2019 NFL Thread v. Chiefs are Champs, Missouri rules the sports world

[PowerSlave]

Still won't top the diarrhea fest that their 2007 meeting was.

I'll never forget the way that one punt landed in the mud  Probably the most entertaining play of that game.

Yeah, I remember that game pretty well. They had the excuse of bad weather, so I can give it a pass. As far as I know, there shouldn't be any excuses like that for this meeting. The fish seem to be intentionally tanking their season, and my beloved stillers appear to be lost in the wilderness.

[Dream Team]

So I heard Mahomes is trying to get cleared to play this weekend. Probably won't happen though. Still pisses me off to no end that some useless, shitty lineman cost us seeing Mahomes vs Rodgers. Probably 4 more years til we get another chance, and Rodgers is likely out of the league by then. 

[King Postwhore]

I would blame his head coach for trying a sneak with a QB he was already injured with a bad ankle sprain.  Don't put your most important piece in harms way when already injured.

[Dream Team]

^ Yeah. Hey I just saw the Vegas line on Mia-Pit. PUT ALL YOUR MONEY ON THE DOLPHINS. This is the hot tip of the day, I know Tomlin well. In fact this will probably be Miami's first win of the season.

[Stadler]

Sorry, this is going to sound crueler than I intend, but as for Mahomes, welcome to the NFL.  Players get hurt.  If you're a fan of '80's Giants, you understand this (Simms/Hostetler).  If you're a Patriots fan, you understand this (Brady missing a season).  If you're a Colts fan, you understand this (Manning, Luck).  If you're a Saints fan, you understand this (Brees).  If you're an Eagles fan, you understand this (Wentz).  If you're a Redskins fan, you understand this (Theismann).  If you're a Browns fan, you understand this (Kozar). 

I don't disagree with King at all (I'm not a Reid fan, so...), but as a general proposition, "things happen" in an athletic contest, where you're using your BODY to advance the game.

[King Postwhore]

I thought that too Stads but this is your franchise. Without him they will make the playoffs but go anywhere.   He injured his ankle the week before bad.  Still fought through for this game so the sneak would be the one call I take off the board.

[El Barto]

I thought that too Stads but this is your franchise. Without him they will make the playoffs but go anywhere.   He injured his ankle the week before bad.  Still fought through for this game so the sneak would be the one call I take off the board.

He's far more likely to get hurt running out of the pocket and making those off-balance throws he's always chucking. Getting hurt on the sneak was more of a fluke than anything else. Either the guy's capable of playing or he's not. If he's likely to get hurt running a play from their book then he's not capable of playing. Or at least shouldn't be. However, it doesn't look like the known injury was the problem here, so none of this really matters. Chalk it up to "shit happens."

[Dream Team]

Injuries happen in football ?!?  I was just trying to make the point I'm going to miss seeing a Mahomes-Rodgers battle, nothing more.

[Stadler]

Injuries happen in football ?!?  I was just trying to make the point I'm going to miss seeing a Mahomes-Rodgers battle, nothing more.

I guess I got thrown by the "useless shitty lineman" comment.   

[King Postwhore]

I thought that too Stads but this is your franchise. Without him they will make the playoffs but go anywhere.   He injured his ankle the week before bad.  Still fought through for this game so the sneak would be the one call I take off the board.

He's far more likely to get hurt running out of the pocket and making those off-balance throws he's always chucking. Getting hurt on the sneak was more of a fluke than anything else. Either the guy's capable of playing or he's not. If he's likely to get hurt running a play from their book then he's not capable of playing. Or at least shouldn't be. However, it doesn't look like the known injury was the problem here, so none of this really matters. Chalk it up to "shit happens."

No I get yeah.  Brady never comes off as well no matter what.  What about him possibly playing this Sunday?  Would you be ok with that?

We can shit all over Reid though.

[El Barto]

I thought that too Stads but this is your franchise. Without him they will make the playoffs but go anywhere.   He injured his ankle the week before bad.  Still fought through for this game so the sneak would be the one call I take off the board.

He's far more likely to get hurt running out of the pocket and making those off-balance throws he's always chucking. Getting hurt on the sneak was more of a fluke than anything else. Either the guy's capable of playing or he's not. If he's likely to get hurt running a play from their book then he's not capable of playing. Or at least shouldn't be. However, it doesn't look like the known injury was the problem here, so none of this really matters. Chalk it up to "shit happens."

No I get yeah.  Brady never comes off as well no matter what.  What about him possibly playing this Sunday?  Would you be ok with that?

We can shit all over Reid though.

I have no idea what the extent of the injury is, but I'd be inclined to start Matt Moore. Even if PM is 100%, there's till no guarantee they beat GB. KC didn't look very good at all with PM at <100%. I'd give them no chance with a hobbled Mahomes. And there's always the possibility that the team rallies around Matt Moore leading to an improbable upset. Adversity builds character.

More important, though, you run the risk of losing him for even longer. What Jerry Jones did with Romo should have been a bucket of cold water to the other coaches and GMs in the league. Jerry had an excuse because it was do or die time. This game's not all that important in the grand scheme of things.  When Mahomes comes back healthy and ready to rock they're going to plow their way through the rest of the schedule and earn a bye week. He's far more important later than he is now, and that's really the key.

[King Postwhore]

100% agree  What's 2 games missed compared to the alternative.

[KevShmev]

I know Andy Reid's is everyone's favorite punching bag, but I can't put the injury to Mahomes on him.  We see 944 QB sneaks a year and injuries never happen.  That's about as fluky an injury as you will see.

[pg1067]

I know Andy Reid's is everyone's favorite punching bag, but I can't put the injury to Mahomes on him.  We see 944 QB sneaks a year and injuries never happen.  That's about as fluky an injury as you will see.

Agree.  I heard some rather hilarious discussion about this on Will Cain's ESPN radio show last week.  It culminated with someone making the mock argument that having a head cold might increase one's susceptibility to a torn ACL.

[El Barto]

I know Andy Reid's is everyone's favorite punching bag, but I can't put the injury to Mahomes on him.  We see 944 QB sneaks a year and injuries never happen.  That's about as fluky an injury as you will see.

Yeah, and I tried to find a way. 

[King Postwhore]

 

we'll see how you feel when he starts this week Kev.  LOL

[El Barto]

The league really has taken kind of a strange turn this year. When I pick games on Sunday morning I research most of them. When there's one that seems to me to be a no-brainer, a NE v Mia kind of thing, I check and if 90% or more Yahooers agree with me I call it a pick and move on. If it's 89-11 I investigate it, and I might even decide to go with the dog. Normally there might be 5/16 no-brainers. Eight would be a real convenience and I'd get done with my picks early. This year it's probably half the games. Nine this week, and the most competitive games are two 67-33 splits. Week after week of obvious picks. And yet, as we learned a couple of weeks ago, when you see an entire week of clear-cut, obvious wins, it's almost always a trap. You'd be hard-pressed to find good underdogs this week, yet six or seven of them will very likely win.

I'm honestly not quite sure what to make of it. I think Rodger's silly ass was right. There really does seem to be some parity in the league right now, and the Any Given Sunday adage is more accurate than ever.

[Rattlehead]

I agree, it's been harder to pick games this season - seems like there's been more upsets than usual. You're still kicking ass with your picks though, as usual Barto!

[Stadler]

Case in point:  how is this game 6-6 at half time?   This game makes the Pats/Jets look like the '58 Championship Game.  I LOVE a good defensive battle, but this ain't that.  This is like watching Pop Warner. 

[TAC]

Case in point:  how is this game 6-6 at half time?   This game makes the Pats/Jets look like the '58 Championship Game.  I LOVE a good defensive battle, but this ain't that.  This is like watching Pop Warner.

Um..that was keen.

[TAC]

Vikings just blew it wide open!

[Stadler]

Classy move by the Vikings fans acknowledging Adrian Peterson. 

[DragonAttack]

Going back a bit on Lamar Jackson.  He was the first in the SB era with over 200+ passing and 150+ rushing in a game.  He was the first ever with two straight 100+ yards rushing and a TD in two straight games.

I'm enjoying him for what he is.  Reminds me of Barry Sanders, when even a play that nets one yard might get me out of my seat.  I also see similarities as to when he gets tackled, where he doesn't take the full brunt of a hit.  Of course, one helmet to the knee such as what Robert Griffin suffered, and that can all change.  The two recent injuries to Mahomes are a case in point of the luck of the draw.

Last year and in the off season, I made these comparisons of QBs:

In spite of great coverage, Tom Brady can zip the ball into that one foot window for a completion
Patrick Mahomes can roll out and throw it off balance 40 yards downfield into that one foot window for a completion.
Lamar Jackson couldn't hit my picture window fifty percent of the time from ten yards out.

That's changed this year.  He's never going to be the 'elite' passer.  He doesn't have to be.  But he's improved dramatically, and took the team on his shoulders last week after his security blanket TE dropped three passes.   Opponent TOs certainly helped, the football gods smiled and kept Seattle's fumble in bounds (same as the Steeler OT fumble against the Ravens), and injuries actually helped Balto in forcing them to make some changes.  We don't need any more. 

I can see this team making the Super Bowl.  I can also see them going 9-7 in this fickle week to week league.

[TAC]

Classy move by the Vikings fans acknowledging Adrian Peterson.

Did they punch him in the nuts?

[max_security]

Going back a bit on Lamar Jackson.  He was the first in the SB era with over 200+ passing and 150+ rushing in a game.  He was the first ever with two straight 100+ yards rushing and a TD in two straight games.

I'm enjoying him for what he is.  Reminds me of Barry Sanders, when even a play that nets one yard might get me out of my seat.  I also see similarities as to when he gets tackled, where he doesn't take the full brunt of a hit.  Of course, one helmet to the knee such as what Robert Griffin suffered, and that can all change.  The two recent injuries to Mahomes are a case in point of the luck of the draw.

Last year and in the off season, I made these comparisons of QBs:

In spite of great coverage, Tom Brady can zip the ball into that one foot window for a completion
Patrick Mahomes can roll out and throw it off balance 40 yards downfield into that one foot window for a completion.
Lamar Jackson couldn't hit my picture window fifty percent of the time from ten yards out.

That's changed this year.  He's never going to be the 'elite' passer.  He doesn't have to be.  But he's improved dramatically, and took the team on his shoulders last week after his security blanket TE dropped three passes.   Opponent TOs certainly helped, the football gods smiled and kept Seattle's fumble in bounds (same as the Steeler OT fumble against the Ravens), and injuries actually helped Balto in forcing them to make some changes.  We don't need any more. 

I can see this team making the Super Bowl.  I can also see them going 9-7 in this fickle week to week league.

This season has gone better than most expected so far ( Ravens Fans ). They have made some huge improvements on defense , personnel and scheme that have made the difference recently. They have a tough road through the rest of the season so I don't know what to expect record wise. As long as they show up , like really show up ( that Browns game ) I'm good from a fan perspective.

How are those Eagles treating you bro ? Great fan base from what I hear ...

[Stadler]

Going back a bit on Lamar Jackson.  He was the first in the SB era with over 200+ passing and 150+ rushing in a game.  He was the first ever with two straight 100+ yards rushing and a TD in two straight games.

I'm enjoying him for what he is.  Reminds me of Barry Sanders, when even a play that nets one yard might get me out of my seat.  I also see similarities as to when he gets tackled, where he doesn't take the full brunt of a hit.  Of course, one helmet to the knee such as what Robert Griffin suffered, and that can all change.  The two recent injuries to Mahomes are a case in point of the luck of the draw.

Last year and in the off season, I made these comparisons of QBs:

In spite of great coverage, Tom Brady can zip the ball into that one foot window for a completion
Patrick Mahomes can roll out and throw it off balance 40 yards downfield into that one foot window for a completion.
Lamar Jackson couldn't hit my picture window fifty percent of the time from ten yards out.

That's changed this year.  He's never going to be the 'elite' passer.  He doesn't have to be.  But he's improved dramatically, and took the team on his shoulders last week after his security blanket TE dropped three passes.   Opponent TOs certainly helped, the football gods smiled and kept Seattle's fumble in bounds (same as the Steeler OT fumble against the Ravens), and injuries actually helped Balto in forcing them to make some changes.  We don't need any more. 

I can see this team making the Super Bowl.  I can also see them going 9-7 in this fickle week to week league.

I hope you take this in the spirit intended - objective football discussion - and not petty pissing on your parade, but enjoy him while you can.  History shows that's not a winning combination.  He's most often compared to Michael Vick, who, while an amazing athlete (I mean, once in a generation athlete) has zero Super Bowl wins to his credit, and will be a footnote in NFL history, for off the field tom-foolery.   He's often compared to Colin Kaepernick, who, while an amazing athlete, has zero Super Bowl wins to his credit, and will be a footnote in NFL history, for off the field shenanigans.  Other names that come up often:  Cam Newton, who, while a very good athlete, has zero Super Bowl wins to his credit, and will likely be a footnote in NFL history, for off the field balderdash.  The only one that gets mentioned in this conversation that defies this trend is Russell Wilson, and his "history" is not the same, in that he will rush when he has to, but recognizes that he doesn't have to more often than not (his season high is something like 850 yards, and his average per season is under 500). 

I can see the Ravens making a dent in the playoffs, but if they are going to rely on one guy for that kind of production to be the difference, they aren't getting past the Patriots, and they might not get past the Bills (though the other side of the ball may change that).  Even if "ANY GIVEN SUNDAY", they will still likely have to get by the Rams or the Saints, and I just don't see Wade Phillips getting beat by one guy like that (see Super Bowl 50).

Sorry, I'm impressed with Lamar Jackson as an athlete, not so much as a quarterback.

[jammindude]

Stadler touched on Wilson as being an outlier, and there are 2 **HUGE** reasons for that.   And they are most likely the reasons why Russell Wilson will become "among the greats" as time goes on.

1) The league favors those who keep their nose clean.   Yes, in certain instances, they will occasionally bury bad PR, but more often than not, they punish bad PR.  And they ALWAYS favor (and promote) the types of characters that make for good PR.   You can love or hate that fact, but it is fact. 

2) Moreso than any other QB in the league that I can think of, he is a passionate STUDENT of the game.  He has a reputation of constantly studying film, constantly studying plays, going far above and beyond any other player on the team (and indeed, most players in the entire league) to learn more about the game and how to beat the other team.   Passion combined with knowledge will grow into wisdom.   Wise players will usually have long and fruitful careers.   

Not sure how many of you guys heard.   But Wilson's headset cut out completely during the Browns game, so Wilson was forced to call his own play on the fly.   That was the pass play that resulted in a TD.    IMO, he doesn't have Peyton Manning's height or stature, but he does have Manning's wisdom of the game and how to play it.   

[KevShmev]

I don't want to get into comparing Wilson too soon to a top tier all-timer like Peyton, but the biggest difference, to me, between Wilson and those other QB's who were known for being running ones early in their career is that Wilson has always been a very good passer.  He came into the league as a good passer and has only gotten better.  I remember watching him as a rookie and thinking that he would scare the hell out of me if I was playing against him.  And every single time the Seahawks have played the Broncos since, Russell Wilson has been the player/thing I feared the most, even in Super Bowl 48.  As a longtime Broncos fan, he is in that list of QB's who I worried/worry about going into games (Marino, Montana, Young, Favre, Warner, Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Wilson, Mahomes).

[jammindude]

And to clarify, I don't think he will ever be in Manning territory, because his natural physical attributes give him some extra hurdles that Manning never had.   I was only comparing his smarts, and his "extra mile" work ethic....which will put him above most other QBs who only show up for camp, only study when they have to...etc...etc..

[KevShmev]

Yep, yep, I know what you mean, and I agree.  I feel that Wilson has been underrated for years, and I fear that those who give all of the credit for his one ring to the D and M Lynch will never give him the full credit he deserves until he wins another ring, which is unfair, but it is what it is. 

[TAC]

Yep, yep, I know what you mean, and I agree.  I feel that Wilson has been underrated for years, and I fear that those who give all of the credit for his one ring to the D and M Lynch will never give him the full credit he deserves until he wins another ring, which is unfair, but it is what it is.

Credit on whether a guy wins a ring or not has always been ridiculous to me.

[KevShmev]

Credit on whether a guy wins a ring or not has always been ridiculous to me.

I mostly agree. It always aggravated me that Elway was knocked for most of the latter half of his career because he had yet to win a ring.  Fortunately, he won two late that solidified his spot as an all-time great.  On the flip side, even though I think he is kind of an a-hole, I feel that Dan Marino gets shafted in "best QB's ever" conversations because he never won a ring. 

[Cool Chris]

I feel that Wilson has been underrated for years, and I fear that those who give all of the credit for his one ring to the D and M Lynch will never give him the full credit he deserves until he wins another ring, which is unfair, but it is what it is. 

Maybe nationally, but fans here in the PNW know what they have in Wilson, and have never underappreciated him and what he has meant to the franchise and the city.

[jammindude]

No one ever talks about great punters anymore.   But man, it sure is pretty freakin awesome when you have one. 

I've watched football for 40 years, and Dickson for Seattle is in the top 5 punters I've ever seen.   Most people will never hear about it, because the media never covers punters.   

I still remember Ray Guy from Oakland.   Jeff Feagles was another good one I remember...

[El Barto]

No one ever talks about great punters anymore.   But man, it sure is pretty freakin awesome when you have one. 

I've watched football for 40 years, and Dickson for Seattle is in the top 5 punters I've ever seen.   Most people will never hear about it, because the media never covers punters.   

I still remember Ray Guy from Oakland.   Jeff Feagles was another good one I remember...

At the NFL level the difference between a good punter and a great punter just isn't that great. Right now only 3 yards separate the top 15 punters in net average, and that has as much to do with the coverage unit as anything else. And since coffin corner kicks are out of style that's really what matters.