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General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: Orbert on May 30, 2012, 12:10:22 PM
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One album per week, or however long discussion seems to be productive. Live and studio albums, and some compilations. Chronological, starting with
Yes (1969)
(https://imgur.com/qstpLIp.jpg) (https://imgur.com/cukKxG8.jpg)
Original cover art on the left, U.S. release on the right.
Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Peter Banks - Guitar, Vocals
Bill Bruford - Drums
Tony Kaye - Keyboards
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
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In 1969, most rock and roll was for parties and dancing, but some bands had started making rock music for actual listening. The beginnings of what would become "art rock" and later "progressive rock" came about when musicians got tired of playing three-minute, three-chord songs with a catchy beat and nice vocal harmonies.
Yes therefore started making five- or six- or seven-minute songs with several chords, catchy beats, and nice vocal harmonies. From the opening notes, it is clear that you aren't supposed to dance to this music, you are supposed to listen to it. That's not to say that it wasn't catchy, or at least easily accessible. Early Yes was not as indulgent as it would become in the 70's, but many elements of their sound were already in place. Instrumental intros which had nothing to do with the song proper, extended jams, and of course the classic Yes harmonies. It is an impressive debut album, especially considering the year of release.
The first album features six originals and two covers (The Byrds and The Beatles). An early Yes trademark was taking a song by another band and going crazy with it, changing the key and/or time signature, and adding extended instrumental sections. The two covers are among the longer tracks on this album.
Yes saw themselves as taking The Beatles one step further. They wanted to have three-part harmonies (the entire opening song is sung in three-part harmony) but wanted to get more adventurous musically. They succeeded.
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I know we have a Yes thread going somewhere, but Yes is my favorite band, and I'd like to get some more in-depth discussion going on each album. Let's see what happens.
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Great idea! :tup :tup
Honestly, I have never owned this album (I had a CD that was a combo of the first two), but I heard it at a friend's a few times a long time ago. It was always interesting, but never grabbed me enough to make me want to go out and buy it. Survival is a helluva tune, however; definitely my favorite from the first album.
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Raw Yes, their earliest of early days, and definitely a good outing for a debut. It's a shame that "Something's Coming" didn't make the cut because their cover of it is truly one of their best covers (I'd rank it as good as "America" to be honest).
Surprisingly enough, among many classic prog-band debuts, this is probably one of my favorites (next to Kansas perhaps, and of course King Crimson). There were many foundations for what would be key Yes sounds laid here, including Squire's amazing bass work and the signature Squire/Anderson harmonies. We also get a glimpse of a young Bill Bruford, who, even at this age, was a great and unique drummer. He definitely set himself apart from others out there. Then of course there's Tony Kaye's powerful organ sound, which drove much of the music in the band's first three albums.
I think I'll give this album a couple spins sometime tonight or tomorrow. It's a good one, and if you don't have this album yet, definitely seek out the Rhino Re-issue that includes demos/early versions and the B-Side "Something's Coming".
-Marc.
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Definatly a topic worthy of it's own thread. I'll be chiming in starting with the next album, and going through the Ladder, haven't given this one a whole lot of listens to be honest.
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I think I'll give this album a couple spins sometime tonight or tomorrow. It's a good one, and if you don't have this album yet, definitely seek out the Rhino Re-issue that includes demos/early versions and the B-Side "Something's Coming".
That is good. Everyone should hear their version of "Something's Coming". I never knew it existed until YesYears, and it blew my mind. Also, "West Side Story" is one of my favorite musicals, so that probably helped.
I'll be chiming in starting with the next album, and going through the Ladder, haven't given this one a whole lot of listens to be honest.
Spin it once or twice in the next few days, and chime in. I know these early ones won't get as much traffic, but I'd still like to hear from anyone who has them and/or has heard them.
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I'll try to get to it, got quite a listening agenda and I don't own that one.
Edit:fix'd, own it and listening, been a looooong time since I heard this stuff, will chime in with opinions later.
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A nice debut. It's a little rough around the edges in places, but it has a youthful enthusiasm that's fun. I like it better than Time and a Word. Cool songs: Beyond and Before, Looking Around, Harold Land.
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The one thing I noticed immediatly and was reminded of was how the base spirituality of their music was all ready taking hold. It is always one of my favorite aspects of Yes, they are guides to how I want to feel and be, and have been for a long time. That beauty they want to approach and touch is apparent this early.
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Anderson has always been a very spiritual person, and yeah, it comes through here and in pretty much everything he does. It's been said that the very name of the band was chosen to represent their positive attitude about life and music.
I listened to the first album twice prior to my initial post, and have listened to it again since then, and I'm reminded what a great keyboard player Tony Kaye is, and what a great guitarist Peter Banks is. They both were overshadowed so early and so much by Wakeman and Howe that they're often forgotten, but Kaye's early Hammond work is impressive, and Banks is actually something like a pre-Howe in his style and approach, if that makes any sense.
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Banks does remind me of Howe in some ways. I guess that's one reason they picked Howe.
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I love the first two Yes albums. I think Tony Kaye might be my favorite on this. I think the early work was his best work in the band.
Favorite tracks are Beyond and Before, I See You, Harold Land, Sweetness and of course Survival. Aside from the BBC sessions, I don't think much is available live from this period.
I've always thought these first two were largely forgotten, but I listen to them as much as I do the rest of it.
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I've always thought these first two were largely forgotten, but I listen to them as much as I do the rest of it.
:tup
Back in the cassette and vinyl days, I always found two albums that "went together" in some way and put one on each side of a C-90 cassette tape. I could take them with me in the car or on my Walkman clone (I don't think I ever owned an actual Walkman, but went through a series of portable tape players). This also saved the vinyl for "special occassions".
The downside was that I didn't always know the names of all the songs, and didn't always have time to study the liner notes. It was years before I realized that "Every Little Thing" was a cover, as I was a Yes fan long before I was a Beatles fan. It was years after that that I learned that "I See You" was also a cover. I picked up the first two albums one day, at the same time, copied them to tape, and put the vinyl on the shelf. I may have read the back covers of each once or twice each, in over 30 years.
I love the way Yes cover songs. They totally own them, make them their own.
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Outside the run from TYA to Drama this my favourite Yes album, and I prefer it as a whole to both Tormato and Tales.
A very, very impressive debut that was a portent of things to come. Squire's bass is awesome and Bruford's work must have been a revelation at the time. As others have already posted Kaye and Banks have both been overshadowed over the years by Howe and Wakeman, but their contributions here are first class. Anderson's vocals must have dropped a few jaws at the times and the vocal harmonies were also as good as any of their early contemporaries. The trademark intros. are also present on several tracks.
While Survival is a great track, my favourite is Harold Land: one of the most poignant and beautiful tracks about the loss of one man's innocence through war ever.
A terrific album that is now often overlooked as a result of what followed only a few years later. :hefdaddy
Great idea for a thread BTW :tup
I'm onboard for the long haul.
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Not a bad album as such and hinting at the greatness that was to come. But i seldom listen to it. I discovered yes with the 90125 album and then went backwards in their discography. In comparison to Close to the edge, Fragile, The Yes album etc. this album to me feels like they were not yet sure in which direction they want to go or that they had not fully lived up to their potential. Nonetheless the covers are great because they turned the original songs around and made them completely their songs.
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I own every Yes studio album from the debut through Big Generator, so I'll be around this discussion for a while. As for this album...it's definitely the foundation of Yes, but to me it really only hints at their future. There are things that are there that become part of Yes, but not quite properly cooked,if you know what I mean. More like broad hints rather than the more direct pointing to the future that you got from the second album. It's a fun album, but I rarely play it-usually when I get in my Yes mode, I start at The Yes Album.
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Getting into Yes in the late 70's I had to back track to their early albums and the Yes album seemed a million years different then the other Yes albums I owned and like Rush's debut, I don't spin them much.
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I've always thought these first two were largely forgotten, but I listen to them as much as I do the rest of it.
:tup
Back in the cassette and vinyl days, I always found two albums that "went together" in some way and put one on each side of a C-90 cassette tape. I could take them with me in the car or on my Walkman clone (I don't think I ever owned an actual Walkman, but went through a series of portable tape players). This also saved the vinyl for "special occassions".
The downside was that I didn't always know the names of all the songs, and didn't always have time to study the liner notes. It was years before I realized that "Every Little Thing" was a cover, as I was a Yes fan long before I was a Beatles fan. It was years after that that I learned that "I See You" was also a cover. I picked up the first two albums one day, at the same time, copied them to tape, and put the vinyl on the shelf. I may have read the back covers of each once or twice each, in over 30 years.
I love the way Yes cover songs. They totally own them, make them their own.
I didn't realize those were cover songs either. I'd recorded them from my friend's record collection and really didn't start to listen to them more frequently until i got the CDs myself.
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Time and a Word (1970)
(https://imgur.com/GQGHSjw.jpg) (https://imgur.com/VhbE6aC.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Peter Banks - Guitar, Vocals
Bill Bruford - Drums
Tony Kaye - Keyboards
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
The original cover art is on the left. There was some issue with having nudity on the cover (it had been done before, but not everyone was okay with it) so the label asked for a new cover with a group picture. Peter Banks had left the band by then, and all the new promo pictures had Steve Howe in them. They went ahead and put one of the newer pictures on the cover, so Steve Howe is on the album cover even though he didn't play on the album. Steve even looks a bit uncertain as to whether or not he should actually be there.
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As with the first album, this album consisted of eight tracks, two of which are covers. The album opens with a Tony Kaye fanfare on the Hammond organ, then an orchestra comes in and we are launched into a completely otherworldly cover of Richie Havens' "No Opportunity Necessary, No Experience Needed". Once again, Yes has taken a song and completely owned it, and this time taken it a few steps further by adding an orchestra and using the results to open their new album.
This is Yes' least successful album in terms of sales, and certainly not one of their most popular, but in its own way, it is one of their most ambitious, and I give them points for that. As mentioned upthread, the first two albums tend to be overlooked by many Yes fans and prog fans in general because Yes were still finding their feet, Steve Howe hadn't joined the band yet, etc., but the real culprit IMO is that the songs just aren't as strong as on the first album, and the use of an orchestra is very effective in some places but in others (sometimes within the same song) the editing is done poorly and is cringeworthy.
Still, I like this album. I first bought it back in junior high when anything was still possible, musically, and I thought the use of an orchestra was awesome. And as mentioned, it is used very well sometimes, adding a dimension to the songs that keyboards or guitars cannot. After all, singer/songwriters use strings and horns and whatever else they want on their albums, whatever serves the song; why can't bands do the same thing? The orchestra only appears on about half the songs (I've never actually counted) and sometimes quite sparingly, so it's not like it's all over the place, obliterating the original arrangements a la The Beatles Let It Be. It is usually there complimenting the music quite well, even echoing parts played by the guitar or doubling Hammond parts and such, to great effect.
The album continues Yes' tendency to sing about unusual people ("Astral Traveller", something of a precursor to "Starship Trooper", and "The Prophet") and idealized worlds ("Then", "Time and a Word"). It also shows them further developing their songwriting craft, with instrumentals and odd changes, sometimes not quite getting it right, but again, I have to admire the effort.
Peter Banks left the band shortly after recording was completed. Whether he quit or was fired seems to depend upon whom you ask, but in interviews, he makes it pretty clear that he's not happy about it, and would preferred to stay with the band. And as much as Steve Howe is considered a step forward in the band's sound and playing, Banks is a fine guitarist and his contributions to Yes should not be undervalued. Yes would not have continued without such a strong start, and Banks was certainly a part of that.
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Fantastic write up!!!! As with the first album, I'm gonna have to give this one a spin too, though I can say the title track is, to me, one of their most beautiful songs, right up there with Turn of the Century and Wondrous Stories.
Are we going to have a week for Yessongs? It certainly deserves one.
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Thanks. Yeah, I think so. I'm already thinking ahead to what I'll say about the various albums, and there's a lot going on with Yessongs.
Yeah, the title track is very nice, a favorite for sure. The only thing that keeps it from being top tier for me is that one weird chord, behind the word "perspective". It dips minor when an inverted seventh would've worked better. It's a Jon Anderson song, and Jon is a gifted songwriter but not a great guitarist or musician in that sense. There are stories of him presenting songs to the band, and Steve Howe would change some of the chords to things that worked better. That's part of why so many great Yessongs were written by Anderson/Howe. Jon mostly wrote the songs, and Steve would "fix them up". But this of course is before Steve joined the band, so the original chords stand. It's not like that one chord totally ruins the song, but I'm anal about stuff like that, and I cringe every time I hear it. The chorus, however, is beautiful.
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Time and a Word is kind of a weird album, but it has some neat stuff. Astral Traveller really hints at things to come in the band's style. The title track is my favorite on the album.
PS, Squire sure does rock on the bass. Such a unique and influential musician. Not many other bands at the time featured bass in such a prominent role.
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I love how this starts. I really really dig Tony Kaye's work on the first three albums.
I'd agree that it might be slightly weaker overall of the two although "No Opportunity Necessary, No Experience Needed" and "Time and A Word" are top two of those first two albums.
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This album is a bit unusual to me, but there are a few good tunes on here, although I'm more inclined to spin the first album than I am this one. The highlights definitely are "Astral Traveler", "The Prophet" and the title track. There's also the extremely catchy B-Side "Dear Father", featured on the Rhino Re-Issue, although I can see why it was not included on the album.
This was a good album, and compliments the first one quite well, but better things happen even on the following album.
-Marc.
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I have the same feelings towards this album than towards the first one, though in comparison I find Time And A Word a little weaker without being able to tell exactly why. You can hear that they have potential and there are some nice songs but overall it's not yet the classic yes.
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Pretty much agree with everything that's already been said. A very decent album that further hints at what is soon to follow. Underappreciated by many casual Yes fans. As we discussed in the Battle of the Bands thread there is a real parallel here with the formative Genesis albums: The first two by each band give some strong hints of what is to follow, while also representing bands still finding their musical feet so to speak. The albums are also tend to be overlooked and underappreciated by many fans. I rate TaaW on a par with Trespass jsut as I rate the debuts on a par with each other.
Favourite tracks: Astral Traveller and The Prophet.
For what it's worth I have the vinyl album with the original cover art. Still in near perfect condition. Not bad considering I bought it new back in about 1980 and have played it many times since then. Interesting point is I bought it new at that time so Atlantic were still using the original cover art in Australia, 10 years after the albums release.
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I was gonna say that maybe it was only the U.S. that the cover art had to be changed, but that doesn't make sense either, because the first two albums were only originally released in the U.K. Maybe when the finally did release it in the U.S., they went with the new cover.
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Could be the latter possibility Orbert is the most likely explanation as there several other examples of US releases having completely different covers to the rest of the world.
Gentle Giant's Octopus, ACDCs Dirty Deeds... and Camel's mirage are some examples that immediately spring to mind. Mirage was all down to copyright issues with the design very closely resembling Camel cigarettes. In fact I don't know how Decca mangaged to get away with that anywhere. Not sure of the reasons for the other two.
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Ha ha, speaking of Gentle Giant's Octopus, the original "red octopus" art is by Roger Dean, who would later become best known for doing album art for Yes.
(https://imgur.com/Q4etbJu.jpg)
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While we're on the subject of alternate album covers, I blew it. I completely forgot that both of the first two Yes albums had different covers in the U.K. versus the U.S., not just the second album. I've updated the initial post in this thread to include both covers, and included them here as well for purposes of discussion.
Both of the first two albums were originally only released in the U.K., and even though times were different and bands generally were given more latitude in what they could do, record labels still ultimately would prefer to sell albums and make money, so for the U.S. release, a different cover was created. Album covers with the pictures of the band were and still are very common, even cliché, but there's a good reason for that. A lot of people like to know what the band looks like. Bands that have been around for a while can afford to put some nice artwork on the front, maybe put pictures of the band on the back, but when you're first starting out, it's generally a good idea to give people a visual to work with.
(https://imgur.com/qstpLIp.jpg) (https://imgur.com/cukKxG8.jpg)
The original Yes album just had a speech bubble saying "Yes" on both the front and back covers. The album did not sell particularly well, and while that is at least partly because it was different, ambitious music that didn't fit neatly into any genre, it's also at least partly because no one had idea any who or what "Yes" was. But put a picture of the band on the front, and at the very least, some people might buy it because they look cool or whatever. Yes was very different, and wanted to be different in their approach, and while it's great to want the music to speak for itself, you still have to sell albums for that to happen (at least you did in 1969). In this case, I think it was a good move to go with the U.S. cover.
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But put a picture of the band on the front, and at the very least, some people might buy it because they look cool or whatever.
And man, do they look cool on that cover! ;)
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The wink seems to be implying sarcasm, but in 1969, that was a cool group picture.
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That gatefold vinyl of Octopus is one of my most desired albums to get. (Caravan's In the Land of Grey and Pink is another) I only have the cd version of Octopus with the alternate US cover (Octopus in the jar). The Roger Dean cover is way cooler IMO. Speaking of RD, he came out to Australia when Yes toured in 2003 (Full Circle Tour) and waas at the Yesfanz function in Sydney. As I had flown over from Perth (like flying from LA to NY for a show I suppose) I didn't take any vinyl covers with me, only some CD books and a Full Circle Tour poster. I got CTTE, the poster and Uriah Heep's Demons and Wizardsd sigend by the man himself. The poster, ticket stub and a couple of Yes postcards I had framed. One day I'll get around to posting a pic. Looking back I wish I had taken a few vinyl covers with me as well as Greenslade's Bedside manners are extra. I would love to have gotten Drama and Asia's Alpha signed. Two of my favourite RD covers. Relayer and Tales are right up there as well. Roger Dean was really patient at the signing and signed pretty much everything people had brought along. Foolish me though only had taken three items thinking it would be limited to about that. :facepalm: Still you never know hat to expect at these sort of things and the signing was just before the concert, so there's the question of what to do with the stuff while the show's on.
Man I'm enjoying this thread Orbert - bringing back some really cool memories. :tup
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Thanks, that's what it's all about.
I don't think I've mentioned yet how totally smokin' Bill Bruford is on this album. When you've got a guitarist, keyboardist, and a bassist wailing away, it takes some serious discipline* at the drumkit to keep things from getting completely out of hand and just sounding like noise. Not only does Bill hold everything together, and quite well at that, but he's also adding all those little fills and frills that he's known for now, and this was his first band.
I can't emphasize this enough for you fans of later Yes. Give the first two albums a good, honest listen. Yes was out of the chute firing on all eight cylinders. Or if it helps, put your mindset firmly in the late 60's (The Turtles, The Beach Boys, Donovan) and imagine what kind of impact this band must have made on unsuspecting teenagers.
*heh heh
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i pretty much dont know it at all, save for the opening track, but i was checking out time and a word last night.
i think i always just assumed the band took off with steve howe joining and never bothered to get into checking out the first two albums. not only was i pleasantly surprised last night, but i realized the band didnt sound that much different than on the couple of big time albums that followed.
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True. Steve Howe joined on the third album, and Rick Wakeman on the fourth, but in many ways, the die was already set with these first two albums.
Chris Squire was already a beast on the bass, doing things that literally no one else was doing as far as bass playing is concerned. Bill Bruford was a master of the drumkit, Jon Anderson's voice was unique, and the three-part harmonies were sweet. Howe doesn't have the greatest voice, but it blends nicely with Anderson and Squire and in the same way as Peter Banks' voice did. And they had already showed a penchant for instrumental excursions featuring both guitar and keyboards. So The Yes Album is a natural progression from the first two, and the difference is not as extreme as some might think.
For an interesting experiment, check out the first album by Flash (which I was going to talk a little about in the next installment, but here is as good a place as any). Flash was the band that Peter Banks put together after leaving Yes, and Tony Kaye was the keyboard player on the first album. The sound is quite similar to the first two Yes albums, for obvious reasons, although I'd say that the vocals and overall songwriting aren't as strong.
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True. Steve Howe joined on the third album, and Rick Wakeman on the fourth, but in many ways, the die was already set with these first two albums.
Chris Squire was already a beast on the bass, doing things that literally no one else was doing as far as bass playing is concerned. Bill Bruford was a master of the drumkit, Jon Anderson's voice was unique, and the three-part harmonies were sweet. Howe doesn't have the greatest voice, but it blends nicely with Anderson and Squire and in the same way as Peter Banks' voice did. And they had already showed a penchant for instrumental excursions featuring both guitar and keyboards. So The Yes Album is a natural progression from the first two, and the difference is not as extreme as some might think.
For an interesting experiment, check out the first album by Flash (which I was going to talk a little about in the next installment, but here is as good a place as any). Flash was the band that Peter Banks put together after leaving Yes, and Tony Kaye was the keyboard player on the first album. The sound is quite similar to the first two Yes albums, for obvious reasons, although I'd say that the vocals and overall songwriting aren't as strong.
Never picked up Flash. I've got a few Peter Banks solo albums, but not that one.
The other thing about those first two albums...they remind me a bit of early Pink Floyd, maybe a little more grounded, but that was the thing back then. Even The Nice had a touch or two of that at times.
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Time and a Word, moreso than the first album, is where you can see them "becoming" Yes, though it took the arrival of Steve Howe and Rick Wakeman for them to become the Yes we know today. The fact that the title track for this album fits neatly on the live album Yessongs is all you need to consider for how the band Yes became was always there, it just took a while to show fully.
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"Time and a Word" appeared on Yesshows, the second live album, not Yessongs, but your point is well taken. Yes has always had a "regular short songs" side to them; it just got lost for a little while there in the 70's.
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I love Time and a Word. Very underrated album. :)
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Come on Obert! Let's get to an album I've heard!
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Almost there. I know that the first two aren't as well-known, but some people only check the boards every couple of days or so, and we did get a new comment this morning. Maybe over the weekend.
(And it's Orbert. Two R's, just not next to each other.)
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Orbert has had the tiger avatar for years now. I propose we start calling him Grrbert.
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Almost there. I know that the first two aren't as well-known, but some people only check the boards every couple of days or so, and we did get a new comment this morning. Maybe over the weekend.
(And it's Orbert. Two R's, just not next to each other.)
Are we moving on to The Yes Album next? I know it was released next, chronologically, but if we're throwing in EVERYTHING, based on recorded performances, the live album/compilation Beyond And Before would come next as it chronicles live versions of songs from the band's first two albums. It's an interesting listen and a great look in to what the band sounded like live for their first couple years/albums/tours.
-Marc.
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"Time and a Word" appeared on Yesshows, the second live album, not Yessongs, but your point is well taken. Yes has always had a "regular short songs" side to them; it just got lost for a little while there in the 70's.
I always get those two mixed up, and what's worse is I own them both. :lol
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I never picked up Beyond and Before so no, it won't be covered. In fact, I'd completely forgotten that it existed, as it came later and I don't know if it's considered an official release.
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(And it's Orbert. Two R's, just not next to each other.)
My mistake. Won't happen again, sir. :blush
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Almost there. I know that the first two aren't as well-known, but some people only check the boards every couple of days or so, and we did get a new comment this morning. Maybe over the weekend.
(And it's Orbert. Two R's, just not next to each other.)
Are we moving on to The Yes Album next? I know it was released next, chronologically, but if we're throwing in EVERYTHING, based on recorded performances, the live album/compilation Beyond And Before would come next as it chronicles live versions of songs from the band's first two albums. It's an interesting listen and a great look in to what the band sounded like live for their first couple years/albums/tours.
-Marc.
I think Beyond and Before is the BBC Sessions from that period. It's been released under a number of different names such as The Millenium Collection, which is the 2CD set I have. It's been a while since I've put it on because the fidelity really isn't up to snuff.
I'm not sure you could even call it "official," but it's a fairly good document for those that are curious about what Peter Banks brought to the band live in those days.
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Orbert, though my passion for Yes is probably equal to yours, I don't have a fraction of your knowledge behind the music, and just want to thank you for your insight, it's just plain awesome to learn so much more about my favorite band. That goes for you other guys too, music theory and history were never my wrongdoings, and I appreciate the education.
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You're welcome. I'm just glad I can contribute something to this forum. I was digging the Rush Song of the Day thread, and all the discussions about the individual songs, and I've been listening to Genesis almost as long, and have been trying to stir up some more in-depth talks during the survivor, but that format really isn't conducive to really deep analysis.
So I tried to think of a band I could do something for, a band I knew a lot about and have been listening to for a long time, and could blab about and hopefully stir up some good conversation, but I came up empty for quite a while. Then one day I looked at my signature.
:facepalm:
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(And it's Orbert. Two R's, just not next to each other.)
My mistake. Won't happen again, sir. :blush
Okay then.
Actually, it's not an uncommon mistake. I've seen it mistyped as "Obert" probably half a dozen times. Over a period of several years, but still, it's about the only misspelling I've ever seen, so it's stuck with me. Weird.
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The Yes Album (1971)
(https://imgur.com/3zZfpzW.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Bill Bruford - Drums
Steve Howe - Guitar, Vocals
Tony Kaye - Keyboards
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
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The Yes Album was not the first album by Yes, but it was the first one released in the U.S., and its title could easily be that of a debut album, a clever alternative to the standard eponymous release. It was also the first album to have a song break into the U.S. charts ("I've Seen All Good People"), and most important to many, this is the first album with Steve Howe on guitar. And finally, it is the first Yes album to contain all original material; no covers. It is generally considered the first album in the classic 70's main sequence.
Thus far, I've tried to somewhat downplay the significance of Steve Howe joining the band, partly because IMO Peter Banks is a very underrated guitarist and did an excellent job on the first two albums, and partly because I feel a bit sorry for anyone who is kicked out of a band on the verge of superstardom. Yes claims that the split was amicable, or even that Banks quit; Banks says he was fired.
The biggest change that came with this album wasn't the sound so much as it was the songwriting and playing. We still have a lot of instrumental excursions between verses and elsewhere throughout the songs, but they are more sophisticated. Guitar, keyboards, bass, and drums are all very strong and each given their moments to shine, as before. The three-part harmonies are still present, with Howe providing the low tenor harmony as Banks used to do. The difference is the songs themselves. The songs on this album show both greater ambition and greater maturity than those on the first two albums.
Side One opens with "Yours Is No Disgrace" which at nine and one-half minutes was the longest Yessong to date. In a way, it starts similarly to how the previous album starts; with a fanfare. This time, however, its a tutti fanfare from Mr. Howe with Mr. Squire and Mr. Bruford, and they are joined by Mr. Kaye providing contrast on his blazing Hammond Organ. "Yours Is No Disgrace" goes through many changes, but keeps returning to the same theme, the same verse and chorus, so it never feels like a song artificially padded by long solos, or composed of shorter bits pieced together. It's a song that just happens to be pretty long and have a lot of changes, and it was to become a Yes concert staple for years to come.
We are then treated to the first of what would eventually become many acoustic guitar solos from Steve Howe. I think it says something when you're the new guitarist in a band, and they let you have an acoustic solo, even placing it second on the album. The tune was named "Clap" by Steve Howe, but the recording is live and you can hear it being introduced as "The Clap" by Jon Anderson, and it is also titled that way on the album. I guess if you're the new guitarist and they let you have an acoustic solo, you take it, and you don't complain that they got the name wrong. Side One concludes with "Starship Trooper", another nine-and-a-half minute song, this time a three-part suite and another fan favorite.
Side Two opens with "I've Seen All Good People", a two-part suite consisting of "Your Move" and "All Good People" and as mentioned, the first song to break into the U.S. charts. The album is rounded out with "A Venture", a short song by Anderson which opens and closes with piano solos by Tony Kaye, and "Perpetual Change", another longish song (just under nine minutes) and whose title would become something of a joke mantra for the band itself, among some fans. Yes has released 20 studio albums over the course of 40 years, but have never gone more than two consecutive albums without a personnel change. Almost prophetically, this album was their first change, and contains the song "Perpetual Change".
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Flash (1972)
(https://imgur.com/87fnnmA.jpg)
After The Yes Album, Tony Kaye would leave Yes for over a decade, and join a new band being formed by former Yesman Peter Banks. The debut album of the band Flash is somewhat more progressive than Time and a Word, consisting of only five songs, three of which are nine minutes or longer, and the instrumental work is strong, resembling early Yes for obvious reasons. In terms of "progressivity", it is about comparable to The Yes Album. I encourage fans of early Yes to check out this excellent first album by something of a Yes offshoot.
Tony Kaye left Flash after the first album, and they did not replace him, although Peter Banks did play some keyboards on the second album, In the Can. It is not as strong as the debut album, and IMO the third album was weaker still, so basically I'm not going to follow Flash anymore in this discography.
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I first off have to say that the next four albums, especially Yessongs, defined my musical life.
I had four older brothers, the oldest 9 years my senior. When I was six or seven, he was a Dj at his HS radio station, and was spinning this one and the others constantly. Even at that young age, I was in love, and would listen to nothing else till about age ten or so when I discovered bands like The Who, The Kinks, Rush, and Triumph, but up to that point, it was all about Yes.
The four big songs, All Good People, Perpetual Change, Starship Trooper, and Yours is no Disgrace, have been the soundtrack of my life, have dictated my base philosophy, and have helped shape my spirituality, I really can't put into words what these songs mean to me, especially Your Move/All Good People and Perpetual Change, I live and breathe still today by what I learned from those pieces at such a young age. As you can imagine, with this type of start in music, my standards were high, and it took me a long time to realize that all bands weren't going to be that good, that I had been given the golden ticket on my first go round.
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And with the arrival of Steve Howe, Yes truly begins to BECOME Yes. Wakeman and White are still to come-and really, White tends to be criminally overlooked by some prog heads because he's not Bruford-but this is the first album you could point at and really say "This is Yes." A quantum leap forward from the previous album yet still being recognizably the same band. While I think Banks is a great guitarist, I simply can't overlook the arrival of Howe in terms of what it meant to the band. Much like the arrival of Jordan Rudess did for DT, Howe's arrival kicked the rest of the band into high gear. Amazing album, which I actually prefer to Fragile in terms of the main sequence albums-nothing's touching Close to the Edge, man. Nothing. The Yes Album is one of the most essential albums in prog rock history.
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I have maintained for the longest time that The Yes Album is their 2nd best 70s album (behind only Close to the Edge). And I still feel that way. It has that perfect blend of rock and prog, without ever going overboard into either (unlike Tales..., for example).
Starship Trooper is still a top 3 Yes song for me. :hat
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My second favorite Yes album. It has such a positive energy to it. Starship Trooper is just amazing, especially the Würm section, which culminates with one of Steve Howe's best guitar solos. Yours is No Disgrace is another of my top Yes tracks.
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Here is where the magic really begins. Great album
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Listened to it today for the first time in ages. Man I forgot how good that album was.
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Yes continued to grow stronger as they entered the 70's. People have different favorites and differing opinions on which is the best or strongest or "most prog" (none of which are necessarily the same thing) album, but pretty much everyone agrees that starting with The Yes Album, things really took off. Songs got longer, and instrumental pyrotechnics continued to develop. Neither of these factors will necessarily make a song or an album "better", but in the case of Yes, it played to their strengths. They were quite comfortable with longer compositions which gave them time to develop an idea, or just take it and run, and they had a lot of musical talent in the band, so those instrumental sections could be quite complex. They were written and arranged instrumentals at least as often as they were "regular" solos with the rest of the band serving as backup.
As mentioned in the OP, there was a growing subgenre of rock music meant not for dancing, but for listening. And if you're going to just sit and listen to the music, there's only so many extra-long guitar solos you can bear, so the scored instrumentals performed with bona fide virtuosity became a hallmark of "art rock". Some called it pretentious. After all, this isn't classical music; it's only rock and roll (but I like it).
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I guess if you held a gun to my head, this would be my favorite Yes album ever. I don't think it ever gets better than this. (I'd choose this over Fragile any day of the week.)
Again, it's Tony Kaye who is one of the major stars on this. For me it's almost as it Tony Kaye is a completely different person than he would be when he returned a decade later. There's a chemistry here that has never been equaled although it comes close a bunch of times.
Maybe it's the Hammond B fetish I have.
I love the innocence of the whole thing, like they really didn't know what they were doing, but it was very honest if not majestic.
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I think that that's a large part of it. They were young and full of energy and ideas, and there was no sense of "you can't do that". They kept pushing and pushing, and in the early 70's, you could actually do that.
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This was my first Yes album and it didn't blow me away initially. However, time has shown how good this album actually is, and now it stands among my favorites. Starship trooper is one of their better crafted songs, Perpetual change and Yours is no disgrace are indisputable prog classics, and songs like I've seen all good people just make me happy. It was a sign of good things to come and it laid the foundation for the masterpieces that followed.
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I guess if you held a gun to my head, this would be my favorite Yes album ever. I don't think it ever gets better than this. (I'd choose this over Fragile any day of the week.)
Again, it's Tony Kaye who is one of the major stars on this. For me it's almost as it Tony Kaye is a completely different person than he would be when he returned a decade later. There's a chemistry here that has never been equaled although it comes close a bunch of times.
Maybe it's the Hammond B fetish I have.
I love the innocence of the whole thing, like they really didn't know what they were doing, but it was very honest if not majestic.
Yeah, I don't know what happened to Tony Kaye. Even when I saw Yes in 1994, his playing was a bit subdued, and Rabin even handled some of the keyboard duties, on the Talk album and on the tour.
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Yes in the 80's and early 90's was little more than Trevor Rabin's backup band. I'll get into the history of that when we get to 90125, but basically, Rabin played most of the keyboards on the Yes albums he wrote, even if it said Tony Kaye in the credits. Rabin's primary concern was getting his music out there, and was willing to play whatever game the label asked him to play. There's a weird kind of artistic integrity there that I've never fully unravelled, but it included putting "Yes" on the cover when he wanted the band to be called something else, and giving keyboard credits to Kaye even though Kaye barely played.
In the live situation, Kaye was asked to play keyboard parts that he didn't write and had never actually played before, and he wasn't really comfortable with that, but a gig's a gig, as they say in the biz, so he did it. With the help of some extensive programming and even a "phantom" keyboard player offstage. Why didn't Kaye actually learn the parts and play them himself? You'd have to ask him that.
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Yes in the 80's and early 90's was little more than Trevor Rabin's backup band.
I hear a lot of Squire and Anderson influence on 90125 and Big Generator. Talk was pretty Rabin-centric, though.
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90125 was almost completely written by time Anderson came on board, but he insisted on rewriting some of the lyrics if he was going to sing them. Squire was involved from the outset, so yeah, his mark is there. He and White formed the original core of the band, along with Rabin. Big Generator was more of an actual collaboration, but it was still very much Rabin's band. Anderson was not used to sharing control of the band "he" created, and the resulting tensions led to the breakup of that lineup, and the fact that it took several years to even make the album. Squire was there the whole time, but he's a much more laid-back guy and just wanted to make music. Squire is the only person to appear on every Yes album.
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90125 was almost completely written by time Anderson came on board, but he insisted on rewriting some of the lyrics if he was going to sing them. Squire was involved from the outset, so yeah, his mark is there. He and White formed the original core of the band, along with Rabin. Big Generator was more of an actual collaboration, but it was still very much Rabin's band. Anderson was not used to sharing control of the band "he" created, and the resulting tensions led to the breakup of that lineup, and the fact that it took several years to even make the album. Squire was there the whole time, but he's a much more laid-back guy and just wanted to make music. Squire is the only person to appear on every Yes album.
100% Correct.
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In fact the original intention was for the band to be called Cinema. it was only when Anderson agreed to come on board that they decided (probably with some pressure from the label) to use the name Yes for the project. I remember seeing Squire interviewed around the time 90125 came out where he gave the impressiont that he would certainly have preferred to stock with Cinema given the obvious difference in sound. Let's not forget the influence of trevor Horn asa a producer though. The change in sound was not all down to Rabin.
Which brings us back to The Yes Album - the one that saw Eddie Offord take on the reigns of producer. While he did serve as sound engineer on Time.. and Yes are credited as co-procures on the Yes album, it's no coincidence that Eddie Offord's involvement in production marks the beginning of that 'classic Yes" sound that was evident right through to Relayer. A much fuller and richer sound than what went before or followed. I'm sure hard-core yes fans will know the sound I mean. It's the lack of it that stops Going for the One from being even better than CTTE IMHO. As for TYA, a great album that heralded the beginning of a run of three albums that are up there with any run of three albums by any artist of any genre ever. Starship Trooper alon with Awaken and Close to the Edge are three of the tracks that define progressive rock.
A classic album that is essential in any discering music fan's collection, astonishing thing is they were only just beginning to hit full stride! :hefdaddy
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Good point. Yes and Offord are one of those band/producer combinations where everything just clicked together perfectly and the result was amazing music. The only two I find superior are Rush's run of albums with Terry Brown and the king of band/producer combos, Iron Maiden and Martin Birch in the 80s. Eventually you do have to move on or you stagnate, but when you get into a groove with a producer, it's generally a good run of music for a band.
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Much like the arrival of Jordan Rudess did for DT, Howe's arrival kicked the rest of the band into high gear.
not so sure a majority on this forum would quite agree with the Rudess/DT part, but yes, Howe helped vault the band fo sho.
A classic album that is essential in any discering music fan's collection, astonishing thing is they were only just beginning to hit full stride! :hefdaddy
this. :tup
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I haven't commented on this yet mostly because I've been in RUSH-mode for the last week or so, and Yes has taken a back seat in my listening queue for awhile not, but TYA is a great album with 4 awesome tracks, a wonderful solo from Steve (who gets to show off now that he's new, well, back then), and another often-forgotten/overlooked track in "A Venture". The 4 longer songs all find new life on Yessongs, where extended arrangements and solos really energize the songs, and to me, those are the definitive live versions of those tracks, but the original studio versions sound great as well. This was/is an instant classic and shows what Yes was and would become, all in one. Their penchant for longer tracks would begin here, along with more fantasy-driven lyrics that use sci-fi, literature, and religion as backdrops and inspirations for future lyrical endeavors.
Many would say this is where Yes finally becomes Yes, and I would be inclined to agree. From here til Going For The One, Yes would add to the wonderful tapestry that is 70's prog rock, and leave their stamp on the idea of progressive rock music for decades to come. Fans of this album and this era have become to be known as "Troopers", and I'd like to consider myself a Trooper.
-Marc.
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Fragile (1972)
(https://imgur.com/Nrytuh5.jpg) (https://imgur.com/fcGjFzf.jpg)
(click for larger version)
Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Bill Bruford - Drums
Steve Howe - Guitar, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
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With Fragile, all of the pieces were finally in place. Yes were creating some of the ambitious music they'd always wanted to, but Tony Kaye, who had performed admirably on the first three Yes albums, was more comfortable on piano and organ than he was with Mellotrons and Moogs, and fought against them, so he was asked to leave. As with most changes of Yes personnel, there is some disagreement as to exactly how amicable the split was, but whatever; Tony Kaye was out and Rick Wakeman was in. Wakeman brought with him classical training, a music conservatory education, years of experience as a session player, and a roomful of keyboards. The classic Yes sound was complete.
This album also marked the beginning of Yes' relationship with artist Roger Dean, who was to provide cover art for many Yes albums to come and become forever associated with their music. I'll be providing a standard thumbnail of each Roger Dean cover, but wherever possible, also link to a higher-resolution version. I spent some time collecting all of them; I might as well share them with whoever's interested.
The album opens with "Roundabout", the second Yessong to make the charts in the U.S. (in its shortened form), peaking at #13. Electric and acoustic guitar, Hammond and Moog, three-part harmonies, fast and slow movements, all in the same song, and it even got played on the radio. The 70's were truly an amazing time for music. At eight and a half minutes, it was too long to release as a single, but even the "45" version was quite a tour-de-force, keeping all the essential bits of the song.
We are then treated to the first two "solo features" on the album. Fragile consists of four "regular" songs (for Yes, anyway) and five tracks, one composed and performed by each of the individual members. Rick Wakeman was still contracted to A&M Records (Yes was on Atlantic) and thus was not allowed to include his original composition, so he threw together a piece called "Cans and Brahms", an adaption of an orchestral work by Johannes Brahms, with each section of the orchestra covered by a different keyboard instrument. Jon Anderson's "We Have Heaven" follows, and as additional multitracked parts are added and the chaos builds toward the end, a door slams, footsteps and other sound effects are heard (courtesy of the BBC library) and Side One closes with another eight-minute band piece, "South Side of the Sky", with lyrics written by Jon Anderson after reading an account of a tragic mountain-climbing expedition wherein everybody perished.
Side Two opens with Bruford's short piece "Five Per Cent for Nothing", a phrase Bruford himself used when referring to managers and booking agents, who took a percentage of any money which changed hands but who in his opinion never actually did anything.
The next band song "Long Distance Runaround" segues into Chris Squire's bass-and-multitrack extravaganza "The Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)". "The Fish" was Squire's nickname in the band, after his tendency to spend countless hours in the bathtub. Steve Howe's acoustic solo "Mood for a Day" follows, and the album closes with the final band selection "Heart of the Sunrise".
In the original vinyl LP pressings, "Heart of the Sunrise" would finish (it ends quite suddenly) then the sound of a door opening could faintly be heard, followed by a reprise/continuation of "We Have Heaven". The reprise is very quiet, barely audible. In later pressings, and most CD reissues, this reprise comes full volume and eventually fades out. There is at least one CD reissue where the reprise is missing completely.
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Fragile was my first Yes album, and to this day, I can still remember the ride home from the department store where I'd bought it with my paper-route money. I'd started my musicial journey with Chicago, and their early albums taught me that there is much more to music than what you hear on the radio. Complex arrangements, suites and other structures found in classical, jazz or other genres, can all be done within the framework of Rock and Roll. Yes took me to the next step: full-blown Progressive Rock, though we still called it Art Rock at the time.
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My favourite Yes album :heart
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And here we go with Wakeman arriving. For me, Fragile is a slightly uneven album because of the solo pieces, but keep in mind that uneven is in comparison to the rest of the main sequence Yes albums. Which means that this is still a really, really good album. There's nothing wrong with the solo pieces, but they come across as being more sketches than actual songs. It doesn't detract from the rest of the album, since the full songs are damn good (Heart of the Sunrise in particular is one of my favorite Yes songs) but they're why Fragile ranks behind Close to the Edge and TYA on my Yes lists.
Always loved the cover, though. It's a shame I never owned it on vinyl, the Roger Dean Yes covers are pretty gorgeous.
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Thanks to SSotS and HotS, my favorite Yes album. Mood for a Day was also my favorite of the Steve Howe solo pieces.
I'm a big fan of musical interludes breaking up an album. I don't think all of them on this album worked, but it's a great idea and some of them work beautifully. The best example, and surely influenced by this, is all of Rik Emmett's solo pieces on the various Triumph albums. Without Mood for a Day I'm not sure we would have gotten Midsummer's Daydream, which would be a real bummer.
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They were also something of a necessity. Yes put this album together in two months and needed the filler tracks. The Yes Album was released in 1971, Kaye was out, Wakeman was in, and Fragile was released in January of 1972. They were under pressure to get the next album out, which they already assumed would be a hit (it was) in order to pay for all of Wakeman's new keyboards. When I said he "brought them with him" I was being figurative. They bought all that gear, then had to pay for it.
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Fragile's a classic, and deservedly so. While the whole band is in top form, Bruford and Squire especially are just on fire on this album. Although some fans may be tired of Roundabout, it's still one of the band's greatest songs.
The drum fill to start South Side of the Sky is one of my favorites ever.
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Never really liked the shorter tracks on the album, but Roundabout, South Side Of The Sky, and Long Distance Runaround are some of my favorite tracks ever, so it evens out. I like Heart Of The Sunrise too, but I don't remember if it was just a bonus track on the remaster so I'm not sure whether to count it.
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I love reading your writeups!
In the original vinyl LP pressings, "Heart of the Sunrise" would finish -- it ends quite suddenly -- then as one's phonograph needle began its journey into the take-up groove, the sound of a door opening could faintly be heard, followed by a reprise/continuation of "We Have Heaven". The reprise is very quiet, but if you're hearing it at all, it is because your turnable doesn't have an arm that automatically retracts, so the song would continue forever while the needle plays in the take-up groove. In later pressings, and most CD reissues, this reprise comes full volume and eventually fades out. While not quite faithful to the original idea, it's actually a good thing, because we can actually hear one difference in the reprise. Whenever the word "Yes" is sung, another much louder voice can also be heard singing "Yes!"
And I didn't know that! Awesome.
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The four full songs on this album are amazing pieces, and the five solo segments show off the band's individual talents, something they needed to do to show the world their new keyboard player and more of Steve Howe.
I really wish "America" had been part of the album proper, so much so that I made a fantasy-vinyl track list of what it would have looked like...
Total - 51:56
Side 1 - 25:59
1. "Roundabout" – 8:36
2. "Five Per Cent For Nothing" – 0:38
3. "Long Distance Runaround" – 3:30
4. "The Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)" – 2:42
5. "America" – 10:33
Side 2 - 25:57
6. "We Have Heaven" - 1:40
7. "South Side Of The Sky" – 7:58
8. "Cans And Brahms" – 1:43
9. "Mood For A Day" – 3:03
10. "Heart Of The Sunrise" – 11:33
Totally realistic in the vinyl side times (Genesis had album sides as long as over 26 minutes). Also, opening Side 2 with "We Have Heaven" and closing with it's reprise after HOTS makes for a cool book-ending effect. I also kept some of the original track list in order, like WHH/SSOTS, MFAD/HOTS, and FPCFN/LDR/The Fish.
Anyways, Fragile seems like a logical step for the band, the longer pieces got a bit longer and a bit more complex/experimental, while the short pieces on the album made for great showcases. It wasn't until the next album that they could meld all those ideas together - extended pieces with even more showcases for the individual players. Oddly enough, it's such a different album than this one, not just in terms of music and lyrics, but also arrangement and lay-out, but it was still YES music.
-Marc.
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I just realized something that I never thought about before. On The Yes Album, "Clap" is second, and features the new guitarist. On Fragile, "Cans and Brahms" is second, and features the new keyboard player. In each case, they were about as prominent as they could be, since you never open an album with such a track.
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I just realized something that I never thought about before. On The Yes Album, "Clap" is second, and features the new guitarist. On Fragile, "Cans and Brahms" is second, and features the new keyboard player. In each case, they were about as prominent as they could be, since you never open an album with such a track.
True, and coming after the first track almost guaranteed the song to be listened to. It was pretty smart placement on their part although one has to wonder if it was done on purpose or if it's a coincidence.
-Marc.
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For me, Fragile is a slightly uneven album because of the solo pieces, but keep in mind that uneven is in comparison to the rest of the main sequence Yes albums. Which means that this is still a really, really good album. There's nothing wrong with the solo pieces, but they come across as being more sketches than actual songs. It doesn't detract from the rest of the album, since the full songs are damn good (Heart of the Sunrise in particular is one of my favorite Yes songs) but they're why Fragile ranks behind Close to the Edge and TYA on my Yes lists.
Same here. Granted, the three solo pieces that I can do without (the first three) only total about four minutes out of the 38 the album is, but like you said, it breaks up the flow a bit.
But this is still a dynamite album, regardless. I always say that if you had to list the rock albums that featured the best bass playing, you could put Fragile at number 1 and it would be hard to argue otherwise.
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When I was seven, my four older brothers and I used to do air rock band to Roundabout. I really don't think I need to say more than that about what this album means to me, it has been a centerpiece of my musical life for 35 years, and has seen me through ups and downs only a few can even imagine. Yes is my favorite band for many reasons,the first though was that song.
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Definitely following this thread and LOVING the bits and pieces of Yes history that I never knew up until now.
I do have to say that Fragile is in my Top 3 favorite Yes albums - other two being CttE and TYA. I also remember, growing up, hearing the hits AND the deeper cuts on AOR. Yes was part of a group of bands that were my gateway to being the prog chick I am today (Peter Gabriel's Genesis being another).
As for the solo pieces, I have a special place in my heart for We Have Heaven - my best friend is a FANTASTIC artist and she drew this really cool picture which was a 2d diagram of how she saw the song in her mind's eye. I was flabbergasted - it's one of the best things she's ever done.
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I love reading your writeups!
Thanks! They're a lot of fun to do, and I'm glad people are enjoying them.
In the original vinyl LP pressings, "Heart of the Sunrise" would finish -- it ends quite suddenly -- then as one's phonograph needle began its journey into the take-up groove, the sound of a door opening could faintly be heard, followed by a reprise/continuation of "We Have Heaven". The reprise is very quiet, but if you're hearing it at all, it is because your turnable doesn't have an arm that automatically retracts, so the song would continue forever while the needle plays in the take-up groove. In later pressings, and most CD reissues, this reprise comes full volume and eventually fades out. While not quite faithful to the original idea, it's actually a good thing, because we can actually hear one difference in the reprise. Whenever the word "Yes" is sung, another much louder voice can also be heard singing "Yes!"
And I didn't know that! Awesome.
Argh, I fucked up! I got this album and the original vinyl LP of King Crimson's U.S.A. mixed up. U.S.A. is a live album, and at the end, if your tone arm doesn't pick up, the applause continues forever because it's cut into the takeup groove. This happened with my old turntable when it started dying and didn't automatically pick up anymore. I remember sitting in my dorm room listening to it, and after the last song, it seemed like the applause went on and on, and I finally looked over and realized what was happening.
With Fragile, the reprise is very quiet, but it's there as a "hidden track" on the regular part of the record. It fades out normally. Also, the extra "Yes!" which I'd never noticed before is there in "We Have Heaven". It's the last overdub added during the chaos at the end. I just listened to Fragile again today on my iPod and realized that it's there. I've corrected the original Fragile post.
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I just realized something that I never thought about before. On The Yes Album, "Clap" is second, and features the new guitarist. On Fragile, "Cans and Brahms" is second, and features the new keyboard player. In each case, they were about as prominent as they could be, since you never open an album with such a track.
True, and coming after the first track almost guaranteed the song to be listened to. It was pretty smart placement on their part although one has to wonder if it was done on purpose or if it's a coincidence.
Yeah, it may just be a coincidence. Or maybe since "Clap" was placed second on The Yes Album and they had solo spots for all five of them on Fragile anyway, it made a certain amount of sense to place "Cans and Brahms" second. There's definitely a flow and logic to the track order on Fragile. Opening and closing with full-band songs is no coincidence, ending Side One with a band track also makes sense, and placing the very short "Five Per Cent for Nothing" first on Side Two makes it feel almost like an into to "Long Distance Runaround" and since that song segues into the next track, there is a certain flow to Side Two as well. Anyway, they had five solo pieces to place, so why not put Wakeman's bit second. It may not have occurred to them, but if it did, sure, why not?
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I like Fragile.
I'm afraid I have nothing else to say. I'm not the biggest Yes fan, but I've listened to Fragile a few times. It's a cool album.
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Perfect album. Just amazing. Second favourite Yes album.
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Fragile is my second favorite Yes album as well and one of my favorite albums of all time. The three epics are obvious highlights, I love them all, but Roundabout might be the one I enjoy the most. Even the shorter songs on here are a lot of fun, and every member absolutely shines on there. Mood for the day is one of the most gorgeous acoustic pieces I've ever heard.
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Such a great album full of great songs.
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include America, and i dont see how i can place Fragile any lower than number 2 on my list of favorite Yes albums. great album, and also, fairly accessible - for sure the album i'll shove down the throat of anyone looking to check them out.
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Fragile is third on my least favorite Yes studio albums of the '70s behind Tormato and Going For The One.
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Why?
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It's more that I really love Time And A Word, The Yes Album, Close To The Edge, Tales and Relayer more.
The albums before it sound more organic to me while the ones after are more frantic, but yet very melodic.
It's less dislike for me, it's just that I like the other albums more, though I admit that Fragile might be very close to a sonic masterpiece moreso that most of the other albums I've mentioned.
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That's fair. I was just wondering because you said it was your third least favorite but not why. I'm always interested in the "why".
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When I was seven, my four older brothers and I used to do air rock band to Roundabout. I really don't think I need to say more than that about what this album means to me, it has been a centerpiece of my musical life for 35 years, and has seen me through ups and downs only a few can even imagine. Yes is my favorite band for many reasons,the first though was that song.
I remember laying on the floor in the living room, my brother in the basement playing bass along to this album. I listened to the music and felt the vibrations of bass shaking the floor. It was awesome.
Fragile is my favorite Yesalbum.
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The questions "what is prog?" and "what defines prog?" have been around as long as the label has existed, and let's face it, it's really a label more than a genre if people can't agree on who it applies to but are quick to use it anyway. But I was thinking about it, and how this was my first prog album, and why it seemed so different.
"Roundabout" was the first Yessong I remember hearing. I remember hearing the quiet section in the middle, where the acoustic guitar returns and Jon slowly sings "In and around the lake..." with the Mellotron flutes behind him. It was the first time I'd ever heard a song on the radio that actually had different "movements" to it. A fast section, a slow section, then the fast part comes back. Like a mini-sonata all in one song.
But later, I'd hear the song, and it seemed shorter. It didn't go into the slow part in the middle. This was before I was aware of the "album version" of a song versus the "single version". Take out the quiet section in the middle, keep all the upbeat stuff, and you have a Top 40 hit. The full-length version, with its acoustic breakdown and complete change of mood, is undeniably prog.
"South Side of the Sky" is similar. You would never, ever hear a song with a breakdown in the middle featuring an impressionistic grand piano solo and voices singing "La la la la la la, la la la la la la la la" on the radio. But if you could somehow take that part out, what remains is just a "regular" song in 4/4. A weird one, but a regular song.
So maybe prog isn't just unusual time signatures, or the use of acoustic instruments alongside electric, or long songs. Those are just things that prog songs happen to have because the guys playing them tend to not feel the same limits as some others. All of these things show up in music that most people agree is not prog. But if you have a song that has fast and slow movements, actual changes in mood within the song, you've probably got prog.
Anyway, just something I was thinking about.
Final thought: I really hate it when I hear "Long Distance Runaround" on the radio and they don't also play "The Fish".
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Final thought: I really hate it when I hear "Long Distance Runaround" on the radio and they don't also play "The Fish".
Yup, drives me nuts.
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It's kind of funny; my local classic rock station is godawful. Once for a month and a half they played War Pigs by Black Sabbath every morning at 11:53 am. You could tell how corporately programmed they were. And yet they NEVER play Long Distance Runaround without The Fish. You'd figure playing both tracks would mess up some playlist or something. :lol
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Close to the Edge (1972)
(https://imgur.com/QCYsxRQ.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Bill Bruford - Percussion
Steve Howe - Guitar, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
I'm not sure how I did it, but I managed to delete the original writeup for this album. No backup, either. Everything's typed up right here on DTF. So what follows is a recreation of the original post. Or, more accurately, what I decided to write instead.
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The jacket for Close to the Edge was designed by Roger Dean, who had also done the cover for Fragile, but the front cover (shown above) had only the band name and name of the album. The "real" artwork was reserved for the inside gatefold:
(https://imgur.com/MMv5b0M.jpg)
Yes' sound continued to improve, thanks to the efforts of Eddie Offord, who was in some ways a sixth member of the band. The final arrangements of the songs ultimately came down to him and his editing decisions. He cut and spliced miles of two-inch master tape by hand in order to create what we hear as the finished product. The band literally learned what was on the albums so that they could go out and play the songs in the final arrangements.
To honor and reward Eddie, there are six individual photos on the back cover: Yes and Eddie Offord, the co-producers.
(https://imgur.com/Lc17h9N.jpg)
Close to the Edge
I. The Solid Time of Change
II. Total Mass Retain
III. I Get Up, I Get Down
IV. Seasons of Man
And You And I
I. Cord of Life
II. Eclipse
III. The Preacher The Teacher
IV. Apocalypse
Siberian Khatru
The album consisted of only three songs, one on Side A and two on Side B, which was unheard-of at the time, at least in the rock world. The "side-long epic" (its length determined by the 20-to-25-minute physical limitation of an LP record) became something which most prog bands seemed obliged to attempt at least once in their careers. Yes did it eight times. Even if you somehow take into account that four of them appear one album (Tales from Topographic Oceans) and are considered by the band to be separate movements of an even greater work, that still has to be some kind of record. "Close to the Edge" was their first, and is considered by many to be their best, although "The Gates of Delerium" from Relayer is probably a close second.
After writing and recording Fragile in mere months, then embarking upon a tour to support the album, Yes turned around and did the same thing with Close to the Edge. The recording sessions went late into the night and into the early morning hours. The band occassionally played gigs, so the equipment had to be packed up and moved, then set back up in the studio again for the next session. By the time they finished recording, drummer Bill Bruford had had enough, and announced that he was leaving the band. After four and a half years with Yes, he felt that they had gone about as far as they could go, and he had been offerred -- and had accepted -- a job with King Crimson.
When it was pointed out to him that they had already booked a tour to support the album, and that his unexpected departure left them in a quandry, Bill offerred to stay on and do the tour, but it was clear that his heart was no longer with the band. Alan White, Eddie Offord's roommate and an experienced session drummer, was brought in to play drums on the tour, and he has been with Yes ever since.
With the earlier departures of guitarist Peter Banks and keyboardist Tony Kaye, there are differing opinions on whether they were fired or it was a mutual decision, and how amicable the split was. Bill Bruford's departure was voluntary, and after five studio albums, Yes had still not gone more than two consecutive albums with the same lineup.
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I'll probably be raked over the coals again for this, but I like side two a lot more than side one.
But I really like side one too, it's just that I really think and You and I is one of the best tunes they've ever written....and Siberian Khatru is pretty awesome in its own right.
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I agree with you. Though I should give Close to the Edge more listens.
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And You And I is a beautiful, wonderful song, but it's still third of three to me. The title track and Awaken (from Going for the One) constantly fight it out for favorite Yessong and my favorite song of all time. OF ALL TIME! Siberian Khatru just kicks all kinds of ass, and that leaves the love song in last place. But all three songs are masterpieces.
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When I first got into Yes, this was a hard one for me to digest, especially the title track. Side two was a bit easier, there's a type of majestic, emotionally-moving feel of "And You And I", and the awesome rocking riffs of "Siberian Khatru" recall some of their earlier work on The Yes Album. Side one was a bit tougher and it took me a couple years to really "get it", but now the whole album is a great masterpiece in my eyes/ears. I would change nothing about it (unlike TFTO, which I could stand to shave off a few minutes here and there), and it's one of the great stepping stones of 70's Prog.
Up to this point, their albums have evolved greatly, and their evolution would continue further and make a u-turn at TFTO, where they could go back to the 3-song-format (with an opening side-long epic), then some shorter pieces and more songs on an album, but to me, CTTE is where things got REALLY interesting for the band, and produced some music that had no similarities to what came before. That's truly progressing right there.
-Marc.
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It is near impossible for me to apply any type of ranking for any song in this four album stretch that began with TYA. I feel that CTTE is an incredible work, and probably my favorite to see live(maybe four or five times I've seen it). Siberian Khatru is an incredible opener. And You And I still leaves me speechless after 30 years of listening to it, and is very high on my list of most beautiful songs ever written. I will now prepare my long, gushy post for the next album...
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It's almost hard to believe how good Close to the Edge is. It is befuddling.
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3 perfect songs in this album. It took me a while to really appreciate Siberian Khatru but once it kicked in it rocketed this record way up in my appreciation list.
And You And I has to be one of the most beautiful songs ever written.
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This is without a doubt my favorite Yes album and, like Fragile, one of the best albums I've ever heard. There aren't a lot of albums where every song is brilliant, but this is one of them. Yeah, there are only three songs here, but they're lengthy ones and it takes real competence to make three amazing epics. The title track is a milestone in progressive rock that perfectly describes what this band is about. Siberian khatru is one of their catchiest tunes with so many hooks, right now I particularly adore the guitar solo in the fourth minute. And then there's my absolute favorite on the album, And you and I. Music rarely gets more beautiful than this. Overall, Close to the edge, to me, has to be what people call a desert island disc.
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If Close to the Edge were a woman, I would take it home and do unthinkable things to it in bed. It's just fucking perfect.
A friend of mine gave me a copy of it a few years back. I listened to it as background music while I was cleaning my room. I didn't get anything done though because I was mesmerized by the music. I fell in love with the band at that moment.
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Argh, late to the party (again) but I try to catch up.
The Yes Album: Now we're talking classic Yes. A quantum leap from the previous two outputs. I don't know if it's the arrival of Steve Howe or because Eddie Offord came on board as producer or something completely different, but they managed to really take off with this album. Now we have one of the great masterpieces of Progressive Rock with instant classics such as Starship Troopers, Yours Is No Disgrace, I've Seen All Good People etc. The only "not that great" song is A Venture. Along with Close To The Edge this is my favourite Yes Album. Tony Kayes piano and hammond work is more down to earth than Wakeman's playing on later albums but it fits really good on this album.
Fragile: Great follow up with three outstanding longtracks. South Side Of The Sky is probably my favourite here. It's a great rocking track with a dark mood. The only factor for not being my number one Yes Album are the short tracks which in my opinion ruin the flow of the music and I like The Clap much more than Mood For A Day.
Close To The Edge: I can't describe how great this thing is. The title track is such a masterpiece. I mean: the slightly tonal intro! The guitar melody! The church organ! and I could go on and on and on. It's funny that if you read about the writing and recording process that this song doesn't feel like it's pieced together. Sure it consists of different movements but they flow so well together. Then we have And You And I and all I can say that this song is simply beautiful beautiful beautiful beautiful and not in a cheesy way. The closer Siberian Khatru is the rocker on this album and again a great track though for me not as great as the other two. I've always wondered if the acapella part "dat dat dadaa dadaa" (you know what I mean) is reminiscient of Led Zeps Whole Lotta Love.
And I have to say this is a great idea for a threat and although I'm a long time Yes fan I didn't know all of the details of the history of the albums so far. Nicely done!
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Close To The Edge:
As a youngster, growing interested in music, I used to go to record stores-yes, back then that's what they were called-and looked at album covers that looked interesting, or to find which album had a song that I had heard on the radio, or just to browse. And as I became aware of progressive rock by listening to Genesis-I got into them when Abacab came out-I started looking at albums by other bands that I'd read in magazines, mostly Circus, that were described as progressive. Which is what led me to the Yes section of my local record store. (Ahh, Mother's Records, long closed in a mall demolished four years ago for one of those open air shopping centers, how I miss you.) And I looked at their albums, and was flat out floored by their cover art. And I remember there was this one, with a green color scheme, that I picked up, and my interest in music changed forever.
"Holy crap" my younger self said. "This album only has three songs on it!"
When I was younger, I didn't really have much money, and what money I did have went to books, comic books, and large drinks to drink at the local 7-11 while I shoveled quarters into Qbert and Ms. Pac man machines. Albums weren't expensive back then by modern terms, but when you're a teen with a limited allowance and you're too young to get a job, five dollars could vanish in a hurry. So I didn't own very many albums, and the ones I owned were largely hand me downs from my sister, none of them very progressive. The lion's share of the music I could play over and over again were 45s, singles given to my sister by my paternal grandmother, who worked at a restaurant and when the management swept the old songs out of the jukebox, my grandmother snatched them up and gave them to my sister*. (Yes, this story is a grand tour of formats that we don't have anymore.) The most progressive album I owned was Moving Pictures. To me, then, seeing an album with only three songs on it gave me a sense of "Can you DO that? Is that even possible?" It opened my eyes to the notion that rock music could be more expanse, more open, go further, than I ever dreamed possible listening to my sister's old 45s with single edits of songs, even further than the copy of Sgt Pepper I checked out of the local library and wound up keeping because I moved out of town three weeks later.**
That album, of course, was Close to the Edge.
I'd love to tell you I took my allowance the next week and bought it and listened to it and loved it, but life is a funny thing. I didn't buy it. I don't even remember what the next album I bought was. Probably something by Iron Maiden. I'd like to tell you that Close to the Edge was the first side long song I ever heard, but I can't. That was the Seconds Out version of Supper's Ready. I didn't hear the three songs that were on Close to the Edge for several more years, when with the first paycheck I ever received as a laborer on a construction site I bought Marillion's Misplaced Childhood, Pink Floyd's The Wall, and Yessongs. I didn't actually own Close To The Edge until 2007, when I went on a massive Yes binge and bought seventeen Yes CDs over a period of five weeks.
And yet...
Just seeing the album cover, that otherworldly green, and reading the three song titles on it, did as much for my listening to music and my interests as any song I heard on the radio, any video I saw on MTV, and any of my sister's 45s I spun at random, wondering what this song would sound like. Without hearing it, it taught me that music could go as far as you wanted it to.
And thankfully, after not actually listening to the damn thing for over two decades, it turns out that it's a masterpiece. Easily the best album Yes ever made, one of the best albums the progressive rock movement ever made, and one of my ten favorite albums ever. It's remarkable, though, the amount of influence its mere existence had on me.
*My sister got the 45s. My grandmother also worked at the drug store owned by the same person who owned the restaurant next door, once upon a time they'd been an old time drug store with restaurant like you had back in the 50s, and when they cleared out the comics that hadn't sold to make room for the new ones, she would grab a few for me. I think it turned out well.
**When you're a kid, you don't quite realize, or even pay attention, to the fact that your parents are in the other room planning to move to another state to look for better job prospects. Also inadvertently taken with me on that move, checked out the same day I checked out Sgt. Pepper; the three books of The Lord of the Rings. Again, I think it turned out well.
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The title epic seems to divide a lot of people, even prog fans. Some embrace it immediately, but most need some time to digest it all. With "Close to the Edge" I would hazard a guess that even more time is needed than with most epics, because the song itself starts very strangely and is very complex. The intro alone goes through several changes before the vocals come in.
Things to notice:
At about 1:20, the organ is playing the same notes as the bass, several octaves higher and at double the tempo.
For all its insanity, the song actually has a very basic, very common structure. You just have to "zoom out" a bit to see it. There is an intro, two verses ("The Solid Time of Change" and "Total Mass Retain"), a B section ("I Get Up, I Get Down"), a solo (Wakeman's amazing Hammond solo), then the last verse ("Seasons of Man").
Each of the verses, however, has a different time signature. "A seasoned witch..." is in 12/8. "My eyes, convinced..." is the same melody, but in 4/4 (some might argue that the 4/4 triplets are effectively the same as 12/8, but there's no question that the rhythm is half-tempo). The last verse "The time between the notes..." uses a 6/4 variation of the second verse rhythm, then changes to the 12/8 of the first verse.
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Close To The Edge = my fav prog rock album.
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Simply the best out of the lot, IMO.
I still have chills hearing that fantastic intro in the title track. The first time I heard this and appreciated it, I compared it to those unison movements that DT did on I&W (considering that my very first full-on fan phase for prog-metal or prog in general started with DT).
I also like that part toward the end of the third movement of side one when Anderson holds that note on "I get uuuuuuuuuuuup..." It always grabs me.
What I most remember though about CTTE was that I played it a lot in my dinky little Dodge hooptie driving the streets of downtown Oklahoma City to Edmond on the weekend to catch indie films like Pi and Boogie Nights. Those were great times.
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Close To The Edge, both the song and the album, are Yes's friggin pinnacle right there. (Awaken may contend for that title, but that's about it). I shouldn't relate to it, being sober and not even around around when it was modern and new, but it just fits me. I've never heard anything quite like it; I generally get imagery from listening to tunes, but this stuff, it provides me high-definition, cinema-quality pictures.
That title track is just one of those songs that is a true adventure. And in spite of its being a grand spectacle, it's damn catchy as well. The other two songs, they're up there, as well. And You and I is a wondrous peace-out song. I love taking long walks through my over-developed, pedestrian-unfriendly city to it. It'd be even better to hike in actual wilderness to, I figure. It certainly made a van ride through rural Ohio fun. Siberian Khatru, that one's just plain groovy. It's one of my jams. Probably fantastic love-making music (assuming no one knows it's Yes :blush )
On another note, that landscape on the inside of the album looks way Sonic-y.
Funny thing with Yes, I practically look over everything else they did, because of this green-clad monster. I really like the 2 albums before this, though. Not nearly as much as CttE, but they have some really fantastic momements (think Starship Trooper, I've Seen All Good People, Heart of the Sunrise, ect.). Then again, they don't have the 'introductory appeal' that CttE has with me. I don't remember much about the first album (barely heard it), but Time and a Word's pretty neat. I really like Astral Traveler (it's another one of my jams.) and some other tunes off it are good and funky.
Orbert, I thank you for starting up this thread and sharing your words on Yes. I can see that you're way passionate about these guys and it's really cool to hear from someone who dug these guys back when it was just coming out and was a brand new thing.
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For all its insanity, the song actually has a very basic, very common structure. You just have to "zoom out" a bit to see it. There is an intro, two verses ("The Solid Time of Change" and "Total Mass Retain"), a B section ("I Get Up, I Get Down"), a solo (Wakeman's amazing Hammond solo), then the last verse ("Seasons of Man").
That's a great thing about prog. It takes a structure of a three minute long hit song, and makes a groundbreaking epic. :hefdaddy
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Close to the Edge = musical perfection
I remember the day I bought this CD - I think it was 1993 - and popping it in for the first time. When I heard that buildup of the keyboards, I thought, "Okay, this is gonna be good." And was it ever. :coolio
And You and I still might be my favorite Yes song (there are three or four that usually fight it out for the top spot).
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So, not much more to say about Close to the Edge. It's awesome and amazing. I did stumble across one interesting comment that I thought I'd share. Then I have to start putting some thoughts together on the first live album.
Someone on the Yesfans forums was talking about Close to the Edge, and how it's almost a perfect album. He loves all three songs, the production is amazing, all that, but somehow something didn't seem quite right, and he couldn't figure out what it was for a long time. Then it finally hit him. The songs are in the wrong order. They're backwards!
Consider: The album starts off with the rocker, "Siberian Khatru". Fans from Fragile and perhaps before that all go "Yeah, baby!" as it grabs you right from the start, goes through the changes, and fades out, leaving you wanting more. Then comes the glorious "And You And I". The mellower piece before the mind-blowing title track. Instead of starting with the mind-blower and possibly putting people off (which, let's face it, does happen), you build up to it. In the LP days, you even had that little breather while you turned the record over. You're thinking "Wow, two long songs, now what?" Then the title track blows you away.
Also, how many times have people asked you what your favorite Yes album is, or which is the best, and you tell them Close to the Edge, but usually you tell them not to start with that one? You do have to work up to it. Would it work better if the song order was reversed? After "Siberian Khatru" -- probably the most accessible song of the three -- then "And You And I", they'd probably be ready for "Close to the Edge". But for someone who only knows their radio hits, it's not the place to start.
Anyway, I found myself agreeing. There's nothing wrong with how the album turned out, but it might have possibly worked just a little bit better with the song order reversed.
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Final thought: I'm not huge on buying the latest reissues and remasters and all that. I consider myself an audiophile, but not the snooty kind. I don't have to have the latest version, the one where the sound quality is 3% better than the last remaster, which itself was a 4% improvement over the original CD. I do, however, have two CDs of Close to the Edge.
When I got my very first CD player back in the 80's, they were still relatively new, and the CD player was a birthday present. My girlfriend (now wife) got it for me, along with The Dark Side of the Moon. Of course. I had to have something to play, and remember, only certain albums were even available on CD for quite a while. I got a gift certificate from my parents, so I picked up Duke by Genesis.
The first CD I bought for myself, with my own actual money, was Close to the Edge. And it is the only CD I've ever gotten a second copy of. Supposedly the sound quality of the remaster is so much better. I don't know if it is; I don't even know if it's better at all. I grew up with LPs, and to me CDs sound amazingly clear, and it's nice to not hear and "wow and flutter" (remember those?) but I've never done a comparison between the two versions of the CD. They both sound great, and that's good enough for me. I figured that if I don't notice any difference with an album I've heard literally hundreds of times, it's not worth it. I'd rather spend my money checking out new tunes, not "upgrading" old ones.
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Hmmm, I've never thought of listening to the album in reverse order, although I suppose that could work. But the album starting with that intro is just soooo perfect!
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Close to the Edge Close to the Edge Fragile Close to the Edge Close to the Edge The Dark Side of the Moon Duke Close to the Edge
Close to the Edge: the only album title that deserves to be bolded :lol
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I generally italicize the names of albums, but within posts discussing a particular album in the discography, that album title is bolded. It was a stylistic choice I had to make for consistency, as I knew the title of the album would be bolded at the beginning of each section for that album, and it didn't make sense to italicize it elsewhere.
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Yeah, I recognized the pattern from earlier posts in the thread, but I thought my analysis was at least partially amusing.
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Oh, it was. At the very least, I was wondering if anyone would notice, as it started looking kinda weird even to me, but I figured I'd started the pattern and had to keep to it. Then I was curious if anyone would figure it out. But who would be brave enough to mention it, even make a joke about it?
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CttE is great. I find And You And I too long though.
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Yessongs (1973)
(https://imgur.com/xgXMKNd.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Bill Bruford - Drums
Steve Howe - Guitar, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums
Before I get into the contents of the album itself, I have to take some time to discuss the packaging. This album was originally released as three vinyl LPs in a quadruple gatefold, one of the most elaborate and beautiful LP packages of its time. Three sleeves of the double jacket each contained one record, and the fourth contained an elaborate picture book (https://imgur.com/09w444t.jpg) with concert photos and photos of the crew. The entire package, including the picture book, was designed by Roger Dean, who was becoming inextricably associated with Yes and their music. His surreal style and creative use of imagery and color was a perfect match for their ethereal music. The front and back covers featured paintings by him, as well as the six interior panels, with one of his surrealistic landscapes spread across each pair of panels.
(https://imgur.com/cfZ9JCh.jpg)
The entire package, partially opened.
(https://imgur.com/7qmZjTX.jpg)
The front and back covers, and one of the interior paintings, which is an embellishment of the cover painting.
(https://imgur.com/j4t7e2M.jpg)
The first interior painting. Titled "Pathway", it is the same as the cover painting (inside the border), but with the addition of a person sitting on the tower in the foreground, and the flying ship from the cover of Fragile (https://imgur.com/fcGjFzf.jpg). The flying ship also makes an appearance on the back cover of Close to the Edge (https://imgur.com/Lc17h9N.jpg) (in the lower right-hand corner).
(https://i.imgur.com/aGlgfIf.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/a4BoNU5.jpg)
The other two interior paintings, "Arrival" and "Awakening".
According to the artist Roger Dean, the paintings tell a story. It starts with the planet from the cover of Fragile (https://i.imgur.com/fcGjFzf.jpg), which has exploded. It was, after all, fragile.
The fragments of the planet, or "spores", travel through space (accompanied by the flying ship). Back cover -- "Spores" (https://i.imgur.com/mOQpHGx.jpg)
The spores land on a new planet. Interior painting -- "Arrival" (https://i.imgur.com/aGlgfIf.jpg)
The arrival is witnessed by the person sitting on the tower in the embellished picture above. Here (https://i.imgur.com/j4t7e2M.jpg) is a larger version of the original painting.
After much time has passed, life begins anew. Interior painting -- "Awakening" (https://i.imgur.com/a4BoNU5.jpg)
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Opening (Excerpt from "Firebird Suite")
Siberian Khatru
Heart of the Sunrise
Perpetual Change
And You And I
Mood for a Day
Excerpts from "The Six Wives of Henry VIII"
Roundabout
I've Seen All Good People
Long Distance Runaround
The Fish
Close to the Edge
Yours is No Disgrace
Starship Trooper
The material on Yessongs comes from the Fragile and Close to the Edge tours, though the bulk of it is from the latter. The only tracks on which Bill Bruford appears are "Perpetual Change" and the medley of "Long Distance Runaround" and "The Fish". The remaining tracks came from the Close to the Edge tour, after Bill had left the band and been replaced by Alan White.
(https://i.imgur.com/fKXE5I3.jpg)
Alan was a friend of producer Eddie Offord, who suggested him as a replacement, and at the time he was best known for playing with John Lennon's Plastic Ono band, but had also played with George Harrison, Gary Wright, and others, and had quite an impressive resumé for someone his age (he was 23 when he joined Yes). Alan had just two weeks to learn the material for the upcoming tour, which included all of the Close to the Edge, and most of the main songs from both The Yes Album and Fragile.
Given the short time he had to prepare, Alan's performances on this album are remarkable. His style is quite different from Bill Bruford's. Where Bill is very measured and calculated ("disciplined" one might say), Alan prefers to let loose. He rides the cymbals and pounds the toms and generally adds a lot of dynamics and excitement to the Yes sound -- which is exactly what they needed on this, their first live album.
Perhaps it was out of respect for Bill Bruford, or simply an editing choice, but the drum solo on the album belongs to Bill, and occurs during "Perpetual Change". An extended version of Chris Squire's "The Fish" serves as his feature, and Steve Howe performs a slightly augmented version of "Mood for a Day". Rick Wakeman's solo section is a medley of excerpts from his first solo album The Six Wives of Henry VIII, which he somehow managed to record in between recording sessions for Close to the Edge.
(https://i.imgur.com/PSx62m0.jpg)
Overall, Yessongs is a very good album, an excellent document of what many consider the prime of Yes. Yes demonstrates their ability to recreate their complex studio arrangements live, sometimes note-for-note, and sometimes seamlessly incorporating new parts and variations. Playing is tight and precise, yet still has the spontaneity of a good live performance.
Generally, the only negative criticism one will hear about this album is of the sound quality. It is tolerable, but not very clear; muddy overall. Fans and critics alike tend to agree that the fire in the performances more than makes up for this shortcoming.
At over two hours total time, Yessongs is clearly meant to represent an entire concert. The entire opening track is included, and you can hear the audience respond as the band take the stage. All songs are uncut, and the applause between tracks is blended together so as to provide a cohesive concert experience. Actually, with each CD containing the original contents of three LP sides, each CD is a "mini-concert" of its own. You can hear Jon Anderson saying Good-night to the crowd at the end of "Starship Trooper" which closes the second disc, but also at the end of "Roundabout" which ends the first disc. "Roundabout" was their regular encore piece, which is why you hear him saying Good-night, but the track order is preserved from the original vinyl release; it is just a happy coincidence that things turned out this way due to editing decisions that went into the original release.
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As I mentioned in my post on Close to the Edge, Yessongs was one of three albums purchased with my very first paycheck ever, all on vinyl, and just as a reminder, the other two were The Wall and Misplaced Childhood. That summer was something of a prog rock summer for me, with massive purchases of Pink Floyd, Yes, Genesis, and all the available Marillion albums. Oddly, while my plans were to buy Yessongs, Seconds Out by Genesis, and Welcome Back My Friends...by ELP that summer and have a massive multi-album live album festival, I never got around to buying the ELP one on vinyl. I have it on CD now, thank you very much. Yessongs holds a very special place in my heart...or, well, okay, let's be precise here. The last side of the album does. I enjoyed the entire thing, yes, but I adored those versions of Yours Is No Disgrace and Starship Trooper, and I would play them a LOT. There were quite a few nights that summer where I would put that side on and listen to it as I fell asleep. And would manage to wake up for the end solos of Starship Trooper every time.
It also had, as Orbert mentions, the most fantastic packaging for an album I've ever owned. The multi-gatefold of Yessongs was stunning to look at, and while I eventually sold my vinyls at a tidy profit a few years ago, that was one of the albums I regretted letting go. I love the hell out of this album, even if I have the aggravating habit of confusing it with Yesshows :lol
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This album was where my love of Yes was born, the one that my brothers spun incessantly from when I was age seven. Though I have since fallen for all the studio albums, this was the one that I listened to as a child, and through my teen years. Imagine my surprise when I found out that all the songs didn't sound like they did on Yessongs, my first clue as to how talented they really were(probably around age twelve). A premiere live album, easily in my top five of all time live albums. I owe about 90% of my love of music to Yessongs.
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Yessongs is a great album, one of my favorite live albums ever.
It is a good document of their live playing in the classic era. Minus South Side Of The Sky and the little ditties from Fragile all the great songs from the previous three classic albums are present. They prove that they are able to recreate their music live and do it justice. Sometimes very close to the studio versions, sometimes a little more varied.
I find it interesting that there are no songs of their first two albums. Either they weren't played on the particular tours or they didn't make the final cut, I don't know.
Although after reading your description of the packaging I feel a little bit cheated. I bought this album first on vinyl and it came in a nice packaging containing the three records, but i didn't get the picture book and the picture on the inner sleeve called "arrival" is missing. In fact up until now I didn't know that there were versions with an additional picture book. My album looked like this:
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-WHAil8nWVxA/TsIfwEz6CkI/AAAAAAAAAjM/CM2bG5aIUrQ/s1600/Yessongs%2B2.JPG)
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I never really cared for live albums. The only exception I make is Led Zeppelin because they sounded way better live than they did in studio.
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Kwyjibo, you must have gotten a later pressing. I've never seen that edition, but it must have come later, after someone made the decision that the original packaging was too elaborate (and costly) so they come up with that version. They still had to hold three records, but the quad-gatefold was out.
It's still a nice package, and a bummer that "Arrival" was omitted, though I suppose that if you had to cut one of them, that would be the one. And somebody else must have come to the same conclusion. The book of concert pics is pretty cool, though, and that's just a shame. That's why I always tried to get first-run editions. It wasn't just because I wanted the album as soon as it came out; I remember being aware even then that original packaging was often more elaborate and had extras goodies with it. I was always bummed when I found a copy of an album but the jacket didn't "open up" if I knew that there were versions out there that did, yet here's a cheapo version that doesn't. Therefore all the liner notes, or pictures or whatever, are missing. I wanted the whole deal.
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I bought Yessongs in the mid 80s, so definitely a later pressing. When Yessongs was published in 1973 I was three years old and my taste for progressive rock wasn't fully developed.
I still liked the packaging as it was still different and more elaborate than most of the other records out there. Sadly I sold all my records when my record player broke and I decided to go all for CD. I sometimes miss some of those records, not so much for the sound but for the packaging. If I had the edition of Yessongs with a picture book I think I would have kept it.
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Yeah, everything was cheaper back then, and record companies were a lot more willing to do things like come up with elaborate packaging for special albums and stuff. They try to do stuff like that today, but with CD jackets at half the dimensions of record jackets, it's just not the same.
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I love this live album. Pretty much everything on it is at least a bpm faster than the studio versions. The 'set list' is impressive, and I think the ripped copy of the album is in my portable hard drive right now. Maybe I'll give it a spin this instant.
I have a co-worker who plays music with Alan White in a band during his down time. Hopefully there will be a time that I could indeed meet him and shake his hand.
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I have to give Alan White a lot of credit for what he's done with Yes. He jumped right in and played the tour, extremely well, cementing his position as regular Yes drummer, but after 40 freakin' years, some people still think of him as the "new" drummer. Bill Bruford of course went on to do a lot of different things, but because he's a more well-known name, and was the original drummer, it's like Alan will never completely shake that.
Honestly, I have trouble deciding between them sometimes. I generally love Alan's energy and the way he just goes for it, but sometimes Bill's more refined approach works better. Bill was great on those first five studio albums, and they wouldn't have been the same with Alan on the kit, but Bill himself said that Yes kept "trading up" and getting better and better. I don't know if he meant to include himself in that statement, but many people prefer Alan over Bill.
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I bought Yessongs in the mid 80s, so definitely a later pressing. When Yessongs was published in 1973 I was three years old and my taste for progressive rock wasn't fully developed.
I still liked the packaging as it was still different and more elaborate than most of the other records out there. Sadly I sold all my records when my record player broke and I decided to go all for CD. I sometimes miss some of those records, not so much for the sound but for the packaging. If I had the edition of Yessongs with a picture book I think I would have kept it.
Strangely that's when I bought my copy, and it was like Orbert's. And yes, in hindsight, I wish I had kept that one when I sold my vinyls.
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I have to give Alan White a lot of credit for what he's done with Yes. He jumped right in and played the tour, extremely well, cementing his position as regular Yes drummer, but after 40 freakin' years, some people still think of him as the "new" drummer. Bill Bruford of course went on to do a lot of different things, but because he's a more well-known name, and was the original drummer, it's like Alan will never completely shake that.
Honestly, I have trouble deciding between them sometimes. I generally love Alan's energy and the way he just goes for it, but sometimes Bill's more refined approach works better. Bill was great on those first five studio albums, and they wouldn't have been the same with Alan on the kit, but Bill himself said that Yes kept "trading up" and getting better and better. I don't know if he meant to include himself in that statement, but many people prefer Alan over Bill.
I was about 22 years old when AW came in, and I was greatly disappointed. To me, he was the wrong drummer for the band, and to a certain extent, I still think the same. BB had that jazz feel, which AW had not. IMO, BB was also clearly the better technical drummer. AW was never anything else than an average drummer you could find in any club. He has no distinct qualities that make you recognize him amongst 1000s of drummers, like the great ones. Think about that, even the rather 'untechnical' Keith Moon was fairly recognizable. As was Ginger Baker, Jon Hiseman, Phil Collins to mention some.
When Yes recorded the Keys to Ascension sessions, AW had grown to sound almost BBish though. He did a fairly acceptable job there, but then fell down again. On one of their anniversery DVDs (40 years?), he was a joke in the band. The man sounded like he stopped playing and only pulled out the drumkit for this occasion. I know it sounds pretty harsh, but Yes could have been so much better if they had chosen the right man at that time. It's only my opinion of course.
- Poul
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I hear what you're saying, though I think you're being a bit harsh on Alan. He may not have a really distinctive style, but the fact that he was able to learn two hours of mostly long, very complex songs in very short order speaks a lot to his musical ability.
And while I agree with you that they could have done better, had they chosen someone else at the time, they simply didn't have that luxury. The album was done, the tour was booked, and Bill quit. Alan was Eddie Offord's roommate at the time and had literally just finished a tour with Joe Cocker. Eddie called Alan before Alan had even come home yet and told him that Bill had quit and Yes needed a drummer... and oh yeah, he'd sortuv suggested Alan for the job.
Bill did have a lighter, jazzier approach. He's more of a top kit drummer, as they say, while Alan has more of a traditional approach. But there are indications that the Yes sound was changing direction anyway. When you have longer pieces of music, dynamics and contrast become more important, and Bill really didn't have a heavy side at all. Alan brought that, and was also willing to sit quietly for several minutes during a section where there's no percussion at all. Sure, other drummers could do that, but how many would?
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Short answer:
I love the tracklist and most of the performances, but I don't like the production at all. Never have.
I think we may have had this conversation before, but Yes is one of the few bands that I prefer the studio albums rather than the live versions.
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I agree with you, but I'm actually that way about most bands. I do love seeing live music, and there's nothing like the energy of a live performance. But if I'm just going to listen to an album, I'd rather listen to the studio versions most of the time. There are some bands which really gain something in a live setting, but most of the time I find myself wishing it were mixed better or performed more cleanly. Yes music can be very intricate and subtle, and while they do a great job of playing their very complex music live, I still prefer the studio versions. Their studio albums are just perfect.
Yessongs was recorded by Eddie Offord, who is an absolute wizard in the studio, bringing out the best of bands like Yes, ELP, and others, and they thought he would be the man to capture them live. But he had no experience recording live, and honestly, I've tried for years to figure out how in the hell it could sound so bad. The mix is fine, but the sound quality is crap. It's like it's underwater, or the microphones have blankets over them, or something.
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Sound quality aside, the performances are just stellar. And we're treated to extended solos and jams from songs that were under 10 minutes and have now reached over (and for some, well past) the 10 minute park. They really took the songs from The Yes Album and really energized them on the stage.
The solo spots are all fantastic, as well, and each definitively showcase their talents. This is probably one of my favorite live albums of all time, especially since we get the 4 longer songs from TYA and all 3 tracks from CTTE, as well as 3 of the 4 band-songs from Fragile. I wonder, would the album have been better if we had gotten "South Side Of The Sky" and/or "America" in place of some/all of the solo spots?
-Marc.
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Man, that would've been astounding. But I wouldn't want to lose the solo spots. That was always a big part of their live show, and a big part of Yes. Maybe they could've made it a four-record set, as Chicago did with their first live album.
I grew up with a portable record player, the kind that looks like a little suitcase and the turntable folded down from between two crummy little speakers, but it was actual stereo and I loved it. It lasted me until well into junior high, when I bought my first actual stereo with my paper-route money. I could never go back to it, but to this day, I'm just not that picky about sound quality. Sure, I would prefer it if Yessongs sounded better, and it is much more apparent now that I have decent audio gear, but I never noticed it back then. It's probably because of those humble beginnings that I appreciate the performances on a live album more than I worry about the sound quality.
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Tales from Topographic Oceans (1974)
(https://i.imgur.com/zv5BS7H.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/IaHxOGJ.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitar, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Percussion
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The Revealing Science of God: Dance of the Dawn
The Remembering: High the Memory
The Ancient: Giants Under the Sun
Ritual: Nous Sommes du Soleil
If the epic "Close to the Edge" was their masterpiece, then this is what happened when Yes asked themselves "What now?" Tales from Topographic Oceans consists of four pieces of music averaging over 20 minutes each, together forming a single, larger work. This is the only concept album by Yes, but what a concept it is. Jon wrote the lyrics based on the Buddhist Shastric scriptures. Critics point out that that alone is pretentious and ridiculous, but neither of those criticisms is particularly new to prog rock.
The cover and gatefold were once again was created by artist Roger Dean. Click for the full original painting. (https://i.imgur.com/IaHxOGJ.jpg) Click for gatefold. (https://i.imgur.com/bqYaITP.jpg) It was reaching the point where people would ask two questions when a new Yes album came out: "Have you heard it?" and "Have you seen the cover?"
Once again, Yes had produced an album which divided fans and critics alike. With each piece filling an entire LP side, some accused Yes of deliberately noodling about in order to fill a double LP, while others embraced the more impressionist, improvisational approach. "Close to the Edge" takes most listeners, even seasoned prog veterans, several listens to fully absorb and appreciate. Multiply that by four, and you have some idea of what it takes to digest Tales from Topographic Oceans.
It is difficult to discuss the individual pieces within the album, as each is itself an epic suite and goes through multiple changes. Each runs the gamut from quiet and pensive to loud and bombastic. Each has extended instrumental sections woven around bits that could almost be standalone songs.
"The Revealing Science of God: Dance of the Dawn" opens and closes with a chant and introduces some of the album's main themes. It originally was even longer, with an ambient introduction which was eventually cut, one of the last editing decisions made before final pressing. The restored intro is now on most CD versions of the album.
"The Remembering: High the Memory" is pastoral, the mellowest of the four movements, but it has its moments of excitement and bombast.
"The Ancient: Giants Under the Sun" is the most manic-depressive. It opens with an atonal guitar solo by Steve Howe over a synth-and-percussion backdrop that sounds like a primitive wardance, but also includes extended acoustic guitar work, and some of most beautiful "song" parts of the entire album.
"Ritual: Nous Sommes du Soleil" brings everything together. Each of the major themes is revisited, and it ends with, of all things, a love song.
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I listened to this album twice recently in an attempt to prepare myself to speak intelligently about it for this discography, but this is the best I could do. It is easily the deepest and most challenging Yes album, due simply to its immense size. I consider it one of my favorites, but it's hard to say why, other than that it's just so amazing to be able to put on a single piece of prog music that lasts over an hour. There aren't any individual songs to discuss, just song-like parts. There are some incredible solos, but by time it's over, it's hard to remember exactly where and when they were. I liken it to a Beethoven symphony; there's just so much to it that the best you can really do is say "I do like that part that goes like..." and then sing a bit of it. ♫♫ After perhaps 50 or 60 times through the album, maybe more, I've reached the point where I can sing along with most of it, or whistle or scat with most of the instrumental bits.
In the 70's, you used to be able to buy posters, large beautiful prints of most of Roger Dean's more popular album covers for Yes and other bands. I had several of them, including this one, and I still have it tucked away somewhere.
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Attempting to discuss Tales is a little difficult, largely for the reasons Orbert has already laid out. One thing I noticed about it as I listened to it on CD during my big Yes binge of a few years ago is that the CD age has been kinder to Tales than to some albums. After all, with some editing and cutting here and there, and Tales could be a single CD album much like The Whirlwind is today. It's easier to digest now with most of the album on one CD and able to be listened to in one go without taking the time to flip the album over and get out the next one. I understand perfectly why a lot of the late 70s critics of prog rock can point to it and laugh; it is definitely over the top, even by the standards of 70s prog. I'm not sure if it can be called a masterpiece-I've always thought a single album of the best ideas from Tales would have made a fantastic album-and it may have been one of the nails in the coffin of 70s prog as it was then, but it was also an album that, I think, someone in the progressive rock world needed to make, just to see if it was even possible.
Nowadays, of course, we have Transatlantic banging out 76 minute suites and no one blinks. Yes did it in 1974. For that if nothing else it deserves respect.
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When I first got into progressive music, epic songs were what drew me to some bands/albums, the type of song that was symphonic and had parts or sections or movements, and were long (12, 15, even 20 minutes or more) - this was the type of music that drew me into Yes.
So when I came to Yes (with Genesis and King Crimson at about the same time), it was THIS album that drew the most attention. Four songs, four epics, and such an obtuse concept that would take awhile to figure out, let alone fully understand. In fact, I can't even claim to say I understand the lyrics or their meaning, but it's a very spiritual album, as were much of Jon Anderson's lyrics.
And like the other 1974 double-LP concept album (Genesis' The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway), Tales is an album that really divides the fan-base - some love it, some hate, while others just ignore it. In the case of both, I love them, and Tales delivers some unique musical experiences. While it's not all flash and style, there's a lot of depth and density here, which probably explains why many fans offer the advice of "Listen to it a LOT before you write it off!" because for me, I had to listen to it for over a year before it really sunk in and 'clicked' with me. There's a lot going on in each piece, and really, the whole album must be taken in, and not each individual song. I view the album as a huge symphonic piece, and each 20-minute song is a movement, like a classical 4-movement symphonic work.
Tales From Topographic Oceans does, however, have a sense of prog-rock-pretension, with it's other-worldly artwork, lyrics based on scriptures, long song titles, and the fact that each song took a side of vinyl, but looking beyond all of that, the band really took the next big step after Close To The Edge, and what a step it was. Definitely one of my favorite albums of all time.
Regarding a single-CD mix, I did make one for easier listening without having to switch CDs. I cross-faded the songs and took the 2-minute ambient intro out of the first song. I think I still have that CD-r somewhere...
-Marc.
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Oddly enough, I've probably listened to this album the most out of all the Yes albums, just because I wanted to digest it so much. Most times I'd listen to each song at random points, twice I've just listened to the whole thing in one go. Each song does have something to offer. I remember really liking at least one section in each of the four tracks. However, I've never found that it was all that great. None of the songs are really that memorable to me (I honestly couldn't tell you which song was which) and it's really hard to sit through four epics when none of them are particularly remarkable.
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I didn't much care for this album for a long time. I first heard it in the mid 90s shortly after I had gotten into almost all of their 70s work, and it came across to me as bloated and too all over the place. Fast forward to now, and I still think it is a bit too bloated and over the place, but I gave it more shots a few years back and managed to finally get into it. As a whole, it is a nice album to listen to from start to finish once in a while and just kind of get lost in, but I can't call it one of their best albums. I like the other four albums from 1971-1974 all a lot better, and I'd take the two best Rabin era albums (90125 and Talk) over it.
The two obvious best songs are The Revealing Science of God and Ritual. While neither are top 10 Yes tunes, both are mostly really, really good.
The Remembering is one of the biggest teases ever. It is like it is constantly building up to a major climax that never really happens. No more is this more obvious than when the keyboard solo kicks in around 14:10. For one, that should have been a huge epic keyboard solo, considering the build-up that preceded it, and it is cut way off way too quickly. And two, Steve Howe soloing along with it and almost overtaking it was a travesty. That should have been an all-time great keyboard solo, but Howe and Anderson, the two main writers of the album, just had to take center stage once again, hence Howe soloing over it too much and Anderson cutting it short with yet another vocal reprise section.
The last five minutes of The Ancient are terrific, but the beginning is hard to handle, thanks to that screechy guitar tone of Steve Howe.
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The one thing I often hear when it comes to Tales is that you either love it or hate it. Well I do both.
Sometimes I think that Yes went completely overboard. Tales is over-ambitious, pretentious, the songs are long for the sake of long. The story is too much, too esoteric, too vague to put into music and to this day I haven't understood what it's really about. There's too much noodling for the sake of noodling etc.
On other days I admire Tales because Yes show that they have no boundaries, neither concerning the lyrics and concept nor concerning the music. They created some beautiful parts and to me they clearly gave a shit to what the fans might expect, saying this is what we want so this is what we do and we want to take everything to the next level. For that I have to admire them.
All in all I'm really torn. I have given up in trying to understand what the concept and the lyrics are about but when I listen to it from time to time I always find parts that are simply great and I always find parts where I think the record would be better without. I seldom listen to it in one go because I find it to much to digest. Still it's one of the better Yes records for sure.
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My no. 1 album of all time.
Tales took me till about five years or so ago to fully capture, and once I did, I was hooked. This album serves as a sort of spiritual meter for me, it centers me and gives me focus. There is a lake up in the Tahoe area where I do my yearly camping trips. As the sun sets over the granite cliffs, I put Tales on. Following the setting sun, and watching the ripples in the water reflect its power, I let the music take me, and it takes me to a place where no other can, as I meld with all the beauty around me. The reflected sunlight changes as it sets, the ripples dancing and scampering in tune to the music, tears slowly form, every time. It is the moment I go camping for, sitting on a specific rock about ten feet out in the water, when the guys see me there with the headphones on, they know I am out of commission for a good hour and a half, and they also know I come back at peace with myself and with the world around me. Just typing this brings up those memories and emotions. When I was getting sober, in the very early months, this piece saved my ass on numerous occasions, because it would bring me to that place, that spiritual place where my desire to drink doesn't exist, the place I needed to live in to keep on living, so in that aspect, this album had a part in saving my life too.
On the thematic elements of the album, I just want to touch on Rituals. This song expresses to me my ideal state of being, that of love. The simple yet resounding elements of "we are of the sun" and "we love when we play" strike a chord with my very soul. Nous somme du soleil, we are of the sun, we are beautiful one and all, warm, bright, and giving, that is a potential I honestly feel exist in all of us, and to achieve it, we need the second half, we love when we play. Being to exist in that childlike state of play and innocence, we come to a place where love is not an emotion or a commodity to be given and taken, but a state of being that we can exist in together, this piece taught me that, and I have given my life and soul over to living in that state of being as best as I can, and it has made a resounding and wonderful impact on how I live within the world around me.
Musically, I just love the way this album carries me. The layers of it are constantly growing and changing for me, as I grow and change myself, each member shines brightly on it, and the variation is endless. I don't listen to Tales, Tales decides on the moment where to take me, and I always willingly go, it has never steered me wrong before. I can only hope to live long enough to fully capture what else this work has in store for me.
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That's awesome! :tup
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I do not care for it as much as its 3 predecessors. I've only sat through it a couple times, so it isn't exactly familiar territory. Not bad at all, just not as memorable to me. Needs more listens; I suppose that's what vacation's for.
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I listened to it again over the past couple of days. I'm as certain as ever that this album just isn't meant to be consumed the same way as other Yes albums. As I said upthread, it's like a symphony, a huge piece of music that you sit back and listen to and let it take you on a journey. It's not for everyone, so if it doesn't really work for you, that's okay. But prog is music to be listened to, not danced to, not played in five-minute chunks, and not put on in the background during a party. Sure, there are times and particular prog bits that are the exceptions, but you know what I mean.
Also, Steve's closing solo, starting around 19:50, is absolutely amazing. I love how it goes through all the different changes in mood, all in while wrapping things up. And then the ending. Wow.
And I screwed up in my original writeup. The drum solo is in "Ritual" not "The Ancient". The writeup has been corrected.
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So true. That is when my shift of perception happened with the album,when I started letting it carry me as opposed to listening to it. The more I let go of self,the greater the experience is.
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This was the first time I listened to Tales from topographic ocean in a couple of years, I think. Not because I don't like it, I actually really do. But man, it's requires patience, concentration and a prog mood, if that's even a term.
The Revealing science of God is still my favorite Yes song that contains everything I adore about this band. I personally love The Ancient, Steve Howe is all over it and delivers some of his best work on this song. With it, he managed to create a song that's insanely chaotic and absolutely beautiful, and this is the only time he achieved to have those two sides of his playing so extremely dominant within one song. I don't enjoy Ritual quite as much as others. For me, the drum solo kills it, although everything prior to that section is wonderful. And then there's The Remembering, a song that, in my opinion, builds and builds, but nothing really happens in the end. I understand that it needed to be stretched out to 20 minutes, but that didn't help it become a better song.
I wouldn't call it one of my favorite Yes albums, but it's still really good, and there are some undeniably magical moments.
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So true. That is when my shift of perception happened with the album,when I started letting it carry me as opposed to listening to it. The more I let go of self,the greater the experience is.
This pretty much nails it for me. I mostly like it better than the two that came before it and it really resonates. I don't know how anyone could take it all in after one listen. Depending on the day in might be my favorite Yes album, but there are so many great ones from all of the decades.
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I personally love The Ancient, Steve Howe is all over it and delivers some of his best work on this song. With it, he managed to create a song that's insanely chaotic and absolutely beautiful, and this is the only time he achieved to have those two sides of his playing so extremely dominant within one song.
Yeah, he goes from that harsh Telecaster sound to the beautiful acoustic stuff. The whole album is really a showcase for Steve's playing and, to a somewhat lesser extent, Jon's lyrics. It makes sense, as they wrote almost all of it. I think most other Yes albums show a bit better balance, though I've never really thought about it before. Alan gets to go pretty nuts too, I guess. Chris finds his moments, and as always, he seems pretty happy to have the entire lower end as his playground.
Rick was the only one really upset about this album, and didn't much enjoy making this one. He says that as the songs got longer and seemed to incorporate more noodling about, he lost interest. He finished the album and played on the tour, even though he didn't really enjoy either of them, before quitting the band.
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Relayer (1974)
(https://i.imgur.com/9V1LtQ9.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/AixBEOb.jpg)
(click for full painting)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitar, Vocals
Patrick Moraz - Keyboards
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Percussion
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The Gates of Delerium
Sound Chaser
To Be Over
With Tales from Topographic Oceans, Yes had hit their pinnacle, recorded and published their symphony, and needed to get back to making regular (for them) albums. They eased into it, with an album having the same structure as Close to the Edge: a side-length epic on Side One and two nine-minute pieces on Side Two. And of course another beautiful gatefold cover by Roger Dean.
Rick Wakeman had finished the Tales tour and left Yes (for the first time). Having worked for many years as a session musician with the likes of David Bowie ("Space Oddity"), Cat Stevens ("Morning Has Broken"), Elton John ("Madman Across the Water") and others, and also tasted success as a solo artist, he found working with Yes to be fine when he liked what they were doing, otherwise he didn't see the point in staying on. On his birthday in 1974, he made the decision to leave Yes and called them to tell them. Literally minutes later, his own label A & M called to tell him that his solo album Journey to the Centre of the Earth had just hit Number 1 on the British charts.
(https://i.imgur.com/twt3fmH.jpg)
Chris Squire had spent the band's off-time converting his garage into a studio, which they filled with Eddie Offord's audio gear. The result was a recording space where the band didn't have to worry about what time it was or how many hours they'd have to pay for. They hadn't really worried too much about it before, but now they truly had the freedom to write and record at their own pace and were anxious to begin work on the new album. Unfortunately, they had just lost their keyboard player, so they conducted interviews and auditions while the Relayer sessions began.
An early favorite was a friend of Jon's named Vangelis Papathanassiou, who would later reach international fame with his soundtrack to Chariots of Fire. Vangelis unfortunately had some trouble adjusting to working within a band, especially a band such as Yes as they were pushing into a more jazzfusion, improvisational period, and after two weeks, they all agreed that it just wasn't working.
Yes eventually decided upon Swiss keyboard player Patrick Moraz of the band Refugee, a prog trio in the style of Emerson, Lake & Palmer. (The other two-thirds of Refugee were in fact bassist/vocalist Lee Jackson and drummer Brian Davison, who were in The Nice with Keith Emerson before he'd broken up that band to form ELP.) Before Refugee, Patrick was in Mainhorse, another prog band which had recorded one album before breaking up.
(https://i.imgur.com/cqZhXQ5.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/mcYV91n.jpg)
Patrick's mastery of the keyboards seemed to nicely fill the hole left by Rick Wakeman's departure, and his energetic style fit well with the direction Yes was going. The middle section of what would become "Sound Chaser" was already written, and in one of their first sessions together, they asked Patrick to provide an introduction to it. The frenetic, improvised solo that he provided impressed everyone, and things were off to a great start.
"The Gates of Delerium" -- at 23 minutes, Yes' longest epic of all -- is based loosely on Leo Tolstoy's "War and Peace". It begins with an examination of some of the reasons for war, includes a lengthy instrumental "battle scene" and concludes with a hymn to peace titled "Soon". Atlantic, becoming somewhat frustrated in their efforts get some radio exposure for Yes, released "Soon" as a single in the U.K. and eventually the U.S. as well. In general, Yes maintained their popularity by word of mouth more than by radio singles.
The aforementioned "Sound Chaser" is mostly instrumental, largely improvised, and highly energetic. It is inspired by the jazzfusion sound of Mahavishnu Orchestra and Return to Forever, but with Yes vocals. "Sound Chaser" was originally the opening number on the Relayer tour, but the band eventually realized that by starting with such a high-energy piece, it took another two or three songs until they'd settled down enough to play some of the older material properly.
"To Be Over" starts and ends quietly, but it (like all songs on this album) features an extended Telecaster solo by Steve. Trivia: Many people have tried to figure out the lyrics to the chant at the end of "To Be Over". Jon Anderson finally revealed in an interview that they are gibberish. They just figured out some syllables that sounded nice and fit the music, wrote them out, and sang them.
The recording sessions for Relayer started off well, with the band very excited about their new direction and having a new keyboard player with new ideas, but both musical and personality conflicts began to arise. In particular, Steve had some specific ideas about what he wanted Patrick to play under his guitar solos, and Patrick disagreed with much of it. And while the band was trying to incorporate more improvisation into their work, they each had different ideas how that should work. There was also a slight language barrier between Patrick (whose English was not yet very good) and the rest of the band. This would be Patrick's only Yes studio album.
By the time the album and its tour were done in 1975, a group decision was made, and Yes took its first official hiatus.
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Gates Of Delirium has the "Soon" section on it, yes? Always loved that part. Rest of the song is boring to me though. Sound Chaser is a fun song, but it's low-tier on the list of Yes songs I like. To Be Over... I can't remember what the song sounds like.
I guess it's obvious that I don't think much of this one. :lol Delirium turned me off the first time I heard it, but even though it's one of my least favorite Yes "epics" it still has some good stuff in there. Sound Chaser weirded me out at first too, but I've grown to like it enough. Otherwise, eh. I barely ever listen to Relayer.
Always loved the cover art though. One of my favorite Dean pieces, to the point that the cover art is on one of the only two Yes shirts I own.
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Relayer isn't really one of my favorites, either, to be honest. I don't dislike any of the songs, but they each took me quite a while to get into, and I just haven't reached the point yet where I'm as comfortable with them as I am most other 70's Yes. This is at least partially because Relayer was one of the last Yes albums I bought, back in the 70's when I first started collecting them. Come to think of it, I'm pretty sure it was the last one I picked up. I had both Going for the One and Tormato before this one.
Each Yes album, at least back then, had its own character and personality, so it's no surprise that there are a lot of them which tend to divide the fanbase. This one's the most chaotic, the most out-there. The album cover was another winner from Roger Dean, though.
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Love the music on this album. But to me, the production is one of Eddie's worst jobs. It doesn't feel to me like anything has any separation at all.
Almost like the production on WDADU....sortof like the band was performing in the back of a huge cave, and they hung a single microphone at the mouth of the cave.
The performances are stellar. But it's quite hard to listen to. Tinny and harsh...
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What's really sad is that we're finally reaching the point where I'll actively have to force myself to listen to the next two albums on the list in order to discuss them. I never listen to the next two. :lol
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im loving the thread, though i keep taking large breaks between reads.
Concerning Tales:
a friend of mine and myself are both fairly big Yes-heads, or at least are of 70's Yes, though neither of us have ever been able to get into Tales. well, about 7 months back, another one of our close friends started joining us for board game night, and was, all of a sudden (12 years late to the party), interested in getting into all the prog we were into. apparently he had already scratched the surface with some recommendations from my other friend i found out. anywayz, the other friend and i start discussing Yes at great length when Newbie friend chimes in with, "I dont even know what Yes is, but i know i like it" which i found quite amusing and laughed pretty hard at. so that night we basically both recommended all of the early 70s Yes to him EXCEPT Tales. now i dont know if it was our descriptions, or maybe something he went home and read up on, but the first two Yes albums he gave a shot were Fragile and, of course against our 'orders', Tales.
by the next time we saw him, probably about 3 weeks later, he's raving about Tales, already knows it WAY better than us two Yes-heads, and claims he's having trouble getting into anything else by the band. the guy was a complete prog-Noob, and he embraced Tales like it was an easy feat and he had fallen in love. im still not sure how he did it.
about a year ago in the Yes thread, i discussed my inability to get into the album despite knowing its 3 predecessors and its follow up inside and out. Orbert and maybe KevShmev(?) suggested just tackling one track at a time. i think i only managed to get through the album once more in this fashion, even though it shoulda made things way easier. i guess im gonna have to give it another try. maybe i need newbie friend to get ME into a Yes album now. man, it still trips me out.
Regarding Relayer:
i dont have much time here to write up anything, but to me its their crowning achievement. absolutely love the album and really wish they had done one more with Moraz, somewhat along the same lines (even if i already think the album feels like its along the same lines as CTTE).
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The Soon portion of The Gates of Delirium is one of the most beautiful pieces of music I have ever heard.
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im loving the thread, though i keep taking large breaks between reads.
Concerning Tales:
a friend of mine and myself are both fairly big Yes-heads, or at least are of 70's Yes, though neither of us have ever been able to get into Tales. well, about 7 months back, another one of our close friends started joining us for board game night, and was, all of a sudden (12 years late to the party), interested in getting into all the prog we were into. apparently he had already scratched the surface with some recommendations from my other friend i found out. anywayz, the other friend and i start discussing Yes at great length when Newbie friend chimes in with, "I dont even know what Yes is, but i know i like it" which i found quite amusing and laughed pretty hard at. so that night we basically both recommended all of the early 70s Yes to him EXCEPT Tales. now i dont know if it was our descriptions, or maybe something he went home and read up on, but the first two Yes albums he gave a shot were Fragile and, of course against our 'orders', Tales.
by the next time we saw him, probably about 3 weeks later, he's raving about Tales, already knows it WAY better than us two Yes-heads, and claims he's having trouble getting into anything else by the band. the guy was a complete prog-Noob, and he embraced Tales like it was an easy feat and he had fallen in love. im still not sure how he did it.
about a year ago in the Yes thread, i discussed my inability to get into the album despite knowing its 3 predecessors and its follow up inside and out. Orbert and maybe KevShmev(?) suggested just tackling one track at a time. i think i only managed to get through the album once more in this fashion, even though it shoulda made things way easier. i guess im gonna have to give it another try. maybe i need newbie friend to get ME into a Yes album now. man, it still trips me out.
That's kinda crazy, but it happens. Is your friend into Classical music by chance? Classical fans seem to have less trouble getting into longer pieces of music. It's not anything new to them. As I said a few posts ago, it's more in the way you listen to it. You don't try to absorb it all at once; you enjoy it for the journey it takes you on, and eventually become more familiar with the individual passages within it, and ultimately can follow the whole thing. It can take a while. But it sounds like your friend dove right in, which is another way to go, I guess.
Regarding Relayer:
i dont have much time here to write up anything, but to me its their crowning achievement. absolutely love the album and really wish they had done one more with Moraz, somewhat along the same lines (even if i already think the album feels like its along the same lines as CTTE).
Some folks on the Yesfans boards feel the same way, that Relayer is it. Yes took the epic attitude and the improvisational element and combined them, and reduced it to three songs. The result was concentrated awesomeness. I've listened to Relayer a few times recently to prepare for the Discography and have been appreciating it more, especially "The Gates of Delerium".
"Close to the Edge" (the song) was and is still amazing. But as I pointed out, it ultimately follows a standard format -- intro, verses, bridge, last verse -- just on a grand scale. "The Gates of Delerium" is linear; there's a progression to it. We go through the different parts and don't come back to them. It wouldn't make any sense musically to somehow come back to the beginnining section at the end. That kind of thing. So while the two songs have a bit in common at first glance, being the two standalone epics, it's really only superficial. They're very different songs, which is why many folks are more strongly drawn to one than the other.
Some radio stations received copies of Relayer marked "Banded for airplay". "The Gates of Delerium" was divided into the three sections (the opening part, the "battle", and the "Soon" section) with minor fades between them, so they could play it on the air. The "Soon" edit, which was released as a single and later appears on the compilation Yesyears, came from that.
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Relayer is great, but their best? No way. Really, it follows the same format as Close to the Edge:
Long ass epic: Close to the Edge and The Gates of Delirium are both top 5 Yes tunes, but so I can see the argument for either being better.
9-minute rocker: And Siberian Khatru destroys Sound Chaser, the latter of which has its moments, but is kind of a mess.
A 9 to 10-minute mellow tune: To Be Over is great, but is it really as good or better than And You And I? No chance.
So, given this, I fail to see how Relayer is better than Close to the Edge.
But it is still pretty great, and arguably a top 5 Yes record.
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But that's all just personal preference. "Siberian Khatru" is a favorite of mine, but it's a standard rocker. I know some people really love the manic intensity of "Sound Chaser". Really, it comes out of the gate screaming and never lets up.
I'll give you "And You And I" over "To Be Over" though. :lol But again, that's just taste. "To Be Over" is pretty sweet, too.
And if you're firmly in the camp that prefers "Gates" over CTTE, I can see that swinging the album preference. Relayer is a unique one, and if it's got something that resonates with some people, more power to them.
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Oh, absolutely. That was just me thinking out loud there. :biggrin:
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I have to say, I do like Relayer. It's one of those albums I play when I want something a little different, as it does sound pretty different from most Yes, but I have to agree that Close To The Edge is the one I get on most well with because I love Siberian Khatru, and To Be Over doesn't stick in my mind as well as And You And I, although with the two epics, I'm pretty much equal on both.
On the subject of Tales: I think that album's probably one of those that it just clicks with some people instantly (it did with me and my speaker system I was listening to it through was completely boned at the time too), but sometimes, I can see it will just refuse to click. I think it's not one for the classical fan, but one for the jazz fan because it does meander like crazy and feels less rigid, but I love it very much.
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I love Love LOVE this album. Relayer came to me a bit easier than Close To The Edge, especially the epics. Don't ask me HOW, but "The Gates Of Delirium" just impressed me a lot more during my initial listens than "Close To The Edge" did. I also enjoyed the "manic intensity" (as Orbert put it) of "Sound Chaser" - it's just all over the place and blazing fast, and also quite unlike anything they had done so far. Then there's the cool-down of "To Be Over", soothing and a bit catchy.
Then there's also the cover art, also unlike their previous covers, it's got a colder feel, reflecting the bleak outlook of war as seen/heard in the opening track. Whatever the cover REALLY means, though, is beyond me but it's one of Roger Dean's best with Yes.
Definitely a Top 5 Yes albums for me...perhaps even Top 3!
-Marc.
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Like most of classic Yes albums, I discovered Relayer in the summer of 2009. It was the only one I honestly couldn't get into. After giving it many, and I mean many chances, it finally clicked about two years later. I would now say it's my 3rd favorite Yes album, and the last of their classic period.
The centerpiece, of course, is The Gates of delirium, an absolute beast of an epic with one of the craziest instrumental sections in the history of prog, which is followed by an adorable soft section that almost brings me to tears. Sound chaser is pretty rad as well, I love how Patrick is just going insane here. As for the closer, To be over, it's a very nice song, but not as impressive as the rest of the album, and not as touching as their other ballads.
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I like Relayer, but it feels, I don't know, a little jagged and angular, with all kinds of rough edges. While I know the band was getting more into being improvisational, I'm not entirely certain that sort of music was particularly their forte. I think they worked better with a framework, and probably should have left the more improvisational passages to the live arena. The Gates of Delirium is certainly a fantastic track, but I've often thought that Yes spent a little too much time in the 70s wrapped up with an approach that they weren't as good at as they thought they were. One can argue that after this they whiplashed too FAR in the opposite direction, but we'll talk about that when we get to the next two albums.
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Relayer is great, but their best? No way. Really, it follows the same format as Close to the Edge:
Long ass epic: Close to the Edge and The Gates of Delirium are both top 5 Yes tunes, but so I can see the argument for either being better.
9-minute rocker: And Siberian Khatru destroys Sound Chaser, the latter of which has its moments, but is kind of a mess.
A 9 to 10-minute mellow tune: To Be Over is great, but is it really as good or better than And You And I? No chance.
So, given this, I fail to see how Relayer is better than Close to the Edge.
But it is still pretty great, and arguably a top 5 Yes record.
Destroys?!! i guess one can use such a strong word if one really feels Sound Chaser is "kind of a mess". but man, thats strong. maybe im being a little defensive/dramatic cuz i would probably call Sound Chaser my all time favorite Yes song (and THAT's what i would have liked to see them do more of, particularly if they HAD done another album with Moraz). but really, even my aforementioned buddy, who calls Siberian Khatru his favorite Yes song, wouldnt give SK a landslide dominating victory over SC.
comparing those two albums (Relayer and CTTE), i'd say i slightly favor Relayer's epic, more than slightly favor Relayer's rocker/ripper, and enjoy the two slow-builders/mellow-tunes about equally. maybe when my current album is finished i'll throw them in for closer inspection (particularly the two mellow tunes).
That's kinda crazy, but it happens. Is your friend into Classical music by chance? Classical fans seem to have less trouble getting into longer pieces of music. It's not anything new to them. As I said a few posts ago, it's more in the way you listen to it. You don't try to absorb it all at once; you enjoy it for the journey it takes you on, and eventually become more familiar with the individual passages within it, and ultimately can follow the whole thing. It can take a while. But it sounds like your friend dove right in, which is another way to go, I guess.
um, i wouldnt say hes particularly into classical music, though he has been more interested in going to the symphony the past couple years. i would say before his recent interest in prog, he was mostly more into indie, folk, and ambient type instrumental stuff. but you never know what youre gonna get with that guy, i guess...while hes never struck me as someone overly 'into' music, he HAS explored a lot of different types of stuff over the years.
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Relayer is a weird one for me. I love the songs, especially Gates and Sound Chasers, but this to me seems to be the point where they took a step back spiritually in their music, and never went back to what made the previous two albums so incredible. The songs just don't carry me like the previous ones did. Still some phenomonal music, and Gates is probably my favorite live, absolutly stunning.,
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I absolutely totally adore this album. I LOVE it!
I always get funny looks whenever I say I prefer albums like Tales and Relayer over Fragile and Close to The Edge. But I do. It's not that I don't like those albums, but it just seems like they kept raising the bar with these.
Do I wish it was in Fragile's league sonically? Hell yeah. But I don't let that detract from what could be on any given day the best album they ever recorded.
I really wish at this point they would have kept pushing the envelope in the future. I'd have loved for Moraz to have hung around for a few more albums.
After this is really where I think all of those managerial problems really started to affect the musical vision of the band.
After this one Drama is really the next album I'd put in the same league.
It's funny but I just realized that maybe people really put the Rick Wakeman albums a lot higher on their top list than I do. (Except for Tales of course and he didn't even enjoy that one himself.) I think I need to check if this is more than just a coincidence for me because I don't hate the guy or his playing. Wow! Interesting realization for me after 30-plus years that I need to dig deeper into. Thanks Orbert! It might have taken me even longer to realize this if it wasn't for this thread.
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:tup
I always find it interesting when a band has been around a long time and has gone through a lot of changes, how different people are drawn to different eras or different things over that time. There's so much Yes, and there's some of it that I'll admit I don't listen to very much. There isn't much that I really dislike, it's just that there's so much more that I'd rather hear, and I'm just not likely to play something I don't like as much. But one of the things I was looking to happen with this discography was for people to point out things that they like about certain albums, especially if it's not something I'd noticed before or agree with. Ultimately, I'd like to see it add to my own appreciation for all aspects of Yesmusic.
Rick is a lot like Jordan. Both classicially trained, both with a substantial background in playing different types of music (mostly rock, but different subgenres within that), both better known for their work with a particular band but also known for other stuff. And both very good at supporting and playing within a band, and just a bit of a tendency to overplay or otherwise get carried away.
On Relayer, I can't fault Patrick at all for going nuts a few times, especially on "Sound Chaser" because that's exactly what he was asked to do, and they loved it. Then later they decided they didn't like his style and dumped him. Go figure. If Jordan is the Rick Wakeman of DT, then Derek is the Patrick Moraz. One album, brought something new and different and pretty cool, then dumped.
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Leaving Tony Kaye to be Kevin Moore, of course. :lol
Actually the more I think about it...
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Actually, that analogy works up to a point. He was the original keyboardist and the band certainly could not have gotten started without him. Also, in some ways, he created the template for what was to come. Tony actually came back in the 80's and played on three albums, while KM apparently wants nothing to do with DT anymore, so that's where things fall apart. But yeah.
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Yeah, it doesn't hold up to much scrutiny once you get to the 80s for Kaye. :lol
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(Of course, some say that he never actually played on those albums, so...)
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I wasn't going to muddy the waters of this stretched comparison any further by mentioning that :lol
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Relayer is the best damn thing Yes ever did.
That's all I have to say on the matter.
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Yesterdays (1975)
(https://i.imgur.com/87h30ye.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/A6dd794.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/ODezUuh.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/WbOGoye.jpg)
(front and back covers - click for larger views)
There were plans at one point to release the album with two different covers, but it was eventually decided to make one the front and one the back. The front cover contains a reference to the Time and a Word cover, and the back cover actually comes from a painting that Roger Dean already had completed.
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Peter Banks - Guitar, Vocals
Bill Bruford - Drums
Steve Howe - Guitar, Vocals
Tony Kaye - Keyboards
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
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America
Looking Around
Time and a Word
Sweet Dreams
Then
Survival
Astral Traveller
Dear Father
Up to this point, Yes had put out seven studio albums in seven years. Not particularly unusual in those days, but when you consider that one of those was a double album, and just how much music goes into a Yes album, you can understand that the band needed a break. They took a two-year break, during which time all five members released their first solo albums. (Rick Wakeman, their prolific on again, off again keyboard player, released his third and fourth albums as well as a movie soundtrack during this time).
Still, this left Atlantic Records with no new music from one of their biggest-selling bands, so Yesterdays was created to fill the void. It is an odd album, leading off with a then-rare track from the Fragile lineup, filled out with selected songs from the first two albums (some of which are alternate versions), and closing with an unreleased track, "Dear Father", also from the original lineup.
Promotional albums featuring different bands from a particular label were rather popular in those days. Because the label already owned the rights to the songs and the bands, they were relatively cheap to produce, and if you knew one or more bands that had songs on the album, you might buy it and thus become exposed to several more new bands. The Age of Atlantic was followed by The New Age of Atlantic and it was this second promotional album which featured one of the first songs recorded by Yes after Rick Wakeman had joined the band, their amazing 10-minute cover of Paul Simon's "America".
Yes didn't have many unreleased tracks in those days; most every song they recorded made its way onto an album. The only two exceptions were included here. And while it's not clear why the remaining songs were all from the first two albums, it may be because those first two were before Yes were really well known, and Atlantic felt that they could use a sales boost.
In November 1975, Chris Squire released Fish Out Of Water and Steve Howe released Beginnings.
(https://i.imgur.com/6rjOrPc.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/LlYROVk.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/uboYKeZ.jpg)
Fish Out Of Water has some great songs, is very prog, and is practically a lost Yes album. Chris' high voice is well-known to Yes fans and is similar to Jon's, so it's no surprise that his lead vocals are quite good, and to give it an even more Yeslike sound, Bill Bruford plays drums and Patrick Moraz provides the keyboards.
Beginnings is an excellent showpiece for Steve. Both Alan White and Bill Bruford appear on drums on various tracks, and Patrick Moraz appears on keyboards, but overall the album is not really very prog, although to be fair that's clearly not the intention. There are solo guitar pieces, other instrumentals, and some actual songs. I'm sorry to say, but Steve is fine as a background vocalist, but perhaps should reconsider doing lead vocals on his solo albums.
1976 saw the release of Alan White's Ramshackled. Jon Anderson and Steve Howe both appear on this album. It is the only one of the solo albums from this period that I've never heard, so I can't really comment on it (but I've heard that it's not great).
(https://i.imgur.com/qWrJi2z.jpg)
Right behind Ramshackled was Patrick Moraz's The Story of I. The Story of I is a concept album with some songs and a lot of instrumental work, mostly keyboards, somewhere between early electronica and new age. At the time, it was quite groundbreaking, and I know a lot of people who really enjoy it, but I have a bit of trouble with it. I only first heard it a few years ago, and maybe it's because it sounds rather dated by today's standards. No other Yes members play on this album.
(https://i.imgur.com/gEYvJip.jpg)
The last of the solo Yes albums from this period was Jon Anderson's Olias of Sunhillow. Most people consider either this album or Chris Squire's Fish Out Of Water to be the best of the lot. Olias of Sunhillow tells the story inspired by the cover of Fragile and concluded on Yessongs. The "earth" (not capitalized) is going to explode, and Olias the shipbuilder builds The Moorglade to take his people to a new world. No other Yes members play on this album, but that's because Jon plays all the instruments and sings all the vocal parts himself. Oddly, although Roger Dean did all the paintings which inspired the story, he was not asked to provide the cover for this album.
(https://i.imgur.com/J12Ifcp.jpg)
Just as Yes took a break at this point and fans were given all this to fill in the gap, I'm taking one too. I'm going on vacation, so no more Yes Discography updates for a while. I might be able to post if the place where we're going has wi-fi, but I don't know.
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Always wanted to get into the Yes members' solo albums, but the sheer amount of them by each member is a bit overwhelming. Any recommendations?
As for live albums... never listened to any of them. I don't really go for live albums unless a band has done something to really distinguish the songs from their studio versions. It's nothing against Yes, live albums are just generally not my thing.
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As for live albums... never listened to any of them. I don't really go for live albums unless a band has done something to really distinguish the songs from their studio versions. It's nothing against Yes, live albums are just generally not my thing.
So...have you listened to Yessongs then?! The songs are a bit longer, some are a LOT longer, with improvised sections/jams, some with extended solos, some with jammy-outros. It's a great mix of material and the band really comes alive with the awesome and unique interpretations of the songs, especially the four from The Yes Album!
-Marc.
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Always wanted to get into the Yes members' solo albums, but the sheer amount of them by each member is a bit overwhelming. Any recommendations?
Fish Out Of Water by Chris Squire - Song-based, but pretty proggy. Some longish tunes (11 1/2 minutes and 14 minutes)
Olias of Sunhillow by Jon Anderson - Not really prog, but very good songs.
The Six Wives of Henry VIII by Rick Wakeman - All instrumental, keyboard-driven prog.
Any Steve Howe solo album has a mix of styles.
As for live albums... never listened to any of them. I don't really go for live albums unless a band has done something to really distinguish the songs from their studio versions. It's nothing against Yes, live albums are just generally not my thing.
I'll second Marc's recommendation. Yessongs has Yes at their peak, expanding upon the original arrangements and somehow keeping things tight yet loose at the same time. Yesshows is similar. The live versions of "The Gates of Delerium" and "Ritual" are mind-blowing. It's amazing to hear what these guys could do live.
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Good thread. I'm a huge Yes fan. I'm 36 years old; been listening to Yes ever since my parents introduced me to them in junior high school.
Relayer is my favorite Yes album. I'm not saying it is their best album on a technical level, just my favorite due to the extended instrumental section on "The Gates of Delirium". It also contains my favorite Steve Howie solo on "Sound Chaser" (it starts at the 3:00 mark).
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Despite owning more albums by Yes than any other band in my collection, this period is a black hole for me. I'll just use this opportunity to praise the hell out of their cover of America; that's one of the best examples ever of a band tackling a song and truly making it their own I know of. The discussion when this thread resumes should be interesting to say the least. Watch with wonder as I defend Tormato! :lol
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People should feel free to continue discussing any albums covered so far, or even future ones. I'm just letting people know that I'll be gone (after tonight) and I wanted to get the Yesterdays post out there before I left.
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Going back to Relayer, this is the last great album of the classic Yes. I think up to this album they sound very consistent even though they changed the drummer, the guitarplayer and the keyboardist (twice). Sure you can hear the differences as each musician brings his own style to the table, nonetheless Yes were able to create their own sound.
While I think that Relayer (the track) is great, I find Sound Chaser a bit too hectic at times and To Be Over is just nice.
And the comparison to Close To The Edge has to be made, because the similarities are too great not to notice. You have the epic on side one (which in both cases is also the album title), you have the rocker and the mellow piece on side two, although on Relayer the rocker comes first. For me CTTE wins this in every aspect, but Relayer is still high on my Yes list.
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Going for the One (1977)
(https://i.imgur.com/LmwGt31.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/KU5xQfi.jpg)
(click for full version)
Jon Anderson - Vocals, Percussion, Harp
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums, Percussion
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Going for the One
Turn of the Century
Parallels
Wonderous Stories
Awaken
After a break of nearly two and a half years, Yes was back. As with so many events in Yes history, there are many versions of what happened regarding the departure of Patrick Moraz and the return of Rick Wakeman on keyboards. Patrick Moraz was with them when the sessions began; the album itself was recorded in his native Switzerland. Patrick is thanked in the liner notes and has claimed in interviews that he helped write some of the music (even though he is not credited), but at some point he and the band parted ways. The decision was made by the remaining members to contact Rick Wakeman and see if he would be interested in returning to Yes. Communications between Rick and the band, and between the band, their management, and their P.R. departments, all crossed, and Rick got a phone call asking if he'd like to return to Yes at about the same time he heard on the news that he had already done so.
Going for the One marked the return of Yes to shorter songs, relatively speaking. The album contains five songs, including two singles. "Wonderous Stories" reached #7 on the U.K. charts and the title track reached #24. Yes also chose not to go with a Roger Dean painting on the cover, for the first time since The Yes Album. The cover instead was designed by Hipgnosis, best known at the time for their Pink Floyd covers. The classic Yes logo, created by Roger Dean, appears on the cover.
This album is not, however, without a healthy serving of Yes indulgence. Two of the songs, "Parallels" and "Awaken" feature Rick Wakeman playing the pipe organ at St. Martins Church in Vevey. In Switzerland, it is possible to rent telephone lines for dedicated use, so Yes (who also produced the album themselves) did just that. Microphones were set up in the church where Rick played the organ, and the sound was sent over the telephone lines to the recording studio a few miles away. "Awaken" also features the St. Martins Church choir, and Jon Anderson on harp. Jon considers "Awaken" to be their masterwork.
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This album and Close to the Edge constantly fight it out for my favorite Yes album. This is largely because "Close to the Edge" and "Awaken" are constantly battling for favorite Yes song. If ever there was a statement of the pomposity and pretentiousness of prog rock, it is here where electric guitars and Moog synthesizers play alongside pipe organ, church choir, harp, and triangle.
As much as I love Yes' longer songs, I have no problem with their shorter songs. I love every song on this album, from its weird title track featuring Steve doing rockabilly and pedal steel, to the beautiful "Turn of the Century" with its introspective middle section, "Parallels" with a rock organ solo played not on Hammond but on pipes, to the sheer audacity and brilliance of "Awaken". Jon Anderson has said that he considers this album and the song "Awaken" to be the absolute apex of the band's output, and it's hard to find fault with that statement. They were going for the one.
And finally, the cover always makes me think of the line "Lost in the city..." from "Heart of the Sunrise" off of Fragile.
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I believe I read somewhere that one of the reasons that Rick Wakeman rejoined Yes was that they'd started writing songs again-think it was in the liner notes for the CD reissue of Going For The One, in fact. At any rate, that's a fair summary of the album. The band had worked through the wild, free-form improvisational style that I personally thought they weren't as good at as they thought they were and had started to focus on making memorable, tight songs again. Going For The One felt like the band had realized that what prog had become, both in music and image, had gotten a little out of hand, hence the shorter songs and the replacement of Roger Dean's artwork for a more "modern" and less mystical look. Prog needed to change a little, to learn the power of restraint on occasion, and this album is perhaps the best example of a band doing that from the 70s prog movement.
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Good album, but I've never thought it was all that like a lot of Yes fans do. I'll take everything from The Yes Album through Relayer over it by a wide margin, as well as the main three Rabin albums, Drama and The Ladder. Turn of the Century and Awaken are both really good, but the other three songs, none of which are bad, don't do a lot for me. Plus, the sound of this album annoys me; it is way too high on the treble and way too low on the low end.
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Yes, this is pretty much my favorite Yes album. I was floored the first time I heard "Parallels" as a download on progarchives. Then I eventually got the record, and discovered "Awaken" which pretty much says it all. I really love the simpler songs on this album too, though. "Wonderful Stories" is a nice little tune and "Turn of the Century" is just so sincere and sentimental. I love it.
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Going For The One has a certain beauty to it that isn't present on their other albums. It's a great mix of varying styles that is still essentially Yes. You have a couple of rockers, a couple of ballads, and (what perhaps might be their definitive) epic, "Awaken", which is almost unlike anything they had done up to that point. Probably one of my favorite Yes albums.
-Marc.
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To me, THIS is Yes' masterpiece. Even moreso than CttE. Stunning album from start to finish. To go from this to Tormato...one of the biggest "falling off in a single album" in the history of rock.
But GftO is just... You know what? There aren't enough amazing adjectives. I'd need to go to a thesaurus.
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The title track is my least favorite, I love all the others. Wondrous Stories and Turn of the Century are beauty personified, as only Yes can do. Parallels is a great song. Awaken would put up a good fight for the no. 1 spot on my Yes list. I went to about 8 shows before finally getting to see it live. My girlfriend at the time(not a Yes fan btw) could never understand why I was crying.(incedentally, it was also the show where I saw The Revealing Science of God live). The closing lines of Awaken,"like the time I ran away, turned around, and you were standing close to me" trancends and transects my life on multiple levels.
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I bought it years ago, and only when we got to the Relayer discussion did I give it my full attention. So, barring "Awaken", which I have loved for years, my view is mostly a "just heard it" review.
Like Lonestar, the title track is my least favorite. It's not necessarily bad, but it doesn't really stand out in Yes' catalog. Turn Of the Century has a pretty cool instrumental section in the middle of it, but other than that I don't find it interesting. Rest of the album is great. Parallels is solid to me, even if I found the organ a bit cheesy at first, it really does take the stage by the second half of the song. Wonderous Stories, well, I've already liked that from radio. Just a nice little song that moves the album along, to... one of Yes' best songs. many fans put Awaken in their #1 slot, and it was that that made me listen to it years ago. I love this song. Definitely in my top 5 Yes songs. Admittedly, I like the very epic first section (the build up, and the part that starts up about a minute and thirty seconds into the song) more than the rest, but the whole thing is fantastic.
Extra innings time. The copy I have is remastered with bonus tracks, so... I like Montreux's Theme, the rest is meh.
EDIT: I suppose I now have to listen to Tormato to get ready for the next round. Sigh... :lol
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Good album, but I've never thought it was all that like a lot of Yes fans do. I'll take everything from The Yes Album through Relayer over it by a wide margin, as well as the main three Rabin albums, Drama and The Ladder. Turn of the Century and Awaken are both really good, but the other three songs, none of which are bad, don't do a lot for me.
With a little fix for me, that's exactly what I think about it.
After the great run of albums that started with The Yes Album through to Relayer this is for me the first record that's only good instead of great.
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I've described the story of "Turn of the Century" to people and they say "Oh, like in Faust?" or some other story. I've never read Faust or any of the other great works in literature where an artist creates a likeness of someone and it comes to life, but apparently there are a few of them. But since the idea was new to me and I was still an impressionable teenager, the song brought me to tears.
He's a sculptor; he spends his days working his craft while his lady dances and sings. They're happy just to spend their time together, even if there isn't a lot of interaction. He's working on a likeness of her, but she gets sick during this time and dies before he can finish it. Heartbroken, he cannot bring himself to work again. Time passes, and eventually he finds the strength to finish the sculpture, putting everything he has into it, the memory of every line, every curve, every detail. You can hear it in the music, how the time passes as he works, and you can hear the magic building... building... until the statue comes to life. Steve's guitar takes off, playing those jubilant, triumphant runs. They are together again. Holding hands in the sun, spending their autumn years together.
There are a handful of songs I can put on when I need a good cry. This is one of them. What a beautiful, amazing piece of music.
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Not Faust, but the story of Pygmalion in Ovid's Metamrphoses is of a sculptor who falls in love with his sculpture, and the statue thru the grace of Venus comes alive.
Pygmalion is the inspiration for the George Bernard Shaw play of the same name, and that was made into the musical My Fair Lady.
Anyhoo, I've been enjoying your Yes commentary immensely.
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Thanks, I'm having a good time writing it all. And thanks for the correction, though I seem to think I've been corrected on that point before, yet for some stupid reason Faust sticks in my head.
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I've described the story of "Turn of the Century" to people and they say "Oh, like in Faust?" or some other story. I've never read Faust or any of the other great works in literature where an artist creates a likeness of someone and it comes to life, but apparently there are a few of them. But since the idea was new to me and I was still an impressionable teenager, the song brought me to tears.
He's a sculptor; he spends his days working his craft while his lady dances and sings. They're happy just to spend their time together, even if there isn't a lot of interaction. He's working on a likeness of her, but she gets sick during this time and dies before he can finish it. Heartbroken, he cannot bring himself to work again. Time passes, and eventually he finds the strength to finish the sculpture, putting everything he has into it, the memory of every line, every curve, every detail. You can hear it in the music, how the time passes as he works, and you can hear the magic building... building... until the statue comes to life. Steve's guitar takes off, playing those jubilant, triumphant runs. They are together again. Holding hands in the sun, spending their autumn years together.
There are a handful of songs I can put on when I need a good cry. This is one of them. What a beautiful, amazing piece of music.
Thanks so much for this. I have heard this song a million times, but it sounds brand new to me now.
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I'm not that crazy about Going for the one, but I still quite like it. For the first time since Fragile, the band went back to not filling the album with epics. However, this album proved that epics are still their strength. Awaken is stellar, it's very moving and remains a fan favorite to this day. It would certainly make it to my top 10 Yes songs, and Rick Wakeman delivers some of the most beautiful melodies he's ever played.
Out of the shorter ones, I really enjoy the title track, it just plain rocks. Parallels remains one of my least favorite Yes songs. It's not exactly terrible while it's still listenable, but it's a definition of a bland song, it offers absolutely nothing memorable or even remotely interesting.
Overall, I'm fine with giving this album a listen every now and then, but I don't do it too often.
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Parallels remains one of my least favorite Yes songs. It's not exactly terrible while it's still listenable, but it's a definition of a bland song, it offers absolutely nothing memorable or even remotely interesting.
A rock organ solo played not on a Hammond, but on an actual church pipe organ, recorded over the phone to a studio miles away, is not even remotely interesting? And he doesn't just play a Hammond solo on a pipe organ, he plays it the way you play a pipe organ; listen to the phrasing, his use of the dual manuals. That's classical training.
I'll give you that the solo itself is a bit stiff and clunky, because pipe organs are not meant for rock solos, but I'm pretty sure that this is the first time anyone had ever tried it, and I don't think it's been done since. That's gotta be worth some points, or at least "remotely interesting" doesn't it?
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I like the organ in Parallels, but the rest of the song is pretty run of the mill, IMO. Not a bad song, but just doesn't stand out or do much for me.
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As a new poster to the forums, and as a long time Yes fan, I have to say that this thread is immensely good. I really enjoy hearing people's thoughts and more information on all the Yes albums throughout the years. It has also caused me to listen to some of these albums again with a fresh outlook.
For whatever reason, Going for the One does not get a lot of play time when I am in the mood for classic Yes. This and Tales seem to get overlooked by me, though I know why I don't listen to Tales much. With Going for the One, I always remembered the title track, Turn of the Century (thanks for the background on this!) which I loved, and Wondrous Stories. This thread inspired me to take a new listen to the album, and I am quite glad I did. I really don't know how I passed over "Awaken". What a great track. I think the best part about it is that when it is over, you think that much more time as passed than just 15 minutes, because it is such an epic track.
I did also notice a couple of other things when listening to this album again. Sections of it really remind me of other later albums that Yes band members would go on to make. Steve's acoustic guitar playing in Turn of the Century reminds me of Toe the Line by GTR, of which he was a member, and also the piano and instrumental section that starts around 4:00 of Turn of the Century reminds me of bits of the Anderson Bruford Wakeman and Howe album.
Looking forward to the rest of the albums!
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This album and Close to the Edge constantly fight it out for my favorite Yes album. This is largely because "Close to the Edge" and "Awaken" are constantly battling for favorite Yes song. If ever there was a statement of the pomposity and pretentiousness of prog rock, it is here where electric guitars and Moog synthesizers play alongside pipe organ, church choir, harp, and triangle.
Those are my 2 favorite Yes albums as well. I'd say that my favorite Yes song is Close to The Edge and my favorite album is GFTO. Both are practically tied for first.
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Going for the One is the Yes album that didnt quite win me over despite a number of attempts and (mostly) kept me from further exploring the later catalog.
its been a while, so i cant say much, though i did revisit the title track and closing track the other night when i had a free 20 minutes...and im gonna say something controversial bout the title track. it pains me to even say it: the title track is pretty killer and rocking, but steve howe (cant believe im saying it) ruins it for me. the leads near the end of the song mostly dont fit and theyre also too loud in the mix. there, i said it. sorry fans of the song/album. and my dearest apologies to steve howe. still love you, bud.
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A lot of people don't care for the title track, so don't feel like you have to apologize. Towards the end, when they're doing the thing where they repeat phrases and build up to the big finish, his wailing adds to the insanity for me. But I can see how Steve's crazy "soloing over everything" can be a distraction.
One thing about Yes is that their instruments don't play "normal" roles all the time. Steve is playing leads and countermelodies at least as often as he plays chords, maybe even moreso. Chris' bass lines are almost the same thing; he's all over the place down there, not just playing a bassline, but practically adding another melody. I love their uptempo stuff where everyone's going nuts and it all somehow works. But again, I can see how some people would find it a turnoff.
Also, the sound and production on this album isn't the greatest. I know I've mentioned this upthread, but back in those days, it just didn't matter, or not nearly as much. For one thing, vinyl is naturally warmer sounding. Cheapo turntables such as were common in the 70's and 80's didn't have a lot of high end reproduction, so that brashness wasn't nearly as in-your-face as it is today, with everything remastered on CD and sounding crystal clear. In fact, I'd say that the brightness may have been intentional. A lot of bands made some really good, really mellow sounding albums, and that's great, then Yes come along with lots of "Ahhh-ahhh!" and cymbals and bells and harps and really, people didn't know what to think. To me, this album sounds very "live" even though it's a studio album. You can hear everything. I've listened to Going for the One with the treble turned down a bit, and it's still really clear and helps balance things.
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A rock organ solo played not on a Hammond, but on an actual church pipe organ, recorded over the phone to a studio miles away, is not even remotely interesting? And he doesn't just play a Hammond solo on a pipe organ, he plays it the way you play a pipe organ; listen to the phrasing, his use of the dual manuals. That's classical training.
I'll give you that the solo itself is a bit stiff and clunky, because pipe organs are not meant for rock solos, but I'm pretty sure that this is the first time anyone had ever tried it, and I don't think it's been done since. That's gotta be worth some points, or at least "remotely interesting" doesn't it?
I wasn't aware of that. It's a very original idea, but it wasn't executed that well, at least for my taste. I don't care if he played it on a washing machine, nothing about it touches me, it doesn't even rock. I admire it, but I don't like it.
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That's fair. It's not a great solo, but one of the things about prog that I've always found attractive is that prog bands are willing to try crazy things like this. I find the very idea of combining pipe organ and electric guitars interesting. Rick is not a jazzy, bluesy type of rocker. He's almost not even a rocker, despite almost 50 years in the business. He comes from classical, same as me and probably most other keyboard players, since most of us started with piano lessons when we were kids.
Listen to a Rick Wakeman solo. There are never any blue notes. No sevenths or ninths. No R&B at all. He has somehow adapted his classical training into something that works in rock and roll. The recently deceased Jon Lord of Deep Purple may have helped pave the way for that, bringing his classical chops (think "Highway Star") to people's ears, even though he obviously had his R&B side (everything else).
Anyway, I didn't mean to give you so much shit; I just was taken aback by someone saying that there wasn't anything remotely interesting about the song. I like the song itself, but what they're doing on it I find amazing. It's like J.S. Bach rose from the grave and played the solo. Doesn't quite work, but works well enough, and bonus points for doing it in the first place.
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Solid and certainly better than Tormato, but I still prefer the Rabin years and some of what came after that to Going For The One.
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Solid and certainly better than Tormato, but I still prefer the Rabin years and some of what came after that to Going For The One.
Man, talk about a back-handed compliment! :lol
But I guess we should wait for Orbert's review first before we lay into how awful Tormato is.
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It's coming. I listened to Going for the One again yesterday, just because I love it so much. I've listened to Tormato many times over the years as well, since I don't hate it as much as many seem to, but I do like to give each album at least two full listens before I start my writeup.
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Tormato (1978)
(https://i.imgur.com/Ke2JwCS.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/ybPIVRA.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/XF1JhS3.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/dZ2TmZo.jpg)
(front and back covers -- click for larger views)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums, Percussion
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Future Times / Rejoice
Don't Kill the Whale
Madrigal
Release, Release
Arriving UFO
Circus of Heaven
Onward
On the Silent Wings of Freedom
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"Tormato was a bit of a mess!" -- Jon Anderson
"We were trying to produce ourselves and we sometimes paid the price" -- Steve Howe
"Tormato has never been my favorite album." -- Alan White
"It just seems to me like both Rick and Steve on that particular album were seeing which one could play more notes than the other one." -- Chris Squire
Yes was once again in turmoil. The writing team of Jon and Steve which had produced such amazing music on earlier albums didn't seem to be working, so Jon wrote much of the album alone and with Rick. This is contrary to the credits on the album.
"Never believe credits on any album. They're all political." -- Rick Wakeman
The times were changing. Prog was being eclipsed by Punk and New Wave. Yes tried to stay current with shorter songs and obtuse album covers, but the result was an unbalanced album which did not play to their strengths. Jon was writing lots of songs, and it's no surprise that the number of songs written by Jon which made it onto the album more or less reflects how many more he had written for the Tormato sessions. This also shifted the overall sound to a more "song-based" approach. Gone were the long instrumental excursions which characterized earlier albums and cemented Yes' place as one of the premiere prog bands of the 70's. Replacing them were short, strange songs about UFOs and political songs about whale hunting and musings on what it might be like if Heaven itself came to Earth.
Rick had some new keyboards and was clearly very keen on seeing everything that they could do. His ongoing relationship with the Moog company had put one of the first Polymoogs in his hands; meanwhile, he had been working on developing a successor to the Mellotron, a device he dubbed the Birotron. These keyboards dominate the album, replacing the classic Hammond, acoustic piano, and even Minimoog which had been his standard keyboards for years.
"On Tormato, keyboards were in real conflict with me not so much in the notation, but in the sound. The Polymoog and other things weren't sympathetic." -- Steve Howe
The album is not without its high points. "Onward" is a beautiful song by Chris, featuring a French horn solo (actually keyboards) by Rick. "Madrigal" is an actual madrigal written by Jon and Rick, and while Steve and Chris also play on it, it clearly began as a simple voice and piano piece. "Future Times" and "Release, Release" are high-energy rockers. "Don't Kill the Whale" took many people aback with its blatant political message, but it charted in both the U.K. and U.S. And the album closer, "On the Silent Wings of Freedom" is an old-style Yes prog song, complete with mood changes and multiple instrumental adventures featuring Chris, Steve, and Rick.
Tormato may have been painful to create, but the "Yes in the Round" tour which supported it was considered one of their best to date. They played in the round, on a rotating stage with Jon in the middle, slightly elevated, and the others at the four compass points. The stage slowly rotated throughout the show, giving everyone in the audience a chance to see each member of Yes from every angle. Yes was so excited by the success of the '78 tour that they hit the road again in '79 without an album to support, just for the joy of playing.
Sadly, this turned out to be a mistake, as by the time the '79 tour was finished, they were all exhausted, and Yes decided to take another hiatus.
(https://i.imgur.com/gbN6iVi.jpg)
Jon, perhaps opened to the idea of working solely with a keyboardist after his work with Rick on Tormato, took this time to make Short Stories with Greek keyboard virtuoso Vangelis Papathanassiou. Just as it sounds, the album consists entirely of keyboards and Jon's solo voice.
(https://i.imgur.com/SHh4DZ8.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/fsKIxW0.jpg)
Steve meanwhile created what many consider to be his essential work, The Steve Howe Album which, like his first album, Beginnings, features a cover by Roger Dean. Also similar to his first album are the appearances of both Alan White and Bill Bruford on drums (on various tracks) as well as Patrick Moraz on keyboards. Unlike his first album, Steve restricts his vocals to a single track, and another track ("Look Over Your Shoulder") features vocals by Claire Hamill. The rest of the album is an instrumental showcase for Steve, who plays eight different instruments, including bass, pedal steel, sitar, banjo, and mandolin. It concludes with two pieces performed by Steve on guitar and a 59-piece orchestra. The first is a piece written by Steve, and the second is a Vivaldi concerto arranged for guitar and orchestra by Steve.
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I don't hate this album the way many Yesfans seem to. It's not one of my favorites, but I bought it shortly after it came out and it was actually one of my first Yes albums, so it holds a special place for me. And it doesn't sound "dated" to me, not in the negative sense. It just sounds like a late-70's album does, especially the keyboards. Rick has always been about trying new things with keyboards and sounds, not always with great results, but some of his work on this album is really good. It's just played on keyboards that people don't like.
Rick's French horn solo on "Onward" is still, to me, the single greatest example of how to play a synthesizer and make it sound like another instrument. Listen to the phrasing, the ways he uses glissando and not portamento, the way the timbre changes as he reaches for the high notes, just as a real French horn would do. It is brilliant.
The interplay between Rick and Steve on "Silent Wings" is an all-time Yes highlight, from any album. Even more incredible is that the song started as a jam by Chris and Alan.
I know, the whole "UFO" thing is silly. But to this day, I remember hanging out in a friend's dorm room with Tormato blasting as he played pinball, and when the aliens landed and the music kept building, building, building, he was just going crazy because the music was so intense.
It's an uneven album, and it's not very prog in that it's mostly "regular songs", no extended tunes with multiple movements or changes in mood or tempo or time signature or even key. But as with every Yes album, the playing is still top notch. Chris' bass is as in-your-face as ever. Alan's drumming is phenomenal. The mixing and production are odd, but again, I don't consider them bad, just different.
Okay, start throwing tomatoes.
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The live version of Onward from the first Keys album absolutely slays the studio version. Other than that, I don't have much good to say about Tormato.
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Ahh, Tormato. How to discuss you without being overly dismissive, since it's clearly the lowest point Yes had in the 1970s-and you can argue their career, and I wouldn't be able to say you were wrong.
Going For The One's shorter songs did prefigure the direction that Tormato was heading in. Overall, the band's sound had become less edgy and improvisational and had become a bit more modern sounding and focused. In that regard, the band certainly hit on HALF of what they were aiming for. Tormato certainly sounded more modern than any Yes album to date-in fact, in many ways, it sounded more like a product of 1983 than 1978, largely due to Wakeman's keyboards. Focused songwriting, however, the band lacked on this go round. A lot of prog bands, at least the biggest, most successful ones, were going through evolutions at the time-Emerson, Lake And Palmer threw out the godawful Love Beach to fulfill a contract obligation, and filled half of it with dreadful pop songs, while Genesis was beginning their evolution towards being less a prog band and more a smart, pop rock band with And Then There Were Three. Yes felt the same change in the air as those two bands, and their effort fell somewhere in the middle. What killed Tormato dead, or at least, made it less than appealing, was that it was somewhat half baked. There's a lot of good ideas in there, but they don't really congeal into a whole. Tormato always feels somewhat at a distance to me, even at its best moments; it wasn't Yes going through the motions, it was Yes not really sure what motions they should be making. Howe and Wakeman never really work well together on the album, and it hurts it in a lot of places.
I could offer a defense of this album, though, if one thing hadn't happened; if Anderson and Wakeman hadn't left. I think the next album this line up COULD have made might have learned from the mistakes made here and been an album that managed to be concise while remaining prog. Interestingly, Howe wound up doing a lot of songs that qualified as that with Asia, and the entire band adopted that approach with Rabin. But I won't credit Tormato for helping there, I'll leave that notion to more knowledgeable Yes fans.
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Jon and Rick did leave, but the next album, Drama, is one of my favorite Yes albums. Jon and Rick wanted to go in a mellower direction. Meanwhile, Steve, Chris, and Alan wanted to get heavier and try to get back to the prog sound they'd established in the 70's, and Drama scores in that department. Short Stories is pretty lightweight, as are Rick's solo albums from this time.
I think it was an album that had to be made, if only to force the issue. Jon Anderson was more and more starting to see himself as the leader of Yes, not just the lead singer. And he wasn't completely wrong; "Close to the Edge", Tales from Topographic Oceans, and "The Gates of Delerium" were all his ideas. I'll give him credit for those. What blows me away is that in just a few years, he went from that to songs about UFOs and The Circus of Heaven. Jon leaving, and Rick following, were necessary for the evolution of Yes to continue.
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Jon and Rick did leave, but the next album, Drama, is one of my favorite Yes albums. Jon and Rick wanted to go in a mellower direction. Meanwhile, Steve, Chris, and Alan wanted to get heavier and try to get back to the prog sound they'd established in the 70's, and Drama scores in that department. Short Stories is pretty lightweight, as are Rick's solo albums from this time.
I think it was an album that had to be made, if only to force the issue. Jon Anderson was more and more starting to see himself as the leader of Yes, not just the lead singer. And he wasn't completely wrong; "Close to the Edge", Tales from Topographic Oceans, and "The Gates of Delerium" were all his ideas. I'll give him credit for those. What blows me away is that in just a few years, he went from that to songs about UFOs and The Circus of Heaven. Jon leaving, and Rick following, were necessary for the evolution of Yes to continue.
Jon seems to have gone from being "off in the deep end" to "out in left field" around that time. I guess Magic Mushroom teas once per day will do that to a man.
I've never heard Tormato in it's entirely, so I'll reserve comment.
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Jon has always been a very spiritual person. He speaks of God in a monotheistic way, not in the sense of a Christian god but more like he's open to outside ideas and a cosmic consciousness and all that. I ridicule the song "Arriving U.F.O." but it's not really a stretch for Jon; it wouldn't surprise me at all to find that he believes firmly in extraterrestrials. I just prefer my Yes music a bit more vaguely ethereal.
Quotes from other members of the band hint that Jon was starting to see Yes as his personal vehicle; Jon just says that he was writing a lot more than the others, so naturally that ratio would be reflected in what made it onto the album. The problem is that Jon doesn't separate his songs from what would be more appropriate for Yes. But if the others weren't writing a lot, I'm not sure that they had much room to complain. Rick continued to crank out solo albums, and Steve made some amazing music on his solo album from this period. If they had brought those ideas to the Yes table, Tormato would have been a very different album.
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Arriving UFO doesn't really bother me considering the time frame; the 70s were big on extraterrestrials visiting the earth and being responsible for ancient wonders, especially the whole Chariots of the Gods thing, and UFO sightings were a big deal back then, largely due to Close Encounters of the Third Kind, admittedly, but UFOs were part of the cultural zeitgeist back then. In fact, in 1978, you were running into sci fi themes a lot thanks to a lot of reasons, even Star Wars (which I doubt is the case here.) It would have been ODD if some band didn't address UFOs in some fashion.
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What can I say about Tormato... I like "Don't Kill The Whale". The beginning sounds like the theme to a crime detective show. Not really interested in the rest of the album. And the cover art and album title are atrocious. I know the story behind it, but still, it's awful. Thank goodness they went back to Dean for the next one.
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I'm not really a fan of this album. It does sound like a mess. There are some great parts, Onwards is very nice and Release release can be a lot of fun, but I'm not sure about the rest. Even the proggy stuff doesn't do anything for me...
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So it's come to this, the first really low point in their long career. And the cover art with the thrown tomato seems like a self-fulfilling prophecy.
This album to me always was more of a Anderson solo release than a group effort and that may be the problem. It's more song orientated and less proggy, that in itself is not necessarily bad, but the songs for the most part just don't work. Future Times and On The Silent Wings Of Freedom are decent, Don't Kill The Whale is a fun song despite it's blatant message but the rest is just meh. And did they really think that including Anderson's son to talk about a circus was a good thing?
Maybe they just ran out of ideas or were a little burnt out in the creative area but it's obvious that something had to change to revitalize the band. Looking at Drama it seems that the departure of both Anderson and Wakeman (again) was excatly that.
In conclusion: Don't hate, don't like, normally don't listen to it.
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Drama (1980)
(https://i.imgur.com/2EkG86a.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/pmWugkr.jpg)
(click for full painting)
Geoff Downes - Keyboards
Trevor Horn - Vocals, Bass
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Keyboards, Vocals
Alan White - Drums, Percussion
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Machine Messiah
White Car
Does It Really Happen?
Into the Lens
Run Through the Light
Tempus Fugit
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After the 1979 tour, Yes reconvened in what have become known as "the Paris sessions". They felt that a change of scenery would give them a fresh outlook and perhaps spark some new ideas. Some of the results of these sessions can be found as bonus tracks on this album and elsewhere, and they reveal that the musical direction of the band had not changed much since Tormato. That is, Jon Anderson seemed to be writing the bulk of the material, and the material itself was simpler, more song-based. This seemed to frustrate the rest of the band, especially Steve, Chris, and Alan, who were looking to either move into a heavier direction or return to their proggier sound from earlier in the 70's. Amidst these tensions, Rick Wakeman decided to leave the band again, and Jon Anderson followed shortly after.
Steve, Chris, and Alan chose to carry on with Yes. They began working on new material, although they weren't sure what form the new Yes would take. Continuing as a power trio was a possibility, as was the idea of finding a new singer and probably keyboard player as well. Although Chris and Steve both sing, outtakes from the new "London sessions" are all instrumental.
(https://i.imgur.com/slJC0mh.jpg)
As it happened, Yes manager Brian Lane also managed a new band, The Buggles, who had a hit single ("Video Killed the Radio Star") and a hot album in the charts (The Age of Plastic). The Buggles also happened to be a duo, a singer and a keyboard player. Brian suggested that they try playing together, just to see what might come up. After one session together, Chris asked them to join Yes.
Trevor Horn, the singer, was not so sure; in fact, he resisted. He knew that joining Yes meant that he would at some point be asked to sing onstage before huge crowds and essentially "be" Jon Anderson. Either that, or he would be seen as the one who dared to replace Jon, and either way, Yes audiences would likely reject him. Besides, he honestly preferred the production side of music-making and did not consider himself a great singer. Keyboardist Geoff Downes was into the idea. He had literally dreamed of playing in Yes and had written a song about it ("Tempus Fugit"). Trevor eventually gave in and the lineup for the new album was complete.
Drama reflected the heavier direction that Steve, Chris, and Alan had been pushing for, combined with the whimsy and new age sound of The Buggles, and the end result is rather progressive. It seemed fitting that artist Roger Dean was asked to provide the cover art, for the first time in half a decade. Drama is considered a worthy addition to the Yes catalog by many fans and their strongest effort in years. The sound quality is also noticeably better than the previous few albums, partly due to the return Eddie Offord at the console. After backing tracks had been laid down, however, Eddie left, and the album was finished by the band.
While the album was considered a success, critically if not commercially, the ensuing tour was nearly a complete disaster. Trevor's voice was similar to Jon Anderson's, but not strong enough to sustain the high range of the Yes catalog every night. There were certainly some off nights, and as predicted, crowds reacted poorly to the new lineup. Some fans attended the concerts with no idea that either Jon or Rick had left the band. It probably did not help that The Buggles, who had replaced their beloved Jon and Rick, were seen as one-hit wonders, no more than a lightweight pop act. (This is unfair, as Geoff is a gifted keyboard player and The Age of Plastic quite a good album.)
With concerts getting poor reviews and some cancelled for poor ticket sales, the tour ended prematurely. The "great experiment" of trying to continue without Jon and Rick seemed to have been a failure, and Yes officially broke up after Drama. Steve and Geoff went on to form Asia, Trevor went back to his first love, producing, and Chris and Alan began looking for new projects.
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Great album! Machine Messiah is a Top 5 Yes song for me. I don't care that Jon isn't on it, great music is great music.
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Trevor Horn - Vocals, Bass
I doubt Trevor Horn played any bass on Drama.
My fav Yes album. :hefdaddy
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Drama is my favorite Yes album. It's possibly the only one where I wouldn't skip a single track. There... there really isn't much more to it than that. I love the songs on here, cheesy as some of them may be, and I really wish the rest of 80s era Yes had followed this direction.
Chunkilicious bass ftw. :metal
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One thing about Drama that's always interested me-and it's a great album, one of my higher end Yes albums-is how bloody HEAVY it is. Especially in terms of Steve Howe's overall career-I always wondered how he went from the sound he had on Tormato, to the simply massive sound he had on Drama, then back to the sound that was closer to his usual on the Asia albums. Someone more knowledgeable about his work may have an answer, but Drama just sticks out like a sore thumb with his sound (you can cite the one GTR album too, but Drama is WAY away from the Howe norm.)
Another thing about this album: I was listening to it when I finally bought it on CD a few years ago, and I thought, I swear, the following: "Man, Trevor Horn wasn't really that great a singer, but he was awesome on the production end. I wonder what Yes with him producing a different singer would have sounded like?"
Thirty seconds later: "Hold on a minute..."
:rollin
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I really like this album. I've heard Going For The One, but not Tormato, but Drama seems a lot more fresh than Going For The One to me. Machine Messiah and Tempus Fugit rock so damn hard too.
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Trevor Horn - Vocals, Bass
I doubt Trevor Horn played any bass on Drama.
He plays bass on "Run Through the Light". Chris plays keys on that one.
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I like this record. Machine Messiah is a great tune, and everything else is pretty solid. Having no Jon Anderson is a bit strange, but I can handle it for this record, although I expect it might have been different had I been a fan at the time this came out (similar to how ambivalent I was towards Fly from Here last year).
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I remember getting into the band in the summer of 2009, listening to all of their classic records, even Tormato, but for some reason skipping this one. Man, was I missing out! I was probably skeptical about an album without Jon Anderson, but I don't miss him at all when listening to Drama.
Tempus fugit and Machine messiah are among their best songs, especially the latter, being absolutely intense and heavy, yet beautiful. Also, dare I say that Does it really happen is almost as good as the two classics I mentioned, I'm having so much fun every time I hear it, the groove is incredibly infectious. And lets not forget Into the lens, a song that I couldn't get out of my mind the first time I heard it, and I still can't get enough of ''I am the camera, camera camera.''
Overall, Close to the edge is untouchable, Fragile and Relayer follow, then there's The Yes Album, and finally Drama. These five albums remind me why I love this band so much.
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I did not comment on Tormato, mostly because it was never one of my favorites among their first 10 albums, and in fact, I would rather take most of their first two albums over most of Tormato. I have grown to appreciate it more over the years, but it's still slightly under par for what they were capable of, being the same lineup that put out Tales From Topographic Oceans and Going For The One. There were two or three songs on it that I really liked, but following an album like GFTO and preceding the greatness of Drama, it's just the bad tomato in the sandwich of two meaty monsters.
As for Drama, I absolutely love Love LOVE this album, and when I first got into Yes, I could not get enough for it. This is probably one of their best albums, IMO, and definitely worthy of a spot in my Yes Top 5. "Machine Messiah" rocks in a way that they had only touched on before, and it's so HEAVY and powerful. Unexpected after their previous album, but more than welcome. The follow tracks after it are all great, well produced pieces of music. This whole album is one I have kept in my car's CD player for days and weeks on end, spinning it everywhere I'd go. Definitely one I can never get tired of listening to! It's just so good, you almost forget Jon and Rick even left the band!
-Marc.
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There are really only two reasons why people didn't expect this album to be any good: Jon Anderson and Rick Wakeman. With them gone, the assumption was that Yes would pretty much fall apart. But look at the direction in which Jon had taken them with Tormato; the others called it "too folksy" or just too light. That's what Jon was into at the time. And while Rick is one of my favorite keyboard players, he was getting into some pretty cheesy sounds, and the success of Relayer showed that he wasn't irreplaceable either.
Geoff Downes was very good for one so inexperienced, and his approach to keyboards is actually very similar to Rick's. He has an ear for orchestration, using the different sounds in layers, and it works within Yes the same way as Rick's keyboards had. In fact, probably moreso, as Steve had expressed frustration with Rick's choices of late and found it hard to work with. In The Buggles, Geoff was basically the entire band, so he knew how to create space, and how to leave room for other instruments to fill. The other instruments used to be more keyboards, but it's really the same principle; each instrument worked within its space. Steve once again had room to go crazy with his constant "solo over everything" style, and Chris owned the lower end, as always, in a similar way.
Trevor's voice is high, but otherwise isn't really very much like Jon's. What made it work is that his voice blended with Chris' and Steve's in the same way as Jon's; the classic Yes three-part harmonies were still there. His lyrics were somewhat whimsical and spacy, and in that sense not too different from Jon's lyrics from the early 70's. Jon had actually started his trend towards more literal lyrics by this time, so it could be argued that Trevor was actually more suited to Yes than Jon was at this point.
Drama is one of my favorite Yes albums. When it came out, I had my doubts, but I'd heard "Tempus Fugit" on the radio and thought it was a cool song, and when I went to the record store, I was thrilled to find that not only was there a Roger Dean painting on the cover, but the album "opened up". For some reason, this was always very important to me. An album with a jacket that unfolded was just cooler than one which didn't. Usually the cover art continued around to the back, forming a larger picture, and it also meant there was an inside gatefold for more art, photos, lyrics, or whatever. Tormato was the first Yes album that didn't open, and not only was it disappointing just for that, but it was also a sign to me of their lowered status as a band; it meant that Atlantic was no longer willing to invest in deluxe packaging for Yes albums, and that was discouraging. Drama was a return to form in many ways. But with the way the album was received, and the disastrous tour which followed, it's understandable that this was really the last straw. The 70's were over, and so was Yes (for now).
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Another thought-
Of all the 6-song albums released in 1980 by a band with a single-word name, Yes' Drama is probably my second favorite!!!
-Marc.
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I like Permanent Waves too, but it's second to Drama for me.
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I like Permanent Waves too, but it's second to Drama for me.
Yes, but how close are they? :tup
To me, it's probably pretty close. I've also been on a near 2-month long Rush binge, so I've been all about Rush for weeks now.
Also, PEW probably ranks in my Top 5 Rush albums, so it's already pretty high on my "All Time Favorite" albums list.
-Marc.
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It's pretty close. I've been a Rush fan longer than I've been a Yes fan, but I think my infatuation for Yes just goes a bit deeper. I'd put Moving Pictures over Drama, but probably not Hemispheres, for example. Both bands had some good runs of killer albums.
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Drama is good, but Permanent Waves is all-time great. It ain't close in my book.
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Not sure how Rush comes into play here, but....
Strangely, as much as I'm not much into Tormato, the mix isn't bad and there are a lot of neat things going but it's not sustained for some reason for me.
Drama is a top Yes album for me. When I first heard it shortly after it came out, I was unaware of any baggage or ...wait for it....drama associated with this album.
I love the modern sound and it still doesn't sound very dated to me. Although some effects are "trapped in the 80's" the emphasis is definately on the music.
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I didn't think much about the title until later, but it does seem to fit, doesn't it? I think it was Steve who was asked what the title Drama meant, and he just said that it seemed appropriate. Typical Steve Howe answer, quite direct if you understand what he's getting at, otherwise pretty obscure.
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Yesshows (1980)
(https://i.imgur.com/YpY54tB.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/HH7J5ax.jpg)
(click for full painting)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Patrick Moraz - Keyboards
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums, Percussion
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Parallels
Time and a Word
Going for the One
The Gates of Delerium
Don't Kill the Whale
Ritual
Wonderous Stories
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When Jon and Rick left Yes in 1979 following the Tormato tour, the remaining members chose to carry on, but Atlantic Records was not so sure about the future of the band. It was therefore decided that it was time for another live album, to keep Yes in the public eye and ear, and of course to bring in some revenue for the label.
Chris sat down with tapes from the past three tours and began editing. At one point, Yesshows was to be like its predecessor Yessongs in that it would be a triple LP package and feature the entire album Tales from Topographic Oceans, just as Yessongs had contained all of Close to the Edge. Chris was also asked to prepare a two-LP version, in case it was decided that another three-LP release wasn't feasible. Then the famous meeting of The Buggles with Steve, Chris, and Alan took place, leading to the Drama sessions and eventual album, and the Yesshows project was shelved.
After the band officially broke up in 1980 following the aborted Drama tour, Atlantic decided to release Yesshows after all. Apparently because Yes technically did not exist at the time, no one from the band was consulted, and someone at Atlantic dug up the two-LP rough cut that Chris had put together. This became Yesshows.
Yesshows has material from the Relayer, Going for the One, and Tormato tours, which is why both Rick and Patrick appear on keyboards. Patrick plays on "The Gates of Delerium" and, perhaps surprisingly, on "Ritual". The remaining tracks have Rick on keyboards as they were taken from the later tours.
The album opens, as does Yessongs, with an excerpt from Stravinsky's "Firebird Suite". But in this case, we join the excerpt nearer to its conclusion. We hear the applause as the band takes the stage, and they play along with the final segment, leading directly into "Parallels" to open the concert.
Because of its length, "Ritual" was originally split across the two sides of the second LP. There was a fade-down at the end of side 3, then a fade-up at the beginning of side 4, just before the point of the fade-down, so no music is actually missing, but it was still unfortunate that the song had to be treated this way. Incredibly, the two parts were not rejoined on the original CD release but instead the fade-down and fade-up were preserved as on the original vinyl. This was eventually corrected, and current CD versions of Yesshows feature a seamless 28-minute performance of "Ritual".
Another questionable edit is the joining of "Time and a Word" with "Going for the One". The performances were taken from different nights, from two different tours. It is a clever segue, but it never actually took place in concert.
Chris is alternately quite proud of the job he did in creating Yesshows, or quick to point out that it was merely a rough cut, (perhaps to apologize for the questionable edits he made), depending on when you ask him. Other members of Yes were generally unhappy with the results, including the choice of performances, the mixes, and the sound quality in general. They tend to point out that no one consulted them about Yesshows at all, including Chris. Some fans complain that the bass is too prominent in the mix. (The album was produced and mixed by the bass player; go figure.)
Most fans, however, were just happy to get more Yes. With live versions of two fan favorite epics, both of the band's recent hit singles, a classic from the early years, and two songs from Going for the One which took on new life in concert, there is much to like about this album. Even if it had been a triple-LP release, by the time all of Tales from Topographic Oceans was included, and "The Gates of Delerium" given its own side, there would have been only one LP side left for anything else. The two-LP release, with its greater variety, was probably the right decision, although to this day, fans would still love to hear a complete live performance of Tales from Topographic Oceans.
Yesshows features another surrealistic landscape cover by Roger Dean. The artwork on the front and back covers both come from the same painting, but they do not form a continuous print, which is an odd choice, as the original painting is quite large and would have lent itself nicely to such an application. The larger view (click on the cover above) shows the original painting, with its references to both Yessongs and Relayer.
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Oh yes, the album I confuse in title with Yessongs. :lol
Ritual being spread across more than one side was one of two "wow, can you really do that?" moments in my formative days of progressive rock listening, the other being the similar way the epics on ELP's Welcome Back My Friends...were continued across more than one side. That's definitely something that's been lost from the days of vinyl albums; true, you get the song as it was intended now on both Yesshows and the ELP album, but you lose a little something. You lose the sense of a band being so adventurous that they break the format of the music and stretching boundaries literally.
These days, what strikes me most about this CD is how well Time and a Word fits in with the longer, more epic version of Yes that is on display for the rest of the songs. I mentioned this WAY back in the thread, but it still bears repeating, how the evolution of Yes could be tracked so neatly all the way through their career. I think I'll give this one a spin today, it's been a bit since I have played it.
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I should listen to this live album... As well as most of the albums you're about to discuss, so I'll just enjoy the read. :smiley:
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I love this album. As I've said before, I think it sounds much better than Yessongs.
Thanks for the back story. I didn't know that about this album. I don't recall reading that in the Chris Welch Close To The Edge book for some reason.
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I've been getting a lot of my insights from the Tim Morse book "Yesstories: Yes in the Own Words". It's basically a collection of quotes collected from every interview, magazine article, etc., that he could get his hands on, including a number that he did himself. For example, when I say stuff like "Other members of Yes were generally unhappy with the results", it's generalizing, but it's because there are quotes from Steve and Jon expressing their displeasure. I've also been hitting up AMG and Wiki for tidbits, discussions with folks on the Yesfans boards, and of course a lot of it is from liner notes and stuff I've read myself over the years.
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Classic Yes (1981)
(https://i.imgur.com/JV0BUju.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/qCj0SLJ.jpg)
(click for full painting)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Bill Bruford - Drums, Percussion
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Tony Kaye - Keyboards
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums, Percussion
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Heart of the Sunrise
Wonderous Stories
Yours is No Disgrace
Starship Trooper
Long Distance Runaround
The Fish
And You And I
Roundabout (live)
I've Seen All Good People (live)
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When a band is taking a break, or has actually broken up, there are a number of things that a record label can do to keep them in the public eye and ear, and of course make some more money off of them. One is to release a live album, which they did in 1980 with Yesshows. Another is to release a "greatest hits" compilation. The problem with Yes is that while they were well-known and one of Atlantic's mainstay acts, they didn't have a lot of hits, certainly not enough to fill an album. A variation of the "greatest hits" collection is the "best of" collection. Classic Yes is more the second variety.
It is an odd collection, assembled by Chris (the only person to appear on every Yes album). "Wonderous Stories" from Going for the One is here, but it is the only song not from their classic three-album run starting with The Yes Album. Their two biggest hits, "Roundabout" and "I've Seen All Good People" aren't included in their original studio incarnations, but as live versions. They were originally included as "bonus tracks" on a 7-inch record slipped inside the LP jacket. CD versions of this album include all nine tracks, of course, but the focus here is clearly on album tracks which have become FM staples rather than on hits.
Appropriately, the album features cover art by Roger Dean.
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Just as Yes was on a break and the label was providing filler albums, I'm doing the same. I just got back from a long weekend, and will be writing up the next studio release in the next day or two. It's actually a coincidence, though. I knew from the beginning that I was going to include these last two releases, as an excuse to include their awesome cover art if nothing else.
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IIRC, Classic Yes was the only studio album, at the time, to feature "Heart Of The Sunrise" without the "We Have Heaven" reprise tacked on the end of it, so if you wanted a version of the track without it, this was the album to get!
It's got a good track list, especially for its time, and probably one of the band's best compilations. Also, the cover art is pretty awesome.
-Marc.
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90125 (1983)
(https://i.imgur.com/0buBdoH.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Tony Kaye - Keyboards
Trevor Rabin - Guitar, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums, Percussion
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Owner of a Lonely Heart
Hold On
It Can Happen
Changes
Cinema
Leave It
Our Song
City of Love
Hearts
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When 1983 began, Yes did not exist, having officially broken up after Drama and its disastrous tour. Steve Howe and Geoff Downes had left to form Asia, which had released its very successful debut album and was working on a follow-up. Geoff had also briefly rejoined Trevor Horn for the second album from The Buggles, Adventures in Modern Recording, although he only appears on three tracks. (Adventures is really more a Trevor Horn solo project than a true Buggles album.)
Alan and Chris were working on creating a new band, and joined up with South African guitarist/singer Trevor Rabin. The band was to be called Cinema. Trevor Rabin already had an album's worth of songs completed or nearly completed, and after two solo albums (on which he played nearly everything himself), he was looking forward to playing in a band again, as he had with Rabbit in the 70's. Original Yes keyboardist Tony Kaye was brought in, but the band still needed a strong lead singer and front man. Chris suggested Jon Anderson.
At that point the band was 4/5 former Yes members, and it was suggested that the band resurrect the name Yes. Trevor was strongly against it. Other than the lead vocals, the music didn't really sound anything like Yes. And while Yes had had different drummers, keyboardists, and even lead singers over the years, Steve Howe had been the only guitarist since the classic Yes sound was established, and Trevor knew that he would be accused of daring to replace Steve, or at the very least, changing the Yes sound, just as Trevor Horn had met resistance when he replaced Jon.
In the end, the band was called Yes. And while Trevor's fears did prove true -- longtime fans were thrilled to hear that Yes had a new album out, but shocked at the new sound -- the band's only #1 song ever ("Owner of a Lonely Heart") did much to soften the blow. Yes was back, with their most commercially successful album ever. Many people attribute part of that success to its excellent production, by none other than Trevor Horn, who also has writing credits on two of the songs, including "Owner of a Lonely Heart".
The album's one instrumental, "Cinema", was originally called "Time" and was part of a 20-minute suite written by Trevor Rabin that was never completed. It was most likely retitled as a way of preserving and honoring the name Cinema, the original name of the band.
As with most things Yes, there are numerous, conflicting stories about this album, and how the band name went from Cinema to Yes, but the most likely scenario is that the label was more willing to promote a new Yes album than a debut album by an unknown band called Cinema. With four Yes alumni, including the lead singer, the band had a legitimate claim to being called Yes, so Yes it was.
As 1984 began, Yes was at the top of the charts.
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This was one of the earliest albums I remember ever hearing. Love it, even though it's sound is so different than other yes. My dad listened to it all the time.
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90125 was my introduction to Yes, and I still think it is a damn good pop rock record. And a borderline top 5 Yes record...from any era. I stand by that. :coolio
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Owner of a Lonely Heart is good, the rest is kinda...meh. I think it's not the worst Yes album, but it's definitely down there.
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Cinema was also the only Grammy Yes ever won, for rock instrumental.
90125 was a special one for me actually. It was the first Yes album I grew into on my own, every other one was fed to me by my brothers. Even though it was drastically different, I still fell for it hard. Then the magic moment happened, I went to my second concert ever(the first was The Tubes at a smaller venue), Yes at the Cow Palace in San Francisco. The enviornment was insane, the lasers on the stage as Yes opened with Cinema and Leave it. Then went straight into Yours is no Disgrace. My life as I knew it was over, but Yes wasn't done, they continued on, busting out new songs with classics like And You And I and All Good People mixed in, then came the knockout blow, Long Distance Runaround and Squire's amazing solo, the stage was rushed, the crowd went insane, I walked out of that concert a different person. I also didn't miss a single Yes tour until Jon left the band.
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Well, Owner of a lonely heart was the first Yes song I ever heard. Several years ago I lived in Mexico and I remember that I my parents used to go to a place where books were sold for very low prices. There were stands in the streets with lots of them and I remember that this song played there every time.
The rest of the album is also quite good but that specific song is in my heart.
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The guy who got me into Yes hated everything after Relayer, so for the longest time I completely avoided 90125 and the entire post-70s output. I got The Yes Album first and then eventually went from there, until I'd finally run out of 70s Yes album. When I finally did pick 90125 up out of a bargain bin, I distinctly remember thinking that it was actually not a bad album at all. I was never a big fan of "Owner of Lonely Heart", but other songs on the record, like "Hearts" and "Cinema" became instant favorites.
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I liked 90125 when it first came out, and I stuck with it for a while. After a while, I found myself playing it less and less, and instead reaching for the 70's stuff when I felt like hearing some Yes. I listened to this album again for the first time in a while, then again, and remembered why I like it so much. There's some excellent writing, musicianship, and production. Of course, it's pretty different from 70's Yes. It was also pretty different from anything else out and the time, too, and I can understand why it was so popular.
It came out during my "lost years" when I'd quit my day job and was playing in a band, which meant that I was perpetually broke, so I didn't buy this one right away. I remember being in a record store, and they kept playing "Owner of a Lonely Heart" over and over. The guy working there must've really loved it. They were playing the LP, so sometimes after "Owner" ended, you'd hear "Hold On" start up. Those snare hits, then that guitar grooving in and the slow 12/8 sounded awesome. Then the guy would start the album over so he could hear "Owner" again.
But that groove on "Hold On" intrigued me, so I bought it. I had to hear the rest of the album. I remember thinking that I could probably buy a meal or two for what I was spending, but this is Yes we're talking about. Gotta have your priorities. ♫♫
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My preference of the songs on this album goes like this:
1. Changes
2. Hearts
3. Cinema
4. Leave It
5. It Can Happen
6. Owner of a Lonely Heart
7. City of Love
8. Hold On
9. Our Song
It speaks volumes when songs that strong are at the bottom. :tup :tup
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This might come as a shock to some Yes fans, but when I rank Yes albums, the only ones I rate AHEAD of 90125 are the truest classics, Close to the Edge and The Yes Album, and it's TIED with Fragile. I like it that much. It's true that it doesn't sound much like classic Yes, but then again it wouldn't given Rabin's completely different approach to guitar playing and songwriting. Given that prog had moved into a paradigm where the long, flowery epics of old had been replaced by more concise, compact songwriting, it was probably better that Yes present themselves this way musically, even if they hadn't intended to BE Yes at the start. But really, once Jon Anderson arrived, how could they have been anything else? A Trevor Rabin fronted band wouldn't necessarily have sounded like Yes, but Anderson's voice made it inevitable that the band had to be called Yes, he was that associated with the band's sound by then. Plus I'd put Changes and Hearts up against anything you'd want to name short of the songs on Close to the Edge and they'd have come out looking decent.
The album is definitely helped by its otherworldly production sound, which holds up far better here in the 21st Century than a LOT of 80s albums. Trevor Horn knocked it out of the park. Overall, while it wasn't meant to be Yes from the start, it turned out to be the precise album the band NEEDED to make to survive the 80s. Add a couple of visually interesting videos-anyone remember all the different versions of Leave It-and you had a band that, albeit inadvertently, had updated itself for a new decade.
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Excellent post! The "new" Yes was exactly what had to happen for the band to continue, even if that wasn't the original plan.
It was only a year earlier that I'd picked up the debut album from some band I'd never heard of called Asia, because there was a sticker on the front that listed the band members. Whoa, a prog supergroup! I was massively disappointed by what I heard when I put it on. My expectations were probably too high, but they were also very high when I picked up 90125, and I was not disappointed by 90125.
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Cinema was also the only Grammy Yes ever won, for rock instrumental.
True! I was going to mention that, but forgot, so thanks for bringing that up.
90125 was a special one for me actually. It was the first Yes album I grew into on my own, every other one was fed to me by my brothers. Even though it was drastically different, I still fell for it hard. Then the magic moment happened, I went to my second concert ever(the first was The Tubes at a smaller venue), Yes at the Cow Palace in San Francisco. The enviornment was insane, the lasers on the stage as Yes opened with Cinema and Leave it. Then went straight into Yours is no Disgrace. My life as I knew it was over, but Yes wasn't done, they continued on, busting out new songs with classics like And You And I and All Good People mixed in, then came the knockout blow, Long Distance Runaround and Squire's amazing solo, the stage was rushed, the crowd went insane, I walked out of that concert a different person. I also didn't miss a single Yes tour until Jon left the band.
I was wondering about that. I know you've mentioned how deeply Yes music has touched you, especially Tales from Topographics Oceans, and while 90125 is very good, it seems to lack that special something -- the magical, mystical Yes element that transcends words -- that the 70's stuff has, so I was curious as to how you felt about this one.
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9012Live: The Solos (1985)
(https://i.imgur.com/ndCGLgj.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Tony Kaye - Keyboards
Trevor Rabin - Guitar, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums, Percussion
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Following the huge success of 90125, Yes did the unexpected and took another one of their unexplained long breaks between albums. In the absence of new material, Atlantic was again forced to come up with something to keep them in the public eye and ear, and this was their solution.
Integral to any Yes concert are the solo segments granted to each of the members. When releasing a live album, capturing these segments can provide a more all-encompassing picture of a Yes concert. But here, we get a single 34-minute disc, originally a single LP, consisting mostly of these solo segments, without the rest of the concert. The tracks included here would be worthy additions to a full-length live release, but standing alone as they are, the result feels incomplete and is unsatisfying overall. It is particuarly disappointing because, with the dramatic change in the Yes sound, this would have been the perfect time for a full-length live album, showing off the "new" Yes takes on the classics as well as exciting versions of the newer material. Instead, we get two of the stronger songs from 90125 (but not their hit "Owner of a Lonely Heart") and little else.
"Hold On" We hear Jon introduce Alan on the drumkit, and we know that the song starts with a drum fill, so the assumption is that we'll be treated to an extended section or even a drum solo to serve as an intro, but we merely get a few extra bars and then a fairly pedestrian version of the song itself.
"Si" A short keyboard excursion from Tony. Some nice patches and textures, but it's a bit telling that the quotes from Bach's "Tocatta and Fugue in D minor" -- barely more than the three-note riff -- get the best response from the audience.
"Solly's Beard" Trevor's guitar solo is interesting but somewhat disjointed, though it does show off his versatility.
"Soon" Apparently extracted from a performance of "The Gates of Delerium", as it fades in and fades out. It's lovely, but at only two minutes, it almost seems like it was included just so that Jon would have a "solo" section.
"Changes" After a slightly extended intro, which could conceivably count as a keyboard solo, we get a rather standard live performance of the song itself.
"Amazing Grace" / "Whitefish" The classic hymn, performed by Chris on solo bass, segues into the final track, a bass-and-drums duet from Alan and Chris ("White" + "Fish"). It is the longest track on the album, and probably the most interesting musically. But when the most interesting thing on your live album is the track showcasing your rhythm section, there is probably something wrong with your track selection.
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I've tried to limit my editorial comments, but found that without them, I don't have much to say about this very short album. It baffled me when it came out, and it still baffles me. What was the point of this release? Why didn't they just make it a proper double or even triple live album and include these tracks? It could have been great. I like hearing what each of the guys can do without a net, but that alone isn't enough to make an album, and including two full-length songs literally just feels like they'd tossed us a bone. A very odd release.
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I never have listened to this, and probably never will. I like 90125, but nothing about an album full of live solo performances entices me at all. What where they trying to prove? That this era of Yes was still technically proficient, or something?
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That would seem to be the case. My understanding is that the "Rabin-era" versions of 70's classics were not always well received. Lonestar's account of his 90125 concert isn't a total anomoly; good music is good music, and I'm sure the show was great. Yes earned a lot of new fans who were very excited to see this band play, and the 70's prog stuff inspired many of them to dig into the back catalogue. But many hardcore Yesfans had trouble with the new interpretations of the old songs, and I would guess that that ambivalent reaction is evident on the audience recordings, so maybe that scared them away from releasing a full live album from this era.
The solo spots are cool, but they make a lot more sense as part of the concert. Even if they'd included "Owner" and one or two more songs from 90125, they'd have had a nice document of this band performing live, but they didn't even do that. And they had room, even on the original LP, so that really makes this album for completists only.
As much as I love Yes, when I got to this album, I realized that it is one of the few official releases that I do not own. I "borrowed" a copy from off the Internet to review for this Discography, but don't worry, I'm not going to be keeping it.
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Never had much interest in getting this, nor did I understand why these solos and performances weren't worked into the 90125 Live video release. That's pretty short-an hour and nine minutes-and I know there's more than they had in the video since Roundabout is a bonus feature on the DVD. I never understood why this wasn't just a full double live album. Especially since this was around the time that the double vinyl live album was having its last hurrah, notably with Maiden's Live After Death. These days I imagine we'd get a 90 minute version of 90125 Live as a DVD bonus for a 2 CD live disc. Other than that, my only lasting memory of this album was the video for the live version of Hold On.
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Big Generator (1987)
(https://i.imgur.com/jhVPlmO.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Tony Kaye - Keyboards
Trevor Rabin - Guitar, Keyboards, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums, Percussion
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Rhythm of Love
Big Generator
Shoot High Aim Low
Almost Like Love
Love Will Find a Way
Final Eyes
I'm Running
Holy Lamb (Song for Harmonic Convergence)
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As mentioned in the writeup for 90125, most of that album was written before Jon Anderson was brought in to sing lead vocals, the move which led to the band becoming Yes rather than Cinema. Jon insisted on reworking some of the parts he was asked to sing before recording them, and ended up with some writing credits.
When the band reconvened to begin work on the follow-up to 90125, things were different. 90125 and the current lineup had essentially developed together as members were added and jam sessions evolved into rehearsal sessions and eventually into recording sessions. This time, Trevor again contributed the majority of the music. Jon and Chris were not getting along well, leaving a vaccuum which Trevor was happy to fill. Jon, however, had certain ideas about what Yes was as a band, and how the music should be approached. All would state later that there was no clear direction to the music, but it might be more accurate to say that there were multiple, conflicting directions. Chris and Alan wanted to continue exploring a heavier sound, the reason that they had formed this band to begin with. Jon wanted to return to the progressive 70's sound. Trevor mostly wanted to expand upon the sound they'd created with 90125.
Big Generator actually does each of these things to some degree, and all things considered, it is a remarkably cohesive album. The sound is heavier overall, reminiscent of the heavier parts of 90125. There are some longer songs with contrasting parts, orchestral bits and the occassional acoustic guitar. And the album stylistically is clearly a successor to 90125.
Sessions for Big Generator began in Italy in 1985, as Trevor Rabin felt that a change of scenery would do them good. After some writing and recording, producer Trevor Horn suggested that they return to London. The London sessions resulted in more tracks, but at some point Trevor Rabin pushed for a return to Los Angeles, where the album was ultimately completed. Trevor Horn was having difficulty getting along with Tony Kaye, and at some point actually told Jon Anderson to stay away from the studio for three months so he could work with the rest of the band (without Jon's interference). Trevor Horn eventually left the project. Trevor Rabin took over production and managed to finish the album.
Citing The Beatles' Abbey Road as a model, he assembled some longer tracks from shorter bits of music that didn't have clear roles as verses or choruses. Trevor also took it upon himself to re-record some of Tony's keyboard parts. After two years in the making, Big Generator was finally released in late 1987.
(https://i.imgur.com/DCa8Rgy.jpg)
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I like this album a lot. Shoot High Aim Low, I'm Running and Final Eyes are all awesome, and everything else is good, even Almost Like Love with its 1,094 "It's almost"s near the end of the song. :lol
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I guess I'm a rarity in that I consider Big Generator to be on par with 90125. Jon always has disappointing things to say about it, but I do wonder how much of that's sincere grievance, as opposed to how much is just him still being sour for not completely getting his way with that record.
I'm curious, why does my copy have a greenish background with purple letters, as opposed to the yellow/red version I always see?
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Rhythm of Love's a cool tune, never bothered to listen to the album.
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I like this album a lot. Shoot High Aim Low, I'm Running and Final Eyes are all awesome, and everything else is good, even Almost Like Love with its 1,094 "It's almost"s near the end of the song. :lol
That's how you know "it's almost" over, finally!
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I guess I'm a rarity in that I consider Big Generator to be on par with 90125. Jon always has disappointing things to say about it, but I do wonder how much of that's sincere grievance, as opposed to how much is just him still being sour for not completely getting his way with that record.
I'm curious, why does my copy have a greenish background with purple letters, as opposed to the yellow/red version I always see?
When I did a Google image search to find a cover picture, a bunch of different color schemes showed up. There's the light green with purple letters that you mention, also the same with much darker letters, almost blue. Against the yellow background, I've seen the letters much lighter, almost pink. But the big red-on-yellow is the original, I'm pretty sure, since that's what's on the vinyl and all the copies I remember seeing back in the 80's. I didn't start seeing the other colors until later. Different printings, I guess. It was a thing for a while. abacab by Genesis had four different color schemes, Synchronicity by The Police had I think 20 different covers; all those pictures were different, or in different orders or something. In Through the Out Door by Led Zeppelin I believe had six possible covers.
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As for the album itself, I listened to it twice in the past two days, and liked it a lot more than I remembered liking it originally. Back then, I was probably thinking that it still wasn't "real" Yes, therefore it sucked. Or maybe it just sounded like more of the same, nothing really special.
I have a better perspective now, and this is actually a very strong album. It brings the heavy, it brings some intricacy (though not quite enough -- it's still mostly heavy), and the production is again excellent. If I liked this kind of music more, I'd really love this album. Trevor Rabin is very good at writing this kind of music, pop with a bit more going on than most pop crap, though not what I'd call prog. Good pop, though.
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Big Generator isn't bad, it's just following up a completely brilliant album in 90125 and doing it with a band that can't clearly decide on its direction. It's highs are pretty high-I love Final Eyes, and Shoot High Aim Low would easily make a top ten of Yes songs if I ever made one-but where 90125 found Yes, as I said earlier, inadvertently re-inventing itself for the 80s, Big Generator finds the band not quite certain where it should take that reinvention next, and suffers for it. It's a good album, but not a great one, and of the three albums this line up did, it's the least, behind 90125 and Talk. I am interested in when this thread gets to Talk, because I love that album to death and I'm wondering what the general Yes community reaction to it is.
Another thought I've had: Shoot High Aim Low would have been perfect music for the end of a Miami Vice episode that ended on a down, brooding note. In fact I'm shocked that, as near as I can tell, it wasn't...it just seems to FIT that show when it got darker and more thoughtful, like when Dire Straits' Brothers in Arms was used to devastating effect in one episode. These were the thoughts I had late at night in the late 80s halfway through a 12 pack of beer in front of my television set. :lol
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Yeah, Shoot High Aim Low is a pretty grim song when you check out the lyrics. Interesting thought about Miami Vice using it. The music on that show, both upbeat and not-so-upbeat, was often very effective. In the 80's, a lot of TV shows were basically music videos anyway. I didn't actually watch the show a lot, but I caught it a few times, and I remember the Brothers in Arms episode. I couldn't tell you what was going on in the show, but I remember hearing the music and thinking Damn! It was shortly after I'd bought the album, and I was kinda psyched that I recognized it.
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I guess I'm a rarity in that I consider Big Generator to be on par with 90125. Jon always has disappointing things to say about it, but I do wonder how much of that's sincere grievance, as opposed to how much is just him still being sour for not completely getting his way with that record.
Before leaving Yes after Tormato, Jon had begun to see himself more and more as the "leader" of Yes, not just the lead singer. I was trying to hint at that without being too blatant, because some don't see it that way, and some who do don't really have a problem with it. Jon didn't have much input into 90125 because of how and when he joined the group, but with Big Generator, he saw an opportunity to exert his influence from the ground up. Since the band was Yes, Jon felt that it should have a certain vibe to the music, and Jon saw himself as the one to spread that vibe.
The problem is that Trevor Rabin had come to see the band as his vehicle as well. In researching the 80's Yes for this discography, I was surprised to learn that he was not the actual leader. The story I'd heard long ago was that he was putting together Cinema, and Chris and Alan were brought on as the rhythm section. This made perfect sense, as it's well-known that Trevor wrote most of the music and was looking to put together a band to break into the U.S. market. I found three sources that say that it was Chris and Alan who were putting the band together and brought in Trevor, but those sources were all focusing on the history of Yes, so it's possible that they were simply relating events in a rather Yes-centric way. The truth is probably somewhere in between, that they all found each other. It's not like Chris and Alan had "a band" and added a guitarist. Prior to that, they were just a rhythm section.
Anyway, it's pretty clear that Trevor and Jon were fighting for control and direction of the band. Jon says that it wasn't really what Yes is about. The opening track, Rhythm of Love, is literally about sex, something Trevor seems rather proud of, but something I would never have imagined Jon singing about on a record. The overall heavy vibe on the album is something the others seemed fine with, but look at Jon's contributions to the album: Holy Lamb, and some of the mellowest sections of other songs. It was not a surprise to learn that he'd left Yes to make music that he considered more "Yes-like" -- by contacting former Yesmen Bill Bruford, Rick Wakeman and Steve Howe.
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Have to catch up on the last couple of albums here.
As for 90125, I love it. It was the first Yes album that I got into, back when I was young, and I still like it quite a lot today. It is a fun rock album with outstanding production. What is not to like? Of course, since I did not grow up in the 70s era Yes, and that era was not my introduction to Yes, I really did not have any problem with Yes making this type of album.
A funny sort of story regarding this album as well. Back when I was in 2nd grade, which I think would have been in 2000, we were allowed to bring in music and play it from time to time. Well, I brought in 90125 and played Owner of a Lonely Heart. And it went over well! In fact, as a class, we played that song constantly. One day I said, "Hey, there is this other good song too." Well, I put on Changes. It was promptly turned off and back to Owner. People thought the intro was too weird :lol. I was kind of miffed, but what did I expect in 2nd grade :lol?
On to Big Generator. I enjoy most of this album. I used to love the title track and thought that that guitar was the coolest thing ever. Since then I've become more of a fan of Shoot High Aim Low and some of the others, especially Love Will Find A Way. Personally, I think that it is still a weaker album than 90125, but certainly not a bad album.
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Another thought I've had: Shoot High Aim Low would have been perfect music for the end of a Miami Vice episode that ended on a down, brooding note. In fact I'm shocked that, as near as I can tell, it wasn't...it just seems to FIT that show when it got darker and more thoughtful, like when Dire Straits' Brothers in Arms was used to devastating effect in one episode. These were the thoughts I had late at night in the late 80s halfway through a 12 pack of beer in front of my television set. :lol
Yeah, Shoot High Aim Low is a pretty grim song when you check out the lyrics. Interesting thought about Miami Vice using it. The music on that show, both upbeat and not-so-upbeat, was often very effective. In the 80's, a lot of TV shows were basically music videos anyway. I didn't actually watch the show a lot, but I caught it a few times, and I remember the Brothers in Arms episode. I couldn't tell you what was going on in the show, but I remember hearing the music and thinking Damn! It was shortly after I'd bought the album, and I was kinda psyched that I recognized it.
In case you are interested, that is Season 2, episode 3 - Out Where The Buses Don't Run. There were a couple of seasons that were available to watch on Hulu for a while, but I am not sure if they are still up there or not now.
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FreezingPoint, feel free to post more. Your views on 80's Yes and later are interesting to me and probably others since you didn't grow up with the older proggy stuff the way we did, and thus don't have that bias. I liked what you said about Going for the One and how some of it seemed to foreshadow what the individual players would go on to do with other bands.
And of course more prog fans, especially Yes fans, are always welcome around here! ♫♫
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I've only listened to Big Generator a couple of times but it didn't do much for me. 90125 is much better.
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As someone who didn't really listen to Rabin-Era Yes when I first discovered the band, this was my least-favorite album of the 3 (90125, Big Generator and Talk). However, over the past couple of years, I revisited the album with a more open mind set (especially after having really enjoyed the other 2 Rabin-Era albums, as well as Union, The Ladder and Magnification). Being the one album I have listened to least, it was the most fresh to me at the time, and so the songs have actually gotten better for me! Not being over-played had the added benefit of sounding fresh.
It's a pretty good album for what they did, but you can tell there were some creative differences, but not in the way of Tormato or even TFTO, but it's pretty consistent for having more than one (or two) driving forces pushing the album along over the course of 2 years. Unfortunately, it has the problem living up to the greatness of 90125.
-Marc.
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FreezingPoint, feel free to post more. Your views on 80's Yes and later are interesting to me and probably others since you didn't grow up with the older proggy stuff the way we did, and thus don't have that bias.
That sums me up as well. I didn't hear a single Yes song from the 70s until probably 1989/1990, and by then I was already a big fan of both 90125 and Big Generator. I do sometimes wonder how I would have reacted to those albums had I gotten into the 70s material first, but things happen how they happen. :)
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I was ok with Big Generator, but it was when I realized it wasn't old Yes, and started to miss it. I think a lot of that was because I was really discovering prog at this time, via IQ and Marillion, and was hungry for more. Kinda funny how I had grown up on Yes since I was seven, but had to wait till I was 19 to classify them as prog. :lol
On a sidenote, Holy Lamb is an incredibly beautiful song. :heart
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Holy Lamb is cool, but it seems to end too quickly. It's so mellow, then it ends and I go "Wait... that's it?"
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Really, I think it's a perfect build up to the final line, then draws out calmly. Love it.
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Final Eyes is the best song on the album. I can play that over and over. Never getting sick of it.
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Really, I think it's a perfect build up to the final line, then draws out calmly. Love it.
I must listen again, paying more attention this time.
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FreezingPoint, feel free to post more. Your views on 80's Yes and later are interesting to me and probably others since you didn't grow up with the older proggy stuff the way we did, and thus don't have that bias. I liked what you said about Going for the One and how some of it seemed to foreshadow what the individual players would go on to do with other bands.
And of course more prog fans, especially Yes fans, are always welcome around here! ♫♫
Thanks. I will try to post a bit more as well.
I think that given when I was born and all, the way I got into Yes was perfect. First came the 80s stuff (with ABWH and Union), then the modern era (The Ladder was the first Yes album I actually remember coming out) and then into the Classic era, though I was listening to some of the Classic era "hits" before I really got into the whole albums. I think that it worked well because the modern songs can be a springboard for the earlier prog songs and accessible from the 80s era as well. It is funny, what I think also helped is that even though I was just getting into Yes in the late 90s and early 2000s, I never really thought at the time that it sounded 80s or dated or anything like that. I wasn't really aware of the differences between the decades of music, probably because I was still young and had limited musical experience.
Also, to those who are interested, check out Trevor Rabin's album 90124. It contains demos and such from the Rabin era and it is fascinating to listen not only to the changes in production, but to the changes in the actual songs themselves. I have heard some people complain about the "I eat at chez nous" line in Love Will Find A Way. It wasn't in the demo. The chorus in Changes was also a bit different. I am not sure how I feel about this one, because I feel the demo chorus is pretty good too.
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The very existence of 90124 seems to be evidence that Cinema, later Yes, was Trevor's band, his vehicle. Sure, the songs went through some changes on the way, but it's clear that the album was mostly written prior to Cinema. It's been said that all three Rabin-era albums were basically solo albums with Yes as the backup band, but it's usually disgruntled Yes fans saying it; I wouldn't go that far. But it still seems like Trevor was the leader of that band, and no one will come right out and say it.
I've never had a problem with "I eat at chez nous". First time I heard it, I heard something that rhymed and couldn't tell what he'd said. But since the words are all pretty clear on that album, it obvious to me that it was French or something. Turns out I was right, and later I learned that "chez nous" just means "my house". I eat at my house. Yeah, pretty lame there, Trevor. But whatever. It rhymes, and since it's French, it's cool, right?
Really, I think it's a perfect build up to the final line, then draws out calmly. Love it.
I must listen again, paying more attention this time.
Okay, I listened again, and my impression is still the same. It's a nice song, no doubt, but it seems to just get going, then it fades out. It just seems like there was going to be more to the song, but someone made the decision to fade it out instead.
Even if the lyrics were done and they'd said all they were going to say verbally, musically it feels incomplete somehow.
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Will this thread cover the Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe album? I haven't listened to that in YEARS and might dig it out if it's going to be covered.
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Will this thread cover the Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe album? I haven't listened to that in YEARS and might dig it out if it's going to be covered.
I do consider it a Yes album, at any rate.
As for 90125 and Big Generator... not much to say. Don't like either. Not that I can't get into that style, but I don't really like any of that material. Actually, I'll just save a post and say besides a few passable tracks on Union and Talk ("Real Love" is awesome, as are parts of the suite at the end), I don't really like anything Yes did again until Magnification. ABWH and the 90s albums are all either reeeaaally cheesy or boring, and while KtA's studio tracks tried to do everything in the vein of 70s Yes, none of it really does that for me.
So with that out of the way, see you for Magnification... I guess? ;) I just don't want to fill up the next few album discussions with negativity.
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Will this thread cover the Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe album? I haven't listened to that in YEARS and might dig it out if it's going to be covered.
ABWH is next. I started off trying to include at least brief notes about solo albums and the various other projects that Yes members were doing, and how they fit into things chronologically, but I realized that I'd eventually have to include dozens of other albums along the way. I was going to give Asia and bands like GTR some time, but it was getting awkward trying to fit everything in, ultimately there would have been more side material than Yes. So I cut back on that. But I'd always intended to include ABWH, and also An Evening of Yes Music Plus, especially because of the way they dovetail into the Union album.
As for 90125 and Big Generator... not much to say. Don't like either. Not that I can't get into that style, but I don't really like any of that material. Actually, I'll just save a post and say besides a few passable tracks on Union and Talk ("Real Love" is awesome, as are parts of the suite at the end), I don't really like anything Yes did again until Magnification. ABWH and the 90s albums are all either reeeaaally cheesy or boring, and while KtA's studio tracks tried to do everything in the vein of 70s Yes, none of it really does that for me.
So with that out of the way, see you for Magnification... I guess? ;) I just don't want to fill up the next few album discussions with negativity.
Thanks for being considerate. Usually I prefer it if people keep negative thoughts to themselves, especially in "appreciation" threads and such, where the whole idea is to celebrate something. Someone coming in and saying "nah, it sucks" is such a downer. But I'm looking for all kinds of feedback here, and if there are certain Yes albums that you don't like, I'm curious as to why. As long as you give reasons why, I would consider it negative feedback, not just negativity. And as I said, I'm looking for all kinds of feedback.
I personally am not a huge fan of the 80's Yes, either. I've been trying to be fair and point out the positive, while at the same time pointing out things that weren't so great.
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Cool thread. It has inspired me to try and get into Yes. Which album would you guys recommend as a good starting point? It seems Fragile and Close To The Waters Edge is the most popular ones..
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Any chance Trevor's Can't Look Away will be covered? Considering he was the dominant Yes writer from 1983-1994, it would make sense to include the one solo album he released during that time period, no?
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I thought about it, but I don't think I have a copy. I remember hearing it years ago, and there was that one single, but I think I borrowed it from a friend when I was living in Maryland.
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Cool thread. It has inspired me to try and get into Yes. Which album would you guys recommend as a good starting point? It seems Fragile and Close To The Waters Edge is the most popular ones..
Start with The Yes Album, then proceed to Fragile, then Close to the Edge. In that way, you can hear the start of the classic Yes sound and follow it through its early stages, and decide how to proceed from there.
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Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe (1989)
(https://i.imgur.com/HlQbJ9f.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/odtTz0D.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/AAFnmf5.jpg)
(Front and back covers -- click front for full painting)
Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Bill Bruford - Acoustic and Electronic Drums
Steve Howe - Guitar
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Augmented by:
Tony Levin - Bass, Stick, Vocals
Matt Clifford - Keyboards, Programming, Orchestration, Vocals
Milton McDonald - Rhythm Guitar
Backing Vocals:
The Oxford Circus Singers - Deborah Anderson, Tessa Niles, Carol Kenyon, Frank Dunnery
J.M.C. Singers - Jon, Matt, Chris
Emerald Community Singers, Montserrat
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Themes
i. Sound
ii. Second Attention
iii. Soul Warrior
Fist of Fire
Brother of Mine
i. The Big Dream
ii. Nothing Can Come Between Us
iii. Long Lost Brother of Mine
Birthright
The Meeting
Quartet
i. I Wanna Learn
ii. She Gives Me Love
iii. Who Was the First
iv. I'm Alive
Teakbois
Order of the Universe
i. Order Theme
ii. Rock Gives Courage
iii. It's So Hard to Grow
iv The Universe
Let's Pretend
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Jon Anderson was never completely happy with Big Generator. He felt that it lacked something which a Yes album should have, in terms of the lyrics and the message they convey, and the music itself. Trevor Rabin had come to see himself as leader of the band, taken the tapes back to L.A., and completed production of the album himself in his home studio. There's no question that the writing on 90125 and Big Generator is mostly Trevor's, and that those albums mostly reflect his vision, but Trevor always points out that that band was not originally supposed to be Yes in the first place. Chris Squire was also not getting along with Jon during this time. Ultimately, Jon left Yes after the Big Generator tour. He wanted to make music which was more like his vision of Yes, not like what Yes had become in the 80's.
He contacted former Yesmen Bill Bruford, Rick Wakeman, and Steve Howe about a new project. It started as a solo album, but it eventually became more collaborative, and they needed a name for this new band. They also needed a bassist. Bill suggested Tony Levin, with whom he had worked in the very successful 80's King Crimson lineup.
For name recognition, they went with Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe for both the band and the album. They also contacted artist Roger Dean, whose distinctive style would provide visual assocation with Yes, and his painting "Blue Desert" became the cover art for the album.
It's hard to say what makes a Yes album sound like a Yes album. Fans of the classic 70's Yes albums know that there is something, but can never quite agree on what it is. But if it includes long songs divided into movements with little Roman numerals, Jon Anderson's unique voice, lyrics that don't always make literal sense but sound nice and have great imagery, and instrumental sections featuring Steve Howe's guitar, Rick Wakeman's keyboards, or both, then this album delivers on all counts. They had succeeded in producing an album similar to 70's Yes, but with an updated sound.
It is not a perfect album. It had been over ten years since Jon, Rick, and Steve had played together, over 15 since they had played with Bill, and in that time they had each expanded their musical repetoires in different ways. Jon's taste for World Music, for example, is evident in "Teakbois". Bill's electronic drums are also new, but Bill is quick to point out that this is not a Yes album. He's gone on record saying that he signed on for a Jon Anderson solo project, and was actually disappointed when Steve and Rick were later added to the project. Not because he didn't like playing with them, but because he really wanted to do something new, not just rehash Yes.
Bill: "There was a moment somewhere around ABWH when it was no longer Jon's thing. He started it and when he came to my house I thought he was inviting me to play on a solo album... Well, that was a little window of opportunity that lasted ten minutes before it slammed shut."
Steve: "ABWH wasn't made of people who were desperate to call themselves Yes. It was more made up of a band, that at least Bill and I felt was a new band and we could not rest totally on the old material."
Rick: "For some unknown reason this particular combination of musicians is quite frightening. It's weird, because Jon, Bill, Steve, and I only actually played together for two and a half years. But during that period we were four-fifths responsible for Fragile, Close to the Edge, and a considerable amount of Yessongs. That's pretty terrifying."
Jon: "It was a great album to make here -- you feel the energy."
Trevor Rabin: "I bought the ABWH album and just enjoyed it. I didn't listen to it under any other terms."
Chris Squire: "I wasn't that impressed."
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Well, I was impressed. I still remember browsing CDs in the store and seeing this one, with the obviously Dean font and cover art, and I knew in a moment exactly what it was. It was the "real" Yes and their answer to what had been coming out for several years now under the name Yes. Or something like that.
Let's be clear: 90125 and Big Generator are not bad albums. They're not bad music at all. In listening to them again for this discography, I was reminded how much I liked 90125, and surprised how much more I like Big Generator than I did in the 80's, when I listened to it and dismissed it as not "real Yes". They have a lot of great music, and they introduced a new generation of people to Yes.
But hardcore fans of the early 70's progressive Yes sound had been hoping and wishing that something like this would happen, and it did. If only Chris Squire had played on this album, then it would have been a complete reunion of The Fragile Five. But there was no way that that was going to happen, so this is the closest we were going to get. And for many, it did the trick. It filled the need. Also, Tony Levin is an excellent bassist, and the Stick adds a little something that helps us not miss Chris Squire's bi-amped Rickenbacker sound quite so much.
I'll admit that there are times when it seems that they're trying too hard to be Yes, despite all claims to the contrary. No fewer than four songs broken up into movements with Roman numerals. "Quartet" actually includes quotes from several classic Yes songs. The cover and font were no coincidence. Jon admits that he wanted to make Yes music again, Steve and Bill say they wanted to do new things, and Rick plays both sides.
But for most Yesfans, this is a Yes album in all but name, and I agree, so I've included it.
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Even though I do enjoy it enough to include in my personal Yes Discography, I don't really listen to it much. From 90125 to Talk, there's a peak of uninterest with ABWH that then goes back down as we approach Talk.
90125 > BG > ABWH < Union < Talk (< Keystudio)
There's a few MOMENTS on the album that I enjoy, but I've really not listened to it enough to really have a good grasp on every part of it. I should really revisit it sometime soon. I may go on a Yes-binge in the coming weeks as my Rush-binge is slowly slowing down (which I have been on since the beginning of June).
-Marc.
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I pulled this out yesterday when I heard that it would get covered, first time I've played it in a long time, and I had a couple of thoughts about it. The first was I liked it a LOT more than I used to, when I dismissed it as being four guys from Yes doing their level best to deny they were Yes...while trying very hard to be Yes. The second was...holy christ, you can tell this was recorded in the 1980s, can't you? At the time, all the guys experimenting with electronic drums-Bruford, Phil Collins, Neil Peart, and so on-sounded interesting and modern. These days every hit on the electronic snare yells "80s!" at you, and that isn't helped by Wakeman's keyboard sounds, which feel equally lost in around 1985 or so. I feel like a more organic sounding album, more analog, would have helped me here. But honestly, this album is really hampered by how the band's conflict over how much like Yes they wanted to be. Personally I think they should have just jumped in with both feet myself; there's some ideas on here that could have led to a classic Yes album, but they kind of get lost along the way. But given that the first time I heard it way back when I was terribly disappointed, I guess its a win for the album that these days I actually like it.
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Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe is just too much for me, but some of it is really good. I absolutely loathe "Themes" and "Fist of Fire", so I've never enjoyed the album out of the gate, but I think there are some good things going on in "Brother of Mine" and then "Birthright". "Order of the Universe" is a pretty good closer, too.
Overall, ABWH for me is the inception of what I don't really like about modern Yes. When I listen to stuff like "Lightning Songs" on The Ladder, and wonder wtf is going on, I look back to ABWH and find out there. The weird combo of Yes' 70s progressive style with world and newage started there, and I've never liked it very much.
I'll also add that AWBH music makes me think of tropical islands.
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Even though they are both a bit strange in the context of music that is all but Yes, Wakeman's oddball keyboard sounds and Bruford's electronic drums work well on this album more often than not. I have always loved Birthright, and Themes, Fist of Fire and Brother of Mine are all really good as well. Order of the Universe starts off great, but kind of runs out of gas, and the vocal hooks aren't strong enough. The rest of the songs never made much of a dent for me, except for the comedic factor at the beginning of Teakbois, which used to give my younger brother and me a good laugh (Teakbois!! :rollin :rollin :rollin). Overall, a good album, and I see the appeal of it for Yes prog fans at the time who were craving prog out of them again.
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Love this album. Especially The Order Of The Universe. It frequently just pops up in my head for no reason and stays there for hours.
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I remember hearing Brother Of Mine on the radio and then getting the album to find out it was 5 minutes longer than the radio version. Great tour. I saw them in a venue in Boston that's second to none for acoustics, the Wang Center. Just loved hearing these songs live.
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I had a co-worker who just happened to mention to me one day that he'd gone to a concert the other night. A bunch of guys from Yes were out touring and calling it "An Evening of Yes Music". I asked him if it was Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman, and Howe. He said he thought so. The singer sounded like the guy from Yes. He knew almost nothing about them, but went because a friend of his had tickets. I couldn't believe it. He had no idea that I was a Yes fan, and I had no idea that they were touring. I almost wanted to strangle him on the spot, but needed to perform a mind-meld first and get the concert out of his memory banks. I never figured out how to do that, so I had to let him live.
Man, how did we even survive without the Internet and instant access to all information back then?
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THe best thing about that Evening with Yes Plus video was:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBhpHuv-t-Q
:hefdaddy :hefdaddy
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The ABWH album is quite good, with the first half being brilliant. However, I don't find Teakbois and Order of the Universe as good as the other songs. I used to like Order of the Universe much more, but somehow over time it just became kind of flat for me and I don't listen to it much as much anymore. The Meeting though, is such a beautiful song and I've always enjoyed Birthright and Brother of Mine as well. Fist of Fire is one song which has grown on me through the years.
One of my favorite things about this album is that it is completely unique and is kind of the odd man out in this Yes era. It certainly is 80s, it is very Yes-ish, but I would not quite describe this album as 80s Yes. That connotation is more reserved for the poppier, more Rabin led albums of the era. It could be argued that Union is sort of similar, but according to Wikipedia, the material was reworked for Union. I would have liked to hear a second album from the group, and I wonder how much and what material and in what form actually made it onto Union. (Actually, I just searched and found out that there are some demos floating around out there, called Dialogue I think.)
Also, the first DVD we ever purchased as that Evening of Yes Music Plus. It was so great. I remember that it was a double sided DVD. I especially loved Bruford's Simmons SDX drum kit and Wakeman's solo.
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I'm armed and ready for the next two albums, since I dug around one of my older computers and dug up a bootleg from the Union tour and one from the Talk tour. And also found a few other Yes bootlegs too...yeah this is going to be fun.
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You'll have to chill just a bit longer. I'm hitting the ABWH live album An Evening of Yes Music Plus next. But I'm glad you're getting ready. One of the reasons I did this was to give people a reason to revisit their Yes albums.
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I don't have a problem with 80s Yes or Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman and Howe. (It might be my favorite Wakeman-Yes album.)
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You'll have to chill just a bit longer. I'm hitting the ABWH live album An Evening of Yes Music Plus next. But I'm glad you're getting ready. One of the reasons I did this was to give people a reason to revisit their Yes albums.
Actually I also have a bootleg from that tour too...which I totally forgot I had until today :lol
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Crap. I was nearly done with my writeup for An Evening of Yes Music Plus when I realized that it was not released until after Union. Since I'm going chronologically in order of release, not of recording, it goes on a shelf for now.
Union is up next, after all. But I have some listening to do first.
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No worries, just gives me an excuse to play that Union tour bootleg I found again. :lol
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Union was the one and only time I got to see Yes, and it was amazing. All eight of them, in the round. Most of them hated the album, mostly because of how it came about and how it was executed (more on that to come) and the fan reaction to it was also not great, but the concerts were incredible, and both the band and the fans seem to agree on that.
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I gotta give the nod to the Masterworks tour(Rituals, CTTE,Gates all in one show), but the reunion tour was a strong second.
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One of my friends saw the Masterworks tour. I was pissed when I found out. He knows what a huge Yes fan I am, and he didn't even call me when he got tickets. He said he didn't think I'd drive over from Chicago, so he didn't bother. Asshole. I would have. One big reason I don't go to concerts is because I never have anyone to go with. I would've driven five hours to hang with him and catch the concert.
I consoled myself by reminding myself that Rick Wakeman wasn't with them; they still had Igor Khoroshev on keys. I heard he did a great job "being" both Wakeman and Moraz, but ultimately I go to concerts to see certain performers, not certain songs, so I guess I'm okay with missing out on Masterworks.
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Passed Yes up last time I had the chance to see them with Anderson. And now I'm hating myself for it.
As far as Union goes, it's probably my least favorite album from what I've heard. I'll write more after Orbert updates this though,
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Union was the one and only time I got to see Yes, and it was amazing. All eight of them, in the round. Most of them hated the album, mostly because of how it came about and how it was executed (more on that to come) and the fan reaction to it was also not great, but the concerts were incredible, and both the band and the fans seem to agree on that.
The bootleg I have of that tour was simply fantastic. I'll save my praise of it until we get to Union, but since I rediscovered it I've been playing it a lot and loving it.
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Passed Yes up last time I had the chance to see them with Anderson. And now I'm hating myself for it.
As far as Union goes, it's probably my least favorite album from what I've heard. I'll write more after Orbert updates this though,
Or as Rick Wakeman calls Union..................."Onion"
It makes him cry. :lol
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Union (1991)
(https://i.imgur.com/1MBfN0N.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/wHmFUD4.jpg)
(Click for larger view)
Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Bill Bruford - Percussion
Steve Howe - Guitar, Vocals
Tony Kaye - Keyboards
Tony Levin - Bass, Stick
Trevor Rabin - Guitar, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Percussion
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I Would Have Waited Forever
Shock to the System
Masquerade
Lift Me Up
Without Hope You Cannot Start the Day
Saving My Heart
Miracle of Life
Silent Talking
The More We Live / Let Go
Angkor Wat
Dangerous (Look in the Light of What You're Searching For)
Holding On
Evensong
Take the Water to the Mountain
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In 1990, Yes did not exist, or perhaps was on another hiatus. It didn't really matter anymore. Jon had left again to form Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe. Trevor had taken the opportunity to record his solo album Can't Look Away. ABWH had embarked on a tour called "An Evening of Yes Music Plus" and they did exactly that; they performed Yes music plus some of the grander songs from their album. They were, after all, 4/5 of the band which had recorded Fragile and Close to the Edge, and even though 90125 and Big Generator also featured four Yes veterans, the 80's Yes had a very different sound from the 70's Yes, and most longtime fans considered ABWH "the real Yes". So perhaps Yes did exist, and perhaps there were even two bands with legitimate claims to the name. After all, if Yes was broken up, then why couldn't ABWH simply take the name?
And of course, lawsuits were filed on both sides.
Work had stalled on the second ABWH album. They had some songs, though not enough for a CD. Jon contacted Trevor and told him that they needed one more song, which Trevor took to mean they needed a single. Trevor was working on material for the next Yes album. He sent Jon three songs, figuring Jon would pick one; Jon wanted them all. As with so many events in Yes history, there are many versions of what happened next, and how, but ultimately Arista records ended up with the contract for the next Yes album, and it was to feature the union of the two rival factions: Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman, Howe, Squire, White, Kaye, and Rabin.
It actually made some sense, on paper anyway. If they combined forces, they could release a truly amazing album, with the combined talents of both old and new Yes. It would be promoted endlessly, sell millions of units, and everyone would make a lot of money.
It's not a bad album. On first listen, there is Jon's unique voice, Steve's guitar, Chris' distinctive bass, Alan's powerful drums, Bill's electronic drums, Trevor's voice can be heard... there is a lot of talent, and yes, it seems all of them are here. But if you read the liner notes, you notice that there are no tracks on which all eight of them play. In fact, it's pretty easy to see that Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman, Howe, and Levin play on nine of the tracks, the lineup from 90125 play on four, and there is Steve's acoustic solo, "Masquerade". Then you notice the "additional musicians" for the ABWH material, and that list goes on and on.
It started with Jonathan Elias, who was to produce the second ABWH album but had no idea what made the band tick. Jon is listed as "associate producer". When it came time to do some of Steve's overdubs, Steve wasn't available, but Jimmy Haun (guitarist for The Chris Squire Experiment) was, and with some digital tweaking, he could be made to sound just like Steve. Rick was on a tour when time came for his overdubs, and they were under pressure from the label at this point to complete the album, so countless additional musicians contributed. It could be considered a compliment to Rick that it took the efforts of over a dozen men to create the parts which would sound like him, but Rick can't even listen to it; he says he cannot hear anything that he actually played. Steve didn't realize that his parts had been overdubbed, and was very angry when he finally heard the finished product.
Chris does some vocals on the ABWH tracks, so we do get something of a reunion of the Fragile band, other than the fact that he doesn't also play bass, and it's no longer even possible to tell if that's Steve on guitar, or Rick on keyboards. Rick has gone on record very publicly and very candidly saying that he hates Union. He calls it "Onion" not because of all the layers, but because it makes him cry every time. Bill has stated that there is only one album he's ever played on with Yes or anyone else that he's not proud of, and it is Union. Trevor is more diplomatic, saying that the idea was sound, but the record executives and the producers got too much control over things, and that got in the way of the music. With everything digitized and on the hard drives of computers, it was just too easy to play with the tracks, edit them, and change them until the players themselves didn't even recognize their own performances.
Roger Dean again does the cover art, and introduces a new Yes logo on this album (in the top corner).
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Orbert says: It really isn't a bad album. It is well produced, perhaps over-produced, but the playing is fine and the sound is very good. Some have complained that the songs are somewhat weak, certainly not as strong as the ABWH album or either of the Yes albums preceding it, but that is more a matter of taste and personal preference. The biggest problem is that when you listen to it, you don't know who you are hearing. Steve Howe does not play all the guitar parts on the Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe tracks, and Rick Wakeman does not play any keyboards that he can detect. That is nothing short of criminal. There are 14 additional keyboard/synth credits, two percussionists, seven vocalists, and another guitarist all credited on the ABWH tracks. The "90125 Yes" tracks don't have that problem, but there are only four of them, and it's been said that Trevor used up his better material on his solo album; what we get here are leftovers. I can't really comment on them. When I went to re-listen to Union for this writeup, I found that I'd deleted the "90125 Yes" tracks from my iPod. And the CD player is my car is borked, so I can't even tell you if I thought they were better than I remembered or what. But apparently I made the decision at some point to nuke them. Such is life.
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Union is unique, for many reasons, but when I revisited the entire Yes discography last year, I found myself liking this album more and more. The ABWH tracks are pretty solid, and the Rabin-led Yes had some good pieces too, and while it's not a very cohesive album, it's got a lot of strong points across the board.
It's near the top of their middle-tier albums, IMO, and not a bad effort. Like was said, it looked good on paper, but not so much in execution. However, there are some good tunes and the production isn't bad, either. I also enjoy the non-album tracks "Give & Take" and "Love Conquers All", which I include in my tracklist for this album. Might as well include all I can for it! :lol
-Marc.
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Union, oh boy, what to say about this one?
I'll start off with a shocker: Lift Me Up from this album is one of my favorite Yes songs. Not just on this album, or produced by the Rabin version of Yes-one of my favorite Yes songs period. I had heard somewhere that Rabin's contributions to this album were little more than demos with Jon Anderson adding vocals, and you can hear that in a lot of the details of this song, but that doesn't stop it from being a truly glorious song with an amazing chorus and one of the better solos Rabin laid down in the studio for Yes. Another Rabin contribution, Saving My Heart, is amazingly catchy and has an equally fantastic chorus; it may be said that Rabin used his best material on Can't Look Away, and that was a very good album, but Lift Me Up and Saving My Heart match the best songs on Can't Look Away, and nothing on it is as good as Lift Me Up. The AWBH tracks are so overproduced and robbed of the soul of the players that they barely rate mentioning, though Shock To The System is an excellent track.
However, one good thing did come out of this album: the resulting tour with all eight members playing. As a result of this thread, I went through my older computers looking for some Yes bootlegs I knew I had, and one of them came from that tour. In theory, having all eight guys onstage at once could have been a disaster. In practice, though, it was amazing. The interplay between all eight is amazing-you wouldn't think Steve Howe and Trevor Rabin trading leads on Yours Is No Disgrace would work, but it does so remarkably. Other older tracks like Heart of the Sunrise and And You And I work perfectly beside of the newer songs like Lift Me Up and Rhythm of Love, and there's a fan-fucking-tastic rendition of Awaken that is one of my favorite live versions of that song ever. Any Yes fan who hasn't heard one of the boots from that tour needs to now, because you're missing out on some really stellar performances. So while there is a lot of bad that came of Union, and commercially speaking at least it was largely the end of Yes as a major force, it did give us that tour. We can thank it for that at least.
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Eh, it's a bad album in my opinion. There's a couple decent songs, like "The More We Live" and Steve's solo, but otherwise nothing is memorable at all. The opening track is all right; it sounds like "Heart of the Sunrise" and "Siberian Khatru" packaged together in a much less memorable project that is lesser than the sum of its parts.
Got this for like $2 in a bargain bin, and I'm glad that's all I paid for it. Out of all the Yes studio albums I've heard, Union is the one I listen to least of all (not counting those I don't have: the first two, Tormato, Talk, and Keys).
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This album isn't as completely awful as many make it out be, but it still isn't very good either, and when you consider the possibilities, had they all gotten together to write and play, it is just an utter travesty. I do enjoy Shock to the System, Lift Me Up, Miracle of Life and Saving My Heart all quite a bit, and there are a few other tunes with some good parts, but there are a bunch of songs that are just utter rubbish. Unfortunately, I wasn't a fan of the band yet when this CD was out - outside of 90125 and Big Generator - so I had no interest in going to see them when they came here on that tour. Several friends who did go said it was great.
And another big travesty was that Trevor Rabin and Rick Wakeman, whom reportedly got along splendidly on that tour, never got to work together on a real Yes album.
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I actually like "I Would Have Waited Forever", "Shock To The System", "Without Hope You Cannot Start The Day", and "The More We Live - Let Go", so I consider Union better than ABWH in that there are actually songs I enjoy from it.
So much for me staying out of the topic, but if there's something from this era I enjoy, I'll post it.
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And another big travesty was that Trevor Rabin and Rick Wakeman, whom reportedly got along splendidly on that tour, never got to work together on a real Yes album.
I'm sure it'll come up when we discuss Talk, but Rabin wanted him on that album instead of Kaye, and while I love Talk, I can't imagine how good it could've been with Wakeman.
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Yeah, Trevor and Rick had been admirers of each other's work for years and had wanted to work together for a long time, but all they've ever done is the Union tour; they didn't even get to play together on the album. And then Victory records and Rick's management sabotaged Rick appearing on Talk. Yes has a long history of letting management have too much control and call too many shots and screw too many things up.
On the Union tour, when they played "Owner of Lonely Heart", Rick took a synth solo at the end. I thought that was pretty bizarre, out of left field for sure, as Rick didn't even play on 90125. But now that I know more of the history, I'm guessing it's because Trevor wanted him to. Rick taking a solo on one of Trevor's songs also reinforced the whole "union" concept, with the crossing over between the two camps.
That tour was incredible. In the round, with the two drum kits opposite each other, at East and West. The two keyboard setups were at North and South, the guitarists at NE and SW, and Chris and Jon at NW and SE. Very symmetrical, very logical. The stage slowly turned, so you eventually got to see each of them "in front" for a while. We were in the front row of the balcony, so we could see everything, and best of all, the mix was perfect from where we sat.
The set list that night was:
Firebird Suite (excerpt)
Yours Is No Disgrace
Rhythm of Love
Shock to the System
Heart of the Sunrise
Clap (Steve solo)
Make It Easy
Owner of a Lonely Heart
And You and I
Drum Duet
Changes (Tony solo intro)
I've Seen All Good People
Solly's Beard (Trevor's solo)
Saving My Heart
Whitefish / Amazing Grace (Squire/White duet)
Lift Me Up
Rick's Keyboard Solo
Awaken
Roundabout (encore)
We were in Landover Maryland, just outside Washington, D.C., and earlier that day, Trevor had become an U.S. citizen, so they had a little ceremony on stage during the show to celebrate. My wife even bought the tickets, as an early birthday present. An amazing night.
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Saw them twice on the Union tour and was very happy to see "Awaken" live.
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Looks like a pretty great set list, the only drawback being too many solo spots, but I guess with a band as self-indulgent as Yes, that is to be expected. :lol
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Looks like a pretty great set list, the only drawback being too many solo spots, but I guess with a band as self-indulgent as Yes, that is to be expected. :lol
:lol Everyone but Jon had a solo spot/song/section devoted to them! Amazing! Too bad the shows weren't longer to accommodate more/longer songs.
-Marc.
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Closest thing I have to a complaint about that tour was all the solo spots; they could have worked in a couple more songs, easily, without them. On the other hand, they were so damned good-I love the hell out of Rabin's solo bit, Solly's Beard, and the Whitefish duet has part of Tempus Fugit in it for further awesome-it's hard to complain TOO much. :biggrin:
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Yes has always had the featured solo spots. It's a tradition going back to the Yessongs days, and there's no way they could deny the audience that part of the show. With so many of them, yeah, it took up a lot of time. But with no opening act and no intermission, it helped give everyone a break. And seriously, 12 Yessongs, including "Awaken", "And You And I", "Heart of the Sunrise", and "Yours is No Disgrace" is still a hell of a show, then you add all the solo spots.
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Union was the one and only time I got to see Yes, and it was amazing. All eight of them, in the round. Most of them hated the album, mostly because of how it came about and how it was executed (more on that to come) and the fan reaction to it was also not great, but the concerts were incredible, and both the band and the fans seem to agree on that.
That was the only time I ever saw Yes too. Still have the Tour shirt with I never wore and sits in a box with a bunch of my other tour shirts I haven't worn (Back when I could afford to buy more than one shirt!)
I liked Union a lot when it came out but it's one of the few albums I have where I don't like it as much as when it first came out. Fortunately, there aren't too many of those.
The show was killer though. Steve Howe didn't look to happy at the Meadowlands show I saw. Just sat there and played (might have had something to do with the crowed stage, I don't know)
One of my friends saw the Masterworks tour. I was pissed when I found out. He knows what a huge Yes fan I am, and he didn't even call me when he got tickets. He said he didn't think I'd drive over from Chicago, so he didn't bother. Asshole. I would have. One big reason I don't go to concerts is because I never have anyone to go with. I would've driven five hours to hang with him and catch the concert.
I consoled myself by reminding myself that Rick Wakeman wasn't with them; they still had Igor Khoroshev on keys. I heard he did a great job "being" both Wakeman and Moraz, but ultimately I go to concerts to see certain performers, not certain songs, so I guess I'm okay with missing out on Masterworks.
That was the last tour that I would have had any desire to see Yes and I'm really sorry I never made it. I love Igor's keyboard work and it's a shame he had to "leave."
I'll almost always go to concerts alone if I don't have anyone to go with. I'm going to see Flying colors alone. My wife would have gone with me, but we're cutting expenses so we can all go see Rush in October.
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My wife would go with me, if it came to that. She's not a proghead or anything, but she can handle Yes most of the time and she went with me to see Genesis years ago. I mentioned that one big reason I don't go is because I don't have anyone to go with; the other big reason is the cost, which would be doubled if my wife went with me. It all comes out of the some pocket (mine). Concert tickets are so damned expensive nowadays, and I'd be paying for two, one of whom is really only there to keep me company. I love live music, but I have bills to pay.
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My wife would go with me, if it came to that. She's not a proghead or anything, but she can handle Yes most of the time and she went with me to see Genesis years ago. I mentioned that one big reason I don't go is because I don't have anyone to go with; the other big reason is the cost, which would be doubled if my wife went with me. It all comes out of the some pocket (mine). Concert tickets are so damned expensive nowadays, and I'd be paying for two, one of whom is really only there to keep me company. I love live music, but I have bills to pay.
Big problem when your family likes most of the same music you do. (Well, not really, but it's an expensive problem!) That's about where I am myself. Since it's another Rush year, there are many shows that suffer the budget axe.
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That's why I don't see big acts anymore, really. For what'd I'd spend on seeing Rush or Maiden this year, I could go see half a dozen other smaller acts (this year, for example, Bon Iver, Devin Townsend, Flying Colors, etc)
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Edit: wrong thread...on account to drunken post
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Yesyears (1991)
(https://i.imgur.com/7OpQ1qK.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/dBA7JTx.jpg)
(Box set cover - click for larger view)
(https://i.imgur.com/607sLnb.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/AYwtJ05.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/D3QzUPS.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/uyEBkq6.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/Y8KFY0g.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/8OKwU0c.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/YnH4kIv.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/oCcLgP0.jpg)
(Individual disc covers - click each for larger view)
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1991 was a big year for Yes. The Union album was released, and its accompanying tour was a huge success. It was also the year that Atco (a subsidiary of Atlantic Records, Yes' home for many years) released the box set Yesyears.
Box sets are always hit-or-miss. Sometimes the idea is to provide an expanded "greatest hits" collection. Sometimes it is more to provide a retrospective of the band, with tracks from each period or even from each album. Sometimes the focus is on rarities; B-sides, unreleased tracks, alternate versions, or rare live recordings. Sometimes they try to do all of these at once. Yesyears fits into this last category.
It's hard to tell who the intended audience is here. Hardcore fans tend to be most interested the outtakes and rarities, but they usually already have most of the regular album tracks which comprise a large part of the set. The album tracks do offer an interesting sampling of Yes from every album, but the choices are always highly subjective and a certain percentage of fans will always be disappointed. On the other hand, the entire set is arranged chronologically, and thus it is handy to pick a disc and have an eclectic collection from one's favorite period. Overall, it is an excellent sampling of early, late, live and studio Yes, but box sets are rarely where a casual fan goes looking to learn about a band. The single disc Classic Yes would probably be better suited for that purpose, but it only focuses on a handful of albums. This collection was clearly meant to be much broader in scope.
The packaging is elaborate and beautiful. A full-size (12 x 12) box houses four CDs and a large booklet with photos and a history of the band. The cover art is by Roger Dean, whose work is nearly synonymous with Yes, and the individual disc covers are small Dean abstracts, each unique.
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Disc 1
Something's Coming (B-side of "Sweetness")
Survival (from Yes)
Every Little Thing (from Yes)
Then (BBC recording)
Everydays (BBC recording)
Sweet Dreams (from Time and a Word)
No Opportunity Necessary, No Experience Needed (from Time and a Word)
Time and a Word (from Time and a Word)
Starship Trooper (from The Yes Album)
Yours is No Disgrace (from The Yes Album)
I've Seen All Good People (from The Yes Album)
Long Distance Runaround (from Fragile)
The Fish (from Fragile)
Disc 2
Roundabout (from Fragile)
Heart of the Sunrise (from Fragile)
America (single edit)
Close to the Edge (from Close to the Edge)
Ritual (Nous Sommes Du Soleil) (from Tales from Topographic Oceans)
Sound Chaser (from Relayer)
Disc 3
Soon (single edit, excerpt from "The Gates of Delerium")
Amazing Grace (unreleased Squire solo)
Vevey, Part One (unreleased, Going for the One sessions)
Wonderous Stories (from Going for the One)
Awaken (from Going for the One)
Montreux's Theme (unreleased, Going for the One sessions)
Vevey, Part Two (unreleased, Going for the One sessions)
Going for the One (from Going for the One)
Money (unreleased, Tormato sessions)
Abilene (B-side of "Don't Kill the Whale")
Don't Kill the Whale (from Tormato )
On the Silent Wings of Freedom (from Tormato )
Does It Really Happen? (from Drama)
Tempus Fugit (from Drama)
Run with the Fox (unreleased Squire/White duo)
I'm Down (live, 1976)
Disc 4
Make It Easy (unreleased, 90125 era)
It Can Happen (unreleased early version, 90125 sessions)
Owner of a Lonely Heart (from 90125)
Hold On (from 90125)
Shoot High, Aim Low (from Big Generator)
Rhythm of Love (from Big Generator)
Love Will Find a Way (from Big Generator)
Changes (live, 1988)
And You And I (live, 1988)
Heart of the Sunrise (live, 1988)
Love Conquers All (unreleased, Union era)
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Personally, I love this box set, but that is largely sentimental. 1991 was the year I finally got to see Yes, on the Union tour, which was amazing. My wife bought me tickets as an early birthday present that summer, and that Christmas I found this box set under the tree.
There's something here for everyone, but as I mentioned in the writeup, it's hard for anyone but a hardcore fan to justify investing in a box set, and hardcore fans tend to already have most of the studio material, so they're really only getting it for the rare stuff. But the studio material was all remastered, so that was a nice plus, and again as mentioned, it was kinda cool having discs which each formed something of a mini-retrospective of a certain period. I personally wore out Disc 3 (literally; it started messing up after a while) and probably was pretty close to wearing out Disc 2. As it happens, I did not already have most of this stuff on CD; I still had it all on vinyl. So this was an upgrade for me. Remember that in 1991, CDs still hadn't been around all that long, and a lot of Yesfans hadn't gotten around to upgrading all their vinyl yet.
And yes, that's "Something's Coming" from West Side Story, the musical. Music by Leonard Bernstein. And they give it the full Yes treatment, similar to how "America" and "Every Little Thing" are practically unrecognizable from their original versions. Speaking of which, the edited version of "America" is interesting, but I think I've listened to it exactly once. Same with "Soon". It's pretty, but to me it's just part of a song. Apparently it was actually released as a single at some point.
The Rabin-era live stuff is interesting, but honestly I could take or leave it. Most of the rarities have now found their way onto the Rhino remasters/rereleases, but in 1991, this was a hell of a collection. And the packaging is sweet. If you can find one of these in decent shape, I'd say grab it just to have as a collector's item. It's out of print now, and not likely to be reissued.
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Wow, no one else has this box? I know it's out of print, but I didn't think it was that rare. It was huge news when it came out. Or maybe that's just how it seemed to me.
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Wow, no one else has this box? I know it's out of print, but I didn't think it was that rare. It was huge news when it came out. Or maybe that's just how it seemed to me.
I *wish*I had this, even though now much of this material has been released elsewhere, especially due to the Rhino Remasters.
It's a great set, though I wish I had a copy of it. It's a good track listing, but I'd rather suggest "In A Word" or "The Word Is Live" if anyone was going to get a multi-disc Yes box set, especially for an existing Yesfan.
-Marc.
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An Evening of Yes Music Plus (1993)
(https://i.imgur.com/JX9hg01.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/YKtrJiE.jpg)
(Click for full painting)
Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Bill Bruford - Acoustic and Electronic Drums
Steve Howe - Guitar
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Augmented by:
Jeff Berlin - Bass
Julian Colbeck - Keyboards
Milton McDonald - Guitar
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Young Person's Guide to the Orchestra
Jon Anderson Solo: Time and a Word / Owner of a Lonely Heart / Teakbois
Steve Howe Solo: The Clap / Mood for a Day
Rick Wakeman Solo: Gone but Not Forgotten / Catherine Parr / Merlin the Magician
Long Distance Runaround (including Bill Bruford solo)
Birthright
And You And I
Starship Trooper
Close to the Edge
i. The Solid Time of Change
ii. Total Mass Retain
iii. I Get Up, I Get Down
iv. Seasons of Man
Themes
i. Sound
ii. Second Attention
iii. Soul Warrior
Brother of Mine
i. The Big Dream
ii. Nothing Can Come Between Us
iii. Long Lost Brother of Mine
Heart of the Sunrise
Order of the Universe
i. Order Theme
ii. Rock Gives Courage
iii. It's So Hard to Grow
iv The Universe
Roundabout
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Following the Union album and tour, which record execs had hoped would jump-start one of the more profitable 70's acts (of those that were still around), negotiations for the follow-up album were dragging on, so the Yesyears box set was released to fill the void. The following year, with still no new Yes album in sight, a small label known as Herald managed to license the rights to release a live album recorded on the Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe tour.
Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe were not Yes, and depending on which of them you asked, they were not trying to be, or they definitely were. The matter was ultimately settled when ABWH hit the road and played a series of concerts titled "An Evening of Yes Music". At this point, it would have been ridiculous to pretend that the purpose of the tour was to promote their studio album. They went out and played classic Yes music from The Yes Album, Fragile, and Close to the Edge, plus some songs from the ABWH album.
The album was recorded on the last night of the 1989 U.S. tour, and Tony Levin, who had played bass and Stick on the ABWH album and also on the tour, was very ill and could not play. Jeff Berlin, who had played bass in Bruford (Bill's jazz/fusion band) was called in and had about a day to learn the entire set list. If the circumstances were different, the show would probably have just been cancelled or rescheduled due to illness, but the recording equipment was all arranged, and this may have been the last chance to record ABWH in concert. So they went for it. All things considered, Jeff does a great job playing a lot of complex material. Still, the band ABWH had really begun to gel, and bootlegs from earlier in the tour with Tony Levin reveal a band as worthy as any band called Yes. It's a shame that none of those recordings have seen a proper release.
The show opens with solo sets by each of them. Jon's voice and guitar set includes a medley of the title track from Time and a Word, "Owner of a Lonely Heart", and a song from Anderson Bruford Wakeman Howe, spanning the history of ABWH in about seven minutes. There is some mashing up of the songs during the medley, singing lyrics from one to the tune of another, and so on. Steve plays two of his most well-known solo pieces, from The Yes Album and Fragile, respectively, and also adds some new twists. Rick plays a medley of a new piece and tracks from two of his most well-known solo albums, The Six Wives of Henry VIII and Myths and Legends of King Arthur and the Knights of the Round Table, then leads into "Long Distance Runaround". After performing the song pretty much whole, they venture off into Bill's drum solo, completing the "solos" part of the show.
"Birthright" is a quiet, low-key song from the ABWH album, and then it's time for a trip down memory lane, with "And You And I", "Starship Trooper" and "Close to the Edge". Then they return to the ABWH album for a few songs, and go back and forth between ABWH and Yes for the rest of the evening.
The ABWH songs sit well alongside the Yes classics, and earn respectable ovations from the audience. If it weren't for Bill's insistent use of Simmons drums and the lack of Chris Squire's characteristic bi-amped Rickenbacker, this could easily be a live Yes album. And of course, that's the whole idea. The band Yes officially did not exist in 1989, when the album was recorded, and it may or may not have existed in 1993 when this recording was finally released. But we did get some new live Yes music.
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It's not a perfect album, but it's very good, and I was happy to receive a copy of it, years after its release, as a gift. It was given to me by my late sister-in-law, who had seen the Going for the One tour in the round and was as big a Yesfan as I am. Listening to it again for the first time in years, I found I'd forgotten how much I liked it.
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I have a bootleg with Levin on it from this tour, and it's fantastic. Much like you, I wish there could have been an official release of some of those shows, they were really amazing. I had this ages ago, I taped a copy a friend of mine had, and recall giving it some play for a while before I eventually lost track of those cassettes. They were really in a good groove on that tour, and it carried over to the Union one.
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I think ABWH was when I realized how much Chris Squire's bass was part of the Yes sound. I guess I just hadn't really thought of it before. Steve's guitar and Rick's keyboards, and of course Jon's voice, are all unique and strongly associated with Yes, but in my younger days, I didn't pay as much attention to the rhythm section. It turns out that different drummers can make a difference, and so can a different bass player.
Jeff Berlin is no slouch. I love his work in Bruford. But he was thrown into a very tough gig, and he gave it a hell of a shot. Still, it is only the lack of a really assertive, in-your-face bass that makes this version of "Close to the Edge" less than excellent. The rest of the guys are on fire. Yeah, it would've been nice to have Chris' high harmony there too, but it's that thumping, stomping bass that I really miss. Same with "Heart of the Sunrise". The bass line is so important to both of those songs, and I wish Jeff had had even one more day to practice this stuff; I'm sure he would've nailed it. Instead, he sounds tentative, and they keep the bass a bit low in the mix, which is so unfortunate.
And Tony Levin of course is also a beast. I would love to hear a boot with him on bass with ABWH. I bet he tears it up.
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ABWH always went for that very 1980s sound where the bass is so low in the mix it might as well not be there. Much as I like that album, the keyboards are too loud, the guitar too quiet, the bass invisible and the electronic drums too high in the treble. It's just how rock music was mixed in the 80s. The better tracks are the acoustic ones for this very reason. "The Meeting" is beautiful, and I want it at my funeral.
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Back from the holidays and therefore obviously missed to comment on some great (IMO) records from the Rabin era.
Anyway, back to topic: An Evening of Yes Music plus
I like this record but mainly for nostalgic reasons. The ABWH Tour was the first and to this day last time that I saw YES live (well as close as it gets to YES). I have really fond memories of that concert and I didn't miss Chris Squire that much because Tony Levin was a more than worthy replacement and I really liked the use of the "Bass Fingers" in Heart Of The Sunrise. I remember the band being on fire and they really seemed to have a good time. And I'm still stoned from the amount of weed that was smoked around me. :hat
The setlist was longer than on this record, I wonder if they kicked some of the songs because Jeff Berlin didn't have the time to learn them all. On the other hand, there is a resissue which has I've seen all good people on it. So where does this come from? And they played The Meeting which has no bass at all. Why is it not on the record? At least on CD there would have been enough time left to put them on.
While I don't think that An Evening Of Yes Music plus is a bad record I have some quarrels with it. First the solos at the beginning are way too long. You have to wait about half an hour before the whole band starts with a "real" song, only to be followed by another solo. What seemed great in live settings doesn't work so well on a record. And I find Steve Howe's rendition of The Clap to be a bit lackluster, it is a bit slower and it misses the fire and energy of the Yes Album's version. Furthermore I never really cared for Mood for a day.
Then you have the mixing. Steve Howe's guitars are way too low in the mix. While you can hear his acoustic guitars quite good, his electric guitars more often than not get lost in the sound. They Keys are sometimes too loud and Bruford's electric drums are certainly an aquired taste that sometimes fit and sometimes sound plain off annoying.
The song collection is a good mixture of actual songs and old classics.
Jeff Berlin does a good job, especially considering the short time he had to learn all the songs, but the signature Yes bass sound is missing. Tony Levin did a better job in replacing Squire but then he had more time to rehearse and gel with the band. They even had a Bruford/Levin solo spot on the concert I've seen. I would like to hear a concert of that tour with Levin on bass.
Another interesting point is the addition of a second guitar player and a second keyboard player, which I think they have not done on any other tour, or am I wrong?
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You are not wrong. ABWH is the only time when additional guitars and keyboards were used live. And what makes it particularly disappointing is that it just wasn't necessary. Yes has always been amazing in what they can do live, without tracks and without additional musicians. Did they figure that because technically they're ABWH and not Yes that it was okay? Why break with tradition now? Or was it because it was the 80's and "everyone was doing it anyway"? I hate that rationale.
I can't think of any times when I can hear two guitars; there may be a few, but none that actually stand out. And I don't remember hearing more than two keyboards at any given time. It was never needed with Yes, and while the ABWH tracks are nice, I'm sure Rick could've found a way to cover all essential parts with his two hands.
There are rumours that the 90125 band had a second keyboard player hidden backstage, and there are even a few pictures of this supposed phantom player, but the band has always maintained that his only function was to program the keys and change patches remotely. Some people don't buy it, I'm not sure if I do, but it started with people's assertions that Tony Kaye is no Rick Wakeman and therefore cannot possibly have been playing all the keyboards himself. Since that is both unfounded and unfair to Tony, I don't bother pursuing it any further than that.
I agree with your comments regarding the track listing. The solo spots must've been really cool in concert, but on the album they have the effect of getting things off to a very slow start. And the mixing, yeah, kinda weak. Keyboards and electronic drums were so hot during that time, and production and mixing from the 80's and early 90's reflect that. I'm a keyboard player, but I've always maintained that the mix is more important than any given part. Always. Everything in its place.
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I just watched the DVD on Saturday. I have to say that I think it is much more fun to watch than it is to listen to. (Not that it is bad to listen to either) I would definitely be bored with the solo spots in the beginning of the concert if I were not watching them. Also, I think viewing this concert brings so much more to it.
As far as the mix goes, I agree that Steve's guitars were a little low, sometimes overpowered by the keys, and the backing vocals, especially the ones by the second guitarist, were too loud. As far as the electronic drums, I love em, but there were a bit too loud. I did notice however that Bruford's real snare actually did not sound that much different that the electronic one, it was just quieter. It kind of had that reverb-y gated sound still.
The backup musicians. When watching, the parts I remember when both keyboardists are playing are in the beginning of Themes, also one other song when Rick had a solo (sorry I do not remember which song this is.) Actually, there were three keyboardists on Themes! For the beginning intro, Jon joined Rick behind the keyboards for a small part. I do remember both guitarists playing I think it was on Birthright in the beginning. I do really like how they let both the guitarist and the keyboard player solo on I've Seen All Good People. I thought that was nice of them.
Also, looking over the setlist that is on the CD, it is different than on the DVD. On the DVD, they played Starship Trooper as an encore and I've Seen All Good people after And You And I. I see on wikipedia that the 2006 re-release of the CD is this way as well. I wonder why they cut it from the original?
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Talk (1994)
(https://i.imgur.com/yPIhsW1.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Tony Kaye - Organ
Trevor Rabin - Guitar, Keyboards, Bass, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Percussion
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The Calling
I Am Waiting
Real Love
State of Play
Walls
Where Will You Be
Endless Dream
a. Silent Spring
b. Talk
c. Endless Dream
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After Union, which brought all eight main Yes members together on the same disc if not actually on any given tracks, there was talk of them doing a proper album, with all of them involved from the beginning. But it never got off the ground. If getting five men together to make an album is difficult, getting eight together is nearly impossible. And after the poor sales of Union, Atlantic may have been reluctant to take another chance with Yes. Finally, a man named Phil Carson contacted Trevor about making a new Yes album for his label, Victory Records, but he was only interested in the 90125 lineup. Trevor had been looking forward to working with Rick, and got Phil to agree to Rick appearing on the album, but Rick's management and Victory Records could not come to an agreement, and ultimately Rick was not involved.
Talk therefore had the same lineup as 90125 and Big Generator. One major difference was that Jon Anderson was on board from the start, rather than coming in and adding his touches to completed and mostly-completed songs, as he had done on 90125 and Big Generator. The songs reflect that, still sounding much like 80's Yes, but with a much stronger element of 70's Yes harmony, spirituality, and even a bit more progressive feel. Jon's influence is evident throughout the songs, but Trevor had continued to mature as a songwriter as well and must be given some of the credit for that.
Also, Trevor's state-of-the-art recording studio was now completed, and everything was recorded, edited, and mastered digitally by Trevor. In other words, he produced it and had full creative control. Talk is very much Trevor's vision, even moreso than the previous Yes albums with which he was involved.
Given all that, what might be surprising is that Talk sounds more like 70's Yes than the other albums by this same lineup, and is regarded as the best of the three "Rabin-era" Yes albums. The songs are all very strong, both musically and melodically, and have a greater average length. They take their time introducing ideas and feel more like explorations and less like pop songs crafted to be radio hits. There is some genuine prog here, even if it is mostly restricted to the 15-minute epic "Endless Dream".
The playing on the album is also sometimes reminiscent of 70's Yes. The opening track, "The Calling" features some southern-flavored guitar work by Trevor which almost seems to channel Steve Howe. His lead lines on "I Am Waiting" are similar in style and effect to Steve's work on Going for the One or even Fragile. That is not to say that this album sounds like 70's Yes, but it is a fine blending of the old and new Yes sounds, and combines the best of both worlds.
Unfortunately, once the old-school Yes fans heard who the lineup would be on this album, their interest all but vanished. On the other hand, it had again been nearly seven years since the last "YesWest" album, and many fans of that lineup had moved on as well. That didn't leave much of an audience for this album. Combine that with the fact that Victory Records went bankrupt shortly after the release of Talk, thus there was almost no promotion for it, and you have the poorest-selling Yes album in over 20 years. Perhaps most tragic of all, both critics and fans rate Talk quite highly, and it could have been a huge success under different circumstances.
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Okay, by now you've noticed that the tone and writing style of these writeups can vary a bit, from attempting to be completely objective, to bits of subjectivity creeping in, to some outright editorializing. That is by design; I had no intention of making all of these the same, because not only is that boring, but I wouldn't be able to do it anyway.
I honestly never really listened to Talk before giving it a spin last week in preparation for this writeup. Wow! This is actually a really good album. I spun it again over the weekend, and twice more since then (and today is only Tuesday where I am). I really like this album a lot. My remark about old-school Yesfans writing this one off once they heard that it was another YesWest album was aimed at me and others like me. Give this album a shot, a fair shot. Forget that the cover is stupid and the chic, minimalist approach doesn't work at all. Cast aside your preconceptions about what a YesWest album sounds like if all you've heard is 90125 and Big Generator. This is easily the best of the three. Easily.
And before you say "Yeah, but that's nothing because those albums are crap anyway" try to listen with an open mind and open ears. This album won me over, and I'm a die-hard proghead. Give it a chance.
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I will preface my comments on Talk by saying that for a personal reason, I have a soft spot for it. 1994 was the last year I spent drinking, and I stopped for (hopefully) good in January 1995. In the early days of my self taught rehab program, I played two albums near constantly: The Division Bell by Pink Floyd...and Talk by Yes. Those two albums got me through a rather rough time that, in retrospect, I shouldn't have done alone. And if I had to pick a song from those two albums that got me through it the most, it would be the 15 minute epic Endless Dream that closes out Talk. That's largely the reason why, when I list Yes epics in my head, only Close to the Edge surpasses Endless Dream for me.
That being said...this is the best Yes album no one has ever heard. It vanished without a trace upon release, not getting promoted at all. It got a tour, which I can only confirm via the existence of a bootleg from that tour which I'll get to later. I think I heard The Calling on local radio once, and if there were videos, I couldn't tell you. And in revisiting it preparing for discussing it in this thread, I reordered my Yes list, and Talk rates only behind Close to the Edge, The Yes Album, and Fragile...and on a good day I think it can take Fragile. It blends the progressive ambition of the 70s with the commercial gloss of the 80s perfectly, and the wall of guitar sounds that Trevor Rabin layers Talk in are like nothing I had ever heard before or ever again. His leads go, in a split second, from the country feel of Steve Howe to something perfectly suited to a metal album and then back again. I Am Waiting does feel like classic Yes, but it has two magnificent ending verses with huge sounding vocals that Yes really didn't do often. The album can be catchy and poppy one second, with classic Yes melodies, and then Rabin will blast out bits like the chugging metallic riffs in Real Love.
And oh, Endless Dream, what a BEAUTIFUL song. The places this goes before its 15 minute length finishes rival any of the best Yes epics, and anyone who ever doubted whether Trevor Rabin should have been in Yes needs to listen to Endless Dream, because it'll change your mind. The bootleg I have from this tour has some problems sound wise-it's a thin sounding soundboard with volume issues-but the performances are amazing. Live, Endless Dream became a 21 minute epic featuring a longer ambient section in the middle and Rabin letting fly on the end solo for three or four minutes. The set list is mostly YesWest songs, though And You And I and Heart of the Sunrise make appearances; song lengths in general are longer than their studio versions, and the band is almost fearlessly progressive during the set.
Talk is the single most underrated album in the history of Yes. It's the best album the band made with Rabin and the best album the band made since their 1970s heyday. It's a damn shame more people didn't hear it. Give it a shot if you haven't yet, you might just be stunned at how good it is.
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Talk is definitely way better than many realize. In fact, it is a borderline top 3 Yes album in my book. Like Jaq, I played this and The Division Bell to death throughout the spring and summer of '94 (and saw the two bands within nine days of each other in late June '94). I remember going to the Yes concert and being shocked at what a poor turnout it was at the Riverport Amphitheater (the seats were mostly filled, but the lawn was mostly empty). But the concert absolutely slayed, as they played all of Talk minus State of Play, Rhythm of Love, six of the nine songs from 90125 and four 70s songs (Roundabout, Heart of the Sunrise, And You and I & I've Seen All Good People). It really is too bad that it came out at a time where it had no chance of making a dent. But they did appear on Letterman and play Walls, IIRC, so it did get a little bit of a push.
But getting back to the album, I love every song on it. It has a little bit of everything, from the proggy (Endless Dream) to the pop rock catchiness that Rabin brought to the band (The Calling and Walls) to the laid back (Where Will You Be) to the heavy and weird (Real Love) to the beauty that so embodies Yes (I Am Waiting) to the all-out rock (State of Play). It is a flawless record, on every level possible. Plus, it rocks like almost no other Yes album to date. Howe's heaviest tones have never been ones that can destroy you with their heaviness, as opposed to Rabin's. Think that riff in Real Love near the end of the 2nd verse; that might be the heaviest riff on a Yes record to date. Yes, it is heavier than Machine Messiah or any riff Steve Howe ever played. Plus, nearly every song on this album features awesome vocal melodies that are easy to sing along to, a constant on every great Yes record. Like Orbert and Jaq have already said, if you like Yes at all and have not heard this album, do so immediately, and listen to it with an open mind, and throw away any preconceived notions of what it should sound like and enjoy it for what it does sound like.
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Of the 90's Yes albums, this would be number 1 for me (2 if we count the Keys material as an album, but technically some don't). Talk has strong songs all the way through, and while The Ladder is, at points, proggier than Talk, there's some parts I find are a bit meh, while Talk is good-to-great all the way through.
I often wonder what a 4th YesWest album would have been like had they continued in this direction, and among Yes's 70's prog contemporaries, Yes was about as proggy as any of the others with an album out around this time. They really stepped up from BG and Union, but as Orbert said, poor label backing and relatively small returning fanbase did not allow this album to prosper as it should have. In retrospect, it has indeed become many fan's favorites, and as Orbert said, it is MY favorite of the three Rabin Yes albums.
And yes, I'll also echo the wonderful sentiments about "Endless Dream" - classic Yes epic, dreamy, spacey, full but airy, like a modern "Close To The Edge". Also, the closing section still gives me chills to this day, especially when the chord progression changes just slightly - you know which part I'm talking about.
-Marc.
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"Real Love" is one of my favorite Yes songs. Just the way it builds up to that chorus, and how it sort of feels mechanical, like some kind of structure is sort of being built in the sky. The three-track suite at the end of the album is pretty nice too. Like the other 80s and 90s Yes albums though, the rest of the album doesn't really do much for me.
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I didn't mention much about it last night, but Where Will You Be was, to me, at the time the modern day equivalent of Turn of the Century. If that exact song was on a classic Yes album, and that was Steve Howe playing the acoustic guitar in it, most hardcore Yes fans would salivate over it, but Trevor Rabin is the devil, so therefore the song never gets any props. :tdwn :tdwn
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I like "Where Will You Be" because it's so different. The way the percussion keeps it going, against the completely laid-back feel overall.
I never had the Rabin-hatred that a lot of hardcore Yesfans do/did, and I was a longtime Yesfan. I recognize the guy's talent, and the albums with him aren't bad; they're just not really the type of music I choose to listen to. I never listened to Talk when it came out; I figured it would just be more of the same, but I do remember seeing them on Letterman and thinking the song was okay. Nothing special, but okay.
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I can see Walls (the song they played on Letterman) coming across as pretty run of the mill, and if you are an old school Yes fan, that tune wouldn't get you excited at all about hearing the rest of Talk; I will certainly concede that. But fans should be smart enough to know that the radio hit is not the best example of an album's possible greatness (even if The Calling was the first single from it), so why not check out the rest of the album and listen with an open mind? I swear, sometimes fans go into an album wanting to NOT like it, which makes absolutely no sense to me.
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Agree 100% with you, Kev. If you played Where Will You Be without identifying who the guitarist was, I think most of the more closed minded, Yes is Only Yes When Steve Howe Plays Guitar, would enjoy the song, and would promptly turn on it when they figured out it was Rabin. I'm an oddity in the fandom of Yes for a simple reason; I like Trevor Rabin as a guitarist in general more than I like Steve Howe. I was a fan of Trevor Rabin long before he "joined" Yes, when he was playing as a session musician on Manfred Mann albums in the early 80s, so to me, his arrival in Yes was no big deal. I loved how many different sounds Rabin could yank out of a guitar, the apotheosis of which is the wall of guitar sounds he produced on Talk. It doesn't really shock me that he went into doing movie scores, because he was already writing guitar orchestras with Yes. Make no mistake, Steve Howe is an amazing guitarist and I have no problem with people calling him the sound of Yes. I just dislike how people treat an amazing talent like Rabin just because he ISN'T Steve Howe.
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I am not sure I can say I like Rabin more as a guitarist, but I love both guys' playing, and they bring very different things to the table.
I am also a pretty big fan of Rabin's first solo album and Can't Look Away, his fourth. Face to Face is mostly quite good, as well. And the new one, Jacaranda, is also quite nice, showing off his fusion side a bit.
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I can see Walls (the song they played on Letterman) coming across as pretty run of the mill, and if you are an old school Yes fan, that tune wouldn't get you excited at all about hearing the rest of Talk; I will certainly concede that. But fans should be smart enough to know that the radio hit is not the best example of an album's possible greatness (even if The Calling was the first single from it), so why not check out the rest of the album and listen with an open mind? I swear, sometimes fans go into an album wanting to NOT like it, which makes absolutely no sense to me.
It was 1994. I'd just lost my job and had a two-year-old kid. After Union and all it seemed to portend... we got another RabinYes album. I didn't buy it because I had better things to spend my money on. I didn't go into the album not wanting to like it; I didn't go into it at all. There is a difference. Listening to it with an open mind, I found that I like it quite a bit. I mentioned a few times now.
If your post wasn't directed at me, then I apologize. But it seemed to be, as it references points I made in my post, which immediately preceded yours.
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No, no, I was not talking about you! I swear. :)
I meant fans in general. Hell, I've seen it with a small number of DT fans in regards to the last album, ones who felt such an allegiance to Mike Portnoy that they wanted to NOT like A Dramatic Turn of Events, which is just goofy. Why would you want to not like the music by a band you love? It's crazy to me.
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Ah, sorry about that. All is cool. :coolio
And I know what you mean about DT fans and MP, but mostly I think fans who won't listen to ADTOE with an open mind are only cheating themselves. If they don't like it because of the songs, or the production, that's one thing; but if they don't like it simply because the drummer isn't the original drummer, that's just silly. There's a lot of good stuff on that album.
Yes is kinda different in that regard anyway. If you count ABWH as a Yes album (which many do, including the official Yes website), then there is nobody, no one person, who plays on every album. People come and go every couple of albums. People leave Yes and then come back ten years later sometimes. I heard "Owner of a Lonely Heart" on the radio before I'd heard that Yes had a new album out, or were even back together, and the first thing I thought was that's not Steve on guitar. But whatever, they have a new guitarist. Steve's in Asia now. And those orchestral strikes were kinda cool; is that a synth, or a guitar synth, or what? And I did buy the album, and I did like it.
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I'm giving this album a first spin now, sounds good after a first listen. The Calling, I Am Waiting, and Endless Dream are the highlights. It sure is no Fragile or anything from that era, but I wasn't expecting that either. I sort of lost interest in Yes after Drama.
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Wow, no one else has this box? I know it's out of print, but I didn't think it was that rare. It was huge news when it came out. Or maybe that's just how it seemed to me.
Box is a favorite of mine too. I bought it as soon as it came out and a lot of the rarities were new to me at that time. It had been 10 years since I heard Run With The Fox and it was as awesome as I remember it.
I love the booklet that came with it. Sounds better than the Rhino reissues too. I wish there was more live stuff on it.
We had Roger Dean sign the box when he came in for a signing. I wanted something big for him to sign. I couldn't find my albums at the time so this was all I had ready to go. Very nice guy. I wish he'd come back here more often.
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I played An Evening of Yes Music Plus to death when it came out. It was the best sounding Yes live album I'd heard up to that point. Might be my favorite Yes live album ever.
I love Talk too. Probably the most focused effort of the Rabin years. I really wished I'd seen this tour. I slagged it off figured I'd catch them next time. The band can really hum on this record. Everything you'd ever want in a "classic Yes" record contemporized.
Good stuff. Sonic bliss too.
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I agree with most, if not all of what has been said here. Talk is actually the last Yes album I got into. I did hear and like a couple of songs before hand, but it was only last year that I got into the whole album. I remember I was at the computer lab at school (probably browsing DTF :lol), and then I Am Waiting came on. I was hooked. That guitar solo bit right in the beginning! It was just soaring.
In fact, that is the word I would use to describe the entire album. Soaring guitars, soaring vocals, catchy and melodic but progressive at the same time. To me, this is the perfection and the definition of 90s progressive rock. It is big, modern sounding, and heavy yet has its moments of soothing calmness. The best part is Endless Dream. It sums up the entire album. There are so many great hooks in that song, and it just gets better and better throughout. It is such a beautiful album. It is disappointing to hear that it did not do well in it's time but it is nice to hear that people hold it with high regard now.
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Keys to Ascension (1996)
(https://i.imgur.com/9YPj5mC.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/nR7R2a7.jpg)
(Click for larger view)
Jon Anderson - Vocals, Guitar, Harp
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums, Vocals
Live Tracks
Siberian Khatru
The Revealing Science of God
America
Onward
Awaken
Roundabout
Starship Trooper
Studio Tracks
Be The One
That, That Is
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Talk was a critical success, generally regarded as the best of the three albums by the 90125 lineup, but it was a commercial failure, having been released on a small label with little to no resources with which to promote it, and which went bankrupt. Trevor and Jon were fighting again, and this time Trevor decided that enough was enough, and he left the band. Tony followed him out the door.
Jon made some phone calls and eventually convinced Rick and Steve to return to Yes. The lineup was now the same as Tales from Topographic Oceans, Going for the One, and Tormato. It had been nearly 20 years since this band had played together (other than being part of the Union tour), but it was a return to "classic" Yes in much the same way as ABWH had been, and this time with all five members being Yes veterans and with the name Yes on the cover.
They began writing, and Jon got the idea of playing a few shows near his home in San Luis Obispo, California. The Fremont Theater was a small venue, and the idea was that playing live together, under controlled conditions, would be a way to get the old energy back.
They played three shows, and all three were recorded. The seven live tracks here were taking from those recordings. Unfortunately, music as complex as this is a challenge even for musicians of Yes calibre, and the two weeks they had set aside for rehearsal had not proven to be sufficient. Upon listening to the tapes, the band agreed that some overdubs were in order. Three tracks have their vocals almost entirely replaced, and there are instrumental overdubs as well. Still, the band did play all of the music you hear on the album, and four of the songs had never been released on an official live album before, so they were anxious to release it.
By the time the overdubbing and final mastering was done on the live tracks, they had also completed two new studio tracks. One was nearly ten minutes in length and the other was over 19 minutes, a new "epic". Some members of the band, most notably Rick, felt that they should wait until they had a full album's worth of material, which they could then release as a new studio album. Being included as "bonus tracks" on a live album would marginalize the new songs.
But as is the case so many times in Yes history, the suits made the final decision, and in hindsight, it was not for the best. The album was released as a two-disc set, with the live material given primary importance, and the two new songs including as "bonus" tracks. It was given an elaborate package, with a new Roger Dean cover, a booklet with lyrics and extensive liner notes, a poster, and a slipcase over the entire assembly.
It was released by unknown label Essential Records (a division of Castle Communications), given almost no promotion, and became yet another Yes album with great potential, but which few people even knew existed.
Keys to Ascension 2 (1997)
(https://i.imgur.com/JiwTggt.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/RPYOUoi.jpg)
(Click for larger view)
Jon Anderson - Vocals, Guitar, Harp
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums, Vocals
Live Tracks
I've Seen All Good People
Going for the One
Time and a Word
Close to the Edge
Turn of the Century
And You And I
Studio Tracks
Mind Drive
Foot Prints
Bring Me to the Power
Children of Light
Sign Language
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A few months later, the band had completed five more songs, including another epic. Yes management eventually made a deal with yet another small, unknown label, Purple Pyramid (a division of Cleopatra Records) to release the remaining live tracks from the San Luis Obispo recordings, and again include the new songs as "bonus tracks".
The band now had enough material for a new album, and would have had a full CD if they had not released the other two songs. At one point, Jon had even come up with a title for the new album, Know. But the decision was made to release the remaining live tracks and new studio tracks together as Keys to Ascension 2. Rick was furious and quit Yes, again.
The new album matched the first Keys to Ascension, with the two CDs in a single case, another poster, Roger Dean artwork, and a slipcase over the entire package. It was released, given no promotion, and within a year was found in cutout bins in discount stores.
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I have to agree with Rick. This should have been the huge, triumphant return of classic 70's Yes. Seven new songs, including two epics! They could have shopped this album to Atlantic, their home for so many years, and would have been taken back under their wing. Instead, almost no one even knew that the band was back together, and because of that, it had already broken up again by time the music came out. The only people who knew about it were people such as myself who regularly haunt the record stores and look in the Yes section for CDs to replace their old vinyl. That's how I found both of the Keys to Ascension releases.
A lot of Yesfans like the new live tracks. Many of these had never been released on an official live album before. But the band is older now, and I'm not sure if it's a given or what, but they play much slower now. To me, "Close to the Edge" is nearly unbearable. Maybe it's supposed to be heavy and driving, but to me it just sounds slow and plodding. "Turn of the Century", one of my favorite Yessongs of all time, is finally played live, but Jon can't hit the high notes anymore, so just as the big musical climax is coming up, they transition to a lower key. It feels like they downshifted, or ran into a huge puddle of mud, with the finish line in sight. A hole opens up and all the energy drains out. Most of the new live material is like that. Great songs, but they should have rehearsed more, or overdubbed less. And it's just too obvious that the vocals were overdubbed in places. There are spots where the sound quality is noticeably different.
I do like the studio tracks. They definitely stand on their own and should have been released as an album. "Mind Drive" is my favorite, but "That, That Is" (the other epic) isn't bad. "Lifeline" (Steve's steel guitar solo which is the closing section to "Children of Light") is amazing. And "Sign Language" is a nice, mellow, instrumental to close out the album.
I read a quote from Chris Squire in an interview years ago, and he mentioned that they had set out to record "a certain amount of new music". I don't know exactly what that meant, but I noticed that the total running time of the seven studio tracks is 74 minutes, the length of a CD in those days. CDs were later expanded to 80 minutes, but they were originally 74 minutes. I know this because in 1997, once I had both of these albums, I looked for a cassette (remember those?) to put the studio tracks on because I didn't have a CD player in my car, and when I went to the store, I was surprised to find that they made 74-minute cassettes. 90 minutes was the standard for years, but since CDs were 74 minutes, so were tapes. For a while, anyway.
In 2001, they finally put the seven studio tracks on a single disc, and even restored Rick's original instrumental intro to "Children of Light", which was excised (in retribution perhaps) when he left the band before the final mastering was done. The disc was given the name Keystudio, an ugly cover, and no promotion. Some of the tracks were reworked, and it's handy to have them all on a single disc. But it's almost sad to see it now, knowing what it should have been.
(https://i.imgur.com/1jfkG1T.jpg)
A box set was also created, with the four original CDs, and a concert DVD. I've tried to find this, but it's probably out of print and only on Ebay or used on Amazon.
(https://i.imgur.com/XoSulht.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/TbgLSNU.jpg)
(Click for larger view)
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In total agreement on the new songs. They should have been a new Yes studio album, rather than a virtual afterthought on two live albums by an under-rehearsed Yes. I have always wondered why Yes, arguably from 1983 or so on, was always put in a position where they were allowing their choices to be utterly dictated by the record labels. I am one of those who flat out missed the release of both of these albums in the 90s, and was a little shocked when I came across reviews of them around 2000 or so. The fate of the studio material on these albums is probably the second biggest missed opportunity in Yes' history, just behind Talk being such a good album and getting zero promotion. Most of the 90s output of Yes always ended with "imagine what could have been" when I think about it today.
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I own that grey box set! :D Bought it off of Amazon last year. The studio tracks are alright, as I said before, and I do appreciate them trying to tap into their older style, but they still never did much for me.
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You can definitely tell that the first two songs were written in a hurry, as both are ripe with clunky vocal melodies. It's like the great melodies are almost there, but they come off sounding a tad weird, and likely would have been better with a bit more working, but they were obviously in a hurry to release them so the public new that "Classic Yes" was back.
Of the live tracks, Onward is just spectacular; a massive upgrade over the Tormato studio version.
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I've been lurking this thread since the beginning, mostly because I've said so much about the 70s Yes albums in the past here and on other sites that I don't feel like repeating myself. Then the 80s and 90s albums have just been read by me out of interest. Now, I finally have something to say, in regards to Keys to Ascension albums. I actually don't have those albums, but I do have Keystudio. I got it years after being into Yes (got into them in 2005, and got Keystudio maybe a couple years ago). I remember liking it, but didn't give it enough listens. I'll have to return to it because I really liked Fly From Here that came out last year, and don't know much about their other 90s and 2000s albums.
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I got into both of these for the live tracks and didn't think I'd like the studio tracks but I was pleasantly surprised. I wouldn't mind hearing some of these live.
I didn't know about the overdub problem or that Rick's intro got cut.
Looks like I need to find a copy of KeysStudio afterall. I thought it was just a straight studio reissue so I never bought it as I had those tracks already. Actually, the box set is probably a better option for me.
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Wow, someone who has the box set, and someone who has Keystudio! I figured we're getting into the really obscure stuff here, and didn't expect. But it's cool.
The new studio tracks do have a feeling of being a bit underbaked, and also of "Yes trying to sound like Yes". It's almost like, after Trevor and Tony left and Steve and Rick came back in, that they wanted to prove something. And something that 70's Yes was known for was the long songs. Instrumental excursions and different sections, fast and slow parts, mellow and rocking parts, all in the same song. I have to admit that as a proghead, these things will tend to grab my attention. But it still comes down to good songwriting. Without that, I don't care how long the song is or how many key changes there are or whatever.
I don't think the new songs have the same strength as, say "Close to the Edge". That song was real lightning in a bottle; it will never be equalled. And even if they could write another song like it, it would still be dismissed as just them copying themselves. So any new epics would have to be totally different, yet somehow just as good. Or at least pretty good. With shorter songs, there isn't that kind of pressure, but you only have so much to work with. You want it to be somehow more than just a regular song, but not feel like you've bloated it up just to make it seem more impressive. In some ways, writing a short prog song is harder than writing a long one.
"Be The One" is easily my least favorite. Man, when I found Keys to Ascension in the store, I was so pumped. Actual new music by the 70's lineup! But I did what I always do, and played the album sequentially, which meant the live tracks first. I was impressed with how good they sounded, but this was before I knew how much overdubbing had been done. Then came "Be The One". Whoa. The way it starts, it almost feels like it stumbles into the opening chord. I know what they were going for here, but it felt weak. Its slow beat just felt lame to me, but somehow I wasn't surprised either, after hearing how much they'd slowed down the live material. There's a spot later in the song where the tempo picks up for a while, then it returns to Tempo I and pretty much finishes out. So... 20 years later, here's what these guys sound like. Disappointing, but not exactly surprising.
"That, That Is" is better, with some slightly more interesting lyrics and musical ideas. It's just a consequence of being a longer song with different sections that there's a greater chance that something in it will grab you. Then it ended, and I thinking back, I was disappointed overall, yet at the same time, I was still glad to have new music, anything by a band I had once loved.
Keys to Ascension 2 was another surprise, and happened the same way. I had no idea that it was out, but was digging through the racks at Best Buy, looking for Yes CDs to replace my aging vinyl, and there it was. This time it was one disc of live and one disc of studio. I figured that with five songs on a disc, that's a pretty good average song length, though it occurred to me that it wasn't necessarily a full CD's worth of songs. And it wasn't. And the live songs were obviously the ones leftover from the first Keys album; almost all of them had been released before on at least one live album. But hey, new Yes to take home.
With the live stuff, I have to say that again I was a bit disappointed overall. "Going for the One" felt sloppy, "Close to the Edge" was painfully slow, and I was fine with "Turn of the Century" until the aforementioned horrible key modulation that just took the wind out of the sails. "And You And I" wasn't bad, but with superior live renditions of most of these songs, I knew even then that I wouldn't be listening to these very much.
Ahhh, but "Mind Drive" blew me away. I know some Yesfans don't like it. They say that it repeats itself too much (it does) and that the basic riff is too derivative of "Watcher of the Skies" by Genesis (it's not). Well, it's not a perfect song. But it has everything in it that I like in a Yessong. Steve's acoustic guitar and his wailing countermelodies, in different places. Rick's synths and acoustic piano, in different places. Chris' bass and Alan's drums punching and slamming like there's no tomorrow, but also stepping back when it's time to get mellow. I like the arrangement, and I like the contrast between sections. The only thing I'm not 100% sold on is the last minute or so, Rick's little WTF moment, but whatever, I can live with that.
"Foot Prints" is pretty good, but it definitely repeats some sections one or two times times too many. It's clever towards the end when they put all the parts together, but by then you've heard them all so many times that it's really getting tedious by that point. There are a few places where they could've play a riff twice instead of four times, or four instead of eight, and it would've strengthened the song overall. I think that maybe they were actually going for length here, knowing that the studio disc would be a bit on the short side, and that's unfortunate. You never want to feel like a song was literally padded out. Some say that about prog anyway, but I almost never agree with it. Sections are repeated and new elements are introduced for a purpose. It's rare that a Yessong overstays its welcome with me, but here's one that does.
"Bring Me to the Power" is similar. Maybe a little too much repeating, but overall not as offensive, and a pretty good song overall.
I've heard the restored version of "Children of Light", now known as "Children of the Light". Honestly, the intro by Rick doesn't add much, so losing it wasn't huge, but in general I prefer songs be left the way they were intended. It's almost never a good idea to cut a part of a song out once it has been completed, and here is no exception. That steel guitar solo in the closing section is just glorious. The best minute and a half of Yes in a long time.
"Sign Language" is a nice, mellow closer. Maybe a bit repetitive, but I like the concept, and it's pretty short so it doesn't really drag on too long.
Once again, Yes' management and lack of vision by the suits conspire to destroy something that could have and should have been huge. In the late 90's, fans of 70's Yes were all middle-aged and had good jobs and plenty of disposable income. A new studio album by the classic lineup, properly marketed, would have sold millions. Many were still mourning the breakup after Tormato, even if some of us had eventually come around on Drama. And even among those who finally accepted 90125 and its brethren as Yes, every single one of us would have bought a copy of Know, a new studio album by the Going for the One band.
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The funny thing about people comparing the riff in Mind Drive to Watcher of the Skies is that Phil Collins has said that Watcher was written explicitly so Genesis would have a song that would display the sort of instrumental complexity that a band he'd gotten into at the time Foxtrot was being written.
Namely, Yes. :lol
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Wow, I'd never heard that. I wonder if someone had read that quote about "Watcher of the Skies" and had that in mind when they heard the "Mind Drive" riff and put it together backwards. I never made the connection, myself, and when I heard that complaint, I shrugged it off. They're not that similar. They're two syncopated bass riffs in odd meters with the drums doubling. To say that "Mind Drive" is a rip of "Watcher of the Skies" is to say that anytime anyone plays a syncopated riff like that, then they're ripping off "Watcher of the Skies".
The riff itself goes back to the XYZ days. After Yes had broken up, seemingly for good, Chris and Alan got together with Jimmy Page and John Paul Jones for a while. The band was dubbed XYZ ("Ex Yes and Zeppelin") and to be honest, I regarded the stories as apocryphal at best, most likely myth. But some tapes showed up on the net years ago which were supposedly XYZ. There are four songs, "Mind Drive", "Fortune Hunter", "Can You See?" and "Telephone Secrets", and one just named "XYZ Demo". They're pretty poor quality, but they could be what they claim to be. They could also be any four guys in a basement or garage with a tape machine. The quality isn't really good enough for me to listen to it and say that it's definitely Chris on bass, or Jimmy on guitar. There are some people who perhaps could.
But the tape labelled "Mind Drive" most definitely is a jam based on that same riff, and is reported to be the genesis (ha!) of that song.
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I've also heard that some of the XYZ riffs turned up on the first album by the Firm, but as I haven't heard that album in a LONG time I couldn't tell you which ones. The XYZ project was actually fairly well known in the music magazines of the time, and I remember reading in some magazine about how, since that project had fallen apart, Squire and White were going to work with Trevor Rabin in a band to be called Cinema. I kind of miss those days; the internet puts so much information at your hands now, it was just cool to be connected to the music by magazine articles and comments that DJs said on air sometimes. Certainly was a different era.
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I never got into music magazines. I'm not sure why, since I'm such a music freak, but I think I was just turned off by how the target audience is popular music. You always know the cover artist or band, and chances are really good that the headline is something you've already heard about. They broke up, or they're back together, or they have a new guitarist, or whatever. I guess back in those days, they were the source of news, so if you'd heard about it, it was from those same magazines.
But everything seemed so sensationalized, so dumbed-down to the least common denominator, that I could never bring myself to buy one. Some of my friends told me about XYZ, and really, it just sounded like one of those stories which was a good story, nothing more. If it was actually documented, then yeah, that would add a lot more credibility. I think in those days, I also tended to buy music that I liked, and didn't give a damn how popular (or unpopular) it was. So most of the time, I knew the band on the cover, but it wasn't anyone I listened to anyway.
I did subscribe to Keyboard (then Contemporary Keyboard) for years and learned a lot about keyboards, playing, and technique. I was much more interested in that than the latest gossip or fan-targeted news. Also, let's face it, 99% of rock and roll is about guitars and drums. There was only one place I was going to learn anything about building synth patches and wheel technique.
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Oh, you had to work to find the good stuff, and by around 1985 or so there weren't very many good music magazines in terms of quality-by then I was getting Kerrang, which oddly was occasionally popping up at local 7-11s-but back in the early 80s, Hit Parader and Circus actually did tolerable music journalism. Of course, as I said by 1985 or so everything was turning to dreck, and don't get me started about music journalism today. I'm sure there's some good stuff online, but finding it takes a LOT of patience.
And also back then, there was sort of an underground mentality to music news. Things were just known back then, passed from person to person. A guy in a band's fan club knew things, and he passed them on to someone like me, who dug out items from news stories he'd read in Circus, and then passed it on to someone else. Strangely the information managed to stay intact!
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The problem I had with this is that the live tracks on Keys 1 are mixed totally differently to the live tracks on Keys 2 - Play the one after the other and they feel like two separate shows at two separate venues.
Keys would have made a great 2CD live album had it been mixed and sequenced properly, plus a great comeback album - the studio songs are just sublime. Keys 2 was released (here in the UK at least) the week before Open Your Eyes. Talk about falling from a great height to an all-time low...
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Yes - Know.
I just got it!
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Yeah, Keys 2 and Open Your Eyes came out back to back over here too, which I thought was just horrible.
In general, it's a pretty stupid move to release two albums of new material that close together anyway. The only exception might be something like Load and Re-Load or Use Your Illusion I and Use Your Illusion II, where the idea is that the two go together anyway, like a double album but released separately.
Here, it was an album of new material by the classic band (disguised as the bonus disc of a live album no one needed) stomped on by an album of new material by yet another new Yes lineup. Open Your Eyes (which I'll be covering next) got all the marketing, while the album most fans of both old and new Yes consider to be superior, Keys 2, was ignored by their own management and label. And the tally of management blunders behind the Yesmusic went up two more notches.
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Yes - Know.
I just got it!
Heh heh. Jon Anderson, what a funny guy!
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I don't get it. ??? I feel dumb. ;D
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Know sounds like No.
Yes / No
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Brilliant. :lol
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Well, I'm falling behind in this discussion because I haven't heard many of these newer records. But I picked up Talk for $2.99 in a bargain bin today, and I hope you guys won't mind me posting about it later.
I have The Ladder and Magnification, and I've at least heard Fly From Here. So I will be posting more soon.
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Feel free to post about albums that have already been covered, even after we've moved on. I'm always curious to hear what other people think of each album, especially if they can point out things I may not have heard or thought about before which will ultimately increase my appreciation for them.
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I've been spinning the first two albums a lot this past week. They're both great albums IMHO, and especially the song Then have been getting a lot of spins.
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As I have posted here (and elsewhere), I have a fond affinity towards the Keys albums. I spent a great deal of time and effort in taking the live tracks and re-tracking them to create a seamless, flowing 2-CDr live album, with all the tracks placed in proper order. They're great live tracks, despite all the over-dubs, but at least they're tastefully done and mixed well. I couldn't tell you where what was done on there, so they did it well, IMO.
The live track choices are also very special, with tracks like "The Revealing Science Of God" and "America" (among others) getting their first (and only) official live release. It's a fun listen to, and I'm glad I re-ordered the track list because I don't think I could listen to the album any other way than in the order the songs were performed.
The studio tracks are a great treat, and in my track-order of them, "Mind Drive" opens the album, and it's a masterpiece, IMO, and stands up there with "Close To The Edge" and "Awaken". Sure it's not the same, but why should it be? It was the 90's and even though the band was the same one that released "Awaken", they shouldn't have to retread their old sounds to please fans! I'm happy they released these songs, though I really do wish they were able to wait to release "Be The One" and "That, That Is" until they had the other 5 songs written. Having Know come out in 1997 would've been a great move for them, and then doing a world-tour might have revamped their career! Unfortunately, 1997 was a year that classic prog bands weren't really successful in, especially Yes with Open Your Eyes and Genesis with ...Calling All Stations... - both were, IMO, good, but far from reaching their true potential. Fortunately enough for Yes, they moved on to get better with 2 more albums, but Genesis threw in the towel.
Keystudio later offered fans a glimpse of "what if?" and even though the packaging and the release was not that great, at least it WAS released, and "Children of Light" got it's Wakemen introduction. I'm just glad I bought Keystudio back in 2005 (or was it 2006?), and for only $8+shipping on Amazon!!!
-Marc.
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I finally did the same thing over the weekend. I reordered the live Keys tracks into the original setlist order. Listening to them again, I think I may have been a bit too hard on them in my writeup. They weren't as godawful slow as I thought I remembered them being, though some of them are definitely slowed down from their original tempos and the earlier live releases. As mentioned, the real treat is hearing the ones which don't appear on any other live releases. I guess the shock of hearing the familiar ones played more slowly, the key changes which rob two of the songs of energy at key moments, and knowing that what I was hearing had a lot of overdubbing, all combined to make me dismiss the live tracks completely. I didn't revisit them prior to my writeup, which is the first time I've done that (honest!) because I didn't feel like digging around for them. I realize now that that was a mistake. The live tracks aren't that bad, much better than I'd remembered.
I also created a playlist with the seven studio tracks, substituting the restored "Children of the Light" (with the "Thunder" intro). But I kept the original order. Somehow it didn't seem right to reorder them. I'm anal that way. But the advantage is that I can just skip the first one, or two, if I feel like it, and let things play from there.
I've been spinning the first two albums a lot this past week. They're both great albums IMHO, and especially the song Then have been getting a lot of spins.
The first two albums are overlooked far too often, overshadowed by what came after. But considering that Yes have now released more albums full of "regular songs" than they have full of epics and mostly extended songs, they actually fit in quite well with the rest of the catalogue. Even as shorter songs go, none of them are really short. They each have at least a little adventure to them, some of them quite a lot, especially considering that they came out in 1969 and 1970.
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Well, considering how Talk is like the forgotten middle child of the Yes discography, I'm amazed at how decent it is. It's probably the second best (if not the best) of the Trevor Rabin Yes albums, which easily puts it in the top 3 Yes albums recorded in the last 35 years or so. In terms of post-Going for the One Yes, I'd probably put it alongside Drama, beneath Magnification and 90125, and right above The Ladder. So, heck, it might even make a Yes Top 10 for me.
For me, the Rabin-era Yes albums are similar to Drama in that, while they're good, they just don't feel like "true Yes" to me. I guess there's an excuse to feel that way about Drama , but considering there are 3 or 4 Rabin-era Yes albums, I really should be able to accept them better. But I guess for me, Yes is Jon Anderson, Steve Howe, and Chris Squire. And if one of those elements are missing, it just doesn't sound right. Still, considering Yes' later output, it'd have been great to have had more Rabin albums and Rabin tours, and less of what we wound up getting.
It's a real shame how, converse to many of their peers, Yes basically spent the latter half of the 90's watering down their own legacy.
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Your last statement confuses me. When you say "the latter half of the 90's" are you including the Keys to Ascension albums? I would consider them a pretty strong attempt to recapture the old glory. How well they succeeded depends on who you ask, but I wouldn't consider them watered down.
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Your last statement confuses me. When you say "the latter half of the 90's" are you including the Keys to Ascension albums? I would consider them a pretty strong attempt to recapture the old glory. How well they succeeded depends on who you ask, but I wouldn't consider them watered down.
I haven't really heard much of them, but you've got almost one studio album worth of material between them both amid one of many latter-era Yes live albums. If Yes (or their management) weren't entirely focused on getting as many new albums out as possible, I could imagine Keys, The Ladder, and Open Your Eyes being condensed into one "pretty good" Yes record. And then Yes could have put their time and money into releasing things that would have been more interesting to long-time fans-- like an actual decent DVD or collection of performances from the 70s, or an awesome box-set of remasters, or a full-length documentary recounting Yes' long history. Instead, Yes felt like they needed to release (I think) eight albums between Union and Magnification, most of them "just OK" and obvious failures at recapturing the glory days of Yes.
How does that compare with what, say, Queen were doing at the same time? Or Led Zeppelin? Or Pink Floyd? Or the Rolling Stones? The only real "goodies" for fans of Classic Yes that Yes have given us over the years are way too many (and way too frequent) DVDs from the 00's onward.
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There is a full CD, 75 minutes worth of new studio material between the two Keys to Ascension albums. In the old days, that would have been two LPs. Albums in the 70's rarely topped 40 or 45 minutes, and Yes albums generally came in under 40.
Also, Yes is a very different type of band from all those others you've named. The most obviously difference is that Led Zeppelin and Queen had the same four members for their entire run. Pink Floyd and The Rolling Stones had stable memberships through their glory years. Yes is a collective. Their lineup literally changes every couple of albums, often from one album to the next. In spite of this, I think it's remarkable how consistent their catalogue actually is. Bands with the same lineup for years and years will tend to put out a more consistent product. But even at that, Queen had ten albums and as much as I love Queen, I still tend to reach for the same three or four albums when it's time to listen to Queen. Same with Led Zeppelin; ten albums, but I tend to grab the same three or four all the time. Pink Floyd had a run of four albums that the vast majority of their fans agree constitute the main sequence, and opinions vary widely on everything before and after. Same with the Stones.
Open Your Eyes gets a lot of shit because it wasn't the classic lineup, which had recently broken up again. Oh well. It has some good songs, great vocals, and is well-produced. Keys should have been the new studio album, but it wasn't the bands' fault that their idiot management chose to put out two live albums instead and bury the new material. Then it's like they (the idiot management) suddenly woke up and realized that there hadn't been a new studio album for almost four years. Well, that was their own fault.
Open Your Eyes isn't perfect, but it's not a bad album, and certainly not as bad as people say. As with all Yes albums, multiple listenings tend to reward the persistent. And The Ladder, while also probably not up to 70's standards, is even more highly regarded. It definitely brings the prog and really is regarded as a return to form.
I think the Keys albums come the closest to recapturing the "glory days", but I don't honestly think that that has been the band's intention anyway. The Yes mantra (and your own screen name) has always been about moving forward and trying new things. If you visit the Yesfans boards, you'll find that every album in the Yes catalogue has people who regard it as their favorite. That includes Open Your Eyes, Magnification, and The Ladder as well as the 70's and 80's stuff.
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There is a full CD, 75 minutes worth of new studio material between the two Keys to Ascension albums. In the old days, that would have been two LPs. Albums in the 70's rarely topped 40 or 45 minutes, and Yes albums generally came in under 40.
Yeah, but how much of it actually needed to see the light of day? What I'm saying is, Yes released a lot of really average albums, and for a band their age, they did so at a really frantic pace. They could have just taken their time, and made one or two good albums.
Also, Yes is a very different type of band from all those others you've named. The most obviously difference is that Led Zeppelin and Queen had the same four members for their entire run. Pink Floyd and The Rolling Stones had stable memberships through their glory years. Yes is a collective. Their lineup literally changes every couple of albums, often from one album to the next.
I agree, and that's sort of what I'm getting at. Yes' inability to pull things together caused them to lose focus when their peers were busy solidifying their legacies in the Classic Rock echelon. For awhile it looked like Jon, Steve, Chris, Rick, and Alan could have done it, but ultimately they never could keep it together.
The Yes mantra (and your own screen name) has always been about moving forward and trying new things.
That's cool, but it feels like it became "dabble in new things without putting any real energy or effort into it" instead. Like when they wasted all the money on an orchestra to tour on for Magnification, only to under-rehearse and give some pretty disastrous performances. Or the Homeworld videogame. Or the acoustic DVD, which could have been cool, if it were more than just half an hour of material and an equal amount of filler. I'm just left scratching my head sometimes as to how Yes have had so many good ideas that were executed in a disappointing way.
One reasons why I love Magnification is because it's a rare example of recent Yes going out of their way to craft something different. All too often, like with the subsequent tour, they just half-ass it, and it's a wonder anyone enjoys the outcome at all. The most recent album is a good example of that. But I guess I'm moving to quick here.
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Those are all good points. The instability in their lineup has resulted in a lot of varied music, of which I don't have as much of a problem as some people seem to, but it also means that when they finally get together, there seems to be an urgency, a push to get the material done and out there, resulting in some half-baked albums. I agree that most of their later albums could have benefitted from a little more work, and more rehearsal.
Maybe I just take exception to the assertion that it is the band's fault. I think of the band as literally the guys playing and singing the music, not the management. I don't blame the band for lack of quality output since 1990 or so; I blame the suits. They pushed the band to release the albums before they were done because they were so concerned with profits, they made the boneheaded decisions regarding Keys and Keys 2, and these decisions have caused band members to leave, adding to the instability of the band, adding to the cycle of poor output.
Yes is full of huge yet fragile egos. The music they made in the 70's was made when anything was possible. You take those same guys today and lock them in a room and tell them that they must produce an album in eight weeks, and it's just not gonna happen. Or if it does, it's not gonna be great. Yes was at their best during the Atlantic years, but have never had a decent relationship with a label since then. It's all about profits and formula now, and that's just not how Yes works; it never has been.
But if you're comparing them to Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, The Rolling Stones, and Queen, remember that none of those bands are even around anymore, and (IMO) none of them made any music past the 70's that was worth a shit. Maybe Queen, who had some catchy songs into the early 80's. But they died with Freddy, Zeppelin died with Bonham, Floyd isn't Floyd without both Waters and Gilmour no matter what people say, and does anybody actually buy Rolling Stones albums anymore? I'd still take the collective output of Yes over any of those others.
If Yes had finished after Drama, or even after Going for the One, they would be remembered today for their massive contributions to prog, and only for that. I agree that that reputation has been watered down since then, but I'd still rather they keep making music than not. Name one band whose output today is as strong as it was in the 70's.
Besides Rush, that is.
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Well, take the Stones for example. Or actually, how about Bob Dylan. Both those artists continue to put out new music every 4-5 years. In the meantime, their respective record labels make sure there's never any shortage of "recently unearthed" material from the glory days to put out there. With Dylan, there's the official bootleg series, and the myriad of new live footage, documentaries, books, and soundboard-based live albums from the 60's and 70's that, believe me, wealthy middle-aged Dylan fans spend small fortunes on. And all of these kinda of releases just beef-up Dylan's legacy more and more, so that when he does release an average album like his last two no-one cares: he's still Dylan, and the legend-league material from the 60's and 70's will always overshadow whatever he's done since. The same goes for Queen. They may have genuinely puttered out in the 80s. But the extraordinary amount of great footage and new material that's been released in the last decade has done nothing but enhanced their legacy and solidified their place in Rock history.
With Yes, it's the opposite. We get tons of half-baked DVDs and studio albums from the present day, and next to nothing from the time that really mattered. It winds up making Yes seem like a band that couldn't walk away on top. And it waters down their legacy to the point that I'm genuinely afraid no-one will care or remember soon.
And yeah, you're right. This may be the management's fault, and not the band's. But I think some of it does stem from the fact that the driving force of Yes at their Zenith-- Jon, Steve, Rick, and Chris-- no longer really believe in each other, or look at their past legacy with any particular pride or importance. The "ego" gets in the way: the idea that one, or just some, of them are better off trucking on, and can be better now, fractured, then they were back then, working as a unit.
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To be fair, very, very few bands go out "on top." You'd be lucky to name more than a handful.
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Open Your Eyes (1997)
(https://i.imgur.com/tA7Pixo.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitar, Steel Guitar, Banjo, Mandolin, Vocals
Billy Sherwood - Keyboards, Guitar, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums
Additional Musicians
Igor Khoroshev - Keyboards
Steve Porcaro - Keyboards
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New State of Mind
Open Your Eyes
Universal Garden
No Way We Can Lose
Fortune Seller
Man in the Moon
Wonderlove
From the Balcony
Love Shine
Somehow, Someday
The Solution
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As mentioned in the Keys to Ascension writeup, that project reunited the classic 70's lineup, but the subsequent handling of the resulting material by the two different labels involved so frustrated the band that Rick Wakeman quit, and Steve Howe may have as well. Rick and Steve both returned to England after the news came about the then-new album Keys to Ascension 2. The rest of the band were living in the United States by that time. As there would apparently be no tour to support Keys to Ascension, Jon Anderson took the opportunity to release two more solo albums.
That left Chris Squire and Alan White to carry on, and the future of Yes was once again uncertain. They contacted Billy Sherwood, who had played guitar and keyboards on the Talk tour, and began writing some songs. The album which eventually became Open Your Eyes therefore began as a project by The Chris Squire Experiment. After completing work on his solo albums, Jon Anderson contacted Chris to see what he was up to, and upon finding out that he had been writing songs with Billy, Jon wanted to hear the new songs and eventually expressed an interest in singing on the album. So, not for the first time, an album which did not begin as a Yes album, by a band that was not Yes, became the next Yes album.
Billy Sherwood is a talented musician and songwriter, but a Yes album needs a true virtuoso on guitar, and preferably one on keyboards as well. It is rumored that Trevor Rabin was asked to return to play guitar but declined. Steve Howe agreed to play on the album, but Rick Wakeman refused to participate, so while Billy played most of the keyboards on the album, the more demanding parts were performed by Steve Porcaro of Toto (who had played keyboards on the previous Chris Squire Experiment album) and Igor Khoroshev. Other than on the Union album, this is the only time primary musical parts on a Yes album were played by persons other than current members of Yes.
It took the better part of a year for Keys to Ascension 2 to find a label and be released, and by that time, Open Your Eyes had a label and was nearly completed. It came out within weeks of Keys to Ascension 2 and actually received some promotion by its label, Beyond Records, the fifth label in as many albums to release a Yes album. The title track was released as a single, and reached number 33 on the Billboard charts.
As with most later Yes albums, Open Your Eyes has its fair share of detractors. Most complain that the keyboards are weak due to Rick's absence, or that it should have remained a Chris Squire solo album, or that the music is not very progressive. While each of these criticisms has some merit, none of them are really fair, and none of them are enough to completely discount the album. Open Your Eyes features excellent production, and the trademark Yes three-part harmonies are in full force. The songs, while not as adventurous as 70's Yes, are mostly solid, on par with Rabin-era Yes. Steve's playing is inspired, and he brings his full arsenal of stringed and fretted instruments.
Open Your Eyes is also notable for having the longest track on any Yes album. "The Solution" -- the closing track -- clocks in at nearly 24 minutes. The song itself is only about five and a half minutes long, and the rest is an ambient "hidden track" (though not exactly hidden) which was played over the P.A. prior to the beginning of concerts on the Open Your Eyes tour.
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This is another album I didn't really give a fair shake when it first came out. I'm one of those 70's Yesfans who was angry that Keys and Keys 2 were treated so poorly, while this album with some guy named Billy on keyboards actually got promotion and a single. But I've listened to it four times now in the past three days. It's not as good as Talk, but it's at least as good as Big Generator. The album opens with three very strong songs, maybe it dips a little here and there, but it also finishes strong. Sure, the songs are all 4/4, and there are no screaming Moog solos and no acoustic piece by Steve, but I've come to appreciate the "regular" Yessongs as much as the proggy ones. The first two Yes albums didn't have any 10-minute excursions; they were all regular songs, but they were great songs. Yes is known for their prog, but I think a lot of people unfairly dismiss anything by Yes that isn't ultra-proggy. This album has a great sound and some great, catchy songs.
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Open Your Eyes, along with Big Generator, had the least amount of spins from me when I first got into the band about 7-8 years ago. Back then, I was a fledgling Progger, who was excited by long epics and "screaming Moog solos", but as I grew to appreciate many aspects of prog bands, through their entire careers, I came back to this album with open ears, and gained some newfound appreciation for the songs. Sure, they're not epics or filled with dizzying solos, but they're well written, and there's plenty of trademark Yes-isms like Steve's guitars and the vocal harmonies.
After a steady rise since Union, the band evolved to become more like it's 70's self, and slowly returned to what made their hey-day great, but the sudden change in personnel and the fact that it started off as a NON-Yes project almost turned me off. Unfortunately, while nearly the same situation brought us 90125, the results aren't anywhere near as stellar. You can't really fault anyone, really, because once Jon joined up and it became a Yes album, there was always the chance that he (or the others) could have said "Hey, let's do more with the material". They were happy enough with it to release it, and so, with that in mind, I can appreciate what they did.
Fortunately enough for them, this album, while a bit of a low-point, would begin another rise over the next couple of albums.
-Marc.
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To me Talk was the last really great album that Yes put out. I kind of lost track of them after that. Then around 2005 I got a major Yes phase and bought the two Keys albums, Open Your Eyes, The Ladder and Magnification all in one week. I solely listened to these records for some months, being excited about how much new (at least to me) Yes music was out there. But as it turns out these records didn't make a lasting impact because I haven't listened to them for at least four or five years. Never felt the urge to reach out to them but instead when in a Yes mood put on the classics or the Rabin discs or even ABWH. And therefore I can't really comment on any specific record because in my mind it all got blurred. I don't remember specific songs, only that I liked some while I didn't like others. I think I liked the studio material of Keys 1+2 better than the rest and Open Your Eyes was my least favourite, although I really liked the ambient hidden track. I have to listen to them again to give a more detailed opinion, in fact I might just do that, provided I find the time.
On the point of questionable business decisions: I always wondered (and still do) why Yes so often fell into the trap. If it was not their own doing but the managers/laywers decisions that turned out bad, then I've got to ask, why they didn't try to find a decent manager. I mean they were/are household names as individual musicians and as Yes, they should at least be able to get a management that represents what they want and score an album deal where there are left with some creative freedom. I mean other bands have done it (not to mention the Dream Theater Situation with Falling Into Infinity). Or did they really need money that bad, that they took every opportunity to grab some, knowing that their reputation will suffer?
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After Talk I fell out of touch with Yes, and I honestly didn't realize they were still going until Magnification came out. Which says a lot about how badly bungled things were with Yes in the 90s. A friend of mine from work who was into Yes let me borrow Keys 1&2, Open Your Eyes, and The Ladder, and when I went on my Yes buying spree in 2008 or so, I bought all of those albums off Amazon...except for Open Your Eyes. It remains the sole Yes studio album I don't own, and honestly, it's going to stay that way. I simply didn't like it much, and when I discovered its origins, I wasn't surprised to find out that once again, an album that wasn't meant to be a Yes album became one. I honestly think that Squire and White should've, for once, stuck to their guns and made this album the project that it was meant to be, and THEN got back together with Jon and Steve and whoever on keyboards and got to work on a new Yes album. I remain puzzled, now that I know the history of the band in the 90s, as to why they found themselves the victims of so many bad decisions. They were YES. So many other 70s bands were making money touring in the later part of the 90s without putting out albums, or failing that without them being chart successes, that I don't understand what motivated the band to put out a series of under thought albums at the speed they did. Just doesn't make sense.
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It's always seemed to me that the guys were all gifted musicians, but as far as the business side of things went, they started off not knowing a lot and putting a lot of trust in their management, and never really picked up any savvy. As time went on, they were either too oblivious to what was going on, or just didn't care.
Jon Anderson has always struck me as a total flower child, happy to make beautiful music about life and light and God and space, and not giving a damn about the business side. That's for others to worry about. Rick was at the other end of the spectrum, with the smarts to know when they were getting screwed and the balls to just up and leave when he wasn't happy with the direction of things, be it the music, the politics, or the business. He came to the band with years of experience in bands and as a session musician, so he already knew a lot about that side of things. The others were all somewhere in between but, to put it bluntly, they were all stoners and probably just followed Jon's lead and let the suits deal with things. The result was a lot of amazing music, and some with amazing potential, and a lot of screwed-up opportunities as far as getting it out to the public.
I don't think it was about money grabbing. I really think that they're still completely stupid regarding the business side. They never picked it up, and they may have tried to educate themselves at some point, but things keep changing, the business keeps changing, and I think most of them just gave up at some point. They're in their 60s now, pushing 70, and I just don't think they care anymore. They get to play music for a living, they still sell enough albums and make enough money to live comfortably, so what the heck, pass that over here.
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I actually liked Open Your Eyes quite a bit when it first came out; I got it and KTA2 at the same time and greatly preferred OYE. It didn't age that well for me, but I still think it is a bit better than many consider it. It has some clunky melodies again, but there are plenty of catchy melodies, and Howe gives us enough cool guitar licks (like in Wonderlove and From the Balcony) to give it that classic Yes feel more often than not, even if it ultimately does sound fairly modern for its time.
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Haven't commented much in this thread, but gotta show some love for Open Your Eyes. I couldn't fathom how Yes was going to get back to the business of making albums after the departure of Rabin. Between Keys and this, my faith was restored. Sherwood did a brilliant job of keeping them sounding big. Plus, this was kind of a launch point for The Ladder, which is one of my all time favorites.
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It's always seemed to me that the guys were all gifted musicians, but as far as the business side of things went, they started off not knowing a lot and putting a lot of trust in their management, and never really picked up any savvy. As time went on, they were either too oblivious to what was going on, or just didn't care.
Jon Anderson has always struck me as a total flower child, happy to make beautiful music about life and light and God and space, and not giving a damn about the business side. That's for others to worry about. Rick was at the other end of the spectrum, with the smarts to know when they were getting screwed and the balls to just up and leave when he wasn't happy with the direction of things, be it the music, the politics, or the business. He came to the band with years of experience in bands and as a session musician, so he already knew a lot about that side of things. The others were all somewhere in between but, to put it bluntly, they were all stoners and probably just followed Jon's lead and let the suits deal with things. The result was a lot of amazing music, and some with amazing potential, and a lot of screwed-up opportunities as far as getting it out to the public.
I don't think it was about money grabbing. I really think that they're still completely stupid regarding the business side. They never picked it up, and they may have tried to educate themselves at some point, but things keep changing, the business keeps changing, and I think most of them just gave up at some point. They're in their 60s now, pushing 70, and I just don't think they care anymore. They get to play music for a living, they still sell enough albums and make enough money to live comfortably, so what the heck, pass that over here.
I completely agree with this. They had no clue about the business side and some of the decisions made during this period were very unfortunate.
As far as Open Your Eyes goes, the only reason it's my least favorite Yes album by a huge margin has nothing to due with the lineup other than the fact that Billy Sherwood was involved in it. I've never liked any music this guy touches. It just does nothing for me. I think I listened to it once before dumping it. It's the only Yes album I do not have. (I don't have the In A Word box either.) I probably value The Ladder more than I should because of this album.
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I've never heard the Conspiracy album (Squire and Sherwood), and I don't know if I've heard anything else that Sherwood has played on. He produced the two Keys to Ascension albums, and I thought he did a pretty good job given the time constraints. He played on one of the tracks on Union, I guess, but one of the more forgettable ones. I know I keep seeing his name associated with latter-day Yes, but it's kinda hard to tell exactly what he does.
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Having heard The Ladder and seen the concert DVD that album's line up did, I still can't tell you what Billy Sherwood did in Yes, other than take Rabin's solo in Owner of a Lonely Heart. :lol
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Having heard The Ladder and seen the concert DVD that album's line up did, I still can't tell you what Billy Sherwood did in Yes, other than take Rabin's solo in Owner of a Lonely Heart. :lol
I haven't heard Sherwood's take on the solo, but from the Youtubeclips I saw anyone other than Steve Howe taking the solo can only improve it. ;D
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Steve has been accused of butchering the solo on purpose because he hates the song and resented having to play it every night, when he was back in the band, because it was Yes' Big Number One Hit. Steve just says that his take on the solo is different from Trevor's, just as Trevor's take on his solos are different. Touché. I've never heard a Trevor solo in a classic Yessong that I've liked, either.
Steve was not a fan of the Rabin lineup. He says it's not about the music itself, but that it shouldn't be called Yes because it doesn't sound very "Yessish". I understand what he's saying, but I also understand Trevor's response, which was that Steve was full of shit (paraphrased). Go ahead and say you don't like it, or say that it doesn't sound like the Yes you were in, but saying it doesn't sound "Yessish" because you're not in it means that it can't sound like Yes if you're not the guitarist. Which is basically what most people said about YesWest in the first place.
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Just listened to a few songs from this again.
Man, "The Solution" is really great. As has been a main line of thinking for this thread, the whole album could have been much better if it hadn't been rushed. It's funny; even though Steve Howe's performances were phoned in, some of his most enjoyable guitar playing since the 70's is here. Maybe not being very involved in the writing inspired him to focus solely on his guitars and, as anyone who's heard The Steve Howe Album would know, he's got a pretty awesome array of expertise in that department.
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Steve has been accused of butchering the solo on purpose because he hates the song and resented having to play it every night, when he was back in the band, because it was Yes' Big Number One Hit. Steve just says that his take on the solo is different from Trevor's, just as Trevor's take on his solos are different. Touché. I've never heard a Trevor solo in a classic Yessong that I've liked, either.
Steve was not a fan of the Rabin lineup. He says it's not about the music itself, but that it shouldn't be called Yes because it doesn't sound very "Yessish". I understand what he's saying, but I also understand Trevor's response, which was that Steve was full of shit (paraphrased). Go ahead and say you don't like it, or say that it doesn't sound like the Yes you were in, but saying it doesn't sound "Yessish" because you're not in it means that it can't sound like Yes if you're not the guitarist. Which is basically what most people said about YesWest in the first place.
Steve Howe is an asshole, and just about everything I have ever read about him supports that statement. I mean, in regards to sounding "Yessish," the fact that the band has NEVER had the same members for more than two straight albums in a row :lol means that Yes at the time is a reflection of which members happen to be in the band at the time. Sure, there is a core sound that many would identify as THE Yes sound, but that doesn't mean that every album has to sound like that to be "Yessish."
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Yeah, and FWIW, lots of Drama doesn't sound "Yessish" to me!
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Yeah, and FWIW, lots of Drama doesn't sound "Yessish" to me!
And for that matter, what about Fly From Here? A lot of fans say it sounds like another Buggles album!
Steve Howe...psh. If anything, many fans might say Fly From Here is less "Yessish" because it doesn't have Jon Anderson on it! But...that's another argument for another time...
-Marc.
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To me, an album sounds Yessish as long as Steve Howe is on it. ;D
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Actually, I mostly agree with Steve. I agree that he can be an asshole, too, but his point is a good one. It's not just the harmonies, although that's part of it. It's not how proggy it is, because, for example Open Your Eyes sounds very Yessish to me, and it's about the least prog Yes album there is. But Drama sounds Yessish as well. Something about how Steve's guitar is doing it's thing, wailing during verses, choruses, whenever. Something about how the vocals bring a positive vibe and just sound so damned happy. Even Fly From Here, which does sound like a Buggles album, sounds Yessish to me, and that's probably Steve. But those first two albums also sound Yessish, and they're pre-Steve, and Talk does, too.
It's interesting because one of my first impressions of Talk is that Trevor's guitar work is reminiscent of Steve's. Like they did actually influence each other a bit during the Union tour. And then upon listening to Open Your Eyes, the guitar work is often more straightforward, or playing lines a little more Trevorish.
Yessishness is something that's hard to describe and can't be quantified; I just know it when I hear it.
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It's always seemed to me that the guys were all gifted musicians, but as far as the business side of things went, they started off not knowing a lot and putting a lot of trust in their management, and never really picked up any savvy. As time went on, they were either too oblivious to what was going on, or just didn't care.
Jon Anderson has always struck me as a total flower child, happy to make beautiful music about life and light and God and space, and not giving a damn about the business side. That's for others to worry about. Rick was at the other end of the spectrum, with the smarts to know when they were getting screwed and the balls to just up and leave when he wasn't happy with the direction of things, be it the music, the politics, or the business. He came to the band with years of experience in bands and as a session musician, so he already knew a lot about that side of things. The others were all somewhere in between but, to put it bluntly, they were all stoners and probably just followed Jon's lead and let the suits deal with things. The result was a lot of amazing music, and some with amazing potential, and a lot of screwed-up opportunities as far as getting it out to the public.
I don't think it was about money grabbing. I really think that they're still completely stupid regarding the business side. They never picked it up, and they may have tried to educate themselves at some point, but things keep changing, the business keeps changing, and I think most of them just gave up at some point. They're in their 60s now, pushing 70, and I just don't think they care anymore. They get to play music for a living, they still sell enough albums and make enough money to live comfortably, so what the heck, pass that over here.
I completely agree with this. They had no clue about the business side and some of the decisions made during this period were very unfortunate.
As far as Open Your Eyes goes, the only reason it's my least favorite Yes album by a huge margin has nothing to due with the lineup other than the fact that Billy Sherwood was involved in it. I've never liked any music this guy touches. It just does nothing for me. I think I listened to it once before dumping it. It's the only Yes album I do not have. (I don't have the In A Word box either.) I probably value The Ladder more than I should because of this album.
I stand corrected.
Billy Sherwood IS credited with guitars and vocals on The Ladder. (Just looked at the liner notes as I was putting the CD on) but I'll be damned if I can figure out what it is that he does. I know he is/was a good friend of Chris Squire's and he seems to turn up alot in a lot of Squire projects in the recent past.
Maybe Billy Fairbairn is responsible for keeping Sherwood away from The Ladder as much as possible. I don't know, but the credits are there. I'd forgotten he'd also produced the Keys stuff which I also enjoy.
I really wish Igor hung around a little longer too. Has he done anything of note after he left Yes?
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Bruce Fairbairn actually. But yeah, it's tough to figure out what Billy Sherwood plays on The Ladder. Steve is pretty easy to tell, and there's not a lot of keyboards, so maybe some of it's Billy, but I have to assume that the Hammond solo on "New Language" for example is Igor. The Ladder was the first Yes album that didn't go with a straight five-piece lineup, vocals-guitar-keys-bass-drums. Billy was definitely the sixth man IMO. Maybe he was just kept around because they'd officially made him a member on Open Your Eyes, plus he did contribute to the songwriting, so they let him play on the album.
According to AMG, Igor has done a solo piano album since leaving Yes, and supposedly it's pretty good. Igor Khoroshev - Piano Works (https://www.amazon.com/Piano-Works-igor-khoroshev/dp/B000JHYBJK)
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I'll have to watch that House of Blues DVD with the Ladder line up on it later and when we get to that album, I might have some insight into the mystery of Just What Did Billy Sherwood Do With Yes. :lol
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I rented the House of Blues DVD once, long ago. I remember that they played a lot of newer stuff, including a lot of The Ladder (no surprise), but I remember being disappointed at the lack of older stuff and/or how it was played, though not really surprised. I don't remember anything about who played what. Igor or Billy, didn't matter, they weren't Rick. I'm more open-minded about that kind of thing now. A little, anyway.
Oh yeah, I remember that they played a shortened version of "Roundabout". After people whining for years that they needed a new encore, they shook things up by cutting out the middle section. After holding the Bm chord, Jon shouts "One two three four!" and they jump to the fours, pretty much like the single version of the song. Bummer.
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I remember liking that House of Blues DVD a lot; much better than the Live at Montreal 2003 one, which, despite a great set list, comes off as lifeless and sterile thanks to the band looking bored as hell the whole show.
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Steve has been accused of butchering the solo on purpose because he hates the song and resented having to play it every night, when he was back in the band, because it was Yes' Big Number One Hit.
I thought so, that he's doing it on purpose, but for me that just adds to the argument that he can sometimes be an asshole.
If you don't like it, then don't play it. And if you play it (for whatever reason) play it decent. The solo isn't that hard. Or even try to rearrange the song to make it sound mor yessish, but at least give it a try.
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It's not up to him whether or not they play the song. Yeah, he's being an asshole, but in this case, I actually kinda sympathize with him. He didn't write the song, he had nothing to do with it, he honestly doesn't like it, but he has to play it because it was the Big Number One Hit by a band he wasn't even in. Seriously, that's gotta suck.
There are songs on Drama that fans have been crying for for years, and Jon flat out refuses to sing them because he doesn't consider Drama a "real" Yes album. Simlarly, Rick flat out refuses to play anything from Relayer. So the two prima donnas in the band get to veto entire albums, but Steve has to shut up and just play "Owner"?
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I've got no problem with Steve not liking the song and that he don't wanna play it. It's the "Messing up on purpose" part that bothers me.
Imagine Sammy Hagar thinking back then "I don't like Jump but if I have to play it because it was the Big Numer One Hit by a band I wasn't even in then I'm going to mess it up". And I'm sure there are countless examples of musicians playing songs they don't like but are professional about it.
And if Jon and Rick get their way by refusing certain songs, Steve should be stubborn enough to refuse to play Owner.
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It's not up to him whether or not they play the song. Yeah, he's being an asshole, but in this case, I actually kinda sympathize with him. He didn't write the song, he had nothing to do with it, he honestly doesn't like it, but he has to play it because it was the Big Number One Hit by a band he wasn't even in. Seriously, that's gotta suck.
There are songs on Drama that fans have been crying for for years, and Jon flat out refuses to sing them because he doesn't consider Drama a "real" Yes album. Simlarly, Rick flat out refuses to play anything from Relayer. So the two prima donnas in the band get to veto entire albums, but Steve has to shut up and just play "Owner"?
Actually that makes me respect him slightly more than Jon and Rick. Steve at least shuts up and plays the song because the fans want it. He just butchers it :lol Every song a band puts out is fair game to be played, regardless of the line up on it, and if the fans want to hear it, shut the fuck up and play it.
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There are people who like the solos he takes on "Owner". He's been accused of tanking the solo on purpose, he's always claimed that that's just how he plays them. I think people are expecting him to take a Trevor Rabin-style solo, and that's just not gonna happen. If it sounds like crap to some people, then oh well, it does. There are people who like the 90125 band's versions of "And You And I" and "Starship Trooper" and I think they totally ruin both of them.
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The Ladder (1999)
(https://imgur.com/JLQOP22.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitars, Steel Guitar, Mandolin, Vocals
Igor Khoroshev - Keyboards, Vocals
Billy Sherwood - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums, Percussion, Vocals
Homeworld (The Ladder)
It Will Be a Good Day (The River)
Lightning Strikes
Can I?
Face to Face
If Only You Knew
To Be Alive (Hep Yadda)
Finally
The Messenger
New Language
Nine Voices (Longwalker)
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The Ladder is regarded by many Yesfans as a return to form. Open Your Eyes kept the band going when its future was uncertain, but its music was relatively stripped-down, the songs themselves rather straightforward. Yesfans are generally looking for something more adventurous from Yes, and The Ladder brings back some of the adventure.
There is no one definition for Progressive Rock, but most prog fans agree that longer songs with changes in tempo, time and/or key signature, and instrumental passages, are a large part of it. About half the songs on The Ladder fit that description, so that puts things firmly back on track. We also have the incorporation of various musical styles within the basic rock framework, another prog element, and that too is welcome. The Ladder has a lot more variety to it than its predecessor. Once again, the guys continue to bring new musical influences to the Yes canvas.
The Ladder is not full-on prog, however. There are a handful of "regular" songs, including a few which probably would have fit better on a Jon Anderson solo album than a Yes album, but other than their famous three-album run in the early-mid 70's, Yes has always had the shorter, mellower songs as well as the epics and mini-epics. Overall, The Ladder is a strong album and highly regarded among latter-day Yes.
Igor Khoroshev, who played on three tracks on Open Your Eyes, has been promoted to full-time keyboard player here, and he does an outstanding job. Some songs feature Hammond and synths in key roles, while on others, the keyboards provide atmosphere and fills as necessary. Billy Sherwood, who had played some keyboards on the previous album, is relegated to rhythm guitar for the most part. This is a first for Yes, a six-piece lineup, as Steve Howe rather famously prefers to be the only guitarist on Yes albums. But Billy is a good friend of Chris, and to put it bluntly, without Billy's efforts in both songwriting and just helping Chris carry the torch, Yes would not have existed, so some accommodation was in order.
Another first is a horn section on a Yessong. "Lightning Strikes" features a piccolo, two saxophones, a trumpet, a trombone, and a tuba. Jon's fascination with World Music also makes an appearance. But for all the variety in styles and song structures, it is a well-balanced album. It starts strong and ends strong, and takes the listener through many changes along the way.
We are treated once again to a new Roger Dean cover painting, this time with the new Yes logo introduced a few albums back. It has been said that you can tell how "prog" a Yes album is by looking at the cover. If it has a Roger Dean painting, it's prog. This isn't always true, but it is true more often than not, and the band seems to know this and use Roger's distinctive visual style to help make a connection to their classic 70's sound. It works.
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I know it's a stupid thing to get hung up about, but I've never liked song titles with parentheses in them, and there are four of them here. Why? Couldn't they decide which title to use, so they worked out a way to have both? Four times?
Also, while musically this is a return to form for Yes, I found myself a little bit disappointed with the vocals on this album, especially after Open Your Eyes, where the harmonies were glorious and really helped elevate a number of the songs. Most of the time here, Jon sings solo on the verses and the background harmonies come in on the choruses. Pretty standard stuff, really. It struck me as downright odd, actually, that all six members have vocal credits, yet there are considerably fewer vocals here than on the previous album.
Something else worth mentioning are the numerous references to earlier Yessongs. "Can I?" includes a direct quote from "We Have Heaven" from Fragile. The closing track, "Nine Voices (Longwalker)" sounds like a sequel to "Your Move" from The Yes Album , and I think I hear some "diddit-diddit-diddit" in there. Wiki lists a few more references that I didn't pick up, even upon multiple listens with headphones and after several listens over the years, but apparently there are others. It's clever how they're done, and most are quite subtle. As I said, I haven't even noticed some of them, and I've listened to every Yes album many times, especially the older ones. It just seemed like something that was clever to do once ("Quartet" on the ABWH album) but if you do it too much it loses its impact.
Anyway, the prog is back, and that's what really counts here.
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I know it's a stupid thing to get hung up about, but I've never liked song titles with parentheses in them, and there are four of them here. Why? Couldn't they decide which title to use, so they worked out a way to have both? Four times?
Is that how you feel about the songs titles on TFTO, which all have a second title in parentheses after the main title?
Anyways, The Ladder is a great album, and sounds like the proper sequel to their Keys material and even Talk, some prog, some pop, some Jon Anderson-y stuff...it's a good mix, even as a six-piece Yes, they still prove they can rock out and dole out some great Yessongs.
After the mostly mediocre Open Your Eyes, this was a welcome return to form, well, for what could be a proggy Yes in the 90's. This is chock full of great songs, and while I wasn't entirely open to it at first, the album has grown on me over the years. I was quicker to liking Talk, the Keys To Ascension studio tracks and Magnification more than I was with this album, but since then, in recent years, I've really enjoyed it!
-Marc.
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This is the first Yes album that I actually remember being released. I recall that someone gave it to my dad as a Christmas gift. This CD got a lot of play from me at the time, and I still appreciate it very much. I do skip some songs (Lightning Strikes)--as an aside, I remember this song getting quite a bit of radio play here, which was cool for me, running down to tell everyone that the new Yes is on the radio!
There are a couple of songs that mean very much to me, mostly It Will Be A Good Day. That has a special place in my heart. I like this album quite a bit, a lot of it probably for nostalgia reasons, but I don't think I would still listen to it that much if the songs were less than decent. But the songs are good and this makes an excellent Yes album. I wonder if this would be a good starting place for new fans to get into the band, as it can be a stepping stone to any of the Yes era's IMO.
As far as the parentheses, I don't get em either. Especially since they really don't add much to the understanding of the songs. In fact, it might even confuse people as to what they have to do with the song.
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I know it's a stupid thing to get hung up about, but I've never liked song titles with parentheses in them, and there are four of them here. Why? Couldn't they decide which title to use, so they worked out a way to have both? Four times?
Is that how you feel about the songs titles on TFTO, which all have a second title in parentheses after the main title?
You so silly. Each movement of Tales from Topographic Oceans has a title and subtitle. There are no parentheses.
The original vinyl gatefold. (https://i.imgur.com/bqYaITP.jpg)
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I know it's a stupid thing to get hung up about, but I've never liked song titles with parentheses in them, and there are four of them here. Why? Couldn't they decide which title to use, so they worked out a way to have both? Four times?
Is that how you feel about the songs titles on TFTO, which all have a second title in parentheses after the main title?
You so silly. Each movement of Tales from Topographic Oceans has a title and subtitle. There are no parentheses.
The original vinyl gatefold. (https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/475727_3680870742296_2047354823_o.jpg)
BAH... Wikipedia has lied to me! The article lists the subtitles in parentheses instead of after a hyphen. :facepalm:
Well I suppose that means the songs on The Ladder remain unique to having their subtitles in parentheses. I wonder if there really IS any sort of explanation for them.
-Marc.
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I'm not too familiar with post-Drama Yes, but I discovered a Making of The Ladder video and immediately fell in love with some melodies, so I had to check the album out. It's really good. Very progressive and melodic. Homeworld and New language are two of my favorite Yes songs, and I have a very soft spot for If only you knew. Overall, the guys did a great job here, especially Igor Khoroshev - excellent stuff.
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One of the issues I've had with Yes post-Talk was simply how, for lack of a better word, safe the music was. Even the epics on the Keys albums felt safe, as if they sat down and said "we need a couple of epics" and banged out some 18 minute long songs. Open Your Eyes is safe in a different way, since it's closer to an AOR rock album than a prog album, but that can be discounted by how it didn't start as a Yes album. The Ladder, despite a couple of nine minute long songs, is still Yes playing it safe. It's a return to form of sorts, but I'm not particularly sure the band knew what the form was to be. It finds the band in some halfway home between prog rock and arena rock, but one where the prog isn't really too proggy and the rock isn't really too rocky. I listened to it recently and, other than Homeworld and a couple of other songs, nothing really stuck with me. I'm not sure if I can particularly articulate WHY this happens-it just feels a little flat to me. Part of it might be the production-I don't like to speak ill of Bruce Fairburn's production since this was the last album he worked on before his death, but there are times where this album sounds more like an 80s arena rock album than a prog album, which might be part of my problem with it. And yeah, I don't get ALL the titles with parentheses either.
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I agree. I really don't expect to hear anything like "Close to the Edge" or "Heart of the Sunrise" ever again from Yes. Or things like incorporating a real church pipe organ and choir like on Going for the One. Or an entire album of epics. Stuff like that was experimental and groundbreaking. Now there's a feeling of "been there, done that".
And I think that that might be why we don't get stuff like that anymore. The 70's was a time of incredible musical diversity and expansion, all while still somehow fitting the definition of Rock and Roll. Minds were blown, boundaries were pushed, pushed again, and pushed some more. I think that the guys are simply older and just don't have that youthful drive to keep pushing things the way they once did. Even the epics on Keys to Ascension, yes we have the mood swings, the combining and contrasting of different musical ideas, but all of it feels pretty tame compared to the near-atonal insanity of the early days.
I guess I've accepted that. And if it's huge sprawling epics or real prog with ridiculous instrumental excursions I need, I'm glad we have newer groups like Beardfish, The Flower Kings, and TransAtlantic to provide that. Sad as it is, I'm really not surprised that Yes isn't still doing that after 40+ years. That's a long time to rock, especially as intensely as they do sometimes. You can see that they're physically and mentally exhausted now after playing "Close to the Edge" or "Awaken". And it's completely understandable. I don't want to say that the spark is gone, but it definitely isn't as bright as it once was. They've been doing this for a long time.
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]
BAH... Wikipedia has lied to me! The article lists the subtitles in parentheses instead of after a hyphen. :facepalm:
-Marc.
[/quote]
Wikipedia lied? Say it isn't so....
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The Ladder shocked me when it first came out, as I did not expect a Yes album that good at the time. The middle of the album is pretty average, but the first five and last three songs are all keepers. I still say this is easily the best Yes album of the post-Trevor Rabin years.
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I... I honestly can't believe so many people like it. I couldn't get into a single song on the album. It's about on the same level as ABWH and Union are for me, as far as over-the-top cheesiness goes.
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A song like If Only You Knew definitely lays the cheese on very, very thick, but that to me is the only real throwaway song on the album.
Also, while I do like this album a lot, it is still not quite a top 10 Yes album in my book.
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Just revised this album.
I remembered how when I first listened, I really liked the first two songs. The "Lightning Strikes" came on, and I wasn't sure how to react to it. Now, I appreciate it for its catchiness. But I distinctly remembering feeling like I was listening to background music while standing in line for a high-tech roller coaster at an amusement park.
The album dips in quality, but opens strongly. It's probably beat only by Talk in terms of 90's Yes, and isn't anywhere near as good as Magnification. But ultimately, it (along with Magnification) prove one thing that I've felt more frequently as we do this discography run-through: If you've got Jon, Chris, and Steve in the band, miracles can happen. With one of those three absent, it can never really get as good as classic Yes.
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Without one of those three absent, it can never really get as good as classic Yes.
Wait....what? Did you mean "With one of those three absent", not "Without"? Otherwise, it sounds like a double-negative :lol
And I agree, the better Yes albums have all three, but at least Jon and Chris, which why I don't really rank ABWH or Union very high, and even though Open Your Eyes had all three, the album's material wasn't Yes-centric at the onset, so it suffers from that a bit.
And from here on out, Steve Howe definitely helps the band come along, having been on every album SINCE the Keys material, joining Chris and Alan again, forming a tight trio-core of the band because, really, the keyboard spot was always a rotating door, and so much so that the band even decided to record an album WITHOUT a keyboard player.
-Marc.
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I agree. I really don't expect to hear anything like "Close to the Edge" or "Heart of the Sunrise" ever again from Yes. Or things like incorporating a real church pipe organ and choir like on Going for the One. Or an entire album of epics. Stuff like that was experimental and groundbreaking. Now there's a feeling of "been there, done that".
And I think that that might be why we don't get stuff like that anymore. The 70's was a time of incredible musical diversity and expansion, all while still somehow fitting the definition of Rock and Roll. Minds were blown, boundaries were pushed, pushed again, and pushed some more. I think that the guys are simply older and just don't have that youthful drive to keep pushing things the way they once did. Even the epics on Keys to Ascension, yes we have the mood swings, the combining and contrasting of different musical ideas, but all of it feels pretty tame compared to the near-atonal insanity of the early days.
I guess I've accepted that. And if it's huge sprawling epics or real prog with ridiculous instrumental excursions I need, I'm glad we have newer groups like Beardfish, The Flower Kings, and TransAtlantic to provide that. Sad as it is, I'm really not surprised that Yes isn't still doing that after 40+ years. That's a long time to rock, especially as intensely as they do sometimes. You can see that they're physically and mentally exhausted now after playing "Close to the Edge" or "Awaken". And it's completely understandable. I don't want to say that the spark is gone, but it definitely isn't as bright as it once was. They've been doing this for a long time.
This is very true. And it seems like many bands tend to fall into this, for any number of reasons. Either the fans expect you to sound a certain way and will not accept anything else, or time and an entire career of doing things differently leaves you with less of a drive to be innovative as before. Furthermore, it is easy to "play it safe", to release an album that the fans pretty much know what it sounds like before it actually hits the shelves. All that being said, I do not blame any band who falls into this, especially Yes who's career has been absolutely amazing.
Now, I think it is still possible for Yes and bands to be innovative and fresh. The way I see it, there are two main ways to be innovative as a band:
1) Remove and push boundaries where they have never been before
or 2) create boundaries and confines and force yourself to work within them.
These two ways are not exclusive to one another. Actually, both can be done at the same time. Think of something like this: Create boundaries by saying, "I will only use African percussion on this track", but since the band may not have done that before, you are pushing boundaries as a band. I think that Magnification as a wonderful example of Yes doing something different, and they did it very well. I would like to see them do more of the same thing in the future. Maybe that is as simple as working with a different producer, or recording in a different place. Sometimes, it can be a bigger change. What I don't want is to have Yes be different for the sake of being different, and have it feel unnatural. However, if the next, if any album Yes puts out sounds like the last, I will understand completely, and will not hold it against them. Heck, I would love to be still making music at their age.
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The Magnification project was, as you point out, pretty different in how it was both conceived and executed. The Keys to Ascension studio material would have been their first album of new material to have two epics and an instrumental (other than a Steve Howe acoustic solo), which is also very rare for Yes.
So maybe they're still pushing in some ways, and maybe I'm grasping at straws a bit here. But if there's one thing that Yes has shown us, it's that there can be a huge variety to their music, lineup changes which are almost comical in number and scope, and it all still sounds like Yes. Some say that their product is wildly inconsistent; I say that having a lot of variety in your catalogue is not necessarily a bad thing. I think albums like Open Your Eyes and Tormato, or even 90125 and Big Generator, are underrated. People think of Yes and think of entire albums of epics, forgetting that that was a relatively short period in their very long history.
Someone once asked Rick Wakeman what the deal was with Yes members coming and going, and how it might even lead to Yes continuing after they're all dead. It's hard to tell how serious the question was, but Rick answered it seriously. Yes has transcended what it even means to be a band. There is no one person who "must" be on the album for it to be Yes. He points out that the London Symphony Orchestra has been around for over 100 years. It's still called The London Symphony Orchestra, but obviously it has not been the same members for all that time. People join and leave over the years, and the group itself carries on. Why should the rules be different for rock bands?
That's a pretty crazy statement, pretty out there, but it makes some sense. And then I thought about how orchestras will record albums of symphonies, or light classical works, or popular music, or show tunes. There can be a great variety to the types of albums. And if Yes is something like a symphony, why can't they have all different types of albums? Albums of short pop songs, albums of prog epics, albums with an orchestra instead of a full-time keyboard player? It's all Yes.
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The Magnification project was, as you point out, pretty different in how it was both conceived and executed. The Keys to Ascension studio material would have been their first album of new material to have two epics and an instrumental (other than a Steve Howe acoustic solo), which is also very rare for Yes.
So maybe they're still pushing in some ways, and maybe I'm grasping at straws a bit here. But if there's one thing that Yes has shown us, it's that there can be a huge variety to their music, lineup changes which are almost comical in number and scope, and it all still sounds like Yes. Some say that their product is wildly inconsistent; I say that having a lot of variety in your catalogue is not necessarily a bad thing. I think albums like Open Your Eyes and Tormato, or even 90125 and Big Generator, are underrated. People think of Yes and think of entire albums of epics, forgetting that that was a relatively short period in their very long history.
Someone once asked Rick Wakeman what the deal was with Yes members coming and going, and how it might even lead to Yes continuing after they're all dead. It's hard to tell how serious the question was, but Rick answered it seriously. Yes has transcended what it even means to be a band. There is no one person who "must" be on the album for it to be Yes. He points out that the London Symphony Orchestra has been around for over 100 years. It's still called The London Symphony Orchestra, but obviously it has not been the same members for all that time. People join and leave over the years, and the group itself carries on. Why should the rules be different for rock bands?
That's a pretty crazy statement, pretty out there, but it makes some sense. And then I thought about how orchestras will record albums of symphonies, or light classical works, or popular music, or show tunes. There can be a great variety to the types of albums. And if Yes is something like a symphony, why can't they have all different types of albums? Albums of short pop songs, albums of prog epics, albums with an orchestra instead of a full-time keyboard player? It's all Yes.
GREAT post! :clap:
And I sort of agree, Yes is more like an orchestra than many of their contemporaries - Genesis had their own line-up changes, sure, but they had 2 long runs of albums with the same line-up, creating and evolving a certain sound that was typically Genesis; King Crimson was always Robert Fripp at the helm, with a changing line-up, sure, but nothing like Yes, although their sound did change more dramatically as the line-ups transformed over the years and decades; Other bands had their changes, but for many of them, they had primary writers and/or lyricists, so it seemed more like THEIR band with other performers.
Some might say that about Yes, it being "Jon's band" or "Chris's band", but to be honest, there have been Yes albums without either, and they're still stylistically, in some form, a version of Yes. I tend to agree with Rick's statement - there doesn't always HAVE to be one person on every Yes album for it to be Yes. Heck, Jon made a Yes album without even being able to CALL IT Yes, and it was still (and still is) regarded as Yes. That's saying something.
It's a style, a sound, a feel, a movement, a philosophy or mindset... Yes is just more than the sum of it's parts. I think I could see Yes moving forward after Steve, Chris and Alan call it a day. Rick Wakeman's son could move on with it, maybe invite Steve's sone Virgil Howe, and maybe bring in some other up-and-coming musicians who love the sound of Yes. I think it depends on where the band is going in the next couple of years, especially if the current line-up does another album.
If I had it my way, I wouldn't mind seeing Steve and Geoff take off and commit to Asia from here on out, and then Chris and Alan find new and fresh musicians to play guitars and keyboards, and keep Jon Davidson singing. This would open the door for "the next generation" of Yes, with a younger vocalist, keyboardist and guitarist. Alan would probably step down later and have his spot be filled (How great would it be for Nick D'Virgilio to be the next Yes drummer?!), leaving Chris Squire to be the last old-man out the door before the band continues on for another 10-15 years!
Ah well, I could dream, and I would love to be able to enjoy new Yessongs with my kids (whenever I have them :lol ) over the next couple decades.
-Marc.
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These are some great points and I have really enjoyed reading them. Imagine then, Yes breaking that last boundary. "Yes, the rock group that transcends time and space!" It really is amazing though, how much Yes has changed yet is still completely Yes. There are just so many different styles and sounds in the different eras that it is a complete musical journey in its own. I like how one can hear the influences of the decades come and go. To address M, I think three things need to happen for Yes to continue into a second generation of players. (Yeah, I'm in a list making mood today)
1) You addressed this one already. Phase out the old players and cycle in the new ones.
2) Release albums more regularly to get fans accustomed to the new people.
3) Be able to pass on the love of the band to the next generation
The problem is that all of these have to happen at the same time. I can see some push back happening from some older fans if some of the orignals or long standing members leave. Another problem is number three. Honestly, I am the only Yes fan that I know my age. I am sure some others have heard the hits and all, but I do not know anyone who knows the catalog and appreciates all the eras. There is no way the band can continue into a new generation of members unless a new generation of fans is there to support them. I do also hope that any new members are able to both play and create awesome newer material, yet nail the older material as well. I don't want some keyboardist to come out and try and play through Wakeman's ABWH solo. I would much rather they do a great solo of their own.
Ultimately however, in my gut I am not sure this would happen. But who knows really. I do look forward to what Yes has in their future. I can see at least one album coming from the current group. I do not know if they have plans to do so or not, but I will always look forward to hearing new Yes music.
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It's pretty crazy idea, and I don't really think it will happen. But it did get me thinking about the different "kinds" of Yes albums out there, everything from all shorter pop songs to all epics, and how it's all Yes and IMO all at least pretty good. I didn't expect to enjoy Open Your Eyes as much as I did. I tried it when it first came out and thought it sucked. But listening again with an open mind and open ears, I found the good in it, and there's really quite a bit.
Same with Big Generator. I still can't say that I really like that one, but I don't dislike it as much as I did. In general, it sounds too similar to 90125 but not as good. I think the fact that Yes keeps changing their sound is a plus, not a minus. Each person in the band has, by now, been involving in several different bands and projects, and brings many diverse influences to the table when they get back together. It actually doesn't make sense to expect that their sound wouldn't change, even when it's the same five guys.
Obviously Yes is known first for their prog, and because of the notoriety they gained when they were cranking out the epics in the 70's, they'll always be associated with that. I just think it's unfair and a bit close-minded to write off their less proggy stuff. And that's speaking as someone who used to do exactly that.
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House of Yes: Live From House of Blues (2000)
(https://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_250/MI0001/594/MI0001594171.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Igor Khoroshev - Keyboards, Vocals
Billy Sherwood - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums, Percussion, Vocals
Yours Is No Disgrace
Time And A Word
Homeworld (The Ladder)
Perpetual Change
Lightning Strikes
The Messenger
Ritual - Nous Sommes du Soleil
And You And I
It Will Be A Good Day (The River)
Face To Face
Awaken
Your Move / I've Seen All Good People
Cinema
Owner of a Lonely Heart
Roundabout
----------
I'm including this one for completeness only, in case some people want to discuss it. I rented the DVD a while back and watched it twice. The CD and DVD came from the same concert and they only played the one night, so presumably it's the same music, but I don't have the CD (double CD actually) so I can't give really go into any detail.
This is the only official recording from The Ladder tour and lineup, and by the time it was released, Billy Sherwood had already left the band and Igor Khoroshev was not far behind. The end of the another chapter in Yes history.
I remember thinking that the material from The Ladder was stronger live than on the album, but the older classics were not as good, mostly due to the band being older and not as tight. But this could also be simply because I'm so used to the earlier recordings and I'm just more accustomed to them.
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I remember watching this DVD (and listening to the album) when I first got into the band and actually really enjoying it. Of course, there were (at least 2 more) better live DVDs after this one that were a LOT better, but I did like this one. Good set list choices and a good performance over all. A LOT of new material, comparatively speaking.
I've compared this to performances on the OYE and Talk Tours (of which I have good quality live bootleg DVDs) and I could sort of tell that they were definitely slowing a bit, but it wouldn't get more painfully obvious for another 5-6 years, after the 35th Anniversary Tour, at least.
Anyways, this is a good set to have, even on CD if you don't have time to watch the DVD. Also, this was the first official live release to include "Awaken", as it was not on Yesshows or any other live albums between then and this one. Of course, after this release, there have been 3 more live versions of "Awaken" from different tours released on 3 different sets, but this was the first, so that's probably the most exciting part of LFHOB.
-Marc.
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I have the DVD, and really, it's the newer songs that come off the best. The classics come off with a certain lack of fire, not quite to the point that they're disinterested in playing them, but definitely to the point where it's starting to become obvious that it's getting harder for Anderson, Howe, Squire, and White to play the classics. They were starting to edge closer to playing the classics by the numbers, but a little of the old spark still remains. Plus we get Billy Sherwood taking Rabin's solo in Owner and proving at last he actually DID something in Yes. :lol
Hardly what you call essential, but worth a rental if you can find it that way these days.
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Anyways, this is a good set to have, even on CD if you don't have time to watch the DVD. Also, this was the first official live release to include "Awaken", as it was not on Yesshows or any other live albums between then and this one. Of course, after this release, there have been 3 more live versions of "Awaken" from different tours released on 3 different sets, but this was the first, so that's probably the most exciting part of LFHOB.
-Marc.
Awaken was on Keys to Ascension 1.
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"Awaken" is my favorite Yessong of all, but I've found very few live versions of it that move me the way the original studio version does. When you're there at the concert watching it and hearing it live, it's a different experience and you're there in the moment. Watching it on DVD is similar, though not quite as engrossing.
Listening to the live recording, the imperfections just jump out at me. Without being able to see it and "experience" it, all I really have is a version of the song that isn't as clean, isn't as good overall as the one I love. Sometimes with a live recording, the band takes it up a notch, or there's a solo or other section that's particularly inspired and really great to listen to. I don't remember getting that from this version, but I probably should have hunted down a copy of checked it out before saying anything. As I said, I've really only included this album for completeness.
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Anyways, this is a good set to have, even on CD if you don't have time to watch the DVD. Also, this was the first official live release to include "Awaken", as it was not on Yesshows or any other live albums between then and this one. Of course, after this release, there have been 3 more live versions of "Awaken" from different tours released on 3 different sets, but this was the first, so that's probably the most exciting part of LFHOB.
-Marc.
Awaken was on Keys to Ascension 1.
GAH! I knew I wasn't totally 100% sure on that. Either way, the performance of "Awaken" here isn't at least riddled with over-dubs and studio changes. :tup (as far as we know...)
-Marc.
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Magnification (2001)
(https://i.imgur.com/65JpT7d.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals, Acoustic Guitar, MIDI Guitar
Steve Howe - Acoustic, Electric, and Pedal Steel Guitars, Mandolin, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums, Percussion, Piano, Vocals
Larry Groupé - Conductor, Arrangements, Orchestrations
Magnification
Spirit of Survival
Don't Go
Give Love Each Day
Can You Imagine
We Agree
Soft as a Dove
Dreamtime
In the Presence Of
I) Deeper
II) Death of Ego
III) True Beginner
IV) Turn Around and Remember
Time Is Time
----------
I tried to find some reference as to why Billy Sherwood left Yes after The Ladder tour, but could not. Billy had worked most closely with Chris Squire over the years, as far back as the late 80's, when Yes was on hiatus following Big Generator. Some of the fruits of that collaboration made it onto Union, and Billy remained associated with Yes through the 90's and was an official member on Open Your Eyes and The Ladder. The Squire/Sherwood collaboration Conspiracy was released in 2000, and a second album The Unknown came out in 2003 under the band name Conspiracy, so there was apparently no falling out. My guess is that there simply was no room in Yes for a second guitarist/keyboardist. They had Steve Howe and Igor Khoroshev. So Billy moved on.
In 2000, Yes embarked on the "Masterworks" tour as a five-piece. They'd conducted an online poll to see what songs fans wanted most to hear, and the response overwhelmingly favored the epics and other longer songs, so that's what they played. The set list was "Close to the Edge", "Starship Trooper", "The Gates of Delirium", "Heart of the Sunrise", "Ritual", and "I've Seen All Good People", with "Roundabout" as the encore.
During the tour, however, Igor was involved in an incident for which there aren't a lot of details, but two female security guards were also involved and criminal sexual assault charges were filed. It was settled out of court, which is why not much is known publicly, but it is widely presumed that this is why Igor was asked to leave Yes upon conclusion of the "Masterworks" tour.
That left Yes without a keyboard player. They asked Rick Wakeman if he would like to rejoin, but he was busy. (Rick released five albums in 2000 and two more in 2001.)
Jon suggested that they try something he'd been thinking about: working with an orchestra. Not like on Time And A Word, where strings and horns are basically laid on top of existing songs, or mixed in while keyboards and guitars are mixed out, but actually writing the songs with the orchestra in mind, fully integrated and playing parts which would generally be covered by keyboards, but taking advantage of the additional sonic and tonal range. Real strings and horns instead of Moogs and Mellotrons.
The result was Magnification, and it is exactly how Jon envisioned it. Yes vocals and harmonies, Steve's guitars, minimal keyboards (Alan plays some piano), and a full symphony orchestra "magnifying" the sound. Song lengths vary from two or three minutes to over 10 minutes, with most falling into the six- or seven-minute range. It is progressive and orchestral and sometimes over the top, but is it Yes?
Yes. By now, listeners have come to realize that Yes music has many facets and many elements, and there's no one thing that makes it Yes. And while Magnification doesn't sound anything like Close to the Edge or Relayer, there are definitely parts which are reminiscent of the mellower, more orchestral moments from the early catalog. There are also moments of great power when the horns and winds come blasting in and Alan is slamming the drums and Steve is wailing and Jon is rocking out... okay, rocking out as hard as Jon can, anyway. His voice doesn't really lend itself to rock and roll screaming, but he knows how to emote, and the passion comes through in his delivery.
Magnification is another unique Yes album, for obvious reasons, and it perhaps is not for everyone. But it is most definitely Yes, and while some listeners will miss the Hammond and the synths, those who listen with an open mind and open ears will be rewarded with some really great music. Yes, it's different.
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A dud. I like Spirit of Survival quit a bit, and Can You Imagine? is also good, but the rest does very little for me.
In the Presence Of is like the biggest tease ever. It starts off so good, that main theme in the first few minutes being great, but then it veers off into something, never revisiting that main theme, and pretty much peters off into a boring ending.
Overall, I'd call this one of their three or four least best records.
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From what I remember about this album, I really like it. The orchestra really adds something different to the Yes-sound, and the songs are written well enough. I think the live concerts were a better representation of Yes with an orchestra, but for the purpose of writing an album with an orchestra in mind, I think they achieved their vision.
The longer tracks are pretty good, but I will have to admit, most of the material isn't THAT memorable. I think, of the last 5 albums (Keys, OYE, Ladder, Magnification, and FFH), this is my 2nd least listened-to album. Not that it's as bad as OYE, but I just don't get as much joy out of it as the other 3. Maybe I just need to go back to it again and listen closer.
-Marc.
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It doesn't have a lot of memorable material. For me, mostly it's just nice stuff to put on in the background. I know, that should be heresy for Yes, but that's how I listen to a lot of classical music, and it works out really well. I can appreciate classical music, but most of the time, I'll put on about 30 string quartets, hit Shuffle, and let it go while I study, watch TV, or play on the computer. This isn't Yes music to listen to actively, like "Close to the Edge" which demands your attention.
On the other hand, a lot of people do listen to Magnification actively. I can understand why this one's not as popular as most, but I still think it's a great album.
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This is up there with Yes' 70s material. I didn't know what to make of it at first, but the more I listened to it and allowed Magnification to move me, the better it got. I was never big on the first two songs, but after that the album gets way better. "Don't Go" is one of Yes' catchiest and best "simple" songs ever, and is even better than most Rabin-era Yes songs in that regard. "Give Love Each Day" has an awesome intro, which I love. The way Chris comes in from the Orchestra is awesome, and I get chills down my spine as soon as Jon comes in with "standing here on sacred ground". "Can You Imagine" is another great simple song. After that, I love the great acoustic work and soundscaping verses of "We Agree" that, again, send chills down my spine. "Dreamtime" and "In the Presence Of" are both great, but the latter is just heart wrenching. I remember laying in bed with my headphones listening to "turn around and remember that/when it gets so low as you finally hit the ground" wishing the song would never end. I couldn't believe I was listening to the same Yes whose newer material often has such a glossed-over happiness to it. Whereas albums like The Ladder often sound kinda cheeful in a shallow and phoney kind of way, Magnification is thoughtful, dark and melancholic. I just love it so much. It might be my favorite Yes album.
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The best album to happen since Drama, considering the long line of dreck in that timespan. I love Magnification, with its orchestra. Dreamtime is one of my favorite Yes songs. Admittedly, In The Presence Of doesn't really go anywhere interesting, and the last track doesn't even need to be there, but the rest of it is great.
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I think "Dreamtime" is my favorite. During my listens, it was the one that made me grab my iPod and check the name of the song the most times.
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This album, more than any other Yes album, is the one that falls most firmly into being background music for me. It really doesn't do a whole hell of a lot that's exciting, although there's nothing wrong with it; it just doesn't excite me. It's well written and well performed...it's just kind of there. Better than the other non-Rabin albums after 1980, but for me that's not saying much.
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This is my #2 Yes album. I said it. Does it have some faults? Sure. But it is so great otherwise. The first couple of tracks are not the best on the album, and I admit that I skip over those occasionally. The main strength of Magnification is not just the orchestra, it is the ability to use the orchestra as an intricate and dynamic part of the songs, just as any other instrument and able to fill gaps and be in the background or be at the forefront with ease. I have heard no other rock album that uses the orchestra as effectively as Magnification. It does not feel as an afterthought and it feels like it was supposed to be there from the beginning.
What I also love about this album is that for me, it has a mysterious and contemplative atmosphere about it. For whatever reason, the album reminds me of the Myst series of games, and of that kind of world. Perhaps the songs are not the best Yes had ever written, but they are executed so well. My favorites on the album are Dreamtime, Give Love Each Day, We Agree, and In The Presence Of. I would have been fine if this were Yes' last studio album, going out of a high point IMO. I especially love the last song, which gives me a 70s Yes vibe.
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What I also love about this album is that for me, it has a mysterious and contemplative atmosphere about it.
Yes, this exactly. It is the perfect album for long night drives.
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I think "Dreamtime" is my favorite. During my listens, it was the one that made me grab my iPod and check the name of the song the most times.
I forgot about this one. But after reading your post, I gave it a whirl, and it is a pretty cool song. :tup :tup
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I've got the House of Blues CDs, but not the DVD. I like it. Sounds great to me.
I like Magnification too, though I don't find occasion to listen to it as much as some of the other Yes albums from that time period.
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Symphonic Live (2003)
(https://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_250/MI0000/866/MI0000866069.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals, Acoustic Guitar
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums, Percussion, Vocals
with
Tom Brislin - Keyboards
The European Festival Orchestra, Wilhelm Keitel Conductor
Overture
Close to the Edge
Long Distance Runaround
Don't Go
In the Presence Of
The Gates of Delerium
Steve Howe Guitar Solo
Starship Trooper
Magnification
And You And I
Ritual
I've Seen All Good People
Owner of a Lonely Heart
Roundabout
----------
I don't have this double CD, but I do have the DVD which is the same concert, and I've watched it many times. It's amazing. The double CD is from the same concert, so unless they screwed something up with the sound, it too is presumably amazing. The Magnification material is even better than on the album, and much of the older material takes on a new dimension with the addition of the orchestra. Rick Wakeman was asked to play on the short tour from which this recording was made, but he had scheduling conflicts. As with the album Magnification, the idea was to mostly replace the keyboards with the orchestra, but the climactic Hammond solo in "Close to the Edge" is an exception, and key parts in the epics "The Gates of Delerium" and "Ritual" pretty much had to be there as well, and Tom Brislin does a great job covering those parts.
There are times when it's downright breathtaking what they've done with the orchestra. Those Mellotron lines in "And You And I" sound simply glorious when played by actual strings and horns. "The Gates of Delerium" with a full orchestra participating in the insanity of the "war" and also in the serenity of the "peace" is terrific. There are also times when they've more or less added things for the orchestra to do, as Yes music is often quite dense anyway. But they've actually managed to embellish "Close to the Edge" and other classic Yessongs. The songs of course have stood alone for decades previously, but at least the orchestra doesn't sound superfluous. They're not just doubling the existing lines; they're actually adding to the song and to the sound.
The orchestra gets a few breaks during this very long concert (nearly three hours), but I found some of the choices a bit odd. "Owner of a Lonely Heart" made big waves in the 80's with the sampled orchestral hits, and I was looking forward to hearing those parts played by a real orchestra, but "Owner" is one of the those played without the orchestra. It seemed like an obvious place to actually make the substitution.
Anyway, this is another one essentially included for completeness, since I don't have the CD, but as I said, if it's as good as the DVD, it's definitely worth checking out.
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This is probably one of my favorite live CD/DVD sets released by Yes, and the Orchestra does a stupendous job of adding to the older songs while bringing the newer ones to life.
I mean, where else can you get CTTE, TGOD and Ritual all in the same place?! Those three songs alone are worth the price of admission!
-Marc.
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The Orchestra is great, when they're mixed loud enough to be audible. The tour was notoriously filled with orchestra and band screw-ups, and performances that sounded like both spending the evening trying to play catch-up with one another. In this release, there's definitely been some creative mastering going on, and you kinda have to wonder what that show really sounded like.
Still a nice DVD with a good setlist. If you can only get one Yes DVD, this is probably the one to go for.
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I've never heard it myself, but this is usually the most recommended live album of theirs to me.
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Symphonic Live (2003)
(https://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_250/MI0000/866/MI0000866069.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals, Acoustic Guitar
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums, Percussion, Vocals
with
Tom Brislin - Keyboards
The European Festival Orchestra, Wilhelm Keitel Conductor
Overture
Close to the Edge
Long Distance Runaround
Don't Go
In the Presence Of
The Gates of Delerium
Steve Howe Guitar Solo
Starship Trooper
Magnification
And You And I
Ritual
I've Seen All Good People
Owner of a Lonely Heart
Roundabout
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I don't have this double CD, but I do have the DVD which is the same concert, and I've watched it many times. It's amazing. The double CD is from the same concert, so unless they screwed something up with the sound, it too is presumably amazing. The Magnification material is even better than on the album, and much of the older material takes on a new dimension with the addition of the orchestra. Rick Wakeman was asked to play on the short tour from which this recording was made, but he had scheduling conflicts. As with the album Magnification, the idea was to mostly replace the keyboards with the orchestra, but the climactic Hammond solo in "Close to the Edge" is an exception, and key parts in the epics "The Gates of Delerium" and "Ritual" pretty much had to be there as well, and Tom Brislin does a great job covering those parts.
There are times when it's downright breathtaking what they've done with the orchestra. Those Mellotron lines in "And You And I" sound simply glorious when played by actual strings and horns. "The Gates of Delerium" with a full orchestra participating in the insanity of the "war" and also in the serenity of the "peace" is terrific. There are also times when they've more or less added things for the orchestra to do, as Yes music is often quite dense anyway. But they've actually managed to embellish "Close to the Edge" and other classic Yessongs. The songs of course have stood alone for decades previously, but at least the orchestra doesn't sound superfluous. They're not just doubling the existing lines; they're actually adding to the song and to the sound.
The orchestra gets a few breaks during this very long concert (nearly three hours), but I found some of the choices a bit odd. "Owner of a Lonely Heart" made big waves in the 80's with the sampled orchestral hits, and I was looking forward to hearing those parts played by a real orchestra, but "Owner" is one of the those played without the orchestra. It seemed like an obvious place to actually make the substitution.
Anyway, this is another one essentially included for completeness, since I don't have the CD, but as I said, if it's as good as the DVD, it's definitely worth checking out.
I don't have this.
But I want it.
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Orbert - Will you be including any of the following?
In a Word: Yes (1969 - ) (2002)
The Ultimate Yes: 35th Anniversary Collection (2003)
Yes Remixes (2003)
Yesspeak (2004)
Yes Acoustic: Guaranteed No Hiss (2004)
Songs from Tsongas (2005)
The Word Is Live (2005)
Live at Montreux 2003 (2007)
I'd really like to discuss Songs From Tsongas and maybe The Word Is Live
-Marc.
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Songs from Tsongas (2004)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/80/TsongasYes.jpg)
Jon Anderson - Vocals, MIDI Guitar, Percussion, Keyboards
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Harmonica, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums, Percussion
Firebird Suite
Going for the One
Sweet Dreams
I've Seen All Good People
Mind Drive (Parts 1 & 2)
South Side of the Sky
Turn of The Century
My Eyes (excerpt from "Foot Prints")
Mind Drive (Part 3)
Yours Is No Disgrace
Acoustic Set
The Meeting Room (Rick Wakeman solo)
The Meeting
Long Distance Runaround
Wonderous Stories
Time Is Time
Roundabout
Show Me
Owner of a Lonely Heart
Second Initial (Steve Howe solo)
Rhythm of Love
And You and I
Ritual - Nous Sommes Du Soleil
Every Little Thing
Starship Trooper
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The 2004 tour was the 35th Anniversary Tour, and it was also the last tour with either Jon Anderson or Rick Wakeman. Well, if you're going to go out, try to go out on a high note, and this is a pretty high note. The set list includes songs from each period of Yes history, hitting almost every album from the self-titled debut to Magnification. There's also an acoustic set in the middle featuring some stripped-down versions which are pretty much what you might expect, and a few surprises, most notably an acoustic blues-shuffle version of "Roundabout".
It's an impressive set. Even though they've split up "Mind Drive", it's cool to hear this one, my personal favorite from the Keys to Ascension period. I also prefer the version of "Turn of the Century" here to the one on Keys to Ascension. It seems like they tried to mix things up a bit, aware that a lot of these songs have previously been released on at least one live album, but between the rarities, the new ones, the acoustic set, and the fire with which they attack most everything, this collection is definitely worth checking out.
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Yes has had personnel issues and health issues in the past decade or so, and amidst a dearth of new studio material, we've seen a lot of concert DVDs and live CDs and even a set of interviews (Yesspeak), and to be honest, I consider it to be bordering on overkill. Take a look at Marc's list and you'll see what I mean.
In a Word: Yes (1969 - ) (2002)
The Ultimate Yes: 35th Anniversary Collection (2003)
Yes Remixes (2003)
Yesspeak (2004)
Yes Acoustic: Guaranteed No Hiss (2004)
Songs from Tsongas (2005)
The Word Is Live (2005)
Live at Montreux 2003 (2007)
At least they've tried to vary things a bit. Each of these recent releases has its own focus, its own character, but I can't help but feel that fans are being exploited a bit. Most of these recent releases are beautiful packages, not just "another live album", but they're also expensive, really for collectors only.
Yes is my favorite band, but I'm just not one of those who feels the need to collect literally everything they release. Marc, do you actually have all of those?
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I've got all of those except the 35th Anniversary cd set, although. I've been meaning to get the 3cd set someday lol
I've also been compelled to have a complete collection, so I own a lot of the stuff released over the last 10 years.
Also, since as of today, Yes hasn't released a CD version of Songs From Tsongas, I took it upon my self over 6 years ago to make my own CD version of the album, and it's as follows:
Songs From Tsongas
3-Disc CD Set (171:27)
Disc 1 - 69:34
1. Intro/Firebird Suite
2. Going For The One
3. Sweet Dreams
4. Your Move/I’ve Seen All Good People
5. Mind Drive Parts 1 and 2
6. South Side Of The Sky
7. Turn Of The Century
8. My Eyes/Mind Drive Part 3
9. Yours Is No Disgrace
Disc 2 - 42:26
1. The Meeting Room/The Meeting
2. Long Distance Runaround
3. Wonderous Stories
4. Time Is Time
5. Rounabout
6. Show Me
7. Owner Of A Lonely Heart
8. Second Initial
9. Rhythm Of Love
Disc 3 - 59:27
1. And You And I
2. Ritual
3. Every Little Thing
4. Starship Trooper
I love the set list, and the version of "Ritual" on this set is amazing! I also enjoy "And You And I" and of course, "Mind Drive". Great songs, and it's really does cover most of the career of the band, which was a great move.
-Marc.
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I had originally intended to do Songs from Tsongas next, but then I realized that that would have been two Discography entries in a row which are soundtracks from concert DVDs. Symphonic Live was the previous entry. I don't have all of these later collections on CD; the ones I have are downloaded off the net, so I didn't even realize that Songs from Tsongas was a DVD rip. I guess I should've figured it out when I couldn't find a square version of the cover art. So I had decided to skip it, because my intention from the start has been to focus on audio releases, and to include studio albums but not necessarily all of the live collections they've released lately.
I was finishing up my obligatory second listen through The Word is Live last night, while trying to find a suitable cover picture and starting to write things up in my head, when you specifically asked to include Songs from Tsongas. I was going to work in a comment or two about all of these recent boxes and DVDs, and I tried to work in a section about that, then finally cut it all out, which is partly why the writeup is so short.
It is a great set. The guys had been slowing things down noticeably, and I don't know if that's in an attempt to make things "heavier" or what, but there don't appear to be any tempo issues here. The guys are on fire. The playing is inspired and creative, and I like what they've done with the arrangements in the acoustic set. At first, "Roundabout" threw me for a loop, and I didn't really like it. They played it on the radio around here for a while when it first came out, and eventually I got to liking it a little bit. Now, years later, I'm removed enough from it to appreciate it for what it is; a way for them to update the song without just adding extra frills.
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Excellent show. Going for the One is a great opener, and the jam at the end of SSotS is wonderful.
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the jam at the end of SSotS is wonderful.
Yeah, they really tear it up. I seem to recall that this was one that they hadn't played live in a while, and specifically pulled this one out and worked it up for the 35th anniversary tour. "Heart of the Sunrise", "Long Distance Runaround" and of course "Roundabout" from Fragile get all the love, but I've also thought "South Side of the Sky" was right up there as well. They really nailed it on this tour.
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I have this DVD, and whenever I watch it, it reminds me why I love this band. It's brilliant. :hefdaddy
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The Word is Live (2005)
(https://www.progarchives.com/progressive_rock_discography_covers/105/cover_54507592005.jpg)
The Word is Live is a three-disc collection of live Yes recordings from various periods throughout the band's history, from the original lineup in 1970 to the Big Generator tour in 1988. It specifically avoids duplicating material from Yessongs, Yesshows, and other official live releases, instead focusing on songs and lineups that are not as well documented. Hundreds of hours of collected bootlegs, BBC tapes, and soundboard recordings were reviewed, and the final choices emphasize performance quality. Still, the sound is mostly very good. The definitive recording of the early classic period, Yessongs, has notoriously poor sound quality and is still highly regarded because of the performances contained therein, and the sound here is better than on Yessongs.
The Word is Live is mostly chronological (with a few exceptions so that tracks fit properly onto discs), and presents a nearly four-hour journey through the history of Yes on stage. If you can find a copy, and can afford it, I highly recommend it.
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BBC 1970 (Anderson, Banks, Bruford, Kaye, Squire)
Then (5:25)
For Everyone (4:44)
"Ladies and gentlemen... Yes."
This performance of "Then" is tight and highly energetic, but I suspect that it was chosen mostly because the first thing you hear is the BBC announcer introducing the band, which is a great way to start off any live album. The real gem here is "For Everyone", which never made it onto an album. Its bridge contains an early version of the "Disillusion" section of "Starship Trooper".
Gothenburg 1971 (Anderson, Bruford, Howe, Kaye, Squire)
Astral Traveller (7:24)
Everydays (11:01)
London 1971
Yours Is No Disgrace (11:45)
I've Seen All Good People (7:52)
America (16:21)
It's Love (11:07)
The 1971 band was in some ways the one that really pushed Yes forward the most, although a strong argument can also be made for the following lineup with Rick Wakeman. Yes was still performing some covers, but they were never content to merely cover a song; they took it to new, unimagined heights. Their covers of Stephen Stills' "Everydays", and Simon & Garfunkel's "America" are simply amazing. Yes did not simply add five-minute solos to these songs, but composed entire instrumental sections to bridge the verses. Many Yesfans were surprised to learn that the ten-minute version of "America", itself a major "proggification" of a simple three-minute song, was actually the short version of what Yes played back then. Here we get the full 16-minute version, with all of the verses and changes. Yes' version of The Young Rascals' "It's Love" is... interesting. I can't say I'm a fan of the song itself, but it's certainly impressive what they've done with it.
Detroit 1976 (Anderson, Howe, Moraz, Squire, White)
Apocalypse (3:08)
Siberian Khatru (10:10)
Sound Chaser (11:17)
As mentioned earlier, the early 70's period which is well documented on Yessongs has been skipped, and the next lineup we hear from is the Relayer lineup with Patrick Moraz on keyboards. Notable here are what he does with "Siberian Khatru", including the keyboard solo. Patrick prefers the jazzier sound of the Rhodes to Rick's baroque harpsichord sound, and it gives the break a different feel. Also notable is pretty much everything in "Sound Chaser". This version really smokes.
London 1975 (Anderson, Howe, Squire, Wakeman, White)
Sweet Dreams (6:22)
Oakland 1978
Future Times/Rejoice (6:59)
Circus of Heaven (4:52)
Inglewood 1978
The Big Medley (25:53)
Time And A Word
Long Distance Runaround
Survival
The Fish (Schindleria Praematurus)
Perpetual Change
Soon
Chicago 1979
Hello Chicago (2:11)
Roundabout (8:42)
Oakland 1978
Heart Of The Sunrise (10:56)
Chicago 1979
Awaken (17:53)
No collection would be complete without the classic lineup, but the focus here is on the later 70's, with most of the material coming from the Going for the One and Tormato tours. The version of "Awaken" here is my favorite live version of the song. Yesmusic is sometimes about how perfect and balanced everything is, and sometimes it's about capturing the emotion of the song itself; what we get here is the best of both. Similarly, "Roundabout" and "Heart of the Sunrise" really shine here. I'm not a big fan of medleys, and Yes doesn't actually do them very often, but "The Big Medley" here is really something. Rather than simply jump from one song to the next, there are actual transitions, and the result is a very long, very nicely arranged piece of music.
New York 1980 (Horn, Howe, Downes, Squire, White)
Go Through This (4:21)
We Can Fly From Here (6:46)
Tempus Fugit (5:53)
The Drama tour was, sadly, not very successful. While most Yesfans have come to regard the album itself rather highly (at least those who aren't in the "it's not Yes without Jon" camp), Trevor Horn simply could not "be" Jon Anderson every night on stage. The songs were at the very top of his range and, by most accounts, his versions of classic songs were inconsistent at best. Here, we get songs that that band did well. "Go Through This" and "We Can Fly From Here" were both omitted from the Drama album but played regularly in concert, and it's nice to hear some more music from this lineup. The latter was ultimately reworked into the title suite from the most recent Yes album, Fly From Here. "Tempus Fugit" was obviously included because they hit this one out of the park.
There are some sound quality issues here, but the performances themselves outshine any imperfections in sound.
Houston 1988 (Anderson, Kaye, Rabin, Squire, White)
Rhythm Of Love (6:42)
Hold On (7:24)
Shoot High, Aim Low (8:27)
Make It Easy/Owner Of A Lonely Heart (6:09)
The only official live document of the 90125 band, 9012Live - The Solos is a strange animal and, IMO, does not do justice to the band. Here, we get to really hear what they could do. This was a band that could rock heavier than other Yes lineups, but also had a prog side which is often overlooked by its detractors. "Shoot High, Aim Low" is the gem here, but the extended arrangements of the other popular songs from this period are also quite good.
Tony Kaye was both the first and fourth Yes keyboard player, and the 90125 lineup marked his return. It's interesting that he appears in both the first and last lineup in this collection.
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Got this set for my birthday when I was going through my huge Yes boom of CD purchases a few years ago, and I love it. As a bootleg listener, I have zero problem with the sound quality here, and agree that it's better than Yessongs. Those versions of America, Awaken, and the big medley are worth the price alone, but the Drama and 90125 era recordings seal the deal. This is a great box set, one of my favorites ever.
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Fly From Here (2011)
(https://i.imgur.com/zOZ9yqu.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/dOQhjxB.jpg)
(Click for full painting)
Benoit David - Lead Vocals
Geoff Downes - Keyboards
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums
Fly From Here
Overture
Part 1: We Can Fly
Part 2: Sad Night at the Airfield
Part 3: Madman at the Screens
Part 4: Bumpy Ride
Part 5: We Can Fly Reprise
The Man You Always Wanted Me to Be
Life on a Film Set
Hour of Need
Solitaire
Into the Storm
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There are many accounts of what happened next in Yes history and why ten years passed between studio albums, but here's a somewhat simplified version: After the 35th Anniversary Tour in 2004, Yes decided to take another break. After the band had been on hiatus for a while, Jon Anderson became very ill with a respiratory infection, so getting back together to work on a new album was not possible. The others occupied themselves with various projects, as was now the norm between Yes albums. Rick Wakeman, always the wild card, would participate if his schedule allowed (though the odds always seemed better if Jon Anderson was also available). After a few more years and a few more projects behind them, Steve, Chris, and Alan decided that they should at least do a tour. After all, the last tour was not in support of an album and went quite well. They attempted to contact Jon, and learned that he was busy; Jon had put together a solo tour to support his new album. He had also been quoted in interviews saying that Yes was over, it was in the past.
Steve, Chris, and Alan decided to carry on as Yes, without Jon. They bought out his share of the band name, and began the process of finding a new lead singer. At this point, a new album was not yet in the picture, only a tour, but they would still need a singer. They reviewed YouTube videos of various Yes cover bands, and eventually decided upon Benoit David of the Yes tribute band Close to the Edge. They asked him if he would like to front a tour, and he accepted. Rick was not interested, but in an interesting turn of events, his son Oliver was, and so the new band would have a Wakeman on keyboards after all. The 2008 tour started off billed as "Steve Howe, Chris Squire, and Alan White of Yes" but at some point, they just decided to call the band Yes. Oliver Wakeman was reportedly a pretty good keyboard player, but not in same league as his father, although in fairness, few are. Benoit David received mixed reviews. Some nights, he seemed confident and strong, other nights he struggled. It seemed to depend quite a bit upon what night you happened to catch. Cynics pointed out that there is a huge difference between pretending to be Jon Anderson every night and actually being Jon Anderson. Supporters asked what that difference might be; Benoit had made a career of sounding and acting like Jon Anderson and many thought he did it quite well.
But Benoit does not have Jon's creative side. After the tour, they began writing songs for what they hoped would become the next Yes album, but had some trouble coming up with material. Former Yesman Geoff Downes was rumored to be working with the band again, at least helping write. Eventually it was announced that recording had begun and that Trevor Horn was on board to produce the new album. Then in a surprise twist, or perhaps not so surprising, we learned that Oliver Wakeman was out and Geoff Downes was in as the keyboard player. Geoff of course was the other half of The Buggles with Trevor, and had played keyboards on Drama, which featured both Trevor and Geoff. Also, Steve and Geoff had recently worked together when the original Asia lineup had reformed in 2007 for their album Phoenix. This almost made it a Drama reunion (the album which in some ways had led to the formation of Asia), although Trevor adamantly refused to sing on the album; Benoit would remain on as the lead singer.
Fly From Here has been unofficially dubbed "Drama II" by many Yesfans, some meaning as a compliment, others perhaps not. Benoit's voice is truly more similar to Trevor Horn's than to Jon Anderson's, and with much of the album actually written by Trevor and Geoff, including the six-part title suite which is actually a reworking of a song left over from the Drama sessions, a lot of the music hearkens back to Drama as well.
The album doesn't really have the fire and heaviness that Drama does, but it has some fine songwriting and excellent production. The title suite is good but feels a bit fragmented, with actual breaks rather than smooth segues between some parts. You never get over the feeling that it's a number of shorter pieces put together; it's definitely a suite and not a true epic. The remaining songs range from not-bad to pretty good. Most are in straight 4/4 time, with not a lot of tempo or key changes, but there are some "proggy" moments in most of the songs. The weak point is probably Chris' "The Man You Always Wanted Me to Be", but once you get past that, things pick up and never look back.
If you can, try to find a Japanese import copy of the album, which has an extended version of Steve's "Hour of Need". The longer version has instrumentals both before and after the main song, doubling its length and transforming it into a real showcase piece for Steve. It also shifts the balance of "side two" of the album from "mostly not prog" to "mostly prog". Steve's acoustic solo "Solitaire" is great, definitely one of his better acoustic solos to grace a Yes album and one of his best overall. The album finishes strongly with "Into The Storm", featuring some of the most intricate playing on the album. Also, with its alternating bars of odd meters, it is the most prog.
I know, being more prog does not automatically make it better, but this is Yes we're talking about, and that's one of the first things people want to know. How proggy is it? The answer is: A bit, but not a lot. But don't let that stop you. Open Your Eyes has no prog at all, and I think it's a fine album, a great collection of well-written and well-produced songs. Fly From Here is definitely a step or two up from that, something like Drama's little brother.
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The Fly From Here suite is fantastic until "Bumpy Ride". Fitting name, it almost ruins the whole thing with how all over the place it is. But "We Can Fly", "Sad Night At The Airfield", and "Madman At The Screens"? Fantastic. All three would probably go into my Yes top 20. The rest of the album, I can't really get into as much. The songs at this point just sound like either a very poor imitation of the music from Drama, or just aren't interesting at all. The exception is "Into The Storm". While most of that song sounds a bit too on the goofy side for me (that said, I've grown to love the "bouncy" sections as well), the real winner here is that awesome chorus. Great closer. Drama is my favorite Yes record. So obviously, when I heard how this one was being described, I got my hopes up. The four tracks I praised, I do indeed love as much as the Drama stuff. The rest, though? Doesn't hold a candle to it.
As for Benoit David, I had already been a fan of the band Mystery beforehand, so I didn't mind hearing him on this at all. I already like the guy's other work, so why not. That said, I don't really like how they dumped him, but it's Yes, so what can you do?
Same with the new new guy, actually. I already knew him from the past few Glass Hammer albums, and while I don't like those albums very much (except the song "Nothing Box" which is amazing), I can say the guy is a better fit. Curious to see if they'll make a new album with him. And then dump him in the same manner. :P
EDIT: Oh, yeah, thanks for doing these, Orbert. It's been fun! Is this the end or is In The Present - Live From Lyon up next? I haven't heard that but I've heard very mixed reviews on it.
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I loved the album when it came out, and I still think it's pretty sweet. The epic has some incredible moments, and I also really like The Man You Always Wanted Me to Be, some incredible work by Steve Howe on here. A cool album overall, I wouldn't mind another Yes album like this.
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Fly From Here held my attention and gave me quite some excitement being Yes's first new album in over 10 years. When news of the Drama-era band was working on it, I got even MORE excited. When news that the first half of the album was a side-length suite/epic, I nearly lost it. When I got the album, I was over-joyed. The epic was everything I could imagine the modern Yes producing, and it was great to hear that Drama-esque sound again.
Even though the album has the epic indexed into its 6 parts, I went ahead and made a track with all 6 parts combined (just to play a track with the length of 23:52). As a whole, it's pretty good, but I'll agree with Nel in that "Bumpy Ride" is a bit off, but I enjoy nonetheless. I suppose things are bound to sound different when you have different people contributing to a larger, single piece of work.
The rest of the album is good-to-great. "The Man You Always Wanted Me to Be" is a great mid-tempo piece, which is tinged with prog-ideas (mostly from the random odd-meter bars here and there); "Life On A Film Set" is a bit more unusual, and makes one think it should have been called "Riding A Tiger" considering how often that phrase is repeated; "Hour of Need" is great, but the full-length version is AMAZING and definitely worth hearing; "Solitaire" is a sweet little Steve Howe acoustic solo bit, ya know, just to cement the fact that this IS indeed a Yes album (as if we needed convincing, but it is indeed no "Clap" or "Mood For A Day"); and finally "Into The Storm", probably one of my favorite tracks on the album, it is a great closer and probably a Top 20 Yessong!
Over-all, FFH is a great album with some great ideas, despite some of them not getting off the ground entirely, but the stellar production by Trevor Horn and the return of Geoff Downes marks this pretty high for me, considering I *love* Drama.
-Marc.
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Terrible album, terrible tour, and as few would have thought possible, an actual step-down from 90's-early 00's Yes.
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Terrible album, terrible tour, and as few would have thought possible, an actual step-down from 90's-early 00's Yes.
I guess Troopers couldn't really be Panthers too, eh? :lol
-Marc.
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As for Benoit David, I had already been a fan of the band Mystery beforehand, so I didn't mind hearing him on this at all. I already like the guy's other work, so why not. That said, I don't really like how they dumped him, but it's Yes, so what can you do?
Crap! I was thinking I would forget to mention that, and I did. I actually have One Among the Living by Mystery, and it's a good album, proggy stuff. I didn't realize until after I'd read it on the Yesfans boards that the singer for Mystery is Benoit David. I just didn't make the connection because it'd been a while since I listened to it. But yes, Benoit was known for more than just being the lead singer of a Yes tribute band; he's also a lead singer of a successful prog band, or at least as successful as unknown prog bands can be these days. One Among the Living is their seventh album, so they're doing something right.
Oh, yeah, thanks for doing these, Orbert. It's been fun! Is this the end or is In The Present - Live From Lyon up next? I haven't heard that but I've heard very mixed reviews on it.
You're welcome! It's been fun.
Nope, this is it. I tried to work a mention of In The Present - Live from Lyon into the paragraph about the tour with Oliver on keyboards, but it got really awkward, as the album actually came out after Fly From Here, and I already knew that I wouldn't be writing it up because I don't have it and have never heard it.
Interesting the support for "The Man You Always Wanted Me to Be". I find the song a bit on the dull side, rather pedestrian at best. Maybe it's just because it comes after the title suite and I'm only half paying attention or something. I've given this disc plenty of spins, since it only came out last year, including three in the past week, but I'll give it another go.
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FINAL THOUGHTS
This has been fun. Yes is my favorite band, and as most of you know by now, I'm an egotistical bastard who loves showing off his knowledge of old-school prog. But as a former teacher, I really do love sharing that knowledge, and I also know that teaching something is the best way to learn more about something, because you have to research it, you have to get it right, and you have to be ready to field questions.
I re-listened to all of my Yes while doing this, and found a new appreciation for some of the ones that I'd more or less written off before. Yes has changed a lot over their 40+ years, but in the bigger picture, it's actually pretty impressive how much their sound has stayed consistent over that time. Each Yes album has its own sound and personality, but every one of them still sounds like Yes.
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Don't have much to say about the album, as I wasn't very impressed with it. The thread, though, has been awesome good fun, and I hate to see it done. Good job Orbert!
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Orbert, if you enjoy One Among The Living, definitely check out their 2007 album Beneath The Veil Of Winter's Face. IMO it's an even stronger album. Haven't heard the one that just came out this year though. I should look into that.
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Thanks for the recommendation!
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Terrible album, terrible tour, and as few would have thought possible, an actual step-down from 90's-early 00's Yes.
I wouldn't call the album terrible, but it is not very memorable. A few of the songs are nice, but the bulk of it is wholly forgettable. Definitely a bottom 3 Yes album (along with Union and Tormato).
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Been rocking Yessongs in the car for a few days. I am loving it. No matter how much I might like some of the other records, that period is still definitely what I consider the best.
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Thanks for doing this, Orbert. This thread proved it was possible to have fun and learn a lot at the same time. :tup
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Orbert, if you enjoy One Among The Living, definitely check out their 2007 album Beneath The Veil Of Winter's Face. IMO it's an even stronger album. Haven't heard the one that just came out this year though. I should look into that.
Listened to this last night. Wow, good stuff!
Lots of nice proggy goodness, but man, the one that sticks in my head is the relatively straightforward The Third Dream. I love the line "Won't you please stop crying? I want you to leave right now." Harsh. I love a good break-up song, and this one slams.
Heh heh, the first song on the album is "As I Am". Four years later. Just sayin'.
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Indeed! I love the whole thing, especially carrying that leitmotif through the whole album. Still have no idea what the album's about though. XD
I think that's the first album with David as the singer, though. The first three albums from that band are all from the 90s, and I know nothing about the quality of the music or anything. It'd be interesting to seek them out though.
I'll, um... try to not derail the thread any further. :lol
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That's okay, the thread's pretty much over now. We can talk about whatever we want now. :lol
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Firstly, thanks to Orbert for creating this thread. It really has been a journey, but it has also been fun, informative, and interesting. Good job! :tup
I do not really have much to add to the Fly From Here discussion that hasn't been said already. I am really looking forward to listening to that lengthened "Hour of Need" though.
I do have a few questions though, mostly regarding: the future. Where does everyone see Yes going from here? Where do they end their journey? How should they end it? I could see them releasing one more album, but personally I would want it to be very special, and different than Fly From Here. Perhaps a full blown concept album/rock opera type album? I don't know really. I would kind of hate to see them just fizzle out and disappear, but if that is what they decide to do, I am fine with it. Why? Because Yes' catalog has such depth to it. Albums I've heard a hundred times still have more left to explore in them; this thread proves it. And that is what is so great about Yes.
(Also, what ever happened to that Anderson, Rabin, Wakeman project that was rumored?)
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Orbert, huge thanks to you for starting this thread. And thanks to all the other Yes fans that contributed their thoughts.
Other than Roundabout and Owner of a Lonely Heart, I knew next to nothing about Yes when the thread began. No particular reason really, just an ambivalence borne out of not being a '70s prog guy. Now, I've pulled Fragile and 90125 from the $5 Best Buy bargain bin and bought The Yes Album from iTunes. They've all struck pretty well, particularly the older two and especially Fragile. What a phenomenal album! So, thanks to you and everyone in the thread, I have some new music to enjoy and a new band to explore!
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Very cool! Yes music is awesome and as far as I'm concerned, the more people who experience it, the better.
Supposedly Chris and Alan plan to write some music together soon, between now and the end of the year. That's all we know. It could end up as material for the next Yes album, or the next Conspiracy or Chris Squire Experiment album.
Last I knew, the Anderson/Wakeman/Rabin project was back on. It was "planned" for a while, years ago, but after sitting on the back burner for so long, it's finally been pulled to the front. All that means in this case, however, is that they're back to actively trying to work out schedules to actually do something. In other words, it's still being planned for whenever they can do it.
Earlier this year, Benoit David became ill and could not tour, and Yes (that is, Chris, Alan, and Steve) again had to find a singer. The current lead vocalist for Yes is Jon Davison. As with Benoit, he was selected primarily based on YouTube videos. Some people scoff or snicker at that, and I did too, but when you think about it, it makes sense. Why bother advertising or trying to use whatever connections you have to find people who are interested, when you have all these audition videos online, ready to go? Sit through a few hours of videos, narrow the list down to a few names, make some phone calls. If you're in a Yes tribute band and Chris Squire calls you and wants you to front an actual Yes tour, are you going to turn that down?
Rick Wakeman's vision of Yes continuing indefinitely by coninuously replacing members still seems like nothing more than a really cool idea, but stranger things have happened, I'm sure. Okay, I can't think of any off hand, but I'm sure they have.
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I always figured it would be Kiss that continued by replacing people, but keeping the same make up, myself. Never thought that sort of thing about Yes. :lol
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Last I knew, the Anderson/Wakeman/Rabin project was back on. It was "planned" for a while, years ago, but after sitting on the back burner for so long, it's finally been pulled to the front. All that means in this case, however, is that they're back to actively trying to work out schedules to actually do something. In other words, it's still being planned for whenever they can do it.
Earlier this year, Benoit David became ill and could not tour, and Yes (that is, Chris, Alan, and Steve) again had to find a singer. The current lead vocalist for Yes is Jon Davison. As with Benoit, he was selected primarily based on YouTube videos. Some people scoff or snicker at that, and I did too, but when you think about it, it makes sense. Why bother advertising or trying to use whatever connections you have to find people who are interested, when you have all these audition videos online, ready to go? Sit through a few hours of videos, narrow the list down to a few names, make some phone calls. If you're in a Yes tribute band and Chris Squire calls you and wants you to front an actual Yes tour, are you going to turn that down?
Perhaps now that Rabin's new solo album is finished we will hear some news. Honestly, I am very interested in hearing what they might come up with.
I actually haven't gotten around to listening to the new singer yet. I'll have to do that. I wonder if he will bring anything to the table songwriting wise. I think Steve and Geoff are on tour with Asia now, so I don't expect to hear anything from them until that is done. Either way, with two or more Yes related projects, there are some things to look forward to in Yes-world.
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That makes sense about Steve and Geoff being out with Asia right now. I just remember seeing a quote from Alan back in September about how he and Chris were going to get together to do some writing between now and Christmas. So that too is still only something which is planned, not definite, and hasn't happened yet.
I've mentioned in other threads how the music scene has changed, and how bands or at least individual musicians used to actually retire. At some point, they decide that they've had a good run and call it quits, and enjoy the rest of their lives as normal humans. Very few musicians seem to retire anymore. There seems to be an attitude that you must keep doing it as long as you're still alive, and now fans actually expect it. Sometimes I think all these announcements that things are "planned" are just to keep fans quiet for now, keep them waiting.
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That makes sense about Steve and Geoff being out with Asia right now. I just remember seeing a quote from Alan back in September about how he and Chris were going to get together to do some writing between now and Christmas. So that too is still only something which is planned, not definite, and hasn't happened yet.
You know what's missing from RAW (Rabin/Anderson/Wakeman)?? A good rhythm section... and you know what Alan and Chris are? A good rhythm section.
Just sayin'... I think it would be an awesome line-up - the classic TFTO/GFTO line-up but with Rabin instead of Howe. :metal
Really though, I think I'm a bit more excite for the "RAW" idea than a new Yes album at this point, but that'll largely depend on whether or not Jon and co. get a rhythm section for their band/album.
-Marc.
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I think Anderson/Rabin/Squire/Wakeman/White would be a fantastic band, and that very idea has come up more than once on the Yesfans boards. But that would basically be another Yes, and Trevor has stated that they (Anderson/Rabin/Wakeman) are trying to be very careful about not making this a version of Yes.
Jon and Rick have recorded an album and toured together as a duo, and their music of course has some similarity to the Anderson/Wakeman parts of Yes songs, but in choosing to be a duo, as opposed to rejoining Yes (which they were both invited to do, again, for the latest album), they've made their feelings pretty clear as well.
Steve Howe was interviewed recently, and of course the subject of Jon and Rick came up, and he said point blank that it's not about Jon and Rick anymore; it's about who actually wants to be in the band and make Yes music. I'm sure he's sick of getting asked about them, too, and his response was meant to hopefully put an end to that, but the cynics of course have interpreted it as him saying "Oh, so now it's open to whoever wants to be in Yes?" But then, some people are always looking to read things between the lines that aren't there. To me, it's pretty obvious that that's not what he meant.
That would be a sweet lineup, for Yes or whatever. The problem is that it would almost not make sense to not call it Yes. We're talking about five Yes alumni. But Steve owns 1/3 of the Yes name, and you know he would not allow that. Also, those five guys together on stage, and they don't play any Yes music? That would be criminal. But again, I'm sure Steve would block that. They asked Jon and Rick to come back to Yes, and they declined, then the next thing they do is get together with TR and go out and call it Yes, without him? Steve may be an asshole, but he'd be perfectly justified in telling them to fuck off if they asked his permission to do that.
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I haven't posted any, but I've been following this thread on and off since the start. It's been a lot of fun to read and has increased my interest in Yes, thanks for doing it, Orbert! :tup
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I wish Changes was an instrumental and just kept on going 7/8||10/8 instead of going into the 4/4 section. I'll listen to the first minute of Changes over and over. I love the rest of the song too, but that would just be an EPIC instrumental.
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I haven't posted any, but I've been following this thread on and off since the start. It's been a lot of fun to read and has increased my interest in Yes, thanks for doing it, Orbert! :tup
You're welcome.
(I feel kinda silly responding to each, but it would be rude otherwise.)
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Even though I do enjoy it enough to include in my personal Yes Discography, I don't really listen to it much. From 90125 to Talk, there's a peak of uninterest with ABWH that then goes back down as we approach Talk.
90125 > BG > ABWH < Union < Talk (< Keystudio)
There's a few MOMENTS on the album that I enjoy, but I've really not listened to it enough to really have a good grasp on every part of it. I should really revisit it sometime soon. I may go on a Yes-binge in the coming weeks as my Rush-binge is slowly slowing down (which I have been on since the beginning of June).
-Marc.
So I have been on a HUUUUUGE Yes binge lately, listening to ALL of their albums at some point in the last 4 weeks, and I came to revisit this album earlier this week as I've jumped around the band's discography.
I'll have to say, I don't think I rate ABWH as low as I used to. There's some pretty good material on there, and I think I quite enjoy it a bit more now, even with the unusual "Teakbois". It's on par with the likes of BG, Union and Talk, but still not as great as 90125 (which I still hold pretty highly).
I also threw in "Vultures In The City", a single B-Side from the ABWH sessions, into my iPod playlist and shuffled around the songs a bit.
Themes
Fist Of Fire
Vultures In The City
Brother Of Mine
Birthright
Quartet
Teakbois
The Meeting
Order Of The Universe
Let's Pretend
I separated them as a mock-vinyl track list, where each side is about 15-17 minutes long. It's a good 65 minutes of music, and not as horrible as I recall. I think I shall enjoy it more and more as time goes by.
-Marc.
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I think with a lot of the later stuff, if it's perceived as weaker than earlier Yes or Yes from the main sequence, it's because of what's missing, not because of what it is. With the 80's stuff, a lot of Yesfans complained that it just wasn't the same without Steve and/or Rick. Drama wasn't Yes because Jon wasn't there. The Ladder wasn't great without Rick. And so on.
With ABWH, we realized how important Chris Squire is to the Yes sound, because he's not there. Without his bi-amped "lead bass" filling the bottom end, it comes across as "Yes lite". But as time goes by, and more perspective is gained, ABWH doesn't stick out so badly. It's just another version of Yes, another lineup variation.
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I think with a lot of the later stuff, if it's perceived as weaker than earlier Yes or Yes from the main sequence, it's because of what's missing, not because of what it is. With the 80's stuff, a lot of Yesfans complained that it just wasn't the same without Steve and/or Rick. Drama wasn't Yes because Jon wasn't there. The Ladder wasn't great without Rick. And so on.
With ABWH, we realized how important Chris Squire is to the Yes sound, because he's not there. Without his bi-amped "lead bass" filling the bottom end, it comes across as "Yes lite". But as time goes by, and more perspective is gained, ABWH doesn't stick out so badly. It's just another version of Yes, another lineup variation.
Good point - especially about how the absence of Squire can be felt/heard in ABWH. In that regard, even Union is more Yes than ABWH was, despite having the return of Bruford, Wakeman and Howe. And really, it was as far from the same band that made Fragile/Close To The Edge as the Rabin-led Yes was from any other version of Yes prior to 1981. But you're right, it was just another version/variation of Yes, whether or not people count it as such - but Jon wanted to make new Yes music, with 3 other former Yes members, so it's more Yes than some might think the Rabin-led Yes was, even though that band had Squire and White, as well as Kaye (a former Yesman). Both versions of Yes had 4 members of Yes who were previously Yesmen prior to 1981, so really, by members alone, both were equally Yes!
-Marc.
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Hard to believe this thread was done over 2 1/2 years ago :eek :eek :eek, but it was cool to read through it in one shot given what happened earlier this week.
Orbert, once again, great job! :hat
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Thanks. I've actually been meaning to come back to this thread and add the latest studio album Heaven and Earth, and also at least attempt to cover Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two.
I noticed that all of the images were gone, as they were "hosted" on Facebook. Facebook likes to rotate the links and addresses, probably just so people don't do exactly what I did. I've re-downloaded all of them and re-uploaded them to imgur, and am in the process of updating all the links. Quite a task, but I'm working my way through it. Once that's done, I'll add the next couple of entries.
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Sweet! More Yes discussion is alway good. :hat
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Okay, the images are all live now; no more broken links. That's particularly important with Yes because their album covers are legendary.
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True that man.
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I think the Relayer and Tales covers are the most visually striking, with Close to the Edge just a hair behind them. I remember the first time listening to the title track of Close to the Edge and thinking that the intro went so well with the cover.
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(Not the cover, the inner gatefold. Unless you really mean the plain green cover.)
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You are correct, sir. :hat
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So, I've listened to a ton of Yes this week, and it's still hard for me to rank the least best albums in any order since they all kind of bunch together down there, but my updated top 10 looks like this:
1. Close to the Edge
2. Fragile
3. The Yes Album
4. Relayer
5. Talk
6. 90125
7. Tales from Topographic Oceans
8. Big Generator
9. Drama
10. Going for the One
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Hard to argue with that. Mine's different, of course, but every one of those albums is great.
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For sure. Some new random thoughts:
-I still can't get over what a train wreck The Ancient is. As great as the last six minutes are, the first 12 are a total mess. I am glad I used Audacity to make the Leaves of Green its own song so I can put that mp3 on my ultimate Yes CD for the car.
-Fragile features arguably the greatest bass playing collectively ever heard on a rock record.
-I still like The Ladder more than most, but not as much as I used to. I still like all of it, except for If Only You Knew, but Homeworld, The Messenger and Nine Voices are the only songs I am going for from it when randomly playing Yes.
-The overall sound of Going for the One is still irksome. Where is the low end?? I'd probably like Awaken a lot more if the studio version wasn't so emasculated by the sound of that record.
-Top 3 Yes songs are probably And You and I, Starship Trooper and Gates of Delirium.
-It is still a shame that Trevor Rabin and Rick Wakeman never got to work together on a Yes record.
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GFTO has been my favorite Yes album for a long time...but I was trying to crank it for my son the other day, and it really stuck out at me for the first time just how BAD that album sounds. I thought it was just a cheap vinyl pressing problem when I first heard the album...but listening to the CD for a first time in awhile made me realize that it's really just a fault of production. Not only is there no low end, but the high end is piercing and Howe's guitar has an awful "clanging" quality to it. The music is among the best they ever wrote in their history...but it's truly an awful recording.
I wonder if SW is going to do a total remix, and if so, will he be able to re-EQ it as well?
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I would love a complete remix. I really want to listen to GFTO more and hear what you guys praise about it, but it's one of the few albums that is made unlistenable for me by the production. It's so piercing.
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I actually haven't listened to all of them, I skipped the 80s Yes as well as some 90s material. From what I've heard, the top 10 would probably look something like this:
1. Close to the edge
2. Fragile
3. Relayer
4. Drama
5. Tales from topographic oceans
6. The Ladder
7. The Yes album
8. Magnification
9. Going for the one
10. Fly from here
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I would love a complete remix. I really want to listen to GFTO more and hear what you guys praise about it, but it's one of the few albums that is made unlistenable for me by the production. It's so piercing.
I actually tried listening to that CD the other day and stopped about halfway through for that very reason.
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I'd be curious as to what fans think is the best live version of Awaken. I tried giving the Keys version a whirl, but it was pretty painful and I had to shut it off after six minutes. Jon Anderson really struggled with the singing, and some of the musical transitions were really clunky, almost like the music dipped down for a second or two while whoever was taking the lead had to remember what to play next Very bizarre.
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Heaven & Earth (2014)
(https://i.imgur.com/ugW3Qah.png)
Jon Davison - Vocals, Acoustic Guitar
Geoff Downes - Keyboards
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Alan White - Drums
Believe Again (Davison, Howe) 8:02
The Game (Squire, Davison, Johnson) 6:51
Step Beyond (Howe, Davison) 5:34
To Ascend (Davison, White) 4:43
In a World of Our Own (Davison, Squire) 5:20
Light of the Ages (Davison) 7:41
It Was All We Knew (Howe) 4:13
Subway Walls (Davison, Downes) 9:03
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Touring for the 2011 album Fly From Here was interrupted when lead singer Benoit David contracted a respiratory infection. In January 2012, Chris Squire announced that he had been replaced by Jon Davison, lead singer from Glass Hammer. In typical Yes fashion, the transition was handled poorly, with Benoit only finding out that he had been replaced when he heard the interview with Chris on the radio. Jon Davison was recommended to Chris via a mutual friend, drummer Taylor Hawkins of Foo Fighters. Jon was brought up to speed, Yes completed the tour with Jon, and he has been the lead singer ever since.
In 2013, Yes was one of the key bands featured on the "Cruise to the Edge" series, a cooperative endeavor between Norwegian Cruise Lines and Yes, along with several other prog bands. The 2013 setlist included the albums Close to the Edge and The Yes Album, each played in their entirety and in original track order. They followed this with the "Three Album Tour", adding the album Going for the One also played in its entirety and in order.
In early 2014, Yes announced that they were back in the studio working on a new album, and Heaven and Earth was released in July 2014.
I'll be blunt: I struggle to get through this album. It all sounds great; production values are terrific, there's none of the horrible compression and artificial loudness which plagues most modern recordings, and the playing is all excellent. Jon Davison sounds very much like Jon Anderson did in the 70's, with just a bit of Trevor Horn, and his voice blends with Chris Squire's and Steve Howe's very nicely. But this is easily the most boring, the most bland Yes album of all. Open Your Eyes doesn't have the fire of 70's Yes, but even though the songs are all pretty standard, almost pop songs, they're delivered with an energy and fire. Steve Howe is in full form. Alan White has to be held back. Chris Squire owns the lower end, as always. Magnification is mellow, but it's different, the arrangements are inspired, and the orchestra adds some punch.
Here, despite the core of Howe, Squire, and White, along with now-veteran Geoff Downes on keys, there's none of the fire. The band doesn't sound tired; they just sound like they're content to play adult contemporary "light rock" now. Lots of Jon Davison's acoustic strumming, lots of the trademark Yes three-part vocal harmonies. It sounds great. And I'm sorry, but it's really, really boring.
This is particularly disappointing because the band had spent most of the past two years playing Yes albums from the 70's in their entirety, and many had hoped that the new album would reflect some of the "old Yes". The adventure, the energy, the prog. The band was quoted throughout the process, saying how exciting it was to be recording new music, especially with Jon, who is a gifted song writer. His former band Glass Hammer is often cited as one of the better, more underrated new prog bands. Jon Davison wrote or co-wrote seven of the eight tracks here.
The longer track times seem to hint that the songs at least go through a few changes, maybe even a few instrumental passages. This is Yes, after all. Instead, the songs are longer because they simply going on forever, repeating their wonderful choruses over and over again. There are no genuine uptempo tracks. Everything is medium-tempo and mellow. The closest thing to an actual, catchy song is probably "Step Beyond", which has a bouncing, lilting synth hook throughout. I personally find it kind of catchy, but a lot of Yesfans find it annoying after a while. "In a World of Our Own" starts off with a drum pattern with kicks and rim shots, and goes into a shuffle reminiscent of the acoustic version of "Roundabout" (if you've never heard it, well, you're not really missing anything), but the song itself never goes anywhere. That's it. It's a shuffle. Variety!
The final track, "Subway Walls" is the strongest track and the only track even approaching prog. It starts promisingly, with a keyboard orchestral section (think "Man in a White Car" from Drama, only more developed) and goes into a reasonably interesting song complete with a breakdown in some crazy time signature. But it turns out that it's just 4/4 with some syncopation, a bit repetitive, and overall not nearly as clever as you'd first thought. Then it comes back to the song and finishes up. And that's the end of the album.
If "Subway Walls" had been the first track rather than the last, the album as a whole might have worked better. It would have set the tone much better. Grab people with the best track, one that eases you into the fact that this is an older, mellower Yes. Instead, you sit through seven pretty bland tracks, and the payoff is minimal.
As I've said before, it's not that prog = good and pop = bad. It's that this is Yes, and there is a certain expectation from musicians and songwriters of this caliber. Especially when they talked about how the band has been "revitalized" by the new singer and how "exciting" this new music is. When I hear this music and picture them playing it, I literally imagine a bunch of old men sitting on someone's porch in rocking chairs, strumming guitars and singing in nice, three-part harmony. Alan is nearby, beating on some boxes with his drum sticks, and Geoff, inexplicably, has seven or eight keyboards all plugged in somewhere, even though they all sound the same.
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I struggled to write this, just as I struggled to get through the album. I struggled to find anything positive to say about it, other than that it sounds really great. But I felt like I'd started this whole thing rolling, The Yes Discography, and that meant an implied obligation to continue it when more albums came out. This is a Yes album, their twenty-first studio album. I bought it on release day, so excited to have new Yes. And even if I wasn't expecting another Close to the Edge, I was not expecting... this. I want to say that they sound tired, but that's not it at all. They don't sound tired; they sound like this slow, mellow stuff is exactly what they want it to be. This is the album they wanted to make. If, back in the 70's, you'd been asked to imagine what they would sound like 30-some years later, if they were still around, I suppose you might guess it would sound like this. They've slowed down. This is what's comfortable to them now.
And of course, Chris Squire died of leukemia on June 27, 2015. His condition had only been announced to the public on May 19, so even if it was not entirely surprising, it was still a shock to many. Longtime collaborator and former Yesman Billy Sherwood was Chris' choice to replace him for the upcoming tour, which begins on August 7 of this year. It will be the first time Yes has taken the stage without Chris Squire, and Chris is the only person to have played on all 21 Yes studio albums.
At this time, the future of Yes is uncertain. They will likely make a decision following the upcoming tour.
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Sadly, my opinion on Heaven And Earth hasn't changed. It is, to me, one of the most boring albums they've ever released, (and may very well be the most boring) and that saddens me because I quite liked Fly From Here. There's some good moments in Believe Again and Subway Walls, and I have trouble just remembering those. At its best (and especially with Jon Davison singing), it sounds like a recent Glass Hammer album, who themselves always seem to be trying to be Yes but come off as a much weaker version. Basically, on Heaven And Earth, Yes sound like a lite imitation of themselves. The comparison is so strong to me that I wonder how much of an influence Davison had in writing this. He's not the leader of Glass Hammer by any stretch, but still.
And like you said, it sounds good. The production is great. And you have the nice Roger Dean album art with the traditional Yes logo and everything. It's just sad to me that this might be what they go out on if Chris Squire's death causes them to retire the band after the current tour.
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I really need to read this thread from the top. 2,5 years ago I wasn't into Yes at all, but now they're among my favorite bands of all time. Should be an interesting thread!
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I'll try to listen to this album again one of these days, but I find it very confusing. None of it is bad - the songs are melodic, fairly memorable, there isn't a single song I would call terrible. It's just that the overall sound and mood of the album is too light, silent, calm, there's no punch, no energy, and therefore it can get kind of boring, unexciting and underwhelming. Nothing about it really grabs me.
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At its best (and especially with Jon Davison singing), it sounds like a recent Glass Hammer album, who themselves always seem to be trying to be Yes but come off as a much weaker version. Basically, on Heaven And Earth, Yes sound like a lite imitation of themselves. The comparison is so strong to me that I wonder how much of an influence Davison had in writing this. He's not the leader of Glass Hammer by any stretch, but still.
Davison's mark is all over this album. He has sole writing credit on one song and co-credit on six of the other seven. Steve and Chris, along with Alan, have been the core of Yes for a while now, but none of them are strong or prolific songwriters. They all have been parts of great collaborations, with each other and with Jon Anderson, but each of them seems to need to the others to really come up with something great. Chris was quoted many times saying that one of the reasons why they were so excited to be working on a new album was because Jon Davison is a songwriter. Benoit David is not, and that's the main reason why they brought in Trevor Horn and eventually Geoff Downes on Fly From Here.
There is definitely something exciting about a new musical collaboration, and I'm sure the guys weren't kidding or embellishing when they talked about how great it was to be working on new songs. But I wonder how much of that was simply because they knew that they themselves needed that spark to get things going, and they never realized how bland and homogeneous the results were. "Exciting" is not a word I would use to describe this album, ever.
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Have I missed the Progeny discussion? Only had time to listen to the first three shows but I'm so glad I finally got around to picking this up.
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It's coming. I'm still trying to figure out how it'll work, and listening more. I've completed three listens to the whole thing, and have done some jumping around as well. Obviously, there's a lot to digest.
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I actually haven't listened to all of them, I skipped the 80s Yes as well as some 90s material. From what I've heard, the top 10 would probably look something like this:
1. Close to the edge
2. Fragile
3. Relayer
4. Drama
5. Tales from topographic oceans
6. The Ladder
7. The Yes album
8. Magnification
9. Going for the one
10. Fly from here
Time for an update. I revisited several albums I wasn't that sure about, and I also went for it and decided to finally check out the streak of albums I hadn't heard before - 90125 up to and including Open your eyes. That however excludes the Keys albums as well as AWBH. My updated ranking would look like this:
1. Close to the edge
2. Fragile
3. Relayer
4. Drama
5. Tales from topographic oceans
6. The Ladder
7. The Yes album
8. Fly from here
9. Talk
10. 90125
11. Big generator
12. Magnification
13. Going for the one
14. Heaven and earth
15. Tormato
16. Time And A Word
17. Open your eyes
18. Union
19. Yes
I was pleasantly surprised by the Rabin era stuff. Talk was particularly interesting, especially the first three songs which are all tremendous. 90125 has its share of catchy tunes, and so does Big generator - I found the two albums almost just as good. Open your eyes was filled with average songs, although the first two tracks are pretty rocking. Union is a mess and not a single song REALLY stood out.
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It's coming. I'm still trying to figure out how it'll work, and listening more. I've completed three listens to the whole thing, and have done some jumping around as well. Obviously, there's a lot to digest.
Could do each of the seven shows and how they compare with each other or pick the best performance of each track in the set. i still have the last three shows to go myself. I've been savoring them.
I love this release so much more than Yessongs. Yessongs turned me off to live Yes for the longest time.
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I can't do the shows individually. There just isn't enough time for me to listen to all seven shows enough times to know the individual differences and subtleties between them. Every time I go through them, there are different things that catch my attention, as the shows are actually more different from each other than one might think, but I still haven't gotten to the point where I can pick a favorite show, or a favorite version of "Close to the Edge", or anything like that. Not even close. If I had 30 more hours, I could get to that point, but I just don't have that kind of time to devote to a single album.
I thought about this again just the other day. I think I'm just gonna go with some overall impressions and comments, and let others comment as well.
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Slightly off-topic… Are you planning on going to see Jean Luc Ponty and Jon Anderson when they come to the Chicago area?
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No. I don't really go to concerts any more.
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No. I don't really go to concerts any more.
I usually don't either.... No time or money. Tickets plus fees plus babysitter = dent in paycheck
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1. Going For The One
2. The Yes Album
3. Drama
4. Fragile
5. Tales from Topographic Oceans
6. Big Penetrator
7. Fly From Here
8. Talk
9. 90210
10. Close To The Edge
11. Tormato
12. Magnification
13. Relayer
14. Time And A Word
15. Union
16. Yes
17. Heaven And Earth
18. The Ladder
19. Open Your Eyes
GFTO is my favorite album of all time by any band, so...
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Yes lost me after the departure of Jon Anderson. The replacement singers are uninspired and mediocre at best. I miss the Trevor Rabin era a lot, TALK being a brilliant album along with Big Generator and 90215. Union is a great album with all the members! I still followed Yes closely after the departure of Trevor Rabin, but after Jon Anderson was gone I had to draw the line. Yes is not Yes without Jon Anderson and Chris Squire..
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10. Close To The Edge
I don't think I've ever seen this before.
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10. Close To The Edge
I don't think I've ever seen this before.
Me neither.
But hey, opinions.
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Yes lost me after the departure of Jon Anderson. The replacement singers are uninspired and mediocre at best. I miss the Trevor Rabin era a lot, TALK being a brilliant album along with Big Generator and 90215. Union is a great album with all the members! I still followed Yes closely after the departure of Trevor Rabin, but after Jon Anderson was gone I had to draw the line. Yes is not Yes without Jon Anderson and Chris Squire..
Honestly...Fly From Here is actually not bad. The title track epic and the album closer are both amazing. The middle songs are up and down, but still... I always say that if you like more than half the music from an album, then it's worth the price of purchase.
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10. Close To The Edge
I don't think I've ever seen this before.
Me neither.
But hey, opinions.
Well, I understand that, and don't get me wrong, it is a classic album ("And You And I" is a top five Yes song for me) but I just don't find myself going for it very often. I've already said GFTO is No. 1, but I listen to everything in the Top Five often. To be fair, you could probably put 6 though 10 in a hat, and pull them out at random and I'd live with the order, but still. It's a great album that doesn't move me as much as the rest.
Now, if I was doing an "objective", Five Best Yes Albums list:
1. Close To The Edge
2. The Yes Album
3. 90210
4. Fragile
5. Going For The One
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Yes lost me after the departure of Jon Anderson. The replacement singers are uninspired and mediocre at best. I miss the Trevor Rabin era a lot, TALK being a brilliant album along with Big Generator and 90215. Union is a great album with all the members! I still followed Yes closely after the departure of Trevor Rabin, but after Jon Anderson was gone I had to draw the line. Yes is not Yes without Jon Anderson and Chris Squire..
They lost me live just before he left. What was that 2004? 2005? The last tour I can say I enjoyed was the Masterworks Tour.
Have to say that Jon Davidson does a really good job based on what I've seen on you tube. It's the rest of them I don't care for live at this point.
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Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
(https://i.imgur.com/dKueVLA.png)
Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums
Opening (Excerpt from "Firebird Suite") / Siberian Khatru
I've Seen All Good People
Your Move
All Good People
Mood for a Day / Clap
Heart of the Sunrise
And You And I
Cord of Life
Eclipse
The Preacher The Teacher
Apocalypse
Close to the Edge
The Solid Time of Change
Total Mass Retain
I Get Up, I Get Down
Seasons of Man
Excerpts from "The Six Wives of Henry VIII"
Roundabout
Yours is No Disgrace
October 31, Maple Leaf Gardens Toronto, Ontario
November 1, Ottawa Civic Centre Ottawa, Ontario
November 11, Duke University, Durham North Carolina
November 12, Greensboro Coliseum Greensboro, North Carolina
November 14, University Of Georgia Athens, Georgia
November 15, Knoxville Civic Coliseum Knoxville, Tennessee
November 20, Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum Uniondale, New York
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While searching the vaults for potential bonus material to include on the reissues of Yes' back catalogue, a discovery was made: Eight complete shows from the 1972 Close to the Edge tour. Soundboard recordings, apparently untouched for decades. It turned out that one of the shows had been damaged, but the seven remaining shows were meticulously restored and remastered from the original two-inch, 16-track recordings. The result is a massive 14-CD collection known as Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two.
This was an important discovery for multiple reasons. For one, the long-time standard by which all other Yes live recordings are measured, Yessongs, is known for both its incredible performances and its subpar sound quality. As these tapes would soon reveal themselves to be the original sources for much of Yessongs, the thought of correcting the sound quality after all these years was intriguing at the very least.
Another reason was that these recordings were all from early in the tour. Bill Bruford had left the band shortly after production of Close of the Edge was complete, before the tour began. This gives listeners the opportunity to observe the evolution of the live versions of these classic tracks, and how quickly Alan White filled Bruford's position and has made it his own for the next 40+ years.
And finally, while many fans agree that Yes studio albums are often perfect or near-perfect, most do not realize how much improvisation was part of the early Yes experience. The differences between the live versions on Yessongs and the original studio recordings are well-known; what is not so well-known is that many of them are different because they were improvised every night.
We have here seven shows, each with the same set list. Steve Howe's medley/mashup of "Clap" and "Mood for a Day" is different every time. Similarly, Rick Wakeman's "Excerpts from 'The Six Wives of Henry VIII'" is different every time. The intro jam to "Yours is No Disgrace" is very different every time, and so are Steve Howe's solos. The same with Rick Wakeman's phenomenal B-3 solo in "Close to the Edge". Every one is different.
I was skeptical at first. I had always assumed that with songs so complex and intricate, everything had to be carefully worked out. You can't play music like this and leave solo sections open-ended; the band has to know when to go into the next part of the song. And with that (incorrect) assumption in mind, I had my doubts as to how different these shows would be.
My eyes and ears were opened. These shows are a revelation. Every one is different. Not every bit of every song, no, nothing like that. But for those who are familiar with the songs, there is something different in every performance here. All those little licks and fills that Howe does during songs are different every time. Jon's vocal deliveries vary more than one might think. And so on.
I'm not going to evaluate each show individually. I've listened through the entire collection four times now, and I don't think I'll be doing any more full listens. Obviously it's very time-consuming, but mostly it's just exhausting. I can identify specific things from specific shows which make it stand out, but it would take at least a few more listens before I could rank the shows or judge them individually, and I'm not sure that there would be any point. You are either a big enough Yesfan and/or have the means to purchase this set, or not. And if you do, you're going to listen to it all anyway, and come to your own conclusions.
The first thing that strikes you is how incredibly clear everything sounds. For most of us, this might be partly because we've been listening to Yessongs for 40 years and have become accustomed to the "muddy" sound of it. The Dolby was miscalibrated at an early stage, and correcting this by going back to the original multitracks was impossible until now. We listened "through" the mud to hear the sound of a young band on fire.
The idea here was to clean up the tapes and present the shows "warts and all" as much as possible. You are there, at that venue, that evening. So when a local radio station starts coming through Wakeman's keyboard rig during one of his "Six Wives" solos, you hear it. Jon rambles on in his unique way while guitars are being tuned. There are occassional flub-ups. The band does get out of sync a few times. This is very complex music and the drummer just joined the band a few weeks ago. But that's part of the attraction. You know that this is how it sounded that night.
The one exception is that some of Chris Squire's bass work has been doctored a bit. They ran it through some extra processing to get Squire's characteristic sound, as the original soundboard tapes had not captured enough to work with.
As a keyboard player, I found it particularly satisfying how well you can finally hear Wakeman. He, like the rest of the band, is on fire, and you can finally hear him.
Another thing worth noting is that some of Yessongs came from the Fragile tour and those tapes are not included here. It is therefore not possible create a "new, clean-sounding" version of Yessongs, as many fans would almost certainly do. It turns out that all the original Yessongs tracks from the Close to the Edge tour are here, but the Fragile tour tapes have yet to be found, if they still exist.
The Packaging is, of course, completely ridiculous.
(https://i.imgur.com/OB4dAqH.png)
Seven shows, each in its own double-CD slipcase, plus the booklet, all in a box. Each show has its own unique cover and disc art, new and/or unreleased Roger Dean art from the Yessongs period.
(https://i.imgur.com/fKAEgEi.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/5VuLZKh.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/2wejxhI.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/W7IMkvh.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/BeRN5vv.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/2l1JP6F.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/K5KCr6q.jpg)
(Click each to biggify)
Obviously, this is a set for hardcore completists only. For those who aren't up to purchasing the entire box, Rhino has also prepared
Progeny: Highlights from Seventy-Two
(https://i.imgur.com/viFI0g5.png)
Here we have a two-disc set with "the best" version of each song from the original seven shows, a representative ideal show. Who decided this and how is available somewhere on the Internet, I'm sure. I've heard only positive comments about the "Highlights" set, just as I've heard only positive about the full set (other than the price).
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Interesting. When I heard about this I was pretty skeptical. 7 shows from the same tour with the same setlist? That sounds way too exhaustive for a casual Yes fan like me. But I wasn't aware of the improv, that sounds cool. Might check out at least one of these shows. :tup
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I have friends who are serious Deadheads. They collect bootlegs of The Grateful Dead, make copies for each other, etc. I know the Dead have a huge improvisational component to their music, and I guess that makes sense, but I could never understand how they could listen to countless shows, hundreds or even thousands of them, over and over. And then discuss them with each other, argue about which take of a particular song was better, this venue this night in '73, or this other venue this one night in '75, or whatever.
I picked up the remastered version of Chicago at Carnegie Hall when it came out. Having grown up with the original 4-LP version (it was actually my very first album), I knew every note of every song. The remastered version fit the original four LPs onto three CDs, and included a fourth CD of "alternate takes". Performances of "Sing a Mean Tune, Kid" and "South California Purples" and others from different nights, as Chicago had played Carnegie Hall the entire week. The two songs I mentioned have extended, eight to 10 minute jazz improvs, and they were different every night. I had no idea how different until I heard the alternate takes. Suddenly, I wanted to hear all of them. If they were this different from each other, then it stands to reason that the others were all just as different (which isn't necessarily true, I realized later; it could also be that these alternates were chosen specifically because of how different they were from the ones originally included, and the others were all somewhere in between). But then I understood the deal with the Deadheads. Every night was a unique show. Every one had something different to offer. And if you love the music, as I do, you want to experience every one of them.
That's how I feel about this collection of Yes concerts. There aren't huge 10-minute jams which were different every time, but there is a surprising amount of difference between performances even from one night to the next. The crowd is always different. The technical challenges are always different. But most importantly, the solos are always different, and that's what I love to hear. Sure, there are similarities, certain riffs show up in various forms in different spots. But overall, for diehard Yesfans, this is a treasure trove. All we need now is a similar set of unearthed Fragile concerts. And a complete Tales from Topographic Oceans. And Relayer. And Going for the One...
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Wow, that sounds crazy.
I would love to have this. However, I doubt that I have the money or time required.
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I was skeptical too. Favorited it on spotify, and it's been one of the things by Yes that I listen most to. I really love the honest sound, the way things can go wrong, and the fact that they sometimes do. Great set, would love to buy it once. When it get's a tad cheaper :biggrin:
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Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two (2015)
(https://i.imgur.com/dKueVLA.png)
Jon Anderson - Lead Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitars, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Rick Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums
Opening (Excerpt from "Firebird Suite") / Siberian Khatru
I've Seen All Good People
Your Move
All Good People
Mood for a Day / Clap
Heart of the Sunrise
And You And I
Cord of Life
Eclipse
The Preacher The Teacher
Apocalypse
Close to the Edge
The Solid Time of Change
Total Mass Retain
I Get Up, I Get Down
Seasons of Man
Excerpts from "The Six Wives of Henry VIII"
Roundabout
Yours is No Disgrace
October 31, Maple Leaf Gardens Toronto, Ontario
November 1, Ottawa Civic Centre Ottawa, Ontario
November 11, Duke University, Durham North Carolina
November 12, Greensboro Coliseum Greensboro, North Carolina
November 14, University Of Georgia Athens, Georgia
November 15, Knoxville Civic Coliseum Knoxville, Tennessee
November 20, Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum Uniondale, New York
----------
While searching the vaults for potential bonus material to include on the reissues of Yes' back catalogue, a discovery was made: Eight complete shows from the 1972 Close to the Edge tour. Soundboard recordings, apparently untouched for decades. It turned out that one of the shows had been damaged, but the seven remaining shows were meticulously restored and remastered from the original two-inch, 16-track recordings. The result is a massive 14-CD collection known as Progeny: Seven Shows from Seventy-Two.
This was an important discovery for multiple reasons. For one, the long-time standard by which all other Yes live recordings are measured, Yessongs, is known for both its incredible performances and its subpar sound quality. As these tapes would soon reveal themselves to be the original sources for much of Yessongs, the thought of correcting the sound quality after all these years was intriguing at the very least.
Another reason was that these recordings were all from early in the tour. Bill Bruford had left the band shortly after production of Close of the Edge was complete, before the tour began. This gives listeners the opportunity to observe the evolution of the live versions of these classic tracks, and how quickly Alan White filled Bruford's position and has made it his own for the next 40+ years.
And finally, while many fans agree that Yes studio albums are often perfect or near-perfect, most do not realize how much improvisation was part of the early Yes experience. The differences between the live versions on Yessongs and the original studio recordings are well-known; what is not so well-known is that many of them are different because they were improvised every night.
We have here seven shows, each with the same set list. Steve Howe's medley/mashup of "Clap" and "Mood for a Day" is different every time. Similarly, Rick Wakeman's "Excerpts from 'The Six Wives of Henry VIII'" is different every time. The intro jam to "Yours is No Disgrace" is very different every time, and so are Steve Howe's solos. The same with Rick Wakeman's phenomenal B-3 solo in "Close to the Edge". Every one is different.
I was skeptical at first. I had always assumed that with songs so complex and intricate, everything had to be carefully worked out. You can't play music like this and leave solo sections open-ended; the band has to know when to go into the next part of the song. And with that (incorrect) assumption in mind, I had my doubts as to how different these shows would be.
My eyes and ears were opened. These shows are a revelation. Every one is different. Not every bit of every song, no, nothing like that. But for those who are familiar with the songs, there is something different in every performance here. All those little licks and fills that Howe does during songs are different every time. Jon's vocal deliveries vary more than one might think. And so on.
I'm not going to evaluate each show individually. I've listened through the entire collection four times now, and I don't think I'll be doing any more full listens. Obviously it's very time-consuming, but mostly it's just exhausting. I can identify specific things from specific shows which make it stand out, but it would take at least a few more listens before I could rank the shows or judge them individually, and I'm not sure that there would be any point. You are either a big enough Yesfan and/or have the means to purchase this set, or not. And if you do, you're going to listen to it all anyway, and come to your own conclusions.
The first thing that strikes you is how incredibly clear everything sounds. For most of us, this might be partly because we've been listening to Yessongs for 40 years and have become accustomed to the "muddy" sound of it. The Dolby was miscalibrated at an early stage, and correcting this by going back to the original multitracks was impossible until now. We listened "through" the mud to hear the sound of a young band on fire.
The idea here was to clean up the tapes and present the shows "warts and all" as much as possible. You are there, at that venue, that evening. So when a local radio station starts coming through Wakeman's keyboard rig during one of his "Six Wives" solos, you hear it. Jon rambles on in his unique way while guitars are being tuned. There are occassional flub-ups. The band does get out of sync a few times. This is very complex music and the drummer just joined the band a few weeks ago. But that's part of the attraction. You know that this is how it sounded that night.
The one exception is that some of Chris Squire's bass work has been doctored a bit. They ran it through some extra processing to get Squire's characteristic sound, as the original soundboard tapes had not captured enough to work with.
As a keyboard player, I found it particularly satisfying how well you can finally hear Wakeman. He, like the rest of the band, is on fire, and you can finally hear him.
Another thing worth noting is that some of Yessongs came from the Fragile tour and those tapes are not included here. It is therefore not possible create a "new, clean-sounding" version of Yessongs, as many fans would almost certainly do. It turns out that all the original Yessongs tracks from the Close to the Edge tour are here, but the Fragile tour tapes have yet to be found, if they still exist.
The Packaging is, of course, completely ridiculous.
(https://i.imgur.com/OB4dAqH.png)
Seven shows, each in its own double-CD slipcase, plus the booklet, all in a box. Each show has its own unique cover and disc art, new and/or unreleased Roger Dean art from the Yessongs period.
(https://i.imgur.com/fKAEgEi.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/5VuLZKh.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/2wejxhI.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/W7IMkvh.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/BeRN5vv.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/2l1JP6F.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/K5KCr6q.jpg)
(Click each to biggify)
Obviously, this is a set for hardcore completists only. For those who aren't up to purchasing the entire box, Rhino has also prepared
Progeny: Highlights from Seventy-Two
(https://i.imgur.com/viFI0g5.png)
Here we have a two-disc set with "the best" version of each song from the original seven shows, a representative ideal show. Who decided this and how is available somewhere on the Internet, I'm sure. I've heard only positive comments about the "Highlights" set, just as I've heard only positive about the full set (other than the price).
Glad you finally got to this. It's easily the best live Yes collection I own.
Totally changed my mind about '70's live Yes. Yessongs never did it for me because of the way it sounded to me.
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I was fortunate to get into Yessongs back when all I had was a cheesy portable stereo. I say that this was fortunate because it was a given that the sound wouldn't be great, and this was also in the early years of my record collection, so I had very little basis for comparison. Instead, I enjoyed the performances, and the sound quality didn't bother me. It was only after years of listening to many other live albums that I realized that the sound of Yessongs was really pretty bad.
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I saw the Progeny box set a while ago in a local music store and I was really surprised to see it. Anyone who buys it must truly be a hardcore fan.
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I saw the Progeny box set a while ago in a local music store and I was really surprised to see it. Anyone who buys it must truly be a hardcore fan.
I'm far from the greatest Yes fan there is, but I really like the idea of the boxset. Hearing the subtle differences in shows and improvisations is like a treasure hunt. Too bad the boxset is 100 euros, if I one day see it a tad cheaper I'll buy it. Maybe second hand one day.
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Top 5 Yes albums IMHO:
1- Close to the edge
2. Fragile
3- The Yes album
4- Going for the one
5- Keystudio
Honorable mention:
6- The ladder
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Top 5 Yes albums IMHO:
1- Close to the edge
2. Fragile
3- The Yes album
4- Going for the one
5- Keystudio
Honorable mention:
6- The ladder
Nice to see someone give the Keys material a mention! It's highly underrated, IMO, though some might say the classic line-up kind of over-hyped the material. I think those folks were expecting too much from the line-up that made TFTO and GFTO (because you have to recall, they also gave us Tormato).
The Ladder is a great album, too, with some nice songs and moments in there. Definitely better than the albums that surround it.
-Marc.
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Talk is better than both, IMO, but The Ladder is good (not as great as I once thought, but I still like it), and the Keys songs are mostly good (Be the One and That, That Is have some weird, awkward melodies, but all of the songs from Keys 2 are quite good).
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Talk is better than both, IMO, but The Ladder is good (not as great as I once thought, but I still like it), and the Keys songs are mostly good (Be the One and That, That Is have some weird, awkward melodies, but all of the songs from Keys 2 are quite good).
Talk is, in my view, the most underrated of all Yes albums. If you isolate the Rabin albums (and by that I include the "YesWest" songs from Union) the level of accomplishment of that material is rather consistent. I guess if you don't like it, it is consistently "crap", but I happen to really dig Rabin (especially his voice), so for me, that is three and a half albums of just top notch material. The Anderson material that doesn't have Rabin is (for me) rather patchwork starting with ABWH. "Open Your Eyes" is easily my least favorite Yes album, and the Ladder isn't far off that. Even the Keys material is musically good, but gets ruined by Anderson's hipster "Janie's on crack time!" lyrics, and usually lyrics don't bug me at all (I like Kiss, after all).
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I agree with pretty much all of this, with one important difference. As much as I can admire Trevor Rabin's talent, in writing, arranging, playing, producing, basically everything, a lot of that admiration came later, and there is still something deep down about him that bugs me. I can't pin down what it is. I like 90125, and I like Big Generator. I didn't pick up Big Generator until later, though, because of various circumstances, and it took a while to get into it. This was a very different Yes. I didn't simply write them off because of the lack of both Steve Howe or Rick Wakeman or both, as many did, but there's no denying that there are some elements of "the Yes sound" which aren't here. Steve Howe called it Yessishness, which is a silly word, but somehow I know exactly what it means, just as I can never know what it is about Trevor Rabin that bugs me.
Talk is by Trevor's band, and in my head in parentheses the name of Trevor's band is Cinema. A very good band, really. I picked up Talk much later, again because of circumstances, and it's great, probably the best of the three. But then Trevor sings, and it's not Yes, it's Cinema. It doesn't have to be Jon Anderson. Trevor Horn, Benoit David, and Jon Davison all have Yessish voices. Somehow Trevor Rabin does not. His is simultaneously a voice I like, and one which bugs me. Hey, I think I just figured out what bugs me about Trevor Rabin.
Anyway, I also agree about "crack time". I cringe (or at least mini-cringe inwardly) every time I hear that line. I like the Keys to Ascension material mostly (both releases, since I see them as all one body of work), but some of it's a little shaky. This is the same band that made Tormato, another album I like better than a lot of people do, but which I admit has some questionable moments, so it all makes sense. Not every album is going to be Going for the One, which I think is flawless from start to finish; in fact, very few are, even if they are by the same band.
Overall, I like the Keys to Ascension material best from the 90's and later Yes. I like Wakeman over Kaye or Downes, I like Howe over Rabin or Banks, and I like Anderson over anyone else.
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That's interesting, because as someone who only knew Yes for years as the one where Rabin and Anderson both sang, when I first heard the Drama album, I thought Horn's voice was a unique, albeit vastly inferior, blend of Anderson's and Rabin's voices. But I can certainly understand how someone who grew up on 70s Yes would be a bit turned off by anyone else singing lead vocals on a Yes album. Heck, I had a hard time with Drama at first for that very reason (no Anderson or Rabin).
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I loved Drama from the very beginning, even though it was not Jon Anderson on lead vocals. It helps that I always liked Trevor Horn's voice.
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I agree with pretty much all of this, with one important difference. As much as I can admire Trevor Rabin's talent, in writing, arranging, playing, producing, basically everything, a lot of that admiration came later, and there is still something deep down about him that bugs me. I can't pin down what it is. I like 90125, and I like Big Generator. I didn't pick up Big Generator until later, though, because of various circumstances, and it took a while to get into it. This was a very different Yes. I didn't simply write them off because of the lack of both Steve Howe or Rick Wakeman or both, as many did, but there's no denying that there are some elements of "the Yes sound" which aren't here. Steve Howe called it Yessishness, which is a silly word, but somehow I know exactly what it means, just as I can never know what it is about Trevor Rabin that bugs me.
Talk is by Trevor's band, and in my head in parentheses the name of Trevor's band is Cinema. A very good band, really. I picked up Talk much later, again because of circumstances, and it's great, probably the best of the three. But then Trevor sings, and it's not Yes, it's Cinema. It doesn't have to be Jon Anderson. Trevor Horn, Benoit David, and Jon Davison all have Yessish voices. Somehow Trevor Rabin does not. His is simultaneously a voice I like, and one which bugs me. Hey, I think I just figured out what bugs me about Trevor Rabin.
Anyway, I also agree about "crack time". I cringe (or at least mini-cringe inwardly) every time I hear that line. I like the Keys to Ascension material mostly (both releases, since I see them as all one body of work), but some of it's a little shaky. This is the same band that made Tormato, another album I like better than a lot of people do, but which I admit has some questionable moments, so it all makes sense. Not every album is going to be Going for the One, which I think is flawless from start to finish; in fact, very few are, even if they are by the same band.
Overall, I like the Keys to Ascension material best from the 90's and later Yes. I like Wakeman over Kaye or Downes, I like Howe over Rabin or Banks, and I like Anderson over anyone else.
Orbert, I could have written this. I know EXACTLY what you are saying, and while I don't have a ton to add to it, I would offer that one of the things is, Yes is more than Anderson singing. Chris Squire sang a LOT in Yes, and his voice is ALL OVER Drama, which lent it credibility, and didn't make it 1,000,000 miles from what came before. Except for obvious things like the Leave It a cappella number, Rabin and Anderson did a lot of what Squire and Anderson did. Chris got relegated to the "Steve Howe role, if that makes sense. I think people who aren't Yes freaks would be greatly surprised how distinctive and integral Squire's vocals are to the Yes bouillabaisse (anyone see what I did there? Fish stew? Fish? Crickets...).
Add to that that Anderson, Squire, Howe, and Horn all have that warm, English tenor sound quality to their voices (Lake and Wetton have it too) and Rabin has a more clear, piercing tone to his voice and it really becomes distinctive.
I will add too, that Going For The One is my favorite album of alltime, and Side One of Tormato is REALLY good. Side Two suffers from "Circus of Heaven" and "Arriving UFO", which makes Madrigal sound that much more unimpressive, but it ends well with OTSWOF. If someone could have locked Anderson in the closet when they were recording side two, the world would be a better place. :)
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We're again on the same page. It's not just Jon Anderson, but the harmonies and the blending which matters more to me. The vocals on Drama, Fly From Here, and Heaven & Earth all sound very similar to me because of the ways the voices blend. And most of the vocals on the Rabin-Yes albums have a similar sound, so it's really Rabin's lead vocals which stand out.
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Just to give you something to think about-
In my opinion, the TEN best Yes albums...
Chronologically:
1) Time and a Word
2) The Yes Album
3) Fragile
4) Close to the Edge
5) Going for the One
6) Drama
7) 90125
8) Talk
9) Keys to Ascension
10) Keys to Ascension 2
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A buddy recently got the 5.1 of Fragile, and last night we cranked it up after getting into the right "state of mind" :hat...and it was awesome. :coolio
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Yes is pretty awesome anyway, but yeah :hat
I've got all four of the Steven Wilson 5.1 editions, and that's always how I listen to them the first time.
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There ya go. :coolio :hat
I still think Five Percent for Nothing is pretty useless, and Wakeman's tune is pretty unimpressive when you consider some of the stuff you know he was capable of, but Fragile is still freaking awesome, nonetheless.
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Wakeman's tune was a last-minute thing. He had planned to include (I think) an early version of what would become "Catherine of Aragon" from The Six Wives of Henry VIII, but wasn't allowed, because he was contracted to a different label. I like what he came up with for the Brahms arrangement, each keyboard playing one section.
Bruford is not a composer, and had never written anything before. Most of the stuff on his solo and group albums later were at least co-written by others. He wasn't really into the idea of including a piece, but the rest of the band seemed pretty into it, so this is what he came up with. I've always considered it a bit of a throwaway, too, but in 5.1, there was a lot of stuff I didn't notice before. It really is a clever arrangement.
Now that I'm getting more into arranging things, maybe I'm appreciating arrangements more. I just realized that that's what I like about each of these two pieces, more than the actual content, which is minimal.
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I can understand that. I guess, for me, as someone who hasn't heard much of Wakeman's solo material, whenever I hear the live version of the tunes he played on the ABWH tour, it's hard not to think, "How come his solo piece on Fragile isn't as awesome as any of those?"
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Also remember that Wakeman was not really a "solo artist" as this time. Six Wives hadn't even been released yet. In some ways, it was working in Yes that inspired him to really dive into keyboards and their full potential; he hadn't really had an opportunity to do that previously. Up to this point, he was always "just the keyboard player". In Yes, he was encouraged to contribute fully to the compositions and arrangements. Bruford once said that playing in Yes was like entering a competition to see who can play the most notes.
These are still very young musicians, most of whom had never really developed solo pieces before. So yeah, the concept of each player having a solo spot is kinda cool, but the results vary a bit. Comparing what they did here to what they were able to do many years later might be a bit unfair.
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All fair points. I suppose I just think about what could have been, considering how awesome the solo contributions were from Howe and Squire.
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Part 1
I’m not a frequent poster here in the DTF due to time constraints and a busy personal life but feel the need to post to a number of these discography threads as they have really helped expand my personal CD collection with a tremendous amount of really great music. They are all well written and enjoyable to read even years after the OP and my initial read.
I came across this thread during the last break in the Dream Theater album cycle leading up to the release of the Astonishing. My music collection was pretty stale as I was only picking up releases by Dream Theater and Iron Maiden – my two favorite bands for most of the 2000’s. (Iron Maiden has been my favorite band from way back in the 80’s when I first heard them)
I was not new to Yes, however. I was very familiar with the “pop” hits of 90125 and Big Generator that were played on the radio and like them all. When I purchased my first CD player (~1986), 90125 was one of the first CD’s I purchased due to its polished production and the fact that it was so radically different sounding from everything else I was listening to at the time (Maiden, Sabbath, Priest). Not knowing the details, I just assumed that Yes, like Genesis and Rush, made a conscious effort to change their sound to something more commercial and distance themselves from the style of music they made in their early days.
Everyone here knows what an influence Chris Squire was for many bass players who came after him including Steve Harris of Iron Maiden and John Myung of Dream Theater. Most statements I read regarding Squire’s playing always referred to his work on the early Yes albums as being the source of their inspiration. So, sometime in the late 1980’s I went off to the mall to find some classic Yes. I played it safe and left with the Classic Yes compilation from 1981. I remember liking it a lot especially because the music had quite a bit more “texture” than I had imagined. There wasn’t a bad song on the disc.
Sometime later I picked up The Yes Album, no doubt as my entry into collecting the rest of their discography. The Yes Album was a safe purchase as three of the four long tracks were also on the Classic Yes compilation. But for some reason I didn’t venture any further into their back catalog at this time.
When Union came out in 1991 I picked it up right away after hearing Lift Me Up on the radio. I count myself among the select few who really like this album. I revisited it years later and I still like it a lot. Interesting story time. The local promoter here in NE Ohio for the Union tour was situated in a quaint little town called Chagrin Falls. Their office was located on the second floor of a two story building with a well-established Italian restaurant on the first floor. A very good friend of mine worked as a cook at the restaurant and called me the day after the concert to tell me that the previous night the restaurant closed and they served dinner to Yes! All of the band members and select staff! He was (is) a big Motley Crue, Cinderella, Bon Jovi fan and even though he liked the modern Yes stuff and respected their history, it was no big deal to him. I was in awe.
In 2004 a friend at work asked me if I wanted to go see Yes at the outdoor theater in August. By now I was a DT fan, knew of Squire’s influence on John Myung and was also a fledgling prog music fan so said yes to Yes. The concert was billed as the Return of Rick Wakeman but I think this was also part of the 35th Anniversary Tour. (At the time I didn’t know the humor of the “Return of Rick Wakeman” statement printed on the ticket) I was blown away. I knew some, but not all of the songs played that night but the show ranks up there as one of the most enjoyable and memorable concerts I have ever seen. I couldn’t believe how powerful the music was live. Not from a decibel standpoint but from an emotional one.
Fast forward to the summer of 2015 and this thread. I read the first few pages and then decided to head out to fill in the large holes of my Yes CD collection. And…., I stumbled and fell right out of the gate. For years my MO was to shop at the local bookstore (BN or Borders) or Best Buy stores for music. They typically had a pretty good selection of music and in my community the BN and Best Buy are within walking distance from each other. I rolled through both and came away with nothing. I don’t think between the two of them that they had two or three CD’s and nothing I didn’t have. There is a happy ending however. I knew of a Record Den tucked away in a small shopping center nearby. I had never been in there but decided to stop by and check it out. Words cannot express how shocked I was when I stepped through the door. This place had it all! Stacks of vinyl and bins of CD’s from all of my favorite bands including Imports and singles. I was floored. This was no cheesy mall store – this was the real deal. (I felt pretty dumb knowing this place existed all the while heading to the big commercial places close by only to be disappointed with their music selection)
They must have had a 100 Yes related CD’s including members side projects. I decided to purchase and listen to the discography in order and since I already had The Yes Album I left with Fragile and Close To the Edge. I decided to skip over the first two and get right into the meat of the catalog.
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Nice!
I await Part 2.
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I'm with you on Union, that's the album that got me into Yes. Shortly after I got the Union album, TALK came out with a mind-blowing tour! I've seen Yes several times since then with different line-up's but the Talk Tour is by far the best Yes show I've ever seen.. ☀
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Thanks for sharing that, stargazer18. :coolio
While I think Union is one of their weaker albums, the first half is mostly good. Miracle of Life, Shock to the System and Lift Me Up are all keepers. The back half is pretty dreadful, however.
The Talk tour was the first time I saw Yes and to say it kicked my ass would be an understatement. It sure helped that we scored 5th row center :coolio, but I am a big fan of the Rabin era (90125, BG, Talk), and getting a show of mostly songs from those three albums was pretty awesome. Endless Dream live was bananas. :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
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Surely there must be SOMEONE that got an amazing sounding bootleg of that tour....
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... and a busy personal life ...
Oh, SNAP! :)
Frankly, Union is my go-to example of an opportunity squandered. It has all the pieces, just not put together correctly. The harmony vocals on "I Would Have Waited Forever", the excellent songwriting on "Lift Me Up" and "Miracle of Life"... but the AWBH stuff suffers for not having Squire, and the YesWest stuff suffers from not having Anderson and Wakeman.
Jonathan Elias, I smite you!
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Surely there must be SOMEONE that got an amazing sounding bootleg of that tour....
I got one. It's an audience recording using an ADAT. It was the show at the Gorge 7-10-1994. It's pretty great to listen to. The audience sounds cool with that outdoor feel but not overbearing. The band sounds good over-all and you can hear the wind interrupting the sound waves at times. It doesn't quite capture the energy of that show, but it is worth listening to. I treat it like gold, and all three cd's don't have a scratch.
I was at that show with my wife, and it was absolutely incredible!
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Surely there must be SOMEONE that got an amazing sounding bootleg of that tour....
Not into collecting Yes bootlegs, but I remember reading somewhere that on the Talk tour, they offered head sets to people. This is what Wikipedia has to say:
Rabin supervised the development of Concertsonics, a quadraphonic sound system that allowed people seated in selected seats to hear the concert's soundboard mix with headphones and personal radio by tuning into a specific FM frequency.
Some clever souls hooked up recording equipment and managed to get (essentially) soundboard recordings of some of these shows. So these recordings are out there - you just gotta look for them Ben!
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Surely there must be SOMEONE that got an amazing sounding bootleg of that tour....
Not into collecting Yes bootlegs, but I remember reading somewhere that on the Talk tour, they offered head sets to people. This is what Wikipedia has to say:
Rabin supervised the development of Concertsonics, a quadraphonic sound system that allowed people seated in selected seats to hear the concert's soundboard mix with headphones and personal radio by tuning into a specific FM frequency.
Some clever souls hooked up recording equipment and managed to get (essentially) soundboard recordings of some of these shows. So these recordings are out there - you just gotta look for them Ben!
That's very interesting! I think I had found a few about a decade ago when I was heavily using DIME to download bootleg concerts of bands I liked, and I think I got at least 1 Talk tour soundboard.
-Marc.
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But that would basically be another Yes, and Trevor has stated that they (Anderson/Rabin/Wakeman) are trying to be very careful about not making this a version of Yes.
:D
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Yeah, funny how that turned out. :lol
To be fair, though, I actually believe Trevor Rabin when he said that. He has been the pragmatic one throughout this entire debacle, and has tried to keep to the high road. I honestly believe that all he wanted to do was play some music that he likes playing and had a hand in creating, though I'm sure he knew in the back of his mind that once the suits got ahold of it, it would become Yes somehow, just as it did so long ago with the Cinema project.
Anderson meanwhile is all "We are Yes! I am Yes, therefore anything I do is Yes! I could do a fucking solo album, play every note, sing every word, and it would be Yes! But Trevor and Rick are on this, too, and there were also Yes, so this is Yes!" And Wakeman literally wanders from one extreme to the other, sometimes over the course of a day or an hour or a few seconds, because he loves to talk and doesn't give a shit how true or sensible any of it is.
And six years later, we still haven't heard a single note of new music, so really, who cares?
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Part 2 – 1970’s
For those who like owning a physical copy of CD’s, 2015 was a great time to buy Yes music. There were two different style reissues of the classics from Rhino that year that included pictures and notes about the making of each album and, the lyrics. Fragile, Close to the Edge, Tales from Topographic Oceans and Relayer consisted of a cardboard trifold case with a cardboard slipcase over the trifold to keep it all together. Going for the One, Tormato and Drama are standard issue plastic jewel cases with the text “Expanded and Remastered” after the band name.
In this day and age of the electronic medium I still like to have something to hold in my hand and look at. I tell my wife I’m really buying my “backup” copy ;D
I learned a few things while working my way through 70’s Yes. One was that I knew a lot more Yes than I thought. The local classic rock station was / is pretty bold and digs deep into the Yes catalog on occasion. The other thing I learned was that, in the context of the album, I could listen to the worn out radio hits and still enjoy them.
I don’t have any of the 70’s live albums but I’m considering picking of the 2 CD Progeny disc set someday. I also don’t have their first album nor do I think I’ve heard a song from it.
Time And A Word
This was the last of the 70’s Yes albums that I listened to around the same time as Tormato. There isn’t a whole lot here that is really interesting to me other than the title track which I really like. However, knowing my musical taste, it's possible that I'll put this in again in a year or two and come away with an entirely different opinion.
The Yes Album
In essence I already owned both The Yes Album and Fragile by having the Classic Yes compilation CD since it is comprised mostly of songs from these two albums.
Yours Is No Disgrace, Starship Trooper and I've Seen All Good People are standout tracks.
A Venture is a quick little song that is catchy and enjoyable.
Perpetual Change is good but I don’t think it’s as strong as Yours Is No Disgrace or Starship Trooper.
This album is a huge leap forward to the style and sound of Time And A Word and is, to me, the beginning of the Yes-ish sound. I can listen to this album all the way through and not skip a song.
Fragile
Like The Yes Album, I was already familiar with the songs on this album with the exception of the four short tracks and South Side Of The Sky. I don’t mind the short tracks at all and feel they put some separation between the longer songs on the disc. South Side Of The Sky is a pretty cool song that I had heard before but didn’t know the name.
I also agree with what others have written here about Long Distance Runaround should always be followed by The Fish!
Close to the Edge
I have to admit that I was really looking forward to this album and especially the title track after reading this thread. After a few days of listening I was pretty impressed with the song and listening to it now a few years later it is still impressive. The different sections don’t sound out of place at all (or patched together) within the context of the song. It’s certainly one of their most accessible long form songs given what would come after this.
The rest of album is just icing on the cake.
I already knew And You And I and loved it. Dynamic and diverse, the recurring themes really hold my attention. I can’t really add anything else to what others have written – a fantastic song.
Siberian Khatru is a great album closer and was one that I recognized from the concert, as well as the radio but didn’t know the name. I love the sections where the music slows down and the vocals take over, then there’s a slow build up before exiting back into the main riff. My favorite part is from about 5:20 – 6:20.
It’s pretty clear to me why this album gets the high ratings it does – it’s truly a remarkable achievement for Yes. I listen to this album at least once a month all the way through.
Off to “the den” I went to fetch Tales from Topographic Oceans, Relayer and Drama. They didn’t have Going for the One so I hit Amazon for that one.
Tales from Topographic Oceans
This is an impressive double album with four songs all building on what they had done before but each song sounds unique in their own way. The songs are complex and required a few (!!) listens to help “assemble” them in my mind. I’ve probably listened to all four songs in one sitting about a dozen times now and agree that it’s similar to sitting down and listening to a symphony.
The Revealing Science of God -- Dance of the Dawn is on par with other large epics of the 70’s Yes output. It has distinct sections that flow very well. There are some very catchy vocal melodies interspersed with some great music.
The Remembering High the Memory is just a small step below the opening track. The first few minutes feature a guitar and vocal melody that wander around a steady pattern before being joined by the rhythm section. The pattern continues but numerous times the music and vocals shift, leading the listener to think that a change is coming, only to return to the steady pattern. After about 9 minutes the song finally moves out of the steady guitar and vocal melody, first shifting into some nice acoustic guitar by Howe and catchy vocals by Anderson, then mixing in a number of changes before revisiting the same pattern heard in the beginning before ending. The second half of the song is clearly stronger than the first half.
The Ancient Giants Under the Sun is the only dip in the album. It’s not a big one but just enough to rank it lower than the other three songs. It may be Howe’s screeching guitar that appears at both the beginning and in the middle that seem to wander a bit too long. The song ends with some excellent acoustic guitar by Howe and vocals by Anderson but it's a bit of work to get to this point.
The album ends with Ritual - Nous Sommes du Soleil which to me is on par with the first song. As Orbert described, this song brings back the themes from the three previous pieces. It seems livelier than the previous three tracks meaning that there are more shifts between the fast and slow sections. It is not without a bit of screechy guitar by Howe but not enough to distract.
Relayer
Like Tales this is another album of previously unheard Yes material for me. The opening track is a monster that is mostly interesting. The “battle” rages a bit too long for my tastes and gets a little out of hand to me as the listener but the segue into the closing Soon section helps the listener relax. The Soon section is awesome and really brings the song to conclusion. To me this song is a lot busier sounding than Close to the Edge which isn’t necessarily bad but requires a little more listening time.
Sound Chaser is the weakest song on the album to me. It’s not bad but it really doesn’t grab me either. The recurring themes aren’t quite as interesting to me to come back to.
To Be Over is a good tune that ends the album on a somewhat quiet note. It’s not on the level of And You And I but it’s enjoyable.
Going for the One
This is an awesome album from start to finish. Going for the One is a great lead off track and for the first three minutes the rocking guitar by Howe should really annoy me but it doesn’t. This all changes after three minutes though when the song begins its overly long build up to the end. Here Howe’s “solo over everything” with a wailing guitar just wears the listener out. Combine the guitar with the repetitive vocal melody and by four and a half minutes into the song I’m done. Relief for the listener happens at about 4:40 when the repetition stops and the song transitions to the ending which I like.
Next they slow it down and present the listener with one of their best acoustic songs ever with Turn of the Century. When I listen to the abbreviated version of this album I typically listen to this song and Awaken.
Parallel’s took some time to grow but I like it a lot now. It’s a more straight ahead rocker for Yes but it’s good enough to keep the middle of the album from dipping in quality.
I knew Wondrous Stories from the Classic compilation and always liked this song. Short but sweet – the vocal melodies are very catchy and really carry this song.
I agree that Awaken could be their best epic of the 70’s. The hard rocking intro featuring some excellent riffing by Howe and rhythm by Squire and White. The transition to a much slower, more peaceful middle section dominated by Wakeman is awesome. It ends on a slower quieter note.
Tormato
I wasn’t sure if I would even buy this CD based on what I read here but I’m somewhat of a complete-ist so made the purchase not sure of what I would hear. In the end I like five out of eight songs on this disc: Future Times/Rejoice, Don't Kill The Whale, Madrigal, Onward and On The Silent Wings Of Freedom. Mind you, this adds up to about 25 minutes of music, only a little longer than some of their epics from earlier in the decade!
I don’t find it as bad as some find it to be, but it’s certainly behind everything from The Yes Album thru Going for the One.
Ranking
The Yes Album
Fragile
Close to the Edge
Tales From Topographic Oceans
Going for the One
Relayer
Time and a Word
Tormato
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I think Relayer is far better than Tales or Going for the One, but your top 3 is right on (I suspect many Yes fans would have the same top 3, regardless of the order).
Tales is a good listen from start to finish, but I don't think the middle tracks hold up well on their own.
For the 384th time, I hate the sound of Going for the One, which I know greatly impacts my opinion of it.
Good to see a new fan! :tup :tup
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And for the 385th time, Going For The One is my favorite album of all time by any band ever.
Of these albums:
Going for the One
The Yes Album
Tales From Topographic Oceans
Fragile
Close to the Edge
Tormato
Relayer
Time and a Word
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And for the 385th time, Going For The One is my favorite album of all time by any band ever.
Hard to beat an album with songs like Awaken and Turn of the Century (one of the most beautiful songs I’ve ever heard). It’s my second or third favorite Yes album.
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Going for the One is probably my favorite as well...but honestly the worst sounding record in the entire catalog. Maybe the reason SW skipped that one was because the problem was in the way it was recorded in the first place? In any event... he managed to save Relayer, so I don’t see why he couldn’t salvage GFTO.
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Relayer is one of my top 3 albums of all time. To Be Over is so beautiful, I always think I hear church bells at the end of it, although there are no church bells to be heard. Just listen to it and tell me I'm not crazy :D
I love Tales from start to finish, and I mean every second of it. The Ancient needed some time to get into. But it's brilliant. Steve's "drunk" guitar is all over the place, but he doesn't just play anything. He's constantly reprising melodies from the whole album! And the acoustic ending? What a surprise...
I guess there's not much left to say about Close To The Edge. I just want to say something about Siberian Khatru: this song is so packed with amazing ideas and combined so perfectly with a lot of groove. I would like to recommend the Yessongs-version of it, because Steve plays a great solo at the end. And when the song ends (it has a real ending there which should have been on the album instead of the fadeout) you just feel the release of all the energy packed into that performance.
My ranking of these albums:
Relayer
Tales From Topographic Oceans
Close To The Edge
Going For The One
The Yes Album
Time & A Word
Tormato
Drama would have been either between Close and Going or between Going and The Yes Album. I can never decide if I like Going or Drama better.
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1. Close to the edge
2. Fragile
3. Relayer
4. Drama
5. Tales
I keep on going back and forth with the other ones.
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1. Close To The Edge
2. Fragile
3. Drama
4. The Yes Album
5. Time & A Word
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I wasn't clear in my ranking. The top five are listed chronologically and are really interchangeable in my book. Relayer is just a bit behind but I have listened to this album less than the others.
I read the comments regarding the sound (production) of Going for the One but listening to it on my home stereo system that produces a pretty full sound I don't hear anything really off about it. Could be my hearing.... I suppose listening to it on a pair of ear buds may accentuate the high end.
I think Relayer is far better than Tales or Going for the One, but your top 3 is right on (I suspect many Yes fans would have the same top 3, regardless of the order).
Tales is a good listen from start to finish, but I don't think the middle tracks hold up well on their own.
For the 384th time, I hate the sound of Going for the One, which I know greatly impacts my opinion of it.
Good to see a new fan! :tup :tup
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I love Tales from start to finish, and I mean every second of it. The Ancient needed some time to get into. But it's brilliant. Steve's "drunk" guitar is all over the place, but he doesn't just play anything. He's constantly reprising melodies from the whole album! And the acoustic ending? What a surprise...
I've listened to the album about a dozen times all the way through. Between the four songs there are some really fantastic guitar and vocal melodies for sure. I can see why some don't care for it but I think it's a cornerstone to their 70's output.
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I read the comments regarding the sound (production) of Going for the One but listening to it on my home stereo system that produces a pretty full sound I don't hear anything really off about it. Could be my hearing.... I suppose listening to it on a pair of ear buds may accentuate the high end.
Oh, trust me, I have listened to it many times on my home stereo over the years (I am 44 and have owned the CD for around 25 years now). The sound of it works on Turn of the Century, given the nature of that song, but on all of the others, the lack of low end is glaring. Think of how incredible Chris Squire's bass sounds on all of those other 70's albums. It's like they cut the balls off of it during the mixing of Going for the One.
I've listened to the album about a dozen times all the way through. Between the four songs there are some really fantastic guitar and vocal melodies for sure. I can see why some don't care for it but I think it's a cornerstone to their 70's output.
Tales is a nice "stream of consciousness" album in that you can just turn it on and it sounds nice from start to finish, even if some parts are clearly better than others. There is enough really good Yes music throughout where it works as a whole. I just find the two middle tracks not standing out at all on their own. The Revealing Science of God and Ritual, however, are really good standalone songs. Tales was a difficult mountain for me to climb, though. It took me forever to really get into it.
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Tales is a nice "stream of consciousness" album in that you can just turn it on and it sounds nice from start to finish, even if some parts are clearly better than others. There is enough really good Yes music throughout where it works as a whole. I just find the two middle tracks not standing out at all on their own. The Revealing Science of God and Ritual, however, are really good standalone songs. Tales was a difficult mountain for me to climb, though. It took me forever to really get into it.
I can listen to The Ancient as a standalone track, but I see what you mean. But while Revealing and Ritual function well as standalone songs, they still all function best as a whole. Especially The Remembering as the second, quieter movement and The Ancient as the faster, Scherzo-like movement.
I get that Tales might be too much for some listeners... but for me this is an absolute masterpiece.
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The Ancient is a brilliant standalone piece in my opinion. It's Steve Howe's masterpiece.
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Of the '70s stuff,
My least favorites are Tormato followed by Going For The One. (Not the fan of Awaken many others seem to be. My faves are Wonderous Stories and Going For The One.
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Maybe it's me, but I don't see the problems with the sound of Going For The One that others do. I tend to think that some of the earlier Yes was muddy and thick(er). I like the sort of sparseness, and the way the guitar cuts through. (And this coming from someone that feels Chris Squire was the heart and soul of the band, and feel that ABWH sounds like some here are describing GFTO. ABWH misses Chris Squire like Jimmy Page misses Robert Plant.)
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Part 3 – 1980’s
Drama
I remember during the mid-1980’s, while searching the bargain cassette bin at the local Camelot music store coming across this album. Back then you could buy the tape for $6.99 – a few bucks less than a new release.
From this album forward I can understand why those who had been fans of the band in 70’s might not know what to think of the Yes sound.
Although this album sounds a bit dated with its keyboard sounds, it is a solid album all the way through. I like what The Buggles bring to the Yes sound and consider this to be a unique contribution to the Yes catalog. The songs (White Car excluded) are all pretty dynamic with lots shifts and changes. This is one album I can put in and let play all the way through without feeling the need to skip a song.
90125
This is the first Yes album I purchased and consider this to be an outstanding rock album. Like others who have posted this album was my introduction to the band and a springboard to their earlier catalog. I don’t really listen to Owner... anymore and with the exception of City of Love, the only song on the album I don’t like, the rest is very good to excellent. I even played Hearts at my wedding.
Now that I know the real truth about this being mostly a Rabin effort I can see the dilemma the record company faced in how to market it. It would have been proper to call the band Cinema IMO but for all practical purposes marketing it as Yes made more sense. The sound is radically different but is it any more different than when Howe came aboard and they released The Yes Album? Sure, The Yes Album was a group effort while 90125 was mostly Rabin, but it is somewhat coincidental that once again the new guitarist brings the new sound.
Big Generator
I bought this CD not long after I bought 90125. I liked the radio hits Rhythm Of Love and Love Will Find A Way which is why I bought the album in the first place. After listening to it though, the two longer tracks, Shoot High Aim Low and Final Eyes became the two songs I liked the most.
I went back and listened to the other tracks on this CD before posting. The title track does nothing for me. It’s loud and groovy but lacks anything I find interesting. The same can be said for Almost Like Love – it’s hoppy and skippy but uninteresting. I’m Running is better than I remember and is a pretty cool song. Holy Lamb is an outstanding short track that really showcases Anderson’s unique vocal style.
ABWH
I bought this CD based on the (mostly) positive reviews on this forum. I am not disappointed one bit! I remember when it came out hearing the DJ on the local classic rock station say Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman and Howe a million times it seemed so that term stuck in my head for some reason.
On first listen I was pleasantly surprised to hear Brother of Mine, a song that I had heard before and really liked. The rest of the album is very good. Along with Brother of Mine my favorites include Themes, Birthright, The Meeting, Quartet, Order of the Universe and Let’s Pretend. Not a fan of Teakbois and First Of Fire seems kind of boring.
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Interesting observations, and your comments are quite similar to my own.
Except for "Man in a White Car". Sure it's very short, barely a vignette. But during that minute and a half (or whatever it is), Downes displays a flair for orchestration that exceeds that of Kaye, Wakeman, or even Moraz. I think it's brilliant.
I understand why a lot of people don't like "City of Love". That driving, plodding beat which I love probably drives most people nuts. But it's another really unique Yessong. Yes rarely got really "heavy", not like this, and that's what I like about it.
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Maybe it's me, but I don't see the problems with the sound of Going For The One that others do. I tend to think that some of the earlier Yes was muddy and thick(er). I like the sort of sparseness, and the way the guitar cuts through. (And this coming from someone that feels Chris Squire was the heart and soul of the band, and feel that ABWH sounds like some here are describing GFTO. ABWH misses Chris Squire like Jimmy Page misses Robert Plant.)
I don't know if it's the sound that bothers me about Going For The One. I think it's more of a vibe thing with me. The previous Yes albums (to me) seem to have a looser, happy-go-lucky kind of vibe to them which I don't really get with this album (or even Tormato for that matter)
It just strikes me as a very tense album (oddly and maybe in a similar way the Grace Under Pressure is (Rush seemed to channel that friction and make it work for them), but I don't know nearly enough about the history of making that album as I do Grace Under Pressure. I mean I've read "Close To The Edge-The Story of Yes" But that's really it and even that was years ago.)
I think there was some friction there with the label and maybe even some band members about finances and the like by this time, but I haven't read many accounts of that time period.
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Last night at the Weird Al show in Portland, I ran into an old school prog rock guy who was really into the early scene. So obviously, we started a long discussion.
He seemed rather sure that the issue with redoing anything with GFTO is that the master tapes had been lost. Not sure where he heard that, but he seemed pretty knowledgeable on the subject.
*IF* that is true, it may the reason Steven Wilson didn't do that album.
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How was the weird Al show? I see that he's been doing his originals.
If weird Al did a Yes parody, what should it be?
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That's interesting, didn't know that!
But I thin GFTO HAS been remastered, maybe the tapes have been lost AFTER that? :huh:
If I recall correctly, SW only remasters albums he likes/loves, maybe this isn't one of them?
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How was the weird Al show? I see that he's been doing his originals.
If weird Al did a Yes parody, what should it be?
It was absolutely amazing! And I think I may have gotten the best set list on the entire tour! Midnight star, nature trail the hell, Albuquerque, Mr. Popiel, Horoscope...
Maybe I post pics tomorrow
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That's great, I saw Weird Al at the 5th Avenue a few years back and it was awesome! One of my favorite songs he played was "The night Santa Went Crazy"..... :metal
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Maybe it's me, but I don't see the problems with the sound of Going For The One that others do. I tend to think that some of the earlier Yes was muddy and thick(er). I like the sort of sparseness, and the way the guitar cuts through. (And this coming from someone that feels Chris Squire was the heart and soul of the band, and feel that ABWH sounds like some here are describing GFTO. ABWH misses Chris Squire like Jimmy Page misses Robert Plant.)
I don't know if it's the sound that bothers me about Going For The One. I think it's more of a vibe thing with me. The previous Yes albums (to me) seem to have a looser, happy-go-lucky kind of vibe to them which I don't really get with this album (or even Tormato for that matter)
It just strikes me as a very tense album (oddly and maybe in a similar way the Grace Under Pressure is (Rush seemed to channel that friction and make it work for them), but I don't know nearly enough about the history of making that album as I do Grace Under Pressure. I mean I've read "Close To The Edge-The Story of Yes" But that's really it and even that was years ago.)
I think there was some friction there with the label and maybe even some band members about finances and the like by this time, but I haven't read many accounts of that time period.
Somewhere in a shoebox I have a tape that purports to be a session tape for the recording of the end section of Awaken. Anderson is literally telling Wakeman what to play note for note (on the ending part where the keys seem to be ascending in a spiral). While Wakeman plays all of it, seemingly without much complaint, it's a very weird vibe to hear. Wakeman doesn't need people - especially someone as instrumentally challenged as Anderson, and with Anderson's people skills - telling him what to play.
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Sometimes someone has a song idea and it's really more like a sketch, with a lot of the details to be filled in by the other members of the band. Give the guitarist an idea of what you have in mind, but basically let him work out exactly what he's gonna play. Same with the keyboards, bass, and drums. It all gets fleshed out in rehearsals and/or in the studio. I don't know, but I would think that a lot of co-writing credits come from stuff like that, people contributing different stuff until it's clear that a significant part of the song came from different people. But sometimes the songwriter has very specific things in mind that they feel is important to the song. In a band situation, if you've got guys that are fine with working that way, I don't see the problem. I mean, I found it a little weird that Mike Portnoy could tell James Labrie exactly how to sing his parts, but other people don't see anything wrong with that. If that's how things work(ed) in a band, then who am I to think it's weird?
I know I've harped on this (no pun intended) many times, but basically Anderson saw himself as the leader of the band. So it doesn't surprise me at all that he knew exactly what he wanted in some places, and Wakeman (who spent many years as a session musician, essentially just playing what he was told/paid to play) didn't have any issue with that. And of course it helps that Anderson and Wakeman have immense respect for each other and love working together. So Anderson says this is what he wants, Wakeman plays it. Weird? Maybe. But if they're fine with it, then that's all that matters.
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Ya...to back up Orbert, and play devil’s advocate....when I was in bands, I was the singer, but I ultimately ended up as the “arranger” as well. I didn’t tell guys what to play for the entire song, but if there was a moment that needed that special “something”, I might tell the drummer (beg if I had to) to please hit a hard crash cymbal *right on this one beat*....because it was super important.
Maybe I was meant to be a producer more than a performer. I know what sounds right and when it has to be done.
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No, no, I get that, and totally agree. I'm with you 100%, and that's what it means to be a team (and I believe, especially with LaBrie, that Portnoy pushing him made him a better singer). I'm just offering evidence that it wasn't a matter of five guys jamming and doing what they want. Really a contrast with, say, Fragile, where the band was largely done with the material and left "spaces" for Wakeman to do what he wanted on the underlying tracks.
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Maybe it's me, but I don't see the problems with the sound of Going For The One that others do. I tend to think that some of the earlier Yes was muddy and thick(er). I like the sort of sparseness, and the way the guitar cuts through. (And this coming from someone that feels Chris Squire was the heart and soul of the band, and feel that ABWH sounds like some here are describing GFTO. ABWH misses Chris Squire like Jimmy Page misses Robert Plant.)
I don't know if it's the sound that bothers me about Going For The One. I think it's more of a vibe thing with me. The previous Yes albums (to me) seem to have a looser, happy-go-lucky kind of vibe to them which I don't really get with this album (or even Tormato for that matter)
It just strikes me as a very tense album (oddly and maybe in a similar way the Grace Under Pressure is (Rush seemed to channel that friction and make it work for them), but I don't know nearly enough about the history of making that album as I do Grace Under Pressure. I mean I've read "Close To The Edge-The Story of Yes" But that's really it and even that was years ago.)
I think there was some friction there with the label and maybe even some band members about finances and the like by this time, but I haven't read many accounts of that time period.
Somewhere in a shoebox I have a tape that purports to be a session tape for the recording of the end section of Awaken. Anderson is literally telling Wakeman what to play note for note (on the ending part where the keys seem to be ascending in a spiral). While Wakeman plays all of it, seemingly without much complaint, it's a very weird vibe to hear. Wakeman doesn't need people - especially someone as instrumentally challenged as Anderson, and with Anderson's people skills - telling him what to play.
It seemed to work before (And I'm not saying it didn't work after for the most part) but I just always sensed a change with that album.
Tormato was even worse for me and there seemed to be a renewed sense of energy with Drama and beyond.
In general, it was becoming a lot more difficult by the late '70s to be adventurous in your music and still remain as profitable as you had been before so I suppose that was a pressure that some may have worried about more than others.
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I'm listening to Tales for the second time this week. I think this album is FINALLY starting to click with me. I've had it for years, and I've made annual attempts to try and see if it will reveal its worth, and I think it finally paid off. It's still bloated and somewhat disjointed, and I'm still really not a fan of The Ancient, but there are moments throughout this record that rank among the best Yes moments in their discography. I think The Remembering is a somewhat underrated Yes epic and it's my favorite part of the record. If I had to rank the four parts of the record it would look like this:
The Remembering
Ritual
The Revealing Science of God
The Ancient
I'm glad it has finally clicked for me. I wonder if this is going to be the only album I'm going to listen to for the next few days!
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I'm glad it has finally clicked for you, too! It's a huge, sprawling, often daunting album, but if it works for you, then it's 80+ minutes of amazingness.
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I've been on a bit of a Yes binge lately. I had an epic Yes playlist that I listened to on Sunday while doing yard work that really kicked it off for me. I've since listened to Tales twice this week and I'm working through Relayer right now. I first discovered Relayer back in 1991, and it grabbed me right away. I would have loved to have another Yes album with Moraz on keys. I think he brought a really interesting take on the keyboard position in Yes, and it really seemed to fire up the band.
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I agree. In some ways, Patrick Moraz was "the Derek Shirinian" of Yes. Yes had Wakeman, Wakeman left so they got Moraz, Wakeman became available again so they dumped Moraz and took Wakeman back.
Various members of Yes have gone on record saying that it just wasn't working, blah blah blah, but Relayer is a favorite of a lot of Yesfans, and Moraz is a big part of that. A second album with Moraz, after they'd settled in and figured out how to work together better, could have been really cool.
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I agree with your statement that some of the music on this album is some of the best that they have done. The more I listen the more I find I like. It's just hard to find 80 minutes to sit and listen to all at once.
I'm listening to Tales for the second time this week. I think this album is FINALLY starting to click with me. I've had it for years, and I've made annual attempts to try and see if it will reveal its worth, and I think it finally paid off. It's still bloated and somewhat disjointed, and I'm still really not a fan of The Ancient, but there are moments throughout this record that rank among the best Yes moments in their discography. I think The Remembering is a somewhat underrated Yes epic and it's my favorite part of the record. If I had to rank the four parts of the record it would look like this:
The Remembering
Ritual
The Revealing Science of God
The Ancient
I'm glad it has finally clicked for me. I wonder if this is going to be the only album I'm going to listen to for the next few days!
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Part 4 – 1990’s to Today
I graduated from High School in 1990. During my junior and senior years I got introduced to Led Zepplin and Pink Floyd by a friend and spent some time exploring each bands discography. I also picked up CD’s by the Eagles and Kansas as I continued to expand my music collection from just hard rock and metal. So when I heard Lift Me Up on the radio I knew I would get the new Yes album when it came out.
Union
I know many don’t think highly of this album but I think it’s pretty solid. The only song I don’t care for is Dangerous (Look In The Light Of What You're Searching For). If I’m not in the mood I’ll skip Angkor Wat – it’s pretty cool and atmospheric but I don’t listen to it every time. The rest is pretty good stuff.
Talk
This was another new album for me and I was very excited to check it out based on comments I read. It wasn’t until I listened to it that I realized I’d heard The Calling on the radio when Talk came out. I Am Waiting is another top shelf song. Real Love starts with (to me) a really annoying keyboard melody that makes me hit skip every time I hear it. It just does nothing for me. For this review I listened to the whole song and there are some redeeming parts to it after getting through the first two minutes or so. I get why others like it. It’s mostly up from here to the end of the album for me: State Of Play is good, Walls is okay, Where Will You Be is good and Endless Dream is phenomenal! I don’t know if I would call it the best of the three but it rounds out the trifecta of Rabin Era albums on a very high note.
Keys To Ascension
I’m one of those who happened to get the 4 CD / 1 DVD box set because it was the only copy I could find. I’ve since seen various versions of the packaging show up at ‘the Den” in the past few years but not the box set. To me, the studio tracks are a return to form of sorts with a modern polished sound. I like every song. The long form / epic tracks don’t sound padded out or overlong to me and IMO sound like a natural evolution to what they did in the 70’s.
I know this is heresy but I actually like some of the live tracks and here’s why. I typically don’t listen to live albums because of the lack of quality. (Besides, having seen them in concert I know the statement “you had to be there” applies to Yes) There are some live albums I like but not many. I like some of the Keys tracks because they overdubbed and cleaned up the sound. Yes, they are not really live but they are not really studio and that is why I like the sound. It's different.
Open Your Eyes
I don’t have a copy of this album but I pulled it up YouTube and gave it a listen. It’s not as bad as I expected based on comments I read. Most of the songs have the sound of the short form style that they had been making since the 80’s. Every band I listen to makes a style of song that I don’t like – for Yes this would be New State of Mind. It has the clunky, plodding beat that just turns me off. Best few are Open Your Eyes, Universal Garden, Wonderlove and From the Balcony. To be honest I could put it on in the background and only skip a few songs. If I can find a cheap copy I’ll pick this up on CD.
The Ladder
I like this album a lot and consider it on par with Keys To Ascension. The short form songs are all really good – no clunky, plodding ones here. But, there is some real diversity that I can see would turn a purist off. Lightning Strikes and Can I incorporate that “world music” concept that has always been an element in prog. Both are enjoyable to me even though they are a bit out of my usual music taste. It Will Be A Good Day, Face To Face, If Only You Knew, To Be Alive, Finally and The Messenger are all really good and contain some really nice music and vocal melodies.
Both long form songs are excellent – long enough to develop but not padded out.
Both Keys To Ascension and The Ladder have the modern, contemporary feel of the 70’s era Yes music to me. It doesn’t sound re-hashed and shows the band could evolve beyond their early years. It’s not as bold a statement as it should have been because they only put out these two albums before changing again.
Magnification
I’ve only listened to this album twice. There are a few songs that stand out but there’s nothing I have heard so far that really grabs me. It’s one that I can put on in the background while working and enjoy.
Symphonic Live
I got it, and I like it! The sound is fantastic and you get Close to the Edge, The Gates of Delirium and Ritual in one package - nothing more to say.
Fly From Here
Since I like Drama I was really interested in hearing this album. For the most part it’s good to excellent with The Man You Always Wanted Me To Be and Hour Of Need being the only songs I skip sometimes. They’re not bad but definitely aren’t very Yes sounding to me by a long stretch.
The epic is excellent – bumpy ride doesn’t derail the song to me as much as others feel it does. The rest of the short form songs are diverse enough and sound pretty good.
I’ll admit that I have not listened to Heaven & Earth and will refrain from doing so based on what I’ve read here. In my mind I am going to let the current line up end their tenure on a high note!
Many thanks to Orbert and everyone else who contributed to this thread – as a result I’ve added hours of incredible new music to my library and greatly expanded my enjoyment of music.
Yes was just the beginning of adding new music to my collection though and I then moved on to another big 70’s progressive rock band discography thread…
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Y'know, reading through your journey of discovery through Yes's discography kind of makes me want to go back and listen or re-listen to a lot of the albums I haven't gotten around to listening.
Also, re: Bumpy Ride: I honestly don't mind it when it comes on shuffle by its self, it's a fun and kooky song and it's not badly written by any means. But to me, when I listen to Fly From Here, I feel like it just comes out of nowhere when I go through the whole suite. It doesn't really fit in with the tone of the rest of the song for me, and the transition to it feels so sloppy.
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I get what they were going for with "Bumpy Ride". There are examples of a long-form thing by other bands, and before the big recap there's a crazy section with weird timings and stuff. To me, that's "Bumpy Ride". And yeah, it's pretty well done as a piece and I don't mind it. But when it comes up in the suite, I can't help but think that this is the part they put in because it's the crazy section before the big recap. It doesn't feel like it came up organically.
But if you follow the analogy of the song suite to an airplane ride, turbulence does come out of nowhere and for some reason seems to happen towards the end of the flight a lot of the time. So maybe it's supposed to be like that. I don't know; I just thought of that.
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I get what they were going for with "Bumpy Ride". There are examples of a long-form thing by other bands, and before the big recap there's a crazy section with weird timings and stuff. To me, that's "Bumpy Ride". And yeah, it's pretty well done as a piece and I don't mind it. But when it comes up in the suite, I can't help but think that this is the part they put in because it's the crazy section before the big recap. It doesn't feel like it came up organically.
But if you follow the analogy of the song suite to an airplane ride, turbulence does come out of nowhere and for some reason seems to happen towards the end of the flight a lot of the time. So maybe it's supposed to be like that. I don't know; I just thought of that.
I feel like the whole suite is not organic. It's a suite because Yes wanted to include a long song on the album. I agree on what you're saying, a lot of bands put in crazy parts before the huge reprise (Supper's Ready, Octavarium, In The Presence Of Enemies, Illumination Theory, Ritual, probably about 92 Neal Morse epics). I always felt that Bumpy Ride was supposed to be something like this. But I also find it extremely bland, almost childish with its I-IV-V harmonies. It doesn't work as a standalone track for me either.
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I feel like the whole suite is not organic. It's a suite because Yes wanted to include a long song on the album.
True. When I first heard that they'd taken a leftover tune from Drama and somehow made it into an epic, I had my doubts, and when I saw/heard the results, I wasn't really surprised. But I've come to accept it because I like the sound of this lineup and of this album. It's not really top-tier songwriting.
It doesn't work as a standalone track for me either.
That one's harder for me to judge. I never shuffle bits of suites; they're always concatenated into a single track before going onto the iPod. It serves its purpose in the suite, which is the most important thing, and as I said, I've come to accept it. I suppose that that just underscores how truly cobbled-together the thing is in the first place. But I'm a Yes fanboy. I like these guys and the way they play, even if what they're playing is kinda crap.
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Always enjoyed Sides 3 and 4 (disc 2) of Tales more.
I keep forgetting that I really need to get some Union Live releases. Always liked the album, but even though I saw the show I always forget how much fun they were having and how much of a music festival that tour really was. I'm not much of a fan of Awaken as most people are, but I still think that's the best version of that I've ever heard.
I really like the music of Anderson Bruford Wakeman and Howe and what they did with it live, but the Union Tour just seemed on a whole other plane of existence from that given the augmented guitars, keys and drums.
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Yeah, the Union tour was cool because of the big sound. That was the one and only time I've seen Yes, probably the only time I ever will, but it was a good one.
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bump.
Jon Anderson's 1000 Hands is FINALLY coming out on March 31st, 2019.
30 Bloody Years in the Making with like a bazillion guests in the world of Prog, Classic Rock, Jazz-Fusion, etc
http://ultimateclassicrock.com/jon-anderson-1000-hands-album-tour/
https://jonanderson1000hands.com/
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Do we know anything about the tour? Band? Setlist?
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Do we know anything about the tour? Band? Setlist?
Did you click the links? :-)
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Stadler doesn't have time to click links. That would take time away from crafting those 2,000-word posts. :P
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Do we know anything about the tour? Band? Setlist?
Did you click the links? :-)
I did, actually, and it didn't say anything about the band that he's bringing out with him, or any specific songs (only "past, present and future").
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Stadler doesn't have time to click links. That would take time away from crafting those 2,000-word posts. :P
Stadler did click the links, thank you very much, and if you don't like the posts, they are rather easy to skip over.
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The thing on the left is the track list, right?
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The links provide some tour dates, songs on the album, and performers on the album (including Chris Squire!). No info about who the touring band will be or what songs will be played.
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Stadler doesn't have time to click links. That would take time away from crafting those 2,000-word posts. :P
Stadler did click the links, thank you very much, and if you don't like the posts, they are rather easy to skip over.
It was a playful jab, hence the :P.
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The thing on the left is the track list, right?
This link has 1 minute 30 second samples of each song.
https://jonanderson1000hands.com/pre-order-now.html
My dad is a huge Yes fan so I will preorder him this.
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Stadler doesn't have time to click links. That would take time away from crafting those 2,000-word posts. :P
Stadler did click the links, thank you very much, and if you don't like the posts, they are rather easy to skip over.
It was a playful jab, hence the :P.
Ah. I think I misunderstood the emoji. I thought that meant something like "exasperation" or something.
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The thing on the left is the track list, right?
yes
also if you scroll down to the bottom the track list is given
https://jonanderson1000hands.com/pre-order-now.html
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I might actually check it out. ;)
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I am extremely thrilled for this. I didn’t know Jon knew Chick Corea!
Also, Alan White was mentioned, but does he appear on the album?
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I didn’t know Jon knew Chick Corea!
Yeah, that's a combination that could lead to some crazy things. ♫♫
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Necro-Post Update!
So this is an odd one, and also odd to fit properly into the Discography, for reasons that will hopefully become apparent. But I recently picked this up, and I really like it, so I decided to include it here.
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After the 2004 tour, the final tour featuring the classic lineup of Anderson-Howe-Squire-Wakeman-White and which produced Songs from Tsongas (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=32530.msg1407312#msg1407312), Yes took another break. As I mentioned in the writeup for the next studio album, Fly From Here (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=32530.msg1410908#msg1410908), there are conflicting stories about what exactly happened, but the short version is that Jon Anderson and Rick Wakeman were gone, leaving Yes once again in search of both a lead singer and a keyboard player.
Rick Wakeman's son Oliver is also a keyboard player, and a pretty good one. He appeared on Steve Howe's album Spectrum (2005) and had worked with him on other projects. Howe had appeared previously on Oliver Wakeman's The 3 Ages of Magick (2001). Oliver Wakeman also played keyboards for Starcastle (replacing Herb Schildt) in 2007 for their appearance as RoSfest. Steve Howe suggested Wakeman as the new keyboard player, to which Squire and White agreed.
Benoit David of the band Mystery was also the lead singer for a Yes tribute band called Close to the Edge, and that is how they found him. This lineup did a short tour, which was documented on the live album In the Present - Live from Lyon (2011), released in 2011 but recorded on the brief 2009 tour.
(https://i.imgur.com/b0hVWMo.jpg)
I didn't originally include In the Present - Live from Lyon in this discography for the simple reason that I didn't have it, had never heard it, and had heard that it wasn't great. Yes (or rather their management) is notorious for releasing live albums and other compilations to fill the breaks between studio albums, and considering how many breaks and lineup changes they've had, there seems to be plenty of material to mine for this purpose, so I didn't exactly consider this one mandatory. After Trevor Horn was brought in to produce the next Yes album (the aforementioned Fly From Here), we soon learned that Oliver Wakeman was out and Geoff Downes was in as the keyboard player. And the rest is history.
We now know that there was some material recorded with Oliver Wakeman on keyboards prior to his leaving the band, and he has kept the tapes all this time. Two songs were basically completed but not used ("To The Moment" and "Words on a Page"), and a third was mostly completed and also not used ("The Gift of Love"). Wakeman worked with all three and created finished songs from them. He also resurrected a fourth tune ("From the Turn of a Card") which he had written for the album and which eventually appeared in a different form on an instrumental album by Wakeman and Gordon Giltrap called Ravens and Lullabies (2013) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ravens_%26_Lullabies). At Wakeman's request, Benoit David sings on this track, as Wakeman had originally written it for his voice. Wakeman also recorded a new piano track for the song, making it a "new" Yessong.
These four songs have been approved by Yes (basically Steve Howe and Alan White) for release under the name Yes. The new package is titled From a Page, and it combines the previously unreleased material from the early Fly From Here sessions with the previously released Live from Lyon material, forming a complete document of the David-Howe-Squire-Wakeman-White lineup.
From a Page (2019)
(https://i.imgur.com/tEI2W8k.jpg)
Benoit David - Lead Vocals
Steve Howe - Guitar, Vocals
Chris Squire - Bass, Vocals
Oliver Wakeman - Keyboards
Alan White - Drums
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From a Page
To the Moment 6:09
Words on a Page 6:18
From the Turn of a Card 3:24
The Gift of Love 9:52
In the Present - Live from Lyon
Siberian Khatru 10:39
I've Seen All Good People 7:17
Tempus Fugit 6:05
Onward 4:38
Astral Traveller 8:49
Yours Is No Disgrace 13:23
And You and I 11:27
Corkscrew 3:49
Second Initial 3:19
Owner of a Lonely Heart 6:05
South Side of the Sky 10:44
Machine Messiah 11:41
Heart of the Sunrise 11:43
Roundabout 9:35
Starship Trooper 13:08
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I like this one. I always liked Benoit David's voice. To me, he sounds very much like Drama-era Trevor Horn, which made Fly From Here sound like "Drama II" to me even before people started calling it that. (They even had Horn record new vocals for Fly From Here and released the results, calling it Fly Fom Here - Return Trip, making it truly "Drama II".)
I can understand why some fans had trouble with David as the lead singer. He does struggle from time to time to reach the same notes that Jon Anderson did with the same grace and seeming effortlessness. But there are some songs that he nails. Yes have had so many lead singers by now that I don't really care that he's not Jon Anderson. No one is, including Jon Anderson anymore. Plus, it's great to get live versions of Drama songs "Tempus Fugit" and "Machine Messiah". They both totally smoke, and with David's vocals sounding so much like a live Trevor Horn (and honestly, a bit better), it's like having the Drama lineup again. Even better.
This package was released last year, and I made a mental note to pick it up sometime, but they'd bundled it with a previously released album, and some people had trouble with that. But with only four new songs, it barely qualified as an EP, so releasing it individually didn't make much sense either. Fortunately, I'd never picked up Live from Lyon, so once I was reminded of this release, it was a no-brainer.
The studio tracks sound great. As far as I'm concerned, they're four "lost" Yes tracks that have been found again. I hear Steve Howe on guitar, Chris Squire on bass, Alan White on drums, all sounding great. I hear a Wakeman on keyboards sounding very much like his father but also very good in his own right, and I hear a familiar voice on lead vocals. This is Yes music.
And the live material is fine. A few rough spots, so I guess I understand why people complained, but overall I think it's fine. Yes music is hard to play, and Benoit David is not the only one who messes up once in a while. I prefer my live albums "warts and all", it feels much live that way. So this is more Yes material, both studio and live stuff from a lineup I'd never heard before.
Recommended, especially if you don't already have Live from Lyon , and even if you do, if you're a completist.
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I think it takes quite the amount of oddness to be considered "an odd one" in the Yes discography :lol But yeah, this band never fails to surprise when it comes to weird release choices. To this day, it's not possible to buy this via Amazon or listen to it on streaming services. It's the same with 1000 Hands by Jon Anderson and Fly From Here: Return Trip, but the latter is now available on Amazon.
I'm very curious to hear these songs, I have only heard the "single". But I don't really wanna pay 30 pounds/35€ (including shipping) for a 25 minute EP on vinyl. I don't buy CDs and I have no interest in owning the Lyon concert, because I heard it and... yeah. You were very merciful when reviewing this live album in my opinion :lol
On one thing I really have to disagree though: Jon Anderson is still Jon Anderson. This dude is in his mid-seventies and he sings like a 22 year old. I saw him at the Night Of The Prog with ARW, and he was amazing.
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Fritzinger, I was going to say the same thing. I saw him a year or so ago in a 500 seat theater (got to meet him too; while I'm not blind to his history of being prickly, for the short time he was with me, he was charming and engaged; I had Going For The One with me, and when I noted it was my favorite album of all time by any band he looked at me like "for real?". It was... well, cute, if you can use that word for a conversation between a 51 and 73/74 year old man!).
He played a full set, mostly Yes songs, and he NAILED them. I didn't notice any tuning down, and there was very little re-arranging. Starship Trooper - one of the last songs - was almost breathtaking.
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I should have mentioned that From a Page is only available from a couple of different online sources, including none of the usual ones. I got mine from Burning Shed.
Yes, it's a lot of money for four songs. For four new songs that I really wanted to hear, plus a live album I didn't already have, I figured it was worth it (especially since, for reasons I won't go into right now, it was basically free). Live from Lyon isn't great, but there are some great moments. So what the hell. I was listening to it again the other day, and it occurred to me that I should probably add it to the Discography, since it's an official Yes release that I hadn't covered.
I'd heard that Jon was back in form, but okay, I'd forgotten. I saw some video he did a while back with a youth orchestra, and people were raving about it, but I thought it was kinda bad. He did sound better on the few ARW videos I watched.
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The youth orchestra opened for him when I saw him. I can't find the setlist, but to see high school girls in tight skirts playing "South Side Of The Sky" (if I remember correctly, one of the songs they played), is an emotionally conflicting experience. :)
(I'm kidding; I mean no disrespect. The orchestra I saw was a rotating group of about 10 or 12 kids - "kids" meaning high school age - and they played I think five or so rock/prog classics and they were quite impressive. VERY impressive, actually.)
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwspoyRdeV0
I'm just gonna leave this here... Jon is a master
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If I found any post 2002 live CD/DVD inexpensively, I might be inclined to look into it. I just have a felling that tempo issues would bother me.
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Tempo issues are the number one thing that turns me off from some later live releases. Some songs are the same as they've always been, but some feel like they just drag, and it's really noticeable. And once you notice it, it's annoying.
There are only a few on Live from Lyon, but that unfortunately includes the very first song, so instead of hitting you fast and hard from the start, it opens with "uhhhhhh..." But I was half expecting it, and I knew I was gonna listen to the whole thing anyway. I mean, I bought it, might as well dig in. After a few songs I didn't even think about it. I just heard five very talented guys playing some amazing music. At that point, I didn't care if the singer wasn't the guy I'm used to, or the keyboard player, or whoever. I was just digging some new (to me) live Yes, from a lineup I'd never checked out before. And like I said, it was basically free for me, so why not?
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I remember a friend a while back talking up the Montreux version of South Side of the Sky to me, but when I checked it out, I was like, "Are they playing it in slow motion?" It sounds so slow and plodding. I get that capturing the original vibe of a song is sometimes not possible, but slowing down the tempo the way they did on that one was a major blunder.
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I remember a friend a while back talking up the Montreux version of South Side of the Sky to me, but when I checked it out, I was like, "Are they playing it in slow motion?" It sounds so slow and plodding. I get that capturing the original vibe of a song is sometimes not possible, but slowing down the tempo the way they did on that one was a major blunder.
You're talking about the 2003 show, right? I just listened to the original album version, which has a tempo of about 80-81 bpm, while the Montreux version is about 75-76 bpm. It is a bit slower, but not by a lot IMO.
The dragging tempo feels more apparent in this video (https://youtu.be/n4XdHSebI8I) from 2014, where it feels like 72 bpm. I'd say most of their tempos were pretty good until Jon Anderson left the band, but I've really not listened to much live Yes in the last decade or so to really say for sure.
-Marc.
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Started reading through this thread ever since it was revived a few weeks back. I have all the studio releases from 'The Yes Album' on through 'Magnification', along with ABWH, 'Yessongs', and Steve Howe's 'Turbulence'. Saw the band in concert during the Union tour, and a few years back with Peter Frampton opening. They cancelled a Kalamazoo Big Generator stop.
Anyhoo.....am enjoying the ride down memory lane, with very good posts all around.
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I remember a friend a while back talking up the Montreux version of South Side of the Sky to me, but when I checked it out, I was like, "Are they playing it in slow motion?" It sounds so slow and plodding. I get that capturing the original vibe of a song is sometimes not possible, but slowing down the tempo the way they did on that one was a major blunder.
You're talking about the 2003 show, right? I just listened to the original album version, which has a tempo of about 80-81 bpm, while the Montreux version is about 75-76 bpm. It is a bit slower, but not by a lot IMO.
The dragging tempo feels more apparent in this video (https://youtu.be/n4XdHSebI8I) from 2014, where it feels like 72 bpm. I'd say most of their tempos were pretty good until Jon Anderson left the band, but I've really not listened to much live Yes in the last decade or so to really say for sure.
2003, yes. I guess even though it is technically not that much slower, it just feels a lot slower. Despite not being a fast-paced song on record, the original has this kind of dark, almost dangerous, feel and vibe, where it probably feels faster than it really is.
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Is there seriously anything better than 5:13 onward in Turn Of The Century? If I was to pick my favorite segment of music ever it might be this. Steve Howe going apeshit on guitar with Jon reciting the last verse over orchestral drums and bass....it's absolutely glorious.
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One of my all-time favorite songs. Steve is amazing throughout, from the jubilant, joyous runs when the statue comes to life, to the delicate, introspective licks that open and close the piece. And of course the duet between him and Wakeman during the break. Just an incredible performance from everyone involved. ♫♫
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Is there seriously anything better than 5:13 onward in Turn Of The Century? If I was to pick my favorite segment of music ever it might be this. Steve Howe going apeshit on guitar with Jon reciting the last verse over orchestral drums and bass....it's absolutely glorious.
Well...I'd say there's something better on the other side of the album -- roughly the last 5 1/2 minutes of Awaken. But that's not a knock on TOTC, which is, indeed, stellar (as you and Orbert mentioned). Awaken's just on a higher level.
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Is there seriously anything better than 5:13 onward in Turn Of The Century? If I was to pick my favorite segment of music ever it might be this. Steve Howe going apeshit on guitar with Jon reciting the last verse over orchestral drums and bass....it's absolutely glorious.
Well...I'd say there's something better on the other side of the album -- roughly the last 5 1/2 minutes of Awaken. But that's not a knock on TOTC, which is, indeed, stellar (as you and Orbert mentioned). Awaken's just on a higher level.
I would easily place both of those songs inside my top ten Yes songs. TOTC is such a unique and beautiful piece of music.
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Is there seriously anything better than 5:13 onward in Turn Of The Century? If I was to pick my favorite segment of music ever it might be this. Steve Howe going apeshit on guitar with Jon reciting the last verse over orchestral drums and bass....it's absolutely glorious.
That ending is definitely awesome, probably my favorite part of the Going for the One album, which admittedly isn't one of my favorites. Turn of the Century is the one song from it that would make my Yes top 25. :hat :hat
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I think, before Yes recorded Turn Of The Century, Jon Anderson said something like: "let's try to tell a story with this song... and then I will start to sing".
Awaken is from another world, I agree. But my favorite part is the mellow middle-section. The organ just creates such a great atmosphere. For me, maybe the best moment on the album and one of Yes' best moments overall. Going For The One gets far too little praise.
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It took me a while to get into Turn of the century, but now it's one of my favorite Yes songs of all time. The entire song is gorgeous, but from the instrumental onward it's just perfect. I love how all five members are involved, yet it sounds so skeletal and simple.
The live version on Songs from Tsongas is even better than the studio version. PLEASE, do yourself a favour and check it out.
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Is there seriously anything better than 5:13 onward in Turn Of The Century? If I was to pick my favorite segment of music ever it might be this. Steve Howe going apeshit on guitar with Jon reciting the last verse over orchestral drums and bass....it's absolutely glorious.
Well...I'd say there's something better on the other side of the album -- roughly the last 5 1/2 minutes of Awaken. But that's not a knock on TOTC, which is, indeed, stellar (as you and Orbert mentioned). Awaken's just on a higher level.
That moment in Awaken is incredible too, especially when the organ really kicks in. There's just something about that release at 5:13 after the long buildup in TOTC that is pure elation that I don't really get from many other songs.
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5:13 is where the statue comes to life (as far as I've always understood the story) and all of his work comes to fruition, and they are reunited. Such an awesome moment.
But in the live version, Steve's tone is much thinner, and I don't feel that it has the same effect. Rick's keyboards behind it aren't as full, either. The same huge moment in the studio version just doesn't come across the same way in the live version. It's a great version, but I can't put it above the perfection which is the studio version.
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So, Going For The One is my favorite album by any band ever (got Jon to sign it not long ago!)
I think TOTC is the high point of the album (Awaken is my third favorite song on the record) and just a beautifully composed piece of art. I actually used that song (and Ripples, by Genesis) as a basis of a college essay, and I've used that song as an example to my daughter about how instrumental music can tell it's own story.
Tastes, yadda yadda, but that is my single favorite example of how the five disparate sounds of the band meld together to something much greater than the sum of the parts. That bass line is so simple - for Squire - and yet it's the heartbeat (figuratively AND literally) of the whole song.
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5:13 is where the statue comes to life (as far as I've always understood the story) and all of his work comes to fruition, and they are reunited. Such an awesome moment.
But in the live version, Steve's tone is much thinner, and I don't feel that it has the same effect. Rick's keyboards behind it aren't as full, either. The same huge moment in the studio version just doesn't come across the same way in the live version. It's a great version, but I can't put it about the perfection which is the studio version.
I've checked out a few live versions and feel the same. The power behind that entire section is lost a bit. I have the same issue with The Flower Kings...the music is so dense on the albums that unless they had multiple keyboardists and guitarists recreating it live, parts are going to get left out.
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Turn Of The Century might be my favorite from this album or it could just as easily be Wonderous Stories or Going For The One. Those would easily be my top 3 from that album anyway.
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The Quest (2021)
(https://imgur.com/G0yGKwW.jpg)
Jon Davison - Vocals, Guitar
Geoff Downes - Keyboards
Steve Howe - Guitars, Mandolin, Steel Guitar, Vocals
Billy Sherwood - Bass, Keyboards, Vocals
Alan White - Drums
Jay Schellen - Percussion
FAME'S Studio Orchestra - Oleg Kondratenko, Conductor
Paul K. Joyce - Orchestra Arrangements
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The Ice Bridge
a. Eyes East
b. Race Against Time
c. Interaction
Dare To Know
Minus The Man
Leave Well Alone
a. Across The Border
b. Not For Nothing
c. Wheels
The Western Edge
Future Memories
Music To My Ears
A Living Island
a. Brave The Storm
b. Wake Up
c. We Will Remember
Bonus Disc
Sister Sleeping Soul
Mystery Tour
Damaged World
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As we all know, Chris Squire died, in 2015. He was the last original member of Yes, the only person to appear on every Yes album, and in many ways the heart of the band. Yes had had multiple lead singers, guitarists, keyboardists, and drummers over the years, several members have come and gone and come back again, but there had only ever been one bassist for Yes. With other bands, this might have raised the question of whether they would continue, but in his final days, Squire made it clear that he wished the band to continue, and furthermore, he named his good friend Billy Sherwood as his successor. Sherwood was previously in Yes from 1997-2000, having played on Open Your Eyes and The Ladder, as well as the tours for both albums. Sherwood was Squire's partner in The Chris Squire Experiment, later Conspiracy, which had led directly to Open Your Eyes, and his relationship with Chris had continued since then. While some believe, perhaps cynically, that Squire naming his successor was meant to give Sherwood credibility and/or help smoothe over any negative feelings about anyone daring to replace Chris Squire, it was in fact the most logical choice. When Squire became too ill to continue the 2015 tour, it was Sherwood who replaced him on stage and finished the tour with Yes. Thus began his second tenure with the band, and he's been playing with them ever since.
The album starts strong with "The Ice Bridge", an upbeat seven-minute song with excellent synth and guitar work and many other hallmarks of the Yes sound. Vocals are strong, with excellent three-part harmonies, powerful drumming, and of course prominent bass work. Sherwood is clearly channeling Squire's signature "lead bass" sound, though primarily on Spector and Spector fretless bass rather than Squire's renowned bi-amped Rickenbacker (Sherwood does play a Rickenbacker on one track). Anyway, it's a nice opener.
Okay, let's get it out in the open. If there was one complaint about the previous album Heaven & Earth, it's that it was too "soft" or too "mellow". Yes has always had a lighter side to balance their heavier side, but Heaven & Earth seemed to have forgotten to bring the heavy at all. I would consider most of Heaven & Earth to be Light Rock more than Rock & Roll. Opening the album with "The Ice Bridge" was clearly meant to dispell the fear that The Quest is more of the same. It works. It's a strong opener, with some progressive feel, and I think it's a good song overall.
It could have gone a few directions from there. Hopefully, the rest of the album continues to kick some ass, at least a little. But for me "The Ice Bridge" is the high point of the album. Some of the other songs have uptempo sections that are reminiscent of Yes of old. Nothing as fiery as "Heart of the Sunrise" or "Sound Chaser" but there's some decent, meaty stuff here. It's just scattered kinda thin. Overall we're more rocking than Heaven & Earth which is a step in the right direction, but still distinctively lower energy than anything that came before it. Somewhere between Fly From Here and Heaven & Earth.
It all sounds fantastic. Steve Howe decided to produce the album, having gotten tired of working with producers who clearly didn't understand Yes as far as he was concerned, and the rest of the band supported this decision. As such, Steve's soaring guitar work is on full display. The vocals are mostly very good, and while the three-part harmonies sound great, I'd like to hear more actual lead vocals. And please, someone tell Steve Howe that he should not sing lead. The duets with Jon D are okay, but they let Steve sing lead sometimes, and quite frankly, that's a mistake.
Oh yeah, real orchestra, too! Tracks 2, 3, and 4 have the FAME'S Studio Orchestra, which is exactly what it sounds like. You can get session guys. If you know someone, you can get a good horn section, or a choir. But sometimes you want a real orchestra to play on your album, which is apparently what the FAME'S Studio Orchestra is for. The website has information about them (https://www.fames-project.com/), but I couldn't find any explanation for why they spell it that way. Anyway, they sound pretty good, too.
Yes has stated that this album represents "where they are today" or something like that. In other words, don't expect another Close to the Edge, or you're just setting yourself up for disappointment. Reviews are mixed though mostly positive. Everything I've read praises how great it all sounds, and that's true. Most mention that the writing and playing could use some more fire. There aren't a lot of melodies that stick with you. Well, there's one chorus that sticks with me because it's repeated ad nauseum, but that's not really a compliment, I'm sorry to say.
One review said that the correct way to listen to this album is with headphones and no expectations. Just let it play, and listen to it. I realized that that was something I hadn't really done, and I should have. In the past, my first listen to a Yes album was always with headphones, to catch every nuance. More recently, it was in the car, cranked up. But I'd been listening to it here on my computer, over the dumb little speakers, and that is not how you listen to a Yes album.
So I listened to in the car, cranked, and it really was much better than I'd thought. It was not the 50-minute snoozefest I'd thought it was (well, 43 minutes after that opening track). There's a lot going on. There's a lot of music here, but you do have to listen actively. It's not all mellow. A few days later, I listened with headphones. Wow! Again, there's a lot music here. I urge others to give this album a listen, a real listen. That's all I'll say about that (for now).
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The credits are weird.
(https://imgur.com/RnUH1iL.jpg)
Six band members, right? Jay Schellen is the sixth photo. He's been playing percussion with them live, and some say that this is because Alan is having trouble keeping up these days. But the booklet has individual credits for each song, who plays what, and Jay is not listed in there anywhere. So my belief is that this is their way of acknowledging Jay's contributions. Bottom line is that he didn't play on the album, but is listed as a member of the band.
Visually, it reminds me of the back of Close to the Edge:
(https://imgur.com/Lc17h9N.jpg)
Eddie Offord was honored in a similar way because of his contributions to the arrangements of the songs. The final arrangements that the band learned and reproduced live were literally what he had cut and pasted together.
The standard version of the album on CD is a two-disc set. InsideOut wanted a 50-minute album, so the main disc is right about 50 minutes, and the second disc has three "bonus tracks". Yes, it could have all fit on a single disc. Deal with it.
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Final thoughts. Overall, a bit better than I'd dare hope, but that's mostly because I tried to keep expectations low. Like, none at all, which is hard to do. Still somehow a disappointment, because it started strong and I really wanted to believe that this band still had some fire left in them. And there is, a little bit. But this is them now.
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I spent a couple of weeks with the album and ended up being underwhelmed overall. There are moments of brilliance, of course, every other track has a memorable bit or two, mostly by Steve Howe, but as a whole, it's not that much more engaging and powerful than Heaven and earth.
And I am starting to think that it's partly to Jon Davison not being my cup of tea. His voice is pleasant, but lacks energy. When he goes up high, like the "It's a double edge sword" line in Minus the man, it just sounds like he's too shy about singing. Other than that, they need to crank up the sound a bit, because I'm confident that the performances themselves are solid.
The bits I like the most are the guitar solo in Minus the man, the chorus in Music to my ears, and the outro to the final track, especially the album phasing out with the word "forevermore." It's a touching moment.
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I totally agree about Jon Davison. Nice voice, but seems rather timid or even weak overall. I feel like a lot of the album is brought down a bit by his "La la la la" over everything the band is doing, giving it all a rather homogenized feel. That, and most of the vocals being in harmony rather than true lead vocals. Yes has always had both, and Jon A could bring a real strength and energy despite his voice being high and sometimes airy. I don't feel that at all from Jon D. He seems content to just sing sweetly and nicely, mostly in harmony. And it all sounds nice; it's just not particularly engaging.
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Look back in this thread and I've said the same things about Jon D. For all his "airy fairy" nonsense, Jon A. was/is a great ROCK singer. He held his own with Squire and White and Howe at full flight. The live albums really show the difference. Jon D. has the tone, has the range, but he doesn't quite have the grit, or the power, that Jon A. had (in the band; I saw him live right before COVID and he still has it live. He SLAYED.)
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Mirror to the Sky (2023)
(https://imgur.com/BebFrkw.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/02XKVzY.jpg)
Jon Davison - Lead Vocals, Acoustic Guitar
Geoff Downes - Keyboards
Steve Howe - Guitars, Mandolin, Autoharp, Vocals
Jay Schellen - Drums, Percussion
Billy Sherwood - Bass, Vocals
FAME'S Studio Orchestra - Oleg Kondratenko, Conductor
Paul K. Joyce - Orchestra Arrangements
Produced by Steve Howe
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Cut From the Stars 5:25
All Connected 9:03
Luminosity 9:00
Living Out Their Dream 4:45
Mirror to the Sky 13:53
Circles of Time 4:54
Bonus Disc
Unknown Place 8:12
One Second is Enough 4:04
Magic Potion 4:08
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Yes continues their trend of never releasing more than two albums in a row with the same lineup, and after the 1970's, rarely more than one. While the trend continues, the reasons are sadly different now. Chris Squire passed in 2015, making Heaven & Earth his final album. We lost Alan White in 2022, making The Quest his final album.
Just as Billy Sherwood was Chris Squire's understudy and was specifically chosen by Chris to continue in his place after his passing, Jay Schellen was the obvious choice to replace Alan White full time. Jay had filled in for Alan on the 2016 Topographic Drama tour when Alan injured his back, and due to Alan's ongoing health issues continued to join them on stage as a second drummer/percussionist. On May 22, 2022, Yes announced that Jay would be the sole drummer on the upcoming tour, again citing Alan's health. Alan died days later, on May 26, 2022. Mirror to the Sky is dedicated to him.
To be honest, this album caught me by surprise. I think there'd been a few announcements in 2022 saying that they were working on new material, but these days, I'll believe it when I see it. Then on March 10, 2023, the lead single "Cut from the Stars" was released, and that same day the release date of the album itself (May 26, 2023) was announced.
"Cut from the Stars" (Davison/Sherwood) is the opening track, and it's a good one. The first thing we hear is the FAME'S Studio Orchestra, but I guess I hadn't really thought about that on my first few listens and assumed it was keyboards. I'd avoided reading any credits or even previewing the single when it came out. I wanted my first listen or two to be as unspoiled as possible. Anyway, it's a quick little orchestral line, then the rest of the band comes in and the first real thing that catches my ears is Jay Schellen's bass playing. He's totally channeling Chris Squire here. Not Chris' trademark bi-amped Rickenbacker, but a solid "lead bass" sound and his fingers giving us very Squire-like licks. I don't care if Jay is deliberately trying to sound like Chris or it's just how he feels the bass in Yes should be (probably a bit of both), it works for me and sounds great. The song continues to open up, good old Yes three-part vocals come in, and off we go. There are a some tempo changes and other proggy things, but at 5:25 we're not going full epic or anything. Still, it's a proggy yet pretty accessible song, and sets the tone.
Hmmm. The second track "All Connected" (Davison/Howe/Sherwood) in an interesting choice, in terms of placement. To me, after that great opening track, I'm ready for more, but also half-fearing that I'll be let down by the next song. It's happened before, more than once, by some of my favorite prog rock bands who are still progging but not always bringing the rock and roll. But from Steve Howe's point of view, a longer, proggier tune is what we need next, and yeah it starts pretty mellow, but give it some time and let it grow. We're still building here. Also, he's obviously been aching to break out a wailing steel guitar solo, so here it is. It's a pretty good song, if a bit light, and has some nice changes.
"Luminosity" (Davison/Howe/Sherwood) went through a few changes during its development. It started as "Luminous" and they recorded it that way originally, but they continued to work with the song, adding more and more parts until Steve decided that they should rename it because it was now "a bigger tune". So they recorded it again, renaming it "Luminosity".
Up to this point, most of the vocals have been in harmony. It may be cynical, but I almost think that this was intentional, a way to hopefully minimize the ongoing criticism that Jon Davison is simply not as a strong a lead singer as Jon Anderson. He sings in the same range, and when blended with Steve and Billy, the three-part Yes sound is there. But as a solo vocalist, his voice is just naturally lighter in timbre. With "Luminosity" we get more solo vocals, so the comparisons are going to come. Still, it's a pretty good song, if still a bit on the lighter side, and ends nicely with another wailing steel guitar solo. Go, Steve.
You noticed that he produced this album, just as he did the last one, right? Hey, someone has to carry the Yes torch, and at this point Steve is obviously the one to do it. Also, Geoff Downes is on the album, but I still feel like he's not really there the way a Yes keyboard player should be on a Yes album. Nice pads and fills, some synth here and there, but not a lot to make you take notice and go "Yeah, Geoff Downes on keyboards!" Not that we did that a lot anyway. But seriously, where is he?
And then the next song, "Living Out Their Dream" (Howe/Downes), finally gives it to us! Drum fills, rocking guitar, weird unison things, another steel guitar solo... wait! That was a synth, wasn't it? So he is on this album. Jon and Steve do a "vocal duet" on this track. It's interesting. I think they credited it that way because it's really got a lot of Steve Howe on lead vocals, and that's all I'm going to say about that for now. But hey, a rocker! I am pleased overall.
"Mirror to the Sky" (Davison/Howe) is the title track, the longest track, and the only real "epic" on the album. "All Connected" and "Luminosity" at nine minutes apiece are pretty cool, expansive songs, no doubt, but "Mirror to the Sky" really feels like it takes you on a journey. Rocks out, mellows out, rocks out some more, and goes through some really nice changes, yet so organic sounding that when one of the changes includes an orchestra coming in, it sounds perfectly natural. Definitely one of the highlights of the album.
"Circles of Time" (Davison) closes the main album. * After the title epic, it's a nice little song to wind things down, if a bit "twee". IMO it's probably the weakest track on the album, but Steve heard it and insisted that they develop it and put it on the album. So here it is.
* Yes, they've again given us a two-disc set, with a main album and a "Bonus Disc" when everything could have fit onto a single CD. But who buys CDs anymore anyway? And if you do buy CDs, more is better, right?
"Unknown Place" (Howe) is the first track on the Bonus Disc but is one of my favorite tracks on the album overall. Jon and Steve once again share vocal duties, but it's somehow not as offensive as before, perhaps because they're clearly going for something different here. Steve's voice is still dull and lifeless, but the contrast between his and Jon's voice is interesting and at least adds a different texture. Also, the song rocks out a bit, with Geoff finally rocking out on the Hammond, swapping fours with Steve a few times, and even a jam involving church organ and acoustic guitar (with some tasty bass and drums as well).
"One Second is Enough" (Howe) opens with keyboards, Geoff on the Hammond again, and you realize that you've heard as many interesting keyboard licks on the bonus tracks so far (only 10 seconds into the second one) as on the entire main album. I don't know why that is. As I've mentioned elsewhere, I always thought that there'd be more collaboration between Steve and Geoff, due to their being mainstays in both Yes and Asia for years, but we have the one co-written song (which is pretty good) which features them both, but beyond that Geoff's contributions are largely relegated to the Bonus Tracks. I won't suggest that that's intentional on Steve's part, since it's also entirely possible that these last three tracks were considered weaker overall for different reasons. But it's weird.
"Magic Potion" (Howe) closes the second disc with a nice little song with a message right out of the 60's: "love is the magic potion". But what the heck. Vocals are fine, bass work is great, Steve's hook line is cool (though a bit repetitive after a while), and at 4:08 it doesn't overstay its welcome.
Total play time of both discs is 1:03:34.
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Final thoughts. Just as The Quest was a step up from Heaven & Earth, we take another step up here. I've actually returned to this album a few times just to listen to it because it's new Yes music and it's pretty good. No, it's not going to displace Close to the Edge or Going for the One any time soon, or ever, but it's a good listen, easily the strongest of the Davison-era albums.
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I was really underwhelmed by this one as well. The Quest sounds like a great album in comparison. The two nine minute tracks fly by as if nothing happens within those twenty minutes of the album. The closer is a ballad that isn't too offensive, but not something I particulary want to return to. The remaining tracks are fine, though not great.
I'm not sure what exactly doesn't do it for me. It doesn't rock quite enough, Jon's vocals are a bit too soft for my taste, and melodically, non of it is that memorable. This is one of my least favorite Yes albums, along with Open your eyes, Union and the debut.
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I should probably go back and listen to The Quest again. I spun it many times over the first few weeks and it never clicked. This one clicked right away. Maybe since I keep lowering my expectations, I continue to not be disappointed. But the high points of Mirror to the Sky are pretty high. I don't even remember any high points on The Quest past the opening song.