What is the definitive DT album?

[rumborak]

Yeah hef, I don't see how being a concept album disqualifies it. The lyrical style is still representative of their music, and they have similar, although obviously not as strong, musical connections on other albums too, like Awake and Octavarium. I think the fact it's a concept album is what makes it so diverse though, with a variety of short and longer songs, and I still think it's a lot more representative of their music than IaW. I can listen to SFAM and hear elements of IaW (for obvious reason lol) and I can hear elements of newer albums. When I listen to IaW, it doesn't sound like anything they've done since. Obviously all of the elements of DT's music are there, but they're executed in a unique way that I don't feel represents DT as a whole.

That's what it is for me. The concept album aspect can't overcome the fact that SFAM shows a matured summarization of what their music is about.

rumborak

[austin]

Let's just admit it, the original question is too damn hard to answer.

[Dream Team]

While Awake is my favorite, I think Images and Words is undoubtedly their definitive record.  Every song is a genuine DT classic (not surprising that this era was when their songwriting was at its peak), every band member is at their best, especially JLB, and it just has the sound of a band that is clicking on all cylinders and looking to show the world what they can do.

That's what I was going to post, but now I don't have to.  Thanks, Kev!

Always glad to help.  

I&W is too light to represent their career.

"Pull Me Under," "Take the Time," "Metropolis" and "Under a Glass Moon" would all like a word with you outside.

Scenes from a memory, without a doubt. It's weird people think I&W is the definitive one - Dream Theater is a progressive metal band, yet I&W certainly ain't that much metal.

I&W is just as much metal as SFAM, relatively speaking; not as much so as ToT, but the balance of metal and prog is about equal on I&W and SFAM, if you ask me.  I&W might have "Surrounded," "Wait for Sleep" and "Another Day," but SFAM has "Through Her Eyes," "One Last Time" and "The Spirit Carries On."  And both CDs end with an epic that ranges from fairly mellow to rocking (but never really metal).  

I've always felt Prater's production (plus the mixing) kind of hid the heaviness of some of the I&W riffs a little bit. Petrucci's guitar is often slightly buried under the keys, which were much more melodic in nature. In fact, ironically this is the only thing I would change about the production on I&W - beef up the rhythm guitar a little bit. The remaster on the greatest hits collection was a better indication of the heaviness of the PMU main riff.

[Dr. SeaWolf]

I'm gonna go with the most obvious choice and say I&W.

[zmazar]

I had to go with Images and Words.  It has all elements that truely define DT: epic songs, amazing melodies and transitions, guitar and keyboard harmonies, great vocals, and great lyrics.  Octavarium was second.  Whenever I introduce people to DT I usually pick a song from one of these two albums.  SFAM came very close, but for me it's one of those albums you have to listen through completely.  And I think you kind of have to have an appreciation for that before listening to it.  Kind of a lot to chew on the first go.

[BlobVanDam]

While Awake is my favorite, I think Images and Words is undoubtedly their definitive record.  Every song is a genuine DT classic (not surprising that this era was when their songwriting was at its peak), every band member is at their best, especially JLB, and it just has the sound of a band that is clicking on all cylinders and looking to show the world what they can do.

That's what I was going to post, but now I don't have to.  Thanks, Kev!

Always glad to help.  

I&W is too light to represent their career.

"Pull Me Under," "Take the Time," "Metropolis" and "Under a Glass Moon" would all like a word with you outside.

Scenes from a memory, without a doubt. It's weird people think I&W is the definitive one - Dream Theater is a progressive metal band, yet I&W certainly ain't that much metal.

I&W is just as much metal as SFAM, relatively speaking; not as much so as ToT, but the balance of metal and prog is about equal on I&W and SFAM, if you ask me.  I&W might have "Surrounded," "Wait for Sleep" and "Another Day," but SFAM has "Through Her Eyes," "One Last Time" and "The Spirit Carries On."  And both CDs end with an epic that ranges from fairly mellow to rocking (but never really metal). 

I've always felt Prater's production (plus the mixing) kind of hid the heaviness of some of the I&W riffs a little bit. Petrucci's guitar is often slightly buried under the keys, which were much more melodic in nature. In fact, ironically this is the only thing I would change about the production on I&W - beef up the rhythm guitar a little bit. The remaster on the greatest hits collection was a better indication of the heaviness of the PMU main riff.

It definitely hid the heaviness a bit, although I'm still not sure I'd call them heavy enough to represent DT's sound overall, at least in album form. Although PMU and UAGM both sound pretty heavy on their live DVDs.

[Dream Team]

Actually, I was also just thinking that for an album to qualify as the "definitive" DT album, it would have to contain a number of the band's most popular songs, of which I&W certainly does with at least 4 qualifying for that honor. SFAM's most popular song is probably (like it or not) The Spirit Carries On, which isn't really representative of the album as a whole. Don't get me wrong, I think SFAM is a great choice, but I think it and SDoiT probably come in second behind I&W.

[hefdaddy42]

Actually, I was also just thinking that for an album to qualify as the "definitive" DT album, it would have to contain a number of the band's most popular songs, of which I&W certainly does with at least 4 qualifying for that honor. SFAM's most popular song is probably (like it or not) The Spirit Carries On, which isn't really representative of the album as a whole.

Good point.

[Chagny]

Tough choice deciding between 6DOIT and 8V. Went with 6DOIT though.

[Bone_Daddy]

I knew it would be a toss up between I&W and SFAM. I had to go with the latter based on prog/concept album - meaning SFAM is at its best with regards to concept, soloing, balls and chunk, vocal range, and overall DT presence.

That said, I do recognize that SFAM is a part II of sorts from Metropolis ala I&W. I also recognize I can not take away anything from I&W as it stands alone by itself. I simply feel that SFAM is definitive as a DT album.

[orcus116]

SFAM in vocal range over I&W? Interesting.

[BlobVanDam]

SFAM in vocal range over I&W? Interesting.

Maybe he means emotional range? Also, on SFAM I think JLB would sing some lower notes than on IaW, so maybe it does work out to as much range or more? I dunno, insinctively I'm just as baffled by the statement as you.

[Bone_Daddy]

To clarify, yes, low to high notes I feel are better represented in SFAM by JLB. Also, not sure it's the first time, but we get to hear MP sing backing vocals as well. This was something that I never really expected but welcomed once I heard it play out. Seems that now, a DT album without MP singing on it would be missing something. Perhaps not. Hard to say.

[orcus116]

To each their own I guess. Portnoy vocals aren't really my cup of tea and neither are Petrucci vocals really. And not that he was bad on SFAM but James actually had full range back in 91/92.

[robwebster]

To each their own I guess. Portnoy vocals aren't really my cup of tea and neither are Petrucci vocals really. And not that he was bad on SFAM but James actually had full range back in 91/92.

With the length of their career, though - James has released two albums pre-incident, and seven albums post-incident. I think his stratospheric high-notes are, historically, something of an anomaly, rather than a definitive element of their sound.

[BlobVanDam]

I love the recent trend of big harmonies with JLB/MP/JP. It gives it a much fuller sound, and both JP and MP have a good vocal tone for those mid range vocals.

[robwebster]

I love the recent trend of big harmonies with JLB/MP/JP. It gives it a much fuller sound, and both JP and MP have a good vocal tone for those mid range vocals.

I feel I should probably quote this. I don't have anything to add, I just approve massively.

[hefdaddy42]

I love the recent trend of big harmonies with JLB/MP/JP. It gives it a much fuller sound, and both JP and MP have a good vocal tone for those mid range vocals.

I agree with this as well.

[Dream Team]

To each their own I guess. Portnoy vocals aren't really my cup of tea and neither are Petrucci vocals really. And not that he was bad on SFAM but James actually had full range back in 91/92.

With the length of their career, though - James has released two albums pre-incident, and seven albums post-incident. I think his stratospheric high-notes are, historically, something of an anomaly, rather than a definitive element of their sound.

Unfortunately. But a big element of that is that MP/JP don't WANT him to sing like that anymore, it's "dated".   

[orcus116]

That's a shame if true. I know Labrie can easily use his whole range without making the high notes sound cheesy and 80s.

[Dream Team]

That's a shame if true. I know Labrie can easily use his whole range without making the high notes sound cheesy and 80s.

That makes at least 2 of us that think so.