*Official* The Astonishing discussion thread

[Gromit1710]

Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?

• Play to a click track.

• Play the tracks over the PA.

Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.

It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance. 

[chego_voice]

Hey people! this is me singing MOB! Would you check it out?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xzWQPUOOeU

I'm so happy!

Great job!  When doing DT covers, I think the vocalist almost always has the greatest challenge.  Very few people can sing with authority in the range James sings in.

Is there music/tabs available for this already, or did you guys all do it by ear?  I'm trying to learn the Our New World solo on guitar, but can't figure out those sweep-picking arpeggios, etc.  No tab so far in the usual spots online.

Everything was learned by ear my friend! a hard work but was really fun! Thanks for your kind words!

[jsbru]

I have no idea how Jordan is going to play all the brass/symphony/choir/keyboard parts at once, especially because there's sometimes like three parts at a time.

Maybe the real astonishing thing is that Kevin Moore will return to play extra keyboards for the tour! 




Yes, that's dope the smiley is smoking...

[bosk1]

Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?

• Play to a click track.

• Play the tracks over the PA.

Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.

It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance. 

Um, no.  On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation. 

Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.

[Kotowboy]

Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them.

Um, no.  On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation. 

Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.

[Architeuthis]

JP said in guitar world magazine that the orchestral and choir tracks will be playing along with the click track. He said they have to get it perfect or it could go awry..

[ResultsMayVary]

There's plenty of heavy guitar on this album. Are people on crack?

There's a LOT of 7 string, too.

People seem to find it difficult to know which character is saying which lines, I don't have that problem cause I've sat with the lyrics all the way through the album on my first listen and haven't had any problems identifying who's talking on subsequent listens...

I still have not done that.  But I did read the summaries on DT.net, which give a great overview of the story itself.  And I have found that with that knowledge alone, combined with James' voice inflection changes when he is changing characters, it usually isn't difficult to figure out who is speaking at any given point in the story, with just a few exceptions.

This is exactly what I did. The song summaries/explanations on the website are insanely helpful in understanding the story.

[SebastianPratesi]

One thing not even explained in the website is whether or not Xander was kidnapped, the lyrics clearly state that he followed his father to Heaven's Cove so why was he worried about his life? And why did Daryus threaten him with his son's life?

Well, the way I see it, had Xander been kidnapped by Daryus, Arhys wouldn't have stayed all night in his home (which the track description for "A Tempting Offer" makes me believe he did). Knowing who Arhys is, I guess he would have chased Daryus and get his son back. So, in my opinion: no, he wasn't kidnapped.

Regarding the second question: I don't think Daryus threatened Arhys with Xander's life. From what I've read, Daryus offer was:

A. for the Empire to have Gabriel and for Xander to have a better life, or
B. for the Empire to try having Gabriel and for Xander to remain as is,

Daryus did threaten to kill Xander, but that was once Arhys was dead and Xander appeared out of nowhere surprising the Prince. I guess he threaten to kill him so there'd be no witness to the crime. He would have had to act fast to cover up - I think that there still was time 

Anyway, that's all speculation, and maybe I'm forgetting a bit of text, so be sure to correct me if I'm missing something!

[Gromit1710]

Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?

• Play to a click track.

• Play the tracks over the PA.

Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.

It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance. 

Um, no.  On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation. 

Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.

*shrugs*

We'll all find out at some point then, won't we?

[SebastianPratesi]

YES! Not just after The Path That Divides but they can also be clearly heard at the beginning of that very song! that's one thing I forgot to mention up there; why did he say the NOMAC's were "laying still"? the emperor didn't agree to that when he agreed to meet Gabriel, but also it contradicts what I felt was the whole point of going to Heaven's Cove which is to be away from the NOMAC's sounds and influence, which-stay with me here- brings us to the big elephant in the room; the nature and patterns of the NOMAC's presence, are they patrolling or are they always around? The scenes from the trailer drives me to believe there is hundreds, if not thousands, of them, so they don't take breaks or go in for maintenance or generally be in any situation where they're simply off.
Maybe they only patrol populated places and that's why Heaven's Cove was perfect for the meeting, but then Gabriel saying they "the noise machines lie still tonight" doesn't make sense.

Well, maybe the NOMACs did patrol in Heaven's Cove too, and would have been 'turned off' by Nafaryus during Faythe's and Gabriel's song, but not before. I guess that's why their music can be heard in both "The Path That Divides" and "Machine Chatter" - neither the Emperor/Arabelle nor Faythe/Gabriel had arrived at Heaven's Cove by that time, so the NOMACs were still normally functioning.

I've been thinking about these details for a couple of days. It still isn't clear to me what are all of their purposes, or how do people hear their music (in the first e-mail sent by Nafaryus, he talked about "transmitters inside of the flesh", and Arhys says in his first e-mail that his people had managed to "biohack" them, but there is nothing about this, either in the lyrics or in the track descriptions).

[LCArenas]

The intro to A Savior in the Square, mane

THE FUCKING GUITAR MANE

[Adami]

Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?

• Play to a click track.

• Play the tracks over the PA.

Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.

It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance. 

Um, no.  On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation. 

Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.

*shrugs*

We'll all find out at some point then, won't we?

But why would you think they wouldn't do it? That's what they did (barring 1 show) with Illumination theory. Another song with an orchestra and stuff. So it's what they've been doing it for the past few tours. Why would you assume they'd stop?

[CodyWanKenobi]

There's plenty of heavy guitar on this album. Are people on crack?

There's a LOT of 7 string, too.

Well, there's definitely an imbalance of heavy and lighter stuff, so I think people are just confusing that with there being 'no heavy sections or songs'.

[Progmetty]

One thing not even explained in the website is whether or not Xander was kidnapped, the lyrics clearly state that he followed his father to Heaven's Cove so why was he worried about his life? And why did Daryus threaten him with his son's life?

Well, the way I see it, had Xander been kidnapped by Daryus, Arhys wouldn't have stayed all night in his home (which the track description for "A Tempting Offer" makes me believe he did). Knowing who Arhys is, I guess he would have chased Daryus and get his son back. So, in my opinion: no, he wasn't kidnapped.

Regarding the second question: I don't think Daryus threatened Arhys with Xander's life. From what I've read, Daryus offer was:

A. for the Empire to have Gabriel and for Xander to have a better life, or
B. for the Empire to try having Gabriel and for Xander to remain as is,

Daryus did threaten to kill Xander, but that was once Arhys was dead and Xander appeared out of nowhere surprising the Prince. I guess he threaten to kill him so there'd be no witness to the crime. He would have had to act fast to cover up - I think that there still was time 

Anyway, that's all speculation, and maybe I'm forgetting a bit of text, so be sure to correct me if I'm missing something!

Daryus threatened to kill Xander on Tempting Offer, at least that's what this stand off insinuated:

[Arhys]
How dare you step inside my home?!
[Daryus]
His life is in my hands!
[Arhys]
You monster, leave my son alone!
[Daryus]
You do know who I am
Your love for him is strong
[Arhys]
He's just a boy
He's done no wrong
This fight's not his to lose

Daryus offer was life and riches to Xander and also I don't think Daryus cares if he was found after he killed the leader of the rebellion and his son, it's not like they have a parliament or public opinion, he's the the emperor's son in a dictatorship, he's essentially Kim Jong-un

[SebastianPratesi]

Daryus threatened to kill Xander on Tempting Offer, at least that's what this stand off insinuated:

You're right, sorry. I forgot about that part.

Daryus offer was life and riches to Xander and also I don't think Daryus cares if he was found after he killed the leader of the rebellion and his son, it's not like they have a parliament or public opinion, he's the the emperor's son in a dictatorship, he's essentially Kim Jong-un

Good point; although I also don't get what other reason he would have for killing the boy. Maybe he was overpowered by his aggresive instincts that very moment?

[erwinrafael]

There was no threat to Xander. There was only a tempting offer to give him a better life. Which actually makes Arhys' decision more morally ambiguous (and makes him a better-writtem amd well-rounded character).

[BlobVanDam]

Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?

• Play to a click track.

• Play the tracks over the PA.

Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.

It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance. 

Um, no.  On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation. 

Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.

I think I read somewhere they'd be doing the orchestra with backing track, which is good because JR also has complex piano parts to handle as well under most of the orchestral stuff.
And I expect the NOMAC tracks will be from tape too, to give a slight breather, and also so they could sync up video work closely with those.

[erwinrafael]

YES! Not just after The Path That Divides but they can also be clearly heard at the beginning of that very song! that's one thing I forgot to mention up there; why did he say the NOMAC's were "laying still"? the emperor didn't agree to that when he agreed to meet Gabriel, but also it contradicts what I felt was the whole point of going to Heaven's Cove which is to be away from the NOMAC's sounds and influence, which-stay with me here- brings us to the big elephant in the room; the nature and patterns of the NOMAC's presence, are they patrolling or are they always around? The scenes from the trailer drives me to believe there is hundreds, if not thousands, of them, so they don't take breaks or go in for maintenance or generally be in any situation where they're simply off.
Maybe they only patrol populated places and that's why Heaven's Cove was perfect for the meeting, but then Gabriel saying they "the noise machines lie still tonight" doesn't make sense.

Well, maybe the NOMACs did patrol in Heaven's Cove too, and would have been 'turned off' by Nafaryus during Faythe's and Gabriel's song, but not before. I guess that's why their music can be heard in both "The Path That Divides" and "Machine Chatter" - neither the Emperor/Arabelle nor Faythe/Gabriel had arrived at Heaven's Cove by that time, so the NOMACs were still normally functioning.

I've been thinking about these details for a couple of days. It still isn't clear to me what are all of their purposes, or how do people hear their music (in the first e-mail sent by Nafaryus, he talked about "transmitters inside of the flesh", and Arhys says in his first e-mail that his people had managed to "biohack" them, but there is nothing about this, either in the lyrics or in the track descriptions).

Or maybe there are NOMACS that accompany Daryus. They always appear near songs where he had major scenes.

[DarkLord_Lalinc]

I love the recurring character themes and motifs throughout the whole thing. Very John Wiliams-esque, if you ask me.

[Lax]

Or maybe there are NOMACS that accompany Daryus. They always appear near songs where he had major scenes.

+1000

For the live show, the last times I saw them, they played recorded parts of songs, especially intros (which is totally right for bridges in the sky), was just shocking for the root of all evil.

[Architeuthis]

YES! Not just after The Path That Divides but they can also be clearly heard at the beginning of that very song! that's one thing I forgot to mention up there; why did he say the NOMAC's were "laying still"? the emperor didn't agree to that when he agreed to meet Gabriel, but also it contradicts what I felt was the whole point of going to Heaven's Cove which is to be away from the NOMAC's sounds and influence, which-stay with me here- brings us to the big elephant in the room; the nature and patterns of the NOMAC's presence, are they patrolling or are they always around? The scenes from the trailer drives me to believe there is hundreds, if not thousands, of them, so they don't take breaks or go in for maintenance or generally be in any situation where they're simply off.
Maybe they only patrol populated places and that's why Heaven's Cove was perfect for the meeting, but then Gabriel saying they "the noise machines lie still tonight" doesn't make sense.

Well, maybe the NOMACs did patrol in Heaven's Cove too, and would have been 'turned off' by Nafaryus during Faythe's and Gabriel's song, but not before. I guess that's why their music can be heard in both "The Path That Divides" and "Machine Chatter" - neither the Emperor/Arabelle nor Faythe/Gabriel had arrived at Heaven's Cove by that time, so the NOMACs were still normally functioning.

I've been thinking about these details for a couple of days. It still isn't clear to me what are all of their purposes, or how do people hear their music (in the first e-mail sent by Nafaryus, he talked about "transmitters inside of the flesh", and Arhys says in his first e-mail that his people had managed to "biohack" them, but there is nothing about this, either in the lyrics or in the track descriptions).

Or maybe there are NOMACS that accompany Daryus. They always appear near songs where he had major scenes.

These discussions are freak in GREAT!  Only Dream Theater fans would delve into the details and Take The Time to discuss and help each other understand the story better.

[Cyclopssss]

I can't believe I'm not reading more about Heaven's Cove. My god, that tension building, the eerie keyboards, then the heavy guitars come in...then the end with the gentle piano....it's really four minutes of perfection to me.

[Vandalism]

^ THIS!

Beautiful use of the seaboard as well and that riff! 

[Lax]

Heaven's cove is in my top 5, Tristram meets a great heavy second part ! And the keyboard after the 12 string arppegio is splendid

[Jinx]

Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?

• Play to a click track.

• Play the tracks over the PA.

Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.

It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance. 

Um, no.  On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation. 

Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.

*shrugs*

We'll all find out at some point then, won't we?

But why would you think they wouldn't do it? That's what they did (barring 1 show) with Illumination theory. Another song with an orchestra and stuff. So it's what they've been doing it for the past few tours. Why would you assume they'd stop?

For me there's a big difference between a few minutes of one song and 90% of songs during a 2 and a half hour performance. I'm just thinking it could be a LOT of pressure

[Shooters1221]

Not sure if this JR interview was posted here yet. Caught it on MP forums.

https://drownedinsound.com/in_depth/4149776-jordan-rudess-of-dream-theater-on-working-with-david-bowie-and-new-album-the-astonishing

[Cyclopssss]

The Astonishing entered at # 4 in the Dutch Top 100 albums. Great accomplishment! 

[Kotowboy]

Nothing about the Billboard placing yet ?

[Kotowboy]

Dream Theater really needs to make our new World their next single, make a hopeful video of people helping other people when in despair and this song can easily be a major hit!

They aren't planning on releasing any singles from this album.

Except The Gift Of Music.

" it wasn't a single "

Released on iTunes, Had an official Music Video.

it's a single.

[Gromit1710]

Is anyone else interested to see how the band will pull off all the added instruments/orchestra and choir parts?

• Play to a click track.

• Play the tracks over the PA.

Don't think they'll do either of these. They've always been a band that does everything between the 5 of them. And Jordan LOVES mucking about with tons of patches and samples. Bet he's just lusting over using all his gadgets to fill in the blanks.

It will probably be a bit thinner, but I doubt there's going to be a magical Choir or Orchestra that appears out of the speakers during the performance. 

Um, no.  On the last tour, they played to a click track and piped in backing vocals and instrumentation. 

Because they have done that in the past, it is HIGHLY likely they will do it again on this tour.

*shrugs*

We'll all find out at some point then, won't we?

But why would you think they wouldn't do it? That's what they did (barring 1 show) with Illumination theory. Another song with an orchestra and stuff. So it's what they've been doing it for the past few tours. Why would you assume they'd stop?

For me there's a big difference between a few minutes of one song and 90% of songs during a 2 and a half hour performance. I'm just thinking it could be a LOT of pressure

Pretty much my thoughts on the matter as well. All the times I've seen them, never heard them make widespread use of click tracks and tapes other than intro stuff and random patches during a rare song here and there. Much less a 2 hour long performance. Even on the SFAM tour, I don't recall them using a backing track for the chorus on SCO, a song that used the most obvious choir arrangement up until TA and would have been easy to do so.

But what do I know? Certainly not enough to debate it like it matters. Going to enjoy the show regardless.

[Prog Snob]

It seems to be pretty intuitive figuring out which character is singing during a given song.

Well, one instance that comes to mind is "In peace, we gather here today", which Arhys said in response to Nafaryus asking them to carry on with Gabriel's singing in the square event, to which Daryus responds "Don't make him ask again", it plays like "Show us what we've heard so much about? In peace, we gather here today, Don't make him ask again", I imagine a listener without lyrics would be confused for a second.
Arabelle has few lines here and there but I feel like she always comes out of nowhere and it's not easy to figure out it's her instantly.

Agreed. Once reading the lyrics through and paying attention, it's easy enough to remember. But it's definitely not that easy to get each line from just listening through.

It seems to be pretty intuitive figuring out which character is singing during a given song.

I can't really tell when he's changing characters when I'm listening to it.  But I brought it over to my friend's house this weekend, as he and his wife like more clasically-inspired rock music (the are both big Muse fans, but they've always been open to listening to DT, and while they don't go by the albums, they enjoy it when I am over and play it)--and she could tell right away without even knowing much about the plot when James was singing the female versus male lines.  I thought it was amazing, because I being the DT aficionado and being well-versed in the plot, still couldn't tell which character was singing without reading the lyric book.

There aren't many characters to pick from. One of which is dead already. Also, the characters have different personalities, so it would be hard to confuse Gabriel and Arhys, for example, or Faythe and Arabelle.

[nikatapi]

All tours since ADTOE have been played to a click track, so i wonder why is there any question about this one, especially given that they need to run massive backing tracks and visuals.

[genome]

For me there's a big difference between a few minutes of one song and 90% of songs during a 2 and a half hour performance. I'm just thinking it could be a LOT of pressure

I was under the impression they ran a click for the whole show on the 2014 tour. I think the screen/light show were automated to it as well.

[BlobVanDam]

All tours since ADTOE have been played to a click track, so i wonder why is there any question about this one, especially given that they need to run massive backing tracks and visuals.

And this is possibly the most crucial video show of all, since it has to present a story across the entire show, so it makes clear sense.

[aurorablind]

Does anybody know if MM is the only one who actually hears the click-track?
Does he have the "secret cowbell" that MP had?