Your Controversial Opinions on DT

[JediKnight1969]

After listening to DT12, I'm scared of DT, becoming Toto on steroids. Way too much precision and a clear desire to become mainstream. IMHO.

[BlobVanDam]

After listening to DT12, I'm scared of DT, becoming Toto on steroids. Way too much precision and a clear desire to become mainstream. IMHO.

There's nothing wrong with Toto, my friend! I actually prefer Toto's self titled to DT's self titled.

But this is DT. I don't think there's any chance of them going mainstream. DT12's song lengths are overall shorter, but they're no more mainstream at all. And 2 instrumentals, and a 20 minute song are about as far from mainstream as you can get.
DT have always had an accessibility to their music. We probably wouldn't be here today discussing this if PMU wasn't a hit for them all the way back on their second album.

[Sycsa]

DT is, and has always been, the most mainstream music that I listen to. I don't think you can go much more mainstream in this genre.

[Whatsername]

There's nothing wrong with Toto, my friend! I actually prefer Toto's self titled to DT's self titled.

But this is DT. I don't think there's any chance of them going mainstream. DT12's song lengths are overall shorter, but they're no more mainstream at all. And 2 instrumentals, and a 20 minute song are about as far from mainstream as you can get.
DT have always had an accessibility to their music. We probably wouldn't be here today discussing this if PMU wasn't a hit for them all the way back on their second album.

This. The song-lengths being shorter aren't a bad thing at all. Images And Words and Awake both are comprised of shorter songs, and I doubt anyone would say those albums were excessively mainstream.

[Viking of the Sagas]

The difference is that I&W actually had very touching and genuine progressions all around the place, whereas DT12 has them only at one or two places and is often filled with cliched choruses and (in my opinion) uninteresting progressions.

[King Postwhore]

After listening to DT12, I'm scared of DT, becoming Toto on steroids. Way too much precision and a clear desire to become mainstream. IMHO.

Dude?!

There is no way DT becomes that popular.  They will never be mainstream.  And to chime in what Blob said, What's wrong with Toto.  Falling In Between is a killer album.

[Lucidity]

The difference is that I&W actually had very touching and genuine progressions all around the place, whereas DT12 has them only at one or two places and is often filled with cliched choruses and (in my opinion) uninteresting progressions.

I agree. Images pushed so many musical boundaries and defied so many musical conventions, and I feel like DT12 is almost the opposite. It's like Octavarium without all the amazing parts.

[Zook]

Circus Maximus - The 1st Chapter > Octavarium
CM - Isolate > Systematic Chaos
CM - Nine > BCSL, ADTOE, DT

[JediKnight1969]

The difference is that I&W actually had very touching and genuine progressions all around the place, whereas DT12 has them only at one or two places and is often filled with cliched choruses and (in my opinion) uninteresting progressions.

I agree. Images pushed so many musical boundaries and defied so many musical conventions, and I feel like DT12 is almost the opposite. It's like Octavarium without all the amazing parts.

This. Sadly.

[Polarbear]

The difference is that I&W actually had very touching and genuine progressions all around the place, whereas DT12 has them only at one or two places and is often filled with cliched choruses and (in my opinion) uninteresting progressions.

I agree. Images pushed so many musical boundaries and defied so many musical conventions, and I feel like DT12 is almost the opposite. It's like Octavarium without all the amazing parts.

In 2005 Dream theater showed us that they could do an album comprised mostly of awesome shorter songs with Octavarium. I hoped DT12 would be the same case but i was disappointed sadly.

There's nothing wrong with Toto, my friend! I actually prefer Toto's self titled to DT's self titled.

Toto is just awesome, one of the best bands ever! Steve Lukathers solo stuff is also excelent

[Zantera]

>DT hasn't made a really good album since 6DOIT for me.

-Despite this, I could still customize and make my own great DT-album with one or two songs from each album since 6DOIT.

>6DOIT is the best DT-epic.

>I&W is a great album, but not as good as SFAM, 6DOIT or Awake.

>Falling to Infinity is mostly really nice, and while it has some meh-songs, it's more consistent than recent albums.

>ToT is not as bad as some people say, in fact it's probably my favorite post 6DOIT-album.

>Disappear is my favorite DT-song.

[Nearmyth]

I like the ambience in The Embracing Circle better than the orchestra. Slightly.

Also, I feel like IT should have one more part after Live Kill Die, akin to Carpe Diem from ACOS, or Medicate from 8VM. I think it would make the reflection or the climax at the end more meaningful, in other words it would have a better build up. Take this opinion with a grain of salt though (never thought I would say that), it takes me a little while to accept the epic for what they are.

[gmillerdrake]

Latest controversial thought:
  The lyrics to "The Looking Glass" are directed at/inspired by one Mr. Mike Portnoy. They just 'fit' his whole scenario perfectly.

[Daybreak at the lake]

Here's one:

Jordan Rudess should play piano 90% of the time. His synth stuff is very hit or miss, but every time he plays piano it's amazing.

[BlobVanDam]

Here's one:

Jordan Rudess should play piano 90% of the time. His synth stuff is very hit or miss, but every time he plays piano it's amazing.

Nothing more creative and prog than sticking to one plain ol' instrument!

Terrible idea. JR's strength is adding atmosphere and a unique feel to DT. I think it would a tragedy to think he should be limited to one instrument the majority of the time. A piano won't even fit with the music that often, and it would sound very samey.

Latest controversial thought:
  The lyrics to "The Looking Glass" are directed at/inspired by one Mr. Mike Portnoy. They just 'fit' his whole scenario perfectly.

That's the thing with vague lyrics. You can basically fit them to whatever you want, no matter how wrong. People said the same thing about lyrics on ADTOE too.

[Dark Castle]

Jordan should tinker around with a Harpsichord.

[gmillerdrake]

Latest controversial thought:
  The lyrics to "The Looking Glass" are directed at/inspired by one Mr. Mike Portnoy. They just 'fit' his whole scenario perfectly.

That's the thing with vague lyrics. You can basically fit them to whatever you want, no matter how wrong. People said the same thing about lyrics on ADTOE too.

Yeah, and I'll be honest....I may be looking for the connection. I USED to hold MP in very high regard for all the effort he put into satisfying the DT fans and being the 'leader' of DT. I probably put him on a pedestal he didn't deserve to be on....he's a flawed human being like the rest of us.
   But, the way he handled the split and the things he said in the months afterward.....the whole turning himself into the victim at every chance he could and a host of other comments and actions really put a sour taste in my mouth with anything concerning MP.
   I still buy Transatlantic and Neal Morse albums because the music is fantastic...heck I even bought The Winery Dogs......but I can safely say I don't think I'm a fan of him as a person any longer. Not that he should care about that or as if that is something anyone should care about. But to me....after essentially idolizing the guy since I was 16 it's been tough to see someone I used to hold in such high regard be a total D-Bag and selfish person and I guess I'm just waiting for one of the DT guys to call him out in it.
  But they've already shown who out of the two 'sides' has the class....and who doesn't.

[BlobVanDam]

Jordan should tinker around with a Harpsichord.

That would rock. JR playing neoclassical unisons with JP on a mandolin or acoustic.

[Daybreak at the lake]

Here's one:

Jordan Rudess should play piano 90% of the time. His synth stuff is very hit or miss, but every time he plays piano it's amazing.

Nothing more creative and prog than sticking to one plain ol' instrument!

Terrible idea. JR's strength is adding atmosphere and a unique feel to DT. I think it would a tragedy to think he should be limited to one instrument the majority of the time. A piano won't even fit with the music that often, and it would sound very samey.

Better than him sticking to the same circus patch and moog sounds. And I disagree with JR's main strength being atmosphere. I think that was KM's thing. Rudess's piano work on Scenes and even parts of ADTOE are some of the best stuff he's done.

[theseoafs]

circus patch

I vote that using the word "circus" should be a bannable offense around these parts.  It doesn't even have any meaning anymore.

[BlobVanDam]

Here's one:

Jordan Rudess should play piano 90% of the time. His synth stuff is very hit or miss, but every time he plays piano it's amazing.

Nothing more creative and prog than sticking to one plain ol' instrument!

Terrible idea. JR's strength is adding atmosphere and a unique feel to DT. I think it would a tragedy to think he should be limited to one instrument the majority of the time. A piano won't even fit with the music that often, and it would sound very samey.

Better than him sticking to the same circus patch and moog sounds. And I disagree with JR's main strength being atmosphere. I think that was KM's thing. Rudess's piano work on Scenes and even parts of ADTOE are some of the best stuff he's done.

JR barely uses a "circus patch". That's a generic JR criticism blown way out of proportion. The 5 seconds on TEI is the first time he's used something like that in a while from what I recall.
KM stuck to the same 3 sounds of his old keyboard, so there's only so much atmosphere you can get with synth strings + studio reverb. The atmosphere of Awake is mostly on the producer as far as I'm concerned.

Now listen to SDOIT (the album). The atmosphere JR creates on that blows the hell out of anything KM achieved with DT.

circus patch

I vote that using the word "circus" should be a bannable offense around these parts.  It doesn't even have any meaning anymore.

Can we throw in "cookie monster" too? It seems like both terms have been completely watered down to meaningless by haters.

[Daybreak at the lake]

Here's one:

Jordan Rudess should play piano 90% of the time. His synth stuff is very hit or miss, but every time he plays piano it's amazing.

Nothing more creative and prog than sticking to one plain ol' instrument!

Terrible idea. JR's strength is adding atmosphere and a unique feel to DT. I think it would a tragedy to think he should be limited to one instrument the majority of the time. A piano won't even fit with the music that often, and it would sound very samey.

Better than him sticking to the same circus patch and moog sounds. And I disagree with JR's main strength being atmosphere. I think that was KM's thing. Rudess's piano work on Scenes and even parts of ADTOE are some of the best stuff he's done.

JR barely uses a "circus patch". That's a generic JR criticism blown way out of proportion. The 5 seconds on TEI is the first time he's used something like that in a while from what I recall.
KM stuck to the same 3 sounds of his old keyboard, so there's only so much atmosphere you can get with synth strings + studio reverb. The atmosphere of Awake is mostly on the producer as far as I'm concerned.

Now listen to SDOIT (the album). The atmosphere JR creates on that blows the hell out of anything KM achieved with DT.

circus patch

I vote that using the word "circus" should be a bannable offense around these parts.  It doesn't even have any meaning anymore.

Can we throw in "cookie monster" too? It seems like both terms have been completely watered down to meaningless by haters.

So I guess my opinion is controversial. Maybe you should relax a bit. Jordan Rudess has used a lot of the circusy sounding patches in the last few albums. Personally I prefer his piano stuff. It's not that big of a deal.

[Jaffa]

Man, if I was at a circus and they started playing Jordan Rudess keyboard soloes, that would be basically the best thing ever.

[Lucidity]

Man, if I was at a circus and they started playing Jordan Rudess keyboard soloes, that would be basically the best thing ever.

 

[BlobVanDam]

Man, if I was at a circus and they started playing Jordan Rudess keyboard soloes, that would be basically the best thing ever.

Just wait until the clown comes out on a unicycle and starts riding the frayed tight rope!

[DebraKadabra]

Jordan should tinker around with a Harpsichord.

That would rock. JR playing neoclassical unisons with JP on a mandolin or acoustic.

That would be extremely radular indeed.

[Nel]

There's nothing wrong with Toto, my friend! I actually prefer Toto's self titled to DT's self titled.

  Angela is an absolutely great closer.

[adastra]

Enigma Machine is kinda bad... easily their worst instr.
I wish I will never hear anything like this on DT record anymore :3

[Implode]

Man, if I was at a circus and they started playing Jordan Rudess keyboard soloes, that would be basically the best thing ever.

What Circus/Carnival are you people going to that plays anything like the so called "circus parts" in [DT]'s songs?

Yeah, I hate when I visit the local circus and all they fucking play is[DT].

Fixed for this thread.

[?]

Enigma Machine is kinda bad... easily their worst instr.
I wish I will never hear anything like this on DT record anymore :3

I'm not the biggest fan of Enigma Machine, but I think it beats Raw Dog easily. That's not a huge achievement though

Talking about the new album...

Impermanent Resonance > DT12
Illumination Theory is my 6th favorite song on DT12

[adastra]

Enigma Machine is kinda bad... easily their worst instr.
I wish I will never hear anything like this on DT record anymore :3

I'm not the biggest fan of Enigma Machine, but I think it beats Raw Dog easily. That's not a huge achievement though

Talking about the new album...

Impermanent Resonance > DT12
Illumination Theory is my 6th favorite song on DT12

6th favourite!!?! C'mon Ville, You crazy POHOJALAANEN! 

[?]

It has some great parts, but also some uninteresting bits and the way it has been put together isn't very good.

Also, I don't know if I can call myself a pohojalaanen because I was born in Turku

[adastra]

It has some great parts, but also some uninteresting bits and the way it has been put together isn't very good.

Also, I don't know if I can call myself a pohojalaanen because I was born in Turku

yeah same here,  I'm originally from Rovaniemi. 
But I can agree about that with IT  .. It is pretty strangely put together..   I think that there might be a little too much soloing before the outro.

[Ruba]

Here's one:

Jordan Rudess. every time he plays piano it's amazing.

 

Free by OSI >>>>>>>>>> Octavarium

[?]

Free by OSI >>>>>>>>>> Octavarium

I don't know how you can compare these 2 albums, but