The Flower Kings Discography: Desolation Rose (2013)

[jingle.boy]

Nice informative writeup Kev. Might put this one at the top of the list as a re-listen.

[The Letter M]

As I've said before, PH is an album that took me a couple years to finally understand and click with me. I was more in love with albums like UTF and SWA, and even when TSONE came out, I was spinning that more than PH. After TSONE came out, I went back to PH to see if I could finally get it, if it would finally click with me musically and lyrically and just over-all.

And when it finally did, I was BLOWN AWAY by every song. It wasn't so much a collection of songs, written by more than JUST Roine (with contributions by Tomas and Hasse as well), it was very much a BAND album, and less Roine's stuff played by the rest of the band. The songs weren't so much just songs but they all contributed to the over-all mood of the album as it ebbed and flowed from beginning to end, with the bookending themes presented in "Monsters & Men" coming back in "Blue Planet". Chunks of songs became epic-pieces as the album has a continuous flow, and it makes it harder NOT to listen to the whole thing in one go (which is how I usually listen to it intently anyway).

Once I understood the songs, their flow, their composition, how the sum was greater than its parts, everything fit for me and it has now become a Top 3 TFK album for me (next to UTF and SWA). It's sad that this was Marcus' only TFK album, but I'm glad his fellow former Flower Kings invited him back to other projects, so at least we have the chance to hear him on other TFK-related albums. His drumming on this album isn't wild, but it isn't understated. It's very appropriate and he can rock hard when the song calls for it. He fit very well and while he was a departure from Zoltan, it was a welcome breather from Zoltan's frantic jazz-fusion drumming that was all over UTF and A&E (not that there's anything wrong with that).

It's hard to believe that this album has been out for over 8 years now!!! Time has flown by so fast for the Flower Kings. Then again, that 5 year hiatus really didn't feel like five years with all the projects every member of the band was involved in in that time span.

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

Yeah, I think Marcus was definitely the most "rock" drummer the band has had.  I always got the impression that he was more of a rocker than progger at heart. 

Top 5 TFK album for me.  Hardly anything that I feel the need to skip.  "Bavarian Skies" is the only track I actively dislike. 


I had no idea that "Monsters & Men" was so controversial.  What's not to like about it? I think it's pretty great and they killed it live!  I'd love to hear more about it, why it was dissed by other band members, etc.

Wait, I don't think Monsters and Men was ever played live.  Maybe I am mistaken, but does anyone know for sure?  As for it not being liked by certain band members, all I know is what was said on the TFK yahoo mailing list years ago (that I summed up in my write-up).

Regarding Bavarian Skies, I get why some are not wild about it, but in the context of the album, I think it is fantastic.  And I just love the music in it.

Nice informative writeup Kev. Might put this one at the top of the list as a re-listen.

Thanks! And sweet. 

[Nihil-Morari]

One of two TFK albums that I've never listen too from start to finish (the other being The Sum). I have no idea why. Will start in a minute!

[hefdaddy42]

OK, starting Adam & Eve now.  Been a long time.  But the next one, Paradox Hotel, I've listened to many, many times, so I feel almost caught up lol.

[KevShmev]

One of two TFK albums that I've never listen too from start to finish (the other being The Sum). I have no idea why. Will start in a minute!

You're in for a real treat.

[KevShmev]

Anymore Paradox Hotel chatter before we move on to the next record sometime in the next day or so?

[The Letter M]

Anymore Paradox Hotel chatter before we move on to the next record sometime in the next day or so?

Did anyone else ever find it really odd that "Monsters & Men" had a track time of 21:21, and that "Minor Giant Steps" had the inverse track time of 12:12? Interesting coincidence that both are the first (real) songs on each disc (not counting "Check In").

Also, other than the shared themes between "Monsters & Men" and "Blue Planet", are there any other nods to other songs in other tracks on the album that I'm not really thinking of at the moment?

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

I can't think of any, at the moment.

[KevShmev]

The Sum of No Evil (2007)



Tomas Bodin - piano, organ, synthesizers, mellotron
Hasse Fröberg - vocals, guitars
Jonas Reingold - bass guitar
Roine Stolt - vocals, guitars, additional keyboards
Zoltan Csörsz - drums

----------

1.   "One More Time"
2.   "Love Is The Only Answer"
3.   "Trading My Soul"
4.   "The Sum Of No Reason"
5.   "Flight 999 Brimstone Air" (Tomas Bodin)
6.   "Life In Motion" 

(all songs written and composed by Roine Stolt, except where indicated)

----------

We move now to The Sum of No Evil, the band's 10th studio album. This is a single album with only six songs, and it's pretty much a non-stop prog fest.  While most of their other albums have a nice diversity of different styles and whatnot, this is an album full of nothing but prog songs. Even the two shorter songs are very proggy, albeit in shorter song form.  And while that might seem natural - a full-fledged prog band doing a full-fledged prog album - I don't think it worked out well.  In short, this record was a massive letdown for me following the utter brilliance of Paradox Hotel.  It almost seemed like, after writing songs in a simpler fashion on Paradox Hotel, they tried to write songs with more complex arrangements, instead of letting the songs grow naturally.  All of the longer songs kind of have that padded "hey, let's do something to make this song longer" feel.  That is a frequent criticism of the progressive rock genre in general, and I think the Flower Kings usually do a good job of not falling into that trap, but not this time, IMO.

At first, I thought maybe it was just a bit of initial disappointment cause it followed such a great album, but time has not been kind to it; it's just kind of there.  It's not a bad album by any means, but it's not really outstanding in any way.  Every song has something in it that I think, "Okay, this is really cool; now we're getting somewhere," but in every instance, something comes along that just lets the air out of the balloon.  Take for example, Life in Motion, which starts off really cool with a nice intro and a cool verse, but then we get to the limp chorus that sounds completely uninspired, and the song never really recovers from that, even with a nice ending section (that is totally tacked on, following the song coming to a complete stop). 

I have long stated that One More Time is their most boring full-length song (not counting really short  transitional pieces) ever, and while a recent listen was a bit less unfavorable than usual, I stand by that opinion; it's just a boring song, and it being the first track on the album gives it that stuttering feeling, like it takes forever for the record to come to life., and in a sense, it never really recovers from that. 

Plus, after there being a ton of acoustic guitar and piano on the previous record, we don't hear much of either on this record.

I don't want this review to be totally negative, so I will reiterate that there are some things I like about this record.  Love Is the Only Answer might be totally bloated and overly long, but it has some dynamite sections; Trading My Soul has a very cool vibe during the slower verses; The Sum on No Reason has a great beginning and ending; etc. Really, I can turn this album on and let it play from start to finish, uninterrupted, and there is nothing that really bothers me, but there just isn't a lot that gets me excited.  And considering how much I love this band, and most of their other albums, I can't call this album anything else than a disappointment.

[RoeDent]

TSONE is the only FK album I currently have. I'm still in the process of growing to appreciate it. I love Love Is The Only Answer, Trading My Soul and Flight 999 Brimstone Air, but the others I've yet to get into.

[The Letter M]

After my initial mixed feelings on PH, I eagerly awaited the prog-infused The Sum Of No Evil, where the epics returned in full-force. This album, however, seemed to be a bit polarizing for fans. Some praised it as a return to form and their earlier works (and the music itself even referenced "There Is More To This World", "The Flower King" and "The Truth Will Set You Free") while others felt it was bloated and prog for the sake of prog.

I've enjoyed it since its release and have loved the side-long epic as well. I've even made (as usual) my own personal 2-Disc remix of the track list with the bonus tracks.

Love Is The Only Answer
Trading My Soul
Regal Divers
Turn The Stone
The River

One More Time
The Sum Of No Reason
Flight 999 Brimstone Air
Life In Motion

Each disc is around 45 minutes long, and has a great flow. I kept "One More Time" as an opener but for the second disc. I always felt that "Love Is The Only Answer" was a better opener, so I made both an opener! The bonus tracks on this album were pretty strong, so I felt I needed to include them. The lyrical reprise of LITOA's opening lyrics at the end of "The River" is also a great way to bookend the first disc of this mix! I love the mixing and meshing of themes and lyrics across this whole album!

Over-all, this is a good prog album, different than the last few, but it's an example of how TFK continues to transform and evolve. This album also marked the return of Zoltan!!! His sound is all over the album and he does a great job on what would be his last album with the band.

-Marc.

[hefdaddy42]

Adam & Eve was amazing.

Been listening to Paradox Hotel in the car toward the end of the week.  Absolutely love songs like Monsters & Men, Hit Me With A Hit, Pioneers of Aviation, End on a High Note, Minor Giant Steps, The Way The Waters Are Moving...I'm with Kev, this album is full of reasons to love this band.  Might be my favorite of theirs.

[KevShmev]

Sweet.

Regarding TSONE's bonus tracks, I remember being shocked at how forgettable they were.  I'd have to revisit them to remind myself of them, but my feeling at the time was that it was easy to see why they didn't make the proper album, and considering the record isn't that strong, IMO, that is telling.

[The Letter M]

Sweet.

Regarding TSONE's bonus tracks, I remember being shocked at how forgettable they were.  I'd have to revisit them to remind myself of them, but my feeling at the time was that it was easy to see why they didn't make the proper album, and considering the record isn't that strong, IMO, that is telling.

Different strokes, I guess. Then again, my initial feelings for PH were mixed at best, and that took me a couple years to really appreciate. I guess because of that, I came in to TSONE with lowered expectations or just higher hopes, but either way, it grabbed me and held me tight because I have loved it ever since release, bonus tracks and all!

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

Okay, I am revisiting those bonus tracks...

The River is good. Definitely better than I remember.  But I think I remember why I was probably disappointed with it before: the song has a nice build, and you think there's gonna be this epic guitar solo at the end, and instead it just slowly peters out.  Kind of anti-climatic.  But the vocal melodies are very nice.

Turn the Stone doesn't have anything going on that makes me think, "I want to listen to this again, ever."  Definitely falls into the forgettable category I earlier referred to.

Regal Drivers is pretty good, I suppose.  It's another in a long line of slow burner instrumentals, but they've done that type of song much better before, so that is why I tend to look at it as not being memorable or essential.

[KevShmev]

Banks of Eden (2012)



Tomas Bodin - keyboards
Hasse Fröberg - vocals, guitars
Felix Lehrmann - drums
Jonas Reingold - bass guitar
Roine Stolt - vocals, guitars

----------

1.   "Numbers"
2.   "For The Love Of Gold"
3.   "Pandemonium"
4.   "For Those About To Drown"
5.   "Rising The Imperial"

----------

Following the tour for The Sum of No Evil, the band took a much-needed sabbatical, as the various members focused on various other projects, but they eventually decided to bring the band back together again, with the core four (Stolt, Bodin, Reingold and Froberg) and another new drummer, Felix Lehrmann.  And the result was 2012's Banks of Eden, which I've never really full grasped until the last few months. Granted, I listened to it a lot when it first came out, because a) it was the first Flower Kings album in five years, and b) I always listen to a new Flower Kings album a lot at first. But while I liked it a lot at first, I wasn't sure if I really thought it was great, or if I was just happy that the band was releasing material again.  Over time, I didn't listen to the album that much and my thought was, "Okay, it's not that great, otherwise I'd still be listening to it a ton," but I think was more to do with the phases I go through with bands and whatnot. I simply wasn't in a Flower Kings mood for quite a while.  However, having listened to every Flower Kings album at least a few times in the last few months, partly because of this thread, I can safely say that Banks of Eden is most excellent, and probably one of their three or four best single albums.

One thing that really stands out is how consistent it is.  This isn't like World of Adventures or Space Revolver, where the epic(s) are far ahead of everything else on the record; every song is really good. Granted, there are only five songs, but whatever song I like the least, I probably like about as much as the song I like the most.  Listening to the entire record from start to finish is effortless. It's also notable that it's the shortest Flower Kings album to date, coming in at just over 53 minutes (although the four bonus tracks, if you include them in the mix, bring the album close to the 76-minute mark. 

Stylistically, this album is musically classic Flower Kings.  It's very upbeat, for the most part, and is probably one of their most rocking albums overall.  Lyrically, the album seems a bit more cynical than normal for them. My interpretation is that much of it is a criticism of capitalism and, by that extension, America, which would make sense given Roine's socialist views. In a sense, the title of the the album implies that America is Eden, and the Banks of Eden is a metaphor for the greed for money that exists today, as well how materialistic we have become, in Roine's eyes.  So, while the music is classic happy Flower Kings stuff, the more cynical lyrics give it a different dynamic than normal when considering the package as a whole.  Regardless of what you think of Roine's views, it just works, as is generally the norm.  I usually don't touch on his lyrics that much, but I almost always like them a lot, and just think, English is not his first language!

Overall, this is an excellent and very consistent record.  Despite kicking off with a 25-minute song, I think this would be as good a place as any for someone unfamiliar with the band to start, as it's pretty accessible, and it also had that classic Flower Kings feel and style to it, to appeal to existing and/or longtime fans.  It's the best of both worlds!

[jingle.boy]

So... Paradox Hotel.  Loved it.  Loved, LOVED, LOVED it.  Think I'll be buying that one.

Sorry I'm a tad behind in following/commenting.  Work has been brutal the last 5 weeks.  But, will try to tackle TSONE (with an open mind), and given you're writeup on TBOE (which I remember listening to when it was first released), I'm very much looking forward to that one.

When all is said an done, I think I'll pickup 3 albums ... PH, for sure; perhaps Back in the World; perhaps TBOE... we'll see about Desolation Rose.  I know that I just don't have the appetite to digest the earlier double albums.

[Mindflux]

nevermind... 

[The Letter M]

Banks Of Eden was a bit difficult for me to get in to. I spun it when it came out but I didn't really absorb it like I should have. In the year that produced new albums from Rush, Marillion, and Neal Morse, TFK's triumphant return kind of took a back seat. It wasn't until lately when I revisited the album after Desolation Rose came out that I decided to give it a harder listen, and I also worked in the Bonus Tracks into a new track list (as I do) and came out with the following:

Numbers
Illuminati
For The Love Of Gold
LoLines
Pandemonium
Fireghosts
For Those About To Drown
Going Up
Rising The Imperial

It's a good balance and I now enjoy all the tracks, especially the opening epic (which I did enjoy when the album initially came out). Beyond that and the closing reprisal of "Rising The Imperial", the album sort of just fell through the cracks for me. There's a lack of recurring themes and motifs throughout the album that is a bit apparent, something that I do enjoy about their albums. Then again, Paradox Hotel was similar in that it lacked some over-all themes and it took me a couple years to really get that album.

I think in a year or two from now, after BOE and DR have settled, I'll appreciate both albums more than I do now, but as it stands, BOE is getting better and better for me. I really enjoy DR, so I'm hopeful and excited for the band's next album!

-Marc.

[KevShmev]

So... Paradox Hotel.  Loved it.  Loved, LOVED, LOVED it.  Think I'll be buying that one.

Sorry I'm a tad behind in following/commenting.  Work has been brutal the last 5 weeks.  But, will try to tackle TSONE (with an open mind), and given you're writeup on TBOE (which I remember listening to when it was first released), I'm very much looking forward to that one.

When all is said an done, I think I'll pickup 3 albums ... PH, for sure; perhaps Back in the World; perhaps TBOE... we'll see about Desolation Rose.  I know that I just don't have the appetite to digest the earlier double albums.

Great to hear you are loving and will be buying Paradox Hotel!

No biggie on not keeping up with the thread.  They have so much music that it can be hard to get to a new album every 5-7 days (before I move on to the next one).  Hopefully, once I finish up with Desolation Rose next week, the thread will stay alive for a bit as others catch up.

Banks Of Eden was a bit difficult for me to get in to. I spun it when it came out but I didn't really absorb it like I should have. In the year that produced new albums from Rush, Marillion, and Neal Morse, TFK's triumphant return kind of took a back seat.

I hadn't thought about that, but Clockwork Angels coming out around the same time is probably a big reason why Banks of Eden didn't stick around in my CD player longer when it first came out, as I was way more into the new Rush CD, and that launched me into another one of those Rush phases that seemingly lasted for six months or so , so TFK, among others, kind of fell by the wayside for much of the rest of 2012.

[Nihil-Morari]

I'm going to check out The Sum, but not with the greatest expectations. I just bought Banks... and well... Marc basically said what I think about that album. I like the title track, but it hasn't really clicked, and the rest of the album just feels like leftovers, some way or another. I mean, the short tracks aren't bad per se, but there isn't a great one either.
I just listened to Desolation Rose on the way home from work today, I'd be interested to see what you guys think of that one, cause it keeps growing and growing on me.

[KevShmev]

When you say title track, I assume you mean Numbers, and, yes, that song is pretty great.

I think all of the shorter tracks are really, really good.  No, none of them would be among my favorite shorter TFK songs, but, again, they are all really, really good, and, as I said in my review, it makes for a really consistent record.  Even though I am a big fan of probably 3/4 of TFK's albums (while still liking the other 1/4, for the most part), some of them are so long than listening to many of them in one sitting can feel like a chore.  However, Banks of Eden checks in at under 55 minutes and is just a joy to listen to from start to finish; it's an effortless listen.

[Nihil-Morari]

Yeah, I meant Numbers. I see what you mean about having the opportunity to finally listen to a TFK record in one go. That's one of the things that I love the most about Desolation Rose, but we'll get to that later.

Even nearing the end of this thread, I feel the need to just start over again with their discography. I've got a long weekend off, maybe I'll listen to all their albums within a few days, could be fun!


EDIT: Wow. Their albums really are long... Even though there aren't very many album, there is still 19,5 hours worth of studio material (excluding bonus tracks, including Roine's The Flower King) Maybe I won't make it in one weekend, haha

[The Letter M]

EDIT: Wow. Their albums really are long... Even though there aren't very many album, there is still 19,5 hours worth of studio material (excluding bonus tracks, including Roine's The Flower King) Maybe I won't make it in one weekend, haha

I attempted a Musical Marathon of all the TFK albums in one day, once, but it ended up being over two. This included Roine's The Flower King, and all the bonus tracks from the albums that have them. And yes, including all of that, it's probably over 20 hours at this point. With 12 studio album (13 including Roine's solo), that's a TON of material. It always astounds me how much music they've made, recorded and released as a studio band! And to think, nearly every member of TFK, past and present, have had albums and projects (some with fellow TFK members) that are also very numerous, you have to wonder where their inspiration keeps on coming.

-Marc.

[jingle.boy]

You know, I'm quite enjoying The Sum of No Evil.  With no deep knowledge/history with the band, little-to-no expectations, and simply listening for the sake of listening, it's quite enjoyable.  One More Time was a nice start; Love is the Only Answer flowed smoothly for all 24 minutes, and I'm just wrapping up The Sum of No Reason... great guitar work.

Sometimes it's good to have absolutely zero expectations or predispositions.  This might be a fourth purchase.

[KevShmev]

Interesting.  Well, I would never begrudge someone buying a Flower Kings record, even one of the two I am not overly wild about, so...cool, cool.

[kirksnosehair]

I loved "The Sum of No Evil" when it came out and I still put it near the top of the pack.  "Banks of Eden" is great as well. 


The thing I've noticed with their last few releases is there are no huge stand-out songs.  Like Stardust We Are, or The Truth Will Set You Free, or I Am The Sun, etc.  Sure, there are still plenty of long-form songs and the music is always great.  But I don't think they've created a really stand-out track since UTF.

[RoeDent]

While I only have one FK album atm (I will get more eventually), I've still found this thread really enjoyable to follow. It'd be cool if it's done with more bands in the future.

[BRGM]

Been listening alot to World of Adventures, Desolation Rose and Paradox Hotel these last couple of weeks thanks to you Kev and this thread. Have been meaning to check them out for quite a while now but never got around to it. Fantastic music, really looking forward to all the other albums!

[KevShmev]

Glad to see you guys are enjoying this thread AND the band!

I'd be down for doing more of these, although I don't necessarily want to run them every time.  Merely participating is often more fun.

As for standout songs, I would agree that the last three albums don't have any one song I would call one of their absolute best - even the best songs from the last two albums would barely crack my TFK top 40, probably - but Paradox Hotel is loaded with standout song after standout song, IMO.

[jingle.boy]

While I only have one FK album atm (I will get more eventually), I've still found this thread really enjoyable to follow. It'd be cool if it's done with more bands in the future.

When this is done, I've been considering doing Zeppelin.  I'm thinking that, like the Top 50 lists and Roulette's, maybe we start a cycle of people doing this.  Bob did a great job with his (ELP, Yes and Genesis iirc), so there's no shortage of bands and big fans here on DTF to lead some discussions.

Maybe I'll make a post, see what the interest is, and then we see where it goes from there.

[The Letter M]

While I only have one FK album atm (I will get more eventually), I've still found this thread really enjoyable to follow. It'd be cool if it's done with more bands in the future.

When this is done, I've been considering doing Zeppelin.  I'm thinking that, like the Top 50 lists and Roulette's, maybe we start a cycle of people doing this.  Bob did a great job with his (ELP, Yes and Genesis iirc), so there's no shortage of bands and big fans here on DTF to lead some discussions.

Maybe I'll make a post, see what the interest is, and then we see where it goes from there.

Rush would also be a good one to do this year since it is their 40th Anniversary!

-Marc.

[Nihil-Morari]

While I only have one FK album atm (I will get more eventually), I've still found this thread really enjoyable to follow. It'd be cool if it's done with more bands in the future.

When this is done, I've been considering doing Zeppelin.  I'm thinking that, like the Top 50 lists and Roulette's, maybe we start a cycle of people doing this.  Bob did a great job with his (ELP, Yes and Genesis iirc), so there's no shortage of bands and big fans here on DTF to lead some discussions.

Maybe I'll make a post, see what the interest is, and then we see where it goes from there.

Rush would also be a good one to do this year since it is their 40th Anniversary!

-Marc.

I'd do a Zappa one. Problem is that it won't be done until 2028

As for standout songs: Tower ONE is growing and growing, possibly their best under 20 minute epic, imo.

[KevShmev]

That is hard to say, especially since what makes something epic is often so subjective.  For instance, End on a High Note is less than 11 minutes, but I'd say it has an epic feel, while, on the flip side, Last Minute on Earth is a minute longer, but doesn't feel like an epic.  Make sense?

Regardless, I do like Tower One a lot, especially from about the 4-minute mark till the end (I find the first few minutes a bit underwhelming).