Re: Deadeye Deep Dives: Dream Theater (Octavarium)

Started by Deadeye21, October 15, 2024, 11:59:40 PM

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DTA

I love the vibe of FII, and especially the b-sides. They definitely leaned into the progressive rock side over metal in a lot of the tracks, and there was such a variety of sounds and styles.

Speak To Me is absolutely my favorite of the b-sides, and one of my top DT songs of all time. Raise The Knife is ok, but it definitely feels a bit undercooked to me. Something about it feels incomplete or unfinished.

The FII period is probably my favorite era of the band, incredible songs and setlists, and I enjoyed the unplugged shows they did and wish they'd revisit that idea more for a chance to hear more of their softer songs live.

WilliamMunny

I love virtually every moment of the FII era..."Raise the Knife," "The Way it Used to Be," and "Cover My Eyes" would've made for great additions to a double disc FII.

Xaves

Would've Loved to see Raise The Knife or Cover My Eyes on FII. I think I would replace Take Away My Pain with Cover My Eyes and just add Raise The Knife to the finished product. Luckily we have the FII Demos on Spotify to listen to.

hefdaddy42

All five of these songs are fantastic.  All killer, no filler, especially stacked up against some of the material that actually made it to the final album.

IMO, Speak to Me is the best constructed song here.  I think it's simply gorgeous in its construction, both musically and lyrically.  The performance on Five Years in a LIVEtime is incredible.

Raise the Knife is also incredible, and it was a personal highlight for me to see it performed live at the SCORE show in NY.  I think it is the most "DT" of these songs, and was certainly worthy of being included on the final album.

I love The Way It Used To Be.  What a fantastic song!

Cover My Eyes is also fantastic, although like you, I also much prefer the acoustic version.

Where Are You Now is also really nice, but for me it's definitely the fifth out of five for this group.
Quote from: BlobVanDam on December 11, 2014, 08:19:46 PMHef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Deadeye21

Quote from: DragonAttack on November 06, 2024, 04:20:42 AMSide One:  Raise The Knife / The Way It Used To Be / Cover My Eyes
Side Two:  A Change Of Seasons

Why does this work so well? This would have been fantastic!

Deadeye21

Falling Into Infinity - 1997
Tracklist. 1. New Millennium. 2. You Not Me. 3. Peruvian Skies. 4. Hollow Years. 5. Burning My Soul. 6. Hell's Kitchen. 7. Lines in the Sand. 8. Take Away My Pain. 9. Just Let Me Breathe. 10. Anna Lee. 11. Trial of Tears.

Falling Into Infinity on Spotify

Regardless of how we as fans feel about Falling Into Infinity, it's pretty clear that it isn't the album they wanted to make. Through all the sacrifices made due to industry pressure, having to wait so long to be given the green light to make the album in the first place, then being told they couldn't make what they had set out to achieve which included the influence of outside writers, this album marked something of a dark period in the band's history. For the first and so far only time, Dream Theater was forced to go mainstream.

Since we've already covered the cut content that the band had wanted to include, let's now turn our attention to the main event. Let us now fall into infinity.

I gotta hand it to New Millennium as being a fairly perfect opening track for the album. The first 30 seconds paint such a great soundscape, then shifting into the bassline and setting up a groover of a song before finally bringing in the main riff a mere 1:22 into the song. The whole intro of the song keeps evolving until it reaches a dark verse. James' harmonised vocals in the first verse paints a vivid picture of leaving the single star behind and heading into the red sky ahead. The chorus is a promise that everything good is to come, but the second verse subsequently points out everything going wrong with this new world, with the second pre-chorus ultimately pointing out that the deceitful promises and delay after delay has only strengthened resolve to embrace the changes in this new life ahead. This is one of my favourite lyrics that Portnoy has written, which ultimately serves to point out his displeasure and frustration at the record company. New Millennium is a very strong opener, and while it ultimately doesn't offer a solo from any member of the band, the instrumental section is one of the best on the whole album, being a huge jam section. Myung uses a unique instrument known as a Chapman Stick, which is basically ten to twelve strings on a long fretboard where the user more or less just slaps the note they want to play, allowing for chords and melodies to be played at the same time for a skilled player. The only real notable difference to the demo is the intro used to fade in, as opposed to the more direct start on the album version. This song also features one of my favourite Dream Theater riffs, being the heavy riff directly before the final choruses. Great opener!

You Not Me is a short straightforward rocker with lyrics by Petrucci and Desmond Child about a dysfunctional relationship where one partner takes a dominant role that ruins the other's life. This is one of the songs I feel changed the most from the demo, as Desmond Child suggested the key change for the chorus, This ultimately turned into a very commercially oriented song for the sound of 1997, and I gotta say I kinda like it. The chorus of You Not Me is certainly better, as I feel the original You Or Me chorus was more of a reprieve from the verses, rather than any kind of punchy moment. The lyrics are much refined on the finished version. However, that all said, I really enjoyed the different radio news reports that opened You Or Me, and I really miss the instrumental bridge. I also really like the way that the demo version featured the pre-chorus as a counter-melody to the chorus. It's also another song that lost a religious connection, with the demo version closing on a radio broadcast saying "he came to save the people from their sins". Neither are exactly the greatest of songs though. This is one that could've been replaced with one of the cut songs like Cover My Eyes and the album probably would have benefitted from the decision.

Peruvian Skies is one of the true classics from FII to me. Petrucci's lyrics here are very dark, In my interpretation of the lyrics, this is about a woman named Vanessa who was abused by her father and ends up abusing her own child as she's so emotionally broken that she now confuses love for hate. That said, this song is straight awesomeness. The first half plays it calm and clean, really letting the lyrics take centre stage, but after the bridge the boys get to have a bit of instrumental mayhem. The song actually really reminds me of Metallica, which really wasn't helped by the live versions often containing a Pink Floyd snippet (most commonly Have A Cigar) and ending with a Metallica snippet (either Enter Sandman or Wherever I May Roam). Structurally, this thing could've fit on Load or ReLoad without much of an effort. The only big switch with the demo that I can notice is that the demo chorus has much less harmonised vocal. Derek absolutely nails it on this song. I love his little fills and his later lead riff during the instrumental section.

Hollow Years is without a doubt one of the most beautiful songs that Dream Theater has ever written. The verses are pretty sad, with the first about a man who suppressed his desires for his family and the second being about a woman who said she'd never want another man but having her expression of dissatisfaction ultimately ignored. The pre-chorus shows both of them having the choice to leave this unsatisfactory life behind them being by force rather than by choice but, as shown in the chorus, this took the pressures of it all away and let the wasted time wither away behind them. I love the choice to go predominantly acoustic in much of the lead guitar, with the electric providing a bit of pop to the choruses. The original demo was a little longer, offering extra lines that offer the message getting clearer for the two characters we're presented with. Only the final pre-chorus of the demo was presented the way that the album version has them all. There are several vocal choices that I find interesting between the demo and the final version. There were some backing lines that interjected in the first two choruses that are no longer present in the final version, and one of my favourite pieces that was in the demo was taken away with the final "crashing down" being repeated four times. That said, I'm glad the final had the "sound you'll hear, crashing down of hollow years" from John and Mike. Budokan version for the win btw, just saying, but I do love that the version of this song being played on the 40th Anniversary tour is back to the full demo lyric.

Burning My Soul up next, another straight metal banger, but one that didn't start it's life the way that it's presented. This final version is presented as a very straight intro verse, chorus, verse, chorus, solo, bridge, chorus, done arrangement. However, the intro as we have it here skips over some of the original lines written for the song that I really enjoyed, being "I awoke in a dream today, man it seemed so real. I closed my eyes and try to drift away, the memories keep haunting me". In fact, the solo section doesn't remain here as written, though I must say it may be for the best, as we'll find out shortly. This is another lyric by Portnoy that lays into the record label, though this time much more directly, tackling management changing and the feeling that the band had to walk on eggshells and not step on any toes just to stay in business.

Coupled with Hell's Kitchen and Lines in the Sand, Burning My Soul stands as the first part of another suite much like A Mind Beside Itself, though this one not focussed on the same lyrical concept. Instead, it's a suite connected by intercepting instrumental intros and outros. However, this was not written to be the case. In fact, as even a more casual fan would notice, Hell's Kitchen is a much shorter instrumental track compared to Ytse Jam and Erotomania before it with a much stronger emphasis on guitar. This is because this section was intended to be the guitar solo of Burning My Soul and would connect back up to the keyboard solo. However, through label pressures, it was dissected into two different songs. With the keyboard intro of Lines in the Sand being in the key of D, the climactic ending of Hell's Kitchen was added as a segue. It just so happens to be my favourite part of the song. Hell's Kitchen was played very rarely on the Falling Into Infinity touring cycle, only making it to the last 4 shows and then subsequently forgotten until the 2017 Images, Words and Beyond tour where it was played until the end of the tour. It's also the only song I've seen live from the album, despite being one of the rarer cuts.

Lines in the Sand is an absolute masterpiece, and I don't think that's overly easy to dispute. Petrucci's lyrics here draw a lot of religious iconography with the crown of thorns and hearing the virgin weeping for the saviour. There is a bible story where Jesus wrote in the sand to prevent a woman from being stoned to death, writing "may he who is sinless cast the first stone". To me, this song ultimately calls out those who have entirely missed the message of "love and peace" that the bible was trying to teach by instead turning to hatred for those who don't conform to their views. No matter what your interpretation of the lyrics are, it's quite easy to just fall in love with this as a song. JP's solo here is one of his best ever, Derek's intro is heavy and cinematic and the bass work is beyond reproach (just take a listen to the bass harmonic flurry at 9:47!). This is the second longest song on the album, one of only two that cross that ten minute mark. It's also the second time that Dream Theater would work with an outside musician on this album, this time having Doug Pinnick of King's X belt out a few lines in the chorus. Doug would make appearances with the band for performances of Lines in the Sand on the 2002 tour, though these versions were heavily abridged and often skipping not just the the middle section which I would argue is the best part of the song, but also the main riff! This song went through quite a massive restructuring from the demo version, as the demo version actually had the two verses put together directly into the chorus and then the two pre-choruses serving as the second verse. There was also a second iteration of the intro with some Queen-esque vocal harmonies before the breakdown as well. But the change that has made it into most live versions is the song's final verse "baptized, enlightened, surrounded and frightened. I'm blind to the lines in the sand".


I think I need a bit of a break from the metal, and luckily here's Take Away My Pain with that relief. This is almost a sequel to Another Day, in that this was written about John Petrucci Sr. passing away. This song is a very poppy number on the final version, with Portnoy's drumming being a real highlight. The original demo was much more somber in tone, and as I said while talking about Where Are You Now, the final verse was drastically changed, removing the "say goodbye to Jesus" line. There are actually a lot of cut lyrics that referenced religion and I'm really not sure why that was one of the sticking points. The song references Gene Kelly who passed away in the same year from illness. I used to prefer the demo version of this one, but the final version is definitely a tad more upbeat. I think the demo goes well with the lyrics, but if I'm going to listen to a version of the song just to listen to it, I think I'll be going with the final moving forward,

Back to Portnoy's anger with the label with Just Let Me Breathe, another metal banger for those who like it heavier. This one tackles the idea of not being allowed to think your own thoughts, letting someone else do it for you, and ultimately being exploited until you're dead because you're there to make money for someone else. This song has an obvious callback to Images and Words with Portnoy taking the message from Take the Time of "just close your eyes, you can find all you need in your mind" and flipping it on its head in a motion of sarcasm at being forced into a more mainstream sound. I also hear a bit of a similarity in a repeated instrumental motif to the melody of Wait for Sleep, but that might just be me and it's unintended. Just Let Me Breathe has the guts to invoke the names of Shannon Hoon and Kurt Cobain who both killed themselves because of industry pressures. The Sons of Apollo version in more recent years has taken this a step further by modernising Shannon Hoon to Chris Cornell. In terms of differences with the demo, the only thing I've noticed is that the band removed an annoying backing vocal of a sustained yeah in the pre-chorus. Great song, and I believe the only seven-string song on the album. Killer riff, and I really love Portnoy's drumming in the intro. This song was played in the early stages of the Octavarium tour, but hasn't really surfaced since.

Anna Lee is certainly an interesting song. If I thought songs like The Way It Used to Be didn't carry much of the Dream Theater formula, it's really hard to say what I think of this one. This is Derek Sherinian's influence coming out full fold as the resident Elton John fan. This is James LaBrie's one lyric credit on the album, and I believe he used it to tell a story of the loss of innocence in a girl from what can I only assume is a broken home and ultimately wondering where she'll end up and where she could possibly belong. This is so uncharacteristic for Dream Theater that I find it difficult to talk about the song. The demo is not too different, though does employ some really spacey guitar effects throughout the first chorus. Having rewatched the commentary track for Five Years in a Livetime again recently, I know that this was, at least in 2004, one of Portnoy's favourite deeper cuts. I think it's a great song, but I think it's an oddity for a Dream Theater song.

Trial of Tears is the final song on the album and one of the very finest. John Myung writes a massively poetic lyric on this one that I just love. I'm just going to use his own quote about the song here rather than put my own words onto it. "It deals with ego and my perception of it and understanding how it can cage you and really alter your perspective, but then realizing that life is really short so you need to make a decision. You also need to learn how to deal with regret while still moving forward." It's rather inspiring and a great way to end the album. The middle section, The Wasteland, is a great jam section with JP and Derek both getting an extended solo. I really love the bass wolf whistle slide at the start of JP's solo. This song saw regular inclusion on the Train of Thought tour (50 of 76 shows) and was then played on most of the shows for the Along for the Ride tour, only missing out on the single set festival appearances. It's part of the Schmedley Wilcox medley that closed many of the Systematic Chaos tour shows as well, and usually comes with an extended guitar intro. The demo isn't much different, though it features a shorter sustain on the final notes of the song.

There are some great songs on Falling Into Infinity, that's undeniable. But you can feel them holding back. The demos serve as a great example of choices that could've been made differently had they been granted more control of their own music. And the funny thing is, Falling Into Infinity was not a massive commercial success, with a very lukewarm reception on arrival. This is Dream Theater's attempt at making something more mainstream and it ultimately didn't work. The touring cycle was successful though, with many of the songs being played in demo form and staying more true to the older material around it. The tour also saw the band opt to play more cover songs and more rarities as almost an apology for what they felt was a lacklustre album. Derek really needs to be credited for getting the band through that cycle though, as there was a time when Portnoy almost called it quits on this tour.

One of the many interesting things about this tour is that Jordan Rudess was part of one of the opening bands and would often be invited to play the song Paradigm Shift from JP and Mike's side project, Liquid Tension Experiment.  During this tour, something was brewing and a decision to let Derek Sherinian go was made following the final show. What that would begin is a s tory for another time, namely next Friday!

What are your thoughts on Falling Into Infinity? I'm keen to hear your thoughts, so I'm gonna leave this one here and let you take over. See you all next week!

DTA

Great breakdown! Falling Into Infinity is peak DT for me, along with SFAM and The Astonishing. I know the record company interfered and fans have issues with songs like You Not Me and Burning My Soul, but I can't think of another album of theirs where they explored so many different types of songs and made them still sound like DT songs. The bridge of New Millennium sounds like absolutely nothing else in their catalog, and I love it - it's so playful and fun. Lines in The Sand and Trial of Tears are stunning and sound so different from each other, and are both classic DT songs.

This and WDADU have the most songs I've never seen them play live, as I became a fan right before SFAM and missed live versions of You Not Me, Take Away My Pain, and Anna Lee. 

Did MP ever release a proposed tracklist for how the initial double album with Met 2 would've looked?

Zydar

Great writeup as always!

I really like this album, it's on my upper half of the album rankings. I wasn't a DT fan at the time of its release, so I don't know what the response was among the fanbase. I can only view it in hindsight, since I discovered them 10 years later. Among my favourites are New Millennium, Peruvian Skies, Hollow Years, Take Away My Pain, and Trial Of Tears. Anna Lee is very overlooked too. The only song I don't really enjoy that much is Just Let Me Breathe. I could easily replace that one with any of the outtakes - particularly Raise The Knife or Speak To Me. I have no problems with You Or Me at all. 

jayvee3

Always was, and still to this day in my top 3 Dream Theater albums. I remember going up to the city after I had waited ages for this to release, and coming home to pop the CD in my player. It just had a vibe that I loved, heaps of variety and was filled with brilliant tunes. And it's aged so well for me. I understand Derek is a different cat, and I love Jordan's inclusion, but I wouldn't have minded seeing at least another album with Derek...

Xaves

Quote from: Deadeye21 on November 07, 2024, 10:58:27 PMWhat are your thoughts on Falling Into Infinity?

At first when I heard this album I thought it was the worst DT album ever. But then after several more listens to it, I loved this album. Of course there are still two songs that I don't like on this album. Dereks key presets and playing makes this album super good (Dereks presets are the best IMO.) Its hard to say my favorite from this album buts its probably be either Lines In The Sand, Anna Lee, or Trial Of Tears.

Deadeye21

Quote from: Xaves on November 08, 2024, 06:15:21 AMOf course there are still two songs that I don't like on this album.

I know you mentioned you'd replace Take Away My Pain, but which is the other?

Xaves

Quote from: Deadeye21 on November 08, 2024, 06:56:42 AMbut which is the other?

This may anger some people, but Hollow Years. It's just not my cup of tea.

hefdaddy42

Quote from: Xaves on November 08, 2024, 07:04:47 AMThis may anger some people, but Hollow Years. It's just not my cup of tea.
If that angers anyone, then they are a fool.

None of this should anger anyone.  We like what we like, and there's no reason that everyone should like what we like.
Quote from: BlobVanDam on December 11, 2014, 08:19:46 PMHef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Deadeye21

Quote from: hefdaddy42 on November 08, 2024, 07:29:58 AMNone of this should anger anyone.  We like what we like, and there's no reason that everyone should like what we like.

Hef coming in here with the correct mindset. Just remember this when we get into the later albums

WilliamMunny

I LOVED Falling Into Infinity the day I bought it back in '97, and it remains a personal favorite.

I rank it much, much higher than most DT fans, and it is one of their few releases that I continue to return to regularly. For instance, I won't deny the sheer brilliance of I&W, but I'd personally rank FII higher (as it resonates with me more now than perhaps ever before).

As for the demos...I actually prefer the final version of every song, including "Take Away My Pain." I think Shirly made a bunch of good calls and the album was better for it.

I didn't know it at the time (wasn't online yet), but when I learned about the band's disapproval with this album later on, I was a bit shocked. And whoa was I in for a rude awakening when I first stumbled onto the message boards back in 2000. Be it MP.com or the precursor to this place, loving FII has always been a minority opinion lol.

Anyway, great write-up, per usual!

TheHoveringSojourn808

Wow, how'd I miss this thread so far. Just got caught up and man, you've posted a lot of good stuff here. Can't wait to read the rest!
I'm never sleeping in a teepee again - Father John Misty

macneil

Falling Into Infinity is a great album and I think it fits a very unique place in the whole discography, but I also recognise that had subsequent albums continued in the same direction set by FII then I don't know if I would have ever become a fan of the band. So personally for me it's one of the weaker ones (I'd probably put it #10 or #11).

That said, there are some absolutely top-tier DT tracks like Trial of Tears, Hell's Kitchen and Lines in the Sand. Part of what hurts it is it's sandwiched between arguably the "big 4" albums with Images and Awake before it, and Scenes and Six Degrees after, so it looks a bit weaker in comparison.

Shadowmangini

Quote from: hefdaddy42 on November 08, 2024, 07:29:58 AMIf that angers anyone, then they are a fool.

None of this should anger anyone.  We like what we like, and there's no reason that everyone should like what we like.

Agreed, for instance I do not like Peruvian Skies at all. I've seen people be ridiculed on this site for disliking that song before though.

hefdaddy42

Quote from: Shadowmangini on November 11, 2024, 07:30:58 AMAgreed, for instance I do not like Peruvian Skies at all. I've seen people be ridiculed on this site for disliking that song before though.
I like that song a lot, but it would never occur to me to ridicule someone for not liking it.
Quote from: BlobVanDam on December 11, 2014, 08:19:46 PMHef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

fibreoptix

Quote from: Shadowmangini on November 11, 2024, 07:30:58 AMAgreed, for instance I do not like Peruvian Skies at all. I've seen people be ridiculed on this site for disliking that song before though.

It's my favourite song on the album, I think the chorus is as beautiful as anything they've ever written and the heavy ending section is great, but I can absolutely see why it wouldn't be some people's cup of tea.

Same thing for Anna Lee come to that... such a pretty song,  but I can see why others wouldn't find it very interesting. Such is the rich tapestry of DT fans!

Xaves

Quote from: fibreoptix on November 11, 2024, 09:43:04 AMSame thing for Anna Lee

Anna Lee is my favorite ballad on the album and also my favorite when I listened to the album for the first time. While it's not my favorite anymore, its still definitely is a top three song on the album.

Deadeye21

This is a place for unpopular opinions without judgment, and I'm here for it! Let's keep it that way, even if I end up less in love with a song than the majority.

DTA

Another thought on this album, I know the band (or maybe just MP) weren't too thrilled with the album version of Take Away My Pain, but I greatly prefer it to the demo. It's a very sad song, but something about the upbeat nature of the music makes it all feel more impactful. A very underrated song in their catalog, and though I can't imagine it ever being played live at this point, it's one that would be a highlight of any concert if it was played.

devieira73

Relistened to the demos this week... I stil like a lot FII as a whole, but I think there are some weak spots on it that i could be fixed by some of the B-sides or original demo versions, like Burning My Soul as exemple (although the should keep the extra keyboard line part from Hell's Kitchen). Excluding Met 2 demo version, that it was still a really rudimentary idea of a song, I think we could have a great double album like that:

CD1
1. NM
2. PS
3. HY (album version)
4. BMS (demo version with its drum pattern in the chorus and the added keyboard part from HK)
5. LITS (album version)
6. JLMB
7. STM

CD2
1. RtK
2. CMY (electric version)
3. WAYN?
4. TWIUTB
5. AL
6. ToT

Yeah, I was never much a fan of TAMP, unfortunately, since it's a especial song to JP. You Or Me (with Child melodies) and TAMP (album version) could be interesting B-sides though.

And something that always bugged me... why they didn't call Anna Lee Amy Lee or something like that? Such a beautiful song, but  I could never help but listen to the cacophony of its title, it really kills the mood!

TheCountOfNYC

Quote from: devieira73 on November 12, 2024, 07:01:40 AMRelistened to the demos this week...I think we could have a great double album

You know what's funny? I actually would go the opposite direction. I think they should have cut more from the album and then insisted on including Raise the Knife as the opening track. My ideal track listing would be:

1: Raise the Knife
2: Peruvian Skies
3: Burning My Soul
4: Hell's Kitchen
5: Lines in the Sand
6: Just Let Me Breathe
7: Anna Lee
8: Trial of Tears
Quote from: hefdaddy42 on November 12, 2024, 10:37:36 AMIn Stadler's defense, he's a weird motherfucker

Stadler

I GREATLY prefer the Director's Cut of this record, and that's what I usually listen to when I go to this. I haven't ranked a combined version, but here are my rankings from the Top 100 (Red are the songs from the director's cut only, blue are the songs that made the final album):

1    Cover My Eyes
18    The Way It Used to Be
22    Take Away My Pain
25    Raise The Knife
36    New Millennium
49    Speak To Me
53    Trial of Tears
72    Where Are You Now?
78    Hollow Years
82    Peruvian Skies
88    Anna Lee
127    Lines In the Sand
130    You Not Me
137    Just Let Me Breathe
155    Hell's Kitchen
160    Burning My Soul







DragonAttack

#96
First off, yet another great in depth write up.  :tup

(...and four new responses after I started working on mine... :lol )

Quote from: DragonAttack on November 06, 2024, 04:20:42 AMSide One:  Raise The Knife / The Way It Used To Be / Cover My Eyes
Side Two:  A Change Of Seasons

Quote from: Deadeye21 on November 06, 2024, 09:48:45 PMWhy does this work so well? This would have been fantastic!

Thank you. It does help that the songs are good.  ;)

I didn't own FII until 2007 (could never find a hard copy). Rearranged and edited a version for me and the wife

Side One
Burning My Soul / Peruvian Skies / Hollow Years / Hell's Kitchen (Lines In The Sand optional)

Side Two
Just Let Me Breathe / Take Away My Pain / Tears * / Trial Of Tears

***
'New Millenium': there's just something about it, baby, that just doesn't work for me, baby ;)
'Anna Lee':  it's really nice, but, oh, that title. :lol Plus, there's already enough mellow tunes, and then after I heard their version of 'Tears', I had to find somewhere that I could include that one. 

As with ACOS and 'Cleaning Out The Closet', purchasing FII after SC raises my level of enjoyment for the album, because it fit more of my style of music (and the wife's in the days of long road trips).
Quote from: frogprog on January 05, 2023, 05:45:48 PM...going along with Dragon Attack's Queen discography thread has been like taking a free class in Queen knowledge. Where else are you gonna find info like that?!
QUEEN DISCOGRAPHY      "www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php/topic,57201.0.html"

TheCountOfNYC

Quote from: Stadler on November 12, 2024, 07:20:26 AMI GREATLY prefer the Director's Cut of this record, and that's what I usually listen to when I go to this. I haven't ranked a combined version, but here are my rankings from the Top 100 (Red are the songs from the director's cut only, blue are the songs that made the final album):

1    Cover My Eyes
18    The Way It Used to Be
22    Take Away My Pain
25    Raise The Knife
36    New Millennium
49    Speak To Me
53    Trial of Tears
72    Where Are You Now?
78    Hollow Years
82    Peruvian Skies
88    Anna Lee
127    Lines In the Sand
130    You Not Me
137    Just Let Me Breathe
155    Hell's Kitchen
160    Burning My Soul

That's definitely a unique favorite DT song
Quote from: hefdaddy42 on November 12, 2024, 10:37:36 AMIn Stadler's defense, he's a weird motherfucker

Stadler

I stand by it; I love that song and have since the minute I hear it.

This is two through five, in case you care:
2   Voices   
3   Strange Deja Vu   
4   Overture 1928   
5   This is the Life

For those that have commented on that... I don't quite get what's wrong with "Anna Lee" as a title.   I certainly get the idea of a "dumb title", there are plenty of bands that have song titles and I'm WTF?, but DT is not one of those bands. I'd struggle to get a top five "worst titles" (not counting live-only snippets).

Maybe:
- Erotomania
- Space Dye Vest
- Untethered Angel
- Barstool Warrior
- Invisible Monster
- The Ones Who Help To Set The Sun

hefdaddy42

Quote from: BlobVanDam on December 11, 2014, 08:19:46 PMHef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Mladen

The biggest blunder in the entire Dream Theater discography is them excluding Cover my eyes from Falling into infinity. There was their hit song, right there, and they just glossed over it.

To this day, I don't know how it didn't make the cut. Even in the liner notes for the demos, Mike only says that it was temporarily shelved and nothing more. Does anyone have any factual info on this? Setlist Scotty, bosk or someone?

TheCountOfNYC

Quote from: hefdaddy42 on November 12, 2024, 10:37:36 AMIn Stadler's defense, he's a weird motherfucker

ZirconBlue

Quote from: Stadler on November 12, 2024, 07:20:26 AMI GREATLY prefer the Director's Cut of this record, and that's what I usually listen to when I go to this. I haven't ranked a combined version, but here are my rankings from the Top 100 (Red are the songs from the director's cut only, blue are the songs that made the final album):

1    Cover My Eyes
18    The Way It Used to Be
22    Take Away My Pain
25    Raise The Knife
36    New Millennium
49    Speak To Me
53    Trial of Tears
72    Where Are You Now?
78    Hollow Years
82    Peruvian Skies
88    Anna Lee
127    Lines In the Sand
130    You Not Me
137    Just Let Me Breathe
155    Hell's Kitchen
160    Burning My Soul







I feel similarly.  I love this album, and the demo versions are my preferred versions.

hefdaddy42

Quote from: BlobVanDam on December 11, 2014, 08:19:46 PMHef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

DragonAttack

Quote from: Stadler on November 12, 2024, 08:23:26 AMFor those that have commented on that... I don't quite get what's wrong with "Anna Lee" as a title.  I certainly get the idea of a "dumb title", there are plenty of bands that have song titles and I'm WTF?, but DT is not one of those bands.

In 2007, I finally downloaded FII from iTunes (Best Buy never carried it during my new fandom).  I burn a disc, print a cover sleeve and inner sleeve with the song listings and times.  The wife and I sit in the rec room, I put the disc in, she looks at the titles, and goes 'the next to last song...it isn't about what that one KISS song is about, is it?' 

All I could say was 'I hope not.'  :lol
Quote from: frogprog on January 05, 2023, 05:45:48 PM...going along with Dragon Attack's Queen discography thread has been like taking a free class in Queen knowledge. Where else are you gonna find info like that?!
QUEEN DISCOGRAPHY      "www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php/topic,57201.0.html"