Are there -ANY- fans on DTF?

[DebraKadabra]

One thing is interesting though and i'm only speaking for myself. I tend to visit general and music more than the whole DT section:

My stats are pretty similar to yours, Boom.

[WildeSilas]

Im asking seriously.
Okay, I'm brand spankin' new here, but I was under the assumption that this is a fan site.
All I've seen, thus far, is complaints about this song or that album or which band member sucks ...
I don't get it. I've even read someone saying that they are bored by Dream Theater after multiple listens.
I have literally, no exaggeration, listened to DT every single day for the past three years.
While I have favorite songs and many of them change, I cannot say that there is one song that I dislike.
Am I really alone in this?

Yes, I think it's safe to say that on a fan forum dedicated to DT, with over 3,000 members, you, the new guy, are the sole DT fan. 

[Grizz]

All praise sounds the same. There is little to learn from constant worship, but criticisms allow for much more meaningful discussion.

[adamack]

What site are you on?

I've been hanging out here quite some time now, and while I do see *some* criticism....I find it to be in the overwhelming minority.   

Have you see the poll on the new album?    Every time feedback is asked for, the polls show an 80-90% approval rating on the new album...from both new fans, and old timers.

Seems like you're putting a "zoom lens" on the vocal minority.

This. Sure, every thread is going to have some people who may not jive with the topic of the thread, but that can be said about any forum.

I'm still new here myself (only been here 3 months or so), and I find this place to be full of true, insightful fans. Most of us don't like every single thing DT has done, so that may be where you are seeing some negativity.

As for me though, I can honestly say that I like literally 99% of what DT has ever done. I guess I'm a fanboy

[ariich]

I have to say, coming onto a fan forum that is mostly quite positive about the band in question, and berating everyone here for not being real fans because of a small degree of criticism, seems kind of dickish. Not really making a good first impression there, Hanz. You're kind of being an asshole.

Whether that's the case or not, there's no need to be an asshole back.

[Perpetual Change]

Until about a year ago, I would have considered myself a DT diehard. They were unquestionably my favorite band, and I'd buy whatever they released and would see them whenever they came around.

Slowly, I started becoming less zealous. Mostly, it's because of new expenses that have come with graduating school. I have rent, utilities bills, car payments, loans, and other things going on in my life that make me much more likely to forgo buying DT merch or concert tickets - or a 10th (or whatever) live DVD.

But mostly, I think it's because of MP's departure. I can't believe I'm typing this, considering I'm someone who was banned from this forum awhile ago partly as a consequence to disrespectfully criticizing MP, but here goes: while the quality of DT's music is about the same (if not slightly better) than it was before, I can't help feeling that being a fan is also a lot less special than before. This last album cycle is the most I've felt being a DT fan is just like any other customer relationship.  While I guess it's always really come down to that, the DT "brand" and fan experience seemed a lot stronger and more authentic under Mike Portnoy's leadership.

Despite that, maybe it just comes down to me feeling that way because I'm frustrated that 1.) I'm being priced-out of being a DT diehard 2.) the band haven't really gone anywhere new despite a major member change and 3.) with the self-titled, the band have finally released an album that is so substandard in terms of production I have issues listening to it.

But anyway, yes. I am still a DT fan. I probably always will be. I just feel less interested overall lately. I realize some of that is on me, as I grow and change. Some of it is undoubtedly on DT too, though: they haven't been the same since MP left, they've raised the prices of their concert tickets, and they haven't listened to fans at all when it comes to certain long-standing issues (like sound production).

The end result is I - who've always been more on the defensive side, even through SC and BC&SL - am finally becoming more of a critic. That's just the way it is. I try to be respectful and constructive, as always. I don't feel my attitude should infuriate diehards, either. And I don't think I'm in the majority. Most people here seem thrilled with whatever DT dish out. That's cool. And I think this site is still a great place for DT fans. Frankly I'm not sure what the OP is complaining about.

[The Stray Seed]

I've been a fan since 1999, and I truly love DT. I actually see where you are coming from, Hanz, since I used to feel quite annoyed when someone criticized the work of the band, but well... apart from the fact that everyone is entitled to have (and express) her or his own opinion, I actually have to admit that it was my fault to notice and focus too much on negative comments. As many have already said, in this place (and especially concerning this album), appreciation is waaaay more common than criticism.

[Tis BOOLsheet]

Im asking seriously.
Okay, I'm brand spankin' new here, but I was under the assumption that this is a fan site.
All I've seen, thus far, is complaints about this song or that album or which band member sucks ...
I don't get it. I've even read someone saying that they are bored by Dream Theater after multiple listens.
I have literally, no exaggeration, listened to DT every single day for the past three years.
While I have favorite songs and many of them change, I cannot say that there is one song that I dislike.
Am I really alone in this?

No you are not alone on that. You are actually part of a sizable group that likes everything DT does and believes the band can do no wrong. I have no desire to take that away from you, but you should understand that it is possible to be a huge fan of a band, and simultaneously have complaints/criticisms-- whatever you want to call it-- about some of its output. I won't try to explain how it is possible; I see that others have already done that.

I'll just say that I think everyone here is crazy about DT's music. And there is a lot of positive talk about the band's music.

[Perpetual Change]

I've been a fan since 1999, and I truly love DT. I actually see where you are coming from, Hanz, since I used to feel quite annoyed when someone criticized the work of the band, but well... apart from the fact that everyone is entitled to have (and express) her or his own opinion, I actually have to admit that it was my fault to notice and focus too much on negative comments. As many have already said, in this place (and especially concerning this album), appreciation is waaaay more common than criticism.

Adding to that, anyone who thinks this place is way too critical DT is obviously a newcomer who wasn't around during any of the community's previous eras. Remember DT.net circa ToT? DTF.com during SC? Apparently things were pretty negative for whatever incarnation was around during FII. I wasn't around then but MP specifically complains about the internet fans in a Christmas CD from that time.

[bosk1]

Well, true, but the fact that the community may have been a bit off the rails under prior management doesn't mean that things should get a pass just because "well, we're not as bad as we could be."  That kind of logic is not really a sound way to run anything.

But back to the point that has been made over and over again, which I think is the better point, while there is some criticm, (1) we have rules that criticism must be constructive rather than pointless bashing, and those rules are enforced, and (2) the overwhelming majority opinion on these forums on virtually everything Dream Theater does is in fact very positive.  Unlike past times, the band are actually very aware of what goes on on this forum, and they even feel like this site is very positive promotion for them.  If the band are happy with things, I wouldn't worry too much.

[Heretic]

There are, in fact, no fans on DTF. It's all air conditioned, from what I've seen.

[Prog Snob]

There are, in fact, no fans on DTF. It's all air conditioned, from what I've seen.

But it's that forced air crap.  Time for an upgrade.   

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

One thing is interesting though and i'm only speaking for myself. I tend to visit general and music more than the whole DT section:

*Double snip*

My stats are pretty similar to yours, Boom.

Soulmates?

[Ruba]

There are, in fact, no fans on DTF. It's all air conditioned, from what I've seen.

[Plasmastrike]

@OP

You must not read much DTF

[FlyingBIZKIT]

I'm a fan.

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

I'm a fan.

[Sycsa]

[Chino]

There is a difference between just being a hater and respectfully stating why you don't like what DT has done.

[FlyingBIZKIT]

There is a difference between just being a hater and respectfully stating why you don't like what DT has done.

Exactly. Simply stating why you don't like something, and how it just doesn't work well with you is fine, for anything. I'm a huge DT fan, and there are some songs by them Id be alright never hearing again. It's okay to show criticism. Now saying things like, " this song is absolutely terrible. What the hell were they even thinking" is silly. Although that's only a small portion of people here. I've seen it, so I'm not denying it, but it isn't the memo that the OP seems to think is going around.

[kirksnosehair]

There are, in fact, no fans on DTF. It's all air conditioned, from what I've seen.

The air conditioning is a nice feature, but I'm here for the bacon 

[TheSilentHam]

I have no idea what forum you've been looking at, but it doesn't sound like this one.

At any rate, we have some fans who absolutely love everything DT has done, but they are a minority.  Most of the rest of us are actual human beings.  And we don't really have that many haters who post a lot.  Everyone has certain songs or even albums they aren't crazy about, and most fans seem to have preferences (however big) for one era or another, but that's human nature.

So, I dunno what to tell you.  The band likes this site, so that's good enough for me.

I am glad that there are so many here with different tastes/opinions - would be boring otherwise.  I don't understand why those who happen to love everything DT has done are somehow not human, or how their position is any less valid than another.  I think you can genuinely like every song without being a gushing fanboy.

[Lucien]

The large majority of the people on here aren't criticizing half as much as you think they are.

[Orbert]

I don't think half of them criticize DT half as much as they would like, and I think less than half of them do half as much as they deserve.

[Shadow Ninja 2.0]

 

[Ħ]

After all these years of hearing that sentence, I still have no idea if it's a compliment or a criticism.

[The Curious Orange]

Thing is, there are a lot of websites where any sort of dissent or criticism just isn't tollerated. The Official Star Trek website used to promote the idea that every single Trek episode was equally as good as every other trek episode - this clearly wasn't the case, but any discussion of or dissent from this idea met with a banhammer. So the web filled up with fan sites where fans could have a reasonable, open and frank discussion of the episodes.

I've been a massive fan of DT since 1992, and honestly, they have been consistently my favourite band since. It goes without saying, OMG DT BEST BAND EVA!!!!!11one!

That said, not everything they produce is gold. If this was a website full of people praising DT, it would be pretty boring. We tend to take it as read that OMG DT BEST BAND EVA!!!!!11one! and simply go on to point out the bits that aren't quite as good - that's the germ of a good discussion, which is what most of us are here for.

By the way, this forum has an interesting history. It used to be hosted on the official DT website, but the band decided it was hurting their image to have so much criticism from fans saying they aren't as good as they used to be at a time when the band were hunting for a new record deal. Hence we ended up here (eventually - is 5/8forum still a thing?) and the detractors have actually reduced in number - probably because they're too stupid to find us now that there's no longer a link on the DT site.

Oh, BTW, welcome aboard!

[puppyonacid]

For me, the fact that most people here don't like 100% everything that DT has done makes for really interesting discussion.

Like when someone says The Answer Lies Within is a top 5 song. Seriously?

Or when someone else says that A Change of Seasons is over rated. Wut!!???

Those moments make me look again at songs I don't like and ask myself "what am I missing here?"

or in the case of me liking something someone else doesnt, I ask myself what I'm hearing that they might not be. And I'm thankful that I'm not the one missing out on the awesomeness of a great piece of music.

It doesn't matter your view pointh on any album, song, member, tour or whatever.........a popular opinion will find many agreeing and some offering opinions the other way. But then when you feel you have an opinion that won't go down well, it's good to ask "it is jsut me or....?"

The differences and common ground make this a great place to be. As long as it's good humoured then what's the problem?

[Perpetual Change]

Hence we ended up here (eventually - is 5/8forum still a thing?) and the detractors have actually reduced in number - probably because they're too stupid to find us now that there's no longer a link on the DT site.

Or maybe they just moved on, and stopped talking about bands they're not interested in anymore? That's a possibility, right?

[Orbert]

After all these years of hearing that sentence, I still have no idea if it's a compliment or a criticism.

It's a compliment, but it's deliberately obscure.  The original quote is:

"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

Bilbo likes some of his relatives, but there are many he truly dislikes.  There are still others who he doesn't know very well, because he comes from a very large extended family, and he doesn't see many of them very often.  But everybody is here, and he has to give a speech of some kind.

Both halves of the statement are compliments, but it's not in his nature to insult people, so there's nothing there for those that he doesn't like.  He's addressing the other two groups.

"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like." This expresses regret.  Half of the people there are people likes and he wished he knew better, but he only knows them half as well as he would like.  There are so many of them, and he is a somewhat reclusive person.

"I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." There are some people there, less than half by his estimation, who are genuinely likeable, and he feels that he should like them more.  But he doesn't, for whatever reason.  I've always assumed that these are the ones he never got to know very well.

[Prog Snob]

After all these years of hearing that sentence, I still have no idea if it's a compliment or a criticism.

*snip*

Both halves of the statement are compliments, but it's not in his nature to insult people, so there's nothing there for those that he doesn't like.  He's addressing the other two groups.

Except maybe the Sackville-Bagginses   

[Shadow Ninja 2.0]

They're a special case.

[ariich]

Hence we ended up here (eventually - is 5/8forum still a thing?) and the detractors have actually reduced in number - probably because they're too stupid to find us now that there's no longer a link on the DT site.

Or maybe they just moved on, and stopped talking about bands they're not interested in anymore? That's a possibility, right?

Well, yes and no. I mean, yes of course that happens, but if the forum had stayed exactly as it was, old detractors would be replaced by new detractors, and so on.

Since the emergence of .org, we have tried hard to keep this forum civil and respectful, while still allowing anyone to express their views (including criticisms). People who just want to bitch and bash, we just don't tolerate anymore. I like to think that the way we have tried to run things for the last few years has had a positive influence on the general culture of the forum.

[Nekov]

still allowing anyone to express their views

Says the N°1 internet Censor

[ariich]