STRANGER THINGS season 4 - SPOILERS INSIDE

[The Letter M]

What year is it when the Creel's buy that house? 1955? 1958?

if Henry is who is he is and meets Eleven in 1979, that would make him at least in his mid or late 20's at least. Maybe even in his early to mid 30's. Unless he found some way to manipulate time or aged slower?

It was 1959 when the Creels moved into their new house in Hawkins, and Henry was 12. That means he's 32 when he's helping Eleven at the facility. When I first saw him there, I thought he was in his mid-20s but early 30s doens't seem much of a stretch. That makes him 39 in the present time of 1986. That also makes Eleven eight years old when the massacre happened in 1979 as she is 12 in 1983/the first season.

I liked a lot of what theyve done this season (agreedwith the ending of Episode 4 and Kate Bush's 'Running up that Hill"), however I kind of feel the way they've separated the groups, like they did in Season 3, some of the cast chemistry is not what it was. I mean they wrote it so it connected the dots in some ways, but, it's like the ensemble cast is so big, they felt the needed to created multiple plots to allow them all to have a purpose.

Yeah I can understand that feeling a bit. I both like and dislike the separating of the cast into smaller groups. It's neat to see the creative team giving each group their own sort of 80s-nostalgia-driven film plot on their own (Russian prison escape/spy thriller for Hopper/Joyce/Murray, A Nightmare On Elm Street for the Hawkins crew, a sci-fi/horror aspect for Eleven, and some action adventure stuff for the California crew). It creates a bit of a narrative divide as we bounce back and forth between them all, especially since there's a lot going on OUTSIDE of Hawkins this time (unlike previous seasons where the story was pretty much all in Hawkins), so it feels even more apparent this time around as we're even across the globe. I think it'll pay off in the end when all of these story lines begin to come together, especially as we see Eleven's story and the Hawkins Crew's story come together at the end of episode 7, so I am wondering how Hopper's escape will come into focus with the rest of the story (which seems to be the biggest outlier so far).

I do wonder a bit about Eleven and what the 2 sides are wanting to do with her. The military group and the Lab with Owens and Brenner. Just her to fight the Mind Flayer and its Army? Will they bring back Kali/8?

Given the show will only go 1 more season, the origins of the Upside Down I gotta believe are going to be largest focus. I wonder if a lot if not all of it traces back to Brenner.

I think destroying the Upside Down will probably be the final endgame for Stranger Things, but then I wonder what this will be about, if it happens after Season 5:

I was just looking for information about Season 5 and noticed there is a spinoff planned:

https://bamsmackpow.com/2022/05/27/last-season-of-stranger-things-season-5-happening/

The good news is that the Duffer Brothers apparently have a spinoff already in the works, so while season 5 will be the show’s last, there is a hope that Stranger Things will live on beyond season 5 in some way. As for when season 5 might arrive? We’ll that remains to be seen, but we’re hoping it won’t take quite as long as season 4 did to complete!

A spin-off? Given the amount of backstory we seem to be getting this season, I can't imagine the spin-off will be a prequel, but if Season 5 wraps things up nicely for everyone in/from Hawkins, then I can't imagine a decent sequel. A side-story might be neat, but only if it isn't focused on 008/Eight. It was a neat diversion for Eleven, but I can't see a whole series about Kali and her group. I honestly cannot think of what else a Stranger Things spin-off could be about... maybe a time-skip into the 90s? The fun thing about this series is that, if they wanted to return to the world of Hawkins in the 90s, they just have to wait a few years and let the kids grow up a bit more and they'd be aged up perfectly for a time-skip for a spin-off.

-Marc.

[Metro]

The fun thing about this series is that, if they wanted to return to the world of Hawkins in the 90s, they just have to wait a few years and let the kids grow up a bit more and they'd be aged up perfectly for a time-skip for a spin-off.

I could see something like this happening in the final season. With Stephen King's "It" being such a clear influence on this series, an ending where the kids are grown up and have to come back to Hawkins to deal with something from the Upside Down one last time just makes sense.
With as much world-building as they've done the last two seasons, I would like the final season to scale things down and go back to the show's roots and have everyone in one place rather than scattered across the world.

[KevShmev]

I see a lot of people saying that this new season is way better than 2 or 3.  I loved 1, but could barely get through 2, and then bailed on 3 pretty quickly, so the question is, will I be lost watching Season 4 after having not watched all of 3 (and having little to no memory of much of the show in general since it has been years since I watched any of it)?

A lot of the stuff in season 4 is built on events that occur in season 3, so you'll probably lose context in a lot of scenes. They probably won't have the impact if you haven't watched prior seasons. Not sure if S4 will change your mind if previous seasons weren't as compelling.

I agree. Season 4 does a lot to call back to Season 3 and there's a lot of things happened that you'd need context for going into Season 4. If you want to wait until the rest of Season 4 to go up (on July 1st) before you decide to dive back into the series and see how people react to the S4 finale, that's cool. You definitely have time to rewatch and catch up before the last two episodes drop too.

My worry is that the stakes this season have ramped up so much that I can't imagine what they'll do for the fifth and final season.

Okay.  Based on what you both said, I probably won't bother with it as I cannot see myself forcing myself to watch Seasons 2 and 3 just so I understand 4, considering I thought 2 was a drop-off and 3 bored me so much that I jumped ship, so I will see myself out. 

[gmillerdrake]

So finished watching the 7 available episodes. I mean, I see that a lot of people are enjoying this season so I'm not going to rain on that parade. It's definitely entertaining.....certainly much darker than we've seen....it's still a 'fun' show but for me the 'magic' of the series is gone. S1 was so different and hit in a sweet spot when it was released that it was just awesome. Since then....it's tailed off from being this unique story told in a cool way to just another sci fi / action show. Which doesn't mean it's bad per say but I'm just not feeling or seeing the magic as I said and rate S3 and S4 as just 'average'....with S2 being a mixed bag that led to the average plateau.

Pretty rudimentary writing IMO.....and the actor for Will is clearly out of his league now as his scenes and dialogue are pretty rough to get through. It's not good at all and I'm wondering if that's why in the first season they had that actor basically missing the entire time to cover the fact he's the weakest link when it comes to acting.  The actor for Dustin is great....and the other kids do fine but all in all I see this show as having ran it's course and cannot imagine a S5 has anything remotely new to offer.  I'd love to be surprised but I think Netflix chose the 'cash in' route with this show rather than lets tell an incredible succinct story in three seasons and it's showing in the predictable writing and simple storylines they've thrown at us now for the past three seasons.

Judging from the comments I know I'm in the minority on these opinions....and again...I don't think it's 'bad' and was entertained and enjoyed the episodes...just think it's just another show that had an incredible first season leaving no way to match that acclaim....and has struggled to provide anything in that realm since.

[The Letter M]

I don't think it's 'bad' and was entertained and enjoyed the episodes...just think it's just another show that had an incredible first season leaving no way to match that acclaim....and has struggled to provide anything in that realm since.

Sounds like most people's opinions on NBC's Heroes, one of my favorite shows. Like Stranger Things has become, Heroes was a show that followed a lot of individual story lines from various characters/groups, and when it came time for a climax, they all intersected, which seems to be the trend for Stranger Things now.

As for your other concerns, I can see why some might feel that Will Byers has been pretty much left alone. His role in the series has really diminished and it feels like the writers really aren't sure what to do with him at this point. I think sticking him with his brother and Mike so far this season has been a way for the writers to get them all to do something this season, but so far, there hasn't been a lot of pay-off in that area.

Since it's known that Season 5 will be the last one, I wonder just how much of climax the next two episodes will provide, or if the season will end on a HUGE cliffhanger that will be continued into the final season. Honestly, with nearly four hours of material left for Season 4, I would hope they wrap up the Vecna story and then use Season 5 as a way to tie every loose end together from the previous four seasons and give the surviving characters some sense of finality to their plot lines.

-Marc.

[faizoff]

I don't think it's 'bad' and was entertained and enjoyed the episodes...just think it's just another show that had an incredible first season leaving no way to match that acclaim....and has struggled to provide anything in that realm since.

My wife has the same outlook, she doesn't think anything was as good as the first one. She didn't hate the following seasons but just liked them. I'm sure she's not going to care much about the new season as well. I know the violence alone is going to put her off.

[Melphina]

I'm not sure if I agree that the actor for Will is out of his league so much as it is that, as has already been said, I think the writers don't know what to do with him. I found his struggle with his and Mike's friendship uninteresting and boy whoever decided to put that poor actor through the HORRIBLE combination of that awful hairstyle and that outfit should be fired  I know it's accurate for the era but with how old he looks now it looks sooo awkward.

[Metro]

I'm not sure if I agree that the actor for Will is out of his league so much as it is that, as has already been said, I think the writers don't know what to do with him.

In Season 2, when they're trying to exorcise the Mind Flayer from Will, Joyce says that Will's birthday is March 22nd. This Season begins on March 21st, and everyone seems to have forgotten about Will's birthday, even Will himself. Poor kid can't catch a break.

[gmillerdrake]

I'm not sure if I agree that the actor for Will is out of his league so much as it is that, as has already been said, I think the writers don't know what to do with him. I found his struggle with his and Mike's friendship uninteresting and boy whoever decided to put that poor actor through the HORRIBLE combination of that awful hairstyle and that outfit should be fired  I know it's accurate for the era but with how old he looks now it looks sooo awkward.

I get what you're saying but never mind the wardrobe choices and poor storyline between him and Mike.....when he does get a chance to 'act' it's simply not good. The actor for Mike has been given pretty lame dialogue and scenes as well this season but at least he makes it tolerable with a bit of acting chops.

[gmillerdrake]

One thing that's been sticking with me is that when Erica rolls the Natural 20 in the D&D game that wasn't an automatic guarantee that she killed him. He still had 15 HP's left and depending on the weapon she was using....even though damage would have been doubled.....he still might have survived. But she'd still have had to roll for damage as well....she could have rolled a 1 and only delivered 2 HP's of damage.  A natural 20 isn't an automatic kill shot.

[lonestar]

One thing that's been sticking with me is that when Erica rolls the Natural 20 in the D&D game that wasn't an automatic guarantee that she killed him. He still had 15 HP's left and depending on the weapon she was using....even though damage would have been doubled.....he still might have survived. But she'd still have had to roll for damage as well....she could have rolled a 1 and only delivered 2 HP's of damage.  A natural 20 isn't an automatic kill shot.

OK... Your geek cred is solid for the next decade with that observation

[gmillerdrake]

One thing that's been sticking with me is that when Erica rolls the Natural 20 in the D&D game that wasn't an automatic guarantee that she killed him. He still had 15 HP's left and depending on the weapon she was using....even though damage would have been doubled.....he still might have survived. But she'd still have had to roll for damage as well....she could have rolled a 1 and only delivered 2 HP's of damage.  A natural 20 isn't an automatic kill shot.

OK... Your geek cred is solid for the next decade with that observation

    I'll take it.

It's been a minute since I've played but know that it was super fun and I have some fond memories of it.....your DM makes or breaks how fun it is and ours was awesome.

[faizoff]

Haha this exchange highlights another little goof in the season when they show the screen with the "hacker" and the code is like modern code and not stuff that was in the 80s. Plus don't remember a GUI with a mouse interface being available in that time frame as well.

You'd think a show about nerds watched by nerds would pay attention to details that the nerds would easily identify.

Also no surprise that the weekend viewership broke all sorts of Netflix records for the new season.

[MirrorMask]

I'm at episode 5.

Loved how the protagonist of episode 4 got through, if the episode had ended bad for this character, it would have been such a bummer.

Btw, refresh my memory.... didn't the guy who resurfaced in the lab in episode 5 got gruesomly killed at the end of season 1? or I misremember things?

[bosk1]

Way behind on this thread, and intentionally so, since I haven't finished the episodes yet. But this is FAR surpassing expectations so far.  The end of episode 4: 

I'm sure this half season is going to end on a cliffhanger that is going to have me throwing things at the screen.  But I can't wait to get there, and for the final episodes.

[jammindude]

Way behind on this thread, and intentionally so, since I haven't finished the episodes yet. But this is FAR surpassing expectations so far.  The end of episode 4: 

I'm sure this half season is going to end on a cliffhanger that is going to have me throwing things at the screen.  But I can't wait to get there, and for the final episodes.

I thought the same thing. But it’s not as much a “cliffhanger” as it is a “revelation”. And for that reason, I found it more satisfying than maddening. It was the perfect place to pause and take a breath. Can’t wait for the last two episodes.

[Zoom E]

I thought season 3 was a bit of a dud, but Season 4 is fantastic. It has far surpassed my expectations. Episode 7 was just excellent.

The one new character I don’t care for is the stoner pizza delivery dude. He seems to be there for comic relief, but I just find him irritating.

[SoundscapeMN]

is Steve in trouble?..I must admit, after what happened to him in the upside down, his condition wasn't or has not really fully been addressed.

[MirrorMask]

Finished all the seven episodes. Great stuff.

This could serve as a whole season of its own, glad to know there are two more episodes coming, but knowing they were 2 episodes behind, couldn't they just release one episode per week and make it a summer event? not that I'm complaining about having seen one episode per day, rather than per week 

Loved the various pairings, and how things in the mythology were tied. Can't wait to see the fireworks in episodes 8 and 9!!!

[bosk1]

I have yet to watch the final episode, so I am being careful what I read and what I don't.  But some brief thoughts on the structure so far:
-Episode 1 was pretty slow.  I know it was just setting things up, but my lowered expectations seemed to be right on point through this one.
-2 was still a bit slow, but the show was getting better.
-3 and 4 were a huge step up and were the best pair of episodes out of the entire thing I have seen.  4 in particular was spectacular and may be in the running for my favorite episode of the entire 4 seasons. 
-5 and 6 weren't bad, but were a step down from 3 and 4.  They seemed more to be about setting up 7 and beyond than in trying to be good in their own right.  And that's fine. 
-Can't wait for 7.

[Grappler]

I loved this season and the feel that it's just a full-blown horror movie.  Eddie Munson has become one of my favorite characters and I love that they brought in a metalhead, given the setting in 1985.  And that whole scene with Max had me on the edge of my seat.

I can't wait for the last two episodes!

[The Letter M]

I loved this season and the feel that it's just a full-blown horror movie.  Eddie Munson has become one of my favorite characters and I love that they brought in a metalhead, given the setting in 1985.  And that whole scene with Max had me on the edge of my seat.

I can't wait for the last two episodes!

1986, late March specifically, but yeah, Eddie is a great addition to the cast. I really hope he's able to return for Season 5, but also hope he finally graduates high school! 

-Marc.

[DoctorAction]

Watched episodes 6 and 7 last night. Have been staying away from this thread in case of spoilers. But, wow - I'm blown away by this season. The biggest and best to date, IMO.

The pacing, tension, visuals, acting, plots - smashed it. Really excited to see what happens in the last 2!

[MirrorMask]

-Can't wait for 7.

You're in for a treat!

[dparrott]

I want to speak on the bullying in this episode.  I was bullied in jr high and high school, I'm glad they're showing how pointless and stupid it is, and how it makes victims feel.  That bitch Angela and her stupid friends are why kids shoot up schools!!!  I'm glad she got clocked with that skate, acts like that are the only thing that will stop them.  I know it's just a TV show, but I wanted to kick those kids asses myself.  Physical damage will heal, mental damage does not.  Over 30 years later, I'm still mad about how I was treated for no damn reason. 

[jammindude]

I too was bullied relentlessly through grade school and jr high. And was never the same person. There’s always someone ready to take someone else a step down and I always seemed to find myself on the lowest rung.

That being said, now that it’s all behind me, I look at how my life turned out, and how theirs turned out.

I am a man of peace, and I’m happy today that I chose the course of peace. I don’t carry around any resentment.  So even though younger me wishes he had the balls to retaliate…older me is glad I never went down that path. I don’t wish anyone a “skate to the face”. Their behavior reflects the course they are on. They will stay the way they are, and that’s punishment enough.

[lonestar]

Same man...and I carried that shit way too far into my adult life.

[The Realm]

Finished episode 7 so up to date. Overall I enjoyed it. There were some really great parts but also some parts that didn't work too well for me. I felt the whole Hopper/Murray/Joyce/Russia story line was really farfetched (yeah I know it is tv) and just really detracted from the rest of the show. The Eleven flash back scenes, while very important overall, kind of dragged along as well. Also, it felt weird that in the whole episode 7 (I think) we didn't at all see Mike/Jonathon etc at all. I guess they are being saved for the remaining 2 episodes. My kids loved every second of it though...

[lonestar]

I can understand those criticisms... They are spread very thin as far as stories go... Makes me think Part 2 might be a cliffhanger, with Vecna being the big baddie in perpetuity.

[soupytwist]

I read somewhere the last episode of this season (episode 9) is going to be 2.5 hours long!

[MirrorMask]

I felt the whole Hopper/Murray/Joyce/Russia story line was really farfetched (yeah I know it is tv) and just really detracted from the rest of the show.

Once you accept the premise that someone is held captive and other people try to rescue him, it's less farfetched than the russians being able to build a damn superlab beneath a mall 

[The Letter M]

I read somewhere the last episode of this season (episode 9) is going to be 2.5 hours long!

Yep, I posted the running times for the final two episodes earlier in this thread:

Geez the episode lengths of part 1 is crazy.

Episode 1 – 1 hour 16 minutes

Episode 2 – 1 hour 15 minutes

Episode 3 – 1 hour 3 minutes

Episode 4 – 1 hour 17 minutes

Episode 5 – 1 hour 14 minutes

Episode 6 – 1 hour 13 minutes

Episode 7 – 1 hour 38 minutes

WOW...almost all over 70 minutes long! And I had no idea Part 1 was going to be SEVEN episodes, while Part 2 is the final two:

July 1, final two episodes:

Episode 8 – 1 hour, 25 minutes
Episode 9 – 2 hours, 30 minutes

Seems a little unbalanced in terms of release, and honestly, I could've seen them release 1-4 this weekend, 5-7 in two weeks, and then the final two, but whatever. I guess Episode 7 is going to have a HUGE cliffhanger then, especially since the final two episodes are nearly epic-movie-length combined. Cannot wait! I'm finishing up Season 3 tonight in my marathon rewatch this week.

-Marc.

The final two episodes will be nearly 4 hours in total! It'll be an event for sure!

-Marc

[faizoff]

I think the Duffer brothers or the director Shawn Lewy recently confirmed the official season finale run time to be 2hr 15 mins.

[bosk1]

Wow.  Episode 7 was just...wow.  A LOT of things tied together in a really satisfying way, going all the way to season 1.  Suddenly, nothing that has happened, nor who it happened to, nor why is random. 

[lonestar]

Wow.  Episode 7 was just...wow.  A LOT of things tied together in a really satisfying way, going all the way to season 1.  Suddenly, nothing that has happened, nor who it happened to, nor why is random. 

Yeah, they really pulled it together nicely.