*Official* The Astonishing discussion thread

[matthewmatt]

Please, don't crucify me, but...

Recently I have grown to like not only WDADU, but also The Astonishing as well. I have been listening to it a lot the past two weeks or so. However, it's still a tad overlong and ballad heavy and so on. Since my wife feels that much more than me (she was complaining it's overlong and too plodding etc), I've decided to do some cuts.

In the end I have decided to do a personal tracklists. Kind of a ... well, a "director's cut", so to speak. Two CDs/parts, some shuffling around (so the story is very non-linear, because I had to switch some songs even between the acts). In the end there are 22 songs and the length is 1 hour and 41 minutes. But the most important is the flow, which is now much better, I believe. I have repeatedly tried and deleted and tried and added until I was satisfied at last.

Part 1 / CD 1
1. Dystopian Overture
2. The Gift of Music
3. A Savior in the Square
4. When Your Time Has Come
5. Three Days
6. Act of Faythe
7. A Tempting Offer
8. The X Aspect
9. Heaven's Cove
10. A New Beginning
11. The Road to Revolution

Part 2 / CD 2
1. 2285 Entr'acte
2. Brother Can You Hear Me?
3. Ravenskill
4. Our New World
5. Chosen
6. Moment of Betrayal
7. The Walking Shadow
8. My Last Farewell
9. A Life Left Behind
10. Hymn of a Thousand Voices
11. The Astonishing

(At least my wife prefers it to the official version, so the hours put into it were not spent in vain  )

I'm actually quite proud of this one - I am listening to it again and I really enjoy it more and more. Especially the second part/act, the sequence Ravenskill -> Our New World -> Chosen -> Moment of Betrayal -> The Walking Shadow is really cool, at least from the musical point of view.

Of course you're free to criticise and discuss it. I just want to stress I really like the album as a whole, but it's a lot to take in in one listen. This is more like a "short" version for those already initiated.

[CodyWanKenobi]

YOU FIEND!

[jakepriest]

You're missing the second best song yet kept all the bottom 5 songs in. 

[SystematicThought]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnBHNDb6haE

Maybe I missed it somewhere in the thread, but they released the Moment of Betrayal projection. I didn't realize how many shots are reused in the projection in some of the songs.

[Ninjabait]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a45GI-IPoaI

They've also dropped the tour visuals for The Road to Revolution last week too. I kinda wonder if they're gonna release one for each song on the album...

[matthewmatt]

You're missing the second best song yet kept all the bottom 5 songs in. 

My talets are limitless, you see...

[Prog Snob]

You're missing the second best song yet kept all the bottom 5 songs in. 

My talets are limitless, you see...

Are you trying to say toilets?

[matthewmatt]

Are you trying to say toilets?

Now that you mention it, that too! All my life I've been trying to fill up all the toilets I come across and I haven't been successful so far. The stuff just... disappears. Must be doing something wrong.


Anyway, that second tracklist is not all that good and I'll probably delete it. But I'm still quite satisfied with the first one and enjoy it a lot.

[SystematicThought]

https://teamrock.com/feature/2016-07-28/the-man-behind-dream-theater-concert-films

Interesting interview with Bernard at Lucion, the company behind the visuals. Interesting that they knew A New Beginning's visuals weren't up to par and worked on them later. I thought it was different on later legs. And now we know what happened to the holograms that the band had talked about earlier but never happened. That would have been really cool!

[SebastianPratesi]

And now we know what happened to the holograms that the band had talked about earlier but never happened. That would have been really cool!

Yeah, I was thinking about this. I was worried that at my show last month, there had been holograms and I hadn't payed attention.

[Ben_Jamin]

I think the band had good plans but they fell through. My god, this has to be the saddest promotion ever for a band. They, had big plans, the record company couldn't deliver. So I see why quite a few bands left roadrunner records.

[Darkstarshades]

I think the band had good plans but they fell through. My god, this has to be the saddest promotion ever for a band. They, had big plans, the record company couldn't deliver. So I see why quite a few bands left roadrunner records.

I think this is too exagerated.
DT, as well as many people, consider this a success. The only issue I see is the preorder scandal, but other than that, I don't see how is it sad or bad.
The animating company didn't have too much time and two hours of animation is a very long shot, yet I think they did a good job and made it very enjoyable.
I guess people were expecting some sort of Pixar/Dreamworks animation to cover everything.

But please, TA sold well, don't go as far as to say it was a sad promotion because it wasn't.

[TAC]

Great interview.

[SebastianPratesi]

I guess people were expecting some sort of Pixar/Dreamworks animation to cover everything.

But please, TA sold well, don't go as far as to say it was a sad promotion because it wasn't.

I suppose people were expecting much better, since it was the band/label/companies who announced cool things that eventually fell through or have been indefinitely postponed (the holograms, the deluxe packages, the videogame). I'm not complaining, since I didn't really think any of those things was really that important, but I do think it's reasonable for others to complain.

[Darkstarshades]

I guess people were expecting some sort of Pixar/Dreamworks animation to cover everything.

But please, TA sold well, don't go as far as to say it was a sad promotion because it wasn't.

I suppose people were expecting much better, since it was the band/label/companies who announced cool things that eventually fell through or have been indefinitely postponed (the holograms, the deluxe packages, the videogame). I'm not complaining, since I didn't really think any of those things was really that important, but I do think it's reasonable for others to complain.

Blaming the label for things such as the animation and the videogame is absurd, as the bandmembers were the ones who approached them in the first place. As for the videogame, well, it's an autonomous company who has it delayed.

Now if the label had told them "Here, use these guys" we would be talking differently, but as far as the interviews prove, all the label did was greenlighting stuff.

[rumborak]

Blaming the label for things such as the animation and the videogame is absurd, as the bandmembers were the ones who approached them in the first place. As for the videogame, well, it's an autonomous company who has it delayed.

In general, a band of five people can hardly use lack of creative resources as an explanation. Not utilizing the other band members seems to have been a fully conscious decision.


I wasn't even aware of the whole hologram thing. Yeah, that probably would have done a huge job at tying the story into the performance.

[jvelvet3]

Six months in, and I still can't stop listening to this album. I don't think I've ever enjoyed a new album almost exclusively for this long without getting burned out on it (I still haven't given the new Avantasia, which came out the same day, a full listen through). I think I can safely say TA will probably end up as my favorite DT release. It has so much variety, which is what I really like about DT (and music in general). I'm a sucker for ballads/power ballads, so I love Act of Faythe, Chosen, A Life Left Behind, Begin Again, Losing Faythe, and Hymn of a Thousand Voices. But when I want something heavier, I can go to A Tempting Offer, Moment of Betrayal, The Path That Divides, Walking Shadow, or to the craziness of Lord Nafaryus and Three Days. And of course there's The Gift of Music, A New Beginning, Our New World, A Better Life, Savior in the Square, and the beautiful Heaven's Cove. So much good stuff... I made a single CD version for my car, but had to leave out a lot of great songs that just wouldn't fit.

This album is unlike anything else in their catalog. I love the orchestration, the choirs, the piano, James Labrie, JP's guitar solos in A Better Life, Savior in the Square, When Your Time Has Come, A New Beginning, Chosen, etc, and MM's sometimes subtle drum work. There's so many great melodies from this album that are constantly stuck in my head. I think I'm addicted to it, and I may need help. 

[AngelBack]

Six months in, and I still can't stop listening to this album. I don't think I've ever enjoyed a new album almost exclusively for this long without getting burned out on it (I still haven't given the new Avantasia, which came out the same day, a full listen through). I think I can safely say TA will probably end up as my favorite DT release. It has so much variety, which is what I really like about DT (and music in general). I'm a sucker for ballads/power ballads, so I love Act of Faythe, Chosen, A Life Left Behind, Begin Again, Losing Faythe, and Hymn of a Thousand Voices. But when I want something heavier, I can go to A Tempting Offer, Moment of Betrayal, The Path That Divides, Walking Shadow, or to the craziness of Lord Nafaryus and Three Days. And of course there's The Gift of Music, A New Beginning, Our New World, A Better Life, Savior in the Square, and the beautiful Heaven's Cove. So much good stuff... I made a single CD version for my car, but had to leave out a lot of great songs that just wouldn't fit.

This album is unlike anything else in their catalog. I love the orchestration, the choirs, the piano, James Labrie, JP's guitar solos in A Better Life, Savior in the Square, When Your Time Has Come, A New Beginning, Chosen, etc, and MM's sometimes subtle drum work. There's so many great melodies from this album that are constantly stuck in my head. I think I'm addicted to it, and I may need help. 

I'm with you JV.  TA may not end up being my all time fave DT album, but after all this time and untold numbers of play, I am still loving the album and have not hit the "ok I'll skip this song" phase yet.  Still fresh and no signs of fatigue of any of it. 

[Mosh]

Blaming the label for things such as the animation and the videogame is absurd, as the bandmembers were the ones who approached them in the first place. As for the videogame, well, it's an autonomous company who has it delayed.

In general, a band of five people can hardly use lack of creative resources as an explanation. Not utilizing the other band members seems to have been a fully conscious decision.

It definitely was. JP confirmed that he approached the band and requested that the album be written exclusively by him and JR.

I think that idea was fine for a first draft, but maybe the other guys could've given input after.

[Ben_Jamin]

I think the band had good plans but they fell through. My god, this has to be the saddest promotion ever for a band. They, had big plans, the record company couldn't deliver. So I see why quite a few bands left roadrunner records.

I think this is too exagerated.
DT, as well as many people, consider this a success. The only issue I see is the preorder scandal, but other than that, I don't see how is it sad or bad.
The animating company didn't have too much time and two hours of animation is a very long shot, yet I think they did a good job and made it very enjoyable.
I guess people were expecting some sort of Pixar/Dreamworks animation to cover everything.

But please, TA sold well, don't go as far as to say it was a sad promotion because it wasn't.

I'm talking mainly about Roadrunner, and how unprofessional they are handling this. I think they bit off more then they could chew.

The CD, shows and animations are top notch I feel.

[SebastianPratesi]

Blaming the label for things such as the animation and the videogame is absurd, as the bandmembers were the ones who approached them in the first place. As for the videogame, well, it's an autonomous company who has it delayed.

Now if the label had told them "Here, use these guys" we would be talking differently, but as far as the interviews prove, all the label did was greenlighting stuff.

Hey, I agree that the label probably wasn't responsible for the animation and videogame. What (I understand) they are responsible for is the delay on the deluxe packages.

In short, this is what I was thinking:
- Delay in deluxe packages: label.
- Delay in videogame: the videogame company (who advertised 'April' & 'Q2' as release dates).
- Lack of holograms: well, I didn't read any press release by the animation company, but the band talked about holograms in some interviews before the European leg.

But yeah, maybe they (label, companies, and band) thought that they would be able to achieve what they set for or promised, but ran out of enough time. (Kind of what happened to the Nafaryus intro and the "A New Beginning" solo in the album. )

[Mladen]

Well, when you're trying to pull off such an enormous project like this, something's just bound to go wrong. Taking all the different complicated factors that went into all of this, I'm impressed Dream Theater's gone this far with all of it. People forget how much work was involved in every little detail and aspect of The Astonishing.

[TAC]

Well, when you're trying to pull off such an enormous project like this, something's just bound to go wrong. Taking all the different complicated factors that went into all of this, I'm impressed Dream Theater's gone this far with all of it. People forget how much work was involved in every little detail and aspect of The Astonishing.

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

Well, when you're trying to pull off such an enormous project like this, something's just bound to go wrong. Taking all the different complicated factors that went into all of this, I'm impressed Dream Theater's gone this far with all of it. People forget how much work was involved in every little detail and aspect of The Astonishing.

Agreed. It's way easier to pick on the things that one doesn't like, but enjoy it or not the enormous effort has to be recognised nevertheless.

[hefdaddy42]

Well, when you're trying to pull off such an enormous project like this, something's just bound to go wrong. Taking all the different complicated factors that went into all of this, I'm impressed Dream Theater's gone this far with all of it. People forget how much work was involved in every little detail and aspect of The Astonishing.

Agreed. It's way easier to pick on the things that one doesn't like, but enjoy it or not the enormous effort has to be recognised nevertheless.

Indeed.

[cramx3]

I do wonder if DT's tour in Europe immediately after the album release was a bit too aggressive timeline wise.

[Prog Snob]

Well, when you're trying to pull off such an enormous project like this, something's just bound to go wrong. Taking all the different complicated factors that went into all of this, I'm impressed Dream Theater's gone this far with all of it. People forget how much work was involved in every little detail and aspect of The Astonishing.

Agreed. It's way easier to pick on the things that one doesn't like, but enjoy it or not the enormous effort has to be recognised nevertheless.

Well said. Unfortunately, most people seem too comfortable picking on every last detail instead of enjoying something for what it is. I'm the snob here, yet it seems like others are infinitely more imperious about the music. There's a difference between not liking something and nitpicking on the most trivial details.

[Darkstarshades]

THAT MASTERING ERROR AT THE END OF A TEMPTING OFFER COMPLETELY RUINS THE ALBUM EXPERIENCE FOR ME.

[jakepriest]

THAT MASTERING ERROR AT THE END OF A TEMPTING OFFER COMPLETELY RUINS THE ALBUM EXPERIENCE FOR ME.

your caps ruins the forum experience for me

[erwinrafael]

THAT MASTERING ERROR AT THE END OF A TEMPTING OFFER COMPLETELY RUINS THE ALBUM EXPERIENCE FOR ME.

THAT HORRIBLE LOOPING CRICKET SOUND AT THE START OF THE PATH THAT DIVIDES COMPLETELY RUINS THE ALBUM EXPERIENCE FOR ME.

[Prog Snob]

THAT MASTERING ERROR AT THE END OF A TEMPTING OFFER COMPLETELY RUINS THE ALBUM EXPERIENCE FOR ME.

THAT HORRIBLE LOOPING CRICKET SOUND AT THE START OF THE PATH THAT DIVIDES COMPLETELY RUINS THE ALBUM EXPERIENCE FOR ME.

Now you're getting it. Personally, I just can't listen to it anymore because I don't like the shade of blue they made the sky on the cover.

[Darkstarshades]

Hugh Syme would have done a better job at it, I can only imagine the top notch quality cover of TA by HS.

[Ben_Jamin]

I'm saying I love this album.

If I were to rank it. It'd be 2ND right now.

[Kotowboy]

Hugh Syme would have done a better job at it, I can only imagine the top notch quality cover of TA by HS.

[Adami]