Job hunting while currently employed.

[Stadler]

So. Another question. I have my interview tomorrow. It's actually three separate interviews with three different managers. On the two phone interviews I had, I was asked "What is your current salary?" and "What kind of salary are you looking for?". If I get asked that tomorrow, how am I suppose to properly answer that?

I HATE that!!! You immediately give them the upper hand in knowing what you make and desire to make. They could very well be in the position and willing to pay you much more but then you lay a big gift on them by announcing what you make.

Maybe take the approach of letting them know your salary and then when they ask 'what are you looking for'....tell them "not to make a lateral move in salary". Maybe that'll increase your negotiation leverage? Perhaps you can present a case that even though your making 'X' salary now that you are worth much more given what you accomplish at work?

That's actually a misconception; generally speaking, when two parties are discussing "numbers", the final number is more often than not closer to the original (first) number, so on the whole it is to your advantage to throw out the number first.  The idea is that the first number sets the acceptable range (and the baseline for comparison) on whatever the final number is.   The problem is, "generally" doesn't mean "always", and for this to work in any one person's favor it requires a level of honesty that most people don't possess (in your own abilities and the value of that position in the organization) and a level of information that you might not be able to access in order for that to be case on a specific basis.  I know for me, when I answer that question, I do make it a "total package" discussion and say that the number itself is negotiable based on the other compensation included.  I am lucky, though, in that I have built up a pretty reliable network through which I know what a fair number is for any position; I always have a number in case there is no option but to give one. 

[Chino]

So I had the interviews on Tuesday afternoon and got this response late yesterday.

*snip*

I'm thrilled, but at the same time, I would have bet money that Tuesday would have been the final interview(s). I don't like that I'm going to have to dip out of my current job again some time in the near future.

[gmillerdrake]

That's good news!! Congrats on making it to another round.....any indication on how many rounds there are 

[Chino]

Thanks dude. I'm hoping four is the magic number 

[Stadler]

Is it just me, or would anyone else be a slight bit peeved if a work communication they sent (involving a human resources issue no less) to a potential new hire was posted for all (outside the company) to see on an internet forum board?

To provide perspective: I have three times now randomly encountered people in real life (two at work, one socially) with whom I later found out had connections via internet forums (two - both work - who posted on the MP forum, and one - the social one - who posted on a Marillion forum).

[Chino]

Is it just me, or would anyone else be a slight bit peeved if a work communication they sent (involving a human resources issue no less) to a potential new hire was posted for all (outside the company) to see on an internet forum board?

Depends what the contents of the communication being sent were and the context it was being used in. 

[Calvin6s]

I would take Stadler's advice and delete the screen capture and replace it with some more generalized convo like you did before.

[Nick]

Brian, as much as having to go back sucks, I'd say that if you're to the point where they are having you meet with all these people, it's likely to the point of you having the job unless you say or do something incredibly dumb that day. Or possibly between you and 1 other person, so hopefully there is light at the end of the tunnel soon.

[gmillerdrake]

Just to seal the deal I'd e-mail them this pic.....




.....and just say you can't wait to 'connect' with them.

[Chino]

So... a little update.

I had my 4th round interview on Tuesday morning. I had four interviews and spent a half hour with each person. About thirty minutes after leaving, I got a call from the company. It was a girl from HR/Talent Acquisition saying that a manger wanted me to come in for an interview on Friday for another position (I applied to two within this company). I set up the interview for Friday afternoon.

Last night (Wednesday), I received another call from the company. They offered me the job for the first position I interviewed for. I accepted and just cancelled my interview(s) on Friday. No start date yet. They need to run the background check and I need to set up a drug test for tomorrow. Once those check out, I'll be given a start date. The drug test has me a little concerned. I like weed, but I haven't smoked since mid-august just for this reason. I took an at home test last night and passed, but it's still in the back of my mind. Once that clears, I'll really celebrate.

On an even more positive note, this job bumps my pay up 9.5% 

[ariich]

You get drugs tests in the US? Wow.

[Chino]

You get drugs tests in the US? Wow.

I could understand an employer wanting to know if they're hiring a meth head or a heroin addict, but I think testing for weed is complete bullshit.

[cramx3]

Not every company drug tests, but many do.  My current employer does not and according to my boss, "we dont drug test because none of us would work here"

Anyway Chino, Congrats! Dont be worried about the weed, if you passed an at home test you will pass their test... its the same thing assuming its a piss test.  Ive tested this theory before.

[ariich]

Well yeah, but passing a drugs test doesn't preclude someone from taking drugs as soon as they get the job. I've never heard of that happening here in the UK. Contracts of employment always come with rules around conduct which would cover things like that, so if you're hired and you breach that code of conduct, they can put you on disciplinary and then fire you.

[cramx3]

Well yeah, but passing a drugs test doesn't preclude someone from taking drugs as soon as they get the job. I've never heard of that happening here in the UK. Contracts of employment always come with rules around conduct which would cover things like that, so if you're hired and you breach that code of conduct, they can put you on disciplinary and then fire you.

Yea that would normally be apart of a code of conduct and sure you can do drugs right after you pass a test.  I think its really just a way for a company to see how serious a candidate is.  Like what Chino did, he stopped using because he knew he wanted a job.  If you have control over that then it would seem that drug use is not a problem in your life.

[ariich]

I guess. Still seems fairly extreme to me, but hey ho.

[Chino]

Well yeah, but passing a drugs test doesn't preclude someone from taking drugs as soon as they get the job.

I'm packing a bowl, putting on my 3D glasses, and watching Avatar as soon as I get the official call.   

Well yeah, but passing a drugs test doesn't preclude someone from taking drugs as soon as they get the job. I've never heard of that happening here in the UK. Contracts of employment always come with rules around conduct which would cover things like that, so if you're hired and you breach that code of conduct, they can put you on disciplinary and then fire you.

Yea that would normally be apart of a code of conduct and sure you can do drugs right after you pass a test.  I think its really just a way for a company to see how serious a candidate is.  Like what Chino did, he stopped using because he knew he wanted a job.  If you have control over that then it would seem that drug use is not a problem in your life.

Possibly, but I think it has more to due with liability and unpredictable costs. If a company is paying you benefits, they don't want to have to cover hospital bills that may be attributed to cocaine use. I've read that it is estimated (in the US) that employers lose between $70B and $100B annually as a result of employees using drugs on and off the clock.

[ariich]

Ah wait, you get health insurance from your employer? That's fair enough then, I retract my comments. Doesn't apply here as our healthcare is paid for from our taxes.

[gmillerdrake]

Congrats Brian!! That's a great way to start 2015. If you haven't smoked since August and you passed an in home test I wouldn't get to worried about the drug test. I'd just be concerned that your celebration movie is going to freak you out

[Chino]

Ah wait, you get health insurance from your employer? That's fair enough then, I retract my comments. Doesn't apply here as our healthcare is paid for from our taxes.

Yeah. That's the kicker. My current health coverage gives me dental, clinic, and hospital coverage, as well as a card with $500 that can be used toward any prescriptions and medication I might need to buy throughout the year. I wish we'd go to a single payer system (the affordable care act is a good first step). I think it's super shitty that your medical coverage gets dictated by where you are employed.

Congrats Brian!! That's a great way to start 2015. If you haven't smoked since August and you passed an in home test I wouldn't get to worried about the drug test. I'd just be concerned that your celebration movie is going to freak you out

Thanks! Definitely a good way to kick off the year. I think I'm good as far as the movie goes. I survived it in Imax six times 



On a crappy note, I was just looking at some stuff for my current job. I need to be here for a year to collect my company's matching contributions to my 401k. It looks like I might fall a week or two short. If I put in my two weeks and they let me finish them out, I'll be fine. If they tell me to just pack up my things and leave at the end of the day, I'm going to be losing about $4200 

[Stadler]

Well yeah, but passing a drugs test doesn't preclude someone from taking drugs as soon as they get the job. I've never heard of that happening here in the UK. Contracts of employment always come with rules around conduct which would cover things like that, so if you're hired and you breach that code of conduct, they can put you on disciplinary and then fire you.

Notwithstanding the "bullshit" comment, it is almost always a baseline liability issue to establish no prior knowledge.   As of the date of hire the company can say with proper due diligence that to their knowledge you were drug free.  This can be a factor/requirement of the contracts the company has, or the healthcare program offered by the company.   You might also be asked to sign a document to that effect.  I know my company has a contractual requirement for much of their work funded by the government (for my division, about 65% of backlog) that it be a "drug free workplace", and in lieu of even stricter periodic screenings, we do onboarding testing, and have the employee sign a waiver that they will continue to be drug free.

I'm as pro-legalization as the next guy (actually, more) but a job is a priviledge, not a right, and if the employer, in exchange for paying you and giving you benefits, wants to have (nominally) a drug-free workplace - regardless of the practicality of the program - I think we should thank our lucky stars that it isn't worse.  I have seen customers ask for quarterly testing of key employees. 

[Chino]

Well yeah, but passing a drugs test doesn't preclude someone from taking drugs as soon as they get the job. I've never heard of that happening here in the UK. Contracts of employment always come with rules around conduct which would cover things like that, so if you're hired and you breach that code of conduct, they can put you on disciplinary and then fire you.

Notwithstanding the "bullshit" comment, it is almost always a baseline liability issue to establish no prior knowledge.   As of the date of hire the company can say with proper due diligence that to their knowledge you were drug free.  This can be a factor/requirement of the contracts the company has, or the healthcare program offered by the company.   You might also be asked to sign a document to that effect.  I know my company has a contractual requirement for much of their work funded by the government (for my division, about 65% of backlog) that it be a "drug free workplace", and in lieu of even stricter periodic screenings, we do onboarding testing, and have the employee sign a waiver that they will continue to be drug free.

To add to this... Insurance companies play a big part in this as well. Not so much in corporate environments, but in retail locations where people are using forklifts and moving heavy stuff, an insurer will often times give you a significantly better rate if you test all employees prior to employment.

[ariich]

On a crappy note, I was just looking at some stuff for my current job. I need to be here for a year to collect my company's matching contributions to my 401k. It looks like I might fall a week or two short. If I put in my two weeks and they let me finish them out, I'll be fine. If they tell me to just pack up my things and leave at the end of the day, I'm going to be losing about $4200 

Does your contract not contain a notice period? If so I would have thought it'd be longer than two weeks?

[Chino]

Two weeks is pretty much the standard here.

[hefdaddy42]

Congrats, Chino!

[Chino]

 

[kirksnosehair]

Congrats on the new gig, Brian 

[Chino]

Thanks mate!

[Chino]

Urinalysis came back negative 

Feb 2 is my official start date

[gmillerdrake]

Great News!!!!

[ariich]

Congrats!

[Chino]

I'm giving my two weeks today and I'm terrified. I've never had to give two weeks before! My boss is going to take it very personally.

[gmillerdrake]

I'm giving my two weeks today and I'm terrified. I've never had to give two weeks before! My boss is going to take it very personally.

Yeah....that's a tough situation especially if you have a good relationship with your boss. I worked an an Architecture firm for close to 8 years and my boss and I were very close....went to hockey games together....talked a lot.....but when it came to turn my 2 weeks in to take a job with more of a career path it was hard and he was visibly upset (as was I). Thankfully we still speak and it's now just a friendship.


Good Luck

[Calvin6s]

I'm giving my two weeks today and I'm terrified. I've never had to give two weeks before! My boss is going to take it very personally.

Just tell them the truth.  You were moved into a division that you didn't feel comfortable, you had voiced your reservations and they weren't received.  And if they try to keep you by promising to move you, tell them that you don't want to have to take it to the level of two weeks notice every time you feel uncomfortable with your job duties.

And yes, just because you give two weeks notice doesn't mean they have to keep you on two weeks.  But if they let you go on the spot, they also have to have your pay in hand.

[cramx3]

I'm giving my two weeks today and I'm terrified. I've never had to give two weeks before! My boss is going to take it very personally.

Just tell them the truth.  You were moved into a division that you didn't feel comfortable, you had voiced your reservations and they weren't received.  And if they try to keep you by promising to move you, tell them that you don't want to have to take it to the level of two weeks notice every time you feel uncomfortable with your job duties.

And yes, just because you give two weeks notice doesn't mean they have to keep you on two weeks.  But if they let you go on the spot, they also have to have your pay in hand.

Really? I believe different states have different rules for these kind of things too which I am not knowledgeable in, but I know my co worker who works in CA got fired and they had to give him two weeks of pay regardless whereas I would not get that in NJ.