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No you misunderstood. I do know the costs (sort of). Ive taken the Eurorail a lot. Say factoring all costs (time, convinience, dollars spent), it costs $10 to go from Paris to Madrid either in car or plane. But to do go from NYC to DC costs only $5.Lets say the rail to either costs $7. Where you are effects whether or not its viable.
Quote from: livehard on November 03, 2011, 01:42:12 PMNo you misunderstood. I do know the costs (sort of). Ive taken the Eurorail a lot. Say factoring all costs (time, convinience, dollars spent), it costs $10 to go from Paris to Madrid either in car or plane. But to do go from NYC to DC costs only $5.Lets say the rail to either costs $7. Where you are effects whether or not its viable.I could make up numbers too.
As frequently happens, Super Dude nailed it.
Sounds like a dandy idea.The problem is, as my old man used to say, the problem with planning for transportation 20 years from now is, who the hell knows what transportation will be like in 20 years! (and he really did say that)Simply put, by the time we had the ability to build such a thing and make it effective, we'd probably have the ability to do more useful things that we can't currently imagine. It's entirely possible that in the time it takes to get there, we've started a love affair with something that kicks the bejeezus out of automobiles. Frankly, that love affair is ending quite quickly before our eyes.
High-speed rail has been around since the 1960s. It's only increasing in popularity, and is being implemented around the world. It uses renewable energy, is energy efficient, is fast and affordable, is the safest mode of travel ever put into service, and makes money.It's not going to go away any time soon.
Quote from: El Barto on November 03, 2011, 02:28:18 PMSounds like a dandy idea.The problem is, as my old man used to say, the problem with planning for transportation 20 years from now is, who the hell knows what transportation will be like in 20 years! (and he really did say that)Simply put, by the time we had the ability to build such a thing and make it effective, we'd probably have the ability to do more useful things that we can't currently imagine. It's entirely possible that in the time it takes to get there, we've started a love affair with something that kicks the bejeezus out of automobiles. Frankly, that love affair is ending quite quickly before our eyes. Not likely. The car's been around now, for what? Almost 130 years? Even so, I don't see this as a reason not to get crackin' on the HSR. I see it as a reason to start that and the next thing already.
Alright, but so in that case I refer you to GP's second-to-most-recent post.
Quote from: Super Dude on November 03, 2011, 03:40:48 PMAlright, but so in that case I refer you to GP's second-to-most-recent post.Everything in it is absolutely true. It also has nothing whatsoever to do with America. Perhaps HSR will catch on here, but I think it probably won't. We really are a completely different animal with regards to transpo. Just because something is wildly successful somewhere doesn't mean it won't go down in flames elsewhere. My hunch is that's the case here.And it's really not a bad thing. Personally, I'd like for a better option to develop, and I think it will. HSR is nifty, and when it works it's a lovely thing. I just don't see it working well here. Whereas just like we took the components of the car from Dhaimler, Boch, Watt, etc, and used it to revolutionize our society, I think we'll do the same with a different idea.
Quote from: Super Dude on November 03, 2011, 02:35:30 PMQuote from: El Barto on November 03, 2011, 02:28:18 PMSounds like a dandy idea.The problem is, as my old man used to say, the problem with planning for transportation 20 years from now is, who the hell knows what transportation will be like in 20 years! (and he really did say that)Simply put, by the time we had the ability to build such a thing and make it effective, we'd probably have the ability to do more useful things that we can't currently imagine. It's entirely possible that in the time it takes to get there, we've started a love affair with something that kicks the bejeezus out of automobiles. Frankly, that love affair is ending quite quickly before our eyes. Not likely. The car's been around now, for what? Almost 130 years? Even so, I don't see this as a reason not to get crackin' on the HSR. I see it as a reason to start that and the next thing already.I was actually referring specifically to DTVT's idea. I got quadruple ninja'd and it didn't warn me when I posted. I don't see any reason to design HSR around existing automobile traffic is my point.
Quote from: Scheavo on November 03, 2011, 02:12:53 PMQuote from: livehard on November 03, 2011, 01:42:12 PMNo you misunderstood. I do know the costs (sort of). Ive taken the Eurorail a lot. Say factoring all costs (time, convinience, dollars spent), it costs $10 to go from Paris to Madrid either in car or plane. But to do go from NYC to DC costs only $5.Lets say the rail to either costs $7. Where you are effects whether or not its viable.I could make up numbers too.
Quote from: Dark Castle on November 03, 2011, 02:13:59 PMQuote from: Scheavo on November 03, 2011, 02:12:53 PMQuote from: livehard on November 03, 2011, 01:42:12 PMNo you misunderstood. I do know the costs (sort of). Ive taken the Eurorail a lot. Say factoring all costs (time, convinience, dollars spent), it costs $10 to go from Paris to Madrid either in car or plane. But to do go from NYC to DC costs only $5.Lets say the rail to either costs $7. Where you are effects whether or not its viable.I could make up numbers too.ARE YOU TWO SERIOUS? Of course I am making up numbers. Its to not reflect the actual situation but how costs can change based on geography! oh my God...
Quote from: livehard on November 03, 2011, 03:53:44 PMQuote from: Dark Castle on November 03, 2011, 02:13:59 PMQuote from: Scheavo on November 03, 2011, 02:12:53 PMQuote from: livehard on November 03, 2011, 01:42:12 PMNo you misunderstood. I do know the costs (sort of). Ive taken the Eurorail a lot. Say factoring all costs (time, convinience, dollars spent), it costs $10 to go from Paris to Madrid either in car or plane. But to do go from NYC to DC costs only $5.Lets say the rail to either costs $7. Where you are effects whether or not its viable.I could make up numbers too.ARE YOU TWO SERIOUS? Of course I am making up numbers. Its to not reflect the actual situation but how costs can change based on geography! oh my God...Oh no, we get that you made up the numbers for that purpose, but it has no point, as you didn't prove anything by making up numbers.
Many things CAN happen, what we should be interested in is what is most likely going to happen.
flying [is] relatively cheap
Quote from: livehard on November 03, 2011, 04:22:03 PMflying [is] relatively cheapMaybe I'm just poor, but is it really considered cheap?
I did Delta from Boston to JFK and it was over $300. The same ACELA trip was less than $70.
Quote from: Super Dude on November 03, 2011, 05:13:47 PMI did Delta from Boston to JFK and it was over $300. The same ACELA trip was less than $70.$101 for the red-eye Acela out of Boston. $151 for the non-miserable trip. You looking at weekends, perhaps? As for flying, $240 round trip for tomorrow morning on Jet Blue. A few days in advance will get you one of those $59 flights.
Quote from: Scheavo on November 03, 2011, 04:00:49 PMMany things CAN happen, what we should be interested in is what is most likely going to happen.Funny, that's exactly what I was saying for about two whole pages, and the only answers I got were "But Europe/Nebraska!"
Once again, I prefer train travel. As a tourist I'd pay the extra money for a pleasant 2.5 hour train ride. As a business traveler, I'm taking the dirt cheap 55 minute flight.
Oh shit, you're right!rumborak
While I'm always open to hearing counter-arguments to something like this, I more often than not get the impression that the opposition to it is based on "that's how they do it elsewhere, but not here", which is a rather annoying aspect of American culture I must say.rumborak