DT12 available on HD Tracks!

[BlobVanDam]

And remember, it's my understanding that the FLAC files I got (as well as the DVD tracks) are very nearly as good as the HDTracks.

If you're talking about the FLAC files that came with the vinyl, then I don't think so. The FLAC files with the boxset are just the same as the CD as far as I know. The HDTracks are a different and much better master, along with being higher quality.

I thought someone did a side by side and the FLAC's were better than the CD...but not of the same sampling rate as the HD tracks.

To be fair, I havn't heard my CD yet.   I made my own CD from the FLAC's on Monday, and just got the box set today and only listened to the DVD. 

The side by sides were for the DVD 5.1 mixdown compared to the CD, and for the HDTracks compared to the CD that I recall. I don't have the FLACs, but they're apparently just identical to the CD. Hopefully someone else can confirm or correct that.

I'm really considering getting these HDTracks. My only reservation is that I'm not a huge fan of the album, but having a great master would certainly help me appreciate it more.

[TheGreatPretender]

Well, I have yet to listen to the HD tracks, but on a superficial level, I took a look at The Enemy Inside, and it is not brickwalled AT ALL. The dynamic range on it is immensely improved, so yeah, there's definitely a difference.

[RaiseTheKnife]

I have no problem buying the HD tracks if they still sound better converted to an mp3 for my ipod.  Or would it be the same quality as ripping tracks from the CD?  Just bought the box set, so trying to determine best way to listen to the new album on a portable device.

The less brick walled the better for me.

[Dellers]

So there are no ugly crackle sounds in this version I would guess? Kind of annoying to listen to IT for instance, and when the guitar is only playing on the left side it crackles like all hell.

[BlobVanDam]

I have no problem buying the HD tracks if they still sound better converted to an mp3 for my ipod.  Or would it be the same quality as ripping tracks from the CD?  Just bought the box set, so trying to determine best way to listen to the new album on a portable device.

The less brick walled the better for me.

You would still hear all of the benefits of the more dynamic master even after re-converting to an mp3 for your iPod or whatever other device.
You would obviously lose the higher quality of the 24bit/96Khz file, and lose a tiny bit of quality from converting to mp3, but the greater dynamic range would still very much justifies purchasing it, even if you're going to be reconverting it.

[RaiseTheKnife]

Thank you for the prompt reply, Blob.  Buying now.  HD Tracks (edit) should pay you a commission.

[wasteland]

Thank you for the prompt reply, Blob.  Buying now.  Road Runner should pay you a commission.

Don't give him strange ideas 

[me7]

I downloaded this but I got the FLAC version which is incompatible with iPod. What's the best way to retain the audio quality for use on my iPod? It would defeat the purpose to convert to an MP3, no? Nor do I want to spend 40 bucks on software that will let me convert to another lossless format.

Converting to mp3 will not defeat the purpose. It will still sound better due to the better master. But your iPod probably doesn't support 96kHz files.

To convert them with the best possible quality (and totally free), download SoX: https://sourceforge.net/projects/sox/?source=navbar
and run the following command line: sox.exe "input file name.flac" -b 16 "output file name.wav" rate 44100 dither -s

It will give you 16bit/96kHz wav files that will be compatible with everything but still sound the same. 24bit and 96kHz are nothing but snake oil.
My recommendation is to convert them to AAC, but if you're paranoid (and have a lot of storage space) you're free to go with ALAC.

[soulburner]

The HDTracks version will sound better in all possible mediums - portable mp3 players in standard mp3 format, flac format downsampled to 16/44.1, wave, ogg, wma, youtube, soundcloud, etc. Don't look at the 24 bit/96kHz numbers at all, they're not important. There aren't many people who can really (in a blind test) sense the difference between standard CD and higher, "HD" bit and sample rates. The important thing is it's a different master. Unfortunately, most HDTracks albums aren't more dynamic. So far I think it's been two Dream Theater and Megadeth albums and perhaps a Green Day one. If there are more, please let me know!

[Dellers]

The important thing is it's a different master. Unfortunately, most HDTracks albums aren't more dynamic. So far I think it's been two Dream Theater and Megadeth albums and perhaps a Green Day one. If there are more, please let me know!

So usually they only provide higher sample rate and resolution? Kind of a waste IMO. What makes music HD to me is better masters, 96 or 172 kHz and 24 bit doesn't help at all when the sound quality is heavily downgraded because of a hot master. The CD release of DT12 sounds much worse than almost all mp3's I have, even though it's "CD quality".

[wasteland]

I am now enjoying AFTR in HD. I can really say that the listening experience is less fatiguing and more peaceful this way. Not being an educated audiophile, I can't quite place where the difference is, but the experience is undoubtly better this way.

[adastra]

My hearing is so bad that i wouldn't propably hear any difference in hdtracks, 5.1 or  128kbps MP3's 
Well, it gets cheaper for me than to guess which version is the best... I think there are too many versions already.

[Prog Snob]

Dude. There are people here who collect hundreds of bootlegs (paying for them, at times) or just every single object that was barely touched by a band member. And do you find it surprising that people are spending their money on this? 

I don't know any people like that.   

[IslandInTheMaking]

Ok, finally had a good listen with the HD tracks in my small "homestudio". Sounds really good.. dynamic range is nicely improved. But the biggest improvement for me is that this allows room for Rudess. I can focus on him more effertlessly. Also the snare in Manginis snare sound pops out.. not sure if that's a good thing. Cymbals are a lot brighter but still not very good. I hope I don't sound too negative 'cause it really is a step up in quality. Just some things I noticed.

Now after all this talk about DR.. To put things in perspective. I still enjoyed the cd mix and think it is nicely done. More than good enough to enjoy the content.. and I still like the mix in FII in CD quality a lot more than the mix of DT12 in HD. So was it worth spending another 20 for it? For me absolutely!

[angelusredgrove]

. Unfortunately, most HDTracks albums aren't more dynamic. So far I think it's been two Dream Theater and Megadeth albums and perhaps a Green Day one. If there are more, please let me know!

Muse - The 2nd Law is another one

It's comforting to see so many people seeking the better masters out there...I just hope it makes a big enough difference in sales that they notice the correlation.

[nightsky971]

I feel silly for asking this, but this format is new to me.

I'm assuming that the HD flacs/alacs and identical to the HD wav files...like normal wavs vs. flacs correct?

[JediKnight1969]

Excuse my ignorance, but... Why doesn't they just simply record the best possible sound cd, and that's it?

[Prog Snob]

Excuse my ignorance, but... Why doesn't they just simply record the best possible sound cd, and that's it?

The main reason I'm guessing is because most people don't have access to the proper equipment to enjoy HD audio.

[BelichickFan]

Excuse my ignorance, but... Why doesn't they just simply record the best possible sound cd, and that's it?

The main reason I'm guessing is because most people don't have access to the proper equipment to enjoy HD audio.

Other responses have claimed it would be noticable on all equipment.

I know i won't be playing this game of buying everything twice.  It sounds easy enough for non experts to get the format (aiff, maybe others I don't know) that can be imported into i-tunes then converted to MP3.

I went thought this already reaplacing albums and cassettes with CDs, I won't play their game.  I love DT but I can't say I'm happy about the way this is playing out.

[Prog Snob]

Excuse my ignorance, but... Why doesn't they just simply record the best possible sound cd, and that's it?

The main reason I'm guessing is because most people don't have access to the proper equipment to enjoy HD audio.

Other responses have claimed it would be noticable on all equipment.

I know i won't be playing this game of buying everything twice.  It sounds easy enough for non experts to get the format (aiff, maybe others I don't know) that can be imported into i-tunes then converted to MP3.

I went thought this already reaplacing albums and cassettes with CDs, I won't play their game.  I love DT but I can't say I'm happy about the way this is playing out.

I doubt a regular onboard sound card would be able to make 24/96 sound the way it's supposed to, but I'm not an expert.   

[BelichickFan]

Excuse my ignorance, but... Why doesn't they just simply record the best possible sound cd, and that's it?

The main reason I'm guessing is because most people don't have access to the proper equipment to enjoy HD audio.

Other responses have claimed it would be noticable on all equipment.

I know i won't be playing this game of buying everything twice.  It sounds easy enough for non experts to get the format (aiff, maybe others I don't know) that can be imported into i-tunes then converted to MP3.

I went thought this already reaplacing albums and cassettes with CDs, I won't play their game.  I love DT but I can't say I'm happy about the way this is playing out.

I doubt a regular onboard sound card would be able to make 24/96 sound the way it's supposed to, but I'm not expert.   

I was just basing that on other responses saying many of the benefits would be noticed on any medium.  I just listen to my MP3s, I am clueless.  The only thing I do know is I won't be spending tons of money buying multiple versions of the same CD.

[Dtman2112]

After an intimate listen of the HD Tracks version I'm blown away. I'd even say it's one of the best sounding new albums I've heard in a while (snare sound aside, lol). Light years beyond ADTOE. So happy with this!

[IslandInTheMaking]

To me it really depends on your listening habits. I know I will choose the CD version for my car and for work. Both cases have a lot of ambient noise and not so good sound systems. And HD for when I'm home in (realatively) silent room and good system.

[me7]

Excuse my ignorance, but... Why doesn't they just simply record the best possible sound cd, and that's it?

The main reason I'm guessing is because most people don't have access to the proper equipment to enjoy HD audio.

Other responses have claimed it would be noticable on all equipment.

I know i won't be playing this game of buying everything twice.  It sounds easy enough for non experts to get the format (aiff, maybe others I don't know) that can be imported into i-tunes then converted to MP3.

I went thought this already reaplacing albums and cassettes with CDs, I won't play their game.  I love DT but I can't say I'm happy about the way this is playing out.

I doubt a regular onboard sound card would be able to make 24/96 sound the way it's supposed to, but I'm not an expert.   

Don't worry about that. 24/96 is just "snake oil", "audio homoeopathy" or whatever you want to call it. Humans can't hear anything above 22kHz (the limit of 44,1kHz sampling) and no album mastered for human consumption has a dynamic range above 96dB (the limit of 16 bit).

[ZirconBlue]

Excuse my ignorance, but... Why doesn't they just simply record the best possible sound cd, and that's it?

Because "best" is not an objective standard.  Many of us here prefer music with more dynamic range, but record companies believe that, to the general public, louder sounds better. 


You can learn more here.

[Prog Snob]

Excuse my ignorance, but... Why doesn't they just simply record the best possible sound cd, and that's it?

The main reason I'm guessing is because most people don't have access to the proper equipment to enjoy HD audio.

Other responses have claimed it would be noticable on all equipment.

I know i won't be playing this game of buying everything twice.  It sounds easy enough for non experts to get the format (aiff, maybe others I don't know) that can be imported into i-tunes then converted to MP3.

I went thought this already reaplacing albums and cassettes with CDs, I won't play their game.  I love DT but I can't say I'm happy about the way this is playing out.

I doubt a regular onboard sound card would be able to make 24/96 sound the way it's supposed to, but I'm not an expert.   

Don't worry about that. 24/96 is just "snake oil", "audio homoeopathy" or whatever you want to call it. Humans can't hear anything above 22kHz (the limit of 44,1kHz sampling) and no album mastered for human consumption has a dynamic range above 96dB (the limit of 16 bit).

I knew about the threshold of human hearing.  Are you saying that getting a 24/96 mix is a complete waste?  Or just that most people can't recognize the difference?

[JediKnight1969]

Excuse my ignorance, but... Why doesn't they just simply record the best possible sound cd, and that's it?

Because "best" is not an objective standard.  Many of us here prefer music with more dynamic range, but record companies believe that, to the general public, louder sounds better. 


You can learn more here.

Thank you! 

[IslandInTheMaking]

Don't worry about that. 24/96 is just "snake oil", "audio homoeopathy" or whatever you want to call it. Humans can't hear anything above 22kHz (the limit of 44,1kHz sampling) and no album mastered for human consumption has a dynamic range above 96dB (the limit of 16 bit).

I have to slightly disagree on that. When 22kHz sound is sampled in 44.1 KHz that means that the resulting wave form is made of two voltage readings. Thats not really an accurate discription of the anologue wave. But when you consider that most of us are really struggling to hear anything even beyond 18kHz.. as you said the difference percieved  in sound quality is very small. Even miniscule.. but it's there and noticeable. And 24bit vs 16bit has nothing to do with the range of dynamics. Only how accurately it is represented in the data. 16bit audio gives you around 65000 different voltage leves for the waveform and 24bit around 16,7 million...

Slight edit: I said bits have nothing to do with dynamic range.. that wasn't accurate. With 24bit you end up sacrificing less bits for siglnal noce.. So you end up with more DR to use.  It's been a while since I learned about these things..

[Prog Snob]

Don't worry about that. 24/96 is just "snake oil", "audio homoeopathy" or whatever you want to call it. Humans can't hear anything above 22kHz (the limit of 44,1kHz sampling) and no album mastered for human consumption has a dynamic range above 96dB (the limit of 16 bit).

I have to slightly disagree on that. When 22kHz sound is sampled in 44.1 KHz that means that the resulting wave form is made of two voltage readings. Thats not really an accurate discription of the anologue wave. But when you consider that most of us are really struggling to hear anything even beyond 18kHz.. as you said the difference percieved  in sound quality is very small. Even miniscule.. but it's there and noticeable. And 24bit vs 16bit has nothing to do with the range of dynamics. Only how accurately it is represented in the data. 16bit audio gives you around 65000 different voltage leves for the waveform and 24bit around 16,7 million...

65536 & 16777216...  Sorry, I'm a network engineer who does a lot of subnetting and address design.   

I agree with what you have stated after doing a little bit of research myself. I can notice a difference between different audio samples. Maybe not as well as I used to but there is definitely a difference between a regular CD sample and an HD sample.

[weezul]

Muse - The 2nd Law is another one

It's comforting to see so many people seeking the better masters out there...I just hope it makes a big enough difference in sales that they notice the correlation.

2nd Law HD version is a much much nicer master. Really really good! Hopefully this one will be much better too

[dongringo]

I have the cd and ripped it to flac....listened to that a few times then got the HDTracks flac. No comparison. The HDTracks version is uncompressed, dynamic, eargasmic goodness. Got $2 off with the code so paid $18 for it and it's WELL worth it. Can't imagine listening to it any other way again. Now all I have to do is compress it to 320kbps mp3 and it will be a fixture on my mp3 player / Grado GR8 iems....should sound the same as the flac. Highly recommend the HDTracks version. So glad that DT cares about their fans who care about what their music sounds like.

[Nefarius]

Holy shit, the difference is huge! Even listening to the short preview clips on the HDtracks website (which are probably mp3s of the superior master) is so much more enjoyable than the official MP3/FLAC downloads I have from my box set preorder. I'll buy the HDtracks version as soon as I'm home from work.

I agree it's sad that the HDtracks quality isn't what's on the official release. But I don't regret preordering the box set. I bought it for the gadgets and for being beautiful and I think the price is okay. A little more money for vastly improved audio quality is okay too, in the end it's one of my favorite bands we're talking about and I'll spend many many hours listening to it. Especially considering the master may very well be what prevented me and the new album from any sort of clicking experience so far. Sounding like that I might end up starting to actually like DT12 after all.

Greetings...
Nef

[sueño]

Excuse my ignorance, but... Why doesn't they just simply record the best possible sound cd, and that's it?

The main reason I'm guessing is because most people don't have access to the proper equipment to enjoy HD audio.

Other responses have claimed it would be noticable on all equipment.

I know i won't be playing this game of buying everything twice.  It sounds easy enough for non experts to get the format (aiff, maybe others I don't know) that can be imported into i-tunes then converted to MP3.

I went thought this already reaplacing albums and cassettes with CDs, I won't play their game.  I love DT but I can't say I'm happy about the way this is playing out.

hear...ummm.....here!     

[Kotowboy]

You can't blame DT solely for this - this kind of crap has been 's MO for years.

My bro and I always had a running joke that when you signed to RR for a 5 album deal - that only covered all the different versions of the debut they would release over the years.

It's nothing new. There were about 5 different editions of Soulfly's debut.

[Dark Castle]

I think I might pick it up next week, along with the HD version of A Dramatic Turn of Events. Not quite sure yet though.