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Can say with 99% certainty that Nightingale will be in the regular set. One more sleep till I see what joins it!
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Also, charity auction lumped the Mountain tour backdrop in with the Stonehenge from the show, along with a Virus vinyl and CD. This caused price to go hi and now I do not have a one of a kind Mountain backdrop and this displeases me.
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"The Most Haken that Haken has ever Hakened!"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3uYkE5_1z8
(one of those reaction/analysis video things from a classical composer)
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Can say with 99% certainty that Nightingale will be in the regular set. One more sleep till I see what joins it!
Kind of expected this. Would have been shocked if it wasn't. Got to show off the new music with the "new" keyboardist.
Also, charity auction lumped the Mountain tour backdrop in with the Stonehenge from the show, along with a Virus vinyl and CD. This caused price to go hi and now I do not have a one of a kind Mountain backdrop and this displeases me.
:lol that stonehenge would make for an awesome piece of memorabilia
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Soundcheck was Nightingale followed by Carousel now.
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Carousel is a great tune.
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Soundcheck was Nightingale followed by Carousel now.
Nice :metal
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Prosthetic
Invasion
Nightingale
Cockroach King
Nil By Mouth
1985
Carousel
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Prosthetic
Invasion
Nightingale
Cockroach King
Nil By Mouth
9021985
Carousel
Corrected. :P
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Prosthetic
Invasion
Nightingale
Cockroach King
Nil By Mouth
1985
Carousel
That's a rocking setlist no doubt..
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Like ariich implied, 1985 had a break into Owner of a Lonely Heart that lasted a minute or two.
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Disappointed to see Nil By Mouth in the set again, although I'm sure it's a bit different now. Carousel as a closer is interesting, that'll be cool to see on Tuesday
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Not a very exciting set list for me, as Invasion is the only song from the album I really like much at all, and none of the ones I really liked from Vector are getting played (Puzzle Box, Host). But they never got to tour on the last record, so I get hammering it hard on the next touring cycle. It just makes it extremely unlikely that I would see them this time around if they come here again.
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Now that I'm at an airport sitting on my laptop for the first time in a week and a half, I can give a little more insight into the sets.
Cover set was awesome. Had many people on the boat, many of which weren't big Haken fans, commenting on how much they enjoyed Haken doing those songs. I have to say I was a wee disappointed that Yes was being represented by Owner of a Lonely Heart, so was very happy when they played something more classic later in the set. For the covers they didn't use the usual click track either, so the feel of the show was looser and I little more to my liking than a normal gig. Only downside is up front the sound is never perfect, and in this case I was low on keys. That said Pete seemed to get in the groove and had a great time like everyone else.
Confession time, I've never seen Spinal Tap. Those that have loved the 10 minutes or so they dedicated to it. Jimmy Keegan ran on stage and did a little person dance of some sort. Confirmed after that the band had no idea he'd do that. I hope to finally do the long overdue and watch the movie tomorrow.
The theater show for Haken was a very good representation, maybe on a larger scale, of the rooms I see booked for the Symphony X tour, and they nailed it. Keyboards were in the mix for this set and it was excellent. Pete seemed to have a little settling in at first, but then they got to Nightingale, ripped through that, and then he seemed perfectly at home from there. It was a little weird seeing keyboard land as only a single keyboard, but I also know the band is enjoying that simplicity.
Performance wise they were right back to what you'd expect. Both in their general precision and amazing delivery, but with that focus also comes some of the stationary habits that I think is one of their major downsides. Set wise I could only realistically ask for so much, and it's pretty perfect. If I'm staying within reason I'd likely swap Nil with Good Doctor and 1985 with Endless Knot, but I can see Symphony X fans really eating up this set as is.
Pete is doing more backing vocals than Diego did, falling somewhere between Ray/Conner for clearly most and Charlie/Hen for clearly least.
It's gonna be a great tour package.
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Confession time, I've never seen Spinal Tap. Those that have loved the 10 minutes or so they dedicated to it. Jimmy Keegan ran on stage and did a little person dance of some sort. Confirmed after that the band had no idea he'd do that. I hope to finally do the long overdue and watch the movie tomorrow.
I didn't see it until like 10 years ago myself (late 30s for me), so fret not. ;)
Let us know what you think once you have watched it!
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Thanks for the thought on the shows. I will be seeing them on Weds at the Keswick. Can't wait!
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Thanks for the thought on the shows. I will be seeing them on Weds at the Keswick. Can't wait!
I'll be there as well, can't wait!
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Really love the new song. I've been Haken agnostic for a long time now, but Pete Jones' fusiony/jazzy sound hits the spot for me.
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I usually don't shit on the openers but Trope is on now. It's just a guitarist and female singer. Yet I hear drums... I can give a pass to playing to a track a lot of times but no live drums is a first for me and it's severely killing the vibe... besides the music not being any good so far.
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Haken were good, same set as the cruise :yarr
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Haken were good, same set as the cruise :yarr
That's a bit disappointing for me being my first Haken. But It's understandable since they never got to tour for Virus and the other songs make sense for being the opener for Symphony X.
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Thanks for the thought on the shows. I will be seeing them on Weds at the Keswick. Can't wait!
I'll be there as well, can't wait!
me3 :metal
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I just hope they have a chance to do Messiah Complex sometime. That song begs for a live rendition.
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I just hope they have a chance to do Messiah Complex sometime. That song begs for a live rendition.
I seriously hope for that mentioned Vector/Virus live release. I just... need that.
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I just hope they have a chance to do Messiah Complex sometime. That song begs for a live rendition.
I seriously hope for that mentioned Vector/Virus live release. I just... need that.
Someone should suggest to them to do a "Hakenfest" Weekend somewhere. :lol
-Marc.
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Haken were good, same set as the cruise :yarr
I'm assuming not the cover set ;)
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Pete did mention on the cruise that he learned all of Vector and Virus for the European headlining tour that got canceled.
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Pete did mention on the cruise that he learned all of Vector and Virus for the European headlining tour that got canceled.
But the plan is to reschedule, isn't it?
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Pete did mention on the cruise that he learned all of Vector and Virus for the European headlining tour that got canceled.
But the plan is to reschedule, isn't it?
To be a little clearer, the plan was never to play Vector/Virus at every show in Europe, but rather at select festival/special shows. I don't know if it was finalized as the plan, but the Cruise was on the table as one of the places they would do that in 2020.
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Thought Haken were overall really good. Pete instead of Diego didn't seem to be that big of a change really. I thought he played all the parts fairly on point including on Nil by Mouth. My only issue was him being out of any light so seeing him was kind of difficult and being center, he was often behind Ross. Could just be part of being an opening act so they are playing in front of Symphony X's gear. Sound was overall pretty good. Thought Ross sounded good and Ray was just on fire. I couldn't really see him, but he sounded great and his performance is always awesome. As much as I wish Nil By Mouth was not in the set, it seemed to get a pretty good reaction out of the crowd especially compared to the first half of the set. People didn't seem too into the Virus songs or Nightingale. Although I'd say the Virus songs were the highlight for me. Also the Yes song during 1985 seemed specifically placed where Diego would play the keytar so that's a nice deflection from what you would have seen before in Haken show to something cool they are doing now. That got a nice pop from the crowd as well.
Haken - Invasion LIVE @ Irving Plaza New York City NY 5/10/2022 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euL9OLzPYwE)
Haken - Carousel LIVE @ Irving Plaza New York City NY 5/10/2022 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-OJKFLMZJ8)
My invasion video is decent, Carousel not as good. I have more clips and Symphony X clips as well I need to edit after work today so if anyone is interested, I'll have more videos tonight.
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Thanks for the reviews guys, really good to be getting these updates when I can't be there myself. And thanks Cram for the vids, they're really good (although the sound goes funny occasionally in the Carousel one). Great to hear Pete's backing vocals in the Invasion chorus nice and prominent!
My only issue was him being out of any light so seeing him was kind of difficult and being center, he was often behind Ross. Could just be part of being an opening act so they are playing in front of Symphony X's gear.
I can confirm that this is indeed the case, Pete said they didn't get very long to soundcheck and didn't get much space on the stage. Downside of being an opening act to a band that likes to stage-hog I guess. :lol But yeah I can see in your vids that he was standing in a bit of blackspot in the lighting, which is unfortunate!
As much as I wish Nil By Mouth was not in the set, it seemed to get a pretty good reaction out of the crowd especially compared to the first half of the set. People didn't seem too into the Virus songs or Nightingale. Although I'd say the Virus songs were the highlight for me. Also the Yes song during 1985 seemed specifically placed where Diego would play the keytar so that's a nice deflection from what you would have seen before in Haken show to something cool they are doing now.
Yeah, I think the second half of the set is more "fun" than the first half, so it doesn't surprise me that it elicits a more noticeable reaction from the crowd. From the clips I've seen, the crowd generally seems to have been pretty into it, which is great considering they're not the headliner (and especially after the 2nd cruise set was all seated and so a bit static).
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I’m guessing that they are planning an actual headlining tour after the album comes out?
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Thanks for the reviews guys, really good to be getting these updates when I can't be there myself. And thanks Cram for the vids, they're really good (although the sound goes funny occasionally in the Carousel one). Great to hear Pete's backing vocals in the Invasion chorus nice and prominent!
Yeah... sadly that's why I said Carousel was not as good of a video. I do think Invasion came out well and sounds really good! I mean, these guys put on a legit show compared to a lot of other bands I see these days.
From the clips I've seen, the crowd generally seems to have been pretty into it, which is great considering they're not the headliner (and especially after the 2nd cruise set was all seated and so a bit static).
Irving Plaza is 1k capacity, it wasn't sold out like Gwar was (lol, it was Halloween) and it was very similar to the crowd size for Set It Off last month. I'd guess around 800 people saw Haken last night which is solid considering the last two NYC shows (while sold out) were at 500 capacity. I'm also pretty sure most were there for Symphony X so Haken got exposure to a newer audience. My only issue with the show was why even bother with Trope, just give Haken another song and Symphony X two more ???
All my clips from the show are here with lots of footage from both bands:
Symphony X & Haken LIVE @ Irving Plaza New York City NY 5/10/2022 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYPZCu_8mno)
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Trope is there because they paid to be there, just like Arch Echo paid DT to open their tour. It's a way to make touring more viable - get a band with no fan base on board, who is willing to pay to go on the road with a bigger band, thus making the tour slightly more profitable.
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Saw SX & Haken tonight at the Keswick. Probably about 400 people in attendance, but we witnessed (as did Mike Portnoy) a great show. Symphony X was really good, but Haken were F'n INCREDIBLE! :metal Can't wait to see them as headliners again! Raymond Hearne just continues to move up my "charts" as just an incredible drummer. Definitely in my top 10! :hefdaddy :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
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Trope is there because they paid to be there, just like Arch Echo paid DT to open their tour. It's a way to make touring more viable - get a band with no fan base on board, who is willing to pay to go on the road with a bigger band, thus making the tour slightly more profitable.
I was wondering if that was the case. Arch Echo makes more sense though, not sure what Trope is thinking. Maybe I'm wrong though, maybe this works out for them, but they don't seem to be a fit when you are using a drum backing track at a prog metal show. It was the first show of the tour though, maybe they improve.
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Not just drum track. Dude had about 6 overlaid guitar tracks, bass and keys on most of the songs but just strummed a few chords and played a few leads. Kinds cheesy if you ask me. The singer had a great voice though.
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I was wondering how Pete puts his own spin on the keyboard parts live - does he stay close to what Diego did, or does he add some of his own touch to them? I assume he does backing vocals too.
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Not just drum track. Dude had about 6 overlaid guitar tracks, bass and keys on most of the songs but just strummed a few chords and played a few leads. Kinds cheesy if you ask me. The singer had a great voice though.
:lol yeah it was more than just the drums, but the drums just stand out so much to me because I've seen lots of bands use backing tracks but never for drums. The singer was solid, she's got talent.
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Alright, so I was at the Trope/Haken/Symphony X show in Philly last night, a much anticipated show even though I just saw Haken because of it being a good long while since I've seen SX.
Let's get Trope out of the way. Couldn't be much more of an obvious pay to play, as already eluded to here, but man, was it lacking. I give the vocalist credit, she was good and performed with heart, and the guitarist to a certain extent as well, but not many positives beyond that. Given the two acts after them performing like they did felt empty, the music wasn't overly good, and you'd think if you have that guitarist there he'd at least warrant ripping out a few memorable solos, but nothing came close. I'd consider paying their fee at the NJ show at the end of the tour to give Haken an extra half hours to do covers again.
A stunning 5 days since my last Haken show no major surprises from their set. Someone next to me mentioned it weird they never really talked about who they were, or said much at all, and in hindsight I agreed with that. I hate to say much negative about a band I love so dearly, but between touring with Leprous and now Symphony X there are a few areas where I really think they could up their live game. Having more organic banter and sets would be a nice and easy start. On the Leprous tour they not only had the same set every night, but they performed in the same order, and with almost identical limited talk at the same points in the set. You add that to a band that already mostly stays put on stage and it can really feel like the worst aspect of a band playing to a click track, where everyone is kinda just rehearsing on stage as if they were at home. Leprous on the other hand didn't do anything drastic with their set, maybe changing one song between shows, but even then they changed up the order in which they played songs, it honestly kept them looking fresh and on their toes each night in a cool way. My next major gripe compares to SX, who were considered highly technical prog-metal for their time, and certainly still are, but compared to Haken doing a song like Nightingale in this set it's kinda night and day. Hearing the song live twice now, especially before SX really polarized me on how I feel about it. On one hand there is so much beautiful music and nice melodies there, and on the other it's so hard to follow as it's often disjointed and jarring seemingly for the sake of being so. It often feels too technical for its own good, whereas no matter how complex a part of two within a SX song may be it's almost always still a super strong cohesive song. And Rich, specifically for you, and one thing I'll have to ask Pete about, honestly the only time in the entire show where something doesn't seem well replicated is the keyboard "intro" in the middle of Nil By Mouth. If I recall did Diego use the Continuum style thing for that? Would make sense as to why it's tough to recreate on a standard keyboard.
I realize this is making me sound like an old man, "damn young kids with their polyrhythms and such", so enough with that and onto the good. Haken's music obviously still is amazing, and the performance of said music was great. The audience did seem to skew highly SX as far as who people where mainly there for (not surprising as SX is kinda local), but I heard a LOT of comments that evening that would suggest Haken were winning people over who didn't know them, which was fantastic. And then of course was what has to be a personal highlight for me. During 1985 I put my neon glasses on prior to Ross entering during 1985, only to shockingly see he was not sporting his own. As soon as he got to the front of the stage he motioned to me, I got up and handed him mine, and then he wore them to the Yes section and tossed them back at me. And other than the bit I mentioned, Pete is really stepping in and nailing it, on keys and doing well on vocals as well.
Symphony X was SX, for better and worse. Amazing vocals and delivery from Allen, you bet. Generic ass set? You betcha. Subpar sound while still being amazing live? Yes. Keyboards that could only be heard in softer sections and several key moments? Every time. An absolutely great time singing along to some choruses that will forever be burned into my subconscious? Yup.
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I'd consider paying their fee at the NJ show at the end of the tour to give Haken an extra half hours to do covers again.
How do we start a gofundme for this :lol
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I'd consider paying their fee at the NJ show at the end of the tour to give Haken an extra half hours to do covers again.
How do we start a gofundme for this :lol
Hurry up...can we find out how to do this before their show in Toronto on Sunday? :D
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Apparently, Trope does have a drummer.
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Where can I find a description of the concept and link between Vector and Virus?
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Still have an open mind but so far I like the single less than everything on Virus and Vector.
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Alright, so I was at the Trope/Haken/Symphony X show in Philly last night, a much anticipated show even though I just saw Haken because of it being a good long while since I've seen SX.
A stunning 5 days since my last Haken show no major surprises from their set. Someone next to me mentioned it weird they never really talked about who they were, or said much at all, and in hindsight I agreed with that. I hate to say much negative about a band I love so dearly, but between touring with Leprous and now Symphony X there are a few areas where I really think they could up their live game. Having more organic banter and sets would be a nice and easy start. On the Leprous tour they not only had the same set every night, but they performed in the same order, and with almost identical limited talk at the same points in the set. You add that to a band that already mostly stays put on stage and it can really feel like the worst aspect of a band playing to a click track, where everyone is kinda just rehearsing on stage as if they were at home. Leprous on the other hand didn't do anything drastic with their set, maybe changing one song between shows, but even then they changed up the order in which they played songs, it honestly kept them looking fresh and on their toes each night in a cool way.
That's interesting. I guess I kind of agree that if a band says the same thing at the same time every night, that it could be a little off putting, but for me that's only if they talk a little longer and have the same rehearsed type of speech. If it's limited as you mention, then I'm fine with it; a quick thank you to the audience or song introduction at the same point in the set doesn't bother me. I prefer limited banter, especially when they have a short set to begin with. Just get on with the set and play as much as possible. Speaking of Leprous - I love that about them. I'm not sure if Einar talks more now at actual live shows - he talked a lot during the live streams and sometimes it was a little awkward, but I thought it was fine for that setting. But at an actual live show, I loved how they would come out and just play and pretty much the only thing he would say was "thank you so much" a few times and the sets were always so intense.
But about the setlist changes - I'll always agree that having more variety is a good thing. I miss it with DT, and I guess I've come to accept that most bands aren't going to do it, but I certainly enjoy it when it does happen.
My next major gripe compares to SX, who were considered highly technical prog-metal for their time, and certainly still are, but compared to Haken doing a song like Nightingale in this set it's kinda night and day. Hearing the song live twice now, especially before SX really polarized me on how I feel about it. On one hand there is so much beautiful music and nice melodies there, and on the other it's so hard to follow as it's often disjointed and jarring seemingly for the sake of being so. It often feels too technical for its own good, whereas no matter how complex a part of two within a SX song may be it's almost always still a super strong cohesive song.
I think you're probably a much bigger fan of Haken than I am. I like Haken, and I've actually always liked them more live than studio, but I've never quite fallen in love with them like so many have. But I like what they do and I'm glad that they do it. Maybe sometimes it's disjointed but I think it's actually cool. And if that's not what I'm in the mood for, I can save listening to them for when I am in the mood for it.
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Finally gave Nightingale a listen. It's... alright. It feels like different transitioning sections of previous Haken songs that were stitched together, like we're constantly building up to other build-ups, but without any real payoff at any part of the song. I'd like to give it a few more runs. It's definitely Haken, though.
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Really looking forward to seeing them this Thursday! I feel a bit backwards because it's actually Symphony X I'm completely unfamiliar with. Should be a fun night!
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And then of course was what has to be a personal highlight for me. During 1985 I put my neon glasses on prior to Ross entering during 1985, only to shockingly see he was not sporting his own. As soon as he got to the front of the stage he motioned to me, I got up and handed him mine, and then he wore them to the Yes section and tossed them back at me.
That's fantastic Nick. I love stories like this.
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Really looking forward to seeing them this Thursday! I feel a bit backwards because it's actually Symphony X I'm completely unfamiliar with. Should be a fun night!
My two oldest sons and I will be seeing them Friday night in St. Louis...can't wait. We were all set back in 2020 to see them in St. Louis where they were playing Affinity in full and their tour got cancelled 6 days before we were set to see them. :censored >:(
So....despite this being a pretty short set list my sons are pumped to see them as they've not seen them live so looking forward to it. And, I've never seen Symphony X live and dig their stuff so should be a fun night.
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Anyone else at the Chicago concert now? I've never been to this venue. It's really nice.
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I was blown away by Haken's set. It actually was way better live than I was expecting. Didn't seem like there were too many Haken fans in the crowd, but luckily I seemed to be standing in the Haken fan section and could really rock out with them. Ross seemed to give our half of the stage a bit more attention. I do wish they had talked more, and maybe introduced Pete too. I was also so happy with the inclusion of Owner of a Lonely Heart. This may be sacrilege, but 90125 is my favorite Yes album. The crowd seemed to really get a kick out of it too. I can't wait to see them headline again.
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The entire cover set is on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbIZ020eTAY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbIZ020eTAY)
Also, the happy birthday from Russell Allen to Pete Jones was pretty cool (saw it on instagram recently, not related to the cover set)
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So I'll interview Charlie on Friday, to promote his solo album. Let me know if you have questions for him.
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So I'll interview Charlie on Friday, to promote his solo album. Let me know if you have questions for him.
Not related to his album, but would love to know about Haken's inmediate plans after they finish this tour run with SX. Will they do a proper headlining tour and record that live album they wanted to make? What about their new studio album, will it get moved to a next year release?
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So I'll interview Charlie on Friday, to promote his solo album. Let me know if you have questions for him.
Not related to his album, but would love to know about Haken's inmediate plans after they finish this tour run with SX. Will they do a proper headlining tour and record that live album they wanted to make? What about their new studio album, will it get moved to a next year release?
Yes, those would be great questions for the second half of the interview. Thanks man!
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So I'll interview Charlie on Friday, to promote his solo album. Let me know if you have questions for him.
Not related to his album, but would love to know about Haken's inmediate plans after they finish this tour run with SX. Will they do a proper headlining tour and record that live album they wanted to make? What about their new studio album, will it get moved to a next year release?
This is exactly what I want, no, need to know :tup
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If I had to guess, I'd say maybe towards the end of this year, possibly autumn if we're lucky. The album is all written, but not all recorded yet and they're currently on tour.
They definitely want to do the headline tour they'd planned. My impression is that COVID is still making European tours a lot more complicated and risky - each country has different policies and some are still requiring tests to enter.
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That's fine, just come back to the US instead.
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That's fine, just come back to the US instead.
Yup!
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That's fine, just come back to the US instead.
Yup!
Not until I've seen Pete playing in Haken for the first time in 14 years first! :P
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fair enough, but it would be great if they came back sooner than later to do a full headline set. I just want more virus live.
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fair enough, but it would be great if they came back sooner than later to do a full headline set. I just want more virus live.
Yeah, and it would be great if they could do a tour combining Virus and Vector material, with a few highlights from the back catalog , since the two "V" albums have an overarching concept.
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fair enough, but it would be great if they came back sooner than later to do a full headline set. I just want more virus live.
Yeah, and it would be great if they could do a tour combining Virus and Vector material, with a few highlights from the back catalog , since the two "V" albums have an overarching concept.
Looking at their current set, their full headlining set could be Vector/Virus in full + Cockroach King and 1985 and it would be about 2hrs long.
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I think Peter mentioned that he learned all of Vector and Virus for their European tour that they had to cancel. Or maybe it was just Virus, I can't remember for sure.
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I guess I am the only one here who thinks Nightingale is AMAZING. I cannot stop listening to it.
Disjointed, yes....as Ross said at the Denver show, not exactly a song you can bang your head to!
But the harmonies and melodies are off the chain. And the rhythm section....wow....tons of nuance in the bass playing and drums by Ray. Love the keyboard atmosphere behind the music....and the jazzier elements as well.
And Ross is outstanding here...fantastic tone. Not cheesy to me at all.
I would be happy if the new album sounded a lot like this....even though I love the darker, heavier Virus and Vector stuff too. You can hear the Yes influence big time, but also perhaps a little Toto (too :biggrin:) during those fusiony parts. Then you still had the ridiculous instrumental section in the middle....super syncopation.
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I wasn't a fan of Nightengale until I heard it live. In the past couple days, it really clicked for me, and now I can't get it out of my head.
Also I get a lot of Visions vibes from it for some reason. I wonder if that'll continue throughout the rest of the album
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I guess I am the only one here who thinks Nightingale is AMAZING. I cannot stop listening to it.
Disjointed, yes....as Ross said at the Denver show, not exactly a song you can bang your head to!
But the harmonies and melodies are off the chain. And the rhythm section....wow....tons of nuance in the bass playing and drums by Ray. Love the keyboard atmosphere behind the music....and the jazzier elements as well.
And Ross is outstanding here...fantastic tone. Not cheesy to me at all.
I would be happy if the new album sounded a lot like this....even though I love the darker, heavier Virus and Vector stuff too. You can hear the Yes influence big time, but also perhaps a little Toto (too :biggrin:) during those fusiony parts. Then you still had the ridiculous instrumental section in the middle....super syncopation.
It was better live. I was also at that Denver show and laughed when Ross said that.
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It was better live. I was also at that Denver show and laughed when Ross said that.
I wasn't a fan of Nightengale until I heard it live. In the past couple days, it really clicked for me, and now I can't get it out of my head.
That's what I said to a friend of mine, as well as my son.....that it sounded great live. They did not agree!
Tough to beat Cockroach King live because it is so fun....but after that it might have been the best song they did that night. With VERY honorable mention to Carousel and Nil by Mouth....which is just ridiculous with the precision.
I love that they opened with Prosthetic...great high energy opener. However, they didn't have the mix dialed in yet. Overall, though....except that it was TOO SHORT, I loved the setlist!
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It was better live. I was also at that Denver show and laughed when Ross said that.
I wasn't a fan of Nightengale until I heard it live. In the past couple days, it really clicked for me, and now I can't get it out of my head.
That's what I said to a friend of mine, as well as my son.....that it sounded great live. They did not agree!
Tough to beat Cockroach King live because it is so fun....but after that it might have been the best song they did that night. With VERY honorable mention to Carousel and Nil by Mouth....which is just ridiculous with the precision.
I love that they opened with Prosthetic...great high energy opener. However, they didn't have the mix dialed in yet. Overall, though....except that it was TOO SHORT, I loved the setlist!
Nightingale reminds me of their older sound from Visions and The Mountain.
I also enjoyed the set, it being my first Haken show as well. I wouldn't have minded one more song from Affinity though.
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Disjointed, yes....as Ross said at the Denver show, not exactly a song you can bang your head to!
It was better live. I was also at that Denver show and laughed when Ross said that.
That's not going to stop me from trying to headbanging to it. It might take some prep to headbang to these songs, but it's worth the effort. lol
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Disjointed, yes....as Ross said at the Denver show, not exactly a song you can bang your head to!
It was better live. I was also at that Denver show and laughed when Ross said that.
That's not going to stop me from trying to headbanging to it. It might take some prep to headbang to these songs, but it's worth the effort. lol
I was still headbanging the song. It probably looked funny to them seeing how differently timed people were headbanging...
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I too enjoyed how differently people interpreted the proper head banging rhythms. But honestly, I think it makes the more clear and obvious riffs and sections stand out more. When a huge riff hits after a complex development section like in Nil By Mouth, it's so powerful when everyone is suddenly united and rocking out in time with each other.
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After living with Nightingale for a few weeks, I feel that it suffers a bit from to it's fake vintage sound. It's a bit too fuzzy/noisy for it's own good, you need to concentrate to notice a lot of details. I hope a better balance is found when the actual album is mixed and mastered.
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LA tonight :metal :metal
was only a few days from seeing their tour with Devy in LA before covid shut everything down, so I'm excited to see Haken again :heart
also haven't seen Symphony X live since Wacken 2016, so tonight should be pretty killer :hefdaddy
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So I finally spoke with Charlie today about his new album. He's such a soft spoken guy - not full of expletives or bombastic statements. He's the type of interviewee you need to give some breathing space for him to formulate his answers. It came out great.
And for those who were wondering about a) a tour with Vector and Virus in full and b) a potential new album, he said they will finish the tour with Symphony X now and go straight into the studio - the new album is almost 100% written. And they plan to do Vector and Virus in full at some point, because that's how it was intended initially, but not now.
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And for those who were wondering about a) a tour with Vector and Virus in full and b) a potential new album, he said they will finish the tour with Symphony X now and go straight into the studio - the new album is almost 100% written. And they plan to do Vector and Virus in full at some point, because that's how it was intended initially, but not now.
Thank you! :tup
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Chatted with them after the LA show and it sounded like they're planning to come back to the US early next year :tup
Also since Matt Lynch was at the show I got him and Pete to sign my Nova Collective album, I already had Richard and Dan Briggs and was happy to finish it :hefdaddy
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Chatted with them after the LA show and it sounded like they're planning to come back to the US early next year :tup
Also since Matt Lynch was at the show I got him and Pete to sign my Nova Collective album, I already had Richard and Dan Briggs and was happy to finish it :hefdaddy
Shit. That's awesome about Nova Collective. If you ever decide to part ways with it, let me know.
Saw Haken last night with Symphony X. Hate to say it but SyX stole the show. Prosthetic was nothing short of amazing. Sounds even better live. Richard and Ross were having all sorts of fun. Nil and 1985 were also highlights for me. The rest of the setlist didn't really click for me.
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I’m planning on going to the Orlando show tonight. Does anyone know if there’s another band before Haken and SX?
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I’m planning on going to the Orlando show tonight. Does anyone know if there’s another band before Haken and SX?
There was half a band...as I'm sure you saw.. :lol Not a big fan of that. Basically a guitar and female vocalist (who was way to low in the mix) Then backing tracks for the drums and bass. Very odd to me...
Fantastic show last night in Orlando!! Both Haken and Symphony X kicked ass!!! Great lil venue also. I normally avoid GA shows due to my age and having to hit the bathroom every hour or so. But last night was very civilized and I had no issue getting back to my spot around row 4.
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Nice!
I wonder if Haken and/or SX will do anything unique for the final show of the tour on Sunday. Sometimes the end of tour shows have some shenanigans going on.
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Just learned this today, the Japanese version of Virus has an acoustic version of Canary Yellow as a bonus track featuring some vocals from Courtney of Bent Knee
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgODjCpmElU
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The final show of the NA tour was last night, thought they were pretty good as usual. First time watching from the back in a theater balcony setting so I could actually see they do have a bit of a light show! Looked like most of the band was hanging out after the show as well. :yarr Good times, but I hope when they return some of these songs are no longer on the setlist. Specifically, Nightingale which I don't think works live very well, Nil By Mouth, and one if not both of Cockroach King / 1985. Those last two have been played at every single Haken show I've been too. I get it, bands have songs they always play, but those aren't short songs and there's so much music that doesn't get played live when they aren't getting 90+ minute sets.
Haken - Prosthetic LIVE @ Wellmont Theater Montclair NJ 6/12/2022 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGJcOatrUfk)
Haken - Nightingale LIVE @ Wellmont Theater Montclair NJ 6/12/2022 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7cq4FVmOT0)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FVF--pkXoAALMsI?format=jpg&name=large)
also I could clearly see Ray and Peter this time (the NYC venue was much smaller so they were cramped on the stage that night). I'll have my full video of all my clips up later tonight.
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I just gave Charlie's solo album a listen and I'm pleasently surprised. The first two singles didn't resonate with me, "Arctic Cemetery" reminded me too much of BTBAM and "Tiktaalika" felt like a riff showcase without musical flow. I was worried that this was Charlie's aim with this solo project and that the whole album would be like that, and boy was I wrong. The album is diverse and flows beautifully from start to finish. The track "Tiktaalika" is placed near the end and with the rest of the album in the back of your head, it works really well as a retrospective and breather before the finale.
Anyway, don't sleep on this album.
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I just gave Charlie's solo album a listen and I'm pleasently surprised. The first two singles didn't resonate with me, "Arctic Cemetery" reminded me too much of BTBAM and "Tiktaalika" felt like a riff showcase without musical flow. I was worried that this was Charlie's aim with this solo project and that the whole album would be like that, and boy was I wrong. The album is diverse and flows beautifully from start to finish. The track "Tiktaalika" is placed near the end and with the rest of the album in the back of your head, it works really well as a retrospective and breather before the finale.
Anyway, don't sleep on this album.
What's the album name?
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Tiktaalika
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Yeah I think people who like the heavier, riffier side of Haken's music should generally like it. Lots of influences from Devin Townsend, BTBAM and thrash thrown in there too.
I agree with you about flow. I've been listening for a little while and there's not a huge number of strong vocal hooks, the album flows really well and he uses recurring themes really well! Overall a great album IMO.
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I am in the middle of a pretty heavy studying phase for an exam right now so I don't have the time to listen to any music :-\ I'm looking forward to hearing this one though!!! I'm curious, how do Charlie's lead vocals sound?
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Just listened to Charlie's new album, and I liked it a lot. Very heavy, and very proggy, with a lot of energy. 10 pounds of fun in a 5 pound bag.
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I am in the middle of a pretty heavy studying phase for an exam right now so I don't have the time to listen to any music :-\ I'm looking forward to hearing this one though!!! I'm curious, how do Charlie's lead vocals sound?
He does one of the shorter tracks, the song is heavily influenced by the more subdued side of Adrian-Belew-era King Crimson and his vocal performance is spot-on for what the music tries to accomplish.
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Matching the album release date, here's my chat with Charlie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGLhfz6AJtQ
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Just listened to Charlie's new album, and I liked it a lot. Very heavy, and very proggy, with a lot of energy. 10 pounds of fun in a 5 pound bag.
Love it! Is that like "he looks like he won the 100 yard dash in a 50 yard gym" ? :rollin
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Listened to this earlier during a long run… Wow this is way better than expected. Will repeat often next week while working, could be best of any of their side projects (thinking Novena is tops up til now).
Fantasy casting: would have been great to hear Burton Bell do Crawl Walk Run. After Prosthetic and this song I’m sure Charlie likes himself some early Fear Factory.
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I got Tiktaalika in the mail today. Will listen to it soon :)
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I've listened to the album twice and it's actually really really good. I'm kind of pleasantly surprised by the quality of the songwriting... I don't know, I think I underestimated Charlie's skills as Richard was always the main songwriter on Haken.
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I've listened to the album twice and it's actually really really good. I'm kind of pleasantly surprised by the quality of the songwriting... I don't know, I think I underestimated Charlie's skills as Richard was always the main songwriter on Haken.
FWIW Richard WAS the main songwriter in Haken, from what I understand the last few albums have been much more of a group effort in that department.
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I've listened to the album twice and it's actually really really good. I'm kind of pleasantly surprised by the quality of the songwriting... I don't know, I think I underestimated Charlie's skills as Richard was always the main songwriter on Haken.
I think I know what you mean. I've had the misconception that Hen was sort of an editor who was needed to mold the ideas of the other members into coherent albums. Hen's great solo album solidified this belief at first, but the quality of Ross' and Charlie's albums changed my perspective. What a coincidence that this outrageously talented bunch of musicians found together.
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Yes, I saw some interviews where they say the approach of their songwriting changed since The Mountain (I believe...), but I was still thinking (maybe wrongly) that Charlie was the main driving force behind it. Anyway, I'm very happy to confirm the amazing set of songwriters that Haken has, I also love Ross's album and Hen's is amazing.
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Just had my first listen to Tiktaalika and really enjoyed it :tup :metal
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Just had my first listen to Tiktaalika and really enjoyed it :tup :metal
Yeah....I've listened to it about 4 or 5 times now, really digging it.
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Since everyone here seems to be liking it, I'm listening to Charlies album now... I'm getting some Devin Townsend (the heavy/proggy side) vibes which could make sense since they toured together before this album. Liking it so far :metal
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Jumping on the hype wagon for Tiktaalika. This is a fantastic album :metal
Definitely wears its influences on its sleeve. I hear Megadeth, Metallica, BTBAM, Dream Theater, and parts of it sound like if King Crimson wrote a Thrash Metal album.
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Jumping on the hype wagon for Tiktaalika. This is a fantastic album :metal
Definitely wears its influences on its sleeve. I hear Megadeth, Metallica, BTBAM, Dream Theater, and parts of it sound like if King Crimson wrote a Thrash Metal album.
The press release said it bridged the gap between King Crimson and King Diamond! ;D
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Finally got around to listening to Tiktaalika...I have to agree with the good people on this thread...what a fun ride!! Great playing and songs. Love the thrash metal influence creeping in :)
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I concur with everyone that wrote above, what a fantastic album this Tktaalika is, had no idea Tommy Rogers was on it. Great album start to finish, it has so many cool ideas, riffs, vocals, everything. Such a fun listen.
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Sounds great Charlie! Nice work by a nice guy!
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Charlie's album deserves a thread of its own. Amazing playing and one hell of a ride from front to back. So many cool parts and killer riffs!
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Charlie's album deserves a thread of its own. Amazing playing and one hell of a ride from front to back. So many cool parts and killer riffs!
Tremendous album. I was not expecting to be heavy af. LOL. So far it is a very strong AOTY candidate.
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Charlie's album deserves a thread of its own. Amazing playing and one hell of a ride from front to back. So many cool parts and killer riffs!
Tremendous album. I was not expecting to be heavy af. LOL. So far it is a very strong AOTY candidate.
Yep, VERY heavy.
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Haken announced just now that they've finished drum tracking for the new album.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CgmRyqns10Z/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
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For those interested, here's the setlist for their show at Radar Festival today (basically their Symphony X tour set with 2 more songs):
Prosthetic
Invasion
Nightingale
Falling Back to Earth
Cockroach King
Nil by Mouth
1985
Carousel
The Architect
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I'd be showing up late for any concert that started with Prosthetic. What a tuneless technical piece of garbage that song is. I just gave it a fresh listen to see if maybe I missing something, Nope. It is terrible. What a shame that they are now ignoring songs from the first two albums and going down this road of these tuneless super metal tracks. :tdwn :tdwn
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I can see why a lot of Haken fans wouldn't like Prosthetic and it's not one of their best songs, but it's easily my favorite from Virus. :lol
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I absolutely love Prosthetic. It’s a great tune!
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I absolutely love Prosthetic. It’s a great tune!
Absolutely. Prosthetic alone saved me from my fears of where Haken might be headed. Vector was pretty good, but mostly a big letdown after the 4 album run that preceded it. But once I heard Prosthetic, I knew they were back with a vengeance. Saved the whole V/V cycle in my eyes.
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I absolutely love Prosthetic. It’s a great tune!
Yup, awesome opener too. I'm not going to say it's "top Haken" or anything, but it's certainly not a song to miss.
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I absolutely love Prosthetic. It’s a great tune!
Yup, awesome opener too. I'm not going to say it's "top Haken" or anything, but it's certainly not a song to miss.
Fairly this actually. It’s not in the upper echelons of Haken, less so as an opener, but it’s not a bad song. I love the section that later gets reprised in Messiah Complex, what I call the War of the Worlds section, I love the chorus. It’s just a really strong song for my ear.
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As far as Haken goes, I'd consider Prosthetic pretty mid-tier, but I still enjoy it an absolute ton.
Unrelated, but I saw Pete today and got a chance to catch up about the new album among other things. Sounding pretty exciting - for those of us who got a bit of a Mountain vibe from Nightingale, his personal take is that there's a sense of that throughout the album - not the same style, but a similar feel. What that means in practice I don't know yet. :lol Recording is going well, and having done Nightingale Jens Bogren is scheduled in to mix and (I think) master it.
One thing I learned is how vinyl production times are now double what they were pre-pandemic.
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I'd be showing up late for any concert that started with Prosthetic. What a tuneless technical piece of garbage that song is. I just gave it a fresh listen to see if maybe I missing something, Nope. It is terrible. What a shame that they are now ignoring songs from the first two albums and going down this road of these tuneless super metal tracks. :tdwn :tdwn
I disagree Kev (and I agree with you 95% of the time). While it's far from one of my favorite Haken tunes, I think it's a pretty good rocker and a great song to open with.
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+1 for really enjoying Prosthetic :)