I'll be mainly partaking in this thread when it is about the movies or TNG.
All discussion about Voyager, Enterprise or DS9 leaves me about as useless as Deanna Troi after she's "sensed" something.
My trekkie friends in school and I always joked about how Troi would only ever look worried then pass out or state the bleedin' obvious.
*Borg Ship appears*
Troi : I can sense you are anxious captain.
NO SHIT SHERLOCK :lol
That's pretty much true, really. I saw a thing on Discovery or History Channel or one of those about how sci-fi writers have "predicted" tech for the past century. But they turned it around, and what really happens is that inventors and R&D guys look to sci-fi for inspiration. The most well-known example is the waterbed, a concept which first appeared in a (I think it was) Heinlein novel. Sci-fi writers have come up with all kinds of cool stuff which may or may not be possible, and techies come up with a way to actually make them.
Except the 1973 Cell phone wouldn't fit in your pocket. :lol
Except the 1973 Cell phone wouldn't fit in your pocket. :lol
Yeah, 1993 would've been much closer.
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/1001874_703141423048647_1274028223_n.jpg)
Being contracted for four movies doesn't guarantee there will be four movies though, does it? It just means that if Paramount decide to do a 3rd/4th movie, that the cast is under contract to do them.
I'm hoping they stop at a third (I'd prefer they stop now, but since ID was popular, that isn't going to happen). It took them forever just to give us an empty rehash of old Trek, so I don't feel like they have much to offer other than yet another mindless action movie. I want JJ far away from Trek asap, so they can get a show started that is more in the spirit of Trek. It could be just what the dead scifi scene needs right now.
I miss scifi. :(
That is awesome news fo sho! :tup
Being contracted for four movies doesn't guarantee there will be four movies though, does it? It just means that if Paramount decide to do a 3rd/4th movie, that the cast is under contract to do them.
I'm hoping they stop at a third (I'd prefer they stop now, but since ID was popular, that isn't going to happen). It took them forever just to give us an empty rehash of old Trek, so I don't feel like they have much to offer other than yet another mindless action movie. I want JJ far away from Trek asap, so they can get a show started that is more in the spirit of Trek. It could be just what the dead scifi scene needs right now.
I miss scifi. :(
Well $450m means now more people enjoy Trek than ever before. And i'm totally fine with that.
Also, i've been a trek fan since I can remember and I adored Star Trek AND Into Darkness.
You don't have to watch the next one. I will see it on opening day and judge it on it's own merits like I have with the previous two films.
Plus it doesn't matter what I say or how much I liked them - i'll always be "wrong" according to Some people on this board who feel like they need to be right about everything.No, you're wrong.
Plus it doesn't matter what I say or how much I liked them - i'll always be "wrong" according to Some people on this board who feel like they need to be right about everything.No, you're wrong.
To be fair, that's not much of a benchmark. :lol
I also have no doubt that JJ's Star Wars are going to be a buttload better than the PT too. I actually have pretty high expectations for them. But I guess that's a discussion for the SW thread!
To be fair, that's not much of a benchmark. :lol
I also have no doubt that JJ's Star Wars are going to be a buttload better than the PT too. I actually have pretty high expectations for them. But I guess that's a discussion for the SW thread!
I'm expecting them to be even better than the ST reboot, because I fully believe what Simon Pegg said (I *think* it was Simon Pegg...might have been someone else)...that JJ's natural story telling style (and pace) is better suited to the natural flow of SW than ST. So as good as the ST reboot was, I have even higher expectations for the new SW movies.
I don't have as much of a hate on for Nemesis as most. Yeah, the B4 sub-plot was bad (as was the cinematography on the planet they found him... holy glare!). And while I love the Shinzon character and Hardy's acting, I agree completely that the believably of them being genetic clones was just not there. And the mind-rape between Troi and the other dude was dumb.
hhhmmm... the more I think about it, the shittier the movie gets!
gotta find some time to go thru DS9, Voyager and Enterprise from scratch.
:blush :blush
I like Nemesis.
I watched it again recently with no preconceptions and found myself enjoying it all the way through.
I found Insurrection quite boring actually.
Here's a quick poll :
Best TNG Movie Villain ?
1.Soran
2.Ru'afo
3.Borg Queen
4.Shinzon
Ya...and you even numbered them. And NOT in chronological order either. Wassup with that? :angel:
The Trekker OCD force is strong in this thread... :P
The Trekker OCD force is strong in this thread... :P
DCO are my intials ! :omg:
The Trekker OCD force is strong in this thread... :P
DCO are my intials ! :omg:
Oh the irony of having the initials be out of order. :rollin
Not really - i've shown i don't care for standard procedure.
I'm literally reverse OCD.
Not really - i've shown i don't care for standard procedure.
I'm literally reverse OCD.
Especially in the DT Cover Art thread! ;) You rebel, you...
My initials basically describe me :P
I don't have OCD - I go out of my way to *not* do things exactly right.
;D
My initials basically describe me :P
I don't have OCD - I go out of my way to *not* do things exactly right.
;D
hmmm...is that a compulsion with you..?
My initials basically describe me :P
I don't have OCD - I go out of my way to *not* do things exactly right.
;D
hmmm...is that a compulsion with you..?
Well I'm the type of person that doesn't like following trends. E.g. I've never smoked or been drunk. I've never worn what's "in". I'll never wear skintight jeans for example. Or vans, Converse etc.... I am sceptical of any kind of enforced conformity.
From anything I've heard, impersonations are Spiner's strong suit.
I liked when he got all pissy because Data was so materoffact about the bribe offer.
Great episode overall. The premise is a bit sketchy though (how much information can you seriously transmit if even a simple concept requires a long-winded simile?).
I got my hands on the entire DS9 series a couple of months ago and finished watching the series recently. For any of you that might have some reservations about checking the series out, I highly recommend it. At times it's on par with TNG and at it's worst is still superior to Voyager. Sisko is a little bit over the top at times and it takes some getting used to, but I was thoroughly entertained with the series and will probably watch it all the way through again in the not too distant future.
I got my hands on the entire DS9 series a couple of months ago and finished watching the series recently. For any of you that might have some reservations about checking the series out, I highly recommend it. At times it's on par with TNG and at it's worst is still superior to Voyager. Sisko is a little bit over the top at times and it takes some getting used to, but I was thoroughly entertained with the series and will probably watch it all the way through again in the not too distant future.
I plan to once I am done with TNG. :)
I put on Voyager every once in a while but unless it's a great episode - I just can't be bothered. None of the bridge crew have anything on their TNG counterparts.
Well at least they have an in-universe tech reason for it and don't just dismiss it like other inferior shows would.
besides - Worf *must* be speaking English for those times when he says a Klingon word to describe a situation and it isn't translated :lol
I really hated Riker at first.
I really hated Riker at first.
Admit it; it was the lack of beard, wasn't it?
Well at least they have an in-universe tech reason for it and don't just dismiss it like other inferior shows would.
If that's a dig at Stargate, imma hunt you down and force you to watch it on repeat! (another example where I just have to accept the contrivance for the sake of fitting any sort of story into 45 minutes)besides - Worf *must* be speaking English for those times when he says a Klingon word to describe a situation and it isn't translated :lol
There are plenty of similar situations that just don't work. And we know for a fact that the Ferengi of the show can't speak a lick of English from Little Green Men (which is a pretty neat episode too).
There are plenty of similar situations that just don't work. And we know for a fact that the Ferengi of the show can't speak a lick of English from Little Green Men (which is a pretty neat episode too).Watched this last night, coincidentally. Silly but entertaining. Interesting that throughout all of the Ferengi gibberish you still heard the word oomax, which is the one Ferengi word everybody knows. :lol
There are plenty of similar situations that just don't work. And we know for a fact that the Ferengi of the show can't speak a lick of English from Little Green Men (which is a pretty neat episode too).Watched this last night, coincidentally. Silly but entertaining. Interesting that throughout all of the Ferengi gibberish you still heard the word oomax, which is the one Ferengi word everybody knows. :lol
However, I thought that was a serious undermining of the UT. They suggest that they're placed inside everybody's ear, yet apparently only one person needs it for two way communication. Fixing the one in Quark's ear automatically makes humans capable of understanding his speech. Like plenty of ST tech, it was better when it was left vague and unexplained.
I work on realtime translation software for work actually, so it's kinda interesting to see you guys discuss this :lol
But yes, many inherent issues with a UT. Different word orders in languages dictate a minimum latency in translation. As an example, there is a much-hated-by-foreigners feature of German where you leave the verb to the very end of the sentence. E.g. "I have the apple that was on the table, the one bought yesterday ... eaten." Since English syntax requires the verb to appear much earlier, you can't start the English translation before you heard the last German word.
The only thing that would work would be a device that scans the brain of the speaker and utters the translation straight from the thought, v not through the spoken part.
Let alone completely untranslatable terms, like a cultural practice like "Ramadan". English was just forced to take the Arabic word wholesale because there was no possible English translation for it.
I recognise that ?
Even as a manual process, translating is difficult, because you're translating more than just words. When people speak a language, they're speaking within the confines of a specific cultural context, which includes assumed knowledge and familiarity that can't be translated automatically on the fly as the universal translator would imply.
It's exactly the point in the TNG episode Darmok. Even completely understanding the words, the meaning of the words was lost due to necessary assumed knowledge and cultural understanding.
Petition to change the thread title to
" Star Trek: The United Threaderation of Planets "
:lol
In Enterprise there was always a delay, where Hoshi would say that the UT hadn't had time to figure stuff out yet. That seems pretty reasonable. I suspect there's a data set that you could assemble which would be sufficient for a computer to learn English, for example. Certainly a computer 200 years from now. Probably fit on a floppy disk. A dictionary and 15-20 sentences demonstrating some syntax. "The boy is playing with the red ball." That sort of stuff. You transmit that, they transmit theirs, and after a minute or two the UTs have it all figured out. This seems pretty reasonable. Sometimes it make take longer. ST just treated the whole thing like magic. The aforementioned DS9 episode demonstrated that pretty damned well.
Petition to change the thread title to
" Star Trek: The United Threaderation of Planets "
:lol
I hate any episode of anything where it's a "romance" story.
The one where Riker falls for that androgynous alien is pretty poor too.
DS9 because there are Ferengi to mop up the holosuites when you're done.
If there was one character on TNG that didn't need to be there - it was Troi.
She did next to nothing except sense stuff or get mind raped :lol
She almost never went on away missions and they barely ever showed her counselling anyone.
Even in the films she was just sort of there in the background.
Nothing against Marina in any way but it's like they didn't really know what to do with her week after week.
If Troi was in her quarters - and she looked in the mirror - shit was about to happen. :rollin
She barely even had any character arc either.
One thing that TNG does really well is make you *HATE* alien races. :lol
Like - The Ferengi will offer something only so they can get what they want in return and when picard sees through the charade - they got offended and say how dare you !!! :lol
Or any time someone is in Federation space unlawfully and they hail the Enterprise first and demand to know what they want.
:P So irritating - but so good. They know how to write really annoying aliens :lol
Brent is probably 4th.
Brent is probably 4th.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dePPJxRXhT8
Watch Spiner's career die in that video clip.
DS9, in a heartbeat. TNG is too squeaky clean, I would develop fake Tourette's just so I could yell "Fuck! Shit!" down the hallways.
DS9 had the right amount of seediness to be interesting, but still tons of future amenities.
Brent is probably 4th.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dePPJxRXhT8
Watch Spiner's career die in that video clip.
Brent is probably 4th.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dePPJxRXhT8
Watch Spiner's career die in that video clip.
I laughed harder than I should've at that.
As for where I'd like to be, I'd say DS9 for all the same reasons Rumby mentioned. As for deep cleaning, I'm sure the holodeck can just use the transporter technology to get everything inside the room, and just dump it into space. Of course, that would get the galactic environmentalists after the Federation.
As for where I'd like to be, I'd say DS9 for all the same reasons Rumby mentioned. As for deep cleaning, I'm sure the holodeck can just use the transporter technology to get everything inside the room, and just dump it into space. Of course, that would get the galactic environmentalists after the Federation.
Can you imagine some alien race comes to a large nebula they've never seen before, and it just turns out it's the Federation's dumping ground for space-smile?
I'm surprised Voyager never did an episode where someone has a holo-baby.
It couldn't be any more preposterous than some of their other stories.
I don't want to start another " it's just another summer blockbuster" argument...^ Mainly because i've been a Trekker for almost 30 years and I loved both of them and i'm not alone in that. i know plenty of hard core Trekkers who also thought JJ's films were fantastic and that 2009 is as good as if not better than TWOK. I don't think it's better but it's up there...
I'm suprised Q was never in any of the TNG movies. I imagine that could've been interestingIt could have been cool - but with Q - you can pretty much do anything but always have a deus ex machina to get you out of it - which would be a danger
Why aren't I writing a Star Trek movie ? :lol
I just think there's a lot more going on thematically and plot wise in the last two films that your usual gung-ho action film.Well, maybe I was a bit harsh. But I do think there was too much emphasis on the big action sequences. They could have done with a bit less reliance on that and more of what I mentioned, I thought.
I laughed harder than I should've at that.
As for where I'd like to be, I'd say DS9 for all the same reasons Rumby mentioned. As for deep cleaning, I'm sure the holodeck can just use the transporter technology to get everything inside the room, and just dump it into space. Of course, that would get the galactic environmentalists after the Federation.
Can you imagine some alien race comes to a large nebula they've never seen before, and it just turns out it's the Federation's dumping ground for space-smile?
I laughed harder than I should've at that.
As for where I'd like to be, I'd say DS9 for all the same reasons Rumby mentioned. As for deep cleaning, I'm sure the holodeck can just use the transporter technology to get everything inside the room, and just dump it into space. Of course, that would get the galactic environmentalists after the Federation.
Can you imagine some alien race comes to a large nebula they've never seen before, and it just turns out it's the Federation's dumping ground for space-smile?
I don't think it gets beamed into space. More likely it gets sent back to the replicators.
It gets pumped into making people so why not food ? :neverusethis:
I have so many responses to that, but I'm just going to sit content that you made a joke involving semen.
I always took a sonic shower as just trying to make it sound more science fictiony. I don't recall seeing any attempted explanation as to how it works. Much like how "gigaquads" was their vague measurement of computer data storage so they didn't get laughed at in 20 years for choosing something small.
I always took a sonic shower as just trying to make it sound more science fictiony. I don't recall seeing any attempted explanation as to how it works. Much like how "gigaquads" was their vague measurement of computer data storage so they didn't get laughed at in 20 years for choosing something small.
:lol I love thinking back to my first ever computer - which was an Acorn Electron and I think it has a 52kb memory or something riduculously small by today's standards.
Edit : 32kb ! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acorn_Electron
It's the same as Sci-fi..
If you're gonna make a film in the future - either don't put a date on it OR make it so far in the future that it won't matter.
It's when films put " in 2019 AD " and it's all flying cars etc. Just don't do it.
It's 2015 in 18 months and we're still no closer to flying cars or hoverboards.
Sci fi films should just say " In the distant future.. . "
I always thought Khaaaaaaan! was Kirk pretending so that Khan thought he had won - when in reality - The Enterprise was waiting to beam them all up.
JJ didn't kill Star Trek, he just made it popular by making it not really Star Trek. I'll take Voyager over JJ's empty Big Mac of a movie franchise any day. Enterprise was the series that wore out the franchise and killed it off, and they didn't even really want to make that, the networks wanted that.I certainly agree about Voyager topping the Abram's fair. I don't think Enterprise killed the franchise as much as just plain old saturation. Enterprise certainly could have been much, much better, but a pretty good hiatus between Voyager, which was already not sitting well with the diehards, would have certainly helped their cause. For that matter, I think Voyager's biggest issue might have been being the follow up to the immensely popular DS9. It's not a bad show at all. People just got hooked on the greatly inferior TNG and the greatly superior DS9. Voyager just slipped in there and didn't click.
People just got hooked on the greatly inferior TNGWait, what?
Greatly inferior? Yeah okay.JJ didn't kill Star Trek, he just made it popular by making it not really Star Trek. I'll take Voyager over JJ's empty Big Mac of a movie franchise any day. Enterprise was the series that wore out the franchise and killed it off, and they didn't even really want to make that, the networks wanted that.I certainly agree about Voyager topping the Abram's fair. I don't think Enterprise killed the franchise as much as just plain old saturation. Enterprise certainly could have been much, much better, but a pretty good hiatus between Voyager, which was already not sitting well with the diehards, would have certainly helped their cause. For that matter, I think Voyager's biggest issue might have been being the follow up to the immensely popular DS9. It's not a bad show at all. People just got hooked on the greatly inferior TNG and the greatly superior DS9. Voyager just slipped in there and didn't click.
I'll play devil's advocate here and just say that TNG and Voyager are more like brother and sister with their highly variable quality issues and similarly episodic content. When you really get down to it, there aren't that many differences between the shows aside from the fact that, despite opening with one season of irredeemable shit, TNG has some episodes that are true classics, the kind that stand up to the test of time and are still good today. Does Voyager? I like some Voyager but I can't think of any episodes that could qualify as 'classics.'The best of TNG was better than the best of Voyager. On average, Voyager was the better show. As I've stated numerous times before, the distinction is the horribly uninteresting and inhuman Roddenberry idealizations of people. Once he croaked and we got real characters, the shows improved, even if the stories weren't always as good.
TNG does get kind of a free pass for successfully bringing Trek back to television, but at its best, it was much better than the best of Voyager.
I guess I'm still too old-fashioned about some things. I just don't understand why every show has to have a recurring bad guy and/or a continuing story arc. There seem to no longer be any truly episodic television shows, where each episode tells a self-contained story, and it's good because we already know the characters and thus they don't have spend a lot of time dealing with that. Yes, there are a couple of standalone episodes here and there, then it's time to return to the "main" bad guy, or have another episode which advances, sometimes only slightly, the ongoing story arc.Episodic television still exists, the difference is it doesn't dominate like it used to. Which is good, IMO. It's nice to have a bit of variety now and again. :)
Is this because television has evolved and become more sophisticated? Or simply because some people like to think so?
Except Voyager didn't really have interesting characters to balance that out except for maybe Tuvok, the Doctor, Seven and (depending upon the day of the week) Janeway. Torres was alright too, I guess, but Chakotay, Kim and Paris were incredibly boring and wasted potential. When you think about it, that's about the same amount of boring to not boring that TNG had.I'll play devil's advocate here and just say that TNG and Voyager are more like brother and sister with their highly variable quality issues and similarly episodic content. When you really get down to it, there aren't that many differences between the shows aside from the fact that, despite opening with one season of irredeemable shit, TNG has some episodes that are true classics, the kind that stand up to the test of time and are still good today. Does Voyager? I like some Voyager but I can't think of any episodes that could qualify as 'classics.'The best of TNG was better than the best of Voyager. On average, Voyager was the better show. As I've stated numerous times before, the distinction is the horribly uninteresting and inhuman Roddenberry idealizations of people. Once he croaked and we got real characters, the shows improved, even if the stories weren't always as good.
TNG does get kind of a free pass for successfully bringing Trek back to television, but at its best, it was much better than the best of Voyager.
Except Voyager didn't really have interesting characters to balance that out except for maybe Tuvok, the Doctor, Seven and (depending upon the day of the week) Janeway. Torres was alright too, I guess, but Chakotay, Kim and Paris were incredibly boring and wasted potential. When you think about it, that's about the same amount of boring to not boring that TNG had.Which is still more than the interesting characters TNG had. Piccard and Data are the only two really good ones, and the only one that actually has real human personality is Riker. Worf didn't become worth a shit until DS9, really, and he was always a bit of a pussy for a Klingon. Geordi, both Crushers and the TNG O'Brien were all worthless and Troi might be the worst ST character ever. Paris was decent, although I agree with Rumbo about the silly Tores thing (although that's not even in the same universe as Worf/Troi). Kim actually demonstrated some real character development over the series.
Started DS9 now.
Watching it chronologically instead of dipping in and out like with TNG ( seen em all so often ).
On Episode 3 now.
Started DS9 now.
Watching it chronologically instead of dipping in and out like with TNG ( seen em all so often ).
On Episode 3 now.
The Duras Sisters were terrible characters. Including them in Generations was perhaps the biggest blunder of a fairly average film.
The Duras Sisters were terrible characters. Including them in Generations was perhaps the biggest blunder of a fairly average film.
And if I recall, Quark had access codes for every bit of the station, anyway.
Started DS9 now.
Watching it chronologically instead of dipping in and out like with TNG ( seen em all so often ).
On Episode 3 now.
As skydivingninja also said, DS9 really has to be watched in order anyway. I actually don't find it that enjoyable to pick and choose individual episodes from DS9 anyway, but there is a huge payoff for watching it all in order. :tup
When DS9 first started, I checked it out. It felt like a weak spin-off from TNG, which it was, and TNG was also still on the air, so I gave up on it. My understanding is that DS9 eventually found its feet and is now regarded quite highly, and I hope to someday get around to watching it all.
I actually liked the Geordi/Data thing. Bashir/O'Brien picked it up later, but TNG was the first to portray the most basic relationship of them all; friendship. All the other relationships always had some angle to them, most of them sexual. Whereas realistically, most human interactions rely on friendship, not sexual interest.I disagree. The Kirk/Spock/McCoy thing was based on friendship more than anything else. Particularly by the time the movies came around.
Nobody here is likely to say that Voyager was as good as DS9 (except maybe Blob). That said, the first 9 episodes of Voy were better than DS9's.
Not to me, honestly. Whatever happened between Kirk/Spock/McCoy was interesting, but I don't know what friendships work that way. Geordi/Data was the "live and let live" that defines friendships.
When DS9 first started, I checked it out. It felt like a weak spin-off from TNG, which it was, and TNG was also still on the air, so I gave up on it. My understanding is that DS9 eventually found its feet and is now regarded quite highly, and I hope to someday get around to watching it all.I was the exact same way.
When Voyager started, it was the only Star Trek, and it was new. It was exciting, with the promise of new adventures in the fare quadrant and all that. I somehow watched all seven seasons of Voyager in original broadcast, even though sometimes it seemed like I was disappointed at least as often as I was impressed.
- When Paris starts it it backfires and they all HIT THE DECK cuz, you know, they have no idea what an internal combustion engine is
- When Paris starts it it backfires and they all HIT THE DECK cuz, you know, they have no idea what an internal combustion engine is
No knowledge of combustion engine but they know what a gunshot is?
Totally gonna watch this later. ;D
Actually, that was a pretty funny joke. Everybody hit the dirt except Tuvok who went straight into phaser mode.- When Paris starts it it backfires and they all HIT THE DECK cuz, you know, they have no idea what an internal combustion engine is
No knowledge of combustion engine but they know what a gunshot is?
I was under the impression that "black" was perfectly fine and "coloured" was the one to avoid.
..Apart from the obvious, sadly still used words...
An Intrepid-class vessel capable of holding 200 crew members, the U.S.S. Voyager NCC-74656 is one of the fastest and most powerful starships in Starfleet.
Although only 345 meters long, about half the size of the U.S.S. Enterprise NCC-1701-D, Voyager is more technologically advanced than previous Starfleet vessels. Superbly equipped for exploration and research, Voyager has an equally impressive array of defensive and offensive weapons, making it ready for action.
The U.S.S. Voyager is the second of only four Intrepid-class starships built by Starfleet to date, launched in 2371 on stardate 48038.5.
Shoulda put some random person under the saucer section or something for referenceYou probably wouldn't be able to see a person from the range that the ship needs to be.
I'm a bit pickyI would never have thought that about you.
I'm a doctor, not a...
Trolololololol.
Finally : There's a new comic series coming out explaining Nu-Khan's background in the new universe. Perhaps they'll retcon an explanation for his new appearance. Bob Orci didn't rule it out.
Maybe they had a backstory for him and a reason for his appearance but didn't have enough screen time to fit it in.
[inb4 dey had 2 make rooom for da explosions !!!11one !11 !! ]
One day I should do my countdown of best alien vag-faces. I swear the make-up department had bets on who could get something most resembling a vagina on screen via someone's face.
One day I should do my countdown of best alien vag-faces. I swear the make-up department had bets on who could get something most resembling a vagina on screen via someone's face.
(https://meredithandtimwatchstartrek.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/garack1.png)
One day I should do my countdown of best alien vag-faces. I swear the make-up department had bets on who could get something most resembling a vagina on screen via someone's face.
(https://meredithandtimwatchstartrek.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/garack1.png)
That one wouldn't even make the top 20. :lol You should check out George Costanza's whopper in the Voyager episode "Think Tank".
Good good - i'm passed those episodes.
Man I hated Vedek Winn :lol - she was the typical - bossy woman in power is total bitch trope.
Man I hated Vedek Winn :lol - she was the typical - bossy woman in power is total bitch trope.Man, she hasn't even made Kai yet. You're really gonna hate her in a couple of seasons. Fortunately, she's actually a pretty strong character until season 7, when her story becomes a bit silly.
Ok - back to DS9.Believe me, Winn is far more complex than that. While it's true she does get off on the power she gains as Kai, it's also true that she's 100% devoted to the Prophets. Her biggest flaw isn't her designs for power, but her jealousy of the fact that the Prophets are more interested in Cisko than the Bajoran spiritual leader. Like I said, she's really a damn good character.
I do get a bit tired of " all religion is bad and anyone who believes them are all psycho nutcases " - but I think with Vedek Winn -
- they were perhaps trying to show that religious people with power just abuse that power and don't necessarily even believe
what they force on people - they're using it as an excuse to use gain more power.
Speaking of the political map in the ST universe, have any of you ever tried to tie any of the civilizations in the shows to countries in our own time on earth? I'd be interested in seeing if any of you guys have any ideas about this. For example, are the Klingons supposed to be representative of modern day Russia ect. ect...
Ok - back to DS9.DS9 put a lot of emphasis in showing the Bajoran religion as a positive through Kira and other side characters. How do you see the show presenting it so one sided? It just didn't shy away from how religion can be abused or skewed, but on a base Bajorans were presented as a peaceful people, a reflection of their unified religion, that suffered greatly. Also, Winn, as El Barto pointed out, is a lot more complex than you're giving her credit for.
I do get a bit tired of " all religion is bad and anyone who believes them are all psycho nutcases " - but I think with Vedek Winn -
- they were perhaps trying to show that religious people with power just abuse that power and don't necessarily even believe
what they force on people - they're using it as an excuse to use gain more power.
I should have been a bit more explicit in my post. I was talking mostly about TNG. Because the races in TNG almost had no relation to their TOS counterparts.I don't see much of a difference between the Romulans in the two series. The Klingons might or might not be different, as their mythos was never explored at all in TOS. They still found honor in battle, as evidenced by Kor, but otherwise none of the Viking influence that TNG/DS9 fleshed out.
Good good - i'm passed those episodes.
I think Geordi's character was "average Star Trek fan". Nerdy with super-nerd friends, and having a hard time with the opposite sex.yeah, reasonable assessment. He was also the series flackboy; every TOS redshirt rolled into one. Both of those descriptions also apply to Kim, BTW.
The other thing that I realised is that Odo's Comm badge shape shifts with him. He had to practice really hard to make hair - so I doubt it's a working part of his body :P
Pfft, combadge. Much more interesting to think about is how sex between Kira and him worked!
He can shapeshift into any size/shape he wants, and he doesn't have any human limitations, so could go forever. I assume the sex worked pretty well. :lolAssuming he suddenly didn't have to erm 'revert to liquid form.' :neverusethis:
I think his shoes morphed, though. :lolThe other thing that I realised is that Odo's Comm badge shape shifts with him. He had to practice really hard to make hair - so I doubt it's a working part of his body :P
They even had a time he was hiding as a wall, then shapeshifting out and immediately used the commbadge! So it's definitely not just a visual reproduction of one. They messed up on that. At least they got the clothes correct when he became a shapeshifter again and turned into a bird. I was half expecting them to ignore it and have the clothes morph with him.
There were other issues with the combadge anyway. Take this convo:
*Picard pushes conbadge*
"Picard to LaForge, meet me in transporter room 3"
Immediate response heard through Picard's combadge: "Aye, captain."
https://www.uproxx.com/gammasquad/2013/09/j-j-abrams-will-not-direct-next-star-trek/I can see a new guy wanting to do a real ST movie, rather than Transformers with familiarly named characters, and it bombing because the people who adore the reboot will hate it. End of franchise.
I re-watched it recently and I didn't really find it all that slow. It breathes and takes it's time rather than beating you over the head with boredom.
I don't remember that scene specifically. All I can recall is Kirk boarding Enterprise and then telling Decker to F off and then leaving spaceport :lol
Here's what really sucks. Mankind, being relatively primitive yet insatiably curious, sends out a bunch of rather crude probes with the incredibly naive instructions to "learn all that is learnable." By the God-damnedest stroke of luck, one of them stumbles through a black hole and pops up in front of advanced aliens who are sympathetic to it's cause, and build into it the capability of actually fulfilling it's dramatically overambitious mission. It spends 200 years traveling the galaxy, destroying everything it encounters while accumulating a library of data so large it's unfathomable. Not only does it possess the combined knowledge of the galaxy, it's steadfastly determined to see every bit of that data delivered back to Earth. And when it's finally time to unload all of that information, it up and changes it's mind and disappears off to God knows where, never to be seen again. If it had actually done what it was supposed to do, we could have been on par with The Q by the time TNG rolled around.
In the 23rd century, Will Decker is history's biggest asshole.
Meh. I've always liked it. As you say - it's funny that people bash nu-trek for being all flash and action but they also bash TMP for being all story and character.
TMP is easily better than Search For Spock, Final Frontier & Insurrection in my book.
I probably rank TMP number 3, overall. The original release sucked, but the revised edition made it all make sense. Only complaints are that the flyby took too long, and they didn't elaborate more on Spock's situation. Still the Kirk/Decker rivalry was excellent.
In looking for my previous rankings, I found this which I posted a year or two ago. Funny when you rediscover interesting ideas.QuoteHere's what really sucks. Mankind, being relatively primitive yet insatiably curious, sends out a bunch of rather crude probes with the incredibly naive instructions to "learn all that is learnable." By the God-damnedest stroke of luck, one of them stumbles through a black hole and pops up in front of advanced aliens who are sympathetic to it's cause, and build into it the capability of actually fulfilling it's dramatically overambitious mission. It spends 200 years traveling the galaxy, destroying everything it encounters while accumulating a library of data so large it's unfathomable. Not only does it possess the combined knowledge of the galaxy, it's steadfastly determined to see every bit of that data delivered back to Earth. And when it's finally time to unload all of that information, it up and changes it's mind and disappears off to God knows where, never to be seen again. If it had actually done what it was supposed to do, we could have been on par with The Q by the time TNG rolled around.
In the 23rd century, Will Decker is history's biggest asshole.
And actually...that's what makes Shatner's idea of it being "The Birth of the Borg" an even better idea. Would have made a great idea for a film of its own...but I doubt they'd want to give Shat credit for the idea.A couple of problems there. On several occasions the Borg were established canonically as being around long before the events in TMP. Coincidentally, I watched one of them just today during lunch. The Vaudwar (VOY) had dealings with them in our 15th century. At that point they were just getting started. Also, the events of FC also contradict that. The Borg existed before Zephram Cocharan's test flight; hence their attempt to send a signal to the Borg of that century.
The scenario I had always envisioned was that it was the Borg who repaired V'Ger and sent it on it's merry way. As I recall, Spock's description of the aliens who repaired it bare a striking resemblance to the Borg, and they both share a similar goal.
The scenario I had always envisioned was that it was the Borg who repaired V'Ger and sent it on it's merry way. As I recall, Spock's description of the aliens who repaired it bare a striking resemblance to the Borg, and they both share a similar goal.
I would wonder why the Borg would do such a thing though. I know they've been a bit inconsistent, but typically they ignore technology that is beneath them (and I'm sure a 20th century earth probe would be beneath the Borg in an era of warp capable civilizations).
The only scenario I could think of is that they wanted to see where it came from, in the hopes of finding a more advanced civilization.
The scenario I had always envisioned was that it was the Borg who repaired V'Ger and sent it on it's merry way. As I recall, Spock's description of the aliens who repaired it bare a striking resemblance to the Borg, and they both share a similar goal.
I would wonder why the Borg would do such a thing though. I know they've been a bit inconsistent, but typically they ignore technology that is beneath them (and I'm sure a 20th century earth probe would be beneath the Borg in an era of warp capable civilizations).
The only scenario I could think of is that they wanted to see where it came from, in the hopes of finding a more advanced civilization.
I disagree. I think if you think like the Borg...they would view it as a machine needing another machines help. Granted, it seems they would want to assimilate rather than just send it on its merry way...but we only see that attitude in relation to organic lifeforms.
Do the Borg exist after the First Contact time line ?
Does the Borg Queen just live on - whatever happens ?
Is it the same actress ? Do they explain it ? Is it a new Queen with the same face or the same Queen ?
Does William Shatner tweet one word at a time?
Does William Shatner tweet one word at a time?
Does William Shatner tweet one word at a time?
No...........he...........tweets...........one..........word..........at a time!
And how did JJ shit all over Voyager and DS9 ? It's 100 years before all that - in a different timeline.
I still think they could retie it to the prime u universe if they ever wanted. They've traveled back in time before (by going around the sun), just do it again. Has been done before many times, but it could be a classic "fix the past" episode.
I wish that Benicio got the job. Not to take anything away from Benedict but I think Del Toro would have been an amazing Khan.
I don't know why they kept Admiral Marcus a secret until the film came out.
Did they think that Marcus = Carol Marcus = Khan ?
That guy you mentioned even looks & sounds a bit like Montalban.
They should have known the game was up when they started casting latino actors to play " John Harrison " :lol
Can we at least agree that the worst thing about the JJ movies is Simon Pegg ? :hat
He acts nothing like Doohan did at all - and he's just Pegg being Pegg with a rubbish Scots accent.
It seems like Kirk, Spock & Bones were all perfectly cast and acted and the other 4 were all name only - Sulu came closest to the original Sulu and it would be cool to see him get his own ship in one of the movies.
I like whoever played Old Spock. He looked and sounded identical to the original. :neverusethis:
I thought Karl had the perfect amount of imitation vs acting...
I really can't imagine anyone else playing Bones as well as he does and whenever he has a line - it just IS Bones.
But yeah - they could have *at least* given Anton Yelchin the same hair as Walter Koenig. WHat's up with his curly quiff thing ?
I loved KU in Xena :eyebrows:
Just thinking of it now, was there any explanation in the movie why Carol Marcus had a British accent while Admiral Marcus is an American?Alternate timeline, duh.
In a deleted scene it was revealed that in this new timeline - Admiral Marcus moved to London and Carol grew up there instead.
I loved KU in Xena :eyebrows:
In a deleted scene it was revealed that in this new timeline - Admiral Marcus moved to London and Carol grew up there instead.
Does that mean there were deleted scenes, but they didn't include them on the DVD/Bluray?
In a deleted scene it was revealed that in this new timeline - Admiral Marcus moved to London and Carol grew up there instead.
Does that mean there were deleted scenes, but they didn't include them on the DVD/Bluray?
Apparently so. Also there was a cut scene involving Kirk asking Uhura to patch Scotty thru the ship to his communicator.
That would have saved all those snide " fnar fnar - so you can just phone people across light years now ? "
Just wondering. Did you like Into Darkness more than you disliked it ?
I've been watching Star Trek for 30 years and I adored the last two films. :dunno:Not something I said or suggested.
And I hate stupid brainless action films with no plot.Not something I said or suggested.
Guess I must not be a real Trekker. :dunno:Not something I said or suggested.
Is the Vengeance on there? I'd like to know how big that monstrosity is supposed to be. Awful, awful ship.
Is the Vengeance on there? I'd like to know how big that monstrosity is supposed to be. Awful, awful ship.
Uss Vengeance is 1400m long. Which is like a mm on that chart.
I love Uss Vengeance :dunno: . I love the design and the look of it.
" He attacks Spock’s ship, but the red matter creates a black hole that sends both ships back in time (of course it does)."
Yep. It's fiction.
But that scene was not in the final film.That seems to happen a lot. Doesn't it seem to you that perhaps all that time Kirk spent running from whatever sort of frost troll he found on the Spock planet might have been better spent on the plot elements that wound up on the cutting room floor?
But that scene was not in the final film.That seems to happen a lot. Doesn't it seem to you that perhaps all that time Kirk spent running from whatever sort of frost troll he found on the Spock planet might have been better spent on the plot elements that wound up on the cutting room floor?
Yeah, that still happens on the newer series. Naomi Wildman was quite a bit younger than the actress that played her, and the younger Borg chick was even older. Like BVD said, I hardly notice it anymore.
What really jumps out is the old classics, where they'd get midgets to play kids to avoid child labor laws. Spartacus might be the worst offender in that regard. It's actually pretty creepy when they show big familial settings in their camps and it's full of 20 year old looking toddlers.
And how old was Miri supposed to be, anyway? I always assumed she was supposed to be 16 or so, which is hardly a big deal to be portrayed by a youngish looking 20 yo. If they describer her as 12 or something I could see your point.
Yeah, that still happens on the newer series. Naomi Wildman was quite a bit younger than the actress that played her, and the younger Borg chick was even older. Like BVD said, I hardly notice it anymore.
What really jumps out is the old classics, where they'd get midgets to play kids to avoid child labor laws. Spartacus might be the worst offender in that regard. It's actually pretty creepy when they show big familial settings in their camps and it's full of 20 year old looking toddlers.
And how old was Miri supposed to be, anyway? I always assumed she was supposed to be 16 or so, which is hardly a big deal to be portrayed by a youngish looking 20 yo. If they describer her as 12 or something I could see your point.
I recall they get the disease once they hit puberty or something like that? I think she was supposed to be pretty young. It would have been too creepy to have anyone much younger for the part anyway imo, given Kirk's scenes with her.
I just skimmed Miri, and I think there are a couple of midgets in there too, which would explain why that episode creeps me out. :lol
I have a challenge for El Barto & Blob :lolI have no desire to go piece by piece ( :metal) through the movie, but I will certainly give you an overview. I didn't hate either of them. The aspects I liked remained the same through both of them, which is most of the characterizations. With one or two notable exceptions I thought the way it was cast and the use of the characters was good. I also enjoyed a lot of the jokes and callbacks. Overall I thought they'd both be enjoyable films to watch in a light-hearted sort of way were I not so annoyed by its trying to be something that it clearly isn't.
List everything about 2009 & Into Darkness that you enjoyed.
I'll list things I didn't like about them.
So, I've been trying to watch TAS because it's the only series I never completely watched. Man, it's so bad.
So, I've been trying to watch TAS because it's the only series I never completely watched. Man, it's so bad.
I first saw TOS a few of years ago, so I judge it for what it is, not through any rose tinted glasses of nostalgia. That's not being jaded, that's just judging it for what I see. I shouldn't have to be a kid to appreciate science fiction.
From what I've seen Blob, you judge it based on comparisons with modern programs. I don't think we're talking about rose colored glasses of nostalgia (though I like the metaphor). I think we're talking about viewing it objectively without it having to compete with DS9 or BG.
Jammin, are you talking about TOS or TAS? I have never heard anybody say that TOS was supposed to have been a kid's show.
But I am viewing it objectively, and just judging it for what it is, rather than giving it a free pass for being an old show. I watched this before DS9, and after Voyager (and I have no interest in BG), but I'm judging it as a self contained entity, and the plots of many individual episodes are just ridiculous. There's just no way I can take American Constitution planet or Nazi planet seriously.That's my point. If I judge The Good, the Bad and the Ugly or The Big Country based on modern standards I'd find them equally laughable. Public hangings? Complete lack of public order? Thankfully I don't and consider them exceptional films.
By an objective comparison, the show largely looks very silly these days imo. There are some episodes that are genuinely great Trek (and it's undeniably classic scifi), but I seriously laugh my ass off through about 90% of the episodes.
But I am viewing it objectively, and just judging it for what it is, rather than giving it a free pass for being an old show. I watched this before DS9, and after Voyager (and I have no interest in BG), but I'm judging it as a self contained entity, and the plots of many individual episodes are just ridiculous. There's just no way I can take American Constitution planet or Nazi planet seriously.That's my point. If I judge The Good, the Bad and the Ugly or The Big Country based on modern standards I'd find them equally laughable. Public hangings? Complete lack of public order? Thankfully I don't and consider them exceptional films.
By an objective comparison, the show largely looks very silly these days imo. There are some episodes that are genuinely great Trek (and it's undeniably classic scifi), but I seriously laugh my ass off through about 90% of the episodes.
Also, all of the other series have equally stupid plots. Were the dinosaur or Janeway/Paris lizard humping episodes really any worse than The Omega Glory? (The Nazi episode actually had a perfectly decent explanation, so I won't count that one).
The animation itself is pretty bad. That's the worst part. The stories themselves and the (voice) acting is on par with the rest of the original series.
Man, is there anything in the ST world as anti-climactic as the end of Enterprise season 3, when they destroy the Xindi weapon and wind up in some silly-ass Nazi thing instead of returning home? Christ, not every season has to end with a cliffhanger.
Still waiting for Blob to tell us all what he *did* like about Into Darkness... :lol
I don't think Kai Winn had a single redeeming quality. I think I'd have to put her into a top 10 list of reprehensible ST characters.
The best "bad guys" are always the ones who are intelligent and have their own goals, which sometimes even align with our own. That's so much better than one-dimensional "evil just because muah-ha-ha!" type villains.Which makes it ambiguous as to whether or not they're even a bad guy at all. Shran comes to mind.
Every character Jeffrey Combs does is gold. I can never get enough of him in TV or film.
Yeah, Shran and the doctor were definitely the two best characters on Ent. I know that somewhere in season 4, probably related to that thing with the blind romulans, he loses his ship and remarks that once an Andorian loses a ship he commands it's pretty much game over for his career. That would have been the writers setting him up to become a regular the next season (although I'm not real sure how they would have played that).
As for Jeffrey Combs, I always found it difficult to separate ST characters from ST actors. Put another way, is it JC that made Shran a great character, or was it the writing? I suspect he has a great deal to do with the characterization, but at the same time Brunt never really amused me much. Anybody actually remember him as Tiron, Plenk or Krem? I guess I just never really think of it as "man, that Jeffrey Combs is awesome!", in as much as I think that Shran and Weyoun are awesome. I certainly give him credit for being a huge part of the reason for that, but it's still how I tend to see things.
Also, from what people were saying online, I expected literally no character development and all explosions and action. I was pleasantly surprised at how much character development took place, how often they slowed things down and actually talked.
Also, from what people were saying online, I expected literally no character development and all explosions and action. I was pleasantly surprised at how much character development took place, how often they slowed things down and actually talked.It was certainly an improvement over 2009. Still, there was a helluva lot of time spent on chase scenes, fight scenes, people blasting across space scenes. There were also plenty of plot and character elements they glossed over. I think this was a much better effort, but it still would have benefited greatly from knocking 10 minutes of gee-whiz special effects and devoting it the story. The other thing is that it's paced for all of that action. Yes, there was more dialog and story happening, but part of that was because it was all moving by so quickly.
I said right after 2009 that this cast would be excellent in a TV series. I'd love to see it. However, I was of the impression that none of them would go for it. Add to that, I agree that Orci being in charge would likely be a disaster.
There's also word that a new Trek series is possibly going ahead with Orci in charge, set in the new universe. If you got me to describe the absolute worst case scenario for Star Trek, that would be it. Lets get the guy who can't even write a coherent 2 hour scifi movie to be in charge of one of the longest running scifi franchises!
I said right after 2009 that this cast would be excellent in a TV series. I'd love to see it. However, I was of the impression that none of them would go for it. Add to that, I agree that Orci being in charge would likely be a disaster.
There's also word that a new Trek series is possibly going ahead with Orci in charge, set in the new universe. If you got me to describe the absolute worst case scenario for Star Trek, that would be it. Lets get the guy who can't even write a coherent 2 hour scifi movie to be in charge of one of the longest running scifi franchises!
I really don't want another Trek show. Plus whilst I thought that Scotty was *better* in Into Darkness - he was still nothing like Doohan's scotty at all.
Leave my nuts out of this! :hat
Call me crazy but I prefer waiting 3-4 years for a new movie than waiting 6 -12 months for a cliffhanger to be resolved...
Blob is too busy to list all the things he enjoyed about STID.
Never too busy to put it down though ;)
Can I fart glitter too???
Can I fart glitter too???
I've seen people complain about this one, but it doesn't bother me at all. Warp drive has always been reasonably handwavy, and the warp drive leaving behind some kind of "condensation trail" is as good as any other visual effect.
Most pay off and some don't when they resolve it too fast but for the most part all cliffhangers are awesome.My experience with most of the TNG cliffhangers was that the first half was always great, and the second half was a huge letdown. This was the case with almost all of their 2 parters. I don't recall many cliffhangers with DS9.
Like Locutus of Borg.
Blob is too busy to list all the things he enjoyed about STID.
Never too busy to put it down though ;)
To be fair, I actually mentioned something I did like as well as what I didn't like in that post.
But if you're that desperate for my approval of Into Darkness-
*The actors did a great job all around, and the characters were used better, and Scotty was utilized very well this time despite not even being on the Enterprise for the bulk of the movie. He was dedicated to the ship, and drank a lot. What more could you want? :lol
*They did a good job developing the Kirk/Spock friendship (although I don't think one movie was enough for the ending to work emotionally)
*The communicators were neat.
*The CG/effects looked great, especially at creating the look and feel of future Earth.
*There was a Doohan on the Enterprise again.
I'd have to watch it again to remember what else I liked. All I'm coming up with is things I hated. :lol
Blob is too busy to list all the things he enjoyed about STID.
Never too busy to put it down though ;)
To be fair, I actually mentioned something I did like as well as what I didn't like in that post.
But if you're that desperate for my approval of Into Darkness-
*The actors did a great job all around, and the characters were used better, and Scotty was utilized very well this time despite not even being on the Enterprise for the bulk of the movie. He was dedicated to the ship, and drank a lot. What more could you want? :lol
*They did a good job developing the Kirk/Spock friendship (although I don't think one movie was enough for the ending to work emotionally)
*The communicators were neat.
*The CG/effects looked great, especially at creating the look and feel of future Earth.
*There was a Doohan on the Enterprise again.
I'd have to watch it again to remember what else I liked. All I'm coming up with is things I hated. :lol
While I don't agree with every aspect of your list, the bolded part is IMO the most significant failing of the movie.
https://www.agonybooth.com/movies/Star_Trek_Into_Darkness_2013_Detailed_Review.aspx
Because I promise you...with the right outlook, critical eye and negative POV, you could do a write up very similar to this one for any of the classic ST movies. WoK...TVH....
IB4
IB4
Heh. B4.
Nemesis ! Jammin Dude's fave Star Trek film EVAR !!! :angel: :angel:
I've never understood the point of that B4 character. Initially I thought it was a kinda hommage/copout in the vein of The Search For Spock. You got a body but no brain, and then Data uploads his mind into Bones, err, B4. But then at the end B4 is as retarded as ever.
Or was B4 singing Data's tune at the end supposed to mean he was slowly absorbing the new programming?
I find that review to be utterly hilarious.
I don't think most people realize just how HUGE "the nostalgia factor" influence can be. We live in an era where things are held under a microscope. NEVER IN CINEMA HISTORY has Sci-Fi been held up to "the burden of proof" as it is in the 21st Century. Then...we look at the classics through rose tinted glasses, not even realizing that *IF* that same movie had been released today, it would be every bit as picked apart, dissected and criticized....possibly to an even greater degree.
I think it would be an interesting eye-opener to a lot of people if someone with good creative writing skills were to do a mock up (or...heck...not so 'mock up') negative review of Wrath of Khan. Because I promise you...with the right outlook, critical eye and negative POV, you could do a write up very similar to this one for any of the classic ST movies. WoK...TVH....
Later, Kirk goes and gets himself killed by radiation exposure while fixing the Enterprise's engines. All hope would seem to be lost, but Doctor McCoy, in a valiant attempt to discover the greatest deus ex machina in movie history, learns that Khan's genetically enhanced blood can cure death. Spock chases after Khan and rage pinches him into submission so he can bring his swarthy friend back from the great green booty palace in the sky.
What They Should Have Done:
Apparently the entire Enterprise crew forgot they had 72 other people with the exact same genetic enhancements as Khan just lounging in stasis on their own freaking ship. If Khan's blood could cure Kirk, so could any of theirs. There was no reason for them to risk waiting for Spock to capture Khan. We mean, yeah, it worked: They did manage to save Kirk with Khan's blood, but that's like waiting for the fire department to come put out your grease fire even though you're holding 72 fire extinguishers.
Read more: https://www.cracked.com/article_20659_5-clever-movie-schemes-you-didnt-realize-were-stupid.html#ixzz2l1hea099
A deus Ex Machina is something that crops up magically at the end without being introduced previously. ( Matrix 3 )
Khan's blood is mentioned and used for the same purpose at least twice before the end of the film.
It's at the start of the film and again in the middle before finally being used at the end.
It's hardly a Deus Ex Machina.
Also Bob Orci has been asked this same thing a lot and his reply was that there was no way of knowing whether one of the other 72 Eugenics blood had the same properties. And would they wanna risk having TWO psychotic supermen on the loose ?
" Get me a cryo tube now - keep him in an induced coma. " - Bones was very clear about that.
Cracked pointed something out I hadn't considered this morning:QuoteLater, Kirk goes and gets himself killed by radiation exposure while fixing the Enterprise's engines. All hope would seem to be lost, but Doctor McCoy, in a valiant attempt to discover the greatest deus ex machina in movie history, learns that Khan's genetically enhanced blood can cure death. Spock chases after Khan and rage pinches him into submission so he can bring his swarthy friend back from the great green booty palace in the sky.
What They Should Have Done:
Apparently the entire Enterprise crew forgot they had 72 other people with the exact same genetic enhancements as Khan just lounging in stasis on their own freaking ship. If Khan's blood could cure Kirk, so could any of theirs. There was no reason for them to risk waiting for Spock to capture Khan. We mean, yeah, it worked: They did manage to save Kirk with Khan's blood, but that's like waiting for the fire department to come put out your grease fire even though you're holding 72 fire extinguishers.
Read more: https://www.cracked.com/article_20659_5-clever-movie-schemes-you-didnt-realize-were-stupid.html#ixzz2l1hea099
It doesn't matter what I say anyway.
Everything I say I like or particularly enjoyed about the last two films - you just go " THIS IS WHY YOU ARE WRONG. "
It doesn't matter what I say anyway.Truth be told, I only posted the link because I wanted to make you defend it. :rollin
Everything I say I like or particularly enjoyed about the last two films - you just go " THIS IS WHY YOU ARE WRONG. "
It doesn't matter what I say anyway.Truth be told, I only posted the link because I wanted to make you defend it. :rollin
Everything I say I like or particularly enjoyed about the last two films - you just go " THIS IS WHY YOU ARE WRONG. "
Honestly though, you are a bit defensive about it. And did you ever say that you particularly enjoyed the Khan's magic blood part? You have to recognize that there are some plot holes in the thing. Blob and I have both said there are plenty of things we like about the movie; it just wasn't what we wanted to see out of ST. You don't need to feel so ganged up on.
edit: and the Genesis planet didn't bother me. Spock wasn't brought back to life; he was reborn from his DNA. The rapid aging was a tad silly, though. The Insurrection Planet was typical sci-fi from any series. The Spock's brother thing was just plain stupid.
It doesn't matter what I say anyway.Truth be told, I only posted the link because I wanted to make you defend it. :rollin
Everything I say I like or particularly enjoyed about the last two films - you just go " THIS IS WHY YOU ARE WRONG. "
Ah Kotowboy. You and I are of a kind. In a different reality, I could have called you friend.
Yep, it's not like anybody here is claiming TFF is a good movie, so I don't see the problem. :lol
As I said in an earlier post, it's not like we pretend the old movies were fault free either. Far from it. Some movies just have worse faults than others. And Into Darkness is the latest movie, so that gets the most discussion right now.
Ah Kotowboy. You and I are of a kind. In a different reality, I could have called you friend.
Futurama. " Where No Fan Has Gone Before. "
Best tribute episode ever.
Best tribute episode ever.
It is absolute genius. " All Power to the Engines " = :rollin absolutely lost it.
It doesn't even sound like Frakes when he says it for some reason.
It doesn't even sound like Frakes when he says it for some reason.
Probably because he got all old and different sounding. :P
He is credited though, so I find it amusing that they got him for a one line cameo.
Ah Kotowboy. You and I are of a kind. In a different reality, I could have called you friend.
Futurama. " Where No Fan Has Gone Before. "
MORE LIKE EPISODE 9, BALANCE OF TERROR, LOSER! IN YOUR FACE! VICTORY IS MINE! HE HE!
Best tribute episode ever.
In other news - I find it sad that Takei and Shatner have not publicly settled their differences so late in their lives.Which is odd since Takei doesn't seem like the bitter type. I know Shatner and Nimoy seem to have settled their differences.
If they've worked it out in private then awesome but i'd hate for either of them to leave us whilst still holding a grudge.
- Especially since the TNG cast all get along so famously in reality.
Currently making my way through TNG again. I'm a few episodes into the second season.My condolences to you.
Currently making my way through TNG again. I'm a few episodes into the second season.My condolences to you.
When I knew I was going to be laid up for a while I DL'ed a bunch of TNG. Went through and picked only episodes I recall as being interesting or episodes that I didn't remember but thought might be. Turned out to be 66 episodes that I could stomach re-watching. Of those about 15 wound up being ones where I'd get 5 minutes in and go "oh Christ, not this one!" and turn it off. Final percentage turned out to be about 28% that I deemed watchable. Even the ones that made the cut (and I've watched a few of them over the last week) still just come across as week and silly to me.
Nope. Just went through the list (as percentage of watchable episodes is actually a pretty interesting way to look at it). I'd rate TOS as 50%. Some are good episodes. Some are just entertaining for a variety of reasons. DS9 is probably about 85-90%. Still plenty of dead weight in there. VOY is going to be around 66%. That's what I watched while recovering, and I skipped about 5 episodes per season (and hated some that I did watch). Surprisingly, ENT fared pretty well. I watched all of that during a busy stretch at the shop and only skipped over a handful. Interestingly, I blew off the last few episodes. The show just really fizzled towards the end.Currently making my way through TNG again. I'm a few episodes into the second season.My condolences to you.
When I knew I was going to be laid up for a while I DL'ed a bunch of TNG. Went through and picked only episodes I recall as being interesting or episodes that I didn't remember but thought might be. Turned out to be 66 episodes that I could stomach re-watching. Of those about 15 wound up being ones where I'd get 5 minutes in and go "oh Christ, not this one!" and turn it off. Final percentage turned out to be about 28% that I deemed watchable. Even the ones that made the cut (and I've watched a few of them over the last week) still just come across as week and silly to me.
And yet you can defend TOS, where 90% of the episodes are downright laughable the whole way through. Go figure. :lol
See Kotowboy? We don't just single out JJ Trek. :lol
Nope. Just went through the list (as percentage of watchable episodes is actually a pretty interesting way to look at it). I'd rate TOS as 50%. Some are good episodes. Some are just entertaining for a variety of reasons. DS9 is probably about 85-90%. Still plenty of dead weight in there. VOY is going to be around 66%. That's what I watched while recovering, and I skipped about 5 episodes per season (and hated some that I did watch). Surprisingly, ENT fared pretty well. I watched all of that during a busy stretch at the shop and only skipped over a handful. Interestingly, I blew off the last few episodes. The show just really fizzled towards the end.Currently making my way through TNG again. I'm a few episodes into the second season.My condolences to you.
When I knew I was going to be laid up for a while I DL'ed a bunch of TNG. Went through and picked only episodes I recall as being interesting or episodes that I didn't remember but thought might be. Turned out to be 66 episodes that I could stomach re-watching. Of those about 15 wound up being ones where I'd get 5 minutes in and go "oh Christ, not this one!" and turn it off. Final percentage turned out to be about 28% that I deemed watchable. Even the ones that made the cut (and I've watched a few of them over the last week) still just come across as week and silly to me.
And yet you can defend TOS, where 90% of the episodes are downright laughable the whole way through. Go figure. :lol
TNG was the first series I actively watched so it's bound to be my favourite :)
It really depends on how you define watchable. I do find most of TOS watchable and entertaining, just not in the way it intends to be. To me it's pure comedy, just as I enjoy MacGyver and CSI on the same level.I certainly feel similarly. Plenty of those episodes aren't great, but since I'm a fan of Kirk, Spock and even McCoy, I'm always down for watching them do their thing. Occasionally it's even just for one scene, but an episode that leads up to a big payoff is fine for me.
The percentage of episodes I'd consider actually good though, extremely low. A lot of them are redundantly formulaic anyway, and not necessary watching.
The problem with ENT is that it brought nothing new to the table at all until S3. Up until then, it was just stale and poorly recycled TNG/DS9/Voy plots, and without the strong cast to carry it. S3 was the only great season, but even that had some blatantly recycled plots. Most people seem to love S4, but I thought that was the worst. Unashamed fanwank, most of which was forcing the square peg into the round hole. That season demonstrated perfectly that Trek had painted themselves completely into a corner by that point.I remember thinking at the time they should have just said fuckit and made a 5th season set entirely in the mirror universe. Unfortunately, even the mirror versions of the characters were pretty bad. While it was better than most of that season (and the opening credits were probably the single best thing the series ever did), it was really only redeemable for staring the hot, slutty Hoshi.
Ironically, the best episodes of S4 were the Mirror universe where they were on the Defiant, because they almost showed some character. :lol Incidentally, it also technically didn't include a single character or moment in the prime universe! Possibly the only example of that in all of Trek?
I certainly feel similarly. Plenty of those episodes aren't great, but since I'm a fan of Kirk, Spock and even McCoy, I'm always down for watching them do their thing. Occasionally it's even just for one scene, but an episode that leads up to a big payoff is fine for me.
If TNG had even one character as good as them, I'd be cooler with it. The fact is that I just hate all of their boring, lifeless asses, so there's no interest in watching them in crappy stories. Most of what I did watch were Data-centric episodes, or ones with Borg, Q, Klingons or Romulans in them. Anybody but those smug, awful federation twits.
I remember thinking at the time they should have just said fuckit and made a 5th season set entirely in the mirror universe. Unfortunately, even the mirror versions of the characters were pretty bad. While it was better than most of that season (and the opening credits were probably the single best thing the series ever did), it was really only redeemable for staring the hot, slutty Hoshi.
And for that matter, the one with the augments wasn't bad, although they should have knocked off the entire Sung aspect of it. Either do a pre-Data episode, or a pre-Khan episode. They overdid it with the fanwank there.
It's a shame they always focused more on the androgynous looking Vulcan instead of the cute asian chick. :tup Was never much into the beanpole pixie look.Yeah, but Malcom was right, she had a great ass. Don't dig the hair, but phenomenally well built young lady. And when it comes to fanwank, always finding a way to have her in her skivvies once per episode is pretty damned sporting of them.
It's a shame they always focused more on the androgynous looking Vulcan instead of the cute asian chick. :tup Was never much into the beanpole pixie look.Yeah, but Malcom was right, she had a great ass. Don't dig the hair, but phenomenally well built young lady. And when it comes to fanwank, always finding a way to have her in her skivvies once per episode is pretty damned sporting of them.
This, and it's not even close.TNG was the first series I actively watched so it's bound to be my favourite :)TNG was the first series I watched, after watching all of the TOS movies first, but I still much prefer DS9and Voyageroverall.
Currently making my way through TNG again. I'm a few episodes into the second season.My condolences to you.
When I knew I was going to be laid up for a while I DL'ed a bunch of TNG. Went through and picked only episodes I recall as being interesting or episodes that I didn't remember but thought might be. Turned out to be 66 episodes that I could stomach re-watching. Of those about 15 wound up being ones where I'd get 5 minutes in and go "oh Christ, not this one!" and turn it off. Final percentage turned out to be about 28% that I deemed watchable. Even the ones that made the cut (and I've watched a few of them over the last week) still just come across as week and silly to me.
For the more serious episodes, TNG was able to explore situations and raise questions of which few other TV shows are capableThat's always been ST's greatest virtue. Any of the series can hit on fascinating ethical territory. TOS was pretty good at it, A Private Little War and The Apple come to mind. All the way down to ENT, where they cloned a guy only to kill him because they needed a spare body part, and mugged another ship for their warp coil because they just needed it more. TNG certainly had their fare share of ethical dilemmas , and some of them were pretty well done.
I think TNG has some of the best character interaction of any show I've watched, which I believe contributes to the show's smoothening the further I get into it.This is a valid point. They all seemed to have a camaraderie that none of the other crews had. Even dull and boring Geordi could get along swimmingly with dull and boring Crusher. All of the rest of the crews pretty much paired off or formed cliques. Still, I just thought they were all lifeless and boring (which actually explains why any one of them could get along with any other one), so I don't have much interest in seeing them all get along. Some tension would have greatly improved that show.
TNG first series is really bad compared to what would come later. It's extremely 80's and you can tell Pat Stewart didn't want to be there.
I think one of TNG's first turning points is [spoiler]killing off Yar.[/spoiler]
This is a valid point. They all seemed to have a camaraderie that none of the other crews had. Even dull and boring Geordi could get along swimmingly with dull and boring Crusher. All of the rest of the crews pretty much paired off or formed cliques. Still, I just thought they were all lifeless and boring (which actually explains why any one of them could get along with any other one), so I don't have much interest in seeing them all get along. Some tension would have greatly improved that show.
And I'd say it got better as it went along, before they hit the most solid wall I've ever seen. They ran out of ideas going into seven and the whole thing just fell apart spectacularly. Seven might actually be worse than one, and one really sucked. "Well, what now? I don't know, have we done a Geordi's mom episode yet?" :facepalm:
All Good Things was good, but it wasn't without it's flaws. Giving Crusher command of a ship? Gimme a break. Slapping a 3rd nacelle onto the Enterprise? What's the point? Worf and Riker turning into bitter old assholes? Well, that's actually pretty likely (but did ruin Riker, IMO). Data retiring to Cambridge? Totally out of character. Again, I think it was a very good episode and I particularly liked the Billy Pilgrim idea, but if you're going to blast Voyager's finale for such things, at least give AGT a similar look.
All Good Things was good, but it wasn't without it's flaws. Giving Crusher command of a ship? Gimme a break. Slapping a 3rd nacelle onto the Enterprise? What's the point? Worf and Riker turning into bitter old assholes? Well, that's actually pretty likely (but did ruin Riker, IMO). Data retiring to Cambridge? Totally out of character. Again, I think it was a very good episode and I particularly liked the Billy Pilgrim idea, but if you're going to blast Voyager's finale for such things, at least give AGT a similar look.
I'm actually OK with Data going to Cambridge. He was exploring his humanity for the entire series and him doing that doesn't seem so far fetched. And comparing AGT to the voyager final isn't very fair. Sure, AGT might have had it's flaws, but the voyager final was the opitome of disappointment.
All Good Things was good, but it wasn't without it's flaws. Giving Crusher command of a ship? Gimme a break. Slapping a 3rd nacelle onto the Enterprise? What's the point? Worf and Riker turning into bitter old assholes? Well, that's actually pretty likely (but did ruin Riker, IMO). Data retiring to Cambridge? Totally out of character. Again, I think it was a very good episode and I particularly liked the Billy Pilgrim idea, but if you're going to blast Voyager's finale for such things, at least give AGT a similar look.
So I'm curious what people's favorite TOS episodes are. Aside from the obvious ones, everybody like CotEoF and Balance of Terror, but what other ones do the people who by and large dislike TOS actually enjoy watching? I'm watching Corbomite Maneuver right now, and it's always been one of my favorites. It also has the added advantage of benefiting more than most from the remastering.
A great Kirk/Spock episode, and the only one of their time travel episodes that didn't feel like an excuse to raid the costume department.Tomorrow is Yesterday wasn't an excuse to be cheap, and was actually an interesting idea (mainly because it was the first time it was done).
A great Kirk/Spock episode, and the only one of their time travel episodes that didn't feel like an excuse to raid the costume department.Tomorrow is Yesterday wasn't an excuse to be cheap, and was actually an interesting idea (mainly because it was the first time it was done).
Looking at a list, it seems that every series had a couple of good ones (took TNG until the final episode :lol) and a lot of crappy ones. Two of DS9's best episodes were time travel episodes, and VOY had plenty, several of which were respectable. I also enjoyed the episode with T'pol's ancestor getting stuck on Earth for a few months.
For some reason Year of Hell isn't considered a time travel episode. I suppose if you think about it they never left their own time. The universe just changed around them, and reverted after the initial cause was undone. And while we're on the subject, why was it that for all of Anorax's knowledge about temporal mechanics he couldn't foresee that just removing the stupid time ship from the timeline would undo what he initially fucked up? Dumbass.
The DS9 episodes I was referring to are Visitor and Trials and Tribbilations. None of the other time travel episodes really sat well with me.
Carbon Creek was really the only time travel episode I liked in ENT. I suppose Carpenter Street was alright, but really it'd been done so many times by then that it just didn't do a whole lot for me.
Nope. Just went through the list (as percentage of watchable episodes is actually a pretty interesting way to look at it). I'd rate TOS as 50%. Some are good episodes. Some are just entertaining for a variety of reasons. DS9 is probably about 85-90%. Still plenty of dead weight in there. VOY is going to be around 66%. That's what I watched while recovering, and I skipped about 5 episodes per season (and hated some that I did watch). Surprisingly, ENT fared pretty well. I watched all of that during a busy stretch at the shop and only skipped over a handful. Interestingly, I blew off the last few episodes. The show just really fizzled towards the end.Currently making my way through TNG again. I'm a few episodes into the second season.My condolences to you.
When I knew I was going to be laid up for a while I DL'ed a bunch of TNG. Went through and picked only episodes I recall as being interesting or episodes that I didn't remember but thought might be. Turned out to be 66 episodes that I could stomach re-watching. Of those about 15 wound up being ones where I'd get 5 minutes in and go "oh Christ, not this one!" and turn it off. Final percentage turned out to be about 28% that I deemed watchable. Even the ones that made the cut (and I've watched a few of them over the last week) still just come across as week and silly to me.
And yet you can defend TOS, where 90% of the episodes are downright laughable the whole way through. Go figure. :lol
A nice thing I noticed in Star Trek VI ...
In Into Darkness - Bones says to jim - " Are we firing Torpedos at the Klingons ? "
and in Star trek VI - just after Kronos I is hit - Bones comes on to the bridge and says : " are we firing torpedos ? " [ at the klingons ]
Also - the scene from TMP where Spock is in sick bay after mind melding with V'Ger is pretty much the Into Darkness Sick bay scene reversed.
A nice thing I noticed in Star Trek VI ...
In Into Darkness - Bones says to jim - " Are we firing Torpedos at the Klingons ? "
and in Star trek VI - just after Kronos I is hit - Bones comes on to the bridge and says : " are we firing torpedos ? " [ at the klingons ]
Also - the scene from TMP where Spock is in sick bay after mind melding with V'Ger is pretty much the Into Darkness Sick bay scene reversed.
Those are both good catches, a bit more obscure than the more obvious parallels between Into Darkness and The Wrath of Khan.
J. J. Abrams' justification for all this is that even though the Star Trek universe has been rebooted, there are certain certain events which will tend to occur, and persons whose paths will always cross (Khan and Kirk), though sometimes in somewhat different circumstances. I thought that that was kinda lame, but in a way, also kinda cool. Almost deep, or something.
Yeah, it is, which is the lame part. But the idea that certain events will tend to occur and certain paths will always cross, even if other circumstances are different, is also a time-honored sci-fi concept. Something like the opposite of The Butterfly Effect, which says that if even the slightest thing changes, then everything in the whole damned universe changes. I actually kinda like the idea that there are certain things that will happen anyway, even if the Planet Vulcan is blown up and Scotty looks and acts completely different.
Yeah, it is, which is the lame part. But the idea that certain events will tend to occur and certain paths will always cross, even if other circumstances are different, is also a time-honored sci-fi concept.
I see Cumber-Khan as a result of Admiral Marcus disguising him so he could work for Section 31. Voice and everything.
Yeah, it is, which is the lame part. But the idea that certain events will tend to occur and certain paths will always cross, even if other circumstances are different, is also a time-honored sci-fi concept.
Like in Back To The Future - Marty goes back to 1985 at the end and he still lives in the same house and is the same age etc - even though the entire week in 1955 would have changed a load of things going forward.
They could have at least had some lead up comics like STXI needed to explain all of the stuff they left out of the movie.
They could have at least had some lead up comics like STXI needed to explain all of the stuff they left out of the movie.
...they do ?
I'm not just "making stuff up " as you put it to ignore the errors as you see them. I obviously read a lot of interviews with cast and crew - around the time the movie was due - I was reading everything I could find.
Including Q&A with the writers - where they answered all sorts of queries - such as Admiral Marcus spent most of this new timeline in London which is why Carol sounds like she does etc...And yes - why Khan is so different. And why they didn't just use one of the other 72 frozen eugenics instead of chasing down Khan etc.
While I was too annoyed at the British accent thing (same thing with Carol Marcus, who even has an American-accent father, wtf), I think every Trekkie lost the privilege to bitch about accents ever since a whole series revolved around a French guy with a thick British accent.
One thing that struck me about watching the TOS movies - the pace and tone of the dialogue compared to the new movies. It is relaxed and natural, not DELIVERED.WITH.SO.MUCH.INTENSITY.
I'm pretty sure Enterprise E's saucer doesn't detach from the hull like 1701-D's did.Says who? All the other ones could. Kirk referred to it several times. The Excelsior class Enterprise had a battle bridge, suggesting the ability. The Enterprise C blueprints suggest it's an option. Obviously Picard's luxury liner could. Seems unlikely that they'd just suddenly abandon a useful feature.
One thing that struck me about watching the TOS movies - the pace and tone of the dialogue compared to the new movies. It is relaxed and natural, not DELIVERED.WITH.SO.MUCH.INTENSITY.Made for a different audience. Back then seeing stories unfold and characters interact was the whole point of a film. Now it's just a means to connect all of the explosions and fight scenes.
Something I noticed last night is that for all of the tail Kirk gets throughout the series, Spock gets the hotter women. All of Kirk's babes are blonde bimbos who are usually trying to steel his ship but are too insipid to get very far. Occasionally they're really hot, but often times they're pretty average. The women Spock gets with are usually pretty smart, down to Earth, and quite attractive.
All that said, Kirk still had the all-time winner:
(https://static1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110417182640/memoryalpha/en/images/thumb/3/39/Andrea.jpg/292px-Andrea.jpg)
Actually, he could have said something about Picard's relatives deaths that could have miffed Picard. That would have been a much better motivator to install the emotion chip than dunking Crusher. He could also have referred to previous instances where being unable to read human emotions got him into trouble, which would have pleased the Trekkies.Oh non! Je suis en feu! Sacre bleu! :lol
I'm not seeing anything to complain about there. All of the hairstyles for Troi looked equally bad. She looked best once she discovered the hair straightener for the movies. She looked best in First Contact imo.
She should have kept that dress though. It looked great on her, but I recall she only wore it for the pilot, then she wore her weird costumes until they stuck her in a Starfleet uniform later on. Apparently they stuck her in the dress because they thought she wasn't thin enough to wear the Starfleet pantsuit, which is full of crap.
And Wil Weaton is a dork no matter what you do to him. He looks like a dork even NOW. And Tasha looked like a dude no matter what you do to her. :lol
Dude, they gave her a giant fro! She looked much better with her hair up (and I'm really not a fan of that, in general). Moreover, Marina Sirtis isn't an unattractive chick. Even if one of those wasn't the answer, they could have done better than a GIANT FUCKING AFRO!
Well, for one thing, Linda Hamilton was actually pretty good looking in both Terminator movies. I assume you're referring to II, where she was tough and angry, but she was still attractive and feminine. And on top of that, the chick that played Tasha's sister was much more in line with the heroic Linda Hamilton type. I just don't think making women look like dudes is necessary to make them tough. Personally, I think that tough female action hero thing was exactly what Roddenberry didn't want.
And speaking of Troi, I noticed something else that annoyed me the other night. When Data loses to the galaxy's grand master of some silly game, he relieves himself of duty believing himself defective. When Troi's intellectually crippled ass beats him at chess, he says huh, guess I lost then. I'm barely able to accept Kirk beating Spock in chess, because he is Kirk after all. The idea of Data losing to Troi rates right up there with Troi+Worf as one of the most retarded things they could possibly portray.
I'm pretty sure Enterprise E's saucer doesn't detach from the hull like 1701-D's did.Says who? All the other ones could. Kirk referred to it several times. The Excelsior class Enterprise had a battle bridge, suggesting the ability. The Enterprise C blueprints suggest it's an option. Obviously Picard's luxury liner could. Seems unlikely that they'd just suddenly abandon a useful feature.
Probably true, but never the less Kirk suggests separating the drive section on a few instances. I know The Apple comes to mind. Because they never did it for cost reasons doesn't mean that it wasn't possible. Also, they published complete technical diagrams and blueprints for the Constitution class, and I'm pretty sure those showed it as being possible and are considered canon.I'm pretty sure Enterprise E's saucer doesn't detach from the hull like 1701-D's did.Says who? All the other ones could. Kirk referred to it several times. The Excelsior class Enterprise had a battle bridge, suggesting the ability. The Enterprise C blueprints suggest it's an option. Obviously Picard's luxury liner could. Seems unlikely that they'd just suddenly abandon a useful feature.
Actually I seem to recall someone saying that they stuck it in " Encounter At Farpoint " because they could never afford it on TOS.
Saw Deja Q the other night. One of my favorite episodes from TNG. The scene in Ten forward was amazing.When Guinan stabs him with the fork? That was pretty funny, but the idea that she could do anything to defend herself against a functional Q is about as laughable as Troi beating Data at chess.
Saw Deja Q the other night. One of my favorite episodes from TNG. The scene in Ten forward was amazing.When Guinan stabs him with the fork? That was pretty funny, but the idea that she could do anything to defend herself against a functional Q is about as laughable as Troi beating Data at chess.
Over the 7 seasons of TNG - Q goes from being a being a bully to being interested in Picard to actually giving a crap about them to trying to advance their evolution and finally helping Picard understand a tiny bit more about the universe & helping him save it...
But then they throw away that entire character arc in DS9 by having him go right back to being Encounter At Farpoint Q. :(
Perhaps, but Janeway was more interesting. Both by virtue of being a chick, which Q played on quite a bit, and by being stuck in the middle of Bumfuck. With the exception of Deathwish, which I thought was very good, I didn't much care for the other Q episodes, but they were still better than the crossover mess that was DS9's attempt.Over the 7 seasons of TNG - Q goes from being a being a bully to being interested in Picard to actually giving a crap about them to trying to advance their evolution and finally helping Picard understand a tiny bit more about the universe & helping him save it...
But then they throw away that entire character arc in DS9 by having him go right back to being Encounter At Farpoint Q. :(
Even worse I found that they just reprised the "Q finds captain interesting" with Voyager. It made no sense whatsoever.
Probably true, but never the less Kirk suggests separating the drive section on a few instances. I know The Apple comes to mind. Because they never did it for cost reasons doesn't mean that it wasn't possible. Also, they published complete technical diagrams and blueprints for the Constitution class, and I'm pretty sure those showed it as being possible and are considered canon.I'm pretty sure Enterprise E's saucer doesn't detach from the hull like 1701-D's did.Says who? All the other ones could. Kirk referred to it several times. The Excelsior class Enterprise had a battle bridge, suggesting the ability. The Enterprise C blueprints suggest it's an option. Obviously Picard's luxury liner could. Seems unlikely that they'd just suddenly abandon a useful feature.
Actually I seem to recall someone saying that they stuck it in " Encounter At Farpoint " because they could never afford it on TOS.
Alright, I guess it's time to put the geek hat on.Probably true, but never the less Kirk suggests separating the drive section on a few instances. I know The Apple comes to mind. Because they never did it for cost reasons doesn't mean that it wasn't possible. Also, they published complete technical diagrams and blueprints for the Constitution class, and I'm pretty sure those showed it as being possible and are considered canon.I'm pretty sure Enterprise E's saucer doesn't detach from the hull like 1701-D's did.Says who? All the other ones could. Kirk referred to it several times. The Excelsior class Enterprise had a battle bridge, suggesting the ability. The Enterprise C blueprints suggest it's an option. Obviously Picard's luxury liner could. Seems unlikely that they'd just suddenly abandon a useful feature.
Actually I seem to recall someone saying that they stuck it in " Encounter At Farpoint " because they could never afford it on TOS.
I'm a blueprints hoarder and interesting in the tech side, and this is the first I've ever heard of the idea of the Constitution class separating.
I always found it a little silly anyway, Picard would threaten to separate the saucer section every second episode, but they did it a grand total of maybe twice in the series, plus Generations where it actually was pretty cool.
You'd think they really should have used saucer separation in the TOS movies if it were possible though.The second link I posted was actually for the refit used in TMP, not the 1701A as I mistakenly said. Also, GR was very clear that he wanted a separation sequence in there and it wasn't doable (which is probably a good thing as it would have added another 25 minutes to the thing). He also wanted to separate it in III before blowing up the Klingons, and was thankfully overruled (his was a really awful, cheesy idea).
https://www.startrek.com/article/next-star-trek-films-writers-revealedWell, sort of. They're keeping Orci and replacing Kurzman with two other guys. The problem as I see it is that it's not the day to day screenplay/dialog type stuff that's the problem. Most of the dialog was actually pretty good. It's the overall story, and with Orci as the head writer, I don't see how likely it is to see much improvement there.
New Writers for Star Trek 3.
https://www.startrek.com/article/next-star-trek-films-writers-revealedWell, sort of. They're keeping Orci and replacing Kurzman with two other guys. The problem as I see it is that it's not the day to day screenplay/dialog type stuff that's the problem. Most of the dialog was actually pretty good. It's the overall story, and with Orci as the head writer, I don't see how likely it is to see much improvement there.
New Writers for Star Trek 3.
Man, after watching the first few episodes of DS9 it's amazing that it lasted long enough to get as good as it did. The pilot was just awful. Most of the early character exposition was annoyingly heavy-handed. It seemed they were really interested in making O'Brian a central character, well before he had any personality to really focus on. The generic ST plots are woefully ill-suited for the DS9 format. It was certainly better than TNG, but that really just means that it wasn't as awful as it's possible to be.
As for TOS, it's not so easy to tell since they were aired way out of order. The first few episodes included WNMHGB, Corbomite Maneuver and Naked Time. A lot of the crap they started the show with was much later in production order. Add to that, since there wasn't really any progression, I don't think any of the seasons are different from each other. I don't get when people say that one season is better than another; they're all the same.
My biggest issue with Emmissary (aside from the dreadful acting) was that the exposition was so forced. You really don't need to explain Dax right out of the gate. You don't need to establish backstories right out of the gate. That's just corny. Let the characters evolve naturally instead of providing them with soliloquy opportunities to tell you who they are. That's part of the reason I thought Caretaker was so much better as a pilot. It seemed like they were starting with something of a clean slate and the characters got to grow into their roles.I think you should, as that's really the purpose of a pilot; to establish the setting and characters. This is especially important when characters are different species, the viewer should have some idea of what Dax or Odo are. That said, the absolute clunkiest piece of dialogue in Emissary is easily Odo's infodumping about where he was first discovered. It comes completely out of nowhere and it's probably a piece of information that could have been left off for a later episode.
Haha.
So glad Nemesis under-performed.
Pat Stewart said that they already had a script ready for the follow up which would unite every living Star Trek character in one film.
:lol Holy Fuck that would have been SHIT.
Shit like that is best left to obsessive fangirls on their tumblr.
i meant fan GIRLS as an all-encompassing pejorative term ;)
You know, I love First Contact to death, but the idea that some guy living in sheet metal barracks after a nuclear war would put together a warp-capable rocket, is kinda ludicrous.Moreover that guy? And he said he was in it for the money. Money for what? From who? Like it was lack of money that caused them all to live in a unabomber style shacks in Montana? Entertaining movie, I suppose, but monumentally dumb.
The Cardassians have always been my favorite alien race in the ST universe. They look badass and they're more believable than most of the other species.The funny thing is that I've always hated them as generic bad guys. It's only the ones you actually get to know that make them worthwhile. Almost the exact opposite of the Klingons and the Romulans. I like them both as evil empires, but couldn't name any one in particular that I really liked. Kern was a pretty good Klingon, I suppose. Hell, try naming your favorite Romulan. :lol
You know, given the number of episodes the Romulans appeared in, they stayed remarkably one-dimensional. Maybe the problem was that any kind of"normalcy" would have made them Vulcan.I'm not sure one-dimensional is how I'd describe them. When we got insight they were usually pretty interesting. Troi masquerading as a member of the Tal Shiar and having dinner with the commander, for example. Neat to see the dynamic between the military and the intelligence apparatus. The political aspect that we saw in Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges. Even Spock porking the chick commander in TOS. I don't think they were ever in danger of becoming too Vulcan. They just never developed any of the individuals enough to provide personal insight.
Nero, in my personal opinion, was not a Romulan.
Hell, try naming your favorite Romulan. :lolThat Romulan from The Defector.
Damar had a pretty awesome character arc though.Nero, in my personal opinion, was not a Romulan.
He was Nosferatu. Those were not Romulans at all in that movie, they were JJ asserting his power over Trek by turning every race into generic goblins.
I don't think there's ever been a particularly good Romulan though.
For Klingons, I'm going with Martok. He was awesome. And Gorwon was cool too. I called him crazy eyes.
And Garak and Dukat were both standout characters. Dukat's replacement in later seasons was terrible though.
He was fine as a plot device, it's just that a Abrams needed to slap the label "Romulan" on the guy just so he could increase the Trekkiness of the movie, even though the guy had nothing to do with being Romulan really.
He was fine as a plot device, it's just that a Abrams needed to slap the label "Romulan" on the guy just so he could increase the Trekkiness of the movie, even though the guy had nothing to do with being Romulan really.
And substitute "Romulan" for "Khan" and it also applies to Into Darkness. :lol
When was the last time a Trek movie had a great bad guy anyway? Nu-Khan, Nero, Shinzon, the plastic surgery guys etc.
I saw TWOK on TV the other night, and Khan was just such a good bad guy that he's been the unreachable benchmark for over 30 years now.
The Borg Bitch? Wait, you said "guy".
General Chang.
What's interesting is how the most integral alien race associated with Star Trek, Vulcans, completely fell off the truck. A few TNG episodes that had them (if only to get a Nimoy cameo), but were there any Vulcans in DS9? Voyager finally brought one back, and ENT too I guess. But they always struck me as a forgotten race.That douchebag Vulcan in the baseball episode. ;)
What's interesting is how the most integral alien race associated with Star Trek, Vulcans, completely fell off the truck. A few TNG episodes that had them (if only to get a Nimoy cameo), but were there any Vulcans in DS9? Voyager finally brought one back, and ENT too I guess. But they always struck me as a forgotten race.
The worst thing about Anton Yelchin is why is hair nothing at all like Koening ? They didn't have to give him identical hair but at least get it somewhere in the vicinity...
Also - before Star Trek 11 - I had never heard of Chris Pine or Zoe Saldana before.
Then Zoe was in Avatar in the same year.
While I won't argue the luck point, the original Kirk was actually quite different. TOS Kirk was pretty damned intelligent and learned. Considered a bookworm at the academy, worked his way up through the ranks learning more as he went. If anything, it's the new Kirk that relies on luck and blunders his way forward (the whole premise of ID).
NCC 1701 B - The fugliest piece of fugly that ever fuglied. If Maggie Gyllenhaal was a spaceship, this would be it.
NCC 1701 B - The fugliest piece of fugly that ever fuglied. If Maggie Gyllenhaal was a spaceship, this would be it.
For fuck's sake, Blob, do you ever have a normal opinion on anything? :lol
Can I just PLEASE give a +20 to the Maggie Gyllenhaal bashing? I spent half of The Dark Knight trying to figure out why Bruce Wayne was dating The Elephant Man.She looked terrible in TDK and I don't know why. Pretty much every other thing I've seen her in, she's looked fine.
NX-01 - Not a bad looking ship, especially the refit
NX-01 - Not a bad looking ship, especially the refit
There were two ?
EDIT : just googled NX01 refit...Interesting.. Merely a concept as far as I can tell ?
Hadn't heard about that, but it's possible. There's also R2-D2 in the debri in both movies, I believe (definitely in STXI, and I've heard it's in ID too).
On a similar note, the Millennium Falcon makes an appearance in the Borg battle at the start of First Contact, and the Enterprise makes an appearance in Star Wars: Attack of the Clones, when Anakin and Obiwan are in the flying car thing.
Hadn't heard about that, but it's possible. There's also R2-D2 in the debri in both movies, I believe (definitely in STXI, and I've heard it's in ID too).
On a similar note, the Millennium Falcon makes an appearance in the Borg battle at the start of First Contact, and the Enterprise makes an appearance in Star Wars: Attack of the Clones, when Anakin and Obiwan are in the flying car thing.
I never knew that. Looks like I'm pausing some DVD's tonight.
The whole Kirk-Decker dynamic didn't work to well. It's like "I know what you're trying to do here plot-wise, but it's just not working". Shatners wooden acting didn't help either.Yeah, and in retrospect I think SC's acting had more to do with it. Shatner is a known quantity. He is what he is. For the dynamic they were looking for they needed Decker to be a little more pissed off. And for that matter most of Decker's other parts were pretty bland, as well. I never bought into him suddenly deciding that merging with some alien computer was what he'd always wanted more than anything else. Really, where'd that come from?
The execution of the whole storyline was poor at best. I was only 11 but I remember my Dad and 2 of his friends coming out of the movie saying, "WTF did we just see?" That movie did not connect with with it's core audience.We felt the same way, but remember that what we saw way back then was the original studio release. It was re-released with some extra bits that explained a lot of things and greatly improved the story. Considering how much of a mess the original thing was (thank you Mr. Roddenberry) it's amazing it ever happened at all.
Did they remake Andromeda Strain? I only know of the original Robert Wise version (who incidentally also directed TMP).
The whole Kirk-Decker dynamic didn't work to well. It's like "I know what you're trying to do here plot-wise, but it's just not working". Shatners wooden acting didn't help either.Yeah, and in retrospect I think SC's acting had more to do with it. Shatner is a known quantity. He is what he is. For the dynamic they were looking for they needed Decker to be a little more pissed off. And for that matter most of Decker's other parts were pretty bland, as well. I never bought into him suddenly deciding that merging with some alien computer was what he'd always wanted more than anything else. Really, where'd that come from?
I read somewhere that the TNG characters Riker and Troi were based on Decker and Ilia. I can kinda see that.
Upon catching this movie on TV recently, I was surprised to realize that the TNG theme music is all over it, especially at the end. I didn't even realize. I mean, this movie came out eight years before TNG, and I never made the connection. When TNG hit the air, I know I didn't think "Wow, that's the same music!"
I absolutely love Giacchino's score for STXI, including his new theme (great choice to link btw). I don't have the one for ID yet, as when I checked, they hadn't released the complete edition yet.
I absolutely love Giacchino's score for STXI, including his new theme (great choice to link btw). I don't have the one for ID yet, as when I checked, they hadn't released the complete edition yet.
Into Darkness Score is on Spotify but I don't know if that's what you are after.
Wrath Of Khan score gives me goosebumps everytime. Perfect score for a perfect film.
The 3rd and 4th seasons were definitely a huge departure from the first two seasons. I think the 3rd season is overall great, although I hate the 4th season overall unlike most Enterprise fans. Too much forced fanwank.I agree with you about the 4th season, which I believe we've discussed before. I actually didn't have much of a problem with 1 and 2, though. Some of the episodes sucked, just like any ST series, but some were pretty good. And while the Xindi storyline was entertaining, the trade off was the lack of prequel stuff that made the first 2 seasons interesting.
The mirror universe episodes were good though.
The 3rd and 4th seasons were definitely a huge departure from the first two seasons. I think the 3rd season is overall great, although I hate the 4th season overall unlike most Enterprise fans. Too much forced fanwank.I agree with you about the 4th season, which I believe we've discussed before. I actually didn't have much of a problem with 1 and 2, though. Some of the episodes sucked, just like any ST series, but some were pretty good. And while the Xindi storyline was entertaining, the trade off was the lack of prequel stuff that made the first 2 seasons interesting.
The mirror universe episodes were good though.
Just (re) starting to make my way through Enterprise, cuz I never watched it in the first place. Watched the Andorian Incident and Breaking the Ice.
Andorian ... wasn't too hard to predict what they were gonna find in the cattacombs. And like the group of monks along with Archer/Tripp couldn't over-power those four numbskulls.
Breaking the Ince... WTF was with the "video" back home scene? Like, in 200 years, people don't know how a self contained vessel takes care of shit? Did other naval vessels (subs, air craft carriers...) go extinct or something. The number of ::) at that scene.
Then I flipped over to (rewatch) Boston Legal (starting right at the beginning... S1E01). Enterprise better pick up, or it's gonna lose out to Denny and Alan real quick.
That's actually two words, and I don't know how it relates to the discussion.
One word: Millennium Falcon
Just (re) starting to make my way through Enterprise, cuz I never watched it in the first place. Watched the Andorian Incident and Breaking the Ice.If you're going to be that nit-picky about flaws that pop up in every ST series you're never going to like ENT. In fact, I can already predict that you're never going to like it.
Andorian ... wasn't too hard to predict what they were gonna find in the cattacombs. And like the group of monks along with Archer/Tripp couldn't over-power those four numbskulls.
Breaking the Ince... WTF was with the "video" back home scene? Like, in 200 years, people don't know how a self contained vessel takes care of shit? Did other naval vessels (subs, air craft carriers...) go extinct or something. The number of ::) at that scene.
Then I flipped over to (rewatch) Boston Legal (starting right at the beginning... S1E01). Enterprise better pick up, or it's gonna lose out to Denny and Alan real quick.
To address your point, just because the monks were Vulcans didn't mean that they were Shaolin badasses. They were pacifists and as such the the 3 crewmembers were best served not starting any shit. In fact, they were probably far more aggressive than was tactically sound.
One word: Millennium Falcon
Picard's Enterprise could kick it's tiny arse.
One word: Millennium Falcon
Picard's Enterprise could kick it's tiny arse.
Whoa whoa whoa there! It the ship that made the Kessel run in less than twelve parsecs!
One word: Millennium Falcon
Picard's Enterprise could kick it's tiny arse.
Whoa whoa whoa there! It the ship that made the Kessel run in less than twelve parsecs!
Given how parsecs are a measure of distance, I always assumed that the Kessel run is a race with a fixed amount of time, and people try to cover the most distance. So, covering less than 12 parsecs tells actually tells you how *shitty* the Millenium Falcon is.
There have been a number of "explanations" for that line that I've read over the years. One pretty much agree with you, Kotowboy, that it just shows that Lucas didn't know WTF he was talking about and was trying to sound cool.
Another is kinda the opposite of your theory, Rumby. The Kessel Run is long, something of a space marathon, but it's point-to-point and there is no fixed route. Therefore, a skilled pilot will choose a course which takes advantage of wormholes and gravitational slingslots in order to shorten the distance and/or travel time. Making the run in less than a certain distance makes no sense at face value, but is actually a testament to Han Solo's skill as a hyperspace pilot.
Shit, ninja'd big time. Oh well.
Err, IIRC it was Sulu who steered the Klingon ship so close to the sun that it went back in time. So, Sulu could have fucking finished the race before it even began! And won a sword fight while doing so (in the straight and gay sense of that term)
I disagree. If it didn't happen on film, it didn't happen.There have been a number of "explanations" for that line that I've read over the years. One pretty much agree with you, Kotowboy, that it just shows that Lucas didn't know WTF he was talking about and was trying to sound cool.
Another is kinda the opposite of your theory, Rumby. The Kessel Run is long, something of a space marathon, but it's point-to-point and there is no fixed route. Therefore, a skilled pilot will choose a course which takes advantage of wormholes and gravitational slingslots in order to shorten the distance and/or travel time. Making the run in less than a certain distance makes no sense at face value, but is actually a testament to Han Solo's skill as a hyperspace pilot.
Shit, ninja'd big time. Oh well.
See: Han Solo Trilogy - Star Wars Extended Universe - The slingshot theory is canon.
Yeah, that's where I am, too. I know Lucas considers the books canon as well, but to me that doesn't make any sense. Any schmuck can write a book set in the Star Wars Extended Universe, and even if Lucas supposedly has to okay each one, I'd bet real money that he doesn't read every one of them.
Nothing personal, MOLS, but the number of people who read the books is a tiny, tiny percentage of people who've seen the movies. For enlightenment and perspective, they're fine, but as "proof" because the books are supposedly canonical just seems wrong. And I say that given that you're actually supporting my position.
SO - how about that Star Trek ?
:biggrin: :biggrin:
I wish that All Good Things was a movie instead of Nemesis.
Funny... I STILL haven't watched Insurrection.
Yeah, it definitely feels more like a really long episode, in a good way.
I see so many Trek related things on the net that I always knew that the guy playing Bane was the same guy from Nemesis. And I've never seen the Batman movie, so he's still just the dude from Nemesis to me.
If it makes you feel better though, nobody will fault you for disregarding Nemesis. :P
Prune juice or GTFO.
The production was different too. The ship was lit differently. The 80s synthesiser score was out and - yes - everyone seemed more into it.The improvements in the writing helped a bit too. :)
Speaking of lighting - I :heart the cinematography in Generations.
You think that The Motion Picture is worse than Final Frontier ?
I just meant with the limitations of pumping out a TV show, as opposed to a movie where they could take the time to light it awesomely.
I think that TFF is so bad that it's awesome. :lol To me it most closely captures the spirit of TOS, and I find it highly enjoyable for the camp value.
I just meant with the limitations of pumping out a TV show, as opposed to a movie where they could take the time to light it awesomely.
Ah, got it. I thought maybe it was because of the limitations of the cheap videotape they used or something like that.
I think that TFF is so bad that it's awesome. :lol To me it most closely captures the spirit of TOS, and I find it highly enjoyable for the camp value.
Yes! It's actually one of my favorites, because it's fun (and also because I don't really think it's that bad).
I'm watching Face of the Enemy, where Troi wakes up as a Romulan Major. I've got to say I'm very impressed with the sound dampening the Romulan quarters have, as she is currently yelling at the top of her lungs to her accomplice that she is a Romulan imposter. So far nobody in the hallway or next room over has heard.In space, no one can hear you whine.
Frame of Mind is definitely one of my favorites. Despite watching it numerous times, I still can't fully discern what is reality and what is Riker's imagination.I assumed the entire thing was one big nightmare because he wakes up right at the end on a table ? I thought he'd been under the entire time.
I'm watching Face of the Enemy, where Troi wakes up as a Romulan Major. I've got to say I'm very impressed with the sound dampening the Romulan quarters have, as she is currently yelling at the top of her lungs to her accomplice that she is a Romulan imposter. So far nobody in the hallway or next room over has heard.In space, no one can hear you whine.
Frame of Mind is definitely one of my favorites. Despite watching it numerous times, I still can't fully discern what is reality and what is Riker's imagination.I assumed the entire thing was one big nightmare because he wakes up right at the end on a table ? I thought he'd been under the entire time.
I love to bitch about TNG.
EDIT: Currently watching Tapestry. Why are a bunch of Starfleet officers just standing around watching from the background as Picard gets stabbed through the heart? What a bunch of useless pussies who don't deserve to wear that uniform.It's because they're all enlightened and know that violence is never the solution. Better to go back to your ship and cry to your counselor about how awful a place the universe can be.
TNG is the best Star Trek series hands down.
I like DS9 but imo there were way more annoying characters on it than TNG.
Wes > Jake
Picard > Sisko
The best thing about DS9 was the relationship between Odo and Quark.
But didn't Q create the situation in the first place in All Good Things? Been a while since I've seen it, but I loved that episode regardless, so it doesn't really matter. But I didn't really consider it an arc. Just a bit of progression in their relationship.
I mostly never liked how they dealt with the concept of omnipotence.
The episode was written by Tracy Tormé under the pseudonym of Keith Mills. Tormé had his name removed from the credits after he became unsatisfied with rewrites. His original idea was a surreal nightmare about an astronaut stuck forever in his most pleasant memory.[1]
Wesley better than Jake? What the what! Wesley was the worst, and Jake was downright tolerable for a kid actor too. He even had a few good episodes when teamed up with Nog.If we're talking about the quality of acting, then TNG wins hands down. Sisko was among the worst of the actors, and he was up against a very good one. If we're talking about the quality of characters, we're talking about the best group of the series vs the worst group of the series. The circumstances of DS9 actually allowed their crew to act like humans, unlike the other series (save for ENT). TNG was the pinnacle of the lifeless avatar characterizations.
I do prefer Picard, but Sisko was pretty damn awesome too. If I was doing a direct cast comparison, I think DS9 would overall win, although both were good casts.
The new Blu Ray TNG remasters look stunning.I'm pretty impressed so far (I've only watched a few episodes). For a show that's over twenty years old, they really did a good job cleaning it up and making it look good. If they ever do this to DS9, I'll be very tempted to get the entire series as opposed to just a season or two. My wallet will hate me though.
If I ever get a Blu Ray player - TNG will be the first thing i'd get.
I cast a vote for DS9 myself.Yeah, DS9's easily my favorite.
I don't hate Wesley as much as other people do, but I still don't think he holds a candle to Jake. He was a decent character once the writers finally managed to inject a bit of character into him other than the 'know-it-all boy wonder.' Still, I never really understood the vociferous hate that he received, but then I didn't start watching TNG religiously until near the end and so I didn't see much of the first two seasons until much, much later. In season 3 and onward he's less the boy wonder and more just a smart crew member who happens to be a kid, but in seasons 1 and 2 (especially season 1), he's an irritating little prick who's right most of the time because the writers wanted him to be. For someone who started watching when the show was new, I guess I could see how those first two seasons might forever taint his character.Here's what I think people often overlook about old bastards such as myself. I remember when TNG was new. I excitedly watched the pilot back when I was a sophomore in HS. We had all grown up on TOS, where there was some darkness and the characters had, well, character. Kirk was a great captain who wanted to get laid (a lot) and hit people. He had good friends who were immensely competent and yet not afraid to tell him if he was full of shit to the extent that they'd fight over things. In other words, real people. Then TNG comes out and it's the completely opposite, thanks to Roddenberry's insistence that humanity has evolved to a point where they're far superior to all of us and smug about it. That's not what we wanted to see. It wasn't awful when it was actually being science fiction-y, but it wasn't really ST, either. Wesley was pretty much the personification of everything that was annoying about it. So what, now humanity has evovled to the point where even 15 year olds are idealized paragons of perfection and not obnoxious assholes? Sounds awful. Also, they had a tendency to use him in a "afterschool special" capacity, where they'd lecture people about grave social issues with Wesley and the youth stand in.
"Wesley, on my home world, there was so much poverty and violence that for some people, the only escape was through drugs."Jesus Christ, really?
"How can a chemical substance provide an escape?"
"It doesn't. But it makes you think it does."
- Tasha Yar and Wesley Crusher, discussing drug addiction
They did, from time to time. The aforementioned "Frame of Mind" is a good example. Also, the silly the one where Deanna is having nightmares ("one moon circles") and there's another nightmare one where it turns out they're all being experimented on in their sleep by aliens or something.
But yeah, it seemed like they just wanted to keep things light for the most part.
EB, you're over-generalizing from yourself to others. I was 13 when TNG started, and I, like many others, were drawn by the attempt of showing this "brave new world". At the age of 13, I probably would not have appreciated DS9's message of " whatever you don't like about the present, well boohoo, it's gonna be the same in the future". TNG was squeaky-clean, for sure, but it was a bit like Carl Sagan's "Cosmos": Let's escape for a while from the pesky meddlings of humans (aka the Cold War), and step into a shiny spaceship to see what's out there.But had you grown up watching TOS? Part of the deal is that TOS was set in a far better future, especially when compared to when it aired. The multicultural cast, the aversion to war, the notion that people were provided for all led to a tremendously optimistic outlook; that was a huge part of its appeal. Yet the original cast were all still humans (Spock obviously excepted).
Ummmmm. Two Minutes to Midnight? The Day After?Really? Huh. If I'm wrong then so be it. Can only go by what the mood was down here and nobody in my area really gave serious consideration that Ivan might blow us up. As it relates to ST, just seems to me like comparing 1966 to 1987 in terms of optimism is a complete blowout. Add domestic turmoil to that and the late '60s were pretty rough. A huge chunk of TOS's popularity was based on how bright everything could be in the future.
I was scared s***less in the 80's when i was a kid.
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So I'm just finishing up TNG, and after I watch the movies, I will start on DS9. I have never watched this series all the way through, only an episode here or there. What should I expect in regards to this series?Bad acting and excellent episodes/seasons. It's much darker than the other series and features extended story arcs, including a war that covers the last 3 seasons. Also some excellent characters, although not the ones they initially introduce. The really interesting folks will come along later.
Thanks, sounds like I'll have to be patient through the first season or so... not unlike TNG. :biggrin:Nah, first season is fine (although I thought the premier really sucked). It doesn't deal with the Dominion or the Klingons so it's not as well liked as 3-7, but it's perfectly entertaining. If you can stomach the constant Israel allegories the whole Bajor thing is quite interesting and the various flair ups with the Kardassians, settlers and separatists make for good TV.
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:clap: Congratulations. Hope that post wasn't too difficult for you.
So I'm just finishing up TNG, and after I watch the movies, I will start on DS9. I have never watched this series all the way through, only an episode here or there. What should I expect in regards to this series?Seven seasons of pure awesomeness. If you can tolerate TOS's hammy acting then DS9 will be easy. The first season - the pilot especially which has some utterly dreadful acting by near everyone - is the worst but everyone grows into their characters around season 3 and it becomes pretty much excellent from there on.
she asked me when we could start and I said: "When I'm done preparing a curriculum..."
Just tell her to watch all of TNG and then say " Imagine a shit version of that and you've got Voyager - and imagine that on a space station with series story arcs and you've got DS9. Then imagine it again but 100 years before Kirk and you've got Enterprise "
:lol
Selecting the TOS episodes was very easy as there isn't really any introduction phase or developing background story, just pick the essential ones, the cool ones and those with character background and you're done.You might consider skipping from TNG to VOY continuing with the selections, with the implicit advice that the best series by far needs to be watched pretty much as a whole. If she's up for it she can watch it on her own at that point. Like you said, there's too much development in the lesser episodes. That's something I come up with quite a bit since I'll omit 10-15% of the series when I rewatch through it. If you are going to do selections with it I'd consult Memory Alpha to find out what continuity issues there are with everything you skip. When you factor in the required understanding of Bajoran customs and religion, Dax's history, Bashir being a mutant, and the whole Odo/changeling/Founder thing it's pretty hard to watch it in a non-serialized way. At best I'd plan on watching all but the patently standalone episodes (mirror universe, alternate timelines, dreams, etc.).
With TNG there's quite a bit more to keep in mind: References to TOS and future spin-offs, the background stories (Worf's family and the Empire, Data's development and Lore, Q interactions and the Borg, Wesley and the Traveler, Tasha to Enterprise C to Sela, ...). My initial list had 60 episodes which would have been overkill. There were a few hard decisions like omitting the Chain Of Command and Birthright two-parters (and other episodes I really like), which are great but not really necessary.
DS9 is much harder and like I said I need a rewatch to be able to select the episodes. There's character development spread over a few slower ones in the first two seasons which are nice but not really necessary. And with the destruction of the Odyssey in 2x26 and the 3x01-02 Search two-parter with the introduction of the Defiant and the founders the overarching story starts sooner than what it feels like when thinking back to the last time I watched it. Not to mention how hard it will be to omit episodes once Worf is on board and Dominion background information is in almost every episode.
VOY is mostly self-contained and doesn't really have a lot of background story besides "getting home", so it will be much easier to trim down to the cool episodes.
ENT is probably the hardest to shorten, as it's riddled with references, has a full season 3 arc and the mini arcs in season 4 and many nice episodes in the first two seasons as well.
Then again I don't know if she's really up to go the full distance, nor if it's wise to do so. Maybe it would be better to stop after DS9 and let her explore the rest on her own. After all the goal is to get her into the story and characters and make it much more enjoyable to discover all the little details and additional information in yet unseen episodes later, whenever she decides to watch them.
If someone's interested in my episode lists, I'll post them.
Greetings...
Nef
I thought the ":lol" was more like dismissing the other series. I have trouble recognizing Kotowboy humour! :P
I think we just have a lot of love/hate in this thread for just about every series and movie. Maybe some day we will find that elusive thing we all unanimously adore. :biggrin:
Wrath of Khan for instance.
It is weird how in STID - Enterprise doesn't fire a single phaser or torpedo in the entire film.
Has that ever happened before in a Trek film ? Voyage Home probably :biggrin:
He looks pretty badass in that picture, though, combining the sleeveless look with his bald head. Badass enough to play the Rich.Yeah, I agree with all of that. It's just that nobody cool plays BC Rich, do they? I'm thinking Lita Ford and Slayer off the top of my head.
Ok, it would be *really* cool if the crew got the opportunity to restore the original time line. That would be quite the ethical dilemma. On one hand it would save all of Vulcan, on the other you're essentially killing everybody you know.Since I suspect this is the end of that particular franchise, it'd also be a nifty way for them to turn it into history and we can forget it ever happened. Pretty good idea, actually.
I'd totally be fine with that, because I agree, this will be the end of this particular crew. Not only that, but they could fold in a ton of original actors into the movie if they do it smartly.
Of course the actors would not be cool with NOT doing an action movie with absolutely no script whatsoever.
And I know for a Fact that Zachary Quinto HATES anything with a plot.
Simon Pegg has gone on record as saying that " PLot is over rated - just blow shit up. That's all actors really want.
Studying drama was a waste of time i've found out. "
I'd totally be fine with that, because I agree, this will be the end of this particular crew. Not only that, but they could fold in a ton of original actors into the movie if they do it smartly.
Wirst idea ever. They need to do something completely new.
I know everyone thinks the JJ movies are just Transformers with the Trek crew and I can't disagree enough.
My biggest worry is that Paramount just hands it over to someone like Michael Bay who will just turn it into a slow mo explosion fest with
Kirk wearing shades and firing two phasers then doing a slow mo walk away from an explosion. Shit life that.
That I DO NOT want.
And I wouldn't be hoping for any return to the prime timeline either. The current timeline is what the new viewers have seen, and they'll want to capitalize on that into the future if/when we get a new series.What would be the difference? Unless we get another Kirk, Spock and McCoy with completely different back-stories, then the changes are insignificant. Inexplicably different looking Klingons, a brewery in engineering and a helluva lot fewer Vulcans. Unless they're going to import the reality TV style the Abrams movies had, in which case I doubt people would even consider it Star Trek anymore.
Those look a lot more like Dreamworks characters than Pixar. Kirk has a vague resemblence to Mr. Incredible, but other than that, they're Dreamworks-style caricatures.
EDIT: What's funny, I personally never considered young Anakin to be nearly as bad as fucking Hayden Christensen. Holy shit, that guy is absolutely incapable of acting.Definitely. I never really hated JL because of his acting. I hated the character, his characterization and what it did to Star Wars. If E1TPM had been worth a fuck he wouldn't have bothered me much. HC was just a thoroughly detestable person in all regards.
I watched Into Darkness today. I think that if I didn't know anything about Star Trek other than the 2009 film, I would have really enjoyed it.
I watched Into Darkness today. I think that if I didn't know anything about Star Trek other than the 2009 film, I would have really enjoyed it.I had pretty much the exact opposite reaction. It was mostly the passing familiarity with ST that made me not hate it. I just don't much care for that style of filmmaking, so it's really only the characters that I can appreciate. Now, if I didn't know anything about TWoK I would have enjoyed it much more, as the ripoff aspect really dampened me on it.
I don't think so.I watched Into Darkness today. I think that if I didn't know anything about Star Trek other than the 2009 film, I would have really enjoyed it.I had pretty much the exact opposite reaction.
Now, if I didn't know anything about TWoK I would have enjoyed it much more, as the ripoff aspect really dampened me on it.
A totally random thought occurred to me today: So, TNG plays in the 24th century. That's about 400 years in the future. Now, if you look at the English language from 400 years ago, that's early 17th century, the time of Shakespeare. The pronunciation has shifted so much (check out this video: https://youtu.be/gPlpphT7n9s ), people in the 24th century would likely to be incomprehensible to us.
I still think that in that Voyager episode with Jason Alexander, Janeway should have made a comment at the end, something like: "Man, sometimes the choice of pronunciation of the universal translator is peculiar, to say the least. It gave Kurros the voice of a 20th century New Yorker."
Worf gets denied again and again:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edflm7Hh3hs
Worf is an hilarious character. Just the thought of a warrior like him being reduced to taking orders subserviently aboard a peaceful cruise liner :lol
Interestingly, I stumbled across the Memory-Alpha page on Klingon baldrics the other day. Actually most noteworthy Klingons wore them (as well as Andorians, apparently). They were normally just hard to notice. They tended to be more narrow and often blended in with the rest of their uniform.Worf is an hilarious character. Just the thought of a warrior like him being reduced to taking orders subserviently aboard a peaceful cruise liner :lol
It's so sad. He was supposed to represent how the Federation and the Klingon Empire were now allies, blah blah blah, but even the other Klingons gave him shit about it. Like, every time. And he had to bear it all while trying to keep his dignity and a straight face, and I honestly felt sorry for him sometimes.
That gold sash looked kinda cool, actually, but then we soon find out that no other Klingon ever wears one, and the other Klingons gave him shit about that, too.
I always think of this knucklehead.
(https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT8p6tMvdnt71oAJ3pna2HnunghjygpeUlptV6_r1b8BEvyjTgi)
Is that Henry Gibson ?According to IMDB it is, although I'd honestly never heard of him outside of being the head Illinois Nazi. Turns out he played a Ferengi once.
It's closer to Who Mourns For Adonais :P
Well not quite spelled backwards, but I think it was an intentional similarity.
Morn was a great character. There were always some great bits involving him. Worf cold-cocking him to impress Quark's wife. Jadzia wanting to bang him and getting turned down. In fact, as much as he was a reference to Norm he was also an offshoot of Kijé.
Kowtow, Norm was the resident drunk in Cheers. Didn't realize it before, but I suppose Cheers was an American phenomenon.
I need to pick up the Blu Ray Series for DS9.
I'm still mad that TNG wasn't initially shot on film so yeah, we get HD, but it's in 4:3. If only they hadn't shot the show on tape.
Even Seinfeld and Friends were shot on film which is why they can put out the full 16:9 HD versions, but TNG just feels so useless "re-mastered", like putting whip cream on a turd.
I need to pick up the Blu Ray Series for DS9.
Not even anounced so far. A few FX clips have been recomposited in HD though and they look great (DS9 HD Clip (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJs0-hhOZFQ)).
Greetings...
Nef
I'm still mad that TNG wasn't initially shot on film so yeah, we get HD, but it's in 4:3. If only they hadn't shot the show on tape.
Even Seinfeld and Friends were shot on film which is why they can put out the full 16:9 HD versions, but TNG just feels so useless "re-mastered", like putting whip cream on a turd.
Every Star Trek series was shot on film (35mm), it was only edited on tape at the time for the sake of the visual effects. They then rescanned all of the film elements for the HD versions. Widescreen =/= film. Those are not related things. No show at that time was shot in widescreen, whether it was on tape or film.
I actually hate seeing Seinfeld on TV in 16x9 because that's not how it was originally shot or intended at all, so it's artistically compromised, with heads cropped too close to the top of frame etc. The remastered TOS on TV is even worse. Unwatchable. They could just as easily have put the new TNG in widescreen (and may even still crop it for new TV broadcasts as they did for TOS and Seinfeld), but luckily stuck to how it was supposed to be. That was a huge concern I had with them remastering the show in HD.
I wish people didn't have this strange mental block that widescreen is always better, even when it destroys the integrity of the art. If it wasn't shot in widescreen, it shouldn't be widescreen.
I want to get the 10 movies boxset. Then I can get rid of all my individual movies on DVD that don't match :P
The cut of TMP is no contest. The original made no sense at all. It was the director's cut that added a few things to make the story work. Besides which, I almost always opt for the director's cut in any of these discussions. The theatrical version is usually what the pencil pushers want. I want what the creators wanted to make.
Here's something that had never occurred to me before, but probably happens quite a bit. I went back and watched the scene where Troi crashes the Enterprise in Generations. After they kill those awful Klingon bitches they're doing damage control, and they're all shouting like nobody could hear themselves think. Yet the only thing going on halfway loud was the score, which seems to be the thing they're having to shout over. Seems to be a common dramatic element that whenever there's danger about everybody has to shout at the top of their lungs, and it's usually the music they're competing with. Kind of reminds me of early Spock when he'd just randomly yell.
That'd be great. Like having high speed pursuit music that you could put on anytime things got hairy. I think The Simpsons did that gag once. "The hillbillies didn't start chasing us until you put on that banjo music!"Here's something that had never occurred to me before, but probably happens quite a bit. I went back and watched the scene where Troi crashes the Enterprise in Generations. After they kill those awful Klingon bitches they're doing damage control, and they're all shouting like nobody could hear themselves think. Yet the only thing going on halfway loud was the score, which seems to be the thing they're having to shout over. Seems to be a common dramatic element that whenever there's danger about everybody has to shout at the top of their lungs, and it's usually the music they're competing with. Kind of reminds me of early Spock when he'd just randomly yell.
Who knows, maybe the music *was* playing at the time. Maybe it's like in Family Guy, where Peter has his own theme music wherever he goes.
Sick with the flu and saw the 2 part with Spock on TNG on BBC America. I love when Data used the Vulcan nerve pinch to Sela and then Spock's reaction.
Every Star Trek series was shot on film (35mm), it was only edited on tape at the time for the sake of the visual effects. They then rescanned all of the film elements for the HD versions. Widescreen =/= film. Those are not related things. No show at that time was shot in widescreen, whether it was on tape or film.
I actually hate seeing Seinfeld on TV in 16x9 because that's not how it was originally shot or intended at all, so it's artistically compromised, with heads cropped too close to the top of frame etc. The remastered TOS on TV is even worse. Unwatchable. They could just as easily have put the new TNG in widescreen (and may even still crop it for new TV broadcasts as they did for TOS and Seinfeld), but luckily stuck to how it was supposed to be. That was a huge concern I had with them remastering the show in HD.
I wish people didn't have this strange mental block that widescreen is always better, even when it destroys the integrity of the art. If it wasn't shot in widescreen, it shouldn't be widescreen.
• I want the crew to end up in some weird area of space where physics makes no sense and everything is wrong.Fans of both the old and new ST would both love that, as would the critics. The masses would hate it and it'd end the franchise after losing a hundred million, therefore the studio would never, ever allow them to do it.
• Basically I want a movie like the TNG episode " Where Silence Has Lease " :)
A hint to the next movie was revealed to be " A huge moral dilemma ".
Someone online ( maybe here ) said they should find a way to restore the original timeline at the point of divergence - therefore erasing the last 30 years of their history. Thereby saving both Romulus and Vulcan and getting Spock Prime back to where he belongs. Plus it would end the third film back in the original timeline - leaving the three JJ movies as their own - alt universe franchise - and someone else can take over...
Sounds cool but I dunno if they would just wind up saying "none of this ever happened" - although that would be pretty funny / clever from a writing perspective.
I'm not so sure. Wouldn't surprise me a bit if that wasn't their plan all along. They knew they were looking at a three picture deal, so a temporary alternate universe story and then all back to normal seems perfectly plausible.A hint to the next movie was revealed to be " A huge moral dilemma ".
Someone online ( maybe here ) said they should find a way to restore the original timeline at the point of divergence - therefore erasing the last 30 years of their history. Thereby saving both Romulus and Vulcan and getting Spock Prime back to where he belongs. Plus it would end the third film back in the original timeline - leaving the three JJ movies as their own - alt universe franchise - and someone else can take over...
Sounds cool but I dunno if they would just wind up saying "none of this ever happened" - although that would be pretty funny / clever from a writing perspective.
Absolutely none of this is going to happen. :lol
Although it occurs to me that I might be giving Abrams, Orci and Kurtzman too much credit.
• Basically I want a movie like the TNG episode " Where Silence Has Lease " :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nziS8brN00
This is properly funny.
I'm not sure who the "actor" is playing Spock. I thought Christopher Lloyd.
All those... *clenching fists* emotions, they are over... *pained face* ...whelming me, I am... *sigh*
I can't... quite... *lunatic screaming* SPOCK, I... *calming down, sweating, panting* love...
*shocked expression* you... yes I... do, please... Bones, help me! *covering eyes with hands, crying*
Whedon...no contest.Because:
I wouldn't mind Nolan either.
Spielberg *can* be good, but I've discovered that he basically has two hats. His "action/sci-fi" hat and his "drama" hat. Within those two sides, he does tend to repeat himself quite a bit...but I suppose that's to be expected.
I guess I just don't understand why people criticize JJ Abrams for his "lens flare" signature and praise Spielberg, who had a very similar "signature" in his films. (the E.T./Poltergeist/Close Encounters backlighting thing that he did in these and several other films)
Whedon...no contest.Spielberg uses it on specific scenes for a particular dramatic effect relative to that scene. The red and orange lights worsening the terror Jillian was already dealing with. The white lights showing an angelic nature to the aliens (I watched CEotTK the other night). Abrams used the lens flare constantly to change the entire theme of his movie. Moreover, changing the tone to something pretty far removed from cinema and more into TV territory. That's why I refer to those movies as Star Trek for the reality TV generation.
I wouldn't mind Nolan either.
Spielberg *can* be good, but I've discovered that he basically has two hats. His "action/sci-fi" hat and his "drama" hat. Within those two sides, he does tend to repeat himself quite a bit...but I suppose that's to be expected.
I guess I just don't understand why people criticize JJ Abrams for his "lens flare" signature and praise Spielberg, who had a very similar "signature" in his films. (the E.T./Poltergeist/Close Encounters backlighting thing that he did in these and several other films)
There's no need to continue J. J.'s abomination, no matter which director. You don't create an alternate timeline so you are "free" of 40 years of canon and continuity just to put a bunch of kids on a starship and - remember, we're "free" of canon and continuity - tell variants of the same stories with little twists all over again, only this time without any logical structure or background development or emotional impact at all.
<snip>
...and you guys don't think the exact same effect (I remember seeing screen shots back to back from *several* of Spielberg's films...you would swear they were from the same movie, and maybe even just different angles of THE SAME SHOT) used over and over again has absolutely no bearing here?I have no idea where my original post about it is, so I'll just paraphrase. The problem with the lens flares (and the shaky cameras carried by people running around the action) is that it's an approach to change the entire tone. Rather than being cinematic, where the scenes are portrayed in front of you and it's the narrative that draws you in, it's filmed in such a way to make the viewer feel like he's right in the middle of everything. You don't need good stories or compelling characters because it doesn't need to be gripping. I'd rather have immersion from a great narrative sucking me in than because I feel like I'm trapped inside a bunch of chaos.
Ok, maybe you find the backlight effect less annoying than the lens flare effect...and that's perfectly fine...but don't pretend that they are any different in anything but personal taste.
An arc about the return of the Sisko just as Bajor is falling into chaos without the guide of the prophets. An arc about O'Brien facing a dilemma teaching at the academy. An arc about whatever happened on Cardassia Prime (Damar) and Qo'noS (Martok) after the Dominion war. Arcs with known characters as background and initiators with new characters to continue what they started... infinite diversity in infinite combinations, to boldly go where SciFi and TV have never gone before.Deep Space Nine was more or less given the green light on relaunch books to do whatever, because Paramount wasn't going back to that property. There was a really great written form Season 8 for the series, which culminated with a hardcover book, Unity. That series of books hit on most of those points, but you do realize Damar is dead, right? It kept going after that first set, but fell apart miserably soon after. They got onto a bad arc involving the mirror universe (who'd have thought?) and dropped where they were going in lieu of major changes. I've read where they went after I quit and I just can't understand why they would piss on Deep Space Nine the way they did. ...still, had a nice run going for Deep Space Nine fans to continue the story in a way that honored the series. Highly recommend it for Deep Space Nine fans, just read up until Wolrds of Deep Space Nine. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek:_Deep_Space_Nine_relaunch
A hint to the next movie was revealed to be " A huge moral dilemma ".
Someone online ( maybe here ) said they should find a way to restore the original timeline at the point of divergence - therefore erasing the last 30 years of their history. Thereby saving both Romulus and Vulcan and getting Spock Prime back to where he belongs. Plus it would end the third film back in the original timeline - leaving the three JJ movies as their own - alt universe franchise - and someone else can take over...
Sounds cool but I dunno if they would just wind up saying "none of this ever happened" - although that would be pretty funny / clever from a writing perspective.
Let's play a game of " Who Would You Like To Direct Star Trek 3 " and see if we can list our suggestions without bitching about the previous two movies !
My list would be :
• Joseph Kosinksi - Because Tron legacy and Oblivion are both gorgeous films.
• Chris Nolan - I'd love to see what he could bring to a Trek Universe.
• Joss Whedon - He cares about plot and characters and can clearly do action.
• Spielberg - because that would be all kinds of awesome - just keep Lucas away.
• Edgar Wright - mates with Pegg - directed a scene in Into Darkness ( Kronos ) - knows how to write cohesive stories with through lines.
...you do realize Damar is dead, right?
On TNG - almost nobody ever leaves a room on the first try. :lol
As a Trekkie I would say the inertial dampeners as well as artificial gravity were probably compromised. So, it shouldn't be too surprising if they all get pulled into different directions.
As a non-Trekkie I would say, yeah, they probably didn't think a guy 50 years later would create an animated gif that exposes this :lol
I just checked Balance of Terror, and you'd be keeping your money, Barto. There's another ship hit earlier in the episode with the same camera move, but without a big crew reaction.No dice, mate. I'd be taking your Kangaroo money. Balance of Terror after the atomic mine hits them 41 minutes in.
Any earlier episodes where they do it? I don't want to go and check a dozen episodes for them, but I'd give them a good skim if I knew I was searching the right episode.
I just checked Balance of Terror, and you'd be keeping your money, Barto. There's another ship hit earlier in the episode with the same camera move, but without a big crew reaction.No dice, mate. I'd be taking your Kangaroo money. Balance of Terror after the atomic mine hits them 41 minutes in.
Any earlier episodes where they do it? I don't want to go and check a dozen episodes for them, but I'd give them a good skim if I knew I was searching the right episode.
They haven't yet.
But more to the point, I don't think Star Trek works nowadays. If you could make ST for a small budget, it'd be fine for getting ST fans into the theaters. You can't, though. The special effects are too expensive, so you have to create a Summer blockbuster to suck in the masses. For one thing, that's not ST. Also, now that people have seen it twice, I doubt they'll be as gung-ho for a third. I also think a lot of the popcorn eaters will skip it since JJA isn't attached anymore.
They haven't yet.
It doesn't matter who is directing Trek 3 - they'll only be strong armed into making whatever movie the studio wants anyway.
So you can blame the writing and directing if you want but it may ultimately be Paramount calling the shots.
I would love it if the third movie restored the original timeline and basically said " well that's our universe over with ".
That way if you don't like the JJ era films - you can just dismiss them as an alternate universe that never happened.
It would be as smart as creating the alt timeline in the first place.
Voyager had a good cast and I liked the characters. Problem is that I watched the whole show from start to finish as it aired when I was a kid, and barely remember it.I did the same thing, and mostly hated it when it was done. Years later I rewatched it and decided it was far better than I thought. Darker and more tension than most ST.
EDIT: Except for Threshold. My god.
TV shows seem to always want to have a "recurring bad guy" and I understand that, but I thought the whole premise of Voyager tailored to break that mold, actually break new ground in terms of storytelling and, even better, Star Trek storytelling.One of several things they planned but fell apart on. And if it had been different sects the whole way it would have been alright. The problem was with it always being those Nistrum nimrolds. Like I said, they should have stuck with the street-gang theme. Constantly passing through different territories and dealing with different conflicts.
EDIT: Except for Threshold. My god.
Oh hell, who am I kidding? They never figured it out even with Jeri Ryan's boobs to work with. The Kazon were stupid, but Species 8472 were pretty awesome. I actually liked them more than The Borg because they were original and different, and reminded me of that one species from Babylon 5 that I can't remember the name of, but they were all CGI too. Yeah Jeri's boobs pretty much saved the show.
Nah, DS9 had the one where Quark dresses up like a woman and tries to seduce some Ferengi because... um profit or something. The episode is not painfully, "Threshold" bad, but it's pretty bad.Oh hell, who am I kidding? They never figured it out even with Jeri Ryan's boobs to work with. The Kazon were stupid, but Species 8472 were pretty awesome. I actually liked them more than The Borg because they were original and different, and reminded me of that one species from Babylon 5 that I can't remember the name of, but they were all CGI too. Yeah Jeri's boobs pretty much saved the show.And while Threshold was bad, there are other equally bad episodes in Trek. TNG did a similarly stupid episode with the entire crew turning into animals all over the ship. Every series has its share of equally bad stinkers, except maybe DS9, which had a pretty high average.
Nah, DS9 had the one where Quark dresses up like a woman and tries to seduce some Ferengi because... um profit or something. The episode is not painfully, "Threshold" bad, but it's pretty bad.Oh hell, who am I kidding? They never figured it out even with Jeri Ryan's boobs to work with. The Kazon were stupid, but Species 8472 were pretty awesome. I actually liked them more than The Borg because they were original and different, and reminded me of that one species from Babylon 5 that I can't remember the name of, but they were all CGI too. Yeah Jeri's boobs pretty much saved the show.And while Threshold was bad, there are other equally bad episodes in Trek. TNG did a similarly stupid episode with the entire crew turning into animals all over the ship. Every series has its share of equally bad stinkers, except maybe DS9, which had a pretty high average.
And you didn't like "Genesis?" Aw, that is a dumb one but I still find it pretty entertaining, unlike some of the other bad ones.
And while Threshold was bad, there are other equally bad episodes in Trek. TNG did a similarly stupid episode with the entire crew turning into animals all over the ship. Every series has its share of equally bad stinkers, except maybe DS9, which had a pretty high average.This is certainly true, and part of the point I made earlier about dividing each series into great, watchable and shit. They all break down about the same. Hell, half of TNG's first season is as bad as VOY got. Strangely, VOY's first season is pretty strong, most likely due to it being strike-shortened. There really weren't any duds in there, and the cast didn't spend too long working into their characters (probably because they never really developed).
The Kazon were stupid, but Species 8472 were pretty awesome. I actually liked them more than The Borg because they were original and different, and reminded me of that one species from Babylon 5 that I can't remember the name of, but they were all CGI too.
It's on BBC America and it's now going into Code of Honor. Say what you want about the first season on TNG, but I suppose what I like about it is that the MAJOR cheese factor makes it feel a lot like TOS.
Keep in mind that when this first came out, TOS was the only thing out there to compare it to. To most, it probably would have seemed much like Gene pretty much picking up where he left off. Sure it seems lame by later season standards, but I think it holds up well for what it was at the time.
I noticed on TNG that anytime someone from starfleet arrived alongside Enterprise D - they *always* turned up in an Excelsior class ship.Just as often they'd not show anything at all. Either way it was about money. They didn't really adopt CGI until VOY and midway through DS9, so all of those rendezvous shots in TNG were models and motion control photography. Just inventing the Excelsior would have cost a fortune, so instead of creating new ships they kept it and either reshot or used stock footage whenever possible. The only other ships you'd see were modifications to the existing models. I seem to recall that they cannibalized Reliant for a variety of different ships. Wouldn't surprise me if a lot of the new ships they did show in TNG were using parts of the Excelsior model, as well.
I remember in the Nitpicker's Guide to TNG, they mentioned how many times they used the same shot of the Enterprise orbiting a planet in different episodes.
It's also why they couldn't ding up Voyager throughout its run
Voyager was CGI from the get-go. It wouldn't have been that bad. And they did beat the hell out of it all the time (and add various enhancements). You never saw any changes to 1701D, regardless of how bad it got shot up. Though it's certainly still cheaper to be able to use the stock footage, even if it' CGI. I know part of the transition to CGI included the company that did it maintaining a database of all of the footage so it could be used over and over.
A neat thing about ST is that you'll notice something once, even after however many years, and then see it constantly. The most recent thing that I can't unsee is that anytime there's a task to be done, they'll usually get one of the main characters to do it, no matter how trivial. "Establish a tractor beam, Mr. LaForge." Is that really what you need your chief engineer to do? Voyager was particularly bad about it (although I've only recently started seeing this and it's what I've been watching of late). The other day, they're going into battle against the freaking Borg, and Neelix is manning the tactical station. Not due to crisis or anything, either. Apparently there's just no commissioned officer trained for bridge duty that isn't one of the main cast. Janeway was assisting in surgery the other night. Has Voyager ever sent a security team on an away mission? They're all over the ship, but nobodies never beam do planet or ship.
Maybe the reason it's so easy to commandeer a starship (or space station) or steal a shuttlecraft is because there are never more than 8 people around who aren't fat, lazy and out of practice to the point of worthlessness.
Since this is your business, after all, I won't argue with you, but I was of the opinion that VOY was CGI from the start, and once it was established that it was damned effective, they started using it on DS9 for the last few seasons (the reason we finally got to see big-ass fleet battles). That would make it around season 4 or so of DS9.
Yeah, I get that, but why do you need to introduce characters? There's no harm in having unnamed, generic redshirts do they day to day tasks. I think the concern was that if they have a single line, "arming photon torpedoes," you have to pay them SAG money. So rather than do that you get Neelix's pathetic ass to do it? There were 135 crewmen on Voayger.A neat thing about ST is that you'll notice something once, even after however many years, and then see it constantly. The most recent thing that I can't unsee is that anytime there's a task to be done, they'll usually get one of the main characters to do it, no matter how trivial. "Establish a tractor beam, Mr. LaForge." Is that really what you need your chief engineer to do? Voyager was particularly bad about it (although I've only recently started seeing this and it's what I've been watching of late). The other day, they're going into battle against the freaking Borg, and Neelix is manning the tactical station. Not due to crisis or anything, either. Apparently there's just no commissioned officer trained for bridge duty that isn't one of the main cast. Janeway was assisting in surgery the other night. Has Voyager ever sent a security team on an away mission? They're all over the ship, but nobodies never beam do planet or ship.
Maybe the reason it's so easy to commandeer a starship (or space station) or steal a shuttlecraft is because there are never more than 8 people around who aren't fat, lazy and out of practice to the point of worthlessness.
I mean, the obvious reason of course is the "cost" of introducing characters. From a storytelling perspective it's much better to have a small set of people, because then over time a history between the characters gets established, which then can create tension. As an example, sure, it's ridiculous to have your bridge helmsman (Paris) fly a shuttle, but if Kes happens to need a flight, you can expand and explore their tension.
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@realboborci What do you think of the news of NASA's real life Warp Ship Enterprise ? I want to join NASA to get a ride on that !
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@david0akes "What do you think of the news of NASA's real life Warp Ship Enterprise ?" Hate it. Violates canon;)
He's hardly one to talk, but that actually is a damn clever reply.
Anyway. The person I was watching this with pointed out that this episode shows a pretty clear difference between Picard and Kirk. Kirk would have read the falsified orders and just done them without question. Picard was more willing to think about what was happening and really question it. I thought it was a little silly how only Troi questioned what was going on in the beginning, but I also know everything as an audience member. It's hard to say how I would feel if I were there.Troi beating Data at chess is one of the cheesiest things ever shown in a particularly cheesy series.
Troi beating Data at chess is one of the cheesiest things ever shown in a particularly cheesy series.
How Kirk might have compared with Piccard is always interesting. In this case, I'm not sure it would have been any different. They knew there were significant questions about their mission before they got to the space station. Kirk wouldn't ignore those questions, though he might well give more weight to the import of their mission. Moreover, Kirk would be no more likely to fire on an [essentially] unarmed space station. You'll recall him shutting down all defense and weapon systems when Excalibur was preparing to blow them to hell and back because he knew a fellow startship commander wouldn't fire on a defenseless ship. He was certainly more of a cowboy, but he wasn't a madman.
Even more interesting is that Spock, like Data, draws a strong association between chess and logic, yet in TCM it's Poker that Kirk uses to save the ship; impressing Spock. Where I think there is a recurring theme, which is also present with Data/Picard (albeit more heavy handed and one-sided) is that it takes both logic and humanity to save the day. It's Hemispheres in Sci-fi TV form. Particularly once you throw McCoy into the mix, you've got Spock-Apollo, McCoy-Dyonysis and Kirk-Cygnus, constantly demonstrating the bridge and interconnectedness.
What I find interesting is that, like The Corbomite Maneuver, it's a scene where a logical character bases his thinking in chess, and his chess-thinking is shown to be limited. Is this a recurring theme on purpose?
The parallels aren't the bigger issue. The Kirk/Spock/McCoy dynamic is very rich because you have three characters with strong views who are are very willing to represent and argue for those views.Which is exactly why I bag on TNG so much. There is no passion there, and as such no conflict. That's why Riker is the only one there I think worth a fuck. Since you pointed it out yesterday I skimmed through Conundrum and Riker banging Ro is the perfect example of that. Nobody else on that ship would have done it.
The original Borg as imagined in TNG were the ultimate enemy. Without morals, completely decentralized and thus almost impossible to kill off.
Bummer they compromised that concept for the movie.
"Best of Both Worlds" remains my favorite piece of Star Trek ever.
The Best of Both Worlds > First Contact.
All Good Things > Every TNG Movie.
Redemption was kind of similar. You had the whole Klingon civil war going on, which was great, and Worf running off to actually act like a Klingon for a change. Part two you have Picard and Tasha Yar's daughter, and Data learning to be a captain. Again, I thought it was a perfectly good episode, and I always love Data being in command, but as a conclusion to part one it was a letdown. Then there's Time's Arrow which was great in part one, and absolutely dreadful in pt 2. Descent was an exception in that it just sucked ass from beginning to end.
Redemption was kind of similar. You had the whole Klingon civil war going on, which was great, and Worf running off to actually act like a Klingon for a change. Part two you have Picard and Tasha Yar's daughter, and Data learning to be a captain. Again, I thought it was a perfectly good episode, and I always love Data being in command, but as a conclusion to part one it was a letdown. Then there's Time's Arrow which was great in part one, and absolutely dreadful in pt 2. Descent was an exception in that it just sucked ass from beginning to end.
I would say one sure exception was Chain of Command Pt. 2 The climactic scene with Picard and the Cardassian was so damn brilliant.
It's a disaster.
Your mom's a disaster... in bed.It's a disaster.
This forum is a disaster.
Your mom's a disaster... in bed.It's a disaster.
This forum is a disaster.
Depends on the bed?Your mom's a disaster... in bed.It's a disaster.
This forum is a disaster.
Depends.
Your mom's a disaster... in bed.It's a disaster.
This forum is a disaster.
I kinda liked Captain Jellico. Yeah, he was a hardass and expected things done a certain way, but that's probably more common in the military than Picard's laid-back style. For the drama, they made him a bit of a dick, but he'd come around a bit by the end. If they'd figured out a way to bring him back, he could've been even less of a dick and it would've been fine, merely an extrapolation of the character.At times he seemed like a pretty nice guy. When he first came aboard he was excited and jovial. The second time he met with the Kardies (after flipping out on them the first time) he seemed downright magnanimous (albeit for only a minute or two). Where I run into a problem is figuring out what to do about Riker. Data was the best possible XO he could hope for; they were made for each other. While the tension with Riker is part of what made it all work, I have a hard time putting all of the pieces together.
And I share your WTF at Riker being the best pilot. 100% plot contrivance right there.
Yeah, I'm trying to think of a time Ronnie Cox was ever not awesome. I've always liked him (yes, even on "Apple's Way").There's a scene in Beverly Hills Cop that perfectly defines his character which is all on Ronnie Cox; they probably should have given him a writing credit for that one improvised bit. After Axl Foley conjures up the "alternate story" about how the titty-bar bust went down and the other two detectives fess up, Axl chastises them for "fucking up a perfectly good lie." Bogomil has to stifle a very slight chuckle while keeping up the authoritative demeanor. It establishes Bogomil as both a genuine hardass (which was already demonstrated), and a human enough guy to appreciate everything he just saw (I would have been rolling). My understanding is that was one of the bits that they improvised on set, and it perfectly explains why he can be a tyrant at work yet still the sort of guy that can get along well with a Foley-type maniac. All Ronnie Cox.
The Best of Both Worlds > First Contact.
All Good Things > Every TNG Movie.
I agree with both statements taken individually. However, where I have a problem is that in conjunction they suggest that FC isn't the best TNG movie. It was pretty crappy all things considered, but it was still the best of the lot. I enjoyed Insurrection more, but it also suffers the same faults and also doesn't really seem much like a movie. I think we all agree that it's just a 2 hour episode filmed with a bigger budget. FC seemed fitting of a big-screen and still had entertaining stuff going on, despite being pretty crappy ST (and introducing the damned Borg queen).The Best of Both Worlds > First Contact.
All Good Things > Every TNG Movie.
I can get behind this.
And yeah - FC is great the first time you see it. I find it rather boring on repeated viewings - worse with Insurrection.
So I'd say that him somehow getting to experience emotions was bound to happen sooner or later. The question was how it would play out, and how well.Well, right. It would have made for an episode or so worth of exploration. The truth is that we can't view humanity as objectively as he does, which makes him a valuable character. We do feel emotions, so him learning what he feels like to be scared shitless doesn't make for good viewing.
I think Brent's Data is the most believable "robot" character that's ever been seen on film.
You watch TNG and it's like - yep he's an android - not an actor in make up.
Problem, for me, was when he was asked to act different characters. While he had honed the role of Data to a T over the years, many of his other characters were more a mockery than anything else.
Over the years I have concluded that Brent Spiner is actually a pretty bad actor.
He was one of the best cast decisions by Roddenberry. Problem, for me, was when he was asked to act different characters. While he had honed the role of Data to a T over the years, many of his other characters were more a mockery than anything else.I certainly agree, but that's an issue with almost all ST actors. The thing is, they create their roles, so they're naturally perfect at portraying their respective characters. Nobody ever accused Shatner of being a great actor, but he is Kirk. He defined him and anybody else is really just trying to do a more subtle version of him. It's therefore pretty easy to see how Spiner is great at being Data. If they'd cast you in the role, you'd be great at being Data because he was your blank slate to define. DS9 was a fine example of that anytime they did alternate reality episodes. Most of them were terrible at playing other people. That's why the mirror universe episodes were so dreadful.
Over the years I have concluded that Brent Spiner is actually a pretty bad actor.
He was one of the best cast decisions by Roddenberry. Problem, for me, was when he was asked to act different characters. While he had honed the role of Data to a T over the years, many of his other characters were more a mockery than anything else.
Over the years I have concluded that Brent Spiner is actually a pretty bad actor.
Man, Pulaski was one of the biggest failed ST characters though. The times in which TNG plays was supposedly to be all mature and stuff, but she's essentially an open racist (in the sense that she deems Data nothing more than a robot).
I sure wasn't happy to get her back. I was certainly no Pulaski fan, but she was definitely an improvement over the supremely bland Crusher. At least being bitchy and condescending is a personality trait. Crusher was one of the few castmembers who actually had less character than Geordi, Spot and this guy (https://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20121211045829/memoryalpha/en/images/thumb/1/10/Relief_tactical_officer%2C_2365.jpg/180px-Relief_tactical_officer%2C_2365.jpg).Man, Pulaski was one of the biggest failed ST characters though. The times in which TNG plays was supposedly to be all mature and stuff, but she's essentially an open racist (in the sense that she deems Data nothing more than a robot).
You know a character is awful when you're excited to get Dr Crusher back.
Only one of those on TNG and she was an absolute biatch! lol
38 pages and I think it's time for El Barto to list everything he DOES like about Star Trek :lolAlready have. Besides which, I like damn near everything about Star Trek. It's just TNG and the two reboot movies that I don't like. Hell, I'm even pretty cool with Enterprise.
Talking about forceful reuse of existing of characters: The scene in TMP where Kirk, Nurse Chapel and Scotty try to save the transporting accident. Seriously, those three people are the most capable to fix a transporter malfunction? A fucking nurse, and the captain?!!
I know this thread is not for the TV shows but I'm a newbie wondering where to start in the Star Trek verse, there's like 4 different Star Trek shows on Netflix.
You're talking about the president of the Egyptian Bonanza Fan Club here. TOS is not going to be too cheesy. In fact, James T. Kirk will probably completely blow his mind.I know this thread is not for the TV shows but I'm a newbie wondering where to start in the Star Trek verse, there's like 4 different Star Trek shows on Netflix.
What makes you think that? This thread is for all Star Trek related stuff. :tup
If you're willing to stick with it, I'd go chronologically, which is Star Trek (the original series) + the first 6 movies, followed by The Next Generation, DS9, Voyager, and finally Enterprise (it's a prequel, but I'd say it still works better watched last given when it was made).
If you find the original series too cheesy, you could safely start with The Next Generation, or just watch the movies with the original cast (1 through 6) beforehand if they're on there. But the first movie is very plodding and dull even for most Trekkies.
I know this thread is not for the TV shows but I'm a newbie wondering where to start in the Star Trek verse, there's like 4 different Star Trek shows on Netflix.Regardless, Blob's is absolutely the way to go. You've got to take them in order. If 726 total episodes is too daunting for you, like if there's some major life-changing event coming down the pike or something, we could probably come up with a list of crucial episodes of each series. That'd probably knock 2/3 off, except for Deep Space Nine which can't be whittled down much at all.
You're talking about the president of the Egyptian Bonanza Fan Club here. TOS is not going to be too cheesy. In fact, James T. Kirk will probably completely blow his mind.
I know this thread is not for the TV shows but I'm a newbie wondering where to start in the Star Trek verse, there's like 4 different Star Trek shows on Netflix.
What makes you think that? This thread is for all Star Trek related stuff. :tup
If you're willing to stick with it, I'd go chronologically, which is Star Trek (the original series) + the first 6 movies, followed by The Next Generation, DS9, Voyager, and finally Enterprise (it's a prequel, but I'd say it still works better watched last given when it was made).
If you find the original series too cheesy, you could safely start with The Next Generation, or just watch the movies with the original cast (1 through 6) beforehand if they're on there. But the first movie is very plodding and dull even for most Trekkies.
You're talking about the president of the Egyptian Bonanza Fan Club here. TOS is not going to be too cheesy. In fact, James T. Kirk will probably completely blow his mind.
Regardless, Blob's is absolutely the way to go. You've got to take them in order. If 726 total episodes is too daunting for you, like if there's some major life-changing event coming down the pike or something, we could probably come up with a list of crucial episodes of each series. That'd probably knock 2/3 off, except for Deep Space Nine which can't be whittled down much at all.
:lol Fantastic. I don't know progmetty's tastes, so I was keeping it pretty general. If that's too much Trek, it could be cut down significantly, but I wasn't going to jump ahead just yet.
For some reason I read "The Next Theateration" so I thought the thread was about the new movies hehNormally I'd assume sombebody means the new version of BG, but given your fondness for antiquity (and Lorne Green, now that I think about it), you probably mean the old one. :lol
They don't have the original series or movies but I'm willing to find it and invest time watching, the only space related show I've seen and enjoyed was BattleStar Galactica and I'm in the mood for more space stuff now.
...and worked my way down
Makes sense, you know what else from the same era and is very episodic? Bonanza :biggrin:
I really enjoyed Where No Man Has Gone Before, better than Corbomite IMO. Cool plot and acting, special effects were better than I would have expected from the period.
Ah yes, the Tom Paris episode. Pretty good one.Eh, he just wanted to get payed for inventing the character. Honestly, I'd probably blame Berman more than that guy. He really did kind of did rip him off, ya know.
I want to punch the episode writer in the face though for not allowing the use of the connection. It would have given Paris an immediate depth straight from episode one.
Preparing for shit storm - but whatever -
Bob Orci on Stsr Trek 3 :
" I can tell you that it definitely takes place in [deep] space. They’re finally on their five year mission and that hasn’t been the case in any of the previous movies.
they’re going to hopefully discover some stuff that you haven’t seen before. "
Also he revealed that him directing it isn't set in stone yet.
I'm optimistic. It was allegedly Lindelof who pushed for Khan in the last film and Abrams who wanted the Alice Eve underwear scene.
That and Orci is actually a Trek fan.
They're writing the script now. 2016 is not that far away - so we should start to get drop fed information from now on I reckon.
:)
Preparing for shit storm - but whatever -
Bob Orci on Stsr Trek 3 :
" I can tell you that it definitely takes place in [deep] space. They’re finally on their five year mission and that hasn’t been the case in any of the previous movies.
they’re going to hopefully discover some stuff that you haven’t seen before. "
Also he revealed that him directing it isn't set in stone yet.
I'm optimistic. It was allegedly Lindelof who pushed for Khan in the last film and Abrams who wanted the Alice Eve underwear scene.
That and Orci is actually a Trek fan.
They're writing the script now. 2016 is not that far away - so we should start to get drop fed information from now on I reckon.
:)
I'll wait until I see something tangible before I believe anything just yet, as I recall them saying very different things about the script for the last movie, and then it ended up just being a TWOK wannabe for the 3rd time in a row. :lol
I'm not optimistic about Orci either, but we'll see. You know I'm going to watch it day 1 regardless, so it will get a chance.
I don't see ST09 as a TWOK rehash. Nemesis was absolutely and STID borrowed one scene and twisted it to make a thematic point. Nemesis just stole everything for no reason other than they wanted to go out with a bang and tried to Ctrl-C Ctrl-V the entire movie onto the TNG mould.
Kirk had to die in the engine room in STID because it was hinted from the beginning of the movie. He had to learn to be a leader and not put himself first.
B4 was in Nemesis becasue....Because TWOK !
McCoy: Mr. Spock, remind me to tell you that I'm sick and tired of your logic!
Spock: That is a most illogical attitude.
I was half way through the second episode on the list when I realized Uhura is a black woman and not a very tan white woman. Thought it was me then I noticed that every time there's been a black actor on the show so far they've had some sticky looking layer of white coating on their faces, for lack of a better term since I don't know a lot about make up.
I don't know, when I think of TUC and TVH, Spock had become so normal anyway, the counterweight wasn't necessary anymore.
Spock dies and returns from the dead?! Looks like this thread is gonna be spoilers town for me from now on :lolSpoilers won't hurt you much here. And you got a long ways to go before the whole Spock thing.
I'll try glancing over posts before I read but probably won't work heh
Yeah, coming back from the dead mellowed Spock out quite a bit. Don't dislike him, really, but it does diminish the tension between him and McCoy quite a bit.
And only five episodes in, and Uhura not showing up all that frequently or saying/doing much, I'm surprised he even noticed her existence yet. Really, her whole purpose on the show seemed to have been be black and occasionally sing or offer feminine/Christian/racial commentary. Not dissing her, and clearly Nichelle Nichols inspired a helluva lot of people, but as a character she was barely a cut above Rand or this guy (https://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090306193559/memoryalpha/en/images/thumb/3/3a/Leslie_%28Lieutenant%29.jpg/292px-Leslie_%28Lieutenant%29.jpg).
In one of the most painfully bad episodes of the entire series. No, it doesn't.Yeah, coming back from the dead mellowed Spock out quite a bit. Don't dislike him, really, but it does diminish the tension between him and McCoy quite a bit.
And only five episodes in, and Uhura not showing up all that frequently or saying/doing much, I'm surprised he even noticed her existence yet. Really, her whole purpose on the show seemed to have been be black and occasionally sing or offer feminine/Christian/racial commentary. Not dissing her, and clearly Nichelle Nichols inspired a helluva lot of people, but as a character she was barely a cut above Rand or this guy (https://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090306193559/memoryalpha/en/images/thumb/3/3a/Leslie_%28Lieutenant%29.jpg/292px-Leslie_%28Lieutenant%29.jpg).
As a character she didn't get a lot of development or the character moments of the big guys, but in terms of exposure she was certainly a lot more memorable than redshirt #12 or Rand. And she kissed Kirk. That has to count for something, right? :lol
In the episode "Day of the Dove", it was a Klingon named Mara, but the picture actually shows Kang. Oops.I certainly considered Mara. But you're right, that's definitely Kang and the caption's just wrong (Kang was never on the bridge). And I would consider Mara anything but inquisitive.
New book review: Fun With Kirk And Spock (https://trekmovie.com/2014/07/25/book-review-fun-with-kirk-and-spock/)
Watching Dark Page right now. Another episode I feel is very well done, and one of the most emotionally moving episodes of the series.Had to look up Dark Page just to see what the hell it was. Like all Luwaxana Troi episodes it's in the half that hate. :lol And no, I never saw anything in Majel. She wasn't bad as Number One, but Nurse Chapel did nothing at all for me, and Luwaxana was one of the most annoying aspects of the entire series. She actually made Counselor Troi seem pleasant.
Also, is it just me? Or did Majel get sexier as she got older? In TOS, I thought she was a little "man-ish"....but as Troi's mom, she was just completely different...and kinda hawt.
Also, is it just me? Or did Majel get sexier as she got older? In TOS, I thought she was a little "man-ish"....but as Troi's mom, she was just completely different...and kinda hawt.
"Angel One" is a good one, having both a hot main actress, and the chick from Knight Rider.Good call on the main actress chick. She had a cute, Teri Garr thing working.
Lwaxana's best episodes were on DS9. She was actually tolerable there and she had some good chemistry with Odo.
Which leads me to the Playboy, Teri Garr photo shoot that of course I saw as a teen. Like I didn't know where my dad's playboys were stashed.Teri Garr was never in Playboy. You thinking of Goldie Hahn, perhaps?
Lwaxana's best episodes were on DS9. She was actually tolerable there and she had some good chemistry with Odo.
For sure. They were actually pretty decent episodes, and they gave her character a bit more depth. I just found her annoying in TNG.
And sexy is never a word I would use to describe her either.
Lwaxana's best episodes were on DS9. She was actually tolerable there and she had some good chemistry with Odo.
For sure. They were actually pretty decent episodes, and they gave her character a bit more depth. I just found her annoying in TNG.
And sexy is never a word I would use to describe her either.
This is probably way off topic, but you understand that there are really attractive women who aren't sexy, and there are VERY UNATTRACTIVE women who are sexy. Pretty/attractive is completely and totally different than sexy.
Sexy involves a way of carrying oneself...a confidence...and a host of other things that have absolutely nothing to do with physical attraction or beauty.
Which leads me to the Playboy, Teri Garr photo shoot that of course I saw as a teen. Like I didn't know where my dad's playboys were stashed.Teri Garr was never in Playboy. You thinking of Goldie Hahn, perhaps?
Honestly, for a teen, a stick figure with giant boobs was usually enough.Which leads me to the Playboy, Teri Garr photo shoot that of course I saw as a teen. Like I didn't know where my dad's playboys were stashed.Teri Garr was never in Playboy. You thinking of Goldie Hahn, perhaps?
Not naked but in sexy lingerie and an interview. For a teen, that was enough.
Looks like Teri Garr did a 20 questions for Playboy. Coincidentally the same issue with Denise Crosby. Can't find any pictures.Which leads me to the Playboy, Teri Garr photo shoot that of course I saw as a teen. Like I didn't know where my dad's playboys were stashed.Teri Garr was never in Playboy. You thinking of Goldie Hahn, perhaps?
Not naked but in sexy lingerie and an interview. For a teen, that was enough.
I think when all is said and done - the three Bad Robot Star Trek prequels will be vastly superior to the Lucasfilm Star Wars prequels.
( yea I know that's not exactly difficult :p )
Posted today on Takei's FB page:
https://lockerdome.com/tre/6170042811288129/6890797111052306
Posted today on Takei's FB page:
https://lockerdome.com/tre/6170042811288129/6890797111052306
I saw that on some Doc and us geeks sometimes forget they are real people. A great honest moment in Star Trek history.
Doohan > > > > > Pegg by a f---ing long way.
Damn, Michael Dorn is aging terribly.
He likes Star Trek Nemesis and hates Insurrection the most - which I am totally on board with.
Damn, Michael Dorn is aging terribly.
And .. you can tell that by the edge of his cheek? :lol
Watching The Nostalgia Critic's 10 movies he loves that everyone hates.
He likes Star Trek Nemesis and hates Insurrection the most - which I am totally on board with.
But then he says Matrix Reloaded is *better* than the first one...
:omg: In what universe ?!
Damn, Michael Dorn is aging terribly.
And .. you can tell that by the edge of his cheek? :lol
In Shatner's books, the joining of Decker with Ilia is the birth of the Borg. One of his better ideas IMHO.
It's a neat idea, but official canon puts the origin of the Borg at around 200,000 years ago as a normal biological lifeform.
It's a neat idea, but official canon puts the origin of the Borg at around 200,000 years ago as a normal biological lifeform.And there's that.
It's a neat idea, but official canon puts the origin of the Borg at around 200,000 years ago as a normal biological lifeform.
Plus, Guinan knew them from centuries ago.
Instead of viewing Decker-Ilia as the starting poin of the Borg, a much more likely story would be that V'ger was "upgraded" by the Borg.This was a much better premise. It came across a "similar" life form and it was repaired and rebuilt with the capability of fulfilling it's mission.
The Borg never assimilated inferior technology or lifeforms. I recall Seven pointing out that the Kazon and Telaxians were both deemed unworthy of assimilation. They would have had access to what Voyager already knew when they upgraded it anyway.I didn't know that. I guess I didn't watch enough Voyager to pick up on it.
Yeah, assimilating an entire planet full of Neelix's probably would have lowered the collective intelligence of The Borg by a statistically noticeable amount. :lolThe Borg never assimilated inferior technology or lifeforms. I recall Seven pointing out that the Kazon and Telaxians were both deemed unworthy of assimilation. They would have had access to what Voyager already knew when they upgraded it anyway.I didn't know that. I guess I didn't watch enough Voyager to pick up on it.
Yeah, assimilating an entire planet full of Neelix's probably would have lowered the collective intelligence of The Borg by a statistically noticeable amount. :lolThe Borg never assimilated inferior technology or lifeforms. I recall Seven pointing out that the Kazon and Telaxians were both deemed unworthy of assimilation. They would have had access to what Voyager already knew when they upgraded it anyway.I didn't know that. I guess I didn't watch enough Voyager to pick up on it.
I always assumed they assimilated everything, but I guess it makes more sense to only assimilate races from which you could learn something.Yeah, but that was when they were trying to persuade somebody to go along with assimilation. I think there needs to be some sort of quid pro quo, and the Telaxians didn't bring much to the table.
But didn't the Borg say something about improving the quality of life, in one of their earliest appearances? Or am I misremembering?
One of the things that always annoyed me about ST TNG and onwards is when they would use Earth idioms and just dump in some alien species.
For Example : " She ran in there like a Talaxian Bull in a china shop ! "
Just make up an alien idiom ! You will understand it's meaning by the context which it is used.
Just to try and get back to the appropriately level of nerdishness, wouldn't the UT use "flu" for all sorts of similar infections?
I got all of my DVDs more recently (but individually), so luckily they all match. It also means I'm stuck with the theatrical cut of TMP.Man, the theatrical cut of TMP made zero sense. I'm surprised they even still offer that thing.
STXI and ST:ID don't match the rest, or each other, but they did come in a 2 movie boxset, so it looks as matched as it can.
I got all of my DVDs more recently (but individually), so luckily they all match. It also means I'm stuck with the theatrical cut of TMP.Man, the theatrical cut of TMP made zero sense. I'm surprised they even still offer that thing.
STXI and ST:ID don't match the rest, or each other, but they did come in a 2 movie boxset, so it looks as matched as it can.
Yeah, I suppose you're right. Made available is fine, but necessarily promoted? Nobody thinks the original was better in this case. As opposed to GL who is universally considered to have completely fucked up SW.I got all of my DVDs more recently (but individually), so luckily they all match. It also means I'm stuck with the theatrical cut of TMP.Man, the theatrical cut of TMP made zero sense. I'm surprised they even still offer that thing.
STXI and ST:ID don't match the rest, or each other, but they did come in a 2 movie boxset, so it looks as matched as it can.
Despite the theatrical version being a rushed mess, I'm all for the original version of a movie still being available (see Star Wars OT), and the people who do like it were probably mostly the ones who saw it back in 1979, and want the version they remember. So there would be demand for it, as far as that movie goes.
Well, you just blasted one of the most revered episodes in all of Star Trek. :lol
A couple of things to get used to. Bad people will take over the ship all the time.
But letting Khan go was pretty reasonable (for what we know up until now, at least). He was a genuine badass, and not inherently evil; just ambitious. Plus, if you think about it, he and his goons would probably be damned difficult to imprison. Leaving them all stranded on a deserted planet was as good a strategy as any at that particular point of time.
IMHO, anyone who doesn't look at TOS within the context of the time period it came out in, is simply never going to be able to appreciate it for what it was. That, combined with the fact that no one ever imagined in a million years that the show would A) ever be rewatched at all...B) much less rewatched over and over and over again...and C) dissected in high definition.
Well, he didn't try to blow the ship up. He was trying to steal it. And I believe the only person they tried to kill was Kirk. Still, the nature of his crime was irrelevant. I think what really mattered is that Khan was very likely the most advanced human in the universe. Kirk understandably felt that killing him or tossing him away would be a loss. Stradning him on Ceti Alpha whatever was a good solution. Hell, even Spock expressed curiosity at what might become of the planet in a hundred years.But letting Khan go was pretty reasonable (for what we know up until now, at least). He was a genuine badass, and not inherently evil; just ambitious. Plus, if you think about it, he and his goons would probably be damned difficult to imprison. Leaving them all stranded on a deserted planet was as good a strategy as any at that particular point of time.
The fact they he wasn't inherently evil doesn't change the fact that he tried to kill Kirk and threatened to kill the crew then attempted to blow up the Enterprise, I mean this was the most gruesome villain so far! I thought severe punishment was due unless I missed something about them being indestructible, I mean Kirk did manage to defeat him in a hand to hand combat and Khan's men fainted when gas was released into that meetings room. I would have just blasted Khan and his men into space if you can't execute them for some reason.
Well, you just blasted one of the most revered episodes in all of Star Trek. :lol
As for Khan, the subplot with McGiver was pretty silly. I always thought she flipped out way too early. But letting Khan go was pretty reasonable (for what we know up until now, at least). He was a genuine badass, and not inherently evil; just ambitious. Plus, if you think about it, he and his goons would probably be damned difficult to imprison. Leaving them all stranded on a deserted planet was as good a strategy as any at that particular point of time.
Something that intrigues me is whether Space Seed would still get the love it does if not for TWoK 15 years later. It'd still be a good episode, but being part one of the Khan story boosts it considerably. I doubt it's a top ten episode as a stand alone.
I love the scene where he's trying to get Marla to betray the Enterprise for him, and she won't do it (at least not right away), and he gets mad and says "Then go!" and then realizes that he still kinda wants to bang her so he quickly adds "...or stay. But do it because it is what you want to do." Nice save, Khan.Khan hadn't yet broached taking the ship yet. Go or stay was pretty much just him trying to get into her skirt. Then she says she'll stay for a few more minutes, and that's when he makes her ask permission. Only then does he tell her he's taking the ship. At that point he'd already established his dominance so he knew he could roper her in. As for why it all worked, part of it was that she was weak, part of it what that he was charismatic as all fuck, particularly to a horny historian, but most of it was him expertly playing her. Everything that happened in that scene was him reading the scene and manipulating her flawlessly. Now that I think about it it's exactly what Kirk was always doing, albeit nowhere near as dramatically or expertly.
So she decides to stay, but he needs to get the upper hand again, so he acts all annoyed and says "You must now ask permission to stay." And she does. Pathetic (of her). Was it his amazing charisma, or was she just weak-willed? Probably both.
On the topic of TOS, I must say that any episode involving children makes me want to gouge out my eyes.
Watching "Wink of an Eye" (TOS) right now, where these people who live in accelerated time invade the Enterprise. Great idea as a plot setup, but damn they throw out consistency 30 second into the episode. For quite a while the two time frames run essentially at the same speed, whereas they are supposedly off by a factor of 100 or something. By the time Spock devises counter measures, weeks would have passed in accelerated time.Beyond my level of nitpickiness. Still a very good episode.
There was an episode of TNG that was equally stupid with everyone turning into animals too.
As far as Voyager goes, I think Distant Origin and Spirit Folk were much worse. Spirit Folk is the only episode in all of Trek that I couldn't sit through. Threshold was stupidly fun, in the way that Spock's Brain is (although Spock's Brain gets a bad rap and isn't all that bad compared to the rest of TOS).
There was an episode of TNG that was equally stupid with everyone turning into animals too.
As far as Voyager goes, I think Distant Origin and Spirit Folk were much worse. Spirit Folk is the only episode in all of Trek that I couldn't sit through. Threshold was stupidly fun, in the way that Spock's Brain is (although Spock's Brain gets a bad rap and isn't all that bad compared to the rest of TOS).
Do you mean Genesis? I love that episode! lol It's one of the only episodes I know the name of.
I like Genesis overall, but what annoyed me was that every human devolved into something different. Riker into a Neanderthal (at least that makes sense), but Barkley a spider?!Add to that, how is it that after several days they fixed everybody up and there weren't one or two hundred crewmembers missing? I get that TNG Worf was a real pussy of a Klingon, but he couldn't eat anybody on a ship full of easy prey? Didn't they say half the crew was living in the arboretum? Not one predator got in there? TNG was way too chickenshit about letting people die.
That's interesting! If I ever get around to watching the movie a second time, I'll keep an eye out for that.
That's interesting! If I ever get around to watching the movie a second time, I'll keep an eye out for that.
I'm still amused you hate that film *quite* so much after only one viewing. Did you go to see it in the cinema ?
Did you go in expecting to hate it ? I've seen films that i'd hated on first viewing which i'd loved later.
Kotow and Odo.
Kotow and Odo.
:lol
Where's Zy when you need a photoshop gold moment.
Even at a quick glance by name, I'd choose at least 30, surely plenty more if I read through the descriptions. Voyager is underrated.
As for ENT, just watch S3, and the S4 mirror universe episode and you're more than covered.
Even at a quick glance by name, I'd choose at least 30, surely plenty more if I read through the descriptions. Voyager is underrated.
As for ENT, just watch S3, and the S4 mirror universe episode and you're more than covered.
I like Enterprise's Augment Trilogy. Although I thought that Soong being the creator of both Khan & Data was pushing it a bit.
What?
When they released the remastered version of TOS they should have added Dax or Sisko somewhere in a corridor.Part of me thinks that's way too George Lucassy, and part of me thinks it's freaking brilliant.
Even at a quick glance by name, I'd choose at least 30, surely plenty more if I read through the descriptions. Voyager is underrated.Yeah, I certainly agree about VOY.
As for ENT, just watch S3, and the S4 mirror universe episode and you're more than covered.
When I did go back to season 4 I couldn't even make it through the first few episodes. It's really just terrible. I think I stopped at the one where Phlox's shithead friend gets a coworker killed in one of the most reprehensible acts you'll ever see in ST. I will say that while toying around with canon to force the Borg into the thing was a bad move, that episode wasn't bad at all.
BTW, totally random observation: Have you noticed how the beds in sick bay are always ridiculously narrow? I just watched an episode where T'Pol was required to have 24 hours bed rest, but it must have been hell. The slightest turn would make you fall off.
Yeah, it does much better the second time through for that very reason. That's why I've changed my stance on it. You might also find that season 3 isn't actually all that much better than the other two. Good Xindi stuff with a ton of typical ST filler. Upon a second trip through season 4 is painful to watch.
Season 3 also includes an episode which Brannon Braga called the singularly most embarrassing episode of ST he'd ever been associated with. LeVar Burton told the producers he was ashamed to have directed it. All the more interesting since LeVar had been featured in a very similar episode in TNG. Burton then followed that up by directed probably the best episode of ENT they made (Similitude).
https://io9.com/the-top-100-star-trek-episodes-of-all-time-1641565699Lists like those tend to bug me since it's so subjective. Tons of things I could complain abut, but who'd listen. Instead I counted how many I could identify just from the picture. Got 72, including a couple of tricky ones.
I would definitely have chosen Similitude for ENT, and In a Mirror Darkly, despite my dislike for the rest of S4.Last time I watched Year of Hell it occurred to me that Annorax was a real dumbass, which lessened the episode quite a bit. For all of his intelligence with temporal mechanics, and all the time he had to ponder it, it never occurred to him that erasing the time ship would solve his problems? And you're right about Janeway in Equinox. I forgot how far off the deep end she went. Just like Picard in every TNG move.
For Voyager, I would definitely not have chosen Equinox. Janeway was PMS'ing so hard in part 2 that I assumed she'd been possessed by an alien entity. The Void was ok, but not near one of the best. Year of Hell and Timeless would be my top picks. Both amazing.
Good choices for DS9 and TNG. Can't argue with those.
For TOS, I mostly agree too, although I wouldn't put BoT quite so high. Still near the top of TOS, but not the best. COTEOF is easily the best TOS episode imo, and I think Tribbles deserves its place too. I'd probably choose Amok Time for second place from TOS.
I didn't actually read the list, because with over 700 episodes, they're bound to miss episodes I think should be there, and include ones I don't agree with.
I figure that time travel is too difficult to predict for him to have known the results of destroying the ship, especially as he kind of existed outside of time. It might have been a fluke that it worked. Time travel usually has its problems in TV shows and movies, so it's hard to know exactly how things should work.Well, you got two problems there. This guy was supposed to be the all-time genius of temporal mechanics. And he had centuries to research what was up. Their entire existence involved figuring out what to erase to restore the timeline. While others might have had an excuse, he did not. The other problem is that it's common sense. They knew that erasing the first civilization is what mucked things up, so by erasing the instrument of that first destruction the original timeline restores and that's that. If you want to say that the solution was too simple for somebody as highly trained and focused as Annorax then so be it. Maybe it's a problem that required Naomi Wildman to figure out, but to say that it was too complicated doesn't work for me. It was too simple, instead, and somebody on that ship should have had the idea.
Janeway didn't kamikaze run his ship to fix the timeline, she did it because she was totally screwed anyway and wanted to take him down with her, so it's not like Voyager had it figured out either. One of the most badass moments in Trek.
I figure that time travel is too difficult to predict for him to have known the results of destroying the ship, especially as he kind of existed outside of time. It might have been a fluke that it worked. Time travel usually has its problems in TV shows and movies, so it's hard to know exactly how things should work.Well, you got two problems there. This guy was supposed to be the all-time genius of temporal mechanics. And he had centuries to research what was up. Their entire existence involved figuring out what to erase to restore the timeline. While others might have had an excuse, he did not. The other problem is that it's common sense. They knew that erasing the first civilization is what mucked things up, so by erasing the instrument of that first destruction the original timeline restores and that's that. If you want to say that the solution was too simple for somebody as highly trained and focused as Annorax then so be it. Maybe it's a problem that required Naomi Wildman to figure out, but to say that it was too complicated doesn't work for me. It was too simple, instead, and somebody on that ship should have had the idea.
Janeway didn't kamikaze run his ship to fix the timeline, she did it because she was totally screwed anyway and wanted to take him down with her, so it's not like Voyager had it figured out either. One of the most badass moments in Trek.
What's getting a bit on my nerves is the Malcolm guy. I think they overdid his stuffiness/Britishness/Self-pitying.
What's getting a bit on my nerves is the Malcolm guy. I think they overdid his stuffiness/Britishness/Self-pitying.
Yeah, he might be the worst character on the show. So far, I'm enjoying it more than Voyager and there don't seem to be many bad episodes. I know a little bit about some of the upcoming stuff due to reading other people's comments about them, but I'm saving my judgement. The most consistent characters up to this point are Phlox and Hoshi. They haven't been featured very much, but you usually know what you're getting from them.
Different question: Did any captain ever consciously sacrifice a crew member to save the rest? The only instance I can think of is Troi's officer training, where sending Geordi into that tube would save the rest but kill him. But that was hypothetical; did anybody ever do it? Every episode seems to be about risking everything just to save that one guy.Kirk jettisoned Finney during the ion storm. The fact that Finney faked his own death doesn't change the fact that Kirk actually did hit the button.
Of course that's correct, but it doesn't change the fact that Annorax was a dumbass.
ANNORAX
Every time I see that episode I have to think of that :lol
So, do people who don't like the episode Anoraknophobia?
Every time I see that episode I have to think of that :lol
So, do people who don't like the episode Anoraknophobia?
Ok - supposing they did a JJ Abrams style TNG movie reboot .
How would you cast the Bridge Crew ?
Picard could be played by Tom Hardy ironically or Michael Fassbender or make it really confusing and cast James Mcavoy :P
Riker could be played by Ryan Reynolds or Brandon Routh or Logan Marshall Green from Prometheus.
Worf could literally be anyone.
Data could be played by Sam Huntington.
Geordi Could be Chiwetel Ejiofor.
Troi could be Noomi Rapace - she's already got that weird accent :P
I know you're being ridiculous, but that sounds unintentionally AWESOME!!! (except for the Meghan Fox bit...can't we get someone cuter and less plastic?)
;)
Worf could literally be anyone.
Valid point. I mostly skip it because I find androgynous people creepy as hell.
I'm on season 3 of ENT, and man, it's no surprise then whole thing got axed later. There's just so many stinkers, I'm right now watching "North Star", which is just a lame excuse to shoot a Western.
North Star was a dud, but that season is easily the best. You're not even half way through, so you haven't seen a lot of the best stuff yet.
Is that the one with native american issues? Also where Wesley has visions and meets back up with the traveler?
Is that the one with native american issues? Also where Wesley has visions and meets back up with the traveler?
I had to go to IMDB to look it up. The episode is called "A Fistful of Datas" from season 6. Simply terrible episode.
OK, on the last season of ENT right now, and yeah, a very mixed season. Hoshi just overrode Enterprise's decontamination chamber door from the inside, because "math is just another language". Ugh.Isn't that like the third or fourth time she's done improbable stuff with math because of her language skills? End of last season she cracked an alien encryption code.
But yeah, I agree, too many forced throwbacks. Especially the Tellarites and the Orions, both of whom, let's be honest, were just plain TOS "alien of the week" nonsense.¿Que?
I was about the post the sentence "at least they left the Gorn in TOS", but then I realized, that's actually the biggest shit show :(
It's even more complicated than that, because while TOS was futuristic, it was 1960s futuristic. Take for example the huge red triangle between Sulu and Chekov. It's an item of Enterprise's future, but it also clearly is a 1960s person's idea of the future.Uh, typing too fast or did you have some weird brain-fart where you got stuck between English and Deutsch? :lol
And don't get me started on Spock's "shine in the eyes blue light" device. :lol
It's even more complicated than that, because while TOS was futuristic, it was 1960s futuristic. Take for example the huge red triangle between Sulu and Chekov. It's an item of Enterprise's future, but it also clearly is a 1960s person's idea of the future.
And don't get me started on Spock's "shine in the eyes blue light" device. :lol
It's even more complicated than that, because while TOS was futuristic, it was 1960s futuristic. Take for example the huge red triangle between Sulu and Chekov. It's an item of Enterprise's future, but it also clearly is a 1960s person's idea of the future.Uh, typing too fast or did you have some weird brain-fart where you got stuck between English and Deutsch? :lol
And don't get me started on Spock's "shine in the eyes blue light" device. :lol
But you're right. Brightly lacquered balsa wood doesn't really look very spacey. And the chairs were straight out of a 60's ultramodern wetdream. Yet at the same time it actually did seem more like a functional spaceship than most of the others. D's bridge looked like the break room at Google HQ, and the rest of it might as well have been the Pacific Princess. Defiant just looked cluttered with people working wherever they could find a spot. At least with Enterprise they did actually make it look functionally thought out. Similar bridge. All the decks and quarters seemed cold and metallic. The engine room looked like it was lifted from a Russian Submarine.
I won't fault TNG for that, since they were intentionally going for that look, as if space travel had gotten to the point where it basically was an ocean liner, hence the families travelling on board. I recall they even originally planned to have couches on the bridge at one point. I think it's pretty typical of '80s futuristic design. In the 1960s, just getting into space at all was futuristic enough. :lolI can see that working if you want a Starship Bistromath sort of thing, where the ship flies itself and you have nothing to focus on other than adventure. But they had 200 years of experience to tell them that lots of important stuff happens on the bridge. If you're going to be blowing people up and overseeing the welfare of a whole shit-ton of cruise passengers, you need a bridge and not a lounge.
You also have to keep in mind that Roddenberry had a huge boner for all things navy, which probably influenced the desire for functionality in the early designs. He wanted submarines in space.
Starship BistromathI know what it looks like.
Never heard of this guy, never seen any of his movies, and it seems like a really oddball choice to me, but it's not Orci, so that's still an improvement.
Never heard of this guy, never seen any of his movies, and it seems like a really oddball choice to me, but it's not Orci, so that's still an improvement.
Edgar Wright ?! :eek
Shaun of The Dead
Hot Fuzz
Scott Pilgrim Vs The World
The World's End
Was going to direct Ant Man but quit.
Also directed the UK TV Show Spaced. And most of his stuff has been with Simon Pegg so you'd get a good Pegg performance !
He'd be the perfect choice.
He is known for slapstick comedy. He is immensely talented, but I am not at all sure he is right for something like Star Trek.
If he does it in the style of the first half of the trailer I'll be happy. If he opts for the second half action/sci-fi/laserexplosionmutantrobotbullshit I'll be gravely disappointed. Sadly, I'm not optimistic.He is known for slapstick comedy. He is immensely talented, but I am not at all sure he is right for something like Star Trek.
I'd hardly call "Spaced" slapstick comedy. He's not Adam Sandler.
Spaced is a cult sci fi sitcom which riffs on popular and nerd / geek culture.
Scott Pilgrim and World's End were both smaller budget movies and every penny is on the screen. he can certainly do good choreographed action and not just close up shaky cam.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQA7HcRcLNg&spfreload=10
Sadly, I'm not optimistic.
Nah, you're just being negative. :lolSadly, I'm not optimistic.
Well there's a surprise... ::)
First Contact was decent but Inusrrrection was just bad. I'd sooner have JJ than Frakes.
All the TNG movies have aged really badly for me except generations which I still love.We are opposites. I never want to see either of them again, and I won't see this third one, either.
I can watch the JJ Star Trek films again and again.
So this will have new writers? That's a good start.
Agreed Hef. I also think that Star Trek was loosing steam with the newer generation that needs all the bells and whistles of today's movies. The hardcore fans like EB, Rumbo and Blob do not like the newer franchise but is has brought in new fans and revived a stumbling franchise.
I don't really get the hate for Insurrection. Sure, it felt like a long TNG episode, but I'm not sure I see the problem with that.
It's a good movie but coming off the heels of First Contact, most of the movie viewers felt underwhelmed.
Sorry to be correct on this one. Still, like I said, it's Hollywood and they've got their target audience for the franchise. They're not going to blow 200 million on good sci-fi. They'd rather make it that action/sci-fi/laserexplosionmutantrobotbullshit that fills up 3d theaters.Sadly, I'm not optimistic.
Well there's a surprise... ::)
Well he didn't direct the first few - only the most recent 3. . .Yeah, that's not actually a good sign. :lol
Just scrap it and bring Trek back to TV where it belongs.
I have no idea what he knows/loves about Star Trek. But I think that may not be the most relevant thing in the world.Considering Abrams, I don't think it really matters much anymore.
I think at WORST we'll get a fun action movie.So.... basically ST09 and STID again then.
I have no idea what he knows/loves about Star Trek. But I think that may not be the most relevant thing in the world.Considering Abrams, I don't think it really matters much anymore.
The most important thing is they get someone who can write a fricken script and not hack one out. That's more important than who directs it IMO.I think at WORST we'll get a fun action movie.So.... basically ST09and STID again then.
The question is where do you go with it? Another 75 years into the future? You've got two different gaps in what they've done, but you'd be so surrounded by canon that you'd be pretty limited. That's why VOY worked (at least to the two of us). You can't really set it in a static location, as we saw with DS9. The one thing JJA did right was finding a way to reboot the whole thing to provide a blank slate. Yet transferring that to TV wouldn't work without that cast, and sadly that won't happen.
Star Trek really needs to return to TV, with someone in charge who understands real scifi. TV is in desperate need of some scifi right now.
The question is where do you go with it? Another 75 years into the future? You've got two different gaps in what they've done, but you'd be so surrounded by canon that you'd be pretty limited. That's why VOY worked (at least to the two of us). You can't really set it in a static location, as we saw with DS9. The one thing JJA did right was finding a way to reboot the whole thing to provide a blank slate. Yet transferring that to TV wouldn't work without that cast, and sadly that won't happen.
Star Trek really needs to return to TV, with someone in charge who understands real scifi. TV is in desperate need of some scifi right now.
I really wish they'd release the DS9 series on Blu Ray.
The Starship Enterprise is 50 years old.It's already in the Smithsonian. Alas, it's in the gift shop (places I habitually avoid) so I didn't know to look for it.
December 29, 1964. Richard Datin, Mel Keys, and Vern Sions pose outside the model shop in Burbank, California, with the newly-completed model of the original Starship Enterprise.
(https://i62.tinypic.com/2rvxx06.jpg)
Designed by art director Walter M. Jefferies (in whose honor the Jefferies Tubes are named), the model is currently being prepared for its new home in the Boeing "Milestones of Flight" Gallery, opening in 2016 at the Smithsonian National Air and Space Museum.
the humans on Star Trek aren’t even human. The aliens are human.Always nice to see your opinions validated by some random stranger on the internet.
I did rock climbing once. It was a 20-foot wall in a sporting goods store. The "rock wall" was some kind of heavy plastic, and the footholds were colorful things bolted onto it. I wore a harness attached to a pulley manned by a guy half my age. No danger at all. Still, I got maybe halfway up and decided that maybe rock climbing isn't for me.
I read that earlier, but from a crappy site.
It's like nobody involved has any clue what Star Trek is. Directed by Fast and Furious guy, co-written by Simon Pegg, this is shaping up to be even worse than Into Darkness. It will be a miracle if I'm even able to sit through the next one.
:lol If it was announced that Nick Meyer was directing and Harve Bennett & Leonard Nimoy were writing it
El Barto and Blob would still bitch and moan.
Star wars may be well organized but their last trilogy was so poorly written, that it turned Science fiction fans into Telemundo fans.
Pegg may be a comic actor but he can definitely write.He can definitely write comic stuff. I have no reason to believe he can write Star Trek.
I think the opposite. Yes I agree that Star Trek has always been story driven. The rating for the last TV show and the movie franchises were doing so poorly that they needed a different approach. Trek fans cringe but it's the truth. I myself hope out of this that the newer movies lead to a TV show again where they can concentrate on the storyline again and let the movies be the action films to draw the non Trek fans in.
I think they should do away with movies altogether. Star Trek is built for TV.
Let's hope that the newer interest again in Start Trek leads to a TV show and we discuss it's meters then. At least I'm hoping for that.Yeah, but the new interest isn't in what Star Trek has always been. The interest is in big-budget action sci-fi films, that are Star Trek in name only.
Totally random thought I just had: It's weird that the two bookending series (TOS & ENT) are the least "Star Trek" to me.
They're kinda like WDADU: Sure, it got the whole thing started, but one really only listens to it for completion's sake.
I don't know; to me, TNG, VOY and DS9 are the real "Star Trek" to me. Anybody else feel that way?
This never made any sense to me at all.Totally random thought I just had: It's weird that the two bookending series (TOS & ENT) are the least "Star Trek" to me.
They're kinda like WDADU: Sure, it got the whole thing started, but one really only listens to it for completion's sake.
I don't know; to me, TNG, VOY and DS9 are the real "Star Trek" to me. Anybody else feel that way?
Sorta. I can't really take TOS seriously on the same level as the later series, and when they contradict each other, I naturally give the benefit of the doubt to the later series. But unlike WDADU, TOS is still enjoyable. :lol
This never made any sense to me at all.Totally random thought I just had: It's weird that the two bookending series (TOS & ENT) are the least "Star Trek" to me.
They're kinda like WDADU: Sure, it got the whole thing started, but one really only listens to it for completion's sake.
I don't know; to me, TNG, VOY and DS9 are the real "Star Trek" to me. Anybody else feel that way?
Sorta. I can't really take TOS seriously on the same level as the later series, and when they contradict each other, I naturally give the benefit of the doubt to the later series. But unlike WDADU, TOS is still enjoyable. :lol
Sticking to every word of TOS is comparable to Christians still believing the world is 6000 years old. It doesn't work. At some point you have to relax the interpretation a bit.
Even Roddenberry saw it that way. TNG took preference when it came to canon.Yeah, but Roddenberry was a maniac. :lol
With a charm and sincerity that clearly came from a person who was used to studying human behavior from the perspective of one who looked into the future, Roddenberry said that he expected -- indeed, he hoped -- that in the years to come, new generations of fans would look at the new forms of STAR TREK being produced and say, "This is real STAR TREK. Those other people back there at the beginning, they didn't do it half as well.""»Like I keep saying, the man was a fucking menace. :lol
Err, you are aware that there is a whole episode about Data commanding his own ship, and the problems associated with it, right?
Not on TNG he didn't ;DYou only specified TNG characters not that it had to happen on TNG. ;)
And Geordi got the hottest woman in the entire ST universe...even though it was only her simulation and not the real thing. Leah Brahms :hat
Personally don't like that pic as well. It's weird, I've looked up several pictures of her, and I think she's just hotter in that role for some reason.
Maybe it was the "Dr Quinne Medicine Woman" hair and the fake beauty mark... :lol
Definitely Worf. And definitely not Worf. His par'Mach'kai tend to die much too soon.Except for the one who needed to die in season 1.
Personally don't like that pic as well. It's weird, I've looked up several pictures of her, and I think she's just hotter in that role for some reason.
Maybe it was the "Dr Quinne Medicine Woman" hair and the fake beauty mark... :lol
Wtf dude :lol
I was gonna reply that the pic above makes her look way hotter than in the episode. Yeah, you must have a thing for that Victorian-style woman :D
The one positive about Nimoy's passing is that they probably won't try to write an X Men style old Kirk and Spock vs Young Kirk and Spock team up.
I don't know why anyone would want 83 year old Bill Shatner as Kirk.
Because there needs to be at least something legitimate Star Trek in the next movie. :neverusethis:I'm surprised you're even giving any thought to the next movie. Hell, even Kowtowboy thinks it's gonna suck.
I wish that STXI was Nimoy/Spock's last appearance. It would have been a nice passing the torch moment, and a better finish for the character than Into Darkness.
I wouldn't be surprised if the next movie mentions Spock Prime dying.
One of many US-centric ideas in the Star Trek universe. When was the first time they mentioned the location of Starfleet? Was TMP the first time, or was it established in TOS? I can't say it surprises me that an American show tries to appeal more to Americans, but it would be nice to see an attempt to be more global.I was thinking it was TWoK. Not sure if they mention it in TMP.
One of many US-centric ideas in the Star Trek universe. When was the first time they mentioned the location of Starfleet? Was TMP the first time, or was it established in TOS? I can't say it surprises me that an American show tries to appeal more to Americans, but it would be nice to see an attempt to be more global.I was thinking it was TWoK. Not sure if they mention it in TMP.
I like the "200 yeares since Picard" idea. But, the twist is than Picard is still the captain! They uploaded his brain patterns into Data, who now lives as aSpock/Bones hybrid of two personalities.
See, we already have the first episode down. Something terrible happens to Picard, and he's on the verge of death. Data struggles with the realization that he can't feel any emotions regarding this, and at the end he merges Picard's brain with his, thus saving Picard, and at the same time understands emotions.
Side plot: Wesley falls into an Agony Booth. Nobody helps.
I like the "200 yeares since Picard" idea. But, the twist is than Picard is still the captain! They uploaded his brain patterns into Data, who now lives as aSpock/Bones hybrid of two personalities.Yeah, every ship has a holographic Picard on the bridge now. "Well, lieutenant, I'm stumped. Better activate the EPH."
See, we already have the first episode down. Something terrible happens to Picard, and he's on the verge of death. Data struggles with the realization that he can't feel any emotions regarding this, and at the end he merges Picard's brain with his, thus saving Picard, and at the same time understands emotions.
Side plot: Wesley falls into an Agony Booth. Nobody helps.
I like the "200 yeares since Picard" idea. But, the twist is than Picard is still the captain! They uploaded his brain patterns into Data, who now lives as aSpock/Bones hybrid of two personalities.Yeah, every ship has a holographic Picard on the bridge now. "Well, lieutenant, I'm stumped. Better activate the EPH."
See, we already have the first episode down. Something terrible happens to Picard, and he's on the verge of death. Data struggles with the realization that he can't feel any emotions regarding this, and at the end he merges Picard's brain with his, thus saving Picard, and at the same time understands emotions.
Side plot: Wesley falls into an Agony Booth. Nobody helps.
Yeah, it will be
1. Here we are exploring
2. Wait, something happened
3. Look it's another bad guy with plans for galactic domination
4. Lens flares/other visual effects & explosions
5. Kirk bangs an alien and the good guys win
Yeah, it will be
1. Here we are exploring
2. Wait, something happened
3. Look it's another bad guy with plans for galactic domination
4. Lens flares/other visual effects & explosions
5. Kirk bangs an alien and the good guys win
Justin Lin isn't a horrible director. If he gets good material to work with, he'll be fine.
They'll cast him as a red shirt and the joke will be on us.Most badass redshirt ever.
They should make a movie with an incredible lineup of top actors, and they all die as redshirts in the opening scene :lol
Don't recall that they did that. Honestly, though, never cared much for the show.They should make a movie with an incredible lineup of top actors, and they all die as redshirts in the opening scene :lol
Just like the TV show with Leslie Nielsen, Police Squad. The killed every special guest for every episode. :lol Don't miss this link.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sCBj7z7Afs (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sCBj7z7Afs)
Don't recall that they did that. Honestly, though, never cared much for the show.They should make a movie with an incredible lineup of top actors, and they all die as redshirts in the opening scene :lol
Just like the TV show with Leslie Nielsen, Police Squad. The killed every special guest for every episode. :lol Don't miss this link.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sCBj7z7Afs (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sCBj7z7Afs)
Interesting side-bit: the reason Leslie Nielson was so good at that was that he had absolutely no sense of humor whatsoever. The ZAZ guys were pretty clear that he never got anything and never understood what they were trying to do, which is what made him so perfect for the part.
Yep, Leslie Nielson's characters were always the straight guy, completely unaware of his own cluelessness and the insanity around him, much of which was caused by himself. That's why it worked.Graves figured it out eventually, as did Lloyd Bridges. According to ZAZ it was Robert Stack who straightened them out. "Guys, we're the joke here." After that they both got it and ran with it. Stack got it all along and thought the whole thing was awesome.
Same with Peter Graves. I remember seeing an interview with Peter Graves about Captain Oveur from "Airplane!" and how first of all, he had no idea why they would want him to be in a comedy, since he definitely was not known for his comedic chops. One of his friends, a fellow actor (I forget who), told him that the secret to comedy is that the characters don't know they're in a comedy. You play it completely straight, and that's what makes it funny. It made no sense to him, but he decided to at least check out the script. What?! An airline pilot asking a little boy about Turkish prisons and gladiator movies? People would think he's some kind of homosexual pedophile. But his friend told him that that's what's so funny. Nobody could ever imagine Jim Phelps saying that, so it's perfect. So Graves did it, and still had no idea why it was so damned funny, but people loved it.
Yep, Leslie Nielson's characters were always the straight guy, completely unaware of his own cluelessness and the insanity around him, much of which was caused by himself. That's why it worked.Graves figured it out eventually, as did Lloyd Bridges. According to ZAZ it was Robert Stack who straightened them out. "Guys, we're the joke here." After that they both got it and ran with it. Stack got it all along and thought the whole thing was awesome.
Same with Peter Graves. I remember seeing an interview with Peter Graves about Captain Oveur from "Airplane!" and how first of all, he had no idea why they would want him to be in a comedy, since he definitely was not known for his comedic chops. One of his friends, a fellow actor (I forget who), told him that the secret to comedy is that the characters don't know they're in a comedy. You play it completely straight, and that's what makes it funny. It made no sense to him, but he decided to at least check out the script. What?! An airline pilot asking a little boy about Turkish prisons and gladiator movies? People would think he's some kind of homosexual pedophile. But his friend told him that that's what's so funny. Nobody could ever imagine Jim Phelps saying that, so it's perfect. So Graves did it, and still had no idea why it was so damned funny, but people loved it.
I knew what date that was posted before I even clicked it.
How about Benson? :lolYeah, that's when I first encountered him.
Never even heard of it, but if it's pre-DS9, it doesn't count. :blob:
Early '80s sitcom. Sorry king, that sounds awful. :lol
Early '80s sitcom. Sorry king, that sounds awful. :lol
Aren't you a Golden Girls fan? :lol
I sense they're hiding something.
I sense pain.
I feel a presence of some kind.
If I was Picard, I couldn't help but think "this would be much more useful if you were a real Betazoid". :lol
In the first few seasons she was hardly more than "Captain Obvious having orgasms on the bridge", yeah.Did they really struggle more with the ladies then the gent? Seems to me that all of the characters were essentially the same person, so it was merely their job descriptions that would make them more or less interesting. Eventually all of the characters got flushed out, at least within the confines of Roddenberry's twisted utopia, but that was necessary for all of them.
Overall, I think TNG struggled with their female characters, and I'm not certain why. They did so well with Major Kira and Dax in DS9. Janeway and Torres were okish. T'Pal and Hoshi were pretty colorless again.
Or as people over the age of 16 call it..
...a "photo". ::)
Kotowboy isn't happy unless he's unhappy about something. Then he's happy.That's certainly the way it comes across sometimes.
https://io9.com/simon-pegg-worries-the-love-of-science-fiction-is-makin-1705420424
Hmmmm......
https://mashable.com/2015/05/19/enterprise-building-star-trek/ (https://mashable.com/2015/05/19/enterprise-building-star-trek/)The author of that article is seemingly unaware there were other ST series than TNG. That looks a helluva lot more like Voyager than any of the Enterprise variants.
Every comment I've seen has said the same thing, although I'd say it looks much more like the Enterprise-E. Voyager didn't has that clear separation between saucer and secondary hull.Stubbier secondary hull, shorter nacelles in relation to the rest, and far more oblong primary hull. Sticking with Voy. Though I can see your E similarities (I didn't realize that its hull wasn't circular).
Either way, it's clearly a Trek ship, so that's pretty cool.
Blob - an aside - have you heard of a jazz guitarist from Sydney called Carl Orr ?
just asking since he taught at the school where I did my degree :)
I think I've seen all Alexander episodes now, and they all sucked.A couple were good despite whoever played the role of Alexander. Reunion is excellent even though that kid tries his damnedest to ruin it. And the wedding episode was good, right up until the actual wedding itself. How on Qo'noS could the Klingons be so ridiculously cheesy. Still, the first 40 minutes are entertaining.
But at the very least, it couldn't be worse than Into Darkness, right?Yeah, it could. But I don't think it will.
I think both of the new Star Trek movies are entertaining and fun, in the same way that most action blockbusters are entertaining and fun. Switch your brain off, enjoy the spectacle, and be pleasantly surprised if the plot is actually interesting and doesn't have too many obvious holes. If you can enjoy them on that level, cool. Some people still won't like them, but whatever, you can't please everyone.
The group they tend to divide the most is the hardcore Star Trek fans. They don't like how a certain character is portrayed, or how something from canon was changed or ignored, stuff like that. And a lot of them still fall into the first category (the movie is still entertaining and fun) but a lot of them simply cannot get over the fact that it's Star Trek, but it's not "their" Star Trek, the one they know and love and expect it to be.
The group they tend to divide the most is the hardcore Star Trek fans. They don't like how a certain character is portrayed, or how something from canon was changed or ignored, stuff like that. And a lot of them still fall into the first category (the movie is still entertaining and fun) but a lot of them simply cannot get over the fact that it's Star Trek, but it's not "their" Star Trek, the one they know and love and expect it to be.This.
I think the other complaint from hard core Star Trek fans is that these new movies move far away from the thought provoking, social commentary and general scientific premise of past movies and shows. They are 'dumbed down' action movies set in the star trek universe and don't invoke the same mantra as before.Also this.
I think this is patently false. I don't know of many ST fans that didn't like the characterizations, I thought they were great, and revising the cannon was a good move. The reason it sucked isn't because of trekkie, anal-retentive nitpickings, but because it was simply Transformers set in the ST universe. Rather than not being the ST we remember, it just isn't ST at all. If they decide to make an actual sci-fi movie with the pieces they have in place, rather than a typical blockbuster explosion-fest, I suspect it'll be very good.
The group they tend to divide the most is the hardcore Star Trek fans. They don't like how a certain character is portrayed, or how something from canon was changed or ignored, stuff like that. And a lot of them still fall into the first category (the movie is still entertaining and fun) but a lot of them simply cannot get over the fact that it's Star Trek, but it's not "their" Star Trek, the one they know and love and expect it to be.
Enterprise is the FII of Star Trek. Initially hated, but the more time passes, the more one appreciates it.
Enterprise is the FII of Star Trek. Initially hated, but the more time passes, the more one appreciates it.
Nah. The difference is that FII was hated because it was different, but was actually awesome. Enterprise was just beyond stale rehash at that point and doesn't deserve any better than it gets. The only season that I think is worthwhile is S3, which was a really strong season, but then they lost all of that and went for contrived fanwank garbage for S4.
Enterprise is the FII of Star Trek. Initially hated, but the more time passes, the more one appreciates it.
Nah. The difference is that FII was hated because it was different, but was actually awesome. Enterprise was just beyond stale rehash at that point and doesn't deserve any better than it gets. The only season that I think is worthwhile is S3, which was a really strong season, but then they lost all of that and went for contrived fanwank garbage for S4.
I quite liked the Augments story arc.
T'Pol > 7 of 9 for looks.
Come at me :hat
If you mean Jolene Blalock vs Jeri Ryan, I'd accept that.
T'Pol > 7 of 9 for looks.
Come at me :hatIf you mean Jolene Blalock vs Jeri Ryan, I'd accept that.
Yes. I prefer 7 as a character definitely.
If you mean in character, no way. If you mean Jolene Blalock vs Jeri Ryan, I'd accept that. The gaunt pixie bowl cut look doesn't do it for me though.
On this we disagree. As I've often said, 7 never did much for me but Annika Hansen with the longer hair was gorgeous. While I'm not a fan of the chile bowl haircut, T'Pol was still better looking, and better built, than 7. And for that matter, the short hair on JR was even less flattering than on JB.T'Pol > 7 of 9 for looks.
Come at me :hat
If you mean in character, no way. If you mean Jolene Blalock vs Jeri Ryan, I'd accept that. The gaunt pixie bowl cut look doesn't do it for me though.
If there's one thing Enterprise is not, it's different and fresh. Most of it was rehash from earlier Trek (a lot of it from Voyager too), and it tried to copy the dynamic of TOS, except without the charm and attitude that made it work in the first place.When I went back and rewatched it, season 3 didn't fair as well as I expected. While the Xindi storyline is very good, there's a ton of filler in there. Remember that more than half the episodes are unrelated or only tangentially related to the Xindi. Some were good and some were awful. Season two lacked the recurring story but might have been stronger in terms of quality vs shit episodes.
I think S4 was an attempt at trying to gain back the ST viewers who had abandoned it by relying on past Trek. The show was boxed in by canon from the start, and they spent the first two seasons skirting around it on technicality so they could tell stories that weren't really ideal for it, then for S3 they came up with something fresh of its own that worked well, then for S4 they decided to go all in and tell stories that either shouldn't or didn't need to be told, or wouldn't have needed to be told if they wrote the show properly from the start. It was a confused mess. They should have just left it alone.
The producers involved didn't want to make any more Trek after Voyager, but the network pushed them, and that really shows imo with how uninspired the show is.
On this we disagree. As I've often said, 7 never did much for me but Annika Hansen with the longer hair was gorgeous. While I'm not a fan of the chile bowl haircut, T'Pol was still better looking, and better built, than 7. And for that matter, the short hair on JR was even less flattering than on JB.T'Pol > 7 of 9 for looks.
Come at me :hat
If you mean in character, no way. If you mean Jolene Blalock vs Jeri Ryan, I'd accept that. The gaunt pixie bowl cut look doesn't do it for me though.
If there's one thing Enterprise is not, it's different and fresh. Most of it was rehash from earlier Trek (a lot of it from Voyager too), and it tried to copy the dynamic of TOS, except without the charm and attitude that made it work in the first place.When I went back and rewatched it, season 3 didn't fair as well as I expected. While the Xindi storyline is very good, there's a ton of filler in there. Remember that more than half the episodes are unrelated or only tangentially related to the Xindi. Some were good and some were awful. Season two lacked the recurring story but might have been stronger in terms of quality vs shit episodes.
I think S4 was an attempt at trying to gain back the ST viewers who had abandoned it by relying on past Trek. The show was boxed in by canon from the start, and they spent the first two seasons skirting around it on technicality so they could tell stories that weren't really ideal for it, then for S3 they came up with something fresh of its own that worked well, then for S4 they decided to go all in and tell stories that either shouldn't or didn't need to be told, or wouldn't have needed to be told if they wrote the show properly from the start. It was a confused mess. They should have just left it alone.
The producers involved didn't want to make any more Trek after Voyager, but the network pushed them, and that really shows imo with how uninspired the show is.
JR was way too tall for my taste, and while she did have more meat on her, it didn't do anything to make her curvier. The only curves she had were those enormous tits, whereas JB was nicely built from to to bottom. How many times did you ever see JR and think "wow, great ass!"?On this we disagree. As I've often said, 7 never did much for me but Annika Hansen with the longer hair was gorgeous. While I'm not a fan of the chile bowl haircut, T'Pol was still better looking, and better built, than 7. And for that matter, the short hair on JR was even less flattering than on JB.T'Pol > 7 of 9 for looks.
Come at me :hat
If you mean in character, no way. If you mean Jolene Blalock vs Jeri Ryan, I'd accept that. The gaunt pixie bowl cut look doesn't do it for me though.
I'm not a fan of having the hair up at all, and JR did look better with her hair out (who doesn't?), but even with hair up I preferred it to the Vulcan bowl, especially the bad wig from the first couple of seasons. It wasn't looking too bad in S3 and 4 when they switched it out though, and sorted out the eyebrows a bit.
I don't see how Blalock was better built. She was a twig with bolt-on tits. She looked a lot better in the later seasons when they had the more fitted coloured outfits, rather than the steel wool potato sack of S1/2, but you can't compete with the wonders of the corseted catsuit. :lol (even out of the suit I thought she had a much better figure).
But hey, I'm not kicking either one out of bed! Each to their own.
I actually thought that often. Are you getting the two confused, because Blalock was the one with no ass. She was just a straight line with tits. The two are pretty much the same height too, 7 of 9 just had the heels.I guess it just comes down to preferred body types. Seven just always seemed to have no real defining features other than being a giant with a huge rack. Since I prefer smaller framed girls, which is not to say skinny, BTW, JB always came off better IMO. Also, the heals were part of the problem. I've never been a fan of the way high heals reshape the legs/ass.
So do I, but Jolene is pretty hot, too.Well, yes.
So do I, but Jolene is pretty hot, too.
Yeah, I agree, but that wasn't the initial point. JR>JB, IMO. T'Pol>SoN.So do I, but Jolene is pretty hot, too.
Well, yes. (but not as T'Pol imo)
I don't think I've ever actually seen JB outside of a TV show, just doing an interview as herself, or even seen her properly smile. That bumps her up a few notches (although I already thought she was hot out of costume anyway). The fact she's a pretty crummy actress usually works against her too, and she seems to be a total airhead from that interview (which could be viewed as a pro or a con depending on how you want to look at it :lol )I generally tend to not judge anybody's acting based on their ST character. She played a convincing Vulcan and that's that. It's when they try to play other characters that you see how good or bad they are. That's why all of the DS9 mirror universe episodes sucked so horribly, horribly, badly. So I have no idea if she's a decent actress or not. As for the airhead part, probably, but she just seemed more doped up in that interview than actually dumb. Something else that'd bump her up a notch in my book. JR just doesn't strike me as the adventurous type, but eating some X or doing some blow and doing the late night chat shows works well for me.
Outside of Trek, I'd probably put them about even now, but it's still a no brainer for me in costume that 7 of 9 is way hotter.
Khan ! The Musical starring Gael Garcia Bernal !:yeahright
to bring Trek back to TV in a way it’s never been done (as a modern, premium cable format series with a modern dramatic structure) and to touch on current themes, sociopolitical topics and new sci-fi ideas that Trek hasn’t been able to address for the past 10 years.While I've enjoyed some of the "modern, premium cable format series" a great deal, that's not what I'm interested in seeing in ST. Sounds to me like he's wanting "grittier," just like the rest of today's society, and I've always thought part of the appeal of ST was that even when it was very serious, it was still felt very much like fantasy.
Funny, I didn't get "grittier" from that at all. Not sure where you got it.Quoteto bring Trek back to TV in a way it’s never been done (as a modern, premium cable format series with a modern dramatic structure) and to touch on current themes, sociopolitical topics and new sci-fi ideas that Trek hasn’t been able to address for the past 10 years.While I've enjoyed some of the "modern, premium cable format series" a great deal, that's not what I'm interested in seeing in ST. Sounds to me like he's wanting "grittier," just like the rest of today's society, and I've always thought part of the appeal of ST was that even when it was very serious, it was still felt very much like fantasy.
That's just how I interpret "modern, premium cable format" and "modern dramatic structure." I also suspect that's what it would take for it to fly, nowadays. But hey, maybe I'm completely off base here.Funny, I didn't get "grittier" from that at all. Not sure where you got it.Quoteto bring Trek back to TV in a way it’s never been done (as a modern, premium cable format series with a modern dramatic structure) and to touch on current themes, sociopolitical topics and new sci-fi ideas that Trek hasn’t been able to address for the past 10 years.While I've enjoyed some of the "modern, premium cable format series" a great deal, that's not what I'm interested in seeing in ST. Sounds to me like he's wanting "grittier," just like the rest of today's society, and I've always thought part of the appeal of ST was that even when it was very serious, it was still felt very much like fantasy.
He mentions "current themes and sociopolitical topics" which is exactly what TOS did. No reason to read "grittier" into that at all.
CBS have turned down countless pitches, so I don't know why this one would be any different.At a guess, I would suspect that, since his original idea (and website) were called Star Trek Beyond, which is the same title that has been rumored for the next ST film, this retitling to Star Trek Uncharted and the chance for a pitch are connected with him giving them rights to that title.
Sorry Blob & El Barto but Chris Pine and Zachary Quinto have signed up for Star Trek 4.That news doesn't disappoint me in the slightest. Just because they haven't done anything with the franchise thus far doesn't mean that they can't or won't. I think those two in particular have a lot of potential if they ever make real sci-fi, ST stuff.
For all we know - Star Trek Beyond and Star Trek 4 will be amazing .Hence me not being bothered by the announcement of Pine/Quinto. If the franchise continues to blow it doesn't really effect me and if it suddenly turns great, well, great. Like Hef, I think that's very unlikely, but I'd rather they keep trying than not, I suppose.
There's no Orci, Kurtzman or Lindelof for starters
I hope so.
But I will believe it when I see it.
The whole "#WeWantWorf" thing is definitely just a flash in the pan.
Man, if you're one of those guys do you really want to be cooped up for six days on a boat full of treckies? Treckies die-hard enough to drop a grand minimum for the experience?
If you're talking about Emergence, it's truly one of the most awful things they've done, but it doesn't have anything to do with The Orient Express, other than featuring a train.
Man, I read the synopsis for a TNG episode because I wanted to watch one whilst I ate dinner. I started it and realised it was the bloody Orient Express Holodeck episode...
YAWN. Skip thanks.
Whenever they do " Holodeck Go Fuck Up " episodes - they've never once done where it's genuinely fucked up and the laws of physics and euclidian space no longer apply.
No. It's always just a teensy bit odd in an old timey setting.
If I understand it correctly, the only Trek name on that cruise is John deLancie? That's a lot of dough just to see some badly put together props on a cruise ship.
If I understand it correctly, the only Trek name on that cruise is John deLancie? That's a lot of dough just to see some badly put together props on a cruise ship.???
Marina Sirtis and Jonathan Frakes from Star Trek: The Next Generation, Robert Picardo from Star Trek: Voyager, James Darren from Deep Space Nine, Denise Crosby from The Next Generation plus John de Lancie from TNG, Voyager and Deep Space Nine will all be part of our inaugural journey.
If I understand it correctly, the only Trek name on that cruise is John deLancie? That's a lot of dough just to see some badly put together props on a cruise ship.
While John Delancie is great and all, if I'm being stuck on a cruise with a bunch of other obsessive nerds, I'd need some bigger names, at least main cast.
If I understand it correctly, the only Trek name on that cruise is John deLancie? That's a lot of dough just to see some badly put together props on a cruise ship.
While John Delancie is great and all, if I'm being stuck on a cruise with a bunch of other obsessive nerds, I'd need some bigger names, at least main cast.
You could be the king of all nerds though.
Watched 2x Voyager .Not sure if you have a point to make, but the second one was Dragon's Teeth; not a bad episode. I liked that the aliens were upfront about thinking Neelix and all like him are fucking morons.
Fury : Awful CGI when Kes is walking through Voyager.
& I forget the name but the one where there's a subspace tunnel controlled by an alien race so Voyager lands on a planet and yadda yadda revives aliens after 900 years.
Certainly looks like an improvement. Normally they look like high school plays, but this seems to have progressed to community theater, or perhaps even off-broadway. No interest in watching it or anything, but they do seem to be getting better.
And Admiral Chekov? It took Sulu 20 years to make captain.
:lol Holy crap that looks awful.
Glasses in the 24th century ?!
:lol
We can travel faster than light and solved the problem of mass and can disassemble you atom by atom and put you back together again but sorry we can't cure astigmatism !
I just watched about a minute of it and Walter Koenig is not even trying. Worst acting i've ever heard from him.How could you tell?
It wasn't the CG I was referring to; any of these shows can pull that off nowadays. The others just have a cheap, highschool drama quality about them with the acting, lighting and whatnot. While I don't have audio here so I can't comment as to the lighting, skimming through it looked quite a bit more professional than the other fan stuff I've seen.Certainly looks like an improvement. Normally they look like high school plays, but this seems to have progressed to community theater, or perhaps even off-broadway. No interest in watching it or anything, but they do seem to be getting better.
And Admiral Chekov? It took Sulu 20 years to make captain.
CG has come a long way for low budget stuff, but I actually thought the CG looked a bit sub-par even for what it is. I put that down to being over-ambitious rather than a lack of talent, because there was actually a ton of CG throughout. The acting and dialogue wasn't particularly good considering there were a lot of semi-known actors in there.
Star Trek Continues is pro all around, although that's much more understated sticking to the TOS style, so it's obviously not an apples to apples comparison. Star Trek Horizon is looking really good so far considering it's all essentially done by one guy, although the acting in that is clearly amateur, and I'm not sure if the script will be much better than this.
I don't mean to knock anyone, as it is what it is, but I expected a little better from Renegades given all of the people involved, the money raised, and the time it took.
I need to finally get TNG and watch through all Trek in airing order. But first I need to finish watching through all 26 seasons of the original Doctor Who. :|
I need to finally get TNG and watch through all Trek in airing order. But first I need to finish watching through all 26 seasons of the original Doctor Who. :|
First world problems.
All I really remember of that episode is the Janeway being a badass bit (and the obvious Alien influence). The alien blobs weren't very memorable. S3 and onwards is generally better though, once they ditched the barnacle heads for good.The whole thing just seemed like an excuse to have Janeway run around in a tank-top like Ripley. I honestly got more of a John McClane vibe from it, though. I'm surprised they didn't hold off on the thing until Jeri Ryan joined up.
All I really remember of that episode is the Janeway being a badass bit (and the obvious Alien influence). The alien blobs weren't very memorable. S3 and onwards is generally better though, once they ditched the barnacle heads for good.The whole thing just seemed like an excuse to have Janeway run around in a tank-top like Ripley. I honestly got more of a John McClane vibe from it, though. I'm surprised they didn't hold off on the thing until Jeri Ryan joined up.
Well, I despise Alien and its sequel.
I've never actually seen an Alien movie because I despise what little I saw, so it was a very surface comparison for me anyway. :lolYup. Exact same. Just a tone that I'm not crazy about.
Nah, don't think I've ever thought that. In fact, where we disagree is the reboots which you adore.Well, I despise Alien and its sequel.
:facepalm:
And you thought I hated everything. ::)
Or maybe one for prime universe, and one for "misc". :biggrin:
I feel like we need two Star Trek threads. One for everyone to talk about Star Trek and the other for everyone else to bitch about every fuckin thing they can think of.
As crap as Nemesis is, Nemesis is still a miles better movie than Into Darkness. I still haven't gotten all the way through a second viewing of Into Darkness.I'm kind of torn on this. At the end of the day I'd probably go with ID as the better movie, mostly because the characters are better. Even the reboot TOS characters are more interesting than the real TNG crew. Moreover, while I agree that making him Khan was an awful thing to do, John Harrison was actually a much better villain than the fake-Picard.
What was the point of rebooting the entire universe when those hacks still couldn't come up with a single original idea? Then they tried to sneakily hide the fact it was a ripoff as long as possible by making awful casting choices. If you're going to rip off a classic, at least pay some respect to it. The big "reveal" that it was Khan could not have fallen flatter, because the characters had no clue who it was. Tell us who you are. I'm bob. Oh, ok bob. That means nothing to us. Oh wait, the better older Spock from the better older universe tells us you're dangerous. Sorry, bob.
I'm kind of torn on this. At the end of the day I'd probably go with ID as the better movie, mostly because the characters are better. Even the reboot TOS characters are more interesting than the real TNG crew. Moreover, while I agree that making him Khan was an awful thing to do, John Harrison was actually a much better villain than the fake-Picard.
I'd still say ID is the worse Trek movie. I'm not arguing Nemesis is a good movie, but if I'm measuring the number of times I yelled at the screen throughout, ID fared so much worse.I agree. ID is the only ST film that left me feeling angry after watching.
I've felt disappointed by several of the others, and bored to tears after the first one, but angry only after ID.
I shame all of you for not picking a Star Trek movie as the worst if it's not directed by Shatner.
I've felt disappointed by several of the others, and bored to tears after the first one, but angry only after ID.
Likewise. Star Trek doesn't have a great hit-rate when it comes to the movies, but ID was uniquely bad.
Voyager does not get significantly better. It gets a little better.
And Enterprise was cancelled AND had a terrible finale.
Voyager does not get significantly better. It gets a little better.
It gets a little better at S3. It gets significantly better once it hits S4.
The only Trek series to get canceled were TOS and ENT, and all but TOS have proper endings. I'd say Voyager's finale is quite a good episode, but as a finale it doesn't give any payoff, like Kotowboy said. DS9 managed to get that absolutely perfect.
Voyager does not get significantly better. It gets a little better.
It gets a little better at S3. It gets significantly better once it hits S4.
Some years ago after I watched TNG for the first time in its entirety (in the 90s I only caught random episodes here and there), I started watching Voyager but I quickly gave up on it after a few episodes. It just seemed so much worse (no character caught my attention too) after watching TNG, Babylon 5 and DS9 pretty much back to back. Does it get significantly better later and does it have a proper end or was it cancelled?All ST series have their bad, their average and their good episodes, with a smattering of Godawful and brilliant ones tossed in. I've found all of the series to be about the same with the bulk of them, with the only real difference being the number of brilliant ones. TNG and DS9 certainly had the most really exceptional episodes, but for the most part we're looking at a very slight difference in quality between the series once they all average out. VOY is just like the others in that you'll see good, bad and ugly with a couple of great ones here and there. It's possible you just stumbled across some bad/average ones. That's why you really have to stick with these things if you haven't seen them through before.
Holy crap.
" Three-quel "
Then you're in luck, because Into Darkness was all three! :P
Then you're in luck, because Into Darkness was all three! :PSteaming pile of Sasquatch shit?
What about Pre-three-quel? Pre-boot? Re-inno-magining? Pre-bake? Encoremakquel?
Phrases Kotowboy will accept :Sorry, your highness.
• Sequel.
• Prequel.
• Remake.
Hopefully the threequel won't suck.
Well the last two didn't.Opinions vary.
Well the last two didn't.Opinions vary.
That's OK.Well the last two didn't.Opinions vary.
Sorry, your highness.
That's OK.Well the last two didn't.Opinions vary.
Sorry, your highness.
I didn't think two sucked any more or less than one. They both had their moments both good and bad. They both make for 45 minutes or so of entertaining viewing, but fail as 90 minute movies.Hopefully the threequel won't suck.
Then it would establish a new reverse Star Trek curse for the alt universe, of the odds being the good ones, and the evens sucking.
While I agree with you, as has been stated here, the problem is that sci-fi doesn't really work anymore in the big-budget arnea, and that's what ST is. The new franchise works for modern audiences is because it's action set in space.That's OK.Well the last two didn't.Opinions vary.
Sorry, your highness.
I'm ok with them myself.
The franchise needed some adrenaline and it got it. Sure it's not the Star Trek we grew up with but that Star Trek was running on fumes. Maybe this will help with getting a new series on TV, maybe not but they weren't coming out with another movie with the same formula that Roddenberry established. It, in the modern movie world was not working.
It, in the modern movie world was not working.
I didn't think two sucked any more or less than one. They both had their moments both good and bad. They both make for 45 minutes or so of entertaining viewing, but fail as 90 minute movies.
It, in the modern movie world was not working.
Turning Trek into Star Wars isn't working either. :biggrin: It's not like the old movies had a terribly good hit rate either, but real Trek (and imo most real scifi) just isn't suited to the big screen, and the new movies are one extreme end of how it can fail hard.
Trek has always been at its best on TV. My greatest fear is that when we finally get a new Trek series, one of these hacks is in charge. Unlike the '90s when Trek and scifi were at a high point, there is currently a huge opening for a smart space-based scifi series.
My dream is still to have Simon Barry in charge of a new Trek series. Hell, just do the whole thing in Canada, because America has no clue how to do scifi anymore.
(edit: oh hi Barto)
Both are very flawed in terms of the overall stories and the big picture. Both have plenty of entertaining scenes. In the case of the first one you can knock off most of the action sequences and get a enjoyable 50% out of it. It's been a while, but my recollection of ID is that the first 20 minutes of it is fine, you skip most of the early Harrison stuff, and turn it off once they blow the bejeezus out of whatever Weller's ship was called. Either way, they both have plenty of good content, it's just interspersed with the crap.I didn't think two sucked any more or less than one. They both had their moments both good and bad. They both make for 45 minutes or so of entertaining viewing, but fail as 90 minute movies.
That might be because they're both over two hours. :P
And I didn't get anywhere near 45 minutes of entertainment out of ID. :lol Both very flawed movies, but imo ST11 is still quite a bit better.
It'd be much simpler to name the bad guy, I don't know, John Harrison or something, and ditch the whole attempt at redoing TWoK altogether.:tup
I noticed Ten Forward was a lot smaller than it is on the show. Plus I don't know how accurate they're going with it but it appeared to be on deck 2 as well.
Would be cool using that with VR.
I noticed Ten Forward was a lot smaller than it is on the show. Plus I don't know how accurate they're going with it but it appeared to be on deck 2 as well.
There could be a few reasons for that. It might not be smaller, but might appear so due to the different camera and field of view. Or maybe they had to compromise for the sake of the ship layout and fitting it with the exterior. The interiors never match the exteriors 100%, and that goes for almost any fictional ship from any franchise. It will be easier to tell once they get some people in there to give a point of reference for scale.
I just watched the video properly, and what they have so far is very impressive.
:hifive: we're a bunch of saddoes !
I wonder how long it would take to explore an entire ship the size of the real Enterprise D? It's a huge ship.
:lol Even excluding the horrific burny death radiation sections, just exploring all of the rooms in the saucer section would take a while.
:lol Even excluding the horrific burny death radiation sections, just exploring all of the rooms in the saucer section would take a while.
:lol Even excluding the horrific burny death radiation sections, just exploring all of the rooms in the saucer section would take a while.
It would especially take longer if you stopped for a booty call with Ensign Roe.
Oh well, you're no Riker, Blob.
I guess you Aussies don't call jackets Anoraks ? Is it just a Brit thing ?
I'm guessing that Annorax is pronounced : An - ORR - Acts. Emphasis on the ORR.
Anorak is pronounced AN - or - ak. Just FYI :P
And Jeffrey Combs was fantastic at pretty much everything they gave him.
And we can't talk about guest stars on Star Trek without of course talking about Majel Barrett .
She was a regular on TOS. Lwaxana Troi on TNG and the voices of all the ships from TNG onwards til Star Trek (2009).
I don't know if she ever starred in VOY, DS9 Or Enterprise though.
The only person whose Star Trek career has spanned a longer period is Leonard Nimoy, who also managed Into Darkness before passing.
The only person whose Star Trek career has spanned a longer period is Leonard Nimoy, who also managed Into Darkness before passing.
Yeah he was in the first ever trek and the most recent thing too.
Plus Spock was in TNG and two more movies than Shatner. I also don't know if Spock cropped up in any TNG spin off series.
EDIT : I Hope Star Trek Beyond has a tribute to Nimoy. They could say Spock Prime has passed on and have a big Vulcan funeral for Spock Prime which could also double as a farewell to Nimoy.
Principal Photography wraps tomorrow :oSeems a little quick.
I am hoping for a teaser trailer around Christmas time...
One thing that I don't think was ever established was whether the computer handled those transports of if there's somebody in the transporter room ready to beam ever person on the ship somewhere at a moment's notice. That would be important so that if something goes wrong there's a person at point able to handle the situation.
Why do they have 3 separate slider controls on the transporter, when they always move all 3 together?
New ‘Star Trek’ TV Series in the Works at CBS All Access (https://www.slashfilm.com/star-trek-tv-series/)
New Star Trek on TV? Yay!
On CBS All Access? Boo!
What are Kurtzman's crimes?
Star Trek 2009 is fine, for a Hollywood scifi action movie. As a part of the Star Trek universe, it's pretty empty and dumb. I prefer it to Nemesis too, but that's because Nemesis was terrible. I don't want a series that is as equally empty and dumb as the new movies.
That would be interesting Blob and I wouldn't call JJ a hack at all. He's had huge TV shows and movies. How about Josh Whedon?
That would be interesting Blob and I wouldn't call JJ a hack at all. He's had huge TV shows and movies.
He is but those guys always have their hands into everything.
and JJ
Fringe
Alias
Lost
I love, love, loved Fringe.
And according to a Damon Lindelof interview with Adam Savage - they had the arc of the show all planned out but the show was so popular the network demanded more seasons -
- which is why there is so much padding in the middle.
In the first season, there's a really bad TNG episode called "The Naked Now" which is tied to "The Naked Time" from TOS. That's the episode where Yar jumps Data. Anyway, I believe somebody on Enterprise D mentions that the wacky malady they're currently fighting was encountered once by the original Enterprise, and James T. Kirk was the captain. They read it in a log. I'm pretty sure they mention him by name.If I'm not mistaken that episode had one of their After School Special moments with Wesley about the evils of drink. There were several during the first season and as much as they disgust me it's surprising I kept watching for the second season.
I think it's interesting that ( Relics aside ) they never really mentioned Jim Kirk at all in The Next Gen.
I can't recall them even mentioning him in Unification apart from " you remind me of a previous Captain ".
Well, they did set the show on the Enterprise and parade McCoy's geriatric ass around in the opening 5 minutes of the series. :lolI think it's interesting that ( Relics aside ) they never really mentioned Jim Kirk at all in The Next Gen.
I can't recall them even mentioning him in Unification apart from " you remind me of a previous Captain ".
I think that was a good thing. First of all, you don't want your new show mooching off the old show, you want it to be its own thing. Secondly, it makes the universe feel smaller to keep mentioning the one crew we've already seen, when there was also an Enterprise B and C with their own captains, and other ships and events. I never liked the thought of them raving about Kirk & co.
I've never heard of this. It sounds interesting.It was on Netflix. I think it was done in 2014, so it's fairly recent.
That makes it... weirder somehow. Why make a documentary now (or last year) about the launch of a show nearly 30 years ago?Because now there is more perspective on it, and the impact the show had.
Bank of Canada is pleading with Star Trek fans to stop “Spocking” its five dollar bills. Since Leonard Nimoy’s death, Canadian folks have been “Spocking” the hell out of the five dollar bill that features a portrait of Canada’s seventh prime minister Sir Wilfrid Laurier.
Sir Wilfrid now sports, on certain bills at least, pointy ears, the signature Vulcan haircut and eyebrows and Spock’s mantra “Live long and prosper.”
There's just something about seeing a dirt bike in Star Trek that takes me way out of the moment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYz13vgX0U0
:trainwreck:
So they lose the Enterprise entirely during the movie? I guess they're pulling a Search for Spock with this one to carry on the pattern. :neverusethis:
That trailer looked fucking awful.
And "Sabotage" in a Star Trek film? Really? WTF
That trailer looked fucking awful.
And "Sabotage" in a Star Trek film? Really? WTF
That trailer looked fucking awful.
That trailer looked fucking awful.
And "Sabotage" in a Star Trek film? Really? WTF
That trailer looked fucking awful.
And "Sabotage" in a Star Trek film? Really? WTF
Because we never listen to 300 year old music now.
We listen to Bach and Beethoven now.That trailer looked fucking awful.
And "Sabotage" in a Star Trek film? Really? WTF
Because we never listen to 300 year old music now.
One down. El Barto is up next.Not really necessary. You know as well as the rest of us that looks absolutely awful.
One down. El Barto is up next.Not really necessary. You know as well as the rest of us that looks absolutely awful.
Oh hey guys. Let's do something that's never been done in a Trek film. Let's destroy the Enterprise!
You're right, you totally invalidated my comment.
Oh wait, no you didn't.
It's been done. More than once.
That trailer looked fucking awful.
The Fake Outrage is strong in this thread.
The Fake Outrage is strong in this thread.You do realize that every singe one of us would be thrilled if the new movie was an actual Star Trek movie and not just TFatF, right? Nobody here is outraged. We were all expecting this. We're, at most, disappointed that the trailer confirmed what we all hoped wouldn't be the case. There's a very valid criticism of what they're calling Star Trek now that damn near everybody here shares, and which we've all discussed ad nauseum in this thread. You either don't share it, or don't mind it, which is great. Glad you enjoy these movies. There are parts of them that I enjoy, albeit in a different context. Not sure why you need to be so God damned pissy about nobody else being on the bandwagon.
Not sure why you need to be so God damned pissy about nobody else being on the bandwagon.
That trailer looked fucking awful.
And "Sabotage" in a Star Trek film? Really? WTF
Because we never listen to 300 year old music now.
Not the same thing, and you know it. Give me a fucking break.
and everyone has a heart attack and jumps on me for not sharing THEIR opinion.No, we all shit on the movie for looking like a generic explosionfest. I seriously doubt anybody objects to you liking such a thing.
I don't always check out AintItCoolNews anymore, but there are some lol-worthy comments there.
Star Trek: Beyond Recognition
Like poor marksmen they keep...MISSING...THE...Target!!
PARAMOUNT, YOU BLOODSUCKER!
They are indeed laughing at the superior intellect.
My God, Bones. What have they done?
Their pattern suggests two dimensional thinking.
STAR TREK: BEYOND. Good title, as it is beyond me how this is supposed to be Star Trek.
Not really a huge Star Trek fan, but came in here to say I'm so sorry. Star Trek doesn't deserve to be lowered to the tier of "shitty summer action movie everyone will forget about in 4 months." I know it's just a trailer and maybe the movie will be different, but honestly that's exactly what this trailer is marketing this movie as.
From this trailer, the absolute best I can hope for is to be able to sit through the movie without leaving.Whoa, you're actually going to spend seventeen of those kangaroo dollars to see this thing?
From this trailer, the absolute best I can hope for is to be able to sit through the movie without leaving.Whoa, you're actually going to spend seventeen of those kangaroo dollars to see this thing?
Compare that to Star Wars, which has established so much goodwill since the start, and has built such amazing hype with the trailers, it just makes Star Trek look like a second rate hack job franchise.
Compare that to Star Wars, which has established so much goodwill since the start, and has built such amazing hype with the trailers, it just makes Star Trek look like a second rate hack job franchise.
To be fair, Star Wars had its second rate hack job prequel trilogy. And on top of that, Disney plans on releasing a Star Wars movie every single year for the foreseeable future. There is still plenty of time to run that series into the ground as well.
Exactly. Enjoy it if you can.and everyone has a heart attack and jumps on me for not sharing THEIR opinion.No, we all shit on the movie for looking like a generic explosionfest. I seriously doubt anybody objects to you liking such a thing.
I plan to.We saw 90 seconds of crap in the context of having seen the two films prior.
And If I don't like it - then i'll say so.
But unlike everyone else - i'm not gonna watch 90 seconds out of context 8 months from release date and decide it's fucking shit and not go see it.
Not sure why you need to be so God damned pissy about nobody else being on the bandwagon.
We saw 90 seconds of crap in the context of having seen the two films prior.
Not sure why you need to be so God damned pissy about nobody else being on the bandwagon.
I don't know why people get so *angry* that not everyone hates what they hate.
There's a huge of middle ground between plodding boring mess like TMP and ADHD millennial explosion-fest like Into Darkness. See Dawn of the Planet of the Apes. It's a smart movie with subtlety, and yet you also get to see an ape riding a horse through flames while firing two machine guns and fight a tank.
It's possible to make a great movie that appeals to a broad audience without being empty Hollywood garbage. It's also possible to make a fun movie that entertains people without being empty Hollywood garbage. It's also possible to write a movie without gaping plotholes that insult the intelligence and attention span of your audience. There are minor flaws that you can brush off, and there are the kinds of flaws that just make a movie fucking stupid to watch.
But all of this requires a half decent director and a half decent writer, neither of which this movie has.
And that's the whole problem that purists and many long-time fans have. Star Trek (to them) should be more than empty Hollywood garbage. They want something that goes beyond that, actually has something to say, actually gives you something to think about for more than five minutes as you're leaving the theater (or taking the DVD out of the machine). Instead, the primary motivation here is to make a big entertaining movie that makes a lot of money. There's nothing wrong with that. But it certainly bothers some people, and we're hearing about it.
Star Trek at its very core is more than this, but it obviously went over the heads of these morons, because this does not resemble Trek.
Star Trek at its very core is more than this, but it obviously went over the heads of these morons, because this does not resemble Trek.
I wouldn't say they are morons for not understanding Star Trek. They clearly are just trying to make a product that is more likely to make money than a "boring" accurate representation of Star Trek. This kind of movie is safe and doesn't require as much effort as trying to make a legitimate Star Trek movie that's good.
Why even use a franchise's brand recognition to make a movie under the assumption that most people thinks it's boring?
Honestly, that does. It makes me feel a bit better knowing that he's going to commit to his own vision instead of trying to shove in everyone's ideas.
I think the baton of Star Trek has passed so many times at Paramount, it arrived at people who simply don't have an emotional connection to the original series. So, they re-imagine it as something entirely different.
Simon Pegg co-wrote this and he certainly knows how to write a movie. Just look at the Cornetto trilogy.
When he came on board as a writer - they threw away everything that Orci wrote and started again.
That should give you at least *some* goodwill towards it.
He also says they're halfway into the 5 year mission and they're just not addressing anything from Into Darkness like curing death etc.
OR - the studio chose the trailer and the writer and director disagreed with THE STUDIO.
???OR - the studio chose the trailer and the writer and director disagreed with THE STUDIO.
That's most likely. It's obvious that Pegg is embarrassed by the trailer.
I've read a lot over the last few days which makes me look forward to it - but whatever. I'm done. I'm not posting here again until i've seen the film.
lolI've read a lot over the last few days which makes me look forward to it - but whatever. I'm done. I'm not posting here again until i've seen the film.
hhmmm... only took 8 posts, and 14 hours. Welcome back.
Remember it's not about me.Only when you make it that way.
I've read a lot over the last few days which makes me look forward to it - but whatever. I'm done. I'm not posting here again until i've seen the film.
hhmmm... only took 8 posts, and 14 hours. Welcome back.
I've read a lot over the last few days which makes me look forward to it - but whatever. I'm done. I'm not posting here again until i've seen the film.
hhmmm... only took 8 posts, and 14 hours. Welcome back.
I think we all should know by now that when someone on the internet says, "I'm done. I'm going to stop posting," the best response is, "Okay. See you tomorrow!"
That's actually encouraging. Thanks, Implode!I agree. It looked he like was trying to be diplomatic, but really thought the trailer shit all over them. I'm still not hugely enthusiastic, but mostly because I think what I want just isn't possible in the current paradigm. Nevertheless, he did seem to be implying that there were a lot more elements that I've been missing that weren't in the first two.
Here's a fun little task for Hef, El Barto and Blob.I think I already did. Since it was a pretty short list you might not have noticed it. I really enjoyed the characterizations of the principle cast. I think Pine, Quinto and Urban are great as the characters they play. I also liked a lot of the dialog. The writers can't write a good screenplay to save their lives, but somebody on that team has a nice way with words. I also thought there was some good humor in them; particularly the first one. As I've stated on numerous occasions, I can watch one or both of them while skipping over about 50% or so of the content and enjoy it quite a bit. There's not much story left, but the stories weren't very good to begin with. As a collection of various interactions between those three it's perfectly entertaining.
List all the things you enjoyed about Star Trek (2009) and Into Darkness.
I set this challenge once before when Into Darkness came out after i'd listed all the problems with which I agreed with.
Nobody took me up on it then. And will probably just brush it off now. ;)
- casting of Quinto for Spock; Urban for Bones; Pegg for ScottyYou didn't care for Pine? He was a little too over the top, but then so is Kirk. He's the character that has to get the most development, and even though I don't see that happening, if we do get to see the swagger Pine gives him combined with the seriousness Kirk puts into his responsibilities it'll be a damn fine characterization. I saw the bits and pieces there early on.
I don't mind Pine at all. I like him in fact. Pegg was a little to over the top but not that is turned me off.
I agree.
Also not a fan of the Uhura/Spock romance. At all.
I agree.
Also not a fan of the Uhura/Spock romance. At all.
I wanted to rage punch someone over that. Like any chick would fall in love with an emotionless soul. That was pretty much the worst part of the story. Absolutely zero need for that.
https://trekmovie.com/2015/12/17/pegg-interview-from-set-of-beyond/
…we want it to be about them on that five-year mission. In fact, two years into that five-year mission, and how that impacted them personally and what it meant to be out in space that long. And we liked the idea of also, on the fiftieth anniversary, looking at Roddenberry’s original vision and questioning it. The whole notion of the Federation and whether it’s a good thing or a bad thing and how productive is inclusivity and what is the true cost of expansion.:| :( :tdwn
Quote…we want it to be about them on that five-year mission. In fact, two years into that five-year mission, and how that impacted them personally and what it meant to be out in space that long. And we liked the idea of also, on the fiftieth anniversary, looking at Roddenberry’s original vision and questioning it. The whole notion of the Federation and whether it’s a good thing or a bad thing and how productive is inclusivity and what is the true cost of expansion.:| :( :tdwn
Yeah what the fuck ?
I just want a bad guy wanting revenge again.
I don't want anything new for a change...
I know how much Blob *loves* the whole "utopian future" stuff from TNG.
I agree.
Also not a fan of the Uhura/Spock romance. At all.
I wanted to rage punch someone over that. Like any chick would fall in love with an emotionless soul. That was pretty much the worst part of the story. Absolutely zero need for that.
Yeah what the fuck ?Yes, because that is clearly what I said.
I just want a bad guy wanting revenge again.
I don't want anything new for a change...
Just watched TOS. SOooo much cheese.
Now working through TNG.
So much hate for Yar...
:lol I remember when my friend showed me the series for the first time, and I'd constantly yell at the screen about how much I hated her and wanted her to die.
I wonder if you'll feel the same about Pulaski as I did? (she's a later character)
The female characters mostly sucked on TNG. Oh and this is my most hated scene. Absolutely unnecessary and ridiculous. Also... those clothes ???
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXZZeHkL29c
I think the one that I thought was most relatable was Crusher and I found Lwaxana Troi entertaining.
Something I've always wondered about but never remember to ask even though I think I know the answer:
Do they film two-parters all at once or do they come back and finish the second half? I would think they film it all at once for the most part, but maybe if they're not sure the show will be back next year they might do it in two pieces. I'm sure it's different for the genre as well like, say, comedy.
LOL @ "Piker versus Riker"
There's a production break of a few months between seasons, even in the case of two parters. The script for BOBW pt 2 wasn't even written until after the first one was shot.Which I think is one of the big problems with their season cliffhangers. It's real easy to write yourself into a corner. In this case writing a first half that sets up more more than you can accomplish in a second. Hence my feeling that Piller was probably right about making it 3 parts.
Thanks for the info on shooting two-parters.
If they *know* they're coming back next season it seems silly to stop and re-start. Having to get everything set up and looking just the same as the year before sounds very inefficient and stuff. If they just did the shots with actors at the same time and saved the VFX for later would make a lot more sense.
Meh, I'm not Hollywood, I guess they know what they're doing.
It was! I thought it was a good one, and yeah, the resolution to it might've been a bit rushed, but I didn't think Part II was horrible. And then the unofficial Part III, the episode "Family" where Jean-Luc goes home to Earth for R&R and gets hammered with his brother Robert (pronounced "Ro Bare") and ends up feeling a lot better about things, so that was cool. TNG was pretty good through that stretch, those middle seasons.
Maybe... it's been canned?
*crosses fingers*
Torres dies and spends the entire episode trying to stay out of hell.
Have you actually watched all of VOY? I'm not asking to be a dick, but that's an odd choice to single out as a good one. Just curious if it's one of the few you remember or something, or if you know all of them and really liked that one.QuoteTorres dies and spends the entire episode trying to stay out of hell.
That was a great episode.
It had a good premise, but I really didn't care for the execution. In fact, that applies to a lot of those Voyager episodes. Good ideas but not great scripts. However, I did love the episode where they find out they're all clones and die.This guy is a writer. He wrote all the shows I listed, plus a handful more. I'd say that Kurtzman is the bigger problem, but considering what this guy's style is and what will actually work for modern television, I'm not real hopeful either.
I'm still not hopeful about the new show. Kurtzman has just as much say as this guy does and neither of them are writers as far as I know. It also seems like it's made to fail by putting it as paid for content. How many viewers will really sign up for something just to watch it? I'm pretty sure they had to make some kind of deal to keep the new movie name and this is their way of making sure the show doesn't last too long.
I truly hope I'm wrong. Good trek is always welcomed by me.
Some of this guy's work:
VOY-
The entire Voyager crew slowly dies, before disintegrating seconds outside of range of the other Voyager that could have saved them.
Ancient Earth probe causes the complete annihilation of a planet. Long time cremember returns only to be murdered by the understandably bitter and resentful mutant survivors.
So is it true that the new Trek show will only be available on CBS's streaming service and they're pulling all of the Trek shows off of Netflix? If so, I'm going to bummed becasue I was just about to start going through all of the series.Yes, the new series will only be available on CBS's streaming service (after the pilot debuts on CBS).
So is it true that the new Trek show will only be available on CBS's streaming service and they're pulling all of the Trek shows off of Netflix? If so, I'm going to bummed becasue I was just about to start going through all of the series.Welcome to the 21st century, where it's easier for everybody to demand a slice of your money, and easier for you to take their shit for free.
So is it true that the new Trek show will only be available on CBS's streaming service and they're pulling all of the Trek shows off of Netflix? If so, I'm going to bummed becasue I was just about to start going through all of the series.Welcome to the 21st century, where it's easier for everybody to demand a slice of your money, and easier for you to take their shit for free.
There's talk now of Angela Basset and Rosario Dawson being Capt./XO of the new series. I've got no problem with either of them, but both together sounds like something of a bummer. I get diversity and all, and strong females work very well in ST, but that just seems like a bit too much of an estrogen festival.
I'm surprised there hasn't been an out and out ( no pun intended ) gay character in Trek up til now.That'd be an interesting way to do it, for that reason. In TOS you really had three and a half guys and a token extra (Scotty fell somewhere in between). All of the other shows had a real ensemble cast. Actually having 8 or so main characters on an old Constitution class ship would be a cool way to go about it.
But yeah it needs to be appropriate and not just thrown in to stop SJWs going apeshit.
I think the new series should either be like 100 years on from Picard's time or set in Kirk's time just on a different ship because you pretty much only saw Kirk & co in that era.
The Next Gen era has three series all in the same time. Voyager was 75 light years away and did pretty much nothing with it.
Set it in the 25th century ( lol buck rogers ) and on the Enterprise NCC 1701-X
I will definitely watch the new show and be oh so glad if it's at least half way decent. But with (so far) a one style writer with mainly bleak and dark episodes plus one of JJ's goons producing... let's say my enthusiasm is somewhat restrained. I'm perfectly fine with Bassett and/or Dawson, both great performers I really like. But in the end it will come down to the show's basic concept and the writing anyway, no matter how awesome or unknown the cast will turn out to be.
JJ timeline would almost be a deal breaker for me though. I really like that sense of history and storylines interweaving the past and the future. It just makes a fictional world feel so much bigger and more grounded and more realistic, even (or maybe especially) in sci-fi or fantasy.
Greetings...
Nef
That'd be an interesting way to do it, for that reason. In TOS you really had three and a half guys and a token extra (Scotty fell somewhere in between). All of the other shows had a real ensemble cast. Actually having 8 or so main characters on an old Constitution class ship would be a cool way to go about it.
If the show sucks, I'd rather it be associated with the new movies, but I'd rather a great series that continued on from where Voyager left off, and real time afterwards, so they could potentially have old actors as guests. But that's aiming a little too high. :biggrin:
JJ timeline. TNG era.
I have zero confidence in a studio to produce a television series in which they refuse to follow the series trademark. That is Star Trek Beyond looks the way it does apparently because Paramount thought the initial screenplay was too Star Trek.
Still can't agree with you on Blalock (although I certainly wouldn't kick her out of bed regardless). Hot slutty Hoshi was the better drawcard for me. :hat
Even though I don't like S4 much at all, I liked In a Mirror Darkly quite a bit for ENT. It was still moderately fanwanky, tying into The Tholian Web and (for all intents and purposes) including the original Enterprise model, but it was a fun departure.
I agree the actors didn't do a great job outside of their regular characters, still mostly very clean cut and stiff, especially Bakula, but I don't think any of them were worse than in their regular roles. :lol
Better than the DS9 cast though? Nah.
When they're playing characters outside of their normal roles, definitely. In the mirror universe episodes the DS9 cast were always way over the top, which made them completely unwatchable. And while Far Beyond the Stars should have been a fantastic episode, most of their acting really ruined it. I found none of them particularly believable, and Avery Brooks and Dorn were just awful. Whereas, aside from Bakula, the ENT cast was perfectly believable in their mirror roles.
Better than the DS9 cast though? Nah.
Like most ST actors, those people are terrible when acting outside of their customary character. Bakula in particular was just awful.
Like most ST actors, those people are terrible when acting outside of their customary character. Bakula in particular was just awful.
It's absolutely shocking to hear this considering .... Quantum Leap.
KIRK: Mister Spock, can we get those two guards? What would you say the odds on our getting out of here?
SPOCK: Difficult to be precise, Captain. I should say approximately 7,824.7 to 1.
KIRK: Difficult to be precise? 7,824 to 1?
SPOCK: 7,824.7 to 1.
KIRK: That's a pretty close approximation.
SPOCK: I endeavor to be accurate.
KIRK: You do quite well.
I actually didn't like Damar at all, but otherwise I agree. Garak was always amazing. The guy who tortured Picard was David Warner, wasn't it? That guy's awesome in everything.
Interesting, I'm glad to hear I'll get to see more of the Klingons in the future, I think they're kinda modeled after the Mongol's from the 1200's in culture and love of war, looks as well.The Mongols is about right, for now. As their mythos gets fleshed out they essentially become vikings. Honor in battle earns you a spot at the big party in the sky with all the great warriors before you. That won't happen til TNG, though. For now they're just mongols.
I agree. I thought Tuvok was consistently well written. There was one particular episode where I recall he had to do something pretty shady for the sake of the crew's benefit, and managed to justify it to Janeway logically, and she was a little horrified at how he was able to do so. I can't remember much more specific than that, but it was cool.Tuvok nailed the logic aspect yet still kept an inkling sentimentality. He possessed some wisdom that Spock didn't really come across until after he died and came back. Very good Vulcan.
And Robert Picardo is brilliant in everything. The Doctor got to follow an arc similar to Data, starting off as the emergency program based on a pretty surly dude and confined to one room. I remember Robert Picardo being concerned about getting the portable holo-emitter, thinking it would ruin the character, but it opened up even more options for his character to grow and learn beyond his programming.
What I liked about The Doctor is that he wasn't necessarily aspiring to be more "human", but to explore his own freedom and sentience and become all he could be, and would even actively tinker with his own programming to achieve it. Data wanted to understand humanity, and his ultimate goal was to be human, and was much more about observing the human condition.
Finally on a steady routine of an episode or two a day, working through Barto's list and Blob's additions to it, but when I don't have my iPad or laptop handy to know which episode to go to next I just watch the next one down the list on Netflix, I think Netflix has them in the same order they are on the DVD's.The replaced footage of the remastering is usually pretty tastefully done. I can only think of one time when it screwed things up. Just as difficult as showing two actors at the same time is showing multiple ships at the same time. In The Ultimate Computer, which I'm sure is on the list I provided, there's a battle sequence with 5 constitution class ships. In the original it was pretty poorly done, with the 4, then 3, then 2 ships locked real close together. In the new one they're all flying about independently. However, along with the music the original provides a great deal of tension. The other ships are constantly bearing down on the Enterprise. There's a sense of sheer determination that's lost. I can see why they redid that footage, but it really took away something from the original.
The episodes I'm watching are the remastered ones, they look great but I don't like the total replacement of space scenes and most landscape scenes on planets, they even replace scenes on monitors that shows the outside of the Enterprise, I saw some comparison scenes between the old and remastered footage; the remasters do look great as I said but then knowing they're newly created takes something away from the experience, especially with the contrast with the scenes they could replace, such as internal of the ship. I just wanted to note that but I'm not getting held up on it or letting it get in the way of me enjoying the episodes.
One last thing about the remastered episodes is that the HD makes the men's make up on this show painfully visible and ALL men on this show had make up on..
I think the reason I was put off for a while was how much I disliked the last episode I saw last year, Space Seed, we've talked about this here and I might revisit it sometimes since it's seemingly a universally acclaimed one.
Amok Time: Great Spock Episode, no remarks except I'm starting to find a trend in Dr. McCoy telling Captain Kirk that there's something suspicious he thinks Kirk needs to look into and Kirk dismissing it or taking it lightly only to find out McCoy was right.Spock inviting McCoy down to Vulcan as one of his closest friends was important to the series, I think. Much like Bart and Lisa in the early days of The Simpsons, they spent most of their time bickering but underneath still had a good deal of regard for each other.
Don't care for either of them. They were the first and second episdoes aired, I believe.
Charlie X: An episode I watched when I didn't have the list handy, the kid is an awful actor and this is one of the episodes that bother me with how easily avoidable the predicament was.
The Man Trap: Another episode that wasn't on the list, this one was decent though, I thought.
Mudd's Women: Just finished that now, decent episode, I think the guy playing Mudd is the first good actor to guest star in this show as far as I've seen.Didn't care for the episode, but Harvey Mudd is great. He'll be back.
The City on the Edge of Forever: Another great one, I'm a time travel fan and I enjoyed how they conducted that here.Generally considered TOS's finest hour. I thought it was overrated at first, but honestly it probably is their best work.
I still find it funny whenever they are scenes around the hallways on the Enterprise and there seem to be A WHOLE LOT OF PEOPLE that we don't know just living there and hanging out like it's a college campus :lolOnce you get to TNG, it's a giant cruise ship. Families walking around in swimwear and stuff.
Quick question: Do you guys think it's okay to view the recent Star Trek trilogy or it would it spoil some stuff?I'd wait until you watch the entire rest of the franchise. Chronological order is working well enough for you now.
What Are Little Girls Made Of? God damn that android Andrea is smoking hot, easily the hottest woman I've seen so far on this show. Decent plot, the red shirts are so useless and so often old and out of shape :lol, I like that Kirk gets upset when they get killed but very briefly and by the end of the episode he's perfectly fine heh, I also like that Kirk's message to alert Spock of his situation included calling him a half-breed and that Spock complained about it at the end of the episode, not cool Captain.. not cool.
Well, if they hadn't inexplicably made it another Earth it would have been slightly better.
Add to that, the kids were just creepy as fuck. And not in a cool, Children of the Corn sort of way. They were just weird to look at. As I recall, a lot of the actors were older than the kids they were supposed to be playing, and there's a point where that becomes quite unsettling.
What Are Little Girls Made Of? God damn that android Andrea is smoking hot, easily the hottest woman I've seen so far on this show. Decent plot, the red shirts are so useless and so often old and out of shape :lol, I like that Kirk gets upset when they get killed but very briefly and by the end of the episode he's perfectly fine heh, I also like that Kirk's message to alert Spock of his situation included calling him a half-breed and that Spock complained about it at the end of the episode, not cool Captain.. not cool.
Kirk specifically focused on that thought so that the mind-copying machine would pick it up, giving Spock a clue that something was up with the android Kirk. Spock knew that Kirk would never say that, so the way android Kirk tossed it out there was a red flag. Not cool, but intentionally so. I thought it was funny the way Spock called him on it at the end, and Kirk was like "Hey, I had three seconds to think of something, and it worked, right?"
And yeah, Sherry Jackson (Andrea) was a total babe. If you search the Internet, there are pictures where you can see... more of her.
I don't remember anything even remotely that intelligent about that episode. I guess I'll have to go back and [shudders] rewatch it.What Are Little Girls Made Of? God damn that android Andrea is smoking hot, easily the hottest woman I've seen so far on this show. Decent plot, the red shirts are so useless and so often old and out of shape :lol , I like that Kirk gets upset when they get killed but very briefly and by the end of the episode he's perfectly fine heh, I also like that Kirk's message to alert Spock of his situation included calling him a half-breed and that Spock complained about it at the end of the episode, not cool Captain.. not cool.
Kirk specifically focused on that thought so that the mind-copying machine would pick it up, giving Spock a clue that something was up with the android Kirk. Spock knew that Kirk would never say that, so the way android Kirk tossed it out there was a red flag. Not cool, but intentionally so. I thought it was funny the way Spock called him on it at the end, and Kirk was like "Hey, I had three seconds to think of something, and it worked, right?"
btw I met a Trekkie today at the playground -I have babies..- and we spoke a bit, he kept driving the point home that the real fun won't being until I get to The Next Generation and frankly I'm not super excited about that, I know it's the Patrick Stewart show and that should be good enough but I'm not very keen on T.V from the early nineties.. I still intend on watching it but I'm just not super hot for it even though it seems to me now that most of Star Trek fandom is oriented around that show.While I hate the characters, if you take the top 50 or 60 episodes they're all good-excellent. Moreover, it sets up all the other series.
If/when you do get to TNG, the first two seasons are easily the weakest, so keep that in mind. I think DS9 is the better series though, and is probably more highly regarded amongst the diehard Trekkies.
It's not what I'd call bad news, as I love the particular movies he worked on.This is pretty much the way I looked at it, as well.
However, the movies and the series are different animals altogether, so I still consider him a wildcard as far as TV is concerned, and outside of Trek, he hasn't done anything at all I've heard of since in the past 25 years. I hope this choice wasn't just to try and ease people's minds more than actually what serves the show. I'd be more excited if he was working on the new movie.
But he wrote the best three Star Trek movies.
Interesting discussion (https://www.missionlogpodcast.com/what-are-little-girls-made-of/) on What Are Little Girls Made Of from the Star Trek podcast that I listen to, they get into the nature of android cloning and whether it's still really you, as in transfer of conscience or just a machine with your background.Two great episodes. Windom really beat the shit out of that redshirt. :lol And it seems there's a lot of cross-training in the federation. On a couple of occasions Uhura takes over for Chekhov or Sulu when one of them flips out or something. Similarly, Chekhov is the junior science officer, taking over when Spock's not around. There's also a relatively unknown redshirt that gets put in charge of the ship a few times when Kirk, Spock and Scotty are all off doing something.
I need to post more often if I wanna share my thoughts cause I tend to forget but I rarely have enough time on my computer, anyway here's a couple of things I wanted to share:
- I forgot to ask this when I first watched Mudd's Women; in the elevator Mudd recognizes Spock as a half-Vulcan, yet it seems to me Spock looks exactly like all the Vulcans he meets in Amok Time, am I missing something?
- William Shatner's acting has significantly improved from Season 1 to Season 2.
- William Windom was pretty great in Doomsday Machine, it took me a few minutes before I recognized him from The Twilight Zone, really good actor and solid character.
On to the episodes, back on Barto's list:
The Doomsday Machine: Solid episode, enjoyed it through out and loved the Moby Dick vibe for Matt Decker, I'm looking to see if youtube has the original footage for the planet eater scenes, curious to see what 1960's technology had there. This episode could have been a movie easily, one thing I love about most of the Star Trek episodes I've seen so far is that they don't drag at all, like most TV shows these days do, on the contrary; it actually very often seems like they could have expanded on a bunch of things in the plot but didn't/couldn't because of time restraints or some other reason.
The scene where Decker takes over the Enterprise was a reminder for me that most -if not all- of these characters are military officers, I dunno why I thought they were a scientific team from a futuristic NASA-like organization.
It was interesting to see Captain Kirk getting down and dirty with some machine fixing on the Constellation, I believe this is the first time I've seen him do anything other than ask a lot of questions and give orders based on the answers he gets from his crew, feels like his only talent has been decision making so far.
Curious to see if there are more of the planet eater out there to show up in later episodes or shows.
Funny bit: As soon as Kirk asked Scotty to beam back and leave him to detonate the Constellation; Scotty is like "okay bye" hehe, didn't try to show any solidarity or sympathy to Kirk who could have easily died in this stunt, I'm thinking they couldn't waste time on more dialogue there.
The Changeling: Great episode, I enjoy episodes that take place entirely on the Enterprise, throughout the episode I wondered why Kirk couldn't just order the Nomad to self destruct as soon as it proved deadly, he eventually did that in some way but after what I thought was unnecessary mind gaming with the thing. Shatner gave his relatively best bit of acting on the series when he thought Scotty was killed.
Funny bit: I like that Uhura's memory has been wiped clean yet it would only take a week to re-educate her on everything she need to do her job again, kinda means that she's very easily replaceable :lol
The fact that they're all military officers explains to me how McCoy is always around even for matters that doesn't require a medical opinion, like they're get together in the conference room to discuss some danger or plan and he'd be there which used to seem odd to me.
- I forgot to ask this when I first watched Mudd's Women; in the elevator Mudd recognizes Spock as a half-Vulcan, yet it seems to me Spock looks exactly like all the Vulcans he meets in Amok Time, am I missing something?Eh. Beats the shit out of me. As a salesman and scoundrel, it would certainly make sense for Mudd to be a fantastic judge of character. At the time, "you're part human, aren't you" would have made a helluva lot more sense.
My hunch is that he just wasn't a particularly bright bulb. I thought his performance was excellent and not over the top (which is unusual for ST). I suspect they just told him to be brooding and obsessive and he ran with it. The Ahab thing just never registered to him.
It's also possible that he deemed his motivation to be solely the loss of his crew, and based his revenge on guilt. I don't think Ahab had the guilt component. He was just pissed off at the whale for maiming him. That could be a reason why Ahab never registered with Windom. While the behavior of Decker and Ahab were very much the same (Decker's treatment of the Enterprise crew is much the same for Ahab's Pequod crew), they were differently motivated.
Nicholas Meyer doesn't want to repeat Star Trek.
https://trekmovie.com/2016/02/29/nicholas-meyer-i-think-its-going-to-be-a-different-star-trek/
At the moment it still has potential to end up great, or terrible.
At the moment it still has potential to end up great, or terrible.
Same with anything really :p
I'd like to see prime universe, set 15 years after the end of Voyager, ie. the realtime amount since the series finished. You wouldn't even need to acknowledge it or have crossovers, at least for a while, but you'd get the cumulative benefit of the entire prime universe, without being boxed in by canon like with Enterprise, and fans would accept it.That's what I would want.
I'd like to see prime universe, set 15 years after the end of Voyager, ie. the realtime amount since the series finished. You wouldn't even need to acknowledge it or have crossovers, at least for a while, but you'd get the cumulative benefit of the entire prime universe, without being boxed in by canon like with Enterprise, and fans would accept it.That's what I would want.
I've noticed that other than Spock - a lot of the Vulcan characters on Star Trek were just angry or arrogant.
T'Pol was one of the worst. She played it the most arrogant.
This is an even stranger token choice than the last. I like Rod Roddenberry, but he has no experience with a real show.I don't know a thing about Rod Roddenberry, but this actually seems slightly encouraging. Of course I think GR was a menace and his vision made TNG blow. However, at least his vision was actual Star Trek. If Jr. wants to carry on in the spirit his old man always intended, that suggests something very different than what they've been doing, or what I've suspected they'd do with this series.
Just give me one clear reassuring name that I can trust to not royally screw this up.
Executive producers don't mean much.
Spock's a great Vulcan, but with a caveat. It was his conflict and eventual embrace of his humanity that made him great. When he was young and trying to be the Vulcan hardass he was great. When he died and came back confused he was good. When he got old and wisdom allowed him to strike a nice balance he was great again. Reunification era Spock was excellent, and the "I have no regrets" scene with Data was a high point of his character, I think.
Tuvok was just a run of the mill Vulcan hardass, but that also made him great. He was pure Vulcan, and still quite interesting. The only other regularly occurring Vulcans all had various peculiarities or eccentricities.
And looking over my first paragraph, it occurs to me that Spock is pretty unique in that it's very rare to see any character evolve as much as he did over a span of nearly 50 years. He aged 124 years between Lt. Spock in The Cage/Menagerie and Ambassador Spock in Unification. Over that span his character evolved very similarly to the actor that played him.
The most likely explanation would be that they needed a couple of scenes to explain something that people weren't picking up on. If you figure that the majority of what they initially shot was explosions, fistfights, motorcycle chases, and people running across conveyor belts, then it makes sense that they need to add another plot element here and there (thought it does seem odd that it would suddenly be important now, in the third installment).
If they did have to reshoot some scenes featuring somebody that didn't work out, it'd be highly concerning that they just figured it out now. Replacing characters in ST isn't a new thing (Geneviève Bujold), but you normally figure it out while you're shooting.
Acting ability is irrelevant. It's the Shat! :lol
"Sir, there's a multilegged creature crawling on your shoulder" :lol
"Sir, there's a multilegged creature crawling on your shoulder" :lolYou must be jumping around all over the place. Or you're re-watching some. Great episode, though.
Taste of Armageddon is so good, I can't quite digest the logic behind the computer war deal; both sides will kill what the other side would have killed if they had actually bombed them, so what are they saving here? property damage?!
- Scotty is so the man! I like how he stood up to ambassador Fox, even Spock would have backed down once Fox started talking of regulations and laws, like he did with Commodore Decker in The Doomsday Machine.Anytime Scotty or Sulu (and DeSalle, for that matter) get put in charge of the ship they usually man up quite a bit. I always like episodes where Kirk and Spock are off getting into trouble and somebody else has to rescue them.
I think it's a good rule of thumb to assume that anyone that steps foot on the Enterprise and happens to outrank Kirk, or can override his orders, is going to be a dick.Or grossly incompetent. I will say that there's a difference between Decker and Fox. One is just some diplomat with no command experience while Decker outranked even Kirk and possessed a great deal of starship command experience.
I should actually make a scorecard and see how Kirk does in disrupting societies. Seems he usually makes alright choices.
I always just chalk the entire episode down to computers/robots = bad, people = good, a common theme in the history of scifi in the west, especially in that era.Yeah, that's what I took away from it. It just seems like they threw some things in there specifically to set up something they didn't bother with. There were numerous references to Daystrom being off his nut, which in retrospect are all quite pointless. He could have been Garth of Izar nuts for all the difference that actually made on the M5.
The story only really touches upon the general survival instinct it inherited, and how the machine lacked the compassion necessary to make decisions about human life.
It wouldn't have taken much to relate it more specifically to Daystrom's own personality traits like megalomania being imprinted upon it, but the only conclusion the episode really gave was that human emotions are a positive trait we have over a cold illogical computer to give us a sense of morality, which is fine too. It could have had more impact to contrast it specifically to one human's mind to compare man and machine, rather than the solution being yet another "Kirk nags a computer to death" scenario.
I agree, they set it up to be potentially more compelling than it ultimately was, but I don't think the episode ever intended anything beyond what was given in the final elevator conversation about computers not having emotions.
The New STAR TREK TV Show Will Be Set Before THE NEXT GENERATION (https://birthmoviesdeath.com/2016/04/13/the-new-star-trek-tv-show-will-be-set-before-the-next-generation)
Obviously, until CBS makes an official statement, take this with a grain of salt.
But what do you think?
Not sure what to make of the seasonal thing. I've advocated a serial approach, which would be awesome. If they were going to take a similar approach, where each season would be set in a different era, or a different part of the galaxy, then I could see that working. At the same time, if they're talking about 24 episode seasons, then that's probably too long to invest in something transient.The New STAR TREK TV Show Will Be Set Before THE NEXT GENERATION (https://birthmoviesdeath.com/2016/04/13/the-new-star-trek-tv-show-will-be-set-before-the-next-generation)
Obviously, until CBS makes an official statement, take this with a grain of salt.
But what do you think?
Eh.......still not a fan of moving backwards. The update where it says that it's seasonal is both good and bad. Cool in the sense that, yea, we could go anywhere, but bad in the sense that how are we going to connect to the characters if they could potentially be seasonal?
Seasonal anthology sounds like a bad idea to me for various reasons, so I hope that's not true. I don't like the idea of setting it pre-TNG either, because they'll encounter the same problems as Enterprise, of being boxed into canon and breaking from that and pissing off fans if they deviate too far. I think the only way to go with the prime universe is post-Nemesis.
Like I've said, I like the anthology approach if that's what they're actually doing. I just thought it'd be better in one or two episode chunks. If a season for this is 12 episodes it might work fine. I also wouldn't necessarily assume that each series is set in the same era. My notion was to set it in all of the various eras set apart from the established narratives.That's the impression I got from the info yesterday.
Personally I prefer episodic series where you can just watch any episode out of order like TNG.
I was a big fan of DS9 until you had to watch every episode to know what was going on.
if you miss a few episodes you've no idea what's going on.
Personally I prefer episodic series where you can just watch any episode out of order like TNG.
I was a big fan of DS9 until you had to watch every episode to know what was going on.
if you miss a few episodes you've no idea what's going on.
The Alternative Factor, there's a decent idea buried somewhere in this episode but it's been completely overshadowed by how much the episode drags and how generally repetitive it is. I actually watched this over two viewings cause I was too bored to finish it at once.Two bottom tier episodes for me. TAF was awful. The character of Lazerus and the conclusion of two people battling for the rest of eternity both had high potential, but the execution just wasn't there. A:O was alright, but not much more. I did like the fact that they all blamed McCoy for blinding Spock when Spock's the God damned science officer. Seems to me he's the one that should have known better.
Operation: Annihilate, I liked this one, entertaining performances for all the cast. Kirk's display of emotions over his brother's death didn't differ much than when a red shirt dies; brief signs of discomfort that's completely gone by the end of the episode heh
J. J. Abrams wanted to be free of canon and the result so far was bland action and a variation of the very canon he tried to get rid of.
David Hyde Pierce as his #1?
:neverusethis:
David Hyde Pierce as his #1?
:neverusethis:
Fuck it, let's just call it "Frasier In Space".
David Hyde Pierce as his #1?
:neverusethis:
Fuck it, let's just call it "Frasier In Space".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2hs0oZ6JuQ
I haven't heard anything beyond a couple of rumours. They're probably just building the sets right now.
It's a shame it's filming in Toronto and not Vancouver, the true home of scifi. :blob:
You're right.
We all know that teaser trailers are always 100% representative of the final movie.
I don't trust a guy who uses Instagram like a 12 yr old girl.
It was also a dead-ringer for the first two movies and what most of us disliked about them. In a vacuum I could go along with "it's not indicative and only there to drum up hype." With the first two as reference that doesn't work anymore.You're right.
We all know that teaser trailers are always 100% representative of the final movie.
Of course they're not. But it is all I have seen of the movie. When I have a trailer that shows something different, I'll believe something different.
Simon Pegg and Justin Lin confirmed that When Pegg and Jung came on board - they completely ditched Orci's script and started over.
Ocri and the other two still get a credit since they started out on the project or whatever. i don't understand it either.
They look about right compared to the shuttle crafts, so those too must be out of scale. What's the supposed diameter of the saucer?
If the anomaly is always bigger in the past, why is it visible several hours after it was created?
But when they went back to find it in the Enterprise, it hadn't actually been created yet. The Pasteur created it and it ran backward, expanding as it went. That's why they couldn't actually see it from the Pasteur. Upon their return it was, from the anomalies standpoint, several hours away from being created.
And I'm not slagging on the episode, I think it was one of their best efforts. It just never occurred to me that the premise completely falls apart in the final 20 minutes until I watched it earlier today. Technically, the future Enterprise couldn't have played a part in the resolution since it hadn't even started yet.
More importantly, the movies don't seem to have anything to do with the series. The names are the same, but the characters really aren't.
The biggest problem is that the only two characters that really interest me are the ones that change most dramatically. Data gets the personality chip hard-wired into him and becomes the clown. That happens almost immediately and he's a fundamentally different character from that point on. I find the funny Data amusing enough, but it's not the same by any means. Picard becomes prone to Ramboism. Not really in Generations, but every movie after that involves him spending a good deal of time as Jean McClain. Moreover, his personality changes to suit the action hero persona. How many times does he disregard orders or the safety of his crew during final 3 movies? The rest of them don't change too much, but Troi becomes the federation's most useful employee, as her pedantic psychobabble isn't very entertaining in long form. Notice that whenever things are at their most dramatic she's either flying the ship or sitting a ops. When they crash the ship in Generations there are 30 people on the bridge. Was she really the most qualified to be the flying the ship as they're crash landing?More importantly, the movies don't seem to have anything to do with the series. The names are the same, but the characters really aren't.
I honestly don't see this at all. Yes, they're more dark/serious versions of the characters, but they don't seem like different people to me.
I'd call that character development. Even if it's development you don't like. They're not fundamentally different though.That works for Troi becoming Wonder Woman. Not so much for Data and Picard. They "evolved" right on out of the defining characteristics of who they'd been all this time. Data's emotional detachment and longing to be human, and Picard's thoughtfulness.
If the anomaly is always bigger in the past, why is it visible several hours after it was created?
I'd call that character development. Even if it's development you don't like. They're not fundamentally different though.That works for Troi becoming Wonder Woman. Not so much for Data and Picard. They "evolved" right on out of the defining characteristics of who they'd been all this time. Data's emotional detachment and longing to be human, and Picard's thoughtfulness.
If it were just the Ahab thing in FC, that would be one thing. Leaving the neutral zone to join the fight against the Borg was a different matter, and not at all Piccard-like. And the problem with Data wasn't expanding him with the emotion chip, per se. It's that they did it when they knew there would only be 2 or three stories left to tell, all self contained. There wasn't any development. There was "new and improved Funny Data" thrown in to make the movies different. It was a conscious effort to make him a fundamentally different character for the movies.I'd call that character development. Even if it's development you don't like. They're not fundamentally different though.That works for Troi becoming Wonder Woman. Not so much for Data and Picard. They "evolved" right on out of the defining characteristics of who they'd been all this time. Data's emotional detachment and longing to be human, and Picard's thoughtfulness.
I didn't have a problem with Data. I'll give you the Picard thing, but only in Insurrection. He made perfect sense in the other movies. In Generations and hell, even that awful Nemesis, it was pretty normal Picard. In First Contact, the trauma and his feelings toward the Borg overcame his normal sensibilities, but it was still in line with his character, given everything he went through.
Honestly, if Data and Picard are just one thing all the time, then those are some pretty flat characters.
Maybe nobody cares.
There is no Enterprise. There is no Starfleet. There is no United Federation of Planets.
There is no Picard or Data or Q.
It's all made up.
Nemesis is still shit though.
Nemesis, insurrection, motion picture, Final Frontier, 2009 and Into Darkness are still shit though.
FTFY.
Sometimes I wonder why certain people even post in this thread.Me too.
Sometimes I wonder why certain people even post in this thread.Me too.
Old Trek fans need to get over the fact that the new movies are action films.
Into Darkness was not so bad it was hard to watch.
I really think you are in the minority Blob.
Yet the Roddenberry was was dying. Each film drew less and less and the last year of Enterprise was a cluster at least in America when they we jumping it to different times and then canceling it. Things needed to change.
Old Trek fans need to get over the fact that the new movies are action films.Dream Theater has been stagnating ever since FII. Their fanbase hasn't changed one bit, and it's limited to a select group of prog fans. I think they need to put out a pop album full of radio friendly hits. And to be on the safe side there should be a duet with Carrie Underwood on it. Best to throw a big net. I'm sure once they expand their fanbase they'll be able to go back to playing prog and all of the new fans will stick with them.
The series in general was dying. You can't deny that. They needed to take a break and pull new fans in. Doing it the old way would do nothing again and they needed to make an action packed film. I know what you are going to say, the writing, the writing, the writing. It's not that bad. It's just that it's not they way the old fans want it written.
I hope this is a catalyst to have a well written TV series more in the vein of the older series. I'm ok with all this.
Old Trek fans need to get over the fact that the new movies are action films.Dream Theater has been stagnating ever since FII. Their fanbase hasn't changed one bit, and it's limited to a select group of prog fans. I think they need to put out a pop album full of radio friendly hits. And to be on the safe side there should be a duet with Carrie Underwood on it. Best to throw a big net. I'm sure once they expand their fanbase they'll be able to go back to playing prog and all of the new fans will stick with them.
The series in general was dying. You can't deny that. They needed to take a break and pull new fans in. Doing it the old way would do nothing again and they needed to make an action packed film. I know what you are going to say, the writing, the writing, the writing. It's not that bad. It's just that it's not they way the old fans want it written.
I hope this is a catalyst to have a well written TV series more in the vein of the older series. I'm ok with all this.
Question about the new movies. Would they be any different if it was some no-name crew, aboard the HMS Pegasus, in some completely new space universe? Most of us wouldn't have gone to see it without the ST franchise tag, but the movie itself would have been exactly the same, and either enjoyable or not based on one's personal inclinations. TWoK worked because we understood the emotional backstory between Kirk, Spock and Khan. ST was the pretty wrapper, but the content was generic.
Question about the new movies. Would they be any different if it was some no-name crew, aboard the HMS Pegasus, in some completely new space universe? Most of us wouldn't have gone to see it without the ST franchise tag, but the movie itself would have been exactly the same, and either enjoyable or not based on one's personal inclinations. TWoK worked because we understood the emotional backstory between Kirk, Spock and Khan. ST was the pretty wrapper, but the content was generic.
It would help me with the cast, since I really don't like Sylar as Spock. But it still wouldn't help with the bad plots/writing etc.
Also, I have no idea why we need other people to like/dislike what we like/dislike. If you love Star Trek 2009 and Into Darkness, cool! Keep enjoying them. I personally didn't like either movie, shouldn't that be cool too? Can't I have my standards for what I want without pissing you guys off simply for not thinking it was well done?
Best case scenario is that ST2017 is great and STBeyond is also great.
People working on it include :
Bryan Fuller who worked on ST Voyager.
Rod Roddenberry
Nick Meyer who directed TWOK and TUC and co-wrote TVH
Some guy who made a Star trek documentary
Alex Kurtzman.
Kurtzman is only producing. Not writing AFAIK.
TWoK worked because we understood the emotional backstory between Kirk, Spock and Khan. ST was the pretty wrapper, but the content was generic.
I'm with Blob.Me too. I saw SDID once, and I will never make that mistake again.
I'm with Blob.Me too. I saw SDID once, and I will never make that mistake again.
...yeah, that's what I said.
I mean, obviously, it was a mistake for me. That doesn't mean it was necessarily a mistake for anyone else.
It would be a mistake for some people to pick a fight with Dwayne Johnson. But that doesn't mean it would necessarily be a mistake for, say, Jason Statham to pick a fight with him. Mistakes don't have to be universal.
I'm just going to give hef the benefit of the doubt, and assume he was cleverly referring to it as Star Dreck. :neverusethis:
So who would you pick to write and direct Star Trek 4 if there is one ?
Never mind " the studio will flood it with action and explosions anyway ". Assume that's a given but who would you choose if it was up to you ?
I'd get Wally Pfister to shoot and light it. I'd love to see Chris and John Nolan write / direct it.
I vote to give the reboot a mercy killing, and pray the TV show ends up watchable.Same here.
I think you are all on drugs. The writing has been suspect but the acting is fine. Just don't watch the movies.
I think it's the writing of Spock that bothers most. Him showing emotion is what bothers both. Never would you see Spock kissing a female.
I loved the Sylar character on Heroes. I think it's more about the writing here.
I think it's the writing of Spock that bothers most. Him showing emotion is what bothers both. Never would you see Spock kissing a female.
I loved the Sylar character on Heroes. I think it's more about the writing here.
Oh the writing is bad too, for sure. I also loved Sylar, which is why I was initially excited about the casting, but the acting is also very off. Nimoy Spock had a very thoughtful way of speaking, as if every word was wise and thought out. There was an irony to it as well. When Sylar talks as Spock, it usually comes off as snarky. There's also an issue of speed. One of the reasons Spock came off as so wise was because of the tone and speed he spoke, which was considerably slow. Sylar speaks pretty damn fast as spock. It's a small thing, but to a huge Spock fan like me, it stands out a lot and makes him just another modern snarky character and not the wise thoughtful character he's supposed to be, new timeline or not.
I think it's the writing of Spock that bothers most. Him showing emotion is what bothers both. Never would you see Spock kissing a female.I seem to recall him being pretty damned successful with the ladies. Even setting aside the episodes where he was rendered non-Vulcan for one reason or another, it took him all of about 2 hours to talk an enemy ship captain right out of her miniskirt, and he was well on his way to getting some of Droxine, as well.
I think it's the writing of Spock that bothers most. Him showing emotion is what bothers both. Never would you see Spock kissing a female.I seem to recall him being pretty damned successful with the ladies. Even setting aside the episodes where he was rendered non-Vulcan for one reason or another, it took him all of about 2 hours to talk an enemy ship captain right out of her miniskirt, and he was well on his way to getting some of Droxine, as well.
He definitely worked on many of the best of Voyager, not sure on TNG, I don't remember it well enough. But definitely some good ones there too.Dude wrote some very good episodes for all of the series. Dude also wrote some of the very worst episodes. For every episode I really like there's one that I can't stand to even think about.
This is the first firmly positive news for the new series for me.
Secondly it seems the Axanar lawsuit is back on.
Seems the guy in charge of Axanar can't stop being a dick.
Can they make STContinues official instead ?
Here's an easy question.Depends on what you're asking. If you're asking who's hotter, as is usually the case when somebody says Girl A or Girl B, then it's Kirstie Alley by a light year. Back in the day she was smoking hot. If it's who was the better Vulcan, neither of them were particularly good. Kirstie's Saavik seemd pretty clueless, though she made it look really good. Robin Curtis's was just bland. Had they actually made Valeris Saavik, as they intended, then Kim Catrall would be the easy pick. She was the best Vulcan.
Lt. Saavik. Robin Curtis or Kirstie Alley?
Secondly it seems the Axanar lawsuit is back on.
Seems the guy in charge of Axanar can't stop being a dick.
Can they make STContinues official instead ?
Secondly it seems the Axanar lawsuit is back on.
Seems the guy in charge of Axanar can't stop being a dick.
Can they make STContinues official instead ?
Apparently they never actually dropped the lawsuit, but they were trying to settle it out of court. But the Axanar crew are idiots, and they deserve to get their asses run into the ground.
Star Trek Continues is the perfect example of how to run a fan film all around. Nothing but class and quality.
Secondly it seems the Axanar lawsuit is back on.
Seems the guy in charge of Axanar can't stop being a dick.
Can they make STContinues official instead ?
Apparently they never actually dropped the lawsuit, but they were trying to settle it out of court. But the Axanar crew are idiots, and they deserve to get their asses run into the ground.
Star Trek Continues is the perfect example of how to run a fan film all around. Nothing but class and quality.
So...Blob....care to summarize this stuff? I looked up the lawsuit, but I don't see why the Axanar guys are such douche bags. Insight pwease?
Nothing is better than Into Darkness.
Nothing is better than Into Darkness.
You're right. Watching nothing would be preferable to watching Into Darkness. :biggrin:
Here's an easy question.Depends on what you're asking. If you're asking who's hotter, as is usually the case when somebody says Girl A or Girl B, then it's Kirstie Alley by a light year. Back in the day she was smoking hot. If it's who was the better Vulcan, neither of them were particularly good. Kirstie's Saavik seemd pretty clueless, though she made it look really good. Robin Curtis's was just bland. Had they actually made Valeris Saavik, as they intended, then Kim Catrall would be the easy pick. She was the best Vulcan.
Lt. Saavik. Robin Curtis or Kirstie Alley?
Nothing is better than Into Darkness.
You're right. Watching nothing would be preferable to watching Into Darkness. :biggrin:
Honestly, i would watch Into Darkness a hundred times, before watching Generations, Insurrection or Nemesis ever again. :D
Well, yeah, she's a Scientologist. That hasn't managed to help with her weight issues. However, I was definitely referring to back in the day. Back when she played Saavik she looked fantastic. Her first season on Cheers, as well.Here's an easy question.Depends on what you're asking. If you're asking who's hotter, as is usually the case when somebody says Girl A or Girl B, then it's Kirstie Alley by a light year. Back in the day she was smoking hot. If it's who was the better Vulcan, neither of them were particularly good. Kirstie's Saavik seemd pretty clueless, though she made it look really good. Robin Curtis's was just bland. Had they actually made Valeris Saavik, as they intended, then Kim Catrall would be the easy pick. She was the best Vulcan.
Lt. Saavik. Robin Curtis or Kirstie Alley?
I looked up Kirstie Alley and she looks ok for her age. But she's still a nut case.
Honestly, i would watch Into Darkness a hundred times, before watching Generations, Insurrection or Nemesis ever again. :D
Whereas I could easily watch it over Insurrection.I watched Insurrection a couple of weeks ago, along with a couple of the other crappy movies. Couldn't bring myself to watch Nemisis. Started it. Skipped to three random points in the movie. Decided I'd rather watch nothing.
I thought the whole film has this aura of warmth. I guess I can't describe it.It was certainly an orange film. I agree about the warmness of it. I just don't' find it particularly entertaining or interesting.
Generations is an odd one to me. I really like (most) of the character moments (probably for similar reasons that Barto doesn't) but it does have a rather awful plot that was clearly forced to help Shatner show up.
First Contact gets an A for both, sucks people here seem to dislike it so much, but such is life. No big deal.
After actually watching the proof of concept I think he might well be right. That was pretty slick. The guy that played Garth didn't work for me, but according to wikiP that was actually the writer and the role will be done professionally for the feature. The only other problem was that the Klingon wasn't particularly Klingon-like, but since this was done as a documentary it's not real telling. All in all I'd really like to see the feature version of that, which is a whole lot more than I can say about Paramount's effort.
Well the lawsuit itself is mostly related to the standard IP stuff.
The reason they're douchebags is because they crowdfunded over a million dollars for their fan film so they could all get salaries for their work, and purchase a large studio to start their own scifi franchise, directly profiting off Star Trek's IP, and on social media they've done nothing but bag the shit out of Star Trek and talk about how much better their fan film is. After the lawsuit started, they made a rant about how they were only being sued because Axanar had the superior product and they didn't want competition, and claimed they were going to win the lawsuit with the best lawyers, and I think they even tried to counter sue, and in defense of the lawsuit itself, claimed their fan film didn't even resemble Star Trek's trademarks.
Basically, CBS/Paramount have been incredibly lenient with people crowdfunding fan film as long as there's transparency that it's all going directly towards equipment/supplies to make the film, and no profit is being made, and Axanar flagrantly disregarded that to profit from it, then bit the hand that feeds them.
Also, the guy in charge apparently has a long history of dodgy shit.
Ugh. Shitty news. Guess this film series is over then...
He was so young with a lot of potential, and to go in such circumstances is a shock and a shame.
I really hope Beyond does really well now.
I really hope Beyond does really well now.
I really hope Beyond does really well now.
Why? Because someone died?
I'd rather hope they end with this one and don't have to deal with writing out the character.
I can easily see how he was hit by his own car, but for it to be fatal is bizarre. People start their car before remembering something and jump out all the time. If you drive a stick might to forget to set the parking brake. We've all done that before. It's just odd for a car to pick up much speed like that, unless it's really steep or a really long roll. Definitely some very bad luck for the kid.He was so young with a lot of potential, and to go in such circumstances is a shock and a shame.
Yea, I am extremely confused by the actual events that happened. Very true though, a real damn shame.
I mean, it's not like Chekov was necessary in the reboots anyway.Was Checkov EVER necessary? Other than TWOK, I never really thought of him as an essential character. He was just, like, the top redshirt or something. Oh, and Russian because of diversity and world peace.
Incorrect. He was created to entice the Monkees fanbase, not appease or acknowlegde the Russians.
Yeah, definitely both. Certainly wasn't about appeasement, though. Just multiculturalism.
Well, certainly pandering to teenage girls. :lol
It's a trip, the more they make cars safer, the more they make them completely unintuitive.
and if you rely on Netflix, the first 7 movies will also be gone by next month. Great time to be a fan! :)
Good interview with Fuller. I was looking forward to exploring the time between ST6 and ST7 so I'm not exactly overjoyed it's off the table. The hint at known characters guesting "eventually" probably points to post VOY era. Good thing Comic Con and more news are only a month away.
Greetings...
Nef
For reals? :(Well, it doesn't have anything to do with the 50th or Axanar or anything. Movies and TV shows are only under contract to be on Netflix (or Hulu, or Amazon Prime, or Crackle, or anything else) for so long. Some things leave those services every month, and new stuff shows up every month.
https://trekmovie.com/2016/06/21/classic-trek-films-warping-away-from-netflix-july-1st/
For reals? :(Well, it doesn't have anything to do with the 50th or Axanar or anything. Movies and TV shows are only under contract to be on Netflix (or Hulu, or Amazon Prime, or Crackle, or anything else) for so long. Some things leave those services every month, and new stuff shows up every month.
https://trekmovie.com/2016/06/21/classic-trek-films-warping-away-from-netflix-july-1st/
Good interview with Fuller. I was looking forward to exploring the time between ST6 and ST7 so I'm not exactly overjoyed it's off the table. The hint at known characters guesting "eventually" probably points to post VOY era. Good thing Comic Con and more news are only a month away.
Greetings...
Nef
I didn't get any indication that ST6 era was off the table, but one can hope. The best thing they could do is go post VOY/NEM.
He said 762 total episodes of Star Trek. Innocent mistake.Seems like rule 5 is the troubling one. Everybody has to work for free and former ST actors can't appear in them. That's the fatal blow.
In case people haven't seen yet, CBS/Paramount just released an official list of fan film guidelines that is sending everyone nuts. Rule 1 is perhaps the worst of them for most fan films.
https://www.startrek.com/fan-films (https://www.startrek.com/fan-films)
Thanks Axanar for fucking everyone. Bunch of assholes.
Axanar raised $1.5m for themselves off the back of Paramount & CBS property I think and now they're not doing refunds for backers despite promising them when they set up the Kickstarter. . .Where? The kickstarter is currently at $638,471. Their preliminary budget is $650-750, and is expected to climb. I really haven't put much effort into learning about all the goings on, so they might be crooks for all I know. I just haven't seen anything that really bugs me much, and it seems that Paramount is acting like the kid who takes his monopoly board home because he doesn't get to be the car.
Axanar raised $1.5m for themselves off the back of Paramount & CBS property I think and now they're not doing refunds for backers despite promising them when they set up the Kickstarter. . .Where? The kickstarter is currently at $638,471. Their preliminary budget is $650-750, and is expected to climb. I really haven't put much effort into learning about all the goings on, so they might be crooks for all I know. I just haven't seen anything that really bugs me much, and it seems that Paramount is acting like the kid who takes his monopoly board home because he doesn't get to be the car.
Axanar wasn't even good. It's run of the mill fan film with pretty CGI and nostalgia actors. Star Trek Continues is so true to what Star Trek is about, and perfectly captures the feel of TOS, without the '60s sillyness.
Which I find "better" is 100% irrelevant to the whole thing though. It's the red herring Axanar is using to rally up their fanboys to divert from the real issue here for the people who had no interest in getting the whole picture, including JJ. They have zero right to make a fan film. People are getting angry at CBS/Paramount for putting limits on fan films and stopping Axanar, instead of realizing how incredibly generous they've been until now to let people make fan series for 20 years. The difference with Axanar has literally zero to do with it being good (there have been many far better ones that had no incident, so that's total BS), it's to do with the recent opening of Pandora's box of crowdfunding. CBS has been forward thinking on the matter and lenient as long as the money was all towards production costs, and not profiteering, and Axanar went and spoiled it for everyone else by being greedy assholes. They're not for the fans, they're only out for themselves and their wallets. Not very Star Trek of them. :biggrin:
The fans have no entitlement to the IP. I don't agree with their criticisms of CBS/Paramount, because they have no legitimate or relevant arguments. Anyone who backs Axanar on this is wrong.
I don't agree with the fan film rules, and I think Beyond will be shit, but none of this makes Axanar right.
Yeah, no disagreement there. I'm just looking at it from the standpoint that there hasn't been good trek in ages, and suddenly these Axanar people seem to be doing something that really piques my interest. Most of the fan stuff looks like high school level productions with some nice CGI to spruce it up. The feature Axanar film looks good enough to interest me far more than the Transformers in space stuff that we've been getting lately, so I'd like to see it happen.
Let's just agree that Trek is in a bad place right now. There's plenty of blame to go around. :lol
And I find it unlikely that the folks doing STB are doing this on weekends while working in cubicles during the week. They're paying themselves living wages for their efforts. What constitutes a living wage vs. profit is a nebulous distinction.
Interesting distinction, albeit one that I don't share. They're not shooting for a theatrical release (unless they are, which would certainly change things). Finances aside, the only difference between what they're doing and what Cawley et al are doing is the length and the production quality. Not sure why one's official and one's a fan film.And I find it unlikely that the folks doing STB are doing this on weekends while working in cubicles during the week. They're paying themselves living wages for their efforts. What constitutes a living wage vs. profit is a nebulous distinction.
What does that have to do with anything? The people making STB are working on an official movie. We're talking about fan films.
Interesting distinction, albeit one that I don't share. They're not shooting for a theatrical release (unless they are, which would certainly change things). Finances aside, the only difference between what they're doing and what Cawley et al are doing is the length and the production quality. Not sure why one's official and one's a fan film.And I find it unlikely that the folks doing STB are doing this on weekends while working in cubicles during the week. They're paying themselves living wages for their efforts. What constitutes a living wage vs. profit is a nebulous distinction.
What does that have to do with anything? The people making STB are working on an official movie. We're talking about fan films.
Because one's made by the people who own the property and one isn't.
Interesting distinction, albeit one that I don't share. They're not shooting for a theatrical release (unless they are, which would certainly change things). Finances aside, the only difference between what they're doing and what Cawley et al are doing is the length and the production quality. Not sure why one's official and one's a fan film.And I find it unlikely that the folks doing STB are doing this on weekends while working in cubicles during the week. They're paying themselves living wages for their efforts. What constitutes a living wage vs. profit is a nebulous distinction.
What does that have to do with anything? The people making STB are working on an official movie. We're talking about fan films.
Because one's made by the people who own the property and one isn't.
Of course. I mistyped and confused the issue for everybody. Sorry. I meant STC rather than STB. Fucking acronyms. How do they work. My point was that the folks behind ST Continues are still very likely supporting themselves by doing what they are. As I've said, they're just doing so on a much smaller scale and with far more courtesy.
I believe nonprofits still get to support themselves, though. You can open up a charitable, nonprofit Save The Dingos Foundation and pay yourself to do it. You just have to account for the money and pay yourself reasonably. Same thing with churches. Father Chester isn't expected to work for free. I get the distinction between Axanar and STC in that regard, and I can see how it would ruffle some feathers. I just don't think that in reality it's all that different, if Axanar can justify where the money goes.Of course. I mistyped and confused the issue for everybody. Sorry. I meant STC rather than STB. Fucking acronyms. How do they work. My point was that the folks behind ST Continues are still very likely supporting themselves by doing what they are. As I've said, they're just doing so on a much smaller scale and with far more courtesy.
STC is registered as a non profit organization, with public records of funds, and they don't get paid for their time, and they even funded the first episode themselves out of pocket for over $100k. They've probably lost money on it if anything. There is a huge difference between STC and Axanar. Axanar has hired everyone to work, the main guy is paying himself a steady salary from the money so he doesn't have to otherwise work, and they've been selling their own Trek merch, and they've used the money to hire studio space for other ventures. They're leeches.
The first episode of STC is my least favourite btw. Too idealistic and hokey. The second episode is my favourite.I was actually going to ask, but I wanted to watch one during lunch and there's not telling when you'd get back. I tend to think it's always 0400 last Thursday down where you are.
I believe nonprofits still get to support themselves, though. You can open up a charitable, nonprofit Save The Dingos Foundation and pay yourself to do it. You just have to account for the money and pay yourself reasonably. Same thing with churches. Father Chester isn't expected to work for free. I get the distinction between Axanar and STC in that regard, and I can see how it would ruffle some feathers. I just don't think that in reality it's all that different, if Axanar can justify where the money goes.Of course. I mistyped and confused the issue for everybody. Sorry. I meant STC rather than STB. Fucking acronyms. How do they work. My point was that the folks behind ST Continues are still very likely supporting themselves by doing what they are. As I've said, they're just doing so on a much smaller scale and with far more courtesy.
STC is registered as a non profit organization, with public records of funds, and they don't get paid for their time, and they even funded the first episode themselves out of pocket for over $100k. They've probably lost money on it if anything. There is a huge difference between STC and Axanar. Axanar has hired everyone to work, the main guy is paying himself a steady salary from the money so he doesn't have to otherwise work, and they've been selling their own Trek merch, and they've used the money to hire studio space for other ventures. They're leeches.QuoteThe first episode of STC is my least favourite btw. Too idealistic and hokey. The second episode is my favourite.I was actually going to ask, but I wanted to watch one during lunch and there's not telling when you'd get back. I tend to think it's always 0400 last Thursday down where you are.
The area's gray enough that I don't see the stark distinction you do, but such is life.I believe nonprofits still get to support themselves, though. You can open up a charitable, nonprofit Save The Dingos Foundation and pay yourself to do it. You just have to account for the money and pay yourself reasonably. Same thing with churches. Father Chester isn't expected to work for free. I get the distinction between Axanar and STC in that regard, and I can see how it would ruffle some feathers. I just don't think that in reality it's all that different, if Axanar can justify where the money goes.Of course. I mistyped and confused the issue for everybody. Sorry. I meant STC rather than STB. Fucking acronyms. How do they work. My point was that the folks behind ST Continues are still very likely supporting themselves by doing what they are. As I've said, they're just doing so on a much smaller scale and with far more courtesy.
STC is registered as a non profit organization, with public records of funds, and they don't get paid for their time, and they even funded the first episode themselves out of pocket for over $100k. They've probably lost money on it if anything. There is a huge difference between STC and Axanar. Axanar has hired everyone to work, the main guy is paying himself a steady salary from the money so he doesn't have to otherwise work, and they've been selling their own Trek merch, and they've used the money to hire studio space for other ventures. They're leeches.QuoteThe first episode of STC is my least favourite btw. Too idealistic and hokey. The second episode is my favourite.I was actually going to ask, but I wanted to watch one during lunch and there's not telling when you'd get back. I tend to think it's always 0400 last Thursday down where you are.
It's actually 0400 next Thursday, thank you very much. :blob:
Vic from STC has outright said none of them are getting paid salaries. I don't know if that includes extras like the big guests stars or just the regulars, I can't claim to account for every single dollar, but the point is they certainly aren't doing it to profit themselves as a business venture. It's a labour of love. And they're not selling merch or DVDs or paying themselves to not have to work any other job, etc.
I admit there's a lot of room for grey area, but the intent of STC is simply to make the fan film and they've respected CBS's wishes at every step, while Axanar is copyright abuse for profit by a known conman who has declared bankruptcy multiple times.
Bart, you are confusing the hell out of me. I just skimmed through some STC, and I was on board with what you're saying until you mention what sounds like a typical TNG bash. Then I was totally lost.Remember one of the very first TNG episodes where one planet gets another planet hooked on some dope that only they can produce? They run through the DARE drugs are bad PSA on the bridge? The second STC is just about as heavy-handed.
Out of curiosity, is Axanar still producing the full length feature? Seems that Paramount has dropped their civil suit, but I'm not sure what that means going forward.
Out of curiosity, is Axanar still producing the full length feature? Seems that Paramount has dropped their civil suit, but I'm not sure what that means going forward.
They never dropped the suit, that was JJ talking out of his ass that got repeated over the net. Paramount was trying to settle out of court, but knowing the idiots at Axanar, it appears that obviously won't happen, so I'd say their squishing like bugs is still pending. There's zero chance they'll get the movie done, especially now they've destroyed fan films entirely.
I'm now convinced you don't like any Trek unless it has a healthy dose of '60s sexism and ideals.
I'm now convinced you don't like any Trek unless it has a healthy dose of '60s sexism and ideals.Like Adami suggested, I just don't like preachy and sappy. While I do like conflict, I really like the ethical variety. That's why I wanted to like the TSC stuff; they seem to get that.
I didn't get any indication that ST6 era was off the table, but one can hope. The best thing they could do is go post VOY/NEM.
wtf is going on
I like the 50's better when an African American couldn't put his name on the comic.
Which, of course, came pretty close to being what happened. Although I suppose if they'd gone that route, the entire franchise would have been part of Benny's story.I like the 50's better when an African American couldn't put his name on the comic.
An entire show based around that hallucination. Yes. Love it.
I didn't get any indication that ST6 era was off the table, but one can hope. The best thing they could do is go post VOY/NEM.
Sorry, that was in another link:
https://trekcore.com/blog/2016/06/bryan-fuller-shoots-down-two-star-trek-2017-rumors/
Post VOY would be the obvious choice of course. Post Khitomer conference would have been very bold and daring and interesting for many reasons I posted before.
But as long as they get the right tone and a certain level of quality I'm sure I'll be happy.
Greetings...
Nef
A fan continuation of TOS with some callbacks to TOS? Well I never!
A fan continuation of TOS with some callbacks to TOS? Well I never!You know damn well what I mean. Every episode is built around them. I've got no problem with making references to things from other episodes, but write stories and throw them in from time to time. Seems like every production meeting must have started with "which character should we bring back this time? Hey, let's have Trellaine put Kirk, the Gorn and that guy from Court Marshal on the planet with the guardian of forever so they can go back and time and prevent the space amoeba from destroying the planet Harry Mudd was on." "Brilliant!"
You know damn well what I mean. Every episode is built around them.
Metamorphosis.. ehh, boring but could have been worse.Babel is a great episode. Always thought very highly of it as a Spock story. It also establishes Sarek who'll return from time to time in the movies and other series.
Journey To Babel, quality episode, enjoyed the story line and dialogue throughout.
Dammit Jim, he's an actor, not a.....
I still say Sarek is the ultimate (full) Vulcan that any ST ever showed us.Sarek was a very good Vulcan, but he was a pretty limited character. You got one episode of him being good and stoically logical, a couple of cameos and then two episodes where he's falling apart. Don't get me wrong, he set the bar for what true Vulcans should be, but he didn't do enough to be the ultimate Vulcan in my book. I believe we've discussed this before, and I still think Tuvok was the only one to get significant airtime and remain truly Vulcan the entire time. He also remained the best outside observer of humanity, which I think is part of why Vulcans work in Star Trek.
Spock: Only a very slight chance it would work.
Kirk: Well, if you don't think we can, maybe we shouldn't try.
Spock: Captain, I didn't say that exactly.
McCoy: Capellans aren't human, Jim. They're humanoid. There's certain internal differences. I don't have equipment to handle an emergency.
Kirk: Well, if you don't think you can handle it..
McCoy: Forget it. I can do it. The last thing I want around is a ham-handed ship's captain.
McCoy: I'll need help getting her in there.
Eleen: No!
McCoy: Look, I'm a doctor, not an escalator!
McCoy to baby: Oochy-woochy coochy-coo. Oochy-woochy coochy-coo.
Spock: Oochy-woochy coochy-coo, Captain?
Kirk: An obscure Earth dialect, Mister Spock.
I like the DAHM CAHNDLE episode.
;D
I like the DAHM CAHNDLE episode.
;D
Oh come on man, don't totally discredit yourself like that.
I like the DAHM CAHNDLE episode.
;D
Oh come on man, don't totally discredit yourself like that.
pssst - he also thinks InsurrectiYAWN is the best Trek movie ;)
There are much worse episodes in the series. At least he didn't say that he liked a fistful of datas...
There are much worse episodes in the series. At least he didn't say that he liked a fistful of datas...
That is preferable. At least silly Data is entertaining on some level.
There are much worse episodes in the series. At least he didn't say that he liked a fistful of datas...
There are much worse episodes in the series. At least he didn't say that he liked a fistful of datas...
Fistful of Datas is nothing compared to Naked Now from season 1, or that one in season 7 where Wesley drops out of starfleet to become a jedi master.
Those 2 episodes still make me want to vomit!
Ha ha, true! That sound Picard makes when he *just about* loses his control -- sounds somewhere between a hrumph! and clearing his throat and maybe choking just a little bit -- is great.
Also - whenever the Enterprise has alien intruders - that capture the crew - I don't know why Picard or Riker can't just sayI was always amused by how easy it was to steel a shuttlecraft. Even kids have no problem getting away.
" Computer - beam all intruders to the brig "
:lol
They get captured so easily.
"Sir, there'a an unauthorized shuttle launch in progress."
"Well stop it!"
"Too late sir."
"Seal the hangar bay doors!"
"Too late sir."
"Tractor beam."
"Too late, sir, he's out of range."
"Lay in a pursuit-"
"Main engines offline, sir."
"Arm photon torpedoes"
"He's gone to warp sir. We lost him."
I like who they picked.
The ending is the only part of the episode that feels awkward. I know what they were going for, but it doesn't quite work. That said, I'm not sure having it be a "big reveal" would have been better. It still comes down to how well it is written.Yeah, I agree. The first cut-back to the enterprise was the mindfuck. Once that's done then the rest is just a nice story. And I think I've mentioned it before, but JLP winding up with the flute was a silly contrivance. How did they know to put it in the probe? What if he'd displayed a fondness for painting instead?
One thing I love about the way it's presented now is that first cut to what's happening on the Enterprise. We've been following Picard as Kamin for a while already, but when they cut back to the Enterprise, Picard has just fallen and they're calling sick bay. That threw me for a loop. Then after years have passed on the planet, we cut back to the Enterprise and it's only been like ten minutes. Kamin's life has been compressed, and Picard lives it in 25 minutes. I like getting thrown like that, having to figure out what's going on instead of having everything spoon-fed to me. Maybe that's what bugs me about the ending. For the sake of the lowest common denominators out there, they have to completely explain everything. I mean, come on. Picard: "Oh... oh, it's me... isn't it? I'm the someone. I'm the one it finds. That's what this launching is – a probe that finds me in the future!"
It seems like they could have made it just a bit more interesting, have the viewer work at least some of it out themselves, which would lead to a sense of accomplishment and thus greater satisfaction in the story overall.
And Non-Tuvok shows up several times. I think he was on DS9 at some point, and also in one of the movies.
World Premiere in Sydney tonight !!
Also, the new Sulu is gay, and ironically, George Takei is not a fan.
Also, the new Sulu is gay, and ironically, George Takei is not a fan.
I agree with Takei. I'm all for a gay character in the Trek universe, and expect and hope the new show addresses it, but tacking it onto an existing character with no history of being a gay character just because Takei is gay, is kind of lame. It appears as if it will be handled well enough, but the situation makes it feel token. They've had two whole movies already in the reboot to address this, but this wasn't even intended for reboot Sulu until now. They've tacked this in after the fact.
I have no problem with a gay character, or that it's Sulu, but this feels misplaced to me. That said, it doesn't really bother me. It's not like Sulu was a womanizer in TOS, or in the reboot, but they could have just as easily created a new gay character.
It's not part of the character's past, but it also doesn't contradict the character's past. So it's no big deal either way.
in flameslol
It would be awesome to do that, especially since they have already fucked up the reboot in almost every other way already.
It would be awesome to do that, especially since they have already fucked up the reboot in almost every other way already.
Whilst still being better than at least half of the Next Gen movies...
I still say Sarek is the ultimate (full) Vulcan that any ST ever showed us.Sarek was a very good Vulcan, but he was a pretty limited character. You got one episode of him being good and stoically logical, a couple of cameos and then two episodes where he's falling apart. Don't get me wrong, he set the bar for what true Vulcans should be, but he didn't do enough to be the ultimate Vulcan in my book. I believe we've discussed this before, and I still think Tuvok was the only one to get significant airtime and remain truly Vulcan the entire time. He also remained the best outside observer of humanity, which I think is part of why Vulcans work in Star Trek.
It would be awesome to do that, especially since they have already fucked up the reboot in almost every other way already.
Whilst still being better than at least half of the Next Gen movies...
Well obviously we disagree, but personally I would only put ST2009 above Nemesis. I'd say the rest of the TNG movies are better than it, and I'd rather watch Nemesis than Into Darkness.
ST09 is the best Trek movie since Undiscovered Country IMO. Into Darkness is nowhere near as good, but still a fun movie. The TNG movies, with the exception of First Contact, are the lowest of the low points in the franchise. Nemesis and Generations are borderline disgusting.
Picard paces up & down.
Troi : " I sense you are pacing up & down, Captain."
Picard : " Your empathic abilities are off the f---ing charts today, Counsellor ::) "
One good thing about Lawaxana showing up was that she had her full powers. Like when she exposed the assassination plan from these other aliens as if it were some after thought of hers. That's what Troi should have been, someone to get into the enemy's mind and give Picard insider information. Pretty sure if the show was remade today, that's more of the role she'd take.
Nevermind, I forgot how things work today. She'd be the super hot love interest of someone who does very little...........so pretty much the same.
Nevermind, I forgot how things work today. She'd be the super hot love interest of someone who does very little...........so pretty much the same.
And I'd be fine with that, as long as the actress was hot. Mission accomplished.
Nevermind, I forgot how things work today. She'd be the super hot love interest of someone who does very little...........so pretty much the same.
And I'd be fine with that, as long as the actress was hot. Mission accomplished.
The mini-skirt uniform in season 1. :hat
You know, for as scantily clothed as they often made alien species, they never took that opportunity with Troi, who was actually incredibly attractive underneath that horrible hair and super modest outfit.
Don't forget the famous yoga scene....
...that scene with the frozen fish people was badass...
Nine times out of ten I'd want to punch an actress in the mouth for such idiocy.
...that scene with the frozen fish people was badass...
You mean Mick Fleetwood in full Antedean mode?
Imagine an Antedean drummer...
Greetings...
Nef
Don't forget the famous yoga scene....
You know, maybe it's an age thing, but i never found those super tight 80's workout clothing attractive.
It's funny. I never found her attractive until Ronny Cox made her where an actual Starfleet uniform. As I understand it, Marina Sirtis hounded them for a year and a half to get out of the catsuits and be an actual respectable character instead of a tart. Nine times out of ten I'd want to punch an actress in the mouth for such idiocy, but in this instance the girl was spot on. It was a huge improvement.
Sure did. Even the wife loved it.
I also think that making a brand new gay character would have felt like pandering.
Is Chekov gay?No.
Is Harry Kim bisexual?Unlikely.
Is Malcom Reed gender fluid?Highly likely.
I also think that making a brand new gay character would have felt like pandering.
Is Malcom Reed gender fluid?Highly likely.
It always bugged me that they just happened to have taken aboard a geriatric specialist, and she just happened to be one of Kirk's old girlfriends. Other than that I've got no problem with it.
Looks like we're getting a Star Trek 4 (no clue about Chekov) and Kirk's dad is coming back.Considering how the movies work, he probably put his katra into one of the bridge crew without telling anybody.
Anyone else noticed that in TNG - whenever someone from Starfleet arrives to board the Enterprise D - It's *always* an Excelsior class ship.
Probably to save on making new models.
Picard : Geordi, Leah Brahms is coming aboard.
Geordi....Ok Captain...
Later that day...
Geordi : Computer - delete all traces of Geordi Brahms Holodeck Program ffs :dangerwillrobinson:
Still have no idea why he didn't immediately do this :lol
Actually....if you think about it, I don't think he could have destroyed the program without destroying the research. That would be a pretty good reason not to delete it.
" Conundrum ".
:o Oh we've all lost our memories. We all appear to be here though. Data, Riker, Troi, Commaner McDuff.
:lol
That was a good camera reveal though.
Is Malcom Reed gender fluid?Highly likely.
" Conundrum ".That was a good premise for a show. I always associate it with Clues, which I also thought was a good episode.
:o Oh we've all lost our memories. We all appear to be here though. Data, Riker, Troi, Commaner McDuff.
:lol
That was a good camera reveal though.
" Conundrum ".That was a good premise for a show. I always associate it with Clues, which I also thought was a good episode.
:o Oh we've all lost our memories. We all appear to be here though. Data, Riker, Troi, Commaner McDuff.
:lol
That was a good camera reveal though.
" Message In A Bottle "
:lol What is this episode ? It's more like Red Dwarf than Star Trek.
And it's a damn shame, as it's a great idea for an episode. I coincidentally just watched it yesterday. Their banter was dreadful, but the doctor dealing with the Romulans was pretty good. They should have done it with Picardo as a second, unevolved EMH with that grouchy demeanor. Also, Seven electrocuting the enraged Hirogin guy via the radio was one of the show's funniest bits. The dude's screams really sold it nicely. :lol" Message In A Bottle "
:lol What is this episode ? It's more like Red Dwarf than Star Trek.
Nothing says quality Trek like Andy Dick as a god damn doctor.
All the main cast are good actors but I think Pat Stewart, Jonathan Frakes and LeVar Burton are the top 3 with Spiner coming in 4th when he plays Data. Not Soong or Lore.Star Trek acting is a peculiar thing. These people essentially create their characters so it's pretty hard for them to be bad at it. You don't think of Wil Wheaton as a bad actor. You think of Wesley Crusher as an annoying character. Same thing with Sirtis and Troi. I really only judge their acting skills by how they play other characters. Dorn is great as Worf, but put him in another role and he's just awful. That applies to most of the DS9 cast. That's the biggest reason the mirror universe episodes were so bad. I think Spiner as Data is a wonderful character, but as an actor I really can't stand the guy, and that's because he played so many non-Data characters and they were all pretty bad. Most of the TNG cast got a break in that regard. When was Levar Burton not Geordi?
I think the reboot actors have a much tougher job, and they have mostly done very well. It's easy for Shatner and Nimoy to play Kirk and Spock. It's a bitch for somebody else to come along and do it.
" The Chase "That guy was a dick, but I liked the episode. And the Klingon was a real hoot.
That old guy who invites himself on board - and basically says Picard has to leave the Enterprise for a year - and gets mad when he doesn't ...
:lol
" The Chase "That guy was a dick, but I liked the episode. And the Klingon was a real hoot.
That old guy who invites himself on board - and basically says Picard has to leave the Enterprise for a year - and gets mad when he doesn't ...
:lol
He also expressed frustration that the non-Female Changeling Salome Jens was already dead as he wanted to kill her for wasting his time.
" Second Chances "
Tom Riker has been alone for 8 years and conveniently his hair and beard are identical to Will Riker.
They could have at least TRIED to make them look different :biggrin:
" Second Chances "
Tom Riker has been alone for 8 years and conveniently his hair and beard are identical to Will Riker.
They could have at least TRIED to make them look different :biggrin:
They did. Thomas Riker had a different colored shirt. :P
Crossing my fingers for Star Trek Space Dick.
Please be post-Nemesis
Please be post-Nemesis
Please be post-Nemesis
Please be post-Nemesis
Please be post-Nemesis
Please be post-Nemesis
Please be post-Nemesis
Crossing my fingers for Star Trek Space Dick.
Planet killer is so horney.
So I'm not a starship geek like some people here ((looks towards Australia)). I've watched TWok-TVH while working around the house and I don't get the Enterprise-A. Isn't it just the same refitted Constitution class they've had since TMP? Did they just take a different ship and rename/number it? For some reason I always thought it was a completely different ship, or at the least refitted, but it didn't seem any different.
Also, the Discovery is a pretty goofy looking ship. The thing that irks me is that it doesn't seem to follow any evolutionary design with other starships. Something that struck me the other day is that the D is an oddball in that regard. It's like all starships have the same basic design features, until the D comes along, and then the E goes back to looking like they're supposed to. I can see how the Discovery could be an evolutionary step foward from the NX-01, the basic shape isn't all that different when seen from above/below, but it's the oppose direction to get to the NCC1701 Enterprise.
Next Gen definitely gets better in series 2.
Series 1 has a lot of lofty dialogue that feels really out of place.
Thankfully Series 2 onwards does away with it for the most part.
Q : " Is the design of the Discovery, the CG and the titles, music all final ? "
A : " NO! We literally threw that together in 3 weeks just for something to show the fans. We'll be working on the design up until the end "
So there you go.
Next Gen definitely gets better in series 2.
Series 1 has a lot of lofty dialogue that feels really out of place.
Thankfully Series 2 onwards does away with it for the most part.
Cumberbatch as Khan was a fucking travesty in every way. Watching Into Darkness before The Wrath of Khan is wrong on so many levels I don't even know where to start. :lolYeah, pretty much.
The Gamesters of Triskelion, eh.. decent concept but something was missing, perhaps the awful guest stars broke this episode for me.I liked Gall, but the blond porno chick was pretty terrible.
Pegg's Scotty is a bit too heavy on the comedy side than James DoohanAs the movies went on they turned Doohan into comedic relief. The Abrams films just treat him the same.
The Trouble with Tribbles,TTWT was a decent episode, but I always felt it a bit overrated (it's usually ranked in the top 3 or so). Mostly I just always thought that particular Klingon was a bit of a fairy. Of the three starring Klingons of that era, who will all show up later in DS9, Kang and Kor were great, and Koloth was weak.
Klingons just don't have any redeeming qualities as yet, they're consistent douchebags.
Barto and Blob, kinda had a hunch you guys were gonna say that, I didn't intend to watch these movies yet as I detailed in my post, it's the misses heh
I doubt that whoever plays Khan in The Wrath of Khan would impress me more than Cumberbatch but I'm gonna go in with an open mind, but I would ask you; if Into Darkness had been exactly the same only Cumberbatch's character wasn't called Khan and it was just a different character with a similar backstory or even if they made out the person who's been woken up (Cumberbatch) to be someone else from Khan's people, would it have worked better for you? Or was your problem in Cumberbatch himself?
And that "whoever" is RICARDO FUCKING MONTALBAN! He IS Khan.Yup. And boy is he pissed off.
Into Darkness was utter garbage
And that "whoever" is RICARDO FUCKING MONTALBAN! He IS Khan.
Whoa Blob calm the fuck down dude, can't disagree with you without you going full on youtube-commentator :eek
TNG is of course great, but it could be a bit preachy at times, and it got off to a really weak start in the first couple of seasons. Still, it's a classic, and I love that cast and the ship.
Whoa Blob calm the fuck down dude, can't disagree with you without you going full on youtube-commentator :eekI was thinking about it and Blob is correct. You probably should just go ahead and what TWoK. It's set about 15 years after TOS, but little has changed so it won't matter much. Honestly, though, considering how highly it's regarded and your dislike of Montalban, you might be sorely disappointed in it. At this point, who knows?
Let me reply the way I reply to youtube commentators, with translation for Barto.Into Darkness was utter garbage
No, it was awesome.
(Chill discussion guy: I liked it a lot and that means something when I'm bias against Abrams, I've truly hated the guy for years. But then again I understand old fans frustrations with changes.)And that "whoever" is RICARDO FUCKING MONTALBAN! He IS Khan.
He's awful.
(Chill discussion guy: I really didn't like him in Space Seed and I've repeatedly mentioned that's all I've seen of him, I'm pretty sure he'll be better in Wrath of Khan since it's unanimously praised.)
A Private Little War, the interesting thing about this episode is that it highlights the prime directive, possibly the first time it get that's much attention from the main plot as far as I remember, I only heard the term on Into Darkness and I looked it up thinking it's a set of rule and found out it was mainly one rule and that makes it really important so I kinda found it funny how Kirk genuinely does not give a fuck about that rule or just always forgets it and somehow doesn't get punished for it, this episode is not the first time Kirk interferes with problems of a primitive planet, or just a planet that has a way of life he finds to be wrong.
The Tyree/Nona thing was pretty annoying and I thought the concept of agents of two advanced civilization arming and meddling in the affairs of a primitive planet could have been explored so much better, it obviously has Cold War hints. Instead we got way too much focus on Nona and her magic.
7 episodes left in season 2 and then it will be just one season to go, it's gonna be sad when I finish this show but I don't feel like taking another hiatus.
TNG series 1 is pretty bad. Code of honour is an awful episode.
I don't think S3-7 Picard would let Tasha fight.
The directing is so awkward.
Tasha gets beamed away. Picard turns to look at the camera and says RED ALERT then just stands there
staring down the lens.
It's like a bad TOS episode with the TNG cast with all the same music cues.
It's so weird.
S2 is better and S3 onwards is great.
I think S5 or so Picard would have just gotten Tasha back and then demanded the vaccine.
He wouldn't have said Ok Tasha you can fight to the death.
It's cool.
It is hilarious how he is so often the comic relief and gets shut down do often.
Worf had some good moments, but a lot of the time I didn't like his character. He was a half-assed Klingon with uptight morals.
Worf had some good moments, but a lot of the time I didn't like his character. He was a half-assed Klingon with uptight morals.
He had some pretty good character development over the shows - I always enjoyed his stuff with the Klingon High Council, getting exiled and his brother stuff. And the bits with General Martok at the end of DS9 was mostly good stuff. The stuff with his son Alexander towards the end of TNG was crap though, and while I didn't mind him hooking up with Jadzia (As far as ST romance goes this was one of the best, although thats not saying much) I hated the Ezri crap in the final season. I think Dorn was great - like Nimoy as Spock, it was a role he was born to play.
Yeah, it took a couple of seasons of DS9 for him to really start being a decent Klingon.
And following Kowtow's theme of pointing out peculiarities of episodes.
And using a different line for each sentence.
Picard pacing back and forth, nervous as hell because Riker is participating in Worf's training program was silly. Did he really think that Worf was going to skin him or something? "There are some parts of the Klingon psyche better left unknown." WTF? And you want him as part of your bridge crew?
And more importantly, are Betazoid drivers like the Asian drivers of the galaxy?
The Ferengi are the type of aliens to deliberately board a quarantined starfleet ship - contract a lethal illness and blame the Federation for using it as a new bio weapon against the Ferengi :lol
And if you're concerned about running out of TOS, there's nothing stopping you from starting up TNG and bouncing back and forth. It's a very different show, so it won't cause any problems. I'd make up a list like I did for TOS, but given our different tastes it probably wouldn't be helpful. It's just pretty rough getting through the first season.
And. . .This is why I won't be making a TNG list. :lolAnd if you're concerned about running out of TOS, there's nothing stopping you from starting up TNG and bouncing back and forth. It's a very different show, so it won't cause any problems. I'd make up a list like I did for TOS, but given our different tastes it probably wouldn't be helpful. It's just pretty rough getting through the first season.
I was thinking about jumping to TNG but I wanted to get to it in production order, if you say it doesn't matter then I might actually give it a shot right away.
I actually have your first list for TOS bookmarked (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=38049.msg1832261#msg1832261) and out of curiosity I keep checking back on it to see if the episode I just watched was on it. The list as I understood was made up as a sampler "best of" so I'd see if I'll get interested in Star Trek. Now that I'm totally hooked and intend on watching everything Star Trek ever produced, there's no need for a TNG list or any other since I'll watch all the episodes anyway, thanks though ;D
Return to Tomorrow, I'm surprised that one didn't show up on yours or Blob's lists, I found it a very engaging and fun watch.
Well scripted, the meeting where Kirk debates the situation with McCoy, Spock, Mulhall and Scotty was pretty great, even with Shatner's over the top performance. Henoch/evil Spock was really cool.
Good plot and decent script, I really liked that episode.
TNG here I come!
That was pretty much why I made the list. There are a lot of episodes and many of them blow. That's even more true of TNG. I generally reckon of every series there are about half that are worth watching and half that aren't. In the case of TOS I picked the half that I would watch.
What he sees looks a lot like infrared.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZ-RIhiBtpE He sees both above and below the visual spectrum, so it's much more cluttered and noisy than the thermal shown in the video. In S1E20 they show a scene through his visor. He doesn't see faces well, but sees microscopic cracks in walls and stuff.That was pretty much why I made the list. There are a lot of episodes and many of them blow. That's even more true of TNG. I generally reckon of every series there are about half that are worth watching and half that aren't. In the case of TOS I picked the half that I would watch.
I think it's tougher for a TV show to satisfy you than me, I kinda fall for atmospheres and vibes or simply a cast, then individual episodes quality becomes a bit secondary. Like now I'm into "futuristic space federation sends star ships to explore uncharted planets and different alien civilizations" and that's that, whatever's available with that premise attached, I'm gonna watch. That doesn't mean I won't recognize episodes that suck, it just doesn't means that I'd still find some joy in watching them. We had a similar discussion about The Simpsons in Austin when we were hanging out before the DT show, I'm just more "articulate" in typing English than I am speaking it heh, relatively :lol
I just watched the TNG pilot and I have several remarks but most urgent is the question: can the blind black guy see with these shades or does it just show code for his surroundings?
And holy shit there's a Klingon on the bridge :lol
" Shades of Gray "
" He's reliving memories ! It's a natural side of effect of stimulation ! "
You mean a writers strike :biggrin:
I actually really like that episode where Riker thinks he's been in a coma for 16 years and he's now Captain of the Enterprise.
He knows something is wrong when that alien thought that Minuet was a real person.
Can we get a music video of Geordi doing Soul Glow?
That picture of Geordi had the chorus from Michael Jackson's Beat It stuck in my head all day..Pretty good assessments. Worf will get more exposition than any of them, but for the first couple of seasons he's a throwaway character (and a pretty crappy Klingon). He's the one character that moves on to Deep Space 9 once TNG wraps up, and the importance of him and the Klingons really can't be understated.
I'm 3 episodes into TNG, early impressions:
- The crew takes a bit of getting used to, none of them were instantly likable for me, unlike TOS where Kirk, Spock, McCoy and Scotty were all hits from the get go for me.
- The show running and handling in general is tolerable so far, which says a lot since I'm a firm believer that good TV was made before the 80's and then after the mid 00's, excluding comedy of course.
- I like Patrick Stewart a lot, I know him as professor Xavier from the X-Men movies, Sejanus from I, Claudius and as CIA Deputy Director Bullock on American Dad, the latter being more recent and on-going, so on the first episode when his voice-over for the intro starts I kinda chuckled cause I thought of Bullock, it didn't help that Bullock called Stan Smith "number one" in a couple of American Dad episodes, but now I know where that came from :lol
- Patrick Stewart is too British to be French and it doesn't seem like he's putting much effort into being French on the show, so I guess I can try to forget that he's supposed to be.
- Geordi, Riker, Worf and Data are the characters I found interesting and could potentially have some story lines that I'd find cool.
- Troi and Yar, not so much.
- Crusher and Wesley, not at all.
- It really sucks that there are children on the ship, it takes away from the sense of danger they're suppose to have in exploring space.
- Data seems to be their way of having Spock around for this show without having another Vulcan on the bridge, he's not exactly like Spock of course but it feels like he was created to give the same impression.
- This is probably just me but it feels like that exposition dialogues on this show are sometimes too quick for how complicated they are, contrary to TOS where they usually eased you into the problem in a more relaxed fashion. On TNG I found myself rewinding a couple of times to catch details.
- I hope they explore Worf's backstory at some point, I'm curious to know if the Klingon empire has joined the federation or if he's some sort of rouge agent of his species.
Glad to have so much binge-ing ahead, I'll probably finish the first season then go back to finish TOS.
I think in the 24th century earth - you can be *from* France but there's no longer any need for passports and you can get around lickety split. It's all just "Earth". Therefore it's easier to live where you want and to move around a lot.
With this in mind - it could explain why Picard was born French but sound English.
Also he could have grown up in England.
We don't really know Picards backstory.
I think it's a pretty easy thing to ignore given it's the future where they can just transport wherever, whenever. Accents and regions evolve all the time.
Data will become far less annoying and is eventually a very good character. Something I never understood was why he had, what, 18 years of star fleet experience, but behaves in the first season of TNG like they just found him in a cave yesterady. His "emotional" development goes from 1-5 in the first 18 years and then from 5-100 in the next 2. Presumably he'd been a dishwasher or something on all of his previous assignments.
The biggest problem for me, as has been discussed here quite a bit, is that Gene Roddenberry's picture of future humans is really boring. They have no soul. They don't get angry. They don't drink. They don't get laid.
I think in the 24th century earth - you can be *from* France but there's no longer any need for passports and you can get around lickety split. It's all just "Earth". Therefore it's easier to live where you want and to move around a lot.
With this in mind - it could explain why Picard was born French but sound English.
Also he could have grown up in England.
I think it's a pretty easy thing to ignore given it's the future where they can just transport wherever, whenever. Accents and regions evolve all the time.
You know I couldn't believe the actor is the area 51 scientist from Independence Day, he didn't age so well.
I was referring to the TNG crew. The TOS characters had a great deal of personality and all of the normal vices. They drank, caroused, got into fights, picked up chicks, etc. Later on Roddenberry apparently decided that humanity would be a paragon of virtue. Riker enjoys that sort of thing somewhat, but the rest of them are all pretty uptight.Data will become far less annoying and is eventually a very good character. Something I never understood was why he had, what, 18 years of star fleet experience, but behaves in the first season of TNG like they just found him in a cave yesterady. His "emotional" development goes from 1-5 in the first 18 years and then from 5-100 in the next 2. Presumably he'd been a dishwasher or something on all of his previous assignments.The biggest problem for me, as has been discussed here quite a bit, is that Gene Roddenberry's picture of future humans is really boring. They have no soul. They don't get angry. They don't drink. They don't get laid.
Well most humans we see on the show are either military officers or have to deal with military officers at their jobs, that could be one reason they seem so bland sometimes, that's how I saw it anyway.
TOS human crew drank on episodes that had shore leave though, like on Wolf in the Fold where it was also implied that Scotty was taking the dancer away to sleep with her.
I don't see how that's a bad thing In and of itself.Nor is mine. I do often think that they're pretty milquetoast, boring people, bereft of life, though. I don't expect them to be hedonistic party animals; that would be silly. It'd be nice if they had some character, and even a flaw or two, though.
When I watch TNG - my immediate thought isn't - Hang On....Nobody is getting drunk.
So, apparently the new ST show, Discovery, is going to be set BEFORE the original series.
Thoughts?
I HATE WHEN MY FUTURISTIC TV SHOWS LOOK FUTURISTIC !!!
I DEMAND MOTHER FUCKING CARDBOARD AND FAIRY LIGHTS
Yeah set before Kirk's time there's so much more that they can't do.
PLUS *nobody* from any series can guest star unless it's set 12 years after Enterprise then the cast will have aged the correct amount.
Sigh.
I'm still convinced the makeup department had some kind of bet going to see how close they could get someone's face to look like a vag without anyone questioning it. There was one in particular that had full on clit-face going on (from memory, I think it was the guy from Critical Care).
Alexander guest stars on TNG?! Color me excited :lolNah, that's Voyager. You're at least 200 episodes away from that right now. Pretty good episode, though.
In TNG he's really a once a season character. He just pops up twice in S1. Also, he pops up a lot because he has a strange fascination with humanity. Humans amuse him, and he actually likes Picard and Riker, along with Janeway who you don't know yet. As he's as keen to present them interesting opportunities as he is to just bully and belittle them.
Also, there was always speculation amongst Star Trek nerds that Q might have been Trelain, the lonely squire of Gothos. Interesting thing to ponder.
If Q. isn't the most annoying motherfuck of a character I've ever seen in anything..
I like Neelix. He's a space rat with a skullet mohawk and the shittiest dress sense in any quadrant. :metal And he always means well. He's the lovable space hobo.
I like Neelix. He's a space rat with a skullet mohawk and the shittiest dress sense in any quadrant. :metal And he always means well. He's the lovable space hobo.
He looked like Mr T's runty ginger brother suffering a bout of measles.
I like Neelix. He's a space rat with a skullet mohawk and the shittiest dress sense in any quadrant. :metal And he always means well. He's the lovable space hobo.
He looked like Mr T's runty ginger brother suffering a bout of measles.
I thought you were trying to make the case for him NOT being awesome? :metal
The jealousy episode with Tom Paris was awful, but aside from that I always found him quite endearing.
Tomalak was such a terrible Romulan.
Tasha Yarr and Pulaski are my most hated. I kept hoping for Tasha to die, and then she did. It was pretty satisfying. :lol
And Pulaski just went out of her way to be a hardcore bitch. Couldn't stand her.
Not so much a main character but I always hated Keiko - what horrible sins must Miles have committed in previous lives to end up stuck with that miserable whining bitch.
Well apart from the fucked up grooming of Kes,This really made me LOL.
They did flush out her characterOh, if only.
I've always wondered what the windows on the underside of the saucer are for. There's no windows on the floor. I wondered if the bottom of the dish had reverse gravity and it's actually the roof.If you're referring to the ones above the phaser ring, it looks like those are angled. Haven't we seen plenty of angle windows before? Or, maybe they just thought it looked cool and didn't give it another thought.
Otherwise they're very much on the floor.
Or, maybe they just thought it looked cool and didn't give it another thought.
Quick google found this
(https://www.itsoverproductions.com/quarters.jpg)
Those look like downward facing windows? Not at an extreme angle, but look downward to me.
Oh I just remembered. Voyager is the series that has really abrupt endings.
" Phew we did it. "
THE END
They're probably not all like that but I love a little epilogue before the episode ends.
Ten-forward has the same downward sloping windows. Which is odd since they should go the opposite direction, being on the top of the saucer and all. I'm pretty sure I've seen other similarly sloped windows, which I think is what KTB was asking about.
When I rewatched TNG the then that struck me was how little The Borg were in the series - I think they feature in about 6 episodes in total of the 178 made. You would have thought after the success of 'The Best of Both Worlds' that they'd pop up far more. I think there may well be more Lwaxana episodes than Borg ones...
When I rewatched TNG the then that struck me was how little The Borg were in the series - I think they feature in about 6 episodes in total of the 178 made. You would have thought after the success of 'The Best of Both Worlds' that they'd pop up far more. I think there may well be more Lwaxana episodes than Borg ones...
I'm happy that they didn't overuse the Borg in TNG. If they had Borg invading Federation every season, it wouldn't make sense. Also the borg stories in TNG after TBoBW, were really hit or miss. I liked 'I Borg' while 'Descent' was awful.
My favorite borg story after 'Best of Both Worlds' is 'Dark Frontier' in Voyager.
Speaking of endings, I watched the TNG episode Justice that ends with Picard telling Riker to "take us out of here, Number One", to which Riker responds enthusiastically "Gladly, sir" then proceeds to sit in his chair with a promising smile, says and does absolutely nothing pertaining to that order then the episode ends :lolJustice could have been so much better than it actually was. The premise was excellent and that part of the episode (somebody needs to be executed in accordance with the prime directive) was nicely done. One of the rare examples of when making Wesley a focal point was a good move. The problem was that the people were pretty goofy and the inclusion of their God was silly and unnecessary. It's also one of the few times Picard tells a society to fuck off, not quite so in accordance with the prime directive.
I laughed harder than I should have at that heh
Voyager : " Parallax ".
Just started. I've seen a lot of episodes of VOY but never seen it all the way through.
Voyager : " Parallax ".
Just started. I've seen a lot of episodes of VOY but never seen it all the way through.
I really like Voyager. The main problems are a good amount of awful episodes, and with rare exception, most of the crew has almost no major character development over the 7 years.
Voyager : " Parallax ".
Just started. I've seen a lot of episodes of VOY but never seen it all the way through.
I really like Voyager. The main problems are a good amount of awful episodes, and with rare exception, most of the crew has almost no major character development over the 7 years.
First 3 seasons of Voyager were pretty rough. There were a few great episodes, but not much. Scorpion part 1 and 2, was a real turning point for Voyager. After that things started to work pretty well for them.
It says something about them that the Borg bothered to assimilate Nelix's race but deemed the Kazon to be a sum negative.
So apparently Discovery will have a female lead (but not the captain), and be set 10 years before Kirk's 5 year mission.
So apparently Discovery will have a female lead (but not the captain), and be set 10 years before Kirk's 5 year mission.
So the lead isn't the captain? Or is it like a co-lead along with the captain?
And the timeline is meh, hopefully the show can still be good.
I guess people really just have a hard-on for TOS and have really just stopped caring about anything TNG or onward.
Wait, I'm confused.
So originally they were like PRIME UNIVERSE! and I was super excited.
Then they were like PROBABLY PREKIRK and I stopped being excited because....obviously it's prime universe if it's before the Kelvin universe started.
Now it's 10 years before? So the Kelvin timeline does exist at that point. Still prime universe though? Seems......odd.
Wait, I'm confused.
So originally they were like PRIME UNIVERSE! and I was super excited.
Then they were like PROBABLY PREKIRK and I stopped being excited because....obviously it's prime universe if it's before the Kelvin universe started.
Now it's 10 years before? So the Kelvin timeline does exist at that point. Still prime universe though? Seems......odd.
It is a little odd, although the Kelvin timeline still made retcons that apply pre-TOS, and even though we mostly assume the events were the same in both timelines prior to that, they were still established to us in the Prime Universe.
So apparently Discovery will have a female lead (but not the captain), and be set 10 years before Kirk's 5 year mission.
But the springboard for the series is an incident from the series’ past.
“There’s been a few rumors going around about [when] the show is set,” explained Fuller. “One of the things that was very exciting to me as a Star Trek fan was… There had been an incident, an event in Star Trek history and the history of Starfleet that had been talked about but never fully explored.
The thing that annoys me about Trek is that they can't just say " he's got flu " or " please get me an apple "
It has to be " He's got [INSERT PLANET HERE] flu "
or
" Please get me a [INSERT PLANET HERE] apple. "
And I hear that Andorian apples are the tastiest.
And I hear that Andorian apples are the tastiest.
I'm picturing a blue apple with not one, but two separate stems sticking out of it.
I'm pretty sure Brooks was off his face in that interview. It was the only part of that doco I didn't like. Everyone else was great.
Been a while since I watched it, but I don't remember getting that vibe from Mulgrew. I felt she was very honest and open though, which I liked. Bakula was cool too.
And nothing needs to be said about Shat and Stewart.
Star Trek Voyager : Lifesigns.
This episode is interest...OH ITS THAT FUCKING POOL HALL *AGAIN*
I had a thought about Encounter At Farpoint. When Wes fell in the river in the holodeck - shouldn't he be dry immediately after he left ? Or are some things real in there and the rest is a projection ?
The problem is that the Moriarty episode pretty much blows that out of the water. They were very clear that holodeck matter loses cohesion after it leaves the holodeck. Picard demonstrated with a book, as I recall, so it wasn't just the Moriarty character that's effected.
And now that he brought it up, the whole The Naked Now thing started after Wesley hit Picard with a holographic snowball, also outside the HD.
I'm watching the episode with that DAHM CAHNDLE!!!! ;D
I'm watching several eps of Voyager a day and Kes always sounds overdubbed.
Nearly up to S4 of Voyager.
After Voyager i'll watch Enterprise as it's only short and then DS9 finally.
I have seen some eps.
I actually like the augment trilogy although I thought it was a bit of a stretch trying to retcon Dr. Noonien Soong being the creator of Khan.
Like I said. Retcon.
Roddenberry came up with those names IRL to try to find a friend by that name.
Once I actually looked at all of the episodes I figured out that season three has about the same ratio of good/bad episodes as any other season. A lot of it is just standalone episodes with little or no link to the Xindi arc, and in some cases they're the absolute bottom of the barrel. The Western, the mutants and the Beauty and the Beast episode might well be the worst of the entire series. It also had too many different plot angles happening (the sphere builders thing was just too much). It probably was the best of the 4 seasons, by virtue of the standouts, but I don't consider it all that much better than the others.Nearly up to S4 of Voyager.
After Voyager i'll watch Enterprise as it's only short and then DS9 finally.
While I don't have the same distaste for seasons 1 and 2 of Enterprise, it gets realllllly good in season 3. Of course my version of really good and yours might be different. Season 3 is quite dark and largely focused on a single story. Not a lot of fun or light hardheartedness in it.
I've started a re-watch of TNG, but I'm not hitting every single episode. I'm being a little selective (especially in the first two seasons).
So I started with "Where No One Has Gone Before", which was much worse than I remembered. Ye gods.
About a third of season 1 is perfectly watchable. It's just that the other 2/3 is so bad. I've gone back and watched some of the more decent ones quite recently and they didn't bug me much. I certainly wouldn't tell somebody to skip the whole thing. I'd just warn them that most of it blows.
Favourite characters from each series ?The only one I'd change is DS9, and I'd either go with Garack or Dukat. Weyoun and Kai Ratched a very close third. DS9 is the best example of an ST show where the secondary characters are all far more interesting than the primary ones.
• TOS - Spock
• TNG - Data
• DS9 - Odo
• VOY - EMH
• ENT - tbc
:rollin omg. the scene where Neelix has to teach 7 how to eat.
Favourite characters from each series ?
Woah Michael Ironside.Dumbass!
Oh wait no it's Kurtwood Smith. I always get them confused...
Is it a robocop reference or a Voyage Home ref ?Red Foreman from That 70's Show. Great reply, though. :tup
Favourite characters from each series ?
• TOS - Spock
• TNG - Data
• DS9 - Odo
• VOY - EMH
• ENT - tbc
TNG : Worf.Worf would actually be a decent pick for DS9 (though IMO far behind several of the secondary characters), but he'd be very low on my list for TNG, even though I dislike damn near all of them. Worf was a weak Klingon for most of that series. He certainly had his better moments when dealing with actual Klingon stuff, but those tended to be offset by a lot of other factors (Troi, his idiot son, his suckiness at his job). Once he got to DS9 he was basically just allowed to be his own guy and it worked far better for him.
Toss Up between Picard and Worf.
DS9 : Garek (because I don't want to pick Worf again)..
I can't really think of any major crossover between them, nothing that would benefit from watching them side by side at least. I say just watch TNG, then watch DS9.Yeah, this is how I did it too. DS9 is amazing, especially after S2.
Kirk: I don't usually go around beating up beautiful women.
Kelinda: Why not?
Kirk: Well, there are better things for men and women to do.
Kelinda: Like what?
Me: :neverusethis:
What are the overlap seasons of TNG and DS9? How much cross-pollination/continuity was there between the shows while both were on the air?It would be fine to watch all of TNG then move on to DS9. From Seasons 4 and onwards, TNG starts setting up a lot of stuff that DS9 revolves around; the Cardassians, the Bajorans, and the Maquis namely.
I never watched much of DS9 when it was on the air. When I start my rewatch, will I need to start it while I am still watching TNG or will I be OK to wait until I'm done with TNG?
Favourite characters from each series ?TOS: Spock
Thought to give you guys a break from my newbie noise hehThis was always one of my favorites. And silly though the ending may have been, it actually made a lot of sense. I especially liked McCoy pumping the dude full of amphetamines to get him riled up. On top of the good episode, Kelinda was one of my favorite of the ST babes. Good looking gal. And compared to most ST babes, the girl was actually wearing more clothes than she was probably accustomed to as an actress. :lol
Just watched By Any Other Name, loved it. So much real tension in this episode, especially when they thought to self destruct. A couple of firsts for me:
- Kirk stood there and witnessed the cold blooded execution of an unarmed crew member, Yeoman Thompson. A moment that felt like it should be crushing but Shatner failed to make it work. Still though, it was something.
- Red shirt Denzel Washington A. Had a relatively big speaking role. B. Was a more than a decent actor. C. Did not die. I also think this might have been the first black guy in a red shirt(could be wrong).
- The gang tries several solutions to get out of the dilemma and fail, usually the second thing works heh
This could have made it into a top 5 list up to the scene where all the crew member have been turned into the little cubes and only Kirk, Spock, Bones and Scotty remain. Then it took a down turn once the highly intelligent creatures became ridiculously gullible. I paused at the scene where they were eating at the mess hall and told my wife "there's only 10 minutes left and they're super beat, the rest of this episode is gonna offer a silly resolution to the plot" :lol
I still enjoyed it a lot overall.
Oh andQuoteKirk: I don't usually go around beating up beautiful women.
Kelinda: Why not?
Kirk: Well, there are better things for men and women to do.
Kelinda: Like what?
Me: :neverusethis:
Finished S4 of Voyager.
I'll start S5 tomorrow.
When S7 is finished i'll start Enterprise. And then DS9 .
I've seen a lot of DS9 - i just lost interest when it became about one thing.Even when ST starts following 1 story arc there are always tons of one-off episodes that are unrelated or at most tangentially related. Even season 7 of DS9, when they had the entirety of the war to wrap up, half the episodes involved the Dominion and half were all sorts of other stuff; baseball, weddings, alternate universes, whatnot. The Xindi season of Enterprise is the same way. It's about 50/50 story stuff and throwaway episodes.
But i'll try again.
I prefer when shows have a good mix. I don't want nothing but story arc, because it's not realistic, and it gets monotonous.I love that baseball episode, although it sure does stick out quite a bit when surrounded by a bunch of war episodes.
That said, there is no justification for that dreadful baseball episode. :lol
Cool.What are the overlap seasons of TNG and DS9? How much cross-pollination/continuity was there between the shows while both were on the air?It would be fine to watch all of TNG then move on to DS9. From Seasons 4 and onwards, TNG starts setting up a lot of stuff that DS9 revolves around; the Cardassians, the Bajorans, and the Maquis namely.
I never watched much of DS9 when it was on the air. When I start my rewatch, will I need to start it while I am still watching TNG or will I be OK to wait until I'm done with TNG?
I prefer when shows have a good mix. I don't want nothing but story arc, because it's not realistic, and it gets monotonous.
That said, there is no justification for that dreadful baseball episode. :lol
The basebal episode was okay. The underdog angle was a bit overplayed, but Worf really saved it with his Klingon comic relief.
So I've just started S5 of Voyager and i've seen "Night" before.I really hated it on my first or second view through. At some point I watched it all from beginning to end and realized it was far better than initially thought. It suffers from some pretty crappy bad guys, and there are parts where they were clearly just making shit up as they went along, but it's still a pretty good show. A couple of more interesting characters would have really helped. Most of the main crew were pretty bland.
Also I think I now prefer VOY to TNG :o
I prefer when shows have a good mix. I don't want nothing but story arc, because it's not realistic, and it gets monotonous.
That said, there is no justification for that dreadful baseball episode. :lol
Say what?! I love that baseball episode!! Damn you Blob, damn you.
Not least in the "Body And Soul" episode where the EMH embodies 7's body.
On top of the good episode, Kelinda was one of my favorite of the ST babes. Good looking gal. And compared to most ST babes, the girl was actually wearing more clothes than she was probably accustomed to as an actress. :lol
I was thinking the other day that in the 75,000 Light Years from the Alpha to the Delta Quadrant - there must be just one alien with a name that sounds the same as
John Smith - with all the sounds in the universe - those two must be placed together at least once :lol
What do you guys think of Enterprise, compared to the other series?
I'd only watched a couple of episodes when it was first aired on TV, but I've been rewatching on Netflix the last few weeks. I'm almost at the end of season 1, but TBH it has been pretty patchy. One "filler" episode with Tucker and Reid stuck in a shuttle with the air running out was particularly woeful. ;)
Is it worth sticking with?
I am actually speaking Rigelian; by an astonishing coincidence, both of our languages are exactly the same.”I was thinking the other day that in the 75,000 Light Years from the Alpha to the Delta Quadrant - there must be just one alien with a name that sounds the same as
John Smith - with all the sounds in the universe - those two must be placed together at least once :lol
Kind of like The Martian Manhunter from DC. His actual alien name (from what I know) is J'onn J'onzz, which of course sounds veeeery similar to John Jones.
"It is a curious fact, and one to which no-one knows quite how much importance to attach, that something like 85 percent of all known worlds in the Galaxy, be they primitive or highly advanced, have invented a drink called jynnan tonyx, or gee-N'N-T'N-ix, or jinond-o-nicks, or any one of a thousand variations on this phonetic theme.
The drinks themselves are not the same, and vary between the Sivolvian ‘chinanto/mnigs’ which is ordinary water served just above room temperature, and the Gagrakackan 'tzjin-anthony-ks’ which kills cows at a hundred paces; and in fact the only one common factor between all of them, beyond the fact that their names sound the same, is that they were all invented and named before the worlds concerned made contact with any other worlds."
What do you guys think of Enterprise, compared to the other series?
I'd only watched a couple of episodes when it was first aired on TV, but I've been rewatching on Netflix the last few weeks. I'm almost at the end of season 1, but TBH it has been pretty patchy. One "filler" episode with Tucker and Reid stuck in a shuttle with the air running out was particularly woeful. ;)
Is it worth sticking with?
I liked Enterprise more than most. I say stick around at least through the first 3 seasons, then you can watch a few episodes of season 4 (the evil universe ones for sure). The first two seasons aren't........terrible? but they aren't really great either, and I really liked most of the 3rd season.
What do you guys think of Enterprise, compared to the other series?
I'd only watched a couple of episodes when it was first aired on TV, but I've been rewatching on Netflix the last few weeks. I'm almost at the end of season 1, but TBH it has been pretty patchy. One "filler" episode with Tucker and Reid stuck in a shuttle with the air running out was particularly woeful. ;)
Is it worth sticking with?
I liked Enterprise more than most. I say stick around at least through the first 3 seasons, then you can watch a few episodes of season 4 (the evil universe ones for sure). The first two seasons aren't........terrible? but they aren't really great either, and I really liked most of the 3rd season.
That. S2 is much the same as S1 in terms of consistency and quality. They changed things up for S3, and imo it's stronger than the rest and worth watching. Enterprise fans seem to consider S4 good, but overall I didn't like it. The mirror universe double episode is one to check out though. And don't watch the finale. Just don't. :lol
That. S2 is much the same as S1 in terms of consistency and quality. They changed things up for S3, and imo it's stronger than the rest and worth watching. Enterprise fans seem to consider S4 good, but overall I didn't like it. The mirror universe double episode is one to check out though. And don't watch the finale. Just don't. :lol
Oh god, ,do NOT watch the finale. Unless you're into being pissed on.
Thought to give you guys a break from my newbie noise hehThis was always one of my favorites.
Just watched By Any Other Name, loved it. So much real tension in this episode, especially when they thought to self destruct. A couple of firsts for me:
- Kirk stood there and witnessed the cold blooded execution of an unarmed crew member, Yeoman Thompson. A moment that felt like it should be crushing but Shatner failed to make it work. Still though, it was something.
- Red shirt Denzel Washington A. Had a relatively big speaking role. B. Was a more than a decent actor. C. Did not die. I also think this might have been the first black guy in a red shirt(could be wrong).
- The gang tries several solutions to get out of the dilemma and fail, usually the second thing works heh
This could have made it into a top 5 list up to the scene where all the crew member have been turned into the little cubes and only Kirk, Spock, Bones and Scotty remain. Then it took a down turn once the highly intelligent creatures became ridiculously gullible. I paused at the scene where they were eating at the mess hall and told my wife "there's only 10 minutes left and they're super beat, the rest of this episode is gonna offer a silly resolution to the plot" :lol
I still enjoyed it a lot overall.
Oh andQuoteKirk: I don't usually go around beating up beautiful women.
Kelinda: Why not?
Kirk: Well, there are better things for men and women to do.
Kelinda: Like what?
Me: :neverusethis:
To commemorate today being the 50th anniversary of the first episode of Star Trek airing, I rewatched The Man Trap.There was a moral component to the Man Trap? I don't recall such a thing.
The basic elements hadn't quite meshed together yet, with the main trio not having much dynamic at this stage, although the characters are there. Interestingly, of the four crewmen to die, none were wearing red shirts. It had some notable moments of the '60s sexism, and the basic plot was fairly standard 50s/60s scifi fare, more of a monster of the week rather than dealing with it in the Trek way. The moral discussion was there in parts, but the outcome didn't give that a payoff.
I never watched TOS in proper order since it didn't really matter, so it's interesting seeing it fresh like people did at the time rather than inbetween other episodes. I'm even contemplating rewatching every episode on the 50th anniversary of their original airing date.
To commemorate today being the 50th anniversary of the first episode of Star Trek airing, I rewatched The Man Trap.There was a moral component to the Man Trap? I don't recall such a thing.
The basic elements hadn't quite meshed together yet, with the main trio not having much dynamic at this stage, although the characters are there. Interestingly, of the four crewmen to die, none were wearing red shirts. It had some notable moments of the '60s sexism, and the basic plot was fairly standard 50s/60s scifi fare, more of a monster of the week rather than dealing with it in the Trek way. The moral discussion was there in parts, but the outcome didn't give that a payoff.
I never watched TOS in proper order since it didn't really matter, so it's interesting seeing it fresh like people did at the time rather than inbetween other episodes. I'm even contemplating rewatching every episode on the 50th anniversary of their original airing date.
You saving the last of its kind or has this become Crater's private heaven, here on this planet? This thing becomes wife, lover, best friend, wise man, fool, idol, slave. Isn't a bad life to have everyone in the universe at your beck and call, and you win all the arguments.If there's an actual moral question it'd be whether or not to have ended this symbiotic relationship. Of course the creature essentially suicided-by-cop at the end, negating the question.
Watched TMT working in the shop earlier. Actually a pretty good episode, but with the typical flaws. It was never established if the salt vampire could physically change appearances or only make people think they see something different.
It appeared as three different characters simultaneously to McCoy/Kirk/Guy at the start (which was pretty dumb of it if it wanted to conceal its true nature), and they established it had the ability to connect to people's minds to read what they wanted to see, so it makes sense that it's only psychological. I had wondered the same thing though.
It's a slightly better episode than I remember first time (not by much), but I think it's a bit better than many of the ones that follow it.
Yeah, I think the beast we saw at the end was its true appearance but up until that point, we'd only seen what it looked like through the eyes of various characters. We just didn't know that at first. But when McCoy saw a much younger Nancy than the "more realistic" aged Nancy that Kirk saw, that was our clue.And that's certainly the way I figure it. The first scene make is such. At the same time when it's wandering around as McCoy it appears the same to everybody. That doesn't preclude the psychological explanation, but it just looks like a physical manifestation to the viewer.
When it went to feed, it dropped the mind games and we saw what it really looked like.
Tough call. And interesting a question that hasn't actually been posed here a dozen times. Far out.
* * * * * * Question Time!!! * * * * * *
What do you think is the greatest single episode ever from any series ?
All Good Things ?
Blink Of An Eye ?
Duet ?
Spock's Brain ? :neverusethis:
You know what I don't hate? Star Trek.
Speaking of which, anyone have any idea when we'll get some news on that new show? They really seem to be taking their time with it.
Off the top of my head I'd probably go with In the Pale Moonlight, but there are certainly rivals. I'm probably blurring the line between the best and my favorite. When I think of the best, all of them really show up in DS9. Duet, The Visitor (quite possibly the high-water mark), ItPM, and Rocks and Shoals.
For TOS, I always found The City on the Edge of Forever overrated, until one day I noticed how good an episode it really was. After that, maybe the Doomsday Machine.
All Good things gets bumped down out of contention in my book because of a previously unnoticed plot hole the size of delta quadrant. Of the TNG episodes, they come down to Picard-centric ones, and Tapestry rates pretty high for me.
A darkhourse contender would be Similitude. The only Enterprise episode that ranks with the greats. Probably falls short, though. Haven't seen it in ages.
VOY probably comes down to Blink of an Eye. Damn near a perfect episode.
That's one of the big reasons that Endgame wasn't a satisfying ending for me. Besides of course the emotional moments reconnecting with their families, I really wanted to see Starfleet's reaction to some of this stuff.Yeah, that's where we disagree. That would have been another episode and perhaps another two parter. DS9 could do it because they'd been wrapping things up for the last 5 or so episodes. Really, the DS9 finale was Dogs of War and the first half of WYLB, with the second hour being the epilogue. I suppose VOY could have spent the last month setting up Endgame, thus leaving the second hour for what you suggest, but I actually liked the premise that they used. So I'm fine with what they did. If you can't show it properly, let the viewer do it on their own.
Hey we're back, don't mind the Borg on board, she's with us. Yes, that's our EMH. He's mobile now thanks to a future holoemitter. Oops, just let me disable the ablative armour on this ship we also got from the future. Oh and please don't arrest the Maquis guys. They're my first officer and chief engineer.
Yeah, I know they had some contact to Starfleet with that communications array, but it's not the same.
That's one of the big reasons that Endgame wasn't a satisfying ending for me. Besides of course the emotional moments reconnecting with their families, I really wanted to see Starfleet's reaction to some of this stuff.Yeah, that's where we disagree. That would have been another episode and perhaps another two parter. DS9 could do it because they'd been wrapping things up for the last 5 or so episodes. Really, the DS9 finale was Dogs of War and the first half of WYLB, with the second hour being the epilogue. I suppose VOY could have spent the last month setting up Endgame, thus leaving the second hour for what you suggest, but I actually liked the premise that they used. So I'm fine with what they did. If you can't show it properly, let the viewer do it on their own.
Hey we're back, don't mind the Borg on board, she's with us. Yes, that's our EMH. He's mobile now thanks to a future holoemitter. Oops, just let me disable the ablative armour on this ship we also got from the future. Oh and please don't arrest the Maquis guys. They're my first officer and chief engineer.
Yeah, I know they had some contact to Starfleet with that communications array, but it's not the same.
And yet, another possibility is that 30 seconds after Janeway says "we're home" and the credits start to role, Captain Braxton shows up in the Relativity and says "nice try. A for effort, but sorry. No dice." and sends the right back to where they were two hours earlier. :lol
The timeship doesn't defy the temporal prime directive, because it's not there to meddle with time, only to prevent others from doing so. They know which reality is the correct one, because it's the one that doesn't involve others screwing with time.
Of course it's time travel, so it never holds up entirely, but it's not difficult to grasp in theory.
I'm back at trying to watch all the Star Trek episodes and i just saw the corobite maneuver. Did they really think the kid wasn't cheesy at the end.I reckon if they couldn't afford Great Space Alien they figured they'd just go with Creepy Fuck instead. Clint Howard always qualifies for that role. Regardless of his suckiness, that was always one of my favorite episodes. Good story to kick off the series and it does well to establish K/S/M. Particularly with McCoy really ripping into Kirk in uncharacteristic fashion.
Either way I'm really enjoying TOS this time around whereas the first time it was a painful chore to get though.
My recollection was that it was a wonderful premise with terrible dialogue. After watching it over dinner this evening I find I was right on the money. Wonderful premise. Awful writing.
The episode " Shattered " is pretty cool too. Having crew-members from different time periods team up.
I thought Jayla was a strong and capable character, without being laid on too thick. She was believable. Usually I don't like that kind of character, but it was done well. I'd actually like to see her character again.
Shut up Wesley.
I actually ST2009 and Darkness - not a popular opinion I guess.
Quote from: soupytwistI actually ST2009 and Darkness - not a popular opinion I guess.
You actually the whole thing ?
And with Beyond doing worse, they'll think that they're better / more profitable with Abrams' involvement, and probably push back even harder with mindless action and non-sensical plot. Hooray!
I'm not really surprised that the slightly more Trekky movie has done worse. The new fans they've gained are not Trek fans.
And with Beyond doing worse, they'll think that they're better / more profitable with Abrams' involvement, and probably push back even harder with mindless action and non-sensical plot. Hooray!
I'm not really surprised that the slightly more Trekky movie has done worse. The new fans they've gained are not Trek fans.
I think Beyond had the same amount of mindless action as the other two and barely had a plot to be non-sensical with (and yet it still managed to make no sense). I don't think there is anything remotely more Trekky about it.
Yeah In Beyond there's no Cadet Kirk being bumped up to first officer or 300 year old Khan designing
Futuristic starships.
Nothing that made you go :/ what ??
Yeah In Beyond there's no Cadet Kirk being bumped up to first officer
I've downloaded Star trek Online for PS4 as it's free. I'm Captain Oakes of the USS Kotow.
Yeah In Beyond there's no Cadet Kirk being bumped up to first officer or 300 year old Khan designing
Futuristic starships.
Nothing that made you go :/ what ??
The Beastie Boys.
Jump Starting a Starship.
Those little dog aliens.
Scottys companion sneezing acid to unlock a door panel.
The Ship flip.
Yeah In Beyond there's no Cadet Kirk being bumped up to first officer or 300 year old Khan designing
Futuristic starships.
Nothing that made you go :/ what ??
The Beastie Boys.
Jump Starting a Starship.
Those little dog aliens.
Scottys companion sneezing acid to unlock a door panel.
The Ship flip.
You know this is based on STAR TREK the original series ?
That series is DUMB.
Is Cause & Effect the one with the Reliant looking ship that gets stuck in that time loop captained by Frasier Crane ?Yes.
I don't have such a problem with Nog and Jake. Yes, they started off annoying, as kids are, but unlike most other kids, they were given actual developmental arcs. They didn't just find some magic ability to experience math transdimensionally or whatever, they had actual growth and development. Where they both ended up was incredible from where they started.
Alexander on the other hand.....ugh.
Like four different kids played Alexander, and one of them is a career felon.
I liked Nog. Even when he was a young dipshit he was alright. And his development was very good.
The only thing that annoyed me about Nog was a typical ST phenomenon, where all principle cast members go on to become a captain. Captain LaForge. Captain Kim. Captain Crusher. Captain Nog was what kept The Visitor from being a perfect episode. Who knows, it's entirely possible that he was destined to be the next Picard, but based on what we knew about him it seemed silly and contrived.