Am I going to Hell?

[El JoNNo]

I'm hoping this will spark some interesting discussion on the concept of Hell. I know Hell has been discussed before but this maybe a chance to figure out which among is going to Hell based on other beliefs; or this could fail horribly and end up being a war. If it does turn out badly I hope this thread get locked.

Most have differing opinions on what mandates enternal dance with the horned one. Some believe that you in order to be sent to Hell you have to be a horrible person and some believe all it takes is to forsake God. So I am an Atheist, an Anti-theist and given the situation I will speak out against the notion of God; however I do not think I am a bad person.  That being said according to your beliefs, Am I going to hell?


Don't go easy on me. 

[PlaysLikeMyung]

According to some of my Christian friends I'm going to burn for not accepting Jesus Christ as my lord and savior.



that seems excessive

[El JoNNo]

I also think that is excessive. What is your normal response to this?

[In The Name Of Rudess]

As you might know, I'm a Buddhist. From a Buddhist point of view, the easiest way to define hell and heaven is that where ever there is more suffering, either in this world or any other plane, that place is a hell to those who suffer. And where there is more pleasure or happiness, either in this world or any other worldly existence, that place is a heaven. The idea of one particular ready-made place or a place created by god as heaven and hell is not acceptable to the Buddhist concept. The human realm is a mixture of both pain and happiness, since human beings experience both pain and happiness.

In Buddhism heaven is a temporary place where those who have done good deeds experience more sensual pleasures for a longer period. Hell is another temporary place where evil doers experience more physical and mental suffering. It is not justifiable to believe that such places are permanent. You only stay there for as long as you have karma remaining. Buddhists believe there is no god behind the scene of heaven and hell. Each and every person experiences according to his good and bad karma.  Buddhist never try to introduce Buddhism by frightening people through hell-fire or enticing people by pointing to paradise, and they couldn't because hell and heaven is not permanent. Their main idea is character building and mental training.

If you sincerely do not think you are a bad person, then you are probably not a bad person and therefore won't go to a "hell". If you think you are a good person, you might actually "level-up" and be reborn in a better position in the world. However, the only way to enter a heaven is becoming enlightened. To become enlightened you do not necessarily have to be a Buddhist, many Buddhist scholars for example believe that Jesus and some of his followers were enlightened too.

[El JoNNo]

As you might know, I'm a Buddhist. From a Buddhist point of view, the easiest way to define hell and heaven is that where ever there is more suffering, either in this world or any other plane, that place is a hell to those who suffer. And where there is more pleasure or happiness, either in this world or any other worldly existence, that place is a heaven. The idea of one particular ready-made place or a place created by god as heaven and hell is not acceptable to the Buddhist concept. The human realm is a mixture of both pain and happiness, since human beings experience both pain and happiness.

In Buddhism heaven is a temporary place where those who have done good deeds experience more sensual pleasures for a longer period. Hell is another temporary place where evil doers experience more physical and mental suffering. It is not justifiable to believe that such places are permanent. You only stay there for as long as you have karma remaining. Buddhists believe there is no god behind the scene of heaven and hell. Each and every person experiences according to his good and bad karma.  Buddhist never try to introduce Buddhism by frightening people through hell-fire or enticing people by pointing to paradise, and they couldn't because hell and heaven is not permanent. Their main idea is character building and mental training.

If you sincerely do not think you are a bad person, then you are probably not a bad person and therefore won't go to a "hell". If you think you are a good person, you might actually "level-up" and be reborn in a better position in the world. However, the only way to enter a heaven is becoming enlightened. To become enlightened you do not necessarily have to be a Buddhist, many Buddhist scholars for example believe that Jesus and some of his followers were enlightened too.

Interesting variation on the two. If I am understanding correctly Heaven and Hell are each attribted to two things. Heaven 1. a blissful enlightenment, a sort of feeling of elation 2. Reincarnation as someone or something of higher status, not nesseccarily of wealth but of perhaps content? Hell being 1. a hollow existance of perhaps depression, guilt or paranoia 2. Reincarnation into a less desirable person or thing.

I have a few questions for you. Does anyone ever not get reincarnated? What is considered the "highest" reincarnated form? Are you ok with being refered to as an Atheist? 

[Jamesman42]

The Christian Hell or some other Hell?

[El JoNNo]

The Christian Hell or some other Hell?

Whatever your belief is.

[Jamesman42]

OK. Well, Christianity is more or less the way for God to help us be saved through Jesus Christ or to live in condemnation. Basically, if you accept Jesus, you're saved from the power of sin, which is death; that means you live in communion with God here on Earth, and death brings you to God. If you don't, the bitter truth is that, yes, you're going to hell.

Of course, non-Christians get hung up on this. I'm sure you do. You WANT to think you're good enough on your own, and that you don't need God. And the prospect that, because you're maybe not good enough and that believing in Jesus would be the only escape from Hell, you just push it all away like that.

You said don't go easy on you. You know all the implications from what is stated here. It sucks, because, like someone pointed out in the other thread, it's just someone trying to warn you of danger that you cannot see. You may not believe it, but I do. I think Hell is serious enough to really mull over in your mind and heart, to see what's really going on, or what could happen when you die. Just a thought.

[Dr. SeaWolf]

James:  How do you know with 100% certainty that there is a place where people suffer eternal torment?

[Quadrochosis]

I've always kind of felt that Hell is a device that higher ups use to scare lower members of churches into submission. That being said, if there is some sort of afterlife, than I think that we all end up in the same place, regardless of anything that we do in this life.

EDIT: James, if Christ is the only way to Heaven, then that means that only those that accept him can go to Heaven. So what about the mentally disabled, children, people that grew up in places that don't have Christianity around them, etc. These people go to hell because they are unlucky? They have no way of accepting Christ because of their environment or because of their mental state, so they are punished because of something they cannot control?

Sounds pretty screwed up to me.

[hefdaddy42]

I have mixed feelings about the possibility of any afterlife at all.  But even if there is one, EJ, I don't think there is a hell for you to go to.  But that's just my opinion.

[Dr. SeaWolf]

I've always kind of felt that Hell is a device that higher ups use to scare lower members of churches into submission. That being said, if there is some sort of afterlife, than I think that we all end up in the same place, regardless of anything that we do in this life.

This.  I don't think even the most evil people throughout history deserve an ETERNITY of torment.  Just imagine that word for a second.  ETERNITY.  FOREVER.  Even Adolf Hitler doesn't deserve to be tormented that long.

[Quadrochosis]

I've always kind of felt that Hell is a device that higher ups use to scare lower members of churches into submission. That being said, if there is some sort of afterlife, than I think that we all end up in the same place, regardless of anything that we do in this life.

This.  I don't think even the most evil people throughout history deserve an ETERNITY of torment.  Just imagine that word for a second.  ETERNITY.  FOREVER.  Even Adolf Hitler doesn't deserve to be tormented that long.

The flipside is also equally as fucked up. Imagine for a second that Mother Teresa was not a Christian and that Adolf Hitler had accepted Christ at some point throughout WWII. He would have gone straight to Heaven despite murdering millions of people, and Mother Teresa would have gone to Hell despite helping and saving millions of people. That just doesn't sit right with me, and I can't imagine a just God allowing something like that to occur.

[In The Name Of Rudess]

Interesting variation on the two. If I am understanding correctly Heaven and Hell are each attribted to two things. Heaven 1. a blissful enlightenment, a sort of feeling of elation 2. Reincarnation as someone or something of higher status, not nesseccarily of wealth but of perhaps content? Hell being 1. a hollow existance of perhaps depression, guilt or paranoia 2. Reincarnation into a less desirable person or thing.  

Your definitions are almost correct. For 1. you would need to be enlightened. For 2. you would not necessarily have great wealth, since wealth does nothing to make you happy. Foolish wealthy people are not as happy as wise poor people. The person will instead be born with a "personality" that lends itself to becoming enlightened during that lifetime (this is a simplified explanation, or else I would have to go into great detail). Hell would be when someone is born with a "personality" that doesn't lend itself as well to becoming enlightened as it would be otherwise. This doesn't mean there's no chance to become enlightened. Nothing in Buddhism is eternal, everything is temporary.

Does anyone ever not get reincarnated?
What is considered the "highest" reincarnated form?

When someone becomes enlightened they have 2 options when they die. Option 1 is to be reborn here on earth to help other people become enlightened. Spiritual teachers like the Dalai Lama have done this many times (the Dalai Lama is now in his 14th enlightened reincarnation). There are many others who have chosen this path, the Dalai Lama is just the most well-known of them. Option 2 will be explained below.

You could see the universe as an ocean. Someone's "soul" is a wave in that ocean. What we take to be a "soul" or "individual spirit" within us is an illusion. This soul/self continues after the physical death, moving on to other realms.  As we gather insight on compassion, love and the inter-dependence of all things, we begin to see the idea of the individual self as an illusion.  When, at some point, we are able to "surrender" the ego to the larger as a wave "surrenders" to the ocean, that is the moment of true enlightenment.  At that point, there is no "I" for anything to happen to. We return to the ocean as the wave returns, we become one with the ocean. When you die enlightened, you stay one with the ocean instead of being reborn. This is the highest reincarnated form. This form is temporary though, like I explained in my original post. How Buddhists know all this? People skilled at meditation can already become one with the ocean during their lifetimes. I have felt my connection to the Being (or ocean) several times during long meditation sessions. Someone who is enlightened is connected to the source of Being, to the ocean every hour of day, not just during meditation. They are free from suffering. This is the reason why I am a Buddhist. Buddhism is the only "religion" where you can empirically know you are doing the right thing (except for Hinduism which is built on roughly the same concepts).

Are you ok with being refered to as an Atheist?  

I suppose so, yes. For many people the definition of an atheist is someone who doesn't believe in a God. The goal of Buddhism is to become aware of how the universe works through rituals such as meditation. There is no God to aid Buddhists in that goal. As Buddha said it:

No one saves us but ourselves,
No one can and no one may.
We ourselves must walk the path,
But Buddha has clearly show the way.

[eric42434224]

Heaven and Hell are constructs created by humans to answer questions they cant answer.....Where do I go when I die?  But they have been exploited, for good and bad, and are used to control behavoir in society.

Essentially, Heaven is a carrot, and Hell is the whip.

[El JoNNo]

OK. Well, Christianity is more or less the way for God to help us be saved through Jesus Christ or to live in condemnation. Basically, if you accept Jesus, you're saved from the power of sin, which is death; that means you live in communion with God here on Earth, and death brings you to God. If you don't, the bitter truth is that, yes, you're going to hell.

Is it your belief that hell is fire and brimstone, is it merely seperation from God or is it something else entirely?

Of course, non-Christians get hung up on this. I'm sure you do. You WANT to think you're good enough on your own, and that you don't need God. And the prospect that, because you're maybe not good enough and that believing in Jesus would be the only escape from Hell, you just push it all away like that.

Actually my lack of belief in a God has very little (or nothing) to do with, thinking or feeling the need to be good on my own. I'm not pushing anything away, I find the notion of a god improbable and the specific of the Abrahamic God even more so.  

You said don't go easy on you. You know all the implications from what is stated here. It sucks, because, like someone pointed out in the other thread, it's just someone trying to warn you of danger that you cannot see. You may not believe it, but I do. I think Hell is serious enough to really mull over in your mind and heart, to see what's really going on, or what could happen when you die. Just a thought.

I thank you for not going easy on me. I have pondered on the consequences of a possible afterlife, probably more so than you would think. My earliest memories of my "Atheism" (I put it into quotations because although I very much doubted the existance of God I may have been convinced otherwise very easily) was at the age of 4 or 5 when my mother would read the bible to me as a bed time story (of course at the time these were picture books). I remember thinking to myself how ridiculous these stories were, Noah's Ark, Samson, and Jonah and the big fish. I've spent about 10 years going to wednesday and sunday church, as a child I payed great attention and new the bible well. If I new it well that meant I got more candy, I was also very interested in all mythology; not just Christian. I pondered greatly on the subject of Heaven and Hell, I have found it to be unbelievable.

I've always kind of felt that Hell is a device that higher ups use to scare lower members of churches into submission. That being said, if there is some sort of afterlife, than I think that we all end up in the same place, regardless of anything that we do in this life.

EDIT: James, if Christ is the only way to Heaven, then that means that only those that accept him can go to Heaven. So what about the mentally disabled, children, people that grew up in places that don't have Christianity around them, etc. These people go to hell because they are unlucky? They have no way of accepting Christ because of their environment or because of their mental state, so they are punished because of something they cannot control?

Sounds pretty screwed up to me.

I agree.

I have mixed feelings about the possibility of any afterlife at all.  But even if there is one, EJ, I don't think there is a hell for you to go to.  But that's just my opinion.

Do you think possibly a heaven or perhaps a state of energy or something..?

[El JoNNo]

Interesting variation on the two. If I am understanding correctly Heaven and Hell are each attribted to two things. Heaven 1. a blissful enlightenment, a sort of feeling of elation 2. Reincarnation as someone or something of higher status, not nesseccarily of wealth but of perhaps content? Hell being 1. a hollow existance of perhaps depression, guilt or paranoia 2. Reincarnation into a less desirable person or thing. 

Your definitions are almost correct. For 1. you would need to be enlightened. For 2. you would not necessarily have great wealth, since wealth does nothing to make you happy. Foolish wealthy people are not as happy as wise poor people. The person will instead be born with a "personality" that lends itself to becoming enlightened during that lifetime (this is a simplified explanation, or else I would have to go into great detail). Hell would be when someone is born with a "personality" that doesn't lend itself as well to becoming enlightened as it would be otherwise. This doesn't mean there's no chance to become enlightened. Nothing in Buddhism is eternal, everything is temporary.

Does anyone ever not get reincarnated?
What is considered the "highest" reincarnated form?

When someone becomes enlightened they have 2 options when they die. Option 1 is to be reborn here on earth to help other people become enlightened. Spiritual teachers like the Dalai Lama have done this many times (the Dalai Lama is now in his 14th enlightened reincarnation). There are many others who have chosen this path, the Dalai Lama is just the most well-known of them. Option 2 will be explained below.

You could see the universe as an ocean. Someone's "soul" is a wave in that ocean. What we take to be a "soul" or "individual spirit" within us is an illusion. This soul/self continues after the physical death, moving on to other realms.  As we gather insight on compassion, love and the inter-dependence of all things, we begin to see the idea of the individual self as an illusion.  When, at some point, we are able to "surrender" the ego to the larger as a wave "surrenders" to the ocean, that is the moment of true enlightenment.  At that point, there is no "I" for anything to happen to. We return to the ocean as the wave returns, we become one with the ocean. When you die enlightened, you stay one with the ocean instead of being reborn. This is the highest reincarnated form. This form is temporary though, like I explained in my original post. How Buddhists know all this? People skilled at meditation can already become one with the ocean during their lifetimes. I have felt my connection to the Being (or ocean) several times during long meditation sessions. Someone who is enlightened is connected to the source of Being, to the ocean every hour of day, not just during meditation. They are free from suffering. This is the reason why I am a Buddhist. Buddhism is the only "religion" where you can empirically know you are doing the right thing (except for Hinduism which is built on roughly the same concepts).

Are you ok with being refered to as an Atheist? 

I suppose so, yes. For many people the definition of an atheist is someone who doesn't believe in a God. The goal of Buddhism is to become aware of how the universe works through rituals such as meditation. There is no God to aid Buddhists in that goal. As Buddha said it:

No one saves us but ourselves,
No one can and no one may.
We ourselves must walk the path,
But Buddha has clearly show the way.

Thanks for the lengthing yet no doubt very brief explanantion. It has been a while since I have read anything at all about buddhism.

Heaven and Hell are constructs created by humans to answer questions they cant answer.....Where do I go when I die?  But they have been exploited, for good and bad, and are used to control behavoir in society.

Essentially, Heaven is a carrot, and Hell is the whip.

[Zook]

Hell aint a bad place. Hell is from here to eternity.

[yeshaberto]

really good question, el jonno, and a thousand times more sobering than I can comprehend.

As far as Christianity is concerned, the term for hell is gehenna which referred to a public dump outside of jerusalem.  it was a horrific place where they would take dead prisoners and bodies of the outcast.  the constant burning, the putrid smell and the sight of the neighborhood garbage was a deplorable scene.  this is the word Jesus used to reference when he was urging people towards righteousness.  He almost used it as a parent would urge their children toward doing right in the face of consequences.

In the bigger picture of christianity, hell is not somewhere we go as much as it is somewhere that we are saved from because of the atoning death of Jesus Christ.  Jesus went down to hell for us so that we would not have to go.

Someone asked about various mental disabilities, etc....Scripture refers repeatedly to the scene of judgment day.  I believe judgment day will be exactly that.  A day in which the Judge of all the earth will make a judgment.

[El JoNNo]

really good question, el jonno, and a thousand times more sobering than I can comprehend.

I'm not sure I understand, I may be taking the word "sobering" to literal.

As far as Christianity is concerned, the term for hell is gehenna which referred to a public dump outside of jerusalem.  it was a horrific place where they would take dead prisoners and bodies of the outcast.  the constant burning, the putrid smell and the sight of the neighborhood garbage was a deplorable scene.  this is the word Jesus used to reference when he was urging people towards righteousness.  He almost used it as a parent would urge their children toward doing right in the face of consequences.

I completely forgot about that, it was a part of Jewish folklore, where the real nasty souls went.

[Seventh Son]

According to some of my Christian friends I'm going to burn for not accepting Jesus Christ as my lord and savior.



that seems excessive

Doesn't stop all Southern Baptists (I've even had teachers from elementary school do this to me) in my area from hating and spitting on me anytime I try to speak to one.

But on-topic:

Am I going to hell? Who knows. I don't know, maybe. Its something I've thought about a lot. What is hell even? Is it some place where the big red guy takes bad souls into a lake of fire and torments them forever? Or maybe its some kind of control device to scare people? Or is it merely a metaphor of some kind?

Those are all possibilities, but I tend to look towards the last one. I've viewed hell as metaphor instead of an actual place. Same goes for heaven. I don't think these places physically exist at all. Rather, they represent different sides of humanity, the good and the bad. Order and Chaos, Heaven and Hell.

Now, one issue I have with the Christian concept of Heaven and Hell is that because of what someone else did, I'm automatically evil. I don't get any say in that at all. No matter what, I'm a bad guy unless I hand myself over to Jesus. Personally (And I mean no offense to any Christians here), I call bullshit on that. It seems like no matter what, humanity is destined to fail, with no way out. Honestly, I view that as a nihilistic and rather hollow (And misanthropic as well) way to live. To live believing that what you are is evil and bad and the only way to ever achieve happiness is to give your soul over to Jesus so you can forever be a servant to God? I don't see the happiness in being born only to be a servant. Maybe I'm just retarded. Because I don't see it. I see happiness in being what I want to be while hurting as few people as possible. I see happiness being an individual, and not a slave to God. I don't exactly worship Satan either though. I want to be myself, I don't want to be like either God or Satan (Heaven and Hell). I just want to be myself and live happy like that. Sure, I'm going to fuck up every now and then. But I'm human, so that's expected. And I like that. And as far as I'm concerned, perfection leads only to madness. Those that try to achieve perfection only become insane. Perfection is boring. I don't want to be perfect like God. Its completely predictable. I don't like it. I like life here on Earth. I like being an imperfect human being. No, I love it. There's pain in it, yes, but the pain is necessary. Its good in a sense. You have to take good with the bad. Without evil, good can't exist, and the opposite is also true. There's nothing to compare it to without knowing what the opposite is like. That's why I call bullshit on the idea of Heaven and Hell. That's why I don't think there is "Eternal Happiness" because if all you know is happiness then you cannot know pain. And without pain, the concept of happiness is completely moot and all you are is a hallow being. I don't think even God can change that. So I'll take both. There are times I'm good, and times when I'm evil. I'll take that in stride and be proud of that. That's because I'm a human fucking being, and I think that's something to be prideful of, not to be ashamed of.

tl;dr Heathen justifying why he's going to hell, etc.

[El JoNNo]

Sing it brother! 

[Adami]

I'd just like to answer the original post. Yes, you are all going to hell.




Well...according to Mel Gibson anyway. Unless any of you are sinless vatican 1 catholics.

[Perpetual Change]

I don't understand why some many non-believers are obsessed with this question. If you accept Jesus Christ as the primary guide for your life and the redeemer of the world, then of course you think other people should, too. If you don't accept Jesus Christ as your primary guide and redeemer, why would you care so much about what those who do accept him think?

What is the non-believer expectation here? That one day a Christian is going to come up and say "Yes, I adhere to a religion that says that the world and all its people need to be redeemed by the son of good. But it's cool for you to join our religion even if you don't believe any of that."?

[eric42434224]

I don't understand why some many non-believers are obsessed with this question.

I dont see anywhere in this discussion, or in the world in general, where non-believers are "obsessed" with this question anymore than any other group.
The real question is "what happens after we die", and there is no monopoly on that question.  You dont have to believe, or not believe, you just have to be human and question the world around you.

If you accept Jesus Christ as the primary guide for your life and the redeemer of the world, then of course you think other people should, too. If you don't accept Jesus Christ as your primary guide and redeemer, why would you care so much about what those who do accept him think?

Why cant both (believers and non-believers) question what happens after death, think that their views are correct, and think other people should agree with their views?  What is good for the goose....

What is the non-believer expectation here? That one day a Christian is going to come up and say "Yes, I adhere to a religion that says that the world and all its people need to be redeemed by the son of good. But it's cool for you to join our religion even if you don't believe any of that."?

I am not sure where this comes from, as I am pretty sure there is no such expectation from any non-believer.

[yeshaberto]

really good question, el jonno, and a thousand times more sobering than I can comprehend.

I'm not sure I understand, I may be taking the word "sobering" to literal.

I only meant that I want to approach the concept with deep sorrow and caution.  because I believe in the biblical concept of hell, I believe that there is strong potential (only the Judge ultimately knows) that those who reject God will experience hell.  this belief causes great pain for me to think about, and is one of the main reasons I try to share my conviction with as many as possible.  furthermore, assuming that hell is a real concept, it is something that I do not want to approach flippantly.   inasmuch as some will choose hell, it is a fearful thing indeed.

as seventh son noted, there is no question at all whether heaven and hell are metaphorical.  as I noted earlier, the very term was a reference to a local dump.  surely no one thought that Jesus was warning of being thrown into the local dump as punishment.  is it metaphorical in the sense that there is no eternal reward and/or place of justice - I would argue absolutely not. 

While this is not an argument to use regarding hell, is there not some sense of comfort in the fact that the Osama's of the world (assuming he never gets caught in this life), or the sadistic muderers or the pedophilic rapists, etc who never get punished in this life still have a bigger court to face?

[Seventh Son]

really good question, el jonno, and a thousand times more sobering than I can comprehend.

I'm not sure I understand, I may be taking the word "sobering" to literal.

I only meant that I want to approach the concept with deep sorrow and caution.  because I believe in the biblical concept of hell, I believe that there is strong potential (only the Judge ultimately knows) that those who reject God will experience hell.  this belief causes great pain for me to think about, and is one of the main reasons I try to share my conviction with as many as possible.  furthermore, assuming that hell is a real concept, it is something that I do not want to approach flippantly.   inasmuch as some will choose hell, it is a fearful thing indeed.

as seventh son noted, there is no question at all whether heaven and hell are metaphorical.  as I noted earlier, the very term was a reference to a local dump.  surely no one thought that Jesus was warning of being thrown into the local dump as punishment.  is it metaphorical in the sense that there is no eternal reward and/or place of justice - I would argue absolutely not. 

While this is not an argument to use regarding hell, is there not some sense of comfort in the fact that the Osama's of the world (assuming he never gets caught in this life), or the sadistic muderers or the pedophilic rapists, etc who never get punished in this life still have a bigger court to face?

For the last comment, not really. As far as I"m concerned, once someone is dead, they are dead. There is no point for me to wish further suffering upon them despite what they did in this life. To wish for them to suffer in the afterlife reeks of hateful spite to me. Honestly, what happens to them beyond this realm isn't really my concern, nor my business as far as I'm concerned.

[El JoNNo]

really good question, el jonno, and a thousand times more sobering than I can comprehend.

I'm not sure I understand, I may be taking the word "sobering" to literal.

I only meant that I want to approach the concept with deep sorrow and caution.  because I believe in the biblical concept of hell, I believe that there is strong potential (only the Judge ultimately knows) that those who reject God will experience hell.  this belief causes great pain for me to think about, and is one of the main reasons I try to share my conviction with as many as possible.  furthermore, assuming that hell is a real concept, it is something that I do not want to approach flippantly.   inasmuch as some will choose hell, it is a fearful thing indeed.

as seventh son noted, there is no question at all whether heaven and hell are metaphorical.  as I noted earlier, the very term was a reference to a local dump.  surely no one thought that Jesus was warning of being thrown into the local dump as punishment.  is it metaphorical in the sense that there is no eternal reward and/or place of justice - I would argue absolutely not. 

While this is not an argument to use regarding hell, is there not some sense of comfort in the fact that the Osama's of the world (assuming he never gets caught in this life), or the sadistic muderers or the pedophilic rapists, etc who never get punished in this life still have a bigger court to face?

For the last comment, not really. As far as I"m concerned, once someone is dead, they are dead. There is no point for me to wish further suffering upon them despite what they did in this life. To wish for them to suffer in the afterlife reeks of hateful spite to me. Honestly, what happens to them beyond this realm isn't really my concern, nor my business as far as I'm concerned.

It is too bad that they will never have to answer for their crimes but such is life, all we can do is attempt to right wrongs in a just manner. I agree with Seven Son in that death is the worst of all punishments and I would not want anyone to endure unending nor thousands of years of unbearable torture. 

[El JoNNo]

I don't understand why some many non-believers are obsessed with this question. If you accept Jesus Christ as the primary guide for your life and the redeemer of the world, then of course you think other people should, too. If you don't accept Jesus Christ as your primary guide and redeemer, why would you care so much about what those who do accept him think?

What is the non-believer expectation here? That one day a Christian is going to come up and say "Yes, I adhere to a religion that says that the world and all its people need to be redeemed by the son of good. But it's cool for you to join our religion even if you don't believe any of that."?

I am in no way obsessed with this question. I thought it might spark good discussion and so far it hasn't disappointed.

[Quadrochosis]

Wow the last 6 posters don't know how to use quotes properly

[Seventh Son]

Wow the last 6 posters don't know how to use quotes properly

I used them properly, just someone originally fucked them up. 

[PlaysLikeMyung]

I also think that is excessive. What is your normal response to this?

My response is generally along the lines of this:

Prove to me that your faith is, without a doubt, the right one, and I will agree that I go to hell. However, we both know you cannot prove that beyond a doubt. Do not tell me, then, what is and isn't right; where I'm going or where I'm not going, because I don't know anymore than you do. I accept that you have different beliefs than I, and I than you, but I don't know what's going to happen when we die so I won't tell you where you're going

[hefdaddy42]

I have mixed feelings about the possibility of any afterlife at all.  But even if there is one, EJ, I don't think there is a hell for you to go to.  But that's just my opinion.

Do you think possibly a heaven or perhaps a state of energy or something..?

I don't know about a state of energy - that's a little too sci-fi for me  (although in honesty, I cannot discount the possibility - I've read too many novels and seen too many films  ).  I would guess a heaven would be possible.  It could also be possible that anyone "going to hell" would just be completely destroyed, sent to oblivion.

Either way, it doesn't matter very much to me.

[robwebster]

According to my beliefs, you're not.

I'm agnostic. I don't know if there is a god, I can't know if there is a god, and it doesn't influence my life, but if there is I don't think he'd discriminate on whether you worshipped him in life or no. That's my belief. There might be, but I'm not going to concern myself by agonising over it. Let's face it, there are so many different options and messages and conflicting signals and then it depends on how you're brought up and what you experience... I don't think any god would resent a wrong turning. It's clearly not ill-meaning, and it seems somewhat selfish to say that "I know it's confusing, but get it wrong and you're going to hell." That's very human. My belief is that he'd be above all that.

Far as I'm concerned, as long as you try and live your life in a positive way, you've got as good a chance as anyone. If there even is a chance. Who knows!

Truth is, you should make your moral decisions based on a personal sense of justice rather than on promise of a reward anyway, and I think most people do, so hey! Live your own life! If it happens, you'll get your just desserts. A higher power would be the ultimate authority on fairness. Meander about in your own way and you'll get what you deserve, if anything. And I think it's impossible to justify that a good person could be cast asunder for being faithless.

[eric42434224]

It just goes back to what I have said before.  I like my omnipotent god to be more enlightened than me.  I wont disown my daughter if she didnt accept me, revere me, or follow my rules.