Game of Thrones (TV, fantasy) Thread

[KevShmev]

Emilia Clarke walks around Times Square dressed like Jon Snow:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acqxeL8mQvw

This is so hilarious.

Nobody watched this?? 

I did. I wish it was more of her interacting with people in disguise and less advertising for whatever it was.

That didn't bother me, as it is for a good cause.  More footage of her interacting with people would have been great, but the stuff they did show was hilarious.  Her looks at the camera when people were puzzled as to what she was saying and asking were gold.

[Volante99]

Arya’s battle has always been against those who betrayed her father and the Stark family. Vengeance is what drives her. She’s not “no one”. She’s Arya f-ing STARK, as she proclaims. This is what makes her story compelling, narratively. Her time to shine was King’s Landing.

Having her be the catalyst to end the war and kill the NK, while “badass”, feels like either fan service  or subversion for its own sake. It doesn’t really hold any weight to it.

I don't know, man.  She's the only trained assassin in the bunch.

She is the only one that I would have sent against the one guy we need to kill.  Makes perfect sense to me.

Exactly. Like she’s supposed to ignore the fight or Noght King to make sure she gets to kill Cersi?

Seems to me Joaquin knew from early on how important she’d be.....probably knew about the Night King and all that as well and trained her then allowed her to leave.

No, I’m saying there are other characters in the show that would have been more compelling in this story to take down the Night King. Maybe do SOMETHING with Bran? Maybe do SOMETHING with Jon Snow? A plot twist? Something clever? Literally ANYTHING would have been better than that. Maybe give me a reason to why I should have cared about that arc? Honestly, now that the NK is dead does it even matter who sits on the Throne? If so, why? Part of the imperative of that was the threat of the dead.

[TheOutlawXanadu]

I think when the Seasons done and you can look at it as a whole it'll be fine.

Honestly, the only 'issue' I've seen is since there hasn't been any source material to extrapolate from for a couple seasons now.....the 'fan theories' have been in full throttle mode and when/if they don't happen people are getting pretty mad...it's the same fate that SW's is suffering from. A lot of folks believe 'their' version of how it should go is better than what they're seeing.

to Adami's continuing point....the writing and character depth has suffered with the lack of GRM's books and writing etc etc to draw from. They've replaced the nuance of the show with a more simplified version. For me, doesn't bother me or matter much. Still enjoying the heck out of the show and I'm sure I'll be satisfied with what they give us. GRM consulted them and has 'directed' them on the path that he's going to take the books.....but, if you're looking to 'blame' anyone it should be GRM himself as he's had ample time to produce the next installment of his books.

Great post.

[cramx3]

Arya’s battle has always been against those who betrayed her father and the Stark family. Vengeance is what drives her. She’s not “no one”. She’s Arya f-ing STARK, as she proclaims. This is what makes her story compelling, narratively. Her time to shine was King’s Landing.

Having her be the catalyst to end the war and kill the NK, while “badass”, feels like either fan service  or subversion for its own sake. It doesn’t really hold any weight to it.

I don't know, man.  She's the only trained assassin in the bunch.

She is the only one that I would have sent against the one guy we need to kill.  Makes perfect sense to me.

Exactly. Like she’s supposed to ignore the fight or Noght King to make sure she gets to kill Cersi?

Seems to me Joaquin knew from early on how important she’d be.....probably knew about the Night King and all that as well and trained her then allowed her to leave.

No, I’m saying there are other characters in the show that would have been more compelling in this story to take down the Night King. Maybe do SOMETHING with Bran? Maybe do SOMETHING with Jon Snow? A plot twist? Something clever? Literally ANYTHING would have been better than that. Maybe give me a reason to why I should have cared about this show? Honestly, now that the NK is dead does it even matter who sits on the Throne? If so, why? Part of the imperative of that was the threat of the dead.

The only thing I have against Arya killing the NK is that it seems to go against the Azor Ahai prophecy.  Other than that, it does make sense and the episode actually gave us clues and reasoning to believe why she could do it (The library scene showed how smooth and quiet she is, we knew this from her training, but we see it in this scene, and of course Melisandre's words).  The killing itself with the dagger drop, the dagger from Bran, was also really cool.  There's no reason to think she couldn't play a big role in Kings Landing too, in fact, I almost wonder if she dies in Kings Landing now since she got her big heroic moment and payoff now.

[The Walrus]

Sigh. Once again, the Night King dying doesn't suddenly invalidate everything else in the show or the war for the throne. What do you think Stannis's arc was about? Renly's? Tywin's? Cersei? Daenerys? And on and on and on. You ask, "If so, why?" Because time is linear, and the world moves on. The Night King is dead, but Cersei is still in power, ready to destroy what is left of the North's army, enfeeble them and force them into submission once again, and continue ruling with an iron fist, building her dynasty, as she's pregnant with one last child.

I get not being happy with the Night King but acting like the rest of the show is invalidated now is insane. How's about we see what the last 4 hours of the show have in store before saying 'nothing matters'?

[lonestar]

Sansa is going to take down Cersei with the pointy end, possibly defending Tyrion after Bronn fails to kill him. It'd be sweet revenge for what Joffrey did to both of them. Sansa and Tyrion will end up ruling because Dany's going to die and Jon's going to be like "I'm going to rebuild and be king of the North instead". Speaking of, maybe Bronn actually kills Jaime? He did have that line "Listen to me, cunt. Till I get what I'm owed, a dragon doesn't get to kill you. You don't get to kill you. Only I get to kill you.".

And maybe the Hound saving Sansa from getting raped ages ago is a foreshadowing as well, having him save her from the Mountain would be a great set up for Clegane Bowl.

[gmillerdrake]

Arya’s battle has always been against those who betrayed her father and the Stark family. Vengeance is what drives her. She’s not “no one”. She’s Arya f-ing STARK, as she proclaims. This is what makes her story compelling, narratively. Her time to shine was King’s Landing.

Having her be the catalyst to end the war and kill the NK, while “badass”, feels like either fan service  or subversion for its own sake. It doesn’t really hold any weight to it.

I don't know, man.  She's the only trained assassin in the bunch.

She is the only one that I would have sent against the one guy we need to kill.  Makes perfect sense to me.

Exactly. Like she’s supposed to ignore the fight or Noght King to make sure she gets to kill Cersi?

Seems to me Joaquin knew from early on how important she’d be.....probably knew about the Night King and all that as well and trained her then allowed her to leave.

No, I’m saying there are other characters in the show that would have been more compelling in this story to take down the Night King. Maybe do SOMETHING with Bran? Maybe do SOMETHING with Jon Snow? A plot twist? Something clever? Literally ANYTHING would have been better than that. Maybe give me a reason to why I should have cared about that arc? Honestly, now that the NK is dead does it even matter who sits on the Throne? If so, why? Part of the imperative of that was the threat of the dead.

they did something with Bran. Bran appears to have know the entire time 'where' the Night King would die and 'how' he'd be killed....and even by who. Can you imagine the criticism they'd have faced had Jon Snow actually been the one to kill the Night King....how 'predictable' that'd have been?

Who else could have done it? They gave Dany a shot and TNK was immune to Dragon Fire. It'd have made zero sense for Brienne, Jamie, Poddirck, Grey Work, Daavos etc etc to have been the one to kill TNK.

Yet, we've had Arya on this journey of training to be an assassin for literally years....seemingly personally 'chosen' by Jaqen to become a faceless man....allowed to leave after she had completed her training despite being in open rebellion to him/them. It's not hard to imagine that even Jaqen had some sort of pre-knowledge as to how important she was to the survival of man. Arya being the one to kill the Night King made the most sense out of any of them honestly. 

[gmillerdrake]

Sansa is going to take down Cersei with the pointy end, possibly defending Tyrion after Bronn fails to kill him. It'd be sweet revenge for what Joffrey did to both of them. Sansa and Tyrion will end up ruling because Dany's going to die and Jon's going to be like "I'm going to rebuild and be king of the North instead". Speaking of, maybe Bronn actually kills Jaime? He did have that line "Listen to me, cunt. Till I get what I'm owed, a dragon doesn't get to kill you. You don't get to kill you. Only I get to kill you.".

And maybe the Hound saving Sansa from getting raped ages ago is a foreshadowing as well, having him save her from the Mountain would be a great set up for Clegane Bowl.

You get the feeling that the Hound is going to clear the way (kill the Mountain) for whichever character ultimately kills Cersi (IF she dies??)

[Chino]

Sansa is going to take down Cersei with the pointy end, possibly defending Tyrion after Bronn fails to kill him. It'd be sweet revenge for what Joffrey did to both of them. Sansa and Tyrion will end up ruling because Dany's going to die and Jon's going to be like "I'm going to rebuild and be king of the North instead". Speaking of, maybe Bronn actually kills Jaime? He did have that line "Listen to me, cunt. Till I get what I'm owed, a dragon doesn't get to kill you. You don't get to kill you. Only I get to kill you.".

And maybe the Hound saving Sansa from getting raped ages ago is a foreshadowing as well, having him save her from the Mountain would be a great set up for Clegane Bowl.

You get the feeling that the Hound is going to clear the way (kill the Mountain) for whichever character ultimately kills Cersi (IF she dies??)

I think that's how it will go down, though I see the Hound also dying in the process. I can't imagine Sansa actually fighting in any capacity, so my money is on her stabbing Cersei in the back, just like Jaime did to the mad king.

[Volante99]

Sigh. Once again, the Night King dying doesn't suddenly invalidate everything else in the show or the war for the throne. What do you think Stannis's arc was about? Renly's? Tywin's? Cersei? Daenerys? And on and on and on. You ask, "If so, why?" Because time is linear, and the world moves on. The Night King is dead, but Cersei is still in power, ready to destroy what is left of the North's army, enfeeble them and force them into submission once again, and continue ruling with an iron fist, building her dynasty, as she's pregnant with one last child.

I get not being happy with the Night King but acting like the rest of the show is invalidated now is insane. How's about we see what the last 4 hours of the show have in store before saying 'nothing matters'?

It's not completely invalidated, but it definitely looses it's "oomph". Again, part of the imperative to getting Cersei out of power was to unite Westeros (at least partially) to defeat the threat, which was NOT going to happen with her in power. Now the only thing driving the show is "Cersei's a meanie, Arya's a badass".

I need MORE. With 3 episodes left, I keep holding out that there is indeed more to it than that. 

[Volante99]

Arya’s battle has always been against those who betrayed her father and the Stark family. Vengeance is what drives her. She’s not “no one”. She’s Arya f-ing STARK, as she proclaims. This is what makes her story compelling, narratively. Her time to shine was King’s Landing.

Having her be the catalyst to end the war and kill the NK, while “badass”, feels like either fan service  or subversion for its own sake. It doesn’t really hold any weight to it.

I don't know, man.  She's the only trained assassin in the bunch.

She is the only one that I would have sent against the one guy we need to kill.  Makes perfect sense to me.

Exactly. Like she’s supposed to ignore the fight or Noght King to make sure she gets to kill Cersi?

Seems to me Joaquin knew from early on how important she’d be.....probably knew about the Night King and all that as well and trained her then allowed her to leave.

No, I’m saying there are other characters in the show that would have been more compelling in this story to take down the Night King. Maybe do SOMETHING with Bran? Maybe do SOMETHING with Jon Snow? A plot twist? Something clever? Literally ANYTHING would have been better than that. Maybe give me a reason to why I should have cared about that arc? Honestly, now that the NK is dead does it even matter who sits on the Throne? If so, why? Part of the imperative of that was the threat of the dead.

they did something with Bran. Bran appears to have know the entire time 'where' the Night King would die and 'how' he'd be killed....and even by who. Can you imagine the criticism they'd have faced had Jon Snow actually been the one to kill the Night King....how 'predictable' that'd have been?

Who else could have done it? They gave Dany a shot and TNK was immune to Dragon Fire. It'd have made zero sense for Brienne, Jamie, Poddirck, Grey Work, Daavos etc etc to have been the one to kill TNK.

Yet, we've had Arya on this journey of training to be an assassin for literally years....seemingly personally 'chosen' by Jaqen to become a faceless man....allowed to leave after she had completed her training despite being in open rebellion to him/them. It's not hard to imagine that even Jaqen had some sort of pre-knowledge as to how important she was to the survival of man. Arya being the one to kill the Night King made the most sense out of any of them honestly.

Why are you limiting the story that someone actually has to physically kill him? Something could have happened? Maybe involving Bran's power? Again, maybe something clever? Unexpected? A twist? I don't make millions of dollars writing TV but I think if I had a few years to figure something out, I'd be able to come up with something better than THAT?

Again, Arya's motivations and story has ALWAYS been about vengeance. That's what drives her character arc, that's what makes her anything besides a one-dimensional "badass". King's Landing is where her story has resonance (to me, anyway). Her journey had nothing to do with the Night King. And shoe-horning her into that in the last episode and making her the "savior" of the human race was not a satisfying conclusion to that arc, to me.

[Grappler]

Why are you limiting the story that someone actually has to physically kill him? Something could have happened? Maybe involving Bran's power? Again, maybe something clever? Unexpected? A twist? I don't make millions of dollars writing TV but I think if I had a few years to figure something out, I'd be able to come up with something better than THAT?

Again, Arya's motivations and story has ALWAYS been about vengeance. That's what drives her character arc, that's what makes her anything besides a one-dimensional "badass". King's Landing is where her story has resonance (to me, anyway). Her journey had nothing to do with the Night King. And shoe-horning her into that in the last episode and making her the "savior" of the human race was not a satisfying conclusion to that arc, to me.

Why are you limiting one character's motivations to only vengeance?  I think wanting to live to the next day and not wanting to see your brothers, sister, friends and mankind die are pretty strong motivations.  Can't Arya just put her list aside to fight with everyone else?  Or should she have ridden south to King's Landing alone, rather than fight in this battle with her family?

[The Walrus]

Sigh. Once again, the Night King dying doesn't suddenly invalidate everything else in the show or the war for the throne. What do you think Stannis's arc was about? Renly's? Tywin's? Cersei? Daenerys? And on and on and on. You ask, "If so, why?" Because time is linear, and the world moves on. The Night King is dead, but Cersei is still in power, ready to destroy what is left of the North's army, enfeeble them and force them into submission once again, and continue ruling with an iron fist, building her dynasty, as she's pregnant with one last child.

I get not being happy with the Night King but acting like the rest of the show is invalidated now is insane. How's about we see what the last 4 hours of the show have in store before saying 'nothing matters'?

It's not completely invalidated, but it definitely looses it's "oomph". Again, part of the imperative to getting Cersei out of power was to unite Westeros (at least partially) to defeat the threat, which was NOT going to happen with her in power. Now the only thing driving the show is "Cersei's a meanie, Arya's a badass".

I need MORE. With 3 episodes left, I keep holding out that there is indeed more to it than that.

Watering it down to "Cersei's a meanie" really shows you don't understand Cersei as a character, the entire arc she's gone through not just 8 seasons but her whole life, and the conflict between the Lannisters and the rest of the kingdoms... but I hope you get some enjoyment out of the last few episodes nonetheless. It's just a real shame you don't see Cersei for the deep character she is - arguably the deepest in the entire series.

[Volante99]

Why are you limiting the story that someone actually has to physically kill him? Something could have happened? Maybe involving Bran's power? Again, maybe something clever? Unexpected? A twist? I don't make millions of dollars writing TV but I think if I had a few years to figure something out, I'd be able to come up with something better than THAT?

Again, Arya's motivations and story has ALWAYS been about vengeance. That's what drives her character arc, that's what makes her anything besides a one-dimensional "badass". King's Landing is where her story has resonance (to me, anyway). Her journey had nothing to do with the Night King. And shoe-horning her into that in the last episode and making her the "savior" of the human race was not a satisfying conclusion to that arc, to me.

Why are you limiting one character's motivations to only vengeance?  I think wanting to live to the next day and not wanting to see your brothers, sister, friends and mankind die are pretty strong motivations.  Can't Arya just put her list aside to fight with everyone else?  Or should she have ridden south to King's Landing alone, rather than fight in this battle with her family?

Look, no one is saying Arya couldn’t kill the Night King or have motivation to do so given the opportunity, in the LITERAL sense. I’m speaking in narrative terms, her killing the NK doesn’t elevate her character or that arc. We already knew she’s the mega badass of the show. Obviously, the writers were being purposely subversive (similar to Snoke scene in Last Jedi).

Call me crazy but maybe, JUST maybe, there were better ways to be subversive but at the same time elevating this arc that has been looming in the background of the show for 8 years. Just my opinion. Obviously many fans are satisfied with how it all panned out.

[gmillerdrake]

Why are you limiting the story that someone actually has to physically kill him? Something could have happened? Maybe involving Bran's power? Again, maybe something clever? Unexpected? A twist? I don't make millions of dollars writing TV but I think if I had a few years to figure something out, I'd be able to come up with something better than THAT?

Again, Arya's motivations and story has ALWAYS been about vengeance. That's what drives her character arc, that's what makes her anything besides a one-dimensional "badass". King's Landing is where her story has resonance (to me, anyway). Her journey had nothing to do with the Night King. And shoe-horning her into that in the last episode and making her the "savior" of the human race was not a satisfying conclusion to that arc, to me.

Why are you limiting one character's motivations to only vengeance?  I think wanting to live to the next day and not wanting to see your brothers, sister, friends and mankind die are pretty strong motivations.  Can't Arya just put her list aside to fight with everyone else?  Or should she have ridden south to King's Landing alone, rather than fight in this battle with her family?

Arya made that choice. It was clear. She was headed to Kingslanding for her vengeance when she heard about Jon and Sansa being at Winterfell. She chose to go to Winterfell. It’s not out of character or out of nowhere for her to have killed TNK. It’s in fact, right along the lines of ‘who’ she is as a character.

[gmillerdrake]

Sigh. Once again, the Night King dying doesn't suddenly invalidate everything else in the show or the war for the throne. What do you think Stannis's arc was about? Renly's? Tywin's? Cersei? Daenerys? And on and on and on. You ask, "If so, why?" Because time is linear, and the world moves on. The Night King is dead, but Cersei is still in power, ready to destroy what is left of the North's army, enfeeble them and force them into submission once again, and continue ruling with an iron fist, building her dynasty, as she's pregnant with one last child.

I get not being happy with the Night King but acting like the rest of the show is invalidated now is insane. How's about we see what the last 4 hours of the show have in store before saying 'nothing matters'?

It's not completely invalidated, but it definitely looses it's "oomph". Again, part of the imperative to getting Cersei out of power was to unite Westeros (at least partially) to defeat the threat, which was NOT going to happen with her in power. Now the only thing driving the show is "Cersei's a meanie, Arya's a badass".

I need MORE. With 3 episodes left, I keep holding out that there is indeed more to it than that.

Watering it down to "Cersei's a meanie" really shows you don't understand Cersei as a character, the entire arc she's gone through not just 8 seasons but her whole life, and the conflict between the Lannisters and the rest of the kingdoms... but I hope you get some enjoyment out of the last few episodes nonetheless. It's just a real shame you don't see Cersei for the deep character she is - arguably the deepest in the entire series.

Cersi as a character has been incredible to watch evolve.

[Volante99]

Sigh. Once again, the Night King dying doesn't suddenly invalidate everything else in the show or the war for the throne. What do you think Stannis's arc was about? Renly's? Tywin's? Cersei? Daenerys? And on and on and on. You ask, "If so, why?" Because time is linear, and the world moves on. The Night King is dead, but Cersei is still in power, ready to destroy what is left of the North's army, enfeeble them and force them into submission once again, and continue ruling with an iron fist, building her dynasty, as she's pregnant with one last child.

I get not being happy with the Night King but acting like the rest of the show is invalidated now is insane. How's about we see what the last 4 hours of the show have in store before saying 'nothing matters'?

It's not completely invalidated, but it definitely looses it's "oomph". Again, part of the imperative to getting Cersei out of power was to unite Westeros (at least partially) to defeat the threat, which was NOT going to happen with her in power. Now the only thing driving the show is "Cersei's a meanie, Arya's a badass".

I need MORE. With 3 episodes left, I keep holding out that there is indeed more to it than that.

Watering it down to "Cersei's a meanie" really shows you don't understand Cersei as a character, the entire arc she's gone through not just 8 seasons but her whole life, and the conflict between the Lannisters and the rest of the kingdoms... but I hope you get some enjoyment out of the last few episodes nonetheless. It's just a real shame you don't see Cersei for the deep character she is - arguably the deepest in the entire series.

I was mocking the general sentiment. Personally I feel like she’s super deep. I actually like the character and understand her motivations. She’s a better fledged out character than either Jon Snow, or Dany. Which is why I don’t really feel invested in who gets the Throne without some sort of higher stakes (like the NK for example).

Compare her blowing up the Sept to Arya killing the NK. Not only was it unexpected and made Cersei “badass”, the story is elevated. You see Cersei’s motivations and the lengths she’s willing to go, and at the end it costs her son. THAT’S great story telling. Arya killing the Night King is just “oh wow, so ninja, so badass”. Cool, we already know that. And as much as people try, there’s nothing really deeper to it than that.

[The Walrus]

I kind of understand where you're coming from, on the other hand, I just want to shake you by the shoulders and say, "But haven't you been watching the last 8 seasons?!" I've been waiting for years at this point to see Cersei knocked off the throne, and I can't wait to see who leads Westeros in the end: Jon, a reluctant ruler but with a heart of gold, Dany, a leader who wishes to break the wheel and be a good leader but likely will not do either, Cersei, a mad and vengeful tyrant, or whether the Iron Throne will even exist. I get the complaints about Arya and the NK, I just feel sad it's ruined the anticipation for Cersei and the Iron Throne in these last few episodes since it's the future of Westeros we're talking about. I hope there's some good story turnaround that renews your faith

[Volante99]

I kind of understand where you're coming from, on the other hand, I just want to shake you by the shoulders and say, "But haven't you been watching the last 8 seasons?!" I've been waiting for years at this point to see Cersei knocked off the throne, and I can't wait to see who leads Westeros in the end: Jon, a reluctant ruler but with a heart of gold, Dany, a leader who wishes to break the wheel and be a good leader but likely will not do either, Cersei, a mad and vengeful tyrant, or whether the Iron Throne will even exist. I get the complaints about Arya and the NK, I just feel sad it's ruined the anticipation for Cersei and the Iron Throne in these last few episodes since it's the future of Westeros we're talking about. I hope there's some good story turnaround that renews your faith

Fair enough. I may be jumping the gun. In the context of the next episodes perhaps the last one will hold more significance. I have a sneaking suspicion there isn’t COMPLETE resolution to that arc.

[MirrorMask]

Sigh. Once again, the Night King dying doesn't suddenly invalidate everything else in the show or the war for the throne. What do you think Stannis's arc was about? Renly's? Tywin's? Cersei? Daenerys? And on and on and on. You ask, "If so, why?" Because time is linear, and the world moves on. The Night King is dead, but Cersei is still in power, ready to destroy what is left of the North's army, enfeeble them and force them into submission once again, and continue ruling with an iron fist, building her dynasty, as she's pregnant with one last child.

I get not being happy with the Night King but acting like the rest of the show is invalidated now is insane. How's about we see what the last 4 hours of the show have in store before saying 'nothing matters'?

Because it was the general assumption of many, many, many people that the entire overarching story was "People squabble for this and that throne and fail to see the bigger menace". Yes, the game of thrones is what actually make people interested, but the beautiful narrative device was that, in the biggest scheme of things, it didn't really matter - remember Commander Mormont to Jon Snow at the end of Season 1? "When dead things and worse come for us, do you think it matters who sits on the Iron Throne?" NO, IT WASN'T MEANT TO MATTER. At least that's how I and many other people saw it.

If you re-read the Lord of the Rings, you notice the hints that Gandalf drops about how you shouldn't mindlessly kill people, and that even Gollum has a part to play in the end. Imagine now that it was not just hints here and there, but it was made the whole point of the book: "Don't kill people for nothing", just like it was so evidently hammered home that "the only war that matters is the one against the dead". Now imagine that, with Lord of the Rings being almost every second page (or scene, if you think the movie) a reminder of "Don't kill people just for the sake of killing", Frodo at the end kills Gollum for no deep reason and heroically throws the Ring into the fire with a badass one-liner. The entire point of the story was that Gollum with his stupidity and carelessness was to accidentally destroy the ring, Frodo killing him would negate the entire premise.

Ah, I'll just let Tywin Lannister himself explain it.

[faizoff]

I watched the last episode again but this time on my PC and it looked soooo much better. I could see everything properly. And I think I loved the episode even more now. I'd give it a 9/10. There are still a few things I wished they had given a bit more visual context, maybe have a general of sorts on the field commanding the moves, esp like the Dothraki horde. And another is to not always show characters always on the brink of death being saved at the last minute. But I accept they may have done that to save some of them for later in the season.
I loved the ending sequence a lot, just that last 10 mins I must've seen like 30 times.

It goes without saying that the season would benefit immensely with more episodes but it is what it is and we have just 3 more to wrap things up. I cannot be more excited and will probably just stay off the internet anything GOT related until the series finale.

[Podaar]

For those who have a problem with it being Arya and not Jon who took down the Night King, I thought it was them working together that got the job done.

The ice dragon is guarding the entrance to the Godswood, so Jon distracts it by standing in it's grill yelling "Gooooooo, Go." Then seconds later you see the hair of one of the WW fluff out as if a breeze went by and he has a "What?" look on his face. Then immediately Arya is in a running flying leap at the Night King. I didn't notice this sequence until I watched it a second time without the distraction of house guests.

It appears Jon was sacrificing himself to give Arya a chance to take a run at the Night King. Maybe he wasn't as useless as he appeared. 

[MirrorMask]

....or not.

Just rewatched the scene - Jon does not seem to look at any specific point (if at all, it could be argued that Theon was seemingly looking above himself in his final moments), the subtitles say "[YELLS]" and not "Go, go" and the very next scene after that is Arya jumping, so there's not even the time to go from whatever Jon was into the Godswood.

And the jumping is what annoys me. I accept Arya as the killer. I don't accept that she jumped out of the goddamn nowhere and that the authors confirm it,

See that scene - she is on a ramp. Ok, I understand that shooting a scene is something different and the fact that, in reality, they had to use a ramp does not mean in the scene there could be another point for her to jump that is added with CGI or whatever. But still, she jumps out of the goddamn nowhere and that's what ruins it all - shock value for shock value.

Cersei blowing up the Sept was badass and well written. She had the motivation, the means, and it was orchestrated well. Maybe it doesn't happen in the book - who cares, it was awesome and fitting to her story. Arya killing the Night King sneaking up on him is still fitting - Arya appearing out of thin air is not.

Remember Pippin stabbing the Nazgul in the leg when he was facing Eowyn? he was right there, and was on the ground. He didn't jump out of nowhere. There were no need for rationalizations such as "Oh come on, you saw him get out of Minas Tirith 20 minutes before, do you need to see him walking to the battlefield?" or "well, he's an Hobbit, he's small, he can't be detected and in a previous scene he was shown to be able to run fast" or whatever.

[hefdaddy42]

But, if she didn't "jump from nowhere", she never would have made it to the Night King.  The other Walkers would have killed her long before.

No one else could have gotten the drop on him, and no one could beat him in a regular fight, and not even dragonfire fazed him.  Really, I'm not sure what else you would have them do.

[Chino]

But, if she didn't "jump from nowhere", she never would have made it to the Night King.  The other Walkers would have killed her long before.

No one else could have gotten the drop on him, and no one could beat him in a regular fight, and not even dragonfire fazed him.  Really, I'm not sure what else you would have them do.

Be real about it and allow the Knight King to lay waste to all of the 7 Kingdoms, taking the throne for himself.

[cramx3]

Is it possible Arya wore the face of a wight to get that close?  My friend told me this as fact, but I haven't seen it anywhere as fact or even discussed. 

[Podaar]

I never new those "Game revealed" things existed. Pretty cool.

If I'm not mistaken, the spot you reference  in the documentary is the director talking about achieving the shot of "her flying out of know where", not that she literally flew out of know where. I was simply commenting that the sequence made it appear like she took the opportunity provided by Jon to run and take a running leap at the NK. Was it hollywoodeque? Sure.

I was more commenting, that on second watch, I thought perhaps Jon actually achieved something. I'm probably wrong though.

As for taking CC for canon. I don't recommend it. I've seen some pretty stupid shit in close captioning.

[Chino]

Is it possible Arya wore the face of a wight to get that close?  My friend told me this as fact, but I haven't seen it anywhere as fact or even discussed.

Doubt it.   

1) She was on the run the entire time. When did she get one.
2) The creators wouldn't have hid that as stealing faces is such a big part of her character.
3) She wouldn't have taken it off before making the kill. "I snuck up to the garden, now let me take off my disguise as I try and sneak through the last line of defense". That would make zero sense.

[cramx3]

Is it possible Arya wore the face of a wight to get that close?  My friend told me this as fact, but I haven't seen it anywhere as fact or even discussed.

Doubt it.   

1) She was on the run the entire time. When did she get one.
2) The creators wouldn't have hid that as stealing faces is such a big part of her character.
3) She wouldn't have taken it off before making the kill. "I snuck up to the garden, now let me take off my disguise as I try and sneak through the last line of defense". That would make zero sense.

She revealed herself before killing Walder so there is precedence to it.  I don't think the creators need to say anything for it to be true, but I do admit they would be more likely to talk about it since it wasn't clearly shown as a way to explain things.  And lastly we don't need to see it to beleive, go back to the Walder scene, we don't see where or how she got that face.

Having said that, I'm not saying I believe she used a face of a wight, just thinking maybe that could be the explanation.  But I keep going back to that library scene, one of my favorites from the episode (minus the silence, I don't know how there could be silence in that room with whats going on outside), because I think that was the foreshadow of how Arya can get around unnoticed in her own face.

[The Walrus]

I wrote up a few different very long posts but thought it would come off as annoying which is my biggest fear so I deleted it. I suppose we'll agree to disagree MM, but I see what you're saying. I just vehemently disagree with the savage criticism the entire show is now receiving because people's expectations weren't met with one episode. I too am disappointed, but to a lesser extent, and I certainly don't believe it lessens the importance of the conflict over the Iron Throne. The Night King isn't even the most important overarching story, it was just the most pressing. Humanity is finite, power is temporary, Cersei will eventually die, but the undead need no food, no rest, no water, it is analogous to a destructive force of nature, representative of Death itself - every body that falls is another troop for the undead. And I get wanting to know more lore and backstory, but that is the beauty of this whole thing to me. We have been told exactly what the White Walkers were and what the Night King is. The Night King's only goal is to destroy Mankind. The First Men invaded the Children of the Forest's home and they created a weapon to push them back, and it went AWOL on everybody. The White Walkers are sacrificed humans turned magically by the NK, and the wights are the regular plain Jane undead. The main characters have no time to get some cliché last minute speech from the Night King or some lengthy exposition on it, Bran just got right to the point. And I like that. The main characters, even the audience, DON'T need all this secondary info. Sometimes learning more about a legendary, magical being ruins the mystique and draw to the character.

There are two other massive storylines at the very minimum: Daenerys's quest to return home and conquer the throne, and how Cersei is going to attempt to stay in power for good. And they've been in play since episode 1. Night King didn't even show his face until season 4. So while the NK's storyline is more pressing and urgent, and definitely the scariest, I strongly disagree that it is the most important. It is because of its urgency that they've been building it up, and now that it's done for (at least for this cycle, maybe Westeros will eventually relive the threat, we don't know), we can focus on the last obstacle: Cersei, whatever dark shit Qyburn has conjured up, Zombie Clegane, and her army of elephants golden-clad mercenaries.

More characters should've died though. Maybe Brienne got Lt. Dan'd and got her legs eaten

[KevShmev]

The smarts of Cersei cannot be underestimated.  Remember that she was on to something being amiss with the dragons at the end of 7 since Danny showed up at their meeting (when Jon showed them the wight) with only 2, not 3, while Jamie figured one was guarding a fleet. Cersei even said, "the dragons are vulnerable." Don't think she won't have a plan for when the dragons come flying into King's Landing.  Not saying she will win the war, but she will have a plan to try and counteract the dragons.

[The Walrus]

The smarts of Cersei cannot be underestimated.  Remember that she was on to something being amiss with the dragons at the end of 7 since Danny showed up at their meeting (when Jon showed them the wight) with only 2, not 3, while Jamie figured one was guarding a fleet. Cersei even said, "the dragons are vulnerable." Don't think she won't have a plan for when the dragons come flying into King's Landing.  Not saying she will win the war, but she will have a plan to try and counteract the dragons.

I'll bet you lunch she's ordered more than one ballista to take down the dragons. She'll probably line the battlements of the Red Keep with them. I think she, unlike the Night King, will hole herself up in the Red Keep at all times, she absolutely won't expose herself. I'm predicting death in the Red Keep somehow.

[cramx3]

The smarts of Cersei cannot be underestimated.  Remember that she was on to something being amiss with the dragons at the end of 7 since Danny showed up at their meeting (when Jon showed them the wight) only 2, not 3, while Jamie figured one was guarding a fleet. Cersei even said, "the dragons are vulnerable." Don't think she won't have a plan for when the dragons come flying into King's Landing.  Not saying she will win the war, but she will have a plan to try and counteract the dragons.

Oh for sure, the scorpions will be out ready for a dragon attack.  Qyburn could have more tricks up his sleeve as well.  I do wonder if the Iron Bank however will outsmart Cersei or maybe she will outsmart them.  Plus Bronn's mission is still out there, maybe there is some spin to that because maybe she realizes he is unlikely to do it.

[MirrorMask]

I wrote up a few different very long posts but thought it would come off as annoying which is my biggest fear so I deleted it.

Nah, don't worry man, it's all good fun discussing and dissecting the show  it's such a landmark moment in TV history that we all become so passionate about it, but there's no right or wrong, just people having different points of view. The only people who are wrong are those who name their daughters Khaleesi. 

Is it possible Arya wore the face of a wight to get that close?  My friend told me this as fact, but I haven't seen it anywhere as fact or even discussed.

Not at all - White Walkers shatters upon impact and there were no wights there which are all commanded by the Night King anyway, he would have noticed a wight he didn't summon.

But, if she didn't "jump from nowhere", she never would have made it to the Night King.  The other Walkers would have killed her long before.

No one else could have gotten the drop on him, and no one could beat him in a regular fight, and not even dragonfire fazed him.  Really, I'm not sure what else you would have them do.

I'd have her do the biggest moment of the entire culmination of the White Walkers saga not leaving me wondering "where the hell did she come from" rather than rejoice. I did not need to wonder where the hell Cersei got the wildfire to make the Sept explode. Both in the book and in the movie, going back to my Lord of the Rings example, I did not need to wonder how come Pippin could sneak up on the Nazgul king. But here and on Reddit and  everywhere else people are asking themselves right that. That's the sign that something's wrong, for me.

Also - there was a tree, Bran was standing beneath it. If Arya had hidden there, I would have been fine with it. Last season she was shown doing the knife drop trick? in this very episode she distracted the wights tossing a book or whatever it was on one side, and running away from the other. Have her hiding in the tree, toss anything behind the Night King so that he turns his back, and then jump at him from above, because she's hidden in the tree. That would have raised no questions from me and probably from many other people as well.

[RuRoRul]

Because it was the general assumption of many, many, many people that the entire overarching story was "People squabble for this and that throne and fail to see the bigger menace". Yes, the game of thrones is what actually make people interested, but the beautiful narrative device was that, in the biggest scheme of things, it didn't really matter - remember Commander Mormont to Jon Snow at the end of Season 1? "When dead things and worse come for us, do you think it matters who sits on the Iron Throne?" NO, IT WASN'T MEANT TO MATTER. At least that's how I and many other people saw it.

If you re-read the Lord of the Rings, you notice the hints that Gandalf drops about how you shouldn't mindlessly kill people, and that even Gollum has a part to play in the end. Imagine now that it was not just hints here and there, but it was made the whole point of the book: "Don't kill people for nothing", just like it was so evidently hammered home that "the only war that matters is the one against the dead". Now imagine that, with Lord of the Rings being almost every second page (or scene, if you think the movie) a reminder of "Don't kill people just for the sake of killing", Frodo at the end kills Gollum for no deep reason and heroically throws the Ring into the fire with a badass one-liner. The entire point of the story was that Gollum with his stupidity and carelessness was to accidentally destroy the ring, Frodo killing him would negate the entire premise.

Ah, I'll just let Tywin Lannister himself explain it.

I know your post wasn't specifically about about this but I think it's part of an overarching discussion (and I see it as a good jumping off point for me) about the White Walker threat being resolved now and the last 3 episodes focusing on (apparently) political and human conflicts such as who sits on the Iron Throne, and whether that is right for Game of Thrones / ASOIAF because of the previous point that was hammered home that the bigger threat matters more than the fighting over rule.

I don't see it as a question of either the message about the bigger threat was wrong, or the show is betraying its own message by not making the fight against the White Walkers the "endgame" (as I've seen many commenters elsewhere refer to it as). And that's because this was the endgame, this was the climax to the "biggest" story arc in the show, the fight against the potentially world ending threat.

Based on some discussions I'd seen elsewhere where people were acting as though the White Walkers had been dealt with so early and how that indicated they were just a sideplot or a plot device for some bigger "endgame", I did a little number crunching to help demonstrate my point: as of the end of the episode The Long Night, we are 94% of the way through Game of Thrones. And yes, that's accurate down to minutes of runtime (based on the estimated lengths for the last 3 episodes, which might be approximate placeholders rather than exact, but still). So when we're talking about the White Walker storyline and whether or not that was set aside too early, we're talking about a storyline that was introduced in the first scene and had it's climax 94% of the way through the entire story. So it's not over because it was set aside for a "bigger endgame" - it's over because it's near the end of the story.

You mention Lord of the Rings in your post and, although it's not related to the point you were making from it, it reminds me of GRRM's appreciation for Lord of the Rings and specifically the ending (as quoted earlier):

GRRM: " I’ve said before that the tone of the ending that I’m going for is bittersweet. I mean, it’s no secret that Tolkien has been a huge influence on me, and I love the way he ended Lord of the Rings. It ends with victory, but it’s a bittersweet victory. Frodo is never whole again, and he goes away to the Undying Lands, and the other people live their lives. And the scouring of the Shire—brilliant piece of work, which I didn’t understand when I was 13 years old: “Why is this here? The story’s over?” But every time I read it I understand the brilliance of that segment more and more. All I can say is that’s the kind of tone I will be aiming for. Whether I achieve it or not, that will be up to people like you and my readers to judge."

In Lord of the Rings a lot was made of how important the quest to destroy the ring is. Do you know at what stage of the books the ring is destroyed? It's 91% of the way through. A whole couple of chapters before the equivalent stage of the story where the Night King was killed in Game of Thrones. I don't think the fact that the story moved on to include other things after the destruction of the ring invalidated the claims that it was the most important task or undercut that storyline. It's just that the story isn't over when the world ending threat is defeated. And for GRRM, that "what happens after the world is saved?" is an even bigger interest than Tolkien (he's pretty much stated that's one of the things that inspired him, taking a high fantasy story and delving into the human complications that would arise out of it). That's why I don't think Game of Thrones having some part of its story (6%, remember) addressing the conflict that occurs "after" the great war necessarily undercuts the importance of the great war that came before it.

I do think that the poor structure of these last two seasons has heightened this feeling for people though. If they had somehow managed to produce these last two seasons as one extended 13 episode season (or even just labelled them Season 7A and 7B) then I think people wouldn't mind as much the battle against the Others falling in episode 10. Because 94% of the story or not, there's no way to stop people feeling like "halfway through a season" is leaving too much for after the Night King if he was supposed to be the greatest threat.

Edit: Also  at the gif. I hate and avoid that place because if the slightest leak comes out they spam it everywhere (thankfully leaks have been very limited this season so it's not as big a concern) but it's a shame as there's some funny content made there.