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Dream Theater => Dream Theater => Topic started by: SnakeEyes on June 06, 2010, 07:58:02 PM
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That is all.
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Underrated? yes. Amazing? Certain parts, yes.
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That is all.
thaaaank you! :D
nobody else will agree with you, but I'm right there with you. This is one of my favorite DT albums.
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YES YES YES YES YES
Still my favorite DT album to listen to, I don't care what anyone says.
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This album is quite special. It has some of DT's best (LITS, TOT, Hell's Kitchen) and it has the most awful songs DT has done (Burning My Soul, You Not Me)
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It has some great work, a good amount of mediocre work, and a small amount of lame work.
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It has some great work, a good amount of mediocre work, and a small amount of lame work.
THIS
but it's in my top 5 albums from them
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I used to HATE Burning My Soul, but that keyboard solo is phenominal. I don't want to turn this into a "this keyboard player vs. that keyboard player" thread, but that solo really makes me miss the old style of DT's soloing, where it wasn't ONLY about chops and who can play the fastest. I think Derek's solo in Burning My Solo is more tasteful than most of Jordadn's new DT solos.
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It is indeed one of their best.
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It's a fantastic album, and contains my favorite DT song (Trial of Tears).
There was only one bad song on the album: You Not Me
One mediocre song: Anna Lee
One kinda ok song: Burning My Soul
The rest are just awesome
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A bit more than that actually.
The good - Burning my soul, You not me, Just let me breathe.
The mediocre - Anna Lee, New Millenium, take away my pain
The horrible - Trail of Tears, Lines in the sand, peruvian skies.
The rest don't even count as songs. Just long tracks of noise.
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It has some great work, a good amount of mediocre work, and a small amount of lame work.
Completely true. Finally I get to agree something with A.....
The good - Just let me breathe.
The horrible - Trail of Tears.
The rest don't even count as songs. Just long tracks of noise.
.... Nevermind.
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It's not my fault. FII would have greatly benefited from having JR on it. They keys are zany enough and there aren't NEARLY enough pointless unisons.
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I'd say there are only two bad songs on the album, but in varying degrees. Trial of Tears is "bad" because it just doesn't go anywhere. I hate the lyrics, the song is poorly constructed, James sounds really annoying and the guitar solo is just wanking. You Not Me is just AWFUL, plain and simple.
All the other ones are just awesome songs. (notice I said the "S" word.... SONGS). Not just vehicles to show how well Petrucci can trade off with a really fast keyboard player.
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Underrated, but still just "good" in my opinion. The only DT albums I like less than FII are When Dream and Day Unite and... When Dream and Day Unite. It probably ties with Systematic Chaos for me. Both albums have 2 songs I really like and one or two more that I just think are "pretty good."
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I'd also like to say that while I do like FII quite a bit, it's hard to listen to cause I don't like New Millenium, or You Not Me. So it's like....the first two songs aren't great to me, so I never wanna start it.
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Adami, really? You don't care for New Millenium? I understand You Not Me, LOL. But, New Millienium, too?
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SnakeEyes, really? You don't care for Trial of Tears? I understand You Not Me, LOL. But, Trial of Tears, too?
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Adami, really? You don't care for New Millenium? I understand You Not Me, LOL. But, New Millienium, too?
Well, I dunno. I don't dislike it at all. I just get bored with it for some reason. It just doesn't do anything for me.
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SnakeEyes, really? You don't care for Trial of Tears? I understand You Not Me, LOL. But, Trial of Tears, too?
New Millenium sounds exactly like what it is: a mish-mash of leftover parts weakly bound together in a new song. With some terrible lyrics. The only thing good about it is the Chapman stick and the instrumental part.
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SnakeEyes, really? You don't care for Trial of Tears? I understand You Not Me, LOL. But, Trial of Tears, too?
Why the sarcasm? I didn't criticize him for it. So, maybe you should lose the attitude?
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See, the thing is, New Millennium and Trial of Tears are two of the best songs on the album.
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I like the beginning of Trial of Tears, up until the, "hidden by disguise" part, then the entire song just falls apart. It almost seems like they had a really good song going, then had no idea where to go from there..... and, they came up with..... what they came up with.
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That's when the best part in the song starts. Especially the Once in a LIVEtime version.
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It has some great work, a good amount of mediocre work, and a small amount of lame work.
That sums it up nicely.
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SnakeEyes, really? You don't care for Trial of Tears? I understand You Not Me, LOL. But, Trial of Tears, too?
Why the sarcasm? I didn't criticize him for it. So, maybe you should lose the attitude?
Was just fooling around, man :) Sorry to offend.
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oh, no problem man - I thought YOU were offended. :lol .... I wasn't mad. Now that I know you were only joking, it was pretty funny. lol
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The horrible - Trail of Tears, Lines in the sand, peruvian skies.
The rest don't even count as songs. Just long tracks of noise.
...
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Jesus, really? Have you never seen me post before?
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A very good album, and it contains some of my absolutely favourite DT songs. They really struck gold with Trial Of Tears.
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It's an alright album. The problem I have is that, for me, the album has some very high points but it also has some very low points. Rarely are the songs some where in the middle.
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Good record. Would be much closer to amazing if it looked liked this:
New Millennium
You and Me
Peruvian Skies
Hollow Years
Rasie the Knife
Hell's Kitchen
Speak to Me
Lines in the Sand
Cover my Eyes
Anna Lee
Trial of Tears
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Raise the Knife is so much better than a bunch of the songs on the CD, it would be so much better with it on it.
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I like the beginning of Trial of Tears, up until the, "hidden by disguise" part, then the entire song just falls apart. It almost seems like they had a really good song going, then had no idea where to go from there..... and, they came up with..... what they came up with.
Aww come on, The Wasteland is one of the best endings they've come up with.
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Burning my soul is really rockin why don't people like it? That would be so good if they played it live again...
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It's an alright album. The problem I have is that, for me, the album has some very high points but it also has some very low points. Rarely are the songs some where in the middle.
this
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It has some great work, a good amount of mediocre work, and a small amount of lame work.
Indeed.
If it were up to me, this is how I would have liked it to be:
Raise the knife
Cover my eyes
Peruvian skies
Hollow years (original version)
Burning my soul
Hell's kitchen
Lines in the sand
Trial of tears
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Nobody has mentioned just Let Me Breathe yet... :-\
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It's an awesome song. The song that hooked me into infinity.
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Nobody has mentioned just Let Me Breathe yet... :-\
I like it!
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That trade off bit with John and Derek is fuck yeah.
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Falling into Infinity is amazing
Yes, it is. And, yet, it's still in the bottom 3 or 4 DT albums on my list. That's how amazing this band is.
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Falling Into Infinity is hands-down the best-sounding DT album. Shirley did an amazing job on the mix.
It has some of DT's best material (Lines In The Sand, Trial of Tears, Hell's Kitchen), but also some of it worst dreck (Just Let Me Breathe, Burning My Soul, You Not Me) and some average-at-best pseudo-pop (Hollow Years, Take Away My Pain), along with a handful of decent-to-pretty good songs (New Millenium, Peruvian Skies, Anna Lee). The quality level is just too uneven for me rank it as one of their best.
Not to mention that gems like Raise The Knife and Speak To Me (among others) were left off.
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As simple as they are, I quite enjoy Just Let Me Breathe and Burning My Soul. Although they were the pre-cursor to Constant Motion and Never Enough, they have an intensity and drive that newer DT lacks, imo.
You Not Me is in my opinion the only real miss. But it is frustrating at times to think how much greater the album could have been. Still, #3 in my books.
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It has some of DT's best material (Lines In The Sand, Trial of Tears, Hell's Kitchen), but also some of it worst dreck (Just Let Me Breathe, Burning My Soul, You Not Me) and some average-at-best pseudo-pop (Hollow Years, Take Away My Pain), along with a handful of decent-to-pretty good songs (New Millenium, Peruvian Skies, Anna Lee). The quality level is just too uneven for me rank it as one of their best.
I think all of that is a true product of a lot of struggles that the band was involved in at the time, whether it be the band struggling with a bit of an identity crisis, the band vs. label struggle, or some of the other things they were going through. It remains a very interesting time in the band's history that produced some very interesting music.
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It has some of DT's best material (Lines In The Sand, Trial of Tears, Hell's Kitchen), but also some of it worst dreck (Just Let Me Breathe, Burning My Soul, You Not Me) and some average-at-best pseudo-pop (Hollow Years, Take Away My Pain), along with a handful of decent-to-pretty good songs (New Millenium, Peruvian Skies, Anna Lee). The quality level is just too uneven for me rank it as one of their best.
I think all of that is a true product of a lot of struggles that the band was involved in at the time, whether it be the band struggling with a bit of an identity crisis, the band vs. label struggle, or some of the other things they were going through. It remains a very interesting time in the band's history that produced some very interesting music.
Oh, I agree with you in all of that, and it remains a fascinating listen for me.
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I know I'm in the minority but the only thing that was left out of the album that should have been on is Speak to Me and Cover My Eyes. Still, there isn't a song on that album that I would rate below 7 or 7.5 out of 10.
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I know I'm in the minority but the only thing that was left out of the album that should have been on is Speak to Me and Cover My Eyes. Still, there isn't a song on that album that I would rate below 7 or 7.5 out of 10.
:tup I totally agree with you
Speak to Me and Cover My Eyes are fantastic songs, and definitely much better than some of the songs on the album.
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I think the thing that most hurt the CD as whole was hearing the demos...
Just made me think of what could have been...
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Hell's Kitchen and Trial of Tears alone make this album awesome.
The rest makes for an interesting listen. Although it is incredible uneven on the quality scale, as bosk said, it is very representative of where the band was at the time.
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Trial of Tears is "bad" because it just doesn't go anywhere. I hate the lyrics, the song is poorly constructed, James sounds really annoying and the guitar solo is just wanking. You Not Me is just AWFUL, plain and simple.
You spelled A nightmare to remember wrong
:neverusethis:
IS THIS REAL WORLD OR WHERE AM I?
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While most people say that the album is a balance of amazing vs some of their worst songs, I cry 'nay!' And respond that the better songs are actually in the very tippity top tier of DT material. Sure it has it's 'You Not Me's, but it has it's 'Lines In The Sand's which is, in my opinion, one of the top 10 DT songs if not higher. I agree that the album is amazing, and I think that the good moooore than balances out the bad. Unlike Systematic Chaos for me.
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I think that Take Away My Pain is very underrated. It is one of my favorites of the album and I could just listen to the singing all day.
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I think that Take Away My Pain is very underrated. It is one of my favorites of the album and I could just listen to the singing all day.
I agree, it's an underrated song :tup
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I personally hate terms like "underrated" and "overrated" because I think they are pretty meaningless and have an air of "I'm superior to most people out there because only I seem to understand the true value of such and such whereas most other people have it all wrong."
But, yes, it is a terrific song. I prefer the demo version to the album version.
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I personally hate terms like "underrated" and "overrated" because I think they are pretty meaningless and have an air of "I'm superior to most people out there because only I seem to understand the true value of such and such whereas most other people have it all wrong."
But, yes, it is a terrific song. I prefer the demo version to the album version.
I totally agree, and I also prefer the demo version to the album version, though it's overrated.
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demo version is the intended version. Yeah falling into infinity is in my top 5 DT albums, it's nice to hear them tone down a bit and just chill on their instruments. I wish they would approach the laid backness of Hollow Years, Anna Lee on their new stuff. Good ol' Prog Rock. Something just tells me they won't stop the metal for awhile.
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I like the beginning of Trial of Tears, up until the, "hidden by disguise" part, then the entire song just falls apart. It almost seems like they had a really good song going, then had no idea where to go from there..... and, they came up with..... what they came up with.
Aww come on, The Wasteland is one of the best endings they've come up with.
Did you mean the best ending The Beatles came up with?
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Great: Trial Of Tears, New Millenium
Good: Peruvian Skies, Lines In The Sand, Hollow Years (can get boring after awhile though)
Mediocre: Just Let Me Breathe, Burning My Soul, Take Away My Pain
Bad: You Not Me, Anna Lee,
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Great: Trial Of Tears, New Millenium
Good: Peruvian Skies, Lines In The Sand, Hollow Years (can get boring after awhile though)
Mediocre: Just Let Me Breathe, Burning My Soul, Take Away My Pain
Bad: You Not Me, Anna Lee,
No Hell's Kitchen and Lines In The Sand not at the top.
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Jesus, really? Have you never seen me post before?
I haven't. Who are you?
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Jesus, really? Have you never seen me post before?
I haven't. Who are you?
I bolded the answer.
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Jesus, really? Have you never seen me post before?
I haven't. Who are you?
I bolded the answer.
No...
(https://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b390/JonIsOwns/jesuspetrucci.jpg)
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For some reason that picture is incredibly disturbing.
Wait, it's his expression, he looks like JP's hiding something, or knows something I don't. :-[
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I like the beginning of Trial of Tears, up until the, "hidden by disguise" part, then the entire song just falls apart. It almost seems like they had a really good song going, then had no idea where to go from there..... and, they came up with..... what they came up with.
Aww come on, The Wasteland is one of the best endings they've come up with.
Did you mean the best ending The Beatles came up with?
That doesn't even make sense.
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Yes, it does. He's saying that it sounds like The Beatles, which is true. I'd say it's more Floyd, though.
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Yes, it does. He's saying that it sounds like The Beatles, which is true. I'd say it's more Floyd, though.
The wasteland SOUNDS NOTHING like tghe beatles really, i dont know waht beatles are we talking about.
And it's actually REALLY Floydish so im with you there.
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Yes, it does. He's saying that it sounds like The Beatles, which is true. I'd say it's more Floyd, though.
The wasteland SOUNDS NOTHING like tghe beatles really, i dont know waht beatles are we talking about.
And it's actually REALLY Floydish so im with you there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3RYvO2X0Oo
So this doesn't sound like the Wasteland you say? The melody is exactly the same.
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I can hear the similarities. I think "Wasteland" is melodically the Beatles, but atmospherically Floyd (if that makes sense).
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Yes, it does. He's saying that it sounds like The Beatles, which is true. I'd say it's more Floyd, though.
The wasteland SOUNDS NOTHING like tghe beatles really, i dont know waht beatles are we talking about.
And it's actually REALLY Floydish so im with you there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3RYvO2X0Oo
So this doesn't sound like the Wasteland you say? The melody is exactly the same.
You are kidding, right?
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I want whatever he's smoking. :D
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Yes, it does. He's saying that it sounds like The Beatles, which is true. I'd say it's more Floyd, though.
The wasteland SOUNDS NOTHING like tghe beatles really, i dont know waht beatles are we talking about.
And it's actually REALLY Floydish so im with you there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3RYvO2X0Oo
So this doesn't sound like the Wasteland you say? The melody is exactly the same.
It isn't.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3RYvO2X0Oo
Listen to Trial of Tears at 10:44 and the youtube video at 0:17. If you can't hear the similarity between that, you either have a hearing problem or you're too much of a fanboy to accept that they stole it from The Beatles. Even the descending bass line is the same. And before anyone says it's just coincidental, MP is just about the biggest Beatles fan on the planet, so he couldn't have missed this.
Anway, I don't wanna make a big deal out of it, but I think the original artists should be given some credit too.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3RYvO2X0Oo
Listen to Trial of Tears at 10:44 and the youtube video at 0:17. If you can't hear the similarity between that, you either have a hearing problem or you're too much of a fanboy to accept that they stole it from The Beatles. And before anyone says it's just coincidental, MP is just about the biggest Beatles fan on the planet, so he couldn't have missed this.
Anway, I don't wanna make a big deal out of it, but I think the original artists should be given some credit too.
there's some similarity, but in no way that's a rip-off. In music, lots of passages share these similarities. Of course there's a lot of influences in Dream Theater songs, but you're making a big deal out of nothing.
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We are fan boys? :lol I have been probably overly critical of the band over the years for there many "borrowed" riffs and melodies, so the idea that I am a huge fan boy looking to defend the band at all costs is funny to me. Yes, they have their moments of borrowing, but this is one is so far off the mark. I have been listening to that Beatles song for over 20 years, and the DT song since it came out, and I have never thought either sounded like the other. And listening just now, nope, still don't hear it.
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Hell's Kitchen is amazing.
That is all.
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Anway, I don't wanna make a big deal out of it
Too late for that.
but I think the original artists should be given some credit too.
:\ Give me a break. They aren't similar enough.
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I don't think it's a rip-off. But, DT DOES "try" to make their music sound like other bands sometimes. That's a fact ("inspiration corner"). So, maybe they didn't steal a melody note for note, but it's very possible that they said, "let's try to make this sound Beatles-esque or Floyd-ish." I don't mind if they did that, I just don't care for the sound of it. I think it's stupid sounding.
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I think you are stupid sounding. :biggrin: :p ;)
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Anway, I don't wanna make a big deal out of it, but I think the original artists should be given some credit too.
Well, it's not a cover song so DT is the original artist.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3RYvO2X0Oo
Listen to Trial of Tears at 10:44 and the youtube video at 0:17. If you can't hear the similarity between that, you either have a hearing problem or you're too much of a fanboy to accept that they stole it from The Beatles. Even the descending bass line is the same. And before anyone says it's just coincidental, MP is just about the biggest Beatles fan on the planet, so he couldn't have missed this.
Anway, I don't wanna make a big deal out of it, but I think the original artists should be given some credit too.
>Calls us fanboys
Sorry there are practically 0 similaritys between the songs.
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I'm incredibly confused right now.
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I think you are stupid sounding. :biggrin: :p ;)
You know, I hear that a lot! :lol
edit..
.... mostly from dumb ass liberals, though. Go figure!
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So how about that Falling Into Infinity...
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I don't think it's a rip-off. But, DT DOES "try" to make their music sound like other bands sometimes. That's a fact ("inspiration corner"). So, maybe they didn't steal a melody note for note, but it's very possible that they said, "let's try to make this sound Beatles-esque or Floyd-ish." I don't mind if they did that, I just don't care for the sound of it. I think it's stupid sounding.
It sounds very DT-esque to me.
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Underrated? yes. Amazing? Certain parts, yes.
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That is all.
Indeed, FII is amazing.
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I agree...it could be my fav too
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This album is quite special. It has some of DT's best (LITS, TOT, Hell's Kitchen) and it has the most awful songs DT has done (Burning My Soul, You Not Me)
this
also,
IMO the best sound of all dt's albums (you know, production wise)
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I recently listened to You Not Me again. I gotta say, the verses and chorus are pretty lame, but the outro is pretty damn awesome, anyone agree?
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I don't mind the main riff. i just wish they'd left the piano part. it's one of my Fav. sections off of what could've been
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I don't mind the main riff. i just wish they'd left the piano part. it's one of my Fav. sections off of what could've been
I agree with that. The piano riff is indeed amazing, and James's harmony vocals over it are not bad either.
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I assume you're reffering to the demo version?
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I like the whole song, but, yes, Adami, the ending is cool -- very Awake-like.
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I think it has some amazing songs. I have yet to hear all the demos and it's my fourth favorite DT album.
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Just listened to "You or me" it's actually better than you not me.
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Most good musicians borrow thematically from the Beatles.
This album is outstanding because it had DT's best keyboardist playing on it.
I don't think DT borrows/rips anyone off...they are undeniably unique.
However, Peruvian skies is a big homage to Pink Floyd and a crappy one too.
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I honestly consider Kevin Moore as the best keyboardist DT has ever had. Derek is unique in sounds, and his influence was significant, but not as that of Kevin Moore.
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I think Rudess is the best, Derek is almost as good, Moore is kinda Meh for me
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I think if it came down to raw skill, Rudess would win, and he deserves to; the guy went to f***ing Julliard when he was NINE, and has been a genius at the piano for forty years!
On another note, however, I do think that each keyboard player in DT had their own unique sound, and I like the three of them equally.
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I think if it came down to raw skill, Rudess would win, and he deserves to; the guy went to f***ing Julliard when he was NINE, and has been a genius at the piano for forty years!
On another note, however, I do think that each keyboard player in DT had their own unique sound, and I like the three of them equally.
Agree kinda almost, btu I am not a really big fan of Old DT
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I am not a really big fan of Old DT
Never woulda guessed.
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I am not a really big fan of Old DT
*faints in shock*
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Agree kinda almost, btu I am not a really big fan of Old DT
ORLY.jpg
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(https://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2008/9/7/orly128652844336822948.jpg)
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Going back and listening to this material makes me realize how much I miss Derek Sherinian's style of keyboards. He really made his mark within the short time he was with DT. Good stuff.
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I used to HATE Burning My Soul, but that keyboard solo is phenominal. I don't want to turn this into a "this keyboard player vs. that keyboard player" thread, but that solo really makes me miss the old style of DT's soloing, where it wasn't ONLY about chops and who can play the fastest. I think Derek's solo in Burning My Solo is more tasteful than most of Jordadn's new DT solos.
Wow. Between the first post and this one, I was pleasantly surprised that this could be the very first time, ever, that we actually agree about something. Then you went and badmouthed Trial of Tears and blew my euphoria.
This post is dead on, though, and it's exactly the reason why I've always preferred DS over the other two keyboard players. The guy just liked to rock out. He had a more organic style that provided a much more musical aspect that the later albums lacked. Because of that, I've always been a big fan of the album.
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I used to HATE Burning My Soul, but that keyboard solo is phenominal. I don't want to turn this into a "this keyboard player vs. that keyboard player" thread, but that solo really makes me miss the old style of DT's soloing, where it wasn't ONLY about chops and who can play the fastest. I think Derek's solo in Burning My Solo is more tasteful than most of Jordadn's new DT solos.
Wow. Between the first post and this one, I was pleasantly surprised that this could be the very first time, ever, that we actually agree about something. Then you went and badmouthed Trial of Tears and blew my euphoria.
This post is dead on, though, and it's exactly the reason why I've always preferred DS over the other two keyboard players. The guy just liked to rock out. He had a more organic style that provided a much more musical aspect that the later albums lacked. Because of that, I've always been a big fan of the album.
^^yup^^
when it was about writing great songs.
no derek fan is going to tell you he's musically more gifted than Jordan. It's not about that.
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I used to HATE Burning My Soul, but that keyboard solo is phenominal. I don't want to turn this into a "this keyboard player vs. that keyboard player" thread, but that solo really makes me miss the old style of DT's soloing, where it wasn't ONLY about chops and who can play the fastest. I think Derek's solo in Burning My Solo is more tasteful than most of Jordadn's new DT solos.
Wow. Between the first post and this one, I was pleasantly surprised that this could be the very first time, ever, that we actually agree about something. Then you went and badmouthed Trial of Tears and blew my euphoria.
This post is dead on, though, and it's exactly the reason why I've always preferred DS over the other two keyboard players. The guy just liked to rock out. He had a more organic style that provided a much more musical aspect that the later albums lacked. Because of that, I've always been a big fan of the album.
^^yup^^
when it was about writing great songs.
no derek fan is going to tell you he's musically more gifted than Jordan. It's not about that.
Agree'd with everything, And the derek thing its so true, he is not "musically better" but he plays more tasteful stuff.
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no derek fan is going to tell you he's musically more gifted than Jordan. It's not about that.
I can think of maybe one or two people who might be more musically gifted than JR, and it would require some real thought, but I can easily name a ton of keyboard players I like a lot more.
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Obviously Derek was a competent player, but his importance to the band had nothing to do with playing, but everything thing to do with showing the band what a true professional rock musician was. I think his personality lended itself to really blending everyone else's during that turmultuous time. While there were some certain differences of direction, my guess is that Derek got along with everyone.
He's almost like that one scene character that enhances the authenticity of a certain film.
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I am not a really big fan of Old DT
*faints in shock*
It's my opinion
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yes, we know.
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I think if it came down to raw skill, Rudess would win, and he deserves to; the guy went to f***ing Julliard when he was NINE, and has been a genius at the piano for forty years!
On another note, however, I do think that each keyboard player in DT had their own unique sound, and I like the three of them equally.
Fortunately, it doesn't just come down to raw skill (see: chops and technical skill), otherwise everyone would be talking about how much better a guitar player Yngwie Malmsteen is than David Gilmour. :biggrin:
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Though it contains many of their more mediocre songs (by DT standards), FII is still a great album.
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I think if it came down to raw skill, Rudess would win, and he deserves to; the guy went to f***ing Julliard when he was NINE, and has been a genius at the piano for forty years!
On another note, however, I do think that each keyboard player in DT had their own unique sound, and I like the three of them equally.
Fortunately, it doesn't just come down to raw skill (see: chops and technical skill), otherwise everyone would be talking about how much better a guitar player Yngwie Malmsteen is than David Gilmour. :biggrin:
Fine you win.
But they are all great.
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Does anyone else think that 3:36 of New Millennium hints at Scenes From A Memory ?
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Probably my fave album from start to finish, no throw away tracks. :metal Very well thought out and put together no matter what anyone says.
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Makes me also think I need to get the demo two disc version of this album.
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I really like this album. It has a few bad tracks which most everyone here has mentioned, but the high points are absolutely stellar and make up for the mediocrity. I also don't have much of a problem with the production. The album's probably my 6th or 7th favorite.
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Does anyone else think that 3:36 of New Millennium hints at Scenes From A Memory ?
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Does anyone else think that 3:36 of New Millennium hints at Scenes From A Memory ?
I always thought that part sounded like Home. It has everything but the girl moaning :lol
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Yeah exactly. :P
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Its more digestable than most DT albums but I wouldn't recommend it as the first album for a new fan.
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Trail of Tears :hefdaddy
Peruvian Skies, Lines in the Sand, Hell's Kitchen, Anna Lee, Hollow Years ;D
New Millennium, Take Away My Pain, You Not Me :-\
Just Let Me Breathe, Burning My Soul :sadpanda:
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Get rid of all the songs except New Millennium, Peruvian Skies, Hell's Kitchen, Lines In The Sand, Just Let Me Breathe (haters gonna hate), and Trial of Tears and make Hollow Years sound more like the Live at Budokan version and you've got a short but amazing album.
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MP's drumming on this album is very good. In fact, it's one of his strongest.
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That trade off bit with John and Derek on JLMB is fuck yeah.
Thats prob the only part of the song I don't like. Sounds much better when played live.
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That trade off bit with John and Derek on JLMB is fuck yeah.
Thats prob the only part of the song I don't like. Sounds much better when played live.
What's the difference?
Not a rhetorical question.
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Does anyone else think that 3:36 of New Millennium hints at Scenes From A Memory ?
Nope.
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It's literally nothing like Scenes From a Memory.
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It's literally nothing like Scenes From a Memory.
But it is slightly middle eastern sounding! Just like Home!
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That trade off bit with John and Derek on JLMB is fuck yeah.
Thats prob the only part of the song I don't like. Sounds much better when played live.
What's the difference?
Not a rhetorical question.
They don't trade off live
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That trade off bit with John and Derek on JLMB is fuck yeah.
Thats prob the only part of the song I don't like. Sounds much better when played live.
What's the difference?
Not a rhetorical question.
They don't trade off live
Ohhhh gotcha. I usually ignore any live versions (or recorded) of that song lol.
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That trade off bit with John and Derek on JLMB is fuck yeah.
Thats prob the only part of the song I don't like. Sounds much better when played live.
What's the difference?
Not a rhetorical question.
They don't trade off live
I prefer the studio version with the tradeoff. I love the song either way though. The LSFNY version is why I got into FII in the first place. :hat
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FII is indeed amazing, and it was the first DT album I bought. It contains so many beatiful songs that the two total trainwrecks (YNM, JLMB) aren't really that important. Sure, it could have been better if those had been replaced by RTK and STM, but it's still a very good album.
Anna Lee is fantastic.
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This is the last album i've heard before being able to listen to the albums at the time they came out, so coming from TOT, it was a strange album at first.
But man, it is a great album. JM, MP and DS absolutely slay on FII, and the production is awesome.
DS gave the band such a great diversity and atmosphere, which i feel they lacked after his departure.
I love FII, although i don't like some songs very much (TAMP especially) but it was such a creative album, and it felt like the result of amazing jams.
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Hell's Kitchen + Lines in the Sand is pretty amazing. Much of the rest of the album is terrible though.
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Even Trial of Tears? That's like the best song on the album.
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Even Trial of Tears? That's like the best song on the album.
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New Millennium makes me think of a futuristic city hovering above an ocean.
It has really nice pristine production which sounds really futuristic.
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Meh. I could never really get into New Millenium, tbh. It's pretty great in some parts, but I absolutely despise the chorus.
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That is all.
Exactly. :tup
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New Millennium is fucking amazing. IMO, some of LaBrie's best vocals.
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It's not amazing, but it's pretty good.
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It's not amazing, but it's pretty good.
Fair enough. :metal
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Peruvian Skies and Hell's Kitchen are phenomenal. New Millennium, Anna Lee, and Lines in the Sand are pretty good. Most of the rest of the album is very regrettable overall, as well as there being a few songs that I don't like one bit or don't sound like DT. I do think it is underrated just for Peruvian Skies and Hell's Kitchen, they make the album, but there's definitely a reason people don't like it too much. Still a must have for any fan.
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Pretty good album that is weighed down by a few songs. I used to like New Millennium a lot more, but still a decent song. You Not Me is not as bad as people made it out to be but it's still not a good song. Peruvian Skies, Hollow Years, Hells Kitchen, Lines in the Sand and Trial of Tears are fantastic songs. Burning my Soul, and Anna Lee are okay, though I don't listen to them that often. I don't listen to Take Away My Pain or Just let me Breathe much, I don't particularly like those songs.
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I like every song except for Burning My Soul. Yeah, I even like You Not Me.
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On a somewhat related note, am I the only one that can't listen to the intro to New Millennium without hearing Vicarious by Tool, or vice versa? o.O
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Aside from the obvious BMS and YNM, I love it. Anna Lee is the only ok song on it in my opinion. There's something about the vocals on Hollow Years though that has made me like every live version ever better. I really can't put my finger on it, sounds like a major copout but I just don't know what it is. It's just off to me, don't know if anybody else feels that way.
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Yeah there are some weaker tracks like You Not Me, Burning My Soul, Just Let Me Breathe, but damn this is the most diverse DT album as far as production. Everything just sounds crisp clear.
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Peruvian Skies, Hollow Years, Hells Kitchen, Lines in the Sand and Trial of Tears are amazing songs for me. The rest are songs that are not bad (by DT standards) but I wouldnt go out of my way to listen to now. Love Derek's keys on the album.
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Dat necro. Despite being a bit commercial, I think FII is the biggest grower of all the DT albums. I didn't like any of it the first time I heard it (except Lines in the Sand) and now it's way up there.
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Top 5 album for me. I'm totally in love with Lines In the Sand, Hollow Years, Trial Of Tears, New Millennium, Peruvian Skies, and Hell's Kitchen. The rest of the songs are all great too, even Burning My Soul is cool.
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For about 8 years, I considered this to be the worst DT album by far.
Then, about 6 months ago, the weirdest thing happened. I found myself revisiting it randomly... and enjoying certain songs A LOT.
Now I think it's one of my favourite albums of theirs. Funny how things change over time.
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For about 8 years, I considered this to be the worst DT album by far.
Then, about 6 months ago, the weirdest thing happened. I found myself revisiting it randomly... and enjoying certain songs A LOT.
Now I think it's one of my favourite albums of theirs. Funny how things change over time.
I'm still at this stage.
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I remember when I first heard FII (on release) and it was a huge letdown/WTF moment for me after the 1, 2 punch of I&W and Awake.......
Over time though (aside from the first couple of tracks which I still think are shite) it's grown on me to the point where I rate it higher than most of what followed .
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My least favorite Dream Theater album..... but it's still great. I hold this band in the highest of regards.
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Sometimes I prefer FFI over I&W. Is too amazing.
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So who else really likes Just Let Me Breathe? I feel like this is such an under appreciated song :metal
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I enjoy it as well. :metal
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So who else really likes Just Let Me Breathe? I feel like this is such an under appreciated song :metal
I rate everything on it bar New Millennium and You Not Me............so if JLMB is not rated highly by most then I agree with you. If I had to pick a few faves though it would be Peruvian Skies, Lines In The Sand and Hell's Kitchen
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So who else really likes Just Let Me Breathe? I feel like this is such an under appreciated song :metal
This was the first song I liked off FII, and the song that got me into the album. Still a very rockin' track, and I agree it's under appreciated. :metal
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FII would definitely rank on the better half of the DT albums for me, and it's probably the album that would get the most songs on my Top 10 or Top 5, those being Trial of Tears and Lines in the Sand. I love New Millennium and think it is exaggeratedly underrated. I think it would've worked better as an instrumental. Nothing against the lyrics or JLB, it's just the instrumental (the whole instrumental part of the song, that is) is really, really good. Hell's Kitchen is my favorite DT instrumental, Peruvian Skies is great (the version from High Voltage must be one of the best DT live performances I've seen) and TAMP is a beautiful song.
As for the other songs, they're all very solid for me and would listen to them over many other good songs from other bands, to call it some way. Very solid album with a great production. It's a shame its been brought down so many times, even by DT members themselves, because I know for a fact it leads to bias.
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In third place for me.
Awake
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Falling into Infinity
Very underrated record. "Lines in the Sand" is one of my favourite songs--ever. And Mike had a real in-the-pocket feel on this record. Probably second-favourite record drumming-wise.
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It has some of DT best songs (LITS, TO :'( :'( :'() but it has so many fillers :sadpanda:
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My favourite!
Drums and guitar sound amazing!
The songwriting is solid!
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Someday people will worship this work more than DT12. I do already.
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Someday people will worship this work more than DT12. I do already.
For me they're about equal: FII has higher highs (TOT, HK, LITS), but also lower lows (NM, YNM).
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Can't say I like everything on FII, but it is a great album, and it flows well. I didn't like it at first, but it's grown on me every year, mainly because it sounds like DT while not sounding too like DT. I'd love to see them do more like this, ie: let the songs breathe a little.
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track by track:
New Millennium - I think this is a great album opener. I love the synthy sound and I think this might be as close as DT gets to ever sounding like an 80's euro synth pop band. The instrumental section is just awesome! I do not get the hate for this song.
You Not Me - I like this song. I like the lyrics. I like the moody guitar. I do not get the hate for this song.
Peruvian Skies - Well rounded decent song that I rarely listen to. Find it a bit boring to be honest. Personal preference and I can see why people really love it.
Hollow Years - On a par with Another Day as a contender for DT's worst ever song. I think the Budokan version is very saccharin and JP's guitar solo there is hugely over rated IMO. I do not get the love for this song.
Burning My Soul - Not great but not dreadful. Some nice crunchy, bouncy riffs. Redeemed by what follows....
Hell's Kitchen - I think DT's most sublime instrumental. It's atmospheric, melodic, powerful and is not all about chops. I wish they'd do more instrumental stuff like this. The Segue in to the next song is really cool
Lines In the Sand - One of DT's strongest songs of all time. It rocks, great guitar solo, nice proggy moments, funky riffing, cool lyrics. Everything I love about DT is right here in this song.
Take Away My Pain - I like this and I think it is far superior to the demo version. I have stated that before. It's tighter and flows better.
Just Let me Breathe - Perhaps not DT's best rocker but still a good song with a nice scathing message. Nice riffing. The vocal line sounds a bit forced at times but the solo section is really cool. I also do not understand the hate for this song.
Anna Lee - I like this song. Something really different from DS and shows that DT can pitch up nice sentimental poppy songs with the best of them. I love the transition to the bridge and the slide solo. Nice and understated performance from DT
Trial of Tears - The 3rd Longish DT epic on the album. I like how the album pans out with NM at the start, LITS in the middle and they go out with a bang on this one. Somebody pointed out that this is a different sort of DT song. There's no fast unison stuff; but it is quite fusiony in places for sure. It has a lot of atmosphere and rounds the album off nicely. I love the opening riff and how the drums and bass come in. That's some real punch and I wish they'd mix their songs like this more. Punchy with room to breathe.
FII is a solid album and I think has more strong songs on than it is given credit for. With all its supposed lack of focus I actually think it's one of DTs most complete and stylistically diverse albums. It's more like the DT that I grew up with if you like. I love it and I think it's a really good, solid album.
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Someday people will worship this work more than DT12. I do already.
Imagine if DT12 had FII's production :eek
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Someday people will worship this work more than DT12. I do already.
Imagine if DT12 had FII's production :eek
I don't think it would really fit, although I wish every DT album had production as good as FII's.
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Shoot, that looks like fun, puppyonacid.
New Millennium - It's got a groovy feel to it, which I can appreciate, but otherwise the melodies of this song leave a bad taste in my mouth, especially during the chorus. I don't listen to it much.
You Not Me - I hate it. I hate how JLB sounds like he's trying to seduce me, I hate the chorus by Mr.-Bon-Jovi-hook-writer, I hate the awkwardly confident groove throughout it.
Peruvian Skies - Where the album picks up. I love Peruvian Skies, and probably put it in my top 20. It has a very "One"esque structure, but done better. The ending is absolutely rocking!
Hollow Years - I went through DT's discography to make sure, and this song is officially my least-listened to DT song. I find it incredibly boring and almost a chore to listen to. Doubtless, it'll probably strike me one day as something I've been missing out on but for now, I never listen to it.
Burning My Soul - I don't hate it the way I resent You Not Me, but it is without a doubt the must unintentionally comical song in DT's catalogue. I crack up every time the infamous line comes on: "But I don't give a shit, NOOOO". And I can't stand the chorus or MP's backing vocals to it.
Hell's Kitchen - What a perfect instrumental. Seriously, it's concise yet grand, proficient yet subdued. And the drumming in this song is some of my favorite in DT's catalogue. Simple, yet unexpectedly complex. Love the way he implements the cymbal work during the song's finale, and the "slow" fill shortly before the crescendo. Love love love.
Lines In the Sand - I with all my heart wish I liked this song more than I do. I love everything about it besides the chorus, which I cannot stomach for the life of me. The guitar solo is groovy and wonderful, the verses are great, and the vocal section with "we fabricate our demons" is chill-inducing. But the chorus... agh. I don't like ANYTHING about it. Maybe one day.
Take Away My Pain - Nope.
Just Let me Breathe - Double nope.
Seriously though, I feel similarly to these two as I do toward BMS, just without the comical lyrics. TAMPon sounds so insincere lyrically (obviously debatable based on ones connection to the content) and boring sonically, with very little driving it. JLMB is a rockin' song, but if you don't like the groove of it, it has nothing else to offer.
Anna Lee - It's a nice song, but it has a low re-listening capacity. I find myself enjoying it reasonably whenever it comes on.
Trial of Tears - The perfect closer. When I read people's descriptions of it before listening, I expecting to have a "meh" attitude towards it, but this is one of the few songs that didn't even need to grow on me in order for me to appreciate it. Probably a top 10 song me. The misheard lyrics has somewhat marred the enjoyability of the pre-instrumental section, though :-\
Overall, FII has the most clunkers of any DT album (for my ears, of course), but given its highs, I don't know if I could call it my least favorite. The crisp production is my favorite for any DT album as well, and Derek's keyboard contribution provides a unique flavor to the album. A solid album overall!
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In response to the OP:
YES, it is absolutely mind blowing for me. I like all songs on it.
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'Trial of Tears' is soooo good. It's what 'Scarred' is to Awake: The epic track where the musical strength of the album is showcased one more time in the most wonderful way. Both tracks feature my favorite JP solos, but lately I have to give the edge to the TOT solo. That one is just completely out-of-the-box fusion frenzy. He's really painting with beautiful colors. I'd love for him to do stuff like that again.
By the way, JM's bass is DEEP under that solo, damn.
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'Trial of Tears' is soooo good. It's what 'Scarred' is to Awake: The epic track where the musical strength of the album is showcased one more time in the most wonderful way. Both tracks feature my favorite JP solos, but lately I have to give the edge to the TOT solo. That one is just completely out-of-the-box fusion frenzy. He's really painting with beautiful colors. I'd love for him to do stuff like that again.
By the way, JM's bass is DEEP under that solo, damn.
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Trial of Tears and Scarred are the only classic tunes on 2 otherwise bland albums that don't have any other memorable songs.
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:omg:
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Trial of Tears and Scarred are the only classic tunes on 2 otherwise bland albums that don't have any other memorable songs.
I usually don't like responding with pictures but...
(https://images.encyclopediadramatica.es/thumb/a/a1/U_Wot_M8_Original.jpg/180px-U_Wot_M8_Original.jpg)
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I don't like either of those albums. Both are extremely disappointing given the 2 legendary albums that they're sandwiched between.
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Terrible opinions.
Bant.
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Happy 17th Anniversary FII.
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I'd say there are only two bad songs on the album, but in varying degrees. Trial of Tears is "bad" because it just doesn't go anywhere. I hate the lyrics, the song is poorly constructed, James sounds really annoying and the guitar solo is just wanking. You Not Me is just AWFUL, plain and simple.
All the other ones are just awesome songs. (notice I said the "S" word.... SONGS). Not just vehicles to show how well Petrucci can trade off with a really fast keyboard player.
Finally, someone who shares my opinion about TOT.
I've tried time after time to like this song, but it just doesn't do anything for me. Nothing against the song. I just have a different taste.
I really want to like it, especially because it is going to be taking up 13 minutes on the new DVD. :(
As for the rest of FII, I find it a great album overall, but probably my least favorite DT album in the JLB era.
- Lines In The Sand is a straight rocker. It has this bluesy rock vibe to it that no other DT song really has. I can't really explain it. And it's awesome.
- Peruvian Skies has so many sick riffs. I love it because it doesn't really involve much intricacy, but instead showcases a ton of simple, but killer riffs.
- Anna Lee is beautiful. It is a contemporary-ish ballad, but I think I counted like 19 chord changes in the chorus alone. So, maybe not so "contemporary". The arrangement is awesome.
- Hell's Kitchen is one of my favorite instrumentals from DT. It is an epic (and I hate that word) 4 minutes.
- Hollow Years is another beautiful song. I especially love the version from Budokan. It shows how good DT can be at making standard, more contemporary music.
Other than that though, I don't ever listen to anything else.
New Millennium, You Not Me, Burning My Soul, Take Away My Pain, and Just Let Me Breathe are LITERALLY my 5 least favorite DT songs of all time.
I do enjoy some parts of Trial Of Tears (It's Raining chorus, etc.), and that song is not as bad as the others just listed. But it is still near the bottom.
I'm happy for those who love it though. Maybe some day I will grow to like it more as well.
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Wow, it's 17 years old? Crazy stuff.
I was never a huge fan of Trial of Tears, until the bridge section caught me (is it The Wasteland section?), had a very Jethro Tull feel to it with the guitars and something just clicked. Also the "stream of consciousness" section is an amazing vocal moment. Too bad all that stuff happens really late in the song and we have some dragged out verses and chorus' to get there. The chorus is the least interesting part of the song in my opinion but now I'm used to it, it's part of the build up to the good stuff for me now.
New Millennium is actually my favourite songs off of Falling into Infinity next to Lines in the Sand (- very unique song with amazing guitar solo what's not to like). I never quite got the hate for NM, it's a very groovy song with some badass riffage, perhaps it also drags out a big and doesn't get to the point, but it's totally a top 10 song for me. ;)
I even like Burning my Soul, I just wish the vocals were a bit harsher or something I'm not sure maybe Awake James needed to be on here? But there's something holding it back from being as badass of a rocker as it should be. It's alright though.
Oh, and You Or Me's chorus is tenfold better than You Not Me, don't even try and convince me otherwise, I might go into more detail about why I think this but that's probably already been discussed extensively in this thread. :P
Finally, Anna Lee is underrated and Hollow Years is totally overrated. :D
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Oh, and You Or Me's chorus is tenfold better than You Not Me, don't even try and convince me otherwise, I might go into more detail about why I think this but that's probably already been discussed extensively in this thread. :P
Let's just agree they're both pretty bad. :lol
Actually, I'd still take YNM's chorus any day though. It doesn't really fit the song, but it's better than the weak attempt at the angsty '90s thing. :biggrin:
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Since this thread has been revived, I will just post this FII-related post I made in another thread.
"What is the DT sound?
I listened to their albums in chronological order three times last week, and I was surprised that the "DT sound" is actually not the IaW and Awake sound. Some elements of the music from those albums are still heard in the later DT songs, but you can distinctly place the songs as coming from that era. I mean, insert any DT 12 song in an IaW or Awake playlist, and it would not fit.
I believe the "DT sound" that a lot of people refer to actually originated with FII, specifically two songs: Peruvian Skies and Trial of Tears. The approach of keyboard playing is different, of course, but the way they write and structure songs in general, I think, can be traced to these two songs. The way they write ballads nowadays is also more akin to the ballads in FII, especially Anna Lee, rather than ballads like Surrounded from IaW.
Not coincidentally, I believe that what people call the signature MP drum style also took a coherent shape in Trial of Tears. A lot of MP's drum fills can already be heard in Metropolis Pt. 1, but the combo of the fills, the hi-hat work, and the bass drum patterns can be heard coherently in one song in Trial of Tears. I even listened to Trial of Tears and Blind Faith back to back twice, and I smiled at hearing how similar MP's approach was in those two songs. Peruvian Skies also had the Portnoyisms (heh!), but I feel that it was just more pronounced in ToT. Of course, he solidified the style into a signature sound with Metropolis Pt. 2."
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"Falling into Infinity" was actually my first DT album. It was pretty good (good enough for me to check out the bands other stuff), but after I listened to "Scenes from a Memory" and "Images and Words", FII felt somewhat blunt.
A couple of months later, I went back to FII and was happy to find an album in which you can actually hear the bass. :D It's not my favorite album, but I still like most of the parts. And Hell's Kitchen is simply amazing.
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FII isn't my favorite DT album, but it's the one I play the most.
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Wow 17-years... I remember driving to Sonic's (an actual record shop; remember those?) in Abingdon VA to purchase that album with lunch money I'd saved (I was a junior in High School). I almost ran out of gas on the way home! Most of my money went to music and gas now that I think about it.
TOT is my DT song; anytime someone asks me who DT is, I play TOT for them. It just recently surpassed ACoS for me as my all-time favorite.
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Yeah, FII is the type of album that makes you remember where you were during it's release. I remember where I lived, the car I was driving. Saw DT live for the first time on that tour. Yeah, that was a good year. :tup
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I've just seen that it's FII's 17th anniversary today, so happy anniversary to that album! 2 DT album anniversaries on the same day, wow!
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Add me to the list of people who don't care for "Burning My Soul" or "You Not Me"
And I think FII is a bit to ballad-heavy, but the good stuff on that album is stellar and the sound is the best they ever had. Still sounds good 17 years later. In fact, I'd say it's Dream Theater's best produced album in terms of the sonic qualities.
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Add me to the list of people who don't care for "Burning My Soul" or "You Not Me"
And I think FII is a bit to ballad-heavy, but the good stuff on that album is stellar and the sound is the best they ever had. Still sounds good 17 years later. In fact, I'd say it's Dream Theater's best produced album in terms of the sonic qualities.
I definitely agree with all of this. YNM ranks at the bottom five of my DT list. I always say that TWIUTB, with better production, was the better choice.
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In fact, I'd say it's Dream Theater's best produced album in terms of the sonic qualities.
No question.
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I didn't notice the sound quality at the time - I was more worried about which imposter band had kidnapped my beloved Dream Theater . I grew to like it with time ;D
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(https://scontent-a-fra.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/s720x720/1910006_10152750031494759_4165938556625651404_n.jpg?oh=1bacd51bc114044bff8d8a41674cb953&oe=548E6E08)
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(https://scontent-a-fra.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/s720x720/1910006_10152750031494759_4165938556625651404_n.jpg?oh=1bacd51bc114044bff8d8a41674cb953&oe=548E6E08)
Would they sound noticeably different?
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Having heard the demos, I'm glad the album came out the way it did. I do miss Cover My Eyes and Speak to Me, would have loved to hear those with the awesome production but the album would have gotten very ballad heavy. The rest of the demos have no place on the album as they are inferior to every song on it.
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details at https://brookvalerecords.com/
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Wondering how they are going to split this one up. BMS/HK/LITS don't have any place to split them up really. But that would make for a pretty long side 1.
Same thing with the end. Does ToT go with one song before it, or two?
I'm sure they've done it, but it just seems like there no decent way to divide this album amongst 4 sides. :-[
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These look awesome!!!!!
Come on Oct.20th :metal
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[ Thread starter - 'Falling into Infinity is amazing' ]
...you didn't know that? ....
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Terrbile songs: Almost All
Good songs: Trial of Tears
*hides face with hands* "don't hurt me..."
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Wondering how they are going to split this one up. BMS/HK/LITS don't have any place to split them up really. But that would make for a pretty long side 1.
Same thing with the end. Does ToT go with one song before it, or two?
I'm sure they've done it, but it just seems like there no decent way to divide this album amongst 4 sides. :-[
The album is out on vinyl already, Music On Vinyl pressed in last year. The way that one is set up has side B as Hollow Years/Burning My Soul/Hell's Kitchen and the C side is Lines In The Sand/Take Away My Pain/Just Let Me Breathe.
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I don't like either of those albums. Both are extremely disappointing given the 2 legendary albums that they're sandwiched between.
Hahaha, geeeezus.
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FII isn't my favorite DT album, but it's the one I play the most.
I would have to agree....I could listen to Hell's Kitchen a 100 times and not get bored! :smiley:
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I prefer Falling Into Infinity to Awake.
:tup
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Terrbile songs: Almost All
Good songs: Trial of Tears
*hides face with hands* "don't hurt me..."
Hell's Kitchen, Lines In The Sand would like to see you now. :angry:
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Terrbile songs: Almost All
Good songs: Trial of Tears
*hides face with hands* "don't hurt me..."
Hell's Kitchen, Lines In The Sand would like to see you now. :angry:
Having just listened to it on the bus back from school, Hell's Kitchen is good, I'm not a fan of lines in the sand tho :-\
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Lines in the sand is my 2nd favourite song after Octavarium.
:emo: Dat Solo.
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Lines in the sand is my 2nd favourite song after Octavarium.
:emo: Dat Solo.
LITS is up there for sure.
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I have vastly different opinions to most people here, though.
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I have vastly different opinions to most people here, though.
Most people do ! :tup
I for one think Awake is really boring !
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LITS is amazing.
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I have vastly different opinions to most people here, though.
Most people do ! :tup
I for one think Awake is really boring !
That was a risky thing to say!
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I for one think Awake is really boring !
(https://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Mike-Ehrmantraut-Shakes-His-Head-Breaking-Bad.gif)
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I listened to Falling Into Infinity quite recently, and it is very underrated. 5th best DT album, I'd say.
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I have listened to the album a lot lately (three times just yesterday) and... I really like it. More than before. In fact, from a certain point of view, I might actually consider it the most consistent and interesting 90's DT album. Yes, that includes Scenes. But then again, like I said, only from a certain point of view. Peruvian Skies, Hell's Kitchen, Lines in the Sand and Trial are absolutely astonishing, really. Hollow Years is one of the best DT ballads, IMHO, and I really don't get the hate against both Burning My Soul and You Not Me - from the way everybody talks about them you would expect N*SYNC or something... when really those are solid songs, that maybe are too radio-oriented... but aren't Wither or The Spirit Carries On too, then?
If anything, this album suffers from the abundance of ballads, but so does ADTOE. And the production is really cool. This album definitely needs more love!
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I listened to it a week or so ago after not listening to it for... what, a year at least. I liked it worse than the last time I heard it. There are a few good songs on there and a few amazing ones (LitS, ToT) but there's a lot of songs that I just don't really like.
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Falling Into Infinity > Awake.
Flame Resistant Armour Activated.
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There are a few of their best songs on here. It's certainly much better than SC in my opinion. LITS, TOT, and HK are fantastic.
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I for one think Awake is really boring !
(https://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Mike-Ehrmantraut-Shakes-His-Head-Breaking-Bad.gif)
Oh you've convinced me otherwise with a GIF.
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Trial of Tears and Lines in the Sand are Top 50 DT songs for sure. The rest of the album is pretty good as well. It's my least favorite in their discography but that says more about how great DT's body of work is than it does about FII. I think that it's a great album regardless of where it is in my rankings.
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Falling Into Infinity > Awake.
Flame Resistant Armour Activated.
I will protect you!
FII is an album that to this day I still appreciate more and more every time I listen to it, to the point where it may even just nudge out IaW for a top 3 spot, and I fucking love IaW.
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New Millenium - :hefdaddy
You Not Me - :-\
Peruvian Skies - :)
Hollow Years - :tdwn
Burning My Soul - :-\
Hell's Kitchen - :)
Lines In The Sand - :hefdaddy
Take Away My Pain - :tdwn
Just Let Me Breathe - :-\
Anna Lee - :|
Trial Of Tears - :-\
6:00 - :hefdaddy
Caught In A Web - :)
Innocence Faded - :-\
A Mind Beside Itself (all of it) - :hefdaddy
The Mirror - :hefdaddy
Lie - :-\
Lifting Shadows - :|
Scarred - :hefdaddy
Space-Dye Vest - :'(
I prefer Awake
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Used to dislike both FII and Awake, almost all of it, but looking back, I really don't know why I disliked FII that much, they put out more songs than ever on any album, and there's only 2 or 3 letdowns imo.
As for Awake, I for one think Awake is really boring !
Not everything guys, just: Innocence Faded, Lifting Shadows, Erotomania, The Silent Man.
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You know what, I really tried to like it or get into it. It just doesn't happen. I dislike most of the vocal parts on this album. It definitely has some good (instrumental) parts, but some refrains really annoy me (especially where MP sings in the background, which I always dislike). Besides half of SC, this is their only album that doesn't work for me, so fortunately there's still enough DT for me!
I am really happy that a lot of people like it though :biggrin:
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What's not to like about Take Away My Pain, Anna Lee ?
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Anna Lee is awesome, Take Away My Pain? :huh: :huh: :huh:
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What's not to like about Take Away My Pain, Anna Lee ?
Anna Lee is awesome, Take Away My Pain? :huh: :huh: :huh:
Didn't think I was in the minority on that one, but oh well, I'll explain.
For Anna Lee:
Nothing about it gives me anything I can't already got from Another Day, Surrounded, To Live Forever, Lifting Shadows, etc. I don't feel like I get anything new here, so I just kinda get bored. I can understand why some people would like it, since those are good songs, but I don't take anything away from it after I listen to it, & it feels so watered-down in production that I have no reason to come back to it. So as I said, I get bored. If Speak To Me made it onto FII, this would be the first song I'd think to replace. :mehlin
For Take Away My Pain:
This was a bit of a weird one for me. When I first heard it, I couldn't pinpoint what I disliked so much about it, but I knew for a fact that I did in fact dislike it (even now, I had to open the song in another tab to write this). In the verses, although they're relatively quiet, nothing seems to fit together quite right. The main riff sounds dizzy & confused (like they made it up on the spot & looped it, it's played very subpar), the bass sound is god-awful (it dominates way too much when it's there & it sounds too rough, buzzy & springy (if that makes sense) to blend in at all), the drums are good but hardly noticeable & feel a bit too active for what's supposed to be slower, more relaxed section of a slower, more relaxed song. Honestly, James seems like the only one who knows what he's doing. Then it builds up to the chorus, which is a total anticlimax. It lacks any power that a built-up chorus should have & the way it treats itself like some kind of epic statement that's going to move the hearts of millions is just frustrating & obnoxious because I don't hear it in the slightest. When I first heard it, this was easily in my bottom 5 DT songs, but now that I think about it, it's an easy #1.
But whatever, opinions, I'm in the minority it seems. *copy-pasting to controversial opinions forum*
Edit: Forgot to mention that the demo to TAMP is WAAAAY better than the studio version. Just throwing that out there . ;)
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The problem with FII is that it's inconsistent. Not to give the wrong impression, I actually find it to be a classic now as it really represents an aspect of DT that they probably needed to express at the time after the previous 3 albums which were in general, pretty busy and full on albums. It's got some great songs though, and even some great moments in the not so preferable songs.
For me the anomalies are You Not Me, Take Away My Pain and Hollow Years. Not necessarily bad songs but there's definitely something weird about them that I struggle to resonate with, I've felt this way since I first heard them and believe me, I've tried to like them. I might have convinced myself that I kinda do sometimes but still can't shake something being a bit 'off' about them, but clearly I'm not expressing myself very well here. I assume some others might have felt this way about these tracks but I dunno. Haha..
And then there's the fact that some songs took a while to grow for me, so the first impression of the album took a bit of work to get to the 'classic' status that it seems to have now. New Millennium, Just Let Me Breathe, Lines in the Sand and even Trial of Tears were growers for me.
I think the only ones I properly enjoyed from the first listen were Peruvian Skies, Burning my Soul, Anna Lee and Hell's Kitchen. Yeah, I'm kinda dumbfounded that I didn't click with Lines in the Sand and New Millennium because they're quite possibly top 10 (or 20) songs for me now, and to a similar extent ToT but not quite as good as LITS and NM.
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What's not to like about Take Away My Pain, Anna Lee ?
Anna Lee is awesome, Take Away My Pain? :huh: :huh: :huh:
Didn't think I was in the minority on that one, but oh well, I'll explain.
For Anna Lee:
Nothing about it gives me anything I can't already got from Another Day, Surrounded, To Live Forever, Lifting Shadows, etc. I don't feel like I get anything new here, so I just kinda get bored. I can understand why some people would like it, since those are good songs, but I don't take anything away from it after I listen to it, & it feels so watered-down in production that I have no reason to come back to it. So as I said, I get bored. If Speak To Me made it onto FII, this would be the first song I'd think to replace. :mehlin
For Take Away My Pain:
This was a bit of a weird one for me. When I first heard it, I couldn't pinpoint what I disliked so much about it, but I knew for a fact that I did in fact dislike it (even now, I had to open the song in another tab to write this). In the verses, although they're relatively quiet, nothing seems to fit together quite right. The main riff sounds dizzy & confused (like they made it up on the spot & looped it, it's played very subpar), the bass sound is god-awful (it dominates way too much when it's there & it sounds too rough, buzzy & springy (if that makes sense) to blend in at all), the drums are good but hardly noticeable & feel a bit too active for what's supposed to be slower, more relaxed section of a slower, more relaxed song. Honestly, James seems like the only one who knows what he's doing. Then it builds up to the chorus, which is a total anticlimax. It lacks any power that a built-up chorus should have & the way it treats itself like some kind of epic statement that's going to move the hearts of millions is just frustrating & obnoxious because I don't hear it in the slightest. When I first heard it, this was easily in my bottom 5 DT songs, but now that I think about it, it's an easy #1.
But whatever, opinions, I'm in the minority it seems. *copy-pasting to controversial opinions forum*
Edit: Forgot to mention that the demo to TAMP is WAAAAY better than the studio version. Just throwing that out there . ;)
Maybe I wasn't very clear, I STRONGLY dislike TAMP, and I think we're not in the minority at all.
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First, I haven't gone back to read the whole thread, so if any of this is deja vu all over again, I apologize.
Second, any discussion of this album HAS to include the Ytsejam "Director's Cut" of this record. I listen to that more than the original release (in part because it has my favorite DT song of all time, "Cover My Eyes", on it).
I strongly like this album. Not in my Top 3, but good record.
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For me the anomalies are You Not Me, Take Away My Pain and Hollow Years. Not necessarily bad songs but there's definitely something weird about them that I struggle to resonate with, I've felt this way since I first heard them and believe me, I've tried to like them.
Do you feel similarly about the 2004 live version of Hollow Years, or just the album version? To be honest I prefer JR's solo piano version of that particular song by a lot, but just curious if the more 'electric' version with the extended solo would have fit better on the album instead of the original?
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I've been listening to FII a bit lately and I have to say, my least favourite song on the album is actually Lines in the Sand. I dislike the intro, main verse riffs and mainly the vocals in the chorus. I will admit the solo is amazing though, too bad it's in an otherwise terrible song.
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You like You Not Me better than LitS?
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If only they'd return to that sound, I'd be one happy camper!
GREAT ALBUM! Not flawless (you Not Me), but damn close!
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I've been listening to FII a bit lately and I have to say, my least favourite song on the album is actually Lines in the Sand. I dislike the intro, main verse riffs and mainly the vocals in the chorus. I will admit the solo is amazing though, too bad it's in an otherwise terrible song.
You like You Not Me better than LitS?
Count me in on those that don't like LITS. For me, it's okay but the guest vocals ruin it. So yes, I like YNM more than LITS, even with the cheesy, over-emoted vocals in the chorus ("It's all about YYYYEEEEEEEEEUUUUUUUUUWWWW, not MEEEEAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYY".)
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I'd actually enjoy You Not Me more if they kept the middle section from the demo.
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For me, the PERFECT FII album would be to take off "You Not Me" & "Hollow Years" and replace with "Raise The Knife". Then switch "TAMP" & "LITS" with their demo versions instead. :hefdaddy
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I prefer this album a bit more than I&W.
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You like You Not Me better than LitS?
1. Trial Of Tears
2. Peruvian Skies
3. Hell's Kitchen
4. Take Away My Pain
5. You Not Me
:tup
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I remember liking You Not Me when the album first came out. It was different, and a full album of songs like that would be awful, but it was a good song. It is still not the worst song on the album, let alone the worst DT song.
Second, any discussion of this album HAS to include the Ytsejam "Director's Cut" of this record.
It doesn't really. That is just an under-produced, extended version of mediocrity.
...Lines in the Sand. I dislike the intro, main verse riffs and mainly the vocals in the chorus. I will admit the solo is amazing though, too bad it's in an otherwise terrible song.
Sums up my feelings. That intro might have been a good idea, but it is lame and goes on way, way too long; and the backing vocals are terrible. They don't fit a DT song, and having a guest vocalist of that style was a bad idea from the beginning.
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For me the anomalies are You Not Me, Take Away My Pain and Hollow Years. Not necessarily bad songs but there's definitely something weird about them that I struggle to resonate with, I've felt this way since I first heard them and believe me, I've tried to like them.
Do you feel similarly about the 2004 live version of Hollow Years, or just the album version? To be honest I prefer JR's solo piano version of that particular song by a lot, but just curious if the more 'electric' version with the extended solo would have fit better on the album instead of the original?
That's a good point, I think the those live versions are much better, especially the later versions with the guitar solo, but even the live versions during the FII tour had some more spice to it with the keys if I remember correctly. I would note that I feel similarly about Space Dye Vest vs the live version for basically the same reasons.
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Falling Into Infinity is pretty great yeah, I like Derek's contributions and the varied musical styles throughout the album. I for one love Doug's vocals on Lines In the Sand and it's definetely a top 10 song for me :tup
Felt like I never ranked the songs on this album so...
Lines In the Sand
Trial of Tears
Hell's Kitchen
Peruvian Skies
Hollow Years
New Millennium
Anna Lee
Take Away My Pain
Just Let Me Breathe
Burning My Soul
You Not Me
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I for one love Doug's vocals on Lines In the Sand
Yep, me too. I think they work very well.
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I for one love Doug's vocals on Lines In the Sand
Yep, me too. I think they work very well.
Same here :coolio
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I for one love Doug's vocals on Lines In the Sand
Yep, me too. I think they work very well.
Same here :coolio
I was starting to think I was the only one, since everyone seems to hate them. :dunno: I think they work perfectly for the song.
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I think I'm the only one who thinks LitS is easily the album's weakest song :P
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I think I'm the only one who thinks LitS is easily the album's weakest song :P
(https://i.imgur.com/EZGPf3S.gif)
:P
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Second, any discussion of this album HAS to include the Ytsejam "Director's Cut" of this record.
It doesn't really. That is just an under-produced, extended version of mediocrity.
Well, it does. Not saying you have to like it better, but it is SO different than the final released version (and I am not at all talking "production", only song structure, order, and album content) that it has to be at least considered.
Personally, I DO like that version better, but that is a taste question only and so irrelevant. But it does go to the band's intent and state of mind at the time.
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Not saying you have to like it better, but it is SO different than the final released version (and I am not at all talking "production", only song structure, order, and album content) that it has to be at least considered.
I disagree. To me, demos are like rough drafts. Sure, they can be interesting to hear to see what the song sounded like before the final draft, but ultimately since those rough drafts are not found on FII, they really aren't relevant to the discussion of the album itself. For example, I am a big fan of Raise the Knife and Cover My Eyes (the live acoustic version), but even though those songs are from the FII sessions, they aren't actually on the album, so they don't really have to be considered when discussing the album.
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Ranking time!!!!!
11. Take Away My Pain
10. You Not Me
9. Just Let Me Breathe
8. Anna Lee
7. Burning My Soul
6. New Millenium
5. Hell's Kitchen
4. Hollow Years
3. Trial of Tears
2. Peruvian Skies
1. Lines in the Sand
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I disagree. To me, demos are like rough drafts. Sure, they can be interesting to hear to see what the song sounded like before the final draft, but ultimately since those rough drafts are not found on FII, they really aren't relevant to the discussion of the album itself.
That was the point I was trying to make. We can't evaluate a piece of art based on what was not included. We don't judge a movie based on the deleted scenes found on the DVD. Sure they are part of the record of the evolution of the art, but not for basis of critique of the art itself.
If we want to critique the "Ytsejam Cut" of the album, that is a fine and valid discussion, but separate from the critique of the album itself.
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Ranking time!!!!!
Kind of already did this but I'm bored so yeah.
11. Take Away My Pain
10. Hollow Years
9. Anna Lee
8. Burning My Soul
7. You Not Me
6. Just Let Me Breathe
5. Trial Of Tears
4. Hell's Kitchen
3. Peruvian Skies
2. New Millenium
1. Lines In The Sand
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Top 5 album for me : if the ballads, Anna Lee excluded, weren't dragging it down slightly, it would be top 3 I guess. A very solid album in any case. And the production, guys, the production! :omg:
B.Lee
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1. Trial of Tears
2. Lines in the Sand
3. New Millenium
4. Hell's Kitchen
5. Burning My Soul
6. Peruvian Skies
7. Just Let Me Breathe / Take Away My Pain
8. Anna Lee
9. You Not Me
10. Hollow Years
Keep in mind I wouldn't rate any of those songs below a 6/10.
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I honestly never really bother that much with the production quality as others seem to, WDaDU obviously does drag it down a lot, but DT12 and FII for instance, I never notice any major production flaws.
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I honestly never really bother that much with the production quality as others seem to, WDaDU obviously does drag it down a lot, but DT12 and FII for instance, I never notice any major production flaws.
I'm not a production guy either, but to me, the production on FII allows the music to breathe, not that on DT12.
B.Lee
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I disagree. To me, demos are like rough drafts. Sure, they can be interesting to hear to see what the song sounded like before the final draft, but ultimately since those rough drafts are not found on FII, they really aren't relevant to the discussion of the album itself.
That was the point I was trying to make. We can't evaluate a piece of art based on what was not included. We don't judge a movie based on the deleted scenes found on the DVD. Sure they are part of the record of the evolution of the art, but not for basis of critique of the art itself.
If we want to critique the "Ytsejam Cut" of the album, that is a fine and valid discussion, but separate from the critique of the album itself.
Why not, especially if it makes clear (and it is ABUNDANTLY clear here) that the "final draft" does not reflect the artist's intent? I grant you, this wouldn't apply to say, The Number of the Beast, where Steve Harris was clear it was his decision to leave off "Total Eclipse", but - and I know there is some disagreement within the members - there was a lot that was out of the control of the band at this time and it forever influenced future releases. This is not a collection of home demos. These are more significant than that.
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Because releasing an album isn't just about the band and their artistic intent. It is a collaborative effort (artists, producers, label, etc...) and the album was released with the band's name on the disc. I am sure lots of albums are released with the artists thinking or wishing something could have been done differently. We can evaluate the "director's cut" on the album, but in discussion of the album itself, it is a footnote.
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Because releasing an album isn't just about the band and their artistic intent. It is a collaborative effort (artists, producers, label, etc...) and the album was released with the band's name on the disc. I am sure lots of albums are released with the artists thinking or wishing something could have been done differently. We can evaluate the "director's cut" on the album, but in discussion of the album itself, it is a footnote.
Haha, if it isn't about the band or it's intent, what is it about? Have you ever just gone out and bought an album because it was produced by xxx? Or bought an album because it was the "latest on Arista Records"? How about that tour? Did you go see that tour by the Engineer on the latest Noel Gallagher record?
Listen, I'm trying to be humorous, and there are cases where I would agree with you. But this was more than that. There was talk of folding the band because of the record company and label garbage. This is more than a "footnote".
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Well, it's a good thing the record company got it their way, because most of the demos were pretty bad and later we got SFAM instead of one OK sounding 15 minute song.