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General => Archive => Political and Religious => Topic started by: AndyDT on June 02, 2012, 07:05:29 AM

Title: Church kid's camps
Post by: AndyDT on June 02, 2012, 07:05:29 AM
Anybody any experience of these? I get the idea they are slave labour and no sleep or privacy for a week. What's the motivation for going on them? Also what are the demographics - rich kids, poor kids etc?
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: rumborak on June 02, 2012, 08:43:18 AM
I went to several Catholic Church kids camps when I was young, and they were awesome. We would do scavenger hunts, play baseball, kiss your first girl...
Luckily not much religion shoehorned into it, which made the kids come back next year. And it was a heaven-sent for parents trying to get rid of their kids during summer break. And it was cheap too I think.

rumborak
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: jammindude on June 02, 2012, 09:20:20 AM
....parents trying to get rid of their kids during summer break....


This is just an alien concept to me.  :huh:  :'(
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: hefdaddy42 on June 02, 2012, 09:37:10 AM
Anybody any experience of these?
Not as a camper, but I served as a counselor at a summer kid's camp during the summer for 10 straight years.  It was awesome.

I get the idea they are slave labour and no sleep or privacy for a week.
Slave labor?  WTF?  Where do you get this shit?

What's the motivation for going on them?
See rumby's post.  Lots of fun to be had at these camps.  Fun.  Fun is the motivation.  And growing up a little bit.

Also what are the demographics - rich kids, poor kids etc?
I'm sure this varies somewhat by camp, and there are certainly some that are more exclusive that are targeted at richer families, but most of them service a wide spectrum of demographics.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: El Barto on June 02, 2012, 09:57:07 AM
Same experience as Rumby.  I attended a Summer camp run by the Episcopal dioceses two or three times as a lad.  Typical Summer camp, with almost no religion thrown in.  Brief chapel service each morning,  longer one on Sundays, quick prayer at meal time.  That's about it.  I stopped attending before I was old enough to really enjoy it (the girls, that is), but I recall it being an alright time.  Really, the only thing that makes it a church camp is that the participants tend to all come from the same denomination. 

And like he said, since it's subsidized by the church, it's quite affordable, which makes it an economical way to unload your kids onto somebody else for a week or two.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: kári on June 02, 2012, 10:30:40 AM
I went to several Catholic Church kids camps when I was young, and they were awesome. We would do scavenger hunts, play baseball, kiss your first girl...
Luckily not much religion shoehorned into it, which made the kids come back next year. And it was a heaven-sent for parents trying to get rid of their kids during summer break. And it was cheap too I think.

rumborak
Yup this. There was pretty much no religion involved at all.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: ResultsMayVary on June 02, 2012, 11:48:17 AM
I went to several Catholic Church kids camps when I was young, and they were awesome. We would do scavenger hunts, play baseball, kiss your first girl...
Luckily not much religion shoehorned into it, which made the kids come back next year. And it was a heaven-sent for parents trying to get rid of their kids during summer break. And it was cheap too I think.

rumborak
Couldn't had said it better. I went to two or three summer church camps when I was in high school. Pretty fun experience. I would do it again if school didn't own my life 24/7.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: Dr. DTVT on June 02, 2012, 12:14:50 PM
I get the idea they are slave labour and no sleep or privacy for a week.

 :rollin :rollin

I think Andy meant as a counselor since he's too old to go as a camper.  Most of the counselors when I went to camp were high school or college kids, so if you are as old as I think you are you might be a little out of place.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: senecadawg2 on June 02, 2012, 01:31:00 PM
I think Andy meant as a counselor since he's too old to go as a camper.

Are we sure about this?
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: rumborak on June 02, 2012, 01:48:56 PM
And where can I put my veto in?

rumborak
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: El Barto on June 02, 2012, 03:22:11 PM
Yeah, I assumed it was just a point of curiosity.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: theseoafs on June 02, 2012, 08:22:29 PM
"Now, Billy, I know you think Sarah likes you, but you don't want to seem controlling by asking her out in front of people. Do you want me to get her email address for you?"
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: wolfandwolfandwolf on June 03, 2012, 04:19:43 PM
Protestant church camps are pretty cool when done right for high school students.  Sometimes they can become these big meaningless emotional events where kids think they're experiencing God, but really it's just this powerful/emotional bridge in some Christian pop song, or being away from the "world" for a week to deal with their problems.  It can sometimes hurt more than it helps - kids go to some of these camps, get really hyped up on that particular brand of religion and then come back home and discover that Christianity is nothing like what they experienced at church camp.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: AndyDT on June 03, 2012, 04:42:04 PM
It seems a bit frivolous particularly when it's under the banner of Christianity. Surely the purpose is to bring people a bit closer to God rather than just play around for a week?
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: rumborak on June 03, 2012, 04:57:44 PM
I think the idea is to provide a fun environment to kids, while framing it lightly in a religious environment.
The extent to which you imagine the "proper" one would drive everybody away. Not many people share your view that belief is a tool for self-castigation.

rumborak
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: theseoafs on June 03, 2012, 05:12:14 PM
I've never attended one of these camps, though they probably exist for the same reason Veggietales does: to get the kids out of your hair for a period of time while still making sure they're learning Christian values.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: Adami on June 03, 2012, 05:14:39 PM
It seems a bit frivolous particularly when it's under the banner of Christianity. Surely the purpose is to bring people a bit closer to God rather than just play around for a week?

Andy, do you find it a bit hypocritical that you imply that asceticism is the only actual form of Christianity to follow yet at the same time you own a computer, I assume a home, clothing and have a good amount of money?
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: rumborak on June 03, 2012, 05:18:05 PM
Adami, I believe you mean asceticism.

rumborak
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: Adami on June 03, 2012, 05:20:11 PM
Adami, I believe you mean asceticism.

rumborak

GOD DAMN SPELL CHECK!
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: jammindude on June 03, 2012, 07:28:34 PM
I've never attended one of these camps, though they probably exist for the same reason Veggietales does: to get the kids out of your hair for a period of time while still making sure they're learning Christian values.


 :rollin

Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: El Barto on June 03, 2012, 07:45:09 PM
It seems a bit frivolous particularly when it's under the banner of Christianity. Surely the purpose is to bring people a bit closer to God rather than just play around for a week?
Not really.  Believe it or not, play actually is important.  In the case of my camp it was an excuse to have some fun for a week, and the church aspect of it seemed mostly to keep it within like-minded individuals. 
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: Adami on June 03, 2012, 07:49:19 PM
It seems a bit frivolous particularly when it's under the banner of Christianity. Surely the purpose is to bring people a bit closer to God rather than just play around for a week?
Not really.  Believe it or not, play actually is important.  In the case of my camp it was an excuse to have some fun for a week, and the church aspect of it seemed mostly to keep it within like-minded individuals.

You do realize that Andy considers all form of pleasure to be essentially bad, right?
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: El Barto on June 03, 2012, 10:39:21 PM
It seems a bit frivolous particularly when it's under the banner of Christianity. Surely the purpose is to bring people a bit closer to God rather than just play around for a week?
Not really.  Believe it or not, play actually is important.  In the case of my camp it was an excuse to have some fun for a week, and the church aspect of it seemed mostly to keep it within like-minded individuals.

You do realize that Andy considers all form of pleasure to be essentially bad, right?
Certainly, but I'm still going to answer the question. 

And besides, I'm not sure Andy's completely opposed to the idea of leisure. 
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: theseoafs on June 04, 2012, 01:00:14 AM
I watched the documentary Jesus Camp today. Grim stuff. This sort of thing is likely not what Andy was referring to, but I figured I'd bring it up.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: AndyDT on June 04, 2012, 07:01:38 AM
It seems a bit frivolous particularly when it's under the banner of Christianity. Surely the purpose is to bring people a bit closer to God rather than just play around for a week?
Not really.  Believe it or not, play actually is important.  In the case of my camp it was an excuse to have some fun for a week, and the church aspect of it seemed mostly to keep it within like-minded individuals. 
I'm currently trying to find out why adults do them and ISTR people here saying they'd done them. I can see why parents would or people who went while kids themselves but as part of Christian service surely other ways would be more effective and rewarding?
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: rumborak on June 04, 2012, 07:38:58 AM
There are people who enjoy doing things for others. I doubt they did your theological cost-benefit analysis like you do with everything.

rumborak
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: hefdaddy42 on June 04, 2012, 09:38:33 AM
It seems a bit frivolous particularly when it's under the banner of Christianity. Surely the purpose is to bring people a bit closer to God rather than just play around for a week?
Not really.  Believe it or not, play actually is important.  In the case of my camp it was an excuse to have some fun for a week, and the church aspect of it seemed mostly to keep it within like-minded individuals. 
I'm currently trying to find out why adults do them and ISTR people here saying they'd done them. I can see why parents would or people who went while kids themselves but as part of Christian service surely other ways would be more effective and rewarding?
Effective and rewarding are in the eye of the beholder.  I will just say that different people are called to different forms of service.  When I did it, I was in high school, then in college, then a young single adult.  I enjoyed getting together each summer with my fellow counselors and working with young people and having a positive impact on their lives.  I feel that it was time well spent and was both effective and rewarding.

It doesn't sound like a good fit for you.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: rumborak on June 04, 2012, 09:45:07 AM
That is certain.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: ZBomber on June 05, 2012, 04:44:11 AM
It doesn't sound like a good fit for you.

Great, now we KNOW he is gonna sign up for it.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: PowerSlave on June 05, 2012, 06:21:35 PM
I went to a baptist summer camp when I was 13 or 14. We had a certain amount of daily hell-fire thrown in but, for the most part it was play and activity. We also had an adult councelor assigned to each cabin to make sure that no funny stuff occured despite some our best efforts.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: yeshaberto on June 05, 2012, 06:55:29 PM
Been a counselor at various camps for more than twenty years.   Very fun, very rewarding and more tiring every year.   Made some great friends.   Both of my kids been going since birth.  Look fwd to it every year
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: AndyDT on June 06, 2012, 07:39:26 AM
That is certain.
Why is it certain?
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: kári on June 06, 2012, 07:42:12 AM
Because there probably isn't any internet so you wouldn't be able to post a thread here asking us what to do when someone wants to interact with you.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: AndyDT on June 06, 2012, 07:46:05 AM
There are people who enjoy doing things for others. I doubt they did your theological cost-benefit analysis like you do with everything.

rumborak
What cost benefit analysis? Their benefit according to you is they enjoy it. If they didn't and still did it then they would hopefully have a purpose and if not then they might be doing it out of compliance. The former is essential to my mind and the latter is potentially boundary issues both of which are definite reasons to find out more.

It seems a bit frivolous particularly when it's under the banner of Christianity. Surely the purpose is to bring people a bit closer to God rather than just play around for a week?
Not really.  Believe it or not, play actually is important.  In the case of my camp it was an excuse to have some fun for a week, and the church aspect of it seemed mostly to keep it within like-minded individuals. 
I'm currently trying to find out why adults do them and ISTR people here saying they'd done them. I can see why parents would or people who went while kids themselves but as part of Christian service surely other ways would be more effective and rewarding?
Effective and rewarding are in the eye of the beholder.  I will just say that different people are called to different forms of service. 
That's what I'm thinking. I do serve people directly now but they're from a variety of ages and backgrounds and it's a day at a time.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: eric42434224 on June 06, 2012, 08:41:30 AM
Please dont be a counselor at a camp for children.  They need to enjoy life and live in the moment.  Something I think you are unable to do, much less encourage, and may even (knowingly or unknowingly) discourage.

I'm not joking or kidding.  The last thing a kid needs is to be so serious and over-analyzing about life.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: rumborak on June 06, 2012, 09:30:16 AM
Yeah, seriously. You got so many issues yourself, you would inevitably roll those off onto the kids and other counselors.
Counselors are supposed to be balanced people. You are not balanced, not even remotely.

rumborak
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: AndyDT on June 06, 2012, 03:49:43 PM
Been a counselor at various camps for more than twenty years.   Very fun, very rewarding and more tiring every year.   Made some great friends.   Both of my kids been going since birth.  Look fwd to it every year
That's inspiring Yeshaberto, thanks.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: AndyDT on July 03, 2012, 05:46:33 AM
Anybody any experience of these?
Not as a camper, but I served as a counselor at a summer kid's camp during the summer for 10 straight years.  It was awesome.

I get the idea they are slave labour and no sleep or privacy for a week.
Slave labor?  WTF?  Where do you get this shit?
I'm talking abuot the people who do the cooking. From those I've spoke to it seems to be 12 hour days and you're sleeping on the floor at night. That sounds like slave labour to me.

Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: jsem on July 03, 2012, 06:06:19 AM
How is it? It's voluntary, so it's not slavery.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: Orbert on July 03, 2012, 07:26:50 AM
Wow, I missed this one the first time around.  Amusing, as always.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: hefdaddy42 on July 03, 2012, 09:48:56 AM
The actual cooks at my camp were adults who were on staff with the camp, but they didn't live on site.  They also had teenage kids (too old to be campers anymore) who would work as helpers, and they would assist at meal time, and other tasks as needed around the camp.  They earned a weekly wage and slept in special quarters, not on the floor.  They also had lots of downtime, so it was a great gig for a teenager looking for a summer job.
Title: Re: Church kid's camps
Post by: Implode on July 03, 2012, 10:01:41 AM
I never went to a camp, but I went on Kairos (a Catholic retreat). It had a some religious focus, but it seemed like the entire point of it was to stop kids from being assholes, and in that weekend, it worked. It really made me more optimistic for humanity even though I am no longer religious.

Of course Kairos still has that bit of "cult" feel.  :lol