The Official Fates Warning thread v. Elsydeon hasn’t been around

[pg1067]

"The styles of music we've written distinguish this record from the rest of our catalogue," states vocalist Ray Alder. "There are some songs with electronics and some with a nice ethereal feel

Hmmm...that sounds like Disconnected and FWX, and that is NOT a good thing and doesn't bode well for a rebound after TOF.

But, of course, I'll reserve judgment -- I haven't yet listened to the teaser track.  Interesting that Ray seems to have been more involved with the writing.

Just listened to the song.  Liked it, so I'll look forward to the album coming out in a few months.

[wolfking]

No Frank solos? 

[Nel]

Why do all the post-2010 album titles rhyme? 

[gzarruk]

Really enjoyed "Scars." It's really good, and got better on the second listen. I had no idea Gavin Harrison played on When Snow Falls. I wonder why they brought him on for just a track. It's not like Bobby couldn't have done it. He's incredible. But I love Gavin's work too, so it's a nice addition.

I REALLY like that they diversified their sound. And I also think it is cool that Joe Barresi mixed it. I've always admired his work. It'll be interesting to see what his mix of Fates sounds like on a good system.

I remember during the press for Theories of Flight, it was said that they purposefully cut out a lot of the electronics and just went guitar. And I thought that was smart. But as they continue, expanding into all elements of their sound seems like a good move. It was also said back then that they were unsure if Theories might be their last record. I noticed the track name of the final song on Long Day Goodnight is "The Last Song."

I wonder if the album title, the song title, and the fact Ray seems to be saying that they incorporated everything they've sort of ever done musically into this new one, has them thinking this record will be their swansong. Even if it isn't, they had to have known people would ask, given all the above.

Absolutely stoked for it though. Pre-ordered a vinyl/Cd/shirt bundle.

re: the discussion on FWX. I really like the record. "A Handful of Doubt," "Wish," "Heal Me," even straight ahead stuff like "Simple Human" are really good.

First thing I thought after seeing the title and reading through the song list was this seems like it could be their last album. I realize they can’t go on forever, so if this is the end I hope it’s grandiose.

Didn't they just sign back with Metal Blade, though? It'd be a weird move to do that if the plan was to make one last album.

What do I know, tho.

Why do all the post-2010 album titles rhyme? 

Now I can't unsee this

[LudwigVan]

Why do all the post-2010 album titles rhyme? 

It’s Perfect Symmetry

[Phoenix87x]

Why do all the post-2010 album titles rhyme? 

It’s Perfect Symmetry

And also the sequence doesn't feel Disconnected

[pg1067]

Why do all the post-2010 album titles rhyme? 

It’s Perfect Symmetry

And parallel lines.

[Nel]

Please, you guys. I never asked for all this LORE.

[T-ski]

No more rhymes now, I mean it.

[Phoenix87x]

I think we can all see Eye to Eye on the matter

[v_clortho]

No more rhymes now, I mean it.

Anybody want a peanut?

[gzarruk]

I think there's no exit now.

[Mister Gold]

Really enjoyed "Scars." It's really good, and got better on the second listen. I had no idea Gavin Harrison played on When Snow Falls. I wonder why they brought him on for just a track. It's not like Bobby couldn't have done it. He's incredible. But I love Gavin's work too, so it's a nice addition.

I REALLY like that they diversified their sound. And I also think it is cool that Joe Barresi mixed it. I've always admired his work. It'll be interesting to see what his mix of Fates sounds like on a good system.

I remember during the press for Theories of Flight, it was said that they purposefully cut out a lot of the electronics and just went guitar. And I thought that was smart. But as they continue, expanding into all elements of their sound seems like a good move. It was also said back then that they were unsure if Theories might be their last record. I noticed the track name of the final song on Long Day Goodnight is "The Last Song."

I wonder if the album title, the song title, and the fact Ray seems to be saying that they incorporated everything they've sort of ever done musically into this new one, has them thinking this record will be their swansong. Even if it isn't, they had to have known people would ask, given all the above.

Absolutely stoked for it though. Pre-ordered a vinyl/Cd/shirt bundle.

re: the discussion on FWX. I really like the record. "A Handful of Doubt," "Wish," "Heal Me," even straight ahead stuff like "Simple Human" are really good.

Yeah, "Scars" is really growing on me. I liked it fine enough on the first listen, but it didn't have the same immediate "WOW" factor that "From the Rooftops" had back in 2016, but it's quickly weeding its way into my head. Ray gives a really strong performance and has some pretty interesting vocal melodies throughout. And the guitar solo is pretty great too! It doesn't quite rival the three highlights of Theories of Flight for me ("From the Rooftops", "The Light and the Shade of Things" and "White Flag"), but I'd personally say it's at least on par with the great quality of the rest of ToF and I'm excited to hear more.

Very interested in hearing whether or not this is their planned final album, for the same reasons as you.

[wolfking]

The post 2010 album titles may rhyme but if we look through different eyes we find the albums are a world apart from one another.

From my point of view there are lots of light and shade of things within those albums but they still remain top FW albums.  From outside looking in, they are a great monument to the FW legacy.  And maybe the rhyming titles is intentional and the band are remembering and not leaving the past behind.

So, there's nothing left to say but I'm looking forward to this new album.  I wish Frank did a solo or two as he is a very important part of the machine that is FW but maybe on another perfect day they'll work together again. 

What the band has left here for us is a great new song.

[TAC]

Very nice, Kade. Very nice.

[wolfking]

Very nice, Kade. Very nice.

Thanks.  I should be trying to sleep by now but that was more fun.

[Samsara]

Didn't they just sign back with Metal Blade, though? It'd be a weird move to do that if the plan was to make one last album.

They alternate deals with Inside Out and Metal Blade. They appear to be one or two album deals. Inside Out was Theories of Flight and Live Over Europe. My guess is, the deal with Metal Blade is for Long Day Goodnight and the option for another release.

[Max Kuehnau]

Didn't they just sign back with Metal Blade, though? It'd be a weird move to do that if the plan was to make one last album.

They alternate deals with Inside Out and Metal Blade. They appear to be one or two album deals. Inside Out was Theories of Flight and Live Over Europe. My guess is, the deal with Metal Blade is for Long Day Goodnight and the option for another release.

Darkness In A Different Light was on Inside Out as well though.

[jjrock88]

The post 2010 album titles may rhyme but if we look through different eyes we find the albums are a world apart from one another.

From my point of view there are lots of light and shade of things within those albums but they still remain top FW albums.  From outside looking in, they are a great monument to the FW legacy.  And maybe the rhyming titles is intentional and the band are remembering and not leaving the past behind.

So, there's nothing left to say but I'm looking forward to this new album.  I wish Frank did a solo or two as he is a very important part of the machine that is FW but maybe on another perfect day they'll work together again. 

What the band has left here for us is a great new song.

 

[Samsara]

Didn't they just sign back with Metal Blade, though? It'd be a weird move to do that if the plan was to make one last album.

They alternate deals with Inside Out and Metal Blade. They appear to be one or two album deals. Inside Out was Theories of Flight and Live Over Europe. My guess is, the deal with Metal Blade is for Long Day Goodnight and the option for another release.

Darkness In A Different Light was on Inside Out as well though.

True. The point is, however, they alternate. They've said it in interviews in the past, that they have great relationships with both Metal Blade and Inside Out, so they alternate deals with them.

[pg1067]

Didn't they just sign back with Metal Blade, though? It'd be a weird move to do that if the plan was to make one last album.

They alternate deals with Inside Out and Metal Blade. They appear to be one or two album deals. Inside Out was Theories of Flight and Live Over Europe. My guess is, the deal with Metal Blade is for Long Day Goodnight and the option for another release.

Darkness In A Different Light was on Inside Out as well though.

True. The point is, however, they alternate. They've said it in interviews in the past, that they have great relationships with both Metal Blade and Inside Out, so they alternate deals with them.

"Alternating" doesn't make much sense.  It's not as though they have a history of going back and forth and back and forth.  Every studio album through FWX was on Metal Blade.  They then did DIADL and TOF on Inside Out, and now they're back to Metal Blade.  Maybe if, after releasing a couple albums on Metal Blade, they go back to Inside Out, you can call it "alternating," but the foray with IO seems otherwise to have been merely a brief diversion.

[Samsara]

"Alternating" doesn't make much sense.  It's not as though they have a history of going back and forth and back and forth.  Every studio album through FWX was on Metal Blade.  They then did DIADL and TOF on Inside Out, and now they're back to Metal Blade.  Maybe if, after releasing a couple albums on Metal Blade, they go back to Inside Out, you can call it "alternating," but the foray with IO seems otherwise to have been merely a brief diversion.

Not sure why it is hard to accept. I didn't make it up.  They have said, more than once, that they have great relationships with both Metal Blade and Inside Out, and are alternating deals. I don't have links, but they've said it repeatedly. Both Jim and Ray's last solo records were on Inside Out, whereas Arch/Matheos was on Metal Blade. Maybe they meant that between both labels, all their music will be released? I have no idea, you'd have to ask them.

I don't know the reasoning behind it, all I'm saying is what I heard in interviews over the last several years. Maybe I misheard? I don't think I did, but my old fogey status makes it a possibility.

[pg1067]

"Alternating" doesn't make much sense.  It's not as though they have a history of going back and forth and back and forth.  Every studio album through FWX was on Metal Blade.  They then did DIADL and TOF on Inside Out, and now they're back to Metal Blade.  Maybe if, after releasing a couple albums on Metal Blade, they go back to Inside Out, you can call it "alternating," but the foray with IO seems otherwise to have been merely a brief diversion.

Not sure why it is hard to accept. I didn't make it up.  They have said, more than once, that they have great relationships with both Metal Blade and Inside Out, and are alternating deals. I don't have links, but they've said it repeatedly. Both Jim and Ray's last solo records were on Inside Out, whereas Arch/Matheos was on Metal Blade. Maybe they meant that between both labels, all their music will be released? I have no idea, you'd have to ask them.

I don't know the reasoning behind it, all I'm saying is what I heard in interviews over the last several years. Maybe I misheard? I don't think I did, but my old fogey status makes it a possibility.

I'm not doubting that they said it.  I just find the use of "alternating" a bit odd.  That's all.

[goo-goo]

I don't think it's about the alternating between labels because they like working with both of them. It's about who gives them a better deal and terms. One possibility is that Fates may have grown a bit during the Inside Out records (Darkness, Theories, and Live Over Europe). Keep in mind that Metal Blade releases their digital albums through Bandcamp which gives MB artists a bigger cut on the digital side. The Arch Matheos and Awakening the Guardian releases were very successful with MB on Bandcamp.

Inside Out hasn't been the same since the Sony merger which I believe it happened some time after the release of Darkness. And I/O kind of lost it's "independent label" feel when Sony acquired them. MB remains truly independent.

You don't change labels because you like working with both. You change labels because of better terms contractually, artistically, and financially, among other things. Brian Slagel from MB has always supported Fates and Jim Matheos.

[emtee]

Good song. Ray always agrees with my ears.

My intro to FW  was FWX and I love that album. Will always associate it with seeing DT, QR and FW  at DTE Energy Theater on that tour. Fates had just released FWX and they put on a great show.

[Samsara]

I don't think it's about the alternating between labels because they like working with both of them. It's about who gives them a better deal and terms. One possibility is that Fates may have grown a bit during the Inside Out records (Darkness, Theories, and Live Over Europe). Keep in mind that Metal Blade releases their digital albums through Bandcamp which gives MB artists a bigger cut on the digital side. The Arch Matheos and Awakening the Guardian releases were very successful with MB on Bandcamp.

Inside Out hasn't been the same since the Sony merger which I believe it happened some time after the release of Darkness. And I/O kind of lost it's "independent label" feel when Sony acquired them. MB remains truly independent.

You don't change labels because you like working with both. You change labels because of better terms contractually, artistically, and financially, among other things. Brian Slagel from MB has always supported Fates and Jim Matheos.

The lawyer in me completely agrees with you. I was just saying what I heard the band say in interviews. That's all.

Good song. Ray always agrees with my ears.

Amen.

My intro to FW  was FWX and I love that album. Will always associate it with seeing DT, QR and FW  at DTE Energy Theater on that tour. Fates had just released FWX and they put on a great show.

I saw that tour twice. It was the first time I saw FW live, and I was blown away by the opening number, "One." At least I think they opened with it. I remember turning to my wife (who in the past couldn't believe I had never really listened to Fates Warning) and saying how incredible they are, and going out the next day and buying the catalog. That 2003 tour was the start of my Fates fandom sadly, way too late (I've made up for it since). FWX was the first record I bought from Fates on release date (picked it up, I think, at Best Buy) and loved it from the moment I heard it. I think Theories is stronger of course, but I love FWX.

[bosk1]

I don't think it's about the alternating between labels because they like working with both of them. It's about who gives them a better deal and terms. One possibility is that Fates may have grown a bit during the Inside Out records (Darkness, Theories, and Live Over Europe). Keep in mind that Metal Blade releases their digital albums through Bandcamp which gives MB artists a bigger cut on the digital side. The Arch Matheos and Awakening the Guardian releases were very successful with MB on Bandcamp.

Inside Out hasn't been the same since the Sony merger which I believe it happened some time after the release of Darkness. And I/O kind of lost it's "independent label" feel when Sony acquired them. MB remains truly independent.

You don't change labels because you like working with both. You change labels because of better terms contractually, artistically, and financially, among other things. Brian Slagel from MB has always supported Fates and Jim Matheos.

I hear you.  But unless you are a band or label insider with specific knowledge of their specific deals, you can't really make that call.  They know why it works.  We don't.  The explanation from the band's perspective might be very simple.  Or it might be very complicated.  We just don't know.  But it works for them, and they are apparently happy with it, so I'm not sure what the benefit is to try to second guess it as a fan.

[goo-goo]

I don't think it's about the alternating between labels because they like working with both of them. It's about who gives them a better deal and terms. One possibility is that Fates may have grown a bit during the Inside Out records (Darkness, Theories, and Live Over Europe). Keep in mind that Metal Blade releases their digital albums through Bandcamp which gives MB artists a bigger cut on the digital side. The Arch Matheos and Awakening the Guardian releases were very successful with MB on Bandcamp.

Inside Out hasn't been the same since the Sony merger which I believe it happened some time after the release of Darkness. And I/O kind of lost it's "independent label" feel when Sony acquired them. MB remains truly independent.

You don't change labels because you like working with both. You change labels because of better terms contractually, artistically, and financially, among other things. Brian Slagel from MB has always supported Fates and Jim Matheos.

I hear you.  But unless you are a band or label insider with specific knowledge of their specific deals, you can't really make that call.  They know why it works.  We don't.  The explanation from the band's perspective might be very simple.  Or it might be very complicated.  We just don't know.  But it works for them, and they are apparently happy with it, so I'm not sure what the benefit is to try to second guess it as a fan.

And Tracy Vera (Joey's wife) is VP of something at MB 

Absolutely bosk1. Just trying to explain what COULD have happened. Only the band knows why they did it.

I'm interested in seeing who mixed and mastered the album. Theories and Live Over Europe where mixed and mastered by Jens Boegren and sound amazing. Ray's album sounds very good but the engineering was handled by Simone Mularoni (from Prog metal band DGM, who also handled production duties on Romeo's last solo album). Both of them sound great. Hope they keep working with them on the production side.

[bosk1]

And Tracy Vera (Joey's wife) is VP of something at MB 

Oh, interesting.  Didn't know that. 

I can't help but wonder whether switching in and of itself has benefits.  Kind of like how my wife switches our Internet and TV providers each time our contract with the current one is up.  It is annoying and inconvenient.  But it also saves money, because they give good introductory deals that you cannot get if you are an existing customer.  I wonder whether record labels have something like that sometimes.  For instance, I could see a situation existing something along these lines:  One of the benefits of being on a label is that they have distribution agreements with retailers.  So the label is instrumental in making sure the album gets  put "one the shelves" at places that sell albums (and, yeah, I know things have gone almost exclusively to online sales nowadays, but still).  Perhaps the labels are able to negotiate certain distribution breaks for in prices for newer acts designed to incentivize wider distribution for new bands that don't have as much financial capital, and the labels can pass those savings along to the bands, provided it is a new contract and not an extension for an existing artist.  So, in that case, an established band could perhaps take advantage of that by hopping back and forth and constantly getting those "new customer" discounts that are not available for bands on renewed contracts.  I may be way off, but I would not be surprised if something that had a similar effect was the reality.

[pg1067]

And Tracy Vera (Joey's wife) is VP of something at MB 

President since Feb. 2020:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/tracy-vera-9309265/

MB is notable (and probably unique) for having several high-ranking female executives.

[Samsara]

I'm interested in seeing who mixed ... the album.

Joe Barresi

[goo-goo]

I'm interested in seeing who mixed ... the album.

Joe Barresi

Huh. Interesting choice. I missed reading that on the press release lol.

[Max Kuehnau]

Well, he mixed the two recent (or well, somewhat recent ) Tool albums, and I liked his mixes on these. I would guess he did a good job with Fates as well.

[kirksnosehair]

  I would have preferred that they work with whoever mixed Theories of Flight again.  That's an amazing sounding record. But I'll reserve judgement until I hear the new stuff.  I won't listen to any pre-release singles. 

[Mebert78]

I was also hoping they use the same personnel as Theories of Flight. I love the sound of that album as well. But that aside, I'm am digging the new song and very excited for this album. \m/