Your Controversial Opinions on DT

[BlobVanDam]

Through Her Eyes is an embarrassing stain on an otherwise amazing album.

I disliked Through Her Eyes for a long time, but it's not embarrassing in any way.

Lifting Shadows is gorgeous, The Silent Man is very nice too though rather overshadowed by the rest of the album.

The Silent Man is one of my favourites from Awake. I've always appreciated the shorter songs, and The Silent Man does it excellently.

[TheGreatPretender]

Through Her Eyes is an embarrassing stain on an otherwise amazing album.

That's just uncalled for. What if I said the same thing about Erotomania?

[Outcrier]

I don't find Through Her Eyes embarassing.... maybe the orgasm at the end 
But i always skip it.

[Crow]

Let's see. Through Her Eyes has the unnecessary and out of place female singer, very boring instrumentation aside from JP's guitar lead, awful lyrics, is so gratingly cheesy that I'm embarrassed when it comes on and there's someone else in the room, and just kind of makes me sick to my stomach in general. The only good trait it has is JP's guitar lead and the fact that it's pretty short.

So why is Erotomania so bad then? I legitimately am curious because I think it's one of their better instrumentals.

[Crow]

Like, honestly. What if someone gets the impression that DT is this awful cheesy soft-pop band because the first song they heard was Through Her Eyes? That song could /ruin lives/.

[Jaffa]

If they judge an entire band by the first song they hear, they probably weren't going to get into DT anyway. 

[Outcrier]

Many people find the majority of their discography cheesy anyway.

[TheGreatPretender]

I don't find Through Her Eyes embarassing.... maybe the orgasm at the end 
But i always skip it.

My orgasm usually comes in half way through the following song.... If you know what I'm getting at.

Like, honestly. What if someone gets the impression that DT is this awful cheesy soft-pop band because the first song they heard was The Silent Man? That song could /ruin lives/.

That works too. So would Another Day, Lifting Shadows, Hollow Years, Take Away My Pain for that matter. All great songs. If people don't like DT's softer side, they can go cuddle with Howard Stern.

[BlobVanDam]

Let's see. Through Her Eyes has the unnecessary and out of place female singer, very boring instrumentation aside from JP's guitar lead, awful lyrics, is so gratingly cheesy that I'm embarrassed when it comes on and there's someone else in the room, and just kind of makes me sick to my stomach in general. The only good trait it has is JP's guitar lead and the fact that it's pretty short.

So why is Erotomania so bad then? I legitimately am curious because I think it's one of their better instrumentals.

I like the female vocals on the album, along with the choir.  I love the variety of guest musicians they used to have.
And I don't find the instrumentation boring either. It's nice and simple and fitting for the song, and lets JLB's emotional vocals shine.
And what does it matter what other people think of what you're listening to?

[Outcrier]

There is no female singer in Though Her Eyes, i catch that Blob, nice ninja editing skillz 

[BlobVanDam]

There is no female singer in Though Her Eyes, i catch that Blob, nice ninja editing skillz 

I forgot about the intro!

[TheGreatPretender]

So why is Erotomania so bad then? I legitimately am curious because I think it's one of their better instrumentals.

Most of it is just uninteresting. The riffs are fairly bland, it only has a couple of catchy melodies and one of them is from The Silent Man, and by DT's standards, nothing technically impressive. But by far the worst part of it is that keyboard sound they used at the very beginning. I mean, maybe it's the sound itself, or maybe it's just the way it was mixed, but it's absolutely grating on the ears, and makes me skip the song pretty much every time. They just have a ton of other instrumentals that are so much better.

[Outcrier]

What i find seeing some IAW reviews:

"Learning To Love" is especially good."

"I hate Dream Theater. I like Images And Words."

 

[TheGreatPretender]

What i find seeing some IAW reviews:

"Learning To Love" is especially good."

Maybe it's a general statement? Like, I could say, "Dream Theater's self-titled album is fantastic. Also guys, learning to love is especially good. So go out there, learn to love and maybe then you can share this album with your loved one." 

[Zook]

I think we take music too seriously.

[GasparXR]

I think we take music too seriously.

[Ruba]

Space Dye-Vest has some nice moments, but for the most part, it's ruined by those annoying samples.

I consider Train of Thought a perfect album.

Aside from the overabundance of pointless samples in Honor Thy Father, I'd say it's a pretty damn consistently awesome album.

I think DT should use more samples, actually. Maybe it derives from my love to industrial music.

Six Degrees suffers because of the messy title-"track", which is a shame because the first disc includes only awesome songs.

FTFM, and I agree.

[?]

I think DT should use more samples, actually. Maybe it derives from my love for Kevin Moore's music.

FTFM and I agree.

[KevShmev]

I consider Train of Thought a perfect album.

The end of This Dying Soul, featuring the most pointless wankery in the band's recording history, strongly disagrees with you.

Like, honestly. What if someone gets the impression that DT is this awful cheesy soft-pop band because the first song they heard was Through Her Eyes? That song could /ruin lives/.

Yeah, it's better that someone hear Raw Dog or You Not Me first, rather than a gorgeous song like Through Her Eyes. 

[Lucien]

Honor Thy Father is probably my least favorite DT song.

[jakepriest]

Yeah, it's better that someone hear Raw Dog or You Not Me first, rather than a gorgeous song like Through Her Eyes. 

Wasn't there a guy who said he got into DT through YNM?

[XB0BX]

I got into DT through Prophets of War.

[Kilgore Trout]

The end of This Dying Soul, featuring the most pointless awesome wankery in the band's recording history, strongly disagrees with you.

Corrected.
There is no such thing as pointless wankery. There is wankery and not-wankery.

[Zook]

Yeah that wankery, and most wankery is awesome. Train of Thought is almost perfect, but As I Am's boring chorus brings it down.

Dream Theater's first 3 albums are perfect, as in there are no bad songs. Not taking into account the production values and Charlie. Falling Into Infinity has a few OK songs, but nothing cringeworthy. Scenes is perfect. Misunderstood certainly isn't my favorite track, but it's not bad. Same with Never Enough. Prophets of War is DT's worst song. Is it cringeworthy, nah, but it's really stupid. The Shattered Fortress and The Count and maybe wither are the only good songs on BCSL. ANTR has its moments but is too flawed. There is nothing wrong with ADTOE, But the only songs I ever go back to are BITS and BAI. DT12 is perfect.

[TheGreatPretender]

I think DT should use more samples, actually. Maybe it derives from my love to industrial music.

Maybe if they used them in a smart and musical way, I'd agree. But playing a bunch of clips from movies and TV shows over music for over a minute is just a waste of time. Like, a couple seconds is okay, the way it's done in Take The Time, ACOS, etc. But when it comes to Honor Thy Father or Space-Dye Vest, it totally ruins them for me. Luckily, Honor Thy Father has a moment where I can perfectly edit that part out and still have a smooth and seamless transition. But doing that in Space-Dye Vest, I lost a lot of the cool piano melodies.

By the way, I listen to a decent amount of industrial music, and I've never heard samples being used like THAT. Usually, they're either like, one line repeating in rhythm with the song. Which, again, is a musical way of doing that, and works a lot better.

[Zook]

I think DT should use more samples, actually. Maybe it derives from my love to industrial music.

Maybe if they used them in a smart and musical way, I'd agree. But playing a bunch of clips from movies and TV shows over music for over a minute is just a waste of time. Like, a couple seconds is okay, the way it's done in Take The Time, ACOS, etc. But when it comes to Honor Thy Father or Space-Dye Vest, it totally ruins them for me. Luckily, Honor Thy Father has a moment where I can perfectly edit that part out and still have a smooth and seamless transition. But doing that in Space-Dye Vest, I lost a lot of the cool piano melodies.

By the way, I listen to a decent amount of industrial music, and I've never heard samples being used like THAT. Usually, they're either like, one line repeating in rhythm with the song. Which, again, is a musical way of doing that, and works a lot better.

The samples in HTF match the lyrical content, plus the music underneath is awesome.

Also, where do you cut it at? Not that I need to, but I just want to hear what it sounds like. So far I can't find a decent spot for a cut without some bleeding. haha get it?

[TheGreatPretender]

The samples in HTF match the lyrical content, plus the music underneath is awesome.

Yes, I understand that it matches the lyrical content, but the way it's integrated, it's just rolling the clips, or worse, whole long, drawn out scenes from the movies. It just drags for so long, and I just don't want to hear actors from movies bitching and moaning for that long, when I'm listening to music. If I did, I'd watch the actual movie.

Also, where do you cut it at? Not that I need to, but I just want to hear what it sounds like. So far I can't find a decent spot for a cut without some bleeding. haha get it?

I cut it at 5:16, basically after "Don't cross the crooked step" it has that badass riff playing, so then it plays out twice and right then, I basically cut it to the keyboard solo that comes on right after the samples are done. It actually works really well, and those unfamiliar with the song wouldn't even realize there's been an edit. So I'm happy I can at least do that with it. But like I said, with Space-Dye Vest, it loses a lot of awesome piano melodies when I do that.

[Zook]

The samples in HTF match the lyrical content, plus the music underneath is awesome.

Yes, I understand that it matches the lyrical content, but the way it's integrated, it's just rolling the clips, or worse, whole long, drawn out scenes from the movies. It just drags for so long, and I just don't want to hear actors from movies bitching and moaning for that long, when I'm listening to music. If I did, I'd watch the actual movie.

Also, where do you cut it at? Not that I need to, but I just want to hear what it sounds like. So far I can't find a decent spot for a cut without some bleeding. haha get it?

I cut it at 5:16, basically after "Don't cross the crooked step" it has that badass riff playing, so then it plays out twice and right then, I basically cut it to the keyboard solo that comes on right after the samples are done. It actually works really well, and those unfamiliar with the song wouldn't even realize there's been an edit. So I'm happy I can at least do that with it. But like I said, with Space-Dye Vest, it loses a lot of awesome piano melodies when I do that.

Nah man, those samples make that section more intense.

I thought that's where the edit would be, but like I said, there's some sample bleeding. Cutting off the first stanza or whatever makes it doable, but it just sounds jarring to me.

[TheGreatPretender]

Nah man, those samples make that section more intense.

Absolutely not for me. It just kills the pacing of the song and bores me to tears. I mean, like I said, maybe for a small amount of time, it's okay, but as long as it actually goes on in the song is just agonizing. "The god damn regreeeet!"
It really sounds like MP really connected to the movies and felt like those scenes reflected his feelings, and by including as much of them as he did, he'd drive the point home, but personally, I had never actually seen those movies, and those samples mean absolutely nothing to me, and the actual lyrics of the song do a great job of expressing how he must have felt. In fact, it's the ONLY part of Train of Thought that I'd say is boring and hinders the album. If that part wasn't in it, if they just had the actual riff build up, or maybe a guitar solo in its place, or even if it was just shorter, I would honestly say that ToT was one of their most consistently awesome albums, easily on par with Images and Words. But that part, and being right in the middle of the album as it is, just kills the song for me.

I thought that's where the edit would be, but like I said, there's some sample bleeding. Cutting off the first stanza or whatever makes it doable, but it just sounds jarring to me.

If there's any sample bleeding, then it's like, a tiny fraction of a second, and it's barely noticeable. Works for me, anyway. Here's a snippet of my edit:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/tpu5vdyjx8qbldo/Honor%20Thy%20Father%20Edit.mp3

[WheyWaffles]

Controversial opinion: Mike Mangini often looks fat when drumming live.  I think it's the facial expressions forcing some bizarre pseudo-double-chin effect.

[Zook]

Nah man, those samples make that section more intense.

Absolutely not for me. It just kills the pacing of the song and bores me to tears. I mean, like I said, maybe for a small amount of time, it's okay, but as long as it actually goes on in the song is just agonizing. "The god damn regreeeet!"
It really sounds like MP really connected to the movies and felt like those scenes reflected his feelings, and by including as much of them as he did, he'd drive the point home, but personally, I had never actually seen those movies, and those samples mean absolutely nothing to me, and the actual lyrics of the song do a great job of expressing how he must have felt. In fact, it's the ONLY part of Train of Thought that I'd say is boring and hinders the album. If that part wasn't in it, if they just had the actual riff build up, or maybe a guitar solo in its place, or even if it was just shorter, I would honestly say that ToT was one of their most consistently awesome albums, easily on par with Images and Words. But that part, and being right in the middle of the album as it is, just kills the song for me.

I thought that's where the edit would be, but like I said, there's some sample bleeding. Cutting off the first stanza or whatever makes it doable, but it just sounds jarring to me.

If there's any sample bleeding, then it's like, a tiny fraction of a second, and it's barely noticeable. Works for me, anyway. Here's a snippet of my edit:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/tpu5vdyjx8qbldo/Honor%20Thy%20Father%20Edit.mp3

I'm picky (and a perfectionist) so that edit wouldn't work for me. I haven't seen any of the movies the samples are from either, but I don't think it really matters. To each their own.

I do agree about the samples in SDV. Some of them don't even make sense.

[Zook]

Controversial opinion: Mike Mangini often looks fat when drumming live.  I think it's the facial expressions forcing some bizarre pseudo-double-chin effect.

[WheyWaffles]

Sometimes I think Mike Romeo is back there drumming...

[Grizz]

MM and DS are like real life Ren and Stimpy characters with their facial expressions.

[Ruba]

I think DT should use more samples, actually. Maybe it derives from my love to industrial music.

Maybe if they used them in a smart and musical way, I'd agree. But playing a bunch of clips from movies and TV shows over music for over a minute is just a waste of time. Like, a couple seconds is okay, the way it's done in Take The Time, ACOS, etc. But when it comes to Honor Thy Father or Space-Dye Vest, it totally ruins them for me. Luckily, Honor Thy Father has a moment where I can perfectly edit that part out and still have a smooth and seamless transition. But doing that in Space-Dye Vest, I lost a lot of the cool piano melodies.

By the way, I listen to a decent amount of industrial music, and I've never heard samples being used like THAT. Usually, they're either like, one line repeating in rhythm with the song. Which, again, is a musical way of doing that, and works a lot better.

I see. But I don't have any problems with samples on Space-Dye Vest and HTF, and the sections they are featured in would be more boring without them.