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Dream Theater => Dream Theater => Topic started by: perfey on June 05, 2010, 08:35:28 AM
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It's been a while since we did this, what is your favourite?
Mine is currently shifting between ACOS, 6D and TCOT. But TCOT is still just as fresh and epic since I heard it last year, it's epic from the get go and it's transition between the different parts flows so well, even if it's 19 minutes it feels a lot shorter.
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If In The Name of God counts as an epic, then so should A Nightmare to Remember. Just saying.
Regardless, I choose Octavarium.
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Since when was A Mind Beside Itself an epic?
Anyways, I voted Octivarium.
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Since when was A Mind Beside Itself an epic?
I think it is one of the most epics things they have ever done, whether it is a suite or a single song.
The song choices here a bit odd, though, for sure. Several very important DT epics were left off.
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OCTAVARIUM
With Six Degrees as a Really close second.
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Any other day, I would say Octavarium.
However, I just listened to the two Six Degrees CDs yesterday, and am now a JUNKIE for that stuff. What an incredible album... So currently, Six Degrees.
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If AMBI is there, the 12-Step Suite should, as well.
Anyway, I seriously can't choose. DT is too damn good.
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Octavarium
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I picked Octavarium, but I think LtL is an epic.
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If AMBI is there, the 12-Step Suite should, as well.
I don't really think the 12-Step suite is that epic. It's just really :metal. I don't think AMBI should count as a whole but Voices is definitely epic.
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Missing The Killing Hand too
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A Change of Seasons
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A Change of Seasons
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Octavarium owns all. Followed by The Count.
AMBI shouldn't be there. 12 step shouldn't be added. Didn't we have this conversation many times? :\
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Octavarium owns all
except for A Change of Seasons
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Didn't we have this conversation many times? :\
Octavarium's a concept album.
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Not again... :facepalm:
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Six Degrees
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Easily A Change of Seasons.
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Easily A Change of Seasons.
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If you added TOT and AMBI, whers learning to live? Or the killin hand?
Anyways i don't really think TOT a an epic, so Octavarium is my choice(still, trial of tears is my favorite song ever.)
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Octavarium is by far my favourite DT song/epic :-)
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If you added TOT and AMBI, whers learning to live? Or the killin hand?
Anyways i don't really think TOT a an epic, so Octavarium is my choice(still, trial of tears is my favorite song ever.)
well TO :wahhh: is divided into parts on the album so ....
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So is The Killing Hand.
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one of the reasons i argued that it should be on the list
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Octavarium
The Count of tuscany
In The Presence of Enemies
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
A Change of Seasons
Do the others really count as epics? :S
In mu opinion they don't, but that's just me, the yare just, "a little longer DT tracks"
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Pretty much, though I'm with Kev on AMBI because as a suite it works great and if we're counting SDOIT, the other suite, why not count that.
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Lines In The Sand
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These are the only epics that DT has done:
A Change of Seasons
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Octavarium
In The Presence of Enemies
The Count of Tuscany
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These are the only epics that DT has done:
A Change of Seasons
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Octavarium
In The Presence of Enemies
The Count of Tuscany
Yes! exaclty!
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These are the only epics that DT has done:
A Change of Seasons
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Octavarium
In The Presence of Enemies
The Count of Tuscany
I am in full support of this.
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These are the only epics that DT has done:
A Change of Seasons
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Octavarium
In The Presence of Enemies
The Count of Tuscany
I am in full support of this.
Really? I've always considered In the Name of God an epic.
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These are the only epics that DT has done:
A Change of Seasons
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Octavarium
In The Presence of Enemies
The Count of Tuscany
I am in full support of this.
Really? I've always considered In the Name of God an epic.
In DT's case, what qualifies as an epic should either exceed or be almost 20 minutes long. In The Name of God is only a few minutes longer than the rest of the songs on Train of Thought, at 14 minutes. And besides like I said before, if that's an epic than so is A Nightmare to Remember.
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OCTAVARIUM
With Six Degrees as a Really close second.
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The Count Of Tuscany
*puts up shield*
I never really saw all the appeal of "Octavarium"
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The Count Of Tuscany
*puts up shield*
I never really saw all the appeal of "Octavarium"
The one negative thing I can say about Octavarium is this: too much Rudess, not enough Petrucci.
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BTW, Octavarium is my favorite epic
But Trial of Tears is my favorite DT song evar
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not enough Petrucci.
I say that about everything.
This steak could use some more Petrucci.
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not enough Petrucci.
I say that about everything.
This steak could use some more Petrucci.
That....
Could easily be taken the wrong way.
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not enough Petrucci.
I say that about everything.
This steak could use some more Petrucci.
That....
Could easily be taken the wrong way.
:rollin
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not enough Petrucci.
I say that about everything.
This steak could use some more Petrucci.
That....
Could easily be taken the wrong way.
No... No it could not.
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not enough Petrucci.
I say that about everything.
This steak could use some more Petrucci.
That....
Could easily be taken the wrong way.
No... No it could not.
:lolpalm:
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These are the only epics that DT has done:
A Change of Seasons
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Octavarium
In The Presence of Enemies
The Count of Tuscany
.
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(https://img692.imageshack.us/img692/3381/70663337.jpg)
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love them all, but SDOIT is my ultimate fav
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(https://img692.imageshack.us/img692/3381/70663337.jpg)
I like how you missed the fact that, at the time of that screen cap, SDOIT had SIX votes...
-Marc.
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(https://img692.imageshack.us/img692/3381/70663337.jpg)
I like how you missed the fact that, at the time of that screen cap, SDOIT had SIX votes...
-Marc.
True. True. lol. I always miss the obvious things. :facepalm:
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On top of that, you forgot Teh River.
Personally, I don't count TCOT as an epic, but since it's included in the poll, it's my choice, since it's my third favourite DT song.
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These are the only epics that DT has done:
A Change of Seasons
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Octavarium
In The Presence of Enemies
The Count of Tuscany
This.
Oh, and A Change of Seasons.
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I almost voted Mind By Itself, but then, had to go with ACOS. :P
Octavarium is OK, but I'd rank it lower than SDoIT and MBI.
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These are the only epics that DT has done:
A Change of Seasons
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Octavarium
In The Presence of Enemies
The Count of Tuscany
I cannot disagree with that more. Are you gonna tell me that "Metropolis" isn't epic? Or "Trial of Tears?" Or "Learning to Live?" Really?
I will put in this way: since four of those songs you listed are from 2002 or later, in 2001, if someone had said, "Dream Theater has only done one epic to date," they would have been laughed out of the room (or off the internet, in this instance :p).
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I will put in this way: since four of those songs you listed are from 2002 or later, in 2001, if someone had said, "Dream Theater has only done one epic to date," they would have been laughed out of the room (or off the internet, in this instance :p).
Never thought about that. Crap.
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
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if you count all of metropolis, then i would call it an epic definitely.
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Are we talking "Metropolis, Pt. 1: The Miracle and the Sleeper" or Metropolis Pt. 2: Scenes From A Memory?
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
:lol
I can't think of a more overused word on this forum. By that definition then I'm pretty sure TCOT wouldn't count. Most people seem to call it epic though that's more in relation to how ridiculously grand the story is trying to be, at least the way I see it. It doesn't really seem to fit the mold of an epic.
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idk. do you or do you not consider all of metropolis a single thing?
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idk. do you or do you not consider all of metropolis a single thing?
They're related, but definitely not the same thing
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Sadly, this thread was bound to end up in the type of discussion we´re having now.
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idk. do you or do you not consider all of metropolis a single thing?
They're related, but definitely not the same thing
I agree, but i also think that they form something collectively.
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I love these discussions! :D :D
and no, Metropolis pt1, LTL are NOT epic, not even then lenght or the quality of the music
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I love these discussions! :D :D
and no, Metropolis pt1, LTL are NOT epic, not even then lenght or the quality of the music
ok fine.
great songs though
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and no, Metropolis pt1, LTL are NOT epic, not even then lenght or the quality of the music
LTL with no quality WTF
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and no, Metropolis pt1, LTL are NOT epic, not even then lenght or the quality of the music
And i never said Pt.1 either. I meant the whole thing (If its possible to combine part one with SFAM.)
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and no, Metropolis pt1, LTL are NOT epic, not even then lenght or the quality of the music
And i never said Pt.1 either. I meant the whole thing (If its possible to combine part one with SFAM.)
Why would anyone think it is all one thing?
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I personally don't think of it as one thing, but i thought it was a concept somewhat worth entertaining.
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
This, my friends, is semantics at its finest. ;)
Seriously, "Metropolis" is not an epic? That's a new one.
Also, and this is directed towards everyone, length does not dictate whether something is an epic or not. I can name you songs under 5 minutes that are epic, and I can name you really long songs that are not epics.
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I love these discussions! :D :D
and no, Metropolis pt1, LTL are NOT epic, not even then lenght or the quality of the music
lolwut
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I love these discussions! :D :D
and no, Metropolis pt1, LTL are NOT epic, not even then lenght or the quality of the music
lolwut
:lol
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
This, my friends, is semantics at its finest. ;)
Seriously, "Metropolis" is not an epic? That's a new one.
Also, and this is directed towards everyone, length does not dictate whether something is an epic or not. I can name you songs under 5 minutes that are epic, and I can name you really long songs that are not epics.
"Metropolis" is NOT an epic and never will be, just a normal 10 min DT song like Honor thy father, Blind Faith, Sacrificed sons, Home and so on, except that it's not as good as any of'em
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
This, my friends, is semantics at its finest. ;)
Seriously, "Metropolis" is not an epic? That's a new one.
Also, and this is directed towards everyone, length does not dictate whether something is an epic or not. I can name you songs under 5 minutes that are epic, and I can name you really long songs that are not epics.
"Metropolis" is NOT an epic and never will be, just a normal 10 min DT song like Honor thy father, Blind Faith, Sacrificed sons, Home and so on, except that it's not as good as any of'em
Fair enough.
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
This, my friends, is semantics at its finest. ;)
Seriously, "Metropolis" is not an epic? That's a new one.
Also, and this is directed towards everyone, length does not dictate whether something is an epic or not. I can name you songs under 5 minutes that are epic, and I can name you really long songs that are not epics.
"Metropolis" is NOT an epic and never will be, just a normal 10 min DT song like Honor thy father, Blind Faith, Sacrificed sons, Home and so on, except that it's not as good as any of'em
lol
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
This, my friends, is semantics at its finest. ;)
Seriously, "Metropolis" is not an epic? That's a new one.
Also, and this is directed towards everyone, length does not dictate whether something is an epic or not. I can name you songs under 5 minutes that are epic, and I can name you really long songs that are not epics.
"Metropolis" is NOT an epic and never will be, just a normal 10 min DT song like Honor thy father, Blind Faith, Sacrificed sons, Home and so on, except that it's not as good as any of'em
Fair enough.
Maybe i need to simplify what i was getting at.
Metropolis Pt1 + Metropolis Pt2 = Epic?
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
This, my friends, is semantics at its finest. ;)
Seriously, "Metropolis" is not an epic? That's a new one.
Also, and this is directed towards everyone, length does not dictate whether something is an epic or not. I can name you songs under 5 minutes that are epic, and I can name you really long songs that are not epics.
"Metropolis" is NOT an epic and never will be, just a normal 10 min DT song like Honor thy father, Blind Faith, Sacrificed sons, Home and so on, except that it's not as good as any of'em
lol
Everyone has his own conception of what an epic is. I don't see what's wrong with his statement.
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I think he was loling at the statement that Metropolis was't as good as the other songs he listed.
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Bingo!
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Oops, my bad :P
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
This, my friends, is semantics at its finest. ;)
Seriously, "Metropolis" is not an epic? That's a new one.
Also, and this is directed towards everyone, length does not dictate whether something is an epic or not. I can name you songs under 5 minutes that are epic, and I can name you really long songs that are not epics.
"Metropolis" is NOT an epic and never will be, just a normal 10 min DT song like Honor thy father, Blind Faith, Sacrificed sons, Home and so on, except that it's not as good as any of'em
This post is wrong. DT disagrees with you. Gonna go make dinner now. kbye
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As far as what is or is not an epic, I totally understand the argument that songs like Metropolis or Learning To Live are epics. But to me, being a fan from 1992 (and yes, I know that Kev is as well), those were always among my favorite songs, but there was something different about A Change of Seasons - it was set apart, it was unique. It was an epic. And it was all alone, for years and years.
Then came Six Degrees, which was 40+ minutes long. I thought it definitely occupied the same territory as ACOS, so now there were two epics.
Then eventually came Octavarium. By anyone's definition, this is certainly an epic.
Of course, then came In The Presence of Enemies, which I guess belongs as well, though it isn't in the same league as the the other 3.
And I also understand why some people accept The Count of Tuscany as an epic. I'm still of two minds about that one.
But I will say that look back fondly on the time when ACOS stood alone, and there wasn't a new epic on every album. Now people expect them, and will probably be disappointed if there isn't a new one on the next album.
But anyway, opinions vary.
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Some good discussion going on in this thread, I like it :). Its hard to do polls like this, to choose what songs should or should not qualify. If I redid the poll it would look like this:
A Change of Seasons
Octavarium
In The Presence of Enemies
The Count of Tuscany
These songs feels for me like they are the four big epics. On the other hand songs like LTL, Metropolis pt. 1, AMBI, Scarred, ITNOG, 6D, OAMOT, TKH, TOWHTSTS, TOT, LITS (and probably some more song or songs I forgot) also feels like epics, its hard to make these polls :lol.
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I'd like to see the 'for' argument for Count of Tuscany being an epic. Yeah it's a long song but to me it just doesn't feel like what I'd call an epic.
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I'd like to see the 'for' argument for Count of Tuscany being an epic. Yeah it's a long song but to me it just doesn't feel like what I'd call an epic.
Same with ITPOE
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I'd like to see the 'for' argument for Count of Tuscany being an epic. Yeah it's a long song but to me it just doesn't feel like what I'd call an epic.
Musically, it fits, to me. The only thing holding it back are the lyrics. They aren't about anything, well, epic (regardless of the quality of them); they are about a situation where JP was scared, but didn't really need to be. Not weighty enough to be epic.
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The only part that seems to fit musically is the intro, which is fantastic. The rest just doesn't seem to be on the same level for some reason.
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The only part that seems to fit musically is the intro, which is fantastic. The rest just doesn't seem to be on the same level for some reason.
*shrugs* I don't know, it works for me.
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I'd call TCOT grand, but not AN epic.
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
This, my friends, is semantics at its finest. ;)
Seriously, "Metropolis" is not an epic? That's a new one.
Also, and this is directed towards everyone, length does not dictate whether something is an epic or not. I can name you songs under 5 minutes that are epic, and I can name you really long songs that are not epics.
"Metropolis" is NOT an epic and never will be, just a normal 10 min DT song like Honor thy father, Blind Faith, Sacrificed sons, Home and so on, except that it's not as good as any of'em
IP: Logged
Address: Found
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
This, my friends, is semantics at its finest. ;)
Seriously, "Metropolis" is not an epic? That's a new one.
Also, and this is directed towards everyone, length does not dictate whether something is an epic or not. I can name you songs under 5 minutes that are epic, and I can name you really long songs that are not epics.
"Metropolis" is NOT an epic and never will be, just a normal 10 min DT song like Honor thy father, Blind Faith, Sacrificed sons, Home and so on, except that it's not as good as any of'em
IP: Logged
Address: Found
:D
But seriously Honor thy father(the worst song on TOT) and sacrificed sons, better than metropolis? really
I guess being against the favorites andold stuff is still "edgy and kewl"
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Blind Faith and Home are great, but metropolis is where it all started.
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Blind Faith and Home are great, but metropolis is where it all started.
Exactly that's why i didn't mention those 2 songs ;)
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that wasn't directed negatively at you, but i'm glad we share opinions.
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that wasn't directed negatively at you, but i'm glad we share opinions.
It wasn't a direct response also i just wanted to poited it out :P
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My favorite epics are not on the list: "Only a Matter of Time" and "Voices"
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My favorite epics are not on the list: "Only a Matter of Time" and "Voices"
I've never heard those referred to as "epics."
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KEVIN MOORE
"lolwut" needs to be the automatic reply to every post you make from this point forward.
Neither of these kinds of posts do anything to further the discussion in the thread.
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I'd call TCOT grand, but not AN epic.
This is what I was looking for.
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I agree that those songs are epic. But that doesnt make them epics. Now were talking noun vs adjective. Just because a song is epic (descriptive) doesnt make it AN epic (noun). I would not say those songs are epics (nouns)
This, my friends, is semantics at its finest. ;)
Seriously, "Metropolis" is not an epic? That's a new one.
Also, and this is directed towards everyone, length does not dictate whether something is an epic or not. I can name you songs under 5 minutes that are epic, and I can name you really long songs that are not epics.
"Metropolis" is NOT an epic and never will be, just a normal 10 min DT song like Honor thy father, Blind Faith, Sacrificed sons, Home and so on, except that it's not as good as any of'em
IP: Logged
Address: Found
:D
But seriously Honor thy father(the worst song on TOT) and sacrificed sons, better than metropolis? really
I guess being against the favorites andold stuff is still "edgy and kewl"
Oh come on! It's just my opinion! :S the only thing I think is pretty cool about metropolis is the instrumental section :S Honor thy father is in my opinion soooo much better, ToTs most powerfull song.
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lolwut
I mean HtF is awesome but is nothing close to Metropolis IMO :P
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Well, for me it is :)
And I think Metropolis is a DT classic, but not an epic
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Six Degrees with Octavarium a very close second.
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I don't understand how 8VM wins here, but loses to ACOS in the final of favourite DT song a few months back
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The Count Of Tuscany
*puts up shield*
I never really saw all the appeal of "Octavarium"
*13-year old girlie scream of sheer delight*
Yet again we see things quite similarly. I don't have any problem with 8VM except that I think it gets far more praise than it deserves. A fair amount of DT fans from the non-metal and prog factions were painfully disappointed in Train of Thought and probably were beyond delighted to hear what they considered a return to form even though the song(only in my own opinion so please don't get all flamey on me) is a half-hour hit and miss rollercoaster of riffs that lack flow and at times seems very forced as if they either overthought it to the point of killing the original spark that made them pursue it as the epic of the album or they rushed it a bit and threw caution to the wind when it came to arranging it.
Also I'm baffled by anyone not considering Metropolis Pt. 1: The Miracle and the Sleeper an epic.
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The Count Of Tuscany
*puts up shield*
I never really saw all the appeal of "Octavarium"
*13-year old girlie scream of sheer delight*
Yet again we see things quite similarly. I don't have any problem with 8VM except that I think it gets far more praise than it deserves. A fair amount of DT fans from the non-metal and prog factions were painfully disappointed in Train of Thought and probably were beyond delighted to hear what they considered a return to form even though the song(only in my own opinion so please don't get all flamey on me) is a half-hour hit and miss rollercoaster of riffs that lack flow and at times seems very forced as if they either overthought it to the point of killing the original spark that made them pursue it as the epic of the album or they rushed it a bit and threw caution to the wind when it came to arranging it.
I agree. The only part that I love is the "TRAPPED INSIDE THIS. OCTA-VAR-IUM." part, and the parts preceding it and following it. The rest is okay. If I ranked Octavarium, it'd probably be somewhere in the middle.
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YOU! are somewhere in the middle
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Um ...
Birch, I belive you just got owned.
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:|
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Not really.
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Um ...
Birch, I belive you just got owned.
Sarcasm
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YEs I did own him! ;D :biggrin:
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:facepalm:
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YEs I did own him! ;D :biggrin:
What are you?
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Heeheee! :D :laugh:
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You sure you're 16?
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Heeheee! :D :laugh:
LOL! ^ __ ^ :heart :heart
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Once again, 8VM.
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Once again, 8VM.
The story ends where it began.
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By that definition then I'm pretty sure TCOT wouldn't count.
Pun intended?
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By that definition then I'm pretty sure TCOT wouldn't count.
Pun intended?
:lol
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Octavarium is very good, but I don't know wich one is best of ITPOE, 8VM and TCOT
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Of those three, I'd say ACOS.
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...hmmmmmm
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lol sry i meant to say 8vm. :facepalm:
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Hehe :P
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:facepalm:
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lol sry i meant to say 8vm. :facepalm:
No you didn't. It's OK, you were right the first time.
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Naah, the only part in ACOS that I really like is "Carpe Diem"
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By that definition then I'm pretty sure TCOT wouldn't count.
Pun intended?
A real man never puns and tells.
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lol sry i meant to say 8vm. :facepalm:
No you didn't. It's OK, you were right the first time.
Out of those four, 8vm. Out of all DT epics, ACOS.
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My favorite epics are not on the list: "Only a Matter of Time" and "Voices"
I've never heard those referred to as "epics."
Petrucci refers to "Voices" as an epic in this video at the 40-minute mark: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SnLj9QuAGiY
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My favorite epics are not on the list: "Only a Matter of Time" and "Voices"
I've never heard those referred to as "epics."
Petrucci refers to "Voices" as an epic in this video at the 40-minute mark: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SnLj9QuAGiY
It took you 12 years, but you got your proof! :lol
-Marc.
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lol very impressive
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Surprised OV is so far ahead in this poll when ACOS beat it in the Survivor.
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Surprised OV is so far ahead in this poll when ACOS beat it in the Survivor.
It's a 12-year old thread.
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Surprised OV is so far ahead in this poll when ACOS beat it in the Survivor.
It's a 12-year old thread.
You know what's funny? If I'd voted 12 years ago (and I probably did), I probably would've selected ITPOE or ACOS...but I just voted now, and it was for Octavarium!
I was soooo lukewarm on that album when I first heard it, but it's slowly become a top-3 record for me over the years.
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I know I probably shouldn't have resurrected a thread from 12 years ago, but I was randomly watching that video on YouTube and when Petrucci referred to "Voices" as en epic, I instantly thought of hefdaddy's comment, lol. I couldn't resist.
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I know I probably shouldn't have resurrected a thread from 12 years ago, but I was randomly watching that video on YouTube and when Petrucci referred to "Voices" as en epic, I instantly thought of hefdaddy's comment, lol. I couldn't resist.
That was the best move I've seen on the forum in some time. Well done. :clap: