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General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: matt1722 on September 23, 2011, 02:53:14 AM
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Hello All, first off let me preface this by saying that I did a couple of searches for this and found nothing so I do apologize if there is already a thread for this.
Anyway I just wanted to start a Thread for the Pumpkins and their fans, especially since we have the ongoing album experience "Teargarden By Kaleidyscope" and the album within that album Oceania coming out hopefully by the end of this year or early next year.
One last thing we also have the reissues of Gish through Machina I and yes an official release of Machina II.
So how about it, any Pumpkin fans here?
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Siamese Dream was the second or third album I ever heard - still amazing today.
I eagerly look forward to the Machina II official release, though I do have the best quality release you can get of the previous release, it's not perfect.
Teargarden has been pretty awesome so far too, much better than Zeitgeist bar the drumming.
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I've been fan of Smashing Pumpkins since back in 98.
Siamese Dream is one of my favorite albums
and Mellon Collie is fantastic also.
And Even though Adore gets kind of a bad rap, I absolutely love it. Whenever I'm feeling really frustrated, or down, I can put that album on and by the end, I feel much, much better.
Also, This thread has reminded me that I don't listen to the Smashing Pumpkins enough.
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This could be my favorite SNL performance of all time:
https://www.mojvideo.com/video-smashing-pumpkins-cherub-rock-live-on-saturday-night-live/0f41b5cd21ead910c910
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Siamese Dream, Mellon Collie, and Adore is a fantastic 3-run of albums, and one of the best ever. My favorite has always been Adore.
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Hello I guess I wanted to give this thread a bit of a bump just to talk about the new remasters. In November The Pumpkins we'll be getting new remasters of Gish and Siamese Dream, it looks like both will have some unheard songs or at least unreleased songs.
Here's the Siamese Dream "Box Set"
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005MW8CUG/ref=ox_ya_os_product (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005MW8CUG/ref=ox_ya_os_product)
And Here's Gish
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005MW8CLK/ref=ox_ya_os_product (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005MW8CLK/ref=ox_ya_os_product)
So anyone else excited??? I've got mine on preorder from amazon.
Oh and for anyone interested, the man Billy Corgan, said we would be getting remasters of all the pumpkins albums including Machina II getting an offical release.
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Those look really awesome, I wish I weren't a broke student now :(
I look forward to a Machina II release for sure, though the best quality vinyl rip is pretty much as good as it gets anyway - but I think Machina II is good enough that it deserves a real release.
I never got what people didn't like about Machina.
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I never bought any albums by them so bring on those remasters.
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Love this band and all of their "eras"...in fact, I love bands with "eras"....Kiss, Sabbath, Van Halen, even DT...they all have different eras and that makes it super fun to be a fan.
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Gish. Siamese Dream. Mellon Collie. :coolio
Adore. Machina. :tup
Zeitgeist :)
Everything Since... :lol :\ :lol :\
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Siamese Dream is a masterpiece.
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If this is Smashing Pumpkins then so were Zwan.
Zwan had a female bassist and Jimmy Chamberlain.
Why not call this Zwan?
Blatantly just using the SP name.
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Siamese Dream is a masterpiece.
This times a million.
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the preorders are now live on the official site for the Gish and Siamese Dream remasters.
i wish they would've included the 24/96 WAV digital version with the deluxe physical and/or vinyl releases, though. i'm not paying another $30 for the hi res downloads.
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Hm, those look kinda cool. I've never gotten into the pumpkins much, so maybe this is a good time to do so.
It's cool that they're offering flacc and wave versions of the files. I wish more bands would do that.
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If this is Smashing Pumpkins then so were Zwan.
Zwan had a female bassist and Jimmy Chamberlain.
Why not call this Zwan?
Blatantly just using the SP name.
I guess that's kinda true haha. . . although It wouldn't even be Zwan anymore though as Jimmy is no longer in the band, I think Billy is going more along the lines of "I am The Smashing Pumpkins" which sounds a bit weird but it's not to farfetched I mean when James Iha and D'arcy Wretzky were still in the band Billy would often redo some of there parts if he didn't like them.
Also if you look at Zeitgeist in the credits it say's Jimmy Chamberlin: Drums, Billy Corgan: All The Rest.
That being said, I do miss the old Gish, Siamese Dream, Mellon Collie days.
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I had and am having a really hard time getting over Jimmy leaving...I am trying to enjoy the Teargarden stuff but it's honestly all over the place...Zeitgeist had me so excited but Jimmy leaving was a huge blow.
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when James Iha and D'arcy Wretzky were still in the band Billy would often redo some of there parts if he didn't like them.
that's literally the story of Siamese Dream. nearly every track besides drums on every song is Corgan.
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It's acknowledged by all 4 members of the original lineup that Mellon Collie was the only legitimate group effort.
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I had and am having a really hard time getting over Jimmy leaving...I am trying to enjoy the Teargarden stuff but it's honestly all over the place...Zeitgeist had me so excited but Jimmy leaving was a huge blow.
This, I'd have to say, I was beyond happy when it was announced that JC and BC were getting back together, and they made IMO a great album with Zeitgeist. Matt Byrne is a good drummer but like someone said I do agree Teargarden has been a little all over the place, but I'm sure we'll have more consistency when Oceania comes out.
Matt
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I had and am having a really hard time getting over Jimmy leaving...I am trying to enjoy the Teargarden stuff but it's honestly all over the place...Zeitgeist had me so excited but Jimmy leaving was a huge blow.
This, I'd have to say, I was beyond happy when it was announced that JC and BC were getting back together, and they made IMO a great album with Zeitgeist. Matt Byrne is a good drummer but like someone said I do agree Teargarden has been a little all over the place, but I'm sure we'll have more consistency when Oceania comes out.
Matt
So, is the Teargarden thing over or is the Oceana just a part of it?
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From what I know, the Oceania tracks aren't on Teargarden at all. I think they're releasing this to stay relevant while still doing the Teargarden thing.
Or I'm completely wrong.
$30 for those remasters? Holy shit. Might have to wait before I spend money.
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I had and am having a really hard time getting over Jimmy leaving...I am trying to enjoy the Teargarden stuff but it's honestly all over the place...Zeitgeist had me so excited but Jimmy leaving was a huge blow.
This, I'd have to say, I was beyond happy when it was announced that JC and BC were getting back together, and they made IMO a great album with Zeitgeist. Matt Byrne is a good drummer but like someone said I do agree Teargarden has been a little all over the place, but I'm sure we'll have more consistency when Oceania comes out.
Matt
So, is the Teargarden thing over or is the Oceana just a part of it?
Yeah Oceana is part of Teargarden it's going to be an album within an album(Think Inception Only Music :P) judging from what Billy said, so these are part of those 44 songs on Teargarden. Billy said that albums were a "Dead Medium" that's why they're doing Teargarden the way they are, but honestly I think that he probably realized . . ."Oh Shit one song a month for 44 months !!!!" and that goal wasn't really reached. For the first couple of months we had a song out but then they started to get a little more sporadic.
Now what I think is that the whole Teargarden By Kaleidyscope will be in four major parts. There's the first two EP'S, Then We'll get Oceana, and BC has said that the third EP is on hold untill after that, so I'm guessing there will be EP's 3 and 4, for part 3 of the four parts, and then we'll get either get another album type thing or EP's 5, 6 and possibly 7 ???? who knows really, who knows.
tl;dr answer No Teargarden's not dead, but instead Oceana is part of it, An album within and album.
@Nel
Yeah 30 is pretty steep for each release, but I'm hoping that all the extra stuff like the artwork related things will be worth it. And the extra discs should definitely be worth it.
Matt.
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Teargarden's material may be wobbly, but it's better than Zeitgeist.
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Matt, do you know if the extra cuts on the re-issues are the same versions that appeared on Pisces Iscariot (i.e., Hello Kitty Kat)...they have titles that suggest they are new versions but there are only a couple of songs that "*" ...which indicated a previously unreleased track.
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Matt, do you know if the extra cuts on the re-issues are the same versions that appeared on Pisces Iscariot (i.e., Hello Kitty Kat)...they have titles that suggest they are new versions but there are only a couple of songs that "*" ...which indicated a previously unreleased track.
From what I'm seeing no they're not the same versions, I think there may be one or two similar tracks but there different versions, ex "Frail and Bedazzled"
Plus I think that Pisces Iscariot may be one off the reissues coming out.
You can check out the the track listings of both Gish and Siamese Dream remasters on https://www.smashingpumpkins.com/ (https://www.smashingpumpkins.com/)
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So the Oceania songs are part of Teargarden? Hm. Not sure if I want it now. I was planning on just buying the whole damn thing when they release the box set in 2013.
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I'll check out Oceania since all the Teargarden stuff so far has sounded terrible so this might be a bit better.
But it's not SP without at least one other Pumpkin.
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I'll check out Oceania since all the Teargarden stuff so far has sounded terrible so this might be a bit better.
But it's not SP without at least one other Pumpkin.
...how? It's already been shown that he has done the majority of the work in all of the band's history bar a couple of years.
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Just doesn't seem like it should be called SP. It's always been Jimmy and Billy. Now it's just Billy.
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Just doesn't seem like it should be called SP. It's always been Jimmy and Billy. Now it's just Billy.
Except on Adore ;)
No, I hear you and totally feel your sentiment here. Jimmy was such a key part of the "sound" so I was very sad when he decided to leave. Not sure what the whole story was there but I'm sad they couldn't work it out.
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From what I'm seeing no they're not the same versions, I think there may be one or two similar tracks but there different versions, ex "Frail and Bedazzled"
Plus I think that Pisces Iscariot may be one off the reissues coming out.
indeed, there's two or three tracks total that have been previously released. however, the only song not previously heard may be "USSR" on the SD reissue (if it doesn't turn out to be a title of a previously known demo that was called something else).
and Pisces is scheduled for Record Store Day 2012, or so is the last word so far.
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Just doesn't seem like it should be called SP. It's always been Jimmy and Billy. Now it's just Billy.
Except on Adore ;)
No, I hear you and totally feel your sentiment here. Jimmy was such a key part of the "sound" so I was very sad when he decided to leave. Not sure what the whole story was there but I'm sad they couldn't work it out.
Wikipedia says Billy fired him. But that's probably Billy making out that it was Billy's decision.
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This time around I'm pretty sure Jimmy left on his own decisions, however I think he was fired pre Adore, because of drugs. Here's what JC said about his departure this time around. "a positive move forward for me. I can no longer commit all of my energy into something that I don't fully possess" . . . Like WilliamMunny said Wikipeda says BC fire JC but I really don't believe it. Billy is IMO a genius, and is definitely a person who needs to be in control, so if he can say that JC was fired and this was his (Billy's) decision then he'll feel better about it. . . God I hope that kinda made some kind of sense.
That being said Jimmy was a big part of the sound like Kotowboy said. He's the kind of drummer that when a track starts up and the drums kick in you can tell it's him, at least this is how it is for me.
Matt
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If I remember correctly, there was a disagreement over what sort of band that they both wanted it to be. Jimmy wanted to be more of a touring band playing the old classics while Billy wanted to make lots of new material like a normal band.
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If I remember correctly, there was a disagreement over what sort of band that they both wanted it to be. Jimmy wanted to be more of a touring band playing the old classics while Billy wanted to make lots of new material like a normal band.
Yeah that sounds about right, which would explain why Jimmy left and why Billy said that he fired him.
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If I remember correctly, there was a disagreement over what sort of band that they both wanted it to be. Jimmy wanted to be more of a touring band playing the old classics while Billy wanted to make lots of new material like a normal band.
Hmmm....that actually makes a lot of sense...thanx for the insight there....for a band that I totally love I've been kinda out of the loop for a few years here...
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And to be honest, I think that Billy is in the right. I would not want to just tour around playing classics, it's a bit of a pitiful existence and a waste of talent and a letdown to the fans really.
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And to be honest, I think that Billy is in the right. I would not want to just tour around playing classics, it's a bit of a pitiful existence and a waste of talent and a letdown to the fans really.
I agree, It would be like being in a The Smashing Pumpkins cover band.
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Hey Guys, I just wanted to give a quick update on the remasters for those who don't know, It looks like as off today both the Gish and Siamese Dream remasters are $22.76 on Amazon, so you could lock in that price now . . .I think that's how amazon works I know they have the pre order price guarantee so I don't know if that's the price you keep or if it goes up or what.
Interesting to note that the price is still $30.00 on the Pumpkins site and they seem to be the same edition so I don't know.
Anyway quick little update for those who are interested.
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Amazon always charges the preorder once it is ready to ship, so the price at the moment is what you are charged. usually it's a process of watching the preorder price slowly drop until it stabilizes and they charge/ship.
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details about Oceania: https://stereogum.com/1016552/the-smashing-pumpkins-oceania-details-2/news/ (https://stereogum.com/1016552/the-smashing-pumpkins-oceania-details-2/news/)
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I was a fan of this band in the late 90's, basically cause they were big on MTV UK which was my only access to new forgein music then, was a fan approximately since the release of Mellon Collie and until I lost interest shortly after Adore, even though I loved the record itself.
I loved their Batman & Robin song and the slower version of it which was on the soundtrack as well. Musically and the video for it gave us a much darker expectation of what the movie is going to be like, only to have a brutal shock when the movie came out heh
I haven't checked out any albums from their new incarnation.
An incident I'll never forget was in 1998 after the debut of the Ava Adore video on MTV, I loved that video and the song so much and I watched it often cause as I said; we didn't get singles there and albums came out month after it's worldwide release dates, anyway I was 14 at the time and my aunt was visiting with her kids and her 5 year old daughter happened to walk in and watch the video with me.
One of the biggest incident to occur in our family as it resulted in what I was told to be countless sleepless nights of nightmares and terror for the little girl and my aunt demanding my severe prosecution and my dad delivered, he took away the receiver so I had no MTV or any foreign channels whatsoever for about two month and I was grounded for a while and received the silent treatment from everyone for a while. Needless to say I could not see what set the little girl off.
But now as I watch the video again I realize I was a moron to allow her to watch that video :lol
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^^^ just watched the Ava Adore video for the first time.
That was pretty sweet and pretty damn creative. Man do I love that album. :heart
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I was a fan of this band in the late 90's, basically cause they were big on MTV UK which was my only access to new forgein music then, was a fan approximately since the release of Mellon Collie and until I lost interest shortly after Adore, even though I loved the record itself.
I loved their Batman & Robin song and the slower version of it which was on the soundtrack as well. Musically and the video for it gave us a much darker expectation of what the movie is going to be like, only to have a brutal shock when the movie came out heh
I haven't checked out any albums from their new incarnation.
An incident I'll never forget was in 1998 after the debut of the Ava Adore video on MTV, I loved that video and the song so much and I watched it often cause as I said; we didn't get singles there and albums came out month after it's worldwide release dates, anyway I was 14 at the time and my aunt was visiting with her kids and her 5 year old daughter happened to walk in and watch the video with me.
One of the biggest incident to occur in our family as it resulted in what I was told to be countless sleepless nights of nightmares and terror for the little girl and my aunt demanding my severe prosecution and my dad delivered, he took away the receiver so I had no MTV or any foreign channels whatsoever for about two month and I was grounded for a while and received the silent treatment from everyone for a while. Needless to say I could not see what set the little girl off.
But now as I watch the video again I realize I was a moron to allow her to watch that video :lol
I had never really watched the video but just did and although I guess I can see some sheltered 5 year old having nightmares based on having seen the video; I definitely don't see the need for the punishment you endured. Sounds like the punishment you got was likely more affecting than what the 5 year old had to deal with.
But that's coming from someone who had an older brother who would make me watch Friday the 13th, Halloween, My Bloody Valentine etc. and would lock me in a room with the lights cut off and play Iron Maiden's "The Number of the Beast" .... lol
Sorry you went through that over some music. The Pumpkins are awesome! :hat
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:lol it's cool we reminisce and laugh about it now.
Indeed a great video, I remember they said it was one long take.
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Just listened to Mellon Collie for the first time in a long while.
Totally forget how incredible it is.
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Bodies.
:omg:
:metal
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How do you guys feel about Machina? I really like this album but it seems to get quite a bit of flak for some reason.
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I prefer it to Adore anyday.
Plus It has great songs.
*syncs on Spotify to listen to later*
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How do you guys feel about Machina? I really like this album but it seems to get quite a bit of flak for some reason.
actually have never heard it, but I'm listening to the samples now for the first time and am I'm liking what I hearing so far, so I think I will pick it up.
I kind of forgot about it, so thanks for bringing it back to my attention.
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Machina is great! The last song on it is one of my favourites too, was a nice way to go out on.
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Raindrops + Sunshowers is pretty much the sequel to Appels + Oranjes
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Machina just arrived in the mail and I am very excited. I just put it on and so far I'm liking what I'm hearing.
All these years I been a massive Pumpkins fan and I somehow never got around to listening to this album. :facepalm:
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To me it's like Adore but with decent songs, loud guitars and drums.
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I wonder how differently things would have went for them if they Machina came out in place of Adore.
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Oceania is streaming for free on Itunes for one week.
https://www.craveonline.com/music/articles/190271-listen-to-smashing-pumpkins-oceania-album-now (https://www.craveonline.com/music/articles/190271-listen-to-smashing-pumpkins-oceania-album-now)
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Listening to it now. So far so good. I don't know if anything is standing out as spectacular yet though.
Billy mentioned that he will be playing it in its entire on the next tour.
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Yeah sounds better than anything post - Zeitgeist. Has a Machina meets Zeitgeist vibe.
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Already loving Siamese Dream, I listened to Mellon Collie today for the first time, both discs.
Really great stuff. I wasn't expecting it to be as good on the first listen (it's 28 songs after all), but I really liked this album. I've already ordered it physically as well, and I can't wait to spin it more, so it will "click" even more. :)
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Never gave these guys a chance because I was always into very underground metal. I heard Corgan was also into underground stuff and then when he guested on Iommi's album he got my stamp of approval.
Still didn't give the band a chance until i found out they were opening their tour in my hometown after he put the band back together. They rented out the theatre for a week and were seen all over town. I bought Zeitgest and loved it. I then got Mellon Collie and couldnt believe how heavy some of the stuff was.
I've really loved all the stuff INCLUDING their new stuff. I've got Oceania ordered. I'll wait to listen to it until it comes and then I can properly hear it in my car.
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Already loving Siamese Dream, I listened to Mellon Collie today for the first time, both discs.
Really great stuff. I wasn't expecting it to be as good on the first listen (it's 28 songs after all), but I really liked this album. I've already ordered it physically as well, and I can't wait to spin it more, so it will "click" even more. :)
Oh Wow, first time listening Siamese Dream and Mellon Collie? These are excellent albums with lots of great material throughout. Hope you enjoy the fuck out of experiencing these! :tup
Never gave these guys a chance because I was always into very underground metal. I heard Corgan was also into underground stuff and then when he guested on Iommi's album he got my stamp of approval.
Still didn't give the band a chance until i found out they were opening their tour in my hometown after he put the band back together. They rented out the theatre for a week and were seen all over town. I bought Zeitgest and loved it. I then got Mellon Collie and couldnt believe how heavy some of the stuff was.
I've really loved all the stuff INCLUDING their new stuff. I've got Oceania ordered. I'll wait to listen to it until it comes and then I can properly hear it in my car.
I'm guessing you are from Asheville? That was a great time during their residency at The Orange Peel. They put on some amazing shows during that stay.
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I guess I don't have a problem with it being a whole new line-up besides Billy.
If the other 3 members don't want to be in the band - what can you do ?
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I'm guessing you are from Asheville? That was a great time during their residency at The Orange Peel. They put on some amazing shows during that stay.
Nah, this was maybe a few months after Zeitgeist was released. It was a short 10-13 date tour or something so not their very first tour with the new lineup. They opened it in Iowa.
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I'm guessing you are from Asheville? That was a great time during their residency at The Orange Peel. They put on some amazing shows during that stay.
Nah, this was maybe a few months after Zeitgeist was released. It was a short 10-13 date tour or something so not their very first tour with the new lineup. They opened it in Iowa.
Oh cool. The residency in Asheville, NC @ The Orange Peel was a bit before the release of Zeitgeist (it leaked online like the day of the show I attended). I only caught one of the 9 shows during their extended stay (I think several weeks) but was there for a few days during the time and Billy and the band pretty much just hung out around town as much as was possible. Was pretty neat.
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I :heart love :heart Siamese Dream, but never really got into the other albums. I probably should give them another shot.
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Already loving Siamese Dream, I listened to Mellon Collie today for the first time, both discs.
Really great stuff. I wasn't expecting it to be as good on the first listen (it's 28 songs after all), but I really liked this album. I've already ordered it physically as well, and I can't wait to spin it more, so it will "click" even more. :)
Oh Wow, first time listening Siamese Dream and Mellon Collie? These are excellent albums with lots of great material throughout. Hope you enjoy the fuck out of experiencing these! :tup
Yeah I've already given Siamese Dream around 10-15 spins and it's really something special, amazing album. Only listened to Mellon Collie once so far, though I'll probably spin it again today. It might take longer time to fully click (since it's more songs) but I feel optimistic. :)
I also love it how the band has ~1 long song per album/CD. I'd say that songs around the 8-9 or 10 minute mark often appeals to me because they get their time to develop, so to speak. I quickly browsed through their catalogue on Wikipedia and with exception for maybe the debut, I believe there was a longer song on each CD.
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I also love it how the band has ~1 long song per album/CD. I'd say that songs around the 8-9 or 10 minute mark often appeals to me because they get their time to develop, so to speak. I quickly browsed through their catalogue on Wikipedia and with exception for maybe the debut, I believe there was a longer song on each CD.
they do a good job of mixing in some epics, particularly on mellon collie.
that two disc set kinda reminded me of the two GNR Illusion albums when it came out...in that theres a great mix of songs on the albums. some punk, some metal, some atmosphere, some quirky stuff, short songs, and some nicely arranged, longer, epic tracks...and thats where i think mellon collie really shines: them tinged-with-atmosphere epics thru the eyes of ruby and porcelina of the vast oceans (simaese dream's soma accomplishes this nicely as well). but also that agressive as fuck epic XYU (if i can call it 'epic'. i could see people taking issue).
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I must say that through Siamese Dream and Mellon Collie, this band is quickly becoming one of my favorites. It's interesting because I knew "Cherub Rock" and "Today" from before (Guitar Hero-games), and I think I might have heard "1979" as well (if it's featured in GTA), but hearing the albums in full is quite the ride.
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also zantera, since (i'll assume) youre very familiar with both right now, have you noticed any similarities between siamese dream and steventree's stupid dream?! a friend and i were heavily discussing stupid dream half a year back as he was devouring stupid dream after aquiring it, and all of a sudden we were making the stupid/siamese comparisons. i dont know how serious we were, but we half concluded that mr.wilson was trying to make a better version of siamese dream with his album.
(i'd probly have to go back and listen to both to see what all was making us find some parallels between the two albums).
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also zantera, since (i'll assume) youre very familiar with both right now, have you noticed any similarities between siamese dream and steventree's stupid dream?! a friend and i were heavily discussing stupid dream half a year back as he was devouring stupid dream after aquiring it, and all of a sudden we were making the stupid/siamese comparisons. i dont know how serious we were, but we half concluded that mr.wilson was trying to make a better version of siamese dream with his album.
(i'd probly have to go back and listen to both to see what all was making us find some parallels between the two albums).
... wat?
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I haven't noticed any comparison. :lol
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Yeah and did you know that In Rainbows syncs up perfectly with Ok Computer ?
You didn't ???
It doesn't.
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oh come on, its not like theyre miles apart.
sure, a hundred yards, maybe...but maybe not.
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Yeah and did you know that In Rainbows syncs up perfectly with Ok Computer ?
You didn't ???
It doesn't.
that one's almost as bad as Kid 17.
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Well release day is here for Oceania at least in the US and after vising two stores I was able to find it at Wal Mart. I don't really like to buy from Wal Mart but they had it in stock and I had some money so what the fuck.
(https://i.imgur.com/aHm7R.jpg)
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Thanks for the heads up! :D Is it any good?
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Thanks for the heads up! :D Is it any good?
haha I don't know yet I'm saving my first listen for when I go walking, (you know even though I was in a car with a fully functioning CD player :lol) gonna do the walk in a couple minutes here though so I'll let you guys know when I get back.
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Alright back from my walk and more importantly the first listen through of Oceania and I've got to say Wow, this album is different but in a good way. It is true there are elements that fans from all era's of the band will recognize there's some old Pumpkins (Gish sounding almost) in there as well as some new (Teargarden) and even some completely different things in there.
A couple more things I have to say. First: Nicole Fiorentino does an amazing job on this album, the Bass can be clearly heard and there are some really cool Bass lines. Mike Byrne also does a very good job, that being said I do miss Jimmy Chamberlin and his signature sound.
So overall I'll say again this is a good album, I enjoyed the first spin but I will be doing a lot more listen thoughs for it to fully click.
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I've listened to Oceania twice so far.
Sure its good, but at this point I don't feel like its great. I'm gonna do a lot of repeated listens though.
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Just had my first listen through and initial favs are:
Panopticon
Inkless
Glissandra
Oceania
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After a few listens they sort out like this for me....
Really Like:
Panopticon
Inkless
Glissandra
Enjoying and could like more with more listens:
Quasar
The Chimera
Oceania
Violet Rays
Hope to have these grow on me some with more listens:
Pale Horse
The Celestials
Not so sure about these:
My Love Is Winter
Pinwheels
Wildflower
WTF?:
One Diamond, One Heart
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im 5 spins in; so far im wishing i liked it more. some standout tracks, but overall it isnt quite holding up; hope its a grower.
intital interpretations:
-not as heavy as i was expecting
-some odd keyboard sounds in there for TSP
-overall theres something of a hollow vibe to the album. a dark cloud hovers over oceania, showering empty raindrops.
(that being said, im prefering the more upbeat and uplifting tracks like pinwheels and the chimera)
(though the celestials and violet rays are both really cool)
(who am i kidding, the more i type here, the more its dawning on me that i probably love the album)
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Been spinning it 3 times or so, great album. Needs more time though.
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Goddamn, I just revisited Siamese Dream and it hit me harder than it ever has, even more than when it first clicked for me. I'm almost in tears from listening to it, and I'm tempted to say I have nothing but pity for anyone who hasn't heard it or doesn't appreciate its music.
Haven't heard the new album yet, but I'll get around to it.
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I just saw that Mellon Collie is getting reissued on vinyl this month. That is so exciting news, it's my favorite Pumpkins album so far, and I was afraid I would have to pay 300 dollars to get it on ebay.
I've also started listening to Adore, which is really good. I can't believe the hate it has gotten, sure it's different from the earlier albums, but not different as in bad. (IMO at least)
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I remember Adore was a change for Pumpkin fans plus the chaos from the keyboard player dying and Chamberlin leaving may have added to it.
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I just saw that Mellon Collie is getting reissued on vinyl this month. That is so exciting news, it's my favorite Pumpkins album so far, and I was afraid I would have to pay 300 dollars to get it on ebay.
uhh, what? the reissue is nowhere near ready. it won't be coming out until the end of the year. where'd you read that?
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I might actually get the Mellon Collie & Machina re-issues :)
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I just saw that Mellon Collie is getting reissued on vinyl this month. That is so exciting news, it's my favorite Pumpkins album so far, and I was afraid I would have to pay 300 dollars to get it on ebay.
uhh, what? the reissue is nowhere near ready. it won't be coming out until the end of the year. where'd you read that?
Oh. A web-store here in Sweden were I normally order stuff, they had it listed as being released in July. (Probably a mistake on their part) Oh well, I can wait.. I was just happy to see that it would be released at all. :D
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Oh, is that re-release of Mellon Collie coming so soon already? Sweet.
And I actually enjoyed Oceania more than I expected. It's different, but still very catchy!
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i gave the album about 25 spins in the first two weeks (have cooled off the past week or so, though i am spinning it now).
somewhere around spin 15 i realized i actually probably like it more than zeitgeist (for sure didnt think i would after the first 3 or 4 spins). also somewhere around spin 15, it dawned on me that Inkless is probably my favorite track.
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Time for a bump.
Really been in a huge Smashing Pumpkins-phase, and I dare to say that they are among my top3 favorite bands ever at this point. I still haven't heard the Machina-albums, Zeitgeist or most of the B-sides, but I'm sort of taking it slow and just really enjoying everything. I've picked up Gish and Pisces Iscariot on Vinyl, also have Siamese Dream, Mellon Collie, Adore and Oceania on CD, so at least a decent start. :P Will probably expand the collection slowly, while it was delayed, I'm super excited about the Mellon Collie reissue before the end of the year, getting it on Vinyl will be awesome. So far I've stayed fairly in tune getting the Vinyl, but I don't have Siamese Dream yet, should probably try to pick it up while it's fairly available everywhere. Maybe Oceania as well.
Ranking so far:
Mellon Collie
Siamese Dream
Pisces Iscariot
Oceania
Adore
Gish
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Bought Pisces Iscariot's box set, kind of miffed that most of these songs are just the bonus tracks from the Gish and Siamese Dream box sets. But whatever, I'm digging it.
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Pisces Iscariot might be the best b-sides collection of any band ever.
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Pisces Iscariot might be the best b-sides collection of any band ever.
I've been listening a lot to it this week, it's really awesome. I also keep hearing good things about The Aeroplane Flies High, should check it out as well.
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Pisces Iscariot might be the best b-sides collection of any band ever.
Damn, I've been a Pumpkins fan for almost 20 years and never heard about this. Just bought it and what a fool I was, because this is awesome.
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Man I totally forgot about Pisces Iscariot! I had it on CD back in the 90's, but it appears to be missing from my collection now. Anyone know what happened to it? One of my sisters probably took it and lost it years ago, huh? Now I'm pissed >:(
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Good to see you've really enjoyed so much of the Pumpkins and glad you picked up Pisces Iscariot too Zantera. It's always been up there for me in my Pumpkins collection.
There's so much great stuff throughout for me. Some albums or collections are more consistent than others but there's always a few gems here or there that seem to blow me away regardless.
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I actually went to the CD-store to ask about the Mellon Collie reissue, because it had a set date for July here, but the people earlier who said it wouldn't come out were very right about it, since it will come out later this year.
Anyhow, when I went to the store I browsed through the Pumpkins stuff, found Pisces Iscariot on Vinyl (the reissue, cool yellow cover) fairly cheap, and I had only heard about it before (that it was a B-sides album) but I just knew I had to buy it. I also picked up Gish because it was SOOO cheap, but that one was also the reissue vinyl.
So yeah I'm really loving this band. They appeal to me on a grander level because of how much they have to offer. The shoegaze-influenced stuff, the dreampop-sounding songs, the mix between heavy and soft, the whole sound itself. I just love it. :hat
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Pisces Iscariot might be the best b-sides collection of any band ever.
I've been listening a lot to it this week, it's really awesome. I also keep hearing good things about The Aeroplane Flies High, should check it out as well.
Definitely. Aeroplane is a compilation of all b-side tracks from the Mellon Collie singles (Bullet With Butterfly Wings, 1979, yadda yadda), and pretty much all of them are damn, damn good.
Pisces Iscariot might be the best b-sides collection of any band ever.
Damn, I've been a Pumpkins fan for almost 20 years and never heard about this. Just bought it and what a fool I was, because this is awesome.
You've been missing out! Better late than never to discover it, though.
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So yeah I'm really loving this band. They appeal to me on a grander level because of how much they have to offer. The shoegaze-influenced stuff, the dreampop-sounding songs, the mix between heavy and soft, the whole sound itself. I just love it. :hat
What a fantastic description of the band.
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Pisces Iscariot might be the best b-sides collection of any band ever.
I've been listening a lot to it this week, it's really awesome. I also keep hearing good things about The Aeroplane Flies High, should check it out as well.
You might want to wait a little to check out Areoplane as it's supposed to be getting the same remaster/re release treatment as Gish, Siamese Dream, and Pisces Iscariot as well as the other Pumpkin studio albums. Also rumor is from what Billy's said is that Areoplane should have two extra bonus discs.
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Yeah I heard about that as well. Awesome news. Feels like a great period getting into the band, everything being re-released again, it's really cool. :tup
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I actually went to the CD-store to ask about the Mellon Collie reissue, because it had a set date for July here, but the people earlier who said it wouldn't come out were very right about it, since it will come out later this year.
Anyhow, when I went to the store I browsed through the Pumpkins stuff, found Pisces Iscariot on Vinyl (the reissue, cool yellow cover) fairly cheap, and I had only heard about it before (that it was a B-sides album) but I just knew I had to buy it. I also picked up Gish because it was SOOO cheap, but that one was also the reissue vinyl.
So yeah I'm really loving this band. They appeal to me on a grander level because of how much they have to offer. The shoegaze-influenced stuff, the dreampop-sounding songs, the mix between heavy and soft, the whole sound itself. I just love it. :hat
You and I are right on about that. I love all kinds of different music and I love when a band can mix it up so well. There is so much to be found throughout that I never get bored and tend to always be excited for the next song.
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Aeroplane is kinda hit/miss with me. but the stuff that hits is fuckin deadly. :metal
also, to anyone that hasnt, check out The End Is The Beginning is The End single. the title track in particular owns. a mix of metal and electronic effects. it was kinda the direction i was expecting them to go following Mellon Collie. not quite, but whatever. but ya, billy's deadly when he mixes the ripping and the electronic.
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Man, I probably had the biggest luck ever today.
Was going out for a drive with my dad, something we do almost daily to play some music in the car but drive somewhere and buy groceries and other daily products. (We have stores close, but we like going to different places)
So we went to this small city outside Gothenburg (40 minute drive) and they have a very small recordstore there. It's probably 1/10th of the size of the big recordstore here in Gothenburg. Yet, I stumble across a copy of Machina on CD. (new and everything)
Now, they don't even sell Machina down here in Gothenburg, and they don't have it on various sites here where you can order music, so I just feel like I was meant to go there and buy the album. Surely I could have picked it up on Ebay or Amazon, but it's really cool how it works out. Especially seeing how I'm currently really into the band and didn't really know them 6-7 months ago.
Machina was also the only Pumpkins album they had in that store. :P
So yeah, now I have Machina physically as well. Also waiting on an order for Pisces Iscariot on CD which should arrive next week. I'm also going to the big recordstore here in Gothenburg tomorrow and might pick Gish up on CD, but I feel very tempted to buy a Vinyl so it may have to wait a bit. :P
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So, is anybody gonna try and see them on this Fall tour? Supposedly they are playing Oceania in its entirety, so I haven't made up my mind yet.
I kinda feel conflicted, because The Smashing Pumpkins are one of favorite bands in the world, but at the same time I just don't really care that much about Oceania.
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I wouldn't mind seeing them. I actually was really pleasantly surprised by Oceania. Great album. Probably in my top 10 for the year right now.
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Man, I want to see them so bad. Oceania is really good, and while there are other albums in their discography that I enjoy more, I would certainly love seeing it live in it's entirety. Too bad they aren't coming here anytime soon. :/
On another note, I listened to Machina and Machina II for the first time today. Some really cool stuff. I need to read up more on the concept and spin it way more times, but I really enjoyed it. Now only Zeitgeist, Teargarden By Kaleidoscope (both generally disliked by fans) and lots of B-Sides left. (The Aereoplane Flies High for example)
Still, I feel positive. :)
Also, current top 10 Pumpkins songs:
1. Farewell and Goodnight
2. Starla
3. Thru the Eyes of a Ruby
4. For Martha
5. Tonight, Tonight
6. Porcelina Of The Vast Oceans
7. Soma
8. Glass and the Ghost Children
9. Pinwheels
10. Silverfuck
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after spinning both gish and pisces last week, i texted my pumpkins-head friend to ask how many ">" symbols pisces is than gish...he said two. seemed about right.
a few days later after spinning both machina and zeitgeist, it (further) dawned on me that i like oceania more than the previous two. i dont know, maybe the romance of the new album still hasnt worn off.
(didnt hear about oceaniainitsentirety til just now; extra stoked to catch the tour!)
also, ive been in quite a mood for "set the ray to jerry" lately. it might be that one of the new silversun pickups songs has a STRTJ vibe (opening melody and tone) to it. and once i got thinking about it, i predicted it will be THE zantera song outta the aeroplane flies high collection once zantera's ears catch a spin.
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I just listened to Zeitgeist for the first time and was actually quite positively surprised. Pretty much everything I've read has been about how "shit" the album is, and honestly I went into it without any expectations whatsoever.
But I was fairly pleased actually. "Doomsday Clock" and "United States" stood out right away as two songs I really liked actually. Two amazing songs. I didn't find anything particularly bad with the rest, I really enjoyed the album, though it's not weird that only a few songs clicked right on the first listen.
The only negative thing I could see is that it felt perhaps a bit more "one dimensional" than most of the other Pumpkins-albums, lots of "straight up rockers", but I still enjoyed it.
Maybe part of me enjoying it is that I didn't wait 7 years and had high hopes for a new Mellon Collie. :D
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Oceania is growing on me. :smiley:
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You think when the Zeitgeist re-release comes out, it'll have all the bonus tracks they foolishly made store exclusive... to about 5 different stores? Granted, I know nothing about the album, but it must have sucked to have bought it back when it came out and then find out that in order to get all the songs, you needed to buy it from Best Buy and Walmart and iTunes and whatever else.
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You think when the Zeitgeist re-release comes out, it'll have all the bonus tracks they foolishly made store exclusive... to about 5 different stores? Granted, I know nothing about the album, but it must have sucked to have bought it back when it came out and then find out that in order to get all the songs, you needed to buy it from Best Buy and Walmart and iTunes and whatever else.
definitely. my biggest question is whether or not they'll be inserted into the tracklist of the main disc or not. it'll hopefully include demos of songs that didn't make it as well, like the fabled "Signal to Noise" and perhaps even "Gossamer" (the most worthwhile song from the period!).
I just listened to Zeitgeist for the first time and was actually quite positively surprised. Pretty much everything I've read has been about how "shit" the album is, and honestly I went into it without any expectations whatsoever.
But I was fairly pleased actually. "Doomsday Clock" and "United States" stood out right away as two songs I really liked actually. Two amazing songs. I didn't find anything particularly bad with the rest, I really enjoyed the album, though it's not weird that only a few songs clicked right on the first listen.
The only negative thing I could see is that it felt perhaps a bit more "one dimensional" than most of the other Pumpkins-albums, lots of "straight up rockers", but I still enjoyed it.
Maybe part of me enjoying it is that I didn't wait 7 years and had high hopes for a new Mellon Collie. :D
i enjoy some standouts (those two, "That's the Way," "Bleeding the Orchid," "Starz," "Neverlost," and "Stellar"), but between those and some of the related era songs like "Superchrist" and "G.L.O.W.", the American Gothic EP, and some of the standout residency material, they could've had one pretty kickass album that just... wasn't put together in 2007. by the time they could've gotten it right, in hindsight, it would only have been ready a year later. perhaps the better comeback plan would've been to do the tour first and then examine the material that worked.
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I have a question regarding the B-Sides of Zeitgeist. Were they ever released in some form? Available on some release or anything? I have an EP called "Bonus EP" which has live versions of some (Gossamer at least), I know G.L.O.W was released as a single, and I have the track "Zeitgeist" on a single (Tarantula I believe).
But I guess I'm missing quite a few? :P
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I have a question regarding the B-Sides of Zeitgeist. Were they ever released in some form? Available on some release or anything? I have an EP called "Bonus EP" which has live versions of some (Gossamer at least), I know G.L.O.W was released as a single, and I have the track "Zeitgeist" on a single (Tarantula I believe).
But I guess I'm missing quite a few? :P
Those songs were tacked on to several different editions of the cd's at release. It was a pain in the ass to many of the fans trying to track down the different songs because there were so many different versions of the release. The best place I've found for info and releases for The Pumpkins is here....
https://www.spfc.org/
This is the page for Zeitgeist where they list the various editions where you can find the songs.
https://www.spfc.org/songs-releases/discog.html?discog_id=199
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Cool! I'm not quite sure which one I've ordered (since it was from a webstore here in Sweden), but on the picture it has a silver-cover and there is a DVD on it as well, so by that it sounds like it's the Best Buy version?
On another note it's just such a joy getting into the Pumpkins discography. The only "problem" is tracking down individual B-Sides. I do have Pisces Iscariot and Aeroplane, and also a folder with around 100 songs that was called just "B-Sides and Rarities", which has quite a lot of stuff in it. But there's always a few that is harder to track down, and that "B-Sides and Rarities" was from '05, so it doesn't have Zeitgeist-stuff for example.
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Cool! I'm not quite sure which one I've ordered (since it was from a webstore here in Sweden), but on the picture it has a silver-cover and there is a DVD on it as well, so by that it sounds like it's the Best Buy version?
On another note it's just such a joy getting into the Pumpkins discography. The only "problem" is tracking down individual B-Sides. I do have Pisces Iscariot and Aeroplane, and also a folder with around 100 songs that was called just "B-Sides and Rarities", which has quite a lot of stuff in it. But there's always a few that is harder to track down, and that "B-Sides and Rarities" was from '05, so it doesn't have Zeitgeist-stuff for example.
yep, silver is the Best Buy version — has the most bonuses, but not all of them.
B-Sides and Rarities is an iTunes release. it collates pretty much everything pre-'05, as you said, except for some stuff from the bonus discs of the Gish, SD, and PI reissues.
the Zeitgeist period also includes residency material (some of it was released on the If All Goes Wrong DVD), the American Gothic EP, the "Superchrist"/"G.L.O.W." digital single, and "FOL." aside from the Teargarden stuff (initial 3 EPs + Oceania), you'd pretty much be caught up!
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I just listened to Zeitgeist for the first time and was actually quite positively surprised. Pretty much everything I've read has been about how "shit" the album is, and honestly I went into it without any expectations whatsoever.
But I was fairly pleased actually. "Doomsday Clock" and "United States" stood out right away as two songs I really liked actually. Two amazing songs. I didn't find anything particularly bad with the rest, I really enjoyed the album, though it's not weird that only a few songs clicked right on the first listen.
The only negative thing I could see is that it felt perhaps a bit more "one dimensional" than most of the other Pumpkins-albums, lots of "straight up rockers", but I still enjoyed it.
Maybe part of me enjoying it is that I didn't wait 7 years and had high hopes for a new Mellon Collie. :D
In the Zeitgeist EPK - Billy said that he asked Pumpkins fans what they wanted from a new album and they mostly wanted a heavy album.
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I'm still in shock at how good the new album is.
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I'm still in shock at how good the new album is.
Me too. Its all I've been listening to the past few days. I absolutely love inkless.
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it was just dawning on me how Oceania has probably received as many spins in the first 2 month rotation as anything this year.
I'm still in shock at how good the new album is.
Me too. Its all I've been listening to the past few days. I absolutely love inkless.
Pinwheels was an early favorite the 1st week or so...but yeah, theres just something special bout Inkless that has kept it in the top spot since.
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Just got pit tickets for the upcoming tour. :metal
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Oceania is a much better album than Zeitgeist.
For all his supposed legend status - the last two albums by Roy Thomas Baker I heard have been awful.
The Darkness - One Way Ticket. Terrible album and awful mix.
Smashing Pumpkins - Zeitgeist - Ok album but the mix is all over the shop.
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I genuinely like every song on Oceania.
and even though I think the album is about 15 minutes too long, I can still listen to it from beginning to end without feeling the urge to skip. Now I haven't been able to do that since Mellon Collie, so I am very impressed.
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always felt the final track was mostly a stinker, but i found myself getting into it yesterday the most i ever have.
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I need to give Machina II and Zeitgeist a few more listens before I can properly rank the Pumpkins discography, but if I had to do it right now, it would look something like this:
Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness
Siamese Dream
Pisces Iscariot
Oceania
Machina/The Machines of God
Adore
Gish
Machina II/The Friends & Enemies of Modern Music
Zeitgeist
With that said, I very much like all of these. Some are better, some are not as good, but all in all very solid discography. I still have loads of B-Sides and The Aeroplane Flies High left, should be great. :)
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Based on frequency of listens
1. Siamese Dream
2. Mellon Collie
3. Adore
4. Oceania
5. Machina
6. The Rest
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Adore is very patchy for me but " Perfect " is such a good song.
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I need to give Machina II and Zeitgeist a few more listens before I can properly rank the Pumpkins discography, but if I had to do it right now, it would look something like this:
Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness
Siamese Dream
Pisces Iscariot
Oceania
Machina/The Machines of God
Adore
Gish
Machina II/The Friends & Enemies of Modern Music
Zeitgeist
With that said, I very much like all of these. Some are better, some are not as good, but all in all very solid discography. I still have loads of B-Sides and The Aeroplane Flies High left, should be great. :)
As I figured my rankings are very similar Zantera. Only thing different for me (as I tend to be different than most on this) is that I hold Zeitgeist in higher regard. I understand why it rubs some the wrong way but I understand where Corgan was going with the record and enjoy the wall of sound type thing he had there for what it was. Overall though I pretty much agree totally.. Maybe I might have Machina ahead of Oceania.
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Well, as I said, I very much like them all. Zeitgeist is much better than I think people give it credit for, I'm not saying it's a 5/5-album, but I still very much enjoy it. Doomsday Clock and United States in particular.
It feels lame either way I rank it, since I really enjoy the albums I have to rank the lowest. :P
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Bump. Would people be interested in following a top50 Pumpkins-songs thread? I'm really toying with the idea of making a list, but it would be more fun if people would actually be interested in it. :P
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just post it in this thread :corn
pumped to see how high my prediction of set the ray to jerry as a 'zantera song' makes it.
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Sure, I would follow.
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Cool. There's still a few B-sides I want to check out and get to know slightly better before compiling it, so it might be a week or so before I can start it.
Also, considering how many B-sides the band has in total, it's probably impossible for me to hear them all before, but I need to spin The Aeroplane Flies High a few more times. :P
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https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=34510.0 thread made, do follow. ;)
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Uhhh...
Can't wait for the Mellon Collie reissue that drops so soon! I'm already looking forward to checking out the bonus tracks and the DVD video.
https://pitchfork.com/news/48057-smashing-pumpkins-announce-mellon-collie-and-the-infinite-sadness-deluxe-box-set-reissue/ (https://pitchfork.com/news/48057-smashing-pumpkins-announce-mellon-collie-and-the-infinite-sadness-deluxe-box-set-reissue/)
Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness Track Lists (for the curious):
Dawn to Dusk (CD1):
01 Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness
02 Tonight, Tonight
03 Jellybelly
04 Zero
05 Here Is No Why
06 Bullet With Butterfly Wings
07 To Forgive
08 An Ode to No One
09 Love
10 Cupid De Locke
11 Galapogos
12 Muzzle
13 Porcelina of the Vast Oceans
14 Take Me Down
Twilight to Starlight (CD2):
01 Where Boys Fear to Tread
02 Bodies
03 Thirty-Three
04 In the Arms of Sleep
05 1979
06 Tales of a Scorched Earth
07 Thru the Eyes of Ruby
08 Stumbleine
09 X.Y.U.
10 We Only Come Out at Night
11 Beautiful
12 Lily (My One and Only)
13 By Starlight
14 Farewell and Goodnight
Morning Tea (CD3):
01 Tonight, Tonight (Strings Alone mix)
02 Methusela *
03 X.Y.U. (Take 11)
04 Zero (Synth mix)
05 Feelium *
06 Autumn Nocturne *
07 Beautiful (Loop version)
08 Ugly *
09 Ascending Guitars *
10 By Starlight (Flood rough)
11 Medellia of the Gray Skies (Take 1)
12 Lover (Arrangement 1 demo)
13 Thru the Eyes Of Ruby (Take 7)
14 In the Arms of Sleep (Early Live demo)
15 Lily (My One And Only) *
16 1979 *
17 Glamey Glamey *
18 Meladori Magpie
19 Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness (Home Piano version)
20 Galapagos (Instrumental) *
21 To Forgive *
High Tea (CD4):
01 Bullet With Butterfly Wings *
02 Set the Ray to Jerry (Vocal Rough)
03 Thirty-Three *
04 Cupid De Locke (BT 2012 mix)
05 Porcelina of the Vast Oceans (Live Studio rough)
06 Jellybelly (Instrumental/Pit mix 3)
07 The Aeroplane Flies High (Turns Left, Looks Right)
08 Jupiter’s Lament (Barbershop version)
09 Bagpipes Drone *
10 Tonight, Tonight (Band Version Only, No Strings)
11 Knuckles (Studio outtake)
12 Pennies
13 Here Is No Why (Pumpkinland demo)
14 Blast (Fuzz version)
15 Towers of Rabble (Live)
16 Rotten Apples
17 Fun Time *
18 Thru the Eyes Of Ruby (Acoustic version)
19 Chinoise *
20 Speed
Special Tea (CD 5):
01 Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness (Nighttime version 1)
02 Galapagos *
03 Cherry (BT 2012 mix)
04 Love (Flood rough)
05 New Waver *
06 Fuck You (an ode to no one) (Production Master rough)
07 Isolation (BT 2012 mix)
08 Transformer (Early mix)
09 Dizzle *
10 Goodnight (Basic Vocal rough)
11 Eye (Soundworks demo)
12 Blank *
13 Beautiful (Instrumental-Middle 8)
14 My Blue Heaven (BT 2012 mix)
15 One and Two
16 Zoom (7 ips)
17 Pastichio Medley (Reversed extras)
18 Marquis in Spades (BT 2012 mix)
19 Tales of a Scorched Earth (Guitar Overdub mix)
20 Tonite Reprise (Version 1)
21 Wishing You Were Real (Home demo)
22 Thru the Eyes of Ruby (Pit mix 3)
23 Phang *
* Sadlands demo
DVD:
Live at Brixton Academy, London, 5/15/96:
01 Tonight, Tonight
02 1979
03 Zero
04 Here Is No Why
05 Thru the Eyes of Ruby
06 Porcelina of the Vast Oceans
07 Jellybelly
08 Silverfuck
09 Disarm
10 Bullet With Butterfly Wings
Live at Rockpalast, 4/7/96:
11 Fuck You (An Ode to No One)
12 Muzzle
13 Cherub Rock
14 X.Y.U.
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^ and there are already sneak peeks and/or descriptions of lots of the bonus tracks at https://www.crestfallen.com/tea - certainly going to be a varied and entertaining walk through the vaults, methinks, what with a random country tune, a James Iha solo track demo, some Pastichio Medley tracks, etc. i'm waiting for the official site to put up a preorder before i go all-in on the CD box and vinyl.
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Last night I saw the Smashing Pumpkins for the very first time and it was incredible!!!!
The first set was all of Oceania, which was pretty cool. I like the album a lot and enjoyed hearing it live, but the second set is really where shit got crazy. Zero, Bullet with butterfly wings, cherub rock, Tonight Tonight, disarm, X.Y.U and ava adore and The crowd was going crazy. They also played a brand new song which was heavy as hell and damn good as well. My favorite thing was that the band felt like a cohesive unit rather then just hired guns. I Had a great time.
(https://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x459/phoenix87x/C769175B-D087-4A47-B3E8-8342C6E83D94-3058-000001C1756A6F08.jpg)
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Mellon Collie is the best them, closely followed by Siamese Dream and then Oceania.
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They also played a brand new song which was heavy as hell and damn good as well.
agreed! used to be called "Black Sunshine," now it's "The Dream Machine." probably one of the best songs i've heard out of the band since the Zeitgeist-era highlights ("Gossamer," et al).
re: MCIS deluxe—
wow.
worth the $100 package i think. the vinyl, not so much... especially since people are still experiencing issues just like with the Oceania vinyl.
the bonus tracks are nuts. "Ruby" take 7, the "Cupid" re-mix, "Chinoise," "Speed," "MCIS" nighttime version, the "Cherry" and "Marquis in Spades" re-mixes, "Tonite Reprise" take 1, "Galapagos" instrumental demo, etc. — every disc has enormous highlights. there are only a few tracks that bug me.
the mastering sucks ass though (just on the bonus discs - like Pisces Iscariot). squashed to hell, all the quiet songs are as loud as the loud-ass songs, etc. Howie Weinberg and whoever influenced his mastering on this need to be slapped.
the remastering on the actual album is fantastic though. it's actually about the same volume as the original, but with much clearer EQing. that's what one should expect from a pro like Bob Ludwig.
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I can't wait to get the vinyl which I ordered through Amazon.
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New single from the upcoming album: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5dlrGRZSm8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5dlrGRZSm8)
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New single from the upcoming album: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5dlrGRZSm8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5dlrGRZSm8)
This is awful. Sounds like watered down Coldplay.
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This is awful. Sounds like watered down Coldplay.
Watered down coldplay would be elevator music.
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Meh.
When I saw them live a little while back they played this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MceiDoymHEA
Its was a new song called The Dream Machine and really got me excited for what might be on the new album, but this other track just sounds dull and uninteresting.
When I saw them in 2012, they felt like a cohesive band. I dare say, a "happy" band. I'm not too happy that Billy has already run off Nicole Fiorentino and Mike Byrne. Now we are back to half a band with tommy lee of all people playing drums. Nothing against tommy lee, but the band is a hot mess and I don't know what to make of it.
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I feel the last bit of real "Smashing Pumpkins" disappeared after Jimmy Chamberlin was out of the lineup the second time in 09'. That's not to say what they've done since is bad or what Corgan and whoever is with him will produce in the future will be less than. Some felt it was done with Iha and Wretzky out but I think Chamberlin really held it all together most times. It's always been a power struggle for most in the band because Billy has always ran the band as HIS band (maybe rightfully so), but when Chamberlin came back with Corgan in 05' there was potential to recapture some of the original magic.
Now I feel it's just something else. IMO, Corgan is a brilliant musician and artist but he needs to channel and filter his work better sometimes. The funny thing is his material is so polarizing because his music can be on opposite ends of the spectrum from one song to the next. He's always worked that way and it throws a lot of people off but I usually like it.
Also I think the new song is alright (not mind blowing or anything) but I also like the heavier and some of the psychedelic stuff that he's done the last few years like The Dream Machine, Gossamer, etc.
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Ever since I liked the Facebook page, it's become increasingly clear that Billy Corgan's lost his god damn mind. Every "new album update" post over the last six months has been random as hell, half the time not even mentioning the album progress. And two of the new band members are already gone? The non-Oceania Teargarden tracks kind of fizzled out and the project was never really completed (when Corgan started the project he said when all 44 tracks were done they'd get a full album/box set release). Tommy Lee? Doom metal album? Cover of some cat magazine in a sweater? What the fuck?!
I have been enjoying collecting the reissue box sets though. So much bonus content. Adore's came out last month, and I hope to have some spare moolah for it soon.
DOOM METAL?!
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the doom metal thing was Jeff Schroeder's sense of humour about using Sunn amps.
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Oh, really? The way everyone freaked out about it, I assumed it was real. :lol
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another new song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7D3-jXN1Kw (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7D3-jXN1Kw)
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New album out today.
I like it.
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I've only listened once, but it was alright. Very okay-ish as a whole. After Oceania I must admit I had higher hopes, and this kinda felt like something they wrote and recorded in a weekend, but with that said it's also not bad. I have a feeling I will have forgotten all about this album in a few months, because it's only like 30 minutes long and kinda leaves my mind before it starts to stick.
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Very okay-ish as a whole.
That pretty much sums up my thoughts. Nothing spectacular, just ok.
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Every Pumpkins album since Machina has featured almost an entirely different line up for touring. Billy is the only constant. It's odd that he doesn't just out as Billy Corgan now. He could still play Pumpkins songs because he wrote them all.
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I just listened to it again and I must say I think the first track, Tiberius is really darn great. One of their finer "rockers" in a few albums even, and it's a really great track on its own. The album has a few more tracks like that spread out, but then maybe 3-4 tracks that are just kinda okay, so overall that stops the album from being better than like a 3 or 3.5 out of 5.
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After a few more listens, I have to say that apart from Tiberius, I've also really grown to love Drum and Fife, and Monuments. As a whole this album might not be one of their best, but for a ~30 minute album, it is pretty solid, and with 3 songs as good as the ones I mentioned, I feel like their catalog has gotten a few more great additions. I hope the twin-album coming in 2015 is a bit more ambitious though. I read a review saying this album feels a bit unfinished and that it misses the "epic" (like Oceania, Glass and the Ghost Children, XYU or so on) and I can see that. Considering how good they do epics, it's really a shame that there isn't a strong 7-9 minute song on here.
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Oceania is a lot better than Zeitgeist. That album was shocking and the mix was atrocious.
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Lately I think Here is no Why is the Pumpkins' best song.
-J
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Lately I think Here is no Why is the Pumpkins' best song.
-J
Love that song :metal
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Oceania is a lot better than Zeitgeist. That album was shocking and the mix was atrocious.
Oceania was pretty good but Zeitgeist gets more hate than it deserves. It's a good album overall just quite different than the majority of their early discography. The mix is a bit wearing but I can understand he was going for a wall of sound type thing for that album (and it's there!).
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Oceania is definitely better than Zeitgeist. But with that said, Zeitgeist isn't bad. It has some good stuff on it.
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Listened to Monuments a couple times now.
1. Tiberius is incredible and addictive as hell. Its been in my head for days.
2. One and all and Beige Beige are ok
3. The rest does nothing for me.
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I would say Tiberius, Drum and Fife, and Monuments are the three big standouts for me. I really like them all quite a lot. The other tracks are not bad, but they also don't stand out.
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So they are billing this next tour as a re-union tour, but as far as I'm concerned its not a full reunion without Darcy. This isn't like GnR where slash and duff are so much the image of what guns and roses are. And they really are taking a page out of Gun's book, but booking these massive arenas. I could get behind that if it was a full legit re-union, but its not. Oh well, maybe I will try and see it, maybe not
https://www.metalsucks.net/2018/02/15/34ths-of-the-original-smashing-pumpkins-line-up-is-reuniting/
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From what I've read over the years Darcy "Hates" Billy so no big surprise she's not doing it.
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I know we're not getting it because of the legal shit, but...
I just want my Machina I/II and Zeitgeist deluxe reissues. I bought all the other box sets as they released and these were all I needed to have every album. The way Zeitgeist divided up its bonus tracks was misery back in the day and it would have been so nice to have all of that in one package. (Was also hoping when those box sets were coming out that Billy'd eventually do a physical release of all the Teargarden by Kaleidoscope songs, but alas.)
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I know we're not getting it because of the legal shit, but...
I just want my Machina I/II and Zeitgeist deluxe reissues. I bought all the other box sets as they released and these were all I needed to have every album. The way Zeitgeist divided up its bonus tracks was misery back in the day and it would have been so nice to have all of that in one package. (Was also hoping when those box sets were coming out that Billy'd eventually do a physical release of all the Teargarden by Kaleidoscope songs, but alas.)
Getting a remixed/remastered Machina I/II is the thing I want most from the Pumpkins. Those two albums are probably my favorite collective work of theirs but the production is so godawful.
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From what I've read over the years Darcy "Hates" Billy so no big surprise she's not doing it.
Apparently, they made up 2 years ago. Darcy recently shared a series of texts between her and Billy that started with offering her a spot on the tour to offering her a picture on a t-shirt. Doesn't make Billy look good.
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/d-arcy-wretzky-shares-text-145649525.html
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From what I've read over the years Darcy "Hates" Billy so no big surprise she's not doing it.
Apparently, they made up 2 years ago. Darcy recently shared a series of texts between her and Billy that started with offering her a spot on the tour to offering her a picture on a t-shirt. Doesn't make Billy look good.
https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/d-arcy-wretzky-shares-text-145649525.html
Yeah, I don't get the same message from those texts as the author seems to want us to get. He's telling her the facts. Doors open. it's a big tour, and she's not 100% healthy, so the concerns of the machine have to be weighed against her concerns. I don't view the last part of the exchange as a clear reduction in offer, but rather a different way of saying what he said all along: come along, come on stage at your leisure, and we're going to cover our bases so a massive arena tour is not scuttled if you reinjure your shoulder.
I see this almost exactly like the Bill Ward situation. He wanted a full ride with Sabbath, but decided he didn't like the terms, and oh, by the way, the day before HIS tour, he has a heart attack and has to cancel the whole shooting match.
Corgan/Pumpkins are weird to me. They're not my favorite band (though if I ever see a disk at a pawn shop or wherever, I buy it for a $1.00 or two) but every song I hear I really like (and I LOVE Melancholy...). I always used to think Corgan was a publicity whoring douche, but he was on Stern not long ago and really won me over. Seems like an odd guy, but aren't we all? And he said then that he was on good terms with D'Arcy, but that they grew apart over the years and it's hard to just "jump back in full throttle". He's got a business to run.
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As much as I love D'arcy's contributions to Pumpkins I think Billy is in the right here and knowing how her life took a turn for the worse after the drugs and exit from Pumpkins in the first place, the reality is there are a lot of questionmarks around her as to whether she would be reliable and whether she would be able to perform.
I do hope this is a success and we get a European tour as well cause I haven't seen Pumpkins live and they're one of my favorite bands so.
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New song: Solara
https://youtu.be/Do3tSdZucyA
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New song: Solara
https://youtu.be/Do3tSdZucyA
I actually like it. Thinking of seeing them in a month when they come to town.
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Musically it's okay, but I don't know why Corgan insists on having his voice so high and prominent in the mix. His vocals always sounded better when they were pushed back into the mix with reverb. I always loved his voice in the past but time has not been kind to it.
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So the tour started and the setlist is pretty killer if you ask me. I'd like some more of the not so popular songs from Melon Collie, but that's just me. Hard to complain about a 31 song setlist https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/the-smashing-pumpkins/2018/gila-river-arena-glendale-az-23ebb8ef.html (https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/the-smashing-pumpkins/2018/gila-river-arena-glendale-az-23ebb8ef.html) I'm pretty much sold on seeing them in a couple weeks when they come to town. It's not selling very well so I should be able to get a cheap ticket to the local show.
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I saw them on the oceania tour and it was great. Since I've already seen them, I'm in no rush to see them again, but if Darcy was there and it was a legit re-union, then I would see them again.
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Soooo just found this blabbermouth article and apparently the show I'm going to Thursday is the 30th anniversary show (almost all tickets still available too :huh: ) and there's going to be lots of special guests:
https://www.blabbermouth.net/news/smashing-pumpkins-to-be-joined-by-courtney-love-chino-moreno-davey-havok-at-30th-anniversary-concert/ (https://www.blabbermouth.net/news/smashing-pumpkins-to-be-joined-by-courtney-love-chino-moreno-davey-havok-at-30th-anniversary-concert/)
and I LOVE DAVEY HAVOK! I am going to see AFI Sunday and he's been one of my favorite singers since I was younger and grew up loving his voice. I couldn't be more stoked to see this show now, also Chino/Love/McGrath is going to be sick. I just can't believe tickets aren't selling.. at all for this. They are doing a 10$ ticket sale at 1pm today so my gf and I will scoop those up.
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I saw them in Philly a few nights ago and I can honestly say that I was completely blown away and it was one of the best "shows" I've ever seen from a visual standpoint. It's unfortunate it's not selling well, as the band is really on top of their game. They played 31 songs over 3.5 hours and were killing it the entire way through. Even Corgan's voice sounded pretty good. Philly had a lot of empty seats, but it was still relatively full.
I'm seriously tempted to try and make it to the 30th anniversary show. I have work at 6AM the next morning but it's going to be amazing and well worth the tiredness. Once Upon A Time is Chino Moreno's favorite Pumpkins song (and one of mine) so I'm guessing that will be played.
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Nice, I managed to grab two 10 dollar lawn tickets during the flash sale today and then used the livenation app to upgrade to the front section for 20 dollars extra. Ended up in the 15th row for $30 each, flat, no fees with the flash sale or upgrade. Kind of crazy since the row in front my seat is listed at $150 a ticket before fees.
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Bumping this to not take over the concert thread more with Billy Corgan talk, but I saw two of his solo shows last week in LA and I'm in PA tonight for his show in Stroudsburg. I just read his show last night in Kentucky went bad, apparently a few hecklers and many people just talking in general during the show. He ended it early (I think only a song or two early) apparently and I read on instagram he's pretty upset about it. That's really unfortunate. His LA shows were so unique and intimate, it's a big reason why I am out here for a third night of seeing him. I feel bad for him, I hope he knocks it out of the park tonight and the crowd is like LA's.
But anyway, I've been listening to him and SP a bit lately because of these shows. I recorded these two SP songs from their latest album that Billy did solo, sooo good:
Billy Corgan - Silvery Sometimes (Ghosts) Live in LA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q74my0umcAo)
Billy Corgan - Travels (with Happy Birthday) Live in LA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7AMzn2Vui0)
OK, one more, here's a SP song with guest Jeff Shroeder (from SP) on guitar and a girl on Violin. I highly suggest DTF check this one out, it's really interesting
Billy Corgan with Jeff Shroeder - Glass and the Ghost Children Live in LA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGlEEewx3SE)
His setlists are fairly random so I hope we get some cool rare stuff tonight :metal
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Bumping this to not take over the concert thread more with Billy Corgan talk, but I saw two of his solo shows last week in LA and I'm in PA tonight for his show in Stroudsburg. I just read his show last night in Kentucky went bad, apparently a few hecklers and many people just talking in general during the show. He ended it early (I think only a song or two early) apparently and I read on instagram he's pretty upset about it. That's really unfortunate. His LA shows were so unique and intimate, it's a big reason why I am out here for a third night of seeing him. I feel bad for him, I hope he knocks it out of the park tonight and the crowd is like LA's.
But anyway, I've been listening to him and SP a bit lately because of these shows. I recorded these two SP songs from their latest album that Billy did solo, sooo good:
Billy Corgan - Silvery Sometimes (Ghosts) Live in LA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q74my0umcAo)
Billy Corgan - Travels (with Happy Birthday) Live in LA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7AMzn2Vui0)
OK, one more, here's a SP song with guest Jeff Shroeder (from SP) on guitar and a girl on Violin. I highly suggest DTF check this one out, it's really interesting
Billy Corgan with Jeff Shroeder - Glass and the Ghost Children Live in LA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGlEEewx3SE)
His setlists are fairly random so I hope we get some cool rare stuff tonight :metal
I never picked up Ogilala but I'm curious about his new album. His voice is very unappealing to me nowadays so it's tough to really get into new music of his, but traces of his old voice pop out every now and then and I want to support the guy since he made some of my favorite albums of all time. He's always been great at making setlists with lots of rarities and popular stuff
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Tons of rare songs played last night too, but there was also a fight that broke out in the crowd which put a pause to the show. Kind of ridiculous to have a fight at an acoustic show. At least Billy seemed more entertained than annoyed by it. Apparently he's saying he's not going to tour solo anymore, and if he tours under his name it will be with a band. He's definitely got a bit annoyed with the crowds but he was pretty complimentary to the crowd last night. Much bigger venue than LA and less intimate, but still awesome show.
Billy Corgan - Cherry Live in Stroudsburg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sf9ltzaeJr4)
Billy Corgan - Perfect Live in Stroudsburg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6A0sfVcYNQ)
Billy Corgan - Purr Snickety Live in Stroudsburg with the end of the fight (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_XtjCc6UUU)
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After a lot of work, I've completed my longest and most extensive concert video. Clocking in just under 4 hours :lol and comprises of footage edited together between 4 Billy Corgan solo shows from LA to PA to NYC :yarr
Seriously, this took a long time and effort to make. I don't expect anyone to watch the whole thing unless you are a hardcore fan, but there's like 40 songs included, plus the entire trivia game show he did at the end of the last show to give away his two guitars he used for the tour.
I wrote out the songs in order but forgot to put it in the youtube before uploading it before I left for work (since it look like it took about 8 hours to upload and process on youtube) but I plan on adding that to the description with timestamps to easily find what you may be looking for, but until then, here's the full 4 hours.
Billy Corgan - Cotillions Solo Acoustic Tour of the US from LA to NYC (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzmBcf_kDHY)
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New single and music video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AN_GRWlU7k (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AN_GRWlU7k)
synth poppy, I kind of like it though. It's catchy.
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New single and music video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AN_GRWlU7k (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AN_GRWlU7k)
synth poppy, I kind of like it though. It's catchy.
They also released this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3p21SZ3x2A
There's absolutely zero Pumpkins identity in these songs, but they're catchy and easy to listen to which is all I can ask from Billy at this point. They honestly sound like they're taken from his first solo album TheFutureEmbrace
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New single and music video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AN_GRWlU7k (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AN_GRWlU7k)
synth poppy, I kind of like it though. It's catchy.
They also released this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3p21SZ3x2A
There's absolutely zero Pumpkins identity in these songs, but they're catchy and easy to listen to which is all I can ask from Billy at this point. They honestly sound like they're taken from his first solo album TheFutureEmbrace
I wouldn't say there is no identity, they had a lot of synth stuff on Adore. But this may be a bit more poppy. It is catchy and easy, and enjoyable for what they are. Being a double disc, I'm guessing there's a lot more variety than these two. I havent heard that solo album, but I see from other comments that people feel the same.
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Not what I want from a Smashing Pumpkins album.
I know they're never going to make another Siamese Dream or Mellon Collie & The Infinite Sadness - but after they got Jimmy and James back in the band I expected something a little more classic
Pumpkins...
... And No Past, No Future, No Sun was only ok and now this is only OK.
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I actually quite liked Oceania and was hoping they would continue down that path but Monuments felt a bit more 'meh'. Still haven't heard the last one, mostly because there just doesn't seem to be that much hype. Considering he has James and Jimmy back it just feels like the current direction is a bit underwhelming. Like even a dud like Zeitgeist has United States - a 9 min track showcasing just how awesome Jimmy is on the drums but the last few Pumpkin releases just feel safe.
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Yeah the two new singles - I don't think Jimmy even plays a fill does he ? Assuming it's Jimmy and not a drum machine...
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Yeah the two new singles - I don't think Jimmy even plays a fill does he ? Assuming it's Jimmy and not a drum machine...
he dances :lol
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Boy is it ever awkward to watch Billy Corgan these days. Just an odd duck who seems to have not quite found the right balance between being 50-something and still trying to play to his 20 something alt-rock persona.
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So I'm guessing this is Volume 2 of Shiny and Oh So Bright? Cyr? (From the Facebook page.)
(https://scontent-ort2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/119703284_10159143749387642_7068693368408056276_o.jpg?_nc_cat=108&_nc_sid=e3f864&_nc_ohc=AWqMUiKt1A8AX-feSd-&_nc_oc=AQlJ0kEQRqS9ZjLANsvFNuNNHp5nspTs-NiwcYnW3eIFjL6Lr7Wfj1Aj43VIrXQIAZRqTPAkcvdCHbaUdT69JZEQ&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-1.xx&oh=fa0614fe9a425e81ce850a2d3ed0fca4&oe=5F88C597)
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Yea, I believe it is Volume 2. I enjoy the singles but hope they have a lot more diversity than those two. 18 more songs so definitely expect some more "rock" songs and hopefully some interesting tracks.
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Vol.1 / Lp Shiny and oh so bright ( Why the long title Billy ? ) Part 1 / 3
Was merely Ok. I hope this one is a little stronger.
Plus another double ?
I mean it's good on one hand that there's still a band still willing to make big albums / grand statements in the streaming age.
But double albums are usually a chore / weak in the second half
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CYR:
01 The Colour of Love
02 Confessions of a Dopamine Addict
03 Cyr
04 Dulcet in E
05 Wrath
06 Ramona
07 Anno Satana
08 Birch Grove
09 Wyttch
10 Starrcraft
11 Purple Blood
12 Save Your Tears
13 Telegenix
14 Black Forest, Black Hills
15 Adrennalynne
16 Haunted
17 The Hidden Sun
18 Schaudenfreud
19 Tyger, Tyger
20 Minerva
I like some of the titles here but absolutely hate shit like "Adrenalynne" and "Wyttch". Though "White Spyder" is a favorite of mine from Machina 2, so who knows. Still, much like The Astonishing, I'm really excited by the prospect of a double album late in a band's career...it's like one final attempt at making a grand statement and while I haven't been impressed by Billy's work since TheFutureEmbrace, maybe he pulled something magical out of his ass for this thing.
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Do we know the track times? I do wonder if this double album is even that long.
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Do we know the track times? I do wonder if this double album is even that long.
I know that 9 of the songs total up to 37 minutes (according to reddit posts I've seen) so I'm guessing the other 9 will total up to a similar length. Another "double album" that is essentially a long single disc album.
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Do we know the track times? I do wonder if this double album is even that long.
I know that 9 of the songs total up to 37 minutes (according to reddit posts I've seen) so I'm guessing the other 9 will total up to a similar length. Another "double album" that is essentially a long single disc album.
That's kind of what I was thinking, this doesn't immediately rub me off as some major epic double disc album or something
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Do we know the track times? I do wonder if this double album is even that long.
I know that 9 of the songs total up to 37 minutes (according to reddit posts I've seen) so I'm guessing the other 9 will total up to a similar length. Another "double album" that is essentially a long single disc album.
That's kind of what I was thinking, this doesn't immediately rub me off as some major epic double disc album or something
Album is 72 minutes long with the longest song being Black Forest, Black Hills at 4:42.
Ugh, I know track length is no indicator of quality, but if it's just going to be 18 attempts at trying to make a relevant pop single then I'm going to be severely pissed. Where's the epics? Where's the journey/buildup songs like Soma, Porcelina, or Silverfuck? It's like he just want to make a whole album of 1979's.
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Do we know the track times? I do wonder if this double album is even that long.
I know that 9 of the songs total up to 37 minutes (according to reddit posts I've seen) so I'm guessing the other 9 will total up to a similar length. Another "double album" that is essentially a long single disc album.
That's kind of what I was thinking, this doesn't immediately rub me off as some major epic double disc album or something
Album is 72 minutes long with the longest song being Black Forest, Black Hills at 4:42.
Ugh, I know track length is no indicator of quality, but if it's just going to be 18 attempts at trying to make a relevant pop single then I'm going to be severely pissed. Where's the epics? Where's the journey/buildup songs like Soma, Porcelina, or Silverfuck? It's like he just want to make a whole album of 1979's.
Well, I wouldn't judge it more than just the singles so far. But yea, 72 minutes is NOT a double album IMO even if it's broken up. I want some good rockers in there, I don't need epics from SP personally, just good songs. I enjoy the singles so far but they don't blow me away nor do they get me super excited for the other 18 songs.
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I haven't been too up to date and I still haven't heard Shiny and Oh so Bright Vol 1, but personally I find the whole 'double album that is really more a 80 minute album' to be very lackluster in general. I would probably draw the line at 90 minutes for what I would consider a double album, but even so, Mellon Collie is 2 hours. And yeah part of what makes that great is the variety in tracks where you get some hits, some transitional type tracks to build mood and you get your epics. The lack of epics on the last few Pumpkins releases since Oceania is a bit of a turn off for me personally. It's a reason why I still haven't checked out the last one because I looked at the tracklist and it's a 30 minute album with 8 songs on it. One song reaches 5 minutes but 4 of them are 3:30 or shorter. To me that's more aching to an EP than a full album for a band that used to write epics.
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I don’t mind 80 minute albums which are on2 CDs as it’s cool to have two discs.
Opposites by Biffy Clyro and Metallica’s Hardwired both did this.
It just looks nice having a fat box with two discs. IMO ☺️
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* BIG NEWS *
I'm not that excited cause i've not liked anything since Oceania. Not listened to Monuments and SAOSBV1/LP:NP,NF,NS was just Ok....
• After the 20 Song Cyr ( Shiny And Oh So Bright Vol 2 ) in November
• They will release a 33 song Mellon Collie / Machina Follow up in 2021
• Then Shiny And Oh So Bright Volume 3 after that ( 10 songs says Billy )
• THEN the complete Machina album package as fully intended ( 50 songs says Billy )
I mean cool?? I guess i'll listen to Mellon Collie "3" ?? But i'm not that excited. He needs to be careful it's not just Today, Cherub Rock, 1979, Butterfly Wings again and again...
He'll get ripped to shreds for trying to re-live the glory days. But Billy is at least more intelligent than that. It'll probably be in that style without being a rip off.
Plus he says once they are able - a Mellon Collie / Machina / Part 3 THEMED tour - " NOT the albums in full " he stresses.
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I also haven't liked anything since oceania, but I will say I really enjoy the song Tiberius off of monuments.
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I just don't understand how he has like all this music. It makes me wonder if it's quantity over quality. We'll see, the new Cyr album isn't so far shaping up to be anything great at 20 songs already.
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As far I'm concerned, he's shit out 3 very underwhelming solo albums mascarading as pumpkins albums over the past 6 years.
And now that's he's announced a sequel to one of the most beloved SP albums, I feel like he's only setting himself up for embarrassment. We'll see though. I would love for it to be an awesome album.
And honestly, I think he should have tried harder to get Darcy back in the band, and then they could have focused on putting out one very solid and decent album.
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I'll be surprised if any of this actually comes to fruition. He's notorious for announcing projects and abandoning them. All's I care about right now is getting the Machina reissue which I know he's been working on so that has the most likelihood of actually being released.
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I'll be surprised if any of this actually comes to fruition. He's notorious for announcing projects and abandoning them. All's I care about right now is getting the Machina reissue which I know he's been working on so that has the most likelihood of actually being released.
That's the one he says is actually being mixed - which means it's finished.
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I'll be surprised if any of this actually comes to fruition. He's notorious for announcing projects and abandoning them. All's I care about right now is getting the Machina reissue which I know he's been working on so that has the most likelihood of actually being released.
That's the one he says is actually being mixed - which means it's finished.
That era has the most interesting stuff they did imo. I'd love to hear it properly mixed and resequenced as intended, along with any scattered b-sides that have been floating around in low-quality hell for 20 years.
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I'm more interested in a Mellon Collie / Machina follow up than Shiny And Oh So Bright 2 and 3...
Not cause I want SP to sound like Siamese Dream forever.
It's just that i've not enjoyed anything they've done since that time.
Oceania was the closest to classic Pumpkins they've done.
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And honestly, I think he should have tried harder to get Darcy back in the band, and then they could have focused on putting out one very solid and decent album.
I think everyone would have wanted Darcy back, but would that change anything with the direction of the band?
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And honestly, I think he should have tried harder to get Darcy back in the band, and then they could have focused on putting out one very solid and decent album.
I think everyone would have wanted Darcy back, but would that change anything with the direction of the band?
Yeah, I always thought Corgan kind of wrote and played everything himself on those early albums, which is kind of what fractured the band in the first place.
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From what I can gather - Darcy wasn't great live - was too unpredictable from being out of it all the time - and now is just messed up.
Billy said he tried many times to reach out - but she refused.
Meh. Corgan, Iha and Chamberlin is enough of a reunion. I dunno why Melissa didn't do it either.
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I know around the time the reunion was happening D'arcy had a bunch of personal issues. She has struggled with drugs and also been in jail. Unlike Iha or Chamberlin she hasn't really done much in the business since Machina. It's obviously hard to know what 'state' she is in now but at the time I get why Billy Corgan would be hesitant to get someone involved who maybe wasn't up for the job mentally or physically, just for the sake of having the 'true' lineup reunited. But also I don't think it would have mattered that much. I know back in the day D'arcy was given credit for her opinion carrying weight and maybe reigning in some of Billy's crazier ideas but we're now 25 years into the future and Billy has kept making music and arguably gotten a bigger ego meanwhile she has basically vanished from the scene and done nothing of importance to have that same 'aura'. I would just imagine her second guessing one of Billy's ideas and he would go "but who are you to argue with me?".
Hearing all these news about a Mellon Collie & Machina follow up as well as the other new album they are working on, and the one coming out soon, it does give me some excitement again but I just worry it's too much quantity and not enough quality. Mellon Collie is one of the all time classic albums for me, Machina is decent. But as a follow up to the former, I know it will never be AS good, but I would still hope it's closer to Oceania than Zeitgeist or Monuments in quality.
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I put on Oceania yesterday for the first time in years probably - and it still suffers from ALL the guitar being way up front and the drums being in the background.
Zeitgeist had the same problem.
I know they don't currently have a permanent bass player since all 3 play guitars - but I'm guessing either Jeff handles bass as well in the studio - or it's literally
Billy and Jimmy again with Jeff and James just doing solos here and there.
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It's funny that now Billy is either doing massive albums - or very short albums :-P
No Past No Future No Sun is 30 minutes long and then Cyr is 72 minutes long
Mellon Collie 3 will be 33 songs long and Shiny Vol 3 will be 10 songs.
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Listening to Shiny And Oh So Bright now...
It's a bit better than I remember. The mix is a bit better than Zeitgeist but it still has that trademark Rick Ruin crispiness. Nowhere near Death Magnetic levels though...
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I guess my hot take is despite being a huge Pumpkins fan, I've never cared much for their production/sound on any of their albums. Even the classic ones. They're not great albums because of how they sound but rather the music itself.
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Listening to Shiny And Oh So Bright now...
It's a bit better than I remember. The mix is a bit better than Zeitgeist but it still has that trademark Rick Ruin crispiness. Nowhere near Death Magnetic levels though...
That about sums up every album he's ever produced. Agreed about the production on Oceania. There's like no bottom-end or depth to any of the drums...they're all very surface-level sounding and weak in the mix. Mike was a pretty good drummer and I feel like he got so many unhealthy comparisons to Jimmy because the drum-mix sucked for the songs he played on.
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Really enjoying the new song that came out today, Wyttch. Definitely the heaviest of the new ones I've heard. :metal
https://youtu.be/9NcVNOWjv1E (https://youtu.be/9NcVNOWjv1E)
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Strange band for me. I like (and even love) a lot of their music....but Corgan is really unlikely (sort of the reverse Dave Grohl) comes off as a total prick always bitter and jealous. And James Iha is a awful song writer, just dire - his solo album is one of the worst albums I've ever heard and those two songs he wrote on Melon Collie (the ones that end each half) are so obviously the weakest songs on that album.
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Billy is definitely an odd ball personality and certainly rubs people the wrong way. I follow him on instagram where he is very active and he answers questions sometimes in such harsh ways to people. It's kind of entertaining from a social media perspective, but I can't believe he publicly rips his own fans so often.
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Hope the next SmashingPumpkins album is as good as it needs to be.
Shiny and Oh So Bright was pretty good but CYR was like listening to paint Dry.
Oceania was just alright and I never bothered with Monuments to an Elegy.
..I'm writing this as I am listening to Shiny And Oh SO Bright Again and it's way better than I remember.
But I couldn't get through CYR - which wasn't even as good as Adore.
Very interested in " Mellon Collie and The Machines Part 3 : The Infinite Sadness of God's Machines : Deux Ex Machina III - La Tristesse Durera Pour Zero "
or whatever the fuck he calls it.
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Cyr was not very good IMO and I agree, Shiny actually is pretty decent and it didn't hit me at first but I enjoy it much more now. Smashing Pumpkins actually played locally here recently part of a festival. I chose to see The Used and Coheed and Cambria insead.
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So, now that ATUM has been announced and Beguiled is out, I am curious what y'all think. I think Beguiled is fine, it doesn't blow me away or anything. I don't think it will live up to the hype as the follow-up to Mellon Collie and Machina, but I am someone who likes a fair amount of Pumpkins 2.0 stuff. I am excited for the eventual physical release, and it sounds like this will be a pretty diverse album. I have been listening to Billy's 33 podcast as well. So far there are 4 episodes, and they debut a new song for each one, discussing the concept. I have enjoyed what I have heard so far. They also talk about a song from the SP catalog on each and have a guest. The hosts get a little annoying at times, but I have enjoyed it so far.
Now, if we can just get that Machina I/II remaster as well... ;D
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Beguiled is definitely more along what I expect from SP over Cyr, but it also didn't really excite me. Fine song like you said. I haven't listened to the podcasts and probably won't. I am debating internally which concert to see on their local date, them or a the local ska show with some bands I also enjoy. Tough one for me.
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He gave that little 30-minute album a name like "Shiny And Oh So Bright, Vol. 1 / LP: No Past. No Future. No Sun." and then the follow up, which clearly had the same artist for the album cover, was just "CYR". Bugged the crap out of me. :lol I remember when it was announced I was trying to ask him on social media "Is this Shiny And Oh So Bright, Vol. 2"?
And yeah, still sad we got all those cool box sets and then just stopped before the Machina albums got their turn.
I wanted Zeitgeist to get one too, so all those bonus tracks that had been divided up for different stores would finally be in one place.
And I wanted those online-only Teargarden By Kaleidoscope tracks he released before Oceania came out to finally get a cd collection.
My collection feels so incomplete, darn it!
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A Machina reissue is the album I want most from any artist currently making music. I know some parts were rerecorded due to lost originals, and it was in the works at one point, but it seems to have disappeared.
I like the new songs so far but nothing's ever gonna blow me away like their older stuff unfortunately. I just want an enjoyable, listenable album with enough good songs to be worth its length. I liked Cyr enough, but it was bloated and hard to take in one sitting.
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I agree with all of the above sentiments!
I've been a fan from the beginning, and for a solid chunk of time in the late '90s/early'00s they were my favorite band. To me, Machina/Machina 2 is the band at their peak.
Unfortunately, everything since has felt like a meandering case of 'one step forward, one step back.'
Zeitgeist and Oceana were solid enough efforts, if not a little over-long. Monuments was the exact opposite (and I still don't understand why Jimmy isn't drumming on it).
Shiny and Cyr, despite contributions from Iha, feel like a million miles away from what I am looking for in a Pumpkin's record. I'm all for new directions (Adore is in my top 3), but the last two albums are just, well, not my thing at all
So, with all of that said, I 'like' the new song and will surely check out the new triple album. I just fear that, as has been the case for the past two decades, I'm going to have to sift through thirty or so tracks to find a solid album.
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Beguiled is definitely more along what I expect from SP over Cyr, but it also didn't really excite me. Fine song like you said. I haven't listened to the podcasts and probably won't. I am debating internally which concert to see on their local date, them or a the local ska show with some bands I also enjoy. Tough one for me.
I got my dates wrong, there's no conflict. I expect to go to the Pumpkins show at the Garden in 9 days.
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Rick Beato interviews Billy Corgan.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nAfkxHcqWKI&t=2963s
This is a really wonderful, in depth conversation with Billy. One of those guys who always seems to have something interesting to say about music (the conversation about AI at the end is fantastic). But he also got pretty emotional throughout the interview talking about his music, his band, and some of the people he’s worked with through the years. Really good stuff.
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I'll have to check it out, Billy can give some really interesting interviews