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General => General Music Discussion => Topic started by: Phoenix87x on June 20, 2012, 10:18:29 AM
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https://www.billboard.com/news#/news/exclusive-queensryche-parts-ways-with-geoff-1007371752.story
Well it looks like the Queensryche name shall live on, but in a new form. With Todd La Torre as the new singer.
EDIT by bosk1: In case you don't want to search the thread for the new song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6w4RfoUv9KU&nofeather=True
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A bittersweet day. Geoff has given us many special moments and his voice is the soundtrack to many parts of my life, but the direction he's been going is not the direction that the rest of QR and most fans want. Best of luck, Geoff. You're a legend.
EDIT: Just popped on the Empire CD. Oh, man. That voice. I fell in love with it immediately back in the day. :-\
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Wow. Mebert, you about summed up how I'm feeling. Sad to see it came to this, but given the direction the band has been going, this is the BEST Queensryche-related news in years. Consider my interest in this band rekindled.
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Wow. I would like to say I am surprised, but after seeing the Rising West show a couple of weekends ago, this seems to make all the sense in the world. But how did this not turn in to a Waters/Gilmour epic legal battle?
Also:
"Over the past few months, there have been growing creative differences within Queensryche.
"Months?"
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Scott may simply have been trying to be diplomatic. Or he may just be referring to the "final straw(s)" of the situation without dragging out the whole history.
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So Queensryche is taking the same path as Journey and Styx. Enough is enough. Good for them.
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They pretty much had to. At least Journey and Styx could still sell albums, get booking, and were interested in writing their own music. Queensryche...not so much. I hope they turn the corner and this reignites them, which I think it will. My only real concern is that the more casual fans who haven't been paying attention to where the band has been heading will see that Geoff is no longer in the band and just write them off. That would be a great loss.
And on another note, in terms of getting updated info on the band: I have no idea whether the guys will take the intiative to whip the official QR website back into shape. But until that happens (if it does), the most updated information and candid discussion is more often than not found at https://www.anybodylistening.net/breakdownroom/
:mindcrime:
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This is pretty interesting stuff. Tate's voice was awesome back in the day, and the band wouldn't have been the same without him, but I think it's definitely safe to say that he's led them downhill and they need to move on. Dedicated to Chaos was kind of the last straw for me as far as QR went, and I wasn't going to buy any more of their new material...but now I'm really interested to see how the Tate-less Queensryche will fair.
Interest rekindled.
Good luck to the band and to the Tate.
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Queensryche has been one of my favorite bands for such a long time, and I've been anticipating an announcement like this for months, but it still feels strange. I am glad that the Queensryche is opening a new chapter and I think Todd is an excellent choice. I am so excited about what their new album will sound like. I've been very loyal to Queensryche and have bought all of their albums--even if American Soldier, Tribe, and Dedicated to Chaos were disappointments, I always found some songs from those to enjoy and appreciate. However, I am so happy that the metal will finally return for Queensryche!!! :metal
At the same time, I hope the Queensryche and metal community will still give Geoff Tate's solo material a chance. After all he has given us over the years, he deserves our support. His first solo album was filled with creative, passionate material and I'm anxious to hear his follow up.
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Queensryche is now in a similar position as Dream Theater were. For better or worse Geoff Tate was the one doing most of the leg work and was the largest icon on the band, even if he wasn't the dominant songwriter. The rest of the guys are going to need to step up to the plate and deliver big time, or frankly this won't matter one bit as the fans will just continue to slip away as they have been for years.
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Queensryche is now in a similar position as Dream Theater were. For better or worse Geoff Tate was the one doing most of the leg work and was the largest icon on the band, even if he wasn't the dominant songwriter. The rest of the guys are going to need to step up to the plate and deliver big time, or frankly this won't matter one bit as the fans will just continue to slip away as they have been for years.
IMO, even more so because Geoff was MUCH more integral to the band's sound (both in terms of perception and reality) than Mike was to DT.
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To me, what set Queensryche apart from other bands were their concepts and lyrics that gave them the title of "thinking man's metal band." Tate was largely responsible for those concepts. Without him, they become a metal band again, but the concepts/lyrics remain a concern for me. I'll be curious what they come up with without Tate. He has had some genius creative moments with QR, albeit he lost his way with the laughable cabaret and Dedicated to Chaos.
I would have preferred they stay Rising West and let the QR name retire. But I'll support them.
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So...DT/QR tour...please?
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So...DT/QR tour...please?
Throw in FW and we'll be in business. Still regret missing that tour.
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Queensryche is now in a similar position as Dream Theater were. For better or worse Geoff Tate was the one doing most of the leg work and was the largest icon on the band, even if he wasn't the dominant songwriter. The rest of the guys are going to need to step up to the plate and deliver big time, or frankly this won't matter one bit as the fans will just continue to slip away as they have been for years.
IMO, even more so because Geoff was MUCH more integral to the band's sound (both in terms of perception and reality) than Mike was to DT.
Yep. Plus, I am not sure I would say Portnoy was the largest icon in the band. Petrucci is a guitar god and is as well-known a guitar player as Portnoy is a drummer, if not moreso.
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So...DT/QR tour...please?
:2metal:
A fan on another site said this: "this feels like when a relative or friend are dying and you know the end is unavoidable, and then you get the call." I completely get where he is coming from, but I have a slightly different take. To me, it would be more accurate to say: this feels like when a relative or friend are dying and you know the end is unavoidable, and then you get the call where they tell you it looked like the end, but at the 11th hour, the doctors figured out they could save his life by just amputating his leg. And even though that leg was part of what made him an olympic track star, the good news is that not only will he live, but they were able to give him a new bionic leg that lets him run faster than a cheetah on crank and can fire missiles and lasers.
Honestly, while this is indeed bittersweet news, when you look at where the band was heading, and Geoff's headspace and completely unrepentent attitude for how he has been destroying the band's reputation and his own voice in the process, the news is ultimately more sweet than bitter. I am firmly convinced the band moving forward with Todd will be better than they have been for at least a decade, if not more. Even if they end up with all the new material being something that could have been written by "just any metal band," I'm okay with that. If they have to bring in outside writers to help them write, as long as the band as a whole is participating in the process, likes the material, and can get behind it, I'm okay with that as well. And even if they end up putting out albums that don't really have anything "new" to offer, but are solid, and they end up just being relegated to "nostalgia act" status, I'm not crazy about that idea. But given that Todd allows them to actually perform all the old nostalgic material with integrity and engergy, I'd even be okay with that. Heck, that's the rut Journey has been in for a few albums now. The latest album was the only one in a VERY long time that I felt had anything really new to offer. But at least they were able to put out albums that felt consistent, and they made sure they could still bring the live show, which has kept them relevant. While I would love Queensryche to return to being "something more," I'm perfectly okay with them just being a solid band again.
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I actually thought this would happen the other way around: the rest of the band would leave to do something else, leaving Tate with the name. I could have sworn I read somewhere that Tate owned the name, which is what led me to think that. At any rate, an interesting development to say the least.
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Great news and I look forward to new material. A bit sketchy on who will be writing it, but it cannot be worse than what they've done over the last decade plus.
Hopefully they can follow Accept's lead.
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https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=327510623998511&set=a.316090215140552.80991.313098192106421&type=1&ref=nf
:lol
Oh, Tate was booted out. Nice.
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??? I'm not getting what is supposed to be funny.
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I saw the pic and thought they were just trolling or something. Was a few links down where I saw it was actually official.
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Let's hope that this is what the band needs to revitalize themselves because when motivated, QR could put out some amazing stuff. Unfortunately, they haven't been really motivated in the studio since the 90s perhaps because much of the band wants to rock, while Tate would rather continue with his progressive style. Both styles work for QR, but I can see where the underlying tensions might shatter a band. Perhaps this might lead to a return to their 80's sound, and if that's the case, I'm all for it.
I also hope there isn't a lot of drama with the breakup, especially over the name, as too many bands have been damaged by fights over who owns the band (Styx, LA Guns, Great White, Pink Floyd).
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I really wouldn't consider anything they've done Tate's "progressive" style.
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So the name Rising West is unnecessary now? They get to keep Queensryche? Color me surprised. I always assumed Geoff would hire a new band and keep the name, like Axl did with Guns n Roses. Either way, I'm happy. Good for them.
Scott may simply have been trying to be diplomatic. Or he may just be referring to the "final straw(s)" of the situation without dragging out the whole history.
As if anyone needs it dragged out. We may not know the gory details, but at this point, we know enough.
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Its unfortunate when it comes down to something like this; but it had to happen. The legacy of the Queensryche name was getting worse and worse by the day. They were an amazing band and deserve better. However, things were obviously not going to change with Tate as the leader. He assumingly had a different vision for the band then the other members and clearly a different vision then the fans. The EP- Promised Land will always be held in a high regard from me. And I still respect and like select songs from HITNF-present. But with Todd La Torre in, I expect some kick ass music that will rejuvinate the band itself and my interest in the band.
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So...DT/QR tour...please?
I'd be down for that, especially now. :metal
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Sorry for Geoff, but this is exactly what I wanted. Keep the name, boot out the problem. Curious to see how well they do left to their own devices.
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Geoff brought this on himself. I'm happy with this outcome, it had to happen. Interesting they got the name, as I thought I remember reading too that Geoff had full rights to the name or something.
Interesting to hear what Geoff has to say.
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Geoff brought this on himself. I'm happy with this outcome, it had to happen. Interesting they got the name, as I thought I remember reading too that Geoff had full rights to the name or something.
Interesting to hear what Geoff has to say.
A while back someone posted a link at anybodylistening.net to the official public business registry of the Tri-Ryche Corp, the business side of Queensryche, and at the time it listed Geoff, Whip, Ed and Scott as the four executive officers. I'm not certain how exactly that ties in to name rights, but I would think that if three of the four officers vote out that fourth guy, that would give the three remaining officer control over the corporation as a whole, which may mean control of the name rights.
I'm not sure that is exactly the case, of course, but that would be my guess anyways.
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Yeah, fair enough, I guess so based on what's just happened anyway.
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I would have been devastated had this happened 15 years ago, but now I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt, especially with the focus of the RW live shows being the first 4 untouchable albums. Time for some fan service for once, rather than the Tate ego show.
Not sure where the new songs will come from with this line-up though, but time will tell.
Time for Whip to step up to the plate and give us some old style solos too, if a new album surfaces.
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Well said lowdz, agee with every word.
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I'd like it if they went the VH way and pulled out some old demos to create the new material. With La Torre singing like he can, they could go completely old-school. :metal
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The demo idea would be cool. What would everyone think if they threw in a bonus disc of rerecorded classics with their first release? I for one would love to hear the new take on old songs. Or maybe a live recording thrown in.
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What would everyone think if they threw in a bonus disc of rerecorded classics with their first release?
Personally, I don't really like it when bands do that. When Journey did it on Revelations, it rubbed me the wrong way (especially including a song from Generations, which was completely unnecessary). Plus, I couldn't help fixating on things Arnel did differently. IMO, those kinds of things do more harm than good, and I would rather they didn't. It just smacks too much of giving the old singer the finger. And despite what Geoff may have done to the band the last few years, he is still a respected part of their legacy. No reason to indirectly trash him by re-doing some of his older performances.
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One of my favorite Anthrax CDs is The Greater Of Two Evils! :metal
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What this band needs to do is put out a disc of awesome new material written primarily by them, first and foremost. Anything short of that is a disappointment. If they use outside writers then the band is still a charade, and if they put out a bad metal album then it's just going to show that there might have been more to why their ideas weren't on the albums more than simply saying Tate was being controlling.
While them being able to play mostly old material is great, but if either of the above things happen, or they don't put out new material in a reasonable time frame, then they've simply become a Def Leppard-esque nostalgia act. An act I'd very happily pay to see, but one that still wouldn't be worth a dime of modern artistic credit.
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I agree with that, Nick.
Hopefully they can get out an EP or so in the next few months.
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I also think that Scott, Mike, and Ed will feel they have something to prove. Basically throughout the career of QR, all they have ever heard about is Chris and Geoff- Geoff and Chris. Now both are gone and they are running the show. They will want to prove that they werent just support characters, but can be the stars. I don't think Chris will have any involvement as they don't want it to appear they have to rely on him. And I think if they rerecord the songs, it shouldn't be seen as a disrespect to Geoff at all; but rather just a new chapter of QR.
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But to add to that, a disc of new killer material is a must to correlate with anything else they release
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What this band needs to do is put out a disc of awesome new material written primarily by them, first and foremost. Anything short of that is a disappointment. If they use outside writers then the band is still a charade...
I somewhat disagree with the last point. If the album is good, and they are involved in the writing, and can enthusiastically get behind it, I don't care if they have outside writers involved. The difference on the last three albums was that, while they did contribute ideas, they mostly just played what they were told, which was written by outsiders, and which they didn't really get behind and get involved in. Contrast that with, for example, Desmond Child writing Scorpions' Humanity: Hour 1. He wrote with the band, with their input, and helped them put out an album that sounded great and that the band could buy into and get behind enthusiastically. If Queensryche went down a similar road and put out a quality collection of songs, that would be perfectly fine by me. As long as there is input and buy-in on the new music, I don't think they should shy away from using outside writers if that's what they feel they need to synthesize their ideas into quality songs.
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Now Chris needs to come back, then we'll talk.
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Now Chris needs to come back, then we'll talk.
I disagree with that as well. On one hand, it would generate a lot of interest in the short run. But since it is HIGHLY unlikely he would be coming back to the band full-time and doing anything more than helping with the writing, I think the long-term effect would be to create an impression that Mike, Ed, and Scott aren't capable of running the show.
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IMO...the new album *will* be the best thing they've released since PL. However, that is not saying that they album will be great...or even good. Even if it's really meh, it will be the best thing since PL.
What I worry about, is that it will be *TOO* straight forward. I've said before that, as happy as I am with this decision (scratch that...make that "ECSTATIC"), the most important thing Geoff brought to the table was not his voice...it was the weirdness. The Pink Floyd factor. The whispers, the weird deliveries...that "air" of Pink Floyd that always made you feel like something was just off center of sanity. That is a HUGE part of what made QR special, and what separated them from every other metal band. I don't want a straight forward metal album. I'm really hoping that among the 5 members...SOMEONE can bring something to the table that's weird, askew, risky, and just slightly "Out of Mind"...
Pink Floyd lost a step without Waters...but Gilmore was no dummy. He intentionally (and with some success) used material that had that weird "I'm not quite completely sane" air that made Pink Floyd special. Waters was the one who really brought that element to the table...but Gilmore's version (as Water's admitted) was a decent fax simile. I'm hoping that the new QR doesn't forget that element.
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Good points. I think they are definitely capable, and they are smart enough to intentionally incorporate some of that into the music. Remember that of the remaining original members, Whip is the only one I would really consider a pure metalhead. Ed and Scott can definitely bring that to the table, but have much more diverse tastes and styles than only pure metal. And adding Todd to the mix, he seems to not only be a fan of the QR legacy, but also to understand what it is really about. I think he will try hard to inject a lot of the types of things you mentioned into the new music.
fax simile
Uh... ??? :lol
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I also do know a lot of casual fans will be very weary of the new breed of Queensryche.
I wouldn't mind something akin to Tribe. But, time will tell their fate. This is the scary tightrope walk.
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At the end of the day, I think the answer to all their problems is obvious...
OPERATION: MINDCRIME III
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At the end of the day, I think the answer to all their problems is obvious...
OPERATION: MINDCRIME III
Where they kill off the character named Geoff.
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fax simile
Uh... ??? :lol
A fax simile: An email is like a fax that you read on your computer screen, instead of on paper.
I also do know a lot of casual fans will be very weary of the new breed of Queensryche.
"Wary". "Weary" means something else entirely.
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At the end of the day, I think the answer to all their problems is obvious...
OPERATION: MINDCRIME III
:lol Funny you should mention that. I was kind of kicking around in my head sort of a similar idea. Assuming things go well, they put out a solid album and reignate the fan base, what if they did something like: Another album or two down the road, do a re-do of Mindcrime II with a completely different story. Yeah, in a way, that would have a similar effect of kind of giving Geoff the finger. But it would also, IMO, be a positive band statement that acknowledges to the fans that they are sorry about the fact that one of the greatest rock concept albums ever was tarnished by the stupid love story in the sequel, and that fans are entitled to something better.
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I think that by picking an old-school Geoff Tate clone, which is what this guy is however skilled he may be, they are destined to be a nostalgia act... and I'm perfectly fine with that.
Think: Judas Priest.
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Tim brought a lot to Priest, and Jugulator was one of their best records, IMO their best. Priest are more of a nostalia act now that what they were in the early 2000's.
Todd is a good thing for Ryche. If he keeps his attitude in check and the band gel well, this could results in some good things.
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I think that by picking an old-school Geoff Tate clone, which is what this guy is however skilled he may be, they are destined to be a nostalgia act... and I'm perfectly fine with that.
Think: Judas Priest.
Tim brought a lot to Priest, and Jugulator was one of their best records, IMO their best. Priest are more of a nostalia act now that what they were in the early 2000's.
Todd is a good thing for Ryche. If he keeps his attitude in check and the band gel well, this could results in some good things.
I agree with Wolf, Priest became more of a nostalgia act after Ripper left and they reunited with Rob. On the one hand, getting Rob back put the band back in the spotlight and helped the metal revival of the early 2000's. On the other hand, Ripper added a new element to the band that helped rejuvenate Tippton and Downing, and the band had a potentially bright future before they decided to go through with that contrived reunion. After Rob came back, what did they do? They did one album that was a microcosm of their past career but added nothing to their future (Angel of Retribution) and then made an ambitious but ill conceived attempt at an opus (Nostradamus), and now they are on their "farewell" tour without one of their most crucial members. Priest is pretty much the textbook definition of a nostalgia act these days, and the sad thing is they could have avoided that fate had they stayed with Ripper.
As for the new Queensryche, whether or not they will be able to avoid the same fate really depends on how good the new album is. Since they hired a singer who is reminiscent of 80's Tate, I would imagine that the band intends to return to their metal roots, which will probably help to win back the metal die-hards who lost faith after the Empire/Promised Land era. Considering that Geoff not only lost his voice, but also spent the better part of two decades badmouthing metal and rock, I cannot imagine that the fans will pine away for him the same way Priest fans longed for Rob. So I don't think that there is much of a threat of Geoff returning. The real question is how good the next album will be. While just about any metal album will sound good compared to anything QR has done in the past 15 years, only a truly phenomenal metal record will help get Queensryche back to the top where they belong.
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I want to hear Queensryche with the new singer. If Geoff was causing problems then they were right to get rid of him. Todd La Torre sounds like Geoff did in the 80's. Hopefully them doing all old Queensryche songs on tour, will inspire them to go back to the old sound. It would be cool to see Chris DeGarmo come back, but that is probably not likely.
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I think the problem with Queensr˙che was evident looking at this thread. After Dedicated to Chaos almost all discussion in this thread was about how deeply Tate was fucking up the band and now that he's gone this is alive as ever, and full of expectations for what's to come. Geoff's voice was unique; but nor his voice nor his talent were showing up in QR these years. This is a chance for the band to try and go back to their glory days. I'm surprised no legal action notices are showing up since I thought the Tates owned the band's name and stuff.
I checked out some Rising West videos and this La Torre guy fits them really well. It would be amazing if Chris helped them in something, like in songwriting or producing stuff; since I don't think he's ever coming back.
Anyway I'm really excited for what's yet to come from them specially since I pronounced my interest in the band dead even before DTC.
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If nobody is pushing any musical envelopes, I'm not interested in either camp.
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Good post Dark Master.
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At the end of the day, I think the answer to all their problems is obvious...
OPERATION: MINDCRIME III
They could do a track with Dio on guest vo-
:(
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I think this thread is sorely in need of some videos from the Rising West shows:
My Empty Room/Eyes of a Stranger (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQFudkGp62g&feature=related)
Queen of the Reich (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DS20WkSglZ0)
Walk in the Shadows (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P70mEtGwQvM&feature=related)
Was it a "flawless" performance? Nope. But so many things to love. First off, there's Todd. Not only does he have the vocal chops to pull of these songs, and not only is he going for notes and phrasings Geoff hasn't gone for in years, but he COMMANDS THE STAGE. Dude definitely has the stage presence to front a band like Queensryche. Then there's Parker. He got a TON of criticism and almost unfair scrutiny when he joined. But he is the only guitarist they've had since DeGarmo left who has demonstrated a commitment to playing the songs as they were written and putting in quality guitar parts that sound VERY close to Chris' parts. Plus, he just looks like he's having fun. And as far as the rest of the band...they look like a band again instead of a group of guys who can't wait for the last note to end so they can get their check and go home. This was my favorite band for a decade or so. And even when they were eclipsed by DT and fell to the #2 spot, I still really held them in high regard. It was hard to write them off as being dead, but I just completely stopped caring. Now I'm officially excited again. Can't wait to see what the future holds.
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Oh wow! This is not unexpected but you know it's bittersweet news for me. I really love Tate, his voice back in the days was unquestionably amazing. He added many things to music world and to the band. He is always remembered. But done is done and this is the fair result.
I love QR and want them to go as far as they can. Need more music now. I hope they start to write again, mostly close their older stuff. With a new singer like that I think that's unavoidable.
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In the initial Rising West press release, they said they planned to start work on a new album soon. I'm not sure what "soon" means, but even if it means late fall or so, that gives us a new album mid next year.
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I got chills with that "BE MY FRIEEEEEEEND" in the video. I officially like this guy now.
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Was it a "flawless" performance? Nope. But so many things to love. First off, there's Todd. Not only does he have the vocal chops to pull of these songs, and not only is he going for notes and phrasings Geoff hasn't gone for in years, but he COMMANDS THE STAGE. Dude definitely has the stage presence to front a band like Queensryche. Then there's Parker. He got a TON of criticism and almost unfair scrutiny when he joined. But he is the only guitarist they've had since DeGarmo left who has demonstrated a commitment to playing the songs as they were written and putting in quality guitar parts that sound VERY close to Chris' parts. Plus, he just looks like he's having fun.
Having been there, I agree. Todd owned the room. Granted it was a crowd of a couple hundred at most, but I can see him doing the same on a much larger stage. It did not feel like watching a hired gun or new front man at all. And Parker looked like a rock star having the time of his life.
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https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=175788&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+blabbermouth+%28Blabbermouth.net%27s+Daily+Headlines%29
Some awesome stuff in there.
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Those vocals on QOTR are fucking incredible.
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In regard to comments about whether this new version of Queensryche can write solid songs, I now have a completely different outlook than I did before. Whip recently made the "Mosh Pit Demos" available for streaming on his site. From what I understand, most if not all of these are demos Whip and Scott put together for Mindcrime II, which Geoff rejected. After listening, all I can say is: :2metal: Yeah, I think they can definitely bring it for the next album. The thought of Todd singing over something like these demos has me really excited. For those who haven't heard them: https://michaelwilton.com/demos.html
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I have full confidence that this version of QR will not disapoint. I also think they should make Parker an official member and not just a touring member. If Chris ever joins and/or is a special guest, they can go with 3 guitarists. Worked for Maiden.
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I have full confidence that this version of QR will not disapoint. I also think they should make Parker an official member and not just a touring member. If Chris ever joins and/or is a special guest, they can go with 3 guitarists. Worked for Maiden.
The other thing that worked for Maiden is that their songwriting went "next level" in the reunion era. To me, it will come down to the songs. I haven't listened to Bosk's link so it may be unfair to judge them if their ideas were rejected, but the fact is, this band has a lot to prove in this area.
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In regard to comments about whether this new version of Queensryche can write solid songs, I now have a completely different outlook than I did before. Whip recently made the "Mosh Pit Demos" available for streaming on his site. From what I understand, most if not all of these are demos Whip and Scott put together for Mindcrime II, which Geoff rejected. After listening, all I can say is: :2metal: Yeah, I think they can definitely bring it for the next album. The thought of Todd singing over something like these demos has me really excited. For those who haven't heard them: https://michaelwilton.com/demos.html
Thanks for the link Bosk1, sounds a hundred time better than he crap QR have been putting out for 15 years.
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Just having a quick listen to those demos and they sound pretty damn good. The riffs in Psycho and Science are amazing.
Also, the song with Ripper is killer, anyone know the news on this collaboration?
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Just having a quick listen to those demos and they sound pretty damn good. The riffs in Psycho and Science are amazing.
Science sounds like it would fit in just fine with the classic 80s QR albums. I guess not surprising since Wilton had a much bigger role in the writing back then. Definitely promising.
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I was thinking a couple of weeks ago about what happened to QR.
Haven't we all!
Most QR fans consider Promised Land as the last decent thing they did. Me, I think it was Empire. They really fell off the face of the earth, musically. You can pick a few songs off of each album since, and there are some good ones, but overall, it's pretty bad. American Soldier isn't bad, in fact, it's much better than anything they've released in a very long time. Still, it's a far cry to what made them really good.
We just have to face it. Queensryche is gone and they're never coming back!
I haven't read the entire thread (actually haven't gotten past this post yet) but I think the same thing. It was Empire for me too... I bought Promised land the second it came out, gave it a few tries and nothing clicked for me. Nothing. It seemed like whatever it was that made their music speak to me just disappeared over night and I remember being pretty frustrated by it at the time. I've pulled it out a few times over the years to see if it was just me and the timing or whatever... still nothing.
I still love everything they did before that but just lost interest and have only somewhat liked the odd song here and there since.
EDIT: So I read from page 26 and this is interesting. I also think Mebert summed it up well with what he said back on page 26. As it was, Queensryche were forever frozen in that pre 92' era for me. I listened to the Demos and am looking forward to hear what comes next... And it's a long long time since I felt that way.
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The riffs in Psycho and Science are amazing.
Could you describe them as psycosane?
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The riffs in Psycho and Science are amazing.
Could you describe them as psycosane?
I'm in a bit of a psycho mood today so YES!!!
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https://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/exclusive-q-a-geoff-tate-on-queensryches-ugly-split-backstage-brawl-in-brazil-20120626#ixzz1yvdGVnyi (https://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/exclusive-q-a-geoff-tate-on-queensryches-ugly-split-backstage-brawl-in-brazil-20120626#ixzz1yvdGVnyi)
What's gonna happen now?
- Well, we're in a lawsuit right now and it's probably gonna get ugly. I filed a claim a couple of days ago. So it's all going to the legal system now to sort out who is what, and who owns what, and that stuff.
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https://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/exclusive-q-a-geoff-tate-on-queensryches-ugly-split-backstage-brawl-in-brazil-20120626#ixzz1yvdGVnyi (https://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/exclusive-q-a-geoff-tate-on-queensryches-ugly-split-backstage-brawl-in-brazil-20120626#ixzz1yvdGVnyi)
What's gonna happen now?
- Well, we're in a lawsuit right now and it's probably gonna get ugly. I filed a claim a couple of days ago. So it's all going to the legal system now to sort out who is what, and who owns what, and that stuff.
The guy has lost it. He refuses to accept the reality, that the other band members want to go back to the Progressive Metal sound of the earlier albums. Instead, he makes up ridiculous claims that they just want his money :facepalm:
Whenever the interviewer points out that his argumentation doesn't make sense and doesn't fit with the band's actual actions, he twists the statement into how the other band members are doing it wrong. They only want his money, but they're doing it all wrong.
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Fuck Geoff Tate, he's so high off his own farts he can't even see the real picture.
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He sounds like he's completely in denial. To some extent, though, I can understand his point of view.
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So, Geoff, would you go as far as to say you and Queensryche have been married all these years?
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Nick, you need to stop that right now. Obviously, it would be psychosane for anyone to say something like that.
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Queensryche is my baby.
My abused, neglected baby.
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https://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/exclusive-q-a-geoff-tate-on-queensryches-ugly-split-backstage-brawl-in-brazil-20120626#ixzz1yvdGVnyi (https://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/exclusive-q-a-geoff-tate-on-queensryches-ugly-split-backstage-brawl-in-brazil-20120626#ixzz1yvdGVnyi)
What's gonna happen now?
- Well, we're in a lawsuit right now and it's probably gonna get ugly. I filed a claim a couple of days ago. So it's all going to the legal system now to sort out who is what, and who owns what, and that stuff.
The guy has lost it. He refuses to accept the reality, that the other band members want to go back to the Progressive Metal sound of the earlier albums. Instead, he makes up ridiculous claims that they just want his money :facepalm:
Whenever the interviewer points out that his argumentation doesn't make sense and doesn't fit with the band's actual actions, he twists the statement into how the other band members are doing it wrong. They only want his money, but they're doing it all wrong.
Absolutely QFT!!!
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It's all about the money and has nothing to do with the music, yet the guys went out and played old Queensryche songs with a singer who sounds like old Geoff Tate.
DENIAL.
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Geoff's mad if he thinks this is a money driven turn of events, any blind man can see that it's not.
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It's like he threatens the band about things turning so bad. Well, obliviously it's up to him. I don't want to see both side at this condition.
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In the big picture, this move might benefit the band more finanically. DTC only sold very few copies; I can see this new version selling much more.
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I don't think I'd be bragging about being the main creative force in the band since DeGarmo left. :lol :lol
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I love how Tate makes it sound like he was the SOLE writer on all those songs. And if I had been the guy interviewing him, I'd have said "well that's true that you wrote a lot of the songs, but with other people, and anyway, Chris Degarmo wrote your biggest hit, so let's just move away from the songwriting credits, shall we?" :lol
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I don't think I'd be bragging about being the main creative force in the band since DeGarmo left. :lol :lol
Why not? The guy is full of creative ideas that he writes every day, he's a writing force!
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I don't think I'd be bragging about being the main creative force in the band since DeGarmo left. :lol :lol
But it's wot he does.
Seriously though. If Geoff is telling the truth I get his point of view... but then I think back to the incident with Dream Theater. So... yeah... Just hope were gonna get some good new music out of this.
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Seriously though. If Geoff is telling the truth I get his point of view... but then I think back to the incident with Dream Theater. So... yeah... Just hope were gonna get some good new music out of this.
I think there is a grain of truth throughout. But the problem is, there are also flat-out distortions (if not outright lies) in his version of the facts as well. For example, go to BMI's website and look at publication credits. His name may technically show up on 81% of the songs, but there are none (if I'm mistaken, it is a VERY small number) where he is the SOLE writer. He CO-wrote all those songs either with individual members, the entire band, or outside writers. And we have confirmation from a number of sources, including specifics from Jason Slater (search some of his posts on the Breakdown Room) himself (as well as others) that Tate does not write the music. He doesn't really know how, which is WHY he brought in outside writers for Mindcrime II, American Soldier, Dedicated To Chaos, and, yes, even the arrangements for Take Cover. He writes lyrics. He sometimes writes vocal melodies. And when he hears what others have written, he provides verbal input on the songs. But he doesn't write the music, which is at least 80% of the song. So for him to say he "wrote" 81% of Queensryche's music and to imply that he is Queensryche as far as the music is concerned is unequivocally dishonest, even though there is a grain of truth behind what he is saying.
Another example is his statement that none of the other members contributed anything to the past few albums. He has gone on record as specifically saying the other members contributed nothing whatsoever for Mindcrime II and, other than some riff ideas from Wilton, showed no real desire to contribute anything. Silence from the other bandmembers seemed to lend creedence to Geoff's story...until Whip and Scott released the Mosh Pit demos and we could hear for ourselves that some of the ideas they came up with during the Mindcrime II sessions easily could have been more than an album's worth of solid material that is on par with or better than a LOT of what actually showed up on that album. Again, more distortion of the truth by Geoff.
And the list goes on and on.
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Seriously, why are the biggest douchebags in rock always the guys who assume almost tyrannical control over their bands? Tate, EVH, Axl Rose, Roger Waters, etc. The list goes on and on.
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I'd lmao if he Geoff would ever use the marriage analogy.
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Seriously, why are the biggest douchebags in rock always the guys who assume almost tyrannical control over their bands? Tate, EVH, Axl Rose, Roger Waters, etc. The list goes on and on.
I think you answered your own question.
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Fuck Geoff Tate, he's so high off his own farts he can't even see the real picture.
Pretty much this, yeah.
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I read that article yesterday. It seemed to get more and more ridiculous as it went on and it became clear that he's just not living in reality.
But "I write 81% of the music and the lyrics" made me laugh because no one says that. Eighty-one percent? People say they write most of it, or 90% of it or something like that. The only way he could've gotten 81% is if he actually sat and did the math. And of course the next line is "Of the 144 songs that Queensryche has released, I've written 116 of those." He actually sat and did the math. That's just not normal.
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I forgot what the issue between Tate and DT was other than MP referring to him as "Mr. Taint" in the media for a while. I also remember one of their guitarists kinda stepping on JP's toes by insinuating they could show him a thing or two on guitar and JP subsequently playing circles around them on a Comfortably Numb jam when all 3 guitarists shared the stage during a DT performance.
Can someone hip me to what the Tate/DT spat was based on?
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Hate to link you to BMouth, but this should help clear things up (https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=50491).
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Here's a question I'll throw out there for the masses:
Assume the lawsuit Geoff files ends up becomming a roadblock to the guys getting their album out and getting out on the road? What should they do?
Here's my thought. They need to stay in the fight and do what they can to recover the name and the rights. But they also need to get to the business of putting out an album and playing shows. If they can't use the QR name in the mean time, they need another name. Now, I kind of liked Rising West. Cool name, and an obscure nod to the earlier material, but I think they need something else if they are basically going to go out and declare to the world that, name or not, they are Queensryche. I'm thinking kind of like Sabbath did in renaming themselves Heaven and Hell. The casual fans who may not have had any clue that there were issues between the Osbournes and the Sabbath guys would still recognize the name and go, "oh, cool. I need to go see them." Same thing here. I think they need something more closely associated with the Queensryche name than an obscure lyric from an obscure song on their second album. I think "Operation: Mindcrime" would be the ideal name. Granted, that isn't going to pull in the people who only know Queensryche because they heard Silent Lucidy and Jet City Woman on the radio. But it will without a doubt make even the most casual fans who have no idea of the drama stop and try to find out whether this band is somehow linked to Queensryche. It's the most high profile name they could possibly choose, IMO. And if they ultimately win the lawsuit down the road or (more likely) win the rights through a settlement, they can always re-release any album later under the Queensryche name. Yes, it opens up the possiblity that, because it is such a high profile name that belongs to TriRyche Corp., Geoff could get an injunction to stop them from using it. But it's much less likely he would be successful with that then just stopping them from using the Queensryche name. Anyhow, that's my thought. What say you, DTF?
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Kingsryche.
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Queensreich.
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I would suggest their original name "The Mob", but I feel like that's a bit too Psychosane..
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I would suggest their original name "The Mob", but I feel like that's a bit too Psychosane..
Well, the diehards would all love that. But the problem is, as with Rising West, it wouldn't be obvious to most from just hearing the name that it is associated with Queensryche.
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They should just pull a Frost*...
Queensryche*
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Empire
or
The Warning
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Empire
or
Warning
That'd work for me. Empire would be great.
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Empire
Good, but "Empire" is such a general terms that it wouldn't necessarily create the immediate recognition that it is associated with Queensryche. If I know nothing about the band and see "Empire" on a bill, I'm not automatically going to make a Queensryche connection. Operation: Mindcrime immediately and unequivocally takes my mind in a Queensyrche direction.
The Warning
Better, but still a bit too general. And less well-known than Mindcrime.
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Operation Mindcrime just seems too obvious/ cheesy. I don't know why I feel that way, but I do.
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Queensryche.
No umlaute. Or just put another symbol over the y.
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Operation: Queensryche
or
Operation: Queensryche II: Scenes from a Winery
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:|
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Sorry bosk. I like it for an album title...and it is unequivocally associated with QR... But it's a *terrible* band name...IMO.
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Empire was their biggest, most successful album, wasn't it? I would go with that for the new name, if you're looking for the same type of name association as Heaven and Hell had with Black Sabbath.
Yeah, it's a pretty generic term, but in this day and age, it's pretty much a given that word will get out. Rising West was cool, but too obscure. Everybody, even casual fans or those who only knew the hit "Silent Lucidity", has heard of Empire. Short and simple.
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Plus Empire just sounds more "regal"
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I never thought of that, but that's something of a connection as well. The monarchy association.
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"Violent Lucidity"
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Kingsryche.
:clap:
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Queensrýche.
I just read the RS article, damn, just when I thought Tate couldn't be more delusional.
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...people seem to be overlooking the most obvious "Sounds like a band" album name: Rage for Order
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if you drop the "Operation," Mindcrime is a pretty cool band name IMO.
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I really like both of the above mentioned names; rage for order and Mindcrime. But I do hope for little drama and hope the band can continue as Queensryche without any issue and Tate works as a solo artist.
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Promised Band
:neverusethis:
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(https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v317/bizarredevotedfan/Randomness/boredrim.gif)
:lol
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I read that article yesterday. It seemed to get more and more ridiculous as it went on and it became clear that he's just not living in reality.
But "I write 81% of the music and the lyrics" made me laugh because no one says that. Eighty-one percent? People say they write most of it, or 90% of it or something like that. The only way he could've gotten 81% is if he actually sat and did the math. And of course the next line is "Of the 144 songs that Queensryche has released, I've written 116 of those." He actually sat and did the math. That's just not normal.
Yeah that struck me as weird also. He clearly did the maths before the interview otherwise he couldn't have came up with exact figures.
I think that this is his strategy to proof that HE is Queensryche and not the rest, as false as his statements may be.
Imagine the following converation:
Tate: I wrote 116 out of 144 songs therefore I am Queensryche. :angel:
Wilton: No you didn't write them, you just contributed to them! >:(
Tate: OK, let me put it this way, I contributed to 116 out of 144 songs, therefore I am Queensryche. :angel: And while we're at it: How many songs did you write? :hat
Wilton: :eek I think I wrote about 30 to 40.
Tate: Okay, I see, and you wrote them all for yourself and didn't have any help? ;D
Wilton: :censored Alright I wrote some of them myself but the majority I co-wrote with someone else.
Tate: So in other words you contributed to maybe 40 songs. Let me remind you that my last count for myself was 116 and that is more than 40, isn't it? :coolio Therefore I am Queensryche :angel:
Wilton: :omg: But Chris wrote the majority of our songs back when we were good and successful >:(
Tate: Yeah he wrote some and to most of them I contributed essential parts. Anyway Chris is out of the equation, this is between you and me. And the result is 116 beats 40 for the reason of 116 being roughly three times more than 40. I rest my case. :angel:
Wilton: ??? :censored >:(
The moral of it all: Tainters are gonna taint.
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I am not confident that rising west will be good... the fact is, these guys have been in agreement with Tate every step of the way.
Its easy to throw him under the bus now that QR are in the lowest place they could be but the fact is these guys never have uttered a single complaint until now. Sorry but I have no faith in either party here.
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Do you know for a fact that the guys have been in agreement, or are you assuming from their silence that they all agreed with the direction Tate was taking them?
The rest of DT kept quiet while Mike was making decisions they didn't agree with, and it's pretty clear now that that was the case. But at the time, they kept quiet for the sake of band unity. The vibe I'm getting from the Queensryche deal is that they finally had enough, not that they suddenly all decided to fire him for no reason, which is Tate's version of events.
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I am not confident that rising west will be good...
They were pretty damn good when I saw them play a couple weeks ago. Granted that was a set of classic QR stuff in front of a couple hundred people, which speaks little to how good any new material will be. But they looked nothing like a band going through the motions, or one at the tail end of their careers. Parker and Todd had a big hand in their stage presence.
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I am not confident that rising west will be good... the fact is, these guys have been in agreement with Tate every step of the way.
Its easy to throw him under the bus now that QR are in the lowest place they could be but the fact is these guys never have uttered a single complaint until now. Sorry but I have no faith in either party here.
So in other words you're just taking the words of a habitual liar at face value?
I mean, I have my doubts on how good Queensryche 2.0 will be, but you seem to be siding with the same guy that said Operation: Mindcrime II was a grand plan dating back to the original album...
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Over at the Breakdown Room, I posted a more accurate math equation. Geoff contributed about 33% of the overall QR catalog. So he's taking credit for nearly half the music written that he had nothing to do with.
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How did that work? Did Geoff exaggerate on the number of songs he actually has credits on?
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Tate has a credit on 81% of the songs, however most of those credits are simply for lyrics. Well that's important, there's a big difference between saying I contributed lyrics to 81% of our songs, and saying I wrote 81% of our songs. And I can already assure you that when it comes down to it Tate will try taking a lot of credit that deservedly goes to guys like Slater and Gray who actually wrote the music.
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Oh yeah, I get that. I was just wondering how MykeHavoc decided that the correct figure is more like 33%.
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If I was Tate I wouldn't be proud in having written/contributed in the majority of Post-DeGarmo songs :neverusethis:
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Over at the Breakdown Room, I posted a more accurate math equation. Geoff contributed about 33% of the overall QR catalog. So he's taking credit for nearly half the music written that he had nothing to do with.
Myke, just an FYI, not everyone here may have access to Breakdown Room. It's a great site, and I refer people there regularly and strongly encourage anyone who is a fan of Queensryche to check it out. But there may be some users here who are blocked from that site for one reason or another, so a re-post here might be better than just referring to a post there.
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Oh yeah, I get that. I was just wondering how MykeHavoc decided that the correct figure is more like 33%.
Basically, by factoring in who else received writing credit and then weighting that number. Basically, there are two different types of percentages being talked about: (1) Percentage of total songs on which Geoff (or anyone else) receive any writing credit; and (2) Percentage of the total writing credit given out. The former is simply taking the total number of QR songs and diving that by the number of songs a particular writer appeared on, whether as the sole writer or a co-writer. The latter is the percentage of writing credit the writer gets relative to other songwriters. Geoff is talking about the former, but there are two problems with what he said.
First, the way he says he "wrote" the songs is dishonest. He has never written a song by himself. Ever. He co-wrote the songs. And he is deliberately confusing the issue to make it look like he and he along was responsible for the vast majority of the band's output, which is simply not true.
Second, he is implying that he is talking about the second type of percentage when he is only talking about the first. The second is the more relevant. If Geoff wrote 81% of the songs (which he didn't, but anyway), he is implying that he should have 81% of the writing credit, which simply is not true by any stretch. That would imply that everyone else who has ever written a QR song combined can only have a total of 19% between them all. In reality, when you add up the number of writers and the number of songs and do the correct math (which Myke did an approximation of), the real number is about 33% (actually, I believe it is even less that that, but that is at least closer to the truth than 81%).
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Got it. Thanks!
And now just to throw this out there: co-writing when all parties contribute both music and lyrics is usually different from co-writing where one person writes the lyrics and someone else does the music. In the first kind, everybody involved usually recognizes that it was a collaborative endeavor. If Geoff Tate wrote all the lyrics to the songs that he has credit on, then there's no doubt in my mind that to him, he "wrote" the songs.
Yeah, he's using weird math, and is probably delusional anyway, but I don't think he's intentionally being dishonest. As far as he's concerned, he wrote 81% of the songs. He wrote the words, he sings them, in his mind he wrote the songs.
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I am torn. I'm a huge Queensryche fan...even of some of their lesser appreciated material. On one hand they'll bring back some Metal into the sound, on the other I don't know if I can get into it w/o Tate. LaTorre will basically be imitating Tate. Tate was original and passionate...LaTorre is neither, but he is good at what he does on a technical level.
Its like Arnel in Journey...there's something there I don't like that I can't put my finger on despite the obvious talent.
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I am torn. I'm a huge Queensryche fan...even of some of their lesser appreciated material. On one hand they'll bring back some Metal into the sound, on the other I don't know if I can get into it w/o Tate. LaTorre will basically be imitating Tate. Tate was original and passionate...LaTorre is neither, but he is good at what he does on a technical level.
Its like Arnel in Journey...there's something there I don't like that I can't put my finger on despite the obvious talent.
I'm the same way. But if their new stuff is similar to Tribe, specifically Open, Blood, and Great Divide, I'd check it out since the guys have credits in those songs.
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I am torn. I'm a huge Queensryche fan...even of some of their lesser appreciated material. On one hand they'll bring back some Metal into the sound, on the other I don't know if I can get into it w/o Tate. LaTorre will basically be imitating Tate. Tate was original and passionate...LaTorre is neither, but he is good at what he does on a technical level.
Its like Arnel in Journey...there's something there I don't like that I can't put my finger on despite the obvious talent.
I'm the same way. But if their new stuff is similar to Tribe, specifically Open, Blood, and Great Divide, I'd check it out since the guys have credits in those songs.
I'm just hoping it's not loaded down with Wilton's more Metal riffs just for the sake of it though...
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I am not confident that rising west will be good... the fact is, these guys have been in agreement with Tate every step of the way.
Its easy to throw him under the bus now that QR are in the lowest place they could be but the fact is these guys never have uttered a single complaint until now. Sorry but I have no faith in either party here.
So in other words you're just taking the words of a habitual liar at face value?
I mean, I have my doubts on how good Queensryche 2.0 will be, but you seem to be siding with the same guy that said Operation: Mindcrime II was a grand plan dating back to the original album...
He probably thought for a minute that a sequel could be cool and then went about his daily life of checking himself out in the mirror.
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I've been very busy and haven't been in the loop for awhile so just found out about this. I never thought there would ever be a Queensryche without Geoff, but am glad he is out due to all the reasons that have been mentioned. La Torre is a phenomenal singer and also a song writer. This and hearing the Mosh Pit demos gives me confidence that they are fully capable of delivering the goods. Also, I don't think Geoff will be keeping the name. 3/4 of the original band are still in tact. The majority will win the name (imo). Royalties and credits are a different story. Anyway, I'm just glad they are continuing and hope the best for the band...and even Geoff. Maybe some day he will look back and see that total control by himself and his wife wasn't really the best approach for a 'band.'
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You'd think that it would be that simple; four guys in the band, one is out, band keeps the name. But I don't think we've heard much yet about the legal stuff behind it all. If Geoff owns the name, he can take it with him. If the name is owned jointly by him and at least one of the guys still in the band, it can get messy. It may also make a difference to a judge that he was fired, as opposed to quitting. Or maybe not.
When Roger Waters left Pink Floyd, if you asked him, he broke up the band and had every intention of starting a new Pink Floyd. If I recall correctly, he claimed that he owned the name by virtue of he and Syd Barrett having come up with it originally, and since Syd had long since been out, he alone had rights to it. The judge didn't see it that way. He saw a band, and a guy quitting it. Guy moves on, band keeps the name, simple as that.
Nowadays, lawyers get involved in pretty much everything, so I wouldn't be surprised that there are documents specifying who owns the name Queensryche, and what happens when someone leaves. I'm sure we haven't heard the last of it, especially since Geoff seems pretty unhappy about it and will probably fight them on it.
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Hopefully it can get resolved sooner rather than later and not get drawn out over a long period of time.
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What are La Torre's songwriting credentials? I don't know much about his background other than he has a long history as a drummer. He sounds good.
I don't know the first thing about QR's songwriting dynamics, only that during the classic period most of the credit is given to Tate / DeGarmo. So if I had to guess I'd say that the other guys -- even if they are untapped creative wellsprings -- may need a kind of song shaper / finisher.
Anyway I have hopes for new stuff.
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So if I had to guess I'd say that the other guys -- even if they are untapped creative wellsprings -- may need a kind of song shaper / finisher.
I am thinking the same thing.
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the classic period most of the credit is given to Tate / DeGarmo.
If we make the assumption (and it's not without evidence) that DeGarmo wrote the music and Tate was just responsible for the lyrics (and maybe some really cool sound effects).
EP: 50/50 between DeGarmo and Wilton
Warning: 4 by Wilton, 3 by DeGarmo, 2 written together. Slight advantage to Wilton
RFO: 3 by Wilton, 4 by DeGarmo, 3 written together. Slight advantage to DeGarmo
OMC: 5 by Wilton, 7 by DeGarmo, 2 written together (1 by Rockenfield). Slight advantage to DeGarmo
Empire: 2 by Wilton, 4 solely by DeGarmo, 3 by DeGarmo/Wilton, 1 by DeGarmo/Rockenfield, 1 by DeGarmo/Jackson. Advantage to DeGarmo here...but not as much as is commonly thought.
And admittedly, Promised Land (their masterpiece) is well known to be mostly DeGarmo, with some imput from the rest of the band. (although...while the album was not much of a collaborative effort...they did manage to get together for a few days and write their first collaborative *song* with the title track, which is AMAZING).
My point is this...if you look at that list, DeGarmo is *technically* in the majority. But it's not *NEARLY* the dominant force of the classic period that people are sometimes led to believe. The evidence shows otherwise. Wilton was very nearly a 50/50 contributor to the classic QR period, and I think way too many people forget that.
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All good points. I also agree that PL is their best album.
The big mystery (at least for me) is whether, in the post-DeGarmo period, Wilton (above all) and Jackson / Rockenfield were 1) given opportunities to contribute but for the most part were unwilling or unable, or 2) were more or less shut out of the band's creative and decision-making processes by Tate. It's obvious what Tate wants us to believe, but as a casual observer with no special insight into matter, I'm still agnostic on the whole thing. Some solid new RW/QR material will make the question beside the point anyway.
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The band will either die or die based on the next album.
Not a misprint.
On one hand either the album will be bad and anybody who was holding out for Tate-less Ryche as a final hope will abandon ship, or the album will be great and the band still will only slow the decline they've been on. Queensryche today can't really go back up that much, the times and situation just aren't there for it. At this point in either case even if new material is great, which I'll appreciate, they'll probably devolve into a nostalgia act just to keep much needed income coming in the door.
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I disagree. They won't reignite the music scene and become a household name. But they can win back a large portion of the fan base that was disenchanted with Queensryche for the last decade or so. And while they aren't likely to have massive success with a new generation of fans, as with a lot of bands from that era, if they put out some quality material, enough of the band's old fan base's kids and their friends will likely take decent notice. They don't have to sell a ton of albums. They just have to sell enough that people want to come and see them, which will get them booked back into decent venues.
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While I think it's a remote possibility they perhaps outsell the last album, I find that to be highly unlikely, and I would put a chunk of change on them never outselling American Soldier.
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Hey, so I consider myself a bit of a fan of Queensryche (I own their older albums, like the debut EP, The Warning, and O:M), but I haven't been following them recently. Would somebody care to explain to me what these creative differences were that led to Geoff's firing, and why everybody is so thankful they've got a new guy?
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Geoff was basically coming up with concepts, ignoring musical input from the rest of the band so he could hire outside writers to give him exactly what he wanted and the result was anywhere from horribly bad (new album) to pretty good. Most hardcore fans will basically say nothing since Promised Land has come close to that level again.
And it's not just songwriting, but Geoff smokes, drinks at will, and generally doesn't give a shit about the quality of his voice.
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There also seemed to be a pretty extraordinary amount of Tate family cronyism on the business side of things. In the RS interview, he casually mentions that the manager, an office assistant, and a guitar tech happened to be Tate family members; and then you have two Tate daughters involved with the music and performances, and of course Lundgren himself who was initially plugged in to the band when he was a Tate in-law. Yech.
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and why everybody is so thankful they've got a new guy?
Because the new guy hits all the old notes.
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Hey, so I consider myself a bit of a fan of Queensryche (I own their older albums, like the debut EP, The Warning, and O:M), but I haven't been following them recently. Would somebody care to explain to me what these creative differences were that led to Geoff's firing, and why everybody is so thankful they've got a new guy?
Geoff has been a *HUGE* ego problem from the very beginning. (his reputation of being a dickhead of Yngwie Malmsteen proportions has been notorious in the Seattle area since the days of the EP!)
But all this was forgivable as long as the talent was there. You put up with the ego when you've got (quite possibly) the most talented voice in the history of rock.
But after DeGarmo left, Tate started to completely take over the direction of the band. As the above posts have mentioned, Geoff's wife became the manager (and reliable sources have reported that was a contributing factor in DeGarmo's departure) and his creating control was crowding out the other member's contributions. He started bringing in outside writers, and the fans weren't happy with the final product. But the concerts are still selling out, and you're collecting a paycheck, so you leave well enough alone. (that last sentence is speculation...but it does fit existing facts)
But with Defecated to Chaos, the poop really hit the fan. In Brazil, there was a physical altercation when the rest of the band called a band meeting...and Geoff wasn't invited. Sources say that the meeting was about firing Geoff's wife as manager and that Geoff was next. Most people believe this. Some sources say Geoff pulled a knife, but that is now mostly considered apocryphal. Just a couple weeks later, Rising West was born. Coincidence? I think not.
Add to that the previous comments that Geoff has NOT been taking care of his voice. He is *no longer* the greatest voice in rock. He's a jerk who hasn't been taking care of his instrument. ....and that makes him just another jerk....albeit a jerk with money.
Thus (to sum up), the fans don't like the direction of the band (that is all Geoff Tate's doing), havn't liked it in over 15 years (under Geoff's direction), and no longer feel Geoff's talent as a lead singer and frontman is up to par....and not just by QR standards...but by *any* standard whatsoever.
Some fans have been calling for Geoff's head on a stick for the better part of the last decade...but that crowd grew *MUCH* larger after the Cabaret tour, and the abysmal last album. So it all just came to a head, and most people are breathing a sigh of relief right now.
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That really sums everything up pretty well, as far as I can tell. And it all fits with known facts.
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well put Jammin
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Thank you....I try. :angel:
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Jammin, I know you are from Seattle; was there much mainstream media coverage locally in regards to Tate getting kicked out?
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Jammin, I know you are from Seattle; was there much mainstream media coverage locally in regards to Tate getting kicked out?
Not really, no. Although I admit that I don't listen to the local rock stations any more...havn't for a long time. I honestly don't think there is such a thing as "local coverage" in a music event any more. It would have to be *really* huge...like if Ann Wilson died. THAT would be medium range story everywhere else, and a monumental headliner here. But Tater getting kicked out of QR? Not so much.
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I'm not sure if I'm buying all this "Geoff Tate is the devil" stuff.
I'm not saying he's not a dick. I could see, very easily, him being highly egotistical, stubborn, and generally not a very nice person. I can also see him asserting himself artistically to the chagrin of the band.
BUT-
Queensryche was an equal partnership corporation. If the other 75% had a problem with the 25% attempting to run everything, they could have pulled rank on him a long time ago. They did not.
I've seen in many places where one of Chris' reasons for leaving, and one reason the last 2 albums he was on before he left were basically "all Chris", was nobody else bothered to contribute. He (Chris) handled the music, he handled the concepts, he handled the business after EMI started falling apart, he carried the band. So, in my mind, it stands to reason that if the rest of the band weren't stepping up before Chris left, that they would not get any better after he left. My understanding was, this even included Geoff.
Chris really drove the bus on PL and HITNF...the other guys went along. By most accounts, and what I have read, he realized that he was equally splitting his income with guys who were not contributing any longer (there are also strong rumors of him not getting along w/ Geoff's then-new wife Susan)...so he left. It's been strongly rumored that for all intents and purposes, Queensryche broke up after the Empire tour cycle and it took a miracle (Chris) to get them back together to write/record PL.
If there is ANY shred of truth to that whatsoever, then it's not entirely impossible that GT took the reins out of necessity.
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What is this I keep hearing about the cabaret tour?
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What is this I keep hearing about the cabaret tour?
Strippers, acrobats, mimes, GT in his underwear, all while playing Queensryche songs... :lol
(https://allaccessmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/Queensryche-01.jpg)
(https://www.blabbermouth.net/reviewpics/tateundies.jpg)
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....and don't forget that Geoff hired *his own daughter* to be one of the STRIPPERS on stage with him.
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....and don't forget that Geoff hired *his own daughter* to be one of the STRIPPERS on stage with him.
Yeesh... :|
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What is this I keep hearing about the cabaret tour?
Strippers, acrobats, mimes, GT in his underwear, all while playing Queensryche songs... :lol
(https://allaccessmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/Queensryche-01.jpg)
(https://www.blabbermouth.net/reviewpics/tateundies.jpg)
Hot?!
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Queensryche was an equal partnership corporation. If the other 75% had a problem with the 25% attempting to run everything, they could have pulled rank on him a long time ago.
Do we know this? In some bands, everyone has an equal voice, or at least some kind of vote in band-related decisions. In others, there are very clear leaders. The Who was Pete Townshend's vision, without a doubt. The others had a voice, but you know who made the final decisions. King Crimson and Robert Fripp, same thing.
I've seen in many places where one of Chris' reasons for leaving, and one reason the last 2 albums he was on before he left were basically "all Chris", was nobody else bothered to contribute. He (Chris) handled the music, he handled the concepts, he handled the business after EMI started falling apart, he carried the band. So, in my mind, it stands to reason that if the rest of the band weren't stepping up before Chris left, that they would not get any better after he left. My understanding was, this even included Geoff.
Chris really drove the bus on PL and HITNF...the other guys went along. By most accounts, and what I have read, he realized that he was equally splitting his income with guys who were not contributing any longer (there are also strong rumors of him not getting along w/ Geoff's then-new wife Susan)...so he left. It's been strongly rumored that for all intents and purposes, Queensryche broke up after the Empire tour cycle and it took a miracle (Chris) to get them back together to write/record PL.
If there is ANY shred of truth to that whatsoever, then it's not entirely impossible that GT took the reins out of necessity.
This is interesting and yes, Tate may well have taken the wheel because no one else would take it. That would seem to help his case.
But even if the others all held their tongues while Queensryche became a mockery of themselves, collected their paychecks because hey, a gig's a gig, they apparently finally had enough. I'm trying to type this while there's a picture of Geoff Tate in his Jockeys and a dressing gown above me on the screen, and I can't help but think that they made the right decision.
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Do we know this? In some bands, everyone has an equal voice, or at least some kind of vote in band-related decisions. In others, there are very clear leaders. The Who was Pete Townshend's vision, without a doubt. The others had a voice, but you know who made the final decisions. King Crimson and Robert Fripp, same thing.
Well, in GT's RS interview, he said he was a 25% owner of Queensryche's companies. That makes me assume that Scott, EdBass and Wilt are the other 75%.
This is interesting and yes, Tate may well have taken the wheel because no one else would take it. That would seem to help his case.
But even if the others all held their tongues while Queensryche became a mockery of themselves, collected their paychecks because hey, a gig's a gig, they apparently finally had enough. I'm trying to type this while there's a picture of Geoff Tate in his Jockeys and a dressing gown above me on the screen, and I can't help but think that they made the right decision.
Oh, I can see them getting sick of it. I just wish they had pulled rank before letting it get to the point of actually kicking him out...perhaps they could have come to a mututal understanding if they had done something before reaching the frayed ends...
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Michael Wilton *did* state at one point that his ideas had been submitted...but "the lead singer" had rejected them.
It's true that the band was not contributing much for PL or HITNF....but in the *same interview* where CDG said that, he also said that it was primarily due to marital and personal problems that the other band members were having. It stands to reason that if/when these problems were sorted out, many ideas would come flowing out of the darkness. (heck, look at what came out of Phil Collins divorce! DUKE!)
But by that time, Geoff was in charge and rejecting ideas. "Nah...it doesn't fit in with the 'theme' of this album...but thank you for your contribution, and maybe we'll look into that on the next go round....mmmmm kay?"
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Michael Wilton *did* state at one point that his ideas had been submitted...but "the lead singer" had rejected them.
It's true that the band was not contributing much for PL or HITNF....but in the *same interview* where CDG said that, he also said that it was primarily due to marital and personal problems that the other band members were having. It stands to reason that if/when these problems were sorted out, many ideas would come flowing out of the darkness. (heck, look at what came out of Phil Collins divorce! DUKE!)
But by that time, Geoff was in charge and rejecting ideas. "Nah...it doesn't fit in with the 'theme' of this album...but thank you for your contribution, and maybe we'll look into that on the next go round....mmmmm kay?"
Oh yeah, I can totally see that.
But Jason Slater has also stated that when they were making O:M2 he & GT were begging for ideas, and nobody would participate and barely even show up. GT actually fought to keep one of EdBass' ideas against what Slater (producer/co-writer) thought, according to Slater himself. MW submitted ideas finally only after the album had entered the mixing stage. Slater even went to MW's own studio for several days and could not get him to write.
But, in the end it's all "he said/they said" and perspective. What's done is done now, but I really wish it wasn't. I just wish they could have made it work and tried to come back from the DTC thing. (even though some of that is at least fairly interesting)...
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Do we know this? In some bands, everyone has an equal voice, or at least some kind of vote in band-related decisions. In others, there are very clear leaders. The Who was Pete Townshend's vision, without a doubt. The others had a voice, but you know who made the final decisions. King Crimson and Robert Fripp, same thing.
Well, in GT's RS interview, he said he was a 25% owner of Queensryche's companies. That makes me assume that Scott, EdBass and Wilt are the other 75%.
Yes, you are techincally correct. But Geoff's statement was carefully calculated to generate precisely the same type of misunderstanding that your post displays. Let me see if I can clarify exactly why he is being misleading.
Geoff's statement as to the percentage of ownership isn't entirely accurate, but for the sake of argument, yes, it's close enough to say that in terms of the main corporate entity for Queensryche, each of the 4 remaining original members owned 25%. What that number means is that each owns 25% of the stock of the corporation. And when there is a corporate shareholder's meeting to vote on business decisions, each has an equal vote. However, that does not equate to everyone in the band having an equal vote.
First off, either in large corporations, or smaller closely-hold corporations like a band, shareholder meetings are extremely rare. So while they were making creative decisions as a band, that's not the same thing has having a formal shareholder meeting and making business decisions as shareholders of a corporation. Yeah, same guys. But wearing different hats. You aren't really acting in your corporate shareholder capacity when you are submitting some riffs and saying how you think a song should be arranged.
Second, in terms of day-to-day management of a corporation, different people have different management roles, some of which are more active decision-making roles. The most obvious way to describe this is to look at the president/CEO role in comparison to a VP role. Even where the president and vice president have equal ownership rights in a corporation, the president has more management authority in terms of the day-to-day business of the corporation. (and Geoff was not the president; I am merely illustrating the point that roles differ in terms of authority even where ownership is equal)
Third, personal dynamics come into play more than percentage of ownership when you are just doing the day-to-day work of running a band. People with more dominant personalities or who speak up more about their creative vision end up being the ones to steer the ship. That's just the way people interact. When you have a strong personality calling the shots, sometimes it's easier to choke down the frustration and give in than to put your foot down and say "enough." That can be complicated when other factors come into play, such as the fact that the person with the strong personality has been your friend for 30 years, or that he is considered by many to be the face/voice of the band for 30 years, or that his family members, who you have known for a long time, are employees of the band.
So, yeah, there's a lot more that comes into play than just ownership. It's easy to say, "oh, well they were all equal members, so if there was really a problem, the others guys should have spoken up and overruled Geoff." Not nearly as easy in practice when you are the guys in the band. That's what I hate about Geoff's statement. For the most part, the 25% ownership thing is fairly true. But it is also deliberately misleading. Hopefully, my explanation helps.
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Well then, there you go...thanks for explaining.
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Yeah, great post!
That also seems to explain how they were able to fire him, even though he was a partial owner. They, the other owners, voted him out. It was a corporate business decision, which operates on a different level from the band itself. Same guys, same result, but a different mechanism.
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New interview w/ GT:
https://www.billboard.com/news#/news/q-a-ex-queensryche-frontman-geoff-tate-discusses-1007510752.story
At least he clarifies being "co-writer" of 81% of the songs, not "chief writer"...
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You raised the point that you personally wrote the vast majority of the Queensryche catalog . . .
I would say, in vague terms, of the 144 songs that Queensryche has published and written, I've been a co-writer on 114, which is something like 81% of all of the music.
The way it's stated in Rolling Stone is that you wrote them -- as in, you completely wrote them.
Oh yeah. Well, that's one of those little inaccuracies that get passed along through interpretation [laughs]. But the accurate numbers and all that, it's obviously in the legal claim.
Um...no, Geoff. That's one of those little inaccuracies that gets passed along because those were your exact words that you said! :\
And I love how he keeps saying all the "facts" are out there in the lawsuit that was filed. Again, um...no. What is in the lawsuit is Tate's lawyer's spin on the facts. Unfortunately, lawsuits only present one side, and half of what is in a complaint is later usually proven to be either exaggeration or just flat out wrong.
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You raised the point that you personally wrote the vast majority of the Queensryche catalog . . .
I would say, in vague terms, of the 144 songs that Queensryche has published and written, I've been a co-writer on 114, which is something like 81% of all of the music.
The way it's stated in Rolling Stone is that you wrote them -- as in, you completely wrote them.
Oh yeah. Well, that's one of those little inaccuracies that get passed along through interpretation [laughs]. But the accurate numbers and all that, it's obviously in the legal claim.
Um...no, Geoff. That's one of those little inaccuracies that gets passed along because those were your exact words that you said! :\
And I love how he keeps saying all the "facts" are out there in the lawsuit that was filed. Again, um...no. What is in the lawsuit is Tate's lawyer's spin on the facts. Unfortunately, lawsuits only present one side, and half of what is in a complaint is later usually proven to be either exaggeration or just flat out wrong.
I guess, technically, he said "chief" earlier, not "sole"..."chief" implies other people, just under his lead...
But yeah, on the surface it certainly appeared he was trying to take 100% credit for Queensryche's entire career before...
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I haven't verified these numbers, but Scotty did a calculation of the true shares of songwriting credits. So, for example, if Geoff co-wrote a song with one other writer, he gets 50% credit for that song. If we co-wrote with the other four original members, he gets 20%. Etc. Here is how it breaks down:
Tate: 33.54% of 144 songs
Chris DeGarmo: 27.22% of 144 songs
Rockenfield, Wilton, Jackson (combined): 23.89% of 144 songs.
By my calculation, that leaves 15.35% that were written or co-written by others (Kelley Gray, Jason Slater, etc.).
What this shows is that, yes, in comparison to the remaining original members, he co-write a larger share (at least in terms of how the writing credits for songs are listed). But he hardly wrote the majority of Queensryche's material. If he wants to argue he is entitled to a fair share for his contributation, that fair share is approximately 34%. And 34% does not mean that he, Geoff Tate, somehow IS Queensryche. Queensryche is an entity. And it is an entity that, if you subtract Tate's contribuation, should control at least 66%, based on songwriting credits. After all, it's not as if DeGarmo, Slater, and others bequeathed their songwriting credits to Geoff Tate. They contributed to songs for Queensryche. And Geoff Tate is no longer a member of Queensryche. As such, he has no claim to others' songwriting credits. Anyhow, I hope that somewhat helps elucidate the whole songwriting credit thing. The numbers don't lie. Geoff saying he wrote 81% of Queensryche's songs is just flat-out misleading.
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I would like to see those numbers re-crunched to reflect ONLY Promised Land and before.
It is my devout opinion that QR's dog&^% material of the last 15 odd years has stacked the deck in Geoff's favor.
I don't feel he should get the same credit for writing "Wot Kinda Man Are You" as "Eyes of a Stranger"....
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I would like to see those numbers re-crunched to reflect ONLY Promised Land and before.
It is my devout opinion that QR's dog&^% material of the last 15 odd years has stacked the deck in Geoff's favor.
I don't feel he should get the same credit for writing "Wot Kinda Man Are You" as "Eyes of a Stranger"....
Who would WANT that credit?
Oh wait, Geoff Tate, never mind. :lol
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These don't add up to 100% because 1) I rounded off all numbers to the nearest second place decimal, and 2) I counted three-way writing as 33% instead of 33.3 repeating.
EP - Promised Land - 60 songs total.
Chris DeGarmo - 42.63%
Geoff Tate - 30.97%
Michael Wilton - 20.7%
Scott Rockenfield - 4.63%
Eddie Jackson - 0.88%
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Interesting. Given that they are fighting over ownership of the name, I think the arguments may likely play out something like this:
-Geoff: When you look at the numbers, I wrote more than the existing members of "Queensryche" combined. Since my contribution over time is greater than theirs, I should get the name. And even more than that, take a look behind the numbers. I was the one who drove the direction of the band and came up with the album concepts. And I was forced to bring in outside writers to advance those concepts because the other guys did not contribute. So even more than looking at the songwriting credits, I was the driving force behind the continuing business of the band.
-Queensryche (i.e., Whip, Scott, Ed): Queensryche is an entity, not a person. Geoff contributed to the entity that is Queensryche, and his contribuation is about 33%. And given that Tate does not write music itself, regardless of what the publishing credits say, he contributed far less. But Queensryche, the entity, aside from Geoff's contributions, has 67% of the credits. Geoff cannot claim part of those credits for himself. And as far as him controlling the direction of the band, that is largely true, and that is why the band's success and the value of Queensryche as a brand has declined severely over the last decade, plus, while other bands have continued to thrive. He was allowed to manage the band, but he mismanaged it and should not be rewarded for that.
I think it will play out something like that. But I really wonder what specifically Geoff is after. A couple of things come to mind. Does he really want control of the Queensryche name? Maybe he actually does. Not sure, but it wouldn't be beyond the realm of reason to think so. After all, right or wrong, he feels as if he was running the ship all by himself. Rather than having a 25% share, if he controlled the name and brought in a bunch of hired guns rather than having to have 75% go to 3 other guys, he could pay peanuts to guys who are not owners. If he thinks people will still buy the albums and come to the shows, and he turns out to be right, this would be a winning formula for him. And he would still be able to put out new albums as the band has done for awhile now by having outside writers write them based on his input and direction. If that's the case, the other guys NEED to do something going forward to get some positive P/R to counter the Geoff Tate spin machine so that people don't view them as "they guys that tried to kick Geoff Tate out of the band and got their butts kicked in court for trying to screw him over." Honestly, while this would be the worst result for the "Queensryche" brand, if the guys actually do well to get things under control and can become a viable entity under the "Rising West" name or some other name, this might actually be the best result for everybody involved. Don't get me wrong--I don't think it's the best outcome for the fans, and I don't think it's the "right" outcome. But in terms of economics for each of the four parties involved (and Parker as well), this might just be the best solution.
...Or is Geoff simply after a bigger slice of the pie? In other words, is he simply angling for more money as part of his buyout and a larger share of the royalties going forward? Could be. He might very well have his eyes set on the Queensryche name, and have this as his consolation prize if that doesn't work. The problem for him is that, in a sense, for this outcome to be profitable for him, he has to be careful not to damage the Queensryche brand too much. Corporate buyouts generally get paid out over a period of several years because, let's face it, most corporations do not have a large body of liquid cash assets sitting in a bank account somewhere. That's just not how corporations are run. I highly doubt that Queensryche could pay a departing member in cash a lump sum value representing their share. So Queensryche has to continue and make money (and not fail financially) for a long-term payout to happen properly. In this scenario, Geoff has to hope Queensryche does well without him so they can afford to pay him. In terms of royalties, it is also in his best interest for them to do well because the better they do, the more money he stands to gain. In fact, it would not surprise me if any settlement includes a term that Geoff will get some fixed percentage of what the band makes going forward, completely separate from royalties.
These kinds of fights are really stupid. But I'm interested to see how this plays out.
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It works out even better for Wilton if you just go EP-OMC (which many fans consider to be the "classic" QR phase).
That works out to roughly...
40.5% Chris DeGarmo
32.5% Geoff Tate
26% Michael Wilton
with the remainder made up with Rockenfield's sole contribution to OMC.
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I recommend everyone head over to Samsara's board. He has purchased the public documents and has posted a section from Michael Wilton's declaration about the Brazil incident:
https://www.anybodylistening.net/breakdownroom/index.php?topic=2864.120
EDIT: So this was the show that Portnoy played drums for Fates Warning, right? Did he share anything in regard to what he witnessed? I figured he'd jump at the chance to throw Geoff under the bus :P
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We need to have a local meet-up at King County Superior Court. I'd call in sick to see this all play out.
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:lol
Since a lot of people will likely be seeing a lot of these documents soon, here are a few caveats from a legal perspective:
Anything written in the Complaint and Answer/Response is not necessarily true or correct. It is the lawyers' initial spin in the facts and arguments just to attempt to state what the legal claims are. Often, as a case progresses, by the time you get a few months down the road and actual discovery has been conducted (the process where the parties on both sides obtain and disclose evidence), the story that the evidence actually shows is something FAR different than what is in the initial pleadings (the Complaint and Answer).
Things written in declarations/affidavits are sworn statements under oath. The witness is swearing on paper under penalty of perjury, just as he/she would if testifying in open court. However, these statements are still usually written by, or at least with the assistance of, attorneys. Also, they represent the truth as perceived by the particular witness, but they are not conclusively established fact. What witnesses say in declarations is sometimes proven to be mistaken or outright wrong. So what that means is that they should still be taken with a grain of salt, even though they are sworn statements under oath.
Personally, given the track record of the parties involved, I would tend to give more credence to what the remaining guys in Queensryche say over what is said by the Tate camp. But draw your own conclusions.
Lastly, if anyone re-posts any of the Court documents or excerpts here, PLEASE REDACT OUT ANY PERSONAL CONTACT INFORMATION. Even though the documents are in the public domain, I don't want people potentially using information they find on this website to potentially harass or invade the privacy of any current/former members of Queensryche or other witnesses. Thanks.
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I recommend everyone head over to Samsara's board. He has purchased the public documents and has posted a section from Michael Wilton's declaration about the Brazil incident:
https://www.anybodylistening.net/breakdownroom/index.php?topic=2864.120
I second that. He and others there are very on top of the latest information, so it's a great place to go to get up to speed on Queensryche happenings. Personally, I will not be reposting things that are posted there, but others are free to do so if they like (which would be helpful, since not all members of this board can access Breakdown Room).
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Wilton's declaration is interesting as hell.
There must have been something said though that put Tate over the edge. The meeting, despite the fact that they told him why they fired Susan, seemed professional. If that caused him to start punching Scott and Wilton and spitting on them, then Tate has anger issues.
Remember that Tate said Scott said "We fired your family and your next" That definitely would cause Tate to lose his marbles.
This will be an interesting case of he said she said and I hope the crew and band corroborate Wilton's statement.
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Wilton's declaration is interesting as hell.
There must have been something said though that put Tate over the edge. The meeting, despite the fact that they told him why they fired Susan, seemed professional. If that caused him to start punching Scott and Wilton and spitting on them, then Tate has anger issues.
Remember that Tate said Scott said "We fired your family and your next" That definitely would cause Tate to lose his marbles.
This will be an interesting case of he said she said and I hope the crew and band corroborate Wilton's statement.
Well, if you believe Tate's version of events, a statement like that out of the blue would have been completely out of line. But IF Scott said it (or something like it that may have been a bit more tame and toned down), it is more understandable if you take the versions of the previous meeting as Whip and Scott lay them out in their own declarations, and figure that Scott was responding to Geoff's earlier spouting off out of frustration, anger, or whatever. Remember the old addage about 3 sides to every story. ;)
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Did anyone else :lol at the "pet damages" outlined in Exhibit E of Tate's declaration? :lol :lol
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Oh, and they were gonna re-record Mindcrime at the end of this year to celebrate its 25th anniversary?? L-A-M-E.
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I didn't read all the statements (just the declaration, defense, band member statements, Slater, and Fozzy) but it looks like GT doesn't have a great case here.
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www.wpapu.com/other/Case156.rar
That is all of the legal documents in a single file for anyone interested.
However I still highly recommend the forum and the deeper QR discussion that happens there. Here is the original thread: https://www.anybodylistening.net/breakdownroom/index.php?topic=2906.0
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www.wpapu.com/other/Case156.rar
That is all of the legal documents in a single file for anyone interested.
However I still highly recommend the forum and the deeper QR discussion that happens there.
You know Nick, while the documents are publicly available to anyone, I *did* pay for all those documents with my own money and made them available HERE - https://www.anybodylistening.net/breakdownroom/index.php?topic=2906.0
I also planned on going one by one and making individual links in a little while when I got home.
At the very least, if you're going to use material that comes from The Breakdown Room or me, the material should be credited to the board. Not lifted and stored at your own site. I am sure plenty of people will do what you did. I can't stop them. But I thought members of The Breakdown Room would be more respectful to my efforts than that.
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I recommended the forum in my post, and the only reason I didn't personally link to the forum is because a link to the thread in question was posted a few posts ago, but I'll edit it into my post.
Edit: Also, feel free to take the file and host it if you wish, and I'll delete it. My intention was simply an alternative to downloading 15 or so separate files individually.
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boy its sad and pathetic that a 30 year band/friendships come down to something like this.
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Oh, and they were gonna re-record Mindcrime at the end of this year to celebrate its 25th anniversary?? L-A-M-E.
Wow that would have been awful.
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Oh, and they were gonna re-record Mindcrime at the end of this year to celebrate its 25th anniversary?? L-A-M-E.
Wow that would have been awful.
Oh God just saw that. Even though I haven't given a toss about modern Queensryche since I heard American Soldier and hated it, I am so SO glad Geoff Tate is out now because this abomination will never come to pass.
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Oh, and they were gonna re-record Mindcrime at the end of this year to celebrate its 25th anniversary?? L-A-M-E.
Wow that would have been awful.
QFT
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I just like that one of the guys said that MCII was Susan Tate's idea. Feels great hearing a member saying it after Geoff parade around to every interview talking about how it was planned from the beginning.
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I tried liking M2, but it just never did anything for me. American Soldier was much better IMO.
Re-recording Mindcrime would have been an obvious cash grab, but would have been so bad in many ways, plus doing that without DeGarmo is just laughable. Probably Susan's idea also.
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I tried liking M2, but it just never did anything for me. American Soldier was much better IMO.
I agree on both points. American Soldier really wasn't that bad.
The best part about O:M2 was Dio!! :metal
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IF all else fails...Queensryche Of Fire has a nice ring to it.
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The first half of O:M 2 was pretty good; I think Murderer, Rearrange You, The Chase and Hostage are some of QR's strongest tracks since PL. The second half really brings down the disc overall. American Soldier has some solid tracks too, but seemed to struggle at the end too. And I promised myself last summer that I would never listen to DTC again. I havent, thus my opinion still hasnt changed. Still garbage.
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Blabbermouth is quoting the court documents and reporting Scott Rockenfield's version of events:
https://blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176573
After [2005], Geoff and [his wife] Susan Tate began controlling the band's direction and Geoff Tate insisted on pushing only the music he was interested in pursuing. This meant that all of the material that Michael Wilton, Eddie Jackson and I were submitting was not getting finished. As such, Geoff Tate was basically writing with his friends, many of which were not even professional musicians.
"I have hard drives of song material written by Eddie Jackson, Michael Wilton and I that have dates and times on the files showing that in 2010 we had written dozens of hard rock songs that Geoff Tate even began singing on, but eventually was not interested in completing. He changed direction on us in late 2010 and only wanted to pursue a more pop-sounding CD, which meant he was only interested in a majority of songs being written by his friends, some of whom were homeless and living at his house.
"I have been the main composer, producer, engineer and technician for all the live backing tracks, computers, film screens and technology that is used during all QUEENSRźCHE shows from the very beginning. This is a massive, labor intensive undertaking for each tour and has become a huge part of all the live shows for QUEENSRźCHE through the years.
"Our stage manager and monitor tech Kelly Gray's claim that he and Geoff Tate do all the work is completely false. 'Q2K' (2000) was when we added Kelly to the band to play guitar. He was also hired as a producer/mixer for the CD. Producing and mixing a CD has many added requirements and Kelly Gray handled them well. However, his claims that he and Geoff Tate wrote the entire CD is completely and utterly false. Kelly Gray and I spent many weeks at my home studio writing a large amount of songs, and Michael Wilton and Eddie Jackson did the same. Because of everyone's complete involvement, it was easily decided that we should just split all credits equally amongst the five members.
"Geoff Tate's ongoing assault and anger issues have become a serious detriment to the brand of QUEENSRźCHE. In 2000, we had a band meeting regarding our next CD and at that meeting, he did not like some topics of discussion and stormed out of the meeting after throwing a chair across the room.
"In 2007, Geoff Tate was angered by something and approached me in the band's dressing room and proceeded to smash my laptop on the table and then hit me in the face while spitting on me and pushing me around the room for approximately 15 minutes.
"In mid-2011, the band held a meeting in the dressing room to discuss playing some of our older material such as 'Queen Of The Reich'. Geoff Tate got very upset and eventually screamed, 'I am NOT ever going to play those stupid songs!' He then stormed out of the room. We have not been allowed to perform those songs since.
"In late 2011, the band held another meeting in regards to performing 'Operation: Mindcrime' in its entirety for ShipRocked, a rock and roll-themed cruise scheduled for November 2011. The band was asking simple questions as to why we were being offered this and that. We wanted some more information about the offer. Geoff Tate got very upset and screamed at us, something to the effect of 'what's the problem and why can't you just do this?' and then stormed out of the dressing room.
"On April 14, 2012, in Sao Paulo, Brazil, Geoff Tate violently attacked and assaulted Michael Wilton, Eddie Jackson and me on stage just prior to show time. Geoff Tate's claim that I said to him, 'I've fired your family and now I'm going to fire you' is a complete lie and many witnesses support this. All of this ongoing assault and violence from Geoff Tate has repeatedly been very bad for the band's continued business as it has made it very difficult for the band to continue making music and play shows up to the standards that are expected by us and our worldwide fan base.
"In the last couple months at the final QUEENSRźCHE shows that were planned with Geoff Tate, he has made repeated comments on stage to our fans about how 'they suck' and about how 'this could be the end,' etc., etc. He has made multiple comments to the band members about making sure 'we stay away from him on stage or he will attack us again.' He has also made ongoing statements after the Brazil incident about how he 'wants us to stay away from him or else.' His actions resulting from this are very damaging to the band's brand name and has our fans very upset about his remarks, comments and personality.
"I received an email contact from Mike Kadrie at Zoetifex Studios back on December 7, 2010. His company was very interested in making QUEENSRźCHE's iconic concept album 'Operation: Mindcrime' into an animated feature film. He and I exchanged a few emails regarding this, and being that they were excited about proceeding, I ended up passing along his contact info to Susan Tate. Susan and Geoff Tate had many exchanges with them during the course of 2011. During that time, the company was trying to raise enough investment funds to secure the rights option for a two-year deal to then pursue the BIG monies from investors to make the entire full-length feature, which was to include some A-list talents and voices. However, they were not able to raise such funds during 2011. During the process in 2011, Mike Kadrie continued to correspond with me and Susan and Geoff Tate. However, during this process, Susan and Geoff Tate had told Mike to NOT continue conversations with me or the other band members which Mike Kadrie was able to convey to me in his emails.
"Early in 2012, I received an email from Mike Kadrie stating that they had secured the rights option to the film which was authorized and done only through Geoff Tate, and that Geoff Tate had signed the agreement for the rights to them without any knowledge given to the other band members. The deal also contained an advance of monies to secure this options right, which were sent to the band's accountant/attorney, Neil Sussman, to be held in escrow. After receiving this information from Mike Kadrie and Zoetifex Studios about securing the rights option, I informed Michael Wilton and Eddie Jackson and asked if they knew anything about this deal. Michael Wilton and Eddie Jackson had never been told about any film deals, and they were very upset about Geoff Tate presuming that he alone had the right to sign over any deals regarding any QUEENSRźCHE intellectual properties. The band members then contacted our attorney Neil Sussman who proceeded to tell them that, YES, Geoff Tate did sign over a deal for the options rights to 'Operation: Mindcrime', the movie. When the band members asked Neil Sussman how he could allow such a deal to be done without their collective input, he responded by saying something to the effect that 'Geoff told me he owned the rights, and so I just believed him and told him to sign the deal.' This made Michael Wilton, Eddie Jackson and I FURIOUS.
"On March 7, 2012, Michael Wilton, Eddie Jackson and I immediately signed and sent a certified document to Neil Sussman and Geoff Tate stating that this contract and deal was not authorized and that we request that all contracts relating to this deal be 'suspended' and that Neil Sussman was 'NOT ALLOWED TO DISPERSE ANY MONIES BEING HELD IN ESCROW.'
"On March 8, 2012, Neil Sussman confirmed that he had received this certified mailing and that since there was a conflict of interest regarding this movie deal, that he would not continue to work on any such related matters, and that he would not disperse any monies being held in escrow.
"On April 14, 2012, in Brazil, the band held a meeting in our dressing room at Geoff Tate's request. During this meeting we asked Geoff Tate about this 'Operation: Mindcrime' movie deal. He responded by saying that he knew nothing about any 'Operation: Mindcrime' movie deal. When asked further questions, Geoff Tate responded by saying that, 'Yes, I signed a deal for the story rights and that was a deal for me.' The band members absolutely disagree with him and that anything related to QUEENSRźCHE music, recordings, CDs, DVDs, videos, story lines, logos, and trademarks are absolutely considered intellectual properties owned by QUEENSRźCHE, and that NO ONE band member has any rights to sign contracts or accept offers on behalf of QUEENSRźCHE properties.
"On Saturday, April 14, 2012, at approximately 11:05 p.m., we (the band) had just arrived on the stage behind the curtain approximately 10 minutes before our show was to commence in Sao Paulo, Brazil, with 2000+ concertgoers in attendance. I was getting up onto my drum riser when fellow band member Geoff Tate walked in front of my drums and spit into my face while proceeding to yell obscenities at me. Geoff Tate then pushed my drums down onto the drum riser causing the first delays for the show. Geoff Tate then walked around the stage left behind Michael Wilton's guitar speakers and confronted Michael Wilton face to face. He proceeded to yell obscenities at him before striking him with his fist on the right upper side of Michael Wilton's face. I came off my drum riser to Michael Wilton's aid and told Geoff Tate to back off. Geoff Tate continued to yell obscenities and spit at both Michael Wilton and me, and then at that time proceeded to strike me in the face twice. I backed away and asked for security to assist the situation. Geoff Tate continued yelling obscenities and spitting at the band members while chasing us around the stage. The local stage security and our own crew came to assist in trying to subdue Geoff Tate. Geoff Tate continued to resist and kept chasing the band members around the stage, all the while screaming obscenities, spitting at them and threatening them. Our tour manager, Orlando Scott 'Fozzy' O'Hare, came to subdue Geoff Tate and move him to his position on the stage left. After a few minutes of Orlando Scott 'Fozzy' O'Hare trying to calm Geoff Tate down, Geoff Tate then came back across the stage at the band members. He continued to spit and yell obscenities and was trying to get close to them to continue his assault. Local security created a barrier between me, Eddie Jackson and Michael Wilton to keep Geoff Tate from approaching. This behavior continued for about 20 to 25 minutes while we were forced to delay the show. Michael Wilton was handed an ice pack to hold to his face to try and keep any swelling to a minimum. After the situation was under control, the other band members and the band's crew had to fix the damage caused to their equipment during this assault before the show could proceed as scheduled.
"Just minutes prior to the show commencing, Orlando Scott 'Fozzy' O'Hare was told by Geoff Tate that he was going to attack Eddie Jackson next and that he was going to 'mess' with me all during the show. The entire incident lasted about 25 minutes. During the show, Geoff Tate continued to spit on the band members and their equipment, which was clearly seen by the fans in attendance and caused a very uncomfortable situation for the band to perform at the level the fans expected and paid for.
"During the show, Orlando Scott 'Fozzy' O'Hare advised us to exit the stage and go directly into our transportation to get away from Geoff Tate and his possible continued assault. There was concern that Geoff Tate would try and assault us on stage during our final bows to the crowd. We arrived at our hotel safely soon thereafter and were told to stay in our rooms until later the next day to avoid any further confrontations. Local authorities in discussion with our stage manager, Orlando Scott 'Fozzy' O'Hare, agreed to have Geoff Tate booked on another plane flight different from our original flights to also further avoid confrontations. Geoff Tate's new flight cost over $2,500. Later in the night when Geoff Tate departed the venue with Orlando Scott 'Fozzy' O'Hare to go back to the hotel, Geoff Tate proceeded to tell Orlando Scott 'Fozzy' O'Hare to tell me to 'keep the f**k away from him.'
"Geoff Tate's continued lack of interest in original QUEENSRźCHE music or playing the older QUEENSRźCHE music is resulting in damage to the brand of QUEENSRźCHE. His recent and ongoing threats and assaults continued to place a great amount of stress on the remaining band members and their crew. Geoff Tate was no longer allowed to travel with the band, stay in the same hotels, participate in any band interviews, and had to be escorted at the venues with security. This was a very damaging form of business and had left the band with no choice but to move on without him."
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Holy shit.
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Yikes
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I'm just a casual Queensryche fan but this is pathetic.
I hope the band gets what they deserve, and I hope Tate gets what he deserves.
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And now, we have more... Michael Wilton's account of what has happened in the new reality show called Queensryche...
https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176587 (https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176587)
I would've posted the actual article. But, it was just way too frickin' long! Interesting read, though. I'll be curious to see how Tate refutes all this stuff.
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Guys, if you head over to Samsara's site you can see ALL the legal documents for yourself, just FYI.
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I believe MP's negative assessment of Tate from years ago has proven to be quite true.
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Tate, man, what a piece of work. :omg:
Geary's declaration is pretty much a trump card. He has no incentive to lie, and with respect to the band's potential earnings less Tate, you have to believe he knows exactly what he's talking about.
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I can't believe I read the whole thing.
I wish the best for Wilton and the guys, good luck with making the new Queensryche successful. :tup
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Tate obviously comes off as the worst of the whole bunch, but the rest of the band also comes off like a bunch of pansies who allowed themselves to be bossed around by Tate for the better part of a decade. Oh, but now they finally have the balls to man up and kick him out? Kudos for that, I guess, but unless they magically remember how to write songs again, they will be nothing more than a nostalgia act like Styx, playing songs from decades ago with a singer who sounds eerily like their original one. If that makes them happy, more power to 'em.
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Guys, if you head over to Samsara's site you can see ALL the legal documents for yourself, just FYI.
With both you and I (and a couple of others) recommending the site, I think the message is clear that it is a good place for discussion. I recommend it as a good source of information.
The only caveat I will offer for those who visit there in terms of the discussion at hand is, as with everywhere else, take things with a grain of salt and don't automatically assume an opinion is true, no matter how emphatically it is expressed or who says it. I mention this simply because it is a discussion of legal issues, legal procedure, and the substantive law itself. As a lawyer, I am hypersensitive to the TONS of rules and potential hazards when it comes to commenting on legal issues, so I point this out just to say: don't necessarily take things that are said on a message board as legal advice, or as definitive statements of what the law is, or what the likely legal outcome of the case will be. Again, it's a good site run by people who are also sensitive to these issues. But the fact remains that it is a message board where conversations progress rapidly, things are said that may seem to imply something that isn't intended, and/or things can be taken out of context sometimes, especially by someone who is just quickly skimming a long topic to pick up a few details. Again, I'm probably perhaps OVER-sensitive about the issue, but that's just something that comes with my profession. I am assuming all that I said is probably made clear by those posting there, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.
Along similar lines, while we're commenting on legal issues, I can say that I do in fact have general experience in this area of law (in fact, I litigated a case involving shareholder agreements and corporate ownership where there was a departing member; it was a huge, ugly case that lasted several years and culminated in a trial that lasted several weeks), I am not an expert and have limited knowledge of the specifics, including Washington substantive and procedural law.
In terms of what is actually being said in the legal documents, I find it sad and ironic that Tate was the one saying this was going to get ugly and dirty, and yet a lot of the ugly, dirty things he has allegedly said and done probably would have remained behind closed doors if he hadn't forced the issue by filing suit. :ironic:
Interesting that a lot of media outlets are also picking up direct quotes from the court documents all of a sudden as well. I suspect that that is a result of someone who has them and has connections with those media outlets pointing them in the right direction. You know who you are. If I am right about that, kudos for doing that. :tup That's one way to get the band's side of the story out there to counter the spin from the Tate camp.
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Alanis there kinda looks like Todd :lol
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And we thought the DT/MP split was harsh...
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And we thought the DT/MP split was harsh...
It would have been just as harsh had MP been fired, but him quitting made it a whole different ballgame.
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Alanis there kinda looks like Todd :lol
:lol Or Parker.
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Is it weird that this makes me SUPER SUPER EXCITED FOR THE NEXT QUEENSRYCHE ALBUM AND TOUR?
WHO'S WITH ME?!
:caffeine:
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*raises hand*
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And we thought the DT/MP split was harsh...
Funny you should mention that...
https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176607
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And we thought the DT/MP split was harsh...
Funny you should mention that...
https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176607
Awesome.
But I'm completely confused by the EXTREMELY negative comments toward Mike in the comments section. ???
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It's Blabbermouth, that's par for the course there. Much like Youtube, you're better off just skipping the comments.
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It's Blabbermouth, that's par for the course there. Much like Youtube, you're better off just skipping the comments.
Oh, I know. But usually, even though the comments are stupid, they at least have some context.
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Blabbermouth collectively remembers EVERY negative comment and thought hurled at the metal community. Any opportunity to continue the previous discussion is taken without providing context. It's actually a fascinating study of the internet group mind. :rollin
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Funny that news like this suddenly has me on a Queensryche kick in the last day. :metal :metal
NP: The Killing Words
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Funny that news like this suddenly has me on a Queensryche kick in the last day. :metal :metal
NP: The Killing Words
The killing words is my favorite QR song.
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Guys, if you head over to Samsara's site you can see ALL the legal documents for yourself, just FYI.
Unfortunately, his site is blocked for me at work, so I can only visit in the evenings. So, personally, I appreciate the cross-polination of info here at DTF.
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Funny that news like this suddenly has me on a Queensryche kick in the last day. :metal :metal
NP: The Killing Words
Dug out The Warning for the first time in years just now because of this thread, so it isn't just you. :metal
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Been listening to Queensryche (new and old) a good bit lately.
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And we thought the DT/MP split was harsh...
It would have been just as harsh had MP been fired, but him quitting made it a whole different ballgame.
That's true, but I doubt MP would've been even close to that bad. Mike seems like such a nice guy.
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Portnoy would never try to attack any member of Dream Theater because no one is stupid enough to fuck with a ninja, bear, wizard or pirate.
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In all seriousness, I don't think Mike would take it that far either, but more because he seems disappointed and saddened by how it all turned out. Maybe he got angry and took a few pot-shots via the media and social media, but that was anger borne of pain.
Geoff just seems pissed and looking for vengeance. He wants this to get ugly, and he's bringing the ugly.
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Right on, O.
MP also seemed to understand that it would be to his ultimate detriment to tarnish the DT name in any way.
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The similarity seems that both MP and GT had enough of Progressive Metal and wanted to pursue other kinds of music. MP had the sensibility to quit DT and let the other members continue how they wanted to. GT on the other hand forced his Pop-music cabaret act on the other members and alienated loyal Queensryche fans.
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Wow.
It seems like Tate is going through a horrible period of his life right now, to say the least. I hope he gets through it, and I think the rest of the QR guys are in the right to be going on without him. Oddly, this has put me in a Queensryche mood too- something I thought was entirely impossible anymore :P
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Wow.
It seems like Tate is going through a horrible period of his life right now, to say the least. I hope he gets through it, and I think the rest of the QR guys are in the right to be going on without him. Oddly, this has put me in a Queensryche mood too- something I thought was entirely impossible anymore :P
Glad to have you back.
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Wow.
It seems like Tate is going through a horrible period of his life right now, to say the least. I hope he gets through it, and I think the rest of the QR guys are in the right to be going on without him. Oddly, this has put me in a Queensryche mood too- something I thought was entirely impossible anymore :P
Glad to have you back.
Oh wow, this is awkward...
See, the deal was struck that to bring one member back... well...
*goes to mod panel*
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Wow.
It seems like Tate is going through a horrible period of his life right now, to say the least. I hope he gets through it, and I think the rest of the QR guys are in the right to be going on without him. Oddly, this has put me in a Queensryche mood too- something I thought was entirely impossible anymore :P
Glad to have you back.
Oh wow, this is awkward...
See, the deal was struck that to bring one member back... well...
*goes to mod panel*
I have a very particular set of skills; skills I have acquired over a very long career. Skills that make me a nightmare for people like you. If you don't ban me, that'll be the end of it. I will not look for you, I will not pursue you. But if you do, I will look for you, I will find you, and I will kill you.
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(https://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/23324487.jpg)
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:lol
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This story was all over one of the Portland rock radio stations today...totally in favor of the new Queensryche.
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The drama continues: https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176623&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter (https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176623&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)
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Yep, Tate was clearly spitting at Rockenfield there.
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I feel like I'm a little bit too entertained by all this drama. It's such a terrible situation for everyone, but damn, this is some juicy stuff. It's like a heavy metal Jersey Shore. I don't want to enjoy it, but I can't look away.
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I feel like I'm a little bit too entertained by all this drama. It's such a terrible situation for everyone, but damn, this is some juicy stuff. It's like a heavy metal Jersey Shore. I don't want to enjoy it, but I can't look away.
I feel the same way.
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If I ever have the good fortune to get drunk with Parker again, there is going to be a big bunch of questions I'll have for him stemming from all this. Just so much crap...
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I'm surprised he's still in the band, honestly. It seems they were upset about his hiring in their declarations, but they've kept him on for Rising West and the new Queensryche. Maybe its because he's not dating Miranda Tate anymore, but I would've thought they'd have fired him too. Guess he got on their good side.
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Of course this comes from the experience of only one night of hanging out with him and some of the other guys and crew, but even though Geoff brought him in, it seemed to me as if he had been much closer to the rest of the band these years later.
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The "you guys suck" video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d88du2GnAus
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin at him wearing eyeliner.
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"Thank you!"
"Wow, you guys suck."
"Anyway, nice to be here."
....lol? ???
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Think that's bad? Check out how positively awful his voice sounds at the Rocklahoma performance, his final with the band:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EHhK80GnwI&feature=player_detailpage#t=
Silent Lucidity is downright embarrassing.
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Think that's bad? Check out how positively awful his voice sounds at the Rocklahoma performance, his final with the band:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EHhK80GnwI&feature=player_detailpage#t=
Silent Lucidity is downright embarrassing.
Holy cow. I hadn't watched any recent performances in a while. Is his nose plugged up?! lol
Simply awful. He's nearly at Don Dokken level now.
And WTF? Sounds like he says "a doorway that I FUCK YOU in the night." :lol
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The "you guys suck" video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d88du2GnAus
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin at him wearing eyeliner.
Top Comment:
Guess what Geoff.. This is not all there is!!! and it does get better than this!!! It is now called Rising West!!! Now who sucks?
:rollin
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The "you guys suck" video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d88du2GnAus
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin at him wearing eyeliner.
This is one of the most absurd displays to a paying audience I've ever heard. I probably would have walked out after that speech. Geoff surly is fucked up in the head at the moment.
"This is all there is" :rollin WTF!!?
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https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176623
Vids of Tate spitting a Scott.
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https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176619
On Monday, July 9, Wilton, Jackson and Rockenfield filed a response to Tate's motion for preliminary injunction and included individual declarations from all of the defendants supporting their position that Tate's motion should be denied. As one would expect, these documents — copies of which have been obtained by BLABBERMOUTH.NET — contain startling details about the circumstances that led to the split between the singer and his one-time friends and longtime bandmates.
In his sworn declaration, Eddie Jackson writes, in part, "While we were recording the band's fifth album that was released on EMI Records called 'Promised Land', Geoff Tate had been experiencing marital problems. I'm sure he had a very difficult time focusing on both his marriage while also trying to be creative; however, while in the studio, I witnessed something that was a bit disturbing. I was sitting at a table reading some of the band's fan mail and started hearing yelling and cursing. As I turned my head towards the direction it was coming from, that's when I saw Geoff Tate slam through one of the studio doors while screaming at Chris DeGarmo from two feet away, yelling something in the likes of. 'Don't bring any more of your bulls**t here. I don't need any more of your bulls**t!' He was in such rage I thought he was going to physically assault Chris DeGarmo. He continued to yell a couple more expletives and just walked away. Chris DeGarmo, like a true gentleman, just kept his composure and started walking towards the front door. I wanted to share this incident because to this day Scott Rockenfield, Michael Wilton and I have continued to witness this type of random violent behavior from Geoff Tate on several occasions when he gets extremely angry and upset.
"After the album release for 'Hear And The Now Frontier', followed by an extensive tour, it was evident that something wasn't right. Since Geoff Tate didn't write any music, we continued to collectively submit to him various musical compositions to work on. However, Chris DeGarmo had been very quiet with very little communication. Chris DeGarmo finally contacted everyone to schedule a band meeting where he informed us he had made a decision to leave the band.
"Over the course of the next five album releases ('Q2K', 'Tribe', 'Operation: Mindcrime II', 'American Soldier' and 'Dedicated To Chaos') the band had gone through three guitar players, four management firms and five record companies.
"After Chris DeGarmo left, the band he was adamant about hiring Kelly Gray as the next QUEENSRźCHE guitar player. We had also severed ties with Q-Prime Management that had been managing us for about eight years, and decided to hire Ray Daniels, who at the time was also managing the bands RUSH and VAN HALEN. Once again, since Geoff Tate didn't write any music, and the band continued to collectively submit to him various musical compositions for the next album called 'Q2K'.
"Kelly Gray did not write the whole album with Geoff Tate as he claims. Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield, Kelly Gray and I spent many hours writing song ideas collectively and individually.
"After just one album and an extensive tour with Kelly Gray, Geoff Tate refused to continue working with him because of his substance abuse and Kelly Gray was eventually fired. Geoff Tate also decided to fire our manager, Ray Daniels.
"Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield and I weren't too pleased with the firing of Ray Daniels, but to avoid Geoff Tate's random violent behavior, we decided it would be best to just keep our distance and not start an argument. Lars Sorenson was hired as the new QUEENSRźCHE band manager. Susan Tate (Geoff's wife) was already working with Lars Sorensen as an assistant.
"After a year later, Geoff Tate decided to fire Lars Sorensen and conveniently hire his wife Susan Tate as manager. Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield and I knew it was a recipe for disaster and had no choice but to accept the idea if Geoff Tate was to continue working with the band.
"Before recording the album 'Tribe', frustration started to build with Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield and I towards Geoff Tate in regards to songwriting, the type of direction the band should be taking, along with certain decisions made by Geoff Tate that he did not allow us to take part in. He was creating a negative energy around our work environment. In fact, his wife Susan Tate emailed us and said that 'my husband has a dark side… I'm having a difficult time trying to reach out to him!'
"Geoff Tate spiritually had removed himself from QUEENSRźCHE and basically stepped away for about a year and decided to record his own album; however, at the same time, causing a serious detriment to the QUEENSRźCHE brand. Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield and I, along with Mike Stone, continued to write music and compositions for obvious reasons and eventually submitted them to Geoff Tate. In fact, we even rented a studio room at Bear Creek Studios in Woodinville, WA for two weeks to compose. Geoff Tate would on occasion stop in from time to time after riding his motorcycle to hear the various compositions we had written.
"Chris DeGarmo had been invited to participate on the 'Tribe' record. He recorded and composed several songs.
"When Chris DeGarmo was in the band, he used to take part in a lot of Geoff Tate's vocals sessions, and they would work together creating vocal harmony ideas, etc. However, Geoff Tate's demeanor continued and when it was actually his turn to start recording, he rudely told Chris DeGarmo that he wasn't needed. Not a pleasant, 'Hey, thanks for coming back and recording with the band' attitude, especially toward someone who used to be in the band for 15 years and had written arguably the most popular song QUEENSRźCHE had ever recorded! As usual, Chris DeGarmo, like a true gentleman, just kept his composure and simply got up and left.
"It wasn't long before we started to question some of Geoff and Susan Tate's business decisions. Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield and I continued to witness the same disrespectful, controlling negativity from Geoff and Susan Tate and Jason Slater during the writing process for the album 'American Soldier'. The three of us refused to work with Jason Slater again; however, Geoff and Susan Tate paid no attention to us and decided to hire Jason Slater again as co-producer. Once again, Scott Rockenfield, Michael Wilton and I had no voice in the decision. Our working environment had become very stressful.
"'American Soldier' sold approximately 60k copies. That's less than half of what the last album 'Operation: Mincrime' sold.
"As usual, the band continued to submit song ideas to Geoff Tate [for what became the album 'Dedicated To Chaos'] without any musical composition or contribution from him. We all worked long hours collectively and individually for several months.
"Geoff and Susan Tate insisted on hiring Jason Slater once again, even though the rest of us disapproved because of the problems we had encountered with him from before. Our stress levels were high and simply could not voice our opinion on the matter since they fell on deaf ears if we were heard at all.
"During the course of recording, Kelly Gray would continue criticizing Geoff Tate's song selections and decisions and simply said, 'This isn‘t the direction the band should be going.' Kelly Gray had also commented on how he had been underpaid and mistreated by Geoff and Susan Tate.
"Our last album called 'Dedicated To Chaos' was the band's most criticized effort to date. It was not well received. This was a band direction Geoff Tate insisted on taking even though the rest of us had disagreed.
"As you can see by QUEENSRźCHE's last three album releases, sales have declined significantly during Susan Tate's involvement as band manager, in addition with Jason Slater's and Kelly Gray's involvement. Kelly Gray had also taken notice of the band's decline in records sales and direction and commented several times that 'Susan Tate as band manager has run out of gas, and you should considered seeking new band management.'
"In the 30 years as a band, we have never submitted a hard copy paper form via USPS to schedule corporate officers/shareholders meetings. Every meeting has been scheduled through phone conversations and also, texting and emailing when it had become available as another form of communications.
"While on tour a couple of years ago I remember having an argument with Susan Tate over a tour bus issue and she was quoted as saying… 'I have to do what's in the best interest of MY HUSBAND to keep him happy' instead of saying… 'I have to do what's in the best interest of the BAND!' It obviously shows that she wasn't representing the band as a whole.
"The continuous nepotism from Geoff and Susan during her involvement with the band had caused many arguments, generated more tension and a high level of emotional stress on Michael, Scott and I.
"Since January of 2012 a notice of a shareholder and/or corporate officers meetings (approximately 4-5) were submitted to every band member. Michael, Scott and I were always present at these meetings, however, Geoff refused to take part in any of them without a valid reason.
"Michael, Scott and I constantly tried to find ways to minimize costs, however, at the same time maximize our dollar. Geoff's idea was always… 'Why do we need to worry about cutting costs?… We'll just find a way to just make more money!' Not very good business sense especially with the economic recession we've been experiencing over the last 4 years!
"We had a discussion about the current fan club office situation because it was costing the band so much money monthly, and especially since we weren't performing many shows in 2012 we weren‘t going to generate a lot of revenue. Basically, more money was going out than was coming in. The idea of hiring an online company to do this was much more cost effective in comparison. Geoff refused to go along with the idea because his wife and daughter were on the payroll. Needless to say, after eliminating the rental office lease payment, employee payroll, utility expenses and accounting fee's the bands accountant Neil Sussman was also in agreement of the amount of money the band would be saving on a yearly basis by switching to an online merchandise company per an email he submitted to all the band members.
"From March 2012 till to this day Scott, Michael and I have been denied access to the band's web site (Facebook, Twitter, PayPal accounts).
"While on tour in 2007, Geoff Tate physically assaulted Scott Rockenfield in the band's dressing room over another disagreement. He grabbed Scott Rockenfield's laptop and shoved it in his face and proceeded to swing at Scott Rockenfield while screaming expletives at him.
"Geoff Tate has made several comments about how he despises the hard
rock/heavy metal genre which is what QUEENSRźCHE's style has been from the very beginning.
"Twice in the fall of 2011 while on tour, Geoff Tate's irrational, violent behavior surfaced again after a discussion we had regarding songs that fans have been requesting us to perform for quite a few years. While the rest of the band were in agreement with the fans, he screamed in disapproval, 'I don't want to play those stupid songs. I didn't write them!' and stormed out of the dressing room in a violent rage.
"Moments before performing a show in Sao Paulo, Brazil, Geoff Tate physically assaulted Scott Rockenfield and Michael Wilton several times in front of a dozen witnesses including the band crew, the opening act, FATES WARNING, the local promoter, his assistant and among a few others. He even told our tour manager after he physically assaulted Scott Rockenfield and Michael Wilton that 'I'm going to f**k with Scott throughout the show,' and was repeatedly spitting on Scott Rockenfield's drum kit and Michael Wilton's guitars and amplifiers through the course of the night. At the end of the show, our tour manager told us to not go to our dressing room and go straight to the vans and to our hotel because he was afraid Geoff Tate would try to physically assault one of us again. He even had the hotel place security on each floor next to our hotel rooms that night for our own safety.
"Geoff Tate's claim regarding Scott Rockenfield's comment ('I've fired your wife, your daughter and now you're next!') is completely false, and even our band crew who were present at the time of the incident would testify to that.
"Several weeks following the Sao Paulo incident in Brazil at the M3 Festival in Baltimore MD, Geoff Tate continued to make threats to Scott Rockenfield, Michael Wilton and I if were to get near him while performing on stage.
"Another several weeks later, Geoff Tate's rant 'you guys suck' to the fans while performing a show in Oklahoma was extremely unprofessional and has only continued to damage the QUEENSRźCHE brand name.
"Geoff Tate's continued random threats and irrational, violent behavior still poses a threat to Scott Rockenfield, Michael Wilton and me, and has caused a significant amount of stress and we therefore cannot continue working with him in the future."
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The drama continues: https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176623&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter (https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=176623&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)
Didn't see your post mate, sorry.
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The "you guys suck" video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d88du2GnAus
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin at him wearing eyeliner.
Wow, there was no one there! Tons of empty seats.
Reminds me of this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMTPQVOWCiU
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I just can't believe Tate said that! As for being the mere shadow of himsellf...And can you see the distance there is between he and the other guys in the band?
I don't know what will come of the new QR, but it cannot be worse than that.
B.Lee
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The "you guys suck" video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d88du2GnAus
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin at him wearing eyeliner.
This is one of the most absurd displays to a paying audience I've ever heard. I probably would have walked out after that speech. Geoff surly is fucked up in the head at the moment.
He sounded like a muppet on 'Silent Lucidity' just following that speech -- so is this usual for him, or was he doing it on purpose to be a dick?
Wilton's doing a nice job with those solos though, anyway.
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Ya know, watching the whole Rocklahoma set, Tate's vocals and eyeliner are both laughable, but the rest of the band isn't much better. Their live background vocals on Empire are just brutal, and I am pretty sure Wilton did a poor job of playing some of the lead guitar parts from Silent Lucidity. DeGarmo leaving the band really was their death knell.
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They sound really good as Rising West. I think they just stopped caring at that point.
And WTF is with the eyeliner?
Also, lol Geoff Tate.
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Ya know, watching the whole Rocklahoma set, Tate's vocals and eyeliner are both laughable, but the rest of the band isn't much better. Their live background vocals on Empire are just brutal, and I am pretty sure Wilton did a poor job of playing some of the lead guitar parts from Silent Lucidity. DeGarmo leaving the band really was their death knell.
Not sure I'd be playing great if I was constantly making sure the lead singer wasn't about to hit me or spit on me.
There's a moment where Parker almost runs into Geoff after playing a lead. I can only imagine the fear inside :P
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And WTF is with the eyeliner?
Probably Susan's idea. It's actually pretty common for performers to wear stage makeup. When you're in a play or other stage show, your facial expressions can be seen through the entire theater with the right makeup to accent your face, but up close it looks really scary. A front man in a band wearing stage makeup isn't that far-fetched of an idea.
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And WTF is with the eyeliner?
Probably Susan's idea. It's actually pretty common for performers to wear stage makeup. When you're in a play or other stage show, your facial expressions can be seen through the entire theater with the right makeup to accent your face, but up close it looks really scary. A front man in a band wearing stage makeup isn't that far-fetched of an idea.
(https://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y289/wkiml/CAKQEUUVCA0XEV3XCAKNPIK0CAIH3PMMCAR2NZGSCARPIERBCAPQZN80CA904VXGCAGB0GMRCAUDJSX4CA41UI8ICAMDSB00CAI8SN5SCAHNPJE2CA3OBLLBCANCV5Q1CAYMM537CAQ8.jpg)
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(https://cache.jezebel.com/assets/images/39/2009/01/medium_lost13009_jez_512K.flv.jpg)
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Ya know, watching the whole Rocklahoma set, Tate's vocals and eyeliner are both laughable, but the rest of the band isn't much better. Their live background vocals on Empire are just brutal, and I am pretty sure Wilton did a poor job of playing some of the lead guitar parts from Silent Lucidity. DeGarmo leaving the band really was their death knell.
They did look terribly lifeless on-stage, like they were forming a new band, the John Myung Quintet.
But seriously, the difference between their energy and vibe there, and at the Rising West show I went to is night and day. This band (QR w/ Todd) is on its last legs, but I am not ready to write them off as dead just yet.
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The "you guys suck" video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d88du2GnAus
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin at him wearing eyeliner.
This is one of the most absurd displays to a paying audience I've ever heard. I probably would have walked out after that speech. Geoff surly is fucked up in the head at the moment.
He sounded like a muppet on 'Silent Lucidity' just following that speech -- so is this usual for him, or was he doing it on purpose to be a dick?
Well with that shaved head he certainly looks like one... man that's a noggin.
I always thought the growing ego/head comments were a figure of speech.
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Man, I wish I had an extra $7,000 right now! https://www.ebay.com/itm/Scott-Rockenfield-Queensryche-Rising-West-Drum-Kit-/251101316559?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a76ce05cf
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All this recent drama inspired me to buy used copies of all the pre-Promised Land material I hadn't heard yet, and a few others. That'll keep me busy.
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Think that's bad? Check out how positively awful his voice sounds at the Rocklahoma performance, his final with the band:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EHhK80GnwI&feature=player_detailpage#t=
Silent Lucidity is downright embarrassing.
Yes it is. Especially that first verse, although the whole thing is really bad. It's hard to imagine Geoff was ever considered a professional singer. Every single difficult note seems to become a "you sing now!" moment where Geoff hands the mic over to the crowd.
Also do other guys usually shave their armpits, or is that just a Tate thing?
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DAT lip synching! Such a shame.
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And dat monlogue during the bridge in Empire... ??? :wtf:
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Think that's bad? Check out how positively awful his voice sounds at the Rocklahoma performance, his final with the band:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EHhK80GnwI&feature=player_detailpage#t=
Silent Lucidity is downright embarrassing.
Yes it is. Especially that first verse, although the whole thing is really bad. It's hard to imagine Geoff was ever considered a professional singer. Every single difficult note seems to become a "you sing now!" moment where Geoff hands the mic over to the crowd.
Also do other guys usually shave their armpits, or is that just a Tate thing?
I've started shaving mine, it actually feels pretty great.
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TMI, dude. TMI.
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TMI, dude. TMI.
He asked a question and I answered it. It's not really that weird, it's like shaving your face or chest :L
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Also, lol Geoff Tate.
Exactly! :tup :tup
Ya know, watching the whole Rocklahoma set, Tate's vocals and eyeliner are both laughable, but the rest of the band isn't much better. Their live background vocals on Empire are just brutal, and I am pretty sure Wilton did a poor job of playing some of the lead guitar parts from Silent Lucidity. DeGarmo leaving the band really was their death knell.
Not sure I'd be playing great if I was constantly making sure the lead singer wasn't about to hit me or spit on me.
There's a moment where Parker almost runs into Geoff after playing a lead. I can only imagine the fear inside :P
Haha, I suppose that is true. Rockenfield should have chucked a drum stick at the back of Tate's head at the end of the set and said, "Oops," mimicking what Tate said when he knocked the drums off of the riser in Brazil. :biggrin:
Think that's bad? Check out how positively awful his voice sounds at the Rocklahoma performance, his final with the band:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EHhK80GnwI&feature=player_detailpage#t=
Silent Lucidity is downright embarrassing.
Yes it is. Especially that first verse, although the whole thing is really bad. It's hard to imagine Geoff was ever considered a professional singer. Every single difficult note seems to become a "you sing now!" moment where Geoff hands the mic over to the crowd.
It is sad. I mean, I get that it can be hard to maintain your voice when you are a screamer and your voice is often up in the stratosphere like Tate's often was back in the day, but still, it shouldn't be that awful now.
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It is sad. I mean, I get that it can be hard to maintain your voice when you are a screamer and your voice is often up in the stratosphere like Tate's often was back in the day, but still, it shouldn't be that awful now.
Chain smoking, drinking, other substances, no warmup, no vocal coach, and a host of bad vocal habits will cause deterioration and damage. Look at James in contrast. His singing days should have been over. But he WORKED like crazy to get his voice back in shape, doesn't drink or smoke, exercises his body and voice, etc. And, yeah, he still definitely has off nights. But, overall, his voice is in great shape for someone his age singing the type of music he sings and having had such a disastrous accident.
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That all sounds about right.
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Yes it is. Especially that first verse, although the whole thing is really bad. It's hard to imagine Geoff was ever considered a professional singer. Every single difficult note seems to become a "you sing now!" moment where Geoff hands the mic over to the crowd.
JET CITY... take it away crowd.
But in all honesty just looking at Tates stage presence just makes me think hes one of those people that has never really taken a stiff shot to the jaw.
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It is sad. I mean, I get that it can be hard to maintain your voice when you are a screamer and your voice is often up in the stratosphere like Tate's often was back in the day, but still, it shouldn't be that awful now.
Chain smoking, drinking, other substances, no warmup, no vocal coach, and a host of bad vocal habits will cause deterioration and damage. Look at James in contrast. His singing days should have been over. But he WORKED like crazy to get his voice back in shape, doesn't drink or smoke, exercises his body and voice, etc. And, yeah, he still definitely has off nights. But, overall, his voice is in great shape for someone his age singing the type of music he sings and having had such a disastrous accident.
Amen. Great post.
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Not sure what I can say that's not been said other but I thought things might have got better after Mindcrime 2 as I thought that was a step in the right direction.
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Not to pile on, but the performance of 'Empire' at Rockhahoma features some of the most indulgent use of vocal tracks that I've seen.
And then in the middle of a song about socioeconomics and urban violence, he launches into a speech (with that affected 'actorly' cadence) about proving the media wrong about live music being dead. I mean, WHAT?
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I'm interested to see what happens at the preliminary injunction hearing. Just as a bit of background, Geoff is suing the band on a variety of legal theories and basically alleging that the company acted improperly by firing him and his family members (and doing other things), that he owns and should be in charge of the Queenryche name and other intellectual properties, and that the other members defamed him. Typically, when a lawsuit is filed, the lawyers do a lot of stuff for a long time, but nothing really happens that actually affects the parties until either the case is dismissed, the parties reach a settlement, or the case eventually gets to trial. I have no idea what the court's docket is like in King County. But in most metropolitan and suburban areas, it typically takes at least a year to get to trial, and in many cases, 3-5 years for a civil case. So, in other words, unless the parties reach a settlement, it will probably be 1-5 years before anything really happens in this case.
...except that Geoff's attorney filed an application for a preliminary injunction to keep the other bandmembers from using the Queensryche name or doing other things. What this means is that Geoff's side is asking the judge to take immediate action RIGHT NOW to prevent the other guys from using the name until the case gets to trial way down the road. Preliminary injunctions are not typically sought and not typically granted. If you think about it, it's not hard to figure out why. Again, let's assume the case won't get to trial until 2014. Right now, neither side has had the opportunity to subpoena witnesses, ask witnesses questions, request documents, or do any of the other stuff you need to do to gather evidence. But if the injunction is granted, the judge would be saying: "Mssrs. Wilton, Rockenfield, and Jackson, I am ordering that even though we won't get to trial and actually decide the case until 2014 or later, you can't use the Queensryche name in the mean time." That's pretty drastic, right?
I haven't seen the actual application for injunction or the opposition papers, so I don't know what the legal arguments are, for or against. However, as I mentioned, it's hard to get a preliminary injunction. The law varies slightly from state to state, and I don't know Washington law. But basically, for Geoff to get his preliminary injunction and have the judge stop the guys from using the name, he has to prove a few things to the judge right now, including (1) That there is a substantial likelihood of success on the merits of the case (in other words, he has to prove with actual, admissible evidence right now that he is likely to actually win once the case gets to trial way down the road), and (2) That he faces a substantial threat of irreparable damage or injury if the injunction is not granted (he has to prove with actual, admissible evidence right now that HE will be harmed if the judge doesn't grant the injunction).
Having read the declarations, it sure looks like the Queensryche guys have presented enough evidence for the judge to deny the injunction and allow the case to proceed through normal channels. That doesn't mean the Queensryche guys have shown that they will ultimately win. But it will allow them to get out and do what they need to do under the Queensryche name while all this is being sorted out. Can't wait to see how this initla stage plays out.
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Did anyone else :lol at the "pet damages" outlined in Exhibit E of Tate's declaration? :lol :lol
I laughed out loud when I read this. Imagine the guys putting up an agenda for the meeting:
1. Fire Geoff
2. Ensuring the rights to the bandname Queensryche
3. Complaining about Geoff's dog who peed on our carpet :rollin
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bosk1. How does a guy in a band where all 4 have equil standing (I'm guessing this) thinks he can prove he owns the name brand?! I know that in every band that one or 2 are the "leaders" of the band but most except for royalties, are on equil ground?
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bosk1. How does a guy in a band where all 4 have equil standing (I'm guessing this) thinks he can prove he owns the name brand?! I know that in every band that one or 2 are the "leaders" of the band but most except for royalties, are on equil ground?
Geoff is essentially trying to have the original contract thrown out by trying to prove that he did everything, and has been (by his own good graces) allowing these non-participating freeloaders to ride on his coattails for the last 15 odd years.
Again...on this point...I think he is completely insane. But he can *claim* anything he wants. My 88 year old mother in law (who is epileptic, 85% deaf, blind in one eye, mild dementia and can't walk without a walker) *claims* that she doesn't need any of our help and *claims* she's going to go live in a motel whenever she gets mad as us. Claiming something doesn't mean it's based in reality. And it is my firm opinion that Geoff does not have a very strong grip on reality.
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It would seem that the injunction was filed as a piece of leverage, hoping to cause a sense of fear in the remaining 3 that their livlihood will be at jeopardy while waiting for trial. Maybe used to get a bigger piece of the "pie". Looks like the 3 have a competent lawyer and dont seem intimidated. Just my take.
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It would seem that the injunction was filed as a piece of leverage, hoping to cause a sense of fear in the remaining 3 that their livlihood will be at jeopardy while waiting for trial. Maybe used to get a bigger piece of the "pie". Looks like the 3 have a competent lawyer and dont seem intimidated. Just my take.
Probably as leverage AND with the hope that Tate could actually get the injunction. Honestly, I think he DOES want them name, even if he might be perfectly fine with just getting a bigger payout and bigger percentage of royalties. The problem is, he really kicked the hornets' nest in doing this, because look at everything that has come out about Tate in response. And he didn't count on fans with media connections getting the court documents to news sites that are eager to print excerpts of the docs.
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I think having that video be the first time I saw the band was a bad idea. Now I can't hear his voice without thinking of his douchebsg face.
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The following is by a poster at BM. No way to tell if this is legit, but if it is, I would take it that the new QR can use the name. Why else would GT want to block the Breakdown Room from posting about the temp ruling. Again, there's no way to know if it's legit though.
"Husband of clerk texted "outcome of temp injunction to be delayed again" to co-worker at Metal Rag (next cubicle over) also was laughing about "Geoff Spitty Woman" She said a bunch more Declarations had been submitted. Last thing.. this just came in.. Plaintiff is going to try to block "anybodylistening.net " from posting about the temp ruling"
https://blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?newsitemID=176587&mode=Article&order_by=newest&x=60&y=7#comment-2636797
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Maybe they'll go after Blabbermouth and DTF next? :P
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lol the ability Samsara has to get under the Tates' skin is impeccable :P
If it's true, what chance would they have of that? This stuff is legally obtained and open to the public.
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(https://puu.sh/IGyA)
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What's more interesting is that Queensryche would be like this without Tate:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVwGoDT3QkU
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What's more interesting is that Queensryche would be like this without Tate:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVwGoDT3QkU
I don't watch wrestling but that was actually pretty fucking awesome. :metal
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I'm not even a big fan of Queensryche but all of this is just delicious.
Just read the interview with the producer of Mindcrime 2 that said Scott Rockenfield wasn't even on the album.
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Round one over, Queenryche can continue as Queensryche, Geoff Tate is out of luck:
https://www.billboard.com/news/queensryche-may-continue-with-band-name-1007585552.story?utm_source=most_recent#/news/queensryche-may-continue-with-band-name-1007585552.story?utm_source=most_recent
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Round one over, Queenryche can continue as Queensryche, Geoff Tate is out of luck
At least for now, yes. Again, keep in mind what was at stake in the case procedurally. Tate filed a motion to try to stop the Queensryche guys from using the name between now and the trial date (which I think is currently November of 2014) when the case will actually be decided. By denying that motion, the judge is basically saying Tate has not presented enough evidence at this point in time to show that he will likely win at trial, so the judge cannot intervene and keep the guys from using the name at this stage in the case. Whether the case will even get to trial is anybody's guess. Keep in mind that, typically, only about 2% of all cases get that far. It is far more likely that a settlement will be worked out between now and then. But I wouldn't assume that this is the last we've heard from Camp Tate just yet.
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Oh, he's definitely not going to simply shut up and walk off. :lol
He'll bellyache and whine ala Roger Waters all those years ago about all the stuff he's been saying already.
The 'Ryche guys need to tour like madmen for the next 2 years...
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He could always go the Great White route and start "Geoff Tate's Queensryche" and then make every interview about the split.
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Good news, now let's get rocking
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So is it common knowledge that OMII is mostly Geoff Tate and session musicians? If not, I'm surprised no one seems to care much.
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So is it common knowledge that OMII is mostly Geoff Tate and session musicians? If not, I'm surprised no one seems to care much.
Yeah, it's pretty common knowledge...sad though. Given that several killer songs from the original were Wilton/Tate collaborations, I would think they'd have tried to recapture that.
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Good news, now let's get rocking
Pretty much. It's sink or swim time for R/J/W.
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I'm sure it'll sound different. But if the Mosh Pit demos are any indication, Whip and Scott CLEARLY have a lot to say musically, as well as the ability to say it. Whip is a metal guy, who is more than capable of writing the kind of complex chord arrangements QR are known for, and Scott brings quirky dynamic because his musical tastes and writing can be so ecclectic and...progressive, for lack of a better term. If those guys are contributing, and they bring in an outside writer or producer to HELP (as opposed to writing FOR them), I think they'll be just fine and then some.
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Also, it can't be any worse then their last 3 albums, especially Dedicated to Chaos. But, we all know that's a given. Man, all of this is really sad and pathetic for Queensryche's legacy. Geoff Tate has some serious mental issues. How did these guys put up with him for so long? I lol'd to ZKX's comment, he definetly needs a stiff shot to the jaw. What an egotistical ass.
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I'm actually excited for a new QR album and tour. Can't believe I'm saying that. Bring it on!
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American Soldier wasn't terrible. I only listened to a borrowed copy once or twice, but I don't remember feeling like it was bad sans Tate's deteriorating vocals. And I dug what they were trying to do with it thematically. It felt like they could possible bounce back with that, kind like Systematic Chaos was a step back in the right direction for Dream Theater though not a complete return to form.
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American Soldier was a good Tate and Friends album.
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Besides Tribe, AS was the best album since HITNF.
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I just wanted to say that, age and time passing aside, GT still sounded quite good on record. He's obviously not hitting super high notes like the old days, but he turned in good performances, IMO.
Live, I'm sure he struggles...YouTube proves that...but he also made attempts to alter the melodies so as to remain in key at least, as opposed to trying and failing to hit the notes...which most guys his age are forced to do...even Dickinson live wasn't singing things 100% like he did on the albums...but he still sounded good.
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Besides Tribe, AS was the best album since HITNF.
Since and including HitNF.
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...I kind of enjoy Mindcrime 2, in the same way I enjoy 90's Metallica :blush
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I just wanted to say that, age and time passing aside, GT still sounded quite good on record. He's obviously not hitting super high notes like the old days, but he turned in good performances, IMO.
Live, I'm sure he struggles...YouTube proves that...but he also made attempts to alter the melodies so as to remain in key at least, as opposed to trying and failing to hit the notes...which most guys his age are forced to do...even Dickinson live wasn't singing things 100% like he did on the albums...but he still sounded good.
While much of what you're saying is technically true...I would absolutely *NOT* compare his decline with Bruce's. Bruce stays in shape...and while he's no spring chicken...still sounds phenomenal in the studio, and varies between pretty good and fantastic live.
Geoff sounds pretty good in the studio. But live, he varies between above average at best, and downright miserable at worst. The man just does NOT take care of his instrument.
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I just wanted to say that, age and time passing aside, GT still sounded quite good on record. He's obviously not hitting super high notes like the old days, but he turned in good performances, IMO.
Live, I'm sure he struggles...YouTube proves that...but he also made attempts to alter the melodies so as to remain in key at least, as opposed to trying and failing to hit the notes...which most guys his age are forced to do...even Dickinson live wasn't singing things 100% like he did on the albums...but he still sounded good.
While much of what you're saying is technically true...I would absolutely *NOT* compare his decline with Bruce's. Bruce stays in shape...and while he's no spring chicken...still sounds phenomenal in the studio, and varies between pretty good and fantastic live.
Geoff sounds pretty good in the studio. But live, he varies between above average at best, and downright miserable at worst. The man just does NOT take care of his instrument.
Yeah, BD is obviously in better physical shape than GT. I haven't seen GT live since the Q2K tour, and he sounded great then...of course, that was 12 years ago.
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Geoff has NOT sounded good on a studio album in a long time. Mindcrime II was passable. Take Cover and American Soldier were awful. And his live performances have been abysmal. I'm not even sure how somebody could try to make the argument that he has sounded "good" in recent years.
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"The media is saying that live music is dead. But here we are playing live. And here is Empire, featuring an entire chorus with a backing track since I can't sing it live anymore!"
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Geoff has NOT sounded good on a studio album in a long time. Mindcrime II was passable. Take Cover and American Soldier were awful. And his live performances have been abysmal. I'm not even sure how somebody could try to make the argument that he has sounded "good" in recent years.
At least he's got Don Dokken beat.
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Poor Don. But at least Don knows his voice is shot.
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Geoff has NOT sounded good on a studio album in a long time. Mindcrime II was passable. Take Cover and American Soldier were awful. And his live performances have been abysmal. I'm not even sure how somebody could try to make the argument that he has sounded "good" in recent years.
He doesn't sound like he did back as far as Promised Land, but he certainly doesn't sound "bad" IMO. Maybe "diminished" compared to his glory days, but he's still a fine singer, IMO. Don Dokken sounds bad...Mark Slaughter sounds bad...Ozzy sounds bad...GT sounds decent.
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Maybe he's good on things like his solo album (which I quite like tbh) and the similar ryche songs but that's about it.
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Geoff has NOT sounded good on a studio album in a long time. Mindcrime II was passable. Take Cover and American Soldier were awful. And his live performances have been abysmal. I'm not even sure how somebody could try to make the argument that he has sounded "good" in recent years.
He doesn't sound like he did back as far as Promised Land, but he certainly doesn't sound "bad" IMO. Maybe "diminished" compared to his glory days, but he's still a fine singer, IMO. Don Dokken sounds bad...Mark Slaughter sounds bad...Ozzy sounds bad...GT sounds decent.
Er, did you listen to his singing at that Rocklahoma show? That is not decent or fine; that is awful singing.
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Geoff has NOT sounded good on a studio album in a long time. Mindcrime II was passable. Take Cover and American Soldier were awful. And his live performances have been abysmal. I'm not even sure how somebody could try to make the argument that he has sounded "good" in recent years.
He doesn't sound like he did back as far as Promised Land, but he certainly doesn't sound "bad" IMO. Maybe "diminished" compared to his glory days, but he's still a fine singer, IMO. Don Dokken sounds bad...Mark Slaughter sounds bad...Ozzy sounds bad...GT sounds decent.
Er, did you listen to his singing at that Rocklahoma show? That is not decent or fine; that is awful singing.
I'm speaking about on record mostly...these days I expect he and others to sound fair to poor live.
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Well, if you like his performance, I can't really argue with that. But especially on Take Cover and American Soldier, he was frequently off key (not occasionally--frequently), was singing from the neck up, and sounded thin and strained. When the vocals on a studio album sound like the singer recorded them in one take just after rolling out of bed and finishing off a couple of cigarettes, something is wrong. Mindcrime II had those moments as well, but also had some moments where Geoff actually sounded pretty good. I can't speak to Dedicated to Chaos, because I refused to buy it. But with American Soldier especially, it's a shame the vocals are that bad, because it's otherwise a VERY good album.
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Well, if you like his performance, I can't really argue with that. But especially on Take Cover and American Soldier, he was frequently off key (not occasionally--frequently), was singing from the neck up, and sounded thin and strained. When the vocals on a studio album sound like the singer recorded them in one take just after rolling out of bed and finishing off a couple of cigarettes, something is wrong. Mindcrime II had those moments as well, but also had some moments where Geoff actually sounded pretty good. I can't speak to Dedicated to Chaos, because I refused to buy it. But with American Soldier especially, it's a shame the vocals are that bad, because it's otherwise a VERY good album.
Let me clarify...I don't think he sounds "great"...I think he sounds "decent" to "good" and I can hear what you're saying about sounding thin and strained at times. I chalked it up to age and bad habits. But even when I consider those factors, I still think he sounds good to decent on record (though I have not heard Take Cover).
DTC he sounds OK mainly because it's all lower range vocals that don't require much push...just mood...which he still pulls off fairly well at times (kinda like Joe Elliot on later Def Leppard...it's all lower where he still sounds OK). DTC honestly reminds me of later Duran Duran in many spots. :lol
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Poor Don. But at least Don knows his voice is shot.
He's still attempting to use it to entertain people, so I'm assuming he either knows and doesn't care, knows and is in denial, or honestly doesn't know. :lol
That said, GT was passable at M3. He wasn't awesome, but he wasn't too bad either.
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For Geoff Tate, he sounds fucking awful.
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Poor Don. But at least Don knows his voice is shot.
He's still attempting to use it to entertain people, so I'm assuming he either knows and doesn't care, knows and is in denial, or honestly doesn't know. :lol
I think it's that he knows, but if people are still willing to pay for it, he's more than willing to get up onstage (which I guess falls under "knows and doesn't care"). But my impression is that he's also perfectly willing to admit that he sounds bad. In contrast, Tate still seems to think he sounds just fine.
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Besides Tribe, AS was the best album since HITNF.
The reviews for it on Metal Archives are pretty funny.
https://www.metal-archives.com/reviews/Queensr%C3%BFche/American_Soldier/224938/
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If we talk about Geoff Tate and back in the days he had mighty voice which I still adore, it can't be even described his present performance "good or decent". He is totally far from "decent". You know, it's even laughable. I remember when I bought American Soldier album and put it player, my first reaction was: WTF? I didn't bother myself to buy their last stuff but I heard of course. Totally shame, as a whole. I didn't even want to comment about his recent live performances. We are talking about a man who did lip synching. Is it enough to call it "decent"? Nope, it's unfortunately awful.
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If we talk about Geoff Tate and back in the days he had mighty voice which I still adore, it can't be even described his present performance "good or decent". He is totally far from "decent". You know, it's even laughable. I remember when I bought American Soldier album and put it player, my first reaction was: WTF? I didn't bother myself to buy their last stuff but I heard of course. Totally shame, as a whole. I didn't even want to comment about his recent live performances. We are talking about a man who did lip synching. Is it enough to call it "decent"? Nope, it's unfortunately awful.
Opinions, I guess. You can't lip synch on an album. Live is a whole other story...I have not seen him live since Q2K...I'm sure he struggles like hell these days live.
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I have not seen him live since Q2K...I'm sure he struggles like hell these days live.
For example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otSrIrA1PH8&feature=related
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I love how him letting the crowd sing the chorus is really just code for, "I don't have a prayer of singing that the way I used to, so I'll let the crowd do it for me." :lol :lol :lol
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I love how him letting the crowd sing the chorus is really just code for, "I don't have a prayer of singing that the way I used to in a way that wouldn't make your ears bleed, so I'll let the crowd do it for me." :lol :lol :lol
FTFY
Yeah, I know. It's sad, really. And it pisses me off that the reason his voice is that way is simply that he's too apathetic/self-absorbed/etc. to have done anything to correct the situation. It's one thing to have a voice deteriorate because of a health condition. Heck, even if it deteriorated because of his abuse and bad habits, but he at least recognized it and said, "I know the damage is done, but I'm going to get a vocal coach and try to change some of my habits now so that I can at least get some of it back and do a passable job," I could get onboard with that. But to just have the attitude of, "I'm too good to change my bad singing habits, get some training, warm up before shows, stop smoking, etc." is just ridiculous.
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Not sure if this has been posted before, apologies if so. looks like the future could be pretty good for QR. A talented guy for sure.
Demos clips for Todd's solo album.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nIyCKLa99IE&feature=player_embedded
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Not sure if this has been posted before, apologies if so. looks like the future could be pretty good for QR. A talented guy for sure.
Demos clips for Todd's solo album.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nIyCKLa99IE&feature=player_embedded
Very promising. Nice 80s metal vibe. I'm not sure Queensryche deserves this guy. :laugh:
Re: Tate willfully allowing his talent to deteriorate -- I bet he thinks that being able to hit the high notes is something that only concerns dumbshit metal vocalists, and he's so more of a modern artist than that.
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Re: Tate willfully allowing his talent to deteriorate -- I bet he thinks that being able to hit the high notes is something that only concerns dumbshit metal vocalists, and he's so more of a modern artist than that.
Were I a betting man, I'd put money on that being very close to the truth.
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I've never been a hardcore Queensryche fan - the only records I have is Operation: MindCrime I and II and while I think the first one is amazing, I've never dug deeper into their music than that.
But all of this bullshit going on right now has somehow made me a lot more interested in the band. :lol I listened a bit to Promised Land and wow...it sounds nothing like Operation Mindcrime. I'm gonna have to give it more listenings. What are their other records like? Are there more that sounds like O:M?
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I've never been a hardcore Queensryche fan - the only records I have is Operation: MindCrime I and II and while I think the first one is amazing, I've never dug deeper into their music than that.
But all of this bullshit going on right now has somehow made me a lot more interested in the band. :lol I listened a bit to Promised Land and wow...it sounds nothing like Operation Mindcrime. I'm gonna have to give it more listenings. What are their other records like? Are there more that sounds like O:M?
All of their albums are pretty different from each other, but from the debut EP up through Promised Land, they had that perfect combo of songwriting, chops and intensity. The EP and The Warning are the two most similar stylistically, IMO, and after that all the albums sound different from each other. EP & The Warning are the most "Metal", Rage For Order and Promised Land are their two darkest albums (IMO), Mindcrime you already know and Empire is their most commercial, but still amazing.
After Promised Land, they really dropped off while still having the odd song here and there turn out good.
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No, not really. At least for me. There are similarities in the first two albums and the demo but for the most part it's completely different. Same goes for Empire and Promised Land. You can tell it's Queensryche but the music is almost entirely different. Which is one of the reasons this band was legendary. Being able to shift your sound so many times yet remain true to your sound and still create amazing music over 5-6 albums? Not many bands can do that.
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Promised Land is my favorite album of all-time, followed by DT's Awake. It's such a unique creation and such a musical journey. Of the more recent stuff, I really like Tribe.
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Queensryche's music did evolve, but it remained, for lack of a better term, Queensryche. You could hear them finding the sound that defined their music on The Warning if you look hard enough (NM 156 in particular foreshadows Rage For Order nicely), but the next three albums pretty much worked in the same style, only becoming a bit more refined along the way. If anything, to me, Promised Land was the sharpest left turn the band did in their early albums, but remember, I'm one of the few that doesn't like Promised Land.
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Two shows booked in Lincoln City, OR. Oct. 19, 20. Tickets went on sale this morning and are selling amazingly fast. Got mine! ;D
https://tickets.chinookwindscasino.com/Online/
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A lot of drama for a band who only put out one classic album in 1988...
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A lot of drama for a band who only put out one classic album in 1988...
The warning, Rage For Order and Empire would like to speak to you. It won't end well... ;D
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Empire and Op:Mindcrime are classics. I don't get the love for the first two albums + the EP, though Take Hold of the Flame is a good song.
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Empire and Op:Mindcrime are classics. I don't get the love for the first two albums + the EP, though Take Hold of the Flame is a good song.
Rage For Order is a non-stop amaze-fest. It's my all time favorite QR album. That album *IS* Queensryche to me.
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Empire doesn't do much for me. :-\ Not that I think it's bad, but I don't get why it has received the high praise that it has. I guess that after Operation: Mindcrime I was expecting something different from Queensryche.
I still haven't listened to The Warning and Rage for Order (though I do like "Take Hold of the Flame"). I'm not highly interested in listening to them either. But maybe I'll get around to them one of these days. Maybe.
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EP- Promised Land are all classics
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EP- Promised Land are all classics
:hefdaddy
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A lot of drama for a band who only put out one classic album in 1988...
While it's true that they only put out one classic album in 1988, you have to remember that they put out classic albums in several other years as well.
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A lot of drama for a band who only put out one classic album in 1988...
While it's true that they only put out one classic album in 1988, you have to remember that they put out classic albums in several other years as well.
Okay, they have other albums that are regarded as classics, but Mindcrime is the one I usually see placing in greatest metal albums lists. "Classic" is a subjective term, anyways.
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Okay, they have other albums that are regarded as classics, but Mindcrime is the only one I usually see placing in greatest metal albums lists.
??? That might be true. But honestly, how many bands are there that you typically see listed in those types of lists as having more than one "classic" album? Not many, I would guess.
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It's not like they only made one album that was any good. Their first several albums, all the way through Promised Land, are highly regarded by a lot of people.
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Like I mentioned, I bought the EP, Rage For Order, Empire, and Operation: Mindcrime II about a week or two ago. I'm loving the hell out of the early stuff. Up until then I only owned Operation: Mindcrime, Promised Land, American Soldier and Dedicated To Chaos.
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Okay, they have other albums that are regarded as classics, but Mindcrime is the only one I usually see placing in greatest metal albums lists.
??? That might be true. But honestly, how many bands are there that you typically see listed in those types of lists as having more than one "classic" album? Not many, I would guess.
So how else does one measure what's a "classic" album? It's difficult to objectively measure since it's subjective. What's a "classic" to Queensryche and prog rock/metal fans might not be considered a "classic" to fans of music in general. That doesn't mean that Mindcrime was the only good album they put out, but it's the one that is most commonly cited as a "classic" among all metal albums. Empire and some of their other albums are sometimes, too, but to a lesser extent. That's all I'm saying. People can like and consider their albums "classic" as much as they want to, I'm not saying you can't or you shouldn't.
Peoples perception of what is "classic" varies. It can mean different things to different people. Perhaps I was wrong to say they "put out one classic album in 1988" (which is technically true, if you read into it like Orbert did), and it would have been more correct to say that they "put out one classic album in 1988 that is renowned to rank highly among all metal albums" or something to that effect.
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It's difficult to objectively measure since it's subjective. What's a "classic" to Queensryche and prog rock/metal fans might not be considered a "classic" to fans of music in general.
Exactly.
To me, an album being a "classic" basically means (1) the album really defined the band's sound, (2) the album was influential to others, and (3) the album is a bit...old. :P There are lots of ways to word it, and maybe there are other elements that are rightly considered, but I think those three pretty much capture the idea. And, you're right--what makes an album fit those criteria to the degree that the album should be considered a "classic" is very subjective. So, naturally, you are going to get some pushback by saying Queensryche only had one classic album. Aside from just being album that people consider "good," I think there are strong arguments to consider any of Queensryche's albums up through Promised Land to be "classics." Personally, I would probably put Mindcrime and Empire in that category, despite that I rank those albums as Queensryche's 4th and 2nd best. But The Warning, Rage For Order, and/or Promised Land could easily fit the bill, and I wouldn't really raise an eyebrow at any of those being part of the conversation.
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It's difficult to objectively measure since it's subjective. What's a "classic" to Queensryche and prog rock/metal fans might not be considered a "classic" to fans of music in general.
Exactly.
To me, an album being a "classic" basically means (1) the album really defined the band's sound, (2) the album was influential to others, and (3) the album is a bit...old. :P There are lots of ways to word it, and maybe there are other elements that are rightly considered, but I think those three pretty much capture the idea. And, you're right--what makes an album fit those criteria to the degree that the album should be considered a "classic" is very subjective. So, naturally, you are going to get some pushback by saying Queensryche only had one subjective album. Aside from just being album that people consider "good," I think there are strong arguments to consider any of Queensryche's albums up through Promised Land to be "classics." Personally, I would probably put Mindcrime and Empire in that category, despite that I rank those albums as Queensryche's 4th and 2nd best.
lol, I was making a similar point before I read your post. ;D
But I agree entirely with what you said. ;)
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Like I mentioned, I bought the EP, Rage For Order, Empire, and Operation: Mindcrime II about a week or two ago. I'm loving the hell out of the early stuff. Up until then I only owned Operation: Mindcrime, Promised Land, American Soldier and Dedicated To Chaos.
Bro... you seriously need to get The Warning. Next to Mindcrime that's by far my Fav. Folks argue a couple points, one, that it is or isn't a concept album, and two, if it is the very first prog-metal album or not. Either way on both points, it is a fantasticaly rich album, both musicaly and imaginatively.
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Like I mentioned, I bought the EP, Rage For Order, Empire, and Operation: Mindcrime II about a week or two ago. I'm loving the hell out of the early stuff. Up until then I only owned Operation: Mindcrime, Promised Land, American Soldier and Dedicated To Chaos.
Bro... you seriously need to get The Warning. Next to Mindcrime that's by far my Fav. Folks argue a couple points, one, that it is or isn't a concept album, and two, if it is the very first prog-metal album or not. Either way on both points, it is a fantasticaly rich album, both musicaly and imaginatively.
Needs a remaster with the original track order and the label-rejected mix too.
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Like I mentioned, I bought the EP, Rage For Order, Empire, and Operation: Mindcrime II about a week or two ago. I'm loving the hell out of the early stuff. Up until then I only owned Operation: Mindcrime, Promised Land, American Soldier and Dedicated To Chaos.
Bro... you seriously need to get The Warning. Next to Mindcrime that's by far my Fav. Folks argue a couple points, one, that it is or isn't a concept album, and two, if it is the very first prog-metal album or not. Either way on both points, it is a fantasticaly rich album, both musicaly and imaginatively.
Needs a remaster with the original track order and the label-rejected mix too.
sure .... I know the track list was changed, but It works for me better than the song "Warning" being 2nd from the end of the album. Re-master would kick ass though
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D'oh! Forgot to mention The Warning in that list. Bought that along with the others. Love it too. :lol
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D'oh! Forgot to mention The Warning in that list. Bought that along with the others. Love it too. :lol
:tup Ya know what?? It's been WAY too long since I had the CD in my car, I will rectify that mistake when I get home! ;)
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Like I mentioned, I bought the EP, Rage For Order, Empire, and Operation: Mindcrime II about a week or two ago. I'm loving the hell out of the early stuff. Up until then I only owned Operation: Mindcrime, Promised Land, American Soldier and Dedicated To Chaos.
Bro... you seriously need to get The Warning. Next to Mindcrime that's by far my Fav. Folks argue a couple points, one, that it is or isn't a concept album, and two, if it is the very first prog-metal album or not. Either way on both points, it is a fantasticaly rich album, both musicaly and imaginatively.
Needs a remaster with the original track order and the label-rejected mix too.
I've heard the other mix being mentioned somewhere before. Do you or anyone else know more about it? Was it supposed to be more "guitar" driven ect. ect...?
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Like I mentioned, I bought the EP, Rage For Order, Empire, and Operation: Mindcrime II about a week or two ago. I'm loving the hell out of the early stuff. Up until then I only owned Operation: Mindcrime, Promised Land, American Soldier and Dedicated To Chaos.
Bro... you seriously need to get The Warning. Next to Mindcrime that's by far my Fav. Folks argue a couple points, one, that it is or isn't a concept album, and two, if it is the very first prog-metal album or not. Either way on both points, it is a fantasticaly rich album, both musicaly and imaginatively.
Needs a remaster with the original track order and the label-rejected mix too.
I've heard the other mix being mentioned somewhere before. Do you or anyone else know more about it? Was it supposed to be more "guitar" driven ect. ect...?
Yeah, apparently the label wanted the guitars lower in the mix. Wtf is the point of signing a band like QR and then wanting the guitars muted? Labels. The curse of the music world. The sooner they die the better.
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Yeah, apparently the label wanted the guitars lower in the mix. Wtf is the point of signing a band like QR and then wanting the guitars muted? Labels. The curse of the music world. The sooner they die the better.
And then new talent gets no funding to do anything like make albums or go on tour or hire roadies. There are lots of things wrong with labels and the recording industry in general (mostly in their boneheaded approach to piracy) but they don't need to go away permanently. At least not the good ones.
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New official website (no more QR.com): https://www.queensrycheofficial.com/
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I would assume it would be best for the guys to do anything and everything they can to get the word out that QR is alive and well and ongoing legal issues and Geoff-related stuff is not going to keep them down and dominate the headlines.
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looking forward to the new website; hopefully with some samples of new music soon.
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Hoping someone gets good quality footage from Halfway Jam.
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I am starting to develop some curiosity and anticipation in regards to anything new that Queensryche may come up with...
I am also starting to feel like DTC was not all that bad. Certainly NOT a speck on the original Queensryche canon, and if directly compared to anything pre-PL then yeah, it blows...
But had it come out as what it is, a GT solo album, I think it may have been a little easier to stomach. Some of it reminds me of latter-day Duran Duran (which I like) and GT's vocal performance is good.
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Get Started was ok...
That's it.
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Get Started was ok...
That's it.
That is one of the "meh, OK" songs...I'm in the middle of a track-by-track commentary of the whole album now and the second half is coming out a little better than the first half.
I'll post it when I'm done.
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At The Edge is the only one I liked from it. Tate's vocals and lyrics are awful, but that sort of ambient opening and the main riff of the song are awesome.
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I'm going to present a quick review of this album on it's own merits, not comparing it to any of the band's greatest achievements.
Dedicated To Chaos (track by track):
Get Started - sort of pedestrian rock...not even hard rock. Main riff, with the right production, could have been an Empire b-side. Just OK, but nothing worthy of repeated listens.
Hot Spot Junkie - lyrics are trite and forced and serve to instantly date the song...and adding "with a loaded gun" just reeks of trying to feign intensity. Musically, slightly edgy and has a decent groove. Would be OK if not for the lyrics. Avoid.
Got It Bad - musically this one reminds me of latter day Duran Duran. In that context, it's not bad...even kind of cool. But, even DD would not express the sexual nature of a song like this so blatantly and on the surface as GT does here. The lyrics are a little too obvious and, like Hot Spot Junkie, are trite and forced; replacing feigned intensity with feigned sensuality. Avoid.
Higher - this one just sounds kind of haphazard and thrown together. The groove is by the numbers. The sax interludes sound like bad Dave Matthews Band. The attempt to mix in a harmonized solo and an intense build-up fall flat. It's like nobody could decide on a direction for the song, so they just threw it all in. Avoid.
Wot We Do - more GT by way of Duran Duran. This one could actually be a DD song in terms of vibe and arrangement, with the groove and string punches. Even the way GT sings it is sort of LeBon-esque. But, again, GT's put-on sensual aura comes off less sexy and more creepy...and the lyrics, again, trite. Avoid.
Around The World - melodic, unpretentious. It doesn't sound fake, it doesn't sound rushed. It sounds natural. A good, melodic track that sounds like it could have come from the Tribe sessions. The guitar tone and melody are good...with a nice, atmospheric, hopeful sound. The sentiment (and obvious Bealtes nod) of the lyrics may be a little cliche, but it's a welcome, refreshing change from what the album has presented thus far. This song is too good to be on this album. Good.
Drive - not too bad, overall. Musically, it presents a brooding vibe and non-grooved tempo. The guitars don't come in until a minute or more into it, more as texture. Again, not bad. More of GT's wanna-be sensuality in the lyrics. The guitars that come in at 2:27 are overflowing with U2-worship. Decent chours part, but the vocal arrangement & phrasing overall are awkward...trying too hard to be clever in spots. Just OK, but nothing worthy of repeated listens.
At The Edge - this one has promise. They bring a sort of grainy, dark vibe back a little...reminicent of parts of Tribe, maybe Promised Land. I like the music on this one, and the vocals for the most part. But, the lyrics suffer again and drag it down a couple notches, but not nearly as bad as some of the other songs. The sax solo should be a guitar solo. Better than most of the rest of the album, but not quite on par with Around The World. Good.
I Take You - similar to At The Edge...dark & grainy. This is another one that is actually decent. The vocal delivery is good and I like the solo...melodic with a dash of intensity. It's as good as At The Edge, which when combined with Around The World, makes 3 decent songs so far on an album full of "meh to bad". Good.
Retail Therapy - lame, trite, embarrassing lyrics (like the album's early songs), but musically decent. A little more driving, but still carries a dark undercurrent. The vocal delivery is good, solo is decent. More along the lines of the previous two songs. If the lyrics were any good at all, it would elevate this song...but sadly they're not and I can't even listen to this one because of them. They ruin what would have made the 4th song worth listening to. Avoid.
The Lie - this one sounds like it could have been on Q2K or even HITNF. Decent rock song, good groove, passable lyrics, good vocal delivery. Harmonized solo sounds like Mindcrime 2 type stuff. With this, I have found the 4th song worth listening to on the album. Good.
Big Noize - bad title. This one sounds like it's trying to head in the direction of Spool or Right Side Of My Mind...the dark, atmospheric album closer. It partially succeeds in that it's not as good as either of those songs, but still turns out to be one of the best songs on this album. As good as Around The World, only replacing the hopeful vibe of that song with a more melancholy pessimism. Bad title aside, this one makes 5. Good.
So, on a 12-song album we end up with, IMO, 5 songs worth listening to...and they're all on the back half of the album. The front half is packed with the most embarassing, forced, weak material to ever carry the Queensryche name. The back half shows that they were at least capabale of decent songs. Why the other 7 even seemed like good ideas is a mystery for the ages.
Place the songs I've labelled "Good" together as an EP and, IMO, it's not too shabby...but as an entire album, DTC fails.
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I tried to listen to the album back when it came out, made it to Got it bad, and that was it. I thought Get started was kinda catchy, and Hot spot junkie is a lot of fun, I like the groove and the riffs throughout, too bad the lyrics aren't nearly as good as the music.
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DTC is garbage.
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DTC is garbage.
Never listened to it, but I trust this opinion enough not to risk it.
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Setlist for the band's concert at the Halfway Jam:
01. Queen Of The Reich
02. Speak
03. Neue Regel
04. Walk In The Shadows
05. En Force
06. I Don't Believe In Love
07. Child Of Fire
08. The Whisper
09. Warning
10. Spreading The Disease
11. The Needle Lies
12. Prophecy
13. Take Hold Of The Flame
14. My Empty Room
15. Eyes Of A Stranger
16. Empire
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17. Wrathchild (IRON MAIDEN cover)
18. Jet City Woman
19. Roads To Madness
All I am going to say: ROADS TO MADNESS FUCK YEAH. :metal
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Setlist for the band's concert at the Halfway Jam:
01. Queen Of The Reich
05. En Force
07. Child Of Fire
09. Warning
12. Prophecy
13. Take Hold Of The Flame
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17. Wrathchild (IRON MAIDEN cover)
19. Roads To Madness
All I am going to say: ROADS TO MADNESS FUCK YEAH. :metal
Some of these I've seen before, but in general I'm just really excited to see this bunch of songs if they keep the set for their first big tour.
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The clips I saw of the show were awesome. Todd is doing a fantastic job. He's fit in perfectly and I don't think you could have found a better replacement for Tate. They were big shoes to fill and QR has made the transition just fine. Looking forward to a tour and of course studio material.
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The clips I saw of the show were awesome. Todd is doing a fantastic job. He's fit in perfectly and I don't think you could have found a better replacement for Tate. They were big shoes to fill and QR has made the transition just fine. Looking forward to a tour and of course studio material.
He sounds decent overall...but I heard several instances of potential future problems if he doesn't learn to pace himself. He was struggling in several places to hit those notes. Who wouldn't, though...right?
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Some of my personal favorites are missing, too bad they left out a couple of good songs from Promised land, but it's still one fine set overall, I wouldn't mind seeing that show. :smiley:
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Setlist for the band's concert at the Halfway Jam:
01. Queen Of The Reich
02. Speak
03. Neue Regel
04. Walk In The Shadows
05. En Force
06. I Don't Believe In Love
07. Child Of Fire
08. The Whisper
09. Warning
10. Spreading The Disease
11. The Needle Lies
12. Prophecy
13. Take Hold Of The Flame
14. My Empty Room
15. Eyes Of A Stranger
16. Empire
--------------
17. Wrathchild (IRON MAIDEN cover)
18. Jet City Woman
19. Roads To Madness
All I am going to say: ROADS TO MADNESS FUCK YEAH. :metal
That's incredible but I wish they had more recent songs like these they could draw on.
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Whatever you think of Geoff Tate and the bands political views I always like this [My Global Mind] song for it's ideals.
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Whatever you think of Geoff Tate and the bands political views I always like this song for it's ideals.
No linking to pirated material please.
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Incidentally, how is it allowed on Youtube as well as spotify if it's pirated?
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Incidentally, how is it allowed on Youtube as well as spotify if it's pirated?
Just because something is on YouTube or some other site does not mean it is allowed. Besides, what other sites do is their own business. What we do here is mine.
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Really excited about this new lineup and setlist, will be seeing them live ASAP :metal
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Todd posted on his fb last night that they are booking shows. I already have tickets for Oct. 19 and 20 in Lincoln City, OR. Now if they just add Portland... ;)
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We're into day 46 of the party that followed the official announcement of Geoff Tate's dismissal.
(https://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r47/jammindude/QRDrinking.jpg)
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Okay I'll admit, I have 0 idea what they are doing.
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Educated guess...I think there are 4 shot glasses glued to a board.
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Shot-ski
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I know that's Michael Wilton and Eddie in the foreground...I just found out that the third guy is a roadie. I was pretty sure the last one was Parker, and that's been confirmed.
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This is a picture of them after they re-listened to DTC.
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From That Metal Show fb page lol:
"Geoff Tate came by today and commented on the Queensr˙che split: “I’d like to sit in a room with those gentlemen, and have them tell me face to face, what the situation is. Explain their actions. I’d like to know and actually understand their point of view. I’d like to see them talk to me face to face, rather than through the internet... Communication is a big part of any relationship, right? If nobody’s talking, then nothing’s getting settled… My door’s open!”
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^^^^
Ya...I'm not buying it. Geoff has a history of acting one way when no-one's looking and then trying to make himself out to be the victim of misunderstanding when in the public eye. Classic sociopath behavior.
People who have actually met him (with the exception of designated fan meeting arrangements when he's got his "game face" on) universally label him as a completely self-centered narcissistic jerk-off. You don't get *that* widely accepted universal unanimous criticism about you because of a conspiracy. He lost the injunction and he's trying for PR damage control...pure and simple.
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From That Metal Show fb page lol:
"Geoff Tate came by today and commented on the Queensr˙che split: “I’d like to sit in a room with those gentlemen, and have them tell me face to face, what the situation is. Explain their actions. I’d like to know and actually understand their point of view. I’d like to see them talk to me face to face, rather than through the internet... Communication is a big part of any relationship, right? If nobody’s talking, then nothing’s getting settled… My door’s open!”
That sounds like something my old singer would say.
And my old singer was a narcissistic douche bag.
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^^^^
Ya...I'm not buying it. Geoff has a history of acting one way when no-one's looking and then trying to make himself out to be the victim of misunderstanding when in the public eye. Classic sociopath behavior.
People who have actually met him (with the exception of designated fan meeting arrangements when he's got his "game face" on) universally label him as a completely self-centered narcissistic jerk-off. You don't get *that* widely accepted universal unanimous criticism about you because of a conspiracy. He lost the injunction and he's trying for PR damage control...pure and simple.
I met him one time in 2009 at a meet and great at a record store when he supposedly had his game face on and he still acted like a completely self-centered narcissistic jerk-off. Good riddance!
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Here's the other double whammy about these people (and I've known them...personally.)
They can actually be incredibly intelligent, clever and master debaters. (insert Beavis and Butthead laugh here)
*IF* they were to meet him on a talk show, Geoff would talk circles around them and make himself sound great, and them sound like jerks.
It's hard to explain. If you've ever been in a really bad fight with a psychotic girlfriend who just happened to be a psychotic genius...you'd know what I was talking about. It's best to just NOT EVEN START....just stay away...stay silent...and let the lawyers do their job.
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"I’d like to see them talk to me face to face, rather than through the internet..."
That's the thing, the QR guys haven't said a word through the internet. He's so incredibly delusional and out of touch with reality.
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So now the Tate's (old QR) facebook has been edited to read "The ONLY official Queensryche facebook page."
Also, there is a post regarding That Metal Show that Geoff wants everyone to see. As this page has been highjacked by the Tate's, there's a new OFFICIAL Queensryche facebook page. If you haven't done so, it would be a good idea to Unlike the highjacked page here:
https://www.facebook.com/Queensryche
and then Like the official QR page here:
https://www.facebook.com/QueensrycheOfficial
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So now the Tate's (old QR) facebook has been edited to read "The ONLY official Queensryche facebook page."
Also, there is a post regarding That Metal Show that Geoff wants everyone to see. As this page has been highjacked by the Tate's, there's a new OFFICIAL Queensryche facebook page. If you haven't done so, it would be a good idea to Unlike the highjacked page here:
https://www.facebook.com/Queensryche
and then Like the official QR page here:
https://www.facebook.com/QueensrycheOfficial
Wait, so the Tates are so desperate and un-classy that they hijacked the Queensr˙che official page and turned them into their page?
(https://s12.postimage.org/bju14t1yl/1343693896047.jpg)
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This fb comment on the highjacked page pretty much sums up my thoughts:
James "Since they refuse to give the social media sites to the ONLY official Queensryche, hopefully the band is looking into legal restitution and especially bringing attention to the Voodoos debacle to the proper legal authorities. An orange jumpsuit would match Susan's hair color and Geoff would certainly be hitting the high notes again if he drops the soap in a prison shower stall."
:rollin
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This fb comment on the highjacked page pretty much sums up my thoughts:
James "Since they refuse to give the social media sites to the ONLY official Queensryche, hopefully the band is looking into legal restitution and especially bringing attention to the Voodoos debacle to the proper legal authorities. An orange jumpsuit would match Susan's hair color and Geoff would certainly be hitting the high notes again if he drops the soap in a prison shower stall."
:rollin
The last part of the quote is irresistible. :rollin :rollin :rollin
B.Lee
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I'm getting kindof anxious for the new Geoff Tate interview on Eddie Trunk's show. Mostly because it's getting a little personal for me.
Anyone who has ever known anyone with Borderline Personality Disorder can pick out red flags right away...but because of the way it fluctuates...because of the way the person can brighten up whenever it suits him/her, it becomes very difficult to actually diagnose...much less convince the person they have a problem. They are usually *VERY* adept at rallying people to their "side" and thus giving credence to their behavior in their own mind.
I'm just thinking I'm going to need my Nerf "TV Brick" on standby while watching.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borderline_personality_disorder
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The problem for him is, to those who have been paying attention, it is obvious that Geoff is delusional because there is practically irrefutable evidence that half of what he has been saying about the split is completely bogus. And to me, those Court declarations were very telling. Probably the most tell-tale one of all was Fozzy's. Given that he is basically Geoff's "boy," the fact that he completely backed up the band's version of events in Brazil, etc., and said Geoff was lying is HUGE, in my opinion.
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https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=178100&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
Geoff forming his own version of QR. :rollin
https://www.billboard.com/news/queensryche-having-online-identity-crisis-1007815352.story#/news/queensryche-having-online-identity-crisis-1007815352.story
"Tomorrow (Aug. 14), Billboard will publish an interview with Wilton, Rockenfield and Jackson where they discuss their side of the lawsuit.
Read more at https://www.billboard.com/news/queensryche-having-online-identity-crisis-1007815352.story#I6Rv745bSjQ60kc8.99" :metal
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I think there should be dual tours happening soon.
Tour 1: Queensryche and Great White.
Tour 2: Geoff Tate's Queensryche and Jack Russel's Great White.
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Bahahaha. Fantastic. Good luck with that.
I'm... morbidly curious about this solo album he's doing. I mean... it's pretty much is what the next Queensryche album would have sounded like if this hadn't happened, right?
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This has now officially reached bad joke status...my love for the first 6 albums aside, screw these guys. :loser:
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I'm... morbidly curious about this solo album he's doing. I mean... it's pretty much is what the next Queensryche album would have sounded like if this hadn't happened, right?
Probably, so you know it will probably suck something awful.
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I'm... morbidly curious about this solo album he's doing. I mean... it's pretty much is what the next Queensryche album would have sounded like if this hadn't happened, right?
Probably, so you know it will probably suck something awful.
I remember reading not long ago where Tate claimed his solo album was going to be "heavy"...
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maybe Tate means "heavy" in terms of weight.
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I'm... morbidly curious about this solo album he's doing. I mean... it's pretty much is what the next Queensryche album would have sounded like if this hadn't happened, right?
Probably, so you know it will probably suck something awful.
I remember reading not long ago where Tate claimed his solo album was going to be "heavy"...
Yeah, I'll believe it when I hear it. I've been hearing claims like that going back to before Q2K.
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I'm... morbidly curious about this solo album he's doing. I mean... it's pretty much is what the next Queensryche album would have sounded like if this hadn't happened, right?
Probably, so you know it will probably suck something awful.
I remember reading not long ago where Tate claimed his solo album was going to be "heavy"...
Yeah, I'll believe it when I hear it. I've been hearing claims like that going back to before Q2K.
Oh yeah, I know...he's most likely full of shit.
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Billboard.com Q&A with the boys (just before TMS ;) ):
https://www.billboard.com/features/q-a-queensryche-talks-lawsuit-plans-return-1007826952.story?utm_source=most_recent#/features/q-a-queensryche-talks-lawsuit-plans-return-1007826952.story?utm_source=most_recent
Oh...and the new official QR website is up and running with FREE forum:
https://www.queensrycheofficial.com/home.cfm
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What would be hilarious is if they release a Mindcrime II.0 album, completely rewritten.
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What would be hilarious is if they release a Mindcrime II.0 album, completely rewritten.
:rollin That would be great!
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Another interview with Scott and Whip...more of the same basically:
https://www.pollstar.com/news_article.aspx?ID=802398
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Oh...and the new official QR website is up and running with FREE forum:
https://www.queensrycheofficial.com/home.cfm
It's about time. I bailed on their forums when they changed it to "pay-to-post" years ago. This is a good move. I just wish they would have gone with a more user-friendly interface like SMF. All forum software is NOT created equal, unfortunately.
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Oh...and the new official QR website is up and running with FREE forum:
https://www.queensrycheofficial.com/home.cfm
It's about time. I bailed on their forums when they changed it to "pay-to-post" years ago. This is a good move. I just wish they would have gone with a more user-friendly interface like SMF. All forum software is NOT created equal, unfortunately.
Pay to post? Seriously?
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Yup. I can't remember exactly when, but I think it was just after Q2K.
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Yup. I can't remember exactly when, but I think it was just after Q2K.
It doesn't surprise me coming from people as the Tates, but still, :facepalm:
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How many people would they get on their forums? I cant imagine it was a large amount
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Doesn't Iron Maiden do the same thing?
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I don't really listen to Queensryche. I mean, I have their greatest hits CD and I sometimes like to sing Queen of the Reich along with it in my car cause....well it's a damn fun song to sing. But I want to thank all of them for such amazing entertainment they have been providing recently.
Honestly it kind of makes me hope Lars quits Metallica and tries to pull a similar stunt. Imagine how amazing that would be!
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Doesn't Iron Maiden do the same thing?
I think you pay to be a member of the site, which includes things in addition to the forum, like presale codes and speical merch and such. I was a member a while back, it was a small charge but not worth it for me to rejoin.
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This is what's now posted on the Tate family fb page:
QUEENSRźCHE STARRING GEOFF TATE THE ORIGINAL VOICE
This fall, Geoff Tate Electric Band will be releasing his new solo metal album on Inside Out Music, which features such label mates as King’s X, Fates Warning, Pain of Slavation and Dream Theater’s frontman James LaBrie, and many others! Geoff Tate solo tour dates with Alice Cooper beginning in November.
***Watch for the announcement of the upcoming 2013 Queensryche Anniversary Tour featuring an All-Star lineup, starring Geoff Tate, the longtime creative and driving force behind the band, whose vocals can be heard on every Queensryche song ever released!***
:rollin
Edit: So apparently he's celebrating an anniversary of the band he was fired from?
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This is what's now posted on the Tate family fb page:
QUEENSRźCHE STARRING GEOFF TATE THE ORIGINAL VOICE
This fall, Geoff Tate Electric Band will be releasing his new solo metal album on Inside Out Music, which features such label mates as King’s X, Fates Warning, Pain of Slavation and Dream Theater’s frontman James LaBrie, and many others! Geoff Tate solo tour dates with Alice Cooper beginning in November.
***Watch for the announcement of the upcoming 2013 Queensryche Anniversary Tour featuring an All-Star lineup, starring Geoff Tate, the longtime creative and driving force behind the band, whose vocals can be heard on every Queensryche song ever released!***
:rollin
Edit: So apparently he's celebrating an anniversary of the band he was fired from?
Allstar lineup. Geoff Tate, Kelly Gray and a drum machine?
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Pain of Slavation huh?
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Pain of Slavation huh?
Label mates. That's all.
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inb4 InsideOut forces all of their bands to contribute to Tate's monstrosity in some way.
Nah... I mean, they might be bad, but they're not Magna Carta, right?
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Tate really seems to be showing his true, vindictive colors, huh? :\
I mean, really. If you're so talented, and the brains of the operation...prove it. Let them be Queensryche while you, in your infinite genius, make your solo output bigger and better. That would make sense, right?
No. We're going to go round with "official" and "real" and "original" and beat the name to death in the process.
Lame.
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Agreed. I hate it when someone repeatedly hits you over the head with all that, in some kind of effort to "prove" their worthiness. Real fans know who played or sang on each album, and who the creative forces were, and they can make their own decisions. This type of shit is just trying to win over people who don't know any better. Yay, I managed to sell 100 tickets to idiots who didn't realize I've sucked for the last 10 years and thought they were going to hear Queensryche.
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Problem is, Geoff is so out of touch that he thinks MOST fans don't know any better.
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Problem is, Geoff is so out of touch that he thinks MOST fans don't know any better.
QUEENSRYCHE STARRING GEOFF TATE: THE ORIGINAL VOICE
(https://www.adrants.com/images/head_up_ass.jpg)
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:lol That is both disturbing and hilarious.
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And true.
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Geoff's smiling next to us, in silent stupidity.
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This is what's now posted on the Tate family fb page:
QUEENSRźCHE STARRING GEOFF TATE THE ORIGINAL VOICE
This fall, Geoff Tate Electric Band will be releasing his new solo metal album on Inside Out Music, which features such label mates as King’s X, Fates Warning, Pain of Slavation and Dream Theater’s frontman James LaBrie, and many others! Geoff Tate solo tour dates with Alice Cooper beginning in November.
***Watch for the announcement of the upcoming 2013 Queensryche Anniversary Tour featuring an All-Star lineup, starring Geoff Tate, the longtime creative and driving force behind the band, whose vocals can be heard on every Queensryche song ever released!***
:rollin
Edit: So apparently he's celebrating an anniversary of the band he was fired from?
It actually says this :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
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I especially enjoy his vocals on Anarchy X.
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Waiting for 22 has his best vocal performance.
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Did Geoff sing backing vocals on "All I Want"?
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Chris sang on one garbage song
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Not sure, actually. I think it was all Chris, but I'm not sure.
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Chris sang on one garbage song
No he didn't. He sang on All I Want.
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Which is their best song post-PL, imo.
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Just went over to youtube and had a first listen to the new singer....pretty freaking impressive!
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The only thing I am concerned about Todd is that he isn't a trained singer and sometimes his singing seems a bit forced when it shouldn't be (live that is, studio he's perfect). With getting this gig and Crimson Glory, I hope he doesn't burn out his voice or something in a few years of recording and possibly extensive touring. Maybe I'm wrong about this, though. Just a feeling.
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This is what's now posted on the Tate family fb page:
QUEENSRźCHE STARRING GEOFF TATE THE ORIGINAL VOICE
This fall, Geoff Tate Electric Band will be releasing his new solo metal album on Inside Out Music, which features such label mates as King’s X, Fates Warning, Pain of Slavation and Dream Theater’s frontman James LaBrie, and many others! Geoff Tate solo tour dates with Alice Cooper beginning in November.
***Watch for the announcement of the upcoming 2013 Queensryche Anniversary Tour featuring an All-Star lineup, starring Geoff Tate, the longtime creative and driving force behind the band, whose vocals can be heard on every Queensryche song ever released!***
"Geoff Tate Electric Band" -- this is so funny to me, for some reason.
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Oh good, I thought he was going acoustic.
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Wow, I'm impressed by how well it looks for Geoff, he's actually going to tour with Alice Cooper. And the fact that James will appear on his new solo album is pretty surprising. Still, it's kinda sad how all these posts are trying to make us remember how important Geoff was to the band, like they don't know how many fans he alienated with the last couple of Queensryche albums.
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Wow, I'm impressed by how well it looks for Geoff, he's actually going to tour with Alice Cooper. And the fact that James will appear on his new solo album is pretty surprising.
I wouldn't say it is looking good. For the Alice Cooper tour, I doubt it is a co-headlining tour. He is probably opening. So while he'll be playing some decent venues (likely better ones than Queensryche had gotten on the last tour or was likely to get with old management), it will be as an opener rather than headliner.
And it does not say James will be on the album. It is a very poorly written sentence, and perhaps purposely worded as vaguely as it is. All it is saying is that the new album is being released through the same label as those bands, including James' solo band. It doesn't say any of those bands are guesting on the album.
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Although the press release provides some delightful turns of phrase, it feels like it was written by someone with English as their fourth language. "Geoff Tate solo tour dates with..." -- really? And I am to believe his solo album will "feature" King’s X and Fates Warning -- not unspecified members of those bands in some unspecified capacity -- but will feature those bands?
eta: bosk1 I think you are right -- it's simply a botched sentence, though possibly designed to mislead.
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Oh right, I didn't even bother to read it carefully. Thanks for clearing that out for me.
And I'm not saying it's a great tour for Geoff, but I'm sure he'll be performing in front of more people than he did on the last couple of Queensryche tours, and that counts as something whatever, right?
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Well, if he gets out there w/ Alice and insists on shoveling that DTC material in an opening set, he's possibly in for a rude awakening.
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You know what would be incredibly awesome? If right after the tour kicked off, Queensryche's lawyers sent a demand letter to Geoff saying, basically: "Dr. Mr. 'Voice of Queenryche,' as you know, the 'Queensryche' name belongs to TriRyche Corp. (or whichever of the QR entities actually owns the name), which is currently owned solely by Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield, and Eddie Jackson, who are entiteld to X% of income earned by you on this tour from using the Queensryche name. Please contact us immediately with your proposed written payment schedule and provide us with written copies of all contracts for concert guarantees, merchandise, etc. so we can calculate the amount owed by you." That could be very useful leverage in the upcoming legal battle.
(credit to Samsara for posting something similar on his site earlier this morning)
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You know what would be incredibly awesome? If right after the tour kicked off, Queensryche's lawyers sent a demand letter to Geoff saying, basically: "Dr. Mr. 'Voice of Queenryche,' as you know, the 'Queensryche' name belongs to TriRyche Corp. (or whichever of the QR entities actually owns the name), which is currently owned solely by Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield, and Eddie Jackson, who are entiteld to X% of income earned by you on this tour from using the Queensryche name. Please contact us immediately with your proposed written payment schedule and provide us with written copies of all contracts for concert guarantees, merchandise, etc. so we can calculate the amount owed by you." That could be very useful leverage in the upcoming legal battle.
(credit to Samsara for posting something similar on his site earlier this morning)
Yeah, I was sorta wondering about that when I read the press release. I didn't think that he had any rights to the name but, I wasn't sure how it would work. It's actually good to have a lawyer around sometimes to explain things to idiots like me :lol
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This is what's now posted on the Tate family fb page:
QUEENSRźCHE STARRING GEOFF TATE THE ORIGINAL VOICE
This fall, Geoff Tate Electric Band will be releasing his new solo metal album on Inside Out Music, which features such label mates as King’s X, Fates Warning, Pain of Slavation and Dream Theater’s frontman James LaBrie, and many others! Geoff Tate solo tour dates with Alice Cooper beginning in November.
***Watch for the announcement of the upcoming 2013 Queensryche Anniversary Tour featuring an All-Star lineup, starring Geoff Tate, the longtime creative and driving force behind the band, whose vocals can be heard on every Queensryche song ever released!***
:rollin
Edit: So apparently he's celebrating an anniversary of the band he was fired from?
Allstar lineup. Geoff Tate, Kelly Gray and a drum machine?
:rollin
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You know what would be incredibly awesome? If right after the tour kicked off, Queensryche's lawyers sent a demand letter to Geoff saying, basically: "Dr. Mr. 'Voice of Queenryche,' as you know, the 'Queensryche' name belongs to TriRyche Corp. (or whichever of the QR entities actually owns the name), which is currently owned solely by Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield, and Eddie Jackson, who are entiteld to X% of income earned by you on this tour from using the Queensryche name. Please contact us immediately with your proposed written payment schedule and provide us with written copies of all contracts for concert guarantees, merchandise, etc. so we can calculate the amount owed by you." That could be very useful leverage in the upcoming legal battle.
(credit to Samsara for posting something similar on his site earlier this morning)
Damn, the pwnage :eek
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You know what would be incredibly awesome? If right after the tour kicked off, Queensryche's lawyers sent a demand letter to Geoff saying, basically: "Dr. Mr. 'Voice of Queenryche,' as you know, the 'Queensryche' name belongs to TriRyche Corp. (or whichever of the QR entities actually owns the name), which is currently owned solely by Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield, and Eddie Jackson, who are entiteld to X% of income earned by you on this tour from using the Queensryche name. Please contact us immediately with your proposed written payment schedule and provide us with written copies of all contracts for concert guarantees, merchandise, etc. so we can calculate the amount owed by you." That could be very useful leverage in the upcoming legal battle.
(credit to Samsara for posting something similar on his site earlier this morning)
Yeah, I was sorta wondering about that when I read the press release. I didn't think that he had any rights to the name but, I wasn't sure how it would work. It's actually good to have a lawyer around sometimes to explain things to idiots like me :lol
I'm not saying they definitely have a right to stop him from using the name the way he is using it, or to cash in if he uses it that way (assuming the Court ultimately agrees that he was properly separated, who knows what their contracts say about fair use of the name afterward?). But it could still be a useful bargaining chip in ultimately getting the thing resolved outside of court, which is cheaper and quicker than taking it all the way to the end of the legal process.
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When Styx and Dennis DeYoung parted ways over 10 years ago, Styx sued him when he tried to tour billing himself as the "voice of Styx," they won, and DeYoung was allowed to bill his tours as "performing the music of Styx,' or something like that. I could see the same thing happening here, although the difference here is that Tate was QR's sole lead singer, while Styx had three different lead singers, so DeYoung declaring himself the voice of Styx wasn't accurate at all.
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When Styx and Dennis DeYoung parted ways over 10 years ago, Styx sued him when he tried to tour billing himself as the "voice of Styx," they won, and DeYoung was allowed to bill his tours as "performing the music of Styx,' or something like that. I could see the same thing happening here, although the difference here is that Tate was QR's sole lead singer, while Styx had three different lead singers, so DeYoung declaring himself the voice of Styx wasn't accurate at all.
That would be a knife in GT's soul, right there...
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I'm... morbidly curious about this solo album he's doing. I mean... it's pretty much is what the next Queensryche album would have sounded like if this hadn't happened, right?
Probably, so you know it will probably suck something awful.
I remember reading not long ago where Tate claimed his solo album was going to be "heavy"...
It will be written by the same team responsible for the last few QR albums. If they were capable of anything good we'd have heard it by now.
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I'm... morbidly curious about this solo album he's doing. I mean... it's pretty much is what the next Queensryche album would have sounded like if this hadn't happened, right?
Probably, so you know it will probably suck something awful.
I remember reading not long ago where Tate claimed his solo album was going to be "heavy"...
It will be written by the same team responsible for the last few QR albums. If they were capable of anything good we'd have heard it by now.
This is true enough...
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Honestly, I think Slater wrote some really good stuff for American Soldier. Aside from just a couple of weak tracks and an idea or two that didn't quite work, the main problem with that album was the singing.
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I haven't liked a thing that QR has written in the post DeGarmo era and I doubt that will change now. What will change, though, is when they play live shows their classic material will sound good because the new vocalist, unlike Geoff, can actually sing.
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When Styx and Dennis DeYoung parted ways over 10 years ago, Styx sued him when he tried to tour billing himself as the "voice of Styx," they won, and DeYoung was allowed to bill his tours as "performing the music of Styx,' or something like that. I could see the same thing happening here, although the difference here is that Tate was QR's sole lead singer, while Styx had three different lead singers, so DeYoung declaring himself the voice of Styx wasn't accurate at all.
Here you have a different problem though, Tate is not just going for The Voice of Queensryche... some of the press stuff is QUEENRSYCHE staring Geoff Tate... which is just fucking incredibly asshole driven. It should be Geoff Tate, the voice of or the star of, or the main man of Queensryche, and that can get fought over. The problem here isn't that Geoff is eluding to Queensryche or claiming some portion of their history, he is flat out claiming to be Queensryche.
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When Styx and Dennis DeYoung parted ways over 10 years ago, Styx sued him when he tried to tour billing himself as the "voice of Styx," they won, and DeYoung was allowed to bill his tours as "performing the music of Styx,' or something like that. I could see the same thing happening here, although the difference here is that Tate was QR's sole lead singer, while Styx had three different lead singers, so DeYoung declaring himself the voice of Styx wasn't accurate at all.
Here you have a different problem though, Tate is not just going for The Voice of Queensryche... some of the press stuff is QUEENRSYCHE staring Geoff Tate... which is just fucking incredibly asshole driven. It should be Geoff Tate, the voice of or the star of, or the main man of Queensryche, and that can get fought over. The problem here isn't that Geoff is eluding to Queensryche or claiming some portion of their history, he is flat out claiming to be Queensryche.
Great point, Nick. I'm guessing that this will lead to more legal issues down the road?
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You know what would be incredibly awesome? If right after the tour kicked off, Queensryche's lawyers sent a demand letter to Geoff saying, basically: "Dr. Mr. 'Voice of Queenryche,' as you know, the 'Queensryche' name belongs to TriRyche Corp. (or whichever of the QR entities actually owns the name), which is currently owned solely by Michael Wilton, Scott Rockenfield, and Eddie Jackson, who are entiteld to X% of income earned by you on this tour from using the Queensryche name. Please contact us immediately with your proposed written payment schedule and provide us with written copies of all contracts for concert guarantees, merchandise, etc. so we can calculate the amount owed by you." That could be very useful leverage in the upcoming legal battle.
(credit to Samsara for posting something similar on his site earlier this morning)
I'm stealing this and posting it on the fake QR Facebook page...
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Of course. You would. :\
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Hm. Maybe I'm confused about how rights work, but unless they're releasing it somehow.....can't anybody play anything live in most places?
I mean I doubt tribute bands pay royalties or anything. And Geoff Tate would essentially be a Queensryche tribute band.
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Hm. Maybe I'm confused about how rights work, but unless they're releasing it somehow.....can't anybody play anything live in most places?
I mean I doubt tribute bands pay royalties or anything. And Geoff Tate would essentially be a Queensryche tribute band.
You've got that right. Its the labeling of "Queensryche starring Geoff Tate" that's getting people mad at him this time.
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So Jam, was there any response?
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The only thing I am concerned about Todd is that he isn't a trained singer and sometimes his singing seems a bit forced when it shouldn't be (live that is, studio he's perfect). With getting this gig and Crimson Glory, I hope he doesn't burn out his voice or something in a few years of recording and possibly extensive touring. Maybe I'm wrong about this, though. Just a feeling.
That's been my impression as well. The live clips are impressive, but you can hear several spots where he's straining and, if he doesn't learn to pace himself, he could easily fall off the edge.
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Honestly, part of the reason I haven't been 100% super psyched for the new Queensryche is because as much as I've enjoyed Todd's personality and handling of the situation, I just don't know if he'll be much of an answer for Queensryche. In the shows so far he has struggled a bit, and with a full tour that could only get worse. I would have rather they gotten someone who perhaps sounds less like Tate, but who can handle that higher range without any issues. Only time will tell, but while I'm sure he'll be better than Tate as of late, I don't think the improvement will be all that great after a tour or two.
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Honestly, part of the reason I haven't been 100% super psyched for the new Queensryche is because as much as I've enjoyed Todd's personality and handling of the situation, I just don't know if he'll be much of an answer for Queensryche. In the shows so far he has struggled a bit, and with a full tour that could only get worse. I would have rather they gotten someone who perhaps sounds less like Tate, but who can handle that higher range without any issues. Only time will tell, but while I'm sure he'll be better than Tate as of late, I don't think the improvement will be all that great after a tour or two.
Early Tate was almost a case of physical anomaly :lol ...like early Steve Perry. Both were untouchable in their prime and a very rare kind of singer who seemed to be flawless and consistent. But we have seen that age and wear can affect even them. Actually finding someone like that twice is exceedingly rare.
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Honestly, I've never really liked Tate's voice. He's always sounded like-- as someone described above-- a muppet. Sure, some studio performances utilize his voice really well, but he's never had my favorite type of voice to listen to.
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Did Geoff sing backing vocals on "All I Want"?
It doesn't sound like it to me. It's possible Tate is in there somewhere and buried in the mix, but the backing vocals all sound like the lead vocal.
DeGarmo sang backing vocals on quite a number of QR songs and was the main backing vocal contributor live, so there wouldn't have been a need, per-se, to bring in Tate to do harmonies.
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FYI, Tate was on That Metal Show last night. It's on again tonight. He's candid about things, but obviously there is more than one side to the story...
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One annoying d-bag interviewing another? No thanks.
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He didn't really say anything new. He did admit to the whole spitting incident in Brazil and expresses regret for it.
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One annoying d-bag interviewing another? No thanks.
What problem do you have with Eddie Trunk? He seems like a pretty non-offensive guy to me.
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I found it rather funny when they showed the video clip from 1986 and he said "that's right after I wrote mindcrime". Yes Geoff, it was all you.
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He didn't really say anything new. He did admit to the whole spitting incident in Brazil and expresses regret for it.
Well, that's something anyway. The beginnings of some humility, perhaps.
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
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Didn't he deny the whole spitting thing at first? I would hold my hopes on him showing some humanity or basic decency/dignity for now xD Eagerly awaiting to see this "all-star" Ryche tour in 2013. Maybe he'll get singers that can actually sing the songs ^^
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He didn't really say anything new. He did admit to the whole spitting incident in Brazil and expresses regret for it.
Well, that's something anyway. The beginnings of some humility, perhaps.
The one thing he's admitted to is the one thing there is video up on the web for all the world to see plain as day...
As Zander would say...
So brave.
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One annoying d-bag interviewing another? No thanks.
What problem do you have with Eddie Trunk? He seems like a pretty non-offensive guy to me.
Not to speak for KevShmev, but my problems with Eddie Trunk:
(A) He's a whiny bitch when he misses questions on Stump the Trunk.
(2) He kisses everyone's ass and pretends to be their fan when he obviously isn't. (For example, not knowing really easy trivia about Dream Theater)
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Bingo. It only took me seeing bits of his show here and there to pick up on all of that.
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One annoying d-bag interviewing another? No thanks.
What problem do you have with Eddie Trunk? He seems like a pretty non-offensive guy to me.
Not to speak for KevShmev, but my problems with Eddie Trunk:
(A) He's a whiny bitch when he misses questions on Stump the Trunk.
(2) He kisses everyone's ass and pretends to be their fan when he obviously isn't. (For example, not knowing really easy trivia about Dream Theater)
A) OK
2) OK, but seriously - what kind of a show would it be if it were only bands that he was a big fan of? He's gotta reach a broader audience to get advertising, and that means having guests on the show that he doesn't listen to much. That's showbiz.
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He didn't really say anything new. He did admit to the whole spitting incident in Brazil and expresses regret for it.
He also gave a nod to Alex Lifeson. Something like "Has Alex Lifeson sat in this seat? I'm a huge Rush fan."
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2) OK, but seriously - what kind of a show would it be if it were only bands that he was a big fan of? He's gotta reach a broader audience to get advertising, and that means having guests on the show that he doesn't listen to much. That's showbiz.
True, but when you invite someone onto your show, you should at least do some basic research about them. I'm not in show biz, but I'm thinking minimum of a couple hours familiarizing yourself with your guests, so that when you sit down and interview them, you actually have intelligent things to ask them and say to them.
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He didn't really say anything new. He did admit to the whole spitting incident in Brazil and expresses regret for it.
He also gave a nod to Alex Lifeson. Something like "Has Alex Lifeson sat in this seat? I'm a huge Rush fan."
Damage control.
And I'm sorry if I sound like Geoff can do no right in my eyes...but honestly, with his history (and it's a lot longer than this one incident), HE CAN'T!
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He didn't really say anything new. He did admit to the whole spitting incident in Brazil and expresses regret for it.
He also gave a nod to Alex Lifeson. Something like "Has Alex Lifeson sat in this seat? I'm a huge Rush fan."
Damage control.
And I'm sorry if I sound like Geoff can do no right in my eyes...but honestly, with his history (and it's a lot longer than this one incident), HE CAN'T!
Hey, i'm not a QR fan and really don't know much of anything. I was just posting b/c i saw the interview. But it sounds like your opinion is in the majority here...
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Yeah, he is behaving abysmally, and has been for quite some time now. So sad.
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One annoying d-bag interviewing another? No thanks.
What problem do you have with Eddie Trunk? He seems like a pretty non-offensive guy to me.
Not to speak for KevShmev, but my problems with Eddie Trunk:
(A) He's a whiny bitch when he misses questions on Stump the Trunk.
(2) He kisses everyone's ass and pretends to be their fan when he obviously isn't. (For example, not knowing really easy trivia about Dream Theater)
A) OK
2) OK, but seriously - what kind of a show would it be if it were only bands that he was a big fan of? He's gotta reach a broader audience to get advertising, and that means having guests on the show that he doesn't listen to much. That's showbiz.
He's been pretending to be a DT fan for years, when clearly he isn't.
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Not sure whether anyone cares, but audio of the preliminary injunction hearing is online: https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=178728&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
Summary:
The first issue they are fighting over is whether the court should even consider certain evidence and documents that were filed late and because some of the documents were over the allowed page limit. The judge initially declined to decide whether to strike the evidence and documents until after hearing the substantive arguments about the injunction. After hearing the full arguments, she denied Geoff's request to strike that evidence. In other words, she reserved the right to give that evidence whatever weight she felt it was entitled rather than disregard it.
Then they move on discuss the substance of the injunction. Again, what Geoff is trying to do is keep the band from using the Queensryche name until the case ultimately gets to trial at some point WAY down the road. His argument is basically that the Queensryche name will be damaged if the rest of the guys tour without him using the name. The court denied the motion for injunction. She said it looked at this stage like there was good and bad evidence on both sides of the case that could not be resolved by the court at this early stage in the case. Therefore, Geoff cannot prove at this stage what he needs to prove to get a preliminary injunction: That he would likely prevail at trial on the merits of his case. Essentially, both sides are entitled to use the name until the case is decided at trial.
As part of that, the party asking for the injunction (Geoff) has to post a bond (a lump sum of cash) before the court. The final argument was that the amount of the bond should be reduced because poor Geoff Tate doesn't have enough money (hmm...I wonder whether the big attorneys' fees bill for having 3 layers show up was eating into his bank account?). Given that the court did not grant the injunction, there was no need to set a bond (however, the judge indicated that if the matter came back before her prior to trial and came out in such a way that required a bond, it would likely need to be a substantial bond rather than the small amount requested by Geoff).
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Geoff Tate's new version of Queensryche has just been announced on queensryche.com. Thought it was a joke initially, or that he'd been fraped. I see this heading straight back to court- hopefully anyway.
Rudy Sarzo, Bobby Blotzer, Glen Drover, Kelly Gray and Randy Gane
No word yet on who'll be singing ;D ;D ;D ;D
https://www.queensryche.com/2012/09/01/new-lineup-2/
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So there are two Queensr˙ches? :huh:
Fuck you Geoff. You aren't even founding member, so how the hell you can steal the name of the mightiness created by Scott Rockenfield and Michael Wilton (ok it was named Cross+Fire, but still). You're a shame for rock music.
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thy should call it QueensRatt, or QuietRyche or better stil- what it is-= The Geoff Tate Band!
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Geoff & The Tates
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Geoff and the Taints
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Geoff's Taint
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Well, you saw Kelly Gray coming a mile away...
The others? Sarzo & Drover are awesome...but Blotzer?
Whatever...I won't be seeing the band live anyway.
If he was smart, he would have recruited the rest of Crimson Glory... :lol
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the two bands should be called Queensryche and Queensr˙che
(waiting fro th DeGarmo to start playing with his QR band too :biggrin:)
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Seriously,
They should call themselves Starfish. They just grow new members and carry on. Ridiculous - How about the fans decide. Both put out an album and we'll take a vote on whether either are better or if they need to hang it up
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I for one so look forward to a new album by the real QR, especially after hearing the new Crimson Glory song that Todd co-wrote. There's no doubt that Todd's voice and style will fit the new QR perfectly (imo).
https://www.bravewords.com/news/189478
The new Geoff Taint band on the other hand. :rollin Just a side show. Not going to last.
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Hilarious response video...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hqGeNN5Xdo
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I'd rather watch Chris DeGarmo fly a plane. :lol
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thy should call it QueensRatt, or QuietRyche or better stil- what it is-= The Geoff Tate Band!
:tup
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Hilarious response video...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hqGeNN5Xdo
Some great responses in there and a funny video overall. Needless to say, I'm not excited about this line-up at all.
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Hilarious response video...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hqGeNN5Xdo
That is awesome.
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Geoff has hired some bigger names than I thought he would've though.
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I agree, although it still has the whole "a bunch of random 80's hair metal guys touring under a random band name just to try and make a buck" vibe about it. A lot of 80's bands have been marginalized in recent years because of these sorts of shenanigans, so it's a real shame, if not entirely surprising, to see such a thing happening to Queensryche as well.
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Great fucking video there. :lol
This is an interesting yet random lineup. I doubt this lineup will stay in tact any longer than 6 months, it just seems to temporary. Obviously Kelly Gray jumped ship from what was said in the slagging press releases. His guitar playing is ordinary at best, and all his solos on the live Evolution DVD were clearly overdubbed. Drover will mop the floor with this guy. I'm interested to see what Glen does here, I think he will probably be the first to go. If he isn't gonna stick with King Diamond or Megadeth, I don't think GT has a chance.
Saying that, the lineup has potential, minus the Ratt guy.
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It's all a pissing-contest anyway.... :angel:
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I'd rather watch Chris DeGarmo fly a plane. :lol
My favorite part as well. :lol
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Ridiculous move on Geoff's part. I don't blame him for getting some names to support him. But if he promotes this line-up simply as "Queensryche," he is doing everybody, including the fans, a grave disservice. Unfortunately, as hard as it is to imagine this, MOST fans out there really don't pay attention to the Internet as much as those of us here and on sites like Breakdown Room and Queensryche's new and old websites do. I can see a LOT of people being confused that there are two bands out there using the Queensryche name, and figuring that the one with Geoff Tate in it must be the "right" one. Knowing the legal process as I do, I know it is going to be awhile before the dust settles on this. But I am anxious to see what happens next and how all of this will ultimately be resolved.
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So the name Rising West is unnecessary now? They get to keep Queensryche? Color me surprised. I always assumed Geoff would hire a new band and keep the name, like Axl did with Guns n Roses. Either way, I'm happy. Good for them.
Gadostronomous
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TATER NUTS!!! TATER NUTS!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=416HJZBTuas
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Man I just read through the past 10 pages of this thread, it's pretty damn interesting.
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I've enjoyed the soap opera too the last few months. Before this took place, I expected QR to just continue status quo for the remainder of their careers; releasing a few more sub par albums and alienating their fanbase some more. So this whole soap opera is unexpected and very interesting. I'm totally confident that we will get new killer QR material soon and I really believe that the new Geoff Tate solo is going to exceed all expectations. I think it will be an album that people will state that QR should have released instead of that DTC crapola.
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I remember reading on Neil Peart's website (i think - it may have been elsewhere) that Geoff Tate went motorcycling with Neil and his crew sometime in the last year or two. I remember seeing the pics as well. Just remembered this now.
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I remember reading on Neil Peart's website (i think - it may have been elsewhere) that Geoff Tate went motorcycling with Neil and his crew sometime in the last year or two. I remember seeing the pics as well. Just remembered this now.
Point being: Neil is a very private individual who has a very small, close circle of friends. I'm surprised he would hang out with, apparently, the King of Pricks.
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I remember reading on Neil Peart's website (i think - it may have been elsewhere) that Geoff Tate went motorcycling with Neil and his crew sometime in the last year or two. I remember seeing the pics as well. Just remembered this now.
Point being: Neil is a very private individual who has a very small, close circle of friends. I'm surprised he would hang out with, apparently, the King of Pricks.
Just guessing from people that I have known who are like Geoff....but...
I'm thinking that he puts on his "gameface" for those he wishes to impress. People like Geoff are capable of being quite charming and charismatic when doing so is to their advantage.
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I remember reading on Neil Peart's website (i think - it may have been elsewhere) that Geoff Tate went motorcycling with Neil and his crew sometime in the last year or two. I remember seeing the pics as well. Just remembered this now.
Point being: Neil is a very private individual who has a very small, close circle of friends. I'm surprised he would hang out with, apparently, the King of Pricks.
Just guessing from people that I have known who are like Geoff....but...
I'm thinking that he puts on his "gameface" for those he wishes to impress. People like Geoff are capable of being quite charming and charismatic when doing so is to their advantage.
Good call. Maybe he should run for office.
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Just guessing from people that I have known who are like Geoff....but...
I'm thinking that he puts on his "gameface" for those he wishes to impress. People like Geoff are capable of being quite charming and charismatic when doing so is to their advantage.
Didn't GT do the voice and mocap for Gollum/Smeagol? I think I remember seeing that somewhere cuz he fits the role perfectly.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIVWKlUvvBU&feature=g-all-u
Jesus. :facepalm:
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIVWKlUvvBU&feature=g-all-u
Jesus. :facepalm:
Yeah. And the sad thing is, there are some cool things going on in the song. It could have been a decent pop rock song, but the vocals and vocal melody (or lack thereof) just destroys it.
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The lyrics :lol
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Oh man, this is bad ;D
I've launched the "muppet" accusation at Tate before, but this takes it even a step further. It really sounds like one going crazy over a U2 song.
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It really sounds like one going crazy over a U2 song.
Sort of. It sounds like a decent U2-influenced melody, with someone who has no idea how to sing or construct a vocal melody making noise over it, and taking some of Geoff's Mindcrime-era lyrical ideas and trying to say the same things using only tired cliches. If that's "going crazy over a U2 song," then yes.
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Well, he could do worse. Some parts of the song I kind of like (musically), then the very next second I'm facepalming. And he still sounds forced. Am I hearing things or is this really the case?
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Man, when did Tate's vocal chords get replaced with a foghorn? :facepalm:
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Well, he could do worse. Some parts of the song I kind of like (musically), then the very next second I'm facepalming. And he still sounds forced. Am I hearing things or is this really the case?
No, you're not hearing things. Overall, the song isn't awful. But Geoff is more often than not on this.
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This is actually the best thing Geoff has done in a LONG time. And I *HATE* to say that, because I've been one of his biggest nay-sayers for over 15 years.
The lyrics are too heavy handed, and his voice isn't quite what it used to be, but this is not as bad as people are claiming. That being said, Geoff is just not someone I'm ever going to give my money to again. I am the PETA to his KFC. :lol
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Not great, just find that the song doesn't really go anywhere. QR are definitely going to hear this and realize they made a great decision.
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Tribe was actually of this vibe. Most people hate that album but I dig every tune on it except the last one.
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Tribe was actually of this vibe. Most people hate that album but I dig every tune on it except the last one.
Tribe is an interesting record. If you separate what they did with Chris Degarmo (as the original lineup) with what they did as a four piece or with Mike Stone, you get this:
QR Original Lineup
Open
Desert Dance
Falling Behind
Art of Life
Doin' Fine
Justified
QR (four piece, or w/mike stone)
Losing Myself
The Great Divide
Tribe
Rhythm of Hope
Blood
>>>>>>>The tunes from the original full lineup of QR really show a progression that takes up right perfectly from HITNF. Better production, more interesting songs, etc. I really enjoy those tunes. They SOUND like Queensryche. A natural evolution and progression. In fact, I separated it on my iPod from the others, so I can have the entire original lineup catalog together.
The tunes without Chris show some promise (except for Losing Myshit), but clearly they aren't nearly as dynamic. They're ok, but they aren't as complete and interesting as the others. The title track could have really gone places, I think, with Chris involved.
What it shows me is that Queensryche, in its original form, is very much a sum of its parts. The original lineup just played off one another great. The new version of Queensryche has the more "metal" portion of the band with the added elements of La Torre and Lundgren contributing. I have high hopes the chemistry between them gives us some great hard rock and metal moving forward.
But will anything trump that original lineup of the band? No way. Queensryche sucked the last couple of years, mostly because of Tate. Without him, and with La Torre and a focused direction on making QR a metal/hard rock force again, I think the band will succeed and finish off their career in the next 15 years as a force to be reckoned with.
But the original lineup and that chemistry was a special period that resulted in some incredible music.
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Tribe was actually of this vibe. Most people hate that album but I dig every tune on it except the last one.
I always really liked Tribe and The Art of Life is one of my favorite QR songs.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIVWKlUvvBU&feature=g-all-u
Jesus. :facepalm:
Sounds like he's reading the lyrics off a broken teleprompter.
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I love Tribe and this song can't compare to anything on that album IMO.
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I don't really care about Tribe, but The Art of Life is a top 20 QR song and Desert Dance is truly great.
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I never hear anyone mention Blood. Very good song no matter which version of ryche that did it in my opinion.
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I never hear anyone mention Blood.
Worst song in the QR discography BY FAR.
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I never hear anyone mention Blood.
Worst song in the QR discography BY FAR.
Whoa. I mean, I don't like Blood, but that's pretty damn harsh.
There's half a dozen songs from Dedicated to Chaos, a few from American Soldier and one or two from Mindcrime II that I enjoy less than Blood.
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I never hear anyone mention Blood.
Worst song in the QR discography BY FAR.
Wot We Do wants to have a word with you. If I were you I'd run... run far, far away!
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I actually think that Wot We Do is alright *activates 80 flameshields*.
Yesterday I listened to Suite Sister Mary and I was just :hefdaddy.
I feel the flow, blessed stain
Sweating hands like fire and flames
Burn my thighs, spread in sacrificial rite
The hallowed altar burns my flesh once more tonight
Why didn't they make more long songs? Roads to Madness, Suite and Promised Land are all beyond awesome.
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Just read on Blabbermouth that Pamela is joining the new Queensryche in concert. Take that Tate.
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YESSSS! :mindcrime:
*waiting for lawsuit, or rant about how O:M was originally Tate's idea*
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I think Pamela has made her choice correctly
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I think Pamela has made her choice correctly
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Who is Pamela?
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Only Sister Mary herself :heart :hefdaddy
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I think Pamela has made her choice correctly
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I never hear anyone mention Blood.
Worst song in the QR discography BY FAR.
No
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I never hear anyone mention Blood.
Worst song in the QR discography BY FAR.
Whoa. I mean, I don't like Blood, but that's pretty damn harsh.
There's half a dozen songs from Dedicated to Chaos, a few from American Soldier and one or two from Mindcrime II that I enjoy less than Blood.
Well, okay, fair enough. There are a few other contenders that are close. But it is still the worst, and it is the worst by a huge margin over MOST of the QR discography. I can at least find something redeeming about most other songs. There is no reason anyone should ever want to listen to Blood. It has exactly zero good things about it.
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I never hear anyone mention Blood.
Worst song in the QR discography BY FAR.
Whoa. I mean, I don't like Blood, but that's pretty damn harsh.
There's half a dozen songs from Dedicated to Chaos, a few from American Soldier and one or two from Mindcrime II that I enjoy less than Blood.
Well, okay, fair enough. There are a few other contenders that are close. But it is still the worst, and it is the worst by a huge margin over MOST of the QR discography. I can at least find something redeeming about most other songs. There is no reason anyone should ever want to listen to Blood. It has exactly zero good things about it.
I can name atleast one song per album after mindcrime that is worse than this track and sometimes entire albums. I'll not claim that the song belongs in some sort of hall of fame for QR songs but, to say that it's their worst song? It's not even close to being the worst song on it's own album and in comparison Tribe is a masterpiece next to some of the shit that they've put out over the years.
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Who is Pamela? Seriously???
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Who is Pamela?
Only Sister Mary herself :heart :hefdaddy
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Who is Pamela? Seriously???
Pamela Moore, the voice of Sister Mary.
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Yeah, I know that, you clot, I just can't imagine any fan of Queensryche who doesn't! ;)
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Yeah, I know that, you clot, I just can't imagine any fan of Queensryche who doesn't! ;)
Oh, just understood the context of your statement.
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No harm done, man...I think.
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:tup
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I never claimed to be a Queensr˙che fan. I like some of their stuff. I do recognize the name Sister Mary from Operation: Mindcrime, but "Pamela" is just a name.
If someone had said that Theresa had made her choice and was on the current Dream Theater tour, would everyone understand the significance of it?
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Yeah, well, maybe the name is just a fixation for me.... :blush
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I'm sure a lot of Queensr˙che fans know her name. As a casual fan at best, I didn't recognize it and was just wondering what the fuss was about. It's one of my favorite albums of theirs.
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Even though I consider myself Queensryche fan and plus even though I know Pamela did vocals in Sister Mary, when I read "Pamela joining the band!" I was like: Who the fuck is she? ??? :lol
Then it's solved. :millahhhh
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I never claimed to be a Queensr˙che fan. I like some of their stuff. I do recognize the name Sister Mary from Operation: Mindcrime, but "Pamela" is just a name.
If someone had said that Theresa had made her choice and was on the current Dream Theater tour, would everyone understand the significance of it?
I'd be pretty shocked if anyone didn't... :shrugs:
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I don't know a whole lot about Tate or Queensryche, but I just listened to about 2 minutes of his new song Take a Bullet.........are all of his solo songs this awful?
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Oh man, that's terrible. The song itself isn't bad, but Geoff's voice just can't carry any sort of tune at all.
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Oh man, that's terrible. The song itself isn't bad, but Geoff's voice just can't carry any sort of tune at all.
Musically it sounded like a song that would be in a B grade movie that can't afford the rights to real songs.
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It's like... a Deep Purple cover band writes one original tune to commemorate their 20th anniversary of playing together.
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Here's a fun litte comparison:
Queen of the Reich now with Todd: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ka_asEAwWVQ
Queen of the Reich 12 years ago with Geoff: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDag0cEJKds
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Consider this your warning, not allowed to post licensed material! :P
This is the last time I think Tate wasn't entirely terrible. While he still sounds like he's struggling, he still manages to put a decent sounding show, imo. Not all the times, but for the most part.
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This is the last time I think Tate wasn't entirely terrible. While he still sounds like he's struggling, he still manages to put a decent sounding show, imo. Not all the times, but for the most part.
Exactly. That's kinda my point. Even if you take probably his BEST performance over the past 12 years, it's decent at best. And today, he's nowhere near even that level. So even if you ignore the assaults on band members, spitting on them onstage, and corporate fraud, firing him was still a great move just from a musical standpoint.
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Silent Lucidity with Todd. Enjoy :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtJqC8Swamo
B.Lee
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Pretty bad when this guy makes Tate look like the imitator.
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Wow, that's...that's actually a GREAT way of describing it. :lol
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Pretty bad when this guy makes Tate look like the imitator.
:lol
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I was reading through this thread at work and decided to look this new guy up. He is fucking badass! Then I decided to watch a half hour of "Queensr˙che Live Rocklahoma Festival". Tate's voice is worse than I thought, he sings barely 2 octaves now and what he does sing is strained as all hell. Even his low end sounds terrible, what the fuck has he done to his voice? Bruce Dickinson, Rob Halford, Dio, Ozzy and more have all lost range but they at least sound like themselves. Dafuq?
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Yeah, pretty much Tate sounds like a frog who smoked six packs a day for two decades and inhales a little helium before every show.
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I find it hard to believe that somebody wouldnt be sold on La Torre; he's doing a great job. I still hope that when they release a new album next year, they include a bonus disc with either rerecorded tracks or a live show.
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I find it hard to believe that somebody wouldnt be sold on La Torre; he's doing a great job. I still hope that when they release a new album next year, they include a bonus disc with either rerecorded tracks or a live show.
Yeah, they need to do this. Worked for Journey a coupla albums ago. Also KISS' Sonic Boom sold well with the re-recorded tracks.
La Torre is doing great. Years ago I couldn't have imagined QR without Tate but I went from idolizing him to hating him for what he did to my once favourite band. As soon as his first solo album came out it was obvious why they were going downhill so fast. And to abuse your talent like he has is criminal.
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I buy all new releases from bands that I like, but I'm not buying Tate's new one, that's saying something from me.
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I buy all new releases from bands that I like, but I'm not buying Tate's new one, that's saying something from me.
I was somewhat intrigued with the initial press release saying that this album was going to be a "heavy metal" album. The record label is metal so I figured it was possible. Combined with Tate hopefully trying to top QR with his release and prove that he was willing to make a metal record- I actually had some high hopes. Big negative.
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Empire from South TX Rock Fest (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_S8z5qCWFo&feature=relmfu)
Great video and audio quality. He doesn't quite display the high range that Tate had 20 years ago, but
(https://blogs.browardpalmbeach.com/pulp/keanu%20whoa%202012.jpg)
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Pretty amazing performance if you ask me. You can't really ask for much more from a replacement.
I buy all new releases from bands that I like, but I'm not buying Tate's new one, that's saying something from me.
I was somewhat intrigued with the initial press release saying that this album was going to be a "heavy metal" album. The record label is metal so I figured it was possible. Combined with Tate hopefully trying to top QR with his release and prove that he was willing to make a metal record- I actually had some high hopes. Big negative.
Yeah, pretty much all of this.
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https://www.toddlatorre.com/#!videos01
This shows off his range.
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https://www.toddlatorre.com/#!videos01
This shows off his range.
:tup :tup
Wasn't trying to suggest he didn't have the range, just that he wasn't displaying it (at least in the vid that I linked... not until the final scream at least).
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I just wanted to show you his awesomeness. :tup
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How old is Tod now? I'm pretty sure he's older than Tate was 20 years ago.
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Apparently some have inquired as to whether he uses Tates vocal tracks live.
https://loudwire.com/queensryche-vocalist-todd-la-torre-denies-using-geoff-tate-vocal-tracks-at-live-shows/
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That's just lame. Obviously there are some types of music where it's apparently okay to perform to prerecorded tracks, but metal is not one of them, and if any band did it, they'd be immediately scorned for (a) doing it in the first place, and (b) being stupid enough to think it wouldn't somehow get out.
If I were Todd, I'd be a little annoyed, but take it as a compliment that I sound so much like Tate in the old days that people literally cannot believe it isn't Tate's recorded voice.
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Must be especially annoying when Tate was relying on backing tapes to cover for his poor vocals. Seems the band are trying to sing the backgrounds live now.
The youtube clip from the Corpus Christie show of Queen of the Reich was great. Then I watched some of the Rocklahoma show and Tate was nasal and downright shit. And had the gall to berate the crowd! So glad he's gone. I can love QR again :heart ;D
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Wolf said it best, you can't ask much more from a replacement.
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FYI -- Todd and QR have re-recorded Todd doing backing tracks. So when you hear backing tracks live, they are Todd.
Also -- Todd is...in his late 30s.
Can't wait to see what the new studio material sounds like.
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Here's a fun litte comparison:
Queen of the Reich now with Todd: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ka_asEAwWVQ
Queen of the Reich 12 years ago with Geoff: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDag0cEJKds
Todd blows him out of the water, but its not even a fair comparison. Todd is totally live, Geoff Tate no doubt had touch ups done on the official recording.
But Todd still destroys Tate even with that. :lol
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FYI -- Todd and QR have re-recorded Todd doing backing tracks. So when you hear backing tracks live, they are Todd.
Also -- Todd is...in his late 30s.
Can't wait to see what the new studio material sounds like.
Don't forget the new Crimson Glory album. His re-recorded covers are just... he really channels Midnight while singing CG. This guy is insane.
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I just have to confess: I reall like American Soldier. Yeah, Geoff's vocals nearly ruin it in places, and there are a few artistic and sequencing choices that don't quite work. But as a whole, it's still a pretty good album that I still listen to every now and then and end up enjoying. Slater did a pretty good job of actually writing some pretty good songs.
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Here's a fun litte comparison:
Queen of the Reich now with Todd: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ka_asEAwWVQ
Queen of the Reich 12 years ago with Geoff: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDag0cEJKds
Todd blows him out of the water, but its not even a fair comparison. Todd is totally live, Geoff Tate no doubt had touch ups done on the official recording.
But Todd still destroys Tate even with that. :lol
I wouldn't say just that. I would say that the energy level of the entire band is on different levels. They look like they're rejuvinated. I'm waiting for them to come to Ohio with the new line-up and for the first time in several years I actually look forward to seeing them put on a live performance again.
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I would. There isn't really any comparison. I mean, if I go back and listen to Tate on Live In Tokyo, yeah, it's a pretty good comparison. But I've NEVER heard a later recording of Tate EVER that compares to what Todd brought.
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I would. There isn't really any comparison. I mean, if I go back and listen to Tate on Live In Tokyo, yeah, it's a pretty good comparison. But I've NEVER heard a later recording of Tate EVER that compares to what Todd brought.
I probably worded my response wrong. What I meant to say is that not only is Todd a massive improvement but, the whole band has seemed to have stepped up their game. These guys will never rule the world like they did in the very early 90's again but, I can't see how anyone could miss to see how they're back on their game.
I'm trying to keep my expectations in check for the new material because I don't want to be let down but, if any of the clips of their recent performances are any indication then we are in for a treat.
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Roads to Madness - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSV7cnnM46Q
I don't need to post a comparison clip of Tate's because he can only sing it in an acoustic version anyway (which isn't bad tbh).
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AND, it's the full version, which the band hasn't performed in FOREVER (over 2 decades, I believe).
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Un. Fucking. Real.
As good as (maybe better than?) Tate is his hey-day
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WOW!!
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WOW!!
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That is incredible.
It inspired me to listen to Warning today.
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Roads to Madness - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSV7cnnM46Q
I don't need to post a comparison clip of Tate's because he can only sing it in an acoustic version anyway (which isn't bad tbh).
For some odd reason, the video won't load or play for me. Since this is by far my favorite 'ryche song I'm a little bit disappointed but, I'm sure that it's kick ass.
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Roads to Madness - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSV7cnnM46Q
I don't need to post a comparison clip of Tate's because he can only sing it in an acoustic version anyway (which isn't bad tbh).
For some odd reason, the video won't load or play for me. Since this is by far my favorite 'ryche song I'm a little bit disappointed but, I'm sure that it's kick ass.
understatement.
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WOW!!
+1 I'm continually finding myself beyond impressed with Todd and the bands performances.
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Really great performance.
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"Trust me, you will hear a severe difference in sound, style, and writing in the new QUEENSRźCHE record as compared to the last several albums.
"We are very proud of what is being accomplished, and we hope the fans will find it refreshing. It's got some prog elements, heaviness, soul, darkness, and even something very radio-worthy.
https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=181911
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Boy is this new QR album going to be highly anticipated or what.
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Boy is this new QR album going to be highly anticipated or what.
I'm sold on La Torre as a singer and I'm sold on the other band members' honest intention to do the QR legacy justice.
But I am not yet convinced that they actually still can write masterpieces like Operation Mindcrime. Until they release a new song that either sounds like 80's Queensryche OR state-of-the-art Prog Metal I remain sceptical.
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They should try to write new QR material, not try to replicate a masterpiece like OM. It's time for them to evolve (as opposed to what they did over the last 10 years which was devolve). Distancing themselves from the last 10 years doesn't mean they have to get closer to what they were 20 years ago.
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They should try to write new QR material, not try to replicate a masterpiece like OM. It's time for them to evolve (as opposed to what they did over the last 10 years which was devolve). Distancing themselves from the last 10 years doesn't mean they have to get closer to what they were 20 years ago.
Yup. And quality wise I don't expect anything as good as O:M, simply because verrrry few bands put out an album of that quality twice in one career, but the new album needs to be pretty damn good so people don't write them off after all this anticipation has built.
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I have high hopes for their future, I don't expect their first new album as a band to be killer, I expect it to be a very safe album, but I don't think they'll disappoint.
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I'm just hoping for a quality album that sounds like it comes from Queensryche before they became Tate-ryche. Beyond that they should just write what comes naturally. just doing that I thin will be better than anything of recent times. Todd gets it, I'm sure of that. I'm loooking for the interplay between clean and distorted guitars, vocal melodies (remember them on QR albums?), a dusting of keyboard colour and strange noises and voices, and guitar solos. I'm sure they could manage that and it not sound old.
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Wow. I haven't been following much, but Todd does sound great in those clips. The whole band does.
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I'm just hoping for a quality album that sounds like it comes from Queensryche before they became Tate-ryche. Beyond that they should just write what comes naturally. just doing that I thin will be better than anything of recent times. Todd gets it, I'm sure of that. I'm loooking for the interplay between clean and distorted guitars, vocal melodies (remember them on QR albums?), a dusting of keyboard colour and strange noises and voices, and guitar solos. I'm sure they could manage that and it not sound old.
Exactly. If anyone's expecting something of Mindcrime quality, they're going to be disappointed, but anything in the classic Queensryche style with the classic sound would be welcome.
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If they can make anything that's even 30% as good as anything up to (including) Promised Land than this would be a top 5 album of the year contender. And will make a lot of people happy. And we would all be able to picture Tate crying in a corner with a glass of wine. His wine of course.
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I'd like a good heavy metal album. That's all. :smiley:
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Pssst... prog metal!
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I'd like a good heavy metal album. That's all. :smiley:
Totally agree. This is all I've been wanting the band to release since Q2K. Few shining moments here and there, but for the most part, all disapointments. But the bottom line, as long as its better then the last few releases I'll be happy (almost impossible not to)
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Some demos were just posted on ryche's facebook of Wilton with some other folks. Some pretty cool stuff https://soundcloud.com/rat-pak-records/sets/michael-wilton
Sea of Souls is really good.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gKxykp1hLs take hold of the flame..... :metal
never heard of this dude. but I am impressed. Watch Rockenfeilds reaction after Todd hits the C-note in the first verse. He is like holyfuck!
I am 42 and QR was probably my favorite band ever but I lost the faith a number of years back. I hope for a dark melodic heavy album in the future. I am definately interested
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His live performances with Crimson Glory are mind-blowing. The guy is for real.
There's only one Geoff Tate. But the guy he once was (IMO both as a singer and as a person) are long gone. But La Torre gives Queensryche a chance to finish their career -- both live and their catalog of music -- on a high note over the next 10-15 years and give people the Queensryche they remember, mixed with fresh new songs that resonate with fans old and new.
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What's worse? An imposter or an imposter that sounds better? Maybe they should all just throw in the towel
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There's nothing wrong with either scenario, so there is no "worse". One of the members can no longer cut it and was being a dickhead, so he was kicked out of the band. The remaining members have found a replacement and are moving forward. The fact that it's the singer makes no difference.
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Yeah, what Orbert said. Does any other player in a band ever get the shit that replacement singers do? Hardly ever. What if people called Derek or Jordan imposters because they replaced Kevin? Is a band supposed to just give up and die because their singer turned into a douche?
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There's two sides to every story. I'm sure they all have their fair share of douching. At this point if neither party can make something new and invigorating then it's towel time.
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Well, right. But since they are working on new stuff and we haven't heard any of it yet, why do you keep talking about them throwing in the towel? Aren't you even going to give it a fair listen first?
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Yeah, this "throwing in the towel" and "imposter" stuff makes no sense to me. And even if the new QR album isn't stellar, I'm still willing to give them a bit of time. When Journey last brought in a new singer, the first album (Revelations) was awful. But the follow-up (Eclipse) was their best in a VERY long time. I actually expect the new QR album to be a LOT better than anything they have done, but even if it isn't, their live performance is better than anything they have done since the Empire tour, so I see no reason to write them off at this stage.
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How does it make no sense to you? I thought you were a pretty smart feller...
I happen to like some of the stuff tate and QR have done that many of you seem to hate so obviously we have differing opinions. Bringing on a Tate sound alike from 20 years ago is cool and all but that phase of QR is dead. If a band can evolve and continnue to create stimulating music then I'm all for it but if it isn't then throw in the towel. Not sure why this is so hard to get. I love Flotsam and Jetsam and although Eric AK doesn't sound like he used to he's evolved into something even better IMO. I know mainstream surely doesn't agree with that but they tried to replace him and that went nowhere. I truly hope two great albums come out of this but I'm not keeping my fingers crossed.
Don't scratch the hair off your nuts because I don't agree with everything you guys say.
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How does it make no sense to you?
Not sure which of the two issues you are referring to, but:
(1) The term "impostor" (a person who fraudulently pretends to be someone else) makes no sense in this context. Nobody is trying to trick anyone into thinking LaTorre is Tate, so he isn't an impostor. Calling him one just does not fit.
(2) As to the band "throwing in the towel," it doesn't make sense for the reasons I mentioned already above. If the band can write great, current albums again, great, but it may take more than one album to figure that out. And even if they don't, if they can put out "good" albums that don't tread new ground, but are of good quality, that's fine too. Other fans may have higher expectations, but the reality is that most consider Queensryche a "nostalgia act" these days. Putting aside arguments about whether they should be considered that, that's where they are. And if they've reached a point in their careers where that's all they can be, I'm okay with that. If they can put an a decent album every few years to give them an excuse to tour, and the tour itself is quality in terms of performance (and judging from every YouTube clip I've seen since LaTorre joined, they are bringing it), then that's fine. A lot of fans will be satisfied with that, and the band will make a decent enough living and survive with their name intact despite everything Tate has done to try to ruin it. So, once again, in light of that, saying it is time to "throw in the towel" just doesn't make much sense to me.
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OK So if you walked into a room and heard with your ears this guy fronting QR and didn't know any better who would you think you just heard? He sounds like Tate used to sound like was my point. Why the hell do you guys disect words? When you hang out with your friends in real life do you seriously just rip each other apart? Jesus H
Ehh forget I said anything
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OK So if you walked into a room and heard with your ears this guy fronting QR and didn't know any better who would you think you just heard?
Depends. At times, I might think it was Geoff Tate. At other times, I would hear some distinctive things about LaTorre's voice that tell me it isn't Tate. Kind of similar to when I first heard Steve Augeri fronting Journey when I saw them in 2002. There were times when I said, "MAN, it's scary how much this guy sounds like Perry," and then at other times, he put just enough of his own unique flair on something that he did not sound like Perry. But in no case was he trying to trick people into thinking he actually was Steve Perry, so, just like the Queensryche situation, it wouldn't make sense to call him an impostor. So I'm having a hard time figuring out why your question matters to the discussion.
Why the hell do you guys disect words? When you hang out with your friends in real life do you seriously just rip each other apart?
I don't think we are dissecting anything. But when a word doesn't make sense in context, or you aren't using a word correctly because it actually means something completely different than what you are apparently trying to convey (especially when you use a term that is insulting in a context where an insult isn't called for), it is confusing and doesn't make sense. Hence me saying that it didn't make sense. That isn't being pedantic, and it isn't an attack against you. It's just an expression that I don't understand where you are coming from.
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The hell are you guys arguing about?
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Impostors. And towels. Get with it.
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OK So if you walked into a room and heard with your ears this guy fronting QR and didn't know any better who would you think you just heard? He sounds like Tate used to sound like was my point. Why the hell do you guys disect words? When you hang out with your friends in real life do you seriously just rip each other apart? Jesus H
Ehh forget I said anything
This is a forum. All we have are words, so they are chosen carefully. Time and effort are put into choosing the right words to express thoughts and opinions accurately.
If you call someone an imposter, people who know what the word actually means will wonder why you've chosen that particular word and what you meant by it. If you mention more than once that you think Queensryche should throw in the towel, again people will wonder why you're saying that, since we haven't even heard the new music yet.
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Geoff Tate posting from YtseJam's account?
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The poster is an imposter?
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There's two sides to every story. I'm sure they all have their fair share of douching. At this point if neither party can make something new and invigorating then it's towel time.
I think it's all been covered with the court stuff that's been posted. It all depends on your point of view, but GT has basically admitted to the things that he's been accused of. I would also point you to the interview that he did on "That Metal Show".
It is only my opinion, but the actions that the rest of the band took were more than justified. They also had their livelihood's at stake, so at some point they were going to have to make a change. Imagine being at the point of life that they're at. You have the choice of continuing your life's work, or you can just throw it away. What else would you expect them to do? They most likely don't know how to do anything else. They've put their entire existence into this. I'm not sure it's fair to ask someone to just "throw in the towel" when they have this much of themselves invested.
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I think it's all been covered with the court stuff that's been posted. It all depends on your point of view, but GT has basically admitted to the things that he's been accused of. I would also point you to the interview that he did on "That Metal Show".
Basically, yeah. Just from memory, as far as the reasons for being fired, here's the status:
1. Assaulting his band members: Tate admitted, and several nonbandmember witnesses have corroborated several assaults and actually batteries.
2. Spitting on band members: (yeah, I know that's technically a battery as well) Tate admitted, and is caught on video.
3. Mismanaging the band from a financial standpoint, including attempting to embezzle money: Tate admitted some and denied some, but given the nature of some of the allegations by the band, it should be easy to prove/disprove the rest.
4. Not singing the material properly: Anyone with Internet access and the ability to type www.youtube.com and queensryche can determine this undeniable fact for themselves.
5. Insulting fans and acting erratically onstage: see #4.
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Just get these guys in a studio. I'm a 1000% sure the result is gonna be better then any of the dreck they released the last 10 years.
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Tate's new solo album sold a whopping 1,800 copies in the US in the first week... Bwahahahahaha!!!
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Tate's new solo album sold a whopping 1,800 copies in the US in the first week... Bwahahahahaha!!!
lol, that's like 1/8th of what DoC sold. Still way more than Tate deserves, lol.
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Hey you, sass that hoopy Todd la Torre? There's a frood who really knows where his towel is!
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Hey you, sass that hoopy Todd la Torre? There's a frood who really knows where his towel is!
Thirsty Wednesday, Coz?
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I'm guessing QR found him when he mailed a towel by asteroid.
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Hey you, sass that hoopy Todd la Torre? There's a frood who really knows where his towel is!
Thirsty Wednesday, Coz?
Well, band practice was last night, so Thirsty Tuesday. Then of course, tomorrow is :thursday:.
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Just so the mods know, this link was put up by the band themselves.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ZNP_jR0McuU
Album teaser #1
I'm liking what I hear!
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If nothing else, these demo clips (and I emphasize that they are demos--not final recordings) demonstrate (1) that the band is writing heavier and catchier songs than anything we have heard from them in quite awhile and (2) unlike the last few albums, we will definitely not be pointing fingers at the vocals as being the weakest link. :tup
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Already better than DTC.
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The trailer has definitely gotten me excited. A huge step in the right direction.
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And the correct answer is all of the above.
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I wish that we could get just a little bit more of a taste from each track, but I really do like what I hear. I guess that's why they call it a teaser, though.
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I wonder if that image at the beginning is part of or is the album cover?
If so, I dig it.
Seriously digging how heavy some of these tracks sound, glad to see the guys are finally doing what they want to do.
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Last year, DT/MP was my favorite soap opera. This year, it's Queensryche.
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Love the trailer. This album will be killer and won't disappoint!
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JJrock88's reaction to being asked if the new album will be good
(https://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs1/1367110_o.gif)
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:lol
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:metal
Sounding good so far. Like the last 20 years didn't happen.
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:metal
Sounding good so far. Like the last 20 years didn't happen.
Well then for your sake, I hope you're over 20.
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Unfortunately so. By a long way. Full fogey status :tdwn
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Unfortunately so. By a long way. Full fogey status :tdwn
So it seems, but if this album is as good as you think, apparently you'll be 24.
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Todd's latest facebook entry confirms Jimbo Barton is producing the new album :hefdaddy :hefdaddy :hefdaddy :hefdaddy
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So does the video clip.
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The teaser doesn't reveal much about how progressive their attempts are (too short snippets), but it definitely sounds like Metal.
Queensryche....doing Metal again............ :'( (these are tears of joy, not of sadness)
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The teaser doesn't reveal much about how progressive their attempts are (too short snippets), but it definitely sounds like Metal.
Queensryche....doing Metal again............ :'( (these are tears of joy, not of sadness)
QR doing metal again is progress in and of itself.
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Color me cautiously optimistic. It's really hard to tell from clips of demos, but these certainly have promise, to say the least. As for how "progressive" the band needs to be...hmm. This is likely to be a massive "your mileage may vary" moment, but I always saw Queensryche as being less a full on progressive metal band and more an influence on progressive metal's evolution. Remember, back in the 80s, the genre didn't exist-Queensryche was usually called silly things like "thinking man's metal", while the bands that were more like current prog metal were hit with "they sound like Rush", whether they did or not. To me, Queensryche retroactively became prog metal, so the band striving to be progressive would actually miss the point, for me. If they sound like Queensryche used to, they'll be fine.
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Good points. I'd forgotten that it took a while for people to finally settle on "prog metal" as a label, and Queensryche always has leaned a bit more to the metal side.
But the thing I like about Queensryche is their prog side, however great or small it might be at any given time. If I just wanted to listen to straight metal, I'd find some metal and listen to it. That is to say, I wouldn't bother, since metal isn't really my thing. I'm looking for bands that can take it to the next level.
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Color me cautiously optimistic. It's really hard to tell from clips of demos, but these certainly have promise, to say the least. As for how "progressive" the band needs to be...hmm. This is likely to be a massive "your mileage may vary" moment, but I always saw Queensryche as being less a full on progressive metal band and more an influence on progressive metal's evolution. Remember, back in the 80s, the genre didn't exist-Queensryche was usually called silly things like "thinking man's metal", while the bands that were more like current prog metal were hit with "they sound like Rush", whether they did or not. To me, Queensryche retroactively became prog metal, so the band striving to be progressive would actually miss the point, for me. If they sound like Queensryche used to, they'll be fine.
Yes and no. I think Queensryche has as much right to be called porg-metal as Led Zeppelin and Deep Purple have to be called heavy metal, while they may not be part of the genre by the modern definition of the term, they certainly contributed very heavily to the creation of the genre. Unlike Metallica and Iron Maiden who only dabbled here and there in progressive influences and were primarily known for other characteristics, Queensryche, from the release of the Warning onward made being prog their "thing". There wasn't really a term for it back then, but the genre was definitely starting to take shape, and the vanguard bands of progressive metal, like Queensryche, Savatage, Fates Warning, Crimson Glory and Watchtower were already well in the process of creating a wholly new type of metal, even if at the time they didn't know what it should be called. Dream Theater certainly became the "definitive" prog-metal band later on, and after the release of I&W they doubtlessly exercised the greatest influence over the genre in the years hence, but those five bands I mentioned above could, and IMO, should be considered the true founding fathers of progressive metal.
Oh, and about the clip.............
(https://www.pictures88.com/p/awesome/awesome_011.jpg)
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Just so the mods know, this link was put up by the band themselves.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ZNP_jR0McuU
Album teaser #1
I'm liking what I hear!
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-HXu2Q3LbVNE/UGPb4RfesDI/AAAAAAAAA3k/y_76T5Xc1j4/s1600/nod-of-approval.gif)
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Short clips often underwhelm me, but for now I'm pretty underwhelmed. All I really heard was "HEY, LISTEN TO US BE HEAVIER!" rather than get a solid feeling that it will be better. I hope they release a full song soon so I can change that.
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Color me cautiously optimistic. It's really hard to tell from clips of demos, but these certainly have promise, to say the least. As for how "progressive" the band needs to be...hmm. This is likely to be a massive "your mileage may vary" moment, but I always saw Queensryche as being less a full on progressive metal band and more an influence on progressive metal's evolution. Remember, back in the 80s, the genre didn't exist-Queensryche was usually called silly things like "thinking man's metal", while the bands that were more like current prog metal were hit with "they sound like Rush", whether they did or not. To me, Queensryche retroactively became prog metal, so the band striving to be progressive would actually miss the point, for me. If they sound like Queensryche used to, they'll be fine.
Yes and no. I think Queensryche has as much right to be called porg-metal as Led Zeppelin and Deep Purple have to be called heavy metal, which is to say that while they may not be part of the genre by the modern definition of the term, they certainly contributed very heavily to the creation of the genre. Unlike Metallica and Iron Maiden who only dabbled here and there in progressive influences and were primarily known for other characteristics, Queensryche, from the release of the Warning onward made being prog their "thing". There wasn't really a term for it back then, but the genre was definitely starting to take shape, and the vanguard bands of progressive metal, like Queensryche, Savatage, Fates Warning, Crimson Glory and Watchtower were already well in the process of creating a wholly new type of metal, even if at the time they didn't know what it should be called. Dream Theater certainly became the "definitive" prog-metal band later on, and after the release of I&W they doubtlessly exercised the greatest influence over the genre in the years hence, but those five bands I mentioned above could, and IMO, should be considered the true founding fathers of progressive metal.
That's pretty much what I said. :lol I have no problem with someone calling Queensryche a prog metal band, and they certainly were one of the founding fathers of prog metal as we know it. I just always saw Queensryche as a heavy metal band with progressive leanings, rather than a progressive metal band, so I don't have the worry that the new album might be not progressive enough. The progressive side of Queensryche was always the icing on the cake to me, not the cake itself. To me, it'd be like people getting on Diamond Head for not being thrashy enough when they came back because they influenced Metallica. :lol
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I just always saw Queensryche as a heavy metal band with progressive leanings, rather than a progressive metal band, so I don't have the worry that the new album might be not progressive enough. The progressive side of Queensryche was always the icing on the cake to me, not the cake itself. To me, it'd be like people getting on Diamond Head for not being thrashy enough when they came back because they influenced Metallica. :lol
See, in my mind, Queensryche definitely crossed the threshold from a "heavy metal band with progressive leanings" into "a progressive metal band with strong roots in traditional heavy metal" when they did Rage For Order, so while the EP and The Warning may be no more prog then Maiden or early Metallica, on RFO, Mindcrime, Empire and Promised Land they were a true prog-metal band. That hardly applies to Queensryche alone, btw. I don't consider the first two Fates Warning albums prog, either; that band became progressive on Awaken The Guardian in '86. And there is little prog to be found in the first four Savatage albums, but like QR and FW, the 'Tage did cross that same threshold in '87 with their fifth album, Hall Of The Mountain King. Crimson Glory and Watchtower on the other hand (and Majesty, for that matter), were all prog from the very beginning of their careers, but they came after those first three bands were already into their progressive phase.
As for the new QR record being proggy enough, frankly, I just want them to make a good metal record. I'm not going to hold it against them if the album is prog enough as long as it rocks hard and ha quality songwriting and vocals, both of which have been absent on Queensryche records for some time. It's to early to tell with these clips, but will say this sounds more promising then anything I have heard out of Queensryche in nearly 20 years. :metal
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Been a fan of Queensryche since the '80s, and I have never for even a single day considered them a progressive metal band. But I'm also not bothered in the slightest that other people do.
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Been a fan of Queensryche since the '80s, and I have never for even a single day considered them a progressive metal band. But I'm also not bothered in the slightest that other people do.
If you had to put a label on them, what would it be?
I can see both sides of the argument that these guys are putting forth, but prog metal is probably the closest thing that comes to my mind.
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Is "Metal" not a genre anymore?
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It used to be, but now if you say "Metal" then the next thing you hear is "What kind of Metal?" So it's like a supergenre or something, mother to all the Metal subgenres.
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Dark Master, how exactly were Mindcrime and Empire prog metal??
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The clip makes me cautiously optimistic. I haven't really enjoyed any album by them since Promised Land, here's to hoping to a glorious return of QR. :metal
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The clip makes me cautiously optimistic. I haven't really enjoyed any album by them since Promised Land, here's to hoping to a glorious return of QR. :metal
agreed. I think the band has wanted to go in another direction but perhaps has been handicapped by Tate. who really knows. As WE all know a shake up and a fresh start is not always a bad thing.
When I was 14 and heard Queen of the Reich and The Lady wore Black, I was hooked immediately and the bought The Warning as soon as it was released. It gave me a whole new perspective on music and led me to bands like CG, FW and DT in the future. I about threw out my Quiet Riot and Van halen albums at that time and delved into a totally different musical direction. I havent been excited for a release in a long while, but that tease reminds me a bit of some earlier works. But, QR has let me down before and become somewhat of a laughing stock, so who knows
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Dark Master, how exactly were Mindcrime and Empire prog metal??
Well Mindcrime is the definitive prog-metal concept album, and the album throughout uses many distinctively prog-metal elements, most notably in Suite Sister Mary and the various little segue tracks. Furthermore, even many of the more "commercial" songs on the album use progressive elements like irregular time signatures. Beyond all that, though, the very album itself as a whole heavily resembles works by various 70's prog rock bands, most notably Pink Floyd, Yes and Rush, but in a very 80's heavy metal format. Such a combination is the very definition of prog-metal.
Empire, I will grant you is the least prog of the four QR albums I named, yet many of the songs on the album are rather proggy in various ways, in particular, The Thin Line, Della Brown, Empire, One And Only, and Anybody Listening. While the album is very pop oriented with a strong focus on relatively short and catchy individual songs, the whole record still bears that very noticeable combination of 70's art rock influences done with and 80's metal mentality. Again, that specific combination is very distinctive to the genre of prog-metal.
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The best part of the teaser video? "All songs written and performed by Queensryche".
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On the Metal Evolution series on VH-1 created by Sam Dunn, they did an episode on the foundations of progressive metal. QR and Operation Mindcrime was noted as continuing the evolution of the genre.
https://www.vh1.com/video/metal-evolution/full-episodes/progressive-metal/1678612/playlist.jhtml
Go to the beginning of the third segment
(They go right to Dream Theater after QR)
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I love how it looks like there's some sort of disagreement going on here, even though everyone is saying the same things I am, using different words. :lol
I have no problem with someone thinking QR is a progressive metal band. I just don't myself. Are they one of the grandfathers of the genre? Sure. But since the subgenre didn't exist then as it does today, I'm not hung up on QR having to have progressive elements. It's as simple as that.
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On the Metal Evolution series on VH-1 created by Sam Dunn, they did an episode on the foundations of progressive metal. QR and Operation Mindcrime was noted as continuing the evolution of the genre.
https://www.vh1.com/video/metal-evolution/full-episodes/progressive-metal/1678612/playlist.jhtml
Go to the beginning of the third segment
(They go right to Dream Theater after QR)
I just watched that a couple of weeks ago, and the episode on Power Metal.
Good series.
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To me, Queensryche was a hard rock/metal band that had some progressive tendencies. But again, it depends on what your definition of progressive is (which differs for a lot of people).
Anyway, as to the teaser trailer for the new QR album -- heh. Hell. yes.
Queensryche is back. And I'm absolutely positive that teaser doesn't even scratch the surface of how good the record is going to be. Getting Jimbo Barton back in the fold to produce, engineer and mix was a brilliant move, both from an artistic standpoint and from a public relations perspective.
Finally, after all these years, my favorite band is rising once again.
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I skipped through the Tate solo album. It's a disaster in every way.
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Finally listened to it. I like what I hear and don't get me wrong, it sounds pretty good. The only problem I have with it is that it sounds too much like Tate.
And I mean really wayyy too much like him. I'd prefer it a lot more if he'd tried to incorporate his own voice a little more into the music.
But hey, it's a new Queensryche, so what am I bitching about?
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That Firereaver guy is now blasting the trailer on Ultimate Guitar. I'm starting to believe it might actually be Geoff Tate :rollin :rollin
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One of my favorite things in the entire world is when people post something about something that is going on on another website, and don't bother to post a direct link. I just love that.
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That Firereaver guy is now blasting the trailer on Ultimate Guitar. I'm starting to believe it might actually be Geoff Tate :rollin :rollin
It may be. ::)
B.Lee
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https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/upcoming_releases/todd_la_torres_queensryche_trail_new_album.html
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One of my favorite things in the entire world is when people post something about something that is going on on another website, and don't bother to post a direct link. I just love that.
One of my favorite things is when people complain about links not being posted when I named the website anyways.
Seriously, it's not that hard to find, and that was kind of a rude post on your part :L
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One of my favorite things in the entire world is when people post something about something that is going on on another website, and don't bother to post a direct link. I just love that.
One of my favorite things is when people complain about links not being posted when I named the website anyways.
Seriously, it's not that hard to find, and that was kind of a rude post on your part :L
with the number of new posts on that forum...I did have to search around a bit to find it in Bosk's defense
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One of my favorite things in the entire world is when people post something about something that is going on on another website, and don't bother to post a direct link. I just love that.
One of my favorite things is when people complain about links not being posted when I named the website anyways.
Seriously, it's not that hard to find, and that was kind of a rude post on your part :L
with the number of new posts on that forum...I did have to search around a bit to find it in Bosk's defense
I get what you're saying, but all I had to do was click on the more news tab and it was right there. I completely understand what you're saying, I just felt like Bosk laid it on a bit thick.
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Not really. I mean, it would be like someone posting on some other random message board something like, "Heh, that Dark Castle fellow is being a complete tool the way he's posting in some thread over on the Dream Theater board and not posting links." Do you honestly think that description would make people come here and search high and low for the specific post you are talking about (if they even figure out that the comment even refers to this site in particular)? No. So, yeah, it's both incredibly lazy and inconsiderate on your part to not post a direct link, in which case, yeah, people have a right to say something about that.
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In your case, you said "That Dream Theater Board", I said Ultimate Guitar, which is the name of the website and even if you didn't know the address, 2 seconds on Google would have you there. I guess I can see how I could have said it was a comment on the article, but even then, there was no need for you to lay it on thick like you did. You could have just asked for the link :L
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The clips don't really sound that extraordinary to me, to be honest.
Sure, it sounds like a big step up from Tate solo and recent Queensryche, and almost any vocalist is better than Tate these days, but that's not saying very much.
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Hey guys, did you read that story about that one thing over on google? :P
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The one about the guy and the thing, where that stuff happened?
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Yeah. It was so crazy. Can you believe she did that just because he mentioned that in passing??
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:corn
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Man, some people on some forums get lazy in their old age.
:neverusethis:
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The clip was pretty cool. I think its a mashup of five different tunes. Some sounds like classic QR, other parts are something new. But man, so refreshing to hear QR play like a heavy, guitar-driven band again with big vocals.
The new record can't get here fast enough.
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Hey guys, did you read that story about that one thing over on google? :P
The one about the guy and the thing, where that stuff happened?
Yeah. It was so crazy. Can you believe she did that just because he mentioned that in passing??
This 1-2-3 knockout punch may as well be titled "Meanwhile, over on Facebook..."
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But man, so refreshing to hear QR play like a heavy, guitar-driven band again with big vocals.
Yes and no. It's what we expect to hear now, but frankly a bad metal album would be no better or worse than a bad rock/whatever album. Until I can hear a couple of minutes from this and actually latch onto something and see that it's got great potential I'm going to remain more quietly optimistic. Just don't see anything to be really excited about yet.
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Agreed. Strong vocals and heavier music again won't mean a damn thing without good songwriting, and considering how long it's been since the remaining band members have been a part of great songwriting, I am somewhat pessimistic that they will suddenly remember how to write good songs again.
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Unlike you guys, I'm willing to give them an A for effort on this one if they do in fact bring it. There seems to life in their performances now and it feels like they want to win me over. Considering how things have been for so long, that means a lot to me as a fan.
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Oh, I don't question their intentions at all. The live footage I've seen has been great and I can't freaking wait to see them in March. As far as writing music goes though there can be a big difference between intention and execution.
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Off topic: any news on when the new Crimson Glory album is supposed to come out? On their website it says it's already out on amazon and itunes but nothing is actually on the sites, just the Garden of Shadows demo (which is sooooooooooooooooo good!).
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Off topic: any news on when the new Crimson Glory album is supposed to come out? On their website it says it's already out on amazon and itunes but nothing is actually on the sites, just the Garden of Shadows demo (which is sooooooooooooooooo good!).
I was thinking the same thing this morning and checked out their site. Its definitely not out yet and there hasnt been any updates from TLT as of late. Garden of Shadows is very very good and can't wait for this release too.
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I don't know if it's really OK to be excited by just this sample. Well, it sounds promising and aside from some guitar riffs and vocals it tells nothing, at least to me.
I'll wait. Queensryche is one of my favoruite group, no matter what happened in the past or now. Since Tood La Torre does an amazing job I'll keep my expectations high.
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Off topic: any news on when the new Crimson Glory album is supposed to come out? On their website it says it's already out on amazon and itunes but nothing is actually on the sites, just the Garden of Shadows demo (which is sooooooooooooooooo good!).
I was thinking the same thing this morning and checked out their site. Its definitely not out yet and there hasnt been any updates from TLT as of late. Garden of Shadows is very very good and can't wait for this release too.
As a quick follow up to this from his facebook:
Todd La Torre: Kevin, I have done all I can to get that finished, but I'm only one person. fyi..My QR involvement has nothing to do with why CG hasn't fulfilled what should have been done a long time ago. This pattern precedes my entering the band. I love them all, but again...I'm not the reason why. Saddened that more hasn't been accomplished.
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Apparently Drover quit the Geoff Tate band.
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So the guy who had the patience to stay with Megadave Mustaine for four years couldn't last for longer than a couple of weeks with Geoff? Yeaaaaah... :lol What did he say was the reason?
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: "I am really sorry to say that I have decided to bow out of Geoff Tate's QUEENSRźCHE. I was very excited about doing this gig initially, but learned in the past week or so that it's in my best interest not to do this right now. I feel really bad for those who were excited about the idea, and to Geoff himself, who, I have to say, was very nice to me on my past trip to Seattle. I, of course, am very disappointed for arriving at this point, and making this decision, to say the least. I sincerely wish the Geoff and the band all the luck on what they do in the future."
https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=182687
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Everyone was nice, I was really excited to do it....but it's not in my best interests???
I'm going to refrain but speculating...but something doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
EDIT: the only thing that would make all the above statements true, is if he really was treated nice by Geoff...and was excited to be a part of *Queensryche*...but maybe began to feel upon deeper investigation like it was (legally speaking) a sinking ship. I really don't think Geoff has a snowball's chance in an oven of keeping the name...and at that point, he will just be "Geoff Tate". Or maybe in some other way felt that it was not going to be the steady paycheck that it seemed to be on the surface.
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Yea, I assume it was more like "So Glenn, here are a list of all the venue's we'll be playing and what your cut will be"
"Hm....I think I'd have better luck jerking off in a bathroom, c ya"
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Drover was the only reason that I had interest in this version of Queensryche, now, I have nil. Adami could be right. Geoff might have been nice, but I think the conversation would have went like this;
*Drover finally meets Geoff after agreeing to join the band*
Geoff: "Hey Glenn, before we get started, I need you to sign your contract."
Glenn: "No worries..............*reads contract*..................um, WTF is this?"
Geoff: "Well since I wrote 80 percent of the material that you will be playing, and of that material you wrote zero perfect, my cut is 95 percent, and the rest of the band gets 1 percent each.:
Glenn: "How the fuck does that work?"
Geoff: "Also, you will notice that in your contract under the part regarding guitar solos, you are to play all solo exactly as they were written on the albums, because even if Michael and Chris dispuite it, I wrote all the guitar solos for them. Also, Chris and Michael never improvised and never used speedy runs and extensive legato, so if you happen to add your own flavour into the solos that I wrote, you will be using your own creativity and therefore forfeit your 1 percent payment."
Glenn: *thinks, while staring at Geoff* "Damn, I thought Dave was a tight controlling asshole.....I wonder if King Diamond will take me back. *slams door and leaves*
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Can someone reccomend a good starting point for getting into QR? I went to the shop yesterday, but all they had was Dedicated To Chaos, which from this thread, I have gathered that might not be a particularly good way to begin. That said, reading this thread has made me interested to look for some in the near future.
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I wonder if King Diamond will take me back.
This sentence + your avvie = :tup
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Can someone reccomend a good starting point for getting into QR? I went to the shop yesterday, but all they had was Dedicated To Chaos, which from this thread, I have gathered that might not be a particularly good way to begin. That said, reading this thread has made me interested to look for some in the near future.
Mindcrime, Empire, and/or Promised Land would be my tip.
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Can someone reccomend a good starting point for getting into QR? I went to the shop yesterday, but all they had was Dedicated To Chaos, which from this thread, I have gathered that might not be a particularly good way to begin. That said, reading this thread has made me interested to look for some in the near future.
Mindcrime, Empire, and/or Promised Land would be my tip.
Yes. But go no further from those... only backwards.
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Ah, awesome, thanks. O:M had been the one I was hoping would be there to pick up.
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Start with O:M for sure!
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I knew Drover would drop out, but I honestly thought it'd take longer than this. :lol I have a feeling this won't even get on the road at this rate.
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I knew Drover would drop out, but I honestly thought it'd take longer than this. :lol I have a feeling this won't even get on the road at this rate.
At the end it might be other guys no one has ever heard of, but Tate will not let the opportunity slip to cash in on the name while he still can.
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Last year, DT/MP was my favorite soap opera. This year, it's Queensryche.
:corn
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Drover was the only reason that I had interest in this version of Queensryche, now, I have nil. Adami could be right. Geoff might have been nice, but I think the conversation would have went like this;
*Drover finally meets Geoff after agreeing to join the band*
Geoff: "Hey Glenn, before we get started, I need you to sign your contract."
Glenn: "No worries..............*reads contract*..................um, WTF is this?"
Geoff: "Well since I wrote 80 percent of the material that you will be playing, and of that material you wrote zero perfect, my cut is 95 percent, and the rest of the band gets 1 percent each.:
Glenn: "How the fuck does that work?"
Geoff: "Also, you will notice that in your contract under the part regarding guitar solos, you are to play all solo exactly as they were written on the albums, because even if Michael and Chris dispuite it, I wrote all the guitar solos for them. Also, Chris and Michael never improvised and never used speedy runs and extensive legato, so if you happen to add your own flavour into the solos that I wrote, you will be using your own creativity and therefore forfeit your 1 percent payment."
Glenn: *thinks, while staring at Geoff* "Damn, I thought Dave was a tight controlling asshole.....I wonder if King Diamond will take me back. *slams door and leaves*
:lol
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Last year, DT/MP was my favorite soap opera. This year, it's Queensryche.
:corn
Seems like prog rock has the best drama :lol
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Does anyone have the first studio re-recordings of Todd singing Ryche material? The first two videos they released have been made private or taken down on YT. (And Crimson Glory's demo song has been made private).
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Review of QR's gig at the House of Blues.
https://metalassault.com/gig_reviews/2012/11/25/queensryche-shows-off-new-lineup-and-old-classics-in-hollywood/
B.Lee
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Anyone see this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCcY2Eo6bdk
:lol I love how Glen is clearly present but gets his intro cut. He looks so uncomfortable and awkward. I think he made his decision to leave the minute before they did this interview.
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Anyone see this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCcY2Eo6bdk
:lol I love how Glen is clearly present but gets his intro cut. He looks so uncomfortable and awkward. I think he made his decision to leave the minute before they did this interview.
From the comments...
"Geoff, you have given me hope. After I got fired from my job at Subway, I found a bunch of unemployed friends to help me start a new restaurant called "Subway." We serve all the same subs as Subway, except the ingredients we use are old and stale. "
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:lol
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That's one of the best youtube comments I've read in a while. :lol
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Anyone see this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCcY2Eo6bdk
:lol I love how Glen is clearly present but gets his intro cut. He looks so uncomfortable and awkward. I think he made his decision to leave the minute before they did this interview.
From the comments...
"Geoff, you have given me hope. After I got fired from my job at Subway, I found a bunch of unemployed friends to help me start a new restaurant called "Subway." We serve all the same subs as Subway, except the ingredients we use are old and stale. "
You know what's even funnier? THAT comment has more than double the likes of the video itself! As of this post, the video has 23 likes, and that comment has 53 likes.
When is Geoff going to get the clue that this is over.
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I still cannot believe that Rudy Sarzo is involved with this.
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I still cannot believe that Rudy Sarzo is involved with this.
Why not? Imagine all of the dozens of dollars he's going to make!
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I watched that video again for lolz. Man, Randy is one creepy dude. Still enjoy's Glen's body language.
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I just actually watched it for the first time. What a fuc%ing train wreck in the making. The whole "I played with Geoff in Myth" thing..WTF?
Who fuc%ing cares what high school band you were in?. That was over 30 years ago!!
Bobby Blotzer is a clown too. Can he play Scott's parts?
You can tell that Rudy considers Geoff a friend and I respect that whole "I'm there for you, buddy" vibe that he's giving off. He's the only one with any class in the whole video.
I love how Glen is clearly present but gets his intro cut. He looks so uncomfortable and awkward. I think he made his decision to leave the minute before they did this interview.
He certainly had his mind up by the time the video was over. He had that "WTF am I doing here look" on his face the whole time.
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I just actually watched it for the first time. What a fuc%ing train wreck in the making. The whole "I played with Geoff in Myth" thing..WTF?
Who fuc%ing cares what high school band you were in?. That was over 30 years ago!!
Bobby Blotzer is a clown too. Can he play Scott's parts?
You can tell that Rudy considers Geoff a friend and I respect that whole "I'm there for you, buddy" vibe that he's giving off. He's the only one with any class in the whole video.
I love how Glen is clearly present but gets his intro cut. He looks so uncomfortable and awkward. I think he made his decision to leave the minute before they did this interview.
He certainly had his mind up by the time the video was over. He had that "WTF am I doing here look" on his face the whole time.
Glen is absolutely priceless in the whole thing. He is just so withdrawn. I would have loved to have seen his introduction and what he actually said. Check his face around 5:30, you can see him making his mind up that he is definitely gone. I love how Kelly says that he would know a band that he has produced and Glen is like "Nope, never heard of them." Then a sudden scene cut. :lol
I also have never heard of Myth in any way, shape or form so I couldn't give a fuck that these people played with Geoff 30 years ago.
A truly unprofessional video. Not even to redo something without Glen is just laughable, especially when the video is released a week after Glen's departure.
I agree Rudy is the only one with some class.
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Glen is absolutely priceless in the whole thing. He is just so withdrawn. I would have loved to have seen his introduction and what he actually said. Check his face around 5:30, you can see him making his mind up that he is definitely gone. I love how Kelly says that he would know a band that he has produced and Glen is like "Nope, never heard of them." Then a sudden scene cut. :lol
I agree Rudy is the only one with some class.
I totally missed that the first time watching. Good catch, that's hilarious. :rollin
Also very creepy:
Kelly Grey: "I just can't seem to escape"
Geoff: "you're in my web Kelly Gray"
(https://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x459/phoenix87x/Screenshot2012-12-06at100044PM.png)
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"it's an honor for me to play these songs. I'm sure everyone is feeling the same way"
*very sarastic*
"ABSOLUTELY, YEP"
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The real question here is, why would any self-respecting person pay to see Geoff Tate and this sham?
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Geoff Tate gives me the heebie-jeebies.
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"it's an honor for me to play these songs. I'm sure everyone is feeling the same way"
*very sarastic*
"ABSOLUTELY, YEP"
:rollin
Always been a big fan of Glen but for some reason, this makes me like him even more.
Also, Kelly Gray: "I'm just excited to be here I suppose." :lol :lol :lol
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:trainwreck:
Sums it up.
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Anyone see this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCcY2Eo6bdk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCcY2Eo6bdk)
:jets: I love how Glen is clearly present but gets his intro cut. He looks so uncomfortable and awkward. I think he made his decision to leave the minute before they did this interview.
From the comments...
"Geoff, you have given me hope. After I got fired from my job at Subway, I found a bunch of unemployed friends to help me start a new restaurant called "Subway." We serve all the same subs as Subway, except the ingredients we use are old and stale. "
:rollin
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Some of that was hilarious (in a sad way). Most of it was terribly disheartening. That dude has lost it. Completely deranged.
But that comment is golden. :lol
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yikes, Randy is very creepy. The whole band is creepy actually.
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yikes, Randy is very creepy. The whole band is creepy actually.
That's definitely the vibe I'm getting. If GT loses the lawsuit, Creepsryche has a nice ring to it.
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Man, the guyliner on the eyes and the dyed mustache and goatee are just....they're just....ah.....
(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/55966936/pics/slide_266290_1813701_free.gif)
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Yeah, the whole thing has a very...Charles Manson feel to it.
I feel like at any moment one of them might have some kind of constructive criticism for Tate, he'd up and murder the whole group and start yet another new one with members from failed boy bands. Or something. That actually sounds kind of nice compared to what he's doing now. Hmm..
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Yeah, the whole thing has a very...Charles Manson feel to it.
I feel like at any moment one of them might have some kind of constructive criticism for Tate, he'd up and murder the whole group and start yet another new one with members from failed boy bands. Or something. That actually sounds kind of nice compared to what he's doing now. Hmm..
What happens if these guys sack Geoff too. Can they be Queensryche number 3? :corn
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Yeah, the whole thing has a very...Charles Manson feel to it.
I feel like at any moment one of them might have some kind of constructive criticism for Tate, he'd up and murder the whole group and start yet another new one with members from failed boy bands. Or something. That actually sounds kind of nice compared to what he's doing now. Hmm..
What happens if these guys sack Geoff too. Can they be Queensryche number 3? :corn
It happened (kind of) to Stratovarious. Tolkki joined the band in the 80's after it was already established, then fired everyone, then way later on got fired by the other guys who he hired.
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I was just about to post that. Yeah..it's uh...not a good situation. Really sucks.
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:corn
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STOP THAT. THIS IS NO PLACE FOR MERRYMAKING. THIS IS A BATTLEFIELD!!! RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAtheladworeblack.
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Supposedly, Keri Kelli (Alice Cooper, Slash's Snakepit) is the next guitarist to be entering the Geoff Tate touring band.
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He's pretty good. Not Drover good but good.
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Supposedly, Keri Kelli (Alice Cooper, Slash's Snakepit) is the next guitarist to be entering the Geoff Tate touring band.
And a friend of Damon Johnson -- good buds with Kelly Gray. So there's the connection. And I'm sure Alice would recommend him.
This is just laughable.
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Between all the Drover/Kelli nonsense and GT's boring solo album, I say bring on the new Queensryche...those samples have me curious.
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WTF is up with Blabbermouth starting headlines with "Todd La Torre fronted Queensryche"? Between the amount of Tate stories they run and now this I almost think Tate it running the damned site.
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WTF is up with Blabbermouth starting headlines with "Todd La Torre fronted Queensryche"? Between the amount of Tate stories they run and now this I almost think Tate it running the damned site.
Because they are both allowed to use the name. When Geoff finally does anything with the band they'll probably say "Geoff Tate Fronted Queensryche".
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WTF is up with Blabbermouth starting headlines with "Todd La Torre fronted Queensryche"? Between the amount of Tate stories they run and now this I almost think Tate it running the damned site.
Because the page views of the QR related stories go up the more controversy you can generate, and getting people to post and yell "FUCK GEOFF TAINT TODD IS THE SINGER OF QUEENSRYCHE" accomplishes that shit without trying hard.
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WTF is up with Blabbermouth starting headlines with "Todd La Torre fronted Queensryche"? Between the amount of Tate stories they run and now this I almost think Tate it running the damned site.
Because they are both allowed to use the name. When Geoff finally does anything with the band they'll probably say "Geoff Tate Fronted Queensryche".
Ok I am not really a Queensryche fan (yet... I have listening to Operation Mindcrime I believe and the newer concept album about the soldier or whatevs) but I swung in here to post 2 things. I was searching my local upcoming concerts and just saw a show billed as Queensryche: Starring Geoff Tate and I know there is / was just a concert in the same area with Queensryche... I tripped out for a second.
Now... someone recommend me something to help get me into 'em :D
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WTF is up with Blabbermouth starting headlines with "Todd La Torre fronted Queensryche"? Between the amount of Tate stories they run and now this I almost think Tate it running the damned site.
Because they are both allowed to use the name. When Geoff finally does anything with the band they'll probably say "Geoff Tate Fronted Queensryche".
Ok I am not really a Queensryche fan (yet... I have listening to Operation Mindcrime I believe and the newer concept album about the soldier or whatevs) but I swung in here to post 2 things. I was searching my local upcoming concerts and just saw a show billed as Queensryche: Starring Geoff Tate and I know there is / was just a concert in the same area with Queensryche... I tripped out for a second.
Now... someone recommend me something to help get me into 'em :D
Do you like it more prog, or more commercial?
If you want great prog...go get Rage For Order. If you want the more radio friendly commercial version, get Empire. Promised Land is also really great for the prog geek that lives within each one of us.
I give Empire flack from time to time...but it's actually pretty good. It's just got 2 or 3 songs that sound more like Journey or latter-era Def Leppard than Queensryche (I'm looking at you JCW and ARN). But the rest of it is pretty cool.
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Gotta have the prog. I think I will all three of them out though... Thanks :D
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Gotta have the prog. I think I will all three of them out though... Thanks :D
Promised Land then. Jammin's assessment is accurate.
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Someone please tell me what's so proggy about Promised Land??
Personally, I think it's a terrible album, although the songs were much better live (Out Of Mind). To me, the best song on it is Damaged, one of the heaviest tracks they've ever done.
OK maybe terrible is a bit strong, but I think it's only 3 or 4 songs deep. The rest of the stuff is so beneath what this band can do. No wonder they ended up where they did.
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I don't think Promised land is too proggy. It's still a fine album, though, it started to come together nicely a while ago after years of being just an average album to me. Ballads like Lady Jane and One more time are really catchy, I enjoy the weirdness of Disconnected, and then there's Damaged - my favorite Queensryche song, I loved it from the day one. :metal
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I think I Am I, Disconnected and the title track are among the bands best and most adventurous material....and VERY prog.
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I believe its time for me to dive into the post Empire, pre Tribe albums. Promised Land is where I'll start.
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I believe its time for me to dive into the post Empire, pre Tribe albums. Promised Land is where I'll start.
Just stop after Promised Land and save yourself some time. PL is an underrated gem in their discography, but everything after it is barely listenable.
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I believe its time for me to dive into the post Empire, pre Tribe albums. Promised Land is where I'll start.
Promised Land is so damn good. When ever I put it on, the whole week inevitably becomes "promised land week" where that's all I listen to. Its dark, powerful and dripping with emotion. I truly love it and it is my favorite QR release.
Just make sure to the get the newer edition that includes Real World. That's an awesome song.
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Promised Land is one of the most intense and powerful albums they have ever done--it's the kind of album you should listen to alone with the lights off. The title track, Disconnected, and I Am I should be very satisfying for prog fans, and if you're a sucker for sad, haunting music, Out of Mind, Lady Jane, and Someone Else are perhaps their most melancholy tracks ever. But it's not all gloom and doom--My Global Mind is extremely catchy and fun, and would have been the wisest chouce for the first single.
I hope Todd will want to perform some of these songs someday because it's an album that Queensryche should be really proud of. And while their later albums are nowhere near as good, I won't say they are worthless like many people do. Hear in the Now Frontier, Q2K, and Operation Mindcrime 2 especially have many impressive songs, even if they don't resemble at all the Queensryche we knew and loved. And if you're very much into comedy and need a good chuckle, then Dedicated to Chaos will come in handy.
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I love Promised Land now, but I didn't at the time. It had to grow on me over a long period. Disconnected is still terrible though and belongs as a bonus track on DTC, not as a carbuncle on the great PL's ass.
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Someone please tell me what's so proggy about Promised Land??
Personally, I think it's a terrible album, although the songs were much better live (Out Of Mind). To me, the best song on it is Damaged, one of the heaviest tracks they've ever done.
OK maybe terrible is a bit strong, but I think it's only 3 or 4 songs deep. The rest of the stuff is so beneath what this band can do. No wonder they ended up where they did.
While most people started jumping off the QR bandwagon after Promised Land, I never liked it. It just bored me sensless, and I really don't hear the prog that other people do.
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In my opinion, PL is prog because it was very different (I can't think of anything else like it) and the band didn't decide to try to write Empirev2 which would have been the easy thing for them to do at the time. That doesn't exactly make it prog, but it was definitely a move forward for them, so I'm bound to lend that moniker to that album. Look at it this way, ask yourself how many other bands would have thought of putting saxiphone on an album like that? But it works perfectly.
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Promised Land is amazing. I like how Phoenix87 described it- dark, powerful and emotional. The title track is the epitome of this description.
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Yeah, to me Promised Land is the last great Queensryche album...
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To me, Promised Land was "Rage for Order with a budget"...
The music isn't quite as strong as RfO, but the production is much better....and I think they have a very similar "feel" to them.
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I like Promised Land a lot, and One More Time is one of my favourite QR songs.
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To me, Promised Land is their best song. Not the album itself but it's great either.
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Glad to see love for Promised Land. It really is a great album. It's much more atmospheric than their other releases. Production was very good on the album and they took some chances and really won IMO with them.
In my opinion, PL is prog because it was very different (I can't think of anything else like it) and the band didn't decide to try to write Empirev2 which would have been the easy thing for them to do at the time. That doesn't exactly make it prog, but it was definitely a move forward for them, so I'm bound to lend that moniker to that album. Look at it this way, ask yourself how many other bands would have thought of putting saxiphone on an album like that? But it works perfectly.
+1
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PL, to me, sounded like a more earthy RFO. It's a dark, weird album (like RFO) and carries an intense, almost eerie vibe at times...but with more grainy, modern (for the time) mix. They were never the same after.
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PL was the last good QR album. It's really a shame what happened to the band and the music ever since then.
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You have GOT to be kidding me! :facepalm:
https://www.classicrockmagazine.com/news/queensryche-lack-of-violence-bewilders-geoff-tate/
Asked who would throw the first punch in a theoretical situation, Tate tells Uber Rock: “Probably me. Those guys can’t fight their way out of a paper bag. I’ve never seen such a bunch of… how can you be a man and not, like, defend yourself? How can you do that? I don’t understand it.
“Americans are really touchy about that stuff. I spat in Scott’s face and that is an ancient act of defiance and contempt. It’s a symbolic gesture. It’s ancient – people have been doing that for centuries and Americans can’t wrap their head around that.
“They think it’s juvenile, like it’s something a kid does. They can’t understand guys getting in a punch-up. They fear that, they’re appalled by it. In other countries – Ireland for example: the Irish don’t see anything wrong with it at all.”
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I saw that same interview on Blabbermouth-the Tates are carpet bombing Blabbermouth these days-and I loved when someone quoted the bit about how people in Ireland viewed spitting the way Tate said they did, and added "I'm Irish. No, we don't." Geoff Tate has gone from worse to worse, but now he's flat out fucking delusional.
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And this bit...
"And he doesn’t feel that fans should be made to take sides between the two parties for emotional reasons. “You can make up your own mind what you want to listen to,” he says. “If it was me, and my one of my favourite bands had split up and formed two bands, I’d probably check out both bands to see what they were all about, and see if there was something about each one that I liked.”
We've been hearing your version for 10 years Geoff and it is shit. We want a proper QR album and the only chance we have of getting one is with the "official" band that sacked you.
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He really is 10 pounds of bat-shit crazy in a 5 pound bag.
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And this bit...
"And he doesn’t feel that fans should be made to take sides between the two parties for emotional reasons. “You can make up your own mind what you want to listen to,” he says. “If it was me, and my one of my favourite bands had split up and formed two bands, I’d probably check out both bands to see what they were all about, and see if there was something about each one that I liked.”
Normally that's completely true. I would check out both sides and in most cases support both.
But Queensryche is the first band to split where I don't even really give a crap what either side does anymore. Total lack of interest. But I was kind of feeling that way before the split so I guess it's no surprise.
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^ That just goes to show how far Tate has run it into the ground and none of the other bandmates did much to really stand out in fans eyes to keep people interested.
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Couldn't agree more, Ytse. It's really sad; when I first found out about the band years ago (sadly I got into them right as they were changing with PL, but there's old videos of me as a baby and you can hear Mindcrime and Empire playing in the background :laugh: I was definitely conditioned by my pops), I was still following them alongside my dad...since I was still very young, saw my first concert at their show and my hype was building up more and more for this band, who's backlog consisted of some of the most emotionally touching, powerful music I've ever heard. But then...they fell off the radar. I just didn't like a single thing they put out after Promised Land and from then on it was as if they were an entirely different entity. I mean...completely...it just dumbfounded me how different they were and how much I disliked a band that I once fawned over and could listen to for hours on end without being bored for a second.
Now...Tate really has gone off the deep end. He's a straight-up creeper and disillusioned in every mindset possible. It's so very sad. :-\ *Listens to Jet City Woman and weeps*
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:woot:
Just announced March 7th at the Phoenix Concert Theatre here in Toronto.
:woot:
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:woot:
Just announced March 7th at the Phoenix Concert Theatre here in Toronto.
:woot:
Glad for you, mate. I don't even have a chance to see them as I live in a small town in France and won't have the money to go to the capital.
B.Lee
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:woot:
Just announced March 7th at the Phoenix Concert Theatre here in Toronto.
:woot:
They should be playing new material by then
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:woot:
Just announced March 7th at the Phoenix Concert Theatre here in Toronto.
:woot:
They should be playing new material by then
Good god I hope so.
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never mind- wrong thread!
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On a side note, Todd La Torre has resigned from Crimson Glory (it had been in the air for a long time anyway.). Sad!
https://www.bravewords.com/news/198498
B.Lee
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That CG curse. Oh well, at least there was one demo song.
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I knew it would happen, but I was hoping that they could just squeeze out one album. Crimson Glory isn't a very reliable band, so we should be glad that we got the one demo out of it.
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I knew it would happen, but I was hoping that they could just squeeze out one album. Crimson Glory isn't a very reliable band, so we should be glad that we got the one demo out of it.
Yeah, it really is a shame because the demo sounded promising. Too bad!
B.Lee
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On the bright side, I was left with the impression that Todd wrote the majority of that song as a test of what/how he writes, so if they utilize that in QR we'll be in for a treat regardless.
I don't understand how they can be so bad about this. Fuck it, gather once every 3-4 years like Shadow Gallery and just release a studio album, how hard can it be? I wish someone from the band starts acting more respectful to their fans. It's the second or third time they've announced albums that never come out.
"We wanted to see what he could do musically and lyrically on his own. What you hear is exactly what Todd recorded at home without any input from anyone in the band. Indeed, this track helped seal the deal with Todd for us, because we wanted more than just a voice -- we needed a creative writing force as well, someone who understood our particular style and sound of music and the legacy that accompanies it."
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On the bright side, I was left with the impression that Todd wrote the majority of that song as a test of what/how he writes, so if they utilize that in QR we'll be in for a treat regardless.
I don't understand how they can be so bad about this. Fuck it, gather once every 3-4 years like Shadow Gallery and just release a studio album, how hard can it be? I wish someone from the band starts acting more respectful to their fans. It's the second or third time they've announced albums that never come out.
"We wanted to see what he could do musically and lyrically on his own. What you hear is exactly what Todd recorded at home without any input from anyone in the band. Indeed, this track helped seal the deal with Todd for us, because we wanted more than just a voice -- we needed a creative writing force as well, someone who understood our particular style and sound of music and the legacy that accompanies it."
It shows that Todd was more capable of writing CG material than CG themselves. As you said, let's hope he used that talent to write some new QR material as well.
B.Lee
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Really good version of The Whisper. Enjoy!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0UNOauIZsus
B.Lee
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So, there was a new interview with Scott on Eddie Trunk's show with a new trailer from one of the new songs. Anyone heard it? Is there somewhere you can check out past shows?
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So, there was a new interview with Scott on Eddie Trunk's show with a new trailer from one of the new songs. Anyone heard it? Is there somewhere you can check out past shows?
I've been trying to find it, but I keep striking out. However, I ran across something about a GT Queensryche album being recorded when I was looking for the interview. This should be amusing to say the least.
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You have GOT to be kidding me! :facepalm:
https://www.classicrockmagazine.com/news/queensryche-lack-of-violence-bewilders-geoff-tate/
Asked who would throw the first punch in a theoretical situation, Tate tells Uber Rock: “Probably me. Those guys can’t fight their way out of a paper bag. I’ve never seen such a bunch of… how can you be a man and not, like, defend yourself? How can you do that? I don’t understand it.
“Americans are really touchy about that stuff. I spat in Scott’s face and that is an ancient act of defiance and contempt. It’s a symbolic gesture. It’s ancient – people have been doing that for centuries and Americans can’t wrap their head around that.
“They think it’s juvenile, like it’s something a kid does. They can’t understand guys getting in a punch-up. They fear that, they’re appalled by it. In other countries – Ireland for example: the Irish don’t see anything wrong with it at all.”
Despicable.
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"Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent"
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You guys didn't miss anything yet. Scott Rockenfield will be on Eddie Trunk's radio show TONIGHT, and they will play a snippet of a new song. Here is the radio station's website, where you can stream live. https://www.q1043.com/main.html
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Teaser for a new song from the band's official page. I like it!
Song is called "Redemption".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=P8iaNZBUK9c
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I'm not floored by the clip, but it's a vast improvement over anything that we've had from these guys for a very long time. Most definitely a move in the right direction.
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A promising start. Not blown away but its only a 90 second clip. I'm hoping for some of the complimenting clean guitars from days of old. And an epic or two.
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Not bad for a first new song. Not really blown away, but its a million times better then what we were getting.
Regardless, from hearing that sample, I am excited to hear the rest.
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Sounds very promising
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Fitting title.
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I agree with all the above. It's good, but not amazing. Better than anything they've put out in a very long time...but a bit too straightforward to be classic QR imo. I'd like to hear something a bit more on the "weird/off-kilter" scale. But it's a good opening track.
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I agree with all the above. It's good, but not amazing. Better than anything they've put out in a very long time...but a bit too straightforward to be classic QR imo. I'd like to hear something a bit more on the "weird/off-kilter" scale. But it's a good opening track.
Exactlys.
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Yeah. It's not blowing me away, but I at least want to hear more. I don't expect them to get close to their early brilliance, but this at least sounds like it won't be shit with a capital F like the last few.
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It's been a few hours since I checked the teaser. It sounds much better the second time, tbh. Some part of me hopes that this album isn't an instant hit, but a grower. Seems like those albums stand the test of time much better. Or at least they are "fresh" for the longest period since you keep discovering new things in them.
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In other news: Geoff Tate is trying to out heavy Queensryche with his own version of the band.
https://www.blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=186637
GEOFF TATE Working On 'Stupidly Heavy' QUEENSRźCHE Album - Feb. 23, 2013
Guitarist Craig Locicero (FORBIDDEN, SPIRALARMS) and drummer Paul Bostaph (SLAYER, TESTAMENT, EXODUS, FORBIDDEN) are among the featured musicians on the forthcoming album from the new lineup of the Geoff Tate-fronted version of QUEENSRźCHE. The CD, which is currently being mixed by Jason Slater, is due later in the year via the Los Angeles-based independent label Cleopatra Records.
Says Craig: "Whelp, I guess the cat is out of the proverbial bag. Nikki Blakk [of the San Francisco, California radio station 107.7 The Bone] has announced that Paul Bostaph and I have played most of the music on Geoff Tate's QUEENSRźCHE record. It is being mixed by Jason Slater as I type this and it is WAY HEAVIER then most anyone is expecting!
"Geoff and Jason have been nothing but awesome to us and it gave Paul and I a chance to contribute together on a metal record once again. I was working on it for a few weeks and play on every song. There are kick-ass solo contributions from Dave Meniketti [Y&T], Ty Tabor [KING'S X], Brad Gillis [NIGHT RANGER], K.K. Downing [JUDAS PRIEST] and Chris Cannella. As well as bass played by Rudy Sarzo and more drums from Simon Wright. It's some great company to be around and it was an honor to be a part of it.
"I know what the perception of the QUEENSRźCHE camp is and I really don't give a f*ck. QUEENSRźCHE was one of my favorite bands from the EP through 'Operation: Mindcrime'.
"When I was approached about doing the record, I did contemplate all of the turmoil, but I love a challenge. I accepted the challenge and think Geoff has a kick-ass record to deliver the fans...in spite of what some may expect. The songs are cool, classy and in some cases stupidly heavy!
"So there you have it. I am not in QUEENSRźCHE, SPIRALARMS is still my baby with a killer record to be released very soon. So Geoff has a touring lineup ready to go this summer. I'm simply stoked to have put some my riffage in the mix with once of heavy metal's most recognizable and classic voices."
Although a lineup for Tate's QUEENSRźCHE was originally announced in the fall of 2012, things have changed. The band will now feature Tate along with bassist Rudy Sarzo (OZZY OSBOURNE, DIO, WHITESNAKE, QUIET RIOT), guitarist Kelly Gray (QUEENSRźCHE 1998-2001), keyboardist Randy Gane and new additions, guitarist Robert Sarzo (QUIET RIOT, HURRICANE) and drummer Simon Wright (AC/DC, DIO, RHINO BUCKET).
Wright takes over for previously announced drummer Bobby Blotzer, who will be returning to RATT as an integral part of the band that made him famous.
Beginning in early April, Tate's QUEENSRźCHE will be hitting the road to celebrate the 25th anniversary of the band's epic 1988 release, "Operation: Mindcrime", performing all fifteen songs from the album along with other well-known hits and rarities from the catalog they've compiled over the past 30 years.
"I try to surround myself with the best players available and feel our longtime fans deserve nothing less," says Tate. "I expect the forthcoming effort to be one of our best yet."
Tate, who was fired from QUEENSRźCHE in June 2012 after fronting the group for three decades, last year sought to prevent his former bandmates from touring and operating under the QUEENSRźCHE name without him. While ruling against Tate, the presiding judge determined that there was no legal hurdle in Tate also using the name with an all-new lineup of musicians. "I don't see any reason that Mr. Tate can't have the benefit, if he gets other members, of whatever name he uses of using the brand," Superior Court Judge Carol A. Schapira said during the July 13, 2012 court hearing. "I think [doing that would be] inherently confusing, although I'm sure the market can get these things sorted out," she added.
Last November, Tate released his first solo CD in over a decade titled "Kings & Thieves" (InsideOut Music) and toured with his solo band in support of the CD, which included dates with the legendary ALICE COOPER.
(https://www.blabbermouth.net/soulflypremiere/craigtateface.jpg)
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The clip sounded good. I hope the guys make the first album that is good enough to get since Hear in the Now Frontier.
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So, let me get this straight:
Tate with his band can record and tour as Queensryche, and Wilton, Jackson and Rockenfield can also record and tour as Queensryche? So like, if both release an album this year, they will be the 13th and 14th by the band, even though they will be by completely different lineups? How stupid is that?
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It's pretty fucking stupid. In fact so stupid that even if it's good I doubt I will buy either album. Out of respect for their fans they should simply disband, come up with a new name and see what happens.
Up next Mike Portnoy's Dream Theater goes on tour featuring other former members and imposters releasing album A dramatic turn of events for me too
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Wasn't there an interview that said Geoff's version will be called Geoff Tate's Queensryche? Or maybe we just referred to it that way. ;D
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Isn't that what Tate said about Kings & Thieves? It was supposed to be a heavy album. It wasn't. And he's not into Metal- he's said so all along- so I can't see it being anything other than more of the same. It will be written by the same team, produced by the same team and the vocals will still be mediocre.
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People have been referring to the bands as Todd La Torre's QR and Geoff Tate's QR, but as far as either band is concerned they both consider themselves simply Queensryche. Geoff Tate actually believes he's releasing a Queensryche album this year.
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I think Tate/Cleopatra will end up putting "Geoff Tate's Queensryche" on the actual release...I guess we'll see.
I can't figure out why, if he's not into Metal (aside from the old stuff he may have grown up with) these days, why in the hell would he want the guys from Forbidden recording his album? :lol
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I think Tate/Cleopatra will end up putting "Geoff Tate's Queensryche" on the actual release...I guess we'll see.
I can't figure out why, if he's not into Metal (aside from the old stuff he may have grown up with) these days, why in the hell would he want the guys from Forbidden recording his album? :lol
Because Tate is trying to fool people into believing that it was the other guys (Ed, Rock, michael) that didn't want to play heavy music, not him. Geoff's being extremely juvenile. Of course, he has comments all over the Internet making fun of heavy metal and that style of guitar riffs. But he probably figures the fans are too stupid to remember that.
The guy is a walking ball of ego that has had his ass kissed so much over the years, he believes his own fucking spin jobs.
In other news -- I really like the "Redemption" clip. It's only a 90-second teaser, but it has all the elements of the Queensryche sound for the most part...and something new. Can't wait to hear the record.
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The guy is a walking ball of ego that has had his ass kissed so much over the years, he believes his own fucking spin jobs.
This reminds me of what a drawback the internet and social media can be when it comes to the egos of musicians, celebrities, etc. It is easy for there to be tons of loyal "no matter what" fans and tons of critics, so it is easy for a guy like Tate to dismiss the critics as haters, while lapping up everything the "no matter what" fans say as genuine and truthful. Same thing with certain other musicians that get discussed here from time to time...:P
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People have been referring to the bands as Todd La Torre's QR and Geoff Tate's QR, but as far as either band is concerned they both consider themselves simply Queensryche. Geoff Tate actually believes he's releasing a Queensryche album this year.
Well, no, not really. From what I have seen online, most people discussing the two bands out there do refer to the Geoff Tate version as "Geoff Tate's Queensryche" (or by more derogatory names :lol ). But most people refer to the other version simply as "Queensryche," as they should.
And, no, I don't believe Geoff Tate really thinks he is putting out a Queensryche album, despite what he has been saying. First off, I don't see how he could, under the circumstances, with a revolving door of guest musicians on the album and a completely different touring band lined up to play Mindcrime (and, I would guess, a few Queensryche "hits," one or two songs from the new album, and maybe a GT solo song or two). Second, even his studio guest musicians are saying online and on interviews that they are laying down tracks for the new Geoff Tate solo album. Geoff is either telling them that outright, or is acting in such a way as to give that impression. So, no, I don't think he really believes that what he is doing is "Queensryche."
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The guy is a walking ball of ego that has had his ass kissed so much over the years, he believes his own fucking spin jobs.
This reminds me of what a drawback the internet and social media can be when it comes to the egos of musicians, celebrities, etc. It is easy for there to be tons of loyal "no matter what" fans and tons of critics, so it is easy for a guy like Tate to dismiss the critics as haters, while lapping up everything the "no matter what" fans say as genuine and truthful. Same thing with certain other musicians that get discussed here from time to time...:P
I agree on a general level. In the case of Tate however, I doubt that he still has many "no matter what" fans left. Most of the supporting voices he hears are probably in his own head :lol
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They may not be overly strong in numbers, but trust me when I saw the Tate loyalists are still most certainly out there.
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I'm actually keen on hearing what Tate produces, the list of guests is pretty incredible.
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The old thread was getting a bit unwieldy, so I decided to split off a new topic from the point where Todd was announced as the new vocalist for the official Queensryche.
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I would think that even the Tate loyalists would have to agree that this is really a solo album. There can't really be much cohesion with that many players. It'll be a big hodge podge of GT's ideas.
At the rate he's going, he should have the same number of guest artists contributing as Gene Simmons did on his 1978 solo album in no time at all.
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What's so funny, to me, is that Tate thinks "heavy" is what everyone wants when in reality it was Queensryche's mood and vibe more than their heaviness that people are drawn to. They were never really all that heavy.
So he let's 2 guys from Forbidden play on the album, Brad Gillis shred some solos, then tours with known Metal hired-guns for the live shows all in an attempt to seem more Metal than he ever wanted to be in the first place (if you believe his past interviews).
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New label announcement, and album release date of June 11th.
https://blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=186985
QUEENSRźCHE has inked a deal with Century Media Records for the release of the band's new studio album. Due on June 11, the CD marks the debut release from the lineup comprised of La Torre (vocals; ex-CRIMSON GLORY), Michael Wilton (guitar), Parker Lundgren (guitar), Eddie Jackson (bass) and Scott Rockenfield (drums). The drums for the album were recorded at London Bridge Studios in Seattle, Washington with producer James "Jimbo" Barton — the man who engineered and mixed the band's classic 1988 LP, "Operation: Mindcrime", and its 1990 follow-up, "Empire", and co-produced 1994's "Promised Land". The rest of the music and vocals were laid down at several different facilities on the West Coast.
"QUEENSRźCHE is excited to begin writing this next chapter of our career with Century Media. Their passion and love for music has been apparent since early discussions and we are pleased to call them partners on this journey," states Jackson. "We are also thankful for all of the fans who have supported us from day one and helped us get to where we are today. Todd, Scott, Parker, Michael and I wouldn't be here if it wasn't for each and every one of you."
QUEENSRźCHE will head out on the "Return To History" world tour this March and April. The trek kicks off on March 5 in Dubuque, Iowa and makes stops in nine different countries, wrapping up on April 26 in the Netherlands. The band will also take to the high seas on this year's Monsters Of Rock cruise and Sweden Rock Cruise. The 23-date tour will make stops in New York, Tennessee and Florida as well as in Canada, United Kingdom and Germany, among others.
******
In a recent interview with Metal Assault, drummer Scott Rockenfield stated about QUEENSRźCHE's renewed collaboration with Barton: "It's a great thing — we're really excited about it, he's really excited about it. We've wanted to work with him for a while, but for whatever reason, we just hadn't gone there yet. This is a great time for us to do that, though. We all discussed who we wanted to do the record with, and he was one of the first names that came up. It was easy for us to pick up the phone and call him. It was like our relationship picked up right where it left off, so it's gonna be a lot of fun. He's a very creative guy that did some great records with us in the past. I think that's one of the most important things when it comes to why we want to work with him."
Asked if fans will see a return to the progressive metal sound QUEENSRźCHE had in the '80s, Scott said: "What we're trying to do, and what has been really interesting since Todd has jumped into the band, we're trying to revisit the old QUEENSRźCHE catalog — stuff off of the EP and "The Warning". That's always been a part of what we are, so yeah, definitely! I think in my opinion, we're really revisiting that vibe of why that music was special back then for us. There will be a modern flair to it, though, just because we're in the modern age. The fun thing about Jimbo being a part of it is that he can help tie together the two sides. He does come from our past and some of the great records and some of the great sounds that we're known for, but he's also living in the modern age and doing some interesting things as well. I think it's going to be a really great QUEENSRźCHE record. People are going to go, 'Wow, that's QUEENSRźCHE! That sounds just like what we've known them to be, and what we would expect them to now be.' That's what I think peple will get out of it."
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Looking forward to this! Also expecting a Tate album announcement very soon too.
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Coming a bit sooner than expected, looking forward to it.
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Well here's some tasty news:
The lead story on Blabbermouth right now:
Former Guitarist For GEOFF TATE's QUEENSRźCHE To Perform With 'Real' QUEENSRźCHE In Toronto - Mar. 5, 2013 (https://blabbermouth.net/news.aspx?mode=Article&newsitemID=187040)
(https://www.blabbermouth.net/soulflypremiere/droverrealqueen.jpg)
For those who may not have been following closely enough for this fact to click, Tate announced several months ago that Drover was to be part of the unofficial Geoff Tate Queensryche. Tate filmed a press release video with each of the guys in that lineup, and while Glen was present, his spot where he got to talk was edited out, and it was announced right after the filming that he had left. Speculation was that he recognized what an abomination this was, and decided it was in his best interest to bail. He had also said some things that directly contradicted Tate. For example, Tate had said in interviews that he had known Glen quite awhile and had been a longtime fan of his work. In an interview with Glen, Glen said he actually had never met Geoff before and hadn't even got together with him to discuss the new album or anything yet. And on and on. Anyway... :lol
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ZING!
This shit never gets old :lol
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This really is never going to end until one or the other goes down in flames... Oh boy. It will be fun stuff indeed, Mr. Drover.
That said, after re-listening to the samples a few more times, I'm beginning to build my excitement for this; it really does sound like a 'return to glory', and while I'm definitely going to keep my expectations in check, it's nice not to immediately hate something put out by the guys.
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According to the official Queensryche Face Book page, guitars for the new album are done!
Just posted on Queensryche's page: QR guitars are finished.
(https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/858607_272348066231686_1928882877_o.jpg)
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Just posted a picture on Facebook again, bass is done as well!
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Glen Drover is a fantastic guitarist. He doesn't deserve to be in a fake band, and he knows it. Good for him.
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Fuck I love Glen Drover. That's one of the greatest things ever. :hefdaddy :lol :metal
EDIT: If Parker ever leaves and DeGarmo still won't come back, I vote for Glen Drover as the replacement.
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I used to think I was too good to follow this tabloid gossip stuff... guess it just has to be about people I'm interested in.
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:lol Yep, it makes a difference. I love this, I'm like a desperate housewife having morning tea bitching about who is sleeping with who? :lol
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If Wilton and Taint were on the cover of the Enquirer I might bu... read it.
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New interview of the Whip.
https://www.musicenthusiastmag.com/2013/02/26/a-tale-of-two-queensryches-interview-with-michael-wilton/
B.Lee
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New interview of the Whip.
https://www.musicenthusiastmag.com/2013/02/26/a-tale-of-two-queensryches-interview-with-michael-wilton/
B.Lee
Frustratingly tight lipped IMO....
They ask him to just give his personal opinion on what he thinks was the "last great QR album"...and all he can say is that Empire sold the most. I'm sorry, but that's a really freakin LAME answer.
I understand he's trying to watch what he says...but would it kill him to just show a *little* personality and insight??? Still...playing it safe is far better than what Taint is doing.
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New interview of the Whip.
https://www.musicenthusiastmag.com/2013/02/26/a-tale-of-two-queensryches-interview-with-michael-wilton/ (https://www.musicenthusiastmag.com/2013/02/26/a-tale-of-two-queensryches-interview-with-michael-wilton/)
B.Lee
My favorite parts:
"Basically we want to rock, we like the hard rock element, we like a bit of the progressive element, we want to collaborate with our fanbase and really make this a situation where we listen to the audience and hear what they want, and we build upon that."
"Our objective with this album is to rekindle a band writing together as a band, and utilizing the strengths of the creative forces of everybody in the band, to contribute, and just to make a CD, an album, that’s just an honest representation of the band. We’re not going to try and sell you some outlandish or exaggerated claims, this is just an honest collection of songs that we think really represent the creative dynamic of the band."
Edit: Cleaning up the formatting of those quotes, I see that the font for that interview was apparently "helvetica neue".
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Just got back from the Queensryche show, and thought I'd navy seal in and out of here with a post about the it.
What. A. Fucking. Show!!!! Holy mother of god am I so glad I went. I was on the fence a bit earlier this week, but then decided I'd go.
Four (count 'em... FOUR) opening acts. All local outfits. Two absolutely slayed it; one was pretty good; and one - while they had great showmanship - wasn't quite to my liking of styles.
Then comes Queensryche. Someone said a long time ago in this thread when LaTorre was first introduced that it was pretty cool that the replacement was better than the original - ie, he's better than Tate was at HIS prime. And damned if that ain't the truth. Todd was genius - he owned the crowd right from the opener - Queen of the Reich. Scott was a beast. Michael and Eddie were completely on point. And Parker was fuckin impressive.
The main set was entirely of songs from the EP thru Mindcrime. That's it... the first four albums. In some regards, it's kinda sad that the band isn't playing to full arena's anymore. But in another regard, it's awesome to be in such a small intimate venue. I ended up being 2 "rows" back from the stage (as you'll see below... it was general admission, standing only).
(https://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww265/jingle-boy/99449CC0-C18C-4183-914B-B501EA514758-7994-0000093667C0BBBE_zps688545ea.jpg)
(https://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww265/jingle-boy/1B3897D1-5C11-4F4A-B35E-5ED029411166-7994-000009367260A734_zps255466a1.jpg)
(https://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww265/jingle-boy/A523F035-30F9-4EB4-80BB-C3D34AFAA9CF-7994-000009366B7707EA_zps1cfb6088.jpg)
(https://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww265/jingle-boy/D42E858C-D311-44E2-94CE-72EB4364E34C-7994-0000093654770534_zpsd2368a8e.jpg)
Then the encore, and out comes Drover to accompany them on Take Hold the Flame. Suck it bitches!
(https://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww265/jingle-boy/328F97F0-7FE3-4784-B0E4-D1BC7466D4E9-7994-000009365C1E1887_zps03823a65.jpg)
(https://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww265/jingle-boy/1072B7CE-42AE-4288-9600-74387CED7EB8-7994-0000093660072FB9_zps201af6f5.jpg)
The rest of the encore was Empire songs, fitting end to the show - although Silent Lucidity (while I loved it) felt completely out of place given the rest of the setlist.
The final bow. I was too close to get them all in a good shot. I was so busy trying to get a good pic, I missed the opportunity to snatch one of Scott's drum sticks... the guy behind me got one. :censored
(https://i726.photobucket.com/albums/ww265/jingle-boy/EBBA9149-C9F7-429D-8DDA-C1CCBAF46F58-7994-00000936586E45C3_zps293493a4.jpg)
I encourage anyone to go see them. They were dynamite.
That's all. See ya gang.
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So jelly. That's fuckin' awesome.
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Todd looks like a total, utter sweetheart of a guy I swear. So I guess that's refreshing for them as well :D
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Chad, you're the Chris Jericho of DTF. Gone for abit then make a big return. Nice to see QR kicking ass, can't wait for the new disc. Fans of the band that have put up with their sub par stuff for the last number of years deserve seeing their patience pay off.
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Chad, great to see you back, been wondering where you were.
Great pics too. I love that one of Drover and Jackson. It almost looks like they are having a good chuckle and yearn about Tater, in agreement of course. :lol
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Sounds like a great time! It's cool seeing a band like that in a small place, really close up. It's almost like you're just at a party or something and they're the band and you're right there, except this is a world-class rock band tearing it up right in front of you.
I get what you mean about Silent Lucidity but since it was such a big hit for them, they pretty much "had" to play it. Even if it's a really different kind of song for them, there would've been a lot of people pissed if they hadn't played it (including dudes who brought their girlfriends/wives, who only came because of that song).
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Not reading to avoid spoilers, but cool pics!
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Chad, I re-posted your review and pics a few other relevant places.
Now I want to see some video!
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Here we go! The quality isn't great, but here's the first video to surface of Glen playing Take Hold with the guys: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7Iu7w4Dyig
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Here we go! The quality isn't great, but here's the first video to surface of Glen playing Take Hold with the guys: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7Iu7w4Dyig
He put a little shred into the solo. Cool vid.
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If any of you guys are members on other forums where there are likely to be Queensryche fans, spread the word about the new album and the tour, and about how this is the official version of the band--not the counterfeit led by Geoff Tate that is out there using the Queensryche name and falsely claiming that F.U. is the "thirteenth album by Queensryche."
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Of course I agree with you in principle, but having not followed the legal case of late, aren't they technically (and sadly) still both official versions of Queensryche?
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Of course I agree with you in principle, but having not followed the legal case of late, aren't they technically (and sadly) still both official versions of Queensryche?
I get how the argument can be made either way. But in the strictest sense of the word, no, I don't believe they are both "official" versions of Queensryche. They can both use the name for now, but that does not make such use of the name equally valid by Geoff. There are two important reasons why:
First, the judge did not give Geoff permission to use the name, as some would spin it. She simply declined to issue a ruling that would stop him from using it. That is a very subtle, but also very important, distinction. Tate does not have the Court's blessing to use the name. The Court is just not going to actively intervene until the issue is decided at trial or the parties settle.
Second, Geoff is a 25% minority shareholder. Anything a minority shareholder of a corporation does without permission from the majority of the shareholders is not considered an "official" act of the corporation. So, no, it's not official by any stretch, either in a legal sense or in the more common, everyday sense.
But regardless of whether anyone is comfortable making the "official"/"unofficial" distinction, people can still spread the word so that people actually know. The vast majority of people who go to see a "Queensryche" show or buy the "new Queensryche album" will not know there is a split and will not know that the official band is actively touring and getting ready to release an album. So if they hear about the Tate version, that may be all they know or care about unless they have the other side as well.
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I know bosk1 is not fond of Geoff Tate, but I have a chance to see G.T's Queensryche in late April here in town and I may just do so. It's a "25th anniversary Operation: Mindcrime tour"... that said if the "other" Q.R decides to come this way too maybe I'll go see them both.
To be honest, I just can't imagine QR without Geoff's voice.
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I know bosk1 is not fond of Geoff Tate, but I have a chance to see G.T's Queensryche in late April here in town and I may just do so. It's a "25th anniversary Operation: Mindcrime tour"... that said if the "other" Q.R decides to come this way too maybe I'll go see them both.
To be honest, I just can't imagine QR without Geoff's voice.
Tood sounds more like Geoff than Geoff has in the past 10 years.
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Todd sounds live like a prime Geoff studio performance.
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I know bosk1 is not fond of Geoff Tate, but I have a chance to see G.T's Queensryche in late April here in town and I may just do so. It's a "25th anniversary Operation: Mindcrime tour"... that said if the "other" Q.R decides to come this way too maybe I'll go see them both.
To be honest, I just can't imagine QR without Geoff's voice.
Played by musicians who had nothing to do with the original Mindcrime. This is like going to see a tribute band, except you are getting a washed-up Tate, instead of a young singer who could channel the in-his-prime Tate.
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Played by musicians who had nothing to do with the original Mindcrime. This is like going to see a tribute band, except you are getting a washed-up Tate, instead of a young singer who could channel the in-his-prime Tate.
Maybe so, but I can't be sure the "real" QR (if you want to call them that) will be coming around here soon. I want to see O.M performed live in it's entirety.
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You know, when they played Mindcrime in its entirety on the Empire tour it was pretty cool. Now, the novelty is starting fade.
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You know, when they played Mindcrime in its entirety on the Empire tour it was pretty cool. Now, the novelty is starting fade.
I've never seen them live, so the Novelty is new to me. :)
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Who will sing the part of Mary in the tate version? Pamela nailed her flag to the "official" ship a while back. Mrs Tate? The daughter who sang on American Soldier?
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You know, when they played Mindcrime in its entirety on the Empire tour it was pretty cool. Now, the novelty is starting fade.
I got to see that tour. Incredible show and that's where it should have been left. Instead, it's been worn out for quite awhile now. They toured the entire album a few years ago and released a dvd if memory serves me right. It's time for other/better QR songs to be featured and that's exactly what the official band is doing on tour right now.
It's time for this fiasco to end and hopefully these upcoming albums will finally put it to rest.
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Played by musicians who had nothing to do with the original Mindcrime. This is like going to see a tribute band, except you are getting a washed-up Tate, instead of a young singer who could channel the in-his-prime Tate.
Maybe so, but I can't be sure the "real" QR (if you want to call them that) will be coming around here soon. I want to see O.M performed live in it's entirety.
You're right that I am not fond of Tate. Whether you agree with me or not is your own business. People are free to form their own opinions. But as much as possible, I would prefer that people are educated enough to make an informed decision. You are. If what you want to see and are intending to see is Geoff Tate's "Queensryche," then cool. I hope you enjoy it.
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Who will sing the part of Mary in the tate version? Pamela nailed her flag to the "official" ship a while back. Mrs Tate? The daughter who sang on American Soldier?
I suspect they will either (1) just have the vocals piped in; (2) have Lita Ford perform that part (she guested on the new Tate album, and toured with the band awhile back before the split, so I could see her going out with Geoff's band); or (3) have some (cheap) no-name singer play the part. I guess we'll see.
What I can see fairly certainly is that Pamela Moore will NOT be touring with them.
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Here we go! The quality isn't great, but here's the first video to surface of Glen playing Take Hold with the guys: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7Iu7w4Dyig
He put a little shred into the solo. Cool vid.
Awesome solo.
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Another video of Take Hold (video is a bit shakier, but the audio is more clear): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2__bzJZLzQc
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Another video of Take Hold (video is a bit shakier, but the audio is more clear): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2__bzJZLzQc
HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLD
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From Glen's Twitter:
A big thanks to Queensryche and their crew for everything. Had a great time. Here's a pic of me and michael
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BE3EPctCAAEVBJC.jpg:large)
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I know bosk1 is not fond of Geoff Tate, but I have a chance to see G.T's Queensryche in late April here in town and I may just do so. It's a "25th anniversary Operation: Mindcrime tour"... that said if the "other" Q.R decides to come this way too maybe I'll go see them both.
To be honest, I just can't imagine QR without Geoff's voice.
Honest question: What is the most recent QR album you listened to?
I have a theory about people who've been espousing that kind of opinion so it'd be interesting to see how it bears out against reality.
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I know bosk1 is not fond of Geoff Tate, but I have a chance to see G.T's Queensryche in late April here in town and I may just do so. It's a "25th anniversary Operation: Mindcrime tour"... that said if the "other" Q.R decides to come this way too maybe I'll go see them both.
To be honest, I just can't imagine QR without Geoff's voice.
Honest question: What is the most recent QR album you listened to?
I have a theory about people who've been espousing that kind of opinion so it'd be interesting to see how it bears out against reality.
Promised land. The general consensus seems to be that anything after without DeGarmo has not been great. I don't know most of the QR catalog, so take that for what it's worth.
As for people suggesting Geoff Tates QR is like a cover band playing the gigs... that's how I feel when key components (DeGarmo) get replaced in general... so to me BOTH QR editions are 'cover bands'.
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As for people suggesting Geoff Tates QR is like a cover band playing the gigs... that's how I feel when key components (DeGarmo) get replaced in general... so to me BOTH QR editions are 'cover bands'.
That doesn't make a whole lotta sense, considering 3/5 of the original Queensryche is still part of the band. Was Dream Theater a cover band after Kevin Moore left because he was a key component of that band? Of course not.
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As for people suggesting Geoff Tates QR is like a cover band playing the gigs... that's how I feel when key components (DeGarmo) get replaced in general... so to me BOTH QR editions are 'cover bands'.
That doesn't make a whole lotta sense, considering 3/5 of the original Queensryche is still part of the band. Was Dream Theater a cover band after Kevin Moore left because he was a key component of that band? Of course not.
Some would say yes to DT. But I'm not a fan on the "Kevin albums" as much as the later stuff. As far as musicians go, most skilled musicians can fill the role but the lead singer is often the part that if replaced causes the most uproar (from what I've seen in the past). Of course there are exceptions to everything.
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As for people suggesting Geoff Tates QR is like a cover band playing the gigs... that's how I feel when key components (DeGarmo) get replaced in general... so to me BOTH QR editions are 'cover bands'.
That doesn't make a whole lotta sense, considering 3/5 of the original Queensryche is still part of the band. Was Dream Theater a cover band after Kevin Moore left because he was a key component of that band? Of course not.
Some would say yes to DT. But I'm not a fan on the "Kevin albums" as much as the later stuff. As far as musicians go, most skilled musicians can fill the role but the lead singer is often the part that if replaced causes the most uproar (from what I've seen in the past). Of course there are exceptions to everything.
So then DT stopped being DT when Charlie left? :lol
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So then DT stopped being DT when Charlie left? :lol
Maybe to some. Not to me because of James. I said everything has an exception. If Charlie left after 20+ years with the band then I'd be saying the same thing about DT as I am QR if I felt he was a hard act to replace/follow.
MEH.
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Don't make too much fun of Mindflux, he has a point.
DeGarmo was the main songwriter for the albums we consider "true" Queensryche. Whether the LaTorre Queensryche is any more "true" than the Tate Queensryche shouldn't be decided by the presence of band members that were less responsible for the "true" Queensryche sound.
I favour the LaTorre version because the guys seem more honest at trying to deliver a "true" Queensryche album.
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Don't make too much fun of Mindflux, he has a point.
DeGarmo was the main songwriter for the albums we consider "true" Queensryche. Whether the LaTorre Queensryche is any more "true" than the Tate Queensryche shouldn't be decided by the presence of band members that were less responsible for the "true" Queensryche sound.
I favour the LaTorre version because the guys seem more honest at trying to deliver a "true" Queensryche album.
I don't favor either, presently. I'm just having a hard time wrapping my head around the QR sound without Geoff. I'll probably check out both versions albums and decide from there.
That said, I'll still probably go to the 4/24 showing of G.T's Queensryche here in town to see Operation: Mindcrime live.. and if the "real" QR with LaTorre comes around I'll go see that too.
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Don't make too much fun of Mindflux, he has a point.
DeGarmo was the main songwriter for the albums we consider "true" Queensryche. Whether the LaTorre Queensryche is any more "true" than the Tate Queensryche shouldn't be decided by the presence of band members that were less responsible for the "true" Queensryche sound.
I favour the LaTorre version because the guys seem more honest at trying to deliver a "true" Queensryche album.
I don't favor either, presently. I'm just having a hard time wrapping my head around the QR sound without Geoff. I'll probably check out both versions albums and decide from there.
That said, I'll still probably go to the 4/24 showing of G.T's Queensryche here in town to see Operation: Mindcrime live.. and if the "real" QR with LaTorre comes around I'll go see that too.
Todd does a great "Geoff". You won't notice the difference. Except you're getting the songs in the key you recognise and a "Geoff" from 20 years ago, not the washed up has been he's become- from his own neglect of his instrument. Oh, and none of those shit songs not written by Queensryche.
There was a time I thought QR wouldn't be QR without Geoff, but that was before he ran the band into the ground with his "vision".
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So, is their situation similar to what happened to Rhapsody? Maybe one group will be allowed to be officially called Geoff Tate's Queensryche, and the other just Queensryche.
Regardless, I haven't been anticipating the release of a QR album since probably Q2K (bleh). Very exciting to get something new this year.
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Show tonight was FANTASTIC. Will hopefully be able to post more tomorrow.
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Todd does a great "Geoff". You won't notice the difference.
^This. If we're getting the guy in the Take Hold of the Flame posted earlier, color me tickled pink. Sounds like Tate in his prime is all I care about when I hear the old stuff. Now to see if I can make it to Raleigh the weekend they are playing there.
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Promised land. The general consensus seems to be that anything after without DeGarmo has not been great. I don't know most of the QR catalog, so take that for what it's worth.
Obviously one anecdote does not data make... but you're not far off what I have in mind :)
There's a school of people who're saying "No Geoff, no Queensryche" and my guess is that the vast majority of them gave up on QR after the Hear In The Now Frontier album and if not then I certainly find it hard to believe they've listened to anything QR have put out since Tribe, which IMO is his last recorded performance that wasn't risible, particularly the covers album which has vocal performances that can best be described as embarrassing - the cover of Queen's Innuendo is a particularly egregious effort.
The Geoff Tate that I think people are referring to when they can't imagine a QR without him hasn't existed for years - as a singer, a live performer, a lyric writer and a personality - and as far as I'm concerned his ousting was long overdue.
I don't begrudge your interest in seeing Mindcrime performed live by Tate. I jumped at the chance of seeing it performed on the OM:II tour after all. I'm not even sure I'd want to see Queensryche perfom it in its entirety without him, even though Todd La Torre can do the songs justice in a way Tate hasn't been able to since the mid-90s: the album was most certainly a band effort, but the concept was very much driven by Tate and is fairly synonymous with him in my eyes.
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As for people suggesting Geoff Tates QR is like a cover band playing the gigs... that's how I feel when key components (DeGarmo) get replaced in general... so to me BOTH QR editions are 'cover bands'.
There's definitely some validity to that.
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To a very minor degree. Back when these songs were written the rest of the band was actually heavily involved in the albums, even if DeGarmo was the main force behind the bulk of it and bringing everything together.
If Queensyrche were ever a cover band it's when they were playing all of O:MII or most of American Soldier on any given night.
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To a very minor degree. Back when these songs were written the rest of the band was actually heavily involved in the albums, even if DeGarmo was the main force behind the bulk of it and bringing everything together.
If Queensyrche were ever a cover band it's when they were playing all of O:MII or most of American Soldier on any given night.
Oh, I don't disagree. I think "Promised Land" and "Hear in the New Frontier" are both absolute dung, so even with the "real" QR back, it'd have high potential for stnik.
Right now, I really don't care which QR is the more authentic of the two, but rather which is more likely to put on a great show and put out a decent album. Tate's not gonna put on a great show, so there ya go. I have no idea how bad his album is gonna be, but considering all the talent InsideOut seems to want to get involved on it I won't be surprised if it's decent.
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Promised Land is amazing.
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Todd sounds live like a prime Geoff studio performance.
Now THAT is a bit of a stretch. Todd's great in the studio. He's good live. The live YT stuff I have seen shows me the equivalent of a tribute singer covering an early era. He hits notes, but doesn't hold them, often ending them more in a scream than singing. He also skirts notes, and does this thing where he starts a note, then uses an "H" sound to climb...like "wayy-Hayyy". That get's monotonous.
Like I said, Todd is a good singer...but to say that live he's like "prime Tate", to me anyway, is WAY off the mark. Todd live is nowhere NEAR Tate's studio performances on those first 5 albums.
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Promised Land is amazing.
Agreed.
And for me, its my favorite QR album.
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I really hate Promised Land. The terrible production and lolsy vocals ruin it for me. I just can't get over how bad Tate sounds singing over more straightforward rock music. As a singer, Tate only ever really had the capacity to sing *very* 80s metal, and, IMO, Promised Land could have been good from a songwriting standpoint, but Tate's voice just takes me completely out of it.
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Seriously? For me that's among the best Tate material ever.
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I guess it depends on how you hear Tate. For me, I've never liked Tate, even in his great moments, so I'm more inclined to like him when he just sounds like some generic 80s metal singer and the "Tatisms" are well hidden.
On songs like "I Am I" and others on Promised Land, the 80s metal singer is gone and those Tatisms are up-front and on display, and I really can't stand it.
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Promised Land is amazing.
:tup :tup :tup
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I really hate Promised Land. The terrible production and lolsy vocals ruin it for me. I just can't get over how bad Tate sounds singing over more straightforward rock music. As a singer, Tate only ever really had the capacity to sing *very* 80s metal, and, IMO, Promised Land could have been good from a songwriting standpoint, but Tate's voice just takes me completely out of it.
Okay, if you dislike the songs and the vocals, that is fine, but to call the production terrible makes zero sense, when, in fact, the production is splendid. As much as I like most of their 80s material, a lot of it has that cheesy 80s production thing going on, while Empire and Promised Land both took it up several notches, albeit in a very different ways: Empire is more streamlined and slick, ala the Black Album, while Promised Land is more spacey and sonically pleasing.
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^That. Not liking the sound is one thing. But to say the production is terrible completely misses the mark. Albeit for different reasons, as Kev pointed out, Empire and Promised Land are considered by MANY in the music industry to be the gold standard. These are model albums that producers, engineers, and others often use as their baseline. The production is simpy fantastic.
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Okay, sure. It's not terrible, but it leaves me cold, and I don't like it. I guess it comes down to personal tastes. I've never really payed attention to who produced/mixed/engineered QR albums before, but now that I just have two seconds ago I am not surprised to find Paul Northfield and Peter Collins among the main perpetrators of the QR sound.
Of course, it turns out that some of the guys who are partially responsible for "dated glitz" sound I've always disliked about Rush are also the same guys responsible for QR's sound :lol And I don't even want to go into what I dislike about Northfield's DT work.
If those guys are the industry gold standard in the late 80s and early 90s, that explains why I find so much of the "industry" from that time to be pretty bad.
But my point wasn't to derail the thread with my opinion on production standards in the 80's. I was really just saying that I can't stand Tate, and find him tolerable at best even on QR's good albums, so in this case I'm glad he's gone and I'm more than happy to hear a less awkward sounding singer at the helm, even if people are going to make the argument that Tate's version of QR is more legitimate than the actual one.
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Here's a clip I found (finally) for Eyes of a Stranger from last night's show in Long Island: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2MkEDwDnv0
Hard to tell how "on" Todd was since the crowd is SO LOUD! But you can tell he is just killing it, especially when he comes in right after the solos. Actually, the entire band are just killing it up there. This looks like a great show to have witnessed. I can't wait to see them after the album comes out and the tour really kicks off in earnest.
For anyone who questions how a version of Queensryche in 2013 without Geoff Tate can possibly be "legitimate," do yourself a favor and watch that clip.
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Okay, here's a clip where you actually can hear Todd a lot better, and he is just tearing it up!
The Prophecy (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVHwaX44fqM)
Also:
Jet City Woman (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AycmH62xagU)
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I know some may not care, but Frequency Unknown (GT Queensryche) is on Amazon for $10.00 preorder.
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I know some may not care, but Frequency Unknown (GT Queensryche) is on Amazon for $10.00 preorder.
F U
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Okay, sure. It's not terrible, but it leaves me cold, and I don't like it.
I think the bottom line is that we are guilty of sometimes ignoring good production when we don't like the music itself (like you with Promised Land), and sometimes ignoring mediocre production when we love the music (like many of us with Scenes for a Memory, for example).
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Okay, sure. It's not terrible, but it leaves me cold, and I don't like it.
I think the bottom line is that we are guilty of sometimes ignoring good production when we don't like the music itself (like you with Promised Land), and sometimes ignoring mediocre production when we love the music (like many of us with Scenes for a Memory, for example).
Scenes for a memory, an album by Dream Theatre?
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Okay, sure. It's not terrible, but it leaves me cold, and I don't like it.
I think the bottom line is that we are guilty of sometimes ignoring good production when we don't like the music itself (like you with Promised Land), and sometimes ignoring mediocre production when we love the music (like many of us with Scenes for a Memory, for example).
Or like me with prime Rush, tbh.
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Just wanted to chime in on Promised Land. It, to me, is the last GREAT Queensryche album. It's like a more earthy RFO in spots...dark, weird and moody. I love his vocals on it and the songs are fantastic.
:metal
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I know some may not care, but Frequency Unknown (GT Queensryche) is on Amazon for $10.00 preorder.
F U
#16 in Hard Rock & Metal on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/music/67207/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_m_1_2_last
lol u
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I know some may not care, but Frequency Unknown (GT Queensryche) is on Amazon for $10.00 preorder.
F U
#16 in Hard Rock & Metal on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/music/67207/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_m_1_2_last
lol u
What exactly are you trying to prove with this? For one your posts belong in the UNofficial QR topic and it feels like you're just trying to poke at this topic with a sharp stick
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I know some may not care, but Frequency Unknown (GT Queensryche) is on Amazon for $10.00 preorder.
F U
#16 in Hard Rock & Metal on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/music/67207/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_m_1_2_last
lol u
What exactly are you trying to prove with this? For one your posts belong in the UNofficial QR topic and it feels like you're just trying to poke at this topic with a sharp stick
I was just bringing news about it being on sale and how it's doing into this. I already said earlier I haven't made up my mind about either edition of Queensryche now. I plan to buy both discs and go from there. Neither version is UN-official until a ruling says Geoff cannot use the name.. IMO.
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1 member who drove a band into the ground and acts like an immature baby who always has to have the last word vs 3 guys who just wanted control back over the thing they've put their life into. Seems an easy choice to me.
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My reaction to last night's QR show in Patchogue, NY, as I posted earlier today on Samsara's Breakdown Room:
What a show! The band was on fucking fire! I was pretty buzzed and randomly wandered down to the pit area just before QR went on, and I ended up like five feet from the stage. Todd reached over and grabbed by hand during the show. The fans were so into it. I loved when Todd said: "We're playing all the metal that made this band what it is." Some late-30s fans next to me were loving the set list. "I can't believe they're playing 'Child of Fire,'" one guy yelled with a giant smile. So much energy. During the brief pause after the instrumental section on "The Needle Lies," EdBass yelled out: "We're on fucking fire!" Wow, I was so swept away. I feel like this band could really do something and even have a hit song. They are hungry. You could see it in their eyes.
Also, during the show I was kinda thinking about Tate and how this reincarnated QR isn't entirely a slap in the face to him -- but it also could be viewed as a sort-of tribute to him. He created greatness back in the day. His lyrics. His melodies. People love those albums and what he gave us. The new QR with Todd is like a way of saying: Geoff, you're legend and we recognize that by celebrating this early music. But you don't have it anymore and you've lost that person along the way. Please graciously step aside and let the music be honored the way its meant to be honored.
In addition, I honestly think when all is said and done years from now that Todd could potentially be the second most beloved member in QR history to many people behind CDG. I know that's a big statement. But he's the perfect fit and the way he's resurrected this great band again in such an intense and powerful way is no joke. Todd is the fucking man!
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1 member who drove a band into the ground and acts like an immature baby who always has to have the last word vs 3 guys who just wanted control back over the thing they've put their life into. Seems an easy choice to me.
It is.... Mindflux is being a massive:
(https://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r47/jammindude/troll_zps7d6c9db8.jpg)
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1 member who drove a band into the ground and acts like an immature baby who always has to have the last word vs 3 guys who just wanted control back over the thing they've put their life into. Seems an easy choice to me.
It is.... Mindflux is being a massive:
(https://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r47/jammindude/troll_zps7d6c9db8.jpg)
If you say so. I want to hear both albums. How is that trolling?
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I'm actually probably going to listen to FU as well. I had zero interest in Kings & Thieves but if he's slapping the Queensryche name onto it, there's a morbid curiousity in me to see how it stacks up to the La Torre Queensryche album coming out later on.
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I'm definitely gonna check out Tate's album. Don't like the guy anymore, but I'm curious and don't make any apologies for it. Plus, the guests make it worth checking out, not so much Tate.
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I'm definitely gonna check out Tate's album. Don't like the guy anymore, but I'm curious and don't make any apologies for it. Plus, the guests make it worth checking out, not so much Tate.
For $10 I'll take a chance on it. If it sucks, I'll be glad to say it.
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Yeah, same. I purchased Tates last solo album and there was some decent stuff on there. I never listen to it and most of it was a waste, but there was a couple of good tunes.
Saying that, I'm looking forward to the REAL Queensryche album so much more than Tates.
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I tend to take KNH's hardline stance against stealing music....
....but in GT's case, I may make an exception. I am curious...but there is NO WAY IN HELL that guy is getting my money. This will be the one and only album I will be openly advocating any download you can get for nothing.
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I don't see the issue with Mindflux talking about the Tate album in this thread. Okay, I know there is another thread specifically for it, but this is the Queensryche thread, and discussing music stuff relating to current or past members should be okay. I mean, in the Yes thread, there is often talk about the music by ex-members there, too (all 83 of them :lol), so, again, it shouldn't be an issue.
The real issue is Mindflux being misguided enough to want to spend money on Tate's fiasco. :P
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The real issue is Mindflux being misguided enough to want to spend money on Tate's fiasco. :P
Meh. I've spent more then $10 on worse before..
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I'm curious about both, but I desperately, desperately want the real Queensryche to outsell Tateryche. It needs to be a landslide victory. I'll definitely be buying the new Queensryche. As for FU, I haven't really decided what I'm going to do.
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I'm with wolf on this one. I for one can't base my music collection on who is an asshole and who isn't. If that was the case, my collection would be redused quite abit. No more Skid Row and GnR for example. Tate is an ass based on the information provided no question. But I'm going to listen to this with an open mind. I've wanted heavy Queensryche for years. Now it seems there may be two heavy releases in the next couple months. The list of guest stars is very intriguing too.
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The real issue is Mindflux being misguided enough to want to spend money on Tate's fiasco. :P
Meh. I've spent more then $10 on worse before..
My thoughts exactly.
I'm with wolf on this one. I for one can't base my music collection on who is an asshole and who isn't. If that was the case, my collection would be redused quite abit. No more Skid Row and GnR for example. Tate is an ass based on the information provided no question. But I'm going to listen to this with an open mind. I've wanted heavy Queensryche for years. Now it seems there may be two heavy releases in the next couple months. The list of guest stars is very intriguing too.
Nicely said Jason, agree too. For me, I'd have to throw out all my Yngwie, Iced Earth, Megadeth, WASP etc. albums, and I'm sure as hell not gonna do that.
And yeah, we might get two decent metal albums out of this, or we may get one, or maybe none, who knows at this stage.
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There are "egos" and there are "assholes"....
"Egos" I can be a bit more passive about. But openly defiant gits??? Screw them. I got Appetite and Use Your Illusion for free (but legitimate) means, and I will not buy anything more from Axl Rose. Yngwie is another one that I wished I owned more from...but I just can't bring myself to do it because of what a colossal dick he is.
I haven't heard much nastiness from Skid Row. I've seen SB in some reality shows....he's more of an "ego"...not really a complete asshole, just a bit full of himself from time to time. (but you need *a bit* of that in a lead singer sometimes)
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The other thing people will point out is Tate's temper and his alleged assaults on band members. Putting your hands on somebody and assaulting them is never acceptable. But again, I can't go through my collection and remove albums containing members who have committed criminal offences. I think the Tate lead QR albums for the last decade have been sub par but will give this a chance at least.
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I'm with wolf on this one. I for one can't base my music collection on who is an asshole and who isn't. If that was the case, my collection would be redused quite abit. No more Skid Row and GnR for example. Tate is an ass based on the information provided no question. But I'm going to listen to this with an open mind. I've wanted heavy Queensryche for years. Now it seems there may be two heavy releases in the next couple months. The list of guest stars is very intriguing too.
Nicely said Jason, agree too. For me, I'd have to throw out all my Yngwie, Iced Earth, Megadeth, WASP etc. albums, and I'm sure as hell not gonna do that.
And yeah, we might get two decent metal albums out of this, or we may get one, or maybe none, who knows at this stage.
Yea, put me in that category, too. Rock stars are not exactly known for being the most humble and reasonable of people. If I had to throw out all my rock or metal albums which were made by pretentious, self-absorbed egomaniacs, I wouldn't have much left for listening! Hell, by those standards, I'd never be able to listen to classical music at all; Mozart and Beethoven were both insufferably selfish and narcissistic in life, and the less said about Wagner's social-political views, the better!
When Tate first got fired and the court documents started making their way to the internet (courtesy of Samsara's Breakdown Room, of course! :tup) I did get a bit heated about how Tate had blatantly abused his position as lead singer to marginalize the other guys and remake the band in his image. Combined with having to put up with a decade and a half of mediocre Queensryche albums, as well as Geoff's exceptionally shameful behaviour at the end of the QR tenure, I saw Geoff Tate as the root of everything that was wrong with Queensryche, and wanted nothing to do with him ever again. At this point though, I've cooled off a bit, and while I still whole Tate primarily responsible to the decline of QR, it should be noted that the other guys (DeGarmo included) allowed it to happen, so while Tate deserves most of the blame, not all of it should be placed on him alone.
So I will check out Geoff's "Queensryche" album, at least out of curiosity if nothing else. Since it has been written with Jason Slater, I think there is a chance it may turn out half-way decent, like O:M II and American Solider. However that is as high as my hopes will rise for that record. Maybe half of it will be genuinely good songs, but the rest I expect to be sappy tripe or awkward experimental ideas that just don't work. No matter who plays on it, Geoff's singing will most likely drag down any quality music there is to be found on the album. Considering that his voice has been of abysmal quality ever since Take Cover, even in the studio, I don't expect him to suddenly get his shit together vocally now.
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I'm with wolf on this one. I for one can't base my music collection on who is an asshole and who isn't. If that was the case, my collection would be redused quite abit. No more Skid Row and GnR for example. Tate is an ass based on the information provided no question. But I'm going to listen to this with an open mind. I've wanted heavy Queensryche for years. Now it seems there may be two heavy releases in the next couple months. The list of guest stars is very intriguing too.
In the abstract, I agree with you. But there is also a big difference, IMO, between just being a jerk, and being violent, abusive, and insulting to your bandmates and your fans. To physically assault his bandmates, to spit on his bandmates during the performance, which lasted well over an hour, and to do the same thing at subsequent shows, and to continue to this very day to brag about it and call his bandmates p*ssies, and to insult the fans (who had nothing to do with any of the above) p*ssies and tell them they suck, are not understandable actions that some people can easily dismiss. They are the antics of a low-class bully who is full of himself and has no respect for others who disagree with him. And they are the antics of a hypocrite who is acting 180 degrees contrary to the principles he has claimed to be all about for a long, long time.
That isn't to say that you or anyone else shouldn't buy the album or listen to the music if you want to. But for those of us that feel the way we do, there is more than good reason to NOT want to buy the album or listen to the music.
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They are the antics of a low-class bully who is full of himself and has no respect for others who disagree with him. And they are the antics of a hypocrite who is acting 180 degrees contrary to the principles he has claimed to be all about for a long, long time.
Does anyone know what the hell happened to him that made him behave this way, I wonder?
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They are the antics of a low-class bully who is full of himself and has no respect for others who disagree with him. And they are the antics of a hypocrite who is acting 180 degrees contrary to the principles he has claimed to be all about for a long, long time.
Does anyone know what the hell happened to him that made him behave this way, I wonder?
Success?
I still stand by my opinion but what bosk just posted makes you think again. While we have cooled off a bit, his actions still are below acceptable. I don't understand how the rest of them put up with this for so long. They should have nibbed it in the butt years ago when things started going wrong, and then it wouldn't be at the situation it is now.
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They are the antics of a low-class bully who is full of himself and has no respect for others who disagree with him. And they are the antics of a hypocrite who is acting 180 degrees contrary to the principles he has claimed to be all about for a long, long time.
Does anyone know what the hell happened to him that made him behave this way, I wonder?
Too much Insania wine? :P
As I said in the other thread, I don't even listen to QR but I've been following this soap opera out of curiosity. Tate has truly succeeded at making himself look like a douche - my sympathy goes to the other guys and I'll be surprised if Tate wins the court case.
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They are the antics of a low-class bully who is full of himself and has no respect for others who disagree with him. And they are the antics of a hypocrite who is acting 180 degrees contrary to the principles he has claimed to be all about for a long, long time.
Does anyone know what the hell happened to him that made him behave this way, I wonder?
I've talked to 2 or 3 people in the local Seattle media/radio who claim he's been this big of an ass since they interviewed him for the EP....so take that for what it's worth. He's really great at putting on his "game face" for meet and greets...but I personally met him (and the very cordial Whip) waiting to get backstage at a Kiss concert in 1988, and I can personally say that everything the Seattle media people had told me up to that point was absolutely true.
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I know some may not care, but Frequency Unknown (GT Queensryche) is on Amazon for $10.00 preorder.
F U
#16 in Hard Rock & Metal on Amazon:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/music/67207/ref=pd_zg_hrsr_m_1_2_last
lol u
Not sure if srs, but, for the record, I was just making a joke on the Frequency Unknown cover. Not trying to start beef. I see no problem with discussing Tate stuff here.
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Not sure if srs, but, for the record, I was just making a joke on the Frequency Unknown cover. Not trying to start beef. I see no problem with discussing Tate stuff here.
Oh I know.
:rollin
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They are the antics of a low-class bully who is full of himself and has no respect for others who disagree with him. And they are the antics of a hypocrite who is acting 180 degrees contrary to the principles he has claimed to be all about for a long, long time.
Does anyone know what the hell happened to him that made him behave this way, I wonder?
He saw this picture:
(https://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k34/Zook85/bunsen_honeydew_tateshoop3.jpg)
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Glen Drover
https://www.bravewords.com/news/200751
“The musical direction of where Geoff wanted to go wasn’t what I wanted to go forward with,” Drover explains. “I’m more into the first five Queensr˙che albums, the original template of the band. For me, when I think of the band, I think of those records.”
“I felt very bad about it,” he says of jumping ship, “and I wish I knew more about what their plans were before going to Seattle to take band photos. There was very little communication before the trip. In the end, I had to think about my future and I what I felt was right for me. I was on the fence when I got home from Seattle, but after speaking to a couple people that I trust who know what’s going on, it made my decision a lot easier.”
Drover’s team-up with Tate was buzz-worthy, but he made a much bigger noise when he performed with the La Torre-led outfit in his home town of Toronto on March 7th. More to the point, the fans went nuts – both positive and negative – when Drover referred to his scheduled guest appearance as “playing a song with the REAL Queensr˙che.” It sounded like he was taking a swipe at Tate, which he insists most certainly wasn’t the case.
“That was poor wording on my part,” says Drover. “I went on Twitter a day or two before the show in Toronto and posted that because I wanted to try and alleviate any confusion as to which Queensr˙che I was going to play with. What I should have said was maybe the ‘original’ Queensr˙che, or maybe nothing at all. As we all know, Geoff has gone off to do his version of the band, and then you still have the original Queensr˙che that exists with a new singer, as well as Parker, who has been in the band for a few years now. It wasn’t a slap at anyone in any way, shape or form. I have no problems with anybody on either side. It was the wrong choice of wording.”
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Both tactful and informative, and really, really awesome. Respect.
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Yeah, he seems like a really cool dude.
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Both Wilton and Drover have made references to "the first five" Queensryche albums. Do they mean the EP through Empire, or The Warning through Promised Land? I'm assuming the former, but . . .
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Yes, the former. The band has made that abundantly clear. I assume that is what Drover means also.
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Promised Land should definitely be included. Such a solid album.
A great "raw" vibe going though. Tate kinda hit a sweet point between cliche 80's vocals and boring DTC vocals.
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Drover sounds like a class act guy. :tup
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Promised Land should definitely be included. Such a solid album.
I agree, and the band does as well. But it was so obviously a huge departure from what they had previously done, and that is one of the reasons why the band for the first time saw its first dropoff in album sales and concert tickets with Promised Land. Right now, their focus is on getting back to their true roots, which is why they are focusing on the first five albums and calling it the "back to history" tour. But they have said they will play some Promised Land material in the future, which is good.
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Promised Land is considerably better than Empire.
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Promised Land is considerably better than Empire.
(https://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y280/bosk1/thepoint_zpse777c16a.png)
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I would rather them play songs from Promised Land than hear Jet City Woman again.
That help?
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I agree with you, but that still misses the point.
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No, because you are still completely missing the point (even if I, and likely others, agree with you).
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Regardless. I think it should be noted that Promised Land > Empire.
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Perfectly valid opinion, and one that I myself held for a long time.
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Held?
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Rage For Order > Promised Land/Operation Mindcrime >>>>>>>>Empire
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Held?
Yup. I still think it is a brilliant album. But after nearly 20 years, a couple of songs haven't quite held up as well as others. Although some pan Empire for its commercial aspirations, it succeeded in that regard and represents a band that was firing on all cylinders. It is great from start to finish. And I find myself gravitating nowadays toward its more positive, uplifting vibe than Promised Land's darkness and dispair. So as of recently, Empire just barely edges Promised Land out. But they are both very fine albums, to the point where it is almost silly to try to compare them or argue which is better. Kinda like comparing Steve Vai and Yngwie. They are both awesome--which one is "better" really just depends on what you subjectively find most appealing vs. there being any real measurable difference in quality.
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For me, Promised Land is almost as good as O:M as a whole.
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I'd take Empire over PL personally. I don't mind the commerciality aspect of it, and I don't mind the dark vibe of PL either (though I disliked it on release).
Empire doesn't contain anything as bad as Disconnected. PL feels a short album and there are too many average songs. Little did I know they would only get worse from then on...
HITNF has to be my biggest disappointment in music though.
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I was listening to Mindcrime last night with my fancy Sennheisers ($50, still way fancier than my RCA $5 pair which don't sound bad at all) and I was noticing so many more awesome bass lines. I love this album.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=6w4RfoUv9KU#!
Band had the song 'Redemption' showcased on Sirusxm last night, and put up a youtube link of the song.
It's really good! :metal
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If you think anything that Geoff has done in the last decade is even worthy of licking the choad of this song....you...are...high...
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I know I'm going into this album with both high hopes, but also a lot of reservations. The intro and the guitar tones used in it remind me of MCII, and that's certainly not a good thing. That's the only glaringly poor thing I found in this track. The pre-chorus (1:45) is probably the best part of the song and Todd's melodies through the chorus are really strong. Solo is pretty good and this is certainly a more organic "heavy" than the contrived heavy Tate has tried to pull at some points in the past. I find the song to be pretty good, but if this ends up being one of the best tracks on the album I might be disappointed.
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There's a couple of things in the track that I don't like, sonically speaking (I feel like a pretentious twat saying this), but it makes me feel pretty good. And I always go by what I feel. Sweet stuff.
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New song is pretty good I guess.
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Decent song.
Todd should sing more and spend less time trying to emulate Tate.
Also is it just me or is the sound quality awful? Like, far beyond typical Youtube badness?
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Wow. He really does sound like Geoff, doesn't he?
I'm a little disappointed by this. I mean, don't get me wrong, it's a damn sight better than most of the material on AS and D2C and it's a promising return to form in terms of style and technique but... I just don't really like the song. I'm still excited about the album and I have every faith that they'll release a real beauty but nothing really excites me about Redemption.
I think I was expecting an amazing 'blaze-of-glory' kind of return with the song. My expectations were too high.
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I'm kinda like you, and I think you'll agree with this sentiment.
The heaviness is there, the voice is there, but I just don't know if the quality is all there. This song certainly isn't an indicator of an album falling short or anything, but it's not raising my hopes for the full force awesomeness I was hoping for.
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Great follow-up to Promised Land.
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Hey now, as much as we wish we could blame Hear in the Now on Geoff unfortunately we have to acknowledge it as a classic QR record.
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The song is better than I expected. Strong, up-beat rocking opener of an album (I assume it's the opener at least). I like.
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Also is it just me or is the sound quality awful? Like, far beyond typical Youtube badness?
Sure seems that way to me. I was listening on my awful laptop speakers, but they sounded even more atrocious than usual.
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The heaviness is there, the voice is there, but I just don't know if the quality is all there.
This.
Regardless though, I'm still interested to hear the rest of the album.
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And just to help put what may seem overly critical from me going forward in perspective, this song already blows away pretty much any bit of music on Dedicated to Chaos.
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Will listen when I get home. I think it's normal to be a bit let down by something that has so much expectations. It always happen with my for my favourite bands. You always expect something that isn't there, but in time it shows it beauty. I predict before listening to this song, I want it to be one of the best things they have ever done, but due to the hype and expectations, my recation will be something like 'meh, not bad at all.'
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Okay, after my listen, I think this exceeded what I thought I would think from my last post. I think it's simply not bad at all. I don't really hear a problem with the production. It's a little muddy but we will wait to hear the cd. Todd sounds so much like Tate it's scary. The thing is, this sounds like Queensryche, when the chorus hit I it instantly reminded me of Promised Land which is a good thing. I do hope there are a lot better songs on the album, but it's a good start nevertheless.
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I enjoyed it. Sounded very solid and it seems like a song for me that will kind of grow as I get used to the new makeup of the band. Familiar yet different....
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I liked the chorus. There were some parts of the song that kind of made me go "um... what are they doing?" but it's still far, far better than anything they've been putting out recently.
Acceptable! :metal
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My thoughts:
Keep in mind that this is a VERY compressed YouTube stream. But that aside, this is, in my opinion, a really, really good song. This has everything I would want a Queensryche song to have. The only issues I have with it at all are production issues, namely: (1) The vocal effects, whatever they are, are a bit distracting. They may be more blatant here just because of the YouTube compression. And I may get used to them after several listens either way. But they feel a bit too heavy-handed to me. (2) The brick wall mastering. I am reminded of the Band Redemption's most recent album, This Mortal Coil, in that regard. I LOVE that album, but don't listen to it nearly as often as I otherwise might because the "loudness" of that album makes an otherwise great album a not-so-enjoyable listening experience. I hope this album doesn't end up the same.
But, again, those issues aside, this is an outstanding song. One thing I will mention that I haven't seen explicitly referenced elsewhere: I love the ATTITUDE in the vocals. Whether it is the normal verses, the spoken word part, or the soaring chorus, there is a ton of attitude in the way Todd is singing. Completely apart from the notes, he is selling what he is singing. Unfortuntely, with a few exceptions here and there, I have not heard that from anything that band has put out in a long time. I am not trying to fling undeserved criticism Tate's way (goodness knows a lot of criticism is deserved, but I also want to be mindful of just piling on for the sake of piling on), but the majority of his vocals for the past decade have really just sounded phoned in with no commitment or attitude, and I do not mean that merely with regard to the notes that are being sung. It is all about how they are being sung. Even aside from the notes, Todd delivers the attitude this song needs. This, to me, is crucial to why I like this. Yeah, I know the guys can play. And I've heard enough of what they have written through the years to know they can put decent song structures together. And I know Todd can hit the notes. But could they really bring the swagger and attitude to sell the music? That was my question. And it has been answered. If the reast of the album is remotely like this, I am definitely sold.
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Liked the song well enough. I'm not gonna sweat the sound or production issues whatsoever ... let's all remember the first release of Storytime late in 2011 - Annette sounded like a 12 year old boy before hitting puberty. By the time the album came out, it was cleaned up and much better.
Like Nick and other's have said, I fear I may have my expectations too high for this album. Based on this song, I'm trying to take those expectations down a notch. I bailed on QR after HITNF, so really have nothing to compare this against whether it's a vast improvement or not. I do think it's an improvement over anything on HITNF, but can't say whether it's a return to all their original glory or not.
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I bailed on QR after HITNF, so really have nothing to compare this against whether it's a vast improvement or not. I do think it's an improvement over anything on HITNF, but can't say whether it's a return to all their original glory or not.
Change HITNF to Q2K, and this is pretty much me. It sounds good compared to the QR songs I have heard here and there from the last 10+ years, and the vocals definitely sound like vintage Tate, but I am just not sure how good or interesting it really is. Based on this, I would absolutely not buy the forthcoming album, but we'll see.
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...can't say whether it's a return to all their original glory or not.
Not trying to be pedantic, but I just don't think "return to all their original glory" is the proper standard for a band that has been around 20 or 30 years. Not that they can't release something that is of equal or greater quality at that stage in their careers. A lot of bands can and do. But band's do change. And while this song reminds me in a lot of ways of things from Rage, Mindcrime, and Empire, and I may eventually decide that it is as good as the material from those albums, it is also different. To me, it's less about "returning to former glory" than it is about building on that original formula for success, but doing so in a way that sounds relevant and good by today's standards.
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...can't say whether it's a return to all their original glory or not.
Not trying to be pedantic, but I just don't think "return to all their original glory" is the proper standard for a band that has been around 20 or 30 years. Not that they can't release something that is of equal or greater quality at that stage in their careers. A lot of bands can and do. But band's do change. And while this song reminds me in a lot of ways of things from Rage, Mindcrime, and Empire, and I may eventually decide that it is as good as the material from those albums, it is also different. To me, it's less about "returning to former glory" than it is about building on that original formula for success, but doing so in a way that sounds relevant and good by today's standards.
Fair enough. Perhaps I worded it inaccurately, but I guess I look at it a little like DT and ADTOE. Depending on who you talk to, the four releases up to ADTOE were/are generally considered weak efforts - clearly, nowhere near as weak as what QR went through. With ADTOE, I believe most feel it was a 'return' to a much higher level of quality - on par (almost) with some of their best albums. I think that's what I was trying to say about my expectations with QR... I'm hoping for something that comes closer to what they put out on their first 5-6 albums.
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The more I listen to the song, the more it grows on me. As bosk pointed out - I love the attitude of Todd's vocals and the song itself. They are all selling it quite well and it's been quite some time since a Ryche song has made me just want to fucking rock out and enjoy the song.
Todd does sound like Tate a lot in here most of the time, but I never actually picture GT singing this in my mind. Hell, the next time I hear one of the old Ryche songs I'll probably visualize Todd instead and to me that says quite a lot.
We all saw how they look like they are having fun and want to be on stage in live shows, but this to me sounds like they want to write music again - I can just picture them in the studio brainstorming ideas back and forth, interrupting themselves and so on from excitement. Whereas before it felt like "Oh well, we have a contract, we better put out another album next year...sigh". Love the riffage, love the pounding drums and the mixture from "classic" floating melodies to some more odd ones that seem to be more Todd's thing. Maybe all this is in my head, but if one single song can do that to a fan who's only reason to listening to the band's new albums was to see just how far that train wreck can go... they did their job very, very well.
I really hope it's the YT clip, but the production is the only minus in the song so far. It makes my speakers hiss when I increase the volume a bit, which they very rarely do - only when I'm really pushing them.
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Oh yes indeedy. That's a great start. Best thing QR have done since PL without a 2nd thought. That's not saying alot but I'm finally looking forward to a QR album instead of dreading it like I have for the last 20 years.
nine more songs of this quality (at least one epic) and I'll be a happy boy. Thanks for being a tool recently Geoff because without that we'd be stuck with shitty Tateryche churning out Jason Slater written pap with you meeowing over it.
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Sounds pretty damn good to me :)
I don't for a minute think they'll manage to put out an album as good as when Wilton-DeGarmo-Tate were all working coherently as a team of writers as they did for the first few albums, but Wilton was a big part of that team and he's barely been involved in the writing since Empire, so if this is the kind of stuff he's capable of without Tate there to block him then it'll do me.
For the first time since Q2Krap I'm genuinely looking forward to a Queensryche album.
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I wouldn't worry about the quality. A fan illegally ripped the Sirius broadcast and put that up on YouTube. Sounds light years better and is not brickwalled. There are comparison images of the wave forums on The Breakdown Room forum in the thread about "Redemption."
The short of it is -- CM compressed the shit out of it before uploading to YouTube. The actual recording seems like it will be fine. :)
I dig the song. It sounds like Queensryche...with a modern twist. Exactly what I was hoping. LOVE the huge chorus and love the honesty and grit in Todd's delivery.
I could nitpick a couple things (and mentioned them over at The Breakdown Room), but overall a big thumbs up. Great things ahead for the one and only Queensryche.
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I'm digging the new track more and more. The CenturyMedia YouTube version is too loud and distorted though. I wasn't fully digging the song until I heard the proper version played on the radio. I'm beyond psyched to see what the rest of the album has in store for us. This is a great start!
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I've found myself frequently humming the new track too in the past couple of days.
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I was afraid that the new song would suck, but it has far exceeded my expectations. :metal
Can't wait until the album's released!
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And here's the TateRyche single, Cold (which is rather good, but the rest of the samples from the album are abysmal, imo)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzDJHuxBTUw
Nice melodies, OK lyrics, meh singing, a bit too long and radio-friendly but not bad by any means. Pleasantly surprised by the tune. Still, I prefer the direction of Redemption by a light year. I bet if Todd covers "Cold" he will nail it so much better than Tate.
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And here's the TateRyche single, Cold (which is rather good, but the rest of the samples from the album are abysmal, imo)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzDJHuxBTUw
You're a bit late bro.
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Oh. Sorry then. Well, bump? xD
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Take Hold from Belguim: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTYgprxgRxk
It doesn't have microphone licking but still worth the watch, imo. :P
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Outstanding!
So, it looks like they are doing a piece of info or art a day from here on out, according the official QR facebook page - www.facebook.com/queensrycheofficial
(https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/733834_296846270448532_1195870886_n.jpg)
Cool, fun way to promote the album and generate interest in their Facebook page.
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I hope the middle of the cover is a fist with rings that spell out LOL on them.
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Yeah it should say 'lol Tate'
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I hope the middle of the cover is a fist with rings that spell out LOL on them.
:lol
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I hope the middle of the cover is a fist with rings that spell out LOL on them.
I think it's actually going to say "FU2"
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I hope the middle of the cover is a fist with rings that spell out LOL on them.
Totally stealing this.
:tup
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Here's someting nice to wash away some of the recent TateWrëck footage.
https://vimeo.com/49720346
This was the first show they did under the Queensryche name with Todd. They are certainly not the best or tightest shows they have done with Todd, since there have been MANY since then. But still very good, and the pro-shot footage is NICE.
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Oooh shiny.
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Here's someting nice to wash away some of the recent TateWrëck footage.
https://vimeo.com/49720346
This was the first show they did under the Queensryche name with Todd. They are certainly not the best or tightest shows they have done with Todd, since there have been MANY since then. But still very good, and the pro-shot footage is NICE.
I just finished watching the full video. Todd was a little rough in spots, but he was still far superior to anything that Geoff has sounded like in years. It's been awhile since I've seen the band live other than the random video clip here and there. I needed that video to remind me how much I love watching Scott play. The guy isn't flashy. He's just a solid and very entertaining player and he deserves more recognition than he usually gets.
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So based on the bits of cover art the band has put up so far, what are you guys thinking? Self-titled album? With how big the symbol is looking to be, doesn't seem to be much room left for an album title.
(https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/486801_297591707040655_26282280_n.jpg)
By the way, I'm pretty sure my local record store ordered 0 copies of the Frequency Unknown. Not in the Queensryche section, not in the "new albums" section. Is the album online-sale only? Because given how in-the-know the employees are, I wouldn't put it past them to straight up refuse to sell that album. I've been buying from these guys for years and it seems like something they'd do. (One of them actually gave me a look of disapproval back when I bought Dedicated To Chaos.) :lol
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They just revealed more of it.
(https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/BlobVanDam/queensryche.jpg)
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:lol
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Gold.
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:biggrin:
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Just listened to Redemption. If its anywhere near the best song on the album, this album will suck too.
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Just listened to Redemption. If its anywhere near the best song on the album, this album will suck too.
I think it may be more the single. And have you ever heard a single as being the best song on an album? Sometimes, the choice of a single buggers me.
B.Lee
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They just revealed more of it.
(https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/BlobVanDam/queensryche.jpg)
:lol When the whole thing's revealed, you need to post your finished version on their Facebook page.
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They just revealed more of it.
(https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/BlobVanDam/queensryche.jpg)
:lol When the whole thing's revealed, you need to post your finished version on their Facebook page.
I second that. :tup
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Just listened to Redemption. If its anywhere near the best song on the album, this album will suck too.
I think it may be more the single. And have you ever heard a single as being the best song on an album? Sometimes, the choice of a single buggers me.
B.Lee
I understand that, B. But I while I think this album will be better than the Tate one, I still don't know if it's gonna be any good. Redemption has only cemented that thought.
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:lol When the whole thing's revealed, you need to post your finished version on their Facebook page.
It looks like someone already posted it on their FB page. Who was that? :lol
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The worst about all of this fighting over the Queensryche name nonsense is this:
There are currently two versions of the band, and neither of them has Chris DeGarmo. :facepalm: :facepalm:
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Last teaser before revelation :
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/5272_298163706983455_339009519_n.jpg)
B.Lee
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Just listened to Redemption. If its anywhere near the best song on the album, this album will suck too.
I think it may be more the single. And have you ever heard a single as being the best song on an album? Sometimes, the choice of a single buggers me.
B.Lee
I understand that, B. But I while I think this album will be better than the Tate one, I still don't know if it's gonna be any good. Redemption has only cemented that thought.
I second that. Redemption has only mildly got me interested. Idk, but there is something missing in there.
B.Lee
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The worst about all of this fighting over the Queensryche name nonsense is this:
There are currently two versions of the band, and neither of them has Chris DeGarmo. :facepalm: :facepalm:
You said it. :(
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Wow, I never thought of it that way, but that is indeed the worst part about this. You'd think he'd be in one or the other. What's he even doing these days?
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Is he still flying planes?
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Whoa, I had no idea. From Wikipedia:
Around the time of leaving Queensr˙che, DeGarmo began a full-time career as a professional corporate jet pilot. He holds an Airline Transport Pilot Licence, which he acquired during Queensr˙che's most commercially successful years as well as CL-30 (Challenger 300), LR-JET (Learjet), IA-Jet (Westwind) and LR-45 (Learjet 45) type ratings from the FAA.
It goes on to list some musical projects he's done post-Queensr˙che, nothing more recent than 2007.
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https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=298698933596599&set=a.183090515157442.43082.163601033773057&type=1
Our publicist wanted us to wait until his press release went out, but we were so excited to show you all we couldn't wait!! So here you go!!
QUEENSRźCHE RETURN WITH NEW SELF-TITLED ALBUM SLATED FOR RELEASE ON JUNE 25th ON CENTURY MEDIA!!
This gets said often by a lot of bands, but we believe we have recorded some of our finest music in years. The collaborative effort of everyone on this album is something we are extremely proud of. Working with Jimbo and the addition of Todd has revitalized the band in ways we never knew until we heard the final results. We know you have to wait a little longer but are excited for all of our fans to hear it. Queensr˙che wouldn’t be in this position if not for your unwavering support!!
~ Scott Rockenfield.
The track listing for Queensr˙che is:
1. X2
2. Where Dreams Go To Die
3. Spore
4. In This Light
5. Redemption
6. Vindication
7. Midnight Lullaby
8. A World Without
9. Don’t Look Back
10. Fallout
11. Open Road
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/65621_298698933596599_1205646546_n.jpg)
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I am not a fan of bands releasing self-titled albums when it isn't their first, but whatever.
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Why? ???
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but we believe we have recorded some of our finest music in years.
That ain't too tough.
I am not a fan of bands releasing self-titled albums when it isn't their first, but whatever.
Yeah, it seems kinda stupid to do so after 10 albums under your belt already, but I ain't bothered by it. They coulda done something more with the title, and the cover for that matter. Blob... uncover your last few squares. I want that album cover.
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I think the self titled aspect probably has something to do with this being a new beginning. A fresh start and all that...
Personal thoughts? That is one tasty looking tracklisting. Intrigued to hear some of these songs.
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Yeah, it seems kinda stupid to do so after 10 albums under your belt already, but I ain't bothered by it. They coulda done something more with the title, and the cover for that matter. Blob... uncover your last few squares. I want that album cover.
:lol Here you go. I even swapped in the final cover.
https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/BlobVanDam/queensryche_nou.jpg
And I agree with Kev. To me it feels either lazy, or presumptuous to make an album self titled when it's not your first.
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I think the self titled aspect probably has something to do with this being a new beginning. A fresh start and all that...
I'm OK with it here too. Kind of like driving home the point that THEY are Queensryche.
Personal thoughts? That is one tasty looking tracklisting.
Midnight Lullaby? :lol
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When a band does it later on in their career, it's generally a restatement. They've gone through some changes, but they're still Queensr˙che. Spock's Beard did it, Genesis did it, Fleetwood Mac did it twice (both times after major changes), the list goes on and on.
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Midnight Lullaby? :lol
OK, well, for the most part. :lol
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Yeah, it seems kinda stupid to do so after 10 albums under your belt already, but I ain't bothered by it. They coulda done something more with the title, and the cover for that matter. Blob... uncover your last few squares. I want that album cover.
:lol Here you go. I even swapped in the final cover.
https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/BlobVanDam/queensryche_nou.jpg
YES
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Midnight Lullaby? :lol
OK, well, for the most part. :lol
Personally, I think it's a bit silly to read too much into song titles before the songs are actually heard. I mean, can anyone honestly say they would have thought "Best I Can" or "Silent Lucidity" would have been cool songs based just on the titles?
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I absolutely applaud that they went self-titled. That is where they needed to go. For what it's worth, I thought that's where DT needed to go for DT11. QR's confidence level right now is contagious.
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Midnight Lullaby? :lol
OK, well, for the most part. :lol
Personally, I think it's a bit silly to read too much into song titles before the songs are actually heard. I mean, can anyone honestly say they would have thought "Best I Can" or "Silent Lucidity" would have been cool songs based just on the titles?
Umm , Bosk, they're not cool songs! Well Best I Can is anyways. ;D
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Midnight Lullaby? :lol
OK, well, for the most part. :lol
Personally, I think it's a bit silly to read too much into song titles before the songs are actually heard. I mean, can anyone honestly say they would have thought "Best I Can" or "Silent Lucidity" would have been cool songs based just on the titles?
"Silent Lucidity" sounds cool. "Midnight Lullaby" doesn't.
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Silent Lucidity is awesome, and I will throw down with anyone who says otherwise. :biggrin:
As for the self-titled thing, why do I not like it? Because I don't. Maybe I have been conditioned to think that only debut albums should be self-titled since 99% of the self-titled albums likely are debut albums (and I am aware of the exceptions), but there it is. ;)
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I don't like self-titled albums either, and, I guess like Kev, don't have a good reason. I would even prefer that debut albums have a name.
I do like the build-up the guys are working on with this release. While minor, and irrelevent if the music sucks, the album cover reveal was neat.
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When a band does it later on in their career, it's generally a restatement. They've gone through some changes, but they're still Queensr˙che. Spock's Beard did it, Genesis did it, Fleetwood Mac did it twice (both times after major changes), the list goes on and on.
Michael Schenker did it with just about every album :lol
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When a band does it later on in their career, it's generally a restatement. They've gone through some changes, but they're still Queensr˙che. Spock's Beard did it, Genesis did it, Fleetwood Mac did it twice (both times after major changes), the list goes on and on.
Michael Schenker did it with just about every album :lol
Yeah! He's done it a few times. :lol
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I think the self titled aspect probably has something to do with this being a new beginning. A fresh start and all that...
Personal thoughts? That is one tasty looking tracklisting. Intrigued to hear some of these songs.
I agree. This is a new beginning and a fresh start. It just drives home the point that they are the one and only Queensryche; accept no imitations.
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Personally, I think it's a bit silly to read too much into song titles before the songs are actually heard. I mean, can anyone honestly say they would have thought "Best I Can" or "Silent Lucidity" would have been cool songs based just on the titles?
Well, yeah. Obviously it'd be silly to put any real stock in something like that. I just think it kind of fun to speculate what the songs could conceivably sound like based on their titles, s'all.
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I am not a fan of bands releasing self-titled albums when it isn't their first, but whatever.
It's hard to explain, but I feel the same way.
Edit: And even though I'm sure Tate loves his childish F.U. title I think he's kicking himself now for not going the self-titled route.
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When a band does it later on in their career, it's generally a restatement. They've gone through some changes, but they're still Queensr˙che. Spock's Beard did it, Genesis did it, Fleetwood Mac did it twice (both times after major changes), the list goes on and on.
Michael Schenker did it with just about every album :lol
Yeah, and Peter Gabriel did it for his first three. He was gonna do the fourth one as well, but the label insisted on a title, at least for the U.S. release. That's why they all have similar covers, with the name and the font the same. For his fifth album, he finally broke the mold, but used the shortest word he could think of at the time: "So".
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Eh, I'm a bit torn on the self titled thing also, especially since the first EP is always referred to as self titled.
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:lol When the whole thing's revealed, you need to post your finished version on their Facebook page.
It looks like someone already posted it on their FB page. Who was that? :lol
I confess....it was me. Didn't mean to steal anyone's thunder...just thought it was funny.
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Called it.
Anyway, I have two rules for self-titled albums: either do it for the debut, or do it when you're redefining yourself and doing it as a statement (i.e. changed your sound, had a major line-up change, returned after a long-ass hiatus). I'm fine with them doing this.
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Who here used to be an old school QR fan from the 80's and 90's and now can't stand what they've become? I don't have the slightest bit of interest in this band anymore. Haven't for quite some time. I want the old QR back. Wishful thinking. I'll just have to break out the classics and be thankful I still have those.
:2metal:
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Who here used to be an old school QR fan from the 80's and 90's and now can't stand what they've become? I don't have the slightest bit of interest in this band anymore. Haven't for quite some time. I want the old QR back. Wishful thinking. I'll just have to break out the classics and be thankful I still have those.
:2metal:
I echo the initial statement but I'm hopeful of a decent album from what's left of the real QR.
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Who here used to be an old school QR fan from the 80's and 90's and now can't stand what they've become? I don't have the slightest bit of interest in this band anymore. Haven't for quite some time. I want the old QR back. Wishful thinking. I'll just have to break out the classics and be thankful I still have those.
:2metal:
I heard QotR when it was played on KZOK for the first time....that's about as old school as it can get. I can't stand what they *became* under Geoff Tate's direction...but I am VERY PROUD of where they are at this moment. I only wish they had ousted Geoff sooner. The guy has had this reputation in the Seattle area since the EP (in other words, fame didn't do this to him...he's ALWAYS been that way). As long as he was the greatest voice in rock, most people were willing to overlook it. But once the talent was gone...what was the point?
I think the new album is going to kick ALL KINDS of ass, and it will be the first time QR will be a "first day" purchase for me in a *very* long time.
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Who here used to be an old school QR fan from the 80's and 90's and now can't stand what they've become? I don't have the slightest bit of interest in this band anymore. Haven't for quite some time. I want the old QR back. Wishful thinking. I'll just have to break out the classics and be thankful I still have those.
:2metal:
...I can't stand what they *became* under Geoff Tate's direction...but I am VERY PROUD of where they are at this moment. I only wish they had ousted Geoff sooner.
This. Now that Geoff is out, there is not reason to not be able to "stand what they've become." If Redemption is any indication, what they are doing now is on par with the classics. And their live show is definitely up to par. I have no issue with the current state of the band whatsoever.
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I can't stand what they *became* under Geoff Tate's direction...but I am VERY PROUD of where they are at this moment. I only wish they had ousted Geoff sooner.
100x this.
I'll be stunned (and delighted) if the new lineup puts out anything as good as their early output, but I'll also be surprised if they put out something that's not better than Mindcrime II, American Soldier, Dedicated To Chaos and FU and that doesn't sound a hell of a lot more like classic Queensryche than any of the recent efforts.
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My expectations for this album are something in the Promised Land range of quality. Not expecting anything as good as Rage/Mindcrime/Empire, but definitely expecting miles of improvement over the Q2K and Mindcrime II debacles.
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My expectations for this album are something in the Promised Land range of quality. Not expecting anything as good as Rage/Mindcrime/Empire, but definitely expecting miles of improvement over the Q2K and Mindcrime II debacles.
Yeah, that's reasonable.
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My expectations are extremely high for this one. Maybe it's because QR has released disappointment after disappointment and this is pretty much their last chance.
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My expectations are extremely high for this one. Maybe it's because QR has released disappointment after disappointment and this is pretty much their last chance.
But "last chance" for what? I mean, I had written them off in the past, and didn't buy DtC (well, I did eventually find a used copy for a couple of bucks WAY after the release date, but you get what I'm saying). No interest in buying their material. No interest in their live show. Nothing. Because I knew they couldn't deliver anything I was interested in, and they had consistently proven that over a long period of time and had finally gotten to the point where it was clear they had no intention or ability of delivering anything I was interested in with Tate at the helm.
In a way, I guess I'd have to say I can't really view this as a "last chance" kind of album because, even if it ends up not being very good, they are doing things that I am intersted in again. Let's assume the worst and say that Redemption is the only decent song on the album, and the rest of it just falls short. I'd still follow them because (1) I've seen a desire to deliver things that I like, and I'd be willing to give them a bit more time to see if they find their way in terms of writing new music that interests me, and (2) they've shown that they can bring the goods in a live setting again, and I am now re-interested in seeing them live again.
But I don't really believe they'll deliver a bad or even a mediocre album. Honestly, I'm not so optimistic as to believe that Redemption is the worst song on the album and that the rest of it will blow my mind. But I like Redemption a lot. And if it is a fair representation of what the album will sound like (and I think it likely is), I am confident I will like the album a lot, even if Redemption is just kind of middle of the road for the album, and there are some songs that are as good, and some songs that don't measure up. That will still be a "good album" in my opinion. And that's fine. I don't expect Queensryche to be my favorite band anymore, and I don't really care. If they put out good albums again, that'll be just fine with me. And I think they're capable of doing that.
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For me, the "last chance" is already expired, so this album is more like a second life for QR. While I'm sure it'll be better than DtC, if it's just as dull as American Soldier or Mindcrime II I won't be impressed enough to continue following the band.
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For me, the "last chance" is already expired, so this album is more like a second life for QR. While I'm sure it'll be better than DtC, if it's just as dull as American Soldier or Mindcrime II I won't be impressed enough to continue following the band.
I agree, Perp.
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I guess I kind of see what you are saying. But to take American Soldier as an example, IMO, the only things that album were lacking were (1) enthusiasm, and (2) good vocals. Add those two things to the mix, and you have an outstanding album, IMO. They've already proven to me that this lineup can deliver the enthusiasm and the solid vocals. So if they give me something where the writing is on par with American Soldier with those two elements added, and I'll be thrilled.
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My expectations are extremely high for this one. Maybe it's because QR has released disappointment after disappointment and this is pretty much their last chance.
But "last chance" for what? I mean, I had written them off in the past, and didn't buy DtC (well, I did eventually find a used copy for a couple of bucks WAY after the release date, but you get what I'm saying). No interest in buying their material. No interest in their live show. Nothing. Because I knew they couldn't deliver anything I was interested in, and they had consistently proven that over a long period of time and had finally gotten to the point where it was clear they had no intention or ability of delivering anything I was interested in with Tate at the helm.
In a way, I guess I'd have to say I can't really view this as a "last chance" kind of album because, even if it ends up not being very good, they are doing things that I am intersted in again. Let's assume the worst and say that Redemption is the only decent song on the album, and the rest of it just falls short. I'd still follow them because (1) I've seen a desire to deliver things that I like, and I'd be willing to give them a bit more time to see if they find their way in terms of writing new music that interests me, and (2) they've shown that they can bring the goods in a live setting again, and I am now re-interested in seeing them live again.
But I don't really believe they'll deliver a bad or even a mediocre album. Honestly, I'm not so optimistic as to believe that Redemption is the worst song on the album and that the rest of it will blow my mind. But I like Redemption a lot. And if it is a fair representation of what the album will sound like (and I think it likely is), I am confident I will like the album a lot, even if Redemption is just kind of middle of the road for the album, and there are some songs that are as good, and some songs that don't measure up. That will still be a "good album" in my opinion. And that's fine. I don't expect Queensryche to be my favorite band anymore, and I don't really care. If they put out good albums again, that'll be just fine with me. And I think they're capable of doing that.
Great post Bosk1 :tup
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For me personally, this is a chance for QR to redeem themselves and be currently relevant. I view QR from the EP to Promised Land as one of the coolest bands on the planet. Everything that's been released since, I can take or leave and not care too much. I want this release to be a continuation in some ways of Promised Land and something I can be exited for. In the last year I have never watched more YouTube clips that I have with the TLT lead QR. I have been very impressed and that gives me hope that this release will redeem the name Queensryche to the metal community. Because let's be honest, the name QR has taken a beating. IMO the band would've officially died if they stayed with Tate; so this was the only choice to start over.
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My expectations are extremely high for this one. Maybe it's because QR has released disappointment after disappointment and this is pretty much their last chance.
But "last chance" for what? I mean, I had written them off in the past, and didn't buy DtC (well, I did eventually find a used copy for a couple of bucks WAY after the release date, but you get what I'm saying). No interest in buying their material. No interest in their live show. Nothing. Because I knew they couldn't deliver anything I was interested in, and they had consistently proven that over a long period of time and had finally gotten to the point where it was clear they had no intention or ability of delivering anything I was interested in with Tate at the helm.
In a way, I guess I'd have to say I can't really view this as a "last chance" kind of album because, even if it ends up not being very good, they are doing things that I am intersted in again. Let's assume the worst and say that Redemption is the only decent song on the album, and the rest of it just falls short. I'd still follow them because (1) I've seen a desire to deliver things that I like, and I'd be willing to give them a bit more time to see if they find their way in terms of writing new music that interests me, and (2) they've shown that they can bring the goods in a live setting again, and I am now re-interested in seeing them live again.
But I don't really believe they'll deliver a bad or even a mediocre album. Honestly, I'm not so optimistic as to believe that Redemption is the worst song on the album and that the rest of it will blow my mind. But I like Redemption a lot. And if it is a fair representation of what the album will sound like (and I think it likely is), I am confident I will like the album a lot, even if Redemption is just kind of middle of the road for the album, and there are some songs that are as good, and some songs that don't measure up. That will still be a "good album" in my opinion. And that's fine. I don't expect Queensryche to be my favorite band anymore, and I don't really care. If they put out good albums again, that'll be just fine with me. And I think they're capable of doing that.
Very well said, sir. Also, your post said what I'm going to say next, but I'm putting it into different terms. This feels like hungry band again.
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Queensryche was in L.A. last night, and their label did a private listening party at the Viper Club in West Hollywood, followed by a short performance by the band. It was mostly for "insiders," but a few fans were let in as well. A couple of Breakdown Room regulars were posting about going, and from what I understand, the band's management and lawyer saw the posts and personally went out to get those fans into the venue. Major props to the band for making that happen. Early reviews of the songs on the album are VERY positive.
Here's an unofficial set list (may not be complete, and may be out of order--it was just from memory after the fact from one of the two fans who attended):
Queen of the Ryche
Walk In The Shadows
The Whisper
En Force
Warning
Needle Lies
Redemption (new song from the forthcoming album)
Take Hold of the Flame
Eyes of a Stranger
Empire
If you want to read more about it: https://www.anybodylistening.net/breakdownroom/index.php?topic=4209.0
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That's a nice set list, but it strikes me as having the same problem that a lot of set lists by older bands have: it is basically all songs that are 20+ years old and then one or two token new songs. It is like the band is acknowledging, "Yes, all of our best stuff was decades ago, and we are way past our prime." I am not saying they should play any of the crap they have released in the last 15 years, just that at face value, that is how that set list comes across to me.
If the new stuff they wrote is really good at all, why aren't they playing more of it? The easy argument would be, "They don't want fans to hear the rest until the album drops," and that might be fine, but considering how many fans they have lost over the years, they could use some good buzz to get some excitement going for the new record, and people talking about multiple new songs that sound great live could only work in their favor, no?
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They're going to start playing more of the new songs. Remember, this was just a private listening party 6 weeks before the album even drops.
this was an invite only show for Century Media people...
Viper Room was cool....but SMALL!!! I think max capacity was about 175, but there were close to 300 people crammed in there! Scott & Todd hit the stage, thank everyone for coming out and supporting them...then announce they're going to spin the new CD, and then the band will come out and play a short set.
I don't think they've learned the new stuff well enough to play it yet. But they've said they plan to play the new stuff. This was primarily for insiders to hear the entire album now that mixing and mastering is done, and for the band to come out and jam a bit. I see your bigger point, but I don't think this particular set list is an indication of any unwillingness to play the new stuff. They will play it.
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Not sure if this is the new or old twitter, but the one that the official band holds has 30k followers https://twitter.com/queensryche
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That's the real twitter.
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Who here used to be an old school QR fan from the 80's and 90's and now can't stand what they've become? I don't have the slightest bit of interest in this band anymore. Haven't for quite some time. I want the old QR back. Wishful thinking. I'll just have to break out the classics and be thankful I still have those.
:2metal:
I echo the initial statement but I'm hopeful of a decent album from what's left of the real QR.
I'll probably get the new album only out of curiousity. Just to be able to say that I listened to it at least once. If it turns out to be a decent album within the genre of hard rock and heavy metal, then fine. I have no hopes whatsoever of it being anywhere close to the level that the real Queensryche had once attained. In my mind, the real Queensryche doesn't exist anymore.
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In my mind, the real Queensryche doesn't exist anymore.
Your mind is defective.
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Isn't that Sam's point of view?
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Who is Sam?
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In my mind, the real Queensryche doesn't exist anymore.
I can understand and sympathize with that to a certain extent, but here's the thing: If we define "Queensryche" as the original lineup that made the classic albums, then that band stopped existing back in 1997, after Chris DeGarmo left, with a very brief reunion in 2003 for the Tribe album. I mean, there were a lot of very crucial factors that made the classic QR sound besides just Geoff Tate's voice, and CDG's writing and playing styles were certainly among them. So if we are going to define Queensryche as just the original incarnation of that band, then we also have to exclude albums like Q2K, Operation :Mindcrime II, American Solider, and Dedicated To Chaos, since they did not have the original lineup, and therefore were missing key ingredients of the original QR songwriting formula. But those albums are out there, and they exist as part of the Queensryche discography. You and I may not like that fact, but that is the reality of the situation. So long before Todd came into the picture, the QR legacy was already marred by over a decade of half-assed records.
In an ideal world, I think Whip, EdBass, and Scott Rock would have just formed a new band with Todd, bringing along Parker to complete the lineup. I also think Geoff would have just left and started a solo career waaaaay before this split finally happened. Remember, he did put out a solo album back in 2002, and at that time he certainly expressed a lack of interest in continuing with Queensryche. Unfortunately, in the real world, simply establishing a new band can be difficult, so both Geoff and Whip/Ed/Scott would naturally want to use the QR name for their future projects. The last three albums were basically just Geoff Tate solo albums anyways, with the Queensryche name just slapped on the cover, and the other guys just making token appearances to justify calling them "Queensryche."
In my mind, Geoff has had control over the QR name for long enough, and he and his wife have run it into the ground with their hair-brained schemes. Considering also Geoff's abusive behavior towards his band-mates, and the fact that, officially anyways, Geoff, Whip, Ed, and Scott are all equal owners in the Queensryche corporation, I feel the other three guys are perfectly within their rights to give Geoff the boot and continue on without him. They still form the majority of the remaining original lineup, so they should rightly be considered the successors to the Queensryche legacy. The next album with Todd may not be "Queensryche" in the classic sense, but I feel Whip, Ed and Scott are much more deserving of ownership of the name then Geoff, and I also feel that they will be able to make an album that does more justice to the Queensryche name then Geoff has with his abominable FU album.
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Who is Sam?
isn't it obvious?
(https://www.mastermousepatrol.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/pretendingtofarm.typepad.com.jpg)
I mean, he even has a sign.
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In my mind, the real Queensryche doesn't exist anymore.
Your mind is defective.
It's just my opinion. Personal attacks are uncalled for. You of all people should know that.
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"That's what he does! That's ALL he does!"
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It's Wot We Do.
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Just in case anyone has not FB 'liked' them ...
PRE-ORDERS START TODAY!!!! If you'd like to get your pre-order today, please go to the following links and take your pick!!!
Deluxe + shirt and poster: https://www.cmdistro.com/Item/Queensryche_-_-Queensryche-_-Deluxe_Edition-_CD_+_Shirt_+_Autographed_Poster_-PRE-ORDER-/PKG001538
Standard + deluxe and poster:
https://www.cmdistro.com/Item/Queensryche_-_-Queensryche-_-Standard-_CD_+_Shirt_+_Autographed_Poster_-PRE-ORDER-/PKG001537
Deluxe CD:
https://www.cmdistro.com/Item/Queensryche_-_Queensryche_-Deluxe_Edition-_-PRE-ORDER-/45492
Standard CD:
https://www.cmdistro.com/Item/Queensryche_-_Queensryche_-PRE-ORDER-/45491
DELUXE BOX SET EDITION CD (North America only) and includes the following bonus tracks:
· Queen Of The Reich (live)
· En Force (live)
· Prophecy (live)
Housed in a small box with a patch, sticker, guitar pick and button pack.
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Who is Sam?
Samsara?
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I was reading the Facebook comments in the pre-order post, and found this little gem:
You should send us this set for free after making us suffer through "Frequency Unknown". What a trainwreck. I thought Queensryche could do no wrong, love 'em.. but this album makes me want to stab myself in the ears and punch babies.
Some people still don't know, I guess. :lol
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I was reading the Facebook comments in the pre-order post, and found this little gem:
You should send us this set for free after making us suffer through "Frequency Unknown". What a trainwreck. I thought Queensryche could do no wrong, love 'em.. but this album makes me want to stab myself in the ears and punch babies.
Some people still don't know, I guess. :lol
I have to believe that is sarcasm. I think I remember hearing the same kind of comment on DtC.
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That's exactly what Tate wanted to happen, what a shithead.
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I have to believe that is sarcasm. I think I remember hearing the same kind of comment on DtC.
God I hope it is.
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I have to believe that is sarcasm. I think I remember hearing the same kind of comment on DtC.
God I hope it is.
It was probably Rudy Sarzo that posted that comment. :lol
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If you go to their distro page on Facebook and like the page, you get an instant 10% coupon for your purchase: https://www.facebook.com/cmdistro/app_312457232186622
Trying to decide what to get. I usually don't do pre-orders, but the package looks pretty good. I'm defintely getting the deluxe CD, as I want the bonus tracks. CD only is $13, which is reasonable. So for an extram $14, I get a shirt I will wear and a poster that I don't care much about, but can either keep, give away, or Ebay. I think I'll have to get the package...
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If you go to their distro page on Facebook and like the page, you get an instant 10% coupon for your purchase: https://www.facebook.com/cmdistro/app_312457232186622
Trying to decide what to get. I usually don't do pre-orders, but the package looks pretty good. I'm defintely getting the deluxe CD, as I want the bonus tracks. CD only is $13, which is reasonable. So for an extram $14, I get a shirt I will wear and a poster that I don't care much about, but can either keep, give away, or Ebay. I think I'll have to get the package...
I'm in the same boat. $14 for a T-shirt... good deal, considering I spent $30 at the venue for the concert shirt.
Thanks for the tip on the 10% discount.
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I'm keeping the poster. I mean, it's autographed, right? Might even frame it. :biggrin:
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The coupon promo code isn't working at the moment, but I placed my order anyway and emailed customer service.
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Just in case anyone has not FB 'liked' them ...
PRE-ORDERS START TODAY!!!! If you'd like to get your pre-order today, please go to the following links and take your pick!!!
Deluxe + shirt and poster: https://www.cmdistro.com/Item/Queensryche_-_-Queensryche-_-Deluxe_Edition-_CD_+_Shirt_+_Autographed_Poster_-PRE-ORDER-/PKG001538
Standard + deluxe and poster:
https://www.cmdistro.com/Item/Queensryche_-_-Queensryche-_-Standard-_CD_+_Shirt_+_Autographed_Poster_-PRE-ORDER-/PKG001537
Deluxe CD:
https://www.cmdistro.com/Item/Queensryche_-_Queensryche_-Deluxe_Edition-_-PRE-ORDER-/45492
Standard CD:
https://www.cmdistro.com/Item/Queensryche_-_Queensryche_-PRE-ORDER-/45491
DELUXE BOX SET EDITION CD (North America only) and includes the following bonus tracks:
· Queen Of The Reich (live)
· En Force (live)
· Prophecy (live)
Housed in a small box with a patch, sticker, guitar pick and button pack.
Thanks Chad, I don't have facebook. :tup
I'm definitely looking at the cd/shirt and poster.
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For $27 I think I gotta do the mega bundle.
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Man, 10% off for facebook likes. I might have to make an account just for this. :lol
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Wow, so apparently, demand for the deluxe packages was higher than expected, and they ran out of autographed posters yesterday and took the package offer down. They got another set of posters and put it back up today. Not sure how long before those go. They said on Facebook that after those go, they will offer a different deluxe package. Probably the shirts and posters that are not signed, I would guess.
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Man, 10% off for facebook likes. I might have to make an account just for this. :lol
Do it. Thoough if you put a pic up I'll be disappointed if you don't in fact look like King Diamond :biggrin:
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Wow, so apparently, demand for the deluxe packages was higher than expected, and they ran out of autographed posters yesterday and took the package offer down. They got another set of posters and put it back up today. Not sure how long before those go. They said on Facebook that after those go, they will offer a different deluxe package. Probably the shirts and posters that are not signed, I would guess.
Yeah, I was surprised when I checked and it said they were out of stock. This album could pull some decent numbers.
Man, 10% off for facebook likes. I might have to make an account just for this. :lol
Do it. Thoough if you put a pic up I'll be disappointed if you don't in fact look like King Diamond :biggrin:
:lol
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0w60CHCcvc
Damn, Eyes of a Stranger sounds so good again. I can even focus on other things instead of the horrible singer. I just realized how much I miss DeGarmo's backing vocals.
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Definitely not Todd's best vocal delivery. Seems like he really struggled with the low end of the melodies.
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Oh yeah, definitely not the best. But it still sounds good, even by early 90s Tate standards. It's good and "alive" enough that I don't care that it wasn't his best/perfect performance.
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Awesome! :metal
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Definitely not Todd's best vocal delivery. Seems like he really struggled with the low end of the melodies.
To be honest, I've pretty much always thought Eyes was the weakest part of the setlist QR's been playing with Todd so far. However, I do think he's gotten better and better with a lot of the other songs.
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What I notice even more as time goes on, is how much better the music sounds. Of course the vocals are much better with todd, but the backing instrumental piece is so much better. Obviously it is tighter as they have had decades of experience playing it....no disrespect to the other band. I think it is more the tone, sound, and personal touches that make the backing music sound so damn tight, and so close to the original recordings. For lack of a better term, the backing music sounds like Queensryche. Again, no disrespect to the other band.....as well, they arent Queensryche, and these guys are.
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What I notice even more as time goes on, is how much better the music sounds. Of course the vocals are much better with todd, but the backing instrumental piece is so much better. Obviously it is tighter as they have had decades of experience playing it....no disrespect to the other band. I think it is more the tone, sound, and personal touches that make the backing music sound so damn tight, and so close to the original recordings. For lack of a better term, the backing music sounds like Queensryche. Again, no disrespect to the other band.....as well, they arent Queensryche, and these guys are.
I think a lot of it has to do with it being in the right key. :) Changing the key of a song always has a negative impact to me. Queensryche, Rush, Genesis, Fish are ones that I've really noticed this with.
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What I notice even more as time goes on, is how much better the music sounds. Of course the vocals are much better with todd, but the backing instrumental piece is so much better. Obviously it is tighter as they have had decades of experience playing it....no disrespect to the other band. I think it is more the tone, sound, and personal touches that make the backing music sound so damn tight, and so close to the original recordings. For lack of a better term, the backing music sounds like Queensryche. Again, no disrespect to the other band.....as well, they arent Queensryche, and these guys are.
I think a lot of it has to do with it being in the right key. :) Changing the key of a song always has a negative impact to me. Queensryche, Rush, Genesis, Fish are ones that I've really noticed this with.
I usually don't blame people/bands for tuning down in their latter years when the vocalist is aging. It's nature and nobody can out run it. However, Geoff gets a lot of flack over down tuning for good reason. If the band carries on with Todd for a long period of time into the future, they'll probably have to do it for him as well. If he takes the proper steps to take care of his voice then I don't think that anyone should blame them when that time comes.
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New song they played live called Fallout:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=3UvaYY2s5kw
I like it. :tup
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It sounds pretty awesome. :biggrin:
Can't wait to hear the studio version.
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That was cool. The QR I remember and loved is definitely back.
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For me personally, I would say it's a safe bet/prediction, that this will be album of the year.
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That was a good song.
I liked it much more than Redemption.
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For me personally, I would say it's a safe bet/prediction, that this will be album of the year.
It might be for me as well. I'll have to weigh it against the new Fates Warning album when it arrives and I'm still somewhat interested in hearing what DT does as well.
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That was a good song.
I liked it much more than Redemption.
This.
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Pretty killer song.
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If you guys liked Fallout, here's Where Dreams Go To Die. Parker knocked it out of the freaking ballpark with this song, IMO. :metal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhDJLkYbecM
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If you guys liked Fallout, here's Where Dreams Go To Die. Parker knocked it out of the freaking ballpark with this song, IMO. :metal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhDJLkYbecM
Shit quality but that song sounds incredible. This is going to be one killer album. This song alone is better than the entire FU album.
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If you guys liked Fallout, here's Where Dreams Go To Die. Parker knocked it out of the freaking ballpark with this song, IMO. :metal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhDJLkYbecM
Shit quality but that song sounds incredible. This is going to be one killer album. This song alone is better than the entire FU album.
I stayed up to hear the live debut on the radio last night and the audio quality was a lot better there. But yeah, amazing song. :metal
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For me personally, I would say it's a safe bet/prediction, that this will be album of the year.
That's an awfully bold statement with all the albums already out, and still to come - Spock's Beard, Avantasia, Dream Theater, Ayreon, Transatlantic ... and a lot others on my radar. I'll just be happy if it cracks the top 10, and extremely impressed if it hits top 5.
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For me personally, I would say it's a safe bet/prediction, that this will be album of the year.
That's an awfully bold statement with all the albums already out, and still to come - Spock's Beard, Avantasia, Dream Theater, Ayreon, Transatlantic ... and a lot others on my radar. I'll just be happy if it cracks the top 10, and extremely impressed if it hits top 5.
Yeah it's a bold statement for sure! But I have been hoping for a true heavy metal/hard rock release from Queensryche since the late 90s; now it's officially going to happen. That's probably going to have a lot to do for me personally in regards to the enjoyment of this release. Based on the three songs I've heard, this will be an amazing disc. There are still Fates Warning, DT and hopefully Priest releases to come!
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A lot of the prior links for Where Dream Go To Die were taken down, but there is now an official link up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9KOvIdk8gc
IMO, each of these three songs is much better than anything on Dedicated to Chaos or F.U.
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So looking forward to this. QR are back. I think tate's statement that the rest of the band can't write a song is dead in the water.
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I really liked Redemption at first, but I had no desire to listen to it again after hearing it a few times. Fallout sounded much better, despite the poor audio quality. I'm listening to Where Dreams Go To Die right now and I'm really enjoying it. It's easily my favorite of the three I've heard so far.
I doubt that this album will crack my top 10 of the year, but that's only because there were so many other great new releases this year (with many more to come). Based on what we've heard, I'm certain that this will be a great album!
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...only because there were so many other great new releases this year
:rollin
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For me personally, I would say it's a safe bet/prediction, that this will be album of the year.
Like Jboy said, that is pretty bold. I hope you're not disappointed.
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...only because there were so many other great new releases this year
:rollin
Bosk does not agree.
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...only because there were so many other great new releases this year
:rollin
I'm not sure I get what's funny. ??? Are you laughing at the fact that I think there were good albums released this year, or did I word it badly and it only makes sense to me? :lol
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No...I assumed you were joking when you said it has been a great year for new releases, so I was laughing with you since I find that hilarious. Apparently, you weren't joking?
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Well nothing is going to beat Stone Sour for album(s) of the year, but these 3 songs released by Queensryche prove that Tate was the problem all along... Not that it wasn't obvious.
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A lot of the prior links for Where Dream Go To Die were taken down, but there is now an official link up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9KOvIdk8gc
IMO, each of these three songs is much better than anything on Dedicated to Chaos or F.U.
WOW! :o ...... it's amazing to hear this band this way again!
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No...I assumed you were joking when you said it has been a great year for new releases, so I was laughing with you since I find that hilarious. Apparently, you weren't joking?
Not joking. The new Steven Wilson, Big Big Train, Riverside, Renaissance, Spock's Beard, Bowie, Believe, etc albums are all excellent.
But anyways..back to QR...
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I've been listening to "Where Dreams Go To Die" all day over and over again at work. Oh, mama. It's a beast. Love it!
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I prefer Redemption to this one.
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I can't get over how weird it feels to be enjoying brand new QR material again after such a long time. Ever since American Soldier dropped I've missed this excitement.
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I can't get over how weird it feels to be enjoying brand new QR material again after such a long time. Ever since American Soldier Tribe dropped I've missed this excitement.
I know how you feel.
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I can't get over how weird it feels to be enjoying brand new QR material again after such a long time. Ever since American Soldier Tribe Promised Land dropped I've missed this excitement.
I know how you feel.
Yup.
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I can't get over how weird it feels to be enjoying brand new QR material again after such a long time. Ever since American Soldier Tribe dropped I've missed this excitement.
I know how you feel.
American Solider was decent, I liked it, but not classic Ryche. Tribe on the other hand I love, incredible album.
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Yes this song is awesome yes more please yes album now yes I would have Todd's babies if he asked me nicely enough and the planet was in vague danger.
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Man this song is so good!! YES!!
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No...I assumed you were joking when you said it has been a great year for new releases, so I was laughing with you since I find that hilarious. Apparently, you weren't joking?
(List of bands you probably don't give a shit about proving you wrong)
I feel sorry for you if you don't think there's been a lot of good music that's been put out this year so far, because you're missing out on an amazing amount of music that has come out that's absolutely fantastic, and you'll probably be missing out on much more that's yet to come out.
I dig the new song, and feel like this album is going to be quite radular!
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No...I assumed you were joking when you said it has been a great year for new releases, so I was laughing with you since I find that hilarious. Apparently, you weren't joking?
(List of bands you probably don't give a shit about proving you wrong)
I feel sorry for you if you don't think there's been a lot of good music that's been put out this year so far, because you're missing out on an amazing amount of music that has come out that's absolutely fantastic, and you'll probably be missing out on much more that's yet to come out.
No need to feel sorry. I thought it was pretty much a consensus that this has been a crap year for music so far (and isn't really shaping up to be that great a year in total based on what is coming up). Hence why I thought he was joking. But, hey, if there are people out there who actually like some of the stuff that has come out, that's great. Enjoy.
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If anything, I've heard and found it to be the exact opposite of what you've been hearing...This year's only just about halfway through and there has been an astounding amount of fantastic output that ranges the whole gamut in music and I just find it odd that you think so poorly of this year. I mean I guess a lot of my examples could be classified as "extreme" in tastes for a lot of this board, but even in the alternative/electronic/classic metal/rock atmospheres, there's just been a whole bunch of treats.
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Okay, cool. I disagree, but, hey, tastes vary. :tup
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No...I assumed you were joking when you said it has been a great year for new releases, so I was laughing with you since I find that hilarious. Apparently, you weren't joking?
(List of bands you probably don't give a shit about proving you wrong)
I feel sorry for you if you don't think there's been a lot of good music that's been put out this year so far, because you're missing out on an amazing amount of music that has come out that's absolutely fantastic, and you'll probably be missing out on much more that's yet to come out.
I dig the new song, and feel like this album is going to be quite radular!
In Bosk's defense, you could be talking about Taylor Swift. Everyone has different tastes. What you think is amazing, others might think is shit.
EDIT: :ninja:
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Wow. Zook is defending my honor.
:hearts:
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:puke:
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https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CXL6XP0/ref=sr_1_album_1_rd?ie=UTF8&child=B00CXL716A&qid=1369227091&sr=1-1
Amazon's got song samples for the whole album online now. :metal Open Road sounds amazing.
1. X2 1:09
2. Where Dreams Go To Die 4:25
3. Spore 3:25
4. In This Light 3:23
5. Redemption 4:16
6. Vindication 3:26
7. Midnight Lullaby 0:55
8. A World Without 4:11
9. Don't Look Back 3:13
10. Fallout 2:46
11. Open Road 3:54
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Wait, so the CD is only 33 minutes long or so? I thought they had all of this creativity that was waiting to burst out all of those years Tate suppressed them? Only 33 minutes worth??
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The real crazy thing is (although I'm really trying not to put too much stock into small samples) that this band might actually be on track to save their reputation. This stuff is sounding really good.
And if I'm honest, I'd rather 33 minutes of this than however much longer that Tate dross is going to be.
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Well, sure, quality over quantity is always key, but still, 33 minutes is tragically short, especially by today's standards. Hell, it was a bit on the short side by 30 years ago standards. :lol
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It is a bit short but some great albums sit within the realm of being 30 to 40 minutes in length. So I'm not going to prejudge on that factor. 33 minutes is a bit short though.
Honestly some bands could definitely benefit from realizing that you don't need to use every iota of space on a CD in order to make a good or even great album.
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Wait, so the CD is only 33 minutes long or so? I thought they had all of this creativity that was waiting to burst out all of those years Tate suppressed them? Only 33 minutes worth??
No kidding. This might be shorter than those early Van Halen albums!
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Well, sure, quality over quantity is always key, but still, 33 minutes is tragically short, especially by today's standards. Hell, it was a bit on the short side by 30 years ago standards. :lol
Just over 35 minutes, actually. But, yeah, I feel the same way. The upside is that from what I've heard, it's a VERY solid 35 minutes. But still, yeah, the album length feels short, and with a couple of exceptions, the tracks themselves are on the short side as well, which I generally don't like.
But, yeah, sounds like 35 minutes of pretty solid material. And let's not forget, the album also includes the following:
1. Queen Of The Reich (live)
2. En Force (live)
3. Prophecy (live)
4. Eyes Of A Stranger (live) - Japanese Bonus Track only
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Damn, I was expecting at least one 7-8 minute song. Something like Torre's contribution to Crimson Glory in Garden of Shadows.
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Initially, I was as well. But once the album length was leaked a few weeks ago, simply math dictated that that wasn't going to be a likely possibility.
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On the plus side, if they decide to go and record a live dvd they could play the entire album and still have a lot of time for the classics. I'm still hoping for a good live recording of Promised Land.
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I personally don't think they'll play the entire album live (unless it's for a one-off or a small string of shows). But it DOES enable them to play a larger number of new songs than they otherwise might.
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That is a short album, though. Like Rush in the late 70s short. :lol Quality over quantity, though, so if it's 35 awesome minutes, it's all good. Besides which, epics were largely the exception to the rule with Queensryche-they did far more songs in the 4-6 minute range than they did the 7-10, so the lengths of the songs aren't really an issue.
Still. Pretty damn short.
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I'll definitely take quality over quantity, but this is Eat 'em and Smile short. Not bothered, because we also get 3-4 live tracks. Overall, I'm cool with this.
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I thought with the emphasis on The Warning in the live show they may have done a Roads To Madness/No Sanctuary style epic to close the album. Ahh well. I'll take 30 odd minutes of great music over three hours of Tate-wreck any day.
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I'm completely fine with a 35 minute album.
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I'm completely fine with a 35 minute album.
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I'm completely fine with a 35 minute album.
Yes. Fine. Not much else. Definitely not what they need. They need a great album. Ones that short are rarely great.
But we'll see.
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I'd love to hear you try and prove that. I have many great albums in the 30-40 minute range
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Considering music is subjective I can't imagine how asking him to prove it could possibly go wrong.
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My favorite band used to be The Offspring, who had barely 30 minute albums most of the time. Although I am a tad disappointed since Queensryche is a metal band, and my prog fan-ness wants more. Nemesea's In control is like 35-40 minutes, and I love that album so we'll see.
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I'd love to hear you try and prove that. I have many great albums in the 30-40 minute range
I apologize. Who am I to post my opinion...
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It seems a bizarre and patently baseless thing to say. "Ones that short" used to be the normal length for an album. Nothing prior to 1975 or so is great?
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Reign in Blood is often heralded as the greatest thrash album ever made...and it's LESS than 30 min.
Another classic less than a half hour, S.O.D. Speak English or Die. Fantastic album.
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The past few posts is all I'm getting at, length shouldn't be an indication of greatness
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Reign in Blood is often heralded as the greatest thrash album ever made...and it's LESS than 30 min.
Another classic less than a half hour, S.O.D. Speak English or Die. Fantastic album.
Um...you're not helping your case. :lol
The past few posts is all I'm getting at, length shouldn't be an indication of greatness
In the abstract, I agree. But in this day and age, it is a factor. It's easy to overlook 20 or 30 years ago when the media for albums didn't not support longer albums and when the time and expense of making albums was more prohibitive. But in this day and age, expectations are different. I'll admit that while I am still very optimistic, I also feel a bit short-changed. Now if the shorter album means that we will be getting more frequent albums than the norm to make up for it, I will completely change my tune.
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I'm completely fine with a 35 minute album.
Yes. Fine. Not much else. Definitely not what they need. They need a great album. Ones that short are rarely great.
But we'll see.
The 70's disagree with you. :)
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Reign in Blood is often heralded as the greatest thrash album ever made...and it's LESS than 30 min.
Another classic less than a half hour, S.O.D. Speak English or Die. Fantastic album.
Um...you're not helping your case. :lol
The past few posts is all I'm getting at, length shouldn't be an indication of greatness
In the abstract, I agree. But in this day and age, it is a factor. It's easy to overlook 20 or 30 years ago when the media for albums didn't not support longer albums and when the time and expense of making albums was more prohibitive. But in this day and age, expectations are different. I'll admit that while I am still very optimistic, I also feel a bit short-changed. Now if the shorter album means that we will be getting more frequent albums than the norm to make up for it, I will completely change my tune.
Bands aren't obligated to write longer albums just because the technology allows it. I'd rather get a kickass punch in the gut of an album instead of an album with way too much fluff. Shorter albums are just fine.
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Reign in Blood is often heralded as the greatest thrash album ever made...and it's LESS than 30 min.
Another classic less than a half hour, S.O.D. Speak English or Die. Fantastic album.
Um...you're not helping your case. :lol
The past few posts is all I'm getting at, length shouldn't be an indication of greatness
In the abstract, I agree. But in this day and age, it is a factor. It's easy to overlook 20 or 30 years ago when the media for albums didn't not support longer albums and when the time and expense of making albums was more prohibitive. But in this day and age, expectations are different. I'll admit that while I am still very optimistic, I also feel a bit short-changed. Now if the shorter album means that we will be getting more frequent albums than the norm to make up for it, I will completely change my tune.
While I love me my lengthy albums, I do have to say that I think the band made a smart move in going with a shorter and more compact album. A majority of Queensryche's best songs from the classic line-up range from being three-to-five minutes long. While I'd love to see them write another amazing epic like Anybody Listening? or Promised Land, I'd rather have three shorter amazing songs with a really epic vibe to them all than one six minutes-plus long epic that drags on purely as a means for the band to make a song that lasts longer than the others.
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Reign in Blood is often heralded as the greatest thrash album ever made...and it's LESS than 30 min.
Another classic less than a half hour, S.O.D. Speak English or Die. Fantastic album.
Um...you're not helping your case. :lol
The past few posts is all I'm getting at, length shouldn't be an indication of greatness
In the abstract, I agree. But in this day and age, it is a factor. It's easy to overlook 20 or 30 years ago when the media for albums didn't not support longer albums and when the time and expense of making albums was more prohibitive. But in this day and age, expectations are different. I'll admit that while I am still very optimistic, I also feel a bit short-changed. Now if the shorter album means that we will be getting more frequent albums than the norm to make up for it, I will completely change my tune.
Bands aren't obligated to write longer albums just because the technology allows it. I'd rather get a kickass punch in the gut of an album instead of an album with way too much fluff. Shorter albums are just fine.
I would rather have an album that is 35m killer than an album that is 35m killer and 35m filler as you've suggested. However taking it a step farther I'd rather have an album that is 70m killer than one that's 35m killer.
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I have no problem with a 35 minute album. Ghost's Opus Eponymous (released in 2011) is ~34 minutes, and it's glorious. It arrives, kicks ass, and leaves before it has a chance to overstay it's welcome...and it has no weak tracks.
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Reign in Blood is often heralded as the greatest thrash album ever made...and it's LESS than 30 min.
Another classic less than a half hour, S.O.D. Speak English or Die. Fantastic album.
Um...you're not helping your case. :lol
The past few posts is all I'm getting at, length shouldn't be an indication of greatness
In the abstract, I agree. But in this day and age, it is a factor. It's easy to overlook 20 or 30 years ago when the media for albums didn't not support longer albums and when the time and expense of making albums was more prohibitive. But in this day and age, expectations are different. I'll admit that while I am still very optimistic, I also feel a bit short-changed. Now if the shorter album means that we will be getting more frequent albums than the norm to make up for it, I will completely change my tune.
Bands aren't obligated to write longer albums just because the technology allows it. I'd rather get a kickass punch in the gut of an album instead of an album with way too much fluff. Shorter albums are just fine.
I would rather have an album that is 35m killer than an album that is 35m killer and 35m filler as you've suggested. However taking it a step farther I'd rather have an album that is 70m killer than one that's 35m killer.
You can't force a song to be longer than it needs to be. Besides, 70m is quite the stretch for any band.
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Reign in Blood is often heralded as the greatest thrash album ever made...and it's LESS than 30 min.
Another classic less than a half hour, S.O.D. Speak English or Die. Fantastic album.
Um...you're not helping your case. :lol
The past few posts is all I'm getting at, length shouldn't be an indication of greatness
In the abstract, I agree. But in this day and age, it is a factor. It's easy to overlook 20 or 30 years ago when the media for albums didn't not support longer albums and when the time and expense of making albums was more prohibitive. But in this day and age, expectations are different. I'll admit that while I am still very optimistic, I also feel a bit short-changed. Now if the shorter album means that we will be getting more frequent albums than the norm to make up for it, I will completely change my tune.
Bands aren't obligated to write longer albums just because the technology allows it. I'd rather get a kickass punch in the gut of an album instead of an album with way too much fluff. Shorter albums are just fine.
I would rather have an album that is 35m killer than an album that is 35m killer and 35m filler as you've suggested. However taking it a step farther I'd rather have an album that is 70m killer than one that's 35m killer.
You can't force a song to be longer than it needs to be. Besides, 70m is quite the stretch for any band.
Yeah. It would be silly to try for more. Half assing it always works out well.
Bands should just release singles anyway. ::)
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I'd love to hear you try and prove that. I have many great albums in the 30-40 minute range
I apologize. Who am I to post my opinion...
Yeah. It would be silly to try for more. Half assing it always works out well.
Bands should just release singles anyway. ::)
You don't handle opposing views well, do you?
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I'll admit that I'm in the camp of people that was hoping/expecting a longer album. However, it's absolutely silly to judge the merits of the album on the length of the songs alone. It's quite possible that they decided to take steps to trim the fat so to speak and are trying to give us their strongest effort possible. If that's true then there is no way to fault them in my opinion.
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I'd love to hear you try and prove that. I have many great albums in the 30-40 minute range
I apologize. Who am I to post my opinion...
Yeah. It would be silly to try for more. Half assing it always works out well.
Bands should just release singles anyway. ::)
You don't handle opposing views well, do you?
You forgot to use a rolling eyes emote to further demonstrate your superiority, wit and having the right opinion.
But yeah, after the initial "shock" of the album being so short I am now completely fine with it and looking forward to hearing it and hopefully enjoying it immensely.
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I have no problem with the length. Usually the longer album gets, the more filler it has. Permanent Waves by Rush is only circa 2 minutes longer and it is killer throughout, for example.
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Bands aren't obligated to write longer albums just because the technology allows it. I'd rather get a kickass punch in the gut of an album instead of an album with way too much fluff. Shorter albums are just fine.
Of course they're not obligated to write longer albums just because technology allows them to. That's not the point. If you are happy with a shorter album, great. But I know that as a fan, *I* kind of feel ripped off. Great if it's a solid 35 minutes. But if they could do a solid 35 minutes, then they could do a solid 45, or a solid 45 with an extra pretty good 10 minutes tacked on.
I really like the clips I've heard so far. But those are only clips. Given that there are a bunch of sub-3:30 songs, I'm guessing that as complete songs, some are going to feel underdeveloped. And that's a shame because it shouldn't be hard to think a bit more about whether a solo can be lengthened just a bit to add more build and flow, or whether a short intro can be added to set the mood for a song, or whether the outro can be extended just a bit so the listener doesn't feel like the song cuts off prematurely, or whether a short bridge might be a nice transition somewhere in the song. If they do a few of those things and take just a bit more time to do one more "pretty good" song, they silence the criticism by having an album that at least is over 45 minutes. But, again, putting out a 35 minute album just does not feel like enough effort was made, and it foolishly opens them up for the criticism that they really can't write a full album's worth of material without Tate. Yeah, it's a dumb criticism on a lot of levels, but it's out there and it would have been SO easy to avoid had they taken the time to try to avoid it.
If the album ends up being just great from start to finish, cool. If it feels underdeveloped and feels like the songs are too short, I'm not going to be happy, and I'm not sure I'll devote much attention to the band going forward if the trend continues. There are very few albums of that lenght containing songs of that length that have really had any kind of long-lasting impact, and I can't really think of any off the top of my head that have come out in the last 10-15 years. Maybe as the clips might indicate, this is one of those exceptional albums that does the trick despite being so short. I hope so. But we'll see come release date.
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I'd love to hear you try and prove that. I have many great albums in the 30-40 minute range
I apologize. Who am I to post my opinion...
Yeah. It would be silly to try for more. Half assing it always works out well.
Bands should just release singles anyway. ::)
You don't handle opposing views well, do you?
I'm used to opposing views. I enjoyed Lulu. Those who enable mediocrity by being "fine" with it annoy me.
Nobody goes to a baseball game to see a bunt.
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Those who enable mediocrity by being "fine" with it annoy me.
Nobody goes to a baseball game to see a bunt.
I get your point, and I somewhat agree. But I also think "enabling mediocrity" isn't really the issue. (not to mention that the baseball analogy doesn't really fit) To me, I think it's more about not delivering a product that feels like it is complete. To use what in my opinion is a more fitting sports analogy, it is more like a football or basketball game where you pay a lot of money to go and see a hopefully good game and see your favorite players go out there and play for a full game, but the coach decides midway through the 3rd quarter to pull all the starters and rest them for a "more important" game down the road. Yeah, you got to see your favorite players play hard for 2 1/2 quarters, and you may even feel good about your team coming away with the win, which is the bottom line. But as a fan who paid for a product, you also may very validly feel short-changed at the same time. That's kind of where I'm at.
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While I agree with about 81% of what you said, I think things could definitely have been improved if you had switched from a sports analogy to a marriage one.
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:whatisthisidonteven:
But anyway, back to the album, while I am disappointed by the song lengths and album length, I'm still very excited about the album. Based on what I've heard so far, I am tentatively expecting it to be the best of the post-DeGarmo albums, and hopefully on par with some of the earlier material. From the full songs I've heard, I think it will be. But it's still a shame that when I am comparing it to other albums released this year, I can already forsee saying something along the lines of, "I'd put Queensryche on par with album X in terms of quality. But if I had to pick which is the better album, I'm going to have to go with album X because it just gave me more quality music." While there are still some good albums coming down the pike later this year, it looks like Dream Theater is EASILY going to have the album of the year for 2013 without any serious competition whatsoever.
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From the 3 songs and samples, I'd say it could very well be their best since Promised Land.
That said, from what I've heard, I think it's a real stretch to say the stuff heard so far could be on par with the older material. EP-Promised Land was an absolutely mind-blowingly great stretch of music, and while good the stuff so far just doesn't reach that level.
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While there are still some good albums coming down the pike later this year, it looks like Dream Theater is EASILY going to have the album of the year for 2013 without any serious competition whatsoever.
So how is the album then and can I borrow your time machine? ;)
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While there are still some good albums coming down the pike later this year, it looks like Dream Theater is EASILY going to have the album of the year for 2013 without any serious competition whatsoever.
You have very narrow musical horizon if you think there's no serious competition. Notwithstanding those that I mentioned already, there's pending releases from Frost*, Seventh Wonder, Amadeus Awad (quite a heavy list of contributors) and possibly Flying Colors. Then there are the lesser known gems in the works - Epysode, Flaming Row, Eden's Curse, and Neonfly (whose previously releases were all dynamite). DT 11 COULD be AOTY, but I'd hardly say it's a foregone conclusion.
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Hey, that's cool if you like some other bands as much and have confidence that they may put out something you like as much as DT. But given DT's past track record, and looking at the albums that are coming out this year and how much *I* like them in relation to DT, I personally am not expecting any serious competition. Your mileage may vary based on what you like, and that's fine. Your list does nothing to make me change my opinion, but that's okay too. It doesn't have to.
But back to Queensryche...
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That and the shit ton of fantastic debut albums by these little indie bands this year. A bunch of bands I first heard on Sirius last year have been showing up en masse on the regular radio stations, and I've been finding their albums to be really, really good. It's nice to have so much fresh blood and have it be great. (Plus, finally, a break from these folksy bands that have taken over. lol)
As for the album's length, it is kind of perplexing. I thought they said they had written enough material for two albums, but I can't recall which interview that was. But I just want it to be good more than anything.
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I'm completely fine with a 35 minute album.
Yes. Fine. Not much else. Definitely not what they need. They need a great album. Ones that short are rarely great.
But we'll see.
"Ones that short are rarely great".
Boston, S/T: 37:41
Rush, Hemispheres: 36:14
Styx, The Grand Illusion: 38:49
Van Halen, s/t: 35:13
Thin Lizzy, Jailbreak 35:52
Want me to continue? :lol
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I'm completely fine with a 35 minute album.
Yes. Fine. Not much else. Definitely not what they need. They need a great album. Ones that short are rarely great.
But we'll see.
"Ones that short are rarely great".
Boston, S/T: 37:41
Rush, Hemispheres: 36:14
Styx, The Grand Illusion: 38:49
Van Halen, s/t: 35:13
Thin Lizzy, Jailbreak 35:52
Want me to continue? :lol
Yes, please! Love the list so far! :metal
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I love how these lists of supposedly truly great short albums:
1. Typically don't list even a single album that I would consider "great" and
2. Typically don't list even a single album that came out within the last 20 years
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I could list many recent albums, but they're from genres you don't give a shit about and I think we're all wasting our time to change the adamant opinion of a few who feel albums should be longer than 30-40 minutes
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Hey, in the end it's gonna be what it is. As long as what makes the album is good, no one will care.
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I could list many recent albums, but they're from genres you don't give a shit about and I think we're all wasting our time to change the adamant opinion of a few who feel albums should be longer than 30-40 minutes
Quite possibly. But, again, whatever.
I was wracking my brain trying to come up with a sub-45 minute album of short songs in recent years that has been pretty good, and I finally thought of one. Flyleaf's debut album is just under 35 minutes. And with one exception, all songs are under 3:30. That's a pretty rare exception of an album I like, but that album was pretty good (not great, but pretty good). It can work. And it works for that genre of music. But, again, for the type of music I like, and the type of music that Queenryche is known for, it generally doesn't.
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Radiohead's In Rainbows is a little under 43 minutes and is one of the best albums ever.
Also, while it is technically an EP, PT's Nil Recurring is 29 minutes and is fantastic, too.
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Sad Wings of Destiny and Defenders of the Faith are also below 40 minutes in length.
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Yeah...still not helping. :lol
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Well, it is a matter of taste mostly. For great albums under 40 minutes I'd also list Death's Human and Individual Thought Patterns but that isn't music for most people. Point is, you can make great music and not be 60 minutes.
Although, I prefer great 60 minute albums over great 30 minute ones in general :). More awesome > less awesome.
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I absolutely couldn't care less about the length of the album. As long as I enjoy the disc, that's what matters. I'm just glad there is this version of Queensryche to listen to, even if its shorter then the norm.
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Time for a pointless post, since I know I'm not helping too much, but man, that's one helluva short album by 2013 standards, or standards in the last 20 years for that matter.
Still, this way I might check it out, since there won't be too much music in there to digest. ;D
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I'm completely fine with a 35 minute album.
Yes. Fine. Not much else. Definitely not what they need. They need a great album. Ones that short are rarely great.
But we'll see.
"Ones that short are rarely great".
Boston, S/T: 37:41
Rush, Hemispheres: 36:14
Styx, The Grand Illusion: 38:49
Van Halen, s/t: 35:13
Thin Lizzy, Jailbreak 35:52
Want me to continue? :lol
I guess I should clarify.
Queensryche needs a great album. After the last year they had. The last few albums as well. And the need to make an album better than FU. They need a home run. And a 35 minute release ain't helping their case.
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I guess I should clarify.
SHORT ALBUMS CAN BE GOOD. EVEN ONES BY QUEENSRYCHE.
You're just being silly.
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I tend to agree with the assessment that short albums today pretty much mean they are irrelevant or should be seen as not as good as they could have been. The way I see it, take any recent album, how about Dream Theater's last album. Let's remove Build Me Up, Break Me Down, Beneath the Surface and Outcry. Would this make the album lesser in quality? I think quality is in the music itself regardless of length.
Now to talk about those clips! They are awesome sounding. I am VERY intrigued to hear the full album. :metal
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I guess I should clarify.
SHORT ALBUMS CAN BE GOOD. EVEN ONES BY QUEENSRYCHE.
Yeah, that's a good way of putting it, and I agree. But the flipside, which I also agree with is:
They need a home run. And a 35 minute release ain't helping their case.
That's a good way of putting it. It's not that they have to put out a long album. But given everything that's been going on, them putting out what is an abnormally short album in the metal world in this day and age (regardless whether some short albums can be good) isn't helping their cause.
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It's like craving an awesome burger from your favorite joint that went to shit over the years because the owner lost it, and then when they re-vamp the menu, all they have is sliders.
Look, it's gonna be a great slider, but musicians have always written to the media they can deliver on. Albums in the 70s and 80s were written that length because they didn't have a medium that would allow anything greater. From the late 80s until present, it's been 75 minutes-ish because that's what CD's can hold. So, that's what we're accustomed to.
I for one will take quality over quantity. But it still feels like a slider, and I'm likely still gonna be hungry no matter how good it is.
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I guess I should clarify.
SHORT ALBUMS CAN BE GOOD. EVEN ONES BY QUEENSRYCHE.
Yeah, that's a good way of putting it, and I agree. But the flipside, which I also agree with is:
They need a home run. And a 35 minute release ain't helping their case.
That's a good way of putting it. It's not that they have to put out a long album. But given everything that's been going on, them putting out what is an abnormally short album in the metal world in this day and age (regardless whether some short albums can be good) isn't helping their cause.
If its 35 minutes of kickass, then fine. But this band has a lot to prove. They've made some shitty albums over the last decade or so. Blame it ALL on Tate? Where was this bands' backbone?
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Guys, you're already getting two Queensryche albums this year. Don't you think you're getting greedy? :lol :P
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Guys, you're already getting two Queensryche albums this year. Don't you think you're getting greedy? :lol :P
:bosk1:
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Take Hold of the Flame side stage footage by Matt Barlow:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vab3-svOnXo
Awesome performance.
Yes, that Matt Barlow.
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My thoughts on the matter: most of Queensryche's classic material are shorter and more compact songs. My three favorite QR albums (The Warning, Rage for Order and Promised Land) are all somewhere in the forty minute long range. Say what you will, but Operation: Mindcrime drags for me at times, especially on both Suite Sister Mary and Eyes of a Stranger. Mind you, Queensryche did some wonderful epics in the classic era such as Roads to Madness, Anybody Listening? and Promised Land. But generally speaking, the band is at their best with shorter songs that explode with progressive musical ideas like Screaming In Digital, The Needle Lies, One More Time and En Force.
This is also the first true Queensryche album since Tribe, and the first release from QR that wasn't affected by Tate's issues since Promised Land or possibly even Empire. Despite the fact that the band members have written musical material in outside projects during the Tateryche era, it's been awhile since these guys have really gotten to write new material for the true vision of Queensryche, and there's also Todd and Parker to consider too.
This is a band that's re-establishing themselves musically, but they also have to put out a great album. So I can see why the band would focus on writing shorter songs, since that's always been Queensryche's strong point. I would rather wait for the band to make an epic like RtM or PL until they are absolutely confident that it is top notch and a worthy addition to the album than just lop on a song to bump up the album length to forty five minutes. Similarly, I also wouldn't want them to over-saturate the album with a handful of other shorter songs of lesser quality to reach the forty-five minute mark.
I do think the next album will probably be a little longer though. Once the band has completely gelled together as a musical entity in terms of songwriting with both the original members dusting off the rust and Parker and Todd developing more experience as songwriters, I think we'll see them expand on their horizons with varying song lengths. I'd be very surprised if there isn't at least one song on the next album that's over five minutes long.
My .02 cents. :tup
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I love the preconceived ideas floating about when the album hasn't been released yet. I personally won't say what I think until I've heard the album and looked through the linear notes.
Even though it looks short doesn't mean it'll suck. I can't help but think of More by Devin Townsend, everyone wants more. More isn't necessarily good either. But it all depends on the quality of the songs and package. Who knows they might release another album shortly after this one, it's that these songs all flowed well and anything added wouldve killed the vibe.
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My thoughts on the matter: most of Queensryche's classic material are shorter and more compact songs. My three favorite QR albums (The Warning, Rage for Order and Promised Land) are all somewhere in the forty minute long range. Say what you will, but Operation: Mindcrime drags for me at times, especially on both Suite Sister Mary and Eyes of a Stranger. Mind you, Queensryche did some wonderful epics in the classic era such as Roads to Madness, Anybody Listening? and Promised Land. But generally speaking, the band is at their best with shorter songs that explode with progressive musical ideas like Screaming In Digital, The Needle Lies, One More Time and En Force.
This is also the first true Queensryche album since Tribe, and the first release from QR that wasn't affected by Tate's issues since Promised Land or possibly even Empire. Despite the fact that the band members have written musical material in outside projects during the Tateryche era, it's been awhile since these guys have really gotten to write new material for the true vision of Queensryche, and there's also Todd and Parker to consider too.
This is a band that's re-establishing themselves musically, but they also have to put out a great album. So I can see why the band would focus on writing shorter songs, since that's always been Queensryche's strong point. I would rather wait for the band to make an epic like RtM or PL until they are absolutely confident that it is top notch and a worthy addition to the album than just lop on a song to bump up the album length to forty five minutes. Similarly, I also wouldn't want them to over-saturate the album with a handful of other shorter songs of lesser quality to reach the forty-five minute mark.
I do think the next album will probably be a little longer though. Once the band has completely gelled together as a musical entity in terms of songwriting with both the original members dusting off the rust and Parker and Todd developing more experience as songwriters, I think we'll see them expand on their horizons with varying song lengths. I'd be very surprised if there isn't at least one song on the next album that's over five minutes long.
My .02 cents. :tup
You're steadily becoming one of my favorite members around here. You've got a good head on your shoulders.
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My thoughts on the matter: most of Queensryche's classic material are shorter and more compact songs. My three favorite QR albums (The Warning, Rage for Order and Promised Land) are all somewhere in the forty minute long range. Say what you will, but Operation: Mindcrime drags for me at times, especially on both Suite Sister Mary and Eyes of a Stranger. Mind you, Queensryche did some wonderful epics in the classic era such as Roads to Madness, Anybody Listening? and Promised Land. But generally speaking, the band is at their best with shorter songs that explode with progressive musical ideas like Screaming In Digital, The Needle Lies, One More Time and En Force.
This is also the first true Queensryche album since Tribe, and the first release from QR that wasn't affected by Tate's issues since Promised Land or possibly even Empire. Despite the fact that the band members have written musical material in outside projects during the Tateryche era, it's been awhile since these guys have really gotten to write new material for the true vision of Queensryche, and there's also Todd and Parker to consider too.
This is a band that's re-establishing themselves musically, but they also have to put out a great album. So I can see why the band would focus on writing shorter songs, since that's always been Queensryche's strong point. I would rather wait for the band to make an epic like RtM or PL until they are absolutely confident that it is top notch and a worthy addition to the album than just lop on a song to bump up the album length to forty five minutes. Similarly, I also wouldn't want them to over-saturate the album with a handful of other shorter songs of lesser quality to reach the forty-five minute mark.
I do think the next album will probably be a little longer though. Once the band has completely gelled together as a musical entity in terms of songwriting with both the original members dusting off the rust and Parker and Todd developing more experience as songwriters, I think we'll see them expand on their horizons with varying song lengths. I'd be very surprised if there isn't at least one song on the next album that's over five minutes long.
My .02 cents. :tup
You're steadily becoming one of my favorite members around here. You've got a good head on your shoulders.
Domo arigato, good sir! :biggrin: :tup
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My thoughts on the matter: most of Queensryche's classic material are shorter and more compact songs. My three favorite QR albums (The Warning, Rage for Order and Promised Land) are all somewhere in the forty minute long range. Say what you will, but Operation: Mindcrime drags for me at times, especially on both Suite Sister Mary and Eyes of a Stranger. Mind you, Queensryche did some wonderful epics in the classic era such as Roads to Madness, Anybody Listening? and Promised Land. But generally speaking, the band is at their best with shorter songs that explode with progressive musical ideas like Screaming In Digital, The Needle Lies, One More Time and En Force.
This is also the first true Queensryche album since Tribe, and the first release from QR that wasn't affected by Tate's issues since Promised Land or possibly even Empire. Despite the fact that the band members have written musical material in outside projects during the Tateryche era, it's been awhile since these guys have really gotten to write new material for the true vision of Queensryche, and there's also Todd and Parker to consider too.
This is a band that's re-establishing themselves musically, but they also have to put out a great album. So I can see why the band would focus on writing shorter songs, since that's always been Queensryche's strong point. I would rather wait for the band to make an epic like RtM or PL until they are absolutely confident that it is top notch and a worthy addition to the album than just lop on a song to bump up the album length to forty five minutes. Similarly, I also wouldn't want them to over-saturate the album with a handful of other shorter songs of lesser quality to reach the forty-five minute mark.
I do think the next album will probably be a little longer though. Once the band has completely gelled together as a musical entity in terms of songwriting with both the original members dusting off the rust and Parker and Todd developing more experience as songwriters, I think we'll see them expand on their horizons with varying song lengths. I'd be very surprised if there isn't at least one song on the next album that's over five minutes long.
My .02 cents. :tup
I agree with everything you said, with the exception that I believe Suite Sisister Mary is the greatest and most complete song in QR's entire catalog.
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My thoughts on the matter: most of Queensryche's classic material are shorter and more compact songs. My three favorite QR albums (The Warning, Rage for Order and Promised Land) are all somewhere in the forty minute long range. Say what you will, but Operation: Mindcrime drags for me at times, especially on both Suite Sister Mary and Eyes of a Stranger. Mind you, Queensryche did some wonderful epics in the classic era such as Roads to Madness, Anybody Listening? and Promised Land. But generally speaking, the band is at their best with shorter songs that explode with progressive musical ideas like Screaming In Digital, The Needle Lies, One More Time and En Force.
This is also the first true Queensryche album since Tribe, and the first release from QR that wasn't affected by Tate's issues since Promised Land or possibly even Empire. Despite the fact that the band members have written musical material in outside projects during the Tateryche era, it's been awhile since these guys have really gotten to write new material for the true vision of Queensryche, and there's also Todd and Parker to consider too.
This is a band that's re-establishing themselves musically, but they also have to put out a great album. So I can see why the band would focus on writing shorter songs, since that's always been Queensryche's strong point. I would rather wait for the band to make an epic like RtM or PL until they are absolutely confident that it is top notch and a worthy addition to the album than just lop on a song to bump up the album length to forty five minutes. Similarly, I also wouldn't want them to over-saturate the album with a handful of other shorter songs of lesser quality to reach the forty-five minute mark.
I do think the next album will probably be a little longer though. Once the band has completely gelled together as a musical entity in terms of songwriting with both the original members dusting off the rust and Parker and Todd developing more experience as songwriters, I think we'll see them expand on their horizons with varying song lengths. I'd be very surprised if there isn't at least one song on the next album that's over five minutes long.
My .02 cents. :tup
I agree with everything you said, with the exception that I believe Suite Sisister Mary is the greatest and most complete song in QR's entire catalog.
Eh, different strokes for different folks, I guess. :biggrin: I definitely think it drags on a bit, but it's not a bad song by any means and it has some terrific moments, so I can see why others love it so much. :tup
That said, thanks man! :metal
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Shorter albums don't bother me one bit. They do really make the margin of error much more narrow, though. There's only 9 songs here, with an intro and a short instrumental track. Assume 3 or 4 of the songs are duds, and suddenly you've got a pretty average album, even if the other stuff ranges from good to great.
BTW, regarding the "crap year for music" discussion... Not sure. I've heard a ton of great new music this year. I have not heard much great metal/rock music, though.
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Shorter albums don't bother me one bit. They do really make the margin of error much more narrow, though.
Basically this.
I'd far rather have a really tight, 35 minute long album that's strong from start-to-finish than a 45 one that has 10 minutes of filler.
However, if all you're delivering is 35 minutes of music then it has to be damn good 35 minutes worth to feel like value for money these days and any tracks that seem like filler will feel like a kick in the teeth.
Still, what I've heard from the tracks that've been released and the samples it's sounding good - a hell of a lot better than the dreck they've been peddling post-Tribe. Until I hear the full thing I wouldn't like to say it's better than Tribe, HITNF or Promised Land, but I now feel like I can look forward to new QR material again instead of rubber necking the train wreck.
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Ok, my big fear is that Redemption is either one of the better songs on the album, or it's smack in the middle. If we're generous, and we imagine Redemption basically ranks in the middle of songs, then you've got 4 songs on the album that are better than Redemption, and 4 songs that aren't, plus the intro and minute-long instrumental track. Since Redemption is pretty run-of-the-mill, not-bad-but-not-really-good, the idea of half the album, no matter how short, being worse than it is not very promising.
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Ok, my big fear is that Redemption is either one of the better songs on the album, or it's smack in the middle. If we're generous, and we imagine Redemption basically ranks in the middle of songs, then you've got 4 songs on the album that are better than Redemption, and 4 songs that aren't, plus the intro and minute-long instrumental track. Since Redemption is pretty run-of-the-mill, not-bad-but-not-really-good, the idea of half the album, no matter how short, being worse than it is not very promising.
Yup.
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If Redemption is a "middle of the road" song for this album, most Queensryche fans will be thrilled, myself included. Good song.
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Not really thrilled by what I've heard so far. Some good things, but I was waiting for more from Todd. My expectations must have been too high, but I don't know if I will buy the album without listening to it in full first.
B.Lee
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So the album is short. Why on earth do they need a 2 cd edition with the 3 live bonus tracks on a 2nd disc? They must be Grateful Dead length jams on the live tracks if they couldn't fit on one cd.
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So the album is short. Why on earth do they need a 2 cd edition with the 3 live bonus tracks on a 2nd disc? They must be Grateful Dead length jams on the live tracks if they couldn't fit on one cd.
I think the deluxe edition is still just one cd, with the three live tracks at the end of it.
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For some reason there's a single cd edition with the bonus tracks but there is also a digi 2 cd version but with the same bonus tracks.
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Let's see:
Taking off the atrocious NM 156 (deal with it) and Prophecy (since it was only added to the remaster) The Warning would come to 43:59 which is pretty short, but at least there would be no bad songs.
Taking off the even more atrocious Gonna Get Close to You and London, since it's nothing special, Rage For Order comes to 36:11. A minute longer, but no bad songs.
Operation: Mindcrime is perfect as is.
I don't have much issue with Empire.
35 minutes isn't a bad length if there are no bad tracks.
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Let's see:
Taking off the atrocious NM 156 (deal with it) and Prophecy (since it was only added to the remaster) The Warning would come to 43:59 which is pretty short, but at least there would be no bad songs.
Taking off the even more atrocious Gonna Get Close to You and London, since it's nothing special, Rage For Order comes to 36:11. A minute longer, but no bad songs.
Operation: Mindcrime is perfect as is.
I don't have much issue with Empire.
35 minutes isn't a bad length if there are no bad tracks.
:(
I'm absolutely dumbstruck.
The Warning as a whole is just above average....but NM 156 is absolutely BRILLIANT. If there is a weak track off RFO at all, it would be Chemical Youth. OMC would have been perfect were it not for Breaking the Silence (it was so incredibly forgettable that I had to actually look up what it was named...and I've heard that album at least a thousand times). And for the love of God, please forget that Jet City Woman and Another Rainy Night ever existed. QR almost died for me when I heard that dreck.
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Let's see:
Taking off the atrocious NM 156 (deal with it) and Prophecy (since it was only added to the remaster) The Warning would come to 43:59 which is pretty short, but at least there would be no bad songs.
Taking off the even more atrocious Gonna Get Close to You and London, since it's nothing special, Rage For Order comes to 36:11. A minute longer, but no bad songs.
Operation: Mindcrime is perfect as is.
I don't have much issue with Empire.
35 minutes isn't a bad length if there are no bad tracks.
:(
I'm absolutely dumbstruck.
The Warning as a whole is just above average....but NM 156 is absolutely BRILLIANT. If there is a weak track off RFO at all, it would be Chemical Youth. OMC would have been perfect were it not for Breaking the Silence (it was so incredibly forgettable that I had to actually look up what it was named...and I've heard that album at least a thousand times). And for the love of God, please forget that Jet City Woman and Another Rainy Night ever existed. QR almost died for me when I heard that dreck.
On occasion I'm reminded how I can be a fan of a band and have opinions about them that are completely at odds with other fans of that band. This is one of those times lol...
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For some reason there's a single cd edition with the bonus tracks but there is also a digi 2 cd version but with the same bonus tracks.
I'm not a huge fan of live tracks tacked onto the end of an album so would prefer a 2nd disc with them on, but when an album is this short in this day and age charging extra for it is a piss take.
A short album doesn't upset me, many of my top 50 albums were of a similar length. Better that than being 2/3 songs too long like Empire (although not bad, I would cut Della Brown, One And Only and Hand On Heart).
But Zook, NM156??? Great song. I like GGCTY and London too. And BTS. Really albums 1,2,3,and 4 are pretty flawless as albums go imo.
If we're talking crap songs, Dis ConNec Ted. Not even bacon can save that song.
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Guysguysguys...
NM 156 is the tits.
Gonna Get Close to You is my favourite on RFO.
London is decent.
Breaking the Silence is the worst song on O:M, but pretty good still.
Another Rainy Night is a top 15 QR song for me.
Dis Con Nec Ted is at its best when paired with Promised Land, but it's very good as an individual track too.
Chemical Youth is probably the only song from the three first albums I don't particularly care about. Neue Regel isn't really high in my ranks, but it's grown on me (takes cover before jammindude comes around).
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@Lowdz: I don't like the robot voice stuff in the verses. Does nothing for me.
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Guysguysguys...
NM 156 is the tits.
Gonna Get Close to You is my favourite on RFO.
London is decent.
Breaking the Silence is the worst song on O:M, but pretty good still.
Another Rainy Night is a top 15 QR song for me.
Dis Con Nec Ted is at its best when paired with Promised Land, but it's very good as an individual track too.
Chemical Youth is probably the only song from the three first albums I don't particularly care about. Neue Regel isn't really high in my ranks, but it's grown on me (takes cover before jammindude comes around).
Finally...someone that agrees with me on Dis Con Nec Ted.
But then you had to go and ruin it by dissin on Neue Regal. ;) (NR is my second favorite all time QR track behind SSM)
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Let's see:
Taking off the atrocious NM 156 (deal with it) and Prophecy (since it was only added to the remaster) The Warning would come to 43:59 which is pretty short, but at least there would be no bad songs.
Taking off the even more atrocious Gonna Get Close to You and London, since it's nothing special, Rage For Order comes to 36:11. A minute longer, but no bad songs.
Operation: Mindcrime is perfect as is.
I don't have much issue with Empire.
35 minutes isn't a bad length if there are no bad tracks.
:(
I'm absolutely dumbstruck.
The Warning as a whole is just above average....but NM 156 is absolutely BRILLIANT. If there is a weak track off RFO at all, it would be Chemical Youth. OMC would have been perfect were it not for Breaking the Silence (it was so incredibly forgettable that I had to actually look up what it was named...and I've heard that album at least a thousand times). And for the love of God, please forget that Jet City Woman and Another Rainy Night ever existed. QR almost died for me when I heard that dreck.
Well, I have issue with you and Zook and Prophecy and Chemical Youth are my two favorite Queensryche songs. :lol
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I have no problems with Prophecy. I was just trying to justify the short album length with examples.
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@Lowdz: I don't like the robot voice stuff in the verses. Does nothing for me.
Fair enough. I can understand that. It was the first song I fell in love with on TW after THOTF which I'd heard prior to getting the album. At the time it was pretty cool and topical. AAAHHH the killer computers are taking over!!!! :biggrin:
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NM 156 was actually supposed to open the album. The track listing was changed without the bands knowledge (or approval) by EMI. The bands track listing was:
Side 1:
NM 156
En Force
Deliverance
No Sanctuary
Take Hold of the Flame
Side 2:
Child of the Fire
Before the Storm
Warning
Roads to Madness
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NM 156 was actually supposed to open the album. The track listing was changed without the bands knowledge (or approval) by EMI. The bands track listing was:
Side 1:
NM 156
En Force
Deliverance
No Sanctuary
Take Hold of the Flame
Side 2:
Child of the Fire
Before the Storm
Warning
Roads to Madness
Yeah I was aware of this. The album flows so much better the way the band intended. Record companies huh? What do they know?
The album took a long time for me to really get into. Looking back it was probably the track order that caused it. Warning never really sat right as an opener.
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The Warning
Pretty much love the album from beginning to end. I love its song order and its flow and its my favorite QR album.
Rage for order
Love it a lot, but not as much as The Warning. Initially I didn't like Gonna Get close to you, but it has long since grown on me. Its quirky and different. Overall, I think that the album is fantastic, but some of the songs are hit or miss depending on what mood I'm in. But regardless of all that, The killing words is hands down my favorite QR song
Operation mindcrime
There was a time when I listened to it constantly, but not so much at this point. I think I may have over listened to it upon initial discovery. I still highly respect it, but find myself only listening to it on special occasions.
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While NM156 would have been a great opener, and a good indication of what their sound would be evolving to, especially on the next album, I think Warning is a fantastic opening track and a great indication of where they were coming from and where they still were at that point in time. I don't like that the record company did that, but I think the album actually benefits from the move.
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While NM156 would have been a great opener, and a good indication of what their sound would be evolving to, especially on the next album, I think Warning is a fantastic opening track and a great indication of where they were coming from and where they still were at that point in time. I don't like that the record company did that, but I think the album actually benefits from the move.
Yeah, I couldn't imagine the song order any other way than the way that it was released. However, that is probably because I've listened to it for so long the way it is.
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Re-ordering the songs on The Warning was a rare case of good meddling from the record label.
The awful, biteless mix the label insisted on, now...
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Amazon just notified me that the Auto-Rip of this album is available now because the album is coming out soon. I guess I'll download it. :metal
After logging into Cloud Player it seems they've mistaken the new album for the original EP.
:rollin
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Amazon just notified me that the Auto-Rip of this album is available now because the album is coming out soon. I guess I'll download it. :metal
After logging into Cloud Player it seems they've mistaken the new album for the original EP.
:rollin
Ahahahahahahah awesome :lol
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Amazon just notified me that the Auto-Rip of this album is available now because the album is coming out soon. I guess I'll download it. :metal
After logging into Cloud Player it seems they've mistaken the new album for the original EP.
:rollin
Yeah, they may have made a bad name choice there.
Untainted would have been good.
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Amazon just notified me that the Auto-Rip of this album is available now because the album is coming out soon. I guess I'll download it. :metal
After logging into Cloud Player it seems they've mistaken the new album for the original EP.
:rollin
Auto Rip is a freaking pain. It still doesn't have about half the albums it told me were available. Sometimes albums show up with only a few of the songs. >:(
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Amazon just notified me that the Auto-Rip of this album is available now because the album is coming out soon. I guess I'll download it. :metal
After logging into Cloud Player it seems they've mistaken the new album for the original EP.
:rollin
Auto Rip is a freaking pain. It still doesn't have about half the albums it told me were available. Sometimes albums show up with only a few of the songs. >:(
Yeah I don't get that...
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A review of the new album :
https://gunshyassassin.com/reviews/review-toddryches-queensryche-a-moody-dark-lp-that-exceeds-expectations/ (https://gunshyassassin.com/reviews/review-toddryches-queensryche-a-moody-dark-lp-that-exceeds-expectations/)
Interesting, if only for what he says on Tatewreck... :lol
B.Lee
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The marriage analogy in the review :rollin
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A review of the new album :
https://gunshyassassin.com/reviews/review-toddryches-queensryche-a-moody-dark-lp-that-exceeds-expectations/ (https://gunshyassassin.com/reviews/review-toddryches-queensryche-a-moody-dark-lp-that-exceeds-expectations/)
Interesting, if only for what he says on Tatewreck... :lol
boy, he doesn't sound like a "shy guy" at all. Wonder how he really feels about FU?
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It's difficult to take the review seriously because the writer clearly dislikes Tate. I feel the same way but some paragraphs are equal parts about Queensryche and Tateryche, even though the latter have no business being mentioned in this review at all.
Anyway, I'm excited for the album.
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The thing is, FU is so bad, the description he gives the album and Tate are warrant with that disaster of an album.
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Maybe true, but this was a review of the new album, not FU. Mention it, talk about possible confusion, say it was bad if you want, but then drop it and review the new album.
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Maybe true, but this was a review of the new album, not FU. Mention it, talk about possible confusion, say it was bad if you want, but then drop it and review the new album.
Sorry, but I clearly understood it was a review of the new Todd-fronted QRalbum, and I'm not even English. It's even in the title. But maybe I don't get what you mean, being non-English as I am?
B.Lee
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What I mean is that he spent way too much time talking about FU. There's no question that it was a review of the new self-titled album, but if it is, then why spend so much time slamming on Geoff's album?
The "confusion" I mention is that he does have to point out that Geoff released a Queensryche album recently as well, and that there will be some people who don't understand all the background behind the two albums and the two factions. So there can be confusion. I didn't mean to imply that people are confused about what album he's supposed to be reviewing. I'm just thinking there might be some people wondering why there's another Queenryche album out already.
That said, he was supposed to be reviewing the self-titled album, and given that, he basically reviewed both.
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It also seems like he had decided to give it a positive review even before he had listened to it, just to spite Tate and say how much Tateryche sucks compared to Queensryche.
The review is funny, but I'm unsure whether it's honest.
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What I mean is that he spent way too much time talking about FU. There's no question that it was a review of the new self-titled album, but if it is, then why spend so much time slamming on Geoff's album?
The "confusion" I mention is that he does have to point out that Geoff released a Queensryche album recently as well, and that there will be some people who don't understand all the background behind the two albums and the two factions. So there can be confusion. I didn't mean to imply that people are confused about what album he's supposed to be reviewing. I'm just thinking there might be some people wondering why there's another Queenryche album out already.
That said, he was supposed to be reviewing the self-titled album, and given that, he basically reviewed both.
Get it! Yep, he could have refreined from reviewing, sort of, the FU album.
B.Lee
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Maybe true, but this was a review of the new album, not FU. Mention it, talk about possible confusion, say it was bad if you want, but then drop it and review the new album.
Yeah okay, that's fair enough.
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They posted this a few minutes ago, https://soundcloud.com/centurymedia/queensryche-fallout
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He fits the band right enough, without sounding like Tate too much.
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I saw this review yesterday, really interesting: https://www.angrymetalguy.com/queensryche-queensryche-review/ (https://www.angrymetalguy.com/queensryche-queensryche-review/)
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I saw this review yesterday, really interesting: https://www.angrymetalguy.com/queensryche-queensryche-review/ (https://www.angrymetalguy.com/queensryche-queensryche-review/)
Nice he actually reviewed the album and judged it on its own merits, rather than relative to Tate's album.
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And he says pretty much what one could expect. It's short, which can be good and bad. Individual songs sometimes feel like they could've had a little more room to explore the ideas. That kind of thing. But also that it's strong overall, which is nice to hear since all we've had so far are peeks, and obviously the band is going to leak the strongest material first.