DreamTheaterForums.org Dream Theater Fan Site
General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: KevShmev on August 26, 2010, 11:21:59 AM
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Given how popular they are on this forum, I am merely curious to see how many actually like them more than Dream Theater. I did the two DT options for obvious reasons. Please vote accordingly and accurately. :biggrin:
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I am a huge DT fan, while a very moderate PT fan.
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I like both bands a lot, both are probably in my top 10. Very tough call, but I think I slightly prefer DT.
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Nowadays I can't even vote on this.
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Porcupine Tree. No question. But I do like DT a lot.
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If there was some magic calculator that could do the exact math, I am pretty sure that DT and PT would finish 2nd and 3rd on my list of "Bands I have listened to the most in my entire life," with DT being ahead of PT (since I have been listening to them for 11 more years), but PT gets the nod for me now for better band.
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PT. I think they've been my number 2 band for a while behind Rush. DT is still in my top five though.
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No option for PT and dislike of DT :laugh:
Went from obsessive DT to obsessive PT (still like DT though :yarr)
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Porcupine Tree. No question. But I do like DT.
I've been a huge DT fan but not so much anymore. PT on the other hand is my second favorite band behind Unexpect.
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I've only ever heard a few Porcupine Tree songs
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Fan of both bands, seen DT in concert six times and PT twice. Both are excellent live acts and qualify as some of the best shows I've seen in the past decade.
But Dream Theater wins pretty handily.
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Porcupine Tree easily, they're my favorite band meanwhile DT wouldn't make my top20.
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i'm a fan of both, but dt since the early 90s, i prefer pt better these days due to the darker more original songs.
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Porcupine Tree. No question. But I do like DT a lot.
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I like both bands, but Dream Theater by a long shot. I'm afraid PT will always be a band that I have to be in the right mood to listen to, whereas Dream Theater have several albums I can throw on at anytime.
This is how I decided:
My two favorite Dream Theater albums, Awake and Images and Words, slay my two favorite Porcupine Tree albums, In Absentia and Deadwing, regardless of how you match them up.
My favorite mid-tier Dream Theater album, Black Clouds and Silver Linings, is a little bit better than my favorite mid-tier Porcupine Tree album, Fear of a Blank Planet.
And, finally, the worst of the Dream Theater discography, Systematic Chaos, is still more interesting to me than the worst of the Porcupine Tree discography, The Incident.
So there ya go.
:metal
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DT, although I like PT I only have two of their albums. I'm sure I will get more though.
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I would have to go with PT these days. My interest in Dream Theater has been steadily declining in the post-SFAM years, while I am still into listening to the entirety of PT's catalog, sans The Incident.
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Honestly, while I find Porcupine Tree to be a tad overrated on this forum, I still find them a better band and gave them the vote.
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DT doesn't really do it for me anymore. Not in the way they used to, anyway. PT.
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I love both bands, but of late PT has had the better CD's and thus, the edge. Both are still can't miss CD and tours for me.
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This is a good thread. I like the poll options.
I voted PT even though I love both bands to death.
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PT by miles.
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I think the biggest edge PT has over DT is that PT really haven't had a Systematic Chaos yet. They've lost some fans with their changes in musical direction, but they haven't made a bad album since Up the Downstair.
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I love Porcupine Tree but Dream Theater comes out on top for me :D
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I love Porcupine Tree but Dream Theater comes out on top for me :D
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I think the biggest edge PT has over DT is that PT really haven't had a Systematic Chaos yet. They've lost some fans with their changes in musical direction, but they haven't made a bad album since Up the Downstair.
I voted Dream Theater (as a fan of both bands), but Systematic Chaos beats all hell out of The Incident.
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I think the biggest edge PT has over DT is that PT really haven't had a Systematic Chaos yet. They've lost some fans with their changes in musical direction, but they haven't made a bad album since Up the Downstair.
I voted Dream Theater (as a fan of both bands), but Systematic Chaos beats all hell out of The Incident.
Oh my lord, this is so true.
And, while DT doesn't do it for me like they used to, I haven't found the same refuge in PT that so many other disappointed* DT fans have.
*I say disappointed for lack of a better term. I think all DT's records are great, including Systematic Chaos. But their older work was phenomenal. Now, they're just a cool band I still like to listen to.
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Systematic Chaos beats all hell out of The Incident.
Goodness gracious no. SC isn't bad (just average), but The Incident is stellar from start to finish. It has no weak spots.
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Systematic Chaos beats all hell out of The Incident.
Goodness gracious no. SC isn't bad (just average), but The Incident is stellar from start to finish. It has no weak spots.
This, and I'd probably rank it like 8 or 9 in my PT list. That's how good their output is.
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Option 2
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Outside of one, maybe two, songs nothing I've heard from PT grabs me.
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Can't make the call. I really like both bands, but they're very different.
I have no data to support this, but I get the feeling that PT are grossly overrated on this forum (maybe these poll results will say otherwise). I love 'em, but IMO they are just as inconsistent as DT, and neither band has made a great album in several years (although PT did it more recently).
I also might say that DT's best stuff is better than PT's best stuff, but I hesitate to directly compare the two because they make such different music.
-J
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Systematic Chaos beats all hell out of The Incident.
Goodness gracious no. SC isn't bad (just average), but The Incident is stellar from start to finish. It has no weak spots.
The whole thing's a god-damned weak spot. I hope an incident like that never occurs again in the PT discography.
:neverusethis:
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wat
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wat
I don't feel like posting out my thoughts on the Incident again, so just read this. Oh, and ignore the bitching at Darkes.
https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=14921.msg518108#msg518108
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:rollin :rollin
lolDakes7
I understand what you are saying now, but I disagree with you. Degree Zero of Liberty --> Circle of Manias may be a bit boring, but the standouts for me are The Blind House --> Drawing The Line, Time Flies, and I Drive the Hearse. All are well on par with the rest of their discography, imo.
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Sure. The same pretty much holds true for Systematic Chaos, imo.
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DT by miles and miles. PT would probably make my top 10 or 15 and I like them a lot, but DT is my definitive number 1 so its really not even close.
PT just seems like a band that I can only listen to when I'm in a certain mood. There is a DT album for every mood, and the best DT albums absolutely destroy the best PT albums.
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Their both ok in my book, but I'd probably give DT the edge
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Can't make the call. I really like both bands, but they're very different.
I have no data to support this, but I get the feeling that PT are grossly overrated on this forum (maybe these poll results will say otherwise). I love 'em, but IMO they are just as inconsistent as DT, and neither band has made a great album in several years (although PT did it more recently).
I don't know what they teach at Mr. J Schools, but 1 year =/= several years. Thats when The Incident and BC&SL came out, remember?
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lolDarkes.
DT has been my favorite band for 12 years. PT may have grazed my top 20 once. My thoughts on PT have been expressed elsewhere and I'll just leave it that they are good, but massively overratted.
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Can't make the call. I really like both bands, but they're very different.
I have no data to support this, but I get the feeling that PT are grossly overrated on this forum (maybe these poll results will say otherwise). I love 'em, but IMO they are just as inconsistent as DT, and neither band has made a great album in several years (although PT did it more recently).
I don't know what they teach at Mr. J Schools, but 1 year =/= several years. Thats when The Incident and BC&SL came out, remember?
They teach us to have objectively good musical taste. Mine tells me that The Incident and BC&SL are both above average--but not GREAT--albums. :neverusethis:
-J
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If your school taught you that then you must have failed that objective music class, because I passed with an A+ at Ninja School and can tell you they are both great albums. :D
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If we're talking about each band's output since SDOIT, Porcupine Tree easily wins for me. But overall, Dream Theater is still ranked higher in my book.
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If your school taught you that then you must have failed that objective music class, because I passed with an A+ at Ninja School and can tell you they are both great albums. :D
A ninja, eh? Hmm...you win. For now.
-J
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Porcupine Tree. There is no basis for comparison by which DT beats them.
Who has the better discography overall? PT
Who has the better playlist of top 15 songs? PT
Between them, who has the best song? PT
Between them, who has the best album? PT
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"Who was dragged down by the stone."
That's what popped up in my head :P
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Umm..This is DTF NOT PTF..WTF!
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I don't know what they teach at Mr. J Schools, but 1 year =/= several years. Thats when The Incident and BC&SL came out, remember?
Both are weak releases (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/Smileys/default/tard.gif)
I can't vote. Both are great bands with different strengths and weaknesses. Although, with some of PT's albums, I have to be in the right mood to enjoy them. I can usually put on DT at any time.
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Systematic Chaos beats all hell out of The Incident.
Goodness gracious no. SC isn't bad (just average), but The Incident is stellar from start to finish. It has no weak spots.
The whole thing's a god-damned weak spot. I hope an incident like that never occurs again in the PT discography.
:neverusethis:
As much as this post makes me want to brutally rape, murder, and then rape you again, I'll give you some props for the pun.
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Between them, who has the best song? PT
Which song will that be?
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I think it has something to do with what a group of guys does to one really slutty girl (in the plural).
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I am a huge DT fan, while a very moderate PT fan.
If the word "very" were taken out of this post, it would describe me perfectly.
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Umm..This is DTF NOT PTF..WTF!
PTF is a pretty bland place though. DTF is where all the cool PT fans go :coolio
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How is there a difference between very moderate and moderate? That's like saying you're in the very middle instead of just "the middle".
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How is there a difference between very moderate and moderate? That's like saying you're in the very middle instead of just "the middle".
Hm. I don't know. See, if I were going to say moderate, it'd pretty much accurately describe me. Like, I'm a moderate PT fan year round, and then for like 1 month of each year I go batshit crazy of them. If I were very moderate, I'd be the same. Only no crazy period.
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Umm..This is DTF NOT PTF..WTF!
PTF is a pretty bland place though. DTF is where all the cool PT fans go :coolio
Is it really? I wanted to lurk, but didn't feel like registering.
It can't be worse than Opeth Forums. Now, that place is dead.
I'd imagine PT to have a really strong online following, but meh.
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DT, no contest at all.
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Umm..This is DTF NOT PTF..WTF!
PTF is a pretty bland place though. DTF is where all the cool PT fans go :coolio
Is it really? I wanted to lurk, but didn't feel like registering.
It can't be worse than Opeth Forums. Now, that place is dead.
I'd imagine PT to have a really strong online following, but meh.
It's not that it's dead, it's just not very interesting. The community just isn't as tightly woven and fun as DTF's (granted, most online communities aren't).
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Fan of both, but DT by far for me.
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Thei ncident is theeir second best alvium. Ture story.
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Thei ncident is theeir second best alvium. Ture story.
Si soemnoe durnk?
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Thei ncident is theeir second best alvium. Ture story.
Dude. Again?
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How is there a difference between very moderate and moderate? That's like saying you're in the very middle instead of just "the middle".
I don't know, I just felt like putting a "very" in my sentence to emphasize my lukewarm interest for PT ;D
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A pretty easy decision for me: DT. PT's albums tend to be less consistent and have less staying power. Besides, I'm not really fond of Steven Wilson's singing style.
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Thei ncident is theeir second best alvium. Ture story.
Dude. Again?
Sorry, introduction week at uni. I'm not a first year student anymore but I do get access to the parties. It will be over after tonight :p.
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At first I didn't like PT but after giving them many spins over the years and they really grew on me. Over the same years I started listening to DT less and less and now I would listen to PT over DT any day.
Nothing against DT, my music tastes have changed over the years.
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I'm actually really surprised over the PT > DT ratio here, considering this is a DT forum. Wow.
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I'm actually really surprised over the PT > DT ratio here, considering this is a DT forum. Wow.
What? Twice as many people who've voted so far like Dream Theater better. And about a quarter of the people who voted don't like PT at all.
Very few bands have thriving online communities as successful as Dream Theater's. I think a lot of people here are here just as much for the community as they are for Dream Theater. People tend to stick around here even when they don't like Dream Theater so much anymore. Because the other people here are cool.
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I was more going by a lot of the responses in the thread, but you're right when you're looking at the votes.
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Dream Theater.
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Dream Theater (I am not a PT fan)
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I'm actually really surprised over the PT > DT ratio here, considering this is a DT forum. Wow.
Very few bands have thriving online communities as successful as Dream Theater's. I think a lot of people here are here just as much for the community as they are for Dream Theater. People tend to stick around here even when they don't like Dream Theater so much anymore. Because the other people here are cool.
That's pretty much me, I rarely listen to DT anymore. I just like hanging out here.
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Comparing the albums:
WDADU (6) vs OTSOL (?.. at a guess 6-7)
I&W (9.5) vs UTD (?.. at a guess 7-8)
Awake (9) vs TSMS (8)
FII (7) vs S (8)
SFAM (9.5) vs SD (8.5)
SDOIT (9) vs LS (8.5)
TOT (6.5) vs IA (9.5)
O (7.5) vs DW (9)
SC (6.5) vs FOABP (8)
BC&SL (8) vs TI (8)
I much prefer PT (as I got into them more recently), although the figures suggest there isn't much in it.
It looks like DT peaked early and PT later on, another possible reason for my preference to PT.
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My scores:
WDaDU (4) vs. OtSoL (7)
I&W (9) vs. UtD (10)
Awake (10) vs. tSMS (10)
FII (2) vs. Signify (9.5)
SFaM (10) vs. Stupid Dream (8)
SDoIT (8.5) vs. Lightbulb Sun (6)
ToT (4) vs. In Absentia (8)
Octavarium (7) vs. Deadwing (7)
Systematic Chaos (10) vs. FoaBP (7)
BCaSL (7.5) vs. The Incident (2)
Ties count as zero for both. The score is DT: 4 PT: 4
So it's a tie. :laugh: You could probably tell from this that I absolutely love psych PT. I voted DT though because when they make a masterpiece, it hits me a lot harder than any band could ever hope for.
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Porcupine Tree have a few albums that I dig, but Dream Theater is the far greater band for me.
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Between them, who has the best song? PT
Which song will that be?
Right now...
Dark Matter.
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I thought this was a good way to compare, so I'll do it.
(Note: Scale is 1-10. The 12 is for being basically tied for my favorite album ever.)
WDaDU 5 vs. OtSoL 3
I&W 12 vs. UtD 6
Awake 9 vs. tSMS 7
FII 7 vs. Signify 8.5
SFaM 9 vs. Stupid Dream 9
SDoIT 9 vs. Lightbulb Sun 9.5
ToT 6 vs. In Absentia 12
Octavarium 8 vs. Deadwing 9.5
Systematic Chaos 6 vs. FoaBP 9
BCaSL 8.5 vs. The Incident 9
DT: 79.5 PT: 82.5
Albums - DT: 3 PT: 6 Push: 1
Best song - DT: Learning to Live PT: Buying New Soul or Trains
PT wins.
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When comparing the studio albums, let us not forget the MASSIVE advantage PT has in non-studio album work.
DT has ACOS (the song), Don't Look Past Me, the five FII non-album tracks, To Live Forever, Eve, Raw Dog, Bombay Vindaloo and a few Majesty songs, right? That is less than 20 non-album track songs (if you count the Majesty songs as DT songs).
PT has Recordings (9 songs), the Nil Recurring EP (4 songs), three or four non-album tracks from both IA and DW, Insignificance (10 songs, some of which, to be fair, are reworkings are previously recorded songs), Metanoia (8 songs), Voyage 34 (4 songs), Staircase Infinities (5 songs), some of the non-album songs from the Delirium Years (10+ songs, IIRC), Revenant, etc.
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Yeah, Kev is right. PT's b-sides are better than most of their album songs as well.
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OTSOL vs WDADU= WDADU
UTDS vs I&W= I&W no doubt.
TSMS vs Awake= Awake.
Signify vs FII= Signify
SD vs SFAM= SFAM
LBS vs 6DOIT= 6DOIT
IA VS TOT= IA
DW vs 8VM= DW
FOABP vs SC= FOABP
TI vs BC&SL= Tie.
so DT but PT is my second favorite band.
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I'm not sure if I'd count that as a big advantage. Though it has left Porcupine Tree with somewhat more consistent albums (i.e., there are plenty of Dream Theater albums that would have been better if the band had just decided to make them shorter by taking out the duds. Systematic Chaos without TMOLS comes to mind), I'm not sure it affects my feelings about either band too much. Though I haven't heard the majority of PT's non-album stuff, that which I have heard has ranged from disappointing (Voyage 34) to not really warranting a reaction one way or another (Drown With Me).
Underlying it all are the major difference between PT and DT, though. I get the impression that Dream Theater orient around writing as much music as possible to release to the fans, making sure each album has somewhere near a full disc of music. In other words, quantity trumps the overall quality of the albums. Porcupine Tree are the exact opposite. Songs like "Drown With Me," while decent, don't make the cut because PT are more concerned with how the album works as a whole. The result is the fans get less music-at least at first- but what they do is stuff that may not really be that good anyway.
But since everything gets released regardless in one for or another, it doesn't make a huge difference to me. Personally, I like Dream Theater's way of forgoing the additional cash-grab and just putting everything out there and letting the fans decide what they like and don't like better, and not without reason. I remember reading that if 6 Degrees couldn't be a double-disc album, the songs that would have been cut were Blind Faith and Disappear, which would have been terrible, since those are easily the best songs (for me) on that disc. Likewise, the FII b-sides are much better than a lot of the songs that actually made it onto the album.
But anyway, since we're talking about advantages outside of studio albums, I'd say Dream Theater definitely have the advantage when it comes to live releases. Between the 5 DVDs and CDs and all the official bootleg stuff, they do a pretty good job of catering to fans who like that kind of stuff. On the other hand, Porcupine Tree's live stuff is pretty sparse and, for me anyway, they're just not as fun to watch.
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PT doesn't cut all the crowd noise out of their concerts though. But both are amazing as live bands, I'll agree.
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PC, that is an awfully biased way of looking at it. Okay, so when PT doesn't put everything on studio albums, instead putting it on other releases, it is a cash grab, but DT releasing a million live albums and DVDs isn't? Really?
And for the record, I don't have a problem with either band doing either of those things.
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PC, that is an awfully biased way of looking at it. Okay, so when PT doesn't put everything on studio albums, instead putting it on other releases, it is a cash grab, but DT releasing a million live albums and DVDs isn't? Really?
And for the record, I don't have a problem with either band doing either of those things.
Maybe "cash grab" was a little harsh.
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Especially when most of their B-sides and EPs come with the albums whose material they were written for nowadays at no additional cost. I don't buy the whole "let's just put everything on the album no matter what" viewpoint as being a good thing either. Putting potential duds and lacklusters songs/sections on an album because you don't want to cut it because you think you're cheating the fans is absurd, especially when it hurts the album as a whole. I repsect PT's tight editing a whole hell of a lot for that specific reason. While I might not love every song on an album the one thing their albums consistently have is incredible flow and an overall sound that just sounds "right".
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PT.
But there are many bands i'd consider to be better than DT.
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I'm going to guess PoS is one of them?
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Especially when most of their B-sides and EPs come with the albums whose material they were written for nowadays at no additional cost. I don't buy the whole "let's just put everything on the album no matter what" viewpoint as being a good thing either. Putting potential duds and lacklusters songs/sections on an album because you don't want to cut it because you think you're cheating the fans is absurd, especially when it hurts the album as a whole. I repsect PT's tight editing a whole hell of a lot for that specific reason. While I might not love every song on an album the one thing their albums consistently have is incredible flow and an overall sound that just sounds "right".
QFT. I could not agree more. With PT, it is all about making a perfect-sounding and flowing album, not just throwing everything up to 80 minutes on to a CD and saying, "Here ya go."
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I'm going to guess PoS is one of them?
Yes.
But that's not to say DT aren't a very good band. They got me into prog metal and I will always respect them for that. I just think there are better bands out there. Ones who might not be able to match them on a technical standpoint, but in terms of writing great music, i'd argue there's a handful of bands in this genre who have surpassed the talents of DT.
PT is indeed one of those bands. But i'd also argue that i'd never have gotten to this stage without DT being such an influence.
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It's really apples and oranges, but really: Porcupine Tree. I used to drool over DT, but nowadays there are many bands with music that has a much deeper connection with me.
That said, I still like to bang my head to DT tunes, and I have tremendous respect for their music, their togetherness with the fans, etc. Everything is just top notch. And they absolutely rule as players. I just began to realise that some of their songs just aren't as good as I originally thought, when I was high on them. That high never comes back, except when I see them live. That's why I never pass a DT gig. Live, they absolutely rock the house.
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More liek SLIPKNOT LOL1!!!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-11123906
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Porcupine Tree. No question. But I do like DT.
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Dream Theater with no doubt. I enjoy some of PT's stuffs, like Signify, Stupid Dream, Lightbulb Sun and In Absentia, while I thoroughly enjoy DT's discography.
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Epic.........epic fail in the results of this particular thread.
A sad sad day for me.
I hope this thread gets locked, burned and never spoken of again.
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Epic.........epic fail in the results of this particular thread.
A sad sad day for me.
I hope this thread gets locked, burned and never spoken of again.
What? Why?
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Epic.........epic fail in the results of this particular thread.
A sad sad day for me.
I hope this thread gets locked, burned and never spoken of again.
What? Why?
Yeah I don't get it. Like 2/3rds of the forum like DT better, and 1/3rd don't like PT at all.
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Umm..This is DTF NOT PTF..WTF!
PTF is a pretty bland place though. DTF is where all the cool PT fans go :coolio
[troll]
Maybe if PT were a better band PTF would be a better place :biggrin:
[/troll]
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Maybe if PT were a better band PTF would be a better place
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More liek SLIPKNOT LOL1!!!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-11123906
"Jordison is noted for simultaneously playing two bass drums"
...
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More liek SLIPKNOT LOL1!!!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-11123906
"Jordison is noted for simultaneously playing two bass drums"
...
Yeah they don't even listen to technical music!1!
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Maybe if PT were a better band PTF would be a better place
Well, no, but, if you think about it, maybe.
A little bit of conflict is good for community participation. Having a solid minority of fans constantly asserting that the band is done and will never be able to reach its creative potential again thanks to "x" factor is good for drumming up discussion, and, in the long term, activity. As far as I know, the foundation of Porcupine Tree's fanbase shows occasional cracks (notably, people not liking the last two albums) but its nowhere near as broken (and thus as interesting to lurk around) as DT's.
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Epic.........epic fail in the results of this particular thread.
A sad sad day for me.
I hope this thread gets locked, burned and never spoken of again.
Are you sad that lots of people like DT more? Because thats what the majority looks like from here and you don't really seem like a big PT guy...
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no...actually...I read the results so fast...Im a fucking tool...and should edit my post..but I think the "tool" admission would sit better with members......
carry on as though a fat braying ass had never wondered into this thread.
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More liek SLIPKNOT LOL1!!!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-11123906
"Jordison is noted for simultaneously playing two bass drums"
...
Yeah, I lol'd hard at that.
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DT, I'm not a fan of PT/Steven Wilson
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forget it
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carry on as though a fat braying ass had never wondered into this thread.
Wrath posted in this thread?
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Porcupine Tree seems to be doing more inspiring things these days. Dream Theater will always have the better music, though.
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I do like Porcupine Tree a lot, but DT by a large margin.