DreamTheaterForums.org Dream Theater Fan Site
General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: Sigz on July 04, 2010, 07:26:48 PM
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Well?
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Very
BRGM doesn't know what he's saying :P
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Very important. I don't listen to TCOT anymore because the lyrics are just too awful.
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Very
BRGM doesn't know what he's saying :P
Actually for the most part I agree with him in this case.
And come to think of it, this should have been a poll. Oh well.
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It really depends. If the music is good, then lyrics won't bother me if they're bad. But honestly, I find more enjoyment from bands with good lyricists. For example, Modest Mouse is made just that much better by the brilliance in Isaac Brock's lyrics.
Overall, I'd say they're important to me depending on the sort of band. In Opeth, I don't think I know the lyrics to more than a few songs, though I love the music to death. In Pain of Salvation, they're a little more important.
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Bad lyrics take away no enjoyment for music for me, but great lyrics add a ton of enjoyment.
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Lyrics are interesting, but it's the one layer a singer has above any other musician. The guitarist, bassist, keyboardist, etc have to hit the right notes. Their melodies have to be good and so does their tone. All of this applies to the singer, however they also have to deal with the idea of lyrics. To me, they are very importan to an extent. I don't need super serious lyrics all of the time. And I have no real set of standards.
I can listen to Rhapsody at anytime, but can't listen to some Ayreon because of the lyrics. I can listen just fine godsmack, but can't stand some modern DT cause of the lyrics. No real logic behind it, I guess I just hold certain bands up to higher standards based on what else they do.
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Bad lyrics take away no enjoyment for music for me, but great lyrics add a ton of enjoyment.
Pretty much this.
I'll feel way more connected to a song if they have great lyrics. But good music is good music, and I try not to let less-than-stellar lyrics bog it down.
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Honestly, it hasn't been until relatively recently that I'll listen to a song and what the singer is saying will register to me as actual words that have real meaning when strung together. It use to be that it was all just melodies and noise. It's really weird and I'm not sure what to make of it right now.
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Bad lyrics take away no enjoyment for music for me, but great lyrics add a ton of enjoyment.
This.
I love Even Less and Buying New Soul more because of their lyrics, but I don't like The Count of Tuscany or Ants of the Sky less because of theirs.
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Bad lyrics take away no enjoyment for music for me, but great lyrics add a ton of enjoyment.
This. I don't mind if they're bad, but it's a big + if they're good.
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Considering I listen to a lot of death and black metal, not so much.
Great lyrics are a plus, definitely. But not a requirement. Otherwise I wouldn't be a Megadeth fan :biggrin:
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Bad lyrics take away no enjoyment for music for me, but great lyrics add a ton of enjoyment.
This mostly. If the lyrics are really, REALLY bad, then I probably won't bother with it too much.
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Very important, and I honestly feel sorry for those whom lyrics are not important to. Not caring about the lyrics is like watching a movie and not caring about the dialogue.
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I think they're VERY important in regards to the quality and level of the music. Simple music can call for simple lyrics, and more complex music (i.e. concept albums, rock operas, thematic albums) can call for more complex lyrics.
I think good ideas that turn into good lyrics can sound great if backed by great music. Rarely do I feel that good lyrics are found with bad music. It tends to be the other way around - bad lyrics with good music (as some might say is the case with DT's "The Count Of Tuscany", but I've actually grown to like the lyrics BECAUSE the music is so good!).
One case for me is Neal Morse's lyrics since he left Spock's Beard. As someone who doesn't really believe in Christianity (anymore), it took me awhile to get used to his new lyrical style and presentation, but his music is just so damn good, I've grown to accept them as just another lyrical subject matter (much in the way Jon Anderson used Eastern philosophy and religion as a basis for some Yes material) that Neal has decided to use, albeit in a more direct manner. One song in particular, "King Jesus", is so overtly Christian Rock, but musically speaking it's one of Neal's best rock tunes and I love playing it full blast in my car while spinning One.
In other artists, though, sometimes the lyrics do have to be intelligible, and smart, and not simple "love ballads" or "hateful screamers", but there's a time and place for those as well. For the music I listen to most, I think the lyricists do a GREAT job in conveying what they mean and put it with music that matches it so well.
So in other words, yes, lyrics are VERY important, especially when it comes to making or breaking the music behind it.
-Marc.
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Very important, and I honestly feel sorry for those whom lyrics are not important to. Not caring about the lyrics is like watching a movie and not caring about the dialogue.
Thank you, please go to the "most talented member of DT" thread and back me up.
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Very important, and I honestly feel sorry for those whom lyrics are not important to. Not caring about the lyrics is like watching a movie and not caring about the dialogue.
Or maybe I care about the music much more so than the lyrics? I have a lot of bands I listen to, and honestly, there is a threshold where you can't look up the lyrics to every song in your library. Looking up the lyrics to about 10,000 songs would drive me crazy.
The music caries so much more emotion and feeling than words have the capacity to do, I like to think.
P.S. If it means anything, I don't consider DT's lyrics that special, with a few exceptions. There are times that they stand out here and there, but for the most part DT's lyrics aren't really that special to me. I listen to them because I like their music.
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Or maybe I care about the music much more so than the lyrics?
So, really, vocalists in the bands you like might as well just sing wordless vocals, right? I mean, if you don't care about the lyrics at all, it
wouldn't matter to you if they weren't singing any actual ones, right?
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Or maybe I care about the music much more so than the lyrics?
So, really, vocalists in the bands you like might as well just sing wordless vocals, right? I mean, if you don't care about the lyrics at all, it
wouldn't matter to you if they weren't singing any actual ones, right?
Also being the case, do you have any music you listen to that you like from other countries, meaning they sing in their native tongue and not English or any language you speak/understand? There's LOADS of great music out there (more than I'll ever know) from parts of the world where they don't sing in English... I think that'd be perfect for people who don't care so much about lyrics.
-Marc.
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Or maybe I care about the music much more so than the lyrics?
So, really, vocalists in the bands you like might as well just sing wordless vocals, right? I mean, if you don't care about the lyrics at all, it
wouldn't matter to you if they weren't singing any actual ones, right?
Might as well. As long as it sounds good I don't particularly care most of the time.
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To me, lyrics have much more ability to drag a song down than to lift it up to a higher level. I don't pay all that much attention to them except when I specifically notice that they're bad.
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Bad lyrics take away no enjoyment for music for me, but great lyrics add a ton of enjoyment.
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Second only to the melody line.
But lyrics are indeed very important and I go through painstaking levels to scrutinize my work until I feel its perfect...
and even then I'm always thinking about how I could tweak bits here and there later on.
As for artists I listen to? I usually don't care about their intended message.
Example: Nevermore's opening track off their new album is pro-life. I'm very much pro-choice
and just had to recently go through the hardest decision in my life and actually go through with getting an abortion
with a girl I'm dating...yet I won't let it hinder my enjoyment of the song.
I like Trouble, who are a pro-chrisitian doom band, but I'm a hardcore atheist.
There's a million examples of artists I disagree with thematically.
That's irrelevant though. Music is there for enjoyment first and
foremost, and for thought provocation afterward.
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Or maybe I care about the music much more so than the lyrics?
So, really, vocalists in the bands you like might as well just sing wordless vocals, right? I mean, if you don't care about the lyrics at all, it
wouldn't matter to you if they weren't singing any actual ones, right?
Think of it this way. Its not what is said that is important to me, but how its said.
If I cared so much about lyrics, I wouldn't listen to a lot of the bands that I do. I'm not religious, but pro-religion lyrics don't bother me for the most part because I don't put too much stock into it.
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Bad lyrics take away no enjoyment for music for me, but great lyrics add a ton of enjoyment.
This
For Example i can listen to TCOT over and over just beause to the music, not paying much attention to the lyrics but when I DO get TCOT lyrics, i listen to LTL instead. ;D
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Its really important to me, unless the band specifically doesn't give a shit about lyrics. But for bands that I would expect quality lyrics from given their past (like DT), I get disappointed when we are stuck with clunkers. At that point, it does take away from the song as a whole.... the music is still great. but lyrically, it will always bother me, like The Count of Tuscany.
But since one of the things I love doing with my time is writing lyrics, they mean a lot to me, and is what I associate with the most when I listen to music.
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It depends on what type of music I'm listening to, to be honest.
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Doesn't really bother me to be honest. Sometimes if I read lyrics they may add enjoyment to the atmosphere of the song, but a lot of the time it makes no difference.
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If the lyrics are astoundingly bad, they can seriously hinder my enjoyment of a song. This happens fairly often.
If they're extremely good AND fit the music particularly well, they may take my appreciation of the song to a higher level. This happens very rarely.
In general, I think most lyrics are average (or weak) enough that the aspects of them I tend to enjoy have more to do with the way they sound, or the way they are delivered by the vocalist, than what they are actually saying.
-J
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Very
This was going to be my "in brief" answer.
If I find the lyrics to a song atrocious, I won't even give it a chance, with very few exceptions. Pretty bad lyrics won't completely ruin a song for me, though I won't listen to it often.
And generally, if I don't absolutely adore the lyrics to a song or album, it'll have a very hard time climbing high in my favourites.
Though this doesn't mean all my favourite songs are lyrically elaborate poetic masterpieces. Simple lyrics pulled off brilliantly are brilliant lyrics. It's also about the style of lyrics fitting the style of song.
I have a lot of bands I listen to, and honestly, there is a threshold where you can't look up the lyrics to every song in your library. Looking up the lyrics to about 10,000 songs would drive me crazy.
If a good enough percentage of the lyrics isn't reasonably discernible enough for you to get a sense of the quality of a song's lyrics by ear, it's not worth listening to, simple as that. There are exceptions, I suppose, but again, very few. Lyrics are extremely important to me, but I'll usually only look them up once they really start to interest me or impress me.
Also being the case, do you have any music you listen to that you like from other countries, meaning they sing in their native tongue and not English or any language you speak/understand? There's LOADS of great music out there (more than I'll ever know) from parts of the world where they don't sing in English... I think that'd be perfect for people who don't care so much about lyrics.
-Marc.
Lyrics in another language is an entirely different matter. Assuming your competence in that language is low to nonexistent, as you're suggesting, the threshold of effort required to actually familiarise yourself with that band's lyrics is far too high to bother trying to judge them on the quality of the lyrics.
Normally, for lyrics sung in other languages, I'll find out what the songs are about, perhaps follow it with a translation of the lyrics, but anything beyond that I don't think I've ever done.
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To be make a point, there is a difference between bad lyrics and foreign lyrics. You can't say "Well you have no idea if the foreign ones are good, blah blah blah". If I have no idea what they're saying, it's neither good nor bad. If I know what they're saying, they can then become good or bad.
If I hear a song in finnish that translates to "Then I went shopping and bought some cool shirts and blew brad pitt in the back of a volkswagen", but I don't know the translation, then I don't care, cause then it just sounds pretty.
However if that same song is in english and I can make out what they're saying, I'll hate it.
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Why not just read poems if you like lyrics... ::)
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Why not just read poems if you like lyrics... ::)
Are you serious? I honestly can't tell.
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Why not just read poems if you like lyrics... ::)
Good God, what is this?!
Lyrics are kind of important to me, but I don't base my opinion of a song solely on the lyrics. Still, very good lyrics that work well together with the music can put this song on a higher level. Also, bad lyrics can narrow my enjoyment of a song.
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I'm sorry. I'll revise.
Why not just listen to spoken word poem recordings if you like lyrics... ::)
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I'm sorry. I'll revise.
Why not just listen to spoken word poem recordings if you like lyrics... ::)
Do you enjoy movies with horrible dialouge? Why not just read a book?
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Why does everyone keep making this movie analogy? They're two completely different mediums.
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Why does everyone keep making this movie analogy? They're two completely different mediums.
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Why not just listen to spoken word poem recordings if you like lyrics... ::)
Because lyrics are a lot more than just 'poetry' that sits randomly on top of the music. It's about how the language enhances and is enhanced by the music, how they add something to each other via a different realm of expression.
Bad lyrics, however, don't enhance music. They can only detract from it.
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Not very. They're maybe about 10% of a song's meaning to me. When lyrics are really, really good and beautiful it can enhance the song quite significantly but they're barely important to me, honestly sometimes I reckon the singer could just be singing anything and as long as the music underneath appeals to me, then I'm happy. I don't even focus on them very much, I can deeply love a song for a few years and only after that period of time suddenly realise or find out what exactly someone is singing at a certain point, despite knowing the music absolutely inside and out. Bad lyrics don't detract from the music at all for me.
It can be awesome when it suddenly clicks though, I tend to passively absorb lyrics... for the past few years of Fear of a Blank Planet being released, I really loved the 'I simply am not here' line in Anesthetize. I love/d the title track a huge amount (and really really got off on a lot of the lyrics of that song) but it was only a couple of weeks ago that I realised Wilson was singing 'I need to know that someone sees that there's nothing left, I simply am not here'. The click between that song and Anesthetize and the way I was feeling about my life at that moment really meant a lot to me and became significant and I feel like it added another layer of love to the song. I appreciate awesome lyics in the context of a song, but they're the icing on the cake for me, nothing more.
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I don't really care about lyrics, as long as they make sense. I mostly enjoy the instrumentation and the singing itself, not much of the message it conveys, etc.
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Not very. They're maybe about 10% of a song's meaning to me. When lyrics are really, really good and beautiful it can enhance the song quite significantly but they're barely important to me, honestly sometimes I reckon the singer could just be singing anything and as long as the music underneath appeals to me, then I'm happy. I don't even focus on them very much, I can deeply love a song for a few years and only after that period of time suddenly realise or find out what exactly someone is singing at a certain point, despite knowing the music absolutely inside and out. Bad lyrics don't detract from the music at all for me.
Pretty much all of this. :)
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So, really, vocalists in the bands you like might as well just sing wordless vocals, right? I mean, if you don't care about the lyrics at all, it
wouldn't matter to you if they weren't singing any actual ones, right?
Can't say I'd really mind.
Something else I've noticed, though, is that when it comes to something like rap I'll care about the lyrics much more than most other genres, since there isn't much else going on (relative to other types of music).
Also being the case, do you have any music you listen to that you like from other countries, meaning they sing in their native tongue and not English or any language you speak/understand? There's LOADS of great music out there (more than I'll ever know) from parts of the world where they don't sing in English... I think that'd be perfect for people who don't care so much about lyrics.
-Marc.
Actually, what would be "perfect" for people who don't care so much about lyrics are songs with good music. What language they're in doesn't really mean anything (other than how some languages sound when spoken). As for why I don't have much foreign music, because I have nothing to really help me find the good stuff. I use this site and a few others to help figure out if I should check a band out, and foreign stuff doesn't exactly come up very often.
Do you enjoy movies with horrible dialouge? Why not just read a book?
Because that's almost as stupid of a comparison as that spoken word poetry argument earlier.
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Not very. They're maybe about 10% of a song's meaning to me. When lyrics are really, really good and beautiful it can enhance the song quite significantly but they're barely important to me, honestly sometimes I reckon the singer could just be singing anything and as long as the music underneath appeals to me, then I'm happy. I don't even focus on them very much, I can deeply love a song for a few years and only after that period of time suddenly realise or find out what exactly someone is singing at a certain point, despite knowing the music absolutely inside and out. Bad lyrics don't detract from the music at all for me.
This. The music always comes first for me, and if the lyrics are good then that's a nice bonus.
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In general, if the band/artist is going to insist on stupid meaningless drivel for lyrics, I won't listen to the music at all. Not interested. If they don't care about them, why should I? If the lyrics aren't important, why not just be an instrumental group? I just honestly don't understand the viewpoint of "they aren't important at all."
And the comparison between songs and film is a good one. Not sure why anyone would think otherwise.
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In case of most music I listen to, very. Listening with the album booklet is almost necessary for me, and I feel they make a very important part of the music and atmosphere. In general, I'm also not a great fan of all-instrumental music.
The only exceptions are full-on thrash or death metal, where all I expect from the lyrics is to create a certain dark atmosphere and be fairly reasonably written.
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And the comparison between songs and film is a good one. Not sure why anyone would think otherwise.
Because they're completely different forms of entertainment that most people enjoy for entirely different reasons, and books and movies are two different forms of story telling with their own advantages and disadvantages. I don't listen to music for its story (unless it's a concept album, in which case I'll actually care about the lyrics as far as how well they tell the story).
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And the comparison between songs and film is a good one. Not sure why anyone would think otherwise.
Because they're completely different forms of entertainment that most people enjoy for entirely different reasons, and books and movies are two different forms of story telling with their own advantages and disadvantages. I don't listen to music for its story (unless it's a concept album, in which case I'll actually care about the lyrics as far as how well they tell the story).
Yes, but there are multiple ways of enjoying both film and music. There are multiple elements going on at the same time that can be analyzed individually or as a whole.
With film, there is the cinematography, directing, dialogue, writing, acting, special effects, etc.
With music, there is the songwriting, composition, technical difficulty of the music, technical ability of the musicians, the quality of the performance, the lyrics, the delivery of the lyrics by the vocalist(s), etc.
There are comparisons to be made there, and valid ones, regardless of the difference of the media.
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I love lyrics, I've come to appreciate them more and more.
But not when it comes to writing my own, though. We're making great music with my band now, but tonight it's vocal melody & lyrics time. I'm scared to death of that kind of stuff. I want to make music that's honest, but I can't seem to find anything useful to write about. Everything's going perfectly fine in my life, but I don't want to make ignorant happy music.
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I'm sorry. I'll revise.
Why not just listen to spoken word poem recordings if you like lyrics... ::)
That makes absolutely no sense.
And the comparison between songs and film is a good one. Not sure why anyone would think otherwise.
Because they're completely different forms of entertainment that most people enjoy for entirely different reasons, and books and movies are two different forms of story telling with their own advantages and disadvantages. I don't listen to music for its story (unless it's a concept album, in which case I'll actually care about the lyrics as far as how well they tell the story).
Yes, but there are multiple ways of enjoying both film and music. There are multiple elements going on at the same time that can be analyzed individually or as a whole.
With film, there is the cinematography, directing, dialogue, writing, acting, special effects, etc.
With music, there is the songwriting, composition, technical difficulty of the music, technical ability of the musicians, the quality of the performance, the lyrics, the delivery of the lyrics by the vocalist(s), etc.
There are comparisons to be made there, and valid ones, regardless of the difference of the media.
Exactly. :tup :tup
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Very important, but I have no problem with The Count's lyrics. I do enjoy cheese but there's a line to cross. Symphony X gets criticised heavily for being cheesy but to me they're nowhere near that line. But.
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It's the sum off all that makes a great song, from lyrics to melody, to the craftmenship of a song, it matters. Some have it all and these are the song that are near and dear to my heart, others lacking in some of these parts are very good songs I still enjoy and some don't catch my imagination at all because it lacks those qualities. So lyrics matter but it doesn't always take away from my enjoyment.
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Not that important to me.
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Pretty important...I really probably don't notice them so much when they are good (or at least bearable), but when they are bad it can ruin the song for me
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Very
This was going to be my "in brief" answer.
If I find the lyrics to a song atrocious, I won't even give it a chance, with very few exceptions. Pretty bad lyrics won't completely ruin a song for me, though I won't listen to it often.
And generally, if I don't absolutely adore the lyrics to a song or album, it'll have a very hard time climbing high in my favourites.
Though this doesn't mean all my favourite songs are lyrically elaborate poetic masterpieces. Simple lyrics pulled off brilliantly are brilliant lyrics. It's also about the style of lyrics fitting the style of song.
I have a lot of bands I listen to, and honestly, there is a threshold where you can't look up the lyrics to every song in your library. Looking up the lyrics to about 10,000 songs would drive me crazy.
If a good enough percentage of the lyrics isn't reasonably discernible enough for you to get a sense of the quality of a song's lyrics by ear, it's not worth listening to, simple as that. There are exceptions, I suppose, but again, very few. Lyrics are extremely important to me, but I'll usually only look them up once they really start to interest me or impress me.
So, if the singer is so high pitched that its nearly impossible to know what they are saying, its bad? I guess I should feel bad for loving Rush in that case. And I love Rush for their music, not the lyrics. Honestly, Neil Peart's lyrics are very mediocre to me, but I love Rush regardless. And I love Death/Black Metal despite having rather underwhelming lyrical prowess (Atheist is probably the lone exception to this rule, but w/e).
In general, if the band/artist is going to insist on stupid meaningless drivel for lyrics, I won't listen to the music at all. Not interested. If they don't care about them, why should I? If the lyrics aren't important, why not just be an instrumental group? I just honestly don't understand the viewpoint of "they aren't important at all."
And the comparison between songs and film is a good one. Not sure why anyone would think otherwise.
Because honestly, 99% of all bands have terrible lyrics in my opinion. There are VERY few bands that I would say have good lyrics, and even then its just... "decent" lyrics. If I felt the same way as you did about lyrics, I wouldn't listen to music, at all.
As I mentioned in the other topic, I love Megadeth to death, and Holy Wars is probably one of my favorite songs ever, but you have to admit Dave Mustaine is a fucking terrible lyricist. BROTHER WILL KILL BROTHER SPILLING BLOOD ACROSS THE LAND KILLING FOR RELIGION SOMETHING I DON'T UNDERSTAND, etc.
If I cared so much about lyrics I would hate that song to death. Hell, I would hate 99.9% of music.
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What's wrong with those lyrics?
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Hmm, well, they're not hugely important to me, but they are somewhat important. In that the right lyrics or even lyrical moments can turn a song from good to great. On the other hand, good lyrics have never redeemed an otherwise bad song for me, and bad lyrics don't always ruin songs for me, and when they do it's only by a little bit.
Basically, they do affect how much I like or dislike a song/album, but only marginally.
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What's wrong with those lyrics?
They sound like they come from an angry teenager who came up with them in five minutes.
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Important if the song is lyric centric though I will agree with everyone that says that bad lyrics drag a song down no matter what.
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As a songwriter myself, I don't like cheesy lyrics. I can deal with it an long as they don't completely suck. A band like Kiss has cheesy lyrics but it works in the context of there music.
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Yes, but there are multiple ways of enjoying both film and music.
So how does it make any sense to go "you don't care about the lyrics in music? Then how do you feel about movies with bad dialogue, just read a book."? Especially since taking it the other way, telling someone to just listen to spoken word poetry if they care so much about lyrics, makes no sense?
I don't care about the lyrics, just like I really don't care about a movie's cinematography. Like you said, there are multiple ways of enjoying both.
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Dave was in his early 20s wasn't he? Also, I'd like someone to rewrite The Count of Tuscany since the lyrics are so 'awful'. Same melodies too.
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And the comparison between songs and film is a good one. Not sure why anyone would think otherwise.
Because they're completely different forms of entertainment that most people enjoy for entirely different reasons, and books and movies are two different forms of story telling with their own advantages and disadvantages. I don't listen to music for its story (unless it's a concept album, in which case I'll actually care about the lyrics as far as how well they tell the story).
Yes, but there are multiple ways of enjoying both film and music. There are multiple elements going on at the same time that can be analyzed individually or as a whole.
With film, there is the cinematography, directing, dialogue, writing, acting, special effects, etc.
With music, there is the songwriting, composition, technical difficulty of the music, technical ability of the musicians, the quality of the performance, the lyrics, the delivery of the lyrics by the vocalist(s), etc.
There are comparisons to be made there, and valid ones, regardless of the difference of the media.
This is all true, but it doesn't disguise the fact that, for the majority of people, the focus of a movie is the story and dialogue, and the focus of music is the... well, music. Obviously some people have other priorities, and all of us have other factors that are important (such as those you mentioned) but the analogy of liking music regardless of lyrics is more akin to liking movies regardless of cinematography. To me cinematography is fairly important, and can make an otherwise good film great, but there are plenty of films I love where it's nothing special.
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Yes, but there are multiple ways of enjoying both film and music.
So how does it make any sense to go "you don't care about the lyrics in music? Then how do you feel about movies with bad dialogue, just read a book."? Especially since taking it the other way, telling someone to just listen to spoken word poetry if they care so much about lyrics, makes no sense?
I think people took what he said as a "who gives a shit about lyrics?" or at least the way it was worded it seemed like that.
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Dave was in his early 20s wasn't he? Also, I'd like someone to rewrite The Count of Tuscany since the lyrics are so 'awful'. Same melodies too.
Doesn't change the fact that Dave can't write a decent lyric to save his life. Also, I LOVE Megadeth, but that's because Dave is a riff-master. Anyone that listens to Megadeth for their lyrics is doing it wrong.
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Yes, but there are multiple ways of enjoying both film and music.
So how does it make any sense to go "you don't care about the lyrics in music? Then how do you feel about movies with bad dialogue, just read a book."? Especially since taking it the other way, telling someone to just listen to spoken word poetry if they care so much about lyrics, makes no sense?
I think people took what he said as a "who gives a shit about lyrics?" or at least the way it was worded it seemed like that.
I figured he was making fun of the movie argument.
Either way, both make about as much sense to me (that is, none).
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Do you enjoy movies with horrible dialouge? Why not just read a book?
Because that's almost as stupid of a comparison as that spoken word poetry argument earlier.
I agree, I was actually making such a crazy claim to point out how crazy the original one was.
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Not important at all, Unless it's rap. I listen to music for the music, lyrics are like the cherry on top.
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Not important at all, Unless it's rap. I listen to music for the music, lyrics are like the cherry on top.
So you must be realy moved when you hear about T & A and bling. ;D
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^Those are the bestest kind of lyrics.
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Not important at all, Unless it's rap. I listen to music for the music, lyrics are like the cherry on top.
So you must be realy moved when you hear about T & A and bling. ;D
:facepalm:
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Why not just read poems if you like lyrics... ::)
This is probably the stupidest post I have ever read on this site.
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That is true though. Music can give poetry life.
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Don't give a rat's ass about the lyrics but care a great deal about the vocal melody.
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^Exactly, also delivery is important. You could have awesome lyrics with a delivery that doesn't suit the song.
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A while ago I didn't care so much about the lyrical content but over the past 3-4 years I've found a lot of great bands with some amazing lyrics and it really took my listening experience to another level.
So the short end of it is, lyrics are really important to me, I don't listen to a lot of bands I used to because of piss pour lyrics. (A lot of new DT)
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A while ago I didn't care so much about the lyrical content but over the past 3-4 years I've found a lot of great bands with some amazing lyrics and it really took my listening experience to another level.
So the short end of it is, lyrics are really important to me, I don't listen to a lot of bands I used to because of piss pour lyrics. (A lot of new DT)
I still listen to music that has shit lyrics (a lot of classic rock bands), but like you said, when you find great music that has equally good lyrics, it just adds a whole new layer to the listening experience. :tup
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They can make a good song great.
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I have a lot of bands I listen to, and honestly, there is a threshold where you can't look up the lyrics to every song in your library. Looking up the lyrics to about 10,000 songs would drive me crazy.
If a good enough percentage of the lyrics isn't reasonably discernible enough for you to get a sense of the quality of a song's lyrics by ear, it's not worth listening to, simple as that. There are exceptions, I suppose, but again, very few. Lyrics are extremely important to me, but I'll usually only look them up once they really start to interest me or impress me.
So, if the singer is so high pitched that its nearly impossible to know what they are saying, its bad? I guess I should feel bad for loving Rush in that case. And I love Rush for their music, not the lyrics. Honestly, Neil Peart's lyrics are very mediocre to me, but I love Rush regardless. And I love Death/Black Metal despite having rather underwhelming lyrical prowess (Atheist is probably the lone exception to this rule, but w/e).
I have 2112, and I have no problem telling what Geddy Lee is saying, at least on that album. And I used to have the two albums before that on tape, and most of it was perfectly comprehensible stuff, even in his singing style.
If I can't understand a decent amount of what the singer is singing, I'm discouraged from going any further.
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I have a lot of bands I listen to, and honestly, there is a threshold where you can't look up the lyrics to every song in your library. Looking up the lyrics to about 10,000 songs would drive me crazy.
If a good enough percentage of the lyrics isn't reasonably discernible enough for you to get a sense of the quality of a song's lyrics by ear, it's not worth listening to, simple as that. There are exceptions, I suppose, but again, very few. Lyrics are extremely important to me, but I'll usually only look them up once they really start to interest me or impress me.
So, if the singer is so high pitched that its nearly impossible to know what they are saying, its bad? I guess I should feel bad for loving Rush in that case. And I love Rush for their music, not the lyrics. Honestly, Neil Peart's lyrics are very mediocre to me, but I love Rush regardless. And I love Death/Black Metal despite having rather underwhelming lyrical prowess (Atheist is probably the lone exception to this rule, but w/e).
I have 2112, and I have no problem telling what Geddy Lee is saying, at least on that album. And I used to have the two albums before that on tape, and most of it was perfectly comprehensible stuff, even in his singing style.
If I can't understand a decent amount of what the singer is singing, I'm discouraged from going any further.
And I can't understand anything he says outside of a few words here and there. Doesn't change the fact that 2112 is an awesome song and I love Geddy's voice, but the lyrics don't mean that much to me. I honestly think Neil is overrated as a lyricist, personally. I love his drumming and have a lot of respect for him, but reading his lyrics, they only come off as "decent" at best.
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Soulja Boy. :facepalm:
If ever there was a reason lyrics should be important, he is why.
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*doesn't read thread*
Lyrics can block my like for a song if they're against what I believe. It's because I usually would like to connect to a song I am giving my time to listen to. I don't want to connect to stuff that is against my faith.
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Lyrics aren't nearly as important as the music. You can have shitty lyrics/good music and it's still listenable.
Good lyrics/shitty music? Uuuh.........NO!
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Lyrics aren't nearly as important as the music. You can have shitty lyrics/good music and it's still listenable.
Good lyrics/shitty music? Uuuh.........NO!
Good lyrics and good music > bad lyrics and good music.
Therefore, lyrics are, on the surface, important. How important they are as compared to the music is an entirely different conversation.
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Not really. because the vocals are an instrument. Chronic Future, don't know if you know them, have great lyrics but some of their music i don't like, it's just not my style. Power Metal is my favorite genre now, and their lyrics are sometimes cheesy but Damn the music rocks. To me it's how they are delivered.
fluffy's view is how most people listen to music, that i know and chatted with. which seems like you don't grasp the music as much.
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Interesting discussion. Something I’ve waffled over myself. I generally say lyrics are not that important, in the sense that I don’t select my music based on the lyrics, and I don’t not listen to music based on the lyrics. But over time I have come to realize I will respond to different lyrics differently, whereas the music used to solely guide my musical tastes.
I think the biggest thing for me is that when I listen to something new, I process the lyrics last. The first couple of listens I am focused more on the music, structure, and melodies. If those don’t hold my interest, I move on. If they do, lyrics I enjoy will either enhance my enjoyment of the music, lyrics I don’t will bring the song down a notch, but never to the point that I’ll stop listening to the music.
But I am also more concerned with how lyrics work within the context of a song more than how they are read. People have brought up TCoT, and yes if I read those lyrics I would think a 5th grader wrote them for a class assignment. But within the context of the song, which is the only way I judge them, they work fine for me.
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Lyrics aren't nearly as important as the music. You can have shitty lyrics/good music and it's still listenable.
Good lyrics/shitty music? Uuuh.........NO!
Good lyrics and good music > bad lyrics and good music.
Obviously, but not my point.
Therefore, lyrics are, on the surface, important. How important they are as compared to the music is an entirely different conversation.
There are only 2 forms of communication in a song. Lyrics and music. The thread title says "How important are lyrics to you?"
Well, to me, music speaks louder than lyrics. Therefore, lyrics aren't as important as the music (which isn't to say they aren't important).
What else would you compare it to? Music makes or breaks a song. Lyrics? Not necessarily.
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*doesn't read thread*
Lyrics can block my like for a song if they're against what I believe. It's because I usually would like to connect to a song I am giving my time to listen to. I don't want to connect to stuff that is against my faith.
I can listen to Dream Theater songs that are obviously Pro-Christian. The kicker? I'm not a Christian! Quite a few Black Sabbath songs are obviously Pro-Christian (After Forever, anyone?) and I still enjoy them, despite not believing in the same faith. I personally think that not listening to something because the lyrics don't agree with your faith is silly. Just because you listen to it isn't going to convert you against what you believe, just as me listening to Voices, Lines in the Sand, Trial of Tears or the other numerous pro-christian songs Dream Theater has doesn't suddenly convert me either.
But whatever, I don't pay much attention to lyrics, what do I know? ::)
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I can listen to Dream Theater songs that are obviously Pro-Christian. The kicker? I'm not a Christian! Quite a few Black Sabbath songs are obviously Pro-Christian (After Forever, anyone?) and I still enjoy them, despite not believing in the same faith. I personally think that not listening to something because the lyrics don't agree with your faith is silly. Just because you listen to it isn't going to convert you against what you believe, just as me listening to Voices, Lines in the Sand, Trial of Tears or the other numerous pro-christian songs Dream Theater has doesn't suddenly convert me either.
I mean, good for you, but it's something I take seriously; it's not "silly", as you said.
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I can listen to Dream Theater songs that are obviously Pro-Christian. The kicker? I'm not a Christian! Quite a few Black Sabbath songs are obviously Pro-Christian (After Forever, anyone?) and I still enjoy them, despite not believing in the same faith. I personally think that not listening to something because the lyrics don't agree with your faith is silly. Just because you listen to it isn't going to convert you against what you believe, just as me listening to Voices, Lines in the Sand, Trial of Tears or the other numerous pro-christian songs Dream Theater has doesn't suddenly convert me either.
I mean, good for you, but it's something I take seriously; it's not "silly", as you said.
Well, its probably because I don't look into lyrics that much with a few exceptions. There are a few bands that have good lyrics, but honestly, less than 1% of all bands out there have lyrics I would call "good" and limiting myself to just bands that fit that criteria would seriously limit what I listen to so I think its silly to think that way. Not to mention if I only listened to things that fit what I believed, my library would be much smaller than what it is, and I seriously doubt I'd be listening to Dream Theater if I thought that way.
I'm just saying, you limit what music you can listen to by doing that, and there is so much good music in the world to listen to. It just seems silly to me. You could spend your whole life looking for more music and never listen to all the good bands in the world.
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fluffy's view is how most people listen to music, that i know and chatted with. which seems like you don't grasp the music as much.
Okay then.
I just see no point in wasting my time listening to music that is either incomprehensible or glaringly shitty in one (to me) very important aspect. Vocals and lyrics I don't enjoy, or can't at least tolerate, are just not negotiable.
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Therefore, lyrics are, on the surface, important. How important they are as compared to the music is an entirely different conversation.
There are only 2 forms of communication in a song. Lyrics and music. The thread title says "How important are lyrics to you?"
Well, to me, music speaks louder than lyrics. Therefore, lyrics aren't as important as the music (which isn't to say they aren't important).
What else would you compare it to? Music makes or breaks a song. Lyrics? Not necessarily.
Lyrics and music are not necessarily two separate entities. Sometimes, the two blend together seamlessly to make a terrific song, and when that happens, it reminds me of how important lyrics are. :tup :tup
But whatever, I don't pay much attention to lyrics, what do I know? ::)
Okay, no one said that, so save that playing the victim stuff for another time, okay? :biggrin:
As for listening to lyrics that don't jive with your own belief system, I have no problem with that at all. Shoot, I am a believer, and Rush is my favorite band, so do the math. ;) Songs like "Freewill" or "BU2B" don't bother me in the least, despite the fact that Neil Peart's stance as a non-believer comes across loud and clear.
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Therefore, lyrics are, on the surface, important. How important they are as compared to the music is an entirely different conversation.
There are only 2 forms of communication in a song. Lyrics and music. The thread title says "How important are lyrics to you?"
Well, to me, music speaks louder than lyrics. Therefore, lyrics aren't as important as the music (which isn't to say they aren't important).
What else would you compare it to? Music makes or breaks a song. Lyrics? Not necessarily.
Lyrics and music are not necessarily two separate entities. Sometimes, the two blend together seamlessly to make a terrific song, and when that happens, it reminds me of how important lyrics are. :tup :tup
But whatever, I don't pay much attention to lyrics, what do I know? ::)
Okay, no one said that, so save that playing the victim stuff for another time, okay? :biggrin:
As for listening to lyrics that don't jive with your own belief system, I have no problem with that at all. Shoot, I am a believer, and Rush is my favorite band, so do the math. ;) Songs like "Freewill" or "BU2B" don't bother me in the least, despite the fact that Neil Peart's stance as a non-believer comes across loud and clear.
I seemed to be getting a bit of heat from my stance that I don't consider lyrics nearly as important as the music, so that's why I said that.
I'll repeat myself, I have no issues with someone being whatever religion/spirituality they want, I just think its silly that you limit yourself to bands that only repeat the same things you believe. I just think that limits the potential amount of music you can enjoy, and as I said before, there is just SO much good music to be had out there. You can make it your life's goal to listen to everything, and I do mean EVERYTHING that is good, and you still won't be able to do it.
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If there's as much good music out there as you say, then people can limit themselves by whatever criteria they deem desirable and they'll still have tons of music to listen to.
And I agree that there's that much good music out there. All the more reason not to bother with stuff that's flawed.
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I can listen to Dream Theater songs that are obviously Pro-Christian. The kicker? I'm not a Christian! Quite a few Black Sabbath songs are obviously Pro-Christian (After Forever, anyone?) and I still enjoy them, despite not believing in the same faith. I personally think that not listening to something because the lyrics don't agree with your faith is silly. Just because you listen to it isn't going to convert you against what you believe, just as me listening to Voices, Lines in the Sand, Trial of Tears or the other numerous pro-christian songs Dream Theater has doesn't suddenly convert me either.
I mean, good for you, but it's something I take seriously; it's not "silly", as you said.
Well, its probably because I don't look into lyrics that much with a few exceptions. There are a few bands that have good lyrics, but honestly, less than 1% of all bands out there have lyrics I would call "good" and limiting myself to just bands that fit that criteria would seriously limit what I listen to so I think its silly to think that way. Not to mention if I only listened to things that fit what I believed, my library would be much smaller than what it is, and I seriously doubt I'd be listening to Dream Theater if I thought that way.
I'm just saying, you limit what music you can listen to by doing that, and there is so much good music in the world to listen to. It just seems silly to me. You could spend your whole life looking for more music and never listen to all the good bands in the world.
There's a difference between lyrics going against your faith and lyrics fitting in with your beliefs.
As for me, I think I'm the same as a few people here. Bad lyrics won't detract from my enjoyment of a song, but great lyrics can make a good song even better. The only variable is if the lyrics are blatantly anti-God or Christianity. But, I'm not wanting to take this thread down that road.
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I can listen to Dream Theater songs that are obviously Pro-Christian. The kicker? I'm not a Christian! Quite a few Black Sabbath songs are obviously Pro-Christian (After Forever, anyone?) and I still enjoy them, despite not believing in the same faith. I personally think that not listening to something because the lyrics don't agree with your faith is silly. Just because you listen to it isn't going to convert you against what you believe, just as me listening to Voices, Lines in the Sand, Trial of Tears or the other numerous pro-christian songs Dream Theater has doesn't suddenly convert me either.
I mean, good for you, but it's something I take seriously; it's not "silly", as you said.
Well, its probably because I don't look into lyrics that much with a few exceptions. There are a few bands that have good lyrics, but honestly, less than 1% of all bands out there have lyrics I would call "good" and limiting myself to just bands that fit that criteria would seriously limit what I listen to so I think its silly to think that way. Not to mention if I only listened to things that fit what I believed, my library would be much smaller than what it is, and I seriously doubt I'd be listening to Dream Theater if I thought that way.
I'm just saying, you limit what music you can listen to by doing that, and there is so much good music in the world to listen to. It just seems silly to me. You could spend your whole life looking for more music and never listen to all the good bands in the world.
There's a difference between lyrics going against your faith and lyrics fitting in with your beliefs.
He said himself that he would only listen to songs that fit in with his beliefs.
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I can listen to Dream Theater songs that are obviously Pro-Christian. The kicker? I'm not a Christian! Quite a few Black Sabbath songs are obviously Pro-Christian (After Forever, anyone?) and I still enjoy them, despite not believing in the same faith. I personally think that not listening to something because the lyrics don't agree with your faith is silly. Just because you listen to it isn't going to convert you against what you believe, just as me listening to Voices, Lines in the Sand, Trial of Tears or the other numerous pro-christian songs Dream Theater has doesn't suddenly convert me either.
I mean, good for you, but it's something I take seriously; it's not "silly", as you said.
Well, its probably because I don't look into lyrics that much with a few exceptions. There are a few bands that have good lyrics, but honestly, less than 1% of all bands out there have lyrics I would call "good" and limiting myself to just bands that fit that criteria would seriously limit what I listen to so I think its silly to think that way. Not to mention if I only listened to things that fit what I believed, my library would be much smaller than what it is, and I seriously doubt I'd be listening to Dream Theater if I thought that way.
I'm just saying, you limit what music you can listen to by doing that, and there is so much good music in the world to listen to. It just seems silly to me. You could spend your whole life looking for more music and never listen to all the good bands in the world.
There's a difference between lyrics going against your faith and lyrics fitting in with your beliefs.
He said himself that he would only listen to songs that fit in with his beliefs.
*doesn't read thread*
Lyrics can block my like for a song if they're against what I believe. It's because I usually would like to connect to a song I am giving my time to listen to. I don't want to connect to stuff that is against my faith.
I don't think he did?
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I can listen to Dream Theater songs that are obviously Pro-Christian. The kicker? I'm not a Christian! Quite a few Black Sabbath songs are obviously Pro-Christian (After Forever, anyone?) and I still enjoy them, despite not believing in the same faith. I personally think that not listening to something because the lyrics don't agree with your faith is silly. Just because you listen to it isn't going to convert you against what you believe, just as me listening to Voices, Lines in the Sand, Trial of Tears or the other numerous pro-christian songs Dream Theater has doesn't suddenly convert me either.
I mean, good for you, but it's something I take seriously; it's not "silly", as you said.
Well, its probably because I don't look into lyrics that much with a few exceptions. There are a few bands that have good lyrics, but honestly, less than 1% of all bands out there have lyrics I would call "good" and limiting myself to just bands that fit that criteria would seriously limit what I listen to so I think its silly to think that way. Not to mention if I only listened to things that fit what I believed, my library would be much smaller than what it is, and I seriously doubt I'd be listening to Dream Theater if I thought that way.
I'm just saying, you limit what music you can listen to by doing that, and there is so much good music in the world to listen to. It just seems silly to me. You could spend your whole life looking for more music and never listen to all the good bands in the world.
There's a difference between lyrics going against your faith and lyrics fitting in with your beliefs.
He said himself that he would only listen to songs that fit in with his beliefs.
*doesn't read thread*
Lyrics can block my like for a song if they're against what I believe. It's because I usually would like to connect to a song I am giving my time to listen to. I don't want to connect to stuff that is against my faith.
I don't think he did?
Well, if you refuse to listen to something outside your faith, then you're left with stuff that is in your faith.
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Nah, I'm fairly sure there is a huge middle ground.
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James means he won't listen to songs that challenge his faith. However, most songs don't. Since like 98% of all songs are about relationships with women gone bad, I'd say he's pretty much in the clear.
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I was thinking in more black and white terms, forgive me >_>
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I was thinking in more black and white terms, forgive me >_>
Racist.
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I can listen to Dream Theater songs that are obviously Pro-Christian. The kicker? I'm not a Christian! Quite a few Black Sabbath songs are obviously Pro-Christian (After Forever, anyone?) and I still enjoy them, despite not believing in the same faith. I personally think that not listening to something because the lyrics don't agree with your faith is silly. Just because you listen to it isn't going to convert you against what you believe, just as me listening to Voices, Lines in the Sand, Trial of Tears or the other numerous pro-christian songs Dream Theater has doesn't suddenly convert me either.
I mean, good for you, but it's something I take seriously; it's not "silly", as you said.
Well, its probably because I don't look into lyrics that much with a few exceptions. There are a few bands that have good lyrics, but honestly, less than 1% of all bands out there have lyrics I would call "good" and limiting myself to just bands that fit that criteria would seriously limit what I listen to so I think its silly to think that way. Not to mention if I only listened to things that fit what I believed, my library would be much smaller than what it is, and I seriously doubt I'd be listening to Dream Theater if I thought that way.
I'm just saying, you limit what music you can listen to by doing that, and there is so much good music in the world to listen to. It just seems silly to me. You could spend your whole life looking for more music and never listen to all the good bands in the world.
I don't care if it limits me or not. You have to get over the fact that someone views music differently than you do. And for the record, I have plenty of good music to listen to, Christian and secular.
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Hey James, I got a great cd called "Why christianity is the wrong religion" by a band called "The Real God".
Want me to burn copy it for you?
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Or maybe I care about the music much more so than the lyrics?
So, really, vocalists in the bands you like might as well just sing wordless vocals, right? I mean, if you don't care about the lyrics at all, it
wouldn't matter to you if they weren't singing any actual ones, right?
Also being the case, do you have any music you listen to that you like from other countries, meaning they sing in their native tongue and not English or any language you speak/understand? There's LOADS of great music out there (more than I'll ever know) from parts of the world where they don't sing in English... I think that'd be perfect for people who don't care so much about lyrics.
-Marc.
I recommend listening to Shakira's second album, Pies Descalzos. The music and the lyrics are just phenomenal. Now she's singing about how her hips tell the truth and about gypsies. Lame.
Edit: And also, Atom Heart Mother, bad music and terrible lyrics by a great band. Notice something?
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Hey James, I got a great cd called "Why christianity is the wrong religion" by a band called "The Real God".
Want me to burn copy it for you?
:lol Dude, you've been on terrific form recently.
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Hey James, I got a great cd called "Why christianity is the wrong religion" by a band called "The Real God".
Want me to burn copy it for you?
Sure, what are they like? Their name and CD name are really vague.
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Hey James, I got a great cd called "Why christianity is the wrong religion" by a band called "The Real God".
Want me to burn copy it for you?
I wasn't attacking him for being religious, if that's what you're implying.
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Hey James, I got a great cd called "Why christianity is the wrong religion" by a band called "The Real God".
Want me to burn copy it for you?
I wasn't attacking him for being religious, if that's what you're implying.
I wasn't implying anything, I was recomending a CD to my friend and brother in christ, James.
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Hey James, I got a great cd called "Why christianity is the wrong religion" by a band called "The Real God".
Want me to burn copy it for you?
I wasn't attacking him for being religious, if that's what you're implying.
I wasn't implying anything, I was recomending a CD to my friend and brother in christ, James.
Very well then. Figured I might as well make sure that's not what I'm doing. Its just difference of opinions I suppose.
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Either as important or more important than the music. It's why I can't get into instrumental bands.
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Either as important or more important than the music. It's why I can't get into instrumental bands.
It depends on if the songs calls for it, other than another instrument could be the vocals. Cloudkicker's songs call for vocals, some low powerful vocals, yet they're instrumental and everytime I hear them I make up my own vocals.
It amazes me how much people claim to like music, yet Lyrics are more important than the music.
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Hey James, I got a great cd called "Why christianity is the wrong religion" by a band called "The Real God".
Want me to burn copy it for you?
I wasn't attacking him for being religious, if that's what you're implying.
I wasn't implying anything, I was recomending a CD to my friend and brother in christ, James.
:tup :metal