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Dream Theater => Dream Theater => Topic started by: Elite on July 16, 2013, 06:27:40 AM
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I originally did my top 50 Dream Theater songs around a year ago and although I barely listen to them anymore, I have listened to Dream Theater a lot in the past (else I wouldn't be on these forums I guess) and therefore I think I can adequately say which Dream Theater songs I dislike, for various reasons. So I signed up for a v2, with the intention of releasing a list of my least favourite Dream Theater songs, arranged in the order of likeliness that I would listen to them.
Of course, bashing music is ridiculously easy, so I'm trying my best to EXPLAIN why I don't like the song, or why I'm not likely to listen to it separately. This means; no simple write-ups saying 'this song is shit, because DT has done so much better', but accurate descriptions of my feelings towards the song. I'm also not really comparing these songs to the rest of Dream Theater's material, but as separate SONGS, in their own intrinsic quality. This also means I'll only be using songs that were released on an official release. No demos or other songs, like I did in the original top 50.
Yes, this does mean there's probably going to be some controversy, but at least I'll back it up with arguments. I hope we can create an interesting thread together and discuss our own dislike towards these songs in a humane way, without bashing me, my music tastes or Dream Theater, their music and their band members.
THERE WILL BE CONTROVERSY, no bitching. I won't do it and I hope you, as a fellow forum poster won't do this either.
For those interested, this was my top 50 Dream Theater songs as posted around a year ago. I can say with a fair amount of certainty that this list is still pretty accurate:
50. Vacant
49. Outcry
48. Afterlife
47. The Glass Prison
46. Scene Seven: II. One Last Time
45. Eve
44. Lines in the Sand
43. Erotomania
42. Disappear
41. Pull Me Under
40. Raise The Knife
39. Blind Faith
38. The Silent Man
37. The Dark Eternal Night
36. Wither
35. 6:00
34. Far From Heaven
33. Another Day
32. Caught in a Web
31. On The Backs of Angels
30. Another Won
29. Wait for Sleep
28. The Killing Hand
27. The Root of All Evil
26. Misunderstood
25. Breaking All Illusions
24. Hollow Years
23. Scene Nine: Finally Free
22. Bridges in the Sky
21. Voices
20. Lifting Shadows off a Dream
19. Scene Two: I. Overture 1928 & II. Strange Deja-Vu
18. Stream of Consciousness
17. Peruvian Skies
16. Scene Six: Home
15. Scarred
14. Hell’s Kitchen
13. Under a Glass Moon
12. In The Presence of Enemies
11. Take The Time
10. Innocence Faded
9. Octavarium
8. Scene Eight: The Spirit Carries On
7. Trial of Tears
6. The Great Debate
5. Learning to Live
4. Space-Dye Vest
3. Surrounded
2. A Change of Seasons
1. Metropolis Pt. 1: The Miracle and the Sleeper
I'm just waiting for a definitive green light from DoC and then I'll start posting the list one by one.
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This is definitely more interesting than just doing a new version of your top 50. I promise to keep a respectful tooooneeee in my comments :)
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Followiiiinnnnngggg
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Yay! I hope to see... Just Let Me Breathe, Burning My Soul, You Not Me, and Honor Thy Father
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Yay! I hope to see... Just Let Me Breathe, Burning My Soul, You Not Me, and Honor Thy Father
We'll get there when we get there, if we get there, we'll see. For now:
20. Scene Five: Through Her Eyes
Dream Theater's ballads are always something of a hit and miss with me and ranking this one so low on my list of Dream Theater songs, just at the edge of my 20 least favourite songs might actually seem a bit harsh. Let me say this first; this isn't actually a really bad song, it's just one song from Scenes From a Memory that I'm not likely to listen to separately. I won't skip over it when I'll listen to the whole album, but as a standalone track, it doesn't really do anything for me. I can definitely see why Dream Theater put this track on Scenes From a Memory, since after the first couple of tracks on the album, this is a nice breather, with the band holding back a bit and I like Pertucci's leads in the song quite a bit; great phrasing, but the melodies themselves seem very bland. And that actually goes for the rest of the song as well. To me, this song just sounds a little weak and it's a massive drop in intensity in the middle of the album. Again, I can see why this track is there, but SFAM would have flowed a lot better if Dream Theater put a ballad in its place that was a little more active. The whole song is very repetitive to me and it takes too long for the vocals to kick in. Then, after some vocal lines, the song never reaches a climax at all, although in the context of the album it goes very well into the massive stomp that is Home. Of course, dealing with the rest of the album here is pretty inevitable when I'm trying just to judge this song as it works to an extent, but as a standalone track it could never actively engage me. There's no buildup, the leads seem bland and even JLB's vocals sound rushed, like he's on autopilot trying to be melancholic. Like I said in the first sentence; DT's ballads are a hit or a miss for me and this one is definitely a miss for lacking a climax, an interesting part and for being too repetitive. SFAM might benefit from this one being on there, but I also think the album would have been better had there been a more focused, active ballad in the place of Through Her Eyes or if the execution of this one had been a little more structured.
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I agree 100% on this one. Not a bad song, but as you described, it really doesn't do much outside of the context of the album. It might be even lower for me, but only by default (most of the others being better) rather than out of dislike.
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I agree 100% on this one. Not a bad song, but as you described, it really doesn't do much outside of the context of the album. It might be even lower for me, but only by default (most of the others being better) rather than out of dislike.
This
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:'(
I'll concede, lyrically it is a drag. But still... :'(
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I love Through Her Eyes :'(
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Through Her Eyes would be probably around same spot for me, but I still pretty much like it.
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I love Through Her Eyes :'(
Me too. :-\
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It does really wonderful things for me :heart
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To think Through Her Eyes would probably be in my Top 15 :lol
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Yeah, that ranking is about right.
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Here's the next:
19. Prophets of War
Here's one song that most people here will probably either agree with or would rank a lot lower (like bosk, who named it his least favourite DT song (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=36057.315)). While I'm not going that far, this song certainly is not a beauty to me. So where I sort-of liked some stuff that was going on in Through Her Eyes, there barely anything in Prophets of War that I legitimately like. Well, why isn't this one lower on my list then? Basically, it comes down to this: I don't really think Prophets of War is a bad song in itself and I can actually applaud DT for trying something totally different on this one and getting some wacky stuff in there (yes, I'm looking at the Queen-vocals in the verses; actually I don't even know if they were in the verses, I haven't heard this song in ages), but it just doesn't work for me. Everything sounds cheesy or uninspired. What makes it worse to me is that they played this song at the first Dream Theater concert I was ever at and I just wasn't in any mood to hear this song at a live concert, especially since they played 4(!) other songs that will make this list on that same night. Terrible experience. Apart from the band being very bad that night (completely uninspiring performance, barely any crowd interaction, band-members fucking things up, Jordan Rudess getting a solo-spot for some of his random Continuum wankery), this song wasn't really received that well. Although the crowd chanting bit actually works live, on the record it sounds dull and uninteresting, exactly the opposite of what it should do. I suppose after this negativity I could have ranked this one even lower, but it's here now. Deal with it.
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I actually really like POW. It's easily my favorite song on SC and would definitely be in my top 50.
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Well, this list is coming from someone who thinks ITPOE Pt. 2 and The Dark Eternal Night are the best songs on SC and there's a lot of disagreement there too. I suppose SC is a very divisive album.
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Yeah those two are mid-tier at best for me when it comes to ranking songs on that album, so our tates must be pretty different.
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Prepare to see more stuff you'll probably like or even love then :P I have some songs coming up that will probably enrage at least some folks here. I'm very sorry in advance.
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I actually really like Prophets Of War, but that's just me.
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I honestly can't stand POW. I find it one of the worst songs on SC (which I consider their worst album)
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PoW is horrible.
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It's an okay song. I'd probably rank it around the same or maybe a tiny bit higher. Certainly not the band's finest hour, but I find myself enjoying the Queen stuff and the vocals from both James and Mike. I agree that the crowd stuff doesn't sound too good on record, probably because it's hard to record that many voices. I think the overall effect of that part isn't too far removed from what it would have been if Mike had just half-growled those lines.
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POW is pretty underwhelming.
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Prophets of War is a top 20 DT song for me. I like the things people tend to criticize in it, that's why.
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POW deserves that position, although it would be even closer to the bottom in my list.
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I'm down with that
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Yeah, it might well be one of their 'worst' songs, but there's 18 songs I like even less. Some of the songs coming up might be 'better', but I'm less likely to enjoy listening to them. Keep in mind, this is not a ranking of what songs I think of as 'bad', but just my least favourite, ranked in the order of likeliness to listen to them. Then again, basically every song in this whole top 20 wouldn't ever receive a voluntary listen, so the ranking is pretty much arbitrary, although I tried my best.
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Following now, and I have to say: I love Through Her Eyes, and Prophets of War is great too, though it probably is low on my list as well. This will definitely be interesting.
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I really like Prophets of War. The synth-style feel it has is really cool, and James sounds great. I even like Mike's "rap" section. :laugh:
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Let's get it on:
18. New Millennium
I actually really like a lot of stuff on Falling Into Infinity, but I can also imagine an entire Dream Theater fanbase raging over this same CD after putting it on for the first time and expecting anything along the lines of Images & Words and Awake. Picture it yourself; a progressive metal nerd aching for his 'ENERGY AND POWAH' from Dream Theater's music and he puts Falling into Infinity into his CD player and it starts playing. By the time the CD reaches the second verse of You Not Me, this progressive metal nerd angrily turns off his stereo system, never to listen to Falling into Infinity again and missing out on some great music that's still to come. I can see this happening. And that's mainly for this track here, this 'New Millennium'. For me, it kicks off the album on a very low note, with some opening melodies that are uninteresting at best. But my main gripe with it isn't that, it James LaBrie's vocal lines throughout the whole song. Yes, I get that he had a food poisoning accident, but that's not an excuse as he delivers some seriously awesome stuff throughout the album. Why couldn't he do that here? They seem dull, almost spoken and aren't interesting to listen to at all, especially in that 'keep your head up' section that has been dragged out for way too long. Instrumentally, this is song is alright at best for me, but the fact that they draw every instrumental section from so little - and mediocre at that - material drags that part down as well. At a certain point, I have heard enough of those 2-3 melodies that keep repeating throughout the song. Sorry, that was probably too negative. Here's a short rundown: LaBrie's vocal melodies are not interesting enough for me, it's a bad song to open an album after you just had the energy and power of Awake, instrumentally it's way too repetitive.
Anybody who agrees?
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New Millennium is definitely Top 25 for me
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New Millennium is just okay. I don't like the intro, although the song picks up afterward. Overall, I don't dislike it, but I never really have an urge to listen to it.
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New Millennium is just okay. I don't like the intro, although the song picks up afterward. Overall, I don't dislike it, but I never really have an urge to listen to it.
Same here.
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Prophets of War is a really good song IMO. As is Through Her Eyes. New Millennium, on the other hand, is so boring and uninteresting I can't listen to it.
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It's one of those songs that I don't get/hasn't sunk in yet
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Thanks for the replies so far, keep 'em coming!
17. Build Me Up, Break Me Down
Here's a song that I feel I haven't given enough chances. Back when ADTOE was released I was looking forward to the release, but I was also alreday listening to a lot of other music and Dream Theater were a band I loved in the past, but I wasn't really hyperactive about everything they did. I'm feeling similar towards the release of their self-titled album, I'm looking forward to hearing it and I will most likely pre-order it too, but I'm not dying for every tin bit of information like some of the (newer) members here are. I've been a DT fan for quite long (for my age at least, I can remember SC being released), but have also discovered lots of new music since then. This constant discovering leads me to listening to an album a couple of times and then deciding whether it's a keeper or not or whether never to hear it again. This helps me filter through the tons of music I get recommended by Spotify, these boards and various friends. What happened with ADTOE was something extraordinary. I bought the album and listened to it an immense amount of time, but I also chose my definite favourite of the album (Bridges in the Sky) and my least favourite (this one here) and after listening to the album more than a couple of times, I started inserting my favourite songs sparingly into various playlists. BMUBMD never got nominated. In a time where I 'had' to listen to way too much music, this song never really grabbed my attention. I don't exactly know why, since it's probably a good song, but of all the stuff on ADTOE, this one just didn't do it for me. I haven't heard it since I went to see the band on February 1st this year, where they performed it.
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New Millenium is good. It was even in my top 50 when I did it, but I think it isn't anymore. BMUBMD for me is the weakest song on ADTOE, but it's still good. I really like the chorus. It's nowhere near my top 50 though.
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My thoughts on Build Me Up, Break Me Down are the same as New Millennium. Okay song, parts of it I like, but unless I'm listening A Dramatic Turn Of Events all the way through, not one I listen to.
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I agree with everything you said about New Millennium, except that I kind of like the intro. BMUBMD is my least favorite song on ADTOE, although I enjoy it.
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I rather enjoy New Millennium. D:
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Glad to see New Millennium here. It's a very pedestrian song, by DT standards. Ditto for BMUBMD.
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New Millenium is great.
BMUBMD is the worst. DT. song. ever. I even rather listen to their cover of Tori Amos's Winter.
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New Millennium belongs in all bottom X lists. It is the only song on FII that I just can't enjoy (even Burning my Soul is better).
However, you are wrong on PoW :p
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Yay! Next one! But not a very happy one, I would think. I wonder who'll agree with this next one?
16. The Count of Tuscany
Yes, you read that right. It says 'The Count of Tuscany'. Well, I don't necessarily want to be controversial, but with picks like this one, it's just going to happen anyway. So far, I had only picked songs that are more often mentioned in the favourite 'least favourite' thread we've had over the years, but The Count of Tuscany rarely ever gets a mentioned. People apparently love this song, I've seen it in various rankings, I've seen it at live concerts and it bugs me, because this song just can't touch me in any way. Three times I have seen Dream Theater live and twice I have had this song played for me. The first time, John Petrucci completely messed up the volume swells, with some notes out of tune, feedback and whammy-bars not working. The second time, the band decided to cut all-time fan-favourite Learning to Live from the setlist, in favour of this.. the fucking Count, again! My live experiences with Dream Theater haven't really been too well and of some of the songs on this list, it's actually the live experience I had with it that made it make this list. Such is probably the case with The Count of Tuscany. I can't remember having heard this song after the last time I saw the band play it live, which was in the summer of 2011, so that's 2 years ago.
Let me get the most obvious bashing for this song out of the way first; yeah, the lyrics are hilariously bad, but if you look at them as tongue-in-cheek lyrics, they're actually quite okay. Where it goes wrong completely is with the delivery of all those lyrics. They're very bad (anyone will agree, come on! 'down the cellar stairs, I DISAPPEAR!', 'all the finest wines improve with age'), but they're delivered with so much seriousness that you can't possibly believe them. The completely opposite goes for The Dark Eternal Night for instance. That song is just so ridiculously silly and the band knows it. The lyrics are bad, but the delivery of them is fun. TDEN is actually a fun song, The Count of Tuscany is not. The lyrics are apparently meant to be taken seriously and that sole fact brings this song down. But we're not done there yet. Although the intro is very beautiful and probably one of the better openings for any song the band has done, I have zero incentive to listen to this track for all the other instrumentation in the song. The riffs in the first part are repetitive to me and the ending is everything but 'grand' or 'epic'. Instead of a 'bang' of a balloon popping, it's more like a 'fizzz', you know.. when you let all the air out. And then my biggest gripe: those god-damn volume swells. There was absolutely no need for that at all. It just seems like a completely lazy attempt to abridge two different pieces of music (that are actually linked by sharing similar chord progression) by playing the melodies of the upcoming part very slowly on just a guitar using volume swells. It drags the song down from semi-alright riffing (as stated, I find them to be boring rehashed riffs mostly) to a complete snooze-fest of nothing interesting happening at all. The part that follows then lacks any uplifting qualities that could ever bring the song back to the glorious moments in the very intro. From the moment the song starts, it goes downhill very quickly and never up again. A very disappointing ending to a disappointing album, as far as I'm considered. I would love to never hear this song again volutarily; and definitely not in a live setting. It's even worse there.
(Excuse my negativity; I'll respect anyone who does like this song, although I also respectfully disagree)
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I was just going to say I agree with every song. Oh well :lol
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Not with this one then? :lol
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Well, it's not a top 20 song by any means, probably top 50 though.
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I enjoy The Count and therefore disagree with this choice, but I don't like it as much as some seem to. I don't have any particular gripe about it; it just doesn't come together for me as well as pretty much any DT song near or beyond its length. The intro is beautiful and I actually like the vocal melodies (great ones from Mike for what would turn out to be his last DT vocal performance on a studio album). The first half of the song is fantastic. I'm just not sure about the second half. By this point on BCSL, the use of solos to encompass entire instrumental sections is a bit tired (I wish that album had some serious instrumental sections that weren't entirely *guitar solo* *keyboard solo*), and I really don't find that section too engaging. The volume swell section and the finale are alright, even if the finale is a little too long. But I agree that it doesn't really seem to have much to do with the first half of the song. Overall, though it is a very good song, it just doesn't come together as well as the band's other epics, and so, even if I personally wouldn't place it this low, I understand and to some extent agree with your reasons for doing so.
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I can see why you hate it. Lyrics are worse than a hundred-year-old cheese cellar.
Honestly though, I love the 9/8 heavy part driving :neverusethis: the song forward a little more than three minutes in.
The atmospheric guitars near the end also get mention from me.
It will probably be near the bottom of my list when it becomes my turn.
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wait.....
no...
No.
NO!
NO! NO! NO! NO! NO!
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I quite like The Count, but I could completely see how one could dislike it. For the longest time, I absolutely hated it, but it grew on me. Godawful lyrics though. Really, what were they thinking?
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I like TCOT (despite the lyrics), but I can see why someone wouldn't enjoy it too much.
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Shadow Ninja is the only one that's completely right here :biggrin:
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Ahhhhh. I love the count of Tuscany despite it's poor lyrics. Might be a top 10 for me. That being said I can understand why someone wouldn't like it. You're reasons were personal opinion and not just bashing, so I can respect that ;)
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Through Her Eyes - One of my favorite DT ballads. I have to admit though that I much prefer the live version because of how John plays his leads and it has more emotion in the music than the album version.
Prophets of War - What can I say, a bottom 5 DT for me without a doubt.
New Millenium - Never understood the hate for this song. I absolutely LOVE the breakdown.
BMUBMD - Another bottom 5 DT song. Just does nothing for me. It's everything I don't want Dream Theater to be.
The Count of Tuscany - A weird song for me. I love the beginning and the end. I hate some of the lyrics but do enjoy some. And I need to be in the right mood for the middle section.
After not hearing it for a while I tend to really enjoy it as a whole piece. Would be somewhere near the middle for me.
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TCOT was the last song left out from my top 50. So I'm not a huge fan of it and I understand if some people don't like it. I don't have a problem with the lyrics though.
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Next one!
15. Never Enough
Hello Muse, is that you? It sounds like you though, but wait.. we're listening to Dream Theater's 8th album, where they took various 'influences' and made their own versions of songs. It's no secret that Mike Portnoy likes Muse - and frankly, I like Muse too - but this song here is so blatantly forged after Muse's songs that it's not really funny anymore. The main riff is alright, but reminds you of Muse straight away, as do the vocals when they kick in. I believe Dream Theater are a band who are/were good at what they are/were doing, but here it doesn't sound like Dream Theater anymore in the slightest. If you'd have Matt Bellamy singing this song, it could pass off as a Muse song - and not even a good one at that. The chorus sounds totally lame to me, which is probably the exact opposite of what it should do. Dream Theater can't really do the 'angry'-thing very well, I think. The heaviest stuff they've done is on Awake (which is MY opinion) and yet that still doesn't really sound 'angry' in a way. Dream Theater are (to me!) much more the contemplating band that can word stuff brilliantly lyrically (not always the case, see for instance TCOT) and musically, but here they fail on that last part. This song holds nothing to keep my interest, it sounds like a quick rehash of random ideas stolen from Muse, with a boring chorus that fails to deliver its message and a very boring guitar solo/unison (which sounds like JP on autopilot; nothing musically interesting about this one at all) to boot. Definitely not one of my favourites.
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I dislike Never Enough as well, just not as harshly, but for the main reason that the lyrics are so terrible.
I've been speculating that Along for the Ride on the new album will have the exact opposite sentiment.
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Bottom 4 DT song for me... Although the unison is kind of ok, I agree that it sounds like JP and JR on autopilot and isn't nearly enough to save the song.
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I actually think it's a pretty good song. The lyrics piss me off though...
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I can't really blame you for the placement of this song, even though I kind of like it. The lyrics don't really bother me either.
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I like the song well enough (especially that unison), but I can understand why others don't. The lyrics may be a little over-the-top with all the brand new floors and such but I don't think they're totally beyond redemption..
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Did anyone actually read the write-up? :lol I said nothing about the lyrics, but since everybody is keen on doing so, I'll add my thoughts; they're not bad, but not very good either. The execution of the lyrics is what bothers me though.
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There was a writeup? :P I'm just kidding, I read it, but the lyrics are one of the things most people don't like about it (including those in this thread).
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I can definitely get behind this choice.
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Never Enough is OK, but it's in my bottom 20 of DT songs.
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New Millennium - I like this song quite a bit, almost love it. I'd never think to listen to it unless I'm giving FII a full spin, but I do enjoy it while it's there.
BMUBMD - Only song on ADTOE that I don't like. It doesn't bother me much, but I usually do skip it when I spin ADTOE.
The Count of Tuscany - Completely love this song. I think the serious delivery of silly/bad lyrics actually makes the song more entertaining to listen to.
Never Enough - Was never into this song very much. I don't listen to 8VM much anymore, but even when I did this was one of my least favorites.
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Never Enough is really pedestrian, as is the rest of that album. As for the cunt of tuscany, I'm conflicted. I certainly understand why you wouldn't like it, because it is ridiculous in the middle. But the beautiful intro and last 5 minutes more than make up for the trash in between, for me.
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So far I can only agree with BMU BMD and Never Enough although POW might be in my least favorite top 20 songs as well. I like it but I'm not sure if there are 19 songs that I like less.
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As for the cunt of tuscany
Intentional? :biggrin:
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The Cunt of Tuscany from the album Black Cocks & Silver Lingerie :zydar:
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I love Never Enough. A top 20 song for me.
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Shock for TCOT! I love the lyrics :eek
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\o
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Never Enough isn't terrible, but I don't really like it. Love TCOT though.
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I never got why Never Enough is so hated. I listen to a lot of Muse, and I don't think it sounds very similar at all. It's not any worse than any generic DT song, and it's got really cool chords, killer drumming, and an awesome unison. With that said, it's probably not even in my upper half of DT songs, but it's by no means a bad song.
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I never got why Never Enough is so hated. I listen to a lot of Muse, and I don't think it sounds very similar at all. It's not any worse than any generic DT song, and it's got really cool chords, killer drumming, and an awesome unison. With that said, it's probably not even in my upper half of DT songs, but it's by no means a bad song.
There's a such thing?
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I never got why Never Enough is so hated. I listen to a lot of Muse, and I don't think it sounds very similar at all. It's not any worse than any generic DT song, and it's got really cool chords, killer drumming, and an awesome unison. With that said, it's probably not even in my upper half of DT songs, but it's by no means a bad song.
There's a such thing?
I'd say that Never Enough, Panic Attack, Forsaken, These Walls, maybe 6:00, etc. are all paint-by-numbers, generic DT songs. Not that they're bad songs at all, but they all feel like they fit the same general feel, style, structure, etc. Every band has a basic template they follow when they're not breaking new ground.
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6:00 ???
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These Walls ???
:justshootme: :marriageanalogy: :hung:
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:hung:
Marvelous! I didn't have that one.
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Alright, well, it's all objective anyways.
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Yes, yes it is. Though your list of 'generic' DT songs is quite alright, I have no clue what 6:00 is doing there; that's by no means 'generic'. The other 4 follow roughly the same structure and it's interesting to note that they come from only two albums. I think it's pretty safe to say though that there isn't really such a thing as a 'generic' Dream Theater song. Perhaps someone should analyse every song of them to see if they can find some blatant similarities in terms of structure...
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*flameshield on* good call with TCoT. Although it's not one of my least fave songs, I haven't heard it in a forever and I have no strong feelings for it. I think it's the only song on BCSL with no "problematic" parts but that's not really an accomplishment. I also think it's a teensy bit more loved (at least by the part of the fanbase that was there for the release of BCSL, which is to say the majority of us) because it's one of the songs that keeps the more lighthearted, light-sounding spirit of some earlier DT albums and comes after an album full of noodling and problematic decisions, which makes it look better in comparison.
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I'm slowly hating myself for this thread, because of me bashing the songs, but since there's still 14 to go, I figured I would continue it anyway.
14. Take Away My Pain
Placing this so low really makes me feel bad. I completely understand the meaning and purpose of this song and it's actually a wonderful song to dedicate to anyone's late father. What goes wrong here for me is not the song itself; I really like listening to it any time I play Falling Into Infinity, but it doesn't do much more than that for. There's never a moment where I'll think 'let's listen to Take Away My Pain' and however good this song may be (because, let's face, this song is far from Dream Theater's 'worst' and anyone who thinks otherwise is weird), if it doesn't get enough airtime, there's not a chance that it's going to end up being a favourite. Although there's music out there that I don't listen to often that I consider to be among my favourite music ever, the enjoyment of listening to it whenever I do far exceeds the enjoyment of any listen to Take Away My Pain. I'm sorry, John Petrucci, because I'm sure this song means a lot to you and I completely respect and understand that. It's an absolute fine song, by any means, but it's just not for me.
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Nah, you haven't been bashing the songs, at least yet.
I'm in the same boat with you regarding TAMPon, although it wouldn't be that close to the bottom in my list, and The Best of Times falls into the same category IMO: beautiful songs that probably mean a lot to their lyricists, but don't do much to me.
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Nah, you haven't been bashing the songs, at least yet.
No, I suppose so, although I have been quite negative about some of the songs I've mentioned already. Part of me really wants to bash the shit out of some stuff and the other part of me thinks 'well, somebody took time to create this and there's others around here that probably *do* like it. I wouldn't want anybody critisising my band's music in any harsh way either'. I guess that's also why some people tend to only write good reviews for stuff and leave other things that leave them cold untouched. It's quite a challenge really, not in the least trying to rank the songs you dislike.
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What do you think of the Once in a Livetime version?
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Take Away My Pain deserves that spot. Everything you said about it is true, in my experience. Not a bad song by any means, but nowhere near the first song I put on if I'm looking for a quick fix of DT, or even a quick fix of ballady DT.
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What do you think of the Once in a Livetime version?
I must say I never really actively listened to that one. I don't really do live albums, but I just had a listen and the saxophone is a really nice touch there, but other than that I feel pretty much the same towards the song.
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Pretty much agree with everything said here. I certainly don't hate TAMP, but it's like if it never existed nothing would be different. It's just there...
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Yeah, I agree with everyone else. It's not a bad song, it's just that most of the songs DT has done are better.
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I love that song :biggrin:
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I love that song :biggrin:
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13. Scene Seven: I. The Dance of Eternity
This is going to get at least one member here freaked out (oh, hai there, The Great Pretender! :biggrin: ), but probably more. Let me go ahead and say this first: I love playing this 'song' on my guitar. It's lots of fun, I can pretty much play it all the way through, except for that fast section at the end of the guitar solo - and no! this is not the most difficult Dream Theater song to play at all. At least not on guitar, not in the slightest. Once you get the patterns down, it's actually very doable. And that leads me to my point; it seems that The Dance of Eternity only gets so much praise because it's a difficult piece. Yes, it probably does have the most time signature changes in any DT song and it sounds difficult when you listen to it, but in reality, it's not really. Well, it is, to an extent and that makes it a fun song to play as well, but my point being; it's not simply good because it's difficult in structure or difficult to play. In fact, contrasting my joy of playing this song, I find absolutely no joy in actively listening to this track at all. First of all, the guitar sounds muddy, but that shouldn't really be a reason for it to be here. No, I can't help but feel that Dream Theater just tried their best to create their most 'proggy' song to date here with this track, and in that, they succeeded, I won't deny that, but at the cost of something that remains nice to listen to. At times I feel like this is just difficult for the sake of being difficult, without taking into account what it sounds like. So while this may be musically brilliant to some extent, I much prefer listening to something that actually goes somewhere, instead of mindless wankery through odd time-signatures. This 'song' doesn't really have a climax, for me at least, and that makes the instrumental craziness all the more futile. I appreciate the effort of creating this tune, but as something to listen to, I think this is their worst instrumental piece, by a pretty large margin.
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Out of curiosity, which DT songs do you think are the hardest?
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I agree with this placement. I feel like TDOE is just DT trying to make the most complicated song they can, but in doing so they sacrifice all the stuff I like most about them.
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I agree with this placement. I feel like TDOE is just DT trying to make the most complicated song they can, but in doing so they sacrifice all the stuff I like most about them.
Pretty much exactly this. Except to add that the ragtime part is an awesome spontaneous diversion and I love that part. But certainly this isn't one of their best and I would probably place it similarly to you.
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Out of curiosity, which DT songs do you think are the hardest?
I don't know, I'm not a good enough guitarist to actually play all of JP's solos, but both The Glass Prison and the Blind Faith unison are up there.
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Stream of Consciousness solo...
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I found TDOE cool at first, but the feeling wore off pretty quickly. I don't dislike it, but I never have the desire to listen to it, either.
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Bless you.
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Yes, I too used to think TDOE was the coolest song ever, but the excitement wore off in less than a year. The song is still a masterful example of odd-time signature usage and progressive metal wankery. That's about it. A cool song to listen to once in a while, but no more than that.
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Stream of Consciousness solo...
There's a difference between very fast solos and actually difficult solos. In a lot of JP's faster solos he uses the same sort of mechanics, so once you get them down, they're actually pretty easy to play on a lower speed (I'm not really a shredder..), but some stuff is just downright HARD on lower tempos as well (The Glass Prison into, Blind Faith unison, for example).
I found TDOE cool at first, but the feeling wore off pretty quickly. I don't dislike it, but I never have the desire to listen to it, either.
Yes, I too used to think TDOE was the coolest song ever, but the excitement wore off in less than a year. The song is still a masterful example of odd-time signature usage and progressive metal wankery. That's about it. A cool song to listen to once in a while, but no more than that.
Yeah, I feel pretty much the same. Just the lack of replay value mainly, that made it end op here.
Bless you.
Huh? :lol
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To be clear, even though I agree on many of your points, I wouldn't rank TDOE nearly as low :D
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I meant, "bless you for disliking it as much as I do" :lol
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Ah, I see! :tup :lol
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I don't like the majority of DTs instramentals, but TDOE is probably my least favorite after Raw Dog.
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I don't like the majority of DTs instramentals, but TDOE is probably my least favorite after Raw Dog.
TDOE is probably my second least favorite as well, although SOC is also fighting for that position.
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I found TDOE cool at first, but the feeling wore off pretty quickly. I don't dislike it, but I never have the desire to listen to it, either.
My feelings exactly. It's an impressive song from a technical standpoint, but it's not the sort of thing that I gravitate towards or want to listen to much.
I can definitely understand someone ranking it low, considering that the technicality of it is the only thing TDOE has going for it, and nothing else.
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Hopefully Enigma Machine (?) will score better than TDOE in your list, Rich :tup
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I don't like the majority of DTs instramentals, but TDOE is probably my least favorite after Raw Dog.
TDOE is probably my second least favorite as well, although SOC is also fighting for that position.
Well, to be fair, Raw Dog isn't exactly my favourite instrumental either, but for this list I chose to do tracks that were released on albums only, so that means demos and stuff like Raw Dog have not been taken into account when creating this list. As for Stream of Consciousness.. it's my favourite track on Train of Thought and my second favourite instrumental after Hell's Kitchen.
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I find the Outcry instrumental section a lot more complex than TDOE :)
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Well, to be fair, Raw Dog isn't exactly my favourite instrumental either, but for this list I chose to do tracks that were released on albums only, so that means demos and stuff like Raw Dog have not been taken into account when creating this list.
Ignoring the existence of Raw Dog is always the right thing to do :lol :tup
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Well, to be fair, Raw Dog isn't exactly my favourite instrumental either, but for this list I chose to do tracks that were released on albums only, so that means demos and stuff like Raw Dog have not been taken into account when creating this list.
Ignoring the existence of Raw Dog is always the right thing to do :lol :tup
I didn't ignore it, I just went for my least favourite DT songs from all of their studio releases, arranged in the order of likeness that I would listen to them. Adding the demos and random other tracks would completely clutter the whole list (in my case), which is why I chose to draw from studio releases ONLY. Note that in my first top 50 I did use demos and other tracks as well, since Another Won, Eve, Raise the Knife and A Change of Seasons were on that list.
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TDOE is not so great. I like the song and I like the technical aspect of it, and I think it fits well on the album. But it's not my favourite DT instrumental, nor is it in my top 50.
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TDOE is not so great. I like the song and I like the technical aspect of it, and I think it fits well on the album. But it's not my favourite DT instrumental, nor is it in my top 50.
I don't know if its my favorite DT instrumental either, but its hard for me to not like it because its so darn impressive from a technical standpoint. I do agree that it fits well on the album and is represented there as a strong work because its a part of a larger puzzle, when you take the song standing by itself its not quite as good.
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TDOE is not so great. I like the song and I like the technical aspect of it, and I think it fits well on the album. But it's not my favourite DT instrumental, nor is it in my top 50.
I don't know if its my favorite DT instrumental either, but its hard for me to not like it because its so darn impressive from a technical standpoint. I do agree that it fits well on the album and is represented there as a strong work because its a part of a larger puzzle, when you take the song standing by itself its not quite as good.
Yes, that's precisely what I meant! I like the song, but it may be my least favourite DT instrumental after Raw Dog, and it's just not as epic as the 'hype' surrounding it because it's their most technical song.
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The three first minutes of TDOE are fun. The rest of the song isn't.
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The three first minutes of TDOE are fun. The rest of the song isn't.
This is true enough for me. Even when I used to listen to it regularly I would usually skip the part from the bass solo to the ending.
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It's back! Sorry for the absence, I have had a busy week of barely being home, so I simply didn't have the time and means to type out the next write-up. I'll see if I can be a little quicker with the remaining 12.
12. A Nightmare to Remember
Another weird pick for a bottom list I suppose. Although this song is barely featured in top 50 lists and even more rarely so at the top, it's also never the subject of criticism, which makes me suspect most DT listeners (at least on these boards) feel a little indifferent about this song, not exactly knowing what to 'do' with it. I'm in this group too, but being indifferent to a song automatically places it in the 'never listen to' section, exactly what I'm doing in this countdown. Well, let's be clear here, this song has a lot of strong points! The beginning is pretty awesome and also a fantastic opener to an album. The 'beautiful agony' section is also beautiful - and probably one of the best sections on the whole album, but aside from those two aspects, the songs is pretty lacking to me. Song other forum member here (can't remember who) recently said that A Nightmare to Remember is a bit tedious to listen to; too long basically, and that's how I feel about it too. The strong points get drowned in mediocre riffs and solo sections in the latter half of the song, lyrics that aren't as strong as DT's other lyrics. These lyrics suffer from a similar syndrome as the TCOT lyrics too: they're too describing and therefore get a little bland and to me; pretty bad. Then of course there's the RORORO section. Well, you know, that could actually have been pretty awesome, but MP's voice just isn't made to do that and the growled lyrics are absolutely horrendous to me. So yeah, they survived, that's good then isn't it? Absolutely no need to growl those lyrics, if you ask me. I honestly believe that with a bit of trimming of riffs (especially in the latter part), better lyrics and a properly growled section, this song could have been very, very good and even more unique in DT's total library of songs than it is now. Now it just seems unfinished, as if you have to imagine what it could be like. Again, the 'beautiful agony' section is, well, beautiful, but it's not enough to make me listen to the song all the way through, partly because I get turned off by partly the lyrics, partly the wankery solos after the 'beautiful agony' section (that's Rudess mostly) and the tediousness of everything that follows after the 'Day after day' section. This is nowhere near Dream Theater's 12th 'worst' song and like I said, it could have been very good, but I find little enjoyment in listening it all the way through.
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I used to love ANTR, but nowadays I think the song gets really meh after Beautiful Agony, which is a shame because the song is really good up until that point.
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I agree. The song could easily have been five minutes shorter. It suffers from beeing way to stretched out instrumentally, and the RORORO-section and the blastbeat-section is completely pointless.
The song is great up to (and including) Beatiful Agony. After that i usually skip it..
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ANTR is epic!
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I was never big on the heavy parts of ANTR. Wouldn't make my top 50, but it wouldn't be in my bottom 20 either. Purely because of Beautiful Agony. I love that part so much. Usually when I listen to BCSL these days I just fast forward to Beaultiful Agony and skip to TCOT once the heavy part kicks back in. If they fleshed that section out as its own song I think it could be top 10 DT material for me.
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Used to like this song, but it hasn't aged well at all. It now just seems long for the sake of being long, and some of those MP vocals just start to sound silly after a few listens.
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Aww...
I can definitely agree with it being too long, I think they should have wrapped it up right after the last verse. But the rest of it is so good... Yes, I'm one of the four people who really enjoys the "Day after day" section (this despite the fact that I've never been too heavily into growls...). I'd probably put in my top 40 or 50. So, yeah, we disagree here.
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Yes, I'm one of the four people who really enjoys the "Day after day" section (this despite the fact that I've never been too heavily into growls...)
I feel like I've stumbled upon a unicorn, or a leprechaun, or something. :laugh:
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Yes, I'm one of the four people who really enjoys the "Day after day" section (this despite the fact that I've never been too heavily into growls...)
Ehm.. you'll find a lot of forum users love that section.. I even said I really like it in my write-up.
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The "four people" was a hyperbolic joke based on the widespread hatred of that part. If I was being more literal I would have said "part of the minority," because I think it is a minority but not by much (I think the people who don't like it are more vocal about it than those who do).
I also want to say that I like the section even with its current lyrics. While it might have made somewhat more sense with other lyrics, I don't think the disconnect is nearly as big as it initially seems. That lyrical section is actually very dark aside from the final few lines. The whole first part of it is about how the memory of the accident is a "recurring nightmare haunting my dreams," and then the next lines are about how it was tragedy for which no one was prepared. Then the last few lines may have made MORE sense if James had sung them, but those are not exactly cheerful either. They imply that the father was severely injured and everyone only just barely survived. The cut lines from this section (which, for anyone who hasn't heard them, can be found on a version MP uploaded to his forum at one point where both he and James sang on this part), "Glass and steel inside his head, makes no sounds, he should be dead" support this. Maybe those lines would have made more sense with James, but the rest of the section makes just as much sense with Mike and it would ruin the momentum of that section to switch singers at that point.
Plus, as I think was your point in your original description (which I also feel I should mention because I feel somewhat like I'm hijacking your countdown thread), Mike's vocals fit perfectly with that section musically, and I think making musical sense is more important than making lyrical sense, though it is best to have both and I think ANTR largely does.
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I love ANTR, my favorite on the album besides probably TCOT. I only dislike the "day after day" part, the rest is pure proggy goodness to me.
I kinda like that it's stretched out more than what seems necessary, and sort of drives through. It's like you're going deeper and deeper, not sure where you're going or where it's going to take you, until it comes in with a great reprise and outro. It's like a journey (I'm talking musically here).
Beautiful Agony is great of course, and i like the instrumental/solo sections too.
In the end I can see why some would dislike it.
I obviously enjoy this song musically more than lyrically, however. I agree the lyrics are bland, but it doesn't bother me on this song. The lyrics do bother me during the last few minutes of TCOT though *cringe*
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I love the atmosphere of that song, and as a fan of Opeth, I loved when Mikael Åkerfeldt sang the RORORO part on stage with them. If only Mikael were on the studio version too...
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I understand. A Nightmare to Remember has some great moments, like the main melody. But it's streched. 3-4 minutes off and we're good.
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This is taking WAY too long already, I'm sorry. Here's 11, I'll get the top 10 out a bit quicker I hope.
11. The Shattered Fortress
I almost had This Dying Soul in its place, but then I realised I disliked The Shattered Fortress a bit less. So, from #11 to #20 we've had half of BC&SL. Guess what's my least favourite Dream Theater album... What goes wrong in The Shattered Fortress is mainly the complete repetitiveness of riffs, over exaggerated solo sections and vocals that don't stand out at all. From MP's laughable shouts of 'Inventory!' and 'Analysis!' and the liked and JLB's forgettable lines in pretty much every other part, vocally this song has absolutely no great stuff at all. Add to that the most repetitive riffing DT has ever done, not only copying riffs from within this track ad infinitum, but also completely slaughtering some of the cool riffs in the other AA-Suite tracks by playing wankery noodling solos over them (I'm talking about the keyboard solo that goes on for about 2 minutes to long and the guitar solo that adds next to nothing) and we get one of the most boring things Dream Theater has ever done. Although it's pretty fun to play through this track on a guitar, once again I never ever have the desire to go and listen to The Shattered Fortress. Those 13 minutes could easily be spent on some fantastic music by this same band. It's pretty weird to consider that the band that wrote fantastic tunes on Images & Words would write something like this 17 years later. Very weird indeed.
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The list so far:
20. Scene Five: Through Her Eyes
19. Prophets of War
18. New Millennium
17. Build Me Up, Break Me Down
16. The Count of Tuscany
15. Never Enough
14. Take Away My Pain
13. Scene Seven: I. The Dance of Eternity
12. A Nightmare to Remember
11. The Shattered Fortress
10-1. ?
Guesses for the top 10?
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I like TSF, though it's definitely not my favourite of the 12SS. As for top 10 guesses: You Not Me, Burning My Soul, Just Let Me Breathe, maybe Status Seeker?
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Agree with TSF. I actually think the end part (a.k.a the stuff not from another AA song) is pretty good, but the first 8 minutes is just like "I've already heard this before". Glad to see you continue this thread. I'm guessing You Not Me, Burning My Soul, and AROP will be in the top 10.
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TSF is basically a combination of different riffs from 12 Step Suite. It's not bad, but I wish they would've done something more original.
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I really like TSF from the calmer part on, and Petrucci's solo is amazing, but the first few minutes are definitely a little lackluster. I still enjoy it from time to time though.
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Well, be prepared for a couple of surprises yet..
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Next one is probably This Dying Soul, after that... I have no idea :lol
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TSF is probably in my Least 5 favorite. And I don't know why, it just seems uninspired and forced. Unlistenable to me.
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Next one is probably This Dying Soul, after that... I have no idea :lol
No, This Dying Soul was just saved by being replaced with The Shattered Fortress. I said so in the first sentences of the last write-up :)
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I actually like The Shattered Fortress quite a lot. It's not the masterpiece that The Glass Prison is, but it's still an excellent closer to the Suite IMO. I would also rank it third in the suite behind TGP and The Root of All Evil.
I do generally agree that Black Clouds & Silver Linings is among the band's weakest albums. It's frustrating because it feels like the whole is actually less than the sum of its parts. While the first three songs flow fairly well, the last three being all 12-20 minute epics is really just too much. I find while I like those songs on their own, they can be tiring in the context of the album.
Anyway. I disagree with you in regards to TSF, but I'm definitely still interested to see where your list goes next.
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10. I Walk Beside You
And here we have what's probably one of the band's more 'accessible' or even 'mainstream' songs. Having said that, it's especially weird that the band never really released this track to the full public. Well, it probably isn't really, because I believe this is a bad attempt at creating a catchy song. While crafted pretty neatly conforming the styles and structures a radio-friendly song should do (apart from the vocals arguably entering too late for it ever to be played on the radio), this song doesn't really interest me at all. Although it's still Dream Theater, in the sense that it sounds like Dream Theater, mainly because of James LaBrie's voice, it doesn't really resemble anything Dream Theater had done up to this point. Add to this that it feels completely misplaced on an album full of seemingly random songs (yes, Octavarium is also in the bottom 3 of DT albums for me) and we have a song I never want to listen to. I suppose it's alright as background music, but for me, it doesn't hold anything interesting and is as forgettable of your average contemporary radio hit. I'm sorry for the people who do like this track, because I'm sure there are some, but I can't help but feel the band just took a lazy attempt at writing a hit song, but then never actually cashed it in. Although I don't mind the band 'exploring' new territories, this is about the most un-DT-song they have ever written and it's not even a really good one at that, at least for me.
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It's been way over a month. Please try to wrap this thing up.
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Sure thing. I can just go ahead and post the remaining 9 without write-ups?
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Sure thing. I can just go ahead and post the remaining 9 without write-ups?
I mean, you can take a few more days space out the rest of your list if you want. But if you think that you don't have time, then just post the rest.
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Okay, let's see how many replies I'll get with the next pick:
9. In The Name of God
Yes. You read that absolutely right. In The Name of God is my 9th least favourite Dream Theater song. I seriously do not understand how people can rave over this song like it's the best thing ever and neither do I understand how the hell it ended up in the top 4 of the DT The League that was completed recently. This pick here is probably the most controversial in my whole list, but I can't make a top 20 least favourite DT songs that would accurately reflect my own tastes without including this one, so the controversy here is unfortunately necessary. Really, I wanted to like this song, I really did, but I gave up on it after it never really gave me anything. There is one thing though; the ending is absolutely fantastic, but it's not enough to save the song. It doesn't really go wrong at the beginning, but it seems like an endless tirade of verses and choruses, mostly because it moves so slowly. The verses are probably okay at best, but the chorus is so dull and drags the song down even more, because it's slower and completely powerless to me. Then my biggest gripe about the song is the completely out-of-place wankfest that DT calls a solo. It's really this moment in DT's complete discography that I detest most of all. Here come a couple of clichees: it's only fast to show-off, it's soulless, it has nothing to do with the rest of the song and it's boring. And that's really what I think about that solo section. So, what we have left is a song with 'okay' verses, a dull chorus, a solo section/bridge that I severely dislike and a good outro - and that's enough to land it at #9 on my least favourite DT songs. I haven't listened to this song in at least 2 years, nor to I intend to do so anytime soon. I'm sorry, I really am, but I also really don't understand the hype.
Go ahead, kill me.
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Wow. Didn't see that coming, although I totally agree with your points on the solo section. Other than that I think it's a great song. Still, I like the controversial picks. They make things interesting.
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Dude, I know where you live.
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ITNOG is a top 15 song for me :-\ I find the instrumental section interesting thanks to JM and MP's work underneath the soloing and I think DT have had much "wankier" sections in many songs.
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9. In The Name of God
Go ahead, kill me.
I hate you...
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9. In The Name of God
Go ahead, kill me.
I hate you...
What a fantastic first forum post! :tup
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:rollin But welcome anyway :tup
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Totally agree with you Elite.
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I like IWBY and ITNOG.
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Wow. First IWBY, which is one of those songs that isn't too popular but I'm all "aww, I love this one!" And then ITNOG.
Well, these lists wouldn't be fun without people making highly controversial picks, so… thanks for bringing the fun, I guess. Though I'm a bit scared of what's to come...
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In The Name of God on bottom 10
wat
that's all I have to say
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The only problem I have with ITNoG being this low is IWBY being higher... :facepalm:
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16. The Count of Tuscany
From the moment the song starts, it goes downhill very quickly and never up again. A very disappointing ending to a disappointing album, as far as I'm considered. I would love to never hear this song again volutarily; and definitely not in a live setting. It's even worse there.
This is exactly what i think about TCoT, just a forced long song, not an epic like ACOS or 8varium
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I do think ITNOG is overrated, but I have fun with it nonetheless.
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Okay, let's see how many replies I'll get with the next pick:
9. In The Name of God
Yes. You read that absolutely right. In The Name of God is my 9th least favourite Dream Theater song. I seriously do not understand how people can rave over this song like it's the best thing ever and neither do I understand how the hell it ended up in the top 4 of the DT The League that was completed recently. This pick here is probably the most controversial in my whole list, but I can't make a top 20 least favourite DT songs that would accurately reflect my own tastes without including this one, so the controversy here is unfortunately necessary. Really, I wanted to like this song, I really did, but I gave up on it after it never really gave me anything. There is one thing though; the ending is absolutely fantastic, but it's not enough to save the song. It doesn't really go wrong at the beginning, but it seems like an endless tirade of verses and choruses, mostly because it moves so slowly. The verses are probably okay at best, but the chorus is so dull and drags the song down even more, because it's slower and completely powerless to me. Then my biggest gripe about the song is the completely out-of-place wankfest that DT calls a solo. It's really this moment in DT's complete discography that I detest most of all. Here come a couple of clichees: it's only fast to show-off, it's soulless, it has nothing to do with the rest of the song and it's boring. And that's really what I think about that solo section. So, what we have left is a song with 'okay' verses, a dull chorus, a solo section/bridge that I severely dislike and a good outro - and that's enough to land it at #9 on my least favourite DT songs. I haven't listened to this song in at least 2 years, nor to I intend to do so anytime soon. I'm sorry, I really am, but I also really don't understand the hype.
Go ahead, kill me.
To each his own. I for one will be extremely happy if they play it on their upcoming tour
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The only problem I have with ITNoG being this low is IWBY being higher... :facepalm:
This. I like ITNOG, but I know why some people wouldn't. I like IWBY, and I know why some people wouldn't, but I wish everyone would like it :(
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ITNOG is the closest I've ever come to actually disliking a DT song.
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ITNOG is the closest I've ever come to actually disliking a DT song.
Really? Wow!
Totally agree with you Elite.
Also this, wow!
I honestly thought this would attract just 'wat's and 'You're insane' or stuff like that, but it's good to know there's people who think similarly. On to the next:
8. The Answer Lies Within
Like 'I Walk Beside You', I feel The Answer Lies Within does a similar thing; aim at catchiness and then completely forfeit that in the distribution of the song. I'll keep this write-up short, because it will be almost the same as the one for I Walk Beside You. The reason it's lower on my list is mainly because it's slower and therefor it gets harder for me to keep my interest levels high. While IWBY actually holds a little catchiness in the chorus, there's nothing I find memorable about The Answer Lies Within. JLB's vocal performance is very good on this song, I must admit, but like almost every single song in this list, I haven't really heard it in ages and that's due to the replay factor; this song just isn't interesting enough for me.
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I want to react negatively because I like this song, but… in the context of Dream Theater's entire discography, I can't say it isn't bottom 10. So I do think it's a good song, but I agree very much with your placement of it.
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Totally agree with your write up here. I think it's a good song, but like you said, it doesn't have good replay value. I rarely listen to it these days.
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I really just like the song for it's melancholic piano line, and the Octavarium theme reference after the 2nd verse. Besides that, yeah it's in their weaker songs but I've always liked it.
I Walk Beside You... Is a great song to me. I hated it at first for being mainstream and "U2" sounding, but then I actually listened to it... The bridge with the descending bassline and the harmonies is beautiful, and the high notes on the 3rd chorus by James are astounding. I can see why it would be rated so low though, I feel like you either love it or hate it.
ITNOG, reading your write up it makes sense, but listening to it, I can't help but disagree. Took a while to grow on me, I think it's good because it's just so ballsy (like most of ToT of course).
And lastly TSF, I think it's great as a suite closer, but not so great as an individual song. Can't say I disagree with your placement, but i do like it.
I am intrigued to see your number 1, that's for sure :)
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TALW is pretty boring indeed...
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7. Repentance
My least favourite part of the AA Suite certainly isn't a really bad song, but it's too repetitive and even boring for me. My first gripe with it is that it's built solely on the riff/guitar thingy that fuels the majority of verses in This Dying Soul. Now, this isn't necessarily a bad thing, since most of the verses are alright, but with JLB singing some very uninteresting vocal lines throughout, it doesn't exactly make for a good start. The biggest killer in this song for me is the part with all the people speaking. Initially I found this very interesting and I totally understand where the idea comes from, but it grew old on me pretty quickly. Combined with a mediocre beginning and a lack of any climax whatsoever, Repentance is way too long a song for what it really does for me and I have lost interest in it completely.
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"Boring" is a good description of the second half of this song, too :lol
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I like both TALW and Repentance... :flame:
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I think The Answer Lies Within is decent enough. It doesn't deserve the amount of hate or indifference it gets IMO. Completely agree about Repentance though.
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I agree completely with this choice. This is like a good 7 minute song that was stretched into an almost 11 minute song. And I agree that the section with all the other people talking is the part that needed to probably be cut most. The solo is very good but that's the only thing that stands out about this song.
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Agree with repentance. If it was a 4 minute song it would be pretty good. 11 minutes? No thanks.
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I agree with ITNOG, though I wouldn't place that as low.
TALW, on the other hand, is pretty good and Repentance... :( :( :(.
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Repentance is good, but I don't really mind seeing it this low.
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I feel like I'm the only person who doesn't mind the length of Repentance, I love the song. It might be because I'm into the melancholic side of music, and the last 3 minutes of PT like harmonies and keys rock to me. The first 4-5 minutes is really good too of course :)
However, it is repetitive, can't deny that. I understand the hate it gets, though it does bother me being this low.
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I love melancholic music too, but unfortunately that doesn't prevent me from thinking the second half of Repentance is a snoozefest.
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I really, really like JP's solo on Repentance, But that's the only thing on the song that I like. I also have to mention that Mikael Åkerfeldt singing it makes the song A LOT better to me.
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I feel like I'm the only person who doesn't mind the length of Repentance, I love the song. It might be because I'm into the melancholic side of music, and the last 3 minutes of PT like harmonies and keys rock to me. The first 4-5 minutes is really good too of course :)
However, it is repetitive, can't deny that. I understand the hate it gets, though it does bother me being this low.
It is a bit repetitive, but I don't really mind it being that long.
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I love melancholic music too, but unfortunately that doesn't prevent me from thinking the second half of Repentance is a snoozefest.
^This, pretty much.
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Agree with repentance. If it was a 4 minute song it would be pretty good. 11 minutes? No thanks.
^^^ This for me too. Repentance was the first song from memory, where I was like "Righto, lets just get this whole AAA thing over with.."
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Agree with repentance. If it was a 4 minute song it would be pretty good. 11 minutes? No thanks.
^^^ This for me too. Repentance was the first song from memory, where I was like "Righto, lets just get this whole AAA thing over with.."
this!
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I love melancholic music too, but unfortunately that doesn't prevent me from thinking the second half of Repentance is a snoozefest.
I think in some cases I can agree. I remember on my first listen it was pretty great, but now it's a little tiresome.
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The Count of Tuscany is a top 5 song for me I think, ITNOG I think is in my top 25 as it stands, I Walk Beside You is in the top 50. I'd probably put Prophets of War in my bottom 20 as well. I'm indifferent towards Never Enough, ANTR, New Millenium, Take Away My Pain. The Dance of Eternity is pretty much plain wankery but I enjoy it. BMUBMD is my least favorite song on ADTOE by a long shot but it's not bad, but it's probably not in my bottom 20.
Tbh probably half of WDADU would be in my bottom 20, it's just not my cup of tea at all, this album... :angel:
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Repentance is amazing. It's a top 25 DT song for me.
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BORING
bor·ing adjective \ˈbȯr-iŋ\
Definition of BORING
: causing boredom : tiresome
: Dream Theater - Repentance
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I feel like I'm the only person who doesn't mind the length of Repentance, I love the song. It might be because I'm into the melancholic side of music, and the last 3 minutes of PT like harmonies and keys rock to me. The first 4-5 minutes is really good too of course :)
However, it is repetitive, can't deny that. I understand the hate it gets, though it does bother me being this low.
:tup
I don't mind repetitive music, as long as the parts repeated are good.
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I can't really commit to this for long enough, so I'm just going to finish it over the course of two more updates. First I'll post #6 to #4 and then tomorrow I'll end it with #3 to #1.
Okay, let's go ahead:
6. The Best of Times
By now everybody knows Black Clouds & Silver Linings is my least favourite Dream Theater album and with 4 songs in the top 20, the album has the questionable lead in this top 20 least favourite Dream Theater songs. While I fully understand the intention of The Best of Times and why it was written, it probably would have been better if this song was kept off the record, only to be played to MP's dad. Like Take Away My Pain, this song is far too loaded with vivid imagery (which seems pretty random at points, though I'm ABSOLUTELY sure they mean a lot to Mike Portnoy) and way too much emotional load. People often cite this song for s remarkable guitar solo, but I can't really seem to find much enjoyment there either. John Petrucci's guitar sound is way too 'polished', for lack of a better word, in order to properly bring across what it probably wants to do, if you catch my meaning. Yes, his playing is good, but it's far too long and too focused on repeating and changing a simple line over and over again. Once more, I do appreciate the meaning of this song, but I don't really find it enjoyable in any sense.
5. Just Let Me Breathe
Falling Into Infinity is an album of insane heights at certain points, but also some very low lows. Just Let Me Breathe falls into that latter category and we're getting to the songs I genuinely dislike here. Primarily, the lyrics are a great example of terrible bashing and the deliverance of them is completely uninteresting, but the music providing the background for them isn't remarkable in any way either. The solo section sounds and seems rushed and forced, not really finding its way into the song and overall the whole sound of the song is not something we're used to from Dream Theater. It sounds muddy, a little angry, but most of all it sounds generic and the repetitive monotonicity of the song certainly isn't something that keeps me interested. How the hell this one ended up on Falling into Infinity and some fantastic songs from the Demos didn't, I'll never understand.
4. Panic Attack
But Octavarium is also not my favourite Dream Theater album and would probably land just right in second-to-last place and with 4 songs from Octavarium on this list, that position is justified from a pessimistic viewpoint. Although this song in particular might be a surprise to some, I don't really see how anyone could exclude this one on their lists of least favourite Dream Theater songs. Like I said on Just Let Me Breathe, we're getting into the territory of songs that I really dislike. While the first 15 songs in this list were still mildly okay for me, the closer we get to #1, the more aversion I have towards the song and it's here when I start really disliking the music. Panic Attack, front to back, is pretty atrocious to me. The intro riff is too generic and boring, the vocal lines (or more like how they sound) are a complete rip-off of Muse once again and the whole instrumental section does nothing to satisfy me, being mindless wankery over repeating, boring riffs. There's nothing to like about this song for me, I'm sorry. This is the first time I'm really bashing a song without being constructive, I think, but that's the way it is I guess.
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Top 3 shouldn't be too hard to figure out by now, if you look into what has been posted before. Here's a full recap of #20 through #4:
20. Through Her Eyes
19. Prophets of War
18. New Millennium
17. Build Me Up, Break Me Down
16. The Count of Tuscany
15. Never Enough
14. Take Away My Pain
13. The Dance of Eternity
12. A Nightmare to Remember
11. The Shattered Fortress
10. I Walk Beside You
9. In The Name of God
8. The Answer Lies Within
7. Repentance
6. The Best of Times
5. Just Let Me Breathe
4. Panic Attack
3. ???
2. ???
1. ???
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I think we're polar opposites, TBOT would be in my top 20 for sure, maybe even top 10.
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Yeah, it's a great song for sure. Not really Top 10 for me though.
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I don't have any problem with these songs being here. Only one I would have higher is TBOT.
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I actually like Panic Attack, though it did take me a couple of years to warm up to it. I can get behind seeing the other two on a least favourite list though. :tup
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I liked Panic Attack from the beginning, though I only rarely listen to it. It's catchy and sounds good, but I tend to forget about copying Muse. Doesn't really add to my well-being there.
The other songs I do kind of agree with. Boring except for a couple of cool parts, in some places no cool parts at all.
I'd place Wither at top 3 though. Only thing I found really, really interesting about was this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJbTyFzqZu0)
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I'd place Wither at top 3 though. Only thing I found really, really interesting about was this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJbTyFzqZu0)
Gangnam Wither is cool, yes! But Wither was at #36 in my top 50 songs, so no, it won't be in the top 3 ;p
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top 3 in the context of this list. So 3 least favorite.
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Just Let Me Breathe definitely deserves this spot. The Best of Times... Probably also deserves it; I have nothing against the lyrics but there seem to be too few musical ideas for the length.
But Panic Attack? That's a good song! IMO, it is a clinic on how to make an excellent heavy and progressive piece of music.
And now you're going to kill me by putting both CM and AROP in the bottom 3, aren't you?
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Panic Attack and JLMB are probably both bottom 5 songs for me too. :tup
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Panic Attack? That's a good song! IMO, it is a clinic on how to make an excellent heavy and progressive piece of music.
This. It's in my top 50.
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I wouldn't put those three as low, but I am pretty indifferent towards them.
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And now you're going to kill me by putting both CM and AROP in the bottom 3, aren't you?
Hey, Constant Motion is cool.
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I wouldn't put Panic Attack on my list, I really do like that song! But TBOT and JLMB are definitely weaker songs, so I would agree with those. Interesting list so far, I look forward to the completion of it!
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I think Panic Attack is a good song, but kind of "meh" at the same time.
I really like The Best of Times, sure it's a sensitive subject but I tend to rate music on more of a musical aspect. How it morphs from upbeat and headbangingly rocking to dramatic, melancholic, and downright depressing is neat to me. I find it to be nice songwriting to be honest. I think the solo is a littllleee overrated (three minutes of the songs main themes and arpeggios, woohoo?) but I like it a lot either way.
And then Just Let Me Breathe is... Bad? I'm indifferent towards it, but it'll probably never see the light of day in any of my lists...
Very excited to see the next 3! :corn
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And now you're going to kill me by putting both CM and AROP in the bottom 3, aren't you?
Hey, Constant Motion is cool.
:tup
That's really the one I cared about; if you put AROP I'll disagree but not be scandalized. But yeah, Constant Motion is way cool; it's fun, energetic and catchy.
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You Not Me, A Rite of Passage, something from WDADU
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Alright, the big finish! Let's end this thing once and for all:
3. Honor Thy Father
To be completely honest, I didn't even know what this song sounded like anymore, so I had to relisten it and doing that reminded me exactly of why I don't like it in the slightest. My main problem here are with the riffs probably made to sound 'heavy' and while they are, they drag on for far too long and then back down for the lyrics, which I think are pretty terrible. Actually, I don't really know how to word my dislike to this song. Sometimes you just have an unexplainable dislike for a song and that's the case with this song. I don't really find anything interesting about this song and that's partly because it sounds a bit.. dull? James's screams here and there are pretty cool though, but then there's the 'crooked step' with a completely random instrumental section taken out of nowhere with the completely random samples over them. I can't stand that part for some reason, again since it drags on for far too long without ever getting interesting in any way. I hoped I could have worded my dislike a little better here, but apparently I can't. Again, it's a song that's dragging far too long on too little material and it doesn't really a climax, but floats around without going anywhere. My least favourite from Train of Thought.
2. A Rite of Passage
And here's song number 5 from Black Clouds & Silver Linings. Oh boy, where do I start on this one? A Rite of Passage has a tendency to turn up more often on least favourite lists, so I'm sure the forum can back me up on this one, but once again, it's something unexplainable that happens. Did DT move away too much from 'being Dream Theater' on this song, or what is it? The verses are pretty boring in particular (with James sounding especially terrible and the voices in the background completely making a mess of everything) and while the chorus has a nice sing-along quality to it, it doesn't really feel finished and is forced upon you instead. Once more Dream Theater tries to make a song that would appeal to 'mainstream' music and loses its roots on it. But then there's the completely wacky bridge and solo section that doesn't make ANY sense whatsoever. In particular the transition back to the chorus at the end seems very, very forced. I didn't like this song when it came out, I didn't like it in context of the album (go figure, if almost the whole album is in this list..), I didn't like it when I heard it live and I still don't like it today. More DT fans are on my side here, but I can't really explain why again, without simply saying 'it's dreadful'. But yeah, I think it is anyway.
1. Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
And here we have it, the biggest surprise of all; my least favourite Dream Theater song. It's probably a surprise to many that I have SDOIT here and while Six Degrees contains many great sections, but ultimately, as a whole, it doesn't make sense. The concept is nice and the diversity is great, but the transitions are forced, the Overture is bland and one of their worst tracks ever and the Grand Final doesn't really pack a punch at all. Where DT really knew how to end an epic on A Change of Seasons or Octavarium, the listener is left wanting more here. All the parts in between range from 'good' to 'very good', but I can't help but feel that Dream Theater forcibly tried to link all of this music simply for the sake of creating a long song. It would have been better off if the individual tracks were expanded upon to make different songs. In a sense I'm very thankful for them splitting this 'song' into different tracks, so I can listen to the different parts as I please, but as a whole, it simply doesn't hold any ground.
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Thanks for following and see you around, if I'm not killed by some insane fan before that :)
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.....
:|
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I bought it. :P
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Me too. :biggrin:
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I don't buy it. And if I do, I'll have to kill you. :P
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You and your little nugget Elite...
Love Six Degrees... Probably Top 5 for me
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Mmhhmm. I'll buy it if you pay me five.
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Mmhhmm. I'll buy it if you pay me five.
Because then you'll have money to buy it, right? :neverusethis:
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As I've said, I disagree with AROP. But Honor Thy Father... I feel like I have to agree at least in ranking if not in actual feelings toward the song. To me, it feels somewhat on the forced side. I've said before that, to me, about half of Train of Thought doesn't really sound like Dream Theater (for good or for bad), and HTF is definitely the biggest contributor to that. And for that one, not really in a good way.
I eagerly await your actual least favorite. ;)
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Totally agreed on AROP and I also agree with what you said about Six Degrees even though it isn't your actual least favorite (and wouldn't be mine, either).
You Not Me or Burning My Soul would be a safe bet, but those might be too predictable :dunno:
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Agree with AROP but I'm one of the few who really likes HTF. Kinda wish you were serious with SDOIT, it's a bottom 5 song for me. Not as bad as burning my soul though, which is my guess for your real #1.
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Nice nuggets there Rich :biggrin:
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I would have used italics. That would have made it really serious to get :D
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Ah, poor Six Degrees :'(
You just didn't understand the complexity of it Elite... :lol :lol :lol
Meme time
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:neverusethis:
1. Burning My Soul
I love troll #1's. I did it with my original top 50 too, where Metropolis Pt. 1 ended in first place (and still remains there). Burning My Soul was my troll #1 there - and this is what I wrote for it back then:
Well, this comes as a surprise. doesn't it? The thing is, I don't get why people actually dislike this song. I really love Falling Into Infinity and this song is the main reason why. it starts with the most awesome bass riff Dream Theater has ever written and the guitar riff that's ripped off from that is equally awesome. When the lyrics start I always get overwhelmed by the immense literacy the guys put into this song, especially with James's screams. BURNING MY SOUL. The robotic voice that echoes the chorus is unique, I've never heard that before and the second verse doesn't disappoint at all, with more of James's screaming. Simply put, simple as a song can be, it can be absolutely awesome, and this is a prime example of that. Derek Sherinian gets even more shine-time, with an awesome keyboard solo that in some way reminds me of Jordan Rudess's work with Dream Theater later on in their career. Perhaps that's why they chose him, because his style is as awesome as the solo on this song, which is awesome as well. The bridge sort of brings it down, but the chorus makes it all up for it. BAAAAHRNING MY SOUL! Seriously, if you haven't been triggered enough to actually appreciate this song, listen to it right now. It's fucking amazing
It doesn't really take a genius to realise that that is all sarcasm in there, but I must say, Derek's keyboard solo is actually awesome and might even make the song worthwhile to listen to, were it not so insanely bad in every other part. This is - and has been - my least favourite DT song for a long time, and I don't see that changing anytime soon.
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And now it's finished properly. Once again thanks for following! :)
P.S.: look closely to last post (some people already figured it out) :biggrin:
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Called it ;D this was a fun list to follow. Thanks Elite!
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Nice one, elite :D Gave me a good laugh with the trick #1
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Thanks for sharing. Ignoring a couple picks, it seems that we share a lot of the same least favorite songs! Burning my Soul, Honor Thy Father, JLMB, Panic Attack are all pretty bad in my book as well :tdwn :tdwn
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I wouldn't call it their worst song but it's not one of my favorites, either. This was a fun list to follow! A lot of unexpected picks, which made it very interesting! Thanks for taking the time to share!
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And thanks everybody for following, that makes it worthwhile to actually share these lists! :)
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I like Burning My Soul quite much. It's pretty natural, 'cause I love industrial and alternative rock music.