Up there with images and awake for me... only flaws are honor thy father and parts of as I am. The rest is dark, atmospheric, heavy, and super proggy.
I'd probably rank it about 5th, as it doesn't touch my top DT albums of SDOIT/SFAM/IaW/FII (yes, I love FII), but I would definitely call it underrated, at least here.
I love As I Am as a great straight ahead metal track, ITNOG is in my top 5, and Vacant is hugely underrated as a dark and emotional ballad, but the rest I sort of have to be in the mood for, due to the more intentional one dimensional nature of it.
But the only song on the album I don't like all that much is Endless Sacrifice, and I don't even dislike it, so I'd call it a pretty consistent album.
Really solid album but I have to be in the mood for it. Like Blob said it's mostly one dimensional, not that it's a bad thing just that I like some variety. I don't particularly dislike any of the songs on that album and ITNOG is top 15.
I agree, i was listening to it today high volume good headphones and was thinking why don't i listen to this more. It's awesome.
It's awesome, and the reason to like it at least that's a last album where Mike's part sounds 'fresh' and some creativity is still there.
It has As I Am, which is easily a top DT song for me. Also, ES and HTF are killer. Good album.
My second or third favorite DT album, so yes, I'd say it's underrated.
It's in the lower half of my album ranking, but that's mostly because the upper half is so incredible (I&W, SFAM, 6DOIT, ADTOE). Train Of Thought is a good album, but I rarely listen to it anymore aside from ITNOG which is a Top 10 DT song for me.
I remember playing the hell out of this when it came out, really excellent musicianship.
I'd rank TOT somewhere in the middle or the lower half of the DT discography. The songwriting is solid, but as said, the album suffers from a lack of variety.
Great cd for cleaning the house to! :tup
It was the album that really got me into DT, but as many above have stated, it's a bit light on replay value (by extremely high DT standards).
Quote from: Zydar on December 05, 2012, 11:29:17 PM
It's in the lower half of my album ranking, but that's mostly because the upper half is so incredible (I&W, SFAM, 6DOIT, ADTOE). Train Of Thought is a good album, but I rarely listen to it anymore aside from ES which is a Top 10 DT song for me.
FTFM
Maybe the most underrated DT album ever made. Endless Sacrifice is on my top 5 list and the album hasn't any bad song at all.
And as well:
Quote from: The Presence of Frenemies on December 06, 2012, 01:01:31 AM
It was the album that really got me into DT.
Yeah, definitely. I love the album, the darker atmosphere and the songwriting (HTF being the only exception). ITNOG was the first DT song I heard and it remains at Top 10 song for me to this day.
Best DT album.
Quote from: wolfking on December 06, 2012, 03:26:39 AM
Best DT album.
Agreed.
Hence probably the most underrated, and I'd say This Dying Soul and Honor Thy Father are the most underrated DT songs. Never got why Honor Thy Father wasn't too popular around here. To be honest it kind of reminds me of Awake.
Quote from: Polis on December 05, 2012, 09:29:50 PM
Up there with images and awake for me... only flaws are honor thy father and parts of as I am. The rest is dark, atmospheric, heavy, and super proggy.
See, that's way too much for it to be a top tier DT album. Also, I think almost every song is flawed in one way or another and it is therefore in my bottom 3 DT albums.
It's a matter of opinion. I place it second to last in my list
It's a really cool album, and way better than the three that followed it. Honor Thy Father is a drag, though.
Quote from: Pols Voice on December 06, 2012, 04:50:33 AM
It's a really cool album, and way better than the three that followed it. Honor Thy Father is a drag, though.
Precisely that.
I've never been a big fan of Train Of Though. It's currently my second or third to least favourite Dream Theater album. There is nothing really wrong with the individual songs (except for TDS), but I find they work best if played isolated, somewhere in a live set. In one single album they become monotone and overwhelming. As most already said, TOT is by far the most one dimensional album DT has ever put out. Sure, it was on purpose, but still it's not generally my favourite thing to see in an album.
Underrated? I'd rather think that is album is overrated. Yeah, it's a great album, but I don't think it's one of their greatest works. It's a collection of awesome songs, but to me, that's pretty much all it is. It's pretty good, but definitely not as good as people make it out to be.
my opinion
Quote from: Pols Voice on December 06, 2012, 04:50:33 AM
It's a really cool album, and way better than the three that followed it. Honor Thy Father is a drag, though.
This and WDADU, but i like it less than all the others (yes, even FII is better)
It's at the bottom end of the list for me. Never really cared for it.
Quote from: Polis on December 05, 2012, 09:29:50 PM
Up there with images and awake for me... only flaws are honor thy father and parts of as I am. The rest is dark, atmospheric, heavy, and super proggy.
I haven't heard it in a while but HTF is one of the best reasons to listen to it. Not really up there with I&W or Awake so I'd say it's about middle of the road for me.
To me it is an album brought down by too many bad spot in the songs.
Not one of my favorite albums, but definitely one of their most constant. And this is relevant, but over the years, I've really grown tired of INTOG. At first I thought it was as amazing as most people say, but now it mostly feels exhausting. Anyone else feel the same?
Quote from: wasteland on December 06, 2012, 05:44:54 AM
I've never been a big fan of Train Of Though. It's currently my second or third to least favourite Dream Theater album. There is nothing really wrong with the individual songs (except for TDS), but I find they work best if played isolated, somewhere in a live set. In one single album they become monotone and overwhelming. As most already said, TOT is by far the most one dimensional album DT has ever put out. Sure, it was on purpose, but still it's not generally my favourite thing to see in an album.
I would tend to agree, excpet that I love TDS!
These songs sound fantastic on LaB, and in other live shows, where they are really brought to life.
Great album, but TDS and HTF are both not among my favourite DT songs.
Not by me! I still love it...AND I've never understood the distaste (around here) for Honor Thy Father. Then again, I had a shitty step-father.
My favourite album of Dream Theater's. Awake is awfully damn close to it, though. Absolutely hated both albums when I first got them.
Quote from: BlobVanDam on December 05, 2012, 09:36:00 PM
I'd probably rank it about 5th, as it doesn't touch my top DT albums of SDOIT/SFAM/IaW/FII (yes, I love FII), but I would definitely call it underrated, at least here.
I love As I Am as a great straight ahead metal track, ITNOG is in my top 5, and Vacant is hugely underrated as a dark and emotional ballad, but the rest I sort of have to be in the mood for, due to the more intentional one dimensional nature of it.
But the only song on the album I don't like all that much is Endless Sacrifice, and I don't even dislike it, so I'd call it a pretty consistent album.
This is quite literally my thoughts *exactly* on ToT. I'm not much of a metalhead, but I love As I Am for it's atmosphere, use of meters, and for the solo. Vacant gives me chills every time I listen to it, and I love the cello. ITNoG is just the best. Even Honor Thy father, a song that seems like something I'd despise, hits the spot for me. Endless Sacrifice is my least favorite track, but I still like it.
I wouldn't call ToT overrated though, in my experience I've seen it get a lot of praise here.
Quote from: RuRoRul on December 06, 2012, 03:31:27 AM
Quote from: wolfking on December 06, 2012, 03:26:39 AM
Best DT album.
Agreed.
Hence probably the most underrated, and I'd say This Dying Soul and Honor Thy Father are the most underrated DT songs. Never got why Honor Thy Father wasn't too popular around here. To be honest it kind of reminds me of Awake.
Agree.
Definitely gets too much hate. A great driving album. 9/10
No, it's overrated. As I Am is among the worst DT songs. The only tracks I really care about are Vacant and Stream of Consciousness. The remaining four songs are good, but I rarely listen to them. And I can't see why ITNOG is so popular, it is good, but the chorus is repeated waaaaaaaaay to many times.
Perhaps I just don't like so heavy music. A C/drop C-tuning is a major turnoff for me.
I used to really despise Honor Thy Father. It was one of my least favorite songs. One day I was playing a game and thought about it and I figured I never really gave the song a chance because I was never much into the heavier aspect of DT but that had grown on me over time. So I just put it on a loop and listened to it like 10 times in a row and by the end of it I was loving it and now it's probably top 50 for me. Not too high up there but definitely worth listening to. Especially in the car.
Quote from: Ruba on December 07, 2012, 04:21:57 AM
And I can't see why ITNOG is so popular, it is good, but the chorus is repeated waaaaaaaaay to many times.
Glad to see someone feels the same way.
Like I said, it's gets to be exhausting.
This album is neither brilliant nor awful, as others such as SFAM, 6DoIT, 8VM are brilliant, it goes unnoticed, it does what its supposed to, they are songs with adrenaline which hype up the crowd as DT wanted, under-rated, but not amazing.
Quote from: jonnybaxy on December 07, 2012, 12:47:00 PM
This album is neither brilliant nor awful, as others such as SFAM, 6DoIT, 8VM are brilliant, it goes unnoticed, it does what its supposed to, they are songs with adrenaline which hype up the crowd as DT wanted, under-rated, but not amazing.
Octavarium is as controversial as Train of Thought in regards to fan opinions. It's trash if you ask me.
Train of Thought (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=22173.0)
Octavarium (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=22215.0)
Quote from: yorost on December 07, 2012, 01:21:23 PM
Quote from: jonnybaxy on December 07, 2012, 12:47:00 PM
This album is neither brilliant nor awful, as others such as SFAM, 6DoIT, 8VM are brilliant, it goes unnoticed, it does what its supposed to, they are songs with adrenaline which hype up the crowd as DT wanted, under-rated, but not amazing.
Octavarium is as controversial as Train of Thought in regards to fan opinions. It's trash if you ask me.
Train of Thought (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=22173.0)
Octavarium (https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=22215.0)
I respect your opinion but WHAT!?
The title track is awesome, but it's the only Dream Theater album I can't listen to the whole thing. Most of the album is pretty blah, the only other songs I like are still not ones I particularly love. It's their one release I genuinely dislike.
Quote from: yorost on December 07, 2012, 01:53:20 PM
The title track is awesome, but it's the only Dream Theater album I can't listen to the whole thing. Most of the album is pretty blah, the only other songs I like are still not ones I particularly love. It's their one release I genuinely dislike.
Not sure I'd use the word "dislike"--DT is still DT, and a cut above 98% of other music even at their worst (for my personal taste, not necessarily objectively, of course)--but otherwise I 100% agree with this assessment of Octavarium.
This was my first DT song and first album so it holds a special place in my library. I think it was important for the band to release an album like this. It shows the ballsiest side of the band while also staying very progressive. The production is mean, in your face and quite bass heavy which is a huge contrast to most of their discography, namely the follow up, 8VM. For me, TOT is the perfect showcase for the heavy metal side of Dream Theater. Yet with all it's metal influence, 5 of the 7 songs are over 10 minutes. Just another prime example of how awesome these guys are at blending metal/prog together and making it sound right.
Train of Thought is an album I like and want to love. The musicianship is fantastic for the most part, and there isn't one song on it I'd remove. As I Am, Vacant, and Stream of Consciousness are the strong points for me. That said, I think This Dying Soul and Endless Sacrifice are too long for their own good--This Dying Soul in particular has a lot of punch to it for a while, but wears out its welcome.
There's a bigger problem here, and it's one of the issues I have with heavier Dream Theater tracks. First of all, the lyrics are laughable for a good portion of the album. They don't sound as sincerely aggressive as they should. More importantly, James LaBrie's voice just doesn't sell me on any of it, even the tracks I like. As I Am should sound much more aggressive than it actually does. LaBrie's voice, coupled with the lyrics (though As I Am might be the lyrical high point of the album), sounds, well, a bit whiny to me. The rest of this album follows this trend. Worse is LaBrie's "rapping" on Honor Thy Father. I don't mind it just because it's often confused for rapping, but it's a bit shrill and doesn't add anything to the song.
Things like this conspire to make the album less interesting to me. They're stumbling blocks, and have been since at least Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence, but are most pronounced on Train of Thought, Systematic Chaos, and Black Clouds and Silver Linings.
LaBrie took an aggressive approach to a couple of songs in Awake that I liked, and that's distinctly different from what he did on Train of Thought. If he was capable of it when they recorded ToT, I would have preferred it.
Musically, Train of Thought is great, but it's still very much modern DT so it carries with it some idiosyncrasies I'm not so fond of. In the interest of full disclosure, I admit that I prefer the prog side to the metal side of DT. I can still appreciate a good, heavy album, and Stream of Consciousness and Vacant in particular are devoid of the "problems" I've pinpointed with the rest of the album.