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General => General Discussion => Topic started by: Ħ on November 27, 2013, 12:03:35 AM
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I absolutely feel like this needs to be said. Here's three things you should never say to a person in grief.
1. "I know how you feel. [insert what happened to me here]."
It's not about you. And even if your situation is the same, even if you lost the same exact thing as the person you're consoling, the grief is different. Everyone grieves differently. So don't compare losses.
2. "Stay strong."
People need time to heal, for goodness sake. It's not helpful in the slightest to tell someone to "pull it together" when they need time to grieve.
3. "Let me know if you want to talk"/"Let me know if you need anything."
People in shock don't know what they need. Offer your services instead.
That is all. :angel:
I'm no counseling guru, so if you have any objections, let's hear 'em.
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3. "Let me know if you want to talk"/"Let me know if you need anything."
People in shock don't know what they need. Offer your services instead.
Only problem is, I don't know what they need, either. :(
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3. "Let me know if you want to talk"/"Let me know if you need anything."
People in shock don't know what they need. Offer your services instead.
Only problem is, I don't know what they need, either. :(
Then maybe a "What do you need?" is in order, rather than a "Let me know..."
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Perhaps. I don't know. I'm certainly no expert. I've been in the position where I was trying to comfort people close to me who were going through grief, and I just felt helpless. Everything I could think of to say felt like the wrong thing to say. I'm not sure there's a right thing to say, y'know?
Of course, some things are less helpful than others, so I do totally understand where you're coming from. "Stay strong" is almost a slap in the face in some situations.
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"I'm sorry to hear that. I don't know how you feel, and I won't tell you to stay strong, but I offer you my services"
nailed it
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I don't think it's yours or anyone elses place to establish rules on how to comfort grieving people.
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Man, talk about nitpicking semantics.
Let's be perfectly honest, no one knows how anyone ever truly feels, in grieving or otherwise. And it's irrelevant - the comfort is in knowing that someone is empathizing with you, not whether or not they actually KNOW how you feel. Unless they go off the rails talking about their own experiences, I see nothing wrong with that.
Stay strong isn't about telling someone to buck up and get over it, it's a form of encouragement. Like a "you can do this man, I know you can".
3. "Let me know if you want to talk"/"Let me know if you need anything."
People in shock don't know what they need. Offer your services instead.
Only problem is, I don't know what they need, either. :(
Then maybe a "What do you need?" is in order, rather than a "Let me know..."
YOU JUST SAID THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY NEED
Seriously H, I love you, but you're trying to logically interpret cliched english phrases. That alone is an exercise in futility, let alone when they touch on things that are very serious. Grief is an incredibly complex emotion and human interaction is an incredibly complex system, trying to just lay things out in absolute terms is just silly.
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What's the point of this thread? People grieve differently and people approach the situation of grieving people differently too. Some people feel awkward in that sort of situation and aren't very comforting no matter what. Other people know exactly what to say.
I find your first point valid. But at the same time, if the situation is exactly the same, the grieving person might like to know that to understand how you coped with it.
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Personally, I'm very bad at comforting people, precisely because I don't know what they're feeling. All I know is that when someone close is feeling bad, the best thing I can do is either make them feel loved or make them a little happy in one way or another.
Then again, when I'm feeling down, the best thing I can do to help myself is talk to someone about it. That works for me - and I always hope it works for others as well. But like I said, I'm very bad at this.
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Me personally, I would want to be left alone. I'll talk to someone when I'm ready.
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Just tell people how you really feel. Someone in grief is likely not going to be comforted by anything you say. Grief tends to do that. Still better than not saying anything at all.
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Different people grieve differently. Trying to put them all in the same boat with "Do this, don't do that" lists is somewhat defeatist. Yes, it's true that some people might not appreciate the "I know how you feel" line, but most people don't mind - and most situations aren't THAT unique that no one can relate to it. If you really know the person, you already know how to play your cards and you're not resorting to clichés.
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Why do people on the internet feel the urge to legislate the actions of others with what they deem acceptable behavior?
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IMO, Dog and Sigz nailed it.
H... what would your advice on what people SHOULD do be?
I look at Super Dude's thread about losing a close friend this week, and while it is often difficult/impossible to find the "right" words to say, saying something is better than nothing. Isn't knowing that others care about you in your time of grief meaningful, regardless of what or how they say it?
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There isn't one single correct way of trying to provide comfort, people have different things to offer and grieving people have different needs.
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Overall, the reason people say things such as this is because they don't know WTF else to say. Those are always awkward chats that neither party really wants to have, and people are always overcautious about saying the wrong thing. It's understandable that they stick with with the tried and true expressions.
Personally, I never understood the tendency to want to call somebody as soon as you hear there was a bad situation. My mom would always call and say "so and so just croaked, you need to call whosis right away and offer your sympathies." Wrong. Don't call somebody the same day their father just bought it. If you're somebody whose sympathy they really need they'll call you (under the guise of making sure you know what happened). I try to wait until the next day, when they've had a night's sleep and have gotten past the shell-shock.
As for me, I always go with "let me know if there's anything I can do to help." Everybody I'm close to already knows that I'm the man in that regard, but it's still worth reminding people.
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I don't think we need to coddle the greiving by walking on eggshells around them. Having to acknowledge other people's perspectives is all part of the process of healing.
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3. "Let me know if you want to talk"/"Let me know if you need anything."
People in shock don't know what they need. Offer your services instead.
Only problem is, I don't know what they need, either. :(
Then maybe a "What do you need?" is in order, rather than a "Let me know..."
I would say that "let me know if you need anything" is basically the exact same goddamn thing as "what do you need?", except less demanding.
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I absolutely feel like this needs to be said. Here's three things you should never say to a person in grief.
1. "I know how you feel. [insert what happened to me here]."
It's not about you. And even if your situation is the same, even if you lost the same exact thing as the person you're consoling, the grief is different. Everyone grieves differently. So don't compare losses.
2. "Stay strong."
People need time to heal, for goodness sake. It's not helpful in the slightest to tell someone to "pull it together" when they need time to grieve.
3. "Let me know if you want to talk"/"Let me know if you need anything."
People in shock don't know what they need. Offer your services instead.
That is all. :angel:
I'm no counseling guru, so if you have any objections, let's hear 'em.
I'm curious what prompted you to write this at this time? (edited to say, pretty sure I know why at this point)
I think people who are grieving understand how awkward it is for those trying there best to comfort them. I think they have been in the same boat trying to search for the proper things to say.
I personally usually tell people in theses situations. "I know their are no words I can say to make you better at the moment but I love you and I am so sorry for your pain."
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This thread strikes me as being a needlessly frustrating exercise in expectations for others but in the interest of discussion:
While I might find the things other people say as cringe worthy or outside my subjective opinion of good taste I prefer to think in terms of intent. For example; should I lose someone close to me to a freak accident and post it here I would expect to hear everything from the statistics for everyone to experience such an incident to promises to pray for me. Now, while my personal philosophy would cause me to give more weight to the former I still choose to be emotionally comforted by the intent of the latter. Why? Because the person offering the prayer is providing what they see as the most profound of sympathy and support. If that's what they believe is the most helpful of support, why wouldn't I want them to be able to express it and accept it in the spirit given?
I would hope others I try to comfort will give me the same benefit of the doubt when I offer my clumsy attempts. It only seems fair to do the same.
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You can't put form, rules, and structure on such deeply emotional times. Just go with whatever the heart feels, and be present for others.
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IMO, Dog and Sigz nailed it.
Who is dog?
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my takeaway from H is that we need to speak from the heart rather than the mind when encountering people in grief
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my takeaway from H is that we need to speak from the heart rather than the mind when encountering people in grief
Fair enough. But it is worth reiterating what someone up there ^^ said earlier, that comforting a grieving person doesn't come naturally to all of us. Sometimes you don't know what to do or say, apart from just being there. I guess the point being that it can be just as hard to speak from the heart as it is easy to speak from the mind, and sometimes it may be best to just not speak at all and try to remain supportive until the griever is ready to talk.
IMO, Dog and Sigz nailed it.
Who is dog?
It's your avatar. Or me. And I did nail it, but that's beside the point :lol
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The most important thing when comforting someone is to convey to that person that you're there for them and want to help. How you convey it is not a big deal in my experience, just get there somehow.
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I absolutely feel like this needs to be said. Here's three things you should never say to a person in grief.
1. "I know how you feel. [insert what happened to me here]."
It's not about you. And even if your situation is the same, even if you lost the same exact thing as the person you're consoling, the grief is different. Everyone grieves differently. So don't compare losses.
2. "Stay strong."
People need time to heal, for goodness sake. It's not helpful in the slightest to tell someone to "pull it together" when they need time to grieve.
3. "Let me know if you want to talk"/"Let me know if you need anything."
People in shock don't know what they need. Offer your services instead.
That is all. :angel:
I'm no counseling guru, so if you have any objections, let's hear 'em.
As a person who seems to lose a close relative every year... Well... I don't mean to be rude and you seem like a nice guy, but it's kind of... I don't know how to put it.
1. Yes, it's a different experience each time and everyone grieves differently. But in the end, something or someone was lost and grief is felt. I understand that there isn't anything you can say to soothe the pain, but to be offended by someone sharing their experiences is downright selfish. It's not about comparing losses and seeing it as comparing losses will only make both parties feel worse about the whole situation. People have said similar things to me and despite losing a sister, aunt, 3 grandparents, an uncle (sadly, I could go on)... I never saw it as anything but a decent person simply saying that they've lost too, like we all do, and that I'm not and don't have to be alone. I've learned that one of the most destructive ways to react in this situation is seeing yourself as a "woe is me" victim. You aren't the one that passed and that person would definitely not want you to reject another's condolences. Obviously, this perspective is easier said that achieved, and if a person reacts this way than I know that it is of the moment, but to think this way in a general sense is selfish. There are so many other things that eat me up in these situations that to react in a way that diminishes another person's feelings is not only needless, but just hurtful. Really, what would you say to this person? "I'm sorry for your loss, I also lost _____ and it was pretty rough." "Well it was different for me so don't talk to me." Way to completely diminish the significance of that person's loss in his or her life. I get that anybody could be going through anything at anytime, but I would never reject what someone had to say out of the goodness of their heart in the hopes of enlightening perspective no matter what I'm going through.
2. So? Nobody says it in an antagonistic way. When my mother was breaking down while my sister's life faded, my Grandpa told her that she had to, "Stay strong for your children." I don't think any other sentence helped her get through that time more than that did, and it was a mindset that persisted even afterwards.
3. That is offering your services. I've done this and have been silent while the other person just let it all out. Just letting another person know that they have an outlet can be a relief, and even if it's only slight, it's worth it.
I'm sorry for what you could possibly be going through right now, but there are farrrrrrrr worse things to be complaining about and hurting others who are only trying to help is not healthy. Why, after losing someone, would you reject what someone else had to say when that person could also be gone tomorrow?
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I'm no counseling guru, so if you have any objections, let's hear 'em.
No objections here. I think every situation is different and has its own set of circumstances and people. The points you've made could very well be 100% valid in many situations...or....not.
By the way, you said three things, not one :P ;)
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IMO, Dog and Sigz nailed it.
Who is dog?
Doc. Damn typo. Got me a case of the 'shmeglands'. :jets:
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IMO, Dog and Sigz nailed it.
Who is dog?
Doc. Damn typo. Got me a case of the 'shmeglands'. :jets:
*Evil death stare*
:lol
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Looks like I made a sufficient number of people unnecessarily mad. :lol
Basically what yesh and others have said, all I'm saying advocating is being there and speaking from the heart. From my observations, those three catch-phrases I put in the OP are usually in bad taste (even if they are well-meaning). One person said that you shouldn't get offended if someone says these things to you - I mean, on paper I might agree, but you have to realize that grieving people are extremely sensitive and yes, you should "walk on eggshells" if you want to respect their sensitivities.
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Like I said, it's the walking on eggshells part that is exactly the reason why people stick with the old standbys.
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I just tell people fuck their weak little feelings and that they're a pitiful disgrace to the Saiyan race. Then I kill them. And if their friends and family are watching and any of them shed a single tear, I kill them too. Then I keep killing until there's just the emotionless badasses left.
Good job, Hayden.
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I absolutely feel like this needs to be said. Here's three things you should never say to a person in grief.
1. "I know how you feel. [insert what happened to me here]."
Agreed.
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I just tell people fuck their weak little feelings and that they're a pitiful disgrace to the Saiyan race. Then I kill them. And if their friends and family are watching and any of them shed a single tear, I kill them too. Then I keep killing until there's just the emotionless badasses left.
WTF? :jawdrop:
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Things like this just make people feel even more worried and anxious and nervous about what to say to a grieving person than they already do. This makes people avoid saying anything at all, and some people actually avoid the bereaved person because they are so uncomfortable with the potential intensity, isolating the grieving person and making them feel even more alone.It's terrifying for many, the worry of saying the wrong thing and making things worse, but you know what grieving people REALLY need? Just to know that you care.
I've been bereaved before, my mother died nearly three years ago. I volunteer for a suicide line, I have a counselling qualification and I've had bereavement counselling. I'm not trying to brag because I'm very much as much of a novice as anybody else in this area but that's where my opinion is coming from.
I do agree that people should never say 'I know how you feel' because you can NEVER know how somebody feels. As an example, my mother died... a friend might try and comfort me and say 'I know just how you feel, I felt that way when my mother died' but they can't know how I feel because they were different reasons for dying, different relationships between us and our parent, different life situations, everything's different. It can be a little offensive to some people for another person to say that they know how they feel, when they actually cannot know at all. The best thing to do is to try and empathetically find out what the person is feeling, calmly and without judgement, and give them space to express how they are coping and what is running through their mind. But of course, I know people usually say this because they want to comfort, they have the best of intentions.
I also agree with the 'stay strong' stuff. Man, that is frustrating. The worst thing anyone said with the best of intentions was 'pull yourself together, your mum wouldn't have wanted you to be like this because of her'... that made me feel that not only was I being pathetic, I was letting her down too. It places a lot of pressure on people to fake that they are okay when they're not, and they might feel as though they are letting the side down if they ever acknowledge how bad they feel.
When I lost my mother it took literally about six months before I started to properly, really grieve. And then it was a solid year of hell, total pain, crying so hard I couldn't breathe multiple times a week and total numbness and sorrow the rest of the time. The best thing my friends ever did for me was just to be there. I really appreciate the ones that didn't dodge it, that didn't avoid it for fear of upsetting me. Nobody who has lost someone close to them is going to have it far from their minds, so mentioning it isn't going to make anything worse... it shows you acknowledge their grief, and that you are aware things are difficult for them. Slapping somebody on the back and taking them out to 'take their mind off it' usually is counter-productive.
All I appreciated was those people who remembered throughout those horrible eighteen months that I was probably still suffering and that while time was passing, I wasn't necessarily feeling better. It got worse and worse for months before it began to improve. I valued people talking to me about her and asking me stuff about her life and what she was like, people who wanted to see a photo of her or know her name if they'd never met her, just a simple text saying 'hey you, how are you feeling today?' meant everything to me!
There are no easy answers and people almost always mean well. I liked people coming over to hang out so I wasn't alone but also people respecting when I said I needed to be alone. It's good for people to ask 'what can I do for you?' rather than the 'if there's anything I can do, let me know', for example my best friend's mum paid for the funeral food as we couldn't afford it, my best friend, she bought me a bottle of my mum's signature perfume randomly so I could smell it and be close to her, I was living with a partner at the time who took care of meals because I was never hungry and couldn't bring myself to eat for a bit.
Just be there, be present, show that you care and that you're not going anywhere while they go through their pain.
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Looks like I made a sufficient number of people unnecessarily mad. :lol
Basically what yesh and others have said, all I'm saying advocating is being there and speaking from the heart. From my observations, those three catch-phrases I put in the OP are usually in bad taste (even if they are well-meaning). One person said that you shouldn't get offended if someone says these things to you - I mean, on paper I might agree, but you have to realize that grieving people are extremely sensitive and yes, you should "walk on eggshells" if you want to respect their sensitivities.
So what do we do? Do we speak from the heart (and therefore say a bunch of stuff that the grieving person might not want to hear) or do we walk on eggshells (by saying cliche phrases that show our support without getting too specific or intense)? Do we offer help if the person needs it, or do we say "what do you need?", or do we not because apparently "people in shock don't know what they need"?
I'm beginning to suspect you're not a counseling guru, H.
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I can't believe you're seriously advocating walking on eggshells to respect sensitivities... these things seem blatantly obvious to me (although everybody sees things differently depending on what they experienced growing up, what they've learned socially, the culture in which they live etc.):
1. Trying to say 'the right thing' is impossible. Grieving people are sometimes not thinking straight or at their most emotionally stable and might be offended/get upset/get angry at something you could never even have predicted.
2. When/if this happens, you apologise sincerely for causing offence and note for the future.
3. Wanting to walk on eggshells is not only impossible because you can't predict reactions, it makes people less likely to actually acknowledge the grief because they are scared of saying the wrong thing.
4. Most people who have been bereaved just want and need to know that their friends and family care, they don't expect everybody to suddenly become a trained grief counsellor.
5. It's actually quite saddening for the bereaved person sometimes when they feel as though their friend is treating them differently. Something major has changed their life, permanently. It's horrible to feel as though your friendships are changing too and that people are treating you differently. And it's not hard to tell. Also possibly more insulting than anything you could actually say... 'does my best friend really think so little of me that I'd get angry at them for talking to me directly about this?'
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Maybe we are thinking of two different things when we're talking about "walking on eggshells". So let's just drop the cliche.
I just mean we ought to be extra-mindful of what we say to grieving persons. Not that we need to say nothing. Not that we need to avoid them. Just that we ought to realize that grief makes people extremely sensitive and possibly easily offended or put off. And that's OK, cause we'll be there for them. But we will be very cautious about how we express that.
Thanks n_c for sharing, btw.
Honestly, my reaction to the responses ITT is, well, holy crap. Why are people so upset? I just questioned the use of certain consoling methods and brought it to the floor. Not sure why people think I'm wrong on all counts, including my motives. No reason to get your panties in a bundle, people.
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Maybe we are thinking of two different things when we're talking about "walking on eggshells". So let's just drop the cliche.
I just mean we ought to be extra-mindful of what we say to grieving persons. Not that we need to say nothing. Not that we need to avoid them. Just that we ought to realize that grief makes people extremely sensitive and possibly easily offended or put off. And that's OK, cause we'll be there for them. But we will be very cautious about how we express that.
Thanks n_c for sharing, btw.
I don't think anybody tries to comfort a grieving person without realising the gravity of it... it sounds as though you think most people go round to their bereaved friend's house and say any old crap to them thinking 'ah well, what they think about it is irrelevant'; people say all of those things with the best of intentions and while I think it's positive to draw attention to the fact that 'I know how you feel' isn't as supportive as it may superficially seem, putting extra pressure on people in already delicate situations not to fk up is counter-productive, imo.
You're welcome!
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I mean, 1 and 2 are truly brilliant points and certainly something I advocate in a counselling context as well as when interacting with friends. Even 3 is great, it's easier to accept 'I'm cooking dinner, mind if I bring some over?' than ask for help. I just think placing all of this emphasis on people not messing up when they're probably already trying to do their best is a tad damaging.
When someone has died you love, you can feel people pulling away. Not so much in my case because I'm lucky enough to have super supportive, close, open friendships and my friends were utterly fking perfect in every way imaginable. But in the cases of many other people I've spoken to, they feel something of a social pariah. They might have lost their partner, so they're suddenly the odd one out in their coupled up friendship circle, the awkward one at a dinner party, the one who's unsure of who their +1 will be at an event, the person turning up alone to parent's evening. I've even heard of widowed women losing female friends who suddenly become wary of having a single woman in their group who may pose a threat to their marriage (yep, seriously).
People don't know what to say so they just say nothing, or avoid. They go for the 'let's distract them' route leaving the grieving person feeling as though they can't sit and talk about the person they lost for fear of bumming everybody else out. Quite often they're the ones having to put on a brave face for their kids, their remaining parent, or whoever. It's just good for them to know that you are the person they can go to to speak about how they're coping and how they're feeling.
I'd rather people make the effort to talk to the individual even if they risk saying something that doesn't go down well than be so scared of messing up that they say nothing at all. I know you're not openly actively suggesting people ignore their grieving friends, but frightening people away from interacting with them by pointing out the already very obvious would have that exact effect. Can you see that?
You had some great initial points but by diverting into the 'please, remember, respect sensitivities and walk on eggshells' thing was just... weird!
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I will agree that when I've been extremely upset hearing "I know how you feel" has made me quite cross. No one can ever know exactly how one feels in one specific moment because everyone interprets situations different and people's emotions are never quite the same, even if one has been in a similar situation.
However, as has been said, there is no definite right way to comfort a person in grief. Trying to define what combination of words will have greatest effect on a person who is emotionally grieving? That's a futile exercise. I find that people offering support and kindhearted gestures has the best effect with me, personally. Sometimes it is after the fact that I appreciate others' words and actions--sometimes during grief you don't want what people are offering.
Despite my (and others, apparently) disagreement with your actual sentiments I find your approach to this to be somewhat kind of a gesture, though-- you are trying to warn against saying the wrong thing to someone in grief, and that is something to be thought about for sure.
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Honestly, my reaction to the responses ITT is, well, holy crap. Why are people so upset? I just questioned the use of certain consoling methods and brought it to the floor. Not sure why people think I'm wrong on all counts, including my motives. No reason to get your panties in a bundle, people.
I'm no counseling guru, so if you have any objections, let's hear 'em.
You gotta accept that when you post stuff that is quite sensitive, plenty of people will have stuff to say. Especially when it has the potential to tap into difficult emotions and experiences. I'm sure everyone's panties are fine, I know mine are. :)
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@ n_c
I brought up the need for elevated social tact when dealing with grieving people, because people were saying things like:
I don't think we need to coddle the greiving by walking on eggshells around them. Having to acknowledge other people's perspectives is all part of the process of healing.
That's all.
@Heretic
Yeah, I'm not saying we should find the magic words that fit every situation. (There are none.) But, like you say, it's far easier to figure out what not to say, and knowing what not to say is still helpful.
And when you say you disagree with my "sentiments", what exactly are you talking about? It seems like you agree (for the most part) with the actual things I've said.
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Looking very briefly over this thread all I'll say for now is... nothing. Gotta leave for FW soon and don't want to get caught up in it now, but when I get a chance I'll try and throw some thoughts around.
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@ n_c
I brought up the need for elevated social tact when dealing with grieving people, because people were saying things like:
I don't think we need to coddle the greiving by walking on eggshells around them. Having to acknowledge other people's perspectives is all part of the process of healing.
That's all.
I'm not sure where that quote came from, but I didn't see it before just now. It strikes me as very insensitive. Being sensitive to someone who is in a turbulent emotional state and might have just had their life turned completely upside down just strikes me as being a decent human being to me... it's not really the time to be expecting them to acknowledge other perspectives, at least initially. Maybe I'm just viewing it in an extra-negative light because of the term 'coddle', which carries connotations of 'indulging' them or being over-protective.
My grandma told me a couple of days after I lost my mum that she wouldn't be attending the funeral because my mother was a selfish btch who couldn't even be bothered to attend her own father's funeral a year earlier, and it was all self-inflicted so she deserved no sympathy (she died as a result of alcoholism). Can't say that acknowledging her perspective on my mum was hugely helpful at that exact moment. I brushed it off however, I had bigger fish to fry (such as organising a funeral). Nice lady!
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I think the key thing is to be understanding. I mean, the bottom line is, no matter what you say, it's kind of impossible to predict how a grieving person is going to react. If you tell them to stay strong, maybe it'll just make them feel pathetic because they don't feel like they're capable of being strong right now; on the other hand, maybe it will be exactly what they needed to hear, as was apparently the case for emblempride's mother. And I think that's true of pretty much anything you might possibly say: it might make them feel better, it might make them feel worse. They might smile, they might cry, or they might not even hear you because they were so lost in thought. It's impossible to predict.
So while we can try to avoid upsetting them, I think the most important thing is to realize that they already are upset, and that they're probably going to continue to be upset, and that it's okay for them to be upset. However they're reacting, however they're behaving, whatever they're doing, it's all understandable given what they're going through. Once you understand that, it's just a matter of being there for them when you can and trying to play it by ear.
My two cents.
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I think the key thing is to be understanding. I mean, the bottom line is, no matter what you say, it's kind of impossible to predict how a grieving person is going to react. If you tell them to stay strong, maybe it'll just make them feel pathetic because they don't feel like they're capable of being strong right now; on the other hand, maybe it will be exactly what they needed to hear, as was apparently the case for emblempride's mother. And I think that's true of pretty much anything you might possibly say: it might make them feel better, it might make them feel worse. They might smile, they might cry, or they might not even hear you because they were so lost in thought. It's impossible to predict.
So while we can try to avoid upsetting them, I think the most important thing is to realize that they already are upset, and that they're probably going to continue to be upset, and that it's okay for them to be upset. However they're reacting, however they're behaving, whatever they're doing, it's all understandable given what they're going through. Once you understand that, it's just a matter of being there for them when you can and trying to play it by ear.
My two cents.
:'( I cried.
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I didn't mean to seem overemotional in my response and I'd just like to apologize if it came out that way. I wasn't miffed making the post or anything, but rereading it, I can see how that impression can be made. I just think that it's too personal an experience each time for someone to accurately predict how one will react when saying certain things. I agree with the sentiment that just being there, if nothing else, is what's most important.
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I seemingly deal with this issue everyday. As a cancer survivor I'm still involved in social networks with folks fighting. One of my closet comrades in this fight had a reccurence and actually had surgery again today. It's met'd to his bones, so it's not good. I told his fiance, another cancer survivor, that we're thinking of them both today, and then broke your 3rd rule. I ALWAYS ask if there's anyway I can help or if there's anything I can do for them. Almost everyday I'm giving condolences or prayers, vibes and good thoughts to someone.
I don't know if there's a BEST practice, but as long as like you and others mention, it comes from your heart and isn't hurtful it's good. Your original post is a little strong, and in my opinion incorrect. Not trying to beat ya down bro, just saying I disagree with you. One thing I know for sure... I'm dealing with this issue (grieving/condolences) way to fucking much.
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Empathy. Period. Listen to them. Imagine what they are going through, make yourself feel their pain (perhaps not literally but in your mind.) Once you understand their pain, comforting them is that much easier. Having a person to pour their emotions into is comforting in and of itself.
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I'm going through this right now and it's true, you really don't know what to say. There's not much to say, really. The best you can do is be there for the people in grief, and that's all you can do. My emotions have gone off the wall: Sometimes I prefer to be alone in my room listening to music, and other times, like this morning, I wanted to go to work with my mom because it gave me something to do. It's just a weird situation, not only for the people that it really affects, but the people trying to help that certain one. There's no clear answer or thing you need to do, and as many have said, everyone reacts differently to different situations. The best I can do right now is keep moving forward, because my best friend surely wouldn't want me to grieve over this. Carry on :)
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I'm going through this right now and it's true, you really don't know what to say. There's not much to say, really. The best you can do is be there for the people in grief, and that's all you can do. My emotions have gone off the wall: Sometimes I prefer to be alone in my room listening to music, and other times, like this morning, I wanted to go to work with my mom because it gave me something to do. It's just a weird situation, not only for the people that it really affects, but the people trying to help that certain one. There's no clear answer or thing you need to do, and as many have said, everyone reacts differently to different situations. The best I can do right now is keep moving forward, because my best friend surely wouldn't want me to grieve over this. Carry on :)
I love those three words.
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I'm going through this right now and it's true, you really don't know what to say. There's not much to say, really. The best you can do is be there for the people in grief, and that's all you can do. My emotions have gone off the wall: Sometimes I prefer to be alone in my room listening to music, and other times, like this morning, I wanted to go to work with my mom because it gave me something to do. It's just a weird situation, not only for the people that it really affects, but the people trying to help that certain one. There's no clear answer or thing you need to do, and as many have said, everyone reacts differently to different situations. The best I can do right now is keep moving forward, because my best friend surely wouldn't want me to grieve over this. Carry on :)
Nice to hear your input, flyingbizkit.
I think, subconsciously, your recent thread put the whole idea of this topic in my brain. I apologize if this thread was offensive to you; I made it too much on a whim.
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Well, I for one don't think there's any reason to apologize for this thread. You had something on your mind, and you wanted to put it out there, that's all. And it has led to some worthwhile discussion. :)
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I just tell people fuck their weak little feelings and that they're a pitiful disgrace to the Saiyan race. Then I kill them. And if their friends and family are watching and any of them shed a single tear, I kill them too. Then I keep killing until there's just the emotionless badasses left.
WTF? :jawdrop:
Oh, that's just TJ.
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I'm going through this right now and it's true, you really don't know what to say. There's not much to say, really. The best you can do is be there for the people in grief, and that's all you can do. My emotions have gone off the wall: Sometimes I prefer to be alone in my room listening to music, and other times, like this morning, I wanted to go to work with my mom because it gave me something to do. It's just a weird situation, not only for the people that it really affects, but the people trying to help that certain one. There's no clear answer or thing you need to do, and as many have said, everyone reacts differently to different situations. The best I can do right now is keep moving forward, because my best friend surely wouldn't want me to grieve over this. Carry on :)
Nice to hear your input, flyingbizkit.
I think, subconsciously, your recent thread put the whole idea of this topic in my brain. I apologize if this thread was offensive to you; I made it too much on a whim.
Oh no! It's totally cool and I enjoyed reading this thread. :)
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Sometimes a shared experience can (for me) lead to greater connection and greater empathy.
I know that when I lost my father, the lineup of people repeating the same cliched lines to comfort me got a bit tedious. However, when it came from someone who I knew had also recently lost a parent, and shared their experience...THAT was something I felt a connection with. Because when people are just coming up to you and saying "sorry", it can get a little old after the 100th or 1000th time. (although the volume can carry a different comfort when taken as a whole. You're reminded of just how many people cared enough to take the time to say *something*) But those who honestly HAVE been through what you've been through, they tend to stand out. (at least, they did for me anyway)
That's why sometimes I feel the need to share my experience...because people sharing their experiences was what helped me when I suffered a loss, and it really meant a lot to me. It became the grieving voice of an actual person with an individual experience all their own instead of a "form letter" condolence. But again, everyone grieves differently.