How long did DT stay at Berklee?

[rumborak]

Anyone know actually?

[The Letter M]

You mean as "Majesty" (since technically, the name Dream Theater didn't come until later)? I think JP, JM and MP were only there for a year before dropping out and forming the band.

I think anyone who has the Lifting Shadows book here would be able to provide a decent and detailed answer.

-Marc.

[TAC]

I think that's right. Just one year.

Love the part on the Score doc where JP says it was one thing to talk his parents  into letting him go to Music College, and then another talking them into letting him drop out. 

[rumborak]

Oh wow, didn't realize it was that little. I'm saying this out of how DT is always associated with Berklee, but they only really competed less than a quarter of the usual time at Berklee. This might display my ignorance about the American education system, but does that mean the DT members have highschool degrees?

[Lucien]

Makes you wonder how much the college influenced their talent (none at all, I say). You learn so much more at college, I think they should have gone all the way. Music theory during later college semesters is insanely complicated. Imagine what their music would sound like if they had gone all the way. Atonal metal, anyone (I'd personally hate it  )?

[TAC]

Oh wow, didn't realize it was that little. I'm saying this out of how DT is always associated with Berklee, but they only really competed less than a quarter of the usual time at Berklee. This might display my ignorance about the American education system, but does that mean the DT members have highschool degrees?

Yes they do. Rumbo, what Mexican concoction are you on, brother?

[Skeever]

Kinda amazing, actually, when you think about it. DT formed at Berkley in '85, dropped out by '86, released When Dream and Day Unite, a pretty big flop, in '89, and then didn't see success with DT until '91.

From what I understand, the DT guys all come from pretty rich families anyway, so I don't think they ever needed the band to succeed to "survive", but there must have been a lot of awkward phone calls between DT members and their parents from '85-'90.

[rumborak]

Oh wow, didn't realize it was that little. I'm saying this out of how DT is always associated with Berklee, but they only really competed less than a quarter of the usual time at Berklee. This might display my ignorance about the American education system, but does that mean the DT members have highschool degrees?

Yes they do. Rumbo, what Mexican concoction are you on, brother?

What do you mean? DT's educational degrees were not exactly at the forefront of my thoughts over time.

[The Letter M]

Kinda amazing, actually, when you think about it. DT formed at Berkley in '85, dropped out by '86, released When Dream and Day Unite, a pretty big flop, in '89, and then didn't see success with DT until '91.

From what I understand, the DT guys all come from pretty rich families anyway, so I don't think they ever needed the band to succeed to "survive", but there must have been a lot of awkward phone calls between DT members and their parents from '85-'90.

Rich? Now or back then, because I recall reading that Mike Portnoy (I think) went to Berklee (not Berkley) on scholarship. I mean, I'm sure he might have had some loans to help too, but I doubt he and his family were rich in a sense that they could pay for such a prestigious music school out of pocket. I could be wrong, so I hope someone with a better answer can provide one, but they never struck me as being from rich families (unless there's a source somewhere that says otherwise).

-Marc.

[TAC]

I have never heard anything about the relative wealth of their families. Seems that JM and JP came from a nice town though.

[rumborak]

That was my understanding too. Not rich-rich, but upper middle class.

[Skeever]

I have never heard anything about the relative wealth of their families. Seems that JM and JP came from a nice town though.

Yeah I was thinking more specifically of JP and JM. King's Park is nice. No Beverly Hills, but still nice.

[rumborak]

Long Beach (where MP is from) is in Nassau County, which to my understanding is also pretty nice.

[TAC]

Long Beach (where MP is from) is in Nassau County, which to my understanding is also pretty nice.

Yeah, well, I've never heard of anyone that grew up in the slums of Long Island!

Where's LudwigVan when we need him?

[Rodni Demental]

This is purely speculation, but I don't think Berklee is responsible for their musical talents. I believe they were probably already fairly developed musicians and their craft was already well underway. It's possible they had the chance to refine a few techniques or concepts through the school, but I think it more so just served as a platform for them to meet up and find other like minded individuals and an outlet for them to practice together. Clearly they weren't interested in studying there for the long haul or they wouldn't have left so early to start playing gigs, which is obviously what they preferred to do.

They probably didn't need to go to music college in the first place, but it is how they met.

[Madman Shepherd]

On a different message board a long time ago, Chris Collins responded to a post I made when I mentioned Mike Portnoy said that all Collins could do is hit high notes.  Collins actually agreed but said his departure also had to do with his lack of dedication to the band as much as his lack of skill for that particular style of music.  Collins said he came from a much more blue collar background than the rest of the guys and was working construction and didn't have nearly as much time to dedicate to practicing as those guys did. 

In the Ytsejam bootlegs, MP said he used to deliver Chinese food, JM was an equipment mover, and JP worked at a deli (I think).  So, I think its safe to assume they had a little help from home.

[rumborak]

@Rodni: Well, in general, you don't even get into Berklee unless you can already play your instrument very well.

Back to the OP topic a bit, I always felt DT's connection to Berklee was a bit tenuous, probably because of the short stint. Like, Berklee really uses their famous alumni for promotional purposes (e.g. Steve Vai, who has his own online lessons on the Berklee website), but it seems it's really MM who infused DT with a true connection to the college. Not to take away from the original three's skill, but in Boston it's widely known that the first year at Berklee mostly just means that you (well, your parents) can afford the admission fee; they only make the hard cut after the first year.

[TAC]

Well, I think they (MP, JM, JP) (DS too) are very proud of the fact that they went there and are not afraid to name drop it. It was so cool to see the Awake show there in 1994 (Hef  ). Always thought it would make a great Ytsejam show, especially considering that IF and TWWHTSTS were still in  the set.

Anyway, I think they've always felt a connection to the college, and certainly MM reignites it.

[King Postwhore]

I second the  to Hef.

[MetropolisDLX]

I have the Lifting Shadows book, so I'll summarize the best I can just skimming through while drunk.

      John Petrucci and Kevin Moore lived right around the corner from each other in the same town. So they knew each other since their early teens I'm guessing. They eventually met John Myung their junior year of high school and started jamming together. JP's father was a computer programmer, so his parents would have preferred him to go to more of a business type oriented school, but a music teacher at his high school told his parents at a school meeting he needs to go to Berklee because he's that awesome at guitar. After that JP's parents didn't need much convincing and supported him after he got accepted to the school.  JM's family knew he loved bass and was passionate about it so they didn't take much convincing to let him attend the school. He actually started out playing the violin for ten years at the age of five. Kevin Moore decided to go to The State University of New York (S.U.N.Y) to further his musical education. Mike Portnoy's mother was his only obstacle to attending Berkelee.  She would have preferred him to go to a traditional school to have something to fall back on. Sadly she died in a plane crash on November 16, 1984, so he applied and got in. MP had a harsher family life compared to the other members of DT. He wanted to attend Berkelee to get away from the stress of his family life and pursue his love for music.

   Both John's were roommates and lived two floors apart from MP. They became good friends within a couple of weeks and started jamming together. They auditioned a couple keyboard players and singers while at Berklee. The three eventually met up with KM over Christmas break and jammed with him. JP, JM, and MP had a hard time focusing both on their band, 'Majesty', and their studies. They knew one was about to give sooner or later so they decided to drop out. JP, JM, and KM were lucky and had supportive parents and gave them a roof to keep over their heads while they began to pursue their band full time. MP bought his own house since he didn't get along with his stepfather who remarried a woman who had her children move in with him.  JM lived with MP for a short while but moved back in with his parents.
   
   Since leaving Berkelee the band member's held day jobs and they would jam together in the evenings and play whatever gigs they could get. JP worked at a grocery store and eventually started giving guitar lessons. JM worked for a music store called Focus 2. He would pick up equipment from dealers and bring it back to the store. He eventually just started giving bass lessons. MP delivered Chinese food for many years. He also worked at a record shop which he never collected pay checks from. Instead he would use store credit to buy records. I'm not sure what KM did for money. Maybe when I'm sober I can look harder through the book to find out. But as far as I can skim through right now I can't find anything.

[rumborak]

Well, KM obviously doesn't need sustenance.

[King Postwhore]

So KM = T2.

[?]

Kevin gave piano lessons in the period between the first two albums, but I don't know if he had a job before that.

[hefdaddy42]

Seems I remember them saying that they went to Berklee for the express purpose of meeting like-minded musicians to start a band.  When JP & JM met MP, they knew that was it.  No more need for Berklee, so they left.

Of course, JR attended Juliard, but he dropped out of there, too.

Mangini graduated from Bentley, but with a degree in computer science (it's a business-oriented school).

[Calvin6s]

Seems I remember them saying that they went to Berklee for the express purpose of meeting like-minded musicians to start a band.

Actually, their book talks about them already having a band waiting for them (JP & JM) when they left the school.  MP just kinda happened.

It stands to reason that they might have talked to Berklee school friends to get the books used for graduation.  They wouldn't be able to take "performance" classes, but I don't think they are falling short in their real life performance credits.

This is something I've done in my life.  Talk to classmates at a college, jr. college or music trade school to get the required reading materials provided in a syllabus.   You can take just about any course in life if you don't care about credits.

[emtee]

I always wondered if they received an honorary degree because I've seen them referred to as Berklee graduates.

[rumborak]

It stands to reason that they might have talked to Berklee school friends to get the books used for graduation.  They wouldn't be able to take "performance" classes, but I don't think they are falling short in their real life performance credits.

That's very unlikely. Keep in mind, they had absolved less than a quarter of the 4-5 year time it takes to graduate Berklee.
Besides, had they really wanted to finish the coursework, I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have dropped out. For the following three years they sorta noodled around; sure, writing WDADU in the process, but that's not exactly a 3-years fulltime effort. I think realistically, they dropped out because a) sure, they wanted to focus on the band, but also b) because they didn't care all too much about going to college.

[hefdaddy42]

I always wondered if they received an honorary degree because I've seen them referred to as Berklee graduates.

You've seen incorrect references, then, because they clearly aren't graduates.

[rumborak]

Interestingly, Derek is a Berklee graduate.

[Anguyen92]

I always wondered if they received an honorary degree because I've seen them referred to as Berklee graduates.

I think somewhere along the line, in the 2010s, they received honorary degrees. I mean there's a scholarship at Berklee named in their honor.

[rumborak]

I can find no internet record of that.

[King Postwhore]

Why did that even matter when the likes of Mike Tyson has one?!   

[rumborak]

Especially one called "Doctor of Humane Letters"

[Anguyen92]

Ahhh, now I recall where I thought they may have been offered honorary degrees.  From the massive Breaking the Fourth Wall thread.

True that they did not finish, but DT still cite Berkelee as their school, so it is still positive exposure for the school.  And I may be misremembering, but they may have been offered honorary degrees at some point, so they may actually be considered graduating alums.

https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=41580.msg1850287#msg1850287

[rumborak]

Yeah, but no offense to bosk, there is no evidence that this ever happened.