My thoughts on 'Dream Theater' (***SPOILERS***)

[Whatsername]

I pretty much have determined I shouldn't DTF without caffeine.

Yup. That was me yesterday.

[theseoafs]

I mean, most of the people who don't like SC (being fan or not) haven't heard it the enough times it takes to get to understand it in its complexity and artistic rarity.

WTF are you high?

[BlobVanDam]

I mean, most of the people who don't like SC (being fan or not) haven't heard it the enough times it takes to get to understand it in its complexity and artistic rarity.

WTF are you high?

Personal attack. Bant.

[hefdaddy42]

Correction: just a question, not an attack.

[ToT-147]

I mean, most of the people who don't like SC (being fan or not) haven't heard it the enough times it takes to get to understand it in its complexity and artistic rarity...

I have listened to SC quite a few times and it has only gotten worse. When I got it I thought it was a cool record, but later I started to see more and more flaws in the songs.

I just went to sleep and now I wake up and get all this!!.. Don't know whether to be like this:  , like this:  , or just like this: 

I could quote all of you, but I felt some lazy so I just took this replay... It's perfect to what I was trying to express.. I never said neither you should like the album nor you would like it by listening for what deserves (TO ME).. "it has only gotten worse".. That's precisely a judgment.. And I clearly said: "Only giving it the proper time they should be able to judge it"... Not to like it: to judge it.... and that it's relative too, and depends on either one and his own perspective..

And, again, this is just my point of view.. In fact, I actually did apply that also with the so hated St. Anger and with the pretty underrated IM's A Matter of Life and Death, and these both I ended up liking it... Another one was FII, but, though it didn't become worse, I never liked so much as the rest of the albums...

Please, don't distort my words.. Although it was funny see how you reacted...

This was my sequence of expressions:  -  -  - 

[?]

You said the album needs multiple listens before you "get" it and I just wanted to say that I enjoyed it at first, but later on it has started to look weaker in my eyes. I'm not talking about the album negatively because I haven't listened to it carefully enough - I criticize it because it hasn't stood the test of time for me.

[King Postwhore]

You said the album needs multiple listens before you "get" it and I just wanted to say that I enjoyed it at first, but later on it has started to look weaker in my eyes. I'm not talking about the album negatively because I haven't listened to it carefully enough - I criticize it because it hasn't stood the test of time for me.

Exactly.  It's not a DT album a I play a lot.

[noxon]

My sentiments also, and in actuality this goes for almost all of the post SFAM albums for my part - there are songs i come back to (glass prison, itnog, etc), but if i'm to pick an -album- to listen to it's more likely that i pick from the 90's albums than the 2000s.

[The Stray Seed]

Why not starting a different topic about these things? Just suggesting...

[Bertielee]

For me, it's albums post ToT that haven't stood the test of time. In all honesty, Octavarium was the first album I began skipping tracks on. With SC and BC&SL, it was even worse because I only listened to the albums 4 or 5 times in full and then only tracks. It was better with ADToE because I stopped skipping tracks. BUT I am waiting for another album that will last for more than a month for me. Let's wait and see.

B.Lee

EDIT : you're right Stray Seed, we should keep this talk for another place.

[Jaffa]

Holy hell this is ridiculous.

You obviously only think it's ridiculous because you haven't read it the enough times it takes to get to understand it in its complexity.

Do I see this becoming a short-lived DT-Side meme? 

I doubt it.  Things I do never catch on.   

[hefdaddy42]

I mean, most of the people who don't like SC (being fan or not) haven't heard it the enough times it takes to get to understand it in its complexity and artistic rarity...

I have listened to SC quite a few times and it has only gotten worse. When I got it I thought it was a cool record, but later I started to see more and more flaws in the songs.

I just went to sleep and now I wake up and get all this!!.. Don't know whether to be like this:  , like this:  , or just like this: 

I could quote all of you, but I felt some lazy so I just took this replay... It's perfect to what I was trying to express.. I never said neither you should like the album nor you would like it by listening for what deserves (TO ME).. "it has only gotten worse".. That's precisely a judgment.. And I clearly said: "Only giving it the proper time they should be able to judge it"... Not to like it: to judge it.... and that it's relative too, and depends on either one and his own perspective..

And, again, this is just my point of view.. In fact, I actually did apply that also with the so hated St. Anger and with the pretty underrated IM's A Matter of Life and Death, and these both I ended up liking it... Another one was FII, but, though it didn't become worse, I never liked so much as the rest of the albums...

Please, don't distort my words.. Although it was funny see how you reacted...

This was my sequence of expressions:  -  -  - 

So, what you're saying is. . .














You are high?



Just kidding.  I mean, unless you're high.

And yes, let's slowly but surely steer this back onto topic.

[Outcrier]

The whole "you don't like the album because you don't understand it" argument is ridiculous.

Thank God, though i be alone in this (or "on this", i'm not american  )

[Jaffa]

In the interest of aiming this back toward the topic, a question for cyberdrummer, Noxon, and/or Meatrose: would you say there are any songs (or sections of songs) on the new album which are obviously influenced by other bands?  Sorry if this has already been asked. 

[noxon]

Most definitively. The most obvious ones would be Rush (The Looking Glass and particularly Surrender To Reason) and Metallica (Behind the Veil.

[Jaffa]

Hmm!  Very interesting!  And you said Surrender to Reason was one of your favorites on the album, right?  Or am I getting people mixed up in my mind? 

[aXygnus]

Most definitively. The most obvious ones would be Rush (The Looking Glass and particularly Surrender To Reason) and Metallica (Behind the Veil).

Oh... Shit.
Older Metallica, like 80s Metallica, or more recent Metallica?

[Lucien]

Any specific Rush songs that you feel TLG and STR reference?

Also, how strong would you consider the lyrical aspect of the album?

[cyberdrummer]

Hmm!  Very interesting!  And you said Surrender to Reason was one of your favorites on the album, right?  Or am I getting people mixed up in my mind? 

I said that.

[The Stray Seed]

Also, how strong would you consider the lyrical aspect of the album?

Also interested in this one.

[Jaffa]

Hmm!  Very interesting!  And you said Surrender to Reason was one of your favorites on the album, right?  Or am I getting people mixed up in my mind? 

I said that.

Ah, right.  Well then, would you agree with noxon that it's got a Rush influence?  Just curious here. 

[ToT-147]

For me, it's albums post ToT that haven't stood the test of time. In all honesty, Octavarium was the first album I began skipping tracks on. With SC and BC&SL, it was even worse because I only listened to the albums 4 or 5 times in full and then only tracks. It was better with ADToE because I stopped skipping tracks. BUT I am waiting for another album that will last for more than a month for me. Let's wait and see.

B.Lee

EDIT : you're right Stray Seed, we should keep this talk for another place.

You're saying that 8V, SC and BC&SL didn't "last" for more than a month to you?!!.. Well, I feel sorry for you then..

N/C/M: do you guys think this new DT album will last for more than a month?..

[ToT-147]

The whole "you don't like the album because you don't understand it" argument is ridiculous.

Thank God, though i be alone in this (or "on this", i'm not american  )

I already clarified I never said such a thing...

[RMGadelha]

Most definitively. The most obvious ones would be Rush (The Looking Glass and particularly Surrender To Reason) and Metallica (Behind the Veil).

Oh... Shit.
Older Metallica, like 80s Metallica, or more recent Metallica?

I may be completely wrong, but I think he mentioned Enter Sandman.

[aXygnus]

I may be completely wrong, but I think he mentioned Enter Sandman.

If so, I'm not sure how to feel about this

[Mosh]

Last time I really heard Metallica in a DT song, we got Peruvian Skies. Could be awesome.

[RMGadelha]

Last time I really heard Metallica in a DT song, we got Peruvian Skies. Could be awesome.

True. Peruvian Skies is actually my favorite song off FII, even more than Trial of Tears.

[425]

Also, to me, Metallica's problem has never been that they couldn't write good music. They have long had problems with knowing how much of use of a musical idea is too much (St. Anger) and with quality control (Load and Reload). Dream Theater has not had either one of these problems.

And as Mosh said, look at Peruvian Skies. I know people like to mention Pink Floyd in association with that one, which I can see, but to me it's more Metallica. The first part totally channels Bleeding Me and then the second part is your heavy/thrashy Metallica.

[ToT-147]

Also, to me, Metallica's problem has never been that they couldn't write good music. They have long had problems with knowing how much of use of a musical idea is too much (St. Anger) and with quality control (Load and Reload). Dream Theater has not had either one of these problems.

I'm not sure what you mean by "quality control", but I always see Load/Reload and FII in the same path...

Oh, and you didn't mention the Metallica's biggest problem (IMO): their quantity of music..
I mean, I agree with you, they always have had that ability to writing nice music, but, 4 albums in 22 years??!!!... THAT's a problem....

[Mosh]

I've never listened to Bleeding Me, but the first part of Peruvian screams Pink Floyd. Maybe that's because of the Have A Cigar jam.

[cyberdrummer]

Hmm!  Very interesting!  And you said Surrender to Reason was one of your favorites on the album, right?  Or am I getting people mixed up in my mind? 

I said that.

Ah, right.  Well then, would you agree with noxon that it's got a Rush influence?  Just curious here. 

Yep.

You're saying that 8V, SC and BC&SL didn't "last" for more than a month to you?!!.. Well, I feel sorry for you then..

N/C/M: do you guys think this new DT album will last for more than a month?..

Yeah definitely. But I thought the other three mentioned 'lasted' for a month as well...

[Kotowboy]

I played Black Clouds & Silver Linings in full almost every day for ages but now I barely listen to anything off that album.

It probably didn't help that we had those leaks of A Rite Of Passage & Nightmare to Remember for a few weeks beforehand.

[aprilethereal]

The whole "you don't like the album because you don't understand it" argument is ridiculous.

Thank God, though i be alone in this (or "on this", i'm not american  )

I already clarified I never said such a thing...

You said exactly that:

I mean, most of the people who don't like SC (being fan or not) haven't heard it the enough times it takes to get to understand it in its complexity and artistic rarity

[hefdaddy42]

Yeah, he said it.  And now we're past it, so let's drop it.

[Bertielee]

On topic : I like what I've read on the album so far and I'm glad DT have written shorter songs (except IT of course  ).

B.Lee

EDIT : this must have been my 1000th post! Yepeeee!