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General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: KevShmev on August 20, 2015, 09:51:57 PM
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This thread is for Beatles fans to talk about how great they were. I didn't want to bump any of the old existing Beatles threads, since most delve into that silly "The Beatles are overrated" nonsense, so since this is an appreciation thread, we will have none of that in here. :hat
Anyway, I've been listening to a lot of them this week. So many great songs, on so many records.
NP: Glass Onion :hat
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Within You Without You and The Inner Light are some of my favorite underrated Beatles songs. They're both gorgeous.
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They have been my #1 band ever since I was about 8 years. Phenomenal band in all regards.
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greatest band of all time no doubt about it. i want you (she's so heavy) is quite possibly the greatest song of all time as well.
also, i think, even with the praise that they get, that they are UNDERrated. i don't think most people really understood what they were doing at the time, and still don't understand it today.
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I've been revisiting them a bit in the last few weeks, such a great band. While I'm not a big fan of their early albums, I think Rubber Soul and forward is really great. Abbey Road and Sgt Pepper have been favorites for a while, but I've given White Album some more attention. It's a lot of music to take in, but really good stuff.
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Rubber Soul onwards is amazing. Rubber Soul and Abbey Road alternate as my fave album from them.
I find it funny that my top 2 Beatles songa are written by Gerge Harrison. :P
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Simply the best. Of note is the fact of how much they accomplished in 7 years from 1963 - 1970, contrasted to the fact that Metallica has released 1 album in the last 7 years. ::)
Abbey Road will always be my fave, and I wanted to give a shout-out to Yellow Matter Custard which I just watched. The guys did a great job with those songs.
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greatest band of all time no doubt about it. i want you (she's so heavy) is quite possibly the greatest song of all time as well.
also, i think, even with the praise that they get, that they are UNDERrated. i don't think most people really understood what they were doing at the time, and still don't understand it today.
I agree with this 100%. Many people say The Beatles are overrated but I don't think they know too many songs.
To be honest, I still don't know majority of their discography but discovering it I'm surprised how fresh they sound.
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I think to some degree, people look at The Beatles in today's terms. Meaning, "Beatlemania" and equate it with the fury for One Direction or Taylor Swift. I think people forget that they were actually very good musicians, and played and sang all their material around a microphone in what was - in terms of state of the art - a pretty crappy studio.
I saw McCartney in Philly in 2008, and the guy played and sang for two and a half hours (roughly), THEN walked out with just a guitar and did "Yesterday", just him and a guitar, and it was beautiful. I cried (seriously). Then he proceeded to play TEN more songs, all of which are certifiable classics. (You can go to "setlist.com" and see the set; 40 songs, almost three and a half hours... unbelievable).
By far my favorite band.
I think the other thing that is lost is the influence. Other than Hendrix (who was himself influenced by the Beatles) I don't think there's a band out there that has spawned so many blatant imitators that STILL achieved legendary status themselves. Billy Joel, Gene Simmons, Rick Neilson, Jeff Lynne, Ozzy... will all tell you that "if it wasn't for the Beatles..."
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The Beatles - GREAT
The Rolling Stones - diabolically bad :lol
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The last thing I purchased from Borders before they went out of business was this book:
(https://i.imgur.com/83f3j7Q.png)
I already liked The Beatles, and had heard about a lot of the "firsts" they had in their resumé, but what I read in this book blew my mind.
The book dissects 100 songs which the authors consider "the best" which of course is subjective, but let's face it; they have a lot of really, really great songs. And that doesn't change the objective facts they've given for each song. Extensive notes regarding the recording sessions, great "did you know?" tidbits about each song, etc.
The multitracking which we take for granted today was practically invented by George Martin and The Beatles, simply because they had arrangements in their heads that the four of them couldn't play in real time. Prior to The Beatles, albums were recorded very differently.
Augmenting the basic rock group (guitars, bass, drums) with instruments like horns ("Got to Get You Into My Life"), clarinets ("When I'm 64"), strings (many songs) was rare if not unheard-of. The Beatles did it. They had no problem doing whatever it took to serve the music. Adding the sitar and other Eastern instruments. Actually writing and playing songs in that style, and putting them on the album. Never done before.
"Eleanor Rigby" is a double string quartet and three voices, period. The piano solo in "In My Life" was played and recorded at half-speed, so that upon playback it would sound one octave higher and have that timbre which many have mistaken for a harpsichord. Some of the tape loops on "Revolution 9" were so long they the had the tape running through the deck and around the room, kept taut by pencils taped to the desks and tables. Okay, I'll stop with the examples. Get the book.
Anyway, my appreciation for this band was only increased by reading about what they've done to revolutionize the art of recording. And as I said, I already liked them. I mean, I liked most of their songs anyway, without even thinking about what went into creating them in the studio. And I agree with those who say that no matter how big they are considered in the history of recorded music, they are still underrated.
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Yeah, every time I read somewhere that the Beatles are "overrated" I can't help but laugh.
What they did was staggering.
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Dream Team, the Yellow Matter Custard thing is fun to watch, but whenever I've tried listening to just the mp3s, it was hard to get through them. Neal is the only one who did good vocally at all, for the most part, and considering how important vocals, especially harmonies, were to the Beatles sound, I can't say they did a great job from that standpoint, but they clearly had a blast doing those shows, so who cares, right? :lol
Orbert, I need to get that book.
I can still listen to Tomorrow Never Knows and think, "If this came out today, it would still blow our minds." And the song is nearly 50 years old!!
Also, as great as albums like Abbey Road, Sgt. Pepper, Rubber Soul, Revolver and the White Album all are, I still think Magical Mystery Tour gets overlooked in the best Beatles album discussions. Not saying it is the best, but it's pretty freaking great.
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^ I think it gets overlooked because it wasn't a "proper" LP. It was released as a "double EP" in the UK, with just the six songs from the sountrack to the film. For the US market, they made it an "LP length" by adding five (I think) singles the band released in 1967.
Think about that for a second: The Beatles recorded and released all of the following from Nov. 1966 through Nov. 1967:
1. "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band"
2. "With a Little Help from My Friends"
3. "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds"
4. "Getting Better"
5. "Fixing a Hole"
6. "She's Leaving Home"
7. "Being for the Benefit of Mr. Kite!"
1. "Within You Without You"
2. "When I'm Sixty-Four"
3. "Lovely Rita"
4. "Good Morning Good Morning"
5. "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band (Reprise)"
6. "A Day in the Life"
1. "Magical Mystery Tour"
2. "The Fool on the Hill"
3. "Flying"
4. "Blue Jay Way"
5. "Your Mother Should Know"
6. "I Am the Walrus"
1. "Hello, Goodbye"
2. "Strawberry Fields Forever"
3. "Penny Lane"
4. "Baby, You're a Rich Man"
5. "All You Need Is Love"
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Orbert, I need to get that book.
You really do.
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The change in sound from beginning to end is ridiculous.
Feel robbed that their egos got the best of them.
What they had was they created great songs that seemed so new, yet so familiar at the same time. It seems like it would be easy to write songs like that, but it's the little things that make all the difference.
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So The Beatles are The Simpsons?
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Also, as great as albums like Abbey Road, Sgt. Pepper, Rubber Soul, Revolver and the White Album all are, I still think Magical Mystery Tour gets overlooked in the best Beatles album discussions. Not saying it is the best, but it's pretty freaking great.
Right. I had a phase then when I played this everyday for a month. I Am The Walrus was so ahead of its time, it does not have any 1960s sound in it.
The 11 -track LP version is really great. Magical Mystery Tour, Fool On The Hill, I Am The Walrus, Strawberry Fields Forever, Hello Goodbye, Penny Lane, All You Need is Love in one album? Great album indeed.
Ringo Starr is also really underrated. I am glad that Mangini always cites him as one of his biggest influences.
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Within You Without You and The Inner Light are some of my favorite underrated Beatles songs. They're both gorgeous.
WYWY is one of my favourite songs, but in my experience, the songs where the Eastern inspiration is anything more than light are dismissed by 90% of Beatles fans as “that Indian crap that George subjected everyone to”.
The Beatles are extremely hit and miss for me. I find many of their songs brilliant, many average, and a good number god-awful. Take Abbey Road, for example. I don’t care whatsoever for anything on Side B. Side A, on the other hand, is amazing, with the exception of Octopus’ Garden, which is terrible.
Against all odds then, my favourite album of theirs is The White Album.
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Within You Without You and The Inner Light are some of my favorite underrated Beatles songs. They're both gorgeous.
WYWY is one of my favourite songs, but in my experience, the songs where the Eastern inspiration is anything more than light are dismissed by 90% of Beatles fans as “that Indian crap that George subjected everyone to”.
The Beatles are extremely hit and miss for me. I find many of their songs brilliant, many average, and a good number god-awful. Take Abbey Road, for example. I don’t care whatsoever for anything on Side B. Side A, on the other hand, is amazing, with the exception of Octopus’ Garden, which is terrible.
Against all odds then, my favourite album of theirs is The White Album.
You don't like The Abbey Road Medley??? By chance, have you heard the Transatlantic Suite Charlotte Pike/Abbey Road Mashup?
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She Came In Through The Bathroom Window would have been good as a standalone song, and Golden Slumbers is okay, but as they stand, they’re underdeveloped ideas buried amongst all the rest of it.
I’ve heard the Transatlantic song, but not the mashup.
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She Came In Through The Bathroom Window would have been good as a standalone song, and Golden Slumbers is okay, but as they stand, they’re underdeveloped ideas buried amongst all the rest of it.
I’ve heard the Transatlantic song, but not the mashup.
It's long....but....you're welcome. IMO, this version is better than either original. There...I said it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCKJf2kFOiU
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Orbert, I need to get that book.
You really do.
I will...soon. :coolio
I Am The Walrus was so ahead of its time, it does not have any 1960s sound in it.
It's astonishing how many Beatles songs you can say that about, really.
Ringo Starr is also really underrated.
He was better than some give him credit for, but realistically, he's still one of the luckiest musicians ever.
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So, if you had to narrow your favorite Beatles list down to just 20, which 20 would you pick? That isn't easy, but I'd go with these:
A Day in the Life
Strawberry Fields Forever
Hey Jude
Across the Universe
Something
Here Comes the Sun
Abbey Road medley (cheating? perhaps :lol)
Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds
Rocky Raccoon
You've Got to Hide Your Love Away
I Am the Walrus
In My Life
For No One
Glass Onion
Lovely Rita
Nowhere Man
She Said She Said
Doctor Robert
Maxwell's Silver Hammer
All You Need Is Love
Tomorrow, I could do the same thing and maybe 10-12 of those selections would be different.
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When the Beatles stopped touring and performing live shows, it was obviously devastating to fans at the time, but it was a blessing for posterity. They threw all their musical energy into the recording process. George Martin was the true fifth Beatle.
Just magine fan reaction if DT suddenly announced they would stop performing live but just continue to make albums, and multiply that by 10.
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No order.
Norwegian Wood
I Saw Her Standing There
Something
Hey Jude
I Feel Fine
Blackbird
While My Guitar Gently Weeps
A Day In The Life
Strawberry Fields Forever
Nowhere Man
In My Life
Across The Universe
Eleanor Rigby
All My Loving
Here Comes The Sun
Abbey Road medley
She Loves You
If I Fell
Day Tripper
And I Love Her
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When the Beatles stopped touring and performing live shows, it was obviously devastating to fans at the time, but it was a blessing for posterity.
I was thinking about that. Touring, and the revenue involved, was definitely a big shift in the music industry.
The Beatles are extremely hit and miss for me. I find many of their songs brilliant, many average, and a good number god-awful.
This would sum up my feelings, though "god-awful" might be pretty harsh. And even those "god-awful songs" I'll give them credit for, for trying something new, being brave, and trying to not repeat themselves.
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A Day in the Life
Tomorrow Never Knows
Blue Jay Way
Across the Universe
Here Comes the Sun
While My Guitar Gentle Weeps
Golden Slumbers/Carry That Weight
Strawberry Fields Forever
I am the Walrus
Happiness is a Warm Gun
Eleanor Rigby
Come Together
Within You, Without You
Lucy in the Sky With Diamonds
Nowhere Man
Get Back
Got to Get You Into My Life
Taxman
Fool on the Hill
Glass Onion
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How is there not an appreciation thread for them already? They are far and away the greatest band of all time. So many classic songs and they wrote whatever music they wanted to. The first metal song ever was Helter Skelter and one of the albums that paved the way for progressive rock was Sgt. Pepper. They influenced so many artists and popular music would be completely different today if it wasn't for The Beatles.
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Fuck yeah. I was resistant to the Beatles as a kid because my mom is a huge fan and always forced her oldies music on me, so I sorta just lumped them in with "lame/corny shit Mom likes" (it didn't help that all I'd heard was stuff like "I Want to Hold Your Hand"). Then in middle school-ish I heard "While My Guitar Gently Weeps" and was like "This is the same band?! This rules!" It wasn't really until college that I become a big fan though, when Tony gave me Sgt. Pepper and I was just like "Whoooa." Obviously the rest is history but now I love it all. I find myself listening to Rubber Soul and Revolver the most these days, I think, but that changes.
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I don't subscribe to the "Only late Beatles are good" attitude. I think they wrote great songs at the very beginning too, like I Want to Hold Your Hand, A Hard Day's Night, Ticket to Ride and many others.
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Early stuff is great. I love Lady Madonna myself. It's so jaunty :D
Awesome version : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAMJAThEvi0
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I'm not saying that at all, I'm just saying when you're an angsty teenager and your mom makes you listen to Ticket to Ride, you're like "Fuck this shit" :lol
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How is there not an appreciation thread for them already?
Epic fail on the collective part of the forum? ;) :lol
Fuck yeah. I was resistant to the Beatles as a kid because my mom is a huge fan and always forced her oldies music on me, so I sorta just lumped them in with "lame/corny shit Mom likes" (it didn't help that all I'd heard was stuff like "I Want to Hold Your Hand"). Then in middle school-ish I heard "While My Guitar Gently Weeps" and was like "This is the same band?! This rules!" It wasn't really until college that I become a big fan though, when Tony gave me Sgt. Pepper and I was just like "Whoooa." Obviously the rest is history but now I love it all. I find myself listening to Rubber Soul and Revolver the most these days, I think, but that changes.
Make sense. I was lucky in that Sgt. Pepper was my intro to the band, thanks to my dad when I was like 7. My parents owned the vinyl, and not only was the music good, but it had that classic cover, and the back vinyl with all of the lyrics printed on it was so cool, too. When I got my first CD player late in 1990 and started buying CDs, Sgt. Pepper was one of the first ones I purchased. :hat
If my memory serves me right, after buying just The Wall the first day (I intentionally only bought just that since I wanted that to be the first and only album I ever owned on CD), I went back the next day and bought Boston's debut, Sgt. Pepper and (oddly) The Best of Kansas.
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My top 10 is fairly easy, although I'm not too sure about the order of the other five.
I am the walrus
A Day in the life
Tomorrow never knows
In my life
Strawberry fields forever
While my guitar gently weeps
The Long and winding road
Here, there and everywhere
I want to hold your hand
Something
And then if I had to come up with 10 more... I went chronologically:
It won't be long
You can't do that
You're going to lose that girl
Nowhere man
Michelle
Doctor Robert
Lucy in the sky with diamonds
Being for the benefit of Mr. Kite
Everybody's got something to hide except for me and my monkey
Come together
Damn, that was unbelievably tough...
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My top 20, no particular order:
Across The Universe
Something
Golden Slumbers
I Want You (She's so Heavy)
Tomorrow Never Knows
And Your Bird Can Sing
Strawberry Fields Forever
The Fool on the Hill
A Day In The Life
Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds
With a Little Help from my Friends
She's Leaving Home
While My Guitar Gently Weeps
Happiness is a Warm Gun
If I Needed Someone
A Hard Day's Night
And I Love Her
If I Fell
I'm Happy Just to Dance With You
You Mother Should Know
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^ that looks like a pretty good list, myeah.
The Beatles, I would say, are definitely underrated, as someone else said. The majority of people just really have no idea what they were all about, and just think of them as the mop-top dudes. Beatlemania, like... I don't think you'll ever see anything like that ever again.
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i want you (she's so heavy)
tomorrow never knows
i'm only sleeping
dear prudence
helter skelter
come together
fool on the hill
strawberry fields forever
girl
a day in the life
don't let me down
something
because
i am the walrus
in my life
michelle
lucy in the sky w/ diamonds
the night before
i've just seen a face
i want you (she's so heavy)
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Dream Team, the Yellow Matter Custard thing is fun to watch, but whenever I've tried listening to just the mp3s, it was hard to get through them. Neal is the only one who did good vocally at all, for the most part, and considering how important vocals, especially harmonies, were to the Beatles sound, I can't say they did a great job from that standpoint, but they clearly had a blast doing those shows, so who cares, right? :lol
I think you're being a little harsh if you don't mind my saying. They did a great job with the harmonies on "Because" for instance, and there were only a few songs with anything cringe-worthy.
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I never bought the 2nd DVD they did, which I assume Because is from, so I cannot comment on that.
In all fairness, the vocals of the Beatles are hard for any band to do justice to, and I did acknowledge that the YMC guys clearly had a blast playing those shows, so it's not a big deal. It's just more fun to watch the DVD than it is to listen to the mp3s.
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^ that looks like a pretty good list, myeah.
Thanks. Of couse, it was some oddballs like You Mother Should Know that only i care for but the mono version of She's Leaving Home (which is how it was intended to sound at first) is pretty great.
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You Mother Should Know is great! Along with like 100 other Beatles songs. :lol :lol
She's Leaving Home is just gorgeous, in stereo or mono. :hat
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^ that looks like a pretty good list, myeah.
Thanks. Of couse, it was some oddballs like You Mother Should Know
That was the reason I singled out your list tbh :lol I love that song, it's melody is so angular, it takes a while to catch on to what its doing but its fantastic to sing along to once it's ingrained.
If MMT were an 'official album', and not the dastardly two EP thing that Stadler (I think) pointed out, it would most likely be my favourite. I think it flows the best out of all the Beatles' albums. (I'm referring to the version with the soundtrack and the '67 singles attatched at the end.)
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My 20 Favorite Beatles songs:
1. Something
Here Comes the Sun
Two of Us
All You Need is Love
She's Leaving Home
I Am The Walrus
A Day In The Life
Dig A Pony
Penny Lane
I'm Only Sleeping
You Won't See Me
I Want You (She's So Heavy)
Baby You're A Rich Man
I've Got A Feeling
If I Needed Someone
Here, There and Everywhere
Blackbird
Golden Slumbers
Across the Universe
20. The Fool on the Hill
Oh my. Looks like I really love that Magical Mystery Tour LP.
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That was the reason I singled out your list tbh :lol I love that song, it's melody is so angular, it takes a while to catch on to what its doing but its fantastic to sing along to once it's ingrained.
Oh, ok. Nice to see some love for that song :D
If MMT were an 'official album', and not the dastardly two EP thing that Stadler (I think) pointed out, it would most likely be my favourite. I think it flows the best out of all the Beatles' albums. (I'm referring to the version with the soundtrack and the '67 singles attatched at the end.)
That version is my favorite Beatles "album" ;)
My 20 Favorite Beatles songs:
She's Leaving Home
If I Needed Someone
20. The Fool on the Hill
I thought i was the only one who loved these songs :clap:
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Looking it over, I have quite a few more Lennon songs in my top 20 than McCartney songs, but it really is impossible to pick which one was the better songwriter when a Beatle.
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I'm Lennon's bitch. Strawberry Fields Forever, Tomorrow Never Knows, Across the Universe, 'nuff said :hat
Also, i like Harrison more than McCartney, but that counting their solo careers too.
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I'm a McCartney man myself. Because Wings aka the band the Beatles could've been.
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I was hoping there would be more love for All You Need Is Love. It's in 7/4 after all. :rollin
I'm a McCartney man myself. Because Wings aka the band the Beatles could've been.
I shudder at the thought. What a downgrade!
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how dare you sir
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how dare you sir
:lol
Wings lacks the irreverence of Lennon, the zen of George and the charm of Ringo. :p
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I never bought the 2nd DVD they did, which I assume Because is from, so I cannot comment on that.
In all fairness, the vocals of the Beatles are hard for any band to do justice to, and I did acknowledge that the YMC guys clearly had a blast playing those shows, so it's not a big deal. It's just more fun to watch the DVD than it is to listen to the mp3s.
Ah, that explains it. I was referring to the 2nd DVD. You should check it out, they have Kasim Sulton doing a lot of Paul's songs.
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I was hoping there would be more love for All You Need Is Love. It's in 7/4 after all. :rollin
With occasional bars of 2/4 just to mess with you. I've always loved this song, from the "borrowed" horn intro to the wacky outro with callbacks to earlier Beatles songs.
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She Came In Through The Bathroom Window would have been good as a standalone song, and Golden Slumbers is okay, but as they stand, they’re underdeveloped ideas buried amongst all the rest of it.
I’ve heard the Transatlantic song, but not the mashup.
Go. Listen to it right now. We'll wait.
;)
Phil Collins does an excellent version of the latter half of the medley, too.
Also, go ask Queen if they ever heard "Because".
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I love the mistakes. I had a printout from a website of all the little quirks and pops and buzzes and whistles and bad edits from Beatles songs; it just makes them so much more real and therefore so much more awesome if you ask me.
Listen to "Hey Jude", about 2 minutes in, and you can litereally hear Ringo moving in behind his kit (Paul started the take without him).
Listen to "Strawberry Fields Forever" about a minute in, and after the drum fill, the sound of the drums completely changes; that's because they spliced two different takes together to make the final master; the speeds were slightly different, so you get the combination of reverb on the drums and the "slowing down" of the second take to create that amazing, trippy sound. Sounds as if you are going down the rabbit hole with John. Just mind-blowing stuff.
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1. A Day In The Life
2. Paperback Writer
3. I've Got A Feeling
4. Abbey Road Medley
5. Strawberry Fields Forever
Anytime At All
I Feel Fine
The Night Before
Rain
She Said She Said
Tomorrow Never Knows
Lovely Rita
Back In The U.S.S.R.
Dear Prudence
Glass Onion
Everybody's Got Something To Hide...
Savoy Truffle
Two Of Us
Get Back
Magical Mystery Tour
First five are in order, next 15 are chronological. This could change at a moments notice... I could put half of Revolver, Sgt. Pepper, or Past Masters 2 without missing a beat. Plus, I like a lot more of the early songs than this shows ("I Want To Hold Your Hand", "She's A Woman", "Bad Boy", "Slow Down"...)
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I love the mistakes. I had a printout from a website of all the little quirks and pops and buzzes and whistles and bad edits from Beatles songs; it just makes them so much more real and therefore so much more awesome if you ask me.
Listen to "Hey Jude", about 2 minutes in, and you can litereally hear Ringo moving in behind his kit (Paul started the take without him).
Listen to "Strawberry Fields Forever" about a minute in, and after the drum fill, the sound of the drums completely changes; that's because they spliced two different takes together to make the final master; the speeds were slightly different, so you get the combination of reverb on the drums and the "slowing down" of the second take to create that amazing, trippy sound. Sounds as if you are going down the rabbit hole with John. Just mind-blowing stuff.
For sure!
And let's not forget the mostly inaudible f-bomb in Hey Jude. :lol :lol
Looking at the various top 20 lists, two Beatles songs I have never come around to liking at all are Get Back and The Long and Winding Road, yet both are in some top 20s. Just goes to show you how opinions can be all over the map.
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Now, can we get a Winger appreciation thread? :neverusethis:
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Trying to make a top 20 Beatles list proved way too difficult for me. Heck, even trying to say which song is my favorite is impossible.
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I'm a McCartney man myself. Because Wings aka the band the Beatles could've been.
what? this is blasphemy. wings were alright, but the beatles were streets ahead.
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I thought myself a Lennon man until I decided to listen to all the post-Beatles work. While it had moments here and there, it was nowhere close to the high level and consistency of the Beatles working together.
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Agreed. Lennon's solo work has never done a lot for me, outside of a handful of songs (like Imagine, which is hands down one of the best things he ever wrote), but I don't think their post-Beatles work is relevant when discussing who was the better songwriter when they were in the Beatles.
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I've never really looked at the writing credits of the Beatles all that closely, but I think I recall just a wall of "Lennon-McCartney".
They took each other from great songwriters to iconic songwriters. I never really followed the feud, but I'm assuming it all boiled down to the two needing to go out on their own to prove "they were the real deal". And they used their songs to antagonize the other before rap groups ever did.
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I'm a McCartney man myself. Because Wings aka the band the Beatles could've been.
what? this is blasphemy. wings were alright, but the beatles were streets ahead.
Lol. its an Alan Partridge reference. Wings are mostly horrible, but I do enjoy Wings over America.
But I stand by my McCartney preference. He gets a lot of shit, but tbh he wrote most of the Beatles' classic songs, and stayed consistent when Lennon was doing his trying-to-be-edgy shit. Which was edgy I suppose but McCartney penned tracks probably make up most of my favourites. But George is my fave <3
I think I mainly just don't get all the praise Lennon gets. He wasn't anywhere near the god-like figure people make him out to be.
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I think there was a common perception that Lennon was the rocker, the edgier one, and McCartney was more the pretty boy who wrote some nice melodies. And there is some truth to that. It's John Lennon screaming "Shake it up, baby now!" while the crooners (Golden Slumbers medley, She's Leaving Home, Yesterday, etc.) were all McCartney.
But McCartney also wrote "Helter Skelter", easily one of The Beatles' heaviest rockers, if not the heaviest. And overall, McCartney was just far more prolific. A lot of his post-Beatles work is kinda sappy, but there's a lot of good rock and roll, too. I like most of Wings stuff. Rock Show, Venus and Mars, Band on the Run, those are all great albums. And Wings Over America is an incredible live album. John Lennon has nothing in his catalog that does it for me like Paul's later stuff.
To me, it's pretty obvious that Paul's brain is the kind that comes up with melodies and bits of songs pretty much 24/7. The wacky medleys with The Beatles were all his, and he continued that with Wings. Live and Let Die, Band and the Run, and others are clearly separate musical bits that were worked together into something larger. Lennon always stuck with basic 4/4 rock.
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honestly, all post beatles solo stuff is pretty bad in my opinion. there is obviously some good stuff every now and then, but for the most part, it doesn't really do much for me.
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So, if you had to narrow your favorite Beatles list down to just 20, which 20 would you pick?
I can't. I just... I can't. I'll mention favorites in this post, but pretty much everything they touched (except for Revolution #9) was... see, it's hard for me to describe because my parents (Dad especially) were and still are HUGE fans of The Beatles, so you could say that I've been "listening" to them since I was in the womb. :lol :biggrin:
I agree that Within You, Without You is utter gorgeousness - I get goosebumps just thinking about that song. I would have to say that most of my favorite songs were sung by John or George, though some Paul and Ringo ones sneak in there too. Hell--half the reason I made my mother by me a black beret with my school clothes in late 1985 and why I stole her trenchcoat on a daily basis in 1986 was that I was going through a HUGE broody Lennon phase LOL (you couldn't catch me dead wearing a trench in a humid Houston spring otherwise).
One of my other favorites--Strawberry Fields Forever. I remember watching one of The Beatles' cartoons on TV when I was about... 4 or 5 and just being mesmerized by that song (and David Bowie's Fame.... and Bohemian Rhapsody... ).
Favorite album is by FAR Abbey Road. But really, starting with Rubber Soul the quality of their music just skyrocketed. Not that the older stuff is bad, just that starting in 1965 they got that much BETTER.
I saw Jeff Lynne's name pop up earlier - he admits that ELO was a blatant rip-off of The Beatles harmonically, and John Lennon called the ELO song Showdown (more on ELO in a sec) "Son of The Beatles" hehehe. High praise indeed, even with the proggy orchestral ambience ELO was going for at that time. Then, fast forward YEARS later to The Traveling Wilburys (that first album with Roy O was the best) and George Harrison's Cloud 9--both involving Jeff in some way, shape, or form. The point I'm trying to make is that SO many bands and musicians would not have even gotten started were it not for The Beatles breaking as huge as they did, especially here in the US.
So speaking of The Beatles and ELO - my mother was a fan of both, and I remember spending many a rainy day sitting at the kitchen table while playing cards (mainly gin/gin rummy) with her and my brother. We'd listen to ELO and Beatles vinyl religiously, the records stacked so that one side of each album would play and then when all were done my brother would flip them en masse for the second sides.
Last thing before I let y'all read this wall of text - watching Paul at the Beatles appreciation show was just... he was having SO much fun singing along to music HE had helped create, and it was precious to see Dave Grohl's young daughter singing right along too. And you know... John was actually right when he'd said what he did about The Beatles being bigger than Jesus. ;)
All you need is love, people. :heart :hefdaddy
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Help! is pretty great, too, and I do like a lot of the early stuff as well, but I agree that from Rubber Soul to the end was mostly god-tier music (a few songs notwithstanding).
Calvin, except for the Harrison songs and the few Ringo tunes, nearly every Beatles song is credited to Lennon and McCartney, but you can always tell who wrote it by who sang it: whoever sang the lead vocals on a song pretty much wrote it, in regards to the Lennon/McCartney compositions. Some obviously have both - like A Day in the Life, because John wrote the verses and Paul wrote the middle part - but, by and large, whoever wrote it, sang it.
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Lennon always stuck with basic 4/4 rock.
I agree with most of your post Orbert, but I think this is an unfair statement.
Lennon had some awesome stuff like Happiness is a Warm gun which shifts into alternate 9/8 - 4/4 patterns (it may be 9/8 and something else, its been a while since I've listened or looked at the score), but his real strength lies in the way he would add beats to common time to fit the lyric. Don't Let Me Down has that awesome vocal line that stretches over the bar in the verses, same with All You Need is Love.
In terms of manipulating bar lengths, Lennon was a master and making the music fit what he had to say, which is extremely rare.
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a day in the life is a weird song. they were both writing separate songs, and couldn't finish them, and there some lines that make it seem like they could be related, so they just put them together.
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And let's not forget the mostly inaudible f-bomb in Hey Jude. :lol :lol
Crap, I've never heard that!
I have mixed feelings about these types of things in music. On the one hand, you are in the studio, you've had time to rehearse, you have control over your environment. When shit like this happens, cut and start over. On the other hand, music, like all art, should have a level of spontaneity to it. If it becomes too sterile, it starts to feel, well, sterile.
One of the greatest rock songs of all time, Louie Louie, has both a flub, and an f-bomb. And they both sound so integral to the song it is hard to imagine it without those moments.
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recording is a very spontaneous environment, and personally, i'm a huge fan of leaving in things like that. there's a lot of little stuff like that in beatles songs. there's one, can't quite remember which, where there is just a fraction of a second of feedback from a guitar. almost unnoticeable unless you know it's there.
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recording is a very spontaneous environment, and personally, i'm a huge fan of leaving in things like that. there's a lot of little stuff like that in beatles songs. there's one, can't quite remember which, where there is just a fraction of a second of feedback from a guitar. almost unnoticeable unless you know it's there.
That's where the soul of the music is I recks.
a day in the life is a weird song. they were both writing separate songs, and couldn't finish them, and there some lines that make it seem like they could be related, so they just put them together.
I think HAWG is similar in that sense, just mashing together different ideas like a collage. pretty cool
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But I stand by my McCartney preference. He gets a lot of shit, but tbh he wrote most of the Beatles' classic songs, and stayed consistent when Lennon was doing his trying-to-be-edgy shit.
If he wrote your personal favorite Beatles songs, fine. But wrote most of the Beatles's classic songs? I don't think so since both of them were pretty consistent (though i give Lennon a edge because i think he wrote the strongest tracks).
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I think I mainly just don't get all the praise Lennon gets. He wasn't anywhere near the god-like figure people make him out to be.
My praise for John Lennon is because of I Am The Walrus, Come Together, Across the Universe, Dig A Pony, Strawberry Fields Forever, I Want You (She's So Heavy), I'm Only Sleeping, Lucy in the Sky With Diamonds, You've Got To Hide Your Love Away, In My Life, Help!, Norwegian Wood, Rain, Tomorrow Never Knows, and The Word.
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Lennon always stuck with basic 4/4 rock.
I agree with most of your post Orbert, but I think this is an unfair statement.
Lennon had some awesome stuff like Happiness is a Warm gun which shifts into alternate 9/8 - 4/4 patterns (it may be 9/8 and something else, its been a while since I've listened or looked at the score), but his real strength lies in the way he would add beats to common time to fit the lyric. Don't Let Me Down has that awesome vocal line that stretches over the bar in the verses, same with All You Need is Love.
In terms of manipulating bar lengths, Lennon was a master and making the music fit what he had to say, which is extremely rare.
I forgot that John (mostly) wrote "All You Need Is Love" and it does have some crazy meter changes, and I even commented on it earlier. :facepalm: But when I was talking about the straight 4/4 thing versus Paul getting a bit "out there" I was talking about their respective post-Beatles solo careers.
"Rain" is a fave, and it has that weird cadence to it.
Okay, fine, I take it back. There are a lot more Lennon songs that I like than I realized. His solo stuff still does nothing for me, though.
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I think I would agree that in general, McCartney had better songs post-Beatles than John Lennon. But in terms of individual songs, I personally can't think of a McCartney song that comes close to my love for Imagine, Jealous Guy, Woman, Grow Old Along With Me, and Beautiful Boy. Then there are the second-tier songs like Give Peace A Chance, Working Class Hero, Starting Over, Instant Karma and Nobody Told Me, which are also very good.
I proposed marriage to my wife by giving her a letter printed with the lyrics of Grow Old Along With Me and our picture. :)
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I think I mainly just don't get all the praise Lennon gets. He wasn't anywhere near the god-like figure people make him out to be.
My praise for John Lennon is because of I Am The Walrus, Come Together, Across the Universe, Dig A Pony, Strawberry Fields Forever, I Want You (She's So Heavy), I'm Only Sleeping, Lucy in the Sky With Diamonds, You've Got To Hide Your Love Away, In My Life, Help!, Norwegian Wood, Rain, Tomorrow Never Knows, and The Word.
Great list of songs (mostly), but that isn't what I was getting at. Towards the end of his life, his attitude (especially towards the Beatles and Paul in particular) was pretty appalling. That Playboy interview, he just comes off as a whiny twat, and from what I can gather he was just a bit of an asshole, beating on women, being extremely possessive of Yoko. Of course that's mostly from second hand accounts but still, leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I'm not denying that he wrote great music.
But I stand by my McCartney preference. He gets a lot of shit, but tbh he wrote most of the Beatles' classic songs, and stayed consistent when Lennon was doing his trying-to-be-edgy shit.
If he wrote your personal favorite Beatles songs, fine. But wrote most of the Beatles's classic songs? I don't think so since both of them were pretty consistent (though i give Lennon a edge because i think he wrote the strongest tracks).
Yeah, sorry I should have said the bolded part. Most of the classic Beatles songs that immediately spring to my mind are sung, and therefore most likely written by, Paul.
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It's hard to pinpoint their most classic songs down to just a few, but I am pretty sure if we had to list the 10-15 most classic Beatles songs, based on popularity and enduring longevity (as opposed to our personal preferences), Lennon and McCartney would both have about an equal amount in there.
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In RateYourMusic, there was a Artists Top songs. Here is the one they had for Beatles (with near 200 voters):
1. A Day in the Life
2. Strawberry Fields Forever
3. While My Guitar Gently Weeps
4. Tomorrow Never Knows
5. In My Life
6. Eleanor Rigby
7. Hey Jude
8. I Am The Walrus
9. Happiness Is a Warm Gun
10. Here Comes the Sun
11. Something
12. I Want You (She's So Heavy)
13. Across The Universe
14. Let It Be
15. Norgewian Wood
16. Helter Skelter
17. Come Together
18. I'm Only Sleeping
19. Penny Lane
20. Lucy in the Sky With Diamons
So, in short (and accounting A Day in the Life for both):
Lennon: 12 songs
McCartney: 7 songs (counting Yesterday, which was 21º)
Harrison: 3 songs
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Still, i think that, if counting the rest, it evens out a bit but i agree that Lennon had the most important songs.
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I don't buy that list. I remember years ago hearing that Yesterday is the most played song in the history of FM radio, yet it doesn't make that top 20? Also, no way is I Want You... one of their most classic and iconic tunes. Gun to my head, if someone asked me the five most iconic Beatles songs, I'd say:
Hey Jude
Yesterday
A Day in the Life
In My Life
Let It Be
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My personal point was never about which was the "better"? Nor was I using post-Beatles to make further distinctions about which was better. It was that the better was them working together. Anybody that has written music can tell you working with others almost always produces better results. And it doesn't have to be some sharing, but something as simple as changing one note, chord, a simple variation of a repeating pattern or a general suggestion like adding or deleting an instrument. Those little things can make a world of difference.
And when you have two great songwriters, they take each other to milestone levels.
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why do all of these lists exclude early beatles? lol. Hard Days Night, She Loves You, I Want to Hold Your Hand, Help, All My Loving etc. All of those songs are just as iconic imo.
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I don't buy that list.
Proceeds to cite 5 songs, 4 of them are in that list :P
why do all of these lists exclude early beatles? lol. Hard Days Night, She Loves You, I Want to Hold Your Hand, Help, All My Loving etc. All of those songs are just as iconic imo.
Because they are great and all but not really top 20.
It can be if you include popularity and iconic status but that list was made by near 200 people voting exclusively for their personal favorite Beatles songs, not what songs they thought were most iconic (which never was the intention to begin with).
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"sorry, accidental double post"
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if we're talking most iconic, hey jude is def #1 followed by yesterday, and after that i'd have to say hard day's night because that first chord is probably the most iconic chord ever.
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Every time I try to make a top 20 Beatles list, it quickly ends in disaster. The songs are just so varied that there just isn't a pinnacle song for them. So instead, here's my lifetime Beatles journey.
My mom had the Sgt. Peppers tape in her car when she took me to Kindergarten. I recall vividly because I'd race into the car so I could dig through her audio tape bag just to find that tape (ok, 8-track) and slam it in the car deck before she could say no. Loved it from beginning to end, but because 8-track had the equivalent to CD track skip, I believe my favorite from that at the time was Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds. But the Bee Gees/Frampton had a Sgt. Peppers movie and Get Back was the big ending, so of course I loved that being a kid. My father had the rest of the library and would blast the Beatles and many other classics on the weekends. So the melodies are like breathing to me.
Jr. High to most of High School, I viewed the Beatles as "baby stuff" because for me, it literally was.
I started to rediscover them when I picked up guitar in high school due to guitar idol interviews. But they didn't make a full recovery until an early 90s Lynch Mob concert. The concerts would start with the lights going down and the Beatles "Tomorrow Never Knows" as the warm up / intro track. At concert volumes, it was nirvana to me. Obviously, I recognized it as the Beatles, but I didn't know the name of the song because that wasn't one that either my mom or dad played in my formative years. It instantly became my favorite Beatles song. It was beyond cool.
So Revolver was then my favorite album. Now I'm at Musicians Institute and my MI band needed a cover song (and two originals) to compete in the battle of the bands. Clearly TNK was going to be ridiculously difficult to make "your own" while not totally destroying the song. So I created our version of Eleanor Rigby. Mostly orchestration for drums, bass, two guitars and synth.
I even still have the orchestration I presented to the other guys
Eleanor Rigby soundcloud (https://soundcloud.com/calvin6s/eleanor-rigby-1993-synth-arrangement)
Keep in mind, this was 1993. Guitar synth patches were horrendous and the synths were "multi-timbral", but not in a good way. So I just used a staccato string for guitars and keys, the drum machine bass for bass guitar and of course the drum machine for drums to represent what we'd be playing as a sketch. I recorded the whole thing and just their *stem* track and had to hand write out their parts (just print out the MIDI to staff, in 1993? Easier and cheaper to just break out the mechanical pencil and staff paper). Then we took that sketch to get the core down and then branched out in practice. I still wish I recorded the actual band rehearsals, but we figured we'd have time later (which never happens). Oh, and our recording device was usually a $30 tape recorder that made everything sound awful. And I probably pick up my guitar less than an hour a year these days, so the opportunity has passed.
Mid to late 90s, suddenly everybody was covering Eleanor Rigby, so that went into the dust bin. But it was really fun back in 1993.
So LSD to Get Back to Tomorrow Never Knows to Eleanor Rigby. I think my favorite song now is A Day in the Life, but tomorrow it could be Strawberry Fields Forever, then Because, Golden Slumbers/Carry That Weight, or Come Together. They easily have more than 20 "this is the best song ever" songs.
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I think I mainly just don't get all the praise Lennon gets. He wasn't anywhere near the god-like figure people make him out to be.
My praise for John Lennon is because of I Am The Walrus, Come Together, Across the Universe, Dig A Pony, Strawberry Fields Forever, I Want You (She's So Heavy), I'm Only Sleeping, Lucy in the Sky With Diamonds, You've Got To Hide Your Love Away, In My Life, Help!, Norwegian Wood, Rain, Tomorrow Never Knows, and The Word.
Versus Yesterday, Let It Be, Hey Jude, I Saw Her Standing There, Got To Get You Into My Life, Lady Madonna, Eleanor Rigby, Back In The USSR, Golden Slumbers, Get Back, Paperback Writer, Penny Lane
Personally, if you look at the Beatles work and post-Beatles work up to 1980 (let's be fair, though that cut off works both ways) it's hard to say that they aren't at least equals, and for my money, "Jet" and "Band on the Run" (by way of example) blow the bumper sticker jingoism of "Instant Karma!" and "Power to the People". Yes, there is "Imagine", but... what else? I like the slick pop of his later work ("Woman", "Watching The Wheels", "Beautiful Boy" are just gorgeous) but I just feel McCartney just has more breadth and depth.
Having said that, The Beatles don't exist without Lennon, and they don't even get to the point of doing Revolver without Lennon. He was the boosters that got the lunar module into orbit around the moon, and McCartney was the LEM that got the Beatles down to the surface of the moon.
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I have mixed feelings about these types of things in music. On the one hand, you are in the studio, you've had time to rehearse, you have control over your environment. When shit like this happens, cut and start over. On the other hand, music, like all art, should have a level of spontaneity to it. If it becomes too sterile, it starts to feel, well, sterile.
I'm sort of the same opinion, but especially with the Beatles, I love it. There are some bands that make their bones on the tightness and perfectness of their playing. I love DT, but I don't think it's the same if you have a unison run between JP and JR, there is a flub in bar 15, and the air conditioner goes on midway through bar 9. Mike's playing is sublime, and I don't need to hear the squeak of the drum pedal (ala Bonham in "Since I've Been Loving You") to make it special.
But there is something timeless about knowing that Hey Jude, one of the most iconic songs of all time, was a first take, and it has even more resonance when you know about the fractured relationships at the time (by all accounts, McCartney was a douche during these sessions, arguing so much with Harrison about the lead guitar track that Harrison stayed in the control room during the recording of the master track).
Put a different way, these aren't technical virtuosos like a Malmsteen; these are guys that have logged 10's of thousands of hours of playing together and much of the magic is in the innate nature of how they play together. All the "fucking hell"'s and ""Cranberry sauces" contribute to this, in my opinion.
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Yes, there is "Imagine", but... what else?
They each had their moments post-Beatles. For McCartney, I feel it was Maybe, I'm Amazed. That song is grade A stock.
But both also had more misses than hits, and the Beatles was practically all hits.
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Yes, there is "Imagine", but... what else?
Instant Karma, Working Class Hero, Jealous Guy, Mother...
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Lennon and McCartney are like Gilmour and Waters to me. After they split from their respective bands, neither pair did much for me as solo artists.
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Every time I hear a McCartney solo song with Linda singing harmonies or something, I always think that was Paul's way of saying to John, "See, my wife/girlfriend can sing, too!" :lol :lol
This of course ignores the fact that Yoko One was a wretched singer.
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Actually, so was Linda. In the studio, with Paul right there and taking as many takes as necessary, she was okay, but live is another story, and she was always the first to admit that. She said that there was only one reason why she was in the band, and that's because Paul wanted her in it. He's Paul McCartney, it's his band, and he wanted his wife there with him. So she was.
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Oh, definitely.
I just always got the impression that Yoko One fancied herself an actual musician, while Linda, like you said, knew she herself wasn't one.
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I think she really fancied herself an artist, doing something profound with the primal screaming and other horrible auditory sins. I, and many, many others, thought she was just plain dreadful.
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I think she really fancied herself an artist, doing something profound with the primal screaming and other horrible auditory sins. I, and many, many others, thought she was just plain dreadful.
It was profound... ly shit.
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Hey, here's something to appreciate. On April 4, 1964, The Beatles made history by having all five of the Top 5 songs on the Billboard Hot 100 chart. It had never been done before, and I'm pretty sure it will never be done again. Music listening is just too fragmented today. There is no single group or artist with the popularity to have that many songs all that hot, all at the same time.
(https://www.billboard.com/files/styles/promo_650/public/media/beatles-top-5-chart-650.jpg)
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That's pretty awesome, and yes, I'm sure nothing like that will ever happen again.
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One of the most impressive things about The Beatles is not necessarily the amount of good music, but the amount of good music in such a short time period. They were only really around for a decade, and still put out more music (and more great music) than a lot of bands do in 4-5 decades. They just kept pounding out good material and I think that helped contribute to their legacy. Sure, quality is the key, and dropping 2 mediocre albums per year wouldn't have done much for the band, but releasing so many albums in such a short time really helped their popularity.
You don't really see that kind of frequent releases anymore, and it's fascinating to see some bands struggle to write a good album every 5 years when Beatles put out two a year or something. I don't love all their albums, but it's still impressive.
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a lot of the reason you don't see frequent releases anymore is that labels simply won't allow it. they're really committed to the 'album every two years' structure, and don't want to deviate from that.
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Regarding Yoko, it's worth seeking out the video of John Lennon playing with Chuck Berry, and about halfway through the vid, she starts caterwauling off to the side into the mike. Chuck gives John a death stare for the ages, and you can tell he's thinking, "You need to shut that b**** up, bro."
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:lol
That sounds awesome!
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Gun to my head, if someone asked me the five most iconic Beatles songs, I'd say:
Hey Jude
Yesterday
A Day in the Life
In My Life
Let It Be
The thing is, while songs like A Day in the Life and Strawberry Fields Forever are generally viewed as some of the best Beatles songs, they aren't well know such as Hey Jude or Yesterday in the eyes of the public, suggesting that there are others more iconic songs even if they aren't actually better (Twist and Shout, I Wanna Hold Your Hand...)
Or maybe i'm simply confusing iconic with popularity :loser:
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Regarding Yoko, it's worth seeking out the video of John Lennon playing with Chuck Berry, and about halfway through the vid, she starts caterwauling off to the side into the mike. Chuck gives John a death stare for the ages, and you can tell he's thinking, "You need to shut that b**** up, bro."
Never saw that, so had to Google. This has to be it:
YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9kgu71d81U)
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Hey, here's something to appreciate. On April 4, 1964, The Beatles made history by having all five of the Top 5 songs on the Billboard Hot 100 chart. It had never been done before, and I'm pretty sure it will never be done again. Music listening is just too fragmented today. There is no single group or artist with the popularity to have that many songs all that hot, all at the same time.
(https://www.billboard.com/files/styles/promo_650/public/media/beatles-top-5-chart-650.jpg)
That is both crazy and awesome. :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
The thing is, while songs like A Day in the Life and Strawberry Fields Forever are generally viewed as some of the best Beatles songs, they aren't well know such as Hey Jude or Yesterday in the eyes of the public, suggesting that there are others more iconic songs even if they aren't actually better (Twist and Shout, I Wanna Hold Your Hand...)
Or maybe i'm simply confusing iconic with popularity :loser:
I guess it all depends on who you talk to. I'm seeing way too many younger people who are clueless about the Beatles, and it makes me a bit sad.
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The thing is, while songs like A Day in the Life and Strawberry Fields Forever are generally viewed as some of the best Beatles songs, they aren't well know such as Hey Jude or Yesterday in the eyes of the public, suggesting that there are others more iconic songs even if they aren't actually better (Twist and Shout, I Wanna Hold Your Hand...)
Or maybe i'm simply confusing iconic with popularity :loser:
I'm not sure anything becomes iconic without being popular.
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I listened to some of Lennon's solo stuff this week (I forgot I had his best of on CD and had uploaded all of the songs to my iTunes years ago), and I have to admit that I had completely forgotten about (Just Like) Starting Over, which is a highly enjoyable tune. His cover of Stand by Me threw for a loop, as I have zero memory of ever having heard that prior to this week.
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(Just Like) Starting Over might be my favorite John Lennon solo song, no exaggeration. Every part of it is so beautiful, the melodies are remarkable. Yeah, I know that Imagine is iconic, I also love it to bits and think it has the best lyrics in the history of rock, but (Just Like) Starting Over is a masterpiece as well.
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Another list, this time from the BestEverAlbums site, showing the best rated Beatles songs (keep in mind some songs like Hey Jude, Paperback Writer and whatsoever aren't rated because they were released as singles):
95/100: A Day In The Life (also, the best rated song of all time in the site).
92/100: Eleanor Rigby, While My Guitar Gently Weeps, Something, Tomorrow Never Knows, Strawberry Fields Forever, In My Life.
91/100: Here Comes the Sun, Happiness is a Warm Gun, Yesterday.
90/100: Come Together, I'm Only Sleeping, LSD, For No One, Norwegian Wood, Golden Slumbers, You Never Give Me Your Money, I Am The Walrus, The End, Carry That Weight, Helter Skelter, Let It Be, Penny Lane, Help!
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Great top 25 if you ask me.
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Yep, it's hard to argue with most of those.
Also, even though it was technically a cover, I think Twist and Shout has to be one of their most well-known songs. That's a song that you have to be living in a cave to not know.
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Twist and Shout is much more well know than most of the songs there but it goes back to that quality/popularity discussion.
Personally, great rock song but not best Beatles songs worthy if narrowed down to 25 (and because they have so many great songs already ;)).
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Hey, here's something to appreciate. On April 4, 1964, The Beatles made history by having all five of the Top 5 songs on the Billboard Hot 100 chart. It had never been done before, and I'm pretty sure it will never be done again. Music listening is just too fragmented today. There is no single group or artist with the popularity to have that many songs all that hot, all at the same time.
(https://www.billboard.com/files/styles/promo_650/public/media/beatles-top-5-chart-650.jpg)
That is so cool! I'll bet my mom remembers that, it was right before her 14th birthday and she was a huge fangirl :lol
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Another list, this time from the BestEverAlbums site, showing the best rated Beatles songs (keep in mind some songs like Hey Jude, Paperback Writer and whatsoever aren't rated because they were released as singles):
95/100: A Day In The Life (also, the best rated song of all time in the site).
92/100: Eleanor Rigby, While My Guitar Gently Weeps, Something, Tomorrow Never Knows, Strawberry Fields Forever, In My Life.
91/100: Here Comes the Sun, Happiness is a Warm Gun, Yesterday.
90/100: Come Together, I'm Only Sleeping, LSD, For No One, Norwegian Wood, Golden Slumbers, You Never Give Me Your Money, I Am The Walrus, The End, Carry That Weight, Helter Skelter, Let It Be, Penny Lane, Help!
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Great top 25 if you ask me.
Good list. Pretty evenly split between Lennon and McCartney...
For all the praise it gets, I think there are better Beatles songs than DITL if I'm honest. It's really just two different songs separated by a big random orchestral flourish, I don't see what makes that so great. Also McCartneys part of the song is kinda weak in comparison with Lennons.
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I'll be honest, not very much of ANY of the Beatles' post-breakup solo stuff has moved me. They were all very talented, no question, but the magic was in them together, for me, with very few exceptions (Maybe I'm Amazed, Imagine).
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Hef, have you ever heard George Harrison's All Things Must Pass? If not, check it out. I admittedly was very late to the game in hearing it (I don't think I heard it in full till maybe 6-7 years ago), but it was worth the wait. Outstanding stuff on there. By far the best solo album by any of the four Beatles.
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For all the praise it gets, I think there are better Beatles songs than DITL if I'm honest. It's really just two different songs separated by a big random orchestral flourish, I don't see what makes that so great. Also McCartneys part of the song is kinda weak in comparison with Lennons.
I'm with you. That "big random orchestral flourish" you mentioned kinda kill the song for me even though the vocal melodies from the first part are fantastic.
Despite of that, ADITL still is in my top 20 Beatles songs but i do think there are better songs.
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Regarding Yoko, it's worth seeking out the video of John Lennon playing with Chuck Berry, and about halfway through the vid, she starts caterwauling off to the side into the mike. Chuck gives John a death stare for the ages, and you can tell he's thinking, "You need to shut that b**** up, bro."
Similar thing happened in the early 70s when John joined Frank Zappa and the Mothers on stage for a while at a show in NYC. Yoko was in some kind of sheet, all wrapped up, with a mike and just squawking and caterwauling like usual and she kept at it for about 30 minutes or so AFTER everyone left the stage. :rollin
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Yoko Johno and Franko (https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=175&v=LZfk0mCOX0k)
I've never seen these. I didn't think it was possible to dislike Yoko more than I already did. How did all the top tier musicians put up with this nonsense?
I also found another video of the Yoko Chucko fiasco with commentary. It is hilarious. NSFW
LiveLeak (https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=696_1358462552)
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How did all the top tier musicians put up with this nonsense?
I'm sure Lennon and Yoko were a package deal, so they put up with Yoko to play with Lennon. I can just imagine how much she'd get crushed on social media if clips like that happened live in 2015. :eek :eek :lol :lol
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Yoko Outro (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_Cycles)
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For all the praise it gets, I think there are better Beatles songs than DITL if I'm honest. It's really just two different songs separated by a big random orchestral flourish, I don't see what makes that so great. Also McCartneys part of the song is kinda weak in comparison with Lennons.
I'm with you. That "big random orchestral flourish" you mentioned kinda kill the song for me even though the vocal melodies from the first part are fantastic.
Despite of that, ADITL still is in my top 20 Beatles songs but i do think there are better songs.
Look, I totally understand that, and there are probably other reasons to add to the list. But this FIRMLY (in my opinion) is a discussion about the difference between "great" and "I like it" (or not). It's easy to dismiss as "a couple songs put together", but that's more a function of how the Beatles were starting to work than any "laziness" or lack of creativity. First, put yourself in early 1967, a time of a shit-ton of promise, but not a lot of delivery (yet). When you couple the fact that it doesn't sound like anything that came before, that it was the end-piece of an ALBUM that sounded like nothing that came before (what? They put the words on the back of the ALBUM? Who are all those people and why are the Beatles wearing those ridiculous outfits? Who is Billy Shears?) with the fact that it almost perfectly addresses the key concern of the times: we have these massive national and international problems ("I read the news today oh boy..."), but we still have to live each day as individuals, with the mundane task of keeping aware of what's going on ("Woke up... and I went into a dream..."). THEN you add to that the subversive (but arguably unintended) drug references ("I'd love to turn you on..."; "found my way upstairs and had a smoke..."), THEN you add the absolutely amazing recording process (the orchestra was recorded after the fact, to bridge the gaps in the song; Mal Evans had to count out - which you can faintly hear - to mark the spot between the end of the previous section and the start of the next section), THEN you add the most recognizable chord in the history of rock (the E major chord that ends the song... and not coincidentially, begins the Cheap Trick record, "All Shook Up")...
All in, what? Four minutes forty five seconds or something? Epic. The upshot? It was a B-SIDE.
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Hef, have you ever heard George Harrison's All Things Must Pass? If not, check it out. I admittedly was very late to the game in hearing it (I don't think I heard it in full till maybe 6-7 years ago), but it was worth the wait. Outstanding stuff on there. By far the best solo album by any of the four Beatles.
No, I haven't.
And despite your glowing review, I probably still won't. Sorry.
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For all the praise it gets, I think there are better Beatles songs than DITL if I'm honest. It's really just two different songs separated by a big random orchestral flourish, I don't see what makes that so great. Also McCartneys part of the song is kinda weak in comparison with Lennons.
I'm with you. That "big random orchestral flourish" you mentioned kinda kill the song for me even though the vocal melodies from the first part are fantastic.
Despite of that, ADITL still is in my top 20 Beatles songs but i do think there are better songs.
*snip*
Good words, Stadler. I appreciate your insight and analysis of the song, and it has made me appreciate it more.
I suppose everything should be considered in context, which funnily enough is something a lot of people are guilty of forgetting when it comes to the Beatles, or any other act or media etc ahead of its time. We take a lot of things for granted in retrospect without considering the impact and importance these things had at their inception.
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Hef, have you ever heard George Harrison's All Things Must Pass? If not, check it out. I admittedly was very late to the game in hearing it (I don't think I heard it in full till maybe 6-7 years ago), but it was worth the wait. Outstanding stuff on there. By far the best solo album by any of the four Beatles.
No, I haven't.
And despite your glowing review, I probably still won't. Sorry.
No need to apologize. It's your loss. :biggrin:
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I suppose everything should be considered in context, which funnily enough is something a lot of people are guilty of forgetting when it comes to the Beatles, or any other act or media etc ahead of its time. We take a lot of things for granted in retrospect without considering the impact and importance these things had at their inception.
You are not wrong, and those are good words. But at the same time, I don't evaluate music based on the context of the time it came out. My tastes are not dictated but impact, influence, or importance. If something was powerful and amazing at its release, and I think it blows, I am going to think it blows. I will recognize its historical significance, but it isn't going to affect my personal preferences.
So yes, things should be evaluated in context, to a degree. But when it comes to personal taste, I only care about how it makes me feel, and the level of enjoyment I derive from it, now.
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I suppose everything should be considered in context, which funnily enough is something a lot of people are guilty of forgetting when it comes to the Beatles, or any other act or media etc ahead of its time. We take a lot of things for granted in retrospect without considering the impact and importance these things had at their inception.
You are not wrong, and those are good words. But at the same time, I don't evaluate music based on the context of the time it came out. My tastes are not dictated but impact, influence, or importance. If something was powerful and amazing at its release, and I think it blows, I am going to think it blows. I will recognize its historical significance, but it isn't going to affect my personal preferences.
So yes, things should be evaluated in context, to a degree. But when it comes to personal taste, I only care about how it makes me feel, and the level of enjoyment I derive from it, now.
Which is why Stadler stated that : " But this FIRMLY (in my opinion) is a discussion about the difference between "great" and "I like it" (or not)."
We were not discussing liking ADITL at the personal level. It's about discussing its "greatness", which should always be put in context.
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I'm always so stumped when I encounter people that don't like the Beatles. I mean, they like rock music but not the Beatles. I know, I know, to each his own, but I just can't get it through my thick head... What's NOT to like? :angel:
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Beatles, eh? Ah, yes, I seem to remember their off-key caterwauling on the Sullivan show. What was Ed thinking?
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I suppose everything should be considered in context, which funnily enough is something a lot of people are guilty of forgetting when it comes to the Beatles, or any other act or media etc ahead of its time. We take a lot of things for granted in retrospect without considering the impact and importance these things had at their inception.
You are not wrong, and those are good words. But at the same time, I don't evaluate music based on the context of the time it came out. My tastes are not dictated but impact, influence, or importance. If something was powerful and amazing at its release, and I think it blows, I am going to think it blows. I will recognize its historical significance, but it isn't going to affect my personal preferences.
So yes, things should be evaluated in context, to a degree. But when it comes to personal taste, I only care about how it makes me feel, and the level of enjoyment I derive from it, now.
Interesting discussion. I find it difficult to evaluate music in a complete vacuum. It's easier to remove historical context, but not so much personal context. Sentimentality and emotion gets in the way of evaluating certain pieces of music that I grew up with, at least in an objective way. That pimply-faced 10 year old kid that holed himself up in his bedroom playing Abbey Road and Sgt Peppers over and over again is always going to have a soft spot for the music no matter how good or bad it may be. Kinda like that first puppy love or the first time you had sex. Even though it may have been clumsy and awkward, it still holds an extra special place in your heart and mind. When it comes to bands like Pink Floyd, Zeppelin and The Beatles, I was not just hearing the music, I was living it.
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Sentimentality and emotion gets in the way of evaluating certain pieces of music that I grew up with, at least in an objective way.
Oh I definitely agree with this. Art touches us all in uniquely, in different ways at different times in our lives.
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I suppose everything should be considered in context, which funnily enough is something a lot of people are guilty of forgetting when it comes to the Beatles, or any other act or media etc ahead of its time. We take a lot of things for granted in retrospect without considering the impact and importance these things had at their inception.
You are not wrong, and those are good words. But at the same time, I don't evaluate music based on the context of the time it came out. My tastes are not dictated but impact, influence, or importance. If something was powerful and amazing at its release, and I think it blows, I am going to think it blows. I will recognize its historical significance, but it isn't going to affect my personal preferences.
So yes, things should be evaluated in context, to a degree. But when it comes to personal taste, I only care about how it makes me feel, and the level of enjoyment I derive from it, now.
As erwinrafaeil already pointed out, see what I wrote in the first sentence: this is the difference between "great" and "I like it". You can absolutely think it blows and that is your right and no one can take that away from you, or argue with you. But - in my view - one strains credibility when they confuse the two. I think Bob Dylan is unlistenable. Literally. So I say that "Blowin' In The Wind" or "Blonde on Blonde" blow (i.e. I don't like them). But for me to also say they are not great songs/albums is ludicrous. They are iconic. They are the backbone of American music. What I think about them aesthetically doesn't matter one bit. I'm irrelevant.
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It's semantics. To me, if you say something blows, you're saying that it is no good. Since we're talking about music, it comes down to individual taste, and someone saying it is no good can basically be the same as "I don't like it", but while both are opinions, one sounds more like a statement of fact while the other is a statement of preference.
If I don't like something, I say I don't like it. I don't say it sucks or it blows (which oddly enough mean the same thing). All that does is piss off people who actually like it. I just say I don't like it.
Consider a sports analogy. You have a quarterback who's played in two games so far, completed 1 of 25 attempted passes, been intercepted 4 times, and has even fumbled the ball twice. The team has scored no points while he's in, and they currently have net yardage which is negative. If you say this guy blows, you will not get any argument. But if you say you like him, once people stop laughing, they'll ask you why. You apparently have your reasons, and the mere fact that they're asking you would seem to validate your position. You are allowed to like someone/something even if they suck. Conversely, you can dislike something other people think is great.
If there's a band which has sold 500 million albums (or whatever The Beatles are up to now), you can say you don't like them, but to say that they suck is just plain wrong. Clearly a huge number of people enjoy their work, and they are very successful recording artists by almost any standard. You just don't like them. Say you don't like them, but they definitely don't suck.
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Beatles are the Gods of music. End of story. Top 20, huh? Ok, (not including the Medley)
I Saw Her Standing There
She Loves You
Eight Days A Week
Ticket To Ride
Something
Dear Prudence
Blackbird
Rocky Raccoon
A Hard Day's Night
Help!
Let It Be
Across The Universe
Don't Let Me Down
I Am The Walrus
Strawberry Fields Forever
A Day In The Life (my favorite Beatles song)
Lucy In The Sky
Paperback Writer
Hey Jude
Lady Madonna
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Rocky Raccoon
:o that's an oddball choice! I always considered that filler (and there's quite a bit of that on the White Album, imo). Fair enough tho, you've inspired me to give it another listen!
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An oddball choice is Your Mother Should Know :P
Not really, but never seen anyone (besides me) who likes that song that much to put it in his top 20.
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The White Album is probably my favorite Beatles album.
If you think about it, Why Don't We Do It in the Road is deeper than the rap it gets. It's making the statement that you can often get away with something by just doing it in full on plain sight. I actually really love that song, and feel like people dismiss it too quickly.
Everything except Revolution #9 (which is just freakin crap) is actually really prime Beatles.
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An oddball choice is Your Mother Should Know :P
Not really, but never seen anyone (besides me) who likes that song that much to put it in his top 20.
That's a fantastic choice, would make my top 20 for sure, I just wish it were a bit longer, maybe another section or something but that might ruin the magic of it.
The White Album is probably my favorite Beatles album.
If you think about it, Why Don't We Do It in the Road is deeper than the rap it gets. It's making the statement that you can often get away with something by just doing it in full on plain sight. I actually really love that song, and feel like people dismiss it too quickly.
Everything except Revolution #9 (which is just freakin crap) is actually really prime Beatles.
There are some absolute gems on there but yeah I always felt it had its fair share of filler. I should give it a spin today.
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Same here. I would probably love The White Album if it was a single album with the strongest tracks like While My Guitar and Happiness is a Warm Gun.
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Rocky Raccoon has long been a favorite of mine from The White Album. Some days, it would make my Beatles top 20.
I've never cared much for Why Don't We Do It in the Road?
Revolution 9 is definitely total dog shit.
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The White Album always felt like the most filler album to me (for the latter phase of the Beatles).
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No such thing as filler when it comes to the Beatles. Even Revolution 9 isn't filler; it was just Lennon trying to do something different (but failing miserably).
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No such thing as filler when it comes to the Beatles. Even Revolution 9 isn't filler; it was just Lennon trying to do something different (but failing miserably).
Hmmmmm....
I got LOVE the other day from a second hand store. It was like $5 or something. Any one into that? I think its fantastic, great mash ups and stuff. Its like a nugget fest, picking out what elements of what song are being used at any given time. Great stuff.
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It was cool to hear, but while I still have it tucked away somewhere, I don't think I've listened to it since right after getting it when it first came out.
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No such thing as filler when it comes to the Beatles. Even Revolution 9 isn't filler; it was just Lennon trying to do something different (but failing miserably).
I agree. I do tend to take things too literally, but to me, "filler" is literally substandard songs which were included to fill out the album. The Beatles were having some issues, and a lot of the tracks on The Beatles were indeed basically solo tracks by the individual guys, but that gave each of them a chance to flex their wings a bit. I don't hear anything on that entire album that doesn't sound like they wanted it to be there.
Remember, back then, you were either in a group or you were a solo artist, period. Nowadays, various band members can go off and do solo projects or side projects or whatever, then the band gets back together in a year or two and makes another album, or goes on tour. For me, some of the fun of listening to The Beatles was figuring out (or just guessing) who wrote what. It's just a little easier here.
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It was cool to hear, but while I still have it tucked away somewhere, I don't think I've listened to it since right after getting it when it first came out.
I'm in between; it's not something I listen to regularly, but it is interesting, and it is fun to suss out the sources of parts and pieces.
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No such thing as filler when it comes to the Beatles. Even Revolution 9 isn't filler; it was just Lennon trying to do something different (but failing miserably).
Hmmmmm....
I got LOVE the other day from a second hand store. It was like $5 or something. Any one into that? I think its fantastic, great mash ups and stuff. Its like a nugget fest, picking out what elements of what song are being used at any given time. Great stuff.
Totally re-energizes the music. I think it's awesome and very creatively done. I reach for that just as much as for the rest of it.