Haken v. new single Nightingale (April 26)

[The Letter M]

Yeah, only about 73-75 minutes of music, unless there were some expanded/jamming sections.

I'll be interested to see what songs they swap out over the course of the tour, if any.

-Marc.

[Evermind]

Well, I really hope European shows will be longer and have better setlist than this.

[countoftuscany42]

Don’t forget it’s basically a coheadlining tour, so leprous will be doing about the same amount. That’s a pretty normal set length considering

[ariich]

Yeah that's normal length for a co headline set.

[Evermind]

Yeah, but I'm lukewarm on both Crystallized and 1985. Nil by Mouth hasn't clicked with me yet. That leaves only four songs to enjoy, though I guess 1985 will be fun in live setting.

My ticket to the Hamburg show says "Haken plus special guest", so I hope they'll have a bit more time for their set.

[Train of Naught]

Man they picked out my least favourite Affinity song, my least favourite epic, and my 2/4 Vector songs are my bottom 2

I'm still not sure whether I'm going to the Haken gig but this isn't looking like my kinda show :/

[jammindude]

I like the song choices....but ya, way too short. 

[BRGM]

I'm five listens in and I still think this album is awesome. Pretty much every song is great. I like it way more than Affinity and Visions.

Also I just realized that the middle section of Veil (4:00 - 7:00) reminds me of some Porcupine Tree / Steven Wilson song. I don't remember which one though, but the vocal melodies are almost exactly the same if I recall correctly. Anyone?

Yes I heard it too, Hag - Storm Corrosion

[Elite]

Second listen this morning in the car, after being rather unconvinced with the first listen last night (read my last post in this thread for my 'first impression'). I feel like I was a little too harsh with that post, but I feel the album still has some room to grow (i.e. the second listen was better to me, but still a little underwhelming).

- I still think Clear is an awesome opener.

- The Good Doctor is amazing and might be the best 'single'-ish song they have done.

- Puzzle Box was focking weird last night, but today it clicked a little. Instrumentally, it's impressive, but the chorus didn't grab me at all, but now it did. I still think the middle part is weird, but this song has definite potential to grow on me, for sure.

- Veil is still somewhat of a mess. The first 7 minutes are good, some of it seriously good, but at (and just before) the 7 minute mark, Haken manages to pull off the most jarring transition they have ever done. What a way to lose the flow. The second part builds up nicely, but the way the two parts of the song are linked is just .. not good.

- Nil by Mouth doesn't interest me. There's too much same-ey stuff going on throughout the song, with too little repeating themes (or hell: melody). Again, like Puzzle Box, it's an instrumentally impressive feat, but it's just no fun to listen to. Give me Portals any day of the week. That one is actually awesome. This one, not so much.

- Host got better with the second listen as well. Great tune. I read on Facebook someone call this 'Sun if it was good'. While I see where that person's getting from, I don't think the comparison applies, simply because they're both 'ballads'. Sun is good, this one is slightly less good. The climax at the end of the song is a highlight of the album though.

- A Cell Divides.. I've seen someone call this one 'Haken trying to be Leprous', but I don't see that at all. Yes, it's a little more rhythmic than their other work and I can see how the comparison is drawn to songs like Illuminate, but vocally and melodically it's very unlike Leprous. This one got a lot better on second listen. Very nice, catchy tune. It doesn't really feel like a closer though.. yet.

---

Also fun: the vinyl I got has the Verbal Summator after some moments of silence. That was a nice surprise. Initially I thought my record playing was skipping, but then I realised what was going on. The CD I received with the LP, which is what I listened to this morning, also includes the verbal summator. Then I checked Spotify, and A Cell Divides is 4:57 there, while mine is slightly over 6 minutes. On Wikipedia it shows as 4:57 as well. Can other CD owners (maybe people who got a regular copy, and not the vinyl) confirm/deny whether or not the verbal summator is included?

[me7]

I have the special edition CDs and Verbal Summator is included on both discs.

[gborland]

I am making yet another attempt to get into Haken. I think this is attempt #4 now.

Some cool music going on, but I really can't get past the singer. His voice is so bland it actually hurts. Honestly they'd have been better grabbing a random person off the street and asking them to sing instead.

It's like going to a really good Indian restaurant, renowned for fabulous cooking, mouth-watering flavours and great inventive use of spices, and being served a plate of boiled peas and mayonnaise.

[ariich]

I have the special edition CDs and Verbal Summator is included on both discs.

Both discs? That's weird, it should only be at the end of the insturmental one. Or maybe that's just the digital downloads, whereas the physical CDs have it on both?

[me7]

The physical discs come with 7 tracks each. The instrumental disc includes Clear and Nil by Mouth. Verbal Summator comes after A Cell divides on both discs.

Kind of a bummer that the download version omits Verbal Summator on the regular A Cell divides.

[cramx3]

Does anyone know who headlined last night?  Leprous also did an encore so it's not clear to me judging by setlist.fm  They played 12 songs but their songs are shorter.

As for Haken's setlist, kind of bummed it's only 7 songs.  Thought 8 or 9 would be possible with a couple shorter songs or a softer song thrown in there.  The song choices are pretty stellar though IMO, the three best tracks from Vector, no cockroach king (Much prefer Falling Back to Earth).  I'm interested to see what they switch up, assuming they do.

[El Barto]

Don’t forget it’s basically a coheadlining tour, so leprous will be doing about the same amount. That’s a pretty normal set length considering

A co-headline show shouldn't mean that each band plays half a set. Each band could easily play 90 minutes here. I'm just fine with the setlist, and even though I hate TGD they're getting it out of the way early. I'd prefer something other than Puzzle Box, but it's not a dealbreaker. Hopefully they'll alternate encores. Wouldn't surprise me if Cockroach gets played tonight. I'd love for them to go back to Crystalized/Celestial, but I'm not banking on it.

[cramx3]

Looking at my ticket for Saturday...

Doors at 5pm, Show starts at 6pm.

Bent Knee from 6 to 6:30, Haken/Leprous 7-8:30, Haken/Leprous 9-10:30 ?  Why isn't 90 minute sets possible?  11pm usually is the end time.

I'm wondering if it's first night of the tour issues and things got delayed cutting sets short?  They've got some time to work out the kinks before Saturday at least if thats the case.

[axeman90210]

Looking at my ticket for Saturday...

Doors at 5pm, Show starts at 6pm.

Bent Knee from 6 to 6:30, Haken/Leprous 7-8:30, Haken/Leprous 9-10:30 ?  Why isn't 90 minute sets possible?  11pm usually is the end time.

I'm wondering if it's first night of the tour issues and things got delayed cutting sets short?  They've got some time to work out the kinks before Saturday at least if thats the case.

Haken played that venue last year, also on a Saturday night, and the venue turned over after the concert was over for some sort of hip hop club event, so I wouldn't be surprised if there's something totally different going on in that space after the concert.

[erwinrafael]

I just listened to the album, and I have to say, the band seems to be stuck with old tricks in writing their instrumentals / solos. I kept on thinking "I heard them do that before"

[cramx3]

Looking at my ticket for Saturday...

Doors at 5pm, Show starts at 6pm.

Bent Knee from 6 to 6:30, Haken/Leprous 7-8:30, Haken/Leprous 9-10:30 ?  Why isn't 90 minute sets possible?  11pm usually is the end time.

I'm wondering if it's first night of the tour issues and things got delayed cutting sets short?  They've got some time to work out the kinks before Saturday at least if thats the case.

Haken played that venue last year, also on a Saturday night, and the venue turned over after the concert was over for some sort of hip hop club event, so I wouldn't be surprised if there's something totally different going on in that space after the concert.

Yea, true.  I vaguely remember that.  Maybe this show will end at 10pm since it starts at 6?

[El Barto]

Looking at my ticket for Saturday...

Doors at 5pm, Show starts at 6pm.

Bent Knee from 6 to 6:30, Haken/Leprous 7-8:30, Haken/Leprous 9-10:30 ?  Why isn't 90 minute sets possible?  11pm usually is the end time.

I'm wondering if it's first night of the tour issues and things got delayed cutting sets short?  They've got some time to work out the kinks before Saturday at least if thats the case.

Those changeover times are too long. Hell, Metallica barely needs 30 minutes and they've got 3 dozen wha-wha pedals to setup. If the setlists don't change, at 70 minutes a pop I reckon we're looking at 6-630, 650-8, 820-930. Throw in some fucking-off time here and there and we're out the door at 10. That's nuts.

[cramx3]

Looking at my ticket for Saturday...

Doors at 5pm, Show starts at 6pm.

Bent Knee from 6 to 6:30, Haken/Leprous 7-8:30, Haken/Leprous 9-10:30 ?  Why isn't 90 minute sets possible?  11pm usually is the end time.

I'm wondering if it's first night of the tour issues and things got delayed cutting sets short?  They've got some time to work out the kinks before Saturday at least if thats the case.

Those changeover times are too long. Hell, Metallica barely needs 30 minutes and they've got 3 dozen wha-wha pedals to setup. If the setlists don't change, at 70 minutes a pop I reckon we're looking at 6-630, 650-8, 820-930. Throw in some fucking-off time here and there and we're out the door at 10. That's nuts.

Yea, that's really disappointing honestly.  And yes, I was padding the times to try and make sense of how they are only giving us 75 minutes each when it seems possible to do more.

[goo-goo]

Some venues have curfews, some of the times might the bands' decisions in order to leave a certain place in order to travel and get to the other place on time.

Seems like there is a lot of equipment to be used by all of the bands. Also, not sure how the merch is handled (like the bands themselves handle it or if they have a dedicated merch guy/lady). I know Skyharbor doesn't have a merch person and they sell all the merch themselves. They ended their set at 1030pm so they could have 60-90 mins to sell merch...

Speaking of Skyharbor, at their meet and greet, they said they had to trim the crew and that's why they do everything themselves (each band member has a task assigned). From being gear techs and hauling gear, to selling merch, to act as a band manager, etc in order to maximize their profit. I think it was the band and 1 more person to help the band.

[kaos2900]

After a ton of listens (and I still need) more I'm really enjoying the album. I also spent some more time with their whole discography. Currently my ranking would be as follows:

Visions
Affinity
The Mountain
Vector
Aquarius

[cramx3]

Haken was the headliner last night, found out via YouTube. Someone has a video of puzzle box up.

[ariich]

Haken was the headliner last night, found out via YouTube. Someone has a video of puzzle box up.

Cool, I'll have to check that out. Keen to see if they've used Pete's electronic drum programming for the middle section on backing track or if Ray and/or Diego do something different live.

[gzarruk]

Haken was the headliner last night, found out via YouTube. Someone has a video of puzzle box up.

Cool, I'll have to check that out. Keen to see if they've used Pete's electronic drum programming for the middle section on backing track or if Ray and/or Diego do something different live.

He did a great job on that track, btw!

[ariich]

Haken was the headliner last night, found out via YouTube. Someone has a video of puzzle box up.

Cool, I'll have to check that out. Keen to see if they've used Pete's electronic drum programming for the middle section on backing track or if Ray and/or Diego do something different live.

He did a great job on that track, btw!

Thanks, I'll pass the compliment on! It worked out pretty nicely that the band were looking for something along the sort of lines that Pete had spent a couple of years working on for his solo electronic work, and he enjoyed doing it.

I also hadn't realised (only discovered from the liner notes) that Pete Rinaldi from Headspace, who some fans may remember filled in on bass for Haken between Tom leaving and Conner joining, also contributed some guitar work in Veil and Host. Not sure what he played and whether it included any of the solos, but that's pretty cool.

Anyway checked out the live Puzzle Box on youtube and even by Bootleg standards the sound is pretty poor so I can't really work out how they did the electronics. It sounds like it might have been there in the background, but with Ray also playing some live drums over it.

[cramx3]

Yea, it wasn't really that great of a video so I didn't link it when I mentioned it, but I used that video to extract some info from the person who saw the show. 

I'm looking to catch some good video on Saturday.

[YtseJamittaja]

Man they picked out my least favourite Affinity song, my least favourite epic, and my 2/4 Vector songs are my bottom top 2

Fixed 

[DTA]

They seem to end their sets with an epic each time and it's getting a bit too predictable. I'd honestly rather hear 2 shorter songs in their place.  Perfect opportunity to debut Bound By Gravity at the start of the encore and finish off with an upbeat track. Also they did Falling Back To Earth on their last US run sop I'm a bit disappointed they didn't substitute it with something they haven't played. Vector is still growing on me. I'm not in love with it immediately the way I was with Affinity and The Mountain, but I'm liking every single song pretty much (with Nil By Mouth being my favorite so far).

[gzarruk]

I also hadn't realised (only discovered from the liner notes) that Pete Rinaldi from Headspace, who some fans may remember filled in on bass for Haken between Tom leaving and Conner joining, also contributed some guitar work in Veil and Host. Not sure what he played and whether it included any of the solos, but that's pretty cool.

Didn't know that, but it makes sense, since Pete Rinaldi has been a guest on every studio release since he filled in as bassist for them:

- Restoration - acoustic guitar on Crystallised
- Affinity - acoustic guitar on Bound By Gravity

And now he's credited as a guest on two songs on Vector. I think it's really cool that they keep inviting him to guest on every release, as he is/was technically also part of the Haken family.

[cramx3]

Knowing nothing about that guy, that does seem pretty cool to keep him involved in some way.  Nice to not see a bitter end.

[gzarruk]

Knowing nothing about that guy, that does seem pretty cool to keep him involved in some way.  Nice to not see a bitter end.

He's the guitar player for Headspace. They're a great prog metal band with Damian Wilson on vocals and Adam Wakeman (Rick's son) on keys. Their first album is AMAZING, I recommend you to check that one out Their second is good too, but the first is my fav.

Haken toured with Headspace for a while iirc, so that's where they (probably) know each other. His direct relationship with Haken comes as he was asked to fill in as their bassist after Tom left and before they could audition a new bass player.

[Elite]

Knowing nothing about that guy, that does seem pretty cool to keep him involved in some way.  Nice to not see a bitter end.

Haken toured with Headspace for a while iirc, so that's where they (probably) know each other.

2012. The 'Anonymous Visions Tour'. Haken had just released Visions and Headspace had just released I Am Anoymous. Both bands played the albums in full. Those were cool gigs.

[cramx3]

That is pretty cool, I didn't discover Haken until a little over 2 years ago so their history is not something I really know much about. I'd love to see VIsions performed fully.  Probably should have gone to Progpower 18.