Game of Thrones (TV, fantasy) Thread

[Genowyn]

Stannis you're supposed to be the Mannis.

That wasn't very Mannis of you at all.

Book readers who read Westeros.org or keep up on their theories elsewhere:

Isn't there a problem here? Mirri Maz Duur's prophecy should have come true by now. No Sun setting in the east (Quentyn) no Mountains blowing like leaves (Pyramids of Meereen destroyed), no dry seas (though this sign shows up after she leaves). If Dany's period comes next episode like it's supposed to thing's will be really confusing.

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

Awesome episode once again!!

[BlackInk]

When I realized Dany was going to ride Drogon I cried. Just like I knew the White Walkers would show up last week, I was unfortunatelly spoiled about Drogon showing up, having seen some awesome fan art. But I had no idea she was going to ride him, that was amazing. Just like last week, the episode delivered big for me even though I knew about some stuff.

And yeah, the Shireen scene was horrifying. I actually had to turn the volume down, I couldn't stand hearing those screams at full volume. Definetely one of the most powerful moments of the show.

I agree with what someone posted on the previous page, the Dorne stuff this week was the best yet.

There is one more event I'm spoiled on, and it's pretty clear it'll happen next week. I fucking hate having things spoiled for me. Hopefully that won't happen with next season, unless Winds of Winter actually does come out before season 6.

[BlackInk]

I'm also a little taken by how weak the dragon is, this is the creature that fought in the Targaryen conquest wars against Westerosi armies?

Balerion was, fully grown, so large that he could swallow a horse whole. Yeah, Dany's dragons are still just barely teenagers.

[Genowyn]

There's a lot of stuff I really hope happens next episode. Spoilers ahead:

Sam and Gilly need to be sent south to Oldtown. This may be the first thing that happens?
Arya's 'Mercy' chapter and Ser Meryn's death.
Dany gets her period and is found by Khal Jhaqo.
Maybe Sansa and Theon will escape Winterfell? It would have made more sense if this had happened before Davos left, since...
The letter that Davos is to bring to the wall will arrive, it will be the "Pink Letter". Jon may also find out about Sansa somehow.
Cersei's walk of shame and letter to Jaime.
Doran: ""Vengeance." His voice was soft, as if he were afraid that someone might be listening. "Justice." Prince Doran pressed the onyx dragon into her palm with his swollen, gouty fingers, and whispered, "Fire and blood."" IF HE DOES NOT SAY THESE EXACT WORDS OH MY GOD. Also hopefully this will also relate to Trystane being revealed as (f)Aegon. If this happens all the nonsense in Dorne will be worthwhile so PLEASE.
Jaime gets the letter, possibly he has already found out about Doran's plans and is on board, burns the letter.
Arya perhaps gets kicked out of the House of Black and White for not doing what she's told.
Jon gets stabbed, hopefully it shows the signs needed for AA Reborn. It either ends here or...
LADY STONEHEART?! Not counting on it, but it would be lovely.

[faizoff]

There is one more event I'm spoiled on, and it's pretty clear it'll happen next week. I fucking hate having things spoiled for me.

I think I have 2 things spoiled for me which haven't happened yet so it might be there for the finale, I'm not sure. But yeah I hate it as well.

[Progmetty]

I'm also a little taken by how weak the dragon is, this is the creature that fought in the Targaryen conquest wars against Westerosi armies? is it me or did he look like he was about to die after 4 spears?

These dragons are still young.  The ones used in the Targaryen conquest were much older, much larger, and much more powerful.
[/quote]

Balerion was, fully grown, so large that he could swallow a horse whole. Yeah, Dany's dragons are still just barely teenagers.

Thanks for clarifing fellas, I was under the impression that they're done growing. If they're gonna get bigger then it's probably a bad idea to keep them in that dungeon I think

Stannis you're supposed to be the Mannis.

That wasn't very Mannis of you at all.

I keep reading remarks like that on Facebook about how people are disappointed in Stannis and I don't get what ELSE could he have done? Can't go forward, can't go back, they're all gonna die in the cold, there's one thing that had worked before and there are no other ways..

When I realized Dany was going to ride Drogon I cried. Just like I knew the White Walkers would show up last week, I was unfortunatelly spoiled about Drogon showing up, having seen some awesome fan art.

Would you share the fan art links?

[BlackInk]

This was the image I had seen before:

[faizoff]

That's an amazing piece.

[gmillerdrake]

I keep reading remarks like that on Facebook about how people are disappointed in Stannis and I don't get what ELSE could he have done? Can't go forward, can't go back, they're all gonna die in the cold, there's one thing that had worked before and there are no other ways..

Yeah...I mean, it wasn't terribly difficult to determine given the foreshadowing and amount of time they spent building the Stannis/Shireen relationship this season that he was going to sacrifice her. That wasn't a huge shock as far as surprise....it was just like 'wow...he actually did it!?'

[Genowyn]

It's just upsetting how the show insists on trying to turn Stannis into a bad guy. Make sure we play scary music whenever Stannis is on screen guys!

In the books, Stannis leaves Mel, Selyse, and Shireen at the wall. It has been implied that Shireen would have met the same fate in the books, though it has yet to happen. The main difference is that when it happens in the books, it will almost definitely be behind Stannis' back.

It has been described as "Character Assassination" and I don't disagree. In the books, Stannis the Mannis is frankly the best person to end up on the Iron Throne (if the Seven Kingdoms even continue to exist in their current form when all's over which seems...unlikely). In the show they insist on making him a bad guy. IMO, that scene was up there with Sansa's rape as far as being one of the worst changes made to a character for the show. This season has been so bad and only if (almost) every single point I mentioned in my earlier post is met will I consider it successful.

[Genowyn]

“Half my army is made up of unbelievers,” Stannis had replied. “I will have no burnings. Pray harder.”

Remember the real Stannis.

Stannis the Mannis.

[Evermind]

It's just upsetting how the show insists on trying to turn Stannis into a bad guy. Make sure we play scary music whenever Stannis is on screen guys!

In the books, Stannis leaves Mel, Selyse, and Shireen at the wall. It has been implied that Shireen would have met the same fate in the books, though it has yet to happen. The main difference is that when it happens in the books, it will almost definitely be behind Stannis' back.

It has been described as "Character Assassination" and I don't disagree. In the books, Stannis the Mannis is frankly the best person to end up on the Iron Throne (if the Seven Kingdoms even continue to exist in their current form when all's over which seems...unlikely). In the show they insist on making him a bad guy. IMO, that scene was up there with Sansa's rape as far as being one of the worst changes made to a character for the show.

I agree with all of this. I was going to post another huge rant post about that scene, but I kind of settled on the thought show!Stannis and book!Stannis are just two different characters, so it's alright. The scene itself was well-acted though.

Anyway, I'm kind of pissed off that Ramsay and his Twenty Good Men™ were able to stealthily infiltrate the camp of one of the best military commanders of Westeros, simultaneously lighted more than ten fires at once which started burning intensely in a few seconds in a snowfall, burned all of the supplies and siege engines and also a hundred horses, and then were able to escape unnoticed.

Anyway, I thought it was a good episode. Middle of the pack for this season and certainly a significant drop in quality after Hardhome, but not too bad.


Edit:

“Half my army is made up of unbelievers,” Stannis had replied. “I will have no burnings. Pray harder.”

Remember the real Stannis.

Stannis the Mannis.

There's also this:

The knight hesitated. "Your Grace, if you are dead..."
"...you will avenge my death, and seat my daughter on the Iron Throne. Or die in the attempt."

- Stannis

[cramx3]

There's a lot of stuff I really hope happens next episode. Spoilers ahead:

Sam and Gilly need to be sent south to Oldtown. This may be the first thing that happens?
Arya's 'Mercy' chapter and Ser Meryn's death.
Dany gets her period and is found by Khal Jhaqo.
Maybe Sansa and Theon will escape Winterfell? It would have made more sense if this had happened before Davos left, since...
The letter that Davos is to bring to the wall will arrive, it will be the "Pink Letter". Jon may also find out about Sansa somehow.
Cersei's walk of shame and letter to Jaime.
Doran: ""Vengeance." His voice was soft, as if he were afraid that someone might be listening. "Justice." Prince Doran pressed the onyx dragon into her palm with his swollen, gouty fingers, and whispered, "Fire and blood."" IF HE DOES NOT SAY THESE EXACT WORDS OH MY GOD. Also hopefully this will also relate to Trystane being revealed as (f)Aegon. If this happens all the nonsense in Dorne will be worthwhile so PLEASE.
Jaime gets the letter, possibly he has already found out about Doran's plans and is on board, burns the letter.
Arya perhaps gets kicked out of the House of Black and White for not doing what she's told.
Jon gets stabbed, hopefully it shows the signs needed for AA Reborn. It either ends here or...
LADY STONEHEART?! Not counting on it, but it would be lovely.

I will add to this:

Varys showing back up in Kings Landing with a dead Pycelle and Kevan?  I am hoping for a dead Tommen too
Brienne and Pod are going to play a role somewhere with Sansa, maybe help her escape or maybe Brienne attacks Stannis?  Potentially kills him and Melissandre's kiss bring to life Jon instead of Stannis?  Shireens burn give Jon life?
Maybe the R+L=J reveal? It's been hinted at a lot this season, maybe somehow it comes out
None of the above is in the books besides Varys killing Pycelle and Kevan, but I can guess

[Genowyn]

There's a lot of stuff I really hope happens next episode. Spoilers ahead:

Sam and Gilly need to be sent south to Oldtown. This may be the first thing that happens?
Arya's 'Mercy' chapter and Ser Meryn's death.
Dany gets her period and is found by Khal Jhaqo.
Maybe Sansa and Theon will escape Winterfell? It would have made more sense if this had happened before Davos left, since...
The letter that Davos is to bring to the wall will arrive, it will be the "Pink Letter". Jon may also find out about Sansa somehow.
Cersei's walk of shame and letter to Jaime.
Doran: ""Vengeance." His voice was soft, as if he were afraid that someone might be listening. "Justice." Prince Doran pressed the onyx dragon into her palm with his swollen, gouty fingers, and whispered, "Fire and blood."" IF HE DOES NOT SAY THESE EXACT WORDS OH MY GOD. Also hopefully this will also relate to Trystane being revealed as (f)Aegon. If this happens all the nonsense in Dorne will be worthwhile so PLEASE.
Jaime gets the letter, possibly he has already found out about Doran's plans and is on board, burns the letter.
Arya perhaps gets kicked out of the House of Black and White for not doing what she's told.
Jon gets stabbed, hopefully it shows the signs needed for AA Reborn. It either ends here or...
LADY STONEHEART?! Not counting on it, but it would be lovely.

I will add to this:


Maybe the R+L=J reveal? It's been hinted at a lot this season, maybe somehow it comes out

Meant to include this, too.

[Tanatra]

I'm also a little taken by how weak the dragon is, this is the creature that fought in the Targaryen conquest wars against Westerosi armies?

Balerion was, fully grown, so large that he could swallow a horse whole. Yeah, Dany's dragons are still just barely teenagers.

In addition, by showing that Drogon wasn't invincible, it adds tension to the scene. It also evokes Dany's 'motherly instinct' so she would climb up on his back and fly him (and her) to safety.

Anywho, outstanding episode with symbolism and foreshadowing in almost all scenes. I loved how the director used the lighting to emphasize Shireen's gray scale, highlighting Stannis' acceptance that the realm will never rally behind a princess with her affliction. I think that scene along with Sansa's rape shows the writers are trying a tad too hard to incite controversy, but hey, any publicity is good publicity.

And damn, about 99% of the book material is covered now. They even used material from WoW preview chapters for this episode. As a whole I believe D&D (the exec producers) have done a phenomenal job of turning over 1600 pages (two whole books) of an author getting lost in world-building and character development into one of the best shows on TV. They'll be playing the final two seasons by ear, but I'm really looking forward to next year.

There's a lot of stuff I really hope happens next episode. Spoilers ahead:

Sam and Gilly need to be sent south to Oldtown. This may be the first thing that happens?
Arya's 'Mercy' chapter and Ser Meryn's death.
Dany gets her period and is found by Khal Jhaqo.
Maybe Sansa and Theon will escape Winterfell? It would have made more sense if this had happened before Davos left, since...
The letter that Davos is to bring to the wall will arrive, it will be the "Pink Letter". Jon may also find out about Sansa somehow.
Cersei's walk of shame and letter to Jaime.
Doran: ""Vengeance." His voice was soft, as if he were afraid that someone might be listening. "Justice." Prince Doran pressed the onyx dragon into her palm with his swollen, gouty fingers, and whispered, "Fire and blood."" IF HE DOES NOT SAY THESE EXACT WORDS OH MY GOD. Also hopefully this will also relate to Trystane being revealed as (f)Aegon. If this happens all the nonsense in Dorne will be worthwhile so PLEASE.
Jaime gets the letter, possibly he has already found out about Doran's plans and is on board, burns the letter.
Arya perhaps gets kicked out of the House of Black and White for not doing what she's told.
Jon gets stabbed, hopefully it shows the signs needed for AA Reborn. It either ends here or...
LADY STONEHEART?! Not counting on it, but it would be lovely.

I will add to this:


Maybe the R+L=J reveal? It's been hinted at a lot this season, maybe somehow it comes out

Meant to include this, too.

Some minor comments on both your theories (i.e., spamming my own):

I don't think R+L=J will be revealed until the final season.

Jon getting stabbed would be the perfect way to close out this season. More people love Jon Snow's character than Dany's IMO.

Lady Stoneheart would make a great "oh shit!" end of episode moment in the future, but D&D are really playing that close to their chest.

There is a very obvious replacement for the Bloody Flux next season, and Tyrion will be the Steward of Mereen while Dany is out on the Dothraki sea; whoop whoop! His political maneuvering was my favorite story arc in Season 2.

My only concern is that they're probably going to stretch out Stannis' campaign to Winterfell over the entire next season. I don't think there is going to be a battle in Mereen - D&D want to wrap up the episode in 7 seasons despite the protests of execs @ HBO. If that is indeed what transpires, they'll need to spend the remaining two seasons getting Danaerys to Westeros.

[faizoff]

There's much talk of how episode 9 is always the shocker or most important episode of the season, I think last season episode 10 was more eventful than 9 and I get the feeling it's going to be the same this season as well.

[BlackInk]

Given that I'm a massive White Walker nerd, I think it'll be hard to top 'Hardhome' this season.

Also, something I forgot to mention in my initial episode reaction post was the acting of the girl who played Shireen. When I saw that they were leading her to the stake I was thinking "if they go through with this I imagine that will be some tough acting for a girl that young", so I was a bit worried about whether she could sell it or not. But as far as I'm concerned, she was great. So props to her for pulling that off.

[gmillerdrake]

Also, something I forgot to mention in my initial episode reaction post was the acting of the girl who played Shireen. When I saw that they were leading her to the stake I was thinking "if they go through with this I imagine that will be some tough acting for a girl that young", so I was a bit worried about whether she could sell it or not. But as far as I'm concerned, she was great. So props to her for pulling that off.

Other than the Sand Snake Girls (and I just don't think they've been given the material yet) the casting and acting on this show are top notch and IMO is what makes the show. Any less of an effort that we've gotten from these actors/actresses would diminish the quality of the show. It doesn't matter how 'pretty' it is....how cool the CGI is....if the actors aren't selling it, ain't no one gonna buy it. They've all been spot on....no matter who they cast.

Heck, even the last Wildling lady who was killed by the group of wight kids was easy to fall in love with and like due to her acting and she had what....5 minutes of screen time? They consistently cast great actors and that's what makes the show.

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

Given that I'm a massive White Walker nerd, I think it'll be hard to top 'Hardhome' this season.

Also, something I forgot to mention in my initial episode reaction post was the acting of the girl who played Shireen. When I saw that they were leading her to the stake I was thinking "if they go through with this I imagine that will be some tough acting for a girl that young", so I was a bit worried about whether she could sell it or not. But as far as I'm concerned, she was great. So props to her for pulling that off.

Not that it really matter or anything but I was actually thinking during that scene that her scream wasn't that terrifying that I would expect from someone being burned alive, especially a child. I realise my comment sounds a bit messed up  but as you, I did think before hand how she would act that out because having an actor scream in agonising pain is tough but to have a child do it is even worse. She did a good job though and I guess in the realms of what's morally accepted or something like that.

Then again i'm not claiming to be an expert in human combustion and everything that comes along with being burned alive.

[BlackInk]

Other than the Sand Snake Girls (and I just don't think they've been given the material yet) the casting and acting on this show are top notch and IMO is what makes the show.

I agree with the bolded part. In the first half of the season, we had zero personality from any of these girls. But I think both Tyeene and Nymeria are actually a bit likable now after their prison scenes, in which I think the actors were great. If these moments had happened before their fight with Bronn and Jamie, it would have made that scene better. But as it was now, there was just no reason to care for those people.

[Cyclopssss]

Once those screams started to rise in pitch I thought it was plenty believable.  Also:

[Evermind]

 

[Phoenix87x]

Spare no heir, lol

[BlackInk]

 

[Prog Snob]

I would like to see the girl's burning at the stake lead to nothing, and then Stannis rip the Red woman apart for the charlatan that she is.

I was thinking about that or what Davos' reaction would be to finding out the princess was burned alive.

[gmillerdrake]

I would like to see the girl's burning at the stake lead to nothing, and then Stannis rip the Red woman apart for the charlatan that she is.

I was thinking about that or what Davos' reaction would be to finding out the princess was burned alive.

He's too much of a wuss to do anything.....he's proven that. He knew she was in trouble and 'tried' to get her back to Castle Black. I don't think there's much he can or will do other than maybe leave.

[hefdaddy42]

He's not a wuss at all.  He is holding fast to his own sense of honor, duty, and loyalty, at the expense of what his personal choices would be.

[cramx3]

I agree Davos is not a wuss, remember in Season 3 he tried to kill Melisandre.  He knew something was up, but I am not totally sure he knew Shireen was going to be killed.  I do think it will be interesting to see how he reacts though, does he continue to stay loyal to Stannis or was that his last straw?  I think he continues down his book path (which was left out in the show so far), but does it for a different character than Stannis goes after Rickon, but maybe for Jon Snow or Sansa therefore putting him on side Stark

[gmillerdrake]

He's not a wuss at all.  He is holding fast to his own sense of honor, duty, and loyalty, at the expense of what his personal choices would be.

I agree Davos is not a wuss, remember in Season 3 he tried to kill Melisandre.  He knew something was up, but I am not totally sure he knew Shireen was going to be killed.  I do think it will be interesting to see how he reacts though, does he continue to stay loyal to Stannis or was that his last straw?  I think he continues down his book path (which was left out in the show so far), but does it for a different character than Stannis goes after Rickon, but maybe for Jon Snow or Sansa therefore putting him on side Stark

Maybe 'wuss' was a poor choice of word to use to describe him, because both your points are well taken. I just don't see him really doing anything dramatic like killing Stannis or Melesandre. Given his characters "character"...i think him abandoning Stannis would be his way of getting back at Stannis and damaging his plans to rule.

[hefdaddy42]

[ariich]

[faizoff]

 
I had a few things spoiled for me but Jon Snow still surprised me. What an amazing amazing finale and show and the long long wait for next year begins. God April is so freaking far away. I think I'm emotionally scarred after this season lol.

[Genowyn]

I'm so not pleased. If what happened to Stannis is a book spoiler (though obviously it would come from someone else) I'll be really annoyed. I pray GRRM can accomplish his goal of getting The Winds of Winter out before season 6 or I won't be able to watch it. Hell, I might not watch it anyway.

The showrunners' stubborn refusal to incorporate any prophecies from the book really made a difference this episode I think. Made sure to get Melisandre back to CB beforehand of course. Now way you could have had Bowen Marsh Olly shed a tear? Don't think that was important? Had to make up some nonsense about Benjen (and thanks for making me worry you were gonna spoil something about Benjen) instead of the thing with Wun Wun? Why? Didn't want to pay for the giant? Didn't want to cut any time from the super interesting Walk of Shame? I even felt sorta bad because book Cersei makes show Cersei seem downright pleasant and reasonable. AND SO HEY WHY DID WE EVEN GO TO DORNE IF YOU WEREN'T GONNA DO THE VENGEANCE JUSTICE FIRE AND BLOOD?

And was that Dorne scene really the crazy thing one of the Sand Snakes actresses mentioned in an interview?

I'm just so disappointed with this episode and season.

[orcus116]

Did that ending happen in the books or are the showrunners really that stupid?