Author Topic: Kamelot (Read 152325 times)

The Walrus · « **Reply #910 on:** March 02, 2018, 01:17:02 PM »

The more I listen to it and read the lyrics, I can't tell if I just don't like the band anymore or if they're really just different. This vibe is so reminiscent of what they've become ever since they released the video for The Great Pandemonium, but it lacks the energy that had. The lyrics since Tommy joined have been so brooding and maudlin it's borderline funny, but I can't tell if that's just my jaded taste in metal talking or if it really is corny - even the name rubs me the wrong way, like Silverthorn. But the reactions make me think I'm not alone.

On the same day as learning about Seventh Wonder being held up it all kind of makes me grind my teeth - starting to wish Tommy hadn't joined Kamelot, for SW's sake.

Adami · « **Reply #911 on:** March 02, 2018, 01:20:18 PM »

Yea, this wasn't bad, but Kamelot are clearly in factory production mode right now, and have been for a while.

They found a routine they like and show no signs of moving on from that. Makes for very very safe music that is enjoyable and probably a good time live, but also pretty bland, all things considered.

And with the exception of their Faust saga albums, Kamelot have never had good lyrics and have always been pretty laughable. So it's not really anything new.

The Walrus · « **Reply #912 on:** March 02, 2018, 01:37:08 PM »

Quote from: Adami on March 02, 2018, 01:20:18 PM

Yea, this wasn't bad, but Kamelot are clearly in factory production mode right now, and have been for a while.

They found a routine they like and show no signs of moving on from that. Makes for very very safe music that is enjoyable and probably a good time live, but also pretty bland, all things considered.

And with the exception of their Faust saga albums, Kamelot have never had good lyrics and have always been pretty laughable. So it's not really anything new.

I disagree with that. I think they had a few songs with good lyrics up to The Black Halo, then they started really getting good for a few albums. Since Silverthorn though they've cranked the maudlin up to 11. Black Halo through Poetry had some great lyrics I think on almost every song, particularly ballads like Abandoned, House On A Hill, EdenEcho, So Long... but that's just me.

Destiny Of Chaos · « **Reply #913 on:** March 02, 2018, 02:24:12 PM »

Liked the song. Didn't love it. Agree with the sentiment that it's more of the same. But I really like the Tommy era albums, so it works for me.

My favorite Kamelot albums are in the 4th Legacy thru The Black Halo run, and while they'll never get back to that point I do still like their recent output.

NoseofNicko · « **Reply #914 on:** March 02, 2018, 02:36:05 PM »

I liked it. But then again I really liked Silverthorn and Haven.

wolfking · « **Reply #915 on:** March 02, 2018, 02:44:24 PM »

I havent liked anything since Tommy joined but I thought that was alright for some reason. Reminded me of Poetry. Not a fan of Tom's lead tone though. Might check the album out though.

Adami · « **Reply #916 on:** March 02, 2018, 03:12:25 PM »

Quote from: Kattoelox on March 02, 2018, 01:37:08 PM

Quote from: Adami on March 02, 2018, 01:20:18 PM
Yea, this wasn't bad, but Kamelot are clearly in factory production mode right now, and have been for a while.

They found a routine they like and show no signs of moving on from that. Makes for very very safe music that is enjoyable and probably a good time live, but also pretty bland, all things considered.

And with the exception of their Faust saga albums, Kamelot have never had good lyrics and have always been pretty laughable. So it's not really anything new.

I disagree with that. I think they had a few songs with good lyrics up to The Black Halo, then they started really getting good for a few albums. Since Silverthorn though they've cranked the maudlin up to 11. Black Halo through Poetry had some great lyrics I think on almost every song, particularly ballads like Abandoned, House On A Hill, EdenEcho, So Long... but that's just me.

I was a bit hyperbolic, and maybe our standards are different, but I don't see a ton of good lyrics on anything pre-BH. A few bits here and there, but it's more the exception than the rule.

jingle.boy · « **Reply #917 on:** March 02, 2018, 08:43:08 PM »

Quote from: Destiny Of Chaos on March 02, 2018, 02:24:12 PM

Liked the song. Didn't love it. Agree with the sentiment that it's more of the same. But I really like the Tommy era albums, so it works for me.

My favorite Kamelot albums are in the 4th Legacy thru The Black Halo run, and while they'll never get back to that point I do still like their recent output.

Quote from: Adami on March 02, 2018, 01:20:18 PM

Yea, this wasn't bad, but Kamelot are clearly in factory production mode right now, and have been for a while.

They found a routine they like and show no signs of moving on from that. Makes for very very safe music that is enjoyable and probably a good time live, but also pretty bland, all things considered.

These two statements pretty much nail it for me.

robbob · « **Reply #918 on:** March 02, 2018, 10:06:11 PM »

I have to agree with most recent comments, their last few releases have been fairly generic metal that is mainly unforgettable. But, I haven't listened to them as much as the Khan fronted albums. Tommy is an awesome singer, seeing them for the first time next month, sure it will be good though.

But, man they were really at their peak from Fourth Legacy thru Ghost Opera. Yeah, included Ghost Opera, Love that album, don't understand the hate for it. Would have loved to see them with Khan, definitely one of my favorite singers.

Adami · « **Reply #919 on:** March 02, 2018, 10:13:54 PM »

It's odd. They have some REALLY bad material from the Khan era. Like truly meh.

The new stuff....I dunno.

I actually love Silverthorn. But Haven is just a consisten B-. You know? It never really gets terrible, but it never really gets great.

I will buy their B- albums and mostly be cool with them. But I truly hope it gets to A+ at times.

Evermind · « **Reply #920 on:** March 03, 2018, 04:01:51 AM »

I think Karma - Epica - The Black Halo is one of the best album runs in metal overall, all three albums are in my Top 50.

At this point, I'm way more interested in Tiara than in The Shadow Theory, and seeing it pushed to October because of Kamelot's new album is frustrating.

I guess what I'm saying is I agree with Kattelox on most points here.

cramx3 · « **Reply #921 on:** March 03, 2018, 06:09:12 AM »

The push off of SW really is unfortunate.

Zook · « **Reply #922 on:** March 03, 2018, 06:19:45 AM »

Song was kinda meh.

soupytwist · « **Reply #923 on:** March 05, 2018, 06:30:25 AM »

Recently discovered this band. Currently got 5 albums...Black Halo, Haven, Ghost Opera, Silverthorn and Epica. That's the order I'd rank them in, as I have Epica last I'm worried I probably won't like the early stuff much.

cramx3 · « **Reply #924 on:** March 05, 2018, 06:56:12 AM »

You should definitely check out Karma at least, The 4th Legacy is really good as well.

Grappler · « **Reply #925 on:** March 05, 2018, 07:18:12 AM »

Quote from: soupytwist on March 05, 2018, 06:30:25 AM

Recently discovered this band. Currently got 5 albums...Black Halo, Haven, Ghost Opera, Silverthorn and Epica. That's the order I'd rank them in, as I have Epica last I'm worried I probably won't like the early stuff much.

Cramx3 is right - the band's "current' style started with The Fourth Legacy and Karma. I don't even have Siege Perilous, which is when Khan joined the band. Any of the pre-Khan records are not going to be similar to the albums that you have.

The Walrus · « **Reply #926 on:** March 05, 2018, 07:50:26 AM »

Pre-Khan records? You must be imagining things, Grappler.

wolfking · « **Reply #927 on:** March 05, 2018, 02:29:09 PM »

Quote from: Kattoelox on March 05, 2018, 07:50:26 AM

Pre-Khan records? You must be imagining things, Grappler.

I actually think Eternity is not a bad record at all.

The Walrus · « **Reply #928 on:** March 05, 2018, 04:05:31 PM »

Quote from: wolfking on March 05, 2018, 02:29:09 PM

Quote from: Kattoelox on March 05, 2018, 07:50:26 AM
Pre-Khan records? You must be imagining things, Grappler.

I actually think Eternity is not a bad record at all.

I'm sorry, sir, I don't understand. Come again?

wolfking · « **Reply #929 on:** March 05, 2018, 04:26:02 PM »

Quote from: Kattoelox on March 05, 2018, 04:05:31 PM

Quote from: wolfking on March 05, 2018, 02:29:09 PM
Quote from: Kattoelox on March 05, 2018, 07:50:26 AM
Pre-Khan records? You must be imagining things, Grappler.

I actually think Eternity is not a bad record at all.

I'm sorry, sir, I don't understand. Come again?

I actually think Eternity is not a bad record at all.

Sorry mate, someone must have changed my keyboard to symbols.

The Walrus · « **Reply #930 on:** March 05, 2018, 05:19:03 PM »

jingle.boy · « **Reply #931 on:** March 06, 2018, 05:18:59 AM »

Quote from: wolfking on March 05, 2018, 04:26:02 PM

Quote from: Kattoelox on March 05, 2018, 04:05:31 PM
Quote from: wolfking on March 05, 2018, 02:29:09 PM
Quote from: Kattoelox on March 05, 2018, 07:50:26 AM
Pre-Khan records? You must be imagining things, Grappler.

I actually think Eternity is not a bad record at all.

I'm sorry, sir, I don't understand. Come again?

I actually think Eternity is not a bad record at all.

Sorry mate, someone must have changed my keyboard to symbols.

Methinks Kattoe trolled you.

soupytwist · « **Reply #932 on:** March 06, 2018, 06:49:49 AM »

Quote from: Grappler on March 05, 2018, 07:18:12 AM

Quote from: soupytwist on March 05, 2018, 06:30:25 AM
Recently discovered this band. Currently got 5 albums...Black Halo, Haven, Ghost Opera, Silverthorn and Epica. That's the order I'd rank them in, as I have Epica last I'm worried I probably won't like the early stuff much.

Cramx3 is right - the band's "current' style started with The Fourth Legacy and Karma. I don't even have Siege Perilous, which is when Khan joined the band. Any of the pre-Khan records are not going to be similar to the albums that you have.

I was going for 'Poisoned' next - although a few of the reviews I've read seem to rate it the weakest album of the recent ones.

On Ghost Opera - the album starts really strong, the first 5 (proper) tracks are all great, the second half tails of somewhat, nothing terrible but a couple sound like Kamelot by numbers. However the version I got has a bunch of live tracks - then tacked on after the live tracks are three other songs 'Season's End', 'The Pendulous Fall' and 'Epilogue' - the first two of these are really good, better than most of the songs on the second half of the album. What's the story with this?

MirrorMask · « **Reply #933 on:** March 06, 2018, 07:05:17 AM »

The story is that those were various bonus songs for the japanese / digipack / whatever version of the album; when eventually they re-issued it with a bonus live disc, they figured it was cool to add also the "original" bonus tracks.

soupytwist · « **Reply #934 on:** March 06, 2018, 07:13:24 AM »

Quote from: MirrorMask on March 06, 2018, 07:05:17 AM

The story is that those were various bonus songs for the japanese / digipack / whatever version of the album; when eventually they re-issued it with a bonus live disc, they figured it was cool to add also the "original" bonus tracks.

Oh OK that means sense. Is quality of these tracks generally thought of as better than some of the album tracks, or is that just me?

MirrorMask · « **Reply #935 on:** March 06, 2018, 07:14:43 AM »

Season's End as far as I'm concerned is better than half the songs on Ghost Opera. The Pendolous Fall ain't bad either.

The Walrus · « **Reply #936 on:** March 06, 2018, 07:16:37 AM »

Correct.

I think Ghost Opera is awesome from start to finish although if I really had to pick songs to remove I'd probably get rid of Love You To Death and Mourning Star. They're not bad, but not as good as the rest of the album. EdenEcho is one of my all-time favorite Kamelot songs and I really enjoy how it closes the album. The bonus tracks are all right but don't do a whole lot for me. I think this album has a great balance of old Kamelot and new Kamelot. Songs like Blucher and The Human Stain have that modern Kamelot darkness but don't go full bore into Goth territory and the lyrics are pretty good.

soupytwist · « **Reply #937 on:** March 06, 2018, 07:38:24 AM »

Quote from: Kattoelox on March 06, 2018, 07:16:37 AM

Correct.

I think Ghost Opera is awesome from start to finish although if I really had to pick songs to remove I'd probably get rid of Love You To Death and Mourning Star. They're not bad, but not as good as the rest of the album. EdenEcho is one of my all-time favorite Kamelot songs and I really enjoy how it closes the album. The bonus tracks are all right but don't do a whole lot for me. I think this album has a great balance of old Kamelot and new Kamelot. Songs like Blucher and The Human Stain have that modern Kamelot darkness but don't go full bore into Goth territory and the lyrics are pretty good.

Up Through the Ashes & Silence of the Darkness are the two I'd class as somewhat forgettable - not bad by any means, just by-numbers. Rule the World and The Human Stain are outstanding both would easily reside in my Top 10 Kamelot songs (Of the 5 albums I've heard.).

The Walrus · « **Reply #938 on:** March 06, 2018, 07:40:23 AM »

I totally forgot about Up Through The Ashes. Yeah, I'd scrap that too. Not bad, but again, not outstanding. I kinda like Silence of the Darkness but that's because it's a faster tune.

cramx3 · « **Reply #939 on:** March 06, 2018, 08:12:59 AM »

Quote from: MirrorMask on March 06, 2018, 07:14:43 AM

Season's End as far as I'm concerned is better than half the songs on Ghost Opera. The Pendolous Fall ain't bad either.

I really like both of those bonus songs.

soupytwist · « **Reply #940 on:** March 06, 2018, 08:37:56 AM »

Being a newcomer to this band I'm curious to see what are peoples album rankings?

Grappler · « **Reply #941 on:** March 06, 2018, 08:43:41 AM »

Quote from: soupytwist on March 06, 2018, 08:37:56 AM

Being a newcomer to this band I'm curious to see what are peoples album rankings?

The Black Halo
Karma
Ghost Opera
Epica
The Fourth Legacy
Silverthorn
Poetry For the Poisoned
Haven

Hard to do - the Black Halo is an automatic #1, it's just phenomenal. The next 4 are all interchangeable - I love them equally. Then the rest just get shuffled in. I tend to enjoy Haven the least, but it's not a bad record. Just more of the same.

The Walrus · « **Reply #942 on:** March 06, 2018, 08:46:31 AM »

Awesome:
1. Poetry for the Poisoned
2. Ghost Opera
3. The Black Halo

Decently decent:
4. Haven
5. Karma
6. The Fourth Legacy
7. Epica

Yuck:
8. Silverthorn
9. Siege Perilous
10. Eternity and Dominion

cramx3 · « **Reply #943 on:** March 06, 2018, 08:46:45 AM »

The Black Halo
Epica
Silverthorn
Karma
Haven
Ghost Opera
The Fourth legacy
Poetry for the Poisoned

MirrorMask · « **Reply #944 on:** March 06, 2018, 09:16:40 AM »

Top of the top:
Epica
Karma
The Fourth Legacy

All three of them are masterpieces. I'd give them a 10, 9.5 and 9. Or, 10, 9.8, 9.5. They're all awesome.

Second tier:
The Black Halo
Haven
Ghost Opera
Siee Perilous

Not so fond of:
Silverthorn
Poetry for the Poisoned

"Ah, right, they had two albums before Khan":
Eternity and Dominion

News: DreamTheaterForums is a place for people who just don't have the time for music anymore.

Author Topic: Kamelot (Read 152325 times)