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Dream Theater => Dream Theater => Topic started by: noahl on June 29, 2014, 09:40:58 PM
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I understand that Mike Mangini and Portnoy have a friendship history. I know Mike Portnoy has to be jealous considering he misses being in Dream Theater (assumption--at least want's to be back in...) Anyways, do you think that they dislike each other the least bit - nonetheless Portnoy disliking Mangini? Mangini seemed to be assured that he would keep his position in DT, and that MP would never find his way back. MP found that pretty disrespectful and cocky. There whole friendship has to be ruined. Say what you all want, but I know DT will be back with MP in the future. They're going to have a reunion with Portnoy, and realize what they've been missing the whole time. No offense, but the new album was complete GARBAGE. (It's a matter of opinion.) The only song I like is the looking glass, because it's catchy--not the technicality. I hate the way Mangini's snare was tuned in DT 2013. I have all the respect for MM -- he's far better than Portnoy and that's a fact, but that's not his home...it's Portnoys'. The band isn't the same without him either. Back to the point, Mike Mangini and Mike Portnoy are both trying to get in the same position, but Mangini is only a drummer, not a writer or anything, so therefore, Portnoy scores there. Some of the best parts were written by Portnoy.
Here's a little article.
Metal Injection
Robert Pasbani
SOURCE : (https://www.metalinjection.net/latest-news/drama/dream-theater-frontman-doesnt-ever-see-mike-portnoy-rejoining-the-band)
"That possibility, I don't see it ever happening; it's not gonna happen," the singer replied. "Because, first and foremost, Mike Mangini is a full-fledged member of the band now, he's a phenomenal drummer and he's doing everything that we could possibly want as a drummer in a band. He's helping us realize exactly what we wanna do right now musically. And he will be our drummer until the day that we finish doing this, when we conclude. Mike Portnoy was a big part of our past, but I think that's where it's going to remain. He was a drummer from the past. And as far as presently and into the future, it will be Mike Mangini, and we all feel very strongly about that. He's an incredible drummer, he's an incredible asset to the band, and he is fulfilling out wildest dreams as far as what we're doing musically and what we're doing with each album. So that's the way it stands."
This made me lose respect for LaBrie.
You cannot just take a previous member of the band, who created it, who hired YOU PERSONALLY, and just treat him like absolute garbage. Me and LaBrie both know that Portnoy was the soul of the band, was the frontman, was the MAN! It's like he took away custody of his child. Dream Theater was Mike Portnoy's band, and you can tell, Mike Portnoy isn't happy without it. Had you seen him drum? He smiled, smirked, pointed at the audience, was joyful. Now go watch winery dogs, saw them live, wasn't even close to as happy.
One of my favorite lines : "...he's a phenomenal drummer and he's doing everything that we could possibly want as a drummer in a band." Well, LaBrie, how about you put in a little effort? Weren't you almost kicked out of the band for not participating in writing? Don't you dare just say that. Maybe for you, because you don't put in as much effort as the other guys, he's doing what you could possibly want, but what about JP, JM, and JR, they probably feel different.
" He was a drummer from the past. " Just like you should be a singer of the past? Sorry, you're DT's singer, and I love what you do, but no, he was not a drummer from the past. He's the heart of Dream Theater, and he pretends he doesn't care but he truly does. He care's about that band more than each and every one of the band members, and these projects like TWD are just rebounds to fill the whole of his 25 year old daughter.
I know I was going on different topics, but there are multiple parts to pay attention to and respond to. Have fun.
Well what do you guys think? These are my thoughts, and I'm sorry if you disagree, but please no disrespect. Thank you.
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This thread is going to end well.
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This thread is going to end well.
I know it is, I enjoy controversy, it get's the true opinions out of fans, and brings the best out of them.
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Did you get kicked out of mp.com?
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Considering the things Portnoy has said about James, I think JLB dealt with the whole thing very gracefully.
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:facepalm:
So much fail in that original post.
JLB has handled this whole thing with 1,000 times more grace than Portnoy has.
Mike Portnoy never has been and never will be the heart of Dream Theater.
Dream Theater was never just Mike Portnoy's band.
Portnoy is not in the band anymore. Get used to it.
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Considering the things Portnoy has said about James, I think JLB dealt with the whole thing very gracefully.
Portnoy feels left out. He want's to be that guy that is truly in the works. JLB must have said some pretty awful things that wasn't released to the press for Portnoy to act out that way.
Just imagine what it's like for him.
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JLB must have said some pretty awful things that wasn't released to the press for Portnoy to act out that way.
Not really. Portnoy has taken shots at JLB in the press off and on since the turn of the century.
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:facepalm:
So much fail in that original post.
JLB has handled this whole thing with 1,000 times more grace than Portnoy has.
Mike Portnoy never has been and never will be the heart of Dream Theater.
Dream Theater was never just Mike Portnoy's band.
Portnoy is not in the band anymore. Get used to it.
I cannot get used to it. They wouldn't stay with him. He needed a break, and they would not support him. How could they just abandon a band mate like that? They're not telling us something, because bands don't fall apart like that. Please tell me what MP has said that's so bad about JLB.
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Jesus, man, get a grip. They did not abandon him; he left the band on his own! You seriously cannot be this obtuse, so I am thinking this has to be trolling.
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JLB must have said some pretty awful things that wasn't released to the press for Portnoy to act out that way.
Not really. Portnoy has taken shots at JLB in the press off and on since the turn of the century.
I do like your point of view, don't get me wrong, I value it.
I just feel that something isn't right here. Something's got to be pissing portnoy off like that.
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Jesus, man, get a grip. They did not abandon him; he left the band on his own! You seriously cannot be this obtuse, so I am thinking this has to be trolling.
Please understand, they did not value Mike Portnoy enough to realize that he was doing it for the love, he was doing it because he was forced.
If they cannot support his decision, I feel that there was something going on.
They were going for 25 years, and they couldn't take a 1-2 year hiatus. Kev, You're being pretty disrespectful to my opinion.
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Then get over that, too.
Oh, and :rollin :rollin
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holy crap
... I
I gotta get outta here
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MP tried to blackmail them into his personal hiatus, thinking his position was so strong that they would all submit. Probably most of the DT members were already fed up with his antics at that point, and let him run against the wall. His fault really, he was delusional about his importance in DT. The show is, and always has been, run by JP.
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I liked the bit about the daughter ;D
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MP tried to blackmail them into his personal hiatus, thinking his position was so strong that they would all submit. Probably most of the DT members were already fed up with his antics at that point, and let him run against the wall. His fault really.
Fair enough, I do believe part of him wanted to be in A7X, but he was kicked out...oops Portnoy.
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MP tried to blackmail them into his personal hiatus, thinking his position was so strong that they would all submit. Probably most of the DT members were already fed up with his antics at that point, and let him run against the wall. His fault really.
Blackmail? Good god this forum can be melodramatic.
I'm convinced at this point that there's MP, and then there's DTF's invented chinese whispers version of MP.
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Nobody kicked him out. He left because he had to after they called his bluff.
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Nobody kicked him out. He left because he had to after they called his bluff.
I'm talking about A7X, he was let go...so they could get a new drummer which does the job, just right.
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MP tried to blackmail them into his personal hiatus, thinking his position was so strong that they would all submit. Probably most of the DT members were already fed up with his antics at that point, and let him run against the wall. His fault really.
Blackmail? Good god this forum can be melodramatic.
I'm convinced at this point that there's MP, and then there's DTF's invented chinese whispers version of MP.
Blackmail might be too strong a word. Maybe "he tried to strongarm the rest of DT" is better.
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I think a better way of putting it is, he was used to arguing enough to always get his way, that he figured, "I'll quit, they'll beg me to come back, and I'll get what I want," but when they called his bluff, he tried to backtrack and get back in the band, but it was too late.
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Kev, You're being pretty disrespectful to my opinion.
I didn't think it was a rule that we have to respect every single opinion that every single person had. You have a really romantic, unrealistic view of MP's role in all of this. He's not a victim. He quit the band and now he's no longer in it. It is not disrespectful if JLB says in an interview that MP is no longer in Dream Theater because he's not.
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Kev, You're being pretty disrespectful to my opinion.
I didn't think it was a rule that we have to respect every single opinion that every single person had. You have a really romantic, unrealistic view of MP's role in all of this. He's not a victim. He quit the band and now he's no longer in it. It is not disrespectful if JLB says in an interview that MP is no longer in Dream Theater because he's not.
I'll stop you right there.
I never said he had to, I was informing him that he was being rude.
Second of all,
I never said he was, you took that out of context.
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This thread is going to end well.
Update:
It's ending pretty well.
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This thread is going to end well.
I know it is, I enjoy controversy, it get's the true opinions out of fans, and brings the best out of them.
Holy crap!! Someone else who enjoys actual debate!! We should be friends.
I would say I like how LaBrie handled that question. All the guys in DT answer that pretty much the same way, but with varying levels of assertion, and this was definitely very polarized and hard-hitting. It's nice that they are all so honest and audacious enough to say what is actually on their minds, and it gives us a great understanding of how each member feels. It seems JLB certainly feels the most certain about the situation.
And I don't know WHOSE concert you were at, but judging by the Transatlantic show this January, every freaking video on youtube (okay, minus one, but I watch a hell of a lot), and every day on Tweet Secret, I think Mike Portnoy is one of the happiest people I have ever seen. The split was great for everyone involved.
..Oh and about the thread- PERFECT discussion, and yea, how come it's okay to completely disrespect someone else's points only if their in the minority view? I guess rules really only do apply if the mods disagree with your view.. "No bashing" -my ass; "no disagreeing with Bosk and the majority of DTF" is where it's at. Here I am supporting a person's tactics who I thoroughly disagree with substantively, again.
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This thread is going to end well.
I know it is, I enjoy controversy, it get's the true opinions out of fans, and brings the best out of them.
Holy crap!! Someone else who enjoys actual debate!! We should be friends.
I would say I like how LaBrie handled that question. All the guys in DT answer that pretty much the same way, but with varying levels of assertion, and this was definitely very polarized and hard-hitting. It's nice that they are all so honest and audacious enough to say what is actually on their minds, and it gives us a great understanding of how each member feels. It seems JLB certainly feels the most certain about the situation.
And I don't know WHOSE concert you were at, but judging by the Transatlantic show this January, every freaking video on youtube (okay, minus one, but I watch a hell of a lot), and every day on Tweet Secret, I think Mike Portnoy is one of the happiest people I have ever seen. The split was great for everyone involved.
..Oh and about the thread- PERFECT discussion, and yea, how come it's okay to completely disrespect someone else's points only if their in the minority view? I guess rules really only do apply if the mods disagree with your view.. "No bashing" -my ass; "no disagreeing with Bosk and the majority of DTF" is where it's at. Here I am supporting a person's tactics who I thoroughly disagree with substantively, again.
Well as one of my first posts I learned most of the other DT fans hate debate, and hate other opinions if they're different then others :rollin rookie mistake..haha.
I do like it as well. Portnoy took it extremely offensive though. I know JP want's to play with MP again sometime.
I guess he just doesn't like Connecticut. At concerts for DT he was more into it.
I think that you're completely correct, and that I love you. I don't think anyone truly follows the rules at all, not even the mods. :lol
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Thread of the year. :corn
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Thread of the year. :corn
I'm sayin'!
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I think a better way of putting it is, he was used to arguing enough to always get his way, that he figured, "I'll quit, they'll beg me to come back, and I'll get what I want," but when they called his bluff, he tried to backtrack and get back in the band, but it was too late.
This is now one of my all time favorite Dream Theater conspiracy theories.
I think when he quit he really meant it. I suspect that he thought he could join AX7. I think when he realized that wouldn't happen and what he was leaving by not being in DT, he tried to get it back.
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:metal :biggrin:
They are quite skilled at quoting those rules, though. ;)
Well although I don't want MP back in Dream Theater, and I'd rather him do his 10 million projects, I still would LOVE for there to be a LTE3 or for MP to play on JP's solo album (Wasn't there talk about that?), or even for him to jump on stage with them for a song or two would be nice.
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I think a better way of putting it is, he was used to arguing enough to always get his way, that he figured, "I'll quit, they'll beg me to come back, and I'll get what I want," but when they called his bluff, he tried to backtrack and get back in the band, but it was too late.
This is now one of my all time favorite Dream Theater conspiracy theories.
I think when he quit he really meant it. I suspect that he thought he could join AX7. I think when he realized that wouldn't happen and what he was leaving by not being in DT, he tried to get it back.
Exactly my thought. :metal :biggrin:
They are quite skilled at quoting those rules, though. ;)
Well although I don't want MP back in Dream Theater, and I'd rather him do his 10 million projects, I still would LOVE for there to be a LTE3 or for MP to play on JP's solo album (Wasn't there talk about that?), or even for him to jump on stage with them for a song or two would be nice.
Yeah there is talk for that, and I bet it will happen.
And they are very skilled at it, there's no rule about talking crap about the mod's right? ;) :angel:
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I think a better way of putting it is, he was used to arguing enough to always get his way, that he figured, "I'll quit, they'll beg me to come back, and I'll get what I want," but when they called his bluff, he tried to backtrack and get back in the band, but it was too late.
This is now one of my all time favorite Dream Theater conspiracy theories.
I think when he quit he really meant it. I suspect that he thought he could join AX7. I think when he realized that wouldn't happen and what he was leaving by not being in DT, he tried to get it back.
I think it's both. I think he definitely wanted to be a permanent part of Avenged Sevenfold, but didn't want to lose DT in the process, so he tried his "I'll quit, and then they'll agree to the break" act, and it backfired on him.
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I think a better way of putting it is, he was used to arguing enough to always get his way, that he figured, "I'll quit, they'll beg me to come back, and I'll get what I want," but when they called his bluff, he tried to backtrack and get back in the band, but it was too late.
This is now one of my all time favorite Dream Theater conspiracy theories.
I think when he quit he really meant it. I suspect that he thought he could join AX7. I think when he realized that wouldn't happen and what he was leaving by not being in DT, he tried to get it back.
I think it's both. I think he definitely wanted to be a permanent part of Avenged Sevenfold, but didn't want to lose DT in the process, so he tried his "I'll quit, and then they'll agree to the break" act, and it backfired on him.
I don't think so. I think he left genuinely and changed his mind later. More like what ReaPsTA is saying. He probably did think A7X would keep him for good, but I differ in my view in that I think that was only part of it, I think he would have wanted to do other things anyway. Portnoy just misjudged that the other guys would have agreed to take a break (clearly it turned out they really didn't want to), and then was also wrong to think that they would wait just for him if he wanted to do something else for an extended period of time, whatever that may be.
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(https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/t1.0-9/10402559_743818722350482_6660386037827278003_n.jpg)
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Oh my :corn
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Jesus, man, get a grip. They did not abandon him; he left the band on his own! You seriously cannot be this obtuse, so I am thinking this has to be trolling.
Every time, someone keeps mentioning that DT abandoned MP, I am always reminded of this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kj_8E3FOU4s
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I love this thread. :lol
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I love this thread. :lol
Me too..
It's pretty funny, everyone gets so PISSED! :lol :rollin
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It's just that the subject has been done to death.
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Jesus, man, get a grip. They did not abandon him; he left the band on his own! You seriously cannot be this obtuse, so I am thinking this has to be trolling.
Every time, someone keeps mentioning that DT abandoned MP, I am always reminded of this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kj_8E3FOU4s
That is AMAZING.
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Jesus, man, get a grip. They did not abandon him; he left the band on his own! You seriously cannot be this obtuse, so I am thinking this has to be trolling.
Every time, someone keeps mentioning that DT abandoned MP, I am always reminded of this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kj_8E3FOU4s
That is AMAZING.
Agreed.
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:facepalm:
So much fail in that original post.
JLB has handled this whole thing with 1,000 times more grace than Portnoy has.
Mike Portnoy never has been and never will be the heart of Dream Theater.
Dream Theater was never just Mike Portnoy's band.
Portnoy is not in the band anymore. Get used to it.
I couldn't agree more with you. :tup
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There is only one thing this thread is missing...
:marriageanalogy:
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Trust someone with a low post count to kick this off again. Stinks of someone joining the forum just to cause a fuss, ie. a troll. Us mature ones (the band included) have more than moved on.
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Trust someone with a low post count to kick this off again. Stinks of someone joining the forum just to cause a fuss, ie. a troll. Us mature ones (the band included) have more than moved on.
There is nothing about the OP that suggests he is a troll at all, aside from holding an opposite viewpoint to the general forum, even if his information isn't all correct. I also don't get the impression that most people here have moved on from this issue, as it's always the same stuff coming back up constantly. I wish we'd moved on, because seeing the same discussion constantly has gotten tedious!
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Wait.....so Mike Portnoy has left Dream Theater?
I thought he'd just changed his drum kit and straightened his hair. I was wondering why he'd started doing interviews in a Boston accent. Everything makes so much sense now.
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Wait.....so Mike Portnoy has left Dream Theater?
I thought he'd just changed his drum kit and straightened his hair. I was wondering why he'd started doing interviews in a Boston accent. Everything makes so much sense now.
(https://i1300.photobucket.com/albums/ag94/ShadowNinja38/karkat4_zpsfabd398a.png)
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I know I was going on different topics, but there are multiple parts to pay attention to and respond to. Have fun.
I kinda understand where you're coming from sometimes, but to me part of it might be assuming the premise of an extreme separation of the ideas of a DT with MP and a post-MP DT. Sure, it can be a thing. But the way I see it, bands grow and change in different ways, often members step out and someone else steps in. DT has gone through these transformations multiple times. Now Dream Theater is still Dream Theater so.. I guess if you don't like it, that's a chance to recognise what that means for you on a personal level and perhaps the change will grow on you over time or you'll find something else that you prefer. But change will always be constant, and that will never change..?¿
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I don't ever understand people saying that DT was MP's band. I mean, really?
DT was founded by JP, JM, and MP.
Also, I don't think that MP efforts for the band were greater than JP efforts.
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This thread is going to end well.
I know it is, I enjoy controversy, it get's the true opinions out of fans, and brings the best them.
FTFY
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Portnoy thought relationships in the band were strained and wanted "up to 5" years off to rekindle that relationship. ***
The rest of the band said no - the band is our meal ticket. We can't just stop for "up to 5" years.
So Mike Portnoy forced their hand and said he was leaving the band. I dunno if he thought they would stop and wait for him to return.
Instead they made a documentary about finding Mangini . Recorded a new album and carried on as normal.
Meanwhile - MP joined AX7 and assumed that was his new full-time gig but they let him go and told him he was only temporary all along.
MP then went on twitter saying " You can't trust anyone".
*** - Funnily enough - the band are getting on better than ever since they got Mangini. Make of that what you want...
EDIT - Yes MP did try to get back in the band even after Mangini had joined.
JP even said that in an interview - something like " Really? After we've been through all that, the legal stuff and made this film and hired Mangini - you think you can just step back in ? ! "
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This thread is going to end well.
I know it is, I enjoy controversy, it get's the true opinions out of fans, and brings the best out of them.
Holy crap!! Someone else who enjoys actual debate!! We should be friends.
I would say I like how LaBrie handled that question. All the guys in DT answer that pretty much the same way, but with varying levels of assertion, and this was definitely very polarized and hard-hitting. It's nice that they are all so honest and audacious enough to say what is actually on their minds, and it gives us a great understanding of how each member feels. It seems JLB certainly feels the most certain about the situation.
And I don't know WHOSE concert you were at, but judging by the Transatlantic show this January, every freaking video on youtube (okay, minus one, but I watch a hell of a lot), and every day on Tweet Secret, I think Mike Portnoy is one of the happiest people I have ever seen. The split was great for everyone involved.
..Oh and about the thread- PERFECT discussion, and yea, how come it's okay to completely disrespect someone else's points only if their in the minority view? I guess rules really only do apply if the mods disagree with your view.. "No bashing" -my ass; "no disagreeing with Bosk and the majority of DTF" is where it's at. Here I am supporting a person's tactics who I thoroughly disagree with substantively, again.
Well as one of my first posts I learned most of the other DT fans hate debate, and hate other opinions if they're different then others :rollin rookie mistake..haha.
I do like it as well. Portnoy took it extremely offensive though. I know JP want's to play with MP again sometime.
I guess he just doesn't like Connecticut. At concerts for DT he was more into it.
I think that you're completely correct, and that I love you. I don't think anyone truly follows the rules at all, not even the mods. :lol
You say opinions I say fantasy. :lol
Mike is an emotional guy. He was burned out on DT asked to take time of which was quite a long time. I think it was a surprise to the other guys. I think they felt if he was burned out on DT he shouldn't have spread himself so much in other projects all the time. Mike stood his ground and they did as well. He then said he quit, they moved on.
Mike wanted back in after they invested so much time going through the process with finding a new drummer and they already had Mangini in the fold and it was too late at that point.
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The real tragedy against MP is the fact that AX7 kicked him out. I mean, after he poured his heart and soul into a couple of months of being a touring drummer, and then to have them just turn their back on him after the pain of sacrificing his 25 year old daughter for them. I mean, I can understand disowning your 25 year old daughter for a more fun and popular 10 year old, but then when she says goodbye, because you really were only a baby-sitter, I mean it was cruel an unusual punishment.
FOR SHAME on A7X!! What a bunch of manipulative cunts.
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Trust someone with a low post count to kick this off again. Stinks of someone joining the forum just to cause a fuss, ie. a troll. Us mature ones (the band included) have more than moved on.
I am not a troll. I made all 24 posts last night. Sorry you disagree.
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I know I was going on different topics, but there are multiple parts to pay attention to and respond to. Have fun.
I kinda understand where you're coming from sometimes, but to me part of it might be assuming the premise of an extreme separation of the ideas of a DT with MP and a post-MP DT. Sure, it can be a thing. But the way I see it, bands grow and change in different ways, often members step out and someone else steps in. DT has gone through these transformations multiple times. Now Dream Theater is still Dream Theater so.. I guess if you don't like it, that's a chance to recognise what that means for you on a personal level and perhaps the change will grow on you over time or you'll find something else that you prefer. But change will always be constant, and that will never change..?¿
I do like mm's work. Don't get me wrong. I just feel for portnoy. I will still listen I just prefer portnoy in the band--like many others.
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I do like mm's work. Don't get me wrong. I just feel for portnoy. I will still listen I just prefer portnoy in the band--like many others.
I know, right? It's such a shame he hasn't had Dream Theater to channel his creative outlet. I mean, how can a guy get by with only The Winery Dogs, PSMS, Bigelf, Transatlantic, Flying Colors, Adrenaline Mob, and The Neal Morse Band to satisfy all of his writing and touring needs?? He'd be much happier in the Dream Theater 2 year cycle of write-record-tour-break-tour-break.
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Portnoy thought relationships in the band were strained and wanted "up to 5" years off to rekindle that relationship. ***
The rest of the band said no - the band is our meal ticket. We can't just stop for "up to 5" years.
So Mike Portnoy forced their hand and said he was leaving the band. I dunno if he thought they would stop and wait for him to return.
Instead they made a documentary about finding Mangini . Recorded a new album and carried on as normal.
Meanwhile - MP joined AX7 and assumed that was his new full-time gig but they let him go and told him he was only temporary all along.
MP then went on twitter saying " You can't trust anyone".
*** - Funnily enough - the band are getting on better than ever since they got Mangini. Make of that what you want...
EDIT - Yes MP did try to get back in the band even after Mangini had joined.
JP even said that in an interview - something like " Really? After we've been through all that, the legal stuff and made this film and hired Mangini - you think you can just step back in ? ! "
He said UP to 5 years. He came back in less time than that wanting to rejoin. JP would be the guy to get MP back, considering they're still close.
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This thread is going to end well.
I know it is, I enjoy controversy, it get's the true opinions out of fans, and brings the best out of them.
Holy crap!! Someone else who enjoys actual debate!! We should be friends.
I would say I like how LaBrie handled that question. All the guys in DT answer that pretty much the same way, but with varying levels of assertion, and this was definitely very polarized and hard-hitting. It's nice that they are all so honest and audacious enough to say what is actually on their minds, and it gives us a great understanding of how each member feels. It seems JLB certainly feels the most certain about the situation.
And I don't know WHOSE concert you were at, but judging by the Transatlantic show this January, every freaking video on youtube (okay, minus one, but I watch a hell of a lot), and every day on Tweet Secret, I think Mike Portnoy is one of the happiest people I have ever seen. The split was great for everyone involved.
..Oh and about the thread- PERFECT discussion, and yea, how come it's okay to completely disrespect someone else's points only if their in the minority view? I guess rules really only do apply if the mods disagree with your view.. "No bashing" -my ass; "no disagreeing with Bosk and the majority of DTF" is where it's at. Here I am supporting a person's tactics who I thoroughly disagree with substantively, again.
Well as one of my first posts I learned most of the other DT fans hate debate, and hate other opinions if they're different then others :rollin rookie mistake..haha.
I do like it as well. Portnoy took it extremely offensive though. I know JP want's to play with MP again sometime.
I guess he just doesn't like Connecticut. At concerts for DT he was more into it.
I think that you're completely correct, and that I love you. I don't think anyone truly follows the rules at all, not even the mods. :lol
You say opinions I say fantasy. :lol
Mike is an emotional guy. He was burned out on DT asked to take time of which was quite a long time. I think it was a surprise to the other guys. I think they felt if he was burned out on DT he shouldn't have spread himself so much in other projects all the time. Mike stood his ground and they did as well. He then said he quit, they moved on.
Mike wanted back in after they invested so much time going through the process with finding a new drummer and they already had Mangini in the fold and it was too late at that point.
So he was playing chicken?
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I do like mm's work. Don't get me wrong. I just feel for portnoy. I will still listen I just prefer portnoy in the band--like many others.
I know, right? It's such a shame he hasn't had Dream Theater to channel his creative outlet. I mean, how can a guy get by with only The Winery Dogs, PSMS, Bigelf, Transatlantic, Flying Colors, Adrenaline Mob, and The Neal Morse Band to satisfy all of his writing and touring needs?? He'd be much happier in the Dream Theater 2 year cycle of write-record-tour-break-tour-break.
He cannot be creative with The Winery Dogs..It's kind-of sad.
He has much more creativity than MM--not bashin MM--he's still a better drummer than MP., however, MP utilizes his ability 150%.
COME HOME PORTNOY.
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He only wanted back in sooner than five years when he realised the band were happy to carry on without him.
MP won't be back in DT. I wouldn't rule out a guest spot in years to come when the waters are calm. And never say never right?
But, I think a guest spot is unlikely and returning to DT full time is just never going to happen. Him never being in DT is a helluva lot more likely than him ever being in DT again. I don't see how you can state that you know he'll return.
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No. Mike was honestly burnt, but I do believe he did that to himself. His focus for the first time was not on DT and when The guys told him they didn't want to take a break he left. Sometimes things just don't work out. Feeling were hurt. As a fan nothing we can do. I try to look at it as I've got more music to listen to now that Mike plays in so many bands I like.
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No. Mike was honestly burnt, but I do believe he did that to himself. His focus for the first time was not on DT and when The guys told him they didn't want to take a break he left. Sometimes things just don't work out. Feeling were hurt. As a fan nothing we can do. I try to look at it as I've got more music to listen to now that Mike plays in so many bands I like.
Thank you, That's what I've been saying. I do like some of his new bands. HOPE LTE3 HAPPENS!
"Just for the record: "I think my initial feelings of no longer being interested in another LTE album because of the similarities to DT with Jordan have finally passed... It's been long enough now that I think it could indeed be exciting, creative and a lot of fun.
YES.
He only wanted back in sooner than five years when he realised the band were happy to carry on without him.
MP won't be back in DT. I wouldn't rule out a guest spot in years to come when the waters are calm. And never say never right?
But, I think a guest spot is unlikely and returning to DT full time is just never going to happen. Him never being in DT is a helluva lot more likely than him ever being in DT again. I don't see how you can state that you know he'll return.
I have a feeling after that guest spot, they'll know what they've been missing.
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Which playing with him for 25 years would never have shown them?
Nope. Not doing this. I'm out o' tha thread!
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Thank you, That's what I've been saying. I do like some of his new bands. HOPE LTE3 HAPPENS!
"Just for the record: "I think my initial feelings of no longer being interested in another LTE album because of the similarities to DT with Jordan have finally passed... It's been long enough now that I think it could indeed be exciting, creative and a lot of fun.
YES.
I have a feeling after that guest spot, they'll know what they've been missing.
I know it's easy to assume that all prog metal heads have serious hearing loss , but a lot of us don't ;)
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I´ve never seen anyone receive so much criticism over a breakup...not even David lee Roth or Sammy Hagar, who still argue in the press every now and then, and both have left (and come back, and then left) Van Halen more than 15 years ago. I think some of us did enjoy DT a hell of a lot more when MP was in the band. I for one, think they lost 99% of their balls and spontaneity when he left, even though MM can play his beats effortlessly and even improve some of them.
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Thank you, That's what I've been saying. I do like some of his new bands. HOPE LTE3 HAPPENS!
"Just for the record: "I think my initial feelings of no longer being interested in another LTE album because of the similarities to DT with Jordan have finally passed... It's been long enough now that I think it could indeed be exciting, creative and a lot of fun.
YES.
I have a feeling after that guest spot, they'll know what they've been missing.
I know it's easy to assume that all prog metal heads have serious hearing loss , but a lot of us don't ;)
That's a pretty safe/accurate assumption! :lol :biggrin:
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I like the last 2 albums very much. I am happy with the current lineup. I hope it stays as is. :)
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I´ve never seen anyone receive so much criticism over a breakup...not even David lee Roth or Sammy Hagar, who still argue in the press every now and then, and both have left (and come back, and then left) Van Halen more than 15 years ago.
That's because the breakup, from MP's side, was handled like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMagP52BWG8#t=141
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That's not true al all. JP never told MP that "He better wear a cup" the next time he saw him.
That's what Eddie said in an interview about Sammy Hagar. Also on the reunion tour Michael Anthony was working for scale since Eddie kicked him out of the band and forced a buy out.
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The only time I remember EVH saying that was when he said that about DLR when Roth told him to stop talking about his hip at that MTV Music Awards where Roth made an ass about himself. Roth was pissed that Eddie was taking attention away from him by talking about the hip surgery he needed and said something about the lines of, "Tonight's about me, not your f'ing hip."
It wouldn't surprise me if he recycled that line several times, however. :lol
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He only wanted back in sooner than five years when he realised the band were happy to carry on without him.
That's not true. He tried compromising down to about a year, and they all had plenty of time to think it over and discuss it before MP made his decision. He only left when they couldn't reach a compromise. The idea that MP was blackmailing or bluffing them or any other such terms people have used is ridiculous.
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I mean he reneged on the break idea when the band carried on without him. That post was specifically countering one before.
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I mean he reneged on the break idea when the band carried on without him. That post was specifically countering one before.
I don't think he even knew the band had moved on as they had without him when he tried to rejoin.
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That's not true al all. JP never told MP that "He better wear a cup" the next time he saw him.
Which reminds me: https://youtu.be/sL9zwX5LzxQ?t=2m23s
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According to JP, MP pretty much told them he wants to join A7X: https://www.musicradar.com/news/guitars/interview-dream-theaters-john-petrucci-jordan-rudess-on-the-bands-future-442741/ (warning: includes a marriage analogy)
When Mike told you of his plans, did you attempt to change his mind? Did you try to come to some sort of arrangement that would make him happy and keep the band together?
Petrucci: "The biggest thing we did was tell him, 'Don't do that, Mike. It's a mistake.' And we gave him all the reasons you could give to somebody that you're in a band with. See, he wanted to take a long break. He didn't want to leave at first; he wanted to take a five-year break from Dream Theater."
This might be a strange analogy, but it seems akin to a husband leaving his wonderful wife and wanting to run off with –
Petrucci: [laughs] "The younger girl. Right. And she might seem terrific at first, but hey, we told him, 'Mike, this might seem exciting right now, but you're going to wind up unhappy.' We did try to tell him that."
Rudess: "A band member wanting to take a bit of a break is one thing. People are entitled to a break. But Mike wanted to take five years off from Dream Theater. That was a major blow to us. Five years?! That's a big statement. I mean, this is what we do. We enjoy it, we make our livings from it… You can't just stop it cold like that."
Petrucci: "Basically, he was telling us, 'I'm having a good time with this other band. I want to be a part of it.' He didn't want to go right back into Dream Theater, the writing, recording, touring... He thought that we should go away, and then when we came back in five years everybody would welcome us bigger than ever."
I understand that Mike Mangini and Portnoy have a friendship history. I know Mike Portnoy has to be jealous considering he misses being in Dream Theater (assumption--at least want's to be back in...) Anyways, do you think that they dislike each other the least bit - nonetheless Portnoy disliking Mangini? Mangini seemed to be assured that he would keep his position in DT, and that MP would never find his way back. MP found that pretty disrespectful and cocky. There whole friendship has to be ruined.
Mangini has said nothing but positive things about MP in the press and I'm pretty sure he was one of the three who responded to MP's email when he congratulated them on the Grammy nomination. If there's some kind of feud, it's most likely one-sided.
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I mean he reneged on the break idea when the band carried on without him. That post was specifically countering one before.
I don't think he even knew the band had moved on as they had without him when he tried to rejoin.
That's what I'm thinking too. They will have kept their drummer search away from MP as much as from everybody else. From MP's perspective he might have thought that he had let them steam for a while, and now they would badly want him back.
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He only wanted back in sooner than five years when he realised the band were happy to carry on without him.
That's not true. He tried compromising down to about a year, and they all had plenty of time to think it over and discuss it before MP made his decision. He only left when they couldn't reach a compromise. The idea that MP was blackmailing or bluffing them or any other such terms people have used is ridiculous.
Thank you!!
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According to JP, MP pretty much told them he wants to join A7X: https://www.musicradar.com/news/guitars/interview-dream-theaters-john-petrucci-jordan-rudess-on-the-bands-future-442741/ (warning: includes a marriage analogy)
When Mike told you of his plans, did you attempt to change his mind? Did you try to come to some sort of arrangement that would make him happy and keep the band together?
Petrucci: "The biggest thing we did was tell him, 'Don't do that, Mike. It's a mistake.' And we gave him all the reasons you could give to somebody that you're in a band with. See, he wanted to take a long break. He didn't want to leave at first; he wanted to take a five-year break from Dream Theater."
This might be a strange analogy, but it seems akin to a husband leaving his wonderful wife and wanting to run off with –
Petrucci: [laughs] "The younger girl. Right. And she might seem terrific at first, but hey, we told him, 'Mike, this might seem exciting right now, but you're going to wind up unhappy.' We did try to tell him that."
Rudess: "A band member wanting to take a bit of a break is one thing. People are entitled to a break. But Mike wanted to take five years off from Dream Theater. That was a major blow to us. Five years?! That's a big statement. I mean, this is what we do. We enjoy it, we make our livings from it… You can't just stop it cold like that."
Petrucci: "Basically, he was telling us, 'I'm having a good time with this other band. I want to be a part of it.' He didn't want to go right back into Dream Theater, the writing, recording, touring... He thought that we should go away, and then when we came back in five years everybody would welcome us bigger than ever."
I understand that Mike Mangini and Portnoy have a friendship history. I know Mike Portnoy has to be jealous considering he misses being in Dream Theater (assumption--at least want's to be back in...) Anyways, do you think that they dislike each other the least bit - nonetheless Portnoy disliking Mangini? Mangini seemed to be assured that he would keep his position in DT, and that MP would never find his way back. MP found that pretty disrespectful and cocky. There whole friendship has to be ruined.
Mangini has said nothing but positive things about MP in the press and I'm pretty sure he was one of the three who responded to MP's email when he congratulated them on the Grammy nomination. If there's some kind of feud, it's most likely one-sided.
That's incorrect, MP got pissed because MM was being cocky.
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I mean he reneged on the break idea when the band carried on without him. That post was specifically countering one before.
I don't think he even knew the band had moved on as they had without him when he tried to rejoin.
That's what I'm thinking too. They will have kept their drummer search away from MP as much as from everybody else. From MP's perspective he might have thought that he had let them steam for a while, and now they would badly want him back.
He's a dumbass, I would join DT in a heartbeat.
Just kidding.,. I'm not that great of a drummer.
I understand where Portnoy is coming from. HE NEEDED A DAMN BREAK.
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That's incorrect, MP got pissed because MM was being cocky.
:huh:
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That's incorrect, MP got pissed because MM was being cocky.
:huh:
WTF?! :lol
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:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
Yeah, he's not trolling. :lol :lol
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That's incorrect, MP got pissed because MM was being cocky.
:huh:
Ah yeah, I don't think MP got pissed at MM at all (unhappy at having been replaced, but that's not about MM specifically), and MM wasn't being cocky about anything either.
This whole thread (including other people's replies) is a new low for DTF, and that's a pretty tough thing to do.
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That's incorrect, MP got pissed because MM was being cocky.
:huh:
There's an article that I read somewhere that talks about this.That's incorrect, MP got pissed because MM was being cocky.
:huh:
WTF?! :lol
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Being a drummer myself MP was a pretty big inspiration to me back in the day. He's done some amazing things within the drum department for prog metal and no one can take those things away from him. But basically already after 6DOIT I started noticing him re-use alot of his fills, grooves and stuff and I started slowly to loose interest in him as a drummer. Found other bands and other drummers alot more creative so I pretty much stopped following DT, although I did listen occasionally on every new release hoping to find some spark but with no really luck.
I remember alot of times before MP left wondering what DT would have sound like with a diffrent drummer because I had so much respect for JP, JR and JM as musicians and thought they had more passion for their respective craft.
So when MP left I felt nothing more than excitment and interest for the future of DT. With all this being said though i'm only talking about MP as a drummer, he of course did so much more for DT and those things is much harder to replace. That was one of the things why I never actually thought MP would leave DT, I just couldn't picture anyone taking over that chair given how much he did for DT besides playing drums.
It did happen and someone replaced him in the form of the amazing MM which I knew of way before the audition. I knew he was capable of handling anything thrown at him. Could he replace the drum icon Mike Portnoy with his huge fanbase? Probably not but he was a refresing thing for DT as a band.
Fast forward 4 years and seeing this whole debate of MP and DT still raving on I almost feel like:
Please Mike Portnoy come back to DT so we can end this neverending topic on DTF.
I didn't mean to sound harsh but I guess i've never been much of a true fan of any band or member meaning that I don't get very emotional when someone leaves a band that I like. I just accept and move on as I do with alot of things I can't control. There's no point getting worked up over something as trivial. That's just my two cents.
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That's incorrect, MP got pissed because MM was being cocky.
:huh:
There's an article that I read somewhere that talks about this.
Sure you did.
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This thread made my morning.
That's incorrect, MP got pissed because MM was being cocky.
:huh:
There's an article that I read somewhere that talks about this.
Sure you did.
I'm sure it was penned by noahl.
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This thread made my morning.
That's incorrect, MP got pissed because MM was being cocky.
:huh:
There's an article that I read somewhere that talks about this.
Sure you did.
I'm sure it was penned by noahl.
Here's the link, richard.
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/general_music_news/mike_mangini_portnoys_never_coming_back.html
that's one part,
cannot locate where MP get's pissed, but you get the point.
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What the hell, man. Just, what the hell.
"MP is pissed because of MM."
"Why?"
"Read an article. Doesn't say he is pissed, but anyway, enjoy."
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Shit - I need a JD ..............make it a double (https://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-eatdrink005.gif) (https://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php)
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He only wanted back in sooner than five years when he realised the band were happy to carry on without him.
That's not true. He tried compromising down to about a year, and they all had plenty of time to think it over and discuss it before MP made his decision. He only left when they couldn't reach a compromise. The idea that MP was blackmailing or bluffing them or any other such terms people have used is ridiculous.
The "bluff" part came in during the week they gave each other to reconsider. MP wasn't gonna budge about his hiatus, but he expected the rest of DT to budge during that time. After the week his "bluff" was called and he had to actually do what he had threatened too do, i.e. leave DT.
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He only wanted back in sooner than five years when he realised the band were happy to carry on without him.
That's not true. He tried compromising down to about a year, and they all had plenty of time to think it over and discuss it before MP made his decision. He only left when they couldn't reach a compromise. The idea that MP was blackmailing or bluffing them or any other such terms people have used is ridiculous.
The "bluff" part came in during the week they gave each other to reconsider. MP wasn't gonna budge about his hiatus, but he expected the rest of DT to budge during that time. After the week his "bluff" was called and he had to actually do what he had threatened too do, i.e. leave DT.
That's nothing but biased conjecture.
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Honestly, as a fan of both Mike Portnoy and of Dream Theater, I wonder sometimes why there's so much finger-pointing within the fanbase. This was, all things considered, a very amicable split. There were a couple of times when Mike said something he shouldn't have said, sure, but in the context of every other split-up of a band in history? I'm going to list off a few things now that I hope to God we can all agree on:
- Mike Portnoy acted out of what he thought were the best interests of him and the band in calling for a hiatus.
- The rest of the band acted out of the best interests of the band by refusing to take a hiatus. They acted out of what they thought were the best interests of Mike Portnoy by encouraging him to stay.
- Mike Portnoy acted out of what he thought were his own best interests in leaving the band.
- Mike Portnoy was mistaken in believing that leaving the band was in his best interests
- Three current members of Dream Theater have contacted Mike Portnoy since the breakup, at least by responding to his email congratulating them on their Grammy nomination. One of these members is Jordan Rudess. James LaBrie is not one of them.
- Mike Portnoy was wrong to jump to conclusions about James LaBrie's statements to the press. As a corollary, Mike Portnoy admitted his mistake and apologized appropriately.
- Mike Portnoy was wrong to, in the years preceding the breakup, make negative comments about the singing of James LaBrie to the press and in public fora.
- Here's the big one: Mike Portnoy, on a fundamental level, does not mean any ill will towards the members of Dream Theater. He does sometimes make public statements that are imprudent and create the impression that he means ill will towards Dream Theater.
Can we all agree on these truths about this breakup, and as a consequence stop pointing fingers at either Dream Theater or Mike Portnoy? Honestly, I think sometimes that the fans have stronger feelings on this matter than the members of the band! I doubt even JLB feels as strongly negative about MP as the anti-MP faction of the fanbase; and I think MP holds little resentment at all towards the band and is not under the impression that he is likely to be rejoining it, in contrast to the views of the "bring back MP" faction of the fanbase
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He only wanted back in sooner than five years when he realised the band were happy to carry on without him.
That's not true. He tried compromising down to about a year, and they all had plenty of time to think it over and discuss it before MP made his decision. He only left when they couldn't reach a compromise. The idea that MP was blackmailing or bluffing them or any other such terms people have used is ridiculous.
The "bluff" part came in during the week they gave each other to reconsider. MP wasn't gonna budge about his hiatus, but he expected the rest of DT to budge during that time. After the week his "bluff" was called and he had to actually do what he had threatened too do, i.e. leave DT.
That's nothing but biased conjecture.
WTF, what part? We *know* MP threatened to leave, we *know* they gave each other a week to think about it, and we *know* that MP then left the band. Where is the conjecture?
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Here's the link, richard.
https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/general_music_news/mike_mangini_portnoys_never_coming_back.html
that's one part,
cannot locate where MP get's pissed, but you get the point.
Ok, he says MP isn't coming back (which is something the other guys had most likely convinced him about and was 100% obvious anyway), but he also says:
"I don't feel like it's hanging over my head. The reason why is I like Mike very much. He's a friend and I have new brothers in Dream Theater, and when you love somebody you let them do what they need to."
I don't see anything cocky in that, and there's not a single mention of MP being pissed off.
WTF, what part? We *know* MP threatened to leave, we *know* they gave each other a week to think about it, and we *know* that MP then left the band. Where is the conjecture?
I got the impression MP didn't bring up the option of him leaving until after the week had passed and the other guys weren't willing to compromise.
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That's not how I remember it, but maybe my memory is faulty.
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He only wanted back in sooner than five years when he realised the band were happy to carry on without him.
That's not true. He tried compromising down to about a year, and they all had plenty of time to think it over and discuss it before MP made his decision. He only left when they couldn't reach a compromise. The idea that MP was blackmailing or bluffing them or any other such terms people have used is ridiculous.
The "bluff" part came in during the week they gave each other to reconsider. MP wasn't gonna budge about his hiatus, but he expected the rest of DT to budge during that time. After the week his "bluff" was called and he had to actually do what he had threatened too do, i.e. leave DT.
That's nothing but biased conjecture.
WTF, what part? We *know* MP threatened to leave, we *know* they gave each other a week to think about it, and we *know* that MP then left the band. Where is the conjecture?
I don't recall MP "threatening" to leave in the initial discussion (and threaten is such loaded language to begin with), only bringing up the idea of a hiatus, and he did compromise on how long it was going to be. So he'd already "budged" on his initial hiatus idea (just not far enough for the rest of DT to agree to, which was apparently zero, which I can't fault them for), and there is no evidence that he was bluffing to get what he wanted. He was burned out on DT, and him trying to return wasn't backing down on a bluff, it was regretting his decision after other circumstances changed and he had more time to think it over.
Your concept of the split is the truth after being run through the DTF washing machine.
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I decided to try this thread with baked ziti and a salad. It pairs well with both.
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I don't recall MP "threatening" to leave in the initial discussion (and threaten is such loaded language to begin with), only bringing up the idea of a hiatus, and he did compromise on how long it was going to be. So he'd already "budged" on his initial hiatus idea (just not far enough for the rest of DT to agree to, which was apparently zero, which I can't fault them for), and there is no evidence that he was bluffing to get what he wanted. He was burned out on DT, and him trying to return wasn't backing down on a bluff, it was regretting his decision after other circumstances changed and he had more time to think it over.
Your concept of the split is the truth after being run through the DTF washing machine.
Not at all. I think you're just whitewashing MP's dominant control over DT in the years leading up to the split. If you take that into account, I think it's obvious that MP thought he had such a strong hand in the gamble that he could make that decision too for them, just as he had made many decisions before.
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I don't recall MP "threatening" to leave in the initial discussion (and threaten is such loaded language to begin with), only bringing up the idea of a hiatus, and he did compromise on how long it was going to be. So he'd already "budged" on his initial hiatus idea (just not far enough for the rest of DT to agree to, which was apparently zero, which I can't fault them for), and there is no evidence that he was bluffing to get what he wanted. He was burned out on DT, and him trying to return wasn't backing down on a bluff, it was regretting his decision after other circumstances changed and he had more time to think it over.
Your concept of the split is the truth after being run through the DTF washing machine.
Not at all. I think you're just whitewashing MP's dominant control over DT in the years leading up to the split. If you take that into account, I think it's obvious that MP thought he had such a strong hand in the gamble that he could that make decision too for them, just as he had made many decisions before.
I'm not "whitewashing" anything, I just don't invent story beyond what the facts actually support or prove. I haven't heard anything from either side to suggest what you are claiming. It all comes down to your opinion of MP's personality, simple as that.
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[/li][li]Mike Portnoy was wrong to jump to conclusions about James LaBrie's statements to the press. As a corollary, Mike Portnoy admitted his mistake and apologized appropriately.[/li][/list]
No he didn't. He apologized for believing the out of context headline (from a website he always says never to believe) which is akin to a non-apology.
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I decided to try this thread with baked ziti and a salad. It pairs well with both.
You love the extra cheese I see.
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all I know is that I prefer Mike's live drumming to Mangini's... Also overall drum parts.
Mike has way more energy.
With that said, the two albums with Mangini are some of their best.
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Hooooly shit, Hellholming!!
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Perhaps the band jumped for joy over Mike wanting the indefinite break? It would appear it may have been the escape clause for them. They were able to break from his controlling hand by his own doing and start a fresh new future.
Mike always talks about the last few years and feeling distant from the members in the band. After 20+ years of Mike they may feel his departure was a refreshing that energized and propelled the band forward with joy and fully energized for many years to come.
Mike misplayed his hand badly and it cost him his bread and butter. Some gambles don’t go the way you think they will. Seriously…how couldn't Dream Theater not be happier with MM than they were with MP over the last few years.
Dream Theater going on with a new drummer may have saved the band from disbanding sooner.
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[/li][li]Mike Portnoy was wrong to jump to conclusions about James LaBrie's statements to the press. As a corollary, Mike Portnoy admitted his mistake and apologized appropriately.[/li][/list]
No he didn't. He apologized for believing the out of context headline (from a website he always says never to believe) which is akin to a non-apology.
Not if that was his only sin. If his actions (which were: saying that JLB was being "insensitive" and "disrespectful" to MP) would have been appropriate if the content of the headline was in the context it suggested, the appropriate thing to apologize for is acting on the basis of the out-of-context headline, not for just acting in general. The biggest mistake that I think I can agree MP made in that particular episode was believing the Blabbermouth headline in the first place without digging deeper, which I think we can agree was not a good decision, but I think you can't condemn MP too harshly on the sole basis of that.
This all to say nothing of the fact that there's no way that MP and JLB didn't both move past the Blabbermouth headline altercation years and years ago.
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all I know is that I prefer Mike's live drumming to Mangini's... Also overall drum parts.
Mike has way more energy.
With that said, the two albums with Mangini are some of their best.
Hey man, long time no see!! :)
I decided to try this thread with baked ziti and a salad. It pairs well with both.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQXx8z0ERbQ
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[/li][li]Mike Portnoy was wrong to jump to conclusions about James LaBrie's statements to the press. As a corollary, Mike Portnoy admitted his mistake and apologized appropriately.[/li][/list]
No he didn't. He apologized for believing the out of context headline (from a website he always says never to believe) which is akin to a non-apology.
Not if that was his only sin. If his actions (which were: saying that JLB was being "insensitive" and "disrespectful" to MP) would have been appropriate if the content of the headline was in the context it suggested, the appropriate thing to apologize for is acting on the basis of the out-of-context headline, not for just acting in general. The biggest mistake that I think I can agree MP made in that particular episode was believing the Blabbermouth headline in the first place without digging deeper, which I think we can agree was not a good decision, but I think you can't condemn MP too harshly on the sole basis of that.
This all to say nothing of the fact that there's no way that MP and JLB didn't both move past the Blabbermouth headline altercation years and years ago.
...and Mike deleted threads about JLB on his message board and "liked" facebook comments that said LaBrie was a horrible vocalist and sang off pitch and then claimed "I have the right to like whatever I want on facebook" without apologizing for "liking" shitty comments or deleted JLB threads.
So yeah, I'm sure JLB moved past that whole thing. He is still the vocalist in DT afterall.
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Lol, 4 pages in one day. The power of trolling ;D
Portnoy pls cum back... to indonesia
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I knew clicking on this would be a mistake...
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...and Mike deleted threads about JLB on his message board and "liked" facebook comments that said LaBrie was a horrible vocalist and sang off pitch and then claimed "I have the right to like whatever I want on facebook" without apologizing for "liking" shitty comments or deleted JLB threads.
7. Mike Portnoy was wrong to, in the years preceding the breakup, make negative comments about the singing of James LaBrie to the press and in public fora.
Okay?
I'm not defending him on that one. That was wrong, and it was rude, and he shouldn't have done it.
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Yeah, this subject has been debated and discussed within an inch of its life many times before. Can't believe I made it NB4 lock. Give it up for noob power. :justjen
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Me and LaBrie both know that Portnoy was the soul of the band, was the frontman, was the MAN! It's like he took away custody of his child. Dream Theater was Mike Portnoy's band...
NO
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...and Mike deleted threads about JLB on his message board and "liked" facebook comments that said LaBrie was a horrible vocalist and sang off pitch and then claimed "I have the right to like whatever I want on facebook" without apologizing for "liking" shitty comments or deleted JLB threads.
7. Mike Portnoy was wrong to, in the years preceding the breakup, make negative comments about the singing of James LaBrie to the press and in public fora.
Okay?
I'm not defending him on that one. That was wrong, and it was rude, and he shouldn't have done it.
My point was he never apologized for those.
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And that's a fair point, one that is implicit in my list of truths. I'm not here trying to make the case of "MP never did anything wrong." I was just trying to say "can we all agree at least on x, y and z?" This is because I'm seeing a lot of conjecture and a lot of vitriol in these types of discussions.
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The thing I always find humorous is when people suggest that it was inconsiderate or foolish of the other four members of DT to not repsect Mike's wishes for a hiatus. The person making that argument never seems to understand that those four guys have families to feed and bills to pay like everyone else. A hiatus as long as MP may or may not have wanted could easily have been difficult for any of those guys to manage financially, by sitting around with their thumbs up their asses, waiting for MP to be ready again.
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The thing I always find humorous is when people suggest that it was inconsiderate or foolish of the other four members of DT to not repsect Mike's wishes for a hiatus. The person making that argument never seems to understand that those four guys have families to feed and bills to pay like everyone else. A hiatus as long as MP may or may not have wanted could easily have been difficult for any of those guys to manage financially, by sitting around with their thumbs up their asses, waiting for MP to be ready again.
What I find humorous is the fact that you think you know that. You do not know their finances.
They ALL SAID in a documentary that they were extremely financially stable...
Know the facts
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:facepalm: :lol
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The thing I always find humorous is when people suggest that it was inconsiderate or foolish of the other four members of DT to not repsect Mike's wishes for a hiatus. The person making that argument never seems to understand that those four guys have families to feed and bills to pay like everyone else. A hiatus as long as MP may or may not have wanted could easily have been difficult for any of those guys to manage financially, by sitting around with their thumbs up their asses, waiting for MP to be ready again.
What I find humorous is the fact that you think you know that. You do not know their finances.
They ALL SAID in a documentary that they were extremely financially stable...
Know the facts
It also isn't the first time that anybody has suggested that a hiatus could be financially difficult for the other members. Have your boss suggest a two month hiatus for you and see how it works out.
Also, reading comprehension, please. I clearly said "could easily have been difficult". Not "would 100% without any doubt have been financially devastating".
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This is an exquisite, absolutely divine act of trolling. Well done. Seriously. It's like someone went to the fat camp with a bullhorn and yelled "FREE PIZZA!"
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The thing I always find humorous is when people suggest that it was inconsiderate or foolish of the other four members of DT to not repsect Mike's wishes for a hiatus. The person making that argument never seems to understand that those four guys have families to feed and bills to pay like everyone else. A hiatus as long as MP may or may not have wanted could easily have been difficult for any of those guys to manage financially, by sitting around with their thumbs up their asses, waiting for MP to be ready again.
What I find humorous is the fact that you think you know that. You do not know their finances.
They ALL SAID in a documentary that they were extremely financially stable...
Know the facts
It also isn't the first time that anybody has suggested that a hiatus could be financially difficult for the other members. Have your boss suggest a two month hiatus for you and see how it works out.
Also, reading comprehension, please. I clearly said "could easily have been difficult". Not "would 100% without any doubt have been financially devastating".
I understand- I can read...
They make money 24/7...they're well-off, I'll tell you that much.
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Almost everyone who we would consider "financially stable," with the exception of the few super-rich, is financial stable only dependent on their ability to have a good source of income. Unless you have millions in the bank, which I can assure you guys like JLB and JMX don't, you're going to have to change your lifestyle a considerable amount if you basically quit your job for five years.
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Well as one of my first posts I learned most of the other DT fans hate debate
:eek
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:facepalm: :lol
My thoughts/actions exactly
While we are spouting facts...
Dream Theater did say they were one of the top 20 most financially stable bands in the last 37 years (somewhere between Aerosmith and KC & the Sunshine Band). It is mentioned in this interview (I can't find where though) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
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Well as one of my first posts I learned most of the other DT fans hate debate, and hate other opinions if they're different then others :rollin rookie mistake..haha.
You couldn't be more wrong about this.... there are many, many forum members who just love debate. You will be hard pressed to find two regular posters who share that same opinion about everything DT-related. One of the longest-lasting and most popular threads is the one titled "Your Controversial Opinions on DT". I don't know how you can inject your posts (including the quote above) with so much unsupported and presumptuous hyperbole, and then turn around and blame others for the response you have received thus far.
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WTF @ this thread
We love debate here at DTF. We also love class.
There is plenty of room here for all opinions. What matters is how you discuss them.
Show respect for your fellow members, even if you disagree with their POV.
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I am not a troll. I made all 24 posts last night.
:lol
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There is plenty of room here for all opinions. What matters is how you discuss them.
Show respect for your fellow members, even if you disagree with their POV.
You must be new here. It's not as bad as /g/, but c'mon.
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WTF @ this thread
We love debate here at DTF. We also love class.
There is plenty of room here for all opinions. What matters is how you discuss them.
Show respect for your fellow members, even if you disagree with their POV.
You know hef, I blame you. This guy came in here solely to pimp his radio show, and you told him to stick around and be an active member.
:evilmonkey:
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Oh, was that him?
:lol
Well, he listened!
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I see our DTF stenographer Chad looked through the notes.
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" He was a drummer from the past. " Just like you should be a singer of the past? Sorry, you're DT's singer, and I love what you do, but no, he was not a drummer from the past. He's the heart of Dream Theater, and he pretends he doesn't care but he truly does. He care's about that band more than each and every one of the band members, and these projects like TWD are just rebounds to fill the whole of his 25 year old daughter.
I disagree with this. At some point, yes, he WAS the heart of DT. But look at the circumstances, if MP cared so much about DT, more than EACH AND EVERY one of the band members, then he wouldn't have left. It's as simple as that. He's the one who said it was getting stale. He's the one who said it was time for a five year break. And he was right to leave, because if he stayed, he wouldn't have been happy. His heart wasn't in it. And if his heart wasn't in it, then how could he possibly be the "heart" of the band?
Yes, he did a lot for the band, and took on a ridiculous amount of responsibilities, but hey, if he was getting burnt out on that, he could've just left it there, and said, "Hey, guys, do you mind maybe picking up the slack in this and this department?" But no, he said flat out, they should stop. And when they said they didn't want to, he gave them an ultimatum. It's understandable that he'd be tired and exhausted and feel a bit stagnant in DT. It's normal. But the other guys, they were still excited and fired up, and they acknowledged DT as being their life, their bread and butter, and aside from their casual side projects, they didn't feel the need to go join other bands on tours and collaborate with 100 other people.
I just don't see how you can say that he cared more about it than they did. He was more protective of it, maybe, but that's not the same thing.
Sure, he started regretting it later, and asked to come back, but that just proves that he was taking DT for granted.
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As someone who loves MM's personality and technical ability, who loved the two shows that he (as in I) went to, who didn't become a fan until summer of 2008 (the cocky era), but is not a huge fan of ADToE or DTXII, it does seem to me that, personality-wise, MM fits in with the band better.
However, I wish that Portnoy was in the band. I liked his drumming, his songs, his ass and balls, his lack of a click track, his spontaneity, his connection with the fans, etc. Much as I want it to happen, I don't see him coming back unless MM makes a well-timed departure. Clearly that's not going to happen for at least a little while, as MM and the guys are quite comfortable ATM. Even if that wasn't the case now would not be the time for MP to rejoin, as it seems that he did something to hurt JLB and JP.
At the moment, everyone (barring us DT w/ MP fans) seems quite happy with the status quo.
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Me and LaBrie both know that Portnoy was the soul of the band, was the frontman, was the MAN! It's like he took away custody of his child. Dream Theater was Mike Portnoy's band
lol
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good god, again with the "custody of the child"... can we put a "content warning: marriage analogy" in every thread title that contains it so that I don't have to spit out my juice :lol
[/li][li]Mike Portnoy was wrong to jump to conclusions about James LaBrie's statements to the press. As a corollary, Mike Portnoy admitted his mistake and apologized appropriately.[/li][/list]
No he didn't. He apologized for believing the out of context headline (from a website he always says never to believe) which is akin to a non-apology.
To be honest, a lot of people don't know how to apologize and believe that non-apologies are good enough.
And I always wondered how the fuck do we know who responded to his email and who didn't? Like, maybe JP didn't respond. Or maybe MM didn't respond because MP doesn't have his most recent email. Or whatever.
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Well, that's why I only established what we pretty much know to be true. James has been pretty forthcoming, as I recall, that he has not been in touch with MP. Meanwhile, fairly recently Jordan and Mike both posted to social media pictures of the two of them together as friends. So I'm almost certain that James didn't and Jordan did. As to the other two, I agree with the general consensus that it's most likely JP and MM, but we don't really have any information pointing to that aside from MM and MP were good friends and JMX had a diminished role in the band that increased after MP left, which is all just circumstantial.
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The troll is strong with this thread :rollin
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I don't think there's any trolling here.
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Well, that's why I only established what we pretty much know to be true. James has been pretty forthcoming, as I recall, that he has not been in touch with MP. Meanwhile, fairly recently Jordan and Mike both posted to social media pictures of the two of them together as friends. So I'm almost certain that James didn't and Jordan did.
Yeah, but sometimes the logical answer isn't the right one. Maybe James thought some of what MP said were jokes that didn't go over too well - back when MP was saying that they should have hired another vocalist, they were communicating through more than just interviews, and James totes knows more about the context of that statement. Maybe he thought that the other actions (Facebook comments, the deleting of SI discussions) were just done in the heat of rage over being out from the band? Maybe he hasn't even heard of any of these things?
Maybe JMX doesn't consider his diminished role in the band to be something effected by MP and something to be distant about, but just a natural ebb-and-flow?
Maybe two of them are just that terrible at email? Believe me, it's possible to be terrible at email even if your career depends on networking :lol and I think they're big enough that it doesn't.
All I'm saying is that there are so many possible narratives, and the DTF party line is simplified to just one or two, about everything.
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Well, that's why I only established what we pretty much know to be true. James has been pretty forthcoming, as I recall, that he has not been in touch with MP. Meanwhile, fairly recently Jordan and Mike both posted to social media pictures of the two of them together as friends. So I'm almost certain that James didn't and Jordan did.
Yeah, but sometimes the logical answer isn't the right one. Maybe James thought some of what MP said were jokes that didn't go over too well - back when MP was saying that they should have hired another vocalist, they were communicating through more than just interviews, and James totes knows more about the context of that statement. Maybe he thought that the other actions (Facebook comments, the deleting of SI discussions) were just done in the heat of rage over being out from the band? Maybe he hasn't even heard of any of these things?
Maybe JMX doesn't consider his diminished role in the band to be something effected by MP and something to be distant about, but just a natural ebb-and-flow?
Maybe two of them are just that terrible at email? Believe me, it's possible to be terrible at email even if your career depends on networking :lol and I think they're big enough that it doesn't.
All I'm saying is that there are so many possible narratives, and the DTF party line is simplified to just one or two, about everything.
I'm with you. I'm definitely with you on that. Which is why I'm just establishing the two we can confidently say we know. James said in an interview during the ADTOE tour that he was not in touch with Mike Portnoy anymore at that time. Meanwhile, Jordan has taken friendly pictures with Mike recently—it seems logical to think that they remained friends after the split and that Jordan responded to his email.
But yes, I agree with you that there are certainly other possibilities, such as John Myung not holding the grudge that people here have decided he holds and John Petrucci or Mike Mangini forgetting to email or not knowing how to or not wanting to, etc.
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I'm surprised this thread hasn't been locked by now.
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I think that discussion's just starting to get good. :corn
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I don't think there's any trolling here.
Except maybe the people yelling "TROLL!" and mocking the guy who started the thread. :biggrin:
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Maybe JM didn't want to waste MP's time and inbox space by sending an email that only says "..." :neverusethis:
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I mean he reneged on the break idea when the band carried on without him. That post was specifically countering one before.
I don't think he even knew the band had moved on as they had without him when he tried to rejoin.
That's what I'm thinking too. They will have kept their drummer search away from MP as much as from everybody else. From MP's perspective he might have thought that he had let them steam for a while, and now they would badly want him back.
"I figured it was still possible to try and save us, because they hadn't made any announcements yet or begun any public activity with another drummer… but sadly, they declined my offer (well, actually their lawyer did… they didn't even tell me themselves….)"
https://www.blabbermouth.net/news/mike-portnoy-i-tried-to-rejoin-dream-theater-but-was-rebuffed/#ZQBi0Tt8ZITaJJOZ.99
Kind of implies he knew what they were doing.
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It kind of doesn't. He didn't know they'd already moved on with a different drummer, but knew that it would happen (since you know, he'd left and all). So his reason for changing his mind wasn't because the band had moved on, and it wasn't a bluff. He knew he'd left for real, and knew they'd move on, but didn't know where they were with that process.
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Right whatever.
You're 100% right. I bow to your superior knowledge and don't believe for a moment that you have to be right out of principle.
I don't even believe that I'm totally right. Just a POV that I contributed to a pretty limp discussion.
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I was only replying to your post. Shucks, man! :( No hard feelings.
I was just trying to bring some more balance to what is usually a fairly one-sided discussion on DTF.
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Wow, I just read through this entire thread.... This is certainly an interesting one, haha.
Too many things to try to respond to, but my take is simply this: MM is happy to be in DT and DT seems extremely happy to have MM. I have seen no signs of bad blood between MM and MP at all. MP claims to be happy with all his tons of projects, whether he tried to get back in DT or not. And that's pretty much that, nothing more to it.
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BTW, this thread title is awful. MM and MP aren't, and never have been, fighting.
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BTW, this thread title is awful. MM and MP aren't, and never have been, fighting.
Right, and that is why I said the OP was trolling, especially since he even admitted that he likes to stir up controversy, and deliberately misrepresenting facts to get a rise out of people is pretty much the internet textbook definition of trolling. :lol :lol
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I'm shocked it's remained open this long.
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I'm shocked it's remained open this long.
We'll see how much longer it stays open.
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BTW, this thread title is awful. MM and MP aren't, and never have been, fighting.
Yes, it is. But I sense the OP is not a native English speaker which could account for it.
And the allegations of trolling are hilarious.
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What the fuck is this?
MIKE PORTNOY LEFT DREAM THEATRE????
PORQUE!!!!!!!!???!?!?!?
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What the fuck is this?
MIKE PORTNOY LEFT DREAM THEATRE????
PORQUE!!!!!!!!???!?!?!?
Yeah, it happened a couple of years ago. They didn't want to go to Indonesia, so he left.
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BTW, this thread title is awful. MM and MP aren't, and never have been, fighting.
The Fight That Stumped Them All.
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I have always taken these "we're friends" statements by musicians with a big grain of salt. MP and Neal are clearly actual friends. But MP and MM, they will probably have met at the occasional drumming event. I have no doubt they were on very positive terms with each other, but it strikes me more like the kind of "friendship" you have with a coworker whose work you respect.
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What the fuck is this?
MIKE PORTNOY LEFT DREAM THEATRE????
PORQUE!!!!!!!!???!?!?!?
Yeah, it happened a couple of years ago. They didn't want to go to Indonesia, so he left.
Just think of the money they'd make if they like took up residency in Indonesia for a few months.
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I have always taken these "we're friends" statements by musicians with a big grain of salt. MP and Neal are clearly actual friends. But MP and MM, they will probably have met at the occasional drumming event. I have no doubt they were on very positive terms with each other, but it strikes me more like the kind of "friendship" you have with a coworker whose work you respect.
Eh, it's obvious they aren't scheduling sessions of daisy picking and skipping through the meadows, I suppose everyone does go by your definition of things.
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My post was made against the background of the OP which makes it sound as if two twin brothers ended up on opposite sides of a battle. In reality I think they were just two professional drummers who respected each other, and now one of them is banging the ex of the other.
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My post was made against the background of the OP which makes it sound as if two twin brothers ended up on opposite sides of a battle. In reality I think they were just two professional drummers who respected each other, and now one of them is banging the ex of the other.
100% correct and the end of this post is perfection.
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I have always taken these "we're friends" statements by musicians with a big grain of salt. MP and Neal are clearly actual friends. But MP and MM, they will probably have met at the occasional drumming event. I have no doubt they were on very positive terms with each other, but it strikes me more like the kind of "friendship" you have with a coworker whose work you respect.
Eh, it's obvious they aren't scheduling sessions of daisy picking and skipping through the meadows
Do people actually do that? I mean, I'm not judging. If you or people you know do that, its cool.
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Do you really thing that they cross paths much? I bet now so you can see where Rumbo is coming from.
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I have always taken these "we're friends" statements by musicians with a big grain of salt. MP and Neal are clearly actual friends. But MP and MM, they will probably have met at the occasional drumming event. I have no doubt they were on very positive terms with each other, but it strikes me more like the kind of "friendship" you have with a coworker whose work you respect.
Eh, it's obvious they aren't scheduling sessions of daisy picking and skipping through the meadows
Do people actually do that? I mean, I'm not judging. If you or people you know do that, its cool.
I was going for the most exaggerated thing :lol but yeah now that you've mentioned it I'd like to go make some flower crowns.
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My post was made against the background of the OP which makes it sound as if two twin brothers ended up on opposite sides of a battle. In reality I think they were just two professional drummers who respected each other, and now one of them is banging the ex of the other.
Yup, let's face it.
I'm sure MM respects MP, but not so much that he'd retract his application to be the DT drummer because his respected peer wants back in.
Likewise, MP respects MM I'm sure, but wouldn't think twice if he had the chance to take his old job back.
And finally, DT are going to do what they feel is best for them. For example, if a few years from now interest is waning, I'm sure the band will consider a reunion with MP. As long as things continue to go well with MM, they won't.
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The only instances I know of them crossing paths are in 2002 (I think that was the year) when MP invited MM to sit on the other side of the Siamese monster in his drum solo and in 2009 in a Tama promo where he's talking about the double setup and casually mentions MM as one of the people he's played with on his set (even though it was a fairly different kit, at least in terms of material and the right side).
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I have always taken these "we're friends" statements by musicians with a big grain of salt. MP and Neal are clearly actual friends. But MP and MM, they will probably have met at the occasional drumming event. I have no doubt they were on very positive terms with each other, but it strikes me more like the kind of "friendship" you have with a coworker whose work you respect.
Eh, it's obvious they aren't scheduling sessions of daisy picking and skipping through the meadows
Do people actually do that? I mean, I'm not judging. If you or people you know do that, its cool.
I was going for the most exaggerated thing :lol but yeah now that you've mentioned it I'd like to go make some flower crowns.
I prefer flower pressing.
After some thought, I wouldn't be opposed to skipping through the meadows. My allergies are pretty bad though and I'm out of shape so I would have to walk the majority of the time.
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The only instances I know of them crossing paths are in 2002 (I think that was the year) when MP invited MM to sit on the other side of the Siamese monster in his drum solo and in 2009 in a Tama promo where he's talking about the double setup and casually mentions MM as one of the people he's played with on his set (even though it was a fairly different kit, at least in terms of material and the right side).
Actually, MP has mentioned MM as one of the drummers he respects several more times - I think one of those mentions is still in his FAQ on his site.
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The only instances I know of them crossing paths are in 2002 (I think that was the year) when MP invited MM to sit on the other side of the Siamese monster in his drum solo and in 2009 in a Tama promo where he's talking about the double setup and casually mentions MM as one of the people he's played with on his set (even though it was a fairly different kit, at least in terms of material and the right side).
I was at that show.
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I have the bootleg of that show - "When Mike And Mike Unite"
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I have the bootleg of that show - "When Mike And Mike Unite"
:rollin
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The fight that never started.
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I have the bootleg of that show - "When Mike And Mike Unite"
:rollin
That's not a joke, it's the title.
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Yeah I have it too. Too bad it's trapped on the HDD I can't access at the moment.
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Oh and about the thread- PERFECT discussion, and yea, how come it's okay to completely disrespect someone else's points only if their in the minority view? I guess rules really only do apply if the mods disagree with your view.. "No bashing" -my ass; "no disagreeing with Bosk and the majority of DTF" is where it's at. Here I am supporting a person's tactics who I thoroughly disagree with substantively, again.
Not sure how this got missed earlier. But you are dead wrong in your assessment. Plenty of people here disagree with my opinions, bosk1's opinions, and the rest of the mods. But by all means, if you don't like how things are done here, then pretty please, with a cherry on top, get the fuck out. Maybe it's not the place for you.
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This is obviously not true, as bosk threatened to strike me with his banhammer when I put Space Dye Vest at the top of my top 50 list. You don't want to know what gross things I had to do to get out of trouble, and I never transgressed again. Quit spreading lies, hef.
Dennis, there are reasons why some minority opinions are just minority opinions. While I do agree DTF can be harsh to people who have some unpopular opinions, not being able to phrase them respectfully over and over again is a big part of why it seems to be that way. And similarly, there are just some things that have been debated to death already, with unpleasant results, and this sort of OP really gets a rise out of people because we're either jaded of this discussion or we can't believe that after everything that happened someone still has that sort of a viewpoint.
I'm just saying there's a certain time and place, and a certain way to bring this sort of discussion into light again, and the OP didn't do that. While some people can't fit into DTF, this is by far the most welcoming and diverse and respectful internet community I've ever been a part of. Mods themselves have all sorts of different viewpoints, and I never felt disrespected around here.
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"Not sure how this got missed earlier. But you are dead wrong in your assessment. Plenty of people here disagree with my opinions, bosk1's opinions, and the rest of the mods. But by all means, if you don't like how things are done here, then pretty please, with a cherry on top, get the fuck out. Maybe it's not the place for you."
Hef... handling the situation with the blunted edge of the cat o' nine tails as always. Soft as Angel Soft...
My opinion of the situation?.... it doesn't matter what my opinion is. DT knows what really happened; MP knows what really happened... all of our opinions (whether good or bad regarding either party) are simply fun (in some instances) speculations. There's nothing wrong with speculating; as long as the speculator remembers that he/she is speculating.
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Oh and about the thread- PERFECT discussion, and yea, how come it's okay to completely disrespect someone else's points only if their in the minority view? I guess rules really only do apply if the mods disagree with your view.. "No bashing" -my ass; "no disagreeing with Bosk and the majority of DTF" is where it's at. Here I am supporting a person's tactics who I thoroughly disagree with substantively, again.
Not sure how this got missed earlier. But you are dead wrong in your assessment. Plenty of people here disagree with my opinions, bosk1's opinions, and the rest of the mods. But by all means, if you don't like how things are done here, then pretty please, with a cherry on top, get the fuck out. Maybe it's not the place for you.
Welcome to DTF, may I take your order please?
Yeah, I'll take one troll thread, hold the self-awareness, with an extra large order of smackdown.
Would you like a Vlasto shake with that?
NO.
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This thread delivers....
Heartburn (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/55966936/pics/smilies/puke.gif)
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noahlol
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While I do agree DTF can be harsh to people who have some unpopular opinions, not being able to phrase them respectfully over and over again is a big part of why it seems to be that way.
I would say it's mostly that, in fact. A lot of my opinions on DT go against the majority, and I'm sure you're the same Milena, but we're able to express them in respectful ways. Frankly, I would say DTF comes down much harder on people who act like jerks even when their opinion is the majority one.
NOW EVERYONE JUST SHUT UP AND LET'S MAKE DAISY CHAINS :heart
EDIT: Oh yeah and I changed the terrible misleading thread title.
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Oh my god people. Just read Lifting Shadows. There is so much more in that book abuot this case than what we've been told.
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My take :
MM acts like he deserves his place in DT and is loving every minute of it & is nothing but grateful.
MP towards the end seemed like he thought he was the band.
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While I do agree DTF can be harsh to people who have some unpopular opinions, not being able to phrase them respectfully over and over again is a big part of why it seems to be that way.
I would say it's mostly that, in fact. A lot of my opinions on DT go against the majority, and I'm sure you're the same Milena, but we're able to express them in respectful ways. Frankly, I would say DTF comes down much harder on people who act like jerks even when their opinion is the majority one.
NOW EVERYONE JUST SHUT UP AND LET'S MAKE DAISY CHAINS :heart
EDIT: Oh yeah and I changed the terrible misleading thread title.
Rich, that thread title was full of win. It needed to be highlighted.
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Oh and about the thread- PERFECT discussion, and yea, how come it's okay to completely disrespect someone else's points only if their in the minority view? I guess rules really only do apply if the mods disagree with your view.. "No bashing" -my ass; "no disagreeing with Bosk and the majority of DTF" is where it's at. Here I am supporting a person's tactics who I thoroughly disagree with substantively, again.
Not sure how this got missed earlier. But you are dead wrong in your assessment. Plenty of people here disagree with my opinions, bosk1's opinions, and the rest of the mods. But by all means, if you don't like how things are done here, then pretty please, with a cherry on top, get the fuck out. Maybe it's not the place for you.
:rollin :metal :hefdaddy
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This thread delivers....
Heartburn (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/55966936/pics/smilies/puke.gif)
Tum ta tum tum tummmms! :metal
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Mike Mangini seems like the kindest humblest man going. Seriously.
He works his ass off to be great. Great enough to be considered to replace a guy like Mike Portnoy, and the competition he faced as well.
He auditioned for a legendary prog metal band. He was so ecstatic about being hired he was over the top emotionally.
This guy is great and I'm so glad he is in the band. I don't think he spends one waking minute of any day of any week thinking about Mike Portnoy, good, bad, or otherwise.
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Yea, well sorry guys, I'm not going anywhere so you're stuck with me, I freakin' love this forum :P haha
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Four things:
1. The thread title is still a hot mess, and I will fix it momentarily.
2. Yes, this thread exhibits some great trolling. Some good points, but expressed in a way that is obviously designed solely to stir up controversy and not for the purpose of having intelligent discussion. The thread came within an inch of being locked. Then this happened:Hooooly shit, Hellholming!!
Best thread role reversal in the history of the Internet.
3. This is perhaps the best thing I have read in a long, long time:I have always taken these "we're friends" statements by musicians with a big grain of salt. MP and Neal are clearly actual friends. But MP and MM, they will probably have met at the occasional drumming event. I have no doubt they were on very positive terms with each other, but it strikes me more like the kind of "friendship" you have with a coworker whose work you respect.
Eh, it's obvious they aren't scheduling sessions of daisy picking and skipping through the meadows
Do people actually do that? I mean, I'm not judging. If you or people you know do that, its cool.
4. What hef said:Oh and about the thread- PERFECT discussion, and yea, how come it's okay to completely disrespect someone else's points only if their in the minority view? I guess rules really only do apply if the mods disagree with your view.. "No bashing" -my ass; "no disagreeing with Bosk and the majority of DTF" is where it's at. Here I am supporting a person's tactics who I thoroughly disagree with substantively, again.
Not sure how this got missed earlier. But you are dead wrong in your assessment. Plenty of people here disagree with my opinions, bosk1's opinions, and the rest of the mods. But by all means, if you don't like how things are done here, then pretty please, with a cherry on top, get the fuck out. Maybe it's not the place for you.
You've been warned in other threads. Consider this an official warning. Knock it off, or you will find that you are quite mistaken about us being "stuck" with you.
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The new thread title: :clap: :hefdaddy
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I meant stuck with me as in a reply to "if you don't like how things are done here, then pretty please, with a cherry on top, get the fuck out."
As in, if you're asking nicely, no I won't leave you all alone because I like it here whether everyone hates me or not :lol
No, really though I'll be good, that was the last time you'll hear from me in this way :biggrin: :angel:
and-
The new thread title: :clap: :hefdaddy
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Of course they used drum sticks to pick the daisies.
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Kevin Moore
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The new thread title: :clap: :hefdaddy
:djhef:
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1. The thread title is still a hot mess, and I will fix it momentarily.
:heart
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I think that, while the original thread title was complete shit, changing it so that the thread is not taken the least bit serious is only supporting the anti-DTF points made by some members of this thread.
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Two posts into this thread it already was a parody thread. The title now reflects that.
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I think that, while the original thread title was complete shit, changing it so that the thread is not taken the least bit serious is only supporting the anti-DTF points made by some members of this thread.
Only if you have no sense of humor. Besides, the current title is more truthful than the original.
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This anti DTF is always the fringe minority in life. They always make the biggest noise. So when we do see bat shit crazy posts it's fair game. We first try to point out the facts that 90% know the true timeline on the events yet others seem to want to make things up out of thin air like the OP in this thread.
when they fight the facts we pounce, not because it's the opposite of what we know, it's the antic that go with their though process. Bat shit crazy deserve a Hef GTFO and bitchslap.
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(https://fotos.fotoflexer.com/56af256d86c947583e9716284fa3383d.jpg)
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:heart
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:lol
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That just made my day
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The hills are alive with the sound of Mangini.
(https://i.imgur.com/XeD2G36.jpg)
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The hills are alive with the sound of Mangini.
(https://i.imgur.com/XeD2G36.jpg)
:metal :lol
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Zydar :metal
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The hills are alive with the sound of Mangini.
(https://i.imgur.com/XeD2G36.jpg)
:lol :metal
The hills are alive with the sound of paradiddles........
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The hills are alive with the sound of Mangini.
(https://i.imgur.com/XeD2G36.jpg)
This is one of my favourite things.
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Well this thread has gone psychosane.
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This is now worth all of the pain and heartache.
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I saw yestarday again, it's quite youtube phenomenon on DT videos. Someone writes "Mike is better than Mike", releases the bomb and then all you need to watch the following discussion. :lol
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Mike is the best drummer DT have ever had :neverusethis:
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Mike is the best drummer DT have ever had :neverusethis:
Mangini just has no soul or feel
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Mike is the best drummer DT have ever had :neverusethis:
Mangini just has no soul or feel
Mike could never play what Mike plays :neverusethis:
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Mike is the best drummer DT have ever had :neverusethis:
Mangini just has no soul or feel
Mike could never play what Mike plays :neverusethis:
:rollin
That's how those YT arguments usually go.
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Mike is the best drummer DT have ever had :neverusethis:
Mangini just has no soul or feel
Mike could never play what Mike plays :neverusethis:
:rollin
That's how those YT arguments usually go.
mangi is fastr u ritard faget
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Mike is the best drummer DT have ever had :neverusethis:
Mangini just has no soul or feel
Mike could never play what Mike plays :neverusethis:
:rollin
That's how those YT arguments usually go.
mangi is fastr u ritard faget
"Mike is so sad,!!! Cause he stop her studying for concentrating this band.. Bad he spending almost"
That's an actual comment I found. I didn't make it up.
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:justjen
:huh:
:emo:
:sadpanda:
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The hills are alive with the sound of Mangini.
(https://i.imgur.com/XeD2G36.jpg)
🎵Toooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooone!🎵
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Tone, a note, a ph'nom'nal note
Prog, a drop of golden sun
Me, the drums I play myself
Bear, a long long way to run
Sound, the ninja's making none
La, a Brie to sing the song
Wiz, the notes come fast and strong
That will bring us back to Tooooooooooooooone
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La, a Brie to sing the song
:lol :lol :lol :lol
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Tone, a note, a ph'nom'nal note
Prog, a drop of golden sun
Me, the drums I play myself
Bear, a long long way to run
Sound, the ninja's making none
La, a Brie to sing the song
Wiz, the notes come fast and strong
That will bring us back to Tooooooooooooooone
Dude, you're killing me :rollin
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Finally, something to use as my signature...despite having to format it strangely
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Tone, a note, a ph'nom'nal note
Prog, a drop of golden sun
Me, the drums I play myself
Bear, a long long way to run
Sound, the ninja's making none
La, a Brie to sing the song
Wiz, the notes come fast and strong
That will bring us back to Tooooooooooooooone
:hefdaddy
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from instalock potential to thread of the year potential
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(https://fotos.fotoflexer.com/3a981c6f12b32a91ec81d2299bc5b9dc.jpg)
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:lol :lol :lol
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Now we need Sound of Mangini merged with that pic.
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The hills are alive with the sound of Mangini.
(https://i.imgur.com/XeD2G36.jpg)
This is one of my favourite things.
Extraneous vowels are another. :angel:
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Tone, a note, a ph'nom'nal note
Prog, a drop of golden sun
Me, the drums I play myself
Bear, a long long way to run
Sound, the ninja's making none
La, a Brie to sing the song
Wiz, the notes come fast and strong
That will bring us back to Tooooooooooooooone
POTY without a doubt.
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The hills are alive with the sound of Mangini.
(https://i.imgur.com/XeD2G36.jpg)
This is one of my favourite things.
Extraneous vowels are another. :angel:
No, I do believe I spelled everything in my post correctly.
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You spell like shite
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You spell like shite
Don't be an arse! ;D :P
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So what where JM and JP just side men to mike Portnoy. There is no doubt that MP gave 110% to the band but it was started by 3 People so this Dream Theater is MP baby is bull. If it wasn't for JP and JM there would have been no DT.
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So what where JM and JP just side men to mike Portnoy.
I don't know who know but could be maybe other too?
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I don't have access to GIMP right now, so I'll just leave this here... (https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BsXtmFqCAAAZsHq.jpg)
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You spell like shite
Don't be an arse! ;D :P
Stfu you bloody wankers ! :neverusethis:
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So what where JM and JP just side men to mike Portnoy.
I don't know who know but could be maybe other too?
Do you like JM & JP?
I do not like them, Mike-I-am.
I do not like JM & JP!
Would you like their music here or there?
I would not like their music here or there.
I would not like them anywhere.
I do so like TA & WD!
Thank you! Thank you,
Mike-I-am.
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I don't have access to GIMP right now, so I'll just leave this here... (https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BsXtmFqCAAAZsHq.jpg)
Fixed the link. Goofballs, work your magic!
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He has a right to use whatever towels he wants to use!!!!!!
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I don't want to spoil the fun, but I can't keep myself from saying something about the original subject of this thread.
We don't know all about their motives, you don't know all what's happened in the past, not everything is written down. And I think you're actually a bit of a stalker finding as much as possible about this 'drama'. I suggest you go and watch soaps, if you like such. What's happened, happened and all we can do is accept it. Stop interfering, because it's useless for us and them. Let them live their lives and dramas while we live ours and enjoy their music (or not).
(https://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/236x/4e/8d/fb/4e8dfb939a007953f255592cbf120609.jpg)
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Hi guys, this is my first post here.
I found my way here to this thread because I've got the same opinion as the OP, and googled led me here :)
Even though MM is technically better than MP, in my opinion he does not bring in the same groove and feeling that MP did and also I miss the songwriting abilities of MP.
When I heard the self-titled, i was like what is that? :omg: That's not DT... at least not to me. Listening to the self-titled now gives me a better understanding of what MP must have done behind the scenes. I can imagine it was sometimes hell working with him, but that musical conflict between JP & MP somehow, at least for me, made DT so great. And now that part is missing... :'(
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I only read the first and the last post of this thread and I just wanna say that:
Dream Theater sounds better with Mike Mangini.
Dream Theater has not hinted they would want Portnoy back and the general vibe I get is that Petrucci doesn't want it to happen.
Whether or not you liked the self-titled 1) is not related to Portnoy/Mangini. 2) it's still better than the last 3 albums Portnoy made with Dream Theater and so is ADToE.
What I did up there is that I stated my opinions in fact statement phrasing, it's annoying and aggravating, hinty da hinty hint.
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Black Clouds kicks DTXII where its balls should be.
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Hi guys, this is my first post here.
I found my way here to this thread because I've got the same opinion as the OP, and googled led me here :)
Even though MM is technically better than MP, in my opinion he does not bring in the same groove and feeling that MP did and also I miss the songwriting abilities of MP.
When I heard the self-titled, i was like what is that? :omg: That's not DT... at least not to me. Listening to the self-titled now gives me a better understanding of what MP must have done behind the scenes. I can imagine it was sometimes hell working with him, but that musical conflict between JP & MP somehow, at least for me, made DT so great. And now that part is missing... :'(
I really don't get this. I mean, I can totally understand people not liking DT12, two of my best friends don't like it, but to say it's not DT? I don't understand, sincerely! Explain, because I'm very interested.
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(https://i.imgur.com/k4ctiDk.png)
It's nice to see the 2 Mikes together getting along :)
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:lol Actually had to look twice before realizing the obvious.
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I know there are plenty of pics of MM on the web but that one is so great for shoopin' :lol
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Black Clouds kicks DTXII where its balls should be.
I could not disagree more.
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(https://fotos.fotoflexer.com/c655553404cf3032971919ef92259884.jpg)
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Wait, wait, wait, wait, hold on. Jesus is awesome, but he's damn sure no Billy Sheehan.
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Black Clouds kicks DTXII where its balls should be.
I could not disagree more.
I think he meant to say the fleshy patch where DT's balls use to be. :neverusethis:
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Wait, wait, wait, wait, hold on. Jesus is awesome, but he's damn sure no Billy Sheehan.
Actually, and I'm being dead serious here, I thought Mike already looked a little like the popular depiction of Jesus in that photo, without being retouched (see The Last Supper for example).
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What the fuck.
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(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/55966936/pics/_new/shoop1.jpg)
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:lol
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(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/55966936/pics/_new/shoop1.jpg)
Holy shit